1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Regular Session 10 Monday, August 11, 2003 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 DAVE NICHOLSON, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X August 11, 2003 2 PAGE --- Commissioners Comments 4 3 1.1 Presentation by Costco Marketing, request per- 4 mission to hold reception for County employees - 5 1.2 Approve FY 2003 Entitlement Grant & amendment of airport budget to fund FY'03 Entitlement 6 Grant and accomplish airport improvement 6 7 1.3 Request by HCADRC to renew contract to provide mediation services and funding of same 11 8 1.6 Amended plat for Stablewood Springs Ranch 9 Condominium, adding note showing volume & page of related easements for roads/detention ponds 21 10 1.7 Release Letter of Credit for drainage structures 11 for Stablewood Springs Ranch Condominium 27 12 1.4 PUBLIC HEARING - proposed Rabies and Animal Control Order and Fee Schedule 48 13 1.5 Adopt proposed Rabies and Animal Control Order 14 and Fee Schedule 49 15 1.8 Contract with newspaper of general circulation to publish not less than 100 column inches of 16 advertising, authorize County Judge to sign 62 17 1.9 Resolution in support of County participation in Alamo Regional Transportation 66 18 1.10 Proclaim fourth Monday in September as Family- 19 A Day to Eat Dinner with your Children 69 20 1.11 Burn ban 71 21 4.1 Pay Bills 75 4.2 Budget Amendments 76 22 4.3 Late Bills 91 4.4 Read and Approve Minutes 91 23 4.5 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 91 24 5.1 Reports from Commissioners 92 25 --- Adjourned 97 3 1 On Monday, August 11, 2003, at 9:00 a.m., a regular meeting 2 of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in the 3 Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, Kerrville, 4 Texas, and the following proceedings were had in open court: 5 P R O C E E D I N G S 6 JUDGE TINLEY: I'll call to order the meeting 7 of the regular Commissioners Court scheduled for this date, 8 Monday, August the 11th, at 9 a.m. If you would, if you'd 9 stand with me and join me in a moment of prayer? 10 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Please be seated. 12 (Discussion off the record.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: At this point in the agenda, 14 if there is any member of the audience or the public who 15 wishes to speak on a matter that is not listed on the 16 agenda, you're privileged to come forward at this time. We 17 would welcome you to do so. If you want to speak on matters 18 that are on the agenda, we would ask that you fill out a 19 public participation form. It's not required that you do 20 so, but it helps us in planning for the purposes of 21 conducting the meeting and being able to recognize you and 22 make sure we don't miss you. But, at this time, if there's 23 any member of the public that wishes to be heard on any 24 matter that's not on the agenda, we would ask that you 25 please come forward and do so at this time. 8-11-03 4 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: There being no indication, 3 we'll move on. The next item on the agenda. Commissioner 4 Baldwin, what have you got to tell us about this morning? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sir, I'm going to pass 6 today. I sure appreciate your offer and -- and allowing me 7 to speak, but I'm going to pass this morning. Thank you. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Williams? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I could talk about 10 Tivy football. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You could. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm going to let y'all 13 off. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm going to pass 15 too, Judge. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have some comments 17 later at the end of the meeting, but nothing at the moment. 18 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: The -- I was really 19 delighted to see in the newspapers that an organization 20 called Clear River Advocates, Inc., has been formed, a 21 not-for-profit organization to participate in helping to 22 keep the rivers clean. Mr. Marvin Willis of the Hill 23 Country Tile in Ingram is the founder of it. It's got a 24 number of members already, and you can -- you can help out 25 by being a volunteer or giving them money or sponsoring a 8-11-03 5 1 trash burn or spending $27 to join the organization. It 2 does -- it again occurs to me that that's one of the 3 strengths of Kerr County; we've got a lot of people with a 4 lot of talent, and they're willing to devote their time and 5 money to helping improve the community. In that same 6 respect, the volunteer fire departments got a lot of press 7 last week or so, and I -- even as close as I am to them, I'm 8 impressed with their capability when I read about it. I 9 didn't know that our volunteer fire departments had 12 10 operational vehicles to put on fires. That's a lot of -- a 11 lot of equipment and a lot of protection for us. The other 12 thing, I had the privilege last week of cooking at the 13 Cowboy Camp Meeting, the annual event that all of you are 14 aware of and know about. That's -- I've done that for 15 several years. That -- Buster, you probably know that that 16 thing's older than any of us; it goes way, way back. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: '20's. 18 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah. So, that's 19 over as of yesterday for this year, and I encourage 20 everybody to get out there and -- and participate in good 21 food and music and -- and preaching. That's all. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Only comment I 23 have is that I'm sure we all remember that school is just 24 around the corner this next week, and so as you're out 25 driving, be mindful of that, so that we can keep our 8-11-03 6 1 children safe and not expose them to any more danger than 2 they have in this world anyway. Let's move on to the 3 agenda. First item, we have a presentation by Costco 4 Marketing requesting permission to hold a complimentary 5 reception for the Kerr County employees. 6 MS. SOVIL: They're not here. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: They're not here, all right. 8 We'll move on to the next item, then. The next item is 9 consideration of Fiscal Year 2003 Entitlement Grant and 10 amendment of airport budget to fund Fiscal Year 2003 11 Entitlement Grant and accomplish airport improvements. Mr. 12 Pearce, good to see you here this morning. 13 MR. PEARCE: Good morning, Judge and 14 Commissioners. I'm Dave Pearce, the Airport Manager for the 15 Kerr County/Kerrville Municipal Airport. What you have 16 before you today is an opportunity to have a 90/10 grant 17 that is administered through TexDOT, the Block Grant Program 18 from the F.A.A. We have been awarded $150,000 for an 19 entitlement grant, and then our match on top of it would be 20 $16,667. That would give us the opportunity to tack onto an 21 existing grant and continue the fencing around the airport. 22 The fencing is for security, as well as for wildlife. It 23 includes four gates. It is my belief that when we bid this, 24 that we should have at least 85 percent, if not 100 percent, 25 of the fencing project completed. This was not forecasted 8-11-03 7 1 in the budget; however, we do have fund balance to cover it. 2 We're not asking for additional funds, just the 3 authorization to spend the money that's in the fund. With 4 your concurrence, this will go to the City Council tomorrow 5 night, and then to TexDOT on Wednesday. Are there any 6 questions? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: This is one of the items, is 8 it not, that's in the proposed budget for the coming fiscal 9 year, if I'm not mistaken, isn't it, Mr. Pearce? 10 MR. PEARCE: No, sir. We do have an 11 Entitlement Grant that is forecasted for next year also. 12 This was not forecasted in the -- the next year's grant, 13 though, for the fencing. What has happened in the past is 14 there has not been a forecast of entitlement money, and it's 15 been -- a little bit of a reactionary type of an action has 16 been required on all of our parts. What I have done is sat 17 down with the finance director, forecasted out five to seven 18 years, and forecasted an Entitlement Grant which we will 19 probably get every year, and that way we have it in the fund 20 and we're not always reacting toward it. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: And, if I understand you 22 correctly, the -- the Entitlement Grant match of that same 23 amount, $16,667, that was projected and requested in the 24 next year's budget, is a totally separate Entitlement Grant? 25 Is that what you're telling me? 8-11-03 8 1 MR. PEARCE: Yes, sir. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So, essentially what 3 we've got is two of them that we're looking at; this one to 4 be paid matching funds out of airport operational balances, 5 and the other to be budgeted and provided for by joint 6 contributions? 7 MR. PEARCE: Yes. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, thank you. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I might add, Judge, 10 this ones comes on the heels of one which we obtained 11 similarly last year which got the fencing project underway. 12 Is that correct, Mr. Pearce? 13 MR. PEARCE: Yes, sir, and this will be 14 married up with the other one to give us approximately 15 $320,000, and that is why I believe that we'll be able to 16 complete or nearly complete the project. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Very good. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess -- can you 19 explain the fencing project? I mean, obviously, I know what 20 we're doing, but it just seems that $320,000, we could -- 21 must be a pretty amazing fence; just seems like an awful lot 22 of money. 23 MR. PEARCE: It is quite expensive. We've 24 got 503 acres we're trying to fence off. With that, we're 25 going to 10-foot -- or 10-foot fencing with three strands of 8-11-03 9 1 barbed wire on the top; runs about $24.97 a square foot, is 2 what our -- or linear foot, is what we're estimating. When 3 we roll it around the airport, that's going to be right 4 around $300,000 -- $290,000 to $300,000. We also have four 5 gates that are estimated in there. Those type of gates will 6 have keypads, electric, where individuals will get their own 7 key code and be able to -- similar to apartments, where you 8 can enter into the airport on the aircraft side. Those 9 gates run between $30,000 and $45,000, is what we're 10 estimating, apiece so, when we add all that together, we're 11 hoping that we'll come very, very close to the $320,000 12 mark. And this is for both wildlife and for security. 13 Normally, you would see an 8-foot fence with barbed wire, 14 but here, recommended with the deer and what-have-you, is 15 going up to a higher fence. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Dave, when you talk 17 about fences and gates, are you talking about fencing off 18 the -- like, Kerrville Aviation area right there? 19 MR. PEARCE: The entire airport will be 20 fenced off, but as we go into where Kerrville Aviation is, 21 Dugosh Aviation, the fence will actually take a 90-degree 22 cut and go all the way to where the ramp area is. So, 23 people will have access to the facilities, but not to the 24 area where aircraft are parking. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. 8-11-03 10 1 MR. PEARCE: Currently, right now, anybody 2 can drive onto the airport, the runways or whatever, and 3 that's not -- 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And animals can run 5 onto the runway. 6 MR. PEARCE: Yes, sir. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: As they have done. 8 Judge, I would move the approval of the Fiscal Year 2003 9 Entitlement Grant and amendment of the airport budget in the 10 amount of $16,667 to fund Fiscal Year 2003 Entitlement Grant 11 for the completion of fencing at the airport. 12 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded 14 that -- to approve the agenda item. Any further questions 15 or discussion? If not, all in favor of the motion signify 16 by raising your right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Thank you, 21 Mr. Pearce. I appreciate it. 22 MR. PEARCE: Judge, if I could be so bold, 23 could I ask if you possibly could sign that so I can run 24 that through? Sorry. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me get it in hand first. 8-11-03 11 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: City Council takes 2 this up tomorrow night? 3 MR. PEARCE: Yes, it is. It's on the agenda 4 right now. And then, with their concurrence, I'll fax it to 5 TexDOT's district in the morning; I already talked about 6 Wednesday morning. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: While we're waiting, 8 the -- I see we have a special guest in the courtroom this 9 morning, commonly known as Judge Spencer Brown, but I know 10 him as a former Tivy Antler great. Judge Brown, welcome to 11 our courtroom. 12 JUDGE BROWN: Thank you very much. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Next item will be 14 consideration of request by Hill Country Alternate Dispute 15 Resolution Center to renew contract with Kerr County to 16 provide mediation services in Kerr County, and the funding 17 of the same, and to authorize County Judge to sign the 18 contract. Mrs. Bailey? 19 MS. BAILEY: Thank you, Your Honor. Good 20 morning. For the record, my name is Ilse Bailey, and I'm 21 the president of the board of directors for the Hill Country 22 Alternative Dispute Resolution Center; that's the Mediation 23 Center for short. I am here today asking that the Court 24 renew the contract that we initiated last year about this 25 time. As you will recall -- it's my opportunity to kind of 8-11-03 12 1 brag on the center a little bit. We started up in October 2 of last year, so we have not yet even been in operation for 3 a year. Kerr County was kind enough to allow us to utilize 4 some of the funds that have been set aside specifically for 5 use in mediation processes for the beginning of our center, 6 and as y'all see from the documents that I provided to you, 7 we have made some really significant progress. As you can 8 see from the chart on the first page of the document that 9 I've provided to you, we started out in October with no 10 mediations, and as you can see, we've steadily grown, and 11 we've not only been providing mediation services here in 12 Kerr County, but in, so far, three of the eight counties in 13 the judicial districts that we serve, and we're working hard 14 at moving on into the other five counties. 15 What we're asking Kerr County for as part of 16 this contract is $33,000. My understanding is that there is 17 $34,000 left in the fund. As you will recall, that fund is 18 made up of amounts from court costs. The Legislature 19 authorized the Commissioners Court to dedicate -- I believe 20 it's $10 from every civil case filed in district court to 21 this fund, which is to be used solely for mediation 22 services. There was about 70-some thousand dollars in it 23 last year. We got $48,000 from you to start this up. That 24 was used almost exclusively for salaries for our Executive 25 Director, who's here today, Scooter Brown, and we also have 8-11-03 13 1 an assistant to her, so that she can get out in the 2 community and -- and solicit more activity. We get not only 3 court-ordered mediations, but we also resolve disputes 4 between people that come voluntarily to the center, so we 5 keep those cases out of the court, and we're hopefully 6 helping people to resolve law disputes without expensive 7 litigation. 8 We've had a lot of support in the community 9 from individuals, as well as from lawyers who provided -- 10 have sent cases to us, and also provided volunteer services 11 to do the mediations. We also have had one class, and we're 12 scheduling another class. The brochure, I think, was 13 provided to you in the packet. This document shows the next 14 class that we're going to be offering, training people to 15 become mediators so that they can help other people resolve 16 their disputes in the community. If you would be interested 17 in hearing a little bit of the progress report, Scooter 18 Brown has got a little summary of progress to-date. And if 19 you have any other questions, I'd be glad to answer them for 20 you. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Bailey, I'm, of course, a 22 big advocate of mediation, because I know from experience 23 that it works. It's very effective. My concern is, as I'm 24 sure you're aware, we've only got so much money in that 25 fund. We can use it for no other reason, but we only have 8-11-03 14 1 so much. Do we have an indication that, by this additional 2 one-year funding -- I think you had a partial year last 3 year, wasn't it? 4 MS. BAILEY: Well -- 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Or was it a full year? 6 MS. BAILEY: It was a full year, yes. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. With the additional -- 8 this one additional year, that the activity of the Mediation 9 Center will be such that it will be able to kind of carry 10 its own weight? 11 MS. BAILEY: Well, that's certainly our 12 intention. And we gave some thought to how much to request 13 this year, because if we requested a smaller amount, of 14 course, we could assume that there would possibly be more 15 left over for the next year. But it only -- the fund only 16 increases by about $5,000 to $10,000 a year. The reason 17 there was so much in the fund to begin with is that it 18 started up in the mid-90's and no one had ever withdrawn 19 from it. We sort of feel like if -- if the center is going 20 to be able to become self-sufficient, the best way to do 21 that is to really fully fund it from the outset, and -- and 22 work really hard this year on finding alternative sources. 23 Certainly, this year we -- we have done fairly well. We've 24 made some -- some income from the class that we've -- we've 25 offered. We'll probably make more money from this next 8-11-03 15 1 class. We're going to offer another family mediation class 2 in November -- is that right, Scooter? Which is -- that's 3 the additional 24-hour education requirement that the State 4 establishes to qualify people to call themselves family 5 mediators. And we've also gotten some small grants, and 6 because of the fact that now Scooter has some more time to 7 work on grant applications, we're hoping -- the idea is that 8 we would be able to become enough self-sufficient that we'd 9 be able to continue on past this next year. 10 We also are working hard at -- in the other 11 counties. Some of the counties, we're -- Bandera County, 12 for instance, has been collecting the fee, and we were able 13 to get some funding from them. Of course, their fund is 14 smaller than Kerr County's. We will be going back to 15 Bandera asking for funding. The other counties have not yet 16 been collecting the fee. A part of our outreach is to go to 17 the counties to -- to convince them that collecting the fee 18 is going to be important, which would then allow us the next 19 year to come in and -- and solicit those funds from those 20 counties. But, again, those are going to be smaller 21 amounts, because the population is smaller in those counties 22 and the number of cases that they file is smaller. So, it 23 is incumbent upon us to find sources to -- to stay fully 24 funded. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I want to see you be 8-11-03 16 1 successful; I don't want you to outrun your resources. And 2 that's my only concern. 3 MS. BAILEY: Well, it's -- 4 JUDGE TINLEY: But if you've got adjoining 5 counties that are going to be part of this activity, why -- 6 MS. BAILEY: That's our intention. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: You've got resources there 8 that you haven't drawn on yet; is that correct? 9 MS. BAILEY: Exactly. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 11 MS. BAILEY: Any other questions? 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just one quick one, 13 Ilse. What is -- what is the fee structure on mediation 14 training classes? 'Cause I see you've got $20,000 in your 15 budget which would come from training. 16 MS. BAILEY: From training, yeah. Yes, sir. 17 We did a survey around the state, and have ascertained that 18 most of the time, the training classes -- it's a week-long 19 class, so it's a pretty substantial commitment of time from 20 the trainers and the people being trained. They usually run 21 between $800 to $1,000 for a class. We're charging -- 22 MS. BROWN: $795. 23 MS. BAILEY: -- $795 for our class, so we're 24 hoping that by being on the low end of how much those 25 classes cost, the people will come here even from out of 8-11-03 17 1 town to take the classes. And since we are planning on 2 having 20 to 30 people in each class, we sort of figure 3 that, after we take out expenses, that we can expect to 4 maybe make that much. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 6 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Ms. Bailey, the -- 7 the item, Mediation Income, $15,000? What -- 8 MS. BAILEY: We charge $50 per participant, 9 per side, for the mediation. 10 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Are the -- are the 11 parties to the dispute represented by counsel? 12 MS. BAILEY: Sometimes they are and sometimes 13 they aren't. If they are, counsel is welcome to attend the 14 session, but the intent is that it's really an exchange 15 between the actual parties. 16 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: So, the two parties 17 to a dispute could get by with only $50 each cost? 18 MS. BAILEY: Exactly. Yeah, they can 19 complete the whole process for $100 total. 20 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I -- I really like 21 what you're doing, and in my view, this is really good 22 progress. 23 MS. BAILEY: Well, I think it is. You know, 24 the -- the sort of down side to it is that it's certainly 25 not enough to keep us going without additional income from 8-11-03 18 1 other sources. But, for less than a year's progress, I 2 think that it really shows that it's becoming something that 3 the community is aware of and is wanting to participate in. 4 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I share Judge 5 Tinley's views on the funding of it. It's desirable if it 6 could be self-funding from the $10 fee and from other 7 sources. 8 MS. BAILEY: That's certainly what we're 9 intending to do. Don't really have an option. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the approach that 11 they're taking is kind of the way this was presented 12 originally, that they wanted to go ahead and use most of the 13 money, basically, up front to get the program running, and 14 give it the best shot that way, rather than trying to 15 piecemeal it. And it appears to be working. Hopefully -- 16 MS. BAILEY: So far, I think it is. And we 17 provided a -- a form contract there. If -- I think it's 18 pretty much the same as last year's, but I have not run it 19 by the County Attorney for his approval. If you'd like to 20 do that prior to signing it, that would be fine. I can make 21 any changes that you think are necessary. But, at this 22 time, what we're asking you to do is at least approve the 23 concept of the contract and the amount, and authorize the 24 Judge to sign whatever contract is approved by the County 25 Attorney. 8-11-03 19 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move that we approve 2 the new contract with Hill Country Alternative Dispute 3 Resolution Center, subject to that contract being 4 form-approved by the County Attorney, and authorize County 5 Judge to sign the same, and approve the funding from Kerr 6 County in the amount of $33,000 to come from -- do you 7 happen to know what fund that is? 8 MS. BAILEY: I think I -- I would just call 9 it the Alternate Dispute Resolution Fund. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: From the Alternate 11 Dispute Resolution Fund. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second it. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to 14 approve the agreement and funding with Hill Country 15 Alternate Dispute Resolution Center. Any further questions 16 or discussion? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just want to make a 18 comment. I'm -- I'm also a huge fan of -- of this 19 particular program, but I'm really a big fan of the spirit 20 of the program. This is the way things need to be -- have 21 come to resolution, is people sit down and visit about 22 things. And instead of -- what's amazing about -- about it 23 is that they're -- they're cutting lawyers out of work, and 24 I absolutely love that. That's great. (Laughter.) That's 25 all. 8-11-03 20 1 JUDGE TINLEY: I knew you'd be pleased at 2 that, Commissioner Baldwin. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I mean, I saw one poke 4 his head around the corner. He saw some money here 5 somewhere; he poked his head in and took off. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 7 discussion? 8 MS. BROWN: May I say one thing? 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, Ms. Brown. 10 MS. BROWN: Every time we settle a case in 11 mediation instead of sending it to a jury, we save the 12 taxpayers a lot of money. It's expensive to seat juries. 13 So, when these cases come to mediation that are settled 14 there, it saves all the taxpayers money. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Absolutely. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, even if you don't have a 17 jury trial -- granted, if they file a lawsuit, they're going 18 to pay a court cost deposit, but I think Ms. Uecker can -- 19 can affirm that the amount of work that goes into a single 20 case in her office is not enough to offset what's paid in 21 court costs. It's a losing proposition. So, you're 22 certainly performing a very valuable function, and -- and 23 you're getting these people back to where they need to be at 24 the earliest possible opportunity, and I think that's what's 25 good about it. And you don't drive a wedge between 8-11-03 21 1 neighbors or relatives or -- and that's -- oftentimes, 2 that's what it is; the people that ought to be the closest 3 is the ones that are driven apart by matters of this type. 4 Any further questions or discussion? All in favor of the 5 motion, signify bay raising your right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Thank you 10 very much. 11 MS. BAILEY: Thank you. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: The next item on the agenda is 13 to consider the amended plat for Stablewood Springs Ranch 14 Condominium, adding a note showing the volume and page of 15 related easements for roads and detention ponds outside the 16 boundary of the subdivision. 17 MR. JOHNSTON: Good morning. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning. Good morning, 19 Franklin. 20 MR. JOHNSTON: This item was on the agenda, I 21 think, last -- two weeks ago, last meeting. I was out of 22 town. I thought it was all up-to-date, but I guess there 23 was a question about cross-referencing some easement notes 24 that we have that are filed under easements, but they're not 25 referenced on the subdivision plat. Is that correct? I 8-11-03 22 1 believe that the -- in order to change the file plat needs a 2 court order for the person who made the plat to go in and 3 change it. Should be Domingues and Associates. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We don't have any backup 5 on this one. At least I don't have any backup on this. I 6 have backup on the Letter of Credit, but not backup on -- 7 (Discussion off the record.) 8 MR. JOHNSTON: I think that's something 9 different; that's the next item. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's not this one? 11 MR. JOHNSTON: David Jackson probably has 12 some comments, or at least get the wording that he wants or 13 whatever. 14 MR. JACKSON: David Jackson, 820 Main, on 15 behalf of Stablewood. We have no objections if y'all want 16 to make a cross-reference. To explain the history of this 17 matter, you heard the plat presentations; we discussed at 18 length about what would be on the plat. We submitted all 19 the language. That was approved, it was signed, the plat 20 was recorded. And it makes a reference to the condominium, 21 the drainage easement, and the -- what's it called? -- 22 dedication of the road or right-of-way. I have copies here. 23 Both were recorded in the same form that I'd submitted. We 24 did correct one legal description; it's been rerecorded. 25 So, we're done as far as we're concerned. But if you still 8-11-03 23 1 want to make a reference on the plat, so long as we don't 2 have to go back through the platting process -- that's the 3 only reason I'm standing here -- it's fine with us. But I 4 talked to Charles, and he said, "Well, I can't just go over 5 to the plat records and pull the plat and write something on 6 it." And Frank suggested we get an order, so if that's what 7 we're talking about, then that's great, as long as the clerk 8 is okay with that process. Now that we have the recording 9 information on the dedication and the drainage easement, 10 it's an easy matter, so we don't object to that at all. 11 We're going -- we've always been in favor of the 12 cross-referencing, only I think we just want to be sure what 13 the methodology is. So, if you have any questions, that's 14 great, or if you need copies of these documents, I think 15 I -- I've given them to you, or I'll give them to you today. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- the only reason 17 they weren't put on the plat originally is that they weren't 18 available yet? 19 MR. JACKSON: No, they weren't requested. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Weren't requested? 21 MR. JACKSON: We went through the process, 22 had a lengthy discussion that what you wanted on the plat 23 was a cross-reference to the condominium. We did that. You 24 approved it, everybody signed. Excuse me. We just didn't 25 know you wanted that cross-reference. And then Frank was 8-11-03 24 1 out of town some, and we're just a little -- the summer kind 2 of got away from us before we got back to you on the issue. 3 So, yeah, if you -- if we'd been standing here back then and 4 you said, "And, by the way, I want the reference to the 5 dedication and the drainage," I'd say sure, 'cause what we 6 did is we recorded the condominium drainage and dedication, 7 one, two, three, and then the plat, 'cause that's what I'm 8 told to do. We've corrected one legal description, but that 9 -- the substantive document's exactly the same. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Frank, do we normally put 11 this information on plats? Reporting references of 12 easements on the plat? 13 MR. JOHNSTON: I don't think we necessarily 14 normally do. This -- this one is a little unique, because 15 the entrance road, I think, is the issue, and there's some 16 detention ponds that are outside the actual limit of the 17 subdivision. That's what the easements are for. And so 18 just -- it would tie it all together. It's just so if 19 someone looked at the plat without looking up all the -- 20 doing a search of the title, I think they would see all that 21 on there. I think, under normal circumstances, they'd run 22 across all that in the Property Records anyway, wouldn't 23 they? 24 MR. JACKSON: Sure, those easements are 25 pertinent to each of the condominiums. And to refresh your 8-11-03 25 1 memory, we're all kind of feeling our way along here; we've 2 never actually gone through this process; at least I 3 haven't, of condominium. So, however you guys would like to 4 do it, that's great with us. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are you keeping notes on 6 how we're doing this so we can -- 7 MR. JACKSON: Actually, Frank and I did 8 discuss that. You put together a regulation, and it 9 probably does help somebody going along behind us. That's a 10 good thought. 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Well, if recording 12 it takes a court order, I'll move that we -- that we approve 13 an amended plat for Stablewood Springs Ranch Condominium, 14 adding note showing volume and page of related easements for 15 roads and detention ponds. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 18 the Court approve an amended plat for Stablewood Springs 19 Ranch, adding a note showing the volume and page of related 20 easements for road and detention ponds which lie outside the 21 boundary of the subdivision. Any further discussion or 22 questions? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. I don't know -- I'm 24 anticipating a question Jannett is going to have on fees for 25 doing a plat. I presume fees are being waived by the 8-11-03 26 1 County? Because, I mean, to me, it's our request. 2 MR. JACKSON: What kind of fees? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, the -- 4 MS. PIEPER: Recording fees. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Recording fees and all 6 that. 7 MR. JACKSON: We're talking how much to -- to 8 record? 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Refiling the plat is all. 10 MR. JACKSON: Yeah. 11 MS. PIEPER: Well, there's a $50 recording 12 fee, plus records management, courthouse security. 13 MR. JACKSON: Are we talking under $100? 14 That's fine. 15 MS. PIEPER: $100 to $150 possibly. 16 MR. JACKSON: I don't want you to have to 17 waive anything. That's fine with us. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. All right. 19 MS. RAMSEY: Thank you for the thought, 20 though. Thank you for the thought. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I have a 22 question. Do we need to address this -- this letter from 23 Catherine Fox, or not? 24 MR. JOHNSTON: I think that's the next item. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: That's on the -- I think 8-11-03 27 1 that's on the drainage issues. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, it is. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: The inspections and the Letter 4 of Credit in connection with it, if I'm not mistaken. 5 MR. JOHNSTON: I think that's Number 7, yeah. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any further questions? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 9 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 10 your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Now we got 15 to the item where we've got some -- some public interest 16 that's been expressed. Next agenda item is consider release 17 of Letter of Credit Number 7037450 for drainage structures 18 for Stablewood Springs Ranch Condominium. Franklin? 19 MR. JOHNSTON: Yes. I made a second 20 inspection on those. First time out, we looked at all of 21 them. They were in place. They did not at that time have 22 some silt screening up and some trash catchers over the 23 inlets for the drainage outlets, but those have all 24 subsequently been installed, and berms have been seeded. 25 The seeds are not up very much, but they have been seeded. 8-11-03 28 1 I think all that part of the project is complete. I think 2 over the weekend they had a test on it; I think they had 3 some rain up there, and I think it -- water accumulated in 4 the proper places. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: How much rain did they get out 6 there? Do you know? 7 MS. RAMSEY: We got a little under an inch. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Good for you. 9 MS. RAMSEY: It just came right down. I 10 know, I didn't get any in Utopia, but I got it there. 11 MR. JOHNSTON: The design for the detention 12 ponds, you recall, was to hold back a 100-year frequency 13 event, and then -- so they release it at a prescribed rate 14 so it would not cause damage downstream. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, I mean, the retention 16 ponds are complete? That's what the Letter of Credit was 17 for. 18 MR. JOHNSTON: Right. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't see a reason not 20 to release the Letter of Credit. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else, Franklin? 22 MR. JOHNSTON: No. I think that -- 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Frost, you filed a 24 participation request asking to be heard? 25 MS. FROST: I did. Thank you. Good morning, 8-11-03 29 1 Commissioner Nicholson, Commissioner Letz, Judge Tinley, 2 Commissioner Williams, and Commissioner Baldwin. My name is 3 Mary Hart Frost. I own property with my husband in Bumble 4 Bee Hills, and I share property with my cousins on Pleasure 5 Hill. I'm here this morning to ask that the Court not 6 release Letter of Credit Number 7037450 for drainage 7 structures for Stablewood Springs Ranch Condominium 8 Subdivision until the Court and those property owners with 9 property either bordering Stablewood property lines or in 10 close proximity receive a written, detailed explanation of 11 the County Engineer's inspection of each of these drainage 12 structures. That detailed explanation was requested in a 13 letter dated August 5th, 2003, and I believe you all have 14 copies of that, to Mr. Franklin Johnston. As there have 15 always been grave concerns about these drainage structures, 16 referred to as detention ponds, and our properties will 17 forever be next to them, we must be provided with -- excuse 18 me -- with more information concerning this inspection. 19 Referring to Mr. Douglas Hearn's -- Hearn 20 Engineering, Incorporated overview of Domingues and 21 Associates' hydrologic study for Stablewood dated 22 March 21st, 2003, and having conferred with our engineer 23 further, we must have assurances that these drainage 24 structures are of sound integrity. If, for any reason, they 25 are built improperly or are not large enough or are not 8-11-03 30 1 placed in the proper locations to accomplish the purpose for 2 which they were intended, they could make stormwater runoff 3 flooding of our properties worse in the future. Kerr County 4 Subdivision Rules and Regulations 5.06.A states, "Drainage 5 facilities shall be provided and constructed in accordance 6 with approved plans as required in these regulations. 7 Drainage plans shall be prepared by a Registered 8 Professional Engineer experienced in hydrology analysis." 9 Therefore, to verify that the drainage facilities for 10 Stablewood have been constructed in accordance with the 11 approved plan, as required in these regulations, a 12 Registered Professional Engineer experienced in hydrology 13 analysis should inspect and certify these drainage 14 structures before the Court releases the Letter of Credit. 15 Some of our concerns about the drainage 16 structures and detention ponds are: Were proper soil types 17 used to construct these ponds? Has the soil been packed 18 properly? I believe Mr. Johnston answered our next 19 question; when will vegetation be planted to help hold the 20 soil in place? He indicates that the berms have been 21 seeded. Are culverts in the ponds of proper size? And, 22 most importantly, are the pond dimensions correct, as far as 23 depth and size, to retain the water from a 100-year event 24 and release it slowly? Are the ponds placed in the proper 25 locations to control stormwater runoff onto downhill 8-11-03 31 1 property? We think all these questions should be answered 2 in a written report from the County Engineer after those 3 structures have been inspected by him and an engineer 4 experienced in hydrology analysis, such as Hearn 5 Engineering, where they sent the original hydrology report 6 to be analyzed, and they came back with some suggestions. 7 There are 11 drainage structures, detention ponds in the 8 Stablewood development. I would like to ask the Court how 9 many other developments have come before you or Mr. Johnston 10 that have had as many drainage structures/detention ponds as 11 Stablewood that were uphill and where the ponds were in such 12 close proximity to existing structures or homes on others' 13 properties? I don't know if you can answer that for me 14 today, or you -- if you'd have to research that. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, I cannot answer 16 that. 17 MS. FROST: Okay. Anybody else? Okay. The 18 unique topography of this development makes it imperative 19 that the downhill established property owners and this Court 20 receive a detailed, written explanation of the inspection of 21 these structures. I thank you for your attention and 22 consideration of this serious issue that is before the Court 23 today, and I'd be happy to answer any questions you might 24 have. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't have any 8-11-03 32 1 questions, but I have some comments. 2 MS. FROST: All right. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's my understanding 4 that Frank Domingues is the engineer of record. Is -- is 5 that right? 6 MR. JACKSON: That's correct. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Or anybody -- 8 MR. JACKSON: That's correct. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And he is a Registered 10 Professional Engineer with a license in engineering, number, 11 et cetera. 12 MR. JACKSON: That's correct. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That should be 14 satisfactory. The point one of your points is asking the 15 County to do the inspection, Ms. Hart. I couldn't disagree 16 more with that. That's not our job. If it was a road, I 17 can see how our County employee would go there and do the 18 inspection, but on this issue, that's not -- I don't see it 19 that way at all. 20 MS. FROST: Well, the County employee's 21 already gone and done an inspection. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. I 23 understand that. 24 MS. FROST: And all we're requesting is that 25 you pay attention to your own rules and regulations, which 8-11-03 33 1 state that drainage plans shall be prepared by a Registered 2 Professional Engineer experienced in hydrology analysis. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you saying that 4 Mr. Domingues is not? Or -- 5 MS. FROST: I'm saying that we have looked up 6 his qualifications on the internet, and we have not found 7 that he has any certification or any kind of expertise in 8 hydrology analysis. Yes, that's what we're saying. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If I may just, you know, 10 explain a little bit from what Commissioner Baldwin -- first 11 of all, on the experience, if you're challenging his 12 professional credentials, that's done at the state level, 13 not at the county level. So, if you're going to challenge 14 Mr. Domingues -- we have to assume that if an engineer is 15 willing to put his seal and license on the line, that we're 16 going to believe that seal. If you want to challenge his, 17 you're welcome to go to the State. We have no authority 18 over that. But a little -- just a -- you know, they have, 19 in my opinion, met the requirements or of our Subdivision 20 Rules. And it's -- I mean, this is -- we customarily do not 21 go out and inspect -- I mean, you know, Frank -- well, 22 Frank -- I don't see how we can ask him to give a certified 23 letter on something. If he goes through that, then he'd 24 have to do -- we'd have to spend untold thousands of dollars 25 on basically getting the whole thing re-engineered again. 8-11-03 34 1 That's the only way that we can determine if it's in the -- 2 built in the exact place or compaction is the same. We'd 3 probably spend $100,000 in engineering fees to verify what 4 was done, and that's not the intent of our rules. I mean, 5 we have to rely on the licensing provided by the state, and 6 that's what we're doing here. If there's a problem with 7 that, it's beyond our, you know, authority. So, I mean, I 8 think they have met the rules and the requirements of our 9 Subdivision Rules. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 11 comments relative to Ms. Frost? I have another 12 participation form here. Carolyn Bachofen? 13 MS. BACHOVEN: Yes. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you very much. Please 15 come forward. Give your name to the reporter. 16 MS. BACHOVEN: My name is Carolyn Bachofen. 17 I'm a property owner at Bear Paw Ranch, but my husband and I 18 have been property owners at Pleasure Hill for 30 years. We 19 have a small cabin that's right on the property line. 20 There's a berm behind us and a detention pond right there. 21 This last weekend, we had about an inch of rain. At that 22 time, the water, which is just an inch now, has come over 23 this, has made a -- 5-inch ditch on the corner of our cabin, 24 which is undermining the foundation. I think, with just 25 1 inch of rain, this is -- you know, shows that this 8-11-03 35 1 detention pond or berm or whatever has not helped. And I 2 just wanted to say that I really feel like that we need to 3 have somebody relook at this and see what's happening with 4 just a small amount of rain. And I don't know whether that 5 falls in your parameter, but I sure would like to have some 6 help on this. Thank you. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Just a minute. Excuse me, 8 please, ma'am. Does anybody have any questions for 9 Ms. Bachofen? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have a comment; again, 11 it's similar to what I told Ms. Hart, is that, you know, the 12 issue appears to be whether the engineer who sealed this did 13 a good job. And, you know, he has sealed it to us that he 14 has, and it's beyond the scope of our rules and our 15 authority, in my opinion, to challenge it. If you all want 16 to challenge that as an association, a group, an individual, 17 I think you can. But, you know, we're relying on the 18 licensing authority of State of Texas, and I don't see how 19 we can do anything other than what we're doing. 20 MS. BACHOVEN: Well, I just foresee that this 21 is going to be a continuing problem for anybody that lives 22 downhill from the development. And, you know, it will be a 23 problem for our county, too. And this might be a place that 24 we can, you know, stop some of the problems that we're 25 having, because I just see that our county's foreseeing a 8-11-03 36 1 lot of -- a lot of development on the hills above 2 established property. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree. And I think 4 that's why we're requiring the drainage plans to be done by 5 a licensed engineer. And, you know, I trust that the State 6 of Texas is -- you know, their licensing program for 7 engineers is adequate. 8 MR. JOHNSTON: I have a question. Is that 9 where the drain -- there's a ditch down at the edge of the 10 property that drains across the highway. Is that where -- 11 MS. BACHOVEN: The ditch. 12 MR. JOHNSTON: That's where the water drains, 13 right? 14 MS. BACHOVEN: Yes, the water that's coming 15 over my piece of property, which is here, and the berm is 16 right behind with the detention ponds right there. 17 MR. JOHNSTON: Mm-hmm. 18 MS. BACHOVEN: There's water that's coming 19 around this little -- my little cabin. 20 MS. FROST: Around the berm or around the 21 detention -- 22 MS. BACHOVEN: Around the berm. Around the 23 berm itself. So it -- you know, there's some problem with 24 the berm. 25 MS. RAMSEY: May I ask a question? On that 8-11-03 37 1 berm, there was a berm there before we ever did anything. 2 Did the water come then? 3 MS. BACHOVEN: No, the little berm -- there 4 was not a problem with the little berm. 5 MS. RAMSEY: But the little berm's still 6 there; we just added another berm above it. 7 MS. BACHOVEN: Above it, right. But it's -- 8 now, I guess, it's coming between them or over them or -- I 9 don't know what the problem is. 10 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Judge, what we have 11 here, I think, is -- is a bigger issue than a Letter of 12 Credit. We've got a neighborhood -- actually two 13 neighborhoods, Bumble Bee and -- and Pleasure Hill, who've 14 suffered serious adverse impact from the construction 15 activity at Stablewood Springs. And now -- now we have some 16 pretty complex structures up there that are designed to hold 17 and release water, and the residents there don't see -- 18 don't believe that they're being adequately protected. They 19 don't trust that -- that the design and the construction is 20 adequate to prevent an additional disaster. They're looking 21 to the County -- whether that's our job or not, they're 22 looking to the County and the County Engineer to give them 23 some assurances that what's been constructed there will 24 prevent a reoccurrence of the disaster that they've had in 25 the past. The -- on a much smaller scale, the County has 8-11-03 38 1 recently been involved in a situation where -- where we 2 approved plans, subdivision plans, and conducted an 3 inspection, and then there was damage done to a -- to a 4 neighbor of that new subdivision, and the County became 5 involved in litigation on it. I want -- I would like to do 6 two things. I would like to help protect these two 7 neighborhoods, and I would like to do whatever we can to 8 protect the County from further involvement in a dispute 9 between these neighbors. We've -- this recent information 10 is -- in fact, I just -- I got the letter from Catherine Fox 11 via fax a day or two ago, and I just got Franklin Johnston's 12 response today, this morning, 15 minutes before the meeting. 13 I've learned that there's additional requirements for 14 inspection that I didn't know about. For example, the 15 stormwater controls are required to have inspection once 16 every 14 days, or within 24 hours of a storm event of 17 greater than one-half inch. I'd be surprised if an 18 additional inspection occurred after the 1-inch rain that we 19 -- that occurred this weekend, we just heard about. Again, 20 the Letter of Credit's a minor issue. I think we should not 21 release the Letter of Credit until we've gotten a fuller 22 explanation from -- from the County Engineer and had more 23 time to -- to study the issues that have been raised. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I -- my opinion is that 25 they have followed our Subdivision Rules and Regulations, 8-11-03 39 1 and I think we're open to a liability lawsuit if we don't 2 release the Letter of Credit. I don't think we can, without 3 reason, not release one. And, I mean, it's just my opinion. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Commissioner, what is 5 it that you read that requires another inspection? 6 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Franklin? 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: After this last 8 rainfall? 9 MR. JOHNSTON: That -- yeah, I think it was 10 brought up, but they filed back in March of 2000 -- 2001? 11 2002, a year ago, NVDES, which is a national pollution 12 prevention project by the EPA, that says that they'll 13 construct controls -- I mean -- let me refer to my letter. 14 That would prevent any pollution downstream, and they -- you 15 know, that was part of the -- the original plan, and that's 16 what the -- the plan by Charles Domingues was -- was a 17 follow-up to that. And it was a rather extensive stormwater 18 pollution prevention plan that they filed with us, and it's 19 also filed with the EPA. And part of that is, there are 20 14-day inspections of the detention areas. There's a 21 checklist in there, and they -- they go out and look at 22 them. If there's a rain event, they go out within 24 hours, 23 and there's a detailed list of questions they answer yes, 24 no, or N/A on. They keep these on file so they know 25 practically any time what the history of all these are, not 8-11-03 40 1 just a one-time thing and forget about them. It's a 2 follow-up, and it's not a County follow-up; it's a federal 3 program. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's my question. 5 Franklin, you keep saying "they" are supposed to go out, 6 and -- 7 MR. JOHNSTON: That would be the owners of 8 Stablewood Springs. 9 MS. RAMSEY: May I -- it says that 10 environmental -- we got our stormwater pollution plan 11 through, and when we were doing all our construction, they'd 12 come out and check us. And now that we've finished 13 construction, all we're doing is paving the roads, we have 14 been somewhat released from them. But that also says tech 15 engineering. After this last drainage issue, there's also 16 been an extensive report following Franklin Domingues -- his 17 report, and they also approved our drainage and said we did 18 a very good job on it, whoever the engineer was. And also, 19 I think Mr. Hearn checked it out and said we did what we 20 needed to do. 21 MR. JOHNSTON: That's a good point. It was 22 checked out more than any we ever had before, and everyone 23 agreed that it would solve the problems. 24 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Franklin, Mrs. Hart 25 asked some five or six questions that had to do with whether 8-11-03 41 1 or not the -- these retention ponds were built according to 2 specs. 3 MR. JOHNSTON: Well, the way I read that, you 4 know, I do the inspection, which is not a -- a detailed 5 inspection like she was talking about; it's a visual 6 inspection that they were actually in place. And we already 7 have the drainage report on file that there -- it was signed 8 by an engineer, that she was talking about. There's nothing 9 in our rules that says we have to go back and do physical 10 testing on all the drainage structures, like it does roads. 11 We have a detailed section in the appendix on what's 12 required on roads, but there's nothing on detention ponds. 13 I don't know if there is a test on those. They're designed 14 to let water through them. It's not like something you -- 15 has to be a certain density and all, and they're designed to 16 leak slowly, slow things down. That's what they're for. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Franklin, you say you 18 do a visual inspection. What you mean -- correct me if I'm 19 -- if I'm wrong. What you mean is, you look to see that 20 it's -- that the detention basin is constructed as per the 21 plan? 22 MR. JOHNSTON: By the plans. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The size, the depth, 24 the -- 25 MR. JOHNSTON: They are in the right place. 8-11-03 42 1 They are -- in fact, they're all built a little larger than 2 what the plan called for. At least, I think, you know, to 3 detain the 100-year frequency. But that's according to the 4 engineer who designed it, estimated that they would more 5 than rate that. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, thank you. 7 MR. JOHNSTON: There's a provision in the 8 Engineering Registration Act that, if it's a public work, 9 the engineer that designed it has to be out there -- have a 10 representative out there to do day-to-day inspections of the 11 work. But I don't think this is -- would be considered a 12 public work. It's not -- it's not dealing with tax money. 13 It's not initiated by the County. And, even if it was a 14 public work, I think there's a -- there's a whole series of 15 exemptions from an engineer having to be inspecting it 16 on-site day-to-day, and I think at least one of the 17 exemptions would apply. So, I don't think that would be a 18 requirement from our point of view or the State point of 19 view. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is somewhat 21 reminiscent, to me, and probably you too, of the series of 22 events in queries about The Homestead with respect to 23 hydrology studies and the way it was engineered, so forth, 24 so on, and what happened after that. 25 MR. JOHNSTON: Yeah. We changed our rules 8-11-03 43 1 substantially since that point. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just kind of a general 3 comment -- and I understand the neighbors' concern, but the 4 other side of the issue is that the owners of Stablewood 5 Springs have a right to do what they want with their 6 property. And they're -- and they're doing that, and 7 they're doing it within the County rules and regulations. 8 And, you know, that's all that we can vote on. It sounds 9 like they're following the EPA, the other federal/state 10 rules as well, but that has nothing to do with us, you know. 11 There's lots of -- there may be lots of questions, but it's 12 beyond our authority. Our rule and our job is to see if 13 they've met and followed our Subdivision Rules and 14 Regulations, and they have. I mean, the engineer -- our 15 County Engineer has said they have. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I -- I would 17 like to see us protect the people. You know, that's one of 18 our jobs, I think, is to protect the neighbors and protect 19 the people. My question is, legally, on what grounds do we 20 have the authority to hold up a letter -- releasing a Letter 21 of Credit? I'm not sure that -- I mean, I just -- I simply 22 don't know, but it seems to me if we don't have some kind of 23 legal grounds to hold them up, how could we? If they have 24 met all the -- I'm through. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Jackson filed a 8-11-03 44 1 participation form, and I don't want to pass over him here. 2 Mr. Jackson? 3 MR. JACKSON: I don't want to belabor the 4 discussion. You've all said just how you feel, and I pretty 5 well said what I would say. It would be nice if you can 6 make everybody happy all the time. It would even be better 7 if there were no development in Kerr County, from that 8 perspective. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Amen. 10 MR. JACKSON: I respect that. I understand 11 that. But that's not the way the world works. That's not 12 the way the law works. That's not the way the regulations 13 at the city or at the county or at the federal level are. 14 What those regulations are designed to do is to come up with 15 a specific criteria that, if followed, is a compliance. 16 What I think the law says is that if you comply with those 17 rules, you're done. If you want more stringent rules, then 18 you have to pass them. You have to pay the costs and 19 expense to administrate them, and you have to follow them. 20 That's not where my client is at this moment. It's always a 21 balancing of the fairness of the regulation versus the 22 fairness of the use of property. You know, half of our 23 world and our population wants no control of any land use. 24 The other half wants an extreme control of land use. And 25 the Legislature, city councils, commissioners courts have 8-11-03 45 1 struggled with this forever, and will continue to do so. 2 With all respect to all the comments that have been made and 3 all the parties, I think we're done. I think we have 4 complied. I don't see the basis to deny the release of the 5 Letter of Credit. This argument was extensively considered 6 at the time of the plat submission. As Judy Ramsey just 7 pointed out, I forgot that we actually had another 8 engineering firm to be sure that we were correct on Franklin 9 Domingues' position. They continued to monitor -- they did, 10 the EPA. That's a federal rule. My client's done, by my 11 estimation, much more than what most are doing now, 12 certainly more than what used to be done. If you want a 13 highly regulated land use plan in Kerr County, then you need 14 to pass one, detail it, and put it out there so that 15 everybody understands where you're going. It would be 16 unfair if you would deny this client this particular request 17 under these circumstances without that forewarning. Thanks. 18 MS. FROST: Could I make one more statement? 19 This is -- we've looked at this in a broader picture, other 20 than just Stablewood, and this is what we recommend. Kerr 21 County does not have a Registered Professional Engineer 22 experienced in hydrology analysis. Many of the developments 23 in Kerr County, such as Stablewood Springs Ranch 24 Condominium, are not -- excuse me -- are not being built on 25 flat parcels of land, but on hillsides. These types of 8-11-03 46 1 developments require and must have professional planning 2 with emphasis on hydrology and stormwater runoff damage to 3 existing downhill properties. As you all know, I've been 4 coming for two years; I've been trying to educate myself on 5 what ways I could protect Bumblebee Creek, the river, and 6 our property at Pleasure Hill and our properties in Bumble 7 Bee Hills from damage to -- from stormwater runoff, and I 8 have run into the same frustrations that you all have run 9 into. So, I'm just putting this up as something that I 10 would like for you to consider. Kerr County must start 11 paying more attention to stormwater runoff from 12 developments, especially those uphill of existing properties 13 and close to creeks and the Guadalupe River. As our county 14 generally tends to have very little topsoil, stormwater 15 runoff rates are often extremely rapid, and therefore can 16 and do cause damage, from destruction of property to 17 destruction of creeks and the Guadalupe River, with vast 18 silt deposits and bank erosion. We believe our county has 19 not been giving this issue enough attention, and hope that 20 the Kerr County Commissioners Court will start taking 21 drainage plans more seriously. Kerr County residents and 22 our lands are at stake. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you saying that we 24 have not taken this seriously? Is that what you just said? 25 MS. FROST: I am saying that -- 8-11-03 47 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What did you just say? 2 MS. FROST: I did say that. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That is a terrible, 4 terrible statement. Very offensive. 5 MS. FROST: Well, what I think that -- I 6 think what we need is more -- 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. I agree, but 8 that's very offensive, the way you just did that. 9 MS. FROST: Well, I'm sorry. I -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Apology is accepted. 11 But I think that we have a set of rules here that we have 12 complied with, and we're doing our best. If we -- and I 13 agree, I think that we need an engineer on staff that has 14 hydrology background. I also think that we need one with 15 structural background and so forth and so on and so on and 16 so on. But you can't do all of it all at one time. Okay. 17 We've done our deal here, and I think we need to release the 18 Letter of Credit, and I'll make a motion to do so. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 21 the Court release the Letter of Credit Number 7037450, the 22 drainage structures for Stablewood Springs Ranch 23 Condominium. Any further questions or discussion? All in 24 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 25 (Commissioners Baldwin, Williams, and Letz voted in favor of the motion.) 8-11-03 48 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 2 (Commissioner Nicholson voted against the 3 motion.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry, three to 5 one. It's after 10 o'clock, so I will recess the 6 Commissioners Court meeting, and I will open and call to 7 order a public hearing on proposed Rabies and Animal Control 8 Order and Fee Schedule. 9 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 10:05 a.m., and a public hearing 10 was held in open court, as follows:) 11 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Public hearing was set for 13 this date at 10 a.m. It's a few minutes after 10:00 now. 14 Commissioner Nicholson, do you have any opening comments 15 about this, or should I just call for the public comments 16 and go from there? 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: What we've done is 18 rewrite the order, and including the changes of -- changing 19 the cycle for rabies vaccinations from one year to three 20 years, by administrative law and recommended by the vets and 21 the Humane Society and our Animal Control group, and 22 updating the -- the fee schedule to reflect the changes we 23 made in our discussion in an earlier Commissioners Court 24 meeting, including adding a multi-animal, one-owner fee. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Is there any 8-11-03 49 1 member of the public that wishes to be heard relative to the 2 proposed Rabies and Animal Control Order and Fee Schedule? 3 Any member of the public wishing to be heard? 4 (No response.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: There being no one indicating 6 a desire to be heard on this issue, I will close the public 7 hearing. 8 (The public hearing was concluded at 10:06 a.m., and the regular Commissioners Court 9 meeting was reopened.) 10 - - - - - - - - - - 11 JUDGE TINLEY: I will reconvene and call to 12 order from recess the Commissioners Court meeting scheduled 13 for this date. And the next item on the agenda is 14 consideration and discussion, adopting the proposed Rabies 15 and Animal Control Order and Fee Schedule. Commissioner 16 Nicholson, do you have any further comments you wish to make 17 at this time? 18 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Just one other 19 thing; that the Animal Control department, in cooperation 20 with the Humane Society and the vets, plan on embarking on a 21 campaign to get -- to get our rate of registration 22 significantly higher. That will improve protection of the 23 community and control of the animals, and will also 24 contribute to our -- the revenues that we receive off that 25 function. We have our Animal Control manager here. Is 8-11-03 50 1 there anything you'd like to say? 2 MR. ALLEN: Well, if we can get the City to 3 go along with us, we're going to be in good shape. So -- 4 they're in the process of doing the exact same thing we're 5 doing. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Fee -- fees, as well? 7 MR. ALLEN: Fee schedule, yes. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have a couple of 9 questions, if I may. Page 13 of the rules -- by the way, I 10 think they look really good, overall. I mean, I -- I think 11 we're going in the right direction. But on Page 13, it says 12 in order to register a dog or cat under this section, the 13 owner must -- and first thing is file the official rabies 14 vaccination certificate. Okay. Then I look at the fee 15 schedule, and I'm very happy to see a multi-animal, 16 one-owner category. But my question comes in, how does that 17 mesh with that, if you have -- and especially if you go to 18 the lifetime membership. Do you just -- I mean, as I read 19 it, you would give, I guess, the rabies certificate for each 20 animal when you first sign up, but what if you change the 21 number of animals? What if you -- and then what if -- in 22 three years, are you -- is there a requirement that you have 23 to refile all your rabies certificates? I just -- I thought 24 it was ambiguous in this area. 25 MR. ALLEN: Yes, after the rabies 8-11-03 51 1 certificates expire, you're going to have to refile them. 2 'Cause then your registration -- I mean, you'd still be 3 registered, but your rabies vaccination would be no good, so 4 you're going to be in violation. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So -- 6 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Do you get those -- 7 those rabies records electronically? 8 MR. ALLEN: No, we go -- physically go to the 9 vets and pick them up. 10 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay. But, anyhow, 11 if somebody goes down and registers a cat today, or dog, 12 soon you will have that in your database? 13 MR. ALLEN: Yeah, it will be on computer. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess the other part of 15 the question, it says the -- the owner must do it. But if 16 you -- but if you're doing it electronically or you're going 17 to be doing it electronically -- I'm just trying to make 18 sure that the rules are consistent with what's going to 19 happen. 20 MR. ALLEN: You'll physically have to do it, 21 either mail it in to us or come into the shelter. I mean, 22 you couldn't do it by electronic filing; you couldn't do 23 that. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But, I mean, the -- if 25 the vets are going to be set up to automatically forward all 8-11-03 52 1 the rabies to you -- 2 MR. ALLEN: No, it will be the owner's 3 responsibility. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So why have vets do it at 5 all, then? 6 MR. ALLEN: That's what's we're trying to 7 change. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. So -- well, 9 then -- but didn't you just say that all the vets are going 10 to work on getting all the certificates to the Animal 11 Control? 12 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I think I misspoke. 13 That's the way we've been doing it. 14 MR. ALLEN: That's the way we're doing it 15 now. We're wanting to change that, I mean, to take it away 16 from the vets. Vets have no enforcement ability, anyway. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 19 MR. ALLEN: Make it the responsibility of the 20 pet owner, which it should be anyways. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think under, possibly, 23 (c) -- either (b) or (c) under that on Page 13, under this 24 category, it probably ought to be specified that -- I mean, 25 clearly specified that, on lifetime memberships -- or 8-11-03 53 1 basically lifetime memberships, that updated rabies 2 certificates are required, because I don't -- I don't see 3 that that's in here right now. Anyway, that's not a -- 4 really, I think it should be real clear, if you go with 5 lifetime, that you're supposed to do that every... And the 6 other question -- and I don't want to hear any snickers from 7 anyone on the Court when I ask this question, but it's on 8 Page 14. It says that if your dog is not restrained, and 9 "restrained" is defined by a leash or fence or pen, that 10 you're in violation. And I've thought about that, and being 11 one individual that is, I guess, going to become or may be 12 currently under violation of that frequently, but I also 13 think as I drive around the county parks and other things, I 14 think almost every dog I see is unrestrained under that 15 definition. And, to me, "restrained" -- if you can control 16 your dog without it being on a leash, I don't see that 17 that's unrestrained. 18 MR. ALLEN: Let me clarify this. Restrained, 19 it says for the purposes of this section, "restrained" shall 20 mean that this dog or cat is physically restrained by a 21 leash, fence, pen, or other device, -- then you go down to 22 Paragraph (2) -- physically located on the property of the 23 owner or custodian or supervised by and under the direct 24 control of the owner or custodian. And the way our 25 prosecutor reads that, it doesn't say and/or; it just says 8-11-03 54 1 physically located. So, as long as your pet -- you live in 2 the county and your pet is on your property and stays on 3 your property, you're okay. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 5 MR. ALLEN: So you're not in violation. If 6 your dog stays in your yard, the way it -- the prosecutor 7 reads it, you're okay. Now, in the city, that's different. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. But if my dog's 9 in the back of my truck, I mean, I'm -- you know -- 10 MS. BAILEY: That's one of those technical -- 11 technically -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We try to make the rules 13 so that you can enforce them and are able to, and I think 14 that it's -- you know, and if that's the rule, I guess, you 15 know, you could -- you could -- there's a way you can figure 16 out how to do it. I just want to make sure we don't have 17 rules passed that are not practical to enforce. 18 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: No, but I would 19 argue if your lab's in the back of your truck, that it's 20 restrained and it's under your direct control. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: It's also on your property. 22 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: We sure don't want 23 to get in the business of telling people that they can't 24 have labs in the back of their pickup truck. 25 MR. ALLEN: There's a lot of cities going to 8-11-03 55 1 the tether law, you know, saying your animal has to be 2 tethered. 3 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: We talked about the 4 tether law, and nobody wanted anything to do with it, by the 5 way. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I just think that -- I 7 mean, I'll vote for these, but you're going to start getting 8 a lot of citations for unleashed dogs, and I think that's 9 asking for a lot of headaches for this county. 10 MR. ALLEN: Well, this is not going to affect 11 us. We're not asking to change this, and it's been this 12 way -- 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I know, but we're trying 14 to get to the point where we're going to start, you know, 15 more down the enforcing road and get registration up, and 16 we're -- I mean, we're changing our -- may not be changing 17 the rules, but we're changing our approach to the rules. 18 MR. ALLEN: We need to be more aggressive, 19 you know. There's times we really need to be more 20 aggressive. Under this restraint law, there's times we'll 21 stay back down at the end of the street. When we see a dog 22 in a yard and it's not leaving, but the complainants are 23 saying he's out of the yard all the time, so we're going to 24 sit back and wait, see if he crosses the property line. 25 Once he crosses the property line, then he's fair game; we 8-11-03 56 1 can go and -- you know, we have a reason to go pick him up 2 then. It makes it hard on us. In the city, you can just -- 3 it says it has to be restrained in your yard, and if it's 4 sitting on your front porch, we can go take him off your 5 front porch. But the county, we -- you know, it's a little 6 bit different, the way it's written. We've got to sit back 7 and kind of wait. You know, when your neighbor's dog is 8 coming over, getting in your trash, and you know it's him, 9 but you just haven't seen it, and he's not restrained to his 10 yard, you know, and you're telling us we're not doing our 11 job, then we're, like, well, we're going to have to sit and 12 wait and do a little undercover or whatever and catch this 13 dog coming off of his property. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Go ahead, Bill. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Marc, I just became 16 aware this morning, as you know, of a complaint by one of my 17 constituents who says that he has -- he knows of a neighbor, 18 I guess next door to him, with 65 dogs, by count, on one 19 piece of property. And he calls this a puppy farm, and 20 that's probably a -- not an exaggeration. One of my 21 questions is, can this multi-animal one owner register 65 22 dogs for 25 bucks? 23 MR. ALLEN: Yes, he can. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Wow. 25 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Would that be an 8-11-03 57 1 establishment? 2 MR. ALLEN: Probably. I mean, she's not 3 saying she's a kennel. She's just saying she's a person -- 4 and, actually, she has 72 dogs of various breeds. They're 5 very well kept-up. She's working on making sure every 6 animal has a rabies vaccination. I told her I'd work with 7 her; I can't just go out and write her a whole bunch of 8 violations. The dogs are very well-fed, all watered, they 9 all have shelter, the environment's pretty clean. It 10 doesn't smell too bad at all. I was impressed, for that 11 many animals. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're not talking 13 about the one that I'm referring to, are you? 14 MR. ALLEN: Mm-hmm, I'm talking about the 15 same one. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We have -- it's all 17 really, really nice and rosy and good? 18 MR. ALLEN: I've got pictures. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah? I want to see 20 them. 21 MR. ALLEN: I'll bring them to you, and I'm 22 going to show you my case file. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I sure want to see 24 your case file. Okay. 25 MR. ALLEN: I was impressed. I was expecting 8-11-03 58 1 a lot worse. She's more of a -- I don't know if she's 2 selling the puppies. I didn't see a lot of puppies, but I 3 saw a lot of different breed dogs in pairs. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's what I'm told, 5 yes. Okay, we'll deal with that later. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is it -- I hate to 7 mention exemptions on these. Is there an agricultural 8 exemption for working dogs? 9 MR. ALLEN: Not that I know of. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I see a real 11 problem here. We have still a lot of sheep and goats in 12 this county; we have a lot of sheep and cattle, and we have 13 sheep, goat, and cattle dogs, and they may not be on their 14 property. They're hired. I mean, people move them around 15 and -- and use them when they're working for gathering -- it 16 may be a leased property; they may go out for hire. I know 17 one guy who takes his animals out for hire. And I -- you 18 know, if we're going to have -- we just have got to have 19 rules that work. 20 MR. ALLEN: That would fall under -- under 21 the supervised by or under the direct control of the owner 22 or custodian. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Maybe I'm misreading that 24 paragraph. So, really, that "or" is a (3) -- should be a 25 new paragraph. 8-11-03 59 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which paragraph are 2 you talking about? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Page 14. 4 MR. ALLEN: Under Paragraph (2), under the 5 Restraint -- 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, really, we should -- 7 there should be -- or it should be just a number (3) as a 8 different category. 9 MR. ALLEN: Probably. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That makes it clearer to 11 me. 12 MR. ALLEN: Yeah. You're all right if you 13 want to take your dog out, work sheep on somebody else's 14 property. That's -- there's no problem there. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 16 discussion? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Don't get the coon 18 hunters. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Don't get the coon 20 hunters, hog dogs. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hog dogs. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. That -- I'm happy. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 24 discussion? Questions for Mr. Allen? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The changes -- comments I 8-11-03 60 1 made are going to be noted in the -- 2 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Do you want to get 3 that in the record? Do you want to change the wording on 4 that? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I just think that on Page 6 14, under (c) under Section 4(c), number (2) should read 7 "physically located on the property of the owner or 8 custodian," period -- or comma. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Or (3). 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Or (3) as a new -- 11 MR. ALLEN: Paragraph. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- paragraph, "supervised 13 by and under the direct control of owner or custodian." And 14 I think, on Page 13, under (c), I -- we need to have a 15 sentence that addresses lifetime registration fees; that 16 every three years, they're required -- or they're required 17 to keep a current rabies certificate on file. 18 MR. ALLEN: On file. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 20 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: "... responsibility 21 of the owner to ensure that a current official..." Will 22 that do it? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 24 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay. I'm going to 25 move that the Court adopt the Rabies and Animal Control 8-11-03 61 1 Order and Fee Schedule, with the two changes proposed by 2 Commissioner Letz. Do you want me to restate those? Change 3 on Page 13, Section (3), Paragraph 3.1, Registration 4 Required, Part (c), change to read, "It is the 5 responsibility of the owner to ensure that a current 6 official rabies vaccination certificate has been filed and 7 the registration fee is paid." And then, on Page 14, 4.1, 8 (c)(2) -- Subparagraph (2) after "custodian" -- or after 9 "or," and establish a new Subparagraph (3) that says, 10 "supervised by and under the direct control of the owner or 11 custodian." 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Everybody understand that? 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 15 discussion? 16 MS. SOVIL: Need a second. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, we got a motion. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion's made and seconded. 20 Any further questions question or discussion? All in favor 21 of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. The next 8-11-03 62 1 item on the agenda is the consideration and discussion of a 2 contract with a newspaper of general circulation in Kerr 3 County to publish not less than 100 column inches of 4 advertising to receive better rates for public notices for 5 Kerr County, and authorize County Judge to sign the same. 6 MS. PIEPER: Gentlemen, the last time that 7 the newspaper subject had came up, I found a court order 8 back in 1988, but it did not discuss any kind of fees. It 9 basically just set out what newspaper we were going to 10 publish in. And I have talked with both the Daily Times and 11 the Mountain Sun, and they have proposed different rates for 12 us to advertise to receive better rates. Right now, we're 13 currently paying -- I believe it's 8.45 a column inch. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, the question I 15 raised last time may be answered because of the purchase of 16 the Mountain Sun by the Kerrville Daily Times parent 17 corporation, so it's all under the same banner now. 18 MS. PIEPER: Right. And, from what I can 19 understand from reading in the Local Government Code, it 20 basically just says a newspaper of general circulation. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 22 MS. PIEPER: So, I have two different -- what 23 is it called? Amounts or bids, or -- and I'll let y'all 24 choose which one you want to go with. The Daily Times, on 25 daily, it's $6.15. On Sundays, it's $6.40 -- I'm sorry, 8-11-03 63 1 $6.40. And then the Mountain Sun is $5.50. The only thing 2 with the Mountain Sun is, they come out once a week. 3 Therefore, if we chose them, then we'd have to be careful as 4 far as our public notices at our public hearings. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: To what extent does 6 that pose a problem for you? 7 MS. PIEPER: As long as we do our scheduling 8 in accordance with it, it would be fine. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What -- I don't know if 10 you know this, Jannett, or Bill does. What's the 11 circulation daily -- or, I mean, a day for the Daily Times 12 versus -- 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's been reported 14 here in the recent stories about the purchase of The 15 Mountain Sun that the Kerrville Daily Times has something in 16 the range of 8,000 or 8,500 daily, and about 11,000 Sunday, 17 and the Mountain Sun reports that they're somewhere in the 18 range of 36 -- 3,600 to 4,000. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I guess my -- I mean, 20 my gut feeling would be to go with the low bid on this one, 21 but the other point is that the purpose of the public 22 notice, and also our feel is to get public information out 23 to the public. And I don't know, you know, which -- in my 24 mind, the difference as to which one outweighs the other. I 25 know we go out for -- I guess -- I guess I'm indifferent, 8-11-03 64 1 but I think it's a point we need to consider, 'cause 2 circulation and public information is important. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Valid point. That's 4 a valid point. But I think sharing it or splitting it or 5 going back and forth is now academic, since they're both 6 under the same banner. Take the one who does the best job 7 for you. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think going back and 9 forth is confusing to Jannett's office. Maybe not. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: What's the current regular 11 rate for the Mountain Sun? Do we know what that is? 12 MS. PIEPER: No, I don't. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Van Winkle? 14 MS. VAN WINKLE: I'm not in advertising; I 15 don't want to swear to any figures, I'm sorry. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, thank you. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think it's $6.50 a 18 column inch, so they're giving you a dollar break on -- 19 don't hold me to that, Judge. 20 MS. SOVIL: Accept both bids and let her use 21 her discretion as to which paper to utilize. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure, that's what you 23 do. 24 MS. PIEPER: But this is for -- to sign a 25 contract for not less than 100 column inches a year. 8-11-03 65 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Do you know the number of 2 column inches that you end up utilizing in the year? And I 3 realize some of it comes out of your office, some of it 4 comes elsewhere. 5 MS. PIEPER: I really don't. 6 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'm going to guess 7 it's a lot more than 100 column inches. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would too. 9 MS. SOVIL: The District Clerk puts all her 10 divorce notices and stuff in the Mountain Sun. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Does this -- is this a 12 county-wide -- 13 MS. PIEPER: Yes, I'm asking for this to be 14 county-wide. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So this is all Road and 16 Bridge, District Court? I'm sure we're way over 100 for 17 each. I mean, we could accept both and -- 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think that's a 19 point to consider. Really, accept them both, and place -- 20 place them judiciously as you see the need. I think you 21 could execute a 100-inch contract for both of them and be 22 safe. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move we accept both -- 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 8-11-03 66 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- proposals. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 3 the contract submitted for not less than 100 column inches 4 from both publications be accepted and approved by the 5 Court, and the Judge be authorized to sign the contract. 6 Any further question or discussion? All in favor, signify 7 by raising your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Next item 12 is consider and discuss and take appropriate action on 13 resolution in support of Kerr County participation in the 14 Alamo Regional Transportation Program, that being an adjunct 15 of the AACOG. Commissioner Williams? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Judge. I 17 think the resolution, as -- as it's drafted, which gives the 18 historical progression of this issue, pretty well tells the 19 story, in that for years we have supported Dietert in its 20 efforts to provide regional transportation, and Dietert 21 Senior no longer wishes to do that, and it has turned back 22 regional transportation and seniors transportation back to 23 AACOG. AACOG now has folded it into its Alamo Regional 24 Transportation program, and it is now serving Kerr County 25 for both seniors and other rural transportation needs. The 8-11-03 67 1 resolution before you today does not -- does not deal with 2 the economics of the issue, which will come up later in our 3 budget discussions, I'm sure, but it does deal with our 4 willingness to participate in the Regional Transportation 5 Program. It is officially housed now in the inter-modal 6 transportation facility on Schreiner Street, and is 7 operational, and the transfer of the responsibilities from 8 Dietert to AACOG have now taken place. So, what this 9 does -- the resolution does, it says Kerr County will 10 participate in the Alamo Regional Transportation Program 11 from this point forward. Then later, I noted in both my 12 memo to the Judge and with the letter that came from AACOG, 13 and -- and the formula for financial participation -- I'm 14 sure we're going to take that up under the budget, but not 15 today. So, with that background, I would move the 16 resolution that Kerr County Commissioners Court support Kerr 17 County's participation in Alamo Regional Transportation 18 Program, which is a program of Alamo Area Council of 19 Governments. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 22 the resolution, as presented, be approved. Any further 23 question or discussion? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir, I do have a 25 comment to make. When the funding part of it does come to 8-11-03 68 1 us, I noticed in the AACOG letter, it says each county has a 2 suggested base contribution amount of $3,000, along with an 3 amount based on the formula. I understand the formula part 4 of it is kind of a user fee. We use it "X" amount, so we 5 should pay for that. I understand that, but I -- you're 6 going to have to stand here a long time to convince me that 7 we need to cough up $3,000 just for fun to AACOG, or to 8 pay -- no. I'm serious. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I understand. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This is really 11 serious, and it's getting to be a thorn under my saddle a 12 little bit that, you know, these COG -- that COG, in this 13 arena, as well as law enforcement training, they get federal 14 money to do those things and then turn around and charge us 15 again, charge the local counties for those kinds of issues. 16 And that's just way, completely out of line, and has to 17 stop. It has to stop. I don't know if you can recognize 18 the anger in me or not. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm getting the 20 message. It's coming across. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And that's what that 22 is; 3,000 bucks is for their administrative fees or 23 something that they already get once. So, I'm not willing 24 to play that game with them any more. Same thing with TAC, 25 and on and on and on. 8-11-03 69 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right, I'm off my 3 soapbox. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 5 discussion? All in favor -- 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Only one other note, 7 Judge, that this does provide for us to send a signed copy 8 to not only AACOG for its records, but to the Dietert Senior 9 Board of Directors thanking them for their participation. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Absolutely. They've 11 done a great job. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: They have done an excellent 13 job, and we're most grateful for their efforts. So, any 14 further question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, 15 signify by raising your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Next item 20 on the agenda is consider and discuss proclaiming the fourth 21 Monday in September as a Family Day to Eat Dinner with your 22 Children. This was forwarded to me by the -- the National 23 Center on Addiction and Substance Abuse. They've done some 24 studies that indicate that -- that family dinners have been 25 materially helpful in reducing the number of especially 8-11-03 70 1 teenagers and young people that get involved in substance 2 abuse. Some of you gentlemen don't have children quite that 3 young, but I see them several times a week in my juvenile 4 court, and for no cost except a little time this morning, if 5 it helps one individual, I think it's worth the effort. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move the resolution. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 10 the Court -- 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Proclamation. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: -- approve the proclamation 13 designating the fourth Monday in September as Family Day - a 14 Day to Eat Dinner with your Children. Any further question 15 or discussion? All in favor, signify by raising your right 16 hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That doesn't mean I 22 have to drive do Dallas or Fort Worth to eat with my kid, 23 does it? 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, it means that you can 25 ask them to come here, and tell them that there's been an 8-11-03 71 1 official request that they be here. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think the law allows 4 to you meet in Austin, but I don't know about outside of 5 Austin. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: I can get you the name of a 7 fine establishment there to eat dinner with them, if you 8 would like. Last item on the consideration agenda is 9 consider and discuss burn ban status. Where are we, 10 gentlemen? 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I haven't had any 12 calls from fire departments, so I assume we're okay. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I was thinking we were 14 getting close to maybe needing to implement it, just so we 15 could have the flexibility, but I really don't think we need 16 to with the little bit of rain we've had recently. I think 17 most people got a little bit, anyway, over the weekend, and 18 hopefully well get a little bit more. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think that we're on 20 the edge out there, though. If -- you know, if it -- I see 21 that there may be a little rain coming through possibly on 22 Wednesday, that kind of thing. If we don't get that, I'm 23 going to have to look at it pretty close, 'cause it's -- 24 it's on the edge out there, and I have been contacted by 25 fire departments. 8-11-03 72 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We could implement it and 2 just then, individually, not enforce it. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think that, 4 personally, I -- that's what we need to do, is to have it 5 available out there. It's not going to be abused or 6 anything, but just in case it really dries out. They're -- 7 I'm beginning to -- beginning to hear some sounds from the 8 firefighters. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't have any problem 10 at all with implementing it. 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: If you implemented 12 it, would any of you suspend it? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would this week, 16 probably. 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Give us the 18 flexibility to -- later on, to -- that's what we talked 19 about. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we're back in here 21 on Friday. 22 MS. SOVIL: It's a workshop. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're still back in 24 here. But -- and we could take a look at it then. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Take a look at it to 8-11-03 73 1 do? Or -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Take a look at it and 3 say, hey, are you going to do yours? Yes, I'm doing mine, 4 so we can all do them at the same time kind of thing. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make a motion that 6 we implement a burn ban. 7 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: You're talking about the 9 implementation 90 days, with the authority of each 10 Commissioner to -- to suspend or to reimpose it in his own 11 precinct? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: And that second -- who made 14 the second? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Dave. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: And with that modification? 17 (Commissioner Nicholson nodded.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any further questions 19 or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by 20 raising your right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Present standpoint, we're 25 going to suspend Precinct 3 until next Sunday. 8-11-03 74 1 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Suspend -- 2 MS. SOVIL: Until when? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sunday. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Precinct 2, the same. 5 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Same for 4. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Dang. Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sunday at 7 p.m. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: You on board, Commissioner 1? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. Yes, sir. 10 MS. SOVIL: Why don't you do it till Monday 11 morning at 7 a.m.? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, we always have to 13 change everything. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Monday. You're not 15 going to change it on Sunday. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, that's fine. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I wanted to. We going 18 to work on Sundays? Is that the deal? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's what we want, 20 to come in just to do that. Didn't you? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Absolutely. 22 (Discussion off the record.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go ahead and finish on 24 up. I'm not aware of anything that needs to be on the 25 Executive Session portion of the agenda. If not, we'll move 8-11-03 75 1 on to the approval agenda. First item is payment of the 2 bills. 3 (Discussion off the record.) 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, before we do 5 that, didn't we just pass a proclamation that needs 6 signatures? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Uh-huh. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All of us, I mean? 9 That's service, isn't it? I don't have any questions on the 10 bills. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, related to 12 fees on Page 6, in your comments about AACOG a minute ago, 13 were you referring to that $200 fee to AACOG for Sheriff 14 training? Is that one of the things you were talking about? 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I hadn't seen 16 this, but yes. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I just wanted to make 18 sure I understood what you were talking about. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll tell you later. 20 I didn't -- didn't know that we -- our Sheriff and police 21 people were using AACOG. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, yeah. They're 23 there all the time. I see them there on occasion. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Wow. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Various trainings and 8-11-03 76 1 so forth. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That they charge us 3 for, and other COG's come in here and do it for free. I 4 don't get it. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't know. I'll 6 have to look into it for you, but they're there. They use 7 it. I bumped into the Sheriff himself. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They get paid twice. 9 I'm telling you, that's true. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move approval of the 11 bills. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 14 we pay the bills as presented. Any question or discussion? 15 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 16 hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Next item is budget 21 amendments. Budget Amendment Request Number 1. 22 MR. TOMLINSON: Number 1 is for Courthouse 23 Maintenance, request from Glenn Holekamp to transfer $700 24 from Major Repairs to his Telephone line item to make the 25 remainder of the year. 8-11-03 77 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 4 Budget Amendment Request Number 1 be approved. Any further 5 question or discussion? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. So, once 7 again, three -- four years in a row now, we're not going to 8 make any major repairs? I know there's no one here to 9 answer that question, so go on. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 11 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 12 your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Budget 17 Amendment Request Number 2. 18 MR. TOMLINSON: For Road and Bridge, request 19 is to transfer $23.61 from Miscellaneous, $100 from Office 20 Repairs, $124.10 from Books, Publications, and Dues, into 21 the Office Supply line item, totaling $247.71. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 25 Budget Amendment Request Number 2 be approved. Any further 8-11-03 78 1 question or comment? All in favor of the motion, signify by 2 raising your right hand. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 5 (No response.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Budget 7 Amendment Request Number 3. 8 MR. TOMLINSON: This is for the Sheriff's 9 Department. Transfer is for $10.64 from Software 10 Maintenance to Investigation Expenses. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 14 Budget Amendment Request Number 3 be approved. Any 15 questions or discussion? All in favor of the motion, 16 signify by raising your right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Budget 21 Amendment Request Number 5. 22 MR. TOMLINSON: This is for -- 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 4. 24 MR. TOMLINSON: -- Justice of the Peace, 25 Precinct 4. 8-11-03 79 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Excuse me, 4. 2 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. To transfer $51.50 from 3 Conferences to Machine Repair. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 7 Budget Amendment Request Number 4 be approved. Any question 8 or discussion? All in favor of the motion. Signify by 9 raising your right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 12 (No response.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Budget 14 Amendment Request Number 5. 15 MR. TOMLINSON: For Commissioners Court, to 16 transfer $316.76 from Professional Services to Conferences. 17 I have a -- with this, a need for a hand check payable to 18 Texas Association of Counties for $225, for the 19 Post-Legislative Conference registration. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's for my 21 registration. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is this -- I hate to ask. 23 MR. TOMLINSON: Wait a minute, I have another 24 one. I didn't see it. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are these -- 8-11-03 80 1 MR. TOMLINSON: One to Commissioner Williams 2 for $91.76, travel to AACOG. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, are these 4 required to get your hours? 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Somebody needs to make a 8 motion. Make a motion. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Make a motion. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 13 Budget Amendment Request Number 5 be approved, and authorize 14 the issuance of hand checks to Texas Association of Counties 15 for $225, and to Commissioner Williams for reimbursement for 16 travel in the sum of $91.76. Any question or discussion? 17 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 18 hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Budget 23 Amendment Request Number 6. 24 MR. TOMLINSON: Number 6 is for the County 25 Court at Law, 198th District Court, and 216th District 8-11-03 81 1 Court. The request is to transfer $3,914.43 from 2 Court-Appointed Attorney line item in the 216th Court, $300 3 to Special Court Reporter for 198th Court, $2,032.43 to 4 Court-Appointed Attorneys in 198th Court, and $1,582 in 5 Court-Appointed Attorney line item for County Court at Law. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 9 Budget Amendment Request Number 6 be approved. Any further 10 question or discussion? 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Just a question, 12 sophomore question. Are these all criminal matters, or -- 13 or sometimes attorneys are appointed and paid for by the 14 County for civil matters? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: There are some instances where 16 they might be appointed in civil matters. For example, in 17 termination cases, Child Protective Service cases, where a 18 parent's rights are going to be terminated, and they're 19 indigent and unable to afford the attorney, the law provides 20 that they be provided counsel in those cases. Isolated 21 instances, but that's generally the instances where civil 22 cases are provided for. 23 MR. TOMLINSON: As a sidelight to that, I 24 received a -- a letter from what used to be Southwest Texas 25 in San Marcos. They're -- the university's doing a survey 8-11-03 82 1 among all the counties in the state as to the impact of 2 Senate Bill 7 on -- on, well, the financial impact from all 3 the counties in the state for that Senate Bill, so that 4 might be of some interest when it's done. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It will be. Are you 6 going to -- are we going to participate? 7 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes, I plan to participate. 8 The letter came to me, and so I plan to do it. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, that was going to 10 save us money; that's what the Legislature told us. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Is it a student 12 study, or -- or is it a -- 13 MR. TOMLINSON: Apparently, it is. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's cool. 15 MR. TOMLINSON: It was -- I thought it was 16 interesting that they were -- would pick that subject to 17 do -- to do the work on. I'm sure that there's been some -- 18 some suggestions from some commissioners courts throughout 19 the state for them to do that. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: To further answer your 21 question, Commissioner Nicholson, juvenile cases are 22 technically classified as civil cases. They arise because 23 of criminal or quasi-criminal conduct, but they're 24 technically handled as civil cases. So, while none of them 25 were included within these -- this particular budget 8-11-03 83 1 amendment, that is another area where civil cases have 2 court-appointed attorneys, a major area. Any further 3 questions or discussion on Budget Amendment Request Number 4 6? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 5 right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Budget 10 Amendment Request Number 7. 11 MR. TOMLINSON: This -- this amendment is to 12 correct the budget for group insurance for the fiscal year 13 2002-2003. Total -- first of all, let me -- the amount of 14 the difference, my calculation of -- of funds necessary for 15 each department to finish the -- the fiscal year, so where 16 you see the negative amounts is the amount that will be 17 required for each one of those departments. Total is 18 $150,585. And on -- on the bottom part, where it says 19 Transfer From, I went through the -- through the entire 20 budget and found amounts in -- in these line items to 21 transfer from those areas into the individual department 22 budgets for group insurance. If you want me to read them 23 all off, I will. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tommy, what's that on the 25 very bottom? General Transfer Out, and then a Courthouse 8-11-03 84 1 Security -- 2 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, part of the difference 3 -- the negative difference was in a special revenue fund, 4 which was Courthouse Security. So, we actually have to 5 transfer cash from -- from Fund 10 into 29 to be able to -- 6 to make those insurance payments. In other words, there 7 were no funds available in -- in Fund 29. No -- no accounts 8 that would -- that had enough money in it. So, since -- 9 since the transfers are from -- from General Fund accounts, 10 then we're transferring the -- the $698 to that fund. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval of Budget 12 Amendment Number 7, as presented. 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 15 Budget Amendment Request Number 7 be approved. Any further 16 question or discussion? 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Tommy, is this 18 transaction unique, or is this something that occurs 19 periodically? 20 MR. TOMLINSON: This is -- this is unique for 21 this year. It's never happened before, that I recall. 22 There's been some isolated cases where -- that we just -- it 23 was, you know, an oversight in one department or the other, 24 but never a wholesale amendment of this size, no. I would 25 say that's something that's rare. I've not experienced it 8-11-03 85 1 before. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: What this has occurred as a 3 result of is budgeting in August or September for a coming 4 year, when the policy is not going to be renewed until 5 January, and you don't know what the premium is going to be. 6 Is that correct? 7 MR. TOMLINSON: Essentially, that's correct. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're rectifying that in 9 the process. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: We're going to try. Any 11 further question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, 12 signify by raising your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Budget 17 Amendment Request Number 8. 18 MR. TOMLINSON: Number 8 is for the District 19 Clerk. Her request is to transfer $500 from Telephone line 20 item to Microfilm Records. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 23 MR. TOMLINSON: I have two more. I don't -- 24 I just have the copy of that one from the County Attorney's 25 office. 8-11-03 86 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Did we move on the other 2 one yet? Did we vote on 8? 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. 4 MR. TOMLINSON: This is 9. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We haven't voted on 8. 6 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay, I'm sorry. I'm asleep 7 here. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move it. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I moved it. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Moved and seconded? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You were the second, 12 Bill. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Whichever. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 16 discussion on Number 8? All in favor of the motion, signify 17 by raising your right hand. 18 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 20 (No response.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Budget Amendment Request 22 Number 9. 23 MR. TOMLINSON: 9 is a request from the 24 County Attorney's office to transfer $500 from Telephone 25 line item to Books, Publications, and Dues. 8-11-03 87 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 2 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 4 Budget Amendment Request Number 9 be approved. Any further 5 question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify 6 by raising your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Budget Amendment Request 12 Number -- 13 MR. TOMLINSON: 10. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: -- 10. 15 MR. TOMLINSON: 10 is for Justice of the 16 Peace, Precinct 1. His request is to transfer $65 from 17 Miscellaneous and $150 from Machine Repair, totaling $215, 18 into Conferences, and then transfer $160 from Telephone and 19 $123 from Postage line item into Part-Time Salaries. The 20 total's $283. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What happened? What 22 happened? 23 MR. TOMLINSON: I suppose that for -- for his 24 part-time, he's filling in for vacation for his clerk. 25 There was a -- there was a period of time at the beginning 8-11-03 88 1 of this year that he used some of his part-time when -- when 2 he changed clerks, so he used the part-time person while he 3 was trying to hire a full-time. That's what I'm 4 remembering. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I think -- I 6 think you're correct. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: When Judge O'Dell was still 8 his clerk, before taking office January 1, his current clerk 9 was probably being paid from Part-Time moneys to get her 10 trained up while Judge O'Dell was still there as the clerk 11 on the payroll, and that's probably what was -- 12 MR. TOMLINSON: I think that's right. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, I guess my real 14 question is, why would we need a part-time -- an employee? 15 Has this employee been here a full year? 16 MR. TOMLINSON: No. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what it sounded 18 like. Why do we need a part-time -- whatever? 19 MS. SOVIL: There's been $3,000 spent in 20 part-time moneys this year. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: $3,000. And that was 22 in the -- that shift from her going downstairs and all that, 23 I guess. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The question I have is 25 the Conference additional that he is requesting. 8-11-03 89 1 MR. TOMLINSON: Commissioner, I don't have 2 any documentation here with me. He just gave us this this 3 morning, so I -- I don't know -- I don't know what it's for. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is he in today? Do you 5 know? 6 MR. TOMLINSON: His clerk is. I can go ask 7 real quick. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, probably won't 9 keep it from passing one way or the other, but I won't vote 10 for it unless I know where the Conference money is going. 11 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay, I -- hold on. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm not going to mess 13 with it. No motions from here. 14 (Discussion off the record.) 15 MS. SOVIL: During your budget process, you 16 might consider having all the elected officials turn in 17 their education hours so that you know that they have gotten 18 all their education hours or they haven't gotten all their 19 education hours, or they're carrying some over from last 20 year. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I trust them. I 22 mean, I -- 23 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. It's a registration 24 for October conference. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: October conference? 8-11-03 90 1 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes, it's a pre-registration. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is in 3 anticipation of an October -- 4 MR. TOMLINSON: Right. It's due -- he'll be 5 going in October, so he -- he wanted to go ahead and pay it 6 now so he -- 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Pay it now when he 8 doesn't have any money. 9 MR. TOMLINSON: I mean, I'm going to have to 10 do that, too. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'd like to, but I'm 12 going to wait. 13 MR. TOMLINSON: But my conference is in 14 October, too. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So is mine. I'm going 16 to wait till October to pay mine in the new budget, 'cause I 17 don't have budgeted money for it today. I move we approve. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 20 Budget Amendment Request Number 10 be approved. Any further 21 question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify 22 by raising your right hand. 23 (Commissioners Baldwin, Williams, and Nicholson voted in favor of the motion.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (Commissioner Letz voted against the motion.) 8-11-03 91 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Is that 2 all of them? 3 MR. TOMLINSON: Yeah. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: We have any late bills? 5 MR. TOMLINSON: None, no. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: I have before me the 7 transcript of the regular session of Kerr County 8 Commissioners Court Monday, July 14th, the transcript of the 9 Kerr County Commissioners Court Special Session, Monday 10 July 28th, and the transcript of the Emergency Session of 11 the Kerr County Commissioners Court on Wednesday, July 16th. 12 Do I hear a motion that these transcripts and minutes be 13 presented as -- be approved as presented? 14 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I move it. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 17 the designated transcripts and minutes be approved as 18 presented. Any further question or discussion? All in 19 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. I also 24 have before me monthly reports from the Sheriff, Justice of 25 the Peace Precinct 2, Justice of the Peace Precinct 4, and 8-11-03 92 1 the County Clerk. Do I hear a motion that these monthly 2 reports be approved as presented? 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that 6 the monthly reports for the Sheriff, Justice of the Peace 7 Precinct 2, Justice of the Peace Precinct 4, and the County 8 Clerk be approved as presented. Any further question or 9 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 10 your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. We'll now 15 move to the information agenda. Reports from Commissioners. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: None. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Brief report -- question. 19 As we all know, we are without a County Extension Agent at 20 the present time, and I've had some communications from the 21 public on that. And since Eddie Holland was here for so 22 long, it's been a long time since, you know, one came to the 23 County. I'm kind of looking for -- as I understand it, the 24 Extension Service recommends to the County that replacement. 25 And my question is -- and I think, from what I hear from the 8-11-03 93 1 community, that they would like this Court to be a little 2 bit involved in that process, and I think -- which is 3 appropriate; I don't think we should be expected to 4 rubber-stamp an approval without having input into the 5 selection process. So, I'm just bringing that up just to 6 kind of toss it on the table, and I'll probably put on it 7 the agenda for a -- for discussion at the next item -- next 8 meeting. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Sovil, you have some 10 information relative to this? 11 MS. SOVIL: Yes, I do. They don't recommend 12 one person. They will send -- because of Kerr County, and 13 we're the cause of this, we get a certain number of 14 recommendations, and we will get their resumes and stuff, if 15 it's done like it was with Amy. I don't remember if you 16 were on the Court when she came. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 18 MS. SOVIL: We had that big furor about we 19 needed more input. They were recommending someone else, and 20 because of Kerr County's involvement, we got to help pick 21 who we wanted. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I think maybe all 23 we need, we want to make sure that they follow the same 24 process. Which I don't -- you know, which probably would 25 take a letter from the Judge, or we can discuss it at our 8-11-03 94 1 next meeting. I don't think they're imminently getting 2 ready to recommend somebody. 3 MS. SOVIL: They are interviewing. In fact, 4 interviews have stopped, I think. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: They had the job posted, and I 6 think the posting is closed for applications. Now, exactly 7 where they are after all the time has expired for the 8 receiving of applications, I'm not -- I'm not certain. I 9 did have an inquiry from the -- from the lady in Uvalde in 10 whose district Kerr County falls, whether or not we were -- 11 we were proposing to fund it for the coming year. I told 12 her that I didn't, obviously, have the authority to approve 13 the budget, but I suspected, based upon the historical 14 aspect of that particular office, that I felt like the Court 15 probably would approve an agent for Kerr County, as they've 16 done for many, many years in the past. So, she's proceeding 17 on that assumption, I assume. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is it your 19 understanding, Judge, that it was posted as a single-county 20 job, not a multiple-county job? 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, a single-county. It was 22 posted as a single-county. 23 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I don't have an 24 appreciation for the value of the Extension Office to the 25 County. I'm hoping maybe I'll gain one in our budget 8-11-03 95 1 meetings. When I ask myself the question, what would be 2 different if we didn't have one, I can't come up with 3 anything. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: You obviously went to some 5 foreign school, like Baylor. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They don't teach that 7 at Baylor. Do they? They don't teach basketball rules 8 there either. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Anybody else? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm sure you're going to, 11 in your comments, discuss workshops a little bit and budget 12 status? 13 (Judge Tinley nodded.) 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Then I don't have any 15 more comments. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: You have nothing? 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I don't have 18 anything. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. As Commissioner Letz 20 indicated, he's hoping I'll have some enlightenment 21 concerning the budget and the workshops. All of the 22 workshops, of course, have been scheduled for -- first one's 23 this Friday, the 15th, I believe, beginning at 10:00 or 24 10:30? Which is it? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 10:30. 8-11-03 96 1 MS. SOVIL: 10:30, I think. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: They're generally going to be 3 10:00, 10:30, and they'll be continuing through the 4 following Tuesday and Wednesday and Friday. That's the 5 19th, 20th, and 22nd, if necessary, until conclusion. We've 6 currently got a budget workshop scheduled, thanks to 7 Commissioner Letz, who was kind enough to work up a draft of 8 that, and that was approved, and we're going to proceed on 9 that basis. With respect to the proposed budget, I carried 10 that to the Auditor this morning. The Auditor was on 11 vacation for, I think, the last four days of last week, and 12 I carried it to him first thing this morning. So, we should 13 be seeing some product or result of that in the next day or 14 two, and he's first going to bring it to me to make sure 15 it's in conformity with what I submitted to him. And once 16 that's been verified, it will be -- it'll be distributed to 17 all -- all concerned, and a copy of that will be on file for 18 the public review, be a copy for each of the Commissioners. 19 Who else, Ms. Sovil? 20 MS. SOVIL: Copy -- each department will get 21 a copy of their department. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Of their particular portion of 23 it, certainly. And I believe that's pretty much the -- the 24 scoop on the budget at this point. Any further -- any 25 further reports? Comments? Discussions? Enlightenment? 8-11-03 97 1 There being none, I'll declare the meeting adjourned. 2 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 11:05 a.m.) 3 - - - - - - - - - - 4 5 6 STATE OF TEXAS | 7 COUNTY OF KERR | 8 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 9 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 10 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 11 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 12 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 14th day of August, 13 2003. 14 15 16 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 17 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 18 Certified Shorthand Reporter 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 8-11-03