1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Special Session 10 Tuesday, May 27, 2003 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 DAVE NICHOLSON, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X May 27, 2003 2 PAGE --- Visitors' Input 3 3 --- Commissioners Comments 9 4 1.1 Discuss KISD Band Boosters use of Ag Barn for competition/festival March 5-7, 2004, at no cost 14 5 1.2 Request by Texas Hill Country Home Builders to reserve HCYEC every first weekend in February 6 for the next five years 22 1.3 Clarify definition of "road" as discussed in 7 Kerr County Subdivision Rules & Regulations 35 1.4 Consider variance for utilities, final plat 8 for The Reserve of Falling Water 40 1.5 Consider authorizing Road & Bridge to haul 9 materials to Red Rose Ranch for 4-H 46 1.6 Revision of Kerr County Personnel Pay Policy 10 concerning longevity, educational, merit, etc. 49 1.7 Authorize Sheriff to apply for SWALM Foundation 11 grant for high-speed notification system 70 --- Emergency repair of J.P. 3's computer 79 12 1.8 Mutual Aid Agreement for Multi-Jurisdictional Special Operations Unit, authorize Judge to sign 81 13 1.9 Consider and discuss making June 7, 2003 "The Honorable Don McClure Day" 91 14 1.10 Request by Kerr County Child Service Board for additional funds for kids in foster care 96 15 1.11 Consider revisions to Kerr County Parks and Recreation Master Plan, set public hearing date 107 16 1.12 Discuss making burn ban process more responsive to needs of community and fire departments 113 17 1.13 Approve Kerr County Auditor doing annual audit for Kerr County Rural Fire Prevention District 1 115 18 1.14 Approve Amendment No. 1 to Contract 721075 between Kerr County & Office of Rural Community 19 Affairs, authorize County Judge to sign same 118 20 4.1 Pay Bills 124 4.2 Budget Amendments 124 21 4.3 Late Bills 127 4.4 Read and Approve Minutes 132 22 4.5 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 133 23 5.1 Reports from Commissioners 135 24 --- Adjourned 137 25 3 1 On Tuesday, May 27, 2003, at 9:00 a.m., a special meeting 2 of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in the 3 Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, Kerrville, 4 Texas, and the following proceedings were had in open court: 5 P R O C E E D I N G S 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning. It appears to be 7 at or near 9 o'clock. This is Tuesday, May 27th, and I will 8 call to order the Special Commissioners Court meeting posted 9 for this date and time. I would like to introduce as my 10 guest Dr. Ken Graves, who is the Bishop of the Church of 11 Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. And, Dr. Graves, we'd ask 12 that you please honor us. 13 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Please be seated. 15 At this time, if there is any member present in the audience 16 that has anything they'd like to bring to the attention of 17 the Court on a matter that is not on the agenda, we would ask 18 that you feel free to do so. Ms. Frost? 19 MS. FROST: Good morning. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning. How are you? 21 MS. FROST: I appreciate the opportunity to 22 talk to y'all about something that's not on the agenda this 23 morning. I've supplied copies with you. I know that you 24 can't take any action on anything, but I'm hoping for a 25 response sometime in the future. For the record, my name is 5-27-03 4 1 Mary Hart Frost, and my husband and I own property in Bumble 2 Bee Hills Subdivision, and I share ownership with my cousins 3 of property at Pleasure Hill. On behalf of all the parties 4 residing along the Pleasure Hill county road, I would like to 5 thank Commissioner Nicholson and the Kerr County Road and 6 Bridge Department for their prompt attention to the erosion 7 problem along this road. This erosion is a result of the 8 increased velocity of stormwater runoff into the natural 9 drainage gully along the Pleasure Hill Road because of the 10 site development clearing for the Stablewood Springs Ranch 11 Subdivision. Work done by the County on this road may 12 prevent some serious flooding of our property in the future. 13 Because of the experiences I have had in the 14 platting process in the past year and a half with the 15 Stablewood Springs Ranch Subdivision, I would like to ask 16 that the Court place more emphasis on the concept plan 17 phase, as required in the Kerr County Subdivision Rules and 18 Regulations, Section V, Platting Procedure, before a 19 preliminary plat is presented to the Court. 6.01, Concept 20 Plan, states, "Prior to submission of a preliminary plat, 21 the developer shall consult with and present two concept 22 plans in sketch form to the County Engineer, one concept 23 plan in sketch form to the Designated Representative for 24 Kerr County O.S.S.F. program, and an additional concept plan 25 in sketch form to each of the appropriate utility companies. 5-27-03 5 1 The County Engineer will forward one copy of the concept 2 plan, along with a completed checklist, to the Commissioner 3 of the precinct in which the proposed subdivision is 4 located." 5 As far as I know, no concept plan was ever 6 submitted to the County Engineer for the Stablewood Springs 7 Ranch Subdivision. My neighbors and I in the Bumble Bee 8 Hills Subdivision first learned of the proposed subdivision 9 in January 2002, when dirt was dumped in the floodplain 10 along Bumblebee Creek behind our properties to construct a 11 berm as part of the Stablewood Springs Ranch development. 12 When we contacted U.G.R.A. about this berm, we learned that 13 the subdivision would be submitting a preliminary plat to 14 the Kerr County Commissioners Court on February 11th, 2002. 15 The property owners in Bumble Bee Hills and Pleasure Hill, 16 which abut the proposed subdivision site, and which had been 17 and would be further adversely affected by the proposed 18 development, had no opportunity to express concerns in a 19 concept plan phase. 20 I would suggest that the Commissioner of the 21 precinct in which a proposed subdivision is to be located 22 include nearby property owners who may be impacted by the 23 proposed subdivision construction for their input and 24 information. This communication could be extremely helpful, 25 especially to responsible developers. This approach enables 5-27-03 6 1 members of the community to become more involved in the 2 development of their county if they so desire. No one knows 3 a community better than its own residents, and responsible 4 development works for the community, especially its 5 prospective neighbors. Hydrology, water availability, 6 septic, and density plans should be reviewed by a qualified 7 registered engineer in the concept plan phase. These issues 8 can be addressed before the developer has invested a great 9 deal of time and money into his proposed project and a 10 preliminary plat. If this suggestion was implemented and 11 adhered to on a regular basis, perhaps developers would be 12 more likely to agree to safeguards to reduce the impact of 13 the development on nearby property owners' creeks and 14 rivers. 15 Do I want more subdivision development in the 16 hills along the Guadalupe River and the creeks in Kerr 17 County? No. Will there be more subdivision development? 18 Yes. That is why you and I and all concerned citizens of 19 Kerr County need to be informed and proactive in making sure 20 that this subdivision development will be responsible. 21 Irresponsible development must not be allowed to destroy the 22 unique environment that makes Kerr County such a special 23 place to live. We must insure that this precious heritage 24 will be passed on to future generations. And I know that 25 all of you agree with me on that. Thank you for your 5-27-03 7 1 attention and consideration of this matter. I have given 2 each of you a copy of my statement concerning the concept 3 plan phase of the Kerr County Subdivision Rules, and I look 4 forward to your responses. I've given you my e-mail 5 address, my telephone number, and my post office box, and I 6 do hope to hear from you. Thank you very much. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you very much, Ms. Frost. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, if I might make a 9 comment, this is to Ms. Frost. 10 MS. FROST: Yes? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Regarding the response. 12 And this is just from my standpoint, but I think it probably 13 works for the Court as well. The Subdivision Rules are going 14 to be up probably either the first or second meeting in June. 15 MS. FROST: Okay. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: For some revision. And I 17 really think a discussion on this topic is really -- and 18 maybe -- probably a workshop also, I would guess, 'cause it's 19 probably half a dozen changes we're going to be looking at. 20 That would be a good opportunity for feedback -- I mean, for 21 some sort of dialogue. 22 MS. FROST: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: As opposed to, you know -- 24 MS. FROST: Individually trying to -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- individually trying. 5-27-03 8 1 'Cause I just think it's difficult for us, one-on-one, to 2 respond, you know, have some ideas of -- you know, or 3 comments on your statement. 4 MS. FROST: Right. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But it's better, I think, 6 at that time or one-on-one, rather than try to write them 7 down. 8 MS. FROST: So, then, would you contact me 9 about a workshop? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It will be posted. I 11 mean, I'll try to remember to contact you, but -- 12 MS. FROST: I bet Commissioner Nicholson will 13 contact me. Thanks very much. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Ms. Frost. Is there 15 anyone else that has any comments or matters that they'd like 16 to bring to the attention of the Court concerning matters 17 that are not on the agenda? Certainly, if you desire to have 18 input on matters that are on the agenda, we would ask that 19 you fill out a participation form. That helps us in the 20 planning stage, and also helps make sure that I don't miss 21 somebody if they've filled out one of those. That way I can 22 be sure and not pass over the item or go on to the next one 23 before we're through with it, if you haven't participated if 24 you asked to do so. Is there anyone else? We'll move on, 25 then, to the Commissioners' comments. Number 1. 5-27-03 9 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, Judge, very 2 much. The only comment I have is I wanted to announce that 3 I'm going to lift the burn ban effective 10 a.m. this morning 4 through Thursday, 7 p.m. That's the only comments I have. 5 And I kind of wanted to do that up front because sometimes 6 the press folks have important meetings to go to, so they 7 tend to get up in the middle of ours and leave. 8 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: So, you said 10 a.m. 9 today through 7 p.m. Thursday? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I'd say ditto to 12 that; I'm going to take it off also. I know some folks have 13 called me over the weekend about it, so we'll let them have 14 an opportunity to burn while there's sill some moisture out 15 there. But then, also, I'd like to make mention of the fact 16 that this little town was full and running over over the 17 weekend with people who attended multiple functions here in 18 town. I assume they brought their money with them. The Arts 19 and Crafts fair was well-attended, I think, and this is the 20 last one that will be at the Schreiner University site, 21 because they're going to begin work out on the county site 22 for their new arts park pretty quick hereafter. I think 23 they'll get all the critiquing done on this particular one, 24 start filing for grants and so forth and so on. And then on 25 Monday, I -- I, with about 30 other hearty souls, showed up 5-27-03 10 1 at the courthouse for a Memorial Day service, expecting to 2 hear the dulcet tones of the County Judge, and lo and behold, 3 there wasn't a Memorial Day service here. Maybe the County 4 Judge knows the answer to that, because the newspaper, which 5 we put great faith in -- 6 MS. LAVENDER: Not me. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- told us there was 8 going to be one here at 11 a.m. and going to be one at the 9 V.A. at 10 o'clock. So, a few of us showed up, and a few of 10 us went home. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I saw something -- they 12 had one here. I saw it on television. 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Saturday. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Saturday. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It said Sunday. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The newspaper said 17 Sunday and they had it on Saturday? 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, it said yesterday. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Said Monday. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Said Monday, and they 21 had it on Saturday? 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't know when they 23 had it. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just an old trick. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: An old trick? Kind of 5-27-03 11 1 like the shell game, huh? 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's it. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I, likewise, will lift the 5 burn ban in Precinct 3 until -- from 10 a.m. today until 6 7 p.m. on Thursday. And since baseball season's winding down 7 at the collegiate and high school level, I'll make a couple 8 of kudos. The Tivy baseball team, they did lose over the 9 weekend, but they had another great season and went very far 10 in the playoffs. I congratulate that group of young men. I 11 want to move on to -- I don't know -- I doubt most people in 12 the room spend a great deal of time watching college baseball 13 and softball on ESPN, but those that do over the weekend saw 14 two of our recent Tivy graduates do very, very well in their 15 tournaments. Tamara Poppy, University of Texas softball, she 16 has the leading batting average for the Longhorns this year. 17 They got beat in the semi-finals by -- I believe it was 18 California, or UCLA beat them. And -- you know, but anyway, 19 she did a -- had a remarkable season and had a -- played a 20 pretty good game. And also, unfortunately, it isn't my 21 nephew I'm going to talk about next -- brag about; it's 22 someone at Texas A & M. Kevin Whelan, who has not had a lot 23 of playing time, did great in two games against the 24 University of Texas. And I talked to his father, Charlie 25 Whelan, this morning; he said it was the best of all worlds. 5-27-03 12 1 Kevin had a great game, and University of Texas won. So -- 2 (Laughter.) 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: He almost put one over 4 the fence. It was close. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Kevin had a great day, and 6 really headed off the season on a remarkable note, so I'd 7 really like to commend those two young athletes. 8 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'm thankful for the 9 rain that we got on our dry and thirsty land, and I'm going 10 to also join the rest of you in lifting that burn ban till 11 Thursday at 7 p.m. That's all. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: In response to Commissioner 13 Williams, yes, there was a Memorial Day ceremony here at the 14 courthouse. I must have missed the -- the erroneous 15 information, because what I saw indicated it was, in fact, 16 going to be at 11 a.m. on Saturday, and I was here. There 17 was some concern about the propriety of being able to conduct 18 that ceremony, because, as most of you know, that was the 19 fourth Saturday and we had Market Days here, as well as a lot 20 of other traffic in town. And there was some considerable 21 concern about whether or not that would be something that 22 was -- could be pulled off compatibly. Of course, we -- we 23 had the ceremony here in front of the courthouse, the front 24 door. I think it's a little shadier there, frankly, than 25 over on the west side over towards Sidney Baker. I think for 5-27-03 13 1 that reason it worked out pretty good. 2 Also, of course, the Market Days people were 3 all around the square, and we had the usual traffic noise 4 that we're going to have anyway, but I was particularly 5 impressed and moved by -- at that point in the ceremony that 6 the rifle salute occurred and the playing of taps occurred, 7 I was able to look all around the perimeter of the square, 8 and I noticed that everyone involved in the Market Days, the 9 vendors and the participants and the lookers and so forth, 10 all stopped and faced towards the middle of the square where 11 the activity was taking place, and -- and became silent and 12 acted very appropriately, and I was very, very pleased to 13 see that. I discovered after the fact that -- when I made 14 that observation to the Market Day organizers, LuAnn 15 Anderson and Jackie Cain, that I was quite impressed by 16 that, and I discovered that they had put out a little flyer 17 to their vendors to be passed along to the people notifying 18 them that there would, in fact, be such a ceremony taking 19 place beginning at 11 o'clock, and indicating what would 20 occur. 21 And at the closing paragraph of that flyer, 22 it indicated, "In a show of respect for those who gave their 23 lives protecting our nation, please eliminate all unusually 24 loud noise during the ceremony and generally try to do 25 whatever you can to be respectful of the occasion and those 5-27-03 14 1 attending." I thought that was an extraordinarily nice 2 gesture of the Market Days people, and it worked, obviously. 3 And the bottom line was, I think we obtained the 4 participation of a great many more folks in the actual 5 Memorial Day ceremony. So the end result was, I think, 6 absolutely wonderful, and I want to commend the Market Days 7 people and the citizens of Kerr County and the visitors that 8 we had coming to Kerr County for -- for showing the proper 9 respect as they should have done on that occasion. That's 10 all I have. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's move to the 13 consideration agenda. Item Number 1, consider and discuss 14 approval of the K.I.S.D. Band Boosters use of the Ag Barn 15 facility for a pre-UIL competition and festival on the 16 weekend of March 5, 6, and 7, 2004, at no cost. Thank you 17 very much. 18 MS. ELLIOTT: Well, thank you for giving me 19 this opportunity. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Would you state your name for 21 the record, please? 22 MS. ELLIOTT: My name is Deena Elliott. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. 24 MS. ELLIOTT: I'm representing the -- at this 25 point, the K.I.S.D. Band Boosters. I've been a member of 5-27-03 15 1 Band Boosters for approximately nine years. I'm on my second 2 son going through. He's going to be a sophomore this year. 3 He seems pretty excited about that, 'cause he's not a fish 4 any more. I don't know if you're aware of this, but we have 5 been having a fundraiser out at Walmart; it involves Coca 6 Cola sales and a great deal of time sitting and loading Coke 7 cases. And it gives us a lot of time to talk and throw ideas 8 around, and there's been one idea that's been being kicked 9 around by the Band Boosters for the full nine years that I've 10 been associated with them. It's been primarily presented by 11 Fred Burgess, who is retiring this year after 23 years with 12 these kids. He always said it would be so fine to be able to 13 have a jazz festival. And, you know, that's a really good 14 idea, I think, as the parent of a band student. 15 But we've been throwing that idea around, and 16 we'd like to do it, but we'd like to do it a little bit 17 better. We'd like to bring all of the Hill Country in. 18 We'd like to bring every school within a 50-mile radius into 19 the Ag Barn. If we can work it with a pre-UIL contest, that 20 would be terrific, but if we can't, we want to have a jazz 21 festival. We want to bring in colleges, we want to bring in 22 music companies, we want to bring in every school, and that 23 includes Harper, Ingram, Medina, everybody. We want them to 24 have an opportunity to see these other bands, see them 25 perform, and maybe one kid will say, "Hey, that's pretty 5-27-03 16 1 cool. Maybe I can play." That's basically what we want to 2 do. 3 What we want to ask the Commissioners to do 4 is let us do it for free. We'd like to use the Ag Barn 5 facility to do it. It can park buses. It's the only 6 facility that I can think of in this area that can park 7 buses. We don't need the grass. What we need is the 8 building, and we need the whole building. We want to put 9 specialty bands in the exhibition room, the smaller room. 10 We're going to use our boosters to come up with an idea to 11 make it acoustically sound. And portable; that's always 12 very important. In the rodeo area, we'd like to set up 13 those tents for colleges, for the music departments, and we 14 would like to give every booster organization with every 15 school an opportunity to have a little fundraiser on the 16 side. We'd like school children to be admitted for nothing, 17 and we'd like to charge the public to see these fabulous 18 bands. I don't know if you've seen our Tivy bands; they've 19 got a pretty good stage band. But we'd also like to let 20 Harper put together a country band, even if it's just four 21 pieces. Even if it's three pieces. My goodness, even it's 22 a soloist. Give them an opportunity to perform and to 23 perform for a venue that they've never been able to before. 24 If we can pull it off, it could -- it could 25 catapult this area. It's never been done here before. It 5-27-03 17 1 could take Kerrville and just -- not only is it on the map 2 as far as the folk festival is concerned, and original music 3 composition -- I saw in the paper that they had an article 4 about that -- but we're head-and-shoulders above them when 5 it comes to our students, and I'd like for y'all to have 6 faith enough in them to let us attempt this. Thank you very 7 much for your time, and I hope to see you. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've got a question 9 for you. Did you say -- how much of the facility? You said 10 the -- 11 MS. ELLIOTT: We need the exhibition area. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The exhibition room? 13 MS. ELLIOTT: We'd like to set up the bands 14 there. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the rodeo arena? 16 MS. ELLIOTT: Yes, we would. I think that 17 it's going to get that big. I really do. When we start 18 putting out -- we've already had positive responses from 19 Fredericksburg, Boerne, and just the idea of having three 4A 20 programs there is -- is so tremendous that I think once we 21 put out the information and we get in touch with our colleges 22 and our music companies in the area, I think that we're going 23 to have a response that's -- that's going to shock and awe 24 everybody involved. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Shock and awe, okay. I 5-27-03 18 1 can say this. I saw the Tivy stage band in the Alamodome 2 this year, and they are really, really, really good. They 3 are a lot of fun, and you could see -- you could see them 4 kind of cross over from the scripted music over to -- let's 5 get down, do a little rocking here. And they were -- they 6 knocked the place down. It was fantastic. I'm all in favor 7 of it. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions for 9 Ms. Elliott? Thank you. 10 MS. ELLIOTT: Thank you, sir. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think it's another 12 way to help just another group of our local youth. We do 13 everything we can to help the youth, and we work with our 14 high school athletes all year-round, and the band people are 15 the same thing, so it is my opinion that -- I don't know -- I 16 don't know about the entire facility, but I guess we could 17 work on that deal. But I am in favor of it. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Question. Do we know if there 19 are any current bookings for that date? 20 MS. ELLIOTT: Actually, we -- we were checking 21 into facilities, and the question came up that we honestly 22 don't have a place that's big enough. We've been approached 23 for UIL competitions before, and we've had an opportunity to 24 run them, and we just didn't have the facilities to do it. 25 And so we were thinking about what facility would be big 5-27-03 19 1 enough to park buses, to bring buses into, and the only one 2 that came up was the Ag Barn. And then, of course, the 3 question came up about the acoustics at the Ag Barn, because 4 it wasn't initially set up for that type of thing. And I 5 think that we can handle that. It was March, we talked to 6 the person at the Ag Barn, and we asked them to please pencil 7 us in. There were two dates left, and one of them was right 8 in the middle of spring break, which is absolutely -- no. 9 The other one was March 5th, 6th, and 7th, and they penciled 10 us in, and the boosters will receive a contract next month. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, that answers my question. 12 I just didn't know whether we had some conflicting 13 organization that had already reserved the facility for that 14 date, and I -- by the nodding of the head I'm getting back 15 there, it looks like you are, in fact, at least penciled in 16 at this point. 17 MS. ELLIOTT: Yes, we are, sir. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Only comment I'd like to 20 make is, I, along with Commissioner Baldwin, support this 21 totally, and I would just like -- for the record, like to 22 point out a distinction between this one and the last one, 23 which I was not in favor of doing that. K.I.S.D. and all the 24 schools are taxing entities, and it's different to me than 25 going with a private organization, whether it's nonprofit or 5-27-03 20 1 not. And going with a taxing entity, I think that it's 2 appropriate for us to waive fees for other taxing entities in 3 our county. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I would just 5 weigh in on that. I don't see any problem with it. I think 6 the idea is great, and certainly that helps us fulfill the 7 mission of having that facility for the youth, our youth. 8 The only question in my mind has to do with acoustics. Will 9 that facility serve your purposes acoustically? 10 MS. ELLIOTT: For a UIL contest, no, sir, it 11 wouldn't be acceptable. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I know we can park the 13 buses, but -- 14 MS. ELLIOTT: But with specialty bands, sir -- 15 I know that you're aware that there have been several bands 16 perform there. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, yeah. 18 MS. ELLIOTT: I think that we can get ahold of 19 walls that will bend that sound. And since it's not a 20 UIL-sanctioned type thing and they're not actually in 21 competition other than, you know, for us to enjoy the quality 22 of their music, I think that we can make it perfectly 23 acceptable. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: More power to you. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I move that this 5-27-03 21 1 Commissioners Court waives the fees for the Ag Barn facility 2 for March 5, 6, and 7, 2004, for the -- for a regional-type 3 music festival. And we -- the K.I.S.D. Band Boosters would 4 be the group to use it. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second the motion. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion's been made and seconded 7 by Commissioners Baldwin and Williams, respectively, that the 8 Court approve the use of the Ag Barn facility by K.I.S.D. 9 Band Boosters for a pre-UIL competition/festival on the 10 weekend of March 5 through 7, 2004, at no cost. Any further 11 discussion or questions? Commissioner Nicholson? 12 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'm generally not in 13 favor of making such exceptions to policy, and was prepared 14 to vote against this one, and then Commissioner Letz gave me 15 a good reason to vote for it, so I'm going to do that. I 16 would suggest that we ought to either stop making exceptions 17 to policy, or change the policy. I'll -- I might be in 18 favor, for example, of changing the policy to allow taxing 19 entities, maybe even other organizations to use it. I don't 20 like the idea of -- of having to continually make exceptions 21 and to weigh the merits of one not-for-profit group over 22 another one. That's all. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 24 discussion? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can I make just -- you 5-27-03 22 1 know, a comment. I mean, our policy -- and I agree with you; 2 we need to figure out a way to -- we've tried several times 3 to come up with a uniform policy. We have different 4 categories that we have tried to put groups in. The problem 5 is, there's always someone in between categories, and I'm 6 afraid that no matter how we do a policy, they're always 7 going to be referred back to us to make a call whether they 8 should get waived or not waived. And it's -- you know, but I 9 would certainly welcome the opportunity to try to solve this 10 dilemma, because I agree with you, it puts us in an awkward 11 position. And you and I generally agree on the fact that -- 12 you know, that that facility should not be used free of 13 charge. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 15 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 16 your right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. The next 21 item is to consider and discuss the approval of the request 22 by the Texas Hill Country Home Building Association to 23 reserve the Youth Exhibit Center on the first weekend in 24 February for a five-year period, 2005 through 2009. It says 25 the next five years. Actually, that wouldn't be the next 5-27-03 23 1 five years; it would be the five years following the next 2 year. All right, thank you. 3 MR. ROESCH: Good morning, honored members of 4 the Court and ladies and gentlemen in the audience. I'm 5 Heinz Roesch of the Texas Hill Country Home Builders 6 Association. You need to forgive me; this is the first time 7 I've ever been in front of the Court, so I need to refer to 8 my notes. The Texas Hill Country Home Builders Association 9 has now, I think, seven years in a row had a home and garden 10 show at the Youth Exhibit Center here in Kerrville, and over 11 the years that show has been very successful. This year, 12 we've had almost 80 vendors displaying their wares and 13 services, and I think almost 2,000 people attended that show. 14 I think it had a positive effect for Kerrville, Kerr County, 15 and also the vendors that had an ability to display their 16 services there, and I think it was also informative for all 17 the people that came there. 18 The organization and success of such an event 19 is, I think, to a degree dependent on the fact that you can 20 have it on a fixed day every year so that it gets into the 21 minds of the vendors as well as those who come, and also 22 makes the marketing of such an event a great deal easier 23 when you can, during the event, already line up the people 24 for next year's event, because you can make a commitment to 25 them it will be again on the first weekend next year. Also, 5-27-03 24 1 having it on a fixed day would avoid conflict with the other 2 similar events in the greater area, be it San Antonio, 3 Austin, or anywhere else in the Hill Country. Of course, 4 most of those events are also on fixed days throughout the 5 year, and therefore, in order to continue to make this a 6 successful event and also to hopefully make it more 7 successful in years to come, I would ask that we be given 8 the right to have a fixed reservation for the years 2005 9 through 2009. For 2004, unfortunately, the first weekend is 10 no longer available, and so we had to book the second 11 weekend in February, but we'll have the show anyhow. So, I 12 ask for your positive consideration of our request, and look 13 forward to serving the Kerr County area with this show in 14 the years to come. Thank you. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Are there any questions of the 16 gentleman from the members of the Court? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, not him. Do I -- 18 are they booked next year? 19 MS. McCLINTOCK: For the second weekend. 20 MR. ROESCH: They had already rented -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What about the year 22 following that? Just this one time? 23 MS. McCLINTOCK: You want to go ahead and do 24 it? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, I'm asking the 5-27-03 25 1 question. 2 MS. McCLINTOCK: No. 3 MR. ROESCH: Mrs. McClintock -- I guess you're 4 Jamie McClintock? She informed me that the first would be 5 available 2005 through 2009 without conflict in the schedule 6 as it is known right now. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess my question is as 8 to why this is before us. And it's because of the length of 9 time there is to -- Glenn, is it the length of time for the 10 request? Is that the reason? 11 (Mr. Holekamp nodded.) 12 MS. McCLINTOCK: Well, previously -- we had 13 originally said that we were not going to book except for a 14 year and a half in advance. And so, you know, when I start 15 looking -- start sending contracts for the next year, 16 normally that's when we start booking for the following year, 17 but contracts are not sent until then. 18 MR. ROESCH: I mean, in past years we've 19 always been given confirmation of our date only sometime in 20 late fall, and to start organizing such an event in late fall 21 really in earnest is -- is not -- is very, very difficult, 22 you know. I mean, those vendors make their plans also, you 23 know, a year, two years out. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Holekamp? 25 MR. HOLEKAMP: The history on the year and a 5-27-03 26 1 half out on booking -- I don't know if Commissioner Baldwin 2 -- I think Commissioner Williams was on the Court; all three 3 of you should have been. Sudie Burditt came to the Court and 4 indicated that for major events, talking about national 5 events, they needed the availability of two years out to book 6 the facility. So, what was happening is she had a date two 7 years out that the -- I think it was a motorcycle group or 8 something wanted to come, and we had booked something in the 9 facility already. And she had indicated to the Court -- I 10 think she came in to the Court and asked is there any way 11 that you cannot, on local events, book them a long ways out, 12 because if you really get a big one wanting to come to town, 13 they're unable to do it. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I have a couple 15 questions, too, one of them to Mr. Holekamp. Do we not 16 require a deposit for advance bookings? Do we require -- 17 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- a deposit? 19 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. And if this 21 request of yours would be granted, are you prepared to put up 22 a nonrefundable deposit for the five years you're asking? 23 MR. ROESCH: Yes. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm still -- I don't 25 think I'm in favor of booking that far out in advance, 5-27-03 27 1 because there is a good bit of uncertainty as to what we're 2 going to be doing with that facility. And if we go ahead and 3 make a commitment to you, and three years out or whatever, we 4 determine that we're going to do something with that 5 facility, you're disenfranchised. 6 MR. ROESCH: I mean, I'm -- I put five years 7 out because that was the advice I received from 8 Ms. McClintock, you know, just to ask for that booking. If, 9 you know, you can only make a commitment for two or three 10 years out, that would be acceptable just as well. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Holekamp? 12 MR. ROESCH: The important part is that I can 13 make -- excuse me. The important part is that I can, you 14 know, make year-to-year commitments already to vendors 15 displaying so that I don't have to wait until fall this year 16 to make the bookings or the preparations for the show next 17 year. That's very difficult. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Holekamp, am I -- am I 19 given to understand that the current policy on the 20 utilization of that facility is now booking out a maximum of 21 18 months? 22 MR. HOLEKAMP: That is correct. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Secondly, in booking out 24 a maximum of 18 months, are you committing those bookings, I 25 assume, at whatever current-day -- current-day fees are? 5-27-03 28 1 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. In the event the Court 3 is looking at possibly going out beyond the 18 months, what 4 are your thoughts about freezing those fees for whatever 5 period of time it may be, or possibly leaving it open, 6 depending upon what the Court may decide to do on a fee 7 structure at some future point in time a year, two, three 8 years down the road? 9 MR. HOLEKAMP: Or six months. You know, I -- 10 I really believe that in the contract that we do, there 11 should be a provision in there that if -- if the date booked 12 is further than 12 months, or whatever that date may be, from 13 the time of the deposit, and rates are approved or changed by 14 Commissioners Court, that they -- anything past 12 months, 15 they should be increased. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Or subject to increase. 17 MR. HOLEKAMP: Or subject to increase. And I 18 really think that that could be done through contractual -- 19 with the contract itself. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I tend to agree with 21 Mr. Holekamp on that point, that that can be handled in the 22 contract. And I also think it can be handled through the 23 contract that if the facility is unavailable due to 24 construction, I mean -- 25 MR. HOLEKAMP: Oh, yeah. 5-27-03 29 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- I think that can be 2 handled through the contract. And -- you know, so I would -- 3 you know, and going back to the other part you talked about, 4 when we changed the policy, you know, I really don't recall, 5 you know, that meeting, what Sudie had said. But I have -- 6 I'm more inclined to support our local organizations than I 7 am national organizations, because they don't come that 8 often. And these are the people that -- you know, our bread 9 and butter where it comes to that facility, so I wouldn't be 10 in favor of -- I don't know; five years may be too long. 11 Maybe three years is the right number. I don't -- doesn't 12 make that much difference to me what the length of time is. 13 But I would, you know, be in favor of trying to -- if 14 everyone put up a deposit, to block out these dates so we 15 know what we're doing; people can plan. And, you know, the 16 national organizations, the few that may come here, they're 17 just going to have to work around the others, to me. 18 MR. ROESCH: And, you know, I would, from our 19 perspective, certainly find it very reasonable and 20 acceptable, you know, if you put a provision in your contract 21 that says, you know, if, in the interim, fees are changed up 22 or downwards, that that is reflected in the -- you know, in 23 the final payment to be made. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: What about a provision that 25 says in the event there's a -- there's a construction project 5-27-03 30 1 undertaken out there that, in effect, renders the facility 2 unusable by anybody? 3 MR. ROESCH: I mean, that's similar to a force 4 majeure event. So, you know, given, obviously, you know, 5 the -- the notice at the earliest possible time of such, you 6 know, event happening, I -- you know, act of God cannot be 7 prevented, and construction is the same. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, force majeure or 9 acts of God, I don't know that you can put our... 10 (Discussion off the record.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions of this 12 gentleman? 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'm just so happy to 14 see somebody come in here and want to pay for it, I'll vote 15 for about anything. (Laughter.) 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, my only comment, 17 I'm -- I think -- I believe the way we should do this thing 18 is -- is agree with them for one more year, until we see what 19 we're going to do. There may not be a building out there 20 after a year. I mean, I don't know. Where do we stand on 21 that thing, by the way? 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Somewhere between here 23 and here. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Coming up pretty soon. 25 But I think -- I think the long-term issue is just out of 5-27-03 31 1 whack at this time. I think we need to let them run one more 2 year on a year-to-year basis, and then -- then we will know 3 at that point where we stand with our new building, our new 4 facility, and go -- go from that point. And I want to remind 5 Glenn and the Commissioners Court that the Visitors Bureau 6 does not run that operation. This Commissioners Court and 7 your department runs that operation. And that's just the way 8 I think, and I think that's just a smoother way to do it. 9 I'm not going to be able to go along with this five-year 10 deal. I just think that that's too long to make that kind of 11 commitment. I understand how they -- their planning -- how 12 it affects their planning and everything, but I just think 13 it's -- for what we're going through with our building 14 program and our planning long-term and all that, I just think 15 if we just go through one more year with these guys on a 16 year-to-year basis, and then take a look at the long-term 17 plan. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I tend to agree with 19 Commissioner Baldwin. I think they're not even going to be 20 in the building until '04. Here we are in '03, and we're 21 locking it up for five years to '09. So, the first year 22 they're going to be in the building is '05, and I'd be 23 willing to go along with '05 and '06, but not all the way out 24 to '09. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we're losing 5-27-03 32 1 support quickly for this one. I mean, I -- I can see what 2 both Commissioner Baldwin and Williams are saying, but at the 3 same time, I mean, I think from a planning standpoint, I'd 4 hate for us -- because of our inaction, for them to look for 5 another venue, which they need to plan. I mean, I've -- to 6 people that put on these shows, a year goes by pretty quick. 7 And, you know, I think that we need to try to -- when we have 8 somebody who wants to use our facility, we need to try to 9 encourage them to use our facility. And when they want to 10 pay, it's even better. So, to me, maybe the best thing to do 11 at this time would be to ask y'all to come back in a couple 12 of months, 'cause I think in the next couple months we're 13 going to have an idea of where we're going on the facility, 14 and that will resolve some of the questions on construction 15 out there. And I think that will probably give you enough -- 16 I mean, certainly, you're committed for the '04, and maybe we 17 can ask the scheduling to not commit, but pencil you in for 18 the next couple years, the first weekend in February, and 19 then we can address it in a couple of months. 20 MR. ROESCH: I will jump through whatever 21 hoops you need me to jump through to get this done, but I 22 respectfully request that -- you know, we are planning to 23 start our marketing efforts for the 2004 show in June, you 24 know, and it would be helpful if we at least would be able to 25 also tell them that in 2005, it will be the first weekend. I 5-27-03 33 1 mean, I'm coming very much your way. Maybe -- also, 2 Commissioner Williams was suggesting 2005 and 2006. You 3 know, if at least, say, the first two years of the request 4 would be granted, that would be very helpful. That way, at 5 least when we start our efforts now, we can already tell 6 them, okay, these are the next two events. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move for approval for 8 the next two years. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion's been made and seconded 11 that the Court approve -- 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: '05-'06. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, two years. 14 MR. ROESCH: So, 2005 and 2006? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: For 2005-2006, motion made by 16 Commissioner Baldwin, seconded by Commissioner Williams. 17 Point of clarification. Let me inquire, is that subject to 18 the contractual provisions that we talked about? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, it is. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: More than -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There's two items. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: -- twelve months out is subject 23 to a future rate structure, and secondly, it's subject to -- 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Construction. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: -- construction -- use or 5-27-03 34 1 nonavailability because of construction activity. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just one more question. 3 What if we're under construction? What are you going to do? 4 I mean, it's obvious that you -- y'all can't hold this 5 function without us, so what are you going to do if we're 6 under construction? 7 MR. ROESCH: If you're under construction, 8 then we need to look for alternate event -- you know, there 9 is -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I was just 11 wondering, okay. 12 MR. ROESCH: You know, there's other events -- 13 other similar facilities in Gillespie County, in surrounding 14 counties. I would like to be here, 'cause this is our home 15 county. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: We'd like for you to be here. 17 Any further questions? 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: My motion included 19 those two issues. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. All in favor of the 21 motion as made and seconded, signify by raising your right 22 hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 5-27-03 35 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you very much -- 2 MR. ROESCH: Thank you, gentlemen. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: -- for being here. Next item 4 on the agenda is consider clarifying the definition of a 5 "road," quote, unquote, as discussed in Kerr County 6 Subdivision Rules and Regulations. 7 MR. JOHNSTON: May sound peculiar, but this 8 is -- this is a -- in the Subdivision Rules, the definition 9 of a road determines, in some cases, whether or not a tract 10 of land is subject to the Subdivision Rules or not. Section 11 1.02.C is the key -- key paragraph. It talks about streets 12 and alleys and -- legislative talk, and means a road that's 13 existing. Roads in Kerr County Subdivision Rules are defined 14 in Section 2 and Section 7 of the -- of the rules, and 15 specifically, Section 7.06.14 shows the different 16 classifications of roads. I think in the past there's been 17 many definitions of what constitutes a road, in terms of 18 people getting variances or not having to plat a plan to a 19 subdivision, and each one we agonize over. I think we ought 20 to have a definition that -- you know, it's written out, and 21 say this -- this is what we expect, and not just whether or 22 not it's a ranch road or a trail or a -- you know, whatever 23 people are claiming it meets the requirement. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can I make a comment, 25 Judge? First of all, I think it's really -- we need to defer 5-27-03 36 1 much discussion on this until the next time, you know, until 2 we talk about overall -- overall, the rules, which will be in 3 the next couple of weeks. I'll be meeting with Franklin and 4 Leonard. But I really wanted to hear what Franklin had to 5 say; I wanted to understand where he was coming from on this 6 point. Section 1.02 is the law. That's the Legislature. We 7 can't change that. That is -- I mean, that's -- 8 MR. JOHNSTON: We can't change it, but we can 9 clarify what -- you know, what we expect. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But it's -- that is not 11 talking about roads. That's talking about space dedicated 12 for public use. It's talking about right-of-way. It's 13 talking -- I mean, it's not talking about a road, 'cause it 14 clearly says squares, parks, or other parts of a tract. So, 15 I mean, that's not -- you can't -- we may want to try to 16 better define "road" for us, but Part C of 1.02 is not 17 talking about roads; it's talking about space for public use, 18 and that's something that's by the Legislature. 19 MR. JOHNSTON: See, that's interpretation. I 20 think where it talks about streets and alleys, I think 21 it's -- in the county terminology, that's a road. And -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Not what it says. 23 MR. JOHNSTON: -- in the following sections, 24 it gives the exceptions. It all refers back to that. In 25 other words, you have to have access to one of those things 5-27-03 37 1 before you can give them an exception to the platting 2 process. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, anyway, I think 4 it's -- again, this comes back to -- we need to discuss it at 5 a workshop setting with overall intent. I -- I don't see how 6 -- I mean, I -- 7 MR. JOHNSTON: I think that's the way -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's a different intent. 9 Maybe we need to get the County Attorney in here to -- to 10 discuss that point as to what C means, because the way I read 11 it, it's not roads. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: There have been a number of 13 questions come up about the Subdivision Rules and 14 Regulations. I think you've indicated that there are a 15 number of issues that are starting to stack up that need to 16 be addressed in connection with those rules. Maybe we ought 17 to consider having a workshop to deal with this and other 18 issues that are on the table concerning that. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have a stack. I will 20 get with Franklin, and I tend to work with him on the 21 Subdivision Rules, or have in the past. And then, at our 22 next meeting, we'll set a workshop. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I remember years ago, 24 we got into defining "subdivision," and it took weeks and 25 gnashing of teeth and departed friendships and all that 5-27-03 38 1 trying to get that done. I hope this is -- sounds simple; I 2 hope it doesn't come to that. But I'm real curious what -- 3 what triggered this. I mean, what -- how did you get up one 4 morning and not understand what a road was? 5 MR. JOHNSTON: We get a lot -- we get a lot of 6 questions out there from people calling in, saying "what if." 7 You know, what if? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 9 MR. JOHNSTON: And we go in and do a lot of 10 research sometimes trying to figure out, you know, what 11 they're talking about. In my way of thinking, this section 12 is, you know, road defined by committee. It's very vague 13 and, you know, no one seems to know. I want something that's 14 specific so we can tell people, "This is what we're talking 15 about." 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I see your 17 suggestions in the back that you have three different 18 categories; state highway, county-maintained road, and 19 county -- 20 MR. JOHNSTON: I think the whole emphasis of 21 the Subdivision Rules is to provide an adequate road for 22 people that own property for access, for emergency vehicles 23 to get there, and that a -- a road that's substandard, that 24 the County doesn't have to come in later and rebuild at the 25 taxpayers' expense for some private developer or private 5-27-03 39 1 property owner to -- in order to sell, subsidizing their 2 sale. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. Sounds 4 reasonable to me. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's a -- believe 6 it or not, the state law allows for great discussion on -- 7 'cause it's pretty vague in places. And I -- you know, how 8 you interpret different parts of state law and Section 232, 9 and -- 10 (Discussion off the record.) 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's a strange day when 12 I'm exited about Subdivision Rules and state law related to 13 them, but it is -- it's intriguing. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Intriguing? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You spend as much time as 16 I have on these rules, you'd find it intriguing as well. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm just wondering why 18 it's so intriguing. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Baldwin doesn't 20 want to participate in party friendships. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I care about you guys. 22 Deeply. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Anyway, let's put this -- 24 deal with this in a workshop. I'll get with you, Franklin; 25 we'll set up a -- 5-27-03 40 1 (Discussion off the record.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Any member of the Court have 3 anything further on Item 1.3? We'll move forward to 1.4, 4 consider a variance for utilities and final plat for Reserve 5 of Falling Water in Precinct 3. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just a brief comment 7 before I turn this over to the County Engineer and 8 Mr. Crenwelge. We're getting real close, it appears to me. 9 We've looked at this quite a few times. I think it's a very 10 nice subdivision going in in eastern Kerr County, and I think 11 we've come a long way. I'll turn it over to Franklin. I 12 think we -- it appears we may be close enough to approve this 13 today, but I'm not positive. 14 MR. JOHNSTON: You granted some minor 15 variances a couple weeks ago, and I think there may be one 16 more -- I think we have it on the agenda request to request a 17 minor variance for utilities. Dale might want to explain 18 that. 19 MR. CRENWELGE: All utilities are underground. 20 Because of the terrain, it's difficult to have the 21 separation, and there may be an area or two, or maybe a lot 22 of the area we need to put some of the utilities underneath 23 some of the roads. 24 MR. JOHNSTON: We decided last week, in a 25 meeting with the engineer that's developing the utilities, 5-27-03 41 1 that we prefer the electrical wiring to be under the road, as 2 opposed to water lines. That was acceptable to everyone 3 concerned, I think. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So -- and on the variance 5 issue, let me go back to the one we did a couple weeks ago on 6 lot size. I -- 7 MR. JOHNSTON: Lot frontage. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Lot frontages. Something 9 was in the back of my mind about that variance, and I looked 10 at the rules -- our rules. That did not require a variance, 11 in my opinion. The rule clearly -- our rules clearly allow 12 for that a little bit in high-density areas, to go with less 13 than 200 foot. I think it is appropriate for it to come to 14 court and the Court make that determination, but I really, 15 technically, don't think it's a variance, 'cause the rules 16 allow for it in high density. And I would classify this 17 terrain situation as a high-density development, and those 18 are viewed on a case-by-case situation. So, that's just a 19 comment on that variance that we granted previously. So, on 20 this one, the -- the request is -- this would be a variance, 21 in my opinion. It's to -- a variance to allow the electrical 22 lines to be under the road in certain areas. 23 MR. CRENWELGE: Electrical and telephone. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Electrical and telephone 25 in certain areas. And this would be due to the terrain on 5-27-03 42 1 the hills. 2 MR. JOHNSTON: Right. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's a -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How do you -- how do 5 you -- if you can get the electrical and telephone there, why 6 can't you get the water there? 7 MR. CRENWELGE: You have to have 4 foot 8 separation, and some areas you can only go on one side of the 9 road 'cause you have a road next to the -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Where is the water 11 going to go? 12 MR. CRENWELGE: Water's going to go next to 13 the road outside the bar ditch. So, our goal is to, you 14 know, keep the water line outside the ditch -- outside the 15 bar ditch and outside the road, and it's just tough with a 16 lot of this terrain. Franklin's been over it several times, 17 and the engineers have looked at it quite a few times. It's 18 just tough; you can't get these trenchers -- for water line, 19 they want 48 inches, and Central Texas wants 48 inches. A 20 lot of times these trenchers -- they won't take their 21 trenchers on the side of a slope if it's probably more than 5 22 or 6 percent. They weigh 160,000 pounds, big rock trenchers. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- you know, 24 obviously, I went through the subdivision some with Dale the 25 other day, and it is extremely rough terrain, very steep 5-27-03 43 1 roads. And I think the -- when you get in a situation like 2 this, you know, the -- if we didn't grant the variance, I 3 think the damage we do is greater, because what you have to 4 do -- and it goes back to some of the -- like Ms. Hart has a 5 lot of concern about drainage. The bigger we make these 6 cuts, the more we increase another problem. So, I mean, it's 7 just not just an economic issue, in my mind, in some of the 8 these subdivisions. It is aesthetic, and also a drainage 9 issue. If we start increasing the road cuts on the sides of 10 these hills, we're increasing the velocity and the direction 11 of the flow quite a bit. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Want to say something? 13 MR. JOHNSTON: That's exactly the reason that 14 we have variances. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's exactly it, 17 right there. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And so, anyway, we 19 probably ought to handle this in two motions, in my opinion. 20 Assuming we get -- and I'll make a motion to grant a variance 21 to put the electric and telephone utility lines under the 22 roadway where approved by the County Engineer in Falling 23 Water Reserve Subdivision. 24 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded by 5-27-03 44 1 Commissioners Letz and Nicholson, respectively, that the 2 Court approve variances to allow for telephone and electrical 3 utilities to be placed under the roadway in areas approved by 4 the County Engineer in Falling Water Subdivision in Precinct 5 3. Any further discussion on this motion? All in favor, 6 signify by raising your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. You had 11 indicated that there was a second item that you're -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The other item would be, 13 are we ready for final plat approval? 14 MR. JOHNSTON: You have a copy of the drainage 15 study in your backup there; it's been provided by an 16 engineering company in Boerne. We have the letters from 17 T.N.R.C.C. for the water system, the well and the water 18 system. Letter of Credit is in the title company. We have a 19 cover letter in here guaranteeing their -- their providing 20 it, and -- but they can't actually issue, they said, in this 21 case until the plat's filed. So, they're waiting to get a 22 number to put on the -- on the thing, and then they'll give 23 it to us, but it's essentially in the escrow in the title 24 company right now. And I think all the -- everything is 25 there. 5-27-03 45 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Fantastic. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Only question I had, and 3 it's -- and I probably shouldn't bring this up; maybe it's 4 nitpicky. On the letters from T.N.R.C.C., the subdivision 5 name referred to the Falling Waters. 6 MR. CRENWELGE: It's -- it's actually called 7 the Reserve at Falling Water, and the plans show it as the 8 Reserve at Falling Water, three sets of documents. The 9 T.C.E.Q. had to approve the water well, had to approve the 10 booster station, had to approve the distribution system. But 11 it's -- in the actual copies, it's Reserve at Falling Water. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I presume by the I.D. 13 number -- 14 MR. CRENWELGE: They look at the I.D. number. 15 MR. JOHNSTON: You're actually extending the 16 Falling Water, the one where you're adding boosters and all 17 that. 18 MR. CRENWELGE: We're connecting the water 19 systems together. 20 MR. JOHNSTON: This will have a water system, 21 but it will be supplied by water at Falling Water. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The study is in order, 23 Franklin? 24 MR. JOHNSTON: Pardon? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The drainage study is in 5-27-03 46 1 order? 2 MR. JOHNSTON: Yes. There are some detention 3 ponds already there that provided the -- all the requirements 4 that we require. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll move for final plat 6 approval of the Reserve at Falling Waters. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 8 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: We have three seconds. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's right. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: I can just pick and choose 13 whatever I want. Motion -- motion made and seconded by 14 Commissioners Letz and Nicholson that we approve final plat 15 of Falling Water Subdivision in Precinct 3. Any further 16 discussion or comments? All in favor of the motion, signify 17 by raising your right hand. 18 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 20 (No response.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. 22 MR. CRENWELGE: Thank y'all very much. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Good development. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: 1.5, consider and discuss 25 authorizing Road and Bridge to haul materials to Red Rose 5-27-03 47 1 Ranch for 4-H project. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I put this on the agenda. 3 This is similar to an approval we did several months ago to 4 authorize Road and Bridge to haul some material out for 4-H 5 shooting range. That was done. That was some fill material 6 that came out of -- I believe from K.I.S.D. This is to haul 7 some road base material, I believe. And I believe -- I mean, 8 I see a blank look on Leonard's face. I thought Laurinda had 9 talked to you. I told Laurinda to work out the details; I'd 10 put it on the agenda to approve it. Base material. They 11 want it hauled out at your convenience. 12 MR. ODOM: Okay. Len Odom. Laurinda had 13 mentioned base, but when Jack called me the other day -- 14 Friday, I guess it was -- he said it was topping rock. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It could be. I'm -- it's 16 material. I put down "materials" on the agenda. 17 MR. ODOM: My understanding is that Jenschke 18 was going to do the work and that he was going to haul the 19 material out to Red Rose. At first I thought it was us 20 hauling the base material and stockpiling it, but my 21 understanding is it's -- it's topping rock, is what he needs 22 for the sealcoat. So, I have no problems either way; I just 23 need a verification. I would assume that I'm going on 24 about -- they told me a half a mile by 12 feet wide for 25 double penetration, so I told them 50 yards each would be 5-27-03 48 1 more than enough to take care of those if that road is that 2 long; you know, calculations come out as they told me. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Well -- 4 MR. ODOM: I have no problem. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. That being said, 6 I'll make a motion to authorize Road and Bridge to haul the 7 material to Red Rose Ranch for 4-H. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And that's all we're 9 talking about -- second. That's all we're talking about, is 10 hauling material? We're not taking graders out there and 11 smoothing things? 12 MR. ODOM: I don't wish to do that at all. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, hauling material. 14 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Who owns Red Rose 15 Ranch? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's owned by Jack Burch's 17 wife, I guess. And it's -- but the County leases the 18 facility on the ranch for a 4-H shooting facility. We have a 19 20- or 40-year lease on that. To get to -- this is the road 20 to that facility. 21 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Mr. Odom and I have 22 been looking at other privately owned roads where the owners 23 had asked us to -- to haul material. They were using it 24 to -- to upgrade the road. Is this -- and we said no, of 25 course. Is this clearly different, then? 5-27-03 49 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, it's to a County 2 facility. The 4-H facility is a County-operated facility. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The road only goes to 4 that facility? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And, I mean, I guess -- 6 you said "only." It probably could go other places, but it 7 goes to the facility, so we're -- and this is the third time 8 that I'm aware that this Court has authorized County 9 materials to be used for the construction of this County 10 facility. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions? 12 Motion's been made and seconded by Commissioners Letz and 13 Baldwin, respectively, that the Court approve Road and Bridge 14 and authorizing Road and Bridge to haul materials to Red Rose 15 Ranch for 4-H facility out there. All in favor of the 16 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Next item 21 on the agenda is 1.6, consider and discuss revision of Kerr 22 County Personnel Policy concerning longevity, educational, 23 merit, and other raises. I put this on the agenda after some 24 concerns were raised initially by the Sheriff and the County 25 Treasurer concerning some of the provisions of that policy 5-27-03 50 1 that was adopted, I think, in 2000; is that correct? 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: And are now coming to more 4 fruition, since this is now the -- this current coming budget 5 year will be the third year for some of these longevity 6 increases, and that's what prompted this discussion. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: If I may, it's easier 8 just to show you. It's all concerning Paragraph 5 and what's 9 below that paragraph in the policy that is really kind of 10 inequitable to -- the whole basis of the policy was to keep 11 longtime employees, and I believe the very last paragraph in 12 there states that. But the way that policy's set up with the 13 one-year and the three-year cost-of-living -- or not 14 cost-of-living, longevity, and then the three in a row, if 15 you had an employee here in 2000 when the policy was 16 adopted -- and especially, like, deputies; they got a raise 17 due to Nash. They upped that pay scale to -- to try and 18 compensate for some things, so they got a raise right there. 19 According to the policy, they don't get another one until 20 this October, 2003, okay, by longevity is when they would get 21 their -- their longevity raise. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is the first 23 number? I can't read your hen-scratching. 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's hen-scratch. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Zero? 5-27-03 51 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 2000, when the policy 2 came into effect. 3 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: October? 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: October 2000. Now, if we 5 hired somebody in November or December or January, whatever, 6 of 2001, the end of -- after October of 2000, and that 7 person's been here one year, he gets a one-step raise, so 8 this person that's been here five, ten years or whatever is 9 now making less than the one that's been here one year due to 10 the way the policy is. So, it does hamper those that are -- 11 that are long-term employees that should be taken care of. 12 The other portion of this policy that has -- we found out, 13 especially this year, that hurts us is, it says you cannot 14 get more than two raises in one year, an educational and a 15 longevity. And then there -- that's one portion of it. I 16 think that -- is that Paragraph 2, Pat? Or -- 17 JUDGE TINLEY: No, that's 5 also. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 5 also. And then you 19 cannot have a raise -- 20 JUDGE TINLEY: You misspoke when you said you 21 cannot get more than two. You cannot get two in one year, 22 education and/or longevity. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's correct. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. All these raises 5-27-03 52 1 take effect, the way it's currently set up, in October. If I 2 have a person that got his advanced certificate in November 3 of that year, okay, he will not see that step until October 4 of the following year, so he goes a whole year without that 5 raise. Then if he was due a longevity here also, he's only 6 going to get one of the two. He's not going to get that 7 raise he's already been without for a whole year because of 8 his certificate for another whole year, or he's not going to 9 get his longevity. Okay? He can't have two. And then, when 10 you go to that, so maybe he'll get his certificate here; he 11 won't get his longevity, shouldn't get it until here, so 12 he'll finally get it here, and he's due for another 13 certificate here. He won't get that. So, it totally hampers 14 when they should get it, and it could be two years before 15 they see the raise that they should have gotten with their 16 certificate. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't mean to be 18 laughing, Rusty. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I know, just get after 20 me. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm laughing because of -- 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: My drawing. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- your drawing is not 24 much help. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It is to me. But what 5-27-03 53 1 I'm -- what I'm talking about -- and my suggestion would 2 be -- and I met with Barbara and we talked about it, and if 3 the department heads, in figuring our budgets, figure our 4 employees' salary like -- like Pat's had us doing, and then, 5 of course, it all goes back to Barbara to be refigured and 6 she submits it. But if we -- I can pretty well tell where my 7 guys are on their educational. I can definitely tell their 8 anniversary dates. If this County would just adopt a policy 9 that if you have an anniversary date that gets you in line 10 for a longevity, the next pay period you ought to see that 11 increase in your next paycheck. And that can be figured 12 budget to budget. If I have an educational coming up and 13 I've got my guys that I know they got so many years of 14 service, they got so much training already, they'll be due 15 their educational during this year, I can pretty well figure 16 when that's going to be and include that in my budget 17 proposal to make sure the budget lines are -- are covered 18 each year. And that way it's fair to everybody. If they get 19 their educational raise, they ought to see it in their next 20 paycheck; they shouldn't see it two years or a year down the 21 road. And if they get their longevity for their anniversary, 22 they ought to see it then. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, are you saying -- 24 are you saying eliminate the part about you can't get two? 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Eliminate -- 5-27-03 54 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just go ahead and give 2 them everything? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Eliminate the part you 4 can't get two in one year. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Uh-huh. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Eliminate the three years 7 in a row and give it to them when they've earned it, whether 8 they have it on their anniversary date or their educational 9 date. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Are you also suggesting that we 11 not plug this in at the beginning of the fiscal year, but 12 merely plug it in on the pay period next following, for 13 example, their attainment of an educational stepping stone, 14 or the one-year or three-year, as the case may be, and do it 15 on a per-employee basis? If they came to work, for example, 16 in -- in December, that they wouldn't have to wait until the 17 second fiscal year following, but rather, the following -- 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: One year, they'd get 19 their -- 20 JUDGE TINLEY: One year. As to that employee, 21 it would begin the second pay period in December, for 22 example? 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: A year following. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'm suggesting that, and 5-27-03 55 1 that can be figured as long as we have -- like, this year 2 Thea gave us what the FICA's going to be and what the 3 retirement's going to be that we could figure into that, and 4 then we can figure the salary, and with the step and grade 5 scale that the County uses, you can figure in the next one. 6 And, normally, the cost-of-living that the County gives each 7 year is a 2.5, which is another step right along with that 8 scale, and you can figure all that in. Now, the only other 9 portion of this that I feel really needs to be fixed is this 10 first portion where this guy that's been here 10 years or 11 whatever is now making less than this guy that's been here 12 one year because of longevity. I think we need to give the 13 guy that's been here 10 years -- start him with a one-step on 14 one year right here in 2000 when the policy was adopted. 15 That would put him up to that. Then he's due for his other 16 one this year. 17 MS. UECKER: Rusty, are you saying that he's 18 going to be making less, minus the cost-of-living increases 19 that that person that's been there 10 years has been getting? 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. 21 MS. UECKER: Okay. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: A lot of my employees -- 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How does this figure 24 in to cost-of-living? 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It doesn't really figure 5-27-03 56 1 in cost-of-living. It's longevity. But, yes, because that 2 cost-of-living ups the whole step and grade scale, everybody 3 starts with a cost-of-living, so cost-of-living has no effect 4 on it. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's right. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. What has effect is 7 the longevity. 8 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Seems to me that the 9 policy set about to encourage people to stick around and 10 learn their job, perform better, be more productive, and also 11 set about to encourage the peace officers to get additional 12 education and reward them for that. And then we came down to 13 the bottom of it, put this Number 5 in there that says, yeah, 14 but we don't want you to improve too much. We don't want you 15 getting too much education, so we're going to -- we're going 16 to take the reward away in certain cases. I would recommend 17 that we strike Rule 5, and also recommend that we agree with 18 Rusty that they ought to get their -- their increase for 19 their certificate soon after they get the certificate. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Rather than have a benchmark 21 date of the beginning of each fiscal year? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I conceptually agree on 23 both points. My only problem in doing anything today is the 24 budget impact of doing this, both in this year's budget and 25 next year's budget, and I think we need to delay -- put 5-27-03 57 1 this -- defer this into the budget process. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'd like to hear some 3 input also from Ms. Nemec regarding how it affects personnel. 4 I'd like to have her position on it. 5 MS. NEMEC: Thank you, Commissioner Williams. 6 In working with the longevity increases and educational 7 increases this year, we did find all these flaws, and of 8 course, when it was put into effect without really working 9 with the numbers and seeing how it's going to affect 10 everything, I don't think that we could have really 11 envisioned thus far the problems that we're having. But 12 everything that was presented this morning by the Sheriff is 13 -- I agree with. We've discussed it, and I do see where 14 there are some employees that are really not getting what 15 they have earned by the policy. By the way, the policy is 16 set. And you know, of course, all the figures that have been 17 submitted have been submitted on this policy, so if we were 18 going to do anything different, then we'd have to go back and 19 refigure everything differently. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, are you saying 21 that -- in agreeing with the Sheriff, you're saying that an 22 employee, on October 1st of any given year, could receive a 23 cost-of-living increase, if the Court approves same, all 24 right, and perhaps one or two months later, that employee 25 could be or is eligible for a step and grade and would 5-27-03 58 1 receive that increase? Okay. 2 MS. NEMEC: As far as, like, educational. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If that employee, 4 likewise, had an educational certificate to be honored within 5 that same year, that employee could receive that one as well? 6 MS. NEMEC: Right. As long as we -- 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, theoretically, 8 that employee could receive three increases based on 9 cost-of-living, based on longevity, and based on an 10 educational achievement within the space of a 12-month period 11 of time. It's technically possible, correct? 12 MS. NEMEC: It is. It is. And, actually, 13 before the Sheriff brought this up to the Judge, I had -- 14 when I started working on the schedule and the position 15 schedule and everything, I had made a phone call to the Judge 16 and explained to him that I was seeing some -- some problems 17 with the policy, so I kind of had already figured that there 18 was something -- and the Sheriff called me, so we discussed 19 it, and he had already put it on the agenda. 20 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: To help the elected 21 officials and department heads in their budgeting, could 22 we -- if we're going to agree to strike Rule 5, could we 23 agree now to do that and make it effective with the new 24 budget year? 25 (Discussion off the record.) 5-27-03 59 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can certainly do that, 2 but we could also direct the Judge -- or ask the Judge, 3 whatever, through the budget process to act as if it's been 4 done; then we can make that decision. I mean, it could be a 5 pretty tight budget year, and I think it very well may be, 6 and I hate to make a big consequence in our budget until we 7 know how much money we're going to have to work with. You 8 know, and it may affect a lot -- a lot of these things. But 9 I think that we clearly need to figure out how to fix the 10 problem, whether it's done in one year or two years, or 11 figure out how to phase it in. So, I think it's a -- you 12 know, it would make sense to me to -- for the Judge to direct 13 all the elected officials and department heads, you know, to 14 make some assumptions based on what, you know, the Court may 15 or may not do. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, under those 17 circumstances, I would need for the Treasurer, as the 18 personnel and payroll officer, to give me the benefit of that 19 information. Certainly, I -- I'll work off whatever 20 information I'm given, depending upon how the Court wants to 21 look at it, but I -- I'd be real concerned -- just for the 22 rest of this budget year, things are not in probably the best 23 shape that they need to be. I'd be real reluctant to even 24 adopt any policy that might affect any portion of this 25 current budget year. That -- that would be a concern. I 5-27-03 60 1 would also note that Judge Vance Elliott has filled out a 2 participation form to speak on this item. Before we get too 3 far down the road, I'd like to give him the opportunity to 4 speak. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, may I make a 6 comment before -- 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Sure. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- before the good 9 judge comes up? I agree that we should not impact this 10 budget that we're in right now, and I don't -- I don't know 11 if it does or not. You know, we have an agenda item here 12 with 40 or 50 pages in it that are 100 percent something that 13 we have done, that we've already done. And I know what we 14 did. And I voted against this program, by the way. But I 15 want to see something on what you want us to do, and I want 16 to see it in writing. Just like -- I mean, I don't want 50 17 pages, but I want it in writing to -- to know so we'll all be 18 on the exact same page and know exactly what you're saying. 19 We certainly can't read your handwriting. (Laughter.) So, 20 maybe -- 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'll get the Judge to 22 type it, Commissioner. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Get someone to type it 24 for you; probably couldn't read your typing either. But, you 25 know, to lay out the plan, and I just think that would be -- 5-27-03 61 1 there's some wisdom in that. And that's all. I just -- I'm 2 -- I don't think we -- we need to be adopting any kind of 3 policy right now that -- with the possibility of affecting 4 the -- and my other question is, are we talking law 5 enforcement only? 6 MS. NEMEC: No. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good. 8 MS. NEMEC: No, this affects the other 9 employees also. 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The longevity would 11 affect everybody. The educational is mainly law enforcement. 12 And what I'm -- what I'm asking, in a nutshell, is -- is -- I 13 think everybody and all elected officials would agree that 14 this current budget we're in right now, this is not what 15 we're looking at here. It's not what I'm looking at. It's 16 in preparing for next year's budget, to make it equitable to 17 everybody involved. And, in a nutshell -- and, Commissioner 18 Baldwin, I will get you something in writing, but what we're 19 asking is that the two raises in one year be stricken out of 20 here, okay, being the educational -- the three raises, where 21 you can't have three in three consecutive years be stricken 22 out of this, and that you go back to your anniversary dates, 23 whether it's educational or whether it's longevity, to 24 receive the raise. 25 MS. NEMEC: That's where it's going to affect 5-27-03 62 1 the other employees that are not law enforcement, 'cause that 2 one -- 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, it's for -- yeah, 4 next year. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's a budget matter. 6 (Discussion off the record.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm going to get to you, Judge. 8 Come forward, please. 9 JUDGE ELLIOTT: I could really simplify this 10 for the rest of the employees. For example, when I hired my 11 court coordinator, her effective date was January 2003. So, 12 I received the request from Barbara to project for my budget 13 next year. So then I would say, okay, she is eligible for a 14 longevity -- one-year longevity increase effective 15 January 2004. So, what I would do is simply budget her 16 current step for October, November, and December, and Step 2 17 grade from January, when she would receive her annual, 18 through the end of the next budget year. This can easily be 19 done, and it's just all I want to address. As far as the 20 other -- the issues about education and those things that the 21 Sheriff has to -- to introduce to you, if that's a little 22 complicated, what I do want to suggest is this one is real 23 simple; is just allow the employees to receive their one-year 24 longevity on their anniversary date, contingent on the 25 elected official or department head submitting that in the 5-27-03 63 1 budget year. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hear, hear. 3 JUDGE ELLIOTT: In other words, don't come 4 back, you know, later and say, "Hey, my employee hit one 5 year. Where's my raise?" Well, you didn't budget for that, 6 elected official. And that's very simple. But for me to sit 7 here and be able to, obviously, calculate three months at her 8 current step and the other nine months at her new step for 9 the next budget year, you've got plenty of notice of that. I 10 think that's a pretty simple process, and it should be 11 implemented to reward employees on their anniversary date, as 12 in all private businesses, when they give a person an 13 increase on their anniversary, it's on their anniversary, not 14 some next fiscal budget year deadline. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with you, 16 Judge. 17 JUDGE ELLIOTT: Thank you. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you for 19 clarifying and simplifying. 20 MS. NEMEC: I have one other question that 21 came up that I would like to offer for consideration. I 22 don't recall what the policy -- and it doesn't state in the 23 policy and I don't recall what the discussion was on 24 longevity for elected officials, but I did not include any 25 elected officials in the longevity figures. And then it was 5-27-03 64 1 brought to my attention that, "Why were the elected officials 2 not included?" So, anyway, my question to you is, that's 3 something that we need to discuss and see if they were 4 originally supposed to be included. And a problem that I 5 have found by not including them is that we have an employee 6 who is making -- will be making $3 less than an elected 7 official because of the longevity, and so that's just for 8 your info. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To follow up a little bit 10 what Commissioner Baldwin said, you know, I'm voting on -- or 11 not voting. I think if, you know, the Judge or Barbara or 12 whoever can come up with the actual policy that's being 13 recommended and bring that back to the Court, then we can 14 look at the full policy, as opposed -- and, you know, as 15 opposed to having it done through memorandums, the way it was 16 last time. That would, I think, help everyone. And my other 17 comment is, there are other elected officials here. Do any 18 of them want to make a comment? 19 JUDGE ELLIOTT: I would like for the 20 Commissioners Court to -- 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Other. Other. 22 JUDGE ELLIOTT: I understand. By god, I put 23 in my paperwork, okay? Yeah. I just request that the 24 Commissioners Court at least vote on the longevity, one 25 year -- the one-year longevity increase to be awarded on the 5-27-03 65 1 anniversary date of the employee, if the elected official or 2 department head submits it in their budget for the next year. 3 That's what I'm asking; at least take care of that today. 4 What we could do is, we have plenty of time before the June 5 6th deadline to get that -- get that budget back to you. 6 MS. NEMEC: That would also be for -- for 7 whichever, not just the one-year. 8 JUDGE ELLIOTT: I'm asking for you to at least 9 clarify the one-year. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: In order -- in order 11 for them to present to the Judge a budget and the right 12 figures to be in it, he's right. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's the budgetary 14 impact this year, county-wide? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, if we do it 16 effective now, it will have an impact. I don't know why -- 17 you know, Judge or us, if we have to, you know, make a -- or 18 pass an order to direct Barbara to come up with these 19 numbers, we can do that, but I think she can do that on her 20 own. 21 JUDGE ELLIOTT: But it could become -- I'm 22 saying for the order to be passed today, it would be 23 effective the next fiscal budget year. You can do that 24 today. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can do it today, but 5-27-03 66 1 I'd rather do it on the policy so we don't have more than one 2 page floating around with our policy. 3 MS. NEMEC: Okay, I have a suggestion. You 4 have the figures -- I've given everyone the figures, what it 5 takes to implement this policy, and I think I -- I know 6 exactly what needs to be changed to meet the needs of 7 everything that we discussed. I can -- I can rewrite the 8 policy as to what we discussed today, and then along with 9 that, attach the new figures that it would take to implement 10 that policy, and then you can decide from there. Would y'all 11 like me to do that? 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's more workable. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think that's very 14 nice. I mean, I'm not going to vote on anything without it, 15 I can tell you that. 16 MS. NEMEC: Okay. Let me do that, then. And 17 I still have the question on the elected officials. 18 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: On a related subject, 19 I want to express my concern about the compensation levels of 20 our lowest-paid employees. I understand that some of our -- 21 that some of our lowest-paid employees qualify for public 22 assistance. That doesn't feel right to me. I think the 23 County has an obligation to pay its employees well enough 24 that they don't qualify for public assistance. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree with you 100 5-27-03 67 1 percent. 2 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'm just bringing it 3 up now so that we can be thinking about it. I know it will 4 probably have at least some, if not significant, impact on 5 the budget. And we need some -- in order to consider that 6 more fully, we need some additional information, and I recall 7 that Dr. Blackburn talked about this about a year ago, about 8 our hourglass economy, so I'm going to ask Dr. Blackburn -- 9 or maybe Thea's got that report that he made. But, anyhow, 10 I'm going to want to talk about that in the budget process. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Excellent. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Do we have any other elected 13 officials or department heads that wish to be heard on this 14 personnel pay issue that's before us now? Ms. Pieper? 15 MS. PIEPER: Everything that's been said is my 16 thoughts exactly. I have two employees that basically had to 17 wait two years to get their first anniversary increase. 18 MS. RECTOR: So did I. 19 MS. UECKER: The only question I might have 20 is, I disagree with the Judge's statement that the increase 21 should be effective on the anniversary date contingent on the 22 elected official turning it in. That should not be our 23 responsibility, I don't think. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Why not? 25 JUDGE ELLIOTT: Sure, it should. 5-27-03 68 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Why not? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Absolutely, it's your 3 responsibility. 4 JUDGE ELLIOTT: We submit the budget. 5 MS. UECKER: I know, yeah, we should put it in 6 the budget, but I don't think that it should be left out if 7 we don't. I mean, that -- Barbara works with those figures, 8 and, you know, she knows as well as anybody what those dates 9 are. 10 JUDGE ELLIOTT: I tell Barbara -- what would 11 happen is the elected official puts it in the budget. When 12 it comes up for that anniversary date, Barbara would confirm, 13 yes, this is their anniversary. But it's not her job -- it's 14 not her job to submit it and get it put in. 15 MS. UECKER: That's different. That's fine. 16 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Too much detail. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other elected official or 18 department head have any input at this time on this 19 particular matter? 20 MR. PICKENS: Bobby Pickens, Constable, 21 Precinct 1. Being a former county employee in a different 22 county, we had the longevity and the education merit that 23 Sheriff Hierholzer is requesting. I can see it from both 24 ways. And I'm in agreement with all the other elected 25 officials. I feel, like Mr. Nicholson said, if you were 5-27-03 69 1 looking at the longevity, the education pay, that's merit 2 that's being required by the State of Texas; not just law 3 enforcement people, but as far as County Clerk, District 4 Clerk and all. You'll be able to keep your people here that 5 want to stay here and keep the morale up. I'm in favor of 6 what they're requesting. As long as you keep that going, you 7 keep the morale up, your people are going to want to stay 8 here and keep their family here. If they can go off to 9 another agency or another county, say, "We'll pay you for 10 this, this, and this," they're going to get up and leave. 11 MR. BALLARD: Well, we've been threatened with 12 that before. 13 MR. PICKENS: I understand. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we've done 15 everything that we can possibly do to meet those needs, and 16 we will continue to do so. And I hope we don't hear that 17 threat this year. 18 MR. PICKENS: I'm not making a threat. I'm 19 just saying I'm seeing it from both ways. And being on 20 that -- 21 JUDGE ELLIOTT: Because, you see, all of 22 Constable Pickens' employees may get up and leave if this is 23 not passed. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're talking mass 25 exodus here. 5-27-03 70 1 JUDGE ELLIOTT: Yeah, right. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Is there a motion 3 to be made on this item from any member of the Court? Being 4 none, we will move on. I think, at this point in time, it 5 would be appropriate to take a short recess. We'll be in 6 recess until 20 minutes before the hour. 7 (Recess taken from 10:32 a.m. to 10:40 a.m.) 8 - - - - - - - - - - 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I'll call the meeting 10 back to order after our recess. We will resume our May 27th 11 meeting. Next item is 1.7, consider and discuss authorizing 12 Sheriff's Office to apply for a SWALM Foundation grant to 13 fund high-speed notification system. I assume the Sheriff 14 will tell us what SWALM stands for. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's a private foundation 16 grant along the same lines as, like, the Peterson Foundation. 17 They pay 100 percent; it's just not located locally, but you 18 can apply for them. It's one of these in just our going out 19 trying to search grants that would fit this type of program, 20 that we would try and apply for this is one that we found. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is the high-speed 22 notification system? That's really the question. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: What that is, 24 Commissioner, is in this grant, it would be 24 phone lines 25 that come into the Sheriff's Office into a computer system 5-27-03 71 1 that anything can be programmed into to do a high-speed 2 notification of residents or citizens of the county. It is 3 used in a number of other counties in other states at this 4 time to notify for such things, if you have -- an example 5 would be a bank robbery at one of your banks. You set this 6 up where -- where your bankers and your bank organizations in 7 your county would send in their information. There's a form 8 that they fill out; they send it in. That number's 9 programmed into that computer, and if there's a bank robbery, 10 a person can program it to leave a message that there has 11 been a bank robbery; we're, you know, currently looking for a 12 subject described as this, driving this. And you -- it will 13 automatically notify every bank in your area in your county 14 that that's what's going on. It automatically dials the 15 phone and calls. 16 You can do the same thing in a flood 17 situation; we've had, you know, 10 inches of rain in the 18 Headwaters of the Guadalupe River, and you can notify 19 everybody downstream automatically by phone. If you're 20 searching for a lost child is one of the big times that it's 21 used. And if you have a young kid who doesn't show up from 22 school after school's out, maybe they just went to a 23 friend's house to visit, but nobody knows. Mama's reporting 24 him possibly kidnapped or whatever, and this will notify 25 that group in that area of anything you have going on 5-27-03 72 1 automatically. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is this a Rusty Alert, 3 like the Amber Alert? We going to call it the "Rusty Alert"? 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, don't call it the 5 Rusty Alert. It's just a county-wide deal. In our capital 6 murder, okay, that we had last month, we had a lot of 7 concerned citizens that -- we were all working the scene; 8 they were concerned, trying to call Letz and trying to call 9 everybody, find out what's going on. Do they need to -- are 10 we going to have a manhunt in that area? Do they need to be 11 afraid of anything in their area? And this type of system 12 would allow automatic notification of any significant event 13 going on in that area or county-wide, however you program the 14 computer, get that programmed into there. 15 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Rusty, does that mean 16 that if we've got a rapidly rising river, that every phone in 17 the county's going to get a message? 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, you set it up in 19 groups. You can set it up, you know, by the area or the 20 people in it. If it's everybody along the river, when you 21 send out the form for them to fill out, you can have that 22 they -- they want to be notified in case of the river rising; 23 that they live at such-and-such place and need automatic 24 notification, especially if it's 2 o'clock in the morning, 25 which most of them end up being, okay, that it notifies that 5-27-03 73 1 whole group. Or you can set it to notify county-wide anybody 2 you have in that system, okay, that you've programmed in. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Rusty, couple of 4 questions -- are you finished, Dave? 5 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah, for now. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: One, is it one phone line, 7 or does it go simultaneously to multiple phone lines? 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 24 phone lines. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 24 phone lines? Okay. 10 The grant, what does it cover? And what I'm talking about 11 is, you have 24 phone lines which you have to pay for. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Then we also have this 14 system, and I think it's a neat system, but it's only going 15 to be as good as the data we put into it. How much is that 16 going to cost, and where is that money coming from? 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. The grant is 18 covering the total initial setup; the computer, the phone 19 lines, installation and anything like that, copying the 20 forms, getting forms mailed out or handed out or distributed 21 to people. You know, it's going to be through, like, 22 community groups or -- or subdivision/homeowners' 23 associations, things like that, where we hand out part of our 24 crime prevention stuff, to hand out those forms and get them 25 distributed. And I think once it -- once it's discovered, 5-27-03 74 1 people will also be requesting the forms so they can get 2 notified in certain events and that kind of stuff. The 3 reoccurring costs after the first year are the monthly phone 4 bill, okay, which is just the hookup fee itself; it's not 5 long distance on there, but that would be what we would have 6 to absorb after that. After the first year, we'll have to 7 absorb that in the budget. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It seems to me that it's a 9 -- having cards go out and trying to update information is a 10 lot of work. Isn't there a way just to work with 911 or 11 phone companies or someone to do it geographically? Just 12 have either -- and if you could go by precinct; I mean, not 13 Precinct 3. I mean the small precinct numbers. And -- you 14 know, which would give pretty good coverage, it seems, of the 15 county, or something like that that doesn't require so much 16 paperwork and inputting and all that stuff. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That is probably very 18 possible. Since we're not at that stage yet, I really 19 couldn't tell you. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's something 21 that -- you know, the maintenance of it is my big concern. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is this 24 phone lines 23 in addition to what the Sheriff's Department has now? 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. Yes, this would 25 not -- right now, we have -- I think we have about 25 phone 5-27-03 75 1 lines coming into the Sheriff's Office, and we still get at 2 times a busy signal where you can't get out because they are 3 being used. And this is totally in addition to anything that 4 we have currently. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Could the -- could the 25 6 or the 24 lines be used for other things, some sort of a 7 switching system, so when you need to use it, all of a sudden 8 everyone else is blocked off of it? 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I really don't know if it 10 could be hooked up that way or not. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's the cost of 12 this? 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: $52,000. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Do you have an estimate of the 15 ongoing costs of keeping the system operational and whatever 16 other activities you need in order to make -- 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Our base telephone line 18 fee for 25 lines is about a thousand a month, so you're 19 talking about $12,000 a year. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Plus whatever manpower 21 you have to -- to devote to keep your database up. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. Which I don't 23 anticipate would be any -- I'm hoping, like Commissioner Letz 24 said, we can absorb some of that from 911. If we can get 25 through some of the technical, legal releases part of that, 5-27-03 76 1 them releasing that type information to us for that system, 2 where we would do it through our dispatch, since our dispatch 3 is just entering stuff into that system. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there -- on the 25 5 phone lines or 24 phone lines, I presume that's to allow a 6 certain penetration in a certain amount of time. Is there a 7 way -- and this is just a question. Is there a way possibly 8 to maybe get 12 new phone lines, and then have the phone 9 company set up a switching system so they could block out -- 10 when you need to use this, which would be fairly rare, I 11 hope, and I think it wouldn't be that often, is all of a 12 sudden, 12 of your existing lines could be blocked out and 13 use part of those lines, and you'll just be with a reduced 14 phone capacity for a short period of time while these calls 15 are being made? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I would hate to try and 17 do that, because anytime we have something major like that, 18 our normal phone lines are going, you know, nuts about that 19 time too, and we'll get extremely busy. So, I would rather 20 we stay -- and the company recommended -- DCC's rep has 21 recommended that in a county our size, the population we 22 have, is that you start out with 24 phone lines. Or that is 23 what you -- 'cause if you figure each phone call is 30 24 seconds to one minute, okay, per automatic phone call, it's 25 going to take a while even to where we get through a large 5-27-03 77 1 group of people. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval of the 3 request -- application. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 6 the Court approve the Sheriff -- authorizing the Sheriff to 7 apply for SWALM Foundation grant to fund the purchase of 8 high-speed notification system. Any further questions or 9 discussion? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just want to make a 11 comment. That 5,200 -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thousand. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: $52,000. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: $52,000 startup and 15 operating for a while? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We're actually asking 17 $62,000 to cover the other part for the hookups. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And is that -- and 19 then, next year or the year after, we don't get the grant. 20 Then the County picks up how much? And I heard that kind of 21 a question earlier, but -- 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Our base cost right now 23 for our phone lines is about a thousand a month, so it would 24 be about $12,000 a year in phone line costs. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The comment I have -- I 5-27-03 78 1 mean, I'm in favor of going out for the grant, but before we 2 accept it, we need to have a little more -- I need a little 3 more clarification as to some of these questions on phone 4 lines, exactly what that charge is going to be. Maybe we can 5 get some kind of a break on -- you know, because these phone 6 lines aren't going to be used that often. Maybe -- I mean, 7 once or twice a year at most, it seems to me. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Probably be used a little 9 more than that, but it -- I agree with you; maybe we can, 10 'cause it's only going to be -- it's a total public service, 11 and it's only outgoing calls, not incoming calls. It's 12 computer -- dialed by the computer. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think some of the issues 14 on that, because the ongoing cost is a concern to me as well, 15 that we need to work that out before we accept the grant. 16 And the fact that we receive it -- my sense of this -- does 17 not mean -- that means we're applying for it. We're not 18 accepting it. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 21 discussion? 22 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: With some creative 23 ideas, maybe we could figure some conjunctive use for it. 24 Telemarketing business -- 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No. 5-27-03 79 1 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Lease lines 2 commercially. I hate to see them sit there, $12,000 a year, 3 and use it twice a year, but maybe that's not impossible to 4 use them for some other conjunctive purpose. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 6 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 7 your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. I've -- I've 12 got a note that Judge O'Dell wanted to address the Court on 13 an item, and I'm not sure whether it's on the current item or 14 the upcoming item or exactly what it is. 15 JUDGE O'DELL: It's on repairing my computer. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. Well -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Must be a budget 18 amendment. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Does that have -- does that 20 have to do with a budget amendment that's -- 21 JUDGE O'DELL: No. I have $300 in my budget, 22 $200 for Equipment Maintenance and $100 Miscellaneous, and 23 it's going to cost approximately $289 to replace my hard 24 drive. And Shaun has looked at it approximately a week and a 25 half ago, and he said he doesn't know what's wrong with it 5-27-03 80 1 and he had to go research it and he would be back. And, once 2 again, he's not come back, sir. And I can't -- I can't 3 operate. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- I mean, it's 5 not a budget amendment, but I think we have a fund set up, 6 and Tommy can do a transfer through emergency purchases. I'd 7 recommend you get Tommy to do that, and then we can do a 8 budget amendment at our next meeting. I mean, our policy has 9 pretty much been that we will -- you know, if a computer goes 10 down, we fix it. 11 JUDGE O'DELL: Okay. So, do I have to wait, 12 Commissioner? Or -- 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You need to talk to Tommy. 14 JUDGE O'DELL: Okay. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: He has a fund available for -- 16 for things of that nature, is my understanding. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Contingency. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You want us to do this 19 today? Tommy's sick and not here. Isn't that -- so you can 20 talk to Thea. 21 JUDGE O'DELL: Pardon me? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Talk to Thea. 23 JUDGE O'DELL: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: She's got the money. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The answer is yes, you can 5-27-03 81 1 do what you need to do to get it fixed. And I don't know 2 exactly which funds. As long as we have money in that budget 3 line item. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, isn't it, 5 seriously, just a budget -- it's a budget item. If she needs 6 to have it fixed, she needs to have it fixed. And when it 7 comes time to pay for it, we'll do the necessary transfer to 8 get it done. 9 JUDGE O'DELL: Thank you. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Next item, consider 11 Mutual Aid Agreement for Multi-Jurisdictional Special 12 Operations Unit and authorize County Judge to sign same. 13 Mr. Motley? You ready on the Mutual Aid Agreement for 14 Multi-Jurisdictional Special Ops Unit? 15 MR. MOTLEY: The Special Operations Unit is 16 something that's basically, I guess, sort of created maybe at 17 the -- at the wish of the Kerrville Police Department, but it 18 is -- it's a special unit made up of persons who volunteer 19 for the participation in the unit, and they're paid for their 20 time by the different agencies involved. The City of 21 Kerrville, City of Fredericksburg, Kerr County, and Kendall 22 County are the four agencies that are involved. You know, 23 you get a barricaded suspect, any sort of unusual law 24 enforcement situation, we have a specially-trained team of 25 people. The Mutual Aid Agreement that's come in -- and it's 5-27-03 82 1 basically okay. There were a couple of areas that the 2 Sheriff read through and had -- I guess you would call them 3 some technical questions about. And I spoke with the 4 Assistant City Attorney, and she suggested that we can handle 5 those items by a memorandum agreement, and can do that 6 after-the-fact. 7 What I was going to suggest might be the 8 Commissioners Court allow Judge Tinley to sign off on the 9 agreement whenever we get an okay by Rusty or myself, and 10 I'm going to talk a little bit more with the City Attorney's 11 office about a couple of questions we had with some 12 budgeting questions about how this is to be paid for and 13 such as that. Right now, I as I understand it, the costs 14 are totally absorbed within this year's budget to be in 15 keeping with previous budget items. It's just one of the 16 deputies that is on the unit, and I think the Sheriff's 17 Department paid for the specialized equipment that was 18 necessary for them to be involved in this Special Operations 19 Unit. But I think the agreement is pretty good. There's, 20 as I said, a couple technical questions I think need to be 21 resolved before we sign it, or we need to have a very clear 22 understanding that a memorandum agreement will be 23 forthcoming before we sign it, something to that effect. 24 But I think the agreement's okay, pretty much. Do y'all 25 have any questions about it? 5-27-03 83 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I do. This is the City 2 of Kerrville's Special Ops? 3 MR. MOTLEY: Well, it's a Multi-Jurisdictional 4 Special Operations Unit. I think -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Never heard of it. 6 MR. MOTLEY: Well, this -- 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand the City 8 has one. 9 MR. MOTLEY: Well, it's really -- it's really 10 -- it's really not -- I mean, the City has something else. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the -- 12 MR. MOTLEY: Rusty might be able to tell you a 13 little bit more about that. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Kerr County taxpayers 15 participate in it financially? 16 MR. MOTLEY: Well, when you say "financially," 17 the officer who's -- who participates in it, in the event 18 they're called out, that officer would be paid ordinary time 19 that they're paid for being an officer. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's not -- well, it's 21 not like the 216th Drug Task Force? 22 MR. MOTLEY: No. No, this is for dealing with 23 -- and maybe Rusty might be able to tell you a little bit -- 24 little bit better about their -- the -- you know, what they 25 -- what they do and the level of involvement right now, but 5-27-03 84 1 as I understand it, the sole deputy that's on this team is 2 paid for, if and when the team is activated, by ordinary, you 3 know -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: He's not exclusive over 5 with the Special Ops? He's a deputy? 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: If I may explain, this is 7 what you were referring to as the City's -- what they have 8 the is the S.O.U. unit. Used to -- long time ago, it used to 9 be kind of considered a SWAT unit, but now it's actually an 10 S.O.U. unit. We have one officer assigned to that unit. 11 Fredericksburg has a couple. Kerrville P.D. has about four 12 or five, and now Junction is going to have one. This unit is 13 to be activated at times when you have a barricaded hostage 14 situation or we have a riot somewhere or things like that 15 where you need this specialized training. They have the 16 bulletproof shields. They have what's called a pole camera 17 which can look inside different rooms in a house that are 18 barricaded, and there -- barricaded subject. And there are a 19 lot of expenses in it, and there's a lot of -- of extensive 20 training, okay, that has to go with each one of these 21 officers. They're hostage negotiators. They're, you know, 22 weapons experts and everything else with it. It was -- it 23 was originally formulated because when we do have serious 24 situations, the agencies around all do need help, and we try 25 and all help each other. 5-27-03 85 1 The question I have on this unit is, right 2 now I have one officer assigned, and I had paid, out of our 3 budget and part of our grant, his bulletproof vest, which 4 this type of vest is different than what the -- the patrol 5 officers wear. It's a lot -- it's more of a defense against 6 high-powered rifles and things like that, sniper-type 7 situation, and then some T-shirts that go along with that 8 vest. That -- that vest was about $2,000, so I paid for 9 that out of grant money and out of our vest budget. The 10 question is, they have a lot of the other equipment, such as 11 the van they have, the shields that they use, which are 12 about that thick, the pole cameras, the other specialized 13 weapons they have, things like that. They were the 14 recipients of the charity ball thing this year. They've 15 also done some other funding over the last couple of years 16 to -- to fund that organization, and I would -- I wanted to 17 see more in the funding and more of a committee deal to make 18 sure that -- that if the officer -- you know, each agency 19 involved is being -- is being -- is paying equally for -- 20 whether it's a personal officer's equipment, or whether it's 21 the equipment for the overall unit. 22 And I think the overall unit needs to be 23 funded in other ways that they have found to do that. But 24 we need to know where that funding's going and that, 'cause 25 I know they've bought some of the officers in that unit 5-27-03 86 1 weapons and things. My officer assigned has paid personally 2 out of his pocket for his weapons, so there's some things in 3 there that I think need to be addressed, which it says in 4 there "as can be agreed by the governing bodies." We have a 5 30-day back-out on that -- on that contract if we -- if we 6 decide it's not what we want. It's a -- it's a good unit. 7 It's needed to have specialized people in those areas, to 8 where you can get barricaded subjects out, you know. You 9 take our department; we have four members working at a time. 10 It's kind of hard to cover that. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me see if I understand you, 12 Sheriff. Your concern is -- or your understanding is that 13 other officers that perform this particular Special 14 Operations Unit, their equipment is funded through funds 15 received from fundraiser situations? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't know for sure. 17 But I don't know how all that new equipment, being weapons 18 that they have purchased or weapons that those officers are 19 carrying -- is that funded same as my officer? Is he -- are 20 those officers having to buy it out of their pocket, or is 21 that fund money they've raised going to that? I just want to 22 -- an equitable budget for every agency involved in it 23 spelled out somewhere, where we know. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: To this point, your officer 25 that's participating in this Special Operations Unit has 5-27-03 87 1 either had his equipment acquired, number one, out of that 2 officer's own individual pocket, or two, out of your budget 3 which you receive from this County; is that correct? 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's correct. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And they are -- 7 JUDGE TINLEY: You're talking about the other 8 stuff? 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And mine is -- the person 10 I have assigned to it is a patrol sergeant. He does his 11 normal duties, okay? If they have training, he does that 12 off-duty. He doesn't do it as -- as part of his on-duty 13 stuff. We have it set up where it's not costing us, other 14 than the one thing I did have to pay for, which was the 15 bulletproof vest, which we have to have bulletproof vests 16 anyhow; this is just a better one. And the other thing is, 17 that the mutual -- just as it's been in the old agreement, if 18 they're deployed, say, out in Kerr County and have to use 19 some of their tear gas equipment or some of their, you know, 20 percussion equipment, the equipment they use, then that 21 county or that city, wherever they're deployed, will replace 22 that equipment that's used during that operation. But those 23 kind of things I just want to see spelled out a little bit 24 more. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the agreement is a 5-27-03 88 1 good concept. It just seems there's a little bit of devil in 2 the details that need to be worked out. I'll put that to you 3 to work out that, because I think it's -- I agree, it needs 4 to be -- have some sort of open way of funding where everyone 5 that's participating gets equal treatment. And maybe -- 6 maybe it's happened that way, but I think it needs to be 7 spelled out. I think it's a real good idea; no reason for us 8 to have three different units under this type of specialized, 9 you know, training. 10 MR. MOTLEY: As I understand it, the funding 11 for the personal equipment, such as the bulletproof vest and 12 such as that, is paid by the individual participating 13 agencies. Supposedly, the charity money that was raised at 14 the fundraisers go for equipment used in common. You know, 15 Rusty is saying that the officer had to buy his own weapon, 16 but then again, that employee gets to keep that weapon. If 17 somebody else were to have theirs bought by the, you know, 18 charity funds, they would have to leave the equipment with 19 the Special Operations Unit when they left. And I think 20 Jonathan raises a good point about the budget, and I'm told 21 the reason that that was left a little bit vague is because 22 they're dealing with four different jurisdictions here. Each 23 one may have their own different budgeting constraints that 24 they're working with, and they wanted to leave it a little 25 bit open to accommodate the different budget mechanisms that 5-27-03 89 1 are in place. And, you know, Kimble County might be a good 2 place here. And it was suggested that that could be better 3 done by individual memorandum agreements with those four, you 4 know, participating agencies to accommodate their own special 5 budget requirements, and I think the memorandum might well do 6 that. It may be hard to do it quickly. I think that you 7 want to get this agreement signed, because if the Court would 8 see -- and we don't mind coming back at all -- I don't mind 9 coming back, but I thought the thing to do would be to get it 10 worked out in memorandum agreement, let Rusty look it over, 11 let me look it over, send it to the Judge, let him see what 12 he thinks about it, and then be pre-authorized to sign it. 13 If the Court would rather us come back, I can come back. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: One last question. Just 15 -- I know others can sign later. Is there a reason that 16 Gillespie County isn't on the -- you'd think that with the 17 City of Kerrville, City of Fredericksburg, that Gillespie 18 County would be -- 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: They just chose not to. 20 Fredericksburg P.D. is, but Gillespie County just chose not 21 to from the very onset, from the start. And all these guys, 22 like most of our agencies, do even firearms training together 23 out at Thunder Ranch. We already have that where we all work 24 together. It's a great concept. It's a great unit. But 25 there's some things memorandum-wise or whatever I want worked 5-27-03 90 1 out a little bit more than what this shows. But this is a 2 good, broad coverage in every kind of aspect, and I've used 3 them in the county before just to assist us in different 4 situations -- certain situations. 5 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I move that we 6 authorize the County Judge to sign, approve the Mutual Aid 7 Agreement for Multi-Jurisdictional Special Operations Unit. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 9 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Contingent upon the 10 County Attorney providing him advice as to the content and 11 the form of the agreement. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded by 14 Commissioners Nicholson and Baldwin that the Court approve 15 the Mutual Aid Agreement for Multi-Jurisdictional Special 16 Operations Unit and authorize County Judge to sign same upon 17 the approval of the County Attorney of Kerr County indicating 18 it's okay to sign it. Any further discussion? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have a further request. 20 I don't know -- I don't have a problem approving it now, but 21 I would request that the Sheriff come back in 30 days or 60 22 days and kind of give us an update as to some of these 23 concerns, let us know the status of that. Because this is 24 one of those things that -- you know, it may have some budget 25 consequences, and I think we need to make sure it's worked 5-27-03 91 1 out properly. I want to make sure that the Sheriff is 2 comfortable with it if we're going to leave it in place. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I agree. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 5 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 6 your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Next item 11 on the agenda is consider and discuss making June 7th, 2003, 12 "The Honorable Constable Don McClure Day." Constable 13 Pickens. 14 MR. PICKENS: Good morning, Judge, 15 Commissioners. Thank y'all. As y'all know, Don McClure 16 passed away this past March 7th of this year with a battle of 17 cancer. My request is that I would like for the 18 Commissioners Court of Kerr County to set aside June the 7th 19 of 2003, starting this year, and then from then on, every 20 June 7th as The Honorable Constable Don McClure Day, due to 21 the fact that Don had served this county for over 40 years as 22 a true Texas peace officer. He would have been 73 years old 23 coming this -- this June. He was a true Texas peace officer, 24 and he was very proud of it. There is not a man or woman in 25 this state that didn't know Don. To this day, I still get 5-27-03 92 1 phone calls, correspondence through the mail, requesting to 2 speak to Don, that have not been advised of his passing. He 3 was well-known throughout the state. He did a lot for the 4 people here in Kerr County. I feel that the Court should 5 recognize Don for his contributing to the deal. I know that 6 when he retired last year, y'all honored him on his 7 retirement, and then when the unfortunate passing of him 8 away, that y'all paid tribute to him right before his 9 funeral. 10 I'm working with State Representative Harvey 11 Hilderbran right now on -- at the state level as well in 12 making June the 7th Don McClure Day, and he advised me that 13 he is in the process of working on that as we speak. It 14 would be a nice reward for Don and his family to have this 15 day be recognized for him. Any consideration on this would 16 be greatly appreciated. If the Court would consider this 17 and pass this today, I, at my own expense, will go to the 18 trouble of having a plaque made, along with his picture put 19 on it, for the years of service in Kerr County, which, 20 again, over 40 years, and with the Court's permission, have 21 it displayed here in the courthouse next to Precinct 1's 22 office so that anyone and everyone that walked in here would 23 see the plaque. And it would also -- for his 10 grandkids 24 and 5 great-grandkids to be proud of and show the family 25 history. And to back that up, I've asked Mandy Kirkpatrick 5-27-03 93 1 to come and give her piece of why she would like to have 2 this passed. Mandy? 3 MS. KIRKPATRICK: I guess I've known most of 4 you guys since -- well, before I was born. But, anyway, at 5 any rate, y'all know how important my granddad was to me. He 6 was my mentor and my confidante and my best friend, and I 7 miss him a lot. But I think the most important things that 8 he taught me were twofold; when I decided to go into law 9 enforcement, the one thing he told me is, he said, "The 10 people who have committed a crime and the people who are on 11 the other side of the bars aren't any different than you and 12 me. They made a mistake, but that doesn't make them less 13 worthy of your respect." And I used that when I worked with 14 the Kerr County Sheriff's Department, and I was amazed at 15 what I could get accomplished as a 5-foot-2 female. I would 16 have very willingly walked into any one of the 18 man cells, 17 knowing full well that because I had respected everyone in 18 there the way that my granddad taught me to respect them, 19 that if one guy caused problems, 17 would be backing me up as 20 a jailer, not their buddies in the cell. 21 On top of that, he taught me a lot about 22 perception. And you guys know this just as well as I do. 23 He -- being raised in law enforcement, you have a tendency 24 to create a world that's very black and white. And what Pop 25 taught me is that it's not black and white; there are myriad 5-27-03 94 1 shades of gray. And just because it's illegal technically 2 doesn't make it, quote, wrong. He told me one time that he 3 would have no problem arresting a woman shoplifting for 4 makeup, but he would have a real problem arresting a woman 5 shoplifting baby food to feed her kids. That was a very -- 6 that was a distinction that he was able to make because of 7 his respect for the person, and because of his perception of 8 the -- of the views. And I think that that was important in 9 the way that I've learned to be accepting of people, and to 10 also know that I can walk into any situation and not demand 11 respect, but to earn it because of the way that I treat 12 people, because of the way he taught me to treat people. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hear, hear. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sounds like the same 16 guy I know. 17 MS. KIRKPATRICK: Yeah. Kind of crazy, isn't 18 it? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I move that we 20 declare June 7th Don McClure day in Kerr County. No 21 pictures, no plaques. And, I mean, it can go on year after 22 year after year if you want to, but don't expect us to 23 remember it next year. I mean, even if you want to have a 24 big celebration, don't -- 25 MR. PICKENS: I understand what you're saying, 5-27-03 95 1 Commissioner. That's why I'm asking that, at my expense, 2 I would be willing to have a plaque made to where it would 3 be -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bobby, no plaques and 5 no pictures, please. If -- if we -- if we did that, the 6 place would be covered with -- I mean, we get that all the 7 time. And I just don't think it's right to do one and not do 8 the other. I said no. Now, you want to continue this? 9 MR. PICKENS: Okay. Well -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 11 MR. PICKENS: With that, could I ask the 12 Sheriff a question, then? Sheriff, would you have a problem, 13 if I made the plaque, that you display it in your lobby of 14 your Sheriff's office? 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: In honor of Don, the 16 Sheriff's Office has already requested from the governor and 17 through the TCLEOSE a flag that can be presented to the 18 family in a case for any peace officer that served in the 19 state of Texas. We're waiting for that at this time. Many 20 of the employees throughout this courthouse and our office 21 have already donated to have a small plaque done to be 22 mounted next to a tree that will be planted on that 17 acres 23 out there at the Sheriffs Office in honor of Don, and the 24 plaque will be at the bottom of that tree. This has already 25 been in the works for some time now, and we're just waiting 5-27-03 96 1 for everything to get back to us before we actually do it. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think that's 3 excellent. 4 MR. PICKENS: Okay. Thank you, Sheriff. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: My motion is to declare 6 June 7th Don McClure Day. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: 2003, this year? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded by 11 Commissioners Baldwin and Letz, respectively, that the Court 12 make June 7, 2003, Honorable Constable Don McClure Day. Any 13 further discussion or questions? All in favor of the motion, 14 signify by raising your right hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. The next 19 item is consider and discuss a request for additional funds 20 to help offset the expenses for the increase of kids being 21 placed in foster care. The Child Services Board, Kerr 22 County. Mr. Pickens? 23 MR. PICKENS: Thank you on passing the 24 previous amendment -- request. What I'm going to hand for 25 y'all today is the Kerr County Child Services Board, which 5-27-03 97 1 I'm the president of, and the vice president, Sherry Cowell 2 here, is present as well. That shows you our budget that was 3 adopted last year of $5,000. What I've handed y'all is a 4 breakdown of how much is being spent per month on the kids 5 that are in foster care. Last year, we had come before y'all 6 on August the 26th for an emergency request for funds because 7 we had additional increase in kids as far as on school 8 supplies. Two years back, in 2001, we were averaging 9 approximately about 33 kids a year in foster care that we 10 were caring for. In the last two or three years, it has 11 increased, and we're averaging approximately 55 kids a month 12 that we're having to carry -- care for. 13 Back in May of last year, we had come before 14 Commissioners Court when we were on a night session, and we 15 were -- had asked y'all to sign off on an agreement with the 16 State on a nonfinancial contract, which that was passed with 17 the previous Commissioners Court, and at that time I 18 requested for us to be included in the budget workshop so we 19 could explain the increases. Unfortunately, we weren't 20 invited to any workshops, and we were just given the $5,000 21 again, which is -- although we greatly appreciate it. What 22 you have before you is the per-month and per-year -- the 23 steady increase that we're seeing on the kids. We're asking 24 for emergency funds of $995 to help offset for the school 25 supplies and birthday gifts which was adopted by the Court 5-27-03 98 1 to -- to spend on these children. Sherry? 2 MS. COWELL: If you'll flip through there, I 3 think the most important thing to look at is this chart. It 4 shows, from 2001, 2002, 2003 figures, we were consistently 5 running about 33 kids in 2001. In 2002, it went up to 6 40-something kids, and we ended up with 60, 61 kids towards 7 the end of the year. Now we're averaging about 55, so I 8 don't anticipate that that's going to go down. In fact, I 9 anticipate that's going to go up, because they're picking up 10 more kids all the time. So, we're -- we're hoping that -- we 11 need extra money to get us through this fiscal year if we're 12 going to pay for school supplies and for the gifts for the 13 children that have birthdays through September. And we're 14 hoping to be a part of the budget process, because obviously 15 our -- we've got 22 more kids than we've been having. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Say that last sentence 17 again? 18 MS. COWELL: We've got 22 more kids. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Right before that. 20 Part of the budget process? 21 MS. COWELL: We would -- I forgot, I'm sorry. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You want to go through 23 the budget process, or you want money today? 24 MS. COWELL: No. No, we want money today if 25 we can do it, to get us through this fiscal year. 5-27-03 99 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. Okay. 2 MS. COWELL: That's what we're asking. And 3 then we'd like to be a part of that budget process to address 4 needs for next year. 5 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I think I've got 6 three questions. These children are wards of the State of 7 Texas? 8 MS. COWELL: Yes. Yes, sir. 9 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: They're placed in 10 foster homes -- 11 MS. COWELL: Yes. 12 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: -- by the State, and 13 the State pays those foster parents to take care of these 14 children? 15 MS. COWELL: Reimburses them for their 16 expenses, yes. 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Some of them are 18 individual couples, and then there's other entities, 19 including the Hill Country Youth Ranch. My next two 20 questions are, what is the Kerr County Child Services Board? 21 What kind of an organization is it? How is it established? 22 And, two, what does it -- what are these funds used for? 23 MS. COWELL: Basically, it's volunteers who 24 form the board, and that's to oversee and help with the needs 25 that are not addressed by the State. Having -- I'm retired 5-27-03 100 1 from the State with Child Protective Services, so I know, 2 from 29 years of experience, that the State can't cover all 3 the needs that these kids have. And that's why the State 4 asks boards to spring up to raise money or have money to -- 5 you know, to supplement what the State couldn't provide. 6 Because when these kids come into foster care, they're coming 7 in in emergency situations. They're coming to foster 8 parents, and the foster parents have an initial outlay of at 9 least a couple hundred dollars just to get clothes on their 10 back, 'cause these kids come with nothing; no hairbrush, no 11 toothbrush. Lots of times they don't even come with 12 underwear. And I'm serious, 'cause I've picked those kids up 13 and I've delivered them. So, when these foster parents are 14 taking care of the kids' needs, besides clothing and doing 15 all the things that they need to do with them, taking them to 16 doctor's appointments, take them to staffing, take them to 17 parent/child visits, take them to therapy, you know, that's 18 stuff that they're not reimbursed for. 19 And so the board tries to spend $25 a year 20 for birthday gifts, $25 a year for -- per child for 21 Christmas gifts, and then we try to give them some money to 22 help with school supplies and hopefully a little bit left 23 over to maybe buy a pair of shoes for school. Besides 24 that -- that's just for foster kids. We also have kids in 25 Kerr County that have medical needs or dental needs that 5-27-03 101 1 they're not in foster care, but their parents are involved 2 with Child Protective Services or they're involved with the 3 school system, and teachers have identified that there's a 4 need for somebody to get a tooth extraction or something 5 else that's not paid for. They come to us and we -- we vote 6 on that using funds that you've appropriated for us. 7 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: What's the source of 8 your funds? 9 MS. COWELL: You. 10 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's all. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Does the law require 12 that the County have a Child Service Board? 13 MS. COWELL: Yeah. 14 MR. PICKENS: Yes. 15 MS. COWELL: Well, it does in that you've got 16 an agreement with the State that we do. Not every -- not 17 every county has a board. Most -- you know, I'd say 18 probably -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's been a long time 20 since I've read that, but there's something that triggers 21 that Kerr County is required to have a Child Service Board. 22 MS. COWELL: There's about -- still about 23 maybe 10 percent of the counties out there that don't have 24 one. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And then what that 5-27-03 102 1 does -- I'm not real sure what kind of guidance we give, but 2 somehow through the years, the County has adopted that we 3 would participate in those -- the birthday gifts and some 4 school supplies and a Christmas gift, and sometimes the 5 kids -- only thing they get for Christmas is through this 6 Court. But it's really grown, hasn't it? 7 MS. COWELL: Yeah, it has. It's -- I don't 8 think it's ever going to go back the way it was. 9 MR. PICKENS: One month we had pushing 66 10 kids. 11 MS. COWELL: Yeah. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What is the State 13 reimbursement rate for a foster parent? 14 MS. COWELL: If it's for basic care -- 15 basic-care home, which is just a -- basic care, you know, you 16 take them, you love them, you tuck them in, and you provide 17 basic care, I think C.P.S. is paying 16-something a day now, 18 so you're talking $500 a month. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And what does the 20 State do about medical -- taking care of medical needs? 21 MS. COWELL: The kids have Medicaid, and so if 22 they have Medicaid, if they have a provider that will take 23 it, if they have a dentist that will take it or a doctor that 24 will take it or a pharmacy that will take it, then those -- 25 most of those needs -- the medical needs of the children are 5-27-03 103 1 covered. And if they have therapy needs, most of them are 2 covered under Medicaid. But for -- like, for eyeglasses, 3 Medicaid pays $9 for the eyeglasses on a child. They pay for 4 the lens, but the eyeglass frame is $9, so most of our foster 5 parents, you know, dig in their own pockets to supplement 6 something nice for the kids. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: There are programs for 8 things such as that. Texas Lions, for example, has an eye 9 program that provides glasses and frames and so forth. 10 MS. COWELL: And we -- 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just like the -- 12 MS. COWELL: And the social workers tap that. 13 Because there are kids out there that don't have Medicaid; 14 they're not foster kids, that also have the same kind of 15 needs, and social workers locally tap these resources. 16 They're aware of them. The same thing with dental care. 17 There are lots of kids that don't qualify for Medicaid, but 18 they're involved with Child Protective Services because of 19 the parents providing marginal care, but they're not in 20 foster care. But the caseworkers try and tap resources for 21 them too, and sometimes they come to us for that. 22 MR. PICKENS: The reason we're here today is 23 because we'll meet -- our regular meeting is in June. We 24 take the month of July off because, again, we're all 25 volunteers. We also have family lives. School, as everybody 5-27-03 104 1 knows, all start, you know, August 16th, 17th, and that's 2 when we -- and we usually meet the second Monday of the 3 month, and that's when we try to have all our -- we vote on 4 how much to spend for school supplies and stuff to get these 5 kids up and running. That's why we're here before you today. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bobby, in your note it 7 says -- it says because of our -- because our current funding 8 is approximately $5,000. Is that how much the County -- 9 MR. PICKENS: Yes, sir, that's what the 10 Commissioners Court -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So the County puts in 12 $5,000. I don't see here what you're asking for. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Neither do I. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, what I'm going to 15 ask you to do, and I've asked you to do this before, is go 16 back, get with Tommy, and find out a firm figure to bring to 17 this Court. 18 MR. PICKENS: We have. It's right there, sir. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's in this packet 20 here? 21 MS. COWELL: Yes, sir. 22 MR. PICKENS: And at the end of -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm not going to vote 24 on this right now. I want to sit down -- let me finish, 25 please. I want to sit down and go through this packet and 5-27-03 105 1 understand about the dollars and cents. And the State 2 requires us to have a Child Service Board, and in that 3 requirement, it requires you to come to this Court and for 4 this Court to officially appoint your Board of Directors 5 every year. Haven't seen you in three years. 6 MS. COWELL: We came to you and asked to be on 7 the January agenda to do that, and we weren't put on it. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You came to me? 9 MS. COWELL: Mm-hmm. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And asked to be on the 11 agenda? 12 MR. PICKENS: Yes, sir. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I have -- 14 MR. PICKENS: And when we came in last year, 15 at the same time we asked to be considered for the workshop 16 so we could justify the request for additional funds. We 17 weren't invited to come. 18 (Discussion off the record.) 19 MR. PICKENS: Sorry. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see, it's my fault. 21 MR. PICKENS: No, and we weren't included in 22 the workshop, and that's why we're running short this year. 23 At the end of this month, we'll have $2,455.27 -- or .20 left 24 between now and September, and we're still going to be short 25 approximately $995 to help cover the expenses. And it's all 5-27-03 106 1 broke down there. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's a good cause. 3 And my problem is that -- I mean, I don't want to go back 4 into why we did or didn't hear your workshop and all that 5 last year, budget of $5,000. I think we left pretty much 6 all, if not all, the same last year. I don't know where the 7 money comes from. And that's -- and it's one of these items 8 that, you know, it's -- it certainly is a good cause, but 9 we're in a very tight budget this year already. 10 MR. PICKENS: I understand. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And, you know, I would 12 recommend trying to get -- go out and get community -- see if 13 you can raise money. I just don't see that we can do a 14 budget amendment. 'Cause, I mean, every agency that we 15 provide funding for similar to y'all's, and including, like, 16 volunteer fire departments, all of them are strapped for 17 cash, and it's difficult to say one -- you know, if you give 18 it to one, then why you shouldn't do it for another. And the 19 other alternative, if you can't raise money in the community, 20 would be maybe to lower the amount of school supplies to $65 21 for this year, and then, during this budget process, you 22 know, we can look at it again for next year. I'm not sure, 23 you know, how that process is going. Because you look 24 towards the Judge with funds of this nature and budget. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me make a suggestion about 5-27-03 107 1 future budgets. If you have a request that you want to make 2 relative to the upcoming budget year or future years, 3 certainly there's nothing wrong with you putting that request 4 in writing and forwarding it to my office so that you're on 5 record of what you're requesting. We have a number that have 6 already done so, and I expect there will be several more to 7 come. And at least one more -- now that I've put you on 8 notice, probably there's going to be one more coming. 9 MS. COWELL: Yes, sir. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: But that will get you in the 11 mix. 12 MS. COWELL: Okay. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: And then we'll see where we go 14 from there. 15 MS. COWELL: We can do that. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Next meeting is June 17 the 9th. 18 MR. PICKENS: Okay. See y'all then. 19 MS. COWELL: Thank you. 20 MR. PICKENS: Thank you. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further action on that 22 item? We'll move on to the next item, consider and discuss, 23 take appropriate action on accepting revisions to Kerr County 24 Parks and Recreation Master Plan, setting a date for public 25 hearing on that item. 5-27-03 108 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, the -- the 2 results of the input that we received from the workshop are 3 included in these two pages, which I believe are the only two 4 pages that are required under the revision. I apologize to 5 the Court for adding one that I failed to add in the 6 workshop, because sometimes you get so close to it, you 7 forget things. But I've long had a desire to attempt to find 8 grant funds to dredge out the silt from behind Center Point 9 Dam to improve the swimming area, and I would still like to 10 continue to try to find those funds; not County funds, but 11 event funds. So, it was included in the Goals and 12 Objectives. So, with these two pages of changes that reflect 13 the sense of the discussions we had, I guess our next step, 14 if the Court agrees, would be to set a date for -- to accept 15 this as a complete package and set a date for public hearing. 16 I would so move. And the date would be when, Mrs. Thea? 17 MS. SOVIL: How long do you need? 'Cause 18 you'll need to put notice -- 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 20 MS. SOVIL: How many days of notice do you 21 need? Fourteen? 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would think 30. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thirty. 24 MS. SOVIL: Thirty? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That should cover it. 5-27-03 109 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Last meeting in June? 2 Is that sufficient? 3 MS. SOVIL: No, that's not 30 days, 'cause 4 that's the 23rd. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's early. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: First meeting in July. 7 MS. SOVIL: 14th. 14th of July. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That will be fine. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: 10 a.m.? 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: At 10 a.m. I would so 11 move, Judge. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Your motion, then, is 14 that we set a hearing on the -- public hearing for July 14th, 15 '03, at 10 a.m., for public hearing on the revisions to the 16 Kerr County Parks and Recreation Master Plan; is that 17 correct? 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And a copy -- complete 19 copy with these changes will be placed in the County Clerk's 20 office for the public to look at. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Available for inspection. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Does that conform to what you 24 believe you seconded? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I'm just -- I mean, 5-27-03 110 1 I'm thinking, "accepting revisions." We're adopting a new 2 park plan; the other one has expired. I mean, we're not 3 accepting revisions. I guess you could call it revising the 4 old one, but it's updating and adopting the new one. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's fine. If you 6 want to change the language, that's fine. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We want to make sure that 9 we're right in the public notice. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: The public hearing will be for 11 the -- for the purpose of adopting a new, revised Kerr County 12 Parks and Recreation Master Plan. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's fine. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay? Okay. Does that conform 16 with everybody's understanding? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further discussion or 19 questions? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Got a question here, 21 Judge. I beat on everybody that's walked in the door today, 22 so I'm not going to stop now. I just have a simple question, 23 Bill. How -- how did you -- what brought this up? I mean, 24 did you just get up one morning and say, "Man, those park 25 plans need to be changed"? What triggered it? I'm serious. 5-27-03 111 1 I'm just real curious about that. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Didn't exactly happen 3 that way. The good Commissioner from Precinct 3 and I have 4 discussed it, and we've had a lot of discussions about who's 5 doing what park and Flat Rock Lake Park, and then the need of 6 the Texas State Arts and Crafts Fair to go out for grants is 7 really the catalyst. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. Okay, that's 9 what I was looking for. Thank you. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or -- or 11 discussion? Ms. Thea Sovil? 12 MS. SOVIL: You need to know where the money's 13 coming from to pay for the notice, and who's going to publish 14 the notice. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where does the money 16 come from for any notice that we publish? 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Do we not have a line item for 18 legal notices under Commissioners Court? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure, we do. 20 MS. SOVIL: I think it's gone. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We only spend -- I 22 mean, today's bills, there's $500 or $600 on notices. 23 MS. SOVIL: It's zeroed out. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we need to do a 25 budget amendment at our next meeting. I think -- you know, I 5-27-03 112 1 mean, out of Contingency, whatever that small amount will be. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We'll have to find it. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Lacking a budget amendment, 4 take it from Contingency at this point? Okay. Any further 5 questions or discussion? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. When is the 7 -- when is the public hearing? 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 14th at 10 o'clock. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: 14th. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm ready to rote. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion, 12 signify by raising your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That will be Bastille Day, 18 for those that want to remember. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bastille Day? 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Wonderful. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I can't do that. 22 (Discussion off the record.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: You just wake up one morning 24 and decide to try and figure out when Bastille Day was? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Separation of church 5-27-03 113 1 and state. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: One of those intriguing 3 things that just hit me one day. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It did, didn't it? 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Next item, consider and 6 discuss, take appropriate action to improve the process for 7 burn bans so they're more responsive to the needs of the 8 communities and fire departments. Commissioner Nicholson. 9 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Well, when I put this 10 item on the agenda two weeks ago, we had what appeared to be 11 a fairly serious drought situation with dry grass everywhere, 12 and I had two of my four volunteer fire departments beating 13 down my door and my telephone, saying, "You guys are going to 14 burn down the county if you don't take action." And 15 subsequent to that, we did meet in an emergency meeting; got 16 the Judge away from his nap and Buster away from McDonald's, 17 and we initiated a burn ban. That happened pretty quick. We 18 were pretty responsive, I thought. And we did that in a way 19 that gave each Commissioner a -- the option of reimposing or 20 lifting and/or reimposing the burn ban over -- what was it? 21 JUDGE TINLEY: 90-day -- 22 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: 90-day period? Maybe 23 I've talked myself out of thinking that this is a critical 24 issue that -- that has to be taken care of right now, and 25 needs major -- major changes. From my perspective, we're 5-27-03 114 1 going to lift the burn ban now, and it's okay for me. Maybe 2 if we need to do something different, maybe the next time we 3 start getting into a drought -- drought area, at our regular 4 meeting, we could act sooner to give Commissioners the 5 authority to establish the burn ban or something like that. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think that's right; this 7 is the way to proceed. I mean, I think our -- we have a -- I 8 think a good rule right now. And, if anything -- I mean, I 9 don't know how dry it was out west; I don't go out west that 10 often. It was not an emergency situation in the eastern part 11 of the county. That's why I hadn't thought -- I was planning 12 to put it on this agenda to do, 'cause I thought it was about 13 time. I think we just need to -- each of the Commissioners 14 needs to prepare -- when we start heading into summer, it's a 15 good, probably, bet just to have it in place in case any 16 Commissioner or, basically, the fire departments in the 17 precincts want to impose it. 18 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: The day we had the 19 emergency meeting, I had two fires. In fact, I was going 20 back home out 27 at 5:30, and I could see a lot of smoke back 21 up in that area where we had the big fire across the river, 22 and here come two of the Ingram fire trucks. So, it was very 23 timely, and -- and the fire chiefs were appreciative that we 24 did act quickly and get it on. But I think what I'll do is 25 make a note to myself that next spring I'll -- I'll keep an 5-27-03 115 1 ear out, and maybe we can act in some way a little -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Or keep an eye on the 3 beach bum -- 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Keech-Byrum. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: However you say it, 6 then. That's always kind of fun just to touch base with and 7 take a peek at. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So, I gather there's no 9 member of the Court that's proposing any formal action on 10 this particular agenda item? 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: No. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: If not, we'll move on to the 13 next item, consider and discuss approval of the Kerr County 14 Auditor to do the annual audit for the Kerr County Rural Fire 15 Prevention District Number 1, commonly known as the Ingram 16 Fire District, I believe. I received that request in the 17 mail, and apparently we've done -- our County Auditor has 18 done that in years past during the course of their existence. 19 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: And that's part of 20 the contract that we -- part of the contract we have with 21 each volunteer fire department or fire district, is if they 22 ask, we'll do an audit. Maybe it says if they ask, we may do 23 an audit. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It says we may do an audit 25 if we want. 5-27-03 116 1 (Discussion off the record.) 2 MS. SOVIL: No. 3 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: No? Either way. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But this is a little bit 5 different than the volunteer fire department contract. We 6 have done this. It's a good idea. 7 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Just for information, 8 the Mountain Home citizens, including the chief of the fire 9 department, are deep into plans to hold an election and get a 10 fire district for Mountain Home. Judge Tinley and I met with 11 them and a fellow from Austin last Friday night, and he 12 outlined for them what they had to do to get that done. So, 13 I'm about 90 percent sure that they'll be wanting to schedule 14 an election sometime this fall. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That is fantastic. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: It's a great indication that 17 that's where they're going. The fire prevention districts 18 are being phased out, and come September 1, there will be 19 emergency services districts. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: But the O.R.C.A. representative 22 was there; very, very helpful, brought a lot of good 23 educational information, and I -- I think the meeting went 24 very, very well. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I wish the rest of the 5-27-03 117 1 county would do that. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have talked to them 3 for years about doing it, because Ingram has been so 4 successful. Although they shouldn't be getting money from 5 both sides, but that's a different topic, and I hope somebody 6 addresses that someday. But to do -- push and do a 7 county-wide -- county-wide fire district. County-wide. One 8 fire district. I think they're great. 9 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Pretty controversial. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm sure it would be. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Do I hear a motion on Item 1.13 12 on the audit? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved -- or go ahead, 14 Dave. 15 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I move that we 16 approve of the Kerr County Auditor doing the annual audit for 17 Kerr County Rural Fire Prevention District Number 1. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion's been made and seconded 20 by Commissioners Nicholson and Letz, respectively, that the 21 Court approve the Kerr County Auditor doing the annual audit 22 for the Kerr County Rural Fire Prevention District Number 1. 23 Is there any further question or discussion? All in favor of 24 the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5-27-03 118 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Next item 4 on the agenda is consider and discuss approval of the 5 Amendment Number 1 to Contract Number 721075 between Kerr 6 County and the Office of -- O.R.C.A., and authorize County 7 Judge to sign the same. I included that item, and basically 8 the term of the contract expired on -- I believe it's May 9 the -- 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 7th. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: -- 7th, 2003. And that 12 contract is still in the process of being executed, and the 13 amendment will change the term of the contract so that it 14 terminates on December 7th of this year. Pearl Harbor Day. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I believe the Court 16 ordered, in an earlier meeting -- the Judge approved 17 requesting the extension, so this is just merely the 18 formality of signing the agreement. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: I seem to have some 20 recollection of that. But that's the only effect of the 21 amendment, would be to extend the -- 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: -- termination date of that 24 contract. Pearl Harbor Day. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That was based on 5-27-03 119 1 weather delays and so forth. Pearl Harbor Day, as opposed to 2 Bastille Day. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move approval of 4 Amendment Number 1 to Contract Number 721075 between Kerr 5 County and the Office of Rural Community Affairs, authorize 6 County Judge to sign same. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second the motion. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion is made and seconded by 9 Commissioners Letz and Williams, respectively, to approve 10 Amendment Number 1 to Contract 721075 between Kerr County and 11 O.R.C.A., and authorize County Judge to sign the same. Any 12 further discussion or questions? 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Does this change 14 require a public hearing? 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: No. All in favor of the 17 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 18 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I have more 19 questions; I'm not through. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign -- you 21 just voted for it. 22 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: No. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: You're raising your hand to be 24 recognized? 25 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yes, sir. 5-27-03 120 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Your question was? 2 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Well, look at Page 10 3 of 12, Section 21. B appears to require a public hearing. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: We're not changing the 5 activities. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just asking for an 7 extension of the date to complete the activities. 8 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay. Part C, "Prior 9 to the termination of the contract," -- the contract is 10 already expired -- "contractor shall hold a public hearing to 11 review its performance under this contract." Has that 12 happened? Looking down at F, Complaint Procedures, have we 13 done this? Or does the contractor do that? 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We took the court 15 action prior to the termination, asking O.R.C.A. for an 16 extension due to weather and weather-related matters. 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: What have we done to 18 satisfy the provisions of Part F? Section 21, Part F? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't know of any. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On that one, I would think 21 that if, I mean, there's -- if you want to -- anybody, not 22 just us, wants to get a copy of those requests, we just 23 submit it to the contractor, see if there have been 24 complaints. I mean, I don't know if there have or haven't. 25 If there have been -- I have thought complaints; I've had to 5-27-03 121 1 drive around their construction, but I haven't written any. 2 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Are we the 3 contractor? 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, we are. We are 5 the contractual party. 6 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Generally, my 7 concerns are here that I recall those public hearings that 8 were held last year, and I recall the amount of emotion that 9 went into citizens expressing concerns about this -- this 10 whole approach to funding the project. So I think we ought 11 to be extra cautious in the way we -- 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I understand where 13 you're coming from, Commissioner. I think a lot of the 14 public concern had to do with -- with the funding of the 15 mapping project, as opposed to the sewer project. 16 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah, I think that's 17 right. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: The study portion of it. 19 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: The colonia issue. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Colonia issue. 21 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: And there's -- I'm 22 pretty sure there's still a lot of emotion out there about 23 that. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That may be, but most 25 plans like that, it ends up on the shelf, and I think nothing 5-27-03 122 1 happens as a result of it. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- I mean, we're the 3 contractor. Again, if we get complaints, Thea would have 4 them. But I think it's a good point to determine that -- I 5 mean, that we need to compile them and keep them if we do get 6 complaints. I haven't seen any. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I haven't either. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But if we do, it's 9 important that we do notice -- sometimes we don't look at the 10 details as clearly as we should. Something like that, we 11 have a policy set up for that. 12 MS. SOVIL: Would they call here or would they 13 call U.G.R.A., since it's a U.G.R.A. project? 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's a County project. 15 MS. SOVIL: I understand that, but U.G.R.A.'s 16 fronting it, so -- 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, the County is. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: If they get -- if they get 19 questions or concerns raised over there -- 20 MS. SOVIL: Yeah. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: -- they should refer those to 22 us, to Kerr County. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Any -- any concerns. 24 However, there's nothing that happened that I'm aware of that 25 would have brought about a -- a need for a public hearing. 5-27-03 123 1 Concerns that are raised in a routine construction have been 2 forwarded, and Grantworks has worked out most of those things 3 under its administrative agreement. All this does is extends 4 the entire O.R.C.A. contract to December. 5 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'm ready to vote. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Thank you. No 8 further questions. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 10 discussion? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want to make a 12 comment. Commissioner Nicholson, I appreciate you watching 13 for those little things that sometimes become big things, and 14 I appreciate that very much. I really and truly do. But 15 don't do it any more. (Laughter.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further -- 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Not going to do it 18 after 12 noon. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: As we're drawing nigh to lunch, 20 you need to be very brief, huh? Any further questions or 21 comments? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 22 your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 5-27-03 124 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. I'm not 2 aware of any items for Executive Session. We'll now move 3 into the -- 4 (Discussion off the record.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Next item is payment of the 6 bills. Ms. Sovil, I believe you're here as a representative 7 of the Auditor's office? 8 MS. SOVIL: Sort of. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: You won the job by default? 10 MS. SOVIL: Yes, sir. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Does anybody have any 12 questions on the regular bills? 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move we pay the bills. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion's been made and seconded 16 by Commissioners Williams and Baldwin, respectively, that we 17 pay the bills as presented by the County Attorney's office. 18 Any questions or discussion? All in favor of the motion, 19 signify by raising your right hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Next item 24 is the budget amendments. 25 MS. SOVIL: Yes, sir. It's County Court at 5-27-03 125 1 Law; they're moving money from the District Courts' 2 Court-Appointed Attorneys, Publications and Dues, and this 3 amendment is going to require three late bills and approval 4 for hand checks. We need one for dues for Judge Prohl for 5 $235. We need one for dues for Judge Ables for $235, and we 6 need one for -- to Amos Barton for attorney fees in the 7 amount of $1,743. It's a County Court at Law case. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't see that 9 $1,000 one. Where is it? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't either. 11 MS. SOVIL: It's in Court-Appointed Attorneys. 12 427 is County Court at Law. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It doesn't show up on 15 the little request form, is the deal. 16 MS. SOVIL: It doesn't show up individually. 17 There's more than that one bill, but we need a late bill for 18 that specific amount. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 20 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: So, in that $3,325? 21 MS. SOVIL: Yes, sir. 22 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion's been made and seconded 24 by Commissioners Letz and Nicholson, respectively, that 25 Budget Amendment Request Number 1 be approved, and authorize 5-27-03 126 1 hand checks as follows: Judge Prohl, $235; Judge Ables, 2 $235; Mr. Amos Barton, $1,743. Any further discussion or 3 questions? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 4 your right hand. 5 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 7 (No response.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Now we'll 9 move to Budget Amendment Request Number 2. 10 MS. SOVIL: It's from the Sheriff's 11 Department. It's going to require two late bills -- hand 12 checks, one to Krauss Garage for $2,349.71. That's a late 13 bill; that's not a budget amendment, and that's for the April 14 statement. And one to H.E.B. for $171.26; that's for their 15 April statement. We apparently get charged a service charge 16 if it's not paid timely. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 20 budget -- were those late bills only that you were giving us, 21 Ms. Sovil? 22 MS. SOVIL: Well, that's the way Mindy gave it 23 to me, so I'm not sure. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It must be -- 25 MS. SOVIL: It must be a late bill, and part 5-27-03 127 1 of it is probably for this investigative budget amendment to 2 H.E.B. Let me see, I have the bills here. Late bills for -- 3 Krauss Garage is a late bill. And it says H.E.B.'s a late 4 bill. So, budget amendment -- I'm not sure. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Well, we're going to 6 take it out of order as late bills only, then. Motion's been 7 made and seconded to authorize payment to Krauss Garage, 8 being $2,349.71, and H.E.B., $171.26, I believe it was? 9 MS. SOVIL: $171.26. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: And authorize hand checks on 11 each of those. Is there any further discussion or questions? 12 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 13 hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Now, are we 18 to Budget Amendment Request Number 2? This is from the 19 Sheriff's Office. 20 MS. SOVIL: Same thing, sir. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 22 MS. SOVIL: One's his original and one's 23 the -- one made up by the Auditor's office, 'cause you can't 24 hardly read his. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 5-27-03 128 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Same question I had 2 last time. Radio repairs. What could that possibly be? We 3 just spent a million dollars on radios. 4 MS. SOVIL: Cars. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Car radios. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You mean like KTSA, 7 listening to Rudy and Reno Bob, or what? 8 MS. SOVIL: No, it's the "Hello, Car 54, where 9 are you?" 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's what I thought 11 we spent a million bucks on. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's exactly what we 13 spent a million dollars on. I'm not arguing. I'm just -- 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Portable things? 15 Or -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just keep asking the 17 question, 'cause it will be back next month again. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: You're the law enforcement 19 liaison? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm the radio expert. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. Chief in charge of 22 tunes? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tunes, yeah. Maybe I 24 should ask that question of the Sheriff. I mean, I'm here 25 trying to do -- 5-27-03 129 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Good point. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- trying to do it 3 here, you know, as my job says I should. But -- so you want 4 us to approve this amendment, as written? 5 MS. SOVIL: Yes, sir. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I make a motion, Judge, 7 that we approve Budget Amendment Number 2. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion's been made and seconded 10 by Commissioners Baldwin and Letz, respectively, that Budget 11 Amendment Request Number 2 be approved. Any further 12 discussion or questions? All in favor of the motion, signify 13 by raising your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Budget 18 Amendment Request Number 3. 19 MS. SOVIL: Sir, that's open-ended. This is 20 -- Tommy didn't put where the money was coming from. I might 21 remind you, sir, that's a Juvenile Probation budget 22 amendment. You have an A.G.'s opinion that needs to be done 23 by the Juvenile Board. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. Yeah, I'm -- I don't 25 know the particulars behind this, as chairman of the Juvenile 5-27-03 130 1 Board, and I obviously should. But this is a matter that 2 definitely needs to be addressed by the Juvenile Board, which 3 meets later this week. 4 MS. SOVIL: Mm-hmm. You might want to hold 5 this until -- 6 JUDGE TINLEY: I certainly wouldn't have any 7 objection to that. In fact, I'd have some serious concern if 8 you gentlemen approved it in the current state that it's in, 9 as a matter of fact. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Same thing -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: I'll take it if you'll do it. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Could take it out of your 13 salary item. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: It doesn't say where it's 15 coming from. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's what I'm saying, 17 from your salary line item. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Alternate housing over $30,000. 19 That's a pretty significant item. I want to look at it. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's not chump 21 change. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: No, it's sure not. If no one's 23 proposing formal action, we'll move to Budget Amendment 24 Request Number 4. 25 MS. SOVIL: Road and Bridge. This is that oil 5-27-03 131 1 distributor that blew an engine. As you can see, it cost 2 $12,000 to get it fixed. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion's been made and seconded 7 by Commissioners Baldwin and Letz, respectively, that the 8 Court approve budget Amendment Request Number 4. Any further 9 questions or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify 10 by raising your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'd like to point out, 16 Judge, that that last amendment just then, there was a -- 17 $12,000 to fix a piece of equipment. They didn't come in 18 here and say, "Okay, we need $12,000; where are y'all going 19 to get it," did they? They provided information and took it 20 out of their budget and found the money, and provided us with 21 a document that we could take action on. Not like 22 this knothead, Mickey Mouse stuff that was just in here. "We 23 need some money. Where are you going to get it?" That 24 doesn't work. This is a good way to do it here. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I would suggest to you 5-27-03 132 1 the difference in the -- in the two approaches yielded two 2 different results, too. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Certainly did. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The question is, did they 5 fix the engine first? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, yeah. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Did they fix the engine 8 first? 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh. That's 10 probably -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We really have 12 something to be mad about now, don't we? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, boy. Okay. The Court has 14 been presented with the minutes of the Monday, April 14th, 15 2003 regular session of the Kerr County Commissioners Court, 16 and the minutes -- or actually transcript in both cases of 17 the Monday, April 28th special session this year of the Kerr 18 County Commissioners Court. Do I have -- hear a motion that 19 these transcripts be approved as presented? 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 23 the transcript of the minutes of April 14 and April 28 be 24 approved as presented. Any further discussion or questions? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have a quick comment, 5-27-03 133 1 which I don't know what -- just another one of those 2 lightning bolts that hit me sometimes. I just want to thank 3 Kathy for her doing these things. When I first got on the 4 Court, we had little cassette tapes, and it is unbelievable 5 how much better this system is than what was here when we 6 first -- when I first became a Commissioner, and thank you. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So true. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Very appropriate comment. Very 9 appropriate. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It certainly aids in our 11 research of our own actions when we can't remember what we 12 did. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: True. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 15 comments or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify 16 by raising your right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. I've also 21 been presented with monthly reports from the -- appears to be 22 the County Treasurer, District Clerk, Justice of the Peace 23 Precinct 1. 24 (Discussion off the record.) 25 MS. ALFORD: That's where they pay the utility 5-27-03 134 1 bills; it gives the Auditor and them the authority. It's an 2 old order. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Certainly is, 1983. But it was 4 attached to -- 5 MS. ALFORD: I don't know why it was attached 6 to it. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Not certain what it was 8 attached to, but it has the -- the utility bill printout for 9 the current period from the Auditor's office with that copy 10 of the order. I presume it's evidencing the various utility 11 bills paid by them. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: '83? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: No, for the current -- for the 14 current usage period, disbursal date of May 16th of this 15 year. Do I hear a motion that these reports be approved as 16 presented? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion's made and seconded that 20 the -- that the reports as indicated be approved as 21 presented. Any further discussion or questions? All in 22 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 5-27-03 135 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Do we have 2 any reports from the Commissioners that need to be rendered 3 to the Court at this time? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have one report, and 5 that is that Hermann Sons Bridge should be open this week. 6 May be open today. It's -- and I would say it's quite an 7 engineering feat, and this time they had a little bit of 8 experience, based on their knowledge of moving railroad cars 9 around rivers a couple years ago. I think this time they're 10 going to hopefully stay in place, but it's -- really, it's 11 amazing what Road and Bridge has done out there in 12 constructing it. And once they get the asphalt put on today 13 and tomorrow, you won't even be able to have any idea you're 14 driving across railroad cars. It's really a neat structure 15 that they've built. Hats off to Road and Bridge for what 16 they've done. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sheppard Rees Road has 18 been open for some time, but it will officially be completed 19 within a couple of days. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other reports from 21 Commissioners? 22 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'm going to meet 23 tomorrow with -- on Animal Control issues with our Animal 24 Control officer and a representative from the City of 25 Kerrville and from the Humane Society and from the 5-27-03 136 1 veterinarians, and we're going to consider whether or not to 2 recommend taking action on moving the rabies rule from one 3 year to three years, as allowed by new state law. But, more 4 importantly, we're going to look at how we currently do 5 things and what produces revenues and what produces costs, 6 and see if we can find a better way. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Fantastic. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's a -- that's a 9 facility that -- or a program that we run that's doesn't get 10 a whole lot of thanks. It's very important to the county and 11 to the city. And experience has been, you know, when you 12 don't hear a whole lot, things are going fairly smooth. 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Then you hear the 14 outrage when something goes wrong. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh, yeah, you hear it when 16 we -- 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Whether or not 18 something goes wrong, you occasionally here some outrage, I'm 19 told. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. When we happen to 21 euthanize a pet. 22 MS. SOVIL: Kitty. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Even though the time -- 24 the one I'm thinking of, even though, in that situation, the 25 pet was not following our -- the County rules and was off 5-27-03 137 1 property and without a tag. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further reports from 3 Commissioners? 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, sir. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Reports from elected officials 6 or department heads? We have one elected official with us 7 today, who chooses to remain silent. Any reports from 8 boards, commissions, or committees? I have no Road and 9 Bridge monthly report or Maintenance monthly report before 10 us. Anybody have anything further that would fall under the 11 current agenda? Being none, I'll declare the meeting 12 adjourned. 13 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 12:08 p.m.) 14 - - - - - - - - - - 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 5-27-03 138 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 3rd day of June, 2003. 8 9 10 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 11 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 12 Certified Shorthand Reporter 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 5-27-03