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KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT
Regular Session
Monday, December 12, 2005
9:00 a.m.
Commissioners' Courtroom
Kerr County Courthouse
Kerrville, Texas
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PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge
H A."BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1
WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2
JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3
DAVE NICHOLSON, Commissioner Pct. 4
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I N D E X
December 12, 2005
--- Commissioners' Comments
1.2 Consider/discuss Commissioners' Court position
on closing Juvenile Detention Bank Account and
transferring funds to Kerr County Treasurer's
bank account
1.3 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on
lease-purchase agreement for asphalt zipper
milling machine for Road and Bridge, authorize
County Judge to sign same
1.4 Consider/discuss declaring unusable Road &
Bridge items as surplus and allow them to be
sold as scrap iron
1.5 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on
proposed conditional lease agreement with Hill
Country Mounted Peace Officers Association for
construction of multi-use facility
1.6 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to
reappoint Charles Donellen to Alamo Area Agency
on Aging, Senior Advisory Committee
1.1 Discuss update on Kerr County Sesquicentennial
function
1.7 Discuss/consider, take appropriate action on
ownership & maintenance of Turtle Creek Cemetery
1.8 Consider/discuss, address $94,001 Library Fund
balance paid to Kerr County by October 15, 2004
1.9 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on
construction at the Animal Control Facility
1.10 Consider/discuss field agreement with U.S.
Department of Agriculture
1.11 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on
interlocal agreement with City of Kerrville
concerning subdivision platting jurisdiction
within the ETJ
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I N D E X (Continued)
December 12, 2005
PAGE
1.12	Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on	
	possible revisions to Kerr County Information	
	Technology Policies	66
1.13	Consider changing/modifying Kerr County's	
	Personnel Policy with regard to compensatory	
	time off and/or overtime	68
1.14	Reports from the following Departments:	
	Animal Control	--
	Environmental Health	84
	Juvenile Detention Facility	92
	Extension Service	117
1.15	Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on	
	Kerr County Subdivision Rules and Regulations	---
1.16	Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on	
	Kerr County Water Availability Requirements	---
4.1	Pay Bills	105
4.2	Budget Amendments	109
4.3	Late Bills	112
4.4	Approve and Accept Monthly Reports	113
5.1	Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee	
	Assignments	114
---	Adjourned	126
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On Monday, December 12, 2005, at 9:00 a.m., a regular
meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in the
JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen.
Let me call to order this regularly scheduled meeting of the
Kerr County Commissioners Court scheduled for this date and
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Would everyone please stand and
join me for a moment of prayer followed by the pledge.
(Prayer and pledge of allegiance.)
JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. At this time, if there's
any member of the public or the audience that wishes to be
heard on an item that is not a listed agenda item, feel free
to come forward at this time. If you wish to speak on an
agenda item, we'd ask that you fill out a participation form.
They're at the back of the room. It's not required, but it
helps me for purposes of not missing you when we get to that
item, so I'd appreciate if you'd do that. But if there's any
member of the public that wishes to be heard on any matter
which is not a listed agenda item, well, feel free to come
forward at this time. Seeing no one coming forward, we'll go
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on to the next item. Commissioner Letz, what do you have for
us this morning?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the only thing I have is
just a -- I'll wear my Region J hat today. Last week we had
our almost our final meeting under this planning cycle. We
adopted the draft regional water plan for 2006. It's now
being forwarded to the Water Development Board for final
review in January, and then to the Legislature after, I think,
June lst for inclusion into the state water plan. Nothing
earth-shattering. I think I've probably noted any changes
that we've made, but anyway, it's interesting. A lot of work
was done. I'd like to thank everyone that participated in
that process. That's it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner 4?
COMMISSIONEP. NICHOLSON: I think all of you are
aware that in west Kerr County we have three facilities for
youth, the Hill Country Youth Ranch and Star Ranch and 3-H
Youth Ranch. And we got some bad news about a week ago; one
of the children at the -- at the Star Ranch died after being
restrained. And that restraint's not unusual; it's almost a
daily occurrence at the ranches, considering the type of
children they're dealing with. But it's really a tragedy.
The good news is that yesterday, the -- the men's group at the
Hunt Methodist Church had a bake sale fundraiser for the boys
for Christmas presents and other things, and sold some pecan
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pies and cookies and candy, and raised over $8,000 for the
boys. So --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Golly.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: -- it's not hard to raise
money for good causes. That's all I've got.
JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Commissioner Baldwin?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir, thank you. I had a
couple items here. I see that the County Clerk has received
another state commendation in regards to her vital statistics
department, I think.
MS. PIEPER: That is correct.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did I say that correctly?
And some kind of outstanding achievement award, and for how
many years have you won that?
MS. PIEPER: Every year since I've been in office
now.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: A long time. And that makes
us proud, and thank you for your hard work in that.
MS. PIEPER: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I found out last week why so
many people are moving to Kerrville. I had the pleasure to go
into west Texas to some meetings, and I got up Friday morning
to attend a meeting, and it was 2 degrees. And I tell you,
those people seem really smart, you know, but they're not.
God, that place is horrible. I'm glad to be home; glad I made
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it. I had some great tours of some airports, and it only took
me around ten hours to get from San Antonio to wherever I was
going. It was awful. I'm going to do it again. (Laughter.)
I want to talk a minute about the Christmas party.
There -- this is a Christmas party, okay? Where we get
together and have fun and celebrate the birth of Christ. I
mean, it's the greatest day in the -- on the calendar, and
there seems to be a little confusion. So what we're -- what I
think that we should do is, we'll just continue this year,
just like we've done every year. Our office -- Kathy is
checking, coordinating, and doing the thing. And our numbers
have grown in the last couple of years to the point to where
it's uncomfortable to have our party down in the basement, so
we decided that we want to move to the Ag Barn. And then
there was some maybe problems of transporting food to the Ag
Barn, so I took it on myself to visit with the Juvenile
Probation Department and asked them if we could use the van,
and if that's agreeable to you gentlemen, I think that we need
to ask all the elected officials or the people in the
courthouse family that participate in this thing to gather
their foods sometime around 11:00 o'clock down in the basement
of the courthouse, and we'll transport it all at one time in
the van out to the Ag Barn.
And I understand there's -- there's ways out there
that -- to heat or reheat and that kind of thing, so I think
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it would be a -- I don't think it's going to be real difficult
for anybody in the courthouse to get in their car and drive to
the Ag Barn. I'm not sure about that yet; I haven't heard
that one. But, anyway, I think -- I think it'll be a smooth
transaction. And the idea of passing the coordinating efforts
around to the different offices, we'll deal with that next
year. It's nothing to -- anybody to be concerned or worried
about right now. So, anyway, I just wanted to say all that,
and hopefully clear the air. And if you guys have any trouble
moving the food in the van, let me know and I'll sure shut her
down. That's all. It's nice to be here.
JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Williams?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I was chuckling when
Commissioner Baldwin was talking about his activities last
week, because he truly is one of the luckiest people I know.
He gets to go to Wichita Falls when it's zero degrees. Not
many of us get that opportunity.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's true.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We're certainly glad you're
back --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You gentlemen are welcome to
go with me.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We're glad you're back
without getting frostbite. A couple things I want to talk
about. First of all, Friday I was in Austin and filed the
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application on behalf of Kerr County with Texas Water
Development Board for an engineering -- preliminary
engineering money which we hope will be forthcoming for the
design -- initial design phase, preliminary planning and some
engineering design for Center Point wastewater collection
system. You may recall that the Upper Guadalupe River
Authority authorized the funding of the other half of that
match, about $121,000 or $122,000. So, our application is in,
and if T.W.D.B. needs more information, we'll -- we'll oblige
and provide it as -- as they take a look at it. The deadline
for	all of	-- all	of the	applications	under	the	current cycle
of	funding	is the	15th of	this month,	so we'	re	in -- safely in
and we'll await their decisions.
Secondly, I was notified by the T.C.E.Q. that the
Wheatcraft operation had a surprise visit from T.C.E.Q. last
week and was found to be in violation of the air quality
regulations with respect to constructing his equipment, which
I guess is the rock crusher he intends to use. And he will be
issued a cease and desist order on that construction phase of
whatever it is he's doing out there. Doesn't mean he can't do
his	mining	and --	and	hauling	of	materials in and	out,	'cause
he	is doing	that.	But	there	are	some regulations	with	respect
to the construction aspects of the rock crushers until the
permit is issued. And, lastly, in the spirit of the season,
we had an opportunity last night to join with the community of
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Center Point in its Christmas -- annual Christmas parade and
Christmas lighting and arrival of Santa Claus, and it was a
fun time. It brings the little community together. The band,
the high school, and all of the kids and -- and members of the
Alliance for Progress and other citizens who enjoy the
opportunity to get together and listen to the Christmas story
and let the little kids see Santa Claus and get cookies and
hot chocolate and all that good stuff. That's put on each
year, in the event you don't know, by the Center Point
Alliance for Progress. They work all year long raising funds
to do the Christmas lighting, to put up the lighting, to pay
for the lighting, and to pay for these events, and more
importantly than all, to provide a Christmas gift or gifts to
needy children who otherwise would not be remembered during
the Christmas season. So, hats off to them; they do a fine
job, and it's a fun time and a good time to be a part of the
Christmas spirit. That's it, Judge.
JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Let's get on with the
agenda, if we might.
COMMISSIONER LETZ
Judge, can I make one other
comment real briefly, if I might?
JUDGE TINLEY: What do you got?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I just wanted -- all the press
isn't here, but some of the press is. Frequently in the past
year, there have been a lot of articles about the City and the
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County not getting along and not working, and also, just in
note -- I'll bring this up a little bit later when we get into
subdivision rules -- that on the ETJ issue, even though we
don't have an agreement that I'm aware of today from the City,
we were able to sit down, Buster Baldwin and myself, with the
City and work out a deal -- cooperation -- that we both agreed
with, without any difficulty. And, likewise, on water
availability with Headwaters, I was able to -- twice, I've sat
down with their board and gone over and come up with a water
availability plan that they're happy with and I'm happy with.
We'll be talking about that later today. But it's just
frequently in the papers, and the press talks about us not
getting along. I just wanted to point out that in the past
couple of weeks, there's been a lot of times when the county
government has worked very well with the Headwaters Water --
Underground Water Conservation District and City of Kerrville,
and I think we probably cooperate a lot more than we don't
cooperate, in reality.
DODGE TINLEY: As a follow-up to that, I think our
last meeting when we were all present, where we had dinner
together at Commissioner Baldwin's suggestion, when we just
explored ideas and parameters, there was -- there were more
ideas discussed as a suggestion of things that we might look
at in the future than the ones that we currently cooperate
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with, which would indicate to me that everyone's looking
forward to combined efforts and efficiencies and cooperation,
and so I would concur with your suggestion that maybe the --
the continued indications of rancor between the two
entities -- or two or more entities is more myth than truth,
possibly. Let's move on with the agenda, if we might. We'll
go to Item 2 initially. I don't see --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Correct.
DODGE TINLEY: -- the first individual here. And
it's not quite 9:15 anyway, so we'll go with Item 2. Consider
and discuss Commissioners Court position on closing Juvenile
Detention bank account and transferring funds to the Kerr
County Treasurer's bank account. Ms. Nemec?
MS. NEMEC: Good morning. We had discussed this
during court on October the 11th, and we had also discussed
bringing it back to court the nett court session, but that
wasn't done. So, during all this time, there's been
discussion about closing it and how we should handle it. In
visiting with the Auditor and the County Attorney, I have
found out that I do not need a court order to do that.
However, I have stated my position October 11th on it, and in
the letter that I wrote to y'all. Basically, that's just not
something that I would do unless I know that it is the
agreement of all the Commissioners and the Judge to do that,
to close that account. So, I don't need a court order. I'm
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just looking for a direction and to see how each one of you
feel about doing this.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Barbara, my whole thing was
-- to have it separated out there was to be able -- that we
could be able to see and track all the way through, or Joe
Jones off the street, who walked in and started looking at
county records, that he could actually see clearly. But it's
my understanding that by -- by doing your recommendation here,
by closing the account down, moving it into your program, that
it still could be tracked and clearly seen, so I have no
problem. That's my -- that was my only deal in the beginning.
MS. NEMEC: Right. We would keep it in a separate
fund in the Treasurer's account if we do that, and it would
always be able to be --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good.
MS. NEMEC: -- tracked.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Your thought is to keep it
separate, correct?
MS. NEMEC: Well --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's what your memo says.
MS. NEMEC: My thought is to keep it separate.
There's just too much going on over there, and every time that
there is a shortfall, I feel that it should be brought to
y'all's attention. And if we put it in the Treasurer's
account, that's not going to be the case unless you all ask.

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And, so, for that reason, my thought is to keep it separate.
But if -- if -- you know, if that is not what y'all wish to
do, I don't have a problem in transferring it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, I just wanted to get
why -- why you believe it's necessary to keep it separate.
MS. NEMEC: Right. That is the reason.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you.
MS. NEMEC: The general fund will be having to fund
that facility and the shortfall every time we have a
shortfall, and you will not be made aware of it, like I said,
unless you continually ask for those records.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay.
MS. NEMEC: And, so, that is -- that is the reason.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, you can count on me
asking for the records.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. We need to be able to clearly
identify what the operational costs are and what the
revenue -- the receipts are from that facility. I think -- I
think the Court was very, very specific when we finalized the
budget that we were going to be looking at this thing fairly
closely on an ongoing basis. So, whatever's required to be
able to clearly identify those without undue difficulty from
your office, why -- you know, I don't know what your logistics
are down there, but whatever -- whatever's required that -- so
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that we're able to do that, that's my concern.
MS. NEMEC: We will. There's not a problem with
that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: To me, it's simpler to combine
the accounts, but we need to be able to clearly track it.
And, you know, I think that it's something that we can just
ask for. We can figure out a mechanism to -- to get that to
us, whether it's through your office or the Auditor's office.
One of the things that may help is to get a little bit of a --
kind of more of, I guess, a balance sheet or -- of that
department, or income statement, really, more as to
expenditure, transfers in, transfers out. One of the
difficulties I have in tracking, and this is whether it's in a
separate account or in the same account, is that they qet --
end up on different pages for transfers in, transfers out. If
we could have it consolidated on one page, we could see what
was transferred and also what the expenditures have been. It
would be, I think, clearer to me and to the public.
MS. NEMEC: I can do a monthly report and provide
that for you all if y'all want me to do that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That would be very helpful to
me, 'r_ause it's difficult to track it the way we do it, you
},now, 'cause it's not normally the type of thing we do track,
the transfers in, transfers out on the same page.
MS. NEMEC: Okay.
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JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Harris, I think, is doing a
monthly now, but if I'm not mistaken, hers is done -- is yours
done on a cash basis or an accrual basis, Ms. Harris?
MS. HARRIS: Cash basis.
JUDGE TINLEY: Cash basis?
MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Then I'm not sure it would be any
different from -- from yours, then, would it?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Shouldn't be.
MS. NEMEC: Are you doing as we receive the revenue?
Or your report is what you bill out?
MS. HARRIS: Our report is what we billed out.
MS. NEMEC: Then that would be different.
JUDGE TINLEY: That's an accrual basis and not a
cash, then. Okay.
MS. HARRIS: But we also keep up with our cash as
well. But that does not come in -- you know, all of our
checks -- revenue checks do not come in on the same day.
MS. NEMEC: Right.
MS. HARRIS: It comes in different parts of the week
all -- all month long.
JUDGE TINLEY: But your revenue figures, for
example, for November --
MS. HARRIS: Mm-hmm.
JUDGE TINLEY: -- will be the revenues that you
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earned in November, but did not necessarily receive?
MS. HARRIS: Correct.
JUDGE TINLEY: And you would show, offsetting that,
the expenses for that same month, so as to be able to look at
each month --
MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: -- and what you think is a clearer
picture?
MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. And that's what you've been
providing us?
MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: One of the areas of
information that I found wanting is to track the accounts
receivable in terms of the delinquencies, what counties or
entities might be delinquent in remitting their -- their fees
to Kerr County. Is that possible to get a handle on that, so
we know?
MS. NEMEC: Y'all might be able to get that either
from Ms. Harris or the Auditor, Mindy Williams.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If there are none, that's
great, but --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There is some.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, I know.
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COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'm not real sure of the
implications of having separate accounts. Does it mean, for
e~:ample, that the bills are paid by separate entities? Or are
two checkbooks kept?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Two checkbooks.
MS. NEMEC: Yes, two bank accounts. Separate bank
accounts.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: So, currently, expenses of
the facility are being paid by the administration of the
facility?
MS. NEMEC: Right.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I wanted to go back to Mrs.
Harris' monthly report here and really make it clear what
we're seeing. It shows the revenue -- as an example, the one
dated December, and I guess that's the latest, it shows
revenues of 150,000 plus a few dollars, and expenditures of
172,000, so we're a little low there. But what -- what that
means is that revenue -- and I'm just piggy-backing on your
comments. The revenue is simply billed-out money; it is not
money that has actually come into the county coffers. As a
matter of fact, I was peeking at the Auditor's books the other
day in regards to this issue, and there are two or three
months -- I can't remember; seemed like it was October,
billings that still have not come in. So, when we look at
these numbers on our -- on the monthly report -- and I'm
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not -- not knocking this, but I just want us to clearly
understand that that's not necessarily money that's in the
county coffers at this time. So --
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. That's earned, not necessarily
received.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Correct.
JUDGE TINLEY: But it was earned during that same --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that correct?
JUDGE TINLEY: -- period indicated.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That is correct. And there
are some counties -- you know, we've always understood --
going through the issues with the State Hospital, we've always
understood that Harris County is real slow in paying, and
Bexar County is real slow in paying. I think that those are
the major -- major ones. So, yes, there is outstanding
counties.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that exact point is what has
caused the problem, in that the -- we're owed the money, but
we don't have it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's correct.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But the bills, we do have.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And there's not a whole hell
of a lot you're going to do about it, I can tell you.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, over the long-term, if
you break it out for the year, it'll --
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Balances.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- balance out against each
other, but there may be pay periods -- or billing periods that
the money's not there. Which is why I think it makes more
sense to combine the accounts, as long as we keep a close eye
on it, like I think -- and I think we can, and are.
MS. NEMEC: Well, I think I've got some direction
there. I think what we'll do, the Auditor and I will go ahead
and close the bank account. I think what we're going to start
doing as of today is putting all the revenues into the
Treasurer's account, set up a line item just for the Juvenile
Detention Facility, and then we're going to see if everything
can clear the bank account that is out now so that we can
close it at the end of this month.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, great.
MS. NEMEC: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: You're able to pull up the
information just by virtue of the revenue account numbers and
the expense accounts?
MS. NEMEC: Right.
JUDGE TINLEY: Sure.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, ma'am. Let's move to Item
3, if we might; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action
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on lease/purchase agreement for the asphalt zipper milling
machine for Road and Bridge, including approval of payment of
$500 for document processing fee, an additional $15 for UCC
filing, and authorize County Judge to sign same. I put this
on the agenda. This is essentially the same type of item that
we had when we did the chip spreader and asphalt distributor
last year. Basically, the same type of transaction, same type
of -- of expenses and right down the line.
MR. ODOM: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You have funds in your budget
to pay these?
MR. ODOM: Well, I don't have to pay anything.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, I mean the additional.
MR. ODOM: Yes, I do.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: The UCC filing and the --
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, he's got it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- processing.
JUDGE TINLEY: He's got a contingency just like he
pulled out the previous occasion.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is this -- is this the -- I
noticed this was Security State Bank.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is the equipment that we're
buying from Koch? Is this that piece of equipment?
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MR. ODOM: This is that zipper that we were talking
about, that milling machine.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But is that from -- there was
one that we had a problem on the financing side. Is that the
same --
MR. ODOM: The same machine.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We were not able to get the
financing?
MR. ODOM: Right.
JUDGE TINLEY: The County Attorney, I believe, has
approved all the documents.
MR. EMERSON: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Actually, what we did, we
shortened the period too, didn't we?
MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. I wanted to advertise it over
five, but we went ahead and had three, so it will work out.
I'll make it work.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. I move approval of the
agenda item, authorize the County Judge to sign same.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for approval
of the agenda item. Any question or discussion? All in favor
of the motion, signify by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.

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(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to
Item 4; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to
declare unusable Road and Bridge items as surplus and allow
them to be sold as scrap iron.
MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. We have many items in our
yard, and -- the main yard at Spur 100 and the -- behind the
Little League field and Ingram that need to be disposed of.
Space is a problem, and just aesthetic looks of the yards
don't -- don't fare too well. I've attached a few photos and
a list of items, and these are a general list of the things
that I have, and predominant, as an example, what needs to be
cleaned up. None of the items have value except as scrap.
All vehicular-type items have been salvaged for usable parts.
All cattle guards, culvert pipes, and tanks are unsafe for
use, and we will contact the local junk dealers and/or take
these items to San Antonio for scrap. The pipe, we thought
we'd try during the wintertime here over the next couple of
months and Christmas -- we want to try to get out there and
crush as much as we can to be able to take it forward and just
dispose of it. What we ask at this time is to declare such
items surplus and allow us to sell them as scrap, and to put
any funds we might receive for the sale of such items into our
Emulsion, Line Item 15-611-552, to help offset the increase in
oils that we were told about recently, which will come due in
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March. So, we anticipate a short rise in asphalt prices; from
the current 94 cents, we estimate maybe a buck, 20, so that's
substantial. Now, not saying that this scrap is going to
bring me this much. We have no idea until we weigh it out and
all, but it is some value, and a little value is better than
-- than no value.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I11 make a motion to declare the
items listed as surplus in Road and Bridge Department.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second.
MR. ODOM: Thank y'all.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to declare
the indicated items as surplus, allowing them to be sold as
scrap. Any question or discussion on the motion? All in
favor, indicate it by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(NO response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's move to
Item 6, if we might. Consider, discuss, and take appropriate
action to reappoint Charles Donellen to the Alamo Area Agency
on Aging, Senior Advisory Committee, effective 12-12-05.
Commissioner Williams?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Shortly after we appointed
Mr. Weinberg, I was notified by the Senior Advisory Committee
that Mr. Donellen's appointment expires this month and needs
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to be re-upped if we intend to do so. And he is a strong
participant in this and has been nominated to serve as
chairperson for the ensuing year, so I would nominate for
reappointment Mr. Charles Donellen to the Alamo Area Agency on
Aging, Senior Advisory Committee, effective today.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I second the motion.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Third.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for -- for
approval of the agenda item. Any question or discussion?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just one comment. Judge, we
need to prepare a letter and get that off in time for --
JUDGE TINLEY: I think it may already be prepared in
draft form, if I'm not mistaken.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Because he does have a
meeting --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: On the 14th.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Coming up.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or discussion on
the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising
your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
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(NO response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's now go
to Item 1, discussion and update on Kerr County
Sesquicentennial function. Commissioner Baldwin?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, sir. I've asked
Joe Herring, Jr., from the Historical Commission to come in to
kind of give us an update to see where we are and see what
we're doing and what we're going to do for Kerr County's 150th
birthday. The Honorable Joe Herring, Jr.
MR. HERRING: I'm Joe Herring. I reside in
Kerrville, Texas. I do need to make one correction; I'm
actually representing the Kerrville Area Chamber of Commerce.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sorry.
MR. HERRING: No. No, I just wanted to make sure
that I don't wear a hat which I'm not entitled to wear. Can I
give you a brief outline of where we are? And then I'm
certainly willing to take comments about what we're doing so
far. The actual date of the sesquicentennial is January 26th,
a little over a month from today. The date we will hope to
celebrate the sesquicentennial is a weekend, the first full
weekend in April; April 7, 8, and 9, 2006. We notice that the
Centennial Committee did the same thing, because our
forefathers didn't have the foresight to pick a date that was
-- had nice weather. We're hoping that the weather will be
better in April.
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Speaking of the Kerr County Historical Commission,
I've been in discussions with General Schellhase. They plan,
during that weekend, to have some living history exhibits at
the Union Church. I think that that will be the extent of
their participation. That weekend, Friday -- Thursday,
actually, there will be a style show, which is a Chamber
function, which will feature fashions for 150 years. And
Friday night, we're going to have events on the star down here
in downtown Kerrville, and we hope to celebrate the many
cultures that have been a part of our history. Saturday, we
hope to have a parade starting probably at the Wells Fargo
Bank area and going to the park. There'll also be an auto
show in the downtown area. That evening in Louise Hays Park,
we hope to have a musical event, and if the funding comes
through, we hope to have fireworks that night. Then on
Sunday, at the Cailloux Theater, we hope to have a memorial
service, as they did during the centennial. Now, at the
centennial, Howard Butt, Jr., spoke. We've invited him to
come again to speak at the memorial service that Sunday at the
Cailloux Center. The governor has also been invited to make
an appearance at whatever time is convenient for the governor.
To help raise money for the event, we're going -- we
are planning to make coins -- sell little coins. And this is
a design that was done by a student at Schreiner. What we did
at Schreiner, we opened it up to the Graphic Arts Department
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and made a contest out of it, and this is the winning entry.
You'll see on there a draw-knife kind of on the bottom. Looks
like Buster's been using it, 'cause it's all curved. Little
shingle yard, and those little things around the edge of the
coin are supposed to be shingles. We're also making -- making
communication with several other organizations to try to be a
part of the event. We've contacted H.E.B. Grocery Company.
We've contacted Schreiner University. We contacted the Texas
Arts and Crafts Fair people. We're trying to make it very
inclusive. We're not really contacting the other communities
yet. We thought we'd get through Christmas first, and then
get them fully on line with Center Point, Mountain Home, Hunt,
and Ingram. Ingram has its own Chamber of Commerce, and we
hope they'll also be a part of it. Trying to think if I'm
leaving anything out. The big thing is April 7th, 8th, and
9th. We anticipate the big flurry of activities to occur
after the holidays are over. I would make one request of the
Commissioners Court. The official -- the actual day, it would
be nice if the Court had some kind of small ceremony here at
the courthouse to commemorate that day; a little speechifying,
a little flag-waving might be nice.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Maybe even a political speech
or two.
MR. HERRING: That would be probably appropriate.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. I can't imagine that
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this season, but...
MR. HERRING: I'll be happy to help coordinate some
other resources for that event if the Commissioners would be
willing to have some small ceremony here.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, super.
MR. HERRING: On the actual date.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I bet we can do something.
MR. HERRING: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: How's the fundraising going?
MR. HERRING: Fundraising -- we haven't actually
started on the fundraising. What we're going to do, Kerrville
Area Chamber is just asking every member for $150. We feel if
we get 25 percent of our members -- I really wish this
wouldn't be reported. If we only get 25 percent
participation, we can more than fund the event. We want 100
percent participation, though.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But be realistic.
MR. HERRING: If that doesn't come about, we're
still okay.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I won't tell anybody.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Joe, I'm excited about the
parade.
MR. HERRING: Oh, sure.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The -- I'd like to see -- I'd
like to see the Sheriff lead the parade, and then each one of
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us in our own little float. And I've already secured my 1948
Lincoln convertible to ride in. And things like my wife's
family's ranch out at Mountain Home is one of the older
ranches out there, and they want to have their float with the
-- with the family ladies in their bonnets and the cookstove
and -- you know, to celebrate, with the ranch -- Smith Ranch
sign on it and all that. And I just think it would be
exciting for everybody to hop in and really participate in
this thing.
MR. HERRING: When we -- if you want to invite me
back in late January, early February, I can give you the names
of the chairpeople of all the -- I have some private
commitments, not public commitments yet, for people who will
be leading, like, the parade and the memorial service and
other parts of the event. I can give you those. We'll have a
full structure by then. I just -- with the holidays, it's
going to be hard to get anyone to commit to anything.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, Buster, your thought is that
each of us will ride in a vehicle, or be on a float?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Whatever you desire. I'm
going to ride in a vehicle.
MR. HERRING: We will try to make a place
appropriate for the entire Commissioners Court or individually
if they'd like to participate.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think individual cars is a
good idea.
MR. HERRING: It can be three-to-two; it can be
four-to-one.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Make it bigger.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I want to thank Joe for what
you're doing, and the Chamber, because what you've outlined is
really great, and we appreciate that very much.
MR. HERRING: And there are other events, ancillary
events taking place that weekend that will be incorporated in.
We've made contact with the Cherry Ball, which is that
weekend, and they're going to -- from what I understand,
they're going to make their theme compatible with the overall
event. So --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's so cool.
MR. HERRING: Yeah, it's going to be fun.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What day is January the 26th
on?
JUDGE TINLEY: Thursday.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: On a Thursday. So, we
probably need to have an agenda item to formally have a --
MR. HERRING: At least a resolution might be
appropriate.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think a gathering with
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coffee and cookies. The District Clerk always makes cookies
for us.
MR. HERRING: Some type of small birthday
celebration.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
MR. HERRING: When we first talked about this at our
committee, it was, you know, you only turn 150 once, so that's
nice to make it special.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is neat. I like it.
MR. HERRING: Anything else for me, guys?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you very much.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Joe.
JUDGE TINLEY: We appreciate your efforts and that
of the Chamber for taking this project on, coordination and so
forth.
MR. HERRING: The members of the Chamber that do
meet their goal will get a coin, so they may be very rare.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They may.
MR. HERRING: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move to Item 7; discuss,
consider, and take appropriate action on ownership and
maintenance of Turtle Creek Cemetery. Commissioner Baldwin?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, sir. I was handed
this several years ago. And -- I really was.
JUDGE TINLEY: I don't believe I'd have told that.
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, no, I'm going to get
out of it. Watch this. And so I immediately saw it as a
legal issue and turned it over to the County Attorney's
office, and then nothing ever happened, and it resurfaced
again this last week. So, with a new County Attorney, he is
-- you see -- in your packet, you see his opinion on -- on the
documents in the back here. I want to read Mr. Emerson's
note. It said, "It appears to me that Kerr County owns the
land so long as it is used and maintained as a cemetery." So,
it seems to me that Kerr County is a proud owner of a
cemetery. And -- but -- and, you know, I don't see any formal
action to be taken. It's -- it's a done thing that we own.
However, I would like permission from the Commissioners Court
to sit down with the County Attorney and work out some issues.
I think there probably needs to be -- the County owns it, and
there may be some liabilities. I don't know about that, but
there needs to be rules set up. I know that some of these
folks out in that community want us to take it over and
maintain it and keep it, and them keep running it, but that's
not the way it's going to work. So, if we're going to own it,
we need to have some rules and regulations or whatever you
want to call them to -- to keep the thing running properly and
that kind of thing. So --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, do we own other
cemeteries?
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is the only cemetery the
County owns?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who's been maintaining it up
till now?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The community out there. And
the -- what do you call those guys, weekend warriors?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Community service.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Community service folks have
done it. And years -- years ago, Road and Bridge took care of
all the cemeteries, or a number of them. And the -- legally,
we stopped that, thank God. And -- but, you know, this --
this is the only one, to my knowledge, that the County
officially owns, and so I just -- I just think that if we own
it, we need to run it. And it may be -- it may be put in the
Parks Department; I don't know. You know, we need to set up
ways to maintain it, you know, all those things.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Would the community be
interested in owning it, as opposed to the County owning it?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, they came to us with
this.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I know, but they may want
-- they may -- deep down, they may want to own it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Deep down. Well, we can get
a psychiatrist involved in this thing if you want to.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He's talking about the
community doing the maintenance, right?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Commissioner, you -- in
west Kerr -- maybe you may be more aware of this than I am --
I occasionally get requests from -- including biweekly, from
people that want us to maintain Nichols Cemetery. I'm pretty
sure we don't own it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Does this in any way set
any precedent for --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, I don't think so. I
mean, you see the actual document in here from many years ago,
that it was given to the County in 1977, actually. And, we've
been down that road many times about Nichols and Hunt and
Mountain Home and those cemeteries. It used to -- like,
Nichols is an example. We maintain the road that goes into
the gate. That's a county road going in there. We no longer
go inside. We used to. The County used to maintain that road
through there, and actually did the mowing and trimming and
the whole thing for many years, but we stopped that, I don't
know, a long time ago.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner do you want to -- a
motion to authorize you to kind of --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't think we need a
motion. I'm just going to do it anyway.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But I was trying to be nice.
JUDGE TINLEY: Is it your thinking, Commissioner,
that we should continue to own that cemetery? Even in the
face of a possible desire on the part of the people of that
area --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. No, not at all. It
needs to be in the community.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, there's cemetery associations
that you can form under the law, and it may well be that
people out in the Turtle Creek area want to form such an
association for the purpose of operating that cemetery. And
if so --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They sure might.
JUDGE TINLEY: -- it seems to me that I can't think
of any good news by virtue of the County owning a cemetery.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Me either.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Such is the case in Center
Point.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Most of them are owned by
associations; that's why I asked the question, if they have
any desire. Because --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I -- the reason I
negatived that is because they have come to us --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- and said, "Please take
care of your cemetery."
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, I'll be happy to visit
with them and make that offer, and -- but I want to -- I want
Re r, to be in on the whole thing, because I have some strange
feelings about it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, if they want it, they've
got my vote.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, mine too.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yes.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's three; there's a
majority.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But we own it. We officially
own it.
JUDGE TINLEY: We can solve that --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can give it to them.
JUDGE TINLEY: -- that deficiency.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Y'all are so nice. Thank
you.
JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move to Item 5. I'm not sure
if this one is ready for consideration. Consider, discuss,
and take appropriate action on proposed conditional lease
agreement between Kerr County and the Hill Country Mounted
Peace Officers Association for the construction of a multi-use
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facility adjacent to Kerr County Law Enforcement Center for
MR. EMERSON: I don't have a clue, Judge.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I did see Mr. Chapa this
morning, and they were supposed to be -- he knows what time it
was and said that they were planning on being here. I know
that they were also busy this morning, so it's -- game
wardens, so you may want to just pass it for a little while
longer yet and see if they show up.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, we'll defer further action on
that item and come back to it. Let's go to Item 8, if we
might; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to
address the $94,001 Library Fund balance that was paid to Kerr
County -- I guess that was to be paid to Kerr County by
October 15, 2004. Commissioner Nicholson?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: You've got some
the purpose of getting this on the agenda is to try to get
some resolution to this issue. It's a mystery about what
happened to the $94,000, and I haven't been able to solve the
mystery. And just a little bit of background; in budget
deliberations for 2004-2005 budget, we got a request from the
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library; I think it was $406,000 -- it was something around
And then -- so
that was in the summer of 2004. On August 25, 2004, we got a
copy of a letter -- no, we got a letter from -- the County
Judge and Commissioners Court got a letter from the City
Manager outlining joint programs data, and under the library
portion of that, he said that there would be a single equity
payment to both participating entities to return the excess
fund balance. This return of equity equates to $94,001 per
entity. It goes on to say the return of equity would be
returned to the County via check no later than October 15,
2004.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, if you would --
either you or I would read that exact paragraph, I think
that's a very important paragraph to understand what the City
-- what the City said, and --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: "For the past several
years, the Library has been able to absorb major budget
increases from larger than required fund balances. While this
has helped keep the cost of operations apparently low, we will
no doubt lose this fund balance at some point. Moreover,
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there is an excessive fund balance tied up in the Library
Fund, which could and should be returned to both agencies. To
bring this fund into proper budgetary guidelines, we are
proposing a single equity payment to the participating
entities. In other words, the Library will return the excess
fund balance (above the required 5 percent) to the City and
County. This return of equity equates to $94,001 per entity.
To further this realignment of the budget, the Library staff
was asked to bring a balanced budget forward where the
revenues equaled the expenses. As a result, the participation
levels" -- there's a typo -- "from the City and County have
increased from $390,523 to $416,113. The formula for
calculating this funding requirement is simply expenditures
minus service revenue divided by two. This funding level
gives us a base funding level from which to build on from year
to year. Coupled with return of equity, the total net cost
for the County is $323,329, which is $67,194 less than the
current year. The return of equity ($94,001) will be returned
to the County via check no later than October 15th, 2004."
Again, that was written on August 25, 2004.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: As I read that, especially that
last sentence, to me, that means that that year we were
supposed to pay $323,329 to the City for our 50 percent cost,
and we were supposed to receive $94,001 in a check. We, as I
recall, spent the 323 -- or transferred the $323,329 to the
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City, and the issue now is we never received the $94,000
check.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's true. And the first
time that -- at least the first time that it came to my
attention that that was the circumstance is when we were
meeting jointly with the -- the City Council, and we were -- I
think this was in our meeting on the library, and we were
delivered a -- a package that included library budget
worksheets called Line Item Justification Worksheet, and
you've got copies of two of those. One of them shows that
$94,001 was returned of equity to the City of Kerrville, and
the other one notes that Kerr County reduced monthly payment
instead of accepting one-time check for a return of equity.
And I can't tell from that how much was captured. It talks
about the current budget being $94,001 and future budget being
zero.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But with that being the case,
though, with that statement on there, which I don't know that
the County ever -- I don't recall the County ever being in on
that decision, but if it was made -- I should say I don't
recall the Commissioners Court being in on that decision;
someone in the County may have. The amount we should have
been paid should have been $323,329 minus $99,001, and
$230,000, approximately, should have been what we transferred
to the City that year. But I think we transferred more than
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that.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Well, I think -- I'm not
sure if we started to get data. I think what happened is we
paid our 323.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: And they captured the
difference between 323 and what the library asked for from our
94,000. County Judge wrote Don Davis, the Interim City
Manager, on October 7th, asking for an explanation. Who
authorized it? What was -- did anybody in Kerr County
government authorize that? He later got a letter from the new
City Manager essentially saying I don't know how it happened.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, there's one from Brian
Brooks.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: "As to how the application
was to occur, there is no specific documentation." What I
would like is for the City to tell this Commissioners Court
that City Council approved the capturing of the $94,000 of the
County's funds. If they didn't approve it, how was that
accomplished? Who had -- who did it and what was their
authority for -- for capturing that $94,000? I have no
recollection of -- of this Court ever discussing or having
any -- there being any inference that we would spend that
$94,000 instead of receiving a check for it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess -- I guess my question
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-- I still have a question as to the -- in the letter from Ron
Patterson, the then City Manager, of August 25th, that last
paragraph under the library, which says we trust -- I mean, it
clearly says there that we were supposed to pay 323 and get
$94,000 back. There was no netting discussed, and if there
was a netting done, as the later doc -- the other
documentation shows, it should have come off the 323.
Shouldn't have come off the 416.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's true.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's what they said they were
doing, you know.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: What -- and they were very
-- Mr. Patterson was very specific; "You will get the check by
October 15th." One of the things that concerns me is that we
have spent $94,000 of Kerr County money, taxpayer money, that
wasn't budgeted and wasn't authorized by Kerr County
government, and that either -- it would have taken a budget
amendment if we had -- if we had consciously made a decision
that we were going to spend down that fund to pay it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: My recollection of events is
similar to yours, but if I recall correctly, in our
discussions, when we arrived at the 323, we did so knowing
that the previous year, we had spent something in the area of
357, and we hadn't gotten any numbers from them at that time.
And we said, okay, we're going to select a number, and we did,
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and it was around 323 and change. Now, that was before we
were made to know that -- I believe, that there was a $99,000
credit forthcoming. If you add the 94 on the 357, you come to
451, which is even greater than the 416 that he said was
supposed to be Kerr County's obligation for that particular
budget year. So, the numbers just don't wash out.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Commissioner, my
recollection is somewhere in our discussions, we came to
believe that the library could spend less, and that I recall
that one of us -- could have been me -- said that the library
needs to go on a diet. So, it was our intention that we were
going to fund less. It was not our intention we were going to
fund what they requested and let it be paid by a drawing down
on our account.
JUDGE TINLEY: You're exactly right, Commissioner.
The -- the lesser figure of 323 was purposely adopted by this
Court on the basis that they needed to be able to operate for
less. And we -- the entire Court was concerned that there
were -- we'd not gotten numbers we felt like we were entitled
to. And back when we had the joint meeting just prior to the
end of last year's budget year, looking toward this current
budget year, with the members of the City Council upstairs,
specifically on the library item, and it came to light that
the -- the 94,000 return of equity fund had been appropriated
and applied to, quote, our share of the budget. I indicated
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at that time to the City officials present that I thought that
was going to come as quite a surprise to the members of this
Court, and looking around at their faces at that time, it
certainly did. And, as a consequence, that's why I wrote the
letter that I did asking for what notification we'd received
that that, in fact, had occurred, and secondly, who
purportedly, acting on behalf of Kerr County, ever authorized
or approved it. And that's when we got back the letter some
more than 30 days later in which the response was, Gee, we
don't know; we can't find any record either way of anything.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think an important point of
this is that -- is that we're not trying to -- at least I'm
not trying to bring up this whole issue of funding the
library. I think we're in good shape right now. Everything
is hopefully going forward properly. The issue to me is that
there is -- it's a budget issue. Shouldn't make any
difference whether it's City of Kerrville or anybody else. We
should have received and were told we were going to receive
and thought we were going to receive and budgeted to receive
$94,001, which we didn't receive that we can tell, and I think
that needs to be followed through from an audit standpoint.
It has nothing to do with the -- you know, why we did or what
we did, you know, with all the other things that have happened
related to the library. This is a pure budget issue that, you
know, we need to either -- and we can't go back and amend the
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budget from that year -- I mean from two years ago. But it
does need to be accounted for.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, it's a return of
equity situation, and it comes from funds that we had put in
along with the City over the years that had -- and fines and
fees that had gathered in reserve accounts that hadn't been --
hadn't been expended, so that's what it's all about.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Like Number 9 said, the -- it
appears that we have spent $94,001 without authorization. My
question is, our $94,001 out there in thin air floating around
somewhere, where is their -- have you been able to see where
their $99,001 is?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: No, not -- not clearly.
This -- this document I gave you that's called a Line Item
Justification Worksheet, it appears to me that of their
$94,001, they captured $70,501. I think that probably went
back in their general fund. I don't -- I don't know why there
would be such an odd number like that, why they didn't write
themselves a check for $94,001 like they said they were going
to write to us. The whole thing could be cleared up by the
City giving us a check.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Let me ask you, where do we
-- how do we pursue this?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would -- I'm looking at the
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date of this one, November 10th. I think that this is
something that should probably be referred to the new City
Manager. I mean, this -- Brian Brooks was the interim at the
time. I don't know that Mr. Hofmann is even aware of this
situation, and I don't know whether -- you know, probably the
easiest, you know, is maybe for you to go over and to talk to
Mr. Hofmann and show him this and say we just need to
understand what happened -- what happened to it, and it needs
to be resolved from a budget standpoint in the county. And --
and see what happens. I mean, you know, my experience has
been that Mr. Hoffman's been, you know, very diligent to work
with, and I think that he's the -- that's the proper channel
to go at this point.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'll do that.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else on that particular
agenda item? Let's move to Item 9; consider, discuss, and
take appropriate action on the construction at the Animal
Control facility.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Let's see. We do have a
permit. Construction's under way. A little bit of delay
trying to get the plumbing in, the -- the foundations framed
up, and as soon as we get plumbing in, then we'll pour a slab.
Steel has been delivered to the site, so as soon as we get
the -- the slab in there and get it secured, we'll be able to
begin the erection process. The good news is that the
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contractor met with City officials, and -- and they decided
that we would not be required to build a sidewalk along --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Got some good news and some
bad news. The good news is we don't have to build a sidewalk
along that Landfill Road, I think it's called. And it really
would -- doesn't qualify, I think, even under their code,
because it's essentially a private road that's gated at night,
even. And our facility is also gated, so we don't have to
build that piece. They are requiring that we build the piece
that runs along the loop there, and, it's probably going to
cost close to $7,000. Ms. Roman is pursuing some
possibilities of getting somebody to pay that cost for us, so
we may have a resolution on that. It would be easy to
criticize the need to build sidewalks in a place like that.
They're frequently called sidewalks to nowhere. But since
residences, commercial operations, even churches are required
under the code to build these sidewalks, I don't -- I don't
think we can justify even thinking about pursuing an exception
to that. I noticed the Church of Christ right out there on
the loop close by, and they had to build a sidewalk, and it
goes to a ravine. No possibility of it ever being used, but
it's a nice sidewalk.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with you. The only
thing that I disagree with is that there's going to be a
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sidewalk of about one block, and it -- on either end, it
doesn't continue. It's just -- you know, by the time we
get -- the other folks get around to building their little
sidewalks, ours is going to be crumbled, and that just doesn't
make sense to me. But --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, what is the -- do
you have any idea, I guess, of what the -- what the value of
the property that we have out there now versus the value of
the improvement? What I'm wondering is -- and I made this
statement before -- that I hope the City, newt time they do
any kind of a sewer upgrade to their plant, they build a
sidewalk in front of their sewer plant to connect to our
sidewalk, because that's the only reason for us to build a
sidewalk there, is to connect to their sidewalk which they
need to build.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: People aren't going to go
out there to the Animal Control facility looking for a pet and
say, "I think I'll take a stroll down to the..."
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sewer plant.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The sewer plant.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Commissioner, I'm curious as
to how much added capacity will this give us at the Animal
Control facility?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I don't have that -- I know
that, but I've forgotten.
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JUDGE TINLEY: Almost double, as I recall.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Almost double. It's going
to solve a problem that we had looming on the horizon in
having -- being required to have more -- more facilities. So,
it's a wonderful thing to have. I commented to Commissioner
Letz that I've done some building out in the county, and now
I'm coordinating some building in the city, and there's a
world of difference. It's a long process, and it's more
expensive than building out in the county.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: My hope is that with the
expansion, to me, that means that we'll be able to keep
animals longer, two or three days, and the euthanization
program would be minimalized at least. And that seems --
that's always been the big cry of some folks.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That is all I've got on it
for now. I'm glad it's moving along. Be glad when we can
occupy it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: One final note on that. And I
know the -- the donor is -- chose to be anonymous, but I
thought what we may want to do is, I think -- but I think it's
very important to let the public know that it was a private
donation, and even if we just put in a plaque and put, "This
expansion was provided by an anonymous donor," I think it
would be appropriate. It would -- we could work that in
somewhere to put on it there.
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COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: And for -- every
opportunity we can find to get some publicity and educate
people about the need to take care of their pets, we take
those opportunities. It'd probably be good if we had an
opening ceremony or something like that, and the
not-so-anonymous donor might choose to be there.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We might be able to -- Jon,
as a fundraiser, be able to sell the little pavers like they
have downtown. You could have your name put in that sidewalk
out there that goes nowhere. And --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How about memorializing the
pawprint of your pet?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, god, that is good.
JUDGE TINLEY: You're overwhelmed, I can tell,
Commissioner Baldwin.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That -- that one did me in.
I'm ready to go home. What a great idea.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: While the concrete's wet,
let him walk through it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else on that particular
item? Let's move to Item 10, if we might. Consider, discuss,
and take appropriate action on Field Agreement between U.S.
Department of Agriculture, Animal/Plant Health Inspection
Service, Wildlife Services, and Texas Wildlife Damage
Management Service -- and Texas Wildlife Damage Management
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Association, Inc., and Kerr County. I put this on the agenda.
We were presented with a new contract from the Department of
Attorney's blessing, and secondly, I had some concerns about
the amounts that were specified in there in view of what we
had done earlier in connection with the interlocal agreement
with Kendall County, and channeling $5,000 of funds for
Trapper -- as a contribution to the Kendall County Trapper to
do the east end of Kerr County. I note in Fund 10-660, we
have budgeted 26,600, which was up 5,000 from the previous
year. This contract calls for just $200 short of all of that.
So, I guess my issue is more a budget concern than anything
else, and I -- this is kind of Commissioner Letz' bailiwick,
so I wanted to kind of get this cleared up.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Unless I'm dreaming, which is
possible, I thought that the -- someone from the Trapper
Services came by and told us that there was an increase coming
from them. I mean, I think there was another discussion we
I don't think it was Mr. Simms, but I thought it was --
somebody came in at one time, and -- during the budget
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process, and mentioned that there was an increased fee. I
mean, there was 5,000 that we had added in for the Kendall
County issue, and I thought that there was a -- I remember,
you know, that there was an increase charged on the other one
as well, but I didn't think it was -- I don't remember how
much it was. That's my recollection. The 5,000 -- the 5,000
additional that was put in there was intended for Kendall
County; it was not intended for -- but I recall hearing
something about this.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This, I believe, is 26 --
$6,900 short. Right? Didn't we appropriate 20,000 plus five?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: What did we appropriate?
JUDGE TINLEY: We appropriated 26,6, so we've got an
excess of $200 over and above this.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, 4,700.
JUDGE TINLEY: So we're $4,800 short on the 5,000
required for the interlocal agreement. And -- unless at the
time that we -- we -- the thinking was we were going to take
that from somewhere else. But I remember in the transcript,
Commissioner Letz said no, the funds are budgeted.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
JUDGE TINLEY: And you apparently were thinking
about the fact that we added five to this, which we, in fact,
did.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
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JODGE TINLEY: But now the contract has come in
$5,000 more.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't have any other -- I
don't remember anything further, other than the -- the 5,000
addition was for the Kendall County issue. I thought we were
aware of an increase, but I'm not sure -- I don't remember the
details. Does anyone else recall us even hearing that, or did
I hear that from --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't recall anybody
walking in here and saying that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Maybe it's a letter.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think we got a letter from
somebody, and that's as far as I can tell you. But --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't recall it either.
All I recall is we added 5,000, and the purpose of that --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- addition was you were
going to negotiate for eastern Kerr County with Kendall County
for services.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I just remember receiving
something from the Trapper Service related to funding. There
was an increase, but I was also thinking that there was
something in that letter -- or I believe I talked to the guy,
that the timing was going to be such that it wouldn't affect
us right away. But, anyway, that could be --
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JUDGE TINLEY: It appears, then, that we're left
with one or two options. Number one, go back to the U.S.D.A.
and say, you know, maybe we ought to think about renegotiating
this contract, because Kerr County function is going to be
less because we've included part in the Kendall County Trapper
Program interlocal agreement. Or, two, find an additional
$4,800 to sign this --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we need to go back to
the Trapper Service first anyway. I mean, I'm -- one thing
that comes to mind, I certainly want to continue to deal with
Kendall County, and the mechanism set up is I think we pay
30 percent, or is it a third of the salary for a trapper?
And, I don't know; that number looks too high for a third of a
trapper salary to me. So, let me visit with Mr. Simms.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I'll bring this back at our
next meeting or first meeting in January, one or the other.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything further on this item by any
member of the Court? Let's go to Item 11, if we might;
consider, discuss, and take appropriate action on interlocal
agreement with the City of Kerrville concerning subdivision
platting jurisdiction within the ETJ. Commissioner Letz.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I think part of my
answer -- I just saw Mr. Hofmann, the City of Kerrville City
Manager, walk in, so maybe he can give us a little -- maybe
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that's why he's here, on this issue. I'm not sure. I will
make another comment, that Commissioner Baldwin and I have met
gone through this. What I'm handing out right now is a -- a
summary prepared by Mr. Menzies that compares Kerr County
subdivision rules in a draft version that we've kind of been
looking at with the City of Kerrville subdivision rules from a
-- their rural requirements. And if you look at this, you'll
note that our rules are very, very close. In fact, a couple
of the changes that we've made on the right-of-way widths, our
new rules have been changed again since then to even make it a
little bit closer. With that being said, there's really no
reason -- I mean, from the standpoint it's up to the
developers, it's not that much difference in the requirements.
The handwritten notes in the bottom are hard to read, but what
it basically, you know, points out is that the cost or the fee
structure is very similar as well. And with all that said and
done, Commissioner Baldwin and I thought it was -- agreed with
Mr. Hofmann that it made just as much sense for -- as long as
the ETJ is 1 mile, to let the City of Kerrville be responsible
for subdivision platting in the entire ETJ up to a 1-mile
range. There would be an interlocal agreement memorializing
that. It is going to be prepared by the City of Kerrville,
and then there would be a six-month period to work out a few
details on the -- that are listed where differences do exist
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currently. That's kind of -- that's my recollection.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That is correct. It's also
my understanding that the City of Kerrville has basically two
sets of regulations, one for in town and one for out of town.
And I wasn't -- why don't you come up here? I wasn't real
clear when we left our meeting recently of that, which one of
those set of rules that you will apply to ETJ areas.
MR. HOFMANN: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: For the record, you'll need to
identify yourself.
MR. HOFMANN: Okay. Thank you, Judge. I'm Paul
Hofmann, City Manager for the City of Kerrville. And if I may
kind of come around and -- and get to Commissioner Baldwin's
question -- and thank you, Commissioner Letz; I think you did
a really good job of summarizing this issue and actually
pulling all this together for us. You guys probably know all
this already, but you know what we're essentially dealing with
here is a state law requirement that mandates that cities and
counties decide -- resolve who will be the sole provider of
subdivision inspection and approval activities in the city's
extraterritorial jurisdiction, and that requirement is that we
have that in place by January 1st, 2006. So, shortly after I
came on board here, this was a priority identified for me by
the mayor and City Council. I had one conversation with the
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City Council about what we would try to accomplish here and
how we would try to approach it, an~3 Council agreed with that
and asked me to visit with Commissioners Letz and Baldwin, who
I understand have been representing the County on this.
And, as Mr. Letz said, Paul Menzies and I met with
the Commissioners a couple of times to outline what we thought
were basically the issues, and as Mr. Letz said, that revolves
mainly around how the City approaches rural subdivision
standards. As Mr. Baldwin was alluding to, we have a
Subdivision Code -- and this isn't unlike how I understand
most cities do this -- that speaks to standard dense urban
subdivision activity as one set of subjects and one set of
criteria and requirements, and we have another set of
requirements and -- requirements and standards that speak to
rural subdivision development, where the streets are narrower,
the -- we don't have the requirement for curb and gutter and
sidewalks and underground storm sewer, and there is more
flexibility on lot sizes and how lot sizes relate to where
utilities come from and whether utilities are provided from a
central system or from on-site septic and water well. So, as
Mr. Letz said, in this discussion we focused on rural
subdivision standards.
The concern raised by your representatives -- and
this makes all the sense in the world to me -- from the very
beginning was, let's make sure that we're sending a clear and
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consistent message to the development community about whose
rules should we follow here? And so, because of that, we
focused on rural subdivision activity and looked at where
these differences are significant, but there are some
differences. And, so, one of the elements of this resolution
that's on your agenda today and will be on the City Council's
agenda for tomorrow night is a commitment to identify what all
those differences are -- and I think you saw the spreadsheet
we prepared that outlined all of that -- and to resolve to
deal with those differences within six months of your
approving this. And, as we discussed, we would suggest that
we work with the development community, the local builders and
contractors association, to go over those differences and make
sure they have the opportunity to comment on all that, and
we'll resolve to do that within six months.
As I think these two gentlemen both said, too, we
are dealing with a 1-mile ETJ today. As you may know, as soon
as the City of Kerrville hits a population threshold of
25,000, that would go to a 2-mile ETJ, and so we commit within
this resolution that's on your agenda that within a year,
December of '06, we will revisit this whole agreement and see
at that time how close we are to that 25,000 population
threshold, and at that time decide what to do. And that may
change this agreement and it may not. We're also committing
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and resolving, both sides are, to -- if, for example, there is
a subdivision activity within what would be the 2-mile ET J,
is subdivision activity within the 1-mile ET J, we resolve to
share that information, both from a review standpoint and
after it's platted, with the relevant people in the county. I
think that's essentially it. I think this is a really big
deal. I think it speaks well for the two folks that you've
had represent the County here, and I think all of our
interests are being managed and maintained here, and it's a
good message out to the community.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: My recollection was that Mike
Hayes was going to prepare an agreement.
MR. HOFMANN: He did, and he shared that with -- and
I apologize this wasn't more timely, but that was shared with
your County Attorney, I think, Thursday afternoon.
MR. EMERSON: Do you want me to comment on that? I
was gone in San Antonio, as most of y'all know, Wednesday,
Thursday, and Friday, and I picked it up off the computer this
morning, called Mr. Hayes and talked to him.
MR. HOFMANN: Okay.
MR. EMERSON: We discussed one change in Paragraphs
3 and 4, because of the mandatory statutory requirements for
processing plats, that some kind of a specific time frame be
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inserted there for the other entity to comment on reciprocal
plats.
MR. HOFMANN: Oh, and we'd be agreeable to that if
you want to stick an amount of days. Right now, I think the
language is not specific. It says "a reasonable amount of
time," and so if you wanted to suggest a reasonable number of
days, that would be fine.
MR. EMERSON: I mean, other than that, the agreement
appears to benefit both parties.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't see a problem. We have
one more meeting -- I don't know if the City Council -- they
can probably act on it tomorrow.
MR. HOFMANN: This is our -- I'm sorry. Tomorrow
night is our last council meeting, so I apologize for the
rush, but this is our last opportunity to enter into an
agreement on the Council's side, and meet the January 1
deadline.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can the -- rather than do an
unknown document, is it all right if we let Rex and Mike work
out a deal, you all approve it, and then we approve the same
version exactly at our next meeting?
MR. HOFMANN: That'd be great, thank you.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 'Cause I think -- as long as the
rest of the Court's agreeable with the concept that we've
outlined.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No problem. I'd be fine
with it.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Couple questions,
Commissioner. This -- after this agreement, any subdivision
in the ETJ will get a -- would be approved by one entity or
the other, not both?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Be approved by the City.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay. All right. But they
won't have to come to us?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Won't come to us.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: This -- this deals with
approval of subdivisions. It doesn't have anything to do with
permitting or construction inspections or anything like that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's correct.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Are sidewalks a part of the
Subdivision Rules?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: They're not part of the rural
standards.
MR. HOFMANN: That is correct. You are correct.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Not the rural standards. That's
an interesting point.
MR. HOFMANN: They're not required in rural
subdivisions.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: What is interesting, I asked
Mr. Hofmann, how do we know that -- if it's rural or -- or the
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urban, what rules they're using? I stated -- I said I had
this fear that they were never going to use the rural rules.
He said basically it's up to the developer. If the developer
wants the -- if he wants to go out into the ETJ and put in a
high-density development, then he has to use the urban rules.
If he's in the ETJ and wants to put in a 5-acre lot size
development, he's under the rural rules. So, it's driven by
the developer, their choice. So, yes, if they're -- if
someone's going into Creekwood and putting half-acre lots in,
yes, they're going to put sidewalks in. But if they're doing
a 5-acre development, no, they're not. That makes sense.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: One of the small differences
between the city and the county is the right-of-way on a
collector road. The City requires 80 feet; the County
requires 50 feet. And the more I look at that, the more I
think about it and more I listen to Leonard Odom through the
years, then -- (Cell phone rang.) Somebody get a handle on
that. I think -- actually, I think that we need to move from
the 60 closer to the 80, and closer to the City. So, it would
be even -- even -- did I say that correctly? Y'all are
sitting there with blank looks on your faces.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. I understand, yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: If --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It would just be, you know,
even -- even closer to the city.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: The --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think that we need to get
more right-of-way. That's -- we've been asking for that for
years, and can't seem to get it.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: What's --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: His wish is about to come true.
I was trying to say when he's -- when the new draft is
unveiled at 2:00 o'clock today of our Subdivision Rules, the
collector issue -- the third and fourth item will almost
disappear. We're increasing road widths and increasing
right-of-way.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: What -- why does the County
desire to have more right-of-way? Why is 80 better than 60?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's the type of the road. It's
only 80 for a collector. A larger road with a higher volume,
you end up with a -- the likelihood of having to make it into
a four-lane road or something like that at some point, or
divide it. If it's a local road, it's still 60 foot. And I
will have to say there's a -- if you really go out into some
rural subdivisions, it's pretty darn hard to put a road on a
60-foot right-of-way up a hillside.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, it's -- and if you get
into a higher volume of traffic, I definitely think you need
the 80 foot.

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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think you're looking down
the road to see growth and being able to widen and handle more
traffic and that kind of thing.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That makes sense.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just as a matter of
information, Mr. Hofmann, does the City require building
permits in the ETJ?
MR. HOFMANN: No, sir, we do not.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you.
MR. HOFMANN: And that's a state law thing.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else on this particular
item?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Paul, I just wanted to tell
you, just a few minutes ago, or a little earlier today, Mr.
Letz was talking about -- you know how those Germans are from
down in Comfort -- talking about all kind of things, but he
was saying nice things about you.
MR. HOFMANN: That's good to hear.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: About our relationship and
how it's growing and -- and all that. So, we told y'all he
was a nice guy, and he is a nice guy, and we appreciate your
-- appreciate you coming over today, and --
MR. HOFMANN: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- with your explanation.
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Very clear and concise.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And you're so nice, we're also
going to be giving you a new problem, which Mr. Nicholson --
Commissioner Nicholson is going to continue with later, so
when you read it in the paper tomorrow, you'll know.
MR. HOFMANN: Well, that's our job, is solving
problems. Thank you.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Before you solve it, we say
thank you.
MR. HOFMANN: Yes, sir. Enjoyed working with you on
it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else on that particular
item? Let's move to Item 12 before the break; consider,
discuss, and take appropriate action on possible revisions to
the Kerr County Information Technology policy. I put this on
the agenda as a result of some issues that came up concerning
some I.T. issues dealing with the District Judges upstairs.
And since putting it on the agenda, have we got this thing
solved and we don't need to address policy? Or tell me where
we are. I know you've had some discussions with a lot of
folks, Mr. Trolinger, and tell me where we are on it.
MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. Good morning. And as far
as the actual Information Technology policy, I'd like to say
that this particular issue didn't exactly pertain to the
policy; it more pertained to network security, where there was
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a major crisis and I made a change to -- to block a very
potentially damaging virus from the county network. Now, as I
see it right now, the issue is revolved, so no action there.
As far as the Information Technology policy, Commissioner
Williams and myself have been discussing for some three or
four months that it needs a review so that we can update the
policy -- the county policy in regards to the modern
standards, since this was written in 2004, the policy that we
have now. So, I do recommend that we review the -- the
current policy.
JUDGE TINLEY
But as of today, you're not
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let me refresh the Court's
memory just a little bit, Judge, on this topic. In '04, when
we provided a draft of Information Technology, I prepared that
and used as a base model the information technology policy
that was in place by the Alamo Area Council of Governments.
We conducted a series of workshops and informed all the
department heads. There was a good bit of input and a lot of
changes, and the result was our own policy. I gave John,
about three or four weeks ago, again a copy of the information
technology policies that are in place by the Council on
Governments, because there were some new wrinkles in that one,
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and they had to do with information technology training
policy, mobile phone policy, notebook computer policy, and a
personal data PDA-type policy. And these are -- he's reviewed
them, but we have not sat down to discuss what, if any,
changes we want to make to the Kerr County one. We'll do that
again, and if there are changes to be recommended for the
future, we'll come back to court at that time.
JUDGE TINLEY: Good. Thank you. Anything further
on that agenda item by any member of the Court? Why don't we
stand in recess for about 15 minutes.
(Recess taken from 10:29 a.m. to 10:45 a.m.)
JUDGE TINLEY: Let's come back to order, if we
back to work. Let's move to Item Number 13, if we might.
Consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to change or
modify Kerr County's personnel policy with regard to
compensatory time off and/or overtime. I've put this on the
agenda after talking with Ms. Harris out at the detention
facility about the difficulty she has had more recently in
trying to obtain staffing for her facility out there. And the
-- the thought in mind is that if she's given more latitude in
when those employees are allowed to take their compensatory
time off, rather than having to pay that overtime every
quarter, she thinks she can reduce the payroll load to that
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facility. Did I correctly phrase that?
MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Bottom line?
MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir, you did.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I think Ms. Harris has
provided us with some information concerning that issue. I
think essentially what your thought is, is that each
department be allowed to determine for that department whether
it's done on a quarterly basis or an annual basis, or --
MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Just so long as it's done within the
same fiscal year.
MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir, as long as it's taken off the
books by the end of the fiscal year. For my department, I
would like to probably put a deadline date of somewhere around
August, the middle of August. That would allow any loose ends
to be taken care of before the end of the fiscal year, 'cause
there would be some compensatory time that would be accrued
between the middle of August and the end of September, such
as, like, for staff meetings, because I require staff
meetings. That would be -- it would be a minimal amount. The
reason why, if I could have -- or if it could be under the
discretion of every department head and elected official if
they want to do it on a quarterly basis or take the entire
fiscal year, one of the rationales that I had put down is the
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constant changeover in staff -- excuse me -- changeover in
staff at the facility. And you -- and y'all have been aware
of the difficulty of keeping staff out there, which requires
that my full-time staff have to fill in the gaps, since we are
mandated by the State that we have to maintain certain ratios.
During the T.Y.C. project, we went through three
rounds of hiring for part-time staff, and as you are well
aware, the reason why, as of Friday, we no longer have the
T.Y.C. project is due to the fact that we simply could not get
the staff, keep the staff. And going through so many rounds
of hiring, it became -- it became a nightmare, for one thing,
and it was just not cost-efficient. And the full-time staff
that had to fill in those gaps to maintain both buildings, of
course, accrued compensatory time. They have already begun --
they started this weekend taking compensatory time. The only
viable time is our night shift, in essence, really, that we
can take compensatory time is our night shift, because your
resident-to-staff ratio is much greater. It's 1-to-18, so we
can send people home at night. With that rotating schedule
that we have that y'all have seen, it's not a continuous time
that they are on the night shift. Like, you don't have one
set of people that's on the night shift all the time; it's on
a rotating basis. So, in order to catch as many of those
nighttime shifts as we can, that's why I'm requesting that --
if we could have to the end of the fiscal year to give the
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comp time off.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have two comments. One, my
recollection is -- I mean, I was on the Court when we went to
this. We used to do all compensatory time, and you can run a
long period of time with it. And the problem we got into was,
from a budget standpoint, it was very, very costly, and we
couldn't budget for it very well because at the end of the
year we'd have these huge checks we were writing. We cannot
get in that situation again.
MS. HARRIS: Right.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that's why I think we went
to the quarterly period, so that we can kind of keep the books
clear, so -- from a budget standpoint through the year, and
not be hit with a huge payroll expenditure at the very end of
the year, when we had to do this. So, that would be my
concern as to -- you know, that we cannot get into that trap
if we go back to kind of relax the length of time that we use
the compensatory time. And my other question is really just
to Rer, more. Is one year a reasonable amount of time? I
mean, I don't know -- I guess it's a legal issue as to whether
or not allowing a one-year period is reasonable or not under
the labor law.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm just wondering,
Commissioner, to avoid the problem you cite, which is the
reason why we have it the way it is, if, instead of changing
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our policy, we could suspend the policy just for the Juvenile
Detention Facility for the balance of this budget year. That
would accommodate the Juvenile Detention Facility's need, but
keep the policy in place. We would know that at the end of
the budget year, it should be cleared out.
MS. HARRIS: That would be --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tell me how this
recommendation would help your problem with -- you use the
word "changeover" of staff. How's -- how would this help?
MS. HARRIS: It wouldn't help. I was giving you --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're just looking for
something to do? I mean, why -- what are we doing here?
MS. HARRIS: We are trying to give me more time in
order for my full-time staff to eat up the compensatory time
that they accrued during three rounds of tryinq to staff the
facility during the T.Y.C. project, and it would allow them to
eat this compensatory time up rather than have to pay them the
15th of January, which would be a substantial amount, and it
would help our budget and it would help the taxpayers of Kerr
County that they would not be out that much money, because
they would be taking time for time, and it would just allow me
more time do that.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Have you looked at all this?
MR. EMERSON: I haven't seen any backup.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They -- well, I didn't get
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the backup till just now, either, so I don't know. But she
cites F.L.S.A. in here, and --
MR. EMERSON: I just have to go look at it. I mean,
I don't know the answer off the top of my head.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's really -- I mean, I
think it's -- I kind of like Commissioner Williams' idea of
suspending it for a year; that we're not changing the policy.
I'd like to get input, though, probably at our next meeting.
I don't think we have enough information to do it today if Rex
just received this, because the legal implications are pretty
important from a federal standpoint. Get some input from both
Rex and the Treasurer from a personnel standpoint and policy
standpoint, to make sure that we're not doing something that's
going to get us into trouble.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'd like to hear from
Ms. Nemec. Is she still in the audience?
MS. NEMEC: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: With respect to either a
change of policy or -- or a -- just a suspension of the policy
for Juvenile Detention Facility for the remainder of this
budget year, how do you see either affecting this issue?
MS. NEMEC: Well, the thing that I was concerned
about when Ms. Harris told me about this was if, legally, the
Court could treat another department differently than what the
other departments are being treated. And what TAC -- the
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legal department at TAC told me was that you -- you all did
have the authority to do that. The Fair Labor Board does not
recommend that do you that, but you do have the authority to
do that. The other thing is that if you are going to do that,
one of the reasons that we did it was that, as employees work
and they don't take that time off, if an employee leaves
employment and then you promote this employee to that position
at a higher pay, when you pay that comp time off, you're going
to be paying it at the pay that they are receiving at the
time.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's correct.
MS. NEMEC: Therefore, that amount is going to be
larger than it would have been if you paid it at the three
months.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sounds to me like you're
making a case for suspension for extenuating circumstances for
the Juvenile Detention Facility as opposed to a broad policy
change. Am I hearing that correctly?
MS. NEMEC: Right.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How does --
MS. NEMEC: That is what's on the agenda, I believe.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How does your plan fix the
problem?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It gives her the rest --
more time to rotate the staff to the night shift so she can

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give them the compensatory time off without having to pay it
out of time and a half.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You can fix the whole thing,
like, in three weeks?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No. Probably --
MS. HARRIS: No, sir.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- six months.
MS. HARRIS: That's why --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You said till the end of the
year. That's what I'm asking about.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think she's talking about
budget year.
MS. HARRIS: The fiscal year. That's what I stated
in the memo, was fiscal year.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Fiscal year.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would probably -- I mean, I
would -- I like the suspension idea, and we could suspend it,
you know, to June 1st or to something like that and then look
at it and see where we are, and see if it's working. And --
you know, and that way we can kind of address it at that
point. July 1st? I'd like to give us plenty of time. I
don't want to go to August 1st or September 1st.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think that's a -- June --
June 1 or June 30, whichever.
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MS. HARRIS: And that would be fine. I can tell --
I can tell the staff.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: June 30 would give you one
remaining quarter of the budget year to tell you where you
are.
MS. HARRIS: Right, and that would be fine.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I don't think we ought
to do anything until our legal department says that it's cool
to do.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
MS. HARRIS: May I make a suggestion? May I just
ask a question? December 31st -- am I correct? December 31st
is at the end of the quarter, and so this compensatory time
would have to be paid in the January 15th paycheck. You're
going to meet again on Commissioners Court --
JUDGE TINLEY: 27th.
MS. HARRIS: -- the 27th. Do we have enough time to
-- I mean, my staff is already starting to eat the comp time
up. If you choose not to extend it, I'm just asking, could it
be contingent upon what Rex determines?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah, I think it could.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, it could be, or we could
put it on the agenda for the 27th.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I think that's kind of
a short leash, is what she's saying, the 27th.
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JUDGE TINLEY: If all the time has to be turned in
MS. HARRIS: Because payroll cutoff, I believe, is
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let me float a motion, see
where it goes. I would move that the Court approve a
suspension of the current personnel policy with respect to --
to taking -- eliminating compensatory time for the Juvenile
Detention Facility until June 30, '06, pending final clearance
by the County Attorney as to any legal impediments that there
may be.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I second the motion.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for
suspension of the applicability of the quarterly payment of
overtime in lieu of compensatory time each quarter as to the
Juvenile Detention Facility through June 30, 2006, pending
approval of the County Attorney that it's legally appropriate.
Any question or discussion?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have a question and a comment.
I think this is a pretty important thing to be changing, and I
would really -- I have no problem with the concept of what
we're doing, but if we could actually get a copy of the
personnel policy and cite the specific thing that we're
suspending, rather than say we're suspending something. We
got into trouble on water availability on suspending
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something, and I think we have plenty of time today to -- I
know we're going to have a meeting at 1:15 and then have a
workshop.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's in the memorandum.
MS. HARRIS: It's in the memorandum.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Personnel policy, Paragraph
7.12(B) It's in there.
MS. HARRIS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: First line.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, then can you read
specifically what we're suspending in the wording. That's why
I think this is real important that this is real clear.
JODGE TINLEY: I think when I restated it, I think
it's clear. Let me get the reporter to read that back, and --
and I think it's fairly clear.
(Court reporter read back as follows:)
JUDGE TINLEY: "Motion made and seconded for
suspension of the applicability of the quarterly
payment of overtime in lieu of compensatory time
each quarter as to the Juvenile Detention Facility
through June 30, 2006, pending approval of the
County Attorney that it's legally appropriate."
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If we need to amend that,
Judge, by inserting a policy -- the Kerr County Personnel
Policy, Paragraph 7.12(B), we can do so for more specificity.
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JUDGE TINLEY: Is that your desire?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I second that.
JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Is that sufficiently
clear to you, Commissioner Letz?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, it is.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Question. Do shift workers
work 12- or 8-hour shifts?
MS. HARRIS: Twelve.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Is that the same protocol
that we use at the county jail? 12-hour shifts?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. We -- we go strictly by
the -- the F.L.S.A. The only -- only concern you had -- and,
of course, Becky does have a unique situation -- is that the
way we keep our time down is, in law enforcement -- I think
Becky's people, or juvenile detention workers, at least,
qualify under the law enforcement/firefighters exemption, too.
MS. HARRIS: That's right.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Which is -- it's a different
time period. You can work up to 160 hours in a 28-day pay
period without getting time and a half. It's when you qo over
that 171 that you get the time and a half. If you let these
people build up these hours, you're paying them back at time
and a half.
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MS. HARRIS: Right.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Instead of just straight time
where you lose that 11 hours.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: So what we do is try and make
sure that our people schedule it to take it off within that
same period to keep it below that 171. What you're -- you're,
in essence, doing here is allowing them to get it at time and
a half, where you could keep it down to straight time. But if
she doesn't have the personnel to keep it down to straight
time, you're going to have a problem anyway. But it does get
in bad later at the end if the pay's different, 'cause you --
MS. HARRIS: And that is the problem, is trying to
let people off to take that compensatory time while it's still
straight time. That is the difficulty.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Back in 1998, I think, is
when we made the change. It was recommended by TAC that we --
that we -- help me if I'm wrong; I'm working off of memory
here. But TAC recommended that we try to let people take
their time off in the same pay period, and that's kind of
where we were heading. I'm not sure that we ever got to that
point, but --
MS. HARRIS: Right.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- that's exactly what we did.
MS. HARRIS: And that's what they recommend. That's
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what they would like for you to do, is take that off.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, basically, that's what
we're amending?
JUDGE TINLEY: No. No.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is the -- what is it
we're amending?
JUDGE TINLEY: The requirement that if compensatory
time is not taken within the same quarter in which it is
earned, that they must be paid overtime wages for any
remaining compensatory time left. We are waiving the
applicability of that quarterly payment as to the Juvenile
Detention Facility only through June 30, 2006. And the
purpose is -- is to give her time to roll over that
compensatory time that's already accrued with these employees
in order to keep down the overtime that Kerr County would
otherwise be required to pay under the quarterly payment
requirement.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And you would provide us, in
your monthly report, an update on how that's going, how many
hours you've used and how it's working?
MS. HARRIS: Sure, if that's what you'd like.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I would like that.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's outstanding.
MS. HARRIS: Sure.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's worked off or given
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versus what's outstanding.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or discussion?
All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right
hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(NO response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Thank you.
MS. HARRIS: Thank you, gentlemen, very much.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Number 5.
JUDGE TINLEY: Hmm?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 5.
JUDGE TINLEY: Do we have anyone here on Item 5,
dealing with the conditional lease agreement between Kerr
County and the Hill Country Mounted Peace Officers
Association? Dealing with the -- pardon?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I was going to ask, did they
want this back on the agenda, or were you --
JUDGE TINLEY: I put on it the agenda thinking that
-- I knew that there was some activity on it. I put it on the
agenda thinking it might be ready. Obviously, it apparently
is not.
	SHERIFF	HIERHOLZER:	I haven'	t heard that it was
ready.	They just	told me they	were on	the agenda this
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morning. I didn't know if they had put it on or if you had.
JUDGE TINLEY: I had, in thinking that it might be
ready, but obviously it's not, so --
MR. EMERSON: I was just going to say for the
benefit of the rest of the Court, Judge, the -- we had
originally forwarded an agreement; i.e., the County had, back
the first part of October. The association changed attorneys,
and that agreement was passed on to the new attorney. And
then last week, I think it was, I received their response to
that agreement, and then I went through it and forwarded it
back shortly before I left for San Antonio. And I don't know
what, if any, communications occurred the last three days of
last week.
JUDGE TINLEY: Apparently, we're not ready.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That sounds like it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sounds that way.
JUDGE TINLEY: Why don't we go to Item 15; consider,
discuss, and take appropriate action on Kerr County
Subdivision Rules and Regulations. Commissioner Letz?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, this one and the next one
really need to be handled after the workshop.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: After the workshop?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: After the workshop.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Picky, picky, picky.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: Because, really, I mean, I just
put them on there so we could kind of recess at an appropriate
time and then go into the workshop and come back to them if we
so chose.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So, you've got them on as
action items contingent upon whatever happens in the workshop?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct.
JUDGE TINLEY: All right. What's the Court's
thought about maybe taking some of these reports early so that
these people can get on down the road?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's -- I think that's a
good idea.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Be great.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. On Animal Control, Ms. Roman
contacted Ms. Mitchell this morning. She has at least one of
her people out ill, so she's -- she's manning the streets this
morning, I think.
MS. MITCHELL: That's right.
JUDGE TINLEY: And she will not be able to be with
us for that reason. Do we have anybody here from Extension
Office, or do we have to get back to them? We'll come back to
that. Environmental Health, Mr. Arreola. I thought I saw
you.
MR. ARREOLA: Good morning.
JUDGE TINLEY: Good to see you this morning.
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MR. ARREOLA: Good to see you, too. I've got my
usual charts to make things a little more clear. Okay. So
far for this -- what's going on for this fiscal year, we had
an average month in October and a very decent month in
November. It was more than average. December is going a
little slower, so I think it was just that particular month.
If you see your -- your graphic here, the first one, we're a
little bit above what's normally on applications. The same on
revenue; applications go directly with revenue. And that --
you know, that basically mandates the amount of work we have
to do. On complaints investigated, that's only O.S.S.F.
complaints. We're about average. Those, you know, depends on
what the public brings. We normally don't open any complaints
unless, you know, we're really exposed to them, but it's what
the public brings up, and it's about average. That blue line
is what -- the goal we have, what the projected is going to be
for the rest of the year.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: For the rest of the year?
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir. That's going to be the
total to the end of the year.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're saying you're going
to do 250 total?
MR. ARREOLA: If circumstances permits, yes, that's
what I think I'm going to be doing.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: For the entire year, or just
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the month	of December?		
	MR. ARREOLA:	No. No, for the fiscal year.	
	COMMISSIONER	LETZ: Entire year?	
	MR. ARREOLA:	Entire year.	
	COMMISSIONER	NICHOLSON: Is that this pink he	re?
	MR. ARREOLA:	Yes, sir.	
	COMMISSIONER	NICHOLSON: What's going to caus	e a
five-time	increase in	applications for permits?	
	MR. ARREOLA:	I didn't get that.	
	COMMISSIONER	NICHOLSON: From 50 to 250.	
	MR. ARREOLA:	Oh, no, the 250 is the total we	expect
to get fo	r the year, f	or the 12 months.	
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN: Let me try this.	
	MR. ARREOLA:	Yes, sir.	
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN: The light blue little	post.
	MR. ARREOLA:	Yes?	
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN: Is for 'O5.	
	MR. ARREOLA:	Yes, what we had for the first	two
months of	'O5.		
	COMMISSIONER	NICHOLSON: Oh.	
	MR. ARREOLA:	Then the --	
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN: Wait a minute. Wait a	
minute.	We're -- we'r	e closing out 'O5.	
	MR. ARREOLA:	Okay, I'm talking about fiscal	years.
It closed	out in Septe	mber.	
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So that would be --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: See, I see that as, like, the
first two months of '06 -- 'O5-'06. Okay. All right. Now,
what is the dark blue little post, then?
MR. ARREOLA: The purple color, that's the first two
months of Fiscal Year '06. This year, 2005, October and
November.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. What's the difference
between 'OS and '06 -- what's the difference between the light
blue and the purple?
MR. ARREOLA: Well, that's -- the first one is
fiscal year -- the prior fiscal year, and the purple is this
fiscal year that we're going through right now.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Two months.
MR. ARREOLA: Two months.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. So, the light blue
post -- tell me again what that represents?
MR. ARREOLA: Last year's.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: A full year?
MR. ARREOLA: No, the first two months. I'm
comparing the first two months of last year with the first two
months of this year.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. Well, why didn't you
have the full year there?
MR. ARREOLA: Because I was just trying to show what
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we're doing so far.		
COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN: Okay. The -- back	to his
question. Then, if you	had the full year, then this	'06
proposed -- not propose	d.	
MR. ARREOLA:	Yeah, projected.	
COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN: Projected wouldn't	look so
goofy. But --		
MR. ARREOLA:	Oh, okay. I see.	
COMMISSIONER	LETZ: I understand.	
COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN: I'm with you.	
COMMISSIONER	LETZ: I understand totally.	Anything
else? (Laughter.)		
MR. ARREOLA:	Okay. It's basically what -	- the big
line is what we think w	e're going to hit at the end	of the
year. Every month I'm	going to be bringing you wher	e we are
in the line, how close	are we getting to that goal.	
COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN: Okay.	
COMMISSIONER	LETZ: The dark blue is going	to get
bigger every month, and	hopefully by the end of the	year, it
will be 250. That's wh	at he's projecting.	
COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN: I understand it, to	o. I just
think I would have done	it a little bit differently.	I think
that light blue one wou	ld have been a full year.	
COMMISSIONER	LETZ: Well, then you couldn'	t tell the
difference from the sam	e period from year to year.	
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MR. ARREOLA: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, fine.
MR. ARREOLA: I'll try to make it more clear next
time. It's the same principle.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We see the same deal with the
airport all the time. Don't worry.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, we do.
MR. ARREOLA: Same principle on revenue. Those are
thousands of dollars of what we think we're going to get. And
same principle on complaints, what we think we're going to be
seeing. And, like I say, that depends on the public.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: This reminds me, when I
first misread this, in business, it's what they call a
hockey-stick projection. Runs along flat, and then it spikes
up. You probably saw some of those, Commissioner. What it
usually says is we haven't been making much money, but it's
going to be really good next year.
MR. ARREOLA: Do you have any other questions in
that graph?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. I'm curious about the
third bar graph there.
MR. ARREOLA: Uh-huh.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Complaints investigated are
down. Is that a good sign? Or is that --
MR. ARREOLA: That's actually good.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Things are just not
happening or what?
MR. ARREOLA: No, that's positive. That is that we
haven't received as many complaints on O.S.S.F. That means
less failing septic systems.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay.
MR. ARREOLA: So the less we get, the better. The
next graphic is on Solid Waste, and let me try to explain it
here. The blue line, it's the activity we had last fiscal
year.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: For a full year or two
months?
MR. ARREOLA: Full year. The blue is a full year.
Each month has a number in there, how many cases we
investigated each month. Now, the red line is what we
investigated this fiscal year. You can tell in November,
we're a little lower than last year, last November's.
December, we're also not looking that great in that area, too.
We hit the 20 mark in November of last year, and I think we're
going to hit that this month.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: December?
MR. ARREOLA: December.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I have a question.
MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Without getting into people
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or personalities, I think your staff has been reduced somewhat
due to illness; is that correct?
MR. ARREOLA: That's correct.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What is the status of the
staffing right now?
MR. ARREOLA: We got it back. It's back at work
today, so it should be better.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're back to your budgeted
staff right now?
MR. ARREOLA: Correct, back to budgeted staff as of
today.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you.
MR. ARREOLA: You're welcome.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: On Solid Waste, it's my
sense out in my part of the county that -- that a pretty good
effort's been made to clean up problems, and so things are
better than they were a few years ago in terms of a lot of
solid waste.
MR. ARREOLA: We did a lot of cases last year. You
can see in this graphic, we're almost hitting 200 cases.
There's plenty of clean-up to do. There is a lot still in
areas of the county. It's very important. We're trying to
accommodate the rest of the staff to -- to work in that area,
but O.S.S.F. demands a lot. We have to respond to
timing-sensitive inspections. We still feel that we need
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extra staff in Solid Waste. We've been seeing this for a
while, to be able to meet the county needs. There is --
there's a lot there to be cleaned up.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else for Mr. Arreola? Thank
you, sir. We appreciate it.
MR. ARREOLA: Not a problem.
JUDGE TINLEY: Juvenile Detention.
MS. HARRIS: Ukay. For the month of November, our
average total population was 54, 28 being post, 9 pre, and 17
T.Y.C. We had six total postadjudication intakes for the
month of November, and I have listed those by county for you.
We had six discharges. We had five postadjudicated kids and
one T.Y.C. kid in the month of November -- yes, November. Two
pending intakes, one from Guadalupe, which we have received
that resident as of Friday. That one Guadalupe resident came
in. The Andrews County resident will go to court this week, I
believe, so we may be receiving the Andrews resident by the
end of the week, perhaps, depending on what the Court says.
At this point in time, on the report that I gave you, I
indicated that there was one sex offender bed available.
There's two sex offender beds. When Guadalupe brought their
one resident Friday, they took two back with them, and it was
due to budget constraints. One of those residents had already
been with us for seven months. They discharged -- we
discharged him. The county -- Guadalupe wanted to come get
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that resident, take him back to Guadalupe. He had to go to a
jury trial. Then they brought him back, and he -- the second
time around that they brought him back, he was with us for
three months. We11, he was one of the ones, and they just ran
out of money that they had budgeted for him. And the other
young man was the same way. It was a budgetary decision. It
was not a problematic -- or program problem at all. So, we
have two sex offender beds available. We have one substance
abuse bed available.
DODGE TINLEY: What kind of inquiries do you have
outstanding for either of those programs?
MS. HARRIS: Just what I've indicated, these pending
intakes. Which Guadalupe, you can mark off the list. We've
already got that one, so the Andrews. I don't know if you
remember back in our discussions'several, several, several
months ago, whenever we were -- as a matter of fact, it was
about this time of year last year when we were talking about
projections and -- and what the normal cycle for receiving
kids, and remember, I indicated there is normally a Christmas
slump, because counties try to keep their kids from being
locked up in order so they can maybe have Christmas with their
families. So, there's normally a Christmas slump. Plus the
courts -- most judges are not available during the last two
weeks of December, and a lot of probation officers take
vacation during that time. So, your referrals normally slow
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down toward the end of December, then will pick back up about
the second week in January. So, that may be some of what
we're seeing as well, 'cause we're about to approach the
Christmas slump.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Becky, one more -- I'm
sorry.
MS. HARRIS: That's okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Your current census today,
with all the T.Y.C. out, is --
MS. HARRIS: 37.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 37?
MS. HARRIS: 37. 29 post and 8 pre's is what the
population is today.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you.
MS. HARRIS: Also, as I have indicated on here and
as you are aware, we no longer have the T.Y.C. residents. I
really don't know how to state how we feel about that at the
facility. There is a sense of relief on one hand, but then
there is a sense of regret on the other hand. We really
wanted this project to succeed. And it's purely a staffing
issue. Purely a staffing issue. And I just regret that it
had to turn out this way. And I gave you a copy of the letter
that I wrote the Executive Director, Dwight Harris, of the
Texas Youth Commission expressing our regret that the project
had to end.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Have your staffing problems
eased now as a result --
MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir. It's got --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- of the relocation of the
T.Y.C. --
MS. HARRIS: It's gotten much better, yes, sir.
Because we had put the ad in the paper for -- to fill those
full-time slots, and I had indicated to you that the
difficulty of putting full-time -- using part-time people that
were already certified, that we had taken the time and money
to certify, putting them in those full-time slots, you created
this part-time hole, and it was just a vicious cycle. That's
been alleviated. Now, some of the full-time people that we
have hired full-time, of course, they've got to go through
their OJT, and -- but we've got that -- we've got that taken
care of. And I had several people take some of their comp
time this weekend, some of my full-time staff. They were able
to take some of their comp time.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Would you talk a little bit
about the recruiting and retention issue? Why is it difficult
to retain --
MS. HARRIS: It's difficult --
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Is it permanent, or is it
going to go away someday?
MS. HARRIS: Commissioner Nicholson, this time last
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year, we were going through the same problem. Not to this
extent, but I would have hoped that -- that the situation
would have gotten better. I don't see any relief. I'm hoping
these full-time people that we are bringing on board now -- I
can say this. The people that we have hired full-time to fill
these full-time positions seem to have a more professional
manner about them, and a more positive work ethic about them
than what	we've experienced in	the past. The	part-time
situation,	paying $8 an hour --	which that's	what we budgeted;
that's what we said -- you compete with fast food restaurants
and with -- and we didn't have any benefits, you know, going
along with the part-time, so that was a lot of the problem. I
believe the work ethic -- I've never seen anything like it,
where you leave -- literally, you are working on a dorm and
you go take a break and you never come back. And that
happened on more than one occasion. It's -- it's situations
of that nature, where you -- and then you're on the phone
trying to call somebody to fill that slot, 'cause you're out
of ratio, you know.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How do you fix that?
MS. HARRIS: Commissioner, I wish I knew.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I do. I remember the
And we
changed the salary structure.
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MS. HARRIS: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And it fixed it.
MS. HARRIS: And we did that this year.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do you think that changing
the salary structure out there would fix it?
MS. HARRIS: I think would it help a great deal.
Yes, sir, I do. And we had discussed that when y'all came out
to the facility, you and Commissioner Williams. We discussed
about that, and that was part of what we did this year for
this budget, was to -- to help that salary structure somewhat.
And we agreed that it was not a viable thing to do to increase
the salary for the detention officers and shift supervisors to
be comparable to the jail. It was just not financially
feasible. But perhaps -- I don't know; perhaps we might can
look at that again for next year, but you're absolutely right,
the pay scale has a large amount to do with it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, more money would fix the
problem; is that what you're saying?
MS. HARRIS: Better salary scale would -- would fix
the problem.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: More money would fix the
problem.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If we were to do that, you
know, in the next budget cycle, all things being equal, and --
and increase that hourly rate, would that help the problem
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that you indicated to me was also part of this scenario, in
that some of these folks who show up looking for employment
can't clear the background check?
MS. HARRIS: That's correct. That's correct. And
we can't -- we cannot put them on the payroll until they clear
that background check.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: My question is, do you think
just merely addressing the hourly rate would get us up a notch
so that we don't have so much of that problem?
MS. HARRIS: I --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's what I'm asking.
MS. HARRIS: I believe so, yes, sir. I believe so.
'Cause you're making it more attractive. If you were to
increase that part-time hourly rate, you're making it more
attractive to people who are more professional in their
behavior.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the bottom line is -- I
mean, I'm not that concerned about trying to fix the part-time
salaries. Long-term, I'm more concerned about trying to fix
the full-time employees, and then you don't have a part-time
problem. At $8 an hour or $9 an hour or $10 an hour, you're
not going to get quality people that are going to be, you
know, diligent in showing up every day. Some will, certainly.
You have some.
MS. HARRIS: Right.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: But you're competing, like
Ms. Harris said, with, you know, the fast food restaurants,
any kind of -- just manual labor. They all get $10, $11 an
hour.
MS. HARRIS: And Walmart. One of our biggest
competitors is Walmart.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So I think we need to,
long-term, come up with a -- try to get with a -- if we can
get the revenue coming in --
MS. HARRIS: Right.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- then you try to look at the
salary structure for the full-time residents.
MS. HARRIS: It certainly would link to the revenue.
It would not be feasible to increase your salary scale if the
revenues are not there. And I think that that's a viable
argument, and I would not even advocate for that unless the
revenues were -- would support that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
MS. HARRIS: But, the issue, too, you may have some
really good part-time people, but they've got other jobs, and
you're -- and you're having to work around those hours of
those other jobs. And so it's just a difficult situation all
the way around. And --
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I think the only -- I just want
to back her up a little bit on that. You know, people that
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she hires and I hire at the jail or her detention center go
through a more stringent background investigation, and have
to, than anybody that Walmart or anyone else can hire. And
yet -- you know, so you end up cutting out a whole bunch of
good employees, which you could have some real good employees,
because of that type of background they have to go through,
okay? And then if you don't pay them even as much as Walmart
or anybody else pays them, you can't do it. And I know right
now, still -- y'all corrected this some last year, but her
employees' salary now, I think, is about 5,000 or 6,000 a year
less --
MS. HARRIS: Yes.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- than what the jail -- than
what the starting corrections officer at the jails are, and I
have a hard time still keeping them at that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: You had the same basic problem
of the revolving door until we raised the salaries.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You raised it, and that cut
down a whole lot of it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That equates to about 2.50
an hour, and that's very significant.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's $12 -- yeah, something
like that.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: We had raised the salaries
quite a bit, --
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SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: -- but our total cost of
payroll didn't go up as much as the percent that we raised
salaries, because you eliminated the costs of turnover,
training, overtime, all that stuff.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The backgrounds and testing.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: We would probably be wise
to consider dealing with the full-time employees --
MS. HARRIS: Right. Not -- yeah.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: -- in a similar fashion
that we did the jail.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So we can get them on level
ground. Okay.
MS. HARRIS: Which takes me to the end of the
report. Now, what is not on there, because this occurred
after I wrote the report and submitted it to you, the cook
situation, we did not hire the more experienced cook, because
the first more experienced cook that we did have on full-time,
he got a better job offer and he left. And we were going to
hire another more experienced cook, and the job that he was at
matched our offer, so he didn't come on board, so we were back
to square one with two lesser-experienced cooks and a
part-time cook. Now, since this has all occurred, the food
costs -- and we visited with Rusty; groceries have gone up,
because Sysco has had an increase in fuel costs, so our
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grocery bill has risen substantially. So, in order to offset
that, what we have done is we have reduced our cooking staff
from two full-time and one part-time to one full-time and one
part-time. And the one full-time cook had some considerable
comp time, because when the first cook quit, she had to work,
like, 16 days straight in order to cook. So, we were going to
give her these last two weeks of December off. Well, I had my
part-time cook and I had the other full-time cook, but I was
going to make the full-time cook part-time, so I was going to
have two part-time. Well, one of the part-time cooks called
in this weekend and quit, so I'm back to --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who's doing the scrambled
eggs? You?
MS. HARRIS: My shift supervisors. So, the shift
supervisors, starting tomorrow, will be cooking breakfast, and
the -- and we're still going to try to get our full-time cook
that has comp time, to get her to eat up some of that comp
time, and the shift supervisors are going to cook breakfast
and they're going to serve supper and clean up the dishes.
So, fruit basket turnover again.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You got a long-term
solution?
MS. HARRIS: Well, the longer-term solution is, once
this full-time cook eats up some of that comp time, it will be
her and a part-time cook, and my shift supervisors are going
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to continue to cook breakfast, and that way we can keep it
going and we won't have to have another full-time cook. So,
I've eliminated one full-time cook's position that I'm not
going to use this year -- the rest of the fiscal year. I'm
only going to use one and a half to try to help to offset the
increase in food costs because of the increase in fuel and
delivery charges.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, how is that going to
work? Are you going to come back later and transfer the money
that the Court authorized into the cook or the chef, and
transfer that money over to the grocery side? Or --
MS. HARRIS: I don't know, sir. I don't -- I don't
have that formulated at this point in time, 'cause I want to
see what's going to happen when the dust settles on that
situation.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, you know, there's an
actual court order, I think, that says that you're going to go
hire a sheriff -- not a sheriff, a chef -- at a certain amount
of money and all that. I mean, that -- you don't just move
those moneys around.
MS. HARRIS: Well, I didn't hire the chef, so we
didn't have to move that money.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. Okay.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner Baldwin's point, I
think, and I would agree, is to make sure we move the money
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before we spend the money.
MS. HARRIS: Right, exactly. And I will do that.
That's why I want to wait until the dust settles, to see
exactly where we are. Even if we have to do that, I'm hoping,
by the decrease in population, decrease in the number of
staff, I'm hoping that our food costs will substantially
decrease in spite of the extra fuel cost and delivery charges
we're having to pay.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I saw the report on orange
juice, what it's fixing to do. Man, like, quadruple.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Drink apple juice.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: This last month, ours went back
down this last month, but month before, one month for the jail
was a $7,000 increase.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: For orange juice?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, just food. We don't serve
orange juice. Just the overall food cost was --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought cutting out orange
juice --
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Overall food cast was a $7,000
increase.
MS. HARRIS: And, too, we just have the one-week
rotating menus. We no longer have the six-week rotating
menus; we did away with that this year. We've got one --
every Monday, the kids know what they're going to eat every
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Monday, to help curb that too. So, anyway...
JUDGE TINLEY: Any member of the Court have any more
questions for Ms. Harris? Sheriff, do you want to roll that
into your operation?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Thank you, ma'am.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Everything is good in the
adult detention center?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Been there, done that. I ain't
getting into that. She can have it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Where's our Auditor?
MS. HARRIS: Do you want me to go get her?
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, if you wouldn't mind.
MS. HARRIS: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I think that's going to bring
us to the tail end of our agenda on the approval agenda.
First, let me ask if there's any member of the Court that has
any items that they wish to have considered in executive or
closed session. Hearing none, I'm going to move on. We'll go
to the approval agenda. Hopefully we can get the Auditor here
shortly, and we'll act on the bills.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Here she comes.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. First item is payment of the
bills.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move that we pay our bills.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to pay the
bills. I wish Ms. Harris hadn't left. Let me ask the County
Attorney, have you been consulted about some warranty issues
on some of the locks out at the detention facility in the new
annex?
MR. EMERSON: I'm aware that there's a lock issue,
but that's about the extent of it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Maybe I can shed a little
light on that, Judge.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I know that they had some
locks that were not operating correctly through the remote --
or through control center, and they thought that the locks had
failed. Mr. Holekamp and his folks looked at them, and I
think they had somebody who's a locksmith expert or whatever
take a look at them, and the result was they had to -- they
ordered a couple replacement locks. They're special locks;
can't acquire them here. They came in from wherever,
wherever, were installed, and they still didn't work, which
says there was a problem somewhere other than in the locking
mechanism itself. Somewhere between the control panel and the
lock, there must be a problem. That's our -- that's the only
light I can shed on it, but they did acquire a couple locks as
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replacements. So, if it -- if it's a warranty issue -- it
very well could be a warranty issue as a result of replacing a
lock and it still not functioning remotely correctly. And,
so, that's all I can tell you.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are y'all talking about the
new building out there?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir, we are talking
about the new building.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We can't lock the doors on a
jail.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, a couple interior
locks that they're not functioning right.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm shocked.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have a -- is that the only
question you had, Judge?
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that was the one I had.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I had one on the first page
under County Court. And I -- it's the first one, Claudio
Castillo for probable cause hearings. Maybe these have been
on here a lot of times, but -- and I just didn't notice them,
but I don't -- is a J.P. getting paid extra for a probable
cause? Is it -- you're pointing -- mental health? Is that
what that is?
JODGE TINLEY: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But he provides a time sheet
kind of thing.
MS. WILLIAMS: Yes. So many cases, and --
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, he's paid per case.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: And that's charged as court costs to
the county --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: -- where that patient is from. So,
we're recouping -- I think the ratio was about 80 percent
out-of-county, 20 percent Kerr County. I haven't checked
those numbers. I assume it's pretty close to that still, so
we're recouping about 80 percent of that -- 75, 80 percent of
that money from other counties in court costs that we charge
them.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I've got a comment on Page
8, Environmental Health. Texas Commission on Environmental
Quality, on-site council fee/late fees. I talked to Miguel,
and what happened here was that he had a disputed invoice, and
the dispute took him past the due date, and the Commission
didn't -- did not forgive the late fee that was due because of
it being late. And it's only $43, but the principle here is
that, again, we're paying -- incurring costs that we don't
have to incur if we do everything timely. And then I reminded
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them that there's -- we have a court order that says if we
is due an explanation on that, so I'm hoping that the word
gets around to all the department heads and elected officials
that, one, they shouldn't incur late fees or penalties or
interest, and if they do, they need to explain it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments by
any member of the Court on the bills? All in favor of the
motion to pay the bills, signify by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
DODGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget
MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. This budget amendment is
for the County Clerk's Election budget. What happened is,
they had some services provided to the election machines prior
to September 30th. For one reason or another, the -- the
company just did not get the bill to us timely in order for us
to encumber it back into last year's budget. So, what I was
going to ask is for the Court's permission to declare an
emergency, move the funds out of the surplus fund balance from
last year, put it in the Machine Repair line item, and let us
go ahead and get this bill paid, because we do owe the moneys.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved.
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COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for approval
of Budget Amendment Request Number 1 as requested. Any
question or comments?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Surplus fund balance?
MS. WILLIAMS: Fund balance.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Fund 10?
MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir, general fund.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Surplus. That -- I really
dislike that word. Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is there -- reserve? Is
that a better word?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any other --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments? All
in favor of that motion, signify by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(NO response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget
Amendment Request Number 2.
MS. WILLIAMS: This budget amendment is for a
monitor that we had to purchase for one of the Commissioners.
It was not really included in the moneys that was budgeted in
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Operating Equipment for this year. I spoke with Commissioner
Williams, and we've come to the conclusion that we most likely
can take the money out of Books, Publications, and Dues in the
Commissioners Court budget. I believe there's going to be a
little bit of a surplus there. The amount that we needed was
$228.85. That is the difference in order to be able to pay
this bill, and everything will be squared away.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Guilty as charged.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. Guilty of what?
Since you're confessing.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I got the monitor.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for approval
of Budget Amendment Request Number 2. Any question or
discussion?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Comment. I got my computer
fixed. I hadn't been able to read e-mails for about three
months. I sent a response to Commissioner Letz. I think he
thinks I was rude; I hadn't read an e-mail he sent me two
months ago.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: He sent me a response; he gave
me the answer. Didn't make any difference any more, but he
gave me the answer.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments? All
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in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(NO response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Any further
budget amendments?
MS. WILLIAMS: No, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Do we have any late bills?
MS. WILLIAMS: One, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: All right.
MS. WILLIAMS: Commissioner Nicholson brought a bill
in to us. We are asking to reimburse Thomas Mall Concrete for
the building permit from the City of Kerrville for the Animal
Control facility, the expansion. The amount of the permit was
$375, and we're going to ask that we be able to take it out of
10-642-330, which is the Operating Expense line item for
Animal Control.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for approval
of late bill to Thomas Mall Concrete for a building permit for
$375 and issuance of hand check to be charged as indicated by
the Auditor. Any question or comment?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There's no late fee on there,
is there?
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MS. WILLIAMS: I hope not.
JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion, signify
by raising your right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(No response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Any other
late bills?
MS. WILLIAMS: No, sir, that's it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I've been presented with
monthly reports for the Sheriff's Department, Justice of the
Peace, Precinct 2, Justice of the Peace, Precinct 3, Justice
of the Peace, Precinct 4, and County Clerk general and trust
reports. Do I hear a motion that these reports be approved as
submitted?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second.
JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for approval
of the indicated reports as submitted. Any question or
comment? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your
right hand.
(The motion carried by unanimous vote.)
JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign.
(NO response.)
JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Do we have
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any Commissioners that have reports on their liaison or
committee assignments or other reports?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move we go to Buzzie's.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Actually, I have -- I can't go
yet; it's early. I can talk 15 more minutes. No --
JUDGE TINLEY: To whom?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Not with me.
JUDGE TINLEY: To whom?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Two brief comments, one with
regard to the airport.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Like the congressional thing
you see on TV, these guys ranting and raving; not a person in
there.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Nobody in the chamber.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not going to rant and rave.
Related to an airport matter that was in the paper, it was
reported that I voted against the terminal. Which I mentioned
this to Commissioner Baldwin; the reason was -- was that I
don't -- there's a reason to do it. And Commissioner Williams
can go into it if he wants to, but the reason I voted against
it is that we have received zero, including the current
architect, estimates that this rebid is going to come in with
a dollar figure that's within our budget, and I think it's a
waste of time, and I'm fed up with the architect that we
currently have and would like to move on. And in -- and I
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think we can still get the terminal built. That's kind of why
I probably voted against it. And I'll probably vote against
it tomorrow when we meet again.
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: In your opinion, is there a
good business for that terminal? Over some period of time,
will revenues increase to the point where --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, there is.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's a -- I think
there's -- it's one of those intangible things that it's
probably good to build. I would not -- it is -- it's coming
from non -- well, I won't say non-taxpayer funds, 'cause it is
coming from some E.I.C. funds, but it's -- a lot of it's by
federal government grants. I would not be in favor of
spending that -- you know, budgeted or county tax dollars on
that terminal. There's, however, some other projects out
there, but I think it is a viable project.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: There is -- Commissioner
Letz, let me add just one comment. There is a need for it.
This is the type of facility that we should have for folks who
fly in here in these big jets, and they're becoming
increasingly more frequent. There was two of them on the
apron Saturday night, big ones. Kerrville Aviation and its
facilities just doesn't have the facility -- you know, the
accommodation. So, there really is -- the demand is growing,
and I think it is -- it provides a pretty decent window to
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Kerr County having a facility of that nature.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think most of the airports our
size have them, so I think it's common, and I think it is a --
it's one of those things, it's another small step on the way
to getting where we want to be, to be able to, in my mind, get
more corporate jets, probably, housed here. And I think it
helps in that, 'cause there's a pilot lounge and some other
things that go in that area, or down that road. The other
item, if the Court likes, I can hand out -- I don't know what
y'all will be doing for the next couple hours. I can hand out
the draft of the Subdivision Rules.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We need to go to lunch.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: You'll hopefully have time after
lunch, y'all can look through them. Or do y'all want me to
wait until the workshop?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're going to explain it
all to us in the workshop, right?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. I don't know -- I don't
know if I'll explain it to you, but we'll discuss it. I'll
hand one out. There are gray highlights along the pages;
those are the areas that have been changed. That's it.
COMMISSIONEP. WILLIAMS: This takes the place of this
other one I have, dated --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Throw the other one away.
There's a new -- new draft number on it. A new draft number,
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and there's a lot of changes again.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. I'm going to put
"Newest."
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Newest?
COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: 12-12-05.
DODGE TINLEY: Anything further? We will stand in
recess until 2 o'clock this afternoon.
(Recess taken from 11:47 p.m. to 2 p.m.)
DODGE TINLEY: Okay, it is 2 o'clock. Let's come
back to order. We were in recess until 2:00, and we have one
item to take up before the workshop, and that is a report from
the Kerr County Extension Office. So, Mr. Walston, if you --
MR. WALSTON: I didn't get the message that we had
changed our schedule this afternoon, so we'll briefly give
y'all a report. I gave you a little bit of report on what --
some of the things that we've been doing over the last month.
One of the things that I just happened to think of that I left
off, in October during our fair, we held a -- we hosted a
booth, an Extension booth that represented all of our
different groups, our Extension FCE groups, our Master
Gardeners, our 9-H kids, as well as our ag and extension
group, ag groups and committees. So, if y'all were out at the
fair, hopefully y'all got to see our displays. I think that
really was a good representation, and we got a lot of -- made
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a lot of good contacts. This last month in November, we
finalized what we call our validations of our livestock
projects, and that's basically just telling the -- telling us
what kids have what animals and how many we've got. So, that
that's a statewide validation, and those animals that go to
the major stock shows will be tested at the major stock shows
to make sure that -- that those animals are owned by who we
send them in as ownership is. As you can see, the numbers --
as far as our total numbers, we -- we ended up with a total of
193 exhibitors and right at 900 projects.
JUDGE TINLEY: Is that a pretty good indication of
the number of -- that we're going to have in the local shows
here in January?
MR. WALSTON: Yes, sir. Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: 400?
MR. WALSTON: That's -- these are just the 4-H
projects. The FFA projects, we've got those validated, but I
didn't include those in the numbers.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
MR. WALSTON: I just -- these are -- they'll be up
from that. And they're primarily coming from -- I believe we
ended up total validating them right at 100 market lambs. The
meat goats is about 200. A hundred market lambs, and I
imagine we'll have a little over 200 swine, and the beef
project is, I believe, right at 30, so it's going to be up a
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little bit. But that's -- that's pretty close.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are the meat goats still
climbing?
MR. WALSTON: They've kind of leveled off.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Leveled off?
MR. WALSTON: Seems like everything's pretty well
leveled off. As you can see, we're looking at about two
projects per kid, per 4-H member. The -- a lot of the kids
are -- are now feeding one project or two. We don't have
those families that are feeding 10 or 15 or 20, so we're --
we're getting into the -- you know, those kids are -- are more
involved in other things, and -- and they're still feeding
their projects and taking care of them, but they're just at a
smaller level. Judging team-wise, I'd like to recognize our
livestock team, in October, went to the state fair. We're
just getting that group kicked off and under way. That group
-- that team was 8th out of 54 teams. Katie Muehlstein was
our high-point individual out of 200 contestants, and that was
quite a feat for a young lady that has just turned into her
senior year -- or senior competition.
JUDGE TINLEY: She won high point of all
participants?
MR. WALSTON: High point of the 200 kids. So --
and, actually, Katie, I'll have to say -- she's heard me say
it before -- she's been in -- that makes her first, second,
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third -- fifth conference, and she's been high individual in
three of them.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Golly.
MR. WALSTON: So we've got -- we've got some high
hopes for that young lady, along with the rest of them. Our
4-H clubs, just to give you an idea on the overall club
numbers, we have now started a 4-H club as an after-school
program with the Salvation Army. That group identified
themselves as the 4-H Dream Team. We've got 97 of those
youngsters, and they meet after school once a month on Friday.
Our senior and junior council meets with them and they go
through the meetings and teach those kids about the leadership
and teach the activities of carrying on and conducting
meetings with those kids that are able to learn how -- how
meetings are to be conducted. Our six community 4-H clubs,
which includes our east and west Kerr County, Kerrville,
Turtle Creek, Ingram, Hunt, those -- those clubs include 255
members. Our project clubs, which is our trap and skeet
program and our horse project, has 22 and 20, respectively, so
a total of 394 members and nine clubs. Two years ago, we had
a little over 200, so we've -- this last year, we were under
300 -- right at 300, and this year looks like we're going to
be up over 350.
Some of the ways that we're getting that done is
through this BB gun project. The BB gun project is another
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offshoot of our shooting sports program. We have trap and
skeet, rifle, and now we're starting the BB gun. We're able
to do that with some funding through some private agent --
private individuals and agencies helping with some grants.
We're trying to get an archery program started hopefully this
next year. That's bringing in a lot of new kids that wouldn't
-- that are not traditionally 4-H projects that we're able to
encourage those kids to be involved in. That's 3rd grade
through 12th grade. We've got 21 members that is meeting in
our BB gun project right now. They met 10 times in November.
Basically, they're meeting twice a week. They've got enough
kids that they had to split that into twice a week so that
they can give them all enough shooting time. And Mike Boyd is
our -- is our project leader, and we've got several other
parents that have been certified as coaches to help out.
Our horse project is -- is active and getting under
way. They'll really be picking up this spring, and -- spring
and summer. The dog agility project, some of y'all may have
seen that in the newspaper. Laurie Graham has picked that up,
and that's something that we've got a lot of our 4-H'ers and
some of our new kids that have gone in and -- and had dogs as
pets, but really never have worked with them, and they were
able to take them through the agility courses, and she was
able to teach them some obedience and some things. That --
that, I think, was -- was very productive in giving those kids
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some self -- self-discipline about being able to work with
those dogs and teach them some things.
Some of our other activities, of course, our senior
council. Each year in the past, we had what we call the
Waiter's Night, and we'd work at C.W. Steaks. Now that C.W.
Steaks is no longer here, we teamed up with Billy Jean's
Restaurant, and they worked with us on a Friends and Family
Night and helped us. Our senior council helped serve as hosts
and bused tables and some things like that. With the tips
that they made, I believe it came out to about $1,500. Each
year they'll take that money and go shopping at -- at, I
believe, Walmart, and take -- and buy different gifts for the
Salvation Army Angel Tree and the Any Baby Can bunch. Our
senior council really enjoys getting involved with those
groups that way. We also had some leadership opportunities
for our council kids, our seniors and juniors as well. These
were at Brownwood at the Texas 4-H Center, where they were
able to go and -- our senior is basically -- it was an
ambassador training where they go and learn how to promote the
4-H program and go out and do some public speaking to
recognize what's going on in the county.
And that's -- that's some of the things that they
are -- they are working on. Our county food show, we had 18
participants this year. That is down a little bit, I can tell
you, from last year. We had one club -- one of our more
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active clubs that had the 9-H -- had the foods project, and
for whatever reason, they weren't able to participate in the
food show; they just decided to go do the foods projects but
not participate in the food show. We ended up with 18 total
participating, and six of them qualified and competed at
district. I believe we had about 45 or 50 people at the
county food show, counting parents and different guests. Here
in November, we -- we finally had the opportunity to host a
statewide shooting sports clinic. We had 97 different coaches
from around the state that came in. We've been trying to do
that for the last couple years. That gives our coaches here
locally an opportunity to be certified as instructors, and in
order for our kids to -- in order really to expand our
program, we have to have certified coaches, and it gets very
expensive and time-consuming to try to send coaches to east
Texas or to Amarillo for a certification program. So, we were
finally able to coordinate with the state 4-H shooting sports
program to have one here in Kerrville, and we brought in 47
coaches and certified them for different 4-H clubs around the
state. I believe, locally, we ended up having probably six or
eight that were actually certified for trap and skeet, BB
gun -- those two areas, primarily.
We just finished up our pecan show, our district and
regional pecan show. Our regional pecan show had right at 100
entries. Had -- had a really good show. The quality was real
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good, and we also just finished up this last weekend our Any
Baby Can Christmas party, where we helped host that with the
Any Baby Can group. And that -- that was a really good
turnout, where our Senior Council kids were able to help
decorate and help work with those kids. So, that's some of
the things that -- that we're doing. As far as in --
project-wise, of course, with the livestock projects, it's
getting pretty busy, trying to make project visits and getting
ready for the show here coming up here in January. So --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did the courthouse win the
pecan show?
MR. WALSTON: Courthouse didn't have an entry.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Uh-oh.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You were supposed to do
that, weren't you?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Was that one of my jobs?
(Laughter.)
DODGE TINLEY: That's in Precinct 1, those pecan
trees.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You stay out of this.
MR. WALSTON: No, but we did -- you know, we get
some different -- we get some new ones every year, and then
for -- you know, this year was a pretty short year. We had a
lot of people that really just didn't have pecans.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. Very good. Thank
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you.
MR. WALSTON: All right. Thank y'all.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any questions for Mr. Walston? Thank
you, Roy. We appreciate you being here.
MR. WALSTON: Thank y'all.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's move on to our 2 o'clock
timed item now, a workshop on Subdivision Rules and
Regulations and Water Availability Requirements.
(The open session was closed at 2:13 p.m., and a
workshop was held, the transcript of which is
contained in a separate document.)
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I gather we have no formal
action to take with regard to Items 15 and 16, then; is that
correct?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think that's correct. I think
we'll just leave it that these are out for public comment and
will be back on our agenda for the first meeting in January
for us to -- hopefully, by that time we'll have received the
comments and make a final draft that we can put out for a
formal public comment period and public hearing.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anyone else on the Court have
anything to offer?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are we not going into
executive session?
JUDGE TINLEY: No, I already inquired about that and
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no one expressed a need to.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: Unless you've got some deep, dark
secrets you want to tell us.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I do, but...
JUDGE TINLEY: They're all on you?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They're on me, and they're
staying here.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. All right, we'll stand
adjourned.
(Commissioners Court adjourned at 4:25 p.m.)
STATE OF TEXAS
COUNTY OF KERR
The above and foregoing is a true and complete
transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my
capacity as County Clerk of the Commissioners Court
of Kerr County, Texas, at the time and place
heretofore set forth.
DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 16th day of
December, 2005.
JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk
B Y : .~1~JS~S ~~-----
Kathy anik, Deputy County Clerk
Certified Shorthand Reporter

ORDER NO. 29495
DISCUSS LEASE PURCHASE AGREEMENT FOR ASPHALT ZIPPER
MILLING MACHINE
Came to be heard this the 12th day of December, 2005, with a motion made
by Commissioner Letz, seconded by Commissioner Williams. The Court
unanimously approved by vote of 4-0-0 to:
Approve and accept Lease Purchase Agreement for Asphalt Zipper Milling
machine for Road and Bridge including approval of payment of $500 for
document processing fee and an additional $15 for UCC filing and authorize
County Judge to sign same.
,,., ORDER NO. 29496
DECLARE UNUSABLE ROAD AND BRIDGE ITEMS AS SURPLUS
Came to be heard this the 12th day of December, 2005, with a motion made
by Commissioner Letz, seconded by Commissioner Baldwin. The Court
unanimously approved by vote of 4-0-0 to:
Declare unusable items listed as surplus and allow them to be sold as scrap:
1. Signs
2. Grader and mower blades
3. Fuel tanks
4. Side Loaders, spreader boxes
5. Truck axles
6. Bent pipes, rails, I-beam, guard rails, etc.
7. Unsafe cattle guards and culvert pipes
8. Case Roller - RBU 6128
9. Pick-up Truck - RBU 33
ORDER NO. 29497
REAPPOINT CHARLES DONELLEN TO THE ALAMO AREA
AGENCY ON AGING, SENIOR ADVISORY COMMITTEE
Came to be heard this the 12th day of December, 2005, with a motion made
by Commissioner Williams, seconded by Commissioner Baldwin. The
Court unanimously approved by vote of 4-0-0 to:
Approve the nomination to reappoint Mr. Charles Donellen to the Alamo
Area Agency on Aging, Senior Advisory Committee, effective December
12, 2005.
ORDER NO. 29498
DISCUSS KERR COUNTY'S PERSONNEL POLICY WITH REGARD
TO COMPENSATORY TIME OFF AND/OR OVERTIME
Came to be heard this the 12th day of December, 2005, with a motion made
by Commissioner Williams, seconded by Commissioner Nicholson. The
Court unanimously approved by vote of 4-0-0 to:
Approve the suspension of the applicability of the quarterly payment of
overtime in lieu of compensatory time each quarter as to the Juvenile
Detention Facility through June 30, 2006, pending approval of the County
Attorney that it's legally appropriate.
__ ORDER NO. 29499
CLAIMS AND ACCOUNTS
Came to be heard this the 12th day of December, 2005, came to be
considered by the Court various Commissioners Precincts, which said
Claims and Accounts are:
Accounts Expense
10-General	$	124,453.04
14-Fire Protection	$	10,416.66
15-Road & Bridge	$	28,302.25
18-County Law Library	$	5,254.42
19-Public Library	$	25,000.00
50-Indigent Health Care	$	30,051.78
59-General Contractual Obligation	$	1,000.00
76-Juvenile Detention Facility	$	5,414.12
81-District Administration	$	1,368.75
°° Total	$	231,26102
Upon motion made by Commissioner Baldwin, seconded by Commissioner
Williams, the Court unanimously approved by vote of 4-0-0 to pay the
claims and accounts.
ORDER NO. 29500
BUDGET AMENDMENT
ELECTION EXPENSE
Came to be heard this the 12th day of December, 2005, with a motion made
by Commissioner Letz, seconded by Commissioner Nicholson, the Court
unanimously approved by vote of 4-0-0 to transfer the following expense
codes:
Amendment
Expense Code Description Increase/QDecrease
10-402-456 Machine Repair + $2,260.00*
*NOTE: Funds for this expense were budgeted in "04-'OS budget and
services were provided prior to September 30, 2005. The vendor did not
submit their invoice timely for it to be encumbered back to the '04-'05
budget. Need to declare an emergency and take the needed funds from
GENERAL FUND surplus fund balance.
ORDER NO. 29501
BUDGET AMENDMENT
COMMISSIONERS' COURT
Came to be heard this the 12th day of December, 2005, with a motion made
by Commissioner Baldwin, seconded by Commissioner Letz, the Court
unanimously approved by vote of 4-0-0 to transfer the following expense
codes:
Expense Code Description
10-401-569 Operating Equipment
10-401-315 Books-Publications-Dues
Amendment
Increase/()Decrease
+ $228.85
- ($228.85)
ORDER NO. 29502
LATE BILL
AUDITOR
Came to be heard this the 12th day of December, 2005, with a motion made
by Commissioner Letz, seconded by Commissioner Baldwin, the Court
unanimously approved by vote of 4-0-0 to issue a hand check in the amount
of $375.00 payable to Thomas Mall Concrete from line item 10-642-330.
*Reimbursement for building permit from City of Kerrville (Permit
#BP2005-340) [Parcel #: PARC2005-548-3317 Loop 534].
ORDER NO.29503
MONTHLY REPORTS
Came to be heard this the 12th day of December, 2005, with a motion made
by Commissioner Williams, seconded by Commissioner Letz, the Court
unanimously approved by vote of 4-0-0 the following monthly reports:
Sheriff s Department
JP #2
County Clerk -General and Trust
JP #3
JP #4