1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Special Session 10 Monday, March 25, 2002 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: FREDERICK L. HENNEKE, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 LARRY GRIFFIN, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X March 25, 2002 2 PAGE --- Commissioners Comments 4 3 1.1 Pay Bills 14 4 1.2 Budget Amendments 15 1.3 Late Bills 19 5 1.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 22 6 2.1 Presentation by Karl Beuchler, CASI, on Easter Weekend events at Flat Rock Park 23 7 2.2 Consider financial help for rental of HCYEC for Center Point HS Class of 2003 Project Graduation 26 8 2.3 Consider changing road in Pier 5 Subdivision from public to private, set public hearing for same 34 9 2.4 Award 5-year lease of wheel loader, allow County Judge to sign contract for same, issue hand check 10 for first payment 46 2.5 Recommendation for awarding bid on 6,500 tons of 11 base material for Sheppard Rees project 48 2.6 Consider recommendations, award annual bids on 12 Road and Bridge materials 49 2.7 Authorize Sheriff's Department to enter Interlocal 13 Cooperation Contract with DPS to purchase supplies for Restricted DNA Database sample collection 52 14 2.8 Consider authorizing expenditure for new forms required by Senate Bill 7 55 15 2.14 Consider renewal of Kerr County Teen Curfew 62 2.9 Set date and time for joint workshop with UGRA 16 Board to discuss Comprehensive Colonia Infra- structure Study and Plan 66 17 2.10 Consider County appointments to Kerrville/Kerr County Joint Airport Advisory Board 71 18 2.11 Revision to Subdivision Rules & Regulations, Water Availability Requirements, and routing 19 slips; set public hearing for same 75 2.12 Consider referring Court Order 27390 to County 20 Attorney for implementation 97 2.13 Consider amending Court Order 27080 to delete 21 reference to adoption of Kerr County OSSF Program Procedures for Real Estate Transfers 98 22 2.15 Consider executing & delivering to City of Ingram a quitclaim deed covering the old Ingram Bridge 100 23 -- Adjourned 124 24 25 3 1 On Monday, March 25, 2002, at 9 o'clock a.m., a regular 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Good morning, everyone. 8 We'll call to order this regular special session of the Kerr 9 County Commissioners Court. This morning, Commissioner 10 Baldwin, I believe you have the honors. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, I do, and I have 12 a special guest to do the opening prayer for the 13 Commissioners Court, my friend Harley Belew that's coming in 14 the back door. You may recognize him as a part of the 15 famous Steve and Harley program, and that's my friend 16 Harley. Harley, if you'd come to the podium and lead us in 17 a word of prayer. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Please stand. 19 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, Harley. 21 MR. BELEW: Thank you, Buster. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: At this time, any citizen 23 wishing to address the Court on an item not listed on the 24 regular agenda may come forward and do so. Is there any 25 citizen who'd like to address the Court on an item not 4 1 listed on the regular agenda? Going once, going twice. One 2 more time, is there any citizen who would like to address 3 the Court on an item not listed on the regular agenda? 4 Seeing none, we'll go to Commissioners' comments. We'll 5 start with Commissioner Baldwin. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, Judge. As 7 some of you know, Commissioner Williams, Commissioner Letz 8 and myself went out to Abilene to the annual West Texas 9 Judges' and Commissioners' Conference last week, and we are 10 now official members of the West Texas conference. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Good work. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So -- yeah. So -- and 13 I also wanted to add to that, there's some reasoning behind 14 that, and this Court has done some good, long, hard work for 15 a number of years to make these kind of contacts and these 16 relationships around the state, and as we -- as we go around 17 the state and go to our schools, we're recognized all over 18 the state now. And -- and the reason for that is that I've 19 always known that there's going to come a time when we're 20 going to need the contacts, and -- and to have a place at 21 the table when the negotiations and things start getting 22 kind of funny with our State Legislature, and that time has 23 arrived. There's -- there's some things that are going to 24 come down that's going to cost -- cost us or the taxpayers 25 of Kerr County some pretty serious money, I think, in this 5 1 next session, so I think that Kerr County Commissioners 2 Court has positioned ourselves now that we can go to the 3 table and visit all the way to the top with the governor 4 now. So, I commend you guys for your hard work, and I thank 5 you for your support in doing that. I understand 6 Mrs. Lavender here probably spent the weekend in Dallas 7 yesterday receiving a statewide award for some of her 8 writing, and I was wondering, Rosa, could you tell us what 9 that was, please? 10 MS. LAVENDER: It was the Texas Public Health 11 Association Media Award for last year. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Congratulations, 13 that's great. One of our own. And, of course, one of my 14 constituents. 15 (Laughter.) 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's why we're 17 called number one. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Proud to be number one. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Last, but not least, 20 I'd like to wish happy birthday today to Judge Karl Prohl. 21 I think he's in that 39-and-holding pattern, has been there 22 awhile. That's all, Judge. Thank you. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: You're welcome. Commissioner 24 Williams? 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I met a guy in 6 1 Abilene who could attest that Karl Prohl is more than 39, 2 'cause he knew him back when he was about knee-high to a 3 grasshopper. But I would echo Commissioner Baldwin's 4 thoughts about the West Texas Conference, and it was very 5 good. We were, in fact, taken in; I would say welcomed with 6 open arms, and a lot of folks expressed a desire to see 7 Kerrville a little closer and a little more intimately 8 somewhere down the line. What I found interesting about the 9 West Texas, in addition to the 40-mile-an-hour winds that 10 blew something in that got my voice -- I'm not sure what it 11 was, but what I found interesting was the quality of the 12 educational components. I thought they were very good. 13 Some of the speakers that I had heard before were better 14 this time. Tommy, you would be happy to know that I heard 15 your buddy talk about GASB, and while I went to sleep the 16 first time, he kept me awake this whole time, and it was 17 really a very interesting presentation, and I thought it was 18 extremely well worthwhile. 19 I have a couple other items here, Judge, if 20 you don't mind. I'd like to express publicly condolences to 21 the family of Robert L. Mosty. Robert Mosty is an absolute 22 icon in Center Point and eastern Kerr County, and he passed 23 away after a long illness over the weekend. The viewing 24 will be tonight between the hours of 5:00 and 7 p.m. at the 25 Grimes Chapel, and funeral tomorrow -- if anybody's 7 1 interested and knew Robert and his family, the funeral will 2 be conducted at the First United Methodist Church at 1 p.m. 3 in Center Point. And, lastly, the -- the last Library Board 4 meeting I went to, I was reminded by the Library Director 5 that we still need to present to him in a memo form the 6 stops that we would like the bookmobile to make in each of 7 our precincts. Keep in mind that it doesn't have to be one 8 stop. If you think your precinct would be better served by 9 multiple stops, two or more, then tell me about that, if you 10 will, and I'll frame it all in a memo and give it to Antonio 11 Martinez. The truck is available. It's yet -- it's at the 12 City shop being outfitted with racks and so forth, whatever 13 you outfit a library truck with, but it won't be long. And 14 he's working up the job description, and so we need that 15 information back from you fellows as quickly as possible. 16 That's all I have, Judge. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: All right, thank you. 18 Commissioner Letz? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I just have two comments 20 this morning. First, I'd like to echo what Commissioner 21 Baldwin and Williams said about the West Texas meeting. It 22 was excellent. And I'd like to really thank Buster, single 23 him out, because he was the driving force to get us to move 24 out there. He brought it up to us after he served as 25 President of the South Texas region. It is a much better 8 1 fit. I think we will -- we learned -- I think I we learned 2 a lot more, much better contacts, and I think it's an 3 association that we should be in, and I'm very happy to be 4 out there. My other comment is, it's spring, which means 5 baseball season, and just to announce to everybody, Little 6 League will be starting next Monday, a week from today, and 7 that means traffic on Highway 27 will become very dangerous 8 for the next two months around the Ag Barn area. Lots of 9 traffic in and out. We do what we can with parking, but 10 just everybody -- everyone needs to be careful. Lots of 11 kids out there, and the kids don't always think like they 12 should. That's it. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you. Commissioner 14 Griffin? 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yes, Judge. While I 16 distribute these letters -- or copies of the letter, I would 17 like to read into the record the text of it, to District 18 Attorney Curry, in which I say, "Dear Mr. Curry: During the 19 recently completed primary election political campaign, one 20 of the candidates, David Nicholson, repeatedly alleged that 21 Kerr County road funds have been spent by the Commissioners 22 Court for political purposes. These allegations were made 23 both in print and verbally in at least three public 24 meetings. These are grave allegations, and if true, would 25 constitute indictable felony offenses by the five members of 9 1 the Court, County Engineer, and the Road Administrator. I 2 respectfully request that you open a formal investigation 3 into the Mr. Nicholson's allegations to determine if any 4 criminal activity has taken place in the administration and 5 operation of the County's road program. I would hope that 6 Mr. Nicholson would be invited or summoned to present to you 7 and the Grand Jury whatever evidence he has to support his 8 allegations. Likewise, of course, County officials listed 9 above should have the opportunity to answer those 10 allegations. I stand ready to provide any additional 11 information you may request of me, and to testify to the 12 Grand Jury at any time on this matter. Sincerely." That's 13 all. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay, thank you. Baseball 15 isn't the only spring sport, as we well know. How about a 16 track report, Commissioner Baldwin? I mean, congratulations 17 to your son for two first-place finishes at Fredericksburg. 18 How'd he do at Boerne this past week? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: He won two 20 third-places. He won a third in the 110-meter hurdles, and 21 a third in the 300-meter hurdles, and the two -- both people 22 that beat him in both races were from 5A schools in San 23 Antonio, so he is -- he's doing really, really well. He's 24 doing really well, and we have another whole year. Man, I 25 can't wait. I'm making reservations in Austin. 10 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Outstanding. That's a good 2 report. At our next Commissioners Court meeting April 8th, 3 I will not be present, so this be the first one I will miss 4 in over a year. As part of the Sex Offender Management 5 Grant which the County got as sponsoring agency for this 6 county, Bandera, Kendall, and Gillespie, there is a 7 mandatory training session in Washington, D.C., which, in 8 their infinite wisdom, the Department of Justice has 9 scheduled for the 8th and 9th of April, so I will be in 10 Washington. So, those of you who remain behind will have to 11 choose among yourselves to lead you through the perils of 12 the agenda on that date, and I'll leave that up to your 13 infinite wisdom. I'm not about to step into that briar 14 patch. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, I thought we were 16 taking turns. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's what we said. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think Commissioner 19 Letz was the last one. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's Commissioner 21 Griffin's turn. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge Griffin. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Judge Griffin. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: God, that has a ring 25 to it. 11 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: May be prophetic. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Also, I'd like to offer my 4 congratulations to Mr. Tinley and Mr. Nicholson, and of 5 course our colleague, Commissioner Williams, on their 6 victories in the March 12th Republican primary. Service on 7 this Commissioners Court is truly public service. 8 Commissioner Baldwin has -- has often said, and I totally 9 agree with him, that County government is the government 10 closest to the people. We're not insulated by staff. We're 11 not insulated by bureaucracy. We deal directly with our 12 constituents on matters that have impact upon their lives 13 and upon their futures. To the new members of the Court, I 14 pray that God will grant them the wisdom to know what is 15 right and the strength to do what is right for all the 16 people in Kerr County; not just those who voted in the 17 campaign, not just those who made contributions out of their 18 time or of their treasures. 19 I'm very proud of what this Commissioners 20 Court has accomplished in three and a half years. I'm proud 21 of the improvements in the water situation in Kerr County 22 which this Court has enacted; the water savings account with 23 G.B.R.A., the water availability rules, the lot sizes, the 24 leadership Commissioner Letz has expressed through the 25 Region J planning group. I'm proud of the additional 12 1 resources we've provided to the Sheriff's Department, 2 putting new cars on the road instead of old cars that were 3 more of a danger to the driver than they were to the bad 4 guys; providing additional officers and providing training 5 and equipment for those officers so they can go out and do 6 the job that we ask them to do. 7 I'm proud of the fact that we took the 8 necessary steps and made the decisions to bring the salaries 9 for the employees up to comparable levels and proper levels, 10 because we don't provide the services from this court. The 11 employees do. And unless you have a well-qualified, 12 well-trained and motivated work force in the county, you 13 don't have the excellence of services that this county 14 enjoys. And if you don't believe that this county has 15 excellent services, go to some other county and try to get 16 information from the Clerk's office, from the Treasurer, 17 from the Tax Assessor's office. I'm proud of the fact, in 18 particular, that we will -- that when I leave office, we 19 will leave this county in the best financial condition that 20 it's ever been in, or it has been in for a long time. We 21 have increased reserves. We have managed the funds provided 22 to us by the taxpayers to provide the services that they 23 command for their government. 24 Yes, we unfortunately had to raise taxes. 25 Once. One tax increase in nine years, a tax increase that 13 1 has been directly linked to the renovation of the annex, and 2 which I fully expect, under the next administration, will go 3 away in the year 2005, when the funds for this annex have 4 been retired. And I fully expect that, for the next nine 5 months, we're going to keep on keeping on to do what we've 6 done for the last three and a half years, to dedicate 7 ourselves to improvement of the situation in Kerr County. 8 So that when I walk away from here at the end of my term, 9 I'll walk away from here with my head high, knowing that I 10 kept my promise to the voters of Kerr County, that I served 11 all the voters of Kerr County to the best of my ability to 12 improve their situation, and not only to improve their 13 current situation, but to leave a foundation and a framework 14 for the future which will insure, to the best of our ability 15 as leaders, that this County continues to prosper and to be 16 an attractive place for all of us to live in and for all of 17 our children to live in and for all of our grandchildren to 18 live in. 'Cause that was the mission I felt I was handed 19 when I started this job, and that's the direction I have 20 taken in every decision I have made as County Judge. 21 Obviously, I'm not a politician. If I was a 22 politician, some of the decisions that I made I would not 23 have made, had I considered re-election instead of the good 24 of the county. But that's what happens when you sit up 25 here; you put those things aside and you move forward for 14 1 the benefit of everybody. And, I want to thank you guys. 2 I'm proud of the fact that, in the three and a half years, 3 I've cast a handful of votes to break a tie. I'm even more 4 proud of the fact that the overwhelming majority of all the 5 votes that we've cast up here in the last three and a half 6 years have been unanimous. This Court has displayed an 7 amazing degree of unanimity in working together for the 8 benefit of all of the citizens of Kerr County; west, north, 9 south, in the city, out in the ranches, anywhere in Kerr 10 County. What we need to do now is what we're going to do 11 now, and let's get to work. So -- 12 (Applause.) 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Let's pay some bills. 14 Mr. Auditor? Does anyone have any questions or comments 15 about the bills as presented? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move the bills be 17 paid. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 20 Williams, second by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court 21 approve payment of the bills as presented and recommended by 22 the Auditor. Any further questions or comments? If not, 23 all in favor, raise your right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 15 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 3 (Discussion off the record.) 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Budget Amendment 5 Request Number 1 is for Permanent Improvements. 6 MR. TOMLINSON: I think I have maybe one -- 7 the last, final bill for -- for our renovation of the -- of 8 the annex. I have a bill from Keith Longnecker for $135.55. 9 This requires an amendment of $218.26, that -- that amount 10 to come from the annex finish-out construction fund -- or 11 the account, the courthouse construction account. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 15 second by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court approve 16 Budget Amendment Request Number 1 for Permanent 17 Improvements. Any questions or comments? If not, all in 18 favor, raise your right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Budget 23 Amendment Request Number 2 for 216th District Court. 24 MR. TOMLINSON: This amendment is to pay 25 bills for court transcripts. I have total bills today of 16 1 $3,271.15. We're requesting a move of those -- of funds 2 from Special Trials in the 216th court to Court Transcripts. 3 And I need to -- to approve a hand check to Cindy Snider for 4 $326.95 for a transcript, another one to Paula Richards 5 Loetz for $2,722.50. I have another one for Cindy Snider 6 for a transcript for the Reynaldo Alvarez case. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: How much is the last one? 8 MR. TOMLINSON: $221.70. 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And that totals the 10 number we've got here? 11 MR. TOMLINSON: Yeah. 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So moved. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll second the 14 motion. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are the mics on? 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah, it is. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Try it again. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tommy, all I can hear 20 is your natural voice. Is that thing on? 21 MR. TOMLINSON: I don't believe it is. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That may be a good 23 thing. Got to be smarter than the machine. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Supposed to be set up before 25 we start. 17 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tommy, I have a question 2 before we vote on that, anyway. This is an item that will 3 probably be short -- or we will be short on the rest of the 4 year. Would it make sense, to keep from having to come back 5 and do this every time, to maybe, I don't know, take a 6 larger sum out of Special Trials and put it in Court 7 Transcripts? Or just do it each time? 8 MR. TOMLINSON: These come only when we have 9 an appeal. So -- 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 11 MR. TOMLINSON: -- most likely we will have 12 more, but it's hard to judge what that would be. I'm afraid 13 we're going to be short at the end of the year totally in 14 the district courts' budgets. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. We'll just do them 16 case-by-case. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. I believe we have a 18 motion by Commissioner Griffin, second by Commissioner 19 Baldwin, to approve Budget Amendment Request Number 2 for 20 216th District Court, and to authorize hand checks to Cindy 21 Snider in the amount of $326.95, Paula Richards Loetz in the 22 amount of $2,722.50, and also to Cindy Snider in the amount 23 of $221.70. Any other questions or comments? If not, all 24 in favor, raise your right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Budget 4 Amendment Request Number 3 is for the County Clerk election 5 expense. 6 MR. TOMLINSON: This request from the County 7 Clerk to transfer $1,260.54 to Machine Repairs, and this is 8 for repair to the voting equipment on election day. I have 9 a bill actually for $3,746.76. The other part of this 10 amendment is really -- is an error. The amount for $13.78 11 should actually read "Miscellaneous Office Equipment" rather 12 than "Capital Outlay." But this is to replace the mother 13 board on part of that equipment, so that -- that should read 14 -- since it's under $1,000 is the reason it should be a 15 different account. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. So moved. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 19 second by Commissioner Williams, that the Court approve 20 Budget Amendment Request Number 3 for the County Clerk's 21 office. Any further questions or comments? If not, all in 22 favor, raise your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 19 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Item Number 2 4 is again for the 216th. 3 MR. TOMLINSON: I have an additional court 4 transcript payable to Paula Beaver, $1,318.05. Our request 5 is to move $1,318.05 from Special Trials in the 216th court. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 9 second by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve 10 Budget Amendment Request Number 4 for the 216th District 11 Court and authorize a hand check in the amount of $1,318.05 12 payable to the order of Paula Beaver. Any questions or 13 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Do we have 18 any more late bills, Tommy? 19 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes, I do. First one is to 20 VeriClaims, Inc. It's the firm that -- that is -- the 21 County contracted with for indigent health care payments. 22 And this is $140.69, and it's our commission that we pay -- 23 pay this firm for this purpose. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 25 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 20 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 2 second by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court authorize a 3 late bill and hand check in the amount of $140.69 payable to 4 the order of VeriClaims for commissions on indigent health 5 care processing. Any questions or comments? If not, all in 6 favor, raise your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 11 MR. TOMLINSON: The last one is to Allen & 12 Allen Lumber Company. It's for $225.80, and it's for an 13 order for some lumber for the build-out of the Treasurer's 14 office. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: I don't know if we want to go 16 forward with that or not. 17 MS. NEMEC: It has to be special lumber or I 18 don't want it. 19 (Laughter.) 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I wasn't going to bring 21 that up. 22 MS. NEMEC: I have no idea what they're 23 talking about. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 21 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 2 Baldwin, second by Commissioner Letz, that the Court 3 authorize the late bill and hand check in the amount of 4 $225.80 payable to the Allen & Allen Lumber Company for 5 lumber for the finish-out of the Treasurer's office. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My comment is, it must 7 not be much lumber for 200-some dollars from Allen & Allen. 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Not at prices today. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any further questions or 10 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 15 MR. TOMLINSON: That's all I have. I just 16 want to inform the Court that as far -- as part of the 17 reports, that we plan to have an auction, county-wide, for 18 surplus equipment and -- and supplies on the first Saturday 19 in May. Glenn Holekamp and I have -- have visited with 20 various departments to make sure that -- that that's a good 21 day, and so far that's okay, so that's what we plan to do. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: At the Ag Barn? 23 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did you pay rent? 25 MR. TOMLINSON: Almost didn't get it, it's so 22 1 busy. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Moving right along, at 3 this time, I'd entertain a motion to approve and accept the 4 monthly reports as presented. 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So moved. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved -- second. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 8 Griffin, second by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court 9 approve and accept the monthly reports as presented. Any 10 other questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise 11 your right hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, if I can just make 17 a comment related to the auction? 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Go ahead. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just because -- and I 20 don't know. One year I bid on some things. If any 21 Commissioners decide they want to bid on anything, there's 22 some paperwork you got to fill out and file with the County 23 Clerk, just so no one gets in trouble. I had to fill out 24 some kind of a financial disclosure form. You're eligible 25 to bid. Of course, I didn't -- I didn't win what I wanted, 23 1 but -- but, anyway, if you do bid, there's paperwork you 2 need to do if you're a Commissioner. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's good -- 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Or probably any elected 5 official. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's good information to 7 have. Anything else? If not, let's move along. Item 8 Number 1, presentation by Karl Buechler on plans and 9 programs for Easter weekend events at Flat Rock Lake Park. 10 Commissioner Williams? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: A lot has happened 12 since the last time we talked about the proposed events at 13 Flat Rock Lake Park. We had quotations for electrical 14 service, and we had some negotiations, got those numbers 15 down. We've had discussions with Mr. Buechler about whether 16 we put the transformer and pole in the right spot, or 17 whether we should have moved it over 2 inches to the left. 18 Be that at as it may, he's here today to tell the Court what 19 all has been done and what he plans to do on that weekend. 20 He has some exciting plans. Karl, would you come up, 21 please? 22 MR. BEUCHLER: Thank y'all for the 23 opportunity to be here. And I'd like to thank Mr. -- 24 Commissioner Williams and the Court for all their help and 25 support in doing what they've done to help this event be a 24 1 great success. I do have a schedule of events I will give 2 everybody before I leave. It is really working out to be a 3 very good event for this weekend. We have -- we have cooks 4 coming from all over Texas and Arizona and New Mexico. We 5 got Dallas, Fort Worth, Houston. It's going to be a record 6 crowd for cooks for barbecue and chili. I would like to 7 thank also Carson Distributor -- Distributing and a lot of 8 other businesses for their help and support in putting this 9 on. We're going to have a big event for the Easter egg -- 10 the businesses has responded real well in donating stuff. 11 We will be giving prize eggs that will be -- have bicycles 12 and tricycles and stuff for the kids that find them. Also, 13 I would like to invite y'all, the Commissioners Court, to be 14 there for the judging, if possible. We're going to have 15 some of the best barbecue in the state of Texas and the 16 United States, if you would like to come down and help judge 17 it. Other than that, we're just hoping for good weather. 18 And it's a good event, planned event; it's organized. We 19 have everything covered. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What are the hours? 21 MR. BEUCHLER: The hours, Friday night the 22 festivities will start -- the cooks will start coming in 23 Friday evening. We will have a cook's party Friday night, 24 which will consist of a wild game dinner, which the -- the 25 meat was provided by Woodbury Taxidermy, Rhodes Taxidermy, 25 1 and Bernhard's Processing Plant. And we will cook that, and 2 all the cooks will have a big party that night, and y'all 3 are also welcome to come to that festivities and eat as 4 well. Then the next morning, restoration will begin 5 somewhere around -- I don't know, 9 or 10 o'clock, and the 6 cook-off will actually start at -- at 11 o'clock. And then 7 the different events and vendors will be setting up at 8 around 9 or 10 o'clock also. We did have a good response 9 from vendors. We -- we probably got 30 vendors coming from 10 out of state everywhere to participate in this, with all 11 different kind of arts and crafts and items for sale. We 12 also have the Gunslingers coming; they're going to put on a 13 good performance on the shootouts and stuff, and we got 14 Huckleberry, the mechanical bull, which all the college kids 15 and all the high school bull riders just love to play with. 16 And it's just -- it's just turning out to be a real exiting 17 event, and I'm just glad I'm a part of it. And -- and, as 18 far as the electricity, it just turned out so well. It 19 just -- it just it worked out just the way it was -- it was 20 supposed to work out. We're going to be -- the stage will 21 be under the trees, where the performances are going to be, 22 and it's just -- y'all just come out and enjoy it. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Can we have those? 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thank you, Karl. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 26 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Appreciate your work. 2 You've really -- the event has really grown in the past 3 couple years. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Fair warning, I've 5 judged a couple of those things. It takes about a month to 6 get over. 7 (Laughter.) 8 MR. BEUCHLER: That's the chili, not the 9 barbecue. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. 11 MR. BEUCHLER: I will leave a pile of these 12 back here for the rest of the people, if they would like to 13 pick up one and also come out and enjoy the event, and have 14 any questions. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thanks again. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Karl. 18 MR. BEUCHLER: Thank y'all. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: Sounds like a good time. 20 Item Number 2 is a request from Jackie Keller on behalf of 21 the Center Point Project Graduation for use of the Hill 22 Country Youth Exhibition Center. Ms. Keller, are you in the 23 audience? Come forward, please. Welcome. 24 MS. KELLER: Good morning. Thank y'all for 25 your time this morning. My name is Jackie Keller, and I'm a 27 1 parent of a Center Point High School student and I'm here 2 today representing the students and parents of the Center 3 Point Class of 2003. The reason I'm coming to you today is 4 to talk to you about their Project Graduation. And, even 5 though their graduation is over a year away, planning this 6 event is very important to them. As y'all know, Project 7 Graduation provides a safe place for students to be the 8 night that they graduate. What we are asking for is, we 9 would like to rent the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center for 10 their Project Graduation in the year 2003. We've received 11 prices for this. Renting the hall is $250 for the hall, 12 $150 setup fee that they charge us to help us set up our 13 events in there, $150 clean-up fee, which would be refunded 14 provided that we clean up the hall exactly how it was 15 presented to us, and then a $25-an-hour security charge from 16 12 midnight to 6 a.m. the day of the event. And, adding all 17 that up, I come up with about a $700 figure. And we are a 18 small school, with approximately 40 students for the Class 19 of 2003, and we would greatly appreciate any financial 20 support you can give us for this event. 21 We do have a lot of fun and exciting events 22 planned for them that evening for them to really enjoy 23 themselves, being that this is the last day of high school. 24 Again, any financial support that you can give us would be 25 greatly appreciated, and again, thank you for your time, 28 1 from myself, as a student -- I'm sorry, as a parent; I wish 2 I was a student. As a parent, and all the students and 3 parents of Center Point High School, 2003 class. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Ms. Keller, where is 5 the event being held this year? 6 MS. KELLER: This year it is at the Hermann 7 Sons in Comfort. And the reason we would like to go 8 somewhere else is 'cause, talking to the students that have 9 been there in the past, there's not a lot there for them to 10 do. It's not real big for them to put a lot of stuff in 11 there for them to do, and we figure in the -- in the Exhibit 12 Hall, that we can provide them better games and other things 13 that they could do in there, like basketball or whatever we 14 can come up with for them in there. We plan on having a 15 parent meeting to discuss all the events that we do want to 16 have for them. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are you part of the 18 fundraising group? 19 MS. KELLER: Yes, I am. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Raising funds for 21 this year's event? 22 MS. KELLER: Yes, I am, for the year 2003. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: As well as this 24 year's? 25 MS. KELLER: No, I do not have a graduating 29 1 student this year. Next year I do. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: A concern that I have is 3 that, you know, there's a possibility that the facility may 4 be under renovation at that time. 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: This is May of 2003. 6 MS. KELLER: 2003. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: We're talking about a year 8 from this May. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There's a -- I hadn't 10 even thought of that. I hadn't even thought that far. I 11 think, yeah, that's probably a good concern, but the -- 12 they're also -- while that may be, the arena next door would 13 be available. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think there's an 15 event in the arena. 16 MS. KELLER: Yes, sir, there is an event in 17 the arena next door that night. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that -- but also, 19 that brings us into another whole thing as to, you know, 20 what are we going to do with bookings out into the future? 21 You know, notwithstanding that concern, I mean, I have no 22 problem at all with waiving pretty much all of the fees, 23 except maybe the security and clean-up. I mean, the 24 clean-up would be refunded. 25 MS. KELLER: Yes, sir. 30 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Then whatever the 2 Maintenance Department comes up with as a utility amount, 3 which would be pretty nominal, I imagine. I think it's a 4 good thing, but I think certain things we can't -- I think 5 we can't waive, but we certainly could reduce the amount 6 from -- 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: I would be in favor of 8 waiving the setup fee and the rent, except for the utility 9 cost, but I think the security fee needs to be paid, because 10 those are people that we have to go out and hire off-duty 11 Sheriff's Department or whomever to work the event. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: When do you need to know? 13 Other than right away. 14 MS. KELLER: No, I don't need to know right 15 away. I am going to have a parent meeting with all of the 16 graduating class of 2003 probably sometime in April to 17 discuss, you know, what I have come up with here, just to 18 let them know that I have come in front of y'all and 19 presented this, and that y'all are trying to work with us on 20 it. Just a couple months from now is fine. It doesn't have 21 to be right away. I mean, 'cause we're not going to start 22 anything major until school starts again in August, 'cause 23 we want to let the Class of 2002 finish everything that they 24 have going on before we step in with any fundraisers or 25 anything,'cause we feel like that's not fair to them. And 31 1 when school starts up again in August or September, that's 2 when we really want to start getting all of our fundraisers 3 going and everything. So -- 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just so the Court's kind 5 of aware of -- you know, my thought is it's going to be a 6 lot involved with the renovation ideas out there. You know, 7 I think we need to get something -- you know, the Court 8 needs to decide a direction in the next two months, to me. 9 In fact, I'm meeting with -- Commissioner Baldwin and I are 10 meeting with Bob Dittmar and Glenn Holekamp to look at some 11 repair/renovation things, kind of get another idea of some 12 other options that -- you know, out there. But we already 13 have one concept; I think it's been before the Court, and it 14 may be modified a little bit. Probably -- I've talked with 15 Commissioner Baldwin a little bit. We're looking at, you 16 know, what the alternative would be from a repair 17 standpoint, just a dollar amount figure, what that would be. 18 And I suspect that we can have something before the Court 19 sometime in late April, early May, which would give us a -- 20 and I think this Court needs to decide and make -- we have 21 to vote. Either -- I think we're at a point now, we've been 22 talking about it for two years. I'm not getting mad yet. 23 But I just -- but if you can wait that long, I think that 24 will give an idea as to what direction the Court's going to 25 go. That's just where I stand on it. 32 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think -- I'm sorry, 2 Buster. Go ahead. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, you go ahead. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It might be 5 beneficial to you and your committee if you identify a 6 backup site, just in the event -- 7 MS. KELLER: We sure will. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- that we move 9 forward the renovations that might shut this all down, or 10 make it grossly inadequate. 11 MS. KELLER: Okay. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: My only comment is 13 that -- to piggyback on Commissioner Letz, he and I are 14 going to go meet this afternoon with those folks to look at 15 another option other than the big plan, and that's repairing 16 what we have, basically. And I can -- in my mind, I can see 17 us bringing those numbers together pretty fast, and we 18 already have a plan on the table with some numbers -- fairly 19 firm numbers, and I think pretty quick we should be able to 20 get back around the table the options of, do we want to go 21 build the big program or do we want to fix what we have? 22 And this Court needs to vote pretty quick. So, I -- in my 23 mind, it will be pretty quick. 24 MS. KELLER: Okay. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I'm -- I agree 33 1 with everything they said. I bet you get it. 2 MS. KELLER: Thank you. 3 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: If there's a way to 4 make it work, I think -- my position would be, if there's a 5 way to make it work, we'll make it work. 6 MS. KELLER: We really appreciate that very 7 much. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You might carry back 9 to your group, however, that it wouldn't be a total waiving 10 of the fee. 11 MS. KELLER: Okay. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The rental would be 13 waived, the setup fee would be waived. You'd probably have 14 to put the deposit up for clean-up, just in the event you 15 didn't get it cleaned up, and there would be a charge for 16 utilities, and you'll have to take care of security. 17 MS. KELLER: That will be great. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's kind of what 19 I'm hearing. 20 MS. KELLER: That will be great. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We'll get back to 22 you. 23 MS. KELLER: Thank y'all very much. 24 Appreciate it. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good to see you. 34 1 MS. KELLER: Thank you. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Moving right along, 3 the next item, Item Number 3, consider changing the status 4 of the road in Pier 5 Subdivision from public to private, 5 and set a public hearing date for the same. Commissioner 6 Griffin. 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yes. Franklin 8 Johnston may have -- I'm sure will have some comment to make 9 on this. This is a wholly-owned, platted subdivision that 10 is out on Ingram Lake. The -- it's owned by David and 11 Deborah Simpson. They have asked by our -- our procedure. 12 They have submitted a letter with an affidavit requesting 13 that the Pier 5 Drive, which is the road which you see on 14 that drawing, be changed in status from a public road to a 15 private road so that that community can be gated. There's 16 probably some question about where that gate would -- would 17 have to be to be legal and so on, but the purpose here today 18 primarily is to answer any questions that the Court may have 19 and set a public hearing where all of that can be discussed 20 and -- and the legal issues that would derive from that 21 discussion can be determined, and that we could perhaps move 22 forward in accordance with whatever comes out of that. So, 23 Franklin, do you have anything to add to that? 24 MR. JOHNSTON: That's basically it. The road 25 is dedicated to the public now, and -- 35 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: By the way, this is 2 not a County-maintained road. It is -- it's a -- 3 MR. JOHNSTON: That's right. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: -- privately 5 maintained. 6 MR. JOHNSTON: The issue is, like I say, 7 where to gate it, because there's some other land -- it's 8 kind of a long entryway. There's adjacent property owners. 9 I think some of those are relying on the fact that road was 10 public for some of their ingress -- egress and ingress. I 11 think some of those owners are here. I don't know if we 12 should hear them at this time or wait till the public 13 hearing, or -- 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: We'll let them speak, because 15 they've signed up, when we've finished with our discussion. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The question is, 17 there's other property owners involved that do not have 18 access off of Cade Road? There's property owners inside 19 that subdivision a little ways that -- 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No. 21 MR. JOHNSTON: I think they have access on 22 Cade, but they also have access -- you know, this is also a 23 public road, not maintained, and they also have -- you know, 24 have access off of it. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 36 1 MR. JOHNSTON: Due to the fact it's public. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: There's -- at least 3 from what I can tell from looking at the -- all of the 4 platted information, there are no landowners outside of this 5 platted subdivision who this provides the only access for. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: It provides some 8 access, but there are other accesses as well. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's my question. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: This is not the only 11 access, except for the platted subdivision. It is the only 12 access for it. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Are Mr. and Mrs. Simpson here 14 today? 15 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No, they could not be 16 here today due to another commitment, but they will be here 17 for the public hearing. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Do we know where they intend 19 to place the gate? 20 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think that's 21 probably going to have to be determined by the Court, on 22 where the -- where the abandonment and vacation of the -- 23 abandoning and vacating of the road would take place. 24 MR. JOHNSTON: I think at this time they want 25 to place it at the entrance off of Cade Road, at the very 37 1 bottom there in the drawing that you have. I think 2 that's -- 3 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: We would have to have 4 that proposal from them at the public hearing, exactly what 5 it would be. 6 MR. JOHNSTON: I think some of the other 7 landowners here that are adjacent to it have questions about 8 it. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: I'm not -- I'm not sure we 10 can have a public hearing until we know where the gate goes. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It would have to be very 12 specific. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Critical information for the 14 public to have in order to make an evaluation on the 15 proposal. I don't think that we can -- we can have a public 16 hearing on it -- 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: We can set the public 18 hearing. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- on a gated subdivision 20 without knowing where the gate goes. 21 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: We can -- the way 22 their affidavit reads is that -- is that all of Pier 5 Drive 23 would be abandoned and vacated. We can have a public 24 hearing on that basis. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's my question, 38 1 is -- I mean, you're vacating -- Fred, I don't want to argue 2 with you, but here's a little argument. If you're going to 3 vacate the whole road, what difference does it make where 4 the gate goes? 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, I, quite frankly, 6 haven't looked at it close enough to -- 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: They want to have the whole 9 thing vacated? 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: If it makes it easier 11 to do procedurally, then I would think that the public 12 hearing would be on vacation -- vacating and abandoning the 13 entire road. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Well, that -- that 15 actually -- 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And we can set the 17 public hearing. Now, if information comes out at the public 18 hearing that that's not the thing to do, then we can back 19 off of that. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Exactly. 21 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And I will make -- at 22 the proper time, make a motion to that effect. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Mr. Terrell? 24 MR. TERRELL: Well, Judge, I understand that 25 today is not the hearing on this application, but merely to 39 1 put it on the agenda for a public hearing. I think that's 2 right. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's correct. 4 MR. TERRELL: But I would like to say that I 5 represent Mr. and Mrs. Mertl here, and just -- if you'd just 6 hold up your hand for a minute. And Mr. and Mrs. Wardroup. 7 And we drew a little poster -- maybe I'll give it to Frank 8 here -- that shows how their driveways are and such physical 9 details as that on the ground. But, just right up front, to 10 say where the private road exits onto the Simpson property, 11 where the Simpson property -- where the Simpsons own both 12 sides of the road, we have no problem whatever putting a 13 gate there. And it looks to me like, if their objective is 14 to have a gated community where they have some kind of 15 little development down there -- I'm not sure what they have 16 in mind, but that that would serve their purpose just as 17 well as having the gateway up there at Cade Loop Road. We 18 do object strenuously to the portion of this dedicated 19 public road that adjoins the Mertls' and the Wardroups' 20 property being converted from a public road which they can 21 use to a private road which they cannot. And, like I say, 22 we have a little poster showing the physical layout of the 23 properties and where their driveways are and such as that, 24 but I understand this is not a public hearing today, and I 25 don't want to take up 15 minutes of your time here. 40 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I do have a couple 2 questions, Tom, if you will. The Simpsons -- what -- which 3 is their property? Lot 1? Lot 12? Or where is their -- 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: All of it. 5 MR. JOHNSTON: All of it. All of Pier 5. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Everything. 7 MR. TERRELL: Maybe this will help. Maybe, 8 Frank, if you can hold that up for me. See, here's where 9 the Pier 5 Road comes in from Cade Loop. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. 11 MR. TERRELL: Like this. And the Mertls have 12 this tract right here, and Mr. and Mrs. Wardroup have the 13 tract over here, and their house is back here. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 15 MR. TERRELL: So it runs right along -- it's 16 only 12 -- it's about a 12-foot-wide road. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah, I can see. 18 MR. TERRELL: Can you see? And so, as I 19 understand what the Simpsons want, they want to put a gate 20 up here and turn this into a complete private road, which 21 means that these people -- and these people couldn't use it 22 any more for any purpose, I suppose. But we have no 23 objection whatever to where it leaves the Mertl property 24 here and curves this way onto the Simpson property. So, 25 gosh, we think that -- that the best way out of this for 41 1 everybody is just to put the -- put the gate right there, 2 which would serve most of their purpose and preserve our 3 public -- our right to use the road. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask a question. 5 And I'm -- I'm almost in agreement with you. But, coming 6 off of Cade Loop, if that became private property, if we 7 took it off the -- off the county system and it became 8 private property, then that -- then that property reverts 9 back to that owner, does it not? 10 MR. TERRELL: This road here? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. It reverts 12 back to the Wardroups -- looks like it's just half of it -- 13 half a road there, anyway. Looks like it's all on -- 14 MR. TERRELL: No, 'cause what happened over 15 time, I guess at one time -- 16 MR. JOHNSTON: This is actually part of the 17 subdivision. The little gate right here is part of the 18 subdivision. 19 MR. TERRELL: The under -- the land 20 underneath this little strip here is actually owned by the 21 Simpsons, because that's the way -- 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 23 MR. TERRELL: Whoever owned this to start 24 with conveyed out this, conveyed out this, and then conveyed 25 this out as part of -- part of this down here. 42 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see, okay. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And that's the 3 ticklish legal issue, because I -- I've never seen one -- at 4 least I've never seen one like it. 5 MR. TERRELL: It's a bizarre situation. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: A flag lot, if I ever 7 saw one. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's a flag subdivision. 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: It's a flag 10 subdivision. 11 MR. TERRELL: Is that called a panhandle? 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So I think we -- I 13 think a public hearing to hash all this out and to get -- 14 perhaps get the County Attorney's office, if we might -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 16 MR. JOHNSTON: I think the whole subdivision 17 is only, like, 5 acres, so -- really just one lot. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Twelve lots and -- 19 MR. TERRELL: What's the total acreage down 20 here? 21 MR. JOHNSTON: About 5 acres. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Larry, I mean, I don't 23 know -- it seems to me that I can't see that we're going 24 to -- to me, the gate should go up there where the road goes 25 off to the subdivision. I can't see that we're going to -- 43 1 would abandon that lower portion. Would it be possible to 2 delay setting a public hearing until our next meeting? 3 Because, if we don't, we're basically causing two families 4 to hire an attorney or representatives to come in here and 5 argue before us, when in reality, the Simpsons may be happy 6 with the gate where they -- 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Have any of those 8 discussions taken place? 9 MR. TERRELL: Well, they had a little meeting 10 over at the Wardroup's house Thursday night, and there was a 11 lot of discussion. They thought maybe they had it settled, 12 but the -- let me get this straight, now -- but the next day 13 the Simpsons called and said forget that. 14 MR. MERTL: No, last night. Last night David 15 called and said he wanted the -- he wanted to get his land 16 back, quote, unquote. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Well, maybe a 18 public hearing is the way to go, then. Let us decide it. 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Let's hear all the -- 20 MR. MERTL: If I could just make one -- I'm 21 Bob Mertl. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Come forward, sir. Come to 23 the podium. 24 MR. MERTL: One of the problems that I'm 25 dealing with is that my front gate off of Cade Loop Road is 44 1 a stone arch. The middle of that arch is approximately 2 14 feet high. I had an experience when I moved in here, as 3 an example, and -- and we've used the side entrance on other 4 occasions, but I had an experience when I moved in that the 5 moving trucks from Georgia, and there were a pair of them, 6 could not get through that gate. In other words, they were 7 -- they were just at 14 feet, but because of the width of 8 the box, so that they did use this road. Okay. And that's 9 one of the things that -- that the previous owner had in 10 mind. He had a lot of heavy equipment. Bob Cade, if you 11 know the Cade family, he had a lot of equipment, and he 12 would come in one entrance and go out another. I gated it 13 because I had dogs -- I have dogs, but essentially that's a 14 safety valve for me. And, as such, I'm opposing putting a 15 gate up here. I don't care what David does down below. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Public hearing's 17 the way to go. 18 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Okay. I'll make the 19 motion, then, that we accept this package from the Simpsons 20 for consideration of changing the status of the road in the 21 Pier 5 Subdivision from public to private, and set a public 22 hearing for -- what date? 23 MS. SOVIL: You've got the 8th or the 22nd. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Actually, it actually needs 25 to be the first one in May. 45 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: May. Thirty days. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Got to be 30 days. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: You're looking at the 11th -- 4 is the 11th the meeting? 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Is it the 11th? 6 MS. SOVIL: May the 13th. 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: May 13th. Set a 8 public hearing for 10 a.m. on May 13th. 9 MR. TERRELL: May 13th, you say? 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: May the 13th. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll second that 12 motion. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 14 Griffin, second by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court 15 accept the request from Mr. and Mrs. Simpson to abandon all 16 of the Pier 5 Drive located in Pier 5 Subdivision in 17 Precinct 4, and set a public hearing on same for 10 o'clock 18 a.m. May 13th, Year 2002, here in the Kerr County 19 Commissioners Courtroom. Any further questions or comments? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: One more question, 21 please. Hold your little sign back up. How do the -- how 22 do the Wardroups -- where is their driveway? 23 MR. TERRELL: Right here. They come around 24 on a little road that's called Paradise Retreat to get to 25 their house. 46 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, yeah. 2 MR. TERRELL: They hope some -- maybe this 3 might be -- this slopes down real fast to the river, and 4 they hope -- this is a pretty good site right over here. Of 5 course, there's nothing there now, but -- 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, thanks. I know 7 where it is now. 8 MR. TERRELL: Okay. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any other questions or 10 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. All right. 15 Next item is Item Number 5, consider awarding a bid for 16 five-year lease on wheel loader, authorizing County Judge to 17 sign the contract for same, and issuing a hand check for the 18 first payment. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Item 4. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Item 4, okay. 21 MR. JOHNSTON: Holt was the low bid with the 22 Caterpillar 924-GZ loader, total bid of $67,745, and they 23 have a $7,232 buy-back at the end of five years. We ask the 24 Court to award the bid -- to consider awarding the bid to 25 Holt, and give the County Judge permission to sign the 47 1 contract and issue a hand check in the amount of $1,126.50 2 for the first month's payment to Caterpillar Financial 3 Services Corporation. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 7 Williams, second by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court 8 award the bid for a five-year lease for wheel loader to the 9 Holt Equipment Company. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Caterpillar -- isn't the 11 lease with Caterpillar? 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: The lease is with Holt. Is 13 that correct? It's Holt? 14 MR. JOHNSTON: Yeah, Holt was the bidder. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Holt is the lessee. 16 MR. JOHNSTON: But we pay Caterpillar 17 Financial Services Corporation. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: The motion is to award the 19 bid for the five-year lease of wheel loader to Holt 20 Equipment Company, authorize County Judge to sign the 21 necessary contracts, and authorize a hand check in the 22 amount of $1,126.50 payable to the order of Caterpillar 23 Financial Services for the first month's lease on the 24 equipment. Everybody got that? Any other questions or 25 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 48 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Item Number 5 5 is to consider recommendations and award the bid on 6 6,500 tons of base material for Sheppard Rees Road. 7 MR. JOHNSTON: Again, 6,500 tons of Type A, 8 Grade 2 base material for Sheppard Rees Road. We had -- the 9 low bid was $6.95 per ton, delivered to the site, from Lucky 10 3 Materials. We recommend that bid. 11 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So moved. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 14 Griffin, second by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court 15 award the bid for 6,500 tons of Type A, Grade 2 base 16 material for Sheppard Rees Road to Lucky 3 Materials at an 17 amount of $6.95 per ton. Any questions or comments? If 18 not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I did have a 24 question. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Sorry. 49 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, no, it's okay. 2 But I can't ask it because it's not part of the agenda item, 3 but if I was going to ask it, it would be something like 4 this. How are we doing on our piece of land out there with 5 the County Attorney and all? Are we moving forward? Or -- 6 MR. JOHNSTON: I haven't had a recent update 7 since we've turned it over to him. I really haven't heard 8 anything on it. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, thank you. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Next item is Item 11 Number 6, consider recommendations and award annual bids on 12 base material, cold mix, black base, paving aggregate, 13 asphalt emulsion oil, corrugated metal pipe, and equipment 14 by the hour. 15 MR. JOHNSTON: The following are 16 recommendations for the annual bids opened March 11th, 2002: 17 Road base material, Type A, Lucky 3 Materials. Type B, 18 Drymala Sand & Gravel. And Type C, Rountree Materials. Hot 19 mix, cold laid asphalt; low bid, black base, Smyth Mines. 20 Cold mix, Smyth Mines. Paving aggregate, Type B, Grade 3, 21 Wheatcraft. Type B, Grade 4, Wheatcraft. Type B, Grade 5, 22 Wheatcraft. PB, Grade 3, Smyth Mines. PB, Grade 4 and 23 Grade 5, Smyth Mines. Trap rock, Grades 3, 4, and 5, Vulcan 24 Materials. Emulsion oils, CRS-2 and HFRS-2 is Ergon Asphalt 25 and Emulsions, and AEP is also Ergon Asphalt and Emulsions. 50 1 Corrugated metal pipe, all sizes we had specified, low bid 2 was Wilson Culverts. Equipment by the hour, they're ranked 3 according to bid, the low bid being Schwarz Construction. 4 Second low bid is M.P.B., Mike Butler, Incorporated. Third 5 is Edmund Jenschke, Incorporated. And fourth is Bobby 6 Jenschke. We wish to accept all bids and use in order of 7 their bidding; in other words, the first -- the low bid 8 being called first, or if his schedule is full, we go to the 9 next bid, et cetera. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Franklin, question on 11 the -- going back to the materials. This is just overall. 12 Is the -- are we hauling all this ourselves? I mean, are we 13 sending our truck to -- 14 MR. JOHNSTON: Most of it, we haul. I think, 15 like, on the one on Sheppard Rees, we had it bid -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. That was bid -- 17 MR. JOHNSTON: -- to the job site, but most 18 of it we transport. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. I was just 20 wondering because of the variance in the cost; it looked 21 like we were hauling, because usually there's a freight 22 balancing out -- 23 MR. JOHNSTON: Those -- some of them are in 24 Uvalde. There are different materials in different places. 25 We use our 30-yard live-bottom to haul a lot of that 51 1 material. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I think you said it, 3 but just to emphasize it, all of these materials bids, you 4 are recommending the low bidder? 5 MR. JOHNSTON: The low bidder, yes. 6 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: All right. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm real happy with the 8 number of bids we had, and actually, it looks -- it's 9 interesting that we're spreading it out to -- 10 MR. JOHNSTON: Some of the asphalt bids were 11 good prices, I think, too. Lower than last year. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: I was going to ask, how would 13 you characterize the overall bidding? 14 MR. JOHNSTON: I think on the asphalt per 15 gallon, it's 3-point-something cents lower than last year. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's good. 17 MR. JOHNSTON: Some of the base material was 18 higher, though, so it averages out. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll move we accept all 20 the base materials, cold mix, black base, paving aggregate, 21 asphalt emulsion oil, corrugated metal pipe,, equipment by 22 the hour as presented. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 25 second by Commissioner Williams, that the Court award the 52 1 annual bids on base material, cold mix, black base, paving 2 aggregate, asphalt emulsion oil, corrugated metal pipe, and 3 equipment by the hour as recommended by the -- as 4 recommended and presented by the County Engineer. Any 5 questions or comments? If not, all in favor, raise your 6 right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Thank you 11 Franklin. Next item is Item Number 7, consider and discuss 12 authorizing the Sheriff's Department to enter into an 13 interlocal cooperation contract with Texas Department of 14 Public Safety to purchase supplies to use in Restricted DNA 15 Database sample collection. Is all that necessary? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Unfortunately. Buster 17 was talking about some things the Legislature's going to do 18 this year. Well, they got us right now on some things. We 19 are required by law now to take DNA samples from anybody 20 arrested, charged, convicted or otherwise for any type of 21 sexual offense. The DNA samples have to be submitted to 22 D.P.S. in Austin and put on a database there. And the thing 23 is, we're required also to enter into a contract with D.P.S. 24 in Austin for them to do the processing of that, and we're 25 required to buy the supplies from D.P.S. in Austin, so this 53 1 is one of those deals where -- unfunded mandate or whatever, 2 but we don't have any choices. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's the amount? 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Those kits, from what I 5 understand, D.P.S. hasn't totally gotten all that figured 6 out, but right now it's between $4.50 and $5 each for blood 7 sample kits. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: From a budget standpoint, 9 how much are we going to need? 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: This year it won't 11 affect -- I'll get it out of Operating Supplies. I think we 12 have enough, thank goodness. I hope -- I'm trying to look 13 back, and I hope this is extremely high, but I hope we never 14 need more than 100 of those a year. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Say it again? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: A hundred. 17 Unfortunately, there are quite a few arrests that would fit 18 into that category. I think it's a very well -- a very good 19 law to have it; it will help solve a lot of unsolved crimes. 20 It's just going to be a budgetary thing. We're going to 21 have to look at mainly next year. This year, we can do it 22 with what we have. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, you're saying that 24 the State's requiring us to do something and they want the 25 taxpayers of Kerr County to pay for it? 54 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You got it. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: What a novel suggestion. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What a novel thought. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Wait till we get to the 5 next item, Buster; you can go off again. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We can do business 7 with their monopoly organization, right. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move we authorize Kerr 9 County Sheriff's Department to enter into an interlocal 10 cooperation contract with Texas Department of Public Safety 11 to purchase supplies for the Restricted DNA database. 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 14 second by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court authorize the 15 Sheriff's Department to enter into the interlocal 16 cooperation contract. Any other questions or comments? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And authorize County 18 Judge to sign same. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: And authorize County Judge to 20 sign same. Any other questions or comments? If not, all in 21 favor, raise your right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Item Number 55 1 8, consider and discuss authorizing expenditure for new 2 forms required by Senate Bill 7. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And this is another one 4 of those nice Legislature deals. Senate Bill 7 is the Fair 5 Defense Act, which I don't really have a problem with. 6 Actually, the Sheriff's Department part of this bill is just 7 that we're required to make sure everybody arrested sees a 8 magistrate within 48 hours. Okay. There's no funding 9 requirements on the Sheriff's Office specifically, but what 10 the magistrates have to do is make sure that everybody 11 arrested is given the opportunity that, if they want a 12 court-appointed attorney and cannot hire one, cannot afford 13 one, they get it right then, not once they come to court on 14 their first court date or anything else, like it's really 15 been working all the time. They usually wait till the first 16 court date and they ask the Judge for a court-appointed 17 attorney. But under this new -- new legislation, they're 18 entitled to get a court-appointed attorney within three days 19 of being arrested. 20 This is going to -- in my opinion, this is 21 going to have a devastating effect on the counties all the 22 way across the state, because right now, like the County 23 Court at Law here, their first court date may be six weeks 24 down the road, and if they get out of jail, they wait six 25 weeks to come to court. They sit down with the County 56 1 Attorney and them and see if they want to work out a plea 2 bargain first, and if they can't, then they get a 3 court-appointed attorney. But what's going to happen now is 4 all these people will be getting court-appointed attorneys 5 right off the bat, when they could actually work out a plea 6 bargain or something, and most of -- the going rate for 7 those court-appointed attorneys is going to be anywhere from 8 $40 to $70 an hour that the County's going to have to start 9 paying, which is really going to be the big expense of this. 10 The problem is, all this stuff has to be done in writing, in 11 forms. 12 The District Judges and the County Court at 13 Law Judge have already entered a plan that's been submitted 14 to the governor and put on file there. The forms that go 15 along with that, each J.P. conference, the magistrates all 16 have their different forms, each county that we're using 17 theirs, so I took them all and we tried to combine them down 18 to the least number of forms that we would have to have. I 19 sat down with Judge Ables, and him and I talked about it, 20 made sure it met all the requirements. And we're going to 21 have to have four forms, which all four of those have to be 22 in triplicate, because the Court will get a copy, the 23 magistrate will get a copy, and the defendant will get a 24 copy. The jail won't even keep a copy of these forms. 25 We'll just document this stuff in the computer system. But 57 1 when you do that many forms in triplicate, it does get 2 expensive. 3 There is a task force that the governor 4 appointed to study this implementation and how it's going to 5 work in the future, and see if they can synchronize it, so 6 I'm not trying to get a lot of forms right now. I'm trying 7 to make sure we're in compliance with what we have to do 8 now, and then we'll wait and see what that task force out of 9 the governor's office actually comes up with in finalizing 10 it. But the best I can do right now are the four forms. I 11 think y'all each even have a copy of it. We've actually 12 combined -- like, on one page of this we even combined three 13 different parts of it on one form, which was the transmittal 14 where the J.P. orders us to transmit this request to the 15 proper court within 24 hours, and the inmates or the 16 defendant's actual request for the counsel to be appointed, 17 and then the proper court actually ordering that, the 18 appointment of certain counsel. So, it does get -- then 19 there's an Affidavit of Indigency and everything else. So, 20 the price that we came up with so far so that I can get 21 these and be able to comply now is $783 on this form. I 22 don't have that in my budget, not for just new forms. If 23 this goes through, this cost will end up being pretty close 24 to -- anywhere from $10,000 to $15,000 a year in forms. 25 That's a change. 58 1 The other big thing on this -- and I don't 2 know how the J.P.'s are going to handle it; I don't know how 3 we're going to handle it -- is that also -- and it's even 4 mentioned in one of these forms in the -- in the 5 magistrate's affidavit certification, where he had to advise 6 these people -- the defendants of everything, that it also 7 states, under Number 9 in there, if the accused does not 8 speak or understand English language or is deaf, I have 9 informed the accused in a manner consistent with Texas Code 10 of Criminal Procedures, Articles 38.30 and 38.31. What 11 we've always done is used jailers as interpreters. Under 12 those articles, it says it has to be a non-involved or other 13 party doing that, and you also have to be qualified under 14 those articles to be an interpreter, which is going to -- to 15 really cost us somewhere, because we're going to have to 16 have an interpreter available at any time that a magistrate 17 sees a -- a person arrested. And the way current things are 18 going, a weekend for us alone is normally averaging at least 19 50 arrests, people being brought into that jail, and those 20 interpreters are entitled to their fees, up to $100 a day 21 or -- or whatever. And it's just going to be another one of 22 those very expensive things that we have to do. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't even see that 24 working. I don't see how that will work. I know there's 25 times -- I remember times in District Court where there 59 1 wasn't an interpreter available, and we had to get one out 2 of San Antonio. How would you do that for a full weekend at 3 the jail? 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's going to be a 5 good -- some of the requirements, because we're less than 6 50,000 population -- don't ask me what part that plays for 7 the defendant, but some of the requirements on the 8 interpreter, they don't have to be certified, which are -- 9 your court ones do. They do have to be qualified. And 10 then, an uninterested party. And it's going to be -- you 11 know, I mean, I don't know. There may need to be some 12 meetings or whatever with all the J.P.'s and everyone on how 13 we can hire someone -- the County hire someone or have 14 somebody available to interpret every morning, and sometimes 15 in the evenings and all through the weekends. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's interesting, this is 17 a -- this -- the other side of this was brought up at the -- 18 at the conference in west Texas, and they neglected to tell 19 us the part of this that you're telling us now. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Sure. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- the idea of it was 22 to speed the process from arrest through trial, and their 23 idea was that -- and their numbers -- and I forgot which 24 group it was that pushed for this. I'm sure it's a lobby 25 group. 60 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: In reality -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They want to -- the 3 quicker you get them to trial, the cheaper it is for the 4 County, is what the logic behind it was. I had a lot of the 5 questions that you're bringing up. I was thinking at the 6 time -- I said, well, seems to me if we appoint somebody 7 sooner, it's more fees to be paying that person. But the 8 other side of this is, what it's going to mean is we're 9 going to have to -- well, hopefully -- is speed the trial 10 process. And I don't know if that's possible. I think 11 we're pretty efficient in this county. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: In my opinion, it's 13 going to slow it down drastically, because the best way for 14 a defense attorney to get the best deal for his client, 15 especially if they have to call these court-appointed 16 attorneys, is to postpone and postpone and stack up the 17 dockets, and you're going to see the dockets in this county, 18 especially County Court at Law, get stacked up so bad that 19 they're going to have to be cutting special deals or 20 whatever just to clear dockets out. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think you're right. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think that's what 23 was told to us in Abilene; this really was a defense 24 attorney work protection act. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's going to guarantee 61 1 them a job. Now, you know, there are -- even if they are 2 indigent, if a person does get convicted, there are ways 3 that they can still, as part of that conviction, be ordered 4 to pay back those -- those court appointment fees. But, you 5 know, you can only squeeze so much blood out of turnips. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You're telling me you 7 don't have $783 in your budget? 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I cut my budget real 9 close. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You got a paycheck 11 coming this week. Come on, let's have some commitment here. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Give me yours, Buster. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: What we need to do is 14 authorize the Sheriff to purchase the forms, and then when 15 the bill comes in, he'll have to get with Tommy and find a 16 place for the money. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's true. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Correct, Tommy? 19 MR. TOMLINSON: Sure. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move to do so. 21 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 23 Baldwin, second by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court 24 authorize the Sheriff to purchase the new forms required by 25 Senate Bill 7, as presented. 62 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Thank you. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any other questions or 3 comments? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I'd like to say 5 I am thrilled that there are some folks in the public here 6 from Kerr County that pay taxes, that are forced to pay 7 these kind of taxes that the great State of Texas tells them 8 that they will. So, it's not -- I mean, it's a good 9 education. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think, on the other 11 side of this -- this is something else I learned, and I 12 presume what we were told is true -- that under GASB 34 or 13 39, whatever it is we're doing, a lot of this will become 14 much more apparent. It's going to be very obvious, when the 15 new accounting is in place, that it's going to show where 16 this money's going. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any more questions or 18 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Let's skip down, if we can, 23 to Item Number 14 so we can allow the Sheriff to go back to 24 catching the bad guys if he needs to. Item Number 14 is 25 consider and discuss the renewal of the Kerr County teen 63 1 curfew. As y'all may recall, this curfew was enacted 2 approximately a year ago. Section 4 of the actual order 3 provided in your packet has a sunset of one year, the 4 anniversary of which will be April 1st. If you're willing 5 to continue the curfew in place, we need to take action to 6 extend the order and the curfew. Sheriff, what are your 7 thoughts on this matter, sir? 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Thank goodness, we don't 9 write that many citations actually in violation of the 10 curfew. We do write quite a few warnings and things like 11 that. I think it's been an excellent tool for -- for 12 parents and for law enforcement on controlling a lot of 13 things after the hours of midnight with the kids under 17 14 years of age. It's -- it has really benefitted us. We 15 don't see near as many kids out during those hours, which 16 consequently, I could never say what crime's been saved from 17 happening, but I think it is a crime prevention tool and I'd 18 like to see it continue. And I'd still like to see the City 19 adopt one similar; otherwise, we're going to keep pushing 20 the kids back in the city. 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any questions or comments? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'd just like to point 23 out, as per the court order that's in our -- the original 24 court order that's in our packet, that I voted against it, 25 and I will again today, due to the fact it still doesn't 64 1 make any sense to me that the City of Kerrville does not 2 have any kind of ordinance, whereas out in the county we do. 3 It just doesn't -- it doesn't make sense to do the county 4 and not do the city. I mean, if the City was to go along 5 with it and put something into place, then -- then I think 6 my mind would be changed. But it just -- we're just pushing 7 kids around. We're doing nothing -- we're doing nothing 8 with this thing, in my opinion. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I think we're doing a 10 lot. The City of Ingram does have one in place, and that's 11 where we mainly -- you know, City of Kerrville also has, you 12 know, a lot more officers on the streets than the County and 13 City of Ingram can afford during those hours, which it does 14 help in that. And, being perfectly honest, being a parent 15 of a 16-year-old, you know, it does help the parents, in my 16 opinion, when you tell the kid you have to be in before 17 midnight or anything else, 'cause it is a curfew violation. 18 It is a law violation. I think that has helped a lot, you 19 know. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I tell my kid to be in 21 before midnight because he needs to be in before midnight. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I agree. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You know, that's 24 bottom line. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If I could make a 65 1 comment, I'm sure some of you have -- I originally voted 2 against it, was pretty outspoken against it. I still don't 3 like it. I know the Sheriff likes it from a law enforcement 4 standpoint, but I still am not in favor of a curfew. 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: At the time we adopted 6 the -- the original order, there was a very impassioned plea 7 by a group from my precinct, my constituents, Wayne Este and 8 others, and I thought that their arguments were very good in 9 favor of that at that time, and I still do. So, I will vote 10 in favor of extending the order. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You consider it a 12 useful tool? Did I hear you correctly? 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes, I do. Like I said, 14 we don't write very many citations, thank goodness, at all. 15 But I think it has been a useful tool, and most of the 16 businesses that get affected by it during the summer; 17 namely, like Crider's or places like that, we've had a few 18 little bumps in the road with them, but most of them have 19 now gotten to where what they do is, they announce it at 20 each one of their -- their dances and rodeos, that this is 21 the curfew, and they've really been helpful with us in 22 enforcing it. 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Works well. 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Do I have a motion to extend 66 1 the curfew? 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So moved. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 5 Griffin, second by Commissioner Williams, that the Court 6 extend the Kerr County teen curfew. Any other questions or 7 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 8 (Commissioners Williams and Griffin voted in favor of the motion.) 9 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 11 (Commissioners Baldwin and Letz voted against the motion.) 12 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: County Judge votes aye. 14 Motion carries. That takes me up to six, guys. What's the 15 deal here? Okay. Let's return to the regular order. I 16 think we can take up Item Number 9; then we'll take our 17 break. Item Number 9, consider and discuss setting a date 18 and time for joint workshop with U.G.R.A. Board members to 19 discuss Kerr County Comprehensive Colonia Infrastructure 20 Study and Plan. Commissioner Williams. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Judge. 22 I'm passing out to you -- and one for the clerk, and here's 23 one for Kathy and here's one for the press, if they want 24 copies. This is a copy of a draft of -- of the 25 Comprehensive Plan which is currently being worked on. As 67 1 you know, we've received a grant from the State for about 2 $90,000, I believe. The Grantworks people have done the 3 mapping and are developing this particular plan, and what we 4 need to do is have an opportunity to go over it, let them 5 make the presentation, make any final corrections and so 6 forth on the maps. I gave Commissioner Baldwin a stack of 7 maps, almost blew his mind. Have you done your homework 8 yet, Commissioner? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir, but you 10 can't have them back yet. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. But, anyhow, 12 what I'd like do is set a date from that workshop and a 13 close examination of the draft and of the maps. We'll come 14 up with a capital improvement schedule, and it will identify 15 those very areas in Kerr County that are under -- that have 16 infrastructure needs and housing needs. And the capital -- 17 the capital improvement schedule would be one that we could 18 work with to find the grant moneys out there to be able to 19 do some of these things. So, the suggested dates that would 20 be in conjunction with the U.G.R.A. -- I think their board 21 indicated that whatever date we selected was suitable with 22 them. We're suggesting April 9th or 10th at 3 p.m. in the 23 afternoon, and it's up to the Court at this point. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What days of the week are 25 those? 68 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tuesday and Wednesday. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Tuesday and 3 Wednesday. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: April 10th, I will not 5 be able to attend. 6 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I definitely would not 7 be able to attend on the 10th. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Nor will I, the 9th or the 9 10th. 10 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I'll have a little 11 trouble on the 9th. What time? 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 3 o'clock in the 13 afternoon. 14 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I'll be in Austin. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, the 9th would be 16 suitable? 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: I won't be here. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. Judge, I would 19 move, then, that we set the date of April 9th at 3 p.m. for 20 a joint workshop with the Upper Guadalupe River Authority 21 Board of Directors to discuss the Kerr County Comprehensive 22 Colonia Infrastructure Study and Plan. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, I hear a no 24 here and a maybe here. I think it's too important; I think 25 we need to have the full Court present. 69 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, it would be 2 nice if we did, but if we just keep -- we've got to get it 3 done. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I -- 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: What if we had it the 22nd, 6 which is our second April court date? Do you think that's 7 too late, or -- 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No. If that works 9 for everybody, we can do it then. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: We're already committed to 11 court on that date. Let's do it that afternoon. 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That would be perfect. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would amend it to 14 the 22nd. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 3 o'clock? 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 18 Williams, second by Commissioner Letz, that the Court have a 19 workshop jointly with U.G.R.A. Board to discuss the Kerr 20 County Comprehensive Colonia Infrastructure Study and Plan 21 at 3 o'clock p.m. on Monday, April 22nd, Year 2002. At the 22 U.G.R.A.? 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, big classroom. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: At the classroom at the 25 U.G.R.A. building, 125 Lehmann. Any other questions or 70 1 comments? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have a comment. 3 Just -- this is one of those things that -- that we -- that 4 we get involved in and don't have any questions about it, 5 and we throw -- we begin to throw the word "colonia" around 6 pretty heavy. And I think maybe there's public -- 'cause I 7 know the first few times I heard it, I was real 8 uncomfortable with that word being in our county, but I 9 think as we go along, we may want to bring that up and talk 10 about what the -- the criteria is for being a colonia. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which I think we can. 12 I agree, it's a good point, Commissioner. I think a lot of 13 that is embodied in this document that I handed out to you, 14 and this has to do with infrastructure and substandard 15 housing. And, suffice to it say, we have a good bit of that 16 scattered around in pockets throughout the county. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Any other questions or 18 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge? 24 (Discussion off the record.) 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. We've had a request to 71 1 take up Item Number 10 before we take our break. Consider 2 and discuss County appointments to the Kerrville/Kerr County 3 Joint Airport Advisory Board. And the terms of the current 4 appointees expire March 26th, Year 2002. Commissioner 5 Williams? 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, I put this on 7 the agenda because we were in receipt of communication from 8 the City of Kerrville, over the signature of Megan Caffall, 9 who is the Airport Manager, that two of the appointments -- 10 County appointments expire tomorrow, as a matter of fact. I 11 share some of the concerns that have been expressed to me 12 from other Commissioners about the manner in which the 13 memorandum came down, sort of presupposing that we may want 14 to appoint the same people who have currently -- who 15 currently hold those jobs. And, without casting any 16 aspersion on the quality of their representation -- they've 17 done an excellent job, making the most of the meetings; 18 Ms. Priest, who's the president of that board, can attest to 19 that -- I think we do have an obligation to find out who all 20 may be out there in Kerr County that may be interested in 21 serving on that board. The airport is a major part of our 22 infrastructure and serves a vital need for this community. 23 I personally know of two other individuals who have 24 expressed an interest in serving on that board. So, what 25 I'd like to suggest is, rather than reappoint or appoint any 72 1 particular members that I -- names that I might throw out or 2 Commissioner Griffin might throw out, I think I'd like to 3 take a page out of the City's book in which we let the 4 public know that there are two positions on a very important 5 advisory board available, and if they have a desire to 6 participate and be considered, that they let us know of that 7 desire, and we'll go from there and set a date for doing 8 that about one month out from now. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that a motion? 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That would be in the 11 form of a lengthy motion. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want to hear Fred 13 repeat it. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll second the motion, 15 and just make a comment that I think that we need to -- it 16 is a very important board, and I think we need to open it up 17 to the public and get to know our appointees, whoever they 18 may be, and have them come in, talk to us. Or whoever wants 19 to be on that board, have them come in, talk to us, and 20 we'll make a selection. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which, I might add, 22 would not preclude the current board members from asking the 23 Court to reconsider their -- re-upping them for another 24 term. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sure, I agree. 73 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Sounds like a good 2 idea, and I would echo what Commissioner Williams said. The 3 current appointees have done a fantastic job. They show up, 4 and they know what they're talking about when it comes to 5 airport business. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Ms. Priest, can you tell 7 us real quickly, how long has Dr. Davis been on? Do you 8 recall? 9 MS. PRIEST: Over 10 years. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Over 10 years. How about 11 Mr. Miller? 12 MS. PRIEST: Pardon? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mr. Miller, how long has 14 he been -- 15 MS. PRIEST: Less. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Less? 17 MS. PRIEST: Yes. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 19 MS. PRIEST: I think Dr. Davis went on about 20 '87 or '88, around in there. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, thank you. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: We have a motion by 23 Commissioner Williams, second by Commissioner Letz, that the 24 Court accept expressions of interest from individuals to 25 serve as the County appointees to the Kerrville/Kerr County 74 1 Joint Airport Advisory Board, with such expressions of 2 interest to be received not later than April 17th, to be 3 considered at our meeting on April 22nd. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, will we ask 5 them to submit a request in writing to the Commissioners 6 Court office? Or -- 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: I think that's up to the -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do you want to give 9 them Bill's home number or what? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we should do it, 11 and I think that probably we should -- since this is a 12 little bit different than we've done in the past, I think we 13 should authorize the Judge or someone to write those two a 14 letter asking them, if they are interested, to resubmit 15 their names. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Do we want the expressions of 17 interest to be submitted in writing? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's part of the motion. 20 Any other questions or comments? If not, all in favor, 21 raise your right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Okay. At 75 1 this time, let's take a break and return at a quarter till 2 11:00. 3 (Recess taken from 10:30 a.m. to 10:45 a.m.) 4 - - - - - - - - - - 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Let's resume the regular 6 special meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court. 7 Next item for consideration is Item Number 11, consider and 8 discuss revisions to the Kerr County Subdivision Rules and 9 Regulations, Water Availability Requirements, and routing 10 slips, and set a public hearing for the same. Commissioner 11 Letz. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I've spent quite a 13 bit of time in the past couple months, since I first brought 14 this back, kind of going through the rules again and trying 15 to come up with some revisions that I think kind of meet the 16 spirit of what we talked about originally, which is mainly 17 the revision of plat area, but going through documents, I 18 also found a couple of other things I had questions about or 19 errors that we had or typos or things of that nature. So, 20 what I think we'll do is just go through it, the handout 21 that everyone has in their packet. It starts out with the 22 Section II definitions, and the first item here is a 23 definition of "Authorized Agent," and I'm not sure that's 24 the definition we need in here for this. I've asked Truby 25 to do a word search on "authorized agent" in a document, 76 1 because if we're only using that relating to septic, I think 2 we ought to narrow this, I mean, really look at the 3 definition to make sure it applies. That has not been done 4 yet. But, anyway, we're looking at that, and that's 5 something that we're working on. On page -- second page of 6 the handout, on Page 19, there was just a typo in the 7 previous version. It should be "6.02.C.3." As I recall, we 8 had "6.03," I believe. Just a typo on that one; I think 9 it's been corrected. 10 The main changes that -- that are in the rest 11 of the packet relate back to revision of plat or minor 12 plats. And what I've done, I've gone through the 13 agreement -- or the document, and we're trying to come up 14 with a -- a way to do a minor plat that's in compliance with 15 state law, and easier on landowners, property owners, and 16 developers. And, basically, if you're in a subdivision, on 17 new plats, if you're less than four lots, you can combine 18 the preliminary plat and final plat in one meeting to the 19 court. But, you -- you know, that's just the way it's done. 20 It's basically -- you're doing it at one time. If it's a 21 revision, you still have to do the public hearing, which is 22 required by state law. However, it could also -- if it's 23 less than -- if you're revising less than four lots, you can 24 come to the court at one time, but you still would have to 25 have a public hearing there. The language in here hopefully 77 1 accomplishes that. And the other area that I made some 2 changes is -- and it's really probably easier to go to 3 Appendix B, if everyone has a copy of that. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: What page number? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's a separate stapled 6 area. 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Okay, got it. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And a number of our 9 certifications that are on the plat I looked at, and a lot 10 of these, I've had some feedback from those that sign off on 11 them, and others I have not heard back from, but we were 12 having things -- or were asking things be certified that I 13 didn't think were proper. As an example, with the 14 Designated Representative for O.S.S.F., during the interim 15 we changed our rules a little bit on O.S.S.F., and the state 16 law changed a little bit too, so we tried to come up with 17 something a little bit different there. That's under Item 18 2, Certification by Administrator of On-Site Sewage 19 Facilities. And I put a note on here; I said, "This 20 certification is only required if any lot in the subdivision 21 is less than 2 acres." It didn't make sense to me, and 22 doesn't make sense to me, to require our Designated 23 Representative to review every plat. It is clear that in 24 a -- in a place that we're going to put a plat note, or 25 recommended we put a plat note that goes on every plat, that 78 1 just says pretty much, "You're going to have to comply with 2 county O.S.S.F. rules at the time you make any improvements 3 on the lot," and only are asking the Designated 4 Representative to look at the plat if it's less than 5 2 acres. That's an arbitrary number. It could be 3, it 6 could be 1, it could be -- could be 5. But it seems to me 7 that you're -- if you're at least 2 acres, there is a way to 8 put a licensed septic system on that lot. 9 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: You're talking about 10 in a case you know where there's -- there is unimproved 11 property in the subdivision? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 13 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Okay. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: But they would still have to 15 go through the process. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Doesn't change anything. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: All it is, is we're talking 18 about a certification on a plat. 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: On a plat. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: We're not talking about the 21 actual -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It means that if you're 23 on a 5-acre lot and you're going to have a septic, there's 24 no reason to ask, in this case, Stuart Barron to go out and 25 look at it. I mean, 5 acres, they're going to be able to do 79 1 something. It may be an aerobic system; it may be 2 expensive, may not be a conventional system, but there's 3 something that could be done if you choose to build a home 4 out there. That bridge would be crossed at that time that 5 they decide to make the improvement. So, basically, we're 6 speeding up the process. Most -- or a majority of the plats 7 would not have to go through the Designated Representative 8 for certification. On the one before that on the packet, I 9 got kind of got -- on the Certifications by Registered 10 Professional Land Surveyor, I deleted the language related 11 to the floodplain, 'cause it didn't make any sense to me to 12 have the surveyor talk about floodplain and the floodplain 13 representative talking about floodplains. So, I put it all 14 where the County has the responsibility and the control, 15 under Floodplain Administrator. 16 Under Headwaters, Certification Number 3, the 17 current certification somehow says that -- or I wrote it, so 18 I should know this, but it says that the certification is 19 that the person -- or the plat is going to abide by 20 Headwaters' rules, which doesn't make any sense. All we're 21 asking Headwaters to certify on the plat is that they're in 22 compliance with water availability, and would narrow the 23 scope down to that very specific item, so that they will 24 only look at it -- and that determination, whether it goes 25 to Headwaters at all, will be made by the County Engineer. 80 1 So, all plats will not be going through Headwaters. The 2 County Engineer will look at it and decide if it needs that 3 certification or not. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: I thought that the developer 5 had the option of either having their engineer certify the 6 water availability, or sending it to Headwaters. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I think that can 8 still happen, but some of them don't need to go there at 9 all. I mean, right now every plat has to go through 10 Headwaters. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Yeah, right. I mean, like, a 12 community water system -- 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sure. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- that already existed. 15 There's no need for it to go to Headwaters at all. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. Or if it's -- 17 lots are all less -- greater than 10 acres, it's exempt from 18 Water Availability Requirements. Therefore, Franklin just 19 says no, it doesn't have to go there on the routing slip. 20 So, it's going to put a little bit more work on Road and 21 Bridge to say on the routing slip where they have to go. 22 MR. JOHNSTON: Whatever meets one of their 23 exceptions, we can just eliminate them? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, eliminate them from 25 the routing slip. Then the other one is Certification 81 1 Number 5, which is 911, and it's a -- it just really narrows 2 the scope of this work a little bit. It says that 911 3 certifies that the name -- the subdivision name and the road 4 name meets guidelines. There was some other language about 5 addressing and a bunch of other stuff in their 6 certification. To me, that was not applicable either. So, 7 these are the provisions, or the appendix changes. 8 And then, to go through them before we 9 discuss them, under Water Availability, which is the last 10 handout, there was -- there was basically, I would say, not 11 a typo, but just an incorrect way of looking at it. Under 12 1.04, Public or Community Water Systems, it was previously 13 worded 16 or more, or more than 16 -- more than 15 and less 14 than 15. Basically, we eliminated 15. If you had 15 15 connections, you weren't subject to anything. So, we 16 modified the language to 16 or more, 16 or less. And also, 17 Headwaters' name has changed since we did these, and we're 18 going through and making all the changes to "Headwaters 19 Groundwater Conservation District," as opposed to 20 "Headwaters Underground Water Conservation District." Those 21 are the changes. 22 Where I think we -- you know, recommend we go 23 from that now is, if the Court is agreeable to this, I'll 24 get with Road and Bridge and Truby and we'll get a draft 25 document complete with all the changes put together, and 82 1 then make it available to the public within, you know, 2 plenty of time for the public hearing. Set the public 3 hearing for the first meeting in May. That will give Truby 4 and I a week to get it -- to get copies to the County 5 Clerk's office and anywhere else. Any questions? 6 MR. JOHNSTON: I had a question about the 7 minor replat revision, if it requires a public hearing. You 8 say it only has to come once. Doesn't it have to come once, 9 request a public hearing, and then come and do the -- 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It would have to come to 11 get -- I think Road and Bridge would have to set the public 12 hearing. It wouldn't be a preliminary plat. The -- all 13 we're doing is saying you don't have to come for a 14 preliminary plat and a final plat. 15 MR. JOHNSTON: They won't have to submit 16 their plat to get the public hearing, so we can see what 17 they're doing? Almost a two-step thing. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. But they -- they'd 19 have to submit it early, but it would just be still one -- 20 MR. JOHNSTON: One time, and they actually do 21 the -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: One time the developer 23 would actually have to come, I think, or the -- you know, 24 their representative. But it would take -- you're correct. 25 And I may go back to -- does it read that way right now? Is 83 1 that clear? Or should we change it, do you think, the 2 language? 3 MR. JOHNSTON: I'd have to go back and reread 4 it. I was just going by what you were saying. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, if we need to make 6 that a little bit clearer, I can do that with Truby when we 7 prepare the final draft. Commissioner Williams? 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Commissioner, on 9 Number 5, Certification by Kerr 911, "I hereby certify that 10 the subdivision name platted hereon and road names hereon 11 are in compliance with Kerr 911 guidelines according to..." 12 blah, blah, blah. Is that sufficient? Or do we need to 13 mention a separate item and say, "and are not duplicates of 14 any other names in Kerr County," or do you think that's 15 sufficient to get the job done? 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: If they're in 17 compliance with the guidelines, then they are not 18 duplicates. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, fine. That's 20 the thrust of my question. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I also think there's -- 22 and the issue on that, the fact that, I mean, they may not 23 -- you know, may choose not to sign it because of a 24 duplicate issue or a name, and if the developer and Road and 25 Bridge wants, they can bring it to the court and we can 84 1 still -- you know, there's some roads that are -- situations 2 that could come up and the plat could get approved without 3 that certification on it, because I don't think that 911 can 4 hold up a plat. It's more of a notice to us that, you know, 5 that they're in -- the guidelines are in compliance. But we 6 still have a choice on road names. I don't see that 7 happening, but it could. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: On Number 3 on Page 9 4, it has to do with test well. B, test well should be 10 "well," not "will." And you might want to think about 11 changing "will be" to "is." Test well "is" required. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, on that item, again, 13 the trigger is not the test well. The trigger is whether 14 the developer has their own engineer that's going to give us 15 a water availability certification, or whether the developer 16 is referring the issue to Headwaters for their 17 determination. So, it's really -- it's not whether a test 18 well will be required -- shall be required. It's whether, 19 under Section 1.05.2.B, the developer has requested 20 Headwaters to certify its water availability. 1.05.2.A is a 21 situation where the developer's engineer himself provides 22 the certification of the water availability. 1.05.2.B is a 23 situation where the developer does not have an engineer, or 24 the engineer is unwilling to give the certification, and so 25 it's referred to the Headwaters, which really are limited 85 1 situations where not -- not that test wells have been 2 performed, but the developer does not have the engineer's 3 certification. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But under 1.05.2.A, 5 Headwaters still -- under the Water Availability 6 Requirements, they still look at the data submitted by the 7 -- the developer and look at -- we never look at that data. 8 So, either -- on Section 1.0 -- 1.05, either way, Headwaters 9 certifies that they received that information. 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's not the way it's 11 written. 1.05.2 says, In addition to test results required 12 above, submit to Commissioners Court either a certificate 13 from a Registered Professional Engineer or a letter from 14 Headwaters. Now, it's true that Headwaters gets all the 15 test data, but that's for the purpose of Headwaters' 16 database, so that they'll have more testing data information 17 on wells so that they can build a better database so that 18 they can do a better job of scoping the aquifer. The second 19 is really designed so that the developer is not tied into 20 Headwaters' certification, so that the developer has the 21 option of hiring a private engineer who will take the test 22 results and certify those results as far as water 23 availability. Now, if that's not where we want to be, then 24 we need to look at changing the whole intent of that, but 25 that's the way that it was written up in the first place. 86 1 Headwaters gets all the data. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: But that's for purposes of 4 their database. They only provide a certification if the 5 developer does not have an engineer or, as you pointed out, 6 if it's a community water system with less than -- 16 or 7 fewer -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Connections. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- connections. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But, without going back 11 and rereading the whole thing, when it is deemed that the 12 well is sufficient if it has a certain minimum flow -- if it 13 meets the flow criteria, and doesn't Headwaters -- they look 14 at that to -- to check that out? We never look at that 15 information, so Headwaters -- 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, that's -- that's what 17 I'm saying. We get a certification from one of two sources, 18 a Registered Professional Engineer who gives us a 19 certificate saying, I've done -- we've done the test, here 20 are the test results, and in my opinion, there is adequate 21 water. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mm-hmm. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Or the test results are 24 provided to Headwaters, and Headwaters provides us with a 25 letter which says, Based on the test results, it's our 87 1 opinion that there's adequate water. It comes -- can come 2 from one of two different directions, and the whole intent 3 of that was so that the developer had an alternative to 4 Headwaters. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We may need to -- I mean, 6 I agree with it, but I'm wondering -- the question comes in 7 now is that it seems that it is best for us and for 8 Headwaters that, if they're going to -- the developer's 9 going to rely on a third-party engineer, not -- not relying 10 on Headwaters, that we still want that letter to go to 11 Headwaters and at least acknowledge that Headwaters has 12 received the letter. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Yeah, we could -- we can 14 require that the developer give -- that the engineer provide 15 a copy of the certificate to Headwaters. I don't know if we 16 want to allow Headwaters to come in and challenge the 17 certificate or not. But the whole -- I mean, again, the way 18 it was created was really -- there were two needs; one for 19 Headwaters to get the data, 'cause we all know that the 20 Trinity Aquifer is an understudied aquifer, and they need 21 all the data they can get. Secondly, to allow the developer 22 to have two alternative routes; a private engineer who's 23 putting his Registered Professional Engineer's license at 24 risk, or the Headwaters, in the event the engineer wasn't 25 available or wasn't willing. 88 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I still think that we 2 would want the -- the data -- we want the data to get -- 3 well, Headwaters should then certify that this data -- 4 they've received the data. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Yeah, we can do that. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That -- 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Say that again. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Certify that -- 9 Headwaters certifies that they have received the data, and 10 that they're being asked to -- and as long as we're saying 11 that in 1.05, which I think we do right now, that they would 12 receive the data, then we can just refer to Section 1.05 and 13 say that they're -- that the developer is in compliance. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay, I see where you're 15 headed. That they're in compliance, in the sense that 16 they've either -- 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: They've done one or 18 the other. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: They've received the data, 20 or -- 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Or -- 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: -- from a private engineer, 23 along with the certification, or that the Headwaters has 24 reviewed the raw test well data and made a determination 25 that there is adequate water. 89 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay, I follow that. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's what I was -- 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sorry I wasn't clear as 6 to where my mind was. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: This is something we've 8 chewed on now for two years. Why should we be clear about 9 it? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So -- but the 11 certification, then, would say -- well, instead of -- I 12 mean, I agree with you that we should delete the language 13 about test well, and say that the development is in 14 compliance with Section 1.05. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's good. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: All right. Does that make 18 you feel better, Commissioner? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I feel a lot 20 better. 21 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Jonathan, could we 22 back up a minute to Page 23, as it is in the book? Under 23 Section 6.03, the highlighted portion that you have there. 24 In the paragraph that's in quotes, that says that the 25 following plat note -- 90 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: -- will take place. 3 And this goes back to your question about an authorized 4 agent; is that the correct definition. I think the short 5 answer to that is no, it's not the correct definition if it 6 only applies to O.S.S.F. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Because we, the Court, 9 are the authorized agent, T.N.R.C.C. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 11 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So I have -- I would 12 strike "Authorized Agent for," and after O.S.S.F., strike 13 "or its." I'll read the whole thing in a minute. And then, 14 approved -- at the end of that statement, "approved by the 15 Authorized Agent," I would say "adopted by Kerr County." So 16 that it would read now, "Prior to construction of any lot, 17 the owner of said lot shall contact the Kerr County O.S.S.F. 18 Designated Representative to determine if the proposed 19 improvements will meet the exemption criteria. All lots in 20 the subdivision are required to comply with all current and 21 future O.S.S.F. regulations adopted by Kerr County," is the 22 way that would then read. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And the next paragraph 25 down there, Headwaters' name didn't get changed. 91 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: So that needs to be 3 corrected. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Stuart, does this work 5 from -- with you? I mean, I tried to take the language that 6 you gave me and then make it fit. 7 MR. BARRON: The way -- what he just read 8 there sounded good to me. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 10 MR. BARRON: I didn't get a copy of it, so -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, if you have a 12 comment, you have time to comment. You can look at it, if 13 you would, and get it back to me later this week before we 14 get the final draft. I really -- on that language, I worked 15 with Stuart to try to get -- 16 MR. BARRON: Could you e-mail me a copy of 17 that so I can have a copy of it on -- or get me one? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We'll give you one. I'm 19 trying -- I haven't figured out how you take a page out of a 20 document and then send that one page only on e-mail. I'm 21 not that sophisticated yet. 22 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Easier to create a new 23 document with just that page. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, no, I didn't e-mail 25 it to you. Not that I didn't want to; I just couldn't 92 1 figure out how to do it. 2 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any other questions? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Any other questions? 4 MR. BARRON: I'd like to make one comment, if 5 I could. I know y'all -- we've proposed to shrink the size 6 of the acreages down to an acre or 5 acres, and it may be 7 easier for the public to understand, since we have a 10-acre 8 exemption, if it's anything under 10 acres, then it goes 9 through the platting process at U.G.R.A. And it will just 10 be for the simple -- for the public, to make it easier for 11 them, instead of if we're in a subdivision scenario, we're 12 at 2 acres. Then we don't have to bring it to the 13 Authorized Agent -- or the Designated Representative. And 14 if we're not, if we have more than 10 acres, we don't have 15 to get permitted at all, just to make it easy for the public 16 to understand. If we have more than 10 acres, we don't have 17 to do this, this, and this. If we have less than 10 acres, 18 we have to. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We could put that on the 20 plat note that -- I mean, I wouldn't have a problem with 21 putting it on the plat note, saying that you're exempt if 22 it's over 10 acres. Only problem then comes that if we 23 change -- if the rules change from T.N.R.C.C. at some point, 24 then we need to make sure we change that plat note at that 25 same time. 93 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And if we just say, you 3 know, that you've got to meet -- before you do any 4 improvements, you have to be in compliance with the rules, 5 we're covered no matter what. That's the reason I did it 6 that way, but I don't have a problem with saying that, you 7 know, if you're over 10 acres, you're exempt from the 8 O.S.S.F. rules. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: I agree with you, because 10 we'd have to be more specific than that. 11 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Permit, not the rules. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: We'd have to be more 13 specific. I mean, we'd have to say that, A., O.S.S.F. -- 14 one O.S.S.F. system serving one residence on a lot greater 15 than 10 acres, 10 acres or greater. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: So I prefer to do it the way 18 you've set it out. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's safer for 20 the County and for the pubic to know, when they're getting 21 ready to do improvements, they need to check with the -- our 22 Designated Representative, whoever that is, to, you know, 23 find out if they have to do anything or not, and then they 24 can be told they're exempt or not exempt at that time. 25 MR. BARRON: And one other comment about the 94 1 floodplain. I think what we had the surveyor certifying 2 there, actually out on the ground certifying, taking their 3 metes and bounds measurements to see if it does meet the -- 4 or if it's inside a floodplain. When we get a map, I don't 5 know if y'all -- I'm sure y'all have looked at FEMA's maps, 6 but they're really hard to interpret where they're at with 7 the little portion that we get on a scale from the surveyor. 8 So, it may be -- I go back and I look and determine where it 9 is, but if they're looking at metes and bounds and 10 determining if it is or isn't, then we can make them certify 11 what they need to show on there. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's still 13 covered. I thought about this when I rewrote it, but we 14 didn't change anything about, you know, the floodplain being 15 designated on the map or the BFE's and all the other 16 language in the other documents. All we changed was the 17 certification, and the surveyors are already certifying that 18 the data on the plat is correct, whether that includes a BFE 19 or not. All we're saying is that everything that -- on the 20 plat is already being certified by them, but they're not 21 being asked to pick the BFE and all that. That's -- you can 22 tell them they have to do it before they -- you're going to 23 get the plat through -- or, I mean, it's got done on the 24 plat somewhere, how they do it. 25 MR. BARRON: I think the only ones that they 95 1 really certify is that if they -- they were not inside a 2 floodplain situation, they certify that it was not in a 3 floodplain, give the map and date, on the ones that I've 4 seen. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. And we talked 6 about that, and the Judge brought up a point here; that it's 7 probably better to have the Floodplain Administrator certify 8 it's not in the floodplain, since we're responsible for the 9 program, as opposed to have the surveyor certify it's not in 10 the floodplain. And it means that you're going -- you may 11 have to look at more plats, I mean, since you wear that hat 12 as well. Every plat's going to have to come through the 13 Floodplain Administrator, and I think that's, you know, 14 probably good. I think that is really -- it should be the 15 administrator's responsibility more than the surveyor's 16 responsibility. 17 MR. BARRON: Okay. 18 JUDGE HENNEKE: Thanks, Stuart. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And if the surveyors -- 20 you know, people object to that, tell them to come to the 21 public hearing and let us know, and we can -- there may be a 22 reason to do it the other way. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any other questions or 24 comments? If not, I'd entertain a motion to approve the 25 revisions to the Kerr County Subdivision Rules and 96 1 Regulations and Water Availability Requirements, routing 2 slips, and set a public hearing for -- let's make it 3 11 o'clock in the morning on May the 13th, Year 2002. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 5 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Second. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Those changes will 7 incorporate the changes that we discussed today. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner Letz, 9 second by Commissioner Griffin, that the Court approve the 10 revisions to the Kerr County Subdivision Rules and 11 regulations, the Kerr County Water Availability 12 Requirements, and routing slips, as amended today, and set a 13 public hearing for the same on Monday, May the 13th, Year 14 2002, at 11 o'clock a.m., here in the Kerr County 15 Commissioners Courtroom. Any other questions or comments? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: A comment. I will 17 have -- a copy will be with the County Clerk by next Monday. 18 That will be the basis for the public hearing. We'll get 19 the changes incorporated by then. 20 JUDGE HENNEKE: If not, all in favor, raise 21 your right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Good work. 97 1 Next item is Item Number 12, consider and discuss referring 2 Court Order Number 27390 to the County Attorney for 3 implementation. Commissioner Griffin. 4 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yes. In your packets 5 there, you have a copy of Court Order 27390 that we did back 6 in January, which authorized me to get with the owner of the 7 building in west Kerr County, where the West Kerr County 8 Annex is in Ingram, to draw up a new lease. The rent, by 9 the way -- or the lease right now is going on a 10 month-to-month basis, in terms of the lease, but that we 11 would up the monthly rate to $450 a month, and multi-year -- 12 in a multi-year contract of some sort, and that I was 13 authorized to negotiate the final details and bring it back 14 to Court for final approval. I have tried repeatedly to get 15 hold of the owner, and have been unsuccessful. I've left 16 notes, I've left phone calls, voice mail messages, messages 17 with some of the folks in his offices. I can not get a 18 response. So, since there is a legal obligation here, I'm 19 going to recommend that we request the County Attorney try 20 to get in touch through the proper channels with the owner, 21 and let's see where we can go with renewing the lease. And 22 I'll make a motion that to that effect. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 25 Griffin, second by Commissioner Baldwin, that the Court 98 1 refer implementation of Court Order Number 27390 regarding 2 renewal of the lease for the West Kerr County Annex to the 3 County attorney for action. Any other questions or 4 comments? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If I remember 6 correctly, he's the one that was nervous about getting the 7 new contract going. 8 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the new numbers 10 going. 11 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: And the $50 bump. I 12 think they called you first. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Called me first. 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: Number one. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's right. 16 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any other questions or 17 comments? If not, all in favor, raise your right hand. 18 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: All opposed, same sign. 20 (No response.) 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Next item is 22 Item Number 13, consider and discuss amending Court Order 23 Number 27080, adopting rules of Kerr County, Texas, for 24 On-Site Sewage Facility, to delete the reference to adoption 25 of the Kerr County On-Site Sewage Facility program 99 1 procedures for real estate transfers. Commissioner Griffin. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yes. Let me say up 3 top that this amendment to that order that's being proposed 4 in no way changes the O.S.S.F. rules or the real estate 5 transfer inspection. It only changes the way that the rule 6 is implemented procedurally. I got a call from Ken Graber 7 at T.N.R.C.C., and he said that, in reviewing our last 8 order, we had tied two orders together; the one that has our 9 basic O.S.S.F. rule, and then this other order where we had 10 laid out some procedures to be followed in the real estate 11 transfer inspection. They don't have any problem with that, 12 except for the fact that if we're going to tie those two 13 orders together, this order that had to do with the real 14 estate transfer procedures would have to be an integral part 15 of our rule, which we don't want to do. So, procedurally, 16 if we will just amend the Order Number 27080 to delete the 17 reference to the program procedures for the real estate 18 transfers, then the order's right, T.N.R.C.C. legal is 19 happy, and we've got a clean order. Doesn't change 20 anything, as far as what we do. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do we need to create a 22 new order for the real estate language, though? 23 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: No, we've already got 24 one. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 100 1 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: But it's just that we 2 don't tie them together in our order that implements our 3 rule. That's the only thing we're doing. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm hip. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: What specifically do we need 6 to amend? Do you -- is the language -- 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: I would make a motion 8 that we amend Court Order 27080 to delete the reference to 9 adoption of the Kerr County On-Site Sewage Facility program 10 procedures for real estate transfers. I don't have that 11 number, but -- that's the order, 27079. So, we would -- we 12 would just delete the reference to 27079. 13 JUDGE HENNEKE: Do I have a second? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion by Commissioner 16 Griffin, second by Commissioner Letz, that the Court amend 17 Order Number 27080 to delete any reference therein to Order 18 Number 27079. Any questions or comments? If not, all in 19 favor, raise your right hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE HENNEKE: Opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Motion carries. Okay. The 24 last item for discussion today is Item Number 15, consider 25 and discuss executing and delivering to City of Ingram a 101 1 quitclaim deed covering the old Ingram Bridge. If I can, 2 Commissioner Griffin, let me set the table on this. We're 3 talking about the old Indian Creek Bridge. This was a 4 structure that was built in the 1930's by the W.P.A. It was 5 used for decades by TexDOT as the road across Indian Creek 6 there. When TexDOT built the new crossing, they abandoned 7 the use of what is commonly known as Indian Creek Bridge. 8 Kerr County has no record of any ownership interest in this 9 structure. Road and Bridge has reviewed its records. 10 There's no indication that this structure ever accrued to 11 the ownership of Kerr County. It's -- I believe it's not 12 covered on our insurance. We don't maintain it. It's not 13 ours legally, to the extent that anyone can figure out. I 14 have indicated that I thought the Court would be willing to 15 entertain a request from the City of Ingram that we would 16 quitclaim to the City of Ingram whatever interest we have in 17 that structure so that they might have it and continue the 18 benefits to be derived from it. It's never been discussed 19 in court before; this is the first time it's ever officially 20 come to court. You have in your packet a letter from Mayor 21 Schlabach requesting that the Commissioners Court formally 22 consider the issue of transferring whatever interest we may 23 have in this structure to the City of Ingram, and so that is 24 where we stand as of today. The mayor is here, as well 25 Danny Edwards, City Attorney. We're prepared to discuss 102 1 this with them and see where we can get. Commissioner 2 Griffin, do you want to add anything? 3 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: The only thing I would 4 add is that, on the maintenance side, the Road and Bridge 5 Department has, on occasion, done repairs to the -- to that 6 flume area, that plate that was in there. There was some 7 grating several times that the County has -- as a health, 8 safety, and welfare issue, has gone in and repaired that so 9 kids can't slide down through there and get trapped in there 10 or something of that sort, and it has been, I understand, 11 most recently repaired with a larger, heavy -- more 12 heavy-duty plate in there so that that -- the chances of 13 falling are much less now than it was before. But that's 14 the only thing I would add to what you just said, Judge. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Any questions or comments 16 from the Commissioners Court? 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Repaired by Road and 18 Bridge? 19 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Road and Bridge 20 Department. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have a question. 22 What about -- what about the issue of the County obtaining 23 property by prescription? By the -- I mean, I guess -- I 24 guess it -- I mean, doesn't it say something like -- Danny's 25 going to know this better than anybody in the room, 103 1 probably, but if the County used and maintained a road on a 2 regular basis for a certain period of time or something like 3 that, it becomes public-owned property by prescription? 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: I'm not sure a political 5 subdivision can acquire property by prescription. I'm not 6 sure. I haven't looked at that section -- 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Right-of-way. 8 Right-of-way, but not ownership. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: I don't think that we ever 10 really maintained the road, 'cause it was a TexDOT -- I 11 mean, up until the time -- my understanding is, up until the 12 time they built the new crossing, it was TexDOT who took 13 care of that particular bridge. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: As a Commissioner out 15 there, I don't recall ever doing anything other than putting 16 those grates over the old -- under the spillway thing. 17 But -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And your question, I 19 think -- but I think it brings up a point, and this would, I 20 think, have to be addressed if there's -- if we do a 21 quitclaim. Or make sure, I guess, that that would cover -- 22 I mean, prescription doesn't transfer ownership. It only 23 transfers maintenance, basically, and use. I mean, other 24 roads that we've acquired by prescription, we never own that 25 land; we just own the road, as I understand. 104 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The right-of-way. 2 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: You have a 3 prescriptive right-of-way. You don't have prescriptive 4 ownership. 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: That still doesn't answer the 6 issue of ownership. 7 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: That's right. That's 8 exactly the point. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, let me ask you 10 this, then. If we don't own something, we can't give it to 11 somebody else. 12 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, but we're not giving it 13 to them. We're giving whatever interest we may have, if 14 any. It's a request situation where we're saying, hey, we 15 don't claim it. We don't have it on our books. As far as 16 we know, it's not ours, but we'll give you whatever claim we 17 might ever have to it. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you looking for a 19 second to that motion? 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How do we deal with 21 the presumed assumption that we're going to maintain it? 22 We've done maintenance in the past. Is there not some 23 presumption that we'll continue? 24 JUDGE HENNEKE: We've done very limited 25 maintenance on a health, safety, and welfare basis. 105 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. There's no 2 need to deal with that? 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: I don't think so. I mean, I 4 guess the County Attorney can advise us of that. But -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The question I had is 6 the -- in the attachments, the -- a bid for concrete work. 7 JUDGE HENNEKE: No. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's not related? I 9 mean, the City's doing that concrete work? 10 JUDGE HENNEKE: No. Danny, do you want to 11 address us now at this time? I think it's appropriate. 12 MR. EDWARDS: Thank you, Judge, 13 Commissioners. The -- the position of the City has been 14 from the -- I'm Danny Edwards, City Attorney for the City of 15 Ingram, Post Office Box 379, Hunt, Texas, 238-4925. Thank 16 you. The position of the City of Ingram has been, from the 17 inception, that we would be happy to accept the quitclaim 18 deed from the County; however, before we would accept it, 19 the bridge would have to be put into a safer condition. And 20 I had a meeting with the County Engineer and Mr. Griffin -- 21 Commissioner Griffin on October the 9th, 2001, and at that 22 time I think we so expressed ourselves to Commissioner 23 Griffin, that we would accept it if it were properly 24 repaired, and Commissioner Griffin indicated that we should 25 all -- pardon me -- make a joint effort to try to find the 106 1 funds to make these repairs. 2 I talked to Commissioner Griffin on the 24th 3 of October, and he indicated that he had found about $3,000 4 in the budget that could be put toward this. That was 5 passed on to the commission -- to the City Council. I 6 talked to him on December the 5th, '01. He said he found 7 $5,000, so I passed that on to the City Council. And we've 8 been looking for funds also, and we really couldn't do much 9 until we knew what the position of the County was to begin 10 with on how much they were willing to contribute, or if they 11 were going to help us with it. And, finally, we -- at the 12 suggestion of Commissioner Griffin, we tried to get bids on 13 this, and we had two or three people show up, and they never 14 gave us a written bid. And we finally got two, and we sent 15 to the Judge on -- I think on the 6th of September, or 12th 16 -- 17th -- 6th of February, a copy of the lowest bid that we 17 had been able to receive. And that was not a bid for the 18 complete work that the City would like to see done to it, 19 but the council did agree that if they would do just that 20 minimum amount, we'd go ahead and take it, and in future 21 budget years try to put budget money into our -- our budget 22 for repairing the dam or bridge on a further basis. But we 23 really don't know how to jump on this until we know what the 24 County's participation in it is going to be, if any. 25 Two things that we needed to have done, which 107 1 we discussed with the County Engineer, was there was a grate 2 that needs some welding on it, but it's -- one of the bars 3 has broken off. It's big enough for a human being to be 4 sucked into it. We thought that could be repaired. And 5 then the surface of it needs to be resurfaced, concrete. We 6 have the same concerns that the County does, and that's to 7 the structure and integrity of it. If you're worried about 8 the structure and integrity of it, we ought to be worried 9 about the structure and integrity of it. So, we're trying 10 to complete some -- have some kind of a compromise as to how 11 we can accomplish what we think is the will of the people of 12 west Kerr County, and that is they don't want that bridge 13 torn out. And, of course, I don't think it's economically 14 feasible to do it; you'd have the biggest study to be done 15 for the EPA, that it would cost us more than it would to 16 rebuild that bridge, probably. So, we're happy to take the 17 bridge, take the responsibility for it if it's put into a -- 18 a structurally sound condition and a safe condition. And 19 we're just looking for cooperative effort -- and I know you 20 are cooperative, and we appreciate it very much -- to see 21 how we can accomplish the -- accomplish that purpose. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: A comment in general, and 23 considering -- and I know very little about this, overall, 24 other than what I just heard today, but my preference would 25 be, if we find some funds, that we give the -- if we're 108 1 getting rid of the ownership of it, if we have any 2 ownership, which we probably don't, I'd rather the City of 3 Ingram do the repairs than us do the repairs. I'd rather 4 give them money and let them -- 'cause that way we're 5 clearly -- you know, we're not going to be responsible. 6 Because, I mean, the money or the cost to repair and to 7 get -- I mean, the liability is pretty high with this. Lots 8 of things that can come up. So, I'd rather let the City do 9 it, as opposed to the County doing the repairs. If, indeed, 10 we can find the funds to do the repairs. 11 MR. EDWARDS: I can't comment any further 12 than say that the mayor will testify, I think, that they -- 13 that the County has repaved that bridge several times. It's 14 been maintained by the County, and I -- I'm sorry, I didn't 15 get it at the time, because it was of no consequence to me, 16 but a young man appeared before our City Council and 17 testified and gave the page and number that there -- that 18 this bridge is mentioned in the City -- in the County 19 Commissioners' minutes about repairs, et cetera, et cetera, 20 way back there. And I didn't write them down because, as I 21 said, at the time it was of no consequence to me; I didn't 22 care. So I don't know what the status is of the ownership 23 in it. He claimed that -- his statement was that the County 24 did own it and the Commissioners Court minutes evidenced 25 that, but I can't give you the page and number, date, time 109 1 or anything. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My view is that -- you 3 know, and then I'll be quiet on the issue -- is that, you 4 know, the bridge is of benefit to the county and the 5 residents of the county, and I think we certainly don't 6 want, you know, the -- it to fall apart. I mean, but 7 it's -- I think it puts us in a little bit of a precarious 8 situation, being able to spend money on it if we don't think 9 we own it. But I think you can do something -- health and 10 safety we can do somewhat, and I think it's a good time to 11 clean it up. 12 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well, as Danny -- and 13 if I might interrupt, as Danny and I, I think, had 14 discussed, and I think I mentioned it to the mayor as well 15 in the letter, is that -- that I think we can jointly go try 16 to find grant moneys also to try to defray all or part of 17 this cost, and we could do that in lock-step, which I think 18 would be good. The -- the issue was -- and when we 19 discussed bids, is that we needed to see how big the 20 enchilada was. Is this a -- is this a $2,000 problem or is 21 it a $25,000 problem? We didn't know. And my suggestion 22 was -- was, hey, the people who do that kind of work ought 23 to be willing to make bids on it, and we'll find out, get an 24 idea of how much that's going to cost, and then we can see 25 what the -- develop a strategy for getting whatever funds, 110 1 if it's from the County coffers, the City coffers, or grant 2 moneys or whatever. And there may be some T.N.R.C.C. money 3 out there, even, in the dam work. And, by the way, I don't 4 think this has been used, quote, as a bridge -- 5 MR. EDWARDS: No. 6 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: -- legally for a long, 7 long time, since the new road -- since the new bridge was 8 built. So, it's really a dam. It's -- and so we need 9 someone who's got expertise in how do you cap a dam? 10 Because it's the top of it that's coming apart. If you try 11 to just pave it, the first flood peels the stuff right, you 12 know, off, and it all ends up down in Kerrville somewhere. 13 So, we need to probably get some -- some good technical 14 expertise on how would you do it. So, I don't know. I 15 think if we get rid of the -- if the County quitclaims its 16 ownership, then I agree with -- with any ownership it may 17 have, which it may have none. But I think, then, that 18 Jonathan's suggestion that -- that we try to support 19 financially and be out of it, as far as the repairs go, and 20 let's let the City handle it so you've got that continuity 21 of how the work was done, who did it, and so it's all under 22 one roof. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Another -- go ahead. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Danny, if you know, 25 the bridge is -- or the dam, whichever it is, combination of 111 1 both, is within the corporate limits of the city of Ingram 2 or the ETJ or not? Both? 3 MR. EDWARDS: No, it's not in the corporate 4 limits, to answer your question. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's in the ETJ? 6 MR. EDWARDS: In the ETJ, but not in the 7 corporate limits. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think we have to 9 deal with what I said earlier, the implied ongoing 10 maintenance that's been mentioned. There is something 11 implied. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that -- and related 13 to that, also, if it's not a road, I don't think Road and 14 Bridge has the authority to do anything on it. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: I don't know. I wonder what 16 authority -- if we have any authority to do anything on it. 17 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: See, that's why 18 that's -- the logic track you keep coming around to is, who 19 owns it, and who should be working on it? And -- and, like 20 I say, the Road and Bridge, on health, safety, and welfare, 21 on that basis has done repairs to those grates. And if -- 22 in fact, I think the latest thing that you mentioned, 23 Danny -- 24 MR. EDWARDS: I don't know if it's been done 25 or not. 112 1 MR. JOHNSTON: It's done. It was done a few 2 days after we talked. 3 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Yeah, it has been 4 done, and so that part of it's solved for now. So the 5 question is, though -- still would come back to, who owns it 6 and how do we get this thing done? Everybody's interested 7 in seeing that it gets done correctly, but there are 8 ownership and liability and maintenance responsibility 9 issues that have to be resolved. 10 MR. EDWARDS: I would suggest -- how do I say 11 this? I would comment to the Court that if I were you, I 12 would not go to T.N.R.C.C. for any assistance in this, 13 because I have talked to T.N.R.C.C., and I know their stand 14 on it, and you wouldn't like their stand if we got to push 15 this issue. So, I -- just get away from T.N.R.C.C. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Once you get into dams 17 with them, you -- you go up three or four levels. 18 MR. EDWARDS: Right. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And it's a whole 20 different world when you start dealing with dams and -- 21 MR. EDWARDS: You're right. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- holding water. 23 MR. EDWARDS: That's a world you want to stay 24 away from. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's correct. 113 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: As a person who permitted 2 probably the last dam in Kerr County, I absolutely amen that 3 one. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tell me again, what 5 is -- where is TexDOT in this thing? Do they own the 6 bridge? I mean, did somebody just say that? To kind of get 7 it out of here, we can do an unfunded mandate to them, order 8 them to fix their problem. 9 JUDGE HENNEKE: Franklin -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Don't send any money. 11 JUDGE HENNEKE: Franklin, what's your 12 understanding on TexDot's position? 13 MR. JOHNSTON: I don't know if TexDOT ever 14 owned it. They made inspections on it when we used it, and 15 when we built the new bridge and -- and, you know, 16 essentially abandoned that, they no longer inspect it. So, 17 I don't think they have ownership in it either. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But it was -- 19 MR. JOHNSTON: I don't think they own those 20 bridges. They do their annual inspections, or semiannual. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But it was a TexDOT road 22 when the -- before they moved the road. 23 MR. JOHNSTON: That was before they moved the 24 road. They don't do it any more. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Indian Creek Road is a 114 1 county road? 2 MR. JOHNSTON: Yes. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Out to the city. And 4 just -- in my mind, I've always considered that bridge a 5 part of -- 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Indian Creek. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- Indian Creek Road. 8 It's just the way I've always looked at it. Does TexDOT own 9 the new bridge? Do they own the new bridge that we bought? 10 MR. JOHNSTON: I don't know if we ever talked 11 about it, who owns it. They -- they paid -- they paid, 12 what, 80 percent and we paid 10? They paid 90 percent, we 13 paid 10. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, actually, the 15 federal people, with our money. 16 MR. JOHNSTON: I don't -- yeah. 17 JUDGE HENNEKE: We paid 100 percent, in other 18 words. 19 MR. JOHNSTON: So they -- 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, we paid 100 21 percent for it, believe me. 22 MR. JOHNSTON: I don't think they issued the 23 contract. They oversaw the construction, but I -- as far as 24 who owns it, I don't know who owns it. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, 20 years down the 115 1 road we're going to be going through the same thing again, 2 or somebody will be. 3 MR. JOHNSTON: I would assume it's a Kerr 4 County bridge. They'll make future -- you know, they make 5 inspections on it, like all the other bridges. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't think -- I mean, 7 if it's just like Hermann Sons Bridge, we're going to own 8 this bridge when it's rebuilt. It sounds like it's the same 9 80/20; the new bridge, anyway. 10 MR. JOHNSTON: As soon as the County assumes 11 ownership after it's built. 12 MR. EDWARDS: Who will maintain the new 13 bridge? 14 MR. JOHNSTON: I've never seen any paper or 15 anything on it. 16 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: We maintain the new 17 bridge; is that correct? 18 MR. JOHNSTON: Yeah, we maintain all the 19 bridges that are on county roads. If -- 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, it's a county road 21 across the river, huh? 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: County road across 23 the state dam. 24 COMMISSIONER GRIFFIN: Well-fed dam. See, 25 that's the -- the issue was here -- I think what got this in 116 1 the predicament that we're in, trying to figure out who owns 2 it, was that it was a W.P.A. project, and the feds did that. 3 And I don't think the feds, back when most of those low 4 government W.P.A. projects, ever transferred much of 5 anything, so it's probably by assumption, and people just -- 6 eventually just did it. I mean, they just took ownership. 7 At this point, I -- I think if we could get the legal minds 8 together and come up with a solution -- and I'll be glad to 9 do whatever I can do as Commissioner from my precinct, 10 and -- but whatever will work is what we ought to try to do, 11 but it's got to be something that everybody can sign up to 12 legally, so I think we've got to have the legal side of this 13 in the equation; we can't just do it off the top of our 14 heads. That's my view. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree a hundred 16 percent. We can't -- I mean, I just don't see us sending a 17 bunch of money somewhere where we really don't have any 18 responsibility. If we have some responsibility; i.e., the 19 grates under there -- I mean, I think we ought to not drive 20 out there. We ought to get the police to drive us out there 21 to get that fixed. 22 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's been fixed. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand that. 24 But, I mean, if -- you know, in that case we need to take 25 care of that. But if we don't -- if we don't have any 117 1 ownership, I don't know -- I'm uncomfortable with spending 2 taxpayers' money on something that we don't own. But -- so 3 how do we -- who -- are you going to go hire a lawyer, or 4 what are we going to do? 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We got one 6 downstairs. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, yeah. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: You seen him lately? 9 MR. EDWARDS: Pardon me. I think one thing 10 you can -- should consider, Commissioner Baldwin, is if 11 somebody gets hurt on that, who's going to be looked at? 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's a very good 13 question. Where is the liability? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree with that, but -- 15 MR. EDWARDS: It's not going to be Ingram, 16 'cause we've never owned it. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, that's right. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How about Uncle Sam? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But the liability also 20 goes -- if it is a dam and it's not repaired properly, the 21 County does that repair, then I think there is a -- a 22 liability on the County for not repairing it properly, too. 23 I mean, that liability goes on down. And I have no idea, 24 until we -- I think what Commissioner Griffin says, we need 25 to get someone who understands the structure a little bit 118 1 that can tell us what it's going to cost to fix it. I don't 2 know that we're going to want to know that answer. 3 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, I agree with you that 4 if we're going to transfer the quitclaim to the City, we'll 5 make a financial contribution to whatever repairs they want 6 to do. We should get the financial contribution and not the 7 repairs. I think what we need to focus on is the dollar 8 amount and where we could find the funds and under what 9 legal authority we can make the contribution, if that's 10 where we want to go. I was out there and looked at that 11 thing the other day, and I'd like to sign the deed today and 12 get rid of it. 13 MR. EDWARDS: Pardon me. If it will be of 14 any comfort to you, I jumped through all the hoops we had to 15 jump through to determine how much water the bridge was 16 holding back volume-wise, how many acre feet, et cetera, and 17 we have reported that to our insurance carrier, and it's 18 economically feasible for us to insure it. So, once we take 19 it over, it will be insured, and the liability question then 20 becomes minimalized. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, why can't we 22 proceed with the quitclaim? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do that now, quitclaim 25 whatever we have. If Ingram's willing to do it -- City's 119 1 willing to take it, let them have it, and then with the 2 understanding that we will work with the City in trying to 3 figure out how to fund what needs to be done that's 4 reasonable, in effect, to get it in better shape. Does that 5 work? 6 MR. EDWARDS: No, sir. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, it doesn't work. 8 MR. EDWARDS: We want the cart to go with the 9 horse, at the same time. We want to know where you -- what 10 we're getting when we -- when we take the deed. I mean, 11 that's -- I'm speaking for the mayor, and I think I've 12 interpreted his position correctly, but if you wish to ask 13 him that -- we're not willing to take it with a -- with a 14 promise. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: So you're not going to take 16 it unless there's cash with it? 17 MR. EDWARDS: We're not going to take it 18 unless there's -- it's either made structurally sound to the 19 point that we have agreed to, Judge, in the letter that we 20 wrote you, or agreement has been made concerning the -- how 21 the money will come to us to let us make it structurally 22 sound when we do receive it. 23 JUDGE HENNEKE: Money in the amount of a 24 $17,000 -- 25 MR. EDWARDS: Well, I'm with Commissioner 120 1 Griffin there. I think that if we knew where the County 2 stood on this thing, that we have one entity out in west 3 Kerr County that's indicated that they would maybe 4 contribute to it in some fashion. But we just -- 5 JUDGE HENNEKE: I think the position of the 6 County is pretty clear. We would like to quitclaim it to 7 you. What you're saying, though, is that you won't accept 8 the deed unless we come up with the cash. And I'm saying 9 are you talking about cash in the amount of 17,5 or are you 10 talking about cash in an undisclosed amount? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think there's 12 another issue, Judge, and Mr. Edwards said it, "structurally 13 sound." By whose definition, and what does that mean? 14 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's what I'm trying to get 15 around -- I'm trying to say. Are we going to get a dam 16 engineer to come look at that? 17 MR. EDWARDS: I don't know that -- pardon me, 18 I'm sorry. 19 JUDGE HENNEKE: You're presenting us with 20 this bid for 17,5. The question is, is that the amount that 21 the City wants? 22 MR. EDWARDS: Our -- our -- the City's 23 position is as I stated in my letter back on February the 24 12th, is that we will accept the bridge if it's brought to a 25 safer condition, and that consists of resurfacing the travel 121 1 -- the old travel part of it. And if you would go out and 2 look at it, you will see that if you -- there's some asphalt 3 on it, but if you scrape a little of that asphalt off of it, 4 water starts shooting up through the base of it. So, we're 5 not certain that resurfacing it under the bid that we've 6 gotten would meet anybody's definition of structurally 7 sound. We're just trying to work a solution on this thing 8 at a minimum of cost. Our other bid was $35,000 to do the 9 surface, and another $35,000 to reinforce the surface of 10 it -- or $17,000, I think, to resurface it. And the two 11 bids that -- this last bid that we got in, the 12 17,000-some-odd dollars to do the surface, and we were going 13 to go up and rebuild the lip part of it that goes above the 14 road surface. It actually constitutes the dam portion of 15 it, and that was another $17,000 or $18,000. So, the City 16 Council met and said, well, let's compromise on this, and 17 said, you know, let's just get the surface done and we'll 18 worry about the dam part of it in the future in our budgets 19 once we get it. So, the City Council feels like they've 20 already tried to work with you, and -- or with anybody to 21 get this done at a minimum of cost by waiving the necessary 22 repairs to the lip part of it that constitutes the dam. And 23 it's in pretty bad shape. But, again, in response to 24 Commissioner Letz' question, if we can get it transferred 25 satisfactorily to our name, we will insure it. 122 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I take a little bit of 2 offense. You haven't come -- wait. You haven't come to us 3 with anything to ask -- I mean, you're coming with a general 4 letter. We haven't said no. We're trying to figure out a 5 way to do it. And, you know, I think, to me, if the City of 6 Ingram will come to us with -- say, with a definite, "Do 7 this," you know, if the County will spend 17,5 and, you 8 know, then y'all will take the bridge, I think we'll 9 probably get this Court to do that, but I don't know what 10 you want. I mean, I can't get that -- you know, until you 11 tell me what you want for sure, I can't pass it or make a 12 motion on an order to do something. 13 MR. EDWARDS: It's my understanding, Mr. 14 Letz -- and I can't answer it any better than what we've put 15 in writing, and that is if it is repaired by whomever, 16 whenever, however, to resurface -- this is for resurfacing 17 the traveled area of the bridge through -- though the riser 18 part that acts as a dam. Also, these repairs -- the City is 19 willing to accept the bridge with a resurfacing only and 20 hope that in the future we will be able to do additional 21 repairs. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. You get a deed 23 together like that -- 24 MR. EDWARDS: That's as clear as I can make 25 it. 123 1 JUDGE HENNEKE: Well, it -- 2 MR. EDWARDS: That's the mayor's letter, not 3 mine. Not my words. That's the mayor's letter. 4 JUDGE HENNEKE: Are you suggesting we do the 5 resurfacing again, or we give them -- what I want to hear is 6 they'll take the bridge if we give them the 17,5. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 8 JUDGE HENNEKE: That's what's I want to hear. 9 And I'm not hearing that. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm not either. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, that's -- 12 MR. EDWARDS: That offer's never been put to 13 us, so our City Council never heard it either. We can't 14 respond to a comment we've never heard. 15 JUDGE HENNEKE: Perhaps it would be a good 16 idea for you to go back and say that the Commissioners Court 17 has indicated a -- a willingness to transfer title and pay 18 up to 17,5 for your use in repairing the bridge. Now, 19 that's assuming we can find the legal authority and the 20 17,5. The question becomes, will you accept the deed along 21 with a commitment for the County to fund up to 17,5 for your 22 purposes? That's the issue. 23 MR. EDWARDS: I'll be happy to do that. 24 Thank you very much for your time. 25 JUDGE HENNEKE: Okay. Any other questions or 124 1 comments? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I don't -- I 3 don't know if it ought to be on the 17,5. I think I would 4 have done half of it or something like that, but whatever. 5 It's not going to get done today. 6 JUDGE HENNEKE: Anything else today? If not, 7 gentlemen, ladies, we are adjourned. Thank you all. 8 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 11:46 a.m.) 9 - - - - - - - - - - 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 125 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 29th day of March, 8 2002. 9 10 11 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 12 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 13 Certified Shorthand Reporter 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25