1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Regular Session 10 Monday, December 11, 2000 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: FREDERICK L. HENNEKE, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 LARRY GRIFFIN, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X December 11, 2000 PAGE 2 Visitors' Input 3 Commissioners' Comments 4 3 Approval Agenda 9 4 Consideration Agenda: 2.1 Sale of Lake Ingram Road District bonds 17 5 2.2 Request for exception to OSSF regulation, 6 340 Cedar Springs w/Lot 6, Block 4 30 7 2.3 Approval of 2000-2001 Criminal Justice and Public Safety Community Plan 34 8 2.4 Approve county-sponsored contract with Kids 9 Advocacy Place, Inc. 36 10 2.5 Acceptance of RFP's for performance of Colonia Planning Grant 37 11 2.6 Approve members of Child Services Board 43 12 2.7 Set February 22, 2001, as grand opening date 47 13 2.8 Appoint Stanley A. Schaeffer of Hunt to Texas 14 Veterans Land Board Kerr County Committee 51 15 2.9 PUBLIC HEARING - Proposed Kerr County On-Site Sewage Facility Rules and Regulations 53 16 2.10 Adopt Kerr County OSSF Rules & Regulations 68 17 2.14 Recognize winners of Short Story Contest 80 18 2.11 PUBLIC HEARING - Proposed Kerr County 19 Subdivision Rules and Regulations 85 20 2.12 Adopt Kerr County Subdivision Rules & Regs 88 21 2.13 Order prohibiting discharge of firearms on lots 10 acres or smaller in a subdivision 94 22 2.15 Request for uncollected 1999-2000 K'Star funds 103 23 2.16 Correction of travel budget, Constable Pct. 3 106 24 2.17 Approval of revised Change Order No. 6 112 25 --- Adjourned 126 3 1 On Monday, December 11, 2000, at 9 a.m., a regular 2 session of Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in the 3 Commissioners Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, Kerrville, 4 Texas, and the following proceedings were had in open court: 5 P R O C E E D I N G S 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Good morning. It's 9 o'clock 7 on Monday, December 11th, Year 2000. We'll call to order 8 the -- the regular session of the Kerr County Commissioners 9 Court. Commissioner Letz, I believe you have the honors 10 this morning. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. Everybody please 12 stand and bow your head. 13 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: At this time, if there's any 15 citizen wishing to address the Court on an item which is not 16 listed on the regular agenda, please come forward and do so. 17 MS. PIEPER: Judge, I have something that I 18 would like to share with the Court. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Please do. 20 MS. PIEPER: I'll pass it around. This is a 21 5-Star Vital Registration. It's called the Ultimate Honor 22 of Excellence. That was presented to my office last week at 23 the annual conference. Even though it says Kerr County 24 Clerk's Office, I would like to add that our J.P.'s have a 25 hand in this, our doctors, our funeral directors, because if 4 1 it wasn't for them that get their paperwork to us in a 2 timely manner, we would not be able to -- to receive this 3 award. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Congratulations. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: It's always a pleasure for 6 those of us who work with you and all the other people to 7 have your work recognized outside of the confines of Kerr 8 County. So, our congratulations to you, Jannett, and 9 everyone else who participated in this award. 10 MS. PIEPER: Thank you. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you very much. Does 12 anyone else have anything they'd like to address the Court 13 on that's not listed on the regular agenda? Seeing no one, 14 we'll move to the Commissioners' Comments. Commissioner 15 Letz? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: First, I'd like to thank 17 some individuals that have been really helpful with the 18 Hermann bridge situation, or lack of bridge, probably more 19 accurate at the moment. Joe Franklin with the N.R.C.S. has 20 been a big help in really working with the federal 21 government, which is probably going to be the solution to 22 solve that problem on a short-term basis with a temporary 23 structure, and then, of course, Road and Bridge Department, 24 Len Odom and Frank Johnston have been a big help working 25 with that. It's just been a real pleasure to work with all 5 1 these individuals in trying to solve this problem we have. 2 And, I'd also like to thank the Kerrville Daily Times; they 3 did a very good article on that bridge, extremely accurate, 4 in my opinion. I appreciate that. 5 Region J is having a meeting this Thursday. 6 It will be the final -- at that meeting we'll adopt, 7 hopefully, the final version of the Regional Water Plan. 8 It's in Bracketville. Not real close, but if anyone wants 9 to go down, there are some real good restaurants in 10 Bracketville. And it's at 1 o'clock in the afternoon; 11 should be, I imagine, a three- to four-hour meeting. And, 12 finally, the Tivy Booster Club -- today's the final today 13 for selling raffle tickets for their fall raffle for raising 14 funds. Anybody that wants to buy a raffle ticket, I've got 15 some in my office. Drawing will be at halftime tonight at 16 the basketball game. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: What's the prize? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There are five prizes. 19 The winner -- first name drawn will pick from them, and the 20 prizes are a whitetail hunt at Bill Carter's Apache Springs 21 Ranch, which is -- to a whitetail hunter, it's a pretty big 22 deal, about a $3,500 prize. There's a trip to Las Vegas for 23 Super Bowl weekend, air fare, hotel, everything. There's 24 two Spurs tickets and a night at probably the Mariott or 25 some nice hotel in downtown San Antonio. Seats are on the 6 1 floor, very nice seats. There's a golfing weekend at 2 Horseshoe Bay for two, and then there's a two-day fishing 3 trip at Baffin Bay with guide, lodging, and that's for two 4 people as well. So, pretty good prizes. 5 MS. NEMEC: Guide or guys? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Guide. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Barbara's not interested any 8 more. 9 (Laughter.) 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tickets are $20. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Commissioner Griffin? 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I just would like to 13 say thanks to the Road and Bridge Department, to TexDOT, and 14 to KPUB for the way that they have jumped to -- to address 15 the safety issue out near the Hunt School, where all three 16 agencies have to get involved, and they showed up on the 17 ground. We worked out a solution to it and it will be 18 implemented over the next few weeks to correct just a safety 19 deficiency in getting off -- off Highway 1340 into the Hunt 20 School area. And, that's the way problems get solved, is 21 when you can get the right people together on the ground at 22 the same time and look at it. And they came up with a great 23 plan, I think, and it's going to help, and my thanks go to 24 them. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Commissioner Baldwin? 7 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. We don't 2 have any football to talk about, so I have very little to 3 say, except that our Assistant County Attorney, Travis 4 Lucas, I understand, is -- they have called him back to 5 Florida to -- and no surprise here that they would come to 6 Kerr County to find somebody to help them fix the problem 7 down there. So, I think we're -- quite an honor it is to 8 have a young man of that caliber that they would call down 9 to help them do those things. My hat's off to Travis Lucas. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Commissioner Williams? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, as a lifelong 12 journalist, I have a deep and abiding interest in the 13 ownership of our newspapers, and I extend my good wishes to 14 the new ownership of The Mountain Sun. Mountain Sun is 120 15 years old, and I hope it lasts for another 120 years. I 16 particularly want to extend good wishes to the new 17 publisher, Neice Wienecke. Neice returns to the public 18 field in Kerrville, having lived here a long time and having 19 participated both in the Kerrville Daily Times and Mountain 20 Sun before leaving for Boerne. She returns, and I have 21 every confidence that that bright young woman will do an 22 excellent job at this newspaper, and I extend my good wishes 23 to her, as well. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. I'd like to offer my 25 thanks to the Courthouse Lighting Committee, which 8 1 Commissioner Williams is the liaison. I think they've done 2 an excellent job this year. I think the lights continue to 3 improve every year, and they seem to have a good theme and 4 handle on how to proceed, and it really looks nice in the 5 evening around here. 6 A matter of scheduling, I want to remind 7 everyone, our last meeting for this year will be held on 8 Friday, December 22nd, commencing at 9 o'clock in the 9 morning. Agenda items must absolutely be in, all copies, 10 ready to publish by noon on Monday, the 18th. I will tell 11 you right now that I will not accept anything after noon on 12 Monday, and that means you must have the complete package 13 in. Don't be bringing in an agenda request and say you'll 14 have the backup later. It's a very short turnaround; we 15 have to put the agenda out that day, get the books ready by 16 the next day, and there just simply isn't any time for us to 17 allow people to put a marker in and then bring in their 18 backup material at a later date. So, please keep in mind 19 that the absolute deadline for agenda items for the last 20 meeting of this year will be a week from today at noon. 21 Please keep that in mind. 22 I'll also remind everyone that the annual 23 Christmas employees' luncheon will be at 11:30 on the 22nd, 24 down in the basement of the Annex. It's being put together 25 by Thea Sovil. It will be a good time. We have lots of 9 1 food, and we hope that all the departments will arrange 2 their schedule so that their employees can come by and share 3 some Christmas cheer with the rest of the employees here at 4 Kerr County. With that in mind, let's proceed to the 5 business at hand. Mr. Auditor, do we have any bills to pay? 6 Does anyone have any questions or comments regarding the 7 bills as presented by Tommy Tomlinson? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I have a couple 9 of questions, and it's just -- just some, I'm sure, 10 clarification. On Page 3, it's -- it just looks like large 11 numbers here, and I'm sure there's an explanation. In the, 12 I guess, 216th District Court, about three-quarters of the 13 way down, there's a bill for $12,004, and I just want to be 14 sure that's not a typo. 15 MR. TOMLINSON: No. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's a bill for 17 $12,000 for -- to do some kind of transcript on a trial? 18 MR. TOMLINSON: That's for the appeal. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That is a lot of 20 money. And then drop down one more, something very similar. 21 In the 198th District Court, there is one for 4,000 -- I 22 assume that's some kind of Court-appointed lawyer, for 23 $4,300. 24 MR. TOMLINSON: That's correct. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Seems like to me that 10 1 that's -- we don't normally see that large of a number in 2 these bills for the -- for Court-appointed attorneys. I'd 3 like an explanation on that one, please. 4 MR. TOMLINSON: On which one? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's Item Number 6 120232. 7 MR. TOMLINSON: On the 4,000 one? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 9 MR. TOMLINSON: Do you want it now? Or -- I 10 don't have -- I don't have any further explanation for it at 11 this time. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I want it before 13 I approve a -- vote to pay the thing. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: I would presume that's based 15 on invoices submitted by Mr. Rudkin for representing 16 Mr. Christiansen. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, we see -- we see 18 all kinds of lawyer bills come in that are even $2,000, but 19 $4,000 is just really out there a good ways. I mean, is 20 this a long-term thing? Or is this -- 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: This was a fairly significant 22 matter. They had a 2-day jury trial, picked a jury and all 23 the other things. We have an order signed by Judge Ables? 24 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes -- well, it's signed by 25 Judge Prohl. 11 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Judge Prohl. 2 MR. TOMLINSON: I don't -- I don't have 3 anything other than -- than that with this. There's not 4 anything attached to it. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. That's all 6 the questions I have. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anyone else? 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I just have one quick 9 question. County Engineer can probably tell me about this. 10 It's on Page 15, the last item. Digital camera for traffic 11 counter. What's that all about? 12 MR. JOHNSTON: That was in the capital outlay 13 for traffic counters. They called it traffic counters, but 14 it's also supposed to have been listed in there under 15 capital outlay. It's for documentation of road conditions. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, thank you. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anyone else? 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move we pay the 19 bills. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 23 Baldwin, seconded by Commissioner Williams, that the Court 24 approve the bills as recommended by the Auditor. Any 25 further questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise 12 1 your right hand. 2 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 4 (No response.) 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. We'll next 6 turn to the budget amendments. Budget Amendment Number 1 is 7 from the Sheriff's Department. 8 MR. TOMLINSON: This is a request from the 9 Sheriff to transfer $515 from Operating Expenses. $265 of 10 that goes to Machine Repair for repair of a printer. $250 11 goes to Computer Hardware for the purchase of a -- of a 12 printer as a standby -- or printer for their office, goes to 13 that. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Do you -- 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 18 Baldwin, seconded by Commissioner Griffin, that we approve 19 Budget Amendment Number 1 for the Sheriff's Department. Any 20 questions? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: When you say "standby," 22 is this to put the money in the budget or to buy it? 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: This is our TLETS 24 printer, the one for the D.P.S. computer where you run your 25 registrations, wanted and everything. The con -- 13 1 maintenance contract the County used to have, it expired 2 quite awhile back on the printer we have, and we had to -- 3 it's a special printer that works for TLETS, and we had to 4 end up sending that one off to get it repaired. It had 5 broke down. So, in the process, we went ahead and bought a 6 used one to replace it while that one's being sent off, 7 which now gives us two, to where if one breaks down, we can 8 -- we can still keep going with the used one. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, thank you. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any further questions or 11 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Budget 16 Amendment Request Number 2 for Nondepartmental. 17 MR. TOMLINSON: This is a request from me to 18 transfer $1,392.81 from Capital Outlay to transfer into 19 Mainframe Maintenance. This -- this is part of the -- in 20 our Capital Outlay, we put in $60,000 for the purchase of a 21 new system. Part of that cost was actually for maintenance 22 for -- for a period of -- it's a 5-year period for a prepaid 23 maintenance contract with IBM. 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Associated with that? 25 MR. TOMLINSON: Associated with that. So, 14 1 I'm actually reclassifying the maintenance part of that 2 $60,000 to the maintenance, is what I'm doing. 3 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I move that we approve 4 that. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 7 Griffin, seconded by Commissioner Letz, that the Court 8 approve Budget Amendment Request Number 2. Any further 9 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 10 right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Budget 15 Amendment Request Number 3 is for J.P. Number 3. 16 MR. TOMLINSON: On this, I have a bill from 17 Computer Service Center for -- for time of $75, and it's -- 18 the request is to transfer $75 from Software Maintenance to 19 Machine Repair. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 21 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner Letz, 23 seconded by Commissioner Griffin, that we approve Budget 24 Amendment Request Number 3. Any further questions or 25 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hands. 15 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Number 4 is 5 for Constable, Precinct 1. 6 MR. TOMLINSON: This is a request from Don 7 McClure to transfer $15 from Office Supplies to Books, 8 Publications, and Dues. It's to pay a membership for his 9 deputy, Chuck Brecher, for the Justice of the Peace & 10 Constables Association. It's for him to allow -- to be able 11 to get training through the Association. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 13 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner Letz, 15 seconded by Commissioner Griffin, that we approve Budget 16 Amendment Request Number 4 for the Constable, Precinct 1. 17 Any further questions or comments? If not, all in favor, 18 raise your right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Do we have 23 any late bills? 24 MR. TOMLINSON: I have one. It's for $33 to 25 the Kerrville Postmaster, and it's for some postage for 16 1 Animal Control. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner Letz, 5 seconded by Commissioner Williams, that we approve a hand 6 check and late bill in the amount of $33, payable to the 7 Postmaster for the Animal Control Department. All in favor, 8 raise your right hands. 9 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 11 (No response.) 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 13 MR. TOMLINSON: That's it. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Thank you, Tommy. 15 Next item is to read and approve the minutes. At this time 16 I'd entertain a motion to waive reading and approve the 17 minutes of the regular session of Monday, November 13th, the 18 regular session continued from Monday, November 13th, to 19 Tuesday, November 14th, special -- and the special session 20 on Monday, November 27th. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 24 Williams, seconded by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court 25 waive reading and approve the minutes of the Kerr County 17 1 Commissioners Court regular session on Monday, November 2 13th, Year 2000, as continued until Tuesday, November 14th, 3 and the Kerr County Commissioners Court special session for 4 Monday, November 27th, Year 2000. Any questions or 5 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hands. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: At this time, I'd entertain a 10 motion to approve and accept the monthly reports as 11 presented. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 13 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner Letz, 15 seconded by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve and 16 accept the monthly reports as presented. Any further 17 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 18 right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. We'll now 23 move straight into the consideration agenda. First item is 24 to consider and discuss the sale of the Lake Ingram Road 25 District road bond. Commissioner Griffin. 18 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yes. As the Court is 2 aware, after a considerable amount of work leading up to an 3 election that was held last August 12th, the Lake Ingram 4 Estates Road District was formed, and then the voters, on 5 August 12th, from that district approved the issuance of 6 road bond or bonds to improve the major road that -- and the 7 cul-de-sacs that go from that major road in the subdivision. 8 Since that time, Mr. Bob Henderson with Dain Rauscher has 9 been attempting to sell the bonds in the amount -- or even 10 in a lesser amount, in some cases. We've looked at several 11 alternatives, and we have not as yet been successful in 12 selling those bonds. So, I've asked Mr. Henderson to come 13 here today and sort of go through what he's done and for us 14 to explore, if possible, what the alternatives might be to 15 try to either sell the bonds or take another approach for 16 the road district in raising that money. So, with that, 17 I'll turn it over to Bob and let him sort of run through 18 what has happened to date. 19 MR. HENDERSON: Thank you, Commissioners. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bob, August the 12th 21 was the election day. Is there a time frame when this whole 22 program becomes void? 23 MR. HENDERSON: Yes. The Attorney General's 24 office will not allow us to sell bonds that the election for 25 which is over 10 years old. So, there is a time limit, but 19 1 it's quite a lengthy one. We can sell the bonds up to 10 2 years. It's a pleasure to be in front of the Commissioners 3 Court this morning. I wish I had better news. As 4 Commissioner Griffin indicated, we have done a lot of work 5 trying to find buyers for those bonds. It would be -- take 6 us quite some time to go through all of the litany of the 7 people we talked to, but very briefly, I will tell you that 8 we spoke at length with all of your local banks. 9 Particularly, one bank we looked at possibly selling less 10 than the voted authorization and issue an amount as little 11 as $140,000, $150,000, to try to phase this project in. 12 Ultimately, that bank elected not do that. 13 I asked our unrated desk out of our Houston 14 office, which sells a lot of municipal utility district debt 15 across the state, to take a look at this. They contacted a 16 number of high net worth individuals and companies that buy 17 unrated paper. In particular, I thought -- what kind of 18 sticks in my mind is Bluebell Ice Cream, believe it or not. 19 Those guys own about $100 million worth of unrated paper 20 from municipal utility districts, and they were not 21 interested in buying the debt. We also went through our 22 retail distribution system. As you know, we have an office 23 here in Kerrville, and we talked to a number of high net 24 worth individuals in Kerrville seeking interest in buying 25 all or a portion of these bonds, and were not able to sell 20 1 them to those individuals, either. 2 Finally, we contacted both the state and 3 federal governments, looking for federal programs that would 4 be set up to assist rural districts with road development. 5 And, after visiting with people in Temple and Austin and 6 Washington, D.C., and even over in Fredericksburg, we were 7 not able to identify any federal or state grant or loan 8 program that would be interested in -- that's set up to 9 handle these types of things. We also visited with some 10 local charitable foundations, both here in Kerrville, also 11 in Austin, also in the Houston area, trying to see if we 12 couldn't get the charitable foundations interested in buying 13 all our or a portion of the bonds, and could not find any 14 luck there. So, we have really run the gamut on trying to 15 find potential buyers. 16 The problem, as you're probably aware, is, 17 quite frankly, the assessed valuation of that road district. 18 The taxable value out there is about $1,400,000. There are 19 only about nine homes built out there and, in fact, one 20 single of those homes represents something in the 21 neighborhood of 20 percent of the assessed valuation of the 22 district. So, as we went around to the various investor 23 types to try to sell this debt, the consistent response that 24 we got back was that the -- simply, the risk was too great. 25 The amount of money versus the assessed valuation of that 21 1 road district, and the fact that so much of the wealth of 2 that -- limited wealth of the road district was tied up in 3 such a very small percentage of the -- of the population in 4 terms of number of houses that were built out there. We 5 just couldn't get it to fit anybody's risk profile. 6 A couple other alternatives that we 7 expressed, "we" being Commissioner Griffin and myself, is 8 looking at state law with respect to the Public Funds 9 Investment Act to see if there was some way that the County, 10 itself, could buy some of those bonds and let the -- the 11 road district repay the County. Unfortunately, the minimum 12 credit requirements in the Texas Public Funds Investment Act 13 would not even allow the County to do that. There is a -- a 14 number of things that we have explored and have not been 15 able to be successful. In terms of where we go from here, I 16 think one of the things that Commissioner Griffin has 17 already been working on is getting with the road engineers 18 to see if there's a way to break this project down even 19 further. 20 As you know, there are two primary phases to 21 this. One is to go out there, do the grading, put the road 22 bed in, and the second one would be to come back with the 23 asphalt paving on top of that. That attempt at phasing the 24 project in to -- to -- in order to get the help of the local 25 bank was not successful, because even the road beds for the 22 1 entire project would be about $150,000, which still gives us 2 a debt-to-assessed valuation ratio in excess of 10 percent. 3 It may be that further phasing could help us by just doing 4 the primary road and not attempting at this point to try and 5 do all the cul-de-sacs. That would reduce the initial debt, 6 hopefully substantially, maybe under $100,000. We could get 7 a purchaser to buy that debt, and then -- and then, based on 8 those improvements, have the values of the district overall 9 go up. And, as the value of the district goes up, the 10 debt-to-assessed valuation ratios fall, which will allow us 11 then to sell subsequent debt. 12 One of the concerns that we had expressed to 13 us by the two investors, the local bank and another 14 individual out of Houston, was that even with the phasing, 15 how do we assure the investor that once we've sold the first 16 $75,000, that we don't come back and sell the balance? And 17 we talked about a variety of options, by resolution of the 18 Commissioners Court, representing that road district, to 19 assure the investors that the additional debt would not be 20 sold until certain debt-AV ratios were met, and I think that 21 met with some favor. But the bottom line is, in terms of 22 selling the debt, as of now, we have not been able to 23 structure a package that will be attractive to individual 24 investors. 25 Alternate -- alternatives, outside of selling 23 1 the debt, would be to consider some sort of assessment 2 program, which is to go out there and -- and have the 3 property owners -- assess the property owners directly for a 4 percentage of the improvements. The attorneys, McCall, 5 Parkhurst, and Horton, after looking at this issue two or 6 three different times over the course of the last 60 days, 7 continued to suggest that -- that there is apparently 8 conflicting statutes as to the ability of the road district 9 to do that. They think one statute clearly gives the 10 ability to assess. The other statute seemed to indicate 11 that you have to be able to prove up value versus the 12 assessments in order to make that program work. So, the 13 primary alternative, we're not sure we have 100 percent 14 green light on the legalities to go out and do that, in a 15 nutshell. 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: The only thing I would 17 add to that is that it's obvious that we sort of -- we have 18 a chicken and egg problem here, because the valuations are 19 low because the properties haven't been developed because 20 the road is not there and -- and really passable. Once the 21 road is made passable, once the road -- and once the 22 improvement starts, then it's obvious that the development 23 of those properties will begin and probably flourish. The 24 valuations go up and then you don't have a problem. Then 25 you can incur more debt because the ratios are decreasing. 24 1 MR. HENDERSON: Right. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So, it's how we 3 kick-start this, is the problem that we're wrestling with 4 here. And -- and I think what we'll do primarily, first, is 5 go back and look at another phasing, and I've started on 6 that, another phasing of it where we can sell less debt to 7 get the program started, and to come up with a -- a ratio in 8 that first sale that -- that the valuations would have to 9 reach before we would sell additional debt, so that that 10 first investor or the first couple of investors would feel 11 comfortable as time goes on that there is a -- an adequate 12 ratio to cover their risk. So, has anybody else got any 13 ideas? That's the reason we have this on the agenda, to see 14 if there's anything else that we might pursue for the road 15 district to get the program started, preferably without 16 having to go back to the voters. But, if there's some 17 approach we might take that would require us to go back to 18 the voters, we'll do that. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The owners of the 20 road district? 21 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Owners of the road 22 district, right. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Did you determine that this 24 debt is not an appropriate investment for the Schreiner Road 25 Trust? 25 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, we've got a 2 mixed signal on that, and I -- I'd like to go -- we probably 3 need to sit down with the trustee and see what their 4 understanding is. I have not done that yet. Because, if it 5 were possible, that would be a good solution. They've got 6 monies -- that trust is invested in other things. There's 7 nothing that says that some of those funds could not be 8 pulled back by the trustee and invested in this. We don't 9 lose money there; it's going to make money. And, if -- if 10 the trustee can be convinced of that and -- and that it's 11 all nice and legal and tidy, that may be a solution. That 12 may be at least a partial solution. But, the main reason we 13 wanted it on the agenda for today was to -- was to see if 14 there are other ideas and other approaches that might be 15 possible, and if so, we'll certainly go investigate them. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My question, I guess, 17 is -- I mean, it seems, from what I'm hearing, that 18 additional phasing is really the only way to go. It seems 19 like, to me, the logical way would be to do the primary 20 road, but if you do that or do additional phasing, do you 21 need to go back to the -- the voters in the road district to 22 have them approve doing that? And I'm not -- one, there's 23 the -- legally, if you have to, and two, they voted on 24 something, and were they aware that it may not all happen? 25 I mean, I think they need to be -- just from an -- 26 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, what the -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- ethical standpoint, 3 need to be aware what we're doing and concur, as well. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And I think what the 5 real -- I think what the real issue is there is that the -- 6 the bond issue election authorizes the sale of those bonds 7 up to the amount. I don't think that the homeowners would 8 have any problem -- the landowners there would have any 9 problem with the phased program, as long as it all gets done 10 eventually, which I think we can do once the valuations get 11 high enough to cover that much debt. So, I think that -- I 12 don't think, from the -- from the landowners' point of view, 13 the property owners' point of view, that that's an issue. 14 It's -- it's how can we make this first egg fall, or hatch 15 or get laid, whatever it is, in this -- in this circle that 16 we've got to do. We've got to get started with it, and 17 that's what we're looking for help on. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: The question I have -- I was 19 not aware when we went into the road district that there was 20 any question at all about the sale of the bonds. I was not 21 aware that there was any doubt whatsoever as to the sale. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's the condition 23 we went into. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: So, the question I have is, 25 if we go back and phase it, do we have any assurances that 27 1 we can sell the bond, even on a reduced phased program? 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: If we can get to a 3 level -- if we can get to a level of investment that the 4 current valuations cover, and -- and be able to give that 5 investor -- that first investor confidence that -- and in 6 the agreement, in the agreement to buy that bond, if I 7 understand Bob correctly, that additional debt will not be 8 incurred until the valuations are high enough to support 9 that additional risk, then I think that's a possibility. Is 10 it not, Bob? 11 MR. HENDERSON: I think that it is. I -- I 12 would hasten to add that we do not have a firm commitment 13 from an investor -- 14 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right. 15 MR. HENDERSON: -- at this time. And, Judge, 16 to address your initial comment, I agree. I have been doing 17 this for 18 years. I have never seen voted bonds that could 18 not be sold. This is the first time I've had trouble like 19 this in 18 years selling a piece of paper, and just never 20 dreamed that we couldn't find anybody that would be willing 21 to buy it at some price. And, I don't know what to say 22 other than that. The -- even though the debt-to-assessed- 23 valuation ratios are approaching 20 percent, we felt 24 confident that, at the very least, we could get some area 25 banks to -- to buy this debt. Haven't been able to do that. 28 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What is the outer 2 limits of that risk factor that you think is -- 3 MR. HENDERSON: Well, you know, I guess the 4 reason that I -- one of the reasons I didn't think that we 5 were going to have difficulty, even with assessed 6 valuations -- I mean, debt-to-assessed-valuation ratios 7 being -- approaching 20 percent, is that we've seen other 8 districts -- not necessarily road districts, but municipal 9 utility districts and other unrated issuers of debt with 10 ratios that high. I think the difference here is -- is that 11 those districts have had 20 and $25 million assessed 12 valuations in terms of their aggregate tax base, and they 13 were selling debt that was as high as the percentage of that 14 ratio. 15 Here, what we've got -- and because -- I 16 mean, let me go back and say, because they had $25 million 17 assessed valuations and they had a -- lots that might be 18 valued at anywhere from $35,000 to $75,000 per lot, the 19 investor saw a lot of diversification in that tax base. 20 And, what we're finding here is -- is equally as problematic 21 as the debt-to-AV ratio, is the fact that our aggregate tax 22 base is only 1.4 million, and we've got one home out there 23 that's almost $300,000 all by itself. So, when you take 24 off, you know, the top six homes, certainly the top six 25 property owners are 50 percent of the assessed valuation, 29 1 and they're saying, "Gosh, all it would take is -- is one or 2 two homeowners to not pay their taxes and we're in default 3 on the bonds." So, there's no -- no -- to answer your 4 question, there's no pat ratio, really, that we can apply 5 here. We've got a problem as much as anything else of the 6 fact that the gross assessed valuations is only $1.4 7 million. 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, I don't think we 9 need to beat this any longer today, but -- but I would 10 certainly ask for any help that anybody can come up with 11 for ways to pursue this, and -- and let me know or let Bob 12 know directly, and -- and we'll be scouring the community 13 again. And I think we need to run all the traps again and 14 look at a rephasing, which we're doing now, and see what we 15 can do, and just ask for your help, if -- if you can come up 16 with something. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Only thing I know is 18 that -- is that we don't need to drop the ball on it. We 19 need to keep it alive as long as possible. And the 20 Schreiner Trust Fund, which I think that we should go take a 21 look at, and I'd be happy to assist you in that, is -- I 22 think the thing was set up, and it's -- the verbiage in 23 there says something about, you know, farm-to-market, back 24 in the days when it was set up, you know, to get your mohair 25 from the ranch to town to sell and that kind of thing. 30 1 That's exactly what it was set up for. And, to me, this is 2 a little bit outside of that, but I'd be happy to -- be 3 happy to help in any way I can. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Thank you. I think 5 that's enough for today, but if anybody has got any ideas, 6 help. We need it. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Bob. 8 MR. HENDERSON: Thank you. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Item Number 2 is to consider 10 and discuss request for exception to O.S.S.F. Regulation 11 808.02(b) for property located at 340 Cedar Springs. 12 Commissioner Griffin? 13 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yes. The Court will 14 remember that this issue came before us once before. We 15 went through the -- the technical detail -- most of the 16 technical detail at that time. As it turned out, when the 17 item was submitted by -- by Ms. Whiteside, that the -- there 18 was a sale pending, but that contract did not happen, and so 19 we said when you do have a firm contract, come back and we 20 would revisit it, and that's the situation now. You'll see 21 in the package that there is a -- a copy of the pending 22 contract. There is a fax from -- faxed memo from Charlie 23 Wiedenfeld, our Designated Representative, recommending, as 24 he did in the last Court session, approval of this, and 25 that's where we are. Ms. Whiteside, anything to add? 31 1 MS. WHITESIDE: Nothing, really. We just 2 have a cash contract set to close in January. January 22nd. 3 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Okay. And so if the 4 Court -- 5 MS. WHITESIDE: Nothing's changed. 6 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: If no one has 7 questions, I'm set to make a motion on this. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: The question I have is, has 9 the agreement been drafted, negotiated, and signed for the 10 sharing of the septic system? 11 MS. WHITESIDE: Not yet. Jarrod Hamil will 12 do that when -- after they get the title policy, and start 13 preparing the documents, but it hasn't been prepared yet. 14 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, my motion would 15 include that that -- that is part of the deal. 16 MS. WHITESIDE: Right. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That it's contingent 18 on a -- on the proper execution of that agreement that we 19 had talked about before. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sorry, I don't know 21 what we're talking about, because I don't have any of that 22 backup material. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's in the section 24 before, probably. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This is confidential 32 1 information, Bill. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'll vote 3 confidentially, then. 4 (Discussion off the record.) 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I sure would like to 6 see the issue cleaned up. My god. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: If there's no further 9 questions, I'll make a motion that we approve the request as 10 submitted, with the understanding, as a contingency, that 11 the properly executed agreement on sharing be executed at 12 the time of closing. 13 MS. WHITESIDE: Do I need to -- when that's 14 done, do I just send it over here? 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: If you'll just send me 16 a copy, I'll make sure -- 17 MS. WHITESIDE: Before it's signed? I mean, 18 you don't want -- 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I want an executed -- 20 we need an executed copy. 21 MS. WHITESIDE: That won't be till 22 January 22nd. 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's fine. 24 MS. WHITESIDE: Okay. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 33 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 2 Griffin, second by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court 3 approve the request for exception to O.S.S.F. Regulation 4 808.02(b), Property Transfer, for property located at 340 5 Cedar Springs and the sharing of a septic system located 6 thereon with the property at Lot 6, Block 4, contingent upon 7 delivery to Commissioner Griffin of an executed copy of the 8 Septic Maintenance Agreement outlining the obligations of 9 each party for maintenance and upkeep of the system. Any 10 further questions or comments? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That -- if this is ever 12 to be transferred again, it would have to go through another 13 -- this is not a continued -- 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's correct. This is a 15 one-time -- one per customer. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, the only way I 17 would second this is because we have a recommendation from 18 our Designated Representative. 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And that's the only 20 reason I would make the motion, also. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Duly noted. Any further 22 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 23 right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 34 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 3 MS. WHITESIDE: Thank you. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Ms. Whiteside. 5 Next item is Item Number 3, consider and discuss approval of 6 the 2001/2002 Criminal Justice and Public Safety Community 7 Plan. I've asked Diane Oehler -- I believe she's here -- to 8 be here to answer any questions. Criminal Justice and 9 Public Safety Community Plan is something that -- that we do 10 on an annual basis. It's done by a large representative 11 group of the community who come together and spend an 12 afternoon talking about three areas: Crime and 13 delinquency -- juvenile justice, victims services, and 14 public safety and drug trafficking. Together, they 15 formulate a plan which is then the basis for grant requests 16 and interagency coordination. Last year, the Court approved 17 the last year's plan, which I understand was a step that was 18 very effective in presenting grant requests to the different 19 agencies and foundations. Diane, do you have anything you 20 want to add? 21 MS. OEHLER: No, but I'll be glad to answer 22 any questions y'all might have. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think Fred had 24 probably answered my question, but isn't this the -- the 25 engine that drives our grants for juvenile justice and 35 1 our -- 2 MS. OEHLER: Victim services and -- 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- victim services and 4 narcotics -- 5 MS. OEHLER: Right. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- the 216th? 7 MS. OEHLER: I think we have eight working 8 grants out of nonprofits. The new school resource officers 9 that Kerrville and Ingram -- maybe Center Point, too -- have 10 are funded out of these grants. Victims services, Crisis 11 Council, K'Star, CASA, the new CAP, the advocacy center, all 12 have a basis in these grants. The new idea out of AACOG is 13 that this will be the first step in a comprehensive 5-year 14 plan for the counties in terms of reaching out, and that's 15 not so much you gentlemen as the -- and I look at it from 16 the nonprofit perspective, as we work to do service in the 17 community. We can approach private foundations through 18 these -- through this grant -- I mean, through this 19 community plan. We had good attendance this year. People 20 came and worked. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: I was pleased to see some new 22 people. Bill Blackburn was here on behalf of Parkerson 23 Industries, some people we hadn't seen in the last couple 24 years. 25 MS. OEHLER: We appreciate the County Judge 36 1 chairing the meeting. AACOG sends somebody over, but it's 2 always much better if the communities are involved, so the 3 more the Commissioners Court can become involved, too, in 4 the future, the better it will be. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any questions or comments? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move we approve the 7 2001-2002 Criminal Justice and Public Safety Community Plan. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 11 Baldwin, seconded by Commissioner Williams, that the Court 12 approve the 2001-2002 Criminal Justice and Public Safety 13 Community Plan. Any further questions or comments? If not, 14 all in favor, raise your right hands. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carried. 19 MS. OEHLER: Thank you. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Diane. Next item 21 is Item Number 4, consider and discuss approval of the 22 county-sponsored contract between Kerr County and the Kids 23 Advocacy Place, Inc., and authorize County Judge to sign 24 same. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved, Judge. 37 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 3 Williams, seconded by Commissioner Letz, that the Court 4 approve the county-sponsored contract between Kerr County 5 and the Kids Advocacy Place, Inc., and authorize County 6 Judge to sign same. Any further questions or comments? If 7 not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Next item is 12 Item Number 5, consider and discuss acceptance of RFP's for 13 performance of the Colonia Planning Grant. As the Court 14 will remember, Kerr County applied for and was awarded a 15 $98,000 Colonia Grant to map those portions of Kerr County 16 that have substandard infrastructure, such as water and 17 wastewater. We sent out a request for RFP's for interested 18 parties to perform the actual planning. I've received only 19 one response to our request, which I will now open. It is 20 from Grantworks, and it is a proposal to do the Kerr County 21 2000 Texas Community Development Program, Colonia 22 Comprehensive Planning Study, within the budget of the 23 grant. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, Eric Hartzell 25 is here. 38 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Mr. Hartzell, do you want to 2 make any comments? 3 MR. HARTZELL: Thank you. Thank you, Judge 4 Henneke and Commissioners Court. Yeah, the -- the Colonia 5 Planning Grant grants are a fairly new program, and Kerr 6 County's about the sixth county, I believe, to be awarded. 7 Right now we're working with four other counties, in 8 Bandera, Atascosa, and Medina in this area, performing these 9 studies. Atascosa County will be finished in January, the 10 first one. And, we look forward to helping you with this. 11 It's a lot of mapping, working a lot with the other groups 12 here in the county, probably the U.G.R.A. quite a bit, and 13 we'll have meetings with you as well periodically, workshop 14 meetings and things like that, assuming that you award us 15 the contract. I also have a status report. I don't know if 16 I can hand that out now or -- can do I that? It's on the 17 other grants that we also have been applying for, just so 18 you'll have information. And, I'll be happy to answer any 19 questions. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anyone have any questions of 21 Mr. Hartzell? 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I have a question just 23 of the process here. Do we -- do we need to accept it and 24 then have the proposal reviewed by Commissioner Williams and 25 whoever -- or whatever -- do we need to do that and then 39 1 come back and approve it, or -- 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: We can do that, or we can 3 simply accept the proposal, since it is the only one. I 4 guess our alternatives are to refer it for review, bring it 5 back hopefully by the end of today, review it, and then if 6 it's not acceptable, renew our RFP, or to accept the 7 proposal as presented. 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah, just to make 9 sure we've -- 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: There is a timeline, 11 is there not, Eric, which this has to be accepted? 12 MR. HARTZELL: There's not any specific 13 timeline. Before the next meeting or at your next meeting, 14 even, will be fine. 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I would just recommend 16 that Commissioner Williams, since he is familiar with the 17 RFP as it was written, just take a look at it and we can 18 come back after our break. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'll take a look at 20 it. 21 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So that there's -- 22 somebody has looked at it and said, yes, this is what we 23 asked for. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Is that a motion to accept 25 the proposal and refer to it Commissioner Williams for 40 1 review and report to the Commissioners Court? 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yes, Judge, that's a 3 motion. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Do I have a second? 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'll second. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 7 Griffin, seconded by Commissioner Williams, that we accept 8 the proposal from Grantworks for Colonia Comprehensive 9 Planning Studies and refer it to Commissioner Williams for 10 review and recommendation to the Commissioners Court, 11 hopefully before we adjourn today. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My only -- I would 13 probably be more comfortable having a -- I hate to refer it 14 for formal approval by our County Attorney because it takes 15 a long time, but considering that we're probably going to 16 award the grant to the same company that brought it to us -- 17 I mean, we're only dealing with one entity the whole time. 18 I really would -- from a legal standpoint, to make sure that 19 everything is in order, it would be my preference to 20 recommend it to the County -- run it through the County 21 Attorney's office. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, if we choose to accept 23 it, we can then set it up for the approval of the County 24 Attorney's office. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That will be fine. 41 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: The motion before us is to 2 accept the proposal and refer it to Commissioner Williams 3 for review and recommendation. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who will ultimately 5 refer it to the County Attorney. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Then you bring it back, and 7 if we -- 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That will take care of 10 that, then. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: If we award it, then it's 12 awarded subject to review of the County Attorney. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I got you. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Everyone clear, then? Any 15 questions? Any further questions or comments? If not, all 16 in favor, raise your right hands. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would like to ask 22 Eric, while he's still here, for just a brief explanation of 23 this document you gave us. 24 MR. HARTZELL: Sure. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: With respect to where 42 1 we are in these other two grants, a quarter of a million 2 Community Development Grant, which I believe was the one 3 that was approved by AACOG or scored well by AACOG? 4 MR. HARTZELL: Sure. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that correct? 6 MR. HARTZELL: Mm-hmm. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And then the other 8 half million dollar grant, both of which walk hand-in-hand 9 with the potential of doing the Kerrville South wastewater 10 treatment? 11 MR. HARTZELL: That's correct. Probably do 12 about 25 percent, 30 percent of the area would be in these 13 two grants. The first grant that you mentioned, the 14 Community Development Program Grant, is the one that went to 15 Alamo to have the scoring. The State does the other half of 16 the score. They should be done probably in January, is what 17 they're saying right now. We did -- the County scored 18 number 18 out of 29 at Alamo, which is actually fairly good 19 for the County. The counties that came in didn't score very 20 well this year. There's somewhat of a political process 21 there. The -- once the State does its scoring, the County 22 should rise in the rankings slightly because of the fact 23 that the project is a first-time sewer project, which scores 24 very well at the State. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: We're starting to get into a 43 1 problem here, because it's not a posted item. We'll take 2 what you've given us as information, but at this time we 3 need to move on. 4 MR. HARTZELL: Okay. Any other questions, 5 you can let me know. Thank you. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, Eric. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Next item is Item Number 6, 8 consider and discuss approving members of the Child Services 9 Board per Texas Family Code, Section 264.005. Commissioner 10 Baldwin. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. As your 12 liaison, we have been going over the Child Service Board, 13 working with them, and -- and as per the note that I wrote 14 y'all and put in your agenda packet, I wanted to let you 15 know what's going on here. The -- through the years, you 16 know, these -- these boards change memberships, and it's 17 hard to find folks that will serve on them, so it's a 18 continual change. And, through the years, we've gotten away 19 from the contract and gotten away from the state law, and so 20 what we're doing now is taking a close look at it and trying 21 to bring it back -- and not trying to, but we're bringing it 22 back to -- to where it's supposed to be. And, in our 23 contract, it states that the -- initially, the appointees 24 will be designated to serve the following terms; one-third 25 of the members appointed to 3-year terms, one-third of 44 1 members to 2-year terms, and one-third of the members to 2 1-year terms. So, also in your packet we have this slate of 3 officers that serve on that board and the term beside them, 4 which -- which works -- works out well with our contract. 5 And that's all I'm asking today, is that this Commissioners 6 Court is supposed to approve the slate of officers every 7 year, and so that's what we're doing today, is approving 8 that slate. And then, later on, we're going to come back -- 9 when our County Attorney gets Governor Bush elected, we'll 10 be back with our new contract that completes it. So, I 11 would like to make the motion that we approve this slate of 12 officers for 2000-2001. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 14 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 16 Baldwin, seconded by Commissioner Letz, that the Court 17 approve the Child Services Board members as presented. Any 18 questions or comments? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just one quick 20 question. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Mr. Letz got ahead of you. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm sorry, go ahead. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are all these members 24 currently serving? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir, they are. 45 1 They're in place. That's what we're doing. They've been 2 functioning for some time now. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And how are the members 4 getting -- how are they being found? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, that's a good 6 question. We -- we go into the alleyways and backways and 7 under rocks and wherever we can. I am responsible for a 8 couple of folks on here. Where the rest of them come from, 9 I have no idea. It's closely tied to the -- the state 10 system over there. So, you know, they go out and find those 11 folks, and most of these people are plugged into this type 12 of system somewhere in this area. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 14 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Are we responsible -- 15 I'm sorry. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, Commissioner Letz 17 asked the question I had in mind. Thank you. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Are we responsible for 19 appointing all of these members? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. Yes, sir. 21 They serve to the Commissioners Court. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we've gotten -- 24 that's the point. We've gotten completely away from that. 25 And it's not their fault, of course. They just lost contact 46 1 with contracts and state law. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I've been meeting 4 with them and our attorney's been meeting with them. We're 5 slowly but surely getting back in place. 6 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Okay. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Do we have a good geographic 8 representation? I know most of these people, but could you 9 use some suggestions from the other Commissioners for people 10 in their areas? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure. Sure. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- you know, 13 that's kind of where I was going with my question, and I 14 think it -- at this point, I think it's probably best to go 15 ahead and approve this list, but I think probably what we 16 need to do is just get a -- you know, we've discussed 17 before, for all the boards that we make appointees to -- I 18 know we have another appointment coming up a little bit 19 later, as to what precinct they're in and what all the 20 different things we make appointments to. It seems like 21 several times a year we make appointments, and I think it's 22 important that we keep, if possible, geographic -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's one of the 24 things we're going to do in the contract, is to add into the 25 contract that this be done on an annual basis, which it 47 1 never has. It's not in there. And -- 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do we know the 3 precinct breakdown of this list? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion before the Court is to 7 approve the members as presented. It's been made and 8 seconded. Any further questions or comments? If not, all 9 in favor, raise your right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 12 (No response.) 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I will tell you now, 15 most of them are in my precinct. 16 (Laughter.) 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 18 (Discussion off the record.) 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Next item is Item Number 7, 20 consider and discuss setting February 22nd, 2001, as the 21 grand opening for the renovated courthouse. Commissioner 22 Baldwin. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. You know, 24 we had talked about having the grand opening of the new 25 facilities upstairs here and the new building next door on 48 1 February the 12th, which was President Lincoln's birthday, 2 and now I understand that we've run into a little more 3 problems getting the facilities completed, which is beyond 4 me. I'm not -- I'm not here to discuss that. I think we'll 5 discuss that later on. But, I would like to move that date 6 from February the 12th to February 22nd. And, again, the 7 District Judges have agreed to that date also, and we're 8 simply moving it from President Lincoln's birthday to 9 President Washington's birthday. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You do so with the 11 reasonable assurance the contractor will be out of here? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I tell you, on -- on 13 February 22nd, I'm having a grand opening, and I'd like for 14 y'all to be there. But, if not, that's your problem. We're 15 having one. From 1 o'clock to 4 o'clock, preferably. Now, 16 that's not in stone at this point, but it's something we 17 kind of kicked around. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Commissioner Letz, what do 19 you think the chances are that we'll have a complete project 20 at that time? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the probability 22 of having a grand opening is very good. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: On that date? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On that date. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: I'm very serious about that. 49 1 I do not think, based on current discussions, that we'll be 2 done with the construction at that time. At what stage they 3 will be, God only knows. So, the real question is whether 4 we want to go ahead and have the grand opening laid in 5 stone, with the likelihood that they're not going to be 6 done. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I agree with 8 that. The Judge and I met with the contractor and the 9 architect one day last week for a marathon meeting about all 10 these situations. My feeling is that -- I mean, I like the 11 date being Washington's birthday. I also liked Lincoln's 12 birthday as the date. I think it will be enough complete to 13 do the grand opening. I think there will be things that 14 will be left to do, but fairly minor. But, I'm not going to 15 let -- let the date, you know, rush us into accepting the 16 project. I mean, we're going to -- it is likely there'll be 17 some things left to be done; we'll not have finally accepted 18 everything by that date, is my gut feeling. But, the date's 19 good. We can have a grand opening without it being 100 20 percent complete. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Do we have a motion? 23 Was that a motion? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, that was a motion to 25 set the date for the 22nd of February for grand opening. 50 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I'll second that. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Commissioner Baldwin, do you 3 want to make the motion? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't know. Let my 5 anger settle down here just a little bit. I'd like to make 6 that as a motion, yes. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll second it. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 9 Baldwin, seconded by Commissioner Letz, that the Court -- 10 that the Court schedule February 22nd, Year 2001, from 1:00 11 to 4:00 as the grand opening for the renovated courthouse 12 and courthouse annex. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And, just to help his 14 anger a little bit, I mean, the contractor has said he'd be 15 done by the 15th. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, we'd set it for 17 the 12th. Didn't, after your meeting, you come back and say 18 the new finish date is the 14th? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 14th, that's right. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 14th, and I'm saying 21 the 22nd. And you're saying now that that is not a real 22 number either? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm just going on past 24 history with the contractor. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, again, I think 51 1 the guy -- you know, let's get our attorney to write him a 2 letter and tell him to work around the clock and get the 3 hell out of town. It's getting to be nuts. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Our last agenda item -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This is costing these 6 people a lot of money. A lot of money, way over, and it's 7 just getting ridiculous. All right. I've vented and I'm 8 happy. Let's go on. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion's been made and 10 seconded. Any further questions or comments? If not, all 11 in favor, raise your right hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Item 2.8, 16 consider and discuss appointment of Stanley A. Schaeffer of 17 Hunt to serve on the Texas Veterans Land Board Kerr County 18 Committee. Before I turn this over to Mr. Griffin, y'all 19 may recall that we currently have two of the three members 20 of the land committee. The chair is Ron Sprott, who is a 21 former city councilman, lives in the city of Kerrville, 22 school in Comfort. The other member is Steve Galland, 23 retired Master Sergeant, I think, from the U.S. Air Force, 24 lives in Center Point. And, now Commissioner Griffin has 25 come forward with someone to represent the western end of 52 1 the county. Commissioner? 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yes. And I would like 3 to -- to move that Mr. Stanley Schaeffer of Hunt be 4 appointed to that open position. Mr. Schaeffer is here, and 5 I can tell you that he meets all the requirements. He is a 6 veteran, he's a property owner, and very energetic in 7 community activities, and I think he will make a great 8 addition to this committee, and he's ready to go to work. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll second that 10 motion. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 12 Griffin, seconded by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court 13 appoint Stanley A. Schaeffer of Hunt, Texas, to serve on the 14 Texas Veterans Land Board Kerr County Committee. Any 15 further questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise 16 your right hands. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Stan. We 21 appreciate your willingness to serve. All right. The next 22 item is Item Number 9. At this time, we will recess the 23 regular Commissioners Court meeting and open the public 24 hearing on the proposed Kerr County On-Site Sewage Facility 25 Rules and Regulations. 53 1 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 10:00 a.m., and a public hearing 2 was held in open court, as follows:) 3 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: These rules were approved by 5 the Commissioners Court approximately one month ago, and 6 have been available for inspection at the County Clerk's 7 office. We've been working on this project for some time 8 now, and I think we're finally getting close, at least to 9 the point where we can take final action on this. We have a 10 number of people who signed up to address the Court on this 11 issue. We'd ask you to be brief and nonrepetitive, if 12 possible. You're going to have a full chance to be heard. 13 We'll start with Paul Siemers of Hunt. Paul? 14 MR. SIEMERS: I just have a -- Paul Siemers, 15 Hunt, HC-1, Box 156N. I just have a couple quick comments. 16 You have been working with us a long time, and I appreciate 17 Commissioner Griffin's efforts on this. And, I've spoken 18 with him about it, and I guess what I want to say today is 19 that the State of Texas rules are Kerr County rules and Kerr 20 County's rules are State of Texas rules, and I don't know 21 what more we have to talk about. Thank you. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. Mr. Jim Brown 23 from U.G.R.A. 24 MR. BROWN: For the record, my name is Jim 25 Brown, General Manager of the Upper Guadalupe River 54 1 Authority, and I'm speaking to you as both the River 2 Authority's interest in water quality and U.G.R.A.'s 3 interest in fulfilling a current contract that we have with 4 the County to administer the County's O.S.S.F. program. 5 U.G.R.A. is in support of the -- of the rules. 6 (Several photographs handed to the Court.) 7 MR. BROWN: If I may -- I don't have enough 8 to hand out. If you will share these, I'll make a very, 9 very brief comment. The photographs that I have handed to 10 you will support our only concern about the rules as 11 written, and that's the -- that's the statement that -- that 12 limits the inspections to surface inspections. The -- the 13 first photograph I'd like to talk about is this particular 14 photograph that shows the cross-section and the pipe. As 15 you can see, that is -- that is a drain field that's located 16 on top of rock. There is absolutely no way for that to -- 17 for the effluent to have percolated into the soil. It would 18 have followed that rock strata and possibly outcropped in 19 the neighbor's yard. That was discovered along with the 20 fact that the septic tank was crushed. The walls had caved 21 in, and the system was inadequate to serve the needs of the 22 treatment. 23 The next -- the photograph of the four, very 24 briefly, that is a cesspool. If you'll look at the bottom 25 left-hand corner, you can see the cesspool is covered with a 55 1 -- a piece of plywood. The soil was implied -- or installed 2 on top of the plywood. The -- and grass had grown above the 3 plywood. Had we not have done a visual inspection on both 4 of these projects -- and there are many, many more. We just 5 discovered one out in Hunt on the South Fork the other day, 6 a very upscale home that had been there for quite some time. 7 It was being served by two cesspools. Both of those 8 cesspools on a ground surface would not have indicated they 9 were even there, much less malfunctioning, because they were 10 in the alluvials, and the untreated effluent out of those 11 cesspools, we assume, was traversing through the alluvials 12 into the South Fork of the river. 13 U.G.R.A. has asked that the County consider 14 maybe expanding Item Number 10-C, and consider removing the 15 term "surface inspection" and expand on that to cover three 16 various categories of types of construction -- or types of 17 situations. Briefly, I have substitute language I'd like to 18 hand to the court. We believe that the substitute language 19 will go a long way to protect the water quality and efforts 20 along the Guadalupe and its various tributaries. And, with 21 that, I think I -- I think I've sent to you -- to the Court 22 in a previous correspondence our review of the rules. We 23 find them -- we find them -- although simplistic, we find 24 them very adequate to protect the water quality issues of 25 the river. There is a -- there is an item in Section 12 56 1 that's an administrative item that U.G.R.A. and the County 2 should probably discuss at another time. Thank you. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Mr. Brown. John 4 Vanderkam? 5 MR. VANDERKAM: Good morning. My name is 6 John Vanderkam, and I live at 2849 Bandera Highway in 7 Kerrville, Texas. First, let me say I applaud the Court for 8 not trying to reinvent the wheel by implementing the Texas 9 Natural -- Natural Resource Conservation Commission's rules 10 covering on-site sewer facilities. However, having said 11 that, I believe you are burdening the citizens and this 12 Court by imposing Section 10, Paragraph B, which covers the 13 minimum number acreage required to have both a well and an 14 on-site septic facility. As you know, under Section 285.4, 15 Paragraph C, of the T.N.R.C.C. rules, a minimum of 1 acre is 16 required, and you want to have a 5-acre minimum. I think 17 this is highly restrictive. I believe and understand your 18 intent of reducing the density of future tracts or lots, but 19 we can't charge -- change what is already in place. I don't 20 understand why you'd want to hear all the requests for 21 variances that will occur when the property changes 22 ownership. A couple of suggested recommendations are to 23 either remove Section 10, Paragraph B, from the rules and 24 let your proposed Subdivision Rules cover future density, 25 or, as the T.N.R.C.C. rules often does, grandfather existing 57 1 systems subject to all the other requirements of inspection, 2 fees, and et cetera. Thank you. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. Jorge Zapata? 4 MR. ZAPATA: Good morning, gentlemen. I'm 5 Jorge Zapata, and I work for a local wastewater company, and 6 I got some concerns and questions for y'all. One of my 7 questions is on this surface inspection on the existing 8 systems, like Mr. Brown was saying a while ago. There's -- 9 there's a lot of places up there where there's only 10 cesspools, and with the surface inspection, we don't know 11 where -- and the -- the drain fields. So, I don't think 12 y'all folks want to -- a septic system on a drain field 13 close to the well, because, you know, if you don't do a 14 subsurface inspection, you don't know where the system is. 15 How do we know it's going to be compliant or not in 16 compliance and violate even the state regulations? So, I 17 mean, you -- you're planning to license a system where it's 18 not in compliance with any rules, and even if the State said 19 no cesspools and no closer than 100 feet from the well, if 20 we -- if we do just a surface inspection, we don't know if 21 it's, you know, plenty far from the wells or not. So, 22 there's some of my concerns and my -- some of my questions. 23 And, the other one is going to be caliche 24 materials. I don't know why we never -- never discussed 25 this material before on previous sessions. The -- I don't 58 1 know. There's some of my questions. So, we don't -- we 2 don't have the understanding of what the caliche's going to 3 do on treating sewage, or -- or just because a system -- we 4 hear from many folks, from many peoples out there, the 5 system is working for many years. You know, a lot of people 6 say, "My system worked for 20 years, I never have a 7 problem." So, why did they change this? So, that means how 8 slow we perk the sewage. The system's working, so we're 9 migrating the water to where? To the rivers? To the creek? 10 To somebody's neighbor? And, I have a lot of material here 11 on caliche; I have a lot of data here on caliche material. 12 I'll be glad to share all this information with y'all. And 13 even landscape companies, they're -- they don't want to use 14 caliche for their work. 15 But, back to the wastewater. In this 16 state -- the State approved these -- for these soil 17 scientists to -- to train the people in the state on this -- 18 on soil -- on soils, so -- so when the State said -- and 19 they approved these soil scientists to teach the people 20 across the state that caliche materials are not suitable for 21 on-site systems. Why -- why we saying that we can use that? 22 Why are the counties -- why don't they hire or use -- they 23 don't hire or contract a professional on soils to do a study 24 on soils on caliche materials before we make a decision? 25 Before -- before, years back, when we were using caliche 59 1 materials, especially the south side of the county, it was a 2 lot of problems there. A lot of problems there. So, once 3 we start eliminating the use of caliche, we don't have that 4 many problems any more. Water's been cleaner. And why do 5 we go back to that? You know, not even the State has 6 answers if the caliche is usable -- suitable or not. So, if 7 we don't have the answers on that, why do we want to take 8 the chance to use it? Why do we want to take the chance to 9 contaminate our waters? These are questions I don't 10 understand. And -- and I'm out there in the field. I'm a 11 site and soil evaluator. I'm every day out there on the 12 field. My hands is out there on the field all the time 13 testing soils, caliche materials, and I can show y'all folks 14 and -- and what's the differences between the -- the sewage 15 treating -- the caliche materials in soils treating on-site 16 wastewater. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Mr. Zapata. 18 MR. ZAPATA: Thank you. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Bernard Syfan? 20 MR. SYFAN: Good day, gentlemen. Back again, 21 and again I commend you for taking large steps towards 22 sanity. I have one concern here. Again, it's a -- your 23 Section 10 and the inclusion of every property, whether it's 24 1,000 acres or a half acre, under the same rule is -- is my 25 concern. The -- a house, say it has two or three or four 60 1 people in it, has a certain effect on the environment, and 2 that house in the middle of 1,000 acres is -- is absorbed, 3 just like nature has always absorbed these things. But 4 where it's a half acre or a third of an acre, it becomes so 5 intense that it's a big problem. So, you've got two 6 extremes there that we're looking at, and to throw them all 7 into the same pile is not really rational. We're here to be 8 responsible, not restrictive, I believe. And I think that 9 you need to draw a line logically, scientifically, fairly, 10 where it becomes a problem. And where it's a problem, we 11 need to address it. Where it's not a problem, we should 12 leave it alone. Nature takes care of these things. 13 I have cattle on my ranch. If we put a cow 14 in every third acre all over this county, we'd have some 15 big, bad problems. If we put cows every 1,000 acres, we 16 don't have a problem. Come up with a place that's rational. 17 Ten acres of land can very easily absorb a house. Ten acres 18 of land can easily absorb a house. If you put the sewage 19 too close -- sewage treatment facility too close to the 20 river, it's different from putting it far away from the 21 river. So, yes, there ought to be a restriction in 22 proximity to the river. But, I really request that you stop 23 and think this over, and I would suggest that item 10-A be 24 deleted and revised to designate a logical acreage. I'm 25 suggesting 10 acres is that logical acreage. And that Item 61 1 B, as revised, I guess it is, should be -- should recognize 2 that you go in and inspect any that are supposed to be 3 licensed. Thank you very much. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Mr. Syfan. Jerry 5 Wheeler? 6 MR. WHEELER: Good morning. At the workshop 7 done by the T.N.R.C.C., I asked a question. If the rules of 8 the state are followed, is the environment protected? The 9 gentleman from T.N.R.C.C.'s answer was yes. So, I'm going 10 to ask this Court again, why are we doing more? The 11 environment is paramount. That's what needs to be 12 protected. Thank you. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. Bill Stacy? 14 MR. STACY: Gentlemen, again, I rise to 15 the -- when you took the -- when you placed over in the 16 Clerk's office your revised rules, again, you're putting a 17 financial burden on the camping industry by taking away the 18 25-acre exemption. Any way you slice it, it's going to turn 19 over to the camps a very difficult financial burden, and 20 that should be restored. It's my understanding, as the 21 gentleman has spoken, that we are following some of the 22 state rules. I did not see over there any state rules. 23 It's my understanding that there is a 10-acre exemption, and 24 that should be in our rules here. It bothers me that there 25 wasn't a more in-depth workshop to other people in the 62 1 camping industry and other people that have dealt with this 2 problem for years. 3 There's an old saying, an Indian saying, that 4 the man that walks in another man's moccasins knows what the 5 situation is. And, I'll look to the Court, 'cause I've been 6 there, done that, and I've walked in those moccasins, and I 7 would think that you would take somebody's advice who has 8 been there and has walked in those moccasins, because I can 9 see what has happened, and the -- these rules have been 10 interpreted. The man that's responsible for the enforcement 11 of these rules has been -- his own company has been in 12 violation. I think, gentlemen, you should restore as a 13 minimum a 10-acre exemption, and look what you might do in 14 harm financially to one of the entities that's been the 15 backbone of this community. So, it's up to you to make that 16 decision. Thank you. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. Toni Burch? 18 MS. BURCH: Yes. This is my first visit. 19 I'm a new resident in Kerrville, and I'm really here out of 20 fear. And, I apologize for having not read the rules in 21 advance, but up until this weekend, I didn't think that this 22 applied to me. Then I read something in the newspaper that 23 scared me to death, and that's why I'm here, 'cause I've 24 asked other people, but I need to hear from y'all, because 25 I'm really afraid. I own 2.5 acres only up on Upper Turtle 63 1 Creek, and all along I've followed this in the newspaper. 2 I've thought it only applied to new subdivisions, but then 3 there was just this one sentence in the newspaper that made 4 me afraid it applied to me. And I already have my well in 5 and I'm getting ready to build after the first of the year, 6 and if these new rules apply to me, I'm out of luck. My 7 property value will be zero. My investment in my well will 8 be zero and my dream will be gone. Will these rules apply 9 to me? 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Ms. Burch. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We'll have a discussion 12 about it after all the comments. 13 MS. BURCH: Okay. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: This is a public hearing. We 15 cannot -- it's not for us to answer questions. Gordon 16 Morgan? 17 MR. MORGAN: I assume that our discussion 18 today is on that 3-page piece of -- or document that has to 19 do with Section 10. I don't want to discuss whether caliche 20 works or doesn't work. I would hope we can discuss the 21 three items in 10 and justify their usage, or even determine 22 whether they are legal or not legal or enforceable. In A, 23 it says regardless of the acreage involved, a permit and an 24 inspection are required for all O.S.S.F.'s in Kerr County. 25 I may interpret that wrong, but that tells me that 64 1 regardless of the state rules, which do give exemptions and 2 grandfather clauses, that this nullifies that. If that is 3 to be used, I would think one would need to say that all 4 new S.F.S. -- O.S.S.F. systems, and also it should address 5 that the grandfather clauses which the state rules and 6 regulations grant be acknowledged, and also any allowances 7 as by state rules as to exemptions. 8 The second item, as required in the Kerr 9 County Subdivision Rules and Regulations, tracts or lots 10 with private wells and systems shall be a minimum of 11 5 acres. This is addressed in your Subdivision Rules and 12 Regulations. And I may recall incorrectly, but I think that 13 was one of the things that the State had said that should be 14 addressed in the Subdivision Rules and Regulations, rather 15 than the on-site rules. Thirdly, when the ownership of 16 property with a system -- and I'm going to say "system" 17 instead of "O.S.S.F." -- is transferred by sale, contract 18 for deed, gift, or by any other means, the Designated 19 Representative shall be notified, and the Designated 20 Representative shall make a surface inspection. And, rather 21 than argue about what is a surface inspection and rather 22 than argue whether it's adequate or not, who is to notify 23 the Designated Representative? Whose responsibility is 24 that? Is that the new owner, or is that the person 25 transferring the property? We can go into defining surface 65 1 inspections, and I think that needs to be done before people 2 approve something that they may not be sure what that 3 designates. 4 But, in closing, I would like to suggest to 5 the Court that they eliminate Section 10 in its entirety. 6 The State rules and regulations, as amended in '99, and as 7 -- in part of your resource material, covers everything that 8 Kerr County ever intended to cover, beginning in '88 and 9 '89. The soil -- Carlisle studies, the soil classifications 10 have been incorporated. They don't call them that, but 11 they're here. If you do an analysis of the soil, you will 12 find that the profiles and the regulations and systems that 13 Carlisle called for are directly proportional to the ones 14 that are in here. So, as a practical matter, as a political 15 matter, as a peace on the home front, we all realize we have 16 to live by state rules, whether we like it or not. We do 17 not have a choice. But we do have a choice of what we add 18 to those. And, as you all well realize, these are political 19 issues, and I would urge the Court to eliminate Section 10. 20 Thank you. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Mr. Morgan. 22 Anyone else who wishes to address the Court in this public 23 hearing? Anyone else? Come forward. 24 MR. PURDY: I'm Bill Purdy. I live on the 25 south side of Ingram Lake, and I have less than 5 acres. 66 1 I've had this property for several years. I agree with John 2 Vanderkam's analysis of this. You would render our property 3 completely worthless if you put in the 5 acres with -- when 4 we have a perfectly functioning system, water well and 5 everything. So, I think that you should give a grandfather 6 clause to functioning properly systems. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Mr. Wiedenfeld? 8 MR. WIEDENFELD: Your Honor, I would just 9 like to submit some written comments. 10 (Document handed to the Court.) 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: All right, thank you. Anyone 12 else? Mr. Oehler? Bruce Oehler. 13 MR. OEHLER: Good morning. Glad to be here. 14 Sorry I have to come back again, but this is a very 15 important issue and has been for a long time, and I just -- 16 I guess I have several questions, and most of them related 17 to what Mr. Morgan was just -- or Dr. Morgan was just 18 addressing, and that was Section 10. To my knowledge, Kerr 19 County doesn't seem to have much history of pollution or 20 nuisance or public health hazard on tracts of 10 acres or 21 larger. It just doesn't seem to exist. We know where the 22 problems areas are. Those areas don't seem to be a problem, 23 so I don't understand why we can't eliminate Section 10 and 24 put the acreage exemption back in, just like the State has 25 in their rules. And, I think you just adopt those and -- 67 1 and everybody will go away, and I think -- I know I'll go 2 away. 'Cause I know we have to live with -- with the rules 3 and the way they're submitted by the State. I guess another 4 thing is that if we -- if we adopt the rules as y'all have 5 presented them today, there's going to be a large 6 expenditure of more staffing to enforce those rules, and 7 that, of course, will cause some tax increase to the 8 taxpayers in the future, and it's not going to be a small 9 amount if you're talking about doing every system in Kerr 10 County, whether it's necessary or not. It's a lot of money. 11 And, I believe there's enough money being spent in Kerr 12 County right now on a lot of other projects. I don't 13 believe this one is one that needs to be done at this time. 14 Maybe in the future, but I don't see it now. The State 15 doesn't see it now, because they have spent many years 16 developing the rules that they have in place, and they amend 17 them periodically when they need amending. It'd sure be 18 easy if we just go ahead and do what the State asks us to do 19 and -- and I don't believe you'll have much of a fight that 20 way. That's really all I have. Thank you. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. Anyone else? 22 Anyone else? Seeing no one else, we're going to close the 23 public hearing now, going to take about a 10-minute break 24 and return at 20 minutes to 11:00 and take up the next item, 25 which is consideration of the O.S.S.F. Rules. 68 1 (The public hearing was concluded at 10:30 a.m., and the regular Commissioners Court 2 meeting was reopened.) 3 (Recess taken from 10:30 a.m. to 10:40 a.m.) 4 - - - - - - - - - - 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Let's reconvene this session 6 of the Kerr County Commissioners Court. The next item for 7 consideration is Item Number 10, which is consider and 8 discuss adoption of the proposed Kerr County On-Site Sewage 9 Facility Rules and Regulations. Commissioner Griffin. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Thank you. Can 11 everybody -- everybody out there that's interested in this 12 subject hear and be heard? 13 AUDIENCE: No. Close the door. 14 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think we're going to 15 have to ask folks to come on in, 'cause I know the noise is 16 such out there you cannot hear in the back of the room. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Move your mike closer. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And this will help, 19 too. Okay. Can everybody hear me now? Okay. I want to 20 first say thanks for all of the -- over the last several 21 months, thanks for all the inputs from citizens and other 22 agencies, and particularly those who were interested enough 23 to come to these public hearings and make an input. I think 24 the dispassionate dialogue that we've had today is a good 25 example of people trying to get together and get the right 69 1 issues on the table and make sure that we, the public 2 officials that have to judge on this, have considered all 3 the aspects of the issue before we act. I hope, as I have 4 said many times, that we're drawing to the end of this 5 process. It started some months ago. I've just about 6 filled up a hard drive on one of my computers with various 7 versions of rules and various versions of other documents 8 that I have either received from the State or from other 9 agencies around the state. 10 As everybody here probably knows, we have had 11 several public hearings on this issue, and we've listened to 12 arguments from -- on both sides of the issue, to be more 13 restrictive and to be less restrictive. And, I think what I 14 keep coming down to is, let's see what the law says and 15 let's see what the jurisdictions are, and let's write a rule 16 that we think will last and one that can serve all the 17 citizens and the people in Kerr County. In that regard, I, 18 just as late as last week, have been in contact again with 19 the T.N.R.C.C. I got several pieces of information from 20 them about how these rules that they have were developed, 21 and how we have -- how they have been amended in the past, 22 what the various jurisdictions are, and what different 23 agencies and entities have an input into this process. And, 24 so, I would tell the other members of the Court at the same 25 time I tell you, I've sort of come full circle again on this 70 1 issue. And, I think that -- and I -- I don't base this on 2 what's been said here today; I was going to say this when I 3 came in here this morning before we ever met. I believe 4 that we need to give the state rule a real chance to 5 operate, and I am going to make some motions for amendments 6 to these rules before we adopt them that will essentially do 7 that. 8 There are some technical -- there is one 9 technical correction that I'll also make a motion on to do 10 as well, but I believe that where I come down now is that we 11 should adopt the state rule as our county rule. If other 12 jurisdictions -- and, by the way, we have three 13 jurisdictions involved now. We have the City of Kerrville, 14 who has a rule, the City of Ingram has a rule, and the 15 County has a rule. But, if those or any other jurisdictions 16 want to make additional rules above and beyond what we set 17 today, then that is certainly their right to do so. I 18 wouldn't impinge on that right by trying to say that 19 whatever we do here is the absolute final authority. With 20 that, I'd like to hear any comments from the other 21 Commissioners, and then I'll make a set of motions to do 22 what I think would be perfect the document. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Does anyone else have any 24 comments? Jonathan? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd just like to thank 71 1 Larry for the hours he's put into this, hours and days. I 2 mean, it's -- I know he's put in a tremendous amount of 3 time, and I've talked to him a great deal for resolution and 4 some guidance in understanding the state rules, and our 5 current rules, for that matter. And, I think -- you know, 6 I -- I think all along, I basically agreed that we should go 7 with the state rules, with maybe a few modifications, and 8 the more I look at it, I think I am further and further 9 along the path to going with the state rules, period. I 10 think, from what I'm hearing, Larry's going that direction 11 as well. That's really my only comment. I think that 12 the -- the state rules regarding this issue are -- have been 13 modified and changed over time, and I think they are 14 adequate to protect the interests in Kerr County at this 15 time. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: My only comment is 17 that I agree with both the gentlemen on the end of the 18 table. January 1, I will begin my third term as a member of 19 this Commissioners Court, and was around in the beginning of 20 the state rules and regulations. And, to my knowledge, this 21 County has never, ever given these state rules an 22 opportunity to work or not work, and I think that we need to 23 delete Section 10 and adopt the state rules and go on. Now, 24 if there was -- if there was going to be any item in Section 25 10, I would want the 25-acre exemption put in there, but I 72 1 see that as a long shot here. So, for the sake of today's 2 debate, I'm for deleting Section 10 and adopting the state 3 rules only. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: My only comment is, I 5 don't have a problem with the deletion of Section 10, as 6 such, or relying heavily on the state rules. I think that 7 makes a lot of sense. In that respect, I do have a 8 concern -- and I'd like to hear Commissioner Griffin's 9 motion so as to be able to talk more intelligently on it. I 10 have a concern about real estate transfers. I've expressed 11 this before, and I really have some concerns as to the 12 caveat emptor theory that -- that seems to permeate our 13 thinking, which it's a "buyer beware" type of situation. We 14 have a -- have a recent example of buyer beware, and I think 15 Mr. Brown pointed it out in the pictures that he presented 16 to us today. 17 One of them, the most grievous of all of 18 them, has to do with one of our elected officials of this 19 county who bought a piece of property believing that 20 everything was fine, and then on -- and an initial 21 inspection sort of confirmed that everything was okay. Upon 22 closer inspection, you know, come to find laterals up 23 against the -- right up against the house, and the whole 24 thing is failing. So, I really have some concerns about 25 real estate transfers and how they're taken care of. Who 73 1 does the notification? Who is responsible? Does the buyer 2 know when he goes in that he's buying a sick puppy, or does 3 he find it out six months after he's bought the property 4 that he's got a sick system? And I think we need to take a 5 look at that particular aspect. As far as letting Section 6 10 work, I don't have a problem -- I mean letting the rules 7 work, T.N.R.C.C. rules work, I don't have a problem with it. 8 I do have some concerns about real estate transfers. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: At this time, I think it 10 would be appropriate for us to have Commissioner Griffin's 11 motions for any revisions to the approved O.S.S.F. Rules. 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Thank you, Judge. 13 Just to answer Commissioner Williams' one question that he 14 raised, is that if there is to be some inspection at -- 15 at -- at the time of transfer of property, I, as a matter 16 of -- of moral judgment, don't have any problem with that. 17 I just don't think that that belongs in this O.S.S.F. rule. 18 For example, in real estate transactions, we have termite 19 inspections that are done, and I know that those are called 20 for in the real estate law. I do know that we've got other 21 inspections, structural inspections that can be on some 22 commercial properties that are required by state law, and 23 that if we are interested in this inspection being done, 24 that it's not -- my view is -- is that that should not be in 25 our county rule. 74 1 If another jurisdiction wants that 2 requirement, I could see that. If the City of Kerrville, 3 for example, or City of Ingram, or if -- if -- I don't see 4 it being in our State law, because we have so much rural 5 property -- I mean county rule, because we have so much open 6 rangeland, et cetera. But -- but I don't have any problem 7 with it, and -- and maybe it's a piece of legislation that 8 someone can ask the State Legislature to pass, that they 9 must be inspected across the state. But, a state law, not 10 just us jumping in with a rule in our county rules. That's 11 what I -- I don't like. I don't like the feel of it, and 12 I'm not sure it makes much sense to us to do that. And 13 that's the answer to that. So, I'll -- unless there's other 14 comments or -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Only -- 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I'll move along. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Only comment I'd like to 18 make on that, I share the concern that Commissioner Williams 19 mentioned, but I think that there may be some sort of 20 voluntary program that we could maybe help fund or encourage 21 to, you know, help the public with real estate transfers, 22 and I think that's something we can work out later. 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think it's also an 24 educational issue, one that we can probably undertake pretty 25 well through the local closing organizations and real estate 75 1 agents and so on, that there is something that a buyer ought 2 to want to look at. And, I understand the argument that 3 says well, not every person who comes here from Houston or 4 Dallas looking at property has ever seen a septic system. I 5 understand that. But that's an educational thing. Maybe we 6 can -- can you close the door, please? Is there enough 7 room? Okay. So, I'll move on if it's -- 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Let me just make one -- my 9 comment on the inspection issue, because I've evolved on 10 this, as well. When I bought my first piece of property in 11 Kerr County, I bought a piece of property on the river, had 12 it inspected for purposes of having a license transferred. 13 There wasn't a system; it was a cesspool, a cesspool 14 basically on a gravel bar right on the Guadalupe -- or on 15 the South Fork. Had I not asked for an inspection, I never 16 would have known I had a bad system and would have continued 17 to pollute the river. But, I think the river and -- the 18 vast majority of river and its tributaries are different 19 than the vast majority of the territory in Kerr County, and 20 there are mechanisms whereby there can be special rules for 21 rivers and tributaries, as opposed to special rules for the 22 whole county. 23 So, what I think Commissioner Griffin has 24 proposed and is proposing is a rule that works well for Kerr 25 County as an entirety, while at the same time leaving, as 76 1 he's pointed out, the ability of other jurisdictions that 2 have O.S.S.F. authority to impose rules that are specific to 3 their jurisdictions. And, I think that may be the 4 appropriate way for us to proceed. Rather than try to adopt 5 a rule which really sets forth different standards for 6 different areas, we're going to adopt a rule which works for 7 Kerr County as a whole, and let the other jurisdictions that 8 have authority take control of their territory. And I think 9 this is the appropriate way to proceed. So -- 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Thank you. If you'll 11 refer to the copy as -- as submitted to the Clerk for review 12 by the public -- and I hope I've got the right one. I think 13 I've tried to weed them out as I've gone along. I would 14 first make the motion that we -- that on Page, as is 15 numbered, 2, that we strike the third "Whereas." That's the 16 Whereas that relates to Senate Bill 1 regarding water 17 availability, because all of the water availability issues 18 are now going to be addressed in our Subdivision Rules, and 19 there's no need to address them in this rule. So, the third 20 "Whereas" in there, I would move that we strike. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by -- do we have a 22 second? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 25 Griffin, seconded by Commissioner Letz, that we strike the 77 1 third "Whereas" of the introductory portion relating to 2 Senate Bill 1. Any questions or comments? If not, all in 3 favor, raise your right hands. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Okay. Next, I would 9 like to refer to Page, as numbered, 3. I'll make a motion 10 that we strike all of Section 10 and renumber the paragraphs 11 thereafter accordingly. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 14 Griffin, second by Commissioner Baldwin, that the approved 15 and proposed order be amended by striking all of Section 10 16 and renumbering accordingly all paragraphs thereafter. Any 17 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 18 right hands. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Then a technical issue 24 in what now will be Section 11. It was on the same page -- 25 it was previously Section 12, on collection of fees. As 78 1 submitted for the public hearing, it read, "All fees 2 collected for permits and/or inspection shall be made 3 payable to Kerr County, Texas." I would make the motion 4 that we add the language to that, just continuing the 5 sentence, that "or such other entity as the Commissioners 6 Court may designate," and that takes care of a Designated 7 Representative being able to collect, with the collection 8 actually being made payable to them rather than Kerr County. 9 And, this is more in the nature of a technical correction; 10 it's really not of substance. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 13 Griffin, seconded by Commissioner Letz, that Section -- what 14 is it now, 11 point -- 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: The underlined 16 portion. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- 11 be amended to add, "or 18 to such other entity as the Commissioners Court may 19 designate." Any further questions or comments? If not, all 20 in favor, raise your right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carried. 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Judge, then I will 79 1 make the motion that the -- that the Kerr County -- let me 2 get back to my -- here we go. That the Court adopt the 3 proposed Kerr County On-Site Sewage Facility Rules and 4 Regulations, as amended. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 8 Griffin, seconded by Commissioner Letz, that the Court 9 approve the Kerr County On-Site Septic Rules and Regulations 10 as amended. Any further questions or comments? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I have one comment. 12 I will support it, but I still have concerns regarding real 13 estate transfers. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Commissioner. 15 I'll also point out that if -- assuming that the adoption 16 carries today, the -- the new order does not become 17 effective until such time as it is approved by the 18 T.N.R.C.C. Any further questions or comments? If not, all 19 in favor, raise your right hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries, and the 24 proposed Kerr County On-Site Sewage Facility Rules and 25 Regulations as amended are adopted. Okay. Before we move 80 1 on to Item Number 11, we're having someone check to see if 2 our kids are here on the writers' contest. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, yeah. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: If they are, we'll go ahead 5 and run them in ahead of time before we have our -- our 6 subdivision discussion. At this time, we're going to go to 7 an item which was posted for 11 o'clock, which is to 8 recognize and give out Certificates of Achievement to the 9 winners of the Kerrville Writers Association's Sixth Annual 10 Short Story Contest. If y'all could make room for the kids 11 to come in? Folks, we're going to do the writers' contest 12 winners; it will probably take us about 10 minutes. We need 13 to make space for them to come in. We'll let everybody in 14 the hall know before we take up any additional item. So, if 15 I could ask some of y'all's indulgence to please give them 16 some space for the kids to come in and get recognized for 17 their accomplishments, I'd appreciate it. 18 (Discussion off the record.) 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anne Schneider? Where are 20 you, Anne? 21 AUDIENCE: She's coming. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Why don't we have -- let's 23 have the -- the young people here in front of the -- of the 24 bench, and facing the audience. There we go. And we're 25 going to ask Ms. Schneider to make a brief introduction 81 1 here, and then we'll call the names. When we call your 2 names, if you would come through and accept our 3 congratulations, we would appreciate that. And after we 4 call everyone and give out the awards, we're going to take a 5 recess and have a -- a couple photo opportunities. So -- 6 and if you'd give us a brief introduction, I'd appreciate 7 it. 8 MS. SNYDER: Thank you. As president of the 9 Kerrville Writers Association, I'd like to thank the 10 Commissioners for continuing the special tradition of 11 awarding our student short story winners their Certificates 12 of Achievement. Every summer in August, the Kerrville 13 Writers Association takes time out from their writing and 14 critiquing to work on plans for the annual student Short 15 Story Contest. This is our sixth year to sponsor the 16 contest for fifth through eighth graders in Kerr County. 17 Early in September, guidelines are delivered to all schools 18 in Kerr County. Some schools invite Kerrville Writers 19 Association member Katie Jones to present a program on short 20 story writing to their students. Some teachers even allow 21 class time for their students to work on stories. Other 22 students are encouraged at home to complete their stories. 23 There are two divisions of competition. 24 Fifth and sixth graders compete with each other in one 25 division, and seventh and eighth graders compete in the 82 1 other. All entries in the contest are judged on creative 2 content alone. Kerrville Writers Association members judge 3 the stories, and winners attend an editing session with 4 K.W.A. members to prepare their manuscripts for both 5 newspapers. In addition to honoring the students with these 6 Certificates of Achievement today, the winners and their 7 families and friends will attend a reception on Wednesday at 8 the Cailloux Center on the Schreiner College campus. 9 Students will have the opportunity to read their stories at 10 the reception hosted by the Kerrville Writers Association 11 and the Java Pump. 12 Thanks to the support once again of corporate 13 sponsors, the first-place winners will each receive $100 14 gift certificates to the Main Book Shop, and additionally 15 will receive copies of the "Market Guide for Children 16 Writers" from the Kerrville Writers Association. 17 Second-place winners receive $75 gift certificates, as well 18 as a book from the Dove's Nest. Third-place winners will 19 receive $50 gift certificates, and the honorable mention 20 winner will receive a $25 gift certificate. Our generous 21 sponsors this year are the Mountain Sun, Kerrville Daily 22 Times, Wells Fargo Bank, Bank of the Hills, and James Avery. 23 It's a great time of year to celebrate, and the Kerrville 24 Writers Association joins with the Kerr County community in 25 celebrating the achievements of these talented students. 83 1 Thank you. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. And, at this 3 time, what I'm going to do is call the names. First I'll 4 read you the fifth and sixth grade, then the seventh and 5 eighth grade. I will call the names of the finalists who 6 are not here, then I'll call the names of the winners, 7 starting with the honorable mention and moving up to first 8 place. As I call your name, if you will come by and accept 9 the congratulations of the Court, I'll hand you your 10 certificate. Once again, after we finish with all of the 11 winners, then we'll have an opportunity for a picture 12 somewhere, either here or out in the hall. We'll find a 13 place. So, it's always a pleasure to do this. It's also a 14 treat for us on the Commissioners Court to recognize the 15 accomplishments of our young people, particularly in the 16 literary and arts area. And, Anne, we appreciate being 17 asked to do this, and we hope y'all will continue to come 18 back. 19 So, the finalists in the fifth and sixth 20 grade division, who I understand are not here, are Joseph 21 Hubble from Ingram, Taylor Faust from Ingram, and Michael 22 Alston from Tivy Upper Elementary. The winner of fifth and 23 sixth grade's honorable mention is Lindsey Blaha. Lindsey? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Right here. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Come this way, if you will. 84 1 (Applause.) 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Third place is Christa Goben. 3 Christa? 4 (Applause.) 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Second place to Sarah 6 Beaudoin. 7 (Applause.) 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: First place to Tyler Brown. 9 (Applause.) 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: For the seventh and eighth 11 grade division, the finalists are Hannah Irvin, who's 12 home-schooled, Jessica Boone from Peterson, Daniel 13 Prislovsky, who's also home-schooled, Aubrey Ely, 14 home-schooled, and Brayden Olson from Peterson. The 15 third-place winner in the seventh and eighth grade division 16 is Kayla Kitchens. Kayla? 17 (Applause.) 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Second-place winner is 19 Caroline Arnold. 20 (Applause.) 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: And the first-place winner is 22 Michael Andrews. 23 (Applause.) 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Let's give these young 25 people, their parents and sponsors another big hand. 85 1 (Applause.) 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Photographers, take 3 over now. Where do you want us? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, can I ask a 5 question? How many people in this room are home-schooled? 6 (Several children raised their hands.) 7 AUDIENCE: And we didn't help them. It was 8 very difficult, but we didn't help them. 9 (Discussion off the record.) 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: All right. At this time, 11 we'll return to the regular order and take up Item Number 12 11, which is a public hearing on the -- on the proposed Kerr 13 County Subdivision Rules and Regulations. Larry, would you 14 let the people outside know, please -- Larry Arnold -- that 15 we're taking up the Subdivision Rules right now? 16 MR. ARNOLD: We're on down the list? Number 17 11, okay. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Yeah. 19 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 11:10 a.m., and a public hearing 20 was held in open court, as follows:) 21 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: At this time, the 23 Commissioners Court meeting will go into recess and we will 24 open the public hearing on the adoption of the proposed Kerr 25 County On-Site -- I'm sorry, Kerr County Subdivision Rules 86 1 and Regulations. Again, these rules and regulations were 2 approved by the Commissioners Court approximately one month 3 ago, and have been on file at the Kerr County Clerk's office 4 for anyone who chose to go and inspect the Subdivision Rules 5 and Regulations. Several people have signed up to speak on 6 this matter. John Vanderkam. Is Mr. Vanderkam still here? 7 AUDIENCE: There's quite a few of them 8 outside. This is Number 2.13? 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: This is -- no, this is Item 10 2.11, Subdivision. Okay, Mr. Vanderkam doesn't seem to be 11 here. Paul Siemers. Paul, I know you're still here. 12 MR. SIEMERS: Can't get rid of me. Paul 13 Siemers, HC-1, 156N, Hunt. I guess my real question is, 14 this is the November 6th edition that we're still talking 15 to? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The one that's on file. 17 MR. SIEMERS: Okay. I approve of these. 18 That's all I have to say. I hope you pass them. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. Bill Stacy? Bill 20 Stacy? 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Ken Muller? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Former Kendall County 24 Judge. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But major property 87 1 owner in Precinct 2. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's right. 3 MR. MULLER: Judge, Commissioners, just one 4 question. I think this has been very well drawn up, but 5 it -- it's in regard to what I believe is an inadvertent 6 omission of part of the state statute. I'd like to give you 7 a copy of it. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 9 MR. MULLER: This is in regards to Section 10 1.03.A of your new subdivision provisions. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Tell us what you mean by 12 that, Mr. Muller, since this is a public hearing. 13 MR. MULLER: Yes. 1.03.A, as it is presently 14 written, states that the owner -- this says, "A subdivision 15 shall not be subject to the platting requirements of these 16 rules and regulations if the owner does not lay out a part 17 of the tract described in Section 1.02.C, and the land is to 18 be used primarily for agricultural purposes, as defined by 19 Section 1-d, Article VIII, Texas Constitution. The state 20 law goes on to read, "or for farm, ranch, wildlife 21 management, or timber production use, within the meaning of 22 Section 1-d(1), Article VIII, Texas Constitution." And 23 then, in the proposed subdivision, it states, "If the land 24 ceases to be used for agriculture purposes, the platting 25 requirement shall apply. And the state law, which I gave 88 1 you a copy of from Local Government Code 232, says that if a 2 tract described by Subsection C ceases to be used primarily 3 for agricultural use or for farm, ranch, wildlife 4 management, or timber production use, the platting 5 requirements of this subchapter shall apply. Simply, what 6 I'm asking -- requesting is that, in accordance with state 7 law, that the subdivision requirements include 1-d as well 8 as 1-d(1). 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Mr. Muller. We 10 appreciate it. Is there any other member of the public who 11 would like to address the Court during this public hearing 12 on the proposed Kerr County Subdivision Rules and 13 Regulations? Is there any other member of the public who 14 would like to address the Court during this public hearing 15 on the proposed Kerr County Subdivision Rules and 16 Regulations? Seeing none, this concludes the public 17 hearing. 18 (The public hearing was concluded at 11:15 a.m., and the regular Commissioners Court 19 meeting was reopened.) 20 - - - - - - - - - - 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Court will now reconvene and 22 move to Item Number 12, which is consider and discuss 23 adopting the proposed Kerr County Subdivision Rules and 24 Regulations. Commissioner Letz? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm glad to be over with 89 1 this process. I hope we are. The main -- only comment I 2 think I would like to make is, the major -- or to the public 3 that's here still, one of the major changes that we have in 4 this draft that I think we'll adopt today is the changes in 5 lot size and things of that nature, and it's a pretty 6 significant departure from what the County has done in the 7 past. It's giving developers a lot more flexibility in how 8 they do developments, and also a little bit stricter 9 regarding water availability and proving that there is water 10 available. And, for those that, you know, haven't read it, 11 I'm not going to belabor the point by reading the text, 12 which is available for the public, but I just will say that 13 I'm very comfortable with these, with the language of the 14 public. I think it's good for the community, I think it's 15 good for development, and I think it's protecting the 16 current residents and the current water situation in this 17 county. 18 Regarding Mr. Muller's comment, I concur with 19 him after a real quick look at it, but I really, I mean, 20 haven't looked at it or didn't have time to really read the 21 language. The language that we used was taken from state 22 law, but it's possible that we inadvertently left off that 23 second part of that sentence, and it should be included if 24 we did. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Are you offering an amendment 90 1 to add the language regarding farm, ranch, wildlife 2 management, or timber production to Item 1.03.A? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. But, I mean, I'm 4 trying to figure out how to get that exact verbiage, 'cause 5 it's two different things, looks like, from what we have 6 written in the draft versus what he gave us. But, I think 7 that maybe if I can offer an amendment that Section 1.03.A 8 meet, verbatim, the requirements in state law, we can, you 9 know, put the language in to that effect. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Does everyone understand the 11 motion? 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I want to ask 13 Mr. Muller one question. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, just -- do I have a 15 second to the motion? 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I'll second the 17 motion. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. The motion was made by 19 Commissioner Letz, seconded by Commissioner Griffin, that -- 20 to conform Section 1.03.A of the proposed rules to the state 21 law regarding exemption for agricultural, farm, ranch, 22 wildlife management, or timber production. Okay. Now, do 23 you have any questions or comments? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That does satisfy 25 your comments; correct, Mr. Muller? 91 1 MR. MULLER: Yes. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: My question is that, 4 because I see -- I just don't see some language in here, I 5 just wanted to verify that this version of the law is post- 6 Elgin Bank case. 7 MR. MULLER: Yes, that's from 1999 law. 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Okay. 9 MR. MULLER: If you go to the last page, it 10 states that. 11 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Okay. I just didn't 12 see -- 'cause I know there were some things about family 13 members and all of that that I didn't see in -- 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably down -- 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Okay. 16 MR. MULLER: Down at the bottom of the page. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: If that's what it is, 18 the motion is a good one. I still second it. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any other questions or 20 comments regarding the proposed amendment? If not, all in 21 favor, raise your right hands. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Do we have 92 1 any other -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make a motion that 3 we adopt the proposed Kerr County Subdivision Rules and 4 Regulations, as amended. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner Letz, 7 seconded by Commissioner Williams, that the Court adopt the 8 proposed Kerr County Subdivision Rules and Regulations, as 9 amended. My comment will be only that these go into effect 10 immediately upon adoption and, unlike the O.S.S.F. Rules, 11 there is no requirement that they be approved by the 12 T.N.R.C.C. or any other regulatory authority. Any further 13 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 14 right hands. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, one other item on 20 this. Because these are in effect now, we probably 21 should -- I think we can, under the way it's styled, enter 22 an order on how we're going to make copies available, what 23 we're going to charge for copies, how we're going to handle 24 the printing for the public. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 93 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: In the past, we've done 2 it through -- Road and Bridge has coordinated it. This time 3 I think it would be appropriate to use a loose-leaf binder 4 format, as opposed to a printed, you know, form. But, I 5 would recommend that we go -- authorize Road and Bridge 6 Department to go out for -- to arrange for the copying of 7 maybe 100 copies, or 100 sets, and that we would set the 8 price at $10 per set. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I second it. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz 11 that the Court authorize the Kerr County Road and Bridge 12 Department to have 100 copies of the recently adopted Kerr 13 county Subdivision Rules and Regulations made, and to offer 14 those for sale to the general public at a cost of $10 per 15 copy. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: In loose-leaf format. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: In loose-leaf format, 18 correct. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Frank, is that an 20 adequate number, do you think, to start with? Okay. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: All right. Any further 22 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 23 right hands. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 94 1 (No response.) 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Was that a motion? I 3 couldn't remember if I made a motion or just discussion. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: As we did with the O.S.S.F. 5 Rules, I think we owe a great deal of thanks to Commissioner 6 Letz for his hard work. He's been working on these 7 Subdivision Rules and Regulations for well over a year now, 8 and I think the product speaks for itself, and it will go a 9 long way towards insuring the continued quality of life here 10 in our great land. So, thanks a lot, Jonathan. We 11 appreciate it. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think he's planning 13 on rewriting these things every two years or so. Isn't that 14 what you told me? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I hope not. I don't plan 16 on another revision of these for some time, hopefully. I 17 would like to thank Road and Bridge. Truby Hardin and Thea 18 in our office here have been a great deal of help in making 19 the changes and helping coordinate a lot of this. Jannett's 20 been a big help, I know, too. So, it's been a county-wide 21 effort, department-wide, to get these put together. 22 Appreciate it. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. The next item is Item 24 Number 13, consider and discuss adopting a Commissioners 25 Court order to prohibit or otherwise regulate the discharge 95 1 of firearms on lots 10 acres or smaller located in the 2 unincorporated area of the county in a subdivision to 3 promote public safety and set a public hearing on same. 4 Commissioner Baldwin? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you very much. 6 In your packet, there is two pages of law. I would like for 7 you to go to the second page, 240.022, Authority to 8 Regulate. This is the actual law, and then I'm going to 9 read the actual verbiage in this thing. It's, "To promote 10 the public safety, the commissioners court of a county, by 11 court order -- by order, may prohibit or otherwise regulate 12 the discharge of firearms on lots that are 10 acres or 13 smaller and are located in the unincorporated area of the 14 county in a subdivision." That's -- and it goes on and 15 talks about prohibited regulations, injunction, criminal 16 penalty, et cetera, but I want to talk for a few moments and 17 tell you what brought this up. 18 A couple of years ago, a lady from my 19 precinct out in Kerrville South contacted me, and she had 20 had neighbors in her -- her community out there shooting 21 deer, hunting deer in their yards. And, she got on the 22 internet, pulled up the Parks and Wildlife law and came 23 across this law right here, and phoned me and asked me to 24 take a look at it, and I did. And I have visited all -- a 25 lot of the Kerrville South. The Community Action Group of 96 1 Kerrville South has endorsed this law, because they have 2 multi-problems with discharge of firearms on these small 3 acre lots, et cetera. But, more recent than the lady two 4 years ago, I've had several phone calls from folks out in 5 the Kerrville South area, neighbors -- their neighbors -- 6 their complaint is their neighbors discharging large 7 firearms in their neighborhood. 8 We have one gentleman in the Kerrville South 9 area that has a bucket on his back yard -- on his back porch 10 that has a large bullet hole in the bucket. Bucket's got a 11 hole in it. We have one lady that was feeding the deer, 12 rattled corn in the bucket and throwing corn out, and a deer 13 was killed right in front of her. Last week I was invited 14 to a residence of a family in Kerrville South, just to take 15 a tour and look at their property and -- and see about some 16 of the complaints. And, as I pulled up there and got out of 17 my truck and was walking across the yard to knock on the 18 door, what did I find? A dead deer. And this is a family 19 with three children that are involved in the livestock show, 20 et cetera, and someone had shot a deer right there in their 21 yard. This particular home in Kerrville South, you can 22 stand in the yard and you can throw a rock to the south and 23 hit Nimitz Elementary School, and you can turn around and 24 throw a rock back to the north and hit Grace Christian 25 School. 97 1 (Audience member made a comment.) 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I beg your pardon? 3 AUDIENCE: Next you're going to be outlawing 4 throwing rocks. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You'll have an 6 opportunity to make comments. Please don't interrupt me. 7 Thank you. I think that this is a travesty in our 8 community, that people are discharging firearms in 9 neighborhoods like I just described. Now, I want to say, 10 there is no one in this community that is more private 11 property rights issue-minded than I am. Not one person. I 12 detest government intervention into our lives, and this is 13 one of those areas that the government would get into your 14 personal life. But, the safety of the adults in our 15 community and their children are much more important than a 16 lot of our values, and something has to be done. 17 And, I'm going to relate this thing to the 18 burn ban. We're all familiar with the burn ban. I have 19 been here a number of years and have voted literally 20 thousands of times, and I think the burn ban is the dumbest 21 thing I have ever done, and I'll tell you why. Because 22 people's private property -- I am telling you what to do 23 with your own property. If you have a pile of brush out 24 there and you light a fire to it, that should be your own 25 concern, shouldn't it? Yes, is the answer. But, there are 98 1 people out there that build too big of a fire and let it get 2 away from them. They burn their own pasture and they burn 3 their neighbor's pasture. Then government steps in and 4 starts regulating it. I just -- I think that's so foolish, 5 but the key to it is -- is that people don't use common 6 sense. 7 Most of us here use common sense in 8 discharging our firearms and burning our brush, but there 9 are people out there that do not use common sense when 10 discharging their firearms, and something has to be done. 11 Now, a lot of you have phoned me, and there's a -- I've even 12 been kind of threatened to get my rear end kicked a little 13 bit, which it's happened before; that doesn't bother me. 14 What I'm going to do is, I'm not even going to make a motion 15 to pass this bill, because I don't like it any more than 16 most of you do. I think it is ridiculous that we have -- 17 that government has to do these kinds of things, to ask 18 people to be responsible. 19 But, what I am going to do today is, I'm 20 calling on a lot of you folks, the gun rights people, the 21 buck and bull-type people, the National Rifle Association, 22 which I am a member also. I'm calling on you all to, first, 23 help me, join this Commissioners Court as leaders of our 24 community. Let's join together and educate folks out there 25 on how to be responsible with a firearm. Let's join 99 1 together and say that -- just say no, that unsafe practices 2 with a firearm is the wrong thing to do. And, I'm calling 3 on y'all to join me in doing this, as opposed to passing 4 this goofy law. But I'm here to make a promise to you, that 5 if it doesn't -- if that deer hunting in Kerrville South 6 doesn't cease and desist immediately, I'm going to bring 7 this law back and I'm going to pass this thing. I know I 8 don't have three votes at this table right now, but I'll get 9 it done. Don't shake your head at me, buddy. I'm going to 10 tell you what, I am really angry about this. 11 AUDIENCE: So am I. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good for you. I'll 13 meet you out in the hall later. I'm going to tell you what, 14 when you start dealing with these children's lives and 15 allowing this kind of thing to happen, you're wrong. So, 16 with that said, Judge, I don't see -- I don't see any reason 17 that we have a public hearing-type meeting. This is my 18 issue. I'm requesting that we drop the issue and move right 19 on. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: I will respect that wish, 21 Commissioner. Would you like to hear from the other 22 Commissioners before we move on? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Certainly. Certainly. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Is there any other 25 Commissioners who would like to make any comments? 100 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm -- 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Go ahead. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I basically agree with a 4 lot of what Buster said, that it takes common sense. And, I 5 mean, it -- every time we do a burn ban, I make -- probably 6 make a comment. His analogy is very good. It's ridiculous 7 that we pass burn bans because we have irresponsible members 8 of the community, and this is basically the same issue, 9 people that are acting irresponsibly in heavily populated 10 areas with firearms. And, the way this -- you know, I 11 certainly don't want any regulation. I don't know that I 12 could ever pass or vote for one to regulate the use of 13 firearms. But, by not regulating yourselves and not being 14 responsible, you're asking for government to do it at all 15 levels. And, this -- you know, I think his challenge to act 16 responsibly to the public is justified and warranted. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I was just going to 18 say the same thing. I would agree. The government usually 19 has to step in when people can't control something on their 20 own. If you've got an urge to go shoot through your 21 neighbor's property, that's not responsible, no matter how 22 much you may want to hit that deer or shoot at the target or 23 whatever. So, good firearm people know good firearm safety, 24 and nobody's got a complaint with any of those. And I would 25 agree that -- that if everybody uses good judgment and we 101 1 have that as a community goal, you can't go wrong. That's a 2 good start. And, if -- and I think we've got -- we wouldn't 3 have to have but one person injured or killed to really feel 4 bad that we didn't do something today, so -- just because of 5 someone's irresponsibility. So, I would urge, again, the 6 same thing that Commissioner Baldwin said; that if you're 7 careful, if you're smart, if you know what the N.R.A. and 8 every other good organization like that says, we probably 9 don't have a problem. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: My only comment is 11 that I agree with the Commissioner in terms of the -- the 12 concern for public safety. I've had -- I don't know how 13 many calls you've had, Commissioner, but I've had equally a 14 good number of calls about folks who shoot firearms in a 15 close proximity of other homes and kill deer; who drive down 16 the road and they spot a deer, and without thinking about 17 whether or not there are other human beings or children 18 around -- and children are human beings, I don't need to 19 distinguish that -- to stop their vehicle and pull out a gun 20 and, boom, they take a deer out of circulation. Government 21 is run by responsible people, and anybody who is responsible 22 enough to attend a Commissioners Court hearing such as this 23 certainly is responsible enough to do the right thing with 24 respect to firearms. 25 The only other comment I have is, I was 102 1 interested in the authority section you cited, Commissioner, 2 and it really talks about our ability to do this. I'm 3 surprised to find out the language says we can do it on 4 10 acres or smaller located in the unincorporated areas of a 5 county in a subdivision, which says to me that a person who 6 is out in the middle of somewhere with 4 or 5, 6, 7, 8 or 9 7 acres of land owned by him or herself is not basically 8 considered under this particular section. And, I found that 9 interesting, 'cause we're talking about subdivisions, and 10 that's where the problems occur in the close proximity to 11 someone else's home or someone else's property. Enough 12 said. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: I will point out that it is a 15 violation of existing law to discharge a firearm that 16 crosses property lines or crosses a high line. I would be 17 curious, but I'm not going to ask for a vote, for how many 18 of you all here who are here to oppose this regulation, 19 which this Court would only, with the greatest deal of 20 reluctance, take up, actually live in Kerrville South where 21 the problem is. Or are you here to express a concern about 22 the regulation of firearms generally? The ability to 23 discharge a firearm in less than 10 acres is not worth the 24 loss of a single child's life. And, all of you hunters know 25 there's no way that you can stand in the middle of a 10-acre 103 1 tract and shoot a deer rifle at a far target and have it 2 stay within the confines of that property if you don't 3 happen to hit your target. 4 So, we are asking you to act responsibly. 5 We're asking to you think logically. And we're going to 6 abate this issue at this time and only bring it back with 7 the greatest deal of reluctance. But, I believe I can 8 assure you that if we have the necessity to bring it back, 9 we will bring it back with the knowledge that this 10 government must intervene in order to protect the lives and 11 safety of our citizens. So, help us out. Give us a chance 12 not to have to impose what we all consider to be an 13 unnecessary regulation if the people of Kerr County act 14 responsibly. So, Commissioner, I'm going to give you the 15 last word and move on. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Amen. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. All right, we're going 18 to move on now. We're going to take up the next item on the 19 agenda. Thank you all for coming. We appreciate your 20 assistance, as always. 21 (Discussion off the record.) 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Next item for consideration 23 is Item Number 15, which is consider and discuss a request 24 by K'Star for uncollected funds provided in the 1999-2000 25 County budget. Vicki Barron. 104 1 MS. BARRON: My name is Vicki Barron. I'm 2 the Assistant Director for K'Star. I'd like to thank you 3 for hearing our request. We're requesting that the Court do 4 an amendment to your 1999-2000 budget to allow us to collect 5 uncollected funds that were designated in that budget. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: We do not have the ability to 7 go back and amend last year's budget, unless we declare an 8 emergency, and this does not rise within the confines of a 9 budget emergency. Real briefly, what Alice McDaniels 10 explained to me was that, through an oversight, K'Star 11 failed to request their funds out of last year's budget. 12 I've spoken to Tommy Tomlinson about this. The only way 13 that we could fund last year's request at this time would 14 essentially be to take the money out of our Contingency 15 fund, Nondepartmental Contingency fund, which is really 16 designed for capital expenditures that we can't foresee in 17 the budget year. I will also tell the Court that K'Star is 18 not the only agency that didn't get their money last year. 19 At least one other agency has brought the same issue to my 20 attention, and at that time I informed them that I was not 21 aware of any way we could go back into last year's budget. 22 If the Court should decide to fund K'Star's request, I will 23 bring the other agency's request back as well, which will 24 further deplete our Contingency budget. I regret that we're 25 in this situation, but I really don't see much way out of 105 1 it. We need -- 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Do we know why the 3 funds weren't requested? 4 MS. BARRON: Just an oversight. It was -- it 5 was my -- my fault. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm sorry, but I agree 7 with the Judge. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: What I've talked about doing 9 is, if we get into July and August and find that we have 10 unexpended funds in the Contingency budget, at that time I 11 think we'd be willing to -- to consider the request. At 12 this stage in the budget year, I think it would be difficult 13 for us to look forward and determine that we can take 14 approximately 40 percent of our Contingency budget out for 15 last year's funding requests. 16 MS. BARRON: We understand, and we appreciate 17 that very much. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: If -- have you 19 requested this year's funds? 20 MS. BARRON: I have the letter all ready to 21 go January 1. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: We want to make sure 23 that gets done first, and then if -- perhaps we can look at 24 it later and see if there's something we can do. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How much is the -- how 106 1 much is the budget amount? 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: $5,000. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: $5,000? I -- I'm not 4 going to ask this question, but if I were going to, the 5 question would be, how in the world do you overlook that 6 kind of stuff? 7 MS. BARRON: Good question. 8 (Discussion off the record.) 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Vicki. We're 10 sorry. You know, we -- 11 MS. BARRON: That's all right. Appreciate 12 it. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: The next item is Item Number 14 16, consider and discuss correction of budgeted amount of 15 travel and approve amount for Constable Precinct 3. 16 Constable Garza? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. 18 MR. GARZA: Good morning, Judge, 19 Commissioners. For the record, my name is Constable Angel 20 Garza, and I'm here before the Court and I'll try to be as 21 brief as possible and explain my situation to the honorable 22 Court. I come before the Court seeking to find an equitable 23 solution to allow me to be able to use all the funds that 24 have been budgeted and appropriated by the County to operate 25 the office of Constable Precinct 3. The approved budget 107 1 appropriations for all departments are on file for public 2 inspection with the County Clerk's office. Listed in the 3 budget appropriations are the approved amounts for Constable 4 Precinct 3's office for Fiscal 2000-2001. Listed is 5 $35,410. All budgeted funds are listed by line item. For 6 Fiscal 2000-2001, in Constables' budgeted appropriations 7 under Line Item 553-001, Travel, the approved amount listed 8 is $2,300. I am requesting that the Court allow me to have 9 $500 from Line Item 553-001, Travel, listed in the budgeted 10 appropriations for Fiscal 2000-2001, be moved to another 11 line item. The funds have been budgeted, appropriated, and 12 approved. At the end of budget 2000-2001, there will be 13 $500 in funds left in Constable Precinct 3's budget that I 14 will not be able to use that have been budgeted for the 15 office of Constable Precinct 3. As stated in my letter to 16 the Commissioners Court, I am not here today to ask for any 17 additional funds, only to allow me to be able to use all the 18 funds that were approved for the office in a public forum 19 and, you know, part of the public record on file in the Kerr 20 County Clerk's office. Respectfully submitted. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Constable, where would you 22 want this $500 added? 23 MR. GARZA: Either in line item -- possibly, 24 like, Gasoline, and probably in Vehicle Insurance. Maybe 25 split it up, or -- you know. I mean, that's all I'm asking 108 1 for, Commissioner. I know there was an oversight on my 2 part, but, you know, I think -- I think it was just an 3 oversight, and I did submit my approved budget. I have the 4 -- I gave you all the forms that I have listed, and that's 5 basically all I'm asking for, that the Court will somehow 6 find a possible way to rectify the situation. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Tell us where you want it, 8 where we can -- 9 MR. GARZA: Okay. I'd like to have $300 in 10 Gasoline, which is Line Item 10-553-331, and then in Vehicle 11 Insurance, Line Item 10-553-480, have the other $200 put in 12 there. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: That will be a total of three 14 as well. Does everyone understand what happened? 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: What happened was that -- 17 that in the previous year, constables' travel allowance had 18 been $2,300. When we did the hearing on elected officials' 19 compensation this year, that $2,300 was inadvertently 20 reduced to $1,800, and I didn't catch it, and the constable 21 didn't catch it when he had a chance to review what his 22 compensation was going to be. Elected officials' 23 compensation must be set pursuant to a public hearing, so we 24 cannot go back and add that additional travel allowance for 25 the constable, because that's against the law and the 109 1 Constitution. So, what he has come to us to do, basically, 2 is to allow him to revise the approved budget to -- to 3 change travel from $2,300 to $1,800, and increase his 4 request as to gasoline from $300, vehicle insurance to $300, 5 which will allow him the same funds to operate with as were 6 actually approved, just in a different configuration. 7 MR. GARZA: If I may, what happened, Your 8 Honor and Commissioners, is, like, the previous year there 9 was $500 that was allotted to the constables to put in any 10 line item. And, of course, I think the travel budget for 11 elected officials and constables is $1,800, so I chose to 12 put the money that was budgeted for that the year before 13 into that line item. That's why mine's a little different 14 from the other constables. And that's where that money goes 15 from the previous years. That's where I wanted to keep it 16 this year. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Didn't -- isn't -- 18 isn't gasoline a legitimate part of the travel expense? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, it's -- see, the 20 problem is, we approved it in the budget in Travel, but we 21 didn't put it for the public hearing purposes; we left it 22 off. So, it's in the budget, but it's not for public 23 hearing for travel compensation. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I understand. I'm 25 just saying, you know, purchase of gasoline, isn't that a 110 1 legitimate travel expense? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, the travel allowance is 4 something that -- that, you know, doesn't have to be 5 accounted for. It's simply like our travel allowance; they 6 get it on a monthly basis. Gasoline, the constable's going 7 to have to come in with receipts. 8 MR. GARZA: Right, and I'm willing to do 9 that. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: It's treated differently than 11 it is for travel; is that correct? 12 MS. NEMEC: In other words, instead of me 13 paying him those $300 throughout the 24 payroll periods, he 14 would have to submit a receipt to the County Auditor's 15 office, or request his gasoline be paid for. Or -- 16 MR. GARZA: Until the funds are used. 17 MS. NEMEC: -- or his insurance. It's just 18 his waiver, being able to use those $300, that legally we 19 cannot use salary -- 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I move we approve the 21 request as submitted and outlined into the proper line items 22 that you have there. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner 25 Griffin, seconded by Commissioner Letz, that the Court amend 111 1 the Constable Precinct 3 budget to reduce the approved 2 travel allowance by $500 to $1,800, to increase Line Item 3 331, Gasoline, from zero to $300, and to increase Line Item 4 480, Vehicle Insurance from $100 to $300. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Question. If we would 6 have done everything right, Constable 3's proposed Travel 7 line would be $2,300? 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's correct. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Constable 4 would be 10 $2,700? 11 MS. NEMEC: Constable 4 gives their -- that 12 -- that travel is used for the deputy, Constable 4's. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The line reads $2,700. 14 MS. NEMEC: And that's to pay to his deputy. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And Constable 2 is 16 $1,800? 17 MS. NEMEC: Right. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And Constable 1 is 19 $1,800? 20 MS. NEMEC: Correct. All the constables got 21 an additional $500 last year, and they chose where they 22 wanted to put it. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, all those years of 24 Commissioners Court trying to get everything equal, and here 25 we are back tearing it down again. 112 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Bring that up during 2 budget. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, I know that's 4 true; it's just that -- I'm not opposing it. Cool. Go get 5 it. 6 MS. NEMEC: So, the way I look at it is 7 there's $500, so $300 would go into Gasoline and $200 in 8 Vehicle Insurance? 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: An additional $200, so it 10 would be a total of $300. 11 MS. NEMEC: Okay, a total. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any further questions or 13 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Constable. 18 MR. GARZA: Thank you very much, Your Honor 19 and Commissioners. I appreciate your courtesy in this 20 matter. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Item Number 17, 22 consider and discuss the approval of revised Change Order 23 Number 6. Where do we start with this one? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This goes back to Item 25 Number 1 -- Issue Number 1 or whatever it was when we did 113 1 the -- 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Last November 14th, we 3 approved Change Order Number 6 at that time. The contractor 4 refused to sign that change order. He had -- he wanted some 5 items included in the change order that were not priced at 6 the time. He had some disagreement with the way in which we 7 analyzed his requests for supervision and temporary 8 facilities. Commissioner Letz and I met with our architect, 9 Mike Walker, Keith Longnecker, and the contractor last 10 Tuesday for about two and a half hours, went through what 11 was proposed at the time as Change Order Number 6, and came 12 forward with this result. We deleted from the request of 13 the District Clerk some drawers that she had requested to go 14 under the counter. We deleted from the reworking of the 15 holding cells some items which it was our opinion that could 16 be performed by the Maintenance Department or contracted by 17 the Maintenance Department at a more adequate price, and we 18 also negotiated a reduction in the temporary facilities 19 charges based on the actual invoices that were presented by 20 the contractor, the net result being what you see in front 21 of you. Jonathan? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the only 23 comment -- I mean, the methodology we used, we went back 24 through item-by-item each listed change order item, was that 25 if it was -- if it could be done by the County and did not 114 1 affect any of the -- I guess, the construction work or 2 structural or electrical, anything like that, we opted to 3 take it out of the change order and do it later. However, 4 if it was something that was going to involve tearing into a 5 wall or doing something that the contractor had already 6 worked on, then we said no, let's let the contractor go 7 ahead and do it, so we don't have a finger-pointing 8 liability issue if something happens down the road. And, 9 that made -- you know, made good sense to us. 10 I think the -- the other thing -- the big -- 11 main hurdle I think we had when we did the change order the 12 first time was the -- all the things, the -- the temporary 13 facilities issue. And, what -- and I guess the information 14 that Mr. Stoddard brought along and how he explained it, I 15 think, is correct, was that basically it's a lot of 16 insurance. When he -- about $1,500 of the total is 17 insurance, his monthly charge. His contract -- or our 18 contract with him, essentially, was for a certain amount of 19 time, and 15 -- plus or minus $1,500 of each -- of that 20 temporary facility's charge is for him to keep his insurance 21 continued during this period beyond the original contractual 22 period. So, that was why -- it wasn't port-a-pottys and -- 23 all that stuff was included in there, but the big lion's 24 share of that was the insurance thing. And, each time we do 25 a change order, there is an insurance and bonds component, 115 1 but that's only covering the additional dollars, not the 2 amount to keep the full -- his, I guess, policy in force 3 during the extended contract period, and that's -- you know, 4 and that was basically the reason. And he came down -- I 5 don't know how much it was. He wanted $2,700, so he came 6 down $400 a month? 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: He wanted $2,400. He came 8 down about $270 a month, possibly. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And he came down to -- he 10 provided some invoices and phone bills and fax charges and 11 all that, and dumpster charges, and his amount that he was 12 asking was basically higher than his receipts. So, we 13 reduced it to his -- what his receipts actually showed he 14 was spending a month. The $2,180 for temporary facilities 15 is what his receipts showed it to be. 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: This appears to be 17 fair and at least -- or at least doable, and with good 18 conscience. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I just have one quick 20 question. Is there any change in the -- the Directive 21 21 with respect to the ceiling? 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: No. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Part of the problem that -- 25 that we've -- that this process has created for Commissioner 116 1 Baldwin and his grand opening that we're so anxious to have 2 is the fact that the contractor would not order the 3 additional mill work, say, for the County Clerk's office or 4 the additional supplies for the ceiling until the change 5 order was approved, and we need this -- we did not sign the 6 change order in November. That basically put it from 7 November 14th until December 11th for him to order the stuff 8 that he had to do in order to go forward. So, that's kind 9 of how it started slipping further back. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I think the other 11 thing -- I mean, the -- the timing, when you look at the 12 calendar and what he has to do, I mean, it -- it's going to 13 be until the middle of February, no two ways around it. And 14 who -- whose fault it is, you know, I think he certainly 15 shares a large portion of the blame. Now, we also did ask 16 for these changes, so, I mean, there are items that we've 17 added to the contract because of things that we found out 18 during the construction period. And, you know, I -- while 19 he may be getting to us a little bit, we don't have a whole 20 lot of choice. This is as fair as I think we're going to 21 get it, bottom line. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me make sure I'm 23 on the same page with everybody here. So, we're talking 24 about an increase of 59,030 bucks? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. 117 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And 149 days. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Which takes us through 3 February 24th, actually. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Two days extra. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: I thought it was 6 February 14th. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So did I. 8 MR. WALKER: We went back and recounted the 9 days, and apparently in our haste to do that the other day, 10 we missed about 10 days. But, this is what -- what he 11 wanted to do is start 75 days from December the 11th, and 12 that's where it came out. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mike, we want to have 14 a grand opening here on George Washington's' birthday. I 15 know he wasn't an Aggie, but he was a good man. We'd like 16 to have the grand opening on that date. Would you help us 17 get that done, please? 18 MR. WALKER: Yes. What would you like me to 19 do? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Get this contractor 21 out of town. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Have him gone before the 23 24th. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Have him gone so we 25 can have our grand opening and the taxpayers will be happy. 118 1 MR. WALKER: As I have always done, I will do 2 everything in my power to expedite this process. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. Thank 4 you so much. 5 MR. WALKER: My pleasure. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Would any of the 7 Commissioners like to go through the directives in the 8 change order? 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Tony? 12 MR. GALLUCCI: I just have a question on 13 Change Order 6 Breakdown, Page 4, under "Temporary 14 facilities." There's a number there that doesn't work. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Where's 4? 16 MR. GALLUCCI: Page 4 of 7 on the Breakdown 17 under "Temporary facilities." It says 6 weeks, and I think 18 $218. I think it's supposed to be $2,180. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Whatever it is, yes. We'll 20 get that corrected. I see. 21 MR. GALLUCCI: The math shows it as $2,180. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anything else? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, first we need to 24 cancel the first change order? 'Cause that's of record. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Yeah. Well, this order will 119 1 be in substitution, replacement for the first order. Anyone 2 -- does anyone, again, want to take up any directive or -- 3 or specific item? Jonathan? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The other thing we ought 5 to bring up, just so everyone on the Court's aware, is 6 windows, briefly. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Yes. Do so, please. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: In the original, I guess, 9 contract, it was -- part of the contract was to redo all of 10 the windows in the old part of the building that were not 11 redone previously under the previous contracts when we 12 renovated the first and second floors. We -- well, this 13 change order deletes all those renovations on -- basically, 14 on the main ones on the second floor -- are we first floor? 15 On the first floor, and those on the second floor, except 16 those that need to be done that are in such bad shape that 17 it's going to require damage to the new construction to fix 18 them. And, there's four or five, it looks like. I don't 19 know, Mike, if you have a new number on that? 20 MR. WALKER: Let me -- some things have 21 transpired since we talked about that the other day, and I 22 want to kind of bring you up to what I think date is on 23 this. In further review of those windows, after our meeting 24 we looked at them in terms of what the -- the contractor 25 could do to expedite and get out of that. He obviously does 120 1 not want to do the windows. He wants to get out of this 2 project, as well as -- as unscathed as possible. So, one of 3 the -- we have a couple places where we, Keith Longnecker 4 and I, say we can draw the line. One is that we do go ahead 5 and do the survey. Now, your instructions at our last 6 meeting were -- was to eliminate all of the first floor 7 windows, because they're occupied, and concentrate on the 8 ones upstairs. 9 But, the -- the thing that could easily be 10 done is we could break the line by -- by denoting the 11 windows that need repair. He would either -- he would give 12 us a credit, which the $500 that he offered to fix each 13 badly damaged window, that was just an average number, we 14 feel like is a fair figure. His credit to do the painting 15 on the windows was not fair, and he is reconsidering that at 16 this time and he's trying to come up with a better allowance 17 per window to repaint them on the outside. But, if we took 18 the -- if we took the survey and we said, okay, these sashes 19 are bad or this trim is bad, and omitted that from his scope 20 of work and considered that as a separate contract, but let 21 him go and finish the interior of the building, which is all 22 the patching around the windows, and do the varnish on the 23 inside of the windows, with the exception of those that 24 really, truly have bad sashes -- I mean, there's some that 25 you can stick three or four fingers through up there -- 121 1 those, then, could subsequently be done, whether you 2 dovetail it in right now, which is -- it really needs to get 3 started, with another contract, and accept his -- his bid 4 for that, or possibly even take him out of the outside 5 painting altogether, also. So, there's sort of two 6 different ways that we sort of break that down, and he is 7 giving that -- he's working up some numbers on that, and I 8 -- he just didn't have them ready for today, Your Honor. 9 (Discussion off the record.) 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- I thought -- I 11 mean, we're not going to repaint all the windows. Or were 12 we? I recall in our meeting, we were only going to -- we 13 didn't want to have to repaint all the exterior windows if 14 we are going to redo them anyway. We wanted them not to be 15 one pink, one blue, but as long as they were reasonably 16 close, rather than having to repaint them whenever we do 17 fix the remainder of the windows in the next -- hopefully 18 next budget year. 19 MR. WALKER: What I'm trying to give you is 20 one that has him doing the windows that can be redone, that 21 don't need any -- any surgery, and then him just not doing 22 anything on the exterior. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 24 MR. WALKER: So, I'm trying to give you two 25 options. 122 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: My understanding was that we 2 had -- we had instructed that he find those windows that 3 were in such bad shape that, if they were left undone at 4 this time and done at a later time, that it would result in 5 damage to the -- to the walls that he had finished around 6 the windows, so that we didn't result in a situation where 7 we had to go back and redo not only windows, but plaster and 8 paint and everything else. 9 MR. WALKER: Okay. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: We apparently have deviated 11 from that. 12 MR. WALKER: But excluding the ones on the 13 first floor. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: I thought we took everything 15 out of first floor. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: First floor was -- 17 nothing was going to be done. 18 MR. WALKER: Okay. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 20 MR. WALKER: I guess my question is, would 21 you -- would you like some other options, or do you want to 22 just strictly go with what the Judge just said? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, it seems to me 24 that we're going to be better off if he, as much as 25 possible, is out of the window repair situation. 123 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's right. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we're probably 3 going to, one, get a better product and be able to do what 4 needs to be done, rather than someone who doesn't want to do 5 it in the first place and we don't want to pay him to do it. 6 So, I would fix the windows that we absolutely have to, that 7 we're going to do some damage to the new interior walls if 8 we don't do that repair right now, but everything else -- 9 MR. WALKER: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- no. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Our discussion was, as 12 Commissioner Letz is saying, is do what we have to do, let's 13 get Stoddard out of the picture, and then we will budget, 14 over the next budget year or two, a certain amount each year 15 to repair and replace windows so that, over time and through 16 a more rational budgeting process, instead of being part of 17 the contract, we can get the job done that we need to. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's good. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's correct. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 21 MR. WALKER: Okay. I will redirect him in 22 that direction and come back with a number at the next 23 Commissioners meeting. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But the change order 25 doesn't address -- 124 1 MR. WALKER: The change order does not 2 address this. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I didn't think so. One 4 more change order, right? 5 MR. WALKER: Yes. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: With very -- which we'll 7 have a credit coming back to us, right? 8 MR. WALKER: If we take that tack, yes. If 9 you accept this, correct. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Okay. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Do I have a motion to approve 12 Change Order Number 6 as presented in substitution and 13 replacement for the previous Change Order Number 6 adopted 14 on November 14th? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Moved by Commissioner Letz, 18 seconded by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve 19 Change Order Number 6 in a total amount of $59,030 in 20 replacement for and substitution for the change order 21 previously approved on November 14th, Year 2000. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: With the correction 23 that we found. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Yes, with the correction 25 pointed out on the temporary facilities number. Any further 125 1 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 2 right hands. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 5 (No response.) 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 7 MR. WALKER: Thank you. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Oh, yes. Before we adjourn, 9 Commissioner Williams has reviewed the proposal from 10 Grantworks on the mapping. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm going to review 12 it, let the County Attorney take a look at it. I'll have it 13 on the agenda next time. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Anything else that 15 needs to come before us today? 16 AUDIENCE: I have some comments that I'd like 17 to bring before the Court, if I may. It's up to y'all. 18 Tell me yes or no. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Regarding what, sir? 20 AUDIENCE: That firearms issue. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: We've already taken that up. 22 AUDIENCE: Okay. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Commissioner? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do you and I need to 25 visit? 126 1 AUDIENCE: Well, that's what I'm here for, 2 because you told me you'd meet me out in the hall. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hold on, we're fixing 4 to adjourn. I'll be happy to do that. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Nothing else to come -- if 6 there's nothing else to come before us, then we stand 7 adjourned. Thank you. 8 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 12:08 p.m.) 9 - - - - - - - - - - 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 127 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 15th day of December, 8 2000. 9 10 11 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 12 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 13 Certified Shorthand Reporter 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25