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KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT
Budget Workshop
Wednesday, July 22, 2009
2:00 p.m.
Commissioners' Courtroom
Kerr County Courthouse
Kerrville, Texas
PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge
H.A."BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1
WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2
JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3
BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4

Q`-
'O
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I N D E X
July 22, 2009
PAGE
Review and discuss FY 2009-10 Budgets and fiscal,
capital expenditure and personnel matters related
thereto, for various county departments, including,
but not limited to the following departments:
County Court at Law ................................. --
Employee Health Benefits ............................ 3
Reorganization Issues ............................... 42
Human Resources and Personnel Policies .............. 64
Organizational Development .......................... 65
Step and Grade Schedules ............................ 76
Adjourned ............................................... 103
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On Wednesday, July 22, 2009, at 2:00 p.m., a budget
workshop meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was
held in the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse,
Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in
open court:
P R O C E E D I N G S
JUDGE TINLEY: I will now convene our Commissioners
Court workshop scheduled for Wednesday, July 22nd, 2009, at
2 p.m., and it is that time now. The agenda item is to
participate in budget workshops for the following
departments: County Court at Law, employee health benefits,
reorganization issues, human resources, personnel policy,
organizational development, and step and grade schedules.
Most of these are personnel or personnel-related items. We
moved County Court at Law there because of a conflict on that
particular one. I tried to get into that budget this morning
in order to make some modifications, and for some reason, I
could not get in there. It would not let me in. But at this
point, well, let's move forward with some -- some of the more
general issues. Let's talk about employee health benefits.
Initially, Ms. Hyde, do you want to kick this thing off?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is this it?
JUDGE TINLEY: That's it.
MS. HYDE: I've got Gary Looney; I asked Gary to
as well. He just got back from Washington, so he
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Washington are thinking about doing and attempting to do this
year. But as far as the benefit plan for this year, the
estimate at this point is -- is $2.2 million. That's up
about 200,000 over last year. And this is just an estimate
at this point. We'd also like to talk a little bit about
active employees' coverage and cost, retirees' spouse and
dependent coverage and cost, the HRA itself, COBRA, and the
stop loss and insurance reimbursements that we've gotten.
The employee health benefit plan right now is pretty robust.
It's a -- it's getting more and more solid. The employees
are understanding it more and more, how to use it, what
places to go. We had a little bit of a hiccup last week
where someone went again to the wrong place to get their
blood work done, and it's going to cost them $700
out-of-pocket. So, unfortunately, sometimes the e-mails, the
talk-WIS, the work-WIS, they don't -- they don't register
until someone gets hit and it brings it back up again.
I don't know what else -- what else we can do. We
can't say you cannot go to certain providers, but at the same
time, if it's going to cost me next to nothing or it's going
to cost me $700 or $1,000, I think that would garner my
attention. We're going to try putting out another post-it
within people's paychecks to see if that will help remind
everyone, because we're getting back into the time of year
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when we do our wellness. Most people get their physicals
twice a year in groups. We have a big group that goes in
January and February, and we have a big group that goes
October, November, and December. So, that's right now how
it's going. And most times when you go and have your
physicals, they want blood work done. So, maybe we can help
save somebody some out-of-pocket expense by reminding them.
You're looking at me confused.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Why would you have two set
times of the year to go get physicals?
MS. HYDE: We don't. That's when -- we don't have
it. That's when people tend to go, right after -- right
after the new year starts and your new-year insurance starts,
and then some people go at the very end of the year after
they've paid their deductible.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
MS. HYDE: So, Gary, do you want to come up and
tell them a little about Washington?
MR. LOONEY: Washington. Judge, Commissioners, I
think I handed you out an organizational chart of the House
of Representatives Bill Number 3200. Be sure and listen
tonight to the press conference that will be conducted this
evening by the president. He will give you additional
updates and be trying to sell his program to the general
public tonight. If you look -- when I first showed that
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flowchart, everybody thought -- you might want to hold one up
so the people out here can see the flowchart. When I first
showed it to everybody, they thought it was a joke, and,
"Hey, this is like Rube" -- what -- Rube Goldberg or
whatever. One of these, you drop a marble in this slot;
where does it come out? There are essentially 14 new
bureaucratic agencies that are created by H.R. Bill 3200.
Unbelievable volume of -- of information that's
been given to the House of Representatives. They were given
last -- a week ago on Tuesday evening, they were given an
1,100-page document. Representative Waxman hired a
speed-reader to read it aloud in Congress so that they could
get it through the House. He had a speed-reader read all
thousand pages, which had to be done in the House. The
chairman of the committee, Mr. Waxman -- Representative
Waxman, has set out the rules for how you can give amendments
or make amendments or mark up the bill. What he said in his
rules were that it would be two-hour advance notice of any
amendment that anybody wished to offer on that bill, and it
would be given to him and his staff would review that
amendment to determine whether or not it was germane to the
discussions that were being held in the conference -- in that
committee. Extremely unusual for any House committee to be
handling that matter, where the chairman of the committee
manages the admission or submission of amendments to the
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whether or not he personally feels that it should be offered
to the committee for vote. That's the House side of it.
The Senate side, with the treasury and the -- and
their side with their bills, they've pretty much settled out
their bills at this point. They're waiting for the House
Bill to be completed so that they can generate a conference
committee that will then hopefully hash out the results of
the national health care plan that they're -- whatever it's
going to end up with. The timeline is one of the critical
issues. When Medicare was created back in the '70's, it took
almost two years of negotiation and discussion by bipartisan
committees, et cetera. This health care plan is attempting
to change the entire delivery system in the United States in
less than four months. The bills have only been active and
been in the hands of the committees for less than four
months. The directive by the president is to have something
I
to be voted on in Congress prior to the August recess. So,
you know, that's this railroad effect, and this is really the
big concern. There's no question that there's a need for
some reforms to take place as far as our health care
delivery. There's no question about that. But doing it
properly, doing it on a timely basis, and maintaining the
relationships that individuals have with their physicians,
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and individuals have as far as being able to direct their own
health care is -- is at risk at this point in time with these
bills and with the Senate that's out there.
', As far as it impacts us, far as it impacts the
County at this point, this next year, between now and renewal
for next year, even if they pass new regulations, new
requirements, whatever it happens to be, it won't impact the
county until possibly 2011 or possibly 2012, based on the
calendars that are put into the events that have to occur for
the creation of these agencies, if they are created -- if
they do get created, with an extension of it being fully
operable in 2015. So, as far as making critical changes in
our program as of today based on pending legislation, we
don't need to worry about that at this point in time. What
we need to worry about more is our -- just our standard
budgeting, moving forward what our plans are, our coverage,
and where we're headed from this point. Any things that
might occur would be administrative types of changes at this
point rather than completely changing what we're doing from a
delivery from an employer to employee at this point in time.
I'm sure that y'all have been kind of watching the
-- the wave. Let me give you just a couple of quick things
that happened, and in visiting with Congressman -- and his
aide for this summer is a young man that just graduated from
college, and he's up there for the summer working; he's an
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intern working for Congressman -- Representative from St.
Louis. Started visiting with him and asked him what his
status was. He said, "I just graduated from college; up here
to follow the health care legislation. I've been admitted to
i
medical school." I said, "That's great. When do you start?"
He said, "Well, this October." I said, "What happens --
you've been watching the legislation. What happens if they
'~ pass this H.R. 3200 as it exists today?" He said, I won't go
to medical school." He said, "I'm not going -- I won't go,
because I don't want to be put into that system as a
physician." Okay? I have his name, address, and phone
number in case anybody would like to talk to him.
The other thing that happened was, I had another
individual, a lady that was an employee of a congressman, and
visiting with her -- and I had the book that they're given as
a new employee to look at, their health care plan that they
have as a new employee. It's about the size of the Kerrville
phone book; it's about that thick and a little bit bigger.
And I asked -- I said, "How did you go about making a
decision about which one of these 9 -- 12 plans that are
being offered to the employees, how'd you make a decision?
Did you go to the aide that specializes in health care for
the senator? Or did you..." She said, "Oh, no, she doesn't
know what's going on." I said, "What?" And she said, "Oh,
she wouldn't be able to help me. She -- she deals with
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theory. This is -- this is -- I had to make a decision on
how my health care's going to be delivered." I said, "Would
it have helped you to have somebody help explain it to you?"
And she said, "We don't have that here." I said, "How did
you make the decision?" She said, "Well, the young lady that
sits at the desk over here normally said it was good plan, so
I chose that one."
And so, you know, the concept in delivery and
what's going on up there, we have a hard time with the
reality of what's going on in Kerrville as far as the
delivery process. Trying to join those media together is
going to be a real challenge. But as far as we're concerned
as an organization at this point in time, I don't think that
what's going on in Washington will impact or do anything to
our budget process for this year for sure, and maybe not for
next year. And I would like love to tell you that's a joke,
but it's -- but it's an actual -- it's an actual spreadsheet
on what the organization is supposed to look like.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, the president is going
to step us through this tonight?
MR. LOONEY: Yes, I'm sure he will. I'm sure he
will.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, Gary, did you --
MR. LOONEY: I promise you, he's not going to enter
that system in the same manner that you and I would.
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What did you just say? Did
you say that it's not going to affect our budget --
MR. LOONEY: Should not affect your budget for this
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This year, and maybe next
MR. LOONEY: And possibly not for next year.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And, of course, the
excitement doesn't hit until they get into the conference
committee. That's when it's really going to get fun.
', MR. LOONEY: It's going to -- yes.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If it gets that far.
MR. LOONEY: I had the opportunity to actually be
in committee, and be in there and feeding information in to
the individuals that were doing testimony.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Wow.
MR. LOONEY: It's an interesting -- it's an
interesting process.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I bet.
MR. LOONEY: Unless you have a lot of gray hair,
they don't let you in.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Doesn't sound like they listen
very much, though.
MR. LOONEY: No. Unfortunately, right now, what's
going on is a lot of trading going on. Democrats are trading
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to the Republicans whatever they feel like they may have in
their pocket that they can give to Republican to gather that
vote. Example: You know, the bill was passed on greening
the U.S., and the effluents that are coming out of the
refineries, you know, they were auctioning off -- they were
going to auction off waivers so that certain refineries that
didn't meet the requirements could pay a fine or buy a waiver
to be able to put that effluent into the air. They changed
that, and instead of auctioning it off, they gave certain
democratic congressmen the ability to negotiate with
different locations around the United States that may have
high-profile refineries in it, but someone that they needed a
vote from. And we have one in Beaumont, in that area, where
we know that those types of bargaining chips are being traded
for a waiver of effluent for a health care vote. So,
politics on a very large scale.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm.
MR. LOONEY: So, that's my -- but that's my happy
update for the day. Unfortunately, you know, we'll have --
again, there will be additional information tonight, but I
suspect it'll all be centered toward passage of whatever the
health care bill is. Eva?
MS. HYDE: We won't have any more real, like,
dollars-and-cents numbers for probably another six to seven
weeks. Is that not correct?
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September.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, the numbers that are in the
recommended -- or in the budget right now are 200,000 over
last year? Is that what I heard?
MR. LOONEY: That's correct.
MS. HYDE: It's 2.2 million this year, yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that's keeping everything
the same?
MS. HYDE: (Nodded.) There might be a little bit
of an increase on the retirees. There's a recommendation --
I don't know if you guys want to go into it at this point or
you want to wait until we get solid numbers.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I think if we have to
wait till October, I don't think we have time for solid
I numbers.
MR. LOONEY: Not October.
MS. HYDE: September. September 1.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We don't have much time for
September 1. But --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask you one question,
and it may open the door to further conversation about it.
', But as far as the retirees and an increase there, you said
that there's maybe something. Obviously, there is something
-- a recommendation. Where did that -- where do those kind
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of recommendations come from?
MS. HYDE: Based on the past. The precedent that's
been set on a yearly basis, there's been a small increase.
I COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You look at it and say,
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that basically kind of
like the way you do it?
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: On prescription drug care, I
know that was a highlighted area last year, probably the year
before. And I know that some other health care plans are, I
guess, getting closer or more and more saying you don't have
the option of taking name brands; you have to take the
generic equivalents. Where are we on all that?
MR. LOONEY: We've been tracking that, as we
suggested last -- we've been tracking it pretty closely as to
where the dollars are being spent. What would happen if we
make changes? What would happen if we make alterations?
Where can we, you know, adjust these numbers to get the best
bang for the buck as far as changing generics, changing the
co-pays, changing these different circumstances? The problem
is, with the volume of medications we're dealing with, making
these changes, we can generate additional income flow through
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the system, but we're not able to generate significant enough
dollars. We're being able to create savings, but it's
ranging from 15,000, 18,000, $20,000 a year type savings.
So, in many cases, it's putting a nail in the bottom of one
or two employees' feet, and/or putting a rock in their shoe,
and every time they -- every time that they take a step,
they're going to talk about us changing their health care
plan. But we want to be able to get -- if we're going to
make those changes, we need to get some significant savings
if we're going to make that. Now, right now, the things that
we've been looking at based on the flows have not generated
enough dollars to -- to make some of those changes we're
talking about.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Have you looked at adjusting
the County's self-insured portion or whatever you call it,
cap?
MR. LOONEY: Co-pays and things of that sort?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Not the employees. I mean the
50,000 -- what's the --
MS. HYDE: Sixty.
JUDGE TINLEY: Stop loss.
MR. LOONEY: Stop loss.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sixty?
JUDGE TINLEY: Sixty.
25 ~ COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that -- I mean, is there any
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savings one way or the other by adjusting that up or down a
little bit?
MR. LOONEY: That's part of what those hard dollar
numbers are that I'll be bringing back to you, because I
don't have any hard dollar numbers in that area yet. But
typically, when we take on more risk, we reduce fixed costs.
If we reduce that risk, we take on additional premium costs.
So, that's one of the analyses that we make during this time.
We're just too far out from the anniversary date to be able
to get the insurance industry to give us hard dollar numbers
based on those projections.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Would you -- I mean, knowing
our history for the year, if we increase the stop loss, would
that be -- just intuitively, to me, if someone's going to
have to spend 60,000 on health care in a year, they're likely
going to be up to 100,000, you know. So, I doubt there's a
whole lot that are going to be from the 60 to 80 range, so
does it make sense to bump it up to 80 or 70 or some other
number?
MR. LOONEY: We just have to weigh that fixed cost
reduction against the additional risk. And usually the
savings in dollars are typically about two to two and a half
times, so if you go from 60 to 70, that's a $10,000 spread.
The premium we expect to see change is two and a half times
that 10,000, or --
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: 25,000.
MR. LOONEY: -- $25,000 change. That's just kind
of a general underwriting rule of thumb that we look at, make
sure that we at least get that amount of spread in the
premium, and then we also look at the number of cases that
have exceeded the stop loss in the previous year.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
MR. LOONEY: To determine what that corridor might
be in relationship to what our overall risk might be.
MS. HYDE: We're staying about the same, I mean,
between 6 to 12 people. I mean, pretty much -- pretty
much -- I mean, it might be different folks, but it's pretty
much 6 to 12. It goes up to between 10 and 12 at the very
end, and that's why we -- we really need to wait, because the
data that they're looking for is what the trend is for
each -- you know, for all of that, and for some reason, June,
July, August seems to be when we tend to get that last big
heavy hit. So, hopefully we won't. I mean, we're in August.
So --
MR. LOONEY: Majority of our high risks are falling
into the cancer therapy care and treatment.
MS. HYDE: Right.
MR. LOONEY: We've had a few cardiovascular
problems in the past, but the -- the greater, higher risks
have typically been in the cancer therapy treatments.
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JUDGE TINLEY: What other options generally might
be available to us to make a significant savings without a
tremendous disruption in -- in the major components of our
MS. HYDE: Gary, I think he's talking --
MR. LOONEY: Are you talking --
JUDGE TINLEY: You may not be able to get both of
them; I don't know.
MR. LOONEY: -- about other changes in plan design?
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
MR. LOONEY: Plan design -- typically, when you
look at plan design changes, you're looking at moving from a
covered portion of the plan document to transferring that
risk back to an employee, so you're not going to eliminate
the cost, but you're just going to reallocate the cost
between employee and county. So, making plan design changes,
reduce copayments, deductibles, coinsurance amounts, change
the maximum available limitation for chiropractic care,
change the coverage for certain dependents possibly where you
don't cover certain elements of a dependent, it doesn't stop
that cost from occurring. It simply changes the risk to
another base. The greatest impact on your plan, the greatest
asset that you can put into your plan is a very strong
controlled wellness program. That puts people in a better
healthy condition -- healthier condition.
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We've talked about wellness and health care and
wellness issues. We've had our wellness fairs. We've done a
lot of those things. More and more, the change -- and making
that change in the physical structure and maintenance of the
individual employees as far as their overall health care has
an immediate impact on the claims. You either prevent
something from occurring, or you identify it in advance of it
becoming a serious illness, which reduces the cost to the
plan. Or you end up -- as we have, you know, in the past, we
end up in disease management, which means it's already been
identified. The claims are already occurring, and we're
trying to mitigate that expense. So, this preventive care/
wellness type program is the one thing that can give an
immediate gain and help the care without just shifting
cost -- without just changing the cost.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've always had a super
interest in that, but I can't see how you do it. I mean, do
you -- do you go down and buy everybody a membership to a
club -- a health club, and then -- and then make them go down
there or fire them? I mean, how do you do that?
MR. LOONEY: A lot of -- a lot of different
methodologies. One thing that happened two years ago, prior
to two years ago, if, as an employer, you wanted to
discriminate against what you determined to be an individual
that met certain physical requirements and someone who
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didn't -- overweight, heavy smoker, whatever -- that
requirement on the federal government program, federal
government wouldn't allow you to discriminate against those
employees. Two years ago, they changed the law. They said
that you could change and you could offer up to a 10 percent
differential in either plan design or premium rate based on
an employee's physical structure or status, based on whatever
criterion you have. The one caveat in that is that if you
have a restriction for smoking, then you, as an employer,
have to offer the individual an opportunity to stop smoking,
which means you have to have something in your plan design
that says, Okay, here, here's the program. If you're on it,
you stay on it, you stay with it, you've got this premium
rate. If you don't stay on it, if you get off of it, then
you've got this premium rate. It's a higher cost. As long
as you're participating in the process of attempting to make
the change, then you are awarded a lower premium cost. And
that's monitorable by health care professionals. It's
monitored by wellness professionals, by companies that offer
that service.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And who is that here in
Kerrville, Texas --
MS. HYDE: There probably is not --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- that would monitor that?
25 I MS. HYDE: There's probably not a wellness program
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administrator in Kerrville, Texas.
MR. LOONEY: The wellness companies, themselves,
they contract with local professionals that have certain
certificates of education -- certain levels of education,
depending on where you -- physical therapist, some
physicians, some internal specialists, different
organizations that provide that kind of service to other
organizations, to other -- other individuals. It is -- it
requires the county to be very aggressive in the process.
Voluntary participation in the programs typically have
difficulty in working. There are things that you can do,
just as an aid. Negotiate with a local health club, like you
said, for a certain fee base, and possibly pay half that fee
for them to -- to encourage the utilization of that program.
I don't know if there's local -- I don't know which local
organizations -- I'm sure you've got local gyms and local
facilities, you know.
So, working and trying to encourage an employee by
a cash contribution is one method. The State of Texas has
discussed encouraging their employees on weight loss programs
and such as that by offering a basic dental program where
they give the employee and/or family two visits to the
dentist a year free if they'll go through the process of
getting in a program, staying in the program, and reporting
to that program. So, there's a -- a huge volume of
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different -- but we're getting to the point where we have to
recognize the health of the individual employee and treat it
as a risk management function, because that really is the
risk for y'all, is managing that health care issue. So,
trying to take care of and manage that piece is -- is
becoming critically important. It's your turn.
MS. HYDE: You've asked regarding the costs, like
for employees or for retirees, and there's been a slight
increase each year that I've been here. I would like for
y'all to maybe consider looking at the retirees. As far as
right now, the cost for a retiree and the cost for their
dependent or spouse is the same as an active employee.
Perhaps we look at the spouse or dependent as other
locations, public and private, are starting to look at the
spouses and dependents, at 50 percent of cost, 50 percent of
base cost. So, if our plan costs Kerr County $600 per
employee per month, then a spouse or dependent would cost
$300 for a retiree. We could also look at changing, too,
once an employee/retiree hits 65, then we look at, you know,
they're under Medicare, Medicaid, and that changes. And,
again, those are retirees, not active employees. And perhaps
we look at paying for Medicare Part D, which is more of an
inclusive coverage for that employee, so it's more like their
supplemental which would cover prescriptions and medical.
That might be another way. Because our -- our employees
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right now, we have 14 to 16 retirees, but that number is
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: She's sitting right behind
you. (Laughter.)
MS. UECKER: Yeah, I'm within kicking reach, aren't
MS. HYDE: There -- there were discussions with me
this year about doing away with retiree funding completely.
I don't take that one well. And here's why. That is part of
this package, and it has been a part of this package. If
we're going -- if we're going to take something away, I
highly suggest that we replace it with something. Do not
take that away as a benefit, because I think it will hurt us
in employees. If people felt like that they were not going
to have retiree benefits, I think that that would hurt us.
JUDGE TINLEY: The -- the dependent costs for
retirees, --
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: -- that's the same as dependent
costs for active employees now, is it not?
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: You mentioned a moment ago about
having it half cost for dependents -- retiree dependents.
That's going the wrong direction, isn't it?
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MS. HYDE: It's going up.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Fifty percent of the
MS. HYDE: It's 50 percent. A lot of places do not
even do it any more. They don't give it to spouses and
dependents. I keep saying spouses and dependents, 'cause
that's in all the language. I'm trying to figure out how
many dependents we would have at that age, and I'm looking at
65. But I guess you could. You know, you could have had
children late, or adopted. The other thing, when Gary looks
at costing this year, per y'all's request from last year,
we're looking at doing away with total self-insurance to see
what the difference in cost is, to see if there's anything
there, if we've closed any gaps. I think that, depending on
what happens with the federal government, what they determine
health care is going to turn into, that might be another
avenue to cover and help save us.
JUDGE TINLEY: Our funding level last year was
equivalent to 1.8 and change, and we're going to 2.2?
(Ms. Hyde nodded.)
JUDGE TINLEY: Effectively, what we're looking at
is a $400,000 commitment, assuming the plan remains
relatively equal. Any preliminary thoughts on a fully
insured program, what that would run? I understand it's
based upon --
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MR. LOONEY: We just --
MR. LOONEY: We just go into the market and try to
find out. We got a lot of companies running scared right
now, so it just depends on the market, Judge. We won't know
until -- again, it's going to take at least three to four
weeks minimum to get some of that information.
JUDGE TINLEY: But once you get closer to the
numbers that you got to have to have the thing --
MR. LOONEY: Yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: -- rated -- quoted, why, you're
going to have it quoted both ways?
MR. LOONEY: Right.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
MR. LOONEY: Right, we want to take a look at it.
We're somewhat limited in the carriers because of the fact
that we have to make sure that they have P.P.O. networks that
are appropriate for utilization by the employees, so it
limits some of the companies that we deal with, because they
don't have the proper networks involved to be able to use for
the employees of the county. The other thing, too, back on
the prescription drug program real quick, we're looking at
also a completely transparent model, which is a -- the
general terminology or the hot-button in pharmacy nowadays is
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what they call transparency, where we actually are able to
get information concerning the true costs of the medications,
and then instead of paying all the markups that are involved
and the rebate programs that are involved, we pay cost-plus,
and then retain rebates. So, we're looking at that
possibility of reducing our cost overall without having to
change the actual delivery of medications themselves. The
prescription benefit management companies nationwide have
gotten a big silver bullet in the last year as far as the
volumes of dollars that they were making in relationship to
the actual costs of the medications that they were
delivering, so we're able to get better negotiated contracts
now on that basis.
JUDGE TINLEY: And you can be required -- they can
be required to disclose all these rebates and --
MR. LOONEY: Correct.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
MR. LOONEY: We actually had a bill passed in the
state of Texas this year that is going to require state
agencies -- and the definition of state agencies, I think
that the county probably is going to fall under that
definition when they get finished with it -- that the PPN
will be required to provide that information. That's
supposed to take place in 2011, is the -- by that time,
ERS/TRS -- ERS/TRS combination spent $660 million last year
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on prescription benefit management, and they didn't do an
audit on $260 million of that flow. Now we've passed a
regulation that says, yes, we can audit. Yes, you have to
disclose it. It took a congressional meeting and a law
change to be able to get to the point where we can do that.
JUDGE TINLEY: If we materially change the co-pays
on the non-generics, could that make a significant amount of
difference if you -- if they have 50 percent co-pay?
MS. HYDE: Yes and no. Because -- it will;
however, comma, the plan -- and we won't -- I don't believe
that we can change the plan, by law. If a doctor fills out a
form that says it's a medical necessity, guess what? We got
to buy it, and we got to buy the Cadillac.
JUDGE TINLEY: I understand that. I'm talking
about changing co-pays.
MR. LOONEY: Yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: Can't you change the co-pays?
MS. HYDE: You can make them more robust, yeah.
MR. LOONEY: We can change it to a percentage. We
can completely redo the formulary and take the -- the drugs
that are -- whatever category we want to classify them in and
make that a -- a percentage as opposed to a co-pay, pay
50 percent of that as opposed to a $30 copayment.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any estimate on what -- what that
would generate in the way of savings?
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MR. LOONEY: We looked at the change in the co-pays
initially, and that's where we're coming up with this about
$15,000 to $16,000 change as far as moving from just
co-payments. Changing to the percentage, then you're going
to impact -- we don't know how many people that we would be
able to save from, because when you put that in, then they're
going to shift back to another -- possibly another drug. So,
rather than saving maybe 50 percent of it, we may save 100
percent of it. So, that change in that process -- again,
we're still -- because of the volume of drugs, we're in that
higher profile area; we're still only looking at within that
$24,000, $25,000 range, even going to a 50 percent.
JUDGE TINLEY: And what -- what's the total dollar
figure that we spend on non-generic prescription drugs
through our plan now, ballpark?
MR. LOONEY: I actually have the report with me,
Judge.
JUDGE TINLEY: I've seen it, but I don't have it in
front of me.
MR. LOONEY: We do -- through the end of May, the
total prescription costs for preferred medications is
$155,000.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So, that's two-thirds of a --
so it's going to be 225 if you prorate it the remainder of
the year, right? Another 50 percent again?
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MR. LOONEY: The total drug expenditure is
MS. HYDE: We brought the drug expenditure down,
and we've moved the generic -- the generic was less than
30 percent last year when we discussed it. This year it's
running over 50 percent.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Your non-generics, though,
for eight months this year are 150,000?
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
MR. LOONEY: For six months.
MS. HYDE: Six months.
JUDGE TINLEY: For six months?
MR. LOONEY: For six months.
JUDGE TINLEY: That's going to be 300,000 if you
use a proration for a one-year period.
MR. LOONEY: Right.
JUDGE TINLEY: But if you can cut half of that out,
you got -- you're 150 to the good.
MS. HYDE: Unfortunately, most of those
preferred -- that's what I would -- that's why I brought that
up. Most of those preferred have brought in medical
necessity forms, so that --
MR. LOONEY: The Judge is saying that doesn't make
any difference. It's 50 percent of whatever the cost is.
JUDGE TINLEY: Whatever the cost is.
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MR. LOONEY: Eliminating -- it's just 50 percent of
JUDGE TINLEY: There again, you're shifting --
MR. LOONEY: Yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: -- that risk.
MR. LOONEY: And we have -- the down side, I guess,
of that, Judge, is you want to make sure that the people that
are taking these medications don't stop taking the
medications if, in fact, there are therapeutic uses that are
maintaining us from having some other critical illness occur
as a result of not taking the medications.
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
MR. LOONEY: So, selection of the -- of the drugs
that fall under that 50 percent category, if we change to
that category, selection of those medications in the
formulary should possibly be based on a therapeutic class, so
that you're dealing with medications that are possibly
maintenance medications, but they're not maintenance as a
result of a disease factor. They're more maintenance as a
result of sleep aid, for instance, a sleep aid or possibly
the esophageal reflux medications, the Nexiums. The things
you have to be careful of, you don't want to put too much
into the cancer therapy medications. You have to be careful
about those. You want to make sure that your diabetics are
-- stay on their treatment programs, and that the
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cardiovascular, cholesterol control medications are
JUDGE TINLEY: But if there's a therapeutic
equivalent at a lower cost, or a generic, you want to do what
you can to get them over there so that they continue to get
the therapeutic benefit?
MR. LOONEY: Correct. And that's where the
doctor-patient relationship has to fall. If you -- you know
the little fold-out they put inside the medications? You
know, that thing -- you ever read one of those? You'd never
take any medication, because the things that it says that it
possibly could cause are substantially greater than what
they're supposed to cure. But one of the things about the
esophageal reflux medications, the Nexiums and that sort of
thing, the actual fold-out on those medications say they're
not supposed to take those for more than 90 days at a time
because of potential damage they may do to the esophagus
overall, but we see people that are on those medications for
two, three, four, and five years.
MS. UECKER: That's right, and I'm not getting off
of it either. (Laughter.)
MR. LOONEY: I can tell her esophagus is in good
shape. (Laughter.)
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You just got your answer.
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MR. LOONEY: As long as the doctor says that's what
you got to have, I'm not going to tell you you can't have it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You don't have to. Obama
will.
MR. LOONEY: Yeah, possibly. There are a lot of us
that wouldn't be able to receive treatment at all. Our hair
is much too gray.
MS. HYDE: Was there any other questions about
retirees and spouses or anything at this point? Or do you
want to wait until we have some hard -- hard numbers?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think we got to have the
numbers. I mean, we can sit here and visit all day long.
You know, we can visit about your goats and stuff like that.
MS. HYDE: I don't have any.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We'll see in exactly --
MS. HYDE: So -- are we done?
MR. LOONEY: Yes.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: When does that happen? When
does the real numbers come?
MS. HYDE: About September 1.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: September 1. And --
JUDGE TINLEY: Got any wonderful ideas how we
quantify it between now and then, Buster?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No.
MS. HYDE: That's why we said 2.2 million. I mean,
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that's --
MR. LOONEY: I wish I had a crystal ball,
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Let's say we plan on 2.2 and
MR. LOONEY: Correct.
MS. HYDE: Right. Right.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And really hope for not worse.
MS. HYDE: Shouldn't be worse. Knock on wood,
shouldn't be worse.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anything else on employee
health benefits that we need to --
MS. HYDE: HRA, suggested carry-overs and change.
We changed it last year to make sure that it got fixed. The
original intent, I think, of the HRA card was the 600 for a
single person -- you know, employee only, 1,200 for employee
plus spouse, 1,800 for employee, spouse, plus child or
children. And somehow it went from 600 to 1,800 years ago,
so we changed it last year to get it back. One other way --
and some of these are small dollar amounts. But the
three-year plan was such that you could carry it over up to
three years. Let's say you didn't use it. So -- I will use
myself. The first two years I was here, I didn't go to the
doctor, didn't use my little $600. So, this year, when I got
my 600, this is my third year; I had $1,800 in the bank.
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Well, accident, head where it shouldn't have been, and so I
got to use my card and pay my deductible, my $1,000
deductible. I didn't have any out-of-pocket for my
deductible this year, which was pretty cool. But we've got
it set up on a three-year plan, and the more I used it this
year, the more I got to thinking about it. What ends up
happening, and myself included, even during open enrollments,
I'm telling folks, "Carry, carry, carry, and use it before
you lose it." Do y'all remember that during open enrollment?
Why not allow them to carry over as long as they want to, but
the max is three grand? The max is three grand. Whether you
get your 600, 1,200, 1,800, you can carry it as long as you
want, but instead of it being $3,600, it's $3,000. That's
it. You can carry it over six years, you can carry it over
one year, whatever you want, but I think that would save us.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's the largest
carry-over that you may have right now?
JUDGE TINLEY: Fifty-four. Carry it for three
years, 1,800, you could have 54.
MS. HYDE: We have a max of 3,600 on the 1,800
people.
JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, you do?
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. We got a --
JUDGE TINLEY: So you're only reducing it by 600.
MS. HYDE: We're reducing them by 600 bucks, but
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they can carry it as long as they want.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: To me, that's -- I like that
better, personally.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's fair.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's easier.
MS. HYDE: It's easy for people to understand.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: To encourage people to go use
it if you don't need it, I mean, it's --
MS. HYDE: Right. Right. And so we were kind of
encouraging that.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Encouraging people to go ahead
and do stuff even though it really wasn't necessary.
MS. HYDE: Right. And they could use that money
and get reimbursed at the end of the year, so -- so that
would be -- that could be an option. Again, this is saving
small dollar amounts, but we're kind of in that --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You keep the records of the
people. The employees know what, if any, carry-over they
have?
MS. HYDE: Oh, yes, sir. That's fun every year,
yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Actually depends -- every
time you use it, if you have -- go to the computer, it gives
you your balance. It will tell you if you used it before.
MS. HYDE: Another area -- and these are just
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discussion topics y'all can think about until we get the
numbers. Right now, we have it set where coverage for
families with multiple active employees within the family --
you know, do you want to look at that it's not free if you
both work here? It's going to cost you if one -- it's going
to cost you a little bit if you have two within the family
that both work here?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Doesn't seem fair.
MS. HYDE: I'm just throwing out ideas. These are
not suggestions, they're just ideas.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Say it again? And then --
as opposed to what?
MS. HYDE: Right now, if there is an employee and
their spouse that work for Kerr County, neither pay for
health insurance. Neither. They're both free.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And how does that work? You
have an opening for my wife anywhere? (Laughter.) Why is
that? Tell me why.
MS. HYDE: Because they're an active employee.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: They're both employees.
MS. HYDE: And one of the benefits as an active
employee currently is that your medical insurance --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see.
MS. HYDE: -- is free.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. So, you want to
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change it to	-- or	you're	-- your suggestion --
MS.	HYDE:	Just	an option for you guys to think
about.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: One of the options that you
threw out was that one of them needs to pay?
MS. HYDE: Or partial, or some.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Or one needs to be the
dependent of the other?
MS. HYDE: Right.
MR. ODOM: Why would you do that?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And how many couples are
there employed?
MS. HYDE: We have several.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're one?
MS. GRINSTEAD: I'm one.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Jody, what do you want to
do? That's the way I'm going to vote.
MS. GRINSTEAD: I say leave it alone. (Laughter.)
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right. Next?
JUDGE TINLEY: You'd, in essence, be penalizing at
least one employee.
MS. HYDE: Absolutely.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't see how you can do
I that .
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's not the right -- let's
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pick on something else, leave that one alone.
MS. HYDE: What you guys have to understand is when
I give you options, I'm trying not to give just one side; I'm
trying to give you -- because sometimes you guys throw out
some stuff that is different as well. So, these are some
things that people suggest, and the industry suggest, and the
public sector is doing.
MR. ODOM: It wasn't a good suggestion.
MS. HYDE: COBRA right now --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let me ask you a question
before you go away from that. In that situation, we don't
~ have any circumstances where both employees who work for us
and are -- and have the employee coverage, we don't have any
situations where they're doing dependent coverage on --
MS. HYDE: We won't allow it. It's not in the
~ plan, but we haven't allowed it. We only --
MR. LOONEY: Just one of the employees has the
dependents.
MS. HYDE: Right. We just allow one side.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's my question, thank
you.
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. On the COBRA, I'm sure y'all
remember that this year we have to pay 65 percent of any
COBRA that "X" employees have. The employee only pays
35 percent, and then we get reimbursed by the government the
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65 percent. We haven't gotten reimbursed between -- we
haven't actually got reimbursed yet of anything that we've
paid, but I do believe that what they're looking at is that
this year, we get reimbursed; the I.R.S. is going to let us
have a tax credit against what we've paid in. But I would
say that that's part of -- is it not? Is that not part of
what the health plan is showing? That, guess what? That
65 percent is going to be our nickel, so that might be
something that you keep in the back of your mind, that
employees can quit or we terminate or they separate for
whatever reason, and we're going to have to pay for part of
their carry-over insurance until they get another job and get
insurance.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Isn't there a time limit?
MS. HYDE: Eighteen months.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah.
MS. HYDE: And if they have a life-qualifying
event, they get another 18. And if there's a -- if there's a
death or a birth or another life-qualifying event, they get
another 18, up to 36 months. So, Mindy -- we've been working
with Mindy, because this reimbursement is a -- it's a trip.
Is it not?
MS. WILLIAMS: Yeah.
MS. HYDE: It is a trip. So, we've had to file --
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MS. WILLIAMS: For the first quarter.
MS. HYDE: You need to help me here.
MS. WILLIAMS: I had to file an amended 941-X for
the first quarter report in order for us to get back what the
County's portion is for a COBRA-qualified individual.
MS. HYDE: Because what can happen is you get 30
days not to pay your bill before we -- before you're
canceled, so if they don't pay at the end of March like
they're supposed to for March, then they pay in April, Mindy
has to go back and do an amended return. Which is what has
happened. Which kind of stinks.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is the word "trip," is that
a '60's word? Is that the same word?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Used to do a lot of
tripping.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tripping, yeah. She used
MS. HYDE: As of today, we've recovered 261,000
from insurance overpayments, stop loss differences, and our
stop loss reimbursement is now under 45 days. When I first
came here, y'ap's stop loss was 6 months to 12 months, 18
months, two years. So, we have treated it kind of like an
A.R., an accounts receivable, and we kind of stay on it, so
at least that puts money in here. This was over 400,000 last
year. As you can see, this number has dropped as well.
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We're maintaining and doing more maintenance. If we have
high-dollar issues or employees that we feel are going to be
high risk, we're getting involved at the beginning, helping
them with getting to the right place, versus the bills coming
in and then us trying to deal with them. So, that's all I've
got for employee health, unless you guys have questions.
JUDGE TINLEY: Are we done with that one, folks?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So far.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to -- sorry?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I was going to ask, what else
11 is on ouz
12
13 the list.
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MS. HYDE: In your handout, I tried to follow the
agenda items.
(Mr. Looney waved goodbye to Commissioners.)
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Have fun next time in
I Washington.
JUDGE TINLEY: Bring us some good numbers, Gary.
MR. LOONEY: I'm going to do my best, Judge.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And some good news.
MR. LOONEY: Be sure and watch tonight. Just wear
your iron underwear when you do.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Shall we put this somewhere
and throw darts at it or what?
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MR. LOONEY: I'll leave that one with you. Thank
MS. HYDE: Bye. I'll call you later. On
reorganization, these, I think, would be discussed during
each of those areas. Is that -- but I just put Tim down
here.
JUDGE TINLEY: I think it would be helpful if we
talked a little bit about some areas in which we're dealing
with some -- you know, there are not that many personnel --
extraordinary personnel issues in the budget --
MS. HYDE: Right.
JUDGE TINLEY: -- process at this point.
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. So, you want me to kind of go
over them real quick?
JUDGE TINLEY: Things are pretty static, but there
are maybe half a dozen different things that -- that we've
been kicking around that we've got plugged in at this point.
MS. HYDE: The first one is Road and Bridge. And
Leonard and Kelly and I have sat down multiple times, and
when we went over Road and Bridge, we reorganized and
reassigned duties so that it made more sense. Are you
nodding?
MR. ODOM: Yeah.
MS. HYDE: 'Cause I can't see behind me. And when
we did that, we also redefined some of their
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responsibilities. So, in Road and Bridge, there is a request
for one more person as a 14-1, because we have 49 weeks of
vacation that we're trying to cover, and we've got the
numbers to show it. They need some help, because we're
robbing Peter to pay Paul, and then we're giving people time
off, and then we're robbing from those people to pay Paul.
And we're in a constant state, especially during your --
paving? Did I say it right? The paving time, which is prime
vacation time. In I.T., we've requested an additional I.T.
person. We've requested a database --
MR. TROLINGER: Administrator.
MS. HYDE: -- administrator. You can come help me.
Right now, we have the 5.0. and jail that really and truly
utilizes a lot of I.T. time. Not because they're doing
anything wrong or bad; it's just because of the equipment
that's over there and what's going on. But the database
analyst -- yeah? Okay, I'm going -- I can't talk your
language. We need somebody to help us with training, also to
understand the software systems that we have. Right now,
we're going through some costs, and I think y'all will agree
we've paid some costs out, and some folks weren't real happy
we've had to pay to have people come in and get trained. We
need to have some on-site experts, and part of that needs to
come from I.T. John and I sort of agree to disagree and to
agree, but we need some on-site experts to help the users.
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Instead of sending users somewhere to get trained at five
grand a week, or to send the trainers down here at five grand
a week, that database analyst can
writing, can help us with systems
with the day-to-day routine, fix
my -- my monitor. Help me here.
MR. TROLINGER: Well, I
we've added on the Animal Control
help us with report
maintenance, can help us
any printer, change out
agree. And, additionally,
facility, which is --
MS. HYDE: Right.
MR. TROLINGER: -- relatively small, the Juvenile
Detention Facility --
MS. HYDE: Road and Bridge.
MR. TROLINGER: -- and Road and bridge onto the
network, so there is a bit more work as far as the user base
goes .
MS. HYDE: The West Kerr is next.
MR. TROLINGER: So, there's a little bit more work
there.
JUDGE TINLEY: We've got the bounce off the tower
going now?
MR. TROLINGER: Yes, it's working.
JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, good.
MR. TROLINGER: Thanks to the City, we've got
microwave capability between facilities, high-speed network
connections.
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MS. HYDE: So that way, those folks can get in just
like we can.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, you had -- you had an
employee, according to your notes there, at that 48,059, and
you're replacing that employee with someone at 41,102; is
that correct?
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And then you're proposing
to have another support person -- which it's not defined as
to how that person supports, but I think I know what -- at
37,238; is that correct?
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. So, what's the
distinction between the 41 and 37 person?
~, MS. HYDE: You're going to have to help me.
MR. TROLINGER: Database analyst is someone that
can sit there and do some programming work, someone that can
write a program that runs a report or write a program that
changes the database.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that the 41 person or --
MR. TROLINGER: Yes.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- the 37?
MR. TROLINGER: The higher.
MS. HYDE: The higher.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, thank you.
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MR. TROLINGER: More expertise required. And,
typically, in a big city, this is a $90,000 to $100,000
person. So, you know, for Kerr County, we're not offering a
whole lot, but I do hope to attract someone that has that
capability. And, as a matter of fact, we've --
MS. HYDE: We -- we've interviewed, and they passed
the background. So, we did the backgrounds before we
interviewed, and they passed the backgrounds. There just
hasn't been a final decision.
MR. TROLINGER: That's right.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Your current interviews are
for the replacement of the employee that's no longer here?
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. It's not the requested
position; we don't have permission yet.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just thought I'd ask.
MS. HYDE: No, sir.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And so you're in that
process, then. You've interviewed and -- background,
interviewed, and now making decisions.
MR. TROLINGER: Yes.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And when is that going to
happen?
MR. TROLINGER: Today, after the workshop.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's a good answer.
25 ~ MS. HYDE: I know, but --
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's a good answer.
MS. HYDE: I was afraid he was going to say, like,
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, yeah, we couldn't put it
MR. TROLINGER: Need to get it done.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Couldn't wait two, three
months. You know, we started -- we started with contracting
with the little company over here in Kerrville South to come
over here and do the smaller things so you could do the
bigger things, and then we got away from that and hired an --
MR. TROLINGER: I.T. specialist.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- I.T. specialist to work
for you, and now we're hiring -- we still have the I.T.
specialist, and now we're hiring another?
MR. TROLINGER: Yes.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay.
MS. HYDE: Please. We're requesting.
MR. TROLINGER: Yes, please.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: He answered the question.
MR. TROLINGER: There's just enough demand with the
databases and the amount of data that we have, we just have
so much data now that we need someone that can go in there
instead of the vendors and waiting on a vendor to go in
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and -- and run a special report for us, or -- or, you know,
figuring out how much it's going to cost for them to do it or
for them to come on-site and do it for us. We need to be
able to do it in-house. It's just the -- the offset and the
cost, it's not going to be break-even initially, but
eventually it will be. It just -- it makes more sense to do
it in-house than to pay for it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, I couldn't agree with
you more. That's -- you're exactly right. And all of this
mumbling that was going on a while ago about having the tower
sending out its signals now, and animal department's coming
online, and so all that's kind of new stuff. That's causing
us to have another employee to handle the new stuff.
MR. TROLINGER: It would help -- it would help out
with the extra load.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Where are we with Tyler
Technologies and happiness?
MS. HYDE: We're happy with Incode.
MR. TROLINGER: Incode's the financial; Human
Resources is in very good shape. I think the courts are
doing fairly well. We've got some problems, got some on-site
time. J.P.'s are going to get a visit next month; that's
going to bring them up a little bit. Sheriff seems to be
doing fairly well. He's done quite a bit of work with the
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Sheriff's Office recently.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did y'all tell him about
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, kept it a secret.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. I was wondering how
it happened.
MS. HYDE: He's in the Sheriff's conference this
system to be loaded on the test system next month, and it's
going to be -- it's a culmination of things we wanted and
things we've asked for and things that we actually need to
have installed. And that will be due on production in
September after we test it. We've gone to annual releases,
where instead of updating the system every couple-three
months and you hear a lot of rumblings that something else is
broken, we're going to have annual releases, which lets us
plan and patch and fix on a regular basis.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
MS. HYDE: So, that's it for I.T.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I have one question. The
two largest items that I see in your budget are capital
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outlay and software maintenance. Software maintenance is all
Tyler? Or is that a multitude of things?
MR. TROLINGER: All -- all of the -- a multitude of
things, not just the one vendor. We have eDoc Tech is the
other significant vendor for the County Clerk's office.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Capital outlay would be
defined by you? Or online, or in the hands of the Auditor?
Or all of the above?
MS. HYDE: Can you repeat the question?
MR. TROLINGER: I think I understand what you're
asking. The capital -- the software line item is -- is a
culmination of vendors, and then the capital outlay includes
everything from new software systems, the initial cost of
them, to computer replacement hardware, server replacements,
and updates, and things that have been asked for by the
various department heads that I visited with.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Going to the heart of
$307,000, where could we see a definitive list?
MR. TROLINGER: It's in there. If you click into
it, you'll see the detailed list, and there's a line item for
each of those requests. For instance, there's a new server
for tape backup. We've gotten to about 2 terabytes of data,
which is a whole bunch, and trying to archive that to tape
has been cumbersome. It now takes longer than the weekend,
running three tapes, to back it all up, to archive it. So,
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I'm forced to go to the next newer technology, and there's a
line item just for that, just for that particular thing.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay.
MR. TROLINGER: Essentially, all the hardware and
software is in the I.T. budget. That's what's changed this
year. Instead of being spread out in all the budgets, it's
now been consolidated completely.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I understand that. That's
a good move.
MR. TROLINGER: And you can see the big picture
more readily than me providing a spreadsheet, as I had in the
past. You can see it on Incode in one place.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay.
MR. TROLINGER: The good news on the software side
is we're still locked in as part of the initial contract with
Tyler Technologies; we have no annual increases. And this
year, we'd have another increase otherwise. That goes on for
another two years where we're locked in. We're not saving,
but we're not having to pay more.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you.
MS. HYDE: On maintenance, I need to ask for -- I
guess I need to request -- there's been an additional request
for an additional employee, and so I'd like permission to be
able to talk with Tim about it and then update the budget
with the request like we did with the rest.
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What do you mean, you want
MS. HYDE: I don't know how I'm supposed to do
this. I've never done this before. I'm just going to go in
and start whopping numbers again. Jeannie and I agreed we're
not going to do it repeatedly; we're going to do them once a
week when we get done with this. Then anything that y'all
say yes or no to, "Yes, we want to see numbers," or, "No, we
don't," then we can change it based on that. Not give
multiple types of numbers to y'all week to week to week.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, what I'm looking for in this
', particular segment is, there -- there are very few areas that
have additional personnel that are being requested.
MS. HYDE: Right.
JUDGE TINLEY: That's what I want you to lay in
front of us now.
MS. HYDE: Maintenance is asking now for a new
person, so Tim and I need to discuss it. Right? Because I'm
not sure if you still want the other --
(Low-voice discussion off the record.)
MS. HYDE: He wants a new maintenance person. And
the rationale behind that is that we now have the Union
Church 100 percent again. The Ag Barn continues to grow.
The 5.0. continues to need a person there pretty much every
day of the week.
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MR. BOLLIER: Full-time.
MS. HYDE: Full-time. So, he's -- he and his folks
are petty stretched. Used to, we'd get some rain or cold
weather where there was a section where we weren't mowing too
much, and -- but now we've got more projects that take up --
besides the mowing, like at the Ag Barn, at the jail, at the
J.D.C. -- am I doing it right?
MR. BOLLIER: Yes, you're doing good.
MS. HYDE: West Kerr.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tim, you want to add
MR. BOLLIER: She's doing real fine, Commissioner.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Any updates on poop in the
park? (Laughter.)
MR. BOLLIER: I'd appreciate it if you'd leave the
I poop out of the park.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Not until next Monday.
MR. BOLLIER: Well, the main course is --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Wait till Monday.
MR. BOLLIER: The main course is, like, at the
jail. We're finding that we need -- we're spending more and
more time over there. The jail is an eight hour-a-day job,
okay? And, like, right now, like B.J. and his bunch, the
trustees work; they help us when they can, but they've got so
much stuff now that they're doing right now too, and that's
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not getting any -- that's not getting any smaller either.
And -- you know, and B.J., he helps out when he can. But it
just seems like he's getting more and more --
MS. HYDE: Adult Probation helps you quite a bit,
community service?
MR. BOLLIER: Well, Adult Probation, they help out
on the weekends. But, like, during the week when we need
setups and stuff, sometimes, you know, community service
don't show up. If we don't have community service, we got
one man out there. If I've got one man mowing, I have to
pull Sonny in to help him. Sometimes it takes two or three
over there. So, you know, it's just -- it's just an ongoing
thing with the same old thing. And --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: How's your overtime?
MR. BOLLIER: Sir?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: How are you on overtime?
MR. BOLLIER: Well, I'm paying overtime. I've put
more overtime in the budget. You know, I've added more
overtime.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: If we add this person, it will
reduce the number, then?
MR. BOLLIER: If we add this person, it should slow
down on overtime, yes. The only time -- you got to
understand, at the Ag Barn on the weekends, where we have a
weekend function, it's -- you don't just have an eight-hour
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function. If there's a function out there, I've got a man
out there anywhere from 8 to 12, 13 hours. Sometimes I have
to put another man out there if it's -- that function may go
from 8 o'clock in the morning to 2 o'clock in the morning.
You know, you can't ask one man to work 18, 19 hours, and
that's what you end up with.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: You can have it.
MR. BOLLIER: I just got -- you got me riled. No,
I'm just trying to be serious here. But, you know, the --
you see where I'm going with it. I mean, I have no control
over the overtime at the Ag Barn on the weekends.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, I understand that. My
point was, your overtime has been a problem. If you get
another employee, that problem needs to start fixing itself.
MR. BOLLIER: The overtime should fix -- it should
cut it way down. That way I can add two people at the Ag
Barn on the weekends when I have anywhere from -- I may have
a function that starts at 7 o'clock in the morning. That guy
would only have to work till 4:00, and I have a -- say a
Quinceanera that starts at 5 o'clock, goes till 1 o'clock in
the morning. Then I've got it covered, and I'm out of
22 I overtime.
23
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. Can I ask you a
related question, just out of curiosity here? Since you
i
mentioned Union Church a minute ago, --
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MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- what's all that
construction fencing doing around the Union Church?
MR. BOLLIER: I did not put it there, sir.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I didn't ask you if you put
it there. I asked what it's for.
MR. BOLLIER: I haven't an answer for that. I do
not know, sir.
MS. GRINSTEAD: I do.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You know?
MS. GRINSTEAD: Yeah. That Congress of Speleology
group is out there, and it's just --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's the next deal.
MS. GRINSTEAD: They're out there a couple more
~ days .
	COMMISSIONER	WILLIAMS:	We had to fence them in,
they got	so rowdy? Is	that the	deal?
	MS. HYDE: That's the	cave people, the spelunkers.
	COMMISSIONER	WILLIAMS:	Okay, thank you.
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	Tim?
	MR. BOLLIER:	Yes, sir	?
	JUDGE TINLEY:	Hold it	down.
	COMMISSIONER	BALDWIN:	The question about -- a
question	about the jail	issue.	You said that's a full-time,
8-hour --	8-hour deal.	Is that	something new? Or has it --
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has that load of work always been there? Or -- let me
finish; you're fixing to jump ir: there. Has it always been
there, or is the place falling down and creating new -- new
work?
MR. BOLLIER: No, sir, the place isn't falling
down. The work has always been there. It's just that
we've -- we've just never really had the time, with the
personnel that we have, to stay there. And -- and, to tell
you the truth, we need to do more pre-maintenance, and we're
getting better at that. I mean, we're not perfect at that
yet, but there's times that there's other things going and we
just don't -- I don't leave a man there just to do what needs
to be done, and goof, off we go again.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: When's the last time we've
added a person to the Maintenance Department?
MS. HYDE: It was prior to 2006. We've taken away
from the Maintenance Department.
MR. BOLLIER: We've taken a minus of one and a half
people, the way I see it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Obviously, that was kind of
easy. Let's try it again.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: See if the answer you get
is consistent.
MR. BOLLIER: Ms. Hyde says one, so we'll go with
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COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. All right, thank you.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Ms. Hyde said?
MR. BOLLIER: Ms. Hyde says we're minus one, so
I'll just go along with that.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any more elaboration on that?
MR. BOLLIER: Just thank you, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
MS. HYDE: We also want to move -- on the budget
right now, somehow the line items on maintenance personnel in
maintenance are kind of not where they need to be, so we'd
like to move those as well, so that housekeeping is all in
one spot where they're supposed to be. But we've got people
all over the place in different budgets, so we need to work
with Tim and with Jeannie to make sure that we've got them in
the right line items so they show right.
MS. MABRY: I visited with Tim not too long ago and
I worked up budget amendments to that effect. You want to
move the money to where it is actually coming out of, and
those will be presented next Commissioners Court.
MS. HYDE: And that's it for maintenance.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
MS. HYDE: Animal Control, modifications on
personnel placement within the budget, and a new budget
request. It's not an additional person. It's for additional
part-time hours. It's about $11,000 in part-time. Some
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things that are going on now is that with the I.T. add, we
can do more with the Pet Finders -- with more of the Pet
Finders. We've got weekend work that needs to be done; the
animals still have to be fed and watered and all that good
stuff. But you've also got vacations that need to be
covered. So, what's happening is we're, again, robbing Peter
to pay Paul. And although you may not see it in overtime
pay, we're seeing it in time off.
MS. WHITT: A lot.
MS. HYDE: So it's killing that operation. If
you've got -- I think it's in y'all's budget notes, and it
shows the time off, how much, the whole nine yards. But it
has to do with being able to cross-train and cross-utilize
that part-time help in the office as well so that they can be
used for the computer. The software that John's going to put
in is going to help with keeping up with some of the reports
that you gentlemen have kind of asked for in the past, like
how many dogs do we pick up? How many cats do we --
MS. WHITT: How many we pick up in the city, how
many we pick up in the county, how many adoptions,
euthanized, I mean, all types. Not only will it do that, it
will also help keep track of cruelty cases, which have
increased, so we're having to deal with that a lot more,
~ which takes away from, you know, the Animal Control officers
helping -- being able to help at the office. They're out in
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the field so much more now. But one of my big things is that
I really don't want to do away with the Pet Finder site.
That has really helped us out a lot in adopting out these
animals. It's been a great thing. We've had people from New
York fly to Kerrville to adopt animals. We get people from
all over the state coming to Kerrville to adopt animals that
they've found on the Pet Finder web site.
MR. TROLINGER: And Pet Finder is a national --
worldwide web site, but the point is, it takes a lot of time
to do data entry into these systems. You know, automating
doesn't necessarily mean that we're going to do things a lot
better; sometimes it's -- you know, we're going to provide
the benefit to the public. We're going to adopt out animals
instead of destroy them. So, that's what's she's talking
about when she means she needs somebody in the office to do
this data entry. It just takes more time, something we
haven't done before.
MS. WHITT: You have to take all the pictures of
all the animals to be able to download them and put them on
the site, and there's just a lot that goes into it.
JUDGE TINLEY: We're not talking about adding an
additional employee, correct?
MS. HYDE: No, sir, just part-time. It's a big --
a big hit on part-time, about $11,800 over last year. It's
an increase. It's a large increase in part-time hours.
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JUDGE TINLEY: We're adding the equivalent of a
part-time employee, then?
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Correct?
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
MS. WHITT: Right.
MS. HYDE: Requesting.
JUDGE TINLEY: Equivalent -- essentially add
one-half, right?
MS. WHITT: Correct.
that one?
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. Any more questions on
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. You used the -- you
use the reason because it assists in vacations.
MS. HYDE: Vacations, yes.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Department can't take a
vacation unless we hire somebody new. And you said that
about one of the others. Now, which one was that?
MS. HYDE: Road and Bridge.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Road and Bridge, okay. I
will argue that point the rest of my life, but obviously, I'm
never going to win, 'cause I've been doing it for about 17
years now.
JUDGE TINLEY: Probably getting pretty good at it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I should be, but I haven't
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cracked it yet.
JUDGE TINLEY: What's that going to do to your
overtime out there? Is that going to affect it?
MS. WHITT: I can cut my overtime.
JUDGE TINLEY: I show you have a 2,000 --
MS. WHITT: I had about 1,000, or I'd be willing to
even go less.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What was your question,
Judge?
JUDGE TINLEY: How that would affect the overtime
she's requesting. She says she can reduce it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, yeah, I see.
JUDGE TINLEY: We call that a Letz question.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: Right?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: That works.
JUDGE TINLEY: We got the right answer, didn't we?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, I like that "reduce." I
like that. Good word.
MS. WHITT: I've got a couple of places once I get
to my budget hearing that -- some things that I can probably
go without.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, good. Good, okay. New folks,
in whole or in part?
MS. HYDE: Total full-time new folks is now -- no,
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requesting.
JUDGE TINLEY: Part-time, full-time, whatever. You
got any more?
MS. HYDE: No, sir, not that I know of.
JUDGE TINLEY: What about the Sheriff?
MS. HYDE: He already got it.
JUDGE TINLEY: Asking for half?
', MS. HYDE: He already got his. Y'all approved it
', last meeting, last Commissioners Court.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
MS. HYDE: So it was approved.
JUDGE TINLEY: But that's effectively a -- a new
one-half employee going into this new budget year, even
though --
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
I
', JUDGE TINLEY: -- he got it late this year.
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So, you're talking about net
gain, three and a half.
(Ms. Hyde nodded.)
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Road and Bridge had one
more?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah.
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. I.T., one. Maintenance,
one. Animal Control, one-half. Okay. Any more that we want
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to kick around there, or do we want to go to the next one?
Let's talk about H.R. and personnel policies.
MS. HYDE: I just have the one there.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any elaboration you want to make on
that?
MS. HYDE: I would love for you gentlemen, at your
pleasure, for us to pick the policy book back up. I would
like to request that we have the policy book, at least the
first one. We can keep changing it, but, please, can we get
the first one passed?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What do we lack to get
there?
MS. HYDE: The I.T. that you and I worked on. We
need to represent that. And then anything -- I think we went
over everything the last time.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Got a meeting next Monday.
Jody's working on the agenda.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're saying that as if
we're -- are we supposed to be doing something with it?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, the last thing that
we -- we were supposed to be doing, she and I were going to
get together and do some retooling of the I.T. policy. We
have done that. It needs to come back to the Court for its
review.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. Are you responsible
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for bringing it back to the Court?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Not me. She is.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. Is that true?
MS. HYDE: Sure. Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. All right. See you
MS. HYDE: Want to add it?
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Are you good with that one?
MS. HYDE: I'm good with that one.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to organizational
development.
MS. HYDE: We tried to find ways this year to
obtain CEU's without people having to travel so much. We put
out several things on the web. We sent out e-mails telling
about different places that we could go. We've invited
T.C.D.R.S. and T.A.C. here, which they've increased the
number of conferences and, in turn, training opportunities
for people here. Last year they had two. This year, there's
-- there will be four by October, which means that we don't
have to pay to go somewhere. They're not all the ones that
everyone needs, but it's getting -- it's getting more and
more. So, we have the four T.A.C., the three T.C.D.R.S., the
F.M.L.A. and the F.L.S.A. conference, Incode and Odyssey
~ webinars that we've been sending out e-mails trying to
encourage people to use those. You need a set of speakers
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and you need to set the appointment and just get online, and
it's like a little video, and they train you, and you get to
play with your computer while they're doing it, which is
pretty cool. We're working with elected and appointed
officials at their request, and we're going to continue to do
that next year. We're trying to find more training that we
can do online. There's some stuff that -- that we found from
different web sites; for example, the Open Meetings Act. I
think that, based on what the Attorney General said -- and
Rex isn't here, so I can't get him to help me, but you're
supposed to be trained on that every year. You can do it
online, and they -- you get to print a little certificate. I
did it this weekend; it takes an hour. You get to listen to
them. There's him and a lady, and then some of their little
actors. But it takes an hour, and you get to print out your
little certificate, and it's supposed to be posted or filed
somewhere for the public to be able to see. He's also got
Open Records, which you can go online and do your training
online. So, I'm searching to see what other types of
training that we can do online, get our little certificate,
and not leave our home, or even at work as well. And it's
free.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Who all's required to do the
Open Meetings and Open Records?
MS. HYDE: Well, I'd rather Rex said that. The way
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it sounds is in 2006, they made a change, and that you're
supposed to go through the training every year.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I know that we are.
MS. HYDE: They were talking -- do you?
(Low-voice discussion off the record.)
MS. UECKER: Open Records Act doesn't apply to
~ regular --
MS. HYDE: Not Open Records. Public meetings.
MS. UECKER: Same thing.
MS. PIEPER: It applies to me, because I have
public records.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. Open Meetings Act
just applies to this body, I think.
MS. HYDE: I think.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we run across that --
that class somewhere every once in a while.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. We've done it
twice at least.
MS. UECKER: Are you talking about Open Meetings or
Public Information Act?
MS. HYDE: Two different ones. Open Meetings, you
go to the Greg Abbott web site, watch it, print out your
little thing, and you're done.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Boy, I really would like to
see us move in that direction, because if these meetings that
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we go to -- if they're not going to get like Linda Uecker
does it, I'm not going to them any more; I don't give a damn
what they say. I'm just not going to do that any more.
That's just --
MS. HYDE: They don't have Buzzy's barbecue?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Don't have Buzzy's barbecue.
MS. UECKER: I didn't do Buzzy's barbecue.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Linda does the meetings
right. They sit down there and they have a meeting, and with
an instructor there talking, and when it comes lunchtime,
they sit down and eat and this guy keeps talking, and they
get it done, knock it out. And they don't go out and play
golf and tennis and be stupid.
MS. UECKER: Nine hours a day.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Pool.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Pool -- yeah, pool players,
sharks.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Golfing tournaments.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Golf tournaments. Pitiful.
Absolutely pitiful, and a waste of taxpayers' money. I'm
going with Linda from now on.
MS. UECKER: September the lst out at the Y.O.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Golf tournament?
MS. HYDE: I don't think they play golf at the Y.O.
ed training this year. We did bloodborne
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', pathogens, sexual harassment, working together, understanding
our differences, finding unit diversity, ethics in the
workplace, understanding security principles for leadership,
managing conflict, employee documentation, progressive
discipline, and methods set -- or resetting expectations and
responsibilities, and that was under individual offices.
Immunizations, of course, we went through and got the courses
and certifications so that we can purchase and oversee the
vaccination process for the county, which saves us some
money. And I didn't realize -- to be honest, I didn't
realize how much it would save us regarding our health
benefit, but it's helped us on our health benefit, major
medical. Influenza, we get every year. This will be the
second year, at no cost to employees. And when I say that,
what I mean -- I can see the Judge wrinkling his head at me.
When you go to the doctor to get your flu shot, if you go to
the doctor, it costs you a $30 co-pay, but the total bill
might be 60 bucks, and that goes into our major medical, and
they pay it at a reduced rate, but they still pay 50 bucks.
It costs us five bucks an employee.
~~ COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are we going to have the --
what do you call it -- swine flu vaccine?
MS. HYDE: They're saying there's not a true swine
flu vaccine, per se, at this point. The C.D.C. has --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Did you -- it was on the radio.
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MS. HYDE: I understand that, but the C.D.C. says
that it isn't in a pandemic right at this point, not because
of what it's doing, but the amount that's going on. But they
said it would be another 6 to 18 months before they have one,
and they probably won't even have enough for everybody,
because then we'll have the chicken flu or something.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Chicken flu.
MS. HYDE: I did request this year for the
influenza vaccines, to go ahead and do the second shot, the
second series of the Hep A-B shots, the rest of the
employees. And then I'm asking for tetanus vaccinations as
well. Tetanus and Hep are on 10-year cycles, so once they're
immunized, then we're talking 10 years before we'd have that
sort of cost again.
JUDGE TINLEY: Talking about tetanus for all
employees?
MS. HYDE: If they need them. If they need them.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Who can remember when you had
your last tetanus shot?
MS. HYDE: There you go.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Only get one every time I
step on a nail.
MS. HYDE: Well, if you read, sir, it doesn't
really -- that's not the biggest reason in how you get it.
That's why I put it in there. It's in the ground. It's in
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the ground, so if you step barefoot on the ground, you might
need to get a tetanus. I'm kidding. I'm kidding, but it is
in the ground.
(Low-voice discussion off the record.)
MS. HYDE: South Texas Blood Center, they've been
here twice now. It's exciting; we get a lot of public people
come in as well. They see us, you know, right out here out
in front. Tim does a good job of helping to cut that -- that
area off so that they can come in. We've been training on
the benefit package. It seems that people are doing much
better at understanding the benefits and how to use them. We
are reducing cost. Workers comp, third year in a row, we've
been able to reduce our cost. 2007 and '08, it was 39 cent.
2008-'09 is 28 cent, and then 2009 and '10 is 18 cent.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Good reduction.
JUDGE TINLEY: Nice reduction.
MS. HYDE: So we want to continue working with
this. We had our safety meeting this morning, and the Judge
told me could I add something, in a nice way, so I'd like to
add it. I'd like to request $5,000 to $10,000 for the safety
committee and needs that we might need this year. Was that a
laugh when I said it?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: He was taking a picture of you.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've got you now.
MS. HYDE: When we talked about --
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You got somebody.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What did you say? Actually,
that was my heart. You said something about you need more
money for something?
MS. HYDE: I'd like to request $5,000, $10,000 for
the safety committee.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: What are you going to do, go to
Hawaii? Or --
MS. HYDE: I'm sorry?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Hawaii? Why do they need
$5, 000?
MS. HYDE: Oh, I wish.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: For a seminar in Vegas.
MS. HYDE: We do need some training materials. It
does cost money, a little bit of money. I think that lOK is
probably high. I was just saying five to ten that so that
maybe y'all would say five is okay. I think five --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Keep talking; we'll get it
~ to 2,500.
JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Hyde, I recall you saying that,
you know, if we're going to do this right on this safety,
we're going to need a little money.
MS. HYDE: Right.
JUDGE TINLEY: I don't remember hearing a five or
ten figure.
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MS. HYDE: I didn't say that to you. I just said
JUDGE TINLEY: Oh. Lest you leave the impression
MS. HYDE: Oh, no. I didn't say a dollar amount to
the Judge; I just told him money. But --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is for materials?
Training materials?
MS. HYDE: Training materials. Some of this stuff
that we can get, we can get free. I mean, I'm a proponent of
freebie. But some of it, we're going to have to purchase.
M.S.D.S. We do need to do M.S.D.S. As everyone learned last
Friday, in --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: What is M.S.D.S.?
MS. HYDE: That's when you label for hazmat. We
need to do hazcom. That is required training, federal and
state. We need to do that this year. We also have
bloodborne pathogens; that's required federal and state. We
did it this year. We didn't do it to everybody, but we did
it, which we get our check. But we need to incorporate --
M.S.D.S. is when you put all your labels on any cleaning
supplies, anything that can be or could be poisonous or toxic
or a health contaminant. It sometimes is silly, and
sometimes it's frustrating, but -- until you get poisoned or
a kid gets poisoned or something falls down dead and you
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don't know why. That's why they want it. If there's -- in
case of fire, we want to know what chemicals and compounds
are in that area. Are they going to blow up? Are they
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Madness never ends.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think that would be a
smart thing to let the fire department know about.
MS. HYDE: Absolutely. When we talked about safety
this morning, some things that we've talked about is we kind
of need an evacuation plan. That might cost us a little bit
to make the big evacuation plan posters. So, I don't know
how much something like that costs, but I know it's not free,
and I know Tim and I can't draw them.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Letz.
MS. HYDE: They'd be cute. Tim and I would do a
good job; they'd be cute, but I don't think that they'd meet
what we need.
MR. BOLLIER: May not explain --
MS. HYDE: "You're here. Get out." You know, that
doesn't quite work.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Someone said 2,500.
MS. HYDE: No, sir, because we also talked about
the -- we also talked about that right now, in our vehicles,
we don't have emergency packs. We don't have anything in
those vehicles. We should have, you know, certain things
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that most of us probably have ir_ our personal vehicles, like
MS. UECKER: Flashlight.
MS. HYDE: Flashlight. You got a camera. You've
got the paperwork you need so that you can report the
accident or injury correctly.
AUDIENCE: First aid kit.
MS. HYDE: First aid kit. You guys are doing
great. I'm so tickled. So --
AUDIENCE: Fire extinguisher.
MS. HYDE: Fire extinguisher for sure. There's
certain little things -- I'm still ticking it up -- for five
grand. We would come before you before we spent anything.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Where is this in your notes?
MS. HYDE: It's not. It's one of the additionals.
I don't know that it would go on my budget. Would it? Oh,
yeah, okay. Sorry. Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Training materials.
MS. HYDE: Okay.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Employee training.
JUDGE TINLEY: Safety materials.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Employee training.
MS. HYDE: We have a line item for safety, so we
can keep it separate so that there's no merging of the --
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MS. HARGIS: We can create one.
MS. HYDE: Jeannie says she can create a safety
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
MS. HYDE: And, to be honest and fair, the shots
and all aren't in my budget. They're in 10-409-483, is where
they're showing.
MS. HARGIS: Nondepartmental.
MS. HYDE: Nondepartmental.
MS. HARGIS: 37,000.
MS. HYDE: Do y'all want step and grades?
JUDGE TINLEY: Are we through with the issues under
organizational development? Step and grade, I think probably
the important thing that we need to do is talk about all of
the policy-mandated adjustments have been made in the step
and grade.
MS. HYDE: Oh. Oh, okay. I misunderstood what you
asked for.
JUDGE TINLEY: Personnel costs.
MS. HYDE: Within the budget, yes, sir. When I did
the payroll -- and each time we get up and each time someone
else gets up, I'm going to request that they look at it very
closely. I did all the educational increases, longevity
increases, anything that -- that they were supposed to get.
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JUDGE TINLEY: And the estimated personnel cost
you.
JUDGE TINLEY: It's approximately --
MS. HYDE: 437,000. If you include --
JUDGE TINLEY: 450, roughly.
MS. HYDE: -- payroll, FICA, and retirement? Is
that what you're asking?
JUDGE TINLEY: The roll-ups. That's exactly what
I'm asking.
MS. HYDE: It ended up being 437, 457.
MS. HARGIS: 47.
MS. HYDE: 447.
JUDGE TINLEY: I was figuring roughly 450,000.
MS. HYDE: 447,000 is what I came up with. And
that does not include -- and it does not include Juvenile
Probation, Airport, District Judges, District Judges' staffs,
D.A. Curry, D.A. Barton, 216th, C.S.C.D., 'cause I don't --
we don't do those; those are special funds. They're special
fundings, so those are not inclusive. Those are
pass-throughs, so to speak.
JUDGE TINLEY: The important point that I want to
make to the Court is that we've got close to a half million
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dollars in -- in mandated personnel costs that --
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
JUDGE TINLEY: Additional, that we're going to need
to find a way to handle.
MS. HYDE: That does include -- Judge, that does
include all the requested new positions.
MS. HARGIS: Except for Tim.
MS. HYDE: Except for Tim's, because I didn't know
about it till yesterday. So, it includes that. It includes
the three new full-timers in there; it includes their
benefits. And this is your longevities and your educations.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: What does our tax numbers look
like?
MS. HARGIS: Tax numbers? Diane?
MS. BOLIN: I'm sorry?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tax numbers, property tax
values. Level? Up?
MS. BOLIN: They're up 2 percent.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 2 percent?
MS. BOLIN: Basically the same as last year because
of our new over-65's.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And what's that translate to in
dollars? Half a million?
JUDGE TINLEY: Pretty close to that. Between
400,000 and 500,000, isn't it, tax dollars?
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MS. BOLIN: Yes.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Seems to me that we're --
depending on how that policy goes forward, the step and the
years and the growth, that -- that I'm not sure we're going
to be able to afford some of our built-in increases, unless
the growth starts picking up again. We're going to be --
from the numbers they just said, I mean, the -- that right
there is just enough to cover only our mandated -- or
policy-mandated increases.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, when this conversation
first started, you said policy-mandated.
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And then we got into new
hires, and the number was a half million.
JUDGE TINLEY: 440-something, and when you roll the
-- the one maintenance in there, you're at a half million.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can we -- I thought we were
-- can we roll all the new hires out?
JUDGE TINLEY: Sure.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And just talk about the
policy-mandated. Now, what -- what kind of number is that?
JUDGE TINLEY: Find a ballpark.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm looking at it a little
bit different from you. If it really got down to crunching
pennies, I would look at the new hires before I would the
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not looking to, really,
this as much as I am looking forward. I mean, we've been
fortunate to have any growth in values in this community
compared to what a lot of communities across the country have
seen, and I think we need to be kind of looking at where
we're going to be going long-term, because I think the -- the
period of growth like we had for the last five years isn't
going to happen in the next five years, and we need to start
planning, in my mind, for that, and making sure we're not
getting ourselves over a barrel.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Going to be much slower the
next three to five years.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. And I don't -- you
know, and I agree. I think you need to look at it, but I
think we -- we set that policy when things were blowing and
going. And, you know, I'd love to be able to keep it going,
but at the same time, we have other things -- computers and
other things we have to buy, and I think we may need to look
at that, and it may be that we have to go to a -- every four
years you get an automatic increase, you know. We just got
to look at it.
MS. BOLIN: There is going to be one other thing
that we're going to have to take into consideration, but it's
III not going to affect this year's budget, that new -- sort of
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new 100 percent exemption for veterans. When I spoke to the
Appraisal District about it, they said that it is going to
have a substantial impact, but it will not be this year.
Maybe next year a little more, as the word gets out and the
qualifications get out. But that because of our area, it is
going to have an impact on us.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Totally disabled are going to
I be zero.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They get taken off the tax
MS. BOLIN: Correct.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, for a homestead.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: For homestead.
JUDGE TINLEY: Right.
MS. BOLIN: They will pay no taxes.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. When's that become
I effective?
MS. BOLIN: It became effective June 19th.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But it will impact us 2011.
MS. BOLIN: Yes.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, it's the same story
we've been through some years ago. Whenever you -- whenever
your values start to stabilize, and all that coupled with the
65 and over exemptions, this is going to be a hard time in
the next couple years. And next year, I feel like that we're
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going	to be --	we'll be	lucky to be -- to have any increase
in tax	value -	- taxable	value.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that's why I'm trying to
look ahead a year, saying, okay, you know, yes, the policy we
mandated, I certainly support, but we got to make sure we can
afford the policy. We don't want to get ourselves in a bind.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And our reserve's already lower
than --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Our reserves are low, and we
also have -- you know, we just -- some of the costs you can't
help, but we are going to have to really look hard at what's
absolutely necessary to provide service, because the
alternative is much worse -- would be much worse on
everybody.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the over-65 tax freeze
continues to chip away. You know, we're having less effect
from that now because some of those properties are rolling,
~ so they're coming up. But --
~i, COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It will stabilize somewhat
within the next year or two, I think.
JUDGE TINLEY: One of the other things that there's
been considerable discussion about is some of the items in
this budget are capital items, and those items are more
readily handled -- capital assets last over a period of time;
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amortize that cost over several years. And when it comes to
looking at your rollback rate, you're really penalizing --
can get yourself into trouble if you don't have some debt in
your -- in your budget. And we -- we're rolling off a lot of
debt. You heard the -- the outside auditor talk about how
there are a lot of local governments that would love to be in
the balance sheet position that we're in, and that debt is
going to roll off -- our major debt, long-term -- I say
"long-term"; most of it's short-term -- is going to start
rolling off one a year for the next four years. So, --
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's going to be --
JUDGE TINLEY: -- what I'm going to strongly
recommend is that we move all these capital items over and
handle those as a separate issue, and not take those out of
the general fund. And I think that's going to let us have
more freedom to handle the things that we need to handle.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Also mitigates against the
rollback.
JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, yeah. Yeah.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Couldn't agree with you more.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. I think we've got to do that,
or we'll -- we're really going to see ourselves in a bad
situation.
25 ~ COMMISSIONER LETZ: We started it last year, and
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just continuing that policy.
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: As long as we don't have any
big long-term debt that's coming on, it works very well. You
just roll it out over five years and keep it running. And,
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Able to do things and pay for
things --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Pretty --
COMMISSIONER	OEHLER: -	- pretty	quickly.
COMMISSIONER	WILLIAMS:	I just	clipped this for
everybody's benefit, but I also learned today that Bexar
County Commissioners Court is, by policy, having no
increases, and no freeze on salary. I think Comal County's
doing the same thing, I learned today. And there may have
been one other count in the re ion alread has indicated
Y g Y
that -- freezes to be eliminated this year, and freeze --
i
~', hiring freezes. So, things are happening within our
geography.
JUDGE TINLEY: But the four debt issues that we've
got, one rolls off next year, another one rolls off the
following year, and they -- one a year.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
JUDGE TINLEY: And --
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, basically, in four years,
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we're debt free right now.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's wonderful.
JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, yeah. Yeah, it is. Like I say,
the -- there's a lot of local governments that would kill for
a balance sheet position like that. Total debt's about
$6 million. A little under, actually. Pretty nice.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mm-hmm.
JUDGE TINLEY: But that will give us some -- some
ability to handle some of these other items.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's the total capital items
in our current budget?
MS. HARGIS: In --
13
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: Or the recommended, I should
MS. HARGIS: The requested is 733,643 in the
general fund. And the Road and Bridge and Juvenile Detention
and D.A., it's 271,100.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: About a million.
I~ MS. HARGIS: For a million, four, yeah.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That will help tremendously.
JUDGE TINLEY: Sure.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It'll help us do some things
to prepare for next year and the year after, 'cause we need
'I to be -- there's a two-year downturn normally before you
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start your growth again. Maybe it won't hit. I'm hoping I'm
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Pretty much did hit.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else out there?
MS. HARGIS: The one other item that we talked
about, Judge, was the Indigent Health Care.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. As -- as we all know, our
indigent health care situation has improved considerably. We
budgeted slightly over a million dollars. The total
expenditure out of that is going to be less than $500,000,
and by shifting a half million dollars there; i.e., the
excess, and reducing the upcoming year's budget for indigent
health care down by that amount, I think they'll be well
within what they need for their expenditures, and that also
gives us a pretty nice little breather. That's going to be
another major component to help us get through this.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I was in hopes that would --
that would work that way.
MS. HARGIS: They're currently at 440,881, and we
have a packet to come to you, but it's about $3,000. We have
three more patients that we found that can go to Social
Security, so we'll get a refund from those. I really feel
like 500, 550 is what they're going to to come out at. If we
can reduce it by at least 500,000 we can shift -- do some
shifting there with revenue, and that would give us a big
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budget they put in here was a little -- even a little greater
than last year, and they're not -- right now, they -- the
prior year, before we put that program into place, we spent
932. Right now, they have 592,000 they haven't spent. So,
Rosa's not here, but I feel like it's -- that she would
probably agree with us.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, that's what's going to get
plugged in, because they've got it down where it's operating
within that range. And bearing in mind, of course, that
we've -- we're looking at up to 6 percent of general --
general fund tax levy. But with what -- with what they've
done down there during the past year, it's -- it just keeps
getting better, and they're getting more recoupments, and at
the time same, when they get recoupments based upon Social
Security Disability, that, of course, takes that person out
of the mix.
MS. HARGIS: Not only out of the mix, but they get
a refund up to six months.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Here's the number on dam --
dam repairs I promised you.
JUDGE TINLEY: Oh. You would have to bring that
one out, wouldn't you?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, just thought I'd trot
~ that little bugger out before it's too late, Judge. Only
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MS. HARGIS: Commissioner Williams and I talked
about this. I haven't talked with Commissioner Oehler, but
we feel like we would probably put this in the capital
projects, since it is a capital project; it would be
considered such along with the engineering for this project.
JUDGE TINLEY: Is that both dams?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Both dams.
JUDGE TINLEY: Both dams, okay.
MS. HARGIS: That way, I think there's a -- an
agreement here that we need to do them consecutively so we
can save money on bringing equipment and things of that
nature out. Is that true?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well --
MS. HARGIS: We're going to try to do that.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: There are some economies by
taking on both dams at the same time. The mobilization
costs, essentially, --
JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- are less -- less than if
you have to do one and go away, and then come back and do
another one.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think another -- just an area
that needs to be considered with the capital items or with
that is the airport, 'cause there's -- I don't know that
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MS. HARGIS: We haven't.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: But their capital projects for
the next couple of years are pretty hefty, and then it trails
off to virtually nothing.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: And it's -- and from the
current -- the board's projecting out through the next ten
years. It's pretty much 2010, 2011, then it just drops off.
They don't see a lot more expenditures out there.
JUDGE TINLEY: What is that one?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, that's just the -- the
operating number, but we're talking more on the capital.
They have a -- they have to do a new airport master plan.
That's kind of required by TexDOT. That's about 150,000, I
think.
MS. HARGIS: 175.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: 175. They've got the --
there's a taxiway project that they'd like to do to get
taxiways built up, kind of out behind, so they can start
trying to develop it. And there's another T-hangar project
that's on the board for -- and some of these may be 2011.
Then the other -- and all those I support as funding our
part. The one that I have a little bit of heartburn with is
the water extension project, which is probably about a
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$600,000 project. The City has made their position known, I
think, on the E.I.C. funding. The water project, I have --
my problem with -- the reason for the heartburn is, it's
absolutely necessary to have that done out there, but that is
-- everything else is fifty-fifty owned. We will never own
half of that water system. That's a City-owned utility, and
I have a problem with the County having to pay their part of
improving the city utility, which they will then collect
revenue off of their hookups. So, I have a little bit of a
problem on that. But on the rest of it, I would support
putting -- really, almost the next two years, I'd like to
front-load that a little bit, do it at one time and give the
Airport Board the opportunity to -- while they're doing a lot
of other projects out there, there may be some economies, and
get the same contractors to do some of that, and do it all in
one year.
MS. HARGIS: Yeah. I was talking with Josh
probably about 6:15 last night, and he still didn't have a
good, firm number, so -- to give me besides the 315.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right.
MS. HARGIS: So -- and keep in mind, next year we
II take on a larger percentage of that. The library I brought
down the 100,000, and we do take on more for Animal Control,
but not the full this year. I thought it was the full, but
it's not. We do take on the full of the Animal Control the
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following year. This year, we still get 25 percent from
COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're off the hook for the
$6 million library.
MS. HARGIS: Thank goodness.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Don't speak too soon. You
never know.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm not -- as far as the
airport's concerned, I'm not over there with Dave Nicholson
quite yet, but now he's wanting to sell -- wants us to sell
it. But I'm moving over there pretty goddern quick. We got
to stop spending money out there at some point. That -- I
know that everybody can see how that's the hub of the
community, but I don't see it.
JUDGE TINLEY: One other major capital outlay item
that we're investigating now is the Adult Probation facility.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tinley Hall? (Laughter.)
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I didn't realize you had it
in you.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: You came up with the idea.
JUDGE TINLEY: I'm going to store that one away,
Jon. Everyone talks about my memory being very faulty. I
assure you, it will last a long time.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Come back to the way at some
~ point.
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COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that synonomous with Taj
I Mahal?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought it had a good ring to
I it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It does. But you need to
misspell his name, though. Tinsley. Tinsley Hall.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. I forgot who came up with
I that one.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't know. I saw it in
the paper, I think.
JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. But that's being looked at
I now.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Good project, Judge. Good
~ project.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the Sheriff thinks it is.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I guess so.
JUDGE TINLEY: He managed to attach himself fairly
strongly to it.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Attached himself? He put
himself right in the middle of it.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: He may be a little delayed in
getting space.
JUDGE TINLEY: There may be some thinking that the
finish-out portion would be limited to the probation, and if
the Sheriff wants to occupy some of his, he can figure out a
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way to finish it.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The rest of the people --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I tell you, it just amazes
me, this game called politics. We started that building out
there with the thought of probation, and we talked about it
one day, and it turned into the Sheriff's office somehow. I
just think -- isn't that -- that's a work of art.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Isn't architecture
wonderful?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's incredible how he did
COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. Is that it?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. We're selling the
airport, and what else? And no salary increases. Did I hear
that?
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Because San Antonio and New
Braunfels are not --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I just gave it to you for
your information, that's all.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the salary increases we
gave last year were generous, and I think this year they're
minimal. I don't know if I'd say none. I don't know, but I
think the data that -- isn't that from you, Eva?
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
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COMMISSIONER LETZ: If I can read it right, which
is not simple with these things, it shows that it's -- C.P.I.
is negative at the moment.
MS. HYDE: Still negative 1.99, but if you look at
the trend, it is coming up. It is coming up; it should be
back -- it should be back -- August or September, it should
I be back at zero.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, if it's a negative and
we tie -- we tie ourselves to some index and it's negative,
salary away.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, I just -- Eva told me to
say that. And I floated it out there. It didn't go over --
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Didn't go very far. That
won't work. I only gave you that information just because it
was passed on to me.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I appreciate that, Bill.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, that -- of course, one, we
have a negative downturn in the economy. You try and, number
one, preserve the number of employees and see if you can
maintain them at their current level.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mm-hmm.
JUDGE TINLEY: And that's kind of an optimum
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COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mm-hmm.
JUDGE TINLEY: Do you have anything else for us on
all these various personnel-type items, Ms. Hyde? I
shouldn't have asked that last question, should I, Buster?
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You shouldn't have.
MS. HYDE: I asked for the dollars for safety. I
would also like for y'all to consider a reimbursement. We
talked a little bit about the health plans. We'd like to put
in for a reimbursement for health and safety. A couple of
~I things, if we can get people to just -- on weight, lose some
weight and get into a little bit better shape, it might be --
I didn't say you.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Suck it up, Tim.
(Laughter.)
MR. BOLLIER: I was sucking it up. I was trying.
MS. HYDE: We might be able to do some things.
Weight, blood pressure, cholesterol, some of the screenings
that we did this year. So, we were looking at perhaps
requesting a reimbursement to employees that go and work out
and get fit, twenty bucks a month, if they can prove that
they've gone at least two hours a week, two different days a
week. Some people disagree and say no, probably not, 'cause
some people just walk themselves. Well, some people don't
have that kind of willpower. Some people don't know what to
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do, and so they do go and work out. So, perhaps another
thing that y'all could consider is reimbursing employees $20
a month if they go and they get fit, and we should see -- we
should see gains in our medical.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, how -- see, I like
that. I like all of the -- all the above. There's a neat
plan in there somewhere. I'm going to go down to the health
spa and -- and pay my membership dues, and have for years,
and haven't been down there in a long time. (Laughter.) And
that's what's going to happen here. And then the employees
go down there, and they go down there and Eddie Sears signs
that they've been in the building, and so we know they've
been there. We need to give them $20. That doesn't -- that
does absolutely nothing, until they come back here and we put
a measuring tape around their stomach or something.
MS. HYDE: Mm-hmm.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There's got to be some way
to measure this thing. Just going down there, I mean, hell,
that's not going to do anything. There's got to be a way to
actually measure -- and, you know, I don't know what that is.
I have no idea.
MS. HYDE: We can do before and after pictures.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Before and after pictures
would -- may be a good way. I don't know what to do. But
don't you think that it has to be based on some kind of --
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MS. UECKER: Success.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- success? "Success" is a
great word.
MS. HYDE: Six-pack.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I tell you what, we can make
the other half of that building -- you know, it'll be Adult
Probation on one end, and the part that is designated at a
future date for the Sheriff can be a workout facility, and we
can get us a person over there -- hire somebody to go and
instruct our employees.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And if you don't work out,
you get fired. How's that? Now, there's an incentive.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh, now, I don't think I want
to go there.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm just trying to find some
I incentive.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's an incentive.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Work out or get fired? Is
I that --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, that one doesn't work
I either.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No traction.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But I really hope we get to
do something like that.
MS. HYDE: I mean, they can't prove or disprove --
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I'm not a doctor, and I'm -- no offense; I don't want to
measure everybody.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, now, Tim and I need to
challenge each other to lose 25 pounds in the next month and
a half or something.
MS. WHITT: We know the trainer.
MR. BOLLIER: I got a good idea.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You have an idea?
MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Uh-oh.
MR. BOLLIER: We go down to the dog park...
(Laughter.) We can turn that into a little track, run the
dogs out.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Will that be before or
after you clean it up?
MR. BOLLIER: Well, sir, I think we'll need to
clean it up a little bit first.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that leash or off-leash?
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That was the next question.
JUDGE TINLEY: Well, we've got a little slippage
I here.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. I'm leaving.
JUDGE TINLEY: Any more personnel-related items
that you have, Ms. Hyde?
MS. HYDE: Just one, and I'm done.
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JUDGE TINLEY: Here again, I asked the wrong
MS. HYDE: I just wanted to -- to reiterate, I
guess, or discuss for y'all's future discussion topic,
there's been some questions about who all do we do payroll
and benefits and things for. And I'd like to go ahead and
bring it up and throw it out there, and if I get hit, I get
hit. But we do about 268 true-blue Kerr County employees.
That's our cost.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 268, okay.
MS. HYDE: However, comma, we do, in H.R., District
Judges and their staffs, we do D.A. Curry, D.A. Barton, the
two -- the Extension Office, the J.P.O., and Adult Probation.
Now, the difference between the Adult Probation and 216th and
the rest of them is that we do not only their payroll; we do
their medical benefits, their supplementals, their AXA, their
457 plan. We do everything. Sometimes that's a little
sticky wicket, 'cause they don't really work for us, but it's
supposed to be like a reimbursement with all these. It helps
us on our cost sometimes, because, you know, we've got that
300 employees or plus that you guys see within the insurance
', and things.
~~ COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That includes the Adult
Probation?
MS. HYDE: It includes all those folks that I just
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I named off.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Ard probably airport.
MS. HYDE: Oh, yeah, and we got that too at the
~ airport.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now --
MS. HYDE: So --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, that's 216th Adult
Probation and 198th Adult Probation?
MS. HYDE: No, sir, we don't do the 198th. I've
never touched the 198th in our cffice that I know of.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: May I ask you why?
MS. HYDE: They don't want us to do it. They have
somebody else do it.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. So, they -- they are
getting the proper authorities probably to do it instead of
the county taxpayers. That's just -- that was me. Go ahead.
MS. HYDE: So, that's it. I mean, I don't know if
y'all all knew that, or recognize that. But --
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's see, two -- two
District Judges and staffs.
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 216th Adult Probation.
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No 198th. And -- run that
by me again?
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101
MS. HYDE: 198th D.A. staff. Okay, 198th D.A. and
staff. 216th D.A. staff.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: D.A. staff.
MS. HYDE: Extension Office.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Extension Office.
MS. HARGIS: That's part of the general fund.
MS. HYDE: But it's also TAMU employees. And then
we have the J.P.O.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: TAMU employees. Who is that
I last one?
MS. HYDE: Juvenile Probation.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I almost see Juvenile
Probation as our people -- folks. Extension Office. How
many is out there? How many Texas A & M employees do we take
care of?
MS. HYDE: Two.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Two?
MS. HARGIS: Two.
I, COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 268 real, live county
employees. And then nobody knows how many of these other
folks.
MS. HYDE: Yes, sir, it's in the position schedule.
We can -- we got it counted up. It takes us over 300.
JUDGE TINLEY: What your suggestion is, is that for
those who we're not directly responsible for, maybe there
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102
should be some appropriate per-employee charge for taking
care of these various personnel services?
MS. HYDE: Well, I brought that up three years ago.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm suggesting that, yeah.
MS. HYDE: I was looking at maybe an administration
charge or just -- just to remind y'all that there's -- there
are some others that we deal with as well.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: What would that charge -- what
is, in your mind, a reasonable administration charge?
MS. HYDE: Honest -- honest injun, you know, my gut
three years ago was I said 5 percent, which is a little bit
high, but 1 to 2 percent -- 1 to 2 percent of total cost.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we could discontinue the
service and find out real quick how much that is.
COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How much it's worth.
COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, how much it's worth.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, 1 percent of the payroll
amount?
MS. HYDE: I mean, you could make it 1 percent of
the payroll. I would probably do 1 percent of total cost,
total pass-through cost. But I would also like, you know,
Jeannie to weigh in on this as well. I mean, she's done some
stuff like this as well.
MS. HARGIS: I'd have to look at it. I never
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thought about it.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sounds reasonable to me to look
at it. I mean --
MS. HYDE: I don't know if you can do that.
JUDGE TINLEY: In terms of total dollars, I'd be
interested in knowing what that was.
COMMISSIONER LETZ: Be interested to know what 1 or
2 percent of that total -- how much that generated, see if
that's a worthwhile number to pursue.
JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else, Ms. Hargis?
MS. HARGIS: No.
JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's fold it up, folks. Bet
Kathy's getting tired over here.
(Budget workshop was adjourned at 4:15 p.m.)
STATE OF TEXAS ~
COUNTY OF KERR ~
The above and foregoing is a true and complete
transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as
County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County,
Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth.
DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 19th day of August,
2009.
JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk
BY: __ ~G ______ _____ _
Kathy B ik, Deputy County Clerk
Certified Shorthand Reporter
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