1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Regular Session 10 Monday, October 8, 2007 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X October 8, 2007 2 PAGE -- Commissioners' Comments 5 3 1.1 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action 4 regarding Sheriff's Department vehicles 12 5 1.5 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to accept the resignation of Robert. L. Weinberg from the 6 Alamo Area Seniors Advisory Committee with thanks and appreciation, and appoint Margie G. Jetton to 7 this position effective immediately 27 8 1.2 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for preliminary plat for Vistas Grande, Pct. 2 28 9 1.3 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 10 change the public hearings set for November 12, 2007, to November 13, 2007, due to holiday schedule 39 11 1.4 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 12 reduce letter for escrow on interest-bearing account from BTEX Ranch, L.P. for Privilege 13 Creek, a/k/a Boerne Falls Ranch, Pct. 3 41 14 1.6 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to formulate and adopt policy on Kerr County's 15 funding or funding formula in future years for the Butt-Holdsworth Memorial Library 49 16 1.7 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 17 authorize use of portable stage maintained at Youth Exhibit Center for Families and Literacy 18 street dance at reduced or no cost 58 19 1.8 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to adopt an order expressing official intent to reimburse 20 with tax exempt obligation proceeds for costs associated with constructing or acquiring various 21 improvements within the county 63 22 1.9 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for a motion to ratify motion to approve the language 23 in House Bill 3195, which states that the Commissioner's Court adopted a budget on September 24 28, 2007, that raised more revenue from property taxes than in the previous year 69 25 3 1 I N D E X (Continued) October 8, 2007 2 PAGE 1.10 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 3 nominate and elect Appraisal District Board of Directors members for the 2008 and 2009 term 71, 106 4 1.11 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 5 approve the new contract, policies and procedures, and the list of organizations which receive 6 discounts at the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center 72 7 1.12 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to adopt 8 TCDRS plan for 2008 79 9 1.13 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on interlocal agreement with Kendall County and the 10 City of Kerrville for EMS in the Falling Waters subdivision area 86, 108 11 1.14 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 12 ratify TXDOT condemnation acquisition of 3.954 acres at airport and authorize County Judge to 13 sign closing documents on behalf of Kerr County in connection with such acquisition 91 14 15 4.1 Pay Bills 92 4.2 Budget Amendments 97 16 4.3 Late Bills -- 4.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 101 17 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee 18 Assignments 101 19 1.15 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action, if any, on pending proposal(s) by letter of intent to 20 lease a portion of the Kerr County Juvenile Detention Facility to Cornerstone Programs 21 Corporation (Executive Session) 105 22 --- Adjourned 112 23 24 25 4 1 On Monday, October 8, 2007, at 9:00 a.m., a regular 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in the 3 Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, Kerrville, 4 Texas, and the following proceedings were had in open court: 5 P R O C E E D I N G S 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. 7 Let me call to order this regular meeting of the Kerr County 8 Commissioners Court scheduled and posted for this time and 9 date, Monday, the 8th of October of 2007, at 9 a.m. It is 10 that time now. Commissioner Williams? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Will you please rise and 12 join me for a word of prayer, followed by the pledge of 13 allegiance to our flag. 14 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. At this time, if there's 16 any member of the public that wishes to be heard on any 17 matter that is not a listed agenda item, feel free to come 18 forward at this time and tell us what's on your mind. If you 19 wish to be heard on an agenda item, we'd ask that you fill 20 out a participation form. They can be found at the rear of 21 the room. It's not essential, but it helps me to be aware 22 that there's someone that wishes to be heard on that issue, 23 and hopefully not miss them when we get to that item. But if 24 you fail to fill out a participation form and want to be 25 heard on an item, just get my attention when we get to that 10-8-07 5 1 item in some fashion, and I'll see that you have an 2 opportunity to be heard. But right now, if there's any 3 member of the public that wishes to be heard on any matter 4 that is not a listed agenda item, please feel free to come 5 forward at this time. Seeing no one coming forward, we will 6 move on. Commissioner Williams, what do you have for us this 7 morning? 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't have anything. I'm 9 just ready to do our business. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Commissioner Letz? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just one minor thing, just to 12 pass on before I forget; it's a message from a committee out 13 of Comfort that's been looking at incorporation, and they 14 have -- I think they're going to go down that road and try to 15 incorporate Comfort. They have met with Judge Schroeder in 16 Kendall County about it, which is basically the only -- the 17 reason it may not happen. So, depending on what they 18 negotiate with Kendall County. I know their committee has 19 spent a lot of time looking at Ingram, primarily, locally as 20 to how Kerr County and Ingram worked through that process. 21 But the reason for bringing it forward today is that they 22 will also be incorporating part of Kerr County into Comfort, 23 pulling it in, which makes sense. And they wanted to make 24 sure that we didn't feel slighted, in Kerr County, that they 25 went to Kendall County first. I assured them that that's a 10-8-07 6 1 far bigger hurdle, if they have to work out a deal with 2 Kendall County, than with Kerr. We don't have that much 3 involvement, just a few streets and things. But, anyway, 4 it's an interesting time for them going down that road. It's 5 taken a long time to get to this point. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Where was the first county 7 seat of Kerr County? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it was Comfort. 9 MR. ODOM: It was in Kerr County. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: West Kerr County. 11 MR. ODOM: It was in Kerr County. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bruce's house. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, right. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, before Kendall County 15 existed. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's it. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I just want to remind 19 everybody that this Saturday, starting at 4 o'clock, Mountain 20 Home Volunteer Fire Department, we're going to be frying 21 fish, and want everybody to come that can and wants to come. 22 And -- and there's no advance tickets. The way you pay for 23 it is by donation only, to help fund the fire department, and 24 it's the second annual. It's taken them a long time to get 25 used to having a fundraiser, but they're going to be doing 10-8-07 7 1 some, hopefully, building program here in one of these years, 2 and they'd like for people to come and help them out. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are you cooking? 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes, sir, frying fish. Rex 5 is going to help, and quite a few others. So, if you're 6 hungry on Saturday, well, come out and have some fish. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: What time? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Starts at 4:00, probably 9 serve about 5:00, till it runs out. Cooking 150 pounds of 10 catfish. That's it. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the raffle issue, $1 per 12 ticket, and there is some major, major prizes. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm, I was going to mention that. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I got that list yesterday, 15 and, heck, I'm going to go. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, well, you should. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I should; that is true. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You have to be present? 'Cause 19 there's another -- I have to be at a Fishes and Loaves dinner 20 for my -- possibly both of my children will be performing in 21 Comfort. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, they're $1 with the 23 fire department, but if you buy them here today, they're $2. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: $2. (Laughter.) 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Give us a little gas money. 10-8-07 8 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's right. I'm selling 2 them, too. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I've got a couple of 4 things. One, a month or so ago, today was a holiday, and so 5 I set up some doctor's appointments and things that I can't 6 get out of, so around 11:00 or so, I'm going to disappear and 7 go take care of those things that I've committed myself to. 8 Number two, there is a small debate, I understand, out in the 9 community about who voted for the salary increases, and I 10 understand that there's a side that's -- I'm a hero because I 11 voted against it, and then there's a side that I'm a villain 12 because I voted for it. Well, I'm here to set the record 13 straight. I voted for it, and I'll not back up from that. 14 I -- I deserve a salary increase just like everybody else on 15 -- on earth. So, I did vote for it, and I'm not a hero to 16 those -- that particular group of people, and that's fine 17 with me. I got to tell you, to me, that -- that kind of 18 stuff is just silliness. When you -- when you hear these 19 debates out there and people getting kind of vicious about 20 them damn Commissioners raising their salaries, you know, 21 that to me is just absolute silliness. There -- there are so 22 many things that -- that should be debated. 23 One that comes to my mind that, if people want to 24 really get in a debate and talk about real dollars and cents, 25 let's talk about the district courts, the two district courts 10-8-07 9 1 in this county. Two district courts in this one county. 2 Personally, I like the idea of having one single district in 3 Kerr County where you have one sitting judge that takes care 4 of Kerr County only. I don't know that we'll ever get to 5 that point, but if I had the opportunity to vote, I would 6 vote that way. But we have two, and both of them are 7 extremely expensive. One of them -- and part of the district 8 court system is the D.A.'s office, and one of them is housed 9 out in another county, so taxpayers -- Kerr County taxpayers' 10 money gets up and leaves and goes to Junction. Just part of 11 the debate. And I don't know if that's going to continue 12 when the lieutenant -- I understand the lieutenant's running 13 for that position up there, and I don't know if he lives in 14 Junction or where he lives. I don't care. But, you know, if 15 you wanted a real debate, that is -- that's something that we 16 should all talk about, I think. If you -- 'cause you're 17 talking about real dollars and cents there when you start 18 looking at all of the things that the district court system 19 has in it. So -- y'all keep looking over at Rex, I think. 20 Has he got his handcuffs out? 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Not yet. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Anyway, that's my little 23 soapbox for the day. And, you know, arguing -- and people 24 arguing about whether I should have a salary increase or not 25 is ludicrous, silly, and they need to get a job and do 10-8-07 10 1 something with theirselves. And -- but if you want a debate, 2 let's talk about district courts in Kerr County. There's a 3 debate with real money. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree with you on the 5 salary issue, and I supported you on it. I voted for it, 6 'cause I don't believe any elected official is a second-class 7 citizen. Enough said. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Only comment I'll make on that 9 one is that I wish they would get their facts straight when 10 they write these articles. And the issue of -- and this is 11 just -- maybe it's an education problem that maybe we should 12 take more time on. It's a little bit different, what we do 13 and what City Council does. If you look at their agenda, I 14 think we're -- we were compared to the City Council working 15 free or whatever that is, $25, and I think if you look at our 16 responsibilities compared to theirs, I think it's a little 17 bit different. But we haven't done a very good job of 18 educating the public. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They lose sight of the fact 20 that the City Manager earns as much as this entire Court to 21 do all their work for them. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: As Dennis Miller would say, you 23 don't want to get off on a rant. However, you do have 24 something on your mind, right? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's true. 10-8-07 11 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Speaking of -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't think you'd call 3 that a rant, though, Judge. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Maybe a rave. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: A rave. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Speaking of getting your facts 8 straight, we have someone I'd like to introduce; Mr. Jeff 9 Wright with the Daily Times who's here with us for the first 10 time this morning, at least the first time to my knowledge. 11 I've not seen him previously. Welcome. Hope that you get 12 your facts straight. 13 MR. WRIGHT: Me too. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: But we appreciate you being here. 15 The other thing that I want to mention -- couple things. One 16 is, there are some tremendous auction -- silent auction items 17 at this Mountain Home Volunteer Fire Department function. I 18 haven't seen the list for this year, but I know what they 19 were last year, 'cause I was there. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Some good stuff. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: And they got some really, really 22 neat stuff. Good crowd. Good time was had by everybody. 23 The other thing I'd like to mention is, this coming Friday, 24 the 12th, right out here, we will be dedicating the Frances 25 Lehmann pavilion. The 12th, Friday, 2 p.m. All of you that 10-8-07 12 1 can be there, we'd like for you to be there, and I think it's 2 going to be a -- a good and appropriate event. And, 3 fortunately, we'll be able to have the entire Lehmann family 4 there, so any of you that can be there, why, please join us. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, I have one quickie; 6 you just reminded me. I'm advised that Senator John Cornyn 7 will be guest speaker for the Republican Women of Kerr 8 County, a noon appearance on the 27th of October at the Inn 9 of the Hills. There will be more details about this coming 10 out, but this, I believe, was the date, and the good 11 senator's coming to town. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that also a Friday? 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I believe it's a Saturday, 14 Judge. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay, let's get on down to 16 business here. First item on the agenda, consider, discuss, 17 and take appropriate action regarding Sheriff's Department 18 vehicles. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, gentleman, you asked me 20 to bring it back, so that's what we're doing. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: We asked to you bring the item back, 22 not the vehicles, Sheriff. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We brought you the vehicle, 24 too. I figured we'll do a little bit better. As most of you 25 have seen, there is one of the vehicles sitting out there. 10-8-07 13 1 One of the misconceptions, I think, that a lot of people have 2 had is that what we're trying to do is get luxury vehicles. 3 That is not what this is. We're a rural county. I need 4 vehicles that are dependable, that are more cost-efficient 5 than the Crown Vics. And I need to be able to go through 6 some water, at least without totaling out a vehicle because 7 of where the air intake sits on the Crown Vics is too low, 8 right behind the wheel well. The air intake on the Tahoe 9 sits up on top. We also have a lot of areas in the county, 10 as most of you are aware of, such as Guadalupe Ranch Estates, 11 Primrose, Elm Pass II additions, not -- not the public 12 maintained roads that Mr. Odom keeps, because I think Kerr 13 County does have some of the best paved roads of any county 14 around, and I think we can all attest to that. But, 15 unfortunately, paved roads in the rural county is not where 16 the Sheriff's Office does most of our business. We're not 17 the highway patrol; I don't have them just out there on the 18 highways. I have them out in these subdivisions. A lot of 19 them are public access, but not public roads, and a lot of 20 our calls are out there. One real quick example is just a 21 few months ago, we had a deal about -- started about 22 4 o'clock in the morning where we had a group of citizens 23 that had been out all night. Some of them stayed a little 24 bit longer than they probably should have. They got on 25 four-wheelers, went back in their ranch, and nobody had heard 10-8-07 14 1 from them. And these -- it was two ladies without shoes on. 2 It was cold; it was freezing weather. This was, like I said, 3 a few months ago, and they called needing help. You could 4 not get into that ranch, into those roads where they could 5 have gone on that four-wheeler, in a Crown Vic. It doesn't 6 stand high enough. The Crown Vic stands 5.6 inches off the 7 ground, and that's before your shocks and everything else. 8 And I know it's kind of funny, but all of y'all know about 9 the one the other day that hit a raccoon and tore a radiator 10 out from underneath it. And, you know, I mean, that's 11 sitting pretty low, okay? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I can't believe you keep 13 saying that. 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, it happens, and I'm not 15 going to deny it. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: A coon tore up your car. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes, Crown Vic. Tore the 18 bottom out from a radiator. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Big coon or small car? 20 What? 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Low car, and big coon. But we 22 do have these problems in Kerr County. I'm asking for one 23 Tahoe -- which is a police package. It's built for police 24 work. It's built for pursuit work. It's built to -- to 25 uphold to the rigors of police work. It's got dual batteries 10-8-07 15 1 in it for the electrical components and everything else. And 2 I need the four on -- one on each shift, which is four, okay? 3 Some of the differences, if you wanted to know, the gas tank 4 capacity is 26 gallons in the Tahoe. It's 19 gallons in the 5 Crown Vic. It gets around -- a little bit better gas 6 mileage, which was asked one time. The Tahoe is stated at 16 7 in the city, 20 on the highway. On the Crown Vic, it's 14 in 8 the city and 21 on the highway. So, in reality, even though 9 the Tahoe has a little bit bigger engine, the 5.3 compared to 10 the 4.6, it does do a little bit better, and it's designed 11 for police work, specifically designed for it. And so I'm 12 still asking that we get four Tahoes and one Crown Vic, which 13 because interest rates have dropped down, is a total of -- I 14 think we budgeted 57,000, and what we had for a four-year 15 term is 54,209.53. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 54 what? 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: $54,209.53 per year for a 18 four-year lease. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Times four. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's four Tahoes and one 21 Crown Vic. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That includes the Crown Vic 23 also? 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. I just really wanted the 25 four Tahoes. The other thing about it -- and I think 10-8-07 16 1 Mr. Brian Brooks can tell you also; he's with Holiday Motors, 2 who sells the Vic under the D.P.S. contract. D.P.S. is going 3 to them; they're buying another hundred and something this 4 year to replace their pickups with. Plano Police Department 5 did a long-term study on the comparison between the Crown Vic 6 and the Tahoe, and found that, cost-effectiveness, the Tahoe 7 was better than the Crown Vic. It's got a 100,000 mile -- 8 5-year, 100,000-mile power train warranty on it, where the 9 Crown Vic has a 5-year, 60,000 miles. And, as we all know, 10 we don't get rid of them in five years. It's the mileage 11 that goes up, and this County's always kept ours over that. 12 So, that part's better, and just the reliability is better, 13 and he's here to answer any questions you might have as to 14 the design. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's in the budget right now, 16 the number? 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 57. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 57? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't have any problem 20 with it. I think the Sheriff's made his case for the need. 21 I'm not troubled by it. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Sheriff, there was one mention made 23 outside in response to an inquiry I made about overall value, 24 and your dealer rep indicated to me some information. I'd 25 like for him to repeat that for the Court's benefit. 10-8-07 17 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Sure. On the resale? 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All the information. 3 MR. BROOKS: Are you talking about the resale 4 value, sir? 5 JUDGE TINLEY: The overall value. 6 MR. BROOKS: Overall value. Well, part of that 7 study that Plano did was the residual value at the end of the 8 service life of a vehicle. Plano generally goes 100,000 9 miles before they flip a vehicle, and I just took -- just on 10 Friday of last week, took an '04 Tahoe police vehicle in 11 trade, 115,000 miles; we allowed 7,250 on trade-in. Crown 12 Vics in the same mileage range, you're looking at 500 to 13 1,000 residual value. So, the -- the difference is that 14 we've gone as high as 9,000 on a trade-in on a police Tahoe 15 that had -- this one had had previous body damage to it that 16 was repaired. Ones that we've had that haven't had no body 17 damage, we've allowed $9,000 on trade-in for vehicles that 18 have 100,000 miles on them. So -- 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The last Crown Vics we did 20 trade in to Philpott Motors, who has the contract on the 21 Crown Vics -- the last ones we traded in to them, we got $300 22 a piece. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: What's the mileage on them, roughly? 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Our mileage is roughly between 25 150,000 and 170,000. 10-8-07 18 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: After how many years? 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That was after -- five? 3 MR. BARTON: Five. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: About five -- five, six years. 5 DEPUTY BEHRENS: 2000's. Those were 2000's. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: What -- what about the residual 7 value when they get up to 150,000? 8 MR. BROOKS: I would say the value on those would 9 be in excess of $4,000 each, even at a hundred -- we have 10 Tahoes that we've taken in at 180,000 miles; we've allowed 11 $4,000 a piece for them. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What -- refresh my memory. 14 What's in the budget right now? 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 57,000. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: No, not the dollars. What vehicles 17 are in the capital -- on your list? 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: There aren't, because last 19 Commissioners Court, we took them all out and decided to 20 bring it back here. Buster had made the motion for one -- 21 was it four Crown Vics and one Tahoe the last time? And then 22 I argued that, and it's gone back and forth, so it was said 23 that I wouldn't do anything until after this Court -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I knew you -- I knew you were 25 bringing it back. I just thought we -- I thought we didn't 10-8-07 19 1 change anything. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: We didn't change the amount in the 3 budget. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. But we took out -- 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: The amount in the budget remained 7 the same, and that's what we're working from, is what's 8 budgeted. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And the only addition -- now, 10 this would be the 54,209, and, you know, we still have to do 11 the decaling on them, which the decaling normally runs 395 a 12 piece, but that's whether we get the Crown Vics or the 13 Tahoes; we still have to do the decals. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All that other stuff is in 15 it, like the two cage -- there's two cages in it, I 16 understand, and both of those are in there. And that little 17 box that's in the back end to put your weapons and -- 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't know if the box -- the 19 storage box is not there. You have the back end. It does 20 have the digital camera, the cages, the radio, the sirens, 21 the light bar. Which this light bar actually even has a 22 directional signal on it for -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Have you asked the guy to 24 give you a box? 25 MR. BROOKS: They're 250 for that box. 10-8-07 20 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How much? 2 MR. BROOKS: 250. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You can do two of them, 4 then. We'll buy one if he'll do two. (Laughter.) 5 Otherwise, you may not sell anything here today at all. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Our resident Monty Hall over here. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But these do -- the Tahoes do 8 already come with the deer guard/brush guard on them, where 9 the Crown Vics, we have to have them installed, and they're 10 $500 a piece. And these are already in that price. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Light bars, -- 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Everything. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- radio systems that are 14 already tuned up to our system? 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Put the chip in. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Put the chip in and it's 18 ready to go. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We normally -- all our Crown 20 Vics we've gotten in the past, normally everything is in 21 them. Everything is there except for the decaling and the 22 deer guards. That's just the way they're purchased. And on 23 the Tahoes, everything is there except the decaling. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What does it do when you add 25 two Tahoes and three Crown Vics? 10-8-07 21 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, the biggest -- 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Surely you have those 3 numbers. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, not two; I did go three. 5 I figured you might ask. Because if -- if I went at least 6 three, Bruce, then what I would do is put my Expedition on 7 the road to be the fourth one, so that we would have four of 8 those type of vehicles on that and put one on every shift. 9 And then we'd do three Tahoes, two Crown Vics, and one of the 10 Crown Vics just plain-jane, without the equipment, which 11 would lower the price, too, and I'd drive a plain-jane Crown 12 Vic. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's that budget? 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That budget for four years 15 would be 49,038 per year. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What is it -- what would -- do 17 you have that number for three years? 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Three years would be 63,500. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Have we set up most of your 20 purchases in the past on four or three? 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Three. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Three. We set some of them 23 up on four. 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I think the first year, when 25 the County went to six vehicles, if I'm not mistaken, that 10-8-07 22 1 one may have been four, because that was the first year the 2 County went to the lease. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think you're right. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: When I took office, and then 5 after that, we dropped it down to five vehicles and went 6 three years. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How many miles do you drive a 8 year on average? 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: On average, 35,000 on patrol. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do you have a number on the two 11 Crown Vics on three years -- excuse me -- and the Tahoes on 12 four? 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He just happens to have it. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Three Tahoes. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: May not have it broke down 16 that way. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: What is it a year on each vehicle? 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: On the Tahoes, for -- well 19 that's four Tahoes. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: What is it for one? 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. 22 (Discussion off the record.) 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Give him four Tahoes; he can 24 divide it by four. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Unit price of a Tahoe is 41,3 10-8-07 23 1 -- or 41,487. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that total contract price? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's total. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that total sales price, or lease 5 contract, total pay? 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That is total price of the 7 vehicle. That's before you'd add in leasing it, you know. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: At whatever interest, okay. 10 The purchase price of the vehicle. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Give him the lease price for 12 four of them. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: For four? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay, I can do that. The 16 lease price on a three-year term -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, four-year. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Four-year term. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On Tahoes. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: On four Tahoes only is 21 45,337.56. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Then what's the lease -- 23 JUDGE TINLEY: What's the Crown Vic? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- on Crown Vics? 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: On one -- 10-8-07 24 1 JUDGE TINLEY: For three years. 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: On two for three years is 3 19,409.23, and that's one of the Crown Vics equipped and one 4 not. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 6 (Discussion off the record.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: That can't be right, Sheriff. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's three-year. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: That's an annual cost? 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's three-year. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Two vehicles. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Two vehicles, three years. 13 One equipped, one not. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We're mixing apples and 15 oranges. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's a three-year lease. 17 And the Tahoes, 45,000 is a four-year lease. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: The 45,000 figure, -- 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: -- is that the unit cost with all 21 the lease costs rolled in? 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's four Tahoes totally for 23 four-year lease with everything included. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 45,000 divided by four gives us 25 the unit of the lease. 10-8-07 25 1 JUDGE TINLEY: They're not $11,000 a piece. 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, per year. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 45,000 per year. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: For four years. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: For four years. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. So that you got 8 rollup costs of about 4,000 per vehicle. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's 45,337.56. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: About 59,000, then. 58, 59. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: And your Crown Vic was -- for two 12 was 19? 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 19,409.23. That's three-year 14 lease on those. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mm-hmm. What's third year -- 16 Judge? 34 -- 17 JUDGE TINLEY: $34,002, less -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Plus 19,409, is -- 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 50. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- 54,000. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah. If you did three Tahoes 22 for four years, it's $34,027.03. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: 53,4. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's my motion. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's three Tahoes. 10-8-07 26 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My motion is three Tahoes for 2 four years, and two Crown Vics for three years. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And one of them not equipped? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, whatever that -- yeah. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Two years? Two years on the 8 Fords? 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Three. Four years on the Tahoes 10 lease, and three years on the Crown Vic lease. Three and 11 two. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: My question is, what happens 13 next year? And we have a -- now we're tied into a four-year 14 lease plan rather than a three-year lease plan, and it's 15 going to come back next year and the year after that with 16 more vehicles, and it's going to extend the time, and you're 17 going to spend a whole lot more money at the end. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Next year, I would hope to 19 replace with all five Crown Vics again. I just need an 20 S.U.V. on each shift, okay? So, you're going to have the one 21 extended year's payment; there's no doubt there. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So we're actually going to -- 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We're going to go back down to 24 Crown Vics. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So we're actually only going 10-8-07 27 1 to pay one -- one more year for Tahoes to get what you want, 2 and then go back to Crown Vics for the next years? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. Now, the only one that 4 will wear out a little bit sooner than the other ones is the 5 Expedition, 'cause it's got -- already got 30,000 miles on 6 it. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We have a motion and a second 8 as indicated. Further question or discussion? All in favor 9 of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 10 (Commissioners Baldwin, Williams, and Letz voted in favor of the motion.) 11 12 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Opposed. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just to be consistent. 16 (Discussion off the record.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's move to Item 5, if we 18 might, and take care of that matter. Consider, discuss, and 19 take appropriate action to accept the resignation of Robert 20 L. Weinberg from the Alamo Area Senior Advisory Committee 21 with thanks and appreciation, and the appointment of Margie 22 G. Jetton to the position effective immediately. 23 Commissioner Williams? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Judge. We've 25 had a little turnover in this committee, but I think if the 10-8-07 28 1 Court approves Ms. Jetton's appointment today, we'll have two 2 very, very good representatives to AACOG on the Seniors 3 Advisory Committee. So, I'd like to move the acceptance of 4 Bob Weinberg's resignation with our thanks appreciation for 5 his support, and move the appointment -- include the movement 6 of appointment for Margie G. Jetton to that position on Alamo 7 Area Seniors Advisory Committee. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I'm very proud to second 9 that motion. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second. Any 11 question or discussion on the motion? All in favor of the 12 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Margie, 17 it's time for you to go to work. 18 MS. JETTON: Okay, I'll do it, and I thank you very 19 much. I always like to be an advocate. Thank you. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Thank you. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Margie. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. The next item, consider, 23 -- Item 2; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action for 24 the preliminary plat for Vistas Grande located in Precinct 2. 25 Mr. Odom? 10-8-07 29 1 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. Good morning. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Morning. 3 MR. ODOM: This plat is both in the ETJ of 4 Kerrville and the County's jurisdiction in Precinct 2. It 5 has a total acreage of 77.48 acres, and will have eight lots. 6 This will be County-maintained roads. We still need a street 7 profile and ditch drainage study, and it's our understanding 8 that Vordenbaum Engineering's working on this and will get it 9 to Wayne Wells. I talked to Wells -- Wayne Friday afternoon, 10 and he had -- to his knowledge, he has not received anything 11 from them. The developer is asking for a variance to the 12 50-foot building setback to be at 25-foot, as shown on the 13 plat for Lot 3. The City has approved the portion in their 14 ETJ, and we assume they will be inspecting the construction. 15 They also had the name change as directed by the Court, and I 16 recommend that we accept this preliminary plat. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Odom, you say you assume the 18 City will be making these inspections. Are they obliged to 19 make these inspections? 20 MR. ODOM: They are obliged to -- to do that in 21 their ETJ, just like they did up on Sheppard Rees. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 23 MR. ODOM: I knew that that word "assumed" -- I 24 wouldn't have put that in there, but Truby did. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They're inspecting the roads? 10-8-07 30 1 MR. ODOM: They're inspecting the roads, based upon 2 their -- their rules and regulations that they have there. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is the name of that 4 street with the cul-de-sac? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Calle Poco. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Calle Poco. 8 MR. DIGGES: In Spanish, it means "short street." 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Short street. I guess we 10 need to keep an eye on that so we're not approving any ugly 11 language or anything. 'Cause I certainly can't read it. 12 MR. ODOM: 390 feet. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 390 feet. 14 MR. ODOM: That is a short road. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: When do we anticipate the 16 profile and drainage study? Do you know? 17 MR. ODOM: I'm not quite sure. In talking to 18 Wayne, he said he would go back to check. Talking to Charlie 19 Digges here, he said that Vordenbaum said that he has already 20 reviewed that with Wayne, and Wayne, from his memory, said he 21 would check to be sure, but he doesn't recall that. And this 22 is the second time I've talked to Wayne about it. So... 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is -- 24 MR. ODOM: I know that the City has had those, and 25 they have reviewed it, but we -- we felt like we needed an 10-8-07 31 1 opportunity to review those plans since it is partly in our 2 ETJ and we're responsible for part of it. So, Wayne -- I 3 have not talked to him this morning, but I intend to get back 4 with him. But the rules say that they can stake, they can do 5 clearing and grubbing, and they can do some minor work out 6 there, but the major work, Mr. Digges, is not to be done 7 until I get those street profiles. 8 MR. DIGGES: I understand that. 9 MR. ODOM: Okay. And we've discussed this before, 10 so we'll get with Vordenbaum to see where we're at. I would 11 assume this is sort of a precarious -- it's a catch-22. The 12 City's doing it, and they go there, and assuming all of it's 13 done -- and I have one little portion down there in front 14 that's mine, and so we assume that this is correct, that it's 15 been looked at as far as the City's concerned, and we'll go 16 forward with it. If we have any questions, Wayne will bring 17 it up. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The variance from setback 19 is only on -- on the Lot Number 3; is that correct? 20 MR. ODOM: That's correct. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Leonard, the -- up to the 23 north, Deer Park Lane comes from the south, correct? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. 25 MR. ODOM: Yes. 10-8-07 32 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why is the lot narrower up 2 there? What's the right-of-way up on that northern piece of 3 it? 4 MR. ODOM: Oh, you're talking about the place that 5 doesn't show that? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's up here -- I mean, I 7 just -- I presume 16 is 50-foot right-of-way. I'm wondering 8 why that right-of-way -- 9 MR. ODOM: 50 foot, I believe, is where we looked 10 -- Truby and I looked at this. This is somewhat ambiguous. 11 You see an unshaded area. Part of this had to do with the 12 state, and in 1996, I believe, we looked -- or I had her look 13 that up. Somehow, this property belonged to the state of 14 Texas, and was bought and developed, and this other is 15 prescriptive all along here; should be 25 foot each side to 16 the center of the roadway. And I believe that, looking at 17 this, Lots 1 and 2 shows to go all the way across. That's 18 the reason it's shaded. The other part's unshaded, and that 19 comes from this opposite side. Truby and them -- I believe 20 as part of this on the opposite side goes all the way up 21 against them. So, it was -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, that road that gets to Lot 23 1 and 2 is a 50-foot right-of-way? 24 MR. ODOM: I believe it's 50 foot on Deer Park. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 50. 10-8-07 33 1 MR. ODOM: Mm-hmm. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why are we going with the 16 -- 3 50-foot right-of-way? 4 MR. ODOM: Well, I guess I messed up. I assumed 5 that I've got a county road right there, and -- 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, if -- if it's -- to me, 7 that needs to be -- I mean, there certainly is, I mean, 8 enough acreage -- 9 MR. ODOM: Well, I guess you could grant that on 3, 10 4 and 5. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If it's going to be a county 12 road, certainly, we want a 60-foot right-of-way. 13 MR. ODOM: Charlie, am I correct in my assumption? 14 That's just 50 foot, right? 15 MR. DIGGES: It's hard to say by looking at this, I 16 must admit, because if you look where it has the cul-de-sac 17 street coming in Deer Park Lane, it's got that 32-foot 18 distance there along the shaded part, but it's at a skew, so 19 I would need to check on that. I mean, we can -- we can tell 20 you that if we need to make an adjustment and if we're not 21 giving you 30 feet off that side, we certainly will. That's 22 not our intention to short you all. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. 24 MR. ODOM: Yeah. 25 MR. DIGGES: And the reason why you have the shaded 10-8-07 34 1 areas is -- is we're -- any place where the developers 2 actually own the property, they're going to dedicate it to 3 the County. But there's certain places here where they abut 4 Deer Park Lane where they don't own the property. 5 MR. ODOM: That's right. 6 MR. DIGGES: In their deed, it didn't come into 7 them, so they can't grant it to y'all. 8 MR. ODOM: It came from the opposite side of the 9 road when we looked at it. It was -- it was strange. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's a narrow -- narrow road, 11 only really accesses these Lots 1 and 2, and doesn't access 12 any other properties at the end of the road, or on the -- be 13 the west of the road. They must have access from another 14 way. 15 MR. ODOM: Well, Deer Park comes all the way 16 through, goes from 16 -- 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 16 to Lower Turtle Creek. 18 MR. ODOM: -- all the way to Lower Turtle Creek. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay, I got you. 20 MR. ODOM: You have access in here. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, the light shaded area is 22 just basically in addition to the existing road? 23 MR. ODOM: No, they're deeding that all the way 24 across. In other words, they own all the way across. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 10-8-07 35 1 MR. ODOM: Okay? When you look down 3 and 4 and 5, 2 you say, why do we have this shaded? And when we started 3 looking back into it, this was precarious because of the 4 state owning it, and it was sold from the opposite side, and 5 they had the deed all the way over to the property line. So, 6 we had two different scenarios. They couldn't deed anything 7 they didn't own. It belonged to -- it's already deeded to 8 the County. I think that I've got 50 foot. I may be wrong; 9 it may be 60, but in the back of my mind, I'm thinking it's 10 50 foot. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Can we determine that by 12 the time we get back for final? 13 MR. ODOM: Yes. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- I mean, maybe this 15 is one of those, because it's both city and county, we 16 definitely need to have 60-foot right-of-way on that 17 entire -- 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- stretch. Even if the rest 20 of the road is 50 foot, let's try to start making it better. 21 MR. ODOM: Well, like Charlie said, the 31.2 feet, 22 and that shows, I guess, on up to the center. And I have to 23 check to see if it is 60 foot on that other side. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I can't -- 25 MR. ODOM: I missed it. Looked at this, and it was 10-8-07 36 1 confusing to me, because both sides turn from one side to 2 another. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I -- I understand the 4 confusion. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, we want 60 feet all the 6 way. 7 MR. DIGGES: So we'll give you -- you know, if 8 we're just giving you 25, you know, it's there by easement 9 now. The entire thing is by easement to Kerr County now. 10 But if we're only giving you 25 now from the center line, we 11 will give you 30 feet. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 13 MR. DIGGES: Then it won't be easement; it will be 14 dedicated. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: From the center line, 16 30 feet? 17 MR. DIGGES: Yes. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And that will be reflected 19 on the final? 20 MR. ODOM: On the final. 21 MR. DIGGES: Yes. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But that gets us to 55 feet, 23 then. 24 MR. DIGGES: We can't -- we can't solve what's on 25 the other side. 10-8-07 37 1 MR. ODOM: You know, that's -- that's the dilemma. 2 It's already platted on the other side, or metes and bounds 3 on the other side, I guess. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Kind of like J.J. Lane 5 revisited here. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But -- I'm thinking through 7 this. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Roadway's already located there, 9 which presents the problem of 25 foot either side of the 10 center line. Otherwise, you could go 35 feet and bring it 11 all up to 60. 12 MR. ODOM: Yes, if that's 25 on the other side. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: But then your roadway's going to 14 be -- 15 MR. ODOM: Shifted over. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Your road won't be in the 17 center of the right-of-way, but at least you'll have a total 18 60-foot right-of-way. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Nothing new. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, what's new about that? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, it just seems to me 22 that when we're doing these developments, it makes sense for 23 us, where we can, to get the -- we either get the 24 right-of-way now or we're going to buy it later. And now we 25 can make them dedicate it to us, especially when it's going 10-8-07 38 1 to be a county road. 2 MR. ODOM: So, you're saying if we have actually 25 3 on the opposite side, that they should give 35? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, that's what I think. 5 MR. ODOM: All right. We'll just have to check to 6 see if we're running at 25 or 31. If we're running 31 -- 7 well, just depends what the other side is. I have to look up 8 those deeds. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And on the waiver, I don't -- 10 that's not that big a deal. 11 MR. ODOM: On the -- well, we discussed that last 12 time. They brought it here, and that's what they were told 13 to do, and that's what they did. Two things; that was that 14 25 down on setback, and the name change. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I move approval of the 16 preliminary plat for Vistas Grande in Precinct 2, with the -- 17 showing a 25-foot setback for -- variance for 25-foot setback 18 on Lot Number 3, and showing a 35-foot dedicated -- 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right-of-way, 60, whatever it 20 takes. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You can't -- well, 35 from 22 the center line. 23 MR. ODOM: On this property. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He doesn't know what this is 25 exactly. I'm just saying we need to get a 60-foot 10-8-07 39 1 right-of-way by the time we're done. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: All right, 60-foot 3 right-of-way. You figure it out. 4 MR. ODOM: I'll figure out -- I'll get with 5 Charlie. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: For this portion that's 7 identified on the plat. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second. Any 10 question or discussion on the motion? All in favor of the 11 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's move 16 to Item 3; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 17 change public hearings set for November the 12th, 2007, to 18 November the 13th, 2007, due to the holiday schedule. We 19 just weren't paying attention to the possible holidays, were 20 we? 21 MR. ODOM: Well, I think that we had set this prior 22 to you setting this schedule, which was after the 1st, so we 23 wanted to come back to the Court and ask to change this to 24 the 13th -- 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 10-8-07 40 1 MR. ODOM: -- of November. We apologize to the 2 Court, but we were going under the assumption that we didn't 3 -- it was still the same, and when y'all changed it, we'd 4 already committed to making these changes. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: There'll have to be republications, 6 won't there? 7 MR. ODOM: I believe so. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 9 MR. ODOM: But the 30 days would be there; just be 10 a day later, so they would -- but we need the publication. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Have they been published? 12 MR. ODOM: Pardon me? 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Have they already been 14 published? 15 MR. ODOM: Yes. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: For the 12th. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Republish. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do we need to read all 20 these into the record, Judge? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably a good idea. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: That will be Hill River Estates, 23 Lots 1, 5, 6, 11, 12, 13 in Block 2 will be at 10 a.m. on the 24 13th, in lieu of the same time on the 12th of November. The 25 Horizon, Lots 25 and 26, will also be at 10 a.m. on the 13th, 10-8-07 41 1 in lieu of the 12th. The Horizon, Lots 99, 100, and 10, will 2 be at 10:05 a.m. on the 13th, in lieu of the 12th of 3 November. Vistas Escondidas de Cypress Springs Estates, Lots 4 113 and 114, will be at 10:10 a.m., in lieu of that same 5 time -- on the 13th, in lieu of that same time on the 12th of 6 November. Privilege Creek Ranch, Lot 17, you're asking that 7 that be set for 10:15 a.m. on the 13th of November, in lieu 8 of its originally set time for 10:05 a.m., because of the 9 duplication in time. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval of all the 11 changes identified. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 14 approval. Any question or discussion? All in favor of the 15 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll go to 20 Item 4; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 21 reduce letter of escrow on interest-bearing account from BTEX 22 Ranch, L.P., for Privilege Creek, also known as Boerne Falls 23 Ranch, located in Precinct 3. Mr. Odom? 24 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. BTEX Ranch, L.P., the 25 developer of Privilege Creek, also known as Boerne Falls, 10-8-07 42 1 placed $543,223.30 in escrow to secure the letter of credit 2 for the roads in Privilege Creek, Phase 1. At this time, he 3 is asking the Court to reduce the amount of security by 4 $215,589.75. Attached is their engineer's estimate and an 5 invoice for materials crushed to support the amount of monies 6 spent for the road materials. I estimate the amount of base 7 produced would approximate what has been placed in stockpile 8 and on the roadway. If the Court chooses to reduce the 9 escrow amount, we suggest the developer bring in a new letter 10 of escrow for $327,633.55, and at that time we will return 11 the old one. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, you're saying that he's 13 built part of the road, and you want to reduce the original 14 amount down to -- 15 MR. ODOM: This new amount. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- that new amount that he's 17 put into the road. 18 MR. ODOM: That's correct. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't know -- you do that? 20 I don't know if I've ever done that before. Is that kosher? 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, if there's a letter 22 of credit to cover the remainder of work to be done. 23 MR. ODOM: The remainder of work to be done. And I 24 believe that we have, but not in that significant fashion. 25 We've discussed that before. I -- 10-8-07 43 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are you cool with that, 2 Mr. County Attorney? 3 MR. EMERSON: It can be done. It's my 4 understanding, I think part of the money is supposed to be 5 held for a year or two after the road's built to make sure 6 it's built properly. 7 MR. ODOM: Have to for county maintenance on that 8 main road. There would be a maintenance bond for 30 percent 9 of that amount on the main -- main road. He'll have to 10 produce a maintenance bond to us. 11 MR. EMERSON: It's over and above what's here? 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Would that 30 percent 13 maintenance bond be 30 percent of the total amount, which was 14 543? Or -- 15 MR. ODOM: Well, not all the roads are -- 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- or 30 percent of 215 -- 17 MR. ODOM: The maintenance bond is only for those 18 that are county-maintained. If they're private roads, 19 there's not a maintenance bond that's needed. And part of 20 this -- or the majority of the fingers of the roads that go 21 off Privilege -- Turkey Knob Road, we're going to maintain 22 that. That's the arterial. So, whatever 30 percent of 23 the -- building that portion, he has to provide us a 24 maintenance bond for one year. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: But there is actually dollars 10-8-07 44 1 put in escrow to pay for this road? 2 MR. DIGGES: They put money into escrow, is what 3 they did. They paid into an escrow account or savings 4 account, and then that bond was issued off that amount of 5 money, 500,000. So, now he's reduced that amount that's on 6 the job, so what is left to be done on Phase 1 is 7 300-some-odd thousand left to do, and that's up to the Court. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This is only Phase 1, though. 9 There will be another -- 10 MR. ODOM: Only Phase 1. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- another escrow required 12 for Phase 2 -- 13 MR. ODOM: That's right. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- on down the road. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Emerson, should we be concerned 16 about a retainage here, a storage retainage of 10 percent? 17 Seems to me like they're asking for draw-down dollar per 18 dollar. 19 MR. EMERSON: I think that that's exactly what 20 they're asking for, Judge. But since it's a partial 21 draw-down and the project's only, I guess, based on dollars, 22 40 percent complete or 30 percent complete, -- 23 MR. ODOM: Probably something like that. 24 MR. EMERSON: -- I'm not sure that the Court can't 25 just hang onto that on the back end. But that's -- 10-8-07 45 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, what I'm concerned about is, 2 if you're drawing down pro rata portion, dollar for dollar, 3 and there's difficulty during Phase 2, you've got no 4 retainage to look to as to the first phase. You may have the 5 pro rata portion of -- of Phase 2. This isn't a bonded 6 project. I just think it may be wise if we were -- as to the 7 amount that we're reducing, that we hold back 10 percent of 8 that. 9 MR. EMERSON: I think that's the more conservative 10 route to take, yes. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: So, instead of authorizing reduction 12 of the -- what is it, 212,000? 13 MR. ODOM: 215,000. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: 215. We -- 15 MR. ODOM: Hold back 21. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: -- hold back 21,5 of that, and for 17 the balance, 90 percent of the 215, we allow a reduction. 18 That might be more appropriate. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the maintenance bond 20 would be even outside of that. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. 22 MR. ODOM: That's correct. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, yeah. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that's totally separate and 25 apart. When you -- 10-8-07 46 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: When does the maintenance 2 bond -- when do they come in and do that? Isn't that -- 3 MR. ODOM: When we accept it. I would bring it to 4 the Court for acceptance. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And -- 6 MR. ODOM: But we have a problem right now to 7 accept it. I don't know if we would accept anything, 'cause 8 they still have the gate locked on one side, and you don't 9 have all the way through. You only got this section right 10 here. All the legal has not been resolved. I understand 11 that there was to be an opinion made Friday -- or by Friday 12 by the Kendall County Judge, but I don't know if that's -- I 13 haven't had a phone call one way or another. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Maybe we should just pass on 15 this for two weeks until they get it straightened out. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I didn't realize there was a 17 legal -- they have a gate locked that -- they have a gate 18 locked on a road that we're thinking about reducing the bond 19 on? 20 MR. ODOM: Sir -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Have they built inside that 22 locked gate? 23 MR. ODOM: Yes. They can, yes. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Have they built inside the 25 locked gate? 10-8-07 47 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I've not been out there. 2 MR. ODOM: Are you talking about a home, you mean? 3 No. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, built the road. 5 MR. ODOM: They're building the road now. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's inside the locked 7 gate? 8 MR. ODOM: That's correct. And the question is -- 9 is tying into Kendall County, and that's a legal question, 10 and which their lawyers -- it's a civil matter in which they 11 are saying that they have the authority to do that. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That doesn't have a lot of 13 bearing, actually, here in terms of reducing the -- 14 MR. ODOM: Reducing this -- 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- the escrow. So, if 16 we're following the numbers -- am I correct, Judge, if we 17 follow the numbers that you're throwing out, we'd be adding 18 back, in effect, 21,5, and that would reduce the security 19 instead to 194,089 instead of 215,589? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Instead of reducing the escrow by 21 215 and change, whatever it is, reduce it by 90 percent of 22 that. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. Well -- 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Same difference. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 195,000 will get us there. 10-8-07 48 1 MR. ODOM: I can -- I'll contact them and tell them 2 that's what the Court decided to do; it's y'all's opinion to 3 do it. But they have reduced it, and it can be built. 4 Material's out there to be done. Their question is -- is a 5 legal question. I'm sure they'll resolve it, but the Court 6 was aware of that when we did the preliminary. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. But this is not -- 8 this is not part of that issue. 9 MR. ODOM: This is not part of it. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: You'd be reducing that escrow by 11 194,030.78. 12 MR. ODOM: Say that number again? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: 194,030.78. 14 MR. ODOM: I'll check your number, make sure. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: I think this works as good as an 16 Aggie calculator. 17 MR. ODOM: Well, I was going to say, Texas 18 calculator works pretty good. Sometimes they're good in 19 business. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, are we taking any 21 action today, or are we bringing it back? 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I guess it depends if we get 23 a motion or not. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I move we reduce the letter 25 of the -- the letter of escrow on interest-bearing account 10-8-07 49 1 G.F. Number 070721K from 543,223.30 to 194,030.78. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: By 194 -- reduce it by that amount? 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Reduce it by that amount, 4 yes, sir. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and second. Any 8 question or discussion on the motion? All in favor of the 9 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 10 (Commissioners Baldwin, Williams, and Oehler voted in favor of the motion.) 11 12 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Let the record reflect that 15 Commissioner Letz did not participate in the discussion, nor 16 vote. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sissy. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move to Item 6 quickly, if we 19 might. Consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 20 formulate and adopt policy on Kerr County funding or funding 21 formula in future years for the Butt-Holdsworth Memorial 22 Library. As I'm sure members of the Court recall, there was 23 discussion that we needed to give some ongoing forward 24 direction to this issue, so that notwithstanding our 25 pronouncement that we've made in prior years, that a clear -- 10-8-07 50 1 clear message is delivered to our funding partners, so to 2 speak, with this venture, the City of Kerrville, as to where 3 we're planning on going in the future. Don't anybody jump in 4 here at once. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, let me jump in and 6 say, after we discussed it last time, I talked with 7 Commissioner Oehler a little bit about it, and suggested that 8 maybe the Court would like to -- maybe the Court would want 9 to consider our position being based on a percentage, as 10 opposed to a dollar figure. Given that everything else has a 11 tendency to grow each year in terms of inflation and other 12 considerations, I thought maybe if we established a 13 percentage that -- reducing a percentage until we get to the 14 level we like or are willing to sustain, that might be a 15 better approach than trying to fix a dollar amount. My 16 assumption is that we probably are somewhere -- in terms of 17 funding, somewhere between 48 and 50 percent right now. We 18 funded at last year's level, which was a little bit short of 19 what they requested this year, so more than likely, we're at 20 about 48 percent right now, somewhere like that, 47, 21 whatever. If we were to consider, in subsequent budget 22 years, going down to 45 and then 40 percent of the budget, 23 whatever that budget is, for library services only, maybe 24 that's an approach, and so I throw it out there for 25 discussion as a possible approach. 10-8-07 51 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is the approach? 2 Reduce it by a particular number -- percentage number next 3 year? Is that what you're saying? 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And what is that number? 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I'm just throwing it 7 out for discussion. Perhaps 45 percent, and in the ensuing 8 year, 40 percent of the total budget. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess I kind of look at it -- 10 I mean, I'd kind of like to see where the City's going with 11 the library, to see a plan from their standpoint. I mean, I 12 know at least one Councilman is very much -- at least 13 publicly has stated he thinks the library needs to be moved 14 and something totally different done. I don't know where the 15 City is on that whole issue, really. I think that if you -- 16 I'm in favor of what you're talking about doing, a 17 percentage, a little bit, but if we start getting into we're 18 just going to fund a flat amount or a flat percentage, does 19 that mean we no longer have say into the -- the operational 20 side? Which we never have had, anyway. (Laughter.) But -- 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, what's your point? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Letz is going to get some 23 control out of this thing. Okay. I want to hear it. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But do we want to try to get 25 control over some of the operations of the library? I mean, 10-8-07 52 1 it's a -- you know, so it's kind of a -- you know, where do 2 we want to be, I think, is the first step. What do we want 3 to do with the library? And then -- and kind of what does 4 the City plan to do with the library? And then make a 5 decision. I mean, I think I'm -- overall policy right now is 6 a little bit premature, in my mind. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If we -- if we confine our 8 discussion to funding library services only, they can move 9 that building anywhere they want to move that building, or 10 construct a new one, and we're only talking about what goes 11 on inside the building. Not the building. Which, in my 12 view, it should be -- that should be the case. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They're -- City is doing a 15 study right now on all of their buildings, and the library is 16 included in that study, to see what's recommended about -- 17 you know, as far as renovation or new location. And I 18 believe the study's going to show that the new location is 19 absolutely necessary to do, because that -- that facility is 20 not a good library. You don't have any parking. The access 21 is horrible. And that has nothing to do with us. I mean, 22 I'm kind of to the point where I'd like to just say, okay, 23 this is how many dollars we're going to give you a year. We 24 went ahead and funded it back up to last year's level last 25 meeting, and I feel like that we need to not reduce it too 10-8-07 53 1 much all at one time, like the City does us. They go up a 2 lot all at one time. I think we -- when we decide that we're 3 going to reduce some of our -- of our contribution, it 4 doesn't need to be so drastic that it hurts the library. And 5 so I -- you know, my recommendation would be somewhere maybe 6 in the range of 10,000 a year until you get down to 400,000. 7 That's just my thought. That may not have any -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's kind of what Bill's 9 saying here, only he's not using a flat amount of money; he's 10 looking at the percentage side of it. And I don't have any 11 idea what those numbers equal, as far as -- 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If I had a chance to get 13 the exact number we had this year, I could have told you, but 14 I don't know. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But I -- I don't think we're 16 ready to do this because of that discrepancy right there, if 17 nothing else. But I don't know if I agree with the fact that 18 -- I just don't understand why we'd want to wait for -- to 19 see what their plan is. It doesn't matter what their plan 20 is. If they build a Taj Mahal or put the library in a tent 21 somewhere, our operations will still be the same. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, if we cap it, it will be, 23 but if they build a Taj Mahal, the operations could double. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And if they build a new 10-8-07 54 1 facility, I can almost assure you, the operation -- the 2 annual operations will increase drastically. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. I agree 100 4 percent. That's why I think that -- I like -- I like Bill's 5 idea here. I just don't know if those are good, firm 6 numbers. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't either. It's just 8 a suggestion. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just don't know that. But 10 if you reduce it next year by 45 percent, and then the 11 following year by 40 percent, and then the next year by 12 30 percent to get to the 400,000 or whatever the -- this 13 wonderful, magical number is, I kind of think that's the way 14 to do it. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Want to offer them the property 16 by the jail, since they don't want that for anything else? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I still haven't figured out 18 why they don't want to deal with that. I don't know. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Maybe we can give them the 20 option to put a library or a jail there. (Laughter.) 21 MS. VAN WINKLE: Combination. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: In the same building. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Obviously, it's an issue that needs 24 to be addressed. The sooner we start, we can throw it out on 25 the table and have it there available. It may be premature, 10-8-07 55 1 but there's a lot of other issues. One, I think -- I don't 2 know whether it's feasible. You mentioned, Commissioner 3 Oehler, something about looking on a per-call basis with 4 regard to some other services. For example, our -- the fire 5 contract this budget year went up 40 percent. Certainly, I 6 think if we were to reduce this one by the same percentage, 7 that would be a pretty drastic, significant move. That would 8 be about $175,000, which I don't think anybody's ready to do. 9 It needs to be out on the table; we need to have it there to 10 continue to discuss, because it continues to be a bone of 11 contention, and we need to -- we need to have a good idea 12 where we're going somewhat in advance of the actual 13 finalization of the budget process so that -- 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I feel like -- 15 JUDGE TINLEY: -- we're not in the dark where they 16 are, and they're not in the dark. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That is right, and they need 18 to know this well in advance so they can do their planning 19 and be fair to them, and not do the same thing they do to us. 20 You know, at least -- at least be try to be fair. And I do 21 believe we do need to fund a large portion of that budget. 22 But it's very difficult when you don't have any control, 23 basically, over that budget, to always fund it at a 50-50 24 level, because you can have all kinds of different expenses, 25 and where they decide to -- to provide different, more 10-8-07 56 1 expensive services as time goes on, that just means our 2 amount's going to continue to rise. So, it's going to be -- 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's our amount this year? 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 443 is what we agreed to. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How about -- well, this is -- 6 certainly, a one-year policy makes sense. I'd just -- how 7 about putting them on notice, we're going to fund 400,000 8 next year, period; that's our maximum amount, subject to them 9 working with us in good faith on operational issues and 10 long-term needs of the library, you know. If they want to 11 work with us -- if they want more money, they're going to 12 have to come to us and change the way they operate. And 13 we're willing to listen, but that's -- you know, that's kind 14 of -- that way they're on notice, and we can always change 15 it, you know, once they start doing some of their stuff down 16 the road. That way, we can at least put it to bed for a 17 year. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the reality of the situation 19 is, we can only -- we can only deal for a year at a time, 20 because that's the way we're structured under the 21 Constitution. But, you know, that's what our preliminary 22 budget for this current year showed initially, was 400,000, 23 and now we're -- we're back. So, that's why we're doing it 24 early. But, you know, we'll continue to work on that. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I'm ready to go, if Bruce 10-8-07 57 1 is, with 400,000. We can do it at 400,000, far as I'm 2 concerned. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I think that -- I 4 really think, in all fairness, that we ought not to reduce it 5 by that much in any one year. I think we need to prepare 6 them for a little bit at a time. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's a little bit? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I'm talking about 9 10,000 a year cut. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thirteen? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, 13 for the first year; 12 make it -- make it -- make it 430 next year instead of 443. 13 I mean -- 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, that's fine. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I just feel like that we're 16 not going to be doing what we should be doing if we drop it 17 that much. If we drop it 10 percent, basically, in one year, 18 I think that's -- 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Too much. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's too much. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The reality is that if we 22 even follow what you're suggesting, we're going to be cutting 23 it even more, because the budget's going to go up next year. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's right. You're exactly 25 right. 10-8-07 58 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 430? I mean, I'd just as soon 2 do something today so we don't have to look at it again for a 3 while. But, I mean, I think I want to listen to what Bruce 4 thinks is right, because I think he has a closer -- 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, you guys don't have to 6 go to the board meetings like I do. You don't have to sit 7 over there and listen to all this. You know, you're 8 insulated over here, you know. You run off and all that kind 9 of stuff. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Sheriff, can you -- 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I turned around; you were 12 gone. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Could you free up your schedule to 14 make one of your people available to go with Commissioner 15 Oehler to the Library Board meetings? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: There is no way any of my 17 people are going. I believe that meeting is probably within 18 the city limits of Kerrville, so I'm sure K.P.D. would be 19 more than happy to send somebody with him. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I want to ride in the Tahoe 21 to do it. (Laughter.) 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: To or from? 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Are we anywhere on this one? 24 Okay. Well, it's out on the table. Let's go to our 25 10 o'clock timed item; consider, discuss, and take 10-8-07 59 1 appropriate action to authorize use of the portable stage to 2 maintained at the Youth Exhibit Center for Families and 3 Literacy street dance at reduced or no cost. I put this 4 matter on the agenda at the request of Joe Herring, Jr., and 5 Brian Bondy, who are here with us. They are ramrodding, so 6 to speak, I suppose, a street dance to benefit Families and 7 Literacy. It's going to take place in downtown Kerrville 8 later on this month. And the -- Mr. Herring reminded me that 9 this is the same stage that we used during -- during the 10 sesquicentennial celebration, and as I'm sure members of the 11 Court recall, it was through the committee that was put 12 together by Mr. Herring and through the cooperation of the 13 Chamber, headed up by Brian Bondy, that that sesquicentennial 14 celebration was so well received and such a tremendous 15 success. And in looking at the proposed schedule of charges 16 that we put into effect on the Youth Exhibit Center, I don't 17 see that there's any -- any separate item for the stage. 18 Apparently, it's assumed that it will stay there, but of 19 course, it is portable and has been moved. Either one of you 20 gentlemen want to tell us what this event is about? 21 MR. HERRING: We're having a -- like you said, a 22 street dance to benefit Literacy Group in Kerrville. We 23 would greatly appreciate the use of the stage. We've tried 24 to raise enough money beforehand that every dollar sold -- 25 every ticket dollar sold goes to that group. That group not 10-8-07 60 1 only does, you know, literacy classes; they do English as a 2 second language class, they do citizenship classes, and they 3 do some parenting classes, so they do really good work. 4 There's also another motive to have it downtown. As you 5 probably know, with the closing of Schreiner's and other 6 things coming downtown, we thought it might be good to have a 7 positive event downtown. And whether you like them or not, 8 the group that's coming is -- will be kind of Beatles 9 impersonators, so it might be fun. Might be a fun evening, 10 but we really need to borrow your stage. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Who's going to transport it, 12 and set up and tear down and bring it back? 13 MR. HERRING: In the past, I believe the County did 14 that. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd rather -- I mean, I'd 16 rather have our people do it than -- 17 MR. HERRING: We would rather, too, because y'all 18 know what you're doing. And we -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I wouldn't go that far. 20 (Laughter.) But I'm all in favor of it, I can tell you that. 21 I think it's neat. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that a motion? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think it's a neat deal, 24 and it's part of the -- part of the community, what they're 25 doing, and that's what we do. Is -- is it on our list? So 10-8-07 61 1 moved. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded -- I assume 4 that's at no cost? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's at no cost, and our 6 people move it. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any other question or 8 discussion on the motion? All in favor of the motion, 9 signify by raising your right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 12 (No response.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Joe, what time of the day is 15 this thing over? 16 MR. HERRING: It will begin at 7:30; it's about an 17 hour and a half, so be over around 9:00, 9:15. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: You going to put tables and chairs 19 up? 20 MR. HERRING: We're going to ask people to bring 21 their own lawn chairs. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tim, can you stay up that 23 late? 24 MR. BOLLIER: I'm fine with it. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's the date? 10-8-07 62 1 MR. HERRING: October 20th. We'll actually need 2 the stage at noon on October 20th. They have to set up sound 3 and all other stuff, and -- 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What day is that? 5 MR. HERRING: That's a Saturday. 6 MR. BOLLIER: You need the stage at noon? 7 MR. HERRING: Yes, sir. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Tim likes lunch at 12:00, so 9 if he sets the stage up -- 10 MR. BOLLIER: I'll miss lunch. 11 MR. HERRING: Well, around noon. Additionally, 12 we'd be happy to add y'all as a sponsor on the publicity, if 13 that's agreeable to you guys. All right, thanks. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're welcome. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Joe, before you leave -- 16 MR. HERRING: Yes, sir? 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Thanks for all of your great work on 18 the sesquicentennial. 19 MR. HERRING: Brian did all the work. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Deeply indebted to both of you guys. 21 MR. HERRING: Brian did all the work, and I caused 22 all the problems. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, invite him to the 24 dedication Friday. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. You're aware of the Frances 10-8-07 63 1 Lehmann Pavilion dedication that's going to take place this 2 Friday at 2 p.m.? 3 MR. HERRING: I'd like to be there. Thank you. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: 2 o'clock this Friday afternoon. 5 MR. HERRING: Thanks, guys. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to Item 8; consider, 8 discuss, take appropriate action to adopt an order expressing 9 official intent to reimburse with tax-exempt obligation 10 proceeds for costs associated with constructing or acquiring 11 various improvements within the county. This item was placed 12 on the agenda at the request of the County Auditor. If the 13 members of the Court will recall, we talked about some 14 significant capital improvements. We were looking at 15 structuring the payment for those a little bit different than 16 in our regular budgetary process. That is what this process 17 and order would accomplish. Ms. Hargis, with regard to the 18 draft of the order, under item (ii), I have some expanded 19 language there that I prefer; to add, after agricultural 20 barns, "and Youth Exhibit Center complex" -- 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where are you, Judge? At 22 the top or the bottom? Where are you? 23 JUDGE TINLEY: (ii) towards the top. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: "And related facilities." 10-8-07 64 1 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do we even need the words 3 "agricultural barns" in there? Doesn't hurt. 4 MS. HARGIS: It's better to have it as broad as you 5 can get it. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: That was the intent of my additional 8 language, is to broaden it up. 9 MS. HARGIS: Does everyone understand the reasoning 10 for this? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I understand the reasoning, 13 yeah. Could you give me a little bit of a minute explanation 14 on Section 2? That language is a little cumbersome there. 15 MS. HARGIS: In order to begin buying some of the 16 things that we need, we put off -- the I.T. -- a lot of I.T. 17 items were placed in the budget in the capital area. Some of 18 those need to be ordered now in order to get here within 19 90 -- 90 days, and some of the people were expecting to have 20 new computers in place, because theirs are not there. 21 They've basically blown up or need to be replaced. You can't 22 spend any of those funds without this resolution in place. 23 Once this resolution is in place, if something needs to be 24 ordered, then it can be ordered, and you can reimburse 25 yourself, but you have to have the resolution in place and 10-8-07 65 1 the order in place in order to do that. This is a pretty 2 standard thing to do when you know you're going to do a 3 long-term loan, because, to give you an example -- it would 4 be the easiest example for me. For instance, if you were 5 building a building, you would need to design it before you 6 would know what the costs would be to go out for your 7 long-term debt, so the architect would want his payment in 8 advance. Ours is a little different, because we have several 9 items in place, but it covers a broad band and it enables you 10 to always be reimbursed. And I'm just accustomed, in my 11 years of doing this, that we always got this in place, 12 whether we used it or not. The attorneys just said it was a 13 good thing to have in place. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Otherwise, you cannot reimburse 15 yourself out of the funds from that issue? 16 MS. HARGIS: Right, whether it's $50 or 100 -- you 17 know, or $100,000, you can't. So, once it's in place, if we 18 buy anything related to these areas, then we can be 19 reimbursed. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Reimbursement window is 21 open for up to 18 months? 22 MS. HARGIS: Right. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: After you've purchased the 24 equipment or whatever? 25 MS. HARGIS: Right. 10-8-07 66 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Or placed in service. 2 MS. HARGIS: Usually, if you went into a real 3 extensive type loan program, then you might need 18 months, 4 but I don't -- and that also allows you to -- the time to 5 design, things of that nature. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- at what point are you 7 going to come back -- are we going to prepare the actual list 8 of things that are going to be included? I mean, to actually 9 come up with the final -- 10 MS. HARGIS: List? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- list of items? 12 MS. HARGIS: Well, I think we need -- we've asked 13 everyone to -- you know, on the areas that we've talked 14 about. And I think we have some from Road and Bridge; I 15 think we have -- John has a detailed list, but we need to add 16 a few things to the list. I think, really, we need the 17 design situation that you guys ordered on the Youth Exhibit 18 Center before we put that one in. And I think talk to all of 19 the department heads and make sure that the items that we 20 took out of theirs are in here and so forth. If there's 21 anything else -- it's come to our attention that we may have 22 to broaden our H.R. software. We had a representative from 23 the software company come in on Thursday. There's some 24 glitches that have got to be fixed, which are going to 25 require about a week's worth of work that we didn't 10-8-07 67 1 anticipate, things of that nature. It's going to have to be 2 done in order to get our payroll to where it needs to be. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, I mean, we're talking a 4 month or so? 5 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, I think a month. We need to get 6 -- I think we need to get Mr. Henderson in here, but he needs 7 an amount, and we need to decide so we can start talking with 8 him. If you want me to put him on the next agenda to discuss 9 how we're going to do this financing, and what type of 10 financing we'd like to do, but as far as the list is 11 concerned, I think it's pretty well nailed down. We just 12 need -- you know, I think that the youth barn would be the 13 last component. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, it says, I mean, 15 improvements to the courthouse. I'm not sure exactly -- 16 MS. HARGIS: We probably need to go and get a 17 general bid; we need to get some bids on some of this stuff, 18 so it may take -- depending on when, you know, we need to 19 authorize these people to go out and get bids on certain 20 things. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: (iii), where you talk about 22 improvements to the County's communication -- 23 MS. HARGIS: The information system. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We're talking about 25 communication system other than the Sheriff's communication 10-8-07 68 1 system; is that correct? 2 MS. HARGIS: We're talking I.T. here. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 4 MS. HARGIS: Again, this is broad language to 5 encompass that. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On this one -- 7 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- my name is misspelled. 9 MS. HARGIS: Okay, I didn't catch that. I'm sorry. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: You need to change your name. 11 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, it is. I printed it without 12 looking at it, sorry. I can fix that. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval of the order 14 expressing official intent to reimburse for tax exempt 15 obligation proceeds for the costs associated with 16 constructing or acquiring various improvements within the 17 county, as amended through the discussions here this morning. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 20 indicated. Any further question or discussion on the motion? 21 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 22 hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 10-8-07 69 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll move 2 to Item 9 -- 3 MR. TROLINGER: Judge Tinley, can I get 4 clarification on what items Information Technology should be 5 ordering with this in place? 6 (Commissioner Baldwin left the courtroom.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: No, not from the Court. 8 MR. TROLINGER: Okay. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I thought you had worked 10 that out with Ms. Hargis. 11 MR. TROLINGER: Should I just work with the Auditor 12 directly to work that out? I just want to be 100 percent 13 sure, since this is something -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: You had a bunch of items that were 15 includible that we moved out of the budget process over into 16 the long-term upgrading process. 17 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: That's essentially what we're 19 looking at, so work with her on that. 20 MR. TROLINGER: Okay, will do. Thank you. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Item 9; consider, discuss, and take 22 appropriate action for a motion to ratify motion to approve 23 the language in House Bill 3195, which states Commissioners 24 Court adopted a budget on September 28, 2007, that raised 25 more revenue from property taxes than in the previous year. 10-8-07 70 1 Ms. Hargis, that was that wild and crazy language that had to 2 go into the proposed budget, which was on the cover page in 3 18-point type or whatever it is, on the proposed budget. 4 That did not have to be included, to my understanding, in the 5 final budget. However, it's your belief that, out of an 6 abundance of caution, that the motion approving the budget 7 should have actually stated that this budget, in fact, raised 8 "X" number of dollars more than the previous year, thus 9 resulting in a, quote, tax increase? 10 MS. HARGIS: Well, actually, I read the minutes of 11 that meeting, and you approved the language in House Bill 12 3195. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 14 MS. HARGIS: But you included it with the adoption 15 of the budget. The law requires -- 3195 requires that you do 16 it as a separate -- as a separate item, so all you're really 17 doing is making a separate motion for this. You did approve 18 it, but you didn't do it as a separate motion. That's really 19 all I need you to do, is just ratify it as a separate motion. 20 It specifically says it has to be a separate motion. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 24 indicated. Is that satisfactory, Ms. Hargis? 25 MS. HARGIS: That's fine. 10-8-07 71 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Any question or 2 discussion on the motion? All in favor of the motion, 3 signify by raising your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll move 8 to Item 10; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 9 nominate and elect Appraisal District Board of Director 10 members for the '08-'09 term. This is on the agenda as a 11 result of communication that was sent to me by the Appraisal 12 District. They've got a timetable there attached to the 13 front of the material. I do not recall getting -- it must 14 have come in separate communication -- the number of votes 15 that we had available to cast in this election for the Board 16 of Directors. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What -- do we know what member 18 -- who's coming off? What member is up? I guess this gets 19 into kind of a -- "delicate" is probably not the right word, 20 but a -- entities work together a little bit to keep 21 representation, and otherwise, the schools get everybody. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Isn't Mr. Lewis our 23 representative? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, and I'm wondering what 25 term is coming off. Who is -- I'd like to know why we got 10-8-07 72 1 this right now, what members are coming off right now, and 2 what entities do they represent? I know he's required by law 3 to do it this way, but depending on what this -- who this 4 individual is, you know, depends on what I think we should 5 do. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't have a clue. I would 7 suggest that -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Call them. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: -- we defer and maybe come back 10 after the break and take a look at this item. How does that 11 sound? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That sounds good. Find out -- 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We'll go to Item 11; 14 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to approve the new 15 contract, policies and procedures, and the list of 16 organizations which receive discounts at the Hill Country 17 Youth Exhibit Center. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the last page in the 19 backup, that's what I thought we ought to do based on what 20 we've done in the past. I don't know if Bruce -- he and I -- 21 you know, pretty much, those that were getting free use in 22 the past get free use now. But "free use" now means you 23 still pay for a lot of the costs that are out-of-pocket to 24 the County. You get free use of the actual facility, not 25 free use of tables, chairs, Maintenance Department, security, 10-8-07 73 1 you know -- 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Concession stand. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- concession, all that stuff. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. There -- we have a lot 5 of events out there that -- that pay, basically, from what we 6 can find out, basic facility rental, but they don't pay 7 anything for setup and tear-down. And I feel like that 8 that's something that most everybody needs to pay, except for 9 a very limited number, because it takes a lot of time to do 10 all this stuff, and then when you have other groups come in 11 and -- and/or caterers with groups and things like that, you 12 have a lot of trash and you have -- all the stuff is real 13 relative to what it actually costs us to operate that 14 facility. And there are very few, in my opinion, that need 15 to be given carte blanche on this thing. Very few. They 16 need to pay at least half in most cases, and the setup, 17 tear-down, and a deposit -- a cleaning deposit. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: In that connection -- I 19 agree with you. In that connection, Paragraph 8 in the -- in 20 the booking policy -- 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mm-hmm. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- does not state what we 23 just said. It discounts -- talks about to qualify for 24 not-for-profit rental rate and so forth, and then it goes on 25 talking about reduced rates will apply only to base rental. 10-8-07 74 1 And it doesn't -- it does not apply to rental chairs, tables, 2 concession stands. Don't you think we should also include 3 there it does not apply to setup and take-down fees? 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They should be in there. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: At that point, Number 8. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's -- I think it's 7 easier to say what it does apply to rather than what it 8 doesn't apply to. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, we're doing both in 10 that paragraph. That's the way it reads. Will apply to the 11 base rental and does not apply to these other things. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Doesn't apply to any other 13 fees. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, simplify it that way. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- yeah, reduced rates 16 will apply only to the base rental for the -- this -- 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Take the last sentence out. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Take out the last sentence, 19 really. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, that's fine. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: I have some kind of grammatical 22 changes that I made. I've provided copies. Those are on the 23 first page. I think cleans it up grammatically and makes it 24 a little clearer. Only other change that I saw is in the 25 last page of the policies, a typo only under Paragraph 19, 10-8-07 75 1 last sentence, "overt time." Take the T out. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Read Number 3, Judge; I 3 can't read that. What does it say? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. First option. Any conflict 5 of dates caused by request of the lessee or by calendar will 6 be resolved and/or mediated by the booking agent, taking into 7 account the varying circumstances, and the booking agent's 8 decision will be final. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, thank you. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: I think, grammatically, it's clear. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Going back to the new list that 12 was attached the last page, to me, the only event that gets 13 free everything is the Hill Country District Junior Livestock 14 Show, their use of it. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And 4-H. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And 4-H. 4-H -- 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: But I will give you an 18 example of what happened this weekend. It was a very, very 19 nice event, but the 4-H and the Sunrise Lion's Club joined 20 for a wild game dinner to raise funds for both organizations. 21 That was a completely free event for all, including the 22 Sunrise Lions, and the money that was taken in was split 23 evenly. So, evidently, 4-H booked the facility. And, you 24 know, I have nothing at all against the Lions; that's a great 25 group of folks. They do a big service to the community, but 10-8-07 76 1 should they not pay something for, you know, their half of 2 that function? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To me, they should. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: These are things that are 5 going to come up. I'm just bringing that to light. That 6 just happened. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They should. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There was a crowd. We were 9 out there Saturday. There was, I would guesstimate, 10 somewhere around 1,200 people showed up. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Unbelievable crowd, and it 13 was a great function, lots of good prizes. But it is a split 14 thing. The moneys were actually split between the two 15 organizations. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I think that, you know, 17 4-H is a county function, County-sponsored organization. We 18 should fund that 100 percent. Anybody else, they should pay, 19 you know, half of whatever the cost should be there. I mean, 20 it's a cost of the fundraiser. I mean, if you go to any 21 organization that does a fundraiser, there's a cost to do a 22 fundraiser. You hope that your income exceeds your -- 23 sometimes they don't. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And a lot of times there are 25 other places that are rented; the Inn of the Hills and -- and 10-8-07 77 1 the Y.O. resort don't give those away for fundraisers. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Exactly. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And we have costs, and I'm 4 not sure that the taxpayers should subsidize each and every 5 one of these different organizations. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Shouldn't subsidize any of 7 them. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And so that's -- I think 9 that's going to be a change that we're going to deal with, 10 and I think it's justified that we -- that we do charge for 11 -- you know, what we spend as much as possible. 'Cause we 12 give away a lot of time to the 4-H, and we should, and the 13 Stock Show Association. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But if -- if everyone's in 15 agreement on the nonprofits list, which is a free use, 16 everybody else pays full rate until they come to the Court 17 and get such designation. I'll make a motion that we approve 18 the Kerr County Facilities Booking Rental Policy, as amended 19 today, the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center and Union Church 20 User Agreement, the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center 21 Reservation and Event Information Form, and the list of 22 nonprofits to get free use of the Hill Country Youth Exhibit 23 Center. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 10-8-07 78 1 indicated. Further question or discussion on the motion? 2 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 3 hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's take 8 about a 15-minute recess. 9 (Recess taken from 10:36 a.m. to 10:55 a.m.) 10 - - - - - - - - - - 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to order. 12 First, let's go back to Item 10; consider, discuss, and take 13 appropriate action to nominate and elect Appraisal District 14 Board of Director members for the 2008-2009 term. 15 Ms. Grinstead, what -- where did we go to try and find out 16 where we are on that? 17 MS. GRINSTEAD: I called the Appraisal District, 18 and they're closed for the holiday. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: And? 20 MS. GRINSTEAD: And I called Diane Bolin, and she 21 was not sure. So, I got no one. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The only other question, is 24 there a window in which to do this? Are we going to miss 25 that window? 10-8-07 79 1 MS. GRINSTEAD: I couldn't get any information. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Since we -- 3 JUDGE TINLEY: The window says, "by written 4 resolution to the chief appraiser before October 15," we 5 submit the name of nominees. It might be appropriate -- I 6 think the only one we have is Charles Lewis. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How about we defer on this till 8 right after lunch? I'll call him and find out. He'll know 9 who it is. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Only one other question 12 about that, too, Judge. In reading the -- the eligibility 13 and so forth that Mr. Coates provided us, it talks about the 14 Tax Assessor/Collector. Did we not establish the Tax 15 Assessor/Collector as a nonvoting member of that board? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: By law, she is a member of that 17 board, and -- and a nonvoting member, I think. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, thank you. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to Item 12; 20 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to adopt 21 T.C.D.R.S. plan for 2008. I put this on the calendar -- on 22 the agenda, rather. As you know, we've got to submit 23 annually our Texas County and District Retirement System plan 24 each year by sometime in December, I think it is. We made, I 25 think, one change, possibly two last year, and then we 10-8-07 80 1 recently approved, as part of our budget process, or during 2 that same time frame, a 50 percent retiree COLA, which puts 3 us in a position of having our current rate of 8.2, I believe 4 it is -- 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: -- as shown, and then the -- the 7 retiree COLA is as set forth in that schedule; that's .088. 8 Now, in addition to that, we have a life insurance component, 9 and that's either .28 or .29, I believe. The bottom line of 10 all of this means that we are within our budgeted rate, 11 including the cost of the COLA. I merely need direction from 12 the Court in order to make the report for T.C.D.R.S., and 13 where we are is based on what we did last year plus a 14 50 percent COLA which we adopted for retirees for this plan 15 year. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The 8.20 is an inclusive 17 rate? It's the percentage, the COLA for the retirees, and 18 the life insurance? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: No, sir. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's not? 21 JUDGE TINLEY: The 8.20 does not include either of 22 those two components. That's the adjusted rate for this 23 year, based upon what we -- what we had in place for last 24 year. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 8.51. 10-8-07 81 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Now, what had to be added to last 2 year's rate was the .28 or .29 for the life portion of it. 3 That's a separate component, and that would also have to be 4 added to this one. And, in addition, we would have to add 5 the retiree 50 percent COLA that we approved last month. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, we'd be adding .36. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Approximately, yeah. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: To the 8.2. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: For a total of 8.56, or 11 very close. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, mm-hmm. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: And that's within what we have 15 budgeted. I think we've got budgeted, like, 8.9. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think you're right. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Because that -- they recrunch those 18 numbers every year. That's why you see a different number 19 all the way across the bottom. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And this year, we're 21 getting the benefit of kind of a -- a high interest earnings 22 to the fund. We're getting some benefit from that. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: May not always get that. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Sometimes it goes up, sometimes it 10-8-07 82 1 goes down. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge -- 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's the chicken and 4 feather routine. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do we have any -- under the 7 retirement eligibility, do we have any say in that, or is 8 that all dictated by the T.C. -- whatever it is? 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Thinking about retiring? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, just looking at it. I'm 11 thinking of some of -- you know, we have some -- as I look at 12 this, you know, some of our employees have 30 years of 13 service, which qualifies them for retirement, and they really 14 don't have any incentive to stay around. But if we could 15 kick up their retirement check if they stayed longer, if you 16 went, like, to 35 or 40 years of service and got more money 17 at that point, that may entice them to be worthwhile for them 18 to stay. One I'm thinking that just comes to mind is, like, 19 Doug Koennecke. Doug's got 30 years of service, I think. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He's 53 or so. And, I mean, 22 from a retirement standpoint, there's no benefit for him 23 really staying with the County, but he's certainly a great 24 asset to the County. I hope he stays. I think he's planning 25 on -- he hasn't told me he's leaving or anything. But, you 10-8-07 83 1 know, if you could increase his retirement amount, and for 2 all employees, if you have 35 years of service or 40 years of 3 service, you get a greater percentage of your final salary, 4 that may be something -- 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Actually, I think it does. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It does? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: I think it does, because it's 8 essentially an annuity, so the greater the contributions in 9 the 30 -- for example in the 31st, 32nd years, there are 10 going to be greater contributions into his annuity fund, 11 which would increase, you know. Plus he's -- plus he's 12 getting older, which means it's going to be paid out over a 13 shorter period of time, using standard actuarial methods, so 14 it's -- he'll be getting some benefit of it. What we can do 15 is, we -- we have the ability to determine the eligibility, 16 and right now we are at 60 years of age and eight years or 17 more, because it takes eight years to vest; the rule of 75, 18 which is when your age plus years of service equal 75, you're 19 eligible; or 30 years of service at any age. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Those are our eligibility 22 requirements now. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, that answered that 24 question. Thank you. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I was just going to comment; 10-8-07 84 1 what you were saying, Judge, is correct. Like mine, I'm 2 eligible, but if I retire now, it's, like, 1,700 a month. 3 But what Jonathan is saying, the longer I stay -- if I stay 4 another four years, it goes to almost 3,400 a month, so it 5 does go up with your years. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, good. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, if you remember, 8 what is the life insurance component here? 9 JUDGE TINLEY: The amount? 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: 20,000. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: In this one? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. We've got two different -- 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I know. That's -- I get 15 confused. I thought 20 was what we added in our benefit 16 package, and this was salary. This is salary. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: We have two of them. We have a 18 20,000 component -- we have a 20,000 component in our health 19 benefits plan, as a component of that also. We'll hear about 20 that at 1:30 this afternoon. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And there's also another 22 component of that, Judge, that I found out, 'cause I had a 23 couple employees over the past years that did that; that it 24 pays them on top of that. It pays them one year of full 25 salary to their survivors. Whatever their salary is, it pays 10-8-07 85 1 that amount too. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are you talking about 3 T.C.D.R.S.? 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I thought it was. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's kind of why I was 6 asking the question. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 'Cause I had -- I had -- well, 8 the dispatcher that died on duty a couple years ago, his 9 spouse actually got a full year's salary plus the life 10 insurance policy. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: That's if you were an active 12 full-time employee. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: At time of death. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, mm-hmm. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And that would have been in 16 addition to the beneficiary annuity? 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, yes. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Because there is a -- there 21 is a beneficiary annuity. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right, he also got that. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. That's kind of what 24 I thought, but I wasn't sure. So, what do you need, Judge? 25 JUDGE TINLEY: I need a motion to file with the 10-8-07 86 1 T.C.D.R.S. our plan for 2008, to be what we've got in place 2 to this point, plus the 50 percent retiree -- 50 percent COLA 3 for retirees adopted last month. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And the life insurance 5 component? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, yeah. That's already in 7 place, though. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 11 indicated. Further question or discussion? All in favor of 12 the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll go to 17 Item 13; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action on 18 interlocal agreement with Kendall County and the City of 19 Kerrville for EMS in the Falling Waters Subdivision area. 20 Commissioner Letz? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I forgot that -- I've been 22 working on this. I forgot that y'all don't have copies of 23 the agreements. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, we don't. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I can briefly go over them. We 10-8-07 87 1 can maybe pass on them if you want to read it before we ask 2 the Judge to sign it. This is -- goes back to the agreement 3 for basically Falling Waters, The Reserve subdivisions. We 4 got a draft from Kendall County a while back. The City -- 5 their draft did not include the City of Kerrville, and had an 6 indemnification clause where they wanted us to indemnify them 7 in case there was any kind of a problem. There was a -- two 8 areas that were changed. The City has gone through it, and 9 Mike Hayes has redrafted it. It includes the City of 10 Kerrville as a signing party to the agreement, and it also 11 eliminated the indemnification clause, which the County 12 Attorney also wanted out. Other than that, it's pretty much 13 just a -- the agreement, and I'll hand it out. The only 14 reason I'm going this far right now is 'cause Eric's here in 15 case anybody has any questions for him. The hope is that we 16 can approve this today, send it to Kendall County. It's very 17 close to the form that they originally sent to us, which is 18 very close to what we -- you know, they kind of drafted -- 19 modeled their original draft after our West Kerr County 20 agreement with Junction, so it was -- it's not onerous. 21 Under the basic terms, it basically just says that 22 if the Comfort ambulance is in, they will respond into Kerr 23 County, and to pretty much all households that are addressed 24 off Highway 87 or you get to off Highway 87 north of Comfort. 25 We'll pay a fee. Eric and I were talking a little bit about 10-8-07 88 1 that, and I'm going to recommend an annual fee of -- flat fee 2 of $3,000 that we pay Kendall County. That's higher than the 3 per-call rate, kind of, that -- or per capita rate we pay the 4 City. We pay them about $9.45. When we were at our meeting, 5 Eric and I, with Kendall County, they were talking about -- 6 more about $24, $25 per capita, so I thought $15 per capita, 7 which there's about 200 people that are in their service 8 area, plus or minus, and 15 was somewhere in between. We're 9 not -- you know, they should accept that. I think we're 10 being a little bit generous, in my mind, but it's not that 11 much money to get this thing done. They only send the 12 Comfort ambulance; all the dispatch, everything else stays 13 with City of Kerrville, and if the Comfort ambulance is out, 14 Kerrville EMS will respond. So, it's only under -- it's 15 pretty limited use, but it will allow the Comfort ambulance 16 out of Kendall County to go into Kerr County and do the 17 transports. But I apologize for not giving everyone a copy 18 of it. I've been reading through it this morning a few 19 times, and neglected to hand it out. But, any questions 20 other than looking at the contract? 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This solves the problem? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If they accept it. Hopefully, 23 they'll accept the agreement. I mean, this is -- it's a 24 pretty big step. We've been working on this, I think, for 25 four years. 10-8-07 89 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's amazing that it takes that 3 long. But I would like y'all to read it before, so we could 4 maybe, right before 1:30, maybe come back at 1:15 from lunch, 5 and give y'all time over lunch to read it. It's only a 6 two-page document. But if anyone has any questions of Eric, 7 he's been involved with the negotiations the whole way. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Essentially, you guys would be 9 secondary response? 10 MR. MALONEY: Yes, sir. We'd still have the 11 capacity to respond as the primary responder, since Kendall 12 County is not willing to take it 100 percent where the calls 13 will actually go to their dispatch center. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 15 MR. MALONEY: So they are strictly willing to offer 16 Comfort EMS as a primary responder. Call still comes into 17 our dispatch at the PSAP here. It would be transferred to 18 Kendall County. Kendall County, in turn, would then dispatch 19 Comfort EMS. If they were available, they will take the 20 call; we'll never know -- we'll never hear any more about it. 21 If they're not, they're going to have to -- 22 JUDGE TINLEY: PSAP's going to know immediately 23 whether or not they're going to be available, right? 24 MR. MALONEY: Not ours, no, sir. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: No. No, whether Comfort is going to 10-8-07 90 1 be available to respond. 2 MR. MALONEY: Yes, sir. Yes, sir. And -- 3 JUDGE TINLEY: So that gives them the option, then, 4 if -- if Comfort's not going to be able to respond, they can 5 dispatch you guys. 6 MR. MALONEY: Yes, sir. So the call would come 7 into here, and we would forward it to their PSAP in Kendall 8 County. If Comfort's not available, they would immediately 9 probably come right back, so -- and, right, in turn, they 10 should know if they're in-house or not and if they are able 11 to respond. So, we're not giving them 100 percent, so it 12 isn't -- I guess the Y.O., I think we gave them 100 percent 13 to Kimble County, as opposed to this is -- we're still kind 14 of the primary responder, where Comfort's just going to be 15 first. So -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I'll get copies to 18 everyone. I think we're hopefully done with this. And, you 19 know, the indemnification clause, there could be some 20 heartburn in Kendall County, but I really don't see why. I 21 mean, certainly, they're -- I mean, it's a government entity. 22 I mean, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense why they're 23 going to be adamant about that. 24 MS. BAILEY: Can't indemnify each other by law, 25 so... 10-8-07 91 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move to -- we're going to look 3 at that later, along with Item 10. Let's go to Item 14; 4 consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to ratify 5 TexDOT condemnation acquisition of 3.954 acres at the 6 airport, and authorize County Judge to sign closing documents 7 on behalf of Kerr County in connection with that acquisition. 8 I put this on the agenda. We -- sometime back, back in '04, 9 when -- when TexDOT was doing some condemnation out there, we 10 had a court order which was open dealing with clear zone out 11 there. However, that one spoke to, I think, a 3 point -- a 12 different sized tract, 3.02-acre tract. And inasmuch as the 13 actual amount of the closing and acquisition of the property 14 comes out to be 3.954, just out of an abundance of caution -- 15 TexDOT is doing the funding. The property's going to come 16 into the city and the county, and we've been presented with 17 closing documents for our signature -- my signature. And 18 because the -- the acreage was different, I just wanted to 19 get the Court's approval for me to go ahead and do that as to 20 this different acreage. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: For the record, this is for 22 -- this is as a result of taxiway relocation, which causes 23 the loop road to be shifted over to the north, correct? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: I believe so. 10-8-07 92 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 4 approval. Any question or discussion? All in favor of the 5 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm going to defer on Item 15, and 8 come on down to the approval agenda. Payment of the bills. 9 Ms. Hargis, Page 24, dealing with your office, actually. 10 MS. HARGIS: Yes. That's -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: There's group insurance -- 12 MS. HARGIS: We had some -- a little bit of group 13 insurance left, and that's what I paid the internal auditor 14 that I've hired out of. That's my new internal auditor that 15 I'm sending around. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 17 MS. HARGIS: He's 15 hours a week, and he finished 18 that one item for me. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. 20 MS. HARGIS: So, that's pretty cheap for an audit. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: So, we weren't buying insurance. We 22 were -- 23 MS. HARGIS: No, it's an amendment. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. There is a contract -- 25 MS. HARGIS: Yes, he's only contract. 10-8-07 93 1 JUDGE TINLEY: -- for his services? Okay. 2 MS. HARGIS: And for those of you who are not 3 aware, he's going to be working about 12 to 15 hours a week, 4 and we're going to try to get all the internal audits done of 5 every department before January. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 7 MS. HARGIS: So that we have kind of a handle on 8 that. I thought everybody would feel better if we got that 9 done. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 11 MS. HARGIS: And that's his occupation by trade, 12 was an internal auditor. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Page 31, next to the last item. 14 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Liberty Flags and Specialty. Flags, 16 $800? 17 MS. HARGIS: I didn't review that one. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Page 31? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 20 MS. HARGIS: I'll have to look at the invoice on 21 that one. Did you -- do you know something about it? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, I just had the occasion to 23 buy some flags not too long ago, and depending on how many 24 flags that is, that's probably not out of line. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10-8-07 94 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And they don't have a very -- 2 they have a very short life expectancy, too. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Pretty expensive. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And they tend to be a lot 5 bigger than you think they are, too. I mean, I thought, you 6 know, a little -- I was planning to buy a 3-by-5. I asked 7 them, what should I buy for the height of the pole? They 8 told me I needed a 10-by-12, and I went down a little bit. 9 But, anyway, flags are expensive. 10 MS. HARGIS: They have gotten pretty expensive. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And they only last about, I 12 think, three months, something like that, is what they 13 project them, you know. 14 MS. HARGIS: If they -- yeah. Since we've moved 15 here, ours is torn up because of the wind. Anything else? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to Page 46. In-town 17 mileage we're paying? I can certainly understand 18 out-of-town. I don't think -- you know, that's kind of like 19 commuting expense. You can't -- 20 MS. HARGIS: We paid two of these this time, and we 21 had the department head sign off on them and they authorized 22 it. So -- 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Who was the other one? For the 24 department head? 25 MS. HARGIS: No, the other one was for another 10-8-07 95 1 clerk that was going -- going to the bank as well. I think 2 this one is probably for deposits and things of that nature. 3 I think, you know, we're asking people to use their personal 4 cars, and, you know, a lot of times if you -- you know, 5 unless I have to, I don't move mine. And so, you know, a lot 6 of people bring their lunch and stuff, so they feel like if 7 they have to take their car to go to the bank. I can look 8 this one up too, but that's what -- you know. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Does -- does the 4-H 10 Coordinator get an allowance? 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, there's all sorts of travel 12 allowances that they get out there. They get -- they get 13 special allowances for stock show. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They get stock show; they get a 15 regular travel allowance. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: They get regular travel allowance. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Travel allowance should cover 18 her in-county. I mean, you know -- 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If this is -- this is not 20 part of the in-county -- part of that line item. 21 MS. HARGIS: Let me look this one up. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: I think this is a very slippery 23 slope that we don't want to start down. 24 MS. HARGIS: Okay, I agree. I agree. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: And if -- if somebody doesn't want 10-8-07 96 1 to take their car to the bank, maybe they can be put to 2 scrubbing floors while somebody else goes to the bank. Is 3 that not an option? They won't have to leave that way. 4 MS. HARGIS: Whatever the Court wants me to do. 5 I'm not... 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Next question I got is on the Tetra 7 Tech. We have that money in-hand? 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What page is that? I'm 11 looking for it. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Way towards the back, Bill. 60. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 60. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, that's what I was 15 looking for. We do have it both from U.G.R.A. and Water 16 Development Board? 17 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, we finished up all that. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: That's all the questions I got. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 22 approval. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 23 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10-8-07 97 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Budget 3 amendments. Again, I thank you for the summary. Makes 4 things so much easier. 5 MS. HARGIS: And there are a lot of them, because 6 this is the end of the year. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 8 MS. HARGIS: And I reviewed each and every one of 9 them. We went through and made sure that if we took -- if we 10 moved from that line item, we'd have sufficient to pay out in 11 that particular fund. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: These are all attributable 13 to the '06-'07 budget? 14 MS. HARGIS: Right. We should have probably one 15 more, this next one. And -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Other than Road and Bridge? 17 MS. HARGIS: Right. Now, we're putting that one 18 as -- actually as an encumbrance, which is different from an 19 accounts payable. Which is -- Tommy had used the term a 20 little differently than I like to refer to it. An 21 encumbrance is some -- a product that you know you can't -- 22 you want to -- you've ordered it, but it hasn't come in, or 23 it's a function you're in the process of doing. These are 24 actually bills that were incurred in the month of September, 25 so we should have some more electric bills, things of that 10-8-07 98 1 nature, gas. Normal. It's not on the agenda, but we talked 2 about -- I understand y'all talked about it at the budget 3 meeting, possibly going to a weekly meeting so that we could 4 pay bills. My suggestion would be that we leave it on a 5 Monday, if we did it. That way you'd receive your packets in 6 the same way; get them on a Friday. You're already used to 7 coming in on Monday. And that's up to y'all. I think my 8 staff -- we feel like we can accomplish that by doing it in 9 that manner, and it would make our bills be paid more on a 10 timely basis until we can get that P.O. system in place. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: If -- if people pay attention to the 12 policy on budget amendments and we get timely action by 13 department heads on -- or if we go off of invoice, for 14 example, won't that solve the problem? 15 MS. HARGIS: It's not the invoices that's the 16 problem. It was -- it was really the holding of those bills 17 while the amendments were being approved that was the 18 problem. If -- as you notice, the last month, six weeks 19 since I found those sitting in there and made them pay them 20 immediately, we haven't had any. You don't have any late 21 bills. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 23 MS. HARGIS: Let's go -- let's try a month and see 24 how we do. I think I'm going to -- in fact, I haven't talked 25 with John, but I talked to the new person -- I forgot his 10-8-07 99 1 name -- about finding out exactly who has Incode and who 2 doesn't. We are passing out budget books to every department 3 head so that they'll all have a budget book, and they'll know 4 what their budget was along with everyone else's. And if 5 they have access to Incode, they can look up their own 6 financials on a daily basis. They should be able to see what 7 they're doing. The departments are getting us the bills 8 fairly promptly; it's just that we were holding them. And 9 paying the invoices per the statement, the vendor doesn't 10 care about that. That wasn't the problem. If you went over 11 on that statement, then that statement got held another two 12 weeks. So, if -- if everyone complies with the way it's 13 written, and they don't purchase something that they know is 14 going to go over their line item before they get permission, 15 we'll be fine. And if they don't, I'm going to make them 16 come here. I'm not paying it. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: I think that'll solve the problem, 18 Ms. Hargis. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the only time we 20 might -- if you look at the calendar, between you and Jody, 21 on our court dates, just the way the calendar falls, about 22 twice a year, maybe three times, there's a three-week gap 23 between our second and our first meeting, and we may look at 24 those ahead of time and get -- you know, and just post a 25 meeting right in that gap. 10-8-07 100 1 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, there's some months where you 2 have five weeks, and those would be a good time to do that. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is one of those 4 periods. During October/November is one of those periods, I 5 think. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 7 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, October does have five weeks. 8 But I think right now, we don't have any bills; we're pretty 9 much caught up, so I think we'll be fine. If -- if it looks 10 like we're going to have a problem, then I'll -- I'll let 11 y'all know. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: I think if -- if the elected 13 official or department head must present their budget 14 amendment, or be available to do that, or both, that may 15 solve the problem. 16 MS. HARGIS: Well, I think if they all have access 17 to their own financials and we show them how to actually look 18 at that account to see what they've spent, who their vendors 19 are, and how much money they actually have left, I think 20 that'll help all of them. That -- that's -- in the past, 21 when my clients could have the access to their own -- you 22 know, on a daily basis, that made a big difference. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval of the budget 24 amendments as presented. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 10-8-07 101 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 2 approval as indicated. Question or discussion? All in favor 3 of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Do we have 8 any late bills, Ms. Hargis? 9 MS. HARGIS: That's it. No late bills. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I've been presented with 11 monthly reports from Constable, Precinct 1; Constable, 12 Precinct 4; Constable, Precinct 2; Justice of the Peace, 13 Precinct 3; District Clerk and Environmental Health 14 Department; and Justice of the Peace, Precinct 1. Do I hear 15 a motion that these reports be approved as presented? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 19 approval. Any question or discussion? All in favor of the 20 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Any reports 25 from Commissioners in connection with their assignments in 10-8-07 102 1 various capacities? Commissioner 2? 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Only thing, I'd just like 3 to note that the current unemployment rate for Kerr County is 4 down to 3 -- I'm sorry, it's -- yeah, it is down. We are at 5 3.8, yeah, down a little bit from last month. That's it. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Letz? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't believe I have 8 anything. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner 4? 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Animal Control is going to 11 get a new bed and some cages out -- I think they got them 12 actually last -- before the end of the budget year. Got a 13 flatbed. The old truck with the solid fiberglass cages that 14 was acquired from the City just kind of fell apart, and 15 there's no ventilation. The fans quit working and some of 16 the doors came off, and -- and those things need to be -- it 17 wasn't -- it wasn't humane to haul animals in any more, so 18 they got some cages from Ingram, as per our contract; they 19 gave us some of their things that they wouldn't need any 20 more, and they purchased a flatbed, I think, from Back 40 21 Supply, and they have that truck operational again. Ag Barn, 22 stalls are gone. They were moved out almost immediately. 23 Library, we haven't had a meeting since our budget was 24 adopted. We'll have one, I think, next week. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: You'll be able to carry the good 10-8-07 103 1 news to them. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Environmental Health -- yeah. 3 Environmental Health is working. They're having some 4 problems with -- in the Ingram area because of, you know, 5 some failed systems. We had a lot of wet weather, for one 6 thing, but encouraging them to work very closely and 7 carefully with the people in the west that are having septic 8 problems, to do minor repairs, maybe come to the Court for -- 9 for exceptions or variances. To solve the health issue, but 10 not to make those people put in all brand-new systems, 11 knowing they're going to have a wastewater system coming 12 their way in the next year or two years. I think it's 13 unfair. I think -- and I'd ask them that they -- when they 14 get into a situation like that, to come to the Court and ask 15 us to grant a variance or exception to rules that will solve 16 the problem temporarily, and then also have the residents 17 sign saying that they will abandon the system as soon as the 18 wastewater lines are available. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree with that. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I just don't -- I can't -- 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Long as we get the potential health 22 issue resolved. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Get the health issue taken 24 care of. I cannot, in good faith, or any other way, justify 25 somebody spending $8,000 for a system, knowing that it's 10-8-07 104 1 going to be abandoned in a year or two. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're right. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, that's -- I wanted to let 4 y'all know that. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Also, I mean, there's -- or is 6 there a requirement that residents hook up to the city 7 system? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Far as I know, it's going to 9 be -- it's going to be mandatory. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. I think City of 11 Ingram is adopting an ordinance to that effect. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That is the way the grants 13 were acquired, was that people would be mandated in that area 14 to hook up. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If we get the EDAP funds 16 that we're asking for Center Point, that will be mandatory 17 there, too. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You'll be having the same 19 kind of issues in Center Point -- 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Exactly. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- that we have in Ingram, 22 and I think that's the best way to handle them. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably makes sense. That's 24 reasonable. I mean -- 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Other than that, I don't have 10-8-07 105 1 anything. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I need to inform the Court 3 Lynn Capers, who is the communications supervisor here with 4 D.P.S., of course, when D.P.S. shut down its operation here, 5 she relocated to San Angelo, and as a result of that, it was 6 necessary that she resign her position, and she has submitted 7 her resignation from the Regional Emergency Preparedness 8 Advisory Committee that's administered out of AACOG. So, we 9 will have to be taking steps to refill that position, so if 10 anybody -- any member of the Court or any member of the 11 public has anyone in mind that they think would be a good 12 candidate to replace that individual -- Ms. Capers has 13 extraordinary training and experience in communications, and 14 if there's anyone having similar qualifications, we'd be 15 interested in considering them for that position. That's all 16 I got. Why don't we come back to Item 15, and that's a 17 matter that Commissioner Williams and I need to talk about to 18 you in executive session. So, it is 11:30 now, and we will 19 go out of closed -- I mean open or public session at this 20 time to go into closed session to consider Item 15; pending 21 proposal by letter of intent to lease a portion of the Kerr 22 County Juvenile Detention Facility, Cornerstone Programs 23 Corporation. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, in addition to the 25 County Attorney, I asked Mr. Stanton to join us in this 10-8-07 106 1 discussion. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3 (The open session was closed at 11:30 a.m., and an executive session was held, the transcript of which 4 is contained in a separate document.) 5 - - - - - - - - - - 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, we will come back to public or 7 open session at 11:53. We have a couple of items that need 8 to be addressed that we're going to have to get more 9 information on, so we will be in recess until 1:15. 10 (Recess taken from 11:54 a.m. to 1:28 p.m.) 11 - - - - - - - - - - 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to order, if 13 we might. We got a couple of tail-end details we want to 14 take a look at. First off, let's take a look at Item 10. 15 Did you get any information from Mr. Lewis? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, I did. The -- and also, I 17 read the thing a little bit closer. The person that is 18 actually rotating off, it looks like, is going to be Stanley 19 Beard, who's the representative of K.I.S.D. He's in poor 20 health, and he's probably coming off, but we need to -- by 21 reading through this, we need to nominate Chuck Lewis as 22 well. All five spots are open right now, or come open the 23 end of this year, so we'll need to nominate Chuck Lewis to 24 keep him on the board from our spot. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10-8-07 107 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But the reasoning -- but there 2 is a potential opening coming under K.I.S.D., who is Stanley 3 Beard. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: And we've generally been lucky to 5 get one seat on that board, haven't we? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. And we can nominate more 7 than -- we can nominate up to five, but I think historically, 8 we've just nominated the one, hoping that, you know, that 9 that's all we're -- would like to have. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Keeping all of our votes for what we 11 would otherwise cast for five for the one candidate. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's what we've done in 13 the past. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Right. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. So, under that item, 16 I'll make a motion that we nominate Charles Lewis to serve on 17 the Kerr Central Appraisal District Board of Directors. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I second that emotion. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second. Any 20 further question or discussion on the motion? All in favor 21 of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll move 10-8-07 108 1 to Item 13, and reconsider, discuss, and take appropriate 2 action on the interlocal agreement with Kendall County and 3 the City of Kerrville for EMS in the Falling Waters 4 Subdivision area. There was a draft of a contract presented. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The only modification -- or not 6 talking about change, just filling in one of the blanks. The 7 sum for this, I'd recommend we put in $3,000, which is just a 8 flat fee, rather than going on a per service call. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Annual fee? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Annual fee. You probably 12 didn't get a copy. 13 MR. EMERSON: Is there any indemnification cause? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, this is the one without the 15 indemnification. 16 MR. EMERSON: Thank you. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And the only other -- the 18 changes, from what we received from Kendall County, really 19 are just a few minor changes City of Kerrville put in there 20 related to verbiage, services -- and this is a services 21 agreement, not an interlocal agreement, and things that 22 really don't do a whole lot. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: And the $3,000 will be a flat annual 24 fee? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 10-8-07 109 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that a motion? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, that's a motion. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and second for 6 approval of the contract as indicated. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I'll get this down to -- 8 authorize County Judge to sign same, and I will get a copy of 9 this down to Judge Schroeder in Kendall County. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Very well. Any further question or 11 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 12 your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. Commissioner 17 Williams, you had something else on Item 15? 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I did, Judge. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: During lunch, I had a call 21 from the Cornerstone folks, and so I returned that call, and 22 in addition to the Court's position on moving forward on the 23 letter of intent, they are wondering if we would be so good 24 as to give them a letter which they can put in their proposal 25 back to T.Y.C. indicating our support for their proposal. 10-8-07 110 1 And the letter would read along these lines: "This letter is 2 in regards to Cornerstone Programs and its proposal to 3 operate a youth facility in a preexisting building within 4 Kerr County. We have had the opportunity to meet with 5 Cornerstone representatives and review, et cetera, their 6 proposal number whatever. We specifically were made aware of 7 the following points: One, facility will house at least 48 8 at-risk T.Y.C. youthful male offenders, ages 10 to 13, and 9 two, educational services will be provided on facility 10 grounds through the Woods Charter School system. This 11 correspondence is not contractual by nature; however, its 12 purpose is to state that, as local officials in Kerr County, 13 we have been notified and support the project Cornerstone 14 Programs is pursuing in our county." 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It'll be a letter of 17 support, and they asked that I convey similar thoughts to 18 K.I.S.D. Any problem with that -- with doing that? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we know that this 20 charter school's going to provide these things? We already 21 know that? 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: This letter of support, in fact, -- 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, we do know that. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: -- requires that, I think. 10-8-07 111 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Our letter of intent 2 embodies that as well. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: And you're seeking formal approval 5 by the Court to send that letter? 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved -- second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 10 approval of the transmittal of the letter as indicated. Any 11 further question or discussion on the matter? 12 MR. EMERSON: Just a general comment. As the Court 13 may or may not be aware, it's my understanding that the 14 director of contracts for T.Y.C. resigned last week. The 15 assistant director for T.Y.C. contracts was terminated the 16 week before. The person that's over the director for 17 contracts, it is my understanding, is potentially leaving 18 this week. So, despite Cornerstone's good intentions, this 19 may all come to a screeching halt, because there's nobody 20 left at T.Y.C. to review the contracts. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They mentioned that, 22 because there was an article in the Houston Chronicle, I'm 23 told, about that, Mr. County Attorney. It's just more of the 24 upheaval at T.Y.C. These folks seem to think they're working 25 sufficiently well off of the programming side, more with the 10-8-07 112 1 financial side. They're aware of it. They're very much 2 aware of it. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Buster? And Bill's going to 4 make sure we get a resolution from K.I.S.D. as well. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thanking us for our 6 position and making certain that this happened. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Whoop-de-do. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Our extraordinary efforts to protect 9 their interests in this matter. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Have been successful. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or discussion 12 on the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by 13 raising your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Gentlemen, 18 do we have any further business to attend to in connection 19 with the regular Commissioners Court agenda posted for this 20 date? If not, that meeting will be adjourned. 21 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 1:35 p.m.) 22 - - - - - - - - - - 23 24 25 10-8-07 113 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 11th day of October, 8 2007. 9 10 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 11 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 12 Certified Shorthand Reporter 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 10-8-07