1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Special Session 10 Monday, April 28, 2008 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X April 28, 2008 2 PAGE --- Commissioners' Comments 5 3 1.1 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 4 approve proclamation declaring month of May as Elder Abuse Awareness Month 12 5 1.2 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to establish a Class C Misdemeanor under Texas 6 Health and Safety Code, with fines up to $500 for persons who fail to clean up their animal 7 waste while using Flat Rock Lake Park 13 1.3 Interpretation report of programs of the Kerr 8 County AgriLIFE Extension Office 23 1.4 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 9 authorize placement of flags of countries represented in World Cup Shotgun competition 10 on courthouse grounds from April 26th through May 12, 2008 33 11 1.5 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve a county-wide vehicle policy 34 12 1.6 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to establish a juvenile court docketing and 13 reporting system with sufficient capacity to comply with Family Code and OCA requirements 38 14 1.7 Consider/discuss, appoint M'lissa Hayes as a member of the Kerr County Child Services Board 39 15 1.10 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to release Letter of Credit #2006-03 from Hebbron- 16 ville Ranch Properties, Ltd. for Vistas Escondidas Cypress Springs Estates 40 17 1.11 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for the commercial preliminary plat of A-OK Storage 41 18 1.12 Consider, discuss and take appropriate action for final revision of plat for Tract 3, Theodore 19 & Dorothea Oehler Estate 42 1.8 Public Hearing to abandon, vacate and discontinue 20 Fossler Road 51 1.9 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 21 abandon, vacate and discontinue Fossler Road 51 1.13 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 22 advertise for bids on new or used forestry truck with chip box 53 23 1.14 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on request to reconsider paying cell phone bill for 24 Justice of the Peace 4 54 1.15 Consider/discuss Kerr County recycling program 59 25 1.16 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to declare old Environmental Health vehicles surplus 62 3 1 I N D E X (Continued) April 28, 2008 2 1.17 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 3 LCRA's request to clear the right-of-way on property located by juvenile detention facility 63 4 1.18 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to remind surveyors of ramifications if platting 5 requirements are not properly adhered to 65 1.19 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action con- 6 cerning updates on joint City & County functions 74 1.20 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 7 Broker/Dealer List for Kerr County in accordance with Public Funds Investment Act 79 8 1.21 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to institute purchasing policy for Kerr County; 9 request any modifications or changes to the draft of purchasing policy from Commissioners Court 84 10 1.23 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for completion of training for Road & Bridge staff 11 member (Executive Session) --- 1.24 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action 12 regarding real estate matters (Executive Session) --- 13 4.1 Pay Bills 101 4.2 Budget Amendments --- 14 4.3 Late Bills --- 4.4 Monthly Reports 102 15 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee 16 Assignments 103 5.2 Reports from Elected Officials/Department Heads 107 17 3.1 Action as may be required on matters discussed 18 in Executive Session 117 19 --- Adjourned 117 20 21 22 23 24 25 4 1 On Monday, April 28, 2008, at 9:00 a.m., a special 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. 8 Let me call to order this regularly scheduled meeting of the 9 Kerr County Commissioners Court scheduled and posted for this 10 time and date, Monday, April 28, 2008, at 9 a.m. It is that 11 time now. Commissioner Oehler? 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Please stand for a word of 13 prayer, and followed by the pledge of allegiance. 14 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: At this time, if there's any member 16 of the public or the audience that wishes to be heard on an 17 item that is not a listed agenda item, feel free to come 18 forward at this time and tell us what's on your mind. If you 19 wish to be heard on an agenda item, we'd ask that you fill 20 out a participation form. They are normally found at the 21 back of the room. I trust there are some there now. If, 22 however, we got an agenda item that you wish to be heard on, 23 and you haven't filled out a participation form, get my 24 attention in some manner and we'll see that you have an 25 opportunity to be heard. But right now, if there's anybody 4-28-08 5 1 that wishes to be heard on any matter that is not a listed 2 agenda item, feel free to come forward at this time. Seeing 3 no one coming forward, we will move on. Commissioner Oehler, 4 what do you have for us this morning? 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: One thing. We have an 6 adopt-a-thon going on at Animal Control this coming Saturday 7 and Sunday. The adoption fees will be $45 for either cats or 8 dogs, and that includes the spay/neuter -- spay or neuter, 9 all their rabies shots, distemper shot, and county 10 registration fee. And we encourage people to come and adopt 11 some animals out so that they can be -- have new homes and be 12 better off. And -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that a reduced price? 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's not really a reduced 15 price. We're already as low as we can possibly go. If they 16 adopt an animal that's already been spayed or neutered, then 17 the fee can be a little bit less, but we're -- we're so low 18 on that, an owner can't go buy a pet and take it and have all 19 those things done for anywhere close to $45. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, I understand, yeah. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And we're going to -- Vicky 22 and I are going to cook some hamburgers, some hot dogs and 23 stuff for people that want to come out there, and that will 24 all be free. And there will be donations accepted, and I 25 believe those will benefit some other agencies that deal with 4-28-08 6 1 -- with animals. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Also going to have some of the other 3 humane organizations that are participating as well as a 4 bunch of door prizes, aren't there? 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's true. They're going 6 to have door prizes, and also Freeman-Fritts and Humane 7 Society will be there. So this is a -- this is a good chance 8 to maybe -- to enhance the overall appearance of Animal 9 Control and give people a chance to tour the facility and see 10 what it's all about. That's it. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How successful have our 12 adoption efforts been so far? 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Very. There are many weeks 14 that go by sometimes without having to euthanize any dogs, 15 and we hope to get that down to where we're -- we would love 16 to be a no-kill shelter. But until owners become more 17 responsible about ownership of pets, it's not going to 18 change. That's it. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Baldwin? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, let's talk about high 21 school athletics a little bit. Track season has ended. 22 Rex's boy threw down in San Antonio, and ended up with a -- 23 fifth? 24 MR. EMERSON: Fourth. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Fourth, and just inches out 4-28-08 7 1 of qualifying for State. And that's what's neat about that 2 regional meet; you get guys in there that are exceptional 3 athletes and -- and inches separate them all the way from 4 first to sixth and seventh place, so it's kind of neat. But, 5 anyway, it -- nobody -- nobody from Kerrville's going to 6 State. I think there's a couple -- couple from Comfort, 7 maybe. But -- so -- and but now my friend Tim's daughter 8 plays softball for the Tivy Antlers -- are they Tivy Antlers? 9 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. I didn't know if 11 girls were Antlers or not. Never have figured that out. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Lady Antlers? 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Lady Antlers, yeah. 14 Nevertheless, they're an appendage, you know, like they could 15 be Lady Spleens or something like that. But -- but they're 16 not. But they are in the state playoffs, and won the first 17 -- their first round of the playoffs. And they play their -- 18 they start their second round this Friday night here in 19 Kerrville. So, who are they playing? 20 MR. BOLLIER: Dripping Springs. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Dripping Springs. So, 22 that's this Friday night. And, of course, Tim's daughter is 23 the -- is the star of the show, and she truly is. I went out 24 and watched her the other night, and she -- she's really some 25 softball player. So, if you don't have anything going on 4-28-08 8 1 Friday night, Lady Antler softball. And then I'm sure 2 everyone is aware that our good friend Coach Reid passed 3 away, and the funeral is tentative -- tentatively set for 4 this coming Saturday at 1 o'clock. I had the -- asked the 5 question, why so long? There is a state coaching school 6 going on this week, basketball coaching school going on here 7 in the state of Texas, and they wanted -- it was requested 8 that the school get out of the way, and so they -- there's 9 lots of those guys that want to come down for it. So, the 10 funeral's tentatively set for 1 o'clock this coming Saturday. 11 That's all. Thank you. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Williams? 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm going to pass, Judge. 14 Save my voice for the main event to come. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Sounds as though you're running a 16 little short on voice. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm running a little short. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sometimes that's good. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Sometimes that can be good news. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, that would be good 21 news. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Letz? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Region J met in Kerrville last 24 week, and thanks to Jody -- those that were around the office 25 last week, I think Jody realized how much can happen that 4-28-08 9 1 needs to be done occasionally as the administrative assistant 2 for Region J. It was one of those -- we're going out for a 3 new scope of work, which means all kinds of notifications 4 have to go out and letters out and all kinds of stuff. 5 Anyway, Jody got through that. Thanks to her for doing a -- 6 going above and beyond last week trying to get all that out. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm wondering, maybe we 8 should put Region J under the sporting section. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The sporting section? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, the sports section, 11 'cause it sounds like it's kind of a contact deal. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Did you give her a glossary 13 of terms? I heard her complaining about acronyms. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: She -- actually, she attended 15 the meeting. I moved it to Kerrville at the last minute, and 16 she attended, and said it was rather difficult to follow 17 'cause we speak in Greek. (Laughter.) But I'll -- we'll 18 have to work on the acronyms, but what we're doing right now 19 which caused all that work is the scope of work for the next 20 two years of the current five-year plan is being written, so 21 all that's going through. The scope of work -- I think it's 22 the 28th -- I believe the 28th of May, we're meeting in Camp 23 Wood, if anyone wants to go, when we do our final review of 24 the scope of work, iron that out. Other than that, I don't 25 have a whole lot. I just had an unusually relaxing weekend. 4-28-08 10 1 I spent a good bit of yesterday afternoon, as cold as it was, 2 catching tadpoles with Sam. We had a good time. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Speaking of sporting events, we -- 4 we've got a World Cup shoot that's going to take place here 5 in Kerrville right outside at the Hill Country Shooting 6 Sports Center. Begins the end of this week. We will have 7 visitors in town to compete for that event from -- I think 8 it's approximately 44 countries. We had that same number, 9 maybe a few more, last year at about this same time that came 10 to our city, and the -- needless to say, the economic benefit 11 that's derived from those competitors that come in -- it's 12 not just the competitors; it's the coaches that come with 13 them, the support people that work with them, the families 14 that come with them, so there's a lot of dollars that flow 15 from that event, and it's really a good thing for the 16 community. Make these folks welcome and encourage them to 17 come back when you see them. I know that's what the 18 merchants are doing when they get that opportunity. But it 19 begins the tail end of this week, and it'll -- it'll run 20 through the end of the following week. Hopefully the 21 governor will be here to participate in some of the events 22 and some of the awards ceremonies. He's currently scheduled 23 to be here, I believe, on May the 9th. Like so many other 24 things, he's got it on his schedule, but we'll know for sure 25 if he shows up. Beyond that, we can't be sure, except that 4-28-08 11 1 he did not respond that he had a conflict and wouldn't be 2 here. So, it ought to be a good event. If you have an 3 opportunity, go out. There's no admission charge. There 4 will be various shooting events, men's and women's, all 5 through the week, and -- and it's exciting to watch. Let's 6 get on with our agenda, -- 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: -- if we might. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge? Well, you're not 10 going to talk about Thursday being prayer day and the 11 function here? 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you for reminding me, 13 Commissioner. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And then before that, 15 there's a breakfast at Trinity Baptist for one dollar. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, one dollar donation, I think. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: One dollar donation. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: And that, I believe, is at 6:30. 19 That's Friday, May 1st. Always occurs on May the 1st, which 20 coincidentally happens to be Law Day in this entire country. 21 We don't want to get the two confused, though. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, let's don't. Thanks for 23 bringing that up. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: But the National Day of Prayer 25 ceremony will begin at 11:30 right out in front of the 4-28-08 12 1 courthouse. There will be a number of folks there, including 2 members of the Court, and we encourage everybody to attend 3 that can attend. Appreciate you reminding me of that. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's get on with the agenda. 6 Item Number 1 is a timed item at 9 o'clock; we're a bit past 7 that. Consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 8 approve proclamation which declares the month of May as Elder 9 Abuse Awareness Month. Is Ms. Doerries -- I don't see her 10 here. Any word from Ms. Doerries about whether she is going 11 to be prevented from being here? Or -- 12 MS. GRINSTEAD: No. When she put it on the agenda, 13 she said she planned on being here. I haven't heard from her 14 since. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. What is the Court's pleasure? 16 Do you want to go ahead and move forward? Or -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If you entertain a motion, 18 I'll be happy -- 'cause I think it's very appropriate to -- 19 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- do, good to do this. I 21 move to approve the agenda item. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 24 approval of the agenda item. Is there any question or 25 discussion on the motion? All in favor of that motion, 4-28-08 13 1 signify by raising your right hand. 2 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 4 (No response.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's move 6 to Item 2, which is to consider, discuss, and take 7 appropriate action to establish a Class C misdemeanor under 8 Texas Health and Safety Code Section 365.012, with fines up 9 to $500 for persons who fail to clean up their animal waste 10 while using Flat Rock Lake Park. Commissioner Williams? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Judge. I was 12 looking for the angry mob out there, but I don't see any of 13 them. Maybe they're rallying on the courthouse lawn before 14 coming in. This is a continuing problem, and Mr. Bollier 15 talked to the Court about it a couple months ago, and I'm 16 going to ask him to speak to the Court about it again today. 17 As late as quarter to 9:00 this morning, I had another 18 constituent complain about it, and urged the Court to do 19 something about it. But the fact of the matter is that the 20 folks who use the park, who have been given the ability to 21 let their animals run free, are doing just exactly that, and 22 they're failing to clean up behind them and they're spoiling 23 it for everybody else. I want Tim to tell the Court exactly 24 what he sees out there and what his maintenance people see, 25 and then we'll go from there. 4-28-08 14 1 MR. BOLLIER: Well, as y'all know, Sonny does most 2 of my mowing down there in the park, and he mowed a week and 3 a half ago down there. And it's so bad down there that it's 4 getting on his mower tires, it's slinging out from underneath 5 the mower as he's running over it. There's a couple of 6 people that I see that -- I've been down there early in the 7 morning, or just basically around 10 o'clock, to where they 8 just come down, they let their dogs run loose, and they're at 9 one end of the park and their dogs are at the other end of 10 the park. And then this morning I had another complaint, and 11 I think it's the same person that talked to Commissioner 12 Williams. He's -- he comes to me and he says, "Tim, I can't 13 even take my granddaughters down there, because it's -- the 14 dog poo is everywhere." And, you know, it's a shame, because 15 you can't -- it used to be you could go down there and take a 16 blanket and put it on the riverbank and have a picnic and 17 whatever, but you can't do that any more. It's everywhere. 18 It is everywhere. And I just -- I would like to see 19 something done. I don't know exactly what we can do about 20 it, but I would like to see something. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I asked the County Attorney 22 to -- thank you, Tim. I asked the County Attorney to 23 research the law to find out just exactly what's available to 24 us in this -- in this area, and in your packet is a letter 25 from Mr. Emerson dated April 10th in which he cites the Texas 4-28-08 15 1 Health and Safety Code Section 365.012. That seems to be 2 what's available to us in this -- in this ability. And also 3 provided you with some sample signage which we could acquire, 4 or make some of our own or do whatever, and -- and post them 5 in conspicuous places. I just believe it's time to do 6 something about it. We're ruining the park for everybody 7 else who wants to use it -- or allowing it to be ruined; 8 we're not ruining it. And it's time to do something about 9 it. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I couldn't agree more. What 11 did we do a few months ago when the -- when the mobs were in 12 here and we talked about putting up a sign? We were talking 13 an actual dog park at that time, and we did not say "dog 14 park," but we said something. What -- 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, we allowed them to 16 take their animals and let them run free so long as they were 17 theoretically under voice control. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You can argue that one back 20 and forth too as to what's voice control or -- and what 21 actually happens. And so they are doing just that; they're 22 running free. And I've witnessed it, as I'm sure anybody 23 else that's been out there. Dogs run all over the place. 24 Owners are here and the dogs are way over there. Dog takes 25 care of his business and the owner doesn't do anything about 4-28-08 16 1 it, and the they run free. I haven't been -- been told of 2 any more incidences where any dog running free has been 3 jumping on people like we had before -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- and attacking people or 6 other animals, but it probably happens. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, what you're talking 8 about here, this $500 fine -- 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Long as it's less than 10 15 pounds. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, that's what I was just 12 fixing to read. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's a load. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: An offense of 15 pounds or 15 less is a Class C misdemeanor. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's a big -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that per dog, or -- 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. And that's a big dog 19 that can do that. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm telling you. But -- "or 21 less." So, the -- I can see that. But shall we -- let's 22 see. I'm like old Tim; I've got to kind of figure out my 23 language here before I open my mouth. Well, can't we -- 24 whoever's -- whoever's in charge of dog laws, whoever arrests 25 people for their dogs breaking the law -- 4-28-08 17 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That would be the Sheriff. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That would be the Kerr 3 County Sheriff. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Or constables. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Or constables, yeah. So, we 7 need to tighten that up about people being here and the dogs 8 being there away from the voice command, out from under the 9 command of the owner. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It would be good as well. 11 Yes, sir. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So we need to start throwing 13 the book at them, and preferably telling them to keep their 14 dogs out of our park. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All we're talking about -- 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Number one -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Today, all we're talking about 18 is up to 15 pounds. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That goes from 1 ounce to 20 15 pounds, Commissioner. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that ankle-deep, or -- 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's wading in the stuff, 23 yeah. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: County Attorney, you want to clarify 25 something, I think? 4-28-08 18 1 MR. EMERSON: I just want to point out to the Court 2 that you don't have to take any action on this. It's a state 3 statute; 'it's already on the books, so -- 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But we could. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's called littering. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think we're trying to get 7 a message out here, though. 8 MR. EMERSON: I understand. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we're doing a pretty 10 good job of it so far. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So far, so good. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think posting a sign would 13 probably be a good idea. I'm not sure, you know -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, I -- well, even though 15 ignorance of the law is no excuse, certainly, if we were to 16 post signs that, you know, it is unlawful to not clean up 17 after your dog, why, I think it -- I think it would be well 18 to post some signs. We may have to get the Sheriff some -- 19 an ample supply of Ziplock bags so that he can use that to 20 collect evidence. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, there's gloves -- 22 those gloves that you stick -- put your hand in the glove and 23 grab ahold of the stuff and pull it right back out, and you 24 got it bagged. Rusty, we need to see what size you're going 25 to need so we can order. 4-28-08 19 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Rusty's hands's small. You 2 have to get varying sizes. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I think this one's going to be 4 for the Commissioners to enforce. 5 MS. UECKER: And DNA testing. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: DNA. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the -- I mean, we're 9 joking about that, but if -- you know, if we're going to put 10 up any signage, a level of enforcement needs to accompany it. 11 And I think the Sheriff is concerned that he doesn't -- isn't 12 real interested in enforcing it, but constables very -- or 13 can enforce it as well. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sure. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And, you know -- 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: My problem with the whole deal 17 is, it's really unrealistic to expect at all, okay, in a lot 18 of ways, when I've got four or five officers on duty and 19 we're answering 3,000 to 4,000 calls a year, to expect us to 20 sit down there in that park with a pair of binoculars and 21 watch when the doggy goes poo-poo so that we can run down and 22 write the owner a ticket. Just ain't going to happen. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I knew the language was 24 going to come out sooner or later. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well -- 4-28-08 20 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He's pooh-poohing this 2 whole thing, isn't he? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't have -- yeah, I'm 4 pooh-poohing the whole thing, because it's just unrealistic 5 to expect us to be able to do that with the law enforcement 6 we have to do. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I think -- I mean, and I 8 don't disagree with that. Certainly, it's not going to be a 9 priority, I wouldn't think. You shouldn't look at it as a 10 priority, but constables could go down there as well. And I 11 think it -- a few enforcements would make a big difference. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think you start with the 13 signage. The County Attorney says we don't have to enact 14 this because it's already in the state law. That's fine, but 15 you start with the signage and see where it goes from there. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I think it's -- you know, and, 17 of course, with the dogs running loose down there, and like 18 you said, the dogs would be at one end of the park, the owner 19 at the other end of the park. It's going to be -- who says 20 the owner even knows what the dog did at that point? It may 21 be more realistic to put the dogs back on a leash down there. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I don't disagree with 23 that, but that's not the way it's styled on the agenda item. 24 I don't disagree with that at all. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Put it back on the agenda for 4-28-08 21 1 next time for the dogs to be back on a leash down there if 2 you're having that problem with them. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Here comes the crowd. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Here comes the crowd, 5 right. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we also have the 7 opportunity to look at the -- now that the bridge that 8 connects the two parks is open, we have discussed the 9 possibility of having one a dog side of the creek, free dogs 10 running around. The other side no dogs, or leashed. I think 11 we can do that now, and that was not an option really before. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, if the Court's cool 13 with the signage, we'll start with the signage. Do I need a 14 motion? 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. But I -- you know, 16 probably so. But I -- I think Rusty's right about bringing 17 it back and let's get them back on the leashes. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I can bring the whole thing 19 back, or we can just take care of what we can take care of 20 today. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: To me, you know -- again, we 22 were kind of joking about it, but I can't imagine somebody 23 sitting and waiting for a dog to squat and -- 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- let's get him on film and 4-28-08 22 1 take him to the courtroom and all of that stuff. So, to me, 2 the answer to it is just get them back on the leash and a 3 little more control. And if mom and daddy doesn't like that, 4 they can keep the dog at home, far as I'm concerned. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We'll bring it back. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't know about this sign 7 thing. How many signs do we have up down there now? We put 8 up three or four different signs. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: One big one at the 10 entrance, right? 11 MR. BOLLIER: One big one at the entrance. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What does it say? You don't 13 know? 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It says that you have to 15 keep your dog in voice -- within voice control, and whatever 16 -- whatever we attached to that. I've forgotten what the 17 penalty was. But it's your responsibility to keep your dog 18 either leashed or under voice control. Am I correct, Tim? 19 MR. BOLLIER: Right. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Also clean up behind him, I 21 believe. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And so you leave that up, 23 and then we're going to add another sign that says what? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Something to the effect of 25 one of these samples here, that it's your responsibility to 4-28-08 23 1 clean up after your dog. If we bring back the leash bit, we 2 can wait on that and then go with one like that, that says 3 leash and clean up after your pet. Which would -- I'll bring 4 it back. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Is that it for that one? 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to Item 3, which is a timed 8 item for 9:15. It's a bit past that. Interpretation report 9 of programs of the Kerr County AgriLIFE Extension Office. 10 Mr. Walston. 11 MR. WALSTON: Good morning. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Got your crew here with you, I see. 13 MR. WALSTON: Yes. Yes. Appreciate y'all's time 14 and letting us come forward and give a quarterly report on 15 what's been going on out at the Extension Office. With that, 16 I'm going to ask Rene Walls to start and give her a brief 17 review on what's she's got coming up. 18 MS. WALLS: Good morning, you guys. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Good morning. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Morning. 21 MS. WALLS: Okay. These are just some programs 22 that I'm working on. My big program for this year is called 23 Eat Smart for Chronic Disease, and it covers heart health, 24 bone health, and cancer risk, and it just discusses eating 25 healthier to help prevent those diseases. And I also did 4-28-08 24 1 Myths and Realities about Maintaining a Healthy Weight for 2 some of the teaches at Nimitz Elementary School. And Better 3 Meals with Better Planning; I'm doing that at the Red Cross 4 tomorrow for a group of senior citizens. And then on the 5 back -- it's going to be real quick. On the back, we had a 6 fashion show this weekend for all the 4-H kids who do 7 clothing and textiles. They got to present their items, and 8 we had some awards. Boehle Behrens got fifth place in the 9 Junior Division for her ensemble. Ricardo Madrigal got fifth 10 place in the intermediate division for his shirt which he 11 entered into the separates category. Sarah Muehlstein got 12 first place in two categories, for her accessories item and 13 her household item, and Katie Muehlstein got second place for 14 her household item and accessories. And that's all I have to 15 report. Thank you. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 17 MS. WAHLS: Yes? 18 JUDGE TINLEY: The Eat Smart program, is there some 19 degree of emphasis on prevention of diabetes? 20 MS. WALLS: There's not in that particular program. 21 I mean, it talks about eating healthy so that it prevents 22 several diseases. It just covers those three in particular. 23 However, I'm going to be doing training in November for Do 24 Well, Be Well, so I can provide that program -- 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 4-28-08 25 1 MS. WALLS: -- next year. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: 'Cause I think we have a pretty high 3 risk of diabetes, particularly with our older population. 4 MS. WALLS: I agree. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: And I think that's a significant 6 cost in our indigent health care program. And if we can do 7 some education to that segment of the population, sometimes 8 just a little bit of education prevents a whole lot of 9 medical costs. 10 MS. WALLS: I agree with you. They just would 11 prefer that I have a little more training first before I go 12 out and do the diabetes stuff, so -- 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 14 MS. WALLS: But we're doing that. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that available to you? 16 MS. WALLS: Yes. It's going to -- I'm going to be 17 doing it in November, and I will be providing it shortly 18 after that. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, great. Thank you. 20 MS. WALLS: Thank you. 21 MS. BOYD: I'm going to do a quick update on some 22 of the 4-H programming that we've been doing. Now, our 23 shooting sports programming is really very important to us in 24 Kerr County, and we were finally able to get our new archery 25 program started about a month ago with $2,300 of grant money. 4-28-08 26 1 We purchased all new archery equipment and got our leaders 2 trained, so we're real excited to be having archery going 3 finally. And we had some new guns purchased on our air 4 rifle, air pistol with another $1,000 grant from a different 5 source. And then also, we just received from the N.R.A. a 6 $7,000 grant to buy new guns for our trap and skeet program. 7 And, as y'all know, one of the purposes that we really 8 emphasize getting this equipment and having it available is 9 so that youth have the opportunity to come and participate in 10 the programming and make sure that it's something that they 11 will, you know, want to be a part of before they go -- their 12 parents go out and invest in a lot of equipment and stuff. 13 So, it's been very -- as a matter of fact, all our shooting 14 sports programs are growing by leaps and bounds. It's 15 really -- it takes a lot of interest in the county. 16 On our Junior and Senior Council programs, you 17 know, that's about 66 kids, junior high and high school, that 18 we do. Basically, we focus on leadership development and 19 community development, and they're doing several things. 20 Actually, they just finished up the -- which is the paper I 21 gave you -- a Health Rocks series, to where they, over -- 22 let's see, we had 16 youth and they went into the Nimitz 23 Elementary School, and also did the program this summer for 24 the Salvation Army on our mini-camp week. And the Health 25 Rocks program is a new curriculum that is a -- it's a 4-28-08 27 1 decision-making curriculum, but it -- the approach is a 2 little different than some of the curriculums to where the 3 kids are -- are going in and actually talking to the third, 4 fourth, and through fifth graders about the emotions and why 5 do they make the types of decisions that they have. And it 6 was really very, very -- we got a lot of great response from 7 the teachers and the principal at Nimitz. Our 16 youth were 8 just amazed at how open the kids were with their responses, 9 and things that came up that kind of really made them think 10 about how fortunate they were that they, you know, maybe had 11 a little better family support than some of the kids they 12 dealt with. So, it was really an eye-opener for them, and 13 real good learning opportunity for them on their speaking 14 skills and dealing with youth. 15 Also, they continue to do their after-school 16 program at the Salvation Army once a month. And we're fixing 17 to, next week, do our Ag Awareness Day for the area fourth 18 graders. We'll have about 500 youth out doing the Ag 19 Awareness Day at the Ag Barn next week, and we do that with 20 the Farm Bureau, and we'll have about 12 different 21 agriculture-based stations that we'll be doing education with 22 the kids on. So, besides that, we have lots more going on 23 but I thought that was really the highlights that y'all would 24 enjoy hearing about. Thank you. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Excuse me, Ms. Boyd. 4-28-08 28 1 MS. BOYD: Yes? 2 JUDGE TINLEY: What -- do you recall offhand the 3 numbers that are in the various shooting sports programs that 4 you've got going? 5 MS. BOYD: We had -- on our starting archery, we 6 had 15 kids, I believe, that ended up participating. We had 7 a few more signed up, but had some conflicts. Our air pistol 8 or rifle, BB gun program has just -- it's gone out the roof. 9 We, last year, had about 12. This year we had right at 30 10 kids, and it's just -- we've already got kids signed up, one 11 that came in late wanting to start in the fall. They're 12 actually going to do it fall and spring now, because we've 13 got so many kids wanting to do it. And our trap and skeet 14 program, we're at 36 kids in our trap and skeet program. And 15 the really great thing is -- is we have 16 certified coaches 16 now for our trap and skeet program, which is a real help. We 17 had been struggling with having enough coaches certified, and 18 we actually have 16 coaches certified now, so it just 19 continues to keep growing and growing every year. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- when they have major shoots 21 out at the Shooting Sports Center, such as the World Cup 22 coming up, -- 23 MS. BOYD: Yes, sir. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: -- do your kids get to do the 25 concessions out there? 4-28-08 29 1 MS. BOYD: We -- we do not do the concessions for 2 those events. We benefit from the concessions for those 3 events, because we have an agreement with the concessionaire 4 out there, because it's just that long an event, it's very 5 difficult to be able to have enough parents and support out 6 there, and also during the day when parents are working. The 7 concessionaire out there, we get 20 percent of all his 8 proceeds from the time, and that's been going ever since the 9 range expanded and got the Olympic agreement, and it actually 10 benefits us probably about $1,500 a year we make off of those 11 concessions. So -- it can fluctuate from about 12 to 15. 12 So, mainly, the concessions we do are our own concessions for 13 our event. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 15 MS. BOYD: So -- but it's a very sweet deal, 'cause 16 actually, he does it -- normally, he only does about 17 15 percent, but he agreed to 20 percent for us. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Is the state 4-H shooting sports -- 19 are we going to have those here in Kerrville? 20 MS. BOYD: We will not be having the state shoot. 21 The state shoot is actually in San Antonio. They have all 22 the disciplines at the end of July. We are having our big 23 shoot on the first weekend of June. We've already -- we're 24 this far out, and we've already met our number. We have 175 25 shooters coming. We had to -- we kind of culled it down a 4-28-08 30 1 little bit from last year, because we had 300 and it was a 2 little bit more than the volunteers could handle for what we 3 had, so we scaled it back a little bit to have more -- a 4 little more manageable. So -- but we're expecting there'll 5 be over 1,000 kids and families out there that weekend. 6 It'll be a three-day shoot. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, thank you. 8 MS. BOYD: Thank you. 9 MR. WALSTON: I want to give you a little bit of an 10 update for the -- as you know, from about the middle of 11 January till the middle of March, I'm pretty well on the road 12 with stock shows. The 4-H kids are participating in five of 13 the major stock shows, being Fort Worth, San Antone, San 14 Angelo, Houston, and Austin. This year we had 47 exhibitors 15 that participated, 137 projects -- livestock projects in the 16 five major shows, and that generated $33,000 in premium money 17 from those animals that made the premium sales. This year, 18 we had a good year in the market lambs, exhibiting in four of 19 the five champion drives. We sold two barrows, one in San 20 Angelo, one in San Antonio, and had one steer made the sale 21 in Houston, and that's a good place to hit it when you do. 22 As far as scholarships, we've got two 4-H'ers coming up for 23 4-H Foundation scholarships. In the past -- I believe in the 24 past four years, we've ended up giving out, I believe, five 25 scholarships. Hopefully we'll get two more, and, Judge, I 4-28-08 31 1 think you've got the chance to interview a couple of those. 2 So, some of the other things we've got coming up is 3 our 4-H Roundup this weekend. We've got 26 kids involved in 4 our District 4-H Roundup contest. This weekend is our 5 judging contest, including our wool contest, wool and mohair 6 contest, and our plant ID, as well as -- well, I believe 7 those three. And also a livestock team that we'll have 8 competing this Saturday at State Roundup. We will have State 9 Roundup the first week of June. This year we'll have also a 10 wool and a mohair team, and for the first time, we'll have a 11 Share The Fun skit group that will be presenting a skit at 12 the state contest. That -- that pretty well winds up the -- 13 the 4-H livestock and ag projects. As far as my Ag Natural 14 Resource programs that have been going on, we had our pecan 15 grafting field day on April the 22nd out at Bill Hathaway's. 16 We had about 30 producers come out and learn how to graft 17 pecans and production -- learn the production management 18 principles on early season pecan production. 19 On May the 5th, I've got a program on 20 trichomoniasis in beef cattle, which is a disease that we're 21 starting to see come from cattle from the north as they start 22 to come down, and we're starting to see some problems in 23 bulls that -- some infertility and some -- it can be a 24 devastating loss to producers, especially larger herds. On 25 May the 8th, we have a private applicator training and 4-28-08 32 1 licensing for anybody that's needing to get private 2 applicator testing. On May the 13th, we'll be having our 3 Hill Country Living 101 program, which is targeted towards 4 new landowners, small landowners that are new to the county, 5 to help them understand more about the properties that 6 they've purchased, exactly what agency do they need to visit, 7 whether it be Parks and Wildlife, Extension, Natural Resource 8 Conservation Service, whatever agency it may be that they -- 9 they feel like, depending on what problem. We'll have a full 10 day program on that to help them from the ground up, as far 11 as learn more about their rain sites and their -- and exactly 12 learn more about their -- their operation. 13 On May the 14th, I'll be working with the Texas 14 Parks and Wildlife on a lands educational program. It's a 15 7th grade -- for 7th graders, and a natural resource 16 conservation field day out at the Kerr area, and we'll have 17 about 74 seven -- 7th graders from the area that will come 18 out and we'll go over natural resources with them on that 19 day. On the 22nd, we have our multi-county meat goat field 20 day, and I actually think this year it's going to be covering 21 hair sheep. Hair sheep are starting to grow in popularity, 22 and also fit in real well on small acreage landowners, so 23 that's an area that we're going to concentrate on May the 24 22nd. It's going to be held in Kendall County this year. We 25 rotate that around every year amongst the four counties. So, 4-28-08 33 1 that's pretty well what we've got so far as far as ag natural 2 resources and 4-H. Any questions I can cover? 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What about the progress on 4 the new -- 5 MR. WALSTON: Project -- our project center? We've 6 got about 3,000 feet of pipe, 2 3/8 pipe sitting there ready 7 to be put up. We'll be getting with our parents and 8 volunteers and -- and getting that laid out. We've got the 9 design ready. It's just a matter of getting the manpower and 10 getting after it. We're still working on funding sources and 11 securing some more funding sources to try to finish the -- 12 the outside. I've got the bids in on -- on enclosing the 13 outside, and as we get into it and complete our funding, 14 we'll get a little better feel on what we can do on that. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Mr. Walston. 18 MR. WALSTON: You bet. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Item 4; consider, discuss, take 20 appropriate action to authorize placement on courthouse 21 grounds from April 26th through May 12th, 2008, of flags of 22 countries represented in World Cup Shotgun Competition at 23 Hill Country Shooting Sports Center. I put this on the 24 agenda at the request of Sudie Burditt of the Convention and 25 Visitors Bureau. If the Court will recall, last year when we 4-28-08 34 1 had the World Cup, we had a whole array of flags of the 2 countries out here on the courthouse grounds which 3 represented the countries from which those shooters came, and 4 essentially, we'd like to do the same thing this year. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 8 approval. Question or discussion? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, that created -- it's 10 very, very impressive to see all those flags. Very 11 impressive, and it created a lot of conversation around 12 Kerrville. I thought that -- I think this is really an 13 excellent, excellent thing to do. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or comment? All 15 in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll move 20 to Item 5; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 21 approve a county-wide vehicle policy. Commissioner Baldwin. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, sir. I -- we had 23 recently set a policy for Road and Bridge, and I see our -- a 24 couple of different departments around the county system, 25 several actually buying new vehicles, and I thought we 4-28-08 35 1 probably need to have a policy county-wide instead of just 2 geared toward Road and Bridge. And as -- as this got on the 3 agenda, it was spotted by Ms. Hyde, that called me over the 4 weekend and informed me that her department is also working 5 on the exact same thing. So, I -- I think it would be wise 6 for us to just put this on hold for right now, and let her 7 come forward with her plan, and we'll take a look at all of 8 it together. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. Is that okay 11 with you, Ms. Hyde? Thank you. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else to be offered in 13 connection with that item? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: A question on this. And maybe 15 Ms. Hyde's working on it. People that take county vehicles 16 home, whether it be Road and Bridge, deputies -- I think 17 Rusty probably has his own policy. I don't know if he does 18 or doesn't. Can they stop at a grocery store on the way home 19 if they're -- if they're using a county vehicle? I'm just 20 using grocery store, I mean, 'cause one of the things listed 21 is personal use. Or are they not to do that? I mean -- 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't know what they do 23 today. The -- the policy that's in here is taken straight 24 out of what we did with Road and Bridge. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 4-28-08 36 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I'm not sure what 2 Ms. Hyde is -- Ms. Hyde's plan is. I think -- I know where 3 you're going with your thoughts. Personally, I think that we 4 need to limit it to county business. I don't think it's 5 appropriate, and I have reasons -- when I first became a 6 Commissioner, people using county vehicles for -- and, I 7 mean, all kinds of things. So, my mind is kind of still back 8 there 20 years ago with the way we used to do things. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mm-hmm. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just -- I just think that 11 using a county vehicle for personal business is 12 inappropriate, and so I'm kind of -- I'm geared in that vein. 13 That's what we've done for Road and Bridge. The Judge 14 brought that same issue up -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- before. But -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess my question is -- and I 18 don't really have a strong opinion one way other the other, 19 but if we have an employee who is expecting to use a county 20 vehicle because he needs it in the course of his work, and 21 say he lives in Mountain Home, and he needs to, at some point 22 during the week, go to H.E.B., it doesn't make a lot of sense 23 to me to have him drive all the way to Mountain Home, drive 24 all the way back to Kerrville, and drive all the way back to 25 Mountain Home, you know. But I don't know how you stop the 4-28-08 37 1 abuse that you're talking about. I mean, that's where you 2 get into a -- 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I don't -- 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't know where to go. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. I don't think 6 anybody's abusing anything, but I don't want them to have 7 that opportunity -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- to abuse. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's just a -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You know, we probably need 12 to do like I do in your scenario that you just drew, is -- 13 is, you know, load up the old wagon like I do on Saturdays 14 and come in, get your dadgum groceries on Saturdays. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. And that may -- you 16 know, that makes sense too. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And that's the way Jack 18 Thorn does it. He only comes to town once a month or so. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Once every six months. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Six months. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Anyway, just to -- looks like 22 the County Attorney has something to say; he's got his hand 23 half up, half down. 24 MR. EMERSON: Just as far as your comment goes, 25 from a liability issue, not only for the County, but for the 4-28-08 38 1 employee, it does make sense not to stop and go to the 2 grocery store. Because once they do that, they're not on 3 official business any more, and if something happens, there's 4 a liability exposure issue. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So they just need to schedule 6 their personal life around not using that county vehicle, 7 then. And I don't have a problem with that. I just want to 8 make sure, you know, we understand what we're doing. But 9 that's right; there is a good reason to do it. 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: My policy is a little bit 11 different, because once they get into a county vehicle, 12 whether they're on duty or off duty, 'cause they even have to 13 bring it in on their off time to get it serviced and things 14 like that, they're required to dress a certain way, required 15 to have the radio on, and required to enforce the laws that 16 they see. So, at those times, yes, on their way home, they 17 do stop, but they're still subject to call and -- and 18 required to do anything that they would have to do if they 19 were on duty. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure. I have no problem 21 with that at all. But I think -- I think when we bring it 22 back is when we will dig out the details and have the debate. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anything further on that 24 item? Let's move to Item 6; consider, discuss, take 25 appropriate action to establish a juvenile court docketing 4-28-08 39 1 and reporting system with sufficient capacity to comply with 2 the Family Code and OCA requirements. Mr. Emerson, I believe 3 you said there are some things being worked on in that, and 4 we are to pass that item today? 5 MR. EMERSON: That would be my recommendation, Your 6 Honor. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Satisfactory with you, Ms. Pieper? 8 MS. PIEPER: Yes. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Very well, we'll pass that item, 10 unless anybody on the Court has anything to offer. We'll 11 move to Item 7; consider, discuss, and appoint M'lissa Hayes 12 as a member of the Kerr County Child Services Board. 13 Commissioner Baldwin. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, sir. It's an 15 honor and a pleasure to be able to put Ms. Hayes' name out as 16 a possible member of the Kerr County Child Service Board. 17 So -- and you see in the backup information about her. I 18 just happen to know her, and she is an excellent, excellent 19 citizen and a perfect person to be on this board. So, I move 20 for approval. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 23 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion on the 24 motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 25 right hand. 4-28-08 40 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 5 to Item 10; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 6 release Letter of Credit Number 2006-03 from Hebbronville 7 Ranch Properties, Limited, for Vistas Escondidas Cypress 8 Springs Estates located in Precinct 4. Ms. Hardin? 9 MS. HARDIN: Good morning. Mr. Odom's out of town 10 today, so all those items that have his name on them I will 11 be presenting. Enclosed in your packet, you will find a memo 12 from Wayne Wells recommending that Vistas Escondidas Cypress 13 Springs Estates be approved. All engineering fees have been 14 paid, all terms have been met, and therefore, we ask that you 15 release the Letter of Credit Number 2006-03 from the Hill 16 Country State Bank. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So moved. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 20 approval as indicated. Question or discussion on the motion? 21 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 22 hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 4-28-08 41 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Item 11; 2 consider, discuss, and take appropriate action for the 3 commercial preliminary plat of A-OK storage located in 4 Precinct 2. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Ms. Hardin? 6 MS. HARDIN: Commissioner Williams and Mr. Odom, 7 Mr. Davis, and Mr. Voelkel all met in our office. Mr. Davis 8 has purchased 6.65 acres of land by metes and bounds. He did 9 this in November of 2007. There was no plat filed at that 10 time. He is now developing the property for commercial use 11 for a storage facility that has already been built. 12 Mr. Davis wants to file this as a one-lot subdivision in 13 compliance with the Kerr County Subdivision Rules and 14 Regulations. There is no drainage study required, and there 15 are no roads to be built. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: For the benefit of the 17 Court, this is the storage sheds that are being built on the 18 north side of 27 as you're going east toward Comfort just 19 before you get to Center Point. So, he's doing a nice job; 20 facility looks good. He did purchase it on metes and bounds, 21 and is willing to meet the plat requirements of a one-lot 22 subdivision. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What -- why is it he doesn't 24 have to have a drainage study? 25 MS. HARDIN: Because it's under a certain number of 4-28-08 42 1 lots, or acreage. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. So, that's the way 3 the rules read. If you have under four or five or something, 4 you -- 5 MS. HARDIN: Five or under. Four? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's five or under. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 10 approval. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 11 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's move 16 to Item 12; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action 17 for final revision of plat for Tract 3, Theodore and Dorothea 18 Oehler Estate, as set forth in Volume 4, Page 27, Plat 19 Records, and located in Precinct 4. 20 MS. HARDIN: This revision was done under the 21 alternate plat process, and it divides a 57.68-acre tract of 22 land into two lots. There was a public hearing that was done 23 on April the 14th. With the exception of the timeline, this 24 plat meets all the requirements set forth by our department. 25 However, there may be some issues with O.S.S.F. that 4-28-08 43 1 Commissioner Oehler or Ray would like to address at this 2 time. 3 MR. GARCIA: The issues with this plat are the 4 illegal installation of the O.S.S.F. systems. I spoke to 5 Commissioner Oehler. Spoke to Lee -- Lee Voelkel on this 6 also. Our stance is that these two are illegally installed, 7 and therefore we did not sign off on the plat. Again, in 8 speaking to Commissioner Oehler, is we don't want to -- we 9 don't want to take this out on the homeowner herself -- the 10 landowner, because she was trying to do the right thing. 11 Again -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's illegal? 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, the -- 14 MR. GARCIA: The two installations. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Put in two systems on one 16 tract, and neither system was -- had a site evaluation or 17 applied for a permit to construct. It was just done by an 18 installer, and the rules say -- Tish pointed the rules out to 19 me -- no matter what, even if you have larger acreage than 20 10 acres, that the County requires, at a minimum, you still 21 have to have a site evaluation. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They're on 3B or 3A? 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, as it is right now, 24 before the plat, both of them are on one tract. By doing 25 this, this will put one on each tract, and they're large 4-28-08 44 1 tracts. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, okay. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And they're -- at this time, 4 I believe I'm correct that there's no evidence of any -- any 5 health hazard or pollution. The lady has come forward and 6 tried to do this correctly and plat it, and then during the 7 process it was discovered that these systems were not put in 8 according to the rules. And I believe that, you know, you go 9 after that installer who is a state-licensed person that's 10 supposed to know how to do this and do it properly, but you 11 don't penalize the lady who's done, this trying to do the 12 right thing by filing a plat. And, therefore, it would 13 create one septic per each lot, instead of having two now on 14 one. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What rule was actually 16 broken that they didn't provide a site evaluation? Is 17 that -- 18 MR. GARCIA: They didn't meet the 10-acre 19 exemption. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 21 MR. GARCIA: Is what -- 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, if we were to approve 23 this -- you're telling us -- you're asking us not to, and if 24 we go ahead and do it, will that change the history of earth 25 or anything? Or -- 4-28-08 45 1 MR. GARCIA: No. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- what will that do? 3 MR. GARCIA: Just have two illegally installed 4 O.S.S.F. systems. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That function? That are not 6 going to leak into the atmosphere or not going to harm the 7 neighbors, or -- well -- 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I don't believe that's 9 an issue, really. The issue is that the installer did not 10 follow proper procedure when he installed the systems. 11 And -- 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. Can we go after him? 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's -- that is -- 14 MR. GARCIA: We have. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- the intent, and they're 16 going after him, and that will not change by approving this. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: In my opinion. Because you 19 still have all the legal ramifications and -- I mean the 20 legal right to go after these people that have done illegal 21 acts in installing septics. But I believe the lady paid a 22 lot of money for these two systems. They weren't 55-gallon 23 drums that were put in with a 10-foot drain field. And there 24 are some -- some requests that have been made, or demands by 25 Environmental Health on this installer to do certain things 4-28-08 46 1 to bring them into compliance. 2 MR. GARCIA: We did make -- we sent a letter out to 3 the installer and to the homeowner of what was needed. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And, you know, this was part 5 of the deal where I -- I asked Environmental Health to also 6 send a copy of what they sent the installer also to the owner 7 of the property so that that person would know what was wrong 8 with the systems that were installed. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is this letter addressed to 10 that installer? 11 MR. GARCIA: Yes. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Does he live in my precinct? 13 MR. GARCIA: It's Commissioner -- that was 14 Commissioner Williams' precinct. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: He lives in your precinct. 16 Let's go after him, then. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He must live in mine, 18 'cause I'm copied here on this letter. Yeah. By all means, 19 yeah. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I just hate to make 21 somebody else -- you know, ignorance of the rules is one 22 thing, but whenever you think you're doing the right thing 23 and you have somebody else misrepresent and do work for you 24 and charge you for it, thinking you are getting what you're 25 paying for, and then you don't get it, I don't believe that's 4-28-08 47 1 the homeowners's fault. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: All of these items that are 3 listed in Ms. Hulett's letter are routine items that would be 4 required had he come in first with the plans? 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Exactly. It's just a matter 6 of abiding by the existing rules and procedure. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is -- 8 (Discussion off the record.) 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is -- what is the 10 status of the two systems today, though? I mean, are they 11 functional? 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They are functioning. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Have you looked at them? 14 MR. GARCIA: We have not. We haven't received any 15 other complaints, either, -- 16 MS. HULETT: No failure. 17 MR. GARCIA: -- of any failure. So -- 18 MS. HULETT: We have asked the installer to provide 19 us a copy of their site evaluation and test holes, because 20 that actually determines what type of system selection that 21 you have to go on the property. So, until such time as we 22 can see that and review the test holes, get a copy of the 23 planning materials where we can determine whether that 24 systems's adequate for the site -- 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, we don't even know what 4-28-08 48 1 kind of system's under the ground right now? 2 MS. HULETT: We have no information. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Has the installer indicated 4 he will cooperate with you? 5 MR. GARCIA: We contacted the installer and, as per 6 the letter there, we talked about what was needed to bring 7 these systems into compliance, and then we don't have 8 anything -- we didn't hear anything from him. We do have a 9 pretrial date set. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Against him? 11 MR. GARCIA: Against him. He -- he's going to have 12 a pretrial. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that trial's to revoke his 14 license? 15 MR. GARCIA: No. That's -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Make him -- 17 MR. GARCIA: He contested the citation. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, okay. 19 MR. GARCIA: They were both cited for this illegal 20 installation. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I'm glad you did that. 22 I'm glad. You need to cite the guy, whoever he is, or 23 regardless of where he lives. But I think -- I think the 24 issue before us today is obvious. You know, this has been in 25 here three or four times. 4-28-08 49 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And, you know, we need to 3 come to some kind of closure on it. You know, these -- 4 obviously, these people need to get this property divided. 5 I'm thinking if -- I mean, I want to approve this thing, if 6 we kind of had an idea that these systems are working. I 7 mean, I don't want to approve something that we don't know 8 what's working on or not. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I've got a little different 10 take, is that we have two functions in the county, 11 Environmental Health and Subdivision Rules and Regulations. 12 They've complied with subdivision rules. We've tied them 13 together for the sole purpose of being able to find these 14 situations. To me, the plat should be approved, and we 15 continue to pursue the Environmental Health side. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree with that. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I agree. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think that should be the 19 policy, regardless, on all of them. I don't think that we 20 should -- the purpose of holding them up, in my mind, on the 21 platting side is to find these problems. And, you know, 22 we're not saying that they've done -- we're saying we found 23 it, and Environmental Health is pursuing it. And it means if 24 the system isn't -- you know, is a nuisance system, they can 25 proceed under state law to make the system come into 4-28-08 50 1 compliance, or they can go after the individual. And that's 2 what the intent is, in my mind, as to why these are tied 3 together. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Commissioner, once again, 5 that German mind of yours is almost making sense. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Almost. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This is good. This is good. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I move for final revision of 9 plat of Tract 3, Theodore and Dorothea Oehler Estate, Volume 10 4, Page 27, Precinct 4. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 13 approval of the agenda item as indicated. Any further 14 question or discussion on the motion? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There's a question. Do you 16 have a big heartburn with this, Ray? 17 MR. GARCIA: No. If that's what the Court wishes. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What are you talking about? 19 This is not -- 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This would be more of a 21 precedent issue. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Your ability to pursue your 23 Environmental Health concerns is not prejudiced by -- 24 MR. GARCIA: Yes, sir. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: -- the Court's action in approving 4-28-08 51 1 this plat, I don't think. How do you see it, Rex? 2 MR. EMERSON: There's no prejudice. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any further question or 4 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 5 your right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. At this 10 time, I will recess the Commissioners Court meeting, and I 11 will convene a public hearing scheduled for 10 a.m. 12 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 10 a.m., and a public hearing was held in open 13 court, as follows:) 14 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 15 JUDGE TINLEY: It is that time now. That public 16 hearing concerning abandonment, vacating, and discontinuance 17 of Fossler Road located in Precinct 4. Is there any member 18 of the public that wishes to be heard with respect to the 19 abandonment, vacation, and discontinuance of Fossler Road, as 20 located in Precinct 4? Seeing no one coming forward, I will 21 close the public hearing. 22 (The public hearing was concluded at 10:01 a.m., and the regular Commissioners Court meeting was 23 reopened.) - - - - - - - - - - 24 JUDGE TINLEY: And call Item 9; consider, discuss, 25 and take appropriate action to abandon, vacate, and 4-28-08 52 1 discontinue Fossler Road located in Precinct 4. 2 MS. HARDIN: While Headwaters Ranch was being 3 platted, the deed records showed there was a county road that 4 went through their property to Mrs. Walton's property. The 5 road is not maintained by the County, nor to our knowledge 6 has it been used for over 20 years. Mrs. Walton accesses her 7 property through Houston-Schumacher Road, and 911 has named 8 her private driveway Fossler Road. Ranchland Enterprises and 9 Mrs. Walton own all the land abutting the road, and wish to 10 -- to abandon, vacate, and discontinue the old road as it's 11 shown on your map. Ranchland has platted their portion of 12 the road as Midwaters Drive, and Mrs. Walton's portion of the 13 private driveway will be known as Fossler Road. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I move for the abandonment. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for the 17 abandonment and approval of the agenda item. Question or 18 discussion on that motion? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mrs. Walton is a Fossler. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Correct. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So she knows the history and 22 has the authority, and she's owner and all of that. So, if 23 she agrees, I agree. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Other question or discussion on the 25 motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 4-28-08 53 1 right hand. 2 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 4 (No response.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 6 to Item 13; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 7 advertise for bids on a new or used forestry truck with chip 8 box. 9 MS. HARDIN: This truck was approved on our list of 10 things that we could purchase this year. However, we've not 11 been able to find it on any government purchasing program, so 12 we're asking to go out for bid for either a new or a used 13 one. And we have put in the packet a couple of photographs 14 of some that we found on TreeTrader.com. to just give you an 15 example of some prices and what types of trucks are 16 available. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How much did we budget for 18 this? 19 MS. HARDIN: 90,000. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 90,000? 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Are you intending to get one 22 of these that has a -- has a bucket on it? 23 MS. HARDIN: We would like to, yes. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So all you're asking today 4-28-08 54 1 is to go out for bid? 2 MS. HARDIN: Yes, sir. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That was a motion. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 6 approval of the agenda item, to go out for bids as indicated. 7 Any question or discussion on the motion? All in favor of 8 the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 9 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 11 (No response.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Item 14; 13 consider, discuss, and take appropriate action on request to 14 reconsider paying cell phone bill for Justice of the Peace 4. 15 Judge Ragsdale? 16 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Yes, sir. I was made aware at the 17 -- from the last meeting that a vote had been made or 18 whatever not to pay the cell phone bill for the number that I 19 mentioned, and I think that decision was made on mistaken 20 information. I had not been made aware that the County had 21 gone into a whole 'nother set of contracts for telephones. I 22 had just renewed the contract that I'd had for the last 13 23 years -- 12 or 13 years, in November. And I do not recall 24 receiving any communication that that contract would be set 25 aside in favor of any other contract. And, as far as I know, 4-28-08 55 1 and I've tried to research the best that I can, I think 2 April 14th was when I became aware that that's what the 3 Commissioners Court wanted. I had no objection at all. It 4 took me all of an hour to get a county cell phone and to stop 5 that number that I'd been using for 13 years, and it was done 6 on April 14th. So, I would just like to ask you to 7 reconsider paying the bill for the two months that are -- 8 that are going to be in question, the one month that you had 9 and -- and then the one that's due on the 1st of this month. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, do you ever, like, on 11 Saturdays, load up in your wagon and come to town? There's 12 all kinds of stuff going on down here. You need to come see 13 us more often. I'm in agreement with you, that I think that 14 we should pay the bill, because I can't argue with you 15 whether you knew that we had changed programs or not. So -- 16 JUDGE RAGSDALE: I appreciate that. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Did -- you do have e-mail out there, 18 don't you? 19 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Yes, sir. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Well -- and, you know, I 21 think -- I think it might be well to use this for an 22 opportunity to maybe enhance communication abilities. I was 23 a little -- I was a little confused. When you sent in the 24 agenda item, you indicated that almost three years ago you 25 notified each department that you would not be responsible 4-28-08 56 1 for receiving memos or mail at the box located in the County 2 Clerk's office or by e-mail unless arrangements were made 3 prior to delivery. 4 JUDGE RAGSDALE: I don't know why you're confused. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I understood from that -- it 6 seems to clearly indicate to me that if someone wants to send 7 you an e-mail, that they need to call you or some other 8 means, communicate with you, and say, "Incoming, I'm sending 9 you an e-mail." 10 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Then I conveyed that message. 11 Well, that's what I intended. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 13 JUDGE RAGSDALE: And the reason being, sir, is I 14 think leading up to that -- when I made that decision, was 15 that there were things being sent out, and for one reason or 16 another, I didn't check the e-mail that day, and so 17 whatever -- and I can't remember exactly what it was. I 18 think it had to do with somebody sending a motion to be 19 considered through my e-mail, and I didn't check it on 20 Friday. It needed to be filed Friday, and I didn't check. 21 If I were going to accept the e-mail filing, it needed to 22 have a -- a Friday mark on it, and it didn't, 'cause I didn't 23 check my e-mail. And I just didn't want to be held 24 responsible for that kind of a problem, and so I just 25 notified everybody that's not the way to get information -- 4-28-08 57 1 if it's that important, they need to call me on the telephone 2 and make sure that I'm aware they're sending me something. 3 Now, I did check back through my archives of e-mail traffic, 4 and I did not see one sent to me. And, again, that's why -- 5 we did get a message on February 11th from John Trolinger 6 saying that anybody that needed a new phone needed to talk to 7 him. And I didn't need a new phone; I'd gotten one in 8 November. And -- 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Is there any particular reason you 10 shouldn't have to be responsive to e-mails, and everybody 11 else in the county should be? 12 JUDGE RAGSDALE: I don't -- I don't know that 13 everybody is. I think that's -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Wouldn't you agree that most of the 15 communication that takes place between county departments, 16 and for that matter, between county departments and state 17 reporting and things of that nature, are done via e-mail? 18 JUDGE RAGSDALE: I would not agree with that. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: You wouldn't agree with that? 20 JUDGE RAGSDALE: No. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, I -- I see us talking 23 about two different issues here. One, if I know where you're 24 going, I agree with you on, and the other one I agree with 25 Commissioner Baldwin on. I mean, you know, the -- you know, 4-28-08 58 1 let's get this thing behind us, in my mind. And I don't -- I 2 don't have a problem paying the phone bill. It was in his 3 budget; he's corrected the problem, and move on. But on the 4 second issue, I would like to see it back on the agenda, 5 because I don't think you have the option to not read e-mails 6 if that's how this County chooses to inform people, and you 7 need to look at your e-mail, or be -- or be subject to -- I 8 mean, I don't care if you -- on proceedings and things of 9 that nature, that's not an issue, but if we're going to 10 correspond on insurance matters, H.R. matters, other matters, 11 that's how we're going to correspond, and that's going to be 12 this Court's decision. And if we choose to do it that way, 13 then you're going to be subject -- 14 JUDGE RAGSDALE: If you choose to do it that way, 15 tell me you're going to do it that way, and I will do what 16 you ask me to do. Same thing that I would have done with the 17 telephone if I had -- and what I did when I was notified, it 18 took me an hour to comply with what you wanted. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that's why I'm agreeing 20 with paying the bill. 21 JUDGE RAGSDALE: But I've never been told you're 22 going to do this. And if -- but if that's what you want, 23 then that's what I'll do. I don't have a problem with -- 24 with accountability. I don't have a problem with 25 communication, other than by experience, I've found that that 4-28-08 59 1 may not be as effective as you think it is. However, if 2 that's the way you want to do it, then that's your business. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll move for approval to pay 5 the bill. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 8 indicated. Question or discussion on the motion? All in 9 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 12 (No response.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll move 14 to Item 15. 15 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Thank you, gentlemen. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Consider/discuss the Kerr County 17 recycling program. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I put this on the agenda after 19 visiting with Tim about it for -- seems like a long time. It 20 came about because of a couple of calls I had inquiring of 21 the public what the County's recycling policy is. And, as it 22 turns out, we basically recycle everything, and I thought it 23 would be a good opportunity to let the public know that we -- 24 we recycle, you know, all electronics, computer-type stuff. 25 And probably in the area of paper, probably in the 4-28-08 60 1 neighborhood -- seems like 75, 80 percent, somewhere in that 2 area; huge -- large quantity. It may be more that we could 3 recycle. 4 (Commissioner Baldwin left the courtroom.) 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And the way we recycle more is, 6 anything that -- Tim, correct me if I'm wrong on this, but 7 anything that we shred gets bundled up and goes to the 8 recycling center. If it's thrown in the garbage can, it's 9 not shredded, it does not. How you shred things, you take it 10 down to the Maintenance office where there's two big 11 commercial shredders. You shred it. Maintenance isn't going 12 to shred it; it's your responsibility to shred the stuff. It 13 gets bagged, and Maintenance will haul it off. You know, and 14 that's how the process works, and it's working pretty well. 15 But those that aren't using it, that's how you can improve, 16 you know, our costs on trash and everything else, and how we 17 proceed. And I just thought it would be a good opportunity 18 to bring it up and let -- it's county-wide, and all 19 departments can use that. And I think it makes sense that it 20 needs to be shredded, because, obviously, we deal with lots 21 of information that -- 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Commissioner, you're 23 talking about that trash that we generate in the courthouse 24 or our other buildings, correct? You're not talking about 25 trash we pick up in the parks or other places. 4-28-08 61 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm basically speaking of 2 things like this, stuff like that. It's the volumes and 3 volumes of -- of paper that we put into reports and budgets 4 and all that kind of stuff, and I think every department 5 generates a lot. It's not the paper cups and, you know, that 6 kind of stuff we're talking about. Clean paper that can be 7 recycled. Also, I think as a separate thing, boxes tend to 8 find their way down there. All that stuff gets taken over to 9 the recycle center as well. So, I just put it on the agenda 10 just kind of as an informative -- 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I appreciate you telling me, 12 'cause I didn't know that's what we were supposed to do. 13 I'll start doing it. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And Tim and I talked, and we -- 15 you know, he doesn't have the staff to go around and put up 16 separate kind of waste bags, sit around and do all the 17 shredding. That's not the intent. Just -- but it is a 18 savings to the County -- to the taxpayers for everything that 19 they do shred down there, and Tim does haul it off as part of 20 his normal responsibilities. That's it. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything further, Tim? 22 MR. BOLLIER: No, sir. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Did I cover all that 24 accurately? 25 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. We might add in there that 4-28-08 62 1 a lot of the departments do have their own shredders. You 2 know, they got those small type that they do shred their own 3 paper in their offices, and they'll bag it and bring it to 4 us, and we haul it off. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 6 MR. BOLLIER: That's all I have. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to Item 16; consider, 8 discuss, and take appropriate action to declare the old 9 Environmental Health vehicles surplus. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Pretty much self-explanatory. 11 I'll move approval. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 14 approval of the agenda item to declare the vehicles surplus. 15 Question or discussion on the motion? All in favor of the 16 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge? 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To clarify it, what exactly 23 we're talking about, on the backup is the VIN number and the 24 actual description of the two vehicles, so there's not a 25 confusion that we're surplusing something other than those 4-28-08 63 1 two vehicles. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The two Jeep vehicles. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Probably ought to take those 4 out to Road and Bridge and put them in a place that's not in 5 the way, but that will be a secure area, until we get them 6 sold. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Does the County intend on 8 taking, like, bids or anything like that to get rid of those? 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, we're going to have -- 10 I think we're going to have another vehicle at the next 11 meeting. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Because I actually have three 13 or four. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Maybe we ought to put them 15 all in a group and take bids on all of them. I think 16 there'll be one more that needs to be declared surplus at the 17 next meeting, but we don't have it on the agenda today. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Mine have already been 19 declared surplus. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do them all together at the 21 same time. 22 (Discussion off the record.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to Item 17; consider, 24 discuss, and take appropriate action on L.C.R.A.'s request to 25 clear the right-of-way on property located by Juvenile 4-28-08 64 1 Detention Facility. 2 (commissioner Baldwin returned to court.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I put this on the agenda. I'm not 4 sure if Court action is required, but in talking with those 5 folks, there's -- the little piece that we own, which is 6 directly across the road to the northeast from the Juvenile 7 Detention Facility, where L.C.R.A. already has the 8 right-of-way, has an existing line, they have the right to 9 maintain that line. And they contacted me because they have 10 continually been doing some trimming there to keep those 11 trees out of their line to keep outages from occurring. But 12 what they want to do now is take selectively a few trees out; 13 hackberry, chinaberry, cedar berry. He said he didn't think 14 there was any oaks in the way, but they're within the 15 easement and the right-of-way, and to avoid continually 16 trimming and running the risk of power outages, those 17 particular trees that they want to selectively take out, I 18 told him I was going to put it on the Court's agenda so that 19 the Court could take the appropriate action. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move approval to allow 21 L.C.R.A. to clear the right-of-way in question. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 24 approval. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 25 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 4-28-08 65 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll move 5 to 18; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 6 remind surveyors of ramifications if platting requirements 7 are not properly adhered to. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You're looking at -- 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Two surveyors back there. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Two scoundrels. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Only two of them came. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I put this on the agenda 13 because of the -- one of the problems that just came up a few 14 items before on platting. There is a tract evidently just to 15 the south of the one with the septic issue that was not 16 platted, and it was evidently surveyed and sold by metes and 17 bounds. And I think it would be a good idea to remind -- and 18 have the County Attorney maybe to write a letter to all of 19 the -- the surveyors in the area and remind them that they 20 need to instruct people to plat their property whenever they 21 divide property, and not try to get away with selling it by 22 metes and bounds when they're not supposed to according to 23 state and county rules. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The question I have -- 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Same question I got. Go ahead. 4-28-08 66 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- is if -- if the surveyor 2 informs the person, and the person says, "I don't care; I 3 want to do it," what are they to do? I mean, I don't know 4 that they're -- that the surveyors are enforcers of county 5 rules -- county law. I guess they could write a memo or turn 6 the business away. I mean, that's their choices. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That is their choice. And I 8 think that that's one of the responsibilities they have, is 9 to inform people of the law, and then if they choose to break 10 it, then they -- you know, they can be held accountable. But 11 at least they should be the first step of getting those rules 12 and the responsibilities relayed to their clients. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is -- is it appropriate to ask 14 a question of one of our surveyors, or the County Surveyor? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, of our County Surveyor, of 16 course. He's our hero. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He's supposed to know all 18 the answers. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: My question is a little more basic 20 than that. Do they even have the duty, if they're called out 21 and asked by a landowner or someone that represents 22 themselves to be a landowner, that, "I want you to survey and 23 write me a metes and bounds description, and prepare a plat 24 for roughly this area," and maybe there are some marks that 25 they want him to adhere to, or maybe they want it from this 4-28-08 67 1 end of the property and they want it to be only 5 acres, but 2 they want the line to be parallel to the east boundary or 3 whatever. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I understand what you're 5 saying. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: And they're contracted to do a job. 7 Do they have a -- a duty under the law to even talk about 8 platting? 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't know if it's a duty 10 or legal obligation, but I think it would be the -- it would 11 be the correct thing for them to do. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Now, I can understand if the 13 landowner tells the surveyor, "What I'm eventually going to 14 do here is I want to carve this bigger tract that I own up 15 into three or four" -- or 24, doesn't make any difference; a 16 number of tracts, and sell them off. I -- I think it's a 17 matter of information. The surveyor probably has an 18 obligation to say, "Do you know the County's got some 19 subdivision regulations that -- that you probably need to 20 look into," and that we get involved in, and if you're 21 actually going to subdivide your property and sell it off 22 like that. But in the first instance, they don't -- they're 23 not certain why they want this description or this plat. May 24 be for another family member. It may be for some other 25 purpose that they're thinking about on down the road. I just 4-28-08 68 1 don't know what obligation we can lay in their lap and expect 2 them legally to discharge under the law. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You're correct. I'm not sure 4 they have a legal obligation either, but if they do, I think 5 they should be sure and inform the public about it. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well -- 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Before they make a mistake 8 and do something wrong. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with Bruce. I agree 10 with Bruce that, you know, there's a -- to me, there's a 11 higher calling than the law, and that's doing the right 12 thing. Right and wrong. And the right thing would be to 13 inform people of the best route to go, regardless how much 14 authority they have and what the law says, in my opinion. 15 Let me ask a question. Is there any way that -- like, if we 16 go out and do things by metes and bounds, is anything -- any 17 part of that recorded in the county records? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The deed would be. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The deed. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The deed. But not 21 necessarily a drawing, a plat? 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: There are a lot of them 23 that are recorded that don't have drawings with them. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: I've seen occasions where there was 25 a subsequent conveyance of the property by metes and bounds, 4-28-08 69 1 or they may attach as an exhibit a plat, or I've seen some 2 do-it-yourself operations where they attach a plat, or even 3 less sophisticated, a drawing, which is somewhat loose, on a 4 lot of occasions. Obviously, not professionally done. But 5 what -- what obligation, if you know at this point, Rex, do 6 the surveyors have to -- in connection with insisting upon 7 enforcement? 8 MR. EMERSON: I don't know about insisting upon 9 enforcement, but hypothetically speaking, considering there 10 is a criminal offense attached to knowingly and intentionally 11 violating the plat requirements, theoretically, if a seller 12 went to a surveyor and said, "I intend to divide the land and 13 sell it, and I am not going to follow the plat requirements 14 and I don't care," it's somewhat setting the surveyor up to 15 be a co-conspirator for violating the criminal statutes if 16 they proceed along that path. Now, I think they could 17 probably alleviate themselves of that duty by providing some 18 kind of written statement that says that I -- these are the 19 county statutes, and I recommend you follow this, and all I'm 20 doing is the surveying for you. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That was -- 22 MR. EMERSON: I don't have the slightest clue 23 what's in their professional obligations and license 24 requirements. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's what I was going to ask 4-28-08 70 1 Lee. From a licensing standpoint, are y'all required, either 2 for civil engineers or the surveyors? 3 MR. LEE VOELKEL: My understanding from the Board 4 of Surveyors is that it's not the obligation or requirement 5 of the surveyors to file the plats, but it is our obligation, 6 as Buster Baldwin said, in order to do the right thing, is to 7 advise people that there are laws that may -- may govern what 8 they're doing, and they should file a plat if it's -- if it 9 falls into the platting category. I don't know of any 10 surveyors that have been held responsible after the fact for 11 not filing a plat. Basically, it's the property owners's 12 responsibility, was my understanding. I'll make another 13 comment too, that just be sure there are a lot of other 14 people involved in the process that maybe ought to be aware 15 of it also. For instance, real estate people, attorney -- 16 real estate attorneys, title companies. They are carrying 17 through with these transactions by metes and bounds without 18 -- I guess they're in the same situation as the surveyors's 19 in. You can tell the people that, and yet if they choose not 20 to do that, who becomes responsible down -- down at the end 21 of the road? But, again, there are a lot of other agencies, 22 businesses that are involved in these things besides the 23 surveyors. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And what is actually -- what 25 happens is that how we -- the tool we've found to find out is 4-28-08 71 1 Environmental Health. That's where we -- 'cause they can do 2 it, but they can't build on it -- or they can't get a septic 3 system, anyway, on it without coming in. And that's -- you 4 know -- 5 MR. DON VOELKEL: If you have an installer that 6 goes by the rules. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's true. 8 MR. DON VOELKEL: Didn't mean to speak out of turn, 9 but -- 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Maybe we need to look at what their 12 professional licensing obligations are also? Is that your -- 13 what you're suggesting? 14 MR. DON VOELKEL: Well, and Lee and I have been 15 talking about this, and also we've been talking with Bruce 16 and Buster, and Rex and I have been talking about a similar 17 situation where the title company called me. They had a lot 18 that was -- the guy was trying to sell a platted lot, half an 19 acre to one person and .22 acres to another person. We met 20 about that, and that was going to be a violation, but the 21 title company made the call to me, and I guess to you too, 22 Rex? And we pretty much told them, "You can't do it that 23 way; it's illegal." And I don't know whether or not they're 24 going to do it, but at least they were making that phone 25 call. And so I think if the title company -- like Lee's 4-28-08 72 1 saying, the title -- if you send out a letter just saying, 2 "Hey, here's what it is," you need to be informed of what -- 3 then you know the proper process. 4 MR. LEE VOELKEL: And I don't have to make a call 5 if it's -- if it's a situation that's shaky. We always talk 6 with the Commissioner and/or Rex about, you know, the -- what 7 we should do, and then we tell our client, "The Commissioner 8 or the County Attorney said you need to file a plat." Or at 9 least bring it before the Court and let y'all make that 10 decision. The Commissioners Court has the authority to tell 11 anybody they don't have to file a plat, but they also have 12 the -- I think the authority to tell them they should do a 13 plat. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: I can see situations in which you're 15 called upon to do some work; somebody's just called you out 16 there and said, "I want you to survey off right here," and 17 they don't tell you why, what their intentions are, and you 18 have no idea what they're going to use it for. So, you 19 prepare them a plat and metes and bounds. But if it 20 subsequently hits the title company where they're trying to 21 convey, and it's described as a certain such-a-sized tract 22 being out of that certain other larger tract, it would seem 23 to me that there's -- there's more heads-up notice on the 24 title company than there is on you guys. 25 MR. DON VOELKEL: If they're guaranteeing title and 4-28-08 73 1 write the title policy, then they should be. They should be. 2 That's why they called me this last weekend. I'm sure that's 3 why they called Rex about that. And -- and I think there's a 4 lot of scenarios -- like, I've been called by a guy who has 5 25 acres, and he's building a house and he wants to put 6 5 acres around the house. They're not selling it, but 7 they're putting a lien against it, and if they ever 8 foreclosed, it would become its own tract. And we've tried 9 to tell them to go with 10 acres, because at least you can, 10 you know, put -- you're not having to get permits for your 11 systems and all, because you're not selling anything. But in 12 the event of a foreclosure, then it becomes a tract and it's 13 severed. And I don't know legally where that -- you know, 14 and that's something maybe Rex can help us on, what we should 15 do with those. I don't see the sense in platting it when 16 somebody's just building a house on 100 acres and they're 17 putting 5 or 10 acres, you know, in the middle of it. But 18 the reason that this came up with the one we just approved, 19 Margaret Krause's, she said -- came to me and said, "I want 20 to sell it off. What do I do?" I told her we have to file a 21 plat, and that's -- she didn't say, "Oh, no, I ain't going to 22 do it." She said, "Let's -- let's do it. You're my 23 professional; do it for me." And that's how that ball got 24 rolling. And I think it's good that y'all -- that at least 25 resolves that issue about two systems on one tract. Just to 4-28-08 74 1 the south -- Bruce and I were talking. We've looked, 'cause 2 we have to get all the adjoinings when we do a survey, and we 3 found some to the south -- I think two lots to her south have 4 been cut up and conveyed, and I'm sure there's septic systems 5 that we may not know about, because no one's ever done the 6 process we just did with Margaret Krause. So, I think -- I 7 mean, I don't know the answer, but I think there is a 8 situation if we have people that are knowingly or unknowingly 9 violating the subdivision rules. But the surveyors know, and 10 the title companies should know, and y'all should know, and 11 so should Environmental Health. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Like I say, we're better than 13 we used to be. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just a reminder is all this 17 really was about. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anything else on that 19 particular item? Why don't we take about a 15-minute recess? 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good idea. 21 (Recess taken from 10:31 a.m. to 10:50 a.m.) 22 - - - - - - - - - - - 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to order, if 24 we might. Next item on the agenda is Item 19; consider, 25 discuss, and take appropriate action concerning updates on 4-28-08 75 1 joint City and County functions. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I put this on the agenda. I 3 really don't know that we have a lot to talk about on it. 4 (Commissioner Williams left the courtroom.) 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is kind of -- more of just 6 a place-keeper. Commissioner Williams and I are meeting with 7 the two Councilmen representatives Friday morning about the 8 airport. And there's really not a whole lot of change, I 9 think, since our last meeting, but that's kind of why -- I 10 just put on it here in case something had happened, or what's 11 coming up. And I think we can -- 12 (Commissioner Williams returned to court.) 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Unless Commissioner Williams 14 has something else to say? 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's it? I missed it? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: He said he didn't have much to 17 report, but he put the agenda item there in case there was 18 something to report. You never know. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We'll probably have more to 20 report after -- after Friday's meeting. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Except I do have one thing. 23 One of the things that was part of our mix that got assigned 24 out are these connect warning systems, okay? And through the 25 911 -- good folks at 911, we've had a couple good 4-28-08 76 1 presentations, and it looks like the numbers are coming down 2 and refining down to about $25,000 per participant, which 3 would be essentially the City or the County -- City and/or 4 the County. So, I think it's interesting to note that this 5 thing -- this whole process of connecting and communicating 6 with your constituents is really advanced from just warning 7 in reverse of a problem. It's -- now you can do all sorts of 8 things, unlimited uses, because these databases are 9 structured so that you can do missing seniors, storm 10 warnings, flood alerts, hazardous materials, water and fire 11 advisories, blackout prevention, health warnings, volunteer 12 call-ups, water main breaks, media updates, road closures, 13 earthquake, just a whole list of things. And, for example, 14 we can also, in addition to law enforcement using it, which 15 they would -- would do, we can structure its use, as can the 16 City as well, for unlimited use by the various departments 17 within city or county government. If there was some reason 18 to notify people that the courthouse was going to be closed 19 or the County Clerk was closing her office for some reason, 20 they can do that. Just a whole raft of things you can do. 21 Bottom line, we'll probably be prepared to make 22 recommendations for some sort of an inclusion for a system of 23 this nature, and the numbers are going to come in roughly 24 around $25,000. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Essentially, what you're talking 4-28-08 77 1 about is a cost-sharing basis between City and County? 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We can do it that way, 3 Judge, or we can maybe look at a proportionate share. We're 4 taking a look at two different proposals. We'll see what -- 5 what, if any, the differences are and make a recommendation, 6 but it's coming in in that range. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I was in -- in attendance at 8 one of the meetings that you're talking about -- 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- with 911. It's pretty 11 impressive what they can do. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And they can notify so 14 quickly and -- and make multiple calls. I forget, how many 15 calls is it a second or a minute? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, just -- 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's unbelievable. They can 18 notify probably everybody in this entire county of 40-plus 19 thousand population in a matter of -- I think it's somewhere, 20 three to five minutes. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. It's incredible what 22 you can do, and the costs are going to boil down to between 23 two or two and a quarter per citizen. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Talking about $2 a person, I 25 believe. 4-28-08 78 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just about two, two and a 2 quarter. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Two, two and a quarter a 4 person, resident in the county. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that a one-time cost, and then -- 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's an annual cost. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Annual cost, Judge, but 8 there's no software, no hardware. There's no particular 9 hosting fee. That's just a -- if you sign up with these 10 people, that's the fee you're going to pay, and you have this 11 unlimited use. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's really quite simple. 13 They took our numbers -- our cell phone numbers when we sat 14 down, and the guy was in California giving a presentation 15 over the -- over the phone, and -- over the in -- well, over 16 the internet with a screen showing all the stuff they could 17 do. And we got our stuff to him, and he -- you know, he 18 notified all of us at the same time, within a second or two 19 of each other. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: While we were sitting at the 22 table, from California, on our cell phones. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's where it's at. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Pretty impressive. And the 25 price is getting down to where I believe we can be able to 4-28-08 79 1 have some justification in case of emergencies or other 2 things. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But it's now becoming 4 affordable and it's becoming more broadly based. We can send 5 out notifications on the home phone, work phone, cell phone, 6 text messaging, e-mail, voice mail, PDA, pagers. That's what 7 can go out on the warning system. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You can also pinpoint areas 9 just by taking the arrow of your computer and hitting a spot 10 here, here, here, and wherever, and zero in just in that area 11 where nobody else will get the calls. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Pretty impressive. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's all I have, Judge. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? Let's move on to 16 Item 20; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action on 17 broker/dealer list for Kerr County in accordance with the 18 Public Funds Investment Act. Broker/dealer list must be 19 approved by the Commissioners Court before Kerr County can 20 transact business with these dealers. List can be added to 21 or broker can be deleted at any time by the Commissioners 22 Court. Ms. Hargis, you've got a -- 23 MS. HARGIS: As you recall, back in -- in October, 24 we signed -- you did the Public Fund Investment Act, and we 25 did -- inadvertently did not include this list. I tried to 4-28-08 80 1 go in the phone book and include every bank here in town. If 2 there is anybody else that you would like to add, you know, 3 please just put it down. As long as they agree to the -- you 4 know, the Public Fund Investment Act, we can invest with 5 them. But in order to branch out from TexPool, you know, and 6 from Security State Bank, which we have already put some 7 investments in, we need this list, and we need it approved by 8 you. And I'd like to make the list all-encompassing and put 9 everybody that you think I might want to use. That way I 10 don't have to come back every time. You are supposed to 11 review these on an annual basis, so I will be bringing it 12 back again in October. But if there's anybody else, 13 please -- you know, I'm fairly new to the area, but I tried 14 to go through the phone book and put people I knew that were 15 normally approved on this list. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Make one correction. Actually, it's 17 an addition to your list. The first one, A.G. Edwards, you 18 need to show a slash, Wachovia Securities. 19 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: I think at least for a period of 21 time, they're going to keep the dual -- the dual 22 identification, but probably eventually they'll go to 23 Wachovia. But they have been absorbed by Wachovia, so -- 24 MS. HARGIS: Okay. Is there -- anybody else have 25 anybody? 4-28-08 81 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: All of these that are on 2 the list, do they have offices or facilities in Kerr County? 3 MS. HARGIS: Yes, except -- 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who's Vining Sparks, and 5 who's Mizuho Securities? 6 MS. HARGIS: Linda Patterson added -- those are 7 investor ones that she likes to use, that sometimes when you 8 buy paper, you have to have someone you buy through, and 9 those are the ones she bought through. That's the reason 10 why -- she only actually put three or four on there. I left 11 hers on there. If you want to take them off, that's fine 12 with me. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, I'm just asking for 14 clarification. 15 MS. HARGIS: To answer you, I don't know. But 16 that's -- 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Barclays would be another one that 18 she probably added. 19 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm, yeah. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 21 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. We used to have a list of 22 probably about two pages, but that -- we tried to cover every 23 bank and every institute that was within, you know, a 60-mile 24 radius. But if there's anybody else that you guys want to 25 add in, feel free. 4-28-08 82 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't recall ever doing 2 this before. Is this -- 3 MS. HARGIS: You haven't done that before, because 4 you didn't have the Public Fund Investment Act in place. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 6 MS. HARGIS: And now you do, which enables you to 7 invest in other areas. One of the things is, because we do 8 have a lot of money, you don't want to put your portfolio -- 9 as they teach you in the public fund training, you don't want 10 to put your portfolio all in one basket, just like we don't 11 do that personally. We do have quite a bit of money already 12 invested in Security State Bank, as well as TexPool. There's 13 another pool that I put on there called Tex Star. It's -- it 14 was a branch off of TexPool; it was the original -- my mind 15 just went blank. Part of it's Chase Bank, and then First 16 Security, I think it is, that went together and formed Tex 17 Star. I'm more comfortable with TexPool because of the -- of 18 the State of Texas being involved in that one. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make approval -- make a 20 motion that we approve the broker/dealer list as submitted 21 and amended. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 24 approval as indicated. Further question or discussion? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Paula, are you -- are 4-28-08 83 1 you acting as the County Treasurer here? 2 MS. HARGIS: No, I'm not acting as the County 3 Treasurer. I'm -- I'm submitting this list to be added to 4 the Public Fund Investment Act, which I did submit to you 5 with Mindy's approval, as you recall, back in October. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 7 MS. HARGIS: This should have been included in 8 that. Mindy and I have been working on the investments 9 together. While she's been out, I have been doing those. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. You don't 11 have to go through all of that. I'm just -- my point is that 12 the investment issue is the Treasurer's -- 13 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir, I understand. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- job, and so -- but -- and 15 that's where this comes in, is it -- if Mindy were on board 16 and up and running, she would be in here doing this. 17 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you very much. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion on 20 the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 21 your right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll go to 4-28-08 84 1 Item 21; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 2 institute a purchasing policy for Kerr County; request any 3 modifications to the draft of purchasing policy from 4 Commissioners Court. Policy is the first step in providing a 5 guide to all Kerr County staff and elected officials on 6 purchasing standards, as required by Commissioners Court and 7 the State. Also sets levels for instituting the 8 decentralized purchasing procedures for the online Incode 9 purchasing system. In addition to approval of purchasing 10 policy, requests are made of Commissioners Court to raise the 11 capital outlay unit cost from $1,000 to $5,000. That level 12 is used to set the items that require depreciation and 13 provide for better level of reportable accountability. 14 Ms. Hargis. 15 MS. HARGIS: Okay. Each of you have a draft. This 16 was actually the second draft. I tried to highlight in 17 yellow a lot of the things that were new and different. 18 There are some things I'm sure that you want to strike out. 19 I just felt that we needed something as a guide for all of us 20 to be in place, because we don't currently have one. When we 21 put the Incode system into place, one of the things in there 22 is levels of authority, which, you know, each department head 23 will be able to decide what they want to do with that, 24 because that depends on how closely they want to scrutinize 25 their own departments. The depreciation is for -- we've been 4-28-08 85 1 depreciating everything that's $1,000, and unfortunately, in 2 today's world, that's not very much. We could end up with a 3 piece of equipment that really costs $1,000 that's not going 4 to last but a year. We have to add to it our fixed assets, 5 which is also raising our insurance. 6 So, $5,000 is pretty much the norm in -- in the 7 county world now, because it's also used for theft and for 8 different -- for different areas. But there's some sections 9 in here called blanket -- there's definitions, and there's 10 one area for blanket purchasing, which we may or may not have 11 done in the past. Blanket purchasing would be where you send 12 out an advertisement for bid, say, for Gibson's or Lowe's or 13 Home Depot, for nuts and bolts and all that kind of stuff, 14 and you put all that on a list. It's called blanket 15 purchasing. You send it out, and then you have their costs, 16 and then you choose which one of those vendors would be 17 better for you to buy the smaller items at, okay. It's not 18 used a lot in small entities; it's used mostly for larger 19 entities. 20 The other thing that I have in here that's a little 21 different is the purchase cards. We don't currently have 22 one. There are thus and sundry ones of them out there. 23 Wells Fargo calls theirs a P-card, and I think Chase calls 24 theirs -- it's the Texas Star card. And, basically, they're 25 just like credit cards, very similar to what we have on our 4-28-08 86 1 health insurance, but they're designated to certain vendors. 2 They're designated to a certain amount, and the person would 3 have -- you know, if they tried to purchase something that 4 was not on that card, that wasn't on the list or wasn't a 5 vendor, it would deny the charge. I'm not recommending it. 6 I just put it in so that you could review it to see if you 7 want to even do that. The other -- that was part of the 8 section that was there. We currently use requisitions, so 9 that's -- when we go into the new system, it will 10 automatically do a requisition, and then it will print a 11 purchase order. It would be nice on some of the things to 12 have those requisitions. And I have given you a sample of 13 one that we could use in the meantime. It's going to take us 14 a while to put Incode on, because it's a -- it's a learning 15 curve. And we also have a lot of areas that still -- like 16 Road and Bridge, which is one of our bigger buyers; they're 17 still not on, you know, our internet web site -- I mean on 18 the internet yet with us. So, until they get the broadband, 19 which will be fairly soon, you know, but they may not be able 20 to get on. 21 It -- you know, this is -- I just think this is a 22 good tool. It's not a complicated system. It just kind of 23 tells everybody how we need to do bidding, recommending 24 certain levels that you call, you solicit, you get e-mails, 25 you get faxes, so it kind of covers them and covers us. You 4-28-08 87 1 know, we all kind of went through that situation, and we 2 didn't all quite understand what the different types of 3 vehicles are that are out there. There are different 4 governmental sites. We're not members of all of them. In 5 fact, we're not members of any of them. We can go through 6 them. One of them is called Buy Board, and Tim and I are in 7 the process right now and have signed up for that one. The 8 other one is H.G.A.C., which is where we use the vehicles -- 9 we generally buy the vehicles out of there. You can also buy 10 them out of Buy Board. It's very good for, I think, 11 everybody to -- they're online; they can go online to see if 12 the products are there, who they can buy them from, how much 13 they would be so that they can get a better idea of someplace 14 else to purchase. But we've never used those universally. I 15 think the Sheriff's Department's used them quite a bit for 16 the vehicles, but I'm not sure that we've used it for other 17 products. And so there -- I think there's -- there's another 18 one. Buy Board is basically the school district. H.G.A.C. 19 is Houston-Galveston Coastal Area, and they've had -- had a 20 web site and a buying co-op, so-to-speak, for years. And I 21 think there's another one that State of Texas has, and I'm 22 not that familiar with that one. The Buy Board was very 23 user-friendly for -- for us to use the other day. The 24 H.G.A.C. web site was not. We had a terrible time with them, 25 just getting to sign on. We could get in there, but we 4-28-08 88 1 couldn't really deal with them, 'cause they wouldn't answer 2 my phone calls, so we kind of gave up on that one. But, 3 like, the air-conditioners, we went on and we put the 4 air-conditioners on; it wasn't really that hard. Tim and I 5 can get it. And he received responses the next day, wasn't 6 it? 7 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, ma'am. 8 MS. HARGIS: But not everybody knows how to do 9 that, so we need to learn. Now, Buy Board has agreed to come 10 down on June the 5th and do a training session with our 11 people, so -- free, and pass out information. So, they're 12 going to come in to try to help us, and so I'm looking to 13 you. This is the first policy I've ever brought to you, so 14 I'm looking to you for direction as to what I need to do. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Jeannie, I've got a 16 question, or maybe two. And if you answer those, you know, 17 I'm ready to rock and roll. 18 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is there a purchasing policy 20 in place today? 21 MS. HARGIS: Not that I'm aware of. And there 22 could be, but I'm not aware of one. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Now -- okay. So, 24 we -- we adopt your recommendation here, this program here. 25 How does that -- tell me how that benefits the taxpayers of 4-28-08 89 1 Kerr County. 2 MS. HARGIS: Well, it -- I think that if we have a 3 policy in place, just like any other policy, it gives all of 4 the employees of the county a direction to go by to know how 5 to best buy their products for their departments. It doesn't 6 mean that they mandatorily have to go through there, but it's 7 a guide. It also provides a guide to keep us from doing 8 something we shouldn't do, especially on anything over 9 $25,000. Most of us are aware of that, but we know we're 10 supposed to bid over 25, but we don't know exactly how, and 11 -- and this policy then gives them a guide as to how to do 12 that. And I think that protects the citizens of Kerr County 13 by making sure that they have something like this in place. 14 There -- the only thing that I -- and I provided y'all with 15 the Government Code -- is that my -- my department ends up 16 being the person that writes all the RFQ's and things of that 17 nature. To be honest with you, I'm not an expert on -- on 18 wood chippers, so I would have to depend on Leonard for that 19 kind of stuff. So, it just makes it a little bit easier for 20 everybody, and it gives us -- so somebody doesn't 21 accidentally do this. It has been my experience, both here 22 and in the Houston area, if -- a lot of times people will 23 circumvent the rule. Well, if I -- if I have a piece here 24 and a piece here, but if I do one a month or one a month and 25 one a month, then I don't have to do them. And -- 4-28-08 90 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I have a question. This is 2 very comprehensive, and it's, I think -- following up on 3 Commissioner Baldwin's question, it is something we do not 4 have in place. We have talked in the past about the 5 potential of a purchasing department, but we haven't got 6 there yet. But it seems to me that what I'm looking at today 7 is, in effect, a transition to a purchasing department. 8 Which leads me to ask you the question, how are you going to 9 do, in your department, with the limited personnel that you 10 have, all of these things that effectively are the 11 responsibility of the purchasing department? 12 MS. HARGIS: We're already doing most of them now. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 14 MS. HARGIS: There are a lot -- there are some 15 things that we are not doing, but there's a lot of them that 16 we are doing now. And questions are asked of us, and -- and, 17 like, if it's under $10,000, sometimes people just go buy it. 18 They don't really solicit. So -- and then by the time we get 19 it, it's already a done deal. So, I'm not suggesting right 20 now -- I would love to have a purchasing agent; that would be 21 great, but I'm not suggesting that. It's just -- I need a 22 guide for myself. I need a guide for everyone else so that 23 everybody's consistent with how they buy. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't have any problem 25 with the guide aspect of it. I think that's a good policy. 4-28-08 91 1 MS. HARGIS: But this is not meant to set up a 2 purchasing department. I think that's a much more detailed 3 document. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Hargis, we've got the Incode 5 system that will be coming online. A lot of these benchmarks 6 will be plugged into that system, will they not? 7 MS. HARGIS: Yes, they will. But I don't have any 8 benchmarks right now, so that's -- 9 JUDGE TINLEY: I understand. But, I mean, if this 10 policy is approved, for example, if -- if there's a request 11 made to purchase something in a given budget category, the 12 systems's going to search to see if there's adequate funds in 13 that category, -- 14 MS. HARGIS: Correct. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: -- number one. Number two, if it 16 falls within one of these that, while it may not be required 17 to be competitively bid, if the policy requires for, say, at 18 least three written bids to be obtained, for example, there 19 will be something that'll pop up to indicate this needs to be 20 done. 21 MS. HARGIS: There'll be an approval level set, and 22 if that approver -- it needs to be the department head at 23 that point, and if that hasn't been done, then the department 24 head at that point would not approve it. There are levels of 25 approval. 4-28-08 92 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 2 MS. HARGIS: And we will set those levels of 3 approval up to make sure that they coincide with what we've 4 said here. And if it's not approved, it won't go through the 5 system; it would be rejected, and then goes back. And it's a 6 real simple thing. I mean, you get an e-mail and it says you 7 have a batch that you need to approve. You go into Incode, 8 you look at the batch, and if you realize it's something 9 that -- your employee has a note down there that they have, 10 in fact, solicited the bids, they have those copies. There's 11 plenty of room for notes. If that note isn't there, then -- 12 and the department head had this purchasing policy, then it 13 would behoove them to make sure that had been done. But the 14 system will not tell them that that has to be done. It will 15 only ask for an approval. But it will ask for an approval at 16 every level that we put. So, when it gets to certain levels, 17 then I'm going to put my name on there to make sure that they 18 have done what they do, especially at 25 -- actually, at 19 24,999, it'll have to come to me before it will be generated 20 for a check. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: And that's in the policy? 22 MS. HARGIS: It is here, yes. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 24 MS. HARGIS: And that's pretty much, I think, in 25 the state code, that, you know, before anything is $25,000, 4-28-08 93 1 that we need to have approval from you, so that keys me 2 there's something out there. Then I will bring that back to 3 you. That is -- I don't even have the power to do that. It 4 has to be bid properly. You have to approve the bidding 5 process before -- and the advertisement, and then we have to 6 bring them back to you. So, I need to be sure that 7 everybody's on -- and this all became apparent to me when we 8 were in the process of purchasing these cars. And it's not 9 an everyday occurrence that we go through something like 10 this, but it's nice to have a document that we can say, okay, 11 here's what we need to do. And -- and so we don't get caught 12 again with the situation that we did. 13 MR. EMERSON: Can I make a comment? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Sure. 15 MR. EMERSON: I like the concept. But sometimes 16 between concept and implementation, there's some minor 17 adjustments that need to be made to make it work smoothly for 18 everybody. And as far as I know, the elected officials have 19 not had an opportunity to look at this, and right now they're 20 all doing their own individual purchasing. What I'd like to 21 request is that, instead of taking any action, if y'all could 22 pass to your next Commissioners Court so that everybody can 23 look at this, and if any tweaking needs to be done, it can be 24 done before instead of after. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I totally agree. 4-28-08 94 1 MS. HARGIS: I think that's a good idea. That's 2 basically why I brought it to you. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I have a question along 4 that same exact same line. Let's pretend that Rex -- she's 5 going to turn her back on me now. Let's pretend that Rex 6 comes to the Commissioners Court during the budget process 7 and -- and requests that the County purchase him something, 8 and so we put $10,000 in there for new office furniture, and 9 he gets ready to make that purchase. How does this policy 10 apply to that? Does he just pick up the phone and call -- 11 you know, he'd gone out and found out I can buy all this 12 furniture from Easy Furniture Company in San Antonio for 13 $10,000, so he comes to Commissioners Court and says, "Okay, 14 I can get it for ten grand." And the Commissioners Court 15 approves it, so in the budget we have furniture, $10,000. 16 How does this apply to that? Does he still have to come get 17 permission from the new purchasing policy to make his 18 purchase? 19 MS. HARGIS: No. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You don't even know that 21 he's made the purchase until you get the bill. 22 MS. HARGIS: We know because of the approval 23 levels. If it is in their budget and you have already 24 approved it, and they go out and they solicit their bids 25 according to the document, and all the approval levels are 4-28-08 95 1 there -- like, if it was in Rex's department, and let's say 2 Ilse bought the furniture for his staff. Then the final 3 approval will go to Rex. And as long as I have Rex's 4 signature or approval on there, then I know he's -- he's 5 reviewed it and he's seen it. That's all I need. Now, if 6 it's not in his budget, he needs to come here first. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. Why -- well, 8 okay. You don't -- you've answered my question. Thank you. 9 MS. UECKER: So, what's different than what we're 10 doing right now? I mean, how is that different? 11 MS. HARGIS: It's not. It's just putting it down 12 in writing, and that's really all it's doing. A lot of it is 13 just putting it in writing, and that's why I gave it to them 14 in a draft form, so that they can mark it up. There are some 15 new things in there that I highlighted, and it's the 16 beginning of starting the other system, and it just gives me 17 a handle. If what I have as levels is not good, then I need 18 to know from y'all. 19 MS. UECKER: I haven't seen it. 20 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. 21 MR. TROLINGER: But does it not actually impose 22 control over purchasing by putting an electronic lock on 23 purchases over that value? 24 MS. HARGIS: It puts an electronic lock up to the 25 department head. In other words, Linda would have the total 4-28-08 96 1 approval of her department, unless it went over $25,000. 2 Then she and I would be the ones that would have to approve 3 it, and it would take joint signature of both of us before it 4 would go through. And if it was a budgeted item and she knew 5 it was over 25, she'd done all other bidding, she would bring 6 it to me; we would discuss it, and we would both approve it 7 at the same time. But it would -- my approval would only be 8 to insure that she did all of the things that she was 9 supposed to do. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm unclear about something 11 you've said. 12 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If I'm understanding what 14 you just said, I believe that's different from what you 15 previously said with respect to anything -- any purchase 16 25,000 or greater. 17 MS. HARGIS: Right. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I was under the impression 19 that first that goes to bid, and secondly, even though it may 20 be in the budget, it comes to Commissioners Court for 21 approval. 22 MS. HARGIS: That's correct. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that correct? 24 MS. HARGIS: That's correct. That's the reason why 25 the approval level is put there, so that that can't happen. 4-28-08 97 1 See, that's the reason why I would be there in case it 2 accidentally went through the system without going the proper 3 channels. And that's easy to happen, because a lot of people 4 are under the assumption -- and I'm not saying here, but that 5 if they have approval in their budget for a certain item, and 6 it's a very large item, they don't necessarily -- say they're 7 a fairly new hire; they think they can go ahead and buy it. 8 They forget to get the proper approvals. That does happen. 9 It's not often, but it does happen. And so by going through 10 levels of approval, it will make sure that that doesn't 11 happen, because then I can lock it down at 25. Say she's not 12 in town, and it -- it pops up that a $25,000 approval -- it 13 would pop up to her and me at the same time, so she would be 14 aware of it and I would be aware of it. So, there's two 15 people watching it. But each department, each elected 16 official would have that authority. 17 (Discussion off the record.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Do you have the ability to transmit 19 this latest draft to all elected officials? 20 MS. HARGIS: Yes, I do. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: And department heads? 22 MS. HARGIS: Yes, I do. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: With a cover that, you know, this is 24 in draft form. Check it over. You're going to later submit 25 it, bring it back to the Court and take a shot at it. 4-28-08 98 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Would this include J.P. 4? 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Of course. (Laughter.) 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Better call him first. 4 MS. HARGIS: I don't have -- I presented for you -- 5 I went to another web site and printed for you the law so you 6 wouldn't have to look it up. I don't have that. I would 7 assume that they all have the Texas Government Code they can 8 look at. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't know that all the elected 10 officials and department heads would necessarily need that, 11 except Ms. Uecker. She likes to -- she likes to play lawyer 12 up there. 13 MS. UECKER: Yeah. 14 (Commissioner Baldwin left the courtroom.) 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there, I guess, a -- in the 16 Incode system, you mentioned the Buy Board. That if Linda 17 was going to buy something that Buy Board sells, and she 18 didn't have Buy Board on there or something, does -- can -- 19 if you flagged it, you know, kind of just information, not 20 that she has to buy through Buy Board, but might want to look 21 at Buy Board or remember this, you know. I mean -- 22 MS. HARGIS: I can ask the programmers. I -- you 23 know, to be honest with you, I'm not exactly sure of all the 24 flags they can put in there, but we can try to put every flag 25 we can in there. I mean, I think that's worth our while. 4-28-08 99 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Because it seems part of it 2 would be an educational thing. If there are multiple state 3 functions or -- you know, that we can buy through, you know, 4 the people that are responsible for purchasing may not know 5 that. 6 MS. HARGIS: Well, and that's my whole reason for 7 bringing this, is -- is twofold; to train everybody that 8 there are other ways to buy things, and -- and to show them 9 how -- the proper way of doing it. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Do you have something? 11 MS. UECKER: Well, he kind of answered it, but not 12 having seen the policy -- the proposed policy, and listening 13 to what she said earlier -- a little earlier about getting 14 approval of budgeted items, if I have gone to the 15 Commissioners Court and got an item budgeted, doesn't that 16 mean that I've already done my homework and I've gotten that 17 approval? 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Not necessarily. You may have a -- 19 have a blanket category. This new Incode system will, number 20 one, determine if you still got that money in your budget. 21 And the policy then will -- if it's -- 22 MS. UECKER: Are you talking about small items? 23 JUDGE TINLEY: -- for you, for your department, and 24 you're requesting it, as long as it's within the -- within 25 the budget and within the non-bid amount, you're probably 4-28-08 100 1 okay. Now, if someone else in your department should tell 2 Robbin, for example, "Go ahead and take care of that," and 3 it -- say it's a $10,000 threshold item, it's going to -- 4 it's going to get flagged if you haven't approved it. As the 5 amount goes up, it requires that additional authority look at 6 it, is essentially what we've done, even though it is 7 budgeted. 8 MS. HARGIS: I think what the policy is trying to 9 do is to make a guide as to how you would purchase things 10 that, for instance, are over $2,000. What it says is $2,000 11 or less are just the normal, everyday things. But anything 12 from two to ten, it suggests that you solicit bids by picking 13 up the phone or e-mail and soliciting three buyers -- three 14 or four, however many you want, and keeping those e-mails, 15 just to show that you looked out there to make sure that 16 you've got the best bang for the buck. 17 (Commissioner Baldwin returned to court.) 18 MS. UECKER: Which we do anyway. 19 MS. HARGIS: Right, which most of you do anyway. 20 But some departments -- they're new, and they may or may not 21 be aware of that, and so it just makes consistency across the 22 board. And that's really -- anything over -- from 10 to 15, 23 the State says you really should get something in writing and 24 keep a file on it. And then from 15 to 25 is when you get 25 into that area where you're getting closer to bidding. And 4-28-08 101 1 it really addresses the 25,000 plus, so that you know how to 2 bid. Now, you have -- if it's a service contract, you don't 3 have to have a bid, so forth and so on. It just kind of 4 tells you the parameters, and it follows the Texas Government 5 Code. And I think Rex has a copy of it as well. But I'll 6 get this to everybody today. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 8 MS. HARGIS: It's in electronic format. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Give them an opportunity to weigh in 10 on it. Okay. Why don't -- why don't we go to Section 4, 11 payment of the bills. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move we pay the bills. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to pay the 15 bills. Question or discussion? Page 36 and 37. Was that 16 bill to Voelkel Engineering really about $5,300, and we just 17 split it between administration and the operational portion 18 of Road and Bridge? 19 MS. HARGIS: I think that's correct. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I believe that is -- 21 MS. HARGIS: I'd have to check. I believe that's 22 correct. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 24 MS. HARGIS: That's the way they coded it when it 25 came over. 4-28-08 102 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So, the total bill was 5,350, 2 roughly. Okay, that's the only question I've got. Any other 3 questions or comments? All in favor of the motion, signify 4 by raising your right hand. 5 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 7 (No response.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. I did not 9 receive any information on budget amendments. Do we have 10 any? 11 MS. HARGIS: No. Next time. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Do we have any late bills? 13 MS. HARGIS: No late bills. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: I've been presented monthly reports 15 from Justice of the Peace, Precinct 4; Justice of the Peace, 16 Precinct 1. Did we receive the J.P. 4 report by e-mail? 17 THE CLERK: No, sir. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Do I hear a motion that these 19 reports be approved as presented? 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to approve 23 the designated reports as presented. Question or comments? 24 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 25 hand. 4-28-08 103 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We have any 5 reports from any of the Commissioners in connection with 6 their committee or liaison assignments? 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I could go on for hours, but 8 I think I'll just defer. We have lots to do. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir. Thank you. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is not -- I'm not 11 liaison, but I've talked to Commissioner Oehler about this. 12 I had a phone call from a constituent wanting to know if the 13 County's insurance would cover his situation, which was that 14 he was injured attending to a hog during the West Kerr sale. 15 And -- 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Show. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Show, sorry. Correct. 18 Last January 5. And it really -- I don't want to bore the 19 Court with all the details, but man was rather insistent that 20 he was injured, he was out there, he was working. 'Cause I 21 asked him who he was working for, and did he work for the 22 County? And he said no, which indicated he was working for 23 the Stock Show Association. So, I decided to check with 24 Ms. Grinstead to see whether or not we had insurance on file, 25 as he indicated, from the Stock Show Association, or any 4-28-08 104 1 association that may conduct business out there with 2 volunteers or with paid employees. And the bottom line is, 3 Ms. Grinstead has nothing on file. What she has as a matter 4 of guidance is that the month of January is open for 5 agricultural stock show related matters, which we all know. 6 So, I just bring this to the Court's attention because I want 7 really to ask the question, is there a potential liability or 8 exposure to the County in situations where an individual 9 claims to have been injured while in attendance to animals at 10 a stock show function? That's a question. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think part of the answer -- 12 we were talking about it the other day -- is we can find out 13 whether 4-H, each individual club has their own liability 14 insurance to cover these kinds of things, or whether we need 15 to see about getting those things in force or getting copies 16 of those policies, if they exist, or whether we are going to 17 be responsible, the County's liability insurance, for these 18 kinds of injuries that may occur. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't -- and the 4-H thing 20 opens up another whole -- all the volunteer coaches and all 21 the kids and -- 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This is a good point, a good 23 time to bring it up, because it's something we probably need 24 to -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Look at. 4-28-08 105 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- to look into and see where 2 we stand on that issue. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I -- I don't know how it came to be 4 there, but I recall seeing a sign on the indoor arena, the 5 exterior of the indoor arena, fairly close to the doorway 6 that's next to the office, that in some manner disclaims 7 liability on behalf of the County, because -- in connection 8 with stock show activities, because of the inherent risk 9 involved in those activities. And I can't recall whether it 10 referred to a state statute or not. Don't know what the 11 origin of the sign was. Don't know whether it's accurate or 12 not, but I recall seeing the sign this last weekend. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It will be something Rex, I 14 think, probably should look into. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, if that, in fact, is 16 there, Judge, and then the County Attorney affirms that it 17 does work as a limiter to our exposure, I still think it may 18 be appropriate for us to have on file with Ms. Grinstead for 19 the month of January any and all insurance coverages that 20 others may have acquired for that event -- their event. 21 Right now, we can't tell you who had it, who didn't have it. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I think even though the 4-H 23 and stock show people have -- have got a priority of use out 24 there, I don't think they're exempt from the insurance 25 requirements. I think -- 4-28-08 106 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's my point. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: I think they ought to have to 3 provide that. 4-H Horse Club people, there's a tremendous 4 potential liability there with that operation. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Exactly. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: I think we ought to have it from 7 everybody that uses it. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. That's my point 9 in bringing it up. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Most of y'all know -- I guess 11 all of y'all know that I've attended these -- they're called 12 county-to-county meetings recently, for better or worse. And 13 on the -- 16th? -- 16th of May, Kerr County will be hosting 14 this county-to-county function at Schreiner University. I 15 just wanted to let everybody be aware, that will be from 9:00 16 to 12:00, the time of it. And it's -- basically, where we're 17 going is looking at what, if anything, needs to be worked out 18 with the Legislature prior to the next session, primarily 19 related to subdivision rule type issues. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What were the dates again? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The 16th of May. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Friday. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's a Friday, 9:00 to 12:00. 24 And then there will be a -- next meeting will be -- there is 25 kind of a -- the final hashing out meeting. The next meeting 4-28-08 107 1 in June, we'll invite all legislators that represent any of 2 the counties involved, along with Speaker Craddick's office 3 and some other senators and representatives that are dealing 4 with these issues that are committee chairs, and that meeting 5 will be in Hays County. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? How about reports 7 from elected officials or department heads? 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Just two things. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just two. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Be brief and to the point. I've had 11 that admonition relayed to me. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. First off, jails's 13 full. Is that brief enough? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We've got 177 in there, 31 16 females. They got 30 female beds. So, with summer coming 17 on, I don't know where we're headed. But this task force 18 roundup didn't help things, 'cause violation of probations 19 don't get out. We're housing a little over 100 VOP's right 20 now. It's going to be an interesting summer. Second thing, 21 I put a deal in each of y'all's box several -- or a couple 22 weeks ago in regards to the radio system and upgrades. I was 23 informed the other day that before the end of this year, the 24 City of Kerrville will be digital. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Will be what? 4-28-08 108 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Digital. Talking digital. 2 Them having one tower site makes it a whole lot cheaper for 3 them to do that than the estimated 1.2, 1.3 million it will 4 cost the County. But the problem with the City going digital 5 at this point in time is, it will end the -- 99 percent of 6 the communication between County and City officers. 7 Interoperability is going to work opposite, because our VHF 8 will not be able to communicate with the digital that they 9 have. They may, depending on how they set theirs up, be able 10 to hear us, but we will not be able to hear them. And that's 11 going to cause a drastic safety issue, in my opinion, between 12 City and County when you're talking the number of officers 13 having to work together. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Were you contacted by the Chief 15 about this, given a heads-up? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I was told last week during 17 our roundup that they will be digital by the end of the year. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there a reason the City 19 needs to make this change right now? 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: They applied for a grant and 21 got it, so now they have to spend it. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are we analog? 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We are analog. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And are we analog 25 convertible to digital? 4-28-08 109 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: At 1.3 -- 1.3 million. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: God, how many years ago did 3 we buy this system? 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not long. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 2000. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Huh? 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 2000. We had -- and if y'all 8 will remember, we did have the bids in 2000 to go digital, 9 but it was exactly the same figures. It would cost -- I 10 think the County paid 900-something thousand for this system, 11 and it would have been 2, 2.4 million to go digital at that 12 time. So, it's about the same; it's just -- it's going to 13 catch up. Now, the State has mandated that every county -- 14 city and county law enforcement be digital by 2015. In 15 reality, that is December 31st of 2014. And to be narrow 16 band by 2013, or December 31st, 2012. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I recall we made that decision 18 to not go the digital route because we didn't have to yet, 19 and most others hadn't yet. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, and there was still a 21 lot of discussion over what they called Project 25, or APCO 22 25 on what changes -- and, as y'all saw in the memo, there's 23 still some changes coming. Now, supposedly, there's 24 agreement that they can't reverse whatever's been done with 25 agencies now, but it's going to be, you know -- 4-28-08 110 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are there grants out there that 2 we can apply for? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: There may be some limited 4 funding grants through AACOG, some of that. But what I think 5 we're going to be in for is, you're -- it's going to be hard 6 to find, 'cause you're going to have -- part of this is done 7 by state, part of it's done by federal. You're going to have 8 every agency within the U.S. that's having to do this, and 9 real small agencies are really going to have a hard time 10 coming up with the price. Our biggest issue is that we are a 11 simulcast system with multiple tower sites to get coverage. 12 Otherwise, the cost would be, you know, a tenth of what the 13 estimated bid is now. But it's going to cause some issues 14 during the first of the year that I don't know how to deal 15 with, and I hate to see the officers not be able to 16 communicate with each other on the street. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This will be the first of the 18 year, this -- 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That they will be -- they're 20 doing the final stuff now. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Another instance -- 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where did they get a grant 23 from? 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: One came -- I saw somewhere 25 where Corning or the federal government gave them some. 4-28-08 111 1 Their total -- total deal was, like, 360,000. 2 MS. HARGIS: They got a Homeland Security grant. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Part of it's Homeland 4 Security. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, if it's part of 6 Homeland Security, we can apply that way too, and should. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Have there been any preliminary 9 efforts to investigate grant funding? 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No. As in talking with Don 11 McFarland with AACOG and seeing what they could do, and his 12 opinion -- his wording back to me last week when I did visit 13 with him was that if we went narrow band -- which I don't 14 know if we really want to do that first, 'cause if you go 15 narrow band, then two years -- within two years, you have to 16 go digital, which you have to redo everything. The narrow 17 band, if you'll remember, was 47,000 on that, and if you go 18 narrow band, he said they could possibly help with that. 19 So -- 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Why don't you go narrow band and 21 digital at the same time? 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's the thing. You know, 23 to me, it is -- it would be kind of useless to spend 50,000 24 and go narrow band, and then by the mandate, within three 25 years have to totally redo everything. 4-28-08 112 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd look into grants. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, we need to. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We're looking -- there is one 4 other deal that's just coming on the horizon that we're 5 looking at. The Rio Grande COG has been doing a test site 6 for a trunking system, digital trunking system, which is kind 7 of like the L.C.R.A. system, for law enforcement, and now 8 they are starting to expand that to allow other agencies to 9 try and sign on. Now, the problem with me, they'd still have 10 to have the towers in this county to be able to do that with. 11 So, we've talked to Don McFarland about that, and to one of 12 the ones heading up the Rio Grande deal, but that is a 13 possibility. It still may not help us and the City to 14 communicate. You know, I don't know, but it would be good to 15 go with digital, which maybe then we could, if you put them 16 in there to talk to. And so we're looking at some of that. 17 It's just going to hit us pretty quick on -- on what it's 18 going to do. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Did you say you've started 20 discussions with Don McFarland? 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Sure would be nice if the 24 City would communicate with us periodically about changes 25 they're going to make that are going to affect communications 4-28-08 113 1 between the two, and especially in this case, between two law 2 enforcement agencies. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Were we aware that they'd even 4 applied for a grant? Did the Chief -- 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: When I saw it in the paper 6 they got one for communications. I'm not -- I have known 7 that one of their employees -- or captain at one point had 8 worked for, like, Motorola or did something with them, and I 9 know he is very big in digital and wanted to go digital. 10 MS. HARGIS: They've been working on this for three 11 years, and converting the radios at about 300,000 a year so 12 that they could get to this point. Because I think there's 13 some mandate that requires them to be on a little sooner, I 14 think. Is it not any sooner? 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, everything is the same. 16 The other problem we have is the car radios and hand-held 17 radios all will also have to be changed, at a cost of right 18 at 2,000 each -- between 1,700 and 2,000 each. 19 MS. HARGIS: That's what they've been doing, 20 converting their radios or getting ready for this, and I 21 guess when they got the grant, they just decided to do it. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: That's the same grant that we were 23 advised about when I was in Washington last fall, and we 24 confirmed its funding several months ago when Congressman 25 Lamar Smith was here and made the announcement with regard to 4-28-08 114 1 the U.S.D.A. design and engineering, and also made the 2 presentation to the City. This is that same 370-something -- 3 $372,000 or something -- 352. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Something like that. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 6 MR. TROLINGER: Sheriff, your point is, at this 7 time, it's actually switching at the end of this year, and 8 you will not be able to communicate with them as of the end 9 of summer? 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: (Witness nodded.) 11 MR. TROLINGER: So, even if we start a project 12 right now, we'd be -- 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We're out of luck. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, they -- I mean -- 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Which is really going to be 16 bad, 'cause, see, D.P.S. went digital a number of years ago, 17 and so now D.P.S., with the way they can have theirs set up, 18 can monitor ours. Normally, they have -- they can listen, 19 but we cannot hear D.P.S.'s traffic. So -- we can hear it; 20 we cannot talk to them, and they cannot talk directly to us 21 from car to car unless they switch over. So, it's really 22 going to isolate the Sheriff's Office, is what it's going to 23 end up doing. And probably the -- I don't know; Roland and I 24 have haven't talked yet on what they're going to do. Hit a 25 lot sooner than five years down the road. 4-28-08 115 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do you have any good news 2 today? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No. Wait until executive 4 session. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: He does have a number of the -- of 6 the reversible plastic gloves. (Laughter.) 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That is good news. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: He told me that he personally has 9 some of those, and I think that's wonderful. 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, I didn't tell you I had 11 any of those, Judge. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: He'll be able to do the training for 13 his officers. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think that's wonderful. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other elected officials or 16 department heads? 17 MS. HYDE: You got two things that are going to be 18 on everyone's payroll this week. One is the increases on 19 FMLA; it goes up to 26 weeks with regard to military and 20 active duty personnel. So, when we had our TAC training a 21 couple weeks ago, they had this. We copied it. We're going 22 to use it. But the Department of Labor is still working on 23 the rest of the language, because the language is very 24 ambiguous and it's very wide. So, this is going to go on 25 everyone's paycheck, along with a repeat that everyone got 4-28-08 116 1 during open enrollment, what's covered by the Kerr County 2 prescription plan and how it works. We've had a couple of 3 issues with some folks that believed that they could go to 4 get their scrip filled, and if it's denied because it's not 5 covered, then somehow H.R. gets to decide what's going to be 6 approved and not approved. So, we're making sure that 7 everything goes back out so that the members can see -- our 8 employees can see, and if it's not covered, there is a 9 process that they have to go through, and it ends up back at 10 our provider, and our provider determines that. That's it. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 12 MR. EMERSON: When you get to the two point -- 13 Section 2 under executive, we have some information. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Who is "we," Rex? 15 MR. EMERSON: These two clowns right here. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You two guys? 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Of course. Who else? 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Are we going to do all the 20 executive session stuff prior to going to lunch, or are we 21 going to -- 22 JUDGE TINLEY: No, we're fixing to knock it out 23 here in about two seconds. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let's go. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Other than executive session 4-28-08 117 1 items, I show us not to have anything else open at this 2 point. At this time, it is 11:47, and we will go out of 3 closed or public session to go into executive or closed 4 session. 5 (The open session was closed at 11:47 a.m., and an executive session was held, the transcript of which 6 is contained in a separate document.) 7 - - - - - - - - - - 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, we'll come back into open or 9 public session at 12:33. Does any member of the Court have 10 anything to offer with respect to any matters considered in 11 executive session? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make a motion that we set 13 Kelly Hofer's step and grade at 19-6. Effective -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: May 1? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- May 1st. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 18 indicated. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 19 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Any other 24 matters to be offered for those items discussed in executive 25 session or otherwise? We'll be adjourned. 4-28-08 118 1 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 12:34 p.m.) 2 - - - - - - - - - - 3 4 5 STATE OF TEXAS | 6 COUNTY OF KERR | 7 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 8 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 9 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 10 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 11 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 2nd day of May, 2008. 12 13 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 14 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 15 Certified Shorthand Reporter 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 4-28-08