1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Special Session 10 Tuesday, December 28, 2004 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 DAVE NICHOLSON, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X December 28, 2004 2 PAGE --- Commissioners' Comments 4 3 1.1 Final Plat of Big Sky Ranch, Pct. 4 7 4 1.2 Consider replacing Gradall damaged in accident 11 1.3 Final Plat of The Horizon, Section Two, Pct. 1 19 5 1.4 Consider expansion of memory on mainframe of imaging part of inmate tracking system 24,54 6 1.5 Consider nomination(s) for membership on Kerr County Emergency Service District No. 1 Board 36 7 1.6 Consider nominations for membership on Kerr County Emergency Service District No. 2 Board 38 8 1.7 Consider, discuss and take appropriate action to authorize advertising for bids for construction 9 for Kerrville South Sanitary Sewer Project under TCDP contracts #722411 and 723095 41 10 1.8 Consider accepting conveyance of land upon which a portion of Red Bird Loop is constructed 43 11 1.11 Approve resolution to apply for grant from Office of the Governor, Criminal Justice Division, to fund 12 80% of Crime Victims' Assistance program 46 1.9 PUBLIC HEARING - Revision of Plat for Lots 6 & 7 13 and parts of Lots 4 & 5 of Hartshorn Country Sites 52 1.10 Revision of Plat for Lots 6 & 7 and parts of 14 Lots 4 & 5, Hartshorn Country Sites 52 1.12 Consider authorizing independent audit of the Kerr 15 County Juvenile Detention Center operation for fiscal years 2002, 2003, and 2004 57 16 1.13 Consider adopting resolution opposing diversion of funds from established programs by ORCA 71 17 1.14 Consider adoption of order authorizing publication of Notice of Intention to Issue Certificates of 18 Obligation 74,109 1.15 Discuss progress of Employee Health Insurance 19 enrollment 83 20 4.1 Pay Bills 91 4.2 Budget Amendments 95 21 4.3 Late Bills --- 4.4 Read and Approve Minutes --- 22 4.5 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 102 23 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee Assignments 103 24 --- Adjourned 115 25 3 1 On Tuesday, December 28, 2004, at 9:00 a.m., a special 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in the 3 Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, Kerrville, 4 Texas, and the following proceedings were had in open court: 5 P R O C E E D I N G S 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me call to order the 7 meeting of the -- special Commissioners Court meeting pieced 8 for this time and date, Tuesday, December 28, 2004, at 9 9 a.m. It is that time now. I want to welcome all of you, 10 and at this time I'd like the call on my good friend, Al 11 Shultz, to lead us in a word of prayer, and then we'll do 12 the pledge of allegiance. Reverend Shultz? 13 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you very much. At this 15 time, if there's any member of the public or the audience 16 that wishes to address the Court on any matter that's not a 17 listed agenda item, we want you to come forward at this 18 time, and feel welcome in doing so. If you want to speak on 19 an item that is listed as an agenda item, we would ask that 20 you fill out a participation form. They're at the back of 21 the room. It's not required, but it helps me in trying to 22 keep up with who wants to be heard on agenda items, and 23 hopefully not miss you when we get to that item. So, if you 24 want to speak on an agenda item, we'd ask that you do that, 25 but if there's any member of the public that wishes to come 12-28-04 4 1 forward and be heard on any matter that's not listed as an 2 agenda item, we'd ask that you come forward at this time. 3 Seeing no one moving this direction, Commissioner Baldwin? 4 You got anything for us this morning? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sir, I just want to 6 remind you that I've always considered Kerrville and Kerr 7 County a defensive driving course in itself. (Laughter.) 8 And now that the college kids are home, that -- that is 9 escalated somewhat, a large percentage. Just want to remind 10 you of that. Burn ban issue. In my opinion, I think we 11 better take a peek at that here pretty quick and start 12 nosing around and seeing what moisture contents are and all 13 of that and how much -- all the dead grass there is. I want 14 to remind you that this Saturday at 10 a.m., the swearing-in 15 ceremony upstairs, and there are a few brand-new folks. I 16 can't remember how many; two or three that are brand new to 17 elected officialism in Kerr County. So, be sure to bring 18 your families and your cameras, and -- because it -- it's 19 that kind of an affair. That's all I have. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What time? 10 a.m.? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 10 a.m. upstairs, and 22 it's an official Commissioners Court meeting deal; you have 23 to be there. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'll be there. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 12-28-04 5 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Williams? 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Nothing much, except 3 to wish everybody a happy New Year, and trust everybody had 4 a good holiday. Mine was safe and sound, and spent it with 5 my family. I did one of those things my wife accuses me of 6 doing all the time with respect to football games. My son 7 put two tickets for the Cowboys-Redskins game on the tree, 8 so he and I went to the ball game. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Golly, you stay till 10 the end? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good seats -- don't 12 take my story away from me. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm sorry. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And after that last 15 disgusting series -- the second to the last series, said, 16 "Let's go." We hopped up and left, and would you believe, 17 by the time we got back to our car, the Cowboys had scored 18 and we missed it, and won the game. Anyhow, we had a good 19 time, safe trip, and I trust all of y'all did the same 20 thing. It's good to be back. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Commissioner Letz? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Nothing to add this 23 morning. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Nicholson? 25 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Good and quiet 12-28-04 6 1 Christmas out in the hinterlands. I want to echo what 2 Commissioner Baldwin said about rising concern about 3 potential for brush fires. We had a pretty good one a 4 couple days ago. Actually started over in Mountain Home 5 area and burned over toward the experimental station, so we 6 had our two fire departments fighting it, Mountain Home and 7 Hunt, and they have good training, good equipment; they got 8 it handled. But the grass is high and it's dry, and we've 9 got good potential for a fire, so I think we're going to 10 probably have to take the unpopular step pretty soon of 11 reintroducing the burn ban. That's all. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. With respect 13 to the meeting on Saturday, unfortunately, I won't be able 14 to be there. I'm scheduled to be out of town. I trust you 15 gentlemen will pull it off well, as I know you will. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It will be difficult, 17 Judge, but we'll get it done. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I have confidence in 19 you. The -- the main thing I want to touch on this morning 20 was some good news about our safety program. We received 21 news here in the last few days that the Texas Workers 22 Compensation Commission has recently conducted an audit -- 23 inspection, as it were, of our Road and Bridge Department 24 where, prior to more emphasis being placed upon the safety 25 program, we had some difficulties out there. And, as a 12-28-04 7 1 result of this inspection, the Workers Compensation 2 Commission gave the Road and Bridge Department a clean bill 3 of health, as it were, and was -- was very, very pleased 4 with the efforts that they've made in the various areas of 5 their safety program. Actually, the net result was during 6 the last calendar year up until early December of this year, 7 the injury frequency rate out there had been reduced to 8 zero, and that's about as good as it gets. And I want to 9 congratulate Mr. Odom and his crew out there for the fine 10 work they've done, and just urge all of our departments to 11 continue to work that safety program, place emphasis on it, 12 and I think it'll continue to pay dividends if -- if we do 13 that. Hope everyone had a good holiday, and would hope that 14 we all pass into the new year in a safe manner, and not have 15 any difficulties in doing so. And let's get down to 16 business. First item on the agenda is to consider the final 17 plat of Big Sky Ranch in Precinct 4. 18 MR. ODOM: Good morning, Judge. Do you -- 19 Jeana, do you have the mylars? Thank you. If I may I go 20 through the accompanying information we sent to the Court, 21 we had looked at -- at the time that we wrote this up, 22 basically, there were some things that were not done, but 23 I've talked to the Commissioner, and -- and it says the 24 roads -- since then the roads have been completed to Kerr 25 County Subdivision Regulations for country lane, with the 12-28-04 8 1 exception of sealcoat on the cul-de-sacs at the point I went 2 out Wednesday, and that is complete. It's to my 3 satisfaction. They were waiting for warm weather, and the 4 sealcoat went down, so that is not a problem. The only 5 thing that we have at this point, and I bring up to the 6 Court, is two items. One is that there's not a stop -- the 7 stop sign in the street on that cul-de-sac need -- needs to 8 be put up, but I have no problems with that. That's a year 9 maintenance in there, and what we're asking is that -- I 10 have a copy that we received this morning. It was faxed to 11 us Friday, since we weren't there, but it was a copy of the 12 letter of credit for the maintenance bond. And we're 13 waiting for the original to show up. It's supposed to be 14 mailed today. At the time that Wells Fargo -- when we 15 talked to the gentleman over there, he said it would take 16 probably after this meeting, so I'm asking the Court to 17 accept this subdivision. They've done everything we've 18 asked them to do; that we're waiting for the original, and 19 then I would ask the Court to accept it and authorize the 20 Judge to sign it, with the exception that we would not file 21 it until we receive that original copy of the letter of 22 credit. 23 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: The stop sign has 24 been purchased; it just hasn't been erected? 25 MR. ODOM: It has been purchased. One of 12-28-04 9 1 them's been put up, the other one has not. That would be in 2 the maintenance bond. If -- I would assume that they would 3 probably get to that pretty quick. If not, I assure you, I 4 will be inspecting it before the year is over with, and I 5 have a letter of credit. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have one question. 7 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The -- between Lot 1 9 and Lot 3, the Buffalo Trail cul-de-sac. 10 MR. ODOM: I'm -- I'm sorry, just a second. 11 Is this the cul-de-sac that was abandoned, or the first one 12 you're talking about? Buffalo Trail? 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 14 MR. ODOM: All right. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There's -- the little 16 line from the cul-de-sac out to the property line, tell me 17 what that is again. 18 MR. ODOM: Little line. Is this -- that is a 19 utility, I would -- is that with a "P" on it? It's overhead 20 utility line. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, not that one. 22 MS. KRAUSE: There's a power line that comes 23 off of Lower Reservation across the property to the 24 adjoining property. That might be what that is. 25 MR. ODOM: I'm sorry, let me see what you 12-28-04 10 1 have. Excuse me. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: See, they always 3 provide me with things that don't have anything to do with 4 the program here. This line right there. 5 MR. ODOM: That's the property line, going 6 down the center of the road. That's splitting the property 7 line. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Center of the road. 9 MR. ODOM: Cul-de-sac goes so far back, and 10 then the property -- between those two lots. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Got it. Thank you. 12 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I move to approve 14 the final plat of Big Sky Ranch -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 16 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: -- Subdivision 17 contingent upon receipt of the original letter of credit, 18 and authorize County Judge to sign. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I second it. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 21 approval of the agenda item, contingent upon receipt of the 22 original letter of credit. Any question or discussion? 23 MR. ODOM: Do you wish the Court -- for you 24 and I to sign it now, and for County Clerk to hold it? Or 25 wait until I get that letter and then bring it to you for 12-28-04 11 1 your signature? 2 JUDGE TINLEY: I think the motion is 3 contingent upon receipt, as I understood it. 4 MR. ODOM: Okay. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that correct? Any further 6 question or discussion? All in favor of that motion, 7 signify by raising your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. The 12 next item on the agenda is to consider and discuss replacing 13 a Gradall that was damaged in a recent accident. 14 MR. ODOM: Yes. After the Judge's 15 introduction, I'm a little bit ashamed to come up here and 16 address this. I have to apologize. We work very hard for 17 safety, but on December the 15th, our crews were working out 18 there on a complaint, which was to level up some base 19 failures on Upper Turtle Creek. They had left that morning. 20 They were working out there, and they were going -- where 21 the accident occurred was about 200 or 300 feet from there. 22 Had a cattle guard they were going to -- base failure right 23 there. At the time, someone had passed them. It is a 24 situation of wrong place, wrong time. Individual went off 25 in the water. There was a little bit of water running 12-28-04 12 1 across in Granada Springs, and it had turned to ice. That 2 was from traffic coming out that was carrying it to the east 3 coming out of Granada Springs going back towards 16. 4 Individual was -- was speeding, and passed -- our man pulled 5 over in the Gradall. This gentleman went ahead 200 or 6 300 yards in front of him. He said he saw a splash of 7 water; the guy went into the water. Said he went up. He 8 said he thought he could -- the car was sinking -- or the 9 truck was, and he thought he could get up there to him and 10 take the bucket and reach out and grab the guy. And he said 11 then he lost control of it on that ice. He said he didn't 12 know it was ice, and we had no other places on Upper Turtle 13 Creek when we were there. 14 So, that's what happened. We ended up -- and 15 it went off the downstream side, and so we have a damaged 16 Gradall, and we are waiting for the insurance company to 17 take a look at it, but we think that it -- the damage will 18 exceed what we paid for it, which was 16,500. So, what I 19 would like to do -- we've been checking. I have some 20 capital outlay. I'm asking the Court to allow me, if I have 21 the money, to be able to purchase another Gradall to replace 22 that. We have called the place that we had -- we called 23 Houston to locate something, and we feel like with what we 24 have, and maybe this Gradall being totaled, that we would 25 have enough money to purchase one or possibly two Gradalls. 12-28-04 13 1 There's some used ones up there, '89's and some '90, '96, in 2 Amarillo. It's an unfortunate situation. The individual 3 was injured, not severely, circumstances of weather and 4 situation and operator's head space. So, the committee has 5 met on that; we've looked at that. We've tried to resolve 6 that problem. We're going -- part of that, I will take a 7 little bit. Maybe I should have had more classes on a 8 situation like that. I have safety meetings every -- every 9 month, and I've never covered that, but that's one thing we 10 will do, what the procedure will be to do that. It's 11 unfortunate. Right now we don't have anything as far as 12 major injuries on our part, other than a Gradall, which we 13 need. It has been an excellent tool for us, and we don't 14 wish to lose it, because the cost is going to be -- exceed 15 what the value of it is. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Have you gotten an 17 insurance adjuster's appraisal? 18 MR. ODOM: We have turned that in. We have 19 not been approached by them. Hopefully -- we've been 20 talking to Tommy and Mindy, and I'm hoping this week or next 21 week -- I figure after the first of the year, maybe we'll 22 get somebody out there to determine. But right now we're 23 looking at parts are going to run probably $11,000, $12,000, 24 plus labor, and then no guarantee on the electrical. I've 25 got to take the cab off and rewire it, and it's going to 12-28-04 14 1 exceed $16,000. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, what you're saying 3 is, you -- in your capital outlay, you don't have -- 4 MR. ODOM: I have seven -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- you don't have a 6 Gradall listed in there. 7 MR. ODOM: Listed in there. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So you want to buy one 9 out of Capital Outlay, and then replace that money with 10 insurance when it comes in? 11 MR. ODOM: That's right. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have no problem with 13 that at all. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- it's entirely possible 15 that the funds received from the insurance coverage will 16 exceed what we -- what you paid for that machine, isn't it? 17 MR. ODOM: It might be. We're -- we have the 18 list of -- of the different things that we've done, but 19 it -- it runs up into the 20's over the years that we've had 20 with that, but I'm assuming that what we originally bought 21 it for, that may be what we have it insured for. I don't 22 know, but we feel like that with that insurance money and 23 what I have left in savings in capital outlays, that we 24 could purchase one, we believe, maybe two. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Should be insured for A.C.V., 12-28-04 15 1 isn't it, Tommy? 2 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Whatever -- whatever 4 the current market value is, is what it's insured for, 5 irrespective -- I seem to recall that when you bought that 6 piece of equipment, if it's the one I'm thinking about, you 7 got an extraordinarily good buy. 8 MR. ODOM: I got a very good buy on it. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: I suspect you're going to get 10 more than what you paid for it. 11 MR. ODOM: We're hoping that would be the 12 case. Then we would be in good shape to do that. We -- we 13 certainly could use two, and I have two qualified people. 14 And the person I have was the individual that is the most 15 proficient in that, and his judgment was such that he -- if 16 anyone could have helped the individual, he could have, had 17 he not lost control when it went up there. So, he was 18 trying to position himself, and the rear end came out, and 19 he said he couldn't overcome -- he couldn't correct it in 20 time to -- to do it. It just slid on off that crossing 21 there. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I move for 23 approval of the agenda item. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 12-28-04 16 1 approval of replacement of the Gradall. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Couple questions. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, sir. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Leonard, the -- I'm 5 confused on the dollar side of it. 6 MR. ODOM: All right, sir. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The prices you gave, 8 there's three of them that range from 22,5 to 32,5. And I 9 know we're talking about 16 to 20 is going to come from 10 this, but you're talking about possibly two. Where is that 11 much -- where is there -- where is that money coming from? 12 MR. ODOM: Well, it depends when I get the 13 insurance. If I get 16,5, and I have $11,700 left, I still 14 have pieces of equipment to pick up. I have a $6,000 15 credit, so $17,000 in capital outlay. There's enough to buy 16 one machine. But remember that I can -- you know, 17 negotiations on prices when you go for two versus one on 18 used equipment, and in the wintertime, I may be able to -- 19 to offset that, plus I may be able to use contingency fees 20 to pick up a thousand or several thousand dollars. I still 21 have that to do that if I could negotiate a better deal. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And the addition -- the 23 11,700 or whatever it was you said, that's money left over 24 in capital outlay right now? 25 MR. ODOM: Left over in capital outlays. And 12-28-04 17 1 y'all have control of that, I don't. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My other question, this 3 doesn't have to be bid? You can just -- I mean, on the -- 4 MR. ODOM: If it's over $25,000, I probably 5 do. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Over $25,000 cutoff now. 7 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Commissioner 9 Baldwin, is your motion to buy one or two? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: To buy one. 11 MR. ODOM: May I ask the Court, if I 12 negotiate well -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, actually, I 14 mean, I don't care one way or the other. You -- if you 15 don't like them, you can use them for bookends or something 16 out there. But I -- I don't care. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How's the bidding 18 process come in? Two of them is going to exceed $25,000. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's correct. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How's the bidding 21 process come in? I'm looking at the new County Attorney. 22 MR. TOMLINSON: I mean, if it -- it would be 23 bid just like any other -- 24 MR. ODOM: Any other bid. I would have put 25 specs out on it, and to do that, I -- you know, I do not 12-28-04 18 1 know. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You answered my 3 question. You got to bid it. 4 MR. ODOM: I've got to put specs out on it, 5 just like I would a normal bid, and we don't know. We're 6 concerned at what the older ones are, whether they've been 7 updated. We know that one of them's been updated; it was 8 done at the factory, but we don't know the -- if the other 9 two have been updated. It's ludicrous to have diodes in the 10 old system. So, we don't really know until I have enough 11 time to do this, and what the -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm in favor of one, but 13 just because there's some excess in Capital Outlay, I'm not 14 in favor of two. 15 MR. ODOM: May I interject something here? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Certainly. 17 MR. ODOM: I appreciate the Commissioner's 18 thoughts, but remember, I did trade-ins, and that's where 19 I'm getting this excess money. It's not because I missed my 20 bid. I came in on my bids. It's the excess that I turned 21 in; that's this old equipment, and that's what I'm hoping -- 22 I only have 1,000 now. If I get the 6,000 -- I should get 23 the 6,000. That's 17,000. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I understand that, but I 25 look at it as the County has had some unexpected 12-28-04 19 1 expenditures recently -- 2 MR. ODOM: That's what I had. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- that far exceed 4 11,000, and just because there's some money available, I 5 don't think -- I'm not in favor of using it. I think we 6 need to tighten the belt everywhere where we can. I mean, 7 it's for one. 8 MR. ODOM: Is that his motion? Or are you 9 trying -- 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: His motion so far is one, 11 and I'll vote for one, but I'm not voting for two. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: My second is for one. 13 MR. ODOM: Thank you, Commissioner. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sorry, Leonard. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to 16 authorize Road and Bridge to replace one Gradall machine. 17 Any further question or discussion? All in favor of that 18 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 23 MR. ODOM: Thank you. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: The next item is consider 25 final plat of The Horizon, Section Two, in Precinct 1. 12-28-04 20 1 MR. ODOM: The -- the preliminary plat was 2 submitted to Commissioners Court in July of '03, and an 3 extension was granted in August of '04. City of Kerrville 4 approved the final plat of Horizon, Section Two, on 5 Thursday, December the 16th, 2004. Lot sizes average 6 5 acres, and they will be served by a central water system. 7 Drainage studies and storm water pollution prevention plan 8 have been submitted, and all roads meet Kerr County 9 Subdivision specifications for privately maintained roads. 10 They look very good. I didn't see any problems with them. 11 Therefore, my recommendation is that Commissioners Court 12 accept the final plat of The Horizon, Section Two, at this 13 time. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Upon the 15 recommendation of the Road Administrator, I move for 16 approval. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'll second it. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 19 approval of the agenda item. Any questions, comments or 20 discussion? 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, I have a 22 question. Did I understand you correctly to say all the 23 lots were 5 acres or more? 24 MR. ODOM: No -- well, I say that. There is 25 one that's less than that. 12-28-04 21 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm looking at 2 several that are less than that. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think they average 4 5 acres. 5 MR. ODOM: The average was 5 acres. There's 6 several up here -- 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Average. 8 MR. ODOM: -- that were less. In other 9 words, 3.9 and a 2.18. That's the reason that I had Miguel 10 sign off on it. 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: 25 lots into 12 125 acres? Is -- is that correct? 13 MR. ODOM: I believe so. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 15 MR. ODOM: 25. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The question I have is -- 17 and I'm not trying to be nitpicky this morning, but I 18 believe the preliminary plat expired in August? I'm not 19 sure our rules allow us to do -- we don't have a preliminary 20 plat, so we're doing a final plat without a preliminary 21 plat. You know, it's -- and we came across this several 22 years ago, and I believe it was decided, and I think by the 23 County Attorney, that we can't do it. There's no 24 preliminary plat. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That we can't -- we 12-28-04 22 1 don't have the authority to? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we can do a 3 waiver, but, I mean, I think that the -- I mean, our rules 4 say we have to have a preliminary plat filed, and we don't 5 have a preliminary plat. Which -- and I would say it's our 6 fault as much as the developer's fault. 7 MR. ODOM: My understanding is that this 8 preliminary plat was given to you and that this was 9 submitted -- I wasn't involved in this; I just picked up on 10 this trying to clarify this to get it done. And my 11 understanding is that the preliminary was -- was granted by 12 y'all. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What was the 14 extension you were talking about? 15 MR. ODOM: Pardon me? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What was the 17 extension you were talking about? 18 MR. ODOM: To my knowledge, that I don't 19 think they had everything completed at the time. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And that would have 21 been an extension of the preliminary plat? 22 MR. ODOM: That's right. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We extended it in August? 24 MR. ODOM: That's what -- yes, in August of 25 2004. 12-28-04 23 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's my question. 2 Do we -- in the rules, do we have the authority to grant 3 extensions? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I think that 6 covers it, then. 7 MR. ODOM: Well, I do too. We felt like 8 there was a situation that needed to be cleaned up, and 9 hadn't been done, and they've done everything they've been 10 asked to do. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought the extension 12 expired in August. 13 MR. ODOM: No. I wasn't here in 2003, you 14 know, before you, but my understanding, it was presented to 15 you. For whatever reason, it wasn't -- wasn't done, and 16 y'all extended it. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Roads are not being accepted 18 for maintenance? 19 MR. ODOM: That's right. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. 21 MR. ODOM: Privately maintained. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any further question or 23 discussion on the motion? 24 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Just for clarity, 25 each lot will be served by an individual septic system, but 12-28-04 24 1 the subdivision will be -- will be -- water supply will be a 2 community water system. 3 MR. ODOM: Community water system, yes, sir. 4 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay. 5 MR. ODOM: So they could be at 1 acre. But 6 all this has been approved by the City, and they had to go 7 before them and their Planning and Zoning. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That part doesn't mean 9 anything to us. 10 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Means they have to 11 jump through two different hoops. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: We need to do 14 something about that someday. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 17 comments? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 18 your right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. The 23 next item on the agenda is to consider and discuss the 24 expansion of memory on the mainframe of the imaging part of 25 the inmate tracking system. The Sheriff asked that this 12-28-04 25 1 item be placed on the agenda. 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes, and Tommy's also 3 here and will speak on it more than I. It does not have 4 anything to do with inmate tracking. That was -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, can we take a 6 three- or four-hour break? 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Buster, we haven't even 8 started the new year. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's table this until 10 next year. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Inmate tracking doesn't 12 have anything to do with this. This is all over imaging 13 space in the current mainframe computer system, "imaging" 14 being documents that the County Clerk, District Clerk, Tax 15 Assessor are all scanning into it, as well as inmate 16 photographs, crime scene photographs, the actual images 17 going in. And because the clerks are doing such a fabulous 18 job of getting caught up on all their old records, getting 19 them imaged in there, it has filled up the current system, 20 and we are at the point now to where we're in serious shape 21 on being able to put any images into the system without it 22 being completely full. So, I got some prices on it. 23 Tommy's talked to Software. We had visited with the Judge, 24 and I'll let Tommy tell you what the recommendation will be. 25 MR. TOMLINSON: During the budget process, 12-28-04 26 1 we -- we already knew that this was going to be a problem, 2 so we had in the budget $1,700. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: $1,700? 4 MR. TOMLINSON: $1,700 for a temporary patch, 5 I would call it. And it's -- what that amounts to is an 6 external hard drive. But since that time, we've -- we 7 visited with our software vendor, and -- and they have made 8 the proposal that you have in front of you. What -- what 9 that -- what this proposal can do is -- is to remove all the 10 images that are currently on the system to a new location, 11 and -- and take those images off of our processing system. 12 What it -- what it can do is extend the life of -- of our 13 current system, probably two years for sure. The system 14 that we have in place today was purchased in December of 15 2000. At -- at that time, we purchased a 5-year maintenance 16 agreement from IBM, so this -- this time next year, that 17 maintenance will expire. And when -- when this system was 18 purchased, we -- we expected it to last four or five years, 19 and -- and with a patch, it will make it five years. 20 There -- there is another side to this, in that there -- 21 there's been a lot of pressure from people in the 22 community -- I mean statewide, not just Kerrville -- to have 23 live access to county records. Talking about, you know, 24 real estate people, banks, attorneys, and what that requires 25 would be a -- a conversion from the current operating system 12-28-04 27 1 that we use currently to a web -- web-based processor. 2 Well, this -- this proposal that Software has made us 3 will -- will not only extend the life of what we have now, 4 but it will give us the opportunity to use this same piece 5 of hardware if, at some point, we decide to go to a 6 web-based processor. So, it can -- it can function and -- 7 in the PC world as well as the -- the Unix world, which 8 we're in right now. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tommy, would you back 10 up? I went into a coma there just for a second. It'll 11 extend the life of what we have now, and it will -- say 12 those two or three words. 13 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, it -- if the Court, in 14 a year or two years -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You can't say just two 16 or three words? 17 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, no, I can't. I can't 18 explain it in two or three words. If -- if, in the future, 19 we decide to go to the web-based processor where -- where 20 everybody that wants or needs access -- you know, live 21 access to our system, then this piece of equipment can be 22 used in -- in that processor. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So that would be the 24 step one toward the -- 25 MR. TOMLINSON: Right. If you want to -- 12-28-04 28 1 yeah, you can look at it that way. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 3 MR. TOMLINSON: It will also -- I mean, if we 4 decide not to do that in the next year or two, then this 5 same piece of equipment will extend the life of what we 6 have. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 8 MR. TOMLINSON: Beyond -- beyond a year. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that because you would be 10 taking the imaging part out of the main server system and 11 putting it off over the side, therefore freeing up some 12 space over in the main server? 13 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes, that's exactly what it 14 does. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 16 MR. TOMLINSON: And what happens -- well, the 17 mechanics of it is that when -- when an image is done, it 18 sends that image in the program to this remote processor, so 19 to speak. And then, if you -- when you access a document 20 out of that -- out of this remote processor, then -- then, 21 when you type in name or number or whatever you use to 22 access that document, the same process occurs; you go 23 through our processor -- our main processor and it sends you 24 to that -- that secondary or remote processor. So we have 25 live retrieval of -- you know, of the document that you're 12-28-04 29 1 trying to find. 2 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Tommy? 3 MR. TOMLINSON: It's a seamless fix, but -- 4 but it could fix us for two years for sure, maybe more. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's the extended 6 life that's estimated, is two years? 7 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. I suspect that it 8 could -- it could last us three years. I mean, that's -- 9 that's hard to determine. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 11 MR. TOMLINSON: I mean, we don't know, you 12 know, how fast, you know, we're going to grow. So -- and, 13 too, the -- you know, we don't know, you know, really what 14 the pressure will be in two years to make a change. And the 15 software right now is available for us to have a web-based 16 system. I mean, it's there now. And next -- next budget 17 year, we will have -- or could have the opportunity to make 18 a decision to -- to change part of our system to -- to a 19 web-based processor. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: If we go to a web-based 21 system, how is that going to affect the implement -- what 22 we've got in place in the County Clerk's office of -- that 23 we just recently put into place concerning the ability of 24 people to get into the system and order copies of documents 25 and -- 12-28-04 30 1 MR. TOMLINSON: It won't change that. In 2 fact, it will make it easier. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 4 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's what I want 5 to learn more about. I think I can see where this web-based 6 system would certainly be a convenience to the legal and 7 banking and real estate community. 8 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, the -- 9 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: What does it do to 10 us? 11 MR. TOMLINSON: It really -- 12 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Does it make us more 13 efficient? 14 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, it could. I mean, 15 there -- in a web-based processing system that I envision 16 would be a mini-processor in each office. Maybe we'd have 17 one with the Sheriff, each clerk, my office, Treasurer's 18 office, Tax Office, and so if you had -- if you had 19 maintenance issues with -- with the main system, you 20 wouldn't affect any user. I mean, the only user you would 21 -- if you had a problem or an update on a software package, 22 say, for instance, for the Sheriff, and you -- you had to 23 bring the system down totally to install whatever that might 24 be, that won't happen again, because we can do it just at 25 the Sheriff's Office only, and the rest of the courthouse 12-28-04 31 1 can keep operating. 2 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Do we lose any fee 3 revenue because it's being accessed on the web? 4 MR. TOMLINSON: I don't know. That's a hard 5 question, and I -- I haven't thought about that. But -- 6 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Then the corollary 7 to that is -- 8 MR. TOMLINSON: -- I mean, there would be -- 9 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Is it feasible to 10 charge for access? 11 MR. TOMLINSON: There would be a way to 12 determine how many -- how many times our site was accessed 13 and by who, so there -- there would be a way to know how 14 much to charge a user if we wanted -- if we so desired to do 15 that. 16 MR. EMERSON: I had a comment for the benefit 17 of the Court. Judge Tinley, I'm sure, is aware, as is 18 Jannett and Linda, but the State itself, many counties are 19 moving to e-filing on behalf of all legal documents, and 20 that does not reduce the fee revenue for the county in any 21 way, but what it does do is keep the clerks from having to 22 handle documents multiple times. So that, theoretically, it 23 should increase the efficiency of the office with the same 24 amount of revenue. 25 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That would be very 12-28-04 32 1 appealing, if we could do same amount of work with -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that the Stan Reid 3 program? 4 MR. EMERSON: I don't know. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I noticed from the 7 Sheriff's document that he estimates the cost here at about 8 $15,693. You say we have $1,700 available. What part of 9 the Sheriff's budget is the other 14,000 -- 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Wait. 11 MR. TOMLINSON: There -- there's some -- 12 there are funds remaining in the Maintenance line item for 13 the mainframe. We have $5,000 in Capital Outlay in 14 Nondepartmental that we have not used. There's 15 approximately $7,500 in the Nondepartmental Contingency line 16 item. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Leonard has another 18 Gradall you can buy. 19 MR. TOMLINSON: So, with those three -- with 20 those three items, we're close to -- to that amount. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes? 22 MR. TOMLINSON: I just wanted to add that one 23 of the reasons that our software vendor has resisted 24 changing to -- to a web-based processor is that the -- the 25 Unix operating system, which is -- which is as opposite of a 12-28-04 33 1 PC system as you can get, is virtually, 99.9 percent 2 bulletproof. You -- a virus of any kind will not impact a 3 Unix-based system. So, we have -- with that processor, we 4 have some security in knowing that -- that somebody from the 5 outside world can hack into our -- our processor, or a virus 6 can attack our processor and -- you know, and destroy our 7 information. So -- but over the last two or three years, 8 the -- the security in a web-based system has improved a 9 lot. So, in the -- in the past year or two years, our 10 software vendor has -- has -- their main thrust has been 11 developing software or converting their software to a web -- 12 web-based processor, and they're there now. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that Software, 14 Inc.? 15 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. The tax -- the tax 16 information system and the court information system I 17 believe is already available. In fact, Sheriff Jung over in 18 Gillespie County was -- was one of the beta sites for the -- 19 the new web-based sheriff's system, and I know the Sheriff 20 has visited with him, and from what the Sheriff tells me, 21 you know, Sheriff Jung is -- can't be more happy with -- 22 with what he has. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, it's a good 24 thing, then. If Sheriff Jung -- 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: If Milton's happy -- 12-28-04 34 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If Milton's happy, 2 it's a good thing. 3 MR. TOMLINSON: So -- so that's why I would 4 recommend to do what they've suggested, in that it gives 5 us -- it gives us two avenues here. It could extend our 6 life -- the life of our processor, or we could use the 7 system to attach to a web-based processor if we want to. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Did we expand the mainframe 9 last year? 10 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes, we did. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Wasn't that a budget item of 12 about $10,000? 13 MR. TOMLINSON: No. That -- that was to 14 purchase some virus protection for our internet system. 15 We -- we had to enlarge our -- our license -- we had to 16 increase our licenses for that product, and that's what that 17 was for. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tommy, what's the -- I'll 20 make a motion if we can figure out what we're trying to buy. 21 What's it called? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do you know what I'd 23 like to see? I'd like to see us have written down what it 24 is we're buying, and the -- the exact, specific lines that 25 we're taking money out of, and how much exact money we're 12-28-04 35 1 taking out of each line, and have that in the court order. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I want that too. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree. I was just 4 trying to figure out what it was we're trying to -- is 5 this -- 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's actually a server. 7 MR. TOMLINSON: Yeah, it's called -- it's 8 called a DataNAS XP filer, and it consists of -- of the 9 amount for an eight -- for a 500-gigabyte usable space. 10 It -- it has a warranty, and it includes $3,000 for 11 installation. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are you doing all 13 these options that are also listed here? 14 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes, we are. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are those options 16 included in the 12,693? 17 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes, they are. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: And where are you proposing 19 the budget line items be -- be charged for? 20 MR. TOMLINSON: I don't have -- I don't have 21 a definitive amount for each line item right now, but I -- 22 essentially, it comes from -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Come back in a little 24 while. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that was going to be my 12-28-04 36 1 suggestion, that you put the pencil to it and -- and put 2 down some specifics. We can come back to this item and take 3 action on it once we have the specifics. That might be the 4 more efficient way to handle it. I think that's where you 5 were coming from, -- 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: -- Commissioner. And you 8 were, likewise? 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Come back today? 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, here in just a few 12 minutes, if you can get the -- get the specifics as to the 13 system, and also the -- the numbers and from what budget 14 line items. I think that's what we're looking for. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. And if you 16 hand-write it, don't let Rusty do it. That left hand, I 17 can't tell what some of these numbers are. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, we'll come back to Item 19 4; take no further action on that now. Let's go to the next 20 item on the agenda, consider and act on nominations for 21 membership on the Kerr County Emergency Service District 22 Number 1 Board of Commissioners. Commissioner Nicholson. 23 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay. Emergency 24 Service District Number 1 is the -- is an Ingram area 25 service district, and in our last meeting, or meeting before 12-28-04 37 1 last, we did appoint -- or we did approve the nomination of 2 a -- of -- 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Johnny Elkins. 4 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah, Johnnie 5 Elkins, to fill a vacancy, the seat vacated by Elaine 6 Casteel. Subsequent to that, one of the other members, 7 Truman Lyles, has determined that he won't serve any longer 8 because of health reasons, so the Board of E.S.D. Number 1 9 has nominated James Damon as a replacement for Truman Lyles. 10 Mr. Damon's got a lengthy history in business, and he knows 11 financial matters very well. He's also got an interest in 12 and experience in community service, and I think he'll be -- 13 make an excellent member of the board. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 15 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: So, I move to -- to 16 nom -- approve the nomination of James Damon to the E.S.D. 17 Number 1 board. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 20 approval of the nomination of James Damon to the Kerr County 21 Emergency Services District Number 1 Board of Commissioners. 22 Any question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, 23 signify by raising your right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 12-28-04 38 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. The 3 next item is to consider and act on nominations for 4 membership on the Kerr County Emergency Service District 5 Number 2 Board of Commissioners. We have with us 6 Mr. Henson, who's on that board, and feel free to come 7 forward and tell us what your thoughts are, Mr. Henson. 8 MR. HENSON: Good morning, gentlemen. I'm 9 F.C. Henson, resident of Mountain Home area, and it's my 10 pleasure and honor to be the president of the Board of 11 Commissioners at the present time for Emergency Services 12 District Number 2. We have two terms that expire at the end 13 of this year. One of those terms, we will have a -- an 14 individual that's an incumbent on the Commission is 15 available to be renominated and reappointed for that 16 position, Mr. Wesley Patton, and our board recommends that 17 the County Commissioners reappoint him to -- to Emergency 18 Services District Board of Commissioners. One of our 19 members, Mr. Bruce Oehler, who I'm sure you all know, will 20 not be available for reappointment due to his interest in 21 some other activities, and so we have a new member 22 recommendation that we'd like to make to you at this time; 23 specifically, Mr. Stephen Bauer. Mr. Bauer is a lifelong 24 resident of the hill country. He lives in the Mountain Home 25 area, and he's over age 18, which we -- which fulfills the 12-28-04 39 1 legal requirements for appointment to that -- to that board. 2 He has a long history of community service, including being 3 the past president of the Farm Bureau. At the Farm Bureau, 4 he was president, on the board. He's very active in other 5 public institutions, public school system in particular. He 6 runs his own very successful business in the Ingram area, so 7 we think he's an ideal candidate for your consideration to 8 be appointed to -- to membership to the Board of Directors. 9 Are there any questions that you have about the nominations? 10 In summary, we'd like to re -- we would like you to 11 reappoint Wesley Patton, and we'd like you to appoint Steve 12 Bauer. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just wanted to make 14 a comment, that even though Mr. Bauer is a resident of 15 Gillespie County, he's a good man. Good man. Be a strong 16 board member. 17 MR. HENSON: Thank you. I -- I think he is a 18 resident of Kerr County, however. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, it says Harper, 20 Texas. 21 MR. HENSON: Yes, sir. His -- his mailing 22 address is Harper, Texas. For very same reason that some of 23 our -- our present members -- Mr. Oehler, in particular, his 24 address is Ingram. That's simply an artifact of the -- of 25 the U.S. mail service, but he lives within the district, 12-28-04 40 1 within the -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's a requirement, 3 isn't it? 4 MR. HENSON: Yes, sir, it is a requirement. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. Appreciate 6 you straightening that out for me. 7 MR. HENSON: Thank you very much for bringing 8 it up for clarification. 9 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay. I move that 10 we approve the reappointment of Wesley Patton and the 11 appointment of Stephen Bauer to the Emergency Service 12 District Number 2 Board of Directors. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 15 approval of the appointments as indicated. Any question or 16 discussion? 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I just -- couple of 18 comments. I've had the opportunity to work with this new 19 E.S.D. board, and I'm very, very impressed with the 20 professionalism, efficiency, and the capability of the board 21 and each individual member. We're in good hands with this 22 board. They're doing everything right. Also comment that I 23 know Mr. Stephen Bauer, and he's a good businessman. He's 24 got a lot of interest in community things. I think all of 25 you probably know him, particularly through youth 12-28-04 41 1 activities, or maybe you've stopped by and bought corn from 2 him before at his store there in Ingram. So, I think we've 3 done well by getting Stephen Bauer. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 6 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 7 your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry, thank 12 you for being with us today, Mr. Henson. 13 MR. HENSON: Thank you very much, gentlemen. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: The next item on the agenda is 15 to consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 16 authorize advertising for bids for construction for Kerr 17 County's Kerrville South sanitary sewer project under Texas 18 Community Development Program contract 722411 and 723095. 19 Commissioner Williams? 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, I put this on 21 the agenda in anticipation that all of the approvals would 22 be ready for us to move forward on bidding. The project 23 engineer, however, advises me that Phases 2 and 3 plans -- 24 construction plans are still in the hands of the City's 25 Public Works Department for review, and we haven't gotten 12-28-04 42 1 their final approval or review comments yet, so I'll 2 withdraw it and will come back at a later date. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Commissioner, could I 4 -- could you give me a map of some sort that outlines what 5 Phase 2 and 3 is? 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sure. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've kind of lost 8 track of all that. I think it's kind of time. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: When I put it back 10 on, I'll have that in the packet. I'll give it to you in 11 advance, if you like. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That'd be great. 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Commissioner, on a 14 related issue, not -- not directly related, but do you have 15 an idea of when the -- the new sewer line to Ingram might be 16 in operation? What I know about is what I read in the 17 newspaper. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, unfortunately, 19 that's about all I know. I know the City says it's moving 20 forward. Danny Edwards says it's moving forward, but based 21 on our experience in constructing, I would say you're 22 looking at two to three years, probably. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Isn't this great? We 24 have a water guru and a sewer guru. This is good. 25 Congratulations, Bill. 12-28-04 43 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He provides -- he 2 provides the natural resources; we flush it away. 3 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Besides water, he's 4 a subdivision guru. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Would you like to be 6 the recycling guru? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, I have nothing to 8 do with that. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Do you want to stay out of 10 this, Commissioner Baldwin? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll stay out of that 12 one. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anybody have anything 14 further on that particular item? If not, we'll move forward 15 on the next agenda item. Consider, discuss, and take 16 appropriate action to accept conveyance of land upon which 17 portion of Red Bird Loop is constructed. Commissioner 18 Williams. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Attorney Lynn 20 LeMeilleur called me, I don't know, a month or so ago, and 21 apparently she has a client, Northpoint Investors, and 22 they're the owners of 0.15 acre of land described on the 23 enclosed plat field note. And I guess when Red Bird Loop 24 was constructed, if you take a look at the plat, and we turn 25 the corner there heading north, I guess you rounded off a 12-28-04 44 1 little bit of those folks' property, and the owner wants to 2 give it to the County, and so I put it on the agenda for the 3 County to accept it. The road is there. It's ours. We run 4 over it, traffic goes over it, so it might as well be a part 5 of our official records. I move acceptance of the portion 6 of Red Bird Loop as constructed and depicted on the plat as 7 submitted in your packet. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to 10 accept the conveyance from the owner of that portion of 11 property, that 0.15 acre upon which the road presently lays. 12 And it is being utilized? 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 15 discussion on the agenda item? 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: My question is, is -- 17 engineer or County Attorney, is this document enough? Is 18 this the -- the document that really outlines the field 19 notes and all those things? 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You want to take -- 21 MR. ODOM: I'm sorry, I haven't seen it. I 22 didn't know exactly, but I -- where I'm at, I think I did 23 field notes -- 24 JUDGE TINLEY: I think there -- I think this 25 anticipates there will be a separate conveyance from the 12-28-04 45 1 record title owner to Kerr County of -- of the property as 2 described in the field notes. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably quitclaim. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: I think it anticipates that. 5 Probably quitclaim, yeah. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 7 MR. ODOM: I believe that I did that several 8 years ago, and that the property owner did not sign the 9 papers on it, and it just laid there. We had it by -- 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, it's changed 11 hands since then. 12 MR. ODOM: It's changed hands, I'm sure. And 13 I think it's at the corner before you get to the Bolins' 14 property right there, and it goes to the right. But that 15 road has always been there. We were there, and when we did 16 that, we approached the gentleman and he wouldn't sign it. 17 For whatever reason, he wouldn't sign. He said he'd sign; 18 then he said he wouldn't. I just said the road stays there. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, as the Judge 20 noted, there will be a conveyance -- appropriate conveyance 21 document. 22 MR. ODOM: But that road had been there for 23 35 or 50, however long Stoneleigh had been there, so we just 24 followed what was there. And we had it for over 10 years, 25 so it's called adverse possession. 12-28-04 46 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question, comments 2 or discussion on the motion? 3 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'm just wondering 4 if Rex is billing us for all this free legal advice we're 5 getting. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I hope not. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't recommend 8 that. Budget's coming up. 9 MR. ODOM: Did I answer your question? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I'm very happy. 11 Thank you. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion, 13 signify by raising your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll 18 move on to Item 11, approval of resolution to apply for 19 grant from the Office of the Governor, Criminal Justice 20 Division, to fund 80 percent of the program from July 1, 21 2005 to June 30, 2006. Ms. Lavender. 22 MS. LAVENDER: Good morning. First, I want 23 to invite you, on behalf of the County Attorney's office, to 24 a reception this afternoon for Nell Gordon. She's going to 25 be retiring, and we're going to have coffee and some goodies 12-28-04 47 1 from 2:00 to 4:00, and I have an invitation for you all, and 2 we hope you'll take time this afternoon to come by and join 3 us. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 5 MS. LAVENDER: Nell has worked in the County 6 Attorney's office for the County for a good 15 years. She 7 was one of the awardees last Thursday at our Christmas 8 luncheon. The resolution that I have there is simply the 9 first step in our application to AACOG for the grant to fund 10 the Crime Victims' Rights Coordinator position and the 11 program from July 1st, 2005 to June 30th of 2006. It does 12 require a 20 percent matching grant from the County. It can 13 be in-kind match. So, we talked about this when we set the 14 program up last October, that this was what our step was 15 going to be. They've moved the schedule up just a little 16 bit on us. We thought we would not have to have the 17 paperwork in until early February, but they have to have the 18 paperwork at AACOG on the 14th of January. So, with the 19 transition in the County Attorney's office and the end of 20 the year and so forth, we decided we'd go ahead and do the 21 resolution today, and then that will give us the option to 22 get the paperwork completed and to AACOG at the time that 23 it's supposed to be. 24 And I also put an end-of-month report -- 25 actually, kind of a summation of what I've done since we 12-28-04 48 1 started the program in October, in your report. It's been 2 an amazing kind of an experience, seeing how much there is a 3 need for this position. The state report that's sent in 4 each year, it's done on a six-month basis. The first one 5 for 2004 from January 1st to June 30th showed that there was 6 one Victims' Rights Impact Statement given out in Kerr 7 County, and none returned. And since October the 15th, I've 8 given out about probably 16 or 18 of them, and all but 9 probably four or five of them are returned, and we've 10 already sent some to T.D.C., and the pen packs. So, people 11 who have been adjudicated in the courts, the victims have 12 been very receptive about the program, and I'm learning a 13 lot about what's going on out there that I didn't know 14 through this job. And you all would be amazed, other than 15 the fact it's confidential; I can't tell you too much, but 16 it's amazing. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Go ahead and tell us. 18 MS. LAVENDER: We're -- we want to get this 19 program going, and going on a permanent basis with this 20 grant. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 80 percent equals how 22 many dollars? 23 MS. LAVENDER: Well, we don't have a budget 24 put together yet. Probably in the neighborhood of about 25 $40,000, is probably what we're going to ask for. 40 to 42, 12-28-04 49 1 probably. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: This is the same grant that -- 3 MS. LAVENDER: Kendall County operates their 4 program on. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: -- that we knew we were going 6 to -- 7 MS. LAVENDER: Right. It's the Victims of 8 Crime Act. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: When we started the program, 10 as well as the match, we were aware -- 11 MS. LAVENDER: Correct. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: -- of the match, and the fact 13 that -- 14 MS. LAVENDER: No surprises. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: -- part of it can be in-kind. 16 MS. LAVENDER: Right, correct. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Question I have is, is 19 the resolution -- is it a form that AACOG sent? 20 MS. LAVENDER: Yes. Well, it's a form that 21 was sent by the Governor's office, Criminal Justice 22 Division. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's just the fourth 24 "Whereas" is kind of odd to me. 25 MS. LAVENDER: It's exactly right off the 12-28-04 50 1 form they sent. I typed it. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I say it's odd from 3 the standpoint that it gives the -- 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Terminate. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, gives the County 6 Judge authority to apply, reject, alter, or terminate the 7 grant. 8 MS. LAVENDER: I would expect he would 9 consult with you before he would do that. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would think so. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: I can assure you, I would do 12 that. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Rather odd. I move 14 approval of the resolution. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 17 approval of the resolution. Any question or discussion? 18 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Isn't the 19 expectation that the grant funds will be available beyond 20 June 30, 2006? 21 MS. LAVENDER: Well, since the money comes 22 from the federal government, I don't think you can make any 23 guarantees about anything like that. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They're -- they're 25 renewable annually. They're one-year increments. 12-28-04 51 1 MS. LAVENDER: Right, the V.O.C.A. grant. 2 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: There's a 3 possibility that would be -- 4 MS. LAVENDER: The V.O.C.A. grant money that 5 AACOG gets, last year, every one of the grants was funded. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Possibilities are 7 good. 8 MS. LAVENDER: In our county plan, the 9 creation of this program was the number-one goal in our 10 county plan for next year, and so I -- I don't see that it's 11 going to be a problem. As far as years to come, we'll just 12 have to do it year by year and hope for the best. The 13 program's been in existence in Kendall County for several 14 years and has been refunded each year. We have to also, in 15 the process, get a bunch of cooperative working agreements 16 signed with the different law enforcement agencies and 17 social service agencies that also work with crime victims, 18 and so we'll be doing that this week and next week also. 19 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Good. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 21 discussion on the motion? All in favor of the motion, 22 signify by raising your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 12-28-04 52 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 2 MS. LAVENDER: Thank you. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: We now have a timed item on 4 the agenda, and I will recess the Commissioners Court 5 meeting at this time, and I'll open a public hearing for the 6 revision of a plat for Lots 6 and 7 and parts of Lots 4 and 7 5 of Hartshorn Country Sites, as shown in Volume 1, page -- 8 Page 68, to include an abandonment of a road easement. 9 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 10:01 a.m., and a public hearing 10 was held in open court, as follows:) 11 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Is there any member of the 13 public that wishes to be heard or otherwise speak on the 14 revision of the plat for Lots 6 and 7 and parts of Lots 4 15 and 5 of Hartshorn Country Sites, as shown in Volume 1, Page 16 68, to include abandonment of a road easement? Seeing no 17 one giving an indication that they desire to be heard on 18 this, I will close the public hearing, and I will reconvene 19 the Commissioners Court meeting. 20 (The public hearing was concluded at 10:02 a.m., and the regular Commissioners 21 Court meeting was reopened.) 22 - - - - - - - - - - 23 JUDGE TINLEY: And the next item is to 24 consider a revision of plat for Lots 6 and 7 and parts of 25 Lots 4 and 5 of Hartshorn Country Sites as shown in Volume 12-28-04 53 1 1, Page 68, to include abandonment of a road easement. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Finally. 3 MR. ODOM: Pardon me? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Finally, we're almost 5 done on this thing. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, unbelievable. 7 MR. ODOM: Yeah -- go ahead, Commissioner. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 9 MR. ODOM: I'm sorry. Any questions? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I move that we 11 approve the revision of plat for Lots 6 and 7 and parts of 12 Lot 4 and 5 of Hartshorn Country Sites in Kerr County, 13 Precinct 1, Kerr County, and that includes the abandonment 14 of a road easement. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 17 approval of the agenda item as stated. Any further 18 questions or discussion? All in favor of that motion, 19 signify by raising your right hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. The 24 next item on the agenda -- 25 (Discussion off the record.) 12-28-04 54 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Why don't we -- why don't we 2 take about a 15-minute recess, and we'll reconvene in 3 approximately 15 minutes. 4 (Recess taken from 10:04 a.m. to 10:20 a.m.) 5 - - - - - - - - - - 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's come back to 7 order. I'll reconvene the Commissioners Court meeting. Are 8 we ready to finalize the -- the software thing? 9 MR. TOMLINSON: I can do it during the paying 10 bills. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Do you have the specifics? 12 MR. TOMLINSON: Yeah, I have it. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Why don't we go ahead and 14 finalize that, if we might. That's Number 4. I'll recall 15 Item 4, consider and discuss expansion of memory on 16 mainframe of imaging parts of the inmate tracking system. 17 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. $5,000 would come from 18 Capital Outlay in Nondepartmental; $7,800 from Contingency, 19 Nondepartmental; $1,260 from Mainframe Maintenance in 20 Nondepartmental; $1,633 from the Sheriff's equipment fund 21 donations. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did you get it? 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I got something. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Nondepartmental Capital 25 Outlay, $5,000. Then we got how much from Nondepartmental 12-28-04 55 1 Contingency? 2 MR. TOMLINSON: $7,800. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: $10,800? 4 MR. TOMLINSON: $7,800. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 7,000, that's better. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. And then we've got 7 Computer Maintenance, and that's Nondepartmental? 8 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: And that's 1,700? 10 MR. TOMLINSON: 1,260. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: 1,260? 12 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, the Sheriff 15 comes out relatively unscathed on this. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's my donation account 17 for equipment, sir. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And 1,633 was the little 19 bit the Sheriff's going to contribute. 20 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Couple of months of 22 salary, he could do the whole thing. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: This wasn't a Sheriff's 24 Office problem; this was a Clerk's office problem. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, the Sheriff's 12-28-04 56 1 cluttering up the system. 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The Clerk's cluttering 3 up the system. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- the item was placed on 5 the agenda by the Sheriff. Does the Sheriff have anything 6 further to offer in connection with this agenda item? 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Thank you. That's it. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move approval of the 9 purchase of a DataNAS XP filer to enhance -- or I guess to 10 enhance our imaging capabilities, for the funds to come -- 11 $5,000 from Capital Outlay, Nondepartmental; $7,800 from 12 Contingency, Nondepartmental; $1,260 from Mainframe 13 Maintenance, and $1,633 from the Sheriff's Department 14 Equipment account. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 16 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded -- 18 (Sneezed.) Excuse me. Any questions? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bless you. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Any question or discussion? 21 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 22 hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 12-28-04 57 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Thank 2 you, gentlemen. Next item on the agenda is Item 12, 3 consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to authorize 4 an independent audit of the Kerr County Juvenile Detention 5 Center operation for fiscal years 2002, 2003, and 2004. 6 Commissioner Williams. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, I put that on 8 the agenda for a couple reasons. First of all, there are a 9 lot of folks who continue to question members of the Court 10 with respect to the prior operation of -- of the detention 11 center, and with particular emphasis on how that 12 800,000-plus dollars got spent down in a two-year period of 13 time, and for what purposes. I think the Court needs to 14 know that. I think the general public has an obligation -- 15 or should have an opportunity to understand what took place 16 over the past, and I think it's fair to Ms. Harris that she 17 have this audit and that she be given the opportunity on 18 January 1 to start from scratch, brand-new, knowing full 19 well what all the warts and blemishes were, knowing what the 20 problems were so that they can be avoided. Perhaps she 21 knows most of them now, but if not, this will help reveal 22 that, and we go forward from that point in time with a clean 23 slate. And that was the purpose of putting it on the 24 agenda. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, and I'd like to 12-28-04 58 1 -- the only thing I'd add to that, not only Mrs. Harris 2 needs to see and understand what has happened and how it 3 works, and needs a clean slate to begin, but Kerr County -- 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- needs a clean slate 6 to start things off. I don't care who does it, who pays for 7 it, how it's done. I just -- I really and truly believe 8 that an audit needs to be done before the County takes the 9 facility over, though. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I didn't make any 11 notations as to what line item, or we do have Professional 12 Service dollars available, whether it's something that could 13 be legitimately charged to the Juvenile Detention Center 14 operations, but I would defer to the County Auditor for his 15 input on those matters. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Auditor, has not -- has 17 not the detention facility operation been a part of the 18 annual outside audit that has been performed annually by the 19 County's outside auditors and approved by the Court? Has 20 not the detention facility been included as a part and 21 parcel of that? 22 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes, it always has been. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It has, and it's in 24 the audit and we can see it. I've looked at it, and it will 25 give you -- gives you the summary data that -- in the same 12-28-04 59 1 format that we get summary data for every other part of the 2 County's operation. It does not give you the nitty-gritty 3 or the detail, or does not tell you the story in terms of 4 how, for example, $800,000 in reserves went from here to 5 here in the pit within a span of two-plus years time. I 6 think it's -- the devil is usually in the details, and I 7 think the details have been missing, and we need to know 8 about it. 9 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, they're -- you know, 10 the Court's already approved an audit firm to audit the 11 detention facility. On October the 12th, there was a court 12 order that gave the Judge the authority to sign an 13 engagement letter with Pressler Thompson and Company to 14 do -- to do an audit. What -- I mean, we -- 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't have any 16 problem with Pressler Thompson. 17 MR. TOMLINSON: I mean, if you're after a 18 specific question, then I think the Court needs to direct 19 them to that direction. I -- you know, they have -- they 20 have already started their work. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's great. I think 22 that's good. 23 MR. TOMLINSON: And so, I mean, you know, in 24 the past -- last year, you know, we -- we spent $23,000 25 on -- on that report. 12-28-04 60 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I understand. 2 MR. TOMLINSON: And I don't see a reason to 3 hire another firm to -- 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm not suggesting 5 that. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No one's suggesting 7 that. 8 MR. TOMLINSON: I mean, if -- I mean, if you 9 will tell -- I mean, if you will give me a direct question 10 as to what you want from me, I'll be glad to do it. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'd like to see from A 12 to Z, more detail. 13 MR. TOMLINSON: I mean -- 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: A to Z. And if they 15 can't do it, then we need to go back and revisit that order 16 and hire somebody that can. 17 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, I mean, what -- what 18 I'm hearing the Commissioner is trying to get at, general 19 auditing procedures that's set out by the Governmental 20 Auditing Standards Board might not give you that 21 information, unless you specifically ask them to do that. 22 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's what I'm 23 thinking. When I -- when I think of an audit report, what I 24 usually get is a report that says -- from somebody that's 25 qualified that says I've looked at the financial documents 12-28-04 61 1 and they meet the general accounting standards. Well, 2 that's not very -- I don't learn very much from that. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's my whole 4 point. 5 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I think what I'm 6 hearing here is that the question is, what happened to 7 revenues and why, and what happened to costs and why? 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And the nitty-gritty 9 of the operation. 10 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: In some kind of 11 detail. 12 MR. TOMLINSON: You know, I -- 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Something you can 14 learn from. Excuse me, Tommy. 15 MR. TOMLINSON: Sure. 16 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: The only -- in my 17 view, the only reason to go through this and do something 18 like this is if we can learn from what happened so that we 19 don't do that same thing again in the future. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Exactly right. 21 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: If it's within our 22 control. I don't know, but it should be a learning 23 experience and exercise, not -- not anything else. Excuse 24 me, Tommy. 25 MR. TOMLINSON: I mean, I -- you may say this 12-28-04 62 1 is sour grapes, but from August up to now, in all this 2 process of, you know, determining what to do, gaining 3 information, those kinds of things, I have -- you know, my 4 office has been left totally out of this picture. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Then you need to 6 know, too. 7 MR. TOMLINSON: No. No, I'm talking about 8 direction from this Court. I -- my office has not been 9 asked specifically to aid in any calculations, any 10 projections. The only thing that my office has been asked 11 to do in this whole process is to help Ms. Harris develop a 12 budget, and that came from the last meeting. If -- you 13 know, if you -- if you want my office to -- to develop those 14 numbers that you want, we can do it. I mean, all -- you 15 know, all the transactions that ever happened in that 16 facility from June the 1st, 1997 until today is part of the 17 records of Kerr County, and they're right down -- I mean, 18 they're on our accounting system. There's no magic. No -- 19 no mystery about what they are. All I need is some -- some 20 direction. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: In the normal course 22 of your -- of events, do you have the time to do what we'd 23 like to see done for those three years? 24 MR. TOMLINSON: Sure. I mean, it's -- we -- 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Or would it be better 12-28-04 63 1 served if an auditor of our choice, and it can be Pressler 2 Thompson or whomever, works with you to do this so we can 3 understand what this is all about? 4 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay, there -- there's 5 probably four specific issues that I can think of that -- 6 that had a major impact on -- on the profit or loss of that 7 facility. It's a matter -- excuse me. It's a matter of 8 quantifying what -- what that is. For one example -- and, I 9 mean, this is knowledge -- common knowledge to everybody. 10 And I can't give you the exact date that this happened, but 11 on June the 1st, 1997, Texas Juvenile Probation Commission 12 gave us a license for 50 residents in that facility. 13 Sometime between the issuance of the bond and when the -- 14 the addition was completed, in a -- in a monitoring visit at 15 some point -- I think it was in 2003. I'm not sure of that, 16 but during -- during that visit, they took away 22 percent 17 of our licenses. Well, I mean, our -- our -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Licenses as in number of 19 beds? Or licenses for certain -- 20 MR. TOMLINSON: Number of beds. So, we -- in 21 one day, we went from 50 to 39. So, you multiply 22 percent 22 onto the revenues that we were producing prior to that, 23 which was approximately a million, six, you know, that's 24 $360,000 that we lost in revenue in -- in one decision by 25 T.J.P.C. 12-28-04 64 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tommy, I think the -- 2 MR. TOMLINSON: And so, I mean, that's -- I 3 mean, that's an example, and there's many more. And so 4 that's the kind of thing that I -- that I can quantify. 5 But, you know, I -- I need -- I mean, I need a definitive 6 direction from this Court, and up until this date, I have 7 never received that. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the -- 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, up until 10 September, it wasn't our issue. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I think the -- what 12 the Court -- what I think the -- you know, the whole Court 13 probably wants is just basically financial statements of the 14 same detail we get on every other county department for 15 those three years. And then if you can outline anything 16 like you just told us, those specific events that caused the 17 problems, whether they're funding or beds or licenses, and 18 then once we get that, I think then we can know if we want 19 more. But until you get those basic things that should be 20 relatively simple for you to put together, I don't know -- 21 you know, I wouldn't know what to tell you we need, or I 22 want to look at. So, to me, that would be the first step, 23 is to give us basic financials. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Tommy, you have the 25 information within your system to be able to go, for 12-28-04 65 1 example, all the way back to June '97, do you not? 2 MR. TOMLINSON: Oh, yeah. Sure. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: And make, say, monthly 4 operating statements? 5 MR. TOMLINSON: I could give you a list of 6 every transaction that ever happened at that place. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't want it. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Translated into a monthly 9 operating statement -- 10 MR. TOMLINSON: It will give -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: -- as well as an annual 12 operating statement? 13 MR. TOMLINSON: It will give you a subtotal 14 of every -- of expenses for every month. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: As well as a balance sheet? 16 MR. TOMLINSON: Mm-hmm. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: And then -- 19 MR. TOMLINSON: I mean, the statements that 20 have already been audited are -- are a summary form of -- of 21 the detail. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 23 MR. TOMLINSON: And that is the -- I mean, 24 that is patterned after the statements that we provide for 25 every other county fund. And that's the -- that's the 12-28-04 66 1 reason that they are -- 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I understand. 3 MR. TOMLINSON: -- like they are. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But that doesn't give 5 us any detail. Doesn't tell us anything. 6 MR. TOMLINSON: Well -- 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But the financial 8 statements the Judge has outlined, you've mentioned the -- I 9 mean, monthly or quarterly or -- I personally don't want to 10 look at a monthly. I think quarterly would be plenty. 11 MR. TOMLINSON: I mean, virtually -- I mean, 12 from memory, I -- I can -- I remember that in 2001-2002, at 13 the end of that year was the high point of our reserve. And 14 in 2002-2003, as stated in the audit report, we -- we had a 15 negative $189,000 in net assets. And so -- and, I mean, you 16 know, there -- it's -- all of that's explained in the audit. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. But I think -- I 18 mean, my standpoint is that, you know, I don't know that I 19 need to look back going into '97, but I think two or three 20 years is fine, or four years, whatever. But I think it'll 21 be very helpful looking at Ms. Harris' budget, when we 22 finally get her final budget, to look back historically like 23 we do in all other departments. 24 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, that's exactly what I 25 gave her. I mean, she and I sat down last week in my office 12-28-04 67 1 for probably two hours, and I gave her historical 2 information that -- on the detail on all accounts for her to 3 use in her budget interpolations. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tommy, in your 5 numbers, we're going to be able to see that T.J.P.C. came in 6 here and in one day, in one fell swoop, removed "X" amount 7 of dollars from our program? 8 MR. TOMLINSON: Mm-hmm. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I -- there's no 10 doubt that that's always been available; I've never 11 questioned that. But that's really not my question. My 12 question is going to go to what caused them to remove that 13 funding. What caused them to -- 14 MR. TOMLINSON: You have to ask them that 15 question. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I'm going to be 17 happy to do that as soon as I get your information. And I 18 think someone in this county ought to be able to answer that 19 question, though. Do you not? 20 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, I -- to be honest with 21 you, I mean, when -- when the Judge, all the Juvenile Board 22 and Ms. Harris and County Attorney and I went to Austin 23 before T.J.P.C. Board, I think that at that time, there were 24 part of their own organization that didn't know that that 25 happened. 12-28-04 68 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But, Tommy, my point 2 is this. Following up on what Commissioner Baldwin said, 3 say you take the T.D.C. -- T.J.P.C. action that reduced 4 revenue stream or number of licensed beds or whatever. Take 5 -- just take this action alone. My question is, what steps 6 did the management of the operation take to make adjustments 7 to accommodate the State's action so that the expenditures 8 didn't continue to rise or stay the same, knowing that the 9 revenue stream was going down? What steps were taken? 10 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, I -- I know, for one 11 thing, we -- we protested the -- or the administration did. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's not an 13 operational action. 14 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, let me finish, 15 Commissioner. I mean, the operation of any detention 16 facility, whether it be a jail or juvenile, it's hard to 17 find a variable cost, except for food and supplies for -- 18 for the residents. So, the operation of that facility is 19 pretty much fixed. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: A cursory look at the 21 statements that we have access to today will show that the 22 revenues diminished as you said, and the expenses stayed 23 level or went up. So the question is, what operational 24 steps were taken, measurably? And if the answer is none, 25 then we need to know that too. 12-28-04 69 1 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, I don't know that. I 2 mean, I -- I mean, that's -- I'm just looking at the raw 3 numbers. And -- and I know the results of -- or can 4 quantify the results of some of the actions that -- that 5 took place. And, I mean, I -- I don't know for sure what 6 kind of action the administration took. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Then you need to know 8 as well as we need to know. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, okay. I'll make a 10 -- just so it is clear, I'll make a motion that we request 11 the Auditor to provide quarterly financials of the same 12 detail received from all other county departments for 2002, 13 2003, 2004. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made -- 16 MR. TOMLINSON: Repeat that? I lost -- got a 17 little lost there. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Quarterly financials. 19 MR. TOMLINSON: Reports on what? Juvenile -- 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On the Juvenile Detention 21 Facility for the same -- on the same format or, you know, 22 detail for all other county departments. In other words, 23 overtime, copy supplies. You know, the same -- 24 MR. TOMLINSON: That's not -- 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Personnel, all that 12-28-04 70 1 stuff. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Personnel. And then -- 3 'cause, I mean, that's a format that I'm familiar looking at 4 with the county. And then, if there's a question, we can 5 ask you specific questions. 6 MR. TOMLINSON: Yeah, I just provided that 7 information to the press about, what, three or four weeks 8 ago? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So it will be easy. And 10 then, in addition, any events that took place that caused -- 11 from the State that caused substantial changes in operations 12 for funding. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think you're right. 14 That's probably going to be the best route for us to go. 15 And from -- from those numbers, then, we can create our 16 questions. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's right. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's fine. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. Y'all are 22 so good. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Was there a second? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There was a second 25 right here. 12-28-04 71 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, I seconded. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Any 3 further question or discussion on the motion? All in favor 4 of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 5 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 7 (No response.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Thank 9 you. The next item is consider, discuss, and take 10 appropriate action to adopt a resolution opposing certain 11 diversion of funds from established programs by O.R.C.A. 12 Commissioner Williams. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, we've -- we 14 all received a copy of an urgent alert that came from our 15 friends at Grantworks with respect to this proposed 16 Education Pilot Program reserved for Pecos only -- only for 17 Pecos and Willacy counties. The alarm bells go off when you 18 determine what the impact would be if O.R.C.A. does this, 19 and if the pilot program, by their definition, turns out to 20 be successful in whatever it is they're trying to prove, and 21 they determine to do this on a broader scale, funds that are 22 available to counties such as Kerr County and others who 23 have programs being funded by O.R.C.A., such things would be 24 affected on a larger scale, such as Community Development 25 Funds, Texas Capital Funds, Disaster Relief Fund, Planning 12-28-04 72 1 Capacity and Building Fund, Non-Border Colonia Fund, which 2 we have some money from, and the STEP Funds and so forth. 3 And so I think it would be appropriate for -- we were unable 4 to make the public hearings, but I think it would be 5 appropriate for us to let our feelings be known, through 6 resolution directed to O.R.C.A., that Kerr County 7 Commissioners Court opposes the diversion of funding being 8 proposed to the Education Pilot Program, and urge the 9 O.R.C.A. Board of Directors to find alternate funding for 10 the proposed Educational Pilot Program, if, indeed, the 11 program is -- is desirable. And that's the nature of the 12 resolution, and I would move the resolution. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I second the motion. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 16 adoption of the resolution. Any question or discussion? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. Could -- Bill? 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can you explain the 20 Education Pilot Program a little bit more? 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I wish I could, 22 Commissioner. It's -- it's job-related, which really calls 23 also into question why -- why O.R.C.A. would be getting 24 involved in this on a pilot basis when funding is available 25 through Alamo Workforce Development, or -- or another 12-28-04 73 1 Workforce Development if Willacy and the other county are 2 not part of the Alamo area. And, so, why would they be 3 getting involved in educational programs to this extent when 4 educational programs are made available through Workforce 5 Development? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But these are -- they're 7 definitely -- these aren't student, school-related 8 education? 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Not to my knowledge. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: These are adult -- 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, not to my 12 knowledge, Commissioner. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: The nexus, I think, is 14 anti-poverty, Commissioner, as I believe it's indicated. 15 Any further question or discussion? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They can do it if 17 they like, but just find another way to fund it instead of 18 taking away money from all these various funds. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, the thing is, 20 they do do it. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They do do it. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And they're reaching 24 for other moneys now. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Exactly. 12-28-04 74 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 2 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 3 your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. The 8 next item is consider and discuss adoption of an order 9 authorizing publication of Notice of Intention to issue 10 Certificates of Obligation. I put this item on the agenda 11 at the suggestion of our financial adviser and bond 12 attorneys as a necessary step in order to proceed with the 13 issuance of C.O.'s in connection with the acquisition of the 14 Juvenile Detention Facility. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I have a question 16 about it, Judge. On the second page of the provided 17 resolution, it talks about whereas -- that should be the 18 third "whereas" on the second page. "Whereas, following 19 such acquisition, the Juvenile Facility will be owned by 20 Kerr County, but will be operated by Juvenile Board in 21 accordance with the requirements of state law." How does 22 that comport with the Court's desire for it to be a county 23 department operated by -- under Commissioners Court? 24 Question's to you. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: My response is, Commissioner, 12-28-04 75 1 the financial adviser and the bond attorneys are the ones 2 that furnished this, and I assume their statement, "in 3 accordance with the requirements of state law," is accurate. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's the phrase, 5 "will be operated by the Juvenile Board" that -- that 6 triggers my question. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess my comment is -- 8 I have that same -- I have a big "NO" written next to that 9 paragraph. And my comment would be that either they need to 10 come -- "they" being Mr. Spurgeon, who wrote this, needs to 11 come and explain why this is the only option available, 12 and/or the County Attorney-elect, 'cause it's going to take 13 place after he's on the watch, needs to research juvenile 14 facilities and see if there are ways -- other ways to 15 operate it as a county facility, as is done in Tom Green 16 County in San Angelo, as I understand it. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's my 18 understanding, too. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, my understanding 20 is that there are other ways other than -- Juvenile Board 21 does have to certify the facility, as I understand it, but I 22 don't believe they have to operate it. But the question I 23 would have would be to the County Attorney-elect and 24 Mr. Spurgeon, and I'm not willing to go forward on the 25 resolution until we get those answered. 12-28-04 76 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It appears to me that 2 just -- just reading the verbiage here, it looks -- you 3 know, we -- you're sitting out at your coffee table out in 4 the public. The taxpayers that are picking up the tab on 5 this thing, which is a pretty good little tab already, and 6 they've seen the fight we've had since September 1 over the 7 issue, and what they see is, they see a facility under the 8 guidance of the Juvenile Board go broke, and real close to 9 closing the doors. Now the -- the Commissioners Court wants 10 to take the taxpayers' money and go purchase the thing and 11 do the same damn thing again, is what they see by this 12 verbiage. Not me, buddy. I'm not going to walk out that 13 door and let the taxpayers get ahold of me over something 14 like that. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So we need that 16 explained, Judge. Also, there's another issue, minor though 17 it may be, on the Notice of Intention to Issue Certificates 18 of Obligation. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: On the last line, I 21 notice it talks about the Court authorizes the issuance of 22 such Certificates of Obligation on Monday, January 24, at a 23 regular term in the Commissioners Courtroom. I think we 24 have -- that's not the regular term; I think that's the 25 special term, and I think we plan to be at the Union Church. 12-28-04 77 1 Is that correct? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That is correct, sir. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I can see that may -- 4 language may change, depending -- depending on the notice 5 requirements, because we're not going to act on the other 6 part today. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right, it probably 8 will. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't think we're going 10 to act on the other part today. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If you could rewrite 12 -- could you act on it if you rewrote that one "whereas"? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me -- let me offer a 14 suggestion on that, that "whereas." The Juvenile Facility 15 will be owned by the County and operated in accordance with 16 the requirements of state law. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You don't have any 18 choice with that. That's -- that'll work. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's okay, far as 20 I'm concerned. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Whatever that is. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: That's exactly right. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But my -- my problem is 24 that we've hired Mr. Spurgeon to do this, not the County 25 Judge. 12-28-04 78 1 JUDGE TINLEY: I understand. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And, I mean, I don't know 3 that -- what you said sounds good, but I can't vote based on 4 legal advice from you. So -- 5 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm not offering you legal 6 advice. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Unless the County 8 Attorney-elect says it's okay. Aren't you glad you showed 9 up this morning, Mr. County Attorney-elect? 10 MR. EMERSON: I don't think I have the 11 statutory jurisdiction to be able to comment on that at this 12 time. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We can give you a few 14 minutes. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Boy, he's a quick 16 learner, isn't he? 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I think what I've 18 been hearing over last couple months is that it's the sense 19 of this Commissioners Court that it wants to have hands-on 20 operational management of this facility, just like it does 21 Road and Bridge and other county departments. And I think 22 I'm also hearing that the Juvenile Board may be -- may be 23 saying no, it's going to be business as usual. I don't know 24 that; Juvenile Board hasn't -- hasn't addressed the issue. 25 So, I -- it's possible that we have a -- no, it's likely 12-28-04 79 1 that we have a disagreement between this Commissioners Court 2 and the Juvenile Board on how that facility is going to be 3 managed. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: I -- I don't think there's any 5 disagreement, Commissioner. In fact, I think that you'll 6 find a -- a very strong willingness on the part of the 7 members of the Juvenile Board to -- if it can be lawfully 8 done, to surrender the oversight of that facility. Very, 9 very strong willingness. Not just a willingness; a 10 preference, as it were. 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I can understand 12 that. Well, that's reassuring to hear that. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I can assure you, that's -- 14 that is the feeling of the Juvenile -- members of the 15 Juvenile Board. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The way I understand 17 the law -- or the way they do it in Tom Green County is -- 18 Rex, is that Commissioners Court literally runs the thing, 19 just like it's a county department, and probably once a year 20 the Juvenile Board comes in and certifies it, blesses it as 21 it goes on -- the license goes on to Austin or something 22 like that. But if that's the case, why -- and I understand 23 Tom Green County does it that way. If that's the case, 24 that's what we want, if that's what the law says, is that 25 the Juvenile Board certifies it. 12-28-04 80 1 MR. EMERSON: All I can do is promise you to 2 contact the Tom Green County Attorney and then do some legal 3 research on it. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're going to be back 5 at 1:30. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, I think you 7 need to do that. And certification -- what does the 8 certification mean? Is that the Juvenile Board's oversight 9 in terms of programs, things of that nature, that are 10 mandatory by law? And so, you know, I think we just need a 11 little help here in understanding who's moving forward and 12 who's on first and so forth. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there -- it gets -- 14 I'm asking the Judge, to his knowledge, is there a reason 15 this has to be done today? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: I think the -- the 17 understanding I had from the financial adviser and the bond 18 attorney was that they want the process fully completed 19 before February 15th, which is the next due date on the 20 bonds, because of some legal requirements that might trigger 21 or legal implications that that might trigger. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, that being said, 23 can you -- I mean, I think we're about to break for lunch. 24 Can you not try to contact Mr. Spurgeon and see if he agrees 25 with the language that you discussed? And when you're 12-28-04 81 1 talking to him, have him correct the spelling of my name at 2 the same time? 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Can you do some 4 research in this next hour or so, Rex, before -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't know that Rex -- 6 I mean, I understand -- we're putting Rex in an unfair 7 position here. And I think Mr. Spurgeon's been hired to 8 represent us in this matter, and if Mr. Spurgeon agrees to 9 the language, I'm comfortable with it. I mean, I don't 10 think it's really -- one, I think his comment was -- was 11 serious that he -- statutorily, he isn't authorized to give 12 us, really, those opinions at this point. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: All I need from Rex 14 is just his knowledge and understanding of how Tom Green 15 does it. A conversation with the Tom Green County Attorney 16 would suffice. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, okay. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: To get that done, and 19 come back and say you're comfortable with what they do and 20 it will work in Kerr County. 21 MR. EMERSON: The only problem I see with 22 that, Commissioner, is that I can't promise you that I can 23 call up there and get ahold of Tom Green County Attorney in 24 the next hour. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I understand. 12-28-04 82 1 If you can. 2 MR. EMERSON: One, it's Christmas holidays, 3 and number two, they're a government entity and he has his 4 obligations and responsibilities. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I understand. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I can assure you that 7 we can get in to the County Judge there, though, and he will 8 know. He will know how the thing runs. And I can -- I can 9 get you in to him. 10 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'd really be 12 interested in knowing just what you think, not as a County 13 Attorney or County Attorney-elect, but a man that lives in 14 Precinct 1 that's a cut above. 15 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Taxpayer. 16 MR. EMERSON: Be happy to make the phone 17 calls. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're a good man. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, I'd recommend we 20 go on to the next agenda item and then break for lunch, and 21 come back after lunch and see if we have a resolution on 22 this. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that the sense of everybody 25 else? 12-28-04 83 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sure. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, the spelling of 3 your name is a deal breaker? Is that -- 4 JUDGE TINLEY: You got it. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I never saw your name 6 in here anywhere. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I didn't either. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's on the last page, 9 right on the Certificate for Order. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, yeah, there it is. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, we'll return to Item 14. 12 Let me call Item 15, consider and discuss progress of 13 employee health insurance enrollment. I provided each 14 member of the Court with a copy of an updated information on 15 enrollment that I received from the representative of the 16 plan administrator, and I think it's self-explanatory. 17 Commissioner Nicholson? 18 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Well, Item Number 19 15? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, mm-hmm. 21 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I was hoping that 22 the personnel officer would be here to help us by providing 23 an update of what the status is of the enrollments. Last 24 time we talked, there were some 40 or more employees that -- 25 who hadn't enrolled. It's -- my concern is, are there going 12-28-04 84 1 to be people that, on January 1, are not covered by our 2 health insurance plan? And if they are, do they know that? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think they're covered 4 automatically. They may not have the coverage they want, 5 'cause they're going to be opted out in default under Plan 6 A, and then they're going to have to take some action to 7 change that if they -- and they may not be able to for a 8 year. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Or they may not have 10 covered their dependents. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I understand it's a 12 one-time annual election. I'm not sure of that part, but 13 I'm pretty sure I remember from our last meeting, the Mutual 14 of Omaha representative said that everyone will be covered 15 and they would default to Plan A. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that's in the 18 communication that I got very, very late last week, and 19 provided copies. I don't know whether you guys got it 20 before we started the meeting this morning. And that's the 21 communication; if there's no information or no plan 22 designated, we will automatically enroll that employee under 23 plan option number 1. That was the communication to the 24 personnel officer. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I -- 12-28-04 85 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Go ahead. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I share Number 4's 3 concern about it. I know that they will be automatically 4 signed up in something, but I'm just -- you know, whether -- 5 whether it's the employee not going to the meeting or the 6 insurance company not bending far enough to get the 7 information to -- out to everybody, I don't know, and it 8 doesn't matter to me, but I really -- I'm concerned that our 9 employees are -- don't have all the information, regardless 10 of how it gets there. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm concerned as to 12 whether the employee -- the dependent coverage for those who 13 want it, is the window of opportunity closing on them? I 14 think that's an important question. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: December 31, it's my 16 understanding that the enrollment period ends. I don't 17 think it extends into January. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What I don't 19 understand -- and I remember him saying that. I don't 20 understand. If you get a new employee, that person gets 21 covered. I mean, it changes daily throughout the year based 22 on the number of employees we have, so I don't understand 23 really why you can't change during the year. Now, there may 24 be some restrictions on the type of coverage and all that, 25 30-day waiting and all that type of stuff, but -- but, 12-28-04 86 1 anyway, I agree, what you just said is what the Mutual of 2 Omaha representative said. 3 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Who's got the 4 accountability for managing this enrollment process and 5 following up and seeing to it that everybody has an 6 opportunity to enroll? Is it Mutual of Omaha, or is it our 7 personnel officer? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's Wallace and 9 Associates. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Say what? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Wallace and Associates- 12 slash-Mutual of Omaha, somewhere in that group, I think 13 they're responsible. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Personnel officer 15 doesn't have any involvement? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't think so, really. 17 I think they facilitate it. 18 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I don't have 19 anything more to offer on it. I'm -- I'm concerned that 20 we're going to have some -- I don't know if it's one or two 21 or 40 -- a few unhappy people come January, either 22 because -- because they didn't have an opportunity in their 23 mind to exercise their options, or perhaps it was 24 mishandled. I don't know. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 12-28-04 87 1 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I wrote a letter to 2 our personnel officer on December 20th and said I think this 3 is what I enrolled in. Would you confirm that? And -- and 4 I haven't gotten a response to that. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You've been holding 6 your breath all through Christmas? 7 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'm not going to be 8 happy if I'm enrolled in the wrong thing. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I mean, I think 10 the -- I don't understand why we can't make some 11 adjustments. It's our plan, and basically we fund it -- the 12 lion's share of it, certainly, so I don't know why we can't 13 make adjustments. But that's a question, really, I think 14 either Wallace and Associates or Mutual of Omaha needs to 15 ask -- or answer, rather. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a roster of -- of the 17 enrollees, and then also the blanks where employees are not 18 yet enrolled, and I think we have that as a result of an 19 inquiry to the personnel officer wanting to know -- I guess 20 impliedly wanting to know if there was any updated 21 information other than is shown on these several sheets of 22 the employees. Obviously, one way to approach this would be 23 to have the -- have contact made with each of these 24 employees for whom there is no selection, and they're coded 25 by department. Have contact made with them so that they are 12-28-04 88 1 given the opportunity to make some selection other than Plan 2 1, employee only. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That would be my 4 recommendation. Is that -- that information is not 5 proprietary in nature or protected? 6 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: May I see it? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 8 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: This is something 9 we're saying Wallace and Associates should do? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I think that -- I 11 think, actually, the -- I think the County -- I think we can 12 ask -- send this out to the supervisors, and the supervisors 13 can tell their employees to contact Wallace and Associates 14 and make an election. And I think that would be -- as long 15 as we can distribute that list. I mean, I don't know if 16 there's any information on there that would prohibit us from 17 distributing from HIPPA and all the other federal rules we 18 have to follow. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: There's no health finances 20 information on there. That's merely plan selection 21 information. 22 (Discussion off the record.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think there would be a 24 problem with that, but -- 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We've got some people 12-28-04 89 1 who really should know what this is all about that haven't 2 done this. Yeah, that's where my eyes were. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My recommendation would 4 be that the County Judge send out that list to all 5 department heads and elected officials and, you know, ask 6 them to get this to their employees, or have their employees 7 contact Wallace and Associates A.S.A.P. I mean, that's all 8 we can do, I think, you know. And, you know 1-- 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Do you want to be the 10 administrative assistant this week that assists me? 11 (Discussion off the record.) 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Me said yes. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They're asking you a 14 question. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You just agreed -- 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- to do it. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: To do what? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: I bet I can secure the 20 assistance from someone in the Clerk's office to send that 21 to all departments. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: To do what? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To serve as 24 administrative assistant while ours is on vacation. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh. The answer is 12-28-04 90 1 no. (Laughter.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think we need any more 3 formal action than that, do we? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't believe so. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: County Judge can do 6 it. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Long as it doesn't involve the 8 practice of law, right? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. All right. 11 Mr. Auditor? 12 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Would you fix my 13 computer while you're at it? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: I can handle that. 15 MR. TOMLINSON: It's 10 after 11:00. Is 16 there time to do the bills? 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, we're fixing to do them 18 in just a minute. 19 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Fixing to do them in just a 21 minute. 22 MR. EMERSON: May I ask what time y'all are 23 going to resume after lunch? 24 JUDGE TINLEY: 1:30. Okay, let's -- let's go 25 to the approval agenda. First let me inquire, is there 12-28-04 91 1 anything to be done in executive session? I didn't think 2 there was. We'll go to the approval agenda, payment of the 3 bills. 4 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Move to pay the 5 bills. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 8 payment of the bills. Any questions? Comments? I think I 9 had a couple. Mr. Sheriff, on Page 7 of the bills, 10 reimbursement, Care expense, Sid Peterson Hospital, over 11 $6,000. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes, that's out of grant 13 money. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Pardon? 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's that grant we had 16 from Peterson Foundation for the last couple of years. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. That's on the -- on the 18 rape intervention? 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The SANE -- used to be 20 called the SANE program; now it' called the Care program. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That we got back going 23 on a grant. This is the last funding out of that. Now 24 they're on their own. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, go to Page 16. The Bank 12-28-04 92 1 of New York as trustee, admin fee, Juvenile Detention. I'm 2 not sure we ought to be paying that $1,000. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir. Thank you 4 for finding that, Judge. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Unless there's a requirement 6 that we do so to avoid a worse fate because of default for 7 failure to pay it. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That wouldn't shock me 9 at all either. Just as confusing as it could possibly get. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, as I indicated a while 11 ago, the -- the timeline for the issuance of the C.O.'s, 12 I -- there seems to be a concerted effort to have that 13 completed by -- before February 15th to avoid the triggering 14 of a default under the various legal documents, and if this 15 would have the same effect if we don't do it and cause more 16 exposure than the $1,000 admin fee, I -- 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Have we paid it in 18 the past? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, yeah. Yeah. 20 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, this -- 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Paid it one time, didn't we? 22 MR. TOMLINSON: We paid it one time. But 23 it's an admin fee for -- for the current year, is what it 24 is. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: But the fee is for -- for 12-28-04 93 1 paying them to act as the disbursing agent for the bond 2 payments. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And has there been a 4 bond payment? The next one is February 1? 5 JUDGE TINLEY: 15. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: February 15. And when 7 was the one prior to that? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: August 15, it was made. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And -- 10 MR. TOMLINSON: And there was one prior to 11 that in February. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And this is probably a 13 fee for that August 15 -- 14 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, no. I think -- I think 15 it says it's from 11-1-04 to 10-31-05, so it's for the 16 coming year. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So we're paying them a 18 fee on a payment that we haven't even made yet? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: And are not going to make. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I mean, I don't 21 function that way at my house. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, it was -- the 23 due date was 11-17. We didn't get it until December 13, so 24 there can't be any great sense of urgency on the part of the 25 Bank of New York. 12-28-04 94 1 MR. TOMLINSON: However -- 2 JUDGE TINLEY: My suggestion would be that we 3 not pay that unless and until we're given instructions by 4 our attorney in connection with this bonding matter. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with you, 6 Judge. 7 MR. TOMLINSON: That's the reason it's on -- 8 on the funding requirement report, 'cause I didn't -- I 9 didn't know what kind of circumstances -- what would happen 10 if we did or didn't pay it. So -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I agree with the 12 Judge. That's two of us, that -- to pull it. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: You're "not a lawyer, but..."? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm not a lawyer, 15 however. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'd really like to see 17 us pull that bill out of there before we approve the payment 18 of the bills. Bill, will you agree with that so we can move 19 on? 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Absolutely, I agree 21 with that. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: With the exception of that one 24 obligation to Bank of New York for $1,000 -- did we already 25 have a motion? 12-28-04 95 1 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah, I made a 2 motion and revision to exclude the payment of $1,000 to the 3 Bank of New York. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Who made the second? 5 MS. PIEPER: Commissioner Baldwin. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Baldwin? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I agree with you 8 on it. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Any further 10 question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify 11 by raising your right hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Thank 16 you. Budget Amendment Request Number 1. 17 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. Number 1 is for the 18 Sheriff's Department. We're requesting a transfer of $1,020 19 from Deputies' Salaries to Vehicle Insurance, and this is 20 for the four 2005 Crown Victorias that we just purchased. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 22 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 24 approval of Budget Amendment Request Number 1. Any question 25 or discussion? 12-28-04 96 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Purchased and 2 delivered? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's just an additional 4 amount; the insurance went up adding those four new cars on 5 the policy, is evidently what I'm -- 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do you have your cars 7 already? 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The cars are there and 9 went on the road two days ago. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That poses one other 11 question. Are any other -- any vehicles coming off from the 12 Sheriff's Department? 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes, there will be. 14 We're finishing shuffling on down. We'll notify them there 15 will be four coming off. But I guess because of the new 16 cars going on -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Commissioners get 18 them. 19 (Discussion off the record.) 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We will no longer have 21 any yellow cars in the Sheriff's Department. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Isn't that nice? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hallelujah. 24 MR. TOMLINSON: It won't change -- I mean, 25 they will still stay on the insurance, though. I mean, 12-28-04 97 1 unless we trade them off or sell them or something. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions? 4 Comments? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 5 your right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 10 Budget Amendment Request Number 2. 11 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. This amendment is 12 actually between the Sheriff's Department and the jail. 13 We're asking to transfer $7,722.48 from Capital Outlay in 14 the Sheriff's office to Lease Payments line item in the jail 15 for -- for the same amount, and it's for the -- the lease 16 payment for 2005 for the Work Program vehicle. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: If I can explain that 18 real quick, when we budgeted for the new cars and the second 19 payment on the truck that we purchased last year, we put all 20 that into the Capital Outlay. It was planned in there; 21 that's what it's for. But since that's the lease payment -- 22 second payment on that truck, Tommy actually has another 23 line item that it comes out of, so he's transferring it out 24 of that Capital Outlay to that line item where it should 25 come out of. 12-28-04 98 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It was budgeted. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Any 5 question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify 6 by raising your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 11 Budget Amendment Request Number 3. 12 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. Number 3 is for 13 Constable, Precinct 4. This amendment is to pay for his 14 bond -- elected official's bond. We're trans -- asking to 15 transfer $128 from Vehicle Insurance to Bonds. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Any 19 question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify 20 by raising your right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 25 Budget Amendment Request Number 4. 12-28-04 99 1 MR. TOMLINSON: Number 4 is for the Sheriff's 2 Department. This amendment is to renew a crime policy for 3 the Sheriff's Office. We're asking to transfer $433 from 4 Deputies' Salaries to Liability Insurance. And with this 5 I'm asking for a hand check for $433 to First Insurance 6 Agency. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 10 approval of Budget Amendment Request Number 4 and 11 authorization of hand check in the amount of $433 to First 12 Insurance Agency. Any question or discussion? All in favor 13 of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Budget 18 Amendment Request Number 5. 19 MR. TOMLINSON: 5 is for -- also for bond 20 payment for two elected officials for Commissioners Court. 21 Asking for a transfer of a dollar from Office Supplies to 22 Bonds. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You could get 50 24 cents from each of them. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 12-28-04 100 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. God, that's 2 embarrassing. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: What's the motion? To get 50 4 cents from each of them? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You could probably do 8 that with me, but -- 9 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Big business. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 11 approval of Budget Amendment Request Number 5. Any question 12 or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by 13 raising your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 18 Budget Amendment Request Number 6. 19 MR. TOMLINSON: Number 6 is for the County 20 Attorney's office. It's also payment of a surety bond 21 for -- and two new notary -- I mean, it's for two new notary 22 bonds for $170. Request is to transfer $170 from Secretary 23 Salaries to Bonds. 24 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Move to approve. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 12-28-04 101 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Any 2 question or discussion? 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just want to make 4 the point the County Attorney's costing us $170. 5 Commissioner Letz and I are costing $1. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's right. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Hell of a difference 8 there. 9 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Sounds about right. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 11 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 12 your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 17 MR. TOMLINSON: Judge, I have a -- I need a 18 clarification on Number 12. We talked about the quarterly 19 statement. Do you want those quarters to stand on their 20 own, or do you want them cumulative? 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Cumulative, with a year-end 22 statement also, I think, probably. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: At the end of each fiscal 25 year. 12-28-04 102 1 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. That -- I just wanted 2 to make sure I did the right thing. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: It'll show individually for 6 that quarter, as well as cumulative through that point in 7 the year. And then at the end of the year, there will be an 8 annual statement. 9 MR. TOMLINSON: Very good. So, it will be -- 10 you want a cumulative column and an individual column. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. Do we have any late 13 bills? 14 MR. TOMLINSON: No. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Don't have any -- 16 MS. PIEPER: Monthly reports. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: -- transcripts. I do have 18 monthly reports for Justice of the Peace, Precinct Number 1, 19 Road and Bridge, and the Kerr County Crime Victims 20 Coordinator. Do I hear a motion to approve those reports as 21 rendered? 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 23 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded 25 for -- to approve the listed reports as submitted. Any 12-28-04 103 1 question or comment? All in favor of the motion, signify by 2 raising your right hand. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 5 (No response.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Do we 7 have any reports from any of the Commissioners in their 8 capacity as liaison with respect to City/County operations 9 or otherwise? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I -- well, I have one 11 related to airport matters. We met out at the airport and 12 reaffirmed the location of the terminal, the location that 13 was previously, I guess, decided upon, after a lot of 14 discussion. And that -- issues related to that and to how 15 that process worked probably will also be added to our 16 agenda for our workshop, which will be held January 18th, 17 and included under that item will be exactly how the current 18 F.B.O. and the terminal and that relationship will work. 19 And it's -- you know, and I think some of the issues that 20 came up were just a matter of the new board taking control 21 and learning how to work with certain members of staff. I 22 should probably say certain members of staff learning how to 23 work with the new board. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think that's 25 probably it. Staff learning to understand that they have a 12-28-04 104 1 new board that sets -- doesn't just give advice, but it sets 2 policy and direction. 3 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Sounds good to me. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's a major 5 paradigm shift for some. Like that word? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It -- that works. 7 That works there, too. The meaning applies. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Really does. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And we're continuing to 10 move forward at the airport. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I didn't oppose the 12 selection of the site that was currently -- that we 13 ultimately close. In fact, I voted along with Commissioner 14 Letz to approve it after looking at the other site. But I 15 think time may show -- "time" being 10 years from now, or 12 16 or 15 years, might show that the growth of the airport, 17 which we're all striving for to achieve, might show that we 18 crowded ourselves in a little more than we thought in terms 19 of future expansion. But we'll have to wait to find that 20 out. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think, in that view -- 22 I didn't go into great depth at the meeting, but I think 23 that some of the -- we could have done better planning at 24 the airport with some renegotiations of the lease with 25 Kerrville Aviation and some other things, because basically 12-28-04 105 1 what we did, we ended up with a tract where we put the 2 terminal -- are going to put the new terminal that was a 3 tract that basically was a useless tract to anybody else, 4 other than possibly City/County or Kerrville Aviation, 5 because it's right -- sandwiched in between all their 6 buildings. But moving down to a more open location would be 7 putting it in the middle of probably the most marketable 8 piece of property on the airport. So, it's kind of -- we're 9 in a situation -- based on where we are at this point, it's 10 the best location, but I think some better planning could 11 have been done, you know, in years previously. But it's all 12 done now. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: All done. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I saw him writing 15 over there too, Buster. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Uh-oh. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Need to see if we can 18 get our attorney in here. I can see that happening. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He's still on the 20 first page, though. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, sir, what do you got? 22 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, after I got into my 23 office, I realized that -- that this -- this $1,000 is for 24 our contractual obligation, and not the Juvenile Facility's 25 bond. 12-28-04 106 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What is our 2 contractual obligation, other than those bonds? 3 MR. TOMLINSON: The -- the Sheriff's radio 4 equipment is our contractual obligation. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that also with 6 Bank of New York? 7 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes, it is. This is the 8 invoice. It says -- 9 JUDGE TINLEY: That's actually what that is 10 for, is on the jail bond? 11 MR. TOMLINSON: It says Kerr County public 12 property finance contractual obligation, Series 2001. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's what that is? 14 MR. TOMLINSON: Yeah. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I move approval. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 18 approval of the payment to Bank of New York for $1,000 that 19 was excluded from the bills paid -- approval given 20 previously. Any question or discussion? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Hand check? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Need a hand check? 23 MR. TOMLINSON: No, it's in the -- it's -- 24 the check's already done. But we do have a bill for -- for 25 the obligation -- for the lease obligation bond that -- I 12-28-04 107 1 think that's -- I sent that to your office. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. And I wrote on it and 3 sent it somewhere. Back to you, I presume. 4 MR. TOMLINSON: I remember now that there -- 5 there are two, and they're the same amount, and they're both 6 to Bank of New York. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: I think the other one's 2,000, 8 if I'm not mistaken. 9 MR. TOMLINSON: Maybe it is. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: As to the motion presently on 11 the table, any further question or discussion? All in favor 12 of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The one we don't owe 17 is 2,000; the one we do owe is 1,000? 18 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm speaking from 19 recollection, Commissioner. Any other -- any other reports 20 from any of the Commissioners? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, when we -- 22 whenever we do get around to doing this -- this bond issue, 23 I think that it -- I think that we need another update, 24 and -- if there is such a thing, on what this is going to do 25 to the credit rating of Kerr County. I know that no one 12-28-04 108 1 knows for sure what's going -- how it's going to work, but I 2 would think that Mr. Henderson would have -- he's not an 3 attorney, but he may have some thoughts on that. And I 4 think that that -- to me, that is the biggest concern of 5 all. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, I mean, we 7 could ask the rating agencies to rate these new bonds we're 8 doing, and we'll find out. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They have to. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, they will. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that how we're 12 going to know what our rating's going to be? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: More than likely. 15 Does that help? That's what determines setting the rate. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. I'm dreaming of 17 hamburgers. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any reports from 19 elected officials? Department heads? Any other reports to 20 be rendered to the Court? Hearing none, we'll stand in 21 recess until 1:30, at which time the open issue on the order 22 authorizing publication of Notice of Intent to issue C.O.'s 23 will be -- will be resumed. 24 (Recess taken from 11:31 a.m. to 1:30 p.m.) 25 - - - - - - - - - - 12-28-04 109 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let me call back to 2 order the meeting of the Commissioners Court scheduled for 3 this time and date, Tuesday, December 28, 2004, at 9 a.m. 4 We were in recess sometime after 11:30 this morning to 5 reconvene again at 1:30. It's that time now. The item on 6 the agenda -- remaining resolution is Item 14, consider and 7 discuss adoption of order authorizing publication of Notice 8 of Intention to issue Certificates of Obligation. I was 9 successful in talking with the bond attorney, Mr. Tom 10 Spurgeon, and, number one, he apologized for the erroneous 11 spelling of Commissioner Letz' first name. Secondly, he had 12 an initial concern about whether or not, since it was going 13 to result in the incurring of a taxing incident, that it had 14 to be at a, quote, regular meeting. He did some further 15 research and responded that it had to be at a regularly 16 scheduled meeting, meaning a meeting at which -- at a time 17 at which the Court regularly meets. And, of course, the 18 second and fourth Monday qualifies those dates, so -- so he 19 indicated that, in his opinion, that would be satisfactory. 20 Also, I asked him about the language on Page 21 2 with reference to operation, and mentioned the possibility 22 of changing the language to, "The Juvenile Facility will be 23 owned by the County and will be operated in accordance with 24 the requirements of state law." He said that was 25 satisfactory, so those changes have been made. Now, with 12-28-04 110 1 regard to the actual notice to be issued, that has been 2 changed to provide that January 24th, which is a regularly 3 scheduled meeting of the Commissioners Court -- the place, 4 of course, will have to change to -- I had some language -- 5 I believe I specified it at the Union Church located on the 6 Schreiner University campus at the intersection of Travis 7 and Broadway in Kerrville, Texas, is my language for the 8 location. If some of you have something different, why, 9 throw it out here. But that change was not made on the 10 actual notice -- the actual -- the location, but that would 11 have to be made. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Question. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, sir? 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This may be a 15 question that -- I don't know whether I'm maybe putting the 16 cart in front of the horse, but let me ask anyway. His 17 covering memorandum, in Paragraph 2, he says he's received 18 the order that provides that C.O.'s will be issued in an 19 amount not to exceed 2 million, which should be sufficient 20 to provide -- sufficient to provide 1.9 million to the 21 corporation to purchase the Juvenile Facility and to pay 22 costs of the issuance. Now, my question is, are we issuing 23 these bonds for the -- for $1.9 million for the purpose of 24 passing that money, even if only technically, to the 25 Facilities Corporation to purchase this facility? Or is the 12-28-04 111 1 Facilities Corporation going to disband and Kerr County's 2 going to purchase it directly? 3 JUDGE TINLEY: The simple answer to that, 4 Commissioner, is I don't know, but the result's going to be 5 the same. If it happens, it's merely going to be a 6 pass-through, because title is going to have to be derived 7 from the Facilities Corporation, because the Facilities 8 Corporation owns record title of the property. So, I 9 suspect that what's going to happen is that the funds will 10 be handed to the -- to the Facilities Corp., who will in 11 turn use those funds to effect the -- the compromise with 12 the bondholders, since the actual issue of the bonds was the 13 Facilities Corp., and they're the ones that have the 14 obligation to the bondholders. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: But then, of course, there'll 17 be releases issued by bondholders to everybody on the -- 18 what I call the Kerr County side of the fence. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And then, subsequent 20 to that, then, Facilities Corporation turns over complete 21 title to the facility to Kerr County. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. Yeah, title will be 23 transferred into Kerr County. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just wanted to be 25 sure. 12-28-04 112 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Just want to make sure 2 who's getting the ducks and where they're lined up. 3 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah, the first 4 "whereas" on the second page of the order spells out that 5 we're purchasing the Juvenile Facility from the corporation. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Whereabouts, 8 Commissioner? 9 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: First "whereas" on 10 Page 2. First sentence. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm, I see it. 12 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: From the 13 corporation. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I'm wondering 16 if there may be any comment from Rex. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, me too. 18 MR. EMERSON: I can -- basically, I can tell 19 you I made the phone calls pursuant to Commissioners Court 20 request. The Tom Green County Attorney, Chris Taylor, said 21 he had no knowledge of any agreement at all as far as 22 operations between the County and the facility. He referred 23 me to Mark Williams, who is the director of the facility, 24 who was unavailable, who then I was then passed through to 25 his executive assistant, who didn't want to comment without 12-28-04 113 1 talking to Mark Williams, who then referred me to the County 2 Judge, who was not in the office. So, that was the essence 3 of the telephone calls. And I left messages at all parties 4 concerned, but -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bet that was fun. 6 MR. EMERSON: Not very productive. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. Thank you for 8 trying, Rex. 9 MR. EMERSON: Sure. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, Ms. Harris has 11 represented to us that that's the way it works, so -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, we're covered. I 13 mean, we'll work out, based on the language, some -- 14 whatever way to do something is according to law. 15 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: It sounded like it's 16 both ours and the Juvenile Board's intent that 17 responsibility for that be transferred, so there has to be a 18 way to do it. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, are you making 21 more -- or not more, but making all the necessary changes so 22 we can make a motion? 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, I'm -- I'm interlining 24 the location aspect of it. 25 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Irene, who are you 12-28-04 114 1 working for today? 2 MS. VAN WINKLE: The Current. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who? 4 MS. VAN WINKLE: West Kerr Current. I've 5 been covering your meetings for them. 6 (Discussion off the record.) 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. I'll make a 8 motion we -- to approve the order authorizing publication of 9 notice of intention to issue Certificates of Obligation. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: And publishing -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And Notice of Intention 12 to issue Certificates of Obligation. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to 15 approve the agenda item and issue Notice of Intention. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I might -- Judge, if I 17 could make -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Sure. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- note of the changes 20 that have been made from the copy that was presented to us, 21 on the second page, third "whereas," it will now read, 22 "Whereas, following such acquisition, the Juvenile Facility 23 will be owned by the County and will be operated in 24 accordance with the requirements of state law." 25 Additionally, under the Notice of Intention -- Notice of 12-28-04 115 1 Intention to Issue Certificates of Obligation, the last 2 sentence shall be changed to read, "The Commissioners Court 3 proposes to authorize the issuance of such Certificates of 4 Obligation at 11 a.m. on Monday, January 24th, 2005, which 5 is regularly scheduled -- which is a regularly scheduled 6 meeting of the Commissioners Court, at the Union Church 7 Building located at the Schreiner University campus at the 8 intersection of Travis and Broadway, Kerrville, Texas." And 9 then, finally, under the Certificate for Order, the 10 correction of my name has been made as well -- spelling of 11 my name. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 13 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 14 your right hand. 15 (Commissioners Williams, Letz, and Nicholson voted in favor of the motion.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Nay. 18 (Commissioner Baldwin voted against the 19 motion.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. Any further 21 business that we didn't get attended to this morning, 22 gentlemen? Hearing none, we'll stand adjourned. 23 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 1:42 p.m.) 24 - - - - - - - - - - 25 12-28-04 116 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 3rd day of January, 8 2005. 9 10 11 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 12 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 13 Certified Shorthand Reporter 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 12-28-04