1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Special Session 10 Monday, March 28, 2005 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 DAVE NICHOLSON, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X March 28, 2005 2 PAGE --- Visitors' Input 3 3 --- Commissioners' Comments 5 4 1.1 Request by Hill Country ADR Center to renew mediation services contract and funding 9 5 1.2 Discuss policies and procedures for utilization of the HCYEC and related property, consider options 6 for improving management of these facilities 16 1.3 Consider resolution in support of M.H.M.R. local 7 authority and provider roles 47 1.4 Letter to Kerrville City Manager requesting trees 8 for Kerr County Courthouse parking area 57 1.18 Resolution authorizing acceptance of donation of 9 approximately 3.025 acres of property from KEDF 61 1.19 Consider approving Airport Code, including Rules 10 and Regulations and Minimum Operating Standards 64 1.5 Consider list of road changes, set public hearing 67 11 1.6 Final Replat of Y.O. Ranchlands, Tract 31, Pct. 4 73 1.7 Award bids for Road & Bridge materials/equipment 76 12 1.8 Consider road name changes for privately maintained roads in accordance with 9-1-1 guidelines 78 13 1.9 Approve proclamation declaring April 2005 Child Abuse Prevention Month in Kerr County 81 14 1.10 Consider appointing Amber Freeman and Pam Peter to Kerr County Child Welfare Board 83 15 1.11 Consider Joint Community Service Program Proposal 86 1.12 Consider and approve contracts for psychological 16 & medical services performed at juvenile facility 96 1.13 Discuss hiring LPC/LCDC to replace facility 17 counselor resigning in April 98 1.14 Consider purchase of video recorder used to monitor 18 and record secured areas within juvenile facility 117 1.15 Consider policy with respect to pauper's remains 120 19 1.16 Discuss Master Road Plan for Kerr County 123 1.17 Discuss Subdivision Rules and Regulations and 20 Water Availability Requirements 130 21 4.1 Pay Bills 138 4.2 Budget Amendments 145 22 4.3 Late Bills --- 4.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 152 23 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee 24 Assignments 153 25 --- Adjourned 155 3 1 On Monday, March 28, 2005, at 9:00 a.m., a special 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in the 3 Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, Kerrville, 4 Texas, and the following proceedings were had in open court: 5 P R O C E E D I N G S 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, ladies and 7 gentlemen. Let me call to order this regularly scheduled 8 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court posted for 9 this time and date, Monday, March the 28th, 2005, at 9 a.m. 10 It appears to be that time now. Commissioner Baldwin -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir? 12 JUDGE TINLEY: -- the floor is yours. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If you'll stand and 14 join me in a word of prayer, and after the prayer, we'll do 15 the pledge of allegiance. 16 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: At this time, if there's any 20 member of the audience or the public that wishes to address 21 the Court or mention some items that are not listed items on 22 the agenda, you're free to come forward at this time. If 23 you want to speak on an agenda item, an item that's listed 24 on the agenda, we would ask that you fill out a 25 participation form. They're at the back of the room. It's 3-28-05 4 1 not essential that you do so, but it helps me to make sure 2 that I get everybody that wants to speak on a given issue. 3 But if you want to speak on an item that is not a listed 4 agenda item, we'd ask that you come forward at this time. 5 Mr. Eller? If you'd give your name and address so that the 6 court reporter can have it, please. 7 MR. ELLER: My name's Charlie Eller, 108 Wild 8 Timber, Kerrville, Texas. I've spent most of the last nine 9 months fighting City Hall, and I would like the Court to 10 know that while we've had disagreements in the past, by 11 comparison, this is a responsive, civil, caring group of 12 people. Thank you. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 16 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: We've really missed 17 you the last nine months, Charlie. (Laughter.) 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, could you get 19 the reporter to read that back, please? (Laughter.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: How many times, Commissioner? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Three or four times. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Is there anyone else that 23 wishes to be heard on any matter that is not a listed agenda 24 item? Seeing no one else coming forward, we will move on. 25 Commissioner Baldwin, what do you have for us this morning? 3-28-05 5 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want to announce 2 that, you know, this Court, on three different occasions, 3 has gone to the West Texas County Judges and Commissioners 4 Association Conference all over the country, and we have put 5 our bid in to bring that conference to Kerrville, and we 6 were finally successful in doing that. In 2007, the West 7 Texas conference will be held right here in Kerrville, and 8 there will be between 500 and 600 brand-new faces that come 9 to town, the best we can tell. But I think that, you know, 10 now that it's come this far south, that we'll have -- our 11 neighboring counties will come over here, and as well as 12 some of the -- the old South Texas bunch; just everybody 13 loves to come to Kerrville, and so our community will be 14 full of county government officials. There -- in the West 15 Texas Association, there's 108 counties, so if you do that 16 math, that's a lot of folks in itself, and then if you start 17 adding these -- Gillespie and Bandera and these other 18 counties locally, our community will be absolutely full, and 19 we're going to have a great time. There's lots of planning 20 to be done. We're -- because we're going to be the host, 21 and we want to dress our community up and learn how to be 22 nice. And -- but a big part of that is there is going to be 23 a large amount of money spent in this community in one week. 24 And, of course, the City of Kerrville gets most of it 25 through the sales tax, so in our process of planning, we 3-28-05 6 1 will be visiting with the brethren over at the City to see 2 how that we can partnership and -- in some functions. So, 3 that's about it, unless y'all want to talk about track at 4 Baylor. But I won't do that to you today. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. Commissioner 6 Williams? 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, my modest 8 colleague to the right failed to tell you that he also was 9 elevated to first vice presidency of -- of the West Texas 10 Judges and Commissioners Association, and in 2007, when the 11 conference is here, he will be the major-domo; he will be 12 the president of that association. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Major-domo? 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You like that? 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that -- that's 16 below general, though? 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's complimentary. 20 And also, you know, there's an old saying, if you don't get 21 it right the first time, you keep trying till you do get it 22 right, and Commissioner Baldwin did that. In his committee 23 meeting, he had a committee that was kind of all over the 24 lot in terms of where they were willing to go, and he kept 25 them at the table voting until they finally got it right, 3-28-05 7 1 and they're going to be here in '07. Congratulations. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, sir. Thank 3 you. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that it? 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Letz? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Unfortunately, I was 8 unable to attend the conference due to illness in the 9 family, but I figure there'll be ample time for some other 10 conferences, probably the post-legislative conference. 11 Legislature seems to be tinkering with a great deal of 12 things that's going to affect us, so I plan to attend that. 13 Only thing I really have, I'd like to read a very short 14 letter that I received the other day. Letter's from J. 15 Dudley Snyder, who owns a ranch in east Kerr County, and 16 it's written to the Kerr County Road and Bridge Department. 17 I think Leonard has the original of this. I received a 18 copy. "Dear sir: Sue and I would like to write this letter 19 of commendation to your crew for the very professional job 20 they did recently in our area of Kerr County. The road 21 construction crew needed material for a road repair job 22 nearby, and we offered some of our gravel from our creek 23 crossings. The crew did a very neat and professional job on 24 our ranch, and we'd like to thank them for doing quality 25 work. Please put this letter in the appropriate personnel 3-28-05 8 1 files. Sincerely, J. Dudley Snyder." Len, appreciate your 2 crew. I'm sure you received the original of this and will 3 pass that word on to Douglas and his crew. Very -- it's 4 always a great thing to receive a letter like this about a 5 Kerr County -- any Kerr County employee, so I just wanted to 6 read that into the record. That's all I have. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Commissioner 8 Nicholson? 9 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Two things, Judge. 10 Our Kerr County children have been competing in the major 11 livestock shows ever since we had the -- the show here, and 12 I don't have information on how well they've done overall. 13 The Houston show was just this weekend, I think. But one 14 group, the Ingram F.F.A., scored really well in Fort Worth, 15 San Antonio, and San Angelo. A dozen of their members 16 scored in those events, and one of them, Hunter Dieringer, 17 scored in five or six different events, so I'll be 18 interested to see how -- how we did overall. I think we've 19 really got fine 4-H activity in this county. There'll be a 20 dedication of the Texas Historical Marker for Hunt on 21 April 7th at 1:30 p.m. at -- near Camp La Junta, right there 22 near the Hunt Crossing. And, as y'all know, that's a major 23 activity to try to -- try to get one of those historical 24 markers approved, so I'm hoping for a good turnout for that. 25 That's it. 3-28-05 9 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. I, too, want to 2 thank Commissioner Baldwin for his efforts in the -- the 3 site selection committee. I think, but for his efforts, we 4 wouldn't be seeing those folks here in 2007, and I think it 5 was because of his efforts -- strong-arming? Would that be 6 a better term? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It works. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Perseverance. But it was 9 primarily his efforts that is going to bring that -- that 10 function here, and we want to thank him for that. I think 11 it was a beneficial conference to all of us that attended, 12 and I think we all came away with some good ideas. That's 13 all I have. Let's get down to business. The first item on 14 the agenda is consideration of a request by the Hill Country 15 A.D.R. Center to renew a contract with Kerr County to 16 provide mediation services in Kerr County, and for funding. 17 Mr. Reaves? 18 MR. REAVES: Good morning. May it please the 19 Court, three years ago, this Court authorized an allocation 20 of some $43,000 to restart the Hill Country A.D.R. Center 21 that has since grown from a trickle of cases the first year 22 to 68 the second year, and in 2004, we had 105 cases, 66 of 23 which were Kerr -- involved Kerr County residents. The 24 mission of the A.D.R. Center is to provide accessible, 25 affordable dispute resolution for the residents of Kerr 3-28-05 10 1 County and the other counties that we serve. You know, it's 2 hard to put a dollar figure on how much is saved with each 3 case. You know, there's a tremendous amount of good done to 4 the individual parties when you can settle a case in a 5 timely manner by agreement, so they have greater 6 satisfaction with what happens, and then it's apt to stand 7 the test of time better when they've been a part of it. 8 But I did do some research. Found out 9 that -- in Travis County, they found out that it cost a 10 little over $5,000 a day to have a trial, the costs of 11 everybody involved. The average in Travis County is three 12 days for trial. I suspect here it's a little less than 13 that, but I don't have the precise figures. But if you took 14 the 66 cases that we had -- Kerr County cases that we had 15 last year, and we know we saved -- we settled, on average, 16 80 percent of the cases. It varies from time to time. The 17 last quarter of last year, we had 27 cases, and we settled 18 26. But -- but you multiply that times those figures, and 19 you're getting a figure close to, oh, some $800,000 or so 20 saved. Now, let's assume that we hear less cases. Maybe we 21 only saved a third of that, but that still would represent 22 about $10 return for every dollar that was allocated by the 23 Court last year to the center. 24 We're excited about the future. We think 25 there are things that we may be able to help out with in the 3-28-05 11 1 community in addition to helping the courts deal with an 2 ever-growing number of cases. Things like peer mediation in 3 some of the schools that do not have them currently, and a 4 possibility of victim offender mediation in juvenile cases 5 that Judge Tinley and have I spoken about before. And so we 6 would respectfully ask the Court to approve the continuation 7 of our contract this year. There was some 18 -- over 8 $18,000 in A.D.R. funds collected by the County back on 30 9 September. It was over $21,000 as of 31 December, and I 10 think they're probably just updated quarterly. But, given a 11 straight-line projection, there should be about almost 12 $25,000 in that fund right now, and we're requesting the 13 Court's consideration of allocating $20,000 of that money. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mr. Reaves, I have a 15 couple questions. How much -- how much did the County kick 16 in this last year? 17 MR. REAVES: $33,000. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 33? 19 MR. REAVES: Yes, sir. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I'm looking at the 21 profit/loss schedule here, and I don't see where that 33 -- 22 I see county funding under December '04, $2,300, and then 23 January-December, $43,000. 24 MR. REAVES: Yes, sir. What that indicates 25 is we received an additional $10,000 from the other counties 3-28-05 12 1 that we served -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. Okay. So 3 that's just -- 4 MR. REAVES: -- during the year. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You lump all the 6 counties together? 7 MR. REAVES: Yes, sir. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And then one other 9 question. On your performance report, for calendar year 10 2004, you -- and I think you just answered my question when 11 -- when you talked about you had served approximately 250 12 clients, and 150 of those were Kerr County residents. 13 MR. REAVES: Yes, sir. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So the Kerr County 15 taxpayers are not picking up the bill for other counties. 16 They are paying for those -- 17 MR. REAVES: No, sir. We'd like to see the 18 other counties participate more. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So would we. 20 MR. REAVES: And that's -- that's on the 21 agenda. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. Thank you very 23 much. 24 MR. REAVES: Thank you, Mr. Baldwin. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What is the fee -- 3-28-05 13 1 average fee charged or paid by users of the mediation 2 service? 3 MR. REAVES: Well, if it's a prelitigation 4 case, each side pays $65. If it's already in litigation, 5 each side pays $125. And the mediators charge no fee; 6 they're all pro bono people. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 8 MR. REAVES: Thank you, sir. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions for Mr. 10 Reaves? 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Not a question, just 12 an observation. I'm a big fan of mediation. Besides all 13 the money it saves, it shortens the time required to get to 14 resolution, and probably makes the community a friendlier 15 place, so mediation is very good. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Emerson, have you reviewed 17 the proposed contract? 18 MR. EMERSON: Yes, Judge. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: And what's the result of that 20 review? 21 MR. EMERSON: I don't think there's any 22 outstanding terms for the County. It's the same contract 23 that's been used -- 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 25 MR. EMERSON: -- for the previous year. And 3-28-05 14 1 at that time, I was actually part of the Hill Country 2 Alternative Dispute Resolution Board and participated in 3 making that contract. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: But the format is the same one 5 that's been approved in the past? 6 MR. EMERSON: Yes, sir. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: These funds are budgeted? 9 JUDGE TINLEY: They're segregated funds, if I 10 understand it correctly. When cases are filed in our -- in 11 our courts, there's a certain amount of the court costs that 12 goes into a segregated fund for -- for alternate dispute 13 resolution, and these are the funds that they're asking that 14 be pushed over and allocated for their use for the A.D.R. 15 purpose. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But if we didn't budget 17 them, we still have to budget those -- we have to authorize 18 the expenditure of these funds, don't we? Even though 19 they're in a separate fund? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. Yes, I would think so. 21 Certainly -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And if we didn't budget 23 for them, we have to declare an emergency and budget for 24 them. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, it'd be just like 3-28-05 15 1 the Law Library fund. We take expenditures -- we make 2 expenditures out of the Law Library fund, for example. I 3 think it's the same principle. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, but we budget 5 those. We still -- we don't just arbitrarily take it out 6 any time we want to. We just budget those during the budget 7 process. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm not sure about 9 that. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not opposed. I just 11 want to make sure we do it properly, so -- you know, they 12 are dedicated funds. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I move for 14 approval. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 17 approval of the contract. All in favor -- any further 18 discussion or comments? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let's get the answer. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm not sure I can find it on 21 this one. 22 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I can't help you. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can deal with that 24 during budget amendments. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3-28-05 16 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That part of it. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 3 discussion on the motion? All in favor of the motion, 4 signify by raising your right hand. 5 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 7 (No response.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Thank 9 you very much, Mr. Reaves. 10 MR. REAVES: Thank you very much. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: The next item is a timed item 12 set for 9:15. It's a few minutes past that now. That is 13 consider and discuss policies and procedures for utilization 14 of the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center and related 15 property; consider options for improving the business 16 management of these facilities. Commissioner Nicholson? 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'll start off by 18 telling you what I expect or hope will come from this 19 discussion. There are -- there's a good bit of interest 20 in -- in reexamining the processes and procedures used to 21 book the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center and related 22 facilities, and what I'm hoping is that we'll get the issues 23 on the table. I don't expect that we're going to find -- 24 come to resolution of all the issues today, but we need to 25 understand the scope of the -- of the concerns or 3-28-05 17 1 grievances, and then establish a -- a process for dealing 2 with those issues, and I'm hoping the process will include 3 broader issues that deal with the revenues of the -- of the 4 Hill Country Youth Exhibition Center and the other 5 facilities. So, first -- first, I'm going to ask, to help 6 me introduce the subject, Aubrey Henderson to speak to it. 7 MR. HENDERSON: Morning. I've been absent 8 from putting on rodeos for the last six or seven years, but 9 I have been in that building putting on rodeos in the past 10 for 13 years; Host Lion Clubs in the spring, Crimestoppers 11 in the fall. But I wasn't here today to talk about that. 12 I'm here to talk about the fundraiser that I wanted to do. 13 I talked -- in the last year and a half, I've talked to the 14 Former Texas Rangers Association; everybody knows Joe Davis 15 and Lila. And my interest was only to -- and there's other 16 people here to talk about different interests, but my 17 interest was to put a fundraiser on again, to start and have 18 a fundraiser for that organization. I want to talk about 19 policy. I don't know if there's a policy handbook. I hope 20 that there will be one. 21 Buster, Mr. Nicholson, everybody, I think 22 y'all went to Odessa. I think if y'all were talking to 23 Commissioners there, that if somebody asked you a question 24 that said, "What's your policy on the building?" You could 25 open your briefcase and you could pull out a handbook and 3-28-05 18 1 could you say, "Page 72." How big the arena is, how much 2 the seating holds; you could have a conversation about that. 3 If I come to your office and I ask you, "Sir, give me an 4 opinion on something," you're not going to send me a Xerox 5 copy from the other center. It's going to be a copy. I 6 want to see a handbook, if it's possible. I would like to 7 talk about costs of the seasons, the dates of the 8 off-season. There's only so many prime dates. We don't 9 have air conditioning and heating in that other building, 10 but I'd be willing to raise my hand right now and put on a 11 convention or rodeo or anything like that to raise money. 12 If you'll tag the money, I'll put on the 13 rodeo or the function, bring in a star, whatever, and we'll 14 tag that money and we'll raise money to put air conditioning 15 and heating. It won't take very long, I don't think. 16 Week-long events should be different. We should cut deals 17 with people that want to come in and have that venue, and it 18 should be at a reduced price, but primary dates should cost 19 money. When you talk -- and I mean Heart of the Hills in 20 Waco, Rose Palace south of here, San Antonio. You talk San 21 Angelo; they all have different prices, but their venues 22 that come in there is money that they make. And we're all 23 about for the kids first, but we need to make money at that 24 facility. Everybody should be eligible to participate, 25 gentlemen; it's just good business, making money for the 3-28-05 19 1 county. 2 I don't think there's anybody in this room 3 that would dispute that the 4-H kids are first. They're 4 number-one priority. But, Buster, you know, you asked me 5 the other day -- you were concerned that there was a 6 letter -- or there was a problem that the kids got bumped 7 for another function. Well, I have this letter here, and 8 I'm going to leave it here with you. I'm not here to 9 mention names or anything. There's three names and numbers 10 on that letter; you can contact them. I'm not an 11 investigator. These kids were bumped. And what that was, 12 was kids wanted to come participate at -- a speaker come 13 from Oklahoma City; it was related to a horse event. They 14 didn't get to participate. They did have their function, 15 but they tied their horses out back. Let's talk about 16 conventions. We all know Sudie. We all know that she 17 brings in a lot of people. A lot of people love to come to 18 the Texas Hill Country. We live in a great, great place. 19 If you were in Odessa, it's pretty. Galveston's pretty. 20 But, unfortunately -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Getting into opinions 22 now. 23 MR. HENDERSON: Huh? We've got -- you've 24 asked for bed tax, and you received it. These conventions 25 that don't get to come down here -- I'm going to read a 3-28-05 20 1 letter right quick, and here's -- Sudie gave me all this 2 stuff. It's called a Lost Business Report Log. It tells of 3 the convention -- the people that want to come here, the 4 year that they want to come, how many rooms they're going to 5 stay in, and it has here reason for loss of booking. You've 6 seen them, Buster. Commissioner, you've seen this. This is 7 not new news, but these are conventions; these are venues 8 that want to come to our facility. And it says here, 9 Christie Lester does advise that the Junior Red Brangus will 10 not be -- will not be coming to Kerrville in 2004 because 11 the ag complex was not available for those dates. 12 Again, I get back to if the building was 13 available 12 months out of the year instead of these primary 14 dates, fall and spring, and it was air-conditioned and it 15 was heated, which it isn't, and we're not in the business 16 right now to even discuss that, but later down the road, 17 then we probably wouldn't be here, 'cause there would be 18 enough dates available for Sudie. There'd be enough dates 19 for equine. There would be a lot of dates for everybody. 20 But it should be equal. What happened to the Budweiser -- 21 Bill Langley Budweiser horses? They used to come. The 22 Lebanon Brangus, the Cutting Horse Association. And, 23 gentlemen, did you know, Sudie told me that the Home and 24 Garden Show is moving to Gillespie County, 22 miles north of 25 here? You just said we have one coming here. You just said 3-28-05 21 1 earlier in your statement that we have a convention. We 2 just lost one. You know, those Commissioners over there and 3 those hotels and those gas stations are applauding us, 4 because this was here for a long time. Now it's gone. 5 I have some recommendations, and they're only 6 recommendations. Form a committee. I raise my hand right 7 now. I've been all over this United States. I've rode in 8 every arena, coliseum; I've seen every venue, good, small, 9 little. Victoria, Texas, where they tell you at 12:01, at 10 midnight, you're charged another day. We don't get that 11 severe, but we have to put rodeos on there. We have to be 12 out at 12:01. If not, we're charged another day. It's just 13 business, gentlemen. All remaining 2005 calendar year's 14 dates be paid in full and deposits in full up front or 15 forfeit those dates, thus opening them for other venues and 16 events. This should eliminate what I believe to call 17 calendar racing and the word "bumped." This allows the 18 County to earn interest up front on their money. It's just 19 business. 20 Recommend that 2006 calendar year be erased 21 immediately, open it up to all parties interested in a fair 22 and honest drawing for these prime dates. No venue, person 23 or persons, private or convention, nonprofit organization, 24 shall be able to rent the indoor or outdoor facility for 25 more than two consecutive occasions per calendar year, 3-28-05 22 1 therefore opening up to all dates for fair and honest 2 competitive scheduling. Note the word, "competitive" 3 scheduling. The County should maintain a log of all 4 incoming inquiries interested in Kerr County facility for 5 future reference. Kerr County Commissioners and public 6 should want to know what kind of interest and venues would 7 like to come to Kerr County with their events. This would 8 also bring outside income to our community. Rebooking after 9 each held annual event. It's kind of like kids playing in a 10 baseball field. Got a chain link fence around it; kids are 11 in there playing. Other kids would like to play, but policy 12 tells them that these kids can't play. If you pay, you 13 ought to be able to play. Everybody wants to play. 14 How do you rate it? This is how I rate it. 15 4-H kids first, nonprofit organizations second, private 16 businesses third. And let's talk about private business. 17 There's nothing wrong with anybody renting that building 18 making money. I am not here to grieve about that, not one 19 bit, but right is right and wrong is wrong. Just a minute. 20 I was down there the other day. This is posted: "Anyone 21 wanting to use the outdoor arena must check in at Expo 22 Office." The word "anyone" means everybody. It's broad. 23 I'd like to ask one question before I close, fair and 24 honestly. Does the Kerr County Commissioners want growth in 25 our community, and local and outside venues to participate 3-28-05 23 1 in our taxpayers' facilities? Thank you. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Aubrey, before you 3 leave -- 4 MR. HENDERSON: Yes? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- can we get a copy? I 6 didn't take a lot of notes. 7 MR. HENDERSON: Yes. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If you'd make a copy, I'd 9 be -- 10 MR. HENDERSON: Yeah, sure, no problem. And 11 I have the letter, too, for you. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 13 MR. HENDERSON: Thank you, Mr. Nicholson. 14 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I think Teri Hawkins 15 also wanted to speak on the subject. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 17 MS. HAWKINS: Thank y'all. Commissioner 18 Nicholson, thank you for asking me to be here today to 19 present the documentation that has come from all my 20 inquiries. I have copies for all of y'all of everything 21 that I have documented, as well as some questions that -- I 22 don't know if they'll get answered today, but eventually I 23 know they will. I'd first like to say that I understand and 24 agree that the county facility dates should always be for 25 the children first, for nonprofit organizations and raising 3-28-05 24 1 money for scholarships or benefits before consideration is 2 given to any outside organization or persons, and I firmly 3 believe this. My question to the Commissioners is, what is 4 the standard procedure that outside organizations or 5 individuals should follow to find the availability of the 6 facilities? 7 I have been told that the booking date for 8 contracts in reference to the indoor facility is the month 9 of August. I don't know for sure, and if so, I don't know 10 what day. If it's not in the month of August, I'd like to 11 know what month and what day. Is this public knowledge? 12 Does the County advertise this booking contract date? If 13 so, who do they advertise with and how often do they do it? 14 How many days can an outside organization book in a single 15 12-month period? How many months in advance can a single 16 organization or individual book the county facilities? And 17 if it's more than a 12-month period, how can you submit 18 these booking contracts based on what I have been told? I 19 would like to know if I could have a blank contract form for 20 my review and a copy of the policies and rules on how the 21 facility is to be ran, rented, et cetera. I'd also -- 22 another question. Please explain the procedure that the 23 County Commissioners use when presented with a new policy or 24 policy change. How many votes does it take to pass a new 25 policy or make an old policy change from the Commissioners? 3-28-05 25 1 Can y'all answer that? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Three. 3 MS. HAWKINS: Takes three? Then how can -- I 4 was told that two County Commissioners met with two County 5 Extension Agent -- or with the County Extension Agent and 6 the County 4-H Coordinator at the County Extension Office 7 during the week of March 7th and discussed, voted, and put 8 into force a policy change after I had already spoke with 9 the County employee that was told to me to be in charge of 10 the outdoor facility. I inquired about certain dates on 11 March the 1st, and was told the week of March the 7th that 12 this vote went into play; that the prices, the dates of 13 everything that was available to me, the insurance rates 14 were given, the concession stand questions were answered. 15 The only question they couldn't answer was they weren't sure 16 about the deposit, and that they'd give that to me at a 17 later date. Well, now I'm told by the County employee 18 that's in charge of the outdoor facility bookings that 19 they're -- they were no longer -- I'm sorry, I'm not real 20 good at speaking. 21 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: You're doing fine. 22 MS. HAWKINS: I'll let y'all read this, and 23 it will make more sense to you. If it takes -- I guess what 24 I'm trying to say, if it takes three votes to put into 25 policy, then it's my understanding that no three 3-28-05 26 1 Commissioners can meet and discuss any issues before the 2 Commissioners Court date. Is that correct also? Okay. 3 And, so, it does take three votes. Then I want to -- what 4 we wanted to know was, how can this new policy of the 5 outdoor arena be enforced with only two Commissioners' votes 6 that was told to me, and we weren't allowed our dates? 7 Those are my questions on behalf of CowHawk Team Roping 8 Productions. And this is -- 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The question -- 10 MS. HAWKINS: I'm sorry if I didn't put it 11 very eloquently. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Does it -- I mean, I 13 don't understand the -- your question, 'cause there's no 14 policy that I'm aware of. Is there more information in your 15 letter about who said what? 16 MS. HAWKINS: Yes, sir, there's 17 documentation. I was told that a new policy was put into 18 effect, and therefore our dates would not be honored. And 19 it's all in there. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It says who said that? 21 MS. HAWKINS: Yes, sir, but I don't want to 22 mention names or anything. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 24 MS. HAWKINS: I really appreciate it. Thank 25 you. 3-28-05 27 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that a single 2 copy, or is that a copy for everybody? 3 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's a single 4 copy. 5 MS. HAWKINS: It's just one copy, and you'll 6 have to make copies. I'm sorry. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: We can reproduce. Thank you 8 very much. 9 MS. HAWKINS: Thank you. 10 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Judge, do you have 11 some participation forms? 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Are you through with the 13 speakers? All right. We have some individuals who have 14 filed public participation forms. Hazelle Calcote. Is 15 Ms. Calcote here? There she is, okay. 16 MS. CALCOTE: Good morning. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, Ms. Calcote. 18 MS. CALCOTE: I'm Hazelle Calcote. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Would you give your address so 20 the reporter can take it down? 21 MS. CALCOTE: 1701 Calcote Road, Kerrville. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 23 MS. CALCOTE: I've lived here for gone on 54 24 years, and I was on the committee that helped build the 25 outdoor arena back in the early '60's. And at that time, 3-28-05 28 1 sir, Judge Neunhoffer was the County Judge, and he was 2 adamant about the 4-H and F.F.A. kids having access anytime, 3 all the time, to that outdoor arena, 'cause that was why it 4 was exclusively built by the parents and interested friends, 5 for the kids. Because we have enough problems with kids, as 6 everybody knows, you know, in other areas, and not all kids 7 like to play soccer or football or other ball games. And I 8 think that that arena should be available to the kids at all 9 times, and he further decreed that under no circumstances 10 would any kind of alcoholic beverages be sold or consumed on 11 those premises there at the outdoor arena. And I would just 12 like to see that that arena is always available to them, and 13 with exception, only requested by an individual organization 14 would it be allowed for outdoor use and rented, but not be 15 set up for extended yearly coverage that would bump kids in 16 any form or manner. 17 And other people say that they're going to 18 make sure that the kids get it, but I have good knowledge 19 that -- that the kids have been bumped and would be bumped 20 at times to keep them from participating. And I think that 21 if kids show up out there and there's something that's going 22 on, that kids come first. 'Cause my first love is kids and 23 horses. And I thank you for listening to me. But please 24 make sure that the kids have first and last and middle 25 request for that outdoor arena. 3-28-05 29 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, ma'am. Does 2 anybody have any questions for Ms. Calcote? We appreciate 3 you being here today, Ms. Calcote. Rusty Henderson? 4 MR. RUSTY HENDERSON: I just wanted to say 5 that the -- 6 JUDGE TINLEY: If you'll give your name -- I 7 mean your address to the reporter. I think she's got your 8 name. 9 MR. RUSTY HENDERSON: 1803 Looker Drive, 10 Ingram. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 12 MR. RUSTY HENDERSON: I just wanted to say 13 that the Original Team Roping Association, which is based in 14 Amarillo, Texas, which used to be the Coors, has been 15 leasing this barn for the last 18 or 19 years, and there's 16 never been a problem with getting dates or maintaining dates 17 or paying deposits. Whatever we were asked to do, we did. 18 Original Team Roping has been involved in the last 18 years, 19 and to my knowledge, we've done everything that the Court's 20 asked us to do, and we would like our record and our 21 reputation to speak for itself. Thank you. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Any questions for 23 Mr. Henderson? Thank you, Mr. Henderson. I appreciate it. 24 Becky Henderson? 25 MS. HENDERSON: I don't think I need to. 3-28-05 30 1 Thank you, Judge. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All right, thank you. Charlie 3 Eller. 4 MR. ELLER: Charlie Eller, 108 Wild Timber, 5 Kerrville. I think I've heard something here this morning I 6 am finally beginning to like about the Ag Barn. In my 7 memory, it had never been operated the way it ought to have 8 been operated, and that is as a business. The County 9 shouldn't be in the business of social engineering and 10 charity and giving away the taxpayers' money. In fact, it's 11 forbidden by law. If what I'm hearing here this morning 12 takes place, then I'm very much encouraged. I won't hear 13 any more $20 million bond issues or three and a half million 14 dollar bond issues to build a facility that we'll lose money 15 on. It seems to me I'm hearing here this morning if we'll 16 run it like a business, if all these people want to come 17 here, there's no reason why that business should not be an 18 asset instead of a debt burden to the taxpayers of this 19 county. And I would encourage you to jump on board and run 20 this like a business and, you know, get it off the 21 taxpayers' back. Make money on it. A tax cut would be 22 wonderful, wouldn't it? I -- I would have no problem 23 whatsoever, if there's more things that need to be done out 24 there, if we issue bonds based on revenue, not on taxpayers' 25 assessments. I wouldn't have any problem with it. But I 3-28-05 31 1 think I heard the gentleman here this morning offer to 2 air-condition and heat that place. Jump on it, and don't 3 send me a tax bill for it. Thank you. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Mr. Eller. Is 5 there anyone else who wishes to be heard on this particular 6 item -- agenda item that has not filed a participation form? 7 Yes, sir? If you'll step forward, give your name and 8 address, please. 9 MR. COWDEN: I'm Tim Cowden. I live 3 miles 10 north of Garven School. I'd like to introduce my partner, 11 Mr. Hawkins. And we own some team roping cattle, and are 12 interested in putting on some team ropings in the Kerrville, 13 Ingram, Boerne, and Bandera area. We're working on dates 14 that work for Mr. Hawkins and myself schedule. We would 15 like to use the indoor and the outdoor arena. We're 16 interested in competitive booking. Also represent the 17 T.R.A., a statewide association that would like to come to 18 this venue in the indoor arena. Jerry Hawkins and I are 19 producers, and we had Teri Hawkins call to book. We are the 20 producers that are talked about in her papers. We would 21 like to be able to use both arenas. My concerns with 22 booking, and the resolution of the problem with the outdoor 23 arena I would appreciate very much. Thank you. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. Is there 25 anyone else here present that wishes to be heard on this 3-28-05 32 1 issue that has not filed a public participation form? 2 Mr. Walston, if you'll come forward. Give your name and 3 address, please. 4 MR. WALSTON: Roy Walston, County Extension 5 Agent, 3650 Highway 27 South. Judge and Commissioners, I've 6 got a letter that we've put together that is made up by the 7 -- by myself and the 4-H Horse Project leaders, and they -- 8 of course, project leaders have signed off on it, and I'd 9 like to give y'all all a copy of that. When we were 10 approached as to using the outdoor arena, I visited with -- 11 I previously visited with Glenn Holekamp, and he had 12 authorized myself to go ahead and -- and lease the outdoor 13 arena as we felt necessary for the 4-H Horse Project. And 14 at that time is when I approached the various -- both 15 Commissioner Baldwin and Commissioner Letz as to what our -- 16 how we would handle that for our 4-H facilities. We've run 17 into some problems in scheduling our office and our meeting 18 rooms by leasing -- or by letting others use it; it got to 19 the point to where we couldn't hold our own meetings in it. 20 So, with that experience and with our growing horse project, 21 and which now has 46 4-H Horse Project members, some growing 22 interest in the English area and some things like that, we 23 felt like by multiple leasing of this facility for multiple 24 events during the year, it was going to conflict with some 25 of the possibilities of scheduling dates for those kids, and 3-28-05 33 1 at that time, that's when we decided that it would be best 2 if we just did not lease it outside for 4-H -- outside of 3 4-H use. And that's primarily -- and I appreciate 4 everybody's interest in putting the 4-H kids first, and 5 that's what we're doing. Until we can know that -- that 6 we're -- we've got access to a facility, and that's what 7 we're doing, is making it to where our 4-H kids have access 8 to a facility. As Ms. Calcote mentioned, that facility was 9 built by 4-H leaders and volunteers, and it was my 10 impression that it was a 4-H facility for us to use as we 11 felt necessary. That's all I have. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Any members of the 13 Court have any questions for Mr. Walston? Thank you, sir. 14 We appreciate you being here. 15 MS. HAWKINS: I have a question, and I have 16 -- can I ask a question? 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. 18 MS. HAWKINS: Okay. What is the date of that 19 letter? 20 MR. WALSTON: March 25th. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Mr. Walston. 22 MS. HAWKINS: Mm-hmm. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Anyone else? We appreciate 24 the input on this subject. It occurs to me that there are a 25 number of stakeholders, interested parties in the use of 3-28-05 34 1 that facility. We've got -- we've got nonprofit 2 organizations. We've obviously got ag groups. We've got, 3 as is pretty evident here today, people interested in 4 roping. They have a significant interest. I think our 5 economic development people, certainly our Convention and 6 Visitors Bureau people, our 4-H leadership structure and 7 that organization, our F.F.A. people. It appears like we've 8 got a number of interested stakeholders in this thing. And 9 let me ask Mr. Holekamp, if I might, do you -- do you have a 10 current policy in-hand that you feel comfortable about when 11 -- when these various groups come to you inquiring about the 12 use of these facilities out there? 13 MR. HOLEKAMP: No, sir, we don't have a clear 14 policy. And back in June of this last year, in this Court, 15 we addressed doing some policy changes, and it has not been 16 done. I have some feelings, again, on some -- some ideas. 17 I think something that was brought up earlier, possibly a 18 group committee to put together some policies for the Court 19 to approve would be very appropriate. If I'm going to err 20 in the rental of the facility or use of the facility, I want 21 to err in favor of the youth, the 4-H groups. As y'all all 22 know, the last year, year and a half, we've -- the hill 23 country has had quite a bit of rain. We have opened the 24 doors to the indoor arena for 4-H'ers to practice also, not 25 only the outdoor arena, which that is their arena to use 3-28-05 35 1 when they ride; they drive up and they go in the arena. If 2 that facility is booked for commercial or -- or community, 3 whatever, what are we going to do? Or do we -- do we say to 4 the 4-H'ers, "Well, come back tomorrow"? 5 I think there needs to be some policy 6 relative to booking, and the word nobody likes is 7 "rollover." One -- one thing is -- and I brought this up 8 before -- is -- is these events book two years in advance, 9 most of the major ones. You know, just like your -- your -- 10 the Commissioners and Judges conference. They didn't say, 11 "Buster, we're coming there this summer." So -- so what I'm 12 saying is -- is that I see nothing wrong with booking two 13 years in advance for major groups. And we have a history -- 14 you know, our pricing structure, we -- we can change that. 15 You know, we can change our pricing structure. We can book 16 more dates. But there needs to be a commitment from the 17 Court to -- to fund the employees, what it takes to change 18 over one event to another overnight. It just doesn't 19 happen. It takes manpower. So, am I comfortable with what 20 we're doing? Not necessarily. I think we could do better, 21 and I think we could do it if we had a group of people that 22 are willing to -- to put self-interest aside and try to come 23 up with a policy that is fair to the youth, and primarily 24 the youth, and then the citizens also, the groups, 25 organizations depend on us. 3-28-05 36 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have some comments. 2 Glenn referred to -- was it June last year? 3 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir, June 14th. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We brought it to the 5 Court, and just a bit of confusion. But I'm -- I'm still -- 6 I still think the policy issue that we talked about that day 7 is still the best policy. I believe that, first of all, 8 there are some things I heard here today that -- to disband 9 our next year's calendar. I'm not in favor of doing that. 10 We've made a commitment to some folks, and I think we need 11 to live up to the commitments that we've made and contracted 12 with so far. But I understand that it's almost time to let 13 the year 2007. 14 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: In my mind, really, 16 the only fair way to do this thing is to -- for Glenn and 17 his staff to send out letters to all -- particularly the 18 major users, which there are many, and let -- let everybody 19 know that there is going to be a date that the 2007 schedule 20 is going to be let. And let's say that that date is 21 March 30th, 8 a.m., in his office downstairs. If you want 22 to book something for 2007, you need to be there to set 23 aside the dates that you want. It's a first-come, 24 first-served basis, and it's just like anything else. I 25 mean, you don't -- you don't get a motel room without -- 3-28-05 37 1 without putting up your credit card and making some kind of 2 a deposit or whatever. So, in order to secure the dates 3 that you want, you need to put up some kind of deposit. 4 And, to me, that money is -- is what secures the date for 5 your use. Now, there could be a time frame in there 6 somewhere. If you want to cancel out two months ahead, then 7 you may get a refund. Preferably, for me, I would think 8 that it's a nonrefundable deal. Anytime you schedule it, 9 you pay for it. It's secured for you. You may want -- we 10 may want to put a cap on how many weekends you can use -- 11 six or eight or ten or whatever the number might be. I 12 don't have any idea how that works. But it just seems to me 13 that it should be on a first-come, first-served basis. And 14 if the guy in front of you got the date you want, well, 15 that's just part of life, and as Mr. Henderson was saying, 16 that's business. And, to me, that's a simple and an easy 17 and fair, equitable way to do things. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mr. Eller touched on 19 some things that have been near and dear to my heart about 20 this topic for a long time. I've said it publicly before, 21 and I'll say it publicly now. I think we do a very poor job 22 of running that facility. Very poor job. I'm not being 23 critical of the people who work for Kerr County, but I think 24 we're not knowledgeable in the management of facility 25 business, and therefore we don't stay abreast of what takes 3-28-05 38 1 place to properly run a facility of this nature, make 2 certain that it's a good facility, and to rent it at market 3 rates. Now, Mr. Holekamp made a comment a little bit ago, 4 if the Court wants to fund the take-down or the turn-around 5 from one event to another, then that's okay. That's not 6 okay. Most facilities of this nature have setup and 7 take-down fees associated with the rental of the building. 8 If you want to rent it tomorrow morning following somebody 9 who had it the night before, you're going to pay setup, and 10 the guy who was there before you has to pay take-down. 11 That's the way it works. And that's not the way we have 12 been operating it. 13 I firmly believe that anything -- any time a 14 reservation is made for this facility, it should be 15 accompanied by a check, probably for at least 50 percent of 16 the rental, and it should be nonrefundable. If you want to 17 establish six dates for the year, you better have six 18 dates -- or the amount of money in one check that represents 19 six dates. That's the way it ought to be. It ought to 20 be -- as our friend, Mr. Eller, said, it ought to be run as 21 a business. And if we're incapable, as a court, of running 22 it as a business, I'll bet you we can find people out there 23 in the private sector who are capable of running it as a 24 business. Other counties do that. Other counties make 25 their facilities pay. Other counties get sufficient revenue 3-28-05 39 1 to keep their facilities up-to-date, and they have people 2 clamoring to get in them. People are not clamoring to get 3 into this one, except maybe a few exceptions here, because I 4 know for a fact there is a lost business report that exists 5 that shows what businesses have lost to Kerr County and for 6 what reasons, and the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center 7 sticks out like a sore thumb. There's a lot of reasons for 8 that. So, if we're going to do it, and it's -- I know one 9 of my colleagues and I are both liaisons to this Ag Barn and 10 complex. We ought to set up rules, regulations, and 11 policies that make sense for Kerr County and for that 12 facility, and take it forward from there. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll just make a comment. 14 I pretty much agree with everything Commissioner Baldwin and 15 Commissioner Williams said. I will say, this has to be a 16 fine day to have Mr. Eller and Mr. Williams in such close 17 agreement. I don't think that I ever saw that was going to 18 happen. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is a special 20 occasion, Charlie. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's phenomenal. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Calls for a drink. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You know, I think -- I 24 mean, I agree; I think the policies need to be a lot 25 clearer. We need to get it done; need to try to make money 3-28-05 40 1 out there. I thought we were further along on the policy 2 and on the balancing of that than we are, evidently. The 3 one thing I haven't heard a whole lot from my other two 4 colleagues is the -- the -- I guess the difficult part of 5 making money when you add in two events; one, 4-H. 4-H, the 6 outdoor arena is pretty much off-limits. It's 4-H unless 7 there's -- I guess there's a way to schedule around it, but 8 the problem you start getting into, we schedule events out 9 there two years in advance. All of a sudden, then you're 10 going to have 4-H kids show up two weeks later -- or, you 11 know, before, and it won't be available for them, and all of 12 a sudden, you're going to start in a situation of having -- 13 if you start letting businesses use that outdoor arena, it 14 won't be available for 4-H. It's going to have to -- I 15 mean, it's a waste of good work, so I think we need to take 16 that into account. 17 The other issue, as we're all aware, is stock 18 show. Stock show takes off almost six weeks out of the year 19 that are important dates, that that is -- that the facility 20 is off the air, so to speak, and it just cannot be used for 21 anybody else to speak of. But I think we can work around 22 those. I think, clearly, we should do what we need -- 23 should try to maximize running it as a business during the 24 rest of the -- keeping into account those two events or 25 items. I think we do need a clear policy written down, and 3-28-05 41 1 we need to work on that. And I think it's been a good 2 discussion. Thank you for bringing it to the table, 3 Commissioner Nicholson. And I don't know how you recommend 4 proceeding; if you want to -- well, I'll just leave it to 5 you what the recommendation -- or Commissioner Williams and 6 myself, probably, you know, as liaisons, to come back in the 7 next court with a plan. 8 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I like that idea. I 9 also think this has been a -- a productive discussion. I 10 appreciate the participation of interested parties, and 11 there are a number of different groups that are interested 12 in it. I'd like to see -- talk about it next time, and 13 focus on establishing a team that will come up with a 14 business plan that would incorporate policies and procedures 15 for scheduling and pricing and all that. But even broader 16 than that, following along on what Commissioner Williams 17 said, a plan for optimization of the facility in terms of -- 18 of revenues and in terms of improving the facility so it's 19 more attractive, to attract revenues. I think we've got an 20 opportunity here to really solve this issue -- this problem 21 once and for all, and do it in a -- in a thorough and 22 professional manner. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm willing to proceed on 24 that. I'll get with Commissioner Williams; we can get 25 together with a plan. I would sense we do have a lot of 3-28-05 42 1 people in the audience that are interested. Anyone who, you 2 know, would like to have more input or possibly serve on a 3 committee or help, get your names to Commissioner Williams 4 and myself, and we can, you know, have that under 5 consideration as well. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. It occurs to me the 7 so-called team that Commissioner Nicholson mentioned would 8 be appropriate in addition to the liaisons from the Court, 9 so that you can get the benefit of all different viewpoints 10 and different stakeholder interest. It also occurs to me 11 that -- following up somewhat on what Commissioner Williams 12 said, that we could probably benefit to a large degree as a 13 resource from what other counties or other governmental 14 entities or even private contractors have -- have gone 15 through in these types of facilities about policies and 16 procedures, their contracts and things of that nature. Get 17 the benefit of their experience, learn from their 18 misfortunes, their -- their workout arrangements and so 19 forth. I -- I would like to correct one thing. If I'm not 20 mistaken, we do have a setup fee -- 21 MR. HOLEKAMP: Oh, yes. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: -- that is charged to users of 23 that facility, so we are trying to recoup that. May not be 24 adequate, but that's another thing for this team to take a 25 look at and -- and come up with an overall policy. But I 3-28-05 43 1 think it has been a good discussion to bring this matter to 2 the forefront, and maybe we're on the way to a solution, and 3 that's really what we're all about. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I got one more 5 question. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, sir? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Beat you. You're 8 fixing to let for 2007. When will -- about when will that 9 be? Tonight? Tomorrow? Next week? 10 MR. HOLEKAMP: No. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Couple of weeks? 12 Whenever. How are you going to handle that? I mean, we 13 have -- I don't think that we've given you an answer today. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we -- I think he 15 should wait until after we -- 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I thought it was in 17 August when you do that. No? 18 MR. HOLEKAMP: No. Alice? 19 MS. DAVIDSON: I was never informed of when I 20 should open up for the new year -- the next year. 21 MR. HOLEKAMP: 2007. 22 MS. DAVIDSON: I did 18 months in advance for 23 '06, so that's a year and a half, basically. Well, I was 24 running late, because being that I just started in August, I 25 got out what I had already -- Jamie had already had '06 open 3-28-05 44 1 with names already penciled in who wanted the next year, so 2 I went ahead and got the contracts going for '06 and sent 3 them out, and people have already returned them with 4 deposits. But, you know, '07, I'm not sure. That's why I 5 was hoping you all would help out. When do we open up for 6 '07? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, if you're 18 months out, 8 that brings us to July 1 of this year, so we've -- 9 MS. DAVIDSON: Correct. 10 MR. HOLEKAMP: That's correct. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: -- we've got a little bit of 12 time. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just one comment, 14 following up on Commissioner Letz. Instead of coming back 15 at the next court meeting, I would suggest we come back 16 within a month, because if we deal -- if we have an 17 opportunity to speak with all the interested parties here, 18 we may not be able to fashion a plan in time for two weeks 19 out, but we could certainly do it in time for the second 20 meeting in April. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: For the public to know, I 22 mean, the plan will be that 2007 dates will open up 23 July 1st, is the current plan, and it will not be before 24 that time. 25 MS. HAWKINS: And will they notify us? Send 3-28-05 45 1 out something? Will it be in the paper? Do we just call 2 down there every day and find out where and what time, or 3 what's the procedure? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd say we don't know the 5 procedure right now. We'll have to just follow the -- you 6 know -- 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Part of what we're -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- the course a little 9 bit. I think the press can probably handle some of this as 10 well. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We'll see that you 12 get notified. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I see a number of hands here. 14 Let me see if I can -- Mr. Eller? 15 MR. ELLER: The -- I see the conflict of 4-H 16 being first, and apparently the only conflict I see is 4-H 17 just needs to have first pick in scheduling their stuff. 18 4-H is a very well-organized business, if you will. All 19 right? Why not give them first shot at reservations for the 20 next year, two years, three years, whatever you want to do, 21 and then open it up to the other levels of people. I -- you 22 know, I just don't think you can run a business by saying, 23 well, the 4-H can run up two weeks ahead of time and say, 24 "No, they're out; we're in." But give them first shot at 25 scheduling. 3-28-05 46 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That certainly would be one of 2 the considerations for the team to keep up. 3 MS. HAWKINS: Can I respond to that? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, please be brief, if you 5 could. We're trying to get this wound up. 6 MS. HAWKINS: As a former 4-H horse club 7 adult leader and director for many, many years, as well as 8 being a 4-H horse club member as a child, thanks to 9 Ms. Calcote, she's the one who got me involved in the 4-H 10 horse club. And when I was a child, we did use the facility 11 out there, and it's a wonderful facility. But the kids do 12 get first pick -- from when I was an adult leader, they get 13 first pick. They get the calendar first, and they pick 14 their dates. Just like whenever I contacted the county for 15 the CowHawk Team Roping Production dates, I contacted the 16 4-H adult leaders immediately after to see if there was a 17 conflict. There was one date that was a conflict. I said 18 scratch it; we are not going to do that. So, that's -- 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. I don't think we 20 need any further court action. I think that we know the 21 direction we're going. Anything else from any member of the 22 Court in regard to this? Let's move on to the next item on 23 the agenda. The next item is Number 3, consider and discuss 24 approval of a resolution in support of Mental Health and 25 Mental Retardation Local Authority and Provider Roles. Dr. 3-28-05 47 1 Junkin, if you'll give these folks an opportunity to clear 2 out, maybe things will be -- can't you stay with us awhile 3 longer, Charlie? 4 MR. ELLER: I might get in trouble. 5 MS. HAWKINS: Mr. Williams? I was going to 6 give you my name and address and phone number, if you're 7 looking for a committee for any input, I'd be happy to. 8 Thank you. 9 (Courtroom clearing. Discussion off the record.) 10 - - - - - - - - - - 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, we've got things kind of 12 cleared out. Dr. Junkin, good to have you here today. 13 DR. JUNKIN: Thank you. Sam Junkin, 148 14 Rincon Road, Hunt, Texas. It's my privilege to serve as 15 your representative to the Hill Country Community Mental 16 Health/Mental Retardation Center Board. Just as a reminder 17 to you, that's 19 counties, 22,000 square miles, 420,000 of 18 your fellow citizens. We are the local authority, and we're 19 going to ask you to participate in a resolution in a few 20 moments. It's my privilege to make a brief report on the 21 activities of this local authority. The Hill Country -- and 22 let's just call it Hill Country now -- Hill Country Center 23 has assumed a statewide and national -- even national 24 leadership role. I don't know how well-known this is. 25 Certainly, the County Judge has been involved and does 3-28-05 48 1 understand some of this. Your State Representative does 2 understand it, and you would be amazed, I believe, at the 3 high profile that Hill Country Community Mental 4 Health/Mental Retardation Center has on a statewide basis. 5 We are now training other centers from around the state and 6 the nation. Some of these have the mandate almost of the 7 Legislature of the state of Texas. 8 Your center developed what is called a 9 disease management opportunity. That is, what it has done 10 is taken the old way of doing mental health/mental 11 retardation and simply turned it upside down. One of the 12 things that would be pleasing to your heart is that it is 13 run as a business now. Disease management is based on an 14 attempt to recover as much as possible. It is an attempt to 15 help clients express and meet their own real-life need 16 goals, rather than some higher authority simply saying if 17 you're mentally retarded or you have a -- a mental illness, 18 then this is what happens for you. Our attempt is to get 19 your fellow citizens who have these particular challenges -- 20 to integrate them back into the community, thereby becoming 21 productive citizens. Your law enforcement officers, and 22 particularly your Sheriff, who was here a few moments ago, 23 would understand our work in terms of jail diversion, for so 24 often someone who has one of these particular challenges 25 finds himself at cross purposes with the law, and is simply 3-28-05 49 1 put in jail. We're now working with your law enforcement 2 officers and city law enforcement officers and others to 3 learn how to deal with the people who really have these 4 challenges and do not know how to deal with them, so your 5 law enforcement officers are much more capable now of 6 dealing with those clients who come into -- into their keep. 7 We are dealing with supported housing and 8 employment. It is completely client-centered, trying to 9 look at both the immediate and the long-term goals for 10 these -- these clients. Mostly, I wish to tell you that the 11 new day for Hill Country, and, yea, the new day for our 12 state is efficiency. We have truly taken to heart the fact 13 that any way we do our business must be run efficiently, so 14 we have reduced staff, but more than that, we have reduced 15 the bureaucracy that is so often a part of such an agency as 16 ours. We require staff members to meet high standards in 17 terms of their own direct involvement with clients. What 18 just almost overwhelms me, because I dealt with an 19 institution for a long time, is the amazingly high 20 commitment on the part of the staff, the high morale that 21 that staff has in terms of what is being done. I need to 22 report to you also that we are working closely, and continue 23 to work closely with the Kerrville State Hospital as its 24 focus shifts in terms of what services it will render our 25 state. Linda Werlein is our Executive Director. She sits 3-28-05 50 1 behind me here. This lady has done amazing things for you, 2 and particularly for the clients who are served by the Hill 3 Country center. She and her staff are creative. They are 4 impressive. They are willingness to -- they have a 5 willingness to work hard and an unwillingness to say it 6 cannot be done. 7 You have before you a resolution which, in 8 effect, reaffirms your commitment to the Hill Country 9 M.H.M.R. Center. We invite you to here publicly, if you 10 will, adopt that resolution and reaffirm your relationship 11 to the Hill Country Center. I have one more personal word, 12 and if there are questions, either Mrs. Werlein or I will 13 attempt to answer them. The personal word is this. It is 14 the genius of the American democratic society that the more 15 able accept responsibility -- at least to some measure, 16 accept responsibility for the less able, especially for 17 those whose lives are complicated more than some of us can 18 imagine by mental retardation and mental health challenges. 19 It is impressive that we will seek to offer those services, 20 and whatever medications are indicated. And these 21 sometimes, in this day and time, are highly expensive, but 22 they enable us to get citizens -- your fellow citizens back 23 into the community, integrated into the community, and 24 becoming productive citizens. 25 I stand before you today -- some might think 3-28-05 51 1 that I'm more a client of this organization than I am a 2 leader of it. (Laughter.) But I stand before you to thank 3 you on behalf of those who are served by the Hill Country 4 Community Mental Health/Mental Retardation Center. It was 5 impressive to me that there was quite a bit of discussion 6 about a particular facility of -- of the county, and at the 7 conclusion of that discussion, a whole bunch of my fellow 8 citizens left. In a few minutes, I will leave, because 9 perhaps I do not have an ongoing stake in some of the other 10 issues before you today. I will say of mental health/mental 11 retardation, we have tried to hide it over the years, and 12 you know that very well. We've tried to make it as little 13 public as we could possibly make it. It's probably time 14 that we recognize that God has made all kinds of different 15 people, and some have challenges that we do not have. Some 16 have challenges that we do not really understand, and it's 17 time for us, as the American society, to say yes, we who 18 have more ability, perhaps even more money, are willing to 19 pay, to invest ourselves in the lives of our fellow citizens 20 who have challenges that we cannot imagine. On behalf of 21 that board, I ask you to consider and, if possible, to adopt 22 the resolution that is before you. Thank you. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Any questions for Dr. Junkin 24 from any member of the Court? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I do have one. 3-28-05 52 1 DR. JUNKIN: Yes? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: In your resolution, under 3 the Resolve portion, I guess there's -- the second item 4 says, "Request intense scrutiny of H.B.470 and S.B.194 5 regarding their detrimental impact on rural counties in 6 Texas." Can you briefly summarize what those bills are and 7 what the status are? 8 MS. WERLEIN: Judge, do you want to do that? 9 JUDGE TINLEY: I'd be happy to, Ms. Werlein. 10 I might point out to members of the Court that week before 11 last, it was my privilege to be asked by Ms. Werlein and her 12 board to testify in Austin before the House Human Services 13 Committee in connection with House Bill 470. Essentially, 14 what House Bill 470 would do -- I'm not sure what it'll do 15 today. It's -- 16 MS. WERLEIN: They just rewrote it Friday, so 17 nobody knows. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: But it would -- there's an 19 effort made, primarily in the metropolitan areas, where -- 20 where some private providers see an opportunity to secure 21 state funds -- this is my perception of it. Ms. Werlein's 22 may be slightly different and somewhat more tactful. But in 23 the metropolitan areas, some private providers see an 24 opportunity to get some state money, and they are trying to 25 segregate the -- the administrative aspect from the actual 3-28-05 53 1 provision -- providing of the mental health care services. 2 And if they were to impose that on us, essentially what it 3 would do is it would create an administrative bureaucracy 4 that would be interfaced between the State and between Hill 5 Country Community M.H.M.R. Center, and would actually 6 decrease the amount of funding available to provide directly 7 to the clients. 8 As it stands now, in the Hill Country 9 community and in other rural areas, we administer the funds 10 and we provide the services, so it's kind of a one-stop 11 shopping, as you might say. I would mention that -- that 12 the program that -- that Ms. Werlein has put together here 13 is looked to throughout the state and outside the state as 14 sort of a model program for providing of mental health 15 services on a community basis. Approximately seven or eight 16 years ago, the Legislature says, well, we -- the State needs 17 to back away from it, and we need to have these services 18 provided on a community level. Well, we did it. We're 19 doing a heck of a good job of it. And now, because my 20 perception is that some private providers see the 21 opportunity to -- to make a strong lobbying effort to get 22 some of these state funds, they want to interface an 23 administrative layer between our facility and the State -- 24 our authority and the State, and I don't see it as being in 25 our best interests at all. 3-28-05 54 1 I might also point out, and I mentioned it 2 earlier, that it is because of the efforts of Ms. Werlein 3 and the board at the Community Center, and the collaborative 4 effort with Representative Hilderbran and the staff out at 5 Kerrville State Hospital that we now have the ability to do 6 locally our acute civil commitments here when the State 7 turned that upside down on us. In that regard, I might 8 mention that I had Ms. Pieper run some figures, which she 9 was kind enough to run, and the court costs that we derive 10 from outside counties that we process, hearings that were 11 held here in Kerr County for Kerrville State Hospital, 12 amounted to, in the last calendar year, approximately 13 $180,000. In addition, based upon costs that we had to pay 14 during this interim period of time, the hearings that were 15 held for Kerr County patients, we would have paid out 16 something under $70,000. So, we're looking at a $225,000, 17 $250,000 financial swing by allowing these things to occur 18 here locally, and it's largely because and through the 19 efforts of the Hill Country Community M.H.M.R. Center, 20 Ms. Werlein, the Board, and collaborative efforts of those 21 at Kerrville State Hospital and our Representative that this 22 has come to be. So, I -- I tried to tell the committee in 23 reasonably strong terms that it ain't broke out here, and it 24 don't need no fixing. And I would urge the Court to adopt 25 the resolution as offered by Dr. Junkin. 3-28-05 55 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, I don't have a 2 question of Dr. Junkin, but I would like to publicly thank 3 him for years of service and dedication to Hill Country 4 Community M.H.M.R. We have a deep debt of gratitude to you, 5 Dr. Junkin, for your work, and Ms. -- Ms. Werlein as well. 6 We thank you. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move approval. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 10 adoption of the resolution. Any further question or 11 discussion? 12 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: One comment -- 13 excuse me, Commissioner. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sorry, go ahead. 15 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I heard Dr. Junkin 16 use some terms that I normally don't hear associated with 17 public agencies and governments, and that's "efficiencies" 18 and "cost reductions," and that just warms my heart to hear 19 those kind of words with things the taxpayers pay for. 20 Thank you, sir. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just want to make a 22 comment, that if y'all need to use the outdoor arena, you'll 23 need to talk to Bill Williams. (Laughter.) 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We'll see if we can 25 work you in. 3-28-05 56 1 MS. WERLEIN: Thank you. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you for your efforts, 3 and thank you for the privilege of allowing me to speak on 4 behalf of Kerr County. And, by the way, several other 5 county judges authorized me to speak on behalf of their 6 counties that are within the community. 7 MS. WERLEIN: And I would like to say -- 8 excuse me, Judge. I would like to say that there were 9 probably 50 people testifying to the subcommittee on Health 10 and Human Services under appropriations, and Judge Tinley 11 was the only one of maybe three that -- number one, every 12 committee member listened to what he had to say as he 13 outlined his points, and secondly, he was the only one that 14 they asked questions of. So, when they ask questions, you 15 know they're listening. So, thank you, Judge. We really 16 appreciate it. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: It was my privilege. Thank 18 you. 19 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Good work. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 21 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 22 your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 3-28-05 57 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 2 DR. JUNKIN: Thank you. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Do we want to -- why don't we 4 take about a 15-minute break here? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Talked me into it. 6 (Recess taken from 10:19 a.m. to 10:35 a.m.) 7 - - - - - - - - - - 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to 9 order, if we could, please, and next item on the agenda is 10 to consider and discuss a letter to the City of Kerrville 11 City Manager requesting approximately 8 to 10 trees from the 12 City Farm to be planted around the outside perimeter of the 13 Kerr County Courthouse parking. Mr. Holekamp? 14 MR. HOLEKAMP: Mm-hmm. This -- this came up 15 from a discussion with -- Commissioner Williams had brought 16 it to my attention, that this might be something that Kerr 17 County would want to participate in. At the City Farm, they 18 have some -- some oak trees. I don't know the particular 19 variety, but they were grown many, many years ago. There's 20 all sizes, anywhere from 3, 4 inches, 6-inch trees that are 21 available -- possibly available for us if we do a letter to 22 the City Manager. My thoughts on this -- and I know 23 Commissioner Letz has voiced his feelings about trees in the 24 courthouse yard on several occasions. Over on the Sidney 25 Baker side and on the Main Street side, in my opinion, 3-28-05 58 1 there's a need for some young trees that may grow up with 2 this -- with the community. The hackberries have died, two 3 or three of them. We still got one to move, but we -- the 4 power lines are an issue for me, so I may need to have 5 someone professionally take that tree down. But the -- as 6 y'all know, Sidney Baker is being re -- there's new gas 7 lines going in. They're going to do reconstruction. I 8 would really like -- and the number of trees, this was just 9 a number, 8 to 10. I mean, it could be 5 or 6. I don't 10 want them real close together. But I really think that our 11 courthouse could utilize some on that outer perimeter only, 12 none in the yard itself, so I was just going to ask 13 permission to ask for some. And they would have to be 14 professionally planted, so my budget probably wouldn't 15 handle it this year, but possibly in October, we could maybe 16 do it, or this winter when they're dormant. We don't have 17 the -- the equipment to plant those trees that are 4 to 18 6 inches in size. We just -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm all for it. I 20 don't know about 10 or 12 or whatever the number is. 21 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yeah. Eight or ten I think is 22 what I -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I can't see -- I don't 24 know. Maybe. If you take out those dadgum worthless 25 hackberry. Take out all the cedar, as far as I'm concerned. 3-28-05 59 1 I mean, they're worthless. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're talking about 3 the Sidney Baker side and the Main Street side? 4 MR. HOLEKAMP: Yes, sir. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That side. How about 6 on the Jefferson Street side? 7 MR. HOLEKAMP: There's some -- quite a few 8 water line issues there on that side. I really have to look 9 at that one prior to doing that because of that barrier 10 wall, those roots. I kind of question whether that would be 11 a good situation. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have no problem with 13 the letter going to the City to get on the list; however, 14 between now and next October, I really want to go back to a 15 little bit more of a plan. I don't want trees just pushed 16 -- put in the ground anywhere. I think we also need to look 17 at the type of trees, and the understanding as to what some 18 of those large trees are -- the maintenance effort's going 19 to take the first couple of years. I'm not a big fan of 20 transplanting trees that size. I think you have a high 21 die-off rate. I think -- and they are going to have to be 22 watered during our normal summer. Even if you plant them in 23 October, they'll have to be watered the following summer 24 almost every day to keep them alive. You have a high 25 die-off, I think, even when you plant them. I think they 3-28-05 60 1 found that out at the River Star; about half of those trees 2 they already pulled out. It depends on the variety. Live 3 oaks are very, very hardy. I do think -- I'm very 4 supportive of planting trees round the perimeter of the 5 courthouse square. As an alternative to that, I would 6 suspect that you probably could get those trees donated, and 7 in a smaller size. 8 MR. HOLEKAMP: Oh, there's so many -- 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I know these are donated. 10 MR. HOLEKAMP: They do have smaller size than 11 this. I just didn't know, you know, what was available as 12 far as -- 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But even if you get other 14 varieties -- I don't know what they have out at the City 15 Farm, but I'll be glad to work with you on that, Glenn. 16 MR. HOLEKAMP: I'd be more than welcome to 17 have him. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He's the right guy to 19 work with you. 20 MR. HOLEKAMP: Well, in fact, if you want to 21 go look at some of the trees, I think they gave me the 22 combination to the gate to go look at them. So, let me 23 know, and I'll be glad to -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. But I'll make -- 25 I'll be glad to make a motion to authorize the Maintenance 3-28-05 61 1 Director to send a letter to the City requesting some trees 2 from the tree farm next fall. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second -- third. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 6 approval of the agenda item. Any questions or discussion? 7 All in favor of that motion, signify by raising your right 8 hand. 9 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 11 (No response.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We're 13 going to take an item out of order here. Actually, we're 14 going to take two of them out of order because of some 15 scheduling conflicts we need to contend with. We're going 16 to go to Item 18, and that item is resolution authorizing 17 the acceptance of donation of approximately 3.025 acres of 18 property from Kerrville Economic Development Foundation. 19 Who wants to run with this? 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well -- 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's easy enough. 23 The City worked with Mooney Aircraft in fashioning a grant 24 to Texas Capital Fund, I believe. Am I correct, Ilse? 25 MS. BAILEY: Yes, a loan from the Capital 3-28-05 62 1 Fund. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: A loan from Texas 3 Capital Fund for, I believe, three-quarters of a million 4 dollars, which would assist Mooney in upgrading their 5 buildings and so forth. As a condition of that -- well, 6 they discovered that -- part of what they wanted to do was 7 improving the parking lot, and in the process they 8 discovered that they didn't own that ground underneath the 9 parking lot. And the State would require that those dollars 10 be spent, that that be incorporated in the broad scheme of 11 things out there. So, to make a long story short, that 12 property, 3.025 acres, is owned by the Kerrville Economic 13 Development Foundation. They acquired it years and years 14 ago, and so a trade or swap came about. K.E.D.F. was 15 willing to swap the property with Mooney for some other 16 property that Mooney itself owned which was contiguous to 17 what K.E.D.F. also owned, and so they fashioned a swap of 18 land. Now, what we're required to do is to accept the 19 donation of this land, as the City Council has done. It 20 then gets incorporated into the main of the body of land 21 upon which Kerrville-Kerr County Airport is located, and all 22 of its ancillary facilities, so that's what this is all 23 about. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're accepting a half 25 interest and the City is accepting a half interest. 3-28-05 63 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Exactly. 2 MS. BAILEY: Yes. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, I would move 4 adoption of the resolution -- I guess it's a resolution, 5 Ilse? Yeah, move adoption of the resolution, that the Court 6 hereby accepts on behalf of Kerr County the 3.025 acres of 7 property from Kerrville Economic Development Foundation. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. I 10 assume that includes authorization -- 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And authorize -- 12 JUDGE TINLEY: -- for me to sign any 13 documents in connection with that -- 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, let's see. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: -- that transaction? There's 16 a closing statement, I see here. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That resolution -- 18 was it a resolution that everybody signs? Yes, it is, 19 Judge. Resolution everybody signs. And authorize you to 20 sign the necessary legal documents accepting the property. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Any further 22 question or discussion on the motion? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The closing costs is 24 $661? Is that the total? We pay half of that, or is that 25 our share? 3-28-05 64 1 MS. BAILEY: No, that's the total closing 2 costs, and that will come out of the airport budget, of 3 which you pay half. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. Okay. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 6 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 7 your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll 12 move to Item 19, consider, discuss, and take appropriate 13 action to approve the Airport Code, which includes Rules and 14 Regulations and Minimum Operating Standards. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Commissioner Letz, do 16 you want to run with that one? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is basically the -- 18 finalizing what we talked about at our last meeting, the 19 Airport Code, whatever they call -- well, it's Airport Code 20 and Operating Standards -- Minimum Operating Standards. I 21 believe the City -- based on the backup from Ilse Bailey, is 22 that the City has made a few changes that accommodated some 23 of the concerns the Judge had about micromanagement and all. 24 I'll let her explain those changes. 25 MS. BAILEY: Yes, sir. Based on Judge 3-28-05 65 1 Tinley's comments at your last meeting about the 2 micromanagement, what we did is we drafted some proposed 3 amendments to Article 5, which is the one-page section that 4 deals with how the rules get made. The City Council did 5 adopt the Code with these suggested changes, which I've 6 provided also to you all. Essentially, what the changes 7 are, there are four minor changes -- four or five, and what 8 they essentially do is approve this Code, and then authorize 9 other changes to be made in the Code by the board. And, 10 instead of each change having to come back to the governing 11 bodies, the governing bodies -- they go automatically into 12 effect unless the governing bodies say we want to review 13 that. That gives us the opportunity, then, to go back and 14 make minor nonsubstantive changes without having to go 15 through this multiple governing body process. So, if you 16 make the -- the recommendation to approve it with those 17 changes, then the City and the County will have approved the 18 same code, and it will need to go back to the Airport Board 19 to approve it with those changes. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: My question, counsel, 21 is 5.01 is underlined in blue. That's the change? 22 MS. BAILEY: That's the added part. And then 23 the part over on the side is anything that's deleted. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. The red line 25 is deleted under Section A, Powers of Authority? 3-28-05 66 1 MS. BAILEY: The only changes that have been 2 suggested and approved by the Council are the ones on Page 3 47. The rest of them -- 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't think I have 5 what you're looking at. 6 MS. BAILEY: Oh. This should have come 7 across in an e-mail. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. Okay, fine. 9 Thank you. 10 MS. BAILEY: Does that make sense? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 13 discussion? Do we even have a motion? Don't have a motion 14 yet. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move approval of the 16 Airport Code -- Airport Code and the Rules and Regulations 17 and Minimum -- can't speak -- Minimum Operating Standards as 18 amended today. 19 MS. BAILEY: Thank you. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 22 approval. Any question or discussion? All in favor of that 23 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3-28-05 67 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Thank 3 you, Ms. Bailey. 4 MS. BAILEY: Thank you, gentlemen. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Now we can get back to where 6 we were. We appreciate your patience, Mr. Odom. That 7 brings us to Item 5, consider list of road name changes, and 8 set a public hearing for the same. 9 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. I would -- it's the 10 intention of the Commissioners Court to consider road 11 changes in various locations in Kerr County, and we ask that 12 a public hearing be held May the 9th at 10 o'clock in the 13 Commissioners Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse. That'll 14 be -- for your information, this -- the notice will go out 15 as such as presented to you, but when I present it to the 16 Court, I'll have two different agenda items for that. For 17 your information, the revised -- the road classification at 18 Big Sky Ranch from public to private, we'll put that on a 19 separate order, so when this is done, we can have a separate 20 court order for the records. We discussed that last time, I 21 believe, in the court. Also, the regulatory signs, the 22 abandon and vacate and name changes as I have here will be 23 on a different agenda item. I have regulatory signs from 24 Hunt River Road, no parking. That is from the river to 1340 25 for about 100 feet on that southwest corner. That's where 3-28-05 68 1 we're proposing to put the "No parking." Bear Creek Road 2 South, 35 mile-an-hour speed zone. We've had some 3 complaints there; we've looked at it, Freedom Trail to 4 Sheppard Rees. Peterson Farm Road is 45 miles an hour. 5 That'll be from 27 to the city limits, which is around 6 Mooney there, that creek crossing, which the City also has a 7 45 mile-an-hour. And we ran that check, and that 45 is more 8 persistent in there, a slower speed than what we're showing 9 up front there, but 45 is where we think it ought to be for 10 that school area in there, and they're having problems. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That would be from 12 the end of the school zone, right? 13 MR. ODOM: It'll be from 27 -- you're right 14 there. That should be, but there's a question there who has 15 authority. But it should be the City's responsibility at 16 the school, but we're saying we're going to put one up front 17 at this point from 27 there, as you turn in there. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 19 MR. ODOM: And go -- takes you both ways. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: My recollection is 21 that we approved the school zone, so we established the 22 school zone. 23 MR. ODOM: You do have a school zone. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I know. We 25 established that. 3-28-05 69 1 MR. ODOM: Flashing lights and all right 2 there. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, right. 4 MR. ODOM: Right -- you're right. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This won't impact the 6 school -- the school zone. This is -- 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm saying this is on 8 either end of it, before you get to it and after it. That's 9 all I'm asking. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 11 MR. ODOM: Right. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 13 MR. ODOM: And then we have the abandon, 14 vacate, and discontinue from Kerr County maintenance 15 1,445 feet of Ox Hollow Road South. Gentleman has all this 16 land, and I'll be more than happy to give up 1,400 feet of 17 road there, and we will present that -- that will be like we 18 have in the past, with a cul-de-sac, and contingent on that. 19 The Hurt-Priour Ranch Road, also known as Henry Priour Ranch 20 Road West, that is something that's been on the agenda. We 21 told the Commissioner that we'd make the decision, and we 22 say that we abandon that. We'll have data on that when we 23 -- for the agenda item, but that is another one. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And that's the entire 25 -- that entire road? 3-28-05 70 1 MR. ODOM: This entire road. That serves two 2 people. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 4 MR. ODOM: And should -- and they asked in 5 1999 to abandon that. That's when we had the County -- the 6 State out there, and they -- they ran the individual off, 7 confronted them and told them that it was private, and asked 8 us to abandon it. We abandoned it. Now they're wanting us 9 to maintain it. And, basically, it would be probably a 10 little bit over 2 and a half-mile driveway, and we don't 11 think the taxpayers should do that. 12 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah. I -- I'd like 13 to hear from the County Attorney on whether or not it's 14 necessary to, you know, formally abandon it when we, in 15 fact, abandoned it back in 1999. I want to abandon the 16 road. I'm just not sure that it -- it requires taking 17 formal action now. Probably does. I just want to be 18 cautious about it. 19 MR. EMERSON: I think the prudent thing to do 20 would be to go ahead and follow the procedures for formal 21 abandonment. 22 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay. 23 MR. ODOM: And then I have name changes from 24 Cedar Drive West to West Cedar Drive West and East Cedar 25 Drive West. 9-1-1 is having a problem addressing. This 3-28-05 71 1 was -- previously it was like this; then it was changed back 2 to Cedar Drive West, and now 9-1-1 is requesting that we 3 change it back for addressing. They're having a difficult 4 time. So, that's another one. East Ridgeway be changed to 5 High Drive. That's off Michon right there. 6 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: You come off Goat 7 Creek Road, and West Cedar Drive West goes right and it goes 8 left, so if you're in an emergency vehicle, you don't know 9 what to do. 10 MR. ODOM: Which way to go. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And it's kind of the 12 same thing with East Ridgeway and High Drive South. 13 MR. ODOM: It's -- 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Kind of -- same kind 15 of deal. Just a cleanup. 16 MR. ODOM: Cleanup. Makes it better. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Be easier -- I don't want 18 to put a fly in the ointment, but on yours, can't you change 19 one of the roads? 20 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Change it 21 completely? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, that's very 23 confusing to me, West Cedar Drive West and East Cedar Drive 24 West. That's just -- I mean, that's -- seems to me it's 25 easier to have Cedar Drive and anything else. 3-28-05 72 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm glad Letz is not 2 driving the ambulances tonight. 3 MR. ODOM: Depends which way you come up. 4 You can either go right/east or left/west. The other way 5 might be confusing. Okay? We're doing what was requested. 6 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Whatever we do, 7 we'll draw some interest from people that live there. I 8 think this is the most palatable approach to solve the 9 problem. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: And acceptable with the 9-1-1 11 emergency service. 12 MR. ODOM: That's right. 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I may have 14 understated that a little bit. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: East Cedar Drive 16 West. That blows my mind. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If that's what they want. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Right now, you're asking for a 19 public hearing? 20 MR. ODOM: Asking for a public hearing. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 23 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 25 public hearing on these matters for May 9th, 2005, at 3-28-05 73 1 10 a.m. Any further question or discussion? All in favor 2 of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 5 (No response.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Next 7 item, Number 6, is consider the final replat of Y.O. 8 Ranchlands, Tract 31, located in Precinct 4. 9 MR. ODOM: Judge, let me hand that to you. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 11 MR. ODOM: To give the Court direction. This 12 is a unique situation. From data that we have -- 13 Mr. Voelkel always brings some unique opportunities here. 14 In 1990, this was brought before the Court for final plat. 15 It was -- Court Order 19941 was given to accept that, but 16 the County Clerk had a problem with the way that the 17 attachment -- with the notarized attachment. In Mexico, 18 they do not allow you to sign original documents, so what 19 was sent to us, some landowners -- two landowners; one lived 20 in Mexico -- did what was by Mexico's law, sent it to us, 21 and Pat Dye at the time said that she could not record it 22 that way. Then in 1995, that individual came in from Mexico 23 and signed it. I don't know why that was not done at that 24 time, but it -- at this point, the owners decided that they 25 would desire to have it -- final plat, have it platted. And 3-28-05 74 1 I bring it before the Court to recognize that. All I need 2 is the Judge's signature. It was okayed by the Court in 3 1990. 4 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I think this is just 5 cleaning up some -- technically, cleaning up some old 6 business. It's been replatted. Nothing's changing. It was 7 just -- 8 MR. ODOM: Hasn't changed. Nothing's changed 9 out there. This is in the Y.O. Ranchlands out there in 10 Precinct 4. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: When did he sign? '95? 12 MR. ODOM: 1995. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: '95. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's just 10 years 15 ago. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh, yeah. I mean, I'm 17 just thinking -- I'm wondering if we have to do a -- 18 technically, a variance, because the -- I think we have a 19 one-year time period to -- for a plat, to get it signed -- 20 of record. And we just grant a variance and get it 21 approved. I think it needs to be approved. I'm just 22 wondering if we need to do a variance or not. 23 MR. ODOM: Well, he did sign it by Mexico's 24 law, so -- of course, this is Texas, but -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I know, but, I mean, I 3-28-05 75 1 don't want to do it wrong. That's all I'm saying. If we 2 have to do a variance, do a variance. If you don't, just do 3 it. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: What you're saying is, in a 5 motion to permit it, just state it as being -- authorizing a 6 variance. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The variance from 9 what? The one-year -- 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The time period to get it 11 filed. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's just do that, 13 and we've covered all the bases. 14 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Let me try, see if 15 it works. I move we approve the final replat of Y.O. 16 Ranchlands, Lot 31 in Precinct 4, and grant a variance of 17 the one-year time requirement for filing with the County 18 Clerk. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. Perfect. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 21 approval. Any question or discussion? All in favor of the 22 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 3-28-05 76 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. The 2 next item on the agenda is Number 7, is consider awarding 3 bids for cold mix, black base, trap rock aggregate, asphalt 4 emulsion oil, corrugated metal pipe, and equipment by the 5 hour with operator. 6 MR. ODOM: I hope that Kathy -- did you give 7 this -- I apologize; we did have it done. It was -- Truby 8 forgot to put it in the package when we sent it up. But it 9 is our recommendation that we accept corrugated metal pipe 10 of Wilson Culverts, emulsion oils from Ergon, cold mix and 11 black base from Vulcan Materials, as well as trap rock. And 12 the equipment by-the-hour, we recommend using Schwarz as the 13 first contractor and the others as backup when he's not 14 available or we need equipment that he does not have. That 15 sometimes arises that his equipment's too small for a 16 specific project. Also, we did -- for everybody, we did 17 send out to everybody we had last year, and which the 18 previous year we had a lot of people. And why we didn't get 19 a response, I -- we just don't know, but we sent out for 20 everyone. And also, in our base, we would ask the Court 21 since we did not receive any bids from local vendors, with 22 the exception of one which was late and we did not accept, 23 that you would -- that the Court would allow the department 24 to purchase base at the closest source to the job site. And 25 part of that reasoning is because of transportation costs, 3-28-05 77 1 fuel costs, and it makes that price cheaper. We have done 2 that in the past, to recognize one when we can do that. 3 But -- and in this situation, everyone received it. Why 4 they didn't, I don't know, but we would ask the Court's 5 permission. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What you're talking 7 about now is, like, base material? 8 MR. ODOM: Just base material. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Caliche and that type 10 of thing? 11 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Absolutely. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval of the 14 recommended bid awards. 15 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to 17 award the bids as recommended by the Road and Bridge 18 Administrator. Any question or discussion on the motion? 19 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 20 hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. The 25 next item is to consider road name changes for privately 3-28-05 78 1 maintained roads in accordance with 9-1-1 guidelines. 2 MR. ODOM: I apologize for Ms. Hardin; she is 3 not feeling well, and she asked me to take over. So, if 4 there's any questions, I'll try to answer, but -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought you were in 6 charge. 7 MR. ODOM: Sometimes. Depends what day of 8 the week. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Today's Monday. 10 MR. ODOM: Today's Monday. I believe that 11 there's six name changes, five from Precinct 4 and one from 12 Precinct 2. The existing road name is Sarah Saphronia to 13 Sarita Saphronia up in Shelton Ranch. Linda Lou is being 14 changed to the Russell Ranch Road off Elm Pass II. And then 15 county names, which were probably -- I don't know if that's 16 Real or whether that's Kimble County out there, but 8015, 17 8014, 8011, and 8010 are being changed to the Y.O. Adventure 18 Camp Road, Schreiner Road, Tortilla Flats, and Airstrip 19 Road, all in Commissioner Nicholson's precinct. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I love Tortilla 21 Flats. 22 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: My question is, the 23 reason for changing Sarah Saphronia to Sarita Saphronia. 24 Was that a typo earlier? 25 MR. ODOM: I'm not quite sure. I -- 3-28-05 79 1 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: There's no 2 explanation. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I remember when we 4 first did it, and it had something to do with family names. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: These are family 7 names. And it just blows me away that suddenly they're 8 changing the first name. 9 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Are Sarah and Sarita 10 taking turns? 11 MR. ODOM: Maybe it's a granddaughter now. I 12 don't know. These are all private roads out there, so I'm 13 just not -- I don't have the background on that. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is Mrs. Bobby 15 Shelton's name. That's who it is. She just wants it the 16 way she wants it. 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I move to approve. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to 21 approve the agenda item. Any questions or discussion? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Question. And I'm sure 23 they've all gone through 9-1-1, 'cause they're on the 24 backup, so I know we have geo-regions, but I'm still -- I'm 25 kind of -- I thought the intent was not to use duplicate 3-28-05 80 1 names if possible. I mean, and using the name "Schreiner" 2 out there is clearly -- I mean, there's a Schreiner Street 3 in Kerrville. I just -- I guess more of -- my question is 4 probably more to 9-1-1 than anyone else, but it seems to me 5 that we were supposed to quit doing this, and we're 6 continuing to do it. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good point. 8 MR. ODOM: It's a good point. I saw that 9 myself. The only thing is, maybe the geo grid might have 10 been different, that they accepted that "Northwest" on it, 11 because it will show "Schreiner Road Northwest." 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 13 MR. ODOM: That's what I'm thinking that 14 they've done. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree with that. It's 16 just that if, you know, in an emergency situation, someone 17 has a car wreck, they see the street sign and it says 18 Schreiner, they're going to say Schreiner, and we have that 19 duplicate problem that we've been trying to get rid of for 20 the last number of years. But I'll talk to Mr. Amerine 21 about that. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 23 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by rising 24 your right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 3-28-05 81 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Next 4 item is Number 9, to consider and discuss approval of a 5 proclamation declaring April 2005 Child Abuse Prevention 6 Month in Kerr County. Ms. Mitchell? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I just wanted 8 to make a comment, that this is another part of our Child 9 Welfare Board in action. They've been working very hard 10 doing all kinds of things. There's two issues on our agenda 11 today dealing with that particular group, and Kathy's been 12 kind enough to steer this proclamation through that group 13 and then in to you, so I'm going to turn it over to Kathy 14 Mitchell, which she now has the board member hat on. 15 MS. MITCHELL: Kathy Mitchell, 411 Peterson 16 Drive. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can we take away from 18 her salary while she's here? She's no longer our secretary 19 or administrative assistant; she's now a board member. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: You can do that. I don't 21 think I want to try it. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't think I -- I 23 was just wondering, 'cause I'm certainly not interested in 24 doing something like that. (Laughter.) 25 MS. MITCHELL: Thank you, gentlemen. April 3-28-05 82 1 is Child Abuse Awareness Month. And, yes, as in all 2 communities all over the nation, Kerr County has abused 3 children also. The Kerr County Child Welfare Board 4 recognizes and joins the efforts of local agencies, the 5 Child Protective Services, CASA, Kids Advocacy Place, 6 K'Star, Hill Country Crisis Council and others, who day-in 7 and day-out provide counseling, support, safe shelter, and 8 guidance through the legal system to help the most 9 vulnerable members of our community, children who are 10 neglected, are physically, emotionally, or sexually abused. 11 The Child Welfare Board urges our community to join in a 12 national effort to raise awareness of child abuse throughout 13 the month of April. In association with the Department of 14 Family and Protective Services, the Child Welfare Board asks 15 the Commissioners Court to join their efforts to raise 16 awareness about child abuse in Kerr County by declaring 17 April Child Abuse Prevention Month in Kerr County. Thank 18 you. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Don't we get any cute 20 little ribbons? 21 MS. MITCHELL: Yes, you do, and thanks to 22 CASA. They provided us with some blue ribbons for each of 23 you to be able to wear in the month of April. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We can't wear them 25 now? 3-28-05 83 1 MS. MITCHELL: You can wear them now. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I move for 3 approval. And, Kathy, thank you so much for doing -- 4 MS. MITCHELL: Thank you. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- the work that 6 you're doing. I move for approval of this proclamation 7 declaring the month of April to be Child Abuse Prevention 8 Month in Kerr County. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 11 approval. Any question or discussion? All in favor of that 12 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll 17 move to the next agenda item, that being Number 10, consider 18 and discuss appointing Amber Freeman and Pam Peter to the 19 Kerr County Child Welfare Board. I -- is that a misspell? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What? 21 JUDGE TINLEY: We got Pam Traver here. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Pam Traver is on the 23 agenda, slash me. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I'll let you run with 25 it, Commissioner. 3-28-05 84 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I'm not going to 2 run very far with it, because I don't -- I don't know either 3 one of these ladies, and there's no backup in here. And one 4 of the requirements to serve on this board is to do a 5 criminal background check, and I'm just -- I just think that 6 it would be wise on our part -- I mean, I'm sure that these 7 are good people, and I'm sure Pam knows what's she's doing, 8 but just -- I'm not willing to -- to approve it at this 9 time. We can just kick it back and let it come back the 10 next time with -- let me present it. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: I think the County Attorney 12 has -- 13 MR. EMERSON: I was going to say, I have 14 information on one of the individuals. I don't know if it 15 will benefit you or not. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, it would. 17 MR. EMERSON: Amber Freeman is a registered 18 nurse. She's head of the K.I.S.D.'s Head Start program, and 19 I know her through the medical community that way. She's an 20 outstanding individual, very involved with children. Her 21 husband's a coach for the high school. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mike. That's Mike 23 Freeman's wife. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make a quick 25 comment. This is on the agenda because when everyone was 3-28-05 85 1 out playing around in west Texas, someone had to hold the 2 fort down around here, and I made the decision -- 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Excuse me? Playing 4 around in west Texas? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I told Kathy this 6 should go on the agenda. We weren't sure if Pam had talked 7 to Buster or not. I thought she had. And there's no 8 problem; I'll pull this. I put it on the agenda and put his 9 name on it, 'cause -- but we can easily put -- I don't have 10 any problem with that. I agree with Buster. He's not 11 talked to Pam about it; we'll do it next time. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: That's why you weren't going 13 to run very far with it, right? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Right. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: With respect to laying 17 around west Texas, I have some numbers here. When the 18 convention comes here for approximately five days, there 19 will be between $250,000 and $275,000 spent in Kerrville by 20 that group. Pretty good chunk of money. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There's no action. It 23 will come back. 24 MS. MITCHELL: Commissioner? My 25 understanding also from Pam Traver is that the other lady, 3-28-05 86 1 Pam Peter, is also with the Head Start program. She -- Pam 2 is at a Commissioners Court meeting in Gillespie County this 3 morning. She said she was going to try to make it to be 4 able to explain a little bit more, but apparently she 5 didn't. But -- 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, the -- really, 7 the only question -- I don't question that these two people 8 are very qualified folks, but when we started this process 9 and we -- we named -- we appointed some from this table, we 10 had to stop that process and do criminal background checks 11 on everybody, and that's what I'd like to know. Are we -- 12 has that been done on these people? Or are we going to 13 appoint people and then do the -- go through that process? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just -- let's hold off on 15 it till next time. I'm sorry. I think it's better to -- my 16 personal feeling is, on any appointment, if there's some 17 criteria, they have to meet the criteria before you appoint 18 them. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You can tell Pam that 20 Jon Letz said that. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. If there's no further 22 activity on that one, we'll move on to the next agenda item, 23 Number 11, Joint Community Service Program Proposal. 24 Ms. Harris. 25 MS. HARRIS: Yes. It's on the agenda for one 3-28-05 87 1 of my counselors, Jennifer Kolb, to make this presentation. 2 She didn't make it back from vacation in time to do this. 3 Her plane did not land when she thought it was going to 4 land, so she called me this morning at the airport, so I'm 5 doing this in her stead. I, too, was in west Texas playing 6 last week, so Ms. Kolb submitted this for the agenda, and I 7 believe she did provide you with the backup documentation, 8 so you do have a copy. What I'm asking the Court, upon 9 reviewing the documentation, that -- that you approve the 10 program so we can proceed in -- in getting all of our ducks 11 in a row. She left a note before she went on vacation. She 12 says that she met with Mr. Dan Edwards, who takes charge of 13 the adult probationers. She did visit with him and -- and 14 Kevin on the 22nd, and that Dan is having a master gardener 15 come out on the 24th to locate the prime area for the 16 garden. Once done, Dan will pick the date for his 17 probationers to come out and clear the land. Dan has access 18 to the equipment to do that. Once cleared, Wally, who is 19 our maintenance person, can get a tractor to plow the dirt, 20 and he's going to have that tractor donated from the Cowboy 21 Church; they're going to donate the tractor. Then 22 Mr. Holekamp and the Ag Extension, they have the dirt. 23 Because you got to have fill dirt, so they've got the dirt. 24 MR. STANTON: They've got a portion of the 25 dirt. 3-28-05 88 1 MS. HARRIS: Portion of the dirt. You talked 2 with your guy -- 3 MR. STANTON: We're still going to have to 4 get some fill dirt from somewhere. There's a portion of it, 5 but we're going to get most of the dirt from the -- the dirt 6 that was pulled out of the Ag Barn and those kind of things. 7 MS. HARRIS: It says she explained the 8 urgency to Dan, because if we're going to have a garden, we 9 need to get certain things planted. We've already missed 10 potatoes and carrots and peas; we've already missed that, so 11 we've got to get the other stuff planted. Anyway, and he 12 said that he was aware of that. Okay. Then, on the fun 13 run, she met with Mindy -- 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Wendele. 15 MS. HARRIS: Thank you. Didn't know how to 16 spell her -- how to say her name. At the Main Street office 17 to organize the 5-K. She said we have a route through 18 downtown Kerrville, and the dates are June the 4th or June 19 the 18th to choose from. We'll have a date set sometime 20 this week, and says we want Judge Tinley to fire the 21 starting line trigger. That's the note she left. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: You'd put a gun in my hands? 23 MS. HARRIS: But the gun -- we'll put blanks 24 in it. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: May have to rethink 3-28-05 89 1 that part. 2 MS. HARRIS: But the -- the community 3 services is a collaborative effort between the Kerr County 4 Juvenile Facility, our kids that reach their last level -- 5 the kids that are in freshman orientation, freshman, 6 sophomore, and junior level will not participate. Only the 7 kids that are in their last 56 days at the facility, the 8 senior level kids, would be able to participate in any of 9 this. And then Kevin's probation kids, and then, of course, 10 the adult probation department would be -- their 11 participation is clearing the land for us. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me ask a question, if I 13 might, Ms. Harris. 14 MS. HARRIS: Sure. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- the chief probation 16 officers from other jurisdictions whose children we have in 17 our program, our post-adjudication programs here, what has 18 been their reaction to this proposal? 19 MS. HARRIS: Their reaction has been very 20 positive, because most of the kids, it's in their court 21 order that they have to perform so many hours of community 22 service, and there is nothing at the facility by which that 23 they could get credit for any community service as it 24 stands. When I was the administrator at Roy K. Robb, 25 because of where the kitchen was located in that facility, 3-28-05 90 1 the kids were able to work in the kitchen washing dishes, 2 things of that nature. They were not allowed to cook, but 3 wash dishes and -- and clean up the kitchen and mop the 4 eating area, and they received community service hours. 5 Well, probation officers really do appreciate it if the kids 6 can work off some of their community service hours while 7 they're with us; therefore, they don't have to tend to that 8 problem whenever the kid gets back to the home county. Plus 9 it's beneficial -- yes, granted, the community service is 10 court-ordered in their home county, but Kerr County would 11 get the benefit of them -- of them serving their community 12 service while they're with us. And so the response from 13 probation officers is very positive for them to be able to 14 do that. It has to be in their court order, though, in 15 order for them to participate in this, that they have 16 community service hours to serve. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If they don't have 18 some -- if they don't have community service -- 19 MS. HARRIS: If they don't have community 20 service hours to serve, they don't participate. Only those 21 kiddoes that have community service hours in their court 22 order. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there -- is there a 24 reason for that? 25 MS. HARRIS: It's the individual judge that 3-28-05 91 1 adjudicates the juveniles. Sometimes they assess community 2 service hours to the court order. Sometimes they don't. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess, really, my 4 question, I guess, is -- I mean, it's fine if they can get 5 community service credit for this, but to me, this is a 6 beneficial -- it would be beneficial for any juvenile, when 7 they reach a certain level, before they go back home, to -- 8 these are all very positive things and teach giving back to 9 the community, doing something positive -- 10 MS. HARRIS: I agree. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- with their lives. And 12 I don't -- I mean, to me, they should be able to do this 13 whether they've got community service credit or not. 14 MS. HARRIS: What we could do -- we already 15 have to solicit the permission of the probation officer to 16 allow those senior level kids to go out on field trips or 17 furloughs. What we could do is, we could get permission for 18 -- from the probation officer, and even get an addendum to 19 the court order, if we need to, for them to participate in 20 this program if they don't have community service hours. 21 'Cause I thoroughly agree with you; it would be beneficial 22 for those kids. 23 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I've got a couple 24 questions -- 25 MS. HARRIS: Sure. 3-28-05 92 1 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: -- Ms. Harris. A 2 couple times in here, it uses a term I'm not familiar with, 3 "community service gene." 4 MS. HARRIS: Community service -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: G-e-n-e. 6 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Bottom paragraph, 7 Page 1. 8 MS. HARRIS: Bottom paragraph, Page 1. 9 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: "Not only will a 10 stronger community service gene..." What does that mean? 11 MS. HARRIS: I wouldn't have the slightest 12 idea, sir. I think it's a typo. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's a typo. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's in here a couple 15 of times. 16 MS. HARRIS: Not only will a -- well, "gene" 17 could be construed as a single entity, so the community 18 service single entity would increase visibility of the 19 services. 'Cause a gene is a single unit. Could be -- 20 MS. VAN WINKLE: Generate? 21 (Discussion off the record.) 22 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: This work by these 23 juveniles is pretty visible. 24 MS. HARRIS: Yes. 25 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Any privacy issues 3-28-05 93 1 that can be identified as -- 2 MS. HARRIS: They wouldn't have any way of 3 being identified. We would not publish their names. We 4 would not even publish what county that they're from. I -- 5 off the top of my head, I can't think where any identity 6 would be -- 7 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: You're the expert on 8 that. Third question, what's it going to cost Kerr County? 9 MS. HARRIS: It shouldn't cost Kerr County 10 one single cent, because everything is being donated. 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: You've got the right 12 answer. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where would the chili 14 cookoff be held? 15 MS. HARRIS: I'm sorry? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where would the chili 17 cookoff be staged? 18 MS. HARRIS: We haven't gotten that far yet. 19 I'm not sure, Commissioner. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: One of the things that 21 jumped off the page at me on this thing is the -- is to help 22 these young people with their education, G.E.D. and A.C.T. 23 exams and things like that. 24 MS. HARRIS: Yes. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But the one that 3-28-05 94 1 really jumped off the page was transition tools, such as 2 clothing to interview for jobs. I just think that is so 3 neat. But you can dress somebody up, and if they don't know 4 -- they don't know how to handle an interview, then you're 5 kind of throwing them out there to the wolves. I would 6 assume that we were -- that we teach them a little bit about 7 interviews and that kind of thing. 8 MS. HARRIS: As a matter of fact, the 9 Workforce here in Kerr County has started coming out to the 10 facility every Monday afternoon, and they're holding 11 workforce readiness classes for the kids, and part of those 12 workforce readiness classes is the interviewing process. 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Good. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: But, by the same token, if the 15 child does not have appropriate clothing to wear -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: -- it's pretty -- can be 18 pretty devastating to their self-esteem when they go to such 19 an interview. So -- 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I understand. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I like it. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: I think when you partner the 23 two up, it's a positive thing. 24 MS. HARRIS: And whenever -- when the kids 25 get -- reach their junior level, they're allowed to wear 3-28-05 95 1 their own clothes, and from the very beginning, they all can 2 bring their own hygiene products. Well, sometimes, for 3 different reasons, economic reasons or lack of interest 4 reasons, those kids do not receive hygiene products from 5 home or they don't receive clothing from home, and a lot of 6 times our staff buy that, buy the clothing and buy the 7 hygiene products for those kids. This would help to offset 8 some of those costs. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Has Ms. Dieringer 10 started those classes to give them those skills in terms 11 of -- 12 MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- how to join the 14 work force? 15 MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir, she has. She -- one 16 week -- one Monday they come out and they do the classes 17 with the girls. Then the next week, they come out and they 18 do it with -- they do the classes with the boys, and they 19 alternate that way. So, we don't mix them up. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval of the 21 joint community service program proposal as presented by 22 Kerr County Juvenile Detention Facility staff. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 25 approval of the proposal. Any question or discussion? 3-28-05 96 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Comment. My hat's off 2 to Jennifer Kolb. Very sharp young lady. 3 MS. HARRIS: I'm blessed to have her on 4 staff. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree with the 6 Commissioner. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: I've had lots of firsthand 8 observation that she's very committed to what she's doing. 9 MS. HARRIS: Very. Very. She's got a lot of 10 energy. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions? 12 Comments? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 13 your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Next 18 item on the agenda is to consider and approve a contract for 19 psychological and medical services performed at the Juvenile 20 Detention Facility. 21 MS. HARRIS: Those two contracts, the 22 psychological and the medical contracts, were included in 23 that packet that I presented to you two weeks ago, that 24 Commissioner Letz had requested all the contracts that we 25 currently have. The psychological contract, the County 3-28-05 97 1 Attorney, Mr. Emerson, read that over and felt like that the 2 psychological contract was just fine as it is. The medical 3 contract, however, Mr. Emerson is in the process of 4 rewriting the medical contract, and it is not ready for 5 approval today. It may be ready for the next Commissioners 6 Court meeting two weeks from now. So, we would not want to 7 -- we would not want to have any action on the medical 8 contract, 'cause it's -- 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The psychological 10 contract was the one that was presented last time? 11 MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move approval of the 13 psychological service contract for the Hill Country Juvenile 14 Detention Facility. 15 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 18 approval of the psychological services contract for the 19 detention facility. Any further question or discussion? 20 All in favor of that motion, signify by raising your right 21 hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll 3-28-05 98 1 move to Item 13, hiring an LPC-slash-LCDC to replace the 2 facility counselor resigning in April, with a proposed entry 3 pay grade of Grade 26, Step 1. 4 MS. HARRIS: Yes. I put this on the agenda. 5 Approximately three weeks to about a month ago, one of my 6 full-time counselors came to me and has turned in his verbal 7 resignation. He has not turned in his written. He will be 8 leaving; he's moving to New York, and he's leaving in April, 9 April the 15th, and I need to fill his position. I had 10 mentioned this to the Court a couple of times before, that 11 if an opening ever came up by which I needed to replace a 12 counselor, it would be to our benefit to replace that 13 position with a Licensed Professional Counselor. Two 14 reasons. Number one, that person could do all of our mental 15 health suicide assessments. We would no longer have to 16 solicit the contract -- or that portion of the contract with 17 the psychological -- Dr. Watts that we use right now to come 18 out and do all of our suicide assessments. This individual 19 has the ability to do that. 20 I put on the proposal the approximate cost 21 that it would save. Dr. Watts' costs for suicide 22 assessments is $85 an assessment. I looked on previous 23 invoices that she submitted, and those run anywhere from 24 $400 to $500 a month. She has to come out and do a lot of 25 suicide assessments on preadjudicated kids, and -- and 3-28-05 99 1 sometimes on our postadjudicated kids, she has to come out, 2 so that would save us approximately $400 to $500 a month for 3 this individual to do the suicide assessments. Also, this 4 person could also be the firsthand person for any mental 5 health issues that we might need to refer to M.H.M.R. for -- 6 for more extensive mental health services that we could not 7 provide at the facility. 8 Secondly, the individual that I have in mind 9 is not only an L.P.C., but this person is also a licensed 10 L.C.D.C. in the state of Texas, which is a Licensed Chemical 11 Dependency Counselor. This individual not only can do the 12 mental health; this individual can also be a counselor for 13 the substance abuse kids, and this person can also supervise 14 my other full-time counselor, Ms. Woods, who qualifies to be 15 an L.C.D.C. counseling intern, and he can supervise her as 16 well. He can carry -- this individual can carry an 17 individual substance abuse counseling load of 10. Ms. Woods 18 can also carry a counseling load of 10. That's a total of 19 20 substance abuse kids that can be covered by the two 20 full-time individuals at the -- at the facility, which I 21 outlined in my proposal what the savings for that would be. 22 Now, anything -- we are licensed for 18 23 substance abuse beds. We can take care of 20 kids in-house 24 if we hire this person full-time. If we exceed our 18 25 licensed beds, we -- we would need to look at sending an 3-28-05 100 1 additional licensing fee to the -- to the Department of 2 State Health Services to license more substance abuse beds. 3 Anything beyond 20 substance abuse kids would require a 4 third counselor. Therefore, I would propose that the 5 contract that we have with HCCADA would pick up those 6 additional kids if -- if we go beyond 20 kids, because 7 in-house we could take care of 20 kids. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can you give me a -- just 9 a question, you know, from ignorance more than anything 10 else. Say you have -- you're at 21 -- or say you're at 11 20 -- say 21. You need to go to HCCADA to get that 12 counselor, and then we drop down. Would they continue to 13 handle that because -- to keep continuity of counselors with 14 that one kid, even though we may be down to 16 beds? 15 MS. HARRIS: Anything -- anything over 20, I 16 would propose that HCCADA would pick up those counseling 17 services. If we drop down to 20, our full-time counselors 18 can take care of those 20. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So there's not a need, 20 then, to have the same counselor every time talking to 21 the -- 22 MS. HARRIS: It would be beneficial, but 23 economically, in a business sense, we -- we would not do 24 that. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 3-28-05 101 1 MS. HARRIS: And this is -- and I'm coming at 2 you on the business side of this, 'cause it's economically 3 more feasible to have a full person on staff that can -- can 4 take care of a myriad of services. Hill Country Council on 5 Alcohol and Drug Abuse were very, very cooperative and 6 gracious for coming in when we had -- when we had the need. 7 I -- at the time that we solicited their services and their 8 contract, I didn't need a full-time L.P.C. or an L.C.D.C., 9 'cause Preston Hyde -- Mr. Hyde had not resigned. Then he 10 resigned, and I've got to fill his position. Because he 11 also does the case management, and Ms. Woods cannot do the 12 case management for all of the kids by herself. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The original agreement 14 we have with Hill Country, and then we have a letter here 15 today from Ms. Stevens, who I see in the courtroom. Have 16 you discussed this with them, their availability for these 17 -- for our new way of thinking? 18 MS. HARRIS: Yes, I spoke with Ms. Stevens 19 while I was at the Alpine conference, which was two weeks 20 ago, and I -- I visited with Ms. Stevens on the phone and 21 told her that I was going to be presenting this to the 22 Court, and the reasons why, 'cause I've got to fill this 23 position. I have a vacancy. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I need to know what 25 she has to say and what she thinks of that. 3-28-05 102 1 JUDGE TINLEY: She's filed a participation 2 form, and we'll hear from her as soon as Ms. Harris is 3 through with her presentation. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I just want to review 6 the numbers before we jump away from Ms. Harris. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, if we can. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Sure. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Currently, Mr. Hyde's 11 salary is 31,845? 12 MS. HARRIS: That's correct. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So if you were to 14 replace him just as he is, you would be continuing to expend 15 31,845? 16 MS. HARRIS: That's correct. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The new person that 18 you're recommending that you would like to hire, you would 19 be hiring at what, Ms. Harris? 20 MS. HARRIS: 37,850. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 37 -- 22 MS. HARRIS: 850. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- 850. 24 MS. HARRIS: That is Pay Grade 26, Step 1. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. So that's 3-28-05 103 1 about $6,000 more than Mr. Hyde's currently making? 2 MS. HARRIS: That's correct. Yes, sir. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Now, what you're 4 indicating to us on the savings side of the equation, by 5 doing this, is that individual counseling and group sessions 6 for up to how many people? 20? 7 MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir. When I made the 8 proposed -- when I wrote the proposal, at that time we had 9 nine. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Nine. I see it, 11 nine. 12 MS. HARRIS: We had nine substance abuse 13 kids. We now have 12. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What you presented, 15 then, equates to an expenditure of about $25,000; is that 16 correct? I did some quick math here. For the nine? Nine 17 at 45 weekly and nine at 17.50 and so forth. 18 MS. HARRIS: Yes. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And then Dr. Watts' 20 cost is about another $6,000? 21 MS. HARRIS: That's correct. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, what you're 23 telling the Court is, by following this plan, you -- you can 24 save about $31,000 worth of expenditures by spending 37,850, 25 which is 6,000 more than you're currently spending? 3-28-05 104 1 MS. HARRIS: That's correct. Yes, sir. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So the net savings 3 would be something like 25,000? 4 MS. HARRIS: That's right. Yes, sir. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just wanted to be 6 sure we had it correct. 7 MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir, but you're getting a 8 person with dual license. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I understand. 10 MS. HARRIS: Mm-hmm. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Harris, the counseling 12 under this alcohol and drug abuse -- substance abuse 13 program, -- 14 MS. HARRIS: Mm-hmm? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: -- that's not a reimbursable 16 medical expense under the residential service contract? 17 MS. HARRIS: No, sir. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So that's our 19 responsibility? 20 MS. HARRIS: That's our responsibility, yes, 21 sir. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, let's pretend 24 that we pass a court order here to approve your little plan. 25 Is this particular person -- and I assume that this resumé 3-28-05 105 1 back here is the person that you're thinking about? 2 MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir, that's correct. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Has -- I mean, has he 4 agreed to the salary? Has he agreed to come on to work? 5 Has he agreed to do all of these things that you have 6 listed? 7 MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir. And, as a matter of 8 fact -- and I didn't ask him, but he's here in the audience. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is he excited? That's 10 my question. He's right here? 11 MR. RUSSELL: Excited? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, excited. 13 MR. RUSSELL: Excited about the future that 14 you can do with the program, yes. There's -- there's so 15 many ways to go about the program to increase the salability 16 of the juvenile center with other counties. Yes, I'm 17 excited about that. Am I excited about 37? It's quite a 18 come down from what I've had before. Am I excited about the 19 salary? No. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He's human. 21 MS. HARRIS: Yes, he is. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Also quite candid, it appears. 23 MS. HARRIS: Yes. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What do you -- 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Let the record reflect that 3-28-05 106 1 was Mr. Michael Russell. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Michael C. Russell. 3 Mr. Russell, what do you do now -- right now? 4 MR. RUSSELL: Right now I'm waiting to see 5 what happens here with the juvenile facility. I was at 6 Starlite. I was the Juvenile Coordinator for Starlite. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 8 MS. HARRIS: He was previously a juvenile 9 probation officer in the state of Ohio. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Compared to nothing, 11 this is pretty good money. 12 MR. RUSSELL: Compared with returning back to 13 Ohio, sir, it's very poor money. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, that's part of 15 life. The way of doing business, as the rednecks informed 16 us this morning. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Are we through with 18 questions for Ms. Harris? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I am. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I am. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that all you have to 22 present on the program? 23 MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Ms. Stevens, give your 25 name and address to the reporter, please. 3-28-05 107 1 MS. STEVENS: Jeannie Stevens, 1456 Sidney 2 Baker. I'm here today not to cause any grief or change the 3 names of streets or what-have-you. Just some clarification 4 on a contract. And I have given to you what I would like to 5 talk about, and that is, to what extent, with the contract 6 that's been signed on the 14th day of this month, will Kerr 7 County Juvenile Detention Facility be utilizing our 8 services? And if you hire the LPC/LCDC for the Juvenile 9 Detention Facility, do you still need our services? 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good questions. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Those are great 12 questions. 13 MS. STEVENS: We're here for you. However, I 14 want to support Ms. Harris with everything, because I do 15 believe that she does understand the business side of making 16 things work, and to have someone in-house to do your 17 services is probably one of the best things you can do, 18 rather than contracting out. When you contract out, you 19 don't pay fringe benefits and things of that nature, but you 20 do have a hand, if you will, on -- on that person, knowing 21 that you have oversight with them, and it's just beneficial 22 for Becky. And so I guess my question today is if the 23 County still desires to contract with our facility for these 24 services. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The question I have, I 3-28-05 108 1 guess -- sorry, Commissioner, but just quickly, does the 2 contract have any staffing implications for you? 3 MS. STEVENS: No, sir. We have a full-time 4 L.C.D.C. to perform treatment services for the girls at 5 juvie, and we have an L.P.C. that's willing to take over the 6 boy's group. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You didn't ramp up, 8 as they say, to meet our expectations, did you, by hiring 9 people? 10 MS. STEVENS: No, sir. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You already had 12 people on staff? 13 MS. STEVENS: Yes, sir. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What about the 16 contract that we've signed with them saying that they are 17 going to provide these services? We just pretend that 18 doesn't exist? Or do we just lay it aside and use it as a 19 -- as an as-needed type thing? 20 MS. HARRIS: That's -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We do that with the 22 contract? 23 MS. HARRIS: That's what I -- that's what I 24 propose. They provide -- 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm asking it, 3-28-05 109 1 actually, from a legal standpoint, what I need to know. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think it's what we 3 would call in the legal world a requirements contract; that 4 any requirements we have in that area, we are obligated to 5 place in the hands of HCCADA. If I'm understanding 6 Ms. Harris' proposal, it's on an as-needed, overflow type 7 situation, that she's proposing that we leave the contract 8 in place to continue to do business. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with that. 10 MR. EMERSON: That's a nonexclusive contract. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. And you're 12 agreeing to play the ball game? 13 MS. STEVENS: Well, we never know what 14 tomorrow brings, but if we're there for the facility, and we 15 hope to be, God bless us all. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It sounds like the -- the 17 change is that instead of having a -- you know, an over 10 18 overflow, now it's over 20 overflow. Which is a -- you 19 know -- 20 MS. HARRIS: 'Cause we have 12 substance 21 abuse kids that require services right now, and we're 22 getting two more kids in this week, which is going to bump 23 our numbers up. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 25 MS. STEVENS: May I add something, please? 3-28-05 110 1 We are there for the facility as long as we have our staff 2 in place, as long as we have resources to provide this. I 3 would like some kind of a notification prior to this 4 happening with us. Right now, we've been put on limbo, and 5 we would really like some kind of a notification prior to us 6 providing the services again. Just -- 30 days. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How much advance 8 notice? 9 MS. STEVENS: Thirty days would be super. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: I think, number one, your 11 observations about contract versus in-house are -- are very 12 valid, and they're certainly considerations that ought to be 13 given in any situation, and your request to be given a 14 heads-up is certainly reasonable. I'm sure Ms. Harris 15 understands. 16 MS. HARRIS: That's perfectly acceptable, and 17 I understand they would need to -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So -- I mean, just so I 19 understand, so the heads-up notification will be that 20 HCCADA -- we'll now look to HCCADA for anything over the 20? 21 MS. HARRIS: Correct. I could -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: After the -- whatever 23 date. 24 MS. HARRIS: I can project our referrals 25 coming in. I can get a pretty good picture of approximately 3-28-05 111 1 how many substance abuse kids we're going to have coming in, 2 and I can give her a 30-day heads-up, going, "Okay, we've 3 got about five kids coming in, which is going to put us over 4 our in-house counseling load," and give her notice to gear 5 up to take care of those -- those five kids. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, every 30 days you'll 7 provide a -- 'cause your numbers are going to be changing 8 every 30 days, what you anticipate you'll be for the next 30 9 days. You anticipate that number? 10 MS. HARRIS: I can do it that way. Like, 11 right now, I have 12 -- 12 kids. I've got two more kids 12 coming in. That's going to get us to 14. As of the end of 13 this week, I don't have any more referrals coming in, so -- 14 and I may not get any more substance abuse referrals in the 15 next 30 days. God forbid that I don't, but -- but it's -- I 16 can usually see at least two or three weeks down the road, 17 'cause we've gotten referrals. And that way I can give her 18 30 days and say, "Okay, I know that I've got this many kids 19 coming in, and it's going to push us over our 20 counseling 20 limit," and give her a heads-up. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Main thing is just good 22 communication -- 23 MS. HARRIS: Sure. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: -- between the two of y'all. 25 MS. HARRIS: Sure. 3-28-05 112 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. Just -- to me, 2 Ms. Stevens needs -- and planning is what I presume is 3 really -- is what she's talking about. Is that the best way 4 to do it? I mean, you know, just a letter, an e-mail, phone 5 call? 6 MS. HARRIS: I can -- whatever you want. 7 MS. STEVENS: A phone call's just fine. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Okay, I'm just 9 trying to figure out if we had to send out formal letters 10 every time, or just -- 11 MS. HARRIS: Right. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just communication is 13 what you need. 14 MS. STEVENS: We just want what's best for 15 the residents. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I just want to make a 18 comment, Judge, and thank Ms. Stevens for her willingness 19 and her organization to -- to come to our aid in -- in 20 getting this ship turned around and going in the right 21 direction. Appreciate it very, very much. Appreciate the 22 spirit that you exhibited when we met -- when Commissioner 23 Baldwin and I met with you, and again, in your willingness 24 to be of assistance to us, because it's -- I guess sometimes 25 good fortune smiles on you, and I guess in this particular 3-28-05 113 1 case, Mr. Harris -- is it Harris or Russell? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Russell. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Coming into Kerr 4 County -- Mr. Russell's coming into Kerr County, available 5 to provide this type of services to us, is -- is fortuitous. 6 So, I appreciate the opportunity you've presented us, and 7 your willingness to continue. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Dittos. 9 MS. STEVENS: So, we're still partners? 10 MS. HARRIS: And triple dittos. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And friends. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Partners and friends. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would move 14 approval. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Whoa, whoa, whoa. 16 Hey, hey. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You want to make it? 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What about -- no. 19 What about our relationship with M.H.M.R.? 20 MS. HARRIS: Our relationship with M.H.M.R.? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Does this affect that 22 relationship -- 23 MS. HARRIS: No, sir. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- in any way? All 25 right. Don't try to explain anything. That answered it. 3-28-05 114 1 MS. HARRIS: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Go ahead. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The -- back to your 4 numbers. The way I understood what you said was -- is that 5 Mr. Hyde's moving to New York; Mr. Russell's moving in with 6 us, and we're going to save a net savings of $25,000 a year. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Based on the census 8 load that we're anticipating, yes, it could effect savings 9 up to $25,000 a year. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Over and above. 12 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's twice today 13 I've heard that word "savings." 14 MS. HARRIS: And when it's associated with 15 me, that's a good thing. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The question I have is, 17 does the 26-1 line up with the work that you all are doing? 18 That you all are doing on -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have no idea. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The work that we're 21 going to be doing? 22 MS. HARRIS: I put a job description in there 23 for that position. To my knowledge, I don't think that 24 there is another position within the county that I could 25 compare it to. This is something different. 3-28-05 115 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I understand that, but, I 2 mean, you can kind of look at -- well, this is above and 3 this is below. I mean, we kind of -- I mean, you're 4 comfortable that we're not creating a one-time deal? This 5 is where this slot should likely be? 6 MS. HARRIS: The research that I've -- that 7 I've done on hiring full-time L.P.C.'s or a full-time 8 L.C.D.C., you're looking at anywhere from $32,000 to 9 possibly $38,000 or $40,000 a year, depending on degrees and 10 licensures. And, by the way, I sent out e-mails to 11 surrounding universities that have psychology departments 12 that graduate Master's degree psychologists with L.P.C.'s. 13 We put an ad in the paper. I didn't get any response from 14 universities. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. I just wanted to 16 make sure that, I mean, this fits somewhere, hopefully, into 17 the -- the big picture. 18 MS. HARRIS: I believe it does. 19 DR. STACK: I was wondering if I might speak. 20 I'm Dr. Ed Stack, and with -- with the salary you're 21 offering, normally a dual license is significantly more. A 22 dual license with a Master's degree is anywhere from $42,000 23 to $47,000. I know at my facility, I could not hire someone 24 at that cost. In addition, just the demands that are being 25 placed on him, especially in terms of the dynamics of 3-28-05 116 1 suicide assessments, plus groups, plus individuals, plus 2 case management, is -- is a significant load. That ought to 3 be -- I don't mean to tell you folk what to do, but that's 4 not a lot of money in what you're asking him to do, just to 5 kind of assuage your own concerns. But in my facility, when 6 I owned my facility, this would have been rock-bottom, to 7 say the least. Thank you very much. Appreciate it. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, doctor. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would move that we 10 authorize Ms. Harris to hire an LPC/LCDC to replace the 11 existing current facility counselor who is resigning with -- 12 as per the job description provided to the Court, with a 13 proposed entrance of Pay Grade 26, Step 1. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Commissioner, would 15 you be willing to put an effective date? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I will if I can find 17 out what it is. 18 MS. HARRIS: April 1st. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: April 1st. Effective 20 April 1st. Works for me. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 23 approval of the motion as stated. Any further question or 24 discussion? All in favor of that motion, signify by raising 25 your right hand. 3-28-05 117 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll 5 move to Item 14 relative to the purchase of the video 6 recorder in the sum of $720. Apparently, the current 7 recorder is not recording, and the warranty has expired. 8 MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge? Just a second. 10 I'm so sorry; I apologize for interrupting. On this -- I 11 want to go back to this other issue just for a second. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: When Mr. Hyde gives 14 you his written resignation, would you pass that along -- 15 MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- to Commissioner 17 Williams and I? Thank you. 18 MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: The recorder is being used to 20 monitor and record secured areas within the facility. 21 Ms. Harris? 22 MS. HARRIS: This occurred while I was at the 23 Odessa conference, and Mr. Valverde called and informed me 24 that the VCR that records all of our security in the old 25 building gave up the ghost, and it is no longer under 3-28-05 118 1 warranty due to its age. He indicated to me that IHR is the 2 security company by which we -- we buy our security 3 equipment. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't know -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I can tell you -- the 6 Judge may have indigestion. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just indigestion. 8 He's got it now. 9 MS. HARRIS: Anyway -- and that he -- he 10 called them and told them what the -- what it was doing. 11 When you put a tape in, it spits the tape back out; it won't 12 even accept the cartridge. Anyway, a new one is going to 13 cost approximately $720. And I looked at the budget that -- 14 that we approved -- that the Court approved, and I can take 15 it out of Line Item 450, which is the Building Maintenance 16 line item. I can take it out of there. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He isn't going to make a 19 motion down there. Second. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 21 approval. Any questions or comments? I'd make a comment, 22 that I -- I don't know the -- the vintage of this particular 23 recording device. I know that the Sheriff has got some new 24 security camera devices that are presently being installed. 25 It may be that you may want to check with him. 3-28-05 119 1 MS. HARRIS: Okay. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: I know the Court took a look 3 at that particular equipment. It's all digital, and I think 4 the Sheriff so far is pretty happy with what he got. 5 MS. HARRIS: I'll get in touch with him. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: As an alternative. Obviously, 7 I think you're mandated by law to have that equipment, 8 aren't you? 9 MS. HARRIS: Yes, sir. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, there's 11 probably -- with that, there may be some of the video 12 cameras that were taken out to replace them with additional 13 ones that are -- we could use, too. I didn't think of that. 14 I think we're going to use most of those cameras, but if 15 there is something available out there, that maybe would 16 be -- 17 MS. HARRIS: I will get in touch with him 18 today. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do you need one? Or 20 just a recorder? 21 MS. HARRIS: Just the VCR. Just the 22 recorder. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He might have one. 25 MS. HARRIS: I'll get in touch with him 3-28-05 120 1 today. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any further question or 3 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 4 your right hand. 5 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 7 (No response.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. 9 MS. HARRIS: Thank you. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Looks like you finally got 11 through. 12 MS. HARRIS: Thank you. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll move on to the next 14 item, Number 15. Consider, discuss, and take appropriate 15 action on policy with respect to pauper's remains. I put 16 this on the agenda after receiving an Attorney General's 17 opinion that allows the Court to -- to adopt a policy on the 18 disposition of remains which allows us to actually specify 19 cremation. That has been our policy. I'm not sure if it 20 was specifically recognized in the law. And there has been 21 possibly a question whether or not we could require that, 22 but this A.G. opinion allows us to do that. And I asked the 23 County Attorney to review that and to prepare a proposed 24 court order to -- to place that into effect, which is among 25 your materials. 3-28-05 121 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, it appears to 2 me that -- or it seems to me that a pauper -- we become 3 owners of that body. Because it looks like here that you 4 have -- you have the option -- or one of the options is to 5 contact the state board and see if they would like to use 6 the body. And if they say yes, then you have the authority 7 to send that thing to San Antonio or wherever to them to use 8 any way they see fit. Or if they say no, then we cremate. 9 So, obviously, it looks like it -- I've never looked at it 10 that way, that the County actually is the owner of that 11 body. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: We, in essence, become -- have 13 control over those remains, to do with -- and the 14 authorization to deliver to the State Anatomical Board was 15 another reference made in the A.G.'s opinion, so we've 16 included that here. You know, it may be in some of those 17 cases, we can avoid the cost of having to handle those 18 cremations. But you're exactly right. If -- if they don't, 19 why, then it's incumbent upon us to do that, as we've done 20 in many cases. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Two questions or 22 comments. We have done this before, so I'm pretty sure we 23 have a court order saying that we're doing this cremating, 24 so I think we ought to cancel any previous court orders, 25 whether we know where they are or not. 3-28-05 122 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Man, that would be 2 old. That would be many, many, many years ago. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we can -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The County's been 5 cremating bodies here for -- 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But the other part is, on 7 the -- the companion to this, it appears that we need to 8 designate who the County's agent is to notify the state, you 9 know, and deliver the body. I mean, we -- this doesn't -- 10 this just says the County's doing it. Well -- or agent. 11 So, are we appointing the County Judge as the person who is 12 going to do the contacting? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm the one that -- that has 14 the responsibility for approving or disapproving pauper 15 status as it -- as it's now operating. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So we're also granting 17 you -- this isn't a question; this is a statement. And we 18 are also granting you the authority to contact the state -- 19 I won't even try to say that word today -- that board, and 20 handle the cremation or set up cremation. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that would necessarily 22 go with it. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 3-28-05 123 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 2 approval. Any question or discussion? All in favor of the 3 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Next 8 item, Number 16, is consider and discuss a master road plan 9 for Kerr County. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, just a quick 11 comment -- or question, is whether we're going to break for 12 lunch or just plow on through? Probably be done at 12:15, 13 12:30 or so. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Plow on through. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Plow on through. I put 16 this on the agenda, and it's here for a couple reasons. The 17 Subdivision Rules and Regulations are -- you know, I've been 18 working on them for some time. I want to really -- well, 19 and that's the reason this is on the agenda. I'll save the 20 rest of it for next agenda item. Part of the master plan 21 for the City of Kerrville was that they appointed me as 22 chair of the Transportation Subcommittee, and part of that 23 -- the main thing that subcommittee worked on was developing 24 a master road plan. And a copy of that road -- master road 25 plan, which is pretty much around the City of Kerrville, is 3-28-05 124 1 in your handout. It's small; it's hard to see. And I don't 2 think we need to take action right now. My main question 3 right now is, if we're going to do something in our 4 Subdivision Rules about a master road plan, that decision 5 needs to be made now so the language can start being built 6 into it. 7 The thought being that, basically, that if -- 8 you know, as an example, you see it on this plat; on the 9 righthand side of it, there's a dotted red line that goes -- 10 it's an arc up to the front of this line right here. That's 11 a potential -- that -- basically, that line says that at 12 some point, Spur 100 needs to connect -- needs to connect 13 with I-10. As subdivisions go in, that needs to be -- I 14 mean, you could easily block off a future access point. 15 That has happened in Kerrville South, primarily. You can't 16 get from Point A to Point B, even though you're right there, 17 because of subdivisions put in. If we're going to adopt a 18 plan, I think we can figure out a way of how we do it. I'm 19 not to that point yet, but the reason to put on it the 20 agenda is, if we're going to try to follow this or some 21 other master plan around the city of Kerrville, we need to 22 have something in our Subdivision Rules that allows or 23 permits or gives us authority to start working with the 24 developer as to what we're going to do to protect some of 25 the right-of-way, or build the road, possibly. 3-28-05 125 1 So, anyway, I've not talked with Rex on this 2 at all as to what our authority may even be, and the reason 3 I put it on the agenda is, if we want to pursue it, I think 4 now is the time we need to start looking at it. I have a 5 larger copy of this in my office which is about 24-inch by 6 24-inch that we can pass around and look at. I think 7 everyone can look at it -- we could look at it, and the 8 Subdivision Rules are going to be on our agenda probably for 9 every meeting for a while, so I think we need to make a 10 decision, really, right now. Just think about it. Look at 11 the map and start thinking of how we might do it. And I'll, 12 in the meantime, get with Rex and see -- I just don't want 13 to spend a whole lot of time writing language if he comes 14 back here and says we're not going to do a master road plan. 15 So I think -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is -- is it -- is it 17 required to have a master road plan in order to negotiate 18 with the developer? I mean, I know that I've done that out 19 in Kerrville South a few times. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, I don't think so. I 21 think what this would do would put the public on notice, and 22 hopefully the developers on notice that, hey, we may require 23 something additional here, because this is in a published, 24 adopted master road plan. And I think that I'll have some 25 more comments, I think, why this may be important under the 3-28-05 126 1 next agenda item. 2 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I've got a question 3 on that. From my understanding -- and I'll use this example 4 you used, the Spur 100, this dotted line. Say I own some 5 property out here where that dotted line goes across. Does 6 this master plan tell me don't build anything where that 7 dotted line is? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The master plan says -- 9 it's a lot like the Trans Texas plan. I probably shouldn't 10 use that analogy at all. These -- it just says that 11 somewhere between Spur 100 and I-10, a road needs to be 12 built. No -- and the next step would be that a -- some 13 topographic studies be looked at and say, okay, where is the 14 most logical -- one, two, three, four, however many 15 different routes you look at. And then, if a developer -- 16 and you keep track of those. This just says, conceptually, 17 a road needs to go that way. I think a little bit of 18 topography was looked at, the way it was drawn. It doesn't 19 mean that that road is going to cross that person's 20 property. 21 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: So in our 22 Subdivision Rules, we might have some language that says 23 here's -- here's our dotted lines for future -- for example, 24 if we decided that a south-of-the-river road out there 25 towards Hunt is desirable, we might publish a map with a 3-28-05 127 1 dotted line on it. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 3 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Under the auspices 4 of the Subdivision Rules. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mm-hmm. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: As an example, what 7 I've done a couple of times out here is, there will be a 8 cul-de-sac that may be 100 yards from the property line. 9 Still, you have another 100 yards to go to the property 10 line, and I have asked them to do an easement from that 11 cul-de-sac to that property line for future usage. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There's -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And they do it, 14 just -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, one of the 16 best -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- 'cause it's a good 18 idea. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- examples of a problem 20 is Saddlewood. Saddlewood has a great big road south -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Right through the 22 middle of it. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's a private road, and 24 you can't -- I mean people that live at the northern end of 25 it have to drive who knows how many miles to get to the 3-28-05 128 1 southern end if they don't live in that subdivision; the 2 gates are closed. So, it's just a way to -- you know, to do 3 it. This was a -- anyway, we don't have to, clearly, use 4 the city's plan. This was just one that was -- you know, 5 that they put on. It's not too far off from one the County 6 and the City, I think, had looked at probably in the early 7 90's. I mean, it's -- it's pretty basic. It's been updated 8 a little bit, but it's just on the agenda for the purpose to 9 think about it. And then we have to look at -- I shouldn't 10 say "we." Rex and I have to look at what authorities we 11 have to implement something like this, if any. And it may 12 be difficult. But, anyway, it's just on the agenda to say 13 it's coming back next week to discuss a little bit more. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner, is it not true 15 that by officially designating an approximate route of 16 roadways on a master plan, that in the platting process for 17 a landowner in that area, you can require the dedication of 18 right-of-way, and right-of-way of a specific width, 19 depending upon the classification of the road, in the 20 platting of that property? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't -- I mean, I'm 22 not sure of what -- what it actually means. I've always had 23 a little bit of a problem with that, because then we get 24 into a taking issue if you have a big road going through, 25 and some of these are pretty -- these are bigger roads that 3-28-05 129 1 we're talking about here, as to how you handle that. And 2 that's why I think it really needs to get back -- if we want 3 to pursue a master road plan on a county-wide basis, I think 4 we need -- really need some guidance from the County 5 Attorney. Clearly, this has been adopted by City of 6 Kerrville. I mean, this -- and a lot of these roads are 7 probably in the ETJ. I'm not sure what that means, 8 necessarily. Since I mentioned the ETJ, I will make a brief 9 comment. While I was visiting with the City Manager on ETJ 10 issues with the County, they have almost finalized a 11 proposed map to divide up the ETJ between the city and the 12 county, and that will be coming to us, I think, probably 13 within the next month. Which is a -- Commissioner Baldwin 14 and I were appointed to a committee a long time ago, and it 15 appears the City's already done all the work. And, 16 actually, I looked at it; it looks reasonable. I won't say 17 we need to agree with it. Commissioner Baldwin hasn't seen 18 it, I don't believe. But they are -- it's working. And 19 it's -- I think the plan, I think, has been mentioned in 20 this court before. The County's going to have an area where 21 our rules will be in place; City's going to have an area of 22 the ETJ where their rules will be in place. It's a lot 23 simpler for the public. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And a single platting 25 process. 3-28-05 130 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Single platting for -- 2 yeah, it will -- each one will have their own platting 3 process, but no one will have to go through two processes. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think you ought to 5 move forward with it, just kind of see where it -- where it 6 takes us. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. All right. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything further on Item 16? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to Item 17, consider 11 and discuss Subdivision Rules and Regulations and Water 12 Availability Requirements. Commissioner Letz? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: One of the things -- this 14 is what I was going to say earlier before I got started. I 15 really want to thank Rex Emerson, our County Attorney, for 16 his help in this area. One of the things we waited on when 17 redoing our Subdivision Rules was the change in the County 18 Attorney's office, and to get new input. Rex has been a big 19 help already in providing legal opinions and things that I 20 actually find quite interesting reading -- most people 21 probably find it quite boring -- related to court cases. I 22 mean, whenever I can find a court case, it grips me and I'm 23 excited to read it when it comes to some of these cases. 24 But I do like subdivision rules, and I like -- another thing 25 that has become very apparent is that we better make darn 3-28-05 131 1 sure our rules follow the law -- the state law. There are 2 more and more cases that are going to court, and the courts 3 are ruling on Section 232 one way or the other, in most of 4 the cases very narrowly. And I think that it's everything 5 from lot size -- there's a new, or relatively new case that 6 clearly says counties have zero authority to set lot size 7 under Section 232, but we do have authority under other 8 areas of the law possibly, and that primary area is probably 9 water availability, because of the priority status granted 10 Kerr County by the Legislature a while back. 11 So, I asked -- and we have talked on this 12 Court previously about almost eliminating the water 13 availability standards because Headwaters is doing it. A 14 lot of things have changed over there. I don't think -- I 15 think I would go 180 degrees opposite; I think we need to 16 work with Headwaters very closely. They do need to help 17 implement them, but I don't think we want to get rid of 18 them, because that's probably our strongest area to set lot 19 sizes and help govern that area. I asked Ms. Mitchell last 20 week to contact Gillespie County and Kendall County and get 21 copies of their water availability requirements, and she was 22 able to do that. She had them actually in moments, I think. 23 She must have great rapport with her counterparts in the 24 cities. Very interesting. The -- Gillespie County is 25 almost verbatim, our current one. Little bit more on parts 3-28-05 132 1 of it, but -- a little bit stricter, but there's a lot of 2 subjectivity in it. Not that I didn't like it a whole lot. 3 Kendall County is a different approach. I have copies of 4 both, just to let everyone on the Court read it, because I 5 think it's very important that we have some sort of water 6 availability, 'cause I think it is a very -- probably one of 7 the best ways for us to set lot sizes, and that's what we've 8 done in our current rules; they're based on water 9 availability totally. The other thing that I asked Kathy to 10 get is a -- something that Kendall County has that I had 11 never seen, and I have a copy. I'll hand out all this in a 12 moment. They have a creature over there -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did you say 14 "creature"? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Creature. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Creature. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Creature. It's called 18 Affidavit of Land Location requirement. And what they 19 require in Kendall County is, any division of property that 20 is not in a subdivision has to file an Affidavit of Land 21 Location, which is basically a survey plat of it, and it 22 does a very interesting thing. One, it goes straight to 23 O.S.S.F. Then they have a -- something that they require 24 when you do any kind of building; you have to get a copy of 25 the land -- and I think Miguel's already getting something 3-28-05 133 1 at this point. That would already be done with O.S.S.F. 2 needs. But the other thing it does -- and these have to be 3 approved by the Court or by the Court designee. It also 4 lets the Court be aware of any time an illegal subdivision 5 is going in, because we have to pass off -- we're basically 6 saying, "Yes, you're correct, this is not a subdivision," 7 or, "No, you're incorrect, this should be subdivision -- 8 platted." And it's a way that -- you know, just to kind of 9 monitor the whole system, and any new subdivision has to go 10 one way or the other. It also goes into road frontage and 11 other things of that nature. Pretty interesting. 12 Rex and I have talked a little bit about it. 13 He has not seen a copy from Kendall County, I don't believe. 14 There's a copy for him as well. I'm not sure if Kendall 15 County is doing this -- their authority seems to list every 16 -- they've got a page and a half of citing their authority 17 for doing this. I don't know if Rex is going to agree with 18 all of them or not. And I don't know if they're really 19 banking on the additional authority that Kendall County has 20 being adjacent to Bexar County that we do not have. 21 Clearly, Kendall County and any county adjacent to Bexar 22 County has additional platting authority. So, anyway we 23 needs to rely on Rex to see if we can do this or not. But 24 after everyone looks at it and we get some input from Road 25 and Bridge -- it's an interesting concept, something we've 3-28-05 134 1 never really looked at before. So that's just -- that being 2 said, a couple of other things. And I'm just going to talk 3 about some of these things, and you can think about it; I'll 4 hand some things out. New laws say that condominiums, 5 clearly, we have authority under 232 to regulate. We had a 6 big issue with that on -- whatever the -- the -- 7 MR. ODOM: Cypress. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Cypress -- whatever it's 9 called. 10 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Saddlewood. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Saddlewood. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, it's -- but whatever 13 it is -- Stablewood. 14 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Stablewood, out 15 Cardinal Hill Road. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We clearly have that 17 authority. I think we need to really tighten up and bring 18 that as a specific item in our Subdivision Rules, but you 19 have to say you do. You have to almost claim that authority 20 under 232. You can't just be silent on it and claim you 21 have the authority. You have to be kind of proactive on 22 that. There's some new cases on being able to set, in a 23 subdivision, lot sizes based on highway frontage. We have a 24 200-foot minimum frontage. That's been thrown out. We -- I 25 think the courts have said we don't have that authority, a 3-28-05 135 1 Guadalupe County case. So, anyway, it's pretty interesting. 2 There's a lot of cases coming down; a lot of these things 3 are being challenged, and so I think it's really important 4 that we try to keep up-to-date with what the current law is, 5 and rely heavily on the County Attorney's office to cite -- 6 basically, to claim the right authority when we're making a 7 rule. Whether we're talking about -- and a lot of the 8 problems have been that the -- the Commissioners Court 9 didn't cite the right authority or didn't cite any 10 authority. 11 And there may be some authority on setting 12 the frontage if it's done in a court order; that that's just 13 a blanket court order that Road and Bridge has, you know, 14 authority to set highway entrances, county road entrances. 15 And we've never done that. There may be some things that we 16 need to do to that enable us -- that we can do that under 17 some various health, safety, and welfare clauses, things of 18 that nature. So, there's -- the good news is, there's a -- 19 a lot coming down the pike on subdivisions. Bad news is, 20 it's slowing down the process a little bit, because some of 21 these new cases, really, I'm looking a lot harder at some of 22 our language and talking with Rex quite a bit about that as 23 well. So, I want to hand these out, just some things to 24 read. These, again, will be at our next meeting, and we'll 25 discuss them a little bit more. I plan to get with Gordon 3-28-05 136 1 Morgan, the president at Headwaters, and Gene Williams over 2 there, their acting manager, and talk a little bit about 3 water availability, 'cause I think it's in every -- well, 4 Gillespie County and Kendall County rely heavily on their 5 groundwater districts to implement the policy. So we 6 clearly -- I think that makes sense. I think that we need 7 to continue that relationship in Kerr County as well. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Commissioner, have 9 you been tracking the progress, or lack thereof, of the -- 10 of the bills in the Legislature that -- some of them were 11 filed by Senator Wentworth, and one by Representative Carter 12 Casteel dealing with county authority under the subdivision 13 platting process? Have you been tracking that? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I've not been tracking 15 them. I read the original -- you know, the summaries, or 16 actually read the bills on those from Mr. Wentworth and Mr. 17 Casteel -- or Ms. Casteel. But I've not -- I don't know 18 what the status is, and it's -- I know there's so many bills 19 pending, and they get changed. It's almost -- it's rather 20 frustrating, in my mind. If you don't -- if you're not 21 there the day they vote on your bill, it's going to be a 22 different bill anyway, so it's kind of -- you know, try to 23 lobby where you can a little bit and hope for the best. 24 But, actually, I will say one other thing. You brought 25 up -- 'cause you asked me a question recently about a 3-28-05 137 1 potential -- not a mobile home park, but an R.V. park going 2 in. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And if that was under the 5 Subdivision Rules. Under another court case that I got a 6 copy of, it may be. It clearly says there's a -- I forgot 7 which one it is that Rex gave me, or I had it from 8 somewhere. It was about Section 232 does apply if you're 9 going to lease your lots. You don't have to divide them and 10 sell them. If you're leasing them, it qualifies under 232. 11 And the contemplation in that court case was for mobile 12 homes, but -- which is a longer term lease than an R.V. park 13 would be. But I don't -- you know, there's nothing in the 14 opinion that says one way or the other. Maybe there's an 15 A.G. opinion that talks about that. But, anyway, there may 16 be some relief in that area if we want to regulate it, R.V. 17 parks. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I sort of 19 believe that's become an issue, and I think there's one 20 brewing out in my precinct. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's why I brought that 22 up. But I think a lot of the -- the main thing, after 23 reading a lot of these recent opinions, is that, you know, 24 we have to try to think outside the box and think where the 25 potential problems may be coming, and then be very specific 3-28-05 138 1 as to what our authority -- where we're getting our 2 authority. And you can't claim most of it comes under 232, 3 'cause that does not grant that much authority, unless 4 you're adjacent to Bexar County or another big county over 5 700,000. So, anyway, that's just good to get everyone 6 thinking a little bit about subdivisions. We'll talk about 7 it again in two weeks, and two weeks after that, two weeks 8 after that. 9 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Commissioner, one 10 quick question. I think you've answered this for me before, 11 but unless something's changed on R.V. parks, the only 12 authority we have to regulate those currently is floodplain 13 administration? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: O.S.S.F. 15 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: And O.S.S.F. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that it on that particular 17 agenda item? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's it on that one. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Does any member of the 20 Court have anything that we need to place in executive or 21 closed session mode? 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Not I. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Well, Mr. Auditor, I 24 guess we're ready for you. First item is payment of the 25 bills. 3-28-05 139 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've got a couple 2 questions. On Page 1, County Clerk -- I'm sorry, County 3 Court. Gerry Rickhoff is the County Clerk in Bexar County? 4 MR. TOMLINSON: That's right. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What -- tell me what 6 this is. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Mental health cases. 8 MR. TOMLINSON: Mental health cases. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Bills of cost for patients 10 that were sent down there during that mid-January to March 1 11 window. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right. Page 6 -- 13 and seemed like to me we went through this about two months 14 ago. Page 6, down at the bottom, the Sheriff's Office. 15 Milton Bernhard, hog processing. Did we not go through -- 16 what was the explanation of that? 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I forgot. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I can tell you what it 19 is, I'm pretty sure. It usually comes out of donations from 20 the stock show. There's a cost -- the meat is donated to 21 the Sheriff's Department from some of the buyers, but then 22 the entity getting it has to pay for the processing. I 23 believe that's probably what it is. 24 MR. TOMLINSON: Exactly. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It looks like that we, 3-28-05 140 1 the taxpayers, are paying for the processing. 2 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, these are donated funds 3 that he's using. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, but you're -- I 5 mean, it's -- the meat is donated, but the entity receiving 6 it has to pay for the processing, and that being the 7 Sheriff's Department in this case. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: And it's using donated funds 9 to pay for that processing. 10 MR. TOMLINSON: Right. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. So, this is 12 just a pass-through -- 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- thing. Why 15 isn't -- my real question behind all this, why isn't the 16 Commissioners Court invited to eat the damn hog? Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's a good 18 question. 19 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: If they put the 20 silver handcuffs on you, you'll get to eat the hog. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Get to eat the hog. 22 Page 8, Feller Fabricators, the awning on the front entrance 23 of the Ag Barn. That has been -- obviously, been done? 24 Yes, I'm sure it has. That kind of goes along with -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Next page. 3-28-05 141 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Final draw. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The final draw on the 3 roof out there. Has Mr. -- well, has Mr. Holekamp signed 4 off on all those? 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What page is that on? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That is on Page 14, 7 the roof. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh, yeah. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the awning -- I 10 didn't know anything about an awning, but I'm assuming 11 that's just part of the gig. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- it's my understanding 13 that they've -- they made a final inspection and have 14 approved the roof. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: If you'll recall, going into 17 the Exhibit Center, there's -- 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: -- a little -- kind of a porch 20 area, covered porch area. The other awning that's being 21 done is the one right outside the entrance into the 22 maintenance facility and the director and so forth. It's 23 the one immediately west of there. And the arrangement, as 24 I understand it, is that Feller is providing the labor at no 25 cost, and we're paying for the materials to put a similar 3-28-05 142 1 type awning over that entrance, similar to the one that's 2 into the Exhibit Hall. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what I figured. 4 Then I see the bill on it is less than $1,000, and I -- 5 that's what made me think, how could he put an awning up 6 there for less than $1,000? Okay. Page 15, the Juvenile 7 Detention Facility. What -- this Bob Barker thing, I'm sure 8 that they -- he sells lots of stuff, but I can't tell what. 9 Resident supplies? Is that -- 10 MR. TOMLINSON: It would be clothing. He 11 sells clothing. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Clothing. And -- 13 MR. TOMLINSON: Bedding. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Key control for 1525 15 lock. So, old Bob just sells all kinds of stuff? Is that 16 what you're telling me? 17 MR. TOMLINSON: Yeah, that's -- 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. And then the 19 last item there, $6,608 to Allison Bass for professional 20 services, Advocacy, Inc. Do we have any idea if this is the 21 last one or not? 22 MR. TOMLINSON: Yes. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This is the last -- 24 MS. HARRIS: Last one. 25 MR. TOMLINSON: It is the last one. 3-28-05 143 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- bill? Can you give 2 us a figure of how much we've paid Allison Bass and whoever 3 all these other people are? 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Relating to Advocacy? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Related to Advocacy. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: 29 to 31, somewhere in that 7 range, total. 8 MR. TOMLINSON: No, it was -- 18 and 6 is 24. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 25,000. 11 MR. TOMLINSON: Yeah. The first one was 18. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: I was thinking it was higher 13 than that. I'm sure you've got more familiarity with the 14 figures than I do. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, out in Odessa, I 16 was with Mr. Allison there the last day, and he was just so 17 friendly. Day before that, I had lunch with Mr. Bass, and 18 they were really nice to me. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I guess -- 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We were out there -- 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They hadn't got that 22 check yet. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Received it, yeah. 24 Yeah. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They were expecting a 3-28-05 144 1 check. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's all my 3 questions. 4 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I've got one on Page 5 7, Juvenile Probation. This is more of an educational 6 question. Kerr County Juvenile Facility, we paid $18,000. 7 So, this is what the facility charges us to take our 8 children? 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: For our kids. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: And Child Protective 12 Services pays us to -- to take care of those children? 13 MR. TOMLINSON: No. 14 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: No? This is a -- 15 this is an $18,000 cost to Kerr County. It's not -- not a 16 pass-through thing? 17 JUDGE TINLEY: I think what you may be 18 thinking about, Commissioner -- notice that this says 19 preadjudicated. 20 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: The post-adjudication is the 22 one that you receive a reimbursement rate from the State of 23 Texas on. 24 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Right. That's it. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay? 3-28-05 145 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move we pay the 2 bills. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 5 payment of the bills. Any further questions or comments? 6 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 7 hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 12 Budget amendments. Budget Amendment Request Number 1. 13 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. Number 1 is for the 14 Commissioners Court and the County Attorney's office. The 15 request is to transfer $2,301 from the Secretary's Salaries 16 in the County Attorney's budget to the Professional Services 17 under the Commissioners Court budget. It's to pay part of 18 the M.O.S. from Davidson Freedle, P.C., for the audit for 19 the Hot Check fund. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 23 approval of Budget Amendment Request Number 1. Any question 24 or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by 25 raising your right hand. 3-28-05 146 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 5 Budget Amendment Request Number 2. 6 MR. TOMLINSON: Number 2 is also for the 7 County Attorney's office. This request for the County 8 Attorney to transfer $602.66 from Computer Software to 9 Software Maintenance. It's an update on his Hot Check 10 software. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 14 approval of Budget Amendment Request Number 2. Questions or 15 comments? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Rex, is this your usual 17 signature, or were you in a hurry this day? 18 MR. EMERSON: Little bit of a hurry. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 20 MR. EMERSON: And, for the Commissioners' 21 information, this is actually an expense from October of 22 last year. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What? 24 MR. EMERSON: This is an invoice from October 25 of last year that didn't get paid. 3-28-05 147 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh. 2 MR. EMERSON: So we're playing catch-up. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Wonderful. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 6 comment? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 7 your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 12 Budget Amendment Request Number 3. 13 MR. TOMLINSON: Number 3 is for Justice of 14 the Peace, Precinct 3. His request is to transfer $270 from 15 his Part-Time Salary line item to Bonds, and that's for his 16 elected official's bond. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 18 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 21 approval of Budget Amendment Request Number 3. Any question 22 or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by 23 raising your right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3-28-05 148 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 3 Budget Amendment Request Number 4. 4 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. Number 4 is for the 5 County Jail. The Sheriff wants to transfer $200 from 6 Jailer's Salaries to Employee Medical Exams. 7 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: So moved. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 10 approval of Budget Amendment Request Number 4. Any question 11 or discussion? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Comment. When you see 13 the employee medical exams going up and over budget, it's a 14 pretty good sign there's a -- the turnover out there has 15 increased on us a little bit. I wonder what's going on. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 17 comment? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 18 your right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 23 Budget Amendment Request Number 5. 24 MR. TOMLINSON: Number 5 is for Road and 25 Bridge to transfer $680.03 from Contract Fees to Capital 3-28-05 149 1 Outlay. They have actually spent -- they've purchased all 2 their Capital Outlay for the year, and the total of their 3 purchases were over budget by $680. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: My observation is, that ain't 5 too bad based upon $385,000-plus. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 9 approval of Budget Amendment Request Number 5. Any question 10 or comment? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 11 your right hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 16 Budget Amendment Request Number 6. 17 MR. TOMLINSON: Number 6 is -- is a request 18 from the County Clerk. Actually has to do with her budget 19 and the Election Expenses budget, but from a recommendation 20 from the I.T. people, she's made this request. Her request 21 is to transfer $343.60 to -- out of Election Judges line 22 item, $6,203.69 from Ballot Expense, and 492.71 from 23 Election Supplies, to transfer $2,200 into Machine Repairs, 24 $800 in Computer Hardware, $1,140 in Computer Software, and 25 $2,900 in Operating Equipment. 3-28-05 150 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Question for the 2 Clerk, I guess. This process means that you're not going to 3 have any other election or ballot expenses for the remainder 4 of the year? 5 MS. PIEPER: No. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What happens if the 7 local option election comes up in Precinct 2? 8 MS. PIEPER: It's my understanding if it 9 comes up, it will be put on the November ballot. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Pardon? 11 MS. PIEPER: If it comes up, it will be put 12 on the November ballot. My new budget would kick in October 13 1. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, fine. Thank 15 you. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I had the same question, 17 'cause I think it will come up. But it'll be in November; 18 it'll be next budget year. 19 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: What is the local 20 option? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Liquor. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Precinct 2 is the 23 only precinct in Kerr County that's dry. 24 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Glad I don't live 25 there. 3-28-05 151 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You can bring it in, 2 Commissioner. You can bring it in. You just can't purchase 3 it. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Actually -- 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Not hard liquor. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You can have beer. No 7 wine, though. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You can have beer -- 9 well, I'm not so sure about that, because -- 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They sell wine, but 11 T.A.B.C. kind of looks the other way over in Precinct 2 a 12 little bit. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It is so convoluted, 14 it's unbelievable. Thank you for the answer. Thank you. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Do I hear a 16 motion? 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 20 approval of Budget Amendment Request Number 6. Any question 21 or comment? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The comment is that there 23 are three or four members of the precinct that are very 24 involved in getting that law changed currently, one of them 25 being a -- I won't mention who they are; they may not want 3-28-05 152 1 their names mentioned who they are. But it's -- they think 2 it's something that needs to be corrected. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 4 comment? 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's brewing. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's brewing, that's 7 right. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion, 9 signify by raising your right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 12 (No response.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Do we 14 have any late bills? 15 MR. TOMLINSON: No. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't see any transcripts. 17 Don't have any monthly reports. 18 MS. PIEPER: Yes, you do. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Do have monthly reports. I've 20 been furnished a monthly report from J.P., Precinct Number 21 1. Do I hear a motion it be accepted as submitted? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 25 approval of the Justice of the Peace, Precinct Number 1 3-28-05 153 1 monthly report as submitted. Any question or discussion? 2 All in favor the of the motion, signify by raising your 3 right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Do we 8 have any reports from the Commissioners in connection with 9 their liaison or committee assignments? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, none of us. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't hear anything -- 12 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I don't have one, 13 but I would like to ask the honorable County Clerk if she's 14 getting the documentation now that she needs. 15 MS. PIEPER: Yes. So far, I have had several 16 papers pushed at me today. I appreciate it. 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Some of the -- some 18 people putting items on the agenda in the past have not 19 complied with the process fully, and it makes her job 20 harder. So -- 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have one comment, and 22 just so everyone knows what's coming around shortly, last 23 year during the preliminary -- or during the audit 24 discussion, I made the comment that the Commissioners Court 25 should be more involved in writing the -- I forgot -- it's a 3-28-05 154 1 management discussion of the county. Well, the Auditor, I 2 think, agrees with that, and has dropped that off in my lap 3 to write. So, anyway -- 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That'll teach you. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, that'll teach me 6 all right. So that's going to -- I'm going to be passing 7 that around. It's about a quarter-inch thick packet from 8 the Auditor from Pressler Thompson, who are our auditors, of 9 last year's comments. And I don't know that I'm going to be 10 the one writing it, but someone on the Court. I think we 11 need to be more involved in it so it can be circulating 12 around for comments. I think it's a good exercise because 13 of the -- it just makes us very much aware of what the audit 14 actually says. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I just have one 16 question, since it's related. One comment. Commissioner 17 Baldwin and I are still looking for an audit firm that can 18 conduct a management audit on the previous activities of the 19 Kerr County Juvenile Detention Facility. When we find that 20 individual, we'll let you know who it is and how much it 21 costs. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other reports from 23 Commissioners? Elected officials? Department heads? Any 24 other reports to be rendered? Any further business? 25 (No response.) 3-28-05 155 1 JUDGE TINLEY: We stand adjourned. 2 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 12:28 p.m.) 3 - - - - - - - - - - 4 5 6 STATE OF TEXAS | 7 COUNTY OF KERR | 8 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 9 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 10 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 11 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 12 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 1st day of April, 2005. 13 14 15 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 16 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 17 Certified Shorthand Reporter 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 3-28-05