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KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT
Budget Workshop
Tuesday, September 4, 2007
10:00 a.m.
Commissioners' Courtroom
Kerr County Courthouse
Kerrville, Texas
PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge
H A."BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1
WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2
JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3
BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4
3
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I N D E X
September 4, 2007
PAGE
Review and discuss FY 2007-08 Budgets and fiscal,
capital expenditure, and personnel matters related
thereto for various county departments 3
Adjourned 101
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the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse,
Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in
open court:
P R O C E E D I N G S
JUDGE TINLEY: I will call to order a Commissioners
Court workshop posted for this time and date, Tuesday,
September 4th, 2007, at 10 a.m. It is a bit past that time
now. The agenda item for the workshop is to review and
discuss Fiscal Year 2007-08 budgets, and fiscal capital
expenditure and personnel matters related thereto for various
county departments. I'm looking for Ms. Hargis. She probably
didn't know we were going to get to her this quickly.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We're speedy.
(Discussion off the record.)
MR. TROLINGER: Ms. Hargis needs about five minutes,
Judge.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. Ms. Hargis is working
on some items that were given to her as a result of the last
workshop, and I assume she's getting those plugged in. She's
rolling the capital items over to another list.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, let me say something
II right quick. Back to the J.P. and the constable issue, we
25 ~ have to fill that constable slot now, and we have a meeting
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mean, we need to get that slot filled. We have --
JUDGE TINLEY: The sooner we fill that slot, the --
the sooner it's going to have budgetary impact? I assume
that's why you're bringing it up in this context?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. Yes, sir, I am.
JUDGE TINLEY: That's what I thought.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And -- (Laughter.) Is Rex
still in the room?
JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, he's there. He's looking at us:
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: He's nodding all of a sudden.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, that's exactly the
reason. And not to mention the stopping government, but
that's not important. It's budget that's important.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Did you finish that train of
j thought?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN:
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS:
JUDGE TINLEY: Because
assume you're going to submit an
our next regular meeting, which
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN:
Is Rex still in the room?
Yes, he is.
of that budgetary impact, I
agenda item for our -- for
is on the 10th of September?
I don't know if I can talk
about that or not, Judge.
JUDGE TINLEY: All right.
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COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That was purely informational,
correct?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It was. I thought we were at
the information part of the --
JUDGE TINLEY: We do have one of those -- no, '
correction, that was on the last agenda.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: John, where's our new tech
person from?
MR. TROLINGER: He's from Kerrville. He's local.
Local family, been here for quite a while, from down in south
Kerrville.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Seems real nice.
MR. TROLINGER: Top quality. I'm really pleased
with him. He took off and started running this morning,
literally.
JUDGE TINLEY: You have a drumroll?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just come straight to the
podium.
MS. HARGIS: Oh, great.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Ms. Hargis? I want to say
something to you. I really like this --
MS. HARGIS: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- thing that you have put
together here. I've got one question about it, though.
MS. HARGIS: Uh-oh.
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Commissioner 4 has pretty
green, and Letz has red. The Judge has yellow. Commissioner
Williams has blue. Mine is pink. (Laughter.) Is there -- I
mean, is there something we're trying to say here? Or --
MS. HARGIS: The --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just come out with it. Don't
~ be shy.
MS. HARGIS: All right, why not? The girls said
that you like -- you had a pink shirt, and that only real men
can wear pink, so you got pink.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Boy, she thinks quickly on
her feet, doesn't she?
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: She's quick.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Those were quotes, actually.
MS. HARGIS: Okay. Let me pass around --
JUDGE TINLEY: You just wanted to be sure that got
on the record. You already knew that, didn't you?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes. I still think we need
to fill -- complete the constable position, though.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I got two different -- we have
two pages?
MS. HARGIS: You should, that's right. You did --
you have one there that you shouldn't have.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh.
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JUDGE TINLEY: You only get one at a time.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not general information.
MS. HARGIS: No. It's coming around; it's just -- I
wondered why I didn't have enough of that one. ,
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do you have another one?
MS. HARGIS: Yeah. You got one?
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We still got two shy.
MS. HARGIS: I think what happened is, it sorted
them. I wonder if I --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just wanted to make sure.
MS. HARGIS: Okay. Did everyone get one of those?
JUDGE TINLEY: Now we're okay.
MS. HARGIS: Now, then, everybody should get one of
these, and then everybody should get one of these. Now, I did
not put people; I put positions, okay? I thought that was
easier. I didn't know if you wanted to go in executive
session on this or not.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: On -- just on the salary sheet,
the first page, the proposed salary includes the COLA or does
not include the COLA?
MS. HARGIS: Does not include the COLA. The
difference -- the increases in the third column, the bold
amount, and then the Medicare, retirement, and the additional
COLA is the -- that they would have received is 2813. So,
it's a combination of those two columns.
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask one question. You
have the current salary and then the proposed salary. How did
it increase if there's not a COLA or --
MS. HARGIS: It's a proposed increase.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh.
MS. HARGIS: Just a proposed increase. It has
nothing to do with COLA.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right. Look at that
County Attorney guy. Whew.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Worth every penny.
MR. EMERSON: Not even sure what you're talking
about, so...
MS. HARGIS: Everyone would have received a COLA
anyway, so the difference if -- if everybody got the proposed
increases, the difference in the COLA would be 2813.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm going to have to be a
little stingy, I guess, on this on one particular issue, and
that's your salary, Ms. Hargis. You just started a month ago,
and I can't see paying a COLA or any increase in the first
year.
MS. HARGIS: Okay, you take that out.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You know, that's just -- I
don't think that's fair to anybody else.
MS. HARGIS: I don't get a COLA either?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the COLA would be --
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should stay.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's up to the Court. I'm
just saying what I think, you know.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, again, the COLA --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: A COLA after one month is not,
in my opinion, justified.
MS. HARGIS: I'll be here three months by the time
the COLA goes into effect.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think the COLA should be
there, because the COLA is a cost-of-living. It costs her to
go to H.E.B. just like it does us.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Except she hasn't been to
H.E.B. but a couple times since she's been here.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But under that logic, though,
you know, anyone that gets -- you would prorate COLA's based
on when you start in the year.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Like I say, it's up to the
pleasure of the Court. That's just my thought.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Where do these numbers come
from?
MS. HARGIS: The recommendations came from this
sheet that -- that Eva gave you.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But some of them are different
than on that sheet.
MS. HARGIS: No.
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What, Letz?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I had trouble with that
sheet before.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I see.
MS. HARGIS: Okay, on her sheet, the -- if you go
actually from the right to the left -- one, two, three, four,
five -- the sixth column over, that's the current salary.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
MS. HARGIS: All right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm.
MS. HARGIS: And then it's possible I could have
MS. HARGIS: Yeah, I got -- I got the County
increase that was shown on that prior sheet.
MS. HARGIS: I was asked to remove that.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: She lowered it.
MS. HARGIS: I lowered it, 'cause it would take away
any of the supposed bias that I heard about Friday afternoon,
and to do the right thing. Because the ones that I told you
guys that I truly felt needed to be increased were I.T. --
I.T., Maintenance, and Animal Control.
JUDGE TINLEY: But I think the discussion was to
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place that at the same percentage as almost all of the others.
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Rather than a different percentage.
MS. HYDE: Absolutely. It shows 3.5 just like the
rest of them.
JUDGE TINLEY: What I'm looking at does not show
I that .
MS. HARGIS: It shows the COLA. Doesn't show a 3.5
increase.
JUDGE TINLEY: You need to plug in 1838.
MS. HARGIS: It's in the last column.
JUDGE TINLEY: You need to plug it in the
next-to-last column.
MS. HARGIS: Okay. I didn't understand.
JUDGE TINLEY: Which will change the second column.
MS. HARGIS: Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right.
MS. HARGIS: Yeah. And I don't have the constables
in there right. I get -- I was -- theirs should be 33,994.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: H.R. Director currently is
at 52,5 or 50?
JUDGE TINLEY: 52,5.
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. I updated the sheets for
y'all.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. Updated this sheet?
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MS. HYDE: Yep.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that one.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Got sheets on top of sheets
I here.
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm, that's what we got.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's the same one, isn't it?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, it's updated, she said.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh, let me have one of that,
I then .
MS. HARGIS: That's going to make a little bit .of
difference. I can go reprint this one real quick.
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
MS. HARGIS: Do you want me to do that?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, if you would. It would be
easier if you get this one -- at least get them in line.
MS. HARGIS: Okay, give me five minutes.
MR. EMERSON: Can I make one comment?
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah.
MR. EMERSON: If y'all are looking at this master
sheet, the COLA should only be on my county part of my salary,
not the state supplement included.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's correct.
MR. EMERSON: Which means that this is overstated.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Doesn't she need to be called
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and told that while she's correcting it?
I COMMISSIONER LETZ: That would be the same with the
County Judge.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: Uh-huh.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I got it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's the only two that get the
big supplements from the state, right?
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, "big" is a relative term. I'll
trade with Rex. I doubt that he wants to trade with me.
MR. EMERSON: You know, it's a unique opportunity,
but I think I'll pass.
JUDGE TINLEY: I see. It may not be the only time
you get that opportunity. I may offer it to you again.
MR. EMERSON: I suspect I'll pass again.
JUDGE TINLEY: Lest you think that this is the last
shot at it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that Eva there, or is that
somebody -- oh, there's Eva there. All I saw was blond and
red hair.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Judge, if we get a chance,
there's two line items that I just really need to address the
Court about in the Sheriff's budget. That y'all --
(Low-voice discussion off the record.)
JUDGE TINLEY: We had one chance that was remaining,
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and Buster took that a while ago when he talked about the
position, so we're out of chances.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Two line items.
JUDGE TINLEY: You took the chance, Buster.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are they beating up on you
~ again?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess the -- looking at this,
I guess the rest of the Court didn't concur with my assessment
at the end of last meeting.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I guess not.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Considering I recommended some
~ changes.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, you would have to
admit that your suggestions were --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Draconian? I don't think so. I
thought they were good, but --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They were rather subjective
to your point of view.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I got that same thing just a
second ago, so it shouldn't be a shock to you either.
MS. UECKER: Judge Tinley?
JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, ma'am?
MS. UECKER: On my budget, on the proposed Records
Preservation, we had 29 in there, and he said the Auditor
showed 22 for my old records. What do you have?
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JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I'll certainly take a look.
MS. UECKER: Appreciate it.
MR. TROLINGER: It's 28-635.
MS. UECKER: Yes, 28-635-411.
JUDGE TINLEY: 22.
MS. UECKER: 22, okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: As I recall, we were going to
increase that 8,000; then we put 8,000 somewhere else. Does
that ring a bell with you? That may not have been the same
one, but --
MS. UECKER: Well, there's 8,000 in my -- in my
budget, in the office budget, for just the standard stuff.
This is -- this is to finish that up, that old records
project.
JUDGE TINLEY: That's special fund money, isn't it?
MS. UECKER: Right, that's dedicated money. And if
we could raise that back to 29, that would be wonderful. Oh,
now -- well, let's see. Yeah, that's right. And then we had
five in the other one. That -- that's where it is, I bet.
There's five in 33-635.
JUDGE TINLEY: One is a joint account that you share
with the County Clerk; the other is exclusively yours,
correct?
MS. UECKER: Right, mm-hmm.
JUDGE TINLEY: And that's where we -- yours
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exclusively is where we put the five.
MS. UECKER: Right.
JUDGE TINLEY: Does that -- does that necessitate
any further change from the 22, then?
MS. UECKER: What do you think?
MR. TROLINGER: Be nice to complete that project.
MS. UECKER: Yeah, I'd like to. Can we raise it
back to 29?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that one of the funds that
there's a pretty good balance in?
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
MS. UECKER: Yes. I -- that's the fund that's
for -- Jannett and I collect money to put into that fund, and
I think the -- the J.P.'s as well, and that's for everybody.
I mean, even the Court could use that for records
preservation.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: On one of those Records
Preservations, I recall there's a balance of about 160,000.
Is this the --
MS. PIEPER: I think that's my dedicated fund.
MS. UECKER: Jannett has one that she uses all by
herself.
MS. PIEPER: Right.
JUDGE TINLEY: It's got 77,6 going into the year.
MS. UECKER: Okay. Back to 29?
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JUDGE TINLEY: It generates about 35.
MS. UECKER: I'm sorry, what?
JUDGE TINLEY: It will generate about 35,000 this
year.
MS. UECKER: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. What else did you --
MS. UECKER: You put that one back at 29?
JUDGE TINLEY: Yes.
MS. UECKER: Okay, thanks. That's it.
MS. PIEPER: Need to make sure the Auditor knows.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The two --
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, we'll take one. If we don't
like the one, you won't get two.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. Sheriff's budget,
10-560-316, Uniforms. I think I originally requested ten.
You cut that to five. The only issue I had with that is,
that's not just deputy uniforms; that's bulletproof vests, and
they're about 800 a piece.
JUDGE TINLEY: According to this, you only requested
five and you got five.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, on mine, I requested ten
and got five.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Hmm-mm.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's what I'm showing you.
Asked for ten and got five. We have replaced most of them, so
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I could probably get by with eight and not a full ten.
JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, now we're playing poker.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, I just -- I'm trying to
anticipate my vests that expire.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: You got eight; he wrote eight
down.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And the other one was on
training. Which is --
JUDGE TINLEY: Is that the ammo issue, 487?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. What do you have that set
I at now?
JUDGE TINLEY: 21,820.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. That's what I -- it had
gone down, but I guess it's plugged back in. That's fine.
JUDGE TINLEY: I think -- I think we increased that
back up when we found out that included ammo.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: And that the ammo issue had gotten
somewhat critical.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It has. That's it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
MS. HARGIS: I've reduced --
JUDGE TINLEY: Have a nice day, Sheriff. You need
to be out on the street catching all the bad guys.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's raining; I'm going to stay
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right here.
JUDGE TINLEY: Where's the element of trust that we
~ enjoy?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, he's been watching us
whack his jailer budget now for six months, so...
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We can take another hundred
out of that one before --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Before it's all over with.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We'll make it.
JUDGE TINLEY: You got more than one there, Jon?
~ No? Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are you missing one?
JUDGE TINLEY: No, I don't need one.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sure you do.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make copies.
MS. HARGIS: Oh, I've got plenty.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: He needs one more.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We need one more.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is Ms. Hyde here?
MS. HARGIS: She's outside the door.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We made her mad already?
MS. HARGIS: I didn't change mine; I forgot, so just
mark through that one again.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: Ms. Hyde, on the -- your
recommendations, which basically these are, did you look back
at -- I know you looked at a number of different things, you
said, on a lot of salary -- the COLA, but on these, did you
look back at the last time people got raises, and -- I mean,
'cause we kind of -- we were doing a bunch of realigning three
or four years ago, and then we got -- hit some budget
difficulties and we didn't finish that process.
MS. HYDE: That's why the -- it goes back to 2000,
the new sheet. And the sheets that you guys got each week,
that I updated, it goes all the way back to 2000, and it shows
the increases or decreases.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. And in your calculations,
on the constables, do you take into account that they're given
cars?
MS. HYDE: I'm sorry?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That they are given cars.
MS. HYDE: No, sir, I didn't do that, because I
didn't figure it into any of the law enforcement either.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, law enforcement's a little
bit different. But they're the only elected officials that
receive -- that get cars and get their fuel paid for, whereas
everyone else pays for it out of their pocket.
MS. HYDE: It's not figured in. I did not figure it
in.
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JUDGE TINLEY: Do you have any further announcements
about any positions?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The constable's office. If
anybody wants to be a constable, get it in quick.
(Discussion off the record.)
JUDGE TINLEY: We ready to move on to another issue?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Satisfied with this one?
Finished with this one?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess -- I mean, I want to
bring up one that I think is too high. Nobody spoke, so I'll
go the other direction. The -- the Environmental Health and
Animal Control are going to stay where they are; I think.
Maintenance needs to go up. I think Maintenance is a bigger
department than those other departments, so, obviously, my
last recommendation of reducing one of those didn't go
anywhere, so I think that Maintenance should be paid higher.
I think Maintenance is a bigger department than Animal
Control, and I think should be paid more.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. Maintenance versus
Animal Control, or -- .
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Or out of the three, if you look
at --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's the third one?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Environmental Health. But if
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', Maintenance a couple years ago, and now it's down. And I
I~ don't know that it should go back up that high, but looking
back historically --
MS. HYDE: But the historical, Commissioner, was
based upon that person that was in that position received
extra for looking over Animal Control, looking over
Maintenance, looking over Environmental Health, so that's why
y'all had put it up a little bit higher. It wasn't just
Maintenance.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's correct. Originally,
the former occupant of that job had --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- Animal Control in it
underneath him.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll tell you what, Animal
Control deals with the public, and Maintenance really doesn't
that much.
MS. HYDE: They've got as many people as --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Big job that you don't see a
lot of times.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm talking about raising
Maintenance.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I talked to him Tim about it
the other day, and he agrees that his job was funded back
under this schedule.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Better than it is, but I
just think that -- I mean, I think that that's a pretty
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It is. They're all critical.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think to have some kind of
parity, it's lower than it should be. I mean, I think that if
you look at -- I think that department deals with the public
quite a bit, as well as all the elected officials and county
employees. And -- and they're directly responsible for, you
know, our physical plant and the maintenance of it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would be amenable to
~ taking that up about 37,5, create some -- create some gap
there.
JUDGE TINLEY: Think that's a good number?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Fine.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do you have something else
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's fine.
MS. HARGIS: Is that a consensus?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 37,5.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: While we're on this topic, I
really want to bring up something that I've been thinking
about for some time, and we've talked about it in the past,
but we haven't done anything about it. And if we approach
25 ~ salaries top to bottom, the way we're looking at them today,
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in my mind, that's okay. That's not -- that's not being
arbitrary or unfair in terms of the process. But I really
believe that there's another way that we should be looking at
elected officials, without having to evaluate one versus
another, good, bad or indifferent. I'm only talking about
process; not talking about people. I'm not talking about the.
kind of job they do. I'm assuming that all elected officials
do their job to the best of their ability, serve the public,
and don't have to back up for their paycheck.
What I'm talking about in terms of future
consideration is a -- a policy or a program that recognizes
elected officials for their length of service. And I really
think it's time that we really consider that -- should
consider that. We have people in our elected family who are
-- who have served us well for many, many, many years; some
who are just joining the elected family, and I think it's high
time that we consider a policy that recognizes that and
rewards them for that length of service. They've been good
public servants, and -- and one way we show that is through a
policy for taking care of length of service. We do the same
thing for our workforce. Everybody in our workforce except
elected officials is rewarded or compensated by steps in
grade; that rewards you for your length of service. We don't
do that for elected officials, and I think it's time we
consider that. A long time ago, or shortly after last year's
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budget discussion, I asked Ms. Hyde to come up with a policy
and draft some sort of a policy that would do that. Are you
prepared to talk about that, Ms. Hyde?
MS. HYDE: We can -- we can talk about it again,
Commissioner. What I had put up and discussed before was a
length of service year award system for department heads. And
the reason why is that, currently, only the non-department
heads receive a length of service increase. So, we talked
about between $200 and $250 per service year, and that way
it's payable on the 30th or 31st of September, at the end of
the budget year. That way, if there's some sort of major
catastrophe and we're short on funds, that would not be given
out. But other than that, the first year would be the biggest
risk, per se, unless we get it through the budget year. And
then, going forward, it would be budgeted.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How much per year?
MS. HYDE: $250. $250 per year. If you did $250
per year for the department heads, and everyone has one year,
you're talking $5,750. Of course, that's not the case. Some
people have more than others. There was a max on that of
$3,500, regardless of the number of years.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: She's using the term
"department head."
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: As opposed to "elected
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MS. HYDE: Meaning you don't have them for
non-elected officials. You don't have them for the department
heads. They don't get a length of service.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: A department head that is in
the step and grade schedule? They certainly do.
MS. HYDE: No, not all the department heads in the
past have gotten a longevity or a length of service.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are there any department
heads who are outside the step and grade schedule?
MS. HYDE: Not all of them have gotten one.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Huh?
MS. HYDE: Not all of them got one, not since 2001.
We've gone back and checked it multiple times. Not everyone
that was not an elected official did not get one.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Would that be by an action
of this Court, or by an oversight?
MS. HYDE: Not that I can find. I think it was
oversight.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oversight, not by an action
of the Court. That's a different ball game. That -- that
should be corrected, because all employees who are hourly
rated within the step and grade schedule should be rewarded
each year.
MS. HYDE: But you keep saying hourly rated, so that
might be where some of the discussion or the misunderstanding
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I want to distinguish
between department heads and elected officials. I want to
create a policy for elected officials. If we have some gaps
in the policy for department heads who are within the step and
grade schedule, we ought to correct that deficiency. What I'm
talking about is creating a policy for elected officials.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Two that we haven't talked about
are our court reporter and our administrative assistant.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Correct, we have not.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Are you looking at me, or are
you looking at --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm just looking -- I mean,
the -- we just -- you know, just haven't made any decision on
that.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, is the court reporter
in the step and grade schedule or is it outside of the step
and grade?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's outside.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who would know?
JUDGE TINLEY: I think outside.
MS. HYDE: Court reporter is outside the -- outside.
I And --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Administrative is inside?
25 ~ MS. HYDE: -- the Commissioners Court Coordinator is
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inside. She's outside, but it would be fixed this year to go
back into a step and grade. I'm -- are you talking about
Jody?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. Well, talking about
Jody and the court reporter.
MS. HYDE: Court reporter is completely outside the
step and grade.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay.
MS. HYDE: But Jody is within $50, $60 of being
within the step and grade. We were going to fix that this
year so that that position stays within a set --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, the court reporter
should be on this master list --
MS. HYDE: Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- that was given to us by
Ms. Hargis.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: They're not -- I mean, it's not
a department head, but otherwise, that -- that slot's going to
get lost. That needs to be kept track of at the same time.
MS. HARGIS: Eva, correct me if I'm wrong --
MS. HYDE: It's in the position schedule, so it
would have been kept into -- you would have figured that. .
Right?
MS. HARGIS: Yeah. I -- she's in the position
schedule. She's just not on this list. Now, the department
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heads, if I'm reading what she's saying correctly, department
heads are what you call exempt; they're not paid hourly. So,
therefore, they are exempt from your longevity raises, so --
MS. HARDIN: In the past they've been paid the
MS. HARGIS: She said not all of them. So, maybe we
MS. HYDE: The terminology probably needs to be
changed. We can change that within an order.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We need to be uniform in our
MS. HARGIS: I wanted to get that clarified, 'cause
I didn't understand either.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And on the -- our administrative
assistant, we've just added one other job to her, which the
County's being paid additional to do, which is the Region J
administrator, which the County's being paid $250 a month to .
do that. And she's about to probably get another job 1st of
October for -- based on my conversations with Commissioner
Oehler. I can't remember what her salary is right now, but --
or what it is on the step and grade, but we need to look at
that, with that -- adding that additional work.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: She needs to be brought up.
MS. HYDE: We would show that in payroll as
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grade. We just need to look at that.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Have you refined the numbers
of what -- what the total package would cost, Ms. Hyde? Based
on the length of service of all elected officials, top to
bottom? What the budgetary impact is?
MS. HYDE: Jeannie, what's 250 times 7?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 250 times 7?
MS. HYDE: 250 times 7.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 1,750.
MS. HARGIS: That's using --
MS. HYDE: About $4,000. That would be on one year;
that's just figuring them on one year, so I don't know how
many years everybody has at this point.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So -- okay, so we can't
assess today what the total impact for all elected officials
would be based on their aggregate length of service? Okay. I
think it would be nice to be able to look at that, but look at
it on several different iterations; 250, 200, 150.
JUDGE RAGSDALE: 250 is nice.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 150, 200, 250. Someone out
there would suggest 500, but that's --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Now, is this length of service
as an elected official, or length of service in the county?
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: As an elected official.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Oh, darn.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sorry about that, Rusty.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Oh, well. It's still quite a
bit.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: For all the years that you
were not, you got it in the step and grade.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We never had such a thing
before I was...
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If you want to broaden it,
that's different, but my thought was as an elected official.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's fine. I mean, I'm -- it
seems that we're spending an awful lot. We've had tight years
too, so we're a little bit better off.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, by Ms. Hyde's
proposal, you know, hers is geared to -- her suggestion is
geared to what's available at the end of the budget year. You
can look at it that way. You can look at it as a sure thing
and do it on October 1. You could do it in time for Christmas
on December -- any number of ways you can do it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd be more inclined to do it --
I mean, if you're going to do something like that, you do it.
I mean, you don't kind of do it as a "what-if" thing.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree with that,
I Commissioner.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd probably -- if you're going
to do it, I also -- I'd do it more like $100 a year or
something.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's a start.
MS. UECKER: You just want to wait till I leave;
then you're going to do it, just that fast.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: You're still going to get more
than anybody else.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're going to break the
bank no matter what.
MS. UECKER: You don't think I've earned it?
JUDGE TINLEY: Do you want us to answer that
question?
MS. UECKER: No. (Laughter.)
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Can we talk privately?
JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. County Attorney, if we do the
"maybe, kind of, sort of" at the end of the year, that smacks
to me of a bonus, and I think generally we're prohibited from
doing that.
MR. EMERSON: Correct.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Nevermind.
MS. HYDE: We did it at the end of the year, because
if someone retires, resigns, separates, quits, the thought
process was that they forfeit that year.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: My thought is it would be
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33
more appropriate if it was done before the end of each
calendar year, and becomes a budgetary line item.
JUDGE RAGSDALE: A raise or some --
JUDGE WRIGHT: Longevity.
JUDGE RAGSDALE: It triggers on a date.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I still think the dead turkey
at retirement's enough.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: With or without a watch?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No watch.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just a dead turkey.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Dead turkey.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Dead turkey.
MS. HARGIS: So, do we want to figure that into this
~ budget?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, we need to know what
the budgetary impact would at 100, 200, 250, whatever.
There's a suggestion to start at 100. You can start it
anywhere, just so it starts.
MS. HARGIS: We have to publish all these salaries.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Pardon?
MS. HARGIS: I have to publish these, so I need to
-- before we do the budget hearing on the 10th.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, what are we talking about
here? Where'd y'all land, 100 bucks?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, yeah, it's --
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: $100 for what?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Each year of service as an
elected official.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And so Linda's, we'll have to
hire a truck to haul hers in here.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Bags of money.
MS. UECKER: No, they put a limit on it. She's
recommending a limit.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Up to 25 years? What are
you talking about?
MS. HYDE: We figured a limit at $3,500 max on 250,-
which means it would have to come down to -- whatever you come
down to, it would come down, 'cause it was figured at 25 years
was the max.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why would you put a limit on it?
MS. HYDE: I just was trying to do what people had
asked me to do.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm just -- I didn't ask you to
do it to start with, so --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't recall asking you to
do it -- put a limit on it.
MS. HYDE: Multiple people have requested this,. so I
listened to lots of folks and lots of ideas.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's the way it is, at
least five sets of ideas, five votes.
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MS. HYDE: At least.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What you're saying is if we
did $100, and say Linda's got 20 years, she'd get 2,000 bucks
a year. And next year she'd get 2,100.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's the way it would
I work.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: She'd get that same increase.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, you build that into the
salary; it's not a difference at the end of the year.
MS. HARGIS: I suggest you do it with the salary
year instead of at the end of the year.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, are we calling that a
salary increase? What --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Based on longevity.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And one of the things is -- this
is just a caution, because this Court has a tendency to forget
things in five or ten years. We're setting up a system where
every constable in all likelihood will get a different salary;
every commissioner will get a different salary. You know, the
parity that we've established, everyone's going to be
different. In five years, people are going to say, "Well, we
need to equalize this."
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Does have it to be --
Mr. County Attorney, does it have to be -- does it have to be
built into the salary, or can it be a separate line item based
on length of service?
MR. EMERSON: I would suspect you can -- you
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: To protect the base salary.
Which is the point, Commissioner.
MR. EMERSON: I think you can probably have a
separate line item, but it's going to have to be very, very
clear that it's not tied to production or anything else.
Strictly longevity.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: It would be just like we used to
do a travel allowance for every elected official. We rolled
that into salary at one point.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which I'd prefer it be
separate and based on length of service. You're
distinguishing it. The base salary should be what it is, and
the Court adjusts that from time to time. Length of service
should be that, separate and apart.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I agree with that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree with that. If we're
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who does?
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MS. UECKER: Navarro County.
MS. HYDE: There's several counties that do a length
of service. Now, I'm going to have to buy Kevlar. I do
believe, based on what I've been hearing, that if you don't
run and you come back after a gap, that gap starts you back
over. They don't -- no one does it where you get to add back.
MS. UECKER: No vested --
MS. HYDE: Yeah. I mean, it's each type of length
of service. So, if you've been in and then out, then in, it
JUDGE TINLEY: Length of continuous service.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes.
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is it -- this is just to toss
out another idea. Does it make more sense to do it by year or
by term?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: By year.
JUDGE TINLEY: I think so.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And it -- with that, I think --
I mean, wherever we end up, I'd rather go with less dollars
per year and not have a cap on the number of years.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree with that.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I do believe that we leave the
base salary what it is. We adjust that, but that way when
somebody comes into office, new elected official, they start
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out at the base just like everybody else, wherever that level
is at the time. They only increase annually based on
longevity.
	COMMISSIONER	WILLIAMS:	Ms. Mitchell's a good
example.	Year one, 100	bucks, wh	atever the number is.
	COMMISSIONER	OEHLER: R	ight.
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	So, do we need to tell the
Auditor wh	at we want to	do and mo	ve on?
	COMMISSIONER	WILLIAMS:	Yeah, we do.
	JUDGE TINLEY:	That's a	good plan, Commissioner.
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	I thought so too. I'm hung
up on the	Commissioners	Court sec	retary and the court
reporter.	I can't find	the court	reporter.
	JUDGE TINLEY:	It's in	the County Court budget.
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	County Court?
	JUDGE TINLEY:	Mm-hmm.	
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	There it is.
	JUDGE TINLEY:	Sure is.	
	COMMISSIONER	WILLIAMS:	What is it, Buster?
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	It's just -- right behind --
	COMMISSIONER	WILLIAMS:	What is the number?
	JUDGE TINLEY:	It's behind the County --
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	No, we're dealing with two
different	things.		
	COMMISSIONER	WILLIAMS:	I'm sorry.
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The amount --
JUDGE TINLEY: 10-426-110.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 53,453.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where is Jody?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Jody is 32,597.
(Low-voice discussion off the record.)
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's all under the County
Judge.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh. Oh, that makes more
I sense.
JUDGE TINLEY: That first tab there.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You mean you're the top of the
heap there.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, he thinks he is.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: With respect to the court --
the administrative assistant, does anybody remember what we .
were compensating for booking, for the former booking --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 200 -- isn't it 200? Eva?
(Low-voice discussion off the record.)
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay, I believe it's 200 a
month, wasn't it? That we were --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: $100 a pay period.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, something like that.
MS. HARGIS: Pay period? Or -- or a month?
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JUDGE TINLEY: No, a month, I think, wasn't it?
MS. HARGIS: 200 a month sounds more reasonable.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't see 30 on here
anywhere.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're giving her two new jobs.
One of them, we're getting revenue from an outside source.
It's going into the general fund.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd say somewhere -- for our
administrative assistant, the new workload that we're adding,
somewhere around -- in the step and grade, around 33, 34,
33,5, somewhere in that range.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It looks like on this
sheet -- is this sheet calculated at about 3.6?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: About 34. 34.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 3.5 or 3.6 on this sheet?
JUDGE TINLEY: 3.5.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 3.5.
MS. HYDE: 3.5.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Then we need to add a couple
at that same --
MS. HARGIS: All right, now --
MS. HYDE: Who are you saying needs to be added?
'Cause in the position schedule, they're already added.
Ms. Hargis already did it in the position schedule.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, the two people we're
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talking about have not had consideration. One is the court
reporter.
MS. HYDE: She's in the position schedule, and she
I
shows it -- Ms. Hargis put her in there.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We're not seeing it here.
i
MS. HYDE: No, it's not in here.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The administrative assistant
to the court.
MS. HYDE: She's also in the position schedule, and
it also shows an increase for her.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. Does that include the
compensation we would give her for handling the booking --
MS. HYDE: No.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- function?
MS. HYDE: No, it does not.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Or the Region J?
MS. HYDE: No. Those would be supplemental, so that
she says within the position schedule.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay.
MS. HYDE: So that she stays within the step and
grade. Her position is a step and grade position.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you telling me Region
J -- doesn't that pay --
JUDGE TINLEY: They pay us.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're -- the County gets $250 a
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month.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is just a pass-through.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, it's -- I mean, it's
coming into our general fund.
i
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We rake off a little?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We should.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Wouldn't surprise me.
(Discussion off the record.)
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Ms. Hargis needs some
direction, right?
MS. HARGIS: Uh-huh. I'm waiting. First of all, I
need what you want to pay the elected officials. 100, 150,
200 a year?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd say 50 or 100.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: My thought is you start at
-- start the program at 100. And you have no -- no cap on
years, whatever it is. If we have to hire a truck for
Ms. Uecker to get hers in here, we have to hire a truck.
MS. HARGIS: Well, that --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Poor Sheriff.
MS. HYDE: She's been here, what, 37 years? 39?
MS. UECKER: 39 total, but elected, 20.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, that cut the --
JUDGE TINLEY: She had to run three times before she
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got elected. (Laughter.)
MS. HARGIS: That wasn't nice.
JUDGE TINLEY: That's what she expects from me.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Twenty? Well, that reduces
our nut considerably.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Longest elected official in the
~ county.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Pretty much for quite a bit.
MS. HARGIS: Okay.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Going for a record.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Going for a record?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It would be kind of tough to
catch Julius Neunhoffer in number of years.
MS. UECKER: Yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: 24 or 28.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 24.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: He's at 24, right.
MS. UECKER: Yeah. I'll be catching him, probably.
Unless I die between now and the end of my term.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: She's going to catch Judge
Neunhoffer and pass him up.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Victor was in there quite a
while. Probably about 20, I would guess.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Maybe 20.
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MS. HARGIS: Okay, we need a little bit more
clarification.
MS. HYDE: Yeah.
MS. HARGIS: The county officials will receive $100
per year for each year they've served as an elected official;
is that correct?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's --
MS. HARGIS: Per year?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's what we're talking
about.
MS. HARGIS: With no cap?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Payable before the end of
the fiscal year. Like, in December.
JUDGE TINLEY: Calendar year, you mean?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sorry, calendar year. Like,
in the first check in December.
JUDGE RAGSDALE: So, it's the amount of time as of
December 31st?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Pardon me?
JUDGE RAGSDALE: So, it would be the amount of years
-- see, like, I'm in my 17th year.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Guess you'd be calculated on
the close of the previous calendar year, payable in December
of whatever the year is. Next year, you catch that next year.
MS. HYDE: If you're going to pay them on
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December 1, I would think you'd --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Whatever.
MS. HYDE: -- go ahead and pay for that year.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You could.
JUDGE RAGSDALE: The year's about up.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Wouldn't want to cheat you.
JUDGE RAGSDALE: No, you don't.
MS. HYDE: You want to figure it by when?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Pardon me?
MS. HYDE: So, you want to figure it payable as of
what date? Would it be for that calendar year? What that
calendar year would be? Or what the next calendar year would
be?
MS. HARGIS: No, what that calendar year would be.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Why don't you and Ms. Hargis
work out the details, so we can move on?
MS. HARGIS: Okay. So, everybody's in agreement
with this chart?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: County Attorney's still in
here.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He's talking.
MS. HARGIS: He's been -- he's in here, but he's
been reduced down to only what you pay him. So, do you
want -- he's not listening. Rex?
MR. EMERSON: Sorry.
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's okay. We just cut you
I in half .
MS. HARGIS: They were trying to jerk your chain, I
think, but you weren't listening.
JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Hargis?
MS. HARGIS: Yes?
JUDGE TINLEY: To that list that you're looking at,
show the court reporter as 3.5 increase, and 3.5 COLA.
MS. HARGIS: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: Now, on the court administrator, is
the preference to handle that as a separate one because of
these additional outside duties that are coming in?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's what Ms. Hyde's
preference is. That's fine.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, that's a good thing,
because it might be at some point that those duties might be
turned over to somebody else.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That way you'd still have your
salary established.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good thought.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, we're looking at four to five,
somewhere in that range.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: $4,000 supplement for those two
~ jobs.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which --
JUDGE TINLEY: Talking about the court administrator
on the supplement line item?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, yeah -- yes.
JUDGE TINLEY: For essentially outside duties.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm.
JUDGE TINLEY: Dealing with Region J, and --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm.
JUDGE TINLEY: -- and booking.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. I agree with that.
JUDGE TINLEY: And the number that was suggested was
four.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think four.
JUDGE TINLEY: You like four, but --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But I'm not going to vote
I here.
JUDGE TINLEY: I understand that.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The County Attorney's still
I in here.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But he's listening to --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Four.
MS. HYDE: Want to keep that in the position
schedule in the step and grade? Or --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: No.
JUDGE TINLEY: Supplement.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: Supplement.
JUDGE TINLEY: Outside.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Outside supplement, or
supplement of some sort.
MS. HYDE: But the actual position would stay within
the position schedule.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yes.
MS. HYDE: So, that would allow us to put her at the
-- at the appropriate level. She's off about 50 bucks.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. Put her -- get her to
where it fits there.
MS. HYDE: Okay.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Then add a supplement for those
outside duties.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: J.P. 4 has a comment.
JUDGE RAGSDALE: On this proposal, something that
you might consider closing up now, rather than dealing with it
later, is you -- you have several people now, and over the
course of time, who have been appointed to office. If you're
going to -- you might clarify and say it's for each calendar
year in the position -- in the elected official position.
'Cause he got appointed in April. Didn't you, Rusty?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Something like that, yeah.
JUDGE RAGSDALE: He --
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But that was an election; I
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just took office early. But you take -- now, there have been
JUDGE RAGSDALE: David Billeiter, you know. Of
course, I know he's going from one office to the other, but he
just got appointed to an office.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: He was appointed to an elected
official position, I guess, is what he --
JUDGE RAGSDALE: Do you understand what I'm saying?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What's the question?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, it's when you start --
JUDGE RAGSDALE: The question is, where do you start
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do they get the supplement the
year they get appointed into it, or do they have to wait until
the first full year in office?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: First time they run.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd say first full year.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, service.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sure, because it's for
length of service.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, service.
JUDGE RAGSDALE: Well, that's why I was saying you
might as well address it in how you write it; address it now
rather than later.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: First full year of service, and
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part of a year doesn't count.
MS. HARGIS: So, if you're appointed or elected, if
you serve a year in that position, you get --
JUDGE RAGSDALE: Right. Thank you.
MS. HARGIS: All right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Are we ready to move on to
something else, Buster?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How did we do -- how did we
do with the Commissioners Court secretary? Did we do it?
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, we just did it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, ma'am?
JUDGE WRIGHT: Yes, I'd like to readdress our
salaries and remind you that we are going to be collecting $2
for each traffic ticket that we collect to help pay for an
offset for the increase in our duties. You have all of that
information with you.
JUDGE RAGSDALE: In my office alone, that would be
-- it's not like I'm asking for $5,000, but that would be
about a $5,000 fee collection, just in my office, which would
certainly pay for a little help in my salary. And we need it.
I address this every year. We not necessarily are a totally
unique position, but we are in a position a little different
25 ~ than some in that we're having to use our vehicles in our
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gone down a	few cents in	the	last	couple weeks, but by	and
large, it -	- we still pay	for	our	fuel and our vehicle	use,
and -- and	we are working	day	and	night too sometimes.	I
mean, you went out on a call of mine there just -- you know,
that happens routinely, and -- and we need some help.
JUDGE TINLEY: You're not suggesting that because of
the increased fee, that consideration be given to a percentage
or a portion of those fees, are you?
JUDGE RAGSDALE: No, but what I am suggesting is
that the legislative intent in -- in instituting this fee was
to help supplement our salaries, 'cause we have increased
statutory duties, and that was their intent, was to help out
with an increase by collecting a fee. It's just like the
courthouse security and the other fees. That's their intent,
is that you would use that money for us. We've been
collecting the judicial supplement for District Judges for,
what, two years? It was their intent that that would help pay
for District Judges' increases. Now they've decided that they
would help pay for justices of the peace to get an increase in
I paY
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, as I stated last week, I
JUDGE WRIGHT: We brought all this to you in
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JUDGE TINLEY: I understand.
JUDGE WRIGHT: You've got the -- and all of the
increases in our duties, you've got all of that too.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, as I said last week, I
mean, I think J.P.'s are one of the ones that I'm more
inclined -- I was more inclined to not raising others and
giving them their increase. So, it appears we're giving.
everyone increases. I don't have a problem with giving a
little bit higher of an increase because of that increased
workload. But --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What are you suggesting?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with you, Judge. If
-- if that's the case, that their intent was to collect that
money as a -- to help the J.P.'s, then that's what we need to
do.
JUDGE WRIGHT: You've got the letter saying that's
what the intent was.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, we've got your letter,
~ okay?
JUDGE WRIGHT: Okay.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We understand about the
I letter.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What are you suggesting,
Commissioner?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, let's talk about it a
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JUDGE TINLEY: Where are we going to get it?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Based on these fees -- this
fee issue, possibly.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, we got to stay away from that,
I think. Mapp vs. Ohio? Isn't that the case?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I heard you ask that
question; I knew you asked it for a reason.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And -- but what I'm hearing
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what I'm hearing.
JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think Mapp v. Ohio has been
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, maybe -- maybe what
the legislative intent was is that that fee is an offset to
help a county pay for a justice of the peace.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Isn't that the same thing?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Not necessarily.
JUDGE TINLEY: Not quite.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Not necessarily funding a
$5,000 increase based on projected additional revenue.
JUDGE RAGSDALE: It was not based on -- oh, the
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revenue of the fee, do you mean?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Isn't that what you're
JUDGE RAGSDALE: Well, I don't know that -- I'm not
sure what you meant. We're -- what we're going to be doing
is, we're increasing, as you know, the jurisdictional limit of
the J.P. courts, and that can be between, I think -- what was•
it? The six-month period of time that you looked at was 60
cases that had been filed?
JUDGE MITCHELL: Yes.
JUDGE RAGSDALE: Had been filed in the County Court
at Law. That would now probably -- doesn't have to be, but
probably be filed in J.P. courts. Civil -- civil trials in
our court are very, very time-consuming and tedious, because
it's a little different than other courts. We -- we have to
prepare everything and process everything. So, anyway,
they're anticipating an increase in that workload there, and
that was a way that they felt like they could compensate
without putting a burden on the counties for the additional
work that we're doing. I'm not proposing that -- I mean, I'm
not proposing a $5,000 increase in my salary.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I didn't think you were. I
just thought I'd seek some clarification.
JUDGE RAGSDALE: I wouldn't complain.
25 ~ COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think my Judge is sort of
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nodding yes. What did you have in mind? Do you have a number
in mind?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think they're working on
I one.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I had a -- and make it a 7.
Instead of the 3 and a half percent increase that was, I
think, figured in here, make it 7 percent.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Say that again?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's about $900. Their increase
would go from, instead of the 1,403, to 2,319, if I did my
math right.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, they're going to get --
this is a 3.5 and this is a 3.5. You put the two together,
right?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. But they're getting --
(Low-voice discussion off the record.)
MS. HARGIS: 7 percent total?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 7 percent before the COLA.
MS. HARGIS: Not the COLA, but the increase.
JUDGE TINLEY: I've got 7.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Our math is coming out
different. He's got a better calculator.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That would get them 41362,
I -363.
JUDGE TINLEY: That's what I get.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Before the COLA.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that's what I get.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How about 6 percent?
MS. HARGIS: Fifty is what you have in here, and
then the COLA --
(Low-voice discussion off the record.)
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's all right. That's the
number I had. I did a 6 percent increase before the COLA.
JUDGE TINLEY: Is that what you're suggesting, a 6?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Before the COLA.
JUDGE TINLEY: His number, then, crank that with 6,
not 7 percent.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That would be 42,765 total.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Before the COLA?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: With the COLA. Before the
COLA, it would be 41,362. 7 percent?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Either one of those, either 6 or
7.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 3.5 COLA? Is that the
number?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: COLA stays there. I'd say
either a 6 percent increase or a 7 percent increase before the
COLA. So their numbers --
MS. PIEPER: Would it help if Linda and I brought
all of our increased duties?
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: If you look at it that way,
theirs was a little bit different than everybody else. I
think every elected official gets increased duties every year,
just about, and I think -- but the J.P.'s work, with the
legislative -- they're restructuring the court system
statewide.
MS. PIEPER: Okay.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is the 413.65 plus 3.5?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I was thinking of 6 percent
before the COLA.
JUDGE TINLEY: Is that what you got, 6?
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm just sitting here.
JUDGE TINLEY: How about 2?
(Discussion off the record.)
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. What else do you need,
Ms. Hargis? Let's go to capital items, shall we?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let's do.
MS. HARGIS: As long as you're handing it out, you
took it away from me, but I can always ask again, can't I?
JUDGE TINLEY: I'm sorry?
MS. HARGIS: Nothing. Okay. All right. I've given
you two columns, and I didn't have much time to put this
together, and we did this on -- on Friday morning, and I
wasn't here all day Friday and I was working on the salary
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58
software -- additional software and everything that we need is
471,000. The windows -- the windows --
(Low-voice discussion off the record.)
MS. HARGIS: The windows, we put 180 in the budget.
But if you multiply 3,300 times 77 windows, it's actually
254,000. So, that's the high side of what the windows would
cost, but if we went into a bond issue, we want the high side,
not the low side. The arena, we have 150. You discussed
several different amounts. I put 250 in there; it could be
300. We decided that, again, all we really need to do is pull
these out, saying we're putting them in long-term debt, and
then we can define them and then define the debt, because
we're not budgeting for payment this year; we're going to push
it out a year.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, we'll finalize all these
numbers during the year, is what you're saying?
MS. HARGIS: Right. What I would suggest -- well,
we need to get bonds and pay back the funds, or however you
want to do it, but I think you propose the design of the
arena. I would like to see that done first. I think you
would too, and then decide what areas you feel the County
should pay for that shouldn't be volunteer funds.
25 ~ COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
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furniture. Most of this is the jury chairs, but there's
miscellaneous odds and ends that adds up to about $10,000. We
could leave that in or take it out; doesn't matter to me. And
then I -- I didn't get ahold of Road and Bridge, because I --
so I still don't know what Flat Rock is going to be.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Ms. Hardin, would you get
ahold of Mr. Odom and see if we can refine that number? That
75 that Ms. Hargis has put in seems to me to be about twice
the amount necessary.
JUDGE TINLEY: I gave her that number. That's just
as a -- to get a response from it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: A ballpark.
MS. HARDIN: For capital outlay or for computers?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: For Flat Rock, the bridge
MS. HARDIN: He's on vacation; he started today. I
have a call in to the contractor that wants to do the work,
and I'll have a number this afternoon, but I don't have one
now.
MS. HARGIS: That would be fine.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let's cut it down to at
25 ~ COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think take the furniture out.
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I think that's a --
MS. HARGIS: It's a minor item.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- minor item, and I think it's.
a real bad public perception that we're buying furniture with
debt.
MS. HARGIS: Okay.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, I agree.
MS. HARGIS: Okay. Now, I put the air conditioners
in on the side, just so you can, again, look at that item.
You did say you wanted to do that pay as you go. I do want
to -- Tommy reminded me that the units you have on this
', building are 11 years old as well, so I really think we need
~I
an air -- an air conditioning inventory on all of our
buildings, and the age, and a priority list done.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree.
MS. HARGIS: Before I can do this, 'cause it may
come up that we want to go ahead and include some of it.
That's kind of -- why I'm kind of putting it on the side.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, I agree with that.
MS. HARGIS: But not just the jail. All of our
buildings.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, that makes sense.
MS. HARGIS: So, we've already come up to the
million pretty easily, so -- but I wanted you to see the two
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amounts, because the -- that means that we would be removing
actually what we have in the budget, so it's going to be about
800,000 -- rounded to 800,000 that we would remove from our
current budget, which would allow for the COLA and -- and the
raises, and then put half -- probably give us 400 to put back
in our reserve.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, we're looking at about a
million dollars in long-term debt?
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. That's about where we
were the other day.
MS. HARGIS: It's really not cost-effective to sell
less than that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. And we -- well, we'll
refine that once we get a couple of these numbers worked out a
little bit. Okay.
MR. TROLINGER: Just to make sure we clarify, on the
I.T., that's two years you calculated for, not just one?
MS. HARGIS: No, just one.
MR. TROLINGER: I did --
MS. HARGIS: But it includes all of the
contingencies and all the software and all those other items
that we -- that you and I went over today.
MR. TROLINGER: Okay. Now, two -- two of those
items, the County Clerk's and the District Clerk, are from
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Records Preservation, those funds. Are those included?
MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm.
MR. TROLINGER: Okay. Those cannot be included,
because those are self-funded from fees.
MS. UECKER: Dedicated funds.
MR. TROLINGER: Dedicated funds.
MS. HARGIS: So, that's about 150,000. But he --
you had me add it in, so -- 'cause we decided to add in the
total package.
MR. TROLINGER: Well, it's got -- and the J.P.
Technology Fund is also the same, self-funded.
MS. HARGIS: I didn't add in J.P.
MR. TROLINGER: Okay.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the point is, though,
that if you're -- if we're going to do the debt, it would make
sense to know a part of -- a lot of the hardware costs are
going to increase for next year, and we're -- cause the debt's
not going to be issued.
MS. HARGIS: He and I talked about taking that next
year. It would be no less than 60,000; probably closer to,
you know, maybe 75, and we'd go ahead and include that in the
issue. Not purchase it. Again, these are all items we can
set aside in a reserve, and we wouldn't purchase them till
close of -- till the end of this year. That would save us
operating costs for next year.
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COMMISSIONER OEHLER: How much money is in that I.T.
budget for these -- for Jannett and Linda?
MS. HARGIS: About 150.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: How much?
MS. HARGIS: 150.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 150. So you take, basically,
150 off the 471, right, but then you add back in software -- I
mean hardware for next year, so is that what you're saying?
MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I have a hard time hearing,
you speak so softly.
MS. HARGIS: I'm sorry.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm about half deaf, and so I
have to strain to try to hear what you're saying.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'll let you borrow one of
my hearing aids.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I need to get some. I had
some; I traded them for a table saw. (Laughter.)
JUDGE TINLEY: Which makes a lot of noise, doesn't
I it?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Made it even worse.
MS. HARGIS: It's real hard to refine that I.T.
number. We tried this morning, but that's the overall -- the
overall number. So, whatever the difference is between this
and what we currently have budgeted will be the -- put in
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reserve, and then the remainder will go towards long-term.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What I'm hearing correctly
is the I.T. budget's going to come down a little bit for the
reasons cited by Mr. Trolinger.
MS. HARGIS: And then go back up again.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And then go back up again?
MS. HARGIS: Yeah. We'll reduce it --
MR. TROLINGER: For year two.
MS. HARGIS: Year two.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, okay.
MS. HARGIS: That should be getting pretty close to
', getting our I.T. products up to where we're just rolling on an
annual basis, and that should -- I think -- John, is that
correct?
MR. TROLINGER: Yes.
MS. HARGIS: We're playing catty-catch-up. Once we
get everything there, then it's just the annual changes, and
it shouldn't be as expensive. Unless the new Windows version
.which is coming out this year -- and that's a -- it's a
difficult product. I don't think we're quite ready for that
yet.
JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Baldwin, where do you
suggest we go next?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I still have a question
about the longer term debt. I like the plan, but how do we --
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how do we get to that place? Do we -- what kind of -- what
kind of bonds are we talking about?
MS. HARGIS: Right now, I wouldn't be able to tell
you. I think we call your financial adviser in and get him to
give us the -- the paper that would best fit our needs.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, it seems to me that
we're moving forward here with -- with the thinking that
there's no problems. We'll just do some bonds and go on down
the road, when in reality, that may not happen, is my --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are you talking about tax --
probably tax anticipation notes, based on the fact that we
have some debt coming off next year?
MS. HARGIS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what I'm asking. Is
that what you're --
MS. HARGIS: Well, I'm not as familiar with the type
of paper that you can sell, so I -- I really hate to go out
and say what it is, 'cause I'm not sure. That's why I'd
rather call your financial adviser in. I would not -- I would
try to buy the paper that has the least amount of cost. In
other words, if we can purchase it locally, and if we can do
tax anticipation notes, whatever would be a cheaper cost to us
would be what I would recommend, 'cause these are not going to
~ be 20-year bonds.
25 ~ COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No.
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Doesn't -- doesn't something
like that need to be done in a pretty big hurry?
MS. HARGIS: No, I don't think so.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Hmm-mm.
JUDGE TINLEY: Not necessarily.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're not going to spend the
money until we do it. Whereas if we don't go forward with
that, John's up the creek, 'cause there's no money -- I mean,
there's no money in our budget for any of the I.T. stuff, so
he can't go buy stuff until we do it. That's the real -- the
real rush, is I.T.'s needs, 'cause the --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what -- that's what
I'm saying. It seems like to me we need to get Bob Henderson.
in here and tell us what the proper route -- proper paper to
deal with, and so that he can do these things.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. I think early -- you
know, as soon as we're finalized with the budget, yeah, we
need to get them down here.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. We need to get them
in here pretty quickly and identify what our options are.
MS. HARGIS: Yeah, it won't take him long to give
you the options, and it probably won't take that long to get
the paper. I mean, we -- we did this at the City last year.
We voted for the bonds for the fire station, and -- in the
budget, and we sold it in December. It closed pretty much in
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December and January. So -- and what you're trying to sell is
not a bond, so it'd probably be even faster.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
MS. HARGIS: You could probably get the paper within
60 days.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Ms. Hargis, if -- with the I.T.-
changes and that, if there's some additional -- I mean, and
you can -- by saying that we need to keep it around a million
dollar range, --
MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- another thing that we could
possibly do is, if you'd look at Road and Bridge's -- some of
their lease-purchase option deals that we have on some of our
equipment, it may make sense to prepay one or two of those and
-buy them outright. You know, it'd probably be at a lower
interest rate, possibly, than we're paying right now on some
of those long five-year leases. I'm not sure. We only have
one left? If we only have one, there may not be any money
there. Truby said there's not much there.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's an option we ought to
look at.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But it's a way to -- you know,
we need to keep it around a million to make it cost-effective.
That's where you --
MS. HARGIS: And, again, he may come back and say
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that because we do a tax anticipation note, there's not that
much fees involved; we don't have to have a million. We
really need to get him in here, but I need an amount to give,
and I need you to approve to do it before I could call him.
So, if you're considering it, then I'll get him in.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you going to give her
permission to call him?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. She said she's going to
I call him.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All I've got to say about
that, Bruce, is I remember the time when I first came on .the
Commissioners Court, we were working on the budget, and had
two gentlemen on the Court that were raised in the eastern
part of the United States -- and I'm being nice.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I understand.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And Road and Bridge was
wanting to purchase some cattle guards to replace cattle
guards, and these two guys could not understand why we had so
many employees out there guarding somebody else's cattle.
(Laughter.) This is a true story.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: One of them used to sit in
~ this spot.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, and the other one right
there. And it was incredible.
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COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Amazing how you can buy
somebody for a lot more money than that.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And they're stuck there.
MS. HARGIS: I think we have a couple of changes to
Road and Bridge's budget. I want her to bring those up, so we
can --
MS. HARDIN: I think the only -- after John and I
talked, the only one we actually have is, we need to put a
line item in there for the software that y'all approved last
week in court. It was 1,750.
MR. TROLINGER: It was discussed in court. I don't
believe it was approved. So, that's --
MS. HARDIN: No.
MR. TROLINGER: -- that's what we're talking about
now. We got to budget for October.
MS. HARGIS: I thought they approved it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought we approved it.
MS. HARDIN: Because it has to be purchased
before --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I thought we approved it.
We did.
MR. TROLINGER: Okay.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's in the current budget year.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We didn't make a court order
and -- but we all acknowledged it.
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MS. HARGIS: We were going to pay for the first year
out of the current budget, but then every year after that it
will still be the same amount of money. Because it will be
due in September, before the end of the year.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. So -- okay, we'll have to
budget. Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: That's 1,750.
MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm.
MS. HARDIN: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The first year was going to~
come out of this budget. The first one's going to come out of
this budget year. '
MS. HARDIN: Right. It has to be purchased before
October 1, so yes, we have already got that line item. The
other -- and I wasn't sure on 15-600-461 for the lease copier.
We discussed it on the last court, and I'm not sure what
number you put in.
JUDGE TINLEY: 18.
MS. HARDIN: Okay. John and I talked about it, and
if we go over for that amount, then we'll have to figure out
where we're going to pay for the copies.
MR. TROLINGER: It'll be close. I think the number
will be close because of the number of copies consideration
and whatnot. But, essentially, it's the same as it was on the
previous contract. Or is it a little bit more?
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MS. HARDIN: It's more.
MR. TROLINGER: It's more.
MS. HARGIS: So, what do you need to go to?
MS. HARDIN: Oh, the line item --
i
MS. HARGIS: What do you need? How much?
MS. HARDIN: 1,800 is what we discussed earlier.
MR. TROLINGER: I think with the copy overage, since
we're trying to be as conservative as possible with annual
costs, we need to look at a couple hundred dollars for going
over on copies.
MS. HARDIN: So, 2,000.
JUDGE TINLEY: What else do you have for us,
Ms. Hargis?
MS. HARGIS: I don't have any other changes that --
if y'all have any other changes you want me to make before I
do a -- you know, a pretty final draft.
JUDGE TINLEY: I've got a couple that I made
notations on while you were revising some figures, but I've --
I've dog-eared my corners, and I can tell you.
MS. HARGIS: Okay. What I think I'll do is do a
little memo to y'all, and give you new schedules, let you
check them to make sure they're correct, before I plug them
in. Especially with the elected officials, so we know exactly
what that cost is. And -- and we'll do a one-time check on
that. Still will have to have FICA and Social Security. I
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assume retirement would also be taken out of that; longevity
as well.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Since it's a salary component,
I think you've got to. Now, the other issue may be on the
salary supplement on the -- on the court coordinator, whether
or not that's handled differently, I don't know. I'm --
MS. HARGIS: Well, in order to not get into the
situation that we have, I think we better pay the retirement
out of it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I was going to leave that to
~ you, okay.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, where are we in the
process now?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're in a meeting right now.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I understand that. But we
have some things left in the process.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: COLA.
JUDGE TINLEY: No.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, I mean notifications,
hearings, et cetera, et cetera. Where are we?
JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, okay. Okay. There will be an
item on the agenda for Monday to consider and adopt -- "adopt"
is probably not the right term. Whatever the appropriate term
is, the proposed tax rate. Then, as Ms. Hargis said, there's
got to be notice published on the proposed salaries for
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elected officials. We've got to do that, and that's going to
have to be published. Time frame on that, Ms. Hargis?
MS. HARGIS: I just received that on my desk.
Tommy, how -- how far in advance did you --
MR. TOMLINSON: I think it's 10 days prior to the
meeting where -- where --
JUDGE TINLEY: Prior to the adoption of --
MR. TOMLINSON: Prior to regular -- 10 days prior to
the regular meeting at which you propose the salaries -- or
approve the salaries.
JUDGE TINLEY: Approve them.
MR. TOMLINSON: Yeah, okay. It's too late for --
JUDGE TINLEY: Sure.
MS. HARGIS: The 10th?
MR. TOMLINSON: -- for this one; it will have to be
10 days prior to the second regular meeting of the month.
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
MS. HARGIS: And then you'll discuss the tax rate on
the 10th, and decide whether or not that is the rate that you
want to go with. And -- and then set -- we've already got the
two public hearings set, so I'm assuming that we're going to
go with the rate that we had. That was on the recommendation.
JUDGE TINLEY: The overall rate will be the same.
The Road and Bridge will be downgraded by, what, five
ten-thousandths?
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1 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm.
2 JUDGE TINLEY: And then that'll be added back to the
3 I M & 0 rate.
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MS. HARGIS: And that's pretty much it. If there's
any minor tweaking before, I'll try to point that out. If I
can -- you know, in the memo. But right now, I've been
through it all, so unless somebody else has a complaint, I did
e-mail all of the elected officials and department heads and
asked them to go online and look at their budgets, and some of
the them did contact me.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: One question.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Two questions. There's two
14 I hands.
15	COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, at what point will we
16	see the proposed number	and how much money	we actually have?
17	JUDGE TINLEY:	Hopefully when Ms.	Hargis does this
18	latest workup and plugs	in what she's done	here today, you'll
19	get a new -- what we ca	ll a budget summary,	which tells you --
20	you're looking -- what	you're concerned about are reserve
21	ratios and things like	that?	
22	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN: All those	things.
23	JUDGE TINLEY:	Total expenditures. This will be a
24	new budget summary that she'll publish.	
25	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN: Prior to	-- prior to salaries
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being published, et cetera?
MS. HARGIS: No. I'll give you a new book that
includes everything that we said today as a proposal. This is
just as a proposal, so that you can look at it on the 10th.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: With the number of how much
income the County's going to have as well?
MS. HARGIS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Could you change it from pink
to some other color? Okay, hang with pink. I can handle it.
MS. HARGIS: We may -- we may actually have to
borrow your book so we can use those tabs, because they were,
like, a four-hour --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do you want it back? Do you
want the books back?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just think that we need to
see how much -- how much income we're going to have and how
much the proposed budget's going to be before we get out in
the public and start saying, here's our salaries and here's
this and here's that. Because, who knows? I mean, I don't
know. We may have to change some things that we've decided
today. I don't know that. I know you don't like to hear
that.
MS. HARGIS: No.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But it's realities.
MS. HARGIS: No. That's why I said I was going to
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prepare a memo to you and incorporate everything that you
asked me to do today. And I'll probably go through and take
out the budgetary changes, add in all the COLA and everything
else, so that you can look at what the total amount is.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, but you -- I've heard
you say that two or three times, but you never have said, "I'm
going to show you the income as well."
MS. HARGIS: The income is in there. The income ---
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's already there?
MS. HARGIS: Pretty much in there. That's pretty
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
MS. HARGIS: When we pick that tax rate, that's
MS. HARGIS: All except that 13,000, which I'll add.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But that one-page summary sheet
is what you're asking for?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, mm-hmm.
MS. HARGIS: But I'll basically have to go through
it all to get you to that point.
JUDGE TINLEY: And I believe I heard her say that
all of that was going to be available not later than next
Monday. Is that not what I heard you say?
MS. HARGIS: Yeah, I will try to get it to you
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before the meeting so that you have a chance to look at it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: When does the salaries --
when are the salaries published?
MS. HARGIS: Well, we need -- we'll need to get it
in the paper next week.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But nothing will be published
until after next Monday? Is that what I'm hearing?
MS. HARGIS: That's up to y'all. We just have to --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree with Commissioner
Baldwin; I think we need to look at all these, mainly so when
our phones start ringing, we -- we're not saying, hey, you
know --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, maybe --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- what are y'all doing? You
know, I mean, I want to see a definite before it gets in any
papers.
MS. HARGIS: We won't put the newspaper ad in, then,
until -- we have 10 days, so we'd have to put it in, like, on
Tuesday after the meeting, no later than that Tuesday
afternoon.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's fine.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. Thank you very
much.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You want these books back,
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Ms. Hargis, so you can just correct them?
MS. HARGIS: If you want the tabs again, I mean,
yeah. I'll give you the books back without the tabs so you'll
have them. We just need to borrow the tabs. If you don't
want it tabbed like that in the next go-round, I don't need
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd like them tabbed, but I have
enough old copies of the budget in my office, you can keep the
whole thing.
MS. HARGIS: Okay. If you'll just leave them on
Jody's desk --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That makes it easy for me.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Here's my book.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We haven't talked about the
money that we're supposed to pay the City for joint services.
Is that anywhere? I didn't see it in here.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, yeah.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's in there. One --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We talked about it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Which number do you want to talk
about? I can tell you off the top of my head what it's
supposed to be.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Library, I guess, would be the
25 ~ JUDGE TINLEY: 443, same as last year.
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COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I thought we were going around
I 400.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I thought we were, too. I'm
glad you brought that up.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What's that under, Judge?
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That will help take care of
some of the additional requests or demand for fire protection
contract.
JUDGE TINLEY: That's in at 175.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, I know.
JUDGE TINLEY: Airport is 188.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 188.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's on -- it's under the other
-- something or other. Miscellaneous departments.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's what I was looking at,
miscellaneous.
JUDGE TINLEY: I've got that in at 443. If we're
going to make a change, let's plug it in now. Since you are
the library guru, we, of course, are looking to you,
Commissioner Oehler.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I tell you, it's real
hard to get those folks pinned down over there. You know,
there's always an excuse for this and an excuse for that. And
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I ask questions about -- one of the questions at the last
meeting was how many certified librarians are -- are required
to operate a library of this size? And we have four certified
librarians over there. And I got beat up pretty badly over
even suggesting that we didn't have, you know, four certified
librarians. But if we have to have one, I think that's some
justification for not paying quite as much. And it seems to
me like that in everything that we do with the City, they just
tell us what it is that we're going to pay. There's no
negotiation. They don't want to negotiate; they just want to
tell us.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, you know, we're not
mandated to pay, you know, 50 percent of the operational costs
of this library. We've agreed to do that for many years, and
have. Maybe -- maybe cutting it by 43,000 is a little severe,
but I think we did put them on notice of that in our first
meeting -- first joint meeting, and I think it was brought up
in the second joint meeting.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That it would be reduced.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That it could be reduced over
time.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: My recollection is that we're
reducing it over time, and the City's recollection is that
we're holding it constant over time.
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COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I recall that we said we
would cut it in next budget year to 400.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah.
MS. HARGIS: Well, having attended that under the
other umbrella, that's exactly what you did say, and I
believe -- honestly, my recollection was you said 350 this
~ year.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: To do what?
MS. HARGIS: Jonathan had mentioned that it would
come down to 350 this year. I think we -- we said four, then
350, and then three.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
MS. HARGIS: And then they would take it over. It
was the goal, I think, that you -- like, a five-year program,
as you suggested, but I don't know what y'all did this year.
I didn't know.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: This year's, they kind of --
they didn't hear the part about the reduced; they just heard
the constant.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So it comes down to four?
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's what I'd say. I'll
take the abuse for it, being as I'm on the Library Board.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You probably already have.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: But also, we have a new
Library Board member over there that knows a lot about running
libraries, and -- the one we just appointed, and she has a lot
of questions. And I don't think that her questions have had
time to be answered yet, and we still have a little time
between now and the time we adopt this thing for some answers.
And she's probably better at asking those questions than I am .,
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, this may trigger
some --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Some answers.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- some answers.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, yeah, my suggestion is the
400. I think we need to start doing it, because --
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- they just went up 50,000 on
us, you know, arbitrarily, tied it in one fire truck. And for
the kind of money we're paying them, I believe the County
could go out and build a -- a satellite station and equip it
and get volunteers to man the thing, and it would be a lot
cheaper than paying the City for one truck.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We've talked about that in
the past, but we haven't gotten past the talk stage.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, we need to get on the --
and a key area is in Kerrville South.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Exactly.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Key area is Kerrville South,
and Judge Tinley needs to take the lead here.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Put it right next to his
I house.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I think, actually --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Ms. Hyde's.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- that would be very good. If
we're going to do something like this and we're going to issue
some debt, now's the time to pay for that, which is truly a
long-term debt issue to get that up and running and funded.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I just don't think it's fair
for us to be giving our volunteer fire departments, you know,
this stuff, and they -- Kerrville is even getting covered at
times or assisted by -- by at least Ingram, and sometimes by
Center Point and, you know, whoever happens to be the closest,
but yet they don't count that worth anything. There may be
four or five trucks come out from volunteer departments, but
they only send one, and they want us to pay for the whole
thing.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: One thing, too -- and I don't
know if this would -- I'm agreeing with your deal, is if the
City didn't take the County up on that offer of that land out
there, our building is very centrally located through the
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county, 'cause you have 534, 27, and I-10 very handy.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Cutting across 16. The County
owns the land; they can put a satellite station -- and I don't
know what it would do. Maybe the Judge and them -- but if you
add a satellite fire station right there by the jail, I wonder
what the jail's insurance premiums would go down with having
access to fire equipment that close.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's a thought.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good point.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is good.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Good point. I just think that
we need to really look at doing that, because I don't want to
get tied in with them and have to pay them up to 320-something
thousand over the next several years. That is -- that is
absurd.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's not too late to crank
that whole issue into the capital planning we're talking
about.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah.
serious about it. I mean, this is no
just -- you know, I just can't see us
ourselves into being tied to whatever
going to pay for.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Par
I mean, I really -- I'm
bull. It's -- it's
doing that, and locking
they decide that we're
ticularly when they told
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us that this year they cut it back, but next year and the year
after, it's going to continue to go up sky-high.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mm-hmm.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, last year; i.e., this year, for
this current year, they asked for 369,000, which is almost
triple what it had been. And they made no bones about that's
clearly the direction they're going.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm.
JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Baldwin and I, I guess,
will go back to the well and take another swing at this and
see what other options we can come up with. We -- we thought
we had one identified, and it looked promising, but it didn't
pan out. But we'll go try again.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think that's something
that --
JUDGE TINLEY: And this is directly focused on
Kerrville South, where that -- where the risk is -- is the
highest.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: The highest.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's where your highest --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, and the authority part
too.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: They're almost two separate
problems.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But the point Rusty's making
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with using the law enforcement property is, if you position
one there, you can go both directions in the same amount of
time.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The problem is, I think,
getting -- unless you have -- unless we have some of the
Sheriff's Department employees that want to man the trucks on
a volunteer basis, which would be fine.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You heard what he said, "so
we can have access to the equipment."
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, I didn't say that.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. They can be trained
and --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He wants to take a ride on a
fire truck.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I did not say that, but you'd
probably have -- in fact, you have a number of my -- several
of my officers now that are volunteer firemen for Mountain
Home and Ingram and that. Just saying --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think that's a great idea.
I think they can man the equipment; they'd be right on site.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, you're not going to find me
on a fire truck.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I didn't say you; I said your
24 employees.
25
COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right.
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JUDGE TINLEY: We're going to take another -- we'll
take another run at that, and we've got another semi-option on
what we were looking at previously.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay, I've said my piece.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The long-term maintenance
contracts, if you do the long-term debt, the yearly
maintenance contracts that we have, are they going to be part
of that long-term debt and come out of our budgets? Or --
MS. HARGIS: Your maintenance contracts? No, that
part still stays.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I was just wondering how it was
going to be.
MS. HARGIS: Hardware --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And software.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Software and hardware?
MS. HARGIS: Purchase of new software, but not the
maintenance. I don't consider that a long-term debt.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Ms. Hargis, which vehicles
have you included in the Sheriff's budget for the coming year?
MS. HARGIS: None.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I saw my -- which one of y'all'
put the sign on my Expedition the other day?
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It wasn't me.
24
25 me."
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SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Oehler first said, "No, not
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JUDGE TINLEY: Which -- that is a good question.
Which -- which vehicles?
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Which package did you put in
the budget?
MS. HARGIS: I still have the same one.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Which one is that?
MS. HARGIS: The --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Four Tahoes and one Crown.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's the only actual bid that
I have on those. Now, I have five --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Four Crown and one -- one of
those Tahoe things. Actually, three Crowns and a Tahoe.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The problem with the Crowns,
though, is what's he's experienced here in blowing out the
engines, the way those things are engineered.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, two of them just went
off in the low water and got new engines in them.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, they never ran off in the
water. The water was on paved road. Because of where the air
-- the intake is on those Crown Vic's, we lost two. D.P.S.
lost one. Kerrville P.D. lost one. It's where it sucks in --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Y'all ought to turn around and
not drown.
JUDGE TINLEY: I see	that as	a training	issue.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER:	I think	-- no, not	with some of
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the city drainage, but I won't get into that issue.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Don't want to.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I really think -- because these
are also -- there are some expenses you have to look at on
these. $5,300 of all these car costs is the cameras, now,
okay? They've gone up. There's that kind of stuff. I just
think we'll be a lot better off -- and the reason I went to
four Tahoes, that puts one on each shift, okay? Of the four
shifts working, it puts the sergeants in those to get to those
issues, and one Vic. We're a lot better off. I'll show .you
the package.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I said my piece. Y'all go
ahead and decide what you want to do.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And they stand up higher for
deer.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I thought we'd decided.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I thought we had too.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What did you decide? .
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I didn't. I heard y'all
decide on that end of the table that there was four Tahoes and
one Ford.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not on this -- not totally on
this end. That was Jonathan's suggestion.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I left the meeting the
25 ~ other day thinking that I heard that.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You did.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You did, from Jonathan.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right. So, I'm not going
to vote in here, huh-uh. This is not a meeting. Don't try to
get me to break any law.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Bruce and I usually are pretty
close, but I agree with Tahoes on this one. I don't think the
cost is that much more.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: How about two Tahoes?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think you need to go with four
Tahoes or no Tahoes.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh, okay, I'll go with no.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Either four or zero, to me, and_
I think that it is a -- you know, with the -- where they need
to go, and I want to be able to get to my house and other
places. I just think they need to be able to get around the
county. You know, we're a rugged, rural county, and I think
that they --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not on county roads, though,
Buster.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But they got to go off county
roads to --
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Spend a lot of time off county
roads.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You ever watch CSI Miami?
They drive a Hummer. At least Rusty didn't put in for a
Hummer.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I hope that's not next.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Hummers will not ever be part
of my request.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't think we need to go with
i a --
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I didn't ask for Hummers.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think four does make sense.
MR. TROLINGER: How about four canoes?
JUDGE TINLEY: Sheriff, did you investigate whether
or not they make a fording kit for those Crown Vic's?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I haven't seen one yet, Judge.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What's the difference between
Tahoes and Expeditions? The name?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The Tahoes are the -- the
Expeditions are not police package. The Tahoes have now been
designed as -- these are police-packaged Tahoes, and they're
the higher pursuit and extra cleaners.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just as a general thing, I think
that there's no difference between Yukons, Tahoes, and
Suburbans. Suburbans are almost more expensive, even though
they used to be lower end. I know we recently bought one; a
comparable Suburban costs more than the Yukon that we got.
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SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The police package changed the
suspension on these and all the rest of that, and the wiring
harnesses and the air coolers, and the transmission coolers is
different than the Tahoe you're going to buy at a lot.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: He was asking for Escalades, but
i we said no.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'm not asking now.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Certainly hope so.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: If I -- there's ever an
Escalade, it's going to be because it was seized or something.
We just haven't had a chance to -- you know, just means we
haven't had a chance to sell it yet.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We're getting another 100,000
of his jailer line item. I think we can afford --
JUDGE TINLEY: Tahoes?
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You took 30 out of it by my
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Still need another 100 to get
out.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I personally have a bad
taste in my mouth with law enforcement right now.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Uh-oh.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: However, I do know that the
public demands police protection. And they demand it. It's .
not a request; it's a demand. And I think the best thing that
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we can do is provide the best service as we can to the
taxpaying public. So, I'm a Ford Tahoe, one Tamakachi, or
whatever the --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: One bicycle.
SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: One Crown Vic and four Tahoes.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right, that's where I'm
at. And I'm not voting in here, because it's not a real
meeting.
MS. HARGIS: All right. We talked about what other
city -- the library's the only one. I think the airport was
agreed upon. EMs was agreed upon.
JUDGE TINLEY: Fire contract.
MS. HARGIS: The animal, we just cut it in half.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's fifty-fifty, yeah, on that
one.
MS. HARGIS: We need to add in what Ingram -- now, I
don't have Ingram's revenue in there. .
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I will say -- and I -- you know,
I was asked by a City Councilman what Ingram was going to do,.
and I said my feeling was that was going to come in, and I
think the City should be reduced proportionately.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Be fair.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are you talking about on the
animal --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We want to be fair with them.
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You know what I mean?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, it's not -- if Ingram's
coming in, we're getting revenue from Ingram, we reduce the
total, then divide that.
JUDGE TINLEY: Exactly. Take 21 off of the total.
MS. HARGIS: But we have more expenses.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Whatever the net -- we net it
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. We add in the additional
costs, the additional half a person. Then, off the bottom
line, we take 21,000, and then we divide that in half, and
that's the City's portion, is one-half. Isn't that the way
you see it, Bruce?
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Sure. If that's not fair, I
don't know how to do it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's all right.
MS. HARGIS: Half of expenses is what we put down,
not half of the revenue. We didn't give them credit for the
revenue, because it wasn't that much before.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we need -- I think they
need credit for the revenue. They need credit for the
revenue.
JUDGE TINLEY: What are we going to allocate to
Ingram's revenue? We need to make some allocation there if
we're going to do that.
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COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Ingram's getting their
revenues. They're keeping --
JUDGE TINLEY: Ingram gets their own?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: They keep theirs.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
(Discussion off the record.)
MS. HARGIS: So, the only one, then, that they're --
the only change this year, I assume, is the fire?
JUDGE TINLEY: The fire?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, that will stay at 175.
MS. HARGIS: They want a letter when we get down to
what it's going to be, so when I give you the memo, I'll do a
little paragraph about what I think you want me to do for
that, so we can send them -- I've been requested to send them
something in writing. Preferably, I'm sure it needs to come
from you -- from the Judge.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I do have one more question.
In terms of the airport and the capital improvement plan,- my
understanding was that CIP was proposed or given to the EIC
for funding, and then some questions were raised about some of
the items on that CIP. Where are we on that?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's -- I have no idea. I
mean, what Commissioner Williams is talking about, a large
number of our grant matches, the plan was for the EIC to fund
those, not the City or the County, out of our general budget.
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EIC -- some of the members of EIC evidently objected to that
approach.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Have raised some serious
questions about it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Questions about it. But at this
point, that's -- I mean, the City prepared the budget and gave
it to us, and they haven't told us we need to change it.
They're over EIC, so I think we budget as we see fit, as we've
done.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay.
MS. HARGIS: Okay.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions? Ms. Hyde?
MS. HYDE: When we talk about salaries, the JDC --
the Juvenile Detention Center was not on that list. They
should have been on that list.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who?
JUDGE TINLEY: Juvenile Detention. Kevin.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Kevin.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He should be.
MS. HYDE: He wasn't on my list.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Maybe he was glad for that;
maybe he wasn't. Probably wasn't glad.
MS. HYDE: I lumped him in with the Juvenile
Probation folks, which are not county. They are, but they're
not.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He's separate. He's not
part of Juvenile Probation; he's separate.
MS. HYDE: I said I lumped him in with Juvenile
Probation. That's why I'm bringing it up. He's not on that
sheet. He should be on that sheet.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He should be.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would not be opposed to doing
a 3.5 percent increase.
JUDGE TINLEY: 3.5. 3.5 plus COLA?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: He's done a good job in turning
that facility around.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree with that.
JUDGE TINLEY: Revenues are -- his revenues are --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 3.5 plus COLA.
JUDGE TINLEY: I hate to drag you out like this,
Kevin, but the numbers last week or so have not been too good;
have they?
MR. STANTON: We went back and looked at that. As
far as -- just talking about the kids?
JUDGE TINLEY: No, I'm just talking about the
census.
MR. STANTON: Oh, the census. Yeah, we've been low
the last -- last --
JUDGE TINLEY: 'Cause of summertime?
MR. STANTON: Summertime and that kind of stuff.
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But the one good thing about this past month was that we
finally had our -- close to our first $10,000 bill go out,
besides to Kerr County. Uvalde got up to about $9,200 this
month -- past month. That was a big one.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, good.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Ms. Hardin had her hand up.
JUDGE TINLEY: I thought you were through a while
ago.
MS. HARDIN: No, I stood up here for a long time,
and y'all were really busy. I was on vacation last week, so
I'm not sure whether Mr. Odom talked to you or not, but Tommy
brought to our attention that nothing was done in the road
district money. When we received our budget, there was no
sheet for the -- for the road districts. All road districts
have been finished with current budgets of Road and Bridge
through the past, and so Len asked Tommy if it would be
possible for us to use some of those funds for capital
purchase.
MS. HARGIS: Are we on this year?
MS. HARDIN: This year. So, the -- there's, like --
it's in Fund 20, and there's, like, $220,000. There's still
two of them that are not paid off, that still are generating
some funds.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, isn't the road district
25 ~ funds like -- like dedicated funds?
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COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, what they want --
MS. HARDIN: They're dedicated for repayment of what
has already been spent.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Right.
MS. HARDIN: And it's dedicated, but --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, we're overcharging
people? Is that what we're saying?
MS. HARDIN: No.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh, no.
MS. HARDIN: No, no, no, we don't do that. But it
was 15 cents per hundred of the tax evaluation, and that money
just goes in, and it was, like, a 30-year pay on some of them.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh. So, what you're saying is
that the revenue account has built up and we've never spent
it?
MS. HARDIN: Correct.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We never put it back into Road
and Bridge, where the materials or wherever came from.
MS. HARDIN: And each year we have received that
budget line item, and we've filled out whatever we needed to
do for that year. This year we did not receive one, so it
wasn't brought to -- Tommy brought it to our attention after
we turned the budget in.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And you want to use it for
debt reduction?
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MS. HARDIN: No, we want to use to it buy a new
Gradall, if possible. We found one that's been -- it's a
leased one, with -- I'm sorry, I don't have the number of
hours.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can't act on it, so you can
put it on the agenda for Monday.
MS. HARDIN: Okay, we can put it on for Monday.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, good solution.
MS. PIEPER: Judge, that information that I gave you
on that bill, do you want to think about that?
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I've not -- I'm not sure what
I've got. You handed it to me, but I didn't have an
opportunity to digest it.
MS. PIEPER: Unfunded mandate.
JUDGE TINLEY: Looks like somebody's lobbying.
"Vote no on H.R. 811."
MS. PIEPER: But -- well, read -- finish reading
that one page.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: The "Vote no" page or the other
page?
MS. PIEPER: No, that page.
JUDGE TINLEY: Is that the "Vote no" page?
MS. PIEPER: Yes. Well, it doesn't matter; either
one. If that passes, we've got unfunded mandates on election
equipment for 2008 and 2012.
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2~
STATE OF TEXAS
COUNTY OF KERR I
The above and foregoing is a true and complete
transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my
capacity as County Clerk of the Commissioners Court
of Kerr County, Texas, at the time and place
heretofore set forth.
DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 7th day of
September, 2007.
JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk
Kath~ik, Deputy County Clerk
Certified Shorthand Reporter
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