1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Regular Session 10 Monday, December 8, 2008 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X December 8, 2008 2 PAGE 3 --- Commissioners' Comments 6 4 1.1 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on appointing an interim Subdivision Administrator 12 5 1.2 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 6 presentation of County Treasurer's monthly report for October 2008 for examination and acceptance 16 7 1.3 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 8 request from Kerrville/Kerr County Joint Airport Board for extension of audit due date 17 9 1.4 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 10 reappoint Janet Moseley to Library Board for a 3-year term 19 11 1.5 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 12 complaint from David L. John regarding action taken at October 27, 2008 Commissioners Court 13 meeting which approved Environmental Health Department issuing an injunction against Dave's 14 Place Backdoor Pottery located at 170 Center Point River Road East 19 15 1.6 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 16 authorize request for funding from UGRA and other state agencies to assist with the cleaning 17 of Flat Rock Lake and Ingram Lake 21 18 1.7 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to designate Commissioners' and Judge's liaison 19 appointments for various functions for calendar year 2009 23 20 1.10 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 21 discuss swearing-in ceremony of newly elected officials in District Courtroom #1 at 10 a.m. 22 on January 1, 2009 25 23 1.11 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to adopt an order, based on the burn ban status, 24 prohibiting the sale or use of restricted fire- works in any portion of the unincorporated area 25 of Kerr County 27 3 1 I N D E X (Continued) December 8, 2008 2 PAGE 3 1.12 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to appoint Coral Adema to represent Kerr County on 4 Alamo Area Agency on Aging Advisory Committee 28 5 1.13 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve an interlocal agreement between Kerr 6 County and AACOG for collection and processing of data to designate census tracts for planning 7 and census purposes 29 8 1.14 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve contract with Divide Volunteer Fire 9 Department; allow the County Judge to sign same 31 10 1.15 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on joint resolution with City of Kerrville in 11 support of gift by HEB and its initiation of efforts to rehabilitate/renovate & expand the 12 Butt-Holdsworth Memorial Library facilities 31 13 1.17 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to proclaim second Tuesday in January as Volunteers 14 for Democracy Day 34 15 1.18 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve Library Agreement between City of 16 Kerrville and Kerr County 35 17 1.19 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve resolution for submission of Victims 18 of Crime Act grant proposal for 2009-2010 to Office of the Governor, Criminal Justice Division 38 19 1.20 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 20 approve appointment of County Treasurer Mindy Williams as financial officer for the Victims 21 of Crime Act grant; authorize County Judge to notify Governor's office of the change within 22 14 days of this court order 38, 84 23 1.21 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve proposed Kerr County Indigent Health 24 policy 42 25 4 1 I N D E X (Continued) December 8, 2008 2 PAGE 3 1.22 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on joint agreement between Kerr County and City 4 of Kerrville with Normandy Group for governmental relations assistance to obtain 5 federal government funding or other assistance for economic development projects and infra- 6 structure and facilities needs 45 7 1.8 Public Hearing to abandon, vacate, and dis- continue the 21.20-acre portion of land from 8 recorded plat of Comanche Caves Ranch, Vol. 4, Page 209, Precinct 4 54 9 4.1 Pay Bills 55 10 4.2 Budget Amendments -- 4.3 Late Bills -- 11 4.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 60 12 1.9 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to abandon, vacate, and discontinue the 21.20-acre 13 portion of land from recorded plat of Comanche Caves Ranch, Vol. 4, Page 209, Precinct 4 60 14 1.23 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action 15 regarding new employee and three employees whose jobs have been changed due to employee 16 termination 66 17 1.16 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to determine status of right-of-way for Bayless 18 Drive North in Hill Country Ranch Estates 99 19 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee Assignments --- 20 5.2 Reports from Elected Officials/Department Heads 114 21 --- Adjourned 116 22 23 24 25 5 1 On Monday, December 8, 2008, at 9:00 a.m., a regular 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. 8 Let me call to order this regularly scheduled meeting of the 9 Kerr County Commissioners Court posted and scheduled for this 10 time and date, Monday, December the 8th, 2008 at 9 a.m. It 11 is a bit past that time now. Commissioner Oehler? 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Please rise for a moment of 13 prayer, and followed by the pledge of allegiance. 14 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: At this time, if there's any member 16 of the audience or the public that wishes to be heard on any 17 matter that is not a listed agenda item, now is your time to 18 come forward and tell us what's on your mind. If you wish to 19 be heard on an agenda item, we'd ask that you fill out a 20 participation form. They're located at the back of the room. 21 It's not essential that you do that; it helps me to know that 22 there's someone that wishes to be heard on that item when we 23 get to it, so that I don't overlook you. But if we happen to 24 get to an agenda item and you wish to be heard on that, and 25 you've not filled out a participation form, just get my 12-8-08 6 1 attention in some manner and I'll see that you have the 2 opportunity to be heard on that item. But right now, if 3 there's any member of the public or audience that wishes to 4 be heard on any matter that is not a listed agenda item, 5 please feel free to come forward at this time and tell us 6 what's on your mind. Seeing no one coming forward, we will 7 move on. Commissioner Oehler, what do you have for us this 8 morning? 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, one thing that's kind 10 of a little positive news, I guess, the other day -- about 11 our Ingram Lake cleaning project. It seems that there's a 12 lot of interest in that silt that's in that lake, and that 13 some of the contractors are able to sell that, and the 14 landowners are not having to pay for the removal of it in 15 some instances. So, that's food for thought for the upcoming 16 draining of Flat Rock, and also maybe more work to be done at 17 Ingram, that it could possibly be done at no cost to the 18 County, or very minimal cost. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Interesting. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mm-hmm. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Some food for thought. We'll 22 figure out a way to go about it with the County Attorney's 23 blessing, maybe getting RFP's or something at some point of 24 how we can do that, and hopefully this could be a wonderful 25 thing for people that want this material, and for us too, to 12-8-08 7 1 not spend the kind of money that we think we may have to. We 2 may have to spend some, but hopefully, if everything were to 3 work right, and it's -- no reason why it can't if we work at 4 it a little bit, I believe. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Following up -- I can't discuss 6 it, nevermind. I think that should be a good agenda item in 7 the future. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. That's all. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Now, for the Tivy sports 10 report, we'll go to Commissioner 1. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, before we get to Tivy 12 sports, ask them to keep an eye out for my Tivy senior ring. 13 (Laughter.) And there's a James Avery cross I lost in there 14 about '66. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There's some boys that are 16 doing some digging, and they're finding things, but I'll tell 17 them to be sure to look for that. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I'd like to have my 19 senior ring back. The Tivy Antlers are one of four teams 20 left in the state of Texas. What else do I need to say? 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: In Division 4? In their 22 division? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: In Division 2 of 24 classification 4A, that's correct. We don't care about those 25 other classifications. 12-8-08 8 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I understand. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. That's all. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: That's it for today? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's it for today. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Life is good. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Williams? 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Couple things, Judge. 8 There have been a lot of pieces of correspondence flying back 9 and forth out of T.C.E.Q. with respect to Wheatcraft, and 10 there's going to be an administrative hearing on some of the 11 issues about the air quality permit that Mr. Wheatcraft seeks 12 for his rock crusher. The date and time and place have not 13 yet been decided, but with respect to place, I was in Center 14 Point for a little Christmas gathering last Saturday, and the 15 issue of where to conduct that hearing came up, and looking 16 for a spot. So, with the Court's approval, I would like to 17 be in a position to offer them either the Ag Barn, set up in 18 auditorium style, at the proper time if there's not a 19 conflict. Either at the exhibit hall, or perhaps the 216th 20 District Court, depending on what's available for that 21 administrative hearing. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Courtroom would be cheaper, 23 wouldn't it? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Probably. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm kidding. I'm kidding, 12-8-08 9 1 Bill. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Secondly, for those of you 3 who have nothing to do next Sunday evening about 6 o'clock, 4 the Center Point folks begin their Christmas celebration with 5 their march down the street with the candle lights and 6 Christmas lighting ceremony in the historical park. 7 Everybody's welcome to attend. That's it. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. Commissioner Letz? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: For those that were able to 10 attend the Christmas in Comfort, it was a really nice event. 11 It was probably the best attended that I can remember; it was 12 just absolutely packed, largely due to the beautiful weather 13 we had. Even though it was dry, it was very pleasant to be 14 outdoors, 60's, 40's. Huge turnout. Huge. I think there 15 was 96 entries in the parade. It was big. A lot of the big 16 floats out of San Antonio came up for it; the Lutheran 17 Coronation, I think it was, one of the biggest. So, that was 18 a good event. I spent a good part of last week in Austin 19 visiting with representatives of various groups on some of 20 the stuff I've been working on through the Hill Country 21 County Coalition. It -- there's a great deal of interest on 22 the 231 bill, which is to give additional authority to the 15 23 counties. A little bit less enthusiasm on trying to tackle 24 the 232 changes, because they're afraid of getting beat up 25 too much statewide. I think local bills are a lot easier for 12-8-08 10 1 them to tackle than statewide bills. But both of them are 2 progressing, and I've got an additional meeting set up in the 3 coming weeks. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Judge, I have one more thing 5 when Jonathan is through that I forgot to mention. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's it. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Last week I had some calls 8 from constituents along Highway 27 that own businesses there 9 between basically the city limits of Kerrville and Ingram, 10 all the way in that area where you have all those little 11 restaurants and glass companies and Bernhard's lockers and 12 all those, and I was -- been working a little bit with Danny 13 Edwards, or kind of getting information from him about the 14 new sewer system that's supposed to be going into Ingram at 15 some point in time. We don't know exactly when that's going 16 to be, but it should happen or start happening before too 17 long. There is -- there are two lines in the ditch that come 18 from the elementary school going toward Kerrville. One of 19 those lines is going to become a dead line. The school is 20 going to gravity flow into the line in Ingram that they -- on 21 the new system they're proposing. And so I contacted Todd 22 Bock last week and asked him if there was some way that we 23 could come to an agreement with Kerrville to take those other 24 -- once that line becomes dead, for those businesses to be 25 able to access that line and flow that water to the City of 12-8-08 11 1 Kerrville for treatment so we can get those businesses off of 2 septic. He was very receptive and said he would carry the 3 ball forward. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The existing line's going 5 to be abandoned? Is that what you're saying? 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Existing line -- there are 7 two lines that -- when they built the elementary, they put 8 two lines in the same ditch for future -- you know, with 9 Ingram, someday we'll maybe be able to hook on, and so one of 10 those is a forced main. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And it's a forced main right 13 now from the Ingram school, but they're going to discontinue 14 that. And even those businesses along there, some of them 15 would be willing to hook into it right now, putting in their 16 lift stations. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If it's -- 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Pressurized -- 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If it's reactivated, will 20 there have to be a pressure main? 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, we don't know that. I 22 haven't gotten that far with the plans, but one way or the 23 other, I'm pretty sure some of it will gravity flow. Some of 24 it may not, but that remains to be determined. But I thought 25 it was real good that the City of Kerrville and Todd said he 12-8-08 12 1 would carry it forward and see what kind of an answer he can 2 get. But they're -- they have -- they have capacity, and 3 they think it's a good idea to get the people, as many as 4 they can, off of septic as soon as possible. And that -- 5 that would really be a big help along there, because we're 6 using up a lot of valuable land for drainfields and 7 what-have-you now that can be turned into residen -- I mean 8 commercial property. Anyway, I just wanted to make that 9 little report. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Future progress. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, can't -- can't do 12 anything if we don't ask. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: That's right. Thank you, 14 Commissioner. Let's get on with our agenda, if we might. 15 The first item on the agenda is to consider, discuss, and 16 take appropriate action on appointing an interim Subdivision 17 Administrator. Commissioner Letz? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I put this on the agenda after 19 a basic conversation I had with Kelly probably two weeks ago 20 about what are we going to do in the interim. 'Cause there's 21 a slot that has to be signed on our plats, to get a signature 22 on, and there's -- we just need to make that decision. And 23 the person that probably makes the most sense to me is Wayne 24 Wells. And we'd incur a fee for it, but he's knowledgeable. 25 He's familiar with our rules, and I think that he's going to 12-8-08 13 1 be looking at these plats for the most part anyway, so I 2 think that he's the best choice. The other -- I talked to 3 Kelly, and, you know, she's got a pretty steep learning 4 curve. This is a little bit too much, I think, to ask her to 5 do. And, you know, I guess the only -- whoever else. I 6 mean, doesn't make any difference to me who it is, but 7 someone needs to be designated, 'cause we actually may have 8 one coming through pretty soon, maybe today. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What -- what does that 10 consist of? What do they do, other than just signing off on 11 it? Is he going to go out in the field? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think he has to review, make 13 sure that everything on the plat is correct. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, that may be a 15 considerable amount of money over and above, or what do you 16 think? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's his rate, 70? Kelly? 18 MS. HOFFER: It went up to 60. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Up to 60? 20 MS. HOFFER: I think it went up to $60. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: $60, I would think that it -- 22 you know, Kelly's going to be doing a lot of legwork, I'm 23 sure, so probably one to two hours a plat, you know. One to 24 three, something like that. 25 MS. HOFFER: I did drop some plats off to Leonard 12-8-08 14 1 that he reviewed, so he may be open to signing on the one 2 that I've got coming up for next agenda, but I still think 3 it's a good topic of discussion, just in case something 4 happens. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Do we have very many plats 6 that you know about that are pending? 7 MS. HOFFER: No, we have one for the next agenda, 8 the Cypress Springs. They're just putting those two lots 9 together, that 46A and 47A. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh, yeah. 11 MS. HOFFER: That's it. Leonard has approved on 12 there; we were just waiting for a final. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Do you know if there's a 14 tremendous hurry to get this done, or can it maybe wait three 15 weeks or so until Leonard comes back? 16 MS. HOFFER: I would have to call Lee Voelkel. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I think that there's a 18 possibility that Leonard can do some of this, you know, while 19 he's at home. This one, I think Leonard would sign off on. 20 It's -- I mean, he's already said everything looks fine 21 there. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's -- we've already done -- 23 MS. HOFFER: Yeah. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- just about everything 25 there is to do. 12-8-08 15 1 MS. HOFFER: We started on it before he was off. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What do we know about 3 Leonard's return in terms of time? 4 MS. HOFFER: 5th of January is what he told me. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's not very far off. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner, is it -- is it your 8 intent by this agenda item to appoint an alternate that's 9 available in the absence of -- of the regular Subdivision 10 Administrator? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, sir. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: On an ongoing basis, for whatever 13 reason that the primary is not available? Is that kind of 14 where you're coming from? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I wasn't really thinking of it 16 being permanent, but it'd probably make sense to do it that 17 way. And I think where we can, it's not replacing him; it's 18 just adding an addition if Leonard's not available for 19 whatever reason, and then we have someone that -- I just hate 20 to hold up work for the public just because we have someone 21 who can't sign something, you know, even though they're -- 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: May or may not use it. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: May or may not ever use it. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll second it. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I make that motion, that we 12-8-08 16 1 appoint Wayne Wells as our alternate Subdivision 2 Administrator, and be compensated at rates under our 3 contract. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second. 6 Question or discussion on that motion? All in favor of the 7 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 12 to Item 2; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action on 13 the presentation of the County Treasurer's monthly report for 14 October 2008 to Commissioners Court for the Court's 15 examination and acceptance. Ms. Williams? 16 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, good morning. The County Clerk 17 brought to my attention something that I had not been aware 18 of, that I'm supposed to be providing the Court with a 19 financial report every month. I didn't realize this was 20 supposed to be done. I apologize for letting the ball drop. 21 But, anyway, going forward, you will be getting a monthly 22 report -- financial report. I basically used another 23 county's format and just set it up to where it would 24 accomplish what we needed here with all our accounts. It 25 does need to be accepted and signed off by the Court, and 12-8-08 17 1 then it has to be posted on the County's web site. So, if 2 there are any questions, I'll try to answer them for you. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I like the little report. 4 Looks good. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move to accept whatever it 7 is. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made to accept the 10 Treasurer's October 2008 monthly report. 11 MS. WILLIAMS: And hopefully I'll be able to get 12 the November report to you at the next court meeting. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Very good. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Fantastic. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or discussion 16 on the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by 17 raising your right hand. 18 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 20 (No response.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. 22 MS. WILLIAMS: Thank you. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll go to Item 3; consider, 24 discuss, take appropriate action on request from the 25 Kerrville/Kerr County Joint Airport Board for extension of 12-8-08 18 1 the audit due date. I don't see Mr. Bobertz here present. 2 MS. GRINSTEAD: He was not able to attend. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. I think it's pretty 4 self-explanatory with the backup material. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I move approval, Judge. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Of the extension. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: To March 31? 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Of '09? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Very good. We have a motion and a 13 second. Further question or discussion on that motion? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just a quick -- quick 15 question. The audit, is it required by the State because 16 there are TexDOT moneys in this thing? 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's required by our new 18 interlocal agreement with the City. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So we have the authority to 20 move it any way we want to? 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. Thank you. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion? All 24 in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12-8-08 19 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We will 4 move to Item 4; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action 5 to reappoint Janet Moseley to the Library Board for a 6 three-year term. Commissioner Oehler? 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So moved. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 10 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion on the 11 motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 12 right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Now we'll 17 move to Item 5; consider, discuss, and take appropriate 18 action on complaint from David L. John regarding action taken 19 at -- on the October 27th, 2008 Commissioners Court, which 20 approved Environmental Health Department issuing an 21 injunction against Dave's Place Backdoor Pottery located at 22 170 Center Point River Road East. Mr. Johns? 23 MR. JOHN: Good morning, Judge. Good morning, 24 Commissioners. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Excuse me, Mr. John. 12-8-08 20 1 MR. JOHN: Yes. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Morning. 3 MR. JOHN: I provided y'all with a sworn 4 deposition; I think y'all got it. Just some things have come 5 to light that I have to make you aware of this morning. We 6 went to court on Wednesday. At that time, the County 7 Attorney requested a continuance on the case in J.P. court. 8 Friday afternoon, I received a phone call from my attorney 9 that the County Attorney's office had contacted him and had 10 asked me if I would table this item until the next 11 Commissioners meeting. So, out of respect for the County 12 Attorney, my attorney, and this Court, that's what I'm here 13 to do. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Very good, sir. You will -- you 15 will make a request to have this item put back on the agenda 16 when you desire to be heard? 17 MR. JOHN: Yes, that is my request now. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Very good. Are you specifically 19 asking that it be put on the December -- 20 MS. GRINSTEAD: 22nd. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: -- 22nd agenda? Or are you asking 22 that we wait until we hear from you to put it on the agenda? 23 MR. JOHN: I guess wait till my attorney says 24 something to me. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 12-8-08 21 1 MR. JOHN: Because right now, -- 2 JUDGE TINLEY: You'll let us know? 3 MR. JOHN: -- everything is sitting in limbo. I 4 don't know what's going on. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. When you want it back on, 6 you'll give us a call, and we can get it put back on. 7 MR. JOHN: Yes, sir. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Very good. Thank you, sir. 9 MR. JOHN: Thank you for your time. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move to Item 6, if we might; 11 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to authorize a 12 request for funding from U.G.R.A. and other state agencies to 13 assist with the cleaning of Flat Rock Lake and Ingram. I 14 assuming you're talking about Ingram Lake? 15 (Commissioner Oehler nodded.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, I think we talked about 18 both of them. Not sure what that level should be, but I 19 think it would be a good idea to go and ask them if they'd be 20 interested in doing that at some point, and give them the 21 opportunity to have time to think about it before we actually 22 ask for a certain specified amount. I don't think we're 23 ready with any kind of a specified amount at this time, but I 24 think it's a good idea to put them on -- on notice that we -- 25 and see what their policy is, see if they would be willing to 12-8-08 22 1 maybe do that if it becomes necessary. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: May I offer a suggestion, 3 Commissioner? 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes, sir. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They have what they call a 6 Finance and Operations Committee that meets in between board 7 meetings where they talk about issues that are not yet on the 8 agenda, or may soon be placed on the agenda. That might be a 9 pretty good place to start. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's basically their 12 executive committee, or their officers of the board. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Kind of like the 14 appropriations committee. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, right. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Who's chair of that? 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's usually the vice 18 president chairs it, so that would be Lana Edwards now. But 19 the president's also there, and it basically is the executive 20 committee. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, what's your suggestion, 22 then? How should we go about this? Just meet with them 23 and -- 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. Pick up the phone 25 and call Ray Buck and say we'd like to make an appearance 12-8-08 23 1 before the -- their F & O committee. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: To talk about this request. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Do you think we need a motion 5 on this to do that, or just go do it? 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You and I can do it. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Unless the Court screams 9 and says, "Don't do it." 10 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think you're going to hear 11 that, Commissioner. With our blessing. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's move on to Item 7, if 14 we might; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 15 designate Commissioners' and Judge's liaison appointments for 16 the various functions for the calendar year 2009. I put this 17 on the agenda because it's something that we try and visit on 18 somewhat of an annual basis, as I recall. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This list that we have in 20 our packet, is this a repeat? 21 JUDGE TINLEY: You've got one in your packet? I 22 don't have one in mine. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Here, I'll share with you, 24 Judge. It's -- apparently, that's what it is right now. 25 MS. GRINSTEAD: Yes. 12-8-08 24 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Good place to start. Okay, thank 2 you. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Looks like I'm overworked a 4 little bit, but -- (Laughter.) -- but I will accept this 5 list as it is. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If somebody wants to work in 7 the jail with Rusty, they're more than welcome. If not, I'll 8 continue. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I've been after Bruce to come 10 do that. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Hear that? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He wants you. Isn't it nice to 13 feel wanted? 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, I'm just wanted. More 15 time to lobby. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's right. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But from my standpoint, 18 airport, Ag Barn, I'd like to stay there, and I have no 19 problem staying at the jail either. Just up to -- whatever. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Looks like nobody's got any big 21 heartburn about changing anything from the current 22 appointments; is that correct? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think so. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval of the -- 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 12-8-08 25 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- liaison appointments for 2 the year -- calendar year 2009, as the list provides. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Under Court Order 30694? 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. I have a motion and a 6 second. Question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, 7 signify by raising your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's move 12 to Item 10; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 13 discuss the swearing-in ceremony of newly elected officials 14 in District Courtroom Number 1 at 10 a.m. on January 1, 2009. 15 Buster, you want to be in charge of this party? 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir, I do. I had a 17 phone call last week from the holy land upstairs, and they 18 wanted to know what -- what we were doing. What time is 19 swearing-in? When is swearing-in? The whole thing. And I 20 tried for 7 a.m. on New Year's Day, but there was some 21 balking going on up there. I mean, just -- I don't know 22 what's wrong with those folks. So -- but so we kind of 23 decided 10 a.m. January 1, District Courtroom Number 1. Is 24 that cool with everybody? So be it. That's it. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I notice that this agenda 12-8-08 26 1 item notes that you are now representing Precinct 3. When 2 did you make that change? 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, Bill, Jon said he was 4 going to be gone that day, so, you know -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Picked it up. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Don't blink around here. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You're saying 10 a.m. on the 8 1st? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. Yeah. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's just an announcement, 11 really, right? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, we just kind of want 13 to make sure we're all riding the same horse. You have a new 14 District Judge up there that's wanting to know. So -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And we want to keep him happy. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- we're going to provide 17 him with answers. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: You aim to please, right? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what we do here. 21 Thank you. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: And you're in charge of the party, 23 right? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Again. 12-8-08 27 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's fine. Sure. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There won't be any leftovers 4 from the Christmas get-together, I promise. You'll have to 5 come up with some others. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's move on to Item 11; 7 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to adopt an order 8 based on burn ban status prohibiting the sale or use of 9 restricted fireworks, that being skyrockets with sticks and 10 missiles with fins, in any portion of the unincorporated area 11 of Kerr County. Commissioner Letz? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I had some calls last week, so 13 I thought we ought to put it on the agenda. Fireworks people 14 want to know what they can sell and not sell, and my 15 recommendation would be, with the weather as such, that we 16 ban the rockets with fins, aerial projectiles, and whatever 17 else is called for under that state law that we have 18 authority to make. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I wish we could ban it all, 20 but we can't. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So do I. I notice one of 22 them's gone out of business. One of them on the Five Star 23 Rental is gone. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They can reappear pretty 25 quickly. 12-8-08 28 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: In your precinct. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I kind of disagree with 3 y'all. I like the free enterprise thing, and I like 4 fireworks and all that. However, it -- the weather has 5 caused a -- really, a dangerous, dangerous situation out 6 there, so I'll second the motion, if that was a motion. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It was a motion, but I'm 8 wondering if we may want to pass on this till we get the 9 actual -- do we need to be more specific, Rex, on something 10 like that, do you think? The actual -- to actually cite the 11 statute that we're -- 12 MR. EMERSON: No. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No? Okay. Okay, I move the 14 agenda item. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 17 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 18 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll go to 23 Item 12; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 24 appoint Coral Adema to represent Kerr County on the Alamo 25 Area Agency on Aging Advisory Committee. That's almost a 12-8-08 29 1 tongue twister. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It really is. And this is 3 the one spot that has kind of bedeviled us for some time. We 4 get somebody appointed, and they serve six months or so and 5 then resign 'cause they don't like making the trip to San 6 Antonio too often. Ms. Adema I've known for some time. 7 She's a registered nurse, has served in many capacities in 8 the county in that regard. I interviewed her here in the 9 courthouse this past week. She's anxious to serve on this 10 particular board, and anybody that's anxious to do so I think 11 deserves an opportunity. I would move her appointment. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second -- third. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 15 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 16 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, I might add, I asked 22 Ms. Grinstead to send appropriate notification to AACOG of 23 her appointment. Thank you. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Item 13; consider, discuss, take 25 appropriate action to approve an interlocal agreement between 12-8-08 30 1 Kerr County and the Alamo Area Council of Governments for 2 collection and processing of data to designate census tracts 3 for planning and census purposes. Commissioner Williams, I 4 think this is a follow-on to -- 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: -- something we looked at at our 7 last meeting. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The Court had agreed to do 9 this and to get this data -- census tract data manipulated 10 and processed so that it makes some sense for us, and this is 11 merely the agreement with AACOG to do that. It's in 12 conformity with what I reported to you earlier, and the only 13 thing missing is I have not run it by the County Attorney for 14 his review. But I would move its approval, if the County 15 Attorney agrees that it's acceptable. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 18 indicated. Question or discussion on that motion? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Where's the money coming from? 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think we agreed it was 21 coming out of Professional Services. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: That's my recollection. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion? All 12-8-08 31 1 in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 2 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed same sane. 4 (No response.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. We'll move to 6 Item 14; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 7 approve the contract with the Divide Volunteer Fire 8 Department; allow the County Judge to sign same. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So moved. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 12 approval. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 13 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's go to 18 Item 15; consider, discuss, take appropriate action on joint 19 resolution with the City of Kerrville in support of the gift 20 by H.E.B. and its initiation of efforts to rehabilitate/ 21 renovate and expand the Butt-Holdsworth Memorial Library 22 facilities. I put this on the agenda as a result of a 23 meeting which was held last week, I believe it was, or 24 possibly latter part of the week before. The H.E.B. family, 25 I believe, through -- possibly through its foundation, has 12-8-08 32 1 been discussing trying to assist in the renovation, 2 rehabilitation, expansion of the existing library facility, 3 and at that meeting it was announced that they had committed 4 a million dollars towards that project, and intended to move 5 forward with a fundraising effort in order to accomplish a 6 significant renovation. The -- the schematics and -- and 7 site workups proposed are being worked on presently, and the 8 efforts are being made to put together teams to work on that. 9 But in the interim, the mayor and I thought it would be well 10 for both of the local government bodies to support a joint 11 resolution in support of their gift and their initiation of 12 those efforts, and that's essentially what it does. It 13 doesn't commit us to any funds. However, should we at some 14 point down the road agree to assist them financially, I'm 15 sure it would be most welcome. But this resolution does not 16 do that; it's merely a support of H.E.B. in its gift and 17 initiation of these efforts. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there -- has it been written 19 yet? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. Yes. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me -- 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This has been going on for 24 quite a while. They sent their architect and some kind of a 25 site plan type fellow to meet with us at Library Board 12-8-08 33 1 meeting, and they kind of -- everything kind got jumbled up, 2 because the City had already hired people to do an assessment 3 of all of their buildings and what their needs were going to 4 be for the future, and then H.E.B. came in with people 5 saying, well, we're -- we have available staff to look into 6 this and kind of do an assessment, but we don't want to get 7 in the way of the people that you've hired. So, I'm glad to 8 see that they have committed to some funds, and they're -- 9 they want to be helpful and support that library. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Got it. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, you got it. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, you mentioned in 13 your comments the foundation. This, of course, is very 14 generous of the H.E.B. family -- the Butt family to do this. 15 Is it the foundation, or is it the H.E. Butt Grocery Company? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the resolution, I note, 17 indicates that the -- 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Howard. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It says the company. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: The company's gift. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I also know that Charles Butt 22 is also, with several of his -- he has three grocery stores 23 that are still his, and he is also very supportive and wants 24 to be involved in some way. And I think this is the way that 25 he will find out how much he wants to be involved. 12-8-08 34 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- the information for the 3 resolution was passed along to the folks over at the City 4 from -- oh, the lady with the San Antonio Library Foundation 5 that is assisting on this. I don't recall her name off the 6 top of my head at this point. But -- so I assume it must be 7 the company that's providing the -- 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: -- the funding, as the resolution 10 calls for. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 14 approval of the resolution. Question or discussion? All in 15 favor of that motion, signify by raising your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's move 20 to Item 17; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 21 proclaim the second Tuesday in January as Volunteers for 22 Democracy Day. A request was made that we place that on the 23 agenda, and I have done so accordingly. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 12-8-08 35 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 2 approval. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 3 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 8 to Item 18; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 9 approve the library agreement between the City of Kerrville 10 and Kerr County. Commissioner Oehler? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This was an agreement, I 12 believe, that we came up with during our joint meeting back 13 in the summer with them of what our funding level would be, 14 and I believe it's a -- it would be a good idea for us to 15 adopt this agreement formally so that the City knows for sure 16 what our funding level will be. Would you like for me to 17 read this into the record, or do you want to -- 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'd like to hear Number 5. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You'd like to hear Number 5? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: In the record. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay, here comes Number 5. 22 The parties agree that County -- the County's contribution 23 for library services for Fiscal Year 2008-2009 shall be 24 $400,000. The County shall pay its contribution to the City 25 in 12 monthly installments on or before the 15th day of each 12-8-08 36 1 month during the term of the agreement, beginning 2 October 15th, 2008. With the provision that funding is 3 subject to budgetary appropriations as provided by law, the 4 anticipated County contribution for library services for 5 Fiscal Year 2009-2010 shall be $300,000, and the contribution 6 for Fiscal Year 2010-2011 shall be $200,000. And this 7 agreement shall remain in full force and effect for a period 8 of one year, beginning October 1, 2008, ending 9 September 30th, 2009. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that a motion to approve? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I move approval of the 12 funding agreement for the library. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 15 approval. Question or discussion on the motion? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: A little just discussion, more 17 for public awareness. The reason for these -- the dollar 18 adjustment is that the County is taking up basically the same 19 amount dollar increase of funding in each of those years for 20 the airport, with the intent being that the County will take 21 over 100 percent funding of maintenance/operations at the 22 airport as of 2011, and our contribution will remain somewhat 23 static with the 200,000 for the library after that date. I 24 just want to make sure the public is aware, and the press, 25 that we're not reducing funding, really, overall. The 12-8-08 37 1 funding is staying the same between the joint operations. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just redistributing. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just redistributing it so that 4 there's less controversy. One's more -- well, each of us are 5 responsible for one of the operations. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Hopefully, this will not lead 7 to some further arguments over library funding. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And airport funding. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And airport funding. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, all of this grows out of a 11 joint meeting which we held earlier this year in which those 12 agreements were struck with regard to shifting the 13 responsibility of the library more to the City, the airport 14 more to the County, and essentially in accordance with the 15 agreements that we've -- we've made with the City on a 16 go-forward basis. We -- do we have a motion? 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 18 THE CLERK: We have a motion and a second. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Any further question or 20 discussion on the motion? All in favor of the motion, 21 signify by raising your right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's move 12-8-08 38 1 to Item 19; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 2 approve the resolution for the submission of the Victims Of 3 Crime Act grant proposal for 2009-2010 to the Office of the 4 Governor, Criminal Justice Division. Purpose of the grant is 5 to fund Kerr County Crime Victims Coordinator program. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and second for 9 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion on the 10 motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 11 right hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll move 16 to Item 20; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 17 approve the appointment of County Treasurer Mindy Williams as 18 financial officer for the Victims Of Crime Act grant that 19 funds the Crime Victims Coordinator position for the 20 remainder of 2008-2009 grant year and for the new grant 21 application for 2009-2010; authorize County Judge to notify 22 the Governor's office of the change within 14 days of the 23 court order. 24 MS. HARGIS: Judge, as the Treasurer, Mindy cannot 25 be the financial officer of this grant because the conflicts 12-8-08 39 1 of internal control. She takes in the money. And, first of 2 all, I have taken one full year and a lot of grief to fill in 3 this application, and I was not notified of this at all. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, where is 5 Ms. Lavender? Doesn't she need to be addressing this Court? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: I would think that -- it's her 7 agenda item. She asked that it be placed on the agenda. 8 MR. EMERSON: I can tell you she's at -- she told 9 me she's at an AACOG meeting in San Antonio, 'cause I had to 10 call and ask her a couple questions. 11 MS. HARGIS: I can tell you that I would -- I 12 was -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, are you supposed to be 14 presenting the agenda item for her? Or -- 15 MR. EMERSON: I can present basically the 16 information that she gave me. But I know she's at the -- 17 she's at an AACOG grant funding mandatory workshop, and I 18 don't know which grant it's for. But -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, just from my point of 20 view, I'm -- you know, we're talking about appointing a 21 treasurer. Now we have the Auditor up here telling us 22 something different. Seems like to me we have a cart pulling 23 a horse here or something, maybe. I don't -- I'm not sure 24 what's going on here. 25 MS. HARGIS: I think this is something that she and 12-8-08 40 1 I need to discuss. She put this on the agenda without 2 discussing it. Also Item 21. I've not seen this. Half of 3 this Indigent Health Care goes through my office, half 4 through hers. These are actually items that should be 5 discussed between the two of us before she puts them on the 6 agenda. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think it should be 8 discussed before us with the two of you present. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's probably true. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's the way I think it 11 ought to be discussed. 12 MR. EMERSON: 21 is a separate agenda item. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I understand. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think on the -- well, on this 15 one, this is -- obviously, there's a difference of what we 16 want to do. Why don't we pass? I don't see that that's a 17 time-urgent -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: You're -- you're presently the -- 19 MS. HARGIS: I'm presently the financial officer. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: -- financial officer? 21 MS. HARGIS: And I have -- the Auditor's office has 22 been financial officer of all the grants, and that's the way 23 that it's supposed to be set up. And -- 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, she needs to be here 25 to tell us why she's requesting a change. 12-8-08 41 1 MS. HARGIS: Well, I can tell you why she's 2 requesting a change. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, I don't want you to tell 4 me. 5 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want her to tell me. 7 That's the whole point of this thing. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree with that. We need 9 to hear from the person who put this on the agenda. And it's 10 highly unusual that a paid staffer would put on the agenda 11 the appointment of a county official. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Highly unusual. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Are we going to pass that 15 item, gentlemen? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just a minute. 19 MS. GRINSTEAD: Rosa had requested that they be put 20 as last, hoping she would be here in time. So, since there 21 is no timed item, if you can just -- I don't know what time 22 she'll be here, but -- 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can pass, and maybe at the 24 workshop -- 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Pass for now. Okay, let's go to 12-8-08 42 1 Item 21; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 2 approve the proposed Kerr County Indigent Health Policy. 3 Another item by Ms. Lavender. 4 MR. EMERSON: Judge, I did tell Ms. Lavender I 5 would present this one. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 7 MR. EMERSON: Because what we've done is, 8 Ms. Lavender and myself and the Indigent Health Care 9 Coordinator have sat down and gone through the statutes, 10 basically, for the last six weeks. And I think there's -- 11 each of you received binders with suggestions for the program 12 that I put together after I went through the statutes. 13 There's a proposed Kerr County Indigent Health Care Policy in 14 the front of it. It takes the existing policy that we have 15 that is deficient, at best, takes the statutes, and 16 fine-tunes it in order to limit the policy pursuant to 17 statute. I realize this may be -- you know, you probably 18 didn't have time to read this whole binder, but we would 19 request that the Court review this policy, take it into 20 consideration, and at the appropriate time, grant it. I 21 think what the Court will find is it'll significantly control 22 the cost of what the County's currently spending on indigent 23 health care. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: The suggestions that this review 25 team has made would -- would tightly define eligibility 12-8-08 43 1 requirements, but still be within the law. 2 MR. EMERSON: It'll -- from the best we can tell, 3 it will be completely within the law. I compared it to the 4 statutes. The Indigent Health Care Coordinator and 5 Ms. Lavender went to state conference; they took the 6 information there, and that's how we came up with this 7 policy. The existing policy we have is -- is extremely 8 loose. It was pieced together over a period of time, and in 9 pieces -- puzzle pieces that were just kind of fit together. 10 And what the statute says is that if we have a comprehensive 11 policy that's adopted by the County, we can -- we can enforce 12 that policy. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: From a time frame standpoint, I 14 notice that this policy was to become effective February 1? 15 August -- January 31? Something like that. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Next year sometime. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: January 31. Is -- is there a lead 18 time by which we must adopt the -- any new policy before it 19 becomes effective? 20 MR. EMERSON: Not necessarily a definite lead time, 21 but there is a requirement in the statute for proper notice 22 to the public. So -- 23 JUDGE TINLEY: What's the notice requirement? 24 MR. EMERSON: -- once the County -- it's not 25 specified. 12-8-08 44 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Fourteen days? 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I thought it was 14 days. 3 MR. EMERSON: That's what I would assume; it's the 4 default, 'cause it's not specified. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So, if we take a look at it 6 at either our next meeting or our first meeting in January, 7 which is going to be on the -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Before we can take a look at it 9 on the 22nd, or the -- 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 22nd. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is the reason we're not 12 going to adopt it today? We're not familiar with it? We 13 don't like it? We don't like each other, or what? 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I read most of this stuff. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I did too. I'm ready. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm in agreement with what's 17 being proposed. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I read the summary, and the 19 summary's very comprehensive. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Sounds to me like what we're 21 doing is tightening it up where it make it a little harder. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I like it. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I like it a whole lot better 24 than some of things that were in the existing one. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, gentlemen, it's before you. 12-8-08 45 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move for approval. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I second it. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for the 4 approval of the proposed Kerr County Indigent Health Policy. 5 Question or discussion on the motion? 6 MS. HARGIS: I still haven't seen it. I would like 7 to have a copy of it. He says it doesn't affect the 8 financials, but the financials are affected by the policy, so 9 I'd at least like to have a copy to see if that's going to be 10 a problem with the way we're currently paying in the program 11 and things of that nature. 12 MR. EMERSON: I can answer that. It doesn't have 13 any effect at all on the current payment policy. It's 14 strictly in the applications and the processing procedures. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: And the eligibility requirements? 16 MR. EMERSON: Correct. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion on 18 the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 19 your right hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll go to 24 Item 22; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action on 25 joint agreement with the -- between Kerr County and the City 12-8-08 46 1 of Kerrville with the Normandy Group for governmental 2 relations assistance to obtain federal government funding or 3 other assistance for economic development projects and 4 infrastructure and facilities needs. I put this on the 5 agenda. You have before you some information from the 6 Normandy Group that would provide assistance with contacts 7 with Congress, federal agencies in order to obtain funding 8 for various projects that we may have. The -- this was 9 developed as a result of the trip to Washington that the 10 mayor and I participated in, along with economic development 11 representatives, the thought being that if we don't get more 12 coming in than what we're paying out, we can terminate the 13 relationship. Also, the thought would be that this would be 14 a joint agreement in which the City and County would equally 15 participate, inasmuch as the financial gains that could be 16 enjoyed by either the City or the County or both, and the 17 Normandy Group would -- would be pursuing on behalf of both 18 the City and the County, spreading the cost that way. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That doesn't mean that they 20 have to be joint initiatives, does it, Judge? Something that 21 we both seek to have funding for? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: No. No. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: A project of the County or 24 project of the City, but not necessarily a project of both. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Or it could be a project which 12-8-08 47 1 benefited -- or primarily benefited some private or 2 quasi-governmental operation, but which would have an 3 economic development impact on Kerr County. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Fine. Okay. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I presume this is related -- my 8 computer doesn't have backup on this one, but I've got a 9 backup that I got in regular mail, and it refers to, like, a 10 pretty hefty retainer. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, it does. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Who's paying that? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the City and the County will 14 jointly pay that. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Jon comes up with the best 17 questions, doesn't he? 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Monthly retainer is 10,000 a 20 month. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's go to the next item. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's 60,000 a year, the way 23 I calculate my half. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: That's exactly right, Commissioner. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just -- you know, I mean, I 12-8-08 48 1 think it's a good idea, and we had another entity -- I mean, 2 I like the fact that -- some of the principals with this one. 3 I think they have some good connections to our area, and may 4 be able to assist. We had another one that we did something 5 with that was similar to this. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, I brought that to the 7 Court several months ago, and we sort of sat on it during 8 budget time, because the fee structure was pretty high. And 9 I did not continue those contacts. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Was very high, from what I 11 remember. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Was very high. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, I mean -- you know, I mean, 14 is the City, with some of their other sources, going to come 15 up with some of this funding? I guess it's a serious 16 question. Where's the money coming from? 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It could -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Jointly from the City and the 19 County. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But -- okay. Then where's it 21 coming from in the county? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, that would be for this Court 23 to determine. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is this for next fiscal 25 year beginning in January, or whenever we sign on? Starts 12-8-08 49 1 when we sign on? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it starts December 1st. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. What you got to understand is 4 that the next general session is going to crank up in 5 January, and there's a whole lot of stuff already going on in 6 connection with what's going to happen there. A lot of 7 people getting in line. So -- 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Are we going to be able to 9 pay for this out of some of the funding that we get, as 10 administrative costs or something? 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Probably not directly. But, as I 12 indicated, the -- the proposition is such that very -- very 13 frankly put, if -- if those efforts don't generate more 14 financial resources coming our direction than are going their 15 direction, we terminate the relationship. And if you can -- 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm afraid -- it is 60-day 17 notice, what I remember, or is it 30-day notice? 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think it's at 60. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Sixty. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Sixty. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: I believe 60. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And, you know, you're going 23 to have to give it time to work. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess -- this is something 12-8-08 50 1 new, and, I mean, the Hill Country county group has talked a 2 lot about this, and some counties are doing this on the state 3 level. Which I haven't -- I said Kerr County wasn't 4 interested in participating, I didn't think. But, you know, 5 maybe we should look at these things more. I've been one 6 that's kind of been closed to these types of things. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, you know, in terms of 8 things that we'd like to try to accomplish over the next year 9 or two or three or four, an investment like this really does 10 make some sense. We're talking about Hill Country Junior 11 District Livestock show. We've got infrastructure projects 12 in the conduit, and there are just a raft of other things we 13 could put into the -- into the conduit along with whatever 14 issues the City would like to try to do. Basically, it makes 15 sense. Question is, do we want to try to fund it? If we 16 fund it, the -- if we fund it for this budget year, we'll 17 have to find $45,000 before we get to next budget year. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Where have you found it? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I didn't. I didn't look. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably Jailers Salaries. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The Judge probably knows. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: No, I don't, sir. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's in gas in the Sheriff's 24 Department. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Ha. 12-8-08 51 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: There you go. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Gas and Oil, that's where it 3 is. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Jailers Salaries. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And Jailers Salaries. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I -- 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there -- what's the 8 possibility of getting a representative -- 9 JUDGE TINLEY: It's a good possibility. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- down here? I mean, I would 11 be much more inclined after talking to them as to what 12 they're looking at covering, what they're -- and at the same 13 time, we can kind of think and really put it on paper what 14 our projects are, 'cause we can say, "This is what we're 15 looking at." What, you know -- 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What's the possibility of 17 getting those things -- some of that funded? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, funded. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And, you know, if -- if we 20 were to get a million bucks, it's worth the $60,000 21 investment, or more. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And we do have some things 23 pending right now that -- clearly, that need federal funding, 24 and probably need a little bit of a nudge to get through that 25 federal funding process. 12-8-08 52 1 JUDGE TINLEY: In our discussions with 2 representatives of that group, the principals, there are some 3 pots of money up there that -- that exist for the apparent 4 purposes can be used for totally different purposes. A lot 5 of transportation money, for example, that has flowed around, 6 apparently. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I would -- 8 JUDGE TINLEY: And if you don't -- if you don't 9 know how to play the game, you can't find the money. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's right. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You have to have somebody 12 that will play the game. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: That knows how, exactly. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I would sure like to talk to 15 these people before -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- before we put them on the 18 payroll. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: We can do that. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So this is really a better 21 financial deal than the one I brought to the Court before. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, they're getting better 23 every time. Maybe there's another one that will appear. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the principals on here 25 are pretty -- 12-8-08 53 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- strong. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think the principals are 4 fine. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think it's just 6 interesting, we're going to hire somebody to go to Washington 7 to get some of our own money. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Back. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: To bring it back down here. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Rather than -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Something wrong with this 12 picture. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Rather than let somebody else hire 14 them and your money goes to somebody else. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, you can put it that 16 way. It's still our damn money. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And it's still -- and it's part 18 of the big problem in Washington. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Exactly. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are they going to get it fixed? 22 Probably not. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's the squeaky wheel gets 24 the grease syndrome. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I can be pretty squeaky. 12-8-08 54 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We will -- well, we'll get 2 you some enlightenment on that subject, sir, very quickly. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to our 10 o'clock timed 5 item. At this time, I will recess the Commissioners Court 6 meeting, and I will convene a public hearing to abandon, 7 vacate, and discontinue the 21.20-acre portion of land from 8 the recorded plat of Comanche Caves Ranch as set forth in 9 Volume 4, Page 209, Plat Records, and located in Precinct 4. 10 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 10:00 a.m., and a public hearing was held in 11 open court, as follows:) 12 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Is there any member of the public 14 that wishes to be heard with respect to the abandonment, 15 vacating, and discontinuance of the 21.20-acre portion of 16 land from the recorded plat of Comanche Caves Ranch, as set 17 forth in Volume 4, Page 209, Plat Records? 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Seeing no one coming forward with 20 respect to that matter, I will close the public hearing 21 dealing with the abandonment, vacating, and discontinuance of 22 the 21.20-acre portion of land from the recorded plat of the 23 Comanche caves Ranch as set forth in Volume 4, Page 209, and 24 located in Precinct 4. 25 (Public hearing concluded at 10:00 a.m., and regular Commissioners Court meeting reopened.) 12-8-08 55 1 JUDGE TINLEY: I will reconvene the Commissioners 2 Court meeting, and since it is not 10:10, we can't take up 3 that next item. I go by the clock on the wall. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Made her walk all the way up 5 here. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Tell you what, why don't we -- why 7 don't we -- why don't we pay the bills right quick? 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Our good friend Rob Kelly is here, 10 and I told him I wanted him to be able to enjoy all of the 11 excitement of a Commissioners Court meeting, and he assured 12 me he wanted to stay for it all. So, we're going to let him 13 have some introduction to this also. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move we pay the bills. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to Section 4. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to pay the 18 bills. Question or discussion on the motion? Okay. I had 19 some questions. Ms. Hargis, on Page 1, I don't know, about 20 two-thirds of the way down the page where you say Court 21 Appointment, Civil Attorneys? 22 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: We created a separate account for 24 the several attorney's fees. 25 MS. HARGIS: For the -- yes, we did. 12-8-08 56 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. For C.P.S.? 2 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Why is it, then, on Page 2, under 4 216th and 198th, there's a whole bunch of civil court 5 appointment payments being made there? 6 MS. HARGIS: It's going to a different account 7 number. We haven't set up a separate fund for it, I don't 8 think. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Did we just set up the civil for the 10 County Court at Law portion? 11 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Not for the -- not for the 13 198th or 216th? 14 MS. HARGIS: No, I wasn't asked to do that. Only 15 for Judge Brown's court. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I know Judge Brown, for a 17 couple of years now, has wanted to get that out of his -- out 18 of his budget, because he essentially has no control over it. 19 MS. HARGIS: Right. The other two did not ask for 20 that. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, the ones on Page 1, 23 that's Judge Brown? 24 JUDGE TINLEY: The civil -- 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's out of his court? 12-8-08 57 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, that's true. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And these two are the two 3 District Courts? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: That's correct. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. And it's going to be 6 this way for next month too? 7 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right, groovy. 9 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, they come in like that, and 10 they're actually posted separate so you can see them. And I 11 think this report format just shows you a little bit better. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, super. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: And I put Commissioner Baldwin's 14 name next to one of the payments under 198th District Court, 15 about three-fourths of the way down. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm not going to say a word. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to Page 4. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Coward. Chicken. Quack, 19 quack, quack. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: AFLAC. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: I notice some dental payments there. 22 That's excluded from the -- 23 MS. HARGIS: From the medical. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: -- medical contract? Okay. 25 MS. HARGIS: And those are also coming in from 12-8-08 58 1 prior months. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Further on down, Constable 3, 3 Capital Outlay. Tell me what that's about. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: More bells and whistles, 5 probably. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: John, do you know what that is? 7 MR. TROLINGER: What is the amount? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: C.D.W. Government, 782. 9 MR. TROLINGER: That is his laptop computer that 10 was approved in the budget process. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 12 MR. TROLINGER: And it's installed and up and 13 running. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 15 MS. HARGIS: Thank you, John. I'd forgotten about 16 that. I had the other one I had a question about. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do all constables have a 18 computer in their car? 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This was a test one, I 20 believe, remember? 21 MS. HARGIS: Remember, he requested to take out the 22 lap -- the desktop and get a laptop, so he's using it for 23 both places. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, I recall. 12-8-08 59 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This way he won't get lost 2 when he goes driving. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right, at night. 4 (Laughter.) He's got Garmin on the big screen? 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Now, that was tacky. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It was tacky. I'm sorry. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just mean. That is 8 downright mean. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Mean-spirited, we could call that. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mean-spirited. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or -- 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I just got to it before you 13 did; that's what happened. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Must be a Republican. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion, signify 16 by raising your right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Do you have 21 any budget amendments? 22 MS. HARGIS: No, sir. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Any late bills? 24 MS. HARGIS: No, sir. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: I've been presented with monthly 12-8-08 60 1 reports from Constable, Precinct 1; Constable, Precinct 4; 2 County Clerk; Justice of the Peace, Precinct 3; and 3 Environmental Health. Do I hear a motion that those reports 4 be approved as presented? 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 8 approval of the reports as presented. Question or discussion 9 on the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by 10 raising your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Looks like 15 it's now 10:10. We will go back to the 10:10 timed item. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Hurry, Kelly. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Consider, discuss, and take 18 appropriate action to abandon, vacate, and discontinue the 19 21.20-acre portion of land from the recorded plat of Comanche 20 Caves Ranch as set forth in Volume 4, Page 209, Plat Records. 21 Yes, ma'am? 22 MS. HOFFER: The Comanche Caves Owners' Association 23 is requesting that the 21.20-acre portion of Naroni Ranch be 24 abandoned, vacated, discontinued from the recorded plat of 25 Comanche Caves Ranch, Volume 4, Page 209. Michael D. Vlasek 12-8-08 61 1 and his wife, Sandra Vlasek, are the owners of this 2 21.20 acres of land. At this time, we ask that you accept 3 the abandonment, vacating, and discontinuation of the said 4 21.20 acres of Naroni Ranch from the Comanche Caves Ranch 5 recorded plat, Volume 4, Page 209. And attorney David 6 Jackson, representing the Comanche Caves Homeowners' 7 Association, and attorney Rob Kelly, representing the 8 Vlaseks, are present if you have any additional questions. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Any questions for Ms. Hoffer? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Only question I have is 11 probably more to Rex first, and he and I discussed this 12 previously. I've talked to Kelly about this, as to the 13 process to do it, and my point all long has been someone 14 needs to prepare a new plat so we can have a good plat of 15 record, and -- because that's just kind of the policy, I 16 guess, we've operated under for a long time. And by my 17 reading of the -- it appears to me this is coming under the 18 cancellation of a subdivision portion of our subdivision 19 rules, which is a part or all of a subdivision. And under 20 that provision, I think that we can require that it be 21 submitted and filed, and approve this and be done with it. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But done by Comanche Caves 23 Subdivision, as opposed to Mr. Vlasek. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. The rules say 25 Commissioners Court, by order, shall authorize the owner of 12-8-08 62 1 the subdivision to file an instrument canceling the 2 subdivision, in whole or in part. And, to me, that means 3 Comanche Caves has to do it, and that it has to be -- you 4 know, and that instrument, in my mind, is a revised plat 5 that's filed of record. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with you. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And if it's -- that's my two 8 cents. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Jackson, obviously, you're going 10 to have some input on this. 11 MR. JACKSON: Well -- David Jackson on behalf of 12 Comanche Caves. We're not opposed to any methodology, but 13 the point's well made, something to record. Simply an 14 approval today wouldn't be adequate. We probably need 15 something signed by Mr. Kelly's clients. We probably need 16 something signed by the Court. It could either be an order, 17 it could be a plat. It could be -- it could show Naroni 18 Ranch; this is in, this is out. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To me -- 20 MR. JACKSON: I really think it's not something -- 21 when I first visited with the office, nobody was real clear 22 on how to do it. Everybody was okay with doing it, so -- 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. To me, -- 24 MR. JACKSON: -- I'm not opposed to that. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- just a new plat of Comanche 12-8-08 63 1 Caves with the portion that's no longer in it being shown to 2 be out of the subdivision, and have it signed by both 3 parties, like a normal -- and then go through like a normal 4 plat. 5 MR. JACKSON: My only comment there is, the whole 6 Comanche Caves is a little more difficult, 'cause you have to 7 get a surveyor. You have to prepare a new survey for all of 8 Comanche Caves, when actually all that's in play is that 9 little section there. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think all that has to be 11 done -- and we frequently have plats filed of record that -- 12 even, like, for a lot line in a big subdivision, we just do 13 that one lot. 14 MR. JACKSON: I agree. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All that has to be done is just 16 one -- one or two lots. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Basically, just a new survey 18 of what's been done. 19 MR. JACKSON: That little survey's actually been 20 done, so it's easy to put together. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Could even be that one lot -- 22 one lot that's being revised, as I understand it, just 23 revising that one lot. 24 MR. JACKSON: That's correct. So, that's better 25 than an order or something like that. Whatever you guys 12-8-08 64 1 would prefer, that's fine with me. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Does that work, Rex? Rob? 3 MR. KELLY: That's fine. 4 MR. JACKSON: Just going to have a new map that 5 will show what's platted, what's not, and it's going of 6 record. And the point's well made that that's a good thing. 7 MR. KELLY: We have no problem with that. 8 MR. JACKSON: Okay. Do we bring that back to you? 9 Or do you approve it today subject to -- subject to -- we 10 have to probably come back with something that would actually 11 be signed off on, and we'd have to have another meeting. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Be fine. 13 MR. JACKSON: That's okay. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not -- I don't think we do. 15 I think we can do it today. I think -- obviously, you don't 16 have the plat. I think once it's done -- 'cause I don't see 17 that this has to go through -- this is not a revision of 18 plat, so we don't need to get all those other signatures. 19 All we need, I think, are the County Judge, the Subdivision 20 Administrator person, and the parties. I mean, I really 21 don't know -- and the surveyor, of course. I mean, that -- 22 but I don't see -- 23 MR. JACKSON: Fine. I'm okay. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You already approved the 25 revision, right? 12-8-08 65 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with Jon. What are 2 you referring to, court order? What is -- 3 MR. JACKSON: I've seen -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What might that be? 5 MR. JACKSON: When you abandon a road, you do a 6 court order. It just occurred to me that might be a 7 methodology. We have not -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What we spoke today will be 9 an order. 10 MR. JACKSON: I agree. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: On this agenda item. So, 12 that may be adequate of what -- okay. 13 MR. JACKSON: But something to go of record, so 14 we're saying the same thing. The replat's fine for revision 15 of plat. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or discussion on 17 the motion? 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What is the motion? 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We don't have a motion yet. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: We don't? 21 THE CLERK: We don't have a motion. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I was looking at -- at 23 Cheryl. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I move for approval of the 25 agenda item, and also that Comanche Caves will provide a new 12-8-08 66 1 plat to be signed by the County Judge and both parties to be 2 filed of record showing the -- the land that was vacated. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 5 indicated. Question or discussion on that motion? All in 6 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: First one that we've done in 12 about 12 years. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Maybe. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Why don't we -- thank you, 15 gentlemen. Why don't we take about a 20-minute recess at 16 this point? 17 (Recess taken from 10:15 a.m. to 11:05 a.m.) 18 - - - - - - - - - - 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to order, if 20 we might. We were in recess for a while, and we will recess 21 the Commissioners Court meeting, go to Item 23; consider, 22 discuss, take appropriate action regarding new employee and 23 three employees whose jobs have been changed due to employee 24 termination. Ms. Bolin asked that this be on the agenda. Is 25 there any portion of it that can be handled in open or public 12-8-08 67 1 session at this point, Ms. Bolin? 2 MS. BOLIN: It's discussing salaries and that. I 3 don't know. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Probably need to get your guidance 5 from the County Attorney. I don't know to what degree he's 6 aware of the subject matter of what you're dealing with. 7 MS. BOLIN: I'm sorry, I didn't talk to him. I 8 talked to Eva. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll be happy to ask some 11 questions, kind of get it going, if you -- it would help. 12 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 13 MS. BOLIN: Okay, they say I can do it in court. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Pardon? 15 MS. BOLIN: In open. The last time I came before 16 you gentlemen regarding an employee was one that we thought 17 we were going to have problems with in termination. I did 18 get her terminated with the help of Ms. Hyde and Rex. When 19 she left, I did some changing around in my office. The 20 person that I hired had nine years experience with us 21 previously. She came in; she worked three days being 22 retrained for the law changes, and went to work at the county 23 by herself. I don't want to start her at a 14-1. I wanted 24 to start her at a 14-3 because of her experience. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Question. 12-8-08 68 1 MS. BOLIN: Yes, sir? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What did you start her at? 3 MS. BOLIN: Right now, she's at a 14-1. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 5 MS. BOLIN: Until I could come here. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right. All right. 7 Okay, go. 8 MS. BOLIN: I have an employee that I moved -- I do 9 not have a supervisor position in my Tax Department. The 10 employee that I moved there is doing the supervisor duties 11 and the bookkeeping, and I wanted to take her from a 14-3 to 12 a 15-3. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: How much of an increase is 14 that? 15 MS. BOLIN: 1,401.92. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How much? 17 MS. BOLIN: 1,401.92. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Are these reclassifications, 19 I guess is what you'd call them? Moving people around in 20 your office? Is that going to have a budgetary impact over 21 and above? 22 MS. BOLIN: No. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Or are you going to be able 24 to take the money that was -- 25 MS. BOLIN: Everything that was -- yes, plus with 12-8-08 69 1 some left. So -- 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All of these changes that 4 you're talking about comes out of the salary line that -- 5 MS. BOLIN: For the terminated person. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- that was released? 7 MS. BOLIN: Correct. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I say the word "released." 9 MS. BOLIN: Okay. Yeah, she was released. Okay, 10 sorry. And then I moved my supervisor from Motor Vehicle 11 over to the Tax Department, because she is familiar with the 12 taxes, and she is now going to be a full-time employee over 13 there. She will be my cover for Ingram substation now, as 14 well as backup supervisor, backup Motor Vehicle, and she 15 works in Elections. So, I didn't want to change her at all 16 as far as status or -- the only thing I could see to do so 17 that I could leave my supervisor position open in Motor 18 Vehicle was to move it to a -- move her to a 16-1. Salary 19 won't change, just the step and grade. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: From a 17-8 to a 16-1? Is 21 that correct? 22 MS. BOLIN: Mm-hmm. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm confused. 24 MS. BOLIN: That doesn't sound right. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Keeping the salaries the 12-8-08 70 1 same? 2 MS. HYDE: No. 3 MS. BOLIN: Which way does that go? 4 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 5 MS. BOLIN: I bet that's supposed to be a 16-12. 6 MS. HYDE: Yeah. Yeah, that's a 16-12. 7 MS. BOLIN: Okay. 8 MS. HYDE: The 2 didn't show up on that one. It's 9 16-12, not a 16-1. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. These damn computers 11 these days, you can't trust them. 12 MS. BOLIN: That's right. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And the number -- the 14 salary number remains the same? 15 MS. BOLIN: Yes, sir. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: And it was 17 what? 17 MS. BOLIN: A 17-8 to a 16-12. That way I still 18 have my supervisor position for Motor Vehicle, and the 19 employee that I moved there is currently at a 14-6, and to 20 move him to a 17-2 would give him a $1,500 increase a year. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 14-6 to -- 22 MS. BOLIN: 17-2. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: 17-2. And that's 1,500? 24 MS. BOLIN: Yes. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Why a 17-2 and not a 17-1? 12-8-08 71 1 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 2 MS. BOLIN: It's the same? 3 MS. HYDE: Yes. Okay, there was an error. It's a 4 16-10, not 12, so that it remains the same. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're going back up? 6 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. See how those 8 computers will do this? 9 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 10 MS. HYDE: Did you catch that, Judge? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No. 12 MS. HYDE: The 17-8 goes to a 16-10. 16-10. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just lowered it two more 14 notches, huh? 15 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. That way there's no increase. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What about the question 17 Commissioner 4 asked? 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Why -- the last one, you just 19 said, was -- 20 MS. BOLIN: 14-6 to a 17-2. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Why a 17-2 and not 17-1? 22 What was a 17-1? 23 MS. HYDE: Which one? 14-6? 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Is that a legitimate 25 question? 12-8-08 72 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Hopefully we'll get a legitimate 3 answer. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've got my doubts. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: I already know the answer, but -- 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That would be nice. I'm 7 not going to say what's on my mind. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: The answer is because there's a 9 change in job description. He's getting additional 10 supervisory duties, so instead of going to 17-1, where he'd 11 be making the 17-1, we give him a one-step increase for more 12 money. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I want to hear it. 14 MS. HYDE: That is the answer. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We're waiting on you to 16 tell us. 17 MS. BOLIN: 'Cause I want him at a 17-2. 18 (Laughter.) 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That wasn't the answer I was 20 expecting. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's not the answer. 22 MS. BOLIN: No, he actually -- actually, the clerk 23 I moved is doing all of the duties except ordering as the 24 supervisor. He does the training, he does all the reports, 25 he does the deposits, everything for Motor Vehicle. 12-8-08 73 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Increased job responsibility? 2 MS. BOLIN: Absolutely. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There you go. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So -- so, that person has 5 taken over Nell's duties? 6 MS. BOLIN: Yes. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is Nell the person right 8 above? 9 MS. BOLIN: Yes. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. All right. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought we -- didn't we 12 discuss -- or did we defer? 13 MS. HYDE: Deferred. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Until we get the H.R. thing? 15 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, we really don't have a 17 policy that people start at 1 when they get an increase. 18 MS. BOLIN: And I don't -- normally I start at a 1. 19 But with nine years experience and not having to train, and 20 putting her on the counter the first day after a holiday, and 21 her just picking up like she's never been gone, I feel like 22 that's an injustice. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's a 17 -- what's the pay 24 of a 17-1? 25 MS. HYDE: As a 17 -- I'm sorry? 12-8-08 74 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 17-1. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Probably the same as the 14-6. 3 MS. HYDE: 17-1 is 30,562.56. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: How much is a 2? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, it's a -- about $800 6 difference. So that's -- well, $800 to get to the -- getting 7 him to a 17-1 would be $800. An $800 raise versus $1,500 8 raise. 9 MS. HYDE: The other part that she hasn't mentioned 10 is that now her people are cross-trained, so that we're not 11 sitting there, and if someone separates, it's no longer as 12 critical as it was before. You know, there's cross-training 13 throughout, and that makes it a heck of a lot easier if you 14 have a separation of some sort. 15 MS. BOLIN: Also, the new employee coming in worked 16 in Voter Registration for a couple of years before she left 17 us. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: On your Motor Vehicle stations, -- 19 MS. BOLIN: Mm-hmm. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: -- how many stations do you have? 21 MS. BOLIN: I have four at the counter, one for the 22 supervisor, and one in Ingram. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Those are the ones that are 24 tied into TexDOT? 25 MS. BOLIN: Yes, sir. 12-8-08 75 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. What -- on a normal day, how 2 many of those do you have going up front? 3 MS. BOLIN: All four of them. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: All four? Okay. 5 MS. BOLIN: Oh, yeah. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: I didn't know whether one was -- 7 MS. BOLIN: Like a backup? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Or, you know, when things got 9 -- got crowded, extra heavy business day, why, then you'd 10 staff that one. 11 MS. BOLIN: No. The only one that would be used 12 any differently would be the one the supervisor uses, and he 13 can do mail there while -- while the clerks at the front are 14 working the customers. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: At the counter? 16 MS. BOLIN: At the counter. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. And you have in place 18 positions in all four of those stations? 19 MS. BOLIN: Yes, sir. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: That are staffed? 21 MS. BOLIN: Yes. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm not an argumentative 24 type person, but if I were, I would argue with you about that 25 very last one. An employee with nine years experience, and 12-8-08 76 1 you're really not doing much here at all. What's your 2 reasoning behind that? That person needs -- that's the one 3 that needs to be bumped -- 4 MS. BOLIN: I really thought that a 14-3 was 5 pushing it, since they're supposed to start at a 14-1. So, 6 I pushed it. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: After nine years 8 experience? 9 MS. BOLIN: Well, she hasn't been here in six 10 years, so she's considered a new employee again in Kerr 11 County. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, she hasn't been here in 13 six years? 14 MS. BOLIN: Yes. 15 MS. HYDE: Right. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The first line of your 17 document, I assume that that individual that you're telling 18 us is released -- 19 MS. BOLIN: Mm-hmm. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- is not going to be 21 replaced? 22 MS. BOLIN: The -- 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The position. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The position. 25 MS. HYDE: No. 12-8-08 77 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm seeing a no -- 2 MS. BOLIN: Mm-hmm. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- from H.R. I am seeing a 4 no from the Tax Assessor. 5 MS. BOLIN: I still -- I have filled a position, 6 but not that one. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, that's what you're 8 doing on the bottom here, the last entry? 9 MS. BOLIN: Right. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Still going to have the same 12 number of people. 13 MS. BOLIN: Right. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just reducing the overall 15 cost. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that means you're -- I 17 mean, but I don't -- do you plan on replacing that position? 18 MS. BOLIN: No. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. So, you're going to 20 leave it? You're going to go down one supervisor and kind of 21 divide the supervisor to into two supervisors? 22 MS. HYDE: Yes. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that a yes? 24 MS. BOLIN: I'm sorry, yes. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Or into kind of one supervisor. 12-8-08 78 1 I guess my only problem is that -- and I guess we've done it 2 so much that it doesn't make any difference at this point -- 3 is that our job description is getting -- in relationship to 4 the position schedule seems to get further and further 5 undone. Almost every time we do something, we make a change, 6 we're just raising a salary here and raising here and 7 changing job descriptions around and changing supervisors' 8 responsibilities around, and getting, you know, just to -- I 9 don't mean at the whim, you know, of the elected official or 10 department head, but that's kind of what it is. Obviously, 11 you know how you want to run your office. I'm in favor of 12 letting you run your office your way, but I just wonder 13 how -- what we're doing to our job descriptions, 'cause we're 14 rewriting them to fit the salary that we want to pay these 15 people, which basically -- why have job descriptions like we 16 do? Why -- I mean -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's an excellent point. 18 I agree with you too, and I've always wondered if it -- if it 19 would be possible to have, like -- like, a window of time -- 20 like, our insurance, you know, you have this window of time 21 to change and fit things in. Maybe at the budget time of the 22 year, that would be the time to rearrange some people, and 23 you can't come back until that -- is there any way to do 24 something like that? 25 MS. HYDE: I guess that would be up to y'all. 12-8-08 79 1 MS. BOLIN: And my problem would be in that 2 situation, is that I had no intention of releasing this girl 3 that actually -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand that. 5 Releasing people is one thing, but I don't think that's 6 anywhere near what he's talking about. But all these other 7 things, like adding Mr. Huff's duties, changing his duties 8 and those kinds of things, you only do that once a year. 9 MS. BOLIN: What I -- what I tried to do was to put 10 the people from my Tax Department -- to be trained at tax 11 time would have just been a nightmare. The person I moved 12 over there was familiar with it. Since we're not in 13 executive session, I'm not saying names, but the person that 14 I moved over there is familiar with it. She had been 15 answering phone calls and trying to help people by looking 16 things up, so she was familiar. She had worked mail as far 17 as collecting. For me to bring someone in who had no idea 18 about the system, no idea about collections, no idea about 19 the laws, and put them there during tax time -- 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, your point's taken. 21 Good. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I have kind of a 23 follow-up question. 24 MS. BOLIN: Okay. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't understand, on the 12-8-08 80 1 Number 2, you talk about there's no supervisor category. 2 MS. BOLIN: Right. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: For taxes. 4 MS. BOLIN: Right. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are you telling me that 6 we've operated all these years, and there's no supervision 7 over that? 8 MS. BOLIN: The supervisor is the -- 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who's -- 10 MS. BOLIN: -- chief deputy and the Tax Assessor. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, what's the matter with 12 the chief deputy now? 13 MS. BOLIN: Nothing. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Why would you change that 15 supervision? Why would you ask for a supervisor if that's 16 been under the purview of the chief deputy? 17 MS. BOLIN: The person that I moved up is the one 18 who does the books, does all the monthly reports, writes the 19 checks, does all the refunds. So, the person who was sitting 20 at the counter now has taken on that additional duty, which 21 the chief deputy did not do. The chief deputy basically 22 overlooks the departments, all three of my departments, 23 covers where it's necessary, helps to train where it's 24 necessary. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 12-8-08 81 1 MS. BOLIN: But the duties that this person has 2 taken on are tremendous. What with the amount of money that 3 we bring in, and the bookkeeping, that's the reason that I 4 wanted the increase for her. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me ask a question, if I might. 6 As long as there's no budgetary impact, cannot an elected 7 official restructure their department and reallocate funds as 8 long as there's no budgetary impact? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- 10 JUDGE TINLEY: It seems to me like the only issue 11 we got that's in our lap right now is a new employee coming 12 on at a -- at a step greater than one, and that requires the 13 action of this Court. Is that not all we're dealing with 14 here? 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Doing more than that. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think that's correct. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we're doing more than 19 that, because right now there's two 14's, a 15, and a 17, and 20 we're changing it to a 14, a 15, a 16, and a 17. We're 21 changing one of the 14's allocated to that office to a 16, 22 and that's a pretty significant change. The dollars aren't 23 changing because of tenure, basically. 24 MS. BOLIN: Right. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So we're making -- it will have 12-8-08 82 1 long-term budgetary impact, because we're changing a 14 to a 2 16. 3 MS. HYDE: Well, the other part of that, 4 Commissioner, is that, unfortunately, you can't see that that 5 14 to 15 falls into the realm that the rest of those folks 6 who are in there are all 15's except for that one position, 7 so it brings that person into the same 15 grade that 8 everybody else is in. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, the 14's going to a 16. 10 MS. HYDE: I thought the 14 went to a 15. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There was two 14's, a 15, and a 12 17, and now we're at a 14, 15, 16, and a 17. 13 MS. HYDE: So one of them went to a 15. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, a 14 went to a 15; 15 went 15 to a 16? 16 (Ms. Hyde nodded.) 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that has long-term impact, 18 and it's changing -- I mean -- I mean, I agree with what the 19 Judge said on the budget from the dollars standpoint, but, 20 you know, it -- it long-term does have a budget impact. 21 MS. BOLIN: At this point, I'm not real sure what's 22 supposed to be brought before y'all. My understanding -- 23 JUDGE TINLEY: So you brought it all. There you 24 go. 25 MS. BOLIN: The -- I knew the new employee needed 12-8-08 83 1 to be. The other ones I wasn't sure of. But H.R. has 2 requested a court order so that they can adjust the salaries 3 on these other folks. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: See, that is exactly right, 5 that you need -- I think that she needs to come before us to 6 get these correct numbers. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: If the position schedule designates 8 something other than what she's -- 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's exactly right. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: -- asking for here, okay. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, I agree. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the third one on the 13 list could be done without coming to the Court for approval. 14 That's -- 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's lateral. 16 MS. BOLIN: Yeah. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, it's going down. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Salary lateral, not going 19 down. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Salary lateral, but -- see, I 21 look at the situation as going from a 17 to a 16. 22 MS. BOLIN: Right. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But, in effect, the salary 24 is red-circled. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. So that's -- you know. 12-8-08 84 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And sometimes you kind of 2 view it as a -- a courtesy of information, you know. A 3 courtesy call type thing, which I'm glad of. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: When in doubt, go for 6 overkill. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 8 MS. BOLIN: I have a tendency to overkill y'all all 9 the time, though. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made for approval of the -- 13 of the changes and restructuring as requested by the Tax 14 Assessor. Question or discussion on the motion? All in 15 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 16 (Commissioners Baldwin, Williams, and Oehler voted in favor of the motion.) 17 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (Commissioner Letz voted against the motion.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. 21 MS. BOLIN: Thank you, gentlemen. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's come back to Item 20, 23 if we might; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 24 approve formal appointment of the County Treasurer, Mindy 25 Williams, as financial officer for the Victims Of Crime Act 12-8-08 85 1 grant that funds Victims Coordinator position for the 2 remainder of the 2008-2009 grant year, and for the new grant 3 application for 2009-2010; authorize County Judge to notify 4 the Governor's office of the change within 14 days of court 5 order. Ms. Lavender? 6 MS. LAVENDER: I apologize for being late, but I 7 had to go to AACOG this morning. When they say you will be 8 here for a grant hearing, you will -- I mean grant workshop, 9 you will be there for a grant workshop, or you don't get to 10 apply for the grant. So, again, I apologize. Four years 11 ago, when I started this program -- and I think in that 12 period of time, you all understand the program and understand 13 what's going on, and would like to see the program continue. 14 And I think you would like to see the program continued with 15 the influx of federal funding as long as it's available. I 16 think, in reality -- and we've talked about this before -- 17 down the road, and it may be this year, that these federal 18 funds are going to decrease or dry up. There's a lot of 19 people with their straw in the bucket right now trying to -- 20 to make up for funding issues, and agencies, nonprofits and 21 government both, that dip into VOCA funding. And VOCA and 22 VAWA have been combined in this next grant year, so there's 23 going to be a broader group of people with more straws, I'm 24 afraid, into the program. They put a question on the grant 25 application this year that says sustainability. In other 12-8-08 86 1 words, what happens if you don't get the grant funding? So, 2 I think AACOG and I think the Governor's office both are in a 3 realization that these funds are not going to go on forever. 4 But one of the things that's required of the funding is that 5 a financial report be submitted in order to get the money 6 back. You submit a report, then they pay you the money back. 7 I've never even seen an FSR; I don't even know what it looks 8 like. I can't -- I can't submit it. It's out of my realm of 9 things that I can do. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: SFL? 11 MS. LAVENDER: FSR is the financial report. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Report, okay. 13 MS. LAVENDER: Okay. In this backup information 14 that I believe Rex gave you, I made a chronological record of 15 what's happened in the last year and a half. And last week, 16 I called the Governor's office and talked with Leslie Holmes 17 up there, who is the new Governor's representative that 18 handles the VOCA grant money, and she confirmed for me that 19 last year, as Ms. Hargis did say, there was some software 20 problems, but that those software problems have been 21 corrected. And this year, the first report that was due in 22 October again was not done on time, and that was bad. It's 23 not good for us; it's not good for the grant program. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can you explain that, 25 please? What do you mean? Who is responsible? 12-8-08 87 1 MS. LAVENDER: Ms. Hargis is responsible for 2 getting them in on time. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And they were not? 4 MS. LAVENDER: And it was not -- it was not done on 5 time again. 6 MS. HARGIS: Can I -- 7 MS. LAVENDER: So there were five quarters -- let 8 me finish, please. So five quarters in a row, or five 9 reports in a row have not been done. The first four was the 10 software issue. I don't know how long into that four deals 11 the software issue was corrected, but the fifth one was not 12 done on time, and it was her fault, according to the 13 Governor's office. Okay? We do have an issue. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 15 MS. LAVENDER: When I found out that that one was 16 not done correctly, and then shortly after that, we were put 17 on vendor hold, I talked with AACOG. And the Judge has 18 talked with AACOG too, I believe. And they suggested that we 19 appoint a new financial officer for the grant. I also -- 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And that'll fix that problem 21 of -- 22 MS. LAVENDER: I believe it will, because, you 23 know, the -- the instructions for doing the FSR is on 24 e-Grants; it's on the web. It's a matter of going in, the 25 way I understand it, and logging on, and putting in what your 12-8-08 88 1 expenses have been for that quarter and logging off, and then 2 they send you the money. And you -- she can correct that if 3 I'm not quite right on it. You have an option of doing it 4 monthly, or you have an option of doing it quarterly. We 5 have chosen to do it quarterly. Her decision. Most VOCA 6 grant recipients do it on a monthly basis, because they have 7 to have the funding. In other words, they don't have a -- a 8 cache of money that they can draw from, like Hill Country 9 Crisis Council and Kids Advocacy Place. They do theirs every 10 month because they need that money returned to them every 11 month. 12 But, anyway, I talked with them. I talked with 13 Judge Ables, who is her supervisor, told him what had 14 happened, and he also suggested -- and he said for me to tell 15 you that he supported that we do something about this now, 16 before we get into any more difficulty with this grant and 17 lose the grant. Then early -- well, midway last week, I 18 called the Governor's office and talked with Leslie Holmes, 19 and the -- the big red flag in the deal -- and I don't want 20 to embarrass you, but she said that when the October report 21 didn't go in on time and the memo was sent out, that when -- 22 when Ms. Hargis called her, that she was very rude to her. 23 She said later she e-mailed and apologized, and I don't know 24 the circumstances around any of that. But the impression 25 that we -- we're leaving in Austin is not good. It's not the 12-8-08 89 1 impression I want to be representative of Kerr County. 2 I have nothing -- this is totally out of my 3 control. I have absolutely nothing I, personally, Rosa can 4 do about this, other than ask that the financial officer be 5 changed in this grant. I understand since I sent in this 6 agenda item that she says that the County Treasurer cannot do 7 it because if you receive funds, that you can't do it. So, I 8 guess what we need to do is come to some resolution of what 9 we want to do, and then look for somebody else to do it. I 10 don't think there's anything in the law that says the County 11 Auditor has to be the financial officer. And when I talked 12 to the Governor's office, they didn't seem to think that it 13 was a problem for the Treasurer to do it, but I'll yield to 14 her expertise in that, because I don't have that expertise. 15 But I know that I am very, very frustrated, and I am very 16 concerned. I mean, I get up every morning, come to work and 17 do what I need to do to make this program work, and I'm 18 afraid we're going to lose something here. And it's the 19 image issue that's part of it with me, too. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, my initial reaction 21 to the request was that that's not an appropriate function 22 for the Treasurer. 23 MS. LAVENDER: Okay. Then -- 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The Treasurer is not here 25 to say yes, it is, and the Treasurer didn't put this on the 12-8-08 90 1 agenda, so I have three problems with it. 2 MS. LAVENDER: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I want to hear from 4 Ms. Hargis as well. 5 MS. LAVENDER: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do we need to get you some 7 oxygen? I mean -- 8 MS. LAVENDER: No. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you hyperventilating? 10 MS. LAVENDER: No. No. 11 MS. HARGIS: When I first took over the grant -- 12 first of all, I didn't pick quarterly; my predecessor picked 13 quarterly. The grant had some tremendous software problems 14 that I've been fighting almost on a quarterly basis. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What kind of problems? 16 MS. HARGIS: Well, you fill in the little box -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Software. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh. 19 MS. HARGIS: -- boxes and you send it in. And we 20 fix it on a quarterly basis. And then if you look down, it 21 has a schedule, and on this schedule, it says -- for 22 instance, it'll say 9/30, and it has a date, and it's 23 required by that date. And then for the next month, it may 24 say October, and it says optional, and then it says November, 25 optional. Well, the problem is, it says optional, but if you 12-8-08 91 1 don't go into the grant and say "no report due," they put you 2 on hold. So, every month I have to go in there, whether 3 there's a report due or not, and say "no report due," which 4 is kind of screwy, because they tell you you don't have to do 5 that. The October grant did go in on time. Unfortunately, 6 it was my fault, because one of the little boxes -- there's 7 three boxes that have dates in them, and I put 9/30 in two of 8 them, and 7/31 I didn't pick up in the other one. The report 9 was there on time; I have a date of when the report was 10 issued. I just put the date in the wrong box. I don't 11 remember whether I was rude to the lady or not, but you can 12 understand, after a year of frustration with this software. 13 In September I corrected the grant, and Rosa received an 14 additional $5,000 that she deducted from her salary that she 15 shouldn't have, and I applied for that, which lengthened it 16 out a little bit more. She didn't ask for that; I was the 17 one who discovered that. 18 MS. LAVENDER: I didn't deduct it. 19 MS. HARGIS: And when I issued that, I asked the 20 clerk if I needed to do a final, because we were dealing with 21 whether or not we could do it, and I sent it in; they 22 approved it, and they said no final grant is due. Well, then 23 they send me the hold-back and said the final grant was due. 24 I have paperwork and concise statements of everything that 25 I've done. I'm -- I'm very cognizant of the fact that it has 12-8-08 92 1 to be in on time, and I've done my very best to make sure 2 that I do it as soon as I can do it after the end of the 3 month, and I do a spreadsheet on it. I have all my backup on 4 it. I send the Judge a copy of it when I send it, and that 5 one did get in on time, except it was put -- the date said 6 7/31 instead of 9/30 in one box. 7 So, I apologize for that, but it's not a matter of 8 me not doing it on time; it's a matter of the software 9 situation. It's a totally different type of a deal. You 10 have boxes that will open and boxes that will not open. You 11 don't put the current expenses; you put cumulative expenses. 12 And they have a lot of dates on different boxes, and if you 13 don't happen to open that one up, you might miss that day. 14 I've probably made every mistake that you can make on this 15 one, and I've talked to them about it. But when I was on 16 hold in this last case, I had to take a number because there 17 were so many people on hold that they couldn't possibly deal 18 with everybody. So, I'm not the only one having trouble with 19 the software. I'm not doing this -- I'm -- I'm very precise 20 about what I do. I realize this has been a problem. I do 21 the Juvenile and Adult Probation and I get those in on time. 22 In fact, they're in earlier than they -- than my predecessor 23 -- excuse me -- got them in. So, I know what I'm doing. 24 It's just that there's -- they don't know what they're doing. 25 And Leslie Holmes is a -- followed in under Laura 12-8-08 93 1 Bettencourt, and the turnover in the Governor's office is 2 tremendous. So, one person will tell you one thing, and then 3 another person will tell you another thing, so it's kind of 4 difficult. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: What about the issue of -- from a 6 reporting standpoint, of who is capable or qualified to do 7 the report? 8 MS. HARGIS: Well -- 9 JUDGE TINLEY: As opposed to who is not, and for 10 what reasons? 11 MS. HARGIS: I don't know anything about the 12 qualifications. I would say that the financial officer that 13 does the grant should be the County Auditor, because the way 14 we have the software set up right now, we have everybody 15 locked out of the detail and a lot of the things in the 16 General Ledger so that we don't have a problem with somebody 17 accidentally -- because everyone has access now, since we've 18 done the budget process, to the G.L. Mindy doesn't even have 19 total access to everything. But in an internal control 20 system, whether it be from the state level or any level, you 21 certainly don't want the person who is receiving the money 22 being the same person that's filling out the grant and -- and 23 doing the G.L. I'm not going to stand here and tell you I 24 didn't make mistakes, because I did, but the reports were in 25 on time. I was talking to the Governor's office immediately. 12-8-08 94 1 I think the Judge is aware of this. And -- and as soon as I 2 submitted them, there's a place that turns -- and it says, 3 "Your report has been submitted." I send a copy of that page 4 to both Rosa and to the Judge so that they'll see it. It's 5 the only thing -- 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This Judge or that Judge? 7 MS. HARGIS: This Judge. I haven't talked to Judge 8 Ables about it. I didn't realize that -- that Rosa had. But 9 it seems a little -- you know, in addition to getting her 10 that $5,000, I also got her the $3,000 for this year, so I've 11 gone out of my way to do the best that I can for her. But 12 I'm not -- I'm not perfect, and I have made some mistakes 13 with this particular system, and it's a difficult system. 14 But I don't think there's anything else I can do that I 15 haven't done. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Question. I think it's acknowledged 17 that there were some software problems for -- I guess up to 18 the reporting for this fiscal year, this current one that 19 we're in now. After the resolution of the glitches that 20 we've talked about for this most recent report, are you and 21 the Governor's office that handles this on the same page now? 22 MS. HARGIS: I'm already -- I've already gone in on 23 the 1st day of December and said no report was due for the 24 month of November. And the gentleman that I talked to -- I 25 didn't talk to Leslie Holmes when I did -- when I -- when I 12-8-08 95 1 called them about the fact they said the report was not there 2 on time, and he had to look, 'cause he saw it. He said, "No, 3 the report is here. You just -- you just sent it in as of 4 7/31 instead of 9/30." So, the report was there on time, 5 and -- and he acknowledged that, and he assisted me with 6 that. And he said the problem is that the -- is the 7 quarterly situation. I don't care if we change to monthly. 8 It's -- you know, now I know where all the dates are. He and 9 I went over all of that. And that was the reason for -- that 10 they said that one was not on time, is because I missed one 11 date. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So, on a go-forward basis, 13 you and that office, in the Governor's office where they 14 administer these grants, are on the same page on a go-forward 15 basis? 16 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Hope it's not another smoke 19 screen. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm curious about something 21 that's really not that important to this thing, but I just -- 22 I'm just curious about it. If somebody like Rosa was to come 23 to me and say, "Buster, you're not doing your damn job," I 24 would say, "Well, take this job and shove it. You do it 25 yourself, or go get somebody else to do it." Why are you 12-8-08 96 1 fighting to do this? 2 MS. HARGIS: Because I've spent a year learning it 3 and trying to -- when Tommy was here, he was having the very 4 same problems that I'm having. It was a -- and because I 5 feel like it's my responsibility to make sure that it's 6 right, just like I got her the money back. I want to be sure 7 that I assist these people with getting the very best for any 8 grant or anything that they have. That's my job. I feel 9 like that's my job. And she -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, it ain't working. 11 MS. HARGIS: No. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I can't imagine you're the 13 only person that can do these reports. That, to me, is -- 14 doesn't make sense. Mindy did them for a long time, I think, 15 too. 16 MS. HARGIS: Mindy was in the Auditor's office. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's right, but she knows 18 how to do them. 19 MS. HARGIS: She did not do it on the software 20 program; she did them by hand. I spoke with Mindy this 21 morning. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I have a hard time believing 23 that -- 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Was that a function of the 25 Treasurer's office? 12-8-08 97 1 MS. HARGIS: No, she was actually in the Auditor's 2 office when she performed those, and she did them by hand. 3 The software program did not go into effect, I understand, 4 till about a year and a half ago. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This is the law according to 6 Ms. Hargis, in my opinion. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I think the -- grant 8 accountability is very important. It's critical, and I think 9 one office needs to do it. I don't really care what office 10 that is, whoever it needs to be. But having multiple 11 offices, I think, makes it worse. I think we need to have 12 one office, one individual, whatever, be in charge of all 13 grant compliances. Because -- well, it's just the way it is. 14 We've got to. I mean, we have too many -- the down side is 15 huge on all these grants, and this isn't a real big one. 16 But -- 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We have some big ones. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But we do have some big ones, 19 and we're probably going to have more big ones coming up, 20 and -- you know, hopefully. And I think the -- you know, I 21 think the Auditor's office is probably the right spot to do 22 it. But it's got to be done. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything further to be offered in 25 connection with that agenda item? 12-8-08 98 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And correctly. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well -- 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move to our 11:30 timed item, 5 if we might. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm sorry. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can we hang there just for a 9 minute? 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I feel like we're -- we're 12 leaving this undone, kind of. And I don't know how to do it, 13 other than to ask the County Auditor for some kind of 14 commitment that we're going to do this correctly from this 15 point on, and timely, and those kind of things. I know that 16 she was saying that she wants to do it, but is she going to? 17 JUDGE TINLEY: That was the intent of my question 18 when I asked her if she and those in the Governor's office 19 that are responsible for this grant accounting were on the -- 20 on a go-forward basis, were on the same page, and she said 21 yes. I took that as that commitment, Commissioner. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I did, too. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Maybe -- maybe it -- the answer 25 needs to be a little stronger. Is that what you're 12-8-08 99 1 suggesting? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, no, I'm not suggesting 3 anything. I just -- I just felt like we were a little bit 4 undone. You know, I -- I just wasn't real clear. Are you 5 going to do it? 6 MS. HARGIS: I am going to do it. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right. That's good 8 enough for me right there. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to Item 16, if we 10 might, the 11:30 timed item. It's a bit past that. 11 Consider, discuss, take appropriate action to determine 12 status of right-of-way for Bayless Drive North in Hill 13 Country Ranch Estates. Commissioner Letz? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. This is a -- I put this 15 on the agenda after discussing this with Ms. Rector, who is 16 here, and she can probably explain it a lot more. But as I 17 understand the situation, it's -- there's a right-of-way that 18 goes -- provides her access to her property, Goldie access 19 his to his property, and then two other lots access to their 20 property. It's a county right-of-way with a private road. 21 And the question that I had initially was, I know people 22 can't give us roads without accepting them, and I'm not sure 23 if people can give us right-of-ways without accepting them or 24 not. And I put it on the agenda to kind of get this out in 25 the forefront, because there's some issues with the property 12-8-08 100 1 owners. We need to find out if this is a county issue, a 2 county problem, or if this is a civil, private issue, in a 3 nutshell. And the -- the problems, I think, are not really 4 relevant; it's just whether this is a county issue or not. 5 And I told Ms. Rector we'd put it on the agenda, and I talked 6 with Rex about it briefly last week, and kind of -- see what 7 he has to think. 8 MR. EMERSON: My understanding is Ms. Rector's 9 currently researching that issue. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, want to pass at this time? 11 Until we determine whose -- 12 MR. EMERSON: I think you need to talk to Paula. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If it's not a county 14 right-of-way, we have no authority. 15 MS. RECTOR: Right. Good morning. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Good morning, Ms. Rector. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: No, we are not doing aerobics. 18 MS. RECTOR: What we wanted to determine was if the 19 right-of-way was actually accepted by the County. This plat 20 goes back to, I think, 1964, when that subdivision came into 21 being. Our county road -- well, our road on the very outside 22 of that subdivision was never developed. All the other roads 23 within that subdivision are under county maintenance except 24 for ours. We maintain that road, and it's just a little tiny 25 dirt road that comes down to our place, goes beyond us, down 12-8-08 101 1 to Goldens' place, and then goes into a ranch at the end. 2 There's one lot in that ranch that's within the subdivision. 3 What I also would like to determine as to whether that part 4 of the easement from his locked gate through his lot that's 5 within the subdivision to the next lot, 'cause there's a 6 locked gate there, if that part of the road was ever 7 abandoned, the county easement was ever abandoned. And I did 8 not find any record of it. I did go to the County Clerk's 9 office a couple of weeks ago. We found where the Judge was 10 ordered to write a letter to the property owners at that time 11 about the locked gate, because it is through that easement. 12 I never did find anything. And I need to do some further 13 research with Cheryl in the County Clerk's office and see if 14 she can come up with something that talks about the 15 abandonment of that easement through there. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The other little bit of the 17 question is, if you -- this is kind of to Rex, to make sure 18 I'm thinking kind of somewhat correctly. If the -- the 19 right-of-way is clearly on the plat of Hill Country Ranch 20 Estates. By us accepting and approving that plat at some 21 point in the past, does that action make it a, one, county 22 right-of-way, and two, or -- and/or a public right-of-way? 23 MR. EMERSON: Does not make it a county 24 right-of-way, necessarily. Now, the fact that it's on the 25 plat -- I mean, it's hard to say without seeing the plat. 12-8-08 102 1 But -- 2 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm looking at the plat. 3 MR. EMERSON: -- it specifically says it does -- 4 and does hereby dedicate to the public for public use forever 5 all roads shown hereon, except as indicated otherwise. So -- 6 JUDGE TINLEY: They're dedicated to the public, the 7 roads. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Including her road. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All roads shown hereon. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: '64, I can imagine that that 11 probably meant that was supposed to be a county road. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: This was in May of 1970, it looks 13 like, that this section was platted. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, the -- you know, what 15 about the issue of -- Rex, what about the issue of these old 16 plats that came along, and I think this developer was known 17 to do this kind of thing, of dedicating right-of-way to the 18 County, and so they come along years later and start selling 19 that land and say, "Look, here on the plat it says this -- 20 this road is dedicated to the county." But the County never 21 accepted it. You can dedicate all day long. 22 MR. EMERSON: There's a long line of court cases 23 that says if the County doesn't accept it, it's not the 24 County's responsibility to maintain. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: To me, that's kind of where 12-8-08 103 1 we are. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: But there's still -- public still 3 has rights in it by virtue of the dedication, right? 4 MR. EMERSON: Still a public right-of-way, just not 5 subject to county maintenance. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 8 MS. RECTOR: So, in that case, would the easement 9 -- the 60-foot easement still be legitimate? I mean, -- 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Public. 11 MS. RECTOR: -- there's still a 60-foot easement. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's open to the public. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, who's the jerk that's 14 got his gate over our easement? 15 MS. RECTOR: I'm not naming names. Name's on the 16 plat. There's a gate here; there's a gate here. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh. 18 MS. RECTOR: Through this easement. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that Carrol Golden? 20 MS. RECTOR: Well, no. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Better not be. 22 MS. RECTOR: This is Goldie's place. There's a 23 gate here going into this -- 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 25 MS. RECTOR: He owns this one lot. The rest is 12-8-08 104 1 acreage, and then he owns this lot. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, got it. 3 MS. RECTOR: You got it right there, yeah. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It goes back to whether -- I 5 mean, there's no record that anyone knows about of this 6 being -- the County accepting this. Therefore, it's probably 7 not our problem. Sorry, Ms. Rector. 8 MS. RECTOR: Okay. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well -- 10 JUDGE TINLEY: It's not a problem if somebody wants 11 to abandon it. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. To completely get it 13 out of the County's business, we'd have to abandon it. 14 MS. RECTOR: Right. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Abandon and vacate. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Tell us, Paula -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How do we abandon a public 18 right-of-way that we don't have a right to? That we don't 19 have an ownership? 20 MS. RECTOR: Abandon the easement? What's the 21 difference between a right-of-way and an easement? 22 MR. EMERSON: Essentially the same for the purposes 23 of this. 24 MS. RECTOR: Okay. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Paula, when you talked to 12-8-08 105 1 us about it, you indicated that everybody has access to their 2 property. 3 MS. RECTOR: Yes. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: On this plat that we're 5 looking at, Lot 25, which has been identified as Babb, I 6 guess? Is that -- 7 MS. RECTOR: Yes. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How does that individual 9 have access to the property? 10 MS. RECTOR: He uses our road, or Bayless Drive. 11 We call it our road. We maintain the road; it's our road. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 13 MR. GOLDEN: And the gate going into it is on our 14 property. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: On your property? 16 MS. RECTOR: Mm-hmm. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Uh-huh. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So what we can do, then, Judge, 20 I guess, to follow up on your -- the same as you did this 21 morning, little bit different. We go through an abandonment 22 process for a subdivision, or revision of plat, either way. 23 So, you can do it. And revise the plat and get that out of 24 being a public right-of-way. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Where does the property 12-8-08 106 1 lines go to if you do that? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Ms. Rector's -- well -- 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Property lines are -- they're 4 outside. 5 MS. RECTOR: We own across the road. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 7 MS. RECTOR: To the other side. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You too, Goldie? 9 MR. GOLDEN: Yes. 10 MS. RECTOR: Yes, he does. 11 MR. GOLDEN: Commissioner Letz, do you remember 12 when the flood was, what year that was? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Which flood? 14 MR. GOLDEN: The 4 to 5 inches. 2002? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, 2002. And -- yeah, that 16 was -- '97 and 2002 were the two most recent. 17 MR. GOLDEN: Yeah, 4 to 5 inches. Our bridge 18 washed out. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 20 MR. GOLDEN: Mr. Babb did not help us at all to put 21 the bridge back in. He did pay a little money, but he did no 22 labor at all. We were landlocked because of his gate. He 23 has two -- three different ways into his property besides the 24 place that we're talking about. 25 MS. RECTOR: So he doesn't have a problem getting 12-8-08 107 1 in and out, except we were cut off and they were cut off, 2 because the bridge is right before you go into our place. 3 Washed the bridge completely out. 4 MR. EMERSON: Based on the limited facts, if 5 there's a public right-of-way and it's locked, and that 6 easement or that right-of-way has not been abandoned, then 7 you got a potential obstruction of a public right-of-way. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Open it up, yeah. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Road and Bridge bulldozers 10 need to be out there this afternoon. 11 MR. GOLDEN: I agree. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Not to improve the road, but to 13 knock down the gate. 14 MR. GOLDEN: You got that right. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Most of my neighbors just drive 17 through them when that happens. 18 MS. RECTOR: I think what -- the whole thing that 19 prompted this issue is that we put a water storage tank to 20 our well, and it was in the easement. We have since then 21 moved that tank, but now he is also, in the letter from his 22 attorney, asking that we move the fences. It's just the 23 Goldens, it's us, and it's him at the end of the road. We 24 really can't afford to start moving fences just because he 25 wants the fences moved. 12-8-08 108 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I wouldn't know why you would 2 have to move a fence, or have a fence, period. But, 3 anyways -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is he this fine citizen that 5 has the gate across the public -- 6 MS. RECTOR: Yes -- yeah. But we don't know that 7 easement was ever abandoned. We didn't find any record of it 8 at the time that I was in the County Clerk's office. We did 9 find the record of the letters that the Judge wrote to the 10 landowners at that time about the locked gate, and that was 11 all that the Commissioners Court minutes said, was to write a 12 letter concerning the locked gate. Never found anything 13 after that that abandoned the easement. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Was it to remove the gate? 15 MS. RECTOR: Well, I don't know. It just said 16 concerning the locked gate. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 18 MS. RECTOR: Through a public easement. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I would think that means 20 move it. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Correct me if I'm wrong, but 22 it looks like there are gates at each one of those property 23 lines, and that it's not linked with a fence. Doesn't have a 24 fence on both sides -- 25 MS. RECTOR: No, hmm-mm. 12-8-08 109 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- of that easement. 2 MS. RECTOR: Right, not along that easement. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, just fenced on the 4 property line, but the roadway is inside of the property. 5 And you have gates at each one of the -- one of the tracts; 6 is that correct? Or not? 7 MS. RECTOR: Now, say that again? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 9 MR. GOLDEN: Paula doesn't have any gates. 10 MS. RECTOR: We don't have a gate. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Y'all come in from here. You 12 come in over here, all the way around -- 13 MS. RECTOR: We come through here, then the road -- 14 we've got a little road that comes up here, which we do have 15 a gate right here on our property. Then it goes around and 16 goes to Goldens, goes around. There's a gate right here. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay, that's what I'm saying. 18 So, every one of these, wherever there's a property line -- 19 MS. RECTOR: There's no gate. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There is no gate? 21 MS. RECTOR: No. The only gate is right here. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: None of this is fenced? 23 MS. RECTOR: All of our -- no. Goldie's -- are you 24 fenced all the way? 25 MR. GOLDEN: No. 12-8-08 110 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You're not fenced all the 2 way, so none -- and what -- 3 MS. RECTOR: There is a hill right here. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 5 MS. RECTOR: And we tried to contact these people. 6 They were trying to buy. We fenced our property because we 7 eventually want to put animals there. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, if this is not fenced, 9 why are there gates there, I guess is my question. 10 MS. RECTOR: Well, his -- going into his place, 11 this is his ranch back here. He's got 200-something acres 12 back here. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 14 MS. RECTOR: So he -- and he owns over on this side 15 to a certain point. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 17 MS. RECTOR: So, he leases some of this land for 18 grazing cattle, and he's got some cows on this property here. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: And, Paula, you're in the process of 21 doing some more research on this? 22 MS. RECTOR: Yeah. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: As to whether or not there's been an 24 abandonment of any portion of the roadways shown? 25 MS. RECTOR: I just want to make sure that whatever 12-8-08 111 1 I find, that Rex looks at to make sure that we're all on the 2 same page, 'cause I don't want to pursue this unless -- and 3 then somebody say, "You're all wet, you can't do that." 4 So -- 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So, until you get all your 6 research done and -- and clear with him, you're not asking 7 this Court to do anything? 8 MS. RECTOR: No. I -- this was the beginning to 9 get the ball rolling, was to get it on the agenda to 10 determine the status of the road. And then -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 12 MS. RECTOR: -- wherever we need to take it from 13 there is where we'll take it. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: I think this plat says what the 15 status of that road is. 16 MS. RECTOR: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And it says that it's a 18 public -- public right-of-way, or public whatever. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, dedicated for the public. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now what are you going to 21 do? What are you going to ask us to do now? 22 MS. RECTOR: Depending on whether Mr. Babb backs 23 off on asking us to move everything out of the easement -- 24 'cause we've got it fenced, and yes, the fence is in the 25 easement. But we've moved the tank, which is what prompted 12-8-08 112 1 this whole thing. And if he'll back off on that, then -- 2 then we can all live happily ever after and use the little 3 dirt road that we maintain. I have no intentions of putting 4 gates up anywhere to keep anybody from ingress and egress to 5 their property. That was not the point. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So we're just going to shove 7 it up under the carpet and go on with life? 8 MS. RECTOR: I would not mind seeing that easement 9 abandoned. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Huh? 11 MS. RECTOR: I would not mind seeing that easement 12 abandoned. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think that's the answer 14 I'm looking for. 15 MS. RECTOR: So we can maintain the road ourselves. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. And then he can put 17 his gates wherever he wants to. 18 MS. RECTOR: Well, yeah. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So you can -- 20 MS. RECTOR: Which he already has through his 21 property. 22 MR. GOLDEN: One thing, though. That land-locks us 23 if we lose the bridge again. 24 MS. RECTOR: Mm-hmm. 25 MR. GOLDEN: If he can put his gates wherever he 12-8-08 113 1 wants. 2 MS. RECTOR: Well, but he's got them locked. It's 3 not -- 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He's not letting you through 5 there. 6 MR. GOLDEN: Yeah. We were hung there for a while. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, enough. Okay. You'll report 8 back to us? 9 MS. RECTOR: I'll report back to you. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: All right, thank you. 11 MR. GOLDEN: If I could bring up one other thing, 12 Harry Reeh has the cattle on Babb's place, and he says that 13 every time he goes out there, and he goes -- he told my wife 14 just about every time he goes out there, the gate codes have 15 changed. 16 MS. GOLDEN: He says he changes them about every 17 three months; he's paranoid or something. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Maybe he wants to keep Harry 19 out of his property. 20 MS. RECTOR: Those are Harry's cows. 21 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, thank you. 23 MS. RECTOR: Okay. Thank you. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move on to Section 5 of the 25 agenda. Do we have any reports from Commissioners in 12-8-08 114 1 connection with liaison or other assignments? Four? 2 (Commissioner Oehler shook his head negatively.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: One? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Two? 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, sir. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Three? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Any reports from elected officials 10 or department heads? 11 MR. EMERSON: I've already put an agenda item on 12 for next Commissioners Court, but we seem to have an issue 13 with elected officials' bonds making it through for payment. 14 I submitted the invoice for my bond several weeks ago. I 15 received a final notice yesterday. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So did I. 17 MR. EMERSON: They're stalled out across the hall 18 for some reason, and the bonds won't be submitted until the 19 invoice is paid. So, I personally would like to be 20 re-elected January 1st, so it's on the agenda for next 21 Commissioners Court. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I got a notice too. 23 MR. EMERSON: Just giving you a heads-up. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't think the problem's 25 over here, to be honest. I think the problem's with the 12-8-08 115 1 bonding people that -- well, I won't say that. But I wasn't 2 very nice to them the other day either. 3 MR. EMERSON: All I know is that my invoice has not 4 been submitted -- or was submitted; has not been paid. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That will leave one person. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Hyde? 8 MS. HYDE: Just real quick. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. 10 MS. HYDE: If it has to be on the next agenda, then 11 we'll put it on the agenda, but we talked during the break 12 about the H.R. capital loan budget. There's approximately 13 $15,000 to $25,000, and we give that freely to the -- 14 transfer towards the video conferences that Rex requests. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: But still an I.T. -- 16 MS. HYDE: Within the -- yeah, within the I.T. for 17 him. And then the second one is just to let y'all know, the 18 Auditor requested that H.R. take over the vehicle insurance 19 through TAC, so I got the file two weeks ago. We deleted 14 20 folks and added 18, and it is now current for our vehicle 21 insurance. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Drivers, you're talking about? 23 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 25 MS. HYDE: Legitimate drivers. 12-8-08 116 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Everybody was cleared? 2 MS. HYDE: Everyone has cleared. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Temporarily. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any other reports from 6 elected officials? Department heads? You're afraid we're 7 going to ask you for money if you stand up. Right, Sheriff? 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You're right. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. And we will. 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You won't get it. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, we'll be adjourned. 12 (Commissioners Court was adjourned at 12:05 p.m.) 13 - - - - - - - - - - 14 STATE OF TEXAS | 15 COUNTY OF KERR | 16 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 17 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 18 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 19 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 20 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 11th day of December, 21 2008. 22 23 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 24 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 25 Certified Shorthand Reporter 12-8-08