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KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT
Emergency Meeting
Monday, July 8, 2002
10:30 a.m.
Commissioners' Courtroom
Kerr County Courthouse
Kerrville, Teras
Response to 2002 Kerr County Flood
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PRESENT: FREDERICK L. HENNEKE, Kerr County Judge
H.A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1
WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2
JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3
LARRY GRIFFIN, Commissioner Pct. 4
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On Monday, July 8, 2002, at 10:30 a.m., an emergency
meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in
the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse,
Kerrville, Te:cas, and the following proceedings were had in
open court:
P R O C E E D I N G S
JUDGE HENNEKE: All right. We'll call to
order this emergency meeting of the Kerr County
Commissioners Court. It's 10:35 on Monday, July 8, Year
2002. Please note that the notice of this emergency meeting
was posted at approximately 8:15 this morning, so we have
complied with the two-hour requirement of the Open Meetings
Act. The topic for consideration is to consider and discuss
the response to the 2002 Kerr County flood. We've had a
description this morning of where we are, and a request Trom
Leonard Odom to go ahead and allocate some funds towards the
flood recovery. I'm not totally sure it is time to do that
yet, but that's what we need to talk about. That, and
things like trash pickup and -- and I don't know; I didn't
have a chance to get in touch with the County Attorney to
see if he could join us. Do you want to call and see if he
can come up and talk about the issue of emergency repair on
private roads? But let's just open it up for discussion.
First of all, I have basically any topics anybody thinks we
ought to -- anything we ought to do, anything we ought to
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cover. I know that Commissioner Williams has got some
ideas, so --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I encountered a
couple things, Judge, that I think I'd like the Court to
consider that perhaps we can do as part of an emergency
response. There are some folks I encountered who have flood
damage, water damage to their houses in the Center Point
area, whose water ended up being cut off, so they had no --
no potable water in their home. And my initial response to
that was, you know, get whatever containers; you can go to
Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center, fill up your jugs, just
whatever you need, if you need bottled water for
drinking/cooking purposes. So, I'd like for that to be a
part of it. Secondly, also, people who -- whose homes
flooded, one of the major items we're getting rid of is
carpeting and other things like that that are totally
destroyed, and they have to get it out of their house. And
I know the landfill has been inoperative because of the
excess water. And when those type things, if ever, will be
picked up in the rural areas I don't really know, so I think
perhaps if there was a way we could encourage folks who can
load them up on a pickup or trailer to bring that type of --
of trash to a point or a location on our grounds, that we
could subsequently pick it up and take it the to the
landfill when the landfill's ready to receive it.

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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have a landfill
report that may help that.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. And also, I'm
not certain to what extent the Salvation Army and other
emergency agencies are dealing with furniture that might be
brought in, but, again, I think there's a way we could help
or encourage others who want to dispose of pieces of
furniture that are usable and can be given to folks. Maybe
we can establish a place for that to be brought in, and --
and allow people to know that items of furniture are
available for nothing if they want to come pick them up.
Just some thoughts.
J~JDGE HENNEKE: Anyone else?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think my -- most of
mine, as I mentioned earlier, deal with the access problem.
I heard another -- Ms. Golden talk about it, another
situation of not being able to have access to their house on
private roads. Now, while I try to explain to all of these
people that that is part of the problem of living on a
private road, is that you're individually -- or the
association is responsible for the upkeep of it, is what
authority we have to at least get access for these people;
not necessarily repair.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, one of the
things that -- that a storm of this magnitude brings --

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brings into focus is, in some locations, the inadequacy of
storm water takeoff. We try hard. We work hard at it, and
we do from time to time make repairs or replace culverts and
whatever, but I know that -- that there are areas in the
county where the culverts and the bar ditches are
insufficient to take the water off of this magnitude, which
the County argument is, it this one is a 200-year sL~nu, we
don't have to worry about it for ancther hundred years or
so. I also know that Road and Bridge is inundated with rcad
problems, but at some point in time, I think we should
seriously consider how we address those areas of the county
where there are sufficient density of homes where the water
runoff just isn't -- isn't being managed properly. One oL
them that comes to mind is Thea's place. And I visited --
not her home, particularly, but her area, the subdivision.
There are culverts and there are bar ditches, but the
culverts and bar ditches don't move the water out fast
enough. The net result of that is, it backs up into
people's homes. So, I think we need to consider that at
some point in time in our discussion with Road and Bridge,
and when we find them, try to do something about them,
COMMISSIONER LETZ: On that point, I mean, I
think that the -- 1 don't know how far the county goes, and
I	know	that we had	-- Thea may	recall,	several years ago,
'	98, '	97, somewhere	in there,	that --	that subdivision riyht
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in that general	area off 173 had similar problems	. We spent
a lot of time --	must be '97 flood, '	cause FEMA was involved
about looking at	that, and the -- the	bottom line	was a lot
property values. I mean, bar ditches had to be dug and
things of that nature. So, I think we need to address it,
but I don't know how you -- what role, if any, really, we
should play. If the residents come to us and are in
people don't want us to be involved.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're pointing --
you're making a good point, Commissioner, and I think that
applies particularly to the subdivision called The Woods out
here. Those folks, for whatever reason, early on, their
storm water wasn't managed properly from the get-go, and
they have never conveyed easements for storm water
management to the County, to my knowledge, but yet they
continue to experience flooding in their homes. I had calls
at home as early as 6:30 in the morning from people in The
Woods, and that's a whole separate issue, and I don't know
how we deal with that. But there are other subdivisions
like the one I referenced that -- where Ms. Sovil lives,
where I don't know that that's the same problem. I think

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the bar ditches are there and the culverts are there, and
they're just not sufficient to manage it, which is not
necessarily the case in I'he Woods.
COMMISSIONER. LETZ: Right.
COMM15S1ONER BALDWIN: Well, now, one thing
you need to remember is that we live in the hill country,
and water runs downhill. And there -- you know, and
particularly when you get this much water -- rain as we've
had, there is not a whole lot you can do about it.
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I was going to say,
no, we can't. 1 agree.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You can't do anything
about that. And we come along and we put all those little
fixinq things throughout the year; we fix this and fix that,
and virtually every time that creates something else. I
mean, that's part of the hill country -- living in the hill
country, you know.
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: We11, to design it for
the amount of water that we got in this last storm episode,
I'm not sure -- first off, I'm not sure for any amount of
money that you could build a system that could run it off.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't know.
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's just an
engineering problem. But --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's just part of

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living here.
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah. And you can
always loo Y. at ways to improve what we have, 'cause
obviously you can always make some kind of improvement, put
a culvert in this particular place where water continually
backs up, but you're probably going to notice that in a
lesser event. You'll notice water backing up. That's when
you probably need to fix it. If you wait for this event to
tell you you've got a problem, you know, you're probably --
you can't design a system that will handle this one.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, but this does
identify problems that you perhaps didn't know you had.
COMMISSlUNER GRIFFIN: That's right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Or that are
exacerbated by other situations in the same area. When the
State widened 173, they took the storm water from the north
side of it and channeled it to the south side of the road.
Both sides of the road will empty into Turtle Creek. I
don't know what was going through their heads when they did
that, but they created more problems on the south side of
the road. That's not something we can fix, but certainly is
identifying --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the -- to follow
up what Commissioner Baldwin says, every time you fix or do
something to channel water, you're making it worse somewhere
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else. It's better to try -- the more you can spread it out,
the lower the velocity is going to be. Everyone may get a
little bit of damage, but no one's going to get wiped out a
whole lot, hopefully. And it's -- I think it's very
accurate that you have to be real careful when increasing
bar ditches and increasing, you know, culverts, because when
you do that, you're forcing -- channeling more water into
that spot. I think Commissioner Williams' point about
Highway 173 -- I think the Highway Department, you know, did
make a mistake there, just from my view, residents I've
talked to in that area. They did just that; they channeled
it. They took two streams of water, made one stream of
water. Whenever you do that, it gets worse, from what I can
see.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The landfill road
washed out and there was no traffic out there, and -- and
one of your constituents, but my trash hauler, called me
over the weekend; needed to get in. And so I called some of
my little City friends and they researched it, and they
report -- and they were just absolutely fantastic, by the
way, but their report back is that the road -- they've
opened up another road into the landfill this morning, up
near the sewer program, up in that area. Put in another
little road to go back in there, and they've hired a
contractor to rebuild the main road in, and that should be

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open on Wednesday morning. So, the landfill is basically up
and running, even as we speak.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Going back to somethinq
Commissioner Baldwin said, I don't know -- I think Glenn's
back here. 1 don't know what the schedule is of use at the
Ag center right now, but I know there are a number of
organizations that are collecting, you know, clothing and
maybe furniture as well, and I would be in favor of letting
them use the Ag Barn as a -- a location, St. Vincent De Paul
collecting clothes, kind of a dropoff point. But those
are -- 1 think they have to man it themselves, but if they
need a spot, I would -- you know, I think that's a good
central location where there is a large covered area. But,
Glenn, what's the booking use of that facility right now,
Tor this week?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You know, that's
what's going on out here with that truck and clothes.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. They may not need
anything more, but if they did need another covered
facility --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Or you take a --
because this is here, and Salvation Army has clothing and so
forth, I was thinking about items of furniture that people
might have had in their garage, looking for the first garage
sale to get rid of, that could be usable to somebody else in
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situations like this.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We could always use
Rusty Hierholzer's office; there's plenty of room in there.
JUDGE HENNEKE: Glenn, what's the -- are they
booked out there this week?
MR. HOLEKAMP: Y"eah, we have some towards the
end of the week, but there would be room in one or two areas
that we cculd have a secure location to place some stuff.
It wouldn't --
JUDGE HENNEKE: I kind of made a little list
here -- thanks, Glenn, Potable water. Anyone have any
problems with turning the spigot on at the Ag Barn for
anybody who needs potable water? Glenn, is that going to
work out for you?
MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir, that would he fine.
JUDGE HENNEKE: Just ask them to come between
8:00 and 5:00?
MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. Or make
arrangements -- if that doesn't work Tor them, to make
arrangements. We can make it work.
JUDGE HENP~EKE: Okay. Debris removal.
Commissioner Williams has suggested that maybe we set up a
central place where people can bring stuff in the county,
We'll arrange to have it hauled to the landfill or --
COMMISSIOI`dER GRIFFIN: It the landfill is
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open, you can get there -- it you can kind oL bring it in,
you might as well take it to the landfill.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, that's true.
Now tha*_ it's open.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- the benefit, it's
easier -- well, certainly cheaper. I mean, basically, the
County's footing the bill to dispose of the materials, as
opposed to the individual.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 'Cause we have to --
whoever takes it in pays, as I understand the rules. But
the other side of it, from a health standpoint, it's better
to get it in the landfill than all along county roads,
private property, or anywhere else, for that matter. And I
think, from a health standpoint, I would be in favor of
doing that, of having a collections spot for whatever, and
the County would just absorb it as a public health issue.
Because areas that I've seen, it's a problem. There is a
lot of debris, and that debris' going to -- you know, nwlds
and vermin of various types, and it's just a health problem.
And it needs to be gotten away from, you know, people's
homes and businesses.
DODGE HENNEKE: Glenn, is there a place ouL
in the Ag Barn that you could -- could segregate a place for
people to put, you know --
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MP.. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir.
JUDGE HENNEKE: -- soaked furniture and
sheetrock and --
MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes. The -- the area where we
currently have that brush pile for burn, there's adequate
area there that we could -- that is accessible.
JUDGE HENNEKE: It needs to be a place where
they can come up in and drop stuff off, Road and Bridqe can
load it up and take it.
MR.. HOLEKAMP: Yes, that's what I'm saying.
We'd have to kind of watch. I'd sure hate for them to come
in the -- in the night and just drop it in the road, but --
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I was about to say, I
think we got to really be careful.
MR. HOLEKAMP: Got to be careful with that
sort of thing, because they may put it in the parking lot.
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: If -- unless you're
going to have somebody there to show them where to put it,
you'll end up with stuff that has been out there for 15
years piled up in the Ag Barn yard somewhere. I don't mean
to sound like Simon Legree, but that's just human nature.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think that's true. I
think if you put a time limit on it, there's -- you know,
you can do it. I've had a lot of people ask me what they do
with the debris, and --
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 1 have, too.
JUDGE HENNEKE: I think, again, that if --
make it so that they either bring it between 8:00 and 5:G0,
or make arrangements with -- with Mike or you for a separate
time.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And designate a
location. And to prevent people coming and dumping in the
middle of the parking lot, maybe you can close and lock the
gates at 5 o'clock, both sides, so they can't get in and do
that.
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: They'll dump it at the
gate. Again, I would just -- you know, what problem are we
solving with that? I think what the problem we're
solving -- we're trying to save people the expense of taking
it to the landfill. Is that what we're trying to do? Maybe
we ought to work out something with the landfill folks and
see if we car, get a waiver of the -- get a waiver of the --
of the charges.
MR. SANDLIN: Fee waiver.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd be in favor of that.
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I would much rather do
it that way than stack it up at the Ag Barn.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 1 would too.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's good. I like that
idea better, some sort of a voucher thing or something that
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cde could help absorb some of the cost. 'Cause I'm feeling
it's very, very expensive for private citizens to go dump
debris, 'cause it goes by weight. And, I mean, it's not
going to -- you know, people aren't going to do it; I don't
think they can afford to do it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, particularly
those wiped out totally and their places, Ltiey can't afford
to do it. I think it's a good idea, waiver of landfill
fees, and make --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Why don't we ask our
Administrative Assistant to trot in there and call II.F.I.
and ask them what they will do while we're sitting here?
MR. SANDLIN: Save handling the garbage
twice.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thal 's a good idea.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Only suggestion that I
would have, Judge is, one, that I've seen alzeady you're
going to end up with -- especially out in some of the areas
in the county where people have no way of getting that stuff
loaded up and even transported, and you're talking -- it may
be their entire house that's out there, walls and all. I
noticed yesterday City of Kerrville was running their
regular city dump trucks and everything else, helping people
around town using their own -- the City's front-end loaders
and that to help load this up and haul it out there in dump

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trucks. I know Road anal Bridge is going to be stretched
thin, but on some of that, it may be a lot safer and a lot
easier for the ~:ounty if -- if they've got a lot like that
to be able to call somewhere and get the County to go ou*_
and load that stuff up and haul it themselves -- haul it
ourselves. Otherwise, we're going to end up with it all
over everywhere, on the roads. I know that's a stretch, but
I just think in a situation like that -- sure, you may have
to get with the ~:ounty Attorney and see it he can -- we ran
legally do it, but in a situation like the one -- like Letz
said, it's a public health hazard. Two, it's a hazard to
everybody else, and just the same way on the private roads.
If they go -- just somebody's driveway, that should be up to
them to fix, but if they go to where we have had calls where
there's nine or ten houses in an area that we can't even get
to right now at the Sheriff's Office, even though that's a
private road, I think they could do some kind of quick fix
on that to help these people at least be able to get in and
out.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So if your deputies are
able to get --
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: My deputies already
flooded one car out; I don't need another one. But just --
you know, if I had the type of inmates in jail right now
that could go out and work, helping clean up some of those
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roads, I'd be more than happy to do it. I just don't really
have that type of inmates right now. But --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I --
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- I think the County,
in a situation like this, that it's an emergency, we ought
to do everything we can.
JUDGE HENNEKE: I'd like to see us be a
little more proactive. I'm not sure whether we should
contract with a private company to --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I've got a thought
here, Judge. I had a call from the Texas Workforce
Commission down here, Gaylyn, and she wanted to come before
the Court -- the call came in too late to get it on the
agenda. She wants to come before the Court and talk abour_ a
new program they have whir_h will give us people that they
can provide to do the work, and they pick up the tab in
terms of -- they pick up the tab. She'll tell us about it.
Maybe we should bring her over a little more quickly and let
her tell us about it. There is some potential manpower that
could be pressed into service to do this, and the Sheriff
brought it to my attention by mentioning that he didn't have
any. But, there's a source of it -- sour~~e of potential
manpower.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I think I read where the
City's bringing in other B.F.I. trucks and that out of San
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Antonio to help -- you know, what the Judge just said., maybe
contract with somebody privately to help these people.
JUDGE HENNEKE: It's going to be somewhat
proactive service. Maybe contact B.F.I. and say, what would
you charge us to come in here and -- and, you know, give us
"X" number of trucks Tor "X" number of days on a call-in
basis, to go out in the county and collect debris and take
it to the landfill. 1 mean, 1 -- 1 really think that this
could be a bad health hazard. I mean, I know the City
already has rats, based on the stuff that's piled by the
roads, which is one of the reasons they got the debris
pickup scheduled so quickly. So, I'm reasonably confident
we have the authority under the general public health and
safety to do that. I'm a little more questionable on a
reimbursement voucher type of thing. My suggestion would be
that we explore the notion of contracting with B.F.I. for a
certain number of trucks for a certain number of days, and
then establish a central call-in register, and people call
in and they get scheduled. "Okay, the truck will be at your
house next Monday between 8:00 and 12:00."
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- and I like
that contract even better. And some of it may be worthwhile
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to qet into collecting trash in lots of areas that didn't
have any damage.
JUDGE HENNEKE: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And people that -- that
did have damage should file a claim. They need to file a
claim for their own purpose, and also to -- it helps give a
real number as to what it is. And I think that, you know,
that's a -- a way to keep people from abusing it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who's going to check
that?
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I started to say, you
know, you've got an administrative cost associated with it.
You've also got -- and you've also got to make a judgment on
whether some people at least have insurance. And if they
have filed an insurance claim, the removal of the debris is
included in the insurance cost. So, that -- it somebody's
going to have it done, that way -- anyway, you sort of need
to get that piece of it in. And I'm not negative on trying
to help ger the stuff cleaned up; don't get me wrong. It's
just that there is an administrative burden here that goes
way beyond just sayinq call in and we'll come pick up the
trash. It's bigger than that. And as long as we address
it, fine. Put, you know, I think we have to --
JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, I think we can over --
over-administer the thing if we try too hard. I mean, I'm
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personally more inclined to say, people, it you have flood
damage debris that you need to be picked up, call us.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
DODGE HEPSNEKE: And trust the people not to
take advantage. Now, some will. And if we contract with --
with B.F.I. to pick up flood damage and they go out there
and somebody's got a 1937 Studebaker --
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I'll buy it.
DODGE HENNEKE: You know, if -- if B.F.I.
picks it up, well, you know, that's their problem, as far as
I'm concerned. But at this time, I don't think we want to
put the face to the public of questioning very hard whether
they're -- whether it's legitimate or not. People are
devastated out there. So, my suggestion is we authorize
a -- a contract with B.F.I. or a similar entity for
flood-related debris pickup, and set a specific time, you
know. I don't know whether it should be a week from today
or 10 days from today or -- or what.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think a lot of that has
to -- we need to have it, but it needs to be based on what
B.F.I. says.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree. Sheriff?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: To even start cleanup.
DODGE HENNEKE: Do you all want to authorize
me to --
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COMMISSIONER. LETZ: Work it out.
JUDGE HENNEKE: -- do that, or do you want me
to work it out and bring it back? Or just proceed with it?
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: We'll have to do
something, just for the cost -- I mean, just so we can cover
it. We can do that now or we can --
JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, we can --
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: -- do it later.
JUDGE HENNEKE: That's a budget amendment.
We don't have to put any money up front. That's a budget
amendment.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why don't we authorize
you to do it, and we're going to meet tomorrow on a budget
hearing, and we can --
JUDGE HENNEKE: That's a workshop.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But we can --
JUDGE HENNEKE: We can recess this.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Recess this and reconvene
tomorrow.
JUDGE HENNEKE: That's a good idea. All
right. So --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That way we can know what
we're voting on, as opposed to just --
JUDGE HENNEKE: Right. That's good.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That way the press can be
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here and know a specific phone number and what else they
need to do.
JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Remind me -- we'll
recess this special emergency meeting, and we can do that
for 24 hours under the Open Meetings Act. So -- all right.
We'll get some information on that. The issue of donations,
is everyone comfortable with offering the use of the Ag Barn
to -- do we need -- a charitable organization that needs
additional temporary storage space? Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think we ought to
emphasize things that are brought should be usable items,
not another way to get rid of their junk. Items that can be
used by people who are in need.
JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, I think if we put it --
if we offer it to the charitable organizations, Salvation
Army, R.ed Cross, they'll be the screening mechanism.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's fine.
JUDGE HENNEKE: We're not opening up the Ag
Barn for people to bring things.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right.
JUDGE HENNEKE: We're going to tell the Red
Cross and Salvation Army, if you need additional storage
spare, we have storage space available. Private road
access? Did you get ahold of David?
MS. SOVIL: No, he was in court.
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JUDGE HENNEKE: I just don't have an answer
for that one. I would -- to me, it's an issue of -- if you
could run a -- you know, just have to blade it, let people
come through, that's fine, but if you have to go in there
and repair a section of their private road, then 1 think we
have a different --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If you look back -- if
you look back at how county roads became count, roads, at
some point, particularly in the hill country area, the
Commissioners went out and fixed a road so people could get
in and out because of flood damage. My family road became a
county road because of that, and I think most of them are by
prescription. I think that that is how that came about.
So, in emergency situations, I don't -- I don't see any
problem so that they can get in and out and get groceries
from the grocery store.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: As a matter of fact,
I think the most recent Attorney General's opinion dealt
with emergency situations in private roads.
JUDGE HENNEKE: But there's a limit to what's
emergency. I think, again, if it's just a question of
making the road --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Passable.
JUDGE HENNEKE: -- passable, that's fine, but
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if it's impassable because there's a 20-by-30 washou*, I
don't think. that -- that qualifies as an emergency. It may
be impassable, but I don't think we should step up for that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's a -- I mean, the
worst situation is the one that I mentioned early on, Peek
Ranch Subdivision. There's 20 -- I believe 22 homes out
there. They can't get -- they can't qet across, and it's
about a -- I took Douglas over there just to get an idea of
someone who knows something about roads, what's it going to
take to get across it, and it will require a 48-inch culvert
and about 120 yards of fill.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where is that
located?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Off Hermann Sons P.oad.
And, you know, and it's a -- it's a tough call. I mean,
one, we want to try to help the people who are out there,
but at the same time, it's -- they bought out there and knew
that they were buying on a -- you know, on a private road.
And I don't know if they have the means or not to -- to do
it themselves. I just don't know the answer to that. I
don't know that many people that live out there. The one
lady I talked to at some length, she liked -- of course, you
have to know this lady; her name's Gail Montana. She liked
the fact that the road is -- she was joking, but liked the
fact that it was washed out; it would slow down the traffic.

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She could charge people a dollar to go across the creek.
Gail Montana has always been interesting to deal with. She
cuts -- she's the one of the barbers in Comfort. Gail's
something else.
JUDGE HENNEKE: You know, one possible way to
handle this is fcr each Commissioner basically to make a --
a case-by-case determination. You go out, look at the
private road., then you go to Road and Bridge and say, "Help
them," or you tell the landowner, "I'm sorry," you know,
"this goes beyond what we can do." 'Cause I don't know
any -- we could refer it to Road and Bridge completely; then
they've got to make the distinction, or we can take it back
to this level or whatever we want to do.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- at a minimum,
I think the Court needs to have a court order to authorize
Road and Bridge r_o do some work, because I think they're
hanging out if they go out and use -- I mean, I think we
should be the ones hanging out, not the supervisor of Road
and Bridge.
JUDGE HENNEKE: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't think it's fair
to have them having to make these calls on the spot. I
think it's -- the Court should make it, and we're standing
behind them if they do it. And I'll make a motion that --
to authorize Road and Bridge to use equipment to make minor
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road repairs so people can gain accessibility to their
property -- to their residence.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are they making the
call, or are the Commissioners making the call?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't -- I really think
them. I know it puts them in a little bit of a situation,
but, you know, it doesn't make sense to me it they have a
maintainer or a -- a large piece of machinery out on Hermann
Sons F.oad, for them to have to try to find me to get me, and
by the time I get over there, the machine may be 20 miles
away. And I think the reality is, they're kind of doing it
anyway. I mean, they're using their judgment and helping
people out, which they should -- I've told them, you know,
to -- I think they should be doing it, and bring it to the
Court. And, you know, and I think it's kind oT being done
to a minor degree right now. I don't think we should
authorize -- at this point, my motion does not include
buying materials. It's only use of equipment at this time.
DODGE HENNEKE: Do you have a time frame?
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Should have a time
frame.
JUDGE HENNEKE: A week to 10 days? Or --
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Thirty days or
something.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd say within the next

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week, ten days.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second the motion.
JUDGE HENtdE KE: Motion by Commissioner Letz,
second by Commissioner Williams, that for the next 10 days,
that Commissioners Court authorizes the Road and Bridge
Department to use equipment, but not material, for purposes
of temporary repairs to private roads, to provide access to
people who otherwise do not have access. And the clear
intent of that is, if there's a back way out, they can get
out the back way, but if they'd just rather get out the
front way because it's shorter, that doesn't qualify.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. That's it.
DODGE HENNEKE: Any questions or comments on
the motion?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Only comment, these are
minimum repairs to make it passable. We're not talking
about blading off the whole road or blading off the
crossing.
DODGE HENNEKE: If not, all in favor, raise
your right hand
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
DODGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Leonard had provided
us with the figure of $250,000 dollars. That's probably a
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reasonable figure, but I -- I'm not sure I'm ready to sign
off to a number yet. What do you all think?
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: 'Phere's a question I
have, 'cause this came up in other flood occurrences and
all. We do get some credit for in-kind toward that
25 percent, right?
(Judge Henneke nodded.)
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So, until we know a
little bit more about the size of the enchilada, I -- I
mean, I agree that this may be a little premature to put a
number on it, because we can always, on an emergency
basis -- if we've got to have some money in the pot to go do
something, we can always vote that, almost in real time. It
becomes almost a budget amendment. Is there a reason that
we need to establish -- is there a -- a real need to
establish a separate fund at this point?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think --
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I guess is the
question.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think there's a need to
establish a fund. I don't think there's a need to put money
in that fund yet. I think we need to -- I think everything
that Road and Bridge is doing, they need to separate it out
from the normal work for the County, and we should authorize
Tommy to set up a fund for that purpose. And we will fund
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that fund later.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I like that idea,
because I've been told that there are avenues for grant
money to help counties offset their match in situations like
this. I think we need to explore that, as well.
JUDGE HENNEKE: I think we can just authorize
Tommy --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: To set up a 2002 flood
fund for flood repairs.
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Expense those items --
go ahead and expense them against that fund.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're sure that
there's not a line item already in there? They are --
MS. SOVIL: You have one; it's Flood Control.
JODGE HENNEKE: Well, we may need to --
that's kind of a generic one. We might need to -- I'll talk
to Tommy, and if he's comfortable with Flood Control, that's
fine. Otherwise, we can set up a specific item for this.
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Might make it easier
to account for the FEMA purposes and others if it were all
in a separate fund.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's true.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Keep this event separate.
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah.
JUDGE HENNEKE: Can anyone think of anything
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else that we need to address?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, Judge. At some
point, I think that you need to -- you met with the FEMA
folks last week, and what is -- I was hoping we'd get that
done today. What is their charge to us? I mean, what is it
they want us, as Commissioners Court, to be doing out in the
county? Obtaining information for them?
JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. I was going to get to
that in a little while.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, sorry.
JUDGE HENNEKE: I'll give you your nickel
later; you picked up on the cue well.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's gone up to 7
cents.
JUDGE HENNEKE: I've met with FEMA three
times, I think. I met with -- first, I met Thursday with
the state disaster coordinator for this area who came
through, and then Friday I met with the FEMA team, and the
FEMA team is back today. And, as we all know, Kerr
County -- you know, 12 other counties have been declared
federal disasters, which means we're eligible for -- for our
purposes, for up -- up to 75 percent of the cost of the
flood event to the public, as far as the Commissioners
Court, which means we'll have to come up with the 25 percent
match, and some of that can be in-kind. And Commissioner
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Williams has got some information about where we might. be
able to actually tap into some state money for 1_he remainder
of the funds. T've given you all a copy of the disaster
summary outline, D.S.O., that we submitted on Friday, I
think it was, with the information that Leonard prcvided.
It was an initial estimate, I think. It's not substantially
low, but I think it's low.
As far as residential damage, the FEMA team
on Friday satisfied themselves that there was sufficient
residential damage to qualify for the assistance programs,
so we don't actually have to prove residential damaye in the
county for FEMA. But I think it would be a good idea still
if we identified and mapped those areas in the county tkiat
suffered damage, because, for one thing, that will enable us
to plan or think at least about the future, because the
damage tends to be repeated in the same areas. Flood
doesn't find a new area ro destroy; it goes back to where
it's been successful before. So, I think -- still think
that's an exercise we ought to do. As Leonard showed us
this morning, we prepared this map of the road and bridge
damage with the help of t_he city GIS pecple. The FEMP. team
is back today. They're meeting with the City at 1 o'clock
to go and look at infrastructure problems. The City has
substantial infrastructure problems; they lost some water
lines, they lost some sewer lines. And the FEMA team is
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scheduled to be here at ~ o'clock to ao out and look at the
damage to their road and bridge structure, and Leonard's
going to come bark, take them around. He's the one who
knows where everybody is; he r_an show them the magnitude of
what we`re talking about.
Leonard's initial estimate was $1.2 million
worth of damage out in the county. The Sheriff gave me an
estimate cf $50,000 fur overtime and damage to his vehicles
as a result of the events. So, it's been -- it's been
considerable. And I guess the good news is, as opposed to
the fire of almost twc years ago where we have yet to have
the first meeting with anybody, the feds are here and they
say they want to help us. So, hopetully we'll get some
things up and rolling and hurried.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would -- just a
comment. I would encourage, like I mentioned earlier,
anyone who has had any kind of damage to file a claim with
FEMA.
JUDGE HENNEKE: That's good.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: FEMA -- and I just -- I
was amazed. In '97 we had a bia flood in eastern Kerr
County, and my residence was damaged quite a bit. Their
response is phenomenal, I think. I mean, if it's your
residence and you're -- you have some problems, they're
there to help, and they help very fast. Also, not to be
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uncomplimentary when they come to businesses, but if ir_'s
your residence where you live, they're there to make sure
you're assisted very, very quickly. So, I would really
encourage anyone to file a claim with FEMA. It doesn't take
that long, and they give you a code. Usually it's one
meeting. I believe that they'll come out and do an
assessment and give you the paperwork, and many times you'll
have a checY, very -- within a week.
JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, the papers have been
very good about publishing the FEMA 800-number. And there
were some initial glitches; the disaster declaration came
out before the FEMA people knew about it, and there was a
few hours where people were calling FEMA and the FEMA people
were saying, "We don't know anything about you." But
they've got it corrected now, and they are taking names and
they will be contacting people. Other relief, the Salvation
Army and Red Cross have cleaning kits for people who want to
try to work on their damage. Clothing's available right out
here from the Seventh Day Adventist. Food and shelter is
available from the Red Cross at the First Presbyterian
Church, and there is a disaster relief fund set up -- I
think one at the Salvation Army and one through the Bank of
the Hills. So, there are avenues for people to help.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Only correction I'd
have, Judge, is, thank goodness, in reevaluating our damages
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with the Sheriff's Office vehicles and overtime, it's
probably actually dropped to about $40,000.
JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. We did have damage
here in the courthouse from some leaks, and we had damage
out at the Ag Extension Office, where water got up into the
office. That's the only county facilities that I'm aware
of. And a car -- well, that's --
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'm not inc]ud~ng our
building leaks. We had some -- some pretty good leaks out
there in that building.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, leaks to private
residences -- we're talking about leaks? You're not -- it's
not necessarily just the river rising and getting into a
home. It could be a lot of rainwater just coming down a
driveway into a home and any kind of water damage, huh?
JUDGE HENNEKE: I would encourage anybody who
had water damage resulting from, you know, the rains of the
las*_ 10 days to file a claim. FEMA may come out and say no,
that was just a lot of rain and, you know, it doesn't
qualify, but if you don't ask, you don't get.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: P1m-hmm. So, what's
that 800-number?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 800-621-FEMA.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is it really? Oh,
that Letz is good, isn't he?
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Wha*_ is it?
DODGE HENNEKE: 521-FEMA.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 621-FEMA.
JUDGE HENNEKE: Do ycu have any questions?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, question -- I had
two, actually. Looking at the report, I don't see a
category for other property, and I'm thinking of the 10
airplanes that were damaged.
JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, we didn't know about
those. Now, those would be included under others. And this
one doesn't show the Kerrville Little League. The City
thought it was theirs, and that's going to be corrected in
the next one, but it was listed on the City's --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
JUDGE HENNEKE: -- submission.
COMMISSIONEP. LETZ: The other question I
have, what. is the status -- and I just don't remember. How
does the ag de~~laration -- disaster declaration differ from
the one we got already, or does it? And the question comes
in, fences, ranch roads, things of that nature. As I
recall, I know they`re covered somehow, but I --
DODGE HENNEKE: It's a separate declaration.
I had a phone call last week -- I think it was Friday --
from a farm service agent.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Joe Franklin, uh-huh.
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JUDGE HENNEE:E: And he said he was working on
the report, and we probably need to call him this morning,
because he was going to e-mail me a copy and my computer
went down on Friday. But that -- it's a different disaster
declaration; it's a different fund. But, yeah, I think they
would make people eligible for fence damage repair, for crop
damage. I'm sure we had some crops go down.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 'Cause there was, I
guess, lots of questions about that, and, you know, we need
to follow up as to where that declaration is. 'Cause, I
mean, I remember it being separate.
JUDGE HENNEKE: We want to encourage people
who have damage out in the county to structures that may or
may not have been in the floodplain or floodway to contact
the County's Floodplain Administrator, Stuart Barrons.
What's the best phone number, Stuart?
MR. BARRON: 896-5445.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Say again?
MR. BARRON: 896-5445.
JUDGE HENNEKE: At no cost, Stuart will go
out and make a determination as to whether or not the
location of the structure is in the floodplain. This
becomes important because of what's called a 50-percent
rule. Under FEMA regulations, if a structure that's located
in the floodplain has -- has had cumulative damage from a
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flood of more than 50 percent of the value of the structure,
they're not supposed to be able to rebuild, and so it
becomes important for purposes of people who've had damage
and are interested in rebuilding. And, you know, that
sounds to me like a harsh, bureaucratic imposition on
people, but we're kind of caught in a r_atch-2~. If you
don't do that, then you call into question your flood
insurance program. And, by state law, the County's required
to have a flood insurance program, so it kind of goes around
this way. So, anyone out in the county who's had damage to
their structure, if they have any questions about whether
it's in the floodplain, contar_t Stuart. He'll go out and
make a determination. Stuart is also the one who's charged
with assessing the damage with regard to the 50-percent
rule. Is that right, Stuart?
MR. BARRON: On houses that have not been
insured, yes, sir.
Jt~DGE HENNEKE: Houses that have not been
insured, right.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Excuse me.
JIIDGE HENNEKE: Go ahead.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Does Leonard's number
include private roads?
JUDGE HENNEKE: No. He's gone -- these are
only County maintained roads.
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COMMISSICNER LETZ: So, private roads would
be in the other --
JUDGE HENNEKE: Right.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I would -- I
would think that number would certainly equal the County's.
JUDGE HENNEKE: Probably. I gave each of you
a flyer about a public assistance information meeting
Tuesday, July 9, 2002, from 10:00 to 12:00 in the morning at
the Alamodome, Meeting Room N. I can't attend. I don't
know if anyone feels that it would be a good idea to go or
not, but that information has been provided to each of you.
That's what I know today. Does anyone have any other
information or any questions? Stuart, do you have anything
else?
MR. BARRUN: I had a comment, that we may
want to -- the Court, if they wish, they -- they might like
to contact Bandera County to see how their landfill is
doing. With Kerr County doing like it is, as bad as some of
the surrounding r_ounties are, some of them may not have
access to the landfill, and, you know, it is a health
problem. It may help us out in the future when the
Guadalupe's up in Medina and such. So, if the Court would
feel --
	COMMISSIONER	LETZ: Isn't	there a	policy
right	now that only county	residents can	use the	Kerr County

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landfill?
JUDGE HENNEKE: Yes.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think so.
MR. BARRON: Usually that is the policy, yes,
sir.
JUDGE HENNEKE: I might check with the City
and see whether we can help Bandera or not. Anything else'
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Create -- you're going
to talk to the Auditor about creating this fund line?
DODGE HENNEKE: Right.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That they're not
putting any money in it till --
JUDGE HENNEKE: We're going to recess today
instead of adjourn, so we can report back tomorrow the
B.F.I. report. We can always revisit that issue if we need
to.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN:
JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay.
else, we will stand in recess of this
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN:
DODGE HENNEKE: Go ahe
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN:
this one?
Very good.
If there's nothing
We11 --
ad, Buster.
We're not going to do
COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah, we got to
revisit this one.
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COMMISSInNER BALDWIN: That's right, I'm
sorry. We're off to another meeting.
JUDGE HENNEKE: Recess this emergency
Commissioners meeting, ar.d -- Jonathan, do you want to --
Glenn?
MR. HOLEKAMP: The only question I have is,
are we prohibited from starting the cleanup, even though the
FEMA thing may be in play? 'Cause --
JUDGE HENNEKE: Not the cleanup.
MR. HOLEKAMP: -- two of the buildings
that -- County buildings that I'm in the process of trying
to get them to where we can get those people back into them
before the mold starts.
JUDGE HENNEKE: Not cleanup. Don't -- we
take pictures. You can't do any repair in the sense of
structural repair, but cleanup, as far as taking out the
trash and --
MR. HOLEKAMP: And the mud out of there, that
sort of thing?
JUDGE HENNEKE
MR. HOLEKAMP:
JUDGE HENNEKE
MR. HOLEKAMP:
Take pictures first.
Okay. We did that.
Yeah, legal --
But it's not a problem to
start?
JUDGE HENPdEKE: No, not a problem to start
~-a =~ enc
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the cleanup. But to start knocking out walls and things
like that, then --
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay.
JUDGE HENNEKE: -- then we may not be
qualified on that.
MR. HOLEKAMP: All right, that will be fine.
MR.. BARRON: That brings up another point.
If y'all put it in the paper, if somebody feels that they do
have what Team A considers "substantial damage," do not
start repairing their property until it's been assessed,
'cause they will not get reimbursed if it's been repaired.
JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. A11 right. Then we'll
adjourn the special emergency Commissioners Court --
MS. ALFORD: I thought you were recessing.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, there's a
question.
MS. ALFORD: I thought you were going to
recess this one.
JUDGE HENNEKE: You're right. I said
"recess," didn't I? We're going to recess the special
emergency Commissioners Court agenda, and at this time we
will reconvene the regular scheduled Commissioners Court
meeting from earlier this morning.
(Special emergency meeting recessed at
approximately 11:15 a.m.)
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STATE OF TEXAS ~
COONTY OF KERR ~
The above and foregoing is a true and complete
transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as
County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County,
Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth.
DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 23rd day of July, 2002.
JANNETT PI{E~P~E~R~,~~K~err County Clerk
t3 Y : -ka~ltdkL-----
Kathy ik, Deputy County Clerk
Certified Shorthand Reporter
_~..;-uz zi~rs
URDER NU. ~764~_
EMERGENCY ALITFIDRIZRTIDN
`~ F'DR I'.DRD RrID BRIDGE TO MAKE MINOR REPAIR WITHIN 1~ DRYS
Dn this the 8th day of J~.xly, 2~0c, upon motion made by
Commissioner Let z, seconded 6y Commissioner Williams, the
Co~_~rt unanimously approved by a vote of 4-~D-0, emer^gency
a~_ithor•iation within +,he next 10 days for• Road and Br^idge to
make minor^r°epair•s to private roads damaged 6y the flood, and
accessing a private residence.