1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Regular Session 10 Monday, June 11, 2007 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X June 11, 2007 2 PAGE --- Commissioners' Comments 5 3 1.1 Request usage and rate of Kerr County Youth Exhibit 4 Center, February 16-17, 2008, for art sale fundraiser to benefit Former Texas Ranger Foundation 11 5 1.2 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 6 readdress Regional Appellate Defense contract 12 7 1.3 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to authorize nuisance enforcement including litigation 8 relative to Roy Street OSSF issues (Executive Session, as applicable) 18 9 1.4 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for road 10 changes in various locations; set public hearing for same 19 11 1.5 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for 12 revision of plat for Y.O. Ranchlands III, Lots 109, 110, 118 & 119; set public hearing for same 24 13 1.6 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for 14 revision of plat of Lots 2-11 of Privilege Creek Ranches (a/k/a Boerne Falls Ranch) to include road 15 name change from Privilege Lane to Turkey Knob; set public hearing for same 27 16 1.7 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 17 proposed site plan for Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center as presented at last meeting; authorize 18 Commissioners Oehler & Letz to proceed with planning 35 19 1.13 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to authorize drafting of a "leash law" requirement 20 for persons bringing dogs to Flat Rock Lake Park 46 21 1.8 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action authorizing John Trolinger to work with Commissioners Letz & 22 Oehler to develop computerized booking system 58 23 1.9 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to add link to Hill Country Veterans Council on the Kerr 24 County website home page 60 25 1.10 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action concerning monthly reports from constables 62 3 1 I N D E X (Continued) June 11, 2007 2 PAGE 1.11 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 3 designate new registered agent for Kerr County Housing Finance Corporation 66 4 1.12 Request Kerr County Environmental Health 5 Department to provide update on status of TCEQ and court-ordered cleanup of property owned by 6 Milton Taylor, adjacent to Flat Rock Lake Park 68 7 1.14 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve Letter of Engagement with McCall, Parkhurst 8 & Horton, LLP, to provide Bond Counsel services to Kerr County for Center Point/Eastern Kerr County 9 Wastewater project 79 10 1.15 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to clarify expiration of terms of office of 11 Commissioners Williams and Letz on Kerrville/ Kerr County Joint Airport Board 80 12 1.16 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 13 IRS notice regarding tax period of March 31, 2007 82 14 4.1 Pay Bills 90 4.2 Budget Amendments 90 15 4.3 Late Bills -- 4.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 95 16 1.17 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to fill 17 vacancy in Environmental Health, administrative assistant position (Executive Session) 96 18 1.18 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action regarding 19 designation or status of Environmental Health Code Enforcement Officer(s) 96 20 3.1 Action as may be required on matters discussed in 21 Executive Session 103 22 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee Assignments --- 23 5.2 Reports from Elected Officials/Department Heads 105 24 --- Adjourned 108 25 4 1 On Monday, June 11, 2007, at 9:00 a.m., a regular 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in the 3 Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, Kerrville, 4 Texas, and the following proceedings were had in open court: 5 P R O C E E D I N G S 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. 7 Let me call to order this regular meeting of the Kerr County 8 Commissioners Court scheduled and posted for this time and 9 date, Monday, June 11, 2007, at 9 a.m. It is that time now. 10 Commissioner Oehler? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Please stand for a moment of 12 prayer. 13 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. At this time, if 15 there's any member of the public that wishes to be heard on 16 any matter that is not a listed agenda item, we'd be happy to 17 hear from you now. If you wish to be heard on a listed agenda 18 item, we would ask that you wait until that agenda item is 19 called, and also that you fill out a participation form. They 20 can be found at the rear of the room. It's not absolutely 21 essential that you do that. It just helps me to identify 22 those that wish to be heard so that I don't overlook you. But 23 if -- if, for some reason, I do overlook you or you haven't 24 filled out a participation form, when we get to that item, 25 please get my attention in some way, shape, form, or fashion, 6-11-07 5 1 and I'll see that you have an opportunity to be heard, even if 2 you haven't filled out an agenda item. But at this time, if 3 there's any member of the public that wishes to be heard on 4 any matter that is not a listed agenda item, feel free to come 5 forward at this time and tell us what's on your mind. Seeing 6 no one coming forward, we'll move on. Commissioner Oehler, do 7 you have anything for us this morning? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh, not a whole lot. It's 9 just finally turned summertime, and things up the river are in 10 full bloom with all the camps being open and lots of people 11 using all the wonderful Guadalupe River again this summer, and 12 sure glad they're here. They bring a lot of money to Kerr 13 County. Besides that, nothing. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Commissioner 1? 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. It's good to be 16 home. Saw a lot of interesting things -- stuff and things. 17 And -- but it's -- it is a thrill to be home, I can tell you. 18 I saw my son bungee jump off of a 200-foot cliff tied to a 19 rubber band. (Laughter.) And doesn't make any sense to me, 20 but, boy, he sure had a good time doing it. But we did a 21 hundred thousand things like that. It was really a treat. 22 That's all I have. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Commissioner Williams? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just got a letter in the 25 mail this morning -- opened this morning. I won't read the 6-11-07 6 1 whole thing, except one paragraph, and I'm going to give it to 2 Commissioner Oehler. It's nice to get a letter that 3 compliments our staff, no matter what department it is. 4 "Ms. Roman is open and honest with people regarding her 5 animals. She and the staff are very caring and compassionate 6 people, and they have the best interests of animals and owners 7 at heart. The place is also very neat and clean," on and on. 8 Commissioner, here's a copy. It's a nice letter commending 9 the activities that take place at the animal -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that from Bruce? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I did not. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: He signed it? I'm going to 14 try that. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Boy, you're sharp this 16 morning. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sharpened up. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No jet lag, huh? Also, I 19 got a communication this morning, which the Judge probably has 20 this as well, from Texas Water Development Board, and it has 21 to do with the comments T.W.D.B. has made on the preliminary 22 planning. This -- this letter and comments should have been 23 in my hands two weeks ago. Just arrived today, this morning, 24 and so we'll incorporate them in the plan. This will 25 necessitate one more public meeting, but it also, because the 6-11-07 7 1 lateness of them getting it to us, might require us to ask for 2 another 30 days, which is all. I won't test -- 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Is this on the -- 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is on the -- 5 JUDGE TINLEY: -- Kerrville South? 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No. No, this is on the 7 preliminary plan for Center Point. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which we're wrapping up on 10 the grant. They have an interest in that grant, as does 11 U.G.R.A. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Planning. That's it, Judge. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Commissioner Letz? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Only thing I have is, I think it 16 was week before last -- the Judge was aware of it -- I was 17 referred a phone call to him from Bud Little of W.O.A.I. He 18 was calling related to the 20th anniversary of the accident 19 outside of Comfort where it was -- ten kids from a camp were 20 swept up the Guadalupe River and killed. But the take on the 21 story, the reason I bring it up, is what has the County done 22 in those 20 years to stop -- to prevent this from happening 23 again? And we don't look back as often as we probably should. 24 And I talked to him, visited with him probably 15, 20 minutes, 25 and was going through things that I could discuss just off the 6-11-07 8 1 top of my head. The early warning system that we have now all 2 along the river that U.S.G.S., Guadalupe-Blanco River 3 Authority, and, really, U.G.R.A. is involved with is a big 4 help; huge thing that's been really accomplished. 5 Plus the -- the number of low-water bridges that 6 this County and TexDOT have participated in replacing, and 7 we're on that final, I guess, push on getting almost all those 8 done in the county right now. And I think it's a -- it just 9 shows that we have done a tremendous amount, not necessarily 10 specifically because of that, but I think that flood and that 11 tragedy has always been in the back of our minds, and a lot of 12 these bridges is a result of that. And I think that's one of 13 the -- it's kind of interesting to reflect back on the 20th 14 anniversary of that tragedy and how we have made this county 15 as a whole -- I think this and many courts before, and TexDOT, 16 through their help, made a lot of improvements in safety along 17 the river. And we have a little ways to go, but I think most 18 of the worst areas have been corrected or are being corrected 19 right now. That's it. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Judge, I have one more thing 21 to add that I forgot. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Sure. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Janie Roman came in earlier 24 this morning; I was here before 8 o'clock, and she told me 25 that she has confirmed more cases of rabies -- and I haven't 6-11-07 9 1 gotten a chance to discuss this with Commissioner Williams -- 2 in Center Point. We have some in our end of the county as 3 well. But she reported to me this morning that she had, I 4 believe over the weekend, in three different areas -- three 5 different locations, but all in close proximity to each other, 6 has found animals she believed to have rabies, two coons and a 7 skunk, and -- and maybe possibly a puppy that has come into 8 contact with possibly the skunk before it died, or -- must 9 have been before it died. And she is, as we speak, headed to 10 San Antonio with the animals to be tested to see if it is 11 positive. She has a real belief that it is going to be 12 positive because of the way the animals were and the way they 13 appeared before they died, and so that's something we all need 14 to be aware of. 15 And the reason I bring it up now is 'cause the press 16 is still here, because later on, when we have Commissioners' 17 reports, that might be a little too late to get that kind of a 18 report put in the paper. But there -- there evidently is some 19 rabies outbreak in Kerr County, and we need to all be aware of 20 that. And if you see animals that are -- that are not acting 21 right, call Animal Control. They deal with them, and they 22 will respond very quickly if they hear of animals that appear 23 to be sick or -- or possibly rabid. So, just keep that in 24 mind, and the newspapers can help us with that. And it's 25 not -- it's not a fun thing to report, but it is true, and we 6-11-07 10 1 need to be aware of it at all times. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, can I have one more 3 minute? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Sure. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: While we're talking about 6 the newspaper being able to help us a little bit, Alamo 7 Regional Transit is running trolleys on deviated routes. 8 Deviated routes run essentially from Ingram to Center Point, 9 and they make stops throughout that trip. And I haven't seen 10 much publicity with respect to -- particularly in the daily 11 paper with respect to schedules and the fact that that's 12 taking place, and I certainly hope that we can get a little 13 publicity. If people are going to ride the bus, they're going 14 to ride because, one, they need to do that, and they know when 15 it's going to run, and the schedule is readily available. And 16 a little publicity about it would be helpful. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: I think at one point, there were some 18 of those flyers at the back of the room. I know that I've 19 seen them posted at various places. They may not still be 20 there, but at one point there were some of those flyers -- 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: -- at the back of the room. I 23 appreciate you mentioning that. Did you have anything? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Since -- since we last met, if you'll 6-11-07 11 1 recall, we adopted a unanimous resolution in support of Mayor 2 Gene Smith's initiative to designate June as Traffic Awareness 3 Safety Month, and we had a kickoff of that since we last met, 4 and had a pretty good bunch of folks there, and we appreciate 5 the media's cooperation, the whole -- whole idea being to try 6 and get people to pay more attention to the traffic laws, 7 drive in a more courteous manner, hopefully be a good example 8 to our visitors that come to see us here locally. And I want 9 to thank Mayor Smith for his taking the lead for that 10 initiative, and hopefully it'll produce some results. There's 11 some question of that, but you don't know until you try. So, 12 I appreciate his efforts. If we don't have anything from 13 anyone else here on the Court, let's get on down to business. 14 The first item on the agenda is to request usage and 15 rates of Kerr County Youth Exhibit Center on February 16 and 16 17, 2008, for a professional art organization, that being the 17 Texas Wild Bunch, to hold an art sale as a fundraiser 18 benefiting the Former Texas Ranger Foundation. That will be a 19 two-day event with art, silent auction, quick draw open 20 free -- which will be open free to the public, and the sixth 21 year to hold that event, four of them having been previously 22 held at the Y.O. Ranch Resort Hotel, and the last year, 23 actually held out at the Youth Center. Is Mr. Napper here 24 with us today? He had asked that this item be placed on the 25 agenda. 6-11-07 12 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Was there a request to get a 2 reduced rate? Or -- I mean -- 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I've -- I've not -- I've not received 4 any request along those lines. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I thought we already had 6 rates established for 501(c). 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We do. You can forward it to 8 our booking agent, and book it, and they can contact us if we 9 need to make an adjustment. We don't need any action by the 10 Court. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: I would agree with that. I thought 12 maybe he wanted to make a presentation. Obviously not. 13 Anybody on the Court have anything to offer on that item? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move on to Item 2, then. 16 Consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to readdress 17 the Regional Appellate Defense contract. Is Ms. Bailey here? 18 MS. BAILEY: Yes, sir. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. And we have someone here from 20 the Regional Appellate Defense group? 21 MS. RODRIGUEZ: Yes. Good morning, gentlemen. On 22 the agenda is Angela Moore -- 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Give your name and address, please. 24 MS. RODRIGUEZ: Yes. I'm Lori Rodriguez, and along 25 with me is Roderick Glass. We're appellate public defenders 6-11-07 13 1 with the Bexar County Public Defender's office in San Antonio. 2 The agenda has Ms. Moore; she's our chief public defender, but 3 unfortunately she had a prior commitment, so she sent us along 4 today. I believe where we're at is, I think that you all had 5 approved the interlocal agreement with Bexar County to enter 6 into the project for the Regional Defense Plan, but there were 7 some problems when it came back to our Commissioners Court 8 because there were interlineations on the contract. So, 9 Mr. Glass and I are here today to just answer any concerns you 10 may have. You know, we came in person, 'cause it's really 11 important that -- we'd really like your county to take part in 12 the program. It's going to be a great opportunity for this 13 region. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- the language that you speak of 15 had to do with extraneous expenses that -- that you had the 16 ability to authorize, and we wanted the approval of the -- of 17 the initiating court, the judge who -- in whose court the case 18 was heard and from where the appeal was taken. And so it 19 was -- I think there was one interlineation, to my 20 recollection, and it was pretty minor. Your -- your chief, 21 Ms. Moore, has since written a letter in which she stated 22 that, number one, the likelihood that that's going to occur 23 for investigators or interpreters or things of that nature 24 post-trial is, at best, extremely remote. And, further, she 25 made the statement in her letter that, being familiar with 6-11-07 14 1 Judge Ables and his procedures, that she -- she wasn't about 2 to put him out on the end of the limb without telling him that 3 she was going to do that and -- and getting his okay to do 4 that, notwithstanding any contractual language. Is that a 5 fair summation of -- 6 MS. RODRIGUEZ: I think that's absolutely fair. I 7 think Rocky and I have both done extensive appellate work, and 8 it's, as you said, extremely rare that it would ever come up. 9 And I think, really, there -- as far as we were concerned, 10 there really wasn't any problem with the contract, but our 11 Commissioners didn't want -- they want all the interlocal 12 agreements to be the same, so they -- they didn't want to 13 accept it with the interlineations. But, certainly, if there 14 were an instance where there would have to be further 15 expenses, I think what Ms. Moore reflected in the letter was 16 that we would certainly, you know, discuss those with the 17 appointing judge. I don't really foresee it being an issue at 18 all. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me ask you, how many -- how many 20 counties are in your Appellate Indigent Defense project? 21 MS. RODRIGUEZ: There's 32 counties in the Fourth 22 Court district. Right now, we have -- about a third of those 23 have entered interlocal agreements. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 25 MS. RODRIGUEZ: We're hoping that all of them will. 6-11-07 15 1 Some of the counties, I think, have been slow in getting back 2 to us because they don't have -- you know, they may have one 3 appeal every two or three years, so it's not a pressing issue 4 for them. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: As to those counties that have 6 entered into interlocal agreements with you, approximately a 7 third of the 32, which would be 10 or 11, I would guess, how 8 many of those have modified any of the language in that 9 interlocal agreement as you proposed it to us? 10 MS. RODRIGUEZ: None. Only Kerr County. None of 11 them had. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I have a question. 14 When costs are incurred like that, whether it be interpreter 15 or whatever, doesn't Judge Ables approve it before it goes out 16 anyway? 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Virtually all of those costs are 18 incurred at the trial level, and I think that's probably what 19 needs to be understood. Costs for investigators, costs for 20 interpreters and similar type costs are incurred at the trial 21 level, before Notice of Appeal is ever given, which starts it 22 on the track down here to these folks. And, yes, Judge Ables 23 does control those costs at the trial -- or whoever the trial 24 judge may be controls those costs and has -- has oversight 25 authority over them at -- at that level. 6-11-07 16 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And then, when it moves into 2 those folks in the appellate arena, then they -- these people 3 here are totally in charge of -- of approving or disapproving? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Under the terms of the contract -- 5 the literal terms of the contract, as I read it, they would be 6 for those type expenses. But the point is that I cannot think 7 of a single case that I've ever been involved in, in which 8 those types of expenses would even come into play once it's up 9 on appeal. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. Mm-hmm. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: And I think that's -- you've 12 handled -- between the two of you folks, you've handled a 13 number of appeals, -- 14 MS. RODRIGUEZ: That's correct. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: -- obviously. 16 MS. RODRIGUEZ: That's correct. And just to sort of 17 give a brief overview, maybe this'll help put it in 18 perspective. Once we get our -- our -- once we get involved 19 on the case, it's at the appellate level, so we're working 20 just from the trial court record, just from what's taken down 21 by the court reporter. And we can't really bring in -- at 22 least at our level of what we're doing, we can't bring in 23 anything outside of the record, so it wouldn't be as if -- 24 we're not authorized to do writs of habeas corpus, which is 25 the collateral attack. That's the only instance, I would 6-11-07 17 1 imagine, in a post-appellate scheme of things that you would 2 have an investigator involved. We're limited to the record, 3 and actually, under our grant funding, we can't go outside. 4 We can't do writs or anything like that, so we're really 5 limited to what happened at trial. Now, the only thing I 6 could foresee, you know, could possibly involve some expense 7 would be if we had to get an interpreter, but chances are that 8 would be a Spanish language interpreter anyway, and our -- we 9 have one in the office. I mean, our secretary speaks Spanish. 10 And Mr. Glass pointed out for me to mention, too, that 11 typically when we've done this kind of work in the past, we've 12 always had to go -- it's sort of our practice to go and get 13 approval from the judge. I mean, in our office it hasn't come 14 up yet, but when we were in private practice, you do -- if 15 there's any expenses that's sort of outside the appellate 16 appointment, you know, we would go and get prior approval from 17 the Judge. That's just sort of standard practice. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The current -- or the agreement 19 that we modified slightly was modified through our County 20 Attorney's office. Does your office have any comment, or do 21 they think it's okay for us to go ahead with the form of 22 contract as originally presented? 23 MS. BAILEY: I can't anticipate there being -- as 24 she said, I can't really anticipate a situation where there 25 would be a large amount of costs in -- in this appellate 6-11-07 18 1 scheme, so I'm not concerned about it from a practical level. 2 Certainly, from a legal level, whatever letter Ms. Moore wrote 3 would be extraneous to the contract, so if there was a huge 4 expense, that letter wouldn't limit us. However, I've worked 5 with Ms. Moore in the past. She's an excellent attorney. I 6 trust her implicitly, and -- and so I don't have any heartburn 7 about agreeing to change the contract back to the way it was 8 presented. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I make a motion that we accept 10 the contract as originally presented. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 14 indicated. Any further question or discussion on that motion? 15 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 16 hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Thank you 21 very much for being here with us today. 22 MS. RODRIGUEZ: Thank you, gentlemen. 23 MR. GLASS: Thank you. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move to Item 3, if we might. 25 Consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to authorize 6-11-07 19 1 nuisance enforcement, including litigation, relative to Roy 2 Street O.S.S.F. issues. First, let me inquire if this is a 3 matter that needs to be totally considered in executive 4 session, or whether or not there are some public -- public 5 session matters that can be addressed? 6 MS. BAILEY: I think it's really pretty much 7 entirely executive session. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any member of the Court -- 9 MS. BAILEY: As far as I know. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: -- have anything to offer in the open 11 or public session? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can we pass on this, Judge, and 13 come back to it later? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. Oh, yeah. Yeah. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, we're going to do the executive 17 session at the tail end. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll defer on that one for now and 20 move to Item 4. Consider, discuss, and take appropriate 21 action for road changes in various locations, and set a public 22 hearing for the same. 23 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. It is the intention of the 24 Commissioners Court to consider road changes in various 25 locations in Kerr County. A public hearing would be held July 6-11-07 20 1 the 23rd, 2007, at 9:55 a.m., Commissioners Courtroom of Kerr 2 County Courthouse, 700 Main, Kerrville, Texas, concerning the 3 following proposed road changes: One is a speed limit on Goat 4 Creek Cutoff. We ran some tests out there to see what the 5 speed is, and we recommend 35 miles an hour. Presently it's 6 30, so we're saying 35 is probably a realistic and a safer 7 speed to go at. A stop sign at Greenwood to Marilyn. 8 Currently, there's a yield sign there now, and the complaint 9 is that these people are running this yield sign. So, as far 10 as tort liability is concerned, it would probably be better to 11 put the stop sign there and make people more responsible. I 12 don't know if that'll make them stop, but it would make them 13 responsible in case there's an accident. It wouldn't be a 14 question of who had right-of-way. Name change. We have a 15 name change, Staach Ranch Road, change that to Bear Creek 16 Road. Currently, we have -- Bandera County has the name Bear 17 Creek. You have to understand where Staach Ranch is at. I go 18 past the courthouse in Bandera and go another 20 miles to get 19 to this road, and so I go several miles up Bear Creek, get our 20 road for one mile, and then the end of the road is in Kendall 21 County. Now, Kendall County and -- and Bandera both named 22 their roads Bear Creek, and I believe that it's appropriate to 23 change that name to Bear Creek also, that 1 mile, for health, 24 safety, and welfare for EMS and police and everything else 25 that would be serving that. I had to put that in there. 6-11-07 21 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: For your information, the people 2 over there that live on the road don't acknowledge that they 3 live on Staach Ranch, anyway. I was down there recently; they 4 said -- 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: "Where's that?" 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, "Where's that road? We 7 don't know anything about that." Truby or Len? 8 MR. ODOM: Mm-hmm? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Where are we on Louise Oehler, 10 changing it to Barbary Way? 11 MS. HARDIN: My understanding is that you were going 12 to have a petition from the landowners. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought 911 was going to take 14 care of that. I was wondering if we -- you might check with 15 Bill Amerine. We can save some money if we add it in, 'cause 16 you -- 17 MS. HARDIN: It doesn't need to be added, 'cause 18 it's not a County-maintained road, so there doesn't have to be 19 a public hearing. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, thank you. 21 MR. ODOM: Okay. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Odom, what about, you know, Bear 23 Creek Road out here between here and Ingram? 24 MR. ODOM: But that's in Bandera County. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What? 6-11-07 22 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, but it's fixing to be in Kerr 2 County. If we -- 3 MR. ODOM: Oh, I hadn't thought of that. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: If we implement this change, we got a 5 Bear Creek in Bandera, we got a Bear Creek in Kendall, and we 6 got an intervening portion that you're proposing to change to 7 Bear Creek, but we've got one out here between here and Ingram 8 too, don't we? 9 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. You have one -- you do have 10 one, but I would suppose that that number that they would call 11 out of, whatever that number is, is so different -- there was 12 a debate a long time ago about the name changes, and had to do 13 with either the names or -- and we could have duplications. I 14 believe that we have some duplications in the county now with 15 a few names. So, this is totally in another geographical area 16 of the county, and should be able to be defined of where it's 17 at. But EMS and all would be coming out of Bandera anyway. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's got a separate geo-region 19 designation, so you can have a duplicate, even though we try 20 to limit them, but in this situation, their phones are under 21 Southwestern Bell system, and their -- their phones go 22 straight -- their 911 calls go straight into Bandera. 23 MR. ODOM: Bandera. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Pipe Creek. It's the Pipe 25 Creek/Castle Lake Fire, Pipe Creek/Bandera County EMS. 6-11-07 23 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, when we first started 2 this stuff, the -- there were five Bear Creeks in Kerr County, 3 Bear Creek Roads. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: And we're down to two, or about to be 5 down to two? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, no, there's still one 7 out at Hunt, the Boy Scout camp. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, scout ranch. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, we're down to three, but 10 they're in different geo-regions, and it works that way. 11 MR. ODOM: It works. It has worked very well. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval of the agenda 13 item. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: That being to set a public hearing -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: -- as indicated? Very well. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second -- we need a second? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I seconded. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I have a motion and a second 21 as indicated. Any further question or discussion on the 22 motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 23 right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6-11-07 24 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's move to 3 Item 5, if we might. Consider, discuss, and take appropriate 4 action for the revision of plat for Y.O. Ranchlands III, Lots 5 109, 110, 118, and 119 as set forth in Volume 6, Page 17, Plat 6 Records, and set a public hearing for the same. 7 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. This revision is being done 8 under the alternate plat process to combine four lots into 9 one, 109-R, 262.19 acres. We ask the Court to address two 10 issues today. And I just received this letter here dated 24 11 January '07 from Mr. Emerson. One is whether or not O.S.S.F. 12 needs to review or sign the final plat. Kerr County 13 Subdivision Rules state, the revised one, 6.03.C.5.c, 14 "Statement on O.S.S.F. required on all final plats." And in 15 the past, there's been discussion previously back in January 16 as to whether O.S.S.F. needs to review and/or sign a plat when 17 it combines lots. We ask the Court to clarify this for both 18 departments, O.S.S.F. and us, in such a way that we can add it 19 to our checklist when we're reviewing plat revisions. We -- 20 also, to set a public hearing for July the 23rd, 2007, at 21 9:50 a.m. 22 I would assume that -- Tish just gave this to Truby 23 back there, and reading it, what I surmise from this, not 24 being legal, is that basically Rex just -- and my memory was 25 that we said that this is not a subdivision. When we're 6-11-07 25 1 combining a lot, we're not creating a subdivision. And his 2 final paragraph here in summary basically says that, but I 3 wanted some clarification from the Court again. If this is 4 the procedure, then I shouldn't have any problem in the future 5 or any questions as to whether the O.S.S.F. needs to sign it 6 or not. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the issue is that, one, 8 either your department or O.S.S.F. needs to get this on the 9 next agenda and make a -- make a total determination. That 10 wasn't done previously, so we're doing them case-by-case right 11 now, and the way the agenda item is styled, I don't think we 12 can do more than a case-by-case today. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I would agree with you. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If this is on our -- if you put 15 it on our next agenda, we can make a policy change. 16 MR. ODOM: Good. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: As long as that's consistent 18 with that letter from -- 19 MR. ODOM: If we have consistency, then the 20 surveyors and engineers are -- we all know which page to go 21 with on this thing, and O.S.S.F. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Basically, what you're saying is the 23 term "subdivision" means making into two or more smaller 24 parts. 25 MR. ODOM: That's right. 6-11-07 26 1 JUDGE TINLEY: When you combine, you don't do that. 2 MR. ODOM: You don't do that. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: They don't fall under that 4 definition. 5 MR. ODOM: That's right. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Makes sense. 7 MR. ODOM: Now, the question would be, can I go 8 forward, then, to go ahead and set a public hearing? If 9 there's any changes, we would catch that before the final 10 anyway. Can we go ahead and set a public hearing for an 11 alternate plat process? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sure. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Sure, I don't see why not. 14 MR. ODOM: Okay. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: That's all you're asking for today on 16 the agenda item, anyway. 17 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir, set a public hearing for July 18 23rd, 2007, at 9:50 a.m. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So moved. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 22 indicated. Any question or discussion? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And one of the two departments 24 will get this on our next agenda? 25 MR. ODOM: Yes. 6-11-07 27 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or discussion? 3 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 4 hand. 5 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 7 (No response.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's move to 9 Item 6; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action for 10 revision of plat of Lots 2 through 11 of Privilege Creek 11 Ranches, as set forth in Volume 7, Pages 136 and 137, also 12 known as Boerne Falls Ranch, to include road name change from 13 Privilege Lane to Turkey Knob, and set a public hearing for 14 the same. 15 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. Before presenting the revision 16 of plat for Lots 2 through 11 of Privilege Creek Ranches, I 17 ask the developer and his legal representative to assure the 18 Court that they have legal egress and ingress to this property 19 through Kendall County, and in addition, I ask that the Kerr 20 County Attorney, Rex Emerson, confirm such findings. The 21 following is how the project has been presented to the Court, 22 and I have a summary of what -- where we're really at, and we 23 actually only have the Privilege Creek Ranch. As you see the 24 -- the outline that I presented, we have also received 25 documents under the name Boerne Falls, so let the record 6-11-07 28 1 reflect that all these names are for one project. The plat 2 before you today is for a revision of plat for Lots 2 through 3 11 of Privilege Creek Ranches, as recorded in Volume 7, Pages 4 136 through 137 of Kerr County Subdivision Records. Wayne 5 Wells has reviewed the construction drawings and drainage 6 study, and his notes and invoices are inclosed. The total 7 cost to Kerr County for engineering is $1,207.31, which is to 8 be reimbursed through the developer, in fact, to the County. 9 With this plat approval, the road name Privilege Lane will be 10 changed to Turkey Knob. With legal egress and ingress to this 11 development in place, I recommend that you approve the 12 revision of plat for Lots 2 through 11 of Privilege Creek 13 Ranches, as recorded in Volume 7, Pages 136 through 137, and 14 set a public hearing July the 23rd of 2007 at 10 a.m. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: So, what you're asking the Court to 16 take action on today is to set the public hearing? 17 MR. ODOM: That is correct, and to -- basically, 18 what we have told the developer before, and his legal counsel, 19 was to provide us certification that he had egress-ingress to 20 this before we proceeded with this plat. My understanding is 21 that they have that, but I -- I'm not legal. So, I just want 22 to be sure that we have egress-ingress and we can proceed 23 forward to this revision. I don't have a problem with the 24 revision of this plat. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who's going to speak to the 6-11-07 29 1 issue? 2 MR. EASON: I was, Your Honor. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: We have two participation forms that 4 have been filed. The first is Mr. Bob Eason, who is with the 5 Kendall County Attorney's office. Mr. Eason? 6 MR. EASON: Morning. Thank you for your time. I'm 7 here on behalf of the Kendall County Commissioners Court. As 8 this Court may know, Kendall County sought injunctive relief 9 on the developer in this case because he is using -- the only 10 access he has is using Kendall County roads, and we asked that 11 he be enjoined from using them to develop that piece of 12 property unless and until he complied with all Kendall County 13 rules and regulations having to do with subdivisions. He did 14 not do that, so a suit was filed asking for injunctive relief. 15 The Court granted Kendall County a temporary injunction. That 16 injunction is still in place. It's effective today. The 17 developer is not allowed to use Kendall County roads to 18 develop that property unless and until he complies with 19 Kendall County rules. And Kendall County rules that he needs 20 to comply with are to have a traffic impact study conducted, 21 file a plat with the county, and then have it considered by 22 the Commissioners Court. He has not done that. This 23 situation is currently set for trial on November the 5th. The 24 temporary injunction has been appealed, but no court has 25 overturned it, so it's still in effect. So, it's our -- what 6-11-07 30 1 we're trying do is tell you we're trying to clarify the access 2 issue. We're certainly not asking you -- or telling you to do 3 anything. Kendall County's not doing that. But he doesn't 4 have legal access at this time. Until it's overturned by a 5 court, or until he complies with Kendall County rules, he 6 won't have access. Thank you. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Who -- who are the parties to that 8 particular litigation? The people? 9 MR. EASON: Kendall County and BTEX Ranch, Limited. 10 And I think there may be some others, but I don't have the 11 names with me today. I think that Mr. Blume was originally on 12 it. He may have been dropped from the suit; I'm not sure. 13 Development company, mostly. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Kerr County obviously was not a party 15 to that. 16 MR. EASON: Absolutely not. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Any questions for Mr. Eason by any 18 member of the Court? Thank you, sir. We appreciate it. 19 MR. EASON: Thank you. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: We have another participation form 21 from Mr. David Jackson. 22 MR. JACKSON: David Jackson, 820 Main, on behalf of 23 the applicant. The clarification with respect to the 24 injunction, although I'm not involved in the litigation, is 25 that there is no injunction for access. There's nothing in 6-11-07 31 1 the order that denies access to this property. As I 2 understand, Kerr County's concern is, does this property have 3 access? Whether or not there are issues of development that 4 need to be complied with, perhaps, is yet to be determined, 5 but that's an issue for the developer, the trial counsel for 6 the developer, and Kendall County to work out with the judge 7 and/or the appellate court. What we did here, if you'll 8 remember the process, is this Court said that it would proceed 9 so long as Kerr County rules were complied with, and we 10 delayed coming back to the Court to accomplish two things. 11 First, we're only revising the existing plat. That's what -- 12 a plat that you approved a long time ago. There was access 13 then. There's access now. 14 Second, we made sure that the County Attorney's 15 office was satisfied. Mr. Mosty and I met with Mr. Emerson, 16 and he is comfortable with the fact that there is access. I 17 certainly concede to counsel that there are issues of 18 development and compliance with Kendall County, but as you 19 might guess, there are always going to be issues when there is 20 a development that is totally located in Kerr using roads in 21 Kendall, and that's just something we're going to have to work 22 out. But that does not prevent this Court or this County from 23 complying with the rules. Unless Ilse has something else to 24 add to that, I think that -- that was our understanding. I 25 wouldn't have come back to you had we not had that assurance 6-11-07 32 1 from the County Attorney. 2 MS. BAILEY: My understanding is that what he's 3 saying about Rex's position is correct. 4 MR. JACKSON: And we're certainly here to answer any 5 questions. The debate will go on. It's a fair and honest 6 debate, but for now, to allow us to move a couple of lot lines 7 and to change the name of a road isn't in the lawsuit in any 8 way, shape, or form. 9 MR. EASON: Would it help the Court to have a 10 certified copy of the injunction? 11 MS. BAILEY: There's a copy in our materials. 12 MR. JACKSON: I think the Court -- the County 13 Attorney has all that information. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think that -- 15 JUDGE TINLEY: There's a copy in the materials 16 provided to the Court also. 17 MR. EASON: Okay. 18 MR. JACKSON: Thank you. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: I think the issue today is setting a 20 public hearing. That's all that Mr. Odom is requesting. And 21 he's requesting that there be a public hearing on this matter 22 for July the 23rd, 2007, at 10 a.m. Is that correct, 23 Mr. Odom? 24 MR. ODOM: That is correct, sir. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I so move, Judge. 6-11-07 33 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want to second it, but I 2 want to be real clear. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I have a motion and second for 4 approval of the public hearing scheduled as indicated. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Public hearing on revision of 6 plat. That's all we're doing? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I'll third it, then. 9 I'm ready to go. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and second as 11 indicated for the setting of a public hearing for the -- 12 MR. ODOM: Excuse me. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: -- revision of a plat for July the 14 23rd, 2007, at 10 a.m. Any further question or discussion on 15 that motion? 16 MR. ODOM: We want to -- basically, not only the 17 revision, but this is a preliminary; to approve this 18 preliminary of this revision. So, in other words, we're 19 changing this from Lots 2 through 11 to this -- to this 20 revision, so it is really a preliminary. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask you a question. 22 Leonard, when we have the public hearing on the 23rd at 23 10 a.m., will that public hearing be followed by action from 24 the Court? 25 MR. ODOM: That's right. 6-11-07 34 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, in my mind, there's 2 plenty of time at the public hearing and the action taken by 3 the Court for the debate, whether we don't like Kendall County 4 or they don't like us or whatever the issue is. 5 MR. ODOM: The issue is just the revision of this 6 plat, and -- and that's all it is. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, ingress-egress. 8 MR. ODOM: That's right. The issue is 9 egress-ingress, and one says no and one says yes. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let me restructure the 11 motion, Judge. I would move that preliminary revision of plat 12 for Lots 2 to 11 of Privilege Creek Ranches, Volume 7, Page 13 136-'37 of Kerr County Land Records, to include the road name 14 change from Privilege Lane to Turkey Knob, and set a public 15 hearing for same on July 23, 2007, at 10 a.m. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and second as 18 indicated and stated in the record. Any further question or 19 discussion on that motion? All in favor of that motion, 20 signify by raising your right hand. 21 (Commissioners Baldwin, Williams, and Oehler voted in favor of the motion.) 22 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Abstain. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Let the record reflect that 6-11-07 35 1 Commissioner Letz abstained, neither participating in the 2 discussion or the vote. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Coward. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's move on to Item 7, if we 5 might. Consider, discuss, and take appropriate action of 6 proposed site plan for Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center, as 7 presented at our last meeting, and authorize Commissioners 8 Oehler and Letz to proceed with planning. Which one of you 9 guys wants to take off? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, I put this on the agenda 11 for the main reason that Commissioner Baldwin was absent at 12 the last meeting when we talked about this a little bit, and I 13 wanted to make sure that he was comfortable with the direction 14 we were going, and also to clarify a point about -- at the 15 last meeting I said that we had put $50,000 in a fund for 16 moving the outdoor arena. During the budget process, that was 17 reduced to 25,000. And -- but the idea would be to instruct 18 the Auditor to, I guess, designate work at the remodeling of 19 the pole barn or substitute that in for moving the arena this 20 year. They're both -- it was listed in capital improvements, 21 so it's just listed under -- listed as an item under the 22 capital improvement. Doesn't require a budget amendment, just 23 a matter of direction from the Court. That was after a 24 discussion I had with the Auditor. 25 But, as the diagram shows -- I'll go over it briefly 6-11-07 36 1 again. The plan is that the barn -- the pole barn with the 2 horse stalls will be renovated, horse stalls moved out. About 3 half to two-thirds of that building will be used for 4-H 4 projects. So, we'll have a concrete slab. Sides will be put 5 on the building, and pens will be put in. Then the other 6 third or so of the building will be used for storage for the 7 Fair Association, the 216th work crew, community service 8 group, and also for the County. And the idea is to kind of 9 get this started. The next phase of the project will be to 10 relocate -- actually build a new outdoor arena, which will be 11 located as shown on the attached plat, kind of to the east 12 side of the property, and then the old arena would be torn 13 down -- or old outdoor arena will be torn down. And then the 14 final portion would be a new barn built on the east side of 15 the arena, approximately 150 feet by 300 feet in size, and 16 after that is built, then the hog barn portion will be torn 17 down. And then the area -- that new area will allow for 18 parking on both sides of the building; probably allow for a 19 little bit more -- better traffic pattern. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I read the minutes from New 21 Zealand; you guys are famous. But to make sure that I 22 understood something that Bruce was talking about, the horse 23 stalls that are out there now, you want -- you're going to 24 move them up under that back part of -- where the present 25 arena -- indoor arena is? 6-11-07 37 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Part of it. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Side part. Side. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Only -- on the east side, 4 that's the covered part, next to the indoor arena. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Move a -- maybe 20 or 25. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Which is what we can -- will 9 have a use for most of the time. That way they're able to be 10 supervised, and also controlled, so that we actually get 11 income off of those, rather than just have people come put 12 animals in there and leave and come back and get them and 13 don't pay. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree 100 percent. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Which we've had some of that. 16 The rest of them, for the time being, will be removed from the 17 existing barn and just stored until we can do something else 18 with them, and maybe outside in the future, maybe under a 19 smaller pole-type barn, if we choose to do that later. But 20 for the time being, get them out of there so that we can start 21 working on making that a -- basically, a -- a project barn for 22 4-H and F.F.A. And they're going to -- my understanding is 23 they're going to raise a good part of the money to do a lot of 24 that renovation. The County's not going to pay for that whole 25 thing. We just -- you know, we're kind of getting things 6-11-07 38 1 started, and they're supposed to come in and -- and finish out 2 with other money, other than county money, this area for the 3 projects. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're talking about the 5 Fair Association? 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Talking about -- talking about 7 Extension Office, 4-H, F.F.A. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- yeah. The -- the 9 idea is, I think the County's going to do the -- kind of the 10 basic work, and then the finish-out of the whole thing, I 11 think the Fair Association is going to pay for their part, 12 216th will pay for their part, and the 4-H projects, through 13 donations, is going to build the pens and all that. I think 14 our obligation is going to be probably to put the concrete 15 slab in, and maybe some of the side work. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: May be a joint effort between 17 the County and -- and whoever they can get to donate some 18 money for that slab. The slab's going to be expensive. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- you know, and on the slab 20 issue, that's where I would see, you know, we would put the 21 25,000 towards that. And, you know, I would be in favor of 22 finding some additional funds in our budget, and I will 23 probably go to some of the -- be an increase in the budget, 24 but using some of the funds that we received from our 25 insurance settlement; designate, you know, maybe 50,000 of 6-11-07 39 1 that, something like that, to get this slab going. And also 2 as a -- you know, to start moving forward on it. I think a 3 lot of the work on the side of the building can probably be 4 done in-house or through -- you know, as we get people -- 5 either trustees or community service people that are qualified 6 welders to do a lot of that work. I mean, the structure, 7 'cause there's -- by putting some sides on, structure work. 8 We're talking about putting some purline welds up -- some 9 purlines up and put some pens up, which is not rocket science. 10 And I think -- so I think that can be done. 11 But -- and the other thing, I mean, we need to look 12 at, and not necessarily -- kind of just the next step, if 13 everyone is in agreement on where we're going, how we're going 14 to do this. If we're getting into these types of projects, we 15 have to -- you know, I'm not sure of the engineering 16 requirements we need to get and how we need to do things. 17 This is a piecemeal-type project. It's not something that 18 we're going to go out for one bid on. And it seems to me that 19 it may be appropriate to get on the next agenda, if everyone's 20 supportive, of getting -- hiring a construction manager or 21 someone that can oversee the work that's paid as we do things 22 on more of an hourly -- whatever the rate would be. I think, 23 under the law, we're allowed to do that. I think a lot of, 24 you know, projects and renovation-type projects are done this 25 way now, and I think we -- we have to go out for proposal for 6-11-07 40 1 that, but I think it makes a lot more sense. Certainly, we 2 don't want to hire an architectural firm to do this. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, you're not talking about 4 hiring a planner or somebody up front to put this thing 5 together? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You got the planners. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Yeah, and that was 8 another one of my questions. And I think it would be wise to 9 have somebody like that in the -- in the construction part of 10 it. The -- are y'all including the stock show people in these 11 plans? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think they're aware of it. I 13 have not visited with them. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think that's smart. You 15 need to -- need to build what the County wants to build, and 16 just don't confuse things this time, like -- like happened 17 last time. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree. I think we keep it. 19 My idea is, this is the plan now. If people have an 20 opinion -- it's been publicized; there was an article in the 21 paper about it. If people have an opinion one way or the 22 other, it's -- they should come to the Court and visit. I 23 mean, it's been two weeks -- two sessions in a row I've had it 24 on the agenda. That was also to see if there was strong 25 comments one way or the other. I mean, I don't know if it's 6-11-07 41 1 lack of interest or agreement, but certainly, there's no -- I 2 don't see a lot of opposition. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, as part of this plan, 4 too, Buster, and the rest of the Court, when we talk about 5 building a new outdoor arena, that's an awfully large number 6 there. That's not necessary, but it is -- I guess if we had 7 to hire somebody to do it all and pay for all the materials 8 costs -- I have some qualified, experienced people that are 9 willing to volunteer to do the labor part of it on building 10 the new arena. And, basically, the County or whoever -- 11 basically, the County will just have to buy the materials, 12 which will be very, very -- almost nominal compared to this 13 number. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, I agree. These are -- 15 these are if we were to hire someone to do it. All these 16 numbers are. And I think, except for the new barn, I don't 17 think that's the intent, really, is to go out and hire -- I 18 just want to give an idea of what we're talking about. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The new barn is going to be 20 the most expensive part of the whole thing. Other things are 21 going to be marginal. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is this outdoor arena -- 23 bucking chutes? 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Not that kind of -- roping 6-11-07 42 1 box? 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 4-H arena. Roping, return 3 alley, and lights. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And stands -- bleachers, and 6 possibly a concession stand under one end of that pole barn 7 that's existing now. But, no. No, if they need to buck 8 livestock, they can use the indoor arena. That is expensive. 9 It is -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's a lot of maintenance. 12 It's heck to keep it up around it with all the weed control 13 and everything else, like we have with the existing one, which 14 is rarely used. And, no, that is not part of my plan, and I 15 have not made that a part of the plan. That -- the 4-H Horse 16 Club that has that has that facility under their control at 17 this time. But that's -- I don't care if this thing takes 18 five years to do it. It just doesn't matter. We've got to 19 start somewhere, and I think at some point we do need to -- we 20 will have to have an exact plan of that big building, because 21 that is going to have to be bid, and there will be multiple 22 parts of that bid, mainly being the slab work and the building 23 itself, and construction of it or -- or fabrication of it. 24 So, those -- that kind of a thing would need to be done, and 25 also for -- the most important reason, in my mind, is to be 6-11-07 43 1 able to try to acquire grant funding for that building, and 2 some of these other projects as well. I do not want to spend 3 any more county money or public money than absolutely 4 necessary to do this. I think that the public will support 5 it, and I think we can -- we can -- if we get a good plan and 6 go to some of the foundations, I believe we can get funding 7 for it. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Without having to spend tax 10 money. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with you. What is 12 the -- what is the limit now for bidding? 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 25,000. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 25. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 25,000. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And this is where -- I really 17 think, you know, I'd like to have the County Attorney's office 18 come back at our next meeting, and after having seen the plan, 19 keep us out of trouble. You know, we want to -- how you 20 interpret a lot of this, and how much volunteer work, how we 21 work with the volunteers, if that has to be engineered or 22 anything, if we have to have a stamp on it, how -- what we 23 have to do to do what we want to do. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think the idea of a 25 construction manager is a good idea, and might help guide us 6-11-07 44 1 in that, because every one of these items is in excess of the 2 bidding ceiling set by the state. And even though you're 3 going to integrate volunteers to do some, and that's all well 4 and good, total cost of it and incremental costs of it, 5 there's some danger there if we're not careful. So, I think a 6 construction manager is a good idea to help guide us through 7 that in accordance with state law. I do have a question with 8 respect to demolition. You got 100,000 estimated for 9 demolition. That -- that is for the removal of the existing 10 pens behind the exhibit hall; is that correct? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And the building. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And the building -- the back 13 part of the building, not the exhibit hall. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, the back part of the 15 building. Would that include any potential remediation for 16 soil, that contaminated soil back there? Or have we thought 17 about that? 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't know how much 19 contamination that's going to have. That will wind up being a 20 parking lot. I mean, what you basically have back there is 21 manure, hay and stuff that's been gathering for years. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't -- I mean, it's not -- 23 it's a bad situation to put livestock on it, 'cause it 24 keeps -- it's more to keep bacteria and things of that sort 25 from growing in the soil. These pens aren't used that much. 6-11-07 45 1 I doubt they're -- I mean, I think the contamination that 2 would be there would be urine and -- and other. I think it's 3 probably taken care of by bacteria almost naturally, you know. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I wouldn't know what -- 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't know. I'm not an 7 expert in the field. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not either, but I'd -- I 9 would be surprised if there's a huge -- 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Exposing that to daylight 11 again would do a world of good. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think Bill's right, though. 13 I think -- I think you probably need to at least have it 14 tested. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mm-hmm. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And if you look, right next 17 door is Texas A & M, actually on the same piece of property. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We built the building. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We built the building. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What a novel approach. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: See, that's part of their 22 planning, and I appreciate you guys building a building right 23 next to A and M that can do the good soil testing. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, great idea. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All works out, sounds like. 6-11-07 46 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Another freebie. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But if -- if everyone's in 3 agreement, we can probably put it on our next agenda to do 4 some of the -- I'll visit with the County Attorney's office 5 about the construction manager issue. And then also, Bruce 6 and I will visit a little bit more about -- and maybe get with 7 Roy and the Fair Association about doing something to get this 8 rolling, at least on the pole barn. I think Bruce already 9 talked to Maintenance about getting the horse stalls moved, 10 which is step one, and then see what we -- get a plan on that, 11 at the same time we're talking to the County Attorney's 12 office, and put it back on the next agenda. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else to be offered in 14 connection with that item? 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't have anything. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: In deference to some folks that -- 17 that wish to be heard, I'm going to take an item out of order. 18 We'll move to Item 13; consider, discuss, and take appropriate 19 action to authorize drafting of a leash law requirement for 20 persons bringing dogs to Flat Rock Lake Park. Commissioner 21 Williams. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. Thank you, Judge. 23 I placed this on the agenda for the Court to think about and 24 talk about, because over the last year or so, since we have 25 sort of ignored what's taken place out there, I've had several 6-11-07 47 1 complaints, the most recent being a person who sought me out 2 at the conclusion of church service a week ago to tell me that 3 their animal had been attacked and nearly killed, and had to 4 be taken to the veterinarian to save that animal's life. So, 5 think about it. I also read where, basically -- and I want 6 the County Attorney to weigh in on this -- that the state law 7 does require it. And if state law requires that, then our 8 policy with respect to the use of that park should reflect 9 what the state law requires. So, I haven't proposed the 10 language of the law. I can certainly defer to the County 11 Attorney's office, and we can get some models and some samples 12 and so forth. But if state law requires it, we ought to 13 comport to that law. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a couple of participation 15 forms on this particular agenda item, and I'd like to give 16 those folks an opportunity to be heard. The first one we have 17 is from Mr. Robert Palmer. Mr. Palmer? If you'll come 18 forward and give us your address and tell us what's on your 19 mind concerning this item. 20 MR. PALMER: Thank you. My name is Robert Palmer. 21 I live at 410 Josephine. First of all, last time I was here, 22 I requested a sign for Flat Rock Park, because there was no 23 sign. And there is one now, and I wanted to make sure I 24 thanked y'all for putting one up. And, so, I represent a 25 group of people -- you see about four of them here on my 6-11-07 48 1 right -- and all of us walk with our dogs off-leash at the 2 park, and our dogs all get along. And, in fact, I know these 3 people; some of them, I don't know their names, but I know 4 their dogs. 5 MR. KELLY: Dogs' names, too. 6 MR. PALMER: But, anyway, I wanted to request that 7 you think seriously about this matter, because this is the one 8 place in Kerr County where dogs have been accepted, have been 9 allowed to go off-leash, and I've been there for over two 10 years, walking my dogs almost every morning around 7:00 to 11 8 o'clock, and most of these people also, and also sometimes 12 in the afternoon. And the problems have not been with the 13 dogs, when there have been any problems. The dogs -- the 14 problems have been with -- mostly with dog owners. I have not 15 seen any real dog fights. I've not seen any dogs get hurt. 16 I've seen a lot of happy dogs, a lot of social dogs. And so 17 what I'm actually going to propose is a compromise. Right 18 now, it's pretty well accepted by everyone in the legal 19 profession in town -- I mean by that the police, the Sheriff's 20 Department, Animal Control -- that this is an area which has 21 been allowed for people to have their dogs off-leash. So, I 22 am proposing that the dogs be allowed to go leash-free from 23 around 7:00 in the morning until noon, and then in the 24 afternoon, those people who have their dogs on-leash and are 25 concerned about dogs running free, those people could bring 6-11-07 49 1 their dogs in the afternoon, after noon. And this is almost 2 happening now, 'cause I've been there in the morning and the 3 afternoon. So, I wanted to ask y'all if this kind of 4 compromise could be made at Flat Rock Park, what your -- what 5 y'all's comments on it might be. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mr. Palmer, the law says 7 there's a leash law, that you must have your animal on a 8 leash. 9 MR. PALMER: Unless -- unless you designate an area 10 as a -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Right. 12 MR. PALMER: -- dog park. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did we do that? 14 MR. PALMER: No, it hasn't been -- it's been 15 accepted. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, you have been going out 17 there leash -- leashless and breaking the law this whole time? 18 MR. PALMER: I -- well -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm serious. I can't figure 20 out what you're talking about. 21 MR. KELLY: You're going to have a busload. 22 MR. PALMER: Well, yes and no. You might have seen 23 on the front page in the newspaper my dog, Boomer, a black 24 lab, is a sightseeing dog for a husky -- a blind husky, and so 25 that dog has been on-leash all the time. And I have another 6-11-07 50 1 dog that's been off-leash, but -- so the answer is yes and no. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: God. 3 MR. PALMER: In other words, if you have a leash 4 law, you don't see who's on which end of the leash, right? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I remember when you 6 first came in, we were talking about a dog park like they do 7 -- have in other places, and we said no to a dog park. 8 MR. PALMER: I don't -- I don't believe there was 9 any official request for the dog park. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I remember it. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Your signage proposal was 13 that we put up signs -- 14 MR. PALMER: Right. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- indicating that as a 16 dog-friendly park. And the Court did not go along with that 17 idea, nor did it designate Flat Rock Lake Park as a -- as a -- 18 whatever you call it; the dog can run free and -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Leashless. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Leashless or whatever. We 21 haven't done that. And we've had a year of experience now 22 since -- since you made your appearance, a little over a year 23 of experience since you made your appearance. And I don't 24 know about the other Commissioners, but I have been contacted 25 several times about the aggressive behavior of animals jumping 6-11-07 51 1 on people, just running and jumping on people that are not -- 2 not their owners, folks who let their dogs run free, not 3 cleaning up after their dogs, and most recently, an owner of 4 an animal -- animal was attacked; a small dachshund dog was 5 attacked and almost killed, and the owners of them then 6 grabbed the dog up after it was all over with and walked down 7 on Riverside Drive home, just totally oblivious to what took 8 place. Didn't try to stop it or anything else. That's the 9 reason why this is on the agenda. 10 MR. PALMER: Okay. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My recollection was that at the 12 time, that the law says something about being under your 13 control or, you know, something along that line. And it was 14 decided that, you know, if -- if the dogs are under your -- 15 under control, may not be under a leash. Am I dreaming that 16 that was part of that conversation? 17 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think so. I think that 18 there's some language in the statute -- 19 MR. PALMER: Right. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: -- in various so-called "leash law" 21 ordinances or orders that -- that deal with that. I'm not 22 sure the state law that we're talking about, but I -- I 23 suspect that as the County Attorney looks into this, they're 24 going to come back and tell us what our options are. If there 25 are any interpretation nuances or other definitions that 6-11-07 52 1 control -- or under leash or under control, why, we'll get 2 that information presented to us. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And that's really all I'm 4 asking the Court today, is to authorize the research and a 5 drafting of a leash law, and bring it back to the Court. 6 Let's talk about it. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mr. Palmer, what was your 8 proposal, this time frame thing during the day? 9 MR. PALMER: It was -- it's a compromise, and that 10 those people who want to have their dogs on-leash and are 11 concerned about other dogs being off-leash, is that they be -- 12 have their time after noon till the evening to have their dogs 13 on -- on-leash. And those people who prefer to have the dogs 14 off-leash and socially mixing with each other have the morning 15 from 7:00 until noon. And that way, you make both parties 16 happy for the most part, because these people here have some 17 great dogs, and we need an area here. And one other thing 18 that has not been brought up, by our being there in the 19 mornings and through the day, this park has become a safer 20 park, because there are less people who are vagrant or -- or, 21 you know, would seek out -- well, anyway, have evil intent. 22 They're the ones who want secrecy. And -- but we have been 23 there, and most of us are responsible. We help pick up in the 24 park. Right now, there aren't enough barrels there, and 25 there's garbage. People come down there and drop off their 6-11-07 53 1 garbage at that park, and so there's a bigger problem with 2 that, and people coming in and messing up the property. 3 That's a bigger problem than us having our dogs off-leash, but 4 that doesn't seem to be addressed, or get addressed. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else, Mr. Palmer? 6 MR. PALMER: No. I just hope we can -- that we 7 don't give up this one area in town where most of us who are 8 responsible can -- can take our dogs and have them mix 9 socially, because for the most part, it -- there's always 10 going to be a few situations, no matter what, in that park, 11 whether it's on-leash or off-leash, where you have dogs -- you 12 know, a dog problem. They were there before we came, and they 13 will be. But, for the most part, it is really a fine park. 14 It's a beautiful park, and we help make it that. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Unfortunately, that's always 16 the case, Mr. Palmer. When you have a privilege, there are -- 17 the privilege has been extended, the abuses by someone who 18 doesn't care and that messes it up for rest of the people. It 19 was a dog that got bitten and injured this time. It could be 20 a human that gets bitten and injured the next time. 21 MR. PALMER: Well, that may happen even if you 22 have -- if have you dogs on-leash. There are stray dogs that 23 come into the park. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I understand. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The part of the park that 6-11-07 54 1 y'all -- you use the west side of Third Creek or the east side 2 of Third Creek? 3 MR. KELLY: West. 4 MR. PALMER: West side. We -- 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The big section. 6 MR. PALMER: Until they complete that bridge. 7 Whenever they do that, we'll probably just use that oval, and 8 walk our dogs on it. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Another option may be to make it 10 more the less-used, which is the east side, in the mornings to 11 be allowed -- and there's access; you can get there right now 12 by going up, I think, by the Swap Shop. But, anyway, that's 13 another thing we can look at at our next meeting. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Mr. Palmer. We appreciate 15 it. We also have a participation form that was filed by 16 Morgan Kelly. 17 MR. KELLY: Sir, my name is Morgan Kelly, and I live 18 at 108 Mesa Del Sol here in Kerrville. I can tell by looking 19 at your faces who's definitely against this program and who 20 may be inclined to be a little more lenient. However, what am 21 I doing here in Kerrville? I came from up in the Kansas City 22 area on the Kansas side, but -- to Kerrville. But before 23 that, I was living in San Antonio, and I was selling Mooney 24 airplanes, and that's how I discovered Kerrville, because I'd 25 bring my prospects up here and take them through the plant. I 6-11-07 55 1 came up so often that they didn't even bother sending one of 2 the employees to lead us through the factory and everything. 3 They said, "You've been here long enough; you know the drill, 4 so go do it yourself." And that made me feel very warm toward 5 Kerrville, and here I am for the last 17, going on 18 years. 6 Now, when I was in Kansas City, there was a beautiful big park 7 there, much -- much larger than the one we're discussing, and 8 they -- they made it a dog-free area until they finished 9 another area that was designed especially for people with 10 dogs, and it worked out very, very well. And that's what we'd 11 ask you to do here. However, because this -- you see the five 12 of us here, and six, really; this man's wife's outside. We 13 didn't know about it until 7 o'clock this morning, when we 14 read the newspaper, and we would like to have an opportunity 15 to come back to the Commissioners Court and present our side 16 of the story and see what can be done. Therefore, I would ask 17 to you shelve this item until another time and give us a 18 little more time to come and present this in a -- in a formal 19 fashion. That's my point, and I thank you. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Excellent point. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Kelly, the matter to be 22 considered today is just to merely ask the County Attorney to 23 look into it to see what we're required to do under the law. 24 We're not in a position to take any action, to adopt any rules 25 one way or the other. 6-11-07 56 1 MR. KELLY: Okay. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay? 3 MR. KELLY: Even if you set a section of the park 4 aside. But I was -- you know, for people with dogs off-leash. 5 But this gentleman's idea -- really, I'm sharing it with him, 6 because he didn't -- we haven't talked about it, but I would 7 -- I would like to see a time schedule there, and -- and the 8 Court could say this section is dog leash -- off-leash area at 9 certain times, and it should be acceptable. Thank you. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't know that it 12 requires court action, Judge. The County Attorney's here. We 13 can look into it and bring it back, and the Court can weigh in 14 on it at that time. 15 MS. BAILEY: Would you like -- 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Only thing I'd like to offer 17 on what you said is that I'm -- of course, everybody knows I'm 18 a dog person. My dog is never on a leash unless it's totally 19 required, because he's under my control. If he's not, he 20 wished he had been. And, you know, I do -- I do believe that 21 dogs should have a place to run free, as long as they're under 22 control of their owners. It's pretty hard to throw a stick or 23 throw a ball and have them go fetch it on a leash. You know, 24 that -- that doesn't work very well. Or throw a dummy out 25 into the water and ask them to go swimming and drag a leash 6-11-07 57 1 along with them, those kind of things. But I know this is a 2 public area, and it may be different as opposed to some 3 private areas. But I am sympathetic toward this situation, 4 and I do -- I'm a -- I understand the problem, and really need 5 to see what the law comes up with when it all comes down to 6 the end. But -- 7 MS. BAILEY: Do you want our office do the agenda -- 8 the request item, or do one of y'all -- 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's that? 10 MS. BAILEY: Do you want our office to prepare the 11 agenda request item for the next meeting, or is that going to 12 come from the Court? 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'll get with you and Rex. 14 MS. BAILEY: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, I believe Mr. Miller also 16 had a comment. 17 MR. MILLER: Good morning. I'm a dog lover. I am. 18 But let me just give you one other aspect -- 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Give your name and address. 20 MR. MILLER: My name's Bob Miller, Texas Arts and 21 Crafts Fair Association, and I run River Star Arts and Events, 22 which is next door to Flat Rock Lake Park. We've had a 23 problem recently with the dogs not on a leash running through 24 the park, especially early in the morning after we've had an 25 event on the weekend, and getting in the trash, spreading it 6-11-07 58 1 all over the place. And one of my problems is -- I have no 2 problem with having dogs unleashed, but there needs to be a 3 fenced, controlled area for that to happen, you know, because 4 we -- you've got lots of businesses and homes adjacent to that 5 park that are not a part of -- don't want to be a part of -- 6 of the dogs running loose. But I think if a dog park is, as 7 such, designated for a park and fenced and set up, it will be 8 wonderful. I'd even take my dog out there. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. Any member of the 10 Court have anything further to offer in connection with this? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move on to Item 8; consider, 13 discuss, and take appropriate action authorizing John 14 Trolinger, our I.T. Manager, to work with Commissioners Letz 15 and Oehler to develop a computerized bookkeeping system. 16 (Commissioner Baldwin left the courtroom.) 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I put this on the agenda really 18 as much just to make sure that Mr. Trolinger understood the 19 importance of the Court to get this done. And Ms. Hyde and 20 Mr. Oehler have done a lot of work on this, and I just 21 really -- I'll make a motion that we make this authorization. 22 I think Commissioner Oehler and myself and Ms. Hyde will 23 continue to work out the plan along with Alyce, and get a 24 system developed where we have the bookings realtime online 25 for those that need access to it. 6-11-07 59 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll second the motion, but I 2 think we also need to include at the next meeting, we'll come 3 with a recommendation to the Court for what the charges and -- 4 and the form to be presented, and the charges need to be 5 agreed upon -- needs to be by the Court. This is going to be 6 the new policy, basically, and the fees for each thing used in 7 that facility. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, I agree. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Everything we do now is 10 manually? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: But Ms. Hyde has already done 14 most of this work. And when we get Mr. Trolinger to 15 incorporate that into our computer so that it can be -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Accessed realtime. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- accessed. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good idea. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Anyway -- 20 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and second? 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'll second it. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He seconded. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or discussion on 24 the motion? All in favor of that motion, signify by raising 25 your right hand. 6-11-07 60 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll move 5 to Item 9; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 6 add link to the -- the Hill Country Veterans Council on the 7 Kerr County website home page. Commissioner Letz. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I received an e-mail a while 9 back, and I -- originally, I had copies of the e-mails 10 attached, and Ms. Hyde had some reaction to that, because her 11 personal e-mail was on that -- home address was on that list, 12 so I decided it's probably not appropriate to put that on 13 here, so that's why there's no backup. But the idea is, one 14 of the -- Gene Higgins, one of the original members of the 15 Veterans Council, contacted me and asked that we put a link on 16 our website to theirs. And I'm not even sure it really took 17 court action, but I said I'd be glad to take care of it. 18 Ms. Hyde, do you have anything to add? 19 (Commissioner Baldwin returned to the courtroom.) 20 MS. HYDE: When I talked with them -- because a lot 21 of folks are going to whine if we allow a certain link to be 22 put on the website. A lot of people are going to want their 23 links to be put on. So, what I suggested would be that, over 24 on the website, that you have a "Special Groups" or "Special 25 Help" for Kerr County, so that if people are new to the area 6-11-07 61 1 or if they're looking for things, they could hit that one link 2 and it'll show, you know, whether it be the Extension Office, 3 Hill Country Veterans, and that way we're not, you know, 4 trying to pick or choose who's on the front page. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's also a matter of, if you 6 leave it up to -- have to come to the Court to close it down a 7 little bit, it makes it harder to get on, which is probably a 8 good thing. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Does the Hill Country 10 Veterans Council have a website? 11 MS. HYDE: Yes. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 13 MS. BAILEY: I just wanted to sort of reiterate what 14 Commissioner Letz said, and if we have some link that links to 15 separate organizations, it would be nice to have some kind of 16 disclaimer that the County takes no responsibility or is not 17 charged with anything that those sites say or anything they 18 link to, because you don't want us to be tangentially linked 19 to something that could end up being inappropriate. Not that 20 any of these would be, but I think it -- just to protect us, 21 it would be better to do it that way. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Just say that Kerr County assumes no 23 responsibility for any of the information as may be contained 24 on any of the links to the -- 25 MS. BAILEY: Exactly. 6-11-07 62 1 JUDGE TINLEY: -- to the special organizations' 2 websites. 3 MS. BAILEY: Right. We do that through a separate 4 link, like Commissioner Letz suggested. I think that would 5 make it clean. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. But if -- I'll make a 7 motion to add a link to the Hill Country Veterans Council on 8 the Kerr County website according to, I guess, the policy that 9 was discussed, and get with Ms. Hyde and we can get Mr. 10 Trolinger, when we talk about the Ag Barn, and make sure this 11 is done properly. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 14 indicated. Any question or discussion on that motion? All in 15 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll move 20 to Item 10; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action 21 concerning monthly reports from constables. Commissioner 22 Letz? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I put this on the agenda 24 primarily because I think there's a court order that's 25 attached that says a constable is supposed to give us monthly 6-11-07 63 1 reports. And my memory was saying that it didn't seem like 2 more than one constable, who happens to be the one constable 3 present today, the only one doing that on a regular basis. 4 And I asked the County Clerk's office to check to see if my 5 memory was correct, and it was. Majority of our constables 6 are not giving us monthly reports. We do have a court order 7 saying that, and I just wanted to reiterate that that court 8 order is in place, and this Commissioner is going to look at 9 it during budget time if they don't comply. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good point. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Really no other action at this 12 time, but just a matter of -- to reiterate that there was a 13 court order in place that -- that I think we expect monthly 14 reports. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'd point out that is 16 Constable 1, which is probably the best precinct in the 17 county. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I've heard this before. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You heard this story before? 20 He not only turns in his report monthly, but he does it at the 21 same time of the month. The other guys sometimes give -- get 22 off -- 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Are you saying that maybe he 24 should train the other three? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just -- just saying that 6-11-07 64 1 he's a great leader, and if the other three were really good 2 employees or elected officials, that they would fall in line 3 behind all people that are elected in Precinct 1. And -- 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I was with you for a while, but 5 you lost me at the end there. (Laughter.) 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Drifted off there. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Going too far, now. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I keep trying. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do we try to encourage the 10 reports to be at a certain time? Like, in time for the second 11 meeting of the month? Or have we ever made that designation? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We've never made -- the court 13 order that we previously passed did not make that designation, 14 and we could do that today. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Maybe that -- maybe we need 16 to do that. And, you know, I agree with you; that needs to be 17 done. We've said it needs to be done. Why don't we say it 18 has to be in time for placement on the agenda for the second 19 meeting -- Commissioners Court meeting of any given month? 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that a motion? 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I make that as a motion. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll second. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and second as 24 indicated. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that -- 6-11-07 65 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or discussion? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I was going to make a statement, 3 but it's not part of the agenda item, so it doesn't make any 4 difference. I was going to ask about J.P.'s. Do we want to 5 get them on more -- a different schedule? I think we get 6 pretty regular reports from them. Anyway, that's not part of 7 the agenda, so -- 8 JUDGE TINLEY: They're required to file reports with 9 the state. We get copies of those. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Maybe we can just suggest to 11 them privately that this is -- this involves them as well. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We certainly get the report 13 from J.P. 1. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And 3. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm just telling you. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And 2. J.P. 2 is very good. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And 4. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. How about the motion? Any 19 further question or discussion on the motion? All in favor of 20 the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What was that? To have the 6-11-07 66 1 report in by the second meeting of the month? 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: In time for the second 3 meeting, yes, sir. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll now move to Item 12 -- excuse 5 me, Item 11; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 6 designate a new registered agent for the Kerr County Housing 7 Finance Corporation. I put this on the agenda. It was called 8 to my attention, we had some information come in on some 9 reports that needed to be filed. I referred it to the County 10 Attorney. The County Attorney, in turn, communicated back to 11 me that he thought it would be appropriate that we designate a 12 new registered agent, inasmuch as the current registered agent 13 on file with the Secretary of State for that nonprofit is 14 Robert Denson, and thought it would be well if we designated a 15 new registered agent. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think it would be wise. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Question, Judge. As you 18 pointed out by noting that the agent was Judge Denson, that 19 goes back many years, and I'm wondering whether or not there 20 was a necessity for us even to be involved in that, given that 21 through AACOG, they're -- we participate in a financing 22 corporation -- housing financing corporation which they have 23 set up for all of the counties in the COG region, and any -- 24 any housing finance that would come through this for 25 affordable housing, or anything that, I think, meets the 6-11-07 67 1 Section 8 rules or whatever, we can -- we can access that, and 2 it's already in place. We don't really need to have another 3 one. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Unless state law requires it. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Unless state law requires 6 it. But -- 7 JUDGE TINLEY: I -- I understand -- the honest 8 answer to that concern, Commissioner, is I don't know. That 9 may be something that we want the County Attorney to look into 10 as well. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What -- I mean -- 13 JUDGE TINLEY: But as long as we have this nonprofit 14 organization outstanding that we've formed, I think we -- we 15 do need to, number one, file the required reports, which 16 there's a report due, and I think it benefits us to have a 17 registered agent that is available to be served, rather than a 18 default not happening. Now, we may later want to -- want to 19 dissolve it because there's no need for it. That's a 20 possibility. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's -- I just wanted to 22 bring it to your attention; that is available to us. And -- 23 and they have bonding authority for millions of dollars for 24 purchases of housing. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do we need to designate a name, 6-11-07 68 1 or can we just say the County Judge, so we don't end up with a 2 former -- in this case, deceased -- judge? 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I think you need to designate a named 4 individual, is generally what the Secretary of State requires 5 for a registered agent. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make a motion we designate 7 County Judge Pat Tinley as the registered agent for the Kerr 8 County Housing Finance Corporation. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 12 indicated. Any further question or discussion? All in favor 13 of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's move 18 to Item 12; request Kerr County Environmental Health 19 Department to provide an update on the status of T.C.E.Q. and 20 court-ordered cleanup of property owned by Milton Taylor 21 adjacent to Flat Rock Lake Park. 22 MR. NORTH: Morning, gentlemen. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Williams, you placed this on the 24 agenda. Do you have any remarks? 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I did, Judge, because I've 6-11-07 69 1 had, again, folks querying as to whether or not that cleanup 2 is ongoing. So, I asked County Attorney to provide me with a 3 copy of the court order, which is dated November '06, and if 4 I'm advised correctly, I think there's only one -- been one 5 report filed by Mr. Taylor since November of '06. But I'd 6 like to get an update on where -- where do we stand? What's 7 going on and so forth? 8 MR. NORTH: Well, probably, gentlemen, since I guess 9 you already have a copy of the terms and conditions of 10 probation, will you need a -- 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's in the packet. 12 MR. NORTH: All right. If you'll turn to -- the 13 last three pages is the most important. That actually sets 14 out the terms and conditions. If you'll notice, all reports 15 were to be submitted to T.C.E.Q. and through T.C.E.Q., and so 16 we were kind of locally out of the loop. There's no provision 17 for us to receive a copy of that, so therefore, I've asked, 18 and Mr. Malcolm Ferris has consented to come up here from San 19 Antonio. He's a special investigator for T.C.E.Q., and he 20 will bring you up to date on T.C.E.Q.'s -- what they have 21 received and where they stand. I've been checking on 22 Mr. Taylor every day, just about, and he started out doing 23 real well abating the problem, but now he's just slacked off. 24 He's not -- he's not done anything. He's whining and crying, 25 claims he can't get any help and so on and so forth. But, 6-11-07 70 1 anyway, the big hammer is the state. That's why Mr. Ferris is 2 here, and he's certainly more knowledgeable about this side of 3 it than I am. And he will -- if I could present him to you, 4 he will bring you up to date on how they see -- yes, sir? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mr. North, tell me again 6 how -- how it got to T.C.E.Q. and not Kerr County. 7 MR. NORTH: Well, the -- when we originally 8 investigated the site, there were a lot of spills, battery 9 spills, oil spills and so on, and right there at Third Creek. 10 As you know, Third Creek empties right into the Guadalupe 11 River, so we thought it best to bring T.C.E.Q. in. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see, okay. 13 MR. NORTH: To -- to look over the site and see what 14 we could do, exactly where we stood. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see -- I see Judge Brown's 16 name in here on some stuff. 17 MR. NORTH: That was -- case was heard in County 18 Court at Law. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. All right, thank you. 20 Thank you, that's fine. 21 MR. NORTH: I'd like to present Mr. Malcolm Ferris 22 of Texas Commission on Environmental Quality. 23 MR. FERRIS: Good morning. My name is Malcolm 24 Ferris; I'm an advisor with the Special Investigations 25 Section, Texas Commission on Environmental Quality. I work 6-11-07 71 1 out of San Antonio regional office. I have copies of the 2 T.C.E.Q. file for the Court. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 4 MR. FERRIS: Did I give you enough? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir -- no, sir. 6 MR. FERRIS: Anybody else? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think one more. 8 MS. BAILEY: I have one. I think I have one. 9 AUDIENCE: Could we have some back here? 10 MR. FERRIS: I don't have that many. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Clerk? Okay, thank you. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Everybody but me. 13 MS. BAILEY: I think I've got one you can have. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, sir. 15 MR. FERRIS: Okay. Basically, to answer some of the 16 questions that were asked, why this was just to T.C.E.Q., I 17 drafted the technical requirements using a template for 18 administrative orders from the agency. Rex Emerson, the 19 County Attorney, could have added the County if he had wished. 20 Apparently, he was satisfied with the T.C.E.Q. receiving the 21 files, and then the County -- the Court would review 22 compliance with terms of probation through review of the 23 T.C.E.Q. file. That was purely up to the County in that 24 matter. In the packet that I provided, you can see there was 25 a submittal on November 18th, '06. I believe that was within 6-11-07 72 1 the time frame for the first submittal giving notification to 2 the agency. The second submittal was -- there's actually 3 copies of the cover letter. One cover letter was received at 4 the regional office, as required under the terms of the court 5 order, without photographs. A second copy apparently was 6 received in the Austin central office, Remediation Division, 7 as required under the order, and with some photographs. 8 I have not personally reviewed the file. I cannot 9 speak to the accuracy of the -- of this information. It was 10 scanned and forwarded to me just last Friday, so I've only had 11 a brief time to review what he's provided. But, basically, a 12 quick summary of the requirements of the order: He was 13 required to submit a Release Investigation Report that was 14 intended to look for signs of contamination, spills from the 15 dumping activities to which he pled, and in general at the 16 property for the other vehicles. He had agreed to this in the 17 court order. There is no apparent sign of complete compliance 18 with that requirement. The information he sent in is 19 essentially a preliminary -- steps taken to remediate 20 problems, but cannot identify specifically on the property 21 showing any kind of -- how the investigation was conducted, 22 what releases were found. 23 And apparently, he took some remedial action. There 24 was no determination of whether the stains that he identified 25 needed to be removed or not. He apparently picked up some 6-11-07 73 1 dirt, which may or may not still be on the property. One of 2 the other things he was to do was to remove all of the solid 3 waste. My understanding was he was arranging to have a 4 vehicle shredder brought on property. I'm not sure if that 5 actually was done. I haven't been by the property myself. Do 6 you know if a vehicle shredder had been brought on the 7 property? 8 MR. NORTH: Sorry, what? 9 MR. FERRIS: A vehicle shredder brought on the 10 property to process the -- 11 MR. NORTH: Yeah, there was once. Hasn't been back 12 again. 13 MR. FERRIS: So, I'm not sure if there are still 14 junk vehicles on the property constituting solid waste, which, 15 again, would constitute violations of the Texas Health and 16 Safety Code to which he pled out for just -- misdemeanor 17 charge for 5 to 200 pounds of waste. Obviously, there was a 18 lot more there. We gave him this opportunity to comply with 19 general requirements and to do a cleanup, and so he's done 20 some actions, but he has neither submitted what would be 21 considered a Release Investigation Report, nor has he 22 submitted the Affected Property Assessment Report which refers 23 to the T.C.E.Q. rules, Chapter 30 -- or, sorry, Chapter 350 24 and Title 30 of the Texas Administrative Code. And so that 25 would kind of be a report that he could only truly comply with 6-11-07 74 1 by hiring an independent consulting firm to do the review, 2 submit the paperwork required to the agency to determine where 3 the releases were, and then whether the releases required 4 cleanup, or if they -- the level of contamination was such 5 that no further action was required. So, that's what we 6 required him to do. 7 You have copies of the information that he 8 submitted. There is a project coordinator assigned the 9 project up in Austin. Her name is in that documentation, 10 Rebecca Hilton. She is the person to make the determination 11 as to what type of information he submitted and how it 12 corresponds to the requirements that we put in the court 13 order, and I haven't had time to pin her down on exactly 14 what's been required and how this information, as submitted, 15 complies with that. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: By looking at the file, it 17 appears that middle of -- March 20th is about the last thing 18 that something happened. I appreciate you coming down, but I 19 just think I want to emphasize, this is important to us. And 20 if you can get Ms. Spillman -- is that her name? Rebecca -- 21 MR. FERRIS: Rebecca Hilton. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Hilton? Just make sure that she 23 keeps -- keeps on him. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Would it be your 25 understanding that the Court established a -- a time frame in 6-11-07 75 1 which this remediation needs to be completed? I'm seeing a 2 nod. 3 MS. BAILEY: That's what -- that's this whole order. 4 Is has timelines in it, and according to what we're hearing 5 right now, so far none of those timeline -- timelines have 6 been complied with to-date. The -- the last one in the order 7 was, by my calculations, due March 22nd of '07, so, you know, 8 a couple of months ago was the last one. And the other two, 9 one was due in early March, the disposal of all solid wastes 10 and the submission of Affected Property Assessment Report. 11 The first deadline was due June the 6th of '07. The Release 12 Investigation Report to which he referred also has not yet 13 been done. So -- well, the only thing it looks like has been 14 done at all was the first submittal required by this probation 15 order. The options under this probation order are only to 16 make a motion to revoke the defendant's probation and place 17 him in jail, which still does not succeed in accomplishing the 18 remediation, but I will remind the Court that we have 19 established a nuisance abatement order that allows the County, 20 upon proper notice and so forth, to order it to be completed, 21 and if not completed, then for the County to go in and do the 22 work, and to place a lien against the property for any 23 expenses incurred by the County. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. That's what I 25 was leading up to. We do have that authority? 6-11-07 76 1 MS. BAILEY: Yes, sir. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: As well as criminal penalties on the 3 enforcement of the probation order in the event the terms of 4 probation are not complied with? 5 MS. BAILEY: Well, we have that, and in addition, 6 his -- if circumstances continue at the location, the statutes 7 all establish that every day of an offense constitutes a new 8 offense, so in theory, every day that he's been in 9 noncompliance is a criminal action. But, once again, 10 filing -- issuing criminal complaints, if it hasn't been done 11 yet, I'm not sure how efficacious that would be. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But there is -- so it sounds 13 like there are more -- 14 MS. BAILEY: We have options. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: A more viable option might be 16 pursuing it, clean it up ourselves, and putting a lien on the 17 property to get it cleaned up. 18 MS. BAILEY: Yes, sir. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: After going through nuisance 20 abatement procedures. 21 MS. BAILEY: Yes. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And the time frame for that is 24 basically past? 25 MS. BAILEY: The time frame for? 6-11-07 77 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The nuisance abatement. 2 MS. BAILEY: No. His time frame provided in the 3 order for him to do it, he's not complied with. He's, 4 therefore, in my opinion, in violation of his probation. 5 Therefore, we can then go forward with our nuisance abatement 6 procedures, saying you have -- well, there's a whole litany of 7 things that have to go on, but basically, we have to send him 8 notice, say you've got, you know, 30 days or whatever -- I 9 think it's 30 days -- to complete it. Then, when it's not 10 done, then at that point we can go in and do -- do the work. 11 I suspect that if he hasn't done it in seven months, he 12 probably won't do it in the next 30 days, but he could. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: On my part, I hope we proceed 14 with the process of trying to make sure it does happen, 15 however it has to happen. I don't care at this point. This 16 has been going on for, I know -- not counting what you're 17 showing in the recent past, but this has been a problem for 18 probably 12 or 15 years, and it's ridiculous that it's had to 19 go on this long. It's time to, you know, finish -- finish it 20 up, throw him in jail, whatever you have to do with him to 21 make it happen. And if we have to do it ourselves, put a lien 22 on his property, I'm all for that, too. 23 MS. BAILEY: We don't have an action item on this 24 agenda item, although -- 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm coming back with an 6-11-07 78 1 action item, Commissioner. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 3 MS. BAILEY: We can pursue the criminal motion to 4 revoke, but we need an action item for doing that. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'll get with the County 6 Attorney and we'll -- we'll figure out the next step. I just 7 wanted to get the report today. I wanted T.C.E.Q. to talk to 8 us a little bit today, tell us what they knew from their 9 perspective. One other question of Mr. Ferris. To your 10 knowledge, sir, has this Rebecca Hilton been to the site and 11 done any investigation? 12 MR. FERRIS: No, that wouldn't be within the scope 13 of the Remediation Division to come out and solicit the 14 property on routine -- 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 16 MR. FERRIS: It's really Ed North here with the 17 County and the court probation system to determine if the 18 probation -- the terms of probation have been met, and if not, 19 take appropriate action. As far as the T.C.E.Q., we were just 20 the, essentially, overseer to determine if action was taken 21 appropriately. So -- 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Have you seen the site? 24 MR. FERRIS: Oh, yes. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions for Mr. Ferris? 6-11-07 79 1 Any other matters to be offered in connection with this item? 2 Why don't we take about a 15-minute recess? 3 (Recess taken from 10:42 a.m. to 11:04 a.m.) 4 - - - - - - - - - - 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's come back to order, if we 6 might. We were in recess. Let's move to Item 14; consider, 7 discuss, and take appropriate action to approve letter of 8 engagement with McCall, Parkhurst, and Horton, LLP, to provide 9 bond counsel services to Kerr County for the Center 10 Point/Eastern Kerr County wastewater project. Commissioner 11 Williams. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Judge. This is 13 just unfinished business from the last time we had this on. 14 It is required that we issue a letter of engagement for bond 15 counsel. Bond counsel fees are predicated on funding, so 16 there's no cost to us to do so. They get funding and so 17 forth, then we talk about the fees, and their fees come out of 18 that automatically, as they do for the financial consultant. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Does Upper Guadalupe River 20 Authority hire the same counsel? 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes. They hired -- I 22 believe so. They're hiring the same financial advisers, and I 23 believe they're also hiring Tom. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Seems like it makes 25 things simpler if it was all one entity. 6-11-07 80 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sure. Move approval. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second -- third. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for approval 5 of the agenda item. Any question or discussion? All in favor 6 of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's move 11 to Item 15; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 12 clarify expiration of terms of office of Commissioners 13 Williams and Letz on Kerrville-Kerr County Joint Airport 14 Board. I put this on the agenda. The issue was raised by the 15 City Clerk. The information provided by the City Clerk 16 indicated that the intention from day one was that the terms 17 of both the two Commissioners on the board, as well as the two 18 City Councilmen on the board, would be staggered so that there 19 would be continuity, and that there wasn't any clear 20 designation of -- of those staggered terms in our liaison 21 appointments. At least that's the way that she read the 22 issue. So, if we need to clarify it, it's out here. If we 23 don't, we don't. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We can, if need be. But -- 25 the City Clerk may not remember; she didn't handle it at that 6-11-07 81 1 time, but the original draw for the bean was, I got the 2 one-year term originally and Jon got two, and then I got a 3 two, and now it's been rotating two and three. So, we do have 4 a staggered situation for two-year terms, actually. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the confusion might be 6 in the court order, by assuming -- you know, in the backup, it 7 says for the calendar year 2007, but there were two-year 8 appointments in 2007. To me, that doesn't need to be 9 clarified, but if they want to clarify it, we can clarify it. 10 I don't see it changes a whole lot. I'll just mention that I 11 would have a -- based on the liaison picks in January, I would 12 -- my term would now run until 2009, and Bill's continues 13 right now to run through 2008. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's correct. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, I guess that would be a 16 clarification, would be that -- 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- you know, I'll -- well, I'll 19 make the motion that my term that was designated by the Court 20 in January was for a two-year term, which will expire in 2009. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: And his would expire the end of 2008. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mine will come up again in 24 '08 for a two-year and so forth. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and second as 6-11-07 82 1 indicated to clarify the issue. Any question or discussion? 2 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 3 hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Next item, 8 consider, discuss, and take appropriate action on I.R.S. 9 notice regarding tax period of March 31, 2007. Ms. Williams. 10 MS. WILLIAMS: Morning. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Good morning. 12 MS. WILLIAMS: I really don't want to be here, but 13 oh well. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think you do; you just 15 won't admit it. 16 MS. WILLIAMS: We received a notice on the 4th of 17 June that the I.R.S. had found a calculation error and they 18 were changing our tax return, and because of the change, 19 therefore we owed them $3,233.86. I called I.R.S. and spoke 20 with a rep; her name was Ms. Austin. She was very, very kind, 21 very polite and very helpful. During the course of the 22 conversation, I found out that I.R.S. evidently had not 23 received our fourth quarter 2006 tax return, which I know that 24 we sent in, but it was not mailed certified mail, so I have no 25 documentation to prove when I'd actually sent it. Her 6-11-07 83 1 suggestion was, go ahead and get a copy of that sent to Ogden, 2 Utah as soon as possible, which I did the same day, by 3 certified mail this time. And I explained to her the 4 situation that had happened at the end of December. 5 We had a $1,114.46, I believe, credit on the fourth 6 quarter 2006 return that we were going to apply to the first 7 quarter of this year. By them not having the fourth quarter 8 report when we filed our first quarter report for this year, 9 it looked like our -- our first pay period tax liability, 10 which would have been January 15th, was over $100,000. If 11 it's over $100,000, it requires next day deposit. Well, with 12 the credit from December carried over to January 15th, it 13 dropped -- it dropped it below, but the deposit had been made. 14 It actually was made, I think, the day before payroll. So, 15 she said basically to put that in a letter to the I.R.S. 16 requesting abatement of the penalty for that, and the fact 17 that the -- the credit was coming over from the fourth quarter 18 of '06. 19 Then the next problem that she said showed on 20 February 15th, we had one liability period which was over 21 $100,000 again. And I explained to her that on January 31st, 22 there were a number of checks that had to be unposted, that 23 were issued in error. We're still learning. And those checks 24 were unposted after the January 31st tax liability period, 25 which threw it over into February 15th. Those credits dropped 6-11-07 84 1 our liability down below $100,000. That's why the tax deposit 2 was not made next day; it was made within the time frame that 3 they allow. Again, she said basically put it in a letter, 4 send it to I.R.S., ask them to abate the penalty and interest. 5 And she said you will probably also get hit with a penalty and 6 interest for late filing on the fourth quarter. When I went 7 into office on the 8th of February, I found that the fourth 8 quarter tax return had not been completed. It was supposed to 9 have been in before the end of January. So, my rough draft 10 copy of the letter that I'm sending to I.R.S. is basically 11 asking them to abate the current penalty and interest notice 12 that we got on the 4th of June, and abate the penalty and 13 interest if there's one assessed for the late filing. The 14 problem is, we need to get this paid before the 25th of June 15 or we will accrue additional charges. I'm asking the Court to 16 allow us to go ahead and pay the $3,233.86, with the hopes 17 that we will get abatement from I.R.S. and they will refund us 18 those moneys. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've heard this story before. 20 MS. WILLIAMS: Not from me. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, but I agree with you. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But we still have the 23 potential of another situation because the fourth quarter of 24 '06 was late? 25 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 6-11-07 85 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We just haven't heard from 2 that one yet? 3 MS. WILLIAMS: Right. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I thought, when I started 5 reading this, this was about the fourth quarter of '06. 6 MS. WILLIAMS: No, sir. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 8 MS. WILLIAMS: No, this is strictly the tax period 9 ending March 31st of '07. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: So, what you're asking the Court to 12 do is authorize the -- the payment of the amount that I.R.S. 13 has at this point assessed? 14 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Of $3,233.86? 16 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: In hopes that we'll get additional -- 18 we'll get that credit down the road if it's abated? 19 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes. If -- if they will take into 20 consideration that I'm new in the office, and that some of 21 this was a carryover from my predecessor, and some of it is 22 learning. We're still learning. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mindy, question. It sounds like 24 our payroll is bumping 100,000 nowadays. 25 MS. WILLIAMS: It's running anywhere from -- our tax 6-11-07 86 1 liability is running anywhere from, say, 93,000 to maybe 96, 2 97. Very seldom do we get over 100,000. The only time we 3 actually hit that is when we have overtime that we pay off. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But would it not -- I mean, 5 with -- looking down the road, as soon as we do -- assuming we 6 do a cost-of-living adjustment, we're going to be over 100,000 7 starting then. Why don't we start going with the next-day -- 8 the requirement right now, so that when -- when that change -- 9 when we're required to change that thing, -- 10 MS. WILLIAMS: We can. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- we get the bugs worked out of 12 that? 13 MS. WILLIAMS: We can. We started doing our tax 14 deposits with EFTPS. It's Electronic tax -- Federal Tax 15 Payment Services. Ms. Austin informed me that, in fact, we 16 have to do it that way because of our -- our liability. And 17 it's really very easy. We can do it online. We can do it by 18 phone. You have up until, I believe, 8 o'clock -- 19 MS. HYDE: 8 o'clock. 20 MS. WILLIAMS: -- to get that in for next-day 21 settlement. So, it's not a problem. H.R. is getting the 22 payroll done ahead of time where we can have it prepared. We 23 can do the tax deposits when it's due by next day. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I just think it would be good 25 practice to start doing it next day, even when we are not 6-11-07 87 1 required to. 2 MS. WILLIAMS: Right. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Because we're going to be over 4 that limit pretty quick, it appears to me. 5 MS. WILLIAMS: Yeah, looks that way. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Essentially, what we talked about, 7 right? 8 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 MS. WILLIAMS: It is. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move that we pay the penalty 12 and interest of $3,233.86. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm going to second it, but I 14 have a question. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Your question is, where's the money 16 going to come from? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. My question also. 20 MS. WILLIAMS: I'll defer that one to the County 21 Auditor, because I -- 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Workers Comp? 23 MR. TOMLINSON: That's fine. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Dip into old Rusty's budget, 6-11-07 88 1 see what he says. 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You want to -- 3 MS. WILLIAMS: Okay, may I ask one thing? 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You want to see my budget? 5 MS. WILLIAMS: Will the -- will the order reflect 6 that we are to move the moneys from Workers Comp to 7 Commissioners Court Contingency so we can pay this and kind of 8 keep everything in one place? 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If that's your 10 recommendation, that's the motion. 11 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir, that would be my 12 recommendation. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We have a motion and second as 15 indicated. Any further question or discussion? 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Discussion from my end would 17 be, I appreciate you coming forward with this and telling us 18 exactly what the problem is and has been so that it can be 19 resolved before it gets out of hand. Thank you. 20 MS. WILLIAMS: You're welcome. I appreciate that. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or discussion? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, while we're talking about 23 abatement, have we ever heard back from the other abatement, 24 the $12,000 one? 25 MS. WILLIAMS: I haven't had any correspondence from 6-11-07 89 1 I.R.S. regarding that at all. We paid it. I guess they're 2 happy, and -- 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sure, they got the money. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But -- well, I'll put it on the 5 next agenda; it's really not on this item. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: It was, quote, on appeal. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, but I want to -- did that 8 appeal happen? Are we certain it happened? 9 MR. TOMLINSON: I thought I saw a letter denying it. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So did I. 11 MS. HYDE: We had a letter that denied it, and then 12 we were supposed to reapply for appeal. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 14 MS. HYDE: And I don't think that anyone has seen a 15 reappeal. 16 MS. WILLIAMS: I haven't seen a denial letter 17 either. I haven't found one downstairs. 18 MS. HYDE: I've got one. 19 MS. WILLIAMS: Yeah, I need a copy. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We mainly want to -- I think, 21 certainly, for that amount of money, we should go to the next 22 level. 23 MS. WILLIAMS: Okay, thank you. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion, signify 25 by raising your right hand. 6-11-07 90 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. What's the 5 pleasure of the Court before we get into executive session? 6 Do you want to go ahead and knock down the bills and what-not? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We'll move to -- 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Judge? 10 JUDGE TINLEY: -- Section 4 of the agenda, payment 11 of the bills. 12 (Discussion off the record.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, first item is to pay the bills. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move we pay our bills. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to pay the 17 bills. Any question or discussion? All in favor of the 18 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget 23 amendments. Budget Amendment Request Number 1. 24 MR. TOMLINSON: One is for the County Jail, to move 25 $5,065.88 from Jailer Salaries, with 790.13 to Operating 6-11-07 91 1 Supplies and 4,275.75 to Prisoner Medical. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. Forgot what we 3 were doing. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 6 approval. Any question or discussion? All in favor of the 7 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. Budget Amendment 12 Request Number 2. 13 MR. TOMLINSON: Number 2 is for the 198th District 14 Court and the County Jail. We're transferring $5,770 from 15 Jailer Salaries, 3,097.50 to Court-Appointed Attorneys line 16 item, and 2,572.50 to Civil Court-Appointed Attorney line 17 item, and $100 to Special Court Reporter. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 21 approval. Any question or discussion? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Rusty has a question. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Only one question. If you look 24 at -- and I just got my printout. In the Jailer Salaries 25 stuff and that, by the budget stuff, we should be at about 6-11-07 92 1 31 percent of our budget left. And if the Court will 2 remember, we did dissolve two part-time, made a full-time and 3 addressed the clerk, and the Court was going to transfer that 4 money later, whenever it became necessary to do it. So, if 5 you look in the clerk line item right now, we're at 6 18 percent, and we're at 29, so we're a few percentage points 7 below the overall budget, so there is going to have to be some 8 money out of the Jailer Salaries remaining so that we can fund 9 those positions fully through the rest of the year as agreed 10 prior. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We'll take it from another 12 line item in your budget if we need to. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I figured that. Thank you. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments? All 15 in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. Budget Amendment 20 Request Number 3. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Not my salary. (Laughter.) 22 MR. TOMLINSON: Number 3 is for the 216th District 23 Court, to transfer 2,495.13 from Special District Judge's line 24 item -- excuse me -- with 1,891.80 into Court-Appointed 25 Services and 603.33 to Special Court Reporter. 6-11-07 93 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 4 approval. Any question or discussion? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Question. Tommy, are you 6 going to recommend that we have a Special District Judge line 7 item again? 8 MR. TOMLINSON: I think we do. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do we ever -- 10 MR. TOMLINSON: For next budget year. Oh, in their 11 budget, I think there is a line. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We have special judges that 13 come in and sit? 14 MR. TOMLINSON: Occasionally they do, yes. It's 15 been rare in the last two years, but -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's because of this state 17 funding being zeroed out, I think. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 19 MR. TOMLINSON: Right. That's right. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's one of those programs 21 that I -- that I like. I think it's beneficial to the entire 22 system, including the jail and, you know, all -- everything 23 involved in it, that we have visiting judges come in here and 24 sit and hear these things, instead of those guys sitting in 25 that jail all the time. Get it cleaned out. Anyway, that's 6-11-07 94 1 beside the point. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments? All 3 in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Budget 8 Amendment Request Number 4. 9 MR. TOMLINSON: Number 4 is for -- is from Kevin 10 Stanton at the juvenile facility. He's transferring some 11 funds in -- in his budget to finish out the year. And he 12 didn't write the name of the accounts on here, but the total 13 of the transfer out is 30,500, with those -- with the same 14 amount going into the line items as specified on the 15 right-hand side of the page. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Could you identify these, 17 what they're for? 18 MR. TOMLINSON: Well, let's see. I don't have -- I 19 don't have his budget with me. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask a question. Does 21 it transfer straight across? 22 MR. TOMLINSON: No. He has -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, it doesn't. 24 MR. TOMLINSON: I'll have to go get my -- I'll have 25 to go get his budget. 6-11-07 95 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is this just to clean up the -- 2 MR. TOMLINSON: He said -- he told me he had some -- 3 he was having to pay some extra amounts in his part-time 4 salaries. That had to do with some problems with -- with 5 replacing some full-time people. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess my question is -- 7 MR. TOMLINSON: Because there -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why don't we hold off till next 9 meeting so we can get this in the same form as all the others? 10 MR. TOMLINSON: Okay. It's not a rush. Let's do 11 that. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: He's just trying to get things lined 13 up to go the rest of the year? 14 MR. TOMLINSON: That's right. I didn't -- I'm -- I 15 apologize; I didn't realize that -- that the names weren't 16 there, and so I'll -- I'll redo it. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Make him redo it. He can use 18 the same form as everybody else. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: I gather that no action be taken on 20 Number 4? You have any other budget amendments? 21 MR. TOMLINSON: No. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: We have any late bills? 23 MR. TOMLINSON: No. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: I've been presented with monthly 25 reports from Justice of the Peace, Precinct 2, and Justice of 6-11-07 96 1 the Peace, Precinct 3. Do I hear a motion that these reports 2 be approved as presented? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved -- second. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 6 approval. Any question or discussion? All in favor of the 7 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let us go 12 back, then, to Item 17; consider, discuss, and take 13 appropriate action to fill vacancy in Environmental Health, 14 administrative assistant position. Does any member of the 15 Court have anything to offer in the open or public session on 16 Item 17? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is it going to closed 18 session? 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Let me go ahead and call Item 22 18; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action regarding 23 designation of status of Environmental Health Code Enforcement 24 Officers. Before we go into executive session, does any 25 member of the Court have anything to offer with regard to 6-11-07 97 1 Agenda Item 18 in public or open session? Seeing no one -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Call this one, too. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, okay. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm not real sure that we need 5 to -- there's much discussion to be had in executive session 6 over that particular -- particular item. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Which one are you referring to? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: On the -- 18. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The designation of -- or 11 status of Environmental Health Code Officer. We talked about 12 this last meeting, and basically authorized the hiring of an 13 individual, and I think this basically -- this means we need 14 to designate that person as the Environmental Health Code 15 Enforcement Officer. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: All wrapped up in one item? 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I think we need to 18 discuss a little bit possibly in executive session about some 19 issues that probably shouldn't be discussed in open session, 20 but as far as making that designation, I don't know what would 21 prohibit that from happening if it was the pleasure of the 22 Court to do so. 'Cause we did authorize that person last 23 meeting, and the money to pay for that person till the end of 24 the year. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't understand 6-11-07 98 1 "designation." What are we doing with this? Do we have to 2 make a -- 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, that basically has to do 4 with the way that person's going to operate, whether they're 5 going to operate with a peace officer's license or whether 6 they're not. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My understanding is, this person 8 has that license. Therefore, they are a peace officer; 9 therefore, we don't make a designation. They just have to 10 operate that way. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. That's what I think it 12 is. It's basically operational. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I think that it's a -- you 14 know, I think we kind of got this from Ilse. There's some 15 good positives and negatives about being a police officer, or 16 a peace officer in this position. But I don't -- you know -- 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This person has his police 19 officer license; therefore, it's not a discussion any more. I 20 mean -- 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's kind of the way I 22 feel about it, and plus the fact that we set a precedent for 23 this matter going back several years with Mr. North. So, you 24 know, it's clearly in place. He has a peace officer's license 25 as well. 6-11-07 99 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Here's a copy of the court 2 order that states basically what -- what has been done with 3 Mr. North, and I think the same designation would have to be 4 made for the incoming peace officer -- or not peace officer, 5 but Code Enforcement officer. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- the question comes in, I 7 guess, as to who holds that license? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask a question before 9 we get to that point. Has the person been hired? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you TCLEOSE-certified? 13 Have you tested out? You got your license and everything? 14 So, you know, who's -- 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We authorized that hiring -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- of Ray last meeting. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Who's going to -- who's going 19 to -- who's your license under? 20 MR. NORTH: Joel Ayala, Constable 2. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And so who are we going to 22 get to carry these licenses? 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I would assume that that 24 basically is up to -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right there. Your constable 6-11-07 100 1 raised his hand. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Of course. I'm not shocked. 3 So, what's the question now? What's the question? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the only question -- I 5 think that Rex raised a question, is there any kind of 6 limitation around the county when it's -- if that license is 7 held by a constable as opposed to a county-wide person? And, 8 you know, I guess -- you know, to me, I don't see what 9 difference it would make, because from the standpoint of -- 10 he's got to follow the rules regardless. But that's something 11 the County Attorney has to -- I mean, he has to follow the 12 peace officer rules, which requires a search -- when it comes 13 to search warrants and all that other stuff you have to do if 14 you're -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, the way I understand 16 it, a constable has as much, if not more, authority than 17 what's-his-name over here. (Laughter.) 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which "what's-his-name" are 19 you talking about? 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sheriff. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: This what's-his-name. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But, anyway -- 23 MS. BAILEY: A peace officer has statewide 24 jurisdiction, and so I think that's over the things that he's 25 going to be charged with taking care of from our perspective. 6-11-07 101 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He does have jurisdiction? 2 MS. BAILEY: He has statewide jurisdiction as a 3 peace officer. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 5 MS. BAILEY: For these purposes, I think. We've 6 satisfied ourselves to that. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, it's -- we just need to have 8 a motion to designate -- 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Designate him as being 10 Environmental Health administrative -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Code Enforcement. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Code Enforcement officer. 13 MS. BAILEY: I don't know that the order says 14 anything about swearing him in on your behalf, but since he's 15 working on -- on your behalf and not really the constable's 16 behalf, I don't know if that's something you want to offer. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: He'll be -- as a deputy 18 constable, David will have to have him sworn in and send the 19 stuff in to the Secretary of State. He'll have to have a 20 psychological exam, and there are expenses in -- in physicals, 21 and that is required by the State before he can carry his 22 commission. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Whatever. Take it out of 24 the Jailer Salaries? 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No. 6-11-07 102 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But it -- basically, we need to 2 read in a motion identical to this with new names. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's the way I see it. I 4 move that we appoint Ray Garcia as our Solid Waste Code 5 Enforcement officer. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Environmental Health. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And Environmental Health. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Environmental Health Code Enforcement 9 officer? 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes, I'm sorry. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Both ways? 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Right. And he can serve in 13 both capacities. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And license to be carried by 15 Constable -- 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: To be carried by Constable, 17 Precinct 1, David Billeiter. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 20 indicated. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 21 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Okay. Now, 6-11-07 103 1 as to the items that have been called that remain, that'll be 2 Item 17 and Item 3, does any member of the Court have anything 3 to offer in open or public session? Hearing none, we will go 4 out of open or public session at 11:32. 5 (The open session was closed at 11:32 a.m., and an executive session was held, the transcript of which 6 is contained in a separate document.) 7 - - - - - - - - - - 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We are back in open or public 9 session at 11:48. Does any member of the Court have anything 10 to offer with regard to matters considered in executive or 11 closed session? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make a motion related to 13 Item 3 -- 1.3. I make a motion that we authorize the County 14 Attorney's office to do whatever is necessary, including 15 nuisance abatement against the property owner at 321 Roy 16 Street, to get that septic system -- or that environmental 17 health issue resolved. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 20 indicated. Any question or discussion on the motion? All in 21 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Any other 6-11-07 104 1 action offered by any member of the Court with regard to any 2 other items considered in executive or closed session? 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: On Item -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 17. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- 17, I move that we fill a 6 vacant administrative assistant position in Environmental 7 Health, making that person a 15-1, Julie -- I can't think of 8 her -- 9 JUDGE TINLEY: De Los Santos, I think. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Trevino, isn't it? Julie 11 Trevino? 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't know her last name. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I believe it is. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: But she fill the vacated 15 position that was a 13-2 -- I mean, that was a 15-1, and that 16 we hire a new person to fill the 13-1 position. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 19 indicated. Any question or discussion? All in favor of the 20 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Okay. That 25 brings us to Section 5. Any reports from Commissioners in 6-11-07 105 1 their liaison or other assignments? One? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Two? 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, sir. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Three? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Um -- 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Come on. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Four? 10 (Commissioner Oehler shook his head negatively.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Do we have any reports from 12 elected officials? Let's move to Item 3. (Laughter.) 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't have a report, but I 14 got cornered with a question out in the hall a while ago. I 15 need to ask -- see if y'all can give advice on something that 16 does concern the courthouse. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: It's not an agenda item at this time, 18 Sheriff. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I just need advice. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can't give you advice, but 21 you can give us a report. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay, I'll give you a report. 23 I had -- 24 JUDGE TINLEY: I'll punch your T.S. card if you have 25 one. 6-11-07 106 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Had a lady by the name of 2 Ms. Platt corner me a while ago in the lobby, and requesting 3 that -- she has gotten approval to have an antique car show on 4 the courthouse grounds on July 7th, and wanted me to shut down 5 the entrances to the courthouse on the night of July 6th and 6 get rid of any other vehicles that may be parked around the 7 courthouse, and advised me that they were setting up tents on 8 the courthouse grounds. Not in the parking lot, on the 9 grounds, and that it had all been given an okay. I said, "I 10 have no idea what you're talking about." 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The County Judge is liaison. I 12 suggest that this be referred to him to handle. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, I've talked to those folks 14 about holding their annual July 4th car show, which is done on 15 Saturday. But -- 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Saturday, July 7th. And that 17 was the request, and I don't know that I have the authority 18 without some kind of court order, and I don't know if there's 19 Commissioners Court after this date to be able to actually tow 20 any vehicles off the courthouse square and close the entrances 21 after midnight so that they can set up, and nor do I know if I 22 have authority to allow anybody to set up tents on the 23 courthouse grounds. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, you don't have authority 25 for that, I can tell you. But we have another court date, and 6-11-07 107 1 you may want to tell those people to make sure they coordinate 2 this, if they want anything done, with the County Judge. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Is there a court date before 4 July 7th? 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Sure, there's one the tail end of 6 this month, second -- or fourth Monday of this month. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And it may be something we put 8 on the agenda, or I'll call her back and have her put it on 9 the agenda. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's pretty common, that 11 when that car show is going on, I mean, you can't drive in 12 there anyway, or people don't. I mean, you park out on the 13 street somewhere and walk through there, because it's really a 14 neat gig. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't know about tents on 17 the lawn. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: They want anybody that was 19 parked in here after midnight that night to be removed so that 20 they have room to get all the antique cars in. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There's not many cars left in 22 here. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: There normally aren't, but even 24 if there was one, I don't think I have the authority to remove 25 it from a public parking lot. 6-11-07 108 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't think I'd want to give 2 you that authority, either. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't want it. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I would suggest you don't get 5 it. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Your dog would eat me up. 7 MS. BAILEY: Even though we're not considering this, 8 'cause it's not on the agenda. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's right. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other reports? Okay. Anybody 12 have anything else to offer? We stand adjourned. 13 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 11:55 a.m.) 14 - - - - - - - - - - 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 6-11-07 109 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my 5 capacity as County Clerk of the Commissioners Court 6 of Kerr County, Texas, at the time and place 7 heretofore set forth. 8 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 14th day of 9 June, 2007. 10 11 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 12 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 13 Certified Shorthand Reporter 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 6-11-07