1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Regular Session 10 Monday, August 8, 2005 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 DAVE NICHOLSON, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X August 8, 2005 2 PAGE --- Commissioners' Comments 5 3 1.1 Consider/discuss Local Option Liquor Election 4 being proposed for Precinct 2, set a special Commissioners' Court meeting September 7, 2005 5 to authorize an election 9 6 1.2 Discuss the way Texas County & District Retirement System handled previous late filing penalties 16 7 1.3 Consider/discuss authorizing River Star Arts & 8 Event Park to construct an outdoor pavilion 17 9 1.4 Consider/discuss approval of City of Kerrville Economic Improvement Corporation to provide funding 10 to River Star Arts & Event Park for construction of an outdoor pavilion 20 11 1.5 Consider Application for Floodplain Permit F05-013 12 and authorize County Judge to sign same 23 13 1.6 Set a public hearing for Revision of Plat for Tract 39-A of Kerrville Country Estates, Section 14 Two, Vol 6, Page 109 27 15 1.7 Set a public hearing for Revision of Plat for Mosty Pecan Grove Subdivision, Vol 7, Page 295 28 16 1.8 Consider authorizing closure of Avenue C between 17 China Street and 1st Street in Center Point on August 13, 2005, between 8 a.m. and 1 p.m.; 18 instruct Road & Bridge Department to provide temporary blockades and road closure signs 38 19 1.9 Consider adopting Kerr County policy for emergency 20 maintenance on roads that become impassable for emergency service or law enforcement vehicles 40 21 1.10 Discuss and consider advertising for Request for 22 Proposals to handle administration of Kerr County Health Insurance Program 49 23 1.11 Consider/discuss evaluations of employees that 24 report directly to the Commissioners' Court 61 25 3 1 I N D E X (Continued) August 8, 2005 2 PAGE 3 1.12 Consider and discuss status of EBA Lawsuit 66 4 1.14 Consider/discuss solicitation of Request for Proposals for Emergency Medical Service to Kerr 5 County residents 68 6 1.13 Consider/discuss EMS Contract with the City of Kerrville 76, 134 7 4.1 Pay Bills 94 8 4.2 Budget Amendments 95 4.3 Late Bills 125 9 4.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 126 10 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee Assignments 130 11 5.2 Reports from Elected Officials/Department Heads 131 12 1.15 Reports from the following Departments: Animal Control --- 13 Extension Office 143 Environmental Health 155 14 Juvenile Detention Facility --- 15 --- Adjourned 165 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 4 1 On Monday, August 8, 2005, at 9:00 a.m., a regular 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in the 3 Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, Kerrville, 4 Texas, and the following proceedings were had in open court: 5 P R O C E E D I N G S 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning. Let me call to 7 order this regularly scheduled meeting of the Kerr County 8 Commissioners Court scheduled for this date and time, 9 Monday, August the 8th, 2005, at 9 a.m. Glad to see 10 everybody here. We're fortunate to have with us today 11 Pastor Ron Moore with the Thousand Hills Cowboy Church, and 12 I'd like to turn it over to him at this time. If you'd 13 please stand? 14 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you very much. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, Ron. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. At this time, 18 if there's any member of the audience that wishes to be 19 heard on any matter that is not listed on the agenda -- a 20 matter that is not listed on the agenda -- you're privileged 21 to come forward at this time and tell us what's on your 22 mind. If you want to speak on a listed agenda item, we'd 23 ask that you wait until we get to that particular item 24 before you ask to be heard. And as to the agenda items, if 25 you want to be heard, there's some participation forms at 8-8-05 5 1 the back of the room. We would ask that you fill those out. 2 It's not essential that you do so, but it helps me to be 3 sure that when we get to that agenda item, I don't miss you, 4 and I certainly don't want to do that if you want to speak 5 on it. If we get to an agenda item and you fail to file a 6 participation form, find some way to get my attention and 7 I'll recognize you so that you can be heard on that item, 8 but if there's any member of the public that wishes to come 9 forward at this time on a matter that is not listed on the 10 agenda, well, come forward and let us hear from you. 11 (No response.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: I hear no one or see no one 13 coming forward, so we'll move on with the agenda. 14 Commissioner 1, what do you have for us this morning? 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me think. I'm 16 going to pass, Judge. Thank you. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All right, sir. Commissioner 18 2? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, we got some 20 folks in the audience who are going to speak to one of the 21 agenda items, but on Saturday, there's another group of 22 folks in Center Point who work real hard for the betterment 23 of the community, a little group called the Alliance for 24 Progress, and they -- they raise money all year long, and 25 they do it for one very basic, good cause, and that's to 8-8-05 6 1 have Christmas for people -- their young people, and some 2 who are less fortunate than we are, and they work all year 3 long and raise money for the purpose of the North Pole 4 Project and to pay for the Christmas lights in downtown 5 Center Point during the Christmas season. Pleased to tell 6 you that the fish fry they had on Saturday was a great 7 event; enjoyed by about, oh, 200, 300 people in and out all 8 afternoon long. And I came home coated with grease, because 9 that's what I was designated to do, cook fish. And I got to 10 tell you, that's some kind of job. Anyhow, for a good 11 cause; had a good time, a lot of good folks and so forth. I 12 will hear from these other folks here in just a few minutes 13 on the agenda item. Judge, that's all I have. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Commissioner 3? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm just glad to hear 16 Commissioner 2 can fry fish, 'cause we'll probably have a 17 use for him on the Court frying some fish some of these 18 times coming up. I think the only thing I really have is an 19 update on Hermann Sons Bridge. It was moving right along, 20 and then it got kind of delayed for a few days -- a few 21 weeks. I think it's going to get back in construction 22 today. Two problems. One was the guardrails; they couldn't 23 order the guardrails, because of the curve in the bridge, 24 until the bridge was built. Then they got back-ordered on 25 guardrails, so the bridge is there, but there's no 8-8-05 7 1 guardrails on it. And the other issue was a little bit of a 2 right-of-way issue. TexDOT decided to build the approaches 3 a little bit beyond the actual right-of-ways; however, that 4 has been rectified. They pulled the road back into what we 5 actually required, so that issue has been rectified as well. 6 Other than that, I'll just comment on high school -- or high 7 school football is getting ready to start in a couple weeks, 8 and I would recommend everyone join their local booster 9 clubs, whether it be Tivy, Comfort, Ingram, Hunt, whatever 10 one. Those folks do a lot of work. I'm bowing out of that 11 position, at least the Tivy Booster Club, and Guy Overby is 12 now president. And, anyway, I encourage everyone to join 13 their appropriate booster club. That's all I have. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner 4? 15 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Cowboy Camp Meeting 16 is going on this week out near Mountain Home off Highway 27. 17 Commissioner Baldwin's been a part of that for nearly the 18 whole 67 years it's been in existence, so we'll probably see 19 him out there, and I'll be out there Tuesday evening cutting 20 onions. I can't fry fish, but I -- they do let me cut the 21 onions. So, anybody that wants to hear some good preaching 22 and singing and have some good food, there's a place to go 23 for that this week. That's all. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. I'm sure some of 25 you noticed that we made some headway on our State Hospital 8-8-05 8 1 situation with our acute critical care civil commitment beds 2 that we managed to get reallocated out there since they have 3 redesignated that hospital as for -- being for forensic 4 patients. It -- it created quite a difficulty for us in 5 having the availability to handle the residents of Kerr 6 County and the nearby counties who had a need for the type 7 of services they offer out there. And going into this next 8 state budget year beginning September 1, we have 16 beds 9 allocated. We've been making do with 10 beds, and so we've 10 got us a pretty good increase. We're still -- still going 11 to move forward to make an effort to try and get that -- 12 that one ward as a stand-alone operation to be operated by 13 the local Hill Country Community Center for acute civil 14 commitment beds. 15 But thanks to a lot of hard work by 16 Ms. Werlein with the Hill Country Community Center, the 17 Executive Director there, and State Representative Harvey 18 Hilderbran and his staff, and some -- some other folks that 19 were involved, and we were able to get those 16 beds. And I 20 can assure you, it's -- it's very, very much needed, and -- 21 and we're real fortunate to have those. And not only will 22 it save us a lot of money in terms of having to send all of 23 our patients out, it will be of benefit to the law 24 enforcement and those that deal directly with those needing 25 mental health services of being able to handle those 8-8-05 9 1 situations locally. So, when you see Ms. Werlein or 2 Representative Hilderbran and the staffs -- the staff 3 persons of those two individuals, thank them for their 4 effort, because they certainly deserve it. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, I have one 6 other quick item, if you don't mind, for the benefit of the 7 public and the Court. Had a preconstruction conference here 8 Friday on the Kerrville South Wastewater Project, and the 9 contractor was in, the engineer was in, and City of 10 Kerrville was involved, and that's moving along fine. The 11 contracts are getting the necessary inserts to them and will 12 be on the County Attorney's desk sometime this week for his 13 review. And City of Kerrville was here, their Public Works 14 Department, and they had some input into the project, and 15 anticipate that Phases 2 and 3 will be underway, I would 16 think, by the end of this month. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Great. Let's move into the 18 agenda, and first item is Number 1 scheduled at 9:05, and 19 we're not too far past that. Consider and discuss the local 20 option liquor election that is being proposed for Precinct 2 21 and set a special Commissioners Court meeting for 22 September 7th, 2005, to authorize an election. Commissioner 23 Williams. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Judge. I 25 happened to bump into Ms. Stacy Fritz last week, and while 8-8-05 10 1 she was elated to learn the number of signatures that they 2 had to gather for this particular petition drive, she was a 3 little dismayed to learn that some of the time she thought 4 she had to gather them was -- had dissipated and gone 5 another direction. So, the basis of this agenda item is to 6 try to give them a little bit more time. But with us this 7 morning are some of the representatives of this initiative 8 who would like to speak to the Court and just bring us up to 9 date, I believe. In the audience is Mr. Ken Wardlaw, 10 Ms. Fritz, and Junior Fritz. Who's going to be the 11 spokesperson? The big, tall guy. 12 MR. WARDLAW: I guess it would be me. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Ken Wardlaw. Come 14 forward, please, sir. 15 MR. WARDLAW: Good morning, gentlemen. We 16 have formed a group in Center Point called Citizens for 17 Progress of Precinct 2. Precinct 2 is kind of the odd 18 precinct that does not have liquor by the drink; all the 19 other precincts do. It's our contention that if we can get 20 this passed, it will be a boon to the precinct. We can get 21 quality restaurants in Center Point, things like that. It 22 will increase the sales tax. It will increase the tax base. 23 We think it will be a win-win situation for everybody. We 24 have been very diligent in following the exact letter to do 25 everything exactly correctly. Commissioner Williams has 8-8-05 11 1 been working with us, and the County Attorney has looked at 2 what we've done. We've had our ad in the newspaper. We've 3 done -- we have -- we've gotten our original signatures. We 4 now have the petitions in-hand and we are gathering 5 signatures as we speak. So, I just wanted to bring you up 6 to date as to what we're doing and what our intent is, and 7 it is to bring Precinct 2 in line with the rest of the 8 precincts in the county so that everybody will be kind of 9 playing on an even field and we can try to compete and bring 10 more business to the Center Point area. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: For the benefit of 12 the Court, Ken, I think it's important that everybody 13 understand that this is not just for the Center Point area. 14 This is for the entire Precinct 2, which is a good chunk of 15 geography, and your initiative has to encompass all of that, 16 and as many signatures as you can get out there in the 17 precinct. And if these folks are successful in gathering 18 the requisite number of signatures, I'm asking the Court 19 to -- to have a special Commissioners Court meeting on 20 September 7th for one purpose, and that would be to 21 authorize an election. Now, they have to have their number 22 -- correct number of signatures, which is now -- what is the 23 number? 24 MS. FRITZ: 1,234. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: 1,200-some-odd signatures. 8-8-05 12 1 MS. FRITZ: 34. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They have to have 3 them in, have to have them certified as to the fact that 4 they're all signed by people who reside in Precinct 2 and so 5 forth and so on. And if they -- if they pass that 6 threshold, then the Court would be asked on September 7th -- 7 which is the last day that we could authorize an election 8 for November; is that correct, Madam Clerk? 9 MS. PIEPER: That is correct. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 11 MR. WARDLAW: So that's our intent, 'cause 12 the precinct is a very big precinct. It includes Comanche 13 Trace, River Hills, Camp Verde. It's a very big precinct. 14 So, that's what we're trying to do, is bring that precinct 15 into line. I appreciate your time this morning. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would move approval 17 of the request to have a special Commissioners Court meeting 18 for September 7, 2005, on the basis of the correct number of 19 signatures being certified so we can authorize an election 20 in November on the special local -- local option election in 21 Precinct 2. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What time? 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 10 a.m. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 8-8-05 13 1 approval of the agenda item for a meeting September 7th, 2 2005, at 10 a.m. Any question or discussion? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Quick comment. I think 4 Ken went over briefly the amount of effort that's gone into 5 this. I know I've talked to Lou Bright, General Counsel of 6 T.A.B.C., and John Steen, Chairman of T.A.B.C., I don't know 7 how many times. And, for instance, Commissioner Williams 8 has made it to Austin, and Ms. Pieper's been involved, and 9 not to mention the citizens in the audience. This has been 10 a major undertaking, trying to figure out how to do this. 11 It was no easy task. And I'd just like to thank -- I think 12 it's something that -- not sure why it happened originally. 13 Very confusing to look back at the boundaries. I still 14 don't understand the way it all works, because the boundary 15 of the precinct has changed every 10 years during this 16 period, but I'd just like to commend everybody. Y'all have 17 done a lot of work, and I appreciate it. I think it's a 18 good move for the county. 19 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I've got one 20 question, Commissioner. I could wait till September 7th, 21 but I'd better ask it now, I think. First, I like 22 referendum-type elections, local options. If a majority of 23 the people who are eligible to vote want this, then they'll 24 tell us that. You talked about the restaurants. Does it -- 25 is there a requirement that a certain percentage of the 8-8-05 14 1 sales has to be food? Or would this election open it up for 2 alcohol-only sales? 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This election would 4 -- would allow, if -- if approved by the voters, would allow 5 on- and off-premise consumption for beer, liquor, and wine 6 within Precinct 2. And whatever the regulations are in 7 terms of a restaurant in terms of food versus alcohol, those 8 are T.A.B.C. regulations, and whatever -- if anybody wishes 9 to do that, they have to satisfy the Alcohol Beverage Code, 10 not Commissioners Court, to make that happen. Commissioner 11 Letz brought up one -- just to illustrate how interesting 12 this whole process has been, I went through records, and I 13 know you have, and the Clerk has gone through the records 14 with me, and it really is interesting to -- when you realize 15 that back 25 or 30 years ago, I guess, when Precinct 1, 3, 16 and 4 legalized total consumption on and off premises, for 17 whatever reasons -- nobody seems to understand why -- the 18 election wasn't conducted in Precinct 2. And I don't know 19 why. Maybe we were all asleep that day, I don't know, but 20 it didn't happen. So, anyhow, that's all my comments. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask you a 22 question. Ken brought up River Hill. Don't they serve 23 liquor by the drink there? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, country clubs 25 come under a separate -- special set of A.B.C. regulations. 8-8-05 15 1 They can function -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Same with the other 3 one? 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, same with 5 Comanche Trace. They're sort of exempted from the routine 6 of what we established for a package store or a restaurant 7 and so forth and so on, so they're under a separate set of 8 rules. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Currently, as I 10 understand it, whenever -- after a prohibition-type period, 11 and he started running through all of that, the State pretty 12 much said beer statewide, and then it was up to each 13 precinct to modify that, and Precinct 2 never did anything, 14 so they're just under the old state law. But you either had 15 to be proactive and get rid of beer or proactive and go 16 beyond beer. So, there is beer sold in Precinct 2, but no 17 wine or liquor. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And as a result of 19 redistricting over the years, you know, the boundaries of 20 the precinct change. That alters the situation as well, and 21 you have some occurring just on the boundaries, where it's 22 grandfathered in. So, that's the story. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Does this address 24 inside the -- inside the City of Kerrville? 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Anything -- anything 8-8-05 16 1 in Precinct 2. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I believe -- I 4 believe that overrides -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, it does. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, it does; it 7 overrides it. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions or 9 comments on the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify 10 by raising your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Thank 15 you folks for being here today. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 17 MR. WARDLAW: Thank you. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: The next item on the agenda is 19 to consider and discuss the way Texas County and District 20 Retirement System handled the previous late filing 21 penalties. Commissioner Letz? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I put this on the agenda, 23 I guess, after two meetings ago the subject came up. 24 Originally, I stated at that meeting we'd try to get someone 25 from T.C.D.R.S. down here; however, they sent a letter, and 8-8-05 17 1 I think their letter pretty much explains how they handle 2 it, and it's somewhat self-explanatory. I mean, basically, 3 any -- it just -- when they recalculate -- as I understand 4 it, when they recalculate the rate that goes into the 5 retirement system, the -- any penalty that is not paid is 6 absorbed out of that rate, and so it's -- you know, it's not 7 coming directly out of -- certainly, out of any employee's 8 contribution. This comes out of the County's contribution, 9 and that's the way it's handled. So, I just put it on the 10 agenda, as I said I would, to clear this up. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions, comments, 12 or action on that item? If not, let's move forward. Item 13 3, consider and discuss authorizing the River Star Arts and 14 Event Park to construct an outdoor pavilion. Commissioner 15 Williams. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We've had some 17 discussions, Commissioner Letz and I, with Mr. Miller, 18 Executive Director of the Texas State Arts and Crafts 19 Educational Foundation with respect to River Star Arts Park, 20 who they are, what they are, and what they expect to be when 21 they grow up. Mr. Miller? 22 MR. MILLER: Good morning. Thank you. Judge 23 Tinley and Commissioners, thank you for letting me come talk 24 to y'all this morning. We've been in the process for the 25 last two years of building River Star Arts and Event Park 8-8-05 18 1 adjacent to the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center. We've 2 really got most of the groundwork done and utilities and 3 that sort of thing. It is time to start doing a building on 4 the site. We've got two buildings planned in the future. 5 This is the first one, which would be a 4,000-square-foot 6 very plain, simple pavilion; just metal roof, concrete slab, 7 lights and fans facility. Under my contract with the 8 County, I need you-all's permission to build this, which is 9 the reason we're here on this item this morning. I've 10 provided you with some information there on what our 11 investment is to-date in the -- in the park. It's a little 12 over a half million dollars at this point. That worksheet 13 also shows you where those funds came from and what we have 14 done with them. Additionally, there's a letter from the 15 Kerrville Convention/Visitors Bureau from Sudie telling 16 about how she feels that pavilion will help her in marketing 17 Kerrville and Kerr County. And there's just a kind of a 18 little tick list of things we see as the advantages to the 19 County and the City of having a covered pavilion in that 20 location. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bob? 22 MR. MILLER: Yes, sir? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Under your Needs and 24 Uses, the little -- one of the bullets says theater seating 25 for 400 for speakers or musical entertainment. 8-8-05 19 1 MR. MILLER: Yes, sir. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That includes 3 bluegrass music, does it not? 4 MR. MILLER: For your benefit only, sir, we 5 would be more than happy -- 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll vote for this. 7 MR. MILLER: -- to have additional bluegrass 8 concerts. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll vote for this 10 one. (Laughter.) 11 MR. MILLER: Okay. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Also doesn't cost us 13 any money. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I like that 15 part. I really like the next agenda item. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move approval. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm sorry. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's okay. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 22 approval of the agenda item. Any question or discussion on 23 the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 24 your right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8-8-05 20 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 4 MR. MILLER: Thank you, gentlemen. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: That brings us to the next 6 agenda item, which is kind of a companion item. Consider 7 and discuss approval of the City of Kerrville Economic 8 Improvement Corporation to provide funding to River Star 9 Arts and Event Park for the construction of an outdoor 10 pavilion. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Give that to 12 Commissioner Letz. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Commissioner Letz? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the plan of River 15 Star Arts and Event Park is to go to E.I.C. to get funds to 16 do that. Technically, this facility will be located in the 17 county outside of the city limits, and as we did recently on 18 another project, we have to be proactive and let E.I.C. know 19 that we will accept funding in the county, allow them to 20 fund an item in the county, whatever the verbiage may be. 21 So, we put this on the agenda as a separate item, and that's 22 what it does. Anything to add? 23 MR. MILLER: This is a little bit of jumping 24 the gun on my part. I'm trying to get the letter before we 25 go to E.I.C., just to cut the time frame down of all the 8-8-05 21 1 paperwork. I understand once -- if they give us approval, 2 that we've got to jump through all these hurdles before we 3 get started. We're trying to get this built before winter. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: In my mind, this is 5 exactly the type of project that E.I.C. money should be used 6 for. 7 MR. MILLER: I agree with you there, sir, in 8 the same manner that you agree with bluegrass concerts. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bluegrass -- okay, 10 we're in agreement here. But I just think it's important 11 that everybody understands that that's the way we think, 12 that it's economic development. This is economic 13 development. 14 MR. MILLER: Well, and this does even a 15 little bit more than helping Sudie. We've become a real 16 adjunct to the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center. This 17 gives us an outdoor pavilion that can be used in conjunction 18 with activities over there. The current plans are to build 19 it right adjacent to the rodeo arena, and we can see it 20 being used in conjunction with things being done at the 21 rodeo arena. In fact, we've talked to the Extension Agent 22 about how we would gate that so that things could be -- 23 would flow from the arena on over to the pavilion. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Your estimated cost 25 for the pavilion is, I think, about $100,000? 8-8-05 22 1 MR. MILLER: Yes, sir. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You will provide a letter 3 for the Judge to sign at a future date? As I recall, don't 4 we need a specific letter, Judge? Didn't we the last time 5 when we did that? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: There needs to be specific 7 authorization from the Commissioners Court for anything out 8 in the county for the applicant to go forward to E.I.C., 9 whether it's in the nature of a court order or a letter, or 10 a combination of both. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make a motion to 12 approve the agenda item and authorize the County Judge to 13 provide this information to E.I.C. or Mr. Miller at the 14 appropriate time. 15 MR. MILLER: Thank you. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 18 approval of the agenda item, and authorizing the County 19 Judge to provide the appropriate documentation on behalf of 20 the Court when requested. Any further question or 21 discussion on this agenda item? All in favor of the motion, 22 signify by raising your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 8-8-05 23 1 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Thank 2 you, sir. 3 MR. MILLER: Thank you, gentlemen, for your 4 support. We appreciate you. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: The next item that we have on 6 the agenda is to consider an application for floodplain 7 permit F-05-013 and authorize the Judge to sign the same. 8 Mr. Odom? 9 MR. ODOM: Thank you, Judge. Attached is a 10 copy of the floodplain permit that the Judge has referred 11 to, F-05-013, for the bridge built across Third Creek to 12 connect two parcels of land owned by Kerr County known as 13 Flat Rock Park. At this time, we ask that the Court approve 14 the application for the floodplain permit and authorize the 15 Judge to sign the same. It's a technical -- I have to sign 16 off on it, but if I can have the Judge to sign the 17 application as the applicant, then I can sign off on it. We 18 have a no-rise certificate, and we thought that was the 19 appropriate thing to do; instead of my signature on both of 20 them, having the Judge authorize it. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would move 22 authorization of the application for floodplain permit 23 F-05-013 for a bridge in Flat Rock Lake Park. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. I 8-8-05 24 1 assume it includes the authorization for -- 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And authorization for 3 the County Judge to sign it. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any question or comment 5 on the motion? 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I do have a question 7 of Mr. Odom. 8 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir? 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I noticed some work 10 going on down there now, Len, in terms of site preparation 11 for -- 12 MR. ODOM: Site preparation. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- abutments and so 14 forth. 15 MR. ODOM: That's correct. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And is there anything 17 beyond that taking place? 18 MR. ODOM: At this point, no. We're trying 19 to get some contractors to give us some bids. It's 20 difficult to get -- there's so much work going on, and we 21 thought we had a person that would do it, but the State -- 22 the State pulled the project in Comfort there for a while, 23 and so that's been on hold. We have a gentleman coming 24 tomorrow to look at it to see if I can push it up to get a 25 reasonable bid on the thing, so right now we're sort of in 8-8-05 25 1 limbo trying to get that drilled and poured in place. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What you just said 3 and what Commissioner Letz said earlier would indicate that 4 the -- the rail cars that make up the temporary bridge at 5 Hermann Sons will be a little bit delayed in coming our way. 6 MR. ODOM: That's probably true, sir. At 7 least another 30 days. Sometime in September is the way 8 we anticipate it. That's what I was told by Dean Word. I 9 have had the gentleman that was in charge of the project -- 10 took him down there and showed him exactly where I wanted 11 those rail cars placed, and they should take care of it, but 12 at this point they're probably another 30 days off before 13 they complete the project. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, thank you. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: That was the question I had. 16 Commissioner Letz mentioned the -- the guardrails for the 17 bridge being back-ordered, and until that bridge is 18 complete, I assume they're not going to want to lift those 19 cars out of there. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's correct. I 21 wouldn't be surprised if it was closer to 45 to 60 days, 22 'cause it's going to -- I mean, it's going to take some work 23 to get those cars out of there, 'cause Leonard put them in 24 pretty solid last time. 25 MR. ODOM: Right. And even if it is open 8-8-05 26 1 now, it will take them a while to get that. And I've tried 2 to work with them to explain where we're at, and I -- when 3 we get to that point, we'll be back down there to show them 4 how we placed them in. But we'll get it -- we'll get them 5 up here. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second. 7 Any further question or comment? All in favor of the 8 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 9 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 11 (No response.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's 13 move on to Item 6, if we might. Set a public hearing for 14 the revision of plat for Tract 39-A of Kerrville Country 15 Estates in Section Two, recorded in Volume 6, Page 109 of 16 the plat records. 17 MR. ODOM: This is a revision of plat being 18 done under the alternate plat process, thereby eliminating 19 the need for a concept plan or a preliminary. There will 20 still need to be a notice published and a public hearing or 21 final approval by the Court. We ask the Court to set the 22 public hearing for September 12th, 2005, at 10:05 a.m. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Leonard, I notice on 24 this one, as in the following one, that, again, we're not 25 putting the precincts on the agenda item. For those of us 8-8-05 27 1 who may not be too familiar -- 2 MR. ODOM: Sir, I'm sorry. I missed that. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: On the next one as 4 well. 5 MR. ODOM: This should be -- this is in 6 Precinct 1, and then the next item is in Precinct 2. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: All right. I 8 recognize it. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: And you're requesting a public 10 hearing on Kerrville Country Estates for when? 11 MR. ODOM: September the 12th at 10:05 a.m. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 15 public hearing on revision of plat for Tract 39-A of 16 Kerrville Country Estates, Section Two, for September the 17 12th, 2005, at 10:05 a.m. Any question or comment on the 18 motion? All in favor of that motion, signify by raising 19 your right hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Item 7 24 is to set a public hearing for the revision of a plat for 25 Mosty Pecan Grove Subdivision in Volume 7, Page 295 of the 8-8-05 28 1 Plat Records, being located in Precinct 2. 2 MR. ODOM: Correct, sir. This is also a 3 revision of plat under the alternate process -- plat 4 process. Needs to be a notice published and a public 5 hearing and final approval. We ask the Court to set the 6 public hearing for September the 12th, 2005, at 10:10 a.m. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to 10 set a public hearing for the revision of plat for Mosty 11 Pecan Grove Subdivision located in Precinct 2 for September 12 the 12th, 2005, at 10:10 a.m. Any question or comment on 13 the motion? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I hate to even ask a 15 question on this one. This has been before us so many 16 times, but I take it the sale of the previous -- to our 17 knowledge, anyway -- I mean, I understood the last time we 18 approved this that all those lots had been sold. 19 MR. ODOM: That was my impression too, but I 20 didn't get into it. I -- at this point, I'll be working on 21 that plat with him to find out the particulars. I -- I 22 would assume that something came up about -- my speculation 23 is water. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, let me see if I 25 can enlighten the Court and you a little bit about it. I've 8-8-05 29 1 had discussions with the gentleman who -- Don? You may want 2 to step forward just a little bit. 3 MR. EICHLER: Okay. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Since the Court 5 approved the plat, whenever we did that, a month or so 6 ago -- six weeks ago, I guess, this gentleman has determined 7 that he'd like to purchase more than 1.77 acres that 8 originally we -- we broke off of that whole 14-acre tract. 9 And you may recall we had some restrictions on that 10 1.77 acres that disallowed building a dwelling and drilling 11 a well. And, so -- Don, what is your last name? 12 MR. EICHLER: Eichler. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Eichler? 14 MR. EICHLER: E-i-c-h-l-e-r. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mr. Eichler is the 16 intended purchaser, right? You have an option to purchase, 17 or you have purchased? 18 MR. EICHLER: I have a purchase contract. 19 The situation arose where, when we contracted to buy this 20 property, the, oh, 14.9 acres or whatever's in that, the 21 party buying the eastern portion of that, the larger 22 portion, decided that he didn't want that much land. So, 23 all we're requesting is to move that property line just east 24 to encompass a 5-acre tract rather than a 1.7. And -- now, 25 I don't know what y'all's rules are on public hearing on 8-8-05 30 1 moving a lot line, but -- encompassing more property in that 2 lot, but it's -- we've been dealing with this since 3 February. And I know this revision don't have anything to 4 do with what we've done in the past, but to increase that 5 lot size, it seems like it's pretty long and drawn out. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are you just 7 intending to purchase Lot 2, which is 5 acres? 8 MR. EICHLER: That's correct. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Or are you intending 10 to purchase the entire thing? 11 MR. EICHLER: Just Lot 2. Lot 1 tract is 12 sold to the Pam White Family Trust, and we're going to have 13 a simultaneous closing on it. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that -- the answer to 16 your question is, if this had been done the first time as we 17 recommended, you wouldn't have had to go through this 18 process. 19 MR. EICHLER: That's true. I understand 20 that. But we just -- I didn't know that the man decided he 21 wanted to sell more, and we wanted to buy more, and our 22 process has changed and reasons for buying it have changed. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 24 MR. EICHLER: And my property where I live 25 is -- almost joins it; it's, like, 15 feet away from the 8-8-05 31 1 property. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And your access to the 3 property is going to be off Highway 27? 4 MR. EICHLER: Highway 27 and J.J. Lane. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Not off J.J. Lane. No 6 access permitted on J.J. Lane. 7 MR. EICHLER: That's part of the owned 8 private road part, is J.J. Lane. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Nope. There's a 10 provision on this, it's not going to be modified -- unless 11 that lane gets modified, there's no access to either of 12 these lots off J.J. Lane, as I recall. Is that correct, 13 Mr. Odom? 14 MR. EICHLER: I know that was a statement on 15 Lot 1, but it didn't reflect that on Lot 2, and I know we're 16 changing that. But -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Lot 2 was a nonbuildable 18 lot at that time. Now you're making this a buildable lot. 19 MR. EICHLER: Right. Can you give me the 20 reasons behind the Court's decision on no access on a 21 private road that I own -- would own part of? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Because the same -- well, 23 the logic was that for this to go through the Court, at that 24 point that road would have to be brought up to county 25 standards, and the residents do not want to do that. 8-8-05 32 1 MR. EICHLER: That's correct. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Over my objection -- I 3 voted against this originally -- it was decided that no 4 access off this whole subdivision would come off J.J. Lane, 5 and there's a provision to that effect. 6 MR. EICHLER: That's not our intention to 7 come off there, but to have access means to drive down it 8 and drive onto our property, and that's access. And we 9 would have to pull out, drive down on the highway. Now, 10 J.J. Lane is a -- right now is a 30-foot private easement. 11 Currently, they use -- there's a picture of it. They 12 just -- they use 10 feet of it. If there was more roadway 13 needed, and the private people could come together on a 14 maintenance agreement, they could increase the size of that. 15 Highway 27 right directly in front of my house has 15-foot 16 travel lanes. That's all it has, 15 foot, Highway 27. 17 We've got 30-foot right-of-way here. China Street out to 27 18 has 11-foot lanes, with a 28-foot overall paved, 19 shoulder-to-shoulder, including the shoulder part. And 20 we've got six people that currently live down this property, 21 maybe seven, and they don't use any more than what's here. 22 I don't see -- I don't see the point on -- 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sir, all I can say is, 24 the point is that we have subdivision rules in this county, 25 and if we allow this subdivision to be done with a waiver, 8-8-05 33 1 that will open the door for every other subdivision in the 2 county to do the same thing and not follow our rules. 3 MR. EICHLER: But does that change it from a 4 private road? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes -- it doesn't make 6 any difference. Our Subdivision Rules are very clear, 7 whether it's a private road or a public road or a 8 county-maintained or any -- any character, the road will be 9 built to county standards. 10 MR. EICHLER: How about the existing roads 11 that are, like, in the little subdivision on Tallwood and 12 Booster, and I think the other one's called Boxwood? 13 That -- the lanes are, like, a lot less than that. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They're grandfathered, as 15 J.J. Lane is grandfathered right now. But once they -- once 16 it is changed and a new person or a new lot is given access 17 to that road, that opens it up, you know -- 18 MR. EICHLER: Yeah, I know that there was a 19 request by Commissioner Williams that there be more 20 right-of-way dedicated down that road, but it wanted to 21 come -- to service the people that live there, they wanted 22 to take the whole 30 foot off my property, and none of that 23 off the existing people's property that would best be served 24 by that, if they ever needed more than one lane. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, as you and I 8-8-05 34 1 discussed it when you first brought it to my attention, it 2 is not the folks who have those individual lots on the south 3 side of J.J. Lane -- they're not the ones petitioning for 4 something to happen. 5 MR. EICHLER: I understand that. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It is you and/or 7 Mr. Mosty and/or whomever else who is purchasing that 8 property are asking for the change to take place in the lot 9 line. 10 MR. EICHLER: My final point on the whole 11 thing is that if that property is ever developed, whether 12 it's by me or someone else, for residence or commercial, the 13 Court has to approve that subdivision, right? 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 15 MR. EICHLER: If it's resubdivided -- 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If it's going to be 17 other than the way it's being proposed. 18 MR. EICHLER: Don't you have control at that 19 time? If somebody comes in there and builds a restaurant or 20 a motel or a hotel or six houses or whatever they're going 21 to do, don't y'all have to approve that at that time? 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If they're going to 23 build a structure or structures that require water and 24 septic, we're going to have some -- we're going to know 25 about the details about that. 8-8-05 35 1 MR. EICHLER: Yeah. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Whether it's 3 commercial or whether it's residential. 4 MR. EICHLER: But my point is that, wouldn't 5 you have to approve the subdivision -- resubdivision? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They're going to ask for 7 a waiver just like you are. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Unless it's dealt 9 with now. 10 MR. EICHLER: Why don't you have us do that 11 at that time rather than restrict it up front? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What I'm saying is, once 13 we go down the road of giving a waiver on this -- 14 MR. EICHLER: I'm not asking for a waiver. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, you are. You will 16 be. 17 MR. EICHLER: I'm just asking for access off 18 of J.J. Lane to my own property; that 15 feet of that is my 19 property. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I understand, but there 21 is a -- a note on this plat right now that will not permit 22 you to use J.J. Lane to access this lot. 23 MR. EICHLER: Off Lot 1. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So for you to do that, 25 you will either be in violation, or you're going to have to 8-8-05 36 1 come to the Court with a waiver on this revision. 2 MR. EICHLER: If I drive my riding lawnmower 3 across there to mow the yard grass, I'm in violation of the 4 law. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's exactly -- as I 6 understand the law, yes. 7 MR. EICHLER: That's pretty ridiculous. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, it was ridiculous 9 that we approved this the first time, in my opinion. 10 MR. EICHLER: I understand that. But I 11 thought it was ridiculous then -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's -- 13 MR. EICHLER: -- to have required 60 feet of 14 roadway that's being utilized for 8 -- for 10 feet. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We were -- we actually, 16 as I recall, offered a number of accommodations that were 17 much less than that right-of-way. We also offered 18 accommodations -- or for the road not to have to be upgraded 19 at this time, and the developers declined every overture we 20 made. 21 MR. EICHLER: I don't know who you made it 22 to, but I never did receive that. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To the person who owns 24 the property currently. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Whoever came in 8-8-05 37 1 representing Mr. Mosty, that's to whom we made the 2 representations. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, you know, it's -- 4 I'm just one Commissioner. 5 MR. EICHLER: I still don't understand the 6 position of the Court, to restrict access up and down that 7 lane to the property owners that own it, when the people 8 that live there -- there's no maintenance agreement. 9 There's one maintenance agreement on that road established 10 and reported, and that's between Mr. Mosty and Robert Legion 11 that owns one residential tract down there, and he has 12 recorded permission to maintain that roadway in front of his 13 house. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, the question 15 before the Court today is to set a public hearing, and 16 they're going to do that for September the 12th. All of 17 these -- all these details and all this debate really 18 belongs in the public hearing, or at that time. And I -- I 19 honestly believe that if you and whomever, Mr. Voelkel or 20 whomever represents you -- and maybe you're just doing it 21 yourself -- if you were able to sit down out at Road and 22 Bridge with Mr. Odom and any other Commissioner who wants to 23 get involved in it, there may be a solution. But right now, 24 as I indicated to you when you came to talk to me to begin 25 with, I said that was an issue the last time, and don't be 8-8-05 38 1 surprised if it comes up again. And, sure enough, it's come 2 up again. 3 MR. EICHLER: Well, I would recommend it be 4 approved; it was approved last time. And not -- not 5 changing it again here in the middle of the stream. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 7 comments on the motion to set a public hearing? All in 8 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 9 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 11 (No response.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's 13 move to the next item, Number 8. Consider, discuss, and 14 take appropriate action to authorize closure of Avenue C 15 between China Street, State Highway 1350, and First Street 16 on August the 13th of this year between the hours of 8 a.m. 17 and 1 p.m., and instruct Road and Bridge Department to 18 provide temporary blockades and road closure signs. 19 Commissioner Williams. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Judge. 21 This is the second year that I'm aware of that the First 22 Baptist Church of Center Point has its little avenue block 23 party, and which the whole express purpose is to raise money 24 for school kids supplies and so forth. Am I right about 25 that, Kathy? Is that correct, that's the whole purpose? I 8-8-05 39 1 asked Kathy because she's a member of that church. And so I 2 asked them to just give us a letter indicating that. We did 3 it last year. Road and Bridge graciously accommodated the 4 request, and I would move that we authorize Road and Bridge 5 to provide the temporary blockades and closure signs, and 6 that we allow First Baptist Church to close China Street -- 7 Avenue C between China, 1350 and whatever, China -- whatever 8 I got down there. Closure of Avenue C between China Street 9 and First Street on August 13th from the hours of 8 a.m. to 10 1 p.m. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 13 approval of the agenda item. Any question or comment? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Question. This isn't for 15 the chicken race? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, that comes up 17 later. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That comes up next. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: That would be the second 21 annual international -- 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, international. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: -- chicken race? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Chicken race in 25 September. World-class event. 8-8-05 40 1 JUDGE TINLEY: A little cooler weather. Any 2 further question or comment on the motion? All in favor of 3 the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. The 8 next item on the agenda is to consider, discuss, and take 9 appropriate action to adopt a Kerr County policy for 10 emergency maintenance on roads that become impassable for 11 emergency service or law enforcement vehicles. Commissioner 12 Williams? 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: As a result of our 14 last discussion -- while Commissioner Baldwin was relaxing 15 up at wherever it is he was relaxing, we had this discussion 16 and pretty well hacked out the parameters of it, and it was 17 left to me to draft a policy statement. I've done that, 18 included it in your packet. Commissioner Letz and I talked 19 about it, and we made some refinements to it, but 20 essentially this would be the policy that would be followed 21 by Road and Bridge in the event of a -- of a situation where 22 a road that is not on the county-maintained list became -- 23 was alleged to be impassable for law enforcement or 24 emergency service vehicles. And, so, the basic -- the basic 25 scenario is that if that becomes in question, Road and 8-8-05 41 1 Bridge dispatches a Sheriff's deputy out to look at the road 2 and check it out. If the road is, in fact, impassable, then 3 Road and Bridge will take whatever steps necessary to make 4 it passable for the purpose of emergency and/or law 5 enforcement on a one-time basis, and not to be construed as 6 being a permanent solution, but a one-time emergency-type 7 situation. I'd move adoption of the policy. 8 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'm going to second, 9 and I've got some comments. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 11 approval of the policy as incorporated in the agenda item. 12 Any question or comments? 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah. I'm thinking 14 about the Sheriff's determination about what is passable or 15 minimally passable or impassable, and then I see in the 16 introduction, we talk about flooding or erosion and other 17 natural disasters. We got some roads that are so bad that 18 it's difficult for me to -- to get through them in my 19 four-wheel drive pickup, but I can do that. So, if you go 20 out there and you determine that a patrol car or an 21 ambulance can -- the road is passable at 5 miles an hour, is 22 that -- is that sufficient to say it doesn't need any 23 emergency work? Or does the definition of "passable" mean 24 something a little more reasonable than that? I'm talking 25 to you, Mr. Sheriff. 8-8-05 42 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'm not sure I want to 2 answer. (Laughter.) I'm trying to read what y'all wrote. 3 Well, in the past -- and another point in here I saw real 4 fast -- this is the first time I've seen this statement, but 5 the only way we did it is if we flat could not get across, 6 okay, at all, then we told Road and Bridge that it was 7 impassable. Now, if we could even go around through grass 8 or another little way or find any other way around, then we 9 did not report it as being impassable. It was still 10 passable. My only -- I'm changing the subject. I hope that 11 answers your question. 12 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: It helps. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: My only concern in this 14 is, it says due to flooding and/or erosion. Now, erosion 15 could cover everything on every county road -- you know, 16 nonmaintained county road there is, and I would -- it could 17 be from 10 years of just water or dirt collapsing or 18 whatever, and I'm not sure that I want our officers having 19 to -- I'm not sure Len would want to have to call us to 20 check every single dirt path road in the county to see -- 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sheriff, it says 22 flooding and/or erosion from flooding. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But the erosion from 24 flooding could be, you know, over a matter of 20 years worth 25 of erosion, and then all of a sudden, one day another part 8-8-05 43 1 fell off. That's not during a flood, but it still -- 2 residents may consider it erosion. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Say, "flooding or other 4 natural disaster." 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We can take that out 6 if that's troublesome. That's not a problem. 7 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Actually, one of the 8 examples I'm thinking about, Commissioner Baldwin, is 9 Primrose Lane. I know it's not in Precinct 4, but you can 10 see it from Precinct 4. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But it could be in 12 Precinct 4 if you wanted it. 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: The next census, it 14 may be. But, anyhow, that's a pretty bad road. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I think that we 16 have actually used this system on that road. 17 MR. ODOM: On that road. Several times. 18 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Well, that -- that 19 helps me understand that. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the -- 21 MR. ODOM: But nothing has been done as far 22 as maintenance on their part, and that's -- that's the key. 23 I mean, when it's drive -- it -- maintenance needs to be 24 done on it. Not us, as -- 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: A lot of this, a patrol 8-8-05 44 1 vehicle may not be able to get it, but a four-wheel drive 2 vehicle may. And we -- we still may say that that's still 3 passable, because you can get up in there with four-wheel 4 drive. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think, after I reread 6 it, or -- or today, I have a slight concern about on the 7 cost side. If a road gets washed out, or a bridge gets 8 washed out more, you know, minimum passable may be 9 construction of a bridge. And I think we probably ought to 10 put a dollar figure on there, or add a provision -- instead 11 of saying Road and Bridge shall do it, you shall -- shall do 12 it or come to the Court for a determination. Because, I 13 mean, I don't want to get -- I don't want to pass an order 14 that says we're going to spend half a million dollars on 15 fixing a road after a flood. 16 MR. ODOM: For a non-County-maintained road. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Especially if it's a 18 non-County-maintained road. 19 MR. ODOM: I don't know if you can. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we probably ought 21 to give Road and Bridge the authority to -- 22 MR. EMERSON: Why don't you just change the 23 "shall" to a "may"? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where? 25 MR. EMERSON: Instead of putting a dollar 8-8-05 45 1 qualification. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which paragraph? 3 MR. EMERSON: Number 4. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: "May" instead of 5 "shall." Okay, that will do it. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And if the -- and that 7 puts it on -- the burden on the residents. If they want 8 it -- or disagree with the determination, they can always 9 bring it to the Court. 10 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That would be two 12 corrections there, or changes. In the lead paragraph, on 13 the third line, after "flooding," delete the words, "and/or 14 erosion from flooding." And then, in Number 4, Road and 15 Bridge Department, change "shall" to "may." 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And on Number 5, I'd 17 just be a little bit more comfortable -- 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sorry, I can't hear 19 you, Sheriff. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: On Number 5, I would 21 just feel a little bit more comfortable if you change the 22 word "certified" to just as being "considered." I don't 23 think we're certifying to anything when an officer just goes 24 out there and comes back on the radio. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What would you change 8-8-05 46 1 it to? 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: "Considered," or 3 considered as -- 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. All right. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- impassable. Not 6 certified as. 7 MR. ODOM: Best judgment. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah, in their judgment. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The problem I see with 10 it is that we need to make it clear to the landowners and 11 property owners that it is truly a one-time basis, on a 12 one-time basis. I guess "one-time basis" is good words. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's in Number 4, 14 Commissioner. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've got it. I've got 16 it circled and squared up here and everything. But I -- I 17 would -- maybe you can put it in block letters or capital 18 letters, you know, where -- I remember in one of your other 19 documents, if you put things in capital letters, that means 20 you're shouting. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But I just -- I'm 23 serious. People come back sometimes and don't -- don't 24 understand that; that if we go in there and fix it one time, 25 they're going to expect it -- 8-8-05 47 1 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- every time. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Why don't we add 4 "only"? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just to make that 6 clear. Just real clear somewhere. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So we'll say on a 8 one-time basis only. 9 MR. ODOM: If you consider, over the last 10 couple of years, we've had two years of floods, then you do 11 know how busy we are trying to get what we maintain, so this 12 will be doing other stuff outside our -- our scope of work. 13 So, understand that things are going to slow down with what 14 we have to maintain, because we have this obligation too. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think that word "may" 16 also gives you a whole lot of flexibility. Obviously, I 17 expect you to work on the County-maintained roads first, and 18 this is done to fit in -- 19 MR. ODOM: Fit in. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- as you can. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And if my memory 22 serves me, when we addressed this a year or two ago, we had 23 gotten a County Attorney's opinion that we can do this; we 24 can go on private property and do this kind of maintenance 25 under these conditions. 8-8-05 48 1 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Sheriff's -- 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Public health and 3 safety in the state. So one other additional change, then, 4 would be on Number 4, the situation on a one-time basis, add 5 the word "only." Move approval of the policy as amended. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to 8 approve the policy as amended. Any questions or comments 9 additionally? With regard to the one year's flood damage 10 not being repaired and coming back and having the same issue 11 at subsequent years, when we're talking about "exist due to 12 flooding," one option may to be insert, "or other current 13 natural disaster." High winds, trees fell into the roadway. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where would that be, 15 Judge? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Up at the opening paragraph. 17 Due to flooding and/or other current natural disaster, or 18 present natural disaster. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I like "current" better. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Current's probably better. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Current. That's good. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You should have been a 24 lawyer. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Yeah, I thought about 8-8-05 49 1 it, but... (Laughter.) 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's fine. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Is that included in 4 your motion? 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. And I will 6 redraft it so everybody has a clean copy. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or 8 comments? All in favor of the motion as amended, signify by 9 raising your right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 12 (No response.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's 14 move to Item 10, discuss and consider advertising for 15 Request for Proposals to handle the administration of Kerr 16 County health insurance program. Commissioner Baldwin. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, sir. I 18 want to preface my comments with a couple of issues. One, I 19 have -- I have nothing against Don and his operation down at 20 Seguin. He's a great guy, been super responsive. This is 21 not a personal thing with him in any way, and I've told him 22 that over the phone last week. Number two, I don't even 23 know if you can legally change agents in the middle of the 24 stream. Hopefully we can -- we can find that out for sure. 25 But it's just been brought to my attention that -- and the 8-8-05 50 1 more I think about it, the -- it just -- it just sounds like 2 a better thing to have an agent -- our agent a local person 3 that we can get our hands on, we can get on the phone, that 4 can get in their car and drive to this building or any other 5 building. And I'll give you an example. I had an eye exam 6 last week, just -- not because my eyes are bad, but I wanted 7 to go through this issue to find out how it worked, and sure 8 enough, there was some stumbling blocks with some of it, 9 with my -- with my little credit card thing. 10 And if -- and I came back and got on the 11 phone with Don, and he faxed me some things back and forth, 12 and it's all going to work out fine. But if I had -- if we 13 had a local agent, that person could hop in the car and meet 14 me there and address it right there on the spot. And I'm 15 sure that there are many other issues. That's just one that 16 I personally encountered. The things like when we have new 17 hires and getting them registered and signed up and to be a 18 part of the system, or people leave our employment, and 19 deleting them from the system. It just seems to me that it 20 would be more of a simple thing to have a local person. I 21 mean, that's all -- that's all I have to say about that. 22 MR. WALLACE: Judge, can I speak? 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, sir. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There's Don. I was 25 just saying nice things about you. Were you in here? 8-8-05 51 1 MR. WALLACE: I heard you, yes, sir. Thank 2 you, I appreciate that. I understand your concern. And 3 originally, when we -- when I brought Mutual of Omaha in 4 here and quoted on your group, I talked with Mutual of 5 Omaha. Maybe I should have talked with the Judge or 6 somebody, but I visited with them and I said, "Do you think 7 we need some local representation?" And their comment was, 8 "No, we know you do a good job and you'll take care of the 9 problems as they come up." So, I went ahead and took it 10 just myself, and no local person involved in the situation. 11 I -- I believe we've done a good job. Michelle responds to 12 everybody in a timely manner. Originally, to get things 13 going, it doesn't matter who you change to or what you do, 14 you're going to have some problems when you change. You 15 know, Mutual of Omaha had ice storms and things that they 16 couldn't get this done and that done, and -- but we've got 17 it all ironed out now. And, you know, we know the plan; we 18 know how it works, we know who to call, we know how to get 19 things done now. In the beginning, of course, we had to -- 20 it was a learning process for us, 'cause we hadn't put into 21 business with Mutual of Omaha before. We know how 22 self-funded plans work. We've been doing them for 17 years, 23 so we know about the ad and the spec and how all that works. 24 So, what I have done -- and you talk about 25 somebody local. I have, I guess you'd say, employed, or 8-8-05 52 1 brought on board a gentleman -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 3 MR. WALLACE: -- here in town who is a block 4 from the courthouse, over here at 820 Main Street. Some of 5 you know him, I'm sure. I didn't know him. I didn't know 6 local agents here, so I called Blue Cross, I called Humana, 7 I called United Health Care. All of them gave me this guy's 8 name. They gave me some others, but all of them gave me 9 this gentleman's name, and he has agreed to be your local 10 agent. He's agreed to come over once a week to Barbara's 11 office and do whatever Barbara needs done. And if you -- 12 she needs to send people over to his office, as I guess 13 she's doing with Mr. Finley on the -- their products; I'm 14 not sure. But I think this will be a good situation for 15 you. And you can -- you can walk over there. Your 16 employees can walk over there. He can come over here. 17 Don't even have to get in the car, Buster; you can walk. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bicycles. 19 MR. WALLACE: But, anyway, I'd like for you 20 to give this a try before you kick me out the back door, so 21 to speak. I think -- I think everybody will be happy with 22 it. If y'all would agree to let us try this and see what 23 happens, I'll get with Barbara, and he and Todd and myself 24 and Barbara will set down and work out whatever Barbara 25 wants to try to help her out in her office. If she needs 8-8-05 53 1 him over here more than once a week, whatever. Whatever it 2 takes to help the situation. I don't know. That's the best 3 I can do for you. And I know Mr. Letz knows him; he 4 mentioned your name in our conversation. And -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, a lot of people 6 do that, but you can't -- can't hang a hat on that deal. 7 MR. WALLACE: Not sure if that's -- you know. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Don, my first question 9 is kind of my annual boy-dummy question here. Does this 10 fellow -- is he familiar with Mutual of Omaha and all those 11 things that we do? 12 MR. WALLACE: He's familiar with the 13 self-funding plans, yes. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 15 MR. WALLACE: Yes, he does have some 16 self-funding. He was telling me about a car dealership that 17 he has about 150 lives, so, yeah, I checked that out to make 18 sure. I wasn't going to get somebody to work with me that 19 didn't know self-funding, because it's -- it's a little 20 different from just, you know, paying your premiums every 21 month and -- and not having to worry about all the different 22 things that are involved in self-funding. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Don, is this 24 gentleman -- or this Hill Country group, are they going to 25 be working for you, or are they going to be replacing you? 8-8-05 54 1 MR. WALLACE: They're going to be working 2 with me. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: With you? 4 MR. WALLACE: Yes, sir. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How are they going to 6 be compensated? 7 MR. WALLACE: We're going to split some 8 commission. Yeah, he's -- we -- we have -- we have sat down 9 and talked about that, and until we meet with Barbara and 10 see, you know, what she expects of him or what she would 11 like for him to do to make things easier on her office -- 12 you know, we hadn't set a dollar amount of how we're going 13 to split it. And, you know, we have agreed that, you know, 14 if we agree on a dollar amount and it involves more work 15 than what starts out, then we'll change it. But I think 16 you'll be real happy. Blue Cross just -- they were just 17 elated that -- they thought he was the -- you know, said he 18 was just a great guy. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Question. 20 MR. WALLACE: Did a good job. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Don, the question I have 22 is probably to Mr. Looney and the County Attorney. I don't 23 see this as any kind of a change, really, in the -- in our 24 policy or our contract, other than Mr. Wallace is, you know, 25 teaming up with someone locally. Am I looking at that 8-8-05 55 1 correctly? 2 MR. LOONEY: Excuse me, Judge. Gary Looney. 3 I don't -- I don't see any restrictions in it, unless I'm -- 4 and I just spoke to the County Attorney; we're going to go 5 back and look at the bid specifications to be sure that 6 there's nothing in there that would be restrictive for 7 subcontractors based on the initial certification of the 8 contracts. I don't believe there is anything in there that 9 would restrict Mr. Wallace from, in essence, subcontracting 10 these services in this area, since there is no impact on the 11 accounts themselves. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. And y'all will get 13 back to us? 14 MR. LOONEY: We'll be able to let you know 15 very quickly. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Did you have anything further, 17 Mr. Wallace? 18 MR. WALLACE: No. I just appreciate the 19 business, and I'm trying my best to take care of you and do 20 what you want done. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We have someone else 22 that wishes to speak. If you'd come forward and give us 23 your name and address, please? 24 MS. JETTON: Margie Jetton. I have Advanced 25 Insurance at 715 Hill Country Drive, Suite 4. The reason 8-8-05 56 1 that I've come here is for -- very similar to Mr. Wallace. 2 In fact, when the County awarded Mr. Wallace the bid in the 3 first place, I made two phone calls, because I do represent 4 both Mutual of Omaha and AFLAC, and I made two phone calls 5 to his office offering to help him free, and never got a 6 return phone call. I hope you got the message. But, 7 anyway, I agree that part of the problem has been -- in 8 fact, the majority of the problem has been not just the 9 insurance companies, because like I said, I've represented 10 Mutual of Omaha for a long time, AFLAC, probably close to 15 11 years. I think the problem has been that you didn't have a 12 local representative in the last several months. I have 13 brought with me both Caroline Twiford, who is the District 14 Manager for AFLAC, and Bobby Zirkel. Bobby, could you step 15 up here with me a minute? Do you mind? Bobby is the broker 16 I use for my group products. 17 I have had group experience when I first 18 started in insurance, which was -- I'll date myself, but it 19 was about 20 years ago. All I did for the first 10 years 20 was group. Then, when I moved to Kerrville, I became an 21 independent agent, so I'm not bound to any one company. 22 Bobby -- the reason for my alliance with him is all they do 23 is group insurance. You do have the authority, if you want, 24 to change an agent midstream. Both AFLAC and Mutual of 25 Omaha have both already told me that, and I knew it, because 8-8-05 57 1 it's happened to me before in -- in counties that I didn't 2 -- I wasn't able to service because they were too far away. 3 When I moved to Kerrville and decided to stay here, then I 4 just drew a circle around myself and said this is as far as 5 I can properly service. And, anyway, I just wanted Bobby to 6 say a few words. 7 MR. ZIRKEL: Good morning. Your plan that 8 you have here is self-insured, but the other part of that is 9 that it is a health reimbursement account. That's a new 10 type of plan, and I've reviewed that and I agree that it is 11 a really good plan. I think it's exactly what's this county 12 needs. But, however, because of the differences on it, the 13 key to success for a plan like this is -- because it is a 14 consumer-driven plan, and your employees are the consumers, 15 the big part of that is education, is going around educating 16 those folks as to how to use that plan, what those dollars 17 can be spent on, how to insure that they aren't using their 18 HRA against their FSA to where they -- those coordinate with 19 each other, not using them in conjunction with each other. 20 The other part of that is talking to not only the employees 21 that are active here, but the ones that are retired. That's 22 the reason that we talk to Margie, is she has such a good 23 rapport with everyone in this town, but especially with some 24 of the seniors. I met with Carey Malek last week. He felt 25 that probably half the county employees understand how to 8-8-05 58 1 use this plan to the best benefit, but he felt like the 2 retirees had much less of a knowledge of the plan, how to 3 use the plan properly. This is a plan that can be in 4 place -- this type of a plan can be in place for years and 5 will allow, I believe, the County to save money over those 6 years, but I think education to those folks and 7 representation to those -- to your County employees here is 8 the key to that plan. And that's why we are -- as Margie 9 said, the agent is a -- is -- we serve at the privilege of 10 the County Commissioners, and so that can be changed at any 11 time, to my knowledge. That's what I understand. 12 Appreciate your time. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 14 MS. JETTON: I think that's all I had to say. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, ma'am. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you very much. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything further on this 18 particular item? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess, so I understand 20 where we are, we're going to go out for health insurance 21 like we do every year? November, more or less? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Probably need to be thinking 23 about earlier than that, because probably, ideally, we 24 should have the proposals go out so that the bids are 25 returned by approximately mid-October, Mr. Looney? 8-8-05 59 1 MR. LOONEY: Yes, sir. Now, one of the 2 things I'd like to do is -- I wasn't sure; when I was here 3 last, we talked about doing a workshop. I'd like to get 4 that scheduled so we can do that workshop, probably in the 5 third week of this month, if we can. And if we -- 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Maybe we can do it the 7 afternoon of our next meeting. 8 MR. LOONEY: If you can do that, that would 9 be fine. I'd like to be able to -- at that time, we'll go 10 over all of the bid specifications, all the things that 11 we're going to be doing going forward and the timeline for 12 the bid process and the status of where we are today. 13 Current status. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Afternoon of our -- 15 not this week's budget meeting, but next week? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, the Commissioners 17 Court meeting. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: 22nd. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 22nd. 20 MR. LOONEY: On the 22nd? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That seems like a good 22 time. We can do that, and that just -- I mean, with that 23 looming, I don't see any reason to really tinker too much 24 with it. Mr. Wallace is just -- that's fine. And then we 25 can look at if we want to make that a requirement in our 8-8-05 60 1 next bid package. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. That's fine. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. 4 MR. LOONEY: Thank you. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: See if we can set that up, and 6 we'll be in touch. 7 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: The idea that we 8 need a local agent down the street is just sort of a mystery 9 to me. I've got another insurance policy, medical, and my 10 local agent's in Atlanta, Georgia, and it doesn't slow down 11 or hinder my ability to receive payments on claims. It 12 could be in India; it wouldn't make any difference in the 13 information age. So, I'm going to need some convincing that 14 there's some value to having somebody down the street from 15 us. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, does that person 17 from Atlanta come up and enroll all your new hires? 18 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: No, just like they 19 don't enroll new hires over at Walmart. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, but they need to 21 here. 22 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Somebody in the 23 Personnel Department enrolls them. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They need to here, is 25 the issue. Okay, I agree with you; we'll put it off. No 8-8-05 61 1 action here, Judge. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions, comments, 3 or matter to be offered in connection with Item 10? If not, 4 we'll move on to Item 11. 5 MR. WALLACE: Thank y'all. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Consider and discuss 7 evaluations of employees that report directly to the 8 Commissioners Court. Commissioner Letz. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I put this on the agenda 10 for a look back at what we decided last time we looked at 11 this topic, and I think the minutes reflect that we were 12 just going to turn in our evaluations and that was kind of 13 it. We would meet one-on-one with employees if we wanted. 14 With budget coming on, I think it -- how we evaluate 15 employees, and it's a good time to discuss organization of 16 some of these departments. My preference would be to have 17 all the employees that report straight to us come in before 18 the Court in executive session. If they choose to do it in 19 open session, we can do it in open session, and meet with 20 them like we did, I believe, last year or two years ago. I 21 think that's -- you know, it's more valuable, in my mind, to 22 -- for the employees primarily to get the feeling of the 23 full Court. Just because I may not be happy with one of 24 them doesn't mean that the majority of the Court isn't -- is 25 very happy. So, I'd just like to schedule this at probably 8-8-05 62 1 one of our budget workshops coming up in the afternoon. I 2 think this will have a budget impact. I just wanted to put 3 it on the agenda to get the rest of the Court's feeling. 4 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Where do we stand 5 currently? Individually, we've written individual 6 appraisals, and they're -- where are they? 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I turned mine in to 8 Ms. Mitchell, so I assume she has them in a folder. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: I did likewise. 10 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: But the individuals 11 that report to us have not yet seen those appraisals? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think that's correct. 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay. So, the next 14 step is, they need to -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They need to get them. 16 We need to mail them out to them, and then we need to 17 schedule -- 18 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: And then, 19 Commissioner, would you -- are you suggesting that they 20 should come in here, or they will have the opportunity to 21 come here and talk to us? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think they will come in 23 here. They shall. 24 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's what I wanted 25 to know. All right. 8-8-05 63 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And they have -- the 2 way I understand it, they have the option whether they want 3 to be in open session or in executive session. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: That will be true. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think that's a good 6 idea, to do it in front of the whole Court. I am going to 7 do mine individually, and then I will be happy to bring that 8 to the Court. But as far as the interview and sitting down 9 and doing the back-and-forth thing and them signing off on 10 our conversation, that's going to be a private issue for me. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's fine. I just 12 think we're giving -- if we want to make a change in how 13 they're doing something, I think it really needs to come to 14 the full Court. And that's -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure. Sure, it could 16 affect the budget. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: When do you suggest 18 we do it? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably -- I'd say maybe 20 next budget meeting. Not this week, but maybe the following 21 week. I know that morning's taken up. I can't remember the 22 schedule we have for that one. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: The 17th, in the afternoon, we 24 have the ESD workshop. We may want to do it after that. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, traditionally, 8-8-05 64 1 this process last time maybe took an hour. I mean, it's not 2 an extremely long process. And we have added a few. I 3 think there's -- I mean, some of the departments are so 4 small, they're basically one-person departments, but some of 5 them are larger and may take a little bit longer. But I 6 just don't think -- this is an hour, hour and a half at 7 most. 8 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: My calendar shows 9 we've got a meeting at 9:00 and 1:30 on the 17th. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, 1:30 is the ESD 11 workshop. And that's why I mentioned we may want to do it 12 for, say, 3 o'clock on the 17th. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That'd be fine. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That'd be fine. Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can I say something 16 about ESD right quick? 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Sure. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The old program of -- 19 of the state agency coming out into the field and making 20 presentations like they did at Mountain Home, Commissioner, 21 is no longer. 22 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's too bad. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They lost their 24 funding to do that. So, we -- we're going to go to Plan B, 25 and we'll have a presentation in here that day; it just 8-8-05 65 1 won't be by state agency. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, we don't need a 3 court order to do that; we can just set that. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm, yeah, on the -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On the employees. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Review of the employee 7 evaluations for 3 p.m. on the 17th of this month. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: That's what I've got it down 10 for. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right, thank you. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 13 MR. HOLEKAMP: Judge? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Holekamp? 15 MR. HOLEKAMP: Question on that -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, sir? 17 MR. HOLEKAMP: -- last item. Currently, I 18 have an agenda item that's set for tomorrow afternoon at 19 1:30. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 21 MR. HOLEKAMP: And on there, it says discuss 22 maintenance capabilities/consolidation of department 23 functions or services at County facilities and/or 24 City/County facilities or operations. Wouldn't -- we could 25 do that all under mine at the same time. That's basically 8-8-05 66 1 what you're asking; is that correct? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The agenda item tomorrow 3 is largely related to mowing that we're -- you know, and 4 looking at other -- some other functions that's more 5 specific. 6 MR. HOLEKAMP: I saw the consolidation of 7 some of the functions, and I thought, well, okay. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Might be. 10 MR. HOLEKAMP: And I didn't know what that 11 might be. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It might be, but the 13 other is employee review. 14 MR. HOLEKAMP: I understand. I understand, 15 okay. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's move to Item 12, 18 if we might. Consider and discuss status of the E.B.A. 19 lawsuit. Precinct 3 Commissioner. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, I put this on the 21 agenda. I guess two meetings ago, one of our constituents 22 came before the Court and asked what the status of the 23 lawsuit was, and I just put it on the agenda. I attached a 24 copy of a letter that we received from our outside counsel 25 on this. It doesn't really go into -- you know, it's just a 8-8-05 67 1 summary of where we are, which basically is that we are 2 waiting to go do depositions with Union Life. Those are 3 pending, and that's kind of the status. And there's, I 4 guess -- lawsuits, I'm learning, at this level are -- move 5 very, very slow, which this actually is an identical report 6 that the Court received in April, I believe. But we might 7 as well go ahead and make it public that that's where we 8 are, waiting to do depositions. And I don't know if the 9 County Attorney has anything further beyond what 10 Mr. Walraven said in his letter or not. 11 MR. EMERSON: Not that could be disclosed 12 without being in executive session, no, sir. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay -- I'm sorry. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want to just 16 reiterate or strengthen one of his sentences he just made, 17 is that the previous report we had -- and I think it was 18 April -- this is basically the exact same thing; we're going 19 to fly to Washington and get these depositions. Well, I'm 20 wondering, when is that going to happen? Are we really 21 going to do it, or are we just going to talk about it for a 22 year or two? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We've talked about it for 24 six months, I can tell you that. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 8-8-05 68 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Maybe we ought to 2 discuss -- 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have a concern with 4 that. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Maybe we should 6 discuss it with the County Attorney in executive session. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Anyway, that is the 8 status for the public as to where that lawsuit is. It is 9 muddling along very slow, waiting on depositions. And we 10 may need to go into executive session later on today to 11 discuss further details of it, where we are on that lawsuit. 12 That's all I had, Judge, on that. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anything -- any other 14 member of the Court have anything to offer on that? Why 15 don't we take a quick recess for about, oh, 15, 20 minutes. 16 (Recess taken from 10:20 a.m. to 10:43 a.m.) 17 - - - - - - - - - - 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Why don't we go ahead and come 19 back to order. We were in recess for a bit. Let's move to 20 Item 14, consider and discuss solicitation of Request for 21 Proposals for emergency medical service to Kerr County 22 residents. I put this on the agenda as a means of trying to 23 make sure we have all of our options open on the EMS issue, 24 to be able to properly consider that. The Court may want to 25 look at that in conjunction with the previous one, or not. 8-8-05 69 1 Whatever the Court's pleasure is, I'll be happy to comply. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I asked the Judge 3 to move this up, 'cause I think this is certainly related to 4 Item 13, which is the EMS contract with City of Kerrville. 5 But I think there's just some information that I have 6 received in this area that I thought would really be helpful 7 before we really get started on the other one. One, I have 8 visited with a company that provides service in south Texas 9 as the primary, and also a company that provides secondary 10 service in Kendall County, Southern Cross Ambulance, 11 Incorporated. They're certainly interested in pursuing 12 something with us if the situation lends itself. I have 13 talked to them and said that, you know, my intent is that we 14 certainly continue to work out an arrangement with Kendall 15 County, but we could not -- I mean with City of Kerrville, 16 but we couldn't, in my mind, afford to -- to wait much 17 longer, based on the response we received from the City of 18 Kerrville at our last offer. So, I really -- I think that 19 we should go out for proposals for EMS service. 20 Additionally, I've talked with a company 21 called Alexander Billing and Consulting; in fact, they're on 22 their way right now from Boerne, as I understand from a 23 phone message; that they're going to drop off a packet of 24 information. They are a billing company only, and could 25 consult the EMS services. And it's come to my attention 8-8-05 70 1 that there are several counties -- quite a few counties in 2 the state that have hired this company, and cities as well 3 that hire them to do the billing 100 percent, or part of the 4 collections. It's kind of -- you can pick how much of their 5 service they offer. But that is something I'm very 6 interested in pursuing. And also they have a lot of 7 information as to what other counties and municipalities in 8 south Texas, this region, are charging for their services. 9 So, I think the -- you know, in addition to 10 going out for proposals for the EMS services, I think that 11 we should also go out for proposals on billing for EMS 12 services. I think that there's -- they can be separate or 13 they can be combined. But even if -- in my mind, I would 14 like to explore possibly going for an outside billing 15 company, even if we use the City of Kerrville for the EMS 16 service, because I think that gives us a lot more control 17 over that portion of it that we, up to now, have had no 18 control over. I think we have much more flexibility in 19 setting rates, determining how much is collected, and 20 getting that whole big black box in disallowables. So, 21 that's kind of what -- you know, what I found out in the 22 past two weeks visiting with these companies, and there are 23 companies out there that are very anxious to work and talk 24 with us. 25 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: We need to know what 8-8-05 71 1 our options are, and those two -- if we took those two 2 steps, that would open up the universe of options available 3 to you. So, I like the ideas that you've presented, and I'm 4 in favor of it. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I like the idea of 6 exploring all of our options. I think we should. But I 7 found a little distressing this morning, as I read the 8 newspaper article, the comment that the County seems to want 9 to be a partner instead of being a client. And if the 10 attitude is that we are only a client and don't have the 11 right to suggest other options, or -- or suggest that 12 perhaps certain things could be improved upon based on input 13 we're all getting, then I think -- you know, then I think we 14 have a real problem. And I -- I'm confident that each of 15 you have had just as many discussions with -- with 16 constituents as I have about some of the shortcomings of the 17 existing system, administrative side of the system. I 18 hasten to say that it's the administrative side of the 19 system, not the quality of service that's rendered by the 20 ambulance or the EMS people themselves. I don't think 21 anybody has any quarrel with that, and I, for one, do not. 22 But it is the administrative side, the handling of the 23 claims, the handling of the collections, the handling of the 24 bad debts, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And if we are 25 -- if we are going to be foreclosed from examining those 8-8-05 72 1 things and making suggestions, then I guess we are, in fact, 2 going to be treated as a client and not listened to, and 3 that would be unfortunate. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have a comment on that, 5 but I think it comes in the next agenda item. On this item, 6 I will make a motion that we go out for Request for 7 Proposals for emergency -- emergency medical services for 8 Kerr County residents, or for the Kerrville -- or for the 9 county portion of Kerr County, and go out for proposals for 10 billing services for EMS -- emergency medical services. 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to -- 13 MR. SCOTT: Judge? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Just a moment, please, sir. 15 Motion made and seconded to advertise for Request for 16 Proposals for emergency medical service, to include billing 17 services, either in conjunction with or separately. Any 18 question or comment? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I just think that -- a 20 comment that I have, before you get to this gentleman who 21 has a hand up, is that this in no way means that I want to 22 stop trying to work out a deal with the City of Kerrville. 23 This is just something I think that we need to do from a 24 time standpoint, as our backs are getting to the point of 25 being up against the wall, and we need to be able to have 8-8-05 73 1 something in place by September 30th. And I think it will 2 take a little bit of time to -- to -- you know, if we have 3 to go to outside service to do that. So, I still am very 4 optimistic. I visited with three members of City Council in 5 the past week, and they seem optimistic we can come to 6 terms. So, I just want to make that on the record, that 7 this is not a signal to City Council. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, sir? If you'd come 9 forward and give your name and address for the reporter, and 10 whatever comments you have on that. 11 MR. SCOTT: I'm Harrison Scott, 605 Florence. 12 The comment I have is the County of Galveston had an 13 emergency service contract in this last -- oh, several 14 months ago; they just kind of shut down with about two weeks 15 notice, and there was a bunch of the cities, like Texas 16 City, a bunch of those, that had contracted out ambulance 17 service. What I would recommend that y'all consider is that 18 you -- if you pursue that option, is that you request an 19 annual financial statement from that ambulance company, and 20 it might suit us well to keep us from getting in that same 21 predicament should we choose that option. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Very good point. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. Good point. 24 Any other question or comments on the motion? 25 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Judge, the -- the 8-8-05 74 1 concern that my constituents seem to express more than any 2 other has to do with the reliability of the service. The 3 questions are, are we going to have EMS service after 4 September 30th? And the answer is yes, we are. We're not 5 going to let people outside of the city limits go without 6 EMS service. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And, Judge, one other 8 thing. I believe the City -- though I have yet to receive 9 anything from the City after the last -- declining our 10 offer. Maybe you've received a letter from the City; I 11 don't know. So, the only communication I've had about the 12 City's rejection of our proposal was through the press, 13 and -- and there was a comment in that article by the 14 Kerrville Daily Times that the City was -- would be willing, 15 or be more than happy to help with going out for proposals, 16 and I think we need to take them up on that. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: To bring you a little closer 18 up to date, when I received that communication from the 19 Interim Assistant City Manager, that same day I called the 20 Interim Assistant City Manager and took him up on that 21 offer. And I -- as I recall, I communicated it to -- that I 22 was going to do so to Commissioner Baldwin. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You did. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: And, as a consequence, I 25 subsequently had a short visit with the Interim City 8-8-05 75 1 Manager, and I've also had some communications with 2 Guadalupe County, who recently submitted a Request for 3 Proposals, and I provided each of you with a copy of what I 4 got from Guadalupe County. They were kind enough to get me 5 something very promptly. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, who's going to do 7 this? You? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Here's your EMS liaison right 9 here. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What was the question? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Who's going to -- who and 12 how are we -- who's going to get this Request for Proposals 13 out, and how are we going to do it? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: County Judge. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's what I thought. I 16 agree wholeheartedly. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Any other 18 questions? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: When? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I guess the County 21 Judge and the County Attorney maybe better take a peek at 22 it. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Probably need some input from 24 the EMS liaison, wouldn't you think? 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 8-8-05 76 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. I just gave it 2 to you. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's go. Let's go. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or comment? 6 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 7 hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll 12 move to Item 13, consider and discuss EMS contract with the 13 City of Kerrville. Commissioner Letz? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, let me start off by 15 -- on this item, last Thursday, I sent an e-mail to Don 16 Davis, Interim City Manager, outlining a number of questions 17 that I had that related primarily to -- well, I'll read 18 them. And I have not received a response yet. He did send 19 me an e-mail saying that I was asking for some information, 20 and they had other things they that they were working on, 21 obviously, and I knew it was short notice, but these are 22 things that I asked: What portion of total expenditures is 23 related to administration and what is included in 24 administration? Can you provide a line-item breakdown, 25 total expenditures of the $1.996 million? Can you provide 8-8-05 77 1 billing information as to how much is billed for all 2 services? Can you provide a breakdown as to how dispatch 3 portion of the operating transfers out amount of $74,036 was 4 calculated? Attachment 2 to the letter from Ron Patterson 5 of May 3rd provided EMS system utilization analysis with 6 percentage given. Can you provide the same data with actual 7 numbers? 8 And those are the questions that I had asked, 9 and there may be some of this somebody else may have 10 provided; I'm not sure, or asked previously. And the reason 11 I read those to the Court is, they're the areas that are, I 12 guess, the -- the big bone of contention, in my mind, is the 13 administration side. I'm unclear exactly what they're 14 including in that. And after we reviewed the airport budget 15 and the way it -- they -- what is included in that, I don't 16 necessarily -- it's very different than the airport budget, 17 but I'm wondering what exactly is in the administration 18 number. In talking with Southern Cross EMS, their number 19 was basically -- it says, in their opinion, it should take 20 $350,000 to put one ambulance on the street seven days a 21 week, 24 hours a day. That's just the cost, and this should 22 include everything, and then any revenue you receive back 23 from that service being provided would be taken off of that. 24 If their number is close to being correct, 25 and the City of Kerrville has four ambulances on duty, two 8-8-05 78 1 on call and two for basically -- essentially backup or 2 transfers, I calculate that to be about $1.4 million in 3 total expenditures, so there is about $500,000 additional 4 expenditures from the City of Kerrville. And that's one 5 reason I asked the questions that I did as to where does 6 that number come from? Based on the Interim City Manager's 7 comment -- you know, I guess he objects to us asking these 8 questions, based on his comment that we want -- you know, 9 just kind of like we want to be a partner and not a client. 10 Well, you know, I want to be a client, but I want to know 11 what I'm paying for, and I want to know what the difference 12 -- how much of that deficit is administration and what 13 they're including in their administration. I've said all 14 along I'm very happy with the actual level of service, so 15 that's just kind of where I am on this. 16 And I think the areas I would like to look at 17 -- I need to get those numbers before we can do a 18 counterproposal, but I think that the dispatch -- I still 19 have a question as to how much of that dispatch number 20 should be billed in this contract. They say they want us to 21 be a client, yet they have asked to us pay for half an 22 ambulance. I don't -- I see that as -- it makes no sense to 23 me. And, actually, I've had some City Councilmen agree with 24 me that it makes no sense. You know, I don't mind if they 25 want to attribute a cost of an ambulance over the life of 8-8-05 79 1 the ambulance, which I presume is 15 years or so. Yes, 2 that's just -- that's a justifiable cost. But the County 3 should not be asked to pay for half of an ambulance that we 4 don't own in one year. That makes no sense. And those are 5 my big areas of -- of question at the moment. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. I agree 100 7 percent. That's exactly what I planned on saying, is that, 8 you know, the -- in the paper, the City Manager says -- uses 9 the words, they're a customer. In my mind, they want to 10 make it a partnership deal. Well, I think he's seeing it 11 exactly backwards. I don't want to be a partner on the 12 issue. I want to -- I don't want to buy half of an 13 ambulance, or I don't want to pay for billing for our 14 citizens out in the county. I want to be a customer. I 15 want to pay for the service that they provide. And I don't 16 want to own any ambulances; I don't want to own any barns or 17 whatever. So, to me, that's a customer. Now, on this 18 ambulance issue, if they would -- I can't remember the 19 number, but it was substantial. If they would take this 20 ambulance -- us paying for this ambulance out of the 21 equation, then the numbers drop pretty good. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 37,500. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: $37,500. That is a 24 huge -- that's a great start. That -- you know, that would 25 be -- that's a good place to begin negotiations on a 8-8-05 80 1 nonnegotiable issue. I just think that's a good place to 2 start right there. And it's -- it's not peanuts. It's not 3 pennies. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's a sum of money. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mentioned the same 7 thing. If we get rid of that 37,500, and then look at the 8 -- in my mind, you know, I've gotten over the hurdle that if 9 50 percent of the time or almost 50 percent of the time is 10 spent on runs in the county, on related costs, I don't have 11 a real problem with spending that. I think I really want to 12 look at how that number's derived, but if that's the number, 13 then so be it. I don't mind paying 50 percent of those 14 costs. However, administration and other -- things of that 15 nature and dispatch are much more related to the volume of 16 the service. They're not -- you know, 25 percent of the 17 bills are going into the county, so why should we pay for 18 50 percent of the billing costs? Administration of the 19 employees and things of that nature are -- are driven by 20 call volume more than by length of time and loaded miles, so 21 I think you need to do a breakdown. And I don't -- you can 22 either say it's 25 percent of these costs and 50 percent of 23 these costs, or you can -- my preference would be to just 24 say, okay, it's 35 percent, some number in the middle. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Have you thought 8-8-05 81 1 about, like, running some numbers, finding out how many 2 dispatchers there are and seeing what the cost is and -- 3 just in that one particular area? I mean -- 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Was that a leading 5 question, Commissioner? He set a trap for me; I'm not going 6 to fall in it. He's referring to a conversation I had with 7 some people in the City last week and a comment I had from 8 the City Manager about me talking to City employees, but 9 I'll leave that off the table for the time being. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I tried. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I think that is 12 important. And I think it's also important to know that 13 9-1-1 spends $36,000 in dispatch, and that's paid for by 14 taxpayers of the entire county, not just the city. So, 15 there's already a funding mechanism for a portion of the 16 total dispatch. But I don't know, you know, the total -- I 17 don't -- I know they have 10 -- they have 10 openings in 18 dispatch; I'm not sure if they're all filled at this time. 19 I believe they are. They recently were not all filled. 20 But, you know, that's a -- part of my numbers requested from 21 the City Manager. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I guess most of 23 my issues are on the administrative side and on the 24 equipment replacement issue. I agree, I don't think we 25 should be participating in that. We don't own the 8-8-05 82 1 equipment. Same scenario goes to the library, the 2 purchasing equipment there. I think we need to be looking 3 very carefully at those particular issues. I kind of am 4 troubled by the fact that every time I look at this -- every 5 time I look at the package of information, I see another set 6 of utilization statistics. There are three sets kicking 7 around right now, and the County's -- County's piece runs 8 anywhere from 20 percent up to as high as 28 percent. Well, 9 I wonder about that. It would seem to me that we should be 10 able to get a handle on those kind of things and come up 11 with one -- one set of statistics that makes sense. 12 But, again, I go back to taking a look at 13 their own dollars and cents. That was not -- if you look at 14 the -- if you look at the operations for the last full year, 15 that was sufficient dollars to cover it. They transferred 16 money out back to the general fund. If you take out the 17 equipment replacement, if you take out that fund ending 18 balance, there was sufficient revenue to cover the expenses 19 without a subsidy on the part of the City and without any 20 basic subsidy over and above what we do from the County. 21 Now, if we have -- if it's necessary to have a county 22 subsidy, fine and dandy, but let's find out where those 23 dollars that are already in the system are going and why 24 they're being transferred out and why they're being held 25 over. Those questions, I think, need some answer. As a 8-8-05 83 1 client, not as a partner. 2 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I just reiterate my 3 earlier position. Once we've sorted out these legitimate 4 questions that you raise about administration, capital costs 5 and dispatch and where the money's going, then what I want 6 from the City is that the -- at least for the county 7 portion, that the users and/or their insurance carriers pay 8 the costs of that service. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I've had that argument at 10 length with City Councilmen, and they said, "Well, with 11 disallowables, we're not going to get that much, and 12 60 percent of it's Medicare." And my answer is, the bills 13 should reflect what it costs. I don't care what the 14 disallowable is, what Medicare's going to pay. You bill 15 what it costs. If Medicare's going to pay a certain amount, 16 yes, it may increase the disallowable, but if we're going -- 17 it does two things. One, it lets Medicare know that there's 18 a huge shortfall, and that's the only way they're ever going 19 to make a change in Medicare. And, obviously, Kerr County's 20 not going to drive Medicare, but I think the state and the 21 nation will. So, you bill what it costs. Secondly, if you 22 don't bill what it costs, then your subsidy -- you're not 23 getting your money from private insurance companies; they 24 will pay more. And I just don't understand their reluctance 25 to look at -- to even look at their billing. And that's why 8-8-05 84 1 I've gone a step further and say let's take -- potentially 2 take billing out of the contract. Let's see if we can come 3 to terms with the City of Kerrville where they provide the 4 service, and that's it. We pay for the -- we do the billing 5 on our own. We handle, you know, the administration part. 6 We do collections on our own, and we pay for the service 7 only. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: What -- what kind of response 9 did you get from the folks at the City about our basic 10 approach of asking that these costs that -- that are 11 involved be adjusted upward to reflect what it really takes 12 to pay for the service? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm actually quite 14 saddened to say that the response that I got was that our 15 proposal received very little consideration. The City 16 Manager -- Assistant City Manager or the Interim City 17 Manager was not present at the meeting. I think there was 18 one City Councilman who was at our workshop who was -- 19 understood what we were asking for. Obviously, our proposal 20 was somewhat brief, and my understanding was that they did 21 not provide a whole lot of insight as to what our proposal 22 was, and this was not a lengthy agenda item for them. So -- 23 and that's just my understanding. I have -- in my 24 conversations with City Councilmen since then, I've 25 recommended that we either -- you know, the two bodies meet 8-8-05 85 1 as a whole, full Commissioners Court with full City Council 2 and hammer this thing out, as I mentioned in court once, or 3 we appoint a committee of maybe two -- at least two from 4 City Council and two from Commissioners Court and hammer it 5 out. I mean, I really -- and I've told them that. 6 I don't think we're very far apart. You get 7 rid of the cost of an ambulance, which they should, 'cause 8 they're saying they don't want us to be partners. Well, 9 okay. And we look a little bit on the administration side 10 and the billing, or let us take the billing over and reduce 11 that out of the contract. I just don't see that we're 12 really much more than probably -- you know, I hate to put a 13 number on it, but $25,000, $30,000, $40,000 apart at most, 14 and probably less than that. And it's just -- you know, I 15 don't know if they misunderstood our proposal, if they 16 didn't -- I don't understand. I can't speak for them, but 17 to me, I have told them that the proposal -- if we came out 18 of today's meeting with a proposal, I don't see it differing 19 significantly from the last proposal. Those are the items 20 that we have to talk about, and if they're not willing to 21 talk about it, then we are, you know, at a dead end. 22 You know, I need to talk about administration 23 costs. I need to know how they're handling their billing. 24 I need to know exactly how they're breaking down, I mean, 25 their expenditures, and they have not provided that 8-8-05 86 1 information to us. They haven't provided numbers on call 2 volume. I have no idea, from a communication coming from 3 the City Manager's office, what the call volume is in the 4 county. They gave us some percentages at one point and said 5 it's anywhere from 20 -- I think 20 percent, then it was 6 25 percent, and now last time it was 28 percent of the 7 volume, and it was almost 50 percent of the time. But I 8 have no idea what that -- you know, how many calls are 9 there? So, these are the things that we really need to 10 answer. The 5 percent fund balance issue that we had in 11 Item 2 last time, you know, I disagree with that policy. If 12 they want to build that in, they can build it in; that's 13 just something they take under consideration. But I did 14 mention to City Council that if the City's going to start 15 billing the County for their reserves, then I think the 16 County's going to start billing the City for its reserves on 17 our contracts that we operate. And I said I think it's a 18 bad practice both ways, but I said I think the contracts 19 need to be done equally. 20 On the dispatch, I said that it should not be 21 calculated -- Number 2 last time in our memo said dispatch 22 should not be included. I could probably go as far as 23 saying that a portion of dispatch should be included. You 24 have to attribute that cost somewhere, but it should be -- 25 what percent is EMS in the county only? And then you take 8-8-05 87 1 out the subsidy that comes out of 9-1-1, figure that out, 2 the costs to run that department, and maybe that portion 3 could be built in. I don't have a real problem with that, 4 but they have to -- haven't given us any numbers to justify 5 that. So, I said a lot, but I didn't answer your question, 6 Commissioner Baldwin, did I? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't think I asked 8 one; I think the Judge did. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we need to put on 10 the table what we think needs to be talked about, and 11 recommend we have a joint meeting, personally. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, the last full 13 set of statistics that came to us as a result of a request 14 submitted by Commissioner Baldwin was for the full year 15 '03-'04, and the run count, which I assume means patient 16 count as well, inside the city limits was 3,931. Outside 17 the city limits, 1,042. Well, that's about four to one, 18 25 percent, maybe a little less. But according to -- when 19 you crank out Ingram and other things, it's 20 percent. 20 76/20; 76 inside, 20 percent county. These are their 21 numbers. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. So, you know, 23 that's -- I go back to it. I don't understand why we should 24 pay 50 percent of the -- of a deficit for 20 percent of the 25 service. Now, I agree it should be higher than 20 percent 8-8-05 88 1 because of the distance that goes into that. But I also 2 should note that Medicare pays more on the distance run; 3 there's a small surcharge for Medicare, so they're receiving 4 more revenue on county runs too. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's right. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, you know, but -- you 7 know, they're -- they seem to -- they never have mentioned 8 that. I found that out talking to people I wasn't supposed 9 to talk to, City employees. I'm not allowed to talk to City 10 employees. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What do you mean, 12 you're not allowed to talk to City employees? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I've been instructed to 14 not talk to City employees, other than the Interim City 15 Manager. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll get it out of him 17 before the day's over. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, maybe I've committed a 19 transgression. I responded to the acting Assistant City 20 Manager's -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Get a bullwhip. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: -- letter, and -- 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You'll be getting an 24 e-mail, too. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: And I contacted him in 8-8-05 89 1 response to his letter to me. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That may be a no-no, 3 Judge. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They're -- just so 5 everyone is on the same page, I received an e-mail saying 6 that I was not to contact City employees; everything should 7 go through the City Manager. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: One comment that I would 10 have, Jonathan, on their deal as to ratio of calls in the 11 city and county, I think most of us know that in the city, 12 they run -- most of the time they run a fire truck right 13 along with an ambulance to help with lifting the patient or 14 moving them. I don't believe they do that that much in the 15 county. They rely more on the deputies, that we go out on 16 those calls with them in the county to assist them in any 17 way. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Except car accidents. 19 Car accidents, I think they send a fire truck. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Car accidents, they 21 normally send a fire truck to help with washing down or 22 things like that, too. I mean, the service is great, but we 23 do assist them a lot in the county with a lot of the stuff 24 that they run an extra fire truck in the city. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They have assured us at 8-8-05 90 1 our meeting here that the fire -- the additional costs 2 incurred in the city has been pulled out. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I specifically asked them, for 4 non-direct EMS-related equipment/personnel, if that was 5 included. They assured me it was not. 6 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Read an article in 7 the newspaper this weekend about the 50 cents per month toll 8 that we pay, all of us that have a telephone. That goes 9 into the 9-1-1 fund, and the story was that that money's 10 being collected, but there's lots of it that doesn't go back 11 to the local communities. And I was naive to think that 12 when I paid my 50 cents a month, it went directly to Kerr 13 9-1-1, but it surely doesn't. But that reminded me that the 14 Safety and Health Code says that the 9-1-1 system begins 15 when a call is made. Dial 9-1-1, received at PSAP, and it 16 ends when the emergency service provider that's responsible 17 for providing the service in that area is dispatched. That 18 tells me that dispatch for EMS should be paid for out of 19 that 50 cents per month toll on telephones. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's kind of our 21 contention. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: At least part of it is. 23 I don't think we can fund the whole dispatch. 24 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I don't know, 'cause 25 I don't know how much of that 50 cents comes back to Kerr 8-8-05 91 1 County. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't know. 3 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: It's a problem 4 bigger than all of us. But 9-1-1 is paying for -- what's 5 Kerr 9-1-1 paying for, two dispatchers? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: $36,000 a year, as I 7 understand it. 8 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: One and a half or 9 two. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't know if you 11 can say that they pay for anything in particular. I think 12 they just kind of send the lump of money over there, and 13 then kind of pretend that it goes toward a salary or some 14 kind of deal. 15 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Just a specific contract 17 service whereby the City provides dispatching service, they 18 agree to pay them $36,000 a year. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Correct. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't know if that amount 21 has been increased. That was the last contract I saw. 22 Well, gentlemen, other than trying to get a full meeting 23 with the members of the Council, do we have anything else to 24 offer on this subject? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I just -- I 8-8-05 92 1 think that we need to have a full meeting. I think we 2 need -- the City Council and the Commissioners Court, as 3 representatives of all taxpayers in the county, must sit 4 down and work this thing out. Now, if -- because we're not 5 going to do it with the twosies and threesies and onesies 6 and all that. It has to be a full-blown deal and come -- 7 and we don't have to come to an agreement, but we need to 8 come to a consensus of some sort, and -- and we need to do 9 that in a hurry. And if they -- if we can't work the thing 10 out, we need to rock and roll, big time. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, how about if we 12 recess on this item till 1:30. During lunch, I will draft a 13 proposal to put on the table for a joint meeting so that 14 we're somewhat focused, and then we can look at that and 15 either y'all can toss it out the window or we can go forward 16 with that and just have a joint meeting with -- without a 17 specific proposal. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Seems like a viable option to 19 me. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And if Kathy can show me 21 how to turn on Kathy's computer and get to a document, I can 22 go from there. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: That's between you and Kathy 24 at this point. I don't want to get involved in that. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is it you're 8-8-05 93 1 going to write? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm going to modify this 3 and just say -- tell them the points that -- what we need to 4 talk about. I think it's kind of the framework of where our 5 main discussion points are. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And try to take out the 8 percentages and the dollars. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other member of the Court 11 at this time have anything further to offer on this agenda 12 item? If not, we'll leave that one pending. Probably the 13 thing to do now is to get to the bills, wouldn't you think, 14 gentlemen? 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't know where the Auditor 17 is. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'll go see if I can 19 find him. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All right, see if you can stir 21 him up. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, while we're 23 waiting, Ms. Harris called, and said she left a message on 24 your voicemail as well. She had some new information she 25 wanted to impart to you and to me so we could impart it to 8-8-05 94 1 the Court, something from T.J.P.C. or something. I don't 2 know what the substance is. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I've not received any 4 voicemail messages this morning. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I said I'd talk to 6 you. I thought maybe, based on our schedule, we might do it 7 at 1:30, but if we're going to recess and do the EMS at 8 1:30, maybe sooner; I don't know. We'll check the voicemail 9 and your schedule and see where that leads us. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, I'll take a listen to 11 that here shortly. Let's go to Section 4, the approval 12 agenda. First item, payment of the bills. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Want us to get you a 14 stool? 15 MS. WILLIAMS: I need something. 16 Mr. Tomlinson had a doctor's appointment; he hasn't made it 17 back, so I'm going to fill in for him. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move we pay the 20 bills. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to 23 pay the bills. Any question or comment? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have a bill-related 25 question. 8-8-05 95 1 MS. WILLIAMS: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Hill Country Telephone 3 Co-Op. Do we get a refund -- a capital credit come back 4 every so often from them? 5 MS. WILLIAMS: Hill Country Telephone? Yes, 6 sir, every year. It's capital credit gains or something, 7 yeah. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I was just wondering. I 9 mean, I know individuals do, and I was wondering if the 10 County did. Just curiosity. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't see it. 12 MS. WILLIAMS: You're not supposed to. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or 14 comments? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 15 your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's 20 move on to budget amendments. Budget Amendment Request 21 Number 1. 22 MS. WILLIAMS: Okay. The District Clerk has 23 some microfilm expenses that need to be paid, and she's 24 requesting moving money out of her Part-Time Salary line 25 item up to Microfilm Expense to take care of these bills at 8-8-05 96 1 the next meeting. 2 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Move to approve. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to 5 approve Budget Amendment Request Number 1. Any question or 6 comment? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And that -- the amount 8 is $706.91? 9 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or comment? 12 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 13 hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 18 Budget Amendment Request Number 2. 19 MS. WILLIAMS: Number 2, we have a bill for 20 court reporting services for the County Court at Law, and we 21 need to move money to cover that. They want to take it out 22 of their Telephone line item and move it up to Special Court 23 Reporter. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: $250? 25 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 8-8-05 97 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 4 approval of Budget Amendment Request Number 2. Any question 5 or comment? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 6 your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Budget Amendment Request 11 Number 3? 12 MS. WILLIAMS: Constable Precinct 2 needs to 13 get some postage stamps to mail out, I think, warrant 14 notices or letters or whatever. Anyway, he is requesting 15 three rolls of stamps. He's $64 short. He'd like to move 16 the money out of his Miscellaneous line item up to Postage 17 in order to get those, and it should carry him through the 18 rest of this year and probably partway into next year. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 22 approval of Budget Amendment Request Number 3. Any question 23 or comment? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 24 your right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8-8-05 98 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget 4 Amendment Request Number 4. 5 MS. WILLIAMS: This is to cover eligible 6 expenses that we have incurred for Indigent Health Care. We 7 have just run the gamut. We've got more expenses than we 8 were anticipating, but we do have the money in Surplus 9 Reserves, and we are still under where we would have to 10 notify the State, so these expenses are eligible. We do 11 need to pay them, and we also need to compensate our 12 third-party administrator for her work on it. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This would make our 14 eligible expenses under Indigent Health Care for the year -- 15 it would bring the total to about $665,000? Would that 16 be -- 17 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- correct? 19 MS. WILLIAMS: Right. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: You're requesting a transfer 21 of $51,810.53 to Eligible Expenses and $2,331.47 for 22 Third-Party Administrator payment? 23 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move we declare an 8-8-05 99 1 emergency and approve the amendment as submitted. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to 4 declare an emergency and approve Budget Amendment Number 4. 5 Any question or comment? All in favor of the motion, 6 signify by raising your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Next 11 item, Budget Amendment Request Number 5. 12 MS. WILLIAMS: Okay. This is one where we 13 had a Road and Bridge employee who had to purchase something 14 on their personal credit card, I believe, or paid by check. 15 We received the O.R.C.A. funds last year in September, but 16 we did not budget those funds in this year's budget, so the 17 funds are actually there in fund surplus. We just need to 18 do a budget amendment creating this line item and putting 19 the money in here so we can reimburse the individual who 20 spent their money to get this digital camera. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What was the 22 expenditure for? 23 MS. WILLIAMS: It was for a digital camera 24 and a charger. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Would this be a 8-8-05 100 1 proper designation, O.R.C.A. Expenses? 2 MS. WILLIAMS: I would assume it would be, 3 yes. I'm not sure what they're using the camera for, but I 4 know that the -- we received the moneys last year. It had 5 to do something with, I think, the flood. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Floodplain expense? 7 MS. WILLIAMS: It could be. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But it's coming out of 9 that O.R.C.A. fund. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I just wondered what 11 it was for. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. So moved. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: The amount in question is 14 $255.82? 15 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 19 approval of the budget amendment. Any question or comment? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the creation of a 21 new line item number? 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, that includes 23 the creation of a line item. 24 MS. WILLIAMS: And we also need an 25 authorization to do a hand check for the late bill so that 8-8-05 101 1 we can -- 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That includes an 3 authorization for a hand check. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: And who's the hand check to? 5 MS. WILLIAMS: Truby Hardin. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's faith. You go 8 out and spend 250 bucks on a camera, not real sure if the 9 money's there or not. That's faith. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to 11 approve Budget Amendment Request Number 5 and to create the 12 new line item and authorize hand check to Truby Hardin for 13 $255.82. Any question or comments? All in favor of the 14 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Budget 19 Amendment Request Number 6. 20 MS. WILLIAMS: This is for a -- I believe a 21 laser jet printer in the District Clerk's Office, and I 22 believe it was a replacement printer. She was short $73 23 being able to pay this invoice, so she'd like to move the 24 money out of her Miscellaneous line item up to Operating 25 Equipment so that we might be able to take care of this 8-8-05 102 1 invoice. 2 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Move to approve. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second, but I've got a 4 question. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 6 approval. Questions or comments? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It says 198th District 8 Court. 9 MS. WILLIAMS: Maybe it was for Becky. I was 10 thinking it was Linda's. You're correct, it was 198th -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Of course I'm correct. 12 MS. WILLIAMS: -- District Court. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So it's -- are you 14 telling me that they have a printer for the 216th and the 15 198th? 16 MS. WILLIAMS: That's a good question. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're not telling me 18 that, are you? 19 MS. WILLIAMS: No, sir. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So it's for the 21 District Court system. I -- it doesn't matter, I don't 22 guess. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's got to come out 24 of one of those two budgets, right? 25 MS. WILLIAMS: I would have to find out from 8-8-05 103 1 John which court this was really for, since he ordered it. 2 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: It's coming out of 3 the one that's got some money left in Miscellaneous. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. Very little 6 money left. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 8 comments? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We got a motion? 10 Good. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. All in favor of the 12 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget 17 Amendment Request 7. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh. 19 MS. WILLIAMS: Do you want to address this 20 one, Rusty? 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't think I want to 22 hear it. I already heard Buster's. 23 MS. WILLIAMS: We have bills that need to be 24 paid out of the jail budget. There's some employee medical 25 exams, a few radio repairs, and a couple of office supply 8-8-05 104 1 invoices. They're running short or have totally run out of 2 funds. What they would like to do is move the funds from 3 the Jailer Salaries line item. The total amount is 4 $2,509.79. Employee Medical Exams, we need $1,275. Radio 5 Repairs, we need $484.79, and Office Supplies, we're asking 6 for $750. We have invoices right now that total $168.90, 7 but we have invoices that are pending that will need to be 8 paid before this next court meeting. 9 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Move to approve. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 12 approval. Any question or comment? 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Sheriff, how are we 14 doing on jailer turnover? 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We had a number of 16 openings at one time, just 'cause some of them left, went to 17 other places. So, right at this current time -- a few weeks 18 ago, we hired four, and I have two openings right now, and 19 that's 'cause I have one that -- today's her last day; she's 20 going back to Llano, to another county. 21 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Just generally, 22 though, is the turnover -- unwanted turnover situation 23 better than it was in previous years? 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: In the Sheriff's Office, 25 the turnover has stopped. You know, this Court's taken care 8-8-05 105 1 of salary situations and that. The last actual turnover I 2 had in the Sheriff's Office was David Billeiter getting 3 elected to constable, so the Sheriff's Office has been 4 fabulous. Jail turnover rate, I really don't think that 5 we're ever going to solve that problem, you know. We have 6 law enforcement academies going on; jailers are always going 7 to the academy, trying to get a job somewhere else, so it's 8 just something that -- that it's a starting point in the 9 training. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's not a very fun 11 place to be. 12 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: No. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, not seven days a 14 week, 24 hours a day, with the liability and stress factors. 15 That's true. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or comment? 17 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 18 hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget 23 Amendment Request Number 8. 24 MS. WILLIAMS: This is a budget amendment for 25 J.P. Precinct 3. They have basically run out of money in 8-8-05 106 1 their Telephone line item. We have a bill for their Five 2 Star cellphone that we need to pay. We have anticipated 3 through the end of the budget year that they will probably 4 need $175 to carry them through, not only with their 5 cellphone, but with their long distance calls and their 6 share of the county phone system expenses. So, they'd like 7 to move that out of Operating Equipment. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 11 approval. Any question or comment? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How many cellphones 13 does the County provide, total? 14 MS. WILLIAMS: Just off the top of my head? 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That'd be fine. Your 16 ears, nose, anywhere. 17 MS. WILLIAMS: I would say probably between 18 20 and 30, if you're counting Sheriff's Department. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Counting the Sheriff's 20 Department? 21 MS. WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. J.P.'s. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And you go through 23 each one of those bills and you can tell if there's lots of 24 personal calls or that kind of thing? You can't? 25 MS. WILLIAMS: There's no way we would be 8-8-05 107 1 able to tell. Now, this man probably can. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what I was 3 afraid of. 4 MS. WILLIAMS: Through his department. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We have to take lunch 6 here in 30 minutes. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I did individually go 8 through -- this is our cellphone bill, and I individually go 9 through it to make sure our officers are using it for 10 department business, not for personal. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that what you're doing 12 when you're on the beach in Galveston? 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You notice I brought all 14 of my stuff with me. But, yes, that is part of it, and we 15 do look at that. And, actually, our basic is what's the 16 expensive thing. If you look at the minutes in the Five 17 Star Wireless, it's not an expense there. In fact, they -- 18 they billed us a couple months ago for wireless-to-wireless, 19 and we caught them on that, and they ended up giving us a 20 very large credit back. But, yes, it is watched constantly. 21 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I don't think I pay 22 by the call on my cellphone. Do I? 23 MS. WILLIAMS: I think a lot depends on the 24 plan that you have. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: By the minute. 8-8-05 108 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or 2 comments? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 3 your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 8 Budget Amendment Request Number 9. 9 MS. WILLIAMS: This budget amendment is for 10 the 216th District Court, and we have some invoices for 11 Court-appointed attorney services and Court-appointed 12 services that need to be paid. And, again, they have either 13 run short or run out of money in those respective line 14 items. They're asking that we take the money out of their 15 Special Trials line item and move them up to the appropriate 16 lines as needed. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: And the request is $3,738.75 18 for Court-Appointed Services, and $4,046.10 for 19 Court-Appointed Attorneys? 20 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This doesn't 23 anticipate the next two months, does it? 24 MS. WILLIAMS: No, sir, this is just current 25 invoices that we have; that's nothing pending right now. We 8-8-05 109 1 don't really know what's pending. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and second. 6 Any question or comment? 7 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: We could buy a 8 county vehicle for Precinct 4 Commissioner and take it out 9 of Special Trials. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: There's an idea. 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Otherwise, we won't 12 use up all that money. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or 14 comments? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 15 your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget 20 Amendment Request Number 10. 21 MS. WILLIAMS: This is a budget amendment for 22 County Court at Law. We have two invoices for court 23 reporting services that we need to pay, and, as you can see, 24 their line item for that is zeroed out. They would like us 25 to go ahead and move the $150 needed out of their Special 8-8-05 110 1 County Court at Law Judge line item up to Special Court 2 Reporter. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Any 6 question or comment? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Question. Item 2 was 8 the same thing -- I mean, not the exact same thing. Is that 9 two different people? 10 MS. WILLIAMS: It's actually two different -- 11 it's three different bills. We got -- Budget Amendment 12 Number 2 we got in first, and then we got the other two 13 bills in later in the week, and decided we'd better go ahead 14 and do another budget amendment so we can get them paid 15 timely also. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, ma'am. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or comment? 18 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 19 hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget 24 Amendment Request Number 11. 25 MS. WILLIAMS: This is -- involves the Jury 8-8-05 111 1 Fund and the 216th District Court. We have a bill from 2 Bilingual Communication Consultants for some interpretation 3 services that they provided, to a total of -- and it's 4 actually, I think, two or three different invoices. It 5 totals $788. The Jury line item for interpreters only has a 6 balance of $32 at this point in time, so we need to add 7 $756. Again, we would like to take it out of the 216th 8 District Court's Special Trials line item and move it up to 9 the Interpreters line item in the Jury Fund. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 13 approval. Any question or comment? All in favor of the 14 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget 19 Amendment Request Number 12. 20 MS. WILLIAMS: This budget amendment involves 21 the 198th District Court. We have two invoices for special 22 court reporting that totals $750, and, as you can see, their 23 line item is zeroed out. They requested us to take the 24 money out of Special Trials and move it up to Special Court 25 Reporter so that we can pay these two invoices. 8-8-05 112 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Ask your question. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: May I ask a question? 3 MS. WILLIAMS: Sure. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is a special 5 court reporter? 6 MS. WILLIAMS: It's a court reporter who 7 comes in and takes the minutes when the court reporter for 8 that court is assigned elsewhere. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we pay -- we pay a 10 salary to the -- the court reporter that is supposedly -- 11 MS. WILLIAMS: Assigned to the 198th District 12 Court, yes, sir. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So -- so, he's -- the 14 District Judge is having court in two different places at 15 once? 16 MS. WILLIAMS: He will -- he will be in one 17 court, but in another county there may be a special District 18 Judge hearing cases for him, and at that point, either our 19 court reporter is here with our Judge or she's assigned over 20 to the special Judge, which means our Judge doesn't have a 21 court reporter, so he brings somebody in. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mindy, you don't have 23 to yell. 24 MS. WILLIAMS: I'm not. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm just asking a 8-8-05 113 1 question. 2 MS. WILLIAMS: If I was yelling, you would 3 know it. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Actually, she answered 5 it better than anybody in the last 12 years. If you come 6 back next month, I'm going to ask the same question. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is the Baldwin quiz. 8 MS. WILLIAMS: That's fine. The Baldwin 9 quiz. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good. Thank you. 11 MS. WILLIAMS: Okay. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Are you moving approval, 13 Commissioner? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move for approval. 15 Don't tell anybody. 16 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 18 approval. Any questions or comments? All in favor of the 19 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget 24 Amendment Request Number 13. 25 MS. WILLIAMS: This budget amendment is for 8-8-05 114 1 the County Clerk's office. And perhaps -- Jannett, would 2 you like to address this instead of me trying to? 3 MS. PIEPER: Gentlemen, I would like to 4 request that we move $1,608.40 from my Deputy Salary line 5 item into my Part-Time Salary line item because I am in a 6 negative balance, and this should carry me through the end 7 of the fiscal year. 8 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Move to approve. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 11 approval. Any question or comment? All in favor of the 12 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 17 Budget Amendment Request Number 14. 18 MS. WILLIAMS: This budget amendment also is 19 for the County Clerk. And I believe, Jannett, you can 20 probably explain it better than I can. 21 MS. PIEPER: Okay. Gentlemen, I am 22 requesting that we take $6,500 from Employee Training and 23 move $3,000 of that into my Operating Equipment and $3,500 24 of that into my Computer Software. In computer software, if 25 y'all will remember back earlier in the budget year, I'm 8-8-05 115 1 going with Landata on the records archival; however, 2 Software Group wants this additional money to write that 3 program that literally sends my document images from the 4 courthouse to Landata. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Have you had any 6 discussions with Mr. Trolinger about the software aspects of 7 this? 8 MS. PIEPER: Yes. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He's cool with all 10 that? 11 MS. PIEPER: Yes, he is. Well, he's just 12 wondering why I haven't done it before, but I've gotten 13 Software to come down from -- to $3,500 on this. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 15 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 17 approval. Any other question or comment? 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Question. Moving 19 $6,500 out of Employee Training line, when we get into the 20 budget, are we going to be able to track that that $6,500 21 was not spent for employee training? 22 MS. PIEPER: Yes. By going to that expense 23 code, it'll show that that money was moved out, so it will 24 show a balance of what -- what and where that training was 25 spent. Is that correct, Mindy? 8-8-05 116 1 MS. WILLIAMS: Right. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's something that 3 y'all provide in the documents? 4 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. What -- what the 5 expenditure worksheet shows now is you have your original 6 budget which started October 1st. You will have a current 7 budget line item. Those figures -- if any moneys have been 8 moved during the year from one line item to the other, those 9 figures will not be the same in both columns. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 11 MS. WILLIAMS: So, it will show -- like, this 12 one is $17,184. When we move the $6,500 out, it's going to 13 drop that down to 11,000 or less. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's true, except that 16 we're working off of the June -- kind of the worksheets that 17 went to the Judge from June, so it's not going -- we'll have 18 to remember it when we're going through budget, because -- 19 MS. PIEPER: Well, normally this one line 20 item, it only has, like, $15,00 max in it. The only reason 21 it has more is because we were expecting a lot more 22 enhancements and training from Software Group on criminal 23 civil court administration and stuff like that. However, 24 we're not getting it, and we don't need it. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Save that speech, 8-8-05 117 1 'cause it will come again soon. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or comment? 3 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 4 hand. 5 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 7 (No response.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget 9 Amendment Request Number 15. 10 MS. WILLIAMS: Okay. This involves the 11 Environmental Health Department, and it looks like he has a 12 couple of line items that are running low on funding. One 13 looks like it's totally out. He is requesting that we move 14 $1,000 out of his Capital Outlay line item and disburse it 15 between postage -- $200 into Postage, $500 into Laboratory 16 Testing, and $300 into Operating Equipment. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Will that be for the 18 purchase of equipment or what? 19 MS. WILLIAMS: He didn't really explain what 20 he needed the $300 for. I'm not -- I think it has something 21 to do with upgrading one of their computers. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My question would be 23 laboratory testing. The original budget was $500. We spent 24 -- the balance is $248. Does he have a lot of testing 25 pending? 8-8-05 118 1 MS. WILLIAMS: I think he does. I think he's 2 got some bills from the State that haven't -- they just 3 haven't come in yet, and they haven't been paid. And he's 4 anticipating that they'll come in before the end of the 5 budget year. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Again, this thousand 8 bucks coming out of Capital Outlay will show up where we can 9 see it? 10 MS. WILLIAMS: I was going to mention a while 11 ago, if it would be helpful, we could probably print the 12 Court a new set of budget expenditure worksheets. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That would be very 14 helpful. 15 MS. WILLIAMS: And then that way, it would 16 show -- if I do it through current, it'll pick up items that 17 were paid here today in court. And I can do it after I put 18 the budget amendments in, so I could have them ready for you 19 guys by -- 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Wednesday. 21 MS. WILLIAMS: Is it Wednesday, or is it 22 tomorrow? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh, tomorrow afternoon. 24 You're right. 25 MS. WILLIAMS: Tomorrow. If I can get court 8-8-05 119 1 orders from Jannett today, I can do that, and I'll have them 2 printed for y'all before your court meeting tomorrow at 3 1:30. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That would be great. 5 MS. WILLIAMS: That would help? 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You bet. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Can't ask for any -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, that's -- 9 JUDGE TINLEY: -- any more diligent effort 10 than that. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's super. My real 12 question is, what Capital Outlay item did he not purchase? 13 That -- that's not a question for you. 14 MS. WILLIAMS: Oh. At this point -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But that is the 16 question. Why didn't you purchase something? 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: He's going to be in 18 here at 2 o'clock. Why don't we ask him then? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll approve this, but 20 I've got some questions about the general idea -- are we 21 having difficulty forecasting our needs? Or are we not 22 budgeting enough, or -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, or too much. 24 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I move to approve. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 8-8-05 120 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 2 approval. Any question or comment? All in favor of the 3 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion is approved. 8 Budget Amendment Request Number 16. 9 MS. WILLIAMS: Sorry. Okay, this budget 10 amendment is -- involves the Sheriff's Department. What we 11 had done, I believe, a couple weeks ago, we had to pay off 12 the note on one of the patrol vehicles that got totaled out. 13 In order to get the title from Ford Motor Credit, we had to 14 be able to send them the funds. We didn't have the money at 15 that point in time, so the Sheriff obliged us by paying the 16 money out of a seizure account that he has. What we want to 17 do now, since we have received the money from TAC to pay -- 18 to cover the damages on the vehicle, we want to go ahead and 19 recognize the money into revenues, and we also would like to 20 go ahead and put the money into Lease Payments in order to 21 pay the Sheriff's seizure fund back for the advance. And 22 the balance of the money from TAC, we want to put into 23 Vehicle Equipment so that they can buy equipment for the new 24 vehicles that they have gotten. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Again, good explanation. 8-8-05 121 1 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: So moved. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and second for 4 approval. Any question or comment? All in favor of the 5 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Did 10 we have any -- 11 MS. PIEPER: Don't we need a hand check? 12 MS. WILLIAMS: We will also need -- I'm 13 sorry. I should have said this earlier, but we need a hand 14 check to go with this budget amendment so that we can 15 reimburse the Sheriff's seizure account. 16 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Okay. I modify that 17 motion to include the hand check. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Who made the second on it? 19 MS. PIEPER: Commissioner Letz. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's fine. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that okay? I'll call for a 22 vote again. All in favor of the motion as amended, signify 23 by raising your right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 8-8-05 122 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. 3 MS. WILLIAMS: I have one additional budget 4 amendment, gentlemen, that came in late. If I could get you 5 to pass that around? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 7 MS. WILLIAMS: The County Attorney called 8 me -- I believe it was either Thursday afternoon or Friday 9 morning, and said that he -- I think had spoke with you, 10 Judge Tinley. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. 12 MS. WILLIAMS: And requested a budget 13 amendment to pay for an ad that was to be placed in the 14 Valley Morning Star in Cameron County. I believe it has to 15 do something with a forfeiture sale on maybe a bond 16 forfeiture. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: There's an execution sale that 18 the Sheriff in Cameron County, I believe it is, as a bond 19 forfeiture judgment, has executed on a piece of property 20 down in Cameron County, and in order to hold the execution 21 sale, they need to advertise it. It'll be added onto the 22 cost of the sale ultimately, but we've got to pay for it up 23 front, and this is the cost of the ad that was quoted to the 24 County Attorney. 25 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Move to approve. 8-8-05 123 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 2 MS. WILLIAMS: Right, and we will need a hand 3 check. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 5 MS. WILLIAMS: Because the check has to be 6 down there by tomorrow. 7 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Move to approve with 8 a hand check authorized. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: To Valley Morning Star? 10 MS. WILLIAMS: Valley Morning Star, yes, sir. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 12 MR. EMERSON: Just for what it's worth, you 13 may end up not spending that money. I did receive a call 14 from the gentleman whose land was seized -- from his 15 attorney, and amazingly now, all of a sudden, they want to 16 cut a deal. So -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good. 18 MR. EMERSON: -- we'll see. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good deal. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Kind of like the mule and the 21 2-by-4, right? 22 MR. EMERSON: I believe so. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 24 MS. WILLIAMS: I do have one late bill 25 that -- 8-8-05 124 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Just a moment. I have a 2 motion and second. Any further question or comment? 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Just make me 4 clear on this. Are you going -- after we pass this court 5 order, are you just going to automatically write a check and 6 send it out? Or whoever writes checks? 7 MS. WILLIAMS: Give it to the County Attorney 8 for him to -- 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Aren't we going to 10 wait to see what Rex says before we actually send it? Or -- 11 MR. EMERSON: If she passes the check to me, 12 I'll hold the check until I know whether or not we have an 13 agreement. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So you mail it? 15 MR. EMERSON: Correct. 16 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir, we don't mail it. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or comment? 18 All in favor of the motion to include a hand check to Valley 19 Morning Star for $1,087.56, signify by raising your right 20 hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Late 25 bills. 8-8-05 125 1 MS. WILLIAMS: One late bill to Continental 2 Battery for equipment repairs out of the Road and Bridge 3 account, Account Number 15-611-450, in the amount of 4 $149.68. This is an invoice from May the 7th, and I don't 5 know exactly what happened. We didn't get it in time to get 6 it paid, but evidently Continental is calling and refusing 7 to deliver any more batteries until this invoice is paid and 8 the account is brought up to date. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is there -- are there 10 other invoices besides that one? 11 MS. WILLIAMS: There was an invoice after 12 that that we got the invoice for. We set it up; we've paid 13 it, but this one evidently got lost in a black hole 14 somewhere. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 18 approval of a late bill to Continental Battery for $149.68. 19 Any question or discussion? 20 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Hand check. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Hand check, right. Any 22 further question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, 23 signify by raising your right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 8-8-05 126 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. 3 Anything further? 4 MS. WILLIAMS: That's it. No, sir. Thank 5 you. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Ms. Williams. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: I have been presented with 9 monthly reports from the Sheriff's Department, County 10 Clerk's office, Justice of the Peace Precinct 3. Do I hear 11 a motion to approve these reports as presented? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 13 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Second. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 15 approval of the reports -- indicated reports as submitted. 16 Any question or comment? All in favor of the motion, 17 signify -- you had a comment, Sheriff? 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: On monthly reports, we 19 give y'all the blue one each month that is -- the stack's 20 about to fall over. Years ago -- Buster may recall -- when 21 I first started, that was actually supposed to be our 22 monthly report. That was worked into that a long time ago. 23 The one you have there is more the civil account and that 24 type that we send over separately too, but I don't know if 25 you want to start including that one in with this one. So 8-8-05 127 1 -- the Clerk doesn't want it filed, or if I should just 2 discontinue it, since it's -- but I think it's very good 3 information for the Court to have to see exactly what we're 4 spending, what we're -- how many inmates we're, you know, 5 housing, and all the different costs that just -- it's just 6 stacked up for you sitting in there. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But you -- 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's public information. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You keep a copy, I'm 10 sure, in your office, correct? 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't keep a copy of 12 that exact one. It's all reports generated out of the 13 computer. We generate y'all's, but I can go back and 14 regenerate one at any time, depending on -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What -- why don't we send 16 ours back to you after we have it? 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 'Cause I don't want to 18 keep a copy. But I can. I mean, it's whatever. I just 19 always felt that that was part of the monthly report that 20 the -- years ago, that the Sheriff's Office provided to this 21 Court. And I was just kind of wondering -- 22 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I don't know about 23 this one, but I expect some of these monthly reports are 24 kind of things we do 'cause we've always done it. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah. 8-8-05 128 1 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: The -- some of the 2 reports I don't find useful at all, so I'm assuming somebody 3 else needs them. I don't. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, to me, the monthly 5 report that you get there is about that much of what the 6 Sheriff's Office does. I wouldn't even consider it a 7 monthly report. I mean, the same information is contained 8 in that other one, but the other -- about one inch thick is 9 an actual monthly report from the Sheriff's office, not what 10 you get there. 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: My point is, unless 12 they're required by some regulation, or if somebody gets 13 more benefit from them than me, and if it's costing money to 14 generate it, we might want to rethink whether we need those 15 reports or not. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think I -- I like 17 one-page summary reports. I think they're handy; I can kind 18 of see what's going on. But I don't know that -- you know, 19 I've never gone through the Sheriff's thick report. 20 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: O.S.S.F. report is 21 useful to me, and that's all the information I need. I 22 don't need any more than that. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Road and Bridge 24 report, the same. It's laid out good. 25 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yes, it is. 8-8-05 129 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I like to know how 2 many coons were killed by the trapper. The silver foxes 3 and -- 4 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: The Judge likes to 5 take that one home to Betsy. Gives her a little -- little 6 bedtime reading. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's going to be a 8 topic in our budget as well. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I enjoy -- sometimes I 10 enjoy going through there. It's interesting reading, but 11 it's certainly not a part of my life. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, I understand. I 13 mean, is there modifications you'd like for me to make to it 14 that we can -- through the computer? Or do you just want to 15 let it continue? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Was there a motion? 17 MS. PIEPER: Yes, you have a motion and a 18 second pending. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, on the reports. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, are you required 21 to present that to the Commissioners Court? 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, sir, I was not. At 23 the time that we started that, the Commissioners Court 24 wanted a more detailed monthly report from the Sheriff's 25 Office, so that's what we had opted to give you. 8-8-05 130 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or 2 comment on the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify 3 by raising your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Do we 8 have any reports from any of the Commissioners on their 9 liaison assignments? 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just one quick note, 11 Judge, that K'Star had -- which is a local agency here that 12 works with runaways and homeless youth that you're very 13 familiar with, I'm sure, had applied for basic -- some 14 funding, and they received a favorable review of their grant 15 application for $64,806 for administration of children and 16 families. That should be moving through the conduit. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Those grant funds were for 18 state funds? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They were for state 20 funds. They came through -- I guess they came through the 21 Criminal Justice Advisory Committee. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I was aware that CASA 23 had received an award of $50,000 from the Kronkosky 24 Foundation out of San Antonio also. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 8-8-05 131 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Private funding. Any -- any 2 other reports from any members of the Court? Elected 3 officials? 4 MR. EMERSON: Quick comment -- go ahead. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. Commissioner 6 Williams knows about this. We are kind of, I guess, on the 7 short list right now with the AACOG Distance Training 8 Center, and I understand that it looks real well where, 9 actually, the Sheriff's Office will -- they will install 10 over $100,000 worth of equipment at their total expense, and 11 we will be the first off-site training center for law 12 enforcement courses through AACOG, where agencies come to 13 the Sheriff's Office, sit in on actual visual, real live -- 14 be able to communicate back and forth with the instructor in 15 San Antonio at computer terminals and take distance 16 training, and I think it's a fabulous thing. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We were their first 18 site of choice. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes, first site of 20 choice. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you talking about, 22 like, TCLEOSE certification or what? 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, yes, they're all 24 TCLEOSE-certified courses. Now, they're not going to run 25 the entire academy here, just 'cause I haven't asked them to 8-8-05 132 1 do that yet. I'm not interested in doing that right now. 2 But for updated training courses, all the law enforcement 3 courses you get may very well be done in San Antonio with an 4 interactive visual deal at our office. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Super. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Which could help all the 7 counties around us and people here, instead of San Antonio. 8 I just thought it was nice. 9 MR. EMERSON: We recently purchased with Hot 10 Check money a Fatal Vision educational kit, which I don't 11 know if y'all know what that is, but it's the simulated DWI 12 goggles and the educational packets to work with the kids. 13 And the goggles are multiple degrees of simulated 14 blood-alcohol levels, so that you can put these on the kids 15 and they can actually experience what it's like. And if 16 anybody -- you know, if the Commissioners want to use it, or 17 law enforcement or any other agency, it's available for 18 their use. If they don't use it, I'm going to use it when I 19 make my presentations to the middle school and high school 20 kids. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We do use them every 22 year through all the kids in the D.A.R.E. courses and the 23 drug courses at the school, and it is a sight to watch these 24 kids wear these goggles and try and function while they're 25 on. A good learning tool. 8-8-05 133 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Would you get a pair 2 of red ones for Letz? Just so occasionally we can put them 3 on him so we can find him. I guess red will probably be the 4 strongest or the -- 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's a dominant 6 color. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought you wanted me 8 to see the world through rose-colored glasses. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Something like that. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything further? 11 MS. NEMEC: I'd like to report an update on 12 the I.R.S. situation. They've corrected all their records 13 and sent me a notice that they'll be sending us interest -- 14 an interest check for $242. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Very good. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hear, hear. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How much of that goes 18 back to the Sheriff and how much it of it comes to us? 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: All of it. I'm charging 20 interest. 21 MS. NEMEC: I'm not real sure why they're 22 sending us that much, but I'll find out. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other elected officials? 24 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I've got a couple 25 things. It's August the 8th; I haven't heard anything from 8-8-05 134 1 the City about the Animal Control contract or library 2 contract. Janie is scheduled to make a report this 3 afternoon. She won't be here. Her 17-year-old son is ill 4 and had to be moved to a San Antonio hospital. I didn't get 5 the impression that it's anything life-threatening or 6 anything like that, but it's one more thing that Janie 7 doesn't need to be dealing with. Her husband's going to be 8 shipping out here pretty soon. But, anyhow, she won't be 9 here at 2 o'clock. That's all. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Gentlemen, anything 11 else? We'll be in recess until -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 1:45. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: -- 1:45. 14 (Recess taken from 11:59 a.m. to 1:45 p.m.) 15 - - - - - - - - - - 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to order 17 for our Commissioners Court meeting scheduled for this date, 18 August the 8th, 2005. We were in recess for lunch, and 19 let's come back to Item -- 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 13? 21 JUDGE TINLEY: -- 13, which was left open 22 till after the recess. Consider and discuss EMS contract 23 with the City of Kerrville. Commissioner Letz? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have handed out a 25 recommendation for a -- I guess a proposal to send to the 8-8-05 135 1 City of Kerrville. I'll give everybody a few minutes to 2 read it. 3 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Move we approve the 4 proposal outlined by Mr. Letz, authorize the County Judge to 5 fax it to the City Manager or City Council, whichever. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I second that emotion. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This sure is easy. I'm 8 -- now I'm worried. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I have some 10 questions. At least I have one, after the Judge states it. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 12 approval of the proposal to the City of Kerrville for EMS 13 contract as submitted by Commissioner Letz. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I will say, the longer I 15 wrote, the more difficult it got on this thing. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. And when I was 17 looking over your shoulder on Number 5 -- and that's where I 18 am still, on Number 5. 19 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: It's pretty 20 comprehensive. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: My question would be, 22 over and above what? Mutually agree about costs per call to 23 the County over and above what? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I think the idea is 25 that -- okay, we're going to ask them, under Item 2 -- the 8-8-05 136 1 first item, 1, says that we want to -- we're going to set 2 the rates for the county. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Pretty simple. Item 2 5 says that, basically, administration, dispatch, collection 6 costs, and bad debt expenses are more related to call volume 7 than to call time, and they need to be accounted for as 8 such, whether they're -- and the last -- I guess the part I 9 added at the bottom is probably the way I really think we 10 should go with that. It should be done on a per-call basis 11 with each of those items, you know, a line item amount. 12 Then the -- Item 3 says, basically, Medical Director, First 13 Responder program stay the same. 4 says that billing will 14 be a separate item in the contract. 'Cause they give us an 15 amount; if we can do better elsewhere, we go elsewhere. And 16 then 5 would just say -- the intention on 3 is probably to 17 add the word "operational costs" -- 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- would be billed to us 20 on a -- and we agree to pay mutually-agreed operational 21 costs for EMS service into the county. And this will 22 require, whoever does this, that there's going to be a 23 separate billing system for the county. They're going to 24 have a different rate structure, and that money, when it 25 comes in, it goes back against the County's cost. 8-8-05 137 1 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yes. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It doesn't get lumped in 3 with the City and all averaged out. I don't know if it's 4 better or worse that way, but it goes back to the way it 5 should be. 6 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: At the end of the 7 year, depending upon how accurate we were on setting the 8 rates, there could be a shortfall against what we expected, 9 or could be a surplus. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: And then one other 12 point under Item 3, Medical Director and First Responder, 13 EMS. I would propose that we set the -- I agree that this 14 should be -- we should continue funding, but I would propose 15 we set the rates at a level that could or should cover this 16 also. In other words, if we think the operational costs are 17 -- require $600 a trip, we could set the operational costs 18 at $620 a trip and pay for the items on -- 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, you want to build 20 those into the rate structure? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would rather keep those 22 separate, 'cause I like to really keep the -- the 23 operational -- what I call operational costs, the cost of 24 the employees and the equipment that are going out to make 25 the EMS runs. I mean, that's one cost, and then the other 8-8-05 138 1 administration-type costs are, you know, other items. I 2 think this is very -- it's kind of a common way to do 3 contracts in this nation; you have a separate amount for the 4 various services provided. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And Number 3 really 6 crosses over -- over both operations and administration. 7 First Responder is definitely on the -- on the service side. 8 Medical Director, I think you could probably argue, is on 9 the administrative side, as is the lease expense. It really 10 crosses over both. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Now, on that, I wrote 12 down EMS office space or office space lease, 'cause that's 13 what we said in our last letter to the City. What are we 14 paying on that? I don't recall what we pay on that. And 15 I'm -- I think that should be basically an overhead. That 16 ought to go up into -- 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We paid $6,000 in the 18 current year. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What was that? 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And they paid six, so 21 it must be $12,000 rent for the place. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, we paid half? 23 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: It's the old 9-1-1 24 building, I think. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 8-8-05 139 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I don't -- I mean, I 2 don't think that should be a separate item. That should be 3 under their -- 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Should be under 2, shouldn't 5 it? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It ought to be under 2, 7 under administration costs. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think First Responder. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. Lease space 11 should be under 2. And -- and I guess I have the same 12 question about the Medical Director. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I think that's -- 14 we still have to have a Medical Director and a First 15 Responder program, even if we don't use the City of 16 Kerrville. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm just questioning 18 whether they belong -- Medical Director belongs under the 19 administration versus service side. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But if we don't -- if 21 worse comes to worst and we go with some other contract 22 company to provide the EMS service, I think the law requires 23 we still have a Medical Director in Kerr County. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I understand. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So I think it ought to be 8-8-05 140 1 a separate item. I think it's different than an EMS 2 contract. Am I right, Commissioner Baldwin, on that? That 3 we have to keep -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm really not sure. 5 There's a possibility that whoever you contract with would 6 be the party required to do the Medical Director -- to 7 obtain the Medical Director. I can't remember how we did 8 that. It seemed like back in the olden days once, that the 9 contractor is the person that secured the Medical Director. 10 And I may be wrong about that, but there's just something in 11 the back of my mind that says that's a possibility. But I 12 don't know enough to change this around. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Let's leave it right now, 14 and -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, that's fine. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, apparently we 17 both paid, in this current year, $9,000 apiece for the 18 Medical Director. We paid $6,000 apiece for -- 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Office space. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- office space. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: I think the office space 22 should go up under the -- under 2, under the administration 23 costs. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll add a separate item 25 there. 8-8-05 141 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. As kind of a language 2 cleanup under 2, based on the number of service calls, 3 rather than time usage. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On the -- 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where are you, Judge? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Second line, Paragraph 2. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I couldn't remember 8 actually what they have in the chart. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What do you want to 10 know? The number of calls? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, that chart that they 12 gave us. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: How did they define -- 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How did they define those 15 items? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Where that bar graph was. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Percent of total miles, I 18 believe. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Percent of patients. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Percent of loaded 21 miles. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Percent of loaded 23 miles versus percent of patients. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Number of patients served or 25 number of service calls? 8-8-05 142 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Number of patients versus 2 number of total miles. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, I'll make it work 5 with the nomenclature they use. Let me go ahead and make 6 those changes real quick, and y'all can start with the 7 reports, if it's all right. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sure. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Rather have everyone vote 10 on something before I start changing this. 11 (Commissioner Letz left the courtroom.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. It's 2 o'clock now, and 13 we're right on time, as usual, of course, to receive reports 14 from departments. I've been advised that Ms. Roman has -- 15 has a health issue in her family. 16 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I'll give you an 17 update on that, Commissioner. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 19 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: The -- that's Janie 20 Romans' 17-year-old son, and his health situation is a 21 little more critical than we thought. We just got a report 22 from her that he's going to have to have some intravenous 23 medicine, and it may go on for as long as a month, so he's 24 pretty ill. We need to keep him and Janie in our prayers. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. What -- 8-8-05 143 1 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Staph infection. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's bad stuff. 3 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: It's gotten into the 4 bones. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Bad stuff. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh. 7 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: So, when we hear -- 8 she's calling in, so when we hear more about that, we'll 9 know. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We have Mr. Walston 11 from the Extension Office, who I'm sure is anxious to give 12 us his report. 13 MR. WALSTON: You bet, yes, sir. Thank you. 14 I actually brought you something this time. I was able to 15 get printed off -- just pass it around; that'll work. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 17 (Discussion off the record.) 18 MR. WALSTON: What I brought this afternoon 19 is -- is a report that we do monthly to our state agent, 20 Texas A & M. And we base this on our statewide goals, which 21 includes our Family/Consumer Science issue, Ag, Natural 22 Resources, as well as Environmental and Health on Number 3, 23 and then Category 4 is our Leadership and Life Skills area, 24 and that's where we're -- 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which page are you 8-8-05 144 1 talking about? 2 MR. WALSTON: Okay, I'm looking at this 1 of 3 5. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh. 5 MR. WALSTON: Probably the last one you got. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Got you. 7 MR. WALSTON: But this is -- these are the 8 reports that we do on a monthly basis, and we base them -- 9 they're based on the number of educational programs we have, 10 on the various issues on the statewide goals. That way, 11 statewide, they're able to pull all the counties together 12 under those four statewide goals and present them to our 13 state legislators, so that's something that A & M asked us 14 to do. And the group methods are basically educational 15 programs, whether it be field days, meetings, whatever it 16 may be. A group educational program. And then the contacts 17 are just total contacts, so I'm going to not bother you with 18 that. You can see those numbers. And then you can go on 19 back; some of this I talked with you about in June when I 20 visited with you, as far as our judging teams and things 21 like that, our Leadership Lab. 22 As far as our July activities, we really 23 picked up, as far as our Record Book program. Our 4-H 24 Record Book program is something that we've really put a big 25 emphasis on in this county here in the last couple of years, 8-8-05 145 1 and this -- this past year, we had 16 4-H'ers that completed 2 a record book. And that's not something that's mandatory. 3 It's something that they do on their own, and we submit it 4 in a competition-type deal on district level. We've got two 5 of those advancing to state. Chance Muehlstein and Lance 6 Bauer, they advanced both theirs to state, and the record 7 book is a summary over the past four years of those 4-H'ers' 8 experiences and activities and learning experiences that 9 they've been involved with. They won -- both of those young 10 men won their district category, and they're going to -- 11 they're going to state and being judged now. 12 Of course, our livestock program is gearing 13 up and getting in full swing. We've been actively searching 14 and looking for livestock projects for kids. We've already 15 had a steer validation, which was back in July, and which we 16 had 43 4-H'ers and parents, leaders that participated. We 17 validated 13 steers. This year we had to start validating 18 for the state fair, so -- and what I mean by "validation" is 19 basically -- we have to basically tie that -- that actual 20 animal to that -- those kids. And we do that through -- we 21 nose-print them, we pull hair samples for -- what am I 22 thinking of? -- for blood -- DNA samples. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: DNA. 24 MR. WALSTON: For DNA. DNA, nose-print. We 25 ear-tag them. We get down to where at major stock shows, 8-8-05 146 1 when they pull blood samples and nose-print them, it's 2 pretty hard not to prove that that's the exact animal they 3 started with. So -- 4 JUDGE TINLEY: You say you're validating them 5 for the state fair? 6 MR. WALSTON: For the state fair for Dallas. 7 Now, the rest of the shows we'll validate here coming up 8 in -- in October/November. So, we'll -- the state fair is 9 much earlier. We have to do it earlier. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And this is just beef? 11 MR. WALSTON: It's everything. Beef -- 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Piggies? Piggies are 13 having babies right now. 14 MR. WALSTON: Yeah, we do those in November. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, okay. 16 MR. WALSTON: Yeah, they scatter it out. We 17 start -- we do the beef in July. We do the lambs and goats 18 in October and the pigs in November. So -- and that way 19 when we get there, there's no question that those kids had 20 those animals when they first started, and we didn't have 21 any swapping going on. As far as -- we had two 4-H'ers 22 compete at the district horse show -- or, excuse me, one 23 4-H'er compete at the district horse show; two at the state 24 horse show in Abilene in July. And Craig Leonard was -- won 25 at the state horse show and placed third in calf-roping, so 8-8-05 147 1 we're pleased with Craig. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right. 3 MR. WALSTON: The one area that I need -- I 4 want to put the emphasis on is our Building Community 5 Initiative program that -- that I'm sure y'all have heard us 6 talk to you about. And that is one that we work with the 7 Salvation Army as well as other after-school youth that we 8 started earlier last -- last year. We're also including 9 groups from the Texas Lion's Camp that were involved in 10 the -- that had physical limitation, handicapped youth; that 11 they were asked -- invited to come and do a fishing derby. 12 And the senior 4-H council members hosted the fishing derby 13 for them, and council members teamed up with the kids and 14 went out and went on the banks of the Guadalupe and spent 15 the morning fishing, and that was really a great opportunity 16 for those senior 4-H'ers to get to work with younger kids 17 and kids where they could serve as mentors and role models. 18 And this program is -- is really building some -- it's a 19 benefit to the community, but it's probably as much of a 20 benefit to our senior 4-H'ers to get involved and get to 21 work with those handicapped kids or those disadvantaged 22 kids. 23 They also -- the second day, Salvation Army 24 and Y.M.C.A. held a fishing derby for the second bunch. We 25 had 78 kids out there, with about 20 -- a little over 20 -- 8-8-05 148 1 I believe she probably has it on here -- council members, 2 and so we teamed up two to three kids per council member and 3 gave them some poles, and they went out and did a fishing 4 derby. And, so, that gets to be real enjoying -- enjoyable. 5 And those council kids really get their patience tested when 6 they get three kids on fishing poles, and hooks flying, and 7 so it's a good opportunity for them to get involved with 8 those kids. 9 Curriculum enrichment-wise, we've got -- our 10 Master Gardeners are gearing up with the Junior Master 11 Gardeners and did some training to teachers. We have a big 12 interest in -- in -- with the teachers in the area with the 13 Junior Master Gardener program. Not only teachers, but the 14 Salvation Army and a lot of other groups that are really 15 getting interested in our Junior Master Gardener program. 16 So, they did a training and had nine teachers that came in, 17 and we had -- Faye Drozd presented the program. Faye is one 18 of our Master Gardeners that has been trained on the state 19 level to -- to do such Junior Master Gardener training, and 20 so she'll be working with those teachers and helping them 21 get a Master Gardener -- Junior Master Gardener program 22 started in their schools. The Egg to Chick program is an 23 embryology program that we had a lot of interest in this 24 last year, and that's one that they also did the training 25 on. So, that gives you a little bit of an idea as to some 8-8-05 149 1 of the things, and it breaks it down as to volunteerism and 2 some things like that. 3 On this next group of reports -- three-page 4 report, it is the Ag Environmental Stewardship, and this is 5 the program that we presented this last month out at the 6 Shin Oak Ranch. We had an excellent turnout. We had about 7 52 participants, and the Shin Oak Ranch hosted it. Steve 8 Bauer was kind of the key person on that. As the Guadalupe 9 River project -- I don't know if y'all are familiar with 10 that, where they're able to get grant funds to go in and do 11 brush control work for watershed improvement based -- for 12 endangered species. So, this was an opportunity that 13 basically gets down to about a 90 percent cost share from 14 the time -- it basically, if they go through the program, 15 conduct the program, the brush control, their prescribed 16 burn program, their only cost for the brush -- for this 17 cost -- this brush control work is the cost of putting in 18 the fire guards and things for the -- that's the only thing 19 they don't get reimbursed for. So, it's an awful good 20 program that's basically off of grants. They're working on 21 putting together another group of landowners that can do 22 this same thing, and it's one that's not individual 23 landowners scattered around the county. It's geared more 24 towards one large group of landowners that will try to 25 encompass several acres. So, hopefully we'll be able to get 8-8-05 150 1 a little more benefit that way. 2 Our Master Gardener phone contacts there is 3 something that they present -- provide for me monthly for my 4 reports, and I just wanted to bring that to you to kind of 5 get an idea as to what those contact numbers look like. A 6 lot of those different categories are more for our benefit 7 as much as anything. They're -- there's probably that many 8 contacts or phone calls that I take care of myself that may 9 or may not get to them. They're there Monday, Wednesday, 10 and Friday. Tuesday and Thursday, you know, if it's 11 something that I don't feel like can wait for them, I'll go 12 ahead and take care of it then. So, are there any 13 questions? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm surprised to see a 15 fairly low number on the fruit and nut production. 16 MR. WALSTON: I think part of that's 'cause I 17 get those. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, I see, yeah. 19 You'd be the one I'd call, too. 20 MR. WALSTON: Well, I mean, that's -- my 21 secretary -- those tend to get forwarded to me rather than 22 to the Master Gardeners. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 24 MR. WALSTON: And if I'm not there, then 25 they'll go to the Master Gardeners. 8-8-05 151 1 JUDGE TINLEY: There seems to be fairly low 2 minority participation in some of these programs. Any 3 thoughts on that? 4 MR. WALSTON: Not -- to be honest with you, 5 the group that we're targeting has really boosted our 6 minority participation. With that BCI program, we're 7 getting a lot more minorities in there than we would 8 otherwise. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Your environmental, though, 10 shows -- 11 MR. WALSTON: Yeah. As far as landowner-wise 12 and -- yeah. We haven't. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably it's who the 14 landowners are. But this -- on the other report, it's -- 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 16 MR. WALSTON: Yeah, the BCI. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Little less than 18 30 percent. 19 MR. WALSTON: Yeah. Landowner-wise, it's -- 20 you know, even back when we were having -- when I had -- 21 hosted the Hill Country Living 101 program, we didn't have a 22 lot of minorities. I mean, we'd have one or two out of the 23 15 or so that we had in it. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's actually 25 ridiculous that we keep track of it that way, but I know the 8-8-05 152 1 State wants us to, so we do. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else for Mr. Walston? 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Roy. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 5 MR. WALSTON: You bet. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Appreciate you being here. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We'll be going out 8 there later, if Commissioner Letz hasn't forgotten about it. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh, yeah. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Of course he hasn't forgotten 11 about it. Okay, do we want to go back to 13 quickly, and 12 then move on? Why don't we go back to 13, and we've got a 13 revised proposal. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think I just 15 incorporated the comments made; at least I attempted to 16 incorporate the comments made. There's already a motion. 17 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: The motion's made, 18 and I incorporate these changes into that motion. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Very well. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: My second stands. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. We have a motion 22 and second to approve the Kerr County proposal to City of 23 Kerrville EMS contract to be submitted to the City of 24 Kerrville as per the final draft as prepared by Commissioner 25 Letz. Any questions, comments, or discussions? 8-8-05 153 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To make it -- make it 2 clear, this is the Court's, not mine. 3 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Yeah. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: It's up for consideration of 5 adoption by the Court right now. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The Letz document. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 8 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: The only comment I 9 have, and it goes without saying, this would be good for the 10 taxpayers. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Will what? 12 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Be good for the 13 taxpayers. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Absolutely. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If nothing else, 17 accountability. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think this is the way 19 the contract really should be structured, in my opinion. I 20 mean, it's really -- kind of took a long ways to get here, 21 but we ought to have it broken out into line items. 22 Administration should be one item and billing should be an 23 amount, and that's the way it needs to be done. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I notice with 25 interest this flyer. We're talking about of all the various 8-8-05 154 1 reports that are forthcoming as a result of this, none of 2 which we get now. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I've been advised that 4 there are a lot of reports that are currently being made by 5 state law that we don't get copies of, either. But, anyway, 6 not that we're required -- I mean, it's for the whole 7 department; it's not split out County/City, I don't think. 8 But, anyway -- 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further questions? 10 Comments? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is this going to be 12 faxed to the City of Kerrville today? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would think, yes. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: I think that's the plan. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If somebody can help get 16 a cover sheet, we can just fax it. I don't know that we 17 need a letter. 18 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: That's part of the 19 motion. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Part of your second, too, 21 wasn't it? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure was. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: That's what I thought. Any 24 further questions or comments? All in favor of the motion, 25 signify by raising your right hand. 8-8-05 155 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We 5 can come back to our reports now. We have the Environmental 6 Health Department director here, Mr. Arreola. 7 MR. ARREOLA: Good afternoon. 8 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Mr. Arreola, before 9 you start, this is a carry-over from this morning's meeting. 10 MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir? 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: We passed that 12 budget change -- 13 MR. ARREOLA: Amendment. 14 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: -- but the 15 Commissioners wanted some more detailed explanation about 16 what's going on there. 17 MR. ARREOLA: Sure. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Question one, you're 19 taking the money out of the Capital Outlay? 20 MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: $1,000. Obviously, 22 you've decided to not make a purchase -- a Capital Outlay 23 purchase of some sort that you had originally -- that we 24 originally put in the budget. 25 MR. ARREOLA: Basically, we did the purchase, 8-8-05 156 1 but it was cheaper than anticipated, so we got what we 2 needed and had some extra money. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Keep going. We like 4 that a lot. Thank you. 5 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Anything else on 6 that? Go ahead. 7 MR. ARREOLA: Great. Thank you. I don't 8 have a lengthy report as I had last time. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hallelujah. 10 MR. ARREOLA: Tried to make it shorter. It's 11 late in the day. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This guy is a fast 13 learner, isn't he? 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Quick study. Is this 15 one dealie or several dealies here? What is it? One for 16 you and one for me. 17 MR. ARREOLA: Four or five pages. Okay. I 18 do have some numbers here, but, you know, we can look at the 19 numbers quick. And I would like to make more emphasis on 20 what, overall, the department is doing. More focus on 21 public education. We had a workshop about two weeks ago, 22 and that was one of the comments -- one of the comments from 23 the installers, public education, so I decided to bring you 24 information on what we have done in public education. But 25 before we get there, the first -- the first page you have in 8-8-05 157 1 front of you, it's just by quarter, what the results. So 2 far, we had the best quarter of the year this last past 3 quarter. We're doing good at revenue and overall 4 inspections, and turn out the paperwork; everything is being 5 handled as fast as we can, so it's pretty good right there. 6 I don't know if you have any questions on that area. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It shows an increase 8 as we go along through the year. Is this -- do you think -- 9 I mean, is this a seasonal-type thing, or will it continue 10 on the uprise in January? 11 MR. ARREOLA: No, I think it's seasonal. 12 It's basically the busiest time of the year. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 14 MR. ARREOLA: We're going to, probably next 15 quarter, see a little bit of decrease. It's normal, 16 basically the way it goes. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You still got a month 18 to go in the third quarter. 19 MR. ARREOLA: No, sir. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, I'm thinking -- 21 I'm sorry, I was thinking of calendar year. 22 MR. ARREOLA: Yes. We go by fiscal year. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Fiscal year. 24 MR. ARREOLA: The next report, that is a 25 calendar year; that's for Solid Waste. And, basically, I've 8-8-05 158 1 just informed you there the number of cases we -- we 2 investigated. Every case that we received has been 3 investigated. Not all of them have been closed yet. The 4 total number year-to-date -- that's January 1st to now -- 5 112 cases. Of those, 83 have been resolved, closed. The 6 rest are still pending, but every one has been investigated. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'd be interested to 8 know how that 112 for the current fiscal year stacks up 9 against previous years. 10 MR. ARREOLA: There's no data. We have a 11 little bit of data on -- on 2004, but not prior to that. 12 So -- 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 14 MR. ARREOLA: -- we can give you that 15 information. 16 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: But the total 17 investigated we know is up from -- 18 MR. ARREOLA: It is from last year. 19 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: -- prior years. 20 MR. ARREOLA: Yes, it is up. I don't have 21 the number, but I know it's up. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can you estimate a 23 number, out of the 112 investigations, how many of those 24 ended up in a courtroom? 25 MR. ARREOLA: Not too many. We might have -- 8-8-05 159 1 do you know the number? Probably four? 2 MR. GARCIA: Four. 3 MR. ARREOLA: Have been in the court. The 4 rest have been solved internally. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, that's good. 6 Did you win all four of them? 7 MR. ARREOLA: Two are still pending, I think, 8 and two we succeed. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 10 MR. ARREOLA: Any other questions on that 11 one? Okay. The last part of your packets, I tried to kind 12 of summarize what we've been doing on public education. 13 That's just a memo, and with your permission, I would like 14 to read the first part of it. It says, "During the last 20 15 months of operations of this department under the direction 16 of the Kerr County Commissioners Court, besides our regular 17 activities, we have hosted or participated in the following 18 public and community events as part of our public education 19 campaign." And there's a list; there's a total of ten 20 activities that we did. We are working really close with 21 the City of Kerrville with the Recycling Day program. It's 22 twice a year. Something I'd like to make emphasis, the 23 entire staff of the department participates, and it's on a 24 volunteer basis. These events normally are on the weekend, 25 so they go and don't get any -- any payment for it. It's -- 8-8-05 160 1 they want to do it. I'm there most of the time. So, it's 2 pretty good to have that type of team. We also participated 3 in Leadership Kerr County the year before, did a 4 presentation for them on environmental issues. The Board of 5 Realtors, they wanted to know about when we changed the rule 6 of -- transfer rule, they were so interested in knowing 7 that, so we prepared a presentation for them. The West Kerr 8 County Cleanup Day, two years in a row we have participated 9 in it and helped them out. I think you received something 10 from them. Yes, sir? 11 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I want to tell you 12 about that one. Commissioner Baldwin knows that this West 13 Kerr Chamber of Commerce struggles a little bit to set up 14 who they are and what they ought to be doing, and they've 15 made a lot of progress in the past few years. But 16 there's -- probably five or six years ago, I was on the 17 board of that. We were trying to figure out ways we could 18 be useful to the community, and so I said let's have a 19 cleanup day. Let's get all this junk out of Ingram. One of 20 the other members said, "Yeah, we ought to do something 21 about Ingram; it's going to start to look just like 22 Kerrville." So, that -- that was the start of the West Kerr 23 County Cleanup Day. And they handle -- Miguel will tell 24 you, they handle a lot of junk. 25 MR. ARREOLA: A lot of trash, yeah. So it 8-8-05 161 1 was -- it was a good event. We're thinking about trying to 2 do something similar in some other areas of the county, 3 Kerrville South or east Kerr County, for money to have 4 something like that done too, so we're working on that. 5 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: I think it's also 6 good county public relations for you and your folks -- 7 MR. ARREOLA: It is very good. 8 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: -- to be involved in 9 that. 10 MR. ARREOLA: Yes, very good. We also hosted 11 an O.S.S.F. seminar. It's the first one I know of. We 12 brought Dr. Bruce Lesikar from Texas A & M. He came over, 13 and did an excellent presentation. We have a video of that. 14 We're going to make some more copies and give it to the 15 public. The U.G.R.A. helped us out a lot on that one with 16 the cost, and they provided the facilities. We had started 17 meetings to discuss procedures and inspections and all of 18 that, the rules. It's very productive. We participated in 19 Earth Day, did a Power Point presentation and worked all day 20 there helping too, so it's a very good experience. And then 21 the latest, we had an O.S.S.F. workshop here in the 22 Commissioners Court. We had a good turnout. We had a few 23 people coming over, and they made the comments -- I made a 24 couple of -- three pages of copies of that workshop, the 25 transcript of the workshop. I'd like to take you -- 8-8-05 162 1 highlight a little bit. On Page 76, Line 17 and 18, is 2 where they basically say they're happy with the process, the 3 way we're doing it. And then on page -- next page, Page 77, 4 Line 24, about -- you know, the other person agrees with -- 5 with that. So I think the -- the relationship we have with 6 the installers is good. I don't think we're going to make 7 everybody happy 100 percent all the time, but it's very good 8 compared to what it used to be. And that's what I have. I 9 don't know if you have any questions. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm very impressed, 11 Miguel, that you and your team would volunteer and take time 12 out of your weekends to go and promote your program and 13 represent the County, and I appreciate that very much. 14 Also, Dr. Lesikar is top of the line. 15 MR. ARREOLA: He's hard to get, I tell you. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. You're not 17 going to find anybody more knowledgeable than that guy. 18 MR. ARREOLA: Yeah, he's good. 19 COMMISSIONER NICHOLSON: Thank you. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, one more 22 question. When you do the Recycling Day -- 23 MR. ARREOLA: Yes, sir? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- is that -- I mean, 25 is it just like cars lined up from here to San Antonio? 8-8-05 163 1 Or -- 2 MR. ARREOLA: It's a -- 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- what's that like? 4 MR. ARREOLA: It's a pretty good amount of 5 people. I'm thinking how many cars we had last time. I 6 think it was 350, something like that. And then in the -- 7 in the summer, it's bigger; it's about 500 cars. The lines 8 don't get too long, but all day long we get people going in. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 10 MR. ARREOLA: They bring everything. And 11 City of Kerrville takes basically everything; tires, 12 batteries, oil, and they help us a lot in the county, 13 basically. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So that's a program 15 that we need to keep. 16 MR. ARREOLA: Yes, it's joint. It's great. 17 It helps us a lot in our department. People can get rid 18 legally of stuff that they otherwise cannot. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Late at night I have 20 these visions of ambulances parked there, county ambulances. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Lots of them? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, yeah. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: A lot of them. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: One for every day of 25 the week. I get to drive on Mondays. Wouldn't that be a 8-8-05 164 1 perfect location, though, for an ambulance station? 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mark your calendar, 3 if you will, Miguel, for next Monday afternoon exactly at 4 the hour 2:30, at the Road and Bridge conference room for a 5 preconstruction conference with the contractor on Kerrville 6 South Wastewater Project. 7 MR. ARREOLA: Okay. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We want him to be 9 totally familiar with the environmental health aspects of 10 the project, okay? 11 MR. ARREOLA: Very good. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 13 MR. ARREOLA: We'll be there. Any other 14 questions? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else for Mr. Arreola? 16 Thank you, sir. We appreciate it. 17 MR. ARREOLA: Thank you. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: The last one that we have 19 listed is the juvenile facility, and we actually got 20 Ms. Harris' report last week. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I saw her outside; I said 22 I didn't see any reason -- I said we saw her last week, 23 we're going to see her tomorrow. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: She'll be here 25 tomorrow. 8-8-05 165 1 JUDGE TINLEY: And we -- in the meantime, she 2 sent us some more information, two different batches. So -- 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Good. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Happy information digesting. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, just for the 6 benefit of the Court, the item I mentioned to you, if the 7 Court doesn't mind starting with either Maintenance or 8 Sheriff tomorrow and give me a chance to get through a 9 doctor's appointment I've had scheduled for a long, long 10 time at 1:45, I'll be here shortly thereafter. But I did 11 want to be in on the Juvenile Detention Facility -- 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Right. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- discussion. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Right. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're just going to 16 have to get your priorities in line. That's what it's all 17 about. Do you want to work here or work over there? 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's the doctor's 19 priorities I've got to get in line. Not easily done. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Is there anything else? 22 Hearing nothing else, we will stand adjourned. 23 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 2:29 p.m.) 24 - - - - - - - - - - 25 8-8-05 166 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 12th day of August, 8 2005. 9 10 11 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 12 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 13 Certified Shorthand Reporter 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 8-8-05