1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Budget Workshop 10 Wednesday, July 30, 2008 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X July 30, 2008 2 PAGE 3 Review and discuss FY 2008-09 Budgets and fiscal, capital expenditure and personnel matters related 4 thereto, for various County Departments, including, but not limited to the following departments: 5 County Court at Law 3 6 Adult Probation 7 District Clerk 10 7 Justice of the Peace 1, 2, 3 & 4 26 Constable 1, 2, 3 & 4 62 8 County Attorney 94 County Auditor 106 9 County Treasurer 114 Juvenile Detention Facility 117 10 Facilities/Maintenance 126 11 --- Adjourned 170 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 3 1 On Wednesday, July 30, 2008, at 9:00 a.m., a budget 2 workshop of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, why don't we come to order. 8 This is the Kerr County Commissioners Court workshop -- 9 budget workshop posted for this time and date, Wednesday, 10 July 30th, 2008, at 9 a.m. It is a bit past that time now. 11 The agenda today is to review and discuss FY 2008-09 budgets 12 and fiscal capital expenditure and personnel matters related 13 thereto for various county departments, including, but not 14 limited to, the following: County Court at Law, Adult 15 Probation, District Clerk, Justice of the Peace, Precincts 1, 16 2, 3, and 4, Constable, Precincts 1, 2, 3, and 4, County 17 Attorney, County Auditor, County Treasurer, Juvenile 18 Detention Facility, Facilities and Maintenance. Let's go 19 ahead and get started with County Court at Law. I think 20 everybody's up to speed on that one. Judge Brown? 21 JUDGE BROWN: Yes, sir. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: You're going to defer to your able 23 admin, probably? 24 JUDGE BROWN: Well, everything looks great to us. 25 There's three little items that are not a big deal. One of 7-30-08 bwk 4 1 them is a little bit important, but she'll tell you about the 2 three items, but one of them I think we really need to 3 address. The first one is that -- what -- 4 MS. GAULDEN: The first one is on office supplies. 5 The reason we requested a larger budget, we just had a new 6 copier installed in the courtroom, so we're looking at extra 7 toner cartridges and paper and all that. So, that -- that 8 might -- 9 JUDGE BROWN: What line item is that? 10 MS. GAULDEN: That's number 309. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 310. 12 MS. GAULDEN: I'm sorry, 310. 13 JUDGE BROWN: That's what -- what do you think we 14 need? 15 MS. GAULDEN: I would say maybe 1,400. 16 JUDGE BROWN: That's just a -- that's not -- I 17 mean, that's not life or death; it's just that we think 18 there's going to be an expense coming up. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Judge, I'm confused as to why -- I 20 don't recall plugging that in at 250, but if I did, I made a 21 serious mistake, because -- 22 JUDGE BROWN: No, wait. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: -- historically -- 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If you got it -- 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I'm in the wrong -- 7-30-08 bwk 5 1 JUDGE BROWN: We're in the wrong office supplies. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm in the wrong -- 3 MS. HYDE: Where's the AR? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm in the wrong budget. Here, let 5 me get to it. 6 JUDGE BROWN: Yeah. We -- I think we asked for 7 1,600, and you're giving us 1,200. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Yeah. 9 JUDGE BROWN: And we're fine with the 1,200, but we 10 may have to beg, borrow from Peter to pay Paul or whatever 11 you do. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's a good deal. 13 JUDGE BROWN: Yeah. But, anyway -- 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Long as there's some left to 15 give. 16 JUDGE BROWN: I just anticipate we're going to have 17 the expense. I just want you to be aware of it. 18 MS. GAULDEN: I don't think it's a major thing. If 19 we have to, we'll do a budget amendment. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: I did that based upon historical 21 expenditures of a high of, it's anticipated, 900. 22 JUDGE BROWN: We don't want to take up your time. 23 Now, here's another one that -- the second one's just -- 24 MS. GAULDEN: Line number 456, machine repair. 25 JUDGE BROWN: Machine repairs. What about that? 7-30-08 bwk 6 1 MS. GAULDEN: This estimate of 500 we got from 2 Kelly. She's going to be sending her machine out next week, 3 and -- 4 JUDGE BROWN: She sends it out every year. 5 MS. GAULDEN: This is based on her estimate as to 6 what it's going to cost, 'cause the -- 7 JUDGE BROWN: And that's going to definitely be an 8 expense. We know we're going to spend $500 on that. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. 10 JUDGE BROWN: That's all -- you know, that's -- 11 we're going to have to spend that for sure. Now, this other 12 one is what? 13 MS. GAULDEN: Statement of facts, Line 497. 14 JUDGE BROWN: That's a give-or-take deal, too. 15 MS. GAULDEN: That one I'm not too concerned about. 16 JUDGE BROWN: We have no way of knowing. We don't 17 have a crystal ball. It's fine at -- 500 is fine, but we may 18 have to borrow later. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: I understand, if there's a -- if 20 there's an indigent appeal that goes up, you got to do a 21 statement of facts, you -- 22 JUDGE BROWN: We don't have any control of that. 23 MS. GAULDEN: Right. 24 JUDGE BROWN: So, that's it. Everything else is 25 fine. 7-30-08 bwk 7 1 JUDGE TINLEY: But you stick so closely by the law 2 that the lawyers know that they're not going to -- 3 JUDGE BROWN: They know they've wasted their time, 4 yeah. Okay, thank you. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So you raised machine repair to 6 500? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: I did. I'm raising machine repair 8 to 500. Sure did. 9 JUDGE BROWN: Okay, that's it. Thank you. 10 MS. GAULDEN: Thank you. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Judge. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Tell you what. Do we have -- 13 we've got 1, 2, 3, but I don't see 4 in here. I was going to 14 go to J.P.'s. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did you notify them? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: I sent a courier out there to his 17 home. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Pigeon? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Pigeons? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 21 JUDGE MITCHELL: Judge, he's magistrating. He's on 22 call this week, so he might be here a little bit later. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. We'll give him a few 24 more minutes. Let's go to Adult Probation, then. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: County Attorney gave us candy. 7-30-08 bwk 8 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Huh? 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Where is that? 3 MR. RUARK: 571. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 71? 5 MR. RUARK: Yeah. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think there's a whole lot 7 there. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tell me what page. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What page did you say, Ken? 10 MR. RUARK: 571. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That would be fund -- I'll 12 get there. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't see it on 71. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Page 57. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 67? 16 MR. RUARK: 57. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 57. Seems like we could get 18 a little help with this stuff. Twenty-five staff members, 19 and five of us. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: There's not a whole lot we can do 21 there, because most of those expenses are pretty well fixed. 22 They're utilities and rent, are the major items. We've got 23 the DOEP instructor. How did we end up with the 11,000? 24 Year-end projection is 8,700. Has that contract increased? 25 MS. DAVIS: DOEP instructor is actually funds that 7-30-08 bwk 9 1 we pay you to run that program for us. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3 MS. DAVIS: So that's the money that we have in 4 that line item, but we project we're probably only going to 5 use the 8,500 out of that. But if he does need an instructor 6 to teach classes that he doesn't already have scheduled, 7 which fluctuate depending on how many people we have that 8 need the class, that -- 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. That funding -- 10 MS. DAVIS: That funding is out -- it comes through 11 us. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: And then you turn it over to us? 13 MS. DAVIS: Yes, and then you pay him out of that. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 15 MS. DAVIS: Right. So it's not coming out of the 16 county -- 17 JUDGE TINLEY: $11,000. 18 MS. DAVIS: Yes. That's from the state. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: That's a wash, then. 20 MS. DAVIS: Yes. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: For our budget purposes. 22 MS. DAVIS: Doesn't have anything to do with y'all 23 at all. You just funnel it through and pay it for us. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Why is the rent going down? 25 MS. DAVIS: Going down? It went up to 35,910, is 7-30-08 bwk 10 1 what I put in there. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The projected year-end is 4 higher than that. That's the reason I asked. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Could be the way they're paid. 6 That projected year-end is just a mathematical calculation. 7 MS. DAVIS: I just asked for exactly what it should 8 be for the year. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. That contract, if you'll 10 recall, was renegotiated, I think, last year. And -- 11 (Discussion off the record.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: But everything else is pretty 13 innocuous, as I see it. 14 MS. DAVIS: Okay. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Any member of the Court have 16 anything else that they want to -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, looks good. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: -- throw into that mix? Okay. 19 Thank you. Appreciate it. 20 MS. DAVIS: Thank you. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll go to District Clerk. That's 22 sure a lot of money you're spending there, Ms. Uecker. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can you get us to the same 24 page too, please? 25 MS. UECKER: Do what? 7-30-08 bwk 11 1 MR. RUARK: Page 25. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 25. 3 MS. UECKER: Just a couple of little -- a few 4 concerns. Let me start out with the maintenance contracts, 5 which is 457. You've got 3,200. We can reduce that to 6 2,000. 457, yeah. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Done. 457 goes to 2,000. 8 MS. UECKER: 2,000 instead of 3,200. I'm a little 9 bit concerned about the postage, with the increase in the 10 postage, how that's going to do us for next year. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is there another 12 anticipated increase, or is it just the one -- 13 MS. HYDE: Yes. 14 MS. UECKER: There is, yes. You've got 15 recommended, 1,720. And, you know, I don't know what the 16 number should be. Maybe 19. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think it's got 20 on there. 18 MS. UECKER: Is it 20? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: I've got 20 in there. 20 MS. UECKER: Okay. Oh, that's right, you and I did 21 talk about that. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 23 MS. UECKER: Okay, nevermind. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Historically, you're 25 projected to go out at 18 this year, which means with the 7-30-08 bwk 12 1 postage increase, that -- 2 MS. UECKER: Let's see. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That should more than cover 4 it. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Hopefully. 6 MS. UECKER: I think it will. I think it will. 7 Overtime, I'm in the hole right now on overtime. And as I've 8 told some of you, that, you know, right now, I have filed 9 more cases criminal and civil, and this all goes with, you 10 know, Rusty's problem, too. If Rusty has a problem, then 11 I've got a problem, because inmates become cases, and -- but 12 anyway, we have filed more cases at the end of June than we 13 did all of last year in civil, and almost the same in 14 criminal. And, you know, I've been trying to do everything I 15 can not to ask for a new employee. I don't want a new 16 employee, so the way I've been able to do that is utilize my 17 overtime line item. And right now, I'm out, and I'd like -- 18 I had 1,200 -- yeah, 1,200 in that. If I could bump that up 19 to 2,000, I think -- 20 JUDGE TINLEY: That's what it is. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You got 2,000. 22 MS. UECKER: Oh, okay. 23 MS. HYDE: That's what's in the administration. 24 That's what you're looking at, isn't it? 25 MR. RUARK: Yeah. 7-30-08 bwk 13 1 MS. UECKER: Okay. Well, my latest printout 2 didn't -- okay. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I anticipated all of these needs. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. And this 5 conversation. 6 MS. UECKER: Yeah. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just keep going here. 8 MS. UECKER: And the Judge and I had already talked 9 about the records preservation. What do you have there for 10 records preservation? 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Seven. 12 MS. UECKER: Okay. That's the one you and I talked 13 about. That needs to go back up, probably, to -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Coming out of that dedicated 15 account? 16 MS. UECKER: Yeah. And we were going to talk about 17 maybe moving all of that to that dedicated account, and I 18 think -- see, there's two accounts that we can take that out 19 of. One of them is just for the District Clerk's fund, just 20 for District Clerk. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 22 MS. UECKER: There's another one that I put money 23 into and Jannett puts money into, and I think maybe even the 24 J.P.'s. I'm not sure about that. That's for use for the 25 whole county, including the Commissioners Court, the Auditor, 7-30-08 bwk 14 1 H.R., I.T., everybody. In looking back in the last couple of 2 years, I'm the only one that has used those funds. And 3 there's, like, almost $70,000 in that fund right now. In the 4 one that I have, I think there's about 12 or 13, which would 5 take care of that line item. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: This request was eight, as I recall. 7 MS. UECKER: Yeah. And -- you know, and that -- 8 I'd love to reduce that, but that is what it is. I mean, if 9 you have more cases, you know, I can't preserve some records 10 and not others. We're already doing everything we can to 11 reduce that cost. I mean, it could be a lot higher, but 12 because of our efforts, we're -- you know, we have reduced 13 that projected amount. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, what my suggestion to you was, 15 Ms. Uecker, that we take that line item, we not take any 16 funds from the -- from your general fund budget. 17 MS. UECKER: Okay. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: And use those dedicated funds for 19 exactly what they're intended for. 20 MS. UECKER: Okay. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: And whether it's 7,000 or 8,000, we 22 zero it out here, and we -- we take that expenditure out of 23 that dedicated -- one of those dedicated funds, whichever is 24 appropriate. And if there's $70,000 that's sitting there in 25 a common fund, and it hasn't -- 7-30-08 bwk 15 1 MS. UECKER: Nobody's used it. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: You know, what's that? 10 percent 3 of it. 4 MS. UECKER: Yeah. I used it -- 5 JUDGE TINLEY: That replenishes with each case 6 filing, so there's more money coming in all the time. 7 MS. UECKER: I have used it. As y'all know, I used 8 that fund to finish my digitizing all of our old records last 9 year. And, let me tell you, I really appreciate y'all 10 allowing me to do that, because that effort alone, I think, 11 has allowed me to do with the staff that I have. We're 12 working smarter, we're working faster, and we've stream -- 13 that has streamlined everything so much. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: You're not having to go pull any 15 paper copies; you can go straight to your computer -- 16 MS. UECKER: We don't even have to get up from our 17 desk. That has been the best money that we have spent, and 18 John can tell you as well. I also want to tell -- to tell 19 you how much I appreciate your view on what that fund is for. 20 I got to tell you, I get calls every day from clerks. "How 21 can I get my records preservation money? The Commissioners 22 won't let me have it. They're spending it on themselves." 23 MS. HYDE: Oh. 24 MS. UECKER: Yeah. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: On themselves? 7-30-08 bwk 16 1 MS. UECKER: Oh, yeah. I can't tell you how many 2 calls I'm getting, and I don't know what to tell them. I'm 3 just saying, "Well," you know, "I'm able to use mine for the 4 purpose for which it's intended." But they're stretching the 5 definition of records preservation, you know, to all kinds of 6 things, and the horror stories I hear. So, I really 7 appreciate y'all for -- 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, let's zero that one out. 9 MS. UECKER: Certainly. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: And where are we going to take it? 11 MS. UECKER: What, 33 or 28? Which one? Mine is 12 33, I think, and the county one is 28. Isn't that right? 13 MS. HARGIS: I think that's right. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: That's a special fund with -- 15 MR. RUARK: 33? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Fund 28. 17 MS. UECKER: Okay. Mine is 33, and it's got 14,940 18 in it. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, District Records Management. 20 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. If we take it from 33, then we 21 can -- 22 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm showing that there's five. 23 MS. UECKER: Well, that's what we had budgeted. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 25 MS. UECKER: The other project that I have been 7-30-08 bwk 17 1 working on is protecting all of the handwritten pre-1900 up 2 to about the '20's documents that are so fine and delicate 3 and sensitive. And although they're -- they have all been 4 scanned, I mean, they're on PaperVision, but to actually 5 preserve them for the future, the other project I've been 6 working on that I've been just taking that $5,000 for is to 7 put those into mylar sleeves so that people that do come look 8 at them don't actually touch the documents. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, that's more of an archival. 10 MS. UECKER: Right. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: So let's take it from somewhere 12 else. 13 MS. UECKER: Take what from somewhere else? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's take this $7,000 or $8,000, 15 whatever you want to do on -- 16 MS. UECKER: Okay. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: -- records preservation, unless 18 that's what your 8,000 was intended for? 19 MS. UECKER: No. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 21 MS. UECKER: No. The 8,000, which actually should 22 be nine, 'cause I can see a huge increase in paper coming 23 across. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Then where do we go, Fund 28? 25 MS. UECKER: Why don't we take it from 28, then? 7-30-08 bwk 18 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But Records Preservation in 2 your budget goes to zero? Is that what you're telling us? 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Yep, in the general fund budget. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 5 MS. HARGIS: Okay, with the 9,000 in Records 6 Preservation 33, and then take the five out of archival? Is 7 that right? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: That shows old records preservation, 9 microfilm expense. Where are you going to plug it in here? 10 MS. UECKER: I don't know the difference between -- 11 I don't think there's that big a difference between those two 12 funds, other than the fact that one of them is dedicated to 13 District Clerk and the other one is county-wide. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, but there's more money in 28, 15 isn't there? 16 MS. UECKER: Right, there's a lot more money in 28. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: So, are we going to increase the 18 10,000 in Fund 28-635, the Old Records Preservation line of 19 10,000, are we going to increase that to 19,000? Is that 20 what you're telling me? 21 MS. UECKER: I think so, yes. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 23 MS. HARGIS: So, you want to take it out of all of 24 our -- out of 28 and nothing out of 33? I want to get this 25 clear. 7-30-08 bwk 19 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That's right. I've changed 2 28-635-411 to 19,000, and increased it 9,000. 3 MS. HARGIS: Go to 28. 4 MR. RUARK: I added $7,000 to this one. 5 MS. HARGIS: No, they're saying don't take anything 6 out of that fund at all. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Zero out the seven. I've already 8 done that. 9 MS. HARGIS: Zero that one out as well. 10 MS. UECKER: You're zeroing out what, 33? 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 12 MS. UECKER: Okay. So we're just going to let that 13 14,000 -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: No, I'm not zeroing out 33; I'm 15 zeroing out the -- in your general fund. 16 MS. UECKER: Okay. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Fund 10, District Clerk account, and 18 I'm moving it all to 28. 19 MS. UECKER: Moving it all to 28. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: And, as you requested, increasing it 21 to $9,000 instead of your original request of eight that I 22 reduced to seven. 23 MS. UECKER: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So Records Management, Fund 28, 25 is 19,000. Fund 33 is 5,000. Right? 7-30-08 bwk 20 1 JUDGE TINLEY: It remains at 5,000. 2 MS. UECKER: Yeah. He zeroed it out. I think it 3 needs to stay at five. 4 MS. HYDE: He did -- he put it back in. 5 MS. HARGIS: 28 goes to five? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: 33 stays at 5,000. 7 MR. RUARK: That's what we've done. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 9 MS. HARGIS: And 28 -- 10 MS. UECKER: Goes to 19. Okay. 11 MS. HARGIS: 19 or -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 19. 28's at 19. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: You got anything else on yours, 14 Ms. Uecker? 15 MS. UECKER: The only other thing -- I probably 16 need some advice on how to handle this. I've got -- as all 17 of you know, except with the exception of one person in my 18 office, everybody's cross-trained to do the same thing. And, 19 you know, in light of the fact that we're requesting the 20 10 percent, which, you know, we're trying to do everything we 21 can to keep our budget so we can accomplish that, I have one 22 employee that does the same thing as everybody else that's 23 sitting down there at a 14. I have always thought that, 24 other than my one person that doesn't do everything, and the 25 chief deputy, that everybody else probably ought to be at -- 7-30-08 bwk 21 1 on the same step, just different grade, based on their 2 experience and their responsibilities. But this one person 3 that I've got that's still at a 14 is doing the same thing as 4 the 15's. So, I'm not necessarily asking for an increase in 5 her salary, just to kind of unify what their positions are. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: She's a 14 what? 7 MS. UECKER: She's a 14 -- she's a 14-3, and I was 8 asking -- I was actually asking for a 1 percent increase -- 9 or a one-step increase, but that was before the 10 percent. 10 But I would like to move her to a 15, whatever the equivalent 11 is. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 15-2? 13 MS. UECKER: The 15-2. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Did we do away with the half steps? 15 We still got those? 16 MS. HYDE: We're trying to do away with the half 17 steps, except for law enforcement. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Between each grade? 19 MS. HYDE: There's still a half step. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: There's two and a half? 21 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: So, if she's at a 14-3 and we move 23 her to 15-2, it's a wash? 24 MS. HYDE: Should be a wash. 25 MS. UECKER: Should be a wash. And then that would 7-30-08 bwk 22 1 be before the -- yeah, okay. And, you know, it's probably -- 2 it's a psychological thing, I think, for her, 'cause, you 3 know, she knows she's doing everything that everybody else is 4 doing, and it's just, you know, within the office, the -- the 5 worker bees -- you know, this person -- yeah, I've got two 6 people that are responsible for criminal, but they can do 7 everything else. I've got two people that are responsible 8 for most of the civil, but they can do criminal and 9 everything else. I've got one person that's basically in 10 charge of keeping all of the family stuff going, but she does 11 everything else. So, you know, I've always kind of had a 12 problem with putting them in different step and grades. 13 MS. HYDE: 15-1. 14 MS. UECKER: Is it a 15? 15 MS. HYDE: It' 15-1. I said 2; it's 15-1. She's a 16 14-3. She'd go to a 15-1 to be the same, and then she would 17 get her normal increase. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: By virtue of the half step stuff, 19 there's two and a half to a half step, and then another two 20 and a half to the full step, so that -- okay. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, you're changing a person 22 from a 14-something to a -- 23 MS. UECKER: 15-1. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- 15-1, and that's going to 25 make her happy, and she doesn't get a penny more but that? 7-30-08 bwk 23 1 MS. UECKER: I think it will. It's just, you know, 2 common sense. It's just -- she's doing the same job as 3 everybody else. Why not? You know. 4 MS. HYDE: That's the last one in her office that 5 needs to fall into the job descriptions. Let me try to help. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Does she get any more money? 7 MS. HYDE: No, not this time. She'll get 8 whatever -- whatever is determined by the Court. 9 MR. TROLINGER: Isn't that advancement potential 10 too? 11 MS. HYDE: Yes. 12 MR. TROLINGER: Longevity gives you that potential 13 to -- 14 MS. HYDE: But you have three steps -- you have 15 three different grades in this office. You've got a chief, 16 you've got middle, and then you have an entry level position 17 that does nothing else but scanning of forms. So, there's a 18 delineation between those jobs. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't see any problem with it. 20 MS. UECKER: Okay. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Probably from a morale standpoint, 22 it has some benefit, but otherwise it's a wash. 23 MS. UECKER: Mm-hmm. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 25 MS. UECKER: The only other thing is employee 7-30-08 bwk 24 1 training. Now, we've been advocating getting the training 2 for our employees, and, you know, it's tough to do that for, 3 you know, six people on $1,000. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, this shows that's what you 5 requested, I think. 6 MS. UECKER: I know. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 8 MS. UECKER: So I'm wondering if we could maybe up 9 that 500 or -- 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there a way that you could 11 take some of that out of some of the Records Preservation 12 funds? 13 MS. UECKER: Well, probably so, Jonathan. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: That's a real good point. 16 MS. UECKER: Depending on what type of training it 17 is. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, then it just comes out 19 of that line item for 19,000. 20 MS. UECKER: Okay. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Or we could increase, I mean, 22 your -- 23 MS. UECKER: Yeah, that's stretching it. And, 24 actually, that's the stretch that I was talking about that 25 the other commissioners are using for themselves. 7-30-08 bwk 25 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, Ms. Uecker, I want to put you 2 on notice that -- 3 MS. UECKER: You're going to be -- 4 JUDGE TINLEY: -- I'm -- I'm working on cataloging 5 my personal papers. (Laughter.) 6 MS. UECKER: Okay. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: And so I'm planning on using that 8 fund, you know, to do that. 9 MS. UECKER: Don't laugh. That's what these guys 10 are doing. I'm telling you, that's what they're doing. And 11 I'm just -- it just blows my mind that they -- boy, that's a 12 stretch. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I can hardly keep up with what's 14 before me, much less trying to think about cataloging 15 anything. 16 MS. UECKER: Are we going to leave that at 1,000, 17 then? 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Be creative. 19 MS. UECKER: All right. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: You've been at this game for 30 21 years, Ms. Uecker. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Forty. 23 MS. UECKER: Forty. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: You of all people can certainly be 25 creative in finding appropriate sources of funding if you 7-30-08 bwk 26 1 want to get there. 2 MS. UECKER: But I'm also honest, you know. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Nothing dishonest about that. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: As I recall, you're the one, when it 5 came to county liability concerning use of personal vehicles, 6 that -- that authored the deception solution. 7 MS. HYDE: Oh. 8 MS. UECKER: Yeah. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: But that's okay. That's okay. I 10 like it, personally. 11 MS. UECKER: Yeah, okay. Yeah, that was my idea. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? 13 MS. UECKER: I think that's it. Thank you. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Thank you. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Now we're going to go to 17 J.P.'s. 18 MR. BILLEITER: Yes. J.P. 1. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What page, Ken? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 26. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 26. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Next page. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. What did I do to you that you 25 don't like? 7-30-08 bwk 27 1 MR. BILLEITER: I don't know. 2 MR. RUARK: Do you need to see this, David? Do you 3 want to see your requested? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We lowered telephone, $150. 5 MR. BILLEITER: Okay. One thing that -- on the 6 part-time salary, which I submitted a letter back some time 7 ago to -- all four J.P.'s met to discuss budget issues, and 8 all of us thought it would be in our best interest to employ 9 a full-time floater to float between the different offices, 10 which would do away with the part-time salary, but this would 11 be a full-time person. They would float between the two 12 offices -- or between the four offices, primarily Precinct 1 13 and Precinct 3, 'cause we have the most paperwork. My office 14 is flooded with truancy issues. I just left the office, and 15 Elsa said we've got to buy stamps. Well, this is -- we've 16 been out of stamp money for two months already, so I'm having 17 to go and -- and I'm going to take it out of conferences in 18 order to buy stamps, 'cause we've probably got 30 or 40 show 19 cause letters that we're mailing out. But our paperwork is 20 -- it's just grown. It's phenomenal how much paperwork we 21 run. 22 The floater, we believe it would benefit the county 23 in the following ways. First of all, the employee would be 24 trained and efficient. The employee would be able to step 25 into the clerk's position in the event of a vacancy, and the 7-30-08 bwk 28 1 employee would be able to fill in for clerk vacation time, 2 clerk training, and sick leave. The employee would be able 3 to assist our offices on a weekly basis. $960 in part-time 4 salary, unless you want me to close my office, just won't cut 5 it. On vacation, I have -- my clerk has vacation time, sick 6 leave, and then she has to attend schools. We're completely 7 out of money on this as far as part-time salary's concerned, 8 so I don't know what the Court wants to do there. And I 9 don't know what you've done as far as the rest of my request. 10 I requested an increase in office supplies. This is due to 11 the large volume of paperwork that we have to mail out, 12 envelopes, professional paper. Asking for an increase in 13 publications and dues, telephone, and for conferences. My 14 clerk actually spent more than I did this year on 15 conferences, and I failed to attend one because we didn't 16 have enough money for it. My clerk spent $1,047 on training 17 and conferences, which she needs. She needs the training. 18 She needs to go to these things. Where did you chop me? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, let's talk about some of these 20 things. 21 MR. BILLEITER: Okay. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: I have plugged in your increase in 23 conferences. 24 MR. BILLEITER: Mm-hmm. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Your telephone, I have decreased to 7-30-08 bwk 29 1 250, primarily based upon the historical use. The projected 2 year end for you was 158. We're on a master contract for 3 cell phone use, which we put that in place in the last year, 4 which helps. 5 MR. BILLEITER: Which I'm not using, so -- 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Pardon? 7 MR. BILLEITER: I don't use it. I don't have a 8 cell phone. I don't have a county cell phone. That's my 9 choice. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: That's even better. 11 MR. BILLEITER: That's my choice. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that's even better. But the 13 historical use is what caused me to reduce that. 14 MR. BILLEITER: That's fine. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: On your office supplies, actually, 16 you requested 2,000 according to what I'm showing here. 17 MR. BILLEITER: That's right. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: And that's plugged in. That's okay. 19 MR. BILLEITER: Okay. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Your postage, I approved what you 21 requested. Now, you may need more, based upon what you just 22 told us. 23 MR. BILLEITER: That's true. We don't know what 24 the next year -- 25 JUDGE TINLEY: About $1,200? 7-30-08 bwk 30 1 MR. BILLEITER: That would be great. I don't know 2 what the next year is going to hold. We have a couple -- I 3 hear all the truancy cases for K.I.S.D. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, I understand that. 5 MS. WILLIAMS: I was going to mention to David, I 6 know that the J.P.'s can't afford a postage meter, but if you 7 run into a bind where you're out of stamps or something, come 8 down and use our postage meter. We can just do a journal 9 entry between budgets, move the money out of yours into ours, 10 and that would save you from having to be behind. You can 11 get your mail out. We'll run it through our postage meter. 12 MR. BILLEITER: Okay. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Still going to have to be charged to 14 him, though. 15 MS. WILLIAMS: Right, but this way -- 16 MR. BILLEITER: Got to come from somewhere. 17 MS. WILLIAMS: But, I mean, this would save them, 18 too. I don't know if you have to put more stamps on your 19 mail than what it actually costs. If you're doing stamps, a 20 lot of times you have to. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, and you overpay. 22 MS. WILLIAMS: Yeah. 23 MR. BILLEITER: Yeah. 24 MS. WILLIAMS: So, that's an option for you. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Increase that to 1,200. 7-30-08 bwk 31 1 MR. BILLEITER: And I don't know what y'all want to 2 do about the floater. I mean, that would -- if we don't get 3 a floater, I need an increase there for part-time help. If 4 we do get a floater, we don't need it at all. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How much of an increase if 6 you don't get a floater? 7 MR. BILLEITER: I asked for -- 8 JUDGE TINLEY: 960. 9 MR. BILLEITER: No, that's not what I asked for. I 10 don't know what -- that's what last year's was, and I 11 asked -- I don't know if I asked for anything there. 12 Depending on what we did on this. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Would a -- 14 MR. BILLEITER: But I think I figured just to cover 15 her vacation time, sick leave, and conferences would be 16 around $3,400. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Would a part-time employee that 18 floats work? 19 MR. BILLEITER: It could. I mean, I don't -- 20 MS. HYDE: One of the things that we had talked 21 about, and hopefully they won't throw tomatoes at me this 22 time, is if you put in a full-time employee that is shared 23 amongst the four J.P.'s -- y'all aren't dumb; you know you 24 got four J.P.'s, four J.P. coordinators. Four times two is 25 eight weeks of vacation. Each of them have got at least two 7-30-08 bwk 32 1 weeks worth of conferences or training, so, you know, you 2 take them on up to 16 weeks. Well, there's 52 weeks in a 3 year, so what are they going to do the rest of the time? And 4 that's a good return on investment, trying to figure out what 5 are they going to do. One of the things that we had talked 6 about was perhaps putting them in the base here, allow them 7 to do that, but also cross-train them upstairs in the 8 District Clerk's Office, which is also doing some of that 9 work with an employee currently, so that the J.P.'s control 10 it, but they've got a spot if they need a spot to fill. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I just -- I know 12 that -- I think it was last year, J.P. 3 asked for a second 13 person. 14 MS. HYDE: Right. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And it's primarily because of 16 the way the boundaries are drawn; 3 and 1 do a lot more -- 17 have a lot more paperwork. 18 MS. HYDE: Right. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Largely to do with traffic 20 tickets and things of that nature. Well, 4 -- I mean, kind 21 of, I think there's a need. I think that there is a problem 22 in our J.P.s' offices, having them all basically two-people 23 offices, and I think that needs to be addressed. You know, 24 under the current budget, I have a hard time seeing how we 25 can afford a full-time floater. But for right now, we're 7-30-08 bwk 33 1 spending -- if you add up the budgets, you got $5,000 in 2 part-time. Y'all are saying you need more than that anyway, 3 so you get to the point, you know, rather than just have a -- 4 it makes more sense to get a qualified person that's here 5 during regular hours, even if it's just a part-time basis, 6 but they come to work, you know, three days a week, whatever 7 y'all work on. To me, that makes a lot more sense. 8 MR. BILLEITER: Anything would be a help to us. My 9 clerk's covered up in paperwork. You should see the stack of 10 show causes that she's mailing out right now for truancy, 11 which that's a big item in our office, so anything would be 12 appreciated there. Part-time. We have a girl coming in 13 doing community service that's helping us some, which we have 14 to be very careful what she can and can't do, so it would be 15 good to have somebody trained. And the other problem we have 16 is when we have a fill-in, sometimes they can make -- because 17 they're not trained -- we have one that's very efficient, and 18 -- and you know who it is, Jon. But we have one that messed 19 up on one of our evictions, and so that's due to lack of 20 training. Not any fault of hers; she just was not trained. 21 So, if we had someone who was trained that could float 22 between offices, yeah, anytime we didn't need her, yeah, you 23 could have her or him or whatever. 24 MS. HYDE: They also should be bonded. That was 25 one of the issues, about bonding, because their offices take 7-30-08 bwk 34 1 money, and they are in all those files, all that top-secret 2 stuff that everybody else isn't supposed to know, so that was 3 the other issue. And a lot of people don't want to work 4 part-time, where it's kind of catch-as-catch-can. So, we try 5 to do something where -- where it could be dual-utilized for 6 vacation coverage and the training from all four, 'cause they 7 basically use the same system, do things the same way, 8 collect -- collect the money the same way, but they can be 9 bonded and have a key to the courthouse, versus what we were 10 kind of doing before. Right, David? 11 MR. BILLEITER: That's right. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: To me, not necessarily only 13 with the J.P.'s; all the other offices have the same problem 14 with vacations and -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- and illness and whatever. 17 So, if we're going to do this, we ought to do it to where it 18 could benefit more than just one group. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just have a permanent 21 floater that goes between Collections and J.P.'s? 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't see any way around 23 it. Otherwise, you're going to be paying part-times that you 24 can't find, and, you know, there just is not -- evidently, 25 from what Ms. Hyde says, there's not many that want to work 7-30-08 bwk 35 1 part-time. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Could you -- 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Hyde, what about our retiree 4 pool of people? Is there not adequate interest in some of 5 the -- some of the -- 6 MS. HYDE: There's interest. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: -- retirees that come here wanting 8 to occupy themselves to do a little part-time work? 9 MS. HYDE: There's interest, but they don't -- oh, 10 man. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They don't want to work on 12 our schedule. 13 MR. BILLEITER: They're retirees, right. They 14 don't want to work. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They don't want to work. 16 MS. HYDE: But we also need -- we -- on a different 17 note, I'm already -- I'm already in the middle. We need some 18 skill sets that -- that -- 19 MR. BILLEITER: Yes. 20 MS. HYDE: -- sometimes haven't been fully trained 21 and utilized by retirees. So -- I mean, we need 22 computer-literate folks, and that is kind of hurting us. And 23 by "computer-literate," I'm not just talking about plugging 24 away on the computer. They can add and subtract, which just 25 about anyone can do. But even if we use a floater throughout 7-30-08 bwk 36 1 the offices, they're still going to have to be trained. 2 There's different things in Ms. Pieper's office versus 3 Ms. Bolin's office versus the J.P.s' offices. The good news 4 is, they're all on Odyssey right now, so if we can find 5 Odyssey work that all of them can do, then we can cross-train 6 them throughout so they could be a true floater throughout 7 the courthouse. I don't think that they could go out to the 8 Sheriff's Office, because they have all those other rules for 9 law enforcement. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If you had a permanent 11 floater, where would you base that person? 12 MS. HYDE: You just -- well, I would base it to 13 start with upstairs in the District Clerk. And that way, the 14 J.P.'s and the District Clerk are doing the same things. And 15 not that they work for the District Clerk; they work for, 16 right now, the courthouse, but that is a big job to learn to 17 start them out at. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think I would base them in 19 the J.P.'s somewhere, J.P. 1 or 3. And I think -- 'cause the 20 J.P.'s -- there's a -- I know there's a need. 21 MS. HYDE: Yes. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And there's -- those are 23 two-people offices. 24 MR. BILLEITER: Yeah, that's right. When my 25 clerk's gone, we don't have anybody that can take over. 7-30-08 bwk 37 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So if we're going to have a 2 floater base, I'd rather base it in the J.P.'s office. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There's times when the 4 Collections Department can use a person. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sure. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Jody, every once in a while, 7 could probably use some help. I mean, you know, Bruce is 8 right. You know, you can expand this thing till the cows 9 come home. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I got -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Whatever that means. I 12 never did understand that. 13 MS. HYDE: The District Clerk, they have the space; 14 they have a computer, so they don't have to buy anything. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Hyde, is it your recommendation, 16 based upon all of the relevant personnel factors, that where 17 we need to go on this issue is a full-time person that's a 18 floater, not just for the J.P.'s, but -- 19 MS. HYDE: Right. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: -- but for other offices, so that -- 21 MS. HYDE: Right. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: -- that individual can be trained 23 and so forth? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How do you charge this 25 person's expense? 7-30-08 bwk 38 1 MS. HYDE: Well, we'd have to work with the 2 Auditor, because wherever they work -- just like we do right 3 now, if you have someone that comes in and works, when we pay 4 them, we pay them by line item. So, however the Auditor 5 would want us to set it up, that's how we would do it. 6 They'd have to turn in a payroll, and we would pay them by 7 that line item, or we can have a -- be up to her, if we put 8 it in a separate line item so that it shows. Put it in mine? 9 Mine? Okay. 10 MS. HARGIS: That -- yeah. To be honest with you, 11 I would rather have it in your department, so that you... 12 MS. HYDE: Okay. 13 MS. HARGIS: And it's a neutral place for each 14 department to call to say, "I need someone," and to -- also 15 to schedule it. I think, you know, there probably might be a 16 little scheduling problem that we would need to deal with, 17 but I can't put the line item everywhere, so if we just put 18 it in the Human Resource department as a floater for the 19 entire courthouse. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Either there or 21 Nondepartmental, one or the other, so that you charge it off 22 in one place and you're not sitting there spreading things 23 around. 24 MS. HARGIS: I can't. That's not -- 25 JUDGE MITCHELL: I can see a problem with this 7-30-08 bwk 39 1 already. Each of the departments is going to -- we have 2 somebody that's going, "Okay, I'm sorry, I'm already booked 3 for this department," and then we're going to have to go 4 hunting for somebody else anyway. I just don't see it 5 working. And that's just my opinion." 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, thank you. Judge Wright? 7 JUDGE WRIGHT: Yes. Another thing, we don't have 8 that big a selection for our schools for our clerks to go to, 9 and usually there's two or three of them going to the same 10 school. Who gets the part-time help? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, forget it. Let's 12 leave it the way it is. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Just let y'all fend for yourselves 14 and fight for yourselves, I guess. 15 MR. BILLEITER: I guess we didn't all agree to 16 this, then. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Apparently not. 18 MR. BILLEITER: We did at the time. 19 JUDGE WRIGHT: Initially, I did agree with it. I 20 thought it was a great idea. 21 MR. BILLEITER: Okay. In that case, I need more 22 part-time salary. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: The concern about two clerks going 24 to the same school, even if it's assigned exclusively for the 25 J.P.'s, that's not going to work. So -- 7-30-08 bwk 40 1 MS. HYDE: The thought process had been, when we 2 all -- when David had talked to me -- excuse me, Judge 3 Billeiter had talked to me about it, was that if they -- 4 typically, there's two of them that go to a conference at a 5 time, so then you would combine. There would be some sort of 6 note; there would be something where, wherever that one 7 person is at, everything would float through that one person, 8 so that neither office would be, you know, out. Because 9 they're typically going to -- 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, if -- if the alternative that 11 is being suggested by those that Judge Billeiter thought were 12 in agreement, but apparently were not in agreement, is that 13 an additional clerical employee be added to each office, I 14 don't know what the feeling of the other members of the Court 15 is, but I don't see that going anywhere, myself. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't either. 17 JUDGE MITCHELL: That's not what I'm saying either. 18 I don't want another employee. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm kind of like the -- 20 MR. BILLEITER: I just want to increase my 21 part-time help, then. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 23 MR. BILLEITER: That will work for me. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right. Well, let's talk 25 about that. 7-30-08 bwk 41 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's have a serious 3 conversation here. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What would you like to have? 5 It's at 960 right now. 6 MR. BILLEITER: Yeah, and that -- I'm out of that. 7 Like I say, my clerk -- if she's gone to school and on 8 vacation, takes sick leave, it amounts to, like, $3,400. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How is this number 10 projected, year-end? 11 JUDGE TINLEY: 960? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. How did that -- is 13 that really a projected year-end? 14 MR. RUARK: What -- 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Current budget's 960. 16 MR. RUARK: What happens, it takes the current 17 budget you're in, and we go out and it just multiplies how 18 many months are remaining, takes whatever the balance is at 19 that point in time and just projects it. So, the problem 20 with that is that if you have -- if you don't have even 21 dollar amounts every month, the projection can be wrong. 22 That's the issue with that. And it does it for everybody, 23 for all -- 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It would be kind of neat if 25 this number could be an actual number. You know, if he's -- 7-30-08 bwk 42 1 if he's gone over by $500, to -- for this number to reflect 2 that there. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The year-to-date has the actual 4 number. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: 882, yeah. 6 MR. BILLEITER: That's all been spent, though. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, he's going to go over; 8 there's no question. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understood him to say he's 11 already spent the 960. 12 MR. BILLEITER: Yes. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: The current request of 960 may have 14 been a default number, too. It may have been carried forward 15 from the current budget amount. I think it's maybe a default 16 number. But either way -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How much have you spent? 18 MR. BILLEITER: I don't know. Of course, Elsa 19 hasn't gone on vacation, so that's helped. 20 MR. RUARK: I can tell you. 21 MR. BILLEITER: She may take a vacation day every 22 once in a while, but I know we've used it all. In fact, I 23 think last time we had to have an amendment to -- or maybe we 24 had -- $70 or $80. I don't know for sure. 25 MS. HARGIS: $78. 7-30-08 bwk 43 1 MR. BILLEITER: $78. 2 MS. HYDE: $78. 3 MR. BILLEITER: $78, I think, that's been spent. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What, over? 5 MR. RUARK: He's not over yet. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: He has $78 left? 7 MR. RUARK: Yeah. 8 MS. HYDE: That's it. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, the 828 is an actual 10 number, then. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, you'd indicated that 12 3,400 would cover your expense? 13 MR. BILLEITER: That would cover vacation time, 14 sick leave, and conferences. Of course, if she isn't sick, I 15 mean, that's great. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's setting aside the 17 unknown of sick leave. 3,400. Is that number also good for 18 J.P. 3? J.P. 2? J.P. -- 19 JUDGE MITCHELL: I don't want that. I don't want 20 that. I want to stick with my 1,600. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. We're not going to 22 give it to you if you don't want it. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I would say 2,000, see 24 where it goes. 25 MR. BILLEITER: Okay, that will work. Okay. 7-30-08 bwk 44 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Go to two? 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3 (electronic noise.) 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That sounds like a jackpot. 5 MR. BILLEITER: I do have court in a little bit, so 6 I appreciate you. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: That's a signal that the hook is 8 coming. 9 MR. BILLEITER: Okay. I'm going to get out of here 10 before the hook gets me. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Somebody hit the jackpot. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Who else has got court here? I 13 think 3 has got court at 10:30 -- no? 14 JUDGE MITCHELL: I had mine yesterday. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 16 JUDGE MITCHELL: Because of this. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We'll go in order, then. 18 Judge Wright? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: J.P. 2. Morning, Judge. 20 JUDGE WRIGHT: Good morning. Mine's very simple. 21 All I did is reduce the telephone bill. I did ask for some 22 money for new furniture, but I'm willing to postpone that if 23 it will help out on the 10 percent. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We have some good used 25 furniture. You might want to go look at it. 7-30-08 bwk 45 1 JUDGE WRIGHT: I did not think about -- when I got 2 my new cell phone, I didn't think about that coming out of my 3 budget. I didn't put that back in. I just took my monthly 4 telephone bill at the office and multiplied by 12, and that's 5 what I'm asking for. If there's a fee for the cell phone, 6 it's not in there. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: There's probably about 25 bucks a 8 month that's charged to you, something like that, so we need 9 to add $300 to that, I would think. What I'm wrassling with 10 right now is there's a travel item in here, and I'm not sure 11 where we're going on this travel item. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are you increasing telephone 13 to -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, first thing I'm doing is 15 part-time going to 2,000. I assume you want that also, as 16 opposed to 1,000? Can do you with 1,000, Judge Wright? 17 JUDGE WRIGHT: I work when she's not there. I keep 18 the office open unless I'm on call. When I'm on call, I 19 always have to get part-time help. But other than that, I 20 just keep the office open and answer the phone and take care 21 of the calls. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Travel, what is that? There 23 hasn't been any -- wasn't that rolled into the salary a long 24 time ago, like ours was? 25 JUDGE TINLEY: So, we're keeping part-time at 7-30-08 bwk 46 1 1,000. Telephone we need to increase by 300 to cover the 2 cell. That'll go to 2,250. 3 JUDGE WRIGHT: There's one thing I would like to 4 touch on. We have a -- a fund that we collect in the office 5 that can be used for computer items or electronic items. And 6 I had asked last year about getting a GPS out of that fund. 7 It's not in -- it's not in this. At 3 o'clock in the morning 8 out on these country roads, it's kind of scary. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- 10 JUDGE WRIGHT: The tech fund. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: The travel item -- 12 JUDGE WRIGHT: We had asked for -- I didn't think 13 that was going to be discussed today. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which one? 15 JUDGE WRIGHT: I had -- we had all asked for a 16 gasoline allowance on -- on one item. But that, I 17 understood, was not going to be discussed today. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Question on telephone first, 19 before you get -- 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why is your telephone 1,950? 22 JUDGE WRIGHT: Every year we go through this. Ask 23 Rusty; I'm off his system. I don't know. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: They're not hooked up with the 25 courthouse system. 7-30-08 bwk 47 1 JUDGE WRIGHT: I'm connected up to the Sheriff's 2 Department system. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: There's a separate commercial 4 installation out there, and separate stuff out at J.P. 4, 5 too. Except that I don't think Hill Country is quite as 6 expensive as -- 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: -- as the other folks, but that's 9 why that's more expensive. 10 JUDGE WRIGHT: Yeah. It's nothing I can -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: You got a phone and a fax line, or 12 two lines and a fax line? 13 JUDGE WRIGHT: Two lines and a fax line. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And you're going to increase 16 the telephone to -- 17 JUDGE TINLEY: 2,250. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 2,250. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Adding 300 to handle the cell phone. 20 JUDGE WRIGHT: I had decreased it because my 21 personal cell phone that I had been using for the county was 22 coming out of it. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't -- we're charging that per 24 department. I know; I get the printout every month, and 25 we're charging that per department. Aren't we, John? 7-30-08 bwk 48 1 MR. TROLINGER: Correct. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. Let's get back to the 3 travel business. I'm kind of like Bruce; I thought we did 4 away with that. Now, I knew there was a -- a request for 5 some sort of consideration because of fuel cost, and there 6 was some discussion about maybe a separate travel line item. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't see that in any of 8 the other budgets. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I didn't recall it either, but 10 we need -- at some point, we're going to address it, either 11 individually or when we get to the end of the road, and I had 12 asked Ms. Hyde to come up with -- if you'll recall, with a 13 schedule of what she thought each particular department head 14 or elected official needed for that purpose. And -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Needed for what purpose? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- the amount of -- there were 17 two possible solutions. One is for those that are driving in 18 their personal vehicle, attending to county business, a 19 travel allowance, which would be included as a salary item, 20 as per I.R.S. regs. The option would be to have a -- one or 21 maybe two county vehicles to be drawn for the purpose of 22 conducting that business, and I think Commissioner Letz was 23 concerned about the liability issues, and that was one reason 24 that he thought we needed to look at the aspect of -- of 25 having a county vehicle that could be drawn by anybody as 7-30-08 bwk 49 1 needed in lieu of the travel line item. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we ought to have a 3 discussion on that at the end, how we're going to handle it, 4 'cause it goes to all these -- whatever it was Bruce went 5 into, when we rolled all the travel into salary at one point. 6 So, there's a salary -- there's a travel allowance in every 7 elected official's salary currently, and it has been adjusted 8 for inflation ever since we've done that. So, there is a 9 salary component of everyone's salary right now. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And -- and we'll probably -- 11 well, I like the vehicle thing, but I don't see that working 12 all the time. It's just like this floater person is going to 13 get tied up. But, of course, the floaters's going to have to 14 have a car, too. (Laughter.) But the -- 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: A floating car? 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, what I'm hearing is that 17 this 001 probably needs to be deleted all the way across, 18 just like the other J.P.'s are. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: That's what I've done at this point, 20 Commissioner. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And deal with -- and deal 22 with this thing. Oh, I kind of wanted to see us deal with 23 the salary thing totally, completely different, separate from 24 all these. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I have a suggestion. 7-30-08 bwk 50 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Rusty, I'm right in the 2 middle of a sentence here. But I'm through now. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I thought so. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: No, I -- until we get to some 5 general discussion, I pulled that out. And I'm going to show 6 it -- I'm not showing it in any other J.P.'s items. Because 7 we will have a general discussion on that and figure out what 8 we're going to do. 9 JUDGE WRIGHT: That's what I thought was going to 10 happen. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You see how these J.P.'s 13 think? Y'all come together and work these things out, and 14 then when you come in here, it's really -- 15 JUDGE WRIGHT: We needed to go somewhere. We 16 needed a starting point. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. Anything else that you see 18 there, Judge? 19 JUDGE WRIGHT: No, sir, except, like I said, in the 20 technology fund, I would like to have a GPS system. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Out of the J.P. Technology? 22 JUDGE WRIGHT: Yes. It's not general fund. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is a GPS system? What 24 is that? 25 JUDGE WRIGHT: It's to keep me from getting lost 7-30-08 bwk 51 1 out here on these little back roads in Center Point at 2 4 o'clock in the morning. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm not going -- 4 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm not going to ask that. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm not going to ask the 6 question. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Me either. 8 JUDGE WRIGHT: I have -- 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I believe that part. But the 10 question is -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Jon's going to say it. See, 12 we're sitting here being nice, and Jon's going to say it. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Don't go there. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would -- have you tried one? 15 Does it help? 16 JUDGE WRIGHT: I don't have one. I've never tried 17 one; I wouldn't know how to turn one on. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have a GPS, and they're -- if 19 you want to find out which way is north, which way is south, 20 it's fine, but if you think it's going to show you where 21 roads are, -- 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You are mistaken. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- it's not going to happen. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I have one. 25 JUDGE WRIGHT: The problem is, if I'm out there and 7-30-08 bwk 52 1 I've got cell phone service, I can call the dispatcher and 2 they can run me around for an hour till I find it. But if 3 I'm out where I don't have cell phone service, then I'm -- I 4 just keep -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I had a GPS, and it's -- it's a 6 little -- it's a toy, in my mind. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It will get you farther from 8 the house and more lost than you were before you got one. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 'Cause, I mean, to work, 10 you have to put it in tracking mode when you leave, and then 11 you can backtrack back, if you can figure out how to make the 12 tracking thing tell you where to go. So, I mean -- 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I can see -- 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not opposed to you spending 15 the money. I don't think it's going to help you. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I can see you sitting out 17 on a little road in Precinct 2 trying to figure out how the 18 damn thing works. 19 JUDGE WRIGHT: Well, it was -- 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It was a thought, I know. I 21 have one too, and they're not very expensive. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 'Cause that's not -- 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: About 200 bucks for one of 24 them. But, my goodness -- 25 JUDGE WRIGHT: I'll call my commissioner the next 7-30-08 bwk 53 1 time I'm out there and let him tell me how to get where I 2 need to go. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You know, I'm not sure that 5 the county roads are in those things. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Not all of them. 7 MS. HYDE: They're not. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The majors are, but not all 9 of them. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It has roads connecting that 11 aren't connected, too. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I can tell you that my road 13 is -- they have it listed on GPS as being in Harper. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Really? 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. Put in Harper, and it 16 will take you home. But if you miss putting in Harper, it 17 won't do it. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I -- I'm not opposed to the 19 expenditure; I just don't think it's going to help you. I'll 20 be glad to loan you mine, and then if you think it helps, we 21 can put it back. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll be glad to loan you mine 23 too, any time. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If you keep talking, one of 25 the two will give it to you. 7-30-08 bwk 54 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It will be a gift; you may be 2 right. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: What else, Judge? 4 JUDGE WRIGHT: That's all. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 6 JUDGE WRIGHT: Like I said, I took the furniture 7 out and I decreased the telephone. That's all I did. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Looking good, Judge. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 10 JUDGE WRIGHT: Okay. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 12 JUDGE WRIGHT: May I be excused? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, ma'am. Yes, ma'am. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Here comes three. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Uh-oh. 16 JUDGE MITCHELL: Hey, I'm nice. I don't want 17 anything. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Great. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, ma'am. We'll see you. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Bye. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: You've got 1,600 for part-time 22 salaries. 23 JUDGE MITCHELL: And that's fine. It works. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. All right. You got 7-30-08 bwk 55 1 everything you asked for. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? 3 JUDGE MITCHELL: The only reason -- I want to 4 explain on the postage. We increased from last year on our 5 postage, for the reason that we do a lot of -- I brought a 6 little sample here, and y'all probably already know, but 7 collections. And we are collecting within our 30 days. If 8 you -- and as people know who collect, if you collect it 9 within the first 30 days, then you're going to -- after that, 10 it's difficult getting it. And so, just for the reason of 11 the postage and these little cards, as of the six months, our 12 revenue's been 180 -- a little over 189,000, almost 190,000, 13 and to the County, a little over 101,000 is our percentage. 14 So, that's the reason I requested the postage, for the fact 15 of mailing out these cards. They work. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: It's in there. We gave you what you 17 asked for. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Looks good. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If you don't get those 20 collected that way, we now have a contract collection 21 service; you can turn stuff over and maybe get more money. 22 JUDGE MITCHELL: We're doing great. I've got a 23 fantastic clerk. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Did you not tell me it looks like 25 your collections are going to be about 100,000 -- 7-30-08 bwk 56 1 JUDGE MITCHELL: More this year than last year. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: -- more this year than last year? 3 JUDGE MITCHELL: Yes, sir. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: And then, of course, the major 5 portion of that is Kerr County funds. 6 JUDGE MITCHELL: Approximately 53 percent of it is 7 Kerr County funds. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Thank you, Ms. Mitchell. 9 JUDGE MITCHELL: Make money for us. Thank you. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Thank you. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Judge Ragsdale. 12 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Good morning. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Good morning. 14 JUDGE RAGSDALE: I don't think there's any 15 significant -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Got everything you wanted. 17 JUDGE RAGSDALE: There is one thing that I want to 18 tell you that I'm trying to work on, and I apologize for not 19 having all the facts and figures today for you. I just 20 couldn't get it done. And that is that we spend -- we kind 21 of did an informal survey in our offices where we figure that 22 each one of our clerks spend about eight hours a week on the 23 telephone with redundant phone calls. You know, "The police 24 officer told me to call," which they swear up and down they 25 don't do, but they call and say, "How do I take care of this 7-30-08 bwk 57 1 ticket?" And we say, "Well, read the courtesy letter we gave 2 you, and call if you have any other questions." But there's 3 a significant portion of people who continue on, you know, 4 "Well, how do I do a driver's safety course? How do I do 5 this? How do I do that?" I've already tried a web site at 6 my office to answer these questions, and that takes care of 7 some small portion. But what I'm proposing is -- is that, 8 through Hill Country Telephone, getting one phone number that 9 would be published on our courtesy letters, and use a 10 rotating system where it would -- you know, one of those, 11 "Press 1 if you have a question about a driving safety 12 course," press 2 if you have this question or this question, 13 the redundant questions, and at the end, the option be 14 that -- hold on, we'll give you the clerk of whatever court 15 you're asking for, and have the call forwarded to that clerk. 16 I think it would reduce really wasted time in our offices, 17 and help us with some of the -- I don't know the right word. 18 I guess some of the down time of our clerks to make them more 19 efficient in the work that they're doing. Again, like -- I 20 would think that -- that this would entail probably four to 21 five telephone lines and some equipment. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Couldn't you -- I'm just 23 thinking. I mean, it seems -- I think it's a good idea, 24 Judge, but rather than have it even forwarded, why couldn't 25 you just give out at the end of the recording each of y'all's 7-30-08 bwk 58 1 phone numbers? That way you're only using one line. The 2 other people have to make a phone call. I mean -- 3 JUDGE RAGSDALE: That -- that would work. I could 4 blueprint that in with the thing, but you would still need 5 more than one phone line, because there's four of us now. 6 And that would -- 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But all -- it's up to the 8 J.P.'s, but if all J.P.'s had the same number for all the 9 redundant questions, then refer the questions. For J.P. 1, 10 call this number for further questions. For 3, give the 11 number. Then you do it with one phone line, 'cause I'm sure 12 y'all all get the same basic questions, and even do basic 13 things like driver's ed, all these things the same. 14 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Yes. 15 MR. TROLINGER: Kind of like the burn ban hotline 16 is with the recording. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. And just have -- that 18 way the people get that, and if they don't -- at least that's 19 the number that's on all the tickets, and if they want to 20 talk to y'all -- 21 JUDGE RAGSDALE: That's not a bad idea, really. 22 But, at any rate, I would like to see probably two or three 23 lines, just so -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He still wants three lines. 25 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Well, the reason being is because 7-30-08 bwk 59 1 there's a high volume of telephone traffic, and if one person 2 has to wait, I mean, it just -- I guess it really doesn't 3 matter if they get angry or put out, but it does -- it does 4 make more complaints against us, that we're not handling our 5 business efficiently. The only -- and I'm just saying the 6 rotating line, you know -- 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Maybe we can include it in 8 the county information line. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, the county information 10 line -- a whole bunch of them probably go to y'all, too. I 11 get a whole bunch of them for Judge Mitchell. They're always 12 calling me wanting to know about a speeding ticket. So, I 13 think it's a good idea to do something like that, 'cause I 14 think it does probably waste a lot of all your time. 15 JUDGE RAGSDALE: It does. And, you know, the 16 courtesy letters, last ones I printed up, I have in three 17 places in 12-point type, boldface, "Do not call a judge until 18 you've read this letter." And they still call up and say, 19 "Well, the police officer said I got to take care of -- I got 20 to call you." And it's -- "Well, have you read the letter?" 21 "No." You know. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not all that concerned 23 about -- 24 JUDGE RAGSDALE: So, we're having to do all this -- 25 MS. PIEPER: And they don't read the letters. 7-30-08 bwk 60 1 MS. UECKER: We get a lot of their calls too, and 2 we just tell them, "Don't worry about it; your case is 3 dismissed." (Laughter.) 4 JUDGE RAGSDALE: And I don't mind. I really don't. 5 But, anyway, if you would allow me to come back within a 6 week, maybe a week to ten days at the outside, calendar days, 7 and present this to you, and I'll -- I'll do what you said; I 8 like it. And I'll give you some options. And another thing 9 about doing it through Hill Country Telephone is, I think 10 it's much less expensive than Kerrville Telephone. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And all -- and you will have 12 all four J.P.'s on the same page, right? 13 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Yeah, it'd just be one telephone 14 number. Yeah, I don't -- I don't have a problem with that. 15 I'm not sure, but I detected a sense of sarcasm in your 16 voice. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Come back with a signed 18 agreement by the other three. 19 JUDGE RAGSDALE: It's not -- 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's a good idea, Judge. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Why don't you work that through 22 Mr. Trolinger, since there's going to be some technology 23 involved in it. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, I think you're right that 25 Hill Country Co-Op is probably going to be easier. I know 7-30-08 bwk 61 1 we're so short of phone lines that you can probably get one 2 at your office easier. 3 JUDGE RAGSDALE: I guarantee you, the engineer that 4 I was working with over there, Jeff Marquardt -- 5 MR. TROLINGER: Top quality operation, I agree, 6 Hill Country Telephone. 7 JUDGE RAGSDALE: They are so eager to accommodate, 8 as opposed to some other places. We won't go into that. 9 But, anyway, I don't think there's anything else. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 11 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Just the part-time salary. I 12 think that's probably fine. I think -- weren't we at -- were 13 we at that same figure last year? 14 MR. RUARK: Yes. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm, sure were. 16 JUDGE RAGSDALE: And we've spent it. But I think 17 Christine's -- she's been declared in remission, so hopefully 18 she won't have a whole lot more doctor stuff. So -- 19 JUDGE TINLEY: So you can do with what you've 20 requested? 21 JUDGE RAGSDALE: I'm going to try real hard. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Good enough. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Looks good. 7-30-08 bwk 62 1 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Thank you. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We'll go -- 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Next, constables. 4 MR. RUARK: 51 is the number. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 51? 551. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What page, Buster? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 46. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I don't see Mr. Lavender 10 here. 11 MS. HYDE: He's on vacation. 12 MS. WILLIAMS: They're not back yet. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: His hasn't changed. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I don't think I did him any 16 damage. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hmm-mm. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Buster said he did fine. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Went down a little bit on -- 20 JUDGE TINLEY: On fuel. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Little bit on vehicles. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: 4,000. That's based on historical. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Little bit down on telephone -- 24 is it telephone? Yeah. Well, pretty good. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Didn't have to go to any 7-30-08 bwk 63 1 conferences? Am I misreading something here? 2 MS. HARGIS: He's using his LEOSE funds, I think, 3 for his training. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I can't hear you. 5 MS. HARGIS: He's using the LEOSE funds for his 6 training. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What are those funds? 8 MS. HARGIS: Law enforcement funds that they get. 9 It's like a special fund, and they can -- this is the only 10 thing they can use it for, is training. So, he's using that 11 for his training. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 13 MS. HARGIS: They all have some of that money 14 available. It's like the J.P. technology fund, except it's a 15 training fund. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Wait a minute. Come to me with that 18 again? 19 MS. HARGIS: LEOSE funds. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Uh-huh. 21 MS. HARGIS: He's using those for his training at 22 the current time. I know John is. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Are you telling me that there's a 24 separate fund that we can do their TCLEOSE training out of? 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Every law enforcement agency 7-30-08 bwk 64 1 throughout the state, depending on how many certified 2 officers you have as employees, gets a check each year from 3 the Attorney General's office that the state provides for 4 training for those officers. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's called the LEOSE fund. 7 MS. UECKER: State doesn't provide it. We charge 8 it as courts costs and send it in. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: State keeps part of it and 10 sends a little bit of it back. 11 MS. HARGIS: In addition to the constables getting 12 it, the Sheriff's Office gets it, and the -- I believe the 13 District Attorney gets it. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me see if I understand this. 15 It's similar to one we were talking about a while ago. For 16 each officer, they're going to give us $300. 17 MS. HARGIS: That's correct. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: So we turn around and budget that 19 same amount for TCLEOSE training for each officer? 20 MS. HARGIS: They have not in the past. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: But that's all we can spend it on, 22 isn't it? 23 MS. HARGIS: That's all you can spend it on. They 24 do have -- they have all built up a -- a considerable amount 25 of money there, because no one has spent it because it was 7-30-08 bwk 65 1 not really budgeted, and so John is the first constable that 2 I can see that's started to use it for that. I think Angel's 3 used it for some of it. I don't know about the other two. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Doesn't appear that any of 5 them -- well, 3 has 500 in training; the rest of them, they 6 have zeroed it out. They've all zeroed out conferences, and 7 most of them zeroed out training. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: But what you're telling me, this is 9 a separate fund -- 10 MS. HARGIS: That they have the discretion to use, 11 but it can only be used for training. Our training, our 12 bullets, or -- help me with this. 13 MR. AYALA: Any kind of training. 14 MS. HARGIS: Any kind of training and equipment? 15 No equipment, just training? 16 MR. AYALA: Books. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Books. One thing we have 18 done -- and we don't have that much of it left. It's not 19 enough to cover Sheriff's Office training per year, okay? It 20 doesn't do enough. But one thing that has -- you can use it 21 for, such as the computers in the training room out there, 22 the upgrades to the training room, as long as they're doing 23 online training. Those computers, which there are 18 of them 24 out there, the County has never bought, okay? Those are 25 bought and replaced and maintained through that fund. And 7-30-08 bwk 66 1 then additional training, if we want to send somebody through 2 it, through specialized training, goes to that. But you're 3 correct, Judge, that for as long as I've been around, the 4 County -- and we're -- like, you see what Linda has; it's a 5 Fund 29 or 28, where it goes into. I don't believe that the 6 County has ever seen that in any certain one that any of that 7 money goes into. It just comes in, and there's -- I don't 8 know where Mindy keeps it, or where y'all keep it. 9 MS. WILLIAMS: It's a separate -- I think it's Fund 10 77 now. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: That's the point of my question. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: If this money is going into a 14 separate fund, like the Records Preservation fund or the J.P. 15 Technology fund, we need to create a -- a companion 16 expenditure fund for that fund. 17 MS. HARGIS: We do. We have that. It was created 18 right before I came here. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So what we need to do, then, 20 is zero out this TCLEOSE training in this budget, and 21 transfer it over to that expenditure budget for that special 22 fund. Wouldn't you agree? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: TCLEOSE and regular training 24 schools both. I mean, there's -- we have three -- we have 25 TCLEOSE training -- I'm just looking at all the J.P.'s. We 7-30-08 bwk 67 1 have TCLEOSE training, training school, and conferences. 2 Some are on all of them. Some are -- 3 MS. HARGIS: They only get 300 per year. They do 4 have a fund balance that's different for each one, and I 5 can't quote that. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Do they each have their own fund 7 balance? 8 MS. HARGIS: Yes. Has to be kept separate. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, but back to my point. TCLEOSE 10 training, at least in this instance, would need to be charged 11 against a separate budget expenditure account that's a 12 companion to the Precinct 1 constable's income account that 13 -- where that money is received. Wouldn't you agree? 14 MS. HARGIS: It's my understanding, by the state 15 law, that this has to be kept in a separate fund, and -- and 16 the revenue is separate from the county, as well as the 17 expense is separate. If you want me to come back with a 18 budget -- or they come back with a budget for that, keep in 19 mind that they only get 300 per year. Right now they do have 20 a little bit of a fund balance in some of them. It's 21 different, again, in each one. That will only work for maybe 22 a year or two before they would deplete that down to 300. 23 And it's my understanding they go to more than one school per 24 year, and so the 300 would only cover, like, maybe one. It 25 won't cover all the schools they need to go to. 7-30-08 bwk 68 1 JUDGE TINLEY: So, what you're suggesting is, maybe 2 Constable Lavender -- that's not all of the TCLEOSE money 3 that he's planning on expending this year. He's going to 4 take some out of the special -- do we, in fact, have a 5 separate expenditure account for those funds? 6 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir, 77. Mindy was right, if you 7 can see that right now. Actually, they get $670, and the 8 Sheriff's Department gets 6,135, and then the D.A.'s office 9 gets the $743. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: That's an income item. Isn't that 11 an income account? 12 MS. HARGIS: No, it hasn't carried in the last -- 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I can't see it from here. Is that 14 an income or expenditure account? 15 MS. HARGIS: That's an expenditure, but it's 16 expense for the amount of money that they get per year. 17 MS. UECKER: Do you want me to pull the statutes 18 for that for you? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, frankly, I'm not sure that we 21 need it if, in fact, it's a separate fund account. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They've got budgeted this year 23 $670 for each constable. 24 MS. HARGIS: Basically, what I did is I went in and 25 budgeted what they would get, the same amount as they got 7-30-08 bwk 69 1 last year. It appears to be the same amount for the last 2 couple of years. Mindy seems to think it may have varied 3 over the years, but the last two years, it's been the same 4 amount. Now, it was only put in this fund right when I -- 5 when I got here. Therefore, the balances that each one has 6 we had to keep on a separate spreadsheet. Mindy had done it 7 in the past, and I had to go in and bring it up to date. It 8 kind of lapsed for a couple of years. So, I sent each of the 9 constables that spreadsheet denoting how much each of them 10 has. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let me -- let me ask the 12 constables. Did any of you specifically budget your TCLEOSE 13 funds out of this separate -- out of these separate funds 14 this year? 15 MS. HARGIS: No. 16 MR. AYALA: No. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm getting a no. 18 MS. HARGIS: John was the only one. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But on -- 20 MR. AYALA: I don't personally need the TCLEOSE 21 line item in this budget. I'm going to spend -- any training 22 I need to do, I'll do it out of my LEOSE money. 23 MR. TERRILL: Same thing with Precinct 4. 24 MR. GARZA: I'd like to have my funding going to 25 training, you know. 7-30-08 bwk 70 1 JUDGE TINLEY: So, in addition to your -- to your 2 TCLEOSE funds in your separate account that you've got there, 3 the 670 that's shown as budgeted for this year, you need an 4 additional amount that you'd included in your budget? 5 MR. GARZA: Yes, sir, unless the Court decides they 6 don't want to. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I understand that. I 8 understand, but we'll talk about that probably in just a 9 minute when we get to yours. 10 MS. HARGIS: I believe that -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm trying to determine whether or 12 not -- 13 MS. HARGIS: I believe that's John Lavender, too. 14 He goes to more than one school. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Simplify this for my pea 16 brain. It seems to me like that the funds have not been 17 expended out of that special fund that comes in for training. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And they have been -- or it 20 has been in the past, in a sense, we're using tax money to 21 pay for those trainings. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Fund 10. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: When it should be used out of 24 a fund that we don't have to use tax money for. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Exactly. 7-30-08 bwk 71 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Is that that difficult to 2 understand? 3 JUDGE TINLEY: The question is whether or not -- 4 whether or not they need funds over and above that which is 5 in this account. And if they do, -- 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Exactly. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: -- then we'll do it out of Fund 10. 8 But without Constable Lavender here, it's a little difficult 9 for me to find out exactly what his intentions were. He's 10 shown as budgeting 670, as are the rest of them, out of 11 that -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 77. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. And so I'm going to delete 14 his $300 that he's requested for training -- TCLEOSE 15 training, and show that to zero. Now, if he needs -- because 16 he's fairly recently come on board, if he needs additional 17 training, maybe we can do a budget amendment on the 77, 18 because there are additional funds. And if he's exhausted 19 his there, then we can come back. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There you go. It's not 21 rocket science. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, are you making a note 24 of that? 25 MR. RUARK: I just did. 7-30-08 bwk 72 1 JUDGE TINLEY: No, but I sure can, and I'm going 2 to. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, I'm talking to the guru 4 sitting out here. 5 MR. RUARK: Okay. The guru has changed it, yes. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You made a note so that 7 he'll understand what we did, why we deleted that 300 out of 8 there. When he comes back, he can see that and know what we 9 did without getting in a tizzy with anybody. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: I've got a notation, too. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I noticed he doesn't have a 12 line item for conferences, and others do. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, he has a line item; he just 14 hasn't asked for any money. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I see it. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, 480. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Hasn't asked for anything. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Are your conferences training 19 sessions that are eligible out of TCLEOSE funds? 20 MR. AYALA: Yes. I have about $2,800 in my LEOSE 21 account, so I'm covered. I'm going to get another $700 in 22 March, so -- 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Bob, where are you? 24 MR. TERRILL: I'm at about $7,000 in credit. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Angel, where are you? 7-30-08 bwk 73 1 MR. GARZA: I don't know, sir. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Can we borrow some of that, 4 Bob? 5 MR. TERRILL: No, sir, that's for me. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Law says you got to keep them 7 separate. Right, Bob? 8 MR. TERRILL: Keep them separate. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, on Precinct 1 -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- you have the 485 13 conference. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And then on Precinct 2, you 16 don't have a 485 conference; you have a 487 training school. 17 And I'm scared to go to Precinct 3. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let's go see. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 485 conference. And 20 Precinct 4 has a 487 training school. So, you have two 21 conferences and two training schools. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There's also TCLEOSE training 23 further up. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I saw that. But it's 25 just in that one little area down there. Doesn't that need 7-30-08 bwk 74 1 to be cleaned up? Don't they need to say the same thing? 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I didn't create the accounts. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. That's an 5 auditor issue. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: But for -- for purposes of 7 finalizing this budget, I think we need to zero out all of 8 the conferences and all of the TCLEOSE training accounts for 9 budgetary purposes, allocation of funds this year, get those 10 requests in and get them moved over to the TCLEOSE. But 11 you're right; it -- for purposes of our understanding, it'd 12 be better if it were training or conference. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, you're -- you just 14 clean it up, Mrs. Auditor. Do you agree or not? 15 MS. HARGIS: I'll fix it. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. I mean, just a common 17 sense thing. 18 MS. HARGIS: They've had conferences in the past, 19 and I -- I don't want to delete that, because we would delete 20 our history in that. So, therefore, probably what I'll do is 21 go in and add the conference line item to those that don't 22 have it. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is there any distinction 25 between a conference and training? 7-30-08 bwk 75 1 MS. HARGIS: I can't answer. 2 MR. AYALA: I don't think there is. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I think for purposes of utilizing 4 these TCLEOSE funds, let's call it training. 'Cause they say 5 that's what their conferences are, training, and they 6 qualify. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with that. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, that's good. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to 2. What do you say, 11 guys? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hot dog, we're moving. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, we're cooking. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We're rolling. 15 MR. AYALA: I lowered my budget by a little over 16 5,000. I took -- I took out the training. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: First thing we're going to do is 18 take out your TCLEOSE training here, Joel, because we're 19 going to use that somewhere else, consolidate that to go over 20 into your account -- go against your account. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Training school, too? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. We're also going to take out 23 your training school and zero that one out. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, where is that -- see, 25 that's -- how much is that so far? 7-30-08 bwk 76 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 150 and 350, I think. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, take -- where does that 4 transfer to? 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, he's going to pull those funds 6 for whatever training he needs out of that 77 expenditure 7 account. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, we're reducing the 9 budget here. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm, yeah, we're reducing. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Zeroing out those line items. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: And what else did I do to you that 13 maybe wasn't the right thing to do, Joel? 14 MR. AYALA: Capital outlay, I took out $4,000. 15 MS. HARGIS: That was for the radios. 16 MR. AYALA: That was for the radios. 17 MS. HARGIS: Because we don't need them. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We don't need them? 19 MR. AYALA: Well, Rusty said we're included in his 20 deal. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So yours goes to zero. 22 MR. AYALA: The capital outlay goes to zero. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: I've already got it at zero. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But that line right above 25 there -- 7-30-08 bwk 77 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Operating equipment. 2 MR. AYALA: Operating equipment, I reduced to 3 2,000. 4 MS. HARGIS: We had 1,500. Is that right? 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, I reduced that, I think, to 6 1,500. You had asked for 25. Or maybe that was a default 7 number, Joel. 8 MR. AYALA: I asked for two. I reduced it from 25 9 to 2. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. What does that include? 11 MR. AYALA: All kinds of -- anything we need. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: But anything specific that -- that 13 comes up to that number? 14 MR. AYALA: No, not anything specific. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: I reduced it to 15, and my rationale 16 for doing that was looking at what you had spent year-to-date 17 and your projected year-end, which is just a hair over 1,000. 18 Is there anything extraordinary over and above what you've 19 done this current year that you think you may need -- 20 MR. AYALA: No, sir. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's see if we can work with what I 22 put in there. And, you know, if you've got a legitimate 23 request, obviously, we'll -- we're going to take care of your 24 needs. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask a question right 7-30-08 bwk 78 1 there. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: On operating equipment, 4 requested budget, Joel said, "I requested 2,000," and here it 5 shows 2,500. Now, how -- how does that happen, and how does 6 this work? Am I supposed to, just by osmosis, know that he 7 actually requested 2,000? 8 MR. RUARK: What's out on the system -- what is out 9 on the system is the DR budget. His budget was $2,500. He 10 may have thought he asked for 2,000. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh. 12 MR. AYALA: No, no, no. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So -- so the elected 14 official is wrong? 15 MR. RUARK: I'm just telling you. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Or he may have subsequently -- 17 MR. AYALA: When they asked us to go through our 18 budgets to see what we could cut out, I went back and -- 19 and -- 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So you changed it? 21 MR. AYALA: Yes, I changed it to 2,000. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You originally said 2,500? 23 MR. AYALA: Yes. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. That's all I'm 25 looking for. So, why didn't you change it to 2,000? 7-30-08 bwk 79 1 MR. RUARK: 'Cause you didn't ask me to. 2 MS. HARGIS: We don't want to change the requested 3 budget, so that you'll see what was originally requested. 4 That's -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, as far as -- I can see 6 y'all knowing that, and I can see the County Judge knowing 7 that, because y'all visit. But I don't see that a 8 commissioner would know that. I'm thinking that the guy 9 requested 2,500 bucks, and in reality, he requested 2,000. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, if you would be on the 11 Commissioners Court page where I am, it shows it. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, I see. Okay. That 13 explains everything. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You've got to have two of 15 these. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm going to Inn of the 17 Hills. What time is happy hour? 18 MS. HYDE: I'm telling you. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Y'all are not going to 20 answer me, so I'm just going to go home. 21 MS. HARGIS: I will answer you. If you look in the 22 notes, every time we made a change, we put a note in there as 23 to why. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Read the notes, Buster. 25 "Read the notes," is what you're saying. Okay, thank you. 7-30-08 bwk 80 1 MR. AYALA: I guess the biggest -- biggest change 2 is the fuel line item. Our current budget this year is 3 2,500. I've already exceeded that. I still got two months 4 to go. So, we're -- we requested 4,500. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: What I've done with all of you is 6 put you at 4,000. I think you can probably work with that. 7 We're going to issue each of you a length of rubber hose -- 8 MR. AYALA: That'll work. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: That will come under operating 10 equipment. (Laughter.) 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You keep a record of the 12 number of gallons you purchase? 13 MR. AYALA: Sure. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hey, Joel, I forgot to ask 15 -- well, there wasn't another constable in front of me. This 16 patrol vehicle in excess of 65,000 miles, what is your 17 thinking there? Like, next year, get a new car or what? 18 MR. AYALA: Rusty has a better idea of what kind of 19 mileage we can get out of them. I know some of his cars -- 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 170,000, 180,000 on some. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're two years away. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Nice to see you. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else, Joel? 24 MR. AYALA: Can't think of anything. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, thank you. Why don't we take 7-30-08 bwk 81 1 a break here for about 15 minutes. 2 (Recess taken from 10:40 a.m. to 11:00 a.m.) 3 - - - - - - - - - - 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to order. 5 We're down to Constable 3. Constable Garza, what did -- what 6 did we do to you? We've got TCLEOSE training zeroed out. 7 MR. GARZA: Okay. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: And let's look under your 9 conferences. That's zeroed out. 10 MR. GARZA: Okay. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: You're going to -- you're going to 12 pull out of your separate fund. 13 MR. GARZA: Okay. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: I reduced your fuel to 4,000 along 15 with everybody else's. 16 MR. GARZA: Yes, sir, that's fine. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: What else have I done to you? 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Capital outlay. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What do you want in capital 20 outlay? 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Operating equipment, 22 capital outlay. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Capital outlay. Computer and 24 hardware/software to allow me the ability to access Odyssey 25 to retrieve information while I'm in my patrol vehicle. 7-30-08 bwk 82 1 MR. GARZA: Which one are we talking about, sir? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't know. One screen just 3 went blank. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: I'll just leave on my deal here. 5 What do you got in your capital outlay? Your operating 6 equipment is the same as Constable 2. 7 MR. GARZA: Okay, sir. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Tell me about your capital outlay. 9 MR. GARZA: I was trying to look into getting a 10 computer, laptop, so I could have it with me in my vehicle. 11 The reason for that is, I would use it to access Odyssey. I 12 talked to John on this, and he said it would be possible, if 13 I did get a computer, that he could possibly access me 14 wirelessly to the vehicle so I could look up information. 15 And the reason for this is, I've really been aggressive this 16 year in trying to get warrants cleared out of my office, as I 17 hope you Commissioners have seen my reports -- my monthly 18 reports on how many warrants I've cleared. And so that's 19 kind of part of what I'm trying to do. Just something -- an 20 extra tool to get me to do a good job and a better job. That 21 would also help me -- being wireless, I could also access, 22 like, Mapquest when I'm out in the field looking for 23 addresses and what-have-you. I've gone to Boerne a few times 24 to check on warrants for people, and I've -- that was one way 25 I did it, was through Mapquest. I printed out maps before I 7-30-08 bwk 83 1 left the office and what-have-you. Sometimes you get to a 2 place; sometimes addresses aren't the same. So -- different 3 locations, so I would just -- it's a tool, is what I want to 4 use it for. It's a tool. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would question the ability to 6 access it remotely in most of our county, 'cause I know I 7 can't -- I know a lot of them, you can't. Maybe you can in 8 Kerrville. I guess you can. I don't know. 9 MR. TROLINGER: The service that we're talking 10 about has full coverage in Kerr County. I've personally 11 tested it; it's great service. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: At my house? Not that you ever 13 go to my house. 14 MR. GARZA: I go out to your house. I drive out 15 there. I mean, Commissioners, it's just a tool that would 16 help me, I think, you know, in my quest to do a better job, 17 you know, for the county. And, like I said -- I again say, 18 you know, you've looked at my reports, my monthly reports, 19 and how much I've -- warrants I've cleared and collected on 20 fines to the county. These are fines that are -- that people 21 have paid. I've sent out notices; I've sent out cards. I've 22 had a good return on money collected to the court. And I 23 just feel like I'm trying to do my best to help the county, 24 you know, bring in funds, and that's just -- okay, it's just 25 a tool. I mean -- 7-30-08 bwk 84 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: John, what is -- how old is -- 2 or maybe you know, Angel. How old is your computer in your 3 office? 4 MR. GARZA: I just got one last year, which I just 5 got it replaced. That was the first computer I had replaced 6 since I took office. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Too bad you didn't get a 8 notebook last year; you would have had one. 9 MR. GARZA: It's just -- just asking. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think notebooks for people in 11 your position and other -- I think all the constables, I 12 think a notebook computer makes more sense. I don't know 13 that you need two computers at this point, not in this year's 14 budget, anyway, 'cause some of the other -- 15 MR. GARZA: Sure, sir. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Why can't you take your 17 notebook in the office? 18 MR. GARZA: I don't have a notebook. It's -- 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Desktop. 20 MR. GARZA: -- a desktop. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's a desktop. 22 MR. TROLINGER: We could pretty easily reallocate 23 the existing desktop computer. Then you could run off the 24 laptop. It's -- you wouldn't have two computers; you'd have 25 one. 7-30-08 bwk 85 1 MR. GARZA: I would welcome that. It's just -- I'm 2 just asking for, you know, a tool to help me do a better job, 3 and that's all I'm looking at. I mean, I know this is a 4 tight budget year, but that's -- 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They're all tight. 6 MR. GARZA: Yes, sir. Yes, sir. But I hope you 7 gentlemen can see where I'm coming from as far as what I'm 8 trying to do, you know. 9 MR. TROLINGER: And Constable Garza's initiative on 10 collections has brought in -- 100,000 additional this year, 11 over last? 12 MR. GARZA: I don't know, sir, but I know I've had 13 -- my monthly reports -- if you've seen my monthly reports 14 every month on the warrants collected, and I kind of want to 15 emphasize that it's fines collected, you know, to the court. 16 It's not putting people in jail, although last month I did 17 have one where I had to put a -- two city warrants, I put a 18 girl in jail and didn't collect in that, because the City has 19 an agreement with the County where if we serve their 20 warrants, we don't ask for the warrant fees, or if they serve 21 our warrants, they don't serve -- they don't ask for warrant 22 fees. $50 warrant fee. So, I try to do it where I collect a 23 warrant fee, and then the fines are due to the court, which 24 helps the court. I mean, the people need to, you know, come 25 up to their responsibility. That's one way I'm trying to do 7-30-08 bwk 86 1 it. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: John, are you saying that 3 there's a -- I mean, the computer he has is needed somewhere 4 else? 5 MR. TROLINGER: It could be used somewhere else, 6 yes. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Could be used, or is needed? 8 MR. TROLINGER: It's needed. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: So, what we're talking about here is 10 allowing the constable to surrender his desktop -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And get a laptop. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: -- and get a laptop, which he could 13 use both in the office and in the car, maybe, to the extent 14 he's got coverage wherever he happens to be. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And what's the cost of the 16 computer? 17 MR. GARZA: The computer that John quoted was $770. 18 Then, of course, there was some optional equipment with it, 19 and it came out to be $1,237. The additional moneys would 20 be, like, for air time; you have to pay an air time card for 21 the computer, and then, of course, the service would be a 22 monthly charge, I think, of $60, which equals to about $720 a 23 year. And then some -- an extra battery and other 24 accessories for it. And I estimate around $3,000 with the 25 total package. It could be more. 7-30-08 bwk 87 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: For liability purposes, you'd 2 better look at the type of mount that goes into the car for 3 using a laptop. I know that's a big issue in law enforcement 4 agencies when they start putting computers in cars because of 5 the increased number of traffic accidents, because there's 6 certain mounts and certain ways of hooking that up. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Good point. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The County does not -- we do 9 not have laptops in the car. I do have some officers that 10 have the capability of using them at home, but not 11 technically in their car for that. Then the air time 12 service, I know John and I experimented or looked at that at 13 one point, and that's a big expense. You know, if we're 14 going to starting to go to laptops in cars, like, I can see 15 that -- 16 MR. GARZA: Commissioners, I'm just -- it's a tool. 17 I mean, it's up to you. I'm just trying to do a good job and 18 I'm just looking at tools, and that's all I'm looking at, 19 sir. If -- if I don't get it, that's fine with me. But I'm 20 trying to do a good job, and that's all I'm asking. I don't 21 need it. If you don't want me to have it, that's fine with 22 me. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: It's really not of any significant 24 benefit if we don't get him on the service where you can use 25 it in a vehicle. You know, otherwise, it's not really valid 7-30-08 bwk 88 1 for him to have it in a vehicle, as I see it. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: So, it's either all or nothing, it 4 seems to me, basically is where we are. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'd say this year, my part of 6 it would be nothing. Maybe next year. Maybe in the future. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: What sayeth the mushroom? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What are we talking, $700? 9 JUDGE TINLEY: 3,000. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: About 3,000. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, with all the stuff? 12 MR. GARZA: All included. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 700 went to 3,000. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just like that. 15 MR. GARZA: 770, Commissioner, was for the 16 computer. That's fine, Commissioner. I'm just -- you know, 17 it was a presentation. I'm -- 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Wait a minute, don't -- 19 MR. TROLINGER: From an I.T. standpoint, I 20 recommend this project. I think if we could do it for all 21 the Sheriff's deputies and all the constables, if we had the 22 money, I'd do it. In a perfect world. But this initiative, 23 it's -- it can save time, save gas money. I think it's a way 24 to go. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The only -- and I'm not trying 7-30-08 bwk 89 1 to keep Angel from getting any technology. I have looked at 2 this a number of times. Only problem I have with it, until 3 we get everything done to where we can run criminal history 4 checks, driver's license checks, you still got to use the 5 radio to call back to your office to confirm that the warrant 6 is still a good warrant. You've got to have that hard copy 7 in your hand. And in the evaluation I've done, due to the 8 cost -- because I've had a lot of officers want it 'cause the 9 City's got it, okay, type deal, that I just have not been 10 able to justify it with at least my fleet yet, with the cost, 11 and until we can really do more than just run a 28 or -- or, 12 you know, something like that. It's just -- the technology's 13 not -- the ability is just not quite there. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, the reason I would 15 want them in your cars, Rusty, is like one of your former 16 deputies had used his own, and at the end of his shift, at 17 midnight or whatever it was, he could pull over on the side 18 of the road, 40 miles out on the other end of the county, and 19 do his report. That way he doesn't come all the way back in 20 and sit down in the office and do all this reporting. He 21 pulls off the side of the road and does it; it's done. I 22 like that kind of stuff. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: When -- and I'll go back to 24 the same thing Jonathan said. When the service, whether it's 25 Sprint or whoever you're using, gets to the capability that 7-30-08 bwk 90 1 makes it advantageous to do, that's fine. But it cut in and 2 out too much with all the times we've tried it. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I see a benefit to doing it 4 like a trial case and see if it works. I also think this 5 isn't maybe the best year to do that trial. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's what I'm saying. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I think it'd be good 8 to -- I would rather have -- whether it be a constable or a 9 deputy have it first, so we can use it, figure out what the 10 real cost is on the time and the coverage. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'd love to be able to keep 12 them out in the field longer. They spend a lot of time in 13 the office doing reports. It just wasn't quite there yet. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You can't -- on the -- on 15 the laptops, you can't run your own 28's, 29's? It all still 16 has to be -- that still has to be done -- your dispatchers do 17 it? Radio -- 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Dispatch does it. Your 19 confirmation right now on the warrants is done that way. 20 City's -- and that's also one of the reasons City's going 21 through to digital, because they can do it all at once. They 22 had -- actually had a contract with L.C.R.A., that 800 23 Megahertz that did the data feed for their laptops in their 24 cars, okay? And, you know, I think they're hoping to cover 25 all that with the digital connection that they're going to. 7-30-08 bwk 91 1 MR. TROLINGER: It's available via web site now, is 2 it not? 3 MR. GARZA: What's that? 4 MR. TROLINGER: The D.P.S. access. 5 MR. GARZA: Yes. 6 MR. TROLINGER: Internet access gets you that same 7 thing. 8 MR. GARZA: Yes. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: With a lot of restrictions. 10 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: A whole lot of restrictions 12 that you're going to have a lot of issues. It's getting 13 there, Buster, and I think it's going to be a great tool for 14 everybody, okay, to have. But me, personally -- and even my 15 officers may not like this, but me, personally, I think it 16 needs to wait a year or two before we can actually get all 17 the bugs out and get the better coverage in the county and 18 know exactly where we are. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with that. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's kind of where I'm 21 at. I think that's where we need to start. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We'll look at it again next 23 year. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We're going to zero that one 25 out. 7-30-08 bwk 92 1 MR. GARZA: Okay. Just on the last note, I do make 2 sure -- I double-check and make sure when I do these warrants 3 that they're current, hard copies at the Sheriff's Office, 4 everything's done properly. I'm a one-man office. I try to 5 do everything I can, and, you know, I follow procedures. So 6 when I go, you know, either to make contact with these folks, 7 you know, I know there's a warrant out, it's out of our 8 court, it's active, where the hard copy's at. You know, I go 9 through all the steps. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: That keeps both you and us out of 11 trouble. 12 MR. GARZA: Exactly, sir. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: We appreciate that. 14 MR. GARZA: I wanted to make sure Your Honor and 15 the Court was aware of this. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Appreciate you going through 17 all those, handling all those warrants. 18 MR. GARZA: Thank you, Commissioner. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else on your budget? 20 MR. GARZA: No, sir. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, great. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 24 MR. GARZA: Thank you, Commissioners. I appreciate 25 your time, sir. 7-30-08 bwk 93 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Four. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: -- four. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The troublemaker. Always 5 wanting a bunch of stuff. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, never enough money. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Never enough. 8 MR. TERRILL: Mine's pretty simple. I just asked 9 for a boost in gas from 2,500 to 3,000, and to go -- for the 10 bond, instead of $50 once a year, just go ahead and pay $200 11 for a four-year bond. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: He's trying to break the 13 County. (Laughter.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I tell you what I did on your 15 gas and oil. I put you at 4,000 with everybody else. 16 MR. TERRILL: Okay. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: And my reasoning for that is, number 18 one, that's where everybody else is, and number two, you got 19 the biggest area of the county, and you probably got 20 potentially more miles to travel than anybody else. I don't 21 think I messed with your bond -- no, left that alone. You 22 didn't give me a whole lot to work on. 23 MR. TERRILL: We're in good shape, sir. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How many miles do you have 25 on your county car? (Laughter.) 7-30-08 bwk 94 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Zero. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You still drive your 3 personal vehicle? 4 MR. TERRILL: That's right, sir. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's a donation to the 6 County. 7 MR. TERRILL: That's correct, sir. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And he has a different one 9 now; he just got an upgrade. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You troublemaker. I cannot 11 believe you. 12 MR. TERRILL: That's me. That's all I've got, Your 13 Honor. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Looks good. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Bob. Appreciate it. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, sir. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: $14,000 less than Constable, 18 Precinct 3. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, okay. We're going to go to 20 the County Attorney. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Uh-oh. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What page is that on? 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Candy. 24 MR. EMERSON: Absolutely. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's it? 7-30-08 bwk 95 1 MR. EMERSON: For now. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's see how we do here. 3 MR. EMERSON: There may be a full-size candy bar 4 waiting later. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Wow. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's first look at what's 7 here. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What page? 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 30. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: And then we'll -- then we'll take a 11 look at what your -- I know you've got some special requests 12 that you -- and I'm not sure they're included here. Let's 13 mess with the middle of the budget first, and what did I do 14 to you? 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Didn't do a whole lot to him. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's cold in here. What are 17 you talking about? 18 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 19 MR. RUARK: Want it a little bigger, Rex? 20 MR. EMERSON: That's great, thank you. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: You have a 5,250 that went to 5,300, 22 according to this -- no, here's 5,250. 5,300 -- 23 MR. EMERSON: Sorry, which line item are we -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Only change that I see is 498, 25 public service account. 7-30-08 bwk 96 1 MR. EMERSON: The only changes I requested from 2 last year is I reduced my telephone by 200. I reduced my 3 statement of facts by 300. I reduced the public service 4 account by 1,300. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm wondering why I reduced to it 6 2,500, because it's based -- it doesn't make sense that I'd 7 do that. Doesn't make sense that you'd ask for 3,800 when 8 you're projected to spend almost 6,000 this year. 9 MR. EMERSON: Well, that was -- we made some 10 expenditures out of there for major -- I think we had a 11 computer and something else that we had to replace out of 12 there that weren't anticipated. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's that supposed to -- 14 what's public service? 15 MR. EMERSON: I think 2,500 is -- I can deal with 16 that. 3,800 is the 10 percent of the revenue that was 17 basically agreed on, but I don't think I'm actually going to 18 need that much, in the interest of trying to help everybody 19 out. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: I, frankly, don't recall why I would 21 have reduced to it 2,500, looking -- 22 MR. EMERSON: I don't think you did. I think I 23 did. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's not easy being a 7-30-08 bwk 97 1 mushroom. 2 MR. EMERSON: They were asking for additional cuts, 3 and that's one of the things that I shaved. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's just not easy being a 6 mushroom, is it, Judge? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: No, that's right. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What is the capital outlay? 10 I don't see that. 11 MR. EMERSON: It's 1,450, but it's contingent upon 12 the approval of -- 13 JUDGE TINLEY: The third lawyer. 14 MR. EMERSON: -- of the third lawyer. If the third 15 attorney is not approved, then I don't need that. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What would it be for? 17 MR. EMERSON: The computer and the printer and the 18 software to go with the -- 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Angel's computer. 20 MR. TROLINGER: Exactly. 21 MR. EMERSON: We have the office space, furniture 22 and everything else. I just don't have a computer. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's get to that. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I surrendered mine, so maybe 25 there's one available. 7-30-08 bwk 98 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Under -- other than what we've gone 2 through, the only other thing that's out of the ordinary is 3 your request for an additional attorney? 4 MR. EMERSON: Correct. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 6 MS. HARGIS: That's included. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: I guess we need to talk about that. 8 MR. EMERSON: Yes, sir. The -- the way our office 9 currently stands right now -- let me tell you the status. 10 When I originally came into office, we had three attorneys. 11 I eliminated one position, because the way it was structured 12 at the time was not very efficient. Since that time, the 13 caseload has shifted and changed, particularly in the last 14 year and a half. Right now, currently, we have 53 cases in 15 County Court at Law set for trial before the court, either 16 jury or bench trial. We have approximately a dozen cases 17 sitting in the J.P. courts waiting for trial. We have a 18 docket movement rate in County Court at Law of 110 percent. 19 So, we're trying to keep people out of your jail, keep Rusty 20 out of trouble, and save you money. We're -- protective 21 orders are up; we filed 17 year-to-date. We've rejected 22 probably half a dozen more over and above that. Adult 23 Protective Services, we're starting to show up more and more 24 in the Judge's court. Before, we never filed those. I mean, 25 we were never asked to file them. 7-30-08 bwk 99 1 JUDGE TINLEY: We probably had a half a dozen in 2 the last couple of months. 3 MR. EMERSON: Seven, to be exact. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 5 MR. EMERSON: Yeah, you're right on target. 6 Environmental cases, Ray and his department are doing a great 7 job. We filed a total of about 15 to 20 environmental cases 8 this year so far. Civil litigation, we have three major 9 cases going right now. We have the two environmental cases; 10 then we have the ranch in Jonathan's precinct that is 11 currently suing the County, so we're dealing with that issue. 12 Then over and above that, a tremendous amount of time spent 13 dealing with frigging cattle guards. (Laughter.) 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That can also be Precinct 3, I 15 guess. 16 MR. EMERSON: Juvenile court, 48 new kids so far 17 this year in the system. The docket's growing. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask you something. 19 How much has it grown percentage-wise over last year? All of 20 those things that you just brought up, just kind of a 21 ballpark. 22 MR. EMERSON: Well, protective orders are probably 23 up 25 percent. Adult Protective Services, 100 percent. 24 Environmental, probably 70, 80 percent. Civil litigation, 25 100 percent. County Court at Law, maybe 5 to 10 percent. 7-30-08 bwk 100 1 And juveniles, probably up 5 to 10 percent. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's the historic going back 3 four or five years, the number of attorneys in your office? 4 I mean -- 5 MR. EMERSON: Three up until when I came into 6 office in '05. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Three. That's including the 8 elected official? 9 MR. EMERSON: Correct. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I got to tell you, Rex, I 11 agree with you. You know, just watching the growth -- and, 12 you know, anybody in their right mind would understand the 13 growth in the county, and Rusty talks about the growth all 14 the time and what it does to his department, and we know that 15 it does the same thing to your department. And I've been 16 here a long time and have dealt with a lot of county 17 attorneys, and some of them are my dear friends, but we've 18 never had the -- as a commissioner, I've never had the 19 service out of the -- out of the County Attorney's office 20 like I have with you, and to me that is worth oodles and 21 oodles. I can't even -- I couldn't even put a price on that. 22 Because of, you know, the ability to know where I stand with 23 the state law. I mean, there's just not a number you can put 24 on that, and it's just super important, and you're the first 25 guy to come along that has -- that provides us with your 7-30-08 bwk 101 1 opinion on issues that, to me, keeps me out of jail. And 2 I -- 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Darn. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The damn jail's full, so we 5 don't have to worry about me going out there. But, anyway, 6 I'm in agreement. And when you came in, you're right, there 7 were three attorneys down there, and you got rid of one. So, 8 it's not like we're recreating the wheel or anything. We -- 9 we're doing the right thing here; I agree with you. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Not only did he get rid of 11 one, but the service to -- as you noted, the service to 12 Commissioners Court has been just like daylight and dawn. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Unbelievable. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And I appreciate that. But 15 next time when you give me a candy bar, will you give me a 16 whole one? (Laughter.) 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want -- I'm not going to 18 say anything on the record here in case we all get in trouble 19 over there. But -- 20 MR. EMERSON: It's the thought that counts, 21 Commissioner. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Buster, on the record, you need to 23 be cautious with those four-letter words, also. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What was it? 25 JUDGE TINLEY: The Community Journal might pick 7-30-08 bwk 102 1 that up. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: "Lawyer?" Oh, I said 3 "damn," didn't I? Yeah. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Uh-oh. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I apologize. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Stringing those together. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I totally echo the comments 8 of Precinct 1 and 2. You know, I was here once upon a time 9 whenever we had -- we had to actually hire a lawyer to get 10 service to Commissioners Court, because the one that -- the 11 County Attorney would not give us any kind of timely advice 12 or -- or opinions on anything. And -- 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's right. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- I totally agree with 15 getting another attorney. I can see what he's doing, you 16 know, and he's real responsive to anything that I have going. 17 Plus Environmental Health is aggressive with the things 18 they're doing, which has created a lot of work for that 19 office. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And their work has proven 22 to -- is proving to -- it's going to make a big difference in 23 the way this county looks in a lot of areas, but it takes 24 legal to get that -- get it done. So, I can't argue with 25 this one at all. 7-30-08 bwk 103 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It creates a logjam if you 2 don't do it, really, in lots of areas. Not a problem. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do you have space available 4 down there? 5 MR. EMERSON: We do have existing space, existing 6 furniture. No increase in support staff required. Everybody 7 in there's cross-trained, and we can just redistribute the 8 workload a little bit, keep on trucking. 9 MR. TROLINGER: Infrastructure's all in place for a 10 telephone, computer. It's just a matter of plugging in. 11 So -- 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I know criminal cases have 13 picked up moving, 'cause most of the arrests -- a lot of them 14 are misdemeanors, or both. And Rex is -- even though we're 15 having problems in the jail, we all know which courts those 16 are out of, and Rex has helped us drastically in that, and I 17 hate to see it slow down because of getting bogged down. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Rex, let me ask you something, if I 19 might. 20 MR. EMERSON: Yes, sir. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: The number that you have in here, 22 assuming that third lawyer comes on board, how's that going 23 to affect your attorney's fees? 24 MR. EMERSON: You can decrease those from 12,000 to 25 1,000. 7-30-08 bwk 104 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that -- Brooks is on -- no, his 2 retainer's more than that. That will need to be what, about 3 1,500? 4 MR. EMERSON: If you want to pay Brooks totally out 5 of that, yes. We've been supplementing. We've been paying 6 some of it out of there and some of it out of the Public 7 Information fund. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Then you want to reduce that 9 12 to -- 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: One. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: To 1,000? Okay. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is -- 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Hyde? Have you crunched all the 14 numbers based upon that request for a third lawyer? 15 MS. HYDE: We just put it in. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: You and the Auditor? 17 MS. HYDE: Right. She's already put it in, done 18 the FICA -- it's all in there. 19 MS. HARGIS: It's all in there. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: In what I'm looking at? 22 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What he's looking at? 24 MS. HYDE: That. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, this one, okay. But 7-30-08 bwk 105 1 that's basically the same -- 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I can't see. 3 MS. HYDE: I can't see yours, sir, I'm sorry. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're not -- I don't think we 5 have access to that one, Buster. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But you can look at it up here. 8 You -- we can't get it on here. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is the numbers different? 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Different screen. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Same as mine. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, there's something 13 illegal going on here, Rex. Let's see how good you are. 14 This third attorney, I'm -- I'm thinking I'm seeing it built 15 in here. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's in here. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: I just want to make sure all the 18 numbers have been crunched and what was here was what needed 19 to be here so we can move on. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, okay. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that it? 22 MR. EMERSON: That's it. Just thank you very much. 23 And by doing that, we'll certainly be able to keep the 24 service and hopefully improve things. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Keep it coming. Right, Buster? 7-30-08 bwk 106 1 MR. EMERSON: Do you want a full size? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 3 MR. EMERSON: Thank y'all. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: One more call to the City 5 Attorney, please. 6 MR. EMERSON: I'm going to go back downstairs and 7 call again. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Good luck. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We come to the Auditor. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What page is that? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 34. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Listen to Bruce down there 13 working. All right. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 34. 15 MS. HARGIS: Take one and pass them around. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: According to the recent 17 Attorney General thing, I don't know why we need to look at 18 this one. We don't have any authority on it. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: We have some. Okay, Ms. Hargis, 20 let's look at the middle of your budget first that I've been 21 tinkering with. Looks like I've reduced your office supplies 22 by about $500. Does that give you a lot of heartburn? 23 MS. HARGIS: Well, the cartridges, unfortunately -- 24 and what we've run into is that every once in a while -- 25 actually, quite frequently, for some reason or another, when 7-30-08 bwk 107 1 people go to print, they print on our -- on our copy machine 2 instead of their own, and so our toner's -- the toner and the 3 printer cartridges alone, just for the one we use the most, 4 is $400. It's $800 just to keep that one running. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me -- let me backtrack on you 6 here. 7 MS. HARGIS: And we're now buying those. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. The year-to-date actual shows 9 over 3,500, so apparently I didn't take that into account. I 10 should not have reduced that. It's going back to four. 11 MS. HARGIS: I am going to try to see -- we have a 12 process that I'm going to try to eliminate printing and see 13 if that doesn't help our cartridges, 'cause we have several 14 printers. I'm going to try to see what we can do to get rid 15 of some of that. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. That takes care of the middle 17 part of your budget. You've got some personnel issues we 18 need to talk about, I think, right? 19 MS. HARGIS: Right. And, actually, after the 20 letter was written, and even though I'm giving it to you this 21 morning, we've had some even greater changes, which the Judge 22 is aware of, and my clerk that's been there the longest 23 resigned yesterday, and so now I'm down to one. I would tell 24 you that I'm not capable of training two people at one time, 25 so there's no way I could -- even though I've requested a 7-30-08 bwk 108 1 second person -- I mean a third person, which was to fill the 2 position that Mindy left, with this employee leaving, now 3 it's going to take probably two or three months just to train 4 that one. We will try to find someone that -- you know, that 5 has the skill-set that we need. It's -- it's just that what 6 I've discovered over the last year I've had additional help, 7 which was kind of a strange situation for me, but being that 8 the prior Auditor was there, he was able to do and knew how 9 to do a lot of the work in connection with the audit, and the 10 other audits that were there. This year that leaves me doing 11 all of it, in addition to the GASB-45, which Eva and I are 12 going to have to work on, which we've put off for a while, 13 'cause the information that they ask for is tremendous. And 14 we're going to have to go through that to get that done, 15 because that has to be put on the audit in the following 16 year, so we have to get it done so they get their work done 17 and present it to us. 18 We -- as I said in my letter, we do produce a lot 19 of checks. The actual entries are even greater than the 20 number of checks, because, for instance, the phone bill is 21 only one check, but it's broken down by 49 departments. So, 22 we have to first do a spreadsheet, send that out to all 49 23 departments, get them to sign off on it, so there's -- 24 there's more there than just issuing a bill. And, 25 unfortunately, two clerks, as you know, they've built up a 7-30-08 bwk 109 1 lot of comp time this year, and they spend most of their time 2 doing checks, checking the indigent health care, things of 3 that nature. We can hurry, but then the problem is we make 4 mistakes; we don't catch their mistakes. And, you know, I'm 5 -- I don't have 17 years behind me. I've got a year, so it's 6 a little difficult. It's -- we put a lot of work out of that 7 office. 8 Ken has come on board as a part-time person really 9 only towards the last couple of months, as you know. That 10 was to help us with this budget process. But prior to that, 11 he was only doing the internal audits as -- as he could 12 get -- you know, get to them. That was the other thing. We 13 hadn't done internal audits since 2000, or -- or longer than 14 that. I think we had done a few departments, but not 15 majorly. Some of the audits are required all the time. 16 Like, I'm supposed to be out at the commissary at least 17 annually, and I'd like to get out there, you know, every six 18 months, and I'm still working with training on that 19 particular avenue. So, there's a lot of places I need to be 20 that I personally can't be because I have to do a lot of the 21 spreadsheets and things of that nature, because I've not 22 really had staff with the expertise that had that. 23 So, that's another -- you know, when I hire the new 24 person, perhaps we're going to be able to get the skill-set 25 that we need. I basically backed it down to a half a year 7-30-08 bwk 110 1 that I'd like to hire someone, at least after we get into -- 2 you know, six months into the year. I -- right now, I don't 3 know exactly how it's going to work. She's going to probably 4 be leaving -- she told us yesterday the 29th, but it looks 5 like that's not going to be -- after talking with her after 6 we got back to my office yesterday, it's probably going to be 7 in the next couple weeks, so I'm going to be down to one 8 person. So, it's going to be -- and no one trained in 9 indigent health care, so that's going to be another problem 10 as well. I mean, we can input it, but the knowledge that 11 Nona had, and the knowledge of -- of those clients, so she 12 knew which client might be going over the 30,000, who might 13 be taking advantage of us, who should have been Medicaid, 14 that's going to take time to train. 15 So, we're going to either have to slow down -- 16 we've tried to get the bills out on time. I will say we've 17 paid no late charges this year, and there were a lot of late 18 charges being paid last year when I got here, so we have no 19 late charges. We are holding within the budget this year, 20 because we've been able to give you those amendments and try 21 to keep everybody within their own budgets. They've not gone 22 out. And, you know, Rusty's still within his own. We 23 grabbed a little bit of his for insurance for 24 nondepartmental, but other than that, we haven't. It's up to 25 y'all, but it's -- you know, I'm only one person. I can only 7-30-08 bwk 111 1 do so much. I spend usually 10 to 12 hours a day here. To 2 be honest with you, you know, I'm getting a little tired of 3 spending 10 to 12 hours a day. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Hargis, it occurs to me that 5 maybe what we're looking at right now may not be a correct 6 reflection. There may be some additional considerations as a 7 result of what got dropped on you yesterday. I guess my 8 question is, based on what we're looking at now, are we able 9 to intelligently move forward and consider your budget, or do 10 you need to do some reworking and maybe bring it back to us? 11 MS. HARGIS: Well, to be honest with you, I haven't 12 even been able -- yesterday this was dropped on us very late 13 in the day, so we don't even really know, you know, the 14 parameters of what we're going to offer for the person to 15 fill that position. So, I'm kind of in, you know, limbo. To 16 say that I know exactly what we're going to do, I don't. I 17 know I'd like to get somebody that's a little bit more 18 qualified. However, the salary that she had, because of the 19 tenure, should be sufficient to bring somebody in of a 20 qualified nature. That person, again, will need to be 21 trained, and because there's only three of us in there most 22 of the time, it takes -- it's going to take me 90 days to 23 train that person. Plus, at the same time, we have to get 24 the audit out. So, we have the auditors coming online this 25 year; supposedly be here in November. 7-30-08 bwk 112 1 You know, I'm going to ask, you know, Ken to -- if 2 he will be kind of enough to work those hours to stay with me 3 for that. But there's just a lot of -- I really don't know 4 exactly, because this is my first year to go into all of 5 these other areas totally without -- without the prior 6 auditor being here. The fixed assets was a huge drop last 7 year. We're trying to keep up with it this year, but there 8 is new requirements under GASB for this year. As you all are 9 aware of, the software was messed up on the GASB-34. I've 10 got to make sure we fix that, which I haven't gotten done 11 yet, because it's not just to go in there and fix it and it 12 goes away. It's going to take me, you know, about a week to 13 be very careful that I don't mess that up. That program is 14 not exactly the greatest program, but it's what we have. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It sounds like what the Judge 16 recommended makes sense. Come back with your -- look at 17 yours again. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, with solutions -- more 19 solutions. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. She's in the -- the numbers 21 we're working with may be okay, but I think, based on what's 22 happened to her just in the last 24 hours, she needs an 23 opportunity to really go back and -- and reconfigure if she 24 needs to, and then we'll look at it again. Because you got a 25 real short ship right now. 7-30-08 bwk 113 1 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. And with only two weeks notice 2 of a -- of an employee who's been there nine years, that's 3 pretty tough. She's my most experienced employee. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Does that sound like a reasonable 5 solution to you? And we'll, maybe next week, take a look at 6 yours. 7 MS. HARGIS: That will be fine with me, if that's 8 all right with y'all. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What about tomorrow? You're 10 giving her too much leeway. 11 MS. HARGIS: Buster wants to help me, right? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. No, but I want you to 13 be more comfortable, and stand there and say positive 14 solutions. I mean, all I hear coming out of your mouth is 15 the mountain that we have to climb. My god, I feel sorry, 16 but I want to hear the solutions. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Was that you? All right. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That was a sob. I want to 19 hear solutions. 20 MS. HARGIS: Right. But I only had an hour to find 21 a solution, and I didn't quite have that time this morning. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now you have a week and an 23 hour, so I think that's terrific. 24 MS. HARGIS: All right, thanks. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We'll go to the -- 7-30-08 bwk 114 1 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: I thought you were climbing that 3 mountain and you were already worn out. Let's go to the 4 Treasurer. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What page, Bruce? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Next page. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Next page. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Next page. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Got it. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm trying to figure out what I did 11 to you, Mindy. What did I do to you? 12 MS. WILLIAMS: I think you took 600 out of postage, 13 and I think I can live with that. I just checked the balance 14 that we've used to-date, and we're still within -- I think 15 we're right at $2,000 used. So I think cutting the 600 will 16 be okay. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: I took 500 out of your -- 18 MS. WILLIAMS: Office supplies. I've been real 19 frugal with what I've been buying. I don't just buy what -- 20 what I'd like to have; I buy what I need, and I just wait and 21 wait and try to find the best price. And I cut 600 on my 22 lease copier. The lease comes up either in October or 23 November this year. I can keep this same copier for another 24 year at the same rate, and then maybe the following year's 25 budget will be a little easier. I'd like to upgrade to where 7-30-08 bwk 115 1 I can use it as a printer, scanner, stuff like that. But I 2 -- I cut this 600 out of there. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. After I -- after I -- 4 MS. WILLIAMS: Right. That was -- that was the one 5 area that I saw that I could actually cut when we discussed 6 the -- 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me ask you this, Ms. Williams. 8 If you -- if your new copier can be utilized for scanning and 9 other uses -- 10 MS. WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: -- from a -- from a labor and 12 personnel efficiency standpoint, would that be greater than 13 the 600 bucks? 14 MS. WILLIAMS: I think it would. Because right 15 now, we're having to print all our reports and stuff off the 16 little 1320 H.P. that we have in the office, and we do a lot 17 of reports. We also use it to print our direct deposit 18 stubs. You know, the 5,000 that we have is strictly for 19 printing our payroll and A.P. checks. The little 1320 is a 20 workhorse. But John can attest, it could go out any time, 21 and then we're stuck. So, if I could upgrade my copier to 22 use it as a network printer, like H.R.'s using, and the 23 Auditor's office, I think -- 24 JUDGE TINLEY: What you're saying is the efficiency 25 that you'll gain will be far greater than -- 7-30-08 bwk 116 1 MS. WILLIAMS: The amount of money that we cut. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: -- than the $600 that we're talking 3 about here. 4 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes. 5 MS. HYDE: Absolutely. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That makes sense -- 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, sure. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- to do that. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll go back to 2,400 on that one, 10 then. 11 MS. HARGIS: She needs that scanning capability as 12 well. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Pardon? 14 MS. HARGIS: This scanning capability is -- 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that's part of the efficiency 16 aspect I was inquiring about. 17 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 18 MS. HYDE: And the reports. Bless her heart. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Other than that -- 20 MS. WILLIAMS: I think I can live with the postage 21 cut and the office supply cut. The postage, I had increased, 22 'cause I wasn't real sure how the Post Office was -- how much 23 they were going to go up next year. 24 MS. HYDE: Another penny. 25 MS. WILLIAMS: Another penny? 7-30-08 bwk 117 1 MS. HYDE: Another penny to three pennies, 2 depending on gas. 3 MS. WILLIAMS: We'll be fine. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Is that it? 5 MS. WILLIAMS: That's it. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, ma'am. 7 MS. WILLIAMS: Thank you. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Kevin, I think you're up, if 9 I can find you here. 10 MR. RUARK: 76. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. He's way on down the -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Fund 76? 13 MR. RUARK: Yeah. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which? 15 MR. RUARK: Fund 76, and I'll get you there in a 16 second. Page -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How many trees did you kill? 18 MR. RUARK: 169. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which one? 20 MR. RUARK: 169. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 169. Is that Page 169? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 168. 23 MS. HARGIS: Actually, 169 is the revenues. You 24 need to go to 170. 25 MR. RUARK: 170 is the department. 7-30-08 bwk 118 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Gosh, what have we done here? 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't know. It's 3 printing. 4 MR. STANTON: The real reason I passed you out -- 5 gave you that is because of the blue tab in the back, and 6 that's the revenue projections for this year, this current 7 budget year that we're in, and then next year's revenue 8 projections. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Under the blue tab? 10 MR. STANTON: Yes, sir. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, initially, based upon our 12 budgeting procedure, Kevin is considerably ahead of -- of 13 where we projected. His -- his portion of the support for 14 the budget based upon his revenue is greater than what we 15 projected by -- what's the percentage, roughly? 25 percent 16 or more? 17 MR. STANTON: Somewhere in that area, sir. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: It's considerably more than -- 19 MR. STANTON: It's -- from talking to the County 20 Auditor, we're able to -- and I'm sure she'll get into more 21 depth about it, but we're able to cut the ad valorem taxes 22 that we're going to be using by over $257,000 this next year. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: That portion of the support of this 24 facility. 25 MR. STANTON: Yes, sir. 7-30-08 bwk 119 1 MS. HARGIS: Yes. Because he's -- his fund balance 2 is increased. It's -- he actually was running about an 3 $82,000 fund balance in all prior years, and this year he 4 jumped, beginning of the year, to 218 -- 218,000, and right 5 now he's at 372,000. So, his beginning fund balance is going 6 to enable us not to have to levy such a large ad valorem tax. 7 And he's also collecting from the other -- other counties 8 that use the facility as well as from ourselves, and so it's 9 becoming a self-funding -- very much a self-funding entity on 10 its own. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: We're not there yet, but we're a 12 whole lot closer than where we were. 13 MS. HARGIS: Yes, we are. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Very good. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that's -- 16 MS. HARGIS: And Kevin knows better than I, he can 17 quote you most of the items. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, Kevin. We've gone over this 19 budget, and -- 20 MR. STANTON: The only reductions that we -- that I 21 made prior was we cut $10,000 out of the utilities budget, 22 $4,300 out of the general maintenance budget, $1,200 out of 23 the training budget, and $1,000 out of the operating 24 equipment budget. The increases are like everybody else's, 25 basically. I mean, vehicle transportation, the cost of gas. 7-30-08 bwk 120 1 We had -- we had asked for a $3,900 increase. The Judge cut 2 it back down to 4,500 total, and that's -- that's fine. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which line? 4 MR. STANTON: That one. 5 MS. HARGIS: 331. 6 MR. STANTON: 331. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Got you. 8 MR. STANTON: You know, we requested a $1,000 9 increase in the medical line item. That's all totally 10 reimbursed by all the counties, so that's kind of a wash. I 11 mean, we get -- any money that we spend on residential 12 medical, we get back from the counties. There was a 13 recommendation to increase the telephone line item by $1,300. 14 The -- one of the issues that we have run into is the 15 professional services, our nurses. We were carrying two 16 nurses last year, and just because we weren't sure how it was 17 going to work. This year, we're going to reduce that to one 18 nurse, but that one nurse is going to be able to spend more 19 time out there with our kids, so we're having to request 20 about a $3,400 increase to pay her salary to be out there to 21 do the things that we need done with our kids. And then the 22 $3,500 increase in the capital outlay item, that's to 23 purchase a door-check system, a computerized door-check 24 system, where we can get away with -- or not "get away with"; 25 where we can get away from -- right now, we're having to 7-30-08 bwk 121 1 hand-write, every 10 minutes, our -- the J.D.O.'s have to 2 make visual contact with the kids as long as they're in the 3 rooms, 24 hours a day, seven days a week. And right now, 4 we're having door sheets, and we're just trying to save 5 trees. We're having to print out door sheets for every door 6 in the facility, and then we have J.D.O.'s that go by and 7 have to write on those door sheets every 10 minutes. And for 8 this $3,500, we're able to put a little computer chip on each 9 door, and the JDO walks by and touches it with a wand, pushes 10 a button on the wand, goes back and sits the wand in the 11 holder, and it prints out on the computer screen all of the 12 door checks. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: And those door checks are -- are 14 T.J.P.C. mandated. 15 MR. STANTON: Yes, sir. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: And that's probably -- when they 17 make their annual -- they call them audits. Not -- I like to 18 refer to them as A.G.I's, Annual General Inspections, as the 19 military would call them. That's probably the first thing 20 that they look at and what they -- what they grade you most 21 on, are those blasted door checks. 22 MR. STANTON: Yeah, they -- they're pretty anal 23 about them. They -- to be honest, I mean, they go through -- 24 they have formulas that they go through to make sure that 25 you're not doing them in a pattern. You can't do them every 7-30-08 bwk 122 1 15 minutes or every 10 minutes, and you can't do them every 2 6 minutes, 8 minutes, and 10 minutes, and 6-8-10. I mean, 3 they have to be totally random. And they'll write you up if 4 they can find five in a sequence that look like they're in 5 some kind of order, you know. So -- 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Where somebody's penciled in the 7 deal is what they're talking about. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure. 9 MR. STANTON: The other increase was up in the 10 salary part. That wasn't there before, was the overtime 11 issue. And that was an increase of about $7,600, and that's 12 to cover -- to pay the holiday pay; instead of letting the 13 employees keep that money on those -- that time on the books, 14 to go ahead and then pay them out when they work holidays. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Makes your staffing much 16 easier that way. 17 MR. STANTON: It makes it easier, and it makes it 18 where we don't have as much time on the books, where if 19 somebody would resign or quit, get fired, we're having to pay 20 all this holiday time out, and it's less time that I'm going 21 to have to let them take and pull part-timers in. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: 'Cause you're pretty tight on 23 staffing anyway, aren't you? 24 MR. STANTON: Yes, sir. Yes, sir. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do you have any staffing 7-30-08 bwk 123 1 problems? 2 MR. STANTON: No, sir. We're -- we're in total 3 compliance as far as staffing goes. I mean, the only issues 4 we ever run into is when we have people out on extended 5 leaves. We've got -- we had two go out on FMLA this last 6 year, and that was a -- that was kind of a heartache. And 7 we've got one that I know that's going to be going out for an 8 extended period of time coming up in October -- September or 9 October. She'll probably be out for six to eight weeks. 10 That's going to be going out on FMLA, so -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, for me, Kevin, I totally 12 support what you've done out there. You've done a fabulous 13 job of getting that thing propped up where, to the extent it 14 can be, it's self-supporting, and you keep going that 15 direction. And -- 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Come a long way. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: A long way in a short period of 18 time. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mm-hmm. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Great job. 21 MR. STANTON: I appreciate that, thank you. I 22 didn't do it myself. I mean, we've had a lot of help out 23 there. We really have. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the fact that you don't have 25 staffing problems, that, in and of itself, speaks highly of 7-30-08 bwk 124 1 you. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure does. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Because that's -- that's not an easy 4 place to staff. That's a -- that's a pretty high-stress 5 situation. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And that's one of the major 7 problems we had before. We appreciate your efforts. 8 MR. STANTON: Thank y'all. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is the Sheriff paying 10 attention to this conversation? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I hope so. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Appears to be. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Buster said that. 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Let's see if it gets repeated 15 when my budget comes up. (Laughter.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else, Kevin? 17 MR. STANTON: No, sir, that's all. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: I think we're in good shape. Thank 20 you. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Thank you, Kevin. 22 MR. STANTON: Thank y'all. Oh, one other thing 23 real quick, and this is not something -- it's something that 24 I'm looking into further down the road, was that I've been 25 talking to the chief of Juvenile Probation, and we've been 7-30-08 bwk 125 1 talking about some way of him getting rid of the van -- not 2 getting rid of it, but trying to find a better use of the van 3 out there. And our van that we have -- and I'm just giving 4 you guys a heads-up; the van that we have out there right now 5 has got about 120,000 miles on it. It's a smaller van, which 6 a lot of times we're having to borrow the Probation 7 Department's van to transport kids to and from court, because 8 our van won't hold the number of kids that we need to 9 transport. So, we're looking at -- Jason and I have been 10 talking about seeing if there's some way that we can maybe 11 purchase the van from the Probation Department or do 12 something that -- maybe some way, instead of having to go out 13 and buy a new van, if we could access the van that they 14 currently have through the Probation Department. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: What about some sort of co-op 16 arrangement? Have y'all talked about that? 17 MR. STANTON: No, we really haven't. We've just -- 18 we were joking around this morning, and I offered him a 19 dollar for his van, and he said he'd take it. So -- 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'll offer him two. We had to 21 borrow it last week. 22 MS. HYDE: Three. 23 MR. DAVIS: For 35,000, I'll say "sold." 24 MS. HYDE: No. 25 MR. STANTON: Thank y'all very much. 7-30-08 bwk 126 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Kevin. Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Custodial and grounds first? 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Facilities and maintenance. How 4 many different accounts you got there? 5 MS. HYDE: A bunch. 6 MR. RUARK: 510, 511, 513, and 666. 7 MR. BOLLIER: Four total. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 510, we're going to start on? 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, we'll go to 510. 10 MR. BOLLIER: 510. And uniforms, I would like to 11 put all my uniforms in that one line item instead of having 12 them separated, so we can keep up with it a little easier. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, that's -- yeah, some of the 14 changes -- some of the changes that you've made, you've 15 incorporated some of your personnel matters from one budget 16 into another and zeroed out in other places. Let's go to 17 where we -- I think I figured that out and didn't mess with 18 that uniforms figure. Isn't that what we're showing up 19 there? 20 MS. HARGIS: No, down a little bit, Judge. You 21 went down from 26,9 to 24,5. 22 MR. RUARK: Uniform and supplies. 316 is uniforms. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. That's what I'm looking at, 24 is uniforms. Is there something else I need to be looking at 25 there? 7-30-08 bwk 127 1 MS. HARGIS: No, I'm sorry. 2 MR. BOLLIER: No, sir, not that I can see. 3 MR. RUARK: Uniforms. 4 MR. BOLLIER: Uniforms right there, yes. We will 5 -- are you at the 7,720? 6 MR. RUARK: Yes. 7 MR. BOLLIER: Okay, that's right. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Now, I did cut your supplies 9 by about $2,500; reduced that to 24,5. 10 MR. BOLLIER: That's fine. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: You didn't incorporate anything else 12 back into that from another budget, did you? 13 MR. BOLLIER: No, sir, I did not. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I was looking at your 15 historical use here, and I figured basically what you were 16 allocated last year was okay, and I just ran that off of 17 24,5. 18 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: What else did I do to you? 20 MR. BOLLIER: You didn't do anything. We tried to 21 go back down on contract fees. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: I did on telephone. 23 MR. BOLLIER: Did you? 24 JUDGE TINLEY: I reduced you 450. 25 MR. BOLLIER: You went to 2,450? 7-30-08 bwk 128 1 MS. HARGIS: 2,400. 2 MR. BOLLIER: Yeah, okay. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Am I cutting that too close? Or -- 4 MR. BOLLIER: I don't think so, Judge. I think I 5 added just a hair more to it. I think we'll be fine. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Utilities, I chopped that a 7 little bit. I realize utility costs are going up, but your 8 projected for this year is 46,5. 9 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: And you've got 78 there. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Raise the thermostat a little 12 bit; won't be so cold in here. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You can hang meat in here. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, electric power went 15 up 30 percent in everybody's bill last month. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- the add-on? Add-on factor? 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: You know, even at 46,5, that gives 19 you about a 50 percent float going to 67,5. 20 MR. BOLLIER: That's fine. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 22 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: You know, if you got any serious 24 objection, I want to know about it. 25 MR. BOLLIER: I'll let you know. 7-30-08 bwk 129 1 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't want to get in a hassle with 2 you, but I want to know what you think. 3 MR. BOLLIER: Wouldn't do any good to get in a 4 hassle, Judge. I'm going to lose anyway. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Might take that down to 60 6 instead of 67,5. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's a good attitude, 8 Tim. That's a good attitude. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Take it down to 60? 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I mean, you're looking 11 at -- if we're talking about a 30 percent increase, that's 12 going to be pretty well close in line. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's what KPUB says their 14 cost of power has increased -- 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- in the last 30, 60 days, 17 is 30 percent. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Basically, that 67 over a 19 projected year-end of 46,440. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's that projected year-end, 21 through what month? 'Cause it doesn't have June, July, 22 August in it. 23 MR. RUARK: It wouldn't. At this point, it 24 wouldn't. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's missing our three big 7-30-08 bwk 130 1 months of the year. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: We're going to leave it 67,5? 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm just suggesting, Judge. 5 I didn't hear anybody else jumping on the bandwagon. So, I 6 guess leave it where it is. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, 30 percent on top of 8 46 is -- 9 JUDGE TINLEY: That's almost 63,000 there. Adding 10 35 percent, so -- 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That was my point. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I didn't give much room 13 there, 67,5. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: 650 -- what did I cut there? Your 16 copier? How'd I come up with that? Or did you cut that to 17 650 on your copier, Tim? 18 MR. BOLLIER: I changed nothing, Judge. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 20 MR. BOLLIER: I changed nothing there. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, you're showing a year-end of 22 five, which is a little tough when your year-to-date is 514. 23 I may have amortized that one. I don't -- I don't know. 24 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: If you amortize that, looks like 7-30-08 bwk 131 1 it's going to come up pretty close to 800. We'd better move 2 that to 800. Line 461 goes to 800, Ken. 3 MR. RUARK: Okay. 4 MR. BOLLIER: We might go to 351, Ground 5 Maintenance there in 510. There's $12,000 in there. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 7 MS. HARGIS: He's not spent any of that. 8 MR. BOLLIER: I have not spent any of that money, 9 because what little work I have done out on the grounds 10 here -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Came out of that capital fund. 12 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, it did. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: There's still some money in the 14 capital fund. Are we going to carry that over into the next 15 budget year to the extent we haven't used it? 16 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: We can do that? 18 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir, that's capital project. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: We need to eliminate that 12, don't 20 we? 21 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How much is in the -- well, at 23 some point during the budget process, can we have a -- where 24 we are on that capital? 25 MS. HARGIS: Yes, I have that. We have the -- 7-30-08 bwk 132 1 other than the concrete, we haven't spent anything. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But this -- I've lost track of 3 what we allocated for what all. 4 MS. HARGIS: I have it. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Tim, let's talk about your -- 6 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: -- your contract fees. Does any of 8 that relate to anything that's in -- you show 14,520. Does 9 any of that relate to any of these capital items that were 10 included in that issue where we had all these other capital 11 items? 12 MR. BOLLIER: No, sir. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Those are, like, your service 15 contracts on -- 16 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: -- on various pieces of equipment 18 and that sort of stuff? 19 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, I'm with you. Operating 21 equipment, you haven't spent any, but -- 22 MR. BOLLIER: No, sir. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: But I expect before the year's out, 24 you're going to -- 25 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. That operating -- 7-30-08 bwk 133 1 JUDGE TINLEY: -- figure out what you need? 2 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. That operating equipment 3 is what we usually buy vacuum cleaners and parts for. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 5 MR. BOLLIER: So -- out of that 510. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 7 MR. BOLLIER: We haven't used any of that. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Are we through with 510? 9 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Wait just a second, Judge. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Hold it. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The Court is aware that 14 there's a possibility that the County could acquire another 15 building. We've talked about it. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Another building we could be 18 acquiring. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: County could be acquiring 20 another building. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And discussing with the 23 principles of that what their average had been in the last 24 few years on R and M, I think from this end of the table, 25 we're suggesting that in Line 450, we plug in 25. Just -- 7-30-08 bwk 134 1 MS. HARGIS: I'm sorry, I can't hear. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just as a contingency. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On Line 450, plug in 25,000. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: As a contingency item for 5 the possibility that that could take place. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And there's a pretty good 7 possibility. We're just waiting. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Some decisions have to be 10 made. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Are you on board with that, 12 Ken? 13 MR. RUARK: Yeah. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Is that it on 510? 15 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, if the Commissioners are 16 happy. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm thrilled. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're always happy. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Happy as a clam. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: In the mud. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: In the soup. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We go to jail maintenance, 23 right? 24 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. And the only change that I 25 made there is, like I said in 510, I took out the uniforms 7-30-08 bwk 135 1 out of 511 and plugged them into 510. And that should be all 2 the changes, I think. I got to look at 451. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I cut back your jail repairs line 4 item. 5 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Looks like $6,500, based upon 7 historical use. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We got 65. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. He asked for 75. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, what's the number of the 12 administration recommended? 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 68,5. 14 MR. BOLLIER: 68. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: We can't tell you that, Buster. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I know. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: That's classified. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If we tell you, we have to 19 kill you. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What does this one say? 21 JUDGE TINLEY: It's going to say 68,5. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 23 MR. BOLLIER: Well, the original budget -- I mean, 24 last year's budget was 72,000. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 70. 7-30-08 bwk 136 1 MR. BOLLIER: 70,000, okay. I'm off on the wrong 2 thing. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's the number? 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Projected year-end, 48,636. 5 MR. BOLLIER: What did you change it to, Judge? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 68,5. 7 MS. HARGIS: Keep in mind, we don't know. We've 8 projected that. We don't know what else he's got in mind. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's true. It's kind of 10 an unknown out there. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, the only thing I would 12 say is, we did have a trustee that was a licensed electrician 13 and did major work this last year at no expense except for 14 parts to the county. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You think he may be coming 16 back?. (Laughter.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else you can arrest him 18 for? 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Unfortunately, he just left. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Does he know something you 21 don't know? 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: This person was classified out 23 right where I could keep him out, and he did thousands and 24 thousands of dollars worth of work for the county. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Is this individual on probation now? 7-30-08 bwk 137 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, he will be on parole when 2 he gets back from -- this is one of those issues that the 3 District Judge is real upset with me over, because I kept 4 this inmate intentionally instead of sending him to T.D.C., 5 and he's going to argue that my overcrowding is because I did 6 that, but I did that due to the electrician license, and this 7 person's saved this county thousands. 8 MR. BOLLIER: He did that -- 9 MR. TROLINGER: We had a couple -- or $2,500 worth 10 of wiring just for Information Technology. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: So, just figuring this, I 12 don't know -- you know, and when we try and get trustees, if 13 I've got some that are good that we can use, yes, it saves 14 Maintenance a lot of money, but I just can't tell you whether 15 I'm going to have them each year or not. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the -- mentioning that 17 holdover may be the least of your worries. They may have a 18 lot of other uncomplimentary things to say about you too, 19 Sheriff. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'm sure they're going to have 21 quite a bit to say after the last few days. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I got a note of 3,500, major 23 repairs, and I realize that's what was budgeted this past 24 year, but so far, nothing's been spent. Have we got anything 25 that we're really anticipating? 7-30-08 bwk 138 1 MR. BOLLIER: No, sir. No, sir. The only thing 2 I'm anticipating is probably a new sallyport motor, but 3 that'll be in next -- that'll be next year. I had to replace 4 a sallyport door; that was a little over $5,000, which was -- 5 I replaced that. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Has that not come in yet, the bill? 7 MR. BOLLIER: The bill has not come in on that yet; 8 it was just done yesterday. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 MR. BOLLIER: And then plus I -- I held back on 11 getting the motor, because I'm hoping that the old motor will 12 last and get me through into next year. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So, you have expended that 14 account for this year, and plus some more. 15 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, I have. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: We just haven't seen it yet. 17 MR. BOLLIER: Just haven't seen it yet. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where are you on your 19 replacement of air conditioners? 20 MR. BOLLIER: I've already got five brand new ones 21 up there on top, sir. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They're working. 23 MR. BOLLIER: They're done; they're working. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are there any plans for any 25 more? 7-30-08 bwk 139 1 MR. BOLLIER: I did not make any plans, sir. I 2 want to make sure that -- 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sheriff's smiling. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Sheriff, bring me your gun up here 5 so that I'll have the benefit of it. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No. 7 MR. BOLLIER: No, sir. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: What you were saying about 9 future major repairs, the other air-conditioners, the 10 remainder -- 11 MR. BOLLIER: The remainder of -- 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay, whatever it is up there 13 is definitely going to be an issue. And the only other issue 14 that I have that we've -- we know about it, each year -- 15 we've been making it each year without having to go into it, 16 but I am really concerned about our boiler room and our water 17 storage tank, and those leak a little bit. If we -- that 18 means taking out a side of a wall to replace -- to take that 19 thing out. That's an issue that we've been saying our 20 prayers and crossing our fingers on. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's one of those things. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You inspect your boiler -- 23 how often is your boiler inspected? 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Every year, okay? It's passed 25 -- I mean, it passes all our inspections. But it does have 7-30-08 bwk 140 1 rust; it does have corrosion. It does have a little leak in 2 it. It's not going to be -- it's kind of like trying to 3 replace a humongous hot water heater, is what it's going to 4 amount to. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we just need to plan 6 for it, and this isn't the year to plan, unless -- if it 7 breaks during the year, you just got to do an emergency and 8 fix it. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's what -- kind of what I 10 did. 11 MR. BOLLIER: Only way out of there is to take town 12 a wall to get it out of there, 'cause it's huge. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Back on the air conditioners -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Or cut it up. 15 MR. BOLLIER: We can probably cut it up. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's what we'll have to do. 17 It's getting a new one in. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On the air-conditioners, is 19 there -- are any of them in bad enough shape -- 'cause we 20 talked about replacing them. 21 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, we did. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are we going to start a cycle 23 to replace them next year, or 2009-2010? 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Did we not save a bunch of 25 money on what we had projected the cost of five would be? 7-30-08 bwk 141 1 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, we did. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean -- 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Could we maybe take and 4 budget some of those funds for five more next year? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Or three. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's kind of why I 7 brought the question up. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Where we can stay on cycle on 9 some kind of a yearly purchase until they're all replaced. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's why I brought it up. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Hargis, those weren't out of any 13 capital item, were they? 14 MS. HARGIS: No. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Off the top of your head, are 16 there any capital funds that might be available to utilize 17 for that? 18 MS. HARGIS: I think that came in at about 35,000, 19 40,000, didn't it? As I recall. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: The five that we replaced were about 21 26. 22 MR. BOLLIER: The five that we put up there were 23 26-something. 24 MS. HARGIS: So, we have 25 -- 25 MR. BOLLIER: We have 25,000? 7-30-08 bwk 142 1 MS. HARGIS: -- left out of that. I don't know if 2 we have any other capital -- I didn't look at all of them. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can probably get another 4 three in this year's budget. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Or four. I think we ought to 6 do it. I don't think we ought to break a year out of the 7 cycle of starting to replace those that need to be replaced. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Me, too. I agree. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Especially if we have the 10 money. We've already borrowed the money; it's designated for 11 that purpose. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We're lucky enough to have 13 enough savings on what was projected to almost pay for it. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This year's. I think we 15 ought to do it. 16 MS. HARGIS: Just go ahead and do it now? Because 17 then it wouldn't reflect in next year's budget. Go ahead and 18 order them now, and spend money on it now? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I don't want -- how bad 20 are they? 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right now, all of them are 22 working, okay. They are 13 years old. They run 24 hours a 23 day, pretty well. It's one or the other. Now, they do a 24 great job of keeping up the maintenance on them, you know, 25 changing everything monthly, so they're doing good. Because 7-30-08 bwk 143 1 there is one other issue that -- that's going to have to be 2 looked at sometime, too, is we do have a number of roof 3 leaks. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Number of what? 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Roof leaks. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Those capital items weren't 7 designated for air conditioners, were they? 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Like a cattle guard. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That money has to be spent 10 on -- 11 MS. HARGIS: No, you -- you put the 50,000 aside 12 for air conditioners, but the cost was less. So, you 13 could -- you know, can do a budget amendment and change what 14 you're going to do with them. I would prefer taking 15 whatever's left in there and showing it as a -- a payable for 16 next year, you know, within that 90-day period, rather than 17 -- because it's going to come up in your fund balance, but 18 it's still going to raise this year's budget, whereas if we 19 show it as, you know, a payable for next year, which we can 20 do for a certain length of time to hold the air-conditioners, 21 that 25,000, open. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why can't we -- I mean, I 23 thought I heard you say earlier we could carry those funds 24 over to next year. 25 MS. HARGIS: All you're really doing is putting 7-30-08 bwk 144 1 that in your beginning fund balance. That's what you can do. 2 So it's not really going to -- all you're going to do is 3 increase this year's budget and show a bigger fund balance, 4 but it's -- that's what you're going to do. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: What you're talking about is 6 carrying it over into the early part of next year's budget as 7 an encumbrance? 8 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: So that the budget itself for 10 '08-'09 is not increased, but you have those funds available. 11 What you're doing is reducing the fund balance for that 12 particular budget going into the next year, because you've 13 encumbered $24,000, roughly, already. 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: If I can suggest something on 15 preparing and not knowing, because there are locks -- I 16 wouldn't say let's go ahead and replace another five air 17 conditioners. You need to have emergency funds or something 18 there, because we are going to have -- but I can't tell y'all 19 whether the roof ought to be replaced first, whether air 20 conditioner units ought to be replaced first, boiler, or 21 there are some serious locking mechanism issues and corrosion 22 into the back, whether that's going to have to be -- I hate 23 to see you spend it on air conditioners when that could have 24 lasted another year, when we had something else go out during 25 the year that we're going to need it on. 7-30-08 bwk 145 1 JUDGE TINLEY: What you're telling me is that you 2 haven't identified and Tim hasn't identified some specific 3 air conditioners that are on their last leg that need to be 4 replaced? 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You took care of those with 6 the ones you already replaced. Those were the serious 7 problem ones. 8 MR. BOLLIER: Right. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The rest of them are all 10 running about the same. There's none of them that the 11 compressors are out or burning or throwing belts, no. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: What you're suggesting is that in 13 the jail maintenance budget, either in major repairs or in 14 contingency, we create a line item in this budget for roughly 15 $25,000? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: There's -- you're going to 17 have at least that in some major repairs, but which area it's 18 going to be in first, I couldn't tell you. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: So we increase 3,500 to 25,000? Is 20 that what I'm hearing? 21 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 22 MS. HARGIS: Or do you want to put it in capital? 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: He didn't like it. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You just fix what breaks 25 first? Is that what the -- 7-30-08 bwk 146 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, what needs attention. 2 MS. HARGIS: I'd prefer to put it in the capital 3 line item. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Capital outlay? 5 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 25,000? 7 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okey-dokey. Are we through with 9 that one? 10 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Where do we go from here? 12 MS. HYDE: Buzzie's. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Looks like we go to building 14 maintenance. 15 MR. BOLLIER: 513. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: 513. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What page are you on? 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 44. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. I probably should have cut 20 you on fuel/oil/maintenance, except for the fact that I think 21 you've eliminated some fuel accounts in other budgets, 22 haven't you? 23 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, I have. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. And that's why that one 25 may -- in this current budget, may be less than a third of 7-30-08 bwk 147 1 it, that you're incorporating it, okay. Trash service, same 2 thing, right? 3 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. The trash service thing, I 4 had to go up a little bit, because they're picking up -- 5 they're picking up twice a week out at the barn and -- and 6 here. But the barn should be a different one. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Major repairs, based upon the 8 history of this budget, I cut that back -- I cut that in 9 half. Did you incorporate some other major repair budgets 10 into this one? 11 MR. BOLLIER: No, sir, I did not. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Is there any specific thing 13 you got in mind, or -- or do we not need that money? 14 MR. BOLLIER: If you cut it -- 15 JUDGE TINLEY: You can work with 75? 16 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, I can. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Can you work with less? 18 MR. BOLLIER: I can. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. What can you work with? 20 MR. BOLLIER: About 65. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Appreciate the help. 22 Operating equipment, I cut to three. 23 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: You had asked for 4,500. 25 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. But I actually -- 7-30-08 bwk 148 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Year-to-date actual is over 2 three. 3 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. But I asked for 4,500, but 4 when I was talking to Jeannie, I cut another 500 off of it. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, what do you need, 4,000? 6 MR. BOLLIER: And the only reason I put 4,000 on 7 there, for the 35,000 -- I mean, for 513, 569 is for mowers 8 and stuff like that, for cutting the yard and the parks. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Well, you and I are 1,000 10 apart now, if you're down to four. 11 MR. BOLLIER: 3,500, Judge. (Laughter.) 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Do I hear two? 13 MR. BOLLIER: I can live with -- I can live with 14 three. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, you're getting some help now 16 from -- from community supervision too on some of that 17 equipment too, aren't you? 18 MR. BOLLIER: No, I don't know about this year. 19 Before I was, but I do -- they haven't offered any. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Have you asked? 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Maybe you need to have a nice 22 pleasant chat with them, Mr. Bollier. 23 MR. BOLLIER: I can do that, sir. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 25 MR. BOLLIER: I can do that. 7-30-08 bwk 149 1 JUDGE TINLEY: You've -- based upon previous 2 conversations we've had, apparently you've got a wonderful 3 relationship with the chief over there at 216th. 4 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, I do. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. And he's still getting the 6 funding, isn't he? 7 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, he's still getting it. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Needs to spread it around. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's the capital outlay? Did 10 you already talk about that? It's at zero. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: He decided to cut that out 12 because of trying to cut the budget and wait another year. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, he -- he voluntarily cut his 14 capital outlay. Didn't you, Tim? 15 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, I voluntarily did that. I 16 originally was going to ask for some vehicles, and I still am 17 going to ask for some vehicles, but I cut that to asking for 18 two instead of four. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: What kind of vehicles do you 20 need, Tim? 21 MR. BOLLIER: I need some pickups. I'd like to 22 have -- I need one like a -- something big enough, I'm 23 thinking, so Sonny can haul his trailer and his tractors on 24 it, and the other one can be just small -- a small vehicle. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You got a seized one out 7-30-08 bwk 150 1 there? 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I have kind of like a Ranger, 3 you know, your basic S-10 or whatever you want to call it, a 4 small one, that's in fair condition that we were going to 5 auction off. It's not anything fabulous. And I have a -- 6 that one was seized. I have a half-ton -- yeah, a half-ton 7 extended cab that we inherited from the task force back when 8 the task force dissolved. It's got a lot of miles on it. It 9 runs good and has no air conditioner, and only one side of 10 the power windows work, okay? But -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Which side? Do you know? 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- it's a small type S-10 13 pickup. In fact, some of my guys were wondering if we ought 14 to keep it, but it's not -- it's not -- 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, S-10 might get some 16 pretty good mileage. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's not a terrible truck. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If it's any good. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: If you're going to be hauling that 20 tractor around, though, you probably need a half-ton. 21 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. That's what I was -- 22 that's what I was saying. I need at least a half-ton to haul 23 that tractor around with, and probably a four-door pickup, 24 one four-door pickup, just because for Sonny, when he goes 25 and mows the parks, he takes community service with him. And 7-30-08 bwk 151 1 other -- 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I thought that's why you got 3 the van. 4 MR. BOLLIER: I knew you'd bring that van up. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The only other thing I do have 6 is, we -- 7 MR. BOLLIER: I knew that was coming up. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- we have acquired two 9 trailers, flatbed trailers, one very small and one 16-foot 10 that needs wheels -- a wheel, but those are now County-owned 11 also that we recovered, that we have. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably need to keep track of 13 those trailers. 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I have to. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't -- I mean, I think we 16 have a need for them, probably. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We keep them because I can't 18 get rid of them. The County cannot get rid of those 19 trailers. I can let Maintenance use them. They were 20 actually done by DPS Auto Theft. They were stolen trailers 21 where the numbers had been removed. We have retitled them. 22 They gave them to us once they seized them. They have been 23 retitled under that chapter for us, so they can be used by 24 the County, but they can't be disposed of or sold or gotten 25 rid of. 7-30-08 bwk 152 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Show and tell. 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The small one is a little one 3 that you can buy up at Tractor Supply. 4 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, you can put you a small mower 6 on there, that riding mower-type arrangement, sure. 7 MR. BOLLIER: You can use that a lot at the barn 8 too, instead of pulling -- instead of with a big, full-size 9 truck, and save on gas and fuel. 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Part of what I'm doing -- Tim 11 had offered, when everybody got together with 10 percent, 12 trying to work on that, that's when he had offered to try and 13 give up those two vehicles he's asking for. And now that 14 we've got all our old vehicles cleaned up and ready to put on 15 GovDeals this week, we've really been going through them. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Tim? 17 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir? 18 JUDGE TINLEY: We've got your capital outlay now at 19 zero. 20 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay? What I'm suggesting here is 22 that maybe you get with the Sheriff, see what he's got that 23 you can use or commandeer or whatever, and see whatever else 24 you might have a real essential need for. 25 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 7-30-08 bwk 153 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Get back with us. If we need to 2 plug something in here, -- 3 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: -- we still have the ability to do 5 that. But it sounds to me like you need to do some more show 6 and tell and get some more information from the Sheriff, and 7 then readjust what it is that you need. 8 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Does that make sense? 10 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, it does. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anything else on that 12 particular budget? 13 MR. BOLLIER: No, sir. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. Detention maintenance 15 is out; that's been incorporated. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: For the jail? Is that 17 where we're at? 18 JUDGE TINLEY: We've already done the jail. 19 MR. BOLLIER: We just went through 513. We should 20 be on 666. 21 MS. HARGIS: 665 first -- no. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Youth Exhibit Center. 23 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, 666. 24 MS. HARGIS: This is where you have those other 25 two -- 7-30-08 bwk 154 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What page? 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 70. Hey, Jody? What's our 3 latest income on -- approximately, on the Ag Barn? 4 MS. GRINSTEAD: I'd have to go look. I don't know. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Please. 6 MR. BOLLIER: You will see in -- have y'all found 7 it? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 9 MR. BOLLIER: You will see down in Building and 10 Grounds Maintenance where I -- where I put in there for 25. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 12 MR. BOLLIER: The reason for doing that is because 13 we've -- we've started painting a lot of -- all the fences, 14 and we're going to try to get some of this -- can't even 15 talk. The pillars inside the ag -- inside the indoor arena, 16 I want to paint all of those. I want to paint all the 17 railings inside the barn, and that's something that we've 18 started on right now. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Don't paint anything in the 20 hog barn. 21 MR. BOLLIER: No, I won't paint anything in the hog 22 barn. You already told me that, Commissioner. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Be a waste of paint. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Have we got anything that we can 25 carry over from the capital dealing with that facility? I 7-30-08 bwk 155 1 think -- what did we have plugged in out there? A pretty 2 good chunk, primarily for the moving of the rodeo -- 3 MS. HARGIS: That was, you know, waiting on 4 Commissioner Letz and Commissioner Oehler to decide what to 5 use those funds for. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 7 MS. HARGIS: Those were -- 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Special projects? 9 MS. HARGIS: I don't think they meant for 10 anything -- I'm not speaking for them, but I don't think they 11 made anything for general-type maintenance out of this. I 12 think y'all wanted those for expansion and things of that 13 nature. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. You've got a pretty good bump 15 in there for vehicle maintenance. 16 MS. HARGIS: That's the other two you wanted. 17 MR. BOLLIER: That's the -- yes, sir. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: And I decreased that to 4,500, as a 19 matter of fact, for those that are in the dark. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see it. I can see it 22 here. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are we cool with utilities? 24 Where we are with it? 25 MS. HARGIS: He has -- 7-30-08 bwk 156 1 MR. BOLLIER: I had utilities -- 2 MS. HARGIS: He has some Gators and some other 3 things in that capital. 4 MR. BOLLIER: I have replacing -- 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Wait a minute, we're bouncing all 6 over the map here. Let's light on one and get it resolved, 7 and then go to the next one. 8 MS. HARGIS: Okay. Where are you? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Utilities. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Utilities, okay. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That enough, Tim? 12 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. I've raised that to -- I 13 raised that, like, 15 percent, I believe it was. 10 percent. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm not sure that's going to be 15 enough. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, 30 percent would take 17 you up to about 31,000. 18 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: We need to go to 35,000 on that one? 20 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, 440 goes to 35,000. Okay. 22 You mentioned the building grounds and maintenance. That's 23 up slightly from, what, about 5,000 -- 4,000, what you 24 projected. Vehicle maintenance, that's the one that I cut to 25 4,500. 7-30-08 bwk 157 1 MR. BOLLIER: I had it to -- I put it to 18,000, 2 because if I wasn't going to get new vehicles, the old 3 vehicles that I have, some of them are going to have to have 4 major repairs on them, new tires. I've got one old truck 5 that I use at the barn, mainly just for the fuel truck that I 6 haul diesel in back and forth for my heavy equipment, and 7 that's all it's used for. But it's -- actually, it's got 8 over a hundred and some-odd thousand miles; it's a 12- or 9 13-year-old truck. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You don't need to be spending 11 a whole lot of money on a 13-, 14-year-old truck. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Hmm-mm. 13 MR. BOLLIER: No, that's what I'm saying. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Get a four-year-old truck 15 somewhere. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me tell you something; you can 17 buy trucks a dime a dozen now. New, used, it doesn't make 18 any difference. They're practically offering to give them to 19 you if you'll sign a piece of paper. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's true. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, fuel costs -- they run them 22 through the auction. The dealers tell me nobody will get a 23 bid on them, you know, particularly the big diesel trucks. 24 You don't need to be spending a lot of repair money on the -- 25 on old, old trucks. 7-30-08 bwk 158 1 MR. BOLLIER: No, sir. And the red truck -- the 2 red truck that Sonny drives, the red Ford, the rear end in it 3 is -- the whole back end of it's all messed up. It's -- 4 everything's falling off of it, bumper, you name it. And 5 yes, we have tried to fix it. We have made a little headway. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't want you spending $18,000 on 7 that old Ford truck. 8 MR. BOLLIER: I know, sir. I understand. I'm just 9 letting you know what kind of shape my trucks are in. My 10 vehicles are in terrible shape. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Sheriff's going to help you out. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't know if I can help out 13 too much, Judge. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What did we reduce 18,000 to? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: 4,500. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, 4,500 for maintenance, 17 for vehicle maintenance. 18 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Equipment repairs, I reduced that to 20 1,500. 21 MR. BOLLIER: I don't see that. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Based on historical. 23 MR. RUARK: 456. 24 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 7-30-08 bwk 159 1 MS. HARGIS: He's at -- 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. The only other one I messed 3 with after that was capital outlay. You started with 89,8. 4 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: I've got 79,8 here, for some reason. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What is it? 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. I thought we were 8 going to cut all that out. 9 MR. RUARK: Here's what's in it right here. If you 10 go in and click on detail, you'll see it. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where's the detail? 12 MS. HYDE: On the big screen. 13 MS. HARGIS: In the middle. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What screen are you on? 15 MR. BOLLIER: You can cut -- I can cut the John 16 Deere tractor out. I left it in there because I have two old 17 blue tractors out there at the barn, and one of them stays 18 broke down most of the time, and the other one is not in that 19 great of condition. And all I was trying to do was replace 20 two with one, because if something happens -- if something 21 happens, I'm going to have -- I will not have a tractor to 22 use, because all I have right now running in great -- in 23 great form and fashion is my green John Deere tractor that I 24 plow the arena with. And -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How old's that tractor? 7-30-08 bwk 160 1 MR. BOLLIER: I'm not sure how old that green John 2 Deere tractor is. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What is it? What model? 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The green John Deere, that's 5 the late tractor. 6 MR. BOLLIER: Do what? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Late. I mean, tractors have a 8 pretty good resale value. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, they do. I think you 10 can take two of them and put them together and sell them for 11 probably -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably get 10,000, 15,000 for 13 them, even if they're not in very good shape. Maybe more. I 14 mean, people are goofy about tractors. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That was my suggestion, is 16 try to sell those two and then try to get one. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: One good one. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And not have more than one 19 tractor that we need. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You don't want to start having 21 to repair tractors. They're expensive. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, not at all. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They're bad -- all that 24 equipment is bad. I'm not -- I think getting a tractor is 25 probably not a bad idea. I don't know about two Gators, but 7-30-08 bwk 161 1 I think a tractor's a pretty good idea. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I believe we can wait on the 3 Gators. 4 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Might get a pedal car. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Where are we going on that 7 one, then, gentlemen? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, what's the shape of the 9 Gators we have? Or do you want to keep those and buy two new 10 ones? 11 MR. BOLLIER: I would like to get rid of the two 12 old ones I have. They basically stay broke down most of the 13 time as it is. They were received before my time. And they 14 used to let the community service workers use them, and 15 evidently, the community service workers tore them up, from 16 my understanding, because it's before my time. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Those things also have a good 18 resale, because there's not -- there's not a lot of used ones 19 out there. 20 MR. BOLLIER: We use those a lot at the barn. They 21 do save -- they do save money on fuel and stuff, without 22 having to take the big truck and drive something. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think you need a couple of 24 Gators out there. I didn't know if the ones you had were in 25 bad shape. 7-30-08 bwk 162 1 MR. BOLLIER: You can go look at them. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We ought to do one this year, 3 one next year. 4 MR. BOLLIER: I can handle that. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: What does that leave our number out 7 there, Tim? 8 MR. RUARK: Tell you in a second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What about the pickup he has in 11 here? 12 MR. RUARK: You got 71,9. 13 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, he's got two pickups. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What did you say? 15 MS. HARGIS: We had talked about used pickups as 16 well here. I think -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He's getting some from Rusty. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, but if you look -- I'll 19 say I can give him some that are running great for running a 20 short term, but I don't believe he has any that I would say 21 are real good pickups at all in his entire -- whether it's 22 here or out there or anywhere else, and I don't have any good 23 pickups that he could get from us. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: He has a pretty good one. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Probably going to need at 7-30-08 bwk 163 1 least a good pickup, one of them. 2 MR. BOLLIER: Do what? 3 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Leave it all -- I'd kind of 6 rather maybe take one Gator and leave the rest of it in for 7 the time being. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: What happens if we take one Gator 9 off? 10 MR. RUARK: I did, and it's 71,9 now. That's what 11 the -- 12 JUDGE TINLEY: 71,9? 13 MR. RUARK: Yeah. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. It's not going to let me do 15 anything here, Ken. 16 MR. RUARK: I've taken it already, so it'll be 17 there for you. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Now you know how it feels, 19 blocking you out. 20 MS. HARGIS: Judge, that's one of the ones we have 21 to go into the detail to change it. 22 MR. RUARK: Yeah. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, okay. 24 MS. HARGIS: He did it already. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Some of those folks got 7-30-08 bwk 164 1 sneaky, and instead of doing it the right way, they did it 2 the left-handed way, right? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that it? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: That's all you got, isn't it, Tim? 5 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. That's it, sir. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: And you're pleased as punch? 7 MR. BOLLIER: I'm fine. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: If you run out of money, you'll quit 9 working, right? 10 MR. BOLLIER: No, sir, then we'll just start 11 begging. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. 13 MR. BOLLIER: Thank you, sir. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, the good constable 16 has a question. 17 MR. GARZA: Commissioners, I'd like to find out if 18 it's possible, on my request that I had for that computer, if 19 the Court would consider allowing me to seek grant funding if 20 it's available. You know, give me the permission, if I 21 wanted to, you know, seek for the computer equipment, 22 what-have-you. I mean, you know, like, to seek out, you 23 know, grant funding sources or something. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You can probably get the 25 equipment, but you're not going to get the service. 7-30-08 bwk 165 1 MR. GARZA: Or use it, you know, as -- as maybe a 2 laptop, just to have in my vehicle or, you know, with me at 3 home. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: And I'm going to think out loud. As 5 to local foundations -- 6 MR. GARZA: Local or whatever I can find. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: I would not be in favor of local 8 foundations. 9 MR. GARZA: Mm-hmm. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: We try and control those requests. 11 Number one, you're not talking about a whole lot of money, 12 and we don't want to use up any -- any good favor we have 13 with those local folks. If you're talking about law 14 enforcement types, that may be one place to go. Where are 15 you on the J.P. technology -- is there any way -- you can't 16 get into J.P. technology? Okay. Well -- 17 MR. TROLINGER: Sheriff has a nice laptop. 18 MS. HYDE: Where did that one come from? 19 MR. TROLINGER: All the vehicles. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The I.T. guy ain't going to be 21 allowed in my office any more if he keeps mouthing off. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: If you have I.T. problems, you'll 23 have I.T. problems, I guess. 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, 'cause we're not going to 25 allow them in here. Since he has his office in there right 7-30-08 bwk 166 1 now, he'll have I.T. problems. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Going back to County Attorney, 3 they're going to need a computer. What's that computer cost? 4 MR. TROLINGER: I don't recall what he's -- what 5 he's put in his capital outlay, but it's approximately $1,100 6 for a laptop. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Sounds about right. 8 MR. TROLINGER: With the software license included. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, that's 1,100 that -- if 10 his computer can go there, that's 1,100 of 3,000 is already 11 in the budget somewhere. I mean, it's, you know, one place 12 or the other, so it's -- the 3,000 goes down. 13 MR. RUARK: He's got $1,450 in his capital outlay. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. That's what he's got for a -- 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Don't look at me. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't have a problem doing 17 it, mainly to see if it works. And how it -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: We're going to have to have a trial 19 sometime, is what you're saying? 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, see how this thing works. 21 And I'm -- 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You're going to open the 23 floodgate. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah, you are. 7-30-08 bwk 167 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You just did. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the other option would be the 3 -- the Sheriff can get him a new laptop and surrender -- 4 surrender the one he's got for trial purposes. Or maybe he 5 doesn't even need a new one; he can just surrender the one 6 he's got. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We have changed out a lot of 8 our desktops, as John can tell you, to laptops. My 9 investigators all have laptops. It's not to be for use in 10 the car, okay? A lot of times they can go to Microsoft Word 11 to do different records in, take laptops with them home or 12 something to work from, but it's not -- it's not the expense 13 and the technology needed yet for a patrol car computer. 14 That's the -- that's -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. And, I mean, I think it 16 makes a lot more sense for people in that position to go, I 17 mean, at least get the laptop, even if we don't sign up for 18 the rest of it. That's not going to cost the County anything 19 right now. And during the year, if we want to do a one-month 20 trial or two-month trial or 60-day trial, if you want to do 21 that, really try it in his budget. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: But for an interim solution, what 23 you're suggesting is, let his desktop go to the new County 24 Attorney -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And get a laptop. 7-30-08 bwk 168 1 JUDGE TINLEY: I assume that's acceptable with the 2 new County Attorney? Otherwise, he's going to have to buy 3 one. 4 MR. TROLINGER: Correct. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: And let him get the laptop, and 6 he'll be that much down the read. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. That doesn't cost 8 any -- there's no reason to buy another desktop when we don't 9 need another desktop right now. So, you -- 10 JUDGE TINLEY: You'll be halfway there. 11 MR. GARZA: I appreciate it, Commissioner. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: But you're still not going to be in 13 your car yet. 14 MR. GARZA: No, sir, but it's the -- 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Smaller step to get there. 16 MR. GARZA: That's all I ask of the Court. I 17 appreciate it. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Figure out what the numbers are. 19 MR. GARZA: What's the old saying? You got to take 20 one step at a time. Thank you, Commissioners. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Do we need to do anything to either 22 one of these budgets? 23 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. Let's add to capital outlay in 24 his and take capital outlay out of County Attorney. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, you got 3,000 in his 7-30-08 bwk 169 1 capital outlay. 2 MS. HARGIS: We zeroed that out. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We zeroed it out? 4 MS. HARGIS: Let me fix it, and then we'll come 5 back with it. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. What you need to do is take 7 it out of the County Attorney's capital outlay. That -- if 8 it's all the computer. 9 MS. HARGIS: I need to see exactly what he wants on 10 that laptop. Just to have a laptop -- 11 MR. GARZA: Whatever John says. 12 MS. HARGIS: Whatever John would say, but you had 13 other things on here. I don't know -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 15 MS. HARGIS: -- what a plain laptop is. 16 MR. TROLINGER: With the software license, $1,100. 17 MR. RUARK: Are you going to change that, Jeannie? 18 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, I'll change it. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There he is right there. 20 MR. EMERSON: What did I do now? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We gave you a used computer 22 instead of a new one. 23 MR. EMERSON: That's fine. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We gave you Angel's, and he got 25 a laptop. 7-30-08 bwk 170 1 MR. EMERSON: All it is is word processing and the 2 internet. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We saved $300. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The County ought to pay our 5 lunch. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let's go to Pampell's. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm hungry. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Are we through, gentlemen? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I am. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I am. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll be adjourned. 12 (Budget workshop was adjourned at 12:45 p.m.) 13 - - - - - - - - - - 14 STATE OF TEXAS | 15 COUNTY OF KERR | 16 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 17 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 18 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 19 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 20 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 15th day of August, 21 2008. 22 23 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 24 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 25 Certified Shorthand Reporter 7-30-08 bwk