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KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT
Regular Session
Monday, June 13, 2005
9:00 a.m.
Commissioners' Courtroom
Kerr County Courthouse
Kerrville, Texas
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PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge
H.A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1
WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2
JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3
DAVE NICHOLSON, Commissioner Pct. 4
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June 13, 2005
Commissioners' Comments
1.1 Presentation by Tina Woods, Executive Director,
on Dietert Seniors Center activities
--- Visitors' Comments (4-H Roundup report)
1.2 Request that Commissioners' Court declare unused
furniture partitions as surplus, authorize sale
1.3 Consider Resolution establishing July as "Flood
Awareness Month" in Kerr County
1.5 Discuss renewal for Pct. 4 and Tax Office Annex
Building, also authorize payment for June balance
1.4 Presentation by Gretchen Jahn, CEO, Mooney
Airplane Company
1.6 Consider authorizing City of Kerrville to
temporarily use courtroom facilities to conduct
City of Kerrville Municipal Court
1.7 Report from City of Kerrville Interim City Manager
Don Davis on EMS budget and contract (Q & A)
1.9 Public Hearing on resolution amending TCDP
contracts regarding Kerrville South Wastewater
Project, Phases 2, 3, and 4
1.10 Consider approving resolution(s) amending TCDP
contracts regarding the scope of Kerrville South
Wastewater Project, Phases II, III, and IV
1.14 Report from Congressman Henry Bonilla's office
concerning status of projects and matters with the
Congressman's district
1.8 Consider authorizing filing application with local
foundation(s) to fund up to 1/2 amount required
for pre-engineering design phase of Center Point
Wastewater Collection System
1.11 Discuss county standards to be met to upgrade
Scenic Ridge Road in Hills 'n Dales Subdivision
to be acceptable for county maintenance
1.12 Consider funding and timeline of construction of
walk bridge in Flat Rock Park
1.13 Set public hearing for revision of plat for
Southern Hills, Phase Two, Lots 36, 37, & 38
1.15 Final Plat of Mosty Pecan Grove, Pct. 2
1.16 Discuss the "Kerr County Management's Discussion
and Analysis" for the 2003-2004 audit
1.17 Approve placement contracts with E1 Paso County
and Cameron County, authorize County Judge to sign
1.18 Consider approval of $4,500 to repair juvenile
facility lift station
1.19 Discuss purchase of three new patrol cars
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I N D E X (continued)
June 13, 2005
PAGE
1.20	Consider having Information Technology Office	
	conduct a review of all county offices in	
	reference to technology efficiency	140
1.21	Consider directing Environmental Health Department	
	Manager/Floodplain Administrator to deny permits	
	when there is a violation of Subdivision Rules	144
1.22	Discuss Commissioners' Court liaison positions	146
1.23	Request approval of resolution to veto H.B. 2438	162
1.24	Consider/discuss Library Contract	164
1.25	Consider/discuss the Animal Control Contract	164
1.26	Consider/discuss the EMS Contract	167
1.27	Reports from the following Departments:	
	Animal Control	167
	Extension Office	171
	Environmental Health	187
	Juvenile Detention Facility	210
4.1	Pay Bills	221
4.2	Budget Amendments	223
4.3	Late Bills	233
4.4	Approve and Accept Monthly Reports	235
5.1	Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee	
	Assignments	235
Adjourned 240
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On Monday, June 13, 2005, at 9:00 a.m., a regular meeting
of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in the
Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, Kerrville,
Texas, and the following proceedings were had in open court:
P R O C E E D I N G S
JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, ladies and
gentlemen. Let me call to order the regularly scheduled
meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court scheduled for
this date and time, Monday, June 13th, 2005, at 9 a.m. It's
that time now, so let's get started, Commissioner 1, I think
you have the honors this morning, I believe.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I do, sir. If y'all
would stand, we'll have a word of prayer and a pledge of
allegiance, please.
(Prayer and pledge of allegiance.)
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: At this time, if there's any
member of the audience or the public that wishes to be heard
or address the Court on any matter that is not a listed
agenda item, you're privileged to come forward at this time.
Mr. Roy Walston, our Kerr County Extension Agent, has
indicated to me that he's got a 4-H representative or
representatives here today to --
MR. WALSTON: I've got several others on the
way. They're going to -- actually, we were planning to be a
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little later, so I -- they're going to -- it's going to
be -- if you don't mind recognizing them when they get here,
JUDGE TINLEY: All right. We appreciate you
being here today, and we'll try and get to you then. So,
we'll defer on that particular visitor's item, and is there
any other member of the public or the audience that wishes
to be heard on a matter that is not a listed agenda item?
If you wish to be heard on an agenda item, we'd ask that you
fill out a participation form at the back of the room. It's
not essential, but it assists me in not overlooking you when
we get to that item. But if there's any member of the
public or the audience that wishes to be to be heard on any
matter that's not a listed agenda item, please come forward
at this time. Seeing no one else coming forward,
Commissioner Baldwin, what do you have for us this morning?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have one item that I
wanted to bring up and talk about, and we have a good, dear
friend in this room that I understand it to be the last time
that she'll appear in this courtroom. Our good friend
Glenda Taylor of the Kerrville Daily Times is leaving
Kerrville and moving on to better things, and I just wanted
to say that I felt like that Glenda has been, as they say on
Fox, fair and balanced to us, and has reported very well,
and I wanted to thank her for her service to us and -- and
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to her own job and to our county. Glenda, thank you so
much, and -- is that going to be front-page stuff here, or
should I keep talking? (Laughter.) Okay, that's all.
Thank you so much. That's all.
JODGE TINLEY: Thank you. Commissioner
Williams?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Now I know why you
got all those quotes all the time. (Laughter.)
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's it. But it's
over, obviously.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I, too, wanted to say
a word about Glenda. Glenda came to Kerrville and the Daily
Times, and my understanding, it was with not a lot of
editorial or journalistic background, and picked up the --
picked up the assignment of covering Commissioners Court,
which in and of itself is a difficult task, if you just walk
into these waters and not -- don't know what this kind of
government is all about or what it does every two weeks and
what issues it confronts. And I just wanted to say thank
you, Glenda. You've done a splendid job. And what I
appreciate as an old -- old, old newspaperman, what I
appreciate most about what you have done is that you have
reserved your opinions for the space -- for that purpose on
the editorial page, and you have reported the news as it has
unfolded, and I thank you for that. That's not too often --
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that doesn't happen in the media today too often, and I
appreciate your efforts. Good luck to you.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner 3?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I'll change the
subject a little bit with all the baseball, 'cause we just
got to talk about baseball for a few minutes. First, I
think everyone's aware that the Comfort Bobcats had an
outstanding run this year in high school baseball. They
lost in the state tournament to Woodville. Disappointing,
but they faced a pitcher that they hadn't ever seen anything
quite the likes of before. But, really, the accomplishments
of making the state tournament is probably -- as long as I
can remember, they're the only team in the area that that's
gotten that far. Tremendous job. Then going to the major
league baseball draft, Kerrville is unbelievable, the
success they've had in this draft in recent years. Kevin
Whelan was drafted in the fourth round, which is phenomenal;
he's going to the Detroit Tigers. And J.P. Carter was
drafted for the third time, and as I understand it, he's for
the third time going to decline and going to go to -- I
believe it may be the University of Alabama. But that is
remarkable to have -- Kerrville currently has now four
players in the major league baseball system, which is
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really -- for a small high school like Kerrville, Tivy, is
amazing.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Any of those relatives
or anything, Jon?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Maybe two of them.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Maybe?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Maybe.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Also in that, before we
leave, hats off to Texas Longhorns and Baylor Bears; they're
continuing to make it through the super regionals. They
both are in decisive games today and will find out if
they'll be going to the college world series or not. Texas
is -- I have my doubts if they're going to make it, but they
may. They have basically the same people that they had last
year, minus a few players that went last year to the draft.
And a final note is -- it's baseball-related. I don't
know -- I doubt if too many people really watch a lot of
baseball -- college baseball games, but if somebody does
watch a lot, there was a game about two weeks ago between
Notre Dame and University of Florida, and this -- it just
happened to be this game, the person that announces a lot of
them -- to and behold, the lead announcer for that was
Carter Blackburn on the College Sports Network, and Carter
is the son of Bill Blackburn. His dream from way, way back
was to be a professional sports announcer. He graduated
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from Tivy, went to Cornell, got a degree and was working in
that field for a little bit, and has hit the big-time,
College Sports Network. He had a 50 -- I believe it's a
50-game contract he's currently working the current year,
and does an outstanding job. So, whenever you're flipping
around and you see Carter Blackburn, he's a local boy as
well.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want to make a
comment on your -- the games yesterday and today. If the
Longhorns -- if they stopped the game after seven innings,
it would be no problem. Boy, those last two innings,
though, golly, fall apart.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Shows how much Houston
Street -- having that closer, which they don't have this
year. And it's Houston Street who was their closer last
year. He's doing the same thing in major leagues as he did
in college; he's shutting them down. Remarkable.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I do have one other
thing. Glad you brought that up.
JUDGE TINLEY: That's why I inquired.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I just wanted to -- two
things. One, just caution everyone when they're driving
down the rural roads, primarily in Dave's area and my area.
I happened to be on Hermann Sons Road yesterday at
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2 o'clock. Camp changes are at 2:30, and you have never
seen so many cars on a narrow, winding road as going out to
Hermann Sons camp yesterday afternoon. So I think that, you
know, a weekend, especially when the camps are changing kids
in and out, it's increasing the traffic on some of our -- on
Highway 39, I'm sure, and roads out in the Hunt area and
around Comfort, some of those areas. It is a lot of
traffic, and those people need to really be careful,
especially Sunday afternoons when that's going on. That's
it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner 4?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Memorial Day weekend
brought some sad news to west Kerr County. In our little
Methodist church, we had two funerals; J.M. Auld and Mark
Edinburgh, both good friends of mine, and I know J.M. was
probably a friend of Mr. Baldwin's for all his life. J.M.
was the great, great, great grandson of Joshua Brown, so
they're a remarkable and important family in Kerr County.
On the bright side, the camps are open. It occurs to me --
and I appreciate what you said, Commissioner. There is a --
there are a lot of foreigners out there driving our roads
all summer long, and the good news is they're bringing in
lots of money from Dallas, Houston and Austin and other
places. So, I appreciate those camps, and I appreciate the
huge impact they have on our economy. That's all.
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JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. I too want to wish
Ms. Taylor well in her future endeavors, whatever those may
be, and we hope she goes with the best of fortunes. Let's
get down to business. I want to get ahead of the game a
little bit. We had a timed item, but I notice that
Ms. Woods is here, so we'll start with the first item on the
agenda, with a presentation by Tina Woods, who is the
Executive Director of the Dietert Senior Center -- Seniors
Center, upon the activities and goings on there at Dietert.
MS. WOODS: Thank you. ,
JUDGE TINLEY: Appreciate you being here this
morning.
MS. WOODS: Well, I appreciate the
opportunity to share with y'all what's happening at our
center. We had our monitoring by AACOG a couple of weeks
ago, and Commissioner Williams was part of that monitoring,
since he's your representative on the AACOG Board. And with
the questions that he asked, it made very clear to me that
it would probably be helpful for y'all to know exactly what
we're doing. There's a lot happening at the center, and
also for me to have the opportunity to thank you for the
support that you give our seniors every year. What I'm
goinq to cover with you this morning is an overview of our
services, how the County makes a difference in helping us to
deliver services to the seniors, and also give you an update
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on our capital campaign, because I'm sure that's of great
interest to y'all.
I have no issues to vent this morning. I
know many times y'all hear a lot of bad news and a lot of
difficult questions to deal with, so I'm here to present
good news. I know that that's not always the case with the
Court. So, I hope y'all bear with me as I walk through what
we do. Many of these things you may know, but some you may
not. For the past 35 years, the Dietert Senior Center has
been the only nonprofit organization in Kerr County
dedicated exclusively to helping older citizens. We serve
two distinct groups in our community. One is the active
senior who comes to our center and enjoys lunch or
participates in activities or delivers Meals on Wheels, and
then the other group is the less active that we deliver
Meals on Wheels to, or that we go in and help them in their
homes with their independent living service. With that
active group, we have about 1,200 seniors who are either
being involved in activities or they're volunteering their
time. That less active group is about 300 seniors.
For the programs that we receive federal and
state funding through the Older Americans Act, we cannot
charge for our services. We can suggest a donation, but we
cannot charge. It is not an income-based program, so even
though folks have the ability to pay, they're not required
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to pay. We suggest donations in every instance where we
receive government funding, but again, part of the Older
Americans Act was to preserve the dignity of our seniors who
are less affluent, so we cannot charge, which makes it kind
of interesting every year when we start to do our budgeting.
We're never quite sure how much our folks are going to be
able to contribute, and that's what makes our contracts with
the County and AACOG and the Texas Department of Human
Services very important to us.
Probably the most critical and
labor-intensive service that we offer is our nutrition
program. We prepare approximately 60,000 meals every year,
and we do that in a kitchen that is very tiny, that was in
the original house that Mr. Dietert bought back in 1969.
About 40,000 of those meals are delivered to our Meals on
Wheels folks. These are homebound elderly who can no longer
prepare meals for themselves or shop. Many times, our
volunteer drivers are the lifeline to those folks. Part of
their requirement is that they give the meal to the
recipient and have a brief conversation with them. They're
trained to recognize changes in the mental status of those
folks and to just really kind of monitor them. Many times
our volunteers are the only person that they see. We're up
to 170 Meals on Wheels every Monday through Friday in our
community, which is a lot. We operate nine routes
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throughout the county, including Center Point, Hunt, and
Ingram. We're looking at dividing up some of those to go to
ten routes, simply because we have as many as 30 meals being
delivered on a single set of drivers, and that's really more
than we would like to keep the food within its safe range
for heat and cold.
We do anticipate this service growing over
time, simply because we know the folks who are active at our
center now are the ones in waiting to be less active.
Probably the age range that we support in this area are
anywhere from early '80's to late, late 90's. Our active
group of seniors is anywhere from 50 to late 90's. It's
amazing what these Yolks can do. But Meals on Wheels is
very important to us, obviously. The volunteers who deliver
these meals log about 9,000 hours every year doing this
service. We had a donor recently come forward who is
concerned about the expense of gas, and he was from another
community and had set up a gas voucher program there. So,
he's an anonymous donor, but we now can supply vouchers.
We've worked with the Fritz family, the Mini-Marts, and
every week each of our drivers gets a gas voucher for $5.
They can use it or not use it, and this kind gentleman comes
in and writes us a check every month, so that's been
amazing. Many of our drivers can afford to pay for it, but
we've got a lot that that is a significant expense for them,
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especially when they're driving 20 miles, so it's been real
gratifying to have this help in that area.
In our dining room, we serve about 20,000
lunches every year. Depending upon the menu -- if it's
fish, we may have about 60; if it's ham or roast beef, we'll
have close to 100. A lot depends upon what we're serving,
just obvious. But that is a service that we provide and
that we're very proud of. Our food is excellent. Y'all are
all invited to come; our dining room is open to everyone.
If you're under 60, I can charge $5 for your meal. If
you're 60 or older, we suggest a $4 donation. Our actual
cost in this area is about $4.80 a meal. We have devoted,
since I've been at the center, the $15,000 that y'all give
us from the County to our nutrition program, simply because
that is the most vital service that we offer. Your $15,000
represents about 25 cents a meal, so I think that's an
excellent investment on your part, and believe me, we
appreciate it.
This service is something that, long-term, we
expect to grow. I learned last week that the Older
Americans Act was really designed primarily to get people
together. I've always thought that it was for a Meals on
Wheels type service, to support them in their homes, but the
idea was that older folks need to get out. They shouldn't
be isolated; they need to come to a centralized place to
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enjoy a meal and enjoy fellowship. It's not the largest
program that we offer, but it's probably the noisiest. We
know that folks who come to our center enjoy themselves, and
many of the people who are there, that's their primary meal
that day. To my surprise when I came to the center, I would
have expected a lot of ladies to be eating with us, because
ladies live longer generally, but we have more gentlemen in
our dining room than ladies. Because, guess what? Do y'all
cook? Not too many men do. When they find themselves on
their own, they -- they really do enjoy coming to our center
and having a good meal, 'cause they don't like to cook for
themselves, or they never learned how. There are also many
relationships that develop. We have a single men's table.
They have a sign on it that says, "Single ladies welcome."
And then "welcome" was crossed out and "wanted" was written
in. (Laughter.) So, it's -- it's a very interesting place.
It's a lot of fun to be, but it's important too.
Our Independent Living Program is probably
less well-known than our Meals on Wheels, but this is the
service where we are providing -- essentially taking our
senior center to the home. Patsy Hodges, who was the
director of social services at Sid Peterson Hospital, is now
in charge of this service, and we expect, long-term, this to
be a growth area for us. We are the only option for folks
who have few resources to be able to get some kind of
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support in their home. We will go in and do a full
assessment, and based on that assessment, we can provide
light housekeeping. We work with home health agencies in
town to come into the home and help folks with bathing and
dressing. We can install an emergency response device like
a lifeline in their homes. These are supported through the
AACOG program, the Older Americans Act program, and it is
provided at no charge. We do suggest a donation, but again,
folks are not required to pay for this service. We contract
for it, so essentially the funds are a pass-through for us.
But there are lots of private home health agencies in town;
for people who have resources, they can get help in their
home. The Dietert Center is the only one that can provide
this service for those who don't have the resources.
It stays pretty busy. Our funds are limited,
because AACOG dictates how much we can spend. We can only
offer this service for a three-month period for the
homemaking and the light housekeeping and the personal
assistance. The emergency response devices we can put in
for a six-month period, but it's better than nothing.
Long-term, I have big concerns about this area, simply
because we're the only senior center in the AACOG region
that provides social services. Most do meals or activities,
but they really don't do the social services that we do. We
are always going to have folks in our community who cannot
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afford to pay for this type of service, but it costs less
for them to be maintained in their home than in an
institutionalized setting. We've formed recently the Hill
Country Coalition on Aging, which combines all of the groups
that deal with seniors in this community, and I believe
they, working with you and the rest of our government
officials, are going to have to be very creative in the next
several years to figure out how we're going to support the
growing number of elderly that are going to need assistance.
It's one of the things that keeps me up at
night, but I do believe that programs like Independent
Living are really going to make a difference. We know they
make a difference now, and long-term it's going to be more
important to us. Besides the programs that AACOG funds, we
also operate a medical equipment lending service through
that area. Folks will bring us shower chairs and canes and
walkers, and we lend them out at no charge. We'll just
pretty much be a central point for folks to drop things off.
That stays extremely busy. We also have volunteers who do
daily reassurance phone calls to folks. Sometimes it's
arranged so that they call us, or sometimes we call them,
just so that there is a human contact every day to say, "Hi,
how are you doing? What's going on?" We do about 1,300 of
those annually. That's something that our volunteers really
look forward to doing.
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We also have help for family caregivers.
This is an area that hasn't been widely discussed in our
community. We know most of the family caregivers are
spouses, and they're elderly themselves. There's not a lot
of support for these folks who have the responsibility of
taking care of a loved one 24/7. We have an on-site program
at the center called Take Five, which is designed for those
who have early Alzheimer's or other forms of dementia or
advanced Parkinson's, any kind of a disorder that keeps them
from being on their own safely. Their loved one can bring
them to the center. They have activities in the morning,
they eat lunch with us, and they're ready to go home about
2 o'clock in the afternoon. When their loved one is in the
Take Five club, that family caregiver has four or five hours
where they can schedule their own doctor's appointments or
run errands, or just rest. We offer that two days a week.
We hope to expand that into five days a week. It is not a
program that is supported by any government funding, so we
do charge $30 a session for that service. We have about 12
families that are involved in that now. Over the course of
time that we've offered this program, we've served about 100
families in this community.
Once their loved one is no longer capable of
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We have volunteers who are trained to go in and provide
respite in the home. They can be there for a couple of
hours. We have beepers that we can give the family member
if they wish to leave so that we can contact them if there's
any issue. This was developed with a grant from the
National Family Caregivers Association a couple of years
ago. We have about 12 volunteers who go out and provide
this service right now, which is really a godsend to many of
those folks. A lot of times that family caregiver will just
take a nap while our volunteer is there, because they're
comfortable and know that their loved one's going to be
monitored.
We've worked with the churches in town to do
another group of visitation, which is called our Good
Samaritans. These folks go into some of the homebound,
isolated elderly who really just need some companionship.
This has been ongoing for a while. I think we have about 15
to 20 volunteers who make visitation on a regular basis, so
those are all the things that are involved in our
independent living service, and usually when I go out and
make presentations in the community, folks are just amazed
that we do all this. We really do have a love for our
seniors, and especially those who have become known to us at
the center, who have maybe been very involved in our on-site
activities. They'll have a health problem that will force
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them to stay at home, so we still want them to be part of
what's going on and support them, and especially support
their families.
Last, but not least, is our Activities
Program, and this is probably some of the traditional things
that you would think of when you think of the senior center.
We have more than 40 groups that are all led by volunteers.
We divide these into two separate areas, more or less.
There are those that work to produce income for the center,
and there are those that just participate in the social side
of what we do. Our income-producing volunteers run our
thrift shop. Our Yesterday and Today thrift shop is very,
very busy. We hope to expand that in the future. We know
that thrift shops do very well in this community, and we
feel that's a great way to offset some of our operating
expenses. We also have volunteers who recycle cards. We
have quilters that quilt on consignment. We have volunteers
to come in and bake pies in the afternoon when our kitchen
is finished with lunch. Right around the holidays, that's
been a great program for us. And then our travel service is
also run by volunteers, and is a great entree to our center
for younger seniors who perhaps don't see themselves ever
coming to a senior center, but they like to go on a trip.
They just came -- they're just coming back from Niagara
Falls right now. That's a very, very active service, and it
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generates income for us.
On the recreational side, we have -- oh, man,
you name it. Everything from exercise to tai chi to yoga to
every kind of dance lesson that you could imagine, computer
classes, foreign language classes, discussion groups. A
number of clubs like A.A.R.P. meet at our center. It's
active from 8:00 in the morning till about 9:30 at night, so
it keeps us hopping. We don't ask for payment for these
activities. We, again, suggest a donation of $2 each time
someone comes and participates at our center to try and
offset some of our operating expense. Part of the Older
Americans Act requires that there not be memberships, so we
don't have a membership; it's not an exclusive club. We
have folks from all walks of life that are involved with us,
and all economic backgrounds, from homemakers to retired
engineers and physicians. And, you know, those are just the
ladies I'm talking about.
So, that kind of gives you a quick overview
of our services. Our Board of Directors is made up of 18
community leaders. Jacques Duhr is our president right now.
Walter Schellhase is our vice president. Don Cochran is our
secretary, and Louise Kirby is our Treasurer. These folks
are working very hard with me right now to raise money for
our new building. You probably know we started a capital
campaign. We are trying to raise $4 million to build a new
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building over on Guadalupe Street. I'm asked frequently,
"Well, why do you need a new building?" And the answer is
very simple. I think y'all know, 'cause you look at county
demographics, that 31 percent of our community right now is
age 60 and older. We know that that is only going to grow
over time. We're maned out where we are. It's phenomenal
what our staff does with the space that we've got. We have
limited parking with our building. They're expensive to
operate. Right now I say a little prayer every day when
lunchtime comes, because we have folks crossing Jefferson
Street, and nobody slows down on Jefferson Street.
So, there are -- there are a host of reasons
why we need the building. Long-term, we also need the
support of the community. We are really characterizing this
new building as more of a community center, not just a
senior center. We will have the availability of renting the
space for reunions, different kinds of meetings. There's a
private dining room that we hope to attract some of the
service clubs on a regular basis to our program. We're
looking at offering evening meals, so when someone comes to
the Dietert Center and has dinner, then they're supporting
our senior lunch program. We really are going to need the
support of the community, because we know, long-term, the
government funding is going to dry up. As many times as
we've heard that that's not going to be the case, I don't
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think it's prudent for us to plan that there's always going
to be an AACOG safety net there. That's why your support is
really, really important to us long-term, because we're
The capital campaign itself is progressing
well. We have up to 62 percent of our funds either
committed or in-hand. Part of that is proceeds from our
property that we sold on Sidney Baker Street and Jefferson.
That whole section was sold to Mr. John Miller early last
year, and he has been gracious to let us stay with a
three-year lease where we are right now, so we can operate
and raise money, but we need to be out of there by March of
2007. So, we need to break ground early next year, if not
this fall. We have commissioned a construction document;
Peter Lewis is our architect. So, we're trying to get a
real good handle on exactly how much we need to raise, but
we intend to move forward with the project. We are doing a
lot of different kinds of fundraising in the area, and you
should know that a lot of our participants have been very
involved in that pror_ess. We published a cookbook that our
volunteers are selling. We've got brick sales. We have our
quilters who are raffling a quilt; they hope to make $1,500
by this August, and they're close to it right now. So many
of our participants are getting involved in the fundraising
to the level that they're able to.
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All of the local foundations have been very
generous in their support of our building campaign, and
we're also applying for grants outside of the community as
well, so we're leaving no rock unturned as far as getting
funds to build a building. But we're excited about it.
It's something that's needed for this community, and we know
it's going to happen. That's a quick overview. Can 1
answer any questions? Y'all's eyes are kind of glazed over.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have a question --
no, it was very interesting. There were some things I
didn't know. I have a question. The question is, what is a
senior? And the reason I ask that, I was recently a member
of a group of about 20 that went to Cici's for dinner, and I
got a discount price on my meal because I'm a senior in
their eyes, and I was just wondering what -- a young guy
like me is considered a senior? And, by the way, you may be
interested to -- Judge Brown and Buddy Hierholzer's in the
back row back there; I'm sure they came to hear what you had
to present as well.
MS. WOODS: Because they're seniors?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, definitely. No
question. (Laughter.) But I'm not. What is a senior? 60?
70? 80? 65?
MS. WOODS: Well, it depends on who you talk
to. You know, the whole definition of seniors is changing
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because, you know, guess what? The Pepsi generation is
hitting their 50's. If you're 50 and older, A.A.R.P, says
you're a senior. If you're 55 and older, that's kind of
where some of the senior discounts start with -- you know,
when you go to restaurants or I think at the mall, it's 55
and above. Because of my health care background, I tend to
think 65, of course, but I'm 53, so, you know -- but, you
know, it really does beg the question, and that's one of the
things that has concerned us in our planning, especially for
the new building, is that folks that are now in their 50's
and in their 60's are still very much involved with careers.
I mean, long-term, all of us are trying to figure out, you
know, will retirement exist for us as it does right now for
folks in their '70's and '80's and 90's? I'm here to tell
you, it's not. So, what does that mean for a center like
us? We're viewing the new building as the Dietert Center or
the Dietert Community Center, because we know that people
who are currently in their 50's and 60's do not only not see
themselves right now as seniors; they're never going to see
themselves as seniors, and we're redefining what aging
means. When you think about your grandparents at your age,
you're a whole lot younger, aren't you?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, they were old.
(Laughter.) Used to be really old.
MS. WOODS: Well, you know, they're saying
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that 50 is the new 30. But, you know, that's mostly because
those of us who said, you know, life ends after 30 are --
are reaching their 50's. But it really is a fascinating
dynamic when you look at our country. I mean, the baby
boomers have always changed whatever era they lived in, and
aging is not going to be any different.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
MS. WOODS: And I think in this community, we
are blessed with active retirees. I mean, they come here
because they want to play golf or they want to hunt or be
involved in the outdoors, and that's not going to change.
But nobody can escape the challenge of aging. I mean, I'm
sure when y'all get up every morning, there are a few little
aches and pains you didn't recognize yesterday. I know I
have them.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let me introduce
myself, Commissioner. I am a senior. (Laughter.)
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: See about getting some
of those walkers rented pretty soon.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I've got one; just
don't bring it to court. Let me just lend a word or two to
Tina's support. On behalf of the -- of what I -- what I
witnessed and participated in in AACOG, she mentioned the
recent monitoring by AACOG of the food program, basically I
think of the congregate meals and the Meals on Wheels, and
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they were found to be in extraordinarily good shape in what
they do, and they do it very well, and they do it for a
number of people that she told you. But the activities as a
whole, and not only the meals and the congregates -- Meals
on Wheels and the congregates, but all of the activities
that Dietert does, are very, very well received by AACOG,
and are among the top tier of everything that AACOG funds,
so you should be proud of what they do. They do it well,
and we thank you for coming to court today to tell us about
it.
MS. WOODS: Sure.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions for
Ms. Woods?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. Very
informative.
JUDGE TINLEY: We appreciate that.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner, I'm often told
that our age as perceived by others oftentimes has a lot to
do with the number of miles we have on us.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've heard that.
But --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's why I'm so
young, then.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's why Buster is so
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old.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Uh-oh, that did it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Let's digress, if we
can. I think we have our -- I think we have our 9-H people
here that wanted to kind of tell us what they had going on.
So, Mr. Walston, if -- if you'll take off and --
MR. WALSTON: Thank you, Judge Tinley. If
you don't mind, I'd like to ask these youngsters to come up
forward. Krystal, if y'a11 will line up across here?
Appreciate y'all's taking time to give me the opportunity to
recognize these youngsters. And I -- I've actually been in
Extension for 17 years. This year we had 12 young men and
women that went to state 4-H Roundup this last year -- this
last week. We had three teams, which is a wool and mohair
team, a wool -- wool judging team, as well as a mohair
evaluation team, and a grass I.D. team. Unfortunately, some
of those kids couldn't be here with us today, with school
vacations and family vacations and -- and jobs, but we'd
like to recognize these kids. Each one of these teams all
placed in the top three in their respective contests, which
I can tell you, that's the first time I've ever had that
happen. And if you place in the top three in your category,
you get to walk across the stage at Texas A & M College
Station; you're recognized in front of about 3,000 people,
so this is quite an accomplishment.
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Our wool judging team is made up of Bryan
Weaver here on my far right. Bryan was our third-high
individual in the contest. He's -- he was our first-high
individual in the Val Verde and the Del Rio contest. And I
can say that with a majority of these kids, this is actually
their second year for judging, so it's quite an
accomplishment. Chance Muehlstein is also on our wool
judging team. Ashley Frizzell is also on our wool judging
team, and Krystal Morey is on our wool judging team, and so
we appreciate those -- those youngsters. Dub Walston on the
end was third-high individual in the mohair contest. This
is his third year there. Last year he was second-high
individual, and the previous year he was second-high in the
wool judging contest. So, as far as our remaining members
on our mohair team, we had Larissa Saur, Brad Behrens, and
Shane Albrecht all made up our mohair judging team. They
helped out Dub, and they were the second-high overall team
in the contest. Just missed out beating Sutton County,
which was the high team.
Our grass I.D. team, which is coached by
Marybeth Bauer and Steve Bauer, had Lance Bauer, their son.
He was second-high individual in the contest, and was --
actually, it was a tie for the first-high, and he was beat
out in the spelling area, so he -- he had a rough row to hoe
there. Kristen Nelson is also on our grass I.D., Elias
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Garcia and Hunter Dieringer, so we had an excellent group of
kids. I think they all enjoyed it, and hopefully we'll be
taking them back again next year. So, I just -- I
appreciate y'all taking the time to -- letting me recognize
these kids.
(Discussion off the record.)
MR. WALSTON: We have two methods
demonstrations, too. Lance Bauer --
MS. BOYD: For the first time in the 13 years
I've been here, the first time we've had methods
administrations go in the contest. I was -- we were excited
about that. So --
MR. WALSTON: Lance Bauer had a sheep and
goat demonstration, and he was fourth in the sheep and goat
demonstration. Hunter Dieringer also had a demonstration on
scoring trophy whitetail and exotics, and he was 9th out of
24. So, again, this is a statewide contest. We have kids
from all over the state of Texas coming in. I would also
like to mention, Kerr County 4-H, with the help of Laurinda
Boyd, presented a grant to the 4-H Alumni Foundation, and we
received a $500 grant. That was the grant awarded out of 16
applicants, and that money will be going towards -- part of
it towards recruitment of 4-H alumni, as well as for the
B.C.I. program. So, we appreciate -- appreciate y'all
giving us this time.
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JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you very much.
(Applause.)
JUDGE TINLEY: Good job.
MS. BOYD: Why don't y'all go on either side;
I'll take a picture of you.
MR. WALSTON: If y'all have any questions for
them, feel free to ask questions.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Who was your 3rd grade
teacher?
JUDGE TINLEY: Don't go asking about
spelling.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No spelling. What was
the word, "sheep"?
MS. BOYD: Lance kind of got a lot of ribbing
about that all day long. Guys, scoot in a little bit for
me. And I will be sending this today to both of the papers,
just 'cause I know y'all were writing furiously.
MR. WALSTON: Krystal, you and Dub scoot
over. Y'all are covering up --
MS. BOYD: Ashley, scoot in. There you go.
There you go, all right. Now we got it. Thank y'all for
your continued support.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you for coming.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to Item 2, if
we might. Item 2 is request that Commissioners Court
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declare unused furniture partitions as surplus and authorize
the sale of same. There you are, Mr. County Attorney.
MR. EMERSON: Yes, sir. As y'all know, the
remodeling is almost complete downstairs in our office, and
it's been my understanding from Maintenance that they do not
have a use, nor would they prefer not to have a use for the
temporary partitions that were previously used in the
office, and as such, we would request that the Court declare
them as surplus, allowing Maintenance to sell them for the
benefit of the County. There's also some old law books that
are sitting in the old holding area where the old county
jail used to be. Those have not been updated in lord knows
how many years, have no use to the County, but they do have
a market value to an attorney that wants to make his office
look good, and we would ask that the County declare those as
surplus and allow the County to sell them for the benefit of
the taxpayers.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move that we approve the
unused furniture, partitions, and law books as surplus, as
requested by the County Attorney.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: I assume that includes
authorization that they be sold? I think --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct.
JUDGE TINLEY: -- that follows surplus,
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doesn't it? Motion made and seconded for approval of the
agenda item. Any question or discussion? All in favor of
the motion, signify by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Thank
you, Mr. Emerson.
MR. EMERSON: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, Rex.
JUDGE TINLEY: Next item on the agenda is to
consider, discuss, and take appropriate action on a
resolution establishing the month of July as Flood Awareness
Month in Kerr County. Commissioner?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Our good friends
George and Mary Virginia Holekamp remind us annually that
July needs to be declared as Flood Awareness Month, and that
we have one of those untamed rivers that run right through
the heart of -- of Kerr County that sometimes reminds us
dramatically what that's all about. So, we have a
resolution in trout of you and some backup information.
George? Mary Virginia? Which one of you would like to
speak to the issue for a second? We expected some R.C. & D.
folks, but Mary Virginia said she is the designated hitter.
So --
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MS. HOLEKAMP: Bertha Venegas is our
why she couldn't be here today. July will be Flood
Awareness Month in the 10 counties that make up Alamo
R.C.& D. The counties are Atascosa, Bandera, Bexar, Frio,
Guadalupe, Kendall, Kerr, Medina, Wilson, and these are
counties in central and south Texas. Proclamations are
being made in each county, and educational material will be
distributed about floods and floodplain management. Each
county will have a different -- different project. Some
counties are having workshops about testing -- testing the
water -- testing water, and others will be checking
contamination in the floodplain. Many of the counties are
not nearly as advanced in this as Kerr County is.
In Kerr County, for the Flood Awareness
Month, we will have a program at the Riverside Nature Center
on Thursday, July 14th, at 6 o'clock. It will be a forum
type; we have four speakers -- about four speakers, and
there will be time for question and answers. So far, an
NRCS person will discuss range practices that benefit the
floodplain, and someone from the Texas Department of
Transportation will discuss flood warnings and signs, and we
have two more things on the -- that we plan to have.
There'll be refreshments afterwards, and we have educational
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material that people will be given to take back to their
groups. And we want to thank the Commissioners Court for
their longtime support of this project. Commissioner
Baldwin has helped from the very start. How long ago was
that? Almost 10 years?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Long time. I'm now a
senior citizen. (Laughter.)
MS. HOLEKAMP: But we just thank you for your
help, and you've helped R.C.& D. many times. I especially
want to mention, when we had a convention here, we were so
proud of Kerr County because it's a fundraiser for R.C.& D.,
and usually they hire a motivational speaker and an
auctioneer, and we didn't have to hire either person in Kerr
County. Commissioner Baldwin was the auctioneer, and did a
fine job for us.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you.
MS. HOLEKAMP: We thank you for what all
you've done. Okay. Commissioner Letz, he was our Kerr
County representative on the Kerr County R.C.& D. for a
number of years, helped set up an office that we had for a
time here, and we acquired a few -- a few grants for fire
departments, held a few programs teaching you how to write
grants, grantwriter seminars, and we thank you for your
continued support.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you.
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MS. HOLEKAMP: Commissioner Nicholson, do you
know you were involved in the very first flood awareness
program that we had? I kept a scrapbook, you know, and you
wrote a letter. You wrote --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'm one of those
older citizens who's losing his memory.
MS. HOLEKAMP: You wrote a little letter in
support of Flood Awareness Week, and we -- we thank you for
your early support and your -- your continued support. And
Bill Williams helped with the thing last year, and maybe the
time before, and he's on the committee for this time. He
set up this meeting, and we certainly do thank you for that.
And Judge Tinley serves on our council, on our R.C.& D.
council, and we appreciate having your name on the list of
County Judges who support R.C.& D. in this area. And also,
George invited him to be the moderator --
DODGE TINLEY: I'm going to have to pass that
to Commissioner Williams; I'm scheduled to be out of town.
I told George that I'd try and find him somebody if -- and
Commissioner Williams is -- is a great moderator. He's a
professional moderator.
MS. HOLEKAMP: Yeah, won't that be good? He
-- he can field all those hard questions.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, yeah.
MS. HOLEKAMP: Well, we -- we just thank you
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so much for your support. And I do believe that's the end
of my story.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let me make a
comment, Judge, if I might. In the packet of materials that
I presented to the Court in support of this resolution is a
floodplain management pamphlet which is prepared by
R.C.& D., and it's really very good. It tells a story and
-- of floods and helps us be aware and tells us what we can
do and where we can go for resource material and so forth.
And while I have Ms. Hardin's attention, please ask Mr. Odom
to contact me with respect to Flood Awareness Month, because
I'd like for him to be a participant on that panel. If I'm
going to moderate it, he's going to be there too. So, if
you'll ask him to give me a r_all for July 14th, we will
enlist his services as the floodplain manager for Kerr
County on this panel of experts.
MS. HARDIN: I would also like to say that on
July the 12th, we're going to have a FEMA workshop where the
people from Ter,DOT will come and present to the Court what
the floodplain administration program is all about.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: With all that, Judge,
I would move the resolution to -- to proclaim in Kerr County
Flood Awareness Month for the month of July.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second, with a slight
typo correction.
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JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. There are
some, yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: In the first sentence,
"Resource" should be capitalized.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yes.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How'd we let that get
by, Ms. Mitchell?
JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or
discussion on the motion? All in favor --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I just want to
express a little bit of frustration that I wish more could
be done on flood awareness. I think one person has already
drowned in the Guadalupe this year down -- it was in the
Guadalupe-Blanco River Authority area on the Guadalupe, and
we'd just be lucky if more -- another one doesn't drown this
year. Just seems to happen every year, and most of them
seem to be preventable. So, any -- you know, anything we
can do to increase awareness of the real dangers of that --
that river can be terribly dangerous.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We might start by
trying to drum up a crowd for this forum that they're going
to have at the Riverside Nature Center on July 14th.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah. That's all.
DODGE TINLEY: Any further question or
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discussion on the motion? All in favor of the motion,
signify by raise goes your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(NO response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Thank
you very much. Let's move on to Item 5, if we might,
consider/discuss renewal for the Precinct 4 and Tax
Office -- Precinct 4 J.P. and Tax Office annex building, and
authorize payment of the June balance. Mr. Holekamp? I
think the Court charged Mr. Holekamp with trying to get this
thing resolved and worked out and a renewal of a lease
agreement accomplished, and --
MR. HOLEKAMP: Y'all have that --
JUDGE TINLEY: -- he has done so.
MR. HOLEKAMP: Y'all have that in your
packet, I believe
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes.
MR. HOLEKAMP: We finally accomplished
getting a lease agreed upon, and I believe all parties are
satisfied with it. Some of the language as far as the
facility -- destruction of premises, eminent domain,
lessor's remedies on default -- those are pretty much just
general language. But we are going to do some work in the
back portion of that office. There'll be a minimal amount
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of remodeling that is going to be done at our expense. So,
I felt like we got a pretty good lease on this particular
facility, comparing it to other facilities in the area.
So -- and part of this motion is that the agreement was --
is that this -- this lease would start June 1st, so I'm
asking as part of the motion to go ahead and authorize that
$250 additional, and then next month it'll be picked up as
the amount.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Has the County
Attorney reviewed the --
MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes. Yes.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move for approval.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second.
MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, he approved it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for
approval of the agenda item. Any question or discussion?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I've got a question.
The provision in Paragraph 3 that outlines the
responsibilities for the cost of maintenance.
MR. HOLEKAMP: Mm-hmm?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Is that standard
kind of language?
MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Is that typically
what you see as a divisional responsibility?
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MR. HOLEKAMP: That's, yes, sir, pretty
standard.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Are Judge Ragsdale
and Ms. Rector both on board with this?
MR. HOLEKAMP: That is correct.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Are they happy to be
there two more years?
MR. HOLEKAMP: Ecstatic.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Great.
JUDGE TINLEY: The -- the roof and related
repairs are complete, are they not?
MR. HOLEKAMP: That is correct. We have some
drainage issues in the back of the building that Mr. Priour
and I agreed that we would address those when we start
getting some of that stuff out of the building that he owns,
and then I think there's stuff that Mr. Ragsdale said he
might want to take home with him or something.
JUDGE TINLEY: But everybody's on the same
page?
MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
MR. HOLEKAMP: And, Commissioner Nicholson,
maybe I was being a little facetious about "ecstatic," but
both -- both of them are well aware, and neither one voiced
an opposition at all, because they realize the importance of
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being prudent with our dollars.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Well, it's a handy
location. It's -- it's centrally located for Precinct 4,
and it's used to some extent by other people outside of
Precinct 4. I spent some time in there, and I can see
that -- that the citizens appreciate the convenience and
accessibility of it. So, if those -- if the J.P. and
Ms. Rector are happy, I'm happy.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I think keeping the
location there, people are used to that location. If we're
able to maintain that, I think that's a plus also.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I appreciate the work
that Glenn did to work out what -- it seemed we were in kind
of divergent mode for a while, having some real problems,
and he got through all that, and we have a deal that's more
economic than the other alternatives we were looking at.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Thank you, Glenn.
This wasn't easy. You're a peacemaker.
MR. HOLEKAMP: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: Thrown into the breach, as it
were. Any further question or discussion on the motion?
All in favor of that motion, signify by raising their right
hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same time -- same
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sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. It's
a few minutes before 10 o'clock; however, we've got the
parties here. The item on the agenda for that time is a
presentation by Gretchen Jahn, C.E.O. of Mooney Airplane
Company, on activities and happenings with that
organization. Commissioner Williams?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Judge.
Commissioner Letz and I had the opportunity to hear Gretchen
Jahn make a presentation on the activities and happenings at
Mooney Airplane Company at a recent Airport Board meeting.
We read in the local paper about some of the successes that
are occurring there, and I thought it would be helpful if
the Court and the public at large had an opportunity to hear
firsthand from Ms. Jahn exactly what's taking place. Just a
bit of introduction about her. Gretchen Jahn brings -- do
you pronounce it Yahn or Jahn?
MS. JAHN: Jahn.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Jahn. I had an old
friend named Jahn, so I thought I'd better ask about that.
MS. JAHN: My older brother pronounces it
Yahn, so we have an independent...
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: She brings years of
experience to manufacturing and leadership to Kerr County at
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Mooney. Before joining here, Gretchen had her own
consulting company and guided manufacturing and other firms
in process and productivity improvements, ERP system
implementation. She has held executive positions at MDC
Holdings, Home American Mortgage, MIS and so forth and so
on, and she has received her Bachelor of Arts with honors at
Lawrence University and her Masters from the University of
Colorado. She obtained her certificate in Integrated
Resource Management from the American Production and
Inventory Control Society, and I might add, she is an avid
pilot of 20 years and is a member of the 99's, the Colorado
Pilots Association, and on the board of the Air Race
Classic, Incorporated. And if you read the recent -- the
newspaper recently, now that I think about it, sometime this
week, Gretchen is leaving and embarking on a cross-country
flight in the company-owned Ovation 2 in the 2,000-mile Air
Race Classic. And not only is she a plane maker C.E.O.
flying the race, but her copilot is 87-year-old Ruby Sheldon
of Phoenix. That would be a senior, Commissioner. We're
MS. JAHN: Thank you very much, and it's a
here. I appreciate the invitation. And
good work that all of you do here, and it's great to be part
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of this community. Mooney is -- we are doing great things,
and wanted to have the opportunity to let you know all the
different things that we are in the process of doing at the
participate in our growth. But we have, let's see,
currently 350 people roughly at the plant, and we, in fact,
have a night shift of about 124 folks who are working on our
second shift. We expect to be expanding both of those as
our sales grow. Right now, we're in the very, very happy
position of having very strong sales, and our problem is
making planes to satisfy it. That's a great place to be.
In fact, let's see, we are getting very close
to being sold out for the year, our production. If you read
the papers earlier this year, you know that our plans are to
produce about 100 airplanes, which is more than double what
we did last year. Last year we produced 36. And just, you
know, so that you know, we -- we talk a lot about sales, but
in reality, sales are taking orders from customers.
Customers sign a piece of paper to buy our airplanes, which
sell roughly for, you know, $950,000. Then we take some
time to produce those airplanes, and when the customer
actually comes and takes delivery of them, that's when we,
in fact, get paid for it, and that's when the customer takes
it and flies off with it. So, our recent quarterly report,
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you'll note that we delivered 20 airplanes this past
quarter; January, February, March. That means that the
people came and took delivery of those planes and flew away
with them. That resulted in about $9.4 million worth of
new airplanes. Things are going great in that regard.
One of the things that is really helping to
stimulate interest in our airplanes is a thing that we have
going on right now known as the Freedom Tour. And this is
where we've targeted over 30 cities in the United States,
and we tour with our airplanes to those cities. We notify
all the pilots in the area to please come, take a look at
what it is that we're producing, and for those who are
qualified buyers, we give them demo rides. And, in fact, we
have a very high percentage of people who take demo rides
who actually buy our airplanes, which is also a great place
to be. Helping us in that process are both our direct sales
people who work for the company, as well as Mooney team
representatives, which are basically dealers. We have a
dealer in -- in Florida who handles, you know, a good part
of the southeast. We have a dealer in California, one up in
Canada, a couple internationally, and then the rest here in
the United States are direct sales people, and we even
recently hired a sales manager who is based here in
Kerrville, flies out of here. These -- as I said, they
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stimulate a lot of interest in our airplane.
How many of you have been to tour the plant?
We would love to have you come back and see what the plant
looks like today. If you came before, you might have seen
things looking rather run down, cluttered and so on. We've
had a facelift. We've painted the buildings. We've cleaned
up a lot of things. There's a program in manufacturing
called "Five S," and there are five S's for things like
sweep, sort, and so on. That allowed us to move a lot of
things that we had cluttered either into storage or into
inventory so we could really see what it is that we were
doing in building airplanes. This is a great manufacturing
concept that I think has helped us to improve our focus on
building high-quality airplanes. Now, how many of you have
actually flown in a Mooney? Good. Two, okay.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want to.
MS. JAHN: All right. Let's see if we can't
coordinate. I'd love to give you a ride.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you.
MS. JAHN: If you're lucky, you may even have
a ride in my airplane.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll take it. Can we
bring the Sheriff with us? Just --
MS. JAHN: Be happy to.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: In the back seat.
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SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No.
MS. JAHN: Be happy to.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Buster would try and
shove me out of that thing, I know it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You got it.
MS. JAHN: The airplanes that we're building
today have the most modern avionics available in the
industry. They have what's known as a glass cockpit, which
is essentially two video screens. They replace all of the
various dials and readouts and so on that you see in
traditional airplanes with two glass readouts, one of which
has a video display of the engine and flight instruments,
and the other of which has a video display of airports,
navigation, you know, obstacles, things of this sort. And
it takes a little bit to transition from the traditional
instruments to the new ones, but once you do, you're hooked.
It's -- it makes a world of difference in your flying and in
-- in my opinion, in the safety of flight. So, we would
love to show you what that looks like.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The instruments are
made by the Gorman Company?
MS. JAHN: Garmin.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Garmin Company.
MS. JAHN: We are in partnership with Garmin.
They have been very supportive. I could not ask for a
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better partnership with them. Last fall, when we were going
through the certification of the aircraft, you know, there
were, you know, some things that always come up with
brand-new equipment, building their equipment into ours,
that delayed our ability to get the airplane certified and
to deliver it to customers. Sut we wanted to make sure that
it was absolutely the safest implementation, that there were
no bugs, because a good part of it is, in addition to the
hardware, the software that goes in it, and much of that
software is specific to our airplane, so to make sure that
it was all working correctly.' I must say that since we have
begun delivering these airplanes, the number of problems
that we have had with Garmin instrumentation has been very,
very low. It has been outstanding. Outstanding
partnership. But people really love these airplanes, and
now that I've -- you know, I have one and I fly it, I really
see why. They fly the dickens out of it.
Many of the people who buy our airplanes are
business people, and they use the aircraft for business.
They fly to visit suppliers, to visit customers, to go from
plant to plant, office to office. And, you know, as a
result, you know, we need to make sure that we provide an
aircraft that is very appealing to the businessmen, and we
do so with both the Garmin instrumentation as well as, you
know, the very high-quality interiors that we have. This
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airplane flies at high altitudes, up very close to the
flight levels that you would fly in commercially, which is a
fabulous thing to do with an airplane that seats four
people. Folks that buy them use it, as I said, on business,
and are attracted to it because it allows them to bypass
many of the hassles of commercial aviation, you know, where
you would fly from major city to major city, and, of course,
have to go through the various things that -- that you do to
be able to board an aircraft, plus then rent cars on either
end. Whereas with a general aviation airplane like Mooney,
you can fly directly from, you know, the airport that you
are based at to where it is that you need to do business.
So, this is a very -- very much a way of
supporting the overall economic condition of the country, as
well as the fact that we build airplanes and are based here
in Kerrville. We are very much involved in the economics
locally. So, I'd be happy to entertain any questions.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We appreciate you
being here, and I also want to introduce Robert Collier.
Robert's part of the executive staff of Mooney, and we
appreciate you being here and your participation at the
Airport Board as well, Robert.
MR. COLLIER: Thank you. Appreciate it.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I have one comment.
Ms. Jahn, it seems like all my adult life I've been hearing
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about Mooney Aircraft, and usually from friends of mine who
own Cessnas and were dreaming about the day that someday
they might be able to trade up to a Mooney, so I'm proud
that such a high-quality company is in our community. But
the -- what's more important are those 350 good jobs you
provide.
MS. JAHN: Yes.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'm hoping that
you'll have the problem of selling so many aircraft that
you'll have to add a third shift.
MS. JAHN: I would love that.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay.
MS. JAHN: I would love that.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Thank you for being
here.
MS. JAHN: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Appreciate you
coming.
JUDGE TINLEY: Very much.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good luck in the
race.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I'd like to say
something about the gentleman that's with her. You know,
there are -- there are folks in this town that do things for
the community that we don't even know about. This guy does
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probably as much -- as much, or if not, more than anybody I
know in this community, and we don't even know who he is.
He is a -- he's a scout leader, and he is -- being an old
Eagle Scout himself, he has produced who knows how many
Eagles in this community. How many did you have at your
ranch Saturday?
MR. COLLIER: 125.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How many Eagles?
MR. COLLIER: 33.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 33 Eagles in
Kerrville, Texas. And that's a phenomenon, in my opinion.
I remember a statement he made one time; he said the
definition -- if I get this wrong, don't worry about it.
(Laughter.) The definition of integrity is flying an F-16
off the hull and back on the hull of a ship in pitch dark.
And he's done that, and what a great guy, and super plus to
our community. I like old Robert Collier; he's a good guy.
MR. COLLIER: Thank you, Buster.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: Tell us a little bit about
this competition that you're about to engage in.
MS. JAHN: Sure. The Air Race Classic has
been in existence for 28 years. It's a cross-country
handicap speed race for women only. It's essentially the
spiritual successor to the Powder Puff Derby. The route is
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different every year. It's between 2,000 and 2,500 miles.
We have eight stops across the country. This year it is
sponsored by Purdue University, so we start and end in West
Lafayette, Indiana. I've been racing in this for 13 years,
14 years. I'm on the Board of Directors and the Treasurer
of the Air Race Classic. And, yes, Ruby Sheldon, who is my
copilot -- she's been my copilot for the last four years --
she's 87 years old. She has more energy than I do. She
sits there and tells me what to do, and it's my job to do
it. But we make a great team. A great team. I've done
well in the race. I've done not so well in the race. This
year I'm planning on doing well.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good luck.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Good luck.
MS. JAHN: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: Best of luck to you. Thank
~ you very much for being here.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank y'all. Thank
you very much.
JUDGE TINLEY: The next item on the agenda is
Item 6, consider and discuss authorizing City of Kerrville
to temporarily use courtroom facilities of Kerr County to
conduct City of Kerrville Municipal Court, or entering into
other agreement or arrangement for utilization of Kerr
County facilities and/or personnel or officials to conduct
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or assist in disposition of Kerrville Municipal Court cases.
I put this on the agenda not as an action item, but as most
of you know, the City of Kerrville is very, very limited in
their municipal court facilities. Approximately a year,
year and a half ago, thereabouts, there was an inquiry made
about possibly entering into some arrangement where the City
of Kerrville might use Kerr County facilities, or maybe even
entering into some sort of an arrangement where we would
contract to handle the cases for them. Not sure what
happened to that proposal; it just kind of waned away. But
the subject has recently come up again, and I put it on the
agenda to merely get the sense of the Court whether or not
they wanted to pursue it down to maybe something specific,
and if so, why, we can work it from that end.
There's some legal issues that I think there
was some concern about when we initially talked about the
proposal. I'm given to understand now that there are a
number of jurisdictions that have worked their way through
those legal issues and, in fact, are -- are handling those
cases on a contract basis, even though they're for a totally
different jurisdiction. On the short end, it might just be
a temporary use of facilities. On the long end, it could be
some indefinite arrangement whereby -- whereby Kerr County
would fully handle the municipal court program for the City
of Kerrville. But, like I say, I just wanted to get the
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sense of the Court whether they wanted to proceed forward
and continue to explore and maybe see where we might go with
that idea.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, Judge, I -- I
have always approved of the concept of a partnership in this
area with the City of Kerrville. I was against it because
of the legal issues, and possibly constitutional issues, I
understand. But if we've worked through -- or someone else
has worked through those issues, I'm certainly in favor of
it. And there could be -- I tell you, of all these words
that you put in here, "entering into other agreement or
arrangement" jumped off the page at me. And I could see us
doing -- you know, if one -- as you said, we may take over
and do it all, County employees do it all, or just simply
provide space for the City to function. And a good
trade-off there would be possibly the -- the City Judge
participating in the rotation of magistrations or some such
issue as that. But I'm -- the concept of it, I like -- I
like a lot.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: As the Judge knows,
I've had discussions with not only the Judge, but Councilman
Carl Meek about this issue as well, and I think it really
kind of got cooking with respect to the possibility of using
Justice of the Peace 2's courtroom facility in the Law
Enforcement Center, which I heartily endorse, it we can work
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through the logistics of it and the scheduling and so forth
and so on. So, conceptually, yes. I was disappointed
originally that we -- two years ago, when we first had this
initiative, and I think the County was the one that put
forth the initiative to integrate the municipal court
function somehow into our justice system -- justice of the
peace system. I was kind of disappointed that that didn't
take place, but now maybe it can and maybe it should. Maybe
it can't, but if not, I just want to let the Court know that
I, too, support the concept of -- of helping the City in
this particular endeavor finding space to conduct the
municipal court for such period of time as they need it
until they get their facility ready for themselves.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm a little confused, I
guess. I mean, I certainly support this, but have we
received a request to look at this again from the City?
JUDGE TINLEY: I was contacted, and I think
-- I think Bill was contacted.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Councilman Meek
called me about some of the issues regarding our space, what
we had available, schedulinq, so forth and so on.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. I mean, I'm
certainly in favor of it, as I was originally, but I -- I
mean, I don't think we need to spend a lot of time on it
until the City Council looks at this and asks us to look at
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it. I mean, I think there's a -- you know, it's good to
have an agenda to let everyone know that we're receptive to
doing this, but I think it's really -- it's a City Council
first move, as opposed to us doing anything at this time.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I agree.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I just -- like I say, I
don't have any specific proposal. The idea has been
broached by the leadership over at the City, and -- and I
just wanted to get the Court's sense on whether or not it
was something that -- something that we'd be willing to
listen to something more specific in the future. And I
certainly am, and --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Certainly.
JUDGE TINLEY: -- I thought the Court
probably would too. That's all we need to do on this
particular item, then, and we'll move forward. The next
timed item we have is a report from the City of Kerrville
Interim City Manager, Don Davis, on the EMS budget and
contract. Commissioner Baldwin has asked that this matter
be placed on the agenda. Commissioner Baldwin?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you very much.
I have asked Mr. Davis to come over and -- and make a
presentation on the budget and contract for the EMS
services. And I don't -- I don't see us, again, making any
kind of firm decision this day. Simply a visit and a
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presentation, and hopefully that we have plenty of time for
question and answer. And, Mr. Davis, thank you very much.
I see you brought in your sidekick over there, Chief
Holloway, and I appreciate you doing that. Very wise man.
So, the floor is yours, sir.
MR. DAMS: Thank you, Commissioner. Thank
you very much. My name is Don Davis, and I'm the Interim
City Manager for the City of Kerrville. Before we get on
this agenda, may I just respond real briefly as to your
previous agenda and say that we have had a couple of
meetings with Judge Tinley on this municipal court thing.
Commissioner Letz, I think you're -- you're exactly right.
It may be a little premature to be talking about anything.
I appreciate the Judge wanting to at least put y'all on
notice and give you heads-up. I think that we need to do a
lot of -- a lot more legwork on this. And, of course, we --
it formally has not even been broached by the City Council
yet, so we're out in front of the Council, and that can be
somewhat dangerous, at least from my perspective. But we
appreciate y'all's attitude and willingness to at least take
a look at this thing, and let us -- let us do some more
work, and then hopefully in the near future, we'll get back
with you. I'd like to also go on the record as saying we --
we appreciate all the County employees and staff that we met
with last week, and they were very hospitable and receptive.
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We went out to Precinct 2 court, and -- and we appreciate
that, the attitude from everybody.
The matter at hand, as Commissioner Baldwin
said, that I'm here formally today on is to discuss the
emergency medical services agreement, and -- proposed
agreement. We had -- my predecessor submitted to the Court,
probably a month or so ago, a proposal, and since that time
I have received a couple of communiques and some questions.
And what I'd like to do, Commissioner Baldwin, if it's all
right with you, is just not spend a lot of time on -- on
these questions. We brought over answers Friday, and I
trust that all of you have received those. You've -- I'm
getting some --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, I have received --
I have received them, and I haven't had time to get it out
to them. We'll discuss that later.
MR. DAVIS: Okay. Well, I apologize. I was
of the opinion -- I guess of the opinion that everyone had
received our responses to your -- to your questions. We had
questions from Commissioner Baldwin, and then also some
questions from Judge Tinley, and we have responded to each
of those questions, and I feel like in detail, and let me
just hurriedly go through the list. And I apologize,
gentlemen; this may be foreign to some of you, but
Commissioner Baldwin asked, first of all, for us to provide
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some balance sheets. We have. We provided two sets -- I
mean, a balance sheet for our fiscal year that ended
September 30 of '04, and those, of course, are audited
numbers. We also then provided a balance sheet for the
current fiscal year through, I believe, May. And,
Commissioner, do you want to go through these things
individually, or --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I tell you, I
was really more proposed --
MR. DAMS: Or I can just answer questions
and highlight.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's probably the
route that we need to go. What I want to do -- I came in
and got my packet over the weekend, and this is the first
time I've seen this, so I really haven't had time to get it
to you guys, and I would like some more time to get this to
y'all and qet it -- let you cipher through it. And a pretty
good stack of paper and a lot of information, and I
appreciate your -- you and your staff and Brian providing
this for us in a very timely manner. And then maybe with
this document, maybe we can have a -- a small workshop in a
couple of weeks and have a sit-down, and then go over these
issues in detail.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I --
MR. DAMS: P'all's pleasure.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess I haven't seen
that, and I really don't know what we have. Don, one of the
things I would like to see, and maybe you've provided it, is
I know Chief Holloway is aware that there is a very big
issue in the far eastern part of the county about getting
ambulance service to the far eastern part of the county, the
Hermann Sons area. We have -- Falling Water Subdivision has
exploded, and there are over 50 homes in that development,
and there's another new development with homes going in very
rapidly. All these homes, unfortunately -- or fortunately,
are in Kerr County, but the access is all out of Kendall
County to all of them. Commissioner Busby out of Kendall
County and myself have been trying to get some sort of
interlocal agreement for -- revived between Kendall County;
Kendall County will be the first responder, or send the
ambulance there out of Comfort when it's available, and
that's kind of not moving very fast. It's been sitting in
Kendall County for months. Chief Holloway may know where it
is.
MR. HOLLOWAY: I have no idea.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Anyway, but that is a
arrangement with Kendall County, which I'm not certain we
will, we need to figure out a plan to get ambulance service
quicker to eastern Kerr County, including the Center Point
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area. It may not be this year, but I think if we're going
to -- you know, the County -- or at least I feel very --
this is critical, that the response time coming out of
Kerrville is just too long. And I don't know -- so,
basically, what I'm saying, long-term, I think we need to
start looking at doing a substation in Comfort or Center
Point area.
MR. DAMS: And I appreciate that. And I
think, as Mayor Fine said the other day in the joint
meeting, that what we're talking about is pretty much
predicated on existing levels of service right now. And to
explore some of these sorts of things, Commissioner Letz, I
think would probably be an increase in the level of service.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sure. Right.
MR. DAMS: And would constitute, you know,
a -- another arrangement of some sort.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. And I'm just
saying I think we need -- I'd appreciate it if your staff
could start looking at that and giving some idea as to what
that additional cost would be. Clearly, it's a cost that's
going to be borne more by the County, and maybe there's some
other options that --
MR. DAMS: I trust those runs are coming out
of the stations there on the loop, aren't they?
MR. HOLLOWAY: Yes, sir. Yes, right.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: So it's a -- and, you
know, it's just -- it's a distance issue. It's not a --
MR. DAVIS: Sure.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Certainly, the response
is coming out quickly, and Chief Holloway and I -- we've
talked about this for many years, and it's just becoming
more and more of a problem as the populations in both
counties are growing. And the -- quite frankly, the Comfort
ambulance isn't there a lot; it isn't available to go into
Kerr County. They don't want to go into Kerr County, so --
Chief?
MR. HOLLOWAY: We -- you know, we have an
agreement with the volunteer fire department there. They do
first respond with us. Our problem we have is with the
ambulance service. They will not come into Kerr County at
all, and we've tried to work with them and tried to get it
worked out, and so far that hasn't happened very well. And
we're receptive to that, because we know the response times
in that area are long, but right now the volunteer fire
department's real receptive to coming in and doing first
responder for us.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
MR. HOLLOWAY: I agree, something needs to be
done, and especially with Falling Waters area, 'cause we
have to qo through Kendall County to get into Kerr County,
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and that's a long run for us.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, and there's a lot
of -- like I said, there's 50 homes now in Falling Water.
When it was a few homes here and a few homes there, it was
an issue, but it's become a major issue, and those residents
are -- they see it as a major issue. You know, I will say,
you know, the Kerrville EMS have been very willing and
anxious to talk to Kendall County EMS. The problem has
been -- or Boerne, whichever -- whoever actually handles
their EMS in Kendall County is where the holdup is.
Everyone is aware of that, including Commissioners Court in
Kendall County. But it's just a -- they have not been
willing to address it for the last three years that I've
been actively pursuing it. Probably five years.
MR. HOLLOWAY: Five years.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think that, you know,
we may not be able to rely on that as a solution, certainly
a long-term solution. And I might note that under our
current contract which we're looking at, it refers to that
area as being handled by Kendall County, but Kendall County
unilaterally decided they weren't going to respond. So,
that's just my comment. I think we need to start looking at
another long-range plan for that.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree. And also,
not only the Hermann Sons area, but way out on Elm Pass
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and -- and way out Camp Verde and all that area and beyond
also poses the same type of problem.
MR. DAMS: Well, let me -- I guess, in
closing, I'm --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Closing?
MR. DAMS: Let me just make one statement
and kind of reiterate some remarks that I heard at the last
joint meeting between the City Council and the Commissioners
Court, and kind of give us a little direction, perhaps. And
my understanding is we have eight programs in which we're
providing services together, and some of those are what I
would refer to as partnerships, and I think those would be
the airport, the library, and the recycling. And then the
other five are arrangements whereby one entity is providing
a service to the other entity, and I think those five would
be the jail, the tax collection and the animal control, for
which the County is providing services to the residents of
the city of Kerrville, and then fire and EMS, which is just
the reverse, where the City is providing service to county
residents. My understanding out of that last joint meeting
was	that	the	partnership	arrangements,	we're	going	to	have
to	spend	some	time on and	work through	and --	and	make	those
arrangements jointly and make some decisions jointly, but on
these other five, it's pretty much just a contract
arrangement whereby you, as providers, will be selling to
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the City a service, and virtually, the City will be selling
the service of the EMS and the fire to the -- to the County.
And that's the basis upon which we're proceeding, and I hope
that's correct and -- and understood.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I tell you what, if
you -- and I want to apologize to you for my timing being
off here. I think it would be -- we'd be all be better
served if we postpone this issue and let me set up a
workshop in this courtroom, and invite you all back again,
if you don't mind. And we'll --
MR. DAMS: Well, I just -- and that's fine.
I mean, that's -- that's fine with us. We're at your beck
and call.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It will be pretty
soon, because, you know, it's a budget issue.
MR. DAMS: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're fixing to -- all
of us and you are going to tackle that here pretty quick,
and so I'll be in touch with you very soon.
MR. DAMS: All right. Now, I trust, then,
that probably this afternoon there won't be any action taken
on the contract. I think that's later -- that's on your
agenda later on today.
AUDIENCE: The 26th.
MR. DAMS: That's not today? That's a later
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council meeting?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, that's today. It's
on today's agenda as an executive session item.
MR. DAMS: That's what I thought. But I --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't think we're going
to even talk about it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think the Judge just
put that on there in the executive session discussion just
in case we needed to qo into executive session. I don't
think that we --
MR. DAMS: We won't worry about coming back?
I guess that's my point.
JUDGE TINLEY: No, sir, I don't -- I put it
on there as kind of a safety valve measure. I saw that
these other items were there. I knew that you folks were
going to be here this morning, didn't know what it might
lead to, and -- but it appears that we're somewhat premature
and we're in the early stages of the EMS issue now.
MR. DAMS: Well, I would encourage and
invite, if any of you individually have any questions --
again, we had about three pages worth of questions -- any
questions on the questions, to give me a call, and we can
sit down individually. It might expedite any sort of a
joint meeting later on.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Got one question,
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Mr. Davis. You mentioned, of the eight contracts, that some
of them were partnerships and others were a supplier-buyer
relationship. What -- what are the implications of that?
What is -- why is that important to make that -- that
MR. DAMS: To me, the distinction -- I think
the three that are partnerships, the airport -- well, the
airport is essentially resolved, so maybe we can take it off
the table. And that leaves, then, recycling and the
library, in which there are some -- some legal implications
and complications, perhaps. But -- but the others, the
other five, to me, the significance is that -- that y'all
have done an excellent job on the -- on the jail, the tax
collection, and the animal control. Y'all have given us the
numbers, and I think then as we receive those and take those
to the County, then it's kind of an option of do we want to
continue buying that service from the County? Likewise, on
the fire and the EMS, the table is turned and, you know,
here's -- here's our information; here's what it costs us.
You have the discretion then of saying we'd like to continue
that service or not. Am I making that -- I may not be
articulating that very well, Commissioner Nicholson, but to
me there's a distinction between those in which we're really
`r 24 I partners --
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COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah.
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MR. DAMS: -- and those that we're just
providing service.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I see that. Thank
you.
MR. DAMS: Thank you. Anything else?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, Don.
MR. DAMS: Gentlemen, we appreciate it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any more questions? Thank you
very much. We appreciate you being here today.
(Discussion off the record.)
JUDGE TINLEY: We've got a timed item for
10:30 that hopefully will take just a moment, so at this
time I'm going to recess the Commissioners Court meeting and
I'm going to open a public hearing on a resolution amending
T.C.D.P. Contracts 722411 and 723095 and 724491 regarding
the Kerrville South Wastewater Project, Phases 2, 3, and 4.
(The regular Commissioners Court meeting was
closed at 10:30 a.m., and a public hearing
was held in open court, as follows:)
P U B L I C H E A R I N G
JUDGE TINLEY: Is there any member of the
public that wishes to be heard with regard to that
resolution amending those contracts? Any member of the
public that wishes to be heard?
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: Seeing no one coming forward,
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we will close the public hearing on that resolution amending
those contracts, and we will reconvene the Commissioners
Court meeting.
(The public hearing was concluded at 10:31
a.m., and the regular Commissioners Court
meeting was reopened.)
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I wouldn't mind if we
took a 10-minute break, and then --
JUDGE TINLEY: At this point --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is going to take
a few minutes to do.
JUDGE TINLEY: At this point, we will stand
in recess for 10 to 15 minutes.
(Recess taken from 10:32 a.m. to 10:47 a.m.)
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to order
after our short recess. Since we just did the public
hearing before the break, let's go to Item 10 and get it out
of the way. Consider, discuss, and take appropriate action
to approve resolutions amending T.C.D.P. Contracts 722411,
723095, and 724441 regarding the scope of the Kerrville
South Wastewater Project, Phases 2, 3, and 4, for the
purposes outlined in the -- in the material as submitted to
members of the Court. Commissioner Williams?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Judge. A~
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the Court knows, we have been trying to get Phases 2 and 3
underway for some time. We advertised for bids the first
time a couple months ago, received no bids, went back to the
advertising regimen again and broadened the net somewhat and
advertised for the second time, and managed to get one bid
from a contractor willing to do this job. Don't know the
reasons, whether they don't like to do sewer work or they're
all too busy doing other things or -- or whatever, but the
bottom line is that the bid was in excess of available
funding by about $213,000, which presented a major problem
in terms of funding available and the ability to move Phases
2 and 3 forward.
The Court may recall that Phases 2 and 3 is
the area in which -- I'm giving you a map, and Dave also has
bigger maps and he'li step you through, but just for
purposes of introduction, this is the area of major concern
from -- from the outset. And is the area where, as you can
see from the diagram, a whole lot of very small lots, all of
which are on septic, most of whom have problems, and all
have contributed to the deterioration of Camp Meeting Creek,
which was noted by EPA as an endangered -- as an endangered
stream. Camp Meeting Creek runs through this area, runs
through the River Hills section of Kerrville, and it runs
into the Guadalupe River, so it is of importance that that
stream not be in a polluted -- polluted area. But also,
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these are -- this is an area of folk who really need the
assistance in terms of first-time sewer service and the
benefits that can accrue to them from that by reason of the
various grants.
Having said all that, after receiving a
$213,000 overbid, I thought, well, this is going to -- this
poses a heck of a problem. How are we going to get this job
done? So I thought about it and thought about it, and it
I
occurred to me that perhaps one solution would be to take
the funding out of 4, which was to do the Ranchero Road last
portion, incorporate those funds into Phases 2 and 3, and
get this, the major part of the project, underway, and then
have an opportunity later to go back and try to get more
money for Phase 4. I ran that scenario by Dave Tucker of
Grantworks, and his initial reaction was, "I don't know."
Now, he got to thinking about it while driving from Houston
back to Austin, and then he called me back and said, "I
think maybe we can do that." So, that's what this is all
about, and Dave's going to answer your questions, step
you through it, tell you how all of this changes the scope,
but not the whole dynamic. And, as a matter of fact, we
managed to do what we really are setting out to do, and it
opens the door for us to go back to ORCA for a Phase 4 grant
again.
MR. TUCKER: Yes.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Whole new grant to do
Phase 4 and complete that. Dave Tucker is here. With that
introduction, please help us get this issue --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Could we have a time-out
first?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes.
MR. TUCKER: Thanks, Commissioner, Judge
Tinley, the rest of you Commissioners.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Dave, before you get
started --
MR. TUCKER: Yes, sir?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- can you, on the map --
which I appreciate these maps.
MR. TUCKER: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Where is the part we did
in Phase 1?
MR. TUCKER: The part that we did for Phase
1?
COMMISSIONER
MR. TUCKER:
the area right in the Wood
even reflected on this map,
COMMISSIONER
MR. TUCKER:
Sweetwater, and Ripplewood.
LETZ: Where's Phase 1?
Where y'all see Phase 1 was in
4obile Home Park. That's not
because that's complete.
LETZ: So, I mean --
That would be along Greenwood,
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: And did the line go --
how'd the line get back?
MR. TUCKER: The length went along Wood
Drive.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Then it comes down to
where the yellow line meets, where the sewer --
MR. TUCKER: Connects it there.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, where -- it
goes into the Kerrville main.
MR. TUCKER: That's correct, yes -- yeah. So
these individuals are being served. And that -- that
project was completed in full, so we've done the first phase
successfully.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, that's what I
needed to find out. I just wanted to -- thank you. That
makes it a lot easier for me.
MR. TUCKER: Okay. So, I'll put this right
here for now -- is it in your way there? Right there. So,
what we're looking at doing is -- as the Commissioner just
explained, is utilizing funds for Phase 4, which are in blue
on here, which were going to provide first-time sewer
service to 17 homes along Ranchero Road, and instead, using
those funds to finish off the area in green; that is Phase
3. So essentially, Phase 3, which is the green part, will
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be divided into two sections. If you look at your amended,
revised form, that section is now green and blue. The Phase
4 funds will be paying for the streets along Shannon and
Frederick. The Phase 3 funds will still be paying for
connections along Loyal Valley and George Muck, and a
portion of Frederick, and Phase 2 funds will remain
essentially unchanged. The charts will be altered slightly,
but the beneficiaries, which is what the agency cares about,
that will remain unchanged. So, basically, Phase 3 is going
to be swallowing the funds for Phase 4. That way we can
complete the entire originally applied for Kerrville South
area, and then the 17 individuals along Ranchero Road will
not be receiving service at this time, but we can apply for
that at a future date.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: There's 14 homes on
Ranchero; is that correct?
MR. TUCKER: 17 homes.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 17 homes?
MR. TUCKER: Yes, sir. And the --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And the number that
will be accommodated in Phase -- in the green area is how
many, Dave?
MR. TUCKER: Let me look at my notes.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You take the story at
your -- any way you want to.
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MR. TUCKER: Originally, it was going to be
64. Just with Phase 3 funds, that's just going to be 37,
but all 64 houses will be served. Basically, even though
funds for Phase 3 and Phase 4 are being combined to pay for
the beneficiaries in Phase 3, every original beneficiary in
Phase 3 is still going to receive benefit, so nobody from
the original Phase 2 or Phase 3 is being eliminated, only
individuals to receive benefit in Phase 4 are no longer
going to be receiving service.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Until we get more
funds.
MR. TUCKER: Until we get more funds.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: From a subsequent
grant application.
MR. TUCKER: It's perfectly all right to
apply for grants for areas that have been applied for before
and perhaps are removed by amendment, which is what we're
doing right now. Just last year I did the same thing in a
neighboring county. The bids came in high; we had to remove
two streets. We removed those streets after court action,
and then an amendment was submitted to the agency, and then
we applied again for those two streets the next year and it
got funded. So, we ended up kind of having our cake and
eating it, too.
JUDGE TINLEY: So, what we had in Phase 3
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serving 64 homes --
MR. TUCKER: Yes.
JUDGE TINLEY: -- is now going to be broken
down into a smaller Phase 3 serving 37?
MR. TUCKER: Yes.
JUDGE TINLEY: And then a Phase 4 serving the
balance of those same 64 homes?
MR. TUCKER: That's exactly correct.
JDDGE TINLEY: Okay.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask a question
just in a simple way.
MR. TUCKER: Yes, sir?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This Court has the
authority to amend the funds to move from one phase to
another phase?
MR. TUCKER: Yes, absolutely.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
MR. TUCKER: Going to be very
straightforward. ORCA does not consider these projects to
be phases; ORCA considers these projects to be individual,
free-standing grants.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
MR. TUCKER: What is allowed to be done is to
alter the beneficiary count. Again, what the agency cares
about is who's receiving benefits and what is their income
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level. There are instruments in the ORCA implementation
manual -- and when I say ORCA, I mean the Office of Rural
Community Affairs, which is the agency providing these
funds -- that provide the tools to amend these contracts by
giving them a revised beneficiary count, and then the format
for resolutions so that -- that County approval is evident
toward the agency. So, it's really not -- not dissimilar at
all from the Court's authority to apply for these projects
to begin with. The Court had a plan before them when the
project was in its preliminary design phase and approved,
"Yes, let's go ahead and apply for this area to get
benefit." It's a similar rein of authority -- similar area
of authority to submit an amendment to change the
beneficiaries, and it's not unusual. It's -- to be very
honest, of the projects I've been administering, the bids
have been coming in high. I think it may be related to
increase in petroleum prices, which is also having an effect
on the price of PVC, plus construction is picking up and
contractors have more work to do.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Dave, going back to
Commissioner Baldwin's question, he said that we had the
authority to do this --
MR. TUCKER: Yes.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- unilaterally. Does it
have to go back to ORCA to get --
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MR. TUCKER: Yes, ORCA needs to approve the
amendment.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And it really becomes
a -- our changing the scope, but we're requesting their
final approval.
MR. TUCKER: That's correct. And instead of
-- if it was a minor change, it could have been done just
with a letter, but if you're changing beneficiaries, and
there is a significant change, I kind of needed the backup
of having court approval and the public hearing that
preceded this. But ORCA sees these type of amendments
often. This may be a little more creative than most they
receive are, but it actually all makes sense. We're trying
to stay within the budget, and the County is not under any
specific obligation to provide first-time service to these
17 individuals who are being removed in Phase 4. You are
obliged to do so without amending the contract, but if you
formally amend the contract through these means and then
list budgetary concerns to be the primary reason, that`s a
perfectly okay way to do this.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions for
Mr. Tucker?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's work through
this. I've asked Bill the question, where -- exactly where
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is Phase 4?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This was Phase 9, the
blue lines, okay? Coming down Ranchero. This was Phase 4,
or is -- is Phase 4 as we know it before today's court
action, if it's taken.
MR. TUCKER: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And this would be the
line we'd have to get an easement from Mr. Woods to take
these on -- these homes down this way to hook up to it.
This was Phase 4, and it all would hook into the sewer line
which is currently in existence here and comes this way and
hooks unto the city main.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Rock and roll.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions for
Mr. Tucker? Do you have anything else you need to bring to
our attention?
MR. TUCKER: No, sir.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, I would move
the resolution, if I can find it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Here's the original.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would move approval
of the resolution that amends the -- the scope of the
project under contract -- ORCA Contract 722411, 723095,
and 724441 for first-time sewer service for Kerrville South,
as detailed in the discussion and outlined in the rest of
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the resolution.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for
approval of the resolution. Any further question or
discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising
your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We
have a timed item for --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, just one other
quick footnote here. Since I'm going to be on vacation here
starting the end of this week, Dave or somebody from the
staff will fill U.G.R.A. in at the next board meeting. I've
provided them, as has Dave, all the information, and their
dollars for grant money won't be expended till way deep in
this project, but we will bring them up to speed on what the
action was today.
MR. TUCKER: All parties will formally
approve any changes. Thank you very much.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you very much,
Dave.
JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Mr. Tucker.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We'll have the
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resolution here for you in just a second.
MR. TUCKER: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: We have a timed item for
11 o'clock; it's a couple of minutes past that now. We have
a report from Congressman Henry Bonilla's office concerning
the status of projects and matters within the district, and
in particular, Kerr County. We're very pleased and
fortunate to have with us today Mr. Richard Martinez, the
District Director of the Congressman's staff. And,
Mr. Martinez, thank you for being here today, and we look
forward to what you have to say.
MR. MARTINEZ: Thank you, Judge. I'm here to
thank the community at large, Judge in particular, and
County Commissioners Court for all the courtesies they have
extended to the Congressman's office and to me. Certainly
appreciate everything that everyone has done. As you know,
the Congressman has only represented the area since January,
and I myself have rejoined the Congressman's team late last
year, and I just wanted to say that of the nine months that
I've been back with the Congressman, I have, as far as
visiting, spent a full month here in Kerrville. It's an
area that's been very important to us, and look forward to
building further on relationships.
I often get a chance to visit different
groups. I've had a chance to visit the school district,
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rotary board, a few other institutions as well, and I'm
reminded of the congressional staffer who one time went
group of Native Americans, and said, "Through our office,
your children will be better educated." Now, the group then
went, "Wiki waka, wiki waka." The staffer thought, "Gee, I
must be doing very well." He said, "Through our office, the
Tribal Council will run more efficiently." Again, the group
went, "Wiki waka, wiki waka." So, they took a tour out to
the pasture, and the staffer said, "Do you mind if I step
closer to that bull over there?" The chief then said, "Yes,
but be careful you don't step in the wiki waka."
(Laughter.) So, I promise my remarks here won't be wiki
waka, so I got to kind of keep that in mind.
We know that there are many institutions that
are very important, not only to the Kerrville area, but to
the Congressman as well. Some of you may have seen in the
newspaper and heard about the Congressman's feasibility
study, which he passed legislation through the
Appropriations Committee to move the site to an area which
would be more beneficial to the community, and also, more
importantly, to the agricultural community as well. That's
something that is being worked on, and the important first
step's been taken on that. Also, I want to let you all know
as well, the Congressman has introduced legislation, 2392,
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to preserve the mission of the V.A. Hospital and to protect
the bed space. I know that's something that's very
important to us all here. I also want to update you as well
on the status of our office. We are currently in
negotiations with the local bank about office space, and
hopefully we can make a more permanent announcement sometime
within the next few weeks. We also have a leading candidate
for a staffer, so we're looking to open an office sometime
this summer, so we're certainly very, very excited about
that as well.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That is great news.
Great news. Thank you.
MR. MARTINEZ: Yes. Also, again, you know,
if there's anything we can ever do to be of any service --
some of you may be aware, we're already visiting with
Ms. Harris about grant possibilities; want to take that a
few steps further. We'll be visiting with her further on
this. So, again, that's something we want to do to build a
relationship on as well. I had a chance again to visit with
Tivy and a few other groups as well, so if there's anything
that we can ever do to be of any service, if you ever see a
meeting or a function or event you think we need to have a
representative at, please don't hesitate to contact us.
We'd like to attend and do as many things as we possibly
can. One of the things, too, that the Congressman is very
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active in is service academies. I'd like to see someone
our academy process, so maybe we can get some Kerrville
students at West Point, at Annapolis, at the Air Force
Academy. Really excited about that, so if you know of any
promising students, let us know. Also, if you know of any
prominent academy graduates in the area who have already
retired from the military, let them know so perhaps they can
serve on our academy board. Want to get some important
representation on some of these groups that the Congressman
has put together. So, again, don't hesitate to contact me
on any of those things at all.
And, in closing, obviously, this is about
relationships and building relationships. I'm reminded of a
couple; it was their tenth wedding anniversary. Decided to
have a big party, invite all their family and friends.
Husband gets up, says a few words. The wife gets up, and
she says, "I'd like to thank my husband for seven wonderful
years." Husband leans forward and says, "Well, honey, we've
been married ten." She said, "I know, but the last few
weren't so good." (Laughter.) The important thing with that
story is, despite their ups and downs, and what couple
hasn't had their ups and downs, they thought that the
relationship was a good one, and they were committed to one
another, and that the relationship was worth recognizing by
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the community at large. The Congressman's relationship is
fairly new to the area; again, he's only represented
Kerrville since January, but this is our time to develop a
relationship, for us to grow and to work together so that
ten years from now we can say, "Boy, those last ten years
were great." Again, thank you very much. If I can ever be
of any service, please don't hesitate to contact me. I'm
only an hour away. Thank you very much. Take care.
JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Any questions for
Mr. Martinez?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Would you like to
introduce your young aide that you have here?
MR. MARTINEZ: Yes. This is my son, Samuel.
I heard that there was some good camps in the area, so I may
just go over to Hunt and drop him off.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Welcome, Samuel.
JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you for being here.
MR. MARTINEZ: I've already introduced him to
Ms. Harris. I said I hope he never meets her
professionally.
JUDGE TINLEY: We're very pleased that you
were able to be here with us today, Mr. Martinez, and we
look forward to the congressman's help on the V.A. Hospital
and this ongoing project with the -- the Agricultural
Research function that's been going on here in Kerrville for
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better than 50 years now.
MR. MARTINEZ: Yes. I know how important the
research is there. In fact, my grandfather was a tick rider
out in west Texas, so we have a family history with ticks as
well.
JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you.
MR. MARTINEZ: Thank you again.
JUDGE TINLEY: Appreciate it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's see if we can kind
of go back and play catch-up. Item 8, consider, discuss,
and take appropriate action to authorize the filing of an
application with local foundation for up to one-half the
amount required to fund the pre-engineering design phase of
the Center Point wastewater collection system. Commissioner
Williams?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Briefly, Judge, this
is in regards to Center Point. The Court approved an
application to Texas Water Development Board on the Small
Community Hardship Program. The funds in that program dried
up. They did like the project. They said that -- said as
much in the correspondence. You'll note they say they're
still looking and hoping to be able to find some funding for
that. In the meantime, however, Upper Guadalupe River
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Authority appropriated 50 percent of what the required
funding would have been for the pre-engineering and design,
and they've made that commitment, and I'm grateful to them
for that. So, in the meantime, I'd like to find a way to
get the other half. T.W.D.B. says that particular fund
dried up, the new biennium having started on the state
level, and there probably are some other sources --
potential sources for funding, and what I'm asking the Court
to do is give me the authority to file for alternate funding
from other sources that may be available to us. And I don't
want to designate any particular place, but there are other
options and other opportunities, and that's what this is all
about.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Was that a motion?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That would be a
motion.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll second it.
DODGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for
approval of the agenda item. Any question or discussion?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make just a comment.
And I do deal with the Water Development Board on a pretty
regular basis on other matters, and this is a project
they're interested in seeing go forward. This is a drop in
the bucket to what the project's going to cost down the
road, and I think it's a -- we really need to, long-term,
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get the pre-engineering done so we have an idea as to what
the best options are engineering-wise to get a sewer system
built for the Center Point/eastern Kerr County area, and I
think there -- it's the first step in getting the project
moving, which may take many years to accomplish. Hopefully
Commissioner Williams will be successful in finding an
alternative source for the funding and get the
pre-engineering study done.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Going to work at it.
Thank you, Commissioner.
JUDGE TINLEY: Essentially, without this
pre-engineering work being done, it cannot go forward.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It really --
JUDGE TINLEY: Bureaucratic process.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS; It really can't,
Judge. And a good example of that is, a pre-engineering
design function or phase is a prerequisite for going to
O.S.D.A. You've got to have it. And anywhere else, for
that matter. You've got to be able to tell them what the
cost or what the options are and what the end result's going
to be. So --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the reason for
it -- 7 mean, it shows, I think, all these state and federal
agencies that the community -- this is an important project
for the community, that someone has funded it. And I'd like
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to thank Commissioner Williams for trying to find a
non-taxpayer source of funding.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or
discussion?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion,
signify by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's
move to Item 11, consider and discuss county standards to be
met to upgrade a private road, that being Scenic Ridge Road
in Hills 'n Dales subdivision, to be acceptable for county
maintenance. Commissioner Nicholson?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yes. I think you
all are aware that we've been working with the property
owners along Scenic Ridge Road for quite some time, trying
to find some resolution to that bad road. And Mr. Voelkel
and I met again out there on-site with them some time ago
before April 18th, and Mr. Voelkel summarized what we
thought was an agreement on the right approach to resolving
the road issues there. And we've got that April 25th letter
in your packet there, and on May 5th, Mr. Odom wrote
Mr. Voelkel and said that he thought it would be wise to get
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a Commissioners Court direction on how to proceed with the
resolution to the road difficulties. Do you want to talk
about this, Mr. Voelkel, or does your letter say it all?
MR. VOELKEL: I'm here to answer any
questions. I was unable to get my client -- he was out of
town, so he was not able to be here this morning.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'm going to make a
motion that the -- to direct Mr. Odom to inform the
landowners that in order to meet county standards to make
the road eligible for county maintenance, that we need a
request from him in writing, and that we need a 40-foot
right-of-way, and the road needs to be built to our
standards with a 15-foot surface, and that the owner of the
property at the end of the road that was subdivided without
going through the platting process will need to do that.
And, if necessary, that owner will need to provide a
cul-de-sac that meets our Road and Bridge standards or
subdivision standards, and that, if necessary, the County
Attorney assist with bringing that owner into compliance.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Commissioner, the --
the platting issue at the end of the road, tell me again how
that works. The property lines come out into the present
cul-de-sac and all that. Isn't that the way it --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Commissioner, as it
turns out, the present cul-de-sac is not a platted
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cul-de-sac; it's an ad hoc cul-de-sac. Apparently the owner
of the property at the end of the road divided it into one
or more additional lots; I'm not sure if it's one or two,
and that access to those lots is being gained through where
the road ends. The road ends, and it's however wide it is;
I think it's probably 14 feet wide or something like that.
So, they're more or less just sharing a common access route,
so that what you think is the cul-de-sac there is not a
cul-de-sac.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, your motion is
stating that not only that the property owners provide us
with more right-of-way --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yes.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- but they purchase
the materials to build the road?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: They bring it up to
our standards.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are we doing the
actual work?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: No.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh. So, they'll hire
a company and come do that?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yes.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And then they also
provide enough property to -- for a cul-de-sac?
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COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I think that will be
the outcome of it, Commissioner. What I'm saying is that
that owner has to come into this court and go through the
subdivision process.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: And if the
subdivision process indicates that a rul-de-sac is required
there, then that would -- that would be required.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Truby, would you agree
that there's a cul-de-sac required there?
MS. HARDIN: That's what the Court has been
requesting of people that are dividing property. But that
property was divided as a family member probably 20 years
ago, and has subsequently sold at least three times that I
know of. Both owners now are very recent owners, but if
they -- that's all I can tell you.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Commissioner, if we
do not grant a waiver on the 60-foot frontage, then it would
have to -- it would take a cul-de-sac. But right now,
there's two or more -- I think three property owners
essentially sharing a --
MS. HARDIN: There's two.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Just two? Sharing a
14- or 16-foot access to that property.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: From what I see here,
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it's -- we're -- it's one motion, but -- it can be one
motion, but there's two issues. One, we're basically just
telling the people that they've got to bring the road to
county standards; however, we gave them a variance on the
width of the right-of-way because of the situation. That's
the only variance you're getting. Otherwise, this is going
to be a county -- you know, county standard road. Issue
one. Issue two is, the illegal subdivision at the end of
the road needs to be cleaned up, and likely, as part of that
process, the cul-de-sac will be added.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: And the precedent
for the 40-foot right-of-way is, this is the same situation
as we had on West Hi Line where we settled for a 40-foot
right-of-way.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Perhaps there's an
issue three, which might be point number four in
Mr. Voelkel's letter to Mr. Alford that deals with the
County establishing a disclaimer for liability with respect
to drainage issues. Is that an issue, or is that
sufficient?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Well, that's a good
question, Commissioner. I'm saying that since we approved
the subdivision, including this road, not to be
county-maintained, then the only time -- we approved it at
that time as accepting that the drainage was not an issue.
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If it surfaces in this platting process of the two lots down
at the end of it that there is a drainage issue, then that
owner will need to -- to resolve that to our satisfaction.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What would be the
length of this road, and how many homes or properties will
be served?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Can you speak to
that, Mr. Surveyor?
MR. VOELKEL: Yes, sir. There -- the road
that we're talking about is actually about 600 feet long,
and there are four property owners along that road. The
road goes into this cul-de-sac that the Commissioner has
talked about. There are two property owners that own lots
on that cul-de-sac, so there's six -- six property owners
total. It's --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: What are the sizes of
these lots?
MR. VOELKEL: 2-acre average, something right
in there. One and a half, 2 acres.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is it -- I can't quite
get my picture here. But is it too much to ask the property
owners to give us the property for the cul-de-sac? Is that
too much? Or do they have houses sitting in the middle of
it or what?
MS. HARDIN: 15 foot --
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COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I think that would
be addressed in the platting process that we're going to
require the owner to go through. If we determine that we
need a cul-de-sac -- that they need a cul-de-sac, and we
determine it's 50 foot, then they need to give you a 50-foot
cul-de-sac.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You see all that
coming down the road?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: In the platting
process.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I second your motion.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: To summarize this,
we're saying to them, you've got to completely comply with
our subdivision regulations, and then we'll consider taking
that on for county maintenance.
JUDGE TINLEY: By telling them up front.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yes.
JUDGE TINLEY: And reduce the right-of-way
down to 40-feet, based upon a prior precedent?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Are you satisfied
with that, Mr. Voelkel?
MR. VOELKEL: Yes, sir. I believe that was
what was done before in that subdivision, so that would be
appropriate.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And so in that motion
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somewhere is granting a variance regarding the width issue,
the right-of-way issue?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: The motion is to
tell them that 40 feet will be sufficient. Just like --
just like West Hi Line.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and a second.
Any further question or discussion on the motion?
MS. HARDIN: Does it take 100 percent of the
landowners to agree that it would be county-maintained?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, I don't believe so.
I --
JUDGE TINLEY: If we're going to take some
property from them, it would seem that it would require
that. I don't know whether it's going to take property from
them. Probably will.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah.
MR. VOELKEL: Yes, it will.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: They agreed to give
us whatever it takes, 5 foot on each side or whatever. If
you want to add a -- well, didn't -- didn't we say that they
have to have petitions --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, said it has to be
unanimous. I'm thinking -- I don't know what would preclude
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one of the property owners from paying 100 percent of the
cost and doing it all, as long as people give the land. I
mean, I don't know -- I can't remember the rules. These are
really not subdivision rules when it comes to taking a -- a
road. If the road's built to standards, I don't know that
we need 100 -- unanimous support for us to do that. Maybe
we do. I'm not sure of the law on that, on, you know, what
the requirements are for us to take a road into the county
system.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I don't think we
have to have 100 percent. I think sometimes we required
that because of controversy.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that just a rule
that the Commissioners -- previous Commissioners Court has
made? Or is that a state law, or is it -- it's not in the
subdivision regs. Where does this 100 percent come from?
MS. HARDIN: I don't know.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Not -- this is not a
subdivision issue, so it's certainly not the subdivision
regs. This is a -- a county accepting a road into the
county system. I think it's -- and I saw Rex writing some
notes feverishly, so I presume he's going to look this up.
'Cause I -- you know, I think it's something that we need to
know, and it'd be good maybe to put with our subdivision
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regs what the state law says we have to do when we accept a
road or abandon a road.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, are we talking
about 100 percent of the property owners that are contiguous
to the road, or are we talking about 100 percent of the --
COMMISSIONER NTCHOLSON: Contiguous.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- people in the
subdivision?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: We're going to ask
each of these -- what did you say? There's six property
owners out there?
MR. VOELKEL: Correct. Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: We're going to
ask -- I think there's five of them that are fronting the
road now, and then a sixth one at the end of the road.
We're going to ask each of those five -- or each of those
five have said that they will give us the -- the 40-foot
easement.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have a question. I'm
going to ask -- when I made my previous statement, I
confused myself. Is this in a platted subdivision?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So it's just a -- they
didn't file a revision with what -- they didn't file -- I
mean, the plat's filed with the subdivision, but they need
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to do a revision of plat for that last lot thickness,
particularly.
MS. HARDIN: It was a family division of
property at the time.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, but as soon as
that sold to a third party, that exemption was no longer
valid; it needed to be platted at that point. It is -- in
answer to the subdivision question, Commissioner, it's a
platted subdivision.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Glad we settled that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I hate to have those, you
know, wrestling around in my brain, fighting with myself.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions?
Comments? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising
your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(NO response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: If we get around to
the Subdivision Rules some day, I want to learn some more
about that, requiring a -- a plat when a relative --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: State law.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Is it? That solved
that problem.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: Rex, for your
information, our Subdivision Rules track state law on
abandoning a road in a subdivision, so it's covered, I
think, right now. I can't remember what the requirement is,
but it's in there.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's move to Item 12,
consider funding and timeline of the construction of the
walk bridge in Flat Rock Park. I think the issue here
concerns what the timeline is more than anything else down
at Hermann Sons, and the movement of that railcar that's
being used for a temporary bridge.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Railcars.
MS. HARDIN: As you all know, the bridge
washed out in the July 2002 flood. It was included with the
grant for property damage to buildings, to all the road
damage done in Kerr County, and it's the only project that
is not completed on either the FEMA or the ORCA grant. Last
year, in June, we came to you with the timeline that you
have in your packet and requested that FEMA give an
extension for that grant. That extension runs out July 4th
of 2005. We also applied for ORCA, Office of Rural
Community Affairs, in Contract Number 718257, and on May the
11th, we -- I received a copy of the letter that went to the
Judge stating that unless we expended those funds by June
the 27th, the Court would not be allowed to file on the
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2005/2006 Colonia Construction Planning Fund. We have done
the engineering survey, boring, the elevation certificate
for floodplain at a cost of 13,000 -- a little over 13,000,
and y'all have that invoice. We've already paid that. But
the timeline is tied to TexDOT. They will not be able to
finish the Hermann Sons Bridge, and their estimate now is
September of 2005. What we're -- what we're asking at this
time is that you allow us to contact FEMA and ORCA and close
out those grants, and -- and then discuss during the funding
process the rebuilding of the bridge through county or Road
and Bridge funds.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What do you mean,
close them out? Just say good-bye? The money goes away?
MS. HARDIN: Correct.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why can't we request
another extension?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I thought that's what
we were doing.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: My preference would be
that we -- I mean, we've expended enough funds on the
project that would cover the -- I mean, what we need to get
reimbursed. I would say that, you know, let them give --
ask them to either accept that as the completion portion of
the project, the 13,000 or so that you've spent, which would
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be enough, I think, to cover that, or to extend it. Because
it's TexDOT's delay. I mean, it's not -- basically, it's
the same reason for the extension request that we asked for
previously last year.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, I think so too.
These are extenuating circumstances beyond our control,
getting the flat cars in here, and I would hate to just walk
away from that money. I'd rather them say, you know, "You
can't have another extension," having applied, than just to
walk away from those funds. I think Commissioner Letz'
point's valid in that if that's not a possibility in terms
of extension, then use those as an offset to the dollars
already spent.
JUDGE TINLEY: What do we have in terms of
funds that are remaining under those grants?
MS. HARDIN: We have already received --
that's in your packet, too, on that timeline. It's on the
very last page of the timeline.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Total grant funds.
MS. HARDIN: The FEMA funds?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 6,924?
MS. HARDIN: Right. Those we've already
received, and they are in the account. The ORCA funds are
reimbursable. That -- it's possible that if we sent them
the engineering amount, that -- that ORCA would consider
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that as closed, but FEMA will make -- would not consider it
closed until the project is complete.
JUDGE TINLEY: If the -- the amount that
we're talking about is not adequate to cover these
engineering costs that you put us on notice of?
MS. HARDIN: No.
JUDGE TINLEY: If we can get them to apply
that there, isn't that the simplest solution? And then this
puts us in line --
MS. HARDIN: That is possible -- that is
possible with ORCA, but it would not be, I don't think, with
FEMA. But we can certainly send this information to them
and ask them.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: With FEMA, that's a
situation that if they don't extend it, we have to send them
the money back? 'Cause we already received it.
MS. HARDIN: I don't know. I don't know.
We've never run across that before, so I really don't know.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I -- you know, either
request an extension or ask them -- either that, or ask them
to apply the grant to the amount we already have expended on
$13,000 worth of studies. And --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think it needs to
be a motion that incorporates both possible solutions,
asking for an extension or --
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MS. HARDIN: The letter from ORCA says that
we will jeopardize funding for other projects if we don't
finish this off.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, this is one way
to finish it out, by either getting the extension, which
preserves your rights, or asking them to allow us to
reallocate those dollars against money we've already spent
on engineering and floodplain assessment and so forth.
Either way, they're going to know that there's some action
on our part, and some potential resolution. So, I would
move that we -- or did you make a motion?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Go ahead.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would move that we
authorize your office to request an extension of ORCA and/or
FEMA, whomever; or, in the alternative, allow us to allocate
those funds from the original designation to cover the cost
of engineering to the extent that funds will do that.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the extension
would be our priority -- would be our first choice.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes.
JUDGE TINLEY: Extension would be, rather
than the allocation of the funds to close it out.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: In my mind, it is.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. Whichever way
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it goes is fine, and then explain in the letter the
extenuating circumstances which are beyond the control of
Kerr County.
MS. HARDIN: But the extension that we did
last year was only for one year. If we do another
extension, it probably would be for only one year. Mr. Odom
doesn't think we can have it completed within a year.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why wouldn't we be able
to complete it in a year? I mean, if we've -- we've already
talked about trying to accelerate the pier drilling to have
it done in the August time framework, so we could have the
railroad cars moved one time and placed, rather than have to
do it twice with equipment. Once that part gets done, I
wouldn't know why --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't either. Are
you suggesting that they won't go a year; that maybe we
should do a shorter time request?
MS. HARDIN: I really don't know. I just
know that the last one we got from FEMA was for one year.
We've never asked for an ORCA extension. Our deadline is
just the 27th for them.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. They probably
only do it in terms of a year, but --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd ask for a one-year
extension, and say that -- you know.
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MS. HARDIN: We can come back, too, if it
isn't --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Exactly.
JUDGE TINLEY: I think we had a motion.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, a motion and second.
Any further question or discussion on that motion? All in
favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: My question is, is the
letter or the request going to come out of Road and Bridge,
or does it come out of this Court?
MS. HARDIN: They're usually --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think you've
handled all the correspondence until now, have you not?
MS. HARDIN: The letters are usually signed
by the Judge after we write them. I think maybe you did the
last one.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You signed the last
one?
MS. HARDIN: No, I think you, Mr. Williams --
you were instructed to sign the last one in July.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I signed it? Then,
if the Court has no problem, I'll sign the next one.
MS. HARDIN: Okay.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just think we need
to make it clear so they don't think that we're doing it and
we think that they're doing it, and we drop the ball.
JUDGE TINLEY: Good point.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It will come out of
the Court.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the motion needs
to be amended to authorize -- I will make a motion to amend
the -- to authorize Commissioner Williams to sign the letter
relating to this matter.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and a second
for that, for that authorization for Commissioner Williams
on the request to FEMA and ORCA on that Item 12 agenda item.
Any question or discussion?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just one question. I
know Commissioner Williams is leaving town. When are you
leaving?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Saturday.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: After he gets this
letter done.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'll get it out --
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we'll get it out this week. we'll get together.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or
discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising
your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(NO response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's
move to Item 13, set a public hearing for the revision of
the plat for Southern Hills, Phase Two, Lots 36, 37, and 38,
located in Precinct 2.
MS. HARDIN: There's a correction to that.
It's Precinct 1.
COMMISSIONER
COMMISSIONER
Precinct 1? Yours?
COMMISSIONER
COMMISSIONER
COMMISSIONER
COMMISSIONER
BALDWIN:
WILLIAMS:
BALDWIN:
WILLIAMS:
BALDWIN:
WILLIAMS:
Darn.
Precinct 2 or
Yeah, it's 1.
Oh, okay.
Don't rub it in, Bill.
Fine, I'll give it to
you.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move we set a public
hearing for 10 a.m., July 25th, 2005, for the revision of
recorded plat, Volume 5, Page 65, to combine three lots into
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one.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion,
signify by raising your right hand -- excuse me. Any
question or discussion?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have a quick comment.
Whoever the surveyor is on this, make sure that you clean up
the language so that it's a revision of plat, not an
undefined term.
MS. HARDIN:	Okay.		
MR. VOELKEL:	That's	a local --	come again?
COMMISSIONER	LETZ:	"Replatted"	is not a term
recognized by the State of	Texas.	"Revision of	plat," I
believe, is.			
MR. VOELKEL: Who was that surveyor again on
there?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not sure.
JUDGE TINLEY: Didn't say.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that the way --
JUDGE TINLEY: But you need to pass the word
along to him, if you would.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Did this term come
out of A & M or what?
MR. VOELKEL: Probably. (Laughter.)
JUDGE TINLEY: Came out of one of those other
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schools, didn't it? Okay. Any further question or
discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising
your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's
move to Item 15, final plat of Mosty Pecan Grove located in
Precinct 2, I think.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I believe.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We have seen this one
before, I believe.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yes.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is the final;
we've been through preliminary. Anything we need to know
about this, Ms. Hardin?
MS. HARDIN: Mr. Voelkel?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That we don't already
know?
MR. VOELKEL: Everything is the same as it
was on preliminary. We were going to try to make some
changes on right-of-way and bring it back to you on the
final, but that did not happen because of some contracts
that were already involved with the property, so the plat
you have today is exactly the same as the preliminary plat
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that was approved with all the notes. And, of course, you
know we have people signed on the plat.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for
approval of the final plat of Mosty Pecan Grove located in
Precinct 2. Any question or discussion?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have a comment.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, no, no.
(Laughter.)
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I voted --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Here we go down J.J.
Lane one more time.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is it a pump house or
what?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I voted against this on
the preliminary plat, and I'll probably go ahead and vote
for it, since I think my opposition to this was made at that
time, but I do think it is a mistake for this county to be
basically rushing business because developers have already
presold property and don't want to do things the way it
properly should be done, and within what I think is the
County authority, which is to make J.J. Lane wider and
improve J.J. Lane's entrance onto Highway 27 to a safer
entrance. I think -- just a comment; I think the developer
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shouldn't have gone and sold property before they came to
us, first of all.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with you,
Commissioner Letz. However, my second stands.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or
discussion on the motion? All in favor of the motion,
signify by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's
move to Item 16, consider and discuss the Kerr County
Management's Discussion and Analysis for the '03/'04 audit.
Commissioner Letz.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is the final draft
to the -- I guess our portion, or it goes with the 2003/2004
budget Management Discussion and Analysis. We looked at
this about a month ago, made some comments. I had Tommy go
through this and go through all the numbers, because I was
-- I got to the point that I was real confused, after
looking at two budgets in two different audits, as to what
numbers I was looking at, and Tommy did find one paragraph I
had made some errors in, which those have been corrected on
the copy you have. I think it's a -- hopefully represents
the Court's view of what we did that year.
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I will make a comment.
Commissioner Letz and I had a visit about this document a
few days ago, and the more I look at it and the more I think
about this thing, this is an excellent tool for us to go
back and reflect on and to look at for the future budgets
and future planning of Kerr County. That was one of the
comments that Commissioner Letz made, and I'm growing closer
and closer to that way of thinking. This is a great
document with a lot of good information.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree with that,
and I want to extend my thanks to appreciation to
Commissioner Letz for taking on this task. It is a daunting
task to get all this stuff pulled together. And I think it
serves our purposes; it depicts the happenings and
activities of Kerr County for the period ending
September 30, 2004.
MR. TOMLINSON: I appreciate Commissioner
Letz doing it also. (Laughter.)
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I bet you do.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I bet you do.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: A lot of work.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You ought to take him
out for a steak dinner.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: With us along.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Commissioner Letz,
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on Page 9, under the heading "Budget for 2004-OS" --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What page are you on?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Page 9, '04-'O5
budget. In that second paragraph, did you switch from
thousands of dollars to actual dollars?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I did, correct. That
needs to be modified. Page 9, second paragraph, those
numbers all need to go into --
JUDGE TINLEY: First one should be 508,
probably.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 508.
JUDGE TINLEY: Second one should be 150.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. Third one should
be 940 -- or the -- 138 and 940.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Old eagle eye.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: It was helpful to me
and read it and think back.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Uh-huh.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Actually, the other one
should be 49. Double typo.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 44 even, just 94.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Take out the second
one.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: 'Cause I don't think our
expenditures are going to be $507 million.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Never can tell.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Wait a month.
JUDGE TINLEY: With respect --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you for catching
that.
JUDGE TINLEY: With respect to the Budget and
Financial Highlights on Page 6, I think there's some
technical corrections that need to be made on the
next-to-the-last bullet there, where it refers to Kerr
County Juvenile Board, that the Kerr County Facilities
Corporation was not going to appropriate. That should be
Kerr County Juvenile Board was not going to appropriate.
The term "debt service" is used. I think, technically,
those are lease payments.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Question. I mean, so the
-- it should say "Kerr County Juvenile Board" twice?
JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And debt service --
correct me -- that would be changed to "lease payment"?
JUDGE TINLEY: Lease payments, those are
technically called in the agreement.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: "...appropriate funds to
make lease payments"?
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JUDGE TINLEY: To pay lease payments, right.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: And then, following on down
with the -- the last bullet there, in order to further
implement those -- those corrections, I've come up with some
revised language. I have a little problem with "notice to
bond holders and trustee of potential default." I think
we're in potential default of anything we do right now.
That doesn't mean you're actually in default. And we have
never fallen under default under any of those agreements.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Technical default.
JUDGE TINLEY: There were material events,
but they were not events of default, and it's never been
established, and we were not ever. However, I would propose
some language to correct that last bullet to read, "On
September 27, 2004, the Commissioners Court voted to not
appropriate funds to pay lease payments, and provided notice
of such nonappropriation to the lease revenue bond holders
and the trustee of such bond holders of the Hill Country
Juvenile Facility Corporation" -- cause that's who the bonds
were held in -- "relative to business-type activities," and
then in parentheses, (Kerr County Juvenile Detention
Facility). I think the same information is imparted, but
it's technically correct.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have no problem with
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that change.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I want to go
back up to the -- your first one.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The difference between
the Juvenile Board and the Facilities Corp.
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Wasn't it the
Facilities Corp, that could not appropriate funds?
JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner, the -- the
Facilities Corp. owns title to the property. The Juvenile
Board was under an operating agreement, and it was the one
that furnished notice of nonappropriation to the Court under
the operating agreement between the Juvenile Board and the
Court.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Wasn't it the Facility
Corp., though, that is the actual body that made payments?
I mean, that's what's in my brain, is that it was the
facility -- not the Juvenile Board, but the Facilities Corp.
that actually -- which sat down and wrote a check to
whomever.
JUDGE TINLEY: I think mechanically what
would happen is that the funds were transferred from the
Juvenile Board, as the operator, to Kerr County under the
operating agreement that it had with Kerr County, and then
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Kerr County, under the lease agreement with the Facility
Corp. -- mechanically how that would happen -- I think,
actually, the check probably went directly -- it never went
through a Facilities Corp. account, did it? No, didn't
think so.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who held the debt?
JUDGE TINLEY: The issuer of the debt was the
Facilities Corp. The lease agreement was with Kerr County.
Then Kerr County entered into an operating agreement with
the Juvenile Board, in which the Juvenile Board assumed that
obligation. So, the Juvenile Board first gave notice of
its -- Juvenile Board's -- nonappropriation to the Court.
The Court then subsequently gave notice of nonappropriation
under the lease agreement, and that's the notice that went
to the bondholders and the trustee.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Who -- maybe y'all just
answered this and I was in never-never land. Who -- and I
think there's something you said referring to lease
payments, you know, but we were never referring to
nonappropriating funds for the bond payment. Who -- I mean,
a lease payment didn't pay the bonds. I mean, the money
went -- I mean, may have been a lease, but someone had to
pay the bondholders, so there's -- it's bonded indebtedness;
it's not a lease indebtedness.
JUDGE TINLEY: The way -- the terminology
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that was used in the documentation in the transaction talked
about lease payments.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
JUDGE TINLEY: Now, what was included within
the lease payments were funds necessary to pay the bonded
indebtedness, but they were called lease payments --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But --
JUDGE TINLEY: -- in the agreement.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But who -- who was the
responsible party to make the bond payment?
JUDGE TINLEY: As it turns out, it was
Kerr -- Kerr County, after it got the funds, if it
appropriated funds, after it got them from the Juvenile
Board. Correct? That was the mechanics of the arrangement.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: County never -- I don't
recall the County ever issuing the bonds. Who issued the
bonds?
JUDGE TINLEY: The Facility Corp. issued the
bonds.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, then, the
Facilities Corp.'s the one that has to pay the bond payment.
It seems to me -- I don't -- I mean, that's -- I mean, the
lease payment, I think, is -- it's a lease payment, but it's
the bonds that weren't paid, is the issue. And that was the
Facilities Corp. that didn't make those bond payments.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The lease payment was
the equivalent of what the debt service would have been.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. So I -- I think
somewhere we need to -- I mean, I don't have a problem with
changing up the lease payments, but I still think we need to
say the Facility Corporation couldn't make the bond
payments, because that's what -- that was the problem. I
mean, the bonds couldn't be paid.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What did the letter
of nonappropriation say -- if you recall, Judge, say when
you gave the letter to the Court?
JUDGE TINLEY: The Juvenile Board gave notice
of nonappropriation to Kerr County. So, under that
next-to-the-last bullet, September 8, it was that the Kerr
County Juvenile Board was not going to appropriate funds.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yes?
MR. TOMLINSON: Well, the -- the Management
Discussion and Analysis is addressing the statements that
are presented, and we're -- we're presenting the statements
of the County. We're -- the statements of the corporation
are not in the body of -- of the financial statement, so I
don't think we need to talk -- we need to say anything about
the corporation, because the corporation's financial
statements aren't within the body of -- of our audit. So
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you need to focus on -- on what the County and the Juvenile
Board did, not what the corporation did or didn't do.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, and in truth and in
fact, the notice -- the first notice of nonappropriation was
from the Juvenile Board to Kerr County.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's the notice that
they weren't going to appropriate. It says -- I mean, I'm
trying to -- hopefully this is a quote -- not going to
appropriate funds to make lease payments. That's what you
said in that notice.
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Then that bullet is
correct. And on this last bullet, Commissioners Court voted
to nonappropriate funds to make lease payments or bond
payments for the Facilities Corp. I mean, I don't --
JUDGE TINLEY: In the lease, the lease
payments were defined as -- as including bond payments in an
amount necessary in order to amortize the bonds.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess what I'm trying
to do, I want to make sure that in 30 years, when someone
looks at this, they understand that what happened was we --
you know, the County decided to not appropriate funds that
we were not obligated to do anyhow, but decided not to
appropriate funds to pay these bonds. That's what happened,
you know, in reality. And I think that this note -- the
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intent of the note is to say -- to tell the public that this
Commissioners Court voted not to appropriate the funds to
pay those bonds, the debt on those bonds. And that's what
-- I mean, you know, and I think it needs to be as clear as
possible. I don't have a real problem with your language,
but maybe -- I think that you read, but I think it needs to
refer back to the bonds at some point, because it's the
bonds that weren't paid that have -- that caused our credit
rating to go down and, you know, other things to happen.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with you.
Unless -- unless when they use the verbiage, "lease
payments," is that being the same thing as bond payments?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's -- I think it is.
JUDGE TINLEY: Under the definition of the
documents, yes, it does include the amount necessary to
amortize the payment on those bonds. In the documents of
the transaction.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. And for that
reason, I think we can say lease payments, and then put in
parentheses, you know, bond -- or debt service or bond
payments. It's bond payments, is what it is.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: Pay lease payments for bond
payments, and provided notice of such nonappropriation.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
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JUDGE TINLEY: Okay? But in the
next-to-the-last bullet --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Change --
DODGE TINLEY: -- it needs to be Juvenile
Board instead of Facilities Corp.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, okay. All right.
Any other comments?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, yeah. One thing
I have learned from this is I don't want to do that again.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree with that.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Too many boards and
too many commissions and too many ...
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And, Commissioner
Baldwin, I take, by your comments earlier about the
usefulness of this, that was volunteering to write next
year's management discussion?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir, that wasn't
anything like that. I was just trying to be nice for a
change. And, of course, that ends right now.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You did such a great
job, I think you should just continue to do it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I really think this is a
good opportunity for the Court to really look at that year
with some, you know, microscope and see what we did. And it
creates a document that can be used -- it obviously has to
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be used in the audit, but it can also be used -- I think put
on the web site, and it's a good summary of the financial
situation for the County, what we did in that year.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll move approval of the
Management Discussion and Analysis as amended today -- or
modified today, excuse me.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for
approval of the Management Discussion and Analysis as
modified.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, can you check the
language -- we need to get the language of yours so we can
get that and put it in there.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: With the corrections.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. Any further question or
discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising
your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's
move to Item 17, if we might, discuss approval of placement
contract with E1 Paso County and Cameron County, and
authorize County Judge to sign same. Ms. Harris.
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MS. HARRIS: Here are the revised contracts.
After the County Attorney reviewed E1 Paso's contract, he
made some suggestions for some more specific clarification,
so I called E1 Paso and had a conference call with the
attorney that drew up this contract, and he approved the
changes that Mr. Emerson wanted to include. And this was
late Friday afternoon; that's the reason why you're getting
the revised copy of the contract. However, Mr. Emerson just
handed me a note that if you will look on -- I believe it's
Section VIII of the contract --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Does this also apply
to Wharton County, this revision? Or Cameron County, I'm
sorry.
MS. HARRIS: No, sir. No, Cameron County,
the County Attorney has looked at it and has approved
Cameron County's contract. This is just E1 Paso's contract.
I wanted to just point out on --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which page?
MS. HARRIS: -- on Section --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: On Page 7.
JUDGE TINLEY: Page 7, yeah.
MS. HARRIS: Yes, Page 7, Section VIII, B and
C, where I have typed in, "See attached general liability
coverage document declarations." County Attorney wants me
to add right after that, "It is agreed that the service
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agency's general liability coverage document declarations
shall suffice to satisfy the insurance and certification
requirements." To just add that after, "See attached
general liability coverage document declarations."
JUDGE TINLEY: On both B and C?
MS. HARRIS: On both B and C, yes, sir. So I
would have to get you another copy, Judge Tinley, in order
for you to sign after I add that. Everything in bold on
this contract is what I added at the request of the County
Attorney. Everything that's in bold on here.
JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. County Attorney, after the
changes have been made that we're looking at here,
eleventh-hour changes, I guess, mostly, do you have any
concerns about any of the substantives or matters of form?
MR. EMERSON: Not particularly after the
changes, Your Honor. I had -- I had a number of concerns
prior to that, and Ms. Harris sat down and went through with
-- went through them with me. Some of them were
T.J.P.C.-dictated, so we didn't really have any control over
it, despite the fact that I didn't particularly care for it.
But, you know, it was just kind of the nature of the beast
we're living with, and El Paso has agreed to other changes
that made a difference in the contract. So --
JUDGE TINLEY: So, substantive, it's
something you can live with?
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MR. EMERSON: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. And as to form, it's
satisfactory?
MR. EMERSON: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: What's the -- what's
the significance under Part 11 -- or Part VI on Page 6 of
the contract that runs from June 13, 2005, until August 31?
This is a contract for less than three months.
MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir, because El Paso sends
out all their contract renewals on September 1, so we'll --
we'll have to have another contract approved come
September 1.
JUDGE TINLEY: They run concurrently fiscally
with the State?
MS. HARRIS: Yes, they do.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
MS. HARRIS: Yes, they do.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I'd like to see
action on this item postponed till after tomorrow's
workshop, after the Sheriff and the jail workshop, so we can
see the -- get a complete, full picture of what we're doing
with our properties.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I agree.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have no problem with
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deferring till tomorrow.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. What you're suggesting
is that, as opposed to adjourning when we finish today, we
recess and -- and incorporate that meeting with our workshop
that we've got scheduled for tomorrow anyway?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Would that apply to
the Cameron County or just the E1 Paso County?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Both.
JUDGE TINLEY: Both. Mr. County Attorney, is
that satisfactory?
MR. EMERSON: Yes, sir, Your Honor.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay, let's move on to
Item 18, then, if nobody has anything further to offer on
17. Discuss approval of $4,500 to repair the facility lift
station, here again, at the detention facility.
MS. HARRIS: The figure $4,500 was put in
here prior to getting a written estimate from the electrical
engineer. You have that in your packet, and his estimation
was $1,786, which would increase it from $4,500 to $4,733.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Four thousand --
MS. HARRIS: 733, rather than $4,500.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there any -- I presume
this is because of the construction problems when this --
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when the addition was built?
MS. HARRIS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Where are we on getting
any relief from the contractor or engineer or architect, or
whoever designed this system that doesn't work?
MR. EMERSON: Where we stand at this point is
that we have had an informal meeting with all parties
concerned out at the detention facility. We had basically
divided responsibilities at that meeting, and as I talked to
Ms. Harris earlier this week, I told her that if we don't
have substantial action, probably within the next week or
so, there will be an agenda item on the next Commissioners
Court meeting authorizing me to pursue litigation.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So there is a chance that
we'll recoup some of these funds? Are we --
MR. EMERSON: Possibly.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is part -- it needs
to be done if there's a problem. So --
MR. EMERSON: Correct. And what actually
needs to be done is not only the sewer lift station,
although this is the most important at this time, but the
parking lot has to be brought up to A.D.A. standards, and
then there's significant drainage issues between the old
building and the new building.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval of the
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agenda item, expenditure of $4,733.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: With those funds -- do
you have those funds in the budget anywhere?
MS. HARRIS: No, sir.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tommy, do we have any
spot to find $4,033 -- $4,733?
MR. TOMLINSON: There's -- there's some funds
that haven't been expended in Contract Fees under the budget
that -- the current budget.
MS. HARRIS: In Contract Fees?
MR. TOMLINSON: Yes.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that all right?
MS. HARRIS: That's fine.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: With funds to come out of
the contract fees in the Juvenile Facility budget.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Any
further question or discussion?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Question.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yes?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The KPUB issue, the
$3,000 -- or $2,947. What is that for exactly?
MS. HARRIS: That's for dropping the pole and
running the line from their pole to a pole that the
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electrical engineer is going to have to drop. And so the
1,700 and some-odd cents is for the electrical engineer.
They have to drop a pole, do the meter loop, and get ready
for KPUB to set the meter on that pole, and then hook it up.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is this full charge
from KPUB? I mean, did they come along and say, "Hey, this
is for our sister government agency, the County. We need to
give them a reduced cost on this thing and work with them."
Did they say anything like that? Or --
MS. HARRIS: Not in those words, but they
worked with us as diligently as they possibly could to give
us --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just -- I think you
know, less than an hour ago, we were discussing our
partnership with the City of Kerrville, and this being a
City-owned function, you know, if they're -- golly. $3,000
sounds like a lot of money to me to set a pole and run a
wire.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's more than just
a pole, is it not? It's a transformer and everything else.
MS. HARRIS: Transformer.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: In that case, it
should be free. See, you guys don't think right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Early on I contacted
Mr. Taylor, and he did indicate his willingness to work with
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Ms. Harris on this whole matter, but he didn't say he'd do
it for free.
JUDGE TINLEY: I can assure you, Commissioner
Baldwin, they were requested to give us whatever
consideration --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They can find in their
soft heart? If you had a pole set in and a transformer and
a wire running to your house as a private citizen, it would
probably cost you $2,947.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Reckon?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. So we're not
getting --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But the good news is that
we'll recover that as we spend money out there on
electricity, get our money back over the long-term.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And better news is,
by doing this, we probably avoid a citation from EPA for
sanitary violations of the lift station.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, the bad news --
let me throw a little more bad news in there. This damned
issue should have been taken care of when they built the
facility.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree with that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree. That's why
we --
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I won in the end.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's important.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or
discussion?
MS. HARRIS: Judge Tinley, what -- also in
your packet, this attachment that KPUB attached to their
estimate, I prefer not to sign that; I prefer that the Court
authorize Judge Tinley to sign it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Maintenance sign it?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sign what?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The KPUB --
MS. HARRIS: It says, "Customer Contribution
Agreement, Kerrville Public Utility Board," that I attached
to their estimate.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're probably right.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll add to my motion to
request that the County Judge sign the appropriate documents
with KPUB.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And the D.W.
contract.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't think we have to
sign it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And the D.W. --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, and D.W. contract.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I accept that.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or
discussion?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yes. Judge, while I
can get this in where it's almost relevant -- it's as close
to being relevant now as it's going to be the rest of the
day. The Sheriff has done a very thorough and thoughtful
study and report on detention issues in Kerr County, and we
just got that, and we're going to have a workshop on it
tomorrow, and I think I'm going to spend some time studying
this between now and tomorrow, because there's some fresh
thinking in here that -- that needs our consideration. And
thanks for doing that, Sheriff.
MS. HARRIS: Were you going to give me a copy
of that?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: You know the
organizations that talk about staff doing the work for them?
Well, there's our staff. And Rusty's now also a part of our
staff.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Rusty's got more
staff than we've got staff.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's what I mean.
Thank you, Rusty. See you tomorrow.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or
discussion on the motion as amended? All in favor of the
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motion, signify by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Lunchtime?
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. We're going to break
for lunch, and we'll come back at 1:30 and will pick up
where we left off.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I didn't think we'd get
through this before lunch.
(Recess taken from 12:05 p.m. to 1:30 p.m.)
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to
order, our Commissioners Court meeting for this date. We
were in recess for lunch. That brings us to Item 19,
consider and discuss purchase of three new patrol cars.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, you all know what
our luck has been with patrol cars for the last month and a
half. Hopefully it's ended, but we have had two cars
totaled. One was our fault, and one was a drunk driver
hitting a deputy head-on.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Both the person and
deputy were out there by a bar or something.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Getting ready to turn
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into a brawl at the bar that the drunk driver was trying to
flee from. But, anyhow, we -- it was two cars totaled, and
anyone who's seen the budget preparations for this coming
year knows I have not asked, and do not intend on asking for
any new cars in this coming-up budget. But what I'd like to
has an amendment to see if y'all approve it to go put it in
the Capital Outlay in our office so that I can make these
purchases. This other money for these purchases of these
three cars would be seized money that we have. Seized
money, and I would like to use that. We're going to use
some of the older equipment out of the two wrecked cars, or
at least one of those wrecked cars, to totally equip them
back like they had been. But these cars will be totally
paid for up front, and not any lease agreements or anything
like that on them, which I think will save us in the long
run. My real intentions is to purchase one more before the
end of the year, making it four, so that we actually kind of
replace four, although two of them I didn't want to replace
right now. But it keeps us on that four-a-year purchase to
keep our cars rotating through. And that fourth car will
come later on. I've got a couple of seizures still pending,
and if those go through, then I would ask to replace that
fourth one.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move we approve the
purchase of three new patrol cars for the Sheriff's
Department, the funds to come from insurance proceeds from
damaged vehicles and the seizure account -- asset seizure
account.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Any
further question or discussion?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just a question.
That gets your fleet back up to where it needs to be?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. What will end up
happening is, at the end of the year, since we lost two cars
totally that we would not have been rotating out of the
fleet, next year we will, in reality, be operating with two
less cars than what we've had, which means we're just going
to keep two of the older ones longer. So --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But it will get us back
up.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or
discussion? All in favor of that motion, signify by raising
your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
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JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Item
20, consider and discuss Information Technology office to
conduct a review of all county offices in reference to
technology efficiency. Commissioner Letz?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. I put this on the
agenda. I think the backup somewhat speaks for itself.
Mr. Trolinger's been in place now long enough to get an idea
of what we have county-wide. He's made an initial review.
I'd like to ask him or instruct him to go one step further
before our budget process, and report back as to where
things can be done differently in departments in the
technology area to improve efficiency. I think it's
important to have this information before we go into the
budget process. And -- and it may mean -- there may be
nothing for certain offices, may be lots of things for
certain offices. Some of the things may not cost much, and
some may cost more than we can afford, but I think it just
-- I'd like to have kind of his independent review as to
what can be done on the technology side to use the
taxpayers' funds a little bit more efficiently.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That includes the
programs that we saw last week from Software, Inc. I'm
putting words in your mouth, and I apologize, but there was
some fairly high-dollar programs presented here last week,
and I was up and saw some of it, and it's just magnificent
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what technology's doing. And it would be a -- I can see
that it would be a huge plus for the County to have those
programs, and -- and to be able to purchase all that, but as
the Commissioner stated, what -- how does that affect our
manpower? Is there -- will any of that replace human
beings? You know, that's what I would be looking for, you
know, as we move on into higher tech. Does it replace
people, or do -- are we going to have to add people to run
that higher tech stuff? You know, that -- that's the kind
of thing that I'm going to be looking for.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's a lot -- and a lot
of it, my rationale is also to have -- you know, we do not
want to start getting in the business of looking into
individual elected officials' departments as to how they're
running things, but at the same time, when it comes to
budget consequences, I mean, if they're not doing something
that could be a more efficient use of tax dollars, I want to
know it. It doesn't mean they have to do it; it means they
may not get some other things if they don't, just is the way
I look at it. I think that it's a -- you know, and if they
don't want to participate in this review, that says
something, too, in my opinion.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yes.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's -- you know, we're
not mandating that -- or my intent is not to mandate at all
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the -- you know, any elected official go along with this,
but if they don't, I want to know that as well.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: In my conversations
with Mr. Trolinger, I recalled a statement made by some wise
man probably about 100 years ago that said, "Man's genius is
getting a machine to do his work for him," whether it's an
automated reaper instead of a mule, or pulling by a mule or
whatever. And then we commiserated -- we were reminded that
if we still had telephone operators, every time you wanted
to make a phone call you had to get the operator, half the
people in the United States would be employed as telephone
operators. So, technology does replace machines, do replace
human efforts, and those people wind up having better jobs
instead of such -- such menial jobs. And I've had personal
experience where -- where radical changes were made in -- in
the way you use and hire and deploy people, because you use
personal computers, PCs, to get the work done. So, I --
there is no doubt that some of that can be done in Kerr
County. It's a matter of whether or not we've got the will
to pursue -- do it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree with that,
and my experience in publishing is also the same way. In
taking the technology of the day and applying it properly,
it helps curb the labor costs, which are always escalating.
My question would be to Mr. Trolinger. Is this a task --
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it's a valuable task; I know you're going to undertake it.
Is this something that you have to start from scratch on, or
do you already have a pretty good basis of understanding in
a lot of these cases, and will add to your understanding as
a result of this?
MR. TROLINGER: I have all the raw numbers,
all the raw data. I've been working on that since I started
evaluating what the -- each department had and what they
needed for next budget year, and maybe even the next two
budget years. We've reviewed the new system and had all the
vendors -- or existing vendors and our competition come in
so we can get an idea of how much it costs to put in the
newest and best equipment and software. Or if there's a
halfway point, what -- what that costs. So, I've got all
the numbers together, and I am ready to put that in --
package that up in package form.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: My intent also in putting
this agenda item in is to hopefully, you know, insulate John
a little bit from the departments. He's -- and elected
officials. He's often in the departments and looking at
them. I wanted it to be clear that we're the ones telling
him to do that; he's not snooping around and doing stuff
that -- you know, on his own. That's why I want it to be a
court order from the Court telling him to do it, and that
the report then comes back to us, and he's not making
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decisions. I mean, it's coming back to us as, "This can be
done, and this is the cost to do it," and then we'll make
the -- you know, the tough calls during the budget process.
I mean, I'll move the agenda item.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for
approval of the agenda item. Any further question or
comment? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising
your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(NO response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Next,
Item 21, consider and discuss directing Environmental Health
Department Manager and Floodplain Administrator to deny
permits where there are violations of the Kerr County
Subdivision Rules and Regulations. Commissioner Letz?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I put this on the agenda,
and before I turn it over to the County Attorney for some
quick advice on this, it came -- I was in a meeting at Road
and Bridge with Miguel and Road and Bridge on some
subdivision, and this topic came up. And there's -- when I
went back and looked at our O.S.S.F. rules and subdivision
rules -- or, rather, floodplain rules and subdivision rules,
there's nothing specifically that says that those permits
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that the County grants in O.S.S.F. and floodplain can be
denied if they -- if the tract is in violation of our
subdivision rules. Assuming we had the legal authority do
that, I'm in favor of doing that, 'cause I think it's a way
for us to police ourselves. The big question is, Rex, did
you have time to research this?
MR. EMERSON: No, sir.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: No? Okay.
MR. EMERSON: I tried, but it just didn't
happen.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Because of that, I would
probably recommend we defer this until the next meeting,
because I think it's very important to do it, but I want to
make sure that we're not overstepping our authority, because
when we get into subdivisions, you know, somewhat, we follow
state rules -- state law in all of these areas, and I think
we need to be very careful that we don't overstep our legal
authority.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I think you're on to
something, Commissioner. It occurs to me that when such a
transaction occurs, a whole lot of people handle it.
Sometimes there's an attorney on each side that's involved
in it. There's a title company involved in it. Sometimes
there's a realtor involved, maybe septic and floodplain.
I'm amazed that it goes through all of that and still
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doesn't follow our prescribed processes. And then I'll go
on to say that I think we ought to do that if the County
Attorney says it's okay. And I'm also concerned about how
it's administered by our floodplain people and our -- our
Environmental Health people. I've got some concerns that
when either one of those departments deal with -- with our
clientele, that they're not always handled as professionally
and courteously as they should be. I'll talk more about
that later.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Miguel, you just walked
in. We were waiting to hear from the County Attorney on
this matter to see if we legally can ask you and the
Floodplain Manager to do this, so we're going to defer it to
the next meeting until he has time to research it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything further on that item?
If not, we'll move to Item 22, consider and discuss
Commissioners Court liaison positions. Commissioner Letz?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I put this on the agenda
because I got -- I got a little confused recently, and I was
looking at all the correspondence that's coming in and out
of our office -- offices, and what caught my mind was on
EMS, we appointed -- the Court appointed Baldwin and
Nicholson as liaisons, I think, and then the library is
Nicholson, and yet I've seen letters from the Judge coming
out on that. And the EMS one -- and it was just a matter of
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-- you know, to me, the library one, I really don't know
that much about that. It just seems odd to me -- I mean, if
we're going to have liaisons, the liaison ought to handle
it. If you're going to let the Judge handle it, the Judge
should handle it. But to have both a liaison and another
member of the Court, whether it's the Judge or somebody
else, I think murkies the water. Murkies the water? Makes
the water murky.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How about "muddies"?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Muddies the water. Makes
the water murky.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If it's muddy, it
becomes murky.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: God. This has gone
downhill, hasn't it?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And it just -- it -- but
the other side of that is -- is that I'm very sensitive also
that each of us individually have responsibilities and, you
know, I guess the authority to -- you know, I don't want the
fact that Dave's a liaison to the library -- that doesn't
mean that I can't talk to the City about the library. But I
just think it's -- I just thought I'd maybe put this on the
agenda to clarify a little bit as to how everybody else
looks at this, 'cause I was confused by the letters that the
Judge wrote on those two topics.
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JUDGE TINLEY: Two topics?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: EMS and library. I mean,
there was one you wrote on the EMS, and the EMS one really
was more of a -- just a list of questions, which, to me, the
way that I would have handled that would be to give that to
Baldwin and Nicholson, let them get it over to the City to
keep them from dealing with so many different people. On
the library one, it was a little bit different. I mean,
Nicholson is the liaison there, but in my opinion, things
were said in the -- in that letter that I don't think
Nicholson or the Judge had the authority to say, such that
the contract is going to terminate at the end of the term if
we don't come to some agreement. I don't think this Court's
ever voted that we're going to terminate any contract with
the library, so on this, you know --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: On the library
issue, my understanding is that the Court -- one, that the
Court had voted some time ago to notify the City that that
contract was going to end and we'll need to negotiate an
agreement. And then in my letter, what I said to the
Interim City Manager and the Library Director was
essentially in accordance with the contract; here's what has
to happen. Now, neither one of them responded to me.
Instead, the City Manager responded to the Judge, so I
thought it was appropriate for the Judge to respond back.
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And I -- and, in fact, I appreciate it, because -- coming to
my defense, because I was saying, "Let's abide by the
contract," and they were saying, "No, that's out. We're not
going to do that."
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, and I think --
well, I think that the City was wrong to not respond to you
personally, then. I mean, I think -- but I think the City
needs to be told, then -- to me, the answer is,
"Commissioner Nicholson's the liaison; respond to him." I
mean, I just think it's -- otherwise, why have liaisons?
That's the way I look at it. I mean --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If memory serves me
correctly, we served notice on the City about the
cancellation or not renewing the existing contract -- I
forgot how we phrased it -- over a year ago, prior to last
budget year, and that got stonewalled and dropped through
the cracks because we didn't meet with the City last year.
So, I believe that notification was in place, but --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I guess my concern
comes in --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Am I right, Judge?
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, I agree with that.
I mean, I agree with what Commissioner Nicholson said. I
guess my issue or concern goes as much into -- really into
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Open Meetings violations. If we have too many people, but
not the full Court, negotiating, I think we're getting into
trouble. I think -- you know, that's just how I look at it,
you know. I see Rex staring at me or glaring at me; I'm not
sure. And, you know, I personally think that if we appoint
an EMS -- Baldwin and Nicholson to, you know, meet with the
staff and come back with a recommendation to the Court, I
don't think that's a violation, but as soon as we start --
as soon as I start getting involved, that's three of us
negotiating that; I think it gets a little bit more
questionable. So, anyway, those are all my concerns.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Let me ask you,
Commissioner, the -- I think all -- a lot of us are seeing
the airport as a model of one way to work cooperatively and
productively together, and there's two of you working on
that. And we don't -- that's the way it's always been. We
don't see that as a violation of the --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, we started that
by court assignment. By court assignment. That was when we
first sat down with them, worked out a governance agreement
and operating agreement.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: But when we and
Commissioner Baldwin were assigned by this Court the
responsibility for the EMS contract, we certainly raised a
question about whether two of us working on it was
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appropriate, so I backed out of it, and Commissioner
Baldwin's been --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh. Oh, I didn't know
you backed out. But, either way --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I didn't see it as
any different from the airport.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't think it's a -- I
think as long as -- like, on the airport one, every meeting,
I believe both of us probably attended it, but we didn't
discuss it with other members of the Court. Whenever there
was any discussion beyond between Bill and I, it was done in
the full court. My concern comes is that I thought --
actually, I didn't know that you removed yourself from EMS.
My concern was on the EMS one, that you had Nicholson and
Baldwin doing it; all of a sudden, the Judge was sending
letters also. Well, then there's three people negotiating,
and I think that's a violation. So, I just think it's --
you know, we either need to use liaisons or we need to use
the Court as a whole. I just --
JUDGE TINLEY: I'm -- what was I negotiating?
I'm having a hard time figuring that out.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, it was terms of the
contract and requesting information. And --
JUDGE TINLEY: On the EMS?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah.
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JODGE TINLEY: I just asked a pretty good
litany of questions. We had us a joint meeting, and we were
each instructed to -- whatever questions we had concerning
the information furnished, to direct those questions to the
City Manager. And I assumed that each of us, if we had
individual questions, would direct them to the City Manager
as per the meeting. I copied everybody else with my letter.
But I merely asked questions, I wasn't negotiating any
deals. I -- with regard to the letter that I received on
the library from the then City Manager, that letter was
directed to me. It concerned initially some communication
received from Commissioner Nicholson, and I was responding
to a letter directed to me. I -- I staffed that letter,
that response, a draft of it before it was sent out, with
everybody that was reasonably available, and before I sent
it out, because I was concerned about the general tenor of
the letter. That letter did not contain anything that -- in
my opinion, that I wasn't authorized to speak on behalf of
the Court for to the extent that I indicated I was speaking
on behalf of the Court.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess what I'm saying
is that -- maybe the problem's with the City. Maybe the
City needs to be told they need to deal with the liaison and
not the County Judge. Because, I mean, I just see -- you
know, I know that on the EMS issue, and -- 'cause I happened
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to visit with the City Manager on another issue, and he --
this came up. And I said to me, it's confusing, I mean,
receiving letters from multiple people. We pass a court
order that says we're doing it this way. Then, all of a
sudden, letters come from another -- from another member of
the Court. And, to me, it should -- we need to be
consistent. Either we should use the liaison or we
shouldn't. I think I -- you know, the library, if I've got
an issue on that, to me, I look at Commissioner Nicholson,
you know, especially on this contract. Once we get into
this contract negotiation, if I have a question, sure, I
might call the City Manager. I might call Antonio. I mean,
I don't think they want me to call Antonio, but I think that
the -- we need to use the liaison system. And I think that
when we're doing these contract negotiations, if we get a
third member -- and we have two appointees or one appointee,
if we start getting other members of the Court involved, I
think we start crossing the line on Open Meetings.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which raises a
question I'd like to direct to the County Attorney. Your
opinion that you wrote and provided all of us with copies of
recently talked about your belief that two Commissioners --
appointed by the Court, I assume; not just ad hoc, but
appointed by the Court -- assigned to a particular task, in
your view, constituted a potential for a violation. Is that
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correct? Was that correct phraseology? A potential for a
violation of Open Meetings?
MR. EMERSON: That's correct, based on --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Of Open Meeting law?
MR. EMERSON: Based on an A.G. opinion, yes,
sir.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And nothing has
happened subsequent to your writing that in terms of
Attorney General's opinion that -- that changes the dynamics
of that?
MR. EMERSON: No, sir, there's no subsequent
opinion that addresses that issue, that would mediate it one
way or another. Now, I think the difference in the two
issues that -- that Commissioner Nicholson was just talking
about is that with the Airport Board, y'all's meetings are
all open records.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm.
MR. EMERSON: And where this originally came
up on the other issue was, it was going to be a closed
meeting between two Commissioners and a representative of
the City to discuss the contracts, and that was where a big
part of the problem was.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I think --
MR. EMERSON: Now -- and the advice --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I want to draw you
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out on that one point. So, if we were to do again what we
did in setting up our -- our meetings and negotiations which
led to governance documents, interlocal agreements,
contracts and so forth with respect to the airport, if we
were to duplicate that process again, and the meetings were
conducted as they were for the airport, two members of this
body with two members of City Council, with staff, all out
in the open, does that constitute a problem?
MR. EMERSON: Not conducted in open, posted
meetings, no, sir.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: They weren't posted
meetings, though. They were -- I mean --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They weren't posted.
No, that's right, they were not posted.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think the --
MR. EMERSON: The problem is, it's a gray
line that's not clear one way or another. What the A.G.
opinion says is that because there's only five of y'all
sitting up there, if two of you -- and this is
hypothetically speaking, so I don't mean to offend anybody.
If two of you go to a meeting and you come back and you both
say that, you know, that table was purple, and we've decided
that table is purple and we want you to vote on it being
purple, because you're so definitively on the same page, the
odds are that at least one of the other three is going to go
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with you on it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Rubber stamp?
MR. EMERSON: And it's rubber-stamping.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That doesn't happen
here, in my opinion.
MR. EMERSON: But it's not -- it's never been
tested in court.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. Well, it
certainly didn't happen --
MR. EMERSON: The A.G. opinion is sitting
there, but so far nobody's challenged it, or at least I
couldn't find a court case with it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That certainly didn't
happen in the situation with the negotiations with the City
on the airport, because every document was -- was discussed
openly, changes made, ideas input, scrapped, and this and
that and back and forth and back and forth. So, till we
finally had a document that was talked out, everybody could
understand and agree upon, so there was a major difference
there.
MR. EMERSON: I understand.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't think it ever
happens the way the -- the A.G.'s opinion is in this Court.
I mean, I go -- and if Mr. Nicholson had chosen to meet with
us that day, we sat in this room right here and simply
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received the information from the City. There wasn't any
negotiations, wasn't any decisions made, in my mind, at all.
I simply received the information and then thought about
bringing it back to the Court, and did not. But that wasn't
a -- even if I did bring it back to the Court, it would be,
"This is what they said. Let's debate it and decide whether
we want to go that route or not." It wasn't something
that -- and I would never, ever come in here and say I've
made the decision -- "They presented this, and I've made the
decision this is the way it should be. I want you to vote
for it." That never happens, ever.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That would go down in
flames, wouldn't it?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We couldn't agree the
table's purple in here, probably.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I just put it on the
agenda; I don't know whether any action needs to be taken.
I just think, personally, we need to be mindful of the
liaison, that if we ask someone to be a liaison, that person
should be a liaison. And, you know, you have to -- it's a
judgment issue, to me, as to -- if I want to find out, you
know, how many rabies cases have been found out in my
precinct, I don't see any reason to go through Commissioner
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Nicholson on that, but if there's some kind of operational
issue, I think it does need to go through Commissioner
Nicholson.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Dead horse.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: And, Commissioner
Baldwin, the reason -- I think you know, the reason I didn't
even attend that meeting is it could have -- might have
slowed down the process. Absent an opinion that it put us
in jeopardy, I surely would have attended.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You did fine.
JUDGE TINLEY: Let me voice a concern, if I
might. When -- when we were having our joint meeting with
the City, there was concern and I think, to some degree,
frustration expressed about our inability to meet directly
with the people at the City that are involved in those
various functions that -- that we have -- that are jointly
operated or contracted for. I think Commissioner Letz
probably was, as I recall, among the most vocal about not
being able to go directly to the source of the information,
that being the Library Director, for example, but rather
being told that he must direct all of his inquiries or
communications through the City Manager. And, of course, we
take enough flak for lack of communication or what sometimes
is perceived as bad relations with the City leadership. I
think it's mostly lack of communication. Anything that's
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going to -- that's going to further restrict that free and
open communication I think -- I think should be questioned,
freely and as -- as frequently as possible
Certainly, none of us here on this Court --
we know that we're not free to make any commitments, cut any
deals, but I don't think that any of us individually should
be put in a position, if approached by anyone in City
leadership, for example, or anyone else having a legitimate
interest in it, and we're engaged about a particular subject
that we're not the, quote, liaison for that particular
subject, that we should say, Hold the phone here, folks,
you're going to need to talk to Commissioner Nicholson or
Commissioner Letz or whomever. I don't -- I don't think
that's conducive	to open government.	What you're	doing	is
channeling all of	your information and	expertise	and --	and
then recommendation through that particular individual, and
I think you're probably more open to a rubber-stamp
allegation than you would be otherwise. I think it's a
matter of having the ability to use good judgment, to listen
to what's being said, to respond to what's being said, to
keep the discussion open and on the mark, but not making any
commitments. Certainly, any of us are free to express our
individual opinion; we do it all the time. But I just don't
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want to be hamstrung with being under any sort of a
directive, enforceable or otherwise, that tells me that if
someone in City leadership or otherwise wants to engage me
about a subject that I'm not the designated liaison about,
that I can't talk to them. And I'm just probably not going
to pay attention to it if I am so directed.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I think --
JUDGE TINLEY: Hate to be that blunt, but --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But you're going to -- if
you -- if the Court has voted to put an individual, whether
it be you or any one of us five up here, as kind of the
person to get with the staff and come back to this Court
with a recommendation, and another member of this body
starts negotiating one-on-one with them over on the side,
that's a problem. I think that if -- I don't have any -- I
mean, certainly, any one of us can talk with any member of
City staff about any issue at any time, and if it starts
getting into the area of -- you know, we're negotiating a
contract, I think it needs to be brought back to this Court.
JUDGE TINLEY: No question.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Otherwise, I think --
because if you're getting input, and then that input goes to
Commissioner Williams and I'm not part of that, I think
that's a problem. I think it's an Open Meetings problem,
and I think it's a problem on the workings of this Court,
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you know. So -- but I think you need to use your judgment,
or any of us use our judgment that if, out of this
conversation, something's come up that's meaningful that the
whole Court needs to be aware of, I think it needs to be
handled in the full Court.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything that's going to
commit the County and this Court certainly needs to be done
right here.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I think that when
we're doing a specific thing like a contract negotiation on
a topic, I think, as much as possible during that period,
that one Commissioner that's been assigned, or two
Commissioners, need to try to come be the point person and
come back to the Court as a whole when there's a question.
That's when I think -- you know, I think you do have to look
at and use judgment on it, but I think that there are times
when you really need to let the liaison come back with a
draft plan, or liaison come back and say, "Hey, I don't want
to do this any more; let somebody else do it," you know. I
think that's probably more than enough said, at least from
my standpoint.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I see it a
little bit different from the way the Judge sees it. If --
if the head guru over at the City called me and wanted to
talk about the airport, I would probably listen to a certain
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extent, but as far as carrying on a detailed conversation, I
would not even get into it. I would tell him that he had to
talk to one of you guys, is the way I would -- it's not
shoving my responsibility; it's just that's the way the
thing, in my opinion, works.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think that's the
way it works.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. That's when your
judgment would tell you this is getting into an area --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: -- of maybe refining or
defining policy. And --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's right. That's
correct, mm-hmm.
JUDGE TINLEY: Sure.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm out of there.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything further on that item?
Let's go to Item 23, request approval of resolution to veto
H.B. 2438. Where's our Tax Assessor? Collecting taxes
somewhere, I hope.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, we're --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, her point is
well-taken in this letter.
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I agree. I
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agree with the resolution.
JUDGE TINLEY: Is that a motion?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is.
JODGE TINLEY: All right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded in
support of the resolution to veto House Bill 2438. Any
question or discussion?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And authorize County
Judge to sign?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And -- well, it's
passed the legislative, but it's not vetoing it. Original
goes to the governor.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Right. It -- yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or
discussion? All in favor of the motion signify by raising
your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry.
What's your pleasure, gentlemen, on these next three items?
Do you want to defer them and go straight to reports? How
do you want to handle that?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: My initial question is,
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why are they executive session?
JUDGE TINLEY: Contracts, negotiation.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess I've never viewed
these as executive session, I mean, items. They've always
been done in --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Want to go ahead and
get into 24 and 25? I can clear that up pretty quick.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Why -- well, go
ahead, clear it up.
JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go with 24, consider and
discuss the library contract.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Call them both at
the same time.
JUDGE TINLEY: I'll call 25 also, consider
and discuss Animal Control contract. Commissioner
Nicholson?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Based on advice from
the County Attorney and my desire not to be the first
elected official in Kerr County in 149 years to go to jail,
I don't have anything to offer on these two issues.
(Laughter.)
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Get the County Judge
to write a letter.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON
jail, I'm good with that.
If he wants to go to
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JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's -- I'm
serious. I talked to the County Attorney this morning, and
he advised me that -- that discussing contract negotiations
strategy in closed session might be problematic in terms of
Open Meetings Act, so I don't have any more to offer on
that. We're at the same place we were last time we talked.
We advised the City on January 28th that we wanted to
renegotiate the Animal Control contract. We haven't heard
from them. And all of you know the status of the library
contract. Same -- same sort of situation.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Have you visited with the
City Manager at all on either of these to know when we may
be getting a response?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I haven't.
JUDGE TINLEY: I think the documentation on
the letter that I got from the City Manager said that when
they got those numbers available, they'd be furnished. Now,
with regard to the Animal Control, I forwarded to the City
Manager what Commissioner Nicholson forwarded to me for
their information, which is the last three years, I believe,
Commissioner? On operations?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Right.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Appears to me, with the
amount of time we've not talked about these two contracts,
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we probably could have resolved them.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Well, it sort of
strikes at what the Interim City Manager seemed to be saying
this morning, that there's a difference in relationships
depending upon whether you're a partner or a supplier of
services. The City has told us that -- that we have not met
our responsibility to provide a new library contract. I
don't think that's -- I'm working on the library contract,
but I don't think that's our duty. They're the one that
owns the library, and they're the ones that are inviting
financial participation in it. It's kind of -- kind of
unusual, I think, to ask the customer to provide the
contract.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would jump at the
opportunity for us to write that contract.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Thanks to the County
Attorney, I've got a draft that's well underway.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'd give them a draft
in a heartbeat.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: It's well underway,
and with the work done last year by Commissioner Williams,
we're doing that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think my view on -- or
take on what he was trying to say was that on the three that
we're partners, we've got to work together, whether we like
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it or not. On the ones that we're not partners, we can wave
at each other and see them down the road and not ever deal
with them again on that topic. Hopefully that won't happen
on any of these; I think it's not in the taxpayers' best
interests. But, you know, that's the way he looks at it,
which I don't really understand the benefit, but ...
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's all I've got
on 24 and 25, Judge.
DODGE TINLEY: Item 26, consider and discuss
EMS contract. As indicated this morning, that was put on
there as a safety valve measure. I've got nothing to offer
on it. If anybody else does, step up. Okay, that brings us
to Item 27, reports from departments. Animal Control?
MS. ROMAN: Hello. Well, as you all know,
I've had a few obstacles come my way, few minor problems.
They have been resolved, and successfully resolved, so all
is well and everything's pretty much back on track. I have
made a few changes in the way we handle money transactions,
things of that nature. A few other changes in working a
little closer with the local veterinarians and rescue
groups. As far as my budget, I'm pretty much on track
there. I have made a few changes, changed uniform
companies. And Rusty will be glad to know, I changed
patches. The uniforms that I'm currently getting, we should
get them next week. They're the navy blue -- navy blue
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pants with the white security shirts, saving me about $800
per year. Employees. At the moment, I have three employees
besides myself. I am short one officer. I am taking my
time on -- on hiring another officer. I am changing a few
things as far as the screening process of -- of new
employees. Long-term projects and goals, I've got numerous,
the first being to have a full-time, honest, dependable
staff. Replace outdoor kennels. Looking into grants for
expansion of -- of the animal shelter, and basically working
closer with other organizations such as the H.A.R.T.
Foundation, Humane Society, things like that.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Janie, can you give
us some idea of your opinion about forecasting the future?
How long will it be before we find that our capacity of our
current facility is insufficient for us to meet state law?
MS. ROMAN: We're getting very close. Very
close. This time of year especially, we are just overloaded
with animals. Our euthanasia rate has gone down quite a
bit, simply because we're working closer with other
organizations and adopting these animals out, such as rescue
ranches, rescue groups, things like that. This time of year
it's really tough on us, because we -- we're such a small
facility. With the amount of animals coming in, we just
don't -- don't have the space available.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The statistics, do
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they still show more activity within the city limits than it
is in the county?
MS. ROMAN: Yes. Yes. The -- and I didn't
bring those with me. I just assumed that Commissioner
Nicholson had those.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's okay. I just
wanted to know if we're still holding the --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: It's about 60
Kerrville, 40 County.
MS. ROMAN: Right.
JUDGE TINLEY: Is it trending more or staying
pretty steady?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: My recollection,
it's been fairly steady.
MS. ROMAN: It's been fairly steady. Yes, it
has. So, any other questions?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- on the expansion,
which has been a topic for many, many years, that's a need
out there, is that something that we can probably do
in-house through trustees at the jail -- or inmates at the
jail, rather?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Sure.
MS. ROMAN: That would be great.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. I mean, we have a
work force out there. Some of those materials -- I mean,
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materials are not that expensive, and you might look at that
in your budget at least, to get a larger --
MS. ROMAN: We definitely have room for
expansion. As a matter of fact, on one side of the
building -- I don't know how many of you have been out
there, but we do have some -- like, a garage-type door that
has double doors that open, and I believe that was built
that way so that we could have room for -- for expansion.
At the moment, like I said, I am looking into getting six
newer outdoor runs. The ones that we currently have have
been there approximately five years. They're pretty run
down; they don't look good. Two of them aren't -- we're not
able to use them because they're in pretty bad shape, so I'm
looking into purchasing new -- new outdoor runs.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: On those, you might get
with -- you know, I don't know the design. It may be
cheaper to build them.
MS. ROMAN: It could very well be.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, it just depends
on -- but I think with your knowledge of that facility, it
may be helpful to help design some that are -- or if the
Sheriff can provide the labor to build them, that -- you
know, I know that on chain link, the bottom chain link
always gets torn up, so if you put a double row -- you can
put, like, a 2-foot piece of heavy-duty something or other
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above it, something that will be easier to maintain without
redoing the whole thing.
MS. ROMAN: The ones that we currently have
are more -- they're not chain link; they're more like cattle
-- built out of the cattle panel material, so they're a
little bit more sturdy. And we have over -- it's not a tull
tarp; it's more like a -- like, just a shade material. It's
pretty sturdy that we have up there to keep animals from
climbing out, because believe it or not, we have quite a few
animals that can just easily climb out. So -- but, yeah,
there's -- that's something we can definitely sit down and
discuss.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
MS. ROMAN: Anything further?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. Appreciate it.
MS. ROMAN: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Mr. Walston,
Extension Office.
MR. WALSTON: Thank you. Good to see y'all
again this afternoon. I'm not real sure exactly what type
of report you want. I -- I'm glad to be able to offer my --
my report. I hope y'all are all aware of the county travel
report that we turn in monthly, and I -- the question is as
to whether that's handled the way you'd like. Is there a
way -- I think now it's turned in to the clerk's office. I
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don't know if that's -- it needs to be turned in to the
Judge's secretary or -- it's basically a monthly travel
report that tells you day-to-day what we do and how many
miles we travel and how many people we see. If we can -- if
that's satisfactory with y'all, I mean, I can do it either
way.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's fine. We get a
copy of it. I mean, we get -- there's no change, I don't
think, in that area.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What's fine?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: The reports they turn in
right now.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Turn it in to us.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: They turn it in to the
Clerk.
MR. WALSTON: It's going in to the clerk
right now.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, it comes in with
our monthly reports.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's okay.
MR. WALSTON: I mean, if that's -- that's the
main thing. I'd like to get -- I'd like for y'all to see
what we do. I mean, I think -- I want to keep y'all as
aware and informed as to the -- you know, the amount of work
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and the work that we're getting done, 'cause I feel like
that's a -- a real important issue as far as -- you know, if
it's not getting to you, I want to get it to you one way or
another, if I send you an e-mail or whatever. So, I realize
y'all may not have time to see them every time, but if you
do have time, I want you to be able to have access to it.
Just to give you a little bit of rundown as
to kind of where we're sitting there in the Extension
Office, currently we have our -- we're a strongly
volunteer-based driven office. We have, with our various
different Extension Program council committees, about 50
people working on those committees right now that help us to
be our directive force behind our program, in identifying
the different educational programs, field days, issues,
areas where we feel like we need to be addressing. We work
with those committees on a year-round basis, and so a lot of
the educational programs we're going to be talking about
deals with as far as the group that I work with, the Agnet
Resource and Wildlife Committee. We also have a
Family/Consumer Science and a 4-H and Youth Committee, and
also an Executive Board. And so that's -- that's the
overall Extension Program council group that we work with.
And, like I say, there's about 50 volunteers on that. We
have right at 75 master gardeners in our Master Gardener
program right now that are serving diligently as we speak
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answering questions, phone calls, office visits, and helping
me out a lot, enabling them to learn more about that.
That's part of their learning process, is answering phone
calls and answering questions. And I spend a considerable
amount of my time helping them learn about that. So --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want to ask you
something about that. Is 75 master gardeners -- is that
normal? That sounds like a lot of people for a small
county.
MR. WALSTON: That's three classes.
JUDGE TINLEY: Huh?
MR. WALSTON: We do 25 to a class, and this
is the third class, so we've trained 75. Now, those that
are actually active, participating -- as you can imagine,
some of that first group, they're still members and they're
still enrolled as master gardeners. They may not work as
much as they did the first year, but they're still
participating. So, in order -- you have to have a certain
percentage that you're going to lose every year, but they're
still on the rolls, and they still -- if you call them and
need help, you can still get some help. So, it's -- it is a
good many. And with what we're going to be looking at in
the next two years, they're looking at hosting the state
Master Gardener meeting, and that's going to be bringing in
about 600 master gardeners from around the state of Texas.
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Wow. Fill up all the
hotel rooms so that the city makes more money.
MR. WALSTON: You bet you. So, you know,
that's something that they're -- it's -- I think it's
something that's going to be a real driving program for
them, that's going to really pull the group together.
It's -- this is the third year of this group of master
gardeners, so they're really still in their infant stages of
getting organized and learning some organizational skills
and management, but it's really a good group to work with.
And thanks to y'all with our greenhouse and a lot of y'all's
support, we really got this group going, and I think they're
really going to be able to -- I couldn't do without them, as
far as horticulture work. You know, in a county this size
and the amount of horticulture questions and calls you get
in, it's vital. I mean, without them -- without
horticulturalists, it'd be a full-time job, me sitting there
answering phone calls. So --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: When do they meet?
MR. WALSTON: The master gardeners? They
meet the first Wednesday of every month.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Wednesday out there?
MR. WALSTON: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- if you remember,
or Kathy remembers, I might want to go to that. Awhile
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back, the Court appointed me to develop some sort of a tree
plan for the courthouse square, and that sounds like a great
project for the master gardeners.
MR. WALSTON: I'm sure they'd be glad to.
And, you know, we're also looking at starting a junior
master gardener program this summer. And Faye Drozd, which
is currently our president of master gardeners, is going to
be instrumental in getting that junior master gardener
program going. I'm sure they'd be glad to help out however
they can.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: First Wednesday.
MR. WALSTON: As far as -- as far as another
group that y'all are very well familiar with, as far as our
4-H concern, just to give you a little bit of an average --
an idea as to what we actually have in Kerr County, we're
running 15 4-H clubs. That includes both community 9-H
clubs as well as project clubs, such as our horse project,
our shooting sports, and which we're just now starting a new
BB gun project, and it's taken off. We've got a lot of
interest, a lot of parents in it. So, our BB gun project
has taken off. We also --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, is that -- who got
involved -- what caused the BB project to get started?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that Arthur Nagle?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that Arthur Nagle?
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MR. WALSTON: Well, actually, it's been
trying to get started for several years.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I know Arthur's been
trying.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is this the one
Mr. Nagle brought to our --
MR. WALSTON: Laurinda has been trying to get
the fire going in it for a while, and about the time Arthur
was interested in getting in it, you know, we -- we had some
other parents that came around, and so it -- you know, it
kind of developed. And Mr. Nagle was -- you know, his
timing was probably pretty handy, so the publicity sure
didn't hurt to -- to stir up some interest in it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: He did.
MR. WALSTON: So, we've got parents involved,
and they're currently shooting out at the -- at the Rose
Ranch. And the Olympic Shooting Sports Committee is very
excited that the 9-H air rifle and the BB gun program's
going, so we've got a lot of enthused parents and leaders
and groups that I think will help make this work.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: One more thing. Before,
you mentioned the Rose Ranch.
MR. WALSTON: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do you anticipate the
Olympic Shooting, you know, facility is going to increase or
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give an opportunity to increase some of the shooting sports
in 4-H or anything? I mean --
MR. WALSTON: I think it will. I think it's
going to be a combination of several things, such as getting
involved in increasing the -- the BB gun project. Right now
we've got a trap and skeet program that's got an excellent
group of leaders that are very knowledgeable in coaching and
leadership, and I think it's just -- it's going to be a
combination of some things as far as the 4-H program is
concerned. That -- but I think it's going to increase.
When the -- when kids can go out and see Olympic shooters,
and hopefully get some instruction by Olympic shooters, I
think it would interest me if I was a 14-, 15-, 16-year-old
kid to get an opportunity to have that kind of help.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: How young are kids that
get involved with the trap and skeet or BB shooting?
MR. WALSTON: Nine.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Nine?
MR. WALSTON: Just barely big enough to hold
up a gun. We got -- as a matter of fact, we've got some
small guns that are cut down and are small for them. And
that's why we think the BB gun project is going to help us
get those kids and get the safety -- all the safety aspects
covered under the same -- same gamut. So, I think we're
going to be able to get a lot -- a lot accomplished and
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speed up some of the other areas. Our rifle project, I
think by moving it out to the Rose Ranch after this last
year and some problems with the ventilation system, not
being able to shoot where we've been shooting, I think
having it out there and having the whole 4-H shooting sports
complex at one facility will help build the whole thing.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Roy, does this mean
that all 4-H shooting programs now either have been or will
be moved out to Red Rose Ranch?
MR. WALSTON: That's the plan.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good.
MR. WALSTON: That's the plan. The rifle
program is -- will be the last one, and we'll get it
gathered up this next spring in facilities out there, and
seeing kind of what we've got. It's -- we're still in the
process of getting the facility ready and getting the rifle
range, so as soon as it's ready, we'll be moving out there.
Like I say, we've got 15 4-H clubs. We have a little over
300, 400 members, little over 100 certified leaders in our
9-H clubs. And, you know, as you can
club managers and projects leaders, t]
what makes our 4-H program clear.
As far as -- since I'm
I'll go ahead and finish up with that
kind of this morning our glory of our
imagine, through our
nose folks are really
on the 4-H program,
part of it. Y'all saw
state 4-H Roundup,
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which is part of an area that I take a lot of pride in and I
put a lot of emphasis on, and that's an opportunity to take
senior 4-H'ers to College Station and spend three or four
days competing and meeting kids from all over the state.
And this year with that group, we were able to get all three
teams across the stage and be recognized in the first or
second -- in the top three teams. We had an opportunity to
take the third-place wool team to the national contest this
next week, and I declined it because of the fact if -- if
you ever take that group of kids to the national contest,
they can only go once, and so I didn't feel like they were
quite ready. And when we go, we want to be able to have a
chance to win it, and so hopefully next year we'll be ready
to -- ready to go.
Another area that is something that's new
that we're starting up -- and, actually, we did it this last
year; it's called a B.C.I., and I mentioned that this
morning and I realized I didn't explain what it was. It's
Building Community Inclusion, and it's a state program that
is basically bringing -- it's about bringing kids out of the
community and getting them involved in our 4-H programs,
like the Salvation Army group that we worked with this year
after school. It's an after-school program. We worked with
them on character building, and we worked with them and met
with that group of kids, which is primarily, I believe,
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third and fourth graders -- second, third, and fourth
graders, about that age group. And we took our council kids
and let them have the opportunity to work with those kids
on -- about building character and what all the different
character development aspects, and we were able to include
and get some of those kids involved in our 4-H program.
I believe there was about a half dozen of
them that had signed up for 9-H since we started meeting
with them. That started off from a grant that we were able
to get -- Laurinda applied for and got, and now she also has
the $500 grant from the 4-H Foundation that she's going to
have, too. So, that's kind of where we're targeting and
putting a lot of emphasis, with Laurinda's expertise in the
4-H program assistant position and spending some more time
in working in community involvement and bringing kids into
the 4-H program through community involvement programs. One
-- another program that that group will be working with
is -- is a fishing derby coming up here in July, July 5th
and 6th. They're going to have 12 fishing derbies, and one
of which will be involving that Salvation Army group and
letting them give -- get an opportunity to work with those
council kids.
Just to change gears a little bit, let me
tell you a little bit of what we've been doing on our ag
side of the program. Just this past month, we had a
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multi-county meat goat field day which brought in about 85
producers. Really had a good turnout. Spent an evening
just talking about production meat goats, management plan
identification. Talked to Bob Dittmar; he was able to help
demonstration that our Horticulture Committee -- actually,
our Ag Committee worked on, and it's a program that they've
had for three years, and some pecan grafting. We had about
95, and that's also a multi-county program that we work with
Bandera County on. I believe in early May we had a turf
grass or home lawn program that we involved -- brought in
about 35 individuals and visited with them for an evening on
management and care of turf grass, and that was in hopes of
curtailing some questions and some problems that we might
get into this summer with some lawn care problems. So,
hopefully we were able to help out some homeowners there.
A program that I started last year was the
Hill Country Living 101 program. Y'all may have heard --
heard a little bit about that. It's basically geared
towards new landowners that are moving into the hill country
area, so that they can learn a little bit more about -- and
because a lot of these people, as you can imagine, are
coming from Houston, Dallas, Fort Worth, and are not
familiar with the different parts of the hill country. And
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with that, we -- we come in; we have them in there. Not --
they do not realize all the different agencies that are
available to them free of charge. Who do they go to if
they've got problems? If they've got cedar that they want
to control, they hear about our cedar control program, if
they need help with whatever, so we talk about some
different agency issues. Get a lot of plant identification
and range work, as well as some information. Just spend a
lot of time on site evaluations and getting out in the
country and letting them see what's out there with some --
with some hands-on, where we were able to kind of hold their
hand and explain some of that to them.
July the 26th, I've got a rangeland
restoration program coming up. It's going to be out at the
Shin Oak Ranch out in west Kerr County, and we're going to
spend all day out there talking about rangeland restoration,
watershed management, brush management, possibly talk a
little bit -- we're going to discuss hopefully some
information on fire control burning and some things like
that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Roy, it appears to me --
I don't want to pick on west Kerr County; they need all the
help they can get out there, but it appears that a lot of
the prescribed burning and things that -- programs you're
talking about are hosted more out in west Kerr County, and
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it's just a long ways to go for a lot of people in east Kerr
County. Is there a way that we can divide them, have west
Kerr County and then the same topic in east Kerr County?
MR. WALSTON: Well, if we can find the time
to do it, we could.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just work a little bit
longer hours.
MR. WALSTON: There's only 24 of them in a
day, and that's about all I can get. And the reason this
one is -- the reason we're having this one -- and a lot of
times the reason we have a particular field day or something
in an area has to do with facilities, or a group of -- in
this case, a group of landowners that have been working on a
particular rangeland restoration program, and so we're able
to go out there and see some of what they've been doing
brush management-wise, endangered species-wise, wildlife,
and we're able to kind of target it in that area. I mean,
that's -- regardless of where it's at, that's where -- I
mean, if it's -- the site is what's drawing the people,
we're having it there. It's a program that Steve Bauer has
had some funding available to where he could go in. They've
got some grants out there that they can do some brush work
on, and so he said that he had a landowner that had a
facility to do it. As far as any other year, next year, I'd
like to have a program similar to this every year, and I'd
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like to -- you know, i_` there's a place in east Kerr County
or wherever that has done some work that we could go out and
tour and see, I'd be glad to do it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm sure I can find one
for you.
MR. WALSTON: Let me know, 'cause a lot of
times I'm looking for places, because that's -- that's what
we like to see. I know our Hill Country Living 101, the
Holekamps -- we've used their facility, their place, toured
it several times, because they -- they're such gracious
hosts, and the range work that he has done has been helpful.
So, that just gives you a little bit of an idea. Of course,
you can imagine this time of year we're getting ready to buy
projects and getting ready for the 4-H projects for this
next year, and we've been putting a lot of miles doing --
trying to qet project animals selected for this next year's
group of 4-Hers. So, any questions?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Roy, what is the
status of the specialist position?
MR. WALSTON: Our F.C.S. position?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir.
MR. WALSTON: Our Family/Consumer Science
position, they reannounced it. We have -- seems like every
time we reannounce it, we get new applicants. You know, you
think you'd get them all applied, but, you know, I go to
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them; I say, "Well, why didn't you apply the first time?"
We -- you know, but we've got several new applicants,
completely new ones. So I think, you know, we'll go through
the process and -- and see what applicants, you know, show
up, and then go from there, and let you know what -- what
we've got out there.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Super.
MR. WALSTON: I'm excited about the ones
we've got now. I think it may have been all for the better.
So, it's going to -- I think there's -- there's, like I say,
a completely new group, and hopefully we'll know something
next month or so.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Fantastic. Thank you.
MR. WALSTON: Thank y'all.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else for Mr. Walston?
Thank you, sir.
MR. WALSTON: Appreciate it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Appreciate you being here
today.
MR. WALSTON: Uh-huh.
JUDGE TINLEY: Environmental Health. P9iguel?
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir. Good afternoon. I
got a few reports by precinct, because at the end of one of
the reports, it's sorted by precinct. The rest of the
report's all the same. Okay. First thing I'd like to talk
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about is the budget. I think we're okay; we're on track on
the budget. The only item that we're running out a little
bit is on the postage, so we -- we're mailing a lot of
letters, so I'd like to request in the future, probably next
Commissioners Court, a budget amendment for postage out of a
couple places; we have some extra money there that we can
use. Also would like to put a little bit more money in the
lab, and I think you have that in your packets there. It's
just, you know, information. But other than that, the
budget's going okay. I don't see any special needs or
special requirements on it. The first page that you might
have in your report is the organizational chart for the
department. That's basically how we're running it right
now. We created a -- a position last year; it's a part-time
position in Solid Waste, and we're hoping to get that as a
full-time this year -- or next budget. That's basically the
way we've been running. Any questions on that one?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Your department now
is six people?
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir, it's six including
myself.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Pardon?
MR. ARREOLA: Six including me.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Including yourself?
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir.
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COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Two of them
part-time.
MR. ARREOLA: Two of them are part-times.
Okay. We did the job evaluation for all the employees.
Everything looks good; they're doing what they're supposed
to. I just have one question on one of them, the O.S.S. F.
inspector. When that was hired, I think that the name of
the -- of the position name, it's a little different than
what they're doing. It was called the administrative clerk,
and actually it's an O.S.S.F. inspector. The job
description I have for them is O.S.S.F. inspector, and the
job evaluation is based on that. And that's a conflict, if
we need to change that to inspector.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: You have two inspectors
or one inspector?
MR. ARREOLA: I do inspections, too.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So you have an inspector,
so the one that you list as O.S.S. F. --
MR. ARREOLA: O.S.S.F.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- inspector is actually
listed as a clerk?
MR. ARREOLA: Yes. It's called
administrative clerk. I can give you copies of how it is in
there.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it -- I mean --
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COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: This is the person
that, when we set up this and brought some people over, we
said are you willing to -- can you learn to --
MR. ARREOLA: Yes.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do both.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Do both.
DODGE TINLEY: Cross-train.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I think that's what
it is.
MR. ARREOLA: And that's the only one that
the job evaluation hasn't been done. I have it done, but it
wasn't signed yet, 'cause I want to get that clear, if we
need to change it or we can leave it the way it is.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, y'all confused
me a little bit, which is easy to do this time of the day.
I'm -- I think that person needs to be identified properly.
If that person's an inspector, and we don't have inspectors
in our makeup, we need to create an inspector. But if we're
leaving that person as an inspector-slash-clerk, I mean,
I -- I don't -- I'm not real firm on that, then. But if
this person is an inspector, we need to have a line --
Inspector line.
MR. ARREOLA: I'm going to give you a copy of
what it is on the Treasurer's format, how they have it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, you'd think that
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the -- have you talked with the personnel director? The
county --
MR. ARREOLA: I haven't had a chance.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: She's next door.
MR. ARREOLA: Yeah, but she wasn't there that
day, and I just found out about this last week. I didn't
know -- we didn't have access to those files at the
beginning.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: The title -- the
title ought to reflect the job duties, certainly.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, absolutely.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: But just in that
regard, we'll have an opportunity to talk about this more in
budget proceedings.
MR. ARREOLA: And --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: We started off with
three and a half people --
MR. ARREOLA: Yes.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: -- two years ago,
and now we've got the equivalent full-time of six.
MR. ARREOLA: Five full-time.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Five. Equivalent
full-time of five. That's a lot of growth.
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's something we
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need to talk about in budget time. We're kind of going the
wrong direction from what we're hoping for and expecting.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, you think we ought
to address this during the budget process, huh? Is that --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I think so.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I do too.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we need to change
it, but budget process is when we need to do it.
MR. ARREOLA: Okay. Hold the job evaluation
until we get it cleared? Okay.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I don't know how
you do that, 'cause the job evaluation --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Not the evaluation,
no.
MR. ARREOLA: In the next page of that --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I wouldn't hold the
job evaluation if I were you. But --
MR. ARREOLA: Okay. Even though it shows to
be a different title?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: The title is -- the pay
and the grade stay the same. Same step and grade, I think.
MR. ARREOLA: Okay.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's listed right now as
O.S.S.F. Administrator/Field Representative. Field
representative, to me, is the same as inspector.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sure.
MR. ARREOLA: Is this --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But if you want to change
responsibilities and change step and grade, that will be
done, you know, during the --
MR. ARREOLA: No.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: You're not? I just think
we need to maybe clean up the job title.
MR. ARREOLA: Change the job title, that's
all. Okay, the next one you have in there is basically the
activity on O.S.S.F. on the septic systems each quarter;
it's by the quarter. We have just the -- the income revenue
in the department, how many applications to construct we
have issued, and the number of inspections. Every quarter
is going up a little more. We're projecting to have the
better quarter -- best quarter of the year this quarter that
we're running right now. The information we have there is
only for the two months that we have so far in the quarter.
Have any questions on that? And the next one is basically
the same with all the numbers in there in revenue, how we
did last year and how we're doing this year. The last four
months is just projected, how we think it's going to go.
The little chart, you know, shows we can't really trust what
happened last year to happen this year. Last year's was
very unpredictable, I guess economy and election time and
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all of that. In our department, it depends a lot on how the
economy goes. That's how we grow or don't grow.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Miguel, what's the
difference in the red and the green line?
MR. ARREOLA: It's one year and the other
year.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Which one's which?
MR. ARREOLA: The green line is last year,
Fiscal Year '04, and the red line is Fiscal Year 'O5.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Instead of Series 1
and 2, that's '04 and 'O5; would that be correct?
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir, mm-hmm. Series 1 is
'04, Series 2 is '05. The last -- last four months, like I
said, is just projected. Last year we went very sharp down,
last four months. Any question on that one?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No questions. Move
forward.
MR. ARREOLA: Move forward, okay. Last part
of the report is Solid Waste. The chart that you have in
there with the purple and blue is basically what we've been
doing in Solid Waste. Number of cases are on top, how many
we have closed of those, how many have been closed by
citations, how many citations we issued, and the number of
cases pending. So, a good number, about 39 percent, have
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been closed with cooperation of the property owners; we
didn't have to issue citations, so it's working out pretty
good. And the last part is just a Solid Waste report; it's
a complete report of all the cases we have open in your
precinct. The last one is by precinct, so you can see in
your precinct how many cases and what type of cases we
handle. We have so far 105 cases this year. We're
predicting about 200 for the year.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
MR. ARREOLA: Any questions?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are you done?
MR. ARREOLA: That's it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: General question.
MR. ARREOLA: Yes?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I hear more and more that
the type of septic systems being installed are aerobic.
Those are the ones with the little sprinklers, right?
MR. ARREOLA: Yes.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Aerobic. And then I hear
in the next breath with people that come in that they don't
like them, and they really hate the maintenance contracts
that go with them. And my -- my response is, we don't tell
you what kind of system you have to put in. But -- but who
is selling the aerobic systems so much? Why are -- you
know, it almost seems that in all the new developments in my
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precinct, they're almost all going in aerobic. And I know a
lot of them are building on top of the hills, so that really
that the consumers are not being totally informed, and I
think it's by the installers, 'cause I don't think it's our
job to -- you know, we approve whatever they submit, or --
you know. Anyway, where is that problem, in your opinion?
Or do you think aerobics aren't a problem?
MR. ARREOLA: Actually, it's going down. It
used to be more. And, yeah, the education of the public is
key. We've been trying to give the homeowner all their
options based on the -- we have a special chart we carry
with us all the time. It shows all the type of systems that
you have available, but that depends on the site. If you
don't have what you need, you can't have conventional. Now,
there's second options that sometimes are very expensive.
And you don't have to have an aerobic, but you have to spend
extra money than what it will cost you for an aerobic. So,
basically, the homeowners' position, we tell them all the
time, "Come to our office; we'll give you all the
information." If they want to take the time to come over,
we'll tell them.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: How often -- or most of
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the time, I'd say average site, do you deal with the
homeowner or the installer?
MR. ARREOLA: Most of the time, it's the
installer.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Installer?
MR. ARREOLA: Mm-hmm. About 80, 75 percent
is installer. The homeowner needs to come to the office,
'cause they need to sign some paperwork, but sometimes they
already have in mind what they want to do. They already
spoke with the installer and they know what they want to do,
but we give them the options all the time, and there's
options there. The number of aerobics is going down. We
don't have as many as we used to.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Good. See if you can
keep that trend going.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If you find somebody
that would like to have their very own aerobic, I have one
that I'd be willing to give up. That thing -- I have three
grandkids and a hunting dog that's not near as expensive as
that thing is. My lord.
MR. ARREOLA: Yeah, they're expensive.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 160 bucks just for a
guy to come by and look at it three times a year.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Really?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. State-mandated.
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MR. ARREOLA: There is options. You can
always have the soil rechecked. In the past -- the rule
changed in 2001. Before then, it was different criteria, so
if you -- if it was installed before 2001, you might want to
have it reevaluated, and there's a chance that you can have
a different system.
JUDGE TINLEY: Who makes the determination of
what type or types of systems can be put on a particular
site?
MR. ARREOLA: It's a person licensed by the
state that's called a site evaluator. It's licensed by
T.C.E.Q., and their responsibility is to go there and look
at everything in the site; the soil, the groundwater,
drainage, everything, and they determine what's the best
system for that location. They're the ones who say that's
it.
JUDGE TINLEY: You can put in this and this
type, but not a -- not these three other types?
MR. ARREOLA: Correct, depending on the site.
JUDGE TINLEY: And are those individuals --
do you have any of those individuals in your office?
MR. ARREOLA: I am one.
JUDGE TINLEY: You are one of them?
MR. ARREOLA: Actually, I'm the only one.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. What about private
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contractors? Are there private contractors available to --
that carry that certification?
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: And do you have some of those
locally?
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir. Yeah, we have a full
list in the office. I am a site evaluator, but I do not do
any determinations. I just basically inspect their job;
that's what I do.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Is site evaluator the
same as the -- what do you call them, designers?
MR. AR.REOLA: No.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. That's a totally
separate designation?
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir. We have three
categories; there are designers, installers, and site
evaluators. There's three different ones.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are -- most private
companies that do installations, do they have all three?
MR. ARREOLA: The big companies do. You
know, when it's just an installer doing business as an
installer only, that's all they have, but the big companies
do have the three normally.
JUDGE TINLEY: Are there any folks that carry
that credential by virtue of some other licensing that they
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have; for example, the professional engineer?
MR. ARREOLA: Mm-hmm.
JUDGE TINLEY: Is that individual given the
same status as a site evaluator?
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: So if they -- a professional
engineer brings a system to you, that's the same as an
approval for that site evaluation, in your opinion?
MR. ARREOLA: Correct, yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
MR. ARREOLA: Engineers are licensed by the
state to do that job with special certification because
they're engineers.
JUDGE TINLEY: Are there any others that
carry that exemption?
MR. ARREOLA: Engineers or site evaluators
only.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: What -- quick question; I
know we're running late today. Since you're a site
evaluator, what if you disagree with what the site evaluator
says? I mean, do you --
MR. ARREOLA: We have done, yes. We just
tell them we don't agree, and if they don't agree with us,
then the State comes up as the next -- they can also bring
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it to your attention. You know, that's a variance, or as
a -- if they think I'm not doing what I'm supposed to. But
normally, the state rule says if you don't agree, they have
to provide proof of us being wrong and bring it to the
State.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And one last question.
How -- I'm trying to figure out if the public is happy with
your job performance, in your opinion, from what you can
tell. I mean, how many complaints do you receive, or is it
up, down, and same? Or do you receive -- or do they not
complain to you, and just grumble out in the public?
MR. ARREOLA: No, I think the public is very
receptive, and they're happy with what we're doing. They
have been far more informed of what we do and why we do it.
Sometimes the installers don't like one position or two, and
they'll bring it to my attention and we'll try to work it
out. So, I think right now the atmosphere is real good.
Everybody's happy. I don't have any complaints, unless you
have some. We have received complaints to investigate, but
not against us. I guess, violations of the Health and
Safety Code.
JUDGE TINLEY: Let me see if I understand
this correctly.
MR. ARREOLA: Mm-hmm.
JUDGE TINLEY: If a -- if a licensed site
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evaluator, or someone who's exempt in that status, approves
a given site for a given type of system, brings it to you
for a permit --
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: -- you have the ability to
veto that?
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TZNLEY: I guess l'm having a hard time
figuring out why you have these guys anyway. Why not just
let you do it?
MR. ARREOLA: State rule.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. And if you say, "Well,
I disagree; I don't think this site is appropriate for the
type of system," then it -- it goes up to the state level?
MR. ARREOLA: It could -- yes, They could
bring it here to you, 'cause you are the authorized agent.
They can bring it to your attention.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
MR. ARREOLA: And if the Court wants to take
a position of overriding our decision, then that's fine. Or
we can go straight to the State and just, you know, bring
the evidence, The State has some specialized people in
that, and they help us a lot. Every time we have a question
or we're not sure, or -- they mediate a lot for us.
JUDGE TINLEY: That's the natural place to
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go, is to the T.C.E.Q. people, isn't it?
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, that's normally what we
do.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Not us.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't know what good
it would do to bring it in here.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Commissioner, I want
to elaborate a little bit on your question about the -- the
public's perception of the performance of O.S.S.F. I've got
a different view than Miguel has, and Miguel and I have
exchanged e-mails on this and have met to talk about it.
And to put that in proper perspective, I kind of reviewed
how we got from where we were to where we are. Three or
four years ago, there was a lot of concern about the way
O.S.S.F. was being administered. A lot of people were
making a lot of noise and demanding change. And the concern
did not deal with the rules, it dealt with how the rules
were being administered. The most common thing we heard in
Commissioners Court and over at the U.G.R.A. and other
public forums was that the administrators were heavy-handed.
That was kind of a code word for administrators that were
not particularly friendly to the users, and maybe sometimes
hostile. And one of the -- there was a number of changes
made because of those concerns and their persistence, and
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one of the things that was probably a direct result of that
was that the O.S.S.F. administration came back to Kerr
County.
And at the time we brought it back, we had
concerns -- and Commissioner Letz and I were heavily
involved with that. We had concerns that it -- there was
sort of a dilemma. The people who were qualified to perform
those kinds of jobs were part of the -- the heavy-handed
administration. So, in discussions in this court and
elsewhere, we talked about the need to make -- bring about a
change; that we wouldn't administer a heavy-handed program.
And we got off to a good start. In fact, Miguel and myself
and quite a number of interested people met once to talk
about some of the issues and decided on some ways to deal
with that to bring about improvement. Now what people are
telling me -- and there are some of them in my precinct, but
there's some of them in your precinct also -- is that it
went pretty well for a year, and now it's reverted back to
the old heavy-handed style that's not user-friendly, that's
sometimes hostile and sometimes unreasonable. So, I've got
a great concern about that performance, and if we converted
back to the old style, I'm not going to be -- I'm not going
to be satisfLed with that.
MR. ARREOLA: Me neither.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: There's another
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corollary issue, and I called this to Miguel's attention the
other day. It has to do with public perception of our
licensed people's involvement with burning. That relates to
Solid Waste. Miguel and I talked this out. It was -- the
names are not important, but we talked about this one
incident, and the bottom line is, Miguel and his other Solid
Waste investigator flipped a U and came back and looked at a
fire -- went by it and saw it, and came back and
investigated a burn.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: "Flipped a U"?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Turned around.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Middle of the street.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've heard of flipping
the bird, but never a U.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: U-turn.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The burn was going on
in the precinct, which the burn ban was suspended, so that
was fine. And when Miguel and his counterpart confronted
the individual, wanted to know what they were doing in
effect and so forth, bottom line was, the burn was quite
legal and they had every right and purpose to be burning.
And after talking with Miguel, I could see where he and his
counterpart had a -- had a possible concern and came back to
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satisfy themselves that there wasn't a deeper issue in terms
of burning; i.e., tires, pieces of pipe --
MR. ARREOLA: Plastics.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- whatever else that
might put carcinogens in the air. Okay, that's kind of the
bottom line. And I guess it gets to the point you just
made. I want you, in the future when you do this, not only
to identify yourself as to who you are and what you are and
why you're there, but help them out. You're only there
to -- you're there just to make certain that there's no
carcinogens, no illegal burning going on. Wish them well,
introduce yourself, give them your card, see if you can be
of service to them; "Here's my number. You call me."
Because, you know, none of us want to get those kind of
calls from somebody who can't understand whether or not it's
heavy-handed, knowing full well that they were doing what
they were doing legally, and why two County agents would
show up, guns a-blazing, if you will, and wondering what the
hell's going on. So, Miguel took it to heart, and I'm sure
he'll correct that.
MR. ARREOLA: Yeah. That is -- that's a
valid concern. What I would like the Court -- or ask the
Court is, when you get a type of compliant or information,
if you don't mind getting our side too, 'cause sometimes
people do say not really what happened. In that particular
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case, you know, I was there, so I know what really was said
and everything. Yeah, we failed to give him our card,
because it was nothing -- it was no problems to investigate.
We didn't need to go back; he didn't need to do anything
with us, so we just told him, "We're here to check you're
safe and that the fire is not going to get out of control
and everything is okay. You have a good day." That -- we
thought we did okay. We can do better. Yes, we can do
better.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's all perception.
Because, as I told you, by the time I got the story, they
had been threatened.
MR. ARREOLA: Yes -- yeah. So, we -- you
might get some of that also on O.S.S.F. There's rules that
we have to go by, and some people don't like to go by those
rules. Some people want to have a certain type of system no
matter what, and if they can't, well, they're going to blame
it on somebody, and sometimes it's going to be us. So,
we're doing the best we can. And we have proof that what we
do is correct.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I don't think you're
doing the best you can, and if you think you're doing the
best you can, you're not going to do better. And there's a
lot of reasons why people whose livelihood is involved in
this are not going to step forward and be identified and
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make complaints, and the reason they're not is they were
trained that way. They learned that if they complained,
they were punished. It got worse, not better. Sut my
point, Miguel, is that if you're, quote, just doing your
job, and there's no room for improvement -- well, I don't
know about other Commissioners, but that's not going to
satisfy me.
MR. ARREOLA: There is room for improvement.
There is room.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay.
MR. ARREOLA: We're doing it, I think, right.
There's -- and we can prove the evidence. We can show you
the evidence of what we're doing.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 2 think -- you know, I
brought this up, and I haven't received any complaints. I
have -- I shouldn't say -- the complaints I received when I
started questioning it have been that basically the
installers didn't do it right, and Miguel said, "No, it's
not going to happen." Or the individual hired a
fly-by-night -- and there are some ]eft in that industry --
individual to do it the cheapest possible way rather than go
with one of the better installers in town, and, you know,
he's objecting to what they're getting now. So, I mean, the
complaints I have haven't been -- have been more, you know,
information to him, but I think what you're hearing is
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that -- the same, I think, speech we tend to give every
department; customer service is critical to this Court.
MR. ARREOLA: We believe that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We -- you know, we
demand, I think, that every department be, you know, the
highest possible level of customer service and politeness
and courtesy, because a lot of what we deal with people
don't like, so we might as well at least do it nicely.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's exactly right.
1 have a quick question about your list of nuisance
abatements.
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I notice there are a
few of them where the location wasn't put down, left blank.
Is there a reason for that?
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir. It`s -- there's a
computer program or computer workbook that we created
in-house, and we're still having glitches in there. The
]ocation didn't come in from the database to feed this
report. We can -- we can get you those. If you're
interested in knowing exactly where they were, we can tell
you.
COMMISSIONER WILLTAMS: Well, the location
didn't come in. How did you know it was in my precinct?
MR. ARREOLA: Because it's in your precinct.
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It just didn't come from the -- from the database.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I like the report.
MR. ARREOLA: Just -- also, to just make a
final comment, we are developing a computer program or
computer system for the department. It was also created
in-house. We started this January, and I would like to show
the Court how it works, but it's a little lengthy, so I
don't know if we can set up a workshop. And I'd like to go
also through those illegal burning rules and what's the
criteria we use on those and the inspections we do on
septics. That way, the Court will be informed what we have
to do, what we're supposed to do by the State, and whenever
someone comes and asks you why we did this, you'll be
informed. So, I think it's very good for you to be aware of
what we're supposed to do, and then you can judge if we do
it right or wrong.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- you might visit
with Truby. There's a workshop set up for July 12th
already, and you might see -- I don't know how Long that
workshop's going to take, but maybe the two can be done on
the same day. That's a floodplain workshop.
MR. ARREOLA: Okay.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And these two are kind
of -- somewhat related.
MR. ARREOLA: Sounds good. I'll get with
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her.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else for Miguel?
Thank you.
	MR. ARREOLA: Thank you.	
	COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Take	a break.
	COMMISSIONER BALDWIN; Yeah.	Yeah, me too.
But	we don't have time, do we?	
	JUDGE TINLEY: I think we can	roll out of
here. You okay for now? Juvenile Detention	. Poquito?
	(Commissioner Nicholson left	the courtroom.)
	COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He's	just going to go
get	the baseball score. Tommy, you should b	e doing that.
You	have an interest in this too, you know.	
	MR. TOMLINSON: What?	
	COMMISSIONER WiLLIAMS: Bears	playing in the
super-regional.
MR. TOMLINSON: Oh,
COMMISSIONER BALDWI;
thing to say, wasn't it?
COMMISSIONER LETZ:
JUDGE TINLEY: Thou
baseball. Thank you, Ms. Harris.
here today.
I could care less.
4; That was the wrong
That's sacrilege.
shall not speak ill of
We appreciate you being
MS. HARRIS: No problem.
JUDGE TINLEY: We'll be happy to take the
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next two minutes to receive your report.
MS. HARRIS: Okay, I will do it.
(Discussion off the record.)
MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir, I'll go through this
quickly. You have a copy of my usual reports.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Go ahead, please. I'm
a quiet little mouse here.
MS. HARRIS: Well, our revenues were up, as
they have been every month since we started keeping this in
January, and so our revenues have increased. Our
expenditures decreased for the month of May, which is a good
thing, at approximately -- we decreased expenditures about
$29,000. We had four intakes in May, and this time of year,
to have that many intakes, that's unusual for this time of
year. So, we had four intakes. We picked up --
JUDGE TINLEY: When you say "intake," you're
talking about post?
MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir. Because pre is every
day. We picked up a new county, Montague County, so they
sent us a kid.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Montague?
MS. HARRIS: Montague County, yeah. You
would be surprised how many people call it "Mon-to-gue," but
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it's "Mon-tague."
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is it really?
MS. HARRIS: It's Montague.
JUDGE TINLEY: I made that mistake one time
in front of a native; got corrected quickly.
MS. HARRIS: And if you didn't know where
that is, that's Bowie, north of Decatur.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay.
MS. HARRIS: So, you only had one discharge
in May. We've got three pending intakes, and they -- all
three of those kids should be here towards the end of this
week, 'cause when I wrote this, court dates were pending.
That's been done, so we should have another Potter County,
Henderson County, and Calhoun. Calhoun's another new county
that we've picked up. Pending discharges for this month, we
don't see -- we're not graduating any long-term kids this
month. Average population for May was 30. We're exceeding
that this month so far. Our average population for this
month is 34. The average post was 19. Average pre, we had
11. And I put your Kerr County statistics on there; we have
five long-term post kids from Kerr County, and we have
averaged eight pre Kerr County kids. The construction
issues on the annex --
(Commissioner Nicholson returned.)
MS. HARRIS: What's the score?
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COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: 5-1. It's over.
MS. HARRIS: The lift station, we talked
about this morning. The drainage issue, a DRG
representative -- I'm not sure who the other two guys were,
but they were supposed to be drainage engineering experts --
came out on June the 2nd. Everybody stood around and looked
at it again and came up with some more possible solutions
and left.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Still pointing
fingers at each other?
MS. HARRIS: And nobody can seem to agree on
what's the best way to do it. And I won't let them put
anything on top of the ground, because we have to weedeat
and mow back there. So, they're wanting to just put
something shoddy and cheap on top of the ground, and I'm
saying no, 'cause we have to -- we have to work around that,
and it doesn't look good. So, anyway... A.D.A. parking
lot, DRG -- STR is saying that the cost of asphalt's going
up every day, and if this continues to be delayed -- and
STR's pointing their fingers at DRG. The price of asphalt's
going to get so high they're not going to be able to afford
to fix it. And the institutional furniture that was never
delivered to the facility, nobody knows where the invoices
are.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Nobody knows where
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the invoices are?
MS. HARRIS: That's correct, sir.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which would suggest
that maybe we didn't pay for it? Or we did pay for it?
MS. HARRIS: We did. We did, because there
is one very broad invoice that says furniture/institutional
furniture, and there was a partial payment of $25,000. But
there's no itemized invoice to show exactly what
institutional furniture was ordered, and it was supposed to
have arrived at the facility. One explanation from DRG was,
well, it was back-ordered. Institutional furniture was
back-ordered. Well, okay. Is it still back-ordered? No.
Where is it? Well, we thought we delivered it. No, you
didn't; it's not here. So, the institutional furniture is
still an issue. There is no institutional furniture in that
new building.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: These are obviously
items that you were able to live without.
MS. HARRIS: Yes, since there's no kids over
there.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Anyway, we can get
the money back and apply it somewhere else. Mr. County
Attorney?
MR. EMERSON: In two weeks it will come up in
the litigation issues. That's -- that's all I know to say.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay.
MS. HARRIS: We had a malfunction in the
control panel in the old building. It was showing -- all
the lights came on. It was showing all the doors not
secure, and plus we'd lost our ability to audio monitor in
the dorms. That's not a good thing. So, we had C.C. Group
-- C.C.C. Group come out, because it was my understanding
that that was who worked on the control panel before in the
old building, plus they were the ones that were contracted
to put the control panel in the new building. They came out
and said that we needed to replace the amplifier. It was
the original amplifier that has been there since 1995. So,
they replaced the amplifier at an approximate cost of about
-- it was about $900 plus the labor, and $109 for the
speaker and the microphone. Well, the gentleman that came
out to do these repairs for C.C.C. Group indicated that
there was another problem with the panel that C.C.C. Group
could not address, but he said an independent repairman
could. I chose not to go that route. I chose to get
somebody locally to come and assess the remaining problems
in there, to come see what that would cost to fix. So, at
that point in time, this shorting out of the microphone, I'm
having a local company come look at that, if at all
possible. And we just -- that came up Thursday, so --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is the -- I'm not
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familiar at all with that system out there, so I probably
don't want to go into too much detail with my question. Is
that a component we bought, like -- is it a company that put
in that whole control panel? Or is it a hodgepodge of
separate things put together?
MS. HARRIS: I can't answer that,
Commissioner Letz, because that was -- it was put in there
in 1995 when the building was original -- was originally
built. I don't know if it was one complete component, or if
it was a hodgepodge. I don't know that. Can't answer that
question.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: It seems -- I mean, if
it's a hodgepodge, you probably -- what you're doing sounds
right, but if it's one item, we need to find an authorized
dealer for that item.
MS. HARRIS: Correct.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
MS. HARRIS: Population concerns. We have 14
male long-term post-adjudication, so that now requires two
dorms, so we've had to -- and I broke it down. Our
post-adjudication males are in Dorm 4 and 5. I have to
reserve one dorm for preadjudicated males; that's Dorm 3.
Which leaves Dorm 2 only for females. And, unfortunately,
it's not the ideal, but it is compliant with T.J.P.C., as
long as I keep separate staff members addressing -- separate
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staff members taking care of each separate group, the pre
girls and the post girls. Right now, we have no empty beds
on the girls -- on the females, because I have eight
long-term girls, and as of this morning, I had four pre
girls. So, I'm just letting you know, you know, that since
our population -- our numbers are increasing, there is a
concern about if we get any more long-term girls, or even if
we even get any more pre girls, it's a matter of where to
put them, because three of the dorms have boys in them. So,
I just want to make you aware of that. Also, the facility
is licensed, you know, for the substance abuse beds. We
licensed 18 beds. 16 of those are full, and one of these
new kids that's coming in this week is a substance abuse
kid, so we're rapidly approaching maxing out our number of
substance abuse beds that we're licensed for.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So we have 19 posts right
there?
MS. HARRIS: We have 22 posts.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, I thought you were
at 19. But, anyway -- so -- but all of -- six of them,
then, are in the drug program?
MS. HARRIS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
MS. HARRIS: Yes. We have three in the sex
offender program. Two of these new kids that are coming in
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are sex offender, so that'll make five, and then the other
one or two is just general corrections. Okay, I just told
you about that. We have one pending E1 Paso resident, so I
guess we'll find out tomorrow if I'm going to be able to
accept him or not. Personnel issues, we put the female
J.D.O.'s on 12-hour shifts. I believe I told you the last
time I was up here that we were going to do that. Well, we
did. That reduces the number of female J.D.O.'s that I have
to have to be in ratio by one. As it so happened, we
terminated one of the clerical -- the person that was in a
clerical position. The one female, after we went to 12-hour
shifts, that could not work 12-hour shifts because she has a
new baby, we offered her the clerical position, and she took
it, so we filled that position within. The other clerical
position will become vacated probably the end of this month,
and that's due to some personal family health issues in her
family. She is training the one clerical -- the new clerk
person; she is training her to handle payroll and all the
human resources for us to be able to do that temporarily for
right now until next fiscal year. And if things work out,
we may not even have to replace that person in October; we
might can even wait a little longer than that.
I terminated two male J.D.O. full-time
positions, so that created two full-time slots, and when I
terminated those two gentlemen, that created us -- that
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caused us to be out of ratio. If I had not put my shift
supervisors in -- my shift supervisors have been working on
their days off and beyond their hours, and even some of the
other full-time remaining male J.D.O.'s have been working on
their days off to fill this gap until we can get people
interviewed, hired, and trained to fill these two full-time
position. So, I'm forewarning you or foretelling you, we
reduced our comp time from -- from April to May
significantly. We reduced the comp time, but I'm telling
you, because of this shortage of male J.D.O.'s, that there's
going to be some comp time. Hopefully I can get them to
take the time before we have to pay them and it won't be so
bad. The community garden status, Adult Probation continues
to work on clearing that whenever it's not raining. They're
-- they're chipping the brush that was pushed, and so we're
still progressing with that. Our population today is 33; 22
and 11, respectively. And that's all I have, unless you
have any questions.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any questions for Ms. Harris?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: It --
JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, ma'am.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: No, I've got one.
JUDGE TINLEY: Oh.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Summer school.
MS. HARRIS: Started summer school today,
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except for the expelled.
JODGE TINLEY: Why didn't we start the
expelled?
MS. HARRIS: One of them didn't show up, and
the other one is at some kind of camp.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Without having
really any facts, it just -- I sense that you have a higher
turnover rate than you would expect among employees. In
your experience, is it -- is the turnover rate here higher
than it is in other facilities, and what's the cause of
that?
MS. HARRIS: In two sentences, two reasons.
The previous -- the pay scale is one of the reasons. And --
and finding people that really want to help kids, and
finding people that don't have their own agendas to take it
out on kids, and finding people that can follow standards
and rules and not make up their own, and finding people that
can just do the job -- that can be taught to do the job.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: You're shaking your
head, Sheriff. That's been kind of your experience with
adults?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: She's exactly right.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You pay more money,
you find better people.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's true. And her --
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you know, I know her salary scale for -- for her J.D.O.'s is
terrible. This Court did a lot for the salary scale for the
adult detention officers and that. As you can tell, in the
last few years, yes, we do still have openings, 'cause
people use jails or J.D.O.'s as a stepping stone a lot of
times to get farther up in the law enforcement -- becoming
an officer or deputy or whatever. But you have slowed down
the adult detention facility turnover ratio by 100 percent,
just about, because of the pay scale. She's still having to
fight the pay scale and all the rest of that, which would be
a nightmare, kind of like what we had years ago.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Thank you.
MS. HARRIS: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Are we ready to get
down and pay the bills?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I am.
JUDGE TINLEY: All right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move we pay the
bills.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion and second that we pay
the bills. Any question or discussion?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, I have a
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question.
JUDGE TINLEY: All right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 426, County Court,
Claudio Castillo, $500 for probable cause hearings.
Somebody tell me what's that's all about.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Would you take us to
the right page, please?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 2.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Top line.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: They get paid on a per-case
basis as a special master in those cases, and they're
charged as court costs. That way, whoever the originating
county is gets to pay that fee.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is mental health
hearings?
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that is mental health.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: That's mental health.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, that's all I
have.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or
comments? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising
your right hand.
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(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(NO response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry.
Budget Amendment Request Number 1.
MR. TOMLINSON: Number -- excuse me -- Number
1 is for the 216th District Court. The request is to
transfer $4,138.75 from Special Trials to Court Transcripts.
Along with that, I need a hand check for $4,138.75 payable
to Cindy Snider.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Payable to who?
MR. TOMLINSON: Cindy Snider.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Move to approve the
amendment and the hand check.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for
approval of Budget Amendment Request Number 1 and a hand
check to Cindy Snider for $9,138.75. Any question or
discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising
your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry.
Budget Amendment Request Number 2.
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MR. TOMLINSON: Number 2 is for the County
Jail. The Sheriff requested a transfer of $451.73 from
Nurses to Office Supplies.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Any
question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify
by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget
Amendment Request Number 3.
MR. TOMLINSON: Number 3 is for J.P. Precinct
4 and the Tax Collector. We have a need to transfer $1,000
from Group Insurance out of the Tax Collector's' budget into
Office Rent in J.P. 4.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Move to approve --
MR. TOMLINSON: Along with that, I need a
hand check for $250 payable to James Priour.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Move to approve the
amendment and the hand check.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for
approval of Budget Amendment Request Number 3 and hand check
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to James Priour in the sum of $250. Any question or
comment?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: One question. I
suppose this new contract means that we will have sufficient
funds in the budget for this year's rent payments?
MR. TOMLINSON: That's what the $1,000 is
for.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: For the remainder of
the year?
MR. TOMLINSON: For the remainder of the
year, yes,
COMMISSIONER BALDWTN: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: June, July, August, September.
Any questions or discussion? A11 in favor of the motion,
signify by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget
Amendment Request Number 9.
MR. TOMLINSON: Number 4 is for the Juvenile
Detention Facility. The request is to transfer $4,415, from
Contract Services to Professional Services, and this is for
the detention facility's share of the audit to Pressler
Thompson and Company.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Any
question or discussion? Mr. Auditor, that account shows to
be overdrawn over $7,000; is that correct?
MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. There was -- I don't --
I don't remember what we expended out of it prior to this,
but I think it had something to do with the bill from the
firm -- the attorneys in Austin.
JUDGE TINLEY: Legal firm -- legal?
MR. TOMLINSON: Legal fees.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bickerstaff?
MR. TOMLINSON: Bickerstaff. That's it,
yeah. I think that firm that -- or Allison Bass.
DODGE TINLEY: Allison Bass.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Allison Bass, yeah.
MR. TOMLINSON: I think there was an $8,000
bill, or something close to that, that we paid probably
three or four months ago.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I remember it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any other questions or
comments?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You pay -- we paid Jim
Allison out of the professional services, so that depleted
the line, and now we need some professional services.
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MR. TOMLINSON: Yes.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
MR. TOMLINSON: To pay Pressler Thompson.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions?
Comments? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising
your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget
Amendment Request 5.
MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. Number 5 is for
Indigent Health Care. I'm requesting a transfer of $688.83
from the Administrative line item to the Third-Party
Administrator line item. This -- this is to satisfy
payments to VeriClaims, Inc., who is our third-party
administrator.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. We just
underbudgeted it? Or is there extra things going on that's
not normal?
MR. TOMLINSON: Well, we're -- we're on -- as
far as the funds that are expended for indigent health care,
we're on the state year, as far as -- as whether or not
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we -- we have -- we have the ability to claim -- to make
claims to the state. So, this -- this firm is also on the
state year, so we -- at the beginninq of the year, we had
some unpaid claims that they processed, so we pay them --
their contract -- under their contract, we pay them 4 and a
half percent of all the eligible claims that -- that we --
that we pay. So, it's -- because we had some holdover
claims, those -- that 4 and a half percent got attached to
those claims. So, this firm is at the point that we're --
we're over budget, so we still have another month to go, two
months to go, so we probably have -- we'll probably be
looking at this again, and we're really close to being
overbudget in Indigent Health Care for eligible claims.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Buster, you have to learn
not to ask questions on indigent health care.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions,
Commissioner Baldwin?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions by any of
the other Commissioners? All in favor of the motion,
signify by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget
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Amendment Request Number 6.
MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. Number 6 is for the --
for the County Jail also. The Sheriff's requested a
transfer of $269.09 from the Cooks line item, $100 to
Employee Medical Exams and $169.04 to Radio Repairs.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for
approval of Budget Amendment Request Number 6. Any question
or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by
raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget
Amendment Request Number 7.
MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. Number 7 is from the
198th District Court. The request is to transfer $5 from
Special Trials to Books, Publications, and Dues.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for
approval. Any question or discussion?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What's the 5 bucks
for?
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: A book.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is it for books, or
are we paying personal dues?
MR. TOMLINSON: It's dues for the State Bar
of Texas.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The man ought to pay
his own.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Commissioner Letz,
does that remind you that back at Exxon, you rounded
everything off to the closest million?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You guys are out of
water here, I can tell.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or
comments? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising
your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget
Amendment Request 8.
MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. Number 8 is for the
216th District Court. This is also for a transcript. I'm
requesting that we transfer $1,982.20 from Special Trials to
Court Transcripts.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for
approval. Any question or comment? All in favor of the
motion, signify by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry.
Budget amendment request 9.
MR. TOMLINSON: Number 9 is for the 198th
District Court. The request is to transfer $1,085.45 from
Special Trials to Conferences.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Where was the
conference?
MR. TOMLINSON: Well, the -- I have -- I have
two bills that we've previously paid for the court
reporter's conference, one for $860.45, and the other for
$225. This left $861 for the Judge's conference, so his
request is to reinstate the $2,100 budget.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Does -- I guess my
comment is -- I probably shouldn't say anything, but do they
just not look at their budget? I mean -- (Laughter.)
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's one way to ask
it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why --
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's diplomatic.
JUDGE TINLEY: Your first comment may have
been the most appropriate one.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I can understand,
you know, $100 over or something. I mean, it depends on the
hotels you stay at. But, I mean, to miss the mark this
far --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, look at how much
-- how much do we spend when we go to a conference each?
$200? $300?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Something like that.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're talking 1,000
here. Where do they go? Nevermind.
MR. TOMLINSON: Well, there is -- I guess, to
make this more palatable, there is a statute that requires a
$15 fee attached to every civil case that is for the purpose
of court reporting. I estimate that over the last five or
six years, we've probably collected $60,000, so there --
there is non-tax revenues that are to be used for the
purpose of court reporting. And so we have never budgeted
separately, but I -- I feel like that they're non-tax
revenues available for this purpose.
JUDGE TINLEY: Court reporter, you're talking
about?
MR. TOMLINSON: For the court reporter part.
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And what happened was that the court reporter needed some
hours that they didn't budget for, and that person used the
Judge's conference money.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: He can still turn
around and ask the exact same question, though, if he wanted
to. Why? But I sure did not know that, and I apologize for
my ugly thoughts. How's that?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's good.
JUDGE TINLEY: Is that a motion for approval?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Dadgum right. I
thought there was already one on the table, or I'd have
jumped on that a long time ago.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for
approval of Budget Amendment Request Number 9. Any question
or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by
raising your right hand.
(Commissioners Baldwin, Williams, and
Nicholson voted in favor of the motion.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(Commissioner Letz voted against the motion.)
JUDGE TINLEY: Do we have any more budget
amendments?
MR. TOMLINSON: No.
JUDGE TINLEY: Do we have any late bills?
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MR. TOMLINSON: One.
JUDGE TINLEY: One late bill?
MR. TOMLINSON: We have -- I have one to
Xerox Corporation for $230.51.
JUDGE TINLEY: 230 what?
MR. TOMLINSON: $230.51.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval of late
bill.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for
approval of the late bill payment to Xerox of $230.51. Any
question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify
by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: I have before me monthly
reports submitted by the Sheriff, Constable Precinct 1,
Justice of the Peace Precinct 2, Justice of the Peace
Precinct 4, Justice of the Peace Precinct 1, County Clerk,
Justice of the Peace Precinct 3, County Attorney, District
Clerk, Kerr County Juvenile Facility, and Environmental
Health. Do I hear a motion that these reports be approved
as submitted?
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Any
question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify
by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Do we
have any reports from any of the members of the Court in
connection with their liaison or committee assignments?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I do -- I have
a comment and a question real quick. We had talked this
morning about setting up a workshop on the EMS issue. I
wondered if we could do that today, set a date.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think so.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes? Okay. Is next
week too late?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm gone for the next
two weeks beginning Saturday.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: When do we start our
budget process?
JODGE TINLEY: Probably week after next.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that, like -- that was
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my -- part of what my question was going to be, workshops.
Start scheduling them? Or -- so, the first week -- last
week of June?
JUDGE TINLEY: Last week of June, first week
of July.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Looks like our next
meeting is Monday, the 27th. Do y'all want to have a
workshop in the afternoon, or are you busy or what?
JUDGE TINLEY: Trying to stay that way all
the time.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Trying to stay that
way. People are waiting on you down the hall right now.
JUDGE TINLEY: They are.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why not do it the day
after?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just think we need
to do it, get it done as soon as possible.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, we need to move on it.
Do you want to try and nail down a date now, or just
collectively put your heads together after the meeting?
That's fine, too.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And have an illegal
meeting? Is that what you're trying to say?
JUDGE TINLEY: Not when you're scheduling the
meeting. We're going to post the meeting. I don't see a
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problem with that. We're not having a meeting; we're just
scheduling a meeting.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Does that mean I can
attend this one?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Bring it back, we can
rubber-stamp the date.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, you can attend
this one. We're going to make some decisions.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I want it in
writing.
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	Is Tuesday a better
day? I mean,	I'll just sele	ct one.	
	JUDGE TINLEY:	Tuesday	afternoon is.
Mornings, I h	ave mental heal	th normall	y.
	COMMISSIONER	LETZ: How	about Tuesday, the
28th, in the	afternoon?		
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	That's exactly where
we're going.	2 o'clock, so	we can get	a nap in after lunch?
	JUDGE TINLEY:	Yeah.	
	COMMISSIONER	LETZ: 1:3	0 is better.
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	1:30?
	COMMISSIONER	NICHOLSON:	1:30 is good.
	COMMISSIONER	WILLIAMS:	You'll tell me when I
call you?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. Kathy will
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know. And, of course, that's -- I have to talk to the City,
make sure they're available, et cetera.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And this is kind of like
our -- we're not going to -- you don't anticipate us
finalizing a contract?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, I don't. No. I
want to provide you with the information that I've received,
which is going back to our little fistfight earlier. It's
basically -- some of it's the exact same information I think
the Judge got, so I'll -- we'll get everything to you.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's fine.
JUDGE TINLEY: Not a fistfight.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, it was close.
JUDGE TINLEY: I got responses to my
questions last Friday, and Kathy is making comments --
copies, excuse me, for -- for all of y'all.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I'll do the same
with mine. I think it's some of the same information.
JUDGE TINLEY: I don't know.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And one other comment
I'd like to make is that not too long ago, we had agreed in
here to do evaluations on our employees in the month of
June, and here we are, so we need to --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: What's the process
on that? I know who to write them on, but what do I do with
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them after I write them?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It doesn't matter.
Just throw them away -- no.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Give them to the
coordinator?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We always give them to
the personnel director of the courthouse. Like I said, just
throw them away.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Do we share them
among each other? Do you get to see what I write and -- do
you just want to give them to the coordinator?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's probably
better. We probably need to start a new trend. I mean
that.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They need to be in
by?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: End of the month.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I was just bringing it
up 'cause we said we were going to do it.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: We did say that.
I've got the forms. I've just got to put some words on
them.
DODGE TINLEY:	Okay.	Anything	further from
any member of the Court? Ele	cted o	fficials?	Department
heads? Any further reports?	Okay,	we are going to stand in
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recess until 1:30 tomorrow afternoon, at which time we will
reconvene this meeting, as well as a workshop previously
posted. We'll be in recess.
(Commissioners Court recessed at 3:45 p.m.)
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STATE OF TEXAS
COUNTY OF KERR
The above and foregoing is a true and complete
transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as
County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County,
Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth.
DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 21st day of June, 2005.
JANNETT PIE PER, Kerr County Clerk
Kathcy Bahik, Deputy County Clerk
Certified Shorthand Reporter
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ORDER N0.29190
DECLARE UNUSED FURNITURE
SURPLUS IN COUNTY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE
On this the 13`h day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Letz, seconded
by Commissioner Williams, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-0-0, to
declare unused furniture partitions, and law books as surplus , as requested by the County
Attorney and authorize such to be sold.
ORDER N0.29191
RESOLUTION FOR
FLOOD AWARENESS MONTH IN JULY
On this the 13s' day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Williams,
seconded by Commissioner Letz, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-0-0,
the resolution establishing month of July as FLOOD AWARENESS MONTH in Kerr
County, Texas.
ORDER NO.29192
RENEWAL OF LEASE FOR PRECINCT #4
AND TAX OFFICE ANNEX BUILDING
On this the 13`h day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Baldwin,
seconded by Commissioner Nicholson, the Court uuauimously approved by a vote of 4-
0-0, to renew the lease for Justice of the Peace Pct. #4 and Tax Office Annex Building
effective June 1, 2005.
ORDER N0.29193
RESOLUTION AMENDING
TCDP CONTRACTS
#722411,723095, & 724441
REGARDING KERRVILLE SOUTH WASTEWATER PROJECT
PHASES II, III, IV
On this the 13`h day of June, 2005 upon motion made by Commissioner Williams,
seconded by Commissioner Baldwin, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-
0-0, the resolution amending TCDP contracts #722411, 723095 & 724441 regarding
Kerrville South Wastewater Project Phases II, III, IV.
ORDER N0.29194
FUND THE PRE-ENGINEERING DESIGN PHASE
OF CENTER POINT WASTEWATER COLLECTION SYSTEM
On this the 13"' day of June 2005 upon motion made by Commissioner Williams,
seconded by Commissioner Letz, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-0-11,
To authorize filing an application with local foundation(s) for up to one-half the amount
required to fund the Pre-Engineering Design phase of the Center Point Wastewater
Collection System.
ORDER N0.29195
UPGRADE SCENIC RIDGE ROAD
IN HILLS `N DALES SUBDIVISION
On this the 13a' day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Nicholson,
seconded by Commissioner Baldwin, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-
0-0, to have land owner upgrade Scenic Ridge Road in Hills `n Dales Subdivision to
County standazds.
ORDER N0.29196
ROAD AND BRIDGE TO REQUEST
EXTENSION OF WALK BRIDGE
IN FLAT ROCK PARK
On this the 13`" day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Williams,
seconded by Commissioner Letz, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-0-0,
authorize Road and Bridge Department to request an extension of ORCA and or FEMA,
whomever; or, in the alternative, allow us to allocate those funds from the original
designation to cover the cost of engineering to the extent that funds will do that for one
year and authorize Commissioner Williams to sign letter.
ORDER N0.29197
SET PUBLIC HEARING FOR REVISION
OF PLAT FOR SOUTHERN HILLS PHASE TWO
On this the 13`h day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Baldwin,
seconded by Commissioner Williams, to set public hearing for Revision of Plat for
Southern Hills Phase Two Lots 36, 37, & 38 on July 25, 2005 at 10:00 a.m. in Kerr
County Commissioners' Court room.
ORDER NO.29198
FINAL PLAT OF MOSTY PECAN GROVE
On this the 13`h day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Williams,
seconded by Commissioner Baldwin, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-
0-0, the final plat of Mosty Pecan Grove in Pct. #2.

ORDER N0.29199
KERR COUNTY MANAGEMENT'S
DISCUSSION AND ANALYSIS
2003-2004 AUDIT
On this t pie 13`h day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Letz, seconded
by Commissioner Williams, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-0-Q the
Kerr Coy ~nty Management's Discussion and Analysis for the ?003-2004 audit as
amended.
ORDER N0.29200
APPROVAL TO REPAIR JUVENILE
DETENTION FACILITY LIFT STATION
On this the 13`h day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Letz, seconded
by Commissioner Williams, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-0-0, to pay
$4,733.00 to repair Facility Lift Station and authorize the County Judge to sign the KPUB
and DW Electric contracts with funds to come from Contract Fees.
ORDER NO.29201
AUTHORIZE THE PURCHASE
OF THREE NEW PATROL CARS
On this the 13th day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Letz, seconded
by Commissioner Baldwin, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-0-0, the
purchase of three new patrol cars for the Sheriff's Offices with funds to come from the
Insurance process and the asset seizure account.
ORDER NO.29202
INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY OFFICE
TO REVIEW ALL COUNTY OFFICES
On this the 13~h day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Letz, seconded
by Commissioner Nicholson, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-0-0, to
have the Information Technology Office to conduct a review of all County Offices in
reference to technology efficiency.
ORDER N0.29203
RESOLUTION TO
VETO H. B 2438
On this 13`h day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Baldwin, seconded
by Commissioner Williams, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-0-0, the
resolution to veto House Bi112438.
ORDER NO.29203A
CLAIMS AND ACCOUNTS
On this the 13`h day June 2005, came to be considered by the Court the various
Commissioners precincts, which said Claims and Accounts aze:
10-GENERAL: $138,821.51
14- FIRE: $10,416.67
15- ROAD & BRIDGE: $23,460.90
18-COUNTY LAW LIBRARY: $4,275.68
19-PUBLIC LIBRARY: $26,944.08
26-JP TECHNOLOGY: $156.47
28-RECORDS MANAGEMENT & PRESERVATION: $6,438.00
31-PARKS: $33.44
50-INDIGENT HEALTH CARE: $66,716.48
76-JUVENILE DETENTIN FACILITY: $9,706.84
81-DISTRICT ADMINISTRATION: $600.00
TOTAL CASH REQUIRED FOR ALL FUNDS: $287,570.08
Upon motion made by Commissioner Williams, seconded by Commissioner Baldwin,
the Court approved by a vote of 4-0-0, to pay said Claims and Accounts.
ORDER N0.29204
216TH DISTRICT COURT
On this t'ie 13`h day of dune 2005 upon motion made by Commissioner Nicholson,
seconded by Commissi mer Letz, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-0-0,
to tra~rsf::r $4,138.75 from Line Item No. 10-435-417 Specials Trials to Line Item No. 10-
435-497 Court Transcripts and issue a hand check in the amount of $4,138.75 made
payable ~o Cindy E. Sn: der for statement of facts: A04-56.
ORDER N0.29205
COUNTY JAIL
On this the 13`h day of ~{une 2005 upon motion made by Commissioner Williams,
secondeu by Commissioner Nicholson, the Cour[ unanimously approved by a vote of 4-
0-0, to transfer $451.73 from Line Item No. 10-512-106 to Line Item No. 10-512-310
Office Supplies in the County Jail.
ORDER N0.29206
JUSTICE OF THE PEACE #4
AND TAX ASSESSOR COLLECTOR
On this the 13`h day of June 2005 upon motion made by Commissioner Nicholson,
seconded by Commissioner Letz, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-0-0,
to transfer $1,000.00 from Line Item No. 10-499-202 Group Insurance to Line Item No.
10-458-460 Office Rent for the Courthouse Annex in Ingram for JP #4 and Tax Assessor
Collector and issue a hand check in the amount of $250.00 to James W. Priour for
balance of June 2005 office rent.
ORDER NO.29207
JUVENILE DETENTION FACILITY
On this the 13`h day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Williams,
seconded by Commissioner Letz, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-0-0,
to transfer $4,415.00 from Line Item No. 76-572-109 Contract Services to Line Item No.
76-572-486 Professional Services in the Juvenile Detention Facility.
ORDER NO.29208
INDIGENT HEALTH CARE
On this 13~' day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Letz, seconded by
Commissioner Baldwin, the Court unanimously approved by vote of 4-0-0, to transfer
$688.83 from Line Item No. 50-641-100 Administrative to Line Item No. 50-641-486
Third Party Administrator in Indigent Health Care
ORDER N0.29209
COUNTY JAIL
On this t ~e 13`h day of ±une 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Letz, seconded
by Com~:~issioner Nicholson, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-0-Q, to
transfer X269.04 from Line Item No. 10-512-103 Cooks with $169.04 to Line Item No.
10-512-~! 53 Radio Repairs and with $100.00 to Line Item No. 10-512-220 Employee
Medical E;cams in the County Jail.
ORDER NO.29210
198TH DISTRICT COURT
On this the 13`h day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Letz, seconded
by Commissioner Baldwin, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-0-0, to
transfer $5.00 from Line Item No. 10-436-417 Special Trials to Line Item No. 10-436-
315 Books-Publications-Dues in the 198' District Court.
ORDER N0.29211
216`" DISTRICT COURT
On this the 13`h day of June 2005, upon made by Commissioner Williams, seconded by
Commissioner Letz, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-0-0, transfer
$1,982.20 from Line Item No. 10-435-417 Special Trials to Line Item No. 10-435-497
Court Transcripts in the 216`h District Court.
ORDER N0.29212
198TH DISTRICT COURT
On this the 13th day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Baldwin,
seconded by Commissioner Nicholson, the Court approved by a vote of 4-1-11, to
transfer $1,085.45 from Line Item No. 10-436-417 Special Trials to Line Item No. 10-
436-485 Conferences in the 198th District Court.
ORDER N0.29213
LATE BILL
TO XEROX CORPORATION
On this the 13`h day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Letz, seconded
by Commissioner Nicholson, the Court uuauimously approved by a vote of 4-0-0, to
pay $230.51 from Line No. 10-456-461 and issue a hand check to Xerox Corporation.
ORDER N0.29214
MONTHLY REPORTS
On this the 13`" day of June, 2005 upon motion made by Commissioner Williams,
seconded by Commissioner Baldwin, the Court unanimously approved by a vote of 4-
0-0, to accept the monthly reports from the Following:
Sheriff's
Constable Pct. #1
JP #1, #2, #3, #4
County Clerk
County Attorney
District Clerk
Kerr County Juvenile Facility
Environmental Health
ORDER N0.29215
PLACEMENT CONTRACT FOR
JUVENILE DETENTION FACILITY
On this the 14th day of June 2005, upon motion made by Commissioner Baldwin,
seconded by Commissioner Williams, the Court approved by a vote of 3-1-0, the
placement contract with El Paso County and Cameron County and authorize the County
Judge to sign same for the Juvenile Detention Facility.