1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Regular Session 10 Monday, April 13, 2009 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X April 13, 2009 2 PAGE 3 --- Commissioners' Comments 6 4 1.1 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve Sunrise Lions Club, a 501(c)(4) 5 organization, being added to the nonprofit list to receive reduced rate at Hill Country 6 Youth Exhibit Center (HCYEC) 13 7 1.4 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to extend current bank depository contract with 8 Security State Bank for an additional two years per Local Government Code, Chapter 116 15 9 1.2 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 10 certification increases for two animal control officers using a budget amendment 17 11 1.3 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 12 allow musicians (Southland) to use gazebo on the courthouse grounds 21 13 1.7 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action 14 regarding utilization of existing space at Kerr County 4-H Livestock Project Center barn 28 15 1.5 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 16 request from 216th Community Supervision and Corrections Department to use area located at 17 old stall barn located on the HCYEC grounds 33 18 1.6 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to waive all OSSF permitting fees for new Mountain 19 Home Volunteer Fire Department 46 20 1.8 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to drop the name Schumann Rd. and change name of 21 road to KC 476 NW, Precinct 4 47 22 1.9 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to review and approve cattle guard policy 49 23 1.10 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 24 approve John Hewitt as Floodplain Administrator 55 25 3 1 I N D E X April 13, 2009 2 PAGE 3 1.11 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to review and approve floodplain letter to be sent 4 to property owners that may be affected by the new proposed DFIRM maps 63 5 1.14 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 6 Kerrville South Wastewater Project, Phase 5, and unresolved easement and/or related issues 66 7 1.15 Consider/discuss status report on planning 8 activities taking place for Center Point/Eastern Kerr County Wastewater Project as part of the 9 TWDB Planning Grant 75 10 1.16 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve filing an application with USDA/RUS for 11 funding the transmission line portion of Center Point/Eastern Kerr County Wastewater project 77 12 1.12 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 13 approve contract with Hill Country Telephone for Internet service at West Kerr Annex 82 14 1.13 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 15 proclaim April 26 - May 3, 2009 "Soil and Water Stewardship Week" 83 16 1.17 Presentation by Mr. David Mendez with Bickerstaff, 17 Heath, Delgado, Acosta, LLP, regarding 2010 census 84 18 1.18 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve contract with Diana Twiss 99 19 1.19 Consider/discuss, approve resolution for the 20 submission of a grant proposal to the Meadows Foundation for funding of Phase 1 of renovations 21 to Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center as proposed in 2008 Hill Country Youth Exhibit Master Plan 104 22 1.20 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to set 23 date to evaluate employees of Commissioners' Court 113 24 1.21 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action in support of Former Texas Ranger Foundation vision 25 of the Ranger History and Education Center to be located in Kerrville, Texas 116 4 1 I N D E X April 13, 2009 2 PAGE 3 1.22 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on resolution regarding applying for funding under 4 U.S. Department of Justice Recovery Act Assistance to Rural Law Enforcement to Crime and Drugs to 5 purchase AFIS tracker for electronic fingerprint machinew.R. Hierholzer) 117 6 4.1 Pay Bills 120 7 4.2 Budget Amendments 126 4.3 Late Bills --- 8 4.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 127 9 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee Assignments 128 10 5.2 Reports from Elected Officials/Department Heads --- 11 --- Adjourned 132 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 5 1 On Monday, April 13, 2009, at 9:00 a.m., a regular 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. 8 Let me call to order this regularly scheduled meeting of the 9 Kerr County Commissioners Court posted and scheduled for 10 today's date, Monday, April the 13th, 2009, at 9 a.m. It is 11 that time now. Commissioner Williams? 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Will you please rise and 13 join me in prayer, followed by the pledge of allegiance? 14 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. At this time, if there's 16 any member of the public or the audience that wishes to be 17 heard on any matter that is not a listed agenda item, this is 18 your opportunity to tell us what's on your mind. If you wish 19 to be heard on an agenda item, we would ask that you fill out 20 a participation form. There should be some located at the 21 back of the room. It's not essential, but it helps me to 22 insure that I don't miss you when we get to that item. If 23 you've not filled out a participation form for a particular 24 agenda item and wish to be heard on that item, when we get to 25 it, get my attention in some fashion and I'll see that you do 4-13-09 6 1 have that opportunity. But right now, if there's any member 2 of the public or the audience that wishes to be heard on any 3 matter that is not a listed agenda item, feel free to come 4 forward at this time and tell us what's on your mind. Seeing 5 no one coming forward, we will move on. Commissioner 6 Williams, what do you have for us this morning? 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm ready to go to work, 8 Judge. Nothing. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Letz? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Two things. One, I think I 11 might have mentioned it last time, and I want to bring it up 12 again; we have a good crowd today. Obviously, most of you 13 have noticed the courthouse square has new grass throughout. 14 It is growing; looks real good, and I again want to, one, 15 thank the Maintenance Department for doing the work, but even 16 more than that, make everyone aware of the savings to the 17 County by doing this entire project in-house. The -- we 18 originally talked about going out and hiring some companies 19 to do that, and we got some preliminary numbers, and the cost 20 to go out there and regrade, resod, kill the old stuff, tear 21 it out, rake it and all that stuff, redo the sprinkler 22 system, was in the neighborhood of $100,000. We spent 23 out-of-pocket dollars, $16,000 plus the labor of our in-house 24 staff, and using the trustees from the jail and community 25 service and those sorts. So, it just shows that, you know, 4-13-09 7 1 we can -- the savings was huge. The product is basically, I 2 think, the same end result, and I just want to -- again, hats 3 off to the Maintenance Department for a job well done, and 4 savings to the County. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Looks good, too. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second item, I spent a good bit 7 of last week, it seems, in Austin on some legislation that 8 we've been working on. The good news is that the -- the 9 bill, House Bill 3165, which modifies county authority a 10 little bit, passed out of the committee into the full House 11 of Representatives. First time a bill has -- like this has 12 come out of committee probably in -- well, since the 12 years 13 I've been a Commissioner. The bad news is that Kerr County 14 was taken out of the bill at the last minute, during a 15 substitute amendment that Representative Rose did at the 16 hearing, and he did that because Representative Hilderbran 17 had not signed onto the bill at that point. I've talked with 18 Harvey at length about it, and his staff, and we're meeting 19 again this week. And we're getting closer, we believe, to 20 having a comfort zone where he's willing to sign on with this 21 bill, and Representative Rose is aware of that as well. So, 22 anyway, I think it's a -- eventually, we'll get there. The 23 problem comes in on a -- well, I'm not going to go into what 24 Representative Hilderbran's problems are, but there's -- the 25 issues are, it gives counties a little bit of authority to, 4-13-09 8 1 in certain situations, assess impact fees on developers. On 2 roads where there's a large impact to a small county road by 3 a new development, it requires the developer to help pay part 4 of that cost to upgrade a county road. The other provision 5 gives counties a little bit of flexibility on density or lot 6 sizes, so we don't have to strictly use the water 7 availability, which is our only authority right now. We can 8 look at other factors. And then the other issue is to go in 9 and let counties have authority to set buffer areas or 10 setbacks on noncompatible land use, and this comes in areas 11 such as -- I guess it can be if a rock quarry or motorcross 12 track wants to come in next to your ranch or next to a 13 subdivision -- it's commercial use of properties, 14 primarily -- we can require a setback. We had one recently 15 out in Bill's area, I believe, mini storage units going right 16 next to a subdivision with zero lot line, basically. It was 17 basically mini storage units right next to the fence line of 18 a nice -- very nice homes. And what it -- it's not going -- 19 it doesn't prevent anything; it just as allows a little bit 20 of a buffer between them. Hopefully those will go through. 21 We're working with the Senate right now to try to get this 22 through the Senate, and then on from there. That's it. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Commissioner Oehler? 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I just have one thing, 25 and I was made aware last week that, you know, we've been 4-13-09 9 1 having our problems with the City as far as who has 2 jurisdiction in the ETJ, and I think that a couple of y'all 3 have been working on that. And one thing that did happen on 4 Goat Creek Cutoff a couple years ago was that they did 5 approve a subdivision of substandard lot size, and now they 6 can't get septics on it without designating some area for -- 7 for wastewater. And the lots were too small. I told the 8 developer at the time that they were too small, and let's 9 don't do that any more. Well, the City approved it. And 10 there's not enough room for setbacks now to have septics on 11 those lots, with new houses sitting on them. So, that's 12 going to have to be resolved by Environmental Health over the 13 next month or so or longer, but that's a prime example of 14 what could happen, just like Jonathan is saying about the 15 storage buildings going next to a really nice housing 16 development. And, I warned the developer; I said, "There's 17 not room for septics." He went ahead and did it anyway, so 18 now they have to deal with it. It's in the ETJ of Kerrville. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's it. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Baldwin? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir, I do have a couple 23 of things here. I wanted to talk about on the week of May 24 19th, our -- our Collections office is going to be shut down, 25 I don't think all week, but the big part of it, and they have 4-13-09 10 1 coordinated with the courts to do that exactly that. They're 2 going to their annual conference where they pick up their 3 education, and I wanted to also announce that Terry, which is 4 the department head there, is one of the presenters at their 5 annual conference in Galveston. So, we have another member 6 of our county family that's going out and representing us and 7 speaking at these big conventions, and very proud of her for 8 being able to do that. 9 On May the 1st at 10 a.m., that's a Friday -- May 10 the 1st, I think, is a Friday -- in this courtroom, we're 11 going to have a -- a workshop, Commissioners Court workshop, 12 and Jana McCowan -- she's the first assistant D.A. in 13 Williamson County, and she's the one that understands the 14 direct filing program as far as the jail and all of that; you 15 remember we talked about it. She's the one that knows more 16 than anyone on earth about that, and she's coming here at 17 10 o'clock on May the 1st to make a presentation to all of 18 us, and all of the other -- you know, the D.A.'s and the 19 District Judges and all those people that are involved in 20 that thing. And if you remember, the primary reason that 21 we're going through all of this, and going -- jumping through 22 these hoops and going over these hurdles is that we're trying 23 to reduce the number of inmates in the Kerr County jail, as 24 opposed to spending a large amount of taxpayers' money to 25 build a new one. So, everyone in our county system is 4-13-09 11 1 bending over backwards and trying to dot all the I's to 2 get -- get this issue done. Actually, they're doing a pretty 3 darn good job of it out there already. The District Judges 4 are going out there and the D.A.'s are going out there and 5 handling that pretty well. But this lady's going to talk 6 about this new program. So, hope you can all attend. I know 7 Mark Cowden's planning on being here. 8 On May the 14th, which is a Thursday, we're going 9 to have dinner on the grounds. We want to invite the entire 10 community to bring your little sack lunch, and if you're not 11 old and stove up like I am, bring you a blanket and sit down 12 on the ground, have a little picnic out on the front lawn. 13 We're going to have some music, live music -- well, I think 14 it's live. I'm the youngest one of the bunch, so, you know, 15 I don't know if -- not sure about those other guys. But 16 we're going to have some entertainment, and just -- it's just 17 a dinner on the grounds for the community to get together and 18 have fun. And we're going to talk a little bit more about 19 this Court and a special invitation to the City Council, and 20 some of them already know about that and -- and are not just 21 in agreement, but are excited about coming over and being our 22 guests during -- during this function. And I wanted to amend 23 Commissioner Williams' prayer. He left out -- you know, he 24 thanked God for lots of things, but I wanted to add to it 25 thank God for Navy SEALS that know how to shoot rifles off of 4-13-09 12 1 a boat. (Laughter.) I think that's pretty dadgum cool. I 2 like that stuff. Yeah, that was cool. That's the way to end 3 that little deal. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You know about that, Ray? 5 MR. GARCIA: Yes, sir. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I know you do. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If you'd accept my 8 amendment, we'll ask -- we'll just kind of privately ask God 9 to say thanks -- thank you, God, for that. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that it? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. I too want to thank our 13 maintenance people and the community service and jail people, 14 trustees that -- B.J. and his boys, as it were, Bobby 15 Johnson, for all the work they did here outside here on our 16 grounds. I've had a lot of good comments about it from a 17 number of citizens. And one of the things that I noticed 18 yesterday was there were a group of children, supervised by 19 some adults, having an Easter egg hunt out here on the 20 courthouse lawn yesterday. It was really, really fun to 21 watch. And this is your courthouse, your grounds, and we 22 invite you to enjoy it. Let's get on with our business. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, can I add one thing 24 real quick? 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Surely. 4-13-09 13 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The public may not have 2 noticed, but it should be noticed, in talking about the 3 courthouse grounds, that we've moved a lot of markers, 4 historical markers. The historical marker that came in from 5 Guadalupe Heights talking about the Kerr County -- formation 6 of Kerr County and the age and so forth is now the 7 centerpiece as you come in the entrance. And some markers 8 that belong out at Camp Verde are being -- have been moved or 9 are in the process of being moved to Camp Verde where they 10 belong. All of which is to say to the Court and the public 11 that Joe Luther, who is the chairman of the Historical 12 Commission, has a very serious heart issue, and we want to 13 keep him in our prayers as he goes under further medical 14 evaluation. Thank you, Judge. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. It's not quite 9:15, so 16 we'll take Item 1 first; consider, discuss, and take 17 appropriate action to approve the Sunrise Lion's Club, a 18 501(c)(4) organization, being added to the nonprofit list to 19 receive a reduced rate at the Hill Country Youth Exhibit 20 Center. Is Mr. Bunch here? 21 MR. WALKER: No, but I am. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All right, Mr. Walker. If you'll 23 come forward, give use your name and address for the record, 24 and tell us what's on your mind here. 25 MR. WALKER: If I can be a substitute. Mike 4-13-09 14 1 Walker, 1303 Vesper, Kerrville. I'm the current president of 2 the Sunrise Lions Club. Lion Katie Lackey is back there, our 3 second vice president, and the -- the report that you were 4 given about the activities of Sunrise Lions is -- was -- I 5 apologize, was submitted to you just most recently, but it 6 gives -- the front two sheets, the loose sheets there, give a 7 breakdown of what our contributions are. Now, if you have 8 any tough questions about it, I'm going to turn it back to 9 our past president, Steve Hamilton, who's here, and he's 10 going to answer those questions for you. But I do want to -- 11 I know you're aware of the things that we do, the flags that 12 we put out for all the U.S. and Texas holidays and 13 commemorations, and then also, the Toys for Hill Country 14 Tots, which we -- we didn't steal that from the Marines. 15 They still own it nationwide, but we do it here locally, so 16 that our presents can stay with the kids locally. And then 17 also, of course, the wild game dinner, which is what we're 18 presenting to you right now. And I know you're all familiar 19 with that, 'cause I think I've seen you all out there. So, 20 if you have any questions about that? We are a (c)(4), 21 simply because I.R.S. says that's what our kind of 22 organizations are supposed to be. And we have no paid 23 employees. We do a little bit of reimbursement for our 24 folks, but everything else that we raise, all that money goes 25 back into the community, and you can see in the magnitude 4-13-09 15 1 there, $47,000 is our annual budget, goes back all into the 2 community. So, if you have any questions, I'll bring Steve 3 up. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Any questions for Mr. Walker? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make kind of a comment. 6 To my mind, this meets the criteria that we're looking at. 7 The criteria that we've been looking at as we've been talking 8 about this is that the -- the organization gives back to the 9 community, not just back to the organization itself. This 10 certainly does -- your group certainly does give to the 11 community. I'll make a motion to approve. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 14 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion on the 15 motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 16 right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Thank you. 21 Appreciate you being here. Let's go to Item 4, which is a 22 9:15 timed item; consider, discuss, and take appropriate 23 action to extend current bank depository contract with 24 Security State Bank for an additional two years per Local 25 Government Code, Chapter 116. Ms. Williams? 4-13-09 16 1 MS. WILLIAMS: Good morning. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning. 3 MS. WILLIAMS: Okay. I think y'all all have the 4 backup. Our current contract expires on May 31st of this 5 year. I've had the County Attorney look at the current 6 contract, and there is in that section that we can go out for 7 a two-year extension, and I'm requesting that the Court go 8 ahead and approve us to do that. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's your recommendation? 10 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move for approval. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 14 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 15 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Thank you. 20 MS. WILLIAMS: Thank you. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I'd like to add that 22 not only the bank does a good job for the county itself, but 23 talking about them giving back to the community, and these 24 organizations that give back to the community, I don't go 25 anywhere to blow my nose without somebody from that bank 4-13-09 17 1 being there. (Laughter.) Involved in absolutely everything 2 that happens. I mean, they're parking cars and -- no, you 3 can't run our lunch on the grounds. (Laughter.) I see those 4 wheels turning. You're not going to take that thing over. 5 No, it's ours. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I might add that Mark 7 Cowden is the newest member of the Airport Board, and he's 8 doing a fine job, and that board is doing a fine job. We 9 thank you for your service, Mark. 10 MR. COWDEN: Thank you. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Appreciate it, Mark. 12 MR. COWDEN: Thank you. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I thank you. Let's move to Item 2, 14 to consider, discuss, and take appropriate action on 15 certification increases for two Animal Control officers by 16 use of a budget amendment. Is Ms. Roman here? There she is, 17 okay. 18 MS. WHITT: It's actually Whitt now. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Say, "I am standing up." 20 MS. WHITT: Pardon me? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: She has a new name. 22 MS. WHITT: Yeah, it's actually Whitt now. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We need to get a little 25 stool for her and Rusty. 4-13-09 18 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Apple crate. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Little apple crate. 3 MS. WHITT: I have two -- two Animal Control 4 officers that were certified, Oscar Hinojosa and Andy 5 Scherwitz, and I'm asking for a budget amendment to give them 6 their -- their increases for their certification, pay 7 increases. Do you have -- do you want to do this? 8 MS. HYDE: I'll do this for you. They're currently 9 14 -- Oscar -- don't laugh. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm not laughing. You need 11 to speak up, though, so we can hear you. 12 MS. HYDE: Hinojosa is a 14-2. Current pay at step 13 and grade is 27,012 even. If he gets his educational 14 increase, which he should, that takes him to a 14-3, which is 15 27,687.84. Impact to the budget is $340 through the end of 16 the year. For -- excuse me -- Scherwitz, he's currently a 17 15-1. It would take him to a 15-2, from a 27,687.84 to a 18 28,380.72, an additional $350 needed. In addition, we want 19 to insure that both of them are under Grade 15. So, Hinojosa 20 is a 14-3; he can go to a 15-1 with no impact, but then our 21 A.C.O.'s are 15's, versus an office worker at a 14 and a 22 kennel worker at a 13. So, total impact would be 700 -- 23 right at $700, and then she can tell where you she wants to 24 move it from. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Essentially, what you're asking for 4-13-09 19 1 is that, because of an educational advancement, that each of 2 these employees receive a one-step increase -- the equivalent 3 of a one-step increase pursuant to the policy adopted by this 4 Court in 1999 for longevity and educational? 5 MS. WHITT: Correct. And that would be coming out 6 of my vehicle gas -- that $700 would be coming out of my 7 vehicle maintenance. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: You're going to absorb that within 9 your own budget? 10 MS. WHITT: Yes, sir. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I feel sure we talked about 12 this at budget time. The same thing applies to the Sheriff's 13 Office. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Different levels of 16 certification, they get -- they get a pay increase because of 17 that certification. And I don't know how it got left out. 18 MS. WHITT: I was pretty sure that we had -- 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: But it was left out. So, I 20 move approval. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 23 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I had a question. I like 25 the education thing. I like it a lot. I couldn't remember 4-13-09 20 1 that we had branched out from the Sheriff's Office, but I'm 2 glad we did. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Does that -- did we branch 5 out and include everybody, though? As an example, like, if 6 somebody in Maintenance gets a -- gets a certificate for 7 whatever -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's -- I think we did it based 9 on -- we did branch out. Road and Bridge has it. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Road and Bridge, yeah. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If it's a license -- a license 12 that enables you to do more in your job, you get an 13 educational bump, like if you have a C.D.L. 14 MS. WHITT: I did it with two other employees last 15 year in my department. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That would come under that. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good. I'm happy about it. 19 That's good. That's how we save money. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Any certification that 21 improves your performance or your ability to do more in your 22 job. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, they have more 24 certified people now to do it, and spread the job where they 25 can do it with -- it doesn't just have to be one person that 4-13-09 21 1 -- yeah. Then they can -- more people can go ahead and do 2 it. Response times are better. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Odom, I think there's a program 4 with your people called Roads Scholars -- 5 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: -- that's been in effect for a 7 while? 8 MR. ODOM: Right, sir. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: And that's a certification issued by 10 a professional organization that -- that your people deal 11 with that certifies certain degrees of proficiency, and we've 12 utilized that '99 educational policy to provide the incentive 13 to your people too, have we not? 14 MR. ODOM: You have, sir. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and second. 17 Further question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, 18 signify by raising your right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 23 to Item 3; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 24 allow musicians, pren Southland, to use the gazebo on the 25 courthouse grounds. Commissioner Oehler? 4-13-09 22 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Dave West called me prior to 2 posting -- posting the agenda to discuss this item. It seems 3 that he has a group of musicians that would like to get 4 together on Sunday afternoons and have a little free musical 5 entertainment for whoever wants to show up, and so I told him 6 I'd put it on the agenda. He can come down and tell us about 7 it. Mr. West, do you want to take over? 8 MR. WEST: Good morning. My name's Dave West. My 9 cohort, Jim Myers, is with me this morning. We're 10 representing Southland Acoustic Players. I'll be real brief 11 -- quick for you. We're a group of about 24 local acoustic 12 musicians from the Kerrville area. We play traditional 13 music, what's come to be known possibly as roots music, and 14 what we're doing here this morning is requesting access to 15 the gazebo which you've erected on the grounds for periodic 16 performances, and to be determined at some future time. And 17 what we're asking this morning is for that access and some -- 18 some instruction on how we can go about scheduling if you so 19 approve. Is there any questions? I'd be glad to answer. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is this one time only, or 21 on an ongoing basis? 22 MR. WEST: Ongoing basis. We would have to get 23 with our people and determine what dates work best for 24 everybody involved and you guys, and -- and then submit a 25 schedule to you. But hopefully it would be on a 4-13-09 23 1 quasi-regular basis. We've talked just roughly among 2 ourselves about once a month, but not specifically about what 3 date and time. There are some other times other than -- 4 than, say, a Sunday afternoon that would make a lot of sense 5 for the community. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The only thing I can think 8 of is the Saturday -- you know, the Market Days. There's an 9 old car show and things like that you have to coordinate 10 with, but I don't know of anything on Sundays. Do you, 11 Judge? 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, not in particular. Now, 13 Market Days, I think, is -- they've got some multiple days 14 that they're going to be doing, I know over Memorial Day. 15 Certainly, if -- if the Court approves, I'd want it 16 understood it's on a nonexclusive basis. 17 MR. WEST: Oh, sure. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Which, you know, if we're going to 19 permit you guys to come, if another musical group wants to 20 come at some other time -- 21 MR. WEST: Let me add that there's no fees or 22 charges attached to this. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: I understand. 24 MR. WEST: Okay. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: And, certainly, we -- if some other 4-13-09 24 1 group were to want do the same thing, but want to charge some 2 sort of an admission fee, I don't think we'd look too kindly 3 on that, because this is the public's property and they're 4 entitled to enjoy it. And we -- we do appreciate your offer, 5 though. But there's not that much going on on Sunday that 6 I'm aware of, other than just every once in a while, I think 7 it would be a welcome draw to people to come enjoy the 8 courthouse. 9 MR. WEST: Another event that we had considered is 10 a lunchtime event, say a Wednesday at lunch, 12:00 to 1:00, 11 would be, I think, a real benefit to the community. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: He's now trying to cut in on your 13 deal. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: He's trying to cut into my 15 deal. No. We like Sunday, a lot. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But even on Market Days, if 17 you're using the gazebo -- 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's true. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- for -- just for the 20 entertainment where your musicians set up, that complements 21 Markets Days. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I would think it would 23 complement it a lot. I'm going to talk to them about doing 24 that in conjunction with Market Days. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, Market Days 4-13-09 25 1 occasionally has musicians. They have weird-looking guitar 2 things going on out there, and have y'all seen those things 3 they call sticks? They're pretty -- that's pretty 4 interesting. 5 MR. MYERS: Scary-looking things. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Pretty interesting 7 things that y'all don't do, I know. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: I know that Ms. Anderson and 9 Ms. Kane have been very, very good about working with other 10 groups that want to have a joint use of courthouse grounds on 11 Market Days. They've always been cooperative, working with 12 them and coming to some arrangement to make that happen. It 13 just requires a little prior communication and coordination, 14 and we can make that happen. But -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Speaking of that, Judge, do 16 you think it would be wise, as kind of a courtesy call, for 17 them to call Jody and say, "Hey, we're going to do Sunday, 18 October the 10th," or whatever? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: You're at the next step. I think 20 that probably that's where the -- where the communication and 21 coordination needs to be initially, to make sure there's not 22 some other group that's decided to get into a competition 23 with them, maybe. Which would be healthy, I think. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. An oompah band. 25 Oompah band and native whatever you called it. Cool. 4-13-09 26 1 MR. MYERS: If I could just add something, 2 Southwind has been around about three-plus years, and it's 3 just folks that have come together that play dulcimers 4 primarily, but we do have some other folks, like Dave plays 5 guitar. We have another fellow that plays mandolin, 6 recorders and so forth. So, it's all acoustics, but 7 Southwind has kind of migrated off where they do these kind 8 of venues at nursing homes. We've been to the V.A. Hospital; 9 we have played at the Kerrville city employees' breakfast 10 around Christmastime, so we've done a number of these things. 11 We got another gig lined up to play at Western Art Museum on 12 Saturday, so it's sort of falling in line with the things 13 that we generally do. And I guess I'm fond of saying, being 14 one of the so-called leaders of this group, that we don't 15 have any dues, we don't have any rules, we don't have any 16 funny hats, we don't have any secret handshakes or anything. 17 (Laughter.) But it's just a group -- it's just a bunch of 18 folks that come together that love to play this instrument, 19 and we like to share it with folks. So, you know, any time 20 that we could use it, and if it's not competing with, you 21 know, somebody else's venue. And, certainly, we're not going 22 to compete with a rock band, because you would never hear us. 23 And we would like to make it fun and just invite people to 24 come and have some fun with it. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sounds good. 4-13-09 27 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me -- let me give -- do 2 you know how many acoustic musicians it takes to screw in a 3 light bulb? 4 AUDIENCE: Uh-oh. 5 MR. MYERS: That sounds like a loaded question. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is. Let me answer it so 7 it doesn't embarrass you. It takes three acoustic musicians 8 to screw in a light bulb; one to screw the light bulb in, and 9 two to stand there and raise hell because there's 10 electricity. (Laughter.) 11 MR. MYERS: Exactly. I get it. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do we need a court order? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't know if we need to 14 approve this. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Y'all have fun. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Appreciate you coming, letting 17 us know what you want to do. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: You know how to get ahold of 19 Ms. Grinstead? 20 MR. WEST: I assume Ms. Grinstead is the person to 21 contact? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. 23 MR. WEST: Great. Thank you. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: And I -- you know, I welcome you to 25 get with Ms. Anderson with Market Days. What you have might 4-13-09 28 1 be a real complementary thing for both of you. It might 2 really be -- increase your available audience and increase 3 their participation down here. 4 MR. WEST: I think you're right. 5 MR. MYERS: We'll do that, and thank you again for 6 your time. Come out and listen to us sometime. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We will. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to our 9:30 timed item, if 10 we might; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action 11 regarding utilization of existing space at the Kerr County 12 4-H Livestock Project Center barn. Mr. Walston? 13 MR. WALSTON: Yes, sir. Good morning. I brought 14 some maps just where I can kind of explain what we're talking 15 about. Want to send that around? I'll give you a little bit 16 of an update on where we are on our project barn. We have -- 17 we're in the process -- we've been approved for a grant from 18 the Cailloux Center that will complete the barn. We'll get 19 it enclosed. As far as the swine pens, they're completed -- 20 in construction; I'd say 99 percent complete, anyway. We've 21 got the panels for the lamb and goat pens. We've got some 22 dirt work to do to finish that up, and then we can put the 23 lamb and goat pens in. So, pretty much we're moving along 24 quite rapidly, or a little faster than we have been. And now 25 we're in the process of getting this completion on the 4-13-09 29 1 Cailloux money and getting that enclosed, hopefully by the 2 middle of May. And when we got into working on enclosing 3 that, we were trying to figure out what to do on the -- on 4 the -- I guess, actually, that -- that right wall; I guess 5 it's the -- kind of the south wall there that is -- will 6 divide us from Maintenance and youth fair and the rest of the 7 facilities that are there. There's an area there that I 8 marked with an "X" that currently Maintenance -- and not 9 knowing what you're doing on the -- on the -- I guess on the 10 east side of it there -- or west side of it, if -- if it was 11 available, if we could use that for a feeding facility or 12 feeding pens and storage -- not pens, but feeding storage for 13 lockers, I'm looking for -- I'm needing an area to lock up 14 medications, scales, arms, vaccinations, things such as that, 15 that I can lock up. We're also needing storage for our 16 office. Currently, we have our office -- we have some things 17 that we use for our wild game dinner, as well as for the 18 Christmas party, for the Any Baby Can Christmas parties and 19 large objects, you know, that we -- we use once or twice a 20 year. It's being stored in what used to -- the youth fair 21 was using. It's a portable building out there, the little 22 gray portable building. We're using it. It has been very 23 helpful, but I'm projecting that that building may want to be 24 moved at some time, and so we're looking at maybe needing a 25 place for some office storage as well as for our projects and 4-13-09 30 1 -- yes, sir? 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The area that you are -- you want us 3 to put under consideration is -- 4 MR. WALSTON: Yes, sir. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: -- the area you've marked with an 6 "X"? 7 MR. WALSTON: Yes, sir. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: And your proposal would be to 9 enclose that? 10 MR. WALSTON: It would be to include that as part 11 of the feeding barn, and put -- it would be enclosed with a 12 rollup door and a walk-through door. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 14 MR. WALSTON: And Tim has a rollup door on the 15 other side of it. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: That's my concern. There -- you'd 17 be closing up around a rollup door that was just recently 18 installed. 19 THE WITNESS: We'd both have a rollup door to where 20 we could go completely through it. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, but that -- you would 22 be able to -- you'd encumber that whole same space, and I'm 23 not for that. I thought in your original plan, Roy, that you 24 had a place on the -- on the far west side in a corner for 25 storage in your original plan. And the plan seems to have 4-13-09 31 1 changed, and include more hog pens -- 2 THE WITNESS: Actually -- 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- than you originally 4 proposed. 5 MR. WALSTON: There's -- in this drawing, there's 6 21 pens instead of 23. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, you still have space 8 available? 9 MR. WALSTON: Yes, sir, there's space there. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That could be used for what 11 you're wanting to do? 12 MR. WALSTON: Yes, sir. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You could actually have two 14 spaces if we give you part of -- and that depends on what's 15 on the agenda later to do to deal with Probation. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 17 MR. WALSTON: And I admit that that's -- I probably 18 -- we don't need that much space. But my thoughts were that 19 we could go in and -- and put a drop ceiling of some sort to 20 where we could use some storage on top for some -- just to 21 have a place to put things that we need to get to once a 22 year, when we do have the events that require -- currently, 23 right now, like I say, the only storage our office has is the 24 garage and that small portable building that -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's -- this is more to Bruce 4-13-09 32 1 or Tim. Who's using -- is this for the Fair Association? 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This is what we left out. 3 Not the -- not the long triangle. That's what we left 4 concrete out of for future restrooms and concession stand. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The one that says Youth 6 Fair? Where is the Kerr County Fair? 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They're over here where it 8 says Youth Fair. That's Kerr County Fair. 9 MR. WALSTON: I'm sorry. Yeah. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Are you talking about the part up on 11 the big -- the long portion? 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The long portion. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Just above maintenance? 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes, sir. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: On the northeast side. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's not been cemented. We 17 didn't know what we were going to do, and didn't have the 18 money to put all the plumbing and everything that has to go 19 with that, so we left that unconcreted. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What about that little square 21 next to the Kerr County Fair, that in the middle? 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I think I want to talk 23 about that as far as my part of it goes to do with Adult 24 Probation community service. Because right now, they have -- 25 we can't talk about it now; Rex will get on me. (Laughter.) 4-13-09 33 1 JUDGE TINLEY: But we'll talk about it in a little 2 bit. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think we need to talk about 4 both of them at the same time, actually. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I do too. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That would be better. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They both have -- are going 8 to have an impact on what we decide to do. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, let me call agenda Item Number 10 5; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action on request 11 from the 216th Community Supervision and Correction 12 Department using area located at the old stall barn located 13 on the grounds of Kerr County Exhibition Center. Okay, we 14 got both of you here now. Now we can talk about the whole 15 enchilada here. 16 MR. WALSTON: Just don't ask to get in an arm 17 wrestling match. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I've been hoping 19 that -- I think when we started this plan originally, that 20 there were -- we really wanted community service to have a 21 permanent structure for storage for them. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So we could get rid of some 24 of those buildings and things out back and clean that area 25 up. 4-13-09 34 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Right. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think that that area that 4 Roy's talking about -- and he's left a spot there, you know, 5 for -- for community service, but what his proposal was is to 6 take over that whole area there that blocks Tim's door, which 7 I'm not -- I'm not for that at all. I think we got to have a 8 compromise there somewhere. We need to find out how much 9 space community service needs to store their stuff in, and 10 then go from there. 'Cause there's still space that can be 11 allocated for another storage for the 4-H project stuff, but 12 I don't think, you know, it was the intent for them to take 13 over the majority of this building in the beginning. And 14 that they were supposed -- what I remember was there was a 15 storage room that's now -- the space for that is being 16 encumbered with hog pens. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I was just going to ask, is 18 there not space for the feed and things he wants to do where 19 he's identified all these 23 hog pens? 20 MR. WALSTON: We can either put it there in the 21 area that I can -- what I really -- the part that I have to 22 have is a place that we can lock up, similar to what Tim has 23 in the maintenance building, a 10 or 20 foot by 10 foot, 200 24 square foot area. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 4-13-09 35 1 MR. WALSTON: That we can lock up, just for things 2 that we've got to keep under lock and key. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Wouldn't you be better 4 served for moving feed in and out by having an end location 5 down at one of those -- the end of those hog pens? 6 MR. WALSTON: That can even be put in the center. 7 I mean, it can be a portable area, something that I planned 8 on, to where I can slide or move it around, you know. And I 9 guess one of the things was, if we're not able to use that 10 area that's marked with an "X," we'd put it just outside of 11 it in the center. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That sounds like a good idea. 13 MR. WALSTON: And -- 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which, Bruce? 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: For him to move -- 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Where, down here? 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Move it out from the "X" back 18 to the left. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: On the alleyway. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: On the alleyway. That way he 22 could back in all the way to take -- put feed in and stuff? 23 Coming in from the west. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That'd be fine. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And not block that west 4-13-09 36 1 entrance. I think that was one of the things that he wanted 2 to do. I don't -- but, Clete, how much do you need for -- 3 how big an area do you need for what you have to store? 4 MR. BUCKALEW: Clete Buckalew, director of the 5 216th Adult Probation Department. Commissioner, on your -- 6 I'm sure they have the same design. It's that -- that area 7 that's directly in front of the youth -- the Youth -- 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Fair Association. 9 MR. BUCKALEW: -- Fair Association and below, I 10 guess, the area that Mr. Walston's talking about, that's 11 about a 750 square foot area that we measured out, and I'm 12 just respectfully requesting consideration for that. And 13 we'll do our best to finish it out and be able to store the 14 community service equipment and implements and get out of 15 those -- those portable storage buildings over there. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That would be nice. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Have one entrance that goes 18 on the outside? 19 MR. BUCKALEW: Yes, sir, one entrance would be from 20 the outside. Yes, sir. And depending on what was done with 21 the -- that other area, may put a -- a rollup door there, 22 some type of entrance. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You could work that out with 24 Tim. On the maintenance, you could add another rollup there 25 or a walk-through. 4-13-09 37 1 MR. BUCKALEW: Yes, sir. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Probably a rollup. 3 MR. BOLLIER: Rollup be better. 4 MR. BUCKALEW: I pretty much do whatever Tim tells 5 me. (Laughter.) 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You're in trouble. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, that was my understanding, 8 that the probation services -- the area immediately to the 9 northwest of the youth fair area, and they come from the 10 outside, and the -- the remaining area there where you've got 11 the fenced-in area, that could be left, and larger pieces of 12 equipment could be secured in there, could it not? 13 MR. BUCKALEW: Yes, sir. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It'd sure clean the area up 16 if we can get those portable buildings out of there and use 17 it for, like you say, larger equipment and things like that. 18 And I think, you know, at some point he's going to want to 19 take over that other -- the area for exercise and stuff too, 20 in his program, which I don't have any problem with that. 21 But that's not what's on the agenda today. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On the area that we haven't 23 paved yet, what's your timetable, do you think, on doing 24 something with that space? Or -- 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Which? 4-13-09 38 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The area that doesn't have any 2 -- the bathroom type area. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I guess as soon as we decide 4 we're going to do something and get the money to, but -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 'Cause that's a big area. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It is. But that also gives 7 you a place to put tables and stuff for people to sit in the 8 shade, in case you've got, you know, a function going on. It 9 is a big area. It's like -- what is that, Tim? Like, 30 10 by -- 11 MR. BOLLIER: 75. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- 75? 13 MR. BOLLIER: Something like that, 76. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: By the the time you put 15 restrooms in there and you put concessions, there's not going 16 to be a lot of left over space. Probably what we really 17 should think about doing is taking it and -- and taking in 18 that other little area right there. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's kind of what I was 20 thinking of. If you went straight across and made that, 21 you'd give a lot more space for -- 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- whoever. I mean, Roy or 24 216th. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Only thing is, though, if you 4-13-09 39 1 block that off, that also blocks Tim's access in, if you wall 2 all that up. I mean, that's the pro and con to it. So, -- 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mm-hmm. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- depends on what we want to 5 do, but that might be a really good spot for some restrooms. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Be an ideal spot. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Be accessed -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: From lots of different areas. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- by all different areas. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's a good reason to leave 11 that center area open. 12 MR. BOLLIER: If you leave the center area open, 13 that little area back there would be too -- that I call -- I 14 call that more or less the south -- southwest corner back 15 there. That's only 30 -- that would be somewhere around 30 16 by 50-foot area, square area. That's the same size as the 17 shop and the Fair Association. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mm-hmm. I think -- I think 19 if you pull your storage out into that alleyway, and then if 20 you could take over -- you said there's not 23 pens, there's 21 only 21? 22 MR. WALSTON: There's 21. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 21, and so you still have 24 space going east at the end of that. 25 MR. WALSTON: Yes, sir. 4-13-09 40 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Where you have hog pens now. 2 MR. WALSTON: I'd intended on putting a wash rack 3 in there on that end. Rather than using it for pens, using 4 it for a wash rack. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: On the east side? 6 MR. WALSTON: Yes, sir. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 8 MR. WALSTON: And -- 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Seems to make sense to take 10 over a small portion of that alleyway area for what you're 11 wanting to do, and then everything stays kind of the way it 12 should, in my opinion. 13 MR. WALSTON: The question I guess I would have is, 14 as far as being able to secure this -- these pens, we're in 15 the process of trying to wall that in. Do we need to -- what 16 kind of access do we need to leave to that? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Where? Say that again? 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't think we need any 19 access to that. 20 MR. WALSTON: Okay. So, just completely enclose 21 it? 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Access point is over here on 23 the west side to get to whatever you're going to do. And if 24 you're going to fence that off and lock it up, you -- I heard 25 something about you were planning to fence some of that area 4-13-09 41 1 around -- 2 MR. WALSTON: Yes, sir. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- with a security fence to 4 keep people out. Needs to be done, because you hear about 5 these other places that have break-ins and animals get killed 6 or stolen or whatever. You know, that's not right. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Dogs. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Dogs can get in. 9 MR. WALSTON: So it would be completely enclosed -- 10 I mean completely walled off. It wouldn't -- at some point, 11 if we were going to have access to some restrooms back there, 12 we could put a walk-through door in there. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh, sure. That wouldn't be 14 hard at all, as long as we leave that space open there for 15 Tim, where Tim can access that rollup door. That'll always 16 be open, except for -- if you wall all that off, I think -- 17 is your intention to come all the way from one side of that 18 building to the other? 19 MR. WALSTON: Yeah. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We could put a rollup door in 21 there, and whenever you build it, you can put one that gives 22 you access whenever you need it to be locked or open. 23 MR. WALSTON: But do we need to put that rollup 24 door in now, or wait till later? 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I would think you'd do it 4-13-09 42 1 now. Much easier when you're building a wall. 2 MR. WALSTON: So, that's -- 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That gives you a way out of 4 there, too. Otherwise, you're go to have to jump a fence. 5 MR. WALSTON: Well, if -- the access is going to be 6 through the front. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Right. 8 MR. WALSTON: The entrance. And other than -- 9 there will be a gate coming through the fence on the -- on 10 that east side. There will be a -- where they can load out 11 swine on that side. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Sure. And, you know, you can 13 also back in that way to unload feed if you put a rollup door 14 in the back of that thing, come in either way. Both ways, 15 you're in the dry. 16 MR. WALSTON: Mm-hmm. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And -- 'cause we don't plan, 18 as far as I'm concerned, of encumbering that area there in 19 front of Tim's shop. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, I think we stay open. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just needs to stay open. 22 MR. WALSTON: Okay. Would there be any 23 possibility, like I say, if we were able to leave it open and 24 put a -- a storage up on top to where we could store some 25 things? 4-13-09 43 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That might work. We have 2 plenty of room up top. 3 MR. BOLLIER: Yeah. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You could take and put a 5 floor in there, extend it up and floor it, and that wouldn't 6 interfere with anything to do with Tim. That still gives you 7 a lot of storage. I got no problem with that. 8 MR. WALSTON: Wouldn't interfere with your access 9 in and out to your rollup door. 10 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. Long as it -- 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Long as you get above the 12 door. 13 MR. BOLLIER: Get above the door, like Roy said. 14 There's a lot of room up there on top. There's another 7 15 foot up there. 16 MR. WALSTON: Oh, yeah. 17 MR. BOLLIER: Six or 7 feet. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't have any problem with 19 that at all. That -- 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Where would you put your 21 stairs? Just use ladders, or do you put stairs? Ladders? 22 How do you get up there? 23 MR. WALSTON: Well we had a -- I started to say we 24 could put it in our arena area, but that would block off that 25 rollup door, if we had a rollup door going in there. So, 4-13-09 44 1 otherwise, you'd have to move over -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mm-hmm. Have to plan an 3 access, like a lift, which would -- if you -- if it's for 4 pens periodically, it would be easier if we had -- 5 MR. WALSTON: I think if we just had an access door 6 on our side, we can get up there. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 8 MR. WALSTON: Whether it be a ladder or -- 9 MR. BOLLIER: Could order one of those -- those 10 roll -- those portable ladders like Ms. Linda's got upstairs. 11 You can get them any size. You can get a portable ladder to 12 roll in there quick, just like what's back there by the 13 Maintenance door right now. You can just get a little taller 14 one. You can roll that in and out of the way. 15 MR. WALSTON: It's not something we're going to be 16 using a whole lot. 17 MR. BOLLIER: Be cheaper than trying to build one, 18 too. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Why don't you work up a plan, Roy, 20 that incorporates these things that -- and achieves these 21 objectives, and bring it back to us, and we'll take another 22 look at it. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That also includes 216th 24 space? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 216th space is pretty much -- 4-13-09 45 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that's -- 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Their space, as far as I'm 3 concerned, is -- 4 JUDGE TINLEY: That's a done deal. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They just need to close it 7 in, put a door in it, but fix it up. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Doesn't that sound like a 10 deal? 11 MR. BUCKALEW: Yes, sir. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Works for you, huh? 13 MR. BUCKALEW: Yes, sir, works for me. 14 MR. WALSTON: I guess what I'm asking -- 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Either that or arm wrestling, right? 16 MR. WALSTON: It will be one of y'all; it won't be 17 me. (Laughter.) But as far as enclosing that wall, that I 18 can go ahead and enclose it and put a door in it. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That would allow for that -- 20 for an opening up top so you can floor that in above -- 21 MR. WALSTON: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- Tim's door where you have 23 access from your side. You don't want anybody else having 24 access to it. 25 MR. WALSTON: No. 4-13-09 46 1 THE WITNESS: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Why don't you work it up? We'll 4 take a look at it, okay? 5 MR. WALSTON: Okay, thank you. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Do we need anything else on either 7 of those two agenda items, gentlemen? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On 5, I think we need approval 9 for 216th to proceed. I make a motion that we designate the 10 section next to the Fair Association to the 216th Community 11 Service Supervision. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 14 indicated. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 15 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 20 Item 6, if we might. Consider, discuss, and take appropriate 21 action to waive all O.S.S.F. permitting fees for the new 22 Mountain Home Volunteer Fire Department. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mountain Home got -- has 24 gotten a grant. It's a two-phase grant. Both of them 25 together will pay for a new fire station, and they're going 4-13-09 47 1 to have to put in septic, and so I don't see any reason why 2 we ought to have the fire department paying the fees and 3 stuff to Environmental Health to put in septic whenever 4 they're serving the public and it's on county property. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I move that we waive the 7 fees. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and a second for 9 approval of the agenda item. Need to take some of that large 10 sum of money we get from them to pay our septic fees, huh? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Makes a lot of sense. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Sure does. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Some things do make sense. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, this is one. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Believe it or not. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This is one. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Question or discussion on that 18 motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 19 right hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 24 to Item 8; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 25 drop the name Schumann Road and change the name of the road 4-13-09 48 1 to KC 476 Northwest, and located in Precinct 4. 2 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. 911 -- the Schumanns, as well 3 as 911, has contacted -- we've talked to them. What we have 4 is a road called KC 476 off 290. We have to go through that 5 to get to about a mile and a half, 2 miles of road that we 6 maintain back there. The Schumanns had contacted 911 to see 7 if there could be continuity of the name. We call it, or 8 have since I've been here, Schumann Road, but we could not 9 find any data that supported that. Neither could 911. The 10 Schumanns were concerned about an emergency that went out, 11 because the Highway Department on 290 has the signs that says 12 KC 476. When you get a couple miles back, you hit our county 13 line, and they're afraid it's going to be confusing. So, we 14 ask the Court to give permission to change this name from 15 Schumann to KC 476. We have done that in relation to Evans 16 Road down there, with Bandera also. And the Schumanns and 17 all feel that this would be safer, as well as everyone is 18 listed in the Windstream book as KC 476, so we don't see that 19 there would be a problem. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not sure if that makes it 21 Kerr County or Kimble County. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Can be either one. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I move approval. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 4-13-09 49 1 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion on the 2 motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 3 right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 8 to Item 9; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 9 review and approve cattle guard policy. 10 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. I'm sure y'all are tired of 11 seeing that memo before you. We've sent it several times for 12 comments, but we have reviewed and reworded the cattle guard 13 policy and I feel that we have a policy that would work for 14 the citizens of Kerr County. At this time, we ask you for 15 your approval of the cattle guard policy. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think, for the benefit of 17 some folks who are here who have asked questions about this 18 before, Mr. Odom, it might bear a little bit of explanation, 19 okay? 20 MR. ODOM: All right. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The Court's heard it, but 22 there are folks in the audience that perhaps would like to 23 hear it. 24 MR. ODOM: What questions do you have for me? 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just explain it, please. 4-13-09 50 1 MR. ODOM: All right. Cattle guards shall be 2 removed during scheduled maintenance of roads when the 3 following circumstances prevail: Both sides of the road are 4 no longer owned by one family and/or the third-degree of 5 consanguinity or affinity does not apply to both sides, 6 and/or both sides of the road are fenced. We have with this 7 court order will be that chart that distinguishes the kinship 8 chart, whether it's by marriage or by blood. That means that 9 one side may be open; the other side may belong to a relative 10 in that degree of kinship, and therefore it would be like one 11 person owning the whole strip there. In most cases, the 12 family was -- would have that. And it hasn't been fenced -- 13 ever been fenced, so therefore it just makes sense not to do 14 that. A traffic count occurs at or near the cattle guard 15 more than three times on a road with a cattle guard in a 16 five-year period. So, we have -- I think that's reasonable. 17 If a cattle guard is the factor or added because of having to 18 yield or runoff, we think, in a five-year period, that's 19 reasonable. The cattle guard should come out. When the 20 traffic count on a road meets the level of a collector 21 road -- what we have by our Subdivision Rules is if it 22 exceeds 801 cars a day, it is no longer rural. Therefore, 23 the cattle guard should be removed. Also, that before we 24 would do anything, we would come to the Court, present our 25 case to the Court why we think it is that way, and let the 4-13-09 51 1 Court make a decision. And then, we would go out for 2 notification at six months, and if the people disagree, then 3 by all means, that they would have the right to come to the 4 Court and to present their case to the Court whether or not 5 we should remove it or not. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Leonard, I don't have a problem 7 with leaving it the way it is. The only one that I have a 8 little bit of heartburn with, but it's going to come to the 9 Court anyway, but it's on the traffic count one. Because I 10 think that there's -- I can see situations where -- well, 11 farm-to-market roads are a good example; there's many 12 farm-to-market roads around the state that have cattle 13 guards. So, you know -- but, you know, that's one that I 14 just, long term, down the road, may have a little bit of 15 problem with taking away cattle guards there. 16 MR. ODOM: Are you saying that if cars get to 801 17 cars a day, that you have -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's possible. You have to 19 look at the situation. I can't really think of a county road 20 that may get that traffic count. 21 MR. ODOM: Well, y'all would make that decision. 22 We would present it at that point. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But it's going to come to the 24 Court on the first one. To me, it's obvious. If there's no 25 need for a cattle guard, if it's fenced, -- 4-13-09 52 1 MR. ODOM: Yeah. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- why have a cattle guard? 3 Second one, if it becomes a true safety hazard because of 4 wrecks, that makes sense. And the third one, I think, needs 5 to -- we need look at it, but that's not as guaranteed, in my 6 mind. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: There's a bill pending in the 8 Legislature now dealing with cattle guards and -- and removal 9 and so forth. I think it only has to do with notification 10 issues, if I'm not mistaken. Have you -- of course, where it 11 is now and where it ends up, if anywhere, are two different 12 things, by the time the Legislature gets through. The 13 notification that you give would be as required by existing 14 law at that time, correct? 15 MR. ODOM: Correct. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Maybe we ought to modify to 18 it say that, Judge, where we talk about the six months 19 notification, or as -- or as state law requires, because 20 state law could change. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, provide notice of an intent to 22 remove in accordance with existing laws. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: There you go. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You may have two-story cattle 25 guards if the Legislature has anything to do with it. 4-13-09 53 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Never know. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Does this resolve the 3 battle of Wilson Creek, Commissioner? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think so. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you joking? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There's fences and -- it 7 qualifies twice. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Incidentally, the gentleman 10 asked me if we're going to fix the cattle guards the other 11 day, make it a little bit smoother. I said, "Yeah, they're 12 going to be smoother; they're coming out." He didn't respond 13 any further. 14 MR. ODOM: To -- and may I say -- I don't want to 15 take too much time on this, but, you know, the reason we 16 didn't use the criteria for the collector is that you start 17 to get the number of lots, and when you have these vast 18 areas, I don't know -- you know, 801, do you go to an 19 arterial? You're pushing the limit of everything we got. 20 And a collector is a -- like a -- is like a farm-to-market 21 road almost. But if we went to the number of lots that could 22 be used, you know, maybe in some of these areas -- these 23 large ranches, then you would -- you would look at the master 24 plan, and automatically, almost everything becomes -- becomes 25 that. 4-13-09 54 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What I'm talking about, I think 2 you have to start looking at right-of-way, some of these 3 issues, the roads and the terrain. Farm-to-markets have 4 90-foot, 100-foot right-of-way. 5 THE WITNESS: 80 to 120 feet. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that's a lot different 7 than -- 8 MR. ODOM: 30 feet. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- 30 feet. And so I think you 10 have to look at other criteria, but it's just one -- to me, 11 that's one criteria. You have to look at other 12 considerations, more so than the other two. 13 MR. ODOM: I have no -- like I say, we will come to 14 the Court and y'all will make criteria stipulations. I mean, 15 we will or will not. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move approval of the cattle 17 guard policy as modified. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 20 approval of the agenda item as amended here in open court. 21 Question or discussion on that motion? All in favor of the 22 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 4-13-09 55 1 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 2 to Item 10; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 3 approve John Hewitt as Floodplain Administrator. 4 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. We came to you before to 5 discuss the option of hiring John to take over the position 6 of Floodplain Administrator. We've discussed with John about 7 this position and come up with a plan of how we would be able 8 to make this position work with the citizens of Kerr County. 9 John Hewitt is a licensed C.F.M. and also a P.E., which makes 10 him very qualified for this position. He was Kerr County's 11 Floodplain Administrator when I was out on medical leave. 12 Enclosed you will find our proposal for this position. We 13 ask to make some fee changes to offset this position. We 14 gave that to you for your observation and for comments. But 15 above all, what we're here for is to ask the Court to approve 16 John Hewitt as Kerr County's Floodplain Administrator. With 17 this, tomorrow I am going to attend a seminar similar to what 18 we had. Rachel is giving that at the L.C.R.A. building there 19 in Austin tomorrow, and it has to do with -- with floodplain, 20 but it has some questions that we were talking about, and so 21 I want to hear that tomorrow. I wish it had been before we 22 had this, but we wanted to go ahead and present this to the 23 Court, and that I can have maybe some answers to some 24 questions we had as far as floodplain, and how the state 25 resolves some of their issues. 4-13-09 56 1 JUDGE TINLEY: The issue as to modification of 2 fees, that's just given to us for informational purposes at 3 this time in view of the agenda item, is it not? 4 MR. ODOM: That is right, sir. And we have talked 5 to T.W. -- Texas Water Development Board, and they're saying 6 that you can't do it yet. FEMA is telling us that we can do 7 it, and we're going to have a -- a collage of speakers 8 tomorrow that I can listen to both sides. FEMA says we can 9 make it more stringent than what we have. We're told by 10 T.W. -- Texas Water Development Board that no one does that. 11 We know of five to six entities that do that. That's between 12 counties and cities that have this ability to say, "Don't 13 develop in the floodway." I wish I had it. Commissioner 14 Williams asked me to get it if I could. But if you'd have 15 seen the presentation we saw of Bolivar Island, you would 16 understand we're not in a V zone; we're in the floodway. 17 That is the same situation. People building in the main 18 force of the water is just not logical. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Doesn't make any sense. 20 MR. ODOM: It doesn't make sense, when you can come 21 back out of that main force of the water. Not saying you 22 can't build in the floodplain, but in the floodway, I think 23 there should be no development in the flood -- in the 24 floodway for the safety of the people. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, that's a policy issue also. 4-13-09 57 1 MR. ODOM: This is a policy issue. That's my 2 opinion. But presenting what I'm finding, there's other 3 people starting to do this and it's picking up momentum. 4 Tomorrow we'll hear a little bit more, and I believe that you 5 can logically do this. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Leonard, in the absence of 7 changing fees, where's the money going to come from for Mr. 8 Hewitt? 9 MR. ODOM: Fees, right now. And I will have some 10 for either contract or engineering, look at the new year. 11 The reason we've adjusted the fees, we feel like this is 12 closer to the cost associated with it, particularly in the 13 floodway. When you start having no-rise certificates and 14 all, there's a whole lot more to it. And we think that this 15 would be closer -- these people that are building in the 16 floodplain are causing this issue; therefore, they should pay 17 for it. I think that's only fair, not the taxpayers. And 18 should we miss it, we will review this as we go along, and in 19 next year's budget we can adjust it one way or another, 20 either down or up if there's more to it. But we feel like 21 this will be pretty close in taking care of -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, the current fees will pay 23 for Mr. Hewitt? 24 MR. ODOM: The current fees? I don't think they 25 will, no. 4-13-09 58 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That's something we're going to need 2 to address in the future, then, fairly quickly. 3 MR. ODOM: Yes, fairly quickly. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This alters your job 5 description, does it not? 6 MR. ODOM: No, sir it doesn't. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How not? 8 MR. ODOM: Well, I'm not getting compensated 9 whatsoever for this, sir. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But you're doing the work. 11 MR. ODOM: I have been doing the work. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So it alters your job 13 description. 14 MR. ODOM: Well, if you're talking about pay, I can 15 tell you right now, there's no pay to this. That's been a 16 whole lot of heartache and -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's don't go there. Let's 18 don't go there. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Get way too emotional. Do 21 you have -- you have a county vehicle in your department that 22 he uses? 23 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. He will have one to use, yes, 24 sir. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: From your department? 4-13-09 59 1 MR. ODOM: From my department. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I just hope the fees that 4 we -- you know, this Option 1, those should pretty well cover 5 the cost of what -- 6 MR. ODOM: We think so. We've looked at -- 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- what his fees would be. 8 MR. ODOM: Right, on Option 1. We've looked at the 9 internet and looked at other people; Kelly has looked that 10 up. There are a lot of people that are doing this, and like 11 I say, I think this covers most -- most situations. At $55, 12 you take your time there, and then you may have to go out. 13 We feel like this 110 will be able to do -- cover that. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Leonard, if we adopt 15 this -- and I'm not opposed to it, don't misunderstand me -- 16 we are, in effect, adopting this Option 1 new fee schedule, 17 correct? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think we can. 20 MR. ODOM: No. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Not with the agenda item as it's 22 styled. 23 MR. ODOM: Basically, I'm asking John to be 24 Floodplain Manager. And this was for your review. That's 25 the way I put this before. I did not expect y'all to make 4-13-09 60 1 this command decision right off the bat; have some time to 2 contemplate it. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the -- it is kind of -- 4 a little bit of -- two things. One, I want more discussion 5 on these fees, because I think they look pretty high to me, 6 potentially. But that's another discussion; it's not on the 7 agenda yet. On the other part of it, I want it real clear 8 that this is, in my mind, a short-term solution. I think 9 sometime in the next year or so, we need to look at the 10 organization in your department. I don't -- I'm not in favor 11 of contracting this out full -- long-term. You agreed to 12 take it at one point, and there was no compensation, I agree. 13 But I think that the -- the County has changed, and your 14 position or your job has changed, and subdivisions have 15 grown, roads have gotten more. We've combined a lot of 16 things into one position in your office under you, and I 17 think that we need to relook at that at some point. 18 MR. ODOM: That's fine, sir. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're at a point now I think 20 we're having to start to contract out. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just like all departments 22 that's under the Commissioners Court, we need to take a look 23 at the big picture of everything. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Because we now have one 25 contract person helping with subdivisions. We have another 4-13-09 61 1 one with this, and you get to a point that it makes more 2 sense to hire another person rather than to contract 3 everything out. 4 MR. ODOM: Well -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But -- 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I disagree with that. I 7 think that it's a user thing. It's a user fee pay, rather 8 than having the taxpayers foot the bill for the whole 9 department and then not charging enough fees to recover your 10 cost. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why not charge the fees and 12 have an employee, and save the taxpayers money? 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Either way. As long as we 14 charge enough fees to pay that, that's fine. But if we 15 don't, like it's been, that doesn't make sense. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. That's what we need 17 to talk about. We need to look at -- start looking at those 18 things. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm a -- I like the user pay 20 thing. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't mind that, but 22 there's another element we're overlooking here in this whole 23 thing, and that is in terms of floodplain management, and 24 that's the remapping of many of our creeks in Kerr County 25 that haven't been mapped in eons. And if we're going to do 4-13-09 62 1 this, that all needs to be incorporated into what we're 2 talking about. We haven't -- that does -- that's not 3 discussed here. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the issue before us today is 5 focused solely on whether or not the Court at this point 6 wants to bring Mr. Hewitt on as Floodplain Administrator. 7 And the other information that Mr. Odom was kind enough to 8 present to us, seeing that coming down the road, deals with 9 the funding issue. And I agree with Commissioner Oehler; it 10 -- if it's benefitting a particular citizen, that user fee 11 needs to be adequate to offset the cost of the service being 12 provided. And -- 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think this is a good 14 opportunity to at least give it a chance to work and see how 15 it works. 16 MR. ODOM: See how it works. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Exactly. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Between now and the end of 19 budget year. Then we can make a determination then to 20 whether we want to stay with that or do something else. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, Mr. Hewitt would -- 22 he -- the way I read it here, he'd work one day a week. 23 MR. ODOM: Correct. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Probably on Wednesday? 25 MR. ODOM: If there was a need for him to come in, 4-13-09 63 1 whether it was an hour or two hours, basically, unless the 2 Court had some studies they wanted to do. He's capable of 3 doing that. We have grown -- last year was 36, which is 4 unusual. You know, I've just had -- since January, since 5 I've come back, I've had 25 -- 26. Isn't that right, Kelly? 6 Already. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, he'd work one day a week 8 for -- at $100 an hour? 9 MR. ODOM: That's correct. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move for approval. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 13 approval of the agenda item as indicated. Question or 14 discussion on that motion? All in favor of the motion, 15 signify by raising your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 20 to Item 11; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 21 review and approve the floodplain letter to be sent to 22 property owners that may be affected by the new proposed 23 DFIRM maps. 24 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. We received a letter from 25 FEMA and the contractor for FEMA saying that they had no 4-13-09 64 1 changes in the floodplain. Being an Aggie, I didn't quite 2 trust that scenario, so we went through -- I say "we"; I have 3 a mouse in my pocket. I've asked John to take a look at this 4 for me, and we came up with about 55 properties that we 5 identified off their new FIRM that was in the floodplain. 6 Then we went back and identified those areas with overlay in 7 our office there. We basically found those property owners, 8 and out of that -- I think we had around 35, 36 property 9 owners out of this 50-some-odd properties, some in Kerrville, 10 some in the city of Ingram, and then outside. We went back 11 again, to use due diligence, and looked at it again, asked 12 John to look at it again to make sure that we got as many 13 people or identified as many as we could. And so, therefore, 14 then we put this letter together to send out to the people 15 that we feel are affected. 16 And we also have in this packet that we gave you 17 was identifying flood insurance and different things that we 18 pulled off the internet that these people will have an 19 opportunity at this point to have flood insurance. We want 20 them to have the opportunity to be grandfathered. I don't 21 have -- I hear one thing, then I hear another thing from 22 different entities about the insurance, but we took this 23 directly off the internet from FEMA and all, and we felt like 24 this was using due diligence to identify all that we can. 25 Have we got everything? I can't say, but we've -- we have 4-13-09 65 1 tried to identify those people and give them an opportunity 2 to, if they wish to dispute the technical data, then by all 3 means, they can give us proof, whatever they have. We will 4 then -- Kerr County Road and Bridge will take that 5 information and send it to FEMA, as well as the contractor 6 that did that, before this is finalized. So, we want to take 7 a step now to do that, allow people to have the opportunity 8 to refute it if they wish to, if they have technical data to 9 dispute what FEMA's come up with. And above all, we want to 10 refute -- do not -- that's not a good word. Let's say 11 "disagree" with their analysis that there's no properties 12 affected, because there are. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Essentially, you've being trying to 14 be proactive with the citizens, let the citizens know that 15 they're about to be included in something they weren't 16 previously included in. 17 MR. ODOM: That's right. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: And if they want to dispute it, give 19 them the opportunity and advise them of the deadline to do 20 that. And secondly, if they feel like they are at risk for 21 flooding, they can acquire the insurance now -- 22 MR. ODOM: Now. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: -- at a reduced rate, rather than 24 after they're included, paying through the nose for it. 25 MR. ODOM: It will -- if they wait until 4-13-09 66 1 afterwards, then it will be at the current FIRM amount. Now 2 they're not, and they should be able to get the insurance 3 cheaper at a premium. They would be in the 500. Afterwards, 4 once they're finalized, then they will pay where they're 5 sitting. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 9 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 10 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move to Item 14, if we might. 15 Consider, discuss, and take appropriate action on Kerrville 16 South wastewater project, Phase 5, and unresolved easement 17 and/or related issues. Not going to be trapped by the agenda 18 item, are you? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm trying not to, Judge. 20 I direct the Court's attention basically to 14A on your 21 computer, which gives you some backup -- backup information 22 that may be helpful to this discussion. As the Court 23 remembers, this is Phase 5, and the purpose of Phase 5 in the 24 Kerrville South project is to hook up the homes on Ranchero 25 Road and the properties on Ranchero Road at approximately the 4-13-09 67 1 intersection of Ranchero and Highway 16 down through 2 Ripplewood, which is, oh, a block and a half or two blocks 3 long. Most of those, the Court will recall, are either 4 duplexes that have been made into four-plexes, or -- or other 5 problem areas, all of them operating on septics that are 6 outmoded and failing. We've been there many, many times. 7 In Phase 1, Kerr County laid a sewer line through 8 the middle of Oak Grove Mobile Home Park. All those 9 properties are hooked up, and it was taken down to the 10 transmission line that came from the Nimitz School that went 11 over to the city. It was an interceptor line that went over 12 to the city sewer line on Highway 16. And this proposal 13 would allow us to hook up how we're doing it, and the funding 14 is already in the bank. They're allowing us to hook up these 15 properties on Ranchero. The problem now is, how do we do 16 that with limited space and an easement? I've had 17 conversations with the new owner of Oak Grove Mobile Home 18 Park with respect to coming across their property from the 19 backs of the properties on Ranchero Road to hook up into that 20 main that we put through Oak Grove Mobile Home Park, and he 21 has resisted our efforts to work out a blanket easement to 22 allow us to do that, citing the fact that there is an 23 easement in place behind the properties on Ranchero and 24 behind the properties on Oak Grove Mobile Home Park. 25 In fact, there is an easement there. It's about 10 4-13-09 68 1 or 15 feet wide. Al, will you -- this is Mr. Groves, who's 2 helping us in our sewer project. Al, if you'd come to the 3 microphone, between you and I, maybe we'll get through and 4 everybody will understand it. There is an existing easement. 5 The problem with the easement is it's too narrow. There's 6 many trees. There are buildings that have -- from Oak Grove 7 Mobile Home Park that are encroaching into that easement. 8 There are gas lines, water lines, electrical lines in there, 9 and it's just absolutely too convoluted to think about how 10 you're going to work into it, so we looked at other 11 suggestions. If we can't use that easement, then we looked 12 into -- and the guy doesn't like a blanket easement for about 13 eight laterals, then maybe we can reduce it down to three or 14 four, and we have proposed that maybe three or four of them, 15 and hooking up the properties on Ranchero, coming together, 16 and then into one lateral going -- one or two or three 17 laterals going in, and that proposal is in front of him. 18 Mr. Groves suggested the other day that maybe we 19 might like to take a look at the other side of the easement 20 on the backs of the Ranchero Road properties. And we have 21 done that, and the -- and the problems are just as complex as 22 they are on the other side of the fence, and so that doesn't 23 offer us any particular good solution. Another solution or 24 possibility is trenching on the Ranchero Road side, the front 25 of those properties on Ranchero Road. The problem with that 4-13-09 69 1 is that the grade from Ranchero Road down to the properties 2 is pretty steep, and we'd have to trench that 15 to 20 feet 3 down to get a gravity flow out of the properties into that 4 transmission line to go on down to Ripplewood. That's the 5 nature of the problem. Complicated by the fact that the 6 owner of the mobile home park now is not Royce and Pearl 7 Woods, who we've dealt with in the past for many years and 8 were always able to work out our easement issues with those 9 good folks. The owner now is a gentleman who lives in San 10 Clemente, California, and getting his attention has been a 11 challenge, to say the very least. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You know how those 13 California people are. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I thought you was going to 15 say he was from New Jersey. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Same thing. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, there is the sense of 18 the problem. I wanted the Court to know about it, and Al -- 19 I asked Mr. Groves to be here for all of these three items 20 that are linked together, to talk about whether or not it 21 really is a possibility to trench on the Ranchero Road side. 22 I've asked Road and Bridge to take a look at it. I've talked 23 with the County Surveyor about it, and it seems that our 24 space is probably pretty limited on the Ranchero Road side in 25 terms of the curb, of what may be available from the curb in 4-13-09 70 1 toward -- toward each of those dwellings. So -- 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner, let me ask a question. 3 The -- you indicated the initial response from the current 4 owner was to the effect that, well, there's a utility 5 easement across the back of the property, and that ought to 6 be good enough? 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Correct. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. It occurs to me that we may 9 have some leverage there. If we decide to indicate we want 10 to use that, that owner's got a number of tenants that have 11 quite a few obstructions encroaching into that utility 12 easement that he's going to be responsible for having his 13 tenants move. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I intend to tell him that, 15 Judge, when we meet later this month. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: And I don't think his tenants are 17 going to be real happy they're going to have to upset the 18 apple cart about 16 times. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That, plus each of them 20 will have to have their service interrupted, because water, 21 gas, and electric is going to have to be interrupted as we 22 come through. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Those are the things that 25 I'm going to remind him about. There has never been any 4-13-09 71 1 offer of compensation from the County from these grant funds 2 available, although there is a modest amount in the grant for 3 the acquisition of easements, but I have not offered that 4 yet. I just wanted the Court to know the issues in front of 5 us. If we get these issues resolved, then we can move 6 forward and get to a bid document for Phase 5. There is 7 another element of this. The Southwinds Mobile Home Park 8 further on down below Nimitz School, on the north side of the 9 road, also will be hooked up as a result of an agreement 10 between the owner of that park and Kerr County several years 11 ago on septic issues, and they're very cooperative. And he 12 said to us, "Anything you need, just tell me what you need, 13 and let me know when you're going to get started." 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Where do they live? 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: In the vicinity. Does not 16 live in San Clemente or anywhere else in California that I'm 17 aware of. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Specifically, he lives in 19 Precinct 1. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, really? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I didn't know that. Is 23 that right? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What a nice fellow. 4-13-09 72 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, he is. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: You would bring that out, 3 Commissioner. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Well -- 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, I just want the Court 6 to know where we are. There have been questions asked as to 7 why we haven't proceeded. That's why. I anticipate a 8 meeting with Mr. San Clemente later this month or early in 9 May, and hopefully we'll get those issues resolved. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Trenching on Ranchero Road, is that 11 feasible? 12 MR. GROVES: You may have an option there, because 13 you have a setback -- setback for buildings off Ranchero Road 14 which goes into the property, and an easement in that area 15 would not be detrimental to the property at all. So -- and 16 the benefit of that is it's further down the slope from that 17 high curb that's on Ranchero Road, if you don't have 18 right-of-way there. But I did a couple of preliminary 19 profiles on there, and I think we would not exceed 15 foot in 20 depth if we did Ranchero Road. And I would suggest if we 21 don't have enough room in the right-of-way, I wouldn't 22 suggest tearing up Ranchero Road, but if we don't have enough 23 room in the right-of-way, expand that by a small easement 24 across the front of the lots. You'd have eight easements to 25 obtain. 4-13-09 73 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right, there would be eight 2 to acquire. 3 MR. GROVES: Yes, sir. The -- the plan, as it 4 stands now, indicated boring under those structures that were 5 in the easement in the back, which is an additional expense. 6 But if you moved to the other side, you'd have structures 7 back there to bore under, and you have the same complication 8 on either side. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: What I'm hearing from you, then, is 10 that maybe the most effective route would be individual lines 11 from individual properties on Ranchero Road, as opposed to 12 using three lines with a semi-collector type arrangement, and 13 then utilizing a three. It occurs to me that if people have 14 put structures in a utility easement, they can be forced to 15 move them. 16 MR. GROVES: Yes, sir, they can be. They can be. 17 'Cause they -- that's -- there's -- you know, fences are 18 structures and anything else. The other complication back 19 there, though, is the number of utilities that currently 20 exist in that -- in that easement, and many of them are -- 21 are, I think, undetermined as to their routes and so forth. 22 It's going to be a -- going to be a picnic back there trying 23 to put that line in. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are y'all going to come back 25 with a recommendation or an idea after y'all -- 4-13-09 74 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I would hope that the 2 next time I bring it back, I'll come back with easements to 3 be approved by the Court. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Y'all are using 15 feet of 6 ditch like it's just an everyday thing. Isn't that -- isn't 7 that pretty deep? I mean -- 8 MR. GROVES: It's relative. I mean, we've got -- 9 you can find them 25 or 30 foot deep, but -- 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Bigger machine, Buster. Just 11 a bigger machine. 12 MR. GROVES: But anything above -- or any less than 13 15 feet is very workable with standard equipment. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just a bigger pile of dirt, 15 right? 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Bigger pile of dirt, and got 17 a long arm on it. 18 MR. GROVES: And you've got to have trench -- 19 trench jacks, but you got to have those if you go over 20 5 feet. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It could drive the expense 22 -- cost up. It's not -- not the preferred option. It drives 23 the cost up. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: So, you guys are going to keep 25 working that, huh? 4-13-09 75 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's move to Item 15; 3 consider, discuss -- and discuss status report on planning 4 activities taking place for the Center Point/East Kerr County 5 Wastewater Project as part of the T.W.D.B. planning grant. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Again, I would direct your 7 attention to 15A on your computer, which is Mr. Groves' 8 monthly report. We have his report as project manager back 9 to us. We have basically complied with the obligations of 10 Category A. Is that correct, Al? 11 MR. GROVES: That's correct. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The grant is broken into 13 four categories, A, B, C, and D, for this level of planning, 14 which the Court will remember is 238,000 worth of planning 15 and engineering work. And, so, we have finished or completed 16 Category A. This report, along with a big, thick document 17 that Tetra Tech has prepared, has been sent to Water 18 Development Board for its approval in a draft form. When 19 that is received -- when that comment is received back, 20 whatever changes are required to be made, and then we can 21 proceed to Category B, which is a whole 'nother level of 22 planning and so forth. Al, do you want to pick it up at that 23 point and talk about your report and what's required 24 forthcoming in Category B? 25 MR. GROVES: The -- actually, Category B is -- 4-13-09 76 1 Category A was to identify eligibility, I think is the way 2 they termed it. These categories are kind of confusing, 3 because as you work this thing out, you're going to be 4 working on Category C or D while you're working on Category A 5 or B. But you can't go too far with them, because if they 6 change something in Category A, then you have to modify it 7 and maybe change something you've done in B. But, at any 8 rate, we're well on the way to -- to getting Category B 9 underway. The Water Development Board said they probably 10 could get approval -- approval or comments back on Category A 11 within a couple weeks. I took it up there, and they said 12 they could probably get it out in a couple of weeks. So, I 13 don't have a full description here, Commissioner, -- 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, that's okay. 15 MR. GROVES: -- of Category B. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I just wanted to direct the 17 Court's attention to not only what we have, but that we have 18 had a meeting with the Kendall County Water Control and 19 Improvement District. County Attorney has given me a draft 20 of an interlocal agreement for treatment and related 21 services, and we'll be taking a look at that. Commissioner 22 Letz will join me in that, and then we'll see if we can fill 23 in some of the blanks and then meet again with the W.C. & 24 I.D. in Kendall County. We have had initial discussions with 25 TexDOT regarding the easements that are required along 4-13-09 77 1 Highway 27 and Highway 480 and Highway 1350 in the Center 2 Point area that will be required for future transmission 3 lines here. So, we're moving forward. It's a slow process, 4 but it's moving forward on schedule. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Let's quickly take up 6 Item 16 before we go to our 10:30 timed item. Consider, 7 discuss, and take appropriate action to approve filing an 8 application with U.S.D.A./R.U.S. for funding the transmission 9 line portion of the Center Point/Eastern Kerr County 10 wastewater project. Commissioner Williams? 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The Court will recall that 12 we had a workshop here in which Senator Hutchison's office 13 was involved, along with the good folks from the 14 U.S.D.A./R.U.S. out of Fredericksburg, and their -- and the 15 local group's immediate supervisor. I'm not sure where he's 16 located. Used to be in Temple, Texas; I'm not sure where he 17 is is now. And we've talked about what was available through 18 U.S.D.A./R.U.S. for funding. Subsequent to that meeting -- 19 well, at the meeting we didn't get a whole lot of information 20 that we didn't already know, but subsequent to that, then I 21 picked up on the internet, through the Comptroller's office, 22 that U.S.D.A. was the beneficiary of about 1.4 billion 23 dollars of stimulus money into the Rural Utilities Services 24 division of of U.S.D.A. So, you know, that says to me why 25 not throw a little bread on the water and see what happens? 4-13-09 78 1 So, that's what this is all about. We're going to file an 2 application with U.S.D.A./R.U.S. for the transmission cost of 3 the line from Center Point to Comfort. Have you broken out 4 that cost, Al? It was somewhere in the area of between two 5 and three million dollars. What's the new number? 6 MR. GROVES: Well -- well, the new number is not 7 out yet, because it's -- you know, I mentioned to you that we 8 may have to change the plan and take a lift station in at 9 Wilson Creek, 'cause by the time you get down to the plant, 10 you're so deep down there that it's -- you talked about deep 11 line. You're very deep. So, we're reworking the alignment 12 to take into effect putting a lift station at Wilson Creek, 13 coming up and running a force main over and going into the 14 city streets in Comfort, and go down city -- Broadway, I 15 guess it is, Broadway down, and I think there's some benefits 16 to that. We might even be able to help them eliminate a lift 17 station over there in their existing system. But we're 18 working that out, and I'll get it back to you. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, all I'm asking the 20 Court today is approval to file the application. We'll get 21 the number from Al as to what this cost is. We'll give them 22 all the other things they want, the County's audit and the 23 preliminary planning and blah, blah, blah, whatever they ask 24 for, and we'll file an application. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Al, have you looked at how far 4-13-09 79 1 north you'd have to go on -- up Wilson Creek to get to a 2 point that you wouldn't need a lift station? 3 MR. GROVES: We're not going up Wilson Creek. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You meant Cypress Creek, 5 didn't you? 6 MR. GROVES: No, Wilson Creek. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Wilson Creek, okay. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If you go further towards the 9 interstate, you're gaining elevation. I wondered if you 10 looked at how far you have to go up. 11 MR. GROVES: Well, you're losing elevation on the 12 sewer line. It's basically -- what's happening, you're going 13 down all the time in a constant slope. And the other thing 14 about doing it this way is the crossing under Cypress Creek. 15 You're going to be a tremendously large line, and if we don't 16 -- I mean, if we put the lift station in at Wilson Creek with 17 a pump, then we go beyond Cypress Creek before we discharge 18 back into the gravity system. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, it's just -- so it's not a 20 force main all the way to the sewer plant? You just go till 21 you -- 22 MR. GROVES: No, it's a force main just over to -- 23 to the alignment that would fit into Broadway. They have an 24 existing system that runs down Broadway which will be too 25 small, I'm sure. 4-13-09 80 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mm-hmm. 2 MR. GROVES: But my thinking now is we can replace 3 that line with a larger line at a shallower grade, with less 4 -- much less expense than what we were going to go through. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: In the area around the -- I 6 guess, how would you tie into the force main? 7 MR. GROVES: The force main comes out -- it's a 8 gravity -- a pressure main. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 10 MR. GROVES: And it goes up and just pumps into the 11 manhole. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But there's that section then 13 between Wilson Creek and the county line. 14 MR. GROVES: That would be force main. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Be force main. How do you tie 16 into that line? 17 MR. GROVES: You don't tie into that line. You 18 would have to take that gravity line back to the lift 19 station. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, you -- 21 MR. GROVES: For any service that was -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. When there, you can 23 gravity flow back to the west? 24 MR. GROVES: Between this, yes, sir. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 'Cause there's an area in the 4-13-09 81 1 Westwood area -- 2 MR. GROVES: It's not very far, but it's a -- you'd 3 have to run a line back to a lift station. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. I think that area, 5 long-term, is a -- is a pretty high development area. 6 MR. GROVES: Yes, sir. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that's why I'm concerned 8 about making sure that we have it in the planning. 9 MR. GROVES: But that line would have to be put in 10 by a developer that will do -- whoever was doing that. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But a line coming out of the 12 Westwood area may come under this project. 13 MR. GROVES: That's true. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Which would get a lot -- I 15 mean, go from -- 16 MR. GROVES: We can -- we can -- as we get into 17 identifying the exact players over there, we can work that 18 out. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, I'm requesting the 21 Court's approval to file the application with U.S.D.A. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: That's a motion? 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That would be a motion. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 4-13-09 82 1 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 2 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 5 (No response.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We will move 7 to our 10:30 timed item, Item 12; consider, discuss, and take 8 appropriate action to approve contract with Hill Country 9 Telephone for internet service at the West Kerr Annex. This 10 is a one-year renewal of the existing service, isn't it? 11 MR. TROLINGER: No, sir, it's a service provider 12 change. Current service provider is a wireless operation, 13 and they're encountering some interference -- I'll say it 14 kindly -- and in the Ingram area has become unreliable. 15 We've decided to switch to a wired hard-line system. It's 16 the same price, and the County Attorney has reviewed the 17 contract. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Motion made and seconded for 21 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Isn't it nice, somebody to 23 stand up and tell you what you need to know? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: In a minute. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion, signify 4-13-09 83 1 by raising your right hand. 2 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 4 (No response.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll go to 6 our 10:35 timed item; consider, discuss, and take appropriate 7 action to proclaim April 26th through May the 3rd, 2009, as 8 Soil and Water Stewardship Week. I see we have Mr. George 9 Holekamp and some of his minions back there. Are you going 10 to drag them all up here, George? 11 MR. HOLEKAMP: I brought -- our whole board is 12 here. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Good. 14 MR. HOLEKAMP: We asked that the Court to go on 15 with us with the proclamation for Soil Stewardship Week, 16 April 26 to May the 3rd. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would move approval of 18 Kerr County proclaiming April 26 to May 3, 2009, as Soil and 19 Water Stewardship Week. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second -- third. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded on the 23 agenda item. Question or discussion on that motion? All in 24 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4-13-09 84 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Why don't we 4 go ahead and take about a 15-, 20-minute recess. It's my 5 understanding that the soil conservation people were going to 6 try and grab a picture here of something. Probably you, 7 Buster. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, probably. 9 (Recess taken from 10:40 a.m. to 11:04 a.m.) 10 - - - - - - - - - - 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let' come back to order, if 12 we might. We'll go to our 11 o'clock timed item. It's a bit 13 past that now. Item 17, a presentation by Mr. David Mendez 14 with Bickerstaff Heath Delgado Acosta LLP regarding the 2010 15 census. Morning, sir. 16 MR. MENDEZ: Good morning, Judge, Commissioners. 17 Thank you for inviting me here to visit with you about the 18 2010 redistricting, and the 2010 census and 2011 19 redistricting obligations of the county. I have a handout 20 for you -- two handouts, actually. One is a timetable which 21 we'll be discussing during this short presentation. The 22 other is a copy -- a hard copy of the slides that I have up 23 here on the screen as well. And, basically, I have three 24 items that I want to cover with you all, and we're going to 25 power up here in a second. Let's see if I can make this 4-13-09 85 1 thing run. Okay. There are three points I want to go over 2 with you briefly this morning. I have -- it will take about 3 15, 20 minutes. 4 The basic idea of this presentation is to inform 5 the Commissioners Court of your obligations regarding the 6 2011 redistricting cycle, to describe the basic redistricting 7 timeline that you will be working under, Commissioners and 8 Judge, and then also to describe some steps that you, as Kerr 9 County, can take to economize or to reduce the cost of the 10 process as you get into it in the redistricting cycle. The 11 Commissioners Court obligation as to redistricting applies as 12 to the commissioner precincts, to your election precincts and 13 constable and justice precincts, to the extent that they're 14 tied to your county commissioner lines, and I'll go into more 15 detail on those concepts in a minute. But, basically, at the 16 beginning of a decade, once the census is issued, the 17 Commissioners Court, under the 14th Amendment of the 18 Constitution, has an obligation to measure the population in 19 the four county commissioner precincts and determine if it is 20 roughly equal in each of the four precincts. 21 It relates to our one person/one vote obligation, 22 so that the voters in each of the four county commissioner 23 precincts basically are equally represented before the dais 24 here, in the sense that if you have a roughly equal number of 25 voters electing each of you, that gives everybody a roughly 4-13-09 86 1 equal vote. One person, one vote. If we're out of balance, 2 then a district that is overpopulated basically is 3 under-represented here at the court. There are other 4 requirements that come into play, other legal implications 5 when you have to go through the redistricting process and 6 redrawing. One of them comes from the Voting Rights Act of 7 1965; it has two parts. It has -- it creates an obligation 8 that you submit your drawing of the -- of your new county 9 commissioner precincts to Washington for preclearance before 10 you use it in an election, and then it also obligates you, 11 under Section 2 of the Voting Rights Act, to not discriminate 12 against certain protected minority groups as you go through 13 the process, and we'll talk briefly about what -- how that 14 law is applied and how the county gets through that process 15 without having any problems with the Voting Rights Act. 16 The other requirement that you'll be using is sort 17 of the flip side of the Voting Rights Act, and that is the 18 requirements under the 14th Amendment of the Constitution 19 that we not discriminate against any Anglo voters. So, at 20 the same time that you are trying to address voting rights of 21 protected minorities, your obligation is to narrowly tailor 22 those solutions so that you don't adversely affect the rights 23 of Anglo members of your community, and voters. So, these 24 constitutional principles that we're talking about, the one 25 person/one vote requirements, for example, apply to the 4-13-09 87 1 Commissioners Court. I'm digressing back to explain, when we 2 look at the Commissioners Court, they have to -- all four of 3 those precincts have to be equal. To the extent your justice 4 and constable precincts are tied to your Commissioner 5 lines -- and I don't know if that's -- how y'all are 6 organized in this county, but if they are, there is no 7 obligation that justice and constable precincts be equal in 8 population. And, in fact, in many counties those are divided 9 by other -- in other territories, separate and apart from the 10 commissioner precincts. 11 And, so, Commissioners Court is responsible for 12 moving those boundaries around, but they do that for 13 administrative reasons, like controlling dockets or the 14 workload of the constables and the J.P.'s, and not so much 15 just to have an equal number of people in each district. The 16 election precincts that you have are also not governed by the 17 one person/one vote requirement, but the law does require 18 that they not have too many voters in them so that it becomes 19 difficult for people to participate in elections. So, 20 there's a maximum size of voters in the precinct, and all 21 that -- and you will need to visit with the elections 22 administrator, the County Clerk, about the size of those as 23 we go through the -- during the redistricting cycle. 24 Under the Voting Rights Act, as I mentioned, it 25 applies to Texas. It has applied since 1972, and it's 4-13-09 88 1 basically a routine submission that we would do. Once you 2 all draw your commissioner precincts and your election 3 precincts, we send them on to Washington as part of the 4 process and get them approved through them so that you can 5 then apply them and utilize those for your elections. Again, 6 I explained a little bit about Section 2 and its protection 7 of members of the voting -- of protected minority classes. 8 And I also mentioned to you earlier -- and I'm not going to 9 go through the whole drill with you; you've got slides on 10 this about the Shaw v. Reno case and how the 14th Amendment 11 protects the rights of Anglo voters as you're going through 12 the process. So, you narrowly tailor any solution you have 13 involving minority voting rights just to address any problems 14 there is on that, but not to adversely affect Anglo voters. 15 And that is a concept that comes from the gerrymandering 16 cases and those kind of things out there. We're trying to 17 avoid gerrymandering, you know, in any way in our county 18 precinct drawings. 19 The requirements of the Local Government Code kind 20 of outline all of your responsibilities in adjusting these 21 lines, and as we go through the process, we will help you 22 apply each of those statutes that -- that works. And so what 23 I've done -- and I'm going to put this document all up on the 24 screen at one time. I will refer you to the 11-by-17 25 timetable which I've provided the Court. And you're early. 4-13-09 89 1 The staff asked me to come do this presentation; we're 2 roughly 15, 18 months ahead of a time when you have to really 3 be focused on this. You really probably don't need to really 4 think about it much until you're setting your budget for the 5 2010 -- October 2010 through September 30th, 2011 budget 6 year, because that's when you will really be undertaking this 7 obligation for your process. So, between now and that point 8 in the fall of 2010, there are, however, some things that you 9 can be doing that -- to kind of economize or save resources. 10 One of them is participation in the boundary and annexation 11 surveys are put on by the Census Bureau. The Census Bureau 12 has as its records where we were when we redistricted Kerr 13 County in 2001. So, it thinks there's a snapshot of Kerr 14 County from 2001; the roads, subdivisions, the boundaries are 15 all from 2001. They're coming in during this cycle, and 16 during -- on April 1st of 2010, they'll take a new census and 17 apply it to your old map. One of the things they're trying 18 to do between then and now is update the records of Kerr 19 County to add in all new subdivisions, all the new streets, 20 all of the new addressing, so that when that's laid in, we 21 can have an accurate way in which to draw your new county 22 commissioner lines. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Who does that? Who gathers 24 that information and lays it in? 25 MR. MENDEZ: The Census Bureau itself. 4-13-09 90 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are they going to pay us for 2 that information? 3 MR. MENDEZ: They will -- they will provide it for 4 free to you all. They -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I thought we had it. I 6 thought it was us that own it. 7 MR. MENDEZ: You have data in your system, and you 8 are -- in participating in the census survey, you submit it 9 to them. I do not think they buy it from anybody. I think 10 that they ask you -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I didn't think they would 12 either, but I thought I'd fire a shot. 13 MR. MENDEZ: It's a good idea. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 15 MR. MENDEZ: And if you have a good GIS county road 16 system, then that data should enter in very easily into -- 17 into that system. We use a GIS system as well, and if any of 18 the members of the Court participated in the 2001 round of 19 redistricting, you'll know that we will put the map up on the 20 screen and we will draw those on the fly as we go through the 21 process so that we can adjust boundaries, and you, in a work 22 session or otherwise, can see us go through that process. 23 But part of the drawing process, and what I've outlined 24 really in your -- in that handout that you have, and that 25 timeline, is these redistricting steps, the blue ones that 4-13-09 91 1 are in the middle of the page, if you will, on your timeline. 2 And what we will be doing as we go into the process 3 is verifying your old boundaries, performing an initial 4 assessment to make sure that you are out of balance, because 5 if you're not out of balance, if, by any chance or 6 coincidence, the districts are -- all four of them are evenly 7 populated, then you avoid the cost of redistricting. Now, we 8 did a -- our firm, along with doing Kerr County, we did about 9 100 different counties, cities, and school districts last 10 round -- 120. And I had two clients that actually were -- of 11 the 120 or so, two of them were in balance; they didn't have 12 to redistrict. One of them was Dallas County, which -- 13 couple of million people. They were -- they happened to be 14 in balance. They had other reasons they needed to 15 redistrict, so they did anyway, but at least one county 16 avoided that expenditure. 17 Once you -- we've measured your -- your population, 18 determined whether you're out of balance or not, then -- and 19 let's say you have to redistrict. We develop and adopt 20 guidelines and criteria for going through that process so 21 that the community can participate and they can give you 22 their feedback as they go through it, and so if anyone 23 submits a plan from the community, that it can be compared to 24 anything that the Commissioners are drawing. And so these 25 criteria relate to easily identifiable geographic boundaries, 4-13-09 92 1 so we're going to try to avoid splitting neighborhoods that 2 we're going to try to draw to permit our county election 3 precincts to continue to operate, 'cause there's nothing 4 worse than confusing voters by splitting their voting 5 precinct. I mean, I don't know what gets people -- gets more 6 complaints at a commissioners court than, "You changed my 7 precinct; you changed my polling location." So, we'll try to 8 get and utilize those old polling locations to the maximum 9 extent possible. 10 Other criteria are laid out in your memo. I'm not 11 going to kind of walk you through all of them, because -- for 12 the purposes of brevity. You've got a long commissioners 13 court agenda. But suffice it to say that these standards and 14 criteria are the ones that the Court and that the Department 15 of Justice also uses, so when we send our stuff in to 16 Washington for you, they will be consistent. The approach 17 you have used and the criteria you've used will be consistent 18 with what they're used to seeing in the courts and at the 19 Department of Justice. With these criteria in mind, I will 20 sit down with the Court and we'll develop an illustrative 21 plan. The basic approach that we normally take as we go 22 through this, or if you hire another consultant, that a 23 consultant will go through is to meet with each of the 24 commissioners, identify whether you're district is over or 25 underpopulated. 4-13-09 93 1 If your precinct is over or underpopulated, you've 2 got to shed population, we'll talk to you and figure out 3 which areas of the precinct should be adjusted to conform. 4 Then as your -- then we'll meet with the other commissioners, 5 and if someone needs to take territory, we try to work out a 6 system of sharing that population so that everybody's fairly 7 represented in the county. Obviously, everybody will be in 8 one of the four commissioner precincts. This illustrative 9 plan is then put out to the public in a hearing. We take 10 their input. The Court meets as part of its regular meeting, 11 analyzes that report that I give them on what they've heard 12 from the court -- we've heard from the community on how 13 they'd like to see their districts drawn, and then you all 14 finalize and adopt the plan, which we send off to Washington. 15 Once the precincts are adopted, once the state 16 legislative lines are drawn, the congressional lines are 17 drawn -- and I don't know if you all -- if Kerr County is in 18 more than one congressional district or you're in one, but if 19 you have any problems with split -- splitting the county for 20 senate districts or state rep districts, or Department of 21 Education -- I mean, Commissioner of Education districts, all 22 of those have to be taken into consideration with your county 23 elections administrator, the County Clerk, as we realign your 24 county election precincts, trying to minimize the changes 25 there so that we avoid confused voters. It's a tough job, 4-13-09 94 1 and I list here in this slide all of the -- the types of 2 territory that cannot be split by a county election precinct 3 line. 4 A county election precinct cannot contain territory 5 from more than one commissioner precinct, more than one J.P. 6 or constable precinct, more than one congressional, state 7 senate, or state rep district, more than one city ward -- you 8 do not have city wards here in the city of Kerrville, but in 9 communities that have those, we have to avoid splitting 10 those, and state board of education districts. So, as you 11 can see, it's hard to draw that jigsaw of the election 12 precincts with all of these other lines criss-crossing 13 throughout the county. Finally, I mentioned earlier, I just 14 want to point this out as we go through it. The -- one of 15 the best ways, Commissioners, to avoid problems with how we 16 redraw your county election precincts is for you all to 17 participate in the boundary and annexation survey that the 18 Census Bureau is putting on. While you may not be able to 19 sell them the data that you've worked real hard to put 20 together, and believe me, I understand how expensive it is 21 for the County to have a good database for that, at least it 22 -- if that data is in the federal records, it'll simplify the 23 mapping for you guys. 24 I didn't tell you a whole bunch about myself. I'm 25 David Mendez, again, with Bickerstaff Heath in Austin, Texas. 4-13-09 95 1 We're a 30-year-old law firm; I've been there for the last 23 2 years at the firm. I've been involved in both the '90 and 3 2000 rounds of redistricting for my clients, and I appreciate 4 the work that the County's allowed us to do in the last round 5 of redistricting for y'all. If you all decided that you 6 needed a proposal for us, we're way ahead of time for that 7 process now. You don't need to budget even for this until, 8 again, the budget that you adopt for October 1, 2010, but if 9 y'all need a budget from us or -- or some kind of expense 10 data, I can provide you with what it -- how you all undertook 11 it last time, the process, and how much it cost you, and then 12 we can budget your time for the upcoming session. I 13 appreciate the staff inviting me to do this presentation for 14 you. I kind of rushed through it, because I'm not sure how 15 much detail you guys need. You've probably been hearing 16 about this if you went to the V.G. Young Institute in Austin 17 or if you've been attending some of the other County Judge 18 and County Commissioner trainings. But are there questions 19 that I can answer about any part of that process right now? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've got -- I have one. 21 I've always thought that it was the -- that the -- like, 2010 22 is going to be the year that it has to be done and adopted. 23 Not so. 24 MR. MENDEZ: April 1, 2010, is when the actual 25 census is taken. That's the census day. The data is 4-13-09 96 1 crunched from that point forward -- or processed from that 2 point forward, so that the initial release of census data 3 does not come out till December of 2010. Congress -- the 4 President gets a report which he delivers to Congress in 5 December of 2010, and that's the one -- it's called P.L., the 6 P.L. data, Public Law data, comes out at that time in order 7 for the Congress to determine how many congressional seats we 8 will end up with in each of our states. Texas is scheduled, 9 by the way, to gain two or three congressional seats, just 10 because of the population growth we've had over the last 11 decade. But that data doesn't get released till December. 12 There -- then it gets delivered from Congress to our 13 Governor, and we have a state statute that says the county 14 cannot utilize the state -- the federal data until the 15 governor has received his report. So, that puts us about to 16 February, and historically, we've been getting it in about 17 February-March timeline of 2011. And from that point 18 forward, as your timeline shows there, we need to be done, 19 because you're going to have primaries in the spring of 2012. 20 So, what we're trying to shoot for, Commissioner, is to get 21 from January-February of 2011 to a point where, when people 22 have to sign up for a race on January 1st, or the primaries 23 January 1, 2012, you are done and everything is -- is 24 finished. So, kind of a long-winded answer to that. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. No, but I -- that was 4-13-09 97 1 a good explanation; I appreciate it. One final question. 2 Your firm did us -- did Kerr County last time? 3 MR. MENDEZ: Right. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you going to reduce the 5 fees because you have repeat -- I don't know why you're 6 laughing; that's a real question. 7 MR. MENDEZ: We -- we do provide a reduced fee for 8 our services to our existing clients, and I'll tell you, it's 9 in the initial -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are we an existing client? 11 MR. MENDEZ: Yes, sir. I mean, you -- we've done 12 this kind of work for you all, and I would treat you that 13 way. And the reason that I can do that is because I already 14 have in my electronic database the basic boundaries that we 15 adopted. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Correct, absolutely. 17 MR. MENDEZ: So, for me, I can take that data and 18 process it on top of the new census data, and then the new 19 census maps. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Absolutely. 21 MR. MENDEZ: But if you decide to -- to hire 22 somebody else, you just need to make sure they have enough 23 time, and that you do budget for the amount of time they'll 24 need to draw that in, 'cause it's not a simple thing. But 25 there is a reduction in that, and I will present that. 4-13-09 98 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you very much. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If I understand you 3 correctly, there are no budgetary considerations for us in 4 the '09-'10 budget? 5 MR. MENDEZ: There are none in the '09-'10 budget 6 year. It'll be in the 20 -- for the -- 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: '10-'11 budget. 8 MR. MENDEZ: Yeah, '10-'11 budget. That's when you 9 first have to worry about this. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The other thing I wanted to 11 call to your attention, you may not know, is the Court 12 undertook an opportunity through AACOG to take a look at our 13 census blocks and tracts through AACOG's GIS system and the 14 internet -- their I.T. Department, and that work has already 15 been done. That's on file, and that's available for 16 whomever. 17 MR. MENDEZ: That's -- that is what your offices 18 should be helping the Census Bureau incorporate into its map. 19 Because if it's not in what's called the federal TIGER/Line 20 files, then the federal government won't use it. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It will be made available 22 to Census. 23 MR. MENDEZ: Well, I think that will get you a long 24 way toward a very efficient process in 2011. You'll be 25 hearing more about this at every session -- I mean, every 4-13-09 99 1 training that you guys go to around the state over the next 2 year, 'cause there are a lot of people asking questions. 3 Again, thank you all for -- for letting me answer -- be here 4 with y'all. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Any more questions for Mr. Mendez? 6 Thank you, sir. We appreciate your presentation. This is 7 particularly helpful, I think, for purposes of planning the 8 timeline. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, sir. 10 MR. MENDEZ: Thank you. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Thank you. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move forward to Item 18; 13 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to approve 14 contract with Diana Twiss. Ms. Bailey? 15 MS. BAILEY: Yes, Your Honor. Good morning. And 16 I'm sorry; Rex is getting ready for a hearing, so he asked me 17 to sub in for him for the rest of the hearing this morning. 18 This item is requesting authorization to enter into a 19 contract with Diana Twiss. Rex has reached a proposed 20 agreement with her to design and implement an access program 21 that will monitor, update, and produce documents for filing 22 new criminal cases with the County Clerk. This proposed 23 program will replace the two-phase process that's currently 24 used by the County Attorney's office to file cases using the 25 prosecutor package, which is in Odyssey, and a document merge 4-13-09 100 1 process utilizing Microsoft Excel and Microsoft Word. The 2 cost for design and setup of this new program is expected to 3 be approximately one-half of the annual fee that Odyssey is 4 requiring for support of its prosecutor package, and the 5 ongoing support for this new program is expected to be 6 substantially less than even that amount. Upon 7 implementation of this new program, we will cease utilizing 8 the prosecutor package in Odyssey, and will therefore not 9 need to contract with Tyler Technologies to receive and pay 10 for that annual support fee for that package. So, we believe 11 that it's not only going to be more efficient, but will 12 reduce our costs overall. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Essentially, what you've done, 14 you've opted out of the -- the package that's available under 15 the Odyssey system to something that's more suitable for what 16 you do? 17 MS. BAILEY: Exactly. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: And for less money. 19 MS. BAILEY: Yes. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: So, you've got the funds in your 21 budget to do that, if what's been budgeted is for Odyssey 22 software updates, and let's go forward on that basis. 23 MS. BAILEY: Yes. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 4-13-09 101 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 2 approval. Question or discussion? 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The -- we just continue with 4 paying for it like we -- like we would if we were with 5 Odyssey? 6 MS. BAILEY: No. My understanding is that we 7 purchased the prosecutor program initially, and so we own 8 that part of it; that what we would have to pay for in the 9 future are updates and support for that package if we were to 10 keep using it. We're not going to use it, so we don't need 11 to update and support it, so I guess it just sits there 12 unused, but we save the $7,000 or $8,000 a year that they're 13 asking for for updates, and instead -- I don't know the exact 14 numbers, and, of course, we won't until she gets it designed, 15 but it's my understanding that we're talking more in the 16 nature of about $4,000 to design it, and maybe $1,000 or more 17 to maintain it annually. And, like I said, don't hold me to 18 those numbers, but that's kind of the range that we've talked 19 about. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, we're not going to pay 21 Odyssey on top of this? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. No, we're not. I'm 23 just a little bit unclear -- I'm certainly going to vote for 24 it, because that's the desire of elected official running his 25 office. I don't have any problem with that. I'm just not 4-13-09 102 1 real clear why we're not utilizing the program that's 2 available to us today. Can we talk about that? 3 MS. BAILEY: Well, we are utilizing it right now, 4 but as I said, it's -- it has some interface and user 5 difficulties, so that we've had to also -- I've actually 6 designed this additional sort of thing that we do over on the 7 side that uses Microsoft Word and Excel program to merge 8 data, so basically we're putting it into the prosecutor 9 program and then I'm retyping the stuff and putting it into 10 another thing that I've designed so that we can get done what 11 we need to have done. What Diana is going to do is create a 12 program that will do both of those things together, so we 13 only input data one time. And -- and it will -- it'll be 14 sort of integrated within the department. Now, whether or 15 not we can also find some way to automatically integrate that 16 with Odyssey, we may be able to. If not, we still have the 17 ability to create our documents and have them filed in the 18 clerk's office, and then from there, the regular Odyssey Case 19 Manager system will take over as it -- as it always has. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do you -- do y'all -- do 21 y'all communicate through Odyssey to -- I understand 216th 22 D.A.'s changing as well. 23 MS. BAILEY: They're actually using -- that's why 24 we got in touch with Diana; it's the same person. Their 25 system is a lot more complex than what we're asking her to 4-13-09 103 1 do, because they have four counties. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 3 MS. BAILEY: And they're trying to go paperless, 4 and so there's a -- a lot more layers of complexity of what 5 they're doing. But I saw what she had done for them, and I 6 think compared to what she's done for them, what we've asked 7 her to do is much simpler. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do you all communicate with 9 them, with 216th? Or any -- any of the -- 10 MS. BAILEY: Electronically, you mean, on this? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, uh-huh. 12 MS. BAILEY: No, not really. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. There's no transfer 14 of information or anything? 15 MS. BAILEY: No. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So we don't have to worry 17 about -- we don't have to worry about losing any kind of 18 communication with anybody -- 19 MS. BAILEY: No. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- by changing? 21 MS. BAILEY: But the fact -- I guess if there were 22 some need to create a communication, having the two systems 23 that are designed on the same base program, they're both 24 using access, it might enhance that if we had some need to do 25 that. 4-13-09 104 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, okay. Thank you very 2 much. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and a second. 4 Further question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, 5 signify by raising your right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carried. We'll go to Item 10 19; consider, discuss, approve the resolution for the 11 submission of a grant proposal to Meadows Foundation for 12 funding of Phase 1 of renovations to the Hill Country Youth 13 Exhibit Center as proposed in the 2008 Hill Country Youth 14 Exhibit Master Plan. Ms. Lavender? 15 MS. LAVENDER: Good morning. Back in February, 16 after the federal stimulus legislation was signed, you all 17 asked me to look at options that we could use for 18 particularly two of the projects, the repair of the dams and 19 the Youth Exhibit Center. Unfortunately, in the federal 20 stimulus money, I've just about jumped through every hoop I 21 know of to find money for both of them, and there's just not 22 anything available. The dams, we would have had to incur the 23 damage to the dams within the last two years to qualify for 24 any of the stimulus money, and there's simply nothing in the 25 federal stimulus that speaks to the Youth Exhibit Center. 4-13-09 105 1 Guy Overby came. We met, we sat through with Judge Tinley 2 the conference call with Lamar Smith, and then about two 3 weeks ago, I guess, sat through a presentation by Kay Bailey 4 Hutchison's staff on the federal stimulus program in here by 5 satellite, and -- or by computer or whatever, and neither one 6 of those produced anything that would key in on either the 7 dams or the Youth Exhibit Center. 8 The Meadows Foundation is an organization out of 9 Dallas that I believe you all are familiar with. A lot of 10 the funding that they provide is for youth-related, 11 child-related type projects. And I really think this is an 12 avenue that we need to explore. I have not called them and 13 talked to them, 'cause I wanted a little bit more direction 14 from you, whether you wanted to look at private funding. I 15 did prepare, and I think you have a copy of kind of a draft 16 proposal on the deal. The only question I have is -- is how 17 much do we want to ask for in this deal. But you've got some 18 critical needs out there at the facility that -- that we need 19 to start addressing one way or another. You've got too much 20 invested in it, and there's too many things going on out 21 there to not do something soon to upgrade the restrooms, make 22 it more accessible, and do some insulation that will provide 23 some energy efficiency, to upgrade the electrical and the 24 fire alarm system and everything out there that makes it a 25 safe, usable facility. And so that's what I've done, is put 4-13-09 106 1 together a proposal. I've talked with Peter Lewis. He 2 talked with Mike Lowe, got kind of an itemized budget 3 together with it. Jeannie has provided the audits that they 4 require, and I just need some guidance this morning on 5 whether you want to go forward with this or not, and if you 6 do, how much you want to ask for. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What is the size of their 8 grants, historically? I mean, are you able to look -- 9 MS. LAVENDER: Yeah, I looked historically at them, 10 and I didn't find anything in there over about a million and 11 a half. They do about 500, and have done about $560 million, 12 I think, statewide. About half of the grant money for 13 Meadows is done in the Dallas/Fort Worth area, because that's 14 their home base, but there are some organizations in the hill 15 country that have received funds from Meadows. And they're 16 interested, as I said, in things that are going to benefit 17 kids. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is it a -- I guess from a 19 dollar amount, this is probably the one that fits it the 20 best, as opposed to the new barn. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, the new hog barn 22 turnout's real bad. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Remind me of what Phase 1 24 is. Where'd I see that? 25 MS. LAVENDER: Okay. Phase 1 is renovating the 4-13-09 107 1 existing indoor arena and storage, repairing the roof and 2 skylights, a 6-inch foil insulation with piano wire. That's 3 insulating the inside of the barn, upgrading the restrooms, 4 which I think we all agree needs to be done, ventilation, 5 electrical, renovating the pens, new fire protection 6 underground, new fire protection system itself, trim on the 7 building, and replacing all the existing lighting. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, every bit of it directly 9 related to the stock show. Kids. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. It's all the arena, 11 redoing the big arena. 12 MS. LAVENDER: And the safety of kids that they 13 have and 4-H, and, -- 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 15 MS. LAVENDER: -- you know, all of those things 16 that go on out there. I think upgrading the restrooms and -- 17 and that area -- 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Everything that doesn't 19 interfere with Phase 2. 20 MS. LAVENDER: Right. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Phase 2 is the barn, and Phase 22 3 is the -- 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Exhibit Hall. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- Exhibit Hall. 25 MS. LAVENDER: Exhibit Hall. And I think with what 4-13-09 108 1 the City's planning to do downtown, there may be a time that 2 we may need to go back and reflect back on maybe Phase 2 and 3 3. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, we're just dealing 5 with -- 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Phase 2 is just a barn. 7 MS. LAVENDER: Right. Phase 3 -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Phase 1 and 2's -- 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And this was something -- 10 what was the figure on that? 900? 11 MS. LAVENDER: 886,500, I think. You have 25,000 12 in this year's budget that was set aside for, I think, 13 renovations, but I think we just need -- if you wouldn't -- 14 we need to decide, number one, if we want to pursue it; 15 number two, what kind of money figure we want to give to 16 them. I think in the current economic environment, 17 everybody's trying to go for grants from private foundations 18 right now if they don't fit into this economic stimulus plan, 19 so I don't know how successful we'll be or whatever, but -- 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do they give -- 21 MS. LAVENDER: Go ahead. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do they give additional credit 23 in the application for part funding internally or locally? 24 MS. LAVENDER: You know, I don't know. I really 25 don't know about that. A lot of private foundations do. 4-13-09 109 1 They do a lot of matching grants. And I think until they 2 look at what we're offering them, I hesitate to say what they 3 would do. A lot of times they send people to the location to 4 look at the facility and that sort of stuff before they make 5 a decision. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 'Cause, like you said, there's 7 25,000 -- there's actually 500,000. 8 MS. LAVENDER: Right. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That, you know, could be used 10 for a -- a partial match. I mean, I think it just makes 11 sense. I think the -- this phase and the phase of the new 12 barn are the two things we need to get done first. This is 13 probably -- I would think would probably suit the Meadows 14 better, the little I know about that organization. 15 MS. LAVENDER: Rather than -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Than the new barn. Because 17 we're -- and I think that we just need to kind of earmark 18 some sort of a match if required. Yeah, I'm in favor of it. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I am too. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: It occurs to me that after the 21 review is when the discussion of match might come up, and 22 then a decision could be made then if they're looking at it 23 favorably. 24 MS. LAVENDER: Yeah. I think in the application, 25 there's a little clause in there about if you've already 4-13-09 110 1 secured matching funds or whatever. And I think if we're 2 talking about using some of this existing money, I think we 3 ought to be up front with them and say, "This is what we're 4 going to -- we're going to ask for to match our existing 5 funds." Whatever -- 350,000 or whatever you're looking for. 6 I think you need to fix an amount that you're going to ask 7 them for, rather than see how much they'll give us and then 8 us come back and say, "Well, we'll put this much in." 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd probably put -- I would 10 spend, you know, maybe -- to me, half of the 500 on this 11 phase, and half of the -- of the 500 for the other -- for 12 Phase 2, or -- or somehow break it out. I wouldn't want to 13 put all 500,000 on Phase 1. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You mean apply for 250,000? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Or 200,000 or something like 16 that. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we have how much? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 500,000. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 500,000. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: I think the second phase is probably 21 going to have more expense allocated to it. If you're going 22 to pro rata, we're looking at probably somewhere in the 23 neighborhood of 150, 175, in that area. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 150, then, allocated. Then 25 it's also a little bit negotiable, so we have $100,000 4-13-09 111 1 that -- 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I like the 886 that we need. 3 Is that what you're -- 4 MS. LAVENDER: So, say that we have 150 allocated 5 for it. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: For part of it. 7 MS. LAVENDER: And we're asking for? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: The difference. 9 MS. LAVENDER: The difference. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Between -- between the 886 11 and the 150. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 886 was a reasonably solid 13 number? 14 MS. LAVENDER: It was as of November of 2008 when I 15 talked to Peter Lewis, and he talked to Mike Lowe. They said 16 we were still pretty close. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And some -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: We've got to furnish that info. 19 MS. LAVENDER: Right. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Some of the material costs 21 are starting to come down just a little bit, so we're 22 probably still in the ballpark. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But it's a good time to go 24 right now. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It is, real good time. 4-13-09 112 1 MS. LAVENDER: Okay. Then -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It seems to me that Phase 1 3 is the one that is really -- really geared toward the youth 4 of the community. 5 MS. LAVENDER: The youth programs. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Health and safety and the 7 welfare of the youth of our community. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Health and safety is very 9 important. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Texas hill country. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: All of it's important, but we 12 got to start somewhere. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. I make a motion that -- 14 what are we doing, approve the resolution? 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Approve the resolution for the 17 grant for the Meadows Foundation for funding of Phase 1 18 renovations at Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center, and 19 allocate 150,000 of the current amount that we've budgeted. 20 MS. LAVENDER: And ask for the balance of it? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Budgeted, and ask for the 22 balance. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 25 indicated. Question or discussion on that motion? All in 4-13-09 113 1 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 2 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 4 (No response.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 6 MS. LAVENDER: Thank you. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move to Item 20; consider, 8 discuss, and take appropriate action to set date to evaluate 9 employees of the Commissioners Court. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Commissioner Baldwin. Thank 11 you, Judge. I've got -- I've got to do it all up here. I 12 don't have a big speech written out on this thing at all. I 13 simply want to set a date to do our evaluations. It's not 14 a -- I don't think there's any magic here. Just let's set a 15 date. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Do you think that's more 17 appropriately done in a -- in a special meeting type deal, as 18 opposed to a -- for that specific purpose, as opposed to in 19 connection with one of our regular meetings? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't know that it makes 21 any difference to me at all. The way I had it pictured in my 22 mind was that, you know, we had these regular meetings, like, 23 here in the morning, and then maybe come back after lunch and 24 have that as a separate -- total separate item. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: There is a little 4-13-09 114 1 preliminary work that has to get done before we actually do 2 it. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm not opposed to setting 5 a date, but Ms. Hyde and I have been playing cat and mouse 6 trying to get together to work out the criteria for the 7 evaluations, and we need to have the Court's approval of the 8 criteria and then move on with it. 9 MS. HYDE: I think there's enough for everybody. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I guess you came prepared 11 to talk about it. 12 MS. HYDE: Not much. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't want her to talk 14 about it. I want to set the date on this thing. That's all 15 the hell I want to do, is set the date on this thing. I 16 don't want to get into this. This can come later on. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is this a date to do it or a 19 date to do it by? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: A day -- an actual date to 21 sit down and do it, that we've been talking about. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How about at our second meeting 23 in May? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm there. Count me in. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's a good time. That's 4-13-09 115 1 prior to budget time. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Prior to budget. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. That's what this is 4 all about, in my mind. Somehow we've got to fit all that in 5 to know how to budget. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 25th of May. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: At 1 o'clock? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I just have it 9 pictured in my mind working that way. I wouldn't want to set 10 it in the morning. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How about 1:30? 1:30, or do a 12 special meeting, either one, but do that it week. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's fine. That tells 14 Ms. Hyde and I we need to get together and get this done. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, 1:30 on May 25. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. Have I told 17 y'all how nice you are and how kind you are? 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, after you just chewed 19 us out. Does that require a second? If so, I second it. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't know that we need 21 a -- need a court order. I don't know. Do we need a court 22 order to set a -- 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- this kind of thing? I 25 don't see it. 4-13-09 116 1 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think so. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're big old boys, and we 3 can just by gosh go do it. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do it. Okay. Ms. Hyde, 5 you and I can get together on this when you're -- 6 JUDGE TINLEY: But no more hollering, okay? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No more hollering. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Let's go to Item 21; 9 consider, discuss, and take appropriate action in support of 10 former Texas Ranger Foundation vision of the Ranger History 11 and Education Center to be located in Kerrville, Texas. I 12 put this on the agenda at the request of the Rangers -- 13 actually, in support of KEDF, and that we do a companion 14 resolution to one that KEDF passed earlier; actually, it was 15 last week, in support of the vision of having that History 16 and Education Center, and two, and probably most importantly, 17 that it be located right here in Kerrville, Texas. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is there some question 19 about that? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: There -- there have been -- there 21 have been some that have suggested that maybe they need to go 22 somewhere else. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, really? 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Shame on them. 4-13-09 117 1 JUDGE TINLEY: And maybe offering some incentives 2 to do so. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think maybe this is the 5 24th time we've done this, but I'd be happy to do it again. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Was that a motion? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's a motion. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second -- third. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second. 12 Question or discussion on the motion? All in favor of the 13 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's move 18 to Item 22; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action on 19 resolution regarding applying for funding under the U.S. 20 Department of Justice Recovery Act Assistance to Rural Law 21 Enforcement to Combat Crime and Drugs to purchase AFIS 22 tracker for our electronic fingerprint machine. Do you have 23 the acronym for that? 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: AFIS is Automated Fingerprint 25 Identification System. 4-13-09 118 1 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm talking about the U.S. 2 Department of -- 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's the way it's spelled 4 out. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Huh? 6 THE WITNESS: That's the way it's spelled out. No 7 acronym; that's it. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I was wondering when the 9 Sheriff was going to show up. 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's all part of the stimulus 11 stuff that's going around. You have to have a population of 12 below 50,000, or gotten less than $50,000 for their -- under 13 their last -- under that rural grant that we automatically 14 get, which was like 13,000. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, what do you do with this 16 thing -- machine you want? 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The machine is an Automated 18 Fingerprint Identification System. Part of it's portable. 19 Part of it's a database to where, instead of having to submit 20 latent prints that we lift at a crime scene to figure out, 21 you know, who our burglar suspect might be, it will create 22 our own database in conjunction with all the surrounding 23 counties, and both the 216th and 198th District. So, it will 24 encompass eight counties and put all that into one local 25 database to search for our crooks or to identify unidentified 4-13-09 119 1 people out on the highway. You have somebody stopped, and if 2 they're in the local system, they can have a portable deal 3 that would identify them. Tried to get this several years 4 ago, but -- and -- and what we're asking is permission to 5 apply for the grant. Now, the grant -- understand, the 6 stimulus stuff is geared more for hiring employees, which 7 it's a separate part of that grant. We're not going for 8 employees, so I don't know what our outcome would be, but I 9 would like to apply for the grant for the equipment, since it 10 does cover it. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Does this machine work with 12 that high-dollar machine we bought for you a couple years 13 ago? 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That high-dollar machine you 15 bought for us a couple years ago is a piece of junk, and it's 16 standing in a corner not used, because it was totally 17 outdated, and D.P.S. out of Austin came in and replaced them 18 all. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So we have a new machine that 20 D.P.S. gave us? 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's right. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Move approval. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But they just changed it. 24 System is no good any more. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You recommended we buy a piece 4-13-09 120 1 of junk, is what you're telling me. 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No. At the time, it was 3 top-dollar. It's a computer. Ask Trolinger; in two years, 4 it all went and changed. We begged and borrowed from one 5 county that didn't want it -- 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I second the motion. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 8 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 9 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 12 (No response.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carried. 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You asked. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: He hasn't had a chance to 16 talk all day, so he -- 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Like winding an 8-day clock, isn't 18 it? 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Boy, I'll tell you. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anything to go into executive 21 session, gentlemen? If not, we'll move on with Section 4 of 22 the agenda. Payment of the bills. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move we pay the bills. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to pay the 4-13-09 121 1 bills. Any questions or discussion? Mr. Trolinger? 2 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir? 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Moonblink, $4,500, is that to bounce 4 off of the water tower? 5 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I was going to ask about 8 that. 9 MR. TROLINGER: Sheriff's Office is online; it 10 works great. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Moonbeam or whatever it is? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Moonblink. 13 MR. TROLINGER: Moonblink. It's the name of the 14 company, the vendor. They had the lowest price for the 15 equipment. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Page 3 -- 17 MS. HARGIS: Want to see it? I knew you were going 18 to ask. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Page 3, we've got the 216th 20 reporting a whole bunch of special court reporter bills. My 21 question, I guess, is does that relate to all this jail 22 cleanout that we're doing? 23 MS. HARGIS: Now, I don't know. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did you say 216th? 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that's on -- pretty sure it's 4-13-09 122 1 216th. 2 MS. HARGIS: On Page 3. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, Page 3, about the middle of 4 the page, at the tail end of 216th. 5 MS. HARGIS: It's my understanding we were kind of 6 also late in getting a lot of these bills. They're all just 7 now coming in because of all this -- of these catch-up 8 trials. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, there are some dates, 10 3/16&18/09, 3/17/09, 3/19-20/09. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: There hasn't been that many 12 from the jail, Judge. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Huh? 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: There hasn't been that many 15 from the jail. I don't know. It's not the -- 16 MS. HARGIS: These are just some -- these are just 17 the -- you know, they've got a lot of trials going on. 18 They're using Judge Ables, and I think this -- this is to 19 clean the docket, not in your area. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: They've been working at it. A 21 lot of times when they've had district court, they've been 22 running both courts at one time. Doesn't necessarily have 23 anything to do with it, but it does that. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: So that's not necessarily relevant 25 to paying that in order to help reduce our cost out at the 4-13-09 123 1 jail. 2 MS. HARGIS: No. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 4 MS. HARGIS: You do have one from him, but -- but 5 that's all. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any other questions? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, what about -- what 8 about -- go up a couple of steps up there. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm going to let you do that, 10 Buster. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mr. Cavazos. Let's see. He 12 has two bills here for 759 and 213. What are those for? 13 MS. HARGIS: Those are for the courts that he did 14 do this last month. He did a little bit in February, and 15 that first bill we got was for the last two weeks in 16 February. This is for March. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: For -- I mean, what is he 18 doing? 19 MS. HARGIS: He's going out to the jail. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Mr. Cavazos is going out to 21 the jail; he's getting reports every day and trying to 22 organize things with some of the defense attorneys to move 23 them. He is -- he's putting in the legwork. Some are 24 refusing to plead. Some are going to plead, but he is doing 25 a lot of the legwork. 4-13-09 124 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Last -- last pay period we 2 paid him a thousand, and that was also for the jail. 3 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 100 percent of that was done 5 for the jail? Rusty's shaking his head no. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The last thousand, I didn't -- 7 I don't believe that a lot of that was for the jail. I don't 8 know. 9 MS. HARGIS: Yes. We would -- 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: A lot may have been behind the 11 scenes, but we had not pled anything out in that jail docket 12 on that last thousand since that time till now. Yes, I'd say 13 this is -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Buster, I think the ones that you're 15 looking at there are some work that he did in representing 16 indigent defendants in particular cases. His prosecution 17 billing comes on Page 1 under Nondepartmental. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: His prosecution billing? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Comes on Page 1? 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, Nondepartmental, towards the 22 bottom of the page, $2,500. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, that's jail stuff? 24 JUDGE TINLEY: That's the jail stuff. 25 MS. HARGIS: But he's also an indigent defense 4-13-09 125 1 attorney. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And so -- okay. Now -- and 3 that's great. I'm glad. I really like the guy; he's a nice 4 guy. We're not paying him to do indigent work or any of 5 those other kinds of work out of this fund that we have set 6 up for the jail? 7 MS. HARGIS: No. No, he gets -- a separate bill 8 from that comes from Bruce. This actually comes from his law 9 firm. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, thank you. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me look at this just 13 real quickly. 14 MS. HARGIS: You do have two packets this time. 15 One, the -- the new -- the packet that you -- the larger 16 packet is the one you've been used to. That's still our -- 17 the payables as we've done them in the past. The second 18 packet is those -- those folks that are on the payable 19 systems now. We do have five offices; we're going to put 20 five more on tomorrow. They've worked very well. 21 Everybody's excited about getting on, and so far, so good. 22 But we have -- we've got a little problem with reports, so 23 we're going to have to work it out with Incode. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Other questions? Comments? 25 THE CLERK: We have a motion and a second. 4-13-09 126 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion, signify 2 by raising your right hand. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 5 (No response.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Budget 7 amendments. Auditor's presented approximately 20 different 8 budget amendments for various departments. Any questions? 9 Comments? 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Move approval of the summary of the 12 budget amendments as reflected on the summary? 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: And a second. Question or 17 discussion on the motion? 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Under Number 5, those appear to be 19 within the same budget, but they appear to be out of two 20 different accounts. 21 MS. HARGIS: When we split the -- the employee, we 22 didn't put the group insurance for -- we put it all in one 23 spot instead of putting it in half-and-half. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, okay. Okay. 25 MS. HARGIS: So that was just a mistake. 4-13-09 127 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That's an administrative type thing. 2 MS. HARGIS: It's not -- we're not actually adding 3 any money. We're just moving it back to the line item where 4 it's being charged. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. Any other questions or 6 comments? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 7 your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Do we have 12 any late bills? 13 MS. HARGIS: No. No, sir, we do not. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I've been presented with 15 monthly reports from Constable Precinct 1, Constable Precinct 16 4, J.P. Precinct 3, J.P. Precinct 4, J.P. Precinct 2, J.P. 17 Precinct 1, Road and Bridge, Environmental Health, and County 18 Clerk. Do I hear a motion that those reports be approved as 19 presented? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved -- second. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 23 approval of the reports as presented. Question or discussion 24 on the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by 25 raising your right hand. 4-13-09 128 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's go to 5 Section 5, reports from Commissioners in connection with 6 their liaison assignments. Commissioner Williams? 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just a couple items, Judge. 8 I'd like to commend Rosa again for her -- Ms. Lavender again 9 for her application that went to AACOG for the Criminal 10 Justice General Victims Assistance Grant, and note that the 11 competition was kind of steep this time -- kind of stiff this 12 time. And while we were among the leaders, the top one was a 13 91.88 score, and Rosa's score was 89.81, and from there it 14 really got -- really got close. Comal County was the same 15 score as ours. Hill Country Crisis Council came in 18 16 hundredths of a percentage below that. Seton Home out of 17 wherever came, you know, very close under that. And the 18 lower score that has any consequence to us was Bexar County 19 at 89. And after that, they all got considerably higher. 20 But, anyhow, she did a fine job and has been -- been approved 21 for funding. The other thing I wanted to call to the Court's 22 attention is the unemployment rates. The ones I got through 23 February reflect that for the entire region, Kerr County is 24 at a 5.3 percent unemployment rate through February of '09. 25 And of the 11 counties that surround Bexar County, we're in 4-13-09 129 1 the -- we're in the top tier in terms of less unemployment. 2 The leader would be Gillespie County at 4 percent. Kendall 3 County's at 5 percent unemployment, and we are at 5.3. At 4 the lower end of the scale, you have Frio County, Karnes 5 County, and Atascosa County, all in the 7 and high 6 range. 6 And so we're doing pretty well. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything further? 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, sir. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Letz? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just a little follow-up to 11 that. I think that we tend to forget how well we're 12 weathering the recession, depression, whatever you want to 13 call it. I did a lot of talking with some friends of mine in 14 North Carolina, Charlotte area specifically, and they're 15 talking about 15 percent unemployment, and across the whole 16 spectrum of employees, low end to the high end. And it kind 17 of -- and their -- their housing has gone down 40 percent. 18 Anyway, you hear stories from some of the other parts of the 19 country that, you know, we've been very, very fortunate. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We have. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And hope that continues. My 22 other comment is -- I guess I'm wearing kind of my Region J 23 hat, or some kind of hat that I'm wearing. I'm going to be 24 speaking with a group that Buster got me convinced to talk to 25 on Friday in Austin. I'm on a panel with -- discussion with 4-13-09 130 1 the -- myself, the attorney for the Sierra Club for the state 2 of Texas, the Environmental Defense Fund's attorney, and some 3 guy out of the Bay Area Water District out of California, 4 which is San Francisco. So, I figure that I was -- 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Buster, you're a real friend, 6 aren't you? (Laughter.) 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're walking in high 8 cotton, aren't you? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I figure I'm the sacrificial 10 conservative in this group going in. But, anyway, it'll be 11 interesting. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Better he than me. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think you'll need body 14 armor when you go to that group. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: At least get all your shots 16 before you go. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, get your shots. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I was told this is a good 19 opportunity to tell me how the real world looks at things. 20 Anyway, it'll be fine, I'm sure. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Goodness. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that it? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's it. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Oehler? 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh, not a whole lot, other 4-13-09 131 1 than the fact that I've been working with some landowners 2 that we need to acquire a little bit of right-of-way for a 3 couple bridge projects, and -- and that requires a fair 4 amount of time and some patience. I think it's going to 5 happen without too much difficulty. And those, when they get 6 funded, will be built. They'll be ready to go. One of them 7 will be in -- one's at Camp Arrowhead, which is a problem on 8 the Arrowhead side with a family feud that's going on about 9 the right-of-way on their side, which they -- neither one 10 would gladly give up normally, and the other one is Hoot Owl 11 Hollow. We're still trying to determine exactly where the 12 right-of-way is that we need to acquire because of some no 13 man's land there. So, anyway, that's what I've been doing, 14 along with checking on the other bridge projects. Doing 15 well, Panther Creek, both Smith Crossings. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that it? 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's enough. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Good enough. Commissioner Baldwin? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. Nothing, thank you. 20 Thank you for the opportunity. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Could you possibly investigate some 22 method by which we could get recompensed for our valuable 23 information that we're going to provide to the census people? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I will be happy to ask the 25 question. But I don't think that it's my position to lean on 4-13-09 132 1 the federal government or anybody like that. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good decision. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Actually, I'm grateful that 4 we're not getting a bunch of stimulus money; I really am. 5 I'm with Pinky Brown on this thing. I don't want them owning 6 my courthouse and telling us how to run this thing. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Get enough of that already. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thus far we got zero. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Batting pretty good 11 here. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, we're doing exactly what Pinky 13 would want us to do, I think. Okay. Do we have any reports 14 from elected officials? Department heads? The Sheriff is 15 remaining seated. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, wow. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Miracles. We still have 18 miracles. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Let's go. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anything further? We'll be 21 adjourned. 22 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 12:03 p.m.) 23 - - - - - - - - - - 24 25 4-13-09 133 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 17th day of April, 2009. 8 9 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 10 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 11 Certified Shorthand Reporter 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 4-13-09