1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Budget Workshop 10 Wednesday, July 25, 2001 11 9:30 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 PRESENT: FREDERICK L. HENNEKE, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 23 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 LARRY GRIFFIN, Commissioner Pct. 4 24 ABSENT: *JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 * (Absent for morning session only.) 2 1 I N D E X July 25, 2001 2 PAGE 3 Budget Workshop 4 9:30 a.m. County Treasurer 3 5 10:00 a.m. County Clerk 9 Elections 9 6 Records Management 20 General Budget 28 7 County Auditor 49 8 9 11:00 a.m. County Tax Assessor/Collector 51 10 1:30 p.m. District Clerk 66 11 216th & 198th Jury 78 12 Maintenance 88 13 Environmental Health 96 14 Road & Bridge 114 15 J.P. 1 157 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 3 1 On Wednesday, July 25, 2001, at 9:30 a.m., a budget 2 workshop of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: It's 9:30 in the morning on 8 Wednesday, July 25th, and we'll convene this recurring 9 budget workshop session of the Kerr County Commissioners 10 Court. The topic for discussion first this morning is the 11 Kerr County Treasurer's office. Barbara Nemec. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What tab, Judge? 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 11. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: It is 11, yes. What do you 15 have to tell us, Barbara? 16 MS. NEMEC: Okay. I guess we'll go down to 17 postage. That's the first item that's changing on my 18 budget. All the rest, I think, is something that we'll 19 address later. Is that correct, as far as salaries and all 20 that? 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Right. 22 MS. NEMEC: So, my postage, I increased that 23 a little bit. I am running short this year. Same goes for 24 office supplies. What I did last year was I tried to stay 25 within the same budget as the year before, and -- in hopes 4 1 that I could try to make it work, but as y'all can see with 2 budget amendments and stuff, that's not working, so that's 3 the increase there. Notices, also. It costs more to print 4 the notice for the Unclaimed Properties report in the 5 newspaper, so I've increased that $100. Down to 6 conferences. I'm just -- 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Hold up. On Notices, 8 it shows you don't have anything in there this year. 9 MS. NEMEC: Okay. I had $500, and I had to 10 move that into other line item that I was short on. So, 11 we've -- we just didn't print the Notice this year. Which I 12 should, but I didn't. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 14 MS. NEMEC: Conferences, I have increased 15 that a couple hundred. Conferences are just getting 16 further -- and I -- I usually don't go to the September 17 conference. I've been to it once since I've been here. I 18 just didn't get any educational hours out of it, so I just 19 would not go to it. But now I'm starting to go to that one 20 because now they're offering investment hours, which I need, 21 and so that's the reason for the increase there. I do plan 22 on -- anytime I can get investment hours, I -- I try to go. 23 So, that's something I'll probably start going to that I 24 didn't used to. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Your comment here is 5 1 that the State is requiring more hours. Actually more 2 hours, or new subjects? 3 MS. NEMEC: Well, new subjects, and we've 4 been told -- and I don't know if it passed or not, but we 5 usually need 20 hours every other year, as far as the 6 Treasurer's; not the investment part of it. We've been told 7 that we're going to need 20 hours a year now. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They doubled it? 9 MS. NEMEC: Mm-hmm. 10 MS. PIEPER: I think that was signed. 11 MS. NEMEC: Was it signed? 12 MS. PIEPER: I think it was. 13 MS. NEMEC: So that was another reason for 14 that small increase there. Okay. Computer supplies -- you 15 know, we just have ribbons and stuff that are real 16 expensive, and the cost has just gone up, so I doubled that, 17 because we really are short this year. And, that's about 18 it. With doing all that, I come up with $2,000 over last 19 year's budget, which I thought was pretty good. And then 20 right below, on the second page, there's the same 21 explanations that I've given y'all. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any questions? Do you think 23 you really need to double your computer supplies? 24 MS. NEMEC: Well, already -- and this was -- 25 this was printed out in June, and I had already spent 6 1 $1,140. And we just had to order some more ribbons, and I'm 2 transferring money from Lease Copiers to cover that this 3 next time we come to court. So, I would say so. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Would you -- could 7 you -- I mean, I don't know what kind of printer she has, 8 but would it be possible -- or is there an option to look at 9 a larger, better printer that doesn't use as much ribbon or 10 it doesn't use as many supplies and you save in the long 11 run? 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah, is that a dot 13 matrix printer that you have? 14 MS. NEMEC: What is it, Tommy? 15 MR. TOMLINSON: It's the biggest dot matrix 16 that Okidata makes. 17 MS. NEMEC: It's wonderful. We used to work 18 with that little printer that we just print receipts on, 19 and -- oh, gosh, it was -- every payroll, every accounts 20 payable, it was a mess. We would end up using more checks 21 because they would be destroyed. We haven't had any 22 problems with this. 23 MR. TOMLINSON: This equipment -- it's 24 equivalent to a line printer. 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Okay. Probably not 7 1 much of any way you could save by a capital investment on 2 that. It's the sheer volume of printing, for one thing, 3 that's the problem. 4 MS. NEMEC: And that's another thing, too; 5 that we're just doing so much more. You know, work 6 increases every year, and we're just using it a lot more. 7 So many more reports to print. Every time we turn around, 8 we're having to send some report to the State. You know, it 9 all adds up. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And we got the feds 11 using some of those printers they were printing those checks 12 with on -- on television about the refund. Did you see 13 those things turning out checks? 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: What is the Capital Outlay 15 for? 16 MS. NEMEC: I do not have any Capital Outlay 17 for this year. In my forecast years for 2002, I did put in 18 $600 there for a small, little round conference table. If I 19 do get the new office, there will be room for a little 20 table, and I usually need something like that whenever I 21 have insurance agents or investment people come to my 22 office. It's kind of crowded to sit around my desk. I'm 23 having to get the chairs that are out in the other girls' 24 offices and bring them into my office, so I thought 25 something small like that would work. 8 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. So, this $1,500 is in 2 the budget? 3 MS. NEMEC: No, that's last year's. I -- if 4 you look at, under Requested -- that really should have been 5 under Estimated Actual, I guess. That -- the Requested is 6 this year's; that I'm working with. The Recommended is what 7 I'm asking for. So, there is no Capital Outlay for this 8 coming year. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Anybody else have any 10 questions? Anything else you want to tell us, Barbara? 11 MS. NEMEC: What can you tell me about the 12 new office? 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: We haven't talked about that 14 completely yet. We talked about it a little bit yesterday, 15 and we do intend to provide some funds for continued work in 16 the basement. Whether we -- you know, I don't think 17 Commissioner Baldwin has prioritized yet or come up with a 18 figure that he's comfortable with as far as overall budget, 19 but we do intend to continue to do some work down there. Is 20 that right, Buster? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, that is right. 22 At this moment, we're still in the same plan of "you're 23 next" kind of thing. But, we'll just have to -- we started 24 looking at the money yesterday. So -- 25 MS. NEMEC: Mm-hmm. Okay. 9 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I can't answer you one 2 way or another right now. 3 MS. NEMEC: Okay. No, I don't really have 4 anything. Everything's been working fine. We finally got a 5 printer -- Tommy got us a great printer, and that was our 6 big gripe for a couple of years. But now it's working 7 great. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: All right. Well, thanks. 9 MS. NEMEC: Thank you. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Jannett, are you ready? 11 MS. PIEPER: I'm ready. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: No reason to delay. Next 13 we'll take up the County Clerk and her many hats; Election, 14 Records Management. 15 MS. PIEPER: Okay. We're going to start with 16 Elections? 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Wherever you want to start. 18 MS. PIEPER: Okay. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Under Tab 3. 20 MS. PIEPER: Well, I have elections on top, 21 so we can start there, if that's okay with y'all. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Sure. 23 MS. PIEPER: To make it easier for 24 distinction, I put my increases in red and my decreases in 25 green. On my clerks and judges, I have increased that with 10 1 the hopes of increasing their pay raise for the 12 or 14 2 hours a day that they spend at the polling place. By law, 3 we were only allowed to charge -- or to pay them $6 per 4 hour, and I'd like to see that raised to $8. There was 5 legislation that brought this about, and I haven't checked 6 to see if that has been signed, but I'm sure it has. So, 7 that -- that's where the increase in that comes. We've had 8 a lot of the county chairs and just election judges and 9 clerks that wrote in to the Secretary of the State that 10 complained about their $6 an hour, so that's what brought 11 that about. Some of those lawyers even came from Kerr 12 County. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Did we -- did we reappoint 14 those people or not? 15 MS. PIEPER: Actually, one of those was the 16 county chair, so -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, you're talking 18 about a $2-an-hour increase per person? 19 MS. PIEPER: Right. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And that adds up to 21 $3,600? 22 MS. PIEPER: Yes. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Damn. 24 MS. PIEPER: We employ somewhere in the 25 neighborhood of 70 to 80 during elections, and that's not 11 1 counting the employees from my office that work 8:00 to 5:00 2 every day on elections. And then I have increased the 3 employee training by $200 to -- hopefully, to get more of my 4 deputies trained in elections. And then, everything else 5 stayed the same until we got to rentals, and this is just an 6 adjusted increase, depending on where we hold the election 7 for the early voting, if we have to pay rent. There's a 8 chance it could stay the same amount, but I don't want to 9 take any chances. The Municipal Auditorium is going to be 10 under construction; therefore, we won't have that building. 11 Tomorrow, Sheila Brand from the City and I are going to be 12 checking out the Saint Peter's Church, but I haven't talked 13 to them about rent or if we're going to actually get to use 14 that space free, or if it even meets A.D.A. compliance to 15 where we can use it. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: It has a ramp in the front, 17 the front of the Parrish Hall, for wheelchairs. Now, I'm 18 quite certain the restrooms aren't A.D.A. compliant, but I 19 think you indicated that it -- they didn't have to be. 20 MS. PIEPER: I talked to one lady from there, 21 and the restrooms that are actually in that section are not 22 A.D.A. compliant; however, if they go around a corner or 23 something, there are some restrooms that are. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: There are some over across 25 the street in the main church, I believe. 12 1 MS. PIEPER: So I'll just have -- have to 2 check it out and see if we would be, you know, okay holding 3 the election there. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: I hope so, because it's going 5 to be major disruption -- 6 MS. PIEPER: It will be. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- if we have to make a 8 radical change in location; the people are so used to going 9 to Municipal Auditorium. I think they can probably find 10 Saint Peter's. 11 MS. PIEPER: Out of the election supplies, I 12 would like to get a sheet of plywood, cut it in half, and 13 put "Elections" -- you know, make two signs that have 14 "Elections" with an arrow, and then hopefully that would 15 help. Now, I can put one maybe on Main Street there by -- 16 between the Municipal Auditorium and the Saint Peter's 17 Church, plus one on Jefferson, because I think there's a 18 drive that goes from Jefferson Street up there, as well. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Actually, it's one-way the 20 other way. 21 MS. PIEPER: Is it? 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: One-way going to Jefferson 23 Street. 24 MS. PIEPER: Okay. Anyway, I thought, well, 25 if we put a big sign that just says "Elections," I think 13 1 that may help. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Why the decrease in 4 the ballots? 5 MS. PIEPER: I don't feel that we're going to 6 need as much money that -- from last year. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The ballots not as 8 large? Or -- 9 MS. PIEPER: Well, we -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You'll have the same 11 amount of ballots. 12 MS. PIEPER: I think we overfunded that line 13 item last year. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh. I'm certainly not 15 arguing with you. I just wondered why. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: And last year was a 17 presidential election; turnout is larger for presidential, 18 particularly with George W. running, than it will be this 19 year, most likely. 20 MS. PIEPER: Yeah. There was some precincts 21 we had 65 percent voter turnout. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's great. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Getting back to your 24 location issue, in the event the Episcopal Church Parrish 25 Hall doesn't work out, for whatever reason, is the Family 14 1 Life Center behind the Presbyterian Church still in the same 2 voting district? 3 MS. PIEPER: Early voting can be anyplace in 4 Kerr County. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Early voting, okay. 6 MS. PIEPER: Right. This is what the money 7 is for, is for our early voting. And there's a couple of 8 places on actual Election Day that I have to pay rent, but 9 that's already been figured in. This increase is basically 10 for the early voting. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I was just thinking 12 about the location, a backup for you in the event that the 13 Parrish Hall at the Episcopal Church didn't work out for 14 you. The Family Life Center at the Presbyterian Church is 15 A.D.A. compliant all the way. 16 MS. PIEPER: Is it? Okay. We -- I 17 haven't -- I've just basically made a list of the different 18 places that -- that we can check out, and it -- I want to 19 check the -- the church right next to the Municipal 20 Auditorium first, because that is -- I mean, it's -- you 21 know, so many people are used to going to the auditorium, I 22 think the closer we have it to the auditorium, the better. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anybody have any questions? 24 Talk to us a little bit, if you would, please, Jannett, 25 about your wish list. Thinking about a new election system, 15 1 talk to us about time frame and what your thoughts are. 2 MS. PIEPER: Well, as of right now, we're not 3 under a time frame, because we still fall under the 4 grandfather clause with the system we have, using the paper 5 optical scan ballots. And, by falling under the clause, 6 we're not A.D.A. compliant. You know, nobody blind can vote 7 without assistance, you know, and somebody handicapped 8 cannot vote without assistance. But, right now we still 9 fall under the grandfather clause, but I don't know how 10 long -- how long they're going to allow that to happen. 11 When and if the time comes that we have to update our 12 system, that's going to mean putting some type of voting 13 systems in each precinct. And, of course, right now we have 14 16 precincts, so each -- I mean, we'll have to have several 15 voting devices in each precinct, which means megabucks. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: What condition are our 17 current machines in? Functioning well? Are they holding up 18 well? 19 MS. PIEPER: That depends on humidity and 20 weather. The last election, we had all kinds of trouble, 21 but that was -- that was due to weather. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: It rained that night? 23 MS. PIEPER: It rained, and we had high 24 humidity, so the ballots came in hard to -- you know, I 25 mean, it's -- it's just -- and they were damp, but just from 16 1 the humidity. So, if we didn't have weather to worry about, 2 we'd be fine. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Have you looked at 4 the cost for an electronic voting system? Have you begun to 5 study that? 6 MS. PIEPER: I have talked with a couple of 7 vendors, just whenever we would go to school, and it's a lot 8 of money. But, to actually sit down with them, I haven't. 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: One of the things 10 that's going on right now is that whole industry is in a 11 pretty good shake-out and resurgence, trying to get the 12 Florida fiasco straightened out. There are all kinds of new 13 technology -- not new technology, but new applications of 14 older technologies to develop systems, and I think that 15 there is a real marketplace developing. And I think we'll 16 see, over the next few years, those costs coming down, 17 because there's a lot of competition. 18 MS. PIEPER: And I think it would be best to 19 wait -- to just put it off as long as we can until we -- 20 until all the technology gets here, and then we can pick out 21 the best system that we think is going to last the longest. 22 Because it's going to cost a ton of money. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: We're talking several hundred 24 thousands dollars to totally refit the system for every 25 precinct. 17 1 MS. PIEPER: And then, of course, depending 2 on -- 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Two computer voting stations 4 in each precinct? 5 MS. PIEPER: At least. I mean, because, you 6 know, we -- the way we're doing it now, we can run voters 7 through really quick, but we still get a line at -- like, at 8 early voting and stuff. And even -- well, even on Election 9 Day at the polling places, we still get a line, you know, 10 with the systems that we have now. So, I don't know if -- 11 if just two voting systems at each precinct will be enough, 12 'cause if they have to stand in line, they get unhappy. 13 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I've seen one system 14 that has -- has a central terminal with very cheap -- I 15 mean, has -- not a central terminal; has a central processor 16 with very cheap input devices for the actual voting, so that 17 the real expense is one machine for each -- 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Mm-hmm. 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: -- voting precinct, 20 and then you would have several stations that feed into that 21 one processor. That's probably where it's headed, the 22 technology. And -- and you can have those repeater 23 inputs or dumb -- in essence, dumb terminals, and those are 24 not real expensive. That one central processor is; that's 25 the real expense, but that could -- that could be handled by 18 1 a high-grade PC, as far as capacity. It's the security 2 aspects of it and the backups and all of that that drive the 3 prices of those kind of things up. If it's a straight 4 computer requirement, you don't -- we could build a heck of 5 a system out of PCs, but then the security people don't buy 6 that, and how could you manipulate numbers in the computer 7 and all that sort of thing. So, it has to be a very secure 8 system. 9 MS. PIEPER: Right. And, so far, the systems 10 I've seen, I'm not happy with, because none of them that I 11 know of yet, that I've looked at, deals with the recount, if 12 there is a recount. 13 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Mm-hmm. 14 MS. PIEPER: Be my luck we'd get a new -- a 15 new system and we'd have a recount right off the bat. 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: There's one that I -- 17 one I've seen that looks pretty good that -- where you 18 would -- you vote and you get a thing like a gas coupon like 19 when you're buying gas at the pump with your credit card, 20 and you get a thing that shows what you voted for, has your 21 voting number on it and all that sort of thing, or whatever 22 you want to put on there. The time you voted and all that 23 sort of thing, and you actually look at that. You've 24 already recorded the vote electronically, but this is your 25 receipt. You look at that and verify that that is, indeed, 19 1 what you wanted to vote for, and you drop that into the -- 2 MS. PIEPER: That wouldn't be A.D.A. 3 compliant, then, because a blind person can not see it. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, but you could 5 always do it voice -- you know, you'd have a voice 6 synthesizer that could take care of that sort of thing. But 7 the issue is, is that if you ever had to have a manual 8 recount, you would actually have a printout of what every 9 voter voted, and that voter gets a second chance to say -- 10 this was to get around the Florida fiasco thing, where we 11 didn't know who we were voting for. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: I can see, though, that you'd 13 have a large percentage of people who look at that receipt, 14 stuff it in their pocket -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, that would be 17 like -- that would be like them taking a ballot out of the 18 -- 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: They've already voted. I 20 mean, in their mind, they've already voted. The machine -- 21 this is just their receipt, so they stick it in their 22 pocket. When you go to do a recount, you've got a major 23 discrepancy between the electronic count and the -- 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, if you can't -- 25 if you can't account for it, I'd say it's a voided ballot. 20 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Kind of like a hanging 2 chad? 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: More like a pregnant chad. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Pregnant chad. 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Chad, yeah. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Any more questions for 7 Jannett about elections? Which one do you want to do next? 8 MS. PIEPER: How about records management? 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: How about records management? 10 Okay. 11 MS. PIEPER: Okay. On -- excuse me. On the 12 salaries, I've decreased that. I've decreased the FICA. 13 The insurance has went up, but that's not -- that's just an 14 adjusted increase, nothing that I have control over. And 15 I've decreased the retirement. And, all the decreases and 16 increases -- there was a turnover in my office, like, back 17 last January, so the person that left, left at a higher 18 salary than what we hired in at a 12/1, so that's where that 19 came in. And, then I have increased the continuing 20 education to $300. And this is for a motel and travel, 21 because I am supposed to, by law, go down and check 22 10 percent of my records that's in storage, and I haven't 23 done that yet. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Where are they stored? 25 MS. PIEPER: Nadene, where do we have them 21 1 stored? Dallas? 2 MS. ALFORD: Uh-huh. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: If you're required by law, 4 you're required by law. Talk to us -- anybody have any 5 questions about that -- the budget? Talk to us a little bit 6 about your wish list. 7 MS. PIEPER: Okay. My wish list is I need 8 one computer, and this one computer is to upgrade one of my 9 scanning stations to a bigger, better computer, so that my 10 scanner will work faster. Right now it works very slow. It 11 was the very first scanner that we've ever -- that we got, 12 and so, because of the size of it, I'm told that it's slow, 13 so I would like to change that one out to a larger computer, 14 and then the computer that we have there, move it to my 15 juvenile court and utilize it there. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Do you think $2,000 is the 17 cost of it? 18 MS. PIEPER: Yes. I talked with Shaun on the 19 cost. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 21 MS. PIEPER: And that's how we came up with 22 that figure. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. Any other item? 24 MS. PIEPER: On the records preservation, -- 25 and this is to be taken out of the records management -- 22 1 not -- not the funds we're actually speaking of, but that 2 28635-411. And that is to continue to get the four more 3 volumes out of our old marriage records done. We did four 4 last year, and if you remember, I spoke about getting a 5 couple done each year until we get them done. So, I am 6 requesting $4,400 to get four more of those volumes done. 7 And this was the marriage records back from 1856 and -- from 8 day one. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: How many volumes of those do 10 you have? 11 MS. PIEPER: I believe we have 12 volumes 12 total. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: So you'll be two-thirds done 14 if you get this year -- 15 MS. PIEPER: Mm-hmm. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anybody have any questions 17 about -- 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't have any. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- records management? 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Let's move on. 22 MS. PIEPER: Also, just on -- I almost forgot 23 this. Just on a note for records management, I found this 24 out a couple of days ago. Let me give you a copy of it. 25 This is a -- a proposal from F & F Microfilming. Supposedly 23 1 back in 1985, this company came in and microfiched all of 2 the Kerr County records. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, yeah, I remember 4 that. 5 MS. PIEPER: Do you remember that? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 7 MS. PIEPER: Well, he came in the other day 8 and was telling me about this, and of course I wasn't there 9 in '85 so I don't -- I don't know any of that. But, he came 10 in and was telling me that they had microfiched all the 11 records, which is 815 volumes, and proposes that he'd like 12 to sell those to us at $44 per volume. But, you have to 13 remember, our volumes are, like, 6 inches thick. So, I was 14 thinking, we -- eventually, I want to get rid of all the 15 books. I mean, they take up tons of room and they're not as 16 easy access. Anyway, if I had one deputy to take one book 17 and to fiche it or scan it, it would probably take at least 18 three days, and that would cost, like, $200. And here he's 19 proposing each volume at $44. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: This is up through what, 21 1983? '85? 22 MS. PIEPER: '85. On the second page is -- 23 is the list of what he microfilmed, and then in his 24 letter -- or in the proposal he said that there is a -- it 25 includes a certificate of authenticity at the beginning and 24 1 each end of the volume. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: So these would be just 3 microfiches? 4 MS. PIEPER: Uh-huh. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: How come we didn't get copies 6 of these things when he did this back in '85? 7 MS. PIEPER: I have no idea. He comes in 8 once a year and sets up a big old microfiche machine out at 9 the loading dock and does all of our plats, and he gives us 10 a copy of that fiche. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: So he can come and copy our 12 plats? 13 MS. PIEPER: By law, if anybody wants to come 14 in and bring whatever equipment in my office, if there is 15 room for them to set up, I can not stop them. So -- 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: But, as a courtesy, he -- 17 MS. PIEPER: But, as a courtesy, he gives us 18 a copy of the fiche on the plats. Now, why we didn't 19 receive a copy of all of this, I have no idea; I wasn't 20 here. But he was telling me that back in 1985, he had 21 proposed the same thing to Pat Dye with the same amount. I 22 mean, he hasn't increased it because I'm a different clerk. 23 And, he let her borrow the fiche for a while, and then he 24 came back and got it. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: How much space would this 25 1 free up? 2 MS. PIEPER: A lot. I'd have to -- 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Many of these records are 4 other than hard copy right now; is that correct? 5 MS. PIEPER: Yeah, these are hard copy in 6 books. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: We don't have any fiche or 8 scan of these documents? 9 MS. PIEPER: No, I'm sure we do. I don't 10 know what year they started ficheing in. 11 MS. ALFORD: '85 is approximately when they 12 started ficheing. 13 MS. PIEPER: Okay. 14 MS. ALFORD: So, anything before that is not 15 fiched. 16 MS. PIEPER: Okay. Now, this doesn't 17 include -- you know, in his list, it doesn't include, like, 18 the criminal civil records or Commissioners Court, you know, 19 so I would still have all of those records, you know, in 20 paper form. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: For some reason, apparently, 22 he didn't do those? 23 MS. PIEPER: Right. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's probably something we 25 ought to put in the back of our minds and take a look at at 26 1 the end of the day. 2 MS. PIEPER: And then he's also proposed on 3 here three different payment plans, you know, if we chose to 4 go that route. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which of those 6 options is preferable to you? 7 MS. PIEPER: Well, if we -- it depending on 8 what option -- I mean, if we go, like, as far as Option 3, 9 that's only $53 per volume. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's what I'm 11 asking. Which of the options is preferable to you? 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, she gets all of 13 the -- it's a budget question. 14 MS. PIEPER: Right. 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Because she gets all 16 of the volumes up front, anyway. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, I realize. 18 MS. PIEPER: So, therefore, it would be just 19 depending on what options y'all chose as far as putting it 20 in the budget. 21 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: You save a little 22 money if you pay it all at once. 23 MS. PIEPER: Right. 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Pay a little more if 25 you stretch it out, just like your automobile. 27 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Do you have any -- any notion 2 of what quality the fiches are? I mean, have you had a 3 chance to -- 4 MS. PIEPER: The original or the silver 5 glaucite, whatever it's called, which is supposed to last 6 forever, and then he also quoted that he has that diazanon, 7 as well. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Do we have the -- the readers 9 that would work for these fiche? 10 MS. PIEPER: Yes. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: We wouldn't be buying 12 something that we'd be unable to make it available to the 13 public? 14 MS. PIEPER: I have two reader-printers. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: But what I'm saying is, are 16 they compatible with this technology? 17 MS. PIEPER: Yes. Yes, it's the exact same 18 thing that I've got in my cabinets now, so it's -- yes, it 19 is the exact same thing. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: I know if you have an old 21 computer, you can't -- 22 MS. PIEPER: No. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- download something in a 24 new computer. 25 MS. PIEPER: No, that's -- it's just a -- a 28 1 fiche and it's got several -- several images on it, and then 2 we have our reader-printers and we put it in there and then 3 it displace up on the screen. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: They're out of where? Where 5 is their office located? 6 MS. PIEPER: I think it was in Austin, but 7 I'm not real sure. Do you know, Nadene? 8 MS. ALFORD: I don't know any more. 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Looks like San 10 Antonio, 210. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: San Antonio, and I 12 think they actually live in Bandera. I kind of know these 13 people. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: One thing we would probably 15 want to do, if we were to consider this, is have you or 16 send -- have you send somebody to actually physically 17 inspect what we buy and do some random samples of the 18 quality to make sure that they're acceptable. 19 MS. PIEPER: Okay. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 21 MS. PIEPER: Okay. The next one on our 22 general budget, the first line item that I have requested an 23 increase is the deputy salary, and this is for my 24 bookkeeper. She's -- she's the one that I've been trying to 25 work with the Nash Company on. It's kind of been a long, 29 1 drawn-out thing, but I'm requesting $586 on that. As it 2 stands with Nash right now, I don't think I'm winning. If I 3 don't win on that route, I would at least like her to be 4 raised up to a 15-10. This is the -- the person in my 5 office that, when we were discussing job titles and that 6 committee was formed to do the hearings on the 7 classifications or title classifications, at that point I 8 didn't know that the administrators were going to be 9 increased in their salary, so I didn't -- I mean, to me, 10 bookkeeper is -- the title is fine, as long as we get the 11 pay that goes with it. You know, my deputies don't care 12 what they're called as long as they get the pay. She was 13 making more money, plus she was over the ones that got more 14 money. Well, now she's still over them, yet making less 15 money, and I really don't think that's fair on her. So, 16 that's what I'm trying to do, is get her title changed, or 17 at least her pay increased. 18 On my part-time, that amount -- the $11,000 19 that was budgeted last year was for two part-time people. I 20 would like to drop that down to one part-time person and 21 then, on my wish list, I have for a probate deputy, and I 22 don't care what her title is. It's for a deputy, and this 23 deputy would work part-time in probate, as well as part-time 24 wherever I need her. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Kind of a floater. 30 1 MS. PIEPER: A floater. Like today, I have 2 five people -- well, counting Nadene and I, we have seven 3 people out of the office. And, if I had a floater that 4 could learn everything and bounce back and forth, it would 5 be a tremendous help. So, that's why I'm decreasing that, 6 hoping to receive another deputy that can work wherever I 7 need her at. And, because of the FICA percentage, that's 8 gone down. Insurance has increased. Let's see, retirement 9 has decreased. My bonds and insurance, every four years I 10 have to renew the one bond that costs more, so that's why 11 that amount has been brought up. Our postage, I've 12 increased that $2,000 for the plat mailings, and the 13 certified mail for $3,000. This comes a lot from that A.G. 14 opinion where the revision on the plats, we have to send out 15 certified notices to all the landowners. Since the A.G. 16 opinion came out, we no longer can charge that back to the 17 developer, so we're having to eat that price, so that's why 18 that increase. 19 The telephone is just an adjusted increase 20 because of the rising costs. We do try to call back collect 21 when we can on long distance calls, but there are several 22 times when we're not able to do that. Reimbursement on 23 travel, this is a new line item. I have never had that line 24 item in the budget before. And this $1,000 is for mileage 25 call for the burial transmits on nights and weekends. This 31 1 is not for me; this is for my girls. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's for what? 3 MS. PIEPER: This is for my deputies. It's 4 for when we get called out at night or -- or weekends for 5 our death permits. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: What do you mean by "death 7 permit"? 8 MS. PIEPER: Well, if -- 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Death certificate? Or what 10 are the circumstances? 11 MS. PIEPER: It's a permit to allow them to 12 transport a deceased person. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Out of the county? 14 MS. PIEPER: Out of the county. You know, 15 like on weekends or at nights, if we have somebody at the 16 V.A. Hospital that -- that dies in the middle of the night 17 and they need to get them on the plane the first thing the 18 next morning or whatever, we get called for the -- the 19 permit. So, either me or one of my girls will carry a 20 beeper 24, 7. And -- 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's the frequency 22 of this? 23 MS. PIEPER: I figured that up a while back, 24 and I think we were averaging -- seems like it was 15 a 25 month -- 15 to 17 a month. 32 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Really? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good lord. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's a lot. 4 MS. PIEPER: Mm-hmm. So, we have -- there's 5 several girls in the office that we rotate; we do it on a 6 weekly basis. But, I feel that two of my girls come from 7 Hunt, and -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And do they -- are 9 they incurring the cost themselves? Their personal -- 10 MS. PIEPER: Yes, they are. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Have you been paying 12 them up to this point? 13 MS. PIEPER: No, I haven't been paying them. 14 I didn't have the money budgeted. For carrying that pager 15 for a week at a time, the only way I can compensate them for 16 that is by giving them comp time. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Uh-huh. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And this is just to 19 reimburse their travel expenses? 20 MS. PIEPER: Right, just their mileage to and 21 from. I mean, most of the time -- 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: After hours? 23 MS. PIEPER: After hours, right. During -- 24 during regular hours, like, if it's Grimes Funeral Home or 25 Overby Funeral Home, they'll come to the office and request 33 1 it right here, so that there is no travel. But, if it's 2 after hours or on weekends, then the pager goes off and we 3 call them and say, "Okay, we'll be right there." 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And you keep records 5 of all that. Would it be possible that we could get a copy 6 of that, just for our records, to show how many -- 7 MS. PIEPER: Mm-hmm. Yes, sir. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- how many a month, 9 for a couple of months? 10 MS. PIEPER: Sure. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Would you do that? Or 12 at least for me. I'd just like to see it. 13 MS. PIEPER: Mm-hmm. You know, a couple of 14 girls, they have to travel 20 miles round-trip. You know, 15 their own personal vehicle, their own gas. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, they should -- 17 they should not be paying their own money to come and do 18 County business. 19 MS. PIEPER: Right, but they are. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I know. 21 MS. PIEPER: It's either that, or I have to 22 carry that thing every day and every night. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, that's an 24 option. 25 MS. PIEPER: There's times I like to go to 34 1 San Antonio or -- you know. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You can't go out of 3 town. We're committed servants here. You could always give 4 it to Thea; Thea could run up here and do it. She doesn't 5 mind. 6 MS. PIEPER: Well, you got to pay her travel 7 on weekends. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good god. 9 MS. PIEPER: Okay. The next line item, 10 Notices and Plats, normally this was not a budgeted item 11 either. This is where we got the money from the developer 12 to put his notice in the newspaper on the revision of plats. 13 Since the A.G. opinion came out, I didn't know if y'all 14 wanted me to put that in my budget or if y'all wanted it in 15 the Commissioners Court budget, so I went ahead and budgeted 16 what I thought, and I just figured two publications a month 17 at $145, for 12 months, and this is what I came up with. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Good guess. To me, 19 that's all we can do. 20 MS. PIEPER: I already had a line item for 21 it; that's why I went ahead and put it in my budget. But, 22 that's strictly up to you. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: I think it's fine. 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's where it ought 25 to be. 35 1 MS. PIEPER: And then the lease copier, of 2 course, they're going up in expense, so I've increased that 3 by $1,000. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Why is that going up? 5 MS. PIEPER: Just the amount of copies that 6 we make. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: More copies? 8 MS. PIEPER: Mm-hmm. And then the 9 conferences, I've increased that by $200, because the 10 conferences are getting further away, and the increase in 11 gas prices. I was on the Internet a while back, and I went 12 into the I.R.S. site and printed out a thing that said that 13 for the businesses in 2000, the gas mileage has increased to 14 32 and a half cents, so that I -- I thought that was kind of 15 interesting. Whenever I go, I'm still putting in for 28 16 cents a mile, so I think in time the Commissioners need 17 to -- 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: It's going to 34 and a 19 half. 20 MS. PIEPER: Is it? Okay. Well, this is for 21 2000. So -- 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And the State is going 23 to 34 and a half as of the 1st of September. 24 MS. PIEPER: Just as a suggestion to the 25 Court, I think it would be a good idea if y'all do a court 36 1 order stating what -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is the -- what is 3 the index that drives that? 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: It's just what the I.R.S. 5 determines is the cost of operating the private vehicle per 6 mile. 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Then it gets reflected 8 in Title 9 of the General Appropriations Act for the State. 9 If you look in Title 9, that's all the general stuff about 10 business travel or travel for the State, and this -- for 11 next year, effective the 1st of September, room and -- room, 12 meals, and incidental expenses goes to $110 a day maximum, 13 and the mileage goes to 34 and a half cents. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: One of the boards that 15 I sit on that -- that I'm reimbursed from, what we -- we 16 have voted to just automatically be tied to that, the I.R.S. 17 number, and if it goes up, it automatically goes up. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: A lot of companies are 19 doing that, too. It's the same for the I.R.S., and now the 20 State has matched that. One year out-of-cycle, but the 21 State has now matched that, so it will go to 34 and a half. 22 Our 28 cents that we're doing now goes to 34 and a half on 23 the 1st of September. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: I don't know if ours, per 25 se -- the County's does, but it's something we probably 37 1 ought to do, is to pass a court order, either tying 2 ourselves to the I.R.S. or to the State. 3 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think we ought to do 4 it to the State. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: I think so, too. 6 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: It makes a lot of 7 sense, since we're an extension of State government and 8 since we're -- 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Their Title 9 stuff 11 ought to be applicable to us. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that a function -- 13 another function of the budget process, or a separate court 14 order? 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: It would be a separate court 16 order. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: We have to put it on 18 the agenda. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: We'll take care of that in 20 August. Okay. 21 MS. PIEPER: Okay. My next line item, I have 22 decreased my computer software by $3,500. I don't know of 23 any software that I'm going to be needing. And then 24 software maintenance, that's just an increase of $184 by the 25 figures that Software Group sent me. 38 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 2 MS. PIEPER: And then on computer supplies, 3 I've dropped that down to $1,000. Just by going on -- on 4 what we've been spending and what I think we may need, I 5 think we'll be safe on that. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask a question 8 here. Let's go back up to Postage, 309. Recently we have 9 talked about the new -- the 911 system of notifying the 10 emergency services of the road name changes. Do you think 11 that there's enough in that to affect this, or have you 12 thought about that? 13 MS. PIEPER: I was not in court yesterday, 14 because my office was slim, so I don't know. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We never let anybody 16 know about it until it's too late, so -- 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think you have -- 18 after we finish this round, the frequency of those will 19 diminish. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, it's not enough 21 to -- 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Probably not enough. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 24 MS. PIEPER: Okay. Do we want to go with the 25 wish list? 39 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Sure. 2 MS. PIEPER: Okay. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Does anyone have any 4 questions about the main budget? 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Go ahead, Jannett. 7 MS. PIEPER: Okay. My very first priority is 8 another deputy, and that $23,843 includes the FICA, 9 insurance, and retirement. And this -- 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This deputy would be 11 used where? Would this be your utility infielder you're 12 talking about? 13 MS. PIEPER: Yes. Yes. And, gentlemen, 14 if -- if, by chance, this position is not funded, I would 15 like to request that my part-time salary be $11,000, what it 16 was -- the same amount that it was last year, 'cause I -- if 17 I don't get another full-time person that can work wherever, 18 then I've got to have the two part-time. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: What are the part times used 20 for, Jannett? 21 MS. PIEPER: For whatever, basically. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Who are they? 23 MS. PIEPER: I've only got -- I've got one 24 open spot right now, but the other one is Betty Burney, and 25 she spends a lot of her time in the Land Records with 40 1 scanning and indexing and stuff like that. And she does -- 2 she does a lot of the filing in probate and just wherever we 3 need her. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Tommy, is there any way one 5 of those part-time positions could be funded out of the 6 Records Management funds? 7 MR. TOMLINSON: I think -- 8 MS. PIEPER: I've already got two that's 9 coming out of that. 10 MR. TOMLINSON: Two out of there. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Two? 12 MS. PIEPER: My two full-time. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Oh, okay. All right, that 14 answers that. 15 MR. TOMLINSON: I've about reached the limit 16 on the dollars we can on that. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: On your wish list 18 here, the -- this new slot that you're requesting -- 19 MS. PIEPER: Yes? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You have "probate 21 deputy." 22 MS. PIEPER: Well, I have probate deputy, 23 which she would work, I don't know, two to three days in 24 probate or, you know, whatever is needed there, and then 25 work wherever. Like today, I have -- Ms. Burney is working 41 1 at my front counter, answering phone calls, and taking care 2 of customers walking in, because I am -- that's where I'm 3 most -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: She has three 5 employees out right now. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Vacation or sick? 7 MS. PIEPER: Well, actually, they're -- well, 8 with Nadene and I, we have a total of seven. I've got one 9 on F.M.L.A. leave. I've got two that are at the hospital 10 with their spouses having surgery. One's on vacation. One 11 is an open spot. Just the facts of everyday office. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: You ran. You wanted this 13 job. 14 MS. PIEPER: Hey, we're holding up good, 15 though. Nadene and I work wherever we're needed, too. And 16 then, of course, being summer, we have vacations that we 17 have to work around. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Sure. 19 MS. PIEPER: I've only got one on vacation. 20 My other wish list is two more computers. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: The deputy, that's a 12-1, 22 right? 23 MS. PIEPER: That's a 12-1, yes. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Including the expenses, okay. 25 MS. PIEPER: Yes. My number two wish list is 42 1 two more computers, one for civil and one for criminal, and 2 I have talked to Shaun about the price on this as well. 3 That's where I came up with that figure. He gave me a 4 printout from Gateway, and he said that a Gateway, at the 5 prices that they are now, would be perfect for what I need. 6 So -- and then I want a credit card machine, which I 7 approached y'all last year on this. There has been new 8 legislation that came out, and it has been signed on May the 9 15th, and I have a copy of that for you. And, this just 10 says that the -- the Commissioners Court may authorize an 11 amount equal to the amount of any transaction fee charged to 12 the County by a vendor. So, you know, like, if somebody 13 brings me a Mastercard and Mastercard charges $1.59 or 14 whatever percent, then by law we can charge that. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: How often do you think that 16 your people would pay by credit card? 17 MS. PIEPER: Continuously, I think. I get 18 all kind of requests on birth and death records alone for 19 that. With this Hawthorne case and the multiple 20 attorneys -- we have a new attorney that popped up 21 yesterday. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Oh, good. 23 MS. PIEPER: And he's already been through 24 several of the files, and as of yesterday, his bill was 25 400-something dollars, and that's not a complete count of 43 1 the pages that he wants. But he asked yesterday, "Do you 2 take credit cards?" And I had to say, "No, sir." So, 3 he's -- he left me a blank check, because we haven't 4 finished counting up all the pages. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Whoa. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: A blank check from a 7 lawyer? 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's probably not 9 going -- 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Put it in a little box so it 11 doesn't vibrate. 12 MS. PIEPER: This is a new attorney, so -- 13 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah, he'll learn. 14 He'll learn. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He may get a 16 transaction fee more than he thought. 17 MS. PIEPER: We do have a -- an 800 number 18 that the Collections Department set up a couple of years 19 ago, if somebody wants to pay a fine or a court cost, but 20 then you key in -- you call the 800 number and you key in 21 your case number. But that doesn't work on anything else in 22 the office. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what I was 24 going to ask. Would this thing work for Russ Duncan's 25 program, too? 44 1 MS. PIEPER: Yes, it will, because if the 2 defendant comes in and hands me a credit card, I can swipe 3 it right then and I have a printout of where that money 4 goes; therefore, I don't have to key in a case number. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Uh-huh. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Which would you -- which 7 companies would you probably contract with? Mastercard? 8 MS. PIEPER: All of them. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Visa, American Express, 10 Discover? 11 MS. PIEPER: All of them. Whatever my vendor 12 would allow me to do. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is the transaction 14 fee uniform among all of the credit card issuers? 15 MS. PIEPER: Excuse me? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is the transaction 17 fee a uniform fee? 18 MS. PIEPER: No. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Among the major 20 issuers of credit cards? 21 MS. PIEPER: No. Visa, Mastercard, Discover, 22 all of them charge different amounts. 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: American Express is 24 most expensive. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Five percent, aren't 45 1 they? 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, as much as -- 3 you can negotiate with them. 4 MS. PIEPER: And I think, after doing further 5 research, we may be able just to set a standard fee -- I 6 mean -- 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That was going to be 8 my follow-up question. Could you just establish a standard 9 fee that covers that, plus a penny or two more or whatever? 10 MS. PIEPER: I'll have to look at that to 11 see, but the money that I had budgeted -- and I -- and 12 there's a possible chance, depending on what vendor I can 13 get, that may be too much money. I mean, we might can get 14 it cheaper, but it's basically just for -- a telephone 15 adapter that I can put in my -- by my fax machine; 16 therefore, I won't have to have another telephone line, and 17 just the actual machine, itself. So, I mean, we might could 18 drop that line item by $2,000, but I don't know for sure 19 yet. 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Could you get a quote 21 on that? Because I think $5,000 is a lot more than they 22 cost now. 23 MS. PIEPER: I met with one gentleman -- let 24 me see. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Jannett, this 46 1 indicates that you can charge no more than the amount being 2 charged to you. If you do set this up, you'll have to have 3 a varying schedule. 4 MS. PIEPER: Right, but there's a place in 5 the law -- that's why I need to check. There was -- 6 actually, even -- I even have it from last year, I believe. 7 It said we could charge up to $5, if I'm not mistaken. So, 8 you know, I don't know if the new law is going to override 9 the other law. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This says an amount 11 equal to the amount of any transaction fee being charged to 12 the County by the vendor. 13 MS. PIEPER: Right. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, if American 15 Express, for example, charged up to 5 percent and -- and 16 Discover only charged a point and a half, you'd have to have 17 a varying set of fees, as well, depending on the card that 18 the person gave you. 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Have a percentage, the 20 way some firms do; that is, that they pass along the cost so 21 that you just have -- whatever contract you have with each 22 credit card vendor has a percentage that you pay for that 23 transaction, a percentage of what the individual is 24 spending. 25 MS. PIEPER: Right. 47 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So, all do you is 2 multiply that, and that's what you put on this credit card. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: You just charge for 5 them. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: The problem is keeping track 7 of -- what kind of card is that? What's my schedule say? 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's my whole 9 point. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think there's only 11 three now, different. Mastercard and Visa have the same, 12 generally speaking. I think that's true. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Discover's different. 14 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Discover and American 15 Express. You have three different percentages that are 16 charged. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: You could probably get by 18 with just Mastercard, Visa, and American Express. 19 MS. PIEPER: I don't know. The list -- this 20 is from NPC Company, and they said that Mastercard, Visa, 21 the rate was 1.6. The American Express was 3.25 percent. 22 Diner's Club, 2.75 percent. And then, if I wanted a 23 statement fee at the -- 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They're still out 25 there? 48 1 MS. PIEPER: -- end of the month, it would be 2 $8.50 a month, which I'll have a printout every day, so I 3 don't care if I get a statement fee. But, Local Government 4 Code 132.003 talks about the process and the handling fee. 5 And, in Section B, it says that the amount cannot exceed 6 5 percent of the amount paid of the fee. But then, if you 7 go down under Section C, it says a flat rate not to exceed 8 $5 for each payment. So, I'll just have to check to see if 9 the new law overrides this law, or if it's just an added 10 law. This one company, NPC, that I had just spoke with, you 11 know, he said his terminal cost is $1,200, plus $300 for a 12 pin pad. So, if I went with that, then, of course, the 13 amount budgeted would be a lot lower. And then I have 14 another company, but I don't remember if I actually brought 15 the quotes with me. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This bill doesn't 17 address a percentage, or an up-to point -- 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: See, this -- this bill 19 amended that section and added Subsection D, so this -- the 20 underlying portion is in addition to what you have there. 21 MS. PIEPER: Okay. So, we can charge a flat 22 rate, then. 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: You can also collect 24 a -- Commissioners Court can -- we can cover actual cost. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Any other questions 49 1 for Jannett on this one or any of her budgets? Okay. 2 MS. PIEPER: So everything's approved, right? 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: I wouldn't go to the bank on 4 that. Next we have on the schedule the County Auditor. 5 Tommy? 6 MR. TOMLINSON: Since I did this, I had to 7 have a budget amendment for office supplies, so I want to 8 add -- I want to add $200 to make that $1,150. That's an 9 increase of $200 from last year. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. Now that I'm on 11 the right page, would you mind starting over? 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: 310. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Office supplies, okay. 14 MR. TOMLINSON: Office supplies. I'd like to 15 add $200 to this $950 for current year. I already had to do 16 a budget amendment. The next change, I'd like to add $160 17 for my conference line item. My conference -- one of 18 mine -- and next year's is in El Paso. And, I've -- my 19 office has always required 20 hours a year, so I have to 20 have 40 hours in a two-year period, so it definitely takes 21 me two to get 20 hours a year. And, so, with the price of 22 gas and -- and one being in El Paso, I think I need another 23 $160. I think that's it. 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: What would that number 25 be, Tommy? 50 1 MR. TOMLINSON: Be $1,500, even. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: $1,500 even? 3 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I tell you, these 5 conferences are driving me up the wall. They just -- 6 they've lost sight of education, and it's money, money, 7 money, money. Send him two hours here and send us two hours 8 there, and we spend just tons of money. That's an awful way 9 to do things. 10 MR. TOMLINSON: I do -- I do have a capital 11 item wish list, for $200 for -- 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Secretary chair? 13 MR. TOMLINSON: For a secretarial chair. I 14 have one that's just a liability. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Did you inherit it from 16 former J.P. 1? 17 (Laughter.) 18 MR. TOMLINSON: So, I definitely need that. 19 Also, I'm asking for my first assistant to be reclassified 20 from a 17-6 to a 19-6. That's -- we had this discussion 21 last -- last budget year, and I agreed to -- to change 22 that -- I mean to wait until this year. I have written a 23 letter to our consulting agency, and an answer from them is 24 forthcoming. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: I know that Barbara has taken 51 1 all of these requests for position classifications and is 2 working with Nash to come up with a response, so we'll have 3 the answers to those prior to the time we make the final 4 decisions on this budget -- these budget issues. 5 MR. TOMLINSON: I think the reason behind my 6 request for this decision is that -- that since -- since I'm 7 part-time, it's -- it is vital that I have a first assistant 8 that can make independent accounting decisions without me 9 being there. So, I think the quality of person that needs 10 to be in this position should be at a 19 level, same as a 11 chief deputy. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anybody have any questions of 13 Tommy regarding the budget or the classification issue 14 raised? 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. I agree with 16 what you're saying. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Thanks, Tommy. Paula, 18 are you here and ready? 19 MS. RECTOR: I guess so. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Let's go on to the 21 last one scheduled for this morning, which is Tab 12, the 22 Tax Assessor/Collector. 23 MS. RECTOR: Okay. I did decrease my 24 Part-Time Salary by $4,000. I'm finding that part-time help 25 costs me more to clean up the mess than it does to have them 52 1 there, so I'm going to reduce that, and we're going to try 2 to work with what we have. My Bonds and Insurance, of 3 course, will be less. My two four-year bonds are due this 4 past year, and just my one bond is due this next year. 5 Postage, there's an increase there because we're -- we'll be 6 doing our mass mailout of our voter registration cards in 7 December, and that takes place every other year. And, I put 8 on there the estimated amount of cards we'll be mailing, and 9 then each card that comes back, there has -- by law, we have 10 to send a confirmation to them. Even though the post office 11 has said that they have moved, we have to be sure that post 12 office is right and we have to send a confirmation card to 13 all of those, so there is an additional cost in postage 14 there. And then again next year, of course, that line item 15 will be reduced. 16 Office Supplies, there's an increase, 17 additional envelopes for the confirmation letters that are 18 required to be sent. My Photocopy Expenses is just an 19 increase in the volume of copies. Telephone, I estimated a 20 little low this year on my telephone. I'm probably going to 21 run a little short, so I bumped that up a little bit this 22 next year to cover that. And, the Maintenance, there's an 23 increase in maintenance. I have a -- a new mailing machine, 24 and there's an increase in the cost of that, the maintenance 25 on that mailing machine. And, Conference, I have asked for 53 1 additional funds there of $100, just the increase in costs 2 of food and lodging; it seems to be going up every year. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: $100 or $200? 4 MR. TOMLINSON: $200. 5 MS. RECTOR: $100. I have 25; I'm asking for 6 26. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm working off this 8 -- I'm working off of a different sheet. In the back, back 9 there, you show $200. Maybe I -- 10 MS. RECTOR: Did I put 26? Well, it should 11 be 26. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, on the pencil 14 sheet, she has $100. 15 MS. RECTOR: And Software Maintenance, I 16 think I was out to lunch when I put that on there. The 17 scanning equipment, the maintenance on the scanning, it's 18 $801 per quarter, and I put that for the full year. So, I 19 had put down $3,000. It's actually $5,544 total 20 maintenance. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: $5,400? 22 MS. RECTOR: $5,544. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: $5,544. 24 MR. TOMLINSON: More than the 10,000? 25 MS. RECTOR: No. Where am I at? 54 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: You're talking about Line 2 457? 3 MS. RECTOR: Software Maintenance. 4 MR. TOMLINSON: Yeah. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Are we on 457? 6 MS. RECTOR: On Software Maintenance, I'm 7 sorry, yeah. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's a pretty stiff 9 increase. 10 MS. RECTOR: Yeah, I put that on the wrong 11 line. Yeah, that -- that maintenance is kind of steep, $801 12 per quarter, but that's -- I bumped up the wrong line. I 13 put it under Maintenance Contracts. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: So, where should the increase 15 go, Paula? 16 MS. RECTOR: The increase should go under 17 Software Maintenance. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's where you have it, I 19 think. You have from $10,968 to $14,1 -- 20 MS. RECTOR: Fourteen -- where did I -- okay. 21 Okay, I see what I did. So I did put that there. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Right. 23 MS. RECTOR: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, let me ask a 25 question about that, Paula. That represents about a 55 1 40 percent increase. What would be involved in that? 2 MS. RECTOR: Well, we just got the scanning 3 equipment this year, and we only paid one quarter of 4 maintenance 'cause we just had it installed, so that was not 5 included in this year's budget. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 7 MS. RECTOR: So this next year it's going to 8 be additional. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 10 MS. RECTOR: $801 per quarter in addition to 11 the maintenance that I already have in place. 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And the software -- 13 the other software maintenance, other than what the 14 additional -- 15 MS. RECTOR: That has not increased. 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's The Software 17 Group? 18 MS. RECTOR: Yes. Yes, it's all Software 19 Group. 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right. 21 MS. RECTOR: Yeah. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let me make sure I 23 understand correctly. You're going from -- under 563, 24 you're going to go from $10,968 to $14,172? 25 MS. RECTOR: Right. 56 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that correct? 2 MS. RECTOR: Mm-hmm. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The number $5,544 you 4 gave us -- 5 MS. RECTOR: Well, don't ask me where I got 6 that. I was on the wrong line. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. So, that's a 8 non-number, right? 9 MS. RECTOR: Right, that's a non-number. 10 Forget that. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 12 MS. RECTOR: Okay. Computer Supplies. As 13 you can see, there's quite an increase there. TexDOT has 14 always supplied our cartridges for laser printers. They 15 supply all the equipment in my Motor Vehicle Department. 16 They notified us this year they will no longer be supplying 17 those cartridges to the counties; the counties will have to 18 absorb that expense. We have argued and argued with them 19 about it, and they say they have other priorities and this 20 is something that -- that the County needs to take care of. 21 But, this is going to be subject to change in a few years, 22 because what we're going to be going to is on-site printing 23 of stickers, where we're not going to have those sticker 24 book that you tear out any longer. It will print -- that 25 machine will print receipt and sticker together, so those 57 1 machines will go away and be replaced by this new machine. 2 We don't know what the cost of those are or what the -- you 3 know, what we're going to be required at the county level. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's the time frame 5 for that happening? 6 MS. RECTOR: They're talking -- they've got 7 some pilot counties up and going right now to see how it's 8 going to work. Probably in the next two or three years, 9 we're going to see that. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But the State will 11 provide those machines? 12 MS. RECTOR: The State will provide those 13 machines. And I think that's where they're directing all of 14 their interest right now, is to get all of these machines, 15 find a vendor, and get them up and going. They've got the 16 pilot counties working on them right now, and it's going to 17 be good, because we can go ahead and print the sticker 18 on-site, instead of having all those books of stickers that 19 we have now. So, then those laser printers will go away, 20 then, and be replaced with these new printers that will 21 print sticker and receipt all together. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay, good. 23 MS. RECTOR: But for the time being, the 24 County has to absorb the cost, and those -- I can probably 25 find a vendor that can supply them cheaper, but at this 58 1 point, all I'm finding is somewhere between $90 and $100 2 each. And we use about six of those per month, 'cause I've 3 got six printer stations. And, the voter registration 4 cards, because of the mass mailout, that's an additional 5 cost this year. And the combination forms for the upcoming 6 elections, those we are required to provide by request as to 7 how they want their list printed. So, we -- a lot of the 8 election judges like the combination forms. We prefer them; 9 it's less paperwork. It's a little more costly, but -- 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 11 MS. RECTOR: Okay. And, then I've got 12 Capital Outlay. I am requesting some new -- five new chairs 13 in my Title and Registration Department. The chairs I have 14 there, like Tommy said, are a liability. You sit down in 15 them and then they kind of just sink to the floor. Some of 16 them, the backs are wobbling and -- 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We have that same 18 problem up here. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: I'm not sure that's because 20 the chairs are old, though. 21 MS. RECTOR: Well, I've had a few people end 22 up on the floor, and I don't want -- I don't need any -- any 23 lawsuits. So, I'm requesting some new chairs in that 24 department, and also requesting new typewriters. The 25 typewriters that I have there are -- they're just -- they've 59 1 seen their better days. And, they work -- they use those 2 typewriters constantly, so I do need to have some new 3 typewriters in that department. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any questions or comments? 5 MS. RECTOR: Where would you like to go next? 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: What would you like to tell 7 us next? 8 MS. RECTOR: I have requested a new position 9 in my Voter Registration Department. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Mm-hmm. 11 MS. RECTOR: And I think you can see -- 12 everyone got a copy of my Chief Deputy's time record, and 13 you see the amount of overtime she puts in to try to keep 14 up. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Mm-hmm. 16 MS. RECTOR: She's not doing the duties that 17 she should be doing as Chief Deputy because she's spending 18 so much time in my Voter Registration Department trying to 19 keep that department going. I need somebody in there to 20 free up her so that she can spend more time working on 21 things she needs to be working on. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Paula, if you had -- I 23 mean, just my first -- at first glance here, you want to 24 hire someone -- another person in the Voter Registration, 25 which I agree; I've watched y'all enough to understand that. 60 1 But you also say that the -- because all this overtime for 2 Diane is due to the voter registration, so -- but if you 3 had -- if you had another voters person there, wouldn't that 4 relieve Diane from all that extra voter work that she's 5 having to do? 6 MS. RECTOR: Well, that's what I'm trying to 7 do, so that she can -- I'm having to do her work so that she 8 can do voter registration. I need her to be able to -- to 9 me, a chief deputy position should be able to step in, in 10 any position in the office where needed, when needed. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 12 MS. RECTOR: That's not always the case. 13 She's so busy trying to keep up with voter registration, and 14 the way we get the new voters coming in, it's just unreal. 15 Unreal. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I understand that, 17 and I agree with you. But, if you had -- if you get this 18 extra person, you get these two people working in voter, 19 then that relieves Diane of that. 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's what she's 21 wanting to do. 22 MS. RECTOR: Not completely. She's still 23 going to be in charge of that department, because that is -- 24 that's where her -- her knowledge is. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's a part of -- 61 1 MS. RECTOR: Yeah, right. But I do need for 2 her -- and I think coming up this year, I may have one 3 retiring in my tax department. I'm going to have to have 4 someone that can step in and kind of keep that department 5 going till we get someone trained and get them up to speed. 6 I -- maybe I'll have more than one retiring. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, you know, during our 8 general discussion yesterday, that position was one of the 9 ones identified as one of my priorities. 10 MS. RECTOR: I saw that. Thank you. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: The gentlemen can speak for 12 themselves, but I think it's one that we recognize as 13 something that has a high degree of urgency to it. 14 MS. RECTOR: Another problem that I'm seeing, 15 because my Vehicle Registration Department is so busy, I 16 have lines out the door. And, I know that County's growing, 17 but the girl I have working in Voter Registration, she's 18 also trained in motor vehicle, so when they get stacked, 19 I've got to take her out and put her over there. So, that 20 kind of leaves that position sitting until she can come back 21 and -- and take up where she left off. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anybody have any questions on 23 that? 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Paula, I want to ask you 62 1 briefly about your out years. 2 MS. RECTOR: Mm-hmm. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: You have $6,000 identified in 4 the first out year for networking the tax department. 5 What's that involve? 6 MS. RECTOR: That's doing the computer 7 networking. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Mm-hmm. 9 MS. RECTOR: Where there's not dumb 10 terminals; they're PCs. I have my Voter Registration 11 department networked now, and I want to do that in my Tax 12 Department, and that was something that I had in mind to do 13 this year, taking it out of the VIT funds, but I didn't 14 think -- feel that the staff I have in that department would 15 utilize it like it should be. To me, it would just have 16 been a waste. But, in -- I'm looking into the future, as 17 those people retire, bringing in people that would be able 18 to -- 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Is this a number that you've 20 scrubbed with Shaun, or -- 21 MS. RECTOR: Well, that's based on what I 22 spent for networking my Voter Registration Department this 23 year, and adding another terminal or two. It's kind of a 24 round figure, and I'm sure it's subject to change over the 25 years. Things -- prices are changing, so -- but that's kind 63 1 of where I'm going with that, is to try to get that 2 department networked in the future and get them where they 3 need to be. The software for my fax package is going to 4 change drastically in the next couple of years, and it's 5 going to be more of a -- a PC-based environment, and also an 6 Internet look to it, and we need to be able to change when 7 that takes place. Also, one thing I wanted to mention, and 8 this was something that we've been -- that it's come down to 9 us this week. Because of the new legislation in voter 10 registration, we're required to send a quarterly update to 11 the State in the form of a tape. The law has changed as of 12 September 1; they will no longer accept tapes. They will 13 be -- the counties that are tied into their mainframe 14 system, which we are not -- I've avoided that because of the 15 problems that they've had. We're -- we're going to be 16 required to update weekly, downloading through our web site. 17 So, my question is, do we have an idea when our web site is 18 going to be finished? 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, you never 20 finish -- never finish a web site. 21 MS. RECTOR: Up and going, where -- 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: We'll have a web 23 site -- we should have in, I would guess, another 30 days. 24 Shaun's pretty ell got it together now. Once you put it on, 25 it's there. I mean, it's almost -- I mean, everything will 64 1 be available that's in there now, but as time goes on, we'll 2 add and change and relink the other good sites and that kind 3 of thing. That's a continuing effort. That's what a web 4 master does. But, I would say in the next -- within the 5 next 30 days, we should have a site. 6 MS. RECTOR: This should be something -- 7 we're going to be in Austin next week at the Secretary of 8 State conference. I'm going to look at the online system 9 again. I don't think they tweaked it enough for my liking. 10 I still like Software's package, but if we're able to do 11 our -- our loads to the State and them download to us 12 through the web site, then we -- that's how I prefer to do 13 it. 14 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And that's what we 15 should be looking towards, as much as of that as we can. 16 MS. RECTOR: Yeah. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Good. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anything else? 19 MS. RECTOR: Questions? 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: I guess not. Thank you, 21 Paula. 22 MS. RECTOR: Great, thank you. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: We'll be adjourned until 24 1:30. 25 MR. TOMLINSON: I had a thought this morning, 65 1 and it all -- it sort of depends on -- on when we get to the 2 Sheriff's budget. But, yesterday we talked about Capital 3 Outlay for Nondepartmental, and I happened to think that -- 4 that -- I know the Sheriff's Office is requesting a -- some 5 scanning equipment, and if -- you know, if the Court 6 approves that, I think we probably need to purchase an 7 external hard drive for our mainframe, because scanned 8 documents -- and with the volume he has, it will just -- I 9 mean, will load our system in a heartbeat. 10 MS. RECTOR: Have you considered -- we're 11 scanning right now, too. 12 MR. TOMLINSON: I know you are, and so we -- 13 we've just added the Tax Office, and we're also trying -- 14 trying to go back and add all of the -- all of the mug shot 15 images for the last six years. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Mm-hmm. 17 MR. TOMLINSON: From the old Sheriff's system 18 to ours. And, you add -- when you add mug shots, I mean, 19 that takes up a huge volume of space on the system. And, 20 it's about -- it's a one -- a 20-gig external hard drive is 21 approximately $4,000, so I just wanted you to know. I just 22 happened to think about that this morning. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Anything else? Okay. 24 Let's go off the record now. 25 (Discussion off the record.) 66 1 (Recess taken from 11:00 a.m. to 1:30 p.m.) 2 - - - - - - - - - - 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. The next victim 4 appears to be present, so we'll call to order this afternoon 5 session of Kerr County Commissioners Court budget workshops. 6 The District Clerk is studiously trying to avoid me. 7 MS. UECKER: Oh, I'm sorry, Your Honor. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Are you prepared, Madam 9 Victim? 10 MS. UECKER: Madam Victim? 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Yes. 12 MS. UECKER: Yes, I am. I'm flying to 13 Virginia to see my grandbabies in the morning, so -- 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Tab 7. 15 MS. UECKER: Tab 7 is good. Hi, Jonathan. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How are you doing? 17 Bright, cheerful like always. 18 MS. UECKER: Why wouldn't I be? Hush, Thea. 19 Okay. How do you -- do you want to just go line-by-line? 20 Or -- 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Why don't you just tell us 22 what you think are the significant differences? 23 MS. UECKER: Okay. Of course, I've asked 24 for -- and I've already gotten a memo on that from you on 25 the salary. But, the way I understand it, we're not going 67 1 to discuss salaries today, right? 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's correct. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 4 MS. UECKER: Okay. Postage, that's actually 5 not really an increase, because we get that money back, and 6 that is my comment note number 3 on the attachment. Since 7 we're doing the passports now, there -- and there's so many 8 of them, we have to send those out, and if they're 9 expedited, we send those out, and that alone is, like, $12 10 and something per passport. Plus, to send an application 11 out is $3 or $4, and we have at least, you know, one or two 12 a day. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: The question, though, is that 14 when the money comes back, does it get credited back to this 15 line item or does it go in the General Fund? 16 MS. UECKER: It goes in the General Fund. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: So, we need to have enough 18 money in this line item to cover your expenses. 19 MS. UECKER: Exactly. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Whether they're reimbursed or 21 not. 22 MS. UECKER: Mm-hmm. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: So -- 24 MS. UECKER: And -- you know, and since we've 25 just started doing passports, I'm not even sure that the 68 1 $1,800 is going to be enough. I -- I feel like it will. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 3 MS. UECKER: But, you know, we'll just have 4 to do that and then play it by ear. Next year we may be 5 able to reduce it, or increase it. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, would it be better 7 to keep passports and all expenses related to that as a 8 separate line item? Or just to keep it separate from the 9 other functions of the -- actually, it's really more up to 10 you. 11 MS. UECKER: I don't think so. I don't think 12 so. The clerk gets -- you know, all we get out of it is the 13 $15 fee that goes in as a clerk's fee. I think it would 14 just be additional bookkeeping for my staff, it would be 15 additional bookkeeping for the Treasurer and the Auditor, 16 and the only two things that come into play in doing a 17 passport is that $15 clerk's fee and the postage. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 19 MS. UECKER: So, as long as, you know, I can 20 justify though this Court that, yeah, we need that postage 21 and we're bringing in that money as a clerk's fee in 22 addition to the -- the additional postage, I don't see any 23 reason in doing that. But, you know, it's the Court's 24 pleasure there. 25 Software Maintenance, the reason I have the 69 1 increase there -- it's $3,200, and that's Line Item 563 -- 2 is I'm asking this Court for a scanning system like the 3 County Clerk has, that she got I think two or three years 4 ago, and the $3,200 is based on what she has told me the 5 maintenance would be for that type -- for two scanners. So, 6 that's the only difference there. Then I'll jump back up to 7 310, which is Office Supplies, and I'm just asking for a 8 $500 increase there due to some increased staff and 9 equipment. And, I did have to do a budget amendment this 10 year for office supplies, and I'm hoping that that $500 will 11 balance out, because we did have extra expenses in the 12 office supply line item this last year because of the move; 13 you know, extra -- another calculator and files and stuff 14 like that. 15 Microfilm Records, I'm asking for an 16 additional -- and that's Line Item 412 -- an additional 17 $4,000. My plan is to ask the Court for $5,000 a year until 18 we get it completely finished, and I'm looking at probably 19 three or four years' worth. Maybe three. This would be my 20 second year of the real, real old, delicate records, 21 previous to 1930, the handwritten ones that go all the way 22 back to 1836, having them encased. And, I didn't bring one 23 with me today, but I did have one here last year, if you saw 24 the little mylar envelopes that they came in. And, we've 25 gotten those back that we did last year, and they -- they 70 1 really look great. We're saving some money by not having 2 them bound, because I want to wait until they're all done 3 and then do some kind of binding in-house, or maybe get some 4 bids on actually binding them. But, their binding was much 5 more expensive. So, that's the increase there. 6 Now, I say in here that that's a four-year 7 plan, but hopefully we can get it done in three. And, 8 again, you know, I never know how much money is in the 9 Records Preservation Fund, but as we -- as the funds are 10 available, that could come from there, and I'll have to work 11 with the Auditor to see what funds are there for records 12 preservation. You know, if we can get that through that, 13 then this won't have to be -- 14 MR. TOMLINSON: I think there's enough there 15 this year. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: I think your extra -- the 17 extra four you've requested would have to come from Records 18 Management Fund, if that's -- if there's sufficient funds in 19 there. Jannett also asked for -- she asked for $4,400 from 20 the same fund. 21 MS. UECKER: And, the conference amount of 45 22 is the next line item. I'm asking for $300 -- a $300 23 increase there. Of course, as you gentlemen know, the 24 inflated gas prices and hotels have just -- have gone, just 25 like overnight, from a government rate of $79 to a 71 1 government rate of $109 a night. And, as a matter of fact, 2 our last -- our annual conference in South Padre Island, our 3 rooms were $139. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: But you can get them cheaper 5 in Bandera. 6 MS. UECKER: That's true. I could see 600 7 people in Bandera at one hotel. Maybe camping out on the 8 lawn or something. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There you go. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Done that in Bandera a 11 long time ago. 12 MS. UECKER: And I had asked for an increase, 13 on my note number 8, in the travel expenses. Of course, 14 that would probably be an overall deal because of the 15 increase in the gas prices. I had to -- you know, I'm 16 having to make more trips to the banks out of county 'cause 17 of the interpleader funds. Plus, because of -- thanks to 18 our Collections people, I'm, you know, running to the bank 19 every day at least once, making deposits, 'cause I try not 20 to keep more cash than, you know, what I'm bonded for or 21 insured for. Number 7, Capital Outlay. I'm asking for a 22 reports printer. The one we have, it's so funny; all the 23 buttons have fallen off and you have to reach in with an 24 eraser to turn it on or off or switch the thing. I'm 25 surprised we haven't electrocuted ourselves with it. But 72 1 we've had it, like -- god, how long? Ever since we got the 2 Software Group stuff, I think. 3 And then Item B under that is the Ableterm 4 scanning stations, and hopefully, what I'm trying to 5 accomplish here by doing the scanning -- of course, and 6 having been on the State Library Committee that wrote the 7 standards and procedures for microfilming and imaging, I 8 still don't -- I don't think that optical imaging is the way 9 to go as far as preserving the record forever. Now, the 10 way -- and after I got off of that committee, they changed 11 it due to some pressure from some vendors to declare that 12 optical imaging is indeed a permanent record, but how they 13 did that was to say you can make it a permanent record if, 14 every ten years, you go in there and rewrite this. Which is 15 okay, and as long as, you know, I'm here, that would happen. 16 But you can't assume that every clerk is 17 going to come in and be protective enough of the County's 18 history and the records that they're not just going to let 19 it slip, because after some point after ten years, they 20 become not rewritable. And when I was on that committee, I 21 argued that over and over again, and I've even been talking 22 to vendors lately and I -- you know, I tell them, "Look, 23 tell me the honest truth. What do you think about, you 24 know, microfilming versus imaging?" And all of them will 25 say, you know, "Linda, I've known you a long time and you 73 1 know I can't fool you, and you know as well as I do that 2 microfilming is still the only permanent record." 3 But -- so, what my plan is, is to do the 4 imaging, as does the County Clerk, for the convenience. You 5 can get a faster copy, you can -- you can get a better copy 6 off of imaging. You can scan it in right away. The Court 7 can see it. There's less chance of files being misplaced. 8 It's all pulled up rather easily. As a result of that, 9 we're going to have to do -- have less reader-printers. And 10 I think I came to the Court a month ago -- it's been about 11 that -- where I told you that I was not going to buy the 12 reader-printer that I had budgeted for last year, which was 13 $9,000, if I can get this scanning. And, the way we do the 14 microfilming now is we index -- and it's a wonderful system. 15 I mean, clerks still come and look what at what I'm doing. 16 Every image is addressed. You can go to an index and find, 17 you know, State vs. Buster Baldwin immediately, put the film 18 in the reader-printer. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: When did that case 20 occur? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It was in Bandera. 22 MS. UECKER: It was in Bandera, maybe, huh? 23 But you can go within 45 seconds, push one button, and run 24 and have the whole file of State vs. Buster Baldwin. Of 25 course, you can also do that with the imaging. So, imaging 74 1 is mainly for convenience and to save a lot of time. But, 2 what I plan to do with the microfilming is continue to film 3 it for backup only, which would mean it would not be 4 addressed. We wouldn't have to go to that time and trouble 5 to make sure that every image is addressed. And, that's the 6 biggest part of Jody's -- my microfilm person's duty, is to 7 make sure that anyone can come in that office at any time 8 and go, you know, directly to an image on -- on the 9 microfilm. So, if we have it -- if we scan it, then we can 10 do the microfilming much easier, much more cost-efficient, 11 by just running the documents through, as long as you 12 know -- you list on the outside of -- of the roll that says, 13 you know, 1940 to 1945 are on this image, so in the event of 14 a catastrophe like a fire or whatever, those images could be 15 reproduced and even put back on -- into the scan. 'Cause if 16 we had a fire, we'd lose everything that was on optical 17 imaging, unless we backed it up on magnetic tape, which I 18 think the Auditor does anyway. 19 MR. TOMLINSON: We -- 20 MS. UECKER: Someone does. 21 MR. TOMLINSON: It goes off-site every night. 22 MS. UECKER: Yeah, it goes off-site, as does 23 the microfilm. But, doing the imaging is more convenience, 24 and I think would be just as cost-effective as microfilm. 25 See, what I had planned to do is take the -- and I haven't 75 1 talked to The Software Group yet, but I know that there's 2 several counties doing this through The Software Group now, 3 is taking the magnetic tape from the images and creating the 4 microfilm from that. So, at some point, we would probably 5 eliminate the microfilm person, to a point. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why do you need two 8 scanners instead of one? 9 MS. UECKER: As they come in, there's so much 10 stuff that gets filed, I'm not sure that one person could 11 keep up with scanning all the stuff. Plus, it's at one 12 station. I mean, you know, we can try it. I don't know. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They're $16,000 a piece? 14 MS. UECKER: Yeah. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Both the same? 16 MS. UECKER: And I think the Sheriff is 17 asking for two scanners, too, for the same reason, because 18 he and I have been working together to try to get his 19 records to -- 'cause I was going to help him put his records 20 on microfilm, and then, when The Software Group came up with 21 this capability -- and I had even told him that rather than 22 do the microfilm thing, maybe we should just do -- put them 23 on CD-ROM. Cause, as you know, I worked with the previous 24 Sheriff also to try to get her to -- 'cause, you know, she 25 had even talked to me about helping her with all the paper 76 1 records, 'cause they're so -- I mean, it's just 2 overwhelming. So, he and I visited and he said, too, that 3 he was going to ask -- if he could get it on the imaging, 4 then it would be more convenient for him than any of the 5 other formats that we discussed. That's where I am now. 6 Let's see. As far as next year, the outlook -- and I don't 7 know if you want to discuss any of that or not. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Sure. 9 MS. UECKER: The only thing I anticipate 10 right now is continuing to get these records done, these old 11 records done. This year I'm going to be kind of in a 12 crunch, because as soon as I get back from Virginia, my 13 number one priority is to empty the Water Street archives, 14 'cause I think we've moved money around so that I could keep 15 that until -- and I don't want to keep it any longer than 16 September the 30th. I've just got to move those out of 17 there. Now, my person -- the staff member, Jeannie, that 18 just went full-time -- and I don't know; you can ask 19 Glenn -- he's here -- how many truckloads of records we've 20 hauled to the dump because of the microfilming and 21 putting -- you know, considering that a permanent record. 22 He has just hauled -- well, everything was out at the jail. 23 I know y'all have all seen all those boxes and boxes. 24 They're gone. They're at the -- they're at the dump. And 25 so, as far as the criminal -- the stuff I have at Water 77 1 Street archives is all the criminal records and exhibits. 2 So, as soon as we finish with the civil, and we're almost 3 there, then we'll start doing all of that criminal stuff. 4 And as far as the year after that, mainly still working on 5 converting to the imaging, in addition to the microfilm. 6 But, microfilming for backup -- I mean, for permanency only. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 8 MS. UECKER: Because I think it would reflect 9 on me if I was to say, "Okay, fine, imaging is -- is a 10 permanent record," and then the new Clerk comes in and says, 11 "Oh, I didn't know that. I forgot to have those, you know, 12 rewritten." So -- and I think the first person that people 13 would look at and say, Well, you know, that District Clerk, 14 she probably didn't do her job or whatever. So -- and those 15 are very important records and very interesting records, and 16 I think we need to do whatever we can to preserve them. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any questions of Linda about 18 the District Clerk's budget? 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: You had a -- there was a bill 21 passed which is going to get you more reimbursement for 22 child support payments, correct? 23 MS. UECKER: Yeah. That's a Clerk's bill. 24 It's the -- 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Effective September 1st? 78 1 MS. UECKER: Effective September the 1st, 2 we'll be able to collect the additional 33 percent of the 3 federal funding. That -- and I think it might have been 4 before your time, Judge, but I had even come to the Court to 5 -- and gotten a resolution when I was legislative chair to 6 go testify on behalf of that issue. Of course, because of 7 the federal welfare reform that failed the last time, but we 8 did manage to get it through this time, thanks to Justice 9 Cornyn. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 11 MS. UECKER: So that -- 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Can we briefly touch on the 13 jury and the County Law Library, which are right behind the 14 District Clerk? 15 MS. UECKER: Okay. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: 216th jury, 198th jury. 17 MS. UECKER: Well, and the reason that I 18 was -- didn't pay any attention to you right away was, Tommy 19 and I were whispering a discussion about why we could not 20 combine all of the jury expenses, and I think that's 21 probably an excellent idea, because I see absolutely no 22 reason why these two can't be combined into one. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: I don't think you'll get a 24 lot of objection from up here if you want to do that. 25 MS. UECKER: You're not going to get a lot of 79 1 objection from me, because when I buy jury supplies, I have 2 to divide the bill in half, and y'all have seen it; you 3 know, half is okayed for 435 and the other half is okayed 4 for 436. And, we -- you know, we move money back and forth, 5 so why not just put it all in one pot? You know, even -- 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just combine it in 7 the 435 and just call it District Courts and do it like 8 that. 9 MS. UECKER: Mm-hmm. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: District Courts, period. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Period, District 12 Courts. 13 MS. UECKER: And I don't even know why we 14 wouldn't do County Court at Law and J.P.'s, too. As long 15 as, you know, we're all made aware at budget time -- if I 16 come in and -- you know, I'm the Jury Officer for Kerr 17 County, so I can get with J.P. courts and County Court at 18 Law -- well, I send out the jury summonses anyway, so 19 there's -- there's no reason why I couldn't touch base with 20 all of those different courts to make sure that they're not 21 having any big trials or any additional expenses or more 22 trials that year, and just do one budget for juries. 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Makes sense. 24 MS. UECKER: I don't think you'd have any -- 25 I have not talked to -- unless the Auditor has talked to 80 1 Judge Brown or the J.P.'s. I don't see them having any 2 objections to that. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: The only -- I think that's a 4 good idea, and let's kind of plan on doing that. The only 5 issue that comes up on juries are interpreters, and we've 6 had quite a few budget amendments in the last month or two 7 on interpreters. 8 MS. UECKER: Well, it's my opinion that the 9 court reporter expense and the court interpreter expense 10 should be taken out of the jury anyway, because -- because 11 those should go back under those individual court budgets. 12 'Cause there's nothing -- although I prepare the budget for 13 that, there's not a darn thing I can do about that one way 14 or the other. As long as the Court orders on occasion the 15 payment for an interpreter or court reporter, it should go 16 in his -- his budget or her budget, that district court 17 budget, or -- 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Yeah. 19 MS. UECKER: I don't know. Auditor, what do 20 you think? 21 MR. TOMLINSON: I agree. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, the -- I'm not going to 23 argue the -- where the line item goes, but I think, you 24 know, the 198th District Court, they've got $1,000 in here 25 for court interpreters. According to what Tommy gave me at 81 1 the end of -- I believe it was the end of June, they had 2 spent $4,629 on interpreters. So I think, at a minimum, 3 that line item needs to go up to $1,500. But probably, 4 if -- 5 MS. UECKER: I think the reason for that was, 6 Judge, if -- I don't remember the defendant's name, but we 7 had a jury trial that was lengthy that required an 8 interpreter for about a week and a half on a sexual assault 9 case. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Mm-hmm. 11 MS. UECKER: And that -- 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Which is very rare. 13 MS. UECKER: Which is rare, yeah. It's not 14 rare that we use interpreters, but it is rare that one case 15 would last that long with an interpreter. So, I -- 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Maybe we don't need that 17 sizable an increase. Double it, but I think it needs to go 18 up substantially from what the judges are telling me. As 19 the population continues to evolve -- 20 MS. UECKER: Mm-hmm. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- into more of a Hispanic 22 oriented population, the need for language interpreters is 23 going to continue to increase, so I think we ought to add 24 some more money to the interpreters budgets in each. 25 MS. UECKER: I think so, too. I agree with 82 1 you there. But I don't think that it should go into my 2 jury -- 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, I'm not -- I'm not 4 arguing about the jury fund; I'm just saying when it comes 5 time to budget money for interpreters we probably need to 6 budget -- 7 MS. UECKER: Right. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- more money in each of the 9 three line items, the two District Courts and the County 10 Court at Law, for interpreters. 11 MS. UECKER: Mm-hmm. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which is another good 13 reason to combine the two budgets together. 14 MS. UECKER: The jury -- yeah. I mean, we 15 could eliminate one budget by moving those over in -- back 16 into the courts and then doing one jury budget. 17 MR. TOMLINSON: I'd like to do that. Because 18 one -- for GASB-34, one of the basic activities that we're 19 going to report is the administrative -- administration of 20 justice. And to accomplish that, I won't -- I'm going to 21 have to consolidate all the costs that are associated with 22 that function. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: I think we'll just assume 24 that you're going to do that. We'll have one jury budget 25 for all the -- the J.P.'s, County Court at Law, and both 83 1 District Courts. 2 MS. UECKER: County Court. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: And interpreter expenses will 4 go into -- as a line item for each of the respective court 5 budgets. 6 MR. TOMLINSON: That's right. 7 MS. UECKER: In addition to court reporter 8 expenses. That needs to go back over there, too. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: I think it is in every one 10 except County Court at Law. 11 MR. TOMLINSON: County Court at Law is not 12 yet. 13 MS. UECKER: Okay. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: And County Law Library. 15 MS. UECKER: Y'all been up there? The 16 computers are hooked up and it's looking real good. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: What kind of use are you 18 getting? 19 MS. UECKER: Actually, we've had a lot of 20 people inquiring as -- on -- on the West Law, a lot of 21 attorneys. Actually, only one computer is -- has got 22 everything on it, but every time I go in there, there's at 23 least one person in there on the computer, so I think the -- 24 the more people that find out about it and learn how to use 25 it -- what we've done is -- is, instead of having the disk, 84 1 you know, there where everybody can grab a disk, put it in, 2 I'm having Mr. Uresti, who's our West representative on 3 this, load everything on every computer, so -- and there's 4 room for him to do that, so that we don't have -- they don't 5 have to check out a C.D. We don't have to worry about 6 losing them. When a new one comes in and replaces another 7 one, we just enter it and load it and replace the -- the old 8 one with the -- the updated version. And right now, there's 9 only one of them that hasn't been loaded. It takes him, 10 like -- he said five hours to load one. And he's supposed 11 to be back through this week and do another one. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. We've had a lot of 13 book budget amendments, it seems like, in the last couple of 14 weeks. Shouldn't our book costs be going down? 15 MS. UECKER: Yes, and it is. We're sending 16 books back -- and that's the one problem that I've had with 17 the Law Library, is I don't -- I don't know how many times 18 I've called the West rep and said, "Look, we've canceled all 19 of these. Why are we still getting them?" Of course, what 20 we're getting now is, you know, the session laws and -- and 21 all of the updates. So -- on the books that we're -- we 22 intend to keep, which is the form books and the Black 23 Statutes, and I think Texas Practice we were going to keep, 24 and the Dursanios (sic). And the one expense I think that 25 you're referring to is Dursanios, and we just buy these -- 85 1 those -- I don't update those, because it's more expensive 2 to update those annually than it is to buy a whole new set 3 of books every two or three years. And, if they actually go 4 in there and have a question on a form or an issue, they can 5 always go back and check the case law or the statutes on it, 6 because they're very, very expensive to update, and I just 7 can't see that, where for half of that amount we can go -- 8 just go and buy a whole new set of books. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 10 MS. UECKER: Which never made sense to me 11 before, but that's what we're doing, and that's the expense 12 you're seeing there. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The $13,000? Do you 14 think that will be enough to cover books? 15 MS. UECKER: Yeah, mm-hmm. Plus, that's -- 16 that's also -- see, the monthly fee for the West Law and the 17 subscription, which comes out to about -- with everything, 18 probably about $580 -- $584 a month or something like that's 19 our monthly fee. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: On the West Law thing, 21 is that where the Black Statutes and all that is? 22 MS. UECKER: Mm-hmm. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So you don't have to 24 handle pocket parts or any kind of hard copy stuff? 25 MS. UECKER: Hmm-mm. Now, if you go into 86 1 West Law, you'll have to get your password. You go in under 2 your own password, and you'll have to get one. Or, you 3 know, if any of y'all want to use West Law, I have a 4 password. But, as far as having a general password, we 5 can't do that, because we'd get charged for every, you know, 6 attorney in town coming in and using it, and then we get the 7 bill for that. You know, if it goes over that limit. So, 8 right now I think we have four passwords. I've got one, and 9 Judge Mauldin has one, and the two District Judges have one. 10 Did they issue you one, Judge Henneke, or not? 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: I don't remember. I don't 12 think so. 13 MS. UECKER: Okay. Well, I'll give you my 14 password, and -- if you need it. And I'd offer that to 15 Judge Brown, too, but I don't think he was that interested 16 in it. But -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge Barton told me 18 one time the most dangerous thing on earth is to see a 19 Commissioner walking down the hallway with a law book under 20 his arms. 21 MS. UECKER: I've heard him say that many 22 times. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The County 24 embarrassed -- kind of embarrassed me. I thought I knew 25 what I was doing. 87 1 MS. UECKER: He and I have spent many hours 2 together on Saturday morning in the Law Library. But, that 3 was pretty interesting. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anything else for Linda on 5 her various budgets? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Have a good time in 7 Virginia. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Whereabouts in Virginia are 9 you going? 10 THE WITNESS: Julie lives in Louisa, which is 11 between Charlottesville and Richmond. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Pretty country. 13 MS. UECKER: Pretty country. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Lots of rain. 15 MS. UECKER: Strange people. Strange people. 16 (Laughter.) 17 (Discussion off the record.) 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Linda. 19 MS. UECKER: Thank you, and I'll see y'all 20 August the 6th. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Have a good trip. 23 MS. UECKER: Thank you. 24 (Discussion off the record.) 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Glenn, you're up. 88 1 Maintenance budgets are under Tab 13. 2 MR. HOLEKAMP: Maintenance. Do you want to 3 just hit the major changes? Is that correct? 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: That sounds good to us. 5 MR. HOLEKAMP: Okay. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Start with Courthouse and 7 Related. 8 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 10 MR. HOLEKAMP: Okay. Maintenance salaries. 11 There have been -- there's a reduction in the maintenance 12 salaries. That's due to the shuffle we did after the budget 13 year last year to provide a maintenance person at the jail. 14 That's a reflection of that. There's an increase in 15 part-time. That's an area that I feel like that I needed to 16 do because of vacation schedules and that sort of thing, is 17 bring people in to help out. All right. We -- everything 18 else pretty much stays the same until we get down to 19 Telephone. Telephone is a real hard one to budget. I -- in 20 the last three years, we've had some increases, and these 21 line charges seem to be going up, up, up. I don't know if 22 the other departments have realized that problem, but we 23 have. It's not long distance. We do not do very much long 24 distance at all. It's in line charges. 25 I'm going to leave Number 550, Major Repairs, 89 1 to the end, and then we'll discuss that. Contract Fees, 2 553. There's an increase there. The -- the part-time 3 employee at the -- that does the cleaning of the Adult 4 Probation, I wanted to increase it because the time that is 5 required for that is -- I've been pushing that one pretty 6 hard to be able to get it cleaned. All right. Capital 7 Outlay. There's several things here, and possibly that 8 should have been on the wish list, a couple of those items. 9 On the -- on the truck situation, that was -- I guess that 10 should have been on the wish list more than on the 11 absolute -- absolute list. I think we're at the point where 12 we're going to have to start upgrading. I've got two '92 13 year model trucks. We have an '89. The '89 is -- is not 14 very solid, and I need to transfer a truck into the Parks 15 Department, but I can't really do it until I get another 16 vehicle into the Maintenance and the -- the Ag budget, 17 because they're all pretty much intermingled trucks. So, 18 that is a wish on my part. 19 Some of the other equipment that I listed 20 here; the saws, table saws, miter saw and stuff, that is 21 stuff that I would really like to add to our current 22 workroom. We're able to do a few projects with these 23 trustees that we've been using down here. There's some 24 tools that some of these fellas are very -- very capable of 25 operating, but they have to be handled, so those are some -- 90 1 some tools that I'd like to add to our -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's a -- 10-inch miter 3 saw, or 10-foot? 4 MR. HOLEKAMP: 10-inch on both -- 12-foot 5 bench-type drill press; that's a good one, too. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's a water extractor? 7 MR. HOLEKAMP: A what? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: A water extractor. What 9 is that? 10 MR. HOLEKAMP: Okay. A wet/dry vac, but it's 11 got a -- it's got a rubber thing on the front that you -- 12 you drop it as you push it, and it will pull water off the 13 floor. It holds approximately 5, 6 gallons of water. When 14 you have a spill, that thing will get it sucked up in no 15 time. We've used it at the Sheriff's Office when we were 16 flooded over there. We use it here occasionally. We've 17 used it at the Ag Barn. It's quite a contraption. We have 18 one, but I need another one to -- so we don't have to haul 19 it around so much. They're -- they're really a good 20 machine, though. 21 Okay, I'm going to go back to Number 550, 22 Major Repairs. The Judge touched on this just briefly 23 yesterday in the summaries of some of the things that need 24 to be done. Major repair. We've got -- there are three 25 units on the annex here on the top. There's -- I think 91 1 there two 5-tons and a 10, or two 8's and a 10, something 2 like that, air conditioning units up there. They were put 3 in in 1976, so we're talking 25 years old now. They're the 4 ones that run the Tax Office and the County Clerk's office. 5 We have spent quite a bit of money just patching and 6 patching and patching, trying to keep them going. We've got 7 some problems with pulling fresh air. These units are -- 8 are, I would say -- "antiquated" is one of the words I'll 9 use, because they're not capable -- since we closed up 10 through the -- through the reconstruction here, the remodel, 11 we're having trouble pulling enough fresh air into the 12 building, and what's happened is we're utilizing the same 13 air over and over and over. 14 So, with some new units -- and that's about 15 the only way that I'm aware, and by talking to 16 air-conditioning people, to be able to accomplish what we're 17 trying to do, is to upgrade to some new rooftop units 18 with -- and to bring them up to new. This budget item says 19 $30,000. That was before I got any bill -- prices, definite 20 prices. Those were estimates. I got one estimate that's 21 firmer at 23,5. So, we're talking anywhere from $20,000 to 22 $30,000, I would guess, to replace -- and those are three 23 units, because the way they -- the way they operate, you 24 can't do it with one unit here and one unit there. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Is there any electrical work 92 1 that would have to go along with that? 2 MR. HOLEKAMP: Well, no, just hooking it up. 3 What -- everything else is -- has been brought up. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, you're thinking 5 something -- somewhere in the range of $25,000? 6 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yeah, I'd say that that is 7 a -- of course, we'd go with the bidding process on -- 8 specifically on these units. But, I -- I tried to get some 9 legitimate estimates. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Tommy, should that -- is that 11 something that should be capitalized, or is that -- 12 MR. TOMLINSON: No, I don't think so. It's 13 an addition to the building. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 15 MR. HOLEKAMP: So, that is one of the things 16 that I feel like should be a priority. I put it in the 17 budget because I think it is something that we need to 18 discuss. All of the other units have been brought up to 19 within seven, eight years of age, I think. These are the 20 only ones that are still old. The rest of them -- there's a 21 few here that are -- that work, like down at Kathy's office 22 downstairs. I think those units there are, like, six -- 23 six, seven years old. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Glenn, will these new 25 units give you the proper mixture of new air and -- 93 1 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. They -- yeah, they 2 have the capability to pull air from up -- these don't. We 3 closed in windows that, prior to this year, they would open 4 some windows and it would be pulling in some fresh air, and 5 we don't have that capability now. And, there have been 6 some complaints about the air being somewhat stagnant. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Again, you have -- this 8 is kind of, I guess, somewhat related to that. I know -- I 9 presume by going with newer units, we're going to probably 10 save on utilities, because newer units are so much more 11 efficient? 12 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But this room, I know, is 14 always very cold, and I'm just wondering if we have an 15 old-style thermostat. Have you looked at going into more of 16 a computerized thermostat in these offices to -- maybe to 17 help our utility side? 18 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. We just changed the 19 one in the -- the Clerk's office last week to a computerized 20 one, where it works like the one in y'all's office, where it 21 shuts -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Shuts off? 23 MR. HOLEKAMP: -- off during the night and 24 cuts on in the morning. Yes, sir, I would. They're -- 25 they're approximately $500 a piece, not counting labor to 94 1 put them in. And, yes, I've really, seriously considered 2 it, and would like to. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Seems to me that we can 4 probably, as big as our utility bills are, pay for that in 5 about a year. 6 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Just in this room alone. 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah. 9 MR. HOLEKAMP: This room here, we try real 10 hard to get in here to knock it back down, but sometimes it 11 doesn't get done. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just a lot -- I mean, 13 especially with the window situation in this old building, I 14 mean, it -- it just goes to -- heat and cold just goes right 15 through them. 16 MR. HOLEKAMP: All of the new construction 17 part, they are set -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Computerized? 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: There's a whole new area of 20 tort law on bad buildings. You know, the bad air, airborne 21 diseases, so I really don't think we have any choice but 22 to -- 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- but to do that. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We've got our money out 95 1 of it; they're 25 years old. We've done very well. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Very well. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Don't tell the Texas 4 Historical Commission; they might declare them historical -- 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What if we kept the 6 number like Glenn asked for, about 30? If he brings this in 7 under 30, that would give you some money for thermostats. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: I think we'll leave it at 30, 9 and we have to bid it, so we don't want to cut it too short. 10 MR. HOLEKAMP: That was my concern, is if we 11 cut it, then we'd have a problem when we get into the 12 bidding. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What if you got 14 something like 20, and -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Get some thermostats. 16 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. And, there's 17 only -- probably would be only about three or four left to 18 get. The rest of the building is done. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any more questions about the 21 courthouse and related buildings? Which one do you want to 22 do next, Glenn? 23 MR. HOLEKAMP: Do you want to go ahead? The 24 other one that I'm scheduled for to today would be the 25 Environmental. Do you want to get it out of the way right 96 1 quick? 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Sure. Environmental Health? 3 MR. HOLEKAMP: Mm-hmm. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Which is the next budget 5 behind it. 6 MR. HOLEKAMP: Marc's snuck in between there, 7 but -- 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: It's cooler in here than it 9 is outside, isn't it, Marc? 10 MR. ALLEN: Yes. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: He doesn't mind waiting. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No dogs barking in 13 here. 14 MR. HOLEKAMP: Okay. Environmental Health. 15 Y'all touched on this one yesterday also in your -- your 16 meeting. And, I -- I guess I -- I want to -- first of all, 17 I'd like to thank y'all for your kind comments about the 18 program and the direction we're going. We're very -- very 19 lucky. We have an officer right now that is semi-retired, 20 that can only make "X" number of dollars. He's giving us a 21 lot of bang for the buck, and he's willing to continue that. 22 He -- he -- in fact, this morning he indicated to me that 23 he'd be willing to work five days a week for the same money. 24 Because the Social Security thing, he cannot make more. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Why? 97 1 MR. HOLEKAMP: He's on Social Security 2 disability. He's on Social Security disability. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. And the -- 4 MR. HOLEKAMP: That has not -- 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That hasn't changed 6 under the -- 7 MR. HOLEKAMP: It does not have anything to 8 do with regular Social Security. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 10 MR. HOLEKAMP: It's a whole different deal. 11 And, he -- he -- one thing about Ed -- Ed North is, he likes 12 to work. He likes to get out there. So, I pretty much left 13 the -- the budget the same. I asked for additional money in 14 vehicle gas, oil, and maintenance, because he probably will 15 do a little bit more driving than -- than the two days which 16 I had figured originally, the two days a week. Had some 17 increases in the telephone bill; that's another one, there 18 again, that I have a problem with budgeting. I'm not smart 19 enough, I guess, to get that one right. We -- I reduced 20 Professional Services, and I left -- 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: What is the Professional 22 Services for? 23 MR. HOLEKAMP: You know, that was one of 24 those that, when we did the grant, they required us to put 25 it in there. A lot of counties charge -- the County 98 1 Attorney's office or the District Attorney's office charges 2 for legal fees to their departments. They're charged out. 3 So, we had put that in there in case we had -- had to pay 4 for legal fees at that time, and it's just been sitting 5 there. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So nobody gets an 7 idea that we're going to do it. 8 MR. HOLEKAMP: Fine with me. I mean -- 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: That could be -- I think we 10 could zero that one out, since we never spend any money. 11 MR. HOLEKAMP: It's just one of those things 12 that has been there since day one. And, I don't think -- I 13 don't recall ever having used any of it. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Glenn, tell me about 15 105, Secretary Salary, at $2,400. 16 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yeah, that's another area, 17 when we were doing the grant, what we were doing is we were 18 supplementing -- or not supplementing -- 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Allocating. 20 MR. HOLEKAMP: Allocating $200 a month 21 towards a secretary's salary, because that -- we calculated 22 about that amount of time that she was spend -- that she 23 spent doing clerical work for Solid Waste. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So that's not a real 25 number. You're paying for that secretary out of another 99 1 line? 2 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Out of the budget. 4 That's not a real number. 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah, it's real. The 6 other number is reduced by that amount. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is it? 8 MR. HOLEKAMP: Well, it isn't, but it could 9 be. I mean, for a grant -- for grant purposes -- see, when 10 we did the grant, we were required to put "X" number of 11 dollars down for clerical, "X" number down for -- 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, in-kind. 13 MR. HOLEKAMP: Buster knows, that first time 14 we went through this circus, we had to put all of these 15 little different areas of cost down. 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right, I understand. 17 But -- so, are you saying that -- that this is 18 double-booked? 19 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. At this time, it 20 is. 21 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Zero this out or 22 reduce the other entry by $2,400. 23 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Zero this one out. 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Zero it out. 100 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I say do it the other 2 way; reduce the other one, 'cause I think it gives a truer 3 reflection. If the secretarial work is being done for this 4 department, if we're going to look at expanding down the 5 road, I think it gives it a more realistic idea what we're 6 spending on it. I mean, even though it's more work, I 7 understand that, but it does give us -- to me, a better idea 8 of what Environmental Health is costing us. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is this a fair 10 representation of the amount of work that secretary does? 11 MR. HOLEKAMP: It's pretty close. Pretty 12 close. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To me, I mean -- 14 MR. HOLEKAMP: But there are no benefits or 15 deductions here. 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: There's FICA. 17 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yeah, FICA, that's it. But 18 no -- 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's for -- 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Oh, that's for 21 Inspector -- 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm with Commissioner 23 Letz; I think it gives a clearer picture of what the -- what 24 that person's actually doing. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think I agree with 101 1 that, if that's an accurate representation. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, ho. 3 MR. HOLEKAMP: Well, what -- one thing I -- 4 if y'all would like for me to, then I could probably, after 5 talking to Mr. North this morning and finding out where 6 we're at on the -- his -- his salary, and under those 7 directions of what you're saying, I can retool this thing 8 and bring it back to you, possibly on the next budget 9 session, if you so wished. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Retool what, if 11 Mr. North is going to work more? That this person is going 12 to be required to do more? 13 MR. HOLEKAMP: No, no, no. To reflect on the 14 secretary's salary the percentage of retirement and health 15 benefits, because that's not in here. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 17 MR. HOLEKAMP: Do you understand? If you 18 want me to show it as reflected in this budget -- 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I know it's probably more 20 work all the way around, but to me it gives a truer picture 21 of what we're doing. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Is Ed actually getting paid 23 $15,000 a year? 24 MR. HOLEKAMP: No, sir. No, sir. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: He's being paid significantly 102 1 less than that. 2 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: By what, about $750 a month? 4 MR. HOLEKAMP: Forty. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: $740 a month? 6 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Can he earn up to 15? 8 MR. HOLEKAMP: No, sir. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: $740 is the most he can earn 10 a month? 11 MR. HOLEKAMP: But I just found out those 12 numbers the last two weeks, those definite numbers. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, that number needs 14 to be readjusted. 15 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir, that's what I meant. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: But, you know, what we might 17 consider doing, in light of the importance that we're all 18 rightfully placing on this, is to leave it at 15, and maybe 19 find a second person to do -- to work part-time. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, I would be in favor 21 of leaving it at 15 also, because I think -- I mean, 22 hopefully Mr. North will stay out there, but if he doesn't, 23 then we have to go out and do a budget amendment, 'cause 24 it's a unique situation with his salary. And, I think 25 during the interim, as long as he's there, I would agree 103 1 with the Judge; let's try to find a part-time person to 2 assist. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Speaking of that, I 4 know that in the interim, you -- I think you were going to 5 talk with the Sheriff's Office about the -- about possibly a 6 deputy picking up some part-time work. Is that a 7 possibility? 8 MR. HOLEKAMP: Well, we -- we did there for a 9 while, and it did not work out very well because of the 10 way -- we're not able to -- out of two different payrolls, a 11 Kerr County employee that's currently paid by the Sheriff's 12 Department, the secondary salary -- a second salary really 13 makes a mess of their deductions and stuff. And, none of 14 them want to do it out of Accounts Payable, because there 15 are no deductions, and they're responsible for all the taxes 16 later on. So, that's a tough one. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I know that yesterday, 18 I went with Mr. North, and we confronted a fellow that's 19 been thumbing his nose at Kerr County for some time, and 20 Eddie walking up there with a badge and a gun on changed the 21 atmosphere a lot. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'll bet. 23 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir, it does work. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Attitude adjustment. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, would it be easier 104 1 to maybe -- to put the Inspector Salary to what we're paying 2 Mr. North, and put the balance in part-time? Or just leave 3 it all in Inspector Salary? 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: I -- you know, six of one, 5 half a dozen of another. I'd just as soon leave it in 6 Inspector Salary. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: That -- you know, we're 9 trying to move away from all that part-time stuff. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: And since the inspector's 12 part-time anyway -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Let's just have 14 two inspectors. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: We could have more than one 16 inspector. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: But if you're going to 18 allocate the functions, we need to allocate everything; 19 FICA, retirement, and all -- or not retirement in this case, 20 but everything ought to be allocated, and wherever this 21 other eight-tenths of a secretary is or whatever. 22 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Needs to be -- 24 everything allocated correctly, too. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: I think we can just do that 105 1 as part of the -- part of budget. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: But it's 3 double-booked. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: We'll have to reduce it. 5 MR. HOLEKAMP: Just go ahead and make those 6 changes? 7 MR. TOMLINSON: Yeah, we can make them. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: We'll have to reduce the 9 secretary under the Ag Barn by $2,400; that will make a 10 change in -- 11 MR. TOMLINSON: We can do it by journal 12 entries, which is okay. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Just make sure we get it 14 right on the final one. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Glenn, on Line 330, 16 Operating Expense, what is that? 17 MR. HOLEKAMP: Operating Expense is -- it 18 goes all the way from pens -- they don't -- he really -- he 19 does have office supplies in this budget. Operating Expense 20 would be -- I'd have to go back -- this was one of the old 21 AACOG -- 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Another one of those 23 items that you put in as in-kind for the grant? 24 MR. HOLEKAMP: Well, you know, we have -- we 25 have not spent -- this year, the reason why you don't see 106 1 much taken out of any of these expense line items is because 2 the Auditor's office has done a real good job of pulling it 3 out of AACOG grant, other. You can see it there. 4 MR. TOMLINSON: You will use it next year. 5 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. You know, next 6 year -- that's the reason why we're having to leave it this 7 year, 'cause there won't be that -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I agree. 9 MR. HOLEKAMP: AACOG grant. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Any other questions on 11 the Environmental Health? Is that all you're up for today? 12 MS. SOVIL: He isn't specifically listed on 13 the Ag Barn. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Yeah, okay. All right. 15 Marc? That's Number 14, I believe -- no. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Same. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Same? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. I said same; I don't 19 think it is. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: What tab are you, Marc? 21 MR. ALLEN: First off -- 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Twenty, I believe. 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Ten? 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Twenty. 107 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Twenty, got it. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Go for it. 3 MR. ALLEN: First off, on my proposal that I 4 turned in to you guys, there is an addition error, and I 5 don't know if y'all caught it. I sure did after I turned it 6 in. Instead of $175,671, it should be $182,871. And, since 7 then, I've turned in a proposal to the City of Kerrville for 8 our Animal Control services and shelter services, and I've 9 got copies of what I did send in to them. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Marc, that $182,871 12 replaces 200,073? 13 MR. ALLEN: No, that's Capital Outlay. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. It replaces 15 the $175,671? 16 MR. ALLEN: That's correct. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: This budget you've given us, 18 Marc, does not reflect reimbursement from -- 19 MR. ALLEN: The City. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- the City? 21 MR. ALLEN: No, it doesn't. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 23 MR. ALLEN: What I just gave you, my proposal 24 to the City would be less that amount from this $182,871. 25 That's if they don't reject that proposal. As far as I 108 1 know, they haven't -- they called me this morning and asked 2 me a few questions, but they sounded pretty confident with 3 it. It is about $7,000 over last year's, and that's just 4 due to the fact everything has gone up; wages, insurance, 5 vehicle maintenance. But, that's less the Capital Outlay, 6 too. We can't charge them for Capital Outlay; that's per 7 the contract. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's right. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 10 MR. ALLEN: The first item is on my kennel 11 worker. When we replaced this worker last year -- and we 12 went for years without that kennel worker, and we got a 13 kennel worker last year, and y'all questioned me when I -- I 14 told you what the salary would be, and I'm afraid it's not 15 going to be enough to keep a good, responsible person in 16 there, and I'd like to see if I could up that. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Do you have someone in that 18 position right now? 19 MR. ALLEN: Yes, I do. I had somebody 20 transfer into this department, and they took a cut in pay, 21 but it's -- they're not real happy with the pay, but they 22 knew what it was when they came over. It's just -- I don't 23 think it's going to be enough to keep them in there. The -- 24 the second major item -- well, the FICA and the group 25 insurance, all that goes with the salary changes. The 109 1 office supplies, I've reduced that a little bit and moved it 2 over to the lease copier. The copier that we have, we're 3 having a lot of billing problems. They're charging us for 4 maintenance per copy, and this new copier that we have 5 gotten is a lot better. I mean, it's -- I don't think we're 6 going to have a billing problems; we're not going to have 7 maintenance problems. And, we've got to have a good copier 8 in there to -- all of our paperwork goes through that copy 9 machine. The only forms that we don't -- that doesn't go 10 through that copy machine is our impounds and our impound 11 cards. All our bite records, all our animal release forms, 12 adoption contracts, everything goes through that copy 13 machine. I think it's real important that we have that. 14 Vehicle oil and maintenance, I've raised that 15 substantially, and due to the fact that we have a 16 10-year-old vehicle there that's got 140-plus thousand miles 17 on it, and I'm having quite a few problems with it. That 18 could be reduced if I did get one of the items I'm 19 requesting on my Capital Outlay, but I -- I do have an older 20 truck. I'd really like to get it replaced, if possible. 21 And, I think that's pretty much it till you get to the 22 Capital Outlay, and I'm asking for two sets of some cat 23 cages, stainless steel cat cages. And, reason being, back 24 in May, I think we had a record-breaking month. There was a 25 couple of weeks -- probably three weeks in a row where, you 110 1 know, we only have 15 cat cages there, but I had 40-plus 2 cats in the shelter. Ninety percent of them were wild, and 3 I had them in traps and carriers and doubled up and tripled 4 up and quadrupled up. I needed some kind of relief. We 5 euthanized -- on one day, we euthanized, like, 36 cats and 6 had 29 come in right behind it, and it was killing me. I 7 mean, we were scrambling all over the place trying to find 8 just some -- a little extra room. I'd like to get some kind 9 of relief on that. 10 Also, we're asking for a digital camera. Our 11 cruelty calls are up tremendously. Every time we go out on 12 a cruelty case, we've got to call the Sheriff's Department 13 to come take pictures for us. I really think that if we got 14 us a good digital camera, it would probably pay for itself 15 after a while, just, you know, not tying up deputies. And a 16 digital camera, you don't have to have the film developed; 17 it can be done right on the computer. But, I -- our cruelty 18 calls are getting more and more, especially this time of 19 year with the heat. We're having to go out, call the 20 deputy, take pictures, write the report and file it and see 21 if it flies. And also, we're asking for a new truck to 22 replace the old '91 Ford. I've done a little investigating; 23 it seems I can get a pretty decent truck like the one we got 24 a year and a half ago, and at a fairly decent price. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How many -- there's how 111 1 many trucks total? 2 MR. ALLEN: Three. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There's a '91? 4 MR. ALLEN: '91, the '98 model that we got 5 from the City, and the 2000 model we got two years ago. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Marc, is that '91 7 equipped? I mean, does it have cages on it? 8 MR. ALLEN: Yes. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Too many. 10 MR. ALLEN: Got the radios, cages -- we've 11 talked about changing the cages on the back, 'cause we use 12 that truck a lot for hauling the traps and hauling dead 13 animals. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And those things would 15 be fairly trans -- easy to transfer to -- 16 MR. ALLEN: Yes. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- a new truck the 18 same size? 19 MR. ALLEN: You bet. I can transfer 20 everything on that. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Glenn was here. Will the 22 red truck work for -- the Parks truck, Glenn? 23 MR. HOLEKAMP: Pardon me? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The red truck that Animal 25 Control's -- 112 1 MR. HOLEKAMP: It probably would. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The Parks truck shouldn't 3 need to be driven that much, I don't think. 4 MR. HOLEKAMP: It probably would work, yeah. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Larry, if you know, 7 are there computers equipped to take the downloads from the 8 digital camera? They are equipped? 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Usually you get the 10 software with the camera. 11 MR. ALLEN: Yeah. We just got our new 12 computer -- well, we've had it, but we're putting more input 13 out on it every day. 14 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: MP-4 also is an 15 option; not as good as some of the software that comes from 16 the camera, but even if you just had a camera, you can dump 17 it into the Internet process. I mean, that's on any 18 Windows-based computer. 19 MR. ALLEN: That camera would be a tremendous 20 help. I mean, it would be great. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any questions of Marc? 22 Anything else you want to tell us? 23 MR. ALLEN: No. We're busy. There's no such 24 thing as the dog days of summer any more, because the dogs 25 aren't hiding under the trees. We're staying busy during 113 1 the day. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What a great quote for 3 the newspaper. 4 MR. ALLEN: When I started working here, the 5 dog days of summer were July and August, and we'd average 6 three, four calls a day. I mean, we could actually go hide, 7 and we can't hide any more. There's no way. Monday we ran 8 23 calls. And, I don't know if it's just that the county's 9 growing, if more people are doing a better service, or 10 people are asking for more. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're doing a better 12 service; that's exactly what it is. 13 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's exactly what it 14 is, that's true. And people know you're there. And I think 15 that's only happened in the last -- I mean, a lot of people 16 know that you are there at the other end of that telephone, 17 and a lot of people are calling now that wouldn't have 18 called three years ago. 19 MR. ALLEN: Well, we try. We really do. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And you're an easy 21 hit. 22 MR. ALLEN: Well, yeah, we're targeted 23 everywhere we go. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Well, you've spent 25 enough time loafing in the air conditioning. Get back out 114 1 on the streets. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah, right. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Let's break till about 10 4 till 3:00 and hold up Road and Bridge a little bit, but 5 Kathy needs to stretch, and I think it will do us all good. 6 So, take a six, seven-minute break, and we'll come back and 7 get after it. 8 (Recess taken from 2:42 p.m. to 2:50 p.m.) 9 - - - - - - - - - - 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Let's go ahead and reconvene 11 the budget workshops. The next topic for discussion is the 12 Road and Bridge Department. Leonard, take us through it. 13 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. I believe we'll start 14 out -- and what you have there is the 600, and I have no 15 changes on 600. I'll sure take any questions that you might 16 have on -- on the 600 budget. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: The only question I would 19 have, Leonard, is on 440, our utilities. And the reason -- 20 and the printout I got from Tommy indicated that they 21 estimated about $4,800 in utilities this year, and so I 22 think, unless you plan to turn the air-conditioners down, we 23 probably ought to take that line up to $5,000 for next year. 24 MR. ODOM: Truby, how are we running right 25 now? I don't have that printout. Do you? 115 1 MS. HARDIN: I don't have the printout, what 2 Tommy has here. 3 MR. ODOM: That may be. I'm sorry. At this 4 point, it's -- I can't answer that for you at this point. 5 I'd have to get our printout and see where we're at. 6 MR. TOMLINSON: What I did, I took what we 7 spent current. 8 MR. ODOM: Current. 9 MR. TOMLINSON: And went back to last year 10 and see what we spent for the remaining months last year, 11 for the summer, and wound up -- it looks to be -- if we 12 spend the same amount, it's going to be over. 13 MR. ODOM: Going to be over? 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: So, I'd make it $5,000, is 15 what my recommendation would be on that Line 440. That will 16 give you at least a running start next year. 17 MR. ODOM: Well, it would be a better start. 18 Seems like that 800 -- if we were running hard, it would be 19 right at the end of September; that's where it would hit. 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Mm-hmm. 21 MR. ODOM: But 800 seems to be a large 22 percentage, a 20 percent increase, but that -- I don't have 23 the most current number to tell you exactly. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, we'd rather -- 25 MR. ODOM: But, now, we -- my question would 116 1 be, if we do that, then would I need to change something 2 over in 611 to make up for that difference? 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: No. 4 MR. ODOM: Okay. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: What about your -- why don't 6 you talk to us briefly about your Capital Outlay there on 7 600, your $3,300 you have showing? 8 MR. ODOM: All right. Capital purchases on 9 600 is two printers, $600. We were trying to -- the chairs 10 over there, there's 11 chairs that we were trying to 11 replace. That was $2,200. And, that rattan -- that little 12 bamboo deal that we have in front, we were trying to replace 13 that; we call that the waiting area furniture. That was 14 $500. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Which chairs are they? 17 MR. ODOM: That's that wicker -- that white 18 wicker when you come in, right there against the wall. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean the 11 chairs. 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: The 11 chairs in the 21 conference room. 22 MS. HARDIN: The chairs are in the conference 23 room. 24 MR. ODOM: Conference room. 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And the break area. 117 1 MR. ODOM: And the break area. And our 2 chairs in there, a couple of those changing in there. The 3 things that we have in our -- in our room came from Ackman 4 Road, from surplus. Everything in there was surplus, and I 5 bought that at Ackman Road for little bit of something to 6 have -- seats around the table that we could sit in. 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Some of those are 8 getting into the liability area. 9 MR. ODOM: They are getting -- I mean, they 10 were used and they were -- they were excess from the 11 military, or from some -- from the state agency, and -- and 12 I bought them years ago, 'cause we never did have a budget 13 for any -- we built the building and had no budget for 14 anything. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anybody have any questions 16 about 600 before we move on? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are some of those 18 chairs those old Commissioner chairs? 19 MR. ODOM: No. Those are those old blue 20 ones, the -- the swivel-type. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Let's go to 611, then. 22 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. 611 is also the same as 23 it was last year. There are some changes on some line 24 items, but the dollars are the same as they were last year. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Point out to us the major 118 1 changes in line items, if you would, please. 2 MR. ODOM: All right. The one that we would 3 have -- Crew Salaries, 111, that includes -- and which I've 4 been putting into the budget over the last three years, four 5 years, was an extra person. That was riding -- I had one 6 last year, I had another person that followed in on that, so 7 that's a 12-1, as well as some merit increases, as directed. 8 But, that $519,094 includes a 12-1 position. And, I've had 9 that budgeted -- like I say, the numbers have worked that 10 way for several years. We've shown that. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 12 MR. ODOM: Of course, the FICA and that are 13 associated with that, with overtime. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Mm-hmm. 15 MR. ODOM: As well as some part-time salary 16 right there. We're finding that, with what we've gotten 17 this -- a lot of mowing may or may not work, but we've spent 18 a lot of time mowing early with the rain that we had. Of 19 course, now we have no rain, and now we're in the middle of 20 the sealcoat, so it's pretty hard to break off and try to 21 get out and mow. So, we increased that to make sure that we 22 had that buffer until I can find a 12-1. That's -- with a 23 Class A CDL, it's difficult. I just always -- it takes a 24 while to find an individual. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The worker's comp, does 119 1 this hit -- I mean, worker's comp for the County goes -- 2 went up so much. Is yours going to be going up the same? 3 MR. TOMLINSON: Yeah, it will. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: We added about 40 percent on 5 workmen's comp? 6 (Mr. Tomlinson nodded.) 7 MR. ODOM: Now, would that be for my -- 8 40 percent overall? Or 40 percent, each department? 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Tommy? 10 MR. TOMLINSON: It's overall. It applies to 11 any -- it applies to anybody that has worker's comp in the 12 budget. 13 MR. ODOM: So, I'm looking at about a 14 $10,000 -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Increase, yeah. 16 Forty percent increase over the 27. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: It hit everybody. 18 (Discussion off the record.) 19 MR. ODOM: Well, I would have to go back into 20 some of this. I mean -- 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's -- I mean, that's 22 just -- we all had to. 23 MR. ODOM: I'm sorry, I didn't know. 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That number didn't get 25 generated when the other numbers were plugged in. It's just 120 1 keyed off of that, anyway. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, so you don't have 3 to worry about it now, but -- 4 MR. ODOM: I'm hoping that this will 5 stabilize after this year, but I don't know what that factor 6 would be, but I -- I sure hope it's -- this insurance 7 stabilizes. Let's see. I -- Equipment Rental, Item 460. 8 What I have now is two new piece -- well, two new pieces. 9 The equipment's five years old. I have a 12-H maintainer 10 and a 924 loader. One is coming due in November, the other 11 one in March. And, we've checked on the price; this 12 reflects that, as well as I have a 678 John Deere that must 13 be a 1980 model that we're worried about in maintenance, 14 because I -- you know, we're just barely surviving on the 15 dollars without a major hit. We're afraid that the engine's 16 going to go on it. So, I factored in two 12-H's and a 924 17 loader on the same type of program, and that reflects that 18 cost here. Next year's budget will be a little bit 19 different, but those numbers all matched for the last three 20 -- for the next three years; they all showed a match, the 21 same number, and -- as this year's, and as -- well, this 22 year, the working budget that we've got. So, I show no 23 increase for three years, but -- although that reflects, 24 because the budget will be -- on that loader is reflected 25 next budget year in March. It will pick up in October, so 121 1 it's going to be a little bit of difference. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are you going to surplus 3 the maintainer? 4 MR. ODOM: I'll have a surplus on the 5 maintainer. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You should make up that 7 difference, probably, on surplus. 8 MR. ODOM: Pardon me? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Surplus, put it out; 10 you'll probably make it up. 11 MR. ODOM: We're going to see what the trade 12 would be. We don't know where we're going to be. We're 13 going to look at the same thing as -- on our Capital Outlay. 14 Well, we haven't got to that yet. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 16 MR. ODOM: But, yes, we were thinking of 17 that, but, you know, if we -- we don't know what we're 18 really going to get on some of this equipment. You go to 19 some of these yards right now -- Holt is stacking up that 20 yard full of equipment. A lot of things are slowing down, 21 and they're stacking equipment. So, it's a good time to 22 negotiate with them, but it's not a good time to let them 23 try to give you the other end on it. He's got enough steel 24 in that yard right now. Let's see. The other major thing 25 that I think that I have, if you look at some of the other 122 1 little line items, I'm reducing those on down. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Mm-hmm. 3 MR. ODOM: As I'm doing that, that's sort of 4 showing -- if you look at my three-year budgets, it's 5 reflecting that. I'm getting near the end of this 6 reconstruction and I want to get over to the maintenance 7 mode where I get out of building roads. Hopefully not 8 another 3 miles of -- of Ingram out there. But, those are 9 the things that we would like to use the contractor to do, 10 and -- but we're almost through with the dirt roads. There 11 will be some of them -- we'll still have dirt roads, I 12 think, just for the nature of the right-of-ways, 30-foot 13 right-of-ways, things like that. Those are not things I 14 want to waste County money on. If I don't have a 30-foot 15 right-of-way -- they can have dirt if they don't give me 60 16 foot. So, I think the Court, sometime in the future, will 17 address that, but we're looking at some type of -- of -- 18 that's our policy right now. And we just see that -- that 19 in the next three years, that we're going to be done and 20 have just about everything, with the exception of some 21 20-foot or 30-foot right-of-ways. That's it. We've 22 basically got the county rebuilt. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Great. 24 MR. ODOM: And that's within the budget that 25 we've been receiving. Now, of course, you know, Capital 123 1 Outlays is the other, but it stays exactly the same. It 2 will -- I'll be more than glad to go over that, if you wish 3 to. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Not yet. I want to go 5 back; I want to touch base on one particular line here, 6 first. 7 MR. ODOM: All right, sir. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see you've reduced 9 road base. 10 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I was wondering -- 12 and that may not even be the line that you would do. 13 What -- what I'm going to request you to do is, what about 14 pulling shoulders and laying material out there and pulling 15 shoulders on the side of the road? I know that's a 16 maintenance-type issue. And, to give you an example, 17 Ranchero Road that I drive daily, and Mr. Williams spends 18 quite a bit of time out there also, first half is, what, two 19 years old? And the second half is one year old, and we're 20 already on the edges. We already have some drop-offs, like, 21 this big, this deep. And, it's just a matter of time that's 22 going to start crumbling off. We're going to end up with 23 our goat trail again. And, the way I understand it from 24 TexDOT is, the only way you correct that is put your 25 material down and pull the shoulders up to the -- to the 124 1 pavement. 2 MR. ODOM: Right. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I would think 4 that -- that base line would be where you would -- you get 5 the material to do that. 6 MR. ODOM: Well, we get that material from 7 that. Also, that -- this also covers when I go into a -- a 8 road and I rebuild, I buy material from individuals, maybe, 9 there. But, $18,000 is 5,000 to 6,000 tons of material. I 10 don't have the manpower to pull 500 miles of road a year. 11 We pull them as maintenance is needed, but I assure you that 12 that's more than enough money to do it with that side loader 13 what you're talking about, you know, where I can get to -- 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me rephrase my 15 question. When are we going to do that? 16 MR. ODOM: Well, I don't know, sir, at this 17 point. I'm up here to talk about the budget instead of 18 maintenance, but I'll -- I don't have a complaint on that at 19 this point. So, I don't know. You can turn it in to 20 Truby -- well, turn it in to Truby, and, you know -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Len, don't interrupt 22 me, please. I see this line item being reduced. 23 MR. ODOM: Mm-hmm. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I'm asking you, is 25 that where you would get the material to do that type of 125 1 work? 2 MR. ODOM: And I said that's part of it. The 3 other part is cold mix, Buster. The other part is cold mix. 4 That's -- that's what we use on the edge most of the time. 5 The base, itself, will come out. And, where we can -- and 6 mostly what happens on corners. That's where it comes out, 7 because they cut the mustard. That road is 22 foot out 8 there. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 10 MR. ODOM: That's the most I could get out of 11 that road. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And it's fast -- fast 13 becoming 20, is my point. And, I -- and I probably don't 14 have to drive out there and call Truby. Anybody can see it. 15 MR. ODOM: I don't drive it all the time, so 16 I don't know, sir. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Consider this a 18 complaint -- 19 MS. HARDIN: Got it. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- please. Thank you. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You can nail it from 22 both of us, 'cause I've noticed it, too. 23 MR. ODOM: But the answer to your question, 24 part of it's base and part of it's cold mix. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 126 1 MR. ODOM: Cold mix will stay longer than the 2 base will. And, what the -- what the state has is -- is 3 24-foot roads and 8-foot shoulders, and so, normally, they 4 put base in there and they don't sealcoat the shoulders out 5 there. But, we'll -- in our case, we don't have much of 6 anything. We don't even have hardly shoulders. It goes 7 almost immediately to a ditch, particularly at Ranchero. 8 So, they cut the butter and they cut the inside and they cut 9 the -- they cut the corner there. And that -- we either put 10 base or either -- normally, we'll put asphalt in there, 11 'cause it stays. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, thank you. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Question I have -- and 14 this will really probably affect Buster's precinct more -- 15 something I've noticed in Kendall County on a road, and I 16 hear complaints or concerns about it, is bike lanes. And, I 17 know that -- and I say bike lanes. The -- the route that I 18 hear a lot -- I hear this because I'm on this -- this city 19 thing and I'm on the committee with -- 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: You wanted it. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm on the committee with 22 Lisa Knott, so that will explain why bikes are a big 23 concern. But, anyway, Sheppard Rees is a highly used bike 24 trail for bike riders. They go out that way, wind around 25 and make a loop, come out, you know, that whole area. 127 1 Anyway, Kendall County has some county roads that they have 2 added a white stripe and probably 4 feet of -- on the 3 shoulder for a bike lane. Is that something that's, I mean, 4 extremely expensive if we have the right-of-way? Or is it 5 something that -- you know, it's just an idea. Or is 6 that -- that's a road that we're working on upgrading in the 7 future, and it seems to me that if we were going to do 8 something like that, that would be the time to do it. 9 MR. ODOM: Sixty-foot right-of-way puts 10 you -- if you go by the spec that you have, puts you within 11 2 foot, a foot each side, of the property line by the time 12 you get your ditches. So, there's not any room there, by 13 the specs. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, to put a bike lane in 15 on a road, you'd have to have -- 16 MR. ODOM: Something wider. You need to go 17 like the city, out 80 foot. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That answers the 19 question. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just e-mailed them 21 that exact question. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Must be call from Lisa 23 Knott. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Why don't you just walk us 25 through your 611 Capital Outlay. 128 1 (Discussion off the record.) 2 MR. ODOM: Okay, I got three columns. Okay, 3 cab and chassis, five-speed diesel. That is for -- that's 4 $40,000, which was for the service truck. That is for cab 5 and chassis, and then the service body for it. And then 6 there's a foreman's truck of 26. I have down an 8-cubic 7 yard dump truck, GMC, like we normally have. This is -- 8 we're debating at this point. I've talked to the shop 9 foreman to see how he felt. We're looking at the 10 possibility of a -- a truck, the cab and chassis with a 11 bucket for cutting brush. The only way that we can cut 12 brush right now is with a loader, to put a man in a loader 13 bucket and raise him up in the air, and that's -- that's 14 dangerous. And we don't have any other way to do it. And 15 then, with -- you know, in the wintertime, it's a little bit 16 easier, but in the summertime we're always doing the 17 maintenance. I'm on one road -- I'm not on Ranchero; I'm 18 somewhere else, and, you know, we just don't have the time 19 to take a -- a loader -- cutting brush is at the end of our 20 priorities right now. And, so we're thinking about that. 21 I'm also looking at the possibility, can we 22 get a -- a truck with a grabber or in a dump bed? I don't 23 know. We've thought about that, because we see this 24 changing. We're getting a whole lot more complaints about 25 brush cutting, and then it takes up dump trucks to put brush 129 1 in to haul it off. So, we thought maybe we could have 2 something instead of a loader there, trying to load the dump 3 trucks with that; maybe there would be a grabber. We could 4 take and load a truck or load -- you know, at least load the 5 dump trucks and still leave the loader alone. So -- but one 6 way or another, we've got -- we've got that 8-yard dump 7 truck in there. It may be a bucket truck, if we can work 8 the numbers to make it work. We think it would be better, 9 and we would not sacrifice anything, because if you -- as we 10 go through, you can see that line item goes on out for the 11 next three years, trying to replace the dump trucks as they 12 get older, and we're not caught in that scenario of having 13 1978 trucks still in there and 1984 trucks. We're trying to 14 keep them fairly new so we can cut our maintenance down and 15 keep our maintenance dollars about where we're at. 16 Then there's a side loader with whirlybird, 17 and that's where we do the edging with -- for these roads. 18 Instead of dumping it out with the blade and all, we have a 19 side loader that -- that takes it and just mills this 20 material right out on the shoulders of the road, and which 21 makes less handling, makes it more efficient. You can bust 22 it out with the maintainer, we can do a whole lot more 23 edging and with asphalt and base, and makes the job look 24 more efficient. We get more productivity there that way. 25 We have one that's down, and essentially it costs as much -- 130 1 as much to repair it as to buy a new one, so we put it in to 2 do this, to go ahead and replace that one. Chain saws and 3 trimmers, normal trying to keep them up so that we have 4 something to go out and work with and have to keep the 5 productivity up. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Len, you go through 7 three or four chainsaws a year? 8 MR. ODOM: At least two. And part of this is 9 having those pole saws, when they stand on the ground and 10 trying to get something within 10 or 11 feet, you trim it 11 up. Other than -- anybody higher than that has to get in a 12 bucket of a loader. Radios and antennas, this is part of 13 updating our old equipment and any of the new equipment that 14 we get to make those go and keep something in reserve for 15 these radios. And, they go out every now and then. Some of 16 them just cannot be repaired; we're told to just replace 17 them. A shredder for 70-horse tractor. This is what we use 18 for our mowing program. I've got four. I've got two 19 60-horse with a single, and I have two with 70's. So, what 20 we propose to do is to trade in one of the 60's this year to 21 get another 70 with a batwing on it, and then next year 22 we'll trade the other one off, 60-horse. And, we've tried 23 to figure those prices in there that we -- to reflect what 24 we think we can get this trade-in for those tractors. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Leonard, is your truck -- 131 1 I'm looking at the tractor -- used primarily for mowing, or 2 is there another use for them? 3 MR. ODOM: No, sir, they're going -- 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Have you looked at 5 contracting the shredding like the Highway Department does? 6 MR. ODOM: Yes, I have. And I've gone to the 7 State before, and they didn't have a -- a total program, 8 because they were frustrated on 39, and they told me that it 9 -- I would -- I could not do -- they do not feel like I 10 could do the whole program, because what they have is a real 11 clear, wide area, and it's easy to get people. I -- when I 12 first came here, I looked at contracting, and I couldn't get 13 anybody to -- to want to do it because of our county roads 14 and the narrowness of it. And, so I am thinking about that, 15 to put a program together over the next couple years to -- I 16 can contract out some. But, I can tell you, some of these 17 people are not going to bid on it. If they do, I probably 18 can't afford it. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Without tearing up all 20 the fences. 21 MR. ODOM: If they're easy and wide-open, 22 they can run, they will do it. And maybe some of them might 23 be able to do it if we looked at a program of -- where I'm 24 going into some subdivisions and mowing. Maybe I ought to 25 stay out of high, high density areas; just mow up to it. 132 1 The city of Castroville, one of the things they do, you go 2 from your property line to the edge of the road. You 3 maintain that. You maintain it. And, maybe we do one pass. 4 I looked at -- Utah Department of Transportation is doing 5 one pass instead of cutting everything, because their 6 wildlife people are saying what you do, you bring the deer 7 down -- the reason you cut is so that deer won't be next to 8 the road. But, the catch-22 is, as you mow, the deer come 9 to the new cutting, 'cause that's the greens. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Mm-hmm. 11 MR. ODOM: So, there you've brought them to 12 the road. And, they say that you -- if you only do one 13 pass -- you know, for us, maybe one pass may be this far to 14 the ditch on some of these roads. But, they say if you just 15 make one pass and leave it, deer are scared of high grass 16 and snakes, and they said that if you've got this buffer 17 between them, that they won't be migrating out there; that 18 you cut down the possibility. If they are, they're out in 19 visibility. So, there's some things I wanted to look at and 20 come to the Court about the way we do things, why we do it, 21 and maybe I can cut down and maybe I can contract some of 22 this stuff out. But, that's the reason I had the part-time, 23 to make -- I feel that I only have 3-man crews, and I put a 24 man with it, so I can keep two in there and try to get some 25 kind of maintenance up, at least in that -- that area. 133 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Leonard, another 3 thing -- this is before you, but one time we were going to 4 save some money and contract out some guys -- maintainers 5 cutting the ditches, cleaning the ditches up. And, we 6 didn't save a penny, 'cause they kept their blade in 7 people's fences. 8 MR. ODOM: All the time. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I mean, they just tore 10 up, I mean, literally a half mile of fence at a time; just 11 kept right on going. 12 MR. ODOM: Kept going. And then you get into 13 the high density; you throw a rock, and everybody's got a 14 paint job they want. Or you -- we've even gone down part of 15 the road down Ranchero, back over there, and they slung a 16 rock through a person's house with -- they were sitting 17 there and had company, and it went right through the window. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's popular. 19 MR. ODOM: And, you know, there are some 20 things I think that we could look at in the possibility of 21 high density that we cut down, and do some things out, and 22 maybe I can contract. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. I just -- that 24 answers the question. 25 MR. ODOM: I really have -- you know, we've 134 1 really looked at it. It's just -- Highway Department said, 2 "Len, you're just not going to get these people to bid on a 3 lot of your roads." They like something that's clean and 4 easy to get in there and get out. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 6 MR. ODOM: And, I have -- the next item was 7 bi-_________ roller, but that's next year's, so that should 8 take care of it. That's $154,492, as it was last year. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any questions on 611? Okay. 10 Let's go to Special Projects. 11 MR. ODOM: I think that was as the page 12 before, right? Okay. Yes, 4. 13 MS. HARDIN: On the front one that you have, 14 on Page 7. 15 MR. ODOM: Is this the one that they've got? 16 (Discussion off the record.) 17 MR. ODOM: Excuse me just a second. Let 18 me -- y'all have one, and then I have had one printed up, 19 and I hope that they correlate numbers. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They do. We've been 21 looking at them. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Okay. On the High 23 Water Bridge, I had $200,000 in this year. I have tried as 24 hard as I can to get a number and to see what the number is 25 for the High Water Bridge. I was told that, at first, that 135 1 we weren't probably going to have any money. Then I was 2 told that we were going to need to buy the land. And, I 3 can't get an answer exactly how much land and what they 4 think that cost is going to be. And, before the 4th of 5 June, before I submitted this thing, I wanted a number that 6 was realistic, you know, so I could reflect, "Are you going 7 to do it?" And they said that they did not think that it 8 was going to be done in this budget year; that it would be 9 next budget year. So, I did not put anything in it. And 10 that $200,000, we've already taken the $12,000 out of that 11 for the Hermann Sons. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Mm-hmm. 13 MR. ODOM: So, what I ended up doing was to 14 show that the Hermann Sons bridge -- I kept it the same. 15 The Hermann Sons bridge is $200,000. Now, my understanding 16 there is that that estimate is 92 -- $920,000 for that 17 bridge. I've already given 12, so that means there's 18 $80,000 in there. Then I've got some land acquisition, and 19 I don't know how much, but I feel like that cannot possibly 20 be all that expensive in there. I may be wrong, but maybe 21 $8,000 -- $6,000, $8,000 an acre for the acre and a half, at 22 least. So, we're all right there. And I felt like if they 23 came back with -- I don't remember whether the number was 2 24 or 3 acres -- with Dr. Lewis' property down there, I could 25 not get a number what they estimated, but I -- I don't know. 136 1 I'm going to guess a quarter to 30 cents a square foot. I 2 may be wrong, it may be more. That would be something I'd 3 have to adjust. But, I feel like there's -- that $200,000 4 should cover the High Water commitment there, I think. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Fred, what was -- what 6 was the date on the public hearing? 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: August 13th. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They're having the 9 public hearing. 10 MR. ODOM: Oh, are they having one? 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Having one. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They're having one, 13 and that sounds like, to me, that they're moving -- moving 14 forward. 15 MR. ODOM: Last thing we had was EPA. The -- 16 the Clean Water Act was holding them up, and they had not 17 gotten that past the EPA, so he told me it -- the worst 18 scenario was it wouldn't start -- it might start after the 19 first of the year; it may not. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Bill Tucker told me they got 21 that worked out and they're hopeful that they're on the 22 schedule that we've all been working off of. 23 MR. ODOM: Well, if that's the case, we 24 shouldn't have anything except the land acquisition. And, I 25 don't know what that land's going for, but say that there's 137 1 2 acres; that's $83,000 a square foot. I don't know what it 2 would be valued at, but if it was a dollar, there's 80 -- 3 another hundred. A hundred -- if it was over that, we 4 could -- I mean, I just have to work the money -- I could 5 pay for it somehow. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we could probably 7 take -- I mean, Hermann Sons obviously doesn't need to be 8 $200,000 -- probably take $80,000 of that and put it up in 9 the High Water Bridge -- leave $80,000 in the High Water 10 Bridge and 120 in Hermann Sons. 11 MR. ODOM: Okay. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Hermann Sons, we've 13 already paid that 9 -- 14 MR. ODOM: I paid $12,000 on Hermann Sons, so 15 should have been 92. So, it's -- there's been $80,000 16 there, but I have land acquisition now. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. So, that ought to 18 give us enough, if we had $120,000 in there. That land 19 shouldn't be more than 10 or 15, outside a little bit of 20 road work and have the titles to the bridge. 21 MR. ODOM: See, we wouldn't do that until 22 after the structures -- they're going to do 150 foot, and if 23 not, we could tie it in. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think, you know, put 25 120 on there and 80 at the High Water. It kind of -- 138 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: As place markers. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's my point. I 4 just think that we need something in the High Water Bridge 5 line. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 7 MR. ODOM: I just didn't have an answer. I 8 knew the $200,000 -- I thought we'd talk about it and we'd 9 go from there. I didn't have -- I wanted to make sure. I 10 felt like that would cover both of them. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 12 MR. ODOM: Then, the Upper Turtle Creek, 13 we'll be working on Pike's Peak over there. And -- I'm 14 sorry, Pike's Peak is down here. $18,000 will probably go 15 up on Keith Boulevard, is the way I'm leaning with that. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And, does that 17 complete that area? 18 MR. ODOM: If we get -- when we get through 19 with -- the answer to your question is yes. Pike's Peak's 20 the last part of it. Half of Pike's Peak's done and half of 21 it's not. That will complete that area, yes, sir. I have 22 one dirt road left that we should sealcoat within the next 23 three weeks. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Leonard, two or three 25 items here I want to ask you about. Evans Road is zeroed 139 1 out. 2 MR. ODOM: Right. That's picked up the next 3 year, I believe. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Elm Pass, which 5 you've zeroed out, and you zeroed out general upgrades. Can 6 I assume that Evans Road is being put aside now for two 7 budget years, this year plus next year? Is that the 8 assumption? 9 MR. ODOM: Let me -- I believe that I have 10 two miles of Elm Pass into the sealcoat program. With Pecan 11 Valley; is that right? Pecan Valley? Yeah. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: From Pecan Valley 13 going out. 14 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. I haven't made up my 15 mind whether I want to go ahead and work on the other two. 16 We've got that quarter, and from there to Pecan Valley is 17 another 2 miles. I may do that. I think that I pick up Elm 18 Pass and Evans the next budget year, because I've got from 19 Pecan Valley on. I still have to get that right-of-way 20 secured back there to find out where my right-of-way's at. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: On Evans? 22 MR. ODOM: And go to the County line, right. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 24 MR. ODOM: And I've got to go to Elm Pass 2. 25 Elm Pass 2 will be finished this year. We'll be working on 140 1 that in the next 30 days or so. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 3 MR. ODOM: So, I haven't made up my mind 4 whether I want to pick up from Pecan Valley -- the 2 miles 5 to Elm Pass 2, or either pick up that portion from the 6 bridge there -- from the creek up to Pecan Valley, because 7 we -- Pecan Valley is going to be done at one time. And, 8 then I'd have that last half back there to do. Sealcoat- 9 wise, it would be about 4 miles, I guess. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I believe I consented 11 to using part of the Evans Road moneys this year for this 12 parking out here. Are we using the whole 35 or a portion of 13 the 35? 14 MR. ODOM: Portion of the 35, right. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What would be left? 16 MR. ODOM: I don't have -- 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Don't know yet? 18 MR. ODOM: What do you think that number's 19 going to run, 16? 20 (Discussion off the record.) 21 MR. ODOM: We're probably around $20,000. 22 But, like, that's what I was telling you earlier. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're going to use 24 20 of the 35? 25 MR. ODOM: Well, probably just $15,000 or 141 1 $16,000, if we use that much. We'll have 20 left at least. 2 But, the -- you know, the point is, like I was saying 3 earlier, I don't think I can get to all this. I can't wrap 4 everything up. If I can, then we want to probably rent 5 something -- at least clear the right-of-way up in there and 6 start the process of at least having the right-of-way 7 cleared up in there. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I guess my concern is 9 not delaying it or going past this upcoming budget and into 10 another year, if that's at all possible. Let me finish my 11 questioning; then we'll see where it goes. General upgrades 12 goes from 76 to zero. Tell me about general upgrades. 13 MR. ODOM: The general upgrade was MacDonald 14 Loop. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 16 MR. ODOM: And that's already complete. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 18 MR. ODOM: McDonald Loop is complete. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Specifically, then, 20 where will I find the dollars for the rehabilitation of 21 Center Point Estates Road? 22 MR. ODOM: That is in contract fees. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 24 MR. ODOM: Plus road base and some of the 25 other things. 142 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And when do you 2 contemplate doing the upper portion of Fall Creek? 3 MR. ODOM: Not anytime soon. I don't have a 4 time frame. I got that middle -- 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Before you and I die, 6 or what? 7 MR. ODOM: Probably before Fred up there 8 dies, anyway. Whatever it is. 9 (Laughter.) 10 MR. ODOM: That's in pretty good shape. We 11 got some leveled up to the -- I understand we did that. The 12 portion that I'm concerned about is down from McDonald's 13 place there in that -- from where I stop my construction -- 14 yes, sir, from down that hill, and that little section 15 there. But we do not have any right-of-way; that's by 16 prescription. And, I've talked to the gentleman from 17 Louisiana, and he owns most of that land in there, and the 18 guys that -- I did not talk to that individual specifically, 19 but the man that ran that, and that's the part that needs to 20 be widened in there, not McDonald's hill up there. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No. I -- 22 MR. ODOM: That one's in pretty good shape, 23 except for what they had put in there originally, and it 24 keeps moving up there because of that much ground water. 25 But, we leveled that up, and I understand that it's still in 143 1 pretty good shape. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. C.P. Estates 3 Drive will be done this year, then? 4 MR. ODOM: Pardon me? 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is C.P. Estates Drive 6 going to be started this year? Or -- 7 MR. ODOM: Well, we may start it towards the 8 end of the budget year when we run out of money, but, I 9 mean, we'll start in -- it will be into the new budget year. 10 We want to do that early. That half mile is going to be 11 open. And then the other will be leveled up, and then the 12 rest of it will just be patching and edging and sealcoat. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, it doesn't really 14 come under Special Projects? 15 MR. ODOM: No, sir, comes under contract 16 fees. We felt like we could make that work. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 18 MR. ODOM: On Evans Road, I don't have that 19 much traffic count up there to get. I think I got one or 20 two people up there for a mile. So, the rest of them are 21 Bandera people, and it doesn't bother me too much about 22 Bandera. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Doesn't bother me, 24 either. I just wondered. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Question on -- on the 144 1 one, Leonard, on -- where Stoneleigh hits Lazy Valley. We 2 talked about straightening out that, and -- 3 MR. ODOM: Yes. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- realigning that 5 stretch up to the hill. 6 MR. ODOM: Mm-hmm. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Where are we? Is that 8 for year after this year? Or -- 9 MR. ODOM: No, it will probably be into -- we 10 -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Contracts? 12 MR. ODOM: Yeah. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We talked about -- I 14 thought -- 15 MR. ODOM: I debated about whether I would go 16 back into Lazy Valley where that striping occurred on that 17 one. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 19 MR. ODOM: And -- when we did that one, but I 20 don't know if I want to wait. I may go into the next year. 21 Douglas and I have talked about it, and we want to get with 22 you at that point and make sure we got that alignment that 23 we're talking about that we know -- 'cause I'm sort of 24 thinking one way and he's thinking another. And -- but 25 we'll get with that. We felt like we could pick up in the 145 1 wintertime and get that alignment done. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To work on the alignment? 3 MR. ODOM: Yeah. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: During the winter, and 5 then the right-of-way -- 6 MR. ODOM: Catch -- 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- changes? 8 MR. ODOM: We just need to sort of look at 9 this weather to make sure we don't have the weather pattern 10 that I had before I start it. But that's not but, you know, 11 what, 35 hundredths of a million or something like that, 12 1,500, 2,000 feet. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 14 MR. ODOM: So we didn't feel like that was a 15 big deal. We could pick it up, and we can pick it up in the 16 sealcoat program somehow. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can you get back on 19 schedule here and get to Sheppard Rees? 20 MR. ODOM: Sheppard Rees, okay. I thought we 21 forgot that one. Sheppard Rees is $100,000. We're trying 22 to get the engineering completed on that one in this budget 23 year. That's why I had some money in this year's to 24 complete that engineering. And, Stuart Vordenbaum is 25 supposed to complete that before October the 1st. This 146 1 $100,000 is essentially to clear the right-of-way, to 2 stockpile the base material. When you look at the '02/'03 3 budget, I've got two hundred -- $250,000 in there. That is 4 when I plan to do that, 'cause that bridge won't come on 5 line for year and a half, probably. Two years at -- I think 6 that's what they were talking about. But, we felt like we 7 could roll into that point, and normally when we hit 8 August/September -- September, we start to complete our 9 program, and we put things on that, and that's what we want 10 to do. But -- but we want to have materials stockpiled. 11 There is a lot of base. There is 84,000 cubic yards of cut 12 and about 80,000 fill off the plans, so you can't do that on 13 $100,000 unless you can buy the base for it. So, this is 14 material, clearing right-of-way, maybe getting it sort of 15 ready. Nothing -- not doing a whole lot until we can turn 16 the contractor loose and have the money to roll with it. 17 That one's going to be a little bit -- that will be a good 18 project. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Most exciting project 20 in this county. 21 MR. ODOM: Then after that, we'll pick up 22 other parts of Sheppard Rees and go back to Freedom Trails, 23 back in there. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Maybe. 25 MR. ODOM: I'm sorry, to Bear -- what's that 147 1 called? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Bear Paw. 3 MR. ODOM: Bear Creek? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bear -- Freedom Trail. 5 MR. ODOM: And then I show about three years 6 old on that one. That's one you and I have talked about, 7 Larry, that we're going to have some right-of-way, and it 8 will be interesting to see where all these fences are at. 9 And -- but that's two or three years down the road. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Maybe a bike trail. 11 MR. ODOM: And, did I leave out anything 12 else? West end project and East Real, and the south end 13 project, which is Southern Lane, where Henry Griffin used to 14 be, and we're trying to get that right of way. We've got 15 two parcels of -- of real estate already. I'm waiting on 16 that corner. It has to do with someone that owns the note. 17 Someone bought it, but the lienholder's got to sign off on 18 it, so we think we can -- we're waiting on that last end of 19 that one. That would be into the contract. We would do 20 that in-house, probably. That money is for that head wall 21 that's out there that looks like it's in the middle of the 22 right-of-way. And, we've talked to the State about it, 23 about a design there, that they had said what we're going to 24 do, and that's where the concrete money basically right 25 there. (does this guy speak English?) 148 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any other questions on 2 Special Projects? 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Not on Special 4 Projects. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess -- well, the 6 Hermann Sons Bridge won't be finished in the next budget 7 year -- yeah, it will be. 8 MR. ODOM: Well, if they start it at the 9 first of the year, it should be a 6- to 8-month project. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do you have any plans for 11 the -- or do you have money, I guess, in your budget 12 somewhere to pull out the railroad cars and undo the 13 temporary bridge? 14 MR. ODOM: Well, they told me that that would 15 be part of the contract; when they built that bridge, that 16 part of their contract would be removing those structures 17 and moving them back to our yard -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 19 MR. ODOM: -- for us. They said they would 20 work that into the contract. We'll make sure that that's 21 in. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 23 MR. ODOM: Somebody else will do it instead 24 of me this time. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I figured you could get 149 1 them out; you got them in. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any other questions about the 3 Special Projects or, I guess, any of the other -- I want 4 Leonard to talk a little bit about his wish list. But -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Remind me, I also want 6 to talk about -- I don't know if -- yes, this is the proper 7 time to do that -- talk about the old -- the old road 8 district program and how the money comes back into the 9 county and where it goes and all that. I just want to have 10 a discussion with the Auditor on that while all y'all are 11 here. 12 MR. ODOM: Okay. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Let's do the wish list first, 14 Leonard. Then we'll take up the road district funding. 15 MR. ODOM: Okay. Number one on the wish list 16 was secretary salary. We had brought it up. We were told 17 to come back to the Court. We did bring this to Barbara's 18 attention. We did get the e-mail back, so, you know, 19 we've -- we feel like that Truby does a tremendous job and 20 that she should be Administrative Assistant, should be a 19 21 instead of a 17. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well -- 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. 24 MR. ODOM: And the reason it never was -- I 25 read the e-mail from Mr. Nash, and the reason that was never 150 1 brought up, because there was no discussion at any time that 2 all the administrative assistants were to stay the same, so 3 we never -- we didn't argue the fact, but it was after the 4 fact that we didn't even know about that some other people 5 brought it back in and it was changed, and we were not privy 6 to any of that information. We were -- I mean, we didn't 7 know it till it was already done, and that's when we came to 8 Court, and y'all said to bring it back again. But, you 9 know, I was on that committee and I -- everybody that was -- 10 that came up before was turned down at that point. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: There are three of the -- 12 three positions like this that are being considered; one in 13 your department, one in the Auditor's department, one in the 14 County Clerk's department. 15 MR. ODOM: Okay. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: We'll address those as we 17 proceed along. 18 MR. ODOM: All right. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: The other salary issues we 20 don't -- we're going to address those. 21 MR. ODOM: That's fine. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Hopefully. Let's go to the 23 capital purchase wish list, if we could. The next -- the 24 page before that. 25 MR. ODOM: Capital purchase -- okay. It's 151 1 the sign machine. Well, we have one, and I guess it's 2 four -- five years old? 3 MS. HARDIN: At least five. 4 MR. ODOM: At least five mand it's becoming 5 antiquated. But, we thought that we're doing more and more 6 signs, and then, of course, with 911 -- I mean, that will 7 end at some time in the future, but then the maintenance of 8 those signs will be the -- be the same that I've got with 9 everything else. But, we were looking at if we had a wish 10 list, we could see that that might be something that we 11 would have a problem with, 'cause we're the only ones -- one 12 in town that's got one. We don't have another backup to go 13 anywhere. So, we would like to get a new sign -- that's -- 14 the last time we checked on that, it was about this cost. 15 We'd certainly trade in the other one or -- either, you 16 know, give it back to 911 or whatever, but we just think 17 that it -- we'd be better off, as much as we do signs and 18 all, to get something new that would keep the productivity 19 up. We're sort of dead in the water if we don't -- if it 20 goes out. We have to go to San Antonio to get it fixed. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 22 MR. ODOM: And a power generator. Those are 23 for the crews when they go out and do different work, either 24 concrete or even for the -- the bridge. We're getting into 25 strange things all the time. So -- but this is a backup, 152 1 other than a welding -- the only welding -- we have one in 2 Ingram that must be from the '70's, I guess, that will 3 hand-crank, and then the others that we have on the service 4 truck that the -- that Ray Cook has. And that's the only 5 power units that we have. And, so, I wanted to have that 6 backup, that ability to have 220 when we need it for drills 7 and into concrete or whatever we need to do. And, if the 8 men need it, then it will be put up in the shop and signed 9 out, and they can set forms or do any concrete work we need 10 to do instead of running and trying to secure something. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't see how you 12 function without them. 13 MR. ODOM: Well, Ingram's got our backup. 14 That's the best that we got right there, besides Ray Cook. 15 But, when we do that, then Ray's truck's down. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is it better, do you 17 think, to get a power generator, or are you thinking of 18 getting, like, a welder/power generator combination? 19 MR. ODOM: Well, that's what Ray is asking, 20 is a welder/generator with electrical on the thing. That 21 way, it would have a multiple use for the guys, instead of 22 asking Ray to come out there with the welder and do it. The 23 only other one's in Ingram that has that backup there, so 24 that's what we were leaning towards, something to have a 25 welding capability as well as power unit on it. 153 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's a good idea. 2 You probably need it, but I think the price is a little bit 3 high. 4 MR. ODOM: I was looking at two of them, and 5 so if you look at that price, then it would be about -- it's 6 around 30 -- 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: About 36. 8 MR. ODOM: Yeah, 34, 35, something like that. 9 I'd rather make sure I have enough in there, but that wasn't 10 just for one; it was for two. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 12 MR. ODOM: And hammer drills with bits. That 13 was the heavy duty drills that we use to put our steel and 14 stuff into those concretes. It is a hammer, and I'm 15 guessing at that, but I bet you what we rented from the 16 rental people and all, that they're probably going to run 17 between $1,200 and $1,500 for bits and all, and that's two 18 of them. Now, air compressor, that is the old unit that we 19 had, that Joy, and it must be 1970 -- 1968, I think it is. 20 And, so, I was looking at that with the breaker, a new 21 breaker, and the hoses that go with that. Last time I 22 checked -- that's been several, several years ago -- I think 23 that it was running around 17 for the same CFP, cubic feet 24 per minute. Then I would take the other -- fifth one is the 25 foreman's truck. Tan sixth one, y'all are sitting down, is 154 1 953 track loader with a ripper, 140,000. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Didn't you just get 3 one of those things two years ago? 4 MR. ODOM: I rented it. That's what -- 5 that's the reason I say that. I want to use that up on 6 Evans; I know I can clear Evans Road with it. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Then let's get it. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any questions about the wish 9 list? Okay. Thanks. Commissioner Baldwin, you had a 10 question about -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. The way I 12 understand it, in the olden days -- in the beginning, 13 Commissioner, when we created those old road districts, the 14 money that we collect through that taxation comes back and 15 goes in the General Fund, and then the Road and Bridge goes 16 out and spends their funds on repairing the road. And it 17 just seems to me, and I -- Truby and I were visiting about 18 it here a while back, and it just seems to me is when that 19 money comes back in from the taxes, it needs to go back into 20 the Road and Bridge. Am I -- how far off base am I? 21 MR. TOMLINSON: Long way. 22 MR. ODOM: I -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: A long way? 24 MR. TOMLINSON: Yeah. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, get me 155 1 corrected, then, Tommy, 'cause I'm a County Commissioner 2 here and I need to represent it right. 3 MR. TOMLINSON: What happens is, we have a -- 4 we have a fund on its own for collection of road district 5 taxes. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Uh-huh. 7 MR. TOMLINSON: And it just stays in that 8 fund until Leonard has a -- has a project in those road 9 districts to use that money for. When -- when he knows he 10 can get in that road district to make any -- to do 11 maintenance or whatever, then we budget a transfer out of -- 12 out of the road district fund into the operating funds of 13 Road and Bridge, and we use that money to do that project. 14 That's how it works. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, thank you. I 16 stand corrected. 17 MR. ODOM: And all that money -- whatever 18 we've done has always been back on the old road districts 19 that y'all used to do, is the only time I did it. And half 20 of those roads were done, I believe, and I inherited the 21 other half that was dirt. And, so -- and then I understand 22 that the road district -- and I'm not belittling anybody, 23 but, you know, there wasn't enough money that they spent 24 more than whatever they -- they got in the taxation, the 25 revenue for that. And all we ever did was go back to those 156 1 roads as they maintained it at that point, was dirt roads. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Right. 3 MR. ODOM: One specifically over there that 4 you're talking about -- or I think this is inferring to, and 5 so we were told exactly where their maintenance ended at 6 that time. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 8 MR. ODOM: And that's where we used only that 9 money, that 20 or 25 or 14, whatever we asked for. That's 10 what it was, to do that road, and we spent that money 11 totally on that -- that road or roads that we did. And 12 we've -- it's never been outside that. We -- now, once 13 those funds are collected for whatever length of time that 14 it is; then that's it, it just stays there. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. Thank y'all 16 very much. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any other questions for 18 Leonard or -- 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Just a quick comment 20 while Leonard's here. I've said this a couple of times. 21 Everybody who gets involved with any roads and bridges in 22 this county ought to go up and see the beautiful road they 23 built up in Lake Ingram Estates. It is the prettiest road 24 in the county. It is beautiful. 25 MR. ODOM: And county boys helped do it, too. 157 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: You bet. 2 MR. ODOM: It's a nice looking road. 3 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: It really came out 4 well. 5 (Discussion off the record.) 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Leonard. 7 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Y'all do an excellent job in 9 a complicated budget. We appreciate it. Truby and 10 Franklin, thank y'all for your work. 11 MR. ODOM: After hearing about Ranchero, I 12 don't know now. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Leonard, I love you. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: By special dispensation, 15 we're going to hear from J.P. 1 at this time. All opposed, 16 raise your right hand. 17 (Laughter.) 18 JUDGE ELLIOTT: Okay. I'm Vance Elliott, 19 J.P. 1. I'm here to talk about our budget, or any other 20 questions that Buster Baldwin has for us today. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't see any 22 changes. I don't see any changes. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's 14. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: I'm sorry, 8. I'm sorry, 25 Number 8. 158 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Number 8. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Justice of the Peace 3 1. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Where are the changes, 5 Judge? 6 JUDGE ELLIOTT: We've -- everything's the 7 same, except we've requested, off Bonds, an additional $200, 8 because this is an election year, that the elected 9 official's bond is purchased for four years. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Actually, it's not. It's the 11 next budget year. 12 JUDGE ELLIOTT: Well, no, my bond will be up 13 in September, because I came into office -- was appointed in 14 September, so mine will come up early. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: So yours is early, okay. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No. You were 17 appointed, but you -- but you also ran for a full term. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah, but his bond 19 went back to September. 20 JUDGE ELLIOTT: The bond goes from September 21 to September, I believe. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: He had to be bonded 23 when he was appointed. 24 JUDGE ELLIOTT: Right. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that an announcement 159 1 that you're running again? 2 JUDGE ELLIOTT: Excuse me? In May, somebody 3 will need this money. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But, if it's not you -- 5 JUDGE ELLIOTT: If it's not me, it will be 6 somebody else. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If it's not you, it's 8 next budget year. So -- 9 JUDGE ELLIOTT: That -- yeah. Well, maybe -- 10 you know, that's something the Commissioners could advise me 11 oh, if -- if y'all feel I should purchase the 4-year bond in 12 September? Or just a 2-month bond or 3-month bond in 13 September. 14 (Laughter.) 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I'd like to do a 16 little study on that one. 17 JUDGE ELLIOTT: And the other area is, of 18 course, dockets and forms. We're requesting a $200 increase 19 there. That's the only change in our budget. Those were 20 explained in an amendment there on that description, the 21 increase from $500 current budget year to $700 next budget 22 year for that Dockets and Forms. And, that's because 23 traffic misdemeanors filed in our court have increased 24 45 percent for the same period, October '99 to April 2000, 25 last budget year to the same period this year, and has been 160 1 continually increasing. Each traffic misdemeanor filed in 2 court requires a file with the proper documentation and 3 everything else, so obviously, they cost money every time 4 they're filed. Our revenue increases for the same period 5 during that period of seven months is $28,252, or also 6 48 percent. So, you know, we're requesting a -- the $200 is 7 about 45 percent increase, and our revenue has been about 8 48 percent increase. So, we're asking to spend $200 more to 9 accommodate that extra $28,000. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Such a deal. 11 JUDGE ELLIOTT: What a deal. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Does anyone have any 13 questions of Vance on his budget? 14 JUDGE ELLIOTT: Not to mention the money 15 we're saving from canceling that subscription to the 16 newspaper, huh? 17 (Laughter.) 18 (Discussion off the record.) 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: All right. If there's 20 nothing else for J.P. 1 -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Number 1. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- Commissioner Williams has 23 something with regard to the -- 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: With regard to the 25 library. We talked a little bit yesterday about it. 161 1 JUDGE ELLIOTT: Thank you, gentlemen. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: About the 3 improvements. What they were is the elevator and what's 4 going to happen and so forth. I noticed on the City Council 5 agenda last night that they had a -- an item authorizing bid 6 advertisement for Phase I, library improvements. And, that 7 didn't indicate what they were, so I asked Dane Tune to fax 8 it over to me. I called the library, and the library turned 9 it over to Dane. Construction plans, bid package, including 10 improvements to the fronts entry, main level restrooms, 11 elevator, fire alarm system, lighting, and et cetera. And, 12 essentially, it goes to the expenditure of the funds already 13 on hand; for example, the elevator, plus the E.I.C. 14 authorized funds, and that really revolved around the 27 15 specific items, a lot of which were in the letter that the 16 County Judge asked me to put to them, and we did, and they 17 accepted it in terms of the needs list. So, basically, 18 we're pretty well covered, things that we'd like to see 19 done. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. We're adjourned for 21 today. I'll remind everyone we have a workshop posted for 22 10:45 tomorrow on the Youth Exhibition Center. I think 23 Mr. Blankenship will be here earlier if anyone wants to come 24 in earlier, about 10:00, and visit with him and maybe get 25 him to do some things, but we won't formally start until 162 1 10:45. 2 (Discussion off the record.) 3 (Budget workshop adjourned at 3:50 p.m.) 4 - - - - - - - - - - 5 6 7 8 STATE OF TEXAS | 9 COUNTY OF KERR | 10 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 11 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 12 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 13 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 14 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 17th day of September, 15 2001. 16 17 18 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 19 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 20 Certified Shorthand Reporter 21 22 23 24 25