1 2 3 4 5 6 7 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 8 Workshop 9 Wednesday, August 1, 2007 10 4:30 p.m. 11 Commissioners' Courtroom 12 Kerr County Courthouse 13 Kerrville, Texas 14 15 16 17 Facilities Use Policy/Procedure Workshop 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X August 1, 2007 2 PAGE 3 Participate in workshop to discuss the new policies and procedures for the use and rental of Hill Country 4 Youth Exhibition Center (Ag Barn) and Union Church 3 5 --- Adjourned 49 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 3 1 On Wednesday, August 1, 2007, at 4:30 p.m., a workshop 2 of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in the 3 Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, Kerrville, 4 Texas, and the following proceedings were had in open court: 5 P R O C E E D I N G S 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let me call to order a 7 workshop that was scheduled for this date at 2 p.m., 8 Wednesday, August 1, '07. And, of course, it's after that 9 now, deferred because of our budget workshop. This particular 10 workshop is to discuss new policies and procedures for use and 11 rental of the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center and Union 12 Church. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can I get rid of all my other 14 copies? 15 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This was the same day and the -- 17 MS. HYDE: I just went ahead and added that hot dog 18 vendor fee, but I didn't call it hot dog vendor. Food vendor 19 fee. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 21 MS. HYDE: We went ahead and added it. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This supersedes the one we 23 had in our -- 24 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Who's taking the lead on this 8-1-07 Ag 4 1 thing? Commissioner Oehler? 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not necessarily. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Not necessarily, okay. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I was looking over the latest 5 part of this. 6 MS. HYDE: I think I'm just asking -- I don't think 7 I'm asking. The front page, the receiving and receipt 8 procedure, was that -- have we approved that? Are we okay 9 with -- we're not okay? 10 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think we've -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Haven't approved anything. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Number one, we can't approve anything 13 today. We can discuss it, but -- 14 MS. HYDE: Well, I meant approved to be put on the 15 agenda for final approval. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's what was supposed to 17 come out of this meeting, right? 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Right. 19 MS. HYDE: Okay. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Have we tried to get a reasonable 21 input from the various stakeholders involved in this entire 22 process over a period of time? I know -- what was it, about a 23 year, two years ago, somewhere in there, there was a 24 considerable amount of discussion concerning some of the 25 procedures that -- 8-1-07 Ag 5 1 MS. HYDE: I think the procedures, really, from the 2 -- from that discussion related to the roping and all that 3 kind of stuff, those are kind of incorporated in here. I 4 don't think we've changed the intent of all that, of our old 5 rules on how it's done and rollover of bookings and all that. 6 I think it's pretty much still in place. I think the 7 procedures have -- the actual internal procedures have changed 8 greatly, and that's part of the whole checks and balances 9 control, whatever you want to call that system, that we didn't 10 have any control on who paid what or how much was paid, where 11 it went, how sometimes we got cash and sometimes we didn't, 12 how we give them back sometimes. We don't know what happened, 13 and we've really tightened up on that, and those are reflected 14 in here, so there's a lot, you know, better control system on 15 the financial side, so we can get much better reporting into 16 the future. 17 But the -- from the public standpoint, I don't think 18 there's much of a change to speak of, other than, obviously, 19 the rate structure side there is. And on getting the public 20 input, I don't -- I mean, I think -- I know Bruce met once 21 with the Stock Show Association, but I think that was more 22 related to some other, you know, stuff. So, I have not gone 23 out and made a great effort to talk to organizations. That's 24 really kind of the intent of this meeting today, was to get 25 feedback. We do have feedback from the Agility Dog Show 8-1-07 Ag 6 1 folks; they sent us a letter. I think what -- and I think 2 that -- you know, my gut feeling is that no one really has 3 paid attention to it. We've been talking about this for quite 4 a while and haven't done anything. I suspect the impact will 5 come next time people go around to start booking and they 6 start getting actually charged under a new rate structure. I 7 suspect there will be some, actually, angst in the community. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. And I kind of wanted 9 to go over some of those things today, if I could, because of 10 David and Caroline Hanson being here with the Hill Country 11 Agility Group. And they've -- they sent us all an e-mail with 12 some very good questions, I think. And I think most of their 13 questions, if we can answer them, will clear a lot of air for 14 all of us, and -- and me included. So, if y'all want to get 15 into this now -- 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Sure. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just take off on it? 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Might as well. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm just going to read -- I'm 20 just going to read one of the questions that she had -- they 21 had, and then we'll go from there. And I have this strange 22 feeling that she may want to respond and have some follow-up 23 questions. I'm not sure of that, but it's just this thing -- 24 MRS. HANSON: I can almost assure it. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just this thing that comes 8-1-07 Ag 7 1 over me. Let's see, her first question here, will the current 2 policy for reservations stay in effect? She's referring to 3 the reoccurring issue. That -- that -- and I think it's, 4 like, Number 8 on your procedure list here, I believe -- yeah. 5 MRS. HANSON: Buster, may I clarify? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do you have something to say? 7 Go ahead. Go ahead. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Hanson, why don't you come on up 9 here so that we can hear you better and the reporter can get 10 you down, please. 11 MRS. HANSON: The policy to which I am referring is 12 the one that is on -- currently on your web site, called Kerr 13 County Facilities Booking and Rental Policy. It's on the web 14 site. It's the one that was developed and was adopted 15 September 26th, 2005. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 17 MRS. HANSON: And that's a very -- you guys worked 18 very hard on that. I was a part of some of the background of 19 helping to develop it, and had a lot of communication with 20 different ones of you about it, and this was done when Glenn 21 Holekamp was here. This is the policy that I was referring to 22 in that number one, which I think does -- there's a little bit 23 that is said in this other one. This one's much more 24 comprehensive than this one. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is the current policy that's 8-1-07 Ag 8 1 on the web site still in effect? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, it is? 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Whatever's there is in effect. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. Can I go to question 6 two now? 7 MR. HANSON: What about question one? 8 MRS. HANSON: The question was, will it stay in 9 effect? 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Will it stay? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, I don't think so. 12 Unless -- I really -- I never have sat down and put them 13 side-by-side and looked at what changes and what doesn't 14 change, but it's basically the same. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's basically the same, as I 16 see it. The main differences are deposit calculations a 17 little bit, refunding deposits is different. I'm going to try 18 -- we didn't intend to change the -- being able to book two 19 years in advance, some of that stuff. We didn't even talk 20 about that stuff. This is more -- this is really more a 21 financial -- how we track money and money comes through the 22 system and how -- this is more internal. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Now, the issue of $500 24 is due at the time of booking, and then the remainder is -- 25 within 21 days of the event, that $500 deposit rolls to the 8-1-07 Ag 9 1 next event. That's always been there, hasn't it? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But what it says, though, to get 5 it to roll, they have to pay them, then, the full amount. The 6 idea is to get the full payment before the event starts. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Right. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, then, to get the $500 to 9 roll, they have to put 100 percent of the amount down 21 days 10 before, and then that $500 then will roll. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, is that a new -- that 12 something new? 13 MS. HYDE: I think that was y'all's intent from the 14 original, but I don't think it was ever -- 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That was the intent. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That was the intent, but it 17 wasn't working like that. 18 MR. HANSON: That wasn't done. 19 MS. HYDE: Right. 20 MR. HANSON: So, in effect, the County gets to hold 21 the 50 percent for what -- if it's -- if it's a long -- if 22 it's twice a year, let's say that, so they're holding 23 50 percent of the cost for six months in your account 24 before -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. And then, when -- prior 8-1-07 Ag 10 1 to that first time that year, you've got to pay 100 percent, 2 and then you -- that 50 percent holds your next date. 3 MR. HANSON: So, it's kind of like your discussion 4 on your salaries. Somehow, someone's out 50 percent, or 5 you're holding 50 percent of our money for whatever that 6 interim period is. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think the intent is to hold 8 a check and not put it in the bank, would be what I would say. 9 You hold -- you hold the deposit check. 10 MS. HYDE: For example, if you -- 11 MR. HANSON: No, I -- no, I think the money goes 12 into an account, Bruce. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It has to. Otherwise, you 14 get -- 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Six months is too long. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: In the simplest form, if you want to 17 roll over a deposit, 21 days before -- at least 21 days before 18 the event, you must have paid the entire cost of the event, 19 excluding any consideration of deposit. When you do that, 20 that automatically kicks your deposit forward to the next 21 event that you have -- that you want to reserve. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's right. The reality 23 is, you always have one and a half times the number you're 24 rolling. 25 MR. HANSON: I understand that. I'm just saying 8-1-07 Ag 11 1 that if it's -- that's fine if it's a monthly event. You 2 know, short-term rollover. I see that as being pretty valid. 3 But if it's -- if you're holding 50 percent of it for, let's 4 say, a semiannual event, what -- what period of time actually 5 defines a rollover? If you wanted to do it annually, would 6 you hold that 50 percent through -- through the whole year? 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, absent that, there's 8 no deposit down. If you don't, you just haven't put a deposit 9 down. 10 MR. HANSON: But if you -- in here, doesn't it say 11 you have to put a deposit down at least 10 days in advance 12 unless authorized? That's Number 1. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. You have to have -- I 14 mean, to hold a date, there's got to be a deposit. 15 MR. HANSON: But it just says 30 days in advance in 16 Number 1. It doesn't -- 17 MS. HYDE: It says to book. 18 MR. HANSON: It doesn't say you're going to hold it 19 for six months or a year. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It also says unless 21 authorized. To be authorized, maybe on semiannual events, to 22 not make those deposits to be able to hold the dates. 23 MR. HANSON: I'm just asking for clarification. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I look at -- the way I read that 25 first one -- 'cause I talked to Ms. Hyde. She was -- I look 8-1-07 Ag 12 1 at that as saying if someone calls to book the facility and 2 they're at least 30 days out, that's when it applies. That 3 deposit has to come in then. If someone calls, you know, like 4 two weeks before an event, well, then a lot of this doesn't 5 make any sense. You got to pay the full amount right then. 6 MR. HANSON: Okay. 7 MS. HYDE: But also, like, yours -- like you were 8 saying, when -- excuse me -- the Number 1 was, for example, 9 Eva Hyde calls 'cause she wants -- she's going to have a fish 10 fry at the Ag Barn, and she wants to have it the 24th of 11 December of 2008, so she calls and she says, "I want to 12 reserve it the 24th of December." I can call and do that, but 13 these -- the rest of these rules start going into effect. I 14 can reserve it, but -- and they get the right of first 15 refusal, just like they had before. If -- if, Commissioner 16 Letz, you call and say, "I want it. I'm sure I want it, and 17 I'm willing to pay right now," -- 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's right. And he gets 19 it. 20 MS. HYDE: -- then he gets it. I would get the 21 right, you know, to be called and say, "Ms. Hyde, do you want 22 it on the 24th?" "Well, I can't really tell you; it might be 23 the 25th or it might be the 30th or whatever." Then 24 Commissioner Letz would get it, 'cause he's going to pay for 25 it and he wants to reserve that date. 8-1-07 Ag 13 1 JUDGE TINLEY: You had a question, Ms. Hanson? 2 MRS. HANSON: Yes, sir. In your policy that's on 3 the web site, Number 2 says consecutive multiple-day events 4 requiring long-term notice, such as conventions, livestock 5 shows, horse or cattle shows, trade shows, rodeos or other 6 events that may be sponsored by a national organization may 7 receive contracts up to three years in advance. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 9 MRS. HANSON: And, you know, that -- that's one of 10 the things that helps us greatly, because I do a lot of the 11 liaison with our national organization, and they have -- they 12 have a four-year calendar, and we're assigned a date, and so 13 we're not real negotiable. But we actually -- should I say 14 that? 15 MR. HANSON: Say what? 16 MRS. HANSON: About the contracts. 17 MR. HANSON: Yeah, you can tell them. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- 19 MRS. HANSON: Do you know that we already -- we, as 20 Hill Country Agility, already have contracts through 2009, and 21 as soon as we had completed our December event in 2007, I was 22 going to book the 2010. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 24 MRS. HANSON: Now, does that mean that this deposit 25 has to be in place for all of those? 8-1-07 Ag 14 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. It's one -- you have one 2 deposit up, and you'll hold all your dates, but then 21 days 3 prior to the event, you've got to pay for that full event. 4 MR. HANSON: That's no problem. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You have to have -- one deposit 6 can hold more than one date. 7 MR. HANSON: But when you say -- when you say that 8 really all the changes are based on the cash issue and who 9 handles what, where it gets paid, how it gets paid, the Number 10 1, "The lessee calls to book the facility at least 30 days in 11 advance", no longer mentions anything to do with conventions, 12 reoccurring events. It's dealing with -- it's a one-off type 13 issue, as I read it. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. Well, that might be. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We need to look at it. But 16 that -- 17 MR. HANSON: Change -- changes the whole context of 18 what's available now to what's here. And that's -- 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can meld the two together 20 better. 21 MR. HANSON: Yeah. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's good. It's not the 23 intent to change that issue. It's just more how to track the 24 money through the system. 25 MR. HANSON: And if it's tracking the money, that's 8-1-07 Ag 15 1 fine. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And it does contemplate the 3 rates will change. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, Number 8 kind of says 5 that. 6 MS. HYDE: But I thought that's what -- right. I 7 thought that's what you had me work on with you, was the 8 Number 8. So that -- 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 10 MS. HYDE: It was the same thing that we had in the 11 current -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 13 MS. HYDE: -- policy. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Number 8, I think, covers it. 15 Regular reoccurring events may be paid for on an event basis 16 within five days -- five working days in a month to maintain a 17 current payment schedule. The deposit may be rolled 18 month-to-month. For example, an event with a total cost of 19 $1,000, $500 is due at the time of booking. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: What may be confusing, it says 21 month-to-month. Month-to-month or year-to-year. 22 MR. HANSON: Or is it from event to event? Because 23 that was my -- one of the other questions. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Maybe event to event is 25 better. 8-1-07 Ag 16 1 MR. HANSON: What do you consider is a rolling 2 event? Is it just monthly, or is it semiannually? 3 MS. HYDE: What do you want me to put in there? I'm 4 sorry. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Event to event. 6 MRS. HANSON: That might make more sense. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, this question, "How will 8 this affect contracts that are already in force and signed," 9 that covers it right there. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It won't -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, the new pay structure 12 will come into play as soon as -- as soon as we adopt this 13 thing. So -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: And the rates are and have been 15 always subject to change. So, whatever the effective date of 16 the rates are, the folks that have dates beyond that effective 17 date, even though they've already, quote, reserved them, 18 they're going to be subject to the new rate structure. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I'll make a comment. The 20 rates aren't changing that much; it's just that we're charging 21 for a lot more that wasn't charged before, such as tables, 22 chairs, concession stand. I mean, the actual indoor facility 23 or indoor arena I don't think is changed at all. It's $500 24 fixed cost, and it was $500 under the nongovernment local 25 before. 8-1-07 Ag 17 1 MR. HANSON: Went from 400 to 600. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask the next question. 3 We're going to get down to some of this stuff that Letz is 4 talking about. With the rate increases, will there be Kerr 5 County staff on duty at a site during the event to assist with 6 supplies, restroom, trash, and emergencies? We used to have 7 someone on duty; now we have only a phone number. And I 8 believe most of that staff resides in Harper. So -- 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That must be -- 10 MR. BOLLIER: We're there -- since I got the Ag Barn 11 back, I have somebody there for every event. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, that answers that. 13 MR. BOLLIER: There is somebody there from the time 14 that event starts till the time that event ends, and then they 15 shut that -- they're there to open up and shut the barn down, 16 and they're there all day long. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. That answers that 18 question. If you will be charging for tables and chairs, will 19 they be new? The current -- 20 MR. HANSON: Or refurbished. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The current ones are not 22 worth renting. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Don't rent them. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Because we don't ever get any 25 money for them. I think that goes -- I think -- yeah, I think 8-1-07 Ag 18 1 they need to be fixed. I'm not sure the status of them. Tim? 2 MR. HANSON: There's some pretty rough ones. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They're not all rough, 'cause 4 I sit in them a lot of times during the year. 5 MR. BOLLIER: I would like to see where we did -- 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They're not all that way. 7 MR. BOLLIER: No, there's -- but I would like to see 8 some new tables and chairs. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did we not just get through 10 with his budget? Did you see tables and chairs in there? 11 MR. BOLLIER: No. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I know where we can get some 13 new chairs, though. Free. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I think the -- one of the 15 problems has been that we haven't been getting money in for 16 the rental, so then we can't afford to fix them. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's kind of a -- you know, I 19 think we need to -- if we charge, they have to be in decent, 20 rentable condition. 21 MR. HANSON: Right. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I think we need to charge, 23 'cause we shouldn't have -- if they're not in rentable 24 condition, we shouldn't have them out there, period. We ought 25 to throw them away or repair them. 8-1-07 Ag 19 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with you. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If they're not in rentable 3 condition, someone's going to get injured using them. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And they have. 5 MR. BOLLIER: For years, when the tables are 6 destroyed or tore up, we've been going and buying 7 three-quarter inch plyboard and we have been making tables, 8 and we have done that in most -- a lot of those tables have 9 been reconstructed. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 11 MR. BOLLIER: But there are still those that -- I 12 mean, there's not a whole bunch of them, but I think there's 13 still a few. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But the answer to your question 15 is yes, they should -- they need to be in proper condition. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Serviceable. 17 MS. HYDE: Serviceable. 18 MR. HANSON: Say, for example, a stack of tables 19 were left for whoever's going to be there. You can cull out 20 the bad ones that you feel are bad? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Within reason. 22 MR. HANSON: Within reason. 23 MRS. HANSON: When they have a piece of metal 24 sticking out of them that hurts people, you know. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 8-1-07 Ag 20 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hopefully we'll fix that as 2 we go along. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, yeah. 4 MR. HANSON: Yeah. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are the hookups guaranteed to 6 work? It is embarrassing to rent a hookup that does not work. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Have you ever rented an R.V. hookup 8 that didn't work? 9 MRS. HANSON: Yes. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 11 MRS. HANSON: But they -- we were lucky enough to be 12 able to get the -- the electrician to get out there and fix it 13 before our person got there. May I share with you the way 14 that I do the R.V. rentals? Because I think there has 15 frequently been slippage in that, and I'm kind of the 16 secretary for our trial; I do all the organization and the 17 paperwork stuff. And if a person wants to come to our dog 18 show and use one of the R.V. hookups or an electrical plug on 19 the outside of the building for some of those small pop-ups 20 and things like that, I collect the money in advance. They 21 have -- they don't -- they can't just drive in and park. I 22 collect the money, with checks made out to Kerr County -- but 23 I guess, now, Kerr County Treasurer -- and I bring those in 24 prior to the event. They have to make their reservations 25 early. Then I print up some little permits on some bright 8-1-07 Ag 21 1 pieces of paper that say, you know, Hill Country Agility Show, 2 R.V. electricity-only spot. Or R.V. self-contained; I make 3 the self-contained ones do it too, and then they're supposed 4 to post that. And I kind of check on them and see that 5 everybody that's out there parking a rig has, in fact, paid 6 the County for it. Now, I'm not aware of any other renters in 7 our Ag Barn area that have a system like that, and it's a lot 8 of trouble for me to do it. It's extra trouble. I have to 9 mail those to the people, then they have to remember to bring 10 them and post them and all that. But I do check on them for 11 the County. And that's -- 12 MR. HANSON: However, if the County were to take 13 that on, that would be fine with us. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tim, is there a way to -- I 15 mean, relatively simple way to lock those so that no one could 16 hook up to that without paying? Like, put a lockbox over the 17 electrical plug so you can't -- 18 MR. BOLLIER: There's a simpler way than that. Just 19 go over there and turn the breaker box off. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is each one on its own breaker? 21 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 22 MRS. HANSON: Each one's separate? 23 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir -- yes, ma'am. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: You can lock it. 25 MR. BOLLIER: And water's all separate. The water's 8-1-07 Ag 22 1 all one. Like, you go over there, turn off the water. 2 MR. HANSON: So, then, is the -- 3 MR. BOLLIER: Water's not the big thing. 4 Electricity may be the big thing. 5 MR. HANSON: So, then, why don't you set it up that 6 whoever wants to get one, contact the County directly, get a 7 -- a receipt for that check from the Treasurer, and they have 8 to present it to the person that's going to be there all the 9 time. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That would work. I don't -- 11 MR. HANSON: Then at least you have a -- you have 12 a -- 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think that all those 14 arrangements have to be handled at the time of booking, as 15 close to it as you can. 16 MR. HANSON: Well, you can't say who's going to have 17 an R.V. hookup. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That puts us in the business 19 of being the booking agent for your events, for all the little 20 details. We don't want to do that. 21 MR. HANSON: Just -- 22 MR. BOLLIER: If they want to rent the R.V. -- if 23 there's an event out there, I don't -- I don't care what event 24 it is. If they want to hook -- rent the R.V. hookups, why 25 shouldn't that be included in the event money itself? And 8-1-07 Ag 23 1 rent them -- all of them? Rent all of them for whatever the 2 County is charging for them, which is $10 a hookup, and has 3 been for years. And -- 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Then y'all get the money. You 5 get it. 6 MR. BOLLIER: And let them pay that money up front, 7 and then there's six R.V. hookups out there. They pay it up 8 front. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Then they get reimbursed. 10 MR. BOLLIER: Then they get it from whoever. It's 11 all square like that. That takes care of that problem. 12 MR. HANSON: That way, we don't have to pay it to 13 the County. 14 MRS. HANSON: Well, there are more than six R.V. 15 hookups, though. Because -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, whatever the number are. 17 MR. BOLLIER: Whatever they are. 18 MRS. HANSON: I've been trying to find that out, and 19 I have get yet to get an answer. But I know there's six out 20 around the periphery. But up against the building and in the 21 front and along the side of the part that we're renting, there 22 are other electrical outlets that can be used by R.V.'s, so I 23 don't know how many there are. And I don't know that I want 24 to pay for all of them if I don't have enough -- you know, I 25 might have five people ask for this particular event, or I 8-1-07 Ag 24 1 might have ten ask for another event. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You pay for whatever you want. 3 And it's -- I think that's -- to me, that's the number that -- 4 it doesn't make sense to have to pay that a year in advance. 5 Twenty-one days before, you need to know how many you want, 6 and you pay it, and then it's up to you to -- 7 MRS. HANSON: Yeah. I usually don't know that 8 number until about two weeks before or three weeks before an 9 event. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: You're going to have to ask for a 11 little bit more advance info from your people. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Twenty-one days is when all that 13 should be due. 14 MR. BOLLIER: And during that -- I'd like to add 15 that during that 21-day period, or 21 days before their event, 16 they have to make sure they're all paid up, but during that 21 17 days, there should be a period in that 21 days to where they 18 have a week -- usually we have everything from a week -- it 19 goes from a week-to-week basis, so if their event -- or 20 whoever's event is on a Saturday, I don't care which, but 21 somewhere in that period of time, once the setup is done, 22 there should be a fee charged to that -- to those people if 23 they come in there and say, "Okay, I want to change this setup 24 from what was originally put out there." 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Are you talking about generally a 8-1-07 Ag 25 1 modification fee? 2 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. There should be something 3 out there. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Modification fee. 5 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: The problem is -- and, number one, I 7 agree with you. If you -- if you get a reservation form and 8 it tells you here's what we need; A, B, C, D, & E, and they 9 come in the day before or the morning of the event and say, 10 you know, "We've rethought this, and we want to change this, 11 that, or the other," -- 12 MR. BOLLIER: There should be something. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: -- and you've got to drop everything 14 and jump through a bunch of hoops to make some changes, there 15 needs to be a charge for that. But -- we don't know what 16 those changes are going to be, but I think it needs to be, you 17 know, something appropriate in the -- you know, in the 18 facility manager's judgment. 19 MR. BOLLIER: Sure. 20 MS. HYDE: We could set it up, Judge, to make it 21 easier, rather than leaving it to be a subjective cost, to 22 say, for example -- I'm not an ag person, so forgive me, but 23 say the pen needs to be totally redone, like we had happen. 24 It's going to take four people. We figure their cost and how 25 many hours, and that's the cost to change the plan. So, for 8-1-07 Ag 26 1 example, you know, if it took me four hours with four people, 2 then this is the cost, and we load the cost with benefits, the 3 whole nine yards, their total compensation cost, not their 4 hourly pay. And that way, we're covered. And if it's 5 overtime, we need to look at that as well. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. 8 MS. HYDE: And that would make it pretty simple. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: The actual cost of labor and 10 materials to make the modifications or changes. 11 MR. HANSON: Generally, we've given the staff there 12 a layout way in advance of what we're looking for. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But the question here today 14 is -- is, are we going to have electricity to the vehicles? 15 Is the thing going to work? 16 MR. BOLLIER: It does work. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How do we do that? 18 MR. HANSON: You can test it the week before. 19 MR. BOLLIER: Just test it a week before. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Who's going to do that? 21 MR. BOLLIER: We will. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 23 MR. BOLLIER: Just go on -- 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That question is answered. 25 MR. BOLLIER: We'll test it. 8-1-07 Ag 27 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is included in the 2 concession rental? The coolers? Question mark. Coffee pots? 3 Roasters? Cookers? Microwave? What -- who owns what? I 4 really don't know. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have no idea. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't either. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't know that the County 8 owns all that stuff. 9 MR. WALSTON: Some of that belongs to the -- 10 MR. HANSON: Some of it's ours. 11 MR. WALSTON: -- Livestock Association. Some of it 12 belongs to 4-H. Some of it's ours. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Kind of a mixed bag. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: I think generally your ag and 4-H 15 functions kind of cross-use that stuff during their various 16 events. But I don't think it's -- they're for general use, 17 other than those two basic participants, is it, Roy? 18 MR. WALSTON: No. I mean, if somebody's using it, 19 as long as they put it back, I mean, I -- we don't have a 20 problem with that. I mean -- 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I would say, in my mind, 22 just a general concession stand would come with -- you have 23 the ice machine in there would come with it. Refrigerators, 24 big appliance-type items. The -- 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Table top, stove. 8-1-07 Ag 28 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, stove. I would think that 2 the -- those white roasters would not be included. Those are 3 something that would be brought by each event. I think 4 it's -- the big appliances are included, you know. 5 MRS. HANSON: So that would mean, perhaps, the 6 cooler as well for when we're doing a two- or three-day event? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Like, a walk-in cooler. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Walk-in cooler, that's 9 available. 10 MRS. HANSON: If we're using that cooler, -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's included in the 12 concession stand. 13 MRS. HANSON: -- that's included in the concession 14 stand? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Cooler, refrigerator, water, ice 16 machine. That's -- you know, but not the utensils and -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Coffee pots. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Those are not included. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Microwave. 20 MR. HANSON: That probably can be written in 21 somewhere so everybody knows who has what. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, that's true. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 24 MR. HANSON: What's meant by this, what you're 25 getting for your money -- or what we're getting for our money. 8-1-07 Ag 29 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is the shed that is 2 listed in the proposed charges? Shed, s-h-e-d. 3 MRS. HANSON: There's a line item that said "shed." 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The shed rental for -- 5 MRS. HANSON: For $200. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Is that the overhang part of 7 the indoor arena? 8 MS. HYDE: The shed rental? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That back part -- 10 MRS. HANSON: Is that what we call -- we call it the 11 annex, that little -- 12 MR. HANSON: It's, like, 25-foot wide, and -- 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. It's, like -- 14 MR. HANSON: It's on the side against the polo 15 field. 16 MS. HYDE: Right. 17 MRS. HANSON: Where they store all the tractors and 18 equipment. 19 MR. BOLLIER: The pen storage over there on the 20 right-hand side, river side? 21 MR. WALSTON: No. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No. 23 MS. HYDE: No, we're talking on the polo side. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We need to change the name, 25 'cause we obviously don't know what we're talking about. 8-1-07 Ag 30 1 MRS. HANSON: Is that the long shed? 2 MR. BOLLIER: The long shed. Yeah, the long shed. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Long shed. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The long shed now. 5 MR. BOLLIER: It's long and narrow. 6 MRS. HANSON: Yeah, and then it has the -- 7 MR. HANSON: The doors and the -- it actually forms 8 part of the access to the indoor arena. 9 MS. HYDE: Right. 10 MR. HANSON: Do you have to pay -- 11 (Discussion off the record.) 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's where the horse stalls 13 were going to go. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We charge 150 a day for a 15 P.A. system? 16 MRS. HANSON: Wait a minute, wait a minute. We 17 haven't finished the shed. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, I thought we did. 19 MR. HANSON: No. We know what it is now. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 21 MR. HANSON: But, generally, access -- 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're way ahead of us. 23 MR. HANSON: Sorry. The access to the indoor arena 24 is through the shed. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Not necessarily. You can get to it 8-1-07 Ag 31 1 through the back -- or through the front, through the indoor 2 arena. 3 MR. HANSON: Can't close it all off, 'cause there 4 aren't doors all the way through. 5 MR. BOLLIER: Sir? 6 MR. HANSON: There aren't doors all the way. You 7 can't totally close off the shed from the indoor arena, can 8 you? 9 MR. BOLLIER: No. 10 MR. HANSON: No, there aren't roll doors between the 11 two parts of that. 12 MRS. HANSON: The roll doors are on the outside of 13 the shed, and that's also the parking area out there for the 14 arena. So, customarily, our competitors come -- come and go 15 through those doors on that side. 16 MR. HANSON: Access doors. Not storing anything in 17 there; we're just providing access. 18 MRS. HANSON: People walk back and forth through it 19 all the time. Are we going to have to pay $800 to rent the 20 arena? 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think the intent, was it 22 not, is if we had a big garden show out there and they set 23 booths up in that shed area, that's an extra rental? Wasn't 24 that the intent? 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That was the intent. 8-1-07 Ag 32 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Something like a trade show 2 of some kind. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The shed, even though it hasn't 4 -- the shed's on the old sheet. It's not a new thing we 5 added. I'm not so sure you wouldn't just include that with 6 the indoor arena, to me. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's what I think. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I really think you just take out 9 the shed altogether. If you rent the indoor arena, you get 10 the shed with it. If you don't want to use it -- 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Really can't use one without 12 the other. 13 MR. HANSON: Right. You can't differentiate between 14 the two anyway. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Let's delete shed. 16 MS. HYDE: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The long shed. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Long shed. 19 MR. HANSON: Long shed. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That becomes part of the 21 indoor arena. 22 MRS. HANSON: Does that mean you're going to raise 23 the rest of the indoor arena? 24 MS. HYDE: Probably. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're fine on that one. 8-1-07 Ag 33 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: P.A. system, 150 bucks a day. 2 That's too high, basically what she's saying. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The only thing I can say -- 4 MR. HANSON: We won't use it. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You can bring your own system. 6 MR. HANSON: We will. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 'Cause we have nothing but 8 headaches. We spent 10,000 on that system. 9 MR. HANSON: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And it's an expensive system, 11 and for us to rent it out, we need -- 12 MR. HANSON: I understand; you're trying to get some 13 of your money back. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're just trying to pay for the 15 lost mics and things too, but it's just -- it is really 16 expensive because of the feedback, and the system is set up to 17 be able to have three or four different things going on at the 18 same time, which is way more than you all need. 19 MR. HANSON: Yeah, it is. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, it's -- I mean, you would be 21 better off going to Five Star and rent a system, probably. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Trying to get enough money off 23 of it to buy another one when that blows up someday. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's all I'm going to do of 25 y'all's. If you have anything -- 8-1-07 Ag 34 1 MRS. HANSON: Well, I did have one more point when I 2 was working up this letter. Where did you -- if I read 3 everything correctly, and we're not paying extra for the shed, 4 the proposal had increased the cost of us renting the -- the 5 arena more than 100 percent from what we've been paying to 6 what we will be paying, I guess, come December, if y'all vote 7 on this by -- and it goes into effect immediately? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, but you're getting a 9 shed. 10 MR. HANSON: We have the shed. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What do you normally rent? 12 MRS. HANSON: Well, we normally rent the arena, and 13 we've been paying, because we're in-county commercial, $400. 14 We've been paying 75 for the concession, and we've been paying 15 150 for setup and take-down. We've not been charged for the 16 tables and chairs, you know, a few of those, and I didn't put 17 the P.A. in there, 'cause we haven't been charged for that. 18 My total has come up to 625. And, you know, the -- that's for 19 one day to rent. And cleanup deposit was 150. Then we'd go 20 to 600 for the arena, 100 for the concession, 300 to set 21 up/take down. Say we wanted 25 chairs, and that's another 22 100. 25 -- I mean, 25 tables is 100. Another 25 chairs is 23 18.75. The R.V. hookups may be -- you know, we'd recoup that. 24 $150 for the P.A., comes up to 1,268.75. And $300 cleanup 25 deposit. 8-1-07 Ag 35 1 MS. HYDE: Is that for one day? 2 MRS. HANSON: That's for one day. 3 MS. HYDE: For one day, but you're saying $600 for 4 an indoor arena, and it's listed for five. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's five on here. You're not 6 paying for the P.A. because you're not using it. 7 MRS. HANSON: Oh, you dropped it to five. The 8 original one said 600, I'm sorry. The one I was working off 9 of was the one I got in court the other day. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm still having a problem with how 11 you say that's more than doubled. Even at 600, that's a 12 50 percent increase from four to six. 13 MRS. HANSON: Well, the other additional charges, 14 setups and take-downs -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Setup and take-down is more 16 fixed. 17 MRS. HANSON: The tables and the chairs, and if we 18 did pay for the P.A. and all. It came up -- when I added it 19 up, you know, it came up to 1,268. 20 MR. HANSON: Now, if you're using -- that's for a 21 one-day event. If you go to a three-day event, then your 22 setup fee's prorated over the three days. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 24 MR. HANSON: Right. Because you're -- but you're 25 getting hit by the same fee -- fixed fee, whether it be a 8-1-07 Ag 36 1 one-day event or whether it be a five-day event, whatever it 2 may be. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, and that's true. And 4 that's -- you know, the cost to the County is the same whether 5 you set it up one time or -- 6 MR. HANSON: And we do the same when we set up our 7 fee schedule. The first class is always bumped up heavier. 8 That's what we use to pay the judges, air fare and everything 9 else. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: One thing that has to be 11 done -- that I believe has to be done for your event is that 12 arena has to be compacted. 13 MR. HANSON: Yes, it does. 14 MRS. HANSON: Yes. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And then it has to -- you 16 know, to get ready for a roping a week later, it takes a long 17 time to get it ready. If it's never compacted, it doesn't 18 take very long. And so that -- you know, it's one of those 19 things, and it takes a while to get it ready to compact so 20 it's nice and flat. 21 MRS. HANSON: Ours is not compacted as tightly as we 22 would be for, like, the home show or wild game dinner or 23 something like that. We want it a little bit fluffy. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just a little bit fluffed up? 25 MRS. HANSON: Yeah. Shel's getting very good at 8-1-07 Ag 37 1 fluffing for us. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Extra charge for fluffing. 3 MR. HANSON: We have at times -- 4 MS. HYDE: Let me write "fluffing fee" down. 5 MR. HANSON: Fluffing fee, right. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: That will put it up to more than 7 double, you're right, with a fluffing fee added. 8 MR. HANSON: Yeah. But we've also said that -- you 9 know, we've kept the barriers up along the side, because -- so 10 that saves the take-down of those side barriers and the chutes 11 for running the cattle through to the pens. 12 MRS. HANSON: Just take down the two ends. 13 MR. HANSON: We just ask for the two ends to be 14 taken down. So, we've -- you know -- 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's where all the work is. 16 MR. HANSON: -- it swings around -- 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's where all the work is. 18 That's where the chutes are. If you leave the side panels up, 19 that's easy. 20 MR. HANSON: We've had times they've left the chutes 21 and we've had to work around it. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 23 MR. HANSON: And, so, when you're paying this much 24 money, you should be -- you should know what you're going to 25 get. 8-1-07 Ag 38 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We've checked with some other 2 local areas, one of them being Gillespie County, I believe, 3 and one was -- 4 MS. HYDE: Kendall. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What was the other one? 6 MS. HYDE: Kendall. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Kendall, and also -- 8 MS. HYDE: Boerne. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah -- or Burnet. 10 MS. HYDE: Burnet. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Burnet. And we're at $50 less 12 than they are. 13 MR. HANSON: Okay. And Kendall County has a 14 facility that's 300 feet long by 100 wide. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, this one's 300 by 150. 16 MR. HANSON: Yeah, but I'm thinking between poles. 17 Where in Kendall County is that? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're not going to tell you. 19 (Laughter.) 20 MRS. HANSON: Well, I checked too, and there's a 21 site in San Marcos for $675 that's all-inclusive. And there's 22 a site in College Station that's air-conditioned for $350 a 23 day, all-inclusive. 24 MR. HANSON: From that -- we're actually paying that 25 facility in College Station, and then they own it. 8-1-07 Ag 39 1 MRS. HANSON: Alton has one for $400 a day. It's 2 heated, but not air-conditioned. These are all covered arenas 3 like our rodeo arena where other dog shows take place. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I think our fee 5 structure is, in our mind, reasonable. And we're not -- I 6 mean, but what we're looking at more than anything else is 7 trying to at least pay what it costs to set it up. The County 8 -- I shouldn't say the County. My view is we shouldn't 9 subsidize your organization or any other organization. 10 MR. HANSON: No, we're not asking you to. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And we probably still are to a 12 degree, because of the -- the manpower. We pay someone to be 13 out there all day, do the setup, take-down. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The trash. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Haul the trash off. There's a 16 lot of expenses that we bear. And, you know, we're just -- 17 you know, we're not trying -- we're just basically trying to 18 break even. We're not trying to make a profit out of this. 19 MR. HANSON: We're just trying to understand what 20 we're facing when we book that facility. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 22 MR. HANSON: I know Bruce has said that there was 23 some issue in the last go-round when we lost our October date 24 and we got bumped to a December date; that's what we could all 25 fit in. But when -- you know, when the truth came out, we 8-1-07 Ag 40 1 didn't know anything about our October date going to somebody 2 else, that we tried to book it. So, that's one of the reasons 3 we're here, is to try to find out what's going on. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The other issue on that is that 5 we are working on and will be implementing much more of a 6 computerized booking calendar, so that we -- and it can be on 7 the internet. We can have it on the internet on our web site; 8 we can put it up there so you can -- the public can look and 9 say these dates are -- it's used for this, and people can 10 start planning three years out. 11 MR. HANSON: That's good. 12 MRS. HANSON: I like that. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's the direction where we're 14 trying to get, and to get it off of the, you know, calendar 15 with things scratched on it. It has to be a much more formal 16 system, and whenever we can get this done, it'll be on our web 17 site. It will help everyone in -- you know, a lot more fixed 18 that way. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's been very loosely 20 operated, in my opinion, for a long time. 21 MR. HANSON: It has. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This is tightening up the 23 screws. We're going to get this thing under control. We are 24 going to get the right charges for the right events, and the 25 money be put into the bank, and there won't be somebody making 8-1-07 Ag 41 1 a decision that says, "Oh, well, we'll just let you have it 2 for 25 percent," you know, without getting Court approval or 3 being on the list that allows that sort of thing to happen. 4 And that's kind of where we've been, I think, for a long time. 5 And I think our revenues will prove it once we implement 6 the -- the new plan. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You are under the local 8 commercial? 9 MR. HANSON: I believe so. We're not a nonprofit 10 organization. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- on the rate structure -- 12 and this is a discussion that we haven't had yet, as to who 13 goes into what category. We haven't, you know, had that. It 14 is -- my recommendation is probably that we try to simplify it 15 a lot. But the system we're going to, you know, is going to 16 give a discount of either 25 percent -- everyone's going to 17 fill in the same form; then you get a discount at the end. 18 MR. HANSON: One of the things that -- 19 MRS. HANSON: How are you going to accomplish -- go 20 ahead. 21 MR. HANSON: Finish this discussion first. 22 MRS. HANSON: I was wondering, how is it going to be 23 decided who gets a discount, what, when, where? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We'll decide if we're going to 25 do the same, local -- the same categories. We haven't 8-1-07 Ag 42 1 discussed it as a Court. It will be probably at our next 2 court date, I guess, we'll actually vote on all these issues. 3 MRS. HANSON: So, you might still have the three 4 tiers possibly, instead of -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's just -- it's going to be -- 6 you know, we're just working on the base thing. And then who 7 gets discounts, whether we're going to think that local 8 commercial should be treated differently than other 9 commercial, you know, I can argue both sides of that pretty 10 easily. 11 MR. HANSON: One of the things that we have done on 12 some of the money that we've taken in is, we've hired Center 13 Point school kids to work the show, and then that money gets 14 paid into that Center Point School District account. Doesn't 15 go directly to the kids. And so it helps fund some of their 16 school activities, like trips and the like. And -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's good. 18 MR. HANSON: We can't keep on doing it. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm sure they appreciate that. 20 MR. HANSON: Hope so. 21 MRS. HANSON: Yeah, I think they do. 22 MR. HANSON: So, anyway -- so we are a nonprofit, 23 almost. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Almost. You're a good 25 commercial citizen. 8-1-07 Ag 43 1 MR. HANSON: Can I get that in writing? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So far. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, what else, guys? 5 (Discussion off the record.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. What else you got, 7 Mr. Oehler? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't have a thing. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're at the point to put it on 10 the agenda. This was just trying to go through it, go over 11 some of these items, who goes to what categories, on the next 12 agenda and vote on the structure. 13 MS. HYDE: I have a -- yeah, I have a little bit of 14 a question. Maybe not, if y'all throw stuff at me. But when 15 we do things, like with the 4-H, the old policy -- the current 16 policy states that 4-H has to turn their stuff in in January, 17 all of it for the year. But I don't -- I don't think -- I 18 think it was you -- I hope it was you. One of y'all said, you 19 know, that's really kind of -- you can't really do the whole 20 year in January. So, do we want to -- are we going to give 21 them flexibility? Or if somebody says, "I want to book it," 22 and then they -- the 4-H wants to book it for something, how 23 would we -- how would we, like, determine that? 24 MR. WALSTON: We can give you dates starting -- I 25 mean, we start -- let's see here -- in July, scheduling all 8-1-07 Ag 44 1 the way through next year. Our problem's going to be two 2 years from now. You know, we can give you for next year, but 3 -- and we can give you for two years from now, but we may not 4 need them. So -- 5 MS. HYDE: Do you know what I'm saying? 6 MR. WALSTON: I mean, we can book them. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think what you do -- I mean, I 8 think you -- all the 4-H dates get plugged in that are 9 possible, and then if someone calls in that wants it for 10 three-day events or some kind of a deal, the booking person 11 contacts 4-H and says, "Okay, here's the date. This date, you 12 know, has been requested. You all absolutely need it that 13 day?" 14 MR. WALSTON: Yeah. And that's what we've been 15 doing, and there's certain days that we're pretty well set on 16 all -- been set for -- done it those dates forever. So, I 17 mean, we know those are going to be there. And there's just a 18 few of those that come up. And, yeah, if somebody books on 19 top of us, I mean, if they'll -- and, you know, we've got 20 Alyce in there; she'll holler at us and say, "Are y'all having 21 this?" We'll say yeah or no. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I have one question on this 24 receiving and receipt procedure. Number 13's pretty clear; we 25 want to make certain that the money is directed to Kerr County 8-1-07 Ag 45 1 Treasurer, and that's pretty clear. That's good. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm curious as to why -- in 4 Number 4 and 5, booking agent's going to have electronic 5 format to fill in out there. So, I'm going to go out to the 6 Extension Office to book the facility; I'm going to work with 7 the booking agent. The booking agent's going to fill out the 8 form electronically right then and there, and then I have to 9 go to the Treasurer's office to sign that. Why do I have to 10 go to the Treasurer's office? Why can't that be done there, 11 and the check given to that, and then all that is accompanied 12 by the booking agent to the Treasurer? Why are we running 13 people back and forth up and down Highway 27? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Because we're the government. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, that's the answer. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We'll need to address the 17 booking agent too at some point, whether we want do it -- stay 18 where it is, or whether it needs to be somewhere else. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let's think that out a 20 little bit. 21 MS. HYDE: Because we didn't want people to, more 22 than -- we didn't want multiple people to handle money. I 23 mean, it was that simple. We were -- according to our old 24 policy, it was supposed to be cashier's check or money order. 25 It wasn't supposed to be cash. But there's a lot of cash. 8-1-07 Ag 46 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 13, "All checks, money 2 orders, bank cashier's checks made out to Kerr County 3 Treasurer." 4 MS. HYDE: When we talked with the new Treasurer and 5 the new Auditor, especially here in the last couple of weeks, 6 they're very much so that they wouldn't want to give it to 7 somebody elsewhere. They have to make another trip down here 8 as well. Now, they're suggesting that perhaps we take it away 9 from out on Highway 27 and bring it right here in the 10 courthouse, where it's all in one, all in one shop. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's an alternative. And 12 that takes care of somebody running up and down Highway 27 to 13 take care of this paperwork. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's right. 15 MS. HYDE: But that's just one of the suggestions. 16 That would have to be determined in Commissioners Court. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think we ought to think 18 that one out, talk that through. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, we may subsequently enact that 20 particular aspect of it as part of the overall policy. That's 21 certainly an option. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. That's all I got. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Anybody else? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Roy's got his hand up. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Y'all done? 8-1-07 Ag 47 1 MR. WALSTON: I just noticed on here, the outdoor 2 arena is listed as far as for booking. Are y'all going to 3 book the outdoor arena? Are we going to keep booking it? Or 4 are we going -- 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll tell you how I feel about 6 that. 7 MR. WALSTON: Okay. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll probably get in trouble 9 for it, but I'm going to say it anyway. You know, Maintenance 10 Department goes out and keeps that thing up. They water it, 11 they plow it, they get it ready for events, and if it's not 12 being used, I think the County ought to be able to recoup some 13 expenses by renting it. And I don't see that that -- it's 14 County-owned property. Yes, the 4-H Horse Club has it -- has 15 a long-term lease. But I can't imagine -- and we just got 16 through cleaning up all the pens just two weeks ago. I mean, 17 the weeds were up like that, and we had people -- I mean, if 18 we're going to -- if the 4-H wants to do all of that, then I 19 think the 4-H ought to get the revenue from the rental. But 20 if the County and community service and the trustees are going 21 to do it with our own people, then it ought to be able to be 22 rented by the County. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree with that. 24 MR. WALSTON: We can -- I mean, I can bring it up to 25 the 4-H group and tell them, see if y'all want to maintain it. 8-1-07 Ag 48 1 If you don't, they're going to -- 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's right. You want to go 3 keep the weeds mowed and keep it -- 4 MR. WALSTON: Because we book it just like we do 5 everything else. I mean, we book it ahead of time, and 6 it's -- 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You get the tractor and you do 8 it. 9 MR. WALSTON: I don't think they'll have a problem. 10 I don't think that's going to be -- 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I just -- it's just not fair, 12 in my opinion. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, you need to give them the 14 option. 15 MR. WALSTON: Yeah. If they want to maintain it, 16 which I don't think they want to, but... 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But even if they chose to 18 maintain it, I think it's going to be important that the 19 booking of that gets on the same booking calendar with 20 everything else, because it has an impact. If that's being 21 used for an event, it impacts other uses of that property 22 also. 23 MR. WALSTON: Yeah. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it all needs to be -- 25 MR. WALSTON: That's where originally we got into 8-1-07 Ag 49 1 some problems with trying to double-book it. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It has a staffing impact. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Staffing impact also. Just 4 people impact, parking and -- and how many people may be -- 5 you know, the intent -- if that's being used with a pretty big 6 event and there's another event, he may think me needs two 7 people out there as opposed to one, and that's the kind of 8 thing that we need to know in advance. 9 MR. WALSTON: Okay, that's fine. I just wanted to 10 double-check and see. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Good point. Thank you for bringing 12 that up. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Thank you. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else, gentlemen? Let's fold 15 it up. We'll be adjourned. 16 (Commissioners Court workshop adjourned at 5:24 p.m.) 17 - - - - - - - - - - 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 8-1-07 Ag 50 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my 5 capacity as County Clerk of the Commissioners Court 6 of Kerr County, Texas, at the time and place 7 heretofore set forth. 8 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 5th day of 9 September, 2007. 10 11 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 12 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 13 Certified Shorthand Reporter 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 8-1-07 Ag