1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Special Session 10 Monday, October 22, 2007 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X October 22, 2007 2 PAGE --- Commissioners' Comments 5 3 1.1 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 4 adopt Proclamation or Resolution in support of veterans and Veteran's Day 2007, as requested 5 by Kerrville American Legion Post 208 11 6 1.2 Consider/discuss, adopt 2007-2008 Kerr County Community Plan for submission to Alamo Area 7 Council of Governments 16 8 1.3 Open sealed bids for Kerr County 4-H Livestock Project Center 22 9 1.4 Consider/discuss, approve appointment of 10 election judges and alternates for term of one year in accordance with the Texas Election Code 24 11 1.7 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 12 adopt Kerr County Employees Health Benefits Plan for 2008 25 13 1.5 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 14 consolidate cellular telephone contracts into a single account; authorize County Judge to sign 47 15 1.11 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 16 request from Kerrville Christmas Lighting Corp- oration to participate in or otherwise assist in 17 cost of electrical upgrades at courthouse 55 18 1.6 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to up- date broadband internet services agreement with 19 Time Warner Cable; authorize County Judge to sign 61 20 1.8 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for re- vision of plat, Lot 67 of Cypress Springs Estates, 21 Phase 2, Section One; set public hearing for same 63 22 1.9 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to amend Court Order #30504 to use Fund 20 to purchase used 23 excavator 65 24 1.10 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to accept petition to vacate and discontinue road for part 25 of Upper Turtle Creek Road, and posting of same 67 3 1 I N D E X (Continued) October 22, 2007 2 PAGE 1.12 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 3 issues related to the Airport Board 70 4 1.13 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to honor request from Texas Association for Home 5 Care to declare November 2007 as home care and hospice month in Kerr County 85 6 1.14 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 7 approve contracts with Kerr Economic Development Foundation, Big Brothers and Sisters, K'Star, 8 Divide VFD, Mountain Home VFD, Center Point VFD, Hunt VFD, Comfort VFD, Elm Pass VFD, Ingram VFD, 9 Castle Lake VFD, and Tierra Linda VFD; allow County Judge to sign same 86 10 1.15 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 11 authorize the draining of Ingram Lake 91 12 1.16 Set date and time for a workshop on long-range planning, improvements, maintenance, etc., for 13 county parks 100 14 1.17 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to set public hearing for revision of Kerr County 15 Subdivision Rules and Regulations 103 16 1.18 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to adopt a resolution regarding 2008 Kerr County 17 Resolution for Indigent Defense Grant Program 107 18 4.1 Pay Bills 109 4.2 Budget Amendments 113 19 4.3 Late Bills --- 4.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 114 20 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee 21 Assignments 115 22 5.2 Reports from Elected Officials/Department Heads 120 23 --- Adjourned 123 24 25 4 1 On Monday, October 22, 2007, at 9:00 a.m., a special 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. 8 Let me call to order this regular meeting of the Kerr County 9 Commissioners Court scheduled for this date and time, Monday, 10 October the 22nd, 2007, at 9 a.m. It is that time now. 11 Commissioner Letz? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Please stand and join me in a 13 moment of prayer, followed by the pledge. 14 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. At this time, if there's 16 any member of the audience that wishes to be heard on any 17 matter that is not a listed agenda item, feel free to come 18 forward and tell us what's on your mind. If you wish to be 19 heard on an agenda item, we'd ask that you fill out a 20 participation form. They can be found at the rear of the 21 room. It's not absolutely essential that you do that; 22 however, by doing so, it alerts me that there is someone that 23 wishes to be heard on an agenda item, and hopefully I won't 24 miss you that way. But even if you don't fill out one of 25 those forms, if you wish to be heard on an agenda item, if 10-22-07 5 1 you'll get my attention in some fashion when we get to that 2 item, I'll give you a reasonable opportunity to be heard. 3 But right now, if there's anybody that wishes to be heard on 4 any matter that is not a listed agenda item, feel free to 5 come forward at this time. Seeing no one coming forward, 6 we'll move on. Commissioner Letz, what do you have for us 7 this morning? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: First, you know, if someone's 9 trying to get his attention and throws something, make sure 10 you err -- throw it that direction rather than this 11 direction. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have a couple things this 14 morning. This chair is -- 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Must have short people sit in 16 these things periodically. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The eastern part of the county 18 had a loss of two very great leaders in that area in the past 19 couple weeks. A former commissioner, Adolph Bartel, died, a 20 commissioner for 24 years in Precinct 3. Those that didn't 21 know him really missed a treasure of an individual. Probably 22 one of the most mild-mannered, kind people you could ever 23 meet. I talked to him frequently since I've been a 24 commissioner. He was very helpful and supportive always, but 25 just an absolutely fantastic person. One thing I didn't 10-22-07 6 1 realize until some of the services, he was also a very 2 accomplished violin player, and in his younger days spent 3 much of his weekend time fiddling around the hill country. 4 Interesting -- very interesting man. The other one was one 5 of my cousins, Gregory Krauter. He lost his life over, I 6 guess, 10 days ago now. He was, I guess, known the most as 7 the person that ran the Ingenhuett Store in Comfort that 8 burned down a little over a year ago. Very interesting guy. 9 He was my brother's age, little bit older. I spent many of 10 my summer days playing with him and his younger brother 11 Peter. But his loss -- he knew a lot about Comfort, and with 12 his death, a lot of the history and knowledge of Comfort also 13 passed. So, two -- two sad events. 14 Other things going on in the eastern part of the 15 county, for those that haven't been through Comfort this time 16 of year, or this year, there's a thing called Scarecrows in 17 Comfort, and it's really grown in popularity, and almost 18 every business in town puts up a scarecrow exhibit and 19 there's competition. And I'm not sure who won, but it's fun 20 to drive around town and see the scarecrows this time of 21 year. There was an antique show this past weekend that was 22 quite successful. Luckily, it got in before the rains came. 23 And I think the final note, I had a call from Judge Schroeder 24 on the way in this morning saying that the EMS issue in the 25 eastern part of the county is on their agenda for approval 10-22-07 7 1 today, so this thing will probably be done after four or five 2 years. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I was going to guess three. 4 It's longer than that? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Longer than that. I mean, I 6 know Commissioner -- Bruce is in his second year now -- I 7 think second year, and it predated him by three or four 8 years. So, it's been on the -- anyway, looks like it's 9 finally going to happen. That is all I have. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Oehler? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, we had the Mountain 12 Home Volunteer Fire Department fish fry not this past 13 weekend, but the one before, and -- and we need to plan a bit 14 more for next year, because we had over double the crowd that 15 we had the year before. We need to improve our serving lines 16 and have more of them and more fish. And it's unbelievable 17 how much -- how many people we had. Preliminary figures, 18 somewhere around $12,000, I think, is what they raised. 19 Unbelievable. That's about double what it was last year as 20 well, with the double -- double crowd. But I think a good 21 time was had mostly by all, and that -- big success. If it 22 keeps growing, it will be a big asset to that fire department 23 to hopefully get a new fire station built one of these days, 24 if they can move forward. The other thing is, I did put the 25 burn ban on last week. And all my fire departments called 10-22-07 8 1 and said, "Hey, don't you think it's about time?" And so I 2 did. And, of course, now we've had rain overnight, but it's 3 supposed to be dry behind it, and we didn't get as much rain 4 out west as what you had here in town over in the eastern 5 part of the county, and I don't think that's going to have 6 much effect on that dry blue stuff sticking out about 2 feet 7 tall everywhere. That's about it. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I will probably put the burn 9 ban on probably, I'm guessing, Wednesday. It will go on this 10 week, though, because of the -- now is the time of year the 11 northers blow through and the winds get really gusty. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Baldwin? 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I will probably put mine -- 14 I was planning on putting mine on this morning, as a matter 15 of fact, until we had that heavy, heavy, heavy downpour of 16 probably half a point of rain last night. But I wasn't going 17 to -- I wasn't going to participate this morning, 'cause I'm 18 so excited about being able to serve the great taxpayers of 19 Kerr County, but these two, my colleagues down at the other 20 end of the table, brought up food, one of my favorite topics, 21 so I want to amen what Bruce was saying. The catfish -- 22 you're really good at that. That is good catfish. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We have a good crew. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You have a good crew. And 25 the party at Mountain Home was excellent, and so I'm going to 10-22-07 9 1 start just following Bruce around wherever he goes so I can 2 get good catfish. And I've been going through Buzzie's 3 withdrawal because of his place not open, so I went to 4 Comfort Saturday and ate at Buzzie's to kind of get that 5 little fix and get me over the hump. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The original Buzzie's. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The original Buzzie's, that 8 is correct. And, Judge, I know that is huge important 9 information, and I wanted to the share it with the -- with 10 you in particular. So, thank you for allowing me to do that. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You forgot to tell them you 12 were at Mamacita's for dinner the night before. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I was at Mamacita's for 14 dinner the night before with Commissioner Williams next door 15 to me, and a good time was had by all. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, absolutely. Yeah. 17 Looks like the fame of the Mountain Home Fire Department's 18 fish fry preceded them westward, because I see now a big sign 19 on Eddie Taylor's fence announcing a fish fry by the Center 20 Point Volunteer Fire Department, and they have never done 21 that before. So -- so we're going -- they're going to do 22 something like that over there. But it was a good -- good 23 event you had. I think I'll put the burn ban on also, but 24 since it rained 2 and a half inches, I guess I'll wait a 25 couple days till it dries out and then do it. 10-22-07 10 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Neither one of y'all said 2 anything about Tivy football. Is that just kind of a dead 3 subject? Or -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well -- 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- you just forget? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, you beat somebody 44 7 to nothing, I mean, what is there to talk about? 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 56 to 6, wasn't it? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, fine. That's even 10 worse. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Shows which part of the 12 game you slept through. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I was just trying to 14 be nice, and here you are going to take advantage of people 15 and just hammer them. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- the Mountain Home event was 17 truly a tremendous success, and, I mean, the line just never 18 stopped. Someone made a comment to me, "It looks like they 19 put up a detour sign in Dallas and directed them down here." 20 They just kept coming. So, it was a -- it was a really great 21 event. And, Commissioner, for your information, it's not 22 just catfish. This man has talents of cooking anything. 23 Until you have tried his pork tenderloin, and particularly 24 beef tenderloin, you haven't lived. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 10-22-07 11 1 JUDGE TINLEY: And, yeah, just follow him around. 2 Whatever he wants to cook, that's fine. We need -- we need 3 to put him on the road; we can generate a pretty good profit 4 out of it. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Why don't we open up a 6 restaurant right here? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: One item that may be of interest to 8 some, one of our United States Senators from Texas, John 9 Cornyn, will be in town this coming Saturday. He will be 10 speaking at a luncheon sponsored by the Kerr County 11 Republican Women, and it's going to be out at the Inn of the 12 Hills, so if any of you have an interest of -- of hearing 13 what our U.S. Senator has to say, maybe expressing some of 14 your concerns to him, that may be an opportunity. Let's get 15 on with the business at hand. First item on the agenda is to 16 consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to adopt a 17 proclamation or resolution in support of veterans and 18 Veterans Day 2007, as requested by the Kerrville American 19 Legion Post 208. I put this on the agenda at the request of 20 Mr. Larry Vetter, who is with us today, in support of the 21 efforts that the local American Legion Post 208 is making 22 with respect to veterans, particularly at the hospital, and 23 some of the events they have going on there. If any of the 24 members of the Court have any questions for Mr. Vetter, he's 25 here available for you. 10-22-07 12 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I do. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: As a matter of fact, I 4 wanted you to tell me about these pledges and this walk and 5 fundraising issue. I see where you're planning on walking 6 200 or 300 miles -- 200 or 300 miles here. But I -- is this 7 going to explain it to me? 8 MR. VETTER: No, that's just that's for your 9 signature and your pledge. (Laughter.) 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So -- so you want me to 11 pledge money for you? 12 MR. VETTER: You can be the first of five. I'll 13 collect it from Jody later. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I know. I'm always the 15 first in this room, pal. So, -- 16 MR. VETTER: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- a pledge per-mile? 18 MR. VETTER: Well, you can do that, or you can make 19 a -- this is not -- this is just -- that's a side issue, that 20 pledge sheet. But what we're doing -- for you it's a side 21 issue. But -- 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 23 MR. VETTER: -- what we're doing -- what we're 24 doing -- and I got to tell you, it is wonderful to be 25 standing in front of you not on city government business. 10-22-07 13 1 This is really -- this is really nice. But -- and to still 2 see, you know, so many of the same faces. But the American 3 Legion has several projects that we're working on throughout 4 the year, and one of the things that we really wanted to help 5 with this year is the local V.A. Hospital. As you know, 6 they -- as you probably know, they do not yet have a budget, 7 and they're working on 95 percent of last year's budget, 8 'cause the federal government hasn't come down with any. But 9 we've gone up to Robin Gutierrez and several other people at 10 the V.A. Hospital and said, "What project would you like us 11 to work on that you don't normally get money for?" And, so, 12 the long-term care unit -- primarily, that is the last home 13 that most of these old soldiers are going to have, and to 14 make it less of a hospital environment and more of a home 15 environment is a project that they really wanted to do. And 16 we said, "Okay. Well, we think we can walk" -- first it was 17 going to be to Bandera. Then the Highway Department said, 18 "No, you're not going to walk to Bandera. Not only are you 19 too old for that, but we don't want you out there. We don't 20 want you out there. We got construction going on the highway 21 in Bandera County." We said, "Okay. How about if we started 22 at Wharton Road and stay off of 173 and 27." We'll go along 23 the River Road through Center Point, and have three low-water 24 crossings, and then come back the same way. Approximately 17 25 -- roughly six 3-mile legs. Y'all could almost put together 10-22-07 14 1 a team here. All you need is one other person. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm going to put a pledge 3 down for you. Count me out. 4 MR. VETTER: And so -- 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Commissioner Letz is a good 6 walker. 7 MR. VETTER: And so we are -- we're looking for -- 8 to raise money for this effort at the V.A. Hospital. And I 9 don't know if you had any particular questions, I'm here to 10 answer it. The commander sends his greetings to you. He 11 can't be here today. And -- and I hope we're going to have 12 fun. I hope it's not going to be like this. It's going to 13 be on a Sunday, so we hopefully will avoid all the sand and 14 gravel trucks on the road. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What time will it start? 16 MR. VETTER: We're -- we're planning right now on 17 starting at 9:00. We're trying to get back to the American 18 Legion at about 3:00, so we're trying to time it when the 19 kitchen is closing with bingo, and then we're going to have 20 our own food. So, it's going to be about 9:00 to 3:00. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: If Commissioner Baldwin would 22 participate in that walk, I'd certainly be pledging -- 23 MR. VETTER: Have a designated walker. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: -- for him. Yeah, I think he'd be a 25 wonderful walker. 10-22-07 15 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, Rex, they estimate 23 2 miles. You can cover it in 7.6 hours. 3 MR. EMERSON: I think the Sheriff's Department has 4 a fitness program, so Rusty would be the more proper 5 delegate. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Does that mean the Sheriff 7 is walking? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Maybe we should talk about 9 this after our health insurance talk. 10 MR. LOONEY: Please don't. 11 MR. VETTER: I did ask one of our city police 12 department lieutenants to coordinate with the Sheriff on 13 this. I don't know -- I haven't double-checked to see 14 whether that happened. I wanted to also ask Mr. Odom whether 15 we might be able to, on that Sunday, borrow some of those 16 low-water crossing signs and put "Idiots Out Walking 17 Around -- Watch For Them" signs over them. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Do we have any "Idiots Out Walking 19 Around" signs, Leonard? 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We can make some. 21 MR. ODOM: I'm sure -- if Larry will tell us what 22 he needs, I'm sure, with authorization of the Court, we can 23 do that. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I move for approval 25 of the resolution. 10-22-07 16 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 3 approval of the resolution. Any question or discussion on 4 the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 5 your right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 10 to Item 2. 11 MR. VETTER: Thank you. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. Consider, discuss, 13 and adopt the 2007-2008 Kerr County Community Plan for 14 submission to the Alamo Area Council of Governments. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mr. Vetter? Got something 16 for you here. 17 MR. VETTER: Oh, really? Already. Wow, I'm 18 impressed. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It made it around up here. 20 MR. VETTER: I should pass this around. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's my 20. Hey, write 22 "paid" on my part of that. 23 MR. VETTER: Okay. Thank y'all. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: You bet. 25 MS. LAVENDER: You all have a copy of the almost 10-22-07 17 1 latest draft of it. There's a couple of changes in there 2 that you might note if you want to keep up with this. On 3 Page 9, Mr. Wendling over at the city police department 4 requested that his phone number be changed to 739 rather than 5 using the 792 number. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who? 7 MS. LAVENDER: Page 9, Jeff Wendling, the chairman 8 of the law enforcement. Just a minor little telephone change 9 there. And the other one is on -- 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't see on it Page 9. 11 MS. LAVENDER: Yeah, where it says -- 12 JUDGE TINLEY: 10. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Page 10. 14 MS. LAVENDER: 10? Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, what is he? 16 MS. LAVENDER: He's the captain at the police 17 department, and he was the chairman of the law enforcement. 18 See, we break up in focus groups, and then each focus group 19 produces their part of the plan and then sends it back to me, 20 and then I do all the gathering of the statistics. It's not 21 in those -- that part of it. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 739 what? 23 MS. LAVENDER: 739, the same last four numbers. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 25 MS. LAVENDER: And then on Page 14 -- 10-22-07 18 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Wait just a minute. 2 MS. LAVENDER: Mm-hmm. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Go back to the criminal 4 justice thing. We got a -- we got a memo this last week from 5 the Police Chief -- I can't remember what the organization 6 is. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It was AACOG Criminal 8 Justice, our representative. The county representative. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: County representative. 10 MS. LAVENDER: We'll talk about that in just a 11 second, Buster. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. No, I want to talk 13 about it right now. 14 MS. LAVENDER: Okay, talk about it right now. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the way I remember the 16 letter from the Police Chief was, there's an opening. You 17 have an opening, and we want to put our guy in, is the way I 18 remembered it. Is this it? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: No. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. We'll talk about 22 that later. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is not it. 24 MS. LAVENDER: Okay. On Page 14, under Proposed 25 Objectives down at the bottom, Number 1, after K'Star, add 10-22-07 19 1 Hill Country CASA. We didn't get that in there in the 2 original typing. About -- under Number 1 of the proposed 3 objectives. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: That's on Page 15. 5 MS. LAVENDER: 15? Okay, sorry about that. Well, 6 the copy I brought with me is the one that Ilse Bailey helped 7 me correct the little things that were in it. I apologize. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where are we? 9 MS. LAVENDER: Add Hill Country CASA in there after 10 K'Star, because they do serve victims also. And that's the 11 only two minor things. This plan is done on an annual basis 12 by all the counties in the AACOG region, submitted, and then 13 becomes the basis for our grant applications. The Victims 14 Services Department is funded through an AACOG VOCA Grant. 15 Hill Country Crisis Council and Kids Advocacy Place both have 16 VOCA grants. The City of Kerrville, this coming year, has a 17 grant that they submitted under the 421 plan. We also 18 submitted a juvenile grant this year, and it was not 19 approved. Juvenile money's very tight at the state level, 20 and even though we were recommended, the money ran out before 21 they got to us in the -- in the ranking. And then we also 22 had a 421 grant for an S.R.O. officer in Ingram and it was 23 not funded; it wasn't even close to the cutoff of the money. 24 So, this is just an annual thing that we do. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It is a prerequisite. 10-22-07 20 1 MS. LAVENDER: It is a prerequisite for us to be 2 able to -- to do the grants. And we are the first county 3 that's finished ours. They told us we had to have them in by 4 the 31st of October, and then they extended the deadline to 5 November 15th because so many of the other counties had not 6 even had their initial meetings. So, we jumped ahead, and -- 7 and according to AACOG last week, when I talked to them, ours 8 is probably going to be the first one that's finished, so 9 that's good. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Question. And I think we're 11 covered in here; I just wanted to make sure. Under the 12 Homeland Security part, under the -- I'm reading on Page 29. 13 MS. LAVENDER: Should be Page 28 for me. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Actually, Page 30. The top 15 box, last couple sentences says, "In disasters, evacuation of 16 people and their animals is a priority. As the country 17 watched in the Katrina and Rita stories in 2005, people do 18 not evacuate if they have to leave behind their beloved pets. 19 Planning for that possibility is very important in Kerr 20 County also because of the potential for floods and 21 tornadoes." One of the things that I've been thinking about 22 is -- is because Homeland Security funds the new, I guess, 23 pool of money, is this language significant or inclusive 24 enough for us to apply for that funding for a plan for out at 25 Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center to get an additional area 10-22-07 21 1 where we can house people in evacuation situations? 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And improve it so that you 3 can house them? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Certainly worth a try. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's what I'm saying. I want 7 to make sure that, you know, since we're working on that 8 right now, that that language is inclusive enough. 9 MS. LAVENDER: I think so. I think we've 10 identified it as a -- as a priority, and then when the grant 11 applications are posted, if we want to do that, I think as 12 long as it's in there as a priority, we're good. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. I mean, it's just to 14 make -- cover the base. Who knows what things we'd need? 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Might be some assistance 16 there for -- 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Rosa, you did a good job on 18 this. 19 MS. LAVENDER: Thank you. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I move approval. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 23 approval of the agenda item. Any further question or 24 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 25 your right hand. 10-22-07 22 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. 5 Ms. Lavender, thank you for all your hard work that you put 6 in on this. We really appreciate it. Next item is to open 7 sealed bids for Kerr County 4-H livestock project center. 8 The bid is here. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You received one? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The bid? 11 JUDGE TINLEY: The bid. One bid. It's titled on 12 the outside, "Concrete and horse barn bid." 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Pretty accurate. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: While the Judge is opening it, 15 that is because the bid came in slightly over 25,000 16 originally, so we had to go out through the whole bid 17 process. We thought -- you know, so that's why we bid it. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a bid from Neal and Neal 19 Concrete, poured concrete in horse born at Ag Barn, 25,360. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move we accept the bid from -- 21 Neal? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Neal and Neal. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Neal and Neal -- Concrete 24 Company? 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 10-22-07 23 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- in the amount of $25,360. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to accept 5 the bid. Is your motion to actually approve the bid and 6 award the work? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, it is. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or discussion? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Question. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes? 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just refresh our memory. 14 How much of the concrete are we doing out there? The 15 entire -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Roy? 17 MR. WALSTON: It's 8,700 square feet. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that the entire 19 under-roof area? 20 MR. WALSTON: No, it's two-thirds of it. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Two-thirds. It's the part 22 that -- 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's close enough, Roy. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- portion that's going to be 25 used by the 4-H, primarily. 10-22-07 24 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, thank you. 2 MR. WALSTON: Yeah. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments? 4 MR. EMERSON: I hate to be a stick-in-the-mud, but 5 the way the agenda item is worded, I don't know how you can 6 award the contract. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good point. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You are a stick-in-the-mud. 11 (Laughter.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's why you get the big 14 bucks. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll put it on our next agenda 16 to award the contract. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: I guess we give this to Cheryl. 18 Okay. Let's move quickly to Item 4; consider, discuss, and 19 approve the appointment of election judges and alternates for 20 the term of one year in accordance with the Texas Election 21 Code, Section 32. 22 MS. PIEPER: Gentlemen, this is just a formality we 23 have to go through. The county election board met this year 24 and had made these recommendations, and so I need approval -- 25 because this is a county election, I need approval from the 10-22-07 25 1 Commissioners Court for the early voting ballot board team 2 and the central accumulator team. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who is the county elections 4 board? 5 MS. PIEPER: It consists of the County Clerk, Voter 6 Registrar's office, Sheriff, County Judge, both party chairs. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and a second for 12 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 13 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We have a 18 9:30 timed item, that being Item 7. I will call that item. 19 Consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to adopt the 20 Kerr County employees' health benefits plan for 2008. 21 Mr. Looney? 22 MR. LOONEY: Morning, Judge. I had dinner at the 23 Mexican food restaurant. I'm sorry, I was trying... 24 (Laughter.) It was a long weekend. I had a long weekend as 25 a result of trying to go through and make sure that we had 10-22-07 26 1 all the bids analyzed appropriately and -- and accurately, 2 all the bids that came in. We had seven complete bids that 3 came in, which is considerably greater than what we've had in 4 the past, which means that we are a viable item in the 5 community. Again, our claims histories are good. As you 6 know, Mutual of Omaha is no longer in business as a claims 7 administrator, so it's necessary for us to change. We went 8 through seven bids. We looked at a lot of different items, 9 and there's not one of them -- or all of them are potentially 10 good administrators. All of them handle claims 11 administration efficiently. There are -- each third-party 12 administrator feels that they've got a certain advantage in 13 the market, certain things that they do in the market that 14 set themselves aside from everybody else, and it's not always 15 in the numbers, the dollars and cents itself. It's more of a 16 service issue, more of a -- that process. 17 So, we go through this analysis -- spreadsheet 18 analysis, and we come up with hard dollar numbers, but the 19 end result really is what I feel, personally -- what I feel, 20 as your consultant, is in the best interest of the county 21 moving forward for 2008. As a result of all these 22 circumstances, it would be easy for me to bring in front of 23 you six disgruntled bidders because they didn't -- were not 24 able to accept this contract or not able to be in this 25 contract. However, we have to award one, and the award I'm 10-22-07 27 1 recommending is to Group and Pension Administrators out of 2 Dallas, Texas. They are a large administrator, one of the 3 oldest in San Antonio. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Say it again? 5 MR. LOONEY: Group and Pension Administrators, Inc. 6 Mr. Wallace, the current agent, has been one of the primary 7 bidders in this process. He has one of the -- his name is on 8 all the bids, as a matter of fact. And I briefly discussed 9 with Mr. Wallace my recommendation to determine if he was 10 satisfied with that recommendation, and -- Don? So, you 11 know, he has clients with Group and Pension Administrators 12 currently that are also counties, and he felt that based on 13 that experience and their history, that they would be a good 14 asset. We are going to have to take a look at a master plan 15 document that Group and Pension Administrators has to make 16 sure that we contract with them appropriately and in 17 relationship to the current -- current benefits, so we will 18 be taking a look at that, making sure that their master 19 contract carries forward the same basic coverage that is 20 provided to the employees currently. Based on our funding, 21 based on the recommendation, we will not have to change the 22 contribution levels for employees. For their dependent care 23 moving forward -- (Mr. Looney's cell phone rang.) 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's the employee group. 25 MS. VAN WINKLE: That's all, folks. 10-22-07 28 1 MR. LOONEY: Did you record that? (Laughter.) 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good timing. 3 MR. LOONEY: Sorry about that, guys. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Looney Tunes? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did you really -- did you 6 plan that? 7 MR. LOONEY: No. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's pretty slick. 9 MR. LOONEY: If I had planned that, believe me, I 10 would take full credit. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: These insurance salesmen are 12 something, aren't they? Golly, to go through all that. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Great. 14 MR. LOONEY: Where was I? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: The other Looney Tunes. 16 MR. LOONEY: The other Looney Tunes. The -- the 17 other thing we have to look at moving forward in the plan 18 design, things that we've discussed before, and that's the 19 possibility of changing the waiting period for new employees. 20 In discussion with Ms. Hyde, we've talked about the 21 possibility of extending that by up to maybe 30 days, going 22 to 60 days in employment, the first of the month following 23 completion of that 60 days of employment. We'll take a 24 harder look at that when we start working on the benefit plan 25 design itself. We're looking at removing dependents' 10-22-07 29 1 pregnancies from the benefit program, and also changing the 2 definition of a dependent to require a dependent to be in a 3 -- a college or trade school or something of a higher 4 education level between the ages of 19 and 23, so that those 5 dependents are truly dependents. We've got the -- as a new 6 administrator, we'll be required for an enrollment process to 7 identify all current dependents covered, so that we're 8 assured that any dependent that is listed under the health 9 care plan is truly a dependent of your employee. 10 We have a life insurance contract that's in effect 11 with Mutual of Omaha that is not going out of effect. They 12 have -- they will have one more year at the current rate, so 13 we do not have to change the life insurance contract. The -- 14 again, the -- you know, they're qualified bidders. They're 15 all qualified. My recommendation is Group and Pension 16 Administrators for your administration for 2008, with two 17 one-year contracts for renewal. The contracts -- the bids 18 that they've provided have guaranteed the administrative 19 rates for up to three years with no change, so that's -- 20 we -- we can only contract for the one year, but offer 21 two-year renewal based on their performance under the 22 contract. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: And, here again, the numbers are 24 within what we've budgeted for the current -- 25 MR. LOONEY: Yes, sir. 10-22-07 30 1 JUDGE TINLEY: -- year. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mr. Looney, just prior to the 3 meeting, you mentioned to me a letter that I expected to be 4 in here, 'cause you said the Court received it. Can I see 5 that letter? 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Here. It may be in your 7 box. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It could be. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's where mine was. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, last place to look. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: With respect to the letter, 12 Gary, I've got a couple of questions about this Entrust issue 13 letter that we had received, just a couple simple questions I 14 think that you can probably answer. One of them is in your 15 last -- the last time you were here, two weeks ago, you used 16 the words "serious plan design issues." And I'm assuming 17 that you were -- pointed that at Entrust, that they were -- 18 that they were the ones that had serious plan design issues, 19 because they didn't make the cut. 20 MR. LOONEY: Well, no, they did -- they did make 21 the cut. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well -- and so I wanted you 23 to talk just a minute about that, just a short thing. I 24 mean, I can catch it pretty quick. I want to talk about 25 that, and then this issue of the bidding laws, Local 10-22-07 31 1 Government Code, Chapter 262 and 252, those -- those two 2 different deals there. If you would talk about that just for 3 a moment? 4 MR. LOONEY: Okay. The serious -- the serious bid 5 concerns had to do -- again, that was a workshop 6 presentation, and the -- and the bid issue that I had was in 7 the optional bids that they had offered under a -- under 8 various different plan designs that they had represented in 9 their bid, and that represented that plan design change in 10 relationship to the overall cost that was associated with 11 that. So, the notes there were my notes as a -- my work 12 progress notes showing that the bids that were in the -- the 13 listing that was there were based on a complete takeover in 14 the current plan document, but that the numbers that were 15 associated with the other plan that they had offered, I had 16 some serious issues with because of the plan design. So, 17 what's in the spreadsheet was a duplicate takeover process. 18 That's why I didn't put the other numbers in that, because it 19 wasn't equivalent to the other plan design issues. 20 Under the bid specification for counties and 21 municipalities, there used to be a regulation that required 22 everything to be made on a proposal basis, which means that 23 it didn't leave any room for negotiation; that whatever was 24 bid was bid. That it was a sealed bid process, and you write 25 the RFP in a manner that gives us the right to negotiate for 10-22-07 32 1 the rates after the bids have been opened. The presentation 2 in the workshop that we made was not a presentation on the 3 final numbers; it was simply a work in progress, and there 4 were no names on that specifically for that reason. There 5 were no names in there, because, as I told you in that 6 meeting, we were still in the process of evaluating those 7 numbers, and that I would give that piece back to the bidder 8 to allow them to make corrections, adjustments, make sure it 9 was accurate. Of all the bids that came in, of all seven of 10 them, if you take all of them, line them up side by side, 11 it's very hard to pull one number or two numbers or three 12 numbers out of them, because of the way they have all been 13 presented. Plus, then you have to consider what is 14 represented by those admin numbers, because they vary. It's 15 like some plans will include X, Y, and Z; some only include X 16 and Y. You have to pay an extra fee for that, and so on. 17 So, there's a lot of that jumbling that goes on. So, trying 18 to put a hard dollar number for that particular item is 19 difficult. You know, that's why -- you know, that's why you 20 pay me the big bucks. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Well, I guess my 22 question is, I just -- I feel like I've been here so long 23 that, you know, this bidding and opening bids and looking at 24 numbers and tinkering with the numbers as you go along has 25 always been kind of a no-no around here. Not necessarily 10-22-07 33 1 with insurance, but other things, and -- that we bid a lot 2 on. I was just uncomfortable with that, with the fact that 3 you can open the bids -- even though you hide the names. I 4 understand that, and that's probably wise. But you -- you 5 open the bids and then negotiate on those numbers. That just 6 doesn't make any sense to me. But it's just -- 7 MR. LOONEY: Common practice. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, in the insurance 9 business. 10 MR. LOONEY: In the insurance business. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We don't do that with 12 tractors and stuff like that. 13 MR. LOONEY: No. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: See, that's what I'm saying. 15 I'm just kind of -- I have -- 16 MR. LOONEY: If it were -- if it were a tractor, it 17 would make my job a whole lot easier. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 19 MR. LOONEY: But -- 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let me follow up on 21 Commissioner Baldwin's -- one of his questions. We have a 22 communication from Entrust, which he cites a meeting -- the 23 letter cites a meeting that I assume took place with you, or 24 at least some representative? 25 MR. LOONEY: On Friday. 10-22-07 34 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that correct? And going 2 back to the -- to the workshop document that you gave us, 3 even though the -- the submittals weren't identified by 4 corporate names or company name, the one that's entitled -- 5 or the one that has a notation, "serious plan design issues," 6 it's pretty easy to determine, from having received this 7 letter, that that's probably -- 8 MR. LOONEY: That's probably who it is. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That probably fits, doesn't 10 it? 11 MR. LOONEY: Yes. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: My question is, at that 13 meeting, were those serious design -- plan design issues -- 14 MR. LOONEY: I just discussed -- 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- rectified? 16 MR. LOONEY: I discussed it with their 17 representative and told him exactly why I put that notation 18 there, just as I explained to Commissioner Baldwin. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They were reconciled or 20 rectified or identified? 21 MR. LOONEY: Whether he accepted my, you know, 22 response or not, I don't know. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I see. 24 MR. LOONEY: Commissioner, it's simply that I told 25 him that those were my notes; that it was a workshop note, 10-22-07 35 1 and I put it in there because of the alternate plans that had 2 been offered, and the numbers that were in the spreadsheet 3 were based on the current plan design. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Go ahead. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- after we had our workshop 6 and -- and these were just merely identified by 1, 2, 3, 4, 7 5, 6, 7, whatever they were, you indicated that you were 8 still digesting the numbers and refining, and I believe you 9 just indicated that you forwarded a copy of that spreadsheet 10 to every single one of the bidders? 11 MR. LOONEY: They had a copy of the spreadsheet 12 that identified their bid. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: And I believe you indicated at our 14 workshop that you were going to do that to make sure that you 15 were properly representing what their bid was and to verify 16 that with them? 17 MR. LOONEY: That's correct. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: And did they all receive it? 19 MR. LOONEY: Yes, sir. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: I assume you got some responses that 21 indicated that, no, this wasn't exactly right, or no, they 22 didn't mean this, they meant something else? 23 MR. LOONEY: I would like to tell you that I'm 24 infallible, but unfortunately, I have to make sure that what 25 I'm representing is what they feel is best represented. 10-22-07 36 1 Yeah, that's correct. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: They all had that opportunity, and 3 those that wished to avail themselves did? 4 MR. LOONEY: Yes, sir. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My -- 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Wallace, you had a question? 8 MR. WALLACE: Gary sent that to me, and I forwarded 9 each individual spreadsheet to each of the seven potential 10 bidders that I got the bid from. I got responses back and 11 forwarded those on to Gary. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 13 MR. WALLACE: I don't remember if all seven of them 14 responded or not, but I got a lot of responses. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My question is really more on 17 the process issue. And I'm -- I trust that you did -- you 18 know bid laws and are following bid laws, but I don't rely on 19 you for that information; I rely on the County Attorney. And 20 I hate to give Rex something to do, but, you know, it's 21 critical to me that we follow bid laws, because it is 22 different, evidently, than any other kind of bidding that we 23 do. And it seems a little -- I'm kind of -- I was thinking 24 as Commissioner Baldwin was talking, and I'm -- it's hard to 25 figure out why we bid insurance, if we do bids and then 10-22-07 37 1 negotiate with all of them, I guess. You know, I mean, so 2 anyway, my question to the County Attorney is, are we -- are 3 you comfortable that all bid laws were followed? 4 MR. EMERSON: Frankly, I don't know the procedures 5 that Mr. Looney followed, because he handled that 6 independently as a representative of this Court. But I can 7 tell you under Chapter 262.030, the Local Government Code, 8 Subsection (e), it says, "As provided in the request for 9 proposals and under rules adopted by the Commissioners Court, 10 discussions may be conducted with responsible offerors who 11 submit proposals determined to be reasonably susceptible of 12 being selected for award. Offerors must be accorded fair and 13 equal treatment with respect to any opportunity for 14 discussion and revision of proposals, and revisions may be 15 permitted after submission and before award for the purpose 16 of obtaining best and final offers." 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But -- 18 MR. EMERSON: So I'm assuming that's the 19 subparagraph that Mr. Looney was dealing with all the bidders 20 on. 21 MR. LOONEY: That's correct. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But that -- the letter -- and I 23 read it pretty quickly -- says that that didn't take place -- 24 alleges that it didn't take place. So, I mean, you know, 25 that's a -- that's an important thing that needs to be 10-22-07 38 1 resolved, in my mind. I mean, I don't know -- you know, I 2 don't know how we do that for something done outside our 3 office. But if a -- if the -- the statement from Entrust is 4 that -- part of the statement is that they were not given the 5 same, I guess, benefit as the other ones, or same negotiation 6 protocol, whatever words they were using. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: As I understand the process, 8 Commissioner, that the County Attorney just referred to, once 9 the bids are received, they're then reviewed to see who of 10 these bidders might ultimately be in the ballpark as being a 11 successful bidder. Any of them that are not in the ballpark 12 are winnowed out, and then those that remain, us, through 13 Mr. Looney, is authorized to go to them to negotiate for the 14 final and best offer. And that, I think, is what -- did you 15 give every single one of those bidders an opportunity -- 16 MR. LOONEY: Yes, sir. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: -- to -- 18 MR. LOONEY: Yes, we did. And, Commissioner Letz, 19 on Friday, Mr. Wallace arranged for a representative of the 20 Entrust people to come to my office. I met with him for 21 about an hour, and asked at that time if they had any 22 additional changes and updates, and anything that they wished 23 to prepare or propose to the County at that point. I think 24 that they'd even made arrangements at one point to come by 25 and visit with the Judge during this process. They've also 10-22-07 39 1 contacted Ms. Hyde on a couple of occasions to discuss the 2 process. So, of all of the individuals that were involved in 3 the process, they were more actively involved in it than the 4 majority of the rest of them. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Was the -- and I know it's -- 6 there are a lot of other things other than price that are in 7 your -- why you're recommending Group and Pension 8 Administrators. Where do they rank on this pure cost? Were 9 they the lowest or the highest, or -- 10 MR. LOONEY: On their maximum aggregate cost? They 11 were the lowest bidder in that. They were -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What about on the -- what about 13 the -- 14 MR. LOONEY: Fixed cost? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- the fixed cost, so to speak? 16 MR. LOONEY: They were second and third -- or 17 second or third. But, again, that has a lot to do with 18 services that are rendered in relationship to that fixed 19 cost, and that's why it's difficult. If you rank the total 20 amount of services that are involved with the cost, then 21 that's why we're making the recommendation. It's the volume 22 of the service in relationship to the overall cost. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It sounds to me like that 24 they didn't peddle any bids like what this letter would 25 indicate. Each bidder got their own package back to make 10-22-07 40 1 sure that they had done everything correctly. They didn't 2 get the spreadsheet of all the bids so they could go and 3 compare one to the other. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what it sounds like 5 to me, too. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And that, to me, would be 7 proper, as long as you don't give another competitor a bid to 8 go and pick apart and try to figure out a way to outbid that 9 person. That's not fair. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But that spreadsheet was 11 public. Any -- every one of them could have it. 12 MR. LOONEY: It was public information after the 13 workshop. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: But it didn't have any names. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 16 MR. LOONEY: No. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You only had numbers. And 18 that's -- you know, that, to me -- you know, they might guess 19 who the other bidders are, but they would -- you know, it's 20 public record, but it's not the same thing as -- as peddling 21 bids with names. 22 MR. LOONEY: The goal and the purpose of the 23 process is to get the best cost and best service for the 24 county. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 10-22-07 41 1 MR. LOONEY: You know, I have no interest in the 2 flow of commission dollars or anything else that has anything 3 to do with it. My job is to bring to you what I feel is the 4 best contract. And it's not a tractor, Commissioner Baldwin. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's not tractors. 6 MR. LOONEY: It's not a tractor. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand that. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: We've got a gentleman in the back of 9 the room that's got a question. If you'll identify yourself 10 and give your address, please. 11 MR. JACOBSON: I'm David Jacobson; I'm with 12 Entrust. And just to go on with the Texas Local Government 13 Code, what it states is, if provided in the request for 14 proposals, proposals shall be opened and in a manner that 15 avoids disclosure of the contents to competing offerors and 16 keeps the proposal secret during the negotiations. All 17 proposers -- all proposals are open for public inspection 18 after the contract is awarded, but trade secrets and 19 confidential information in the proposals are not open for 20 public inspection. And, actually, the RFP cited Texas Local 21 Government Code 252, but 252, which is for municipalities, 22 and 262 for counties, are a little bit -- they're pretty -- 23 they're pretty identical. It goes on to say in the county 24 chapter that once the bid is selected, the final bid, if 25 negotiations with that vendor are not -- are not -- it 10-22-07 42 1 doesn't feel like the Court is getting what they ask for, 2 then they go on to the second bidder. 3 And, basically, what our concerns were -- they were 4 twofold. One, I did an evaluation of the spreadsheet I was 5 presented on October 8th, because we did get a copy of the 6 full sheet. We were unwilling to change our numbers, because 7 we felt that would disqualify our bid after the fact if we 8 changed our numbers after we had the public information. It 9 doesn't matter if the names are withheld. The numbers and 10 the provision of the policy are still -- still in that. The 11 second concern that we had is if -- besides having the lowest 12 cost, on October 8th, from a service standpoint, Mr. Looney 13 did warrant us a meeting, and in that meeting on Friday, he 14 allowed us 25 minutes, which was -- which was nice; we 15 appreciate that. But there was no -- there were no questions 16 regarding service. None of our references were called. 17 Nobody from our office was contacted about any of the -- the 18 questions that were in there. From a service standpoint, we 19 are the only local third-party administrator, the only T.P.A. 20 bidding that's looking at establishing a local service office 21 here, because we've been writing a lot of business in this 22 area, so we already have client services people that come up 23 here at least once a month, generally twice a month, to 24 review reports, things like that. 25 I'll also tell you that from doing an evaluation in 10-22-07 43 1 this -- in this community, I have a similar organization as 2 the county that has 400 people, and the costs range about 3 2.7 million. On your 243, you're at about 2.1. So, I would 4 think there's a lot of things that can be done, and from a 5 service standpoint, Entrust is willing to do that, but our 6 biggest concern at this point is the bids were opened on 7 October 8th. They were presented. The numbers were 8 disclosed for public record. We had a copy of all the 9 numbers. And then, after the fact, I guess, the -- the 10 broker and the consultant went out to negotiate, and that's 11 not normally how the bid process works. And, quite frankly, 12 insurance bids are no different than any other bid, 'cause 13 it's a county law, not an insurance law. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Jacobson, was a copy of your -- 15 your figures, as submitted, furnished to you by Mr. Looney 16 off of his spreadsheet to ask you if those were accurately 17 represented? 18 MR. JACOBS: I did not receive anything from 19 Mr. Looney on -- 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Did you receive it from Mr. Wallace? 21 MR. JACOBS: I think Don Wallace, in the last week, 22 did send something to Entrust, but that was after we had a 23 copy of the spreadsheet. We did not respond to change the 24 numbers, because that would be a violation of the -- 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Were you given an opportunity to 10-22-07 44 1 submit a final and best offer? 2 MR. JACOBS: Last week we were allowed to give one 3 up to Friday at 5 o'clock. We were unwilling to do so, 4 because that would change our bid. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, thank you. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, the issue is -- I mean, if 7 the bid procedures were followed properly, that's the issue, 8 and that's the issue I'm going to ask the County Attorney 9 to -- 10 MR. LOONEY: One correction. He said 25 minutes. 11 We had allocated -- I told them 9:30; the representative 12 didn't show up until ten minutes till 10:00, and I had 13 another appointment that I had to go to, that I had to leave. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But -- that part, to me, is 15 irrelevant. The issue that I'm concerned with is -- I mean, 16 what he's saying is that it's whether the bid procedure was 17 followed. He wasn't going to change the numbers, period. 18 MR. LOONEY: I'd be more than happy to have the 19 representative from the Department of Insurance give you a 20 call and let you know, because I work with him frequently. 21 So -- 22 MR. EMERSON: All I can do, Commissioner Letz, 23 would be offer to meet with Mr. Looney later and go through 24 the procedures that were followed and compare them with the 25 statutes, 'cause I don't have any knowledge of the procedures 10-22-07 45 1 that were followed. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's my preference. Because 3 I think -- I mean, I just think there's a shadow under it. I 4 mean, you know, I don't -- I'm not going to vote in favor of 5 awarding a contract when that issue being brought up is a 6 pretty serious concern about following bid procedures. I 7 think it would invalidate -- if it was determined down the 8 road that our procedures were not followed, that would 9 invalidate this whole exercise and waste a lot of people's 10 time. So, if that can be done by you in the next week, then 11 we'll -- you know, or next two weeks, we can do it. If we 12 need to call a special meeting, we'll call a special meeting. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Or we could do it today. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I don't know if Rex is 15 going to have time today to -- that's just from my vote. 16 Maybe y'all can ... 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I agree. I see it as 18 a serious issue. That's the reason I brought it up. The 19 gentleman in the back with Entrust says that it's not an 20 insurance issue; it's a county issue, or a state law issue I 21 think is what he meant, probably. And if a bidding law is a 22 bidding law, a bidding law is a bidding law. I mean, I don't 23 know that it's not. And what Commissioner Letz is saying is, 24 somebody needs to tell us, are we fixing to break the law or 25 not? 10-22-07 46 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I agree. Because 2 there's a serious accusation made -- or an assertion made in 3 this letter that our consultant violated the bid protocols 4 and so forth. That needs to be clarified. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: I assume that we're going to hang 6 that one on the hook for the time being? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Unless the County Attorney 8 can stand up and -- 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think he said -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- declare. 11 MR. EMERSON: I'm not a genie. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You're not? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 14 MR. LOONEY: I'll try to make him one real quick. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is there a time frame in 16 which this all has to be put to bed? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Fortunately, we're early this 18 year. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I thought we were. That's 20 the reason I asked the question. 21 MR. LOONEY: We're early. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So we're not up against the 23 gun here? 24 MR. LOONEY: Other than the fact that we've got to 25 make a lot of changes as a result of Mutual of Omaha leaving, 10-22-07 47 1 and we want to make sure we get all of our timing done 2 appropriately for enrollment purposes. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: We probably want to get this 4 resolved not later than the first meeting in November, I 5 would think. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: 'Cause we got to do an enrollment. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Whole new enrollment. And that's 10 going to take at least 30 days, wouldn't it? 11 MR. LOONEY: Yeah. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. If nobody else has anything 13 further to offer on that, let's go to Item 5; consider, 14 discuss, take appropriate action to consolidate cellular 15 telephone contracts into a single account, and authorize 16 County Judge to sign same. I've been working with 17 Mr. Trolinger on this. What we're trying to put together is 18 a package much like the Sheriff's Office has, where all of 19 his people are consolidated under one contract out there with 20 one block of minutes. He can add phones, purchase additional 21 minutes. I know the Court has been concerned about the 22 variable cell phone costs, reimbursement issues. Different 23 contracts, different departments. I put down some guidelines 24 that hopefully will be kind of an outline. John has been 25 discussing with the phone company, Five Star Wireless, how 10-22-07 48 1 we're going to put that together. The other thing I've done, 2 I've asked each department head and elected official to 3 furnish me with a roster of persons who have a need to have a 4 cell phone to conduct county business and the approximate 5 number of minutes each month that each would use, so that we 6 can start working from that. That's kind of where I am. 7 John may have some more current information on it. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I've got a question. 9 So, this is your document here? 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: The plan is my document, yes. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. All cell phones on 14 which county business is conducted other than the Sheriff's 15 Office. Now, are you -- is our end goal to have everybody, 16 or is the Sheriff's Office still going to be a separate -- I 17 don't want to hurt anybody's feelings; I just want to know. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, he's already got himself a 19 plan put in place. We might be able just to add to his. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, that's what I'm 21 asking. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If his works -- he's not 24 going to like that; I can hear it already. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Take it from his budget. 10-22-07 49 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I like that. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If it works -- 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's what we started 4 talking about originally. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: If I may, okay? I do have -- 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm through; it's okay. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I do have some issues with 8 that part of it, okay? And John -- John can verify this and 9 check up on it. We've worked on getting our plan the best, 10 and kind of tweaked the best we can possibly get. I get 11 detailed phone call listings of every phone call that my 31 12 phones on the contract make, and I go through those every 13 month to make sure that my department is within -- you know, 14 staying in business, things like that. There's also a lot of 15 undercover type calls being -- our narcotics unit and 16 everything else. I do not want and would object to those -- 17 that detailed bill, okay, going anywhere other than me as the 18 department head to review and make sure it's doing right. I 19 don't need those kind of phone calls out. So, mainly because 20 of that -- and if you look at ours, and John can -- can 21 check, and we can check with Rose over there at the phone 22 company; they can give the rest of the county the same exact 23 plan I have. My plan went into effect -- it's a two-year 24 deal, went into effect July of '06, and I really want the 25 Sheriff's office plan to stay separate for a lot of those 10-22-07 50 1 reasons. And it does give me very good control overseeing 2 all those individual bills, 'cause John can tell you, we run 3 right close to our minutes, but I do stay on it. And I do 4 check it, as a department head should. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I agree. Rusty, 6 before you get off into four-wheel drive stuff, did you say 7 31? 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I have 31 phones over there. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And how many -- how many -- 10 pretend the Sheriff doesn't exist. How many do we have 11 outside of that? 12 MR. TROLINGER: Thirty-two -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So -- 14 MR. TROLINGER: -- additional phones I've counted 15 county-wide. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, we can do something very 17 similar, probably, with just numbers. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: That was the model. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The phone company said they'd 20 give the same exact plan I have. It's just the rest of the 21 county had some real -- some that are real old plans where 22 you're paying 14.95 a phone. That all needs to be redone, 23 and you can do an full plan on that, same exact as I have 24 with the Sheriff's Office. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Actually, we're going to do -- end 10-22-07 51 1 up with a better plan than yours. 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, ain't going to happen. 3 We'll see. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, what are we doing today, 5 Judge? Are we authorizing to do -- to follow up to create 6 this plan? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: John put it on the agenda. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What are we doing, John? 9 MR. TROLINGER: I have -- 10 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think we have a specific 11 proposal yet, do we? 12 MR. TROLINGER: We do not have a specific proposal. 13 This is simply authorization to go forward with -- with 14 consolidating the contract. And once the numbers are worked 15 out, have the -- have the County Judge sign the contract to 16 consolidate those phone plans. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make a motion to authorize 18 Mr. Trolinger to proceed with consolidating cell phone 19 contract for all county employees except the Sheriff's 20 Department. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And bring the contract back to 23 the Court for approval. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 10-22-07 52 1 indicated. Further question or discussion? 2 MR. TROLINGER: And to note the Sheriff's plan -- 3 the main benefit of keeping that separate is the Sheriff 4 enjoys some -- less fees. There are a couple fees or federal 5 taxes that the Sheriff's -- law enforcement is exempt from, 6 so that's the primary purpose of separating. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How many minutes at what 8 cost are we looking at? 9 MR. TROLINGER: I have all the numbers here. The 10 Sheriff's Office, 32 phones at 5,000 minutes. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Total? 12 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. The base rate plus the 13 per-phone rate is about $6,100 per year, and then we'd have a 14 similar -- similar rate for the other 32 county phones, 15 predicated on -- that we can move some of the -- some of the 16 users that are on different service providers over to Five 17 Star. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think that's going to save us 19 a lot of money, 'cause some -- I mean, we have some 20 departments that are $50 a month, or some individuals that 21 are $50 a month. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sure. 23 MR. TROLINGER: I've estimated between $4,000 and 24 $5,000 per year savings. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's good. 10-22-07 53 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Even with the break that the 3 Sheriff's getting on some of those fees, we'll negotiate a 4 better contract than he's got, John. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Nah. 6 MR. TROLINGER: And I'd also like to thank Eva 7 Hyde; she put together most of these numbers for the phones, 8 and Five Star for working with us, because they're going to 9 take a $4,000 or $5,000 hit, basically, even though we're 10 going to bring them some more phones over from some other 11 providers. They've been really good about working with me, 12 you know. Really a good deal all the way around. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It works. And, you know, when 14 some of the old contracts are paying 14.95 a phone, just the 15 base, before any calls, you take my 31 phones I have on the 16 contract, and you -- using 5,000 minutes last month, probably 17 a little over 5,000 minutes, divide that into -- take our 18 bill and divide that into the number of phones, it came out 19 to $16.28 a phone is what I'm paying per month, total. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: John, anyone who wants to, they 21 can keep their current phone numbers, correct? 22 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, that is correct. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Whether they're with Five Star 24 or Sprint or anybody else right now. 25 MR. TROLINGER: Numbers are portable. I verified 10-22-07 54 1 that with Five Star, and they can move the numbers. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Two qualifiers. Number one, the 3 department head or elected official must make a determination 4 that the individual needs a cell phone to do county business, 5 and the cell phone that'll be issued to that person will be 6 only for county business. Now, what they do on their own, 7 that's up to them. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We have a motion and a 10 second. Any further question or discussion? All in favor of 11 the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We've got a 16 10 o'clock timed item that we've run a little bit past, so 17 let's get to that. Item 11; consider, discuss, and take 18 appropriate action on request from the Kerrville Christmas 19 Lighting Corporation to participate in or otherwise assist in 20 the cost of electrical upgrades at the courthouse. Is 21 Mr. Bond here? No, that's right -- 22 MR. BONDY: He has a pinch-hitter today. First of 23 all, I'd be remiss if I didn't thank Commissioners for 24 allowing the stage to be used this past weekend downtown on 25 the Star. We had about 700 or 800 people downtown for the 10-22-07 55 1 Beatlemania Now concert, and it's with great appreciation 2 that we thank you for that effort. It did make a difference. 3 As you know, Kyle Bond, who is president of our organization, 4 has been before you on a couple of occasions talking about 5 what the group is doing for the coming year, one of which is 6 putting in the new archway at the front entrance, which the 7 footings have already been poured -- concrete footings have 8 already been poured on that. And the other was to address 9 the electrical issues up on the roof, putting in some outlets 10 that would keep us from having to have power outages like we 11 did last year especially, and having a lot of live wires 12 sitting in water once again, as we did last year. 13 The lighting corporation spent about $6,500 to have 14 that electrical work done this summer. However, in the 15 course of that work being done and completed, we learned that 16 the electricity that's up there is not up to current code. 17 It's 100-amp service, where 200-amp is now required. And we 18 received a quote from D.W. Electric for $8,213, and to be 19 very honest with you, as good as our fundraising has been 20 this year, it may not be enough to be able to offset that 21 amount of money. It is my hope -- our hope; there are 22 several of us that are here in attendance today -- that 23 perhaps the Commissioners would consider helping us, possibly 24 splitting that cost and -- and allowing us to get the work 25 done in time for this year's Christmas season. Our first 10-22-07 56 1 work Saturday is actually coming up this coming Saturday, the 2 27th, and the work will take a bit of time to complete. And, 3 obviously, the goal is to have it done in time for the 4 lighting on the 17th. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I presume you've visited with 6 our Maintenance Director and he's all up to speed as to what 7 the plan is, or requirements to do the upgrade to 200-amp 8 service? 9 MR. BONDY: Yes, sir. I'm going to have to 10 defer -- I believe Kyle has talked with him, and I believe 11 he's aware of the situation, yes. It is -- it's -- from what 12 I understand, and I'm no electrical person, but the roof 13 can't sustain the power board. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tim, do you have in your budget 15 4,000 extra dollars somewhere? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Stand up, Tim, when you 17 answer, so we can see you. 18 MR. BOLLIER: I can find it, sir. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me -- let me clarify a bit what 20 Mr. Bondy has said. As -- as all of you recall, at the time 21 that we renewed our agreement with the Christmas Lighting 22 Corporation, it was part of that agreement that the 23 electrical circuitry up on the roof was going to have to be 24 upgraded, and that was a given, and they agreed to that. 25 They did that. It was at the end of all of that work that -- 10-22-07 57 1 at the tail end of all of this that it was discovered that we 2 did not have a neutral leg up there serving the roof, and 3 that was brought to Tim's attention. He brought it to my 4 attention, and as a consequence, we went to our electrical 5 service providers, and that's where they came up with that. 6 Apparently, no one really thought to check it until towards 7 the end of the game, and lo and behold, up jumps this $8,400 8 booger. So, that's kind of how we got where we are. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't -- I'm not opposed to 10 spending tax dollars on an upgrade to the physical part of 11 the building. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: It's our structure. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's our building. I don't 14 have a problem with that. If they're willing to pay half, I 15 think we should come up with $4,200, the other half. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree with that. It's 17 our structure, and it's beneficial to us for safety reasons. 18 And -- 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's required for safety 20 reasons. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. So -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Now, I do -- you know, I think 23 that I'm -- my preference would be for the money to come out 24 of the Maintenance budget if it's there, but at the same 25 time, we don't want to cut other things off. We have some 10-22-07 58 1 other contingency funds that we can look at. I think I'd 2 like to, you know, approve proceeding with it, and then 3 letting the Maintenance Director and the Auditor get together 4 and find the funds between their budget and other possible 5 funds. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that a motion? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's a motion. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 10 indicated to approve the agenda item, to pay half the cost of 11 the electrical upgrade, with the determination of funding 12 source to be worked out between the Maintenance Director and 13 the Auditor. Question or discussion? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have a -- I have a couple 15 of comments. Mrs. Kirby called me last night -- my good 16 friend, Louise Kirby, called me at home last night and asked 17 me to participate in this, and -- as her Commissioner, and I 18 stated to her that I wasn't quite that far in my book yet; I 19 was still in the insurance business. And when I got to the 20 lighting thing, Ms. Kirby, there's not one piece of 21 information in here for me to make a decision. So, I don't 22 know what happened, and it's a lot easier for me to have 23 information so I can make decisions before I get in here, but 24 it wasn't there. And also, I wanted to make a point that 25 recently, Mr. Lehmann's letter to the editor about how stupid 10-22-07 59 1 some of us guys sitting at this table are, and then we turn 2 around, and, "You're stupid. Please give me some money." 3 And that's very distasteful to me. But -- 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Who said I was stupid? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Actually, he was talking 6 about you. (Laughter.) 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Not the first. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But I took up for you. But 9 I'm certainly in favor of doing this, and we're talking about 10 half of it. Is that what we're talking about? 11 MR. BONDY: Yes, sir. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Talking about half of it. 13 MR. BONDY: Yes, sir. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Only because it's our 15 facility, and we need to keep it upgraded and stay within 16 guidelines. A lot of y'all do a wonderful job, but I think 17 it's very inappropriate for Mr. Lehmann to call us stupid in 18 the -- in a letter to the editor. And I've just about run 19 out of -- run out of my friendliness with him. 20 MR. BONDY: Point taken. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You might point out, that's 22 not the same Mr. Lehmann for whom we have a thing out there 23 on the lawn. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Gazebo. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Correct. It's Mr. Lehmann 10-22-07 60 1 that's a part of your group. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Which, by the way, is not George 3 Lehmann. The gentleman's name is Gene Lehmann, G.E. Lehmann. 4 And as long as we're -- as long as we're chucking a few 5 rocks, I don't know where our local newspaper came up with 6 George Lehmann. Two -- two lines later, they identified him 7 as Gene. I don't know who's doing the proofreading over 8 there. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Maybe it's -- 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Correction, I don't know if there's 11 anybody doing proofreading. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: May be Mr. Lehmann, the 13 other Mr. Lehmann. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, that could be. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But I'm throwing rocks at -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought there was a new 17 letter. You're talking about the old letter where I was 18 talking about the -- where I put my foot my mouth about 19 decorations. Is that the letter you're talking about? 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, that's the letter. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We saved enough money on cell 23 phone service to pay for it. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: And we got both of ourselves in 25 trouble. 10-22-07 61 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm not going to say anything 3 else. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments? 5 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 6 hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Thank you, 11 Mr. Bondy. 12 MR. BONDY: Thank you, gentlemen. Appreciate it. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move back, if we might, to 14 Item Number 6; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action 15 to update the broadband internet services agreement with Time 16 Warner Cable, and authorize County Judge to sign same. 17 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. The -- 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: John, I just want to make 19 one more stupid statement. Ma'am? There is not any 20 information for me to make a decision here either. Go ahead. 21 MR. TROLINGER: Very simple. The new contract 22 provides us with -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Doesn't bother him at all. 24 MR. TROLINGER: -- a threefold increase in speed -- 25 download speed, and reduces the cost by about $170 per year. 10-22-07 62 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Reduces? 2 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: How much more information do you 4 need, Commissioner? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved, whatever it is. 6 We want it. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 9 approval as indicated. Further question or discussion? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. Go over those numbers 11 again. What was the reduction? I don't have any backup 12 either. 13 MR. TROLINGER: It's about $168 per year reduction 14 from the current contract. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 16 MR. TROLINGER: It's a minor reduction, but we're 17 receiving threefold increase in -- 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Went down. Better hurry up 19 and vote; it's going down. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right, thank you. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or discussion? 22 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 23 hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10-22-07 63 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Now we can 3 finally get Leonard up here. Item 8; consider, discuss, and 4 take appropriate action for the revision of plat for Lot 67 5 of Cypress Springs Estates, Phase 2, Section One, as set 6 forth in Volume 7, Page 172 of the Plat Records, and set 7 public hearing for the same, that property located in 8 Precinct 4. 9 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. This revision is to be done 10 under the alternate plat process, and will take .68 of an 11 acre that was previously unplatted. As you see in the agenda 12 item, it was unplatted, and they're adding that to Lot 67 of 13 Cypress Springs Estates, Phase 2, Section One. We ask at 14 this time that you set the public hearing for 10 o'clock a.m. 15 November the 26th, 2007. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So moved. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to set a 19 public hearing on the revision of plat for Lot 67 of Cypress 20 Springs Estates, Phase 2, Section One, for 10 a.m. on 21 November 26th, 2007. Any question or discussion on that 22 motion? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Quick comment. I don't know 24 if -- Leonard, you might want to stay. We have a subdivision 25 item on the agenda later on. 10-22-07 64 1 MR. ODOM: Right. Three things I was going to 2 check for. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This type of thing, I believe, 4 will not require a public hearing in the future, which is 5 good news. This is just an informational item because of 6 some new state law. 7 MR. ODOM: New state law? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You know, may not, I should 9 say. Which would be a good thing. Some of these revisions, 10 adjusting lot lines and all that, will not require -- 11 MR. ODOM: Something minor like they're doing. As 12 it stands right now -- 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It is, so we got to do it right 14 now. 15 MR. ODOM: We have to do it. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But just for information. 17 Okay. 18 MR. ODOM: Okay. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Somebody make a motion? 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, I did. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I seconded. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Seconded already? Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, you're behind. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or discussion? 10-22-07 65 1 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 2 hand. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 5 (No response.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. We'll move to 7 Item 9; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 8 amend Court Order Number 30504 to use Fund 20 to purchase a 9 used excavator. 10 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. Before, I had come to the 11 Court asking to buy an excavator from Waukesha-Pierce, or 12 what we were looking at, for over 206,000. The Court 13 approved the purchase of a used excavator out of Fund 20 in 14 the 2006-2007 budget. At the time, the only machine we had a 15 price for was a Waukesha-Pierce for 206,055.40. Since then, 16 we found a 2007 with only 51 hours, a nine-month warranty for 17 all parts and service, and delivery from Continental 18 Equipment, the Gradall dealer in Dallas. The price is only 19 $474.49 more. This would be an HGAC contract, and does not 20 require a bid. Fund 20 has a total of 211,535.44. At this 21 time, we ask that you amend the court order to allow Road and 22 Bridge to purchase the best machine available, not to exceed 23 206,529.89. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: The Waukesha-Pierce that you 25 proposed before you became aware of this one, what model was 10-22-07 66 1 it? 2 MR. ODOM: That was a 4100 series. This is a 3100 3 series. It had about 1,400 hours on it, had no warranty. 4 And at the time, we were under the impression that we had to 5 wait till 1 October to do this. Well, that wasn't the case, 6 but we misunderstood. They leased it out; it's in Laredo, 7 Texas, so that is gone. And then I looked at the 41 and 8 compared. It is about 4 to 5 feet longer than the 3100 9 series, which is closer to what we have now. And considering 10 that, plus another 10,000 pounds heavier, that I felt like 11 using it on some of the structures I have, I didn't want that 12 type of weight. The table swing itself was bigger than what 13 we have presently, and that 3100 is -- will be quite 14 adequate; there's only 2 foot of reach difference. And I 15 couldn't get a warranty at all. It would cost me another 16 5,000 or 6,000 on top of that to make sure I had a -- 17 something that's been used. We felt like this was the way to 18 go, with a factory warranty for the $479 more. It was -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with you. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: This one's more suitable, actually, 21 for your needs? 22 MR. ODOM: More suitable to what I had. When we 23 first found that, we were trying to find something there, and 24 we felt that was the best that I had seen. There was another 25 one in Tulsa. I haven't gone to see it, but I've got the 10-22-07 67 1 pictures. This was the best deal. And I had the Dallas 2 dealer wanting to -- to work with us. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Quick question. Cheryl, is 4 there any difference or preference in canceling and issuing a 5 new order versus amending an old order? 6 THE CLERK: Doesn't make any difference. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval of the agenda 8 item. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 11 approval of the agenda item as indicated. Any further 12 question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify 13 by raising your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 18 to Item 10; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 19 accept petition to vacate and discontinue road for part of 20 Upper Turtle Creek Road, and the posting of the same. 21 MR. ODOM: Yes. Upper Turtle Creek Road went very 22 close to Mr. and Mrs. Harden's home, and they wanted it moved 23 to a better location on their property. They worked with 24 Commissioner Baldwin and Road and Bridge Department to locate 25 and build a new road constructed to county specs. The 10-22-07 68 1 property owners paid all the construction and legal costs for 2 the road. The road has been finished for some time, and we 3 have been waiting for the documentation to close the old part 4 of the road and open the new portion of the road. The County 5 Attorney has reviewed the documents, and as we understand, 6 the following items need to be addressed today: The approval 7 of an affidavit of posting notice and approval for Len Odom 8 to sign same; approval of the sign to be posted at both ends 9 of the new section of Upper Turtle Creek road, as well as 10 posting at the courthouse door; acceptance of petition to 11 vacate, abandon, and discontinue road signed by property 12 owners. And we will post the road today, October the 22nd, 13 2007, and after the 20-day posting, we will return to the 14 Court on November the 13th, 2007, for approval of the order 15 of vacating, closing, and abandoning a portion of the old 16 road and approval from Judge Tinley to sign same. Once this 17 is approved and completed and returned to Jons law firm, they 18 will execute the road dedication deed. If possible, we'd 19 like to get approval on November the 13th, 2007, for the 20 Judge to sign the dedication -- dedication deed without 21 coming back to the Court another time. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are we doing anything today? 23 Other than -- I mean -- 24 MR. ODOM: I'm basically -- go ahead, I'm sorry. 25 MR. EMERSON: What you need to do today is approve 10-22-07 69 1 the posting. Technically speaking, the posting has to occur 2 before you accept the application. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 4 MR. EMERSON: So you can accept the application and 5 approve the order at the next Commissioners Court, but -- 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I understand that you 7 have to have some kind of posting here at the courthouse, at 8 the beginning and the ending of the road. Or depends on 9 which way you're going. 10 MR. ODOM: We have done this before. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Both ends of the road. 12 MR. ODOM: That's right. We've done this before, 13 off Drummond. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And -- that's exactly right, 15 and that's the posting. That runs a certain period of time, 16 and then -- 17 MR. ODOM: Twenty days. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- then you get into this 19 vacating and all that stuff. I move for approval. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 22 approval of the posting as indicated. Any further question 23 or discussion on the motion? All in favor of the motion, 24 signify by raising your right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 10-22-07 70 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's move 4 to Item 12, if we might. Consider, discuss, and take 5 appropriate action on issues related to the Airport Board. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Again? 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Still. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Still. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Still. Rex, you see we have 10 a dignitary from the city back there. 11 MR. EMERSON: Morning, Mike. 12 MR. HAYES: Morning. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The Honorable Mike Hayes. 14 MR. EMERSON: The reason we're here, the issue's 15 been raised several times as to whether or not the airport 16 authority as originally voted on by the voters is the current 17 managing authority for the airport, and the only way we can 18 get there is for me to walk you through the timeline of 19 events with the airport. So, if you would bear with me, I 20 provided it to you in writing, but I'm going to skip straight 21 to 1966. And I'm sorry -- 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Wow, fast jump. 23 MR. EMERSON: I could go to 1943; could be worse. 24 November 8, 1966, constitutional amendment of Article 9, 25 Section 12, authorizes airport authorities to be established 10-22-07 71 1 by the Legislature and the voters. March 3, 1967, the County 2 passes a resolution requesting the Legislature establish by 3 statute the Kerr County Airport Authority, which subsequently 4 becomes House Bill 956. April 21st, 1967, the City approves 5 House Bill 956. June 8, 1967, House Bill 956 is approved by 6 the Legislature to become effective August 28th of '67. Now 7 we have a two-year lag, and in February of 1969, the Airport 8 Zoning Board is established by the City, with representation 9 designated as two city, two county, and one representative 10 appointed by both. July 29th, 1969, the City and the County 11 Joint Municipal Airport Zoning Board creates the Board of 12 Adjustment with five members. 1969-1970, sometime in 13 there -- and please bear in mind, I put this data together 14 with compilation of notes I could find from the City, notes 15 from the County, and old newspaper articles from Kerrville 16 Daily Times. 17 1969-1970, the Chamber of Commerce requested a call 18 for election of the airport authority that was previously 19 approved by the Legislature back in '67. February 24th of 20 1970, the City appoints a five-member airport board under the 21 Texas Municipal Airport Act pending a call of election to 22 create the airport authority. February 25th, 1970, the 23 County essentially adopts the same order under a county 24 order. March 10, 1970, the City completes the joint airport 25 board approval. March 13th, the County confirms the 10-22-07 72 1 appointment of the original five joint airport board members. 2 You have five members of the joint airport board under the 3 Municipal Airport Act managing the airport at this point. 4 April 14th of 1970, the joint airport board recommends 5 legislation for airport authority to the City, and the City 6 elects to appoint airport authority board members instead of 7 electing them, following the recommendation of the airport 8 board. The reason that's important is because, under House 9 Bill 956, there's two ways for the airport board to be 10 appointed for the members. One is election; one is 11 appointment by the City. And where the appointment by the 12 City comes in is, it states the City gets to choose which way 13 the board members are appointed, and then the County ratifies 14 it at that point. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Doesn't that statute, 16 however, say that that's done in concurrence with the two 17 governing bodies? 18 MR. EMERSON: That's correct. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: One with the other? 20 MR. EMERSON: Correct. April 17 of 1970, the 21 County accepts and certifies the citizens' petition for 22 airport authority and orders an election. May 16 of 1970, 23 there's a county election for the airport authority, and on 24 May 22nd, the county canvasses the election votes and 25 declares creation of the airport authority. Now, pursuant to 10-22-07 73 1 the statute, House Bill 956, Subsection 6(a), if the 2 governing body of Kerrville determines that the directors are 3 to be appointed, the Commissioners Court of Kerr County shall 4 appoint them within 10 days after declaring the authority 5 created. So, on May 22nd, 1970, this authority was declared 6 into creation. There is no record ever, anywhere, of the 7 appointment of the board members into this authority. Okay? 8 June -- 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That was an act that should 10 have been done by the County? 11 MR. EMERSON: Should have been done by the County 12 within 10 days, with the agreement of the City. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, it's kind of a joint -- we 14 jointly -- we voted, but we talked to them before we voted. 15 MR. EMERSON: Correct. So the ball -- at some 16 point, for whatever reason, that -- that action was not 17 taken. June 29, 1970, the County appoints members of the 18 Airport Board of Adjustment. April 12, 1977, there's a 19 seven-year lapse in any kind of activity I could find that's 20 recorded. Joint airport board recommends to the City that 21 ownership and management be turned over to the City. And 22 June 28th, 1977, the City considers annexing the airport for 23 the tax revenue. January 10 of 1978, the airport board 24 recommends that when annexation is complete, the City will 25 have better control of the airport, and an airport manager 10-22-07 74 1 should be hired. March 14 of 1978, city public hearing on 2 annexation. City assumes management, but -- of the airport, 3 but the expenses are shared with the County, which is kind of 4 where we ended up now. July 1978, the airport board asks for 5 a manager to be hired. June 26 of '79, the City appoints an 6 airport development coordinator. June 8th of 1982, the City 7 amends the airport standards to provide for a City/County 8 airport fund to isolate the funding -- the cash flow between 9 the City and the County to a separate fund. July 26, 1986, 10 the County turns over the water system to the City that 11 supplies the airport. 12 January 27th of '87, City confirms the airport 13 board status as advisory only. February 9th of '87, the 14 County confirms the airport status as advisory only. Once 15 again, not pointing fingers, but I'm not sure, number one, 16 under the Municipal Airport Act, that that's authorized, and 17 it's definitely not following what the voters wanted to do 18 when they voted in 1970 to create an authority. August 25th 19 of '87, the City amends the ordinance establishing airport 20 board to state "advisory only." It's subsequently passed by 21 section reading in September of '87. May 8th of 1990, the 22 airport manager is designated as a contact person for 23 contractual issues. March 24th of 1992, it's interesting; 24 City staff notes that the airport board is not being 25 appointed per ordinance. Okay. Now, frankly, I didn't go 10-22-07 75 1 back and dig up the transcripts from the -- from the 2 Commissioners -- from the City Council meeting, but either 3 way, it's not meeting with the Municipal Airport Act for the 4 elected ordinance. 5 There's a new city airport code in May of 1997. 6 April 16 of 2003, the next viable communication, in a city 7 memorandum, the City Manager states the airport board, under 8 Subparagraph 1, is not merely advisory, but has all the 9 powers of the Texas Municipal Airport Act, which is now 10 Chapter 22, which is what we're currently operating under. 11 And in Paragraph 6, the airport authority, although created 12 via an election in 1970, has never been activated, has no 13 taxing authority, and is not the entity that now exists and 14 manages the affairs of the airport. And then on July 26th of 15 2004, the County approves a new interlocal agreement for 16 joint management of the airport under Texas Transportation 17 Code, Chapter 22, which, as previously stated, is a successor 18 to the Municipal Airport Act. The City subsequently approves 19 that interlocal agreement in August of 2004, and then a new 20 airport code is approved in 2005. 21 And the reason this issue comes up is because it -- 22 the issue of the original airport authority that was blessed 23 by the voters back in May of 1970, when you go back and you 24 read the newspaper articles, the whole reason for appointing 25 that authority and electing that authority was to create an 10-22-07 76 1 independent governing body for the airport so that it could 2 be more efficiently managed. And there's a lot of 3 discussions in the newspaper articles that are quotes from 4 Commissioners in county court meetings that specifically talk 5 about the fact that after some point of establishment, this 6 authority would be able to go back to the voters to determine 7 whether or not they could obtain taxing authority in order to 8 be self-sufficient, instead of the funds coming from both 9 sides and the ever popular battles that occur every year over 10 that. The issue once again has been raised, and the problem 11 arises in that, because the statute specifically designates 12 that those board members should be appointed within 10 days 13 of designation of the authority, there's some question as to 14 whether, 37 years later, we can even go in and raise that 15 authority. 16 I talked to the Texas Legislative Research Library 17 in Austin, who were a little bit dumbfounded, who talked to 18 their attorneys and stated that they had never run across 19 this particular issue before, did not know whether it would 20 be valid or not. At this point, I would recommend that y'all 21 request an opinion from the Attorney General's office in 22 order to put this matter to bed once and for all. If this 23 authority were resurrected without an opinion from the 24 Attorney General, and subsequently did go to the voters and 25 request to be given taxing authority, and they did approve 10-22-07 77 1 it, I think you could be -- have some serious issues as to 2 whether that authority is even valid to start with. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make a couple of comments 4 first, then probably Bill has some. I want to thank Rex, 5 'cause I know he had to bring in some new furniture into his 6 office to house all this paper while he was going through 7 these documents, and it's a massive undertaking. Also, I 8 thank Commissioner Williams, 'cause he dug up a lot of those 9 documents and then asked Rex to go through them. I think 10 this is -- it's an issue that we really do need to put behind 11 us. There are a lot of actions by both the City and the 12 County in the last 30-plus years that were just done, and 13 many times contrary to the -- the vote of the voters. And 14 that's something that seems very odd to me, that that -- I 15 mean, that happens. And it -- it goes over such a long 16 period of time and through so many different people that no 17 one's, you know, responsible necessarily, but it needs to be 18 cleared up. Because I think, once again -- and I think 19 everyone's aware that we're -- the whole airport governance 20 issue is back on the table; we're waiting to work on a new 21 agreement, and I think it needs to be determined once and for 22 all whether that authority exists or does not exist. 23 To me, from a practical standpoint, I don't see a 24 huge difference, 'cause that seems to be the direction we 25 want to go. We want to have an independent board running the 10-22-07 78 1 airport. Whether it's done under the authority, that's fine, 2 or if we say the authority has gone, we'll do it a different 3 way. That's fine. But I think that I certainly support 4 Rex's decision -- or recommendation to go to the Attorney 5 General for a final determination, because I think it would 6 be to the benefit of everybody to get this resolved so we can 7 move forward and get everything on a better running basis at 8 the airport. And I don't know if that requires -- we have to 9 give you an order -- a court order to just ask you to -- 10 MR. EMERSON: A request. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This Commissioner is 12 requesting. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'll support that, because 14 I think it's important. When I wrote the memorandum for Rex 15 in September, all I had the benefit of was what we had on 16 file in the County Clerk's office, and then subsequent to 17 that, I went to the -- to the record -- to the history center 18 and researched the old newspapers going back to 1970, when 19 all this began to take shape. I have one question, Rex, and 20 one comment. In your research, you've turned up a lot of 21 documents, I guess, that the City had, or perhaps were in 22 your files. I don't know where they were. Have you come 23 across any repealers for House Bill 956, which established 24 the Kerr County Airport Authority? 25 MR. EMERSON: Absolutely not. And according to the 10-22-07 79 1 Texas Legislative Library, there is no repeal of that 2 statute. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 4 MR. EMERSON: The statute's still in existence, and 5 the statute was not absorbed into Chapter 22. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Was not absorbed? 7 MR. EMERSON: It still stands independently. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 'Cause it was, I 9 think, intended by the voters, when they did the 10 constitutional amendment back in '69, to set the airport 11 authority up separately and give them their own structure and 12 status and whatever, whatever. And if memory serves me 13 correctly, there was only four that originally were set up as 14 a result of that constitutional amendment going way back. 15 The other thing is, the comment is, in looking at all these 16 old newspaper reports going back, this was an initiative that 17 came out of the City, the airport authority. And I was 18 surprised to learn that, because that was one of the 19 questions. Where did this come about? Who came to 20 Commissioners Court and said, "Hey, we need to create an 21 airport authority"? Because there was a petition sent -- 22 filed with about nine -- almost 1,000 signatures on it, and 23 the articles reveal that this really was an initiative that 24 came out of the Chamber directly to the City Council, for the 25 reasons that the County Attorney points out. They wanted one 10-22-07 80 1 body to govern and make those decisions with respect to the 2 airport and its improvements and whatever took place out 3 there. 4 But -- and in anticipation of what they -- of the 5 authority, they set up a commission under the old 6 Transportation Code or the old Municipal Airport Act, 7 whatever that was. And while I can't find any -- any record 8 anywhere that indicates or confirms this, it is a strong 9 suspicion in my mind that when they appointed the commission 10 and they named five very -- very high-stature citizens of 11 Kerr County to represent or to be on that commission, I just 12 kind of believe in the back of my head their intention -- 13 because they sent the resolution over here with those five 14 names; the Commissioners Court accepted that resolution. It 15 was their intention for those same five that they put on the 16 commission to ultimately be named to the airport authority if 17 approved by the voters of Kerr County. 18 It subsequently was approved, but there never was 19 that document that came back to the Commissioners Court 20 naming those as airport authority people. 'Cause they had 21 some very prominent citizens named to go to that commission 22 at the outset. So, whatever that is, if it was neglect -- 23 benign neglect or whatever, and then for 17 years, the record 24 that I found went dark until that letter came from the former 25 City Manager saying, "We just discovered that we don't have 10-22-07 81 1 enough authority to negotiate leases, and we gave these 2 people some authority they don't really want or deserve." 3 So, let's get it straightened out. I agree with you. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Rex, back in 1970, when the joint 5 airport board -- Kerrville/Kerr County Joint Airport Board 6 was created by the combined actions of the City and the 7 County, were those lawful acts to create that particular 8 entity? 9 MR. EMERSON: Yes, sir. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: So far as you know? 11 MR. EMERSON: As far as I know. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Has there been any action by the 13 City or the County -- any lawful action -- when I say 14 "lawful," I'm excluding the declaration that it's advisory 15 only by both the Court and the City Council, because I 16 believe once they say it's under the Municipal Airport Act, I 17 don't think you can modify state law by this body, by the 18 City Council, or the combined efforts of both. But has there 19 been any lawful action by either the City or the County to 20 disband, eliminate, or do away with the Kerrville/Kerr County 21 Joint Airport Board? 22 MR. EMERSON: The short answer would be no. In 23 2003-2004, that airport board was modified by agreement under 24 Texas Transportation Code, Chapter 22, which subsequently 25 absorbed the Texas Municipal Airport Act. 10-22-07 82 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That was a codification, really, 2 wasn't it? 3 MR. EMERSON: There was an interlocal agreement 4 that modified the way that airport board governed, and the 5 complement thereof. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, there's two -- there's the 7 authority that was voted by the voters, and then there's the 8 acts by the City and the County to operate under the 9 Transportation Code. 10 MR. EMERSON: Correct. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which was the most recent 12 action we took, yeah. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, yeah. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What was really interesting 15 in all that research was that the first four signators on 16 that petition were the City Council. 17 MR. EMERSON: I don't think there's any doubt from 18 the research that it was the intent of the voters in both 19 bodies to make an independent airport authority, but just -- 20 somewhere between Point A and B, it fell off the table. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. And what your -- your 22 purpose here today is to advise us that we've got these 23 questions hanging, and it's your intention to ask for an 24 Attorney General's opinion as to the legal status of 25 primarily the authority, and -- and maybe the joint airport 10-22-07 83 1 board, too. I don't know. Maybe you want to include them 2 both. 3 MR. EMERSON: We could, but I think the real issue 4 is whether or not the authority is a viable entity at this 5 point in time. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But can you have the authority 7 -- I mean, I think, from what the Judge is saying a little 8 bit, if you -- I guess the authority issue will answer, can 9 you have both an authority and operate the other way? Can 10 you do it two ways? I mean, the vote of the authority may 11 have canceled out the ability to operate under the current 12 Transportation Code. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, I think that's 14 correct, that it did. The authority takes precedence. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, therefore, we can't operate 16 under, you know, Chapter 22 right now, or -- Chapter 22? 17 MR. EMERSON: In theory, I think you would be 18 correct, except that 37 years later, the authority never 19 being populated, it may or may not exist. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. Well, that's why we 21 have the Attorney General. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, Center Point 23 incorporated years ago and then had to disincorporate, 24 because they found out later they were and didn't want to be. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Strange things happen. 10-22-07 84 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions? Comments? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you, Rex. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do you need a formal 4 motion? 5 JUDGE TINLEY: He said he doesn't need it. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This -- in this newspaper, I 7 thought it was really interesting that Mr. Schwethelm, that 8 was the Chamber of Commerce guy, says he wanted to work 9 toward improving the industrial climate, with the object of 10 keeping present industry and attracting new industry. We 11 hear that same thing every year. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Every year. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This is 1970. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think Judge Tinley said 15 the very same thing about two weeks ago. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, two or three times. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Exact same words. 18 Unbelievable. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else with regard to that 20 agenda item? Let's go ahead and take about a 15-minute 21 recess. 22 (Recess taken from 10:46 a.m. to 11:00 a.m.) 23 - - - - - - - - - - 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to order, if 25 we might. Next item on the agenda is Item 13, to consider, 10-22-07 85 1 discuss, and take appropriate action to honor request from 2 Texas Association for Home Care to declare November 2007 as 3 Home Care and Hospice Month in Kerr County. I put this on 4 the agenda at the request of -- of the Texas Association for 5 Home Care. Apparently they're doing this all over the state. 6 This is a matter in which Commissioner Baldwin has a very 7 stong and abiding interest. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is it? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Number 13. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. Oh, yeah. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that a move for approval? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is, sir. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I'm honored to do so. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and second for 19 approval of the agenda item. Any question or discussion on 20 the motion? 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: One typographical 22 correction under the Resolved, third line. "Encourages" the 23 authority. Should be plural. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, where is that, Bill? 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The word "encourage" needs 10-22-07 86 1 to have an "S" on it. Encourages. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's why I make the big 4 bucks. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or discussion 6 on the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by 7 raising your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 12 to Item 14; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 13 approve the contracts with Kerr Economic Development 14 Foundation, Big Brothers and Sisters, K'Star, Divide 15 Volunteer Fire Department, Mountain Home Volunteer Fire 16 Department, Center Point Volunteer Fire Department, Hunt 17 Volunteer Fire Department, Comfort Volunteer Fire Department, 18 Elm Pass Volunteer Fire Department, Ingram Volunteer Fire 19 Department, Castle Lake Volunteer Fire Department, and Tierra 20 Linda Volunteer Fire Department, and allow the County Judge 21 to sign same. Mr. Emerson, these contracts are just this 22 year's version of the same contracts that we've had in place 23 for some period of time? 24 MR. EMERSON: That's my understanding, Judge. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. 10-22-07 87 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where's Upper Turtle Creek? 3 MS. GRINSTEAD: They haven't returned it yet. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Where is Castle Lake 6 Volunteer Fire Department? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's down -- it's actually in 8 Bandera County, right there in that far corner area. They 9 serve a couple hundred people of Kerr County. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I didn't know where that was. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You got to go out of county 12 to get there. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: That's right, you literally do. Any 14 other questions or comments? 15 MS. HARGIS: Yes, I do. I don't have specifically 16 with one of these, but you had -- when I first got here, I 17 had a letter on my desk where you approved the Auditor's 18 office doing an audit for -- I think it was the ESD 1, and 19 perhaps ESD 2, the emergency service districts that cover 20 some of these volunteer fire departments. And Tommy probably 21 could have performed those audits without a problem, but 22 because I am a C.P.A., I can't -- because I'm not 23 independent, I cannot do that. And if I do do that audit, 24 then you're going to have to pay more for me to have a peer 25 review than you would for them to have their audit on their 10-22-07 88 1 own, because I cannot audit without having a peer review, and 2 the minimum is $5,000. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: For a peer review or an audit? 4 MS. HARGIS: No, if do I an audit, -- 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 6 MS. HARGIS: -- I have to have a peer review, 7 period. 8 MR. EMERSON: What agenda item are we on? 9 MS. HARGIS: We're on 14. They're talking about 10 approval of those contracts, and part of those contracts are 11 for me to do an audit on those, so I just wanted to bring 12 that up. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Is it required that an audit be 14 done? 15 MS. HARGIS: Yes, under the Health and Safety Code, 16 they're supposed to have an independent audit. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: For a fire department? 18 MS. HARGIS: The ESD's. The fire departments don't 19 have to have, but ESD's do. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: We don't have any ESD's in this 21 group of contracts. 22 MS. HARGIS: Well, they govern this, though. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: ESD's got nothing to do with 24 fire department. 25 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 10-22-07 89 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We'll have to address that at 2 another time. 3 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But when it comes up, we can't 5 do that. (Laughter.) 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Remember so you can stop 7 us, Rex. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't see any provision in here 9 with respect to audit. 10 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: If it's there, I don't ... 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The volunteer fire 13 departments aren't required to have an audit. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But that provision, 15 Judge -- is that provision in our agreement with KEDF, Big 16 Brothers and Sisters, and K'Star? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Then we may require an audit, 18 but we don't do the audit. Ms. Hargis is saying that she 19 can't do an audit. We've never done an audit for those 20 entities. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That was the question. 22 Does the contract say we do it, or does it just say an audit 23 will be done? In which case, anybody else ought to do the 24 audit and give us a copy of it, right? 25 MS. HARGIS: Well, in most -- in most instances, 10-22-07 90 1 when I owned my own firm, it was recommended, and usually in 2 their bylaws of volunteer fire departments, there's a 3 suggestion that they have a review by an audit committee or 4 that they can perform one. And depending on the size of the 5 volunteer department, which these are not that big at this 6 stage of the game. The larger they get, it's highly 7 recommended, but it's the ESD that would then request that 8 they do that, because the ESD provides the funding. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But we've gone off our agenda 10 item, 'cause we're not -- we can't talk about ESD's. 11 MS. HARGIS: Okay. But just -- they provide the 12 funding. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't see it in the contracts I've 14 reviewed. 15 MS. HARGIS: Okay. I'll put it on the agenda for 16 next time. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: The records are available for public 18 inspection. Performance reviews are required, for example, 19 by -- by Big Brothers/Big Sisters under federal law. They're 20 required to comply with those. There's nothing in any of 21 these that I see that have anything to do with audit. Any 22 other questions or comments? All in favor of the motion, 23 signify by raising your right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10-22-07 91 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's move 3 to Item 15; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 4 authorize the draining of Ingram Lake. Commissioner Oehler. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I've had some requests from 6 landowners who have property that actually goes out into the 7 lake, that it be drained so they can do some cleanup and 8 maintenance along their docks and various things. It hasn't 9 been done in 11 years. And I've also called the -- Bob 10 Sweeney, who is the head legal for Texas Parks and Wildlife, 11 to see if there was any problem with doing this and cleaning 12 up those areas that were -- have silted in, and he says that 13 it's an exempt thing. You're not actually working within the 14 gradient boundary; it's all dry ground. It's solid rock 15 bottom, and it's just removing some -- some silted areas that 16 don't have anything to do with necessary -- necessitating any 17 kind of a permit. And I would like for us to do that, and I 18 have Ray Garcia lined up to help tie a chain onto a plug, and 19 Road and Bridge can take a loader and pull the plug to drain 20 it. It will take approximately two weeks for it to drain 21 down to what the normal gradient boundary of the river was 22 before the dam was built. It doesn't dry up completely; 23 still leaves the channels and everything so the fish can 24 survive, or some of them, whatever, don't go through the hole 25 in the dam, go downstream. 10-22-07 92 1 And Leonard tells me that he will notify the City 2 of Kerrville, let them know that we're doing this so if they 3 have any kind of increased flow, whatever, because of that -- 4 because city drinking water does come out of the river. Put 5 them on notice that that is -- that will happen if the Court 6 approves it. And also, I will see to it that we put adequate 7 advertising out so people are aware that it is going to 8 happen. Also, put up warning signs on the dam, keep people 9 from getting anywhere near the drain, so that we don't have 10 somebody get hurt or killed, and have a few flyers that we 11 can put out around the area, make people aware that we need 12 to do this. I think there's a little bit of maintenance that 13 needs to be done with the last survey by the company that 14 just got through X-raying the dam. There's very little, but 15 there's a little bit of maintenance. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I've got a report that just 17 came in. I'll read it. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just flew in your door? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just came in over the 20 transmitter. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What does it say? 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We are putting -- this -- 23 it's dated today from Stefan Schuster of Freese and Nichols. 24 We are putting the final touches on our report for the NDT 25 testing of the Kerr County dams. Report should be complete 10-22-07 93 1 by the end of this week. We will schedule a presentation to 2 Commissioners Court in the next few weeks. Generally, there 3 are voids present at both dams, with up to 20 percent of the 4 decks having some cavity beneath them. Our report will 5 provide an overview of the investigation and make 6 recommendations for a repair plan. If you have any 7 questions, give me a call. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, this would be a good 9 time to do it. That way the water level will be down, and 10 whatever repairs need to be done can be done while it's 11 drained. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: When were you planning to do 13 this? 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: End of this month, first of 15 November. And leaving it -- it's going to take a while once 16 it drains for all that silt to dry out enough to be able to 17 handle it to move it out of there. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My only question would be to 19 make sure that we don't do it -- make sure we have that plan 20 in place prior to doing it, because we don't want to -- I 21 mean, and I suspect that may take a little bit of time to 22 develop a design and a plan for filling that up. I mean, 23 I -- 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I believe that this will be 25 -- you know, it will be drained for two to three months. 10-22-07 94 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He says we'll deliver the 2 report and presentation to the Court in the next few days. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And if it works out to where 5 we can have it repaired at the same time, we can do some 6 other little maintenance that needs to be done in-house. 7 And -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think if we're going to drain 9 it, we need to do the maintenance. We need to fix it now if 10 we're going to fix it. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do we run -- Bruce, do we 12 run into any desilting or dewatering of the silt problems, or 13 is that part of the permit process that we don't need to go 14 through? 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: He tells me that we're exempt 16 from the permit process when doing that. I talked to him 17 three weeks ago, and I -- he said what he would like to have 18 is a copy of the court order, and I assured him that he could 19 have that. As well as -- or I will give him the -- the flyer 20 that I intend to put out to put notice -- you know, residents 21 on notice that it's going to happen, as well as newspaper 22 articles that reference that. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would -- I think we need to 24 get it in writing from them, because I know Parks and 25 Wildlife hammered Bandera County when they drained their lake 10-22-07 95 1 to take some gravel out. They made them put it all back. I 2 think we need to get this in writing. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We're not taking out any 4 gravel. We're not working in the -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. And that's probably the 6 reason. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We're in the gradient 8 boundary. We're actually up on the bank, and I told him the 9 whole story. We're not removing the gravel from areas within 10 the -- the gradient boundary. We're only removing silt from 11 up on the -- or the residents will be removing silt. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, you're not going to do 13 any cleaning? 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If there's anything to be 15 done at all, it will be minor, right around the boat dock, or 16 if there's a boulder or tree or something that's washed in 17 there that needs to be taken out. But the County's exposure 18 to this and cost is almost nothing, 'cause I don't intend for 19 the County to be working on anybody's private property. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's good. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't think that's a good 23 idea. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just don't understand why 25 you don't wait till June to do this. 10-22-07 96 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I understand perfectly why we 2 don't. I think you did that once. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I tried it. It didn't work 4 real well. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Doesn't work during the time 6 of spawn either. 7 MR. EMERSON: Just one issue. When you're talking 8 to all the private property owners, you might remind them 9 that because they're operating within the floodplain area, 10 they're looking at permits to go in there and clean their 11 property out. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Some of that is floodplain 13 and some of it really isn't. The dam created a -- a 14 reservoir, and a lot of that land was not in the floodplain 15 prior to the dam being built. 16 MR. EMERSON: If it's in the floodplain map, and if 17 they go in and make any changes, they need a permit. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. Well, I will -- 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Not as easy as it used to be. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I will check that out as well 21 and make sure that the landowners know what they have to do. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You also might make sure that 23 U.G.R.A.'s in that loop of timing and aware of it all. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 25 MR. ODOM: Also a suggestion, that maybe we have a 10-22-07 97 1 firm date, plus or minus, of when we close it again. Are we 2 going to leave it for Christmas? You know, what it would -- 3 middle of December, plus or minus, in there? 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's a hard thing to know to 5 get a permanent time -- or a set time, because we don't know 6 what the weather's going to do. And if it's going to rain 7 between now and then, it takes a while for that silt to 8 dewater. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And we've also had it drained 11 before, and we got a flood and it filled it back up, and it 12 had to drain back down again, and so there's a lot of 13 unknowns. But I would say the target date to close it back 14 up would be right before the end of the year. 15 MR. ODOM: Before Christmas or New Year's? 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Before New Year's. 17 MR. ODOM: Before New Year's? 18 (Discussion off the record.) 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You going to put the plug back 20 in before New Year's? 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Would like to. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But we're not going to do it 23 until the end of the month, so we're only going to have two 24 months, and you say it will take two months to dry. There's 25 no way to have it done before then. Really, the first of 10-22-07 98 1 February at the earliest. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We need to have it back in 3 before the first of February, 'cause that's when the bass 4 start spawning; that's when you get in trouble with the bass 5 club. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We've done this before, 7 haven't we? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Been there, done that. Just 9 like Buster drained it one year in June. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We drained Flat Rock one 11 year too, and screwed up the spawning too. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm certainly in favor of doing 13 it, but we ought to try to -- doesn't cost that much if we 14 have to do it again. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not a hard thing to do. 16 (Discussion off the record.) 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just make sure everyone -- 18 there's all -- you know, as long as all permits are done and 19 we have sign-off by everybody, I have no problem with it. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: We need any action by the Court at 21 this point? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think at some point we have 23 to authorize Road and Bridge to do it, for Road and Bridge 24 and our volunteer from Environmental Health. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Be sure you get Ray out of 10-22-07 99 1 the water before you pull the plug, will you? 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I told Ray we would get him 3 out of the water in plenty of time before they pulled the 4 plug. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are we going to use your new 6 piece of machinery, Leonard? 7 MR. ODOM: Pardon me? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Nevermind. I asked if you were 9 going to use your new machine to pull the plug. 10 MR. ODOM: Just a loader and cable, that's all I 11 need. It will float like a car. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I make a motion -- you make a 13 motion if you want. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I move that we -- that we -- 15 thank you; it is my precinct. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He just remembered. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I move that we authorize the 18 draining of Ingram Lake, and that the time frame be between 19 the end of October and no later than the first of February to 20 be refilled. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 23 indicated. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 24 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 10-22-07 100 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Item 16, set 4 a date and time for a workshop on long-range planning 5 improvements, maintenance, et cetera, for the county parks. 6 Commissioner Williams? 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I put on this on because 8 there seems to be some questions with respect to parks and 9 recreation and maintenance and improvements, and section one, 10 section two of Flat Rock Lake Park, a bridge, when we're 11 going to open up the park. We got a ton of issues, and so I 12 thought it might be a good time to have a workshop. Also, 13 the Court will remember that we updated the Parks and 14 Recreation master plan, and it extends to 2008, so it's 15 probably time to take a look at all that, and I would suggest 16 we have a workshop on that, maybe in the afternoon of the 17 first meeting in November, if that meets with the pleasure of 18 the Court. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, it will take a while to 20 digest all this. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It does. That's the reason 22 I gave it to you early. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: When do you want to do it? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's that date, Judge? 25 JUDGE TINLEY: November the 12th. 10-22-07 101 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: November 12th in the 2 afternoon. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: 1:30? 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Say 1:30. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that a motion? 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That is a motion. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 8 THE CLERK: That's the holiday. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that whole week is messed up 10 because we got the Veterans Day holiday on the 12th. We'll 11 be here on the 13th, and we got a bunch of stuff that's 12 getting jammed up because we got a four-day week that week. 13 Remember, we had to change all the public hearings on the 14 Road and Bridge stuff. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let's go the second 16 meeting, if that's problematic the first meeting. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. That would be the 25th, 18 correct? 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's going to be one of our 20 other holidays. 21 MS. HYDE: Thanksgiving. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's Thanksgiving. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: But that's the first part of the 24 week. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Monday. 10-22-07 102 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Monday. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Monday, the 19th -- well, wait a 3 minute. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, it would be the 26th. 5 November 26th. Thanksgiving is the 22nd. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, it's real early this 7 year. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. That's my birthday. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thanksgiving? Or -- 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, sometimes it's on 11 Thanksgiving. This year it's -- 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good, we're going to give 13 you a big turkey. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, thank you. I just 15 don't want to be the one being fried. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The 26th at 1:30. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: 1:30. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 26th at 1:30. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's a motion. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to have a 22 parks workshop at 1:30 on November the 26th, 2007. Any 23 question or discussion on the motion? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just one other comment. 25 I'll ask Jody to provide copies of that master plan to 10-22-07 103 1 anybody that needs it; i.e., Maintenance, Road and Bridge, 2 others who have concerns or assist us in the park. Okay. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or comments? All 4 in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 5 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 7 (No response.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 9 to Item 17; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 10 set a public hearing for the revision of the Kerr County 11 Subdivision Rules and regulations. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think everyone received a 13 copy of a draft that I put together. I went through -- well, 14 let me first go back -- this is all -- the main part of this 15 is because of some requirements by Water Development Board to 16 adopt some of their standards and their model rules into our 17 rules. I went back and looked through the letter received 18 from the Water Development Board, and how they thought we 19 could do it. Then I looked at Rex's, a little bit longer, 20 how he thinks that we -- he thought we should do it. Then I 21 worked on this thing, and then I decided to do it my way. 22 (Laughter.) 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm shocked and surprised. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Shock and awe. 10-22-07 104 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, shock and awe. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I actually kind of went 3 back to what the Water Development Board recommended 4 originally, and this is not contrary to Rex, just a different 5 approach, or different than I originally talked about. It 6 became very difficult to edit our current rules and not miss 7 something, though we did have to -- I did have to do that 8 some. So, what I really did, I took the model rules and 9 added them in, Section 5.09. And I want to go through these 10 real quickly, but that's kind of how we got all that in here, 11 and then I'm going to go through real quickly and go over 12 those changes and a few others. They're not -- most of the 13 other ones are not huge or real significant. On Page 7 -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Are we just setting a public 15 hearing? 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what it says. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're setting a public hearing, 19 but to set the public hearing, I think y'all need to know 20 what we're setting the public hearing on. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree. 22 MR. EMERSON: As long as you don't go into detail. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That took care of that. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Commissioner Letz, let me 25 ask you a question. These darkened areas -- 10-22-07 105 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are changes. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- are the changes. And 3 they're throughout this entire book, I see, but I don't know 4 what the changes are. Like, when I turn to Page 29, how do I 5 know what the -- what has been and what's going to be? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The majority of the changes are 7 new language completely; it's additional language that we did 8 not have. There's a big section, -- 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 5.09. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- 5.09, 13 pages long, that is 11 new language completely. What the basic changes are to do 12 this that I'm recommending is, at least when we have the 13 public hearing, we make one big change and say individual 14 water wells -- to have an individual -- individual water 15 well, you have to be greater than 5 acres, instead of 5 acres 16 or greater. That's a very minor change, but what the reason 17 for that is, the new language to adopt covers everything 18 5 acres and smaller. And that's what the basic part of the 19 changes are here, and you can see them, you know, as you're 20 going through the document. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Dealing with model rules, you're 22 talking about? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Model rules essentially talk 24 about water and wastewater. I will put this on the next 25 agenda, 'cause he's shaking his head, and go over it in a 10-22-07 106 1 little more detail after everyone has time to read them. I 2 think we set the public hearing today. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: When do you want that public 4 hearing? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thirty days from -- this 6 requires 30 days, correct, Rex? Subdivision rule 7 modification? Where does that put us? I don't have a 8 calendar. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: 26th. November the 26th? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. Public hearing -- yeah, 11 put it on for public hearing on the Subdivision Rules for the 12 26th of November. At 10 a.m.? 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Question, more directed to 14 the County Attorney. Can we also put approval on the same 15 agenda, behind the public hearing? We can, can we not? 16 MR. EMERSON: I think so. Because -- 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Because we do have kind of 18 a time issue here with Water Development Board. We hope to 19 be on their agenda for consideration in the December meeting, 20 which means we need to get the last piece in place in 21 November. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I will -- yeah. And I will put 23 this on the next agenda, possibly as a workshop format, so 24 that we can go through the changes that need to be made. 25 THE CLERK: You have a motion. 10-22-07 107 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That's what I thought. We don't 2 have a second. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: We do now. I have a motion and 6 second. Any question or discussion on the motion? All in 7 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. We'll move to Item 12 18; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to adopt a 13 resolution regarding the 2008 Kerr County resolutions for 14 Indigent Defense Grant program. This was put on at the 15 request of the Auditor. I assume this has to do with our 16 ability to get what reimbursement we manage to get? 17 MS. HARGIS: Just a formality. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Hmm? 19 MS. HARGIS: Just a formality. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 24 approval. Question or discussion? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: When you -- this is to be 10-22-07 108 1 reimbursed for moneys that we've spent on defense. Who -- 2 who reimburses us? Who's this go to? 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Criminal Justice Division. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Governor's office? And is 5 it federal money that just comes -- comes down to them, block 6 grant type things? 7 MS. HARGIS: No, you have to send in -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 9 MS. HARGIS: -- certification. We have to send in 10 quarterly reports. But it requires that upon granting you 11 the grant, that you have a resolution accepting the grant. 12 That's all you're doing at this point. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. Second -- third. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: These are not federal 15 funds; these are state funds, right? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, some -- they may be federal 17 funds flowing through the state. There's a lot of that that 18 goes on with some of these programs. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It will be -- 20 JUDGE TINLEY: State administers them. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Is this after we reach a 22 certain percentage and we run out of money, basically? 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Like Indigent Health care. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's not. What I gather, 25 that's not the case. 10-22-07 109 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, I don't think that's the 2 case. 3 MS. HARGIS: No. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What I do know about this, 5 though, is it's our money that we have sent to Washington and 6 Austin, and now we're begging to have some of our own money 7 back. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: After the appropriate administrative 9 costs have been deducted. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Correct. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Do we need knee pads for 12 this? (Laughter.) 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's a different grant. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Keep a few votive candles available. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments? 18 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 19 hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. I didn't see 24 any items on the agenda requiring closed or executive 25 session. We'll move to payment of the bills. 10-22-07 110 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'd like to make a motion, 2 Judge, that we pay our bills. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second that motion. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion and second to pay the bills. 5 Any questions or discussion? Speaking of the indigent health 6 care, I noted that this was a banner pay period for those 7 providing health care to those qualifying under the indigent 8 program, for a mere -- just under $83,000 this period. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh my gosh. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I just -- I think I 12 know the answer, but I want to ask Rex about the -- about the 13 public service DVD shoot. 14 MR. EMERSON: I'm sorry, what? 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: On your bills, Sunset 16 Entertainment. 17 MR. EMERSON: That's not what it appears to be. 18 (Laughter.) 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I just thought it might 20 generate a little discussion. 21 MR. EMERSON: That was under the new legislative 22 authority that requires that. We cannot talk to any 23 defendants prior to a written waiver of their right to 24 counsel. Okay, there's very specific rules that were put in 25 place, and what we did was, in County Court at Law, we have a 10-22-07 111 1 video that's shown to everybody that comes in the courtroom. 2 We shot that in two parts. Judge Brown shot the first part 3 of the video, and what he does is take the new admonishments, 4 goes through those individually with everybody that's in the 5 courtroom, goes through the procedures for whether or not 6 they choose to waive or not waive right of access to an 7 attorney to be able to talk to the prosecutor's office that 8 day, and tells them that if they do not waive, they'll be 9 reset for a minimum of ten days pursuant to statute to allow 10 us to talk to them. After the ten days, it's presumed that 11 they've had an opportunity to consult with counsel and talk 12 to them. The second part of the video is a reshoot of the 13 original video that I shot in 1998. Statutes have changed a 14 little bit since then, and a lot of the probation terms are 15 different, and we updated the video. Otherwise, what happens 16 is every single person that comes to the table, we have to 17 sit there and go through every single term of probation with 18 them, and this way we can show it to everybody that waives 19 their right to counsel, and they're advised of all the 20 probation terms and conditions in one shot. So, it allows 21 for the efficiency of the court. We spend a little bit of 22 money up front, but we can move a whole lot more cases. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay, that's fine. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments? 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Only other one I have is on 10-22-07 112 1 reimbursement mileage to Becky Henderson. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I saw that. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Item 12 -- Page 12. Didn't 4 we deny one of those last month? Or did we? 5 JUDGE TINLEY: We didn't actually deny it, but I 6 think we went on record as -- that was specifically in-county 7 mileage, the one last month. 8 MS. HARGIS: That one was the Ag Extension Service, 9 and -- and that one should have been done. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This one -- 11 MS. HARGIS: This one, I -- I haven't had any 12 discussion with them on this one, so I can't -- 13 MR. EMERSON: I might be able to shed a little bit 14 of light. It's my understanding -- because I went up to go 15 see her, and she was gone. It's my understanding that she 16 accompanied the District Judges, specifically Judge Ables as 17 Senior Administrative Judge, and she is his coordinator, to 18 the Judge's conference, and she was responsible for some 19 activities at the conference. I don't know if that's the 20 specific bill, but I know she traveled. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments? 23 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 24 hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 10-22-07 113 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Budget 4 amendments. The Auditor's provided us with a summary sheet 5 of all of those. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We shouldn't see any more of 7 these for a while, should we? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Shouldn't. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is the end of '06-'07. 10 MS. HARGIS: It should be -- there are still a few, 11 like the training that Eva received that was actually 12 contracted for in September. That's about $1,500. We should 13 have all the electric bills and things, water bills, things 14 of that nature. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything that gets accrued. 16 MS. HARGIS: Sometimes you have to wait almost till 17 the end of the month, though. Usually 30 days it takes to 18 wash those out. But we do check most of those, 'cause if we 19 don't, the auditors will pick them up. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move for approval to pay 21 these little darlings. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: And approval of the budget 23 amendments? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: As shown on the summary? 10-22-07 114 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 3 approval of the budget amendments as per the summary. 4 Question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify 5 by raising your right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We have any 10 late bills? 11 MS. HARGIS: No, sir. We don't have them any more. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: I've been presented with monthly 13 reports for Justice of the Peace, Precinct 4; Justice of the 14 Peace, Precinct 2; County Clerk, General and Trust Fund; 15 Justice of the Peace, Precinct 1; and Constable, Precinct 3. 16 Do I hear a motion that these reports be approved as 17 presented? 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 21 approval of the reports as presented. Question or 22 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 23 your right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10-22-07 115 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Any member 3 of the Court have any report with regard to their liaison or 4 committee assignments? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir. Actually, wait, 6 wait, wait. I understand Buzzie's is supposed to be open 7 pretty soon. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Like today? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, not like today at all, 10 but soon. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have a -- 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I have one quickie. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I attended the Alamo 15 Workforce annual awards luncheon in San Antonio on the 16th, 16 and Mooney Aircraft -- Mooney Airplane Company was given an 17 award, a large, big award for excellence in training and so 18 forth and so on with respect to the way they handle their 19 employees. F.Y.I. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Rex, question kind of for you 21 to think about. When Chuck Bickerstaff was here talking 22 about legislative changes a couple weeks ago, he made a 23 comment about a requirement that we do a takings assessment 24 with Subdivision Rules, and that, I believe, has to go -- or 25 should go kind of in concert with it. Can you check as to 10-22-07 116 1 what we need to do on that takings provision, as it being -- 2 and the state law that was passed several years ago about 3 takings, it's a requirement of that law, and that we -- it's 4 fairly -- a procedural thing, but something that we need to 5 have on record, and we need to make sure that if that's 6 correct, that we do that. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I remember a couple of years 8 ago, when you used the word "takings," it was in reference 9 to, like, eminent domain and things like that. Is that where 10 we are? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's where we are, yeah. 12 'Cause -- and, you know, my recollection from Chuck 13 Bickerstaff's comment was that our rules obviously are 14 affecting property, and that if there's something there that 15 says that we're -- that they -- our rules constitute a 16 taking, we need to look at them from that standpoint and make 17 a determination that they are or aren't. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've got his phone number, 19 if you -- is that how you're talking? You want him to 20 contact -- 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I want him -- I just want him 22 to find out if we can do this. 23 MR. EMERSON: I have a copy of the transcript from 24 that workshop that y'all did. I just haven't finished 25 reading it, so I'll skip through and find that section, look 10-22-07 117 1 into it. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh, goodness. Liaison 5 duties. Ag Barn seems to be going fairly well. Animal 6 Control had a couple of issues. I don't think there's 7 anything major. I think they're getting fairly aggressive on 8 some things that have been let go for a while, and some 9 people that have never been in compliance with some of our 10 rules and regulations. Environmental Health is probably the 11 largest change that we're going to see for a long time. Ray 12 is developing some office policies and procedures, as well as 13 he is going to start holding the designers'/installers' feet 14 to the fire on following the rules and the procedures to 15 require permits to construct, as well as getting permits to 16 operate. The main reason that they have been so -- or so far 17 behind in their recordkeeping is because of some installers 18 getting preferential treatment from years past, and have not 19 completed the process so that people can get a permit to 20 operate systems they have paid money for. And he is going to 21 have the policies -- office policies to where everybody 22 follows the same rules, and it's way overdue, and I believe 23 that he is strong enough and determined enough to make it 24 stick. And that some of the -- I think some of us may be 25 getting calls from some of these installers who have received 10-22-07 118 1 special treatment in the past, and I think we need to be sure 2 and listen to both sides of the story and make sure that we 3 don't negate our own rules. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What's amazing about it is 5 that they -- they receive special treatment here -- here, but 6 they don't in the other counties that they do business in. 7 The surrounding counties, they play by the letter of the law, 8 and here we do a lot of stuff for them, and they stay mad at 9 us all the time for doing it -- or when we don't do it, that 10 kind of thing. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Right. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So it has to be -- we have 13 to get to a point to where we're all playing by the same 14 rules. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I totally agree. And Ray -- 16 I met with Ray the other day, and we had a long talk about 17 these things, and he is -- he wants to do everything by the 18 law and comply with everything so that we're not breaking our 19 own law -- breaking state law, and I think it's a good thing. 20 I'm glad he's where he is, and I think he's strong enough to 21 see it through. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We'd encourage him to do 24 that, and encourage these installers that we all know to 25 start playing by the rules and quit asking for special 10-22-07 119 1 treatment. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's it for me. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, if I could, he mentioned 5 Ag Barn, and that brought up something that I forgot to bring 6 up on Ag Barn. I got with Ms. Hargis a week or so ago about 7 the request for services proposal, or RFP for services for 8 the design aspect. That has been published, and while Bruce 9 is up in the far northwest, you know, playing, I'll be 10 working for the taxpayers, meeting with them on October -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh my god. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That was a low blow. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That was. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On October 31st, I'll be 15 meeting with anyone who's interested in submitting a 16 proposal, if they choose. It's not a requirement to meet, 17 but to kind of go over the concept out there that Bruce and I 18 are in agreement needs to be done. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We won't mention all the 20 times that Mr. Letz has been unavailable whenever I've taken 21 care of his duties for him. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, with -- 23 JUDGE TINLEY: We're not going to mention those? 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, we're not going to 25 mention those. 10-22-07 120 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But, anyway -- but I know we've 2 had some inquiries; I've talked to several people about that 3 already, and anyone that you all know in the community, it's 4 a relatively simple RFP. And we will need to -- at our next 5 agenda, we'll put on there as a -- the process to really 6 review them a little bit. We really haven't gone over that, 7 but they will be due -- right before the next meeting? First 8 meeting in November. 9 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right before there. So, we can 11 kind of have them back, and then we can decide the review 12 process at that meeting and go over them. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I might say that back when my 14 children were the age of Mr. Letz's children, we didn't get 15 to go to the Pacific northwest either. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That means he won't be 17 going along with you? 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't believe so. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Do we have any reports from elected 20 officials or department heads? 21 MS. HARGIS: I would like -- I have a couple of 22 things. First of all, I received the bids for the audit. 23 They're not opened, but we do -- and I didn't get it on the 24 agenda. And we have the award of the contract for the ag -- 25 you know, that Roy Walston didn't get, and then also the 10-22-07 121 1 insurance, so it's -- I was kind of wondering if we could 2 have a special meeting. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: The question I was going to propound 4 to Mr. Emerson -- I don't know what it's going to take in 5 terms of time for him to understand what he needs to 6 understand. One possibility could be as early as 2 o'clock 7 this afternoon. Is there any possibility you'd be in a 8 position to give us a response with regard to the employee 9 health benefits program? 10 MR. EMERSON: No. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, solves that issue. What 12 you're looking at is a special meeting for these various 13 items next week or so? 14 MS. HARGIS: 'Cause we really need to award the bid 15 for the audit. I did get two; one that I had -- one company 16 I've never heard of, but -- so we have two. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can do a special meeting 18 next week. 19 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Next Monday. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Why don't you -- why don't 22 you open those bids and then negotiate? 23 MS. HARGIS: No, I don't think so. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What do you mean, you don't 25 think so? 10-22-07 122 1 MS. HARGIS: Because this is not insurance. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I really don't get it. I 3 don't get it. But -- 4 MS. HARGIS: I'm not -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- I'm proud of you. I am 6 so proud of you. 7 MS. HARGIS: I'm not an attorney. I will stay out 8 of that one. I do not -- 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's a good thing. 10 MS. HARGIS: That's right. In my bid process, I 11 don't open them, and I do need permission. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, initially they have to come to 13 the Court for opening, anyway. 14 MS. HARGIS: Right. And then we can -- we can 15 negotiate, because their services -- I think once we do open 16 them, because you're going to get estimates, but they have to 17 be awarded, is my understanding. We have to award them. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: You're going to bring us RFQ's, not 19 RFP's. 20 MS. HARGIS: RFQ's. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll go ahead and get a meeting set 22 up. 23 MS. HARGIS: And then put Roy's on there so you can 24 award that one, at least those two things. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I can talk to Bruce today; we 10-22-07 123 1 can figure out the process for the other one too, so we can 2 get that going too. 3 MS. HARGIS: Okay. I would appreciate it. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 5 MR. EMERSON: If I could elaborate, Judge, what I 6 did was ask Mr. Looney to forward to me in writing proof of 7 the notice that went out for the RFP's, and then as well a 8 written chronology of events that occurred. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 MR. EMERSON: And then at that point, I'll sit down 11 and evaluate it. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay, good enough. So, we 13 don't need to recess; we can adjourn. 14 MS. HARGIS: What day do you want next week? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't know yet. We'll let you 16 know. 17 (Commissioners Court was adjourned at 11:46 a.m.) 18 - - - - - - - - - - 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 10-22-07 124 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 25th day of October, 8 2007. 9 10 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 11 BY: ________________________________ 12 Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk Certified Shorthand Reporter 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 10-22-07