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KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT
Budget Workshop
Friday, August 31, 2007
9:30 a.m.
Commissioners' Courtroom
Kerr County Courthouse
Kerrville, Texas
PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge
H A."BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1
WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2
JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3
BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4
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I N D E X
August 31, 2007
Review and discuss FY 2007-08 budgets and fiscal,
capital expenditure, and personnel matters related
thereto for various county departments
Adjourned
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On Friday, August 31, 2007, at 9:30 a.m., a budget
workshop of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held
in the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse,
Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had
in open court:
P R O C E E D I N G S
JUDGE TINLEY: Let's come to order, if we might, for
this Commissioners Court workshop scheduled for this time and
date, Friday, August the 31st, '07, at 9:30 a.m. It is that
time now. The workshop is for budgetary purposes. The item
listed is review and discuss FY 2007-08 budgets and fiscal,
capital expenditure, and personnel matters related thereto for
various county departments. Each of -- each of us here has a
new printout of the budget, and with an index and some nice
tabs where it's easy -- or much easier to find what we're
looking for. There's some prefacing summary information
provided by the Auditor. I want to thank Ms. Hargis for her
good work in putting this together. I know that it was pretty
much an eleventh hour operation, 'cause I know as recently as~
late yesterday afternoon, we were still working on and
discussing some of these things, and I think she's tried to
give us a summary that is concise, but yet complete, so that
we can know what we're dealing with, and therefore plug in
where -- where we need to be in order to get where we want to
go. With that, I will defer to Ms. Hargis for -- for a
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general summary of where we are, so that she might hit the
high points of -- of the status of our situation at the
present time.
MS. HARGIS: I'd like to give y'all an opportunity
to read the memo first.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is this like a moment of
silence?
MS. HARGIS: Yes.
JUDGE TINLEY: It is.
MS. HARGIS: I think it would be better if y'all had
an opportunity to read it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Y'all want to pray while
we're doing this?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We need to.
JUDGE TINLEY: I might mention one thing. Kind of
keep in mind we've got a -- a special court meeting set for
next Tuesday morning, and if there are any items that need to
be added to that agenda, we've got until the close of business
today to do that, particularly if there are any items in
connection with the budget that we have to take formal action;
the tax rate, or any other matter, as far as that goes. We've
already got the special meeting programmed in, and it's going
to be held next Tuesday morning.
(Discussion off the record.)
MS. HARGIS: Y'all about ready?
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JUDGE TINLEY: Go ahead and launch it.
MS. HARGIS: Okay. You have a booklet in front of
you, which is the budget actually as we made changes to it as
of yesterday. All of this was put together actually last
night. In going over all of the expenses and reviewing them
two and three times and then going over the revenue, I
realized that -- that I did make an error, and I have listed
that for you. And I apologize for that. But it -- I have
changed the web site. John fixed that for me, and it is out
there. The -- the effect of that, of course, is reducing
our -- our reserves, because it is a reduction of revenue.
The amount of tax increase that -- that is the actual is
1,172,172, which is a 9.8 percent increase over last year,
using the same tax rate that we currently have for maintenance
and operation and debt. The 407,900 of that is new property;
that's about 113 million, and that leaves 764,272, which is
from reappraisals. The tax freeze, taxable assessed value has
actually increased by 73 million, taking it to 847 million in
assessed property. If we took that amount of money and
multiplied it times our current tax rate, we would actually
produce a tax revenue of 3 million, 38. The freeze tax rate
which is provided to us by the Appraisal District is actually
2 million, 4, so as of right now, you actually have a loss in
tax revenues because of the freeze of $580,000. The Road and
Bridge tax is currently at .0309. The rollback rate for them
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reduced because of their rollback rate. If we roll that into
our whole rate, which to leave it the same as last year, which
is .3896, that would provide an additional 13,000 only to the
general fund. The rollback rate for the county, including the
Road and Bridge, is .4051, so the -- the maximum increase we
could do is 1.55, and that would produce approximately
394,000. I've given you a schedule that the Tax Assessor gave
me that shows the increments of tax rate increases that --
that comes off of when she produces the effective tax rate
calculation. I've also attached that for your review. As I
said earlier, the Judge and I have gone over and -- and
reviewed everyone's request. We moved people around like you
requested that they be moved around; for instance, the
Maintenance Department. There are no raises, there are no
merit increases, and there's no COLA in this budget. The
longevities are here, because we are obligated to do the
longevities. That is so that you can make that decision
yourself. You had asked me to do the COLA's from 3 percent to
4 percent, and I have given you a sheet which, unfortunately,
is not as clear as I would like, but I didn't have much time
to get it for you. And, basically, the 3 percent would be
326,0000. At 3.1, it would be 336, so every one-tenth is an
additional $10,000. You asked for that as well. And if you
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-- the retirement that we have currently in the budget is at
8.9 percent, and the -- we have received our new rate for next
year, which is 8.2 before your unemployment rate, and then the
new unemployment rate which I've given you a copy of is .0032.
And if you were to give the retirees the same COLA as you gave
them last year, which was a 50 percent COLA on retirement, the
cost would be a half a -- a half a percent, and so that would
bring your rate to 8.7032. So, we could pick up some
reduction in cost if we took our entire payroll and reduced
that, but it -- they had estimated the 8.9. Keep in mind, the
reduction -- I think, Jonathan, you were in the retirement
session with me. The reduction is due to the retirement
system getting a -- short some funds, and so they've actually
reduced everybody's. I did speak with that representative
after the meeting, and I have not verified it, and he told me
that he had had a request on our fund, and so he had checked '
it, and one of the -- someone in the 198th -- actually, I
think Adult Probation for the 198th was considering going into
one of their counties as a retirement system, and he said we
had over 100 percent in our fund, which is great. So, he
suggested no one to reduce it, but if we, in fact, have -- he
said actually 118 percent, but, you know, I -- I would rather
verify that with him before I tell you that's really the
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truth.	But that's	the	rate	that we	could do.	Last	year'	s
rate was	8.75, so	if we	did	go down,	it wouldn'	t be	that	much.
JUDGE TINLEY: Let me interrupt you there, if I
might. Does -- the 8.2 does not include the insurance
benefit, does it?
MS. HARGIS: No. That's the .0032, the unemployment
rate that we have to put into that.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So, the insurance benefit that
we've had in place for the last few years is, like -- I don't
know, .28, .29, something like that.
MS. HARGIS: Yes, it fluctuates just like the other,
and we get -- there's a letter in there telling you what ours
has been in the past and what it is this year.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
MS. HARGIS: So that we could, again, pick up a
little bit of -- of savings on that. I didn't have a chance
and didn't have really enough time to go through and really
itemize all the software or I.T. projects that we have, so
what I did is pick up the big-ticket items for you under the
long-term so that you could see what those are. I can go back
over those in my notes and tell you what they are, but I
wanted you to just see the amounts.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Jeannie, do you have a -- or you
or John, do you have a total I.T. on hardware county-wide?
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MR. TROLINGER: Just hardware only? No, I do not --
well, yes I do, correction. Desktops -- desktop computers,
hardware, it includes some software, it's -- it's about
$125,000. It's on the summary page of the I.T. budget that I
submitted to y'all.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Ms. Hargis, it looks like
this total -- I'm just looking at it at a glance -- looks like
in excess of 600,000. Would that be correct?
MS. HARGIS: I think so.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Something like that?
MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. And keep in mind, now, when we
did the air-conditioners, we didn't do all of them, so if we
-- if you decided to do long-term debt, we might decide to
add, you know, all the air-conditioners, since they are all
the same age out there. You do have one obligation that will
be removed next year, which is your 2001 -- I mean, and I put
1001. I apologize; it's 2001 contractual obligation. That
payment is 160,000, so that will drop off after this year.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that the Sheriff's
communication system?
MS. HARGIS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And so after that, we've got the
MS. HARGIS: We have the Bank of America one, and we
have the I.T. one, and then those will drop off, and the jail
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: When does the Juvenile
Detention Facility drop off?
JUDGE TINLEY: 2010.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 2010? Okay, I see it.
MS. HARGIS: So, most everything will drop off in
2010, so that if you did a long-term now, you could probably
have it for a short-term period and pay it off in 2010, or
shortly thereafter.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: What if we were to shift the
items you have listed to a -- to a debt -- long-term debt?
What would that reduce the budget by?
MS. HARGIS: Well, if we went through and really
took out all of the software, which I think there's actually a
little bit more than that in there --
MR. TROLINGER: There's software and services also.
There are -- for instance, the Internet service at a few
facilities is listed in there.
MS. HARGIS: So, it's -- I would say it's probably
closer, 'cause I know one of the software packages is around
$30,000, so it's probably closer to 200 for that. I would say
about a million. That would reduce the budget by about a
million, which would get us -- a million's going to bring you
up to a higher percentage; it's going to get you up to 20,
maybe 21 percent.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that would be what kind of
long-term debt? Talking about a three-year? Four-year?
MS. HARGIS: Three- or four-year. I wouldn't
suggest you go out that long, because your debt's going to
fall off. We could push it out where the payment wouldn't
come due until next year, which would then, you know, take the
160, and then what we could do is -- is have that 160, and
then at the point where all the debt fell off, we would just
pay that one off. And then -- and you would have the same
schedule as you have today.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: By -- in your opinion, most of
these items, by doing that, are we just making a new problem
for a couple years down the road?
MS. HARGIS: No, because I don't suggest we replace
it with anything maybe but our employee benefits. I'm not
suggesting we take the whole million and spend that. What I'm
suggesting is we use long-term debt for that, which will free
up at least some to help the employees, and then take that
additional money and put in our reserve fund so that our
reserve fund will build over this year. And we always get
plus-or-minus revenue. We get more interest revenue than we
have in the past, so that perhaps we can get that reserve
built up on its own, without us having to do that again. I
wouldn't suggest we do long-term if it wasn't going to have
some kind of effect on the --
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: Positive impact, short-term?
MS. HARGIS: Yeah, 'cause that would -- that would
be my goal. Don't just -- just use a portion of it that we've
saved, not all of it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I think there's --
MS. HARGIS: And --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- there's some items that I
would be in favor of. I mean, I think they're a little bit
discretionary. Windows, I would cut out, but most of those
can be put in the long-term, such as the windows is one of
those items. I mean, that's a legitimate long-term item, but
something we don't have to do this year. But at some point,
that's got to be done. So, it's kind of -- by putting it into
long-term debt may not be a bad way to do it, whether we do it
this year or -- and -- or, you know, not do it this year, then
do it next year as long-term. I mean, which pushes it off a
little bit, which makes it a little bit of a benefit. I think
the Sheriff's Department vehicles can be cut back to standard
cruisers. That's another -- oh, I'm guessing it's about -- a
savings of about $40,000, $50,000, I think, by not going to
the Tahoe-type vehicles.
MS. HARGIS: That wouldn't be that much, would it?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No.
MS. HARGIS: No, he only has 57,000 in there, s.o
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SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And the actual bottom line came
in -- I've got even Ford Motor Credit and everything. The
payments will be 54,000 for the four Tahoes and the one Crown
Vic. And if you wanted just to do the four Tahoes and, say,
forget the one Crown Vic, keep us at four cars instead of
going with five, which is really pushing our mileage, but then
you could take another 9,000 off of that 54.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: What would it be if you just
went to Crown Vics and no Tahoes? Four Crown Vics.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The difference --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: $7,000 less. It extends the
difference in lease payments. It is a difference in the
years, okay?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The length -- term of the
agreement.
JUDGE TINLEY: Term of one more year.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Term of one more year. So,
we're -- you're not changing the amount of the payment.
You're not changing the effect of the budget, except for that
one more year payment.
MS. HARGIS: And we did lose a car Friday.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah, I had one that somebody
turned in front of one of ours. Not our fault, but it's --
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the problem is, it's totaled out. It's one of our Tauruses.
That's not one I've ever asked the Court to -- that's a C.I.D.
car. But -- so I just have to come up with funds for it, '
depending on what the insurance pays us, and that's -- I don't
know what I'm going to do with that one. The adjuster won't
be here till next week.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Looking at some of these other
dedicated funds, is there any additional funds we could shift
to come out of the Records Management or some of these other
dedicated funds? Is there any savings we can get there off
the general fund?
MR. TROLINGER: A large part of the I.T. budgets
where I mentioned there was some software and services are
from Records Management. The -- the County Clerk's and the
District Clerk's imaging project are substantial numbers.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: How about Law Library? I mean,
that's one that's getting -- has a huge balance in it. That's
164,000.
MR. TOMLINSON: That can only be spent in the Law
MS. HARGIS: Yeah, that's what I was concerned
about. I'm not -- but I think some of those things, when you.
get the funds, they're only allocated for one purpose, and --
and that's what Tommy is saying. The Law Library, they have
to go for books.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. Is there any way that we
can -- I mean, are we getting as many of the books that can go
in that category, like J.P.'s, County Attorney -- I mean,
we're putting everything we can into that fund -- or out of
that fund?
MS. HARGIS: I mean, the Judge and I have really
spent several days looking at every line item, and -- and
we've tried to reduce. The group insurance, I think we've
probably got it a little bit high, but I was a little afraid
to reduce it. Some of them are, like, 1,000 in each
department, but I was a little concerned that I bring that
down real far, because we don't know what it's going to be.
We really only know what three months is going to be; we don't
know what -- you know, what we're going to, what the plan's
going to be. So, what they put in -- they plugged in was an
8 percent increase, but some people put much more than that.
So, if it was a lot more, I reduced it. That's where I
basically got -- picked up some of this 230,000, was in the
group insurance. And there's still some of those that are a
little bit much. If I went back and tweaked those, we might
find a little bit of money, but I wanted to let y'all know
we're really pushing it down to the wire, and how close do you
want me to get?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
MS. HARGIS: And I would think if we did that, we
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still probably would want to hold maybe a group insurance
total or -- you know, like a pot, in case it went up and we
had to spread it out amongst the different departments. Group
insurance and health insurance is a real crapshoot from the
get-go, unfortunately. Now, having been involved with -- with
the representatives with the City, I think they got a pretty
good plan, but they still had an increase in it, and I think
it was around 8. And I think that's what the gentleman said
when he was here, was about 8 percent. And, then again, that
2 percent might make a pretty good difference if we go back
and tweak the retirement, but I need to know what you want to
do before I can do that. And I want to verify that rate
with -- and, you know, I need to know if you want to do the
COLA for the retirees this year, or -- you did it last year;
maybe you don't want to do it this year. There were a lot of
options presented at that session, one of which I don't -- I
don't think I even want to mention today, which was to bring
everybody up to the cost-of-living today, and I don't really
think we have that kind of money. The rest of the items, you
know, I've looked at, I've checked going back in their
history. We don't have a lot of fluff in -- in these people's
budgets. I mean, I think throughout this area, everybody's
very concerned that they stay within those line items. So,
there's just -- really, the areas where we've got the expense
this year is really the I.T. areas, getting everybody up. But
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I'm not a proponent of taking those away, because the more
up-to-date equipment that we have, the better our staff will
work, will be more productive, and therefore we won't have to
hire new bodies, and it's a whole lot cheaper than hiring
MR. TROLINGER: And if you look at the I.T., you
also see that I'm giving you numbers over five years, how much
it costs per user spread out over that -- that time period.
So, I'd say the minimum period that you would want to lease
out or -- or defer the payments on hardware would be three
11 years.
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MS. HARGIS: Right.
MR. TROLINGER: Because that's about the limit of
MS. HARGIS: And, again, I would want to call your
financial adviser in here and have him work with us to -- to
come up with the best way to schedule the debt if we did it,
to the best -- you know, to our benefit. But you're at a
million, 394. And if you think about that, for the debt
service payment for this current year, we drop off 160 next
year, so -- and the jail is only 460, so in 2010, you're going
to drop off almost a million dollars, and you can take and pay
that one debt off in that third year, just with the savings
from not having to pay in 2011 from all the others. And the
other -- this is not real popular, but people don't like to
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see their tax rate do this. And if you're going -- if you
remove the debt rate and then you bring it back and then you `
take it away and you bring it back, people don't understand
that kind of thing. So, it's much better, and your debt rate
!I is very, very low. If -- and if you need improvements that
are real capital improvements, and -- and can provide a real
benefit to the county, sometimes it's better to stretch those
out just a little bit and give them that benefit, and keep
your other expenses and your fund balance up. 'Cause a lot of
times what happens when you do a bond issue -- and I'm not as
familiar with counties as I am other entities, but because you
don't have to do -- perhaps if you buy newer vehicles, you're
not repairing; you save those costs. Like, the
air-conditioners, you're spending a lot of money on
maintenance. You save those costs, plus you earn the interest
on that money that you don't spend, and that difference
sometimes will get you to where you -- we're really not that
far away. It's really possible to take interest earnings and
be a little frugal with our maintenance costs and stuff this
next year to get our fund balance back to where we need it to
be, and we just need to have that goal and get there.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Ms. Hargis, what is the
cost-of-living?
MS. HARGIS: COLA? I haven't looked at it
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3.7, depending on which web site you look at. According to
Eva -- and we are in the Dallas County area as much as we --
that's the -- the web site that we have to do. Dallas County
is at 3.4. I think the City's average is going to be about,
3.3, 3.4, is what they're giving this year.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Southwest Urban is between
3.2 and 3.4.
MS. HARGIS: It's somewhere in there. It's a little
lower than it was last year.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I, for one, definitely
want to go that route.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What about -- and you may
have mentioned the raises that we had talked about a couple of
weeks ago. We had talked about raises for several different
people. Those have dropped out.
MS. HARGIS: They're not in here, because you -- we
want -- I want you to tell me, and for y'all to approve that.
That's not a decision that I make.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand that. I
understand that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do we have --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'd be interested in knowing,
though, who those were and how much -- how much the total was.
Do I have that information?
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MS. HARGIS: I would have to go back through. I
think -- Eva, are you here? She has a few recommendations on
some. I don't know if she has all of them.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
MS. HARGIS: But, you know, I can work with her and
go through -- back through, and each department head, and see
what those are. And -- and, to be honest, I have not added
the total of those requests at all, so I cannot give you a
number.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want to tell you a little
story -- or quick story about insurance. And there's a lot of
people talking about -- in Washington, talking about -- they
call it all kinds of things. It's socialized medicine. Let
me tell you about socialized medicine. Yesterday morning at
4 o'clock, my daughter goes into the hospital in New Zealand,
where the medicine and medical attention's all free.
Socialized country. Midnight last night, she got into a --
4 o'clock in the morning to midnight, she sat on a gurney in a
hallway for 20 hours waiting on medical attention. We have a
good program.
MS. HARGIS: We have an excellent program.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Excellent program. And we
need to all understand that.
MS. HARGIS: We do.
25 ~ COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Ms. Hargis, with regard to
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your list of items that could be capitalized, there are some
small ones that surely we would not want to include in a
long-term debt structure.
MS. HARGIS: No, I think that --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Items C, D, E, and F --
whatever -- G. D, E, F, and G, particularly.
~I, MS. HARGIS: I think those are I.T. related, and I
~~ think if we added all the I.T. together, then your amount's
going to be closer -- from what John's got, actually closer to
about 200,000.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay.
MS. HARGIS: But this morning I didn't list them
all, because some of the budgets include them in one line
item, some have them in another line item, and to be honest
with you, I didn't have time to go through and pull out a real
good amount for you, so I didn't want -- I just picked the
largest ones I could see real quickly. As the Judge and I
said, we were here till 8:30 putting your books together. We
wanted you to see and get those adjustments done so you have a
new book to look at, and new summary, and -- and some
suggestions. 'Cause I'm at that point where I need you to
tell me what I need to do, and --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What do you want to know?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the COLA needs to be
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: There's one.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: COLA, 3.3.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 3.3.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And then work on ways to pay
for that by cutting some of these things or redoing them or
putting them on long-term debt.
MS. HARGIS: Okay.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. I think -- I mean, I'm
not a big fan of the long-term debt thing, but I think it's --
knowing our long-term debt situation, and some of these
things, we just -- we've got to do something. Some of these
things, like the windows, is discretionary, but they're really
not. That's something we -- it's been on the radar screen
since you were a Commissioner last time.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. Well, last time I was
here, they supposedly fixed them, and they -- they didn't stay
fixed.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The reality is, you would
pull out the items which really -- really warrant
consideration in a capital position -- capital funding, and
then tell us what that is.
MS. HARGIS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What the total is, correct?
MS. HARGIS: Yes.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: And then put the COLA in.
MS. HARGIS: Put the COLA in, and then what do you
want to do about -- there are no merit increases; there are no
new positions except the ones that you authorized. For
instance, I need to know whether you want me to put in the .
other half position for the Animal Control. Was -- you
accepted his money, but it wasn't on the agenda for you to .
accept the position. Do you want me to add a half a position
to Animal Control?
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. We need to put half --
we have to do that.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think it would be helpful
for the Court, following up on what Commissioner Baldwin asked
a moment ago, if we could see some sort of a list of
recommendations from H.R. with respect to salary adjustments.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think she's provided that at
one point, but --
MS. HYDE: Would y'all like a new one?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I'm seeing it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: The same one. The same one.
But I would like to see it so we can go through it.
MS. HYDE: Do you want it right now?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Any time would be helpful.
JUDGE TINLEY: With respect to the long-term debt,
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one of the things we need to keep in mind is your effective
rate, that rate that you're paying, you have to factor into
~ that your cost of issuance. So, if you're going to do -- in
that situation, you need to structure it in such a manner,
number one, that the cost of issuance is -- you're trying to
keep that as low as possible, and number two, there's almost a
minimal amount that you consider because of that cost that you
have factored in. But --
MS. HARGIS: And I would suggest we try do something
locally so that we don't have to pay all of the fees. There
are different instruments that -- that financial advisers
don't have -- they get a little less percentage, and also you
don't have to have -- you still have to file with the Attorney
General, but other than that, there are some fees we can
reduce.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just get the minimal amount of
fees on a short term. Really, we're looking at short-term
debt instead of -- you know, three years is really not
long-term. I consider long-term 15 to 20 years.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, in this business, anything past
one year is long-term.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
MS. HARGIS: Well, actually, it's one year plus one
25 ~ JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah.
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MS. HARGIS: True.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I was recently, last week,
visiting with a Sheriff	from another	county,	and we were
talking about vehicles,	and he does	five vehi	cles a year. And
I asked him how he did	it, and he sa	id, well,	we used to
lease, but realized tha	t that costs	a lot mor	e in the long run
'cause of your interest	rates. And	so they -	- they just
purchase five up front.	And we may	want to -	- may want to
revisit that next year.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'd look at your -- your cost.
Like, say five Tahoes, okay? Just on that, 'cause I did get
those kind of prices earlier. The cost of five Tahoes is
208,000 if you purchased them outright, total, okay? Your --
your lease payment -- y'all have to figure this -- on four
Tahoes -- and say they're 30-something thousand each, so maybe
it's 177,000 for four Tahoes. Your lease for four years on
four Tahoes is -- on just the Tahoes, is 38,000, and that's at
6 percent. But -- so four of them is 38, compared to the 177,
is what your difference is.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm.
JUDGE TINLEY: What's the per annum factor in there,
though, on the lease factor?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The percentage? The percentage
25 ~ MR. ODOM: 25.
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SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: On the -- this coming year,
because of what -- Ford Motor Credit on that lease is 6.9.
JUDGE TINLEY: We can borrow a whole lot cheaper
I than that.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's your --
JUDGE TINLEY: And so Commissioner Baldwin's point
is well-taken. If we go capital on those, our interest cost
on that -- on that amount will probably be at least 2 points
below, probably closer to 3.
MS. HARGIS: Devil's advocate here.
JUDGE TINLEY: Huh?
MS. HARGIS: Let me play devil's advocate.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
MS. HARGIS: Having just moved from one spot here to
the other, the -- that was their -- the City was buying
vehicles every year. The problem is, once you start that,
you're going to have a $208,000 bill every year.
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
MS. HARGIS: So -- but you need to see -- and the
other thing is, a lot of those vehicles, then you have
problems trading them in. It's just been my experience, even
though you might have a little interest difference -- what we
might do is figure what it would be to see if we really save
that much money. Because if you're leasing the vehicles, you
can trade them back in; you can get another one. You don't
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have to worry about selling them on the web. I mean, even --
even with that, I mean, we have lost a lot of money trying to
sell the vehicles, because we put a lot of miles on them in a
hurry. And they're -- they're leased vehicles, and so it's
got to be another small town that's looking for them, and
they're -- they don't have the money. So, what -- what's
basically happened at the City is, we've sold a lot of those
vehicles and lost money on them because we, you know,
bought -- that's what he does every year. Now they're
switching on the -- actually switching on the fire trucks.
They did put two trucks in, as you know, in the fire
department -- the fire station. But he's always had, like,
one truck and one EMS every year, and so that's begun -- and
your cost is going to go up with the vehicles as well. This
year, they might be 208,000, but next year they might be
225,000, so there may be your interest differential, by the
cost going up. On --
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Judge, if you have your
calculator handy, I do have the figure on sale of four.
JUDGE TINLEY: Say what?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: On four. Four Tahoes,
equipped, okay, is $166,560, plus a $350 document fee, is the
way they get that. All right? That's what it would cost you
outright purchasing them. The payments for four years, and
then you buy them for $1 after that, at the 6.9 percent is
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$45,991.88.
JUDGE TINLEY: 45 what?
i SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 991.88.
I
MR. TROLINGER: Each?
MS. HARGIS: No, for all of them.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
MS. HARGIS: Times four.
JUDGE TINLEY: Times four.
MR. TROLINGER: Each.
MS. HARGIS: Times how many years?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Four.
MS. HARGIS: Four years.
MR. BARYON: Plus $4.
JUDGE TINLEY: Interest cost of $17,000.
MS. HARGIS: In four years. So, what is four times
45?
JUDGE TINLEY: I don't know, I'm past that number.
MR. TROLINGER: It's, like, 15 or 17.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's gone.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 17,000 interest.
MS. HARGIS: Yeah. So even if you put them in a
capital program, you're going to end up with that as well, so
you really need to pay cash if you're going to do that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Ms. Hargis, on a couple of these
items, if -- are we better off, in your opinion, on items
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like -- what do you call those -- air-conditioners, and
possibly Ag Barn, some of that, to look into the crystal ball
and see where we're going to be for the next couple years, and
do it all at once? Or issue possibly more debt next year,
depending on what happens?
MS. HARGIS: No, you're always better off doing all,
those all at one time. The problem -- when you do the arena
and you price it out, it's, like, piecemeal, you know. You're
going to get somebody else adding onto it, and if you do it
j all at one time, they're going to give you a much better price
than if you -- they have to have sections, I think.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So -- and if -- say that we put,
I think, 150,000 here. Put that up to 250,000, then if we
were -- we didn't need it all, we could just pay off the debt
with it?
MS. HARGIS: Yes, you can always pay the off the
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that a good or a bad option,
in your mind?
MS. HARGIS: No, it's a good option. I mean, I
have -- you know, I've had a lot of entities do that where
they, you know, have the capital item; they don't really have
it -- you know, they don't know exactly. They estimate it,
and what we would do is budget what we think needs to go into
long-term debt, knowing that it would have to be plus or minus
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as soon as we get a good estimate after you -- after your
designer gives it to you, or we can sit down and -- and -- but
I think I would really -- if we did an issue with the arena,
all of it, I would like to get some kind of estimate for it
and maybe put 10 percent more. And then if it came back in
less when we bid it, then we would just take that money and --
and pay down the debt.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- what I'm thinking, I
That's going to have to come in through grants. But there's
going to be things associated with it that are going to have
to be done, that we're going to have to pick up, possibly,
such as -- maybe we can get it all paid for; parking, some of
the sewer connections, electrical changes. I mean, there's
things -- more of the infrastructure side that I see the
County's going to be responsible for, with the big ticket of
the actual building being, I mean, through the grant.
MS. HARGIS: Are there any fees going to be made on
the building? Any fees generated from this building?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes, there will be.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. There's also -- this is a
little bit off the track, but at one of our schools, there was
-- there's some new legislation that allows the counties to
do -- I forget what they call them, areas that we can do a --
increase the sales tax. Rather than do a -- City's already
got the sales tax in the city limits. The Ag Barn is not in
the city limits. We could, on that one property, put sales
tax in, which will hit the concession stands and also the arts
and crafts fair. Then we could get -- then that sales tax
revenue can go -- or, anyway, I'd like to look at that a
little bit more after you're done with the budget stuff.
MS. HARGIS: I think that's a good -- I saw that as
well. And I attended a session, I guess, about four or five .
years ago when the emergency fire districts were trying to go
into taxing, and a lot of them were outside of the city, and
they were taking care of it, but if there was a city close by,
they couldn't get the sales tax. One of those things,
first-come, first-served, so they were in the ETJ's. So, I
think new legislation is coming, actually from the emergency
services districts' attorneys. And it's a good thing, because
it's always been sales tax, first-come, first-served. And
then, if you're in the ETJ of that city, then you do not get
any more. So, we could -- that would be a big-ticket item out
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there at the fairgrounds.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want to ask you something.
You may be just talking philosophy, but, like, you're talking
parking and sewer and those kinds of things that are directly
related to the arena, and you would budget that directly
related, instead of 50,000, --
MS. HARGIS: 150.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- 150,000, 200,000, or
whatever the number might be. Is that what you're saying?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. I'm just saying that -- I
mean, I think the County's going to have to pay to get -- do
the kind of plan we've discussed. We're going to have to put
some money into it. But, in my mind, the majority of the
money has to come from grants and foundations.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I understand. I know.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we need to have a --
well, we realize we're going to have to -- there's going to be
some cost to the County to get this done. I don't think we
can go, you know, ask a foundation to do all these little --
you know, little things. As an example, renovating the
current indoor arena. It needs work, and I really -- I
don't -- I think it's going to be real hard-pressed to find
any grant for us to redo that.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's got to be something this
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Co' unty's going to have to pay for. And I think that I'd like
to start -- you know, get a pocket of money set aside that we
can start doing that stuff, sewer hookups and extensions over
there by the pole barn that we're doing, and there's going to
be things like that that I think if we can just have it in our
budget to pay for those things, it's going to make the grant
applications and all that a whole lot simpler. I mean, rather
than say, "Oh, and by the way, we need to do a sewer extension
for 400 feet to tie in this one bathroom that we just built."
It just clouds the issue, to me, so I think we need to budget
for that stuff.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think you're absolutely
right. But that -- we talked about this last Monday, and all
that has to come under the guise of planning and site planning
and some design money.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We can't just be walking in
the front door of various foundations and saying, "Hi, we got
a hell of an idea here," you know.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They want to see it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I just want to make sure that if
we're going to go out on -- on some debt, that we put enough
money for that facility, and use as little of it as possible.
25 ~ MS. HARGIS: And, really, the threshold for debt is
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a million. I mean, that sounds like a lot, but if you don't
sell a million, it really costs you. It costs you too much to
do it. So, we -- we might -- and the air-conditioners,
they're all 20 years old. You know, and doing five a year is
not going to make it, 'cause some of them are just not going
to make it, you know, that length of time, even if we did five
a year, because there's 20 units out there. And if they
hadn't all been put in at the same time, we could probably do
that, but since they were all installed at the same time --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Aren't we compounding the
problem, though? That if we now go to 20 of them, then in 20
years, we're going to have to redo them all again?
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'd rather -- I'd rather do
the most important ones and then do -- like, do a fourth of
them a year until we get them done. That way, we set
ourselves up for not having to spend all of it at one time in
the future.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Getting in a rotation
program.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But you still have the
ongoing maintenance for the other ones that are going to fail
or in the failing mode, so I think you have to balance the
maintenance costs of the ones that you didn't replace with the
cost of replacing them.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I think you get the --
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come -- as they happen. But --
JUDGE TINLEY: It occurs to me, based upon my
recollection -- maybe it's faulty -- that over the past couple
years, every time we look up, we're doing a major replacement
out there.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's true.
JUDGE TINLEY: So we ought to be transitioned on a
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, some of them have been
maintained just recently. And I don't know -- Rusty, have you
been having too much problems with them since you've gotten '
some maintenance done?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Normal. Since they've got them
back on a good maintenance schedule and that, we're doing a
lot better. They've replaced a number of compressors and
things like that, but it's -- they're actually 15 years old
right now, or so, and I think it's very possible that -- and
you just have to take it, you know. You may want to have the
money there and not -- if they're all working right this
minute, don't replace one of them. As long as you got the
money. If we have another major problem with one, replace
that whole unit. Then if you have another major problem six
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any more real maintenance, replacing more compressors and all
that. If you you've got the funds that you can go ahead, and
when you start having these problems with them --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, the other thing is --
that's one way of looking at it. You budget some money to
fix, say, four of them. And if you don't -- if it doesn't go
out, you don't spend the money this year. You let it roll
over to next year, and you start replacing them as they go
out. That's the other way to look at it, rather than just
taking one that's working and put a new one in its place. I'm
not one for fixing stuff that's not broken.
MS. HARGIS: I think we need a priority list. I
think you talked about getting that as well. I think we need
a priority list of the age of those units and when they were
fixed and that kind of thing. That will give y'all an
opportunity to see exactly how many might need to be replaced.
We don't know that right now. I'm guessing.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I think that we -- you
know, we should budget enough money to, say, fix a fourth of
them. If a fourth of them go out, you fix them. If they
don't, you roll it over. If they go out --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: There's one -- there's one big
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SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: There's two monster units. Two
monster units, and then there's about 18 or 20 regular units.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: The small ones aren't that
expensive. I mean, we can -- it's those 20-ton ones that are
going to be the big, big hit.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And how's the maintenance been
on those two 20-ton units?
MR. BOLLIER: We haven't done a whole lot to them in
a while.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't think -- on those, the
best of my recollection, when they do work on them -- on
those, they're old; they're showing it. You know, they act up
once in a while, but on those, we haven't had the serious
maintenance problems yet. Now, that doesn't mean that
tomorrow we won't have one go out, but they have done pretty
well.
(Discussion off the record.)
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I always keep one of those in
the budget if it had to, but I'm like Bruce. If they're
working fine now, let's don't just go in and replace them, and
then you have this same issue 20 years from now. Replace them
as you got to do the maintenance on them.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: How much is one of the big
units? Do we know?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Tim, have you gotten a price on
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one of them big 20-ton units?
MR. BOLLIER: The only price they gave, they told me
at the time when I had them up there that it was $1,000 per
ton. So, if it's a 10-ton air-conditioner unit up there, it
would be, like, $10,000 to replace.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Put in, like $30,000, $40,000
for air-conditioning.
JUDGE TINLEY: There's 50 plugged in.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Fifty's plugged in?
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Is that reflected anywhere in
I this stuff?
JUDGE TINLEY: Plugged in 50.
MR. BOLLIER: I do have that on the -- on that
budget, the pricing, but that was the whole thing, all 20
units that are up there. There are 20 units up there total.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's in here right now, doing
that amount.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Because there will be some
other later on. The big water boiler out there, storage tank,
does have a small leak in it. Has for years. And that's
something I told Glenn Holekamp even before; we're going to
have to get it repaired, to look at that.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The boiler?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: In the boiler room, there's --
instant r_irculatina hot water system. You know,
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it's all the time, and that big tank in there is definitely
showing it. And the problem is, when they go to replace it,
you actually have to take out part of a wall on one side to
get that tank back out of there and get another one in there.
It's going to be a major deal when that tank goes.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I reckon.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Good design. Take out the wall
so we can get the boiler out.
JUDGE TINLEY: That's not that unusual at times with
major pieces of equipment. The hospital does it all the time.
They had to peel off a section of the roof over here to put in
an MRI machine.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right.
JUDGE TINLEY: Drop it in through the top.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: They actually built the -- put
the tank in before they built the wall.
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I have a question.
Mr. Odom, did you provide the amount of money required to
finish that bridge at Flat Rock Lake Park to Ms. Hargis?
MS. HARGIS: No, I don't have it.
MR. ODOM: No, I have not given anything yet. I'm
trying to get a price for someone to help put it in place, and
then concrete would be next budget year, is what I was
25 ~ thinking about.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We're working on next budget
year.
MR. ODOM: I know you are. So am I, sir.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I think that's a big item
that needs to be in there.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's an item that needs to
be in there. That's the reason I asked the question.
MR. ODOM: I don't have that answer right now, but
I'll get you one on concrete.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Tim, where did you put the
air-conditioner money for the jail?
MR. BOLLIER: Sir?
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Where is the money for the
air-conditioners for the jail?
MR. BOLLIER: On the bottom of the budget that I
turned in.
MS. HARGIS: Oh, it's -- it's under Jail. It's --
MR. BOLLIER: Under Jail.
MS. HARGIS: Hang on just a second. Capital Outlay.
Hang on just a second. If you look at your index --
MR. BOLLIER: Should be at the bottom of the page.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Capital Outlay is 13,500.
Fifty-seven was the cars, wasn't it?
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Maintenance is 67,2.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: 67,2.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Is that in my budget or
Maintenance budget?
JUDGE TINLEY: Jail Maintenance.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Jail Maintenance.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What tab is it? Jail?
JUDGE TINLEY: It's grouped under the Maintenance
I tab.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, okay.
MS. HARGIS: It's --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: How much is it?
JUDGE TINLEY: 67,2 total.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay.
MS. HARGIS: Part of that was --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 50,000 in there, that would be
f ine .
JUDGE TINLEY: It's 50,000, another 10,000, and then
7,200 -- no, I'm thinking about the tractors. The 7,200,
that's in a different one.
MS. HARGIS: That's a different one.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, thank you.
MS. HARGIS: This is, I think, the -- a scanning
system and --
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. So, is that under the
Jail budget or the Maintenance budget?
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: Jail Maintenance.
MR. BOLLIER: Jail Maintenance, it should be.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Which is under Maintenance, not
mine. Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: But we could charge that to your
budget, deduct something else in order to make that fit.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think that would work good.
JUDGE TINLEY: If you want to do that.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I was just wanting to -- I was.
like Bruce. I was like Bruce. It was 13,000; I'm going,
"Where's the 50-some?"
JUDGE TINLEY: What was that about Crown Vics,
Commissioner?
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Go back to Crown Vics and take
the Tahoes out; you just paid for your air-conditioners. I
like that plan.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right. The 67 that's in
there, that's how many air-conditioners?
MS. HARGIS: I think we said four or five.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, 50,000 is the allowance for a
portion of A/C replacement, is what we plugged in when we were
having our earlier workshops. Out of a total of -- I believe
it was 200,000 was the total amount, and we factored in 50,000
for this year's, was the rationale.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That will buy you 50 tons of
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43
in there, Capital Outlay?
MS. HARGIS: If you'll wait just a second, I'll pull
it on my backup files.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, you're supposed to
i
have that stuff just like that.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I thought I had it, but I was
wrong. I thought 7,200 was for a mower, see. And -- and
7,200 is for a mower. That 7,200 is just somewhere else,
isn't it?
MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Actually, that might be what it is.
MS. HARGIS: Oh, the rolling steel door.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Doors.
MS. HARGIS: Don't you replace the rolling steel
MR. BOLLIER: That's the sallyport door at the jail.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah.
MR. BOLLIER: I just -- I put that in there.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We do a lot of maintenance on
one of them. It is a working door; there's nothing wrong with
it, but once in a while they come up sideways or whatever, and
when they do, you got to replace a lot, 'cause it bends them
all up. But as far as motor-wise, working and that -- and,
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probably should be, such as -- and I don't know if Tim put
these in -- the hot/cold water mix valves in all the pipe
chases --
MR. BOLLIER: No, I didn't.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- into the tanks are
constantly going out. And, you know, they're having to adjust
them a different way, because they aren't replacing the
valves, and those valves are $800 a piece, and I've got
probably close to 100 of them in there. And this trying to --
and it isn't working. I've got leaks in all the pipe chases
and that, but those are expensive items in the plumbing.
MS. HARGIS: So, you want to take the door out?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Let's leave the door out, and
then put -- add back in -- I mean, I think jail's one of those
things that it's hard to budget. You may put in for a door,
and you may spend the money on, you know, other jail
maintenance. I think --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, he's got 70,000 under.
jail repairs; let it come under that.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Didn't look at his Jail
Maintenance budget. I don't know. But that would --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Close enough.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
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MS. HARGIS: So take that door out; that'll give you
17.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Take the door out. Then we'll
leave 50 for the air-conditioners. And take 17,2 --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tim, do you agree with that?
MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right, sit down. Hush.
MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir.
MS. HARGIS: Okay. Are there any other -- then the
other maintenance item was in -- that's where the mower is,
the arena and the mower.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Where are we at now?
MS. HARGIS: They're in Parks Maintenance, which is'
10-513, and that's under the Maintenance tab.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Capital Outlay.
MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. Well, actually, no. I lied.
That's the windows.
JUDGE TINLEY: That's the windows and the mower.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And what?
JUDGE TINLEY: Mower.
MS. HARGIS: Mower.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And mower, okay.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: How --
JUDGE TINLEY: Parks Maintenance is now general
maintenance. Just take the term "parks" out of there, get rid
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, because I'm looking at
building repairs under Parks Maintenance for 67 -- 68,000.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, that's courthouse buildings
JUDGE TINLEY: We're -- we're going to roll together
that budget and the Courthouse and Related Buildings. The
only other separate maintenance budgets we're going to have
are the Youth Exhibit Center and the Jail.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
MS. HARGIS: We just can't roll them until the end
~ of the year.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
is where the arena is; it's 150,000.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
MS. HARGIS: So, those are our big-ticket items.
They're really all in the maintenance area.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I'd sure like to see us
plug in for those three elected officials that I mentioned
earlier, getting them up to 52,000. I think that's $4,000; it
would be times three, be $12,000, what it would cost to raise
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Clerk, Tax Assessor?
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: County Clerk, District Clerk,
JUDGE TINLEY: I think we need to see generally what
the H.R. Director -- I think she's been doing some work there.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: Look at the whole gamut.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I just wanted to mention that
before we move on to something else.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: See the whole list.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's kind of -- to me, it's kind
to be some adjustments. I mean, I think that the -- under the
arena, we need to add more money to that. If we're going to
do any kind of a debt, I'm not sure what that should be. You
know, that's just -- that's a hard number to call. I think,
obviously, we're going to have to pay for a design fee. I
think we're going to have some sewer connections up there. I
know the interior -- Tim, do you have any kind of a ballpark
to revamp or redo the interior of the current arena?
MR. BOLLIER: No, sir, I do not.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, last time we looked at
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that, which was a few years ago, we talked about insulation,
air movers, lighting, sound, all those things that need to be
included in any kind of revamping of that arena,
~, rehabilitation of the arena. They haven't changed. They've
only gotten worse.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's a big number, probably
close to half a million for that right there. Now, I wouldn't
-- you know, insulation is not going to be a cheap thing.
It's in pretty bad shape. I mean, it's falling --
JUDGE TINLEY: Correct me if I'm wrong, gentlemen.
What I see evolving here is we want to look at a -- a
short-term/long-term debt issue on the capital items, look at
a COLA for -- plugged in for all employees, look to the H.R.
Director's guidance for individual salary adjustments in
individual areas, and move the balance over to augment
reserves.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct.
JUDGE TINLEY: We're going to have to --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Salaries to include also
getting department -- department heads or supervisors'
salaries, I think -- I've looked. I believe you have adjusted
those up to put people in the proper place with the proper
~ money.
JUDGE TINLEY: These are some of the things that the
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H.R. Director has been looking at, and that's part of those
individual --
MS. HYDE: Those are all taken out.
JUDGE TINLEY: But the --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: In or out?
MS. HYDE: They're out.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: All the salaries --
MS. HYDE: Out of this.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- are not there?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Can we see what it is
Ms. Hyde's waving back there?
MS. HARGIS: Do you have it?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are those recommendations or
what?
MS. HYDE: I pulled the net -- the budgeted change
again, so people were kind of confused. This is what I had
given y'all.
JUDGE TINLEY: We are going to have to -- when we
set the tax rate, we're going to have to modify the Road and
Bridge just very, very slightly to keep them within rollback.
That's a given. And then we need to -- one more? Okay.
MS. HYDE: What I suggested before was a 3.5 COLA.
I think that Commissioner Letz said a 3.3. And then, in
addition to the 3.5, there were also some suggestions. After
going through all the salaries I could find, the
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cost-of-living in this area, that final column is my
recommendations -- those final two columns. 3.5 COLA for the
department heads/elected officials on here, and also a
3.5 percent increase. In some cases, there's more. The
parity and consistency wasn't there in some of these
'i locations, and some of our people just were under the radar, I
think. They weren't showing.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tommy, you had your hand up a
minute ago. Was it related to this stuff?
MR. TOMLINSON: No, something else.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh.
JUDGE TINLEY: What you've got here, Ms. --
Ms. Hyde, is your recommendation as to these listed positions,
and then you have calculated in the last column a 3.5 COLA?
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Is your recommendation generally a
3.5 COLA across the board, as opposed to 3.3 or 3.7 or --
MS. HYDE: Yes. I went ahead and I did a 3.5 across
the board, so once we -- once I did the second-to-last column,
which brought people in parity and consistency, the easiest
way to then do it is to have a straight across-the-board
increase, and that would allow you and Commissioners Court to
look at these and determine whether or not you wanted to give
a full 3.5 percent increase to bring them up. But, yes, sir,
3.5 is what I -- what I recommended, and still recommend, if
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we have the money.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm not real clear. 3.5
COLA. All I see on here is elected officials and department
heads. Are we talking about all the indians? Or are we
talking about just --
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir, it was all the indians. But
y'all didn't want to see a whole position schedule, so I
didn't recommend 3.5 percent --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. "Yes" is the
i answer.
MS. HYDE: Yes.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, thank you.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: There are some significant
salary adjustments for certain department heads.
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Based on?
MS. HYDE: Well, if you look at the Maintenance
Department, in 2006 and '7, there was a 60 -- 59 percent
decrease in the salary from the year prior. I asked for
21 percent to be put back, to put that at $36,000 for the
Maintenance head.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Basically, we're going back
to -- we're putting the Maintenance Supervisor's salary back
close to where it was when we had a Maintenance Supervisor?
MS. HYDE: It's still a lot less than it was. I
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think it was at 48 in the budget, and so -- but I think that
at that time, there was a couple of other hats on that person.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
MS. HYDE: So I tried to use what I could find
across -- across our area.
MS. HARGIS: I think it's actually 44.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, Maintenance will be
'~ 37,305.
MS. HARGIS: Well, I don't want to figure the COLA;
I'd rather you take the COLA separate from the raises,
because --
	COMMISSIONER	LETZ: I	was just figuring whatever.
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	37,305, is that --
	MS. HARGIS:	After the	COLA.
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	After the COLA, okay. All
right.	And that fourth	column f	rom the right, '07-'08 is
written	in there.		
	MS. HARGIS:	Really, t	he recommended raise is --
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	I see, okay.
	COMMISSIONER	LETZ: --	36,000.
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	Yeah.
	JUDGE TINLEY:	Mm-hmm.	
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	And where is that person
today?	Help me.		
	MS. HARGIS:	That's Ti	m.
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MS. HYDE: Go back over two columns.
JUDGE TINLEY: Two columns to the left.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 28? Okay, I'm with you now.
JUDGE TINLEY: When you redo your calculations to
try and put all of this budgetary impact in perspective that
we've been talking about here this morning, Ms. Hargis,
calculate these as an option without the COLA, of course,
'cause like you say, the COLA needs to be separate and apart.
I think the total amount is not really that great when you
MS. HYDE: That handwritten number down at the
bottom is the difference.
MS. HARGIS: Keep that in mind. A lot of these are•
going to be multiplied times four, 'cause if you do
constables, you do four. If you do justice of the peace, you•
I do four .
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
MS. HARGIS: And then once we do this, then I will,
you know, need to take that -- that position schedule so we
come out with what our true COLA is. 'Cause right now -- and
we had -- I haven't plugged in the Sheriff's Department
changes that he had, moving people around the other day,
'cause I just got those Tuesday.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, and you're going to have to
calculate off of this next-to-the-last set of columns; you're
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going to have to calculate the rollups to -- to have the total
bud etary impact.
g
MS. HARGIS: Well, I -- my position schedule, once
we get everybody in there at what they're going to make, it
should -- we'll automatically pull that. Which will -- you
know, but I just need to know. And I'll have to work with Eva
on that to make sure that we get everybody -- got everybody's
name on there; everybody's on there. And I'm not so sure we
don't need a little bit of play, 'cause we're going to miss
one.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess -- I mean, we probably
shouldn't go into looking at some of these individually,
but --
COMMISSIONER
COMMISSIONER
I don't -- the COLA, I
for the employees, the
gets the same COLA.
COMMISSIONER
COMMISSIONER
OEHLER: But you're going to anyway.
LETZ: -- but I probably will. I mean,
think, should be whatever we decide on
same as what everybody else -- everyone
WILLIAMS: Right.
LETZ: I don't see an increase for
County Judge, Commissioners, Treasurer. Really, in my mind,
County Attorney, Constables, Road and Bridge, Environmental
Health, Animal Control. I'd probably reduce the H.R.'s
probably to half of what was shown.
25 ~ COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What are you thinking those
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numbers ought to be in those certain areas?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Those ones, I'd say they just
get the COLA; they don't get the increase.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are those the only ones you
want to starve their family to death?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mm-hmm. (Laughter.) I mean,
I'm against Christmas lighting, so might as well be against
families too.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, that's a hodgepodge,
isn't it?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No Christmas. No families.
We're going to have to take up a collection for Jon's kids at
I Christmas.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that's just kind of the
way -- I kind of see it as workloads; things like that change.
And I can go -- give you my logic behind it, poor as that may
be. But just, you know, I think some departments need to get
adjusted more. As an example, J.P.'s; I think J.P.'s got an
increased workload this year, just due to Legislature, but I
don't see constables really getting anything different. I
think constables get a pretty good deal, and they get cars, so
I think constables don't need an increase, but I think J.P.'s~
are warranted one. I think our Road and Bridge Administrator
gets paid, you know, a lot. He had quite a few -- not too
much. I'm just saying what you --
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MR. ODOM: Don't add no more, then.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But we added things, and we did
a lot of pretty significant increases if you go back to 2001.
So, I think that there's -- you know, I think we've made some
of the adjustments in the past.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, but you -- I don't know
that this is a fact, but you could possibly see if you -- you
know, the law changed, and you created more work for the
J.P.'s, and I agree with that. Therefore, that might create
more work for constables. I don't know that that's true.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It could.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But generally, it does.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I think the --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I mean, I'm not going to bat
for anybody; I'm just saying that I think there's flaws in
your thinking.
JUDGE TINLEY: We sure don't want to show up at
Jon's house for Christmas; it'll get a little meager, won't
it?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bring your own, I can tell
You.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Buster, just my ideas. I'm just
I one vote.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I have a little different
idea with respect to the Treasurer. I think that office ought
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: My logic there is that job has
changed significantly since -- not that it's not important,
but a big function -- part of that went to the H.R.
Department, what was in there historically.
MS. HYDE: Part of what went to H.R.?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Part of the Treasurer's jobs,
historically. Two years ago, the Treasurer was doing what you
-- the H.R. is now doing, so I think there's been a reduction
in the Treasurer's -- what that person's doing in the last two
years.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think it's been reduced,
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It has been reduced.
JUDGE TINLEY: Reduced last -- for this year.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm just not increasing it back
up. I'm not reducing it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm making a case to get the
~ parity back.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Not jumping it back up.
MS. HYDE: So -- I'm sure I misunderstood. You do
see that there is a difference in what was before you had an
H.R. person and after, though, right?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sure.
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COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. So, you're talking
about not in -- not giving COLA's to --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, not giving -- everyone gets
a COLA.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Everybody gets a COLA.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: COLA top to bottom.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: But you're just talking about
not giving the other increases to the Treasurer, County
Attorney, Road and Bridge, and Environmental Health.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Environmental Health, and -- and
Commissioners and County Judge. And I guess I have a little
bit of a question in my mind between Animal Control and
Maintenance. I don't think those are -- should be the same.
I'm not saying Animal Control shouldn't be brought up, but I
don't think -- I think one has more responsibility than the
other in the supervision.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Which one has the more
responsibility?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think Maintenance does.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They may have, but boy, I tell
you what, Animal Control is -- they're pretty strapped too.
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And they're only getting -- I mean, I don't disagree that
there's a lot of things that --
MS. HARGIS: Why don't we give you a list and give
you the actual amount of increase, and then y'all can make
your decision at next Tuesday's meeting?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good idea.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, I think we need to --
MS. HARGIS: But do we want to go with the COLA?
JUDGE TINLEY: -- do the recalculations.
MS. HARGIS: Right, but I need a COLA amount. We
have 3 and 3.5.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 3.3.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, what are we saying?
She's going to work up the numbers off this schedule right
here?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: That portion of the numbers will come
off the schedule.
MS. HARGIS: To give you the exact difference that
it was going to make.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Exactly. Good.
MS. HARGIS: So you know the total amount that
you're actually increasing.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm a COLA fan, because it's
directly related to reality; that it costs people to go to
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H.E.B. and buy milk for their little babies. Unlike Jon.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He just milks a goat, right?
(Laughter.)
MS. HYDE: Oh, ouch.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: With love and affection,
Commissioner.
JUDGE TINLEY: You are now labeled the grinch.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Don't let the goat die.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So I think, because -- you
know, and I wish we had a real number from some index
somewhere. Of course, there's a court order that says that
we're tied to an index somewhere, but we never do that. But
I'd be willing to bet that 3.5 is real close, or maybe even
under some. But I would personally go with a 3.5 as opposed
to 3.3.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just me.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm kind of with you, and
I'd like to hear Ms. Hyde's rationale for proposing 3.5.
MS. HYDE: Well --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Help us understand where you
are on that issue.
MS. HYDE: As far as the court order, I couldn't
find a court order that specific -- that specified a specific
index.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Larry Griffin.
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MS. HYDE: The index that was specified within the
discussions no longer exists; the D.O.L. has changed that
index. So, there's a government index, there's an all wage
earners, all urban wage earners, and there's a multitude of
different types. Typically, our folks would be considered all
urban wage earners, clerical. The majority of our folks are
like that. Of course, there's the exception in the jail, the
J.D.C., law enforcement, and you can look at those. You also
look at -- I looked at counties that were similar; you guys
got that information. Looked at tax information so that I
could have something in black and white, but I also looked at
local agencies here and what they pay, and what their increase
was going to be this year, because we live in Kerr County.
And then I looked at the cost of a home. I looked at multiple
types of areas. Although our cost-of-living, per se, is
lower, the cost to purchase a home in this area is extremely
high. The average cost of a 3-bedroom, 2-bath house is
between $180,000 and $225,000. That's large.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If you can find it.
MS. HYDE: If you can find one. So, taking all
those factors into consideration, I did the old-fashioned plus
and minus and Texas math, and ended up with 3.5. But then I
looked at our appointed/elected department heads and looked at
their salaries, and tried to figure out where they stood in
comparison with others. Because I can't compare it to
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anything here locally, not really. If I compare it to the
City, y'all laugh and say, "hope, we're not like the City."
I If I tried to compare it to the hospital, "Nope, we're not
like the hospital."
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, a 3.5.
MS. HYDE: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you.
(Applause.)
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That was a good
dissertation, Ms. Hyde.
MS. HYDE: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: Were you prepared to keep talking
until you heard that?
MS. HYDE: Absolutely. He knew I was talking to
I him.
MS. HARGIS: Having a filibuster here.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's filibuster.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think we could still get
another 100,000 out of the Sheriff's budget.
JUDGE TINLEY: Sheriff, don't take this filibuster
idea to mind; it won't work for you.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I've tried it every year; it
never worked for me. I'm proud of Eva.
JUDGE TINLEY: Kevin, you had --
MR. STANTON: I just had a question. Is the -- the,
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camera situation out at the facility, is that included in the
-- the numbers that she's been talking about? I just didn't
know if it was in there.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I saw a head shake
affirmatively by the Auditor.
MS. HARGIS: Pretty sure it's in there.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Think we can get another
100,000 out of the Sheriff's budget somewhere?
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah.
MS. HARGIS: I think it was, as I recall, to
~ change --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: At least a hundred, maybe
I three.
JUDGE TINLEY: Another hundred?
(Low-voice discussion off the record.)
MS. HARGIS: He's going to give us some money real
~ quick.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think he needs to give us a
little more.
JUDGE TINLEY: Sheriff is going to give you some
~ money.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Wait. Wait, Sheriff, the
Auditor had his hand raised before you -- ex-Auditor, I'm
sorry. Former.
MR. TOMLINSON: Just a reminder, that the 8 percent
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of your general tax levy for indigent health is approximately
1.3 million. We only have 800,000 budgeted for Indigent
Health. That's -- that's going to -- that's under 6 percent.
~~ So, our liability could reach a million, two.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: What have we been running the
past couple years?
MR. TOMLINSON: We've been running right at six, and
last year, it was 880,000. This year it's going to run 800,
850, maybe a little more.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So maybe we should budget, like,
900,000 there.
MR. TOMLINSON: So I just -- I just put this out
there for you to think about.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There went the other 100,000
from Rusty to pay for indigent health care.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's a variable. You
never know.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I know, you don't have any
I idea.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Never know.
MS. HARGIS: It's also going to -- because we put
the people at the jail on that program as well.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
MS. HARGIS: Which has saved us money.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So it's Rusty fault.
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MS. HARGIS: Yes, it's Rusty fault.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Usually.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Maybe we can get some of those
people out of jail out there; indigent costs wouldn't be quite
as high.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'd sure go for that; wouldn't
bother me one bit. One area y'all told me under the budget is
Courthouse Security. You wanted me to come back with some
figures. Right now, I think she probably even still has from
the latest printout I have, under security improvements,
25,000.
JUDGE TINLEY: Two components. Panic system, 15;
keypads, 10.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The actual price, and what I
would suggest probably doing, unless you want to put it in
your long-term stuff, is the keyless entry, the keypad -- now,
the pad entry is 9,603. The panic system is 26,000. Now,
what Chuck -- and I don't know if Jannett's in here or not.
What they've told me they've been doing is, Chuck has a pager.
that he does carry. They have quick-dialed, dialed into most
of their phone systems, and so Chuck says they're getting
ahold of him real quick, okay? As far as panic. You may want
to wait until the following year to do the 26,000 on the panic
system. But do the keyless entry so we can secure the doors
25 ~ better at that 9,600, and that would cut from the 25,000 you
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have programmed in there right now back down to 9,600.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I like that option, 'cause I'm
not sold on the panic system anyway. I'm not --
JUDGE TINLEY: I'm not really sold on the keyless
entry. You know, I think we've improved considerably just by
closing off that downstairs.
MS. HARGIS: Let me put my Auditor hat on here. We
just finished doing J.P. 1, and I visited J.P. 3. Those girls
are by themselves in those facilities most of the time. And I
don't know that -- you know, they're so open, how they could
even reach the speed dial. But one of them is down in the
basement, and she is inside of a corridor with other people,
but if she screamed, they have -- those walls are pretty
thick; there is no way. And -- and Elsa, because people go in
that office just because it's the first one there. Those
girls are -- and they've got money, a lot -- a lot of money.
And they're sitting on that money, and they deposit it, but
they can have as much as $10,000 dollars in one day, and
that's enough to hit somebody over the head for and run.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I personally think there's one
other security issue, which the Parole Department would not
like me saying this, but since the Treasurer's office has
moved down into this part --
JUDGE TINLEY: That's gone.
25 ~ SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Are they gone?
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JUDGE TINLEY: Parole's gone.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I was hoping, 'cause I think
that's wrong.
MS. HARGIS: So I think that maybe we might look at
some -- some way of assisting those girls if we don't go with
the panic system, 'cause they need something in there.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't disagree with that. I
just think that the --
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 26,016, push-button.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think there's a system we
could put in that'll solve those issues, and I agree, people
that are handling a fair amount of cash, they're different,
I because I think they're more likely to get -- to have a
problem. But I just think the -- the chance of a mistake of
a -- everyone kind of flying through the airport -- not
through the airport, through the courthouse, you know -- I
guess false alarm concerns me. But I think we do need to, you
know, do what we need to do to secure these offices.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The other thing --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Maybe it's key -- put some-sort
of a lock system on the doors at the J.P.'s. I mean, J.P. 3,
for example, I mean, it's -- her office is at the very far
back of it, anyway. And, you know, it wouldn't be all bad to
have some sort of a buzzer to open the door during certain
times of the -- when there's not two people in that office or
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something like that. I mean, there's other ways. I think
that we may want to look at that.
MS. HARGIS: But I -- you know, I'm not -- I mean,
this is just my observation from preparing the audits, working
on J.P. 1's. So, I think I'm -- you know, maybe the Sheriff
~ and the J.P.'s can work together to come up with something
better, but I do think those girls are -- they need something
I besides --
MR. TROLINGER: There really is a better technology
solution to panic buttons. If they're going to be sitting in
front of the computers, there's plenty of options. There are
plenty of options using the computer to initiate a panic call.
MS. HARGIS: Okay.
MR. TROLINGER: But I do agree that the keyless
entry is needed, because as part of the keyless entry, that
can be tied in with a -- with a time card system, for
instance. It gives us a lot of options.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: If you add onto it. This will
not have that -- those features, but it will be expandable.
Now, the other thing that I -- I would recommend going with a
keyless entry. I think we need that. There's too many times
that we find a door unlocked or things like that, even on
weekends and at night. And I think a keyless entry would be .
very wise, and lock automatically. The other thing that I am
planning on doing -- it may not have the biggest benefit right
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off, but the Legislature changed where now, especially
starting -- I have to have it by January 1st; every law
enforcement officer, jailer, everybody else with our
department has to have issued a tamperproof identification
card. So, it's going to look like your driver's license.
Each department has to do it. We've worked with Trolinger a
little bit. We've got -- I'm purchasing a laser printer and a
sealer. They will come out identical to a driver's license,
have to have a state seal on them and all that. What I'm also
recommending, since we will have that capability, even by the
end of the month -- next month, is that gradually we issue
every Kerr County employee a tamperproof identification card.
We've got a lot of employees; I don't know half of them, and I
just think it would be very wise. We will be able to do that,
with some added expense of the laminate stuff and card stock,
once we have this in place. So, the keyless entry that --
that we're already going to do, that doesn't add into the
budget. I would recommend it for this year, and let's look at
everything as a whole.
MS. HARGIS: That also helps some of our employees
who don't have bank -- any other form of identity besides
their driver's license to get their checks cashed. We looked
-- we had that problem at the City, and so they were looking
into doing the same thing.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: When are we meeting again?
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JUDGE TINLEY: Do you --
MS. HARGIS: I just want to take this opportunity to
-- and I haven't been around to all the J.P.'s, but I'd
like -- and I haven't really audited J.P. 3, but J.P. 1 and
J.P. 3, their offices are very well intact, and they're doing
a good job, and I really appreciate especially J.P. 3 going
through those boxes, and her clerk, and getting all that done.
And I think they've done a real commendable job, so I just
I want to mention that.
JUDGE TINLEY: Do you have any questions about what
you see as a direction from the Court, what you --
MS. HARGIS: I will go back, plug in the 3.5 COLA.
I will come up with a long-term debt solution, and I may get
with Bruce to see what we want to do about the arena, and then
we'll give you that list of salaries so that you can decide
what you want to do. And then I would suggest you put this on
the agenda for your special meeting so we can get these
changes plugged in, so you can have a budget that's -- a
proposed budget on the 10th that's ready to roll.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And I heard 100,000 out of the
Sheriff's salary.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Salary?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Salary?
25 ~ COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, out of the Jailers Salary
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line item.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He'd be in a negative
~ position.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any member of the Court have anything
they want to add to what the Auditor just mentioned as she
perceives as her charge at this point?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Be sure and get that number
from Mr. Odom.
MS. HARGIS: Yes, I've got that as well.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Four Crown Vics and one Tahoe.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else, gentlemen?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No.
JUDGE TINLEY: We'll be adjourned.
(Budget workshop adjourned at 11:04 a.m.)
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STATE OF TEXAS I
COUNTY OF KERR I
The above and foregoing is a true and complete
transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my
capacity as County Clerk of the Commissioners Court
of Kerr County, Texas, at the time and place
heretofore set forth.
DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 7th day of
September, 2007.
JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk
B Y : ____ _ _ ~~ ------------
Kathy B 'k, Deputy County Clerk
Certified Shorthand Reporter
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