1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Special Session 10 Monday, August 27, 2001 11 6:30 p.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: FREDERICK L. HENNEKE, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 LARRY GRIFFIN, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X August 27, 2001 2 PAGE --- Visitor's Input .................................. 3 3 --- Commissioners Comments ........................... 10 1.1 Pay Bills ........................................ 13 4 1.2 Budget Amendments ................................ 14 1.3 Late Bills ....................................... 30 5 1.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports ............... 34 6 2.1 Approve form of volunteer fire contracts, 7 authorize County Judge to sign same .............. 35 2.2 Letter of Credit, Falling Water Subdivision ...... 41 8 2.3 Final Revision of Plat, Lots 176, 177, 178, & 179 of Spicer Ranch III ........................ 44 9 2.4 Approve name changes for privately maintained roads in Precincts 1 & 4 ......................... 45 10 2.5 Advertisement for Notice of Public Hearing to eliminate duplicate road names, set public 11 hearing date for same ............................ 46 2.6 Step and grade for first assistant auditor ....... 48 12 2.7 Reclassification of job title or increase in step/grade for senior accounting clerk ........... 55 13 2.8 Request from J.P.4 to purchase capital outlay item & transfer money to proper line item ........ 66 14 2.9 Discuss enforcement of Manufactured Home Rental Community ordinance as it applies to Wayne Barney 15 property ......................................... 73 2.10 Approve resolution to make formal application 16 for membership in West Texas County Judges and Commissioners Association ........................ 78 17 2.11 Establish Water Conservation Program as outlined, incorporate Rainwater Harvesting 18 Incentive program as Phase I ..................... 80 2.12 Ratify request for contested case hearing in 19 San Marcos River Foundation application for Guadalupe River water rights ..................... 92 20 2.13 Approve order authorizing publication of Notice of Intention to Issue Kerr County, Texas, 21 Certificates of Obligation ...................... 106 22 --- Adjourned ....................................... 118 --- Reporter's Certificate .......................... 119 23 24 25 3 1 On Monday, August 27, 2001, at 6:30 p.m., a special meeting 2 of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in the 3 Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, Kerrville, 4 Texas, and the following proceedings were had in open court: 5 P R O C E E D I N G S 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Good evening, everyone. It's 7 6:30 on Monday, August 27th, Year 2001. We will call to 8 order this regular special session of the Kerr County 9 Commissioners Court. Commissioner Baldwin, I believe you 10 have the honors this evening. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I do. If y'all would 12 stand and pray with me, please, and then when we finish, 13 we'll do the pledge of allegiance. 14 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Commissioner. At 17 this time, any citizen wishing to address the Court on an 18 item not listed on the regular agenda may come forth and do 19 so. Any citizens who would like to address the Court on an 20 item not listed on the regular agenda? Yes, sir? 21 MR. LAFLAIR: Good evening. My name is Brent 22 Laflair. This is addressed to Commissioner Griffin. Sir, I 23 live out on Voges Lane off of Blue Ridge. I've been out 24 there for three months now and have not been able to get any 25 mail delivered. I've gone to the Postmaster. He said he 4 1 has spoken to you on this matter, something to the effect 2 that the mailboxes out there aren't are on private property 3 and all the mailboxes have to be moved. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I'm not aware -- the 5 Post Office Department, you say? 6 MR. LAFLAIR: Yes, sir. Mr. Hanson told me 7 this himself. 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Is this on Blue Ridge? 9 MR. LAFLAIR: Yes, sir. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Franklin, you met with 11 the -- 12 MR. JOHNSTON: I talked to someone. I think 13 the property owner was talking about -- 14 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think they worked 15 out an accommodation for the location of all those 16 mailboxes. I think that's been done. 17 MR. JOHNSTON: I don't know if it's done, but 18 I think they worked out a deal to move them to the County 19 right-of-way. 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yes, they did. 21 MR. LAFLAIR: The problem is, nobody seems to 22 know where the right-of-way is there out there. I've been 23 out there going on four months now; I have not gotten any 24 mail. My mail is in limbo between the Ingram post office 25 and the Kerrville post office. And, basically, what I'm 5 1 being told in a roundabout manner is, if you really want 2 your mail, you'll rent a P.O. box so that you know you're 3 getting it. Well, as far as I'm concerned, that's federal 4 extortion. I should be able to get my mail. 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think we have an 6 accommodation on the -- on the positioning of all of those 7 mailboxes, have we not? 8 MR. JOHNSTON: That's what I've been told, 9 yeah. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah. And 911, I 11 think -- 12 MR. SANDLIN: I had a conversation with him 13 on some other things -- with Mr. Hanson last Thursday, and 14 my understanding was one of the -- and I'm not -- I don't 15 know who all the property owners are, but one -- the 16 question where the mailbox was, he was going to move them to 17 accommodate the mail carrier. 18 MR. LAFLAIR: Nothing's been done yet. 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Okay. 20 MR. LAFLAIR: Nothing has been done yet. And 21 in the meantime, I can't get my mail. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Probably need to close 23 the loop with the Post Office Department, just make sure 24 that they know where your box is going to be. 25 MR. LAFLAIR: They won't even issue me a 6 1 rural route address out there. I talked to Mr. Hanson about 2 4:30 this afternoon on the phone and I asked him if he could 3 come in here himself tonight, with me, and he said no, that 4 he had other plans. 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, I'll talk to him 6 and see what we can work out. 7 MR. LAFLAIR: Thank you. 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Sure. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, sir. Is there 10 anyone else who would like to address the Commission on an 11 item not on the agenda? Yes, Ms. Pruneda? 12 MS. PRUNEDA: Thank you. Good evening. 13 Thank you for your service. I'm here to request some 14 clarification of the septic rules. I applied last week to 15 transfer a license, and received from U.G.R.A. the process 16 which I should go by, and paid my $150 fee. And, I had a 17 few questions, and U.G.R.A. faxed me a piece of paper. I 18 believe, Commissioner Griffin, you've read that now, or I 19 read part of it to you. They -- they explained to me that 20 you authorized -- that you authored this piece of 21 information, but I noticed that it was not signed by the 22 Judge, and I brought it up here to the Judge Friday morning. 23 He said he, I don't believe, was familiar with this. Is 24 that correct, Judge Henneke? 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: The piece of paper you showed 7 1 me, I'd never seen before. 2 MS. PRUNEDA: Correct, it had not been signed 3 by you. And, after further questioning U.G.R.A., they said, 4 well, this was their interpretation of an item that you 5 authored, and so we've been back and forth several times. 6 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yes. 7 MS. PRUNEDA: My question is, who has the 8 authority and what is the rule? 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: The rule, in the case 10 of the property that you're talking about, will be handled 11 as a licensed property, since it was licensed in '95. And 12 if Stuart Barron, the Designated Representative, has not 13 called you back yet, I'm sure he will -- 14 MS. PRUNEDA: He did. 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: -- call you back 16 tomorrow, 'cause I just talked to him. 17 MS. PRUNEDA: He was most accommodating. The 18 -- what I couldn't seem to get around was, I was told by 19 U.G.R.A. -- I mean, she was very helpful and very 20 informative, but I couldn't get -- she told me that the 21 septic was licensed in '85. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No, licensed in '95, 23 apparently. 24 MS. PRUNEDA: Right. That's my system. And 25 that's what I told her, and she said no, the original 8 1 license was '85. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: The original license 3 was, or the original installation or something. 4 MS. PRUNEDA: And if there was a significant 5 improvement to the system since that time... yada, yada, 6 yada, and if it had been pumped. And I have my manifest and 7 all of the paperwork that they required, but I still paid my 8 $150 fee, and then I had to schedule a pumper and pay his 9 service fee, which will happen at closing on Friday, to come 10 out. And Mr. Barron did not require that -- the system to 11 be pumped, so I'm still paying another fee on top of the 12 $150 fee. 13 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, I just talked 14 with Stuart Barron this afternoon. 15 MS. PRUNEDA: Okay. 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And I think we had 17 that all worked out, but I will close the loop again. 18 MS. PRUNEDA: I know you're going to follow 19 up on it. It's just, as a consumer -- 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right. 21 MS. PRUNEDA: -- it's confusing, and if 22 there's not a -- if there's not a definite rule that has 23 been signed or mandated -- 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: There is. 25 MS. PRUNEDA: There is? Where is that rule? 9 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That rule is in a 2 court order that -- we can get you a copy of that. 3 MS. PRUNEDA: Okay. So, then, this -- this 4 form -- 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's a further 6 interpretation of those orders. 7 MS. PRUNEDA: And that's what Stuart 8 explained to me. He said, you know, I think this is what it 9 says, but it's not been signed. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, it's not going 11 to be signed. And I explained that to him. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. This is not an agenda 13 item; we can't take any action on this. 14 MS. PRUNEDA: I understand. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: What I need is -- is for you 16 all to work this out outside of here. 17 MS. PRUNEDA: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, I'll follow up 19 on it with Stuart again, but it should be taken care of now. 20 At least that's what I'm told. 21 MS. PRUNEDA: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I'll have to find out 23 in the morning. 24 MS. PRUNEDA: I'll call Mr. -- 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: But I talked to him 10 1 about 4:30 this afternoon. 2 MS. PRUNEDA: And, like I said, it's not just 3 for myself. It's for anyone else that has to go through -- 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I understand. 5 MS. PRUNEDA: -- this. Thank you for your 6 time. I appreciate it. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. Anyone else who 8 -- any citizen who would like to address the Court on an 9 item not listed on the regular agenda? Do we have anyone 10 else who would like to address the Court on an item not 11 listed on the regular agenda? Seeing none, we'll turn to 12 the Commissioners' comments. Let's start with Commissioner 13 Baldwin. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. Tivy 15 Antlers. Tivy football had a big scrimmage last Saturday, 16 did real well against Cedar Park. This Thursday, we go to 17 Killeen, Texas. I don't know why they don't schedule 18 something up around Dallas so we can travel a little bit. 19 But, Thursday they'll go to Killeen, and Killeen's a 20 big-time school, high-ranked, so we'll find out this 21 Thursday what kind of Tivy Antlers we have. But, they 22 looked really good last Saturday, and we're real proud of 23 them. I wanted to remind everyone that September the 1st, 24 most of the new legislative laws go into effect, and there's 25 all kinds; alcohol containers in a vehicle, kids under 12 11 1 riding in the rear of a pickup, and the fines quadruple on 2 some of those things. So, you know, if you're wondering 3 about some of it, you may want to get on the Internet and 4 find out about it, 'cause they go into effect September 1, 5 most of them do. How dedicated this Commissioners Court is. 6 The Dallas Cowboys are playing right now. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You call what they do 8 playing? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, which brings up 10 my next point. I'd heard on the way over here that the NFL 11 has offered Fort Worth a team, and they turned it down; said 12 no, if they got one, Dallas would want one. 13 (Laughter.) 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's all my comments 15 for tonight, Judge. Thank you. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Commissioner. 17 Commissioner Williams? 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's pretty hard to 19 top. I'm not going to even try to top it, except to say 20 we've been blessed with rain throughout Precinct 2, and the 21 burn ban's off, for those who didn't have their box of 22 matches in their hip pocket early this morning. And, before 23 we meet and see you again, we will have the traditional 24 Labor Day holiday. I wish each and every -- each of you a 25 safe and sane holiday. 12 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Commissioner Letz? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No further comments. 3 Burn ban is lifted in 3, and I think, from what I can tell, 4 the smoke's all over the hills right now. 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I was going to say, 6 they looked like -- like smoke signals going out in Precinct 7 4 this morning. One thing I did -- would like to bring up 8 is that I was by the 911 office, and as a member of the 911 9 liaison of the Court, I was presented with some video tapes 10 for the Court, and will leave those here. This is of the 11 Sheppard Rees fire there that was put together. Also, 12 there's a couple copies here for the media, if you'd like to 13 have them. That's all. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. The burn ban has been 15 lifted, but I would remind everyone that it has been lifted 16 on a precinct-by-precinct basis, and I believe for a 17 definitive time. The burn ban is in effect county-wide 18 through September 25th; however, it has been lifted in each 19 precinct by the Commissioner, but it has not been lifted 20 totally, county-wide. So, if you're going to burn, be sure 21 you check on the web site or with the burn ban hotline to 22 make sure that the burn ban has not been reimposed in your 23 particular precinct. The other thing I'll note is that we 24 were blessed today with a visit from Secretary of Veterans 25 Affairs, Anthony Principi from Washington. He was in San 13 1 Antonio to address the American Legion National Convention, 2 came to Kerrville specifically for the purpose of getting a 3 briefing on the Kerrville V.A. facility, and also to tour 4 the facility. It was my pleasure to go out and be part of 5 the group that conducted a briefing, and I'm very hopeful 6 that, by virtue of his attention to Kerrville, that that 7 means we will continue to get the attention of Washington 8 and continue to enjoy the funding and support which we need 9 in order to keep that facility alive and a viable part of 10 our community. With that, let's pay some bills. Tommy? 11 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Judge, if I might just 12 mention, I think in all four precincts, the burn ban expires 13 at 7 o'clock Wednesday morning, unless further extended, so 14 we might want to pass that word to everybody, too. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Does anyone have any 16 questions or comments about the bills as presented by the 17 Auditor? 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Move we pay the bills. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 21 Griffin, second by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court 22 approve payment of the bills as recommended and presented by 23 the Auditor. Any further questions or comments? If not, 24 all in favor, raise your right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Budget 4 Amendment Number 1 relates to Maintenance. 5 MR. TOMLINSON: This is a request from Glenn 6 Holekamp to transfer $700 from Leasehold Improvements to the 7 Telephone line item in his department. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 11 Williams, second by Commissioner Griffin, that we approve 12 Budget Amendment Request Number 1 for Maintenance. Any 13 further questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise 14 your right hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Number 2 19 relates to J.P. Number 4. 20 MR. TOMLINSON: This amendment is a result of 21 a need to pay utilities for Precinct 4 Justice of the Peace. 22 We're transferring $1,000 from Major Repairs in the 23 Maintenance Department to Utilities in the J.P. 4 office. 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So moved. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 15 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 2 Griffin, second by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court 3 approve Budget Amendment Request Number 2 for J.P. Number 4. 4 Any further questions or comments? If not, all in favor, 5 raise your right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Number 3 is 10 for Juvenile Probation. 11 MR. TOMLINSON: We have a -- we have a bill 12 for $578.48. No funds in Alternate Housing in the Juvenile 13 Probation budget. The last two amendments we've done, we've 14 taken that money from the Radio line item in the Sheriff's 15 Office. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Tommy, is there any excess in 17 the salary line item under that budget, since we had a 18 vacancy for three months? 19 MR. TOMLINSON: No, not -- not enough to -- 20 to amount to anything. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: We don't have $578 in that 22 one? 23 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, we might have had $578, 24 but I didn't look at it that close. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. It seems to me like we 16 1 should have possibly enough to cover that, since we were 2 down a Juvenile Probation Officer for three months. 3 MR. TOMLINSON: We may have already used it, 4 but I'm not sure. I'll have to look. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: First choice would be to 6 take it out of that salary item. If not, take it out of the 7 Radio. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Is that a motion? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 12 second by Commissioner Williams, that the Court approve 13 Budget Amendment Request Number 3 for Juvenile Probation, 14 with the funds to come first from any excess salary funds 15 for the Juvenile Probation Department, and second from the 16 Radio Project in the Sheriff's budget. Any further 17 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 18 right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Number 4 is 23 also from J.P. Number 4. 24 MR. TOMLINSON: It's Number 1. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Excuse me, Number 1. Sorry, 17 1 Bill. 2 MR. TOMLINSON: Vance Elliott. His request 3 is to transfer $10.10 from his Postage line item to 4 Part-Time Salaries. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 8 second by Commissioner Baldwin, that we approve Budget 9 Amendment Request Number 4 for J.P. Number 1. Any further 10 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 11 right hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Number 5 is 16 for the Ag Extension Service. 17 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. We have a need to 18 transfer funds into the Extension Service line item for 19 utilities, and we're asking to transfer $1,280.83 from Major 20 Repairs from the Ag Barn to the Utilities line item in the 21 Extension Service. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 25 Williams, second by Commissioner Letz, that we approve 18 1 Budget Amendment Request Number 5 for the Agricultural 2 Extension Service. Tommy, is that enough money to go the 3 rest of the fiscal year? 4 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes, it is. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any further questions or 6 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Item Number 11 6 is for the 198th District Court. 12 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. This is for the Jury 13 Fund for the 198th court. We have -- we have a request to 14 transfer $50 from Miscellaneous to the Court Interpreter's 15 line item in that Jury Fund. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 19 second by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve 20 Budget Amendment Request Number 6 for the 198th District 21 Court. Any further questions or comments? If not, all in 22 favor, raise your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 19 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Item Number 2 7 is for the 216th District Court. 3 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. This is also for the 4 Jury Fund, and it's for the 216th court. The request is to 5 transfer $107.25 from Board for Jurors, $82.50 into the 6 Court Interpreters line item, and $22.75 into Operating 7 Supplies. 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So moved. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 11 Griffin, second by Commissioner Letz, that the Court approve 12 Budget Amendment Request Number 7 for the 216th District 13 Court. Any further questions or comments? If not, all in 14 favor, raise your right hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Number 8 is 19 for the Law Library. 20 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. I have a bill for 21 $880.50. It's for West -- West Group, West Law charges that 22 we need to pay out of surplus funds in the Law Library. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Do we have to declare 25 an -- 20 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Emergency. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah, I think we do. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Does that come out of 4 that special fund of theirs? 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yes. 6 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes, it does. 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: It's just that it's 8 not budgeted. Second. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 10 second by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve 11 Budget Amendment Request Number 8 for the Law Library, 12 declare an emergency, and take the funds from the line item 13 specifically for County Law Library. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, I know Linda isn't 15 here, but do we have any control over when they send these 16 things? 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: I agree with you, 18 Commissioner. We've had one of these every meeting for 19 about the last six meetings. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, when they come, I 21 can't really refuse them, but -- I guess I could refuse 22 them, but the -- it seems that there would be something from 23 West Publishing which could give us some kind of idea ahead 24 of time what they're going to send. But -- 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Frustration noted. Any 21 1 further questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise 2 your right hand. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 5 Motion carries. Item Number 9, again, is for the 216th 6 District Court. 7 MR. TOMLINSON: This is a -- a request from 8 the 216th court to transfer $6,547.50 from Court-Appointed 9 Attorneys in -- out of the 198th court into Court-Appointed 10 Attorneys line item in the 216th court. Also, there is a 11 need to transfer $40,230.89 into Special Trials in the 198th 12 court -- I mean in the 216th court. We have $25,741.23 in 13 Special Trials in the 198th court, leaving a balance of 14 $14,489.66 that needs to come from some other source. We -- 15 we have the choice of declaring an emergency and increasing 16 the budget, or taking it out of -- also from the Radio line 17 item. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Motion to take it from 19 the Radio line item. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is this for the Reichenau 22 trial? 23 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 25 second by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court approve 22 1 Budget Amendment Request Number 9 for the 216th District 2 Court, and we transfer $25,741.23 from the Radio 3 Equipment -- Radio Project line item in the Sheriff's 4 Department to Special Trials -- 5 MR. TOMLINSON: No, 14 thousand -- 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Fourteen thousand? 7 MR. TOMLINSON: $14,489.66. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Transfer $14,489.66 from the 9 Radio Project to Special Trials. Any further questions or 10 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Question on that, Tommy. 16 Is that the -- kind of the final tally on that trial, what 17 it cost the County? 18 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, I know we have a bill 19 from Kendall County, for sure. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That we haven't received 21 yet? 22 MR. TOMLINSON: We have received. So, I -- I 23 hope that's it. I think that's it. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is almost $50,000. 25 MR. TOMLINSON: Very expensive, a hung jury. 23 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So the public is aware 2 what these trials cost the County. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Absolutely. Budget Amendment 4 Request number 10 is for County Court at Law. 5 MR. TOMLINSON: I have a bill for $1,365 for 6 court-appointed attorneys for County Court at Law. The 7 balance in this fund is -- I mean, in that account is zero. 8 We're requesting a transfer of $1,365 from the 9 Court-Appointed Attorneys line item out of County Court to 10 transfer into County Court at Law. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 14 second by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve 15 Budget Amendment Request Number 10 for County Court at Law. 16 Any further questions or comments? If not, all in favor, 17 raise your right hand. 18 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 20 (No response.) 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Number 11 is 22 for the District Clerk. 23 MR. TOMLINSON: This request is from the 24 District Clerk to transfer enough funds out of Photocopy 25 Expense, which will be $500 for the remainder of the year 24 1 for office supplies. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 6 Williams, second by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court 7 approve Budget Amendment Request Number 11 for the District 8 Clerk. Any further questions or comments? If not, all in 9 favor, raise your right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 12 (No response.) 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Budget 14 Amendment Request Number 12 is for the Road and Bridge 15 Department. 16 MR. TOMLINSON: This is -- this amendment is 17 a request from Road and Bridge which anticipates the 18 utilities for the remainder of the year, and this request is 19 to transfer $1,424 from the Insurance line item for 20 vehicles, into Utilities. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 24 second by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve 25 Budget Amendment Request Number 12 for Road and Bridge 25 1 Department. Any further questions or comments? If not, all 2 in favor, raise your right hand. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 5 (No response.) 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Item Number 7 13 is Nondepartmental. 8 MR. TOMLINSON: This request is -- is from 9 the County Clerk to transfer $2,495 from Nondepartmental 10 Capital Outlay into Nondepartmental Computer Software, and 11 it's a bill from -- paying a bill for $2,495 to The Software 12 Group, and it's -- it was a budgeted item, but it was 13 budgeted in -- in the Capital Outlay, and really it's a 14 reclassification for -- to reclassify the expense. And, 15 what it is, it's a remote access license for -- for another 16 user to use our system, is what it's for. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 20 Baldwin, second by Commissioner Letz, that the Court approve 21 Budget Amendment Request Number 13 for Nondepartmental. Any 22 further questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise 23 your right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 26 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 3 MS. ALFORD: Judge, it has a late bill. Do 4 you need to issue a hand check for it? 5 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes, I do have a hand check 6 that I need a -- I need a hand check for. It's a late bill, 7 and it's dated July the 25th. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I amend my motion to 9 include a hand check. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Commissioner Letz? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So second. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion is amended as to 13 include the issuance of a hand check in the amount of $2,495 14 to Software Group. Any further questions or comments? If 15 not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Number 14 is 20 for Court Collections Department. 21 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. This request is to 22 transfer $176.83 from Conferences to Telephone line item for 23 Court Collections. This also anticipates the remainder of 24 the year. 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So moved. 27 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 3 Griffin, second by Commissioner Williams, that the Court 4 approve Budget Amendment Request Number 14 for the Court 5 Collections Department. Any further questions or comments? 6 If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Request 11 Number 15 comes from the County Jail. 12 MR. TOMLINSON: This request is from the 13 Sheriff's Office to transfer $2,792.94 from Radio Equipment 14 line item in the Sheriff's budget, $1,466.39 to Prisoner 15 Transfer in the jail, $218.74 for Prisoner Medical in the 16 jail, $118.75 into Jail Uniforms, $63.01 to Computer 17 Supplies in the Sheriff's Office, $180.24 into Lease Copier 18 in the Sheriff's Office, $745.81 into Vehicle Repairs and 19 Maintenance in the Sheriff's Office. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 23 second by Commissioner Williams, that the Court approve 24 Budget Amendment Request Number 15 for the County Jail. Any 25 further questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise 28 1 your right hand. 2 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 4 (No response.) 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Item Number 6 16 is for Commissioners Court. 7 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. This request is from 8 Commissioner Griffin to transfer $116.85 from Professional 9 Services into Conferences for the Commissioners Court. I 10 also -- I have attached to this a late bill that I want -- I 11 am requesting a hand check for. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 15 Baldwin, second by Commissioner Letz, that the Court approve 16 Budget Amendment Request Number 16 for Commissioners Court 17 and authorize issuance of a hand check in the amount of -- 18 MR. TOMLINSON: $254.54. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- $254.54, payable to 20 Commissioner Griffin. Any further questions or comments? 21 If not -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Question. Question on 23 just this overall line item. Did we -- and Thea can 24 probably answer. Did we go to more conferences this year? 25 I mean, Commissioner Baldwin's conference -- a lot of it was 29 1 paid by the state association, and we're over budget, and I 2 haven't submitted a bill for me going to the conference, so 3 we're going to be way over before long. I -- I'm just 4 wondering why we're so far over our budget in conferences 5 for Commissioners Court. 6 MS. SOVIL: Didn't budget the full 36. 7 MS. NEMEC: Y'all are spending too much when 8 you go. 9 (Laughter.) 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you, Barbara. Take 11 that -- take her name down. 12 (Discussion off the record.) 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: I think the answer really 14 would be the overall expenses have gone up. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We might -- when we go 16 through our final budget, we might look at that and make 17 sure -- I know we adjusted it, but we're going to be -- 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Didn't we get a 19 little bit less this time because we knew Commissioner 20 Baldwin's was picked up through the South Texas -- 21 (Discussion off the record.) 22 MS. SOVIL: See? It's normally 36. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any further questions or 24 comments? If not, all in favor raise your right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 30 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Item Number 4 17 is for the County Jail. 5 MR. TOMLINSON: This is a request to transfer 6 $555 from Capital Outlay in Nondepartmental to Computer 7 Hardware in the jail, and it's to replace a printer in the 8 jail. 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So moved. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 12 Griffin, second by Commissioner Letz, that the Court approve 13 Budget Amendment Request Number 17 for the County Jail. Any 14 further questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise 15 your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Do we have 20 any more late bills, Tommy? 21 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. The first one is 22 payable to Perry Cortese in the amount of $700. Its for an 23 ad litem attorney fee. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 31 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 2 second by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve a 3 late bill and hand check in the amount of $700 payable to 4 Perry Cortese for attorney ad litem fees. Any further 5 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 6 right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 11 MR. TOMLINSON: The next one is to Back 40 12 Supply. It's for $2,815 for a utility trailer for the Ag 13 Barn. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 17 second by Commissioner Williams, that the Court approve a 18 late bill and hand check in the amount of $2,815 payable to 19 Back 40 Supply. Any further questions or comments? If not, 20 all in favor, raise your right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 25 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. The next one is to The 32 1 Home Center. It's for $850. It's for materials for the 2 Juvenile Probation Department construction. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 6 second by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve a 7 late bill and hand check in the amount of $850 payable to 8 The Home Center. Any further questions or comments? If 9 not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 12 (No response.) 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 14 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. The next one is to the 15 -- payable to the South Texas J.P. and Constables 16 Association. It's for $150. It's for the registration for 17 J.P. 1 and his clerk. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So moved. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 21 Griffin, second by Commissioner Letz, that the Court approve 22 a late bill and hand check in the amount of $150 payable to 23 the order of South Texas J.P. and Constables Association for 24 J.P. 1. Any further questions or comments? If not, all in 25 favor, raise your right hand. 33 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 5 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. The next one is to the 6 Holiday Inn Sunspree for $357.08 for lodging for two 7 individuals at the J.P. and Constables Association training. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Third. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 12 Williams, second by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court 13 approve a late bill and hand check in the amount of $357.08 14 payable to Holiday Inn for J.P. 1 conference expenses. Any 15 further questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise 16 your right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carried. 21 MR. TOMLINSON: The last one is to Vance 22 Elliott for $35.75, and it's for reimbursement for travel to 23 the conference. 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So moved. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 34 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 2 Griffin, second by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court 3 approve a late bill and hand check in the amount of $35.75 4 payable to the order of Vance Elliott for reimbursement for 5 travel expenses. Any further questions or comments? If 6 not -- I guess not -- all in favor, raise your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 11 (Discussion off the record.) 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: We do not have any minutes to 13 approve. At this time, I would entertain a motion to 14 approve and accept the monthly reports as presented. 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So moved. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 18 Griffin, second by Commissioner Letz, that the Court approve 19 and accept the monthly reports as presented. Any further 20 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 21 right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Okay. 35 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That must have set a 2 record. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: No, we're a long way from a 4 record, I think. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Up in the 20's. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Turning to the consideration 7 agenda, the first item for consideration is Item Number 1, 8 consider and discuss approval of the form of volunteer fire 9 department contracts and authorize the County Judge to sign 10 same when presented with a contract signed by a volunteer 11 fire department. Commissioner Griffin. 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Actually, Mr. Lucas 13 will present the contract to us. 14 MR. LUCAS: Gentlemen, I believe that y'all 15 have looked over this contract. Out of my 13-month tenure, 16 I've never seen a contract negotiated to such a degree, and 17 suffice to it say, it's a good contract, legally and perhaps 18 even policy-wise. The second page contains the boilerplate 19 legal issues. We kept them to a minimum, as we did with 20 what I call the "policy provisions" on the first page. We 21 made the document as succinct as possible, and also readable 22 to all non-lawyers, so it was a plus with that. Like I 23 said, this went through extensive negotiations, and from 24 what I've understood -- what I understand, the Hunt 25 Volunteer Fire Department has -- their Board of Directors 36 1 has checked off on it, as has their general counsel. That 2 was done through Commissioner Griffin, I believe, over the 3 last couple of weeks. There's nothing in here that, you 4 know, we can't do. In other words, everything's legal. 5 There's nothing onerous about the provisions, and I'll just 6 entertain any questions you may have. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anyone have any questions of 8 Mr. Lucas? Commissioners? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: One question, and I'm -- 10 it jumped out at me. The primary fire response area, that's 11 defined in Chapter 352 as to what that actually is? The 12 primary response area? 13 MR. LUCAS: Well, no, that's -- 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It isn't? 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Not in 352. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, is it defined 17 somewhere? 18 MR. LUCAS: No, it's not at all. The -- all 19 352 authorizes us to do is to contract with a volunteer fire 20 department, period. And, those type -- the decisions that I 21 think you're referring to are solely up to that fire 22 department. Our authority ends once we contract, so -- 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think the question, 24 though, is who defines the primary area. I think that's 25 done in the charter, is it not, Dutch? 37 1 MR. HINTZE: Yes, sir. But there still is 2 the question about the statement that we submitted as a 3 result of the 31 July workshop, that when the contract was 4 drafted originally -- remember, it said that the fire 5 departments were responsible for Kerr County, and then we 6 discussed that at the workshop and said, you know, that 7 really wasn't workable because it wasn't the way the system 8 operated. And I sent in -- I acknowledged that during the 9 workshop, that I'd take a crack at submitting an input that 10 would cover that, and I sent it in. But, in going back 11 through the contracts all the way back to 1996, they all 12 have the same statement in there, the identical statement, 13 even through the contract of this year. And, it says the 14 department shall, considering the department's commitment to 15 its own area, provide backup emergency fire services to the 16 other areas of the county as requested. I think that says 17 it all, and I respectfully recommend that that statement be 18 included in this contract in Paragraph 2. 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: However -- we took 20 your letter, Dutch, and I presented that to the County 21 Attorney's office, and in the scrubdown of all of what we 22 could do legally and -- illegally or whatever, the decision 23 was that we had no authority to say how one department 24 relates to another. Help me with that, Travis. 25 MR. LUCAS: That's right. No, it's that 38 1 simple. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's how we were 3 advised, and that's the reason it's not in there. And, as 4 we said at the workshop, we'd take a look at it, and we did, 5 again, and it just didn't survive the scrutiny that, this 6 time, the County Attorney's office gave to the contract. It 7 probably should not have been in there before. That's -- 8 that was the problem. 9 MR. LUCAS: Yeah, I think that's correct. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: It just shouldn't have 11 been in the contract before, because there's no authority 12 for the Court to enter into that kind of agreement. That's 13 where we stand. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: With that said, then, if 15 it's not a defined definition legally, why just say within 16 the response area of Kerr County? 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No, the P.F.R.A. -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: -- is defined in 20 the -- in the fire department's charter, what their area is. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I understand. In all of 22 them? 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: In all of them, and 24 that's what we're doing, is we're -- in each case, we are 25 contracting with them to provide -- 'cause that's what the 39 1 statute allows you to do. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 3 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Is to provide service 4 in that area. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. My last question, 6 and then I'll -- is that preposition correct after the 7 parentheses? Should it be "to" Kerr County or "of" Kerr 8 County? 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Fire protection 10 services "to" Kerr County. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To Kerr County? 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Provide fire 13 protection services to Kerr County. I think that's right. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any other questions or 16 comments from the Commissioners? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: My only comment is, 18 you said that you had written it where non-attorneys could 19 read it. 20 MR. LUCAS: I hope. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Back in the good old 22 days, there were more of us than y'all back then. 23 MR. LUCAS: Right. 24 (Laughter.) 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No longer. So you can 40 1 write it any way you want to. 2 MR. LUCAS: Right, I guess so. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good piece of work, 4 counselor. Thank you. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Short and succinct. 6 Every draft got shorter. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's right. Good work. 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Any final discussion? 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anything else? Any other 10 comments? 11 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I'll make a motion 12 that we approve the form of the volunteer fire department 13 contracts and authorize County Judge to sign them as they 14 are presented, signed by the volunteer fire departments. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 17 Griffin, second by Commissioner Letz, that the Court approve 18 the form of volunteer fire department contracts as 19 presented, and authorize County Judge to sign same when 20 presented with contract executed by volunteer fire 21 department. Any further questions or comments? If not, all 22 in favor, raise your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 41 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Item Number 2 2, consider Letter of Credit issued for Falling Waters 3 Subdivision. Franklin? 4 MR. JOHNSTON: This came about as a result of 5 a phone call we received from, I guess, someone looking at 6 the property in Falling Water; they said that the road was 7 not complete and the Letter of Credit is about to expire, so 8 I went back and looked at it. That was one question I had. 9 And they said, "Why do you have a Letter of Credit for 10 maintenance and not for construction of the roads?" I said, 11 "Well, better go back and look." How it turned out, when we 12 approved that -- that plat revision, we received a -- a fax 13 as part of the backup; didn't have the actual Letter of 14 Credit. The fax stated the conditions and said for the 15 purpose of construction of additional roadways in Falling 16 Water Subdivision. Then, on the day we approved the plat 17 revision, we received the actual Letter of Credit, and it 18 says "for maintenance of roads, streets, and alleyways in 19 Falling Water Subdivision." So, somewhere there's a 20 miscommunication there. And, we looked in the Subdivision 21 Rules, and the term was also not correct. It says that the 22 term should be for a 3-year period, and this was only for a 23 1-year period. So, we're asking for a revision of the 24 Letter of Credit. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is it -- I mean, have we 42 1 -- has the developer -- I mean, is the Letter of Credit 2 ready? We just have to approve it? Or are we authorizing 3 you to tell him he needs to do it? 4 MR. JOHNSTON: I think the latter. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Latter. I'll make a 6 motion that we authorize Road and Bridge to contact Dale 7 Crenwelge, the developer, and work out the details of a 8 Letter of Credit. 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 10 MR. JOHNSTON: I think the actual language in 11 the Subdivision Rules says that Letters of Credit will be 12 approved by the County Attorney and then, you know, 13 submitted to the Court. And we've been relying on faxes and 14 such. I guess in the future, we need to actually get that 15 letter before we put the item on the agenda. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Probably a good idea. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: When is our first meeting in 19 October? 20 AUDIENCE: The 9th. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: It's the 9th. 22 MS. SOVIL: The 5th is on a Friday. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: The 8th is a holiday. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's correct. 25 MS. SOVIL: Right. 43 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. I certainly agree with 2 your motion. What I'm trying to do is set up a time frame 3 if, for some reason, we don't have the revised Letter of 4 Credit for approval on the 9th, that we still have time to 5 draw on the existing Letter of Credit before it expires at 6 close of business on the 10th. 7 MR. JOHNSTON: Expires on the 10th. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Correct. 9 MR. JOHNSTON: The next day. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: I'm just checking the time 11 line here. We have time in order to let it run out. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That would certainly 13 encourage you to work it out before our second meeting in 14 September. 15 MR. JOHNSTON: Get it in the proper format. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We have time to wait. If 17 we don't have it, I would tell Mr. Crenwelge we need to get 18 this in order by the second meeting of September, whatever 19 date that falls on. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 21 second by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court authorize 22 Franklin Johnston to notify Mr. Crenwelge of the need to 23 replace existing Letter of Credit Number 08005 for Falling 24 Water Subdivision with a Letter of Credit conforming to the 25 requirements of the Subdivision Regulations. Any further 44 1 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 2 right hand. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 5 (No response.) 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Item Number 7 3, consider and approve final revision of plat for Lots 176, 8 177, 178, and 179 of Spicer Ranch. Commissioner Williams, I 9 believe this is yours, isn't it? 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't think so. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's in my precinct. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Sorry, Commissioner. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Go ahead, Franklin. 14 MR. JOHNSTON: This item, we had a couple 15 things that we wanted them to look at on the preliminary, 16 which they have completed. They put the lot numbers in 17 sequence with the old existing plat. He marked where all 18 the residences were; there's just one. And, they do not 19 have their own wells; they're on a public water system. 20 And, I believe it's to the satisfaction of U.G.R.A. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any questions or comments? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move that we approve 23 the final revision of plat for Lots 176, 177, 178, and 179 24 of Spicer Ranch III. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 45 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 2 Baldwin, second by Commissioner Williams, that the Court 3 approve the final revision of plat for Lots 176, 177, 178, 4 and 179 of Spicer Ranch, Roman numeral III. Any further 5 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 6 right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Moving right 11 along, Item Number 4, consider and approve name changes for 12 privately maintained roads in Precinct 1 and 4 in accordance 13 in the 911 guidelines. Truby? 14 MS. HARDIN: We have a total of eight road 15 names, seven in Precinct 4 and one in Precinct 1. And, if 16 you'll notice on the new form, it shows the effective date 17 to be October the 11th. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I'll move that we 19 approve the name changes as submitted, privately maintained 20 roads in Precinct 1 and 4, in accordance with the 911 21 guidelines as presented. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 24 Griffin, second by Commissioner Baldwin that the Court 25 approve the name changes for privately maintained roads in 46 1 Precinct 1 and 4 as presented, in accordance with the 911 2 guidelines. Any further questions or comments? If not, all 3 in favor, raise your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 8 (Discussion off the record.) 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Next item is Number 5, 10 consider authorizing advertisement for Notice of Public 11 Hearings to eliminate duplicated names for County-maintained 12 roads in accordance with 911 guidelines, and set the public 13 hearing date for the same. Once again, Truby. 14 MS. HARDIN: We discussed this at the last 15 Commissioners Court date, and we changed the date to 16 October 9th, and we added a few roads. Precinct 2 has -- I 17 mean, Precinct 1 has two roads. Precinct 2, one. Precinct 18 3 has two, and Precinct 4 has 18. On this ad here, I'd like 19 to make two corrections. Down on Sleepy Hollow, the country 20 lane, it needs a geo-region of "West" on the end of those 21 two names. And I would like to add Belfield. It is the 22 official name for Rustic Hill, but is known by all the 23 citizens out there as Rustic Hills, so we'd like to do that 24 to clean up, and it would be to Rustic Hill Road Southwest. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: From -- what is it now? 47 1 MS. HARDIN: Belfield, B-e-l-f-i-e-l-d. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: To Rustic Wills West? 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Rustic Hills is really 4 the real name, isn't it? 5 MS. HARDIN: No, sir. The official name is 6 Belfield, but it is commonly known as Rustic Hill. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 8 MS. HARDIN: And it's also known by 911 as 9 Rustic Hill. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: The road signs have 11 always said Rustic Hills, but on the plat done in 1864, it 12 says Belfield. 13 MS. HARDIN: And on the road list. Do we 14 need -- we don't need to read all these names off, do we? 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: No. Do I have a motion to 16 authorize publication of the names and set the public 17 hearing for October 9th, Year 2001, at 10 a.m.? 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So moved. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 21 Griffin, second by Commissioner Letz, that the Court 22 authorize advertisement of public hearing to eliminate 23 duplicated names for County-maintained roads in accordance 24 with 911 guidelines and set a public hearing for 10 o'clock 25 a.m. on Tuesday, October 9, Year 2001, in the Commissioners 48 1 Courtroom here in the Kerr County Courthouse. Any further 2 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 3 right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Okay. Next 8 item is Item Number 6, consider and discuss the step and 9 grade designation for the first assistant auditor. 10 Mr. Tomlinson. 11 MR. TOMLINSON: I didn't furnish any backup 12 to the Court, as the Treasurer or Personnel Director for the 13 County is actually going to furnish the backup. My request 14 is based on the fact that my first assistant essentially has 15 the same -- the same general duties as the chief deputy in 16 other departments in -- in the courthouse. I -- I have 17 discussed this situation with -- with my boss, and he -- he 18 joins me in -- in requesting that we make this -- that the 19 Court allow this change from -- in changing the grade from a 20 grade of 17 to a 19. And he emphasizes, and I also concur, 21 that since -- since I am part-time, and that it's -- it's 22 important that we -- we have a pay level that we can -- that 23 we can pay a very qualified individual. In most counties in 24 the state, in auditors' offices, the first assistant 25 auditor -- in a lot of cases, a degree in accounting is 49 1 required. And, this is especially -- this job becomes more 2 and more complex all the time. With GASB 34 down the line, 3 I'm -- I have to spend -- I'm going to have to spend almost 4 75, 80 percent of my time in making that happen, and I -- I 5 just -- that's just my request. And, if you have any 6 questions about -- about the -- from the Treasurer, she's 7 here to answer that. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We talked -- go ahead. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, you go ahead. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How much money are we 11 talking about between the 17 and 19? 12 MR. TOMLINSON: The difference is $3,325. 13 However, the net of that is -- is $1,825. Currently, my 14 first assistant is -- manages and operates the phone system. 15 That -- that job is being handed over to our communications 16 person effective October 1st. We have -- we have paid my 17 first assistant approximately $1,450 for that service, so 18 the net of that is one thousand -- approximately $1,850. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And you're not asking 20 for it to happen until -- be effective until October 1? 21 MR. TOMLINSON: October 1. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Talking about the new 23 budget year? 24 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Barbara? 50 1 MS. NEMEC: Really, this should have been 2 done last year. And, in case you're wondering why it wasn't 3 done last year when we had Nash and Associates -- Nash and 4 Company here doing the reclassifications, the survey job 5 descriptions, the two employees in the auditor's office -- 6 he was running behind and they were out in the hall waiting 7 for him, to be seen. They waited 45 minutes and weren't 8 able to see him, so they never were interviewed. And I 9 truly believe that, had they been interviewed, they 10 certainly would have put an accounts payable and a first 11 assistant at the same level. The first assistant needs to 12 know all of our jobs; she audits all of our offices, so I 13 feel that she's real worthy of that salary. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Unless I misread the 15 packet we got from -- that had the Nash -- Mr. Nash's 16 comments, there was three of them that were submitted; this 17 was one of the ones, and he rejected all of them. 18 MS. NEMEC: He rejected all of them. Let me 19 say this; that he and I talked on the phone, to let him know 20 what was coming through his desk, and when we talked about 21 each individual position that was coming through his desk 22 for him to look at, he immediately agreed with me on this 23 one that we're discussing. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought -- 25 MS. NEMEC: It was not until -- then he asked 51 1 for backup. I just sent what I had, which was the job 2 description. We had done two different job descriptions, 3 because they only had one job description, which the -- you 4 know, accounts payable, audits, dah-dah-dah-dah. Well, the 5 employees in that office, not both of them audit, not both 6 of the do accounts payable, so we had to do two different 7 job descriptions. Well, he was in agreement that the first 8 assistant should be moved up. Once he got the information, 9 he called me back and he said, just so that I can have a 10 backup, make sure that I get a letter from your Auditor 11 requesting this. Well, Tommy was pretty aggravated about 12 the whole situation since last year, and his letter 13 indicated that, so it was after he received Tommy's letter 14 that he rejected that particular one. 15 MR. TOMLINSON: I made the man mad. 16 MS. NEMEC: He made him mad. And, I can not 17 -- I can tell you that he had no problem. He fully agreed 18 with me that it should be done. And then Tommy -- he's very 19 honest and sends this honest letter, and it was after that 20 that he said no. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just kind of a general 22 comment that I have. When I read through that packet during 23 the whole process, I heard a lot of complaints about 24 Mr. Nash and how that process went. And, by reading his 25 response and the sarcasm that I read in his e-mails, I would 52 1 never recommend hiring that man again for anything. It was 2 absolutely ridiculous. 3 MS. NEMEC: You don't make him mad, yeah. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He put in the e-mails 5 back to -- I guess they're addressed to you, but they're -- 6 all three of them. And, I mean, I read through those 7 things. I was, like, "Where's this guy coming from?" I 8 mean -- 9 MS. NEMEC: He does not like to be 10 questioned. He does not like to be questioned. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It seemed to me that he 12 rejected some -- all three because someone in Kerr County 13 was challenging his decision. 14 MR. TOMLINSON: That's what I did; I 15 challenged his decision. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Anyway -- 17 MS. NEMEC: Exactly. So, that's how that 18 happened. 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And to add to that 20 just a little bit, just -- as I understand it, the Court has 21 the final authority, not Mr. Nash. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That was my 24 understanding. 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And, I don't know; at 53 1 some point I think we'll quit calling him, right? I mean, 2 at some point -- 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 4 MS. NEMEC: Our year is up. We had a year 5 contract with him, and so when these three came up, that 6 they wanted their titles to be looked at, their pay to be 7 looked at, we had to refer them to him because we had a year 8 contract. 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: He's giving us a 10 recommendation. 11 MS. NEMEC: However -- right. As of August, 12 our year is up. 13 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think we can -- 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Certainly not follow his 15 recommendation. 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: In the future, yeah. 17 Okay. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any further questions or 19 comments? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm in agreement with 21 the Auditor. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Was that a motion? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move that we approve 24 the -- whatever the step and grade is, 17 -- 25 MS. NEMEC: 19/6. 54 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Nineteen -- from 17 2 what? 3 MS. NEMEC: I'm sorry, from -- a 17/6 to a 4 19/6. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do I hear a second? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 8 Baldwin, second by Commissioner Letz, that the Court approve 9 reclassification of the first assistant auditor's position 10 from a Grade 17 to a Grade 19 and authorize reclassification 11 of the existing assistant county auditor from a 17/6 to a 12 19/6. Any further questions -- 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Effective? 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Effective October 1st, Year 15 2001. Thank you, Bill. Any further questions or comments? 16 JUDGE RAGSDALE: If they're talking about 17 Mindy here, this County would be in horrible, horrible, 18 horrible shape if we made that woman mad enough to quit. 19 She is much more qualified than probably what we deserve, 20 and sure has kept a lot of elected officials -- I won't 21 mention any names -- out of a lot of trouble. 22 (Laughter.) 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That is true. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any other comments? 25 Franklin? 55 1 MR. JOHNSTON: There were three people, I 2 think, and one of them's not on the agenda this time, but if 3 there's some way we can address that also? The -- 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Not today. Can't be done 5 today. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Put it back on the 7 agenda. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: If there's no further 9 questions or comments, all in favor, raise your right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 12 (No response.) 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Next item is 14 Item Number 7, which is consider and discuss approval of 15 reclassification of job title or increase in step/grade for 16 the accounting clerk in the County Clerk's office. Jannett? 17 MS. PIEPER: Gentlemen, if y'all will 18 remember, I think I'm the very first one that upset Mr. Nash 19 extremely when I questioned him, so I'm here to try to get 20 my senior accounting clerk reclassified as an administrative 21 clerk. All of y'all know, just like Mindy does all of the 22 accounting, my senior accounting clerk does all of my 23 accounting for all 15 departments, and then some. In 24 addition to bookkeeping, she assists my chief deputy and 25 supervises personnel with required recordkeeping, and all 56 1 different kind of functions. I have, as backup, what 2 happened prior to the Nash study, and then what happened 3 after the Nash study with her. And, she's had to go through 4 a whole year being over one administrator, making less money 5 than that person now. At one point they were all 15's; 6 however, after the Nash study, the administrators -- of 7 course, their titles were changed to administrators, and 8 they got bumped up to 17's, except for her. And, in the 9 process of all the Nash study, I had to fight him 10 tremendously, because he wanted to take one of my deputy 11 clerks and bump her up to an administrative clerk on one of 12 them that didn't deserve it, so I had to fight two battles 13 with him. And, during the appeal process, I was more 14 worried about my probate deputy getting bumped up to a -- an 15 administrative clerk, that she did not deserve that 16 position, and in reading my bookkeeper's duties and job 17 descriptions, it has all of her bookkeeping skills in there 18 that she does, plus it also lists the administrative duties. 19 So, therefore, I failed to appeal that one. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Jannett, which -- who 21 among these ladies are in your supervisory hierarchy? 22 MS. PIEPER: It lists -- it goes down. My 23 first one is my chief deputy. My second-in-command is the 24 senior accounting clerk, and that's the one we're talking 25 about. 57 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Anyone else? 2 MS. PIEPER: And then after that, it just 3 goes straight down the list. I'm not listing names, because 4 we're not in Executive Session. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. I, too, read 6 the Nash report on Ms. Tuck's response to Mr. Nash, which I 7 thought left a lot to be desired. The opening paragraph, he 8 concurred that there was -- there were deserving -- that 9 Ms. Tuck was deserving of this improvement, and then he went 10 on and argued himself out of it during the remainder of 11 his -- of his dissertation, over e-mail. I'm glad we're not 12 paying for that stuff any more. So, anything else we need 13 to know about, Barbara? 14 MS. NEMEC: No. The only thing is that I was 15 looking here through his study that he did last year. It 16 says to recognize more complexity on some desks, we also 17 recommend the designation "senior" in a few instances. So, 18 in here he does -- he does address that there is more 19 complexity in -- in her job. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess -- it doesn't 21 make sense to me -- I mean, and certainly every elected 22 official has the right and obligation to organize their 23 department. It doesn't make sense. If Jannett's choice is 24 to have this position -- or the person in that position be 25 basically the number three person, that person should be 58 1 paid accordingly, I mean, and -- you know, and as long as 2 they're doing the work, it just doesn't make sense to me, 3 the way it's set up. 4 MS. PIEPER: When my staff and I talked about 5 the titles, you know -- because I know within the counties 6 they all want to stay uniform. So, one of the quotes that 7 was made by my senior accounting clerk was, "I don't care 8 what I'm paid, as long as I get the money for doing the job 9 that I am doing." And, so, I understand that there's not an 10 administrative bookkeeper, per se, in the personnel records 11 for that title, so if we could at least get her salary up to 12 where it should be, I would be satisfied with that. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is your preference to 14 change the step -- change the grade or change the step and 15 grade? 16 MS. PIEPER: The -- 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: The step. 18 MS. PIEPER: The step. Well, no. No, sir. 19 No, the step and the grade. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Both? 21 MS. PIEPER: In order for her to be equal, 22 she needs to be raised to a 15/10, if we don't change her 23 title. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And if we change the 25 title, then it goes to a 17/6? 59 1 MS. PIEPER: 17/6. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That would be your 3 first preference; is that correct? 4 MS. PIEPER: That would be my first 5 preference. 6 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Total impact is $586? 7 MS. PIEPER: Yes. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's the total 9 impact to the budget? $586? 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: The job description that the 11 Court approved last year, which I am looking at right now -- 12 MS. PIEPER: Mm-hmm. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- does not have any 14 supervisory responsibilities in it. 15 MS. PIEPER: They should be there. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: I'm talking about the one 17 that was approved last year and which is in effect right 18 now. I know you've marked up one which includes supervisory 19 responsibility, but her job description right now has no 20 supervisory responsibility in it. 21 MS. PIEPER: None of my job descriptions in 22 my office are accurate, and you and I spoke about that, 23 because I was under the impression from you that, because my 24 deputy clerk in the front of my office does not do anything 25 that the deputy in the back of my office does, you had 60 1 implied that the Nash Company was going to do them 2 individual. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: I don't know whether I 4 implied that or thought that. That was a long time ago; 5 I've slept since then, so I don't remember that. The point 6 is, you're trying to base the increase to a 17 on 7 supervisory responsibility. It's not reflected in her job 8 description. Now, it may be that her job description is 9 inaccurate, but these job descriptions were negotiated and 10 adopted by the Court less than a year ago. 11 MS. PIEPER: Right. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: So how can they be so changed 13 from a year ago? 14 MS. PIEPER: Because none of them in my 15 office are accurate. But -- 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, I mean, that's -- 17 MS. PIEPER: Each deputy clerk, each 18 administrative assistant, each one of them do different 19 things in the office. So, I feel like I'm kind of losing 20 the battle on that. 21 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Is there such a thing 22 as a senior administrative accounting clerk -- a senior 23 administrative clerk? 24 MS. PIEPER: Not that I'm aware of. Barbara? 25 MS. NEMEC: No. 61 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To raise it, you change 2 it to basically -- if we do change it to a 17, it becomes an 3 administrative accounting clerk? 4 MS. PIEPER: Right. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And -- couple 6 questions, Jannett. Did -- did Nash not look at any of your 7 job descriptions? 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: He prepared it, the ones that 9 we -- 10 MS. PIEPER: I requested to speak to him five 11 different times. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What I'm getting 13 at -- I understand that, 'cause you and I spoke and you told 14 me that. But, in the process, did he not -- did he not -- 15 MS. PIEPER: He did. I marked -- I marked -- 16 we were sent our job descriptions. I marked them all up, I 17 sent them back to him, and I got basically the same thing he 18 had sent me the first time. So -- 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So he ignored them? 20 MS. PIEPER: Right. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Didn't want to 22 approve them, but you did mark them up and sent them? 23 MS. PIEPER: Yes. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, in effect, are 25 you asking us tonight, in addition to moving this particular 62 1 person up to an administrative accounting clerk or improving 2 the grade so that the -- 3 MS. PIEPER: Or changing the step and the 4 grade to a 15/10. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The job description 6 be changed as well, or not? 7 MS. PIEPER: I would need to get my other job 8 description for y'all to approve that. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But not tonight. 10 MS. PIEPER: No, because I don't have it with 11 me. 12 MS. NEMEC: The thing that y'all need to 13 think about, too, is that if you're going to make this a 14 15/10 rather than a 17/6, what you need to stop to think is, 15 when that -- when that job -- when that person is no longer 16 in that job, is that job going to be worth a 15/1 or a 17/1? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 18 MS. NEMEC: So, when you -- 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, I'm not sure it should 20 be. I mean, and Jannett does a good job, and I'm not 21 arguing with her to be obstreperous, but look at her whole 22 department. Counting Jannett, she has 15 people in her 23 department, and if we make this change, then there's going 24 to be five supervisors out of 15 people. Jannett -- 25 actually, six; Jannett and her chief deputy and four 63 1 administrative clerks. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But, by the same token, 3 though, if Jannett chooses to have a senior accounting clerk 4 be the third most responsible person of that -- running that 5 office, there needs to be a way to get that person to a 6 salary level -- 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, I -- 8 MS. PIEPER: There are times that me and my 9 chief deputy are out of the office together; early voting, 10 schools, just taking care of the clerking business. So, 11 when she and I are out of the office, somebody else needs to 12 be in charge. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We've come across the 14 same situation as a result of the Nash review of all of our 15 jobs, most recently with the Sheriff. And, he upgraded the 16 department significantly, which it needed to be, and we 17 approved that, only to find out 10 months later the chief 18 deputy is making more money than the Sheriff. That doesn't 19 wash. I don't think it washes in any department. I think 20 there ought to be a clear, distinct disparity between those 21 in supervisory responsibility and those who are being 22 supervised. I've always believed that, and I'm not going to 23 stop believing it tonight. 24 MS. NEMEC: We didn't find out 10 months 25 later, though, in that case. The Sheriff knew when that 64 1 happened that he was making less money than his chief 2 deputy, and he chose not to ask for a higher salary at that 3 time. So, I do have to defend Nash in that way. It wasn't 4 -- we were aware of it. The Sheriff was aware of it, and he 5 chose to keep it that way. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I do agree with the Judge 7 on the point that I think it's -- at some point, we need -- 8 do need to look at the number of employees in the department 9 and number of supervisors in the department. And, I mean, 10 you can't end up with all supervisors. I mean, that doesn't 11 work, either. I'm not sure where that line is. I think 12 that's one thing that -- but it's a little bit of a separate 13 issue, to me, on this particular case. I mean, if the 14 individual -- the senior accounting clerk is going to be the 15 number three person in the office, I think that person needs 16 to be raised to a 17. Now, there may be a few -- a second 17 part of this that says, Jannett, you have too many 18 supervisors. You need to relook at your overall 19 classification. 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's a different 21 subject. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Different subject. 23 MS. PIEPER: But I have a lot more 24 departments than most -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not saying -- 65 1 MS. PIEPER: -- than most offices here. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's a different issue 3 than we're talking about tonight. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Barbara, are the 5 dollars the same, 15/10 and 17/6? 6 MS. NEMEC: No, sir -- oh, I'm sorry. 15/10 7 and 17/6? 8 MS. PIEPER: Yes. 9 MS. NEMEC: Okay, a 15/10 is $24,755. 17/6 10 is $24,754. 11 MS. PIEPER: One dollar more. 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Close enough. 13 MS. NEMEC: And -- and there's two more steps 14 after a 10, so that's going to lock that individual into two 15 more steps and that's it. Because the Court last year chose 16 not to go further than a 12, so that's another thing to 17 consider. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I would like to 19 suggest that, Jannett, you come back with a -- a job 20 description that fits so that the Court can take a look at 21 that, but in the meantime I'm going to move that we do a 22 reclassification for this position to a 17/6. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 25 Williams, second by Commissioner Baldwin, that the position 66 1 of senior accounting clerk in the County Clerk's office be 2 reclassified from a 15/6 to a 17/6. 3 MS. PIEPER: Thank you, gentlemen. 4 MS. NEMEC: I'm sorry, Commissioner Williams, 5 what was that statement you made about -- she should come 6 back with what? 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Job description. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Revision of the job 9 description. 10 MS. NEMEC: Updated to a supervisory 11 position. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: With her 13 responsibilities. 14 MS. NEMEC: Effective October 1? 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Effective October 1. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any further questions or 17 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 18 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 20 (No response.) 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Okay. 22 Number 8, Mr. Ragsdale, permission to purchase an item as 23 Capital Outlay and transfer the money necessary to the 24 proper line item. 25 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Actually, two -- three items 67 1 within that, if you'll let me discuss them. One is the fact 2 that, since I prepared my budget, I've had another printer 3 bite the dust. These are -- these are the worst printers -- 4 I bought Epson for a reason; I thought that they would be up 5 to the task, and they've not been. They're wide-carriage 6 printers, because I have a need for a wide-carriage printer, 7 so I bought two of them in case one of them died. I still 8 have a wide-carriage printer that I can still use for narrow 9 paper. But, what has happened is, apparently there's some 10 defect with this particular model. The mother board in them 11 has -- and one of them, while they were under warranty, died 12 four times. They told us this time -- the printer costs 13 $450 -- they'd charge us $325 to replace the mother board. 14 That's a waste of money. I would just rather -- I've been 15 working with the Auditor's office and -- what's the fellow's 16 name that does the computer -- the guru? 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Shaun. 18 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Shaun. My understanding 19 is -- is, for $900, we should be able to replace both of 20 those printers without me asking for an emergency 21 expenditure; just transfer from my Dockets and Forms line 22 item to Capital Outlay. I can't remember what number that 23 is. I think maybe -- 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: It's in here. 25 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Is it on that sheet there? 68 1 That's one item. Then the other item that I need to 2 address, since I have some funds in there, is all of the law 3 enforcement in this county now, or almost all of them, are 4 using video cameras now. I have no way to allow them to use 5 that evidence in my court, so I need a VC player and TV to 6 be mounted in my courtroom. It's about $500. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: $550. 8 JUDGE RAGSDALE: $550. That might -- then 9 the last item would be a chair for my clerk. I don't want 10 to get him bucked out and -- and go through that thing 11 again. Actually, he's using a chair that belongs to me and 12 not to the County, but it's becoming fatigued, and I would 13 like about $400 to get a good, safe chair for him, and 14 replace my own personal item. 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Is all of that coming 16 out of Dockets and Forms? 17 JUDGE RAGSDALE: No, sir. Some of that is 18 coming out of Conference. I wasn't able to go to 19 legislative update and some other things that I needed to go 20 to. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Everything was okay until 22 you hit the $400 chair. Seems like a lot for a chair. I 23 haven't bought chairs recently, but just like -- 24 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Well, the last one I bought 25 was about $350. I mean, if I can find one that's safe 69 1 and -- and will be durable for less, I won't spend the 2 money, but I didn't want to ask -- you know, with freight 3 included, I didn't want to ask for less than what I would 4 need. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: The problem we have, Bill, is 6 that the only item that's posted is the $550 transfer. 7 JUDGE RAGSDALE: That's the only one I gave 8 you backup for. Actually, I -- I don't mind delaying for a 9 couple weeks the -- the other two items. It's just that I 10 was appearing here today, and those things came up in the 11 interim. I -- I asked -- actually, I thought maybe that the 12 Auditor was going to bring up the -- the printers, but he 13 hadn't yet, and so I decided, since I was here anyway, and 14 the item -- line item was -- verbiage was loose enough that 15 I thought maybe I could go ahead and take care of all of it 16 at one time, rather than take up your time and my time 17 again. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, the posting -- 19 other than the lack of the last word, "item" instead of 20 "items," plural. But, I mean, it is pretty broad. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It looks broad enough 22 to do it, to me. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. I'm not going to 24 argue. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm not sure this is 70 1 English, but -- 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Can we phrase a budget 3 amendment or whatever to do all of that? I think that's the 4 only thing we don't have here. I think the -- if the -- the 5 agenda item is okay, we just need to get those numbers out 6 of where they're coming from and where they are they going. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I agree. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why don't -- why don't we 9 take no action on this and let's handle it as a budget 10 amendment next time, and just do all of them? 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, it can't be just a 12 budget amendment, because the VCR and the TV were not listed 13 on the Capital Outlay. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's right. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: What we can do today is -- if 17 we want to, is amend Judge Ragsdale's Capital Outlay to 18 authorize purchase of a VCR and television, and do it all as 19 a budget amendment next -- and chair, and do it all as a 20 budget amendment next time, or we can go ahead and -- and do 21 whatever you want to do. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Let's do it all, be done 23 with it. I'd make a motion that we do it, but I don't know 24 if I can figure out how to say all that. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Do we have good numbers? Is 71 1 it $900 for the printers, Tommy? Do you know how much? 2 MR. TOMLINSON: I'm sorry? 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Do we know how much the 4 printers are for the J.P.'s court? 5 MR. TOMLINSON: I don't know. Is Shaun here? 6 JUDGE RAGSDALE: He was. I thought he was 7 staying; all of a sudden I turned around, and he had 8 disappeared. 9 MR. TOMLINSON: I didn't check the printers, 10 so I don't know. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Didn't Shaun -- Shaun 12 said $900? 13 JUDGE RAGSDALE: That's what Mindy told me 14 last week. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Is that that same kind 16 of printer you replaced in mine? 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: How much for a chair? $400? 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Four. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Make the motion. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Do we have a second? 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 24 second by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court authorize the 25 amendment to J.P. Ragsdale's Precinct 4 budget to authorize 72 1 purchase of a VCR and television and chair for his court, 2 and that the Court authorize a transfer of $550 from Dockets 3 and Forms, as well as $900 and $400 from a combination of 4 Dockets and Forms and Conference and Travel for the purchase 5 of the television, the VCR, a chair for the clerk, and two 6 printers. 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Hear, hear. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where'd you get all 9 that? 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: I made them up as I went 11 along. 12 JUDGE RAGSDALE: That's why he's the County 13 Judge. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any questions or comments? 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I know that. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: If not, all in favor, raise 17 your right hand. 18 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 20 (No response.) 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 22 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Thank you. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: The time has come. Let's 24 take a break and return promptly at 8 o'clock. 25 (Recess taken from 7:52 p.m. to 8:00 p.m.) - - - - - - - - - - 73 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Let's resume this 2 regular special session of the Kerr County Commissioners 3 Court. Next item for consideration is Item Number 9, 4 consider and discuss enforcement of Manufactured Home Rental 5 Communities ordinance as it applies to the Wayne Barney 6 property, and instruct the County Attorney to proceed to 7 enforce the ordinance. Commissioner Baldwin, I believe this 8 is in your precinct; is that correct? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, it is. I'm just 10 going to make a comment and then turn it over to -- 11 Franklin, I guess you're carrying the ball on this thing? 12 It says here in this letter from Franklin -- it says "Buster 13 and I meet with..." I mean, okay. Okay, we did. We did -- 14 we did meet with Mr. Barney -- it's a mobile home park out 15 on Ranchero Road -- several months ago, and talked -- told 16 him specifically how this Manufactured Home Rental Community 17 program works, sent him a copy of it. And I met with him, 18 and then Franklin and I met with him, and his -- his deal at 19 that time was, he was getting a little financial problem 20 there and he wanted to know if he could park some of his 21 mobile homes on his property to satisfy some kind of bank 22 deal. And, I told him I didn't have any problem with that 23 at all; he can do whatever he wants to on his own property, 24 in my opinion, but when he got down to the roads and the 25 O.S.S.F. program, then he needs to start complying with 74 1 rules and regulations. So, he has put in -- there's a 2 couple of -- two or three mobile homes out there that don't 3 even have windows in them. And, take it from there before I 4 get angry and start saying some things. 5 MR. JOHNSTON: Well, I just know it's -- from 6 the road, it looks like the entire area is filled up with 7 mobile homes all of a sudden. We still don't have that 8 development plan, so I just -- that's why I brought it to 9 your attention. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Is there any indication that 11 he's renting these at this time? Or -- 12 MR. JOHNSTON: I don't know. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I try not to look up 14 there. I don't know what he's doing, but he's put in roads 15 without authorization. I mean, just by the photographs, I 16 see at least one car which appears to be a resident-type 17 car. I mean, it's parked in the driveway. 18 MR. JOHNSTON: This was during the day. I 19 don't know if -- you know, people -- people could have been 20 gone or -- I don't know if they're -- you can tell if 21 they're hooked up or not. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Let's be clear. To me, he's 23 in violation, by the pictures. It's not just one or two. 24 We're talking about -- 25 MR. JOHNSTON: Probably a dozen of them. 75 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There's about 11, I 2 think. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Eleven in this one 4 picture. 5 MR. BROWN: Is there a street address for 6 that piece of property? 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thirteen -- 8 MR. JOHNSTON: That may be his residence. 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: What is the location 10 on that? Or -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's at the corner of 12 Ranchero and Machon. A new county road, Machon Road. It's 13 the old Baldwin Mobile Home Park. No, no relation. 14 MR. BROWN: I'll check and see if there's any 15 O.S.S.F. violations. 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: What can we do here? 17 Do we just authorize the County Attorney to take a look at 18 it? Or -- 19 MR. LUCAS: Really, there's about three 20 things. You can enjoin them. We can sue for damages for 21 any kind of construction that we have to do to remedy the 22 situation. We can also file a Class B misdemeanor, criminal 23 case. What's interesting is that I have this guy as a chief 24 witness for the State in about three weeks, and -- 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You'll be in a 76 1 position to have a heart-to-heart talk with him. 2 MR. LUCAS: -- my strategy is going to 3 somehow... 4 (Laughter.) 5 (Discussion off the record.) 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: I suggest we instruct the 7 County Attorney's office to investigate the situation and 8 report back to us the appropriate action. 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And, this looks pretty 10 far along, so we need -- 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Report back to us at our next 12 meeting, which is September the 10th. 13 MR. LUCAS: You bet. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I would think that 15 the rules and regulations clearly say that the County 16 Engineer needs to go and inspect construction of roads, et 17 cetera, et cetera. Yes or no? 18 MR. JOHNSTON: Yeah, that's part of the 19 thing; I think we're supposed to do an inspection. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And some of it's been 21 paved -- I mean, he's a long ways along. 22 MR. JOHNSTON: Next time I write it, I'll try 23 to get the grammar correct. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'd appreciate that. 25 Thank you. 77 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. We're done with that 2 one. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do we need a motion to 4 do that, or is he just going to go do it? 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: We might -- 6 MR. LUCAS: Y'all may -- of course, you know, 7 it's a criminal action -- well, let me just give that to 8 you. The actual enforcement in the Subdivision Rules says, 9 at the request of the Commissioners Court, the County 10 Attorney for the county may file an action in a court of 11 competent jurisdiction to enjoin or recover damages, if we 12 need to undertake any construction. But, if we, you know, 13 decide to do a Class B misdemeanor, then, you know, of 14 course, we have that authority and prosecutorial discretion 15 ourselves. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: I don't think a motion is 17 required to ask him to investigate and report back to us. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: All right. We're not 19 actually saying go charge at this moment. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there any advantage to 21 having it on record that -- I mean, to get the trail or -- 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's kind of what I 23 was thinking, too. Sort of sets the stage, doesn't it? 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Fire away. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 78 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What are you moving? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Authorizing the County 3 Attorney to investigate the -- hold on -- investigate the 4 possible manufactured home rental community on Ranchero 5 Road. That's enough. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 8 Baldwin, second by Commissioner Letz, that the Court 9 instruct the County Attorney's office to investigate the 10 possible manufactured home rental community on the Wayne 11 Barney property on Ranchero Road and report back to the 12 Commissioners Court with the recommendation at our next 13 regularly scheduled meeting, which is September 10th. Any 14 further questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise 15 your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Item Number 20 10, consider and discuss approving the resolution to make 21 formal application for membership in the West Texas County 22 Judges and Commissioners Association. Commissioner Baldwin. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, Judge. I 24 asked Commissioner Williams to please put together a 25 resolution requesting the West Texas Judges and 79 1 Commissioners Association to accept our County into their 2 membership, and he put together this resolution for us. 3 And, Commissioner Williams, thank you very much; a job well 4 done. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're welcome. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It -- it's because of, 7 as he states here, communities of interest and similar 8 problems, we're more related to the west Texas people than 9 -- than we are the south Texas people. And, just like 10 Region J, when we put it together, it was just -- we just 11 had more things in common with those people west of us than 12 we did south of us. So, I'm requesting that you approve 13 this resolution requesting formal application for membership 14 to the West Texas Association. And, the court order in 15 here -- or in the -- somewhere, it says that the County 16 Judge is going to send it. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The last "Resolved." 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. County Judge is 19 authorized to forward a copy of this resolution. But if you 20 will allow me to do that, I will fax it to Judge Field out 21 in west Texas tomorrow. He's expecting it. So -- 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Is that a motion? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move that we approve 24 the resolution. 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I enthusiastically -- 80 1 enthusiastically second that motion. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by -- 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Third. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 5 Baldwin, enthusiastically seconded by Commissioner Griffin, 6 and thirded by Commissioner Letz, that the Court approve the 7 resolution to make formal application for membership in the 8 West Texas County Judges and Commissioners Association. Any 9 further questions or comments? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It all happened because 11 we all went to Beaumont and Pappadeaux. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Find a Pappadeaux in 13 San Antonio. 14 (Discussion off the record.) 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: All in favor, raise your 16 right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 (Discussion off the record.) 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Next item is Item Number 11, 22 consider and discuss establishing a Kerr County Water 23 Conservation Program and incorporating a Rainwater 24 Harvesting Incentive Program as Phase I of the new program. 25 Commissioner Williams. 81 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is the second 2 iteration of this, as you know. And, the first one, we -- 3 when we threw it out, we had a public hearing and it 4 attracted a goodly number of folks who gave us some pretty 5 good insight and asked some pretty good questions about it, 6 but particularly were enthusiastic about the concept. 7 Picked up on the question that was raised by Commissioner 8 Letz with regard to how K.C.A.D. might go about establishing 9 the -- and confirming the formula that we had in the prior 10 offering, and the response that we got back that day in the 11 public hearing from Mr. Coates was not encouraging. And, 12 after talking to each of you on other occasions about a 13 method and manner in which to do this, I decided to try it a 14 different way. First we would establish a Kerr County Water 15 Conservation Program, and that's sketched out on the first 16 page of the background material. And, it's -- you know, 17 it's not rocket science, as they say, Larry, but very 18 simple, straightforward, and talks about the types of -- of 19 water conservation programs the Court could enact if it 20 wished to do so at some later date, or take some away if 21 they wished to do so. 22 The second part, then, headed under 23 "Rainwater Harvesting Benefits and Qualification Criteria," 24 changes completely the incentive that we had previously 25 talked about. In this proposal, what we would do would be 82 1 to encourage rainwater harvesting, and to do so, offer a $1 2 tax credit for every $10 invested in rainwater harvesting 3 equipment, up to a maximum of $1,000 or the limit of the 4 taxpayer's county tax obligation, whichever is lesser. So, 5 for example, if a -- a property owner decided to invest 6 $5,000 in a rainwater cachement system -- harvesting system, 7 that individual could qualify -- after the system is 8 inspected to meet our minimum criteria and certified by one 9 of the two agencies we're proposing do this for us, that 10 person would be eligible for a $500 tax credit in the 11 ensuing year after he -- the installation was installed and 12 certified. If that individual only owed the county $467 in 13 county taxes, that would be the limit of the credit that 14 that individual would get. So, it goes up to one-for-ten 15 all the way up to a potential of $10,000, or $1,000, but 16 it's capped really at the limit of the taxpayer's obligation 17 to the County. It cannot ever be greater than that. 18 The criteria for the system itself is 19 explained, and it's the same basic criteria we had before; 20 that it had to be a minimum of -- had to have an application 21 for the harvesting equipment be made through either the 22 U.G.R.A. or Headwaters, and you'll notice in my packet, I -- 23 I provided you copies of correspondence I sent to both 24 Headwaters and the U.G.R.A. asking them to consider this. 25 And, there would be no fee for an application. The 83 1 individual would simply make the application, and what we're 2 asking the agencies to do would be to handle that 3 application, and when the equipment is installed, be the 4 agency that inspects it and certifies it back to Kerr County 5 as having met the basic minimum criteria, which is 2,500 6 gallons minimum, sunlight-restrictive design and 7 construction to prevent algae growth, and inspect-proofing 8 of the storage system would be required. All the benefits 9 are the same as we outlined them before. 10 The two letters to the agencies are there, 11 and then there's an application blank, which gives all the 12 pertinent information, and the individual would fill it out 13 and submit it to either Headwaters or U.G.R.A. This leaves 14 room for other incentive programs to be developed and 15 designed. In talking with Commissioner Letz, we talked 16 about the potential for other things to happen, some as 17 simple as low-flow toilets being installed and replacing 18 some of the older models. We haven't put an incentive in 19 for that; I'm just starting with rainwater, but that's 20 another incentive program that can be added. Commissioner 21 Letz said to me that there may be possibilities in the 22 future for developing other incentive programs for cedar 23 eradication or perhaps other things as well, but we have not 24 designed those yet. This establishes a program and sets off 25 step one being the rainwater harvesting. So, it's before 84 1 you. I'd welcome any suggestions, any comments, any 2 additions or subtractions or -- or where we are here. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: A couple of comments that 4 I have, and I think it -- I'm still a little hesitant to be 5 100 percent -- you know, I think it's a good idea. I like 6 the idea of Kerr County having something to do with water 7 conservation. I'm just -- my, I guess, caution is what the 8 budget impact will be, and how we can determine what -- if 9 we get into cedar eradication and other things, the costs 10 get far more than we're talking about here, and then how do 11 you start saying, well, we're going to, you know, support 12 rainwater harvesting, but we're not going to support 13 something that doesn't do as much good for saving water. 14 And you get into a -- I just have a philosophical issue that 15 I'm wrestling with on that, so I'll leave that aside and 16 just make some more detailed comments. 17 On the page styled "Kerr County Water 18 Conservation Program," I think it's probably easier for me 19 to get with Commissioner Williams later. I would like the 20 justification for that. I don't like hinging it on prior -- 21 I can't even say it -- Priority Groundwater Management Area, 22 PGMA. I think that the -- you know, that should be part of 23 the thing, of the -- to mention that we're in a PGMA, but 24 just to say that we're in it, therefore we need to do a 25 water conservation program to benefit the citizens, I -- I 85 1 just don't like the way that sounds. I'm not -- you know, I 2 think that water conservation makes sense. We're in an area 3 where we need to be cognizant of the amount of water we're 4 using, but that wording bothers me a little bit, that one 5 paragraph. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We can play with 7 that. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On the second page, I 9 believe the actual program, your second dot, it's a -- 10 designate both U.G.R.A. and Headwaters as places where 11 people can pick up the applications -- or where the public 12 can pick up the applications for participation, kind of 13 using their agencies. To me, it would be a lot easier to 14 pick one or the other. I don't know -- I don't have any 15 preference on which one. I think it's confusing to the 16 public to have two. You know, I can just see someone 17 picking up one here, giving it to the other one, and just 18 the recordkeeping on where they are. To me, it should just 19 be at one or the other. Again, I don't have -- really have 20 any preference on which one that we go through. 21 And, the last comment that I have is on the 22 qualification part of it. I think we need to develop more 23 specific criteria. It's -- and I'm looking at this. 24 It's -- well, if we have homemade systems or we're talking 25 about actual cost or -- I mean, lots of things as to how we 86 1 come up with the -- you know, the -- what the amount of the 2 credit's going to be. And, you have here do a firm bid 3 or -- I was looking at the application -- a firm bid or a 4 detailed cost estimate. Now, that may be fine to have that 5 on the application, but I think we're not going to do 6 anything until we get an actual expenditure, so that can be 7 hinged back to that. But, I think we need to be real, you 8 know, careful that we have -- are very specific in what the 9 -- you know, the criteria are. And, I said that was the 10 last thing, but I do have one other, and I forgot what it 11 was already. I'm getting old. 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: When you say specific 13 criteria, for example, would you go as far as saying 14 Schedule 40 PVC must be used throughout, or -- because, you 15 know, really, if you're going to have a system that lasts 16 for a while, you may have to get into that kind of detail. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. I mean, I don't 18 know. I mean, I've never -- I don't know that much about 19 rainwater harvesting systems. I know a lot about irrigation 20 systems; I know a lot about ranch systems, but, you know, I 21 don't -- I've never installed one. I've never used one. 22 So -- but I would think that there are certain components 23 that you need to make sure are present, and some are listed 24 here, as in tank size. Now, I don't know if tank 25 construction needs to be designated. I don't know if 87 1 piping, if the delivery system of how it gets from the 2 storage tank to the house, how it's going to be utilized. I 3 just think that some of that needs to be specified. Those 4 are my -- oh, I know. My final concern, at some point it 5 needs to get to the County Attorney's office. I know there 6 is some authority in Senate Bill 2 for this. I think we 7 really need to make sure -- I haven't looked at that 8 language specifically; I looked at the summary. We need to 9 make sure what authority we have. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I asked the County 11 Attorney to take a look at it. 12 MR. LUCAS: Yeah, he did that a couple weeks 13 ago. It -- and it's just not completed yet. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. But it's 15 something we need to do before we get -- you know, those are 16 kind of the -- you know, I'm not -- I'm certainly not 17 against it. I'm trying to think of where we're going and 18 where it's going to lead down the road. And, when we look 19 at the budget concerns that we're currently going through 20 and worried about, this is a budget issue, even though it 21 won't have an impact in the 2001/2002 budget. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Based on the tax credits, 24 the way you're phasing it in. It's just -- there will be an 25 impact on the budget to some degree the following year, and 88 1 it's a -- some of these Certificates of Obligation that we 2 currently have and are looking at, we're going to be in a 3 very tight budget situation, I think, for probably the next 4 five to seven years, and it's just -- you know, I don't 5 think this is a huge impact, I don't think, but I'm 6 wondering, you know, is it wise to give credits when we're 7 having problems -- even having vague discussions of raising 8 taxes. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which I understand 10 that. But, if we're -- if we are of a mind to encourage 11 water conservation, then I think we have to step up to the 12 plate and do it, one way or the other. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I share that 14 sentiment. I'm just -- there are two sides of it. I just 15 haven't decided which side I'm coming down on yet. But -- 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Definitely. My question 17 about the qualifications are that we don't want to 18 over-engineer this so that the people who are out there 19 doing it themselves don't have the ability to access the 20 credit. I mean, someone who goes to the trouble to put in a 21 2,500-gallon concrete tank and just run the gutters from the 22 drainpipes down into the tank, if they have the appropriate 23 algae suppression and insect controls, do they have to put 24 PVC pipe between the gutter and the -- and the tank? 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: My question -- because 89 1 you can run that to its logical conclusion; you can -- you 2 could spec it right out of the possibility of wanting to do 3 it. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Rather than detail the 5 components, I think you'd have to have a -- perhaps a 6 tighter definition of what the result is. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. And I agree, 8 'cause I think the -- I mean, I certainly don't want to be 9 in a position where we're making a career or a job for 10 someone, and the only way they can get the system is to hire 11 someone to -- you know, to develop a little business in the 12 county, which I'm not opposed to developing a business, but 13 I don't think we should be basically subsidizing it 14 indirectly. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I think there 16 are some things we have to guard against, in terms of 17 design. There are those, I'm sure, out there who would dig 18 a 4-foot hole at the end of a downspout and line it with a 19 piece of black plastic and tell you that's a water cachement 20 system. And probably, under the nuisance definition, that 21 would apply, but it certainly wouldn't qualify for any kind 22 of a tax credit consideration. So, I know we have to be 23 careful about that, and any safeguards that need to be built 24 in to be sure that we're not doing that. And then the other 25 issue, there are some out there that already exist. And, to 90 1 what extent is there a grandfathering? Should there be a 2 grandfathering? To what extent would we want to consider 3 that? So, that -- that's one aspect. I got it in front of 4 you again because I thought it deserved a second look. 5 We've retooled it considerably; we've gone away from where 6 we were before to where it is now, and if it needs some more 7 fine-tuning, we can certainly do that, too. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it certainly -- 9 it's -- you know, it's going in the right direction from 10 the -- 11 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Great improvement over 12 the -- and I think once we get a legal reading on it and 13 maybe flesh out some of the ideas, I think we're -- I think 14 it's looking pretty good. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I really -- I 16 like the fact that the Court is looking at water 17 conservation as an issue, something that we're promoting, 18 'cause I think water conservation is good in all scenarios. 19 I mean, either in a drought, not in a drought, whether 20 you're in Kerr County or east Texas, I think there's no 21 reason not to conserve water. So, I like that part of it. 22 I'm just trying to think of the long-term ramifications of a 23 program like this. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I think -- I 25 agree with almost everything that's been said here, and of 91 1 course, Letz -- once again, if I let him talk first, he 2 steals my only thunder. But, you know, I -- I agree with 3 everything that's been said, but I just -- I personally -- I 4 think that we're going at it a little bit backwards. I 5 think that -- I think that we need to establish those areas 6 that we might consider giving a tax break on, like cedar 7 eradication, ponds and rainwater harvesting and those kind 8 of things, and put together that list, those things that we 9 would consider for abatement, and go from -- go from that 10 way. 'Cause I -- I really and truly think that we're going 11 to get in a storm if we adopt this program and we're going 12 to give this much abatement. And then the cedar eradication 13 program kind of -- that's what you were referring to a while 14 ago, Jon. I mean, I don't see how you're going to be able 15 to do that; I just really don't. But, I personally -- I 16 think that if we can come up with a list of those things 17 that we would consider and go from that direction, make the 18 list, and then those things that we can address. I find it 19 -- I find it humorous; I was digging through the minutes 20 that they provided from -- she provided from last Tuesday, 21 and we had this long discussion in here about the 22 possibility of raising taxes, and six days later we're 23 talking about giving it away. And -- and I -- I know that's 24 funny. But, again, it was very -- very serious, too. We 25 got to be careful of what we're doing here. And I know 92 1 you're not talking about a great deal of money, and there's 2 not a great deal of people out there doing that. But, 3 again, the drops fill up the bucket. How many providers for 4 those kind of systems are in this county? 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I know for 6 certain there's one, but there are several in other areas 7 like San Antonio; there's several -- there's some going up 8 toward Austin, Dripping Springs, and there's one I know 9 particularly in Kerrville. And, you know -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Could you tell me who 11 that is? 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Golden Eagle. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Golden Eagle? 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm, Landscape. 15 Okay, we'll retool it again. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: All right, very good. Next 17 item is Item Number 12, consider and discuss ratifying a 18 request for contested case hearing in the San Marcos River 19 Foundation application for Guadalupe River water rights. I 20 asked Mr. Brown to be here today to brief us a little more 21 fully on this issue. Because of the time constraints, I 22 went ahead and sent a letter on behalf of the County 23 requesting the contested hearing. So, Jim, if you would 24 step up and give us the impact of this request by San Marcos 25 River Foundation? 93 1 MR. BROWN: For the record, my name is Jim 2 Brown; I'm General Manager of the Upper Guadalupe River 3 Authority. Just -- if I might take just a -- just a tiny 4 bit of personal privilege up front, Commissioner Baldwin, 5 you were talking about going up to Killeen and playing 6 football this weekend. I tell a story on Tommy Tomlinson's 7 Fighting Hamilton Bulldogs. In 1963, the Fighting Hornets, 8 of which I was somewhat a part of, was way out front in the 9 district, and the guys over at Killeen -- and Lampasas was 10 behind us. Killeen was number three, and Hamilton was on 11 the bottom that year. But, Killeen decided that they were 12 going to come after Lampasas, and reported that one of 13 their -- their quarterback, I believe, performed in a rodeo 14 that summer, and which he got paid an entry fee and got a 15 little money out of it. And our running back, our main 16 back, was in that same rodeo, and we thought we were going 17 to get by without getting caught, and then Lampasas then 18 turned on Gatesville, and we got kicked out. And then 19 Hamilton Bulldogs found that one of the Killeen linemen had 20 played in a tennis match that summer, which he had been paid 21 a fee and received a cash award, so Hamilton Bulldogs ended 22 up winning the district in 1963, and only won one ball game 23 in the entire year. 24 (Laughter.) 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's our Auditor. 94 1 MR. BROWN: But I have to confess, when I was 2 a senior in high school, Tommy was in the -- in the 8th 3 grade. A little difference there. But -- 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Those were the 5 Fighting Gatesville Hornets. 6 MR. BROWN: The Fighting Hornets, as you well 7 know. The -- the Waco News Tribune was about the only 8 newspaper that ever covered anything. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Whoever covered it 10 was always late getting the story, too. 11 MR. BROWN: Well, we only had one phone line 12 between Gatesville and Waco. On the serious side of why I'm 13 in here tonight -- I don't know how much background, Judge, 14 you want me to go into on this. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: I think I provided each of 16 the Commissioners with a copy of the letter you provided 17 with the agenda backup. I think it would be useful to have 18 a quick overview for the benefit of the public, in 19 particular. 20 MR. BROWN: Okay. Well, let me break this 21 down, I think, into three parts. First we'll talk about the 22 history of this whole process. The San Marcos River 23 Foundation, which is a not-for-profit environmental group 24 located in/around San Marcos area, has applied for a permit 25 for 1.3 billion acre feet of water a year to maintain a 95 1 stream flow in the Guadalupe River near Gonzales, and again 2 down near Tivoli, in order to meet some -- some previous 3 ecosystem requirements. The 1.3 billion is based on a 4 60-year average monthly flow in the Guadalupe River in these 5 particular areas. Well, Lord knows, in the last 60 years, 6 there's been a lot of things changed on -- on the Guadalupe 7 and the San Marcos River. So, that -- that is an issue 8 that -- that I think most of us are concerned about. And 9 we're talking about -- we're talking about a flow through 10 the run of the river permit of 380 billion gallons of water 11 annually, just to maintain that -- that old, historic 12 60-year-old stream flow. 13 S.M.R.F. has indicated that if they're 14 granted this permit, that they will share with the Texas 15 Parks and Wildlife a 50 percent interest in -- a 50 percent 16 undivided interest in that permit, which -- which allows 17 then for Parks and Wildlife and -- and S.M.R.F. to have 18 their hands on some additional water in the basin other 19 than -- than the water that -- that Parks and Wildlife would 20 commit, then, to the water bank. The water bank is -- is an 21 organization created by the Legislature in 1977 -- I mean 22 '97, I'm sorry, where -- where water rights can be held by 23 the Texas Water Development Board for future use. But, 24 within the Texas Water Bank, there's an organization called 25 the Texas Water Trust, and the Texas Water Trust is that 96 1 entity in the state of Texas where, if water is transferred 2 into that trust, it's pretty well there in perpetuity. We 3 would assume, although S.M.R.F. has not indicated this, 4 that -- that the 50 percent undivided interest in this 5 permit that's going into the water bank -- or would go into 6 Parks and Wildlife, will probably end up in the water bank. 7 The -- what this really does to -- to those 8 of us up in Kerr County and the Hill Country -- even the 9 president of the S.M.R.F. stated in a news release two weeks 10 ago that the Guadalupe River is overadjudicated. In other 11 words, there is more permits allocated for the waters in the 12 river than we actually have water in the river to satisfy 13 those permits. But, having said that, she goes on to say 14 that -- that it's S.M.R.F.'s intent to seal as much of that 15 water up as they can. What this -- what this does -- if 16 this permit is issued, it has a seniority date of June 2000. 17 That means that any future water permit granted in Kerr 18 County -- you have a reservation in for 5,000 acre feet of 19 water with -- with G.B.R.A. We have -- we have a permit 20 with G.B.R.A. which has an older date that would be senior 21 to this. But, we're also -- U.G.R.A.'s looking at two 22 additional allocations from G.B.R.A., at 2,000 acre feet 23 each, to meet our future growth needs in Kerr County. Those 24 permits will obviously not be issued until somewhere 25 around -- probably around 2015 or 2018, at least the first. 97 1 So, that means that the S.M.R.F. permit then would have 2 priority over our permit. 3 Now, if the flow of the river is such that 4 they can't maintain the 350 billion gallons of water 5 annually -- and, by the way, this is -- there's a real 6 complicated formula that says during certain months, the 7 releases must be X, and at other months it must be Y. But, 8 what happens is that -- that if there is a condition in the 9 river where canyon must be -- must release water in order 10 to -- to make up the delta in that permit, then -- then, 11 obviously, that permit would take seniority over -- over the 12 future permits for Kerrville and Kerr County and U.G.R.A. 13 But, that's a real concern for -- for U.G.R.A., as we plan 14 to develop our water systems on out in the public. It also 15 not only affects Kerr County, U.G.R.A., and the City of 16 Kerrville, but also affects the City of Blanco, the City of 17 Boerne, Fair Oaks, and other Hill Country communities who 18 have some reservation for water out of the Guadalupe Basin. 19 Those permits have yet to be issued, and they certainly 20 would be -- they certainly would be junior to the S.M.R.F. 21 permit. 22 At this point, it appears that there will be 23 several groups who will call for a contested hearing on this 24 permit. The reason for the contested hearing is that the 25 permittee, or the applicant, at that point then must put on 98 1 expert testimony to show and to satisfy that there is an 2 adequate supply in the river to meet their permit and any 3 other future permit that -- that might be issued. Part of 4 that argument is, well, the latter permits are for -- are 5 for human needs; the S.M.R.F. permit obviously is for the 6 flora and fauna needs of the Guadalupe basin. There are no 7 rules today that would establish which one of those permits 8 would receive any sort of priority consideration, other than 9 the fact the date of the permit. U.G.R.A. believes that -- 10 along with, I think, every other river authority in the 11 state of Texas, that S.M.R.F. is establishing a dangerous 12 precedent which could affect every river authority and its 13 available water in the state of Texas. So, I think the 14 river authorities, although they do not have -- I'm not sure 15 they could show that they have a stakeholder interest in 16 this fight, as with those of us who are -- are within the 17 Guadalupe Basin, they are at least interested in -- in 18 funding, I believe, a -- an all-out court press on the -- 19 the application during the -- during the contested hearing. 20 To give you some idea of where S.M.R.F. is on 21 this, they have filed the permit; apparently borrowed 22 $25,000 from someone to pay the permit fee, because now 23 S.M.R.F. is out on the streets trying to raise 25 grand to 24 replace the -- the money that they used to apply for the 25 permit. Now, contested hearings -- you know, I'll put this 99 1 in some perspective so that the local folks here can 2 understand this. Contested hearings can be extremely 3 expensive, or -- or if the request for evidence is not so 4 great, they -- they probably look maybe at $50,000 or maybe 5 $100,000. But, U.G.R.A.'s share of the court costs for the 6 contested hearing on the -- on the U.G.R.A. ASR well in 7 Kerrville was $895,000, just in legal fees, and T.N.R.C.C. 8 obviously had other legal fees that were involved in that 9 issue. 10 So, since I sent the letter to the Judge and 11 to the Court, to give you a brief update, the Texas Water 12 Conservation Association has indicated that they will -- 13 they will try to seek status -- party status in the hearing. 14 The City of Kerrville, I understand, last week joined the -- 15 the Texas Water Conservation Association. The City of 16 Victoria has joined. There are going to be some other folks 17 who will line up behind the Texas Water Conservation 18 Association. The big -- all of the river authorities in the 19 state of Texas and the groundwater districts and irrigation 20 districts and other water districts, all are members of the 21 Texas Water Conservation Association, so it looks like that 22 the T.W.C.A. will be the -- the driving force to pull 23 together the funds that will be required to contest this 24 hearing. I would encourage Kerr County to join U.G.R.A. and 25 the City of Kerrville in making it known that -- that you 100 1 have serious doubts about this permit and what this permit 2 does. 3 The other issue that I want to touch on real 4 quickly is that -- that T.N.R.C.C. has already approved the 5 form of this permit, and without this -- without this 6 contested hearing, under the T.N.R.C.C. rules, the Executive 7 Director could, in the morning, sign this permit. So, the 8 thing that -- I think that concerns some of us, and we 9 discussed it in the Region J meeting the other day, is 10 that -- is that T.N.R.C.C. has not looked at Region J or 11 Region L's plans. And, both of our plans depend on future 12 water out of the Guadalupe River to meet the water balancing 13 that's required out of Senate Bill 1. So, there's a lot of 14 issues out there. 15 There's one other issue I want to share with 16 you that I forgot when I wrote the letter. Last year, 17 during the debate on Senate Bill 2, there was an effort to 18 put in in-stream use permits in -- in all the rivers in the 19 state of Texas, and both the House and the Senate Natural 20 Resources Committees took that out of Senate Bill 2, with 21 the agreement with the environmentalists that they would 22 hold -- in the interim between the two biannual sessions, 23 that they would hold public hearings and gather information 24 as to the benefit or lack of benefit from in-stream permits. 25 So, there's some political issues out there that -- that I 101 1 think that will occur. I think that the first thing we have 2 to do now is we have to slow this permit down in order for 3 all of us to take a look at it, and for all of us to -- 4 to -- those of us who can get standing to testify on behalf 5 of our communities and what this permit could do to our 6 water availability. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Couple questions, Jim. 8 MR. BROWN: Yes, sir. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did the Blancos and 10 Boernes join in the protest? 11 MR. BROWN: I don't know that they have or 12 not. I know that -- I know that Blanco and -- Blanco, Fair 13 Oaks Ranch, and Bulverde are all -- were seeking to get into 14 this process. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. I'm sure that 16 they have. Is S.M.R.F.'s -- their primary issue is the 17 flora and the fauna protection? 18 MR. BROWN: Yes, sir. This is all based on a 19 report that the Texas Parks and Wildlife folks did about 20 three, four years ago about what they would like to see 21 occur in the -- in the estuaries down at the end of the 22 river, and these folks have picked that up, and I think that 23 they are carrying the banner, if you will. Parks and 24 Wildlife can't get out front on a deal like this. So, I 25 think most of us -- a little paranoia may be involved, but I 102 1 think most of us assume that what S.M.R.F. has done is 2 picked up the banner for Parks and Wildlife. And, the other 3 issue -- the other issue that we'll touch on very briefly, 4 and then I'll sit down, is that during the time when there's 5 extra water in the river, there's run of the river, and 6 these guys have sewed up the entire appropriations of the 7 river. That means that S.M.R.F. and Parks and Wildlife will 8 get in the business of selling water out of the river, yet 9 we wouldn't be eligible to take any of it. And -- and the 10 law is not clear as to what they could do with that water if 11 they had additional waters in the river over and above the 12 normal flows. And, so, I think several of us are concerned 13 that we've got some people who would be totally unregulated 14 by the two water entities in the state of Texas, would be 15 out in the water market business and be -- you know, it's 16 that kind of a situation. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Jim, who makes the 18 decision on granting status of the various towns or agencies 19 who are requesting standing in this proceeding? Who makes 20 that decision? 21 MR. BROWN: That's the -- the office of the 22 Administrative Judge -- someone help me with that title. 23 State Office -- 24 MR. LUCAS: State Office of Administrative 25 Hearings. 103 1 MR. BROWN: State Office of Administrative 2 Hearings, S.O.L.A. 3 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: In the normal flow of 4 things, how -- if a hearing is granted, a contested hearing, 5 about when would you think that might happen? Could happen? 6 MR. BROWN: I think -- I think the first step 7 would be for the Administrative Judge to decide who has 8 standing. And, I -- I think he's going to have to go 9 through all those hearings. Then, I think after he 10 determines that, then at that point they will then honor the 11 petitions or the requests for the hearings. I would say 12 we're looking at something -- probably late fall before we 13 actually -- before the Administrative Law Judge weeds 14 through all of the applications. I'm sure everybody that's 15 in the water business in the state of Texas went ahead with 16 this. This obviously is -- as I stated in my letter to you, 17 this -- this forces governmental entities to start looking 18 at groundwater resources again, as opposed to river surface 19 water resources, if they're not available. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have no comment. I 21 deal enough with this. I've talked to Jim about it. 22 MR. BROWN: Well, I -- I burned out about 30 23 minutes of our Region J meeting the other day ranting and 24 raving about all this, but -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: When I go to Austin, I'll 104 1 hear about it again. So -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I'm opposed to 3 anybody that thinks flowers and weeds are more important 4 than human beings, I can tell you that real quick. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: What I'm seeking here tonight 6 with this agenda item is for the Court to ratify -- approve 7 the letter which I sent. And I sent the letter at 8 Mr. Brown's request, one, because I think it's important 9 that there be more time to study this issue, and second, 10 because the time deadline for a reply was Monday -- last 11 Monday. So -- 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I'll make a motion 13 that we ratify the -- the sending of the letter by the 14 Judge. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 17 Griffin, second by Commissioner Williams, that the Court 18 ratify and approve the letter sent by the County Judge to 19 the T.N.R.C.C. requesting the contested rate hearing on the 20 San Marcos River Foundation application. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Rate hearing? 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Contested hearing. Contested 23 hearing. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My only comment is that 25 there's a -- it's scary because there's so many things like 105 1 that that are going on in Austin right now. There's this -- 2 I mean, it's just mind-boggling what's going on. It's hard 3 to keep track of it all. I appreciate Jim and U.G.R.A., and 4 Cameron also -- he isn't involved in this one, but I get 5 e-mails from Jim and Cameron on a pretty regular basis about 6 things that -- 7 MR. BROWN: If I might, real quickly, had it 8 not been for Commissioner Letz and his position as Chairman 9 of Region J -- T.W.D.B. was up there setting up the 10 stakeholders committees -- stakeholders group to look at 11 those -- the water in the state of Texas, and no one in 12 Region J was even a part of that. And, I understand there 13 were other regions that were totally overlooked. And these 14 guys are supposed to be sitting up there deciding what to do 15 with the future state water plan, and they left a lot of us 16 out. I think we're -- we're their planning groups; they 17 didn't even invite us to the party. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That was handled. 19 MR. BROWN: I understand, sir. I take my hat 20 off to you. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any other questions or 22 comments on the motion? If not, all in favor, raise your 23 right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 106 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: The last item for 3 consideration, Item Number 13, as amended, consider and 4 discuss an order authorizing County Judge and the County 5 staff and professional advisers to proceed with and take all 6 actions deemed necessary to issue public property financial 7 contractual obligations for the purpose of financing the new 8 radio communications system. Tom Spurgeon from the firm of 9 McCall, Parkhurst, and Horton is here to give us a real 10 quick rundown on what this is and why we need it. Tom? 11 MR. SPURGEON: Judge, this will be quick. A 12 couple weeks ago, Bob was here -- we were both here, and 13 talking about really a couple different ways that you could 14 finance the radio system, and we pretty much had settled on 15 looking at doing a Certificate of Obligation issue. There's 16 a real difficulty in using C.O.'s for counties -- well, 17 really, for either cities or counties. But, in order to 18 issue a C.O. that is solely for cash, you may have to have a 19 revenue pledge that we can pledge to that, even though we're 20 going to actually secure this with taxes. As a practical 21 matter, counties have very limited amounts of revenue 22 sources that you're able to pledge for debt. You do have a 23 couple sources that -- that you do collect taxes for or 24 collect revenues for, but they're not pledgeable for this 25 purpose, because this is a -- a system that is strictly 107 1 personal property. 2 There is a -- there's another financing 3 vehicle called public property finance contractual 4 obligations. In fact, it's essentially just like a 5 Certificate of Obligation. It's an ad valorem tax pledge 6 transaction that will trade the same way that a general 7 obligation bond would for the County. You're not losing 8 anything in terms of your security behind the transaction, 9 et cetera. It's just simply a different financing vehicle 10 that we are recommending that you look to at this point. 11 So, instead of doing Certificates of Obligation, we're 12 recommending that you all would be considering an issue of 13 what's called public property financing contractual 14 obligations. We would -- the order tonight would just be 15 authorizing, essentially, the County staff and Bob's firm 16 and my firm to bring forward all the other documentation, 17 put together the official statement, et cetera, to bring 18 forward to you on the 24th of September the actual sale of 19 the C.O.'s themselves, or the contractual obligations, and 20 that's really what the nature of all this is about. We 21 don't quite know a -- a firm amount that you're looking for 22 on the radio system. I think there have been some numbers 23 that have been bounced about a little bit, but we will need 24 to know that at some point, or very quickly, in order to 25 kind of finalize some of the documents that will go out in 108 1 the public market. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Aren't we going to 3 need the number so we know what the payback is? It affects 4 the upcoming budget. 5 MR. SPURGEON: Yes. All those -- exactly. 6 And Bob, I know, talked about those things in general a 7 couple weeks ago on what that impact would be a little bit, 8 but we still do need to know the type of system you're on, 9 how much money you want to borrow to buy that system, et 10 cetera. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tom, if we approve 12 this tonight -- and I understood you to say September 24th 13 you will be back in here. For what? To do what? 14 MR. SPURGEON: Actually, the sale of the 15 contractual obligations. I mean, we would bring to you a 16 recommendation, final interest rates, final terms of the 17 C.O.'s. We use that same term just for -- but that's a 18 different animal. So, it will be final action in which the 19 Court then would be approving the sale of the -- of the 20 contractual obligations to -- I believe Bob is recommending 21 the First Southwest Company be the underwriter of the bonds, 22 but they would sell the bonds or the -- the contractual 23 obligations, and then you would receive your proceeds about 24 the middle part of October to be able to use to finance and 25 purchase the system. 109 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, you're expecting 2 us, on September 24th, to actually vote for approval of 3 those bonds? 4 MR. SPURGEON: Yes, sir. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: At what point are we 6 going to know what we're voting on? I mean, how much money 7 are we talking about? Is this going to be a secret up until 8 September 24th? 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Sheriff, do you want to -- 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'll address that as -- 11 what I can. We have -- what the Court approved last week 12 was to go ahead and start the negotiations for the best and 13 final offer from Dailey Wells. Our first meeting on that 14 will be Wednesday morning. In talking about some of the -- 15 each of those bidders had some discrepancies -- or not 16 discrepancies. Deficiencies. And those negotiations start 17 first thing Wednesday morning. Travis is planning on being 18 present, along with the County Attorney and myself, so if it 19 goes on farther, that we can correct -- we can answer all 20 those and get into the actual contract negotiations that 21 Travis will be part of on the amounts and everything. 22 That's when we're going to have it. The other thing -- and, 23 hopefully -- Trott has told us, and Daily Wells is aware of 24 it, that we want to -- we are trying to get to a price 25 lockdown on everything that Trott's going to do to see if it 110 1 actually does end up being the best and final, or if we need 2 to go to one of the other vendors, you know, as the Court 3 had approved. But, definitely before -- originally, it was 4 even by almost the 1st of September, and I think that may be 5 pushed back just a little bit, but by -- for sure, I think 6 we had a date of the 17th of September for the final thing 7 to be all in place, as far as knowing what the cost was 8 going to be, to where it can come back to the Court. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sheriff -- 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: It has to be before that. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I think that's the date 12 you had given them originally. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: 13th. 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't remember, but it 15 was plenty of time to have everything figured in. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: I think it was the 13th. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sheriff, just playing 18 devil's advocate here for a second, what if, through 19 negotiations, you are unable to correct the deficiencies in 20 the bid that you're -- with the company that you're working 21 with in the direct negotiations now? And -- and/or the 22 correction of those deficiencies raises the bid price to 23 such an extent that we're not certain that's the way we want 24 to go, and we have to entertain these same negotiations with 25 Bidder Number 2 or Bidder Number 3 or Bidder Number A, B, 111 1 and C, however you want to categorize them? I guess the 2 thrust of my question is, how are we going to get that done 3 by September 24th so we've nailed down a price, we nail down 4 the interest rate, we nail down what we know to be the 5 payback for the ensuing budget, and so we can act with some 6 modicum of intelligence? 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The way we're getting 8 that done is by setting those meetings, with the first one 9 being Wednesday morning, with the County Attorney's office 10 being directly involved, and with a commitment from all 11 sides to get the best that we can do before then. If those 12 -- and with Trott being the consultants for the County, and 13 being hired, if they feel that that does not fit within, you 14 know, the guidelines of what the County had put out with the 15 RFP, with everything else, unfortunately, at that point, 16 okay -- and this is a serious risk because of the public 17 safety factor of it, you know -- I would have to come back 18 to this Court myself and say we need to wait, and the whole 19 thing gets put off another year. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My -- 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Which I wouldn't want to 22 do. Now, the other thing -- one thing that I would like to 23 also bring up, I have -- and I know that Tommy had planned, 24 in this next budget, some funds that we thought were going 25 to be needed for -- the maintenance and lease fees for the 112 1 first year. But one thing I'm wondering, before we take 2 those out, since we've -- we talked, and in talking with 3 Trott today, even figured out that's not needed until the 4 second year, is I have got the chief deputy searching right 5 now -- and I can't get those finalized until we also have a 6 final price on this -- is for grants to also help pay for 7 the system. Now, whatever these obligation-type deals are, 8 I hope that if we can apply for a grant, you know, we can 9 put that to the paying back, if we receive those grants, of 10 this total cost. The other thing in that, with the funds, 11 before it gets totally cut out of the deal, any of these 12 type of grants that we have found so far have a matching 13 amount. So, I don't know -- you know, you've got to have 14 money to apply for money, just about the way it is. But no, 15 we definitely intend on having this thing done. It's just 16 way too -- too important. This Court, even before I became 17 Sheriff, started working on this project three years ago. 18 And -- and, you know, I can show y'all some -- some video 19 tapes of officers in situations where it's a miracle this 20 County hasn't had an officer killed because of it. And, it 21 is the type of situation where I think us, I think Trott, I 22 think the County Attorney's office, are going to do 23 everything we can do to get the best system that we can 24 possibly get at the best price we can get it, and meet all 25 the Court's deadlines that need to be met for this budget 113 1 season. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't -- I don't see -- 3 if we don't have the final answer to -- the 24th, I don't 4 see how we can meet those deadlines. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: We can't by the 24th, but the 6 24th is the deadline that we have to authorize the sale of 7 the obligation. We've got to have the final number by -- I 8 think it was the 13th, somewhere in the neighborhood of the 9 13th of September, in order to meet the time frame -- 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: For the budget. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- to have the budget 12 hearings, pass the tax rate, and approve the budget. And I 13 went over that in great detail with the Trott people, and I 14 am told that the Trott people have gone over that with Daily 15 Wells, and Daily Wells people have said no problem, we can 16 do that. We -- you know, we're in this time crunch; we 17 don't have any choice. You know, we -- and it's kind of an 18 interesting dilemma. We extended the time for the bids by 19 two months, which we knew at the time when we talked about 20 it, it was going to put us in a real budget time crunch. 21 But, in that two -- in that two-month period, Daily Wells 22 came in. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: So, had we not extended 25 the -- time frame, we would not be in a position to 114 1 negotiate with the preferred vendor, according to the three 2 bids that were -- that were received. So, it's kind of a 3 catch-22. So, now that we've done this exercise, we have 4 ourselves in a period where we are really scrambling to make 5 up for lost time, and pushing as hard as we can on all 6 fronts in order to get the information we need in order to 7 go forward. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And, according to Daily 9 Wells' representatives, who were here in court last week -- 10 I think all three of the vendors had representatives here -- 11 after they walked out of the courtroom, Trott had told them 12 we really -- and that the Judge really wanted this done, and 13 we needed some final deals; get the deficiencies taken care 14 of, get a final price, get the contract pretty well where 15 the County Attorney can look at and County Judge can talk 16 about by the 1st of September. So, once this meeting starts 17 Wednesday morning, okay -- although we've got Commissioners 18 Court Wednesday afternoon, which I'll be back for and the 19 County Attorney himself, but Travis is staying up there to 20 work on that part of it. Now, it may go on through 21 Wednesday, Thursday, and Friday; I don't know. But, Daily 22 Wells and Trott and us have all agreed that this thing has 23 to be done immediately, but we have to have everybody's 24 attorneys involved to get the best that we can get. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, my only concern 115 1 or hesitancy right now is our language on the agenda, and 2 I'm sure that you're going to be able to explain it to me so 3 that I'll feel better about it, but it says to authorize the 4 Judge, staff, and professional advisers to proceed with and 5 take all action deemed necessary to issue those obligations 6 for the purpose -- and it just -- I don't know. Maybe I 7 just have a -- 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, the -- you make a good 9 point, Commissioner. And what's really missing in this is 10 the last step, which is we have to raise our hands and say 11 yes. 12 MR. SPURGEON: Yes. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: We issue it. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand that. 15 That's the reason I asked the question. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's what it says, and the 17 resolution actually says take all actions necessary to plan, 18 develop, and implement a program to issue a series -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That sounds a lot 20 better. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Does not give anyone the 22 authority to actually issue them until we come back before 23 the Court for final approval. Is that right, Tom? 24 MR. SPURGEON: That's absolutely right, yes. 25 Comes back to you for final approval, certainly. 116 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: But in order to keep 2 ourselves in the game, we have to do this tonight. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I had the same concern. 4 That's the reason I read it again, until I found the "to 5 implement," that last paragraph. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: On Page 2 of the 7 document, Judge, where it talks about that we passed and 8 approved by the Court, this date, in regular meeting, should 9 that not be "special meeting"? 10 MR. SPURGEON: It should be, right. That was 11 my error, that we'll change that to -- I guess, Judge, 12 I'm -- I've been hearing you refer to this as a special 13 regular meeting tonight. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: It's a regular special 15 meeting. 16 MR. SPURGEON: Regular special meeting. One 17 of those two ways I'm hearing that, so it's a -- and I 18 understand the distinction. I mean, this is a regular 19 meeting of your -- 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: This -- it's a special 21 meeting. The regular meeting is the first one. 22 MR. SPURGEON: But you regularly meet. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Yeah, we meet regularly, but 24 it's a special meeting. 25 MR. SPURGEON: And part of the distinction 117 1 that's important for that is that, as you well know, 2 counties cannot levy a tax except at a regular meeting. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's right. 4 MR. SPURGEON: But there is an exception that 5 you are allowed to levy a tax, and you will be, quote, 6 levying a tax on the 24th in terms of obligating the County 7 to be levying a tax for these contractual obligations, but 8 you will be doing that at a meeting that is regularly 9 scheduled. And, there's a provision in the law that says so 10 long as you regularly meet, you're allowed to -- on a 11 particular day of the month, and you do apparently meet the 12 second and fourth Mondays, and you're allowed to do anything 13 at that meeting that you can do at a regular meeting. So, 14 there's a -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You two lawyers take 16 it outside. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I wasn't confused 18 before; I'm confused now. 19 MR. SPURGEON: I'm sorry, didn't mean to do 20 that. 21 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Okay. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Go for it. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You need a motion? 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: We need a motion to adopt the 25 order. 118 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So moved. No, we -- 2 I'll make a motion that we -- let me see that. What's the 3 other one? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He's got that one. 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I'll make a motion 6 that we -- that we authorize the County Judge and County 7 staff and professional advisers to proceed with all actions 8 required to issue public property finance contractual 9 obligations to finance the new radio communications system. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 12 Griffin, second by Commissioner Williams, that the Court 13 authorize the aforesaid order. Any further questions or 14 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. At long 19 last, we are adjourned. I'll remind every one of our 20 meeting at 1:30 Wednesday afternoon. 21 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 9:04 p.m.) 22 - - - - - - - - - - 23 24 25 119 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 31st day of August, 8 2001. 9 10 11 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 12 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 13 Certified Shorthand Reporter 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25