1 2 3 4 5 6 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 7 Special Session 8 Tuesday, June 9, 2009 9 1:30 p.m. 10 Commissioners' Courtroom 11 Kerr County Courthouse 12 Kerrville, Texas 13 14 15 16 17 18 Evaluation of Commissioners Court Employees 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge 24 H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 25 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 On Tuesday, June 9, 2009, at 1:30 p.m., a special 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let me call to order this 8 special meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court 9 scheduled for this time and date, Tuesday, June 9, 2009, at 10 1:30 p.m. It is that time now, or a bit past it. The agenda 11 item for today is to consider, discuss, and take appropriate 12 action on evaluation of employees that report directly to the 13 Commissioners Court. We have a schedule of individuals that 14 we've got on a timed basis in alphabetical order that we're 15 going to be working with. Before we go into executive 16 session to work on an individual basis, does any member of 17 the Court have anything they wish to offer on a general basis 18 concerning the evaluation process? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Not I. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Want to talk about the City? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: No, I don't think so. I would like 23 to offer some general comments, and I've got my yellow pad 24 over here, Buster. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, y'all get a pillow. 6-9-09 3 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: In trouble now. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- the departments that have 3 some sort of an enforcement function, I think, are the ones 4 that -- that those of us here on the Court probably hear 5 about the most, because those are the ones that the public 6 gets into conflict with. And so, as a consequence, when it 7 comes to the negativity that we receive here on the Court, I 8 suspect, in large measure, it's because of those that do have 9 an enforcement authority. Environmental Health, Animal 10 Control, those are the primary ones that -- that we hear from 11 the most. I think -- I think it behooves us to -- to 12 ascertain that those departments that have an enforcement 13 authority be absolutely certain in exercising that authority 14 that whenever they act, they act within the authority granted 15 to them, and -- and not exceeding the limitations placed on 16 that authority. That -- that avoids complaints. That avoids 17 liability problems. It avoids us on the Court having to 18 spend a lot of time dealing with those issues. 19 That's not to say that we won't have to deal with 20 them, because we will. There will be complaints. The 21 complaints will be that they exceeded their authority or they 22 were somehow abusive in exercising their authority. So, I 23 guess my general suggestion would be that those departments 24 that have enforcement authority, if there is any question at 25 any time about whether they're acting within their authority, 6-9-09 4 1 that if at all possible, they defer, get the County 2 Attorney's opinion, find out that they're on good footing, so 3 that the end result is that -- that the public that we deal 4 with has -- has a confident feeling that we're -- that we're 5 operating within the law, that we're credible, we operate 6 with integrity. And I know this -- I know this is very 7 important, and I would urge that that happen. 8 Another couple of comments I'd like to make deal 9 with just the general overall dealing with the public. One 10 is public information. Oftentimes we're asked about 11 information that we may have in our possession, and we start 12 out with the assumption that every bit of information that we 13 have in our possession is, in fact, public information, 14 unless it's specifically exempted or excluded by law as being 15 confidential. I've said on a number of occasions, and I 16 would like it to be -- it's my policy, whether it's 17 officially adopted by anybody else on the Court, that if I'm 18 asked about an approach to public information, do not require 19 anybody to file a formal request for public information. 20 There's only one way you can be in violation of the act, and 21 that's if, in fact, they file the request under the act and 22 you don't respond to it appropriately. If they never file 23 that request, if you never put them in a position to have to 24 file that request, you're safe. 25 If you're asked for information, you have it 6-9-09 5 1 available to you, and it's clearly public information, 2 provide it to them. Simple. Don't get into hassles about, 3 "Well, you'll have to put that in writing." Don't get into 4 hassles about, "Well, I'll have to see what that costs." If 5 it's just a few pages that you made copies of, you don't have 6 to generate and create information; it's what you have in 7 your possession or subject to your control. Don't get into 8 hassles about cost. If it's several pages, provide it. 9 They've already paid for it; they're taxpayers. Now, if 10 we're talking about 60, 100 pages and whatnot, just sit down 11 with them and say, you know, "This is more than ordinary. 12 We're going to have to figure out a reasonable cost," and get 13 the right guidance on that. Electronic information, e-mails, 14 that is public information. Be very careful what you put in 15 your e-mails. The public has a right to that, the same as 16 letters, correspondence passing back and forth between you 17 and others that relate to local government business. 18 Another thing, if you wouldn't stand within arm's 19 reach of that individual, person-to-person and 20 eyeball-to-eyeball, and say the same thing to them in that 21 context, don't put it in an e-mail. Don't get 10 foot tall, 22 bulletproof, and put it in an e-mail. Treat them just like 23 you were talking eyeball-to-eyeball with them, and I think 24 that'll -- that'll serve you well. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, can I make -- make one 6-9-09 6 1 little comment there? 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd just -- I'd go even further 4 than e-mail. I wouldn't necessarily even say in writing what 5 you would say in person. To me, assume that everyone in the 6 world is going to read that e-mail, 'cause they probably 7 will, especially if you say something you shouldn't say. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Dang. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, it's -- you can get in 11 trouble with e-mails. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Absolutely. I mean, they're there, 13 and it's part -- and be very careful; don't delete e-mails. 14 Don't say, "Oh, my goodness, I wish I wouldn't have said 15 that." Click. Now, if you haven't already sent it, if it 16 hasn't become part of the domain and you're still in the 17 process of drafting it, that's fine. But once it happens, it 18 happens. Don't delete it. That'll get you in big-time 19 problems. I could -- I could refer you to -- what's his 20 name? -- Chuck Rosenthal, the D.A. down in Harris County; he 21 might have a few comments about e-mails. The other general 22 thing I'd like to mention is, I see a lot of situations where 23 we get so many good things done where we operate as a 24 cohesive team, and be mindful that you are one spoke or 25 several spokes in a great big wheel, and it takes that entire 6-9-09 7 1 wheel for this government to keep rolling. Concentrate on 2 the team effort, the cohesiveness. Be mindful of other folks 3 that are involved in a given situation, a given problem, a 4 given solution. Get a team spirit and make it a team effort. 5 And I think if -- if all of us will adopt that attitude, 6 we'll be a whole lot better off and we'll get a whole lot 7 better results, and we'll get them in a more efficient 8 manner. Okay, I'm -- I'm off my soapbox now. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's a lot. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't have any of my yellow pad 11 left. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do you want me to teach them 13 how to sing the Tivy Fight song? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: That would be helpful. Yes, it 15 would. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We'll do that next time 17 around, 'cause I know it. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. I'm off my soapbox for 19 now. Anybody got anything? 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. I have a question. I 21 think it was a good -- I think a lot of times we don't think 22 about that county employees other than elected officials are 23 also subject to the open records. I mean, we -- we get -- 24 the five of us get it drilled into our heads on a regular 25 basis. I think it is good to bring it up. And, Eva, I 6-9-09 8 1 presume -- or hopefully we have that in our packet when we -- 2 for new employees? 3 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It is? Good. 'Cause you can 5 get in lots of trouble over open records, not providing that 6 stuff, and it's very important. That's it. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Are we ready to go into 8 executive session to do a one-on-one? Okay. At this time, 9 it is 1:43, and we will go into -- we will go out of closed 10 or open -- excuse me, public or open session to go into 11 executive or closed session. 12 (The open session was closed at 1:43 p.m., and an executive session was held, the transcript of which 13 is contained in a separate document.) 14 - - - - - - - - - - 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We're back in open or public 16 session. It is 5:22, it looks like. Any member of the Court 17 have anything to offer with respect to what was considered in 18 closed or executive session? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I'd like to make a 20 comment. Everybody at this -- on this Commissioners Court 21 has been here a long time. I don't mean today, but I mean in 22 years of service. And, as a matter of fact, you know, if you 23 go throughout the state, which I have numerous times, and 24 visited commissioners courts all over the state, this Court 25 is probably as stable, mentally -- 6-9-09 9 1 MS. LAVENDER: Let's take a vote on that. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Or second opinion? 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Digging a hole. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, this is my opinion. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I mean, by gosh, it's mine. 7 Actually, it's my fantasy. But these guys have been here a 8 long time, and they understand county government. They 9 understand business, and some of them understand big 10 business. And in the years that I've been here, and the 11 struggles and all the sometimes ugliness that we've been 12 through through the years, I've got to say that this is -- 13 we're in the best condition of anybody in this entire state 14 of Texas, and that covers all departments. Everybody from 15 yours to yours to yours to yours and yours, everything that 16 we do in this county is above and beyond the call of duty. 17 It's top of the line. It is the best you can -- the best 18 I've seen anywhere. A lot of counties across the state talk 19 about us -- talk about Kerr County and how it functions, and 20 it's all because of you guys and how you do your job. And I 21 think that what it is, is that -- is that you love your jobs 22 and you're committed to making Kerr County and your job the 23 best it can possibly be. And I, for one, say thank you, 24 guys, very much for that. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We've been here long this 6-9-09 10 1 afternoon, long afternoon. Most of you were sitting out 2 there wondering what those guys in there are going to say, 3 and we've been here listening and talking and so forth. The 4 bottom line is, I want to thank you for your service, all of 5 you. And I want to thank you for doing what you do with our 6 employees. We have a good group of employees, and if we 7 didn't have a good group of employees, we'd all hear about 8 it, or hear about the transgressions or hear about the 9 attitude or whatever, and we're not hearing that. And that 10 says a lot for our employee group, and says a whole lot for 11 you, and we appreciate that. Appreciate your service. If we 12 were harsh in some cases, it's because these are some of the 13 things we observe or heard or know about, and we only put it 14 out there for you, for your benefit, to help you improve. 15 One last caveat. Ms. Hyde and I talked just a moment or two 16 during or break, and for the benefit of the Court, we're 17 going to -- she and I will get together in about a week or so 18 and take a look at this process to see whether or not the 19 process was good. I'm asking members of the Court to tell 20 me, if you will, or the Judge, if you think there are ways we 21 can improve it. And if any of you think that there's some 22 ways we can improve the review process, that's something 23 we're going to do every year. We want to make it fair. To 24 use the words of Fox, want to be fair and balanced. Good 25 night. 6-9-09 11 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good night. Yeah. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Like the other two, I really 3 appreciate all y'all. Y'all all have a tough task, as you 4 have five bosses, and we all have different idiosyncrasies 5 and different demands and different ways of looking at 6 things, and so y'all do have a tough road right there, and I 7 appreciate it. I think we're very fortunate to have a really 8 good group of department heads, being y'all, and you've 9 accomplished, you know, the vision I think that we tried to 10 set. And y'all are doing a really good job. Thank y'all. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I have to say the same -- 12 pretty much the same thing. This is -- my time here some 13 years ago was not nearly as pleasant as it has been this 14 time. There've been a lot of good changes made and a lot of 15 good people hired, and they're sitting in this room. And 16 y'all have hired some good people to help you, and that 17 really makes a difference, because I don't catch the flak in 18 public that I caught years ago. It's more pleasant now, and 19 I tell people all the time, this is the best staff, top to 20 bottom, Kerr County's ever had, and we thank y'all for being 21 a part of it. And whatever we can do to make this process 22 better, we need to do. And we hope we've been fair with 23 everybody. I think we have. And I -- I don't think you'd be 24 in here now listening to us talk a little more if we didn't 25 feel good about it. That's it. 6-9-09 12 1 JUDGE TINLEY: I -- I think Commissioner Baldwin 2 felt somewhat enabled -- brave, as it were -- making his 3 comments about the mental ability, knowing that the next 4 mental health hearings are a good week away, since they were 5 just held this morning. I think he expects that I'll forget 6 about it by that time. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I do. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: He keeps talking to me about my 9 aging process. I want you to keep thinking "team." 10 Cooperative team. This whole thing runs as efficiently as it 11 does. I've seen -- you know, I'm as short a timer as there 12 is here at this table, and I've been here, what, six and a 13 half years, I guess. But I have seen -- I've seen a lot of 14 positive results because of the cooperative effort of the 15 employees and departments working together as a team, and I 16 think that's where you gain your efficiencies and your 17 productivity, and when that goes up, our problems go down. 18 The complaints go down. You don't hear the complaints out in 19 the public. We don't -- our phone doesn't ring here. We 20 hear -- I hear positive things every single day out in public 21 about -- probably the most common thing I hear is, "I don't 22 hear anything; that tells me everything's getting along just 23 fine down there." And, "No news is good news." And that's 24 not literally always the case, but that's the public 25 perception, and perception is everything. 6-9-09 13 1 I encourage people every time I'm out in the 2 public, if they got some ideas, some suggestions, some 3 complaints, some thoughts, pass them on to us. We want to 4 know what the public's thinking. And I assure you, if they 5 thought there was some improvement that could be made by 6 virtue of what they know, what they hear, what they see, 7 they'll sure as the dickens tell you. They will let you 8 know, because you work for them, and they're going to let you 9 know that. And we're pretty fortunate. We don't hear -- we 10 don't hear a whole lot. Most of what we hear is positive. 11 Occasionally we get a positive suggestion. We kick it 12 around. If it is a good one, we implement it and go on down 13 the road. But it works because you folks and those in your 14 departments work together as a team with the other 15 departments and the elected officials that are elected to run 16 them. Thank you. Just keep up the good work. Anything 17 else, gentlemen? Any of you guys got any comments for us? 18 Any more comments for us? 19 MS. HYDE: 9 a.m. tomorrow morning, policy book, 20 Jury Room 2. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Jury Room 2? 22 MS. HYDE: Jury Room 2. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Going to be working mainly initially 24 on vacations, sick leave -- 25 MS. HYDE: The four sections that are left. If 6-9-09 14 1 they have any other issues -- 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Homework tonight. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You can take my packet when you 4 leave so it can all be disposed of. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? We'll be adjourned. 6 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 5:31 p.m.) 7 - - - - - - - - - - 8 9 10 11 STATE OF TEXAS | 12 COUNTY OF KERR | 13 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 14 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 15 County Clerk of the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 16 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 17 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 10th day of June, 2009. 18 19 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 20 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 21 Certified Shorthand Reporter 22 23 24 25 6-9-09