1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Special Session 10 Monday, March 22, 2010 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X March 22, 2010 2 PAGE --- Visitors' input 6 3 --- Commissioners' comments 7 4 1.1 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve purchase of software license upgrade 5 for QuickBooks using past year's computer software capital monies 11 6 1.2 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve new telephone system service for the 7 county courthouse 13 1.3 Consider/discuss, take appropriate for approval 8 of new broadband services and authorize County Judge to sign same 24 9 1.8 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to authorize reimbursement for sums paid for county 10 debris placed at local landfill by Community Service Infusion (CSI) teams and volunteers on 11 CSI work day scheduled for March 27, 2010 32 1.4 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for 12 approval of regional Video Teleconference system grant application; authorize County Judge to sign 35 13 1.10 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on recommendation of Economic Development Task Force 40 14 1.11 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to designate board member to represent Kerr County 15 on KEDF Board of Directors pursuant to recom- mendations of Economic Development Task Force 58 16 1.12 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to award annual material bids for road base, cold mix, 17 aggregate, emulsion oil, & corrugated metal pipe 60 1.13 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 18 amend the contract with Tetra Tech, Inc., to accommodate revised Scope of Work for engineering 19 services relating to Kerrville South Wastewater Project, Ranchero Road elements 62 20 1.5 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on reducing registration fee to $1 for rabies clinic 21 at Doyle Community Center on April 10, 2010 72 1.6 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 22 allocate funding from 2007 or 2010 capital funds and approve air duct cleaning of courthouse & jail 74 23 1.7 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on problems associated with new telephone system 77 24 1.9 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to replace current Pitney Bowes postage meter with 25 new meter, enter into new contract, and authorize County Judge to sign same 87 3 1 I N D E X (Continued) March 22, 2010 2 PAGE 1.14 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 3 identify eligible Kerr County projects for presentation and consideration by TexDOT at 4 subsequent meetings of ARRPO 89 1.15 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 5 approve concurring with waiver request for well location in Hill Country Ranch Estates 90 6 1.16 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on status of ETJ agreement with City of Kerrville 93 7 1.17 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action regarding Kerr County's position with respect to 8 funding Airport CIP work 120 1.18 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action relating 9 to Kerr County providing airport administrative & support services under Airport Services Contract 10 for F.Y. 2010-2011 129 1.19 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 11 approve request by Kerrville/Kerr County Joint Airport Board to reappoint Mark Cowden, Corey 12 Walters, and Tom Moser for 2-year terms of office beginning June 1, 2010 138 13 1.20 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to confirm authority of Kerrville/Kerr County Joint 14 Airport Board to also act as Joint Airport Zoning Board 139 15 1.21 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on proposed LCRA transmission line route(s) 16 including possible route adjacent to I-H 10 139 1.22 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 17 clarify Court Order #31654 to enter into a contract with Bickerstaff, Heath, Delgado, 18 Acosta, LLP, as consultant for redistricting in 2011 as a result of 2010 Census; authorize 19 County Judge to sign contract for same 148 1.23 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 20 designate an individual employed by the County to serve as Records Management Officer 149 21 1.24 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to declare April 2010 "County Government Month" in 22 Kerr County 155 1.25 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 23 confirm and implement 1.5% increase in compen- sation as budgeted for all Kerr County employees 24 effective April 1, 2010 155 1.26 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 25 declare March 27, 2010, "Bark for Life" and "A Toast to the Animals" day in Kerr County 160 4 1 I N D E X (Continued) March 22, 2010 2 PAGE 1.27 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 3 allow KARFA (Kerr Area Rural Fire Association) to use Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center free of 4 charge for Emergency Vehicle Operators Course training on June 5th and 6th, 2010 165 5 1.28 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve continuing disclosure dissemination agent 6 agreement to provide dissemination agent services in connection with continuing disclosure obligations 7 of Kerr County regarding certain bond issue(s)for which County has agreed to make annual filings 8 pursuant to SEC Rule 15c2-12 167 1.29 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 9 appointment of Rob Henneke as County Attorney (Executive Session if necessary) 170 10 4.1 Pay Bills 179 11 4.2 Budget Amendments 179 4.3 Late Bills 180 12 4.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 182 13 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee Assignments 183 14 5.2 Reports from Elected Officials/Department Heads 184 15 --- Adjourned 196 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 5 1 On Monday, March 22, 2010, at 9:00 a.m., a special 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. 8 Let me call to order this regularly scheduled meeting of the 9 Kerr County Commissioners Court posted and scheduled for this 10 date and time, Monday, March 22, 2010, at 9 a.m. It is that 11 time now. If you'll please stand and join me in a moment of 12 prayer. 13 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Please be seated. At 15 this time, if there's any member of the public that wishes to 16 be heard with respect to any matter that is not a listed 17 agenda item, this is your opportunity to come forward and be 18 heard. If you wish to be heard on the agenda items, any 19 agenda item, we'd ask that you fill out a participation form. 20 They should be some located at the rear of the room. It's 21 not essential that you do that. It helps me, however, when 22 we come to that item, to not miss you. But right now, if 23 there's any person that wishes to be heard on any matter that 24 is not a listed agenda item, come forward and tell us what's 25 on your mind now. 3-22-10 6 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I would like to 2 introduce someone that would like to speak to us for a 3 second. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Julie Leonard is the new 6 president of the Historical Commission, and she has asked to 7 come and bring us greetings from Center Point. 8 MS. LEONARD: Greetings, everybody, from the Kerr 9 County Historical Commission. I want to invite all the 10 Commissioners. We're having a dedication for the Great 11 Western Trail Marker on April the 10th at 2:30 at Bill 12 Rector's, Dr. Bill Rector's entrance to his ranch, and that 13 is 2 miles north of Interstate 10 on Harper Road. And I 14 don't know if y'all know, the Great Western Trail that 15 Charles Schreiner, and I think the other man with -- a 16 Mr. Light, and they did all the cattle drives, gathered all 17 the cattle from this area and took them to all the northern 18 markets. So, it's quite exciting to have this marker 19 dedicated. And we also have another one coming up in May, 20 and that's the Apelt Armadillo Farm, and that's going to be a 21 really fun one. Hope everybody can come. Thank you. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. Thank you very 23 much. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Is there anyone else 25 that wishes to be heard on any matter that is not a listed 3-22-10 7 1 agenda item? Seeing no one else wishing to be heard, we'll 2 move on. Commissioner Baldwin, what do you have for us this 3 morning? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I do have an item 5 here. You know that we proclaim April Child Abuse Awareness 6 and Prevention Month here in the county. I wanted to let 7 everyone know there's be going be some signs be put out on 8 the lawn Wednesday, the 31st, in the evening. And also on 9 Wednesday, April the 7th is Go Blue Day. That's a whole lot 10 like, "Go, Tivy fight never dies" thing, but Go Blue Day. 11 And we're asking everyone to wear some kind of blue. You 12 know, we put out those little -- those little blue ribbons 13 that you put on your -- and everyone's lost them, I know, but 14 I have a couple extra, and we have some more coming as well. 15 And then these -- these bracelets -- do you remember these 16 bracelets, Jon? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. Yes. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we'll have some more of 19 these coming as well. And so on April the 7th, we're all 20 going to wear blue to show that we care more than everybody 21 else. So, anyway, Judge, that's about it, I guess for the 22 day. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, thank you, Commissioner. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Williams? 3-22-10 8 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge Tinley, you and I had 2 the opportunity to have breakfast this morning with about 400 3 of our closest friends at 7:30 this morning at the Inn of the 4 Hills, the purpose of which was the Alamo -- the Area Council 5 on Governments, and the Alamo Area Aging Group was sponsoring 6 a statewide convention on aging. And there are about 400 7 delegates statewide here in town for that purpose. I'll let 8 the Judge tell you exactly what he said; he spoke on it for 9 about 40 minutes, and most people missed their breakfast, but 10 it was a fun time for all. (Laughter.) And we did make it 11 in time for court. Thank you, Judge. You're next. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Letz? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we'll just get on with 14 the agenda. I got enough on there to talk about. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, me too. That's -- 16 that's good. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: I was wondering why they invited 18 Commissioner Williams and I for a statewide conference on 19 aging, and I think it's beginning to sink in. (Laughter.) 20 Be that as it may, a couple of items. First off, I'd like to 21 offer the best wishes of the Court to Ilse Bailey, who has 22 been our acting County Attorney for some time now, who's done 23 a wonderful job for us downstairs in the County Attorney's 24 office, and she will be leaving County Attorney's office at 25 the end of this month, and we wish her well in her endeavors, 3-22-10 9 1 and we thank her for her fine work that she's done for Kerr 2 County. (Applause.) 3 Another item, again, out of the County Attorney's 4 office, Christine McEntyre -- I'm sure all of you are 5 familiar with Ms. McEntyre. She's been very, very active in 6 animal issues state-wide, county-wide. She's been at the 7 forefront of -- of disaster issues, rescue issues. I think, 8 if the truth were known, she's written most of the procedures 9 and protocols and S.O.P.'s for the statewide emergency 10 management procedures dealing with animals. As most of you 11 will recall, there was a significant problem with Katrina in 12 New Orleans; a lot of people refused to leave because they 13 could not take their pets with them, and they did not know if 14 their pets were going to be cared for or not. It caused a 15 tremendous problem. In subsequent disaster relief efforts, 16 there were -- there were provisions made, in large measure 17 with Ms. McEntyre right in the thick of it, dealing with 18 those issues, and the evacuations went much, much better. 19 Recently, Ms. McEntyre received a communication from Mr. Jack 20 Colley, who's the Chief of the Texas Division on Emergency 21 Management, and I'd like to read that to you at this time. 22 "Dear Ms. McEntyre, I want to take this opportunity 23 to congratulate you as the recipient of the Pedigree Breed 24 Rescue Hero of the Year award. The award is deserved, 25 deserving recognition for someone who has done so much to 3-22-10 10 1 help animals in need, particularly in your role as director 2 of the local Citizens' Emergency Response Team and Companion 3 Animal Rescue and Response Team, and Diamond Dachshund Rescue 4 of Texas. You and your team expended countless hours and 5 energy on behalf of the citizens and animals of the state of 6 Texas, as evidenced by your response to hurricanes Katrina, 7 Rita, Gustav, and Ike, the north and central Texas fires, 8 Eagle Pass tornado, and numerous cruelty seizures. You are 9 clearly a role model for those who unselfishly seek to make a 10 difference in the state of Texas. Thank you for your 11 commitment, dedication, and all that you do for the great 12 state of Texas. Sincerely, Jack Colley." She's done a 13 wonderful job, and she's to be commended. And she just sits 14 down there and grinds it out, and she's truly an individual 15 that has done a lot for animals in the state of Texas. 16 The other thing I'd like to call to your attention 17 is, as most of you are aware, we're building a new building 18 out adjacent to the Law Enforcement Center. It's going to be 19 a Sheriff's Office annex and Adult Probation offices. It's 20 about a 14,500 square foot structure. The site work portion 21 of that is being conducted by our Road and Bridge people. 22 They are doing an absolutely fabulous job with their work out 23 there. Those people are truly, truly professionals, and have 24 done as good a job as any contractor we could hire at any 25 price. They have truly done a great job, and they're 3-22-10 11 1 bringing that thing up so as to be able to put that building 2 in place. And I want to thank them and all the guys out 3 there, and gals that are working out there on that -- that 4 project. We thank you very much. Okay, let's get on with 5 our agenda. First item is to consider, discuss, and take 6 appropriate action to approve purchase of software license 7 upgrade for QuickBooks using past year's computer software 8 capital moneys. Mr. Trolinger? 9 MR. TROLINGER: Good morning. Thank you. We have 10 a -- a need to consolidate our QuickBook licenses to the 11 Enterprise edition. We've got three major offices using 12 QuickBooks, and the Auditor's now requested another license. 13 And we have these individual box licenses we purchased, and 14 we want to consolidate it with Enterprise edition. The cost 15 is about $3,110 on the research I've done, and I recommend 16 that we -- we take this from the previous 2008 capital 17 outlay. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who's using QuickBooks, and 19 who will be the new user of QuickBooks? 20 MR. TROLINGER: The Sheriff's Office, commissary in 21 particular, motor vehicle, the Tax Office on the tax 22 collection side, and the Auditor's office. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: By buying a consolidated license, 25 will we end up spending less money for licenses overall than 3-22-10 12 1 the way we're going with these individual licenses? 2 MR. TROLINGER: The cost is a little bit more, but 3 the management is much lower. It allows us to change 4 computers much more easily. And if we need to add another 5 computer to the system, it's much more manageable, mostly 6 from the database standpoint. It centralizes the data, 7 because right now they're kind of spread out. It allows the 8 Auditor to oversee it also, or in a better fashion than it's 9 done right now. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: If -- if we don't do this license, 11 we cannot centralize the database? 12 MR. TROLINGER: Correct. They are separate 13 databases right now. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And the money's coming 16 from? 17 MR. TROLINGER: The 2008 capital outlay that was 18 designated for software. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 22 approval of the agenda item. Further question or discussion 23 on that motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by 24 raising your right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 3-22-10 13 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 4 to Item 2; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 5 approve new telephone system service for the county 6 courthouse. Mr. Trolinger again. 7 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. After some extensive 8 amount of research and some really good competitive pricing 9 from the three providers here in town, we looked at the -- at 10 the big picture, and -- and what I'm going to recommend is 11 that we -- for our telephone service, that we use Time-Warner 12 Cable to provide our PRI line inside the courthouse here. 13 They are a little bit -- little bit more expensive than 14 Windstream. Windstream did come down in their pricing, but 15 our two major reasons, the billing issues that we've had with 16 the Auditor's office are probably -- probably the big one, on 17 performance. We just have an ongoing issue with billing, and 18 we want to get that resolved. And then the performance that 19 we're having with our existing new telephone system, we know 20 that the Time-Warner service will work with the new phone 21 system. So, there's -- those are the two major 22 considerations in bringing this recommendation to the -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: John, so the -- you're 24 saying that Time-Warner will fix this T-1 issue? 25 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. 3-22-10 14 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And Kerrville Telephone will 2 not? Not Kerrville Telephone. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Windstream. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Windstream. 5 MR. TROLINGER: Well, I'm not saying that 6 Windstream would not. I believe that it would fix -- it 7 would fix the echo with the new equipment from Windstream. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They would -- they would 9 change out -- they would take out the T-1 and install 10 something new that's more compatible? 11 MR. TROLINGER: That's right. They would provide a 12 piece of equipment, a piece of hardware that would resolve 13 the issue. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So that's a moot issue, 15 then. And then what -- what's the problem with the billing 16 thing? 17 MR. TROLINGER: Well, we -- 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I didn't follow that. 19 MR. TROLINGER: We've had recurring issues with the 20 billing, and the Auditor's office was involved in this 21 project from the get-go on deciding the provider. We had a 22 sit-down with Windstream, and then a sit-down with 23 Time-Warner, and I think the Auditor's office would be 24 pleased that I've chosen Time-Warner because of the billing 25 issues. 3-22-10 15 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we know that 2 Time-Warner's easier to deal with? 3 MR. TROLINGER: I've been assured that they will be 4 on the telephone side. And, of course, they're our existing 5 provider for broadband. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, thank you. 7 MR. TROLINGER: You're welcome, sir. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm a little bit confused 9 by this worksheet that you -- or spreadsheet, or your idea of 10 what a spreadsheet looks like, at the tail end of your 11 presentation here. And, needless to say, I'm confused by it. 12 I really don't understand who's on first and who's on second, 13 and the differences in terms of levels of service, what we're 14 getting for our dollars, and how many dollars we're either 15 going to expend more or less than. Can you enlighten me a 16 little bit? 17 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir, and I apologize for not 18 providing current backup. That was the backup from the 19 previous agenda item. I was out sick over the week, at the 20 end of the week and over the weekend. But to summarize, 21 those are my notes, and I wanted to put -- since this is a 22 very public issue, I wanted to throw everything in there to 23 make sure everything that I considered was available for 24 review. But the bottom line is, the existing service, we pay 25 about $1,150 a month on average for telephone service and 3-22-10 16 1 long distance. With the new service, it'll be about $600 a 2 month for telephone service and long distance. That -- 3 that's my estimate. That's the bottom line. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, if I'm reading your 5 notes correctly, there's a little disparity there. You're 6 talking about existing 1,137; that's pretty close to 1,150. 7 And the new is going to be 1,095. Can you help me understand 8 that? 9 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. I was factoring in the 10 broadband. I've broken it down into two separate agenda 11 items, but what I did was I compiled the data and the voice 12 when I was considering this, so it's the big picture. And 13 the end result is, once we -- once we go with the additional 14 broadband services, that it'll be an overall slight reduction 15 in cost over what we're being billed for today for broadband 16 and voice. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Trolinger, based upon the 18 numbers furnished to you, my understanding is, based on what 19 you've just told us, is that the lowest cost provider 20 proposal comes from Windstream? 21 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: I assume that Time-Warner is the 23 next lowest cost? 24 MR. TROLINGER: They are. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: And then other proposers were 3-22-10 17 1 greater than that. The recommendation that you're making is 2 based solely upon the -- the issue of billing difficulties 3 that we've had previously, as well as -- what was the other 4 item? 5 MR. TROLINGER: Well, the -- the interface to the 6 new telephone system; I've been assured that it's a known 7 good thing, that it will work, and that the Time-Warner 8 engineer and the contractor will work together to make it 9 perfect. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: But you have nothing to indicate 11 that that same interface cannot be provided, and, in fact, is 12 part of the proposal from Windstream? Is that what I'm to 13 understand? 14 MR. TROLINGER: True. It's an unknown. I'm sure 15 it would be worked out in the long run. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 17 MR. TROLINGER: But it's an unknown. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Ms. Hargis, give me some -- 19 give me some elucidation about this billing issue. 20 MS. HARGIS: Well, the billing issue goes to the 21 fact that -- that we, for years, had a -- a method of billing 22 where we separated the phone numbers so that we were able to 23 charge the proper departments for the long distance, and I 24 think all of you are aware of the problems that we had with 25 that. And we had to do it by hand, which took almost eight 3-22-10 18 1 to ten hours to do. We were overbilled; we were billed for 2 the wrong phone numbers. We have phone numbers that we don't 3 know where they came from, we have to check out. It's been a 4 nightmare. And we have talked to them. They do not do this 5 locally; we have to talk to someone out of the Houston 6 office -- actually, out of Sugarland, and it took us two or 7 three months to get to that person. And they have made it 8 somewhat easier, but they still come up with all these calls 9 that -- that say unidentified, and we sometimes we get three 10 pages of unidentified calls. And what we do is we try to 11 look at the numbers and match them to try to see where they 12 come from, or even if they're ours. We -- you know, we go 13 through that phone to make sure we're paying for what -- so 14 it makes it very uncertain that we're even making these phone 15 calls. So -- and we have worked and worked and worked with 16 them. This is a constant problem. Now, you know, they are a 17 big company, and a lot of phone companies are difficult to 18 deal with in this regard. They have given us a person out of 19 the San Antonio office that will deal with us directly, with 20 Time-Warner. That's what the representative told us. We 21 told them the format that we needed, and they agreed that the 22 format would be designed to fit our needs. And, you know, 23 that's the only -- that's -- I met with him on that, and as 24 far as Windstream is concerned, I'm -- I'm certain we'd have 25 to go through the same procedures that we've already been 3-22-10 19 1 going through. Now, whether that's a -- a deal breaker for 2 the Court, that's up to you. I mean, we'll deal with 3 whatever you give us. But we are concerned about the 4 billing, because we don't know whether those unidentified 5 phone calls, being sometimes three pages, sometimes as many 6 as 100 -- that's a lot of unidentified calls, and we never 7 had that before. And that's been going on now for about two 8 years. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- this billing issue that I 10 gather you've been spending a lot of time on trying to chase 11 down, how long have you been trying to resolve that issue 12 with Windstream? 13 MS. HARGIS: Two years. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Over what period of time? 15 MS. HARGIS: Two years. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: And it's still not fully resolved? 17 MS. HARGIS: Hmm-mm. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Does it appear to be easily 19 resolvable, based upon the experience factor that you've had? 20 MS. HARGIS: It's just a constant monthly problem. 21 You know, we get the bill; we have to call. They have to 22 research, or we have to research. The problem is that we 23 have the main trunk line, and when someone picks up the phone 24 and it just happens to be coming in, then it doesn't work. 25 And when they don't know what line they picked up -- they 3-22-10 20 1 should, because we all put our codes in, but apparently it 2 doesn't work. And so I don't know why the -- the prior 3 company could get it right and now we can't get it, but it's 4 a problem for them. They've designed it as well as they can, 5 and then they just have to help us with it, but it's very 6 time-consuming. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: So, in two years, in trying to 8 resolve this and make it doable for our purposes, they've 9 been unsuccessful, and it just appears that if we continue, 10 it's going to be more of the same? Is that what I'm hearing? 11 MS. HARGIS: As far as I know. I mean -- 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Ms. Hargis, the -- do we have 14 any -- well, I guess not "assurance." How do we know it's 15 going to be different with Time-Warner? 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's the question. 17 MS. HARGIS: I can't guarantee you that. Okay. I 18 mean, and I agree. I mean, that's what I've said. I mean, 19 the representative said that they would design the bill 20 according to our needs. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And Windstream's told us that 22 too, correct? 23 MS. HARGIS: Right. So -- so I don't -- you know, 24 I mean, that is a factor. But I -- you know, I can't tell 25 the Court that that would, you know, be ultimately resolved 3-22-10 21 1 by a new company. That's your decision. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I guess, to me, I want 3 more than Windstream saying they're going to work with us. I 4 want a penalty provision if it doesn't work to our standards. 5 If they're going to -- 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Time-Warner? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. If we're going to make 8 the change based on billing, I want a serious penalty in 9 their contract that if they don't work it out to our -- or, 10 you know, whoever's standards, there's recourse. Maybe 11 that'll get their attention. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Could work the same way going 13 with Windstream. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree; it's the same thing. 15 But it's -- obviously, we're not getting the attention that 16 we need with Windstream, and I'm not -- Time-Warner certainly 17 is a big company, or probably a lot bigger -- whole lot 18 bigger. And it's going to be just like working with Sprint 19 and AT&T and everybody else, which is like -- it's a 20 nightmare. So I think if we're going to make a change, we 21 need to address that issue. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: The sense I'm getting from the Court 23 is that let's get -- let's get a little bit more meat to this 24 situation before we move forward? 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 3-22-10 22 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's my thought, Judge. I 2 would -- I would like to see us bring this back in two weeks, 3 if we have that time, and give Windstream an opportunity to 4 come forward with some solid -- 'cause they're the low bid. 5 They're the low bid, and I think that that is a major part of 6 this thing. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, now, we're obligated in the 8 taxpayers' interest to get the best value for the taxpayers' 9 money. Obviously, if -- and generally, that's the lowest 10 number. If there are other factors that come into play 11 that -- that cause the overall cost in terms of manpower, 12 time expended, efficiency and so forth, well, certainly, 13 that's a difference. But looks like we got some more work to 14 do on this, John. 15 MR. TROLINGER: Well -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Can you work on that some more? 17 MR. TROLINGER: It will delay our -- our ongoing 18 problems with the phone system. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, I'd rather delay it 20 than complicate it. And I also would like to have, next time 21 you come back with this issue, something more definitive than 22 what I'm looking at. Levels of service being offered by each 23 of these providers, what it is. I'd like to have some 24 explanation of who maintains the data from an extension 25 number, and/or the code that the user puts in. That data is 3-22-10 23 1 someplace, which goes to the billing issue. You know, where 2 is that data, and why don't we have access to it? I'd like 3 to have all those answers. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Final point, and I think that 5 if we're going to have another two weeks on this, I think I 6 heard during this conversation that Windstream could fix the 7 phone problem too. I want that in writing, with penalties 8 for both. I mean, if we're going to make this switch based 9 on that. And I'm uncomfortable on having to make a change 10 for that reason, period. We bid the contract for the phone 11 system. In my mind, that phone system should be compatible 12 with the technology that we had at the time we did that 13 contract, so I don't think that that should be -- in my mind, 14 shouldn't even be a consideration why to make a change. The 15 contractor will just have to figure out how to fix that 16 problem. And if that means running whatever, so be it. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Or some acknowledgment that 18 that wasn't examined when the RFP's came in and we took a 19 look at them. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And, John, if Windstream 22 doesn't want to -- or if they struggle with this billing 23 issue, tell them we're going to send Jon Letz over there to 24 visit with them. And that's a threat. That is a threat, 25 so -- 3-22-10 24 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll be right behind him. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Two Germans. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They don't want that to 5 happen. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Send two Germans instead of one, 7 huh? (Laughter.) That will bring them around. Anything 8 else to be offered on that? Let's go to Item 3, if we might. 9 Consider, discuss, take appropriate action for approval of 10 new broadband services and authorize County Judge to sign 11 same. 12 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. Thank you, Judge Tinley. 13 I don't know if we're going to end up delaying this as well. 14 Time-Warner, again, is my choice for the data services. 15 The -- the price is not the lowest, but I believe it's the 16 best service. We've budgeted for an additional $500 per 17 month ongoing for expanded broadband services, and by -- by 18 using Time-Warner's carrier grade class, they bring 19 fiberoptic in the courthouse and make the connection much 20 more reliable than it already is, which is just spectacular. 21 We've had very little trouble with the courthouse internet 22 connection. And it'll give us a little bit better service as 23 far as broadband, because it will be expanded, but then we'll 24 keep the copper -- the old cable modem and provide us with a 25 second additional new fiberoptic line, and that'll give us 3-22-10 25 1 the redundancy that we need to insure that we can do 2 business. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: What bandwidth are you -- are you 4 seeking? 5 MR. TROLINGER: It's 20 mbs up, and 20 mbs down. 6 That's megabits per second, is "mbs." 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Did you say Time-Warner at 8 the beginning of your talk? 9 MR. TROLINGER: I did say time-Warner. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Huh? 11 MR. TROLINGER: I did, yes. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm looking at Hill Country 13 Telephone here in my backup material. Why are we talking 14 about Hill Country -- Time-Warner when we have before us a 15 proposal from Hill Country Telephone? 16 MR. TROLINGER: Oh, I provided the backup in 17 confusing spurts. The backup from last week was combined -- 18 or from the last meeting was combined together with the -- 19 with the telephone from the second agenda item. And I did 20 provide you with a new proposal that Hill Country sent after 21 -- after I'd received -- after I put in the initial agenda 22 item. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: This kind of rides in tandem with 24 the -- with the other service? 25 MR. TROLINGER: It does. They go hand-in-hand. 3-22-10 26 1 Even though they're -- we've been able to break out the two 2 services, two separate contracts, the -- the service does go 3 hand-in-hand. It comes in on the same fiberoptic line, 4 telephone and the data. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're coming back with 6 this? Is that my understanding? 7 MR. TROLINGER: No, sir, it's my recommendation to 8 use Time-Warner. I've got the -- I don't have the 9 Time-Warner contract reviewed by the County Attorney yet. 10 It's the same -- it's the old contract with no changes. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: John, does it affect it in 12 any way if we -- in two weeks, we decide to stay with 13 Kerrville? 14 MR. TROLINGER: It would not. They're separate 15 contracts. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I -- I can't imagine 17 what -- how it would affect it. Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm not prepared to vote on 19 it, because you're talking about Time-Warner, and then you're 20 giving us an illustration of a proposal from Hill Country 21 Telephone. I'd like to see it all put together. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is there a Time-Warner 23 presentation in here? 24 MR. TROLINGER: No, sir. Apparently, I did not 25 include it. 3-22-10 27 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Dang, John. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's bring it back, John. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're making it tough. 4 MR. TROLINGER: Okay. So, do you want the 5 telephone and the data in one proposal? Is that the 6 direction I'm receiving? 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Spreadsheet, so I can 8 understand it, so we're talking about what levels of service, 9 what we're buying and what we're saving. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: I think it's two separate items, 11 John, because they're -- one's not interdependent on the 12 other. 13 MR. TROLINGER: Okay, I understand. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: So, if you'll bring back two 15 separate items, we'd appreciate it, okay? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Before we -- 17 JUDGE TINLEY: We're still on it? Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Leave these two. The biggest 19 issue that I hear about is the fax issue. 20 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We received some -- is there a 22 way to patch that for the next three weeks? Because I 23 believe we meet in three weeks, not two weeks, which is one 24 of those long -- 25 MR. TROLINGER: No, sir, not that I can find. 3-22-10 28 1 We've already band-aided it where we could. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Are you saying that we presently do 3 have fax service available? 4 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, outgoing and incoming. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Are those on limited circuits 6 where -- where we need to identify them so people can know 7 where to access that? 8 MR. TROLINGER: No. Each office has -- has their 9 outgoing fax machine available. The problem is that the 10 offices that we're -- that are on the telephone switch cannot 11 receive faxes on that same machine. It now comes in via 12 e-mail. The other problem is for the outgoing faxes, there's 13 an inconsistent result. Sometimes it'll go through, 14 sometimes it won't. It's not 100 percent, which is what we 15 want faxes to be, 100 percent, when you send out a fax. And 16 we're still nailing down a couple of individual fax machines 17 with problems, trying to nail down issues with those. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, the problem that I received 19 an e-mail about last week about one of our employees having 20 to testify in court, has that been resolved? 21 MR. TROLINGER: I didn't get a copy on that. I 22 don't know. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: County Court at Law. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 3-22-10 29 1 MS. BAILEY: It has not been resolved. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: County Attorney's office. 3 MS. BAILEY: John, it has not been resolved. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Has not been revolved. 5 MR. TROLINGER: The County Attorney's fax is the 6 same as it was three weeks ago. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We had -- 8 MS. BAILEY: We're not able to receive certain 9 faxes, and we're not able to send certain faxes. It'll get 10 fixed; then it won't send or receive. That particular issue, 11 we had to receive proof of service on someone so we could get 12 a protective order, and we were not able to receive the proof 13 on our fax machine, or two or three other fax machines in the 14 county. Fortunately, the Judge allowed Barbara Holmes to 15 testify that she had spoken to the person that served the 16 respondent with that. That's not generally permissible; that 17 is hearsay. So, if he'd shown up, we wouldn't have been able 18 to make our case. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are you indicating you 20 didn't know about this? 21 MR. TROLINGER: I had -- we received a call on the 22 problem. I didn't know the details of it. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So -- 24 JUDGE TINLEY: We're going to bring those back? 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 3-22-10 30 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I'm still -- Judge, I don't 2 want to leave that at the moment, because I think it's a 3 problem. You're saying that they're going -- you can't use 4 the machines, but you can use the faxes on the computers; is 5 that correct? 6 MR. TROLINGER: The -- the outgoing works on the 7 machines -- on the fax machines. Inconsistently. Not -- 8 it's not 100 percent. 9 MS. HOLMES: Very inconsistently, if I may add. 10 MR. TROLINGER: Very inconsistently. And the 11 incoming faxes are -- that we're on the -- on these same 12 machines are now coming in via e-mail. It was my 13 understanding that that is working very well. Of course, 14 receiving contrary to that report now. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can we -- can the outgoing go 16 via e-mail? I mean -- 17 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, it seems -- I just want 19 to make sure that our employees can function. And there's a 20 little bit of -- faxes are a very important part of that. If 21 we can -- if there's a way to use -- you know, not use the 22 current fax machines and use our computer system, whether 23 e-mail or whatever, I think everyone needs to be aware of 24 that, and needs to be trained on that. 25 MR. TROLINGER: And many offices do that now. They 3-22-10 31 1 take their -- their document; instead of sending it via fax, 2 they just send it via e-mail. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They scan it, I'm presuming? 4 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Then you receive it, then you 6 -- is that an acceptable patch to the County Attorney's 7 office, I guess? Which -- 8 MR. TROLINGER: Well, the -- let me speak up on 9 that. The County Attorney's -- they must get these 10 documents. They need a guaranteed method of sending and 11 receiving. And right now, what they're saying is it's not a 12 sure thing. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The faxes is not? 14 MS. BAILEY: The trouble with that last week was 15 not only that we could not receive it in our office, but we 16 tried three other offices in the county, and none of the -- 17 none of those faxes could receive the information that we 18 needed, so we ended up having to go to the hearing without 19 the information. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. I mean, could that 21 information have gone via e-mail and been acceptable to the 22 courts? 23 MS. HOLMES: The information that we were getting 24 was from the Llano County Sheriff's Office. The lady told me 25 no, they were not able to e-mail that information to us. 3-22-10 32 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They only had faxing 2 capability; is that correct? 3 MS. BAILEY: Correct. 4 MS. HOLMES: Correct. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we're not going to 7 resolve this one, Judge, so we should probably move on. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Got some problems that need to get 9 resolved, John. Thank you. 10 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. You're welcome. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move to our 9:30 timed item, 12 Item 8; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 13 authorize reimbursement for sums paid for county debris 14 placed at the local landfill by Community Service Infusion 15 teams and volunteers on CSI workday scheduled for March 27th, 16 2010. 17 MR. HEWITT: Good morning. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning. 19 MR. HEWITT: I'm John Hewitt. I'm this year's 20 chairman for Community Service Infusion, which is -- we refer 21 to that as CSI. It's a program that Partners in Ministry 22 sponsors, and Bill Blackburn with Partners in Ministry is 23 here with me this morning. This is our fourth year. It's a 24 day when churches, nonprofits, schools, and civic groups come 25 together to work on projects for individuals in need of 3-22-10 33 1 community improvements. So, this year we're painting homes, 2 we're fixing up homes. We've got -- we're building some 3 wheelchair ramps on some homes. We've got some river cleanup 4 projects, highway cleanup projects. As a part of that, we've 5 worked out an arrangement with the City of Kerrville for the 6 projects that are in the city of Kerrville; we're going to 7 take items to the dump, and they're going to reimburse 8 Partners in Ministry for the cost of that. We think we have 9 15 -- 10 to 15 projects in the county. We think there will 10 be about ten loads, and so we're asking for some sort of a 11 waiver on those fees at the dump or reimbursement for taking 12 those items to the dump. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Of course, we don't have the ability 14 to issue waivers. That's operated by Allied Waste, I think, 15 and the only way we'd be able to accommodate you is by 16 reimbursement. Which, of course, if you're picking up the 17 debris in the county and -- and getting that out of 18 Mr. Garcia's hair, as solid waste that would otherwise be -- 19 it would seem appropriate that we'd reimburse you for those 20 fees, whatever they may be, and I'm sure you'd be in a 21 position to tell us what they are. 22 MR. HEWITT: We're estimating it would be about ten 23 loads. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: How much per load? 25 MR. HEWITT: $500, $600. 3-22-10 34 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Total? 2 MR. HEWITT: Yeah. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Ray, is that in your budget, 4 available? 5 MR. GARCIA: We can -- we can find it. Take it out 6 of maybe the Kerr County Nuisance Abatement program. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which program? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Nuisance abatement. 9 MR. GARCIA: Nuisance abatement. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That seems appropriate. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Up to 500? Or just leave it 12 open-ended? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: You know, I'm not sure what the 14 number's going to be. I don't think it's going to be a 15 horrendous number, though. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are you talking about 17 dumpsters? 18 MR. HEWITT: Well, it would be trash that we pick 19 up along the highways and along the river, and then some of 20 the lumber and stuff from the homes that we'd be working out 21 in the county on. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You're talking possibly 23 10 tons. 24 MR. HEWITT: Yeah. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Runs about 50 bucks a ton, I 3-22-10 35 1 believe. 2 MR. HEWITT: I think that's right. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Somewhere in that 4 neighborhood. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I make a motion that we 7 authorize reimbursement to the Community Service Infusion 8 group, sum not to exceed $600, as reimbursement for dump 9 fees. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 12 indicated. Question or discussion? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Those funds would come out of 14 the Environmental Health Department's nuisance abatement line 15 item. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion? All 18 in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. We appreciate it. 23 MR. HEWITT: Thank you. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Appreciate the work that you do 25 also. Let's go back to Item 4; consider, discuss, take 3-22-10 36 1 appropriate action for approval of a regional video 2 teleconference system grant application, authorize County 3 Judge to sign same. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I have two questions 5 on that. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: One would be, are we 8 planning on spending any Kerr County taxpayers' money for 9 other -- another county to hook up? 10 JUDGE TINLEY: That would not be my intention. 11 But -- 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, you've been kind of 13 driving the thing -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- for a couple of years. I 16 was just wondering. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: "A couple" is somewhat charitable. 18 More like six, I think, Commissioner. But the -- the grant 19 application would be for a regional hookup, and the -- the 20 cost that we would expend would be for Kerr County's portion 21 of that cost. 22 MR. TROLINGER: Well, there are end points that we 23 would provide to counties that would go in their courtrooms, 24 but as far as the actual hookup, the connection, the data 25 service, we would not provide that as part of this project. 3-22-10 37 1 Excuse me, we would not provide that as part of this project. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But we would provide the 3 hardware that would go in Menard County? 4 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. The Judge would be -- would 5 use a piece of video teleconference equipment on a cart, a 6 display and a box, if you would. And that would be 7 provided -- that end point would be provided by this program. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: By the program, but what about Kerr 9 County funds? 10 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: This has a match portion to it? 12 MR. TROLINGER: That's correct. The match is 13 50 percent, and the cost is about $150,000, so it's a $75,000 14 match. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: John, without some -- some 16 interlocal agreement for reimbursement from these other 17 counties for their pro rata portion, I would not want to move 18 forward on -- with Kerr County dollars. I think we're going 19 to have to get that worked out first. 20 MR. TROLINGER: I see. Well, all's I have at this 21 point are the -- are the District Judges and yourself signed 22 on to, you know, to support this. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You know, the district -- the 24 District Judges would have to go through their budget cycle 25 and ask that it get included in their budget, I would -- 3-22-10 38 1 wouldn't that be the mechanism? 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: District Judges or the 3 County Judges? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: See, that's my second 5 question. I'm not real interested in what the District 6 Judges think about it. I'm interested in the County Judges, 7 the budget officers of each one of those counties. Have they 8 signed off on it? I mean, not to belittle the District 9 Judges, by all means. But -- 10 MR. TROLINGER: Well, I don't want to speak for 11 Rosa Lavender, but she has worked on this project quite a 12 bit, and I'm sure that's one avenue, is -- is to go to Rosa 13 and ask that question. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What we're seeing in this 15 diagram is all -- is eight counties -- one, two, three, four, 16 five, six, seven -- nine counties. No, eight actually for 17 the two districts, Kerr being the hub for both of the two -- 18 of the two judicial districts. And so I guess that goes back 19 to the question the Judge raised and Commissioner Baldwin 20 raised. Have each of these other counties appropriated what 21 they should be appropriating to hook up to this video 22 conferencing system? 23 MR. TROLINGER: No, sir. This, of course, is the 24 grant application. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I understand that. 3-22-10 39 1 MR. TROLINGER: It's Tier 2. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But you said it has to be a 3 50 percent match. 4 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: I would -- I would want to see an 6 assurance from the County Judges in each of these other 7 counties that whatever their pro rata portion is of the -- of 8 the match requirement, that they would shoulder that 9 responsibility. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't believe we should. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Kerr County should not be -- you 12 know, even though we've got our two judges that reside here, 13 and that's primarily to service those two district courts, I 14 don't think it's our responsibility to -- to install this 15 system at our cost for their benefit. And that's been my 16 discussion with these judges from the get-go, starting six 17 years ago, that they would have some costs involved, as well 18 as the cost of service on an ongoing basis. But -- and 19 generally they've been receptive to me. But without some 20 sort of assurance from them, I don't want to be fronting that 21 cost and just playing the card that maybe they'll feel good 22 about us and send us a check. I mean, we're -- we're nice 23 guys and all, but some of the those counties are -- are 24 pretty hard-strapped, as you know. You know, when you look 25 at Menard County, and one cent on the tax rate raises 3-22-10 40 1 $13,000, it's pretty tough. So, we've got to get that 2 assurance before we move forward as to any -- anything other 3 than what the grant covers. 4 MR. TROLINGER: Very good. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Appreciate you saying that, 6 Judge. Thank you. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's -- let's go to our 9:45 timed 8 item. Number 10, consider, discuss, take appropriate action 9 on recommendation of the Economic Development Task Force. We 10 have Mr. Mark Armstrong with us today, who is a vice chair of 11 the Economic Development Task Force that worked on that 12 particular matter. Included within your backup material is a 13 copy of the Power Point presentation that was made to 14 Kerrville City Council on -- looks like February the 23rd. 15 And -- 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't have that. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: -- Mr. Armstrong -- it should be -- 18 MR. ARMSTONG: I think you have it in printed form. 19 I think you have it in non-power, no-point form. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Jody, did you not put that on the 21 electronic backup? 22 MS. GRINSTEAD: I'm sorry? 23 JUDGE TINLEY: The Power Point presentation. 24 MS. GRINSTEAD: It should be on there. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3-22-10 41 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't see it. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm going to go back and 3 check. Okay, I got it. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Armstrong indicated that -- 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I got it. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: -- he, like myself, is somewhat 7 technologically challenged, and so he elected not to do the 8 Power Point. 9 MR. ARMSTONG: Bruce will back me up. Fry cooks 10 have certain limitations when it comes to technology. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. I'm with you. 12 MR. ARMSTONG: Has everyone found it? 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's a separate -- it's a 17 separate one. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Where is it? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's right behind the 20 agenda item, the second -- just the next -- the next frame. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If we're on -- whatever 23 we're on. We're on 10 -- it's 10a or something like that. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 10a? 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Whatever. 3-22-10 42 1 MR. ARMSTRONG: I also had some fears that Bruce 2 might get ahold of the laser pointer and -- 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, that's right. I may 4 point it at you just for fun. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Blind you? 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll find it here in a 7 second. Much easier to fry catfish. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: I think Mark's found that to be true 9 also, haven't you? 10 MR. ARMSTONG: Yes, sir. Watching TV last night, 11 thinking about how easy health care was. (Laughter.) 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That was a sausage-making 13 episode, wasn't it? 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We all feel better this 15 morning. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Notice, everybody is here in good 17 health. 18 MR. ARMSTONG: Yeah. Plan on staying that way. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: He's discriminating against 20 me. Didn't give it to me. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I didn't get it either. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Jon and I are in the dark, 23 which is nothing unusual. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's all right. Go ahead, 25 Mark. 3-22-10 43 1 MR. ARMSTRONG: I'll lead you through it. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm sure -- 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We'll figure it out. 4 MR. ARMSTONG: City Council initiated our task 5 force a while back in an effort to learn what was going on 6 with economic development in our community, amongst all the 7 partners, and to come up with maybe a better way of doing it. 8 The task force members were -- were Mike Huff, large employer 9 representative, myself as a small employer representative, 10 Todd Bock from the City, Bill Crumrine from E.I.C., Stephen 11 Fine from KPUB, Steve Huser representing KEDF, Trevor Hyde, 12 who is with us today to cover my back, from -- representing 13 the Chamber of Commerce, Bob Miller from the C.V.B., the 14 Judge representing Kerr County, and Dr. Dan Troxel from 15 K.I.S.D. Our charge was to draw the economic development 16 partners together into one resource to work out a development 17 structure that would be quantifiable, measurable, and 18 accountable to the citizens. Our charge was to come up with 19 basic recommendations in the areas of organizational 20 structure, funding, and implementation. 21 Our major findings were that all the major 22 stakeholders must be included. The current KEDF board has, 23 like, 40 members on it. We felt that should be limited to 24 nine. It was important to us that no single entity should 25 end up with absolute control. We feel that the program must 3-22-10 44 1 have a degree of autonomy. We feel that the economic 2 development priorities and objectives must be established 3 through joint efforts of all the stakeholders. We believe 4 the stakeholders should have a financial commitment, and that 5 the outcomes and expectations must be clearly defined, 6 including routine reporting. The organizational structure 7 that we suggest for the new KEDF -- and, basically, what's 8 going to happen here is if this goes through, is KEDF as we 9 know it today is basically going to vote to dissolve itself 10 and reorganize as this entity. 11 And, basically, what we have is the seven spokes of 12 the wheel -- "spokes of the wheel" is kind of a key phrase 13 that we latched onto and held onto quite a bit -- with the 14 Chamber, K.I.S.D., KPUB, C.V.B., E.I.C., the City and the 15 County, and then the two at-large representatives. Each of 16 the spokes would designate their own representative, and then 17 the seven spokes would come together and appoint the two 18 at-large business representatives, three-year staggered 19 terms, no more than two terms. The board's responsibility 20 would be to hire and fire the Economic Development Director, 21 approve a budget, and submit funding requests. Funding, 22 which is what it always comes down to, you all have been 23 generous contributors for many years, and hope to see that 24 continue, along with the City, KPUB. 25 And what we are really pushing for is approximately 3-22-10 45 1 10 percent of E.I.C.'s annual budget, along with private 2 donations. So, we would continue to look for that 25,000 3 from the County, City, KPUB, and private donations, and then 4 roughly $250,000 a year from E.I.C. That number may be a 5 little high; depends on how things are, for a total of about 6 a $350,000 annual budget, which would cover routine operating 7 expenses, including marketing. That budget would be 8 submitted to the governing body for approval, and then 9 funding requests submitted after approval of a budget, namely 10 to E.I.C. 11 The implementation of this plan is to take this 12 plan which we have adopted, which hopefully is more 13 controllable and achievable and organized, and everyone 14 participating, than some of the more scattered approaches 15 that we have seen in the past. What we are doing is we are 16 going around and presenting our findings to all of the seven 17 partners that I mentioned and requesting ratification. We 18 are hoping to have that done by the end of March. And we are 19 here today requesting your go-ahead to continue the process. 20 I will say that no one who has heard the presentation has 21 bought every word of every line, and basically what we are 22 looking for is a -- is a thought that, yes, this is a good 23 idea and a good process, and the process should move forward. 24 With those ratifications, the new body will be 25 created. And once the members are named to that body, we'll 3-22-10 46 1 establish roles for the partnering entities, prepare an 2 action plan, prepare a budget, and submit funding requests by 3 July. We want to insure that all partners have input. We 4 want to insure that we have goals and priorities and annual 5 routine evaluations. We want to formalize priorities and 6 objectives of economic development within the area. I'm not 7 going to say the City or KEDF or the County; just with -- 8 with everyone. We want to improve transparency and 9 accountability, and in my opinion communication. And we hope 10 to provide an enhanced level of service, a more proactive 11 effort, and a ready response team. We feel like that 12 insuring adequate resourcing for this project is what has 13 been lacking for -- for many, many years, and we would like 14 to see a steady revenue stream. As I said, we have given 15 this -- we are in the process of giving this presentation to 16 all of the spokes in the wheel. We have gotten the go-ahead 17 to continue to process from Council, E.I.C., the Chamber, and 18 KEDF, and today we are asking for yours. 19 In some of the prior presentations, some of the 20 topics prompting discussion were number of members on the new 21 board. The task force believes that all the spokes listed in 22 the wheel shown on the presentation are partners or 23 stakeholders in the process and that all bring something 24 important to the table. In our meetings, every participant 25 contributed significantly to our overall product. Our task 3-22-10 47 1 force was basically kind of a test drive of this new board 2 structure, and I think we proved and practiced just how 3 functional the wheel that you are looking at can be. And I 4 would also say that anyone who has concerns about the makeup 5 of the new board was not afforded the opportunity to attend 6 any of our meetings. It was really a special group, and I 7 felt like great things could come from that group in the 8 future. Because of the spokes in the wheel, not the 9 individuals that served on the task force, but because of the 10 spokes of the wheel, I think it will remain a special group. 11 There was discussion about who should have 12 oversight of all the board appointments, and we felt that 13 each of the individual spokes are more than capable to do an 14 adequate job of appointing their individual representative. 15 It was discussed that the director should be a City employee. 16 This was a topic that the task force specifically addressed 17 at some length, and the conclusion was a unanimous no. And I 18 would add that we believe that to be not only the best answer 19 for KEDF, but for the City, and more importantly, the process 20 itself as well. We believe the autonomy of an independent 21 executive employed at the will of the board is crucial to the 22 overall process and the success of that process. We believe 23 that the official capacity in which a city employee must 24 function could prevent that executive from being able to 25 address certain aspects with certain prospects in a needed 3-22-10 48 1 way. 2 Council and E.I.C. voiced concerns about the 3 responsibility of properly looking out for the citizens' best 4 interest, and I would certainly anticipate hearing that 5 question from you as well. The task force believes that is 6 exactly where we are trying to take this initiative. When 7 the E.I.C. tax was originally presented to the voters and 8 approved by the voters, it was not billed strictly as an 9 infrastructure program. It was billed and passed as a 10 vehicle to spur economic development, both through specific 11 tangible works that would facilitate and encourage growth, 12 and create a program to help secure that growth. The 13 accomplishments of E.I.C. are many, and we all benefit from 14 those data. However, we have failed from the beginning to 15 dedicate E.I.C. funds to an ongoing program targeted 16 specifically at development. As a member of E.I.C. for four 17 years, and a past chair, I certainly share in the guilt of 18 that. We kind of got so excited about doing the things with 19 the money that we really have neglected for far too long to 20 create and structure a program to go after. 21 So, on behalf of the task force, I would tell you 22 that we believe we are, in fact, looking out for the best 23 interests of the citizens by urging E.I.C. and you to commit 24 to consisting -- assisting in the effort to achieve real 25 economic development by adequately supporting a well thought 3-22-10 49 1 out plan and structure to both retain and go after economic 2 development. We believe that was the citizens' desire when 3 they approved the tax, and we believe it still is today. 4 Appreciate your letting me come see you today. As I said, 5 the two things that we are looking for -- and I'll take a few 6 questions in just a second -- are, number one, a -- a 7 resolution of support for this process, and also for you to 8 name a representative to the new board. The Judge did just a 9 fabulous job as a member of the task force; brought a whole 10 lot to the table. The representative is anyone the County 11 wants to appoint. It can be the Judge, one of you, or it can 12 be a citizen who you think will act on your behalf. Now, if 13 you have any questions? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mark, I have three 15 questions. 16 MR. ARMSTONG: Three? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. One, is your 18 restaurant open today? 19 MR. ARMSTONG: Sir, yes, sir. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, thank you. 21 (Laughter.) That's the important one. 22 MR. ARMSTRONG: I should say I hope it is. I'll 23 know here in a little while. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If it's there. Now, you 25 made a statement, you all would like to see a steady revenue 3-22-10 50 1 stream. What did you mean by that? Does that mean that the 2 County participates sometimes, and sometimes they don't? Or 3 what do you mean by that? 4 MR. ARMSTRONG: The County has been a consistent 5 participant. We are looking for -- 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We'll go right by that one, 7 then. 8 MR. ARMSTRONG: All right. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Then you say you want our 10 go-ahead to continue the process. Now, I've only been here 11 18 years, so does that mean that you want our go-ahead to 12 continue the process, or you want our money? What does that 13 mean? 14 MR. ARMSTRONG: No money. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're not talking money? 16 MR. ARMSTRONG: No money. When the new board is 17 formed, they will create and present their own funding 18 request. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. 20 MR. ARMSTRONG: What I was trying to say is that I 21 would like approval and ratification of every word of every 22 line that is -- that is in the package that at least some of 23 you got. But I've gotten too scared to do that. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The process, yeah. I like 25 it. You know, seems like to me it was about a month ago, I 3-22-10 51 1 made a motion in here and we approved appointing the Judge as 2 a member of this group. We have to do this every couple of 3 months? 4 MR. ARMSTRONG: Well, no. No, he -- you know, I 5 don't know what you have done, but he was on the task force. 6 The task force and new board. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 8 MR. ARMSTRONG: Although, basically, they're the 9 same -- the same group, it will be different individuals. 10 The members of the task force were appointed to serve on the 11 task force. Our work is done. We're going home. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Given all the fuss and 14 feathers that have taken place on this topic over the last 15 two years or more, I consider that to be a major step 16 forward. And, as you well know, 'cause you and I 17 participated for years in this, economic development is a 18 life stream, a life blood for Kerr County and the city of 19 Kerrville. And when I say that, I mean that in the context 20 of the whole. Not the city, not the county, but the whole. 21 MR. ARMSTRONG: Exactly. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And I consider this to be a 23 major step forward. I would support the reorganization of 24 what seems now to be Kerrville Economic Development 25 Foundation into a smaller, more concise, and probably more 3-22-10 52 1 orderly and constructive board. Forty is great; I served on 2 it for a long time. Nine -- seven or nine, whichever -- 3 seven, I guess it is, is better, and I would support that 4 wholeheartedly. I think that your recollections about how 5 funding needs to have come about are accurate. There have 6 been a lot of us, you being in the forefront, and others that 7 we could name were in the forefront of the development or the 8 passage of the 4B sales tax, and for one very major reason. 9 That very major reason was to support economic development, 10 among other things, that the 4B sales tax will allow to take 11 place. And some have taken place, but I think economic 12 development as a topic, as a structure, as an organization, 13 as a goal or a task, have been sadly lacking in terms of 14 funding. And I think this moves toward accomplishing that 15 particular goal, and I support that wholeheartedly. 16 MR. ARMSTRONG: Well, thank you very much. 17 There -- there's been some selective memory problems with the 18 process back in the day. I thank you. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I wouldn't be surprised of 20 that, but, you know, I remember it. And I remember all the 21 pitches that went before the 4B sales tax was taken -- was 22 taken to the voters. I support it wholeheartedly, and I 23 thank you for your involvement. 24 MR. ARMSTRONG: Thank you, sir. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: I -- I want to thank Mark in 3-22-10 53 1 particular as a member of the task force. It was Mark that 2 insisted upon the history of the 4B and economic development 3 to be presented to the task force as a major component of our 4 work, and I think it opened a lot of eyes of folks that 5 either weren't there, or who weren't paying a great deal of 6 attention to the process when 4B came into being. The 7 history is that there was a thought about 4A for 8 infrastructure, and then the move was to -- well, let's look 9 at 4B, because we want an economic development function, even 10 to the point of creating a contingency fund. And we batted 11 that term around, and we've heard it more recently both at 12 council and at E.I.C. That was to be utilized for the 13 purpose of the economic development function, and the 14 replenishment of that contingency fund in an amount equal to 15 10 percent of the revenue stream received by E.I.C., the 4B 16 administrative body, on an annual basis. And Mark was very, 17 very insistent that that history be brought forward, and it 18 was because of that I'm convinced that the E.I.C. funding 19 function of $250,000 got plugged in. 20 The historical data would reflect that of that 21 one-half sent, there was discussion about one-fourth or 22 one-eighth of that being segregated specifically for the 23 economic development function. Be that as it may, it didn't. 24 We came up with the contingency fund, and that has faded from 25 memory. It came back into memory just the other evening at 3-22-10 54 1 the E.I.C. meeting. Sandra Yarbrough, who, of course, has 2 been in charge of accounting for many years at the City of 3 Kerrville -- not in charge of accounting, but involved in 4 accounting -- had a recollection that she acknowledged to me 5 about the contingency fund exists, it doesn't exist, now it 6 exists again. But Mark was insistent upon that history being 7 brought out. And the -- the initial proposal that was 8 brought forward at the insistence of Council was brought 9 forward by City Manager Todd Parton, and he brought forward a 10 model that, amazingly enough, was taken almost totally from 11 our Economic Development Strategic Plan that both the City 12 and the Council -- City Council and this Court approved after 13 about a year and a half of work, and that model was in there. 14 He brought it forward. The Council, for a number of reasons, 15 declined to adopt it, and after an effort to -- to take the 16 economic development function in-house by the City, which was 17 disapproved, this task force was formed. 18 So, that's where we got to where we are. But City 19 Manager Todd Parton deserves a lot of credit for his initial 20 work on this, because that was the launch point for what we 21 -- for what we started with. And the end result is very, 22 very close to that, because it is from our Economic 23 Development Strategic Plan, which this whole thing is a 24 process of. It involves all of the stakeholders, and it 25 provides a funding stream for an adequate economic 3-22-10 55 1 development function. Now, whether or not -- on an ongoing 2 basis, whether it's going to be totally adequate, we don't 3 know. We don't know what the future holds. But it will 4 conform in large measure to the original intent for citizens 5 that they expressed in adopting the 4B tax. The business 6 community sold that 4B to the citizens, establishing that 7 additional tax on themselves, and so I think it's incumbent 8 upon to us approve this recommendation to attempt to move 9 this entire function forward, and I would ask the Court to do 10 that. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: A couple comments, Judge. I 12 agree with everything you said, and Commissioner Williams and 13 Baldwin, for that matter. This is a -- you know, certainly a 14 step in the right direction. I appreciate all that Mark's 15 done, and the -- you, Judge, serving on this task force, and 16 appreciate the City's, you know, participation in getting it 17 moving in this direction. I think it is -- this is a 18 critical issue for the county and city, one and the same, 19 economic development. And I think this provides a mechanism 20 that works. With that, I'll have a little bit of a caution, 21 or just something to remind those that -- probably, Judge, 22 the only area that I have a concern in here is that, you 23 know, E.I.C. is the proper funding for that, clearly for a 24 large portion of it. But I hope that this new group -- and I 25 hope -- I think it will -- that forms will continue to look 3-22-10 56 1 at the county as a whole when it comes to economic 2 development. 3 And I'm saying this for a very specific reason. 4 Comfort, which is on the county line, just attracted a new 5 employer, a manufacturing facility that's going to employ 200 6 -- or 60 people, I believe. Metco is getting ready to open 7 up a plant right outside of Comfort, inside their water 8 district boundary. I've been told that it's a pretty good 9 possibility -- likelihood, and they're just waiting on some 10 other details to be tied in, right outside of Comfort, 11 another facility with 250 employees is getting ready to be 12 announced, a company moving in, manufacturing facility from 13 California. And then one of our local residents has been in 14 the paper; Granger MacDonald is opening up a 65-unit 15 apartment building in Comfort. And I'm bringing this up as 16 these are all right on the county line. And with the whole 17 east water -- east Kerr County water and wastewater project, 18 this is an area ripe for economic development, if we can get 19 all this done, between Center Point and Comfort. 20 And while it may not -- you know, I just hope that 21 this group, even though it's going to, you know, have E.I.C. 22 funding, which is -- comes out of Kerrville, essentially, 23 even though I think all county taxpayers participate in it, I 24 hope that they look at that area, because it will be a 25 benefit to the City of Kerrville and Kerr County if we can 3-22-10 57 1 get some of this economic development that's going in around 2 Comfort right now into, you know, a couple hundred yards 3 across the county line. Then we will, you know, generate the 4 tax revenue. The people will shop in Kerrville. A lot of 5 people in Comfort shop in Kerrville already, and will 6 continue. So, I just hope that the -- this continues -- and 7 I think the same argument could go out towards Junction and 8 the far western areas. And it's a big county. We obviously 9 focus on the center around Kerrville, 'cause it's very 10 important, but the far extremes are very important as well, 11 and I hope that this new group will look at that as a benefit 12 to the whole county and city. That's it. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well said. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Sounds like a good plan to 15 me. Been a long time coming. Pretty different from the way 16 it used to be. This way's got to be better. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Judge, I would offer a 18 motion that Commissioners Court approve the organizational 19 restructure of the Economic Development as proposed by the 20 Kerr Economic Development Task Force. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What about the board member? 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's a separate item. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Totally separate? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. 3-22-10 58 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 3 approval of the agenda item as indicated. Further question 4 or discussion on that motion? All in favor of the motion, 5 signify by raising your right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 10 to Item 11. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, whoa. I don't see 12 how -- I think we need to take the agenda item -- okay. I 13 guess -- I'm sorry; I apologize. It's a recommendation. 14 Your recommendation was that we proceed with the new 15 direction, okay. 16 MR. ARMSTONG: I thank you very much, and 17 appreciate your support. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Item 11, consider, discuss, take 19 appropriate action to designate board member to represent 20 Kerr County on Kerrville Economic Development Foundation 21 Board of Directors pursuant to recommendations of Economic 22 Development Task Force. That's the second item that you were 23 referring to, Commissioner Baldwin. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. And once again, 25 it's a great privilege to nominate or move that Judge Pat 3-22-10 59 1 Tinley be that person on that board. And -- and once again, 2 I want to say why that I endorse Judge Tinley on this kind of 3 board, is because of his desire and ability to see the 4 difference between the commercial tax base and the ad valorem 5 tax base. And I think that is one of the biggest issues of 6 all that this group needs to focus on. And he's talked about 7 that, and I know that's one of his issues, that -- and I 8 appreciate him doing that, and I think it's -- it's 9 important. Very important. So, that's my motion, is to 10 appoint you, sir. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would second that motion, 12 and make a comment along the same lines, Commissioner; that 13 Judge Tinley has been a strong proponent of economic 14 development in Kerr County and the city of Kerrville, and in 15 the whole. And the -- the comments that Commissioner Letz 16 made with respect to economic development that's going to 17 take place in the eastern part of the county is going to be 18 very major over time, and -- and very much a part of that is 19 the infrastructure project that we are undertaking, and the 20 Judge has been a strong supporter of that. So, I heartly 21 endorse Judge Tinley being our representative to Economic 22 Development. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and a second. 24 Further question or discussion on the motion? All in favor 25 of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 3-22-10 60 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Thank you, 5 gentlemen. We appreciate you being here. 6 MR. ARMSTONG: Thank you, gentlemen. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a couple of 10 o'clock 8 items. The first one is Item 12; we'll go to that now. 9 Consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to award the 10 annual material bids for road base, cold mix, aggregate, 11 emulsion oil, and corrugated metal pipe. Mr. Odom? 12 MR. ODOM: Good morning, Judge. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, sir. 14 MR. ODOM: On March the 8th, the last Commissioners 15 Court, you opened the bids. We've had time to review those, 16 and we recommend the awards as follows: Corrugated pipe, 17 Contech Construction Products, Inc. Base material, Allen 18 Keller was low bid, but we also ask the Court to have 19 Wheatcraft, Incorporated, as a backup, depending upon the 20 location, because of the freight. We've done that in the 21 past. Allen Keller would be the first choice. Martin 22 Marietta gave us a bid, but that bid was f.o.b. San Antonio. 23 I don't think that's feasible, so they're not in the running 24 there. I don't wish to run my trucks to San Antonio to get 25 base. Emulsion was Ergon Asphalt and Emulsions, Inc. 3-22-10 61 1 Asphalt products, black base, was Vulcan Construction 2 Materials. Cold mix was Martin Marietta, and paving 3 aggregate was Vulcan Construction Materials. You have the 4 backup data that we have, and last year's bid. You can see 5 that we continue with -- the asphalt products are escalating. 6 We're over $2 a gallon now. I think in the last four years, 7 from my memory, I think we've gone from around upper 80's to 8 $2. And in 2008, we had a barrel of oil at 147, and we have 9 it now around $80, $85, and we're still above where we were 10 in 2008. So, all the products, everything is going up, which 11 we'll do the best we can when we -- it's just getting more 12 difficult to keep your preventive maintenance up. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Leonard, who is the pipe? 14 Who did you -- corrugated metal pipe? 15 MR. ODOM: Contech is a contractor out of west 16 Texas; they've been our supplier. Contech Construction. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On the corrugated pipe, there's 19 a difference in the spread of those. 20 MR. ODOM: Sir? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The spread on the corrugated 22 pipe I thought was pretty large. 23 MR. ODOM: It is large. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Surprising. 25 MR. ODOM: I really was -- Wilson sometimes comes 3-22-10 62 1 in or doesn't, and that spread is getting -- well, 2 commodities, when you hear things now, commodity prices are 3 going up. What you're seeing is people anticipating either a 4 great revamp of the economy, or inflation, and I think it's 5 probably looking at inflation. Dr. Odom here. (Laughter.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: They've got a pretty good economics 7 department down there at Brazos Bottom, don't they? 8 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir, they do. They stick you to it 9 pretty good. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll move we accept the 11 recommendation of the Road and Bridge Administrator. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to accept 14 the recommendation of the Road and Bridge Administrator for 15 materials as indicated. Further question or discussion on 16 the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 17 your right hand. 18 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 20 (No response.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. We'll go to 22 Item 13, again a 10 o'clock timed item. Consider, discuss, 23 take appropriate action to amend the contract with Tetra 24 Tech, Inc., to accommodate a revised scope of work for 25 engineering services relating to Kerrville South Wastewater 3-22-10 63 1 Project to Ranchero Road elements. Commissioner Williams? 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Judge. This 3 hopefully will be the last time we have to bring this to the 4 Court, and we can proceed. Just a little bit of history. 5 We've had a -- to say "difficult" would be an understatement, 6 but a rather intricate and lengthy set of circumstances and 7 negotiations and discussions involving the property owner of 8 Oak Grove Mobile Home Park for expansion of an existing 9 utility easement, the City of Kerrville with respect to its 10 ability to maintain a sewer line in a 10-foot easement or its 11 inability to maintain a sewer line in a 10-foot easement, 12 with property owners with respect to taking a major piece of 13 their property if we continue to examine putting that pipe in 14 an extended utility easement behind their property and behind 15 the Oak Grove Mobile Home Park. And, finally, that has led 16 us to reexamining placing that service line on the Ranchero 17 Road side of those eight -- eight dwellings that comprise a 18 block between Highway 16 on Ranchero Road and Ripplewood. 19 There are eight pieces of property that -- that are part of 20 the funding of the grant we received to wind up the Kerrville 21 South wastewater project. The other element is the mobile 22 home park -- what's the name of it, Keller? 23 MR. DROZDICK: The -- 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The mobile home park down 25 further on the right-hand side; I'll think of it in a minute. 3-22-10 64 1 And that one's okay. Now, we've examined this and reexamined 2 it. We've come back to do some survey. We've asked 3 Mr. Voelkel to check his records going back to the date when 4 his father was involved in the relocation of Ranchero Road or 5 the movement Ranchero Road, and we have discovered -- with 6 Mr. Odom's help and Mr. Voelkels' help, we have discovered 7 that there is sufficient right-of-way owned by the County on 8 the Ranchero Road side to be able to accommodate this 9 particular service line. The service line would be laid in 10 front of those homes, and in each of the locations of those 11 homes, there would be a -- a -- the hookup that would 12 involve, I guess, a grinder pump to push the material up to 13 -- to the service line, which would end up going down to 14 Ripplewood and hooking into the sewer line that's in place on 15 Ripplewood. I asked Mr. Drozdick, who is our engineer from 16 Tetra Tech, to be with us this morning, because I figured the 17 Court was going to have some questions with respect to how 18 can we do this, and in the amount of utility easement 19 available to us on Ranchero Road? And so, Keller, without 20 further ado, if you would be so good as to explain the 21 revised scope of work and how you see our ability to lay this 22 sewer line and get this accomplished without a total 23 disruption of the traffic on Ranchero Road. It's all yours. 24 MR. DROZDICK: Certainly. We haven't had this in a 25 while; we were trying to stay away from this part because of 3-22-10 65 1 the concern over the traffic. That's why we spent so much 2 time trying to get it on the back side of these properties, 3 away from Ranchero Road. Once that proved nearly infeasible, 4 we went back and looked at Ranchero Road, and after 5 investigating with the surveyor, our on-site investigations, 6 including review with your Road and Bridge folk, we found two 7 pleasant surprises. One was that we have about 10 feet of 8 right-of-way remaining between the right-of-way line and the 9 curb itself. We spoke to some contractors, particularly one 10 of the ones that had worked on Phase III, the previous phase. 11 He indicated he had no problem keeping his construction work 12 within a 10-foot easement for the kind of pipe we were 13 proposing, small sewer pipe laid at not too great a depth, so 14 he should be able to do that work and stay entirely within 15 that -- within that boundary, not impacting the traffic 16 significantly at all. 17 In addition, we found that the road -- Ranchero 18 Road in that area is actually quite wide, much wider than 19 typical for a two-lane. Could put about three or four lanes 20 in there if you needed to. So, what we're planning on in the 21 design is the first option being keep all construction within 22 the right-of-way. That does incur some additional expense, 23 scheduled impact, so we will plan for a potential contingency 24 of having that dump truck traffic be in the road itself, but 25 only if that does not impact the traffic flow; that any use 3-22-10 66 1 of the road would require two lanes to be maintained with 2 thru-traffic at all times. Given the amount of room in that 3 road, that should be viable, but that would not be allowed 4 unless we can insure the traffic is not impeded. We'll be 5 staying away from the intersection area, so we shouldn't 6 impact either of the turn lanes. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Question. What are you looking at, 8 time frame, for this work to be accomplished? 9 MR. DROZDICK: Typical is about 12 months start to 10 finish, but that's for the entire package. This one stretch 11 I would expect will take about three to six months. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: What -- do you have a projected 13 start date? What I'm looking at is, obviously, the school 14 vacation. That would be an optimum time. If -- if you're 15 going to have stuff in the way, that would be the time to do 16 it, because the school traffic is what is the killer there, 17 coming and going on Ranchero Road. 18 MR. DROZDICK: We'll try to get this one -- you 19 know, we've got the survey nailed down. We're planning on 20 finalizing the design drawings; we're revising them, getting 21 them back to the City for review. No later than end of next 22 week, hopefully this week, she can do the review process, get 23 this out for contract. I'd like to be able to advertise it 24 in April, will be preferable. One of the constraints on this 25 is funding. This has been around for a long time; starting 3-22-10 67 1 to run up against deadlines. There are a lot of forces 2 pushing us to get the contract out sooner rather than later. 3 If we can get it out roughly that time frame, it's possible 4 they could start construction over the summer. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm glad you mentioned 6 that, because, Judge, following up on your question, we've 7 already asked for and received one extension of the grant 8 funding, and if we don't get the shovel in the ground pretty 9 quick here on this, we stand to lose the funding, and that 10 would not be a good thing. The point is, the -- you're 11 making, Judge, is that if we could accomplish this when 12 school's out, that would be so much the better. And I think 13 what you're indicating, Keller, is that we can do that? 14 MR. DROZDICK: Looks like it. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Particularly by undertaking 16 that piece first. Or, in the alternative, if we get started 17 before school is out, to go work on the Southwind part, 18 because they're really two separate elements, to finish up 19 this thing. If we need to start with the Southwind piece, 20 get that done or well along the way until school is out, and 21 then -- then undertake this piece the beginning of -- as soon 22 as school is out, and complete it before school resumes 23 again, that would be preferable. But bottom line is, we 24 don't have any other options available. And I want to extend 25 my thanks at this point to Ms. Bailey. She's been involved 3-22-10 68 1 with me on numerous meetings, and where we tried to negotiate 2 an extension or an addition to the existing utility easement 3 next to Oak Grove Mobile Home Park, to no avail. The owner 4 of that park has an inflated understanding of what he thinks 5 the value of his property is. And -- (Laughter.) 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's a nice way to put it. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And I don't see the County 8 participating in making him a little richer by -- by 9 purchasing any more easement from him. This is a viable 10 solution. If the Court will approve the extension and 11 revised scope of work, we can get moving forward. And, if 12 necessary, we'll break the thing into two sections to 13 accomplish the point the Judge has made with respect to 14 traffic. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think, back on the school 16 issue, one thing that -- even if it goes into the school year 17 some, as long as there is no work on the road, you know, 18 during the -- 7:00 in the morning to 9:00, or -- and then 19 2 o'clock on. I mean, there can be a window in the middle of 20 the day when it could be used if needed, if you need to go 21 that route, and that should be part of any contract. That if 22 it is -- you know, to at least keep that road completely free 23 at opening and closing of the school. Another question I had 24 is, one of you mentioned -- I think Bill mentioned grinder 25 pumps that would then pump the -- pump some of the -- pump 3-22-10 69 1 the waste up to this line. I'm guessing that's going to cost 2 more to the property owners than would a gravity flow to the 3 back side of the property. Who pays for that additional 4 cost? 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The hookups are part of the 6 grant, because all these properties are eligible for the 7 grant funding, so that should be borne by the grant. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Does the -- the 9 operating cost of those pumps -- 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Then that becomes the 11 property owners' responsibility, ongoing operating expense. 12 But the installation cost is borne by the grant. Once it's 13 in, we don't -- you know, we're finished as far as the County 14 and the project is concerned. We have no further involvement 15 in terms of the operational, anything that takes place 16 operationally. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And this is part of the -- of 18 -- I guess I'm -- well, I'm sure the City will it do in their 19 review, anyway, of this plan. But it just seems if you have 20 these pumps that are the responsibility of the homeowners, I 21 just want to make sure that it's not going to -- all of a 22 sudden, the pump goes out; the person doesn't fix it, and 23 then we have a new problem. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, that would be the 25 individual homeowner's problem if that were allowed to 3-22-10 70 1 happen, and I would think that common sense would dictate 2 that we get that fixed and get that moving again. But that 3 is a property owner's obligation after it's hooked up. And I 4 want to say one other thing -- thank you, Commissioner. I 5 want to say one other thing with respect to involvement by 6 our friends from the City. The engineering department has 7 been very helpful. They laid forth their case that they 8 cannot maintain that line in the utility easement that 9 currently exists back there. There's just not room enough to 10 be able to service that line under any circumstances. And 11 the last meeting we had on the -- on the site, the County -- 12 and I'm not sure -- a whole bunch of us, but the City 13 indicated this was a preferred option and that this would 14 pose no problems for ongoing service. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is it you're asking us 16 to approve today? 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Revision of the scope of 18 work, which is to their engineering. That will allow us to 19 move forward with this exclusion, putting the line in on the 20 Ranchero side. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The 10-foot easement that 22 somebody can work inside of? 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes. 24 MR. DROZDICK: Well -- 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It is a county easement, so 3-22-10 71 1 there's no purchase price involved to the County. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The enlargement of the scope of work 3 would increase the engineering services, but those two would 4 be paid out of the grant. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Correct. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: As a matter of fact, it's 8 probably going to be paid for out of the match that U.G.R.A. 9 provided some time ago. We were talking to Ms. Hargis about 10 that, but U.G.R.A. put up a $25,000 match before they 11 transferred that system to the city of Kerrville some time 12 ago. And that's been -- it was tendered to us some time ago, 13 and received and acknowledged, so those dollars are in place. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Motion? 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I would move that the Court 16 approve the agenda item revising the scope of work for 17 engineering services relating to Kerrville South Wastewater 18 Project, and Ranchero Road elements. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 21 indicated. Further question or discussion on that motion? 22 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 23 hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3-22-10 72 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Why don't we 3 take about a 15-minute recess. 4 (Recess taken from 10:34 a.m. to 10:50 a.m.) 5 - - - - - - - - - - 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's come back to order, if 7 we might, please, get back onto our agenda. We will pick 8 back up with Item 5; to consider, discuss, and take 9 appropriate action on reducing the registration fee to one 10 dollar for a rabies clinic at Doyle Community Center on April 11 the 10th, 2010. Ms. Whitt? 12 MS. WHITT: Actually, that date has been changed to 13 the 24th instead of the 10th. Dr. Barbutti will not be 14 available on April 10th. And, as I mentioned during last -- 15 briefly during last Commissioners Court, we're wanting to put 16 on a small rabies clinic at the Doyle Community Center, and 17 we're asking that you consider reducing the registration fee 18 to one dollar for that day. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Bailey, is it going to be 20 necessary that we re-agenda that item for the 24th? 'Cause 21 it is specific as to the 10th. 22 MS. BAILEY: It probably is. You could approve it 23 and then come back and ratify the change in date at another 24 time, but you probably need to fix it in another meeting. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: What you're saying is approve the 3-22-10 73 1 item at a date to be determined by Animal Control Department? 2 MS. BAILEY: Yeah, because you have the -- you 3 still have time before that new date to come back and -- and 4 specify the date -- correct the date. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Would it not be just as easy to wait 6 until the 12th of April? 7 MS. BAILEY: You could do that. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: And just do the whole thing then? 9 MS. BAILEY: That would be probably just as good. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Unless she needs this time 12 frame of getting things set up with doctors. 13 MS. WHITT: Well, and that's why I believe 14 Dr. Barbutti moved it to the 24th. That would give us a 15 little bit more time to advertise in that area, and then get 16 things, you know, set up and all. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So, what you're looking at is 18 the 24th, but an expression of interest from this Court as to 19 the willingness to having a reduced registration fee -- 20 MS. WHITT: Correct. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: -- of one dollar at that particular 22 location at a future date to be determined by you? 23 MS. WHITT: Yes. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Any member of the Court have any 25 negative thoughts about that? 3-22-10 74 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir. I think that we've 2 always -- we've always participated in that type of program. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Is that good enough for you? 4 MS. WHITT: Yes, sir. Thank you. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Thank you, ma'am. Let's 6 go to Item 6 then; consider, discuss, take appropriate action 7 to allocate funding for -- from the 2007 or 2010 capital 8 funds and approve air duct cleaning of the courthouse and 9 jail. 10 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. Thank you, Judge. Here a 11 couple weeks ago, we had a problem over in County Court at 12 Law with Judge Brown. We cleaned out his duct system. And 13 we had that problem -- we don't have that problem any more. 14 Here a couple months ago, we had a problem over in the 15 clerk's office where we had a smell coming in that office. 16 We could not find it. So, I know it's coming out of that 17 duct work. So, the only way I know to resolve this problem 18 is to clean the ducts here at the courthouse, and to clean 19 the ducts at the jail while we're at it. I have taken the 20 time to get two bids. I have one bid from -- from Cornbread 21 and Sons, and I have another bid from Steamatic and Airtech. 22 Airtech and Steamatic will work together on this project. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's your recommendation? 24 MR. BOLLIER: My recommendation is Steamatic and 25 Airtech. But the only way we can go forward with this 3-22-10 75 1 project is if Jeannie, our Auditor, to find the money. 2 (Laughter.) 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's a pretty good thing 4 to do. 5 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Hargis? Got any ideas for us? 7 MS. HARGIS: Well, we have some items on the 2010 8 -- I mean 2009 bond issue that we could use, but we need to 9 wait just a little bit longer to make sure that those items 10 are complete, that being the radios, and there's some money 11 left from radios. There's some money left in some of the 12 automobiles, but I haven't found 30,000 yet. I can come up 13 with about 10. I haven't found the full 30,000. So, we do 14 have -- of course, we know the building out -- the annex is 15 costing us a lot less, but I didn't know if we wanted to use 16 any of those funds or not. So, there is some money there, 17 but I -- there's projects still outstanding, and I want to be 18 sure those are complete. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Bollier, are the different 20 locations broken down separately under these proposals? 21 MR. BOLLIER: Just -- just one is. Cornbread and 22 Sons has broke it down. Now, Steamatic and Airtech did not 23 break it down; they just give me one complete bid for both 24 places. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3-22-10 76 1 MS. BAILEY: Did we go out for bids on this? 2 JUDGE TINLEY: No. It's just -- they just -- 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Under 50,000. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: -- solicited quotes. 5 MR. BOLLIER: It's under 50,000. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How much? 7 MR. BOLLIER: The Steam -- Steamatic and Airtech 8 were 29,000 and some change, and Cornbread and Sons was 9 almost 32,000. And Airtech and Steamatic, they're going a 10 little bit further than what Cornbread and Sons were going 11 to, because Cornbread cannot touch my -- the A/C units, 12 because they're not licensed to do so. That's the reason 13 that Steamatic and Airtech are doing this -- are doing this 14 together, so that way Airtech can come in, check the 15 air-conditioners, and they're coming and doing it all and 16 making sure that all coils are clean, and everything else in 17 that air-conditioner is clean. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Who's the subcontractor and 19 who's the contract with? 20 MR. BOLLIER: Airtech. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: They're our current provider for 22 HVAC services under our master bid program. Ms. Hargis, do 23 you suppose it might be necessary -- it might be that by next 24 meeting, you could -- 25 MS. HARGIS: Let me review some items, bring them 3-22-10 77 1 to the Court, and get y'all to approve it. Any surplus money 2 from that has to be approved for use by you. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 4 MS. HARGIS: So, let me make sure that the items 5 that I know where we have some surplus are complete. Some of 6 the cars are coming in now. I want to make sure that the 7 cost factor on those is -- is what we have budgeted, and then 8 we'll bring back those areas where I know that there's 9 surplus and have you approve it. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. All right. And, Mr. Bollier, 11 the other thing I would ask you to do is see if you can get 12 Steamatic/Airtech to segregate theirs as between jail and 13 courthouse. We may want to do this in two increments. 14 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. I can do that, sir. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: That's -- can you do that? 16 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, I will. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. And we'll take a look at it 18 come April 12th. 19 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. Thank you, sir. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Let's go to Item 7; 21 consider, discuss, take appropriate action on problems 22 associated with new telephone system. I have here 23 Commissioner Baldwin, Precinct 2. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: When did you move? 3-22-10 78 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm still trying to get 2 Riverhill into my precinct. (Laughter.) You know? 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, be a long -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've observed you all this 5 time, and I found out if I just keep chipping away, I'll end 6 up with something. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It will be a long slog, 8 Commissioner. Keep on going. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't give up easy. Now, 10 when we put this on here, I -- we had some telephone 11 problems. Do we have telephone problems today? 12 MR. TRAINUM: Not that I -- that I'm aware of. We 13 actually -- I mean, everything in our help desk and the punch 14 list that I.T. gave us has been completed. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. The one that -- the 16 complaint that stood out in my mind was in the County Clerk's 17 office. Like, if the phone's ringing, a clerk is sitting 18 there and hears the phone ringing somewhere in there. 19 MR. TRAINUM: Right. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: She couldn't tell whose 21 phone by looking at her phone. She -- nothing blinked or not 22 the correct one blinked or something like that. 23 MR. TRAINUM: I was never made aware of that issue. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that still a problem? 25 MS. PIEPER: It's the ring tones that is our 3-22-10 79 1 problem. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Ring tones, okay. 3 MR. TRAINUM: And generally, my company never 4 covers ring tones, 'cause it is a user setting. I showed 5 I.T. Department how to upload the ring tones to the phone and 6 change them, so -- 7 MS. BAILEY: We're still having the problem of 8 people calling in and ringing a couple of times and 9 disconnecting or going straight to voice mail when we're 10 sitting there, and our phone doesn't ring. 11 MR. TRAINUM: I need to know which phones are doing 12 that. I -- 13 MS. BAILEY: I know Barbara's did last week, and 14 mine does it on a pretty regular basis. The other ones may 15 as well; I don't know. 16 MR. TRAINUM: But, I mean, it's hard for me to fix 17 a problem if I don't know about it. 18 MS. BAILEY: We notified you of that one, Drew. 19 MR. TRAINUM: Right, but you didn't tell me which 20 phones. So -- 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Would it be appropriate if any of 22 these malfunctions, that we keep a master list going with 23 I.T.? Wouldn't that be the logical place? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what we do. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3-22-10 80 1 MS. HYDE: That's what he's got. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And for some reason, we 3 can't get over the hump. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm particularly interested about 5 this fax issue that we've heard so much about. 6 MS. PIEPER: The echo and the fax. 7 MS. HYDE: The echo and fax. 8 MR. TRAINUM: The echo's the T-1. Right now, like, 9 let's say someone calls 792-2257; 257 is the identifier for 10 that line. So what's happening is, the way it's coming in is 11 it's coming in as 2, 25, 257. It's sending three packets for 12 every one packet. Which I have no control over that. That's 13 something that's on Windstream. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: And the -- PSI? 15 MR. TRAINUM: The PRI. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: The PRI. That's going to solve that 17 problem? 18 MR. TRAINUM: Yes, sir. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Irrespective where we procure that, 20 that's going to solve that problem? 21 MR. TRAINUM: Right. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: But that's what it's going to take 23 to solve the problem? 24 MR. TRAINUM: Right, and that also should fix most 25 of the problems with the outgoing faxes, 'cause right now, 3-22-10 81 1 all your incoming lines are coming -- a majority of the 2 incoming lines are coming in on that T-1. All the outgoing 3 lines are coming in on POTS -- or going out on POTS lines, or 4 plain old telephone lines. So, when you get a PRI, it's a 5 dual-channel, which means both your incoming and outgoing are 6 handled by the same one. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Tell us what PRI is, 8 please. 9 MR. TRAINUM: It's 100 percent digital circuit for 10 voice. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 100 percent digital 12 circuit. 13 MR. TRAINUM: Yes, sir. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which is not what we 15 currently have? 16 MR. TRAINUM: Y'all have an RBS T-1. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And that is? 18 MR. TRAINUM: It's a 20-year-old model of the T-1 19 that's never been upgraded. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What? 21 MR. TRAINUM: It's the way they did the T-1's 20 22 years ago. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Not digital? 24 MR. TRAINUM: It's partially digital. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Partially digital. 3-22-10 82 1 MR. TRAINUM: Right. That's the main issue, is 2 it's not 100 percent digital. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But it's in the plans to 4 upgrade that anyway, isn't it? 5 MR. TROLINGER: I'm doing my best to get the item 6 approved, yes, sir. (Laughter.) 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Keep trying. 8 MR. TROLINGER: I feel ill prepared this week. I 9 apologize. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Don't give up, John. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: We're going to work on that some 12 more, Commissioner. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are you finished, 14 Commissioners, down there? The -- when I call in and try to 15 get Jody -- usually it's -- 90 percent of the time, that's 16 who I'm trying to get on the phone. The -- the recording, 17 the hold music or recording music is -- it is just awful, and 18 loud. 19 MR. TRAINUM: I changed the volume of the hold 20 music. So -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You mean that jazz? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So that's not on that list, 23 John? That's my -- 24 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir, I believe that was 25 resolved on Friday. 3-22-10 83 1 MR. TRAINUM: Yes, it was Friday. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, I'll call in and find 3 out. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Call and see. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you talking about that 6 jazz stuff? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't know what it was. I 8 couldn't hear, it was so loud. 9 MR. TRAINUM: It's now -- it's acoustic guitar now, 10 so -- 11 MS. PIEPER: Our headsets are not working, either, 12 like they used to. 13 MR. TRAINUM: Yes. And -- okay, I got a printout 14 from Plantronic that says those head sets are compatible. 15 Also, too, in the manuals to those headsets, it says you 16 should only use the headset part if you're not using 17 automatic handset lifter, and if you have a preprogrammed 18 headset button on the phone. In this configuration, you must 19 press the headset button on your phone and the call control 20 button on the headset to answer incoming calls. So, 21 therefore, the handsets are -- the headsets are working as 22 described in the manual. 23 MS. PIEPER: Well, used to we could be across the 24 room; if our phone rang, we could just punch the button. 25 MR. TRAINUM: You had lifters on them. 3-22-10 84 1 MS. PIEPER: But even with my lifter, I can't do 2 that. 3 MR. TRAINUM: You should. Then it's hooked up 4 wrong. If you're using your lifter, you have to actually 5 plug it into the handset, not headset. 6 MS. PIEPER: Okay, I'll doublecheck that. 7 MS. HYDE: Okay, it's already double-checked on 8 these. It's already plugged in; those little headset things 9 pop up like they're supposed to. The bottom line is we paid 10 $300 and $400 so that people can be mobile. 11 MR. TRAINUM: Right. 12 MS. HYDE: And -- excuse me. And we've talked 13 about this. So, we have them throughout the courthouse. 14 Because we don't sit at our desks. So, to have a phone 15 ringing when we're 50 yards away, it was very nice to be able 16 to answer those people, the public when they called, or 17 employees when they called. And now what we're being told is 18 we need to be sitting at our desk, push that little button, 19 push another button -- and they don't work. Bottom line, 20 they don't work. You yourself told me in my office that they 21 wouldn't work; that that was not how they were designed. 22 MR. TRAINUM: I told you that they would work 23 according to this. You hear sound through them. You can 24 talk back and forth through them. They work. 25 MS. HYDE: As long as we're sitting at the desk 3-22-10 85 1 pushing the buttons every single time. 2 MR. TRAINUM: But can you get up and walk around 3 while you're talking after the -- 4 MS. HYDE: After we answer the phone. 5 MR. TRAINUM: Well, then they work. 6 MS. HYDE: That's not what it was doing. 7 MR. BOLLIER: I want to go back to the fax machine. 8 I got to go back to -- my fax machine is a crucial part of my 9 work, because all my work orders come in on my fax machine. 10 My fax machine hasn't worked in over a month, and it still 11 doesn't work. And, yes, I have asked you about it, and yes, 12 you run a new fax line down to my fax machine, but my fax 13 machine does not work. Now, when all these 300-plus ladies 14 that work for Kerr County start getting on me, I'm going to 15 send them to you, my friend. 16 MR. TRAINUM: Well, your fax machine -- I didn't 17 know that it didn't work after you ran the fax line. 18 MR. BOLLIER: I told you, Drew. I -- 19 MR. TRAINUM: I never got -- 20 MR. BOLLIER: I'm not in here for an argument, but 21 I'm telling you now, my fax machine doesn't work, and I need 22 it fixed. 23 MR. TRAINUM: Okay, I will look at it. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Get those in writing to 25 Mr. Trolinger. All these issues on malfunctions, get them to 3-22-10 86 1 Mr. Trolinger. As you can tell, Drew, we're -- we're getting 2 some frustration levels here that are higher than I want to 3 contend with. 4 MR. TRAINUM: Yes, sir. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: And I want performance. I want 6 these things operating properly. I understand the -- going 7 from the T-1 to the PRI is another issue, and we got to get 8 that solved, and we will get that solved. 9 MR. TRAINUM: Okay. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: But these things that are not 11 dependent upon that, those need to be resolved forthwith. 12 MR. TRAINUM: Okay. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: If you got to stay down here, you 14 know, through the middle of the night, that's -- so be it. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I want to go back to 16 my letter -- 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- that I brought up last 19 time, and Drew was not in this room. This is a letter to 20 Drew from acting County Attorney Bailey, and it was mailed on 21 February 24th, and it says, "Please be advised that if you 22 cannot provide the Commissioners Court and the I.T. 23 Department with some real and immediate assurance that the 24 remaining items will be addressed to their satisfaction 25 within the next ten days, it may become necessary for the 3-22-10 87 1 Court to exercise its available options to have the system 2 completed by another vendor. If this becomes necessary, any 3 damages, including additional costs to the County, will 4 become your financial responsibility." Now, that -- that was 5 26 days ago. She gave you 10 days to get 'er done. 6 MR. TRAINUM: And those were completed for the 7 majority of the 10 days. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And today is 26 days, and 9 we're in here fussing. And I'm not saying -- I'm not saying 10 we need to cut you off and hire somebody else. I'm not 11 saying that. But I'm saying that that's coming. 12 MR. TRAINUM: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If we don't get this stuff 14 fixed pretty dadgum quick. I mean, this is not a school 15 class -- playground. This is a government. We've got to be 16 up and running. 17 MR. TRAINUM: I understand that. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. Thank you for your 19 time. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Any member of the Court have 21 anything further on that? Let's move to Item 9; consider, 22 discuss, take appropriate action to replace current Pitney 23 Bowes postage meter with a new meter, enter into a new 24 contract, authorize County Judge to sign same. Ms. Williams? 25 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. Good morning, gentlemen. 3-22-10 88 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Morning. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Morning. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Don't call us a bunch of 4 gentlemen. 5 MS. WILLIAMS: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Unless you want to. 7 MS. WILLIAMS: Four gentlemen and... 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 9 MS. WILLIAMS: We won't go there. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Four gentlemen and Buster. 11 MS. WILLIAMS: And Buster, yeah. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Good shot. 14 MS. WILLIAMS: The current Pitney Bowes postage 15 meter that I have, the contract will be expiring in July of 16 this year. That machine was down there when I got there, not 17 realizing that is actually a commercial contract. That is 18 why our cost is a little bit higher on it right now. I can 19 get that one replaced with a new meter which is just one step 20 down, and it will cost me, if I go with the five-year 21 contract, the 60-month contract, $53 a month. I'm paying 22 probably about $70 a month right now. So, I would like to 23 get the Court's approval to go ahead and change out my 24 postage meter. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So moved. 3-22-10 89 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 3 approval. Question. This is a government contract subject 4 to annual appropriation, I assume? 5 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. And I had the County -- 6 the acting County Attorney check the terms and conditions 7 before I ever put it on the agenda, and she's given it her 8 blessing. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 MS. WILLIAMS: And it is bid through Buy Board, so 11 it's already been bid. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, thank you. 13 MS. WILLIAMS: Thank you. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion? All 15 in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Item 14 is 20 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to identify 21 eligible Kerr County projects for presentation and 22 consideration by TexDOT at subsequent meetings of the Alamo 23 Regional Rural Planning Organization. Commissioner Williams? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Judge. As I 25 indicated two weeks ago, I would bring this back for the 3-22-10 90 1 Court to identify for me any projects that fall under the 2 categories that we've outlined in the backup statement; 3 safety projects, bridge structure replacement or 4 rehabilitation, on- or off-system, either one, preventive 5 maintenance or rehab projects, which could include 6 sealcoating, road-widening projects, storm-related projects, 7 and if you wish for it to be considered, I've given you a 8 copy of the District Engineer's letter with respect to the 9 great program TexDOT has called High Dollar Pass-Through, 10 which means we pay, they reimburse, sometimes in your 11 lifetime. (Laughter.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Somebody's lifetime. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Somebody's lifetime. So, 14 if we have any of those, if you'll give them to me before 15 next Wednesday -- not before, a week from this Wednesday, 16 when we have the next A.A.R.P.O. meeting with the District 17 Engineer, I'll be happy to advance them on behalf of Kerr 18 County. That's all. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: You're merely making a request to 20 the various commissioners as to their own precincts? 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just give me a note, tell 22 me what it is. We'll go from there. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything further, gentlemen? Let's 24 move on to 15; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 25 approve concurring with waiver request for well location in 3-22-10 91 1 Hill Country Ranch Estates. Commissioner Letz? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I apologize for the wording on 3 that. I think a few words might have got left out somewhere 4 during the translation, but what we're talking about here is 5 120 Riojas, Hill Country Ranch Estates. There's a property 6 there, and they want to drill a well. There is a -- 7 Headwaters has a setback requirement from the property line 8 to get a well permit. We are the property line owners, 9 'cause it's the county right-of-way that they need the 10 setback from. They physically cannot get a well location 11 that required setback requirement under Headwaters rules from 12 the front property -- or from our county right-of-way. So, 13 what the -- they can get it about 40 feet off the road. I 14 think it's -- I believe it's 75 foot is their standard -- 15 what they require. But to process this application, they -- 16 Headwaters doesn't have any problem with it, but we need to 17 give a -- grant a waiver to let them locate the well closer 18 than the minimum required Headwaters rules, and that will 19 come in the -- the actual waiver will come in the form of a 20 property line separation request from Headwaters at the time 21 that they actually need it. And I'll make a motion that we 22 authorize the County Judge to sign the property line 23 separation request granting the waiver to let the property 24 owner at 120 Riojas locate their well closer to the county 25 right-of-way. 3-22-10 92 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 3 indicated. Further question or discussion on the motion? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's 40 feet now? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's going to be about 40 feet 6 where they need to put it. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's going to be about 40 8 feet. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I cannot remember what the 10 setback requirement is. I think it's -- 11 MS. BAILEY: I thought 40. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Maybe it's 50 feet. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's what I thought. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Anyway, they want to get 15 whatever the minimum is that Headwaters requires. And 16 Headwaters -- Gene Williams looked at it, and they just -- 17 the rig falls off a cliff, literally. I mean, the way the 18 lot is configured. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You don't think it would be 20 important to put a particular figure in there from what we're 21 going to allow? Or just -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- give them whatever? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We could -- I think that's a 25 good point. We could add to it that it will be as far from 3-22-10 93 1 the property line as possible, and in no event closer than 2 30 feet. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There you go. Fantastic. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I like that. Good. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So, that's your corrected 6 motion? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Very well. And we have a second? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion on 11 the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 12 your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. We'll go to 17 Item 16; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action on 18 status of ETJ agreement with the city of Kerrville. 19 Commissioner Letz? 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This has been a fast-moving 21 target recently. You might recall that at our last court 22 meeting, I gave an update that Councilman Motheral and myself 23 met on the 25th of -- I guess we were going to meet on the 24 25th of February to go over it, and we did that. At that 25 meeting, we agreed to meet the following Wednesday, which was 3-22-10 94 1 March 2nd, with Mike Hayes and Ilse Bailey at that meeting, 2 because there were some legal issues that had come up, 3 primarily related to the model subdivision rules that Kerr 4 County has adopted as being a Subchapter C county, or under 5 Chapter 232, and also some other requirements just of state 6 law, legal issues that both Councilman Motheral and I thought 7 were appropriate to get answered, because we were for the 8 most part very close, other than some verbiage changes, to 9 working out a blended set of agreements. 10 The following -- last City Council meeting, which, 11 I guess, was March 9th, I wasn't present, but evidently 12 Councilman Motheral came in and wanted to go -- a 13 recommendation, from what I've been told, to go to 14 arbitration, and a lot of comments were made about how 15 difficult I was to work with, and they were frustrated and on 16 and on about that. And it took me by -- by shock when I got 17 that, and I was -- obviously, I wasn't very happy. I 18 probably said some things that I probably shouldn't have. 19 But Bruce never brought up at their Council meeting that we 20 were currently waiting on the City Attorney to give us some 21 information on some legal issues that are very critical to 22 this whole process. And at that meeting, the joint meeting, 23 it was clearly said, in my opinion, anyway, that -- I think 24 Ilse can say if it wasn't -- that we were very close on the 25 issues of roads and drainage and all that. We were -- 3-22-10 95 1 basically had an agreement on those. There were some things 2 we had to work out, but these legal issues were very 3 important. 4 One of them is -- and it's in the current draft 5 that -- well, let me go back a little bit further. There are 6 two things that have happened since then. Last Thursday, a 7 lengthy document was provided to me and I think the rest of 8 the Court from the City Manager, which contained a new 9 agreement -- new draft agreement. And then on Saturday, 10 Councilman Motheral revised that agreement again and sent 11 over a new version again of the draft. So, I haven't really 12 looked at the final draft, other than looking through it off 13 and on during the break today, trying to see what changes 14 were made and not made. Needless to say, you know, 15 basically, I got it this morning when I walked in, the final 16 version. By glancing at it, there are still things that 17 would put us in violation of state law that we clearly, in my 18 opinion, cannot sign; would put us in violation of model 19 subdivision rules, which puts us in violation of Chapter 232, 20 Subchapter C. And I don't think -- you know, therefore, I 21 cannot support going through with this. 22 I'm currently in a discussion on a lot of these 23 issues, both with the Attorney General's office and the Water 24 Development Board's legal staff, and pretty much they flat 25 told me last week that we would be in violation if we went 3-22-10 96 1 forward with this agreement right now. So, clearly, we -- in 2 my opinion, I can't approve this document. And I've got some 3 other problems. As a lot of you know, they're fairly minor 4 from the standpoint of, you know, getting -- moving forward, 5 but they need to be resolved. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Jon, would you give us an 7 example of what it is that we would be -- the state law is in 8 place, and -- 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The most clear one is that the 10 model subdivision rules require that we enforce a provision 11 that there is only one dwelling or residential unit per lot. 12 The draft came in from the City is on -- goes up to four, 13 four residential units per lot. That's a conflict. I mean, 14 and it may be something that can be worked out between, you 15 know, the agreement and the Water Development Board's legal 16 staff, but it's something we can't approach. And I don't 17 think this document -- I mean, unless we adopt the model 18 subdivision rules completely into this agreement, it has to 19 go to Water Development Board's legal counsel for approval, 20 because we don't have authority to change that. Some other 21 areas that are broad areas of concern, I think we all know 22 there's a series of exemptions that are allowed to all 23 property owners outside of municipalities under 232 -- 24 Chapter 232, such as if you finance it through the Veterans 25 Land Board, you're exempt from platting. Those are not part 3-22-10 97 1 of these rules. 2 I don't understand how a county -- how we can enter 3 -- and there's 12 or so exemptions, I believe. I don't 4 understand how we can enter into an agreement that tells the 5 citizens of Kerr County that, you know, they're not -- they 6 don't have to comply with state law, or we're going to, you 7 know, put them in a position where they're not going to be 8 able to get the exemptions that the state law gives them. 9 And the issue comes in that those exemptions aren't under 10 212, which are the city's rules. And, you know, Kevin 11 Coleman -- I see him nodding. We've talked about these 12 things a year and a half now, and -- some of these. So, 13 anyway, they're things that just need to be resolved. I 14 thought we were very close. Councilman Motheral evidently 15 feels otherwise. And the document that was received from the 16 City Manager last week, the recommended action is that they 17 basically approve the draft document and send it to us, give 18 us 30 days. If we don't approve it, we go to arbitration. 19 Well, since I don't think we can approve it, I 20 think we just go to arbitration today. If the City doesn't 21 want to sit down and continue to negotiate, which they 22 evidently don't, let's go to arbitration and start Phase 3 of 23 these things, which should not be that difficult. I think 24 it's sad, to me, that we can't get there. My opinion is that 25 one of the biggest problems is that I've been very close to 3-22-10 98 1 having agreements with City staff, and then it gets to City 2 Council and it falls apart. I had a meeting -- when I talked 3 with Todd Parton on March 3rd, I believe -- no, it was 4 March 4th. No, excuse me, it was after City Council; it was 5 the 11th. He made the comment to me -- it really telling. 6 He goes, "I don't understand why we can't just come up with a 7 set of rules that we can agree on. I don't care who enforces 8 them." I go, "Todd, the issue is Councilman Motheral doesn't 9 look at it that way. He has been adamant that the rules will 10 be enforced by the city of Kerrville." So, I mean, right 11 there -- if we have a City Manager telling me one thing, City 12 Council saying something different, or one member of City 13 Council saying something different. So, I mean... Now, I do 14 agree at this point, I don't think it's productive for 15 Councilman Motheral and myself to continue to try to work out 16 a deal, because Councilman Motheral doesn't appear to want to 17 work out a deal. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with that statement. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You know, I think that if it -- 20 if I could -- you know, if it was the City Manager or, you 21 know, city staff -- I think that Kevin Coleman and I came 22 very close to coming to an agreement before. But if Council 23 is going to continue to want to negotiate a deal -- which, to 24 me, is not their responsibility, but if they want do it that 25 way, that's their prerogative, certainly -- I don't see that 3-22-10 99 1 we're going to get there. And that's -- it's sad. I see 2 Councilperson Keeble in the back of the room. I think it's 3 right after she was elected to Council last June, she made 4 the comment, "We'll probably just go to arbitration; we're 5 not going to get there." And, unfortunately, I think she's 6 right. I don't think that we're going to be able to get a 7 deal with -- working with Council one-on-one. I think we can 8 get a deal working with -- through the City Manager's office, 9 because I think that, you know, we're there almost right now. 10 But I don't like ultimatums. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Jon, other than the legal issues 12 occasioned by the model subdivision rules that -- that we 13 have signed onto as a component of some significant 14 financing -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mm-hmm. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: -- requirements that we have pending 17 under the Water Development Board, other than those issues 18 that would revolve around the model subdivision rules, are 19 there any other major -- well, first, are there other issues? 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There are a lot of small 21 issues. One that's not -- there's a lot of small issues, but 22 I think they can be resolved. There are things -- I would 23 want to talk with Len Odom again about some of the 24 right-of-way widths. These are county -- these are roads in 25 the E.T.J. that are going to be county responsibility more 3-22-10 100 1 than city responsibility. I understand we just need to make 2 sure that we're all exactly -- that the County can work on 3 this situation, and City can. The City has less right-of-way 4 than the County does on a lot of roads, and I want to make 5 sure that for a -- while we require a 60-foot right-of-way, 6 they require a 40-foot. In lots of parts of this county, you 7 know, 40 foot's not enough. I think the city rules, though, 8 allow for a greater right-of-way if needed, so I think it can 9 work. But there's a few things I just want to check off. 10 There is a provision in there that I'm very happy 11 that Councilman Motheral has agreed with, is that P & Z, 12 which is the mechanism under the draft that's being looked at 13 most right now, does the approval process, but they cannot 14 approve it until they get a certification from Len Odom that 15 he's happy with the road construction, things like that. And 16 that is a big plus. That's something that I've been very 17 adamant about. But what is not included is how a developer 18 gets a road from -- going through P & Z system into the 19 county road system. It's kind of part of the platting 20 process with us when we're handling it all. But if a 21 developer -- we have to formally accept a road. We can't 22 give that authority to P & Z. So, if a development's in the 23 ETJ and they want it to be a county road, there has to be a 24 clear way for the developer to -- you know, somewhere in this 25 process, that they're going to have to jump from P & Z back 3-22-10 101 1 to the County, and that's not really addressed, other than it 2 just has to be done. That's pretty much where it is. And I 3 don't like things that just have to be done; I like to have 4 pretty set procedures on things. 5 And an issue that I have a little -- a problem 6 with, and I don't know how we're going to get around it, 7 'cause I don't -- it doesn't make that much difference to me 8 if the City administers these rules, but there's some issues 9 that -- it goes to city -- a lot of the city's subdivision 10 ordinances refers to city standards, "then current city 11 standards." We're not approving city standards. We're 12 approving an agreement, and the City can change those after 13 -- you know, as things happen, which then changes the 14 standards in the county. And I don't know how we get around 15 that. But I think it's a little bit of an issue. I think we 16 can work it out, because I think our standards are -- 17 technical issues are very, very close. Drainage, I think 18 we're almost exactly the same right now. Roads, we're 19 slightly different, but we're very close. So, I think, to 20 answer your question, we're almost there. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me just throw out a couple of 22 items here, if I might, Commissioner, dealing with the 23 acceptance of roads by the County. If the -- if these rules 24 were to merely make reference that if the road lies within 25 the county, if they are to be maintained, must be accepted 3-22-10 102 1 for maintenance by the County under existing county 2 procedures. It just makes a reference over -- 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, yeah. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: But would that not solve the 5 problem? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That would solve the problem. 7 You know, so there's lots. I mean, but there's a lot of 8 things like that. There's one in there on bond requirement 9 for a road. The bond is -- the bond for a county road is 10 approved by the City Engineer. Well, no, I don't think that 11 I want the City -- anybody in the city approving a bond on a 12 county property. I think it either needs to go to the County 13 Attorney's office or Auditor, something like that. That's 14 not a big problem. I think it's easily fixable. I'm sure 15 when Councilman Motheral wrote this draft, he said, okay, 16 City Engineer does it for the city; just leave it like that. 17 So, I mean, they are certainly fixable. And I called these 18 minor issues; that's what I've said for quite a while, that 19 we're past the problems on the substantive issues. There are 20 some substantive legal questions that have to be resolved on 21 how some of these things are done. Water availability is 22 another one. You know, I'm not positive on what the City's 23 authority is on water availability. All of our rules are 24 based on lots and water availability. I don't know how the 25 -- you know, and I just truly don't know. I don't know if 3-22-10 103 1 the City has water availability, if they have their -- the 2 same legal authority that we do under the Water Code. You 3 know, Kevin's nodding yes, but it's -- we just need to make 4 sure all of these things are addressed and that they're 5 looked at legally. Now, I'm not happy with the idea of them 6 going through P & Z. But the other option was to come up 7 with another entity, and I don't know that that's any better 8 either, so I just -- I've agreed. I said yeah, I'll live 9 with P & Z. I don't like it, but, you know, if that's the 10 way to get us moving down the road, so be it. But it's just 11 the -- you know, the approach that Councilman Motheral took 12 most recently really set me back, and was irritating and 13 frustrating. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let me weigh in also on 15 what you said earlier, Commissioner, with respect to the 16 model subdivision rules. In my box this morning was a letter 17 from Water Development Board with respect to the Center 18 Point/East Kerr County wastewater project. And we are moving 19 systematically through their process for planning. And the 20 letter I have here is a letter confirming approval of the 21 Section B of the -- of the four-phase planning that we're 22 engaged in right now. We're undertaking, with the engineer 23 that was here earlier, Section C and D. The model 24 subdivision rules are extraordinarily important, and we're 25 not going to -- at least I'll say this Commissioner is not 3-22-10 104 1 going to agree to anything that infringes upon our ability to 2 get this project completed. So, if we have to make some 3 amendments to this issue in order to find -- or the City has 4 to make some amendments to this issue for us to find accord, 5 then so be it. That's the way it has to be, because we're 6 not going to do anything, in my opinion, that's going to 7 breach this agreement with Water Development Board to move 8 this project forward. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I guess what frustrated me 10 so much with Councilman Motheral's actions were when we met 11 five days or six days prior to him changing course at City 12 Council, their last City Council meeting, what I asked was 13 for the City Attorney to look at this and contact the Water 14 Development Board's attorneys. I mean, they're the ones that 15 have the ability to approve it. They may look at city 16 standards and say, "That's good enough for us. We'll sign 17 off on it." But I don't think the County has authority -- 18 well, I know the County does not have authority to make that 19 call. That's a call that has to be made by the Water 20 Development Board's legal staff. And -- you know, and for it 21 to come up in City Council that -- that I'm throwing out new 22 things, that bring up -- I brought this up to Councilman 23 Motheral in our meeting in early November, when I first 24 brought up the issue of model subdivision rules. And it came 25 up that he was working off an outdated set of county rules to 3-22-10 105 1 start with. I said, "No, Bruce, those aren't the right 2 rules. You need to get our current set of rules." So, you 3 know, I truly thought we were there. I think I've told 4 Council; I've told the Court that yes, it's been a difficult 5 process working with Councilman Motheral, but we're getting 6 there. But after this last change by the City, I don't know. 7 I mean, I think if we're going to work with -- you know, my 8 preference would be to work with the City Manager, 'cause I 9 think we can come up with a resolution then. But I'm not 10 willing to meet with Councilman Motheral one-on-one any more. 11 I'll put it that way. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Finally said it. 13 MR. COLEMAN: I don't think you have that date set. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Don't think we've got that meeting 15 firmed up, do you? 16 MR. COLEMAN: Might I -- if I can? 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Surely. Surely. 18 MR. COLEMAN: Y'all know me, Kevin Coleman with the 19 City of Kerrville Development Services. This is a tough -- 20 you guys have been on this rope with us for a while. I'm not 21 certain that -- what I heard Tuesday night, and I was there a 22 couple Tuesdays ago, was maybe just what you just said, that 23 the process between you and Councilman Motheral has gone 24 about as far as it can go. He presented that idea about 25 bringing it to arbitration, and Council said, well -- 3-22-10 106 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Let me say something. That is 2 not where I was prior to that. 3 MR. COLEMAN: I understand that. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought we were doing fine. 5 MR. COLEMAN: That question of applicability of 6 232, chapter -- or Subchapter C, I'd looked -- it's really 7 frustrating to me that, you know, we don't operate in a 8 vacuum. Every county and city in the state does it. 9 Certainly, we're not the only group that's ever suffered 10 through this. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And it's a problem all across 12 the state. 13 MR. COLEMAN: It's a problem all over, but there's 14 got to be a resolution that we can model here. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree. 16 MR. COLEMAN: And I don't know -- Jon, you know 17 well enough how other, even, areas between -- you know, in 18 kind of our area, how Boerne may do that, or -- 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think I can answer the 20 question, is that generally, statewide -- and I get from the 21 task force, that state-wide task force I'm on on these 22 issues, is that generally, it's the municipalities that adopt 23 the model subdivision rules. Therefore, they change their 24 ordinances, because you don't get the money without the 25 rules. 3-22-10 107 1 MR. COLEMAN: And is that generally specific to 2 these areas? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That is -- 4 MR. COLEMAN: Is it tied to those funding cycles? 5 I mean, is that kind of the path most go down, where -- where 6 whatever the service area is, that the -- 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It can be that way. It can be 8 very specific and it can be broader. We are -- our rules 9 currently require it to be county-wide. 10 MR. COLEMAN: Okay. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I think -- I mean, I think 12 it can be resolved. It just can't be resolved by me. 13 MR. COLEMAN: Okay. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Or Bruce. 15 MR. COLEMAN: So, that -- that said, I think that 16 volume of stuff that y'all had gotten from the Manager's 17 office last week, which really is his effort to kind of 18 recount some history to you as well, and kind of remind 19 everybody that we've been in the ditch with this for a while. 20 And there is more history than the last couple weeks; maybe 21 raise that conversation to that level. I don't think -- and 22 you mentioned the third -- I don't know that I've seen a 23 third kind of agreement floating around out there. But, at 24 any rate, I don't think an agreement you guys have is one 25 that the Council is going to entertain the next -- at their 3-22-10 108 1 meeting tomorrow night, and forward you to them. I think 2 those are provided more -- more or less as background to this 3 conversation, general conversation. So, that -- I wanted to 4 make sure y'all heard that. And -- and, again, I think in 5 terms of just the details of the blended standards, aside 6 from maybe a difference between how, from a commissioner's 7 point of view and a councilman's point of view, we read 8 what's written, I don't think there's much margin of 9 difference in that blended standards that kind of has been 10 talked about. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Let me go back to something, 12 Kevin, if I might. Recommended action. Staff recommends the 13 City Council accepts the draft ETJ standards and forward them 14 with a draft interlocal agreement -- cooperative agreement. 15 This agreement should including the following items: Number 16 3, the draft standards dated March 9th, 2010, would be 17 implemented. That's what the City Manager said. 18 MR. COLEMAN: Right. Right. And I'll just beg 19 your forgiveness; I haven't talked one-on-one about this with 20 City Manager Parton, but will before tomorrow. And so I'm 21 not sure. I think what he offered out was kind of, you know, 22 our old interlocal that was an '05 document, one that we kind 23 of kicked around in the summer months, and we were talking 24 about sort of a jurisdictional map. As -- to kind of get us 25 off square one, to get us someplace to go besides 3-22-10 109 1 arbitration. I think it's clear that, though -- and I guess 2 bottom line of my message is, if -- if the Court leaves this 3 solely in Commissioner Letz' hands, and the Council leaves 4 this discussion solely in Motheral's hands, we will be at 5 arbitration. So, I -- 6 JUDGE TINLEY: We've come to that conclusion. 7 MR. COLEMAN: You got that clear? Yeah. And I 8 think, laying that out just -- again, they did bring it up, 9 and they mentioned the "A" word, if you will. I don't think 10 anybody wants to go there. But I think we kind of 11 collectively need to come up with an alternative path. And 12 -- and if this subsection -- Subchapter C is a deal killer, 13 then I think the Council looks for you guys to figure -- or 14 propose a way that that's worked in other cities or other 15 city/county relationships that protects y'all's interests and 16 the -- 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm not so sure that is a 18 part of other city/county relationships where you're going to 19 find the answer. The answer is, the problem lies within the 20 qualifications of the parameters of the EDAP program put 21 forth by Texas Water Development Board. There are a lot of 22 cities in the state of Texas and counties that don't have 23 anything to do with EDAP program. This is very unique and 24 special, and this Court is very aware of it. So, you know, 25 let's figure out how we comply with the standards of the EDAP 3-22-10 110 1 program as put forth by Texas Water Development Board. This 2 is a very unique situation. 3 MR. COLEMAN: Sure. And I think -- and I don't 4 mean to discount the uniqueness of it. What I mean to say 5 is, truly, there's got to be a model we can use where other 6 folks have broached this hurdle. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Could be. 8 MR. COLEMAN: And -- and if y'all could figure out 9 a way, or give us a path out of that, then I think -- 10 JUDGE TINLEY: I can give you a path right now, Mr. 11 Coleman. You put a provision in these rules that, 12 notwithstanding anything herein to the contrary, to the 13 extent these rules in any manner are in conflict with the 14 model subdivision rules, and if there's a source of them, 15 then those model subdivision rules shall prevail. That will 16 solve the problem. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It will indeed. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, anyway, I think they're -- 19 I think we can get there, still. I do agree with you that I 20 think it's not productive for Councilman Motheral and I to 21 continue to meet, because I don't think that's going to -- I 22 don't want to meet with him any more one-on-one. I mean, 23 I'll be glad to meet with him in a room with some other 24 people that are witnesses, but I'm not going to meet with him 25 one-on-one any more, at least not on this issue. 3-22-10 111 1 MR. COLEMAN: Again, we're here to kind of listen 2 and report back tomorrow night, and so I'll sit back down and 3 do some listening. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: I think -- Mr. Coleman, I think the 5 big issue is the resolution of these model subdivision rules, 6 because our funding on this East Kerr project, we have -- we 7 have tied that to the requirement that we adopt the model 8 subdivision rules, and have done so, so we've got to keep 9 those in place. These other issues, I see ways to work 10 around them. The issue of -- of the standards, for example, 11 where they're incorporated, as -- insofar as they involve 12 standards in the ETJ, the standards must be concurred with or 13 mutually agreed to by City and County. There's all sorts of 14 things we can do to get this thing resolved, I think. But 15 the model subdivision rules, I think, are the real deal 16 killer, as you mentioned, and we've got to figure out a way 17 to work around them. 18 MR. COLEMAN: I got you. And Commissioner Letz did 19 mention there is a significant difference in just the -- just 20 the background to how we deal with this. Our subdivision 21 ordinance is simply just the roadmap for platting. We kind 22 of lean toward other documents to come up with standards for 23 improvements and public improvements. Y'all's is all kind of 24 together in that same rule book. That's been an issue that I 25 don't think we've settled from the beginning how we 3-22-10 112 1 incorporate those two significant differences. That -- that 2 said, I do think, though, that there are -- there's got to be 3 a path out of here that other folks have used, that we can -- 4 that we can model our path out of. I -- I mean, you guys 5 know that subchapter better than anybody at the City does, 6 and so you know that. But I bring that because our rule 7 book -- and I think what state statute calls for us to do is 8 make sure that the platting process follows the same rule 9 book, not necessarily the improvement process follows the 10 same rule book. And I think that's been a piece that we've 11 been hung on for a while. So, you know, where the plat comes 12 in and how it exits the process is really what we're called 13 to come together in agreement of. How we handle improvements 14 tied to those plats, I think we can separate those 15 conversations. That may be a piece of this solution, 16 something. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the -- on that point, 18 Kevin, I think the issue comes a little bit that the -- the 19 enforcing person in the Water Development Board on model 20 subdivision rules ties it to platting. 21 MR. COLEMAN: Right. I follow you, right. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, there -- you know, which I 23 think is -- is very bad, not because of our problem. They've 24 got -- those rules are -- we're looking at some of those 25 rules too, because they're onerous, very onerous on 3-22-10 113 1 developers, cities, counties, on how you handle them. There 2 are situations where you have septic systems that have had to 3 be bonded in developments, and the governmental entity, 4 whether it be the city or county, are having to keep track of 5 all these bonds right now. So, I mean, there's -- you know, 6 there's -- but the reality is that those are the model rules, 7 and we're working through it. Fortunately, the State 8 realized there's a problem, and that's why myself and 22 of 9 my best friends up there -- if you think these meetings are 10 contentious, you ought to see some of those in Austin. We're 11 trying to write a new set of model subdivision rules and redo 12 Subchapter B and C right now. 13 But, you know, the historical perspective a little 14 bit, I think it is good to look at, 'cause I know that some 15 members of Council said publicly that this has been going on 16 for five years. Well, that's really not accurate. We had a 17 deal in 2005, and it went for a while. And if you look at 18 the records of it, and when we started having problems was 19 when we adopted the model subdivision rules, and all of a 20 sudden we weren't in compliance any more. That has been the 21 issue, the driving thing that has -- that was why we had to 22 cancel the agreement, because we were not in compliance. In 23 2008, when we came to realize it, we had to cancel the 24 agreement, you know. And it was a -- several mechanisms were 25 tried by the County, including a -- a court order in January 3-22-10 114 1 of 2009 asking then City Manager Don Davis to go into kind of 2 an interim process. That was never acted on by City Council. 3 So, I think that there is some value to looking at the 4 historical part, but there's a reason it fell apart -- two 5 reasons, in my mind. One, there was just some problems with 6 the way it was being implemented by the City, and the other 7 problem was model subdivision rules, which is most important 8 to the County. 9 I think that -- you know, I know that some feel 10 that I'm hard-headed. Probably most in the room may think 11 that way. But I also think -- you know, hopefully Kevin 12 would agree that I'm reasonable. I mean, 'cause he and I 13 have talked hours and hours and hours on this, and we don't 14 always agree, but I think we've come pretty close to figuring 15 out that we've got to get this done. And I was -- you know, 16 all I intended to do at our meeting of -- when I had the City 17 Manager and City Attorney present, and Bruce -- Councilman 18 Motheral, was to say these legal points, including the model 19 subdivision rules, have to be addressed. And for four 20 months, Councilman Motheral had not addressed those. And one 21 other point, and then I'll be quiet on this issue. A lot was 22 made -- or some was made at City Council meeting, from my 23 understanding, about that I said I was writing a different 24 set of rules. Councilman Motheral and I decided early on 25 that the best way to come up with a set of rules, so we 3-22-10 115 1 didn't miss things, he took essentially the city ordinance 2 and blended it to the county. I took essentially the county 3 ordinance and blended it to the city. That was the only way 4 that we could both be sure that we weren't going to miss 5 something, because our rules are very different. Councilman 6 Motheral got his done first, so we have been working off of 7 his draft, because I didn't see a whole lot of point in 8 having two. And when I made the comment that I'm working 9 on -- going through the same process while -- you know, based 10 on more the county set of rules, you know, he knew this all 11 along, which is frustrating. It came across all of a sudden 12 that I was going to drop a new set of rules on them. Well, 13 no. I've told them all along that I was doing a different 14 set of rules so that we can make sure we weren't missing 15 anything. So, it just seems like it's -- you know, I hope we 16 can get through this. But I would like some guidance 17 tomorrow night, 'cause I will be going to City Council. 18 AUDIENCE: Oh, no. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Behave. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I -- 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Commissioner, be your usual 22 lovable self. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Anyway, I think that there's 24 a -- I have a -- I've been told some things that were said at 25 Council meeting, but I wasn't present, but I do have a tape 3-22-10 116 1 of that portion of the meeting; I will listen to it before 2 Council meeting tomorrow. 'Cause I want to know exactly what 3 two Council people in particular said. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: County Attorney? I'm sorry. 5 MS. BAILEY: I'd just like to reiterate, because I 6 was at the meeting with the City Attorney and Councilman 7 Motheral and Commissioner Letz, that it was very clear to me 8 that -- when we left that meeting on March 2nd, that no 9 further action was going to be taken until the two attorneys 10 had an opportunity to review and perhaps come to some kind of 11 recommendation on what needed to happen on the legal issues. 12 It was very cordial. And since then, this is my first having 13 heard about anything going to Council, any discussion in 14 Council. So, I believe that that -- that part of the 15 process, in my mind, was a little bit out of line from what 16 we had agreed on in the meeting on March the 2nd. So, it's 17 not just Commissioner Letz's perception; that's exactly what 18 was going on. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything further? 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I think on the -- you 21 said to behave. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What does that mean? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, is it the -- I think we 24 need to have a -- at this point, it's been going on a long 25 period of time. If we're not going to go to arbitration, 3-22-10 117 1 which I'm getting the sense from the Court that that's not 2 the avenue to go, I think we need a little bit of a revision 3 to the process of it just being myself and Councilman 4 Motheral, because that has become a -- in the last two weeks, 5 has become a major obstacle. I don't know if it needs to be 6 the -- someone from the County Attorney's office, another 7 member of the Court, Len Odom. I mean, I'll be glad to have 8 someone from here. I think, in my mind, from the City -- 9 it's the City's decision on their side, but it should be the 10 City Manager or Kevin Coleman should be in attendance. 11 They're the ones that do it. But -- I'll be glad to go do it 12 alone, but if the City's perception is that I'm, you know, 13 the problem, well, let's bring someone else from the county 14 over there, and have, you know, Councilman -- sorry, 15 Commissioner Baldwin and myself. We started out meeting with 16 Councilmen Hamilton and Motheral. And -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Didn't take me long. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Didn't take long. He said it 19 wasn't going to go anywhere, so I continued to follow up with 20 that. So, I think that we need to have a -- I would like to 21 have something to go to Council and say, "There is a problem 22 in the process. Here is what the County would like to have 23 go forward." And -- because I would rather be speaking from 24 the county standpoint rather than just Commissioner Letz. 25 So, if y'all would give me some guidance, I'd appreciate it. 3-22-10 118 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sounds like there's some 2 beer involved here, far as I'm concerned. I bet you that 3 they're going to think through all this stuff, everything 4 that you've said today. They'll have to get the minutes to 5 get through it all, though. But I would be willing to bet 6 you that there's going to be a solution from their side as 7 far as whether we like Bruce or not -- Motheral. And -- 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Thank you. (Laughter.) 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we like Councilman 10 Motheral, and I think he's going to be part of the solution 11 from the city standpoint. He should be. He's part of 12 Council. But, you know, it's -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: As far as you and him 14 working one-on-one, -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, thank you. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- I think that they will 17 come up with some kind of solution to that. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I think your -- your point 19 is valid, Commissioner, about the makeup of the negotiating 20 team. And as far as I'm concerned, I -- I trust you 21 implicitly in this matter, and I want to see you -- 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bill, don't get carried 23 away. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I want to see you continue. 25 However, I think that maybe the County Attorney being your 3-22-10 119 1 partner would not be a bad idea. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think that's the only way 4 you're going to get through it, you know, prior to 5 arbitration. Hopefully it'll happen before it goes that far. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We'll do what we have to 7 do. We have a vested interest that has to be protected, and 8 Commissioner Letz has done a tremendous service for this 9 Court in trying to make people understand what this is all 10 about. It's not trying to be arbitrary or disagreeable or 11 anything of the kind. We have a vested interest that 12 benefits Kerr County long term, long after we're gone. And 13 to see it breached because somebody doesn't want to 14 incorporate one simple thing, to me, is unreasonable. You 15 know, I just -- it's just totally unreasonable. Mr. Coleman 16 is correct in saying that somewhere out there, there's a road 17 that leads to a solution. He's right. Somewhere there is. 18 Sometimes you can't see the forest for the trees. But I 19 think that Commissioner Letz needs to continue. He is the 20 sole source of total information with respect to subdivision 21 rules for this Court, and I don't want to see that missing in 22 the continuation of this process. And so my suggestion is 23 County Attorney, existing or new, and if it's the new one, 24 get your books out, buddy. (Laughter.) 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did you know that if it 3-22-10 120 1 wasn't for the trees, there wouldn't be a forest? 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I didn't know that. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thought I'd throw that out. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Are you happy with that, 6 Commissioner? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's move on, then. Let's 9 talk about Item 17, to consider, discuss, take appropriate 10 action regarding Kerr County's position with respect to 11 funding airport C.I.P. work. Commissioner Williams, I'm 12 going to leave this with you, since I expect Jon's a little 13 wore out by now. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Goodness. Let's see. This 15 is -- 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: He'll need oxygen here in a 17 minute. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is a fun day at the 19 Commissioners Court. Commissioner Letz and I have this on 20 because we both serve as the Court's liaisons to the Airport 21 Board. And I have to tell you right at the outset that 22 working with the -- observing and working with the Airport 23 Board, as it is currently constructed, is -- is truly a 24 pleasure. We have five individuals dedicated to the 25 perpetuation of a good airport, and making it happen and 3-22-10 121 1 doing that. And also that goes for our Airport Manager, who 2 does an excellent job. He's here in the audience right now. 3 I'll talk to you, Bruce, about that compliment. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's lunch? Is that what 5 you're saying? 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: All of that being said, we 7 have a couple issues, and we'll deal with them, I guess, 8 back-to-back, Judge, although they are separate. And this 9 particular one, if you'll refer to the backup material 10 provided to you, it really kind of stems from two things. 11 First of all, the longstanding discussions that Commissioner 12 Letz and I have -- have listened to with regard to the 13 engineering and planning for improving the water system to 14 take care of the deficiencies for fire suppression that has 15 been identified by the fire marshal -- is that a fair 16 statement, Commissioner? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And so our concern and our 19 obligation, we think, is to participate fifty-fifty with the 20 City, as per the C.I.P. agreement, for the correction of that 21 deficiency as it applies to fire suppression. That said, we 22 have listened to a lot of engineering stuff, some of which is 23 gobbledygook, goes in one ear and out the other with respect 24 to the details, but the engineers have designed some sort of 25 a solution for fire suppression that includes -- and if I'm 3-22-10 122 1 wrong, somebody will correct me -- that includes some 2 elements that the City would like to see to improve their 3 overall distribution of water from Highway 27, so forth and 4 so on, to the airport. We think that our position and our -- 5 our obligation, if you will, is to participate fifty-fifty 6 with respect to the improvement for fire suppression 7 purposes. Okay. In the proposed solution that will 8 ultimately go to bid, there are three elements of the 9 engineering design that pertain to fire suppression. There 10 are two elements of the engineering design that have other 11 purposes that are not related to fire suppression. If I'm 12 wrong, Bruce, you stand up and say heresy or whatever. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They -- 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So -- let me finish the 15 statement. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So this issue stems from 18 the fact that the -- there was a letter directed to the 19 County Auditor with respect to our putting up our $350,000, 20 which is 50 percent of the estimated -- estimated cost for 21 fire suppression improvements, water -- water for fire 22 suppression improvements. We have a firm belief that the 23 three elements that are involved that will take care of the 24 fire suppression issue are going to come in a great deal 25 under $700,000, or our half of 350 -- our half being 3-22-10 123 1 $350,000. And while we have every inclination and desire to 2 participate in funding our obligation, we don't see that it 3 is our position to fund a portion of that plan that's being 4 -- will be let out for bid with two alternatives that are 5 going to be equivalent of $700,000. That's just not our 6 obligation. Now I'm finished. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The only possible correction, 8 the two portions that you mentioned that the City would want 9 for future distribution and such, they do have a benefit to 10 fire suppression, in that it gives redundancy. But it's not 11 a requirement, and there's certainly not redundancy out there 12 right now, but it does have a benefit. You know, but I agree 13 with your overall statement that I don't think that it's our 14 responsibility to participate in that redundancy, 15 necessarily. The -- this came to the point of this letter, 16 and this is largely driven by our Auditor, who, you know, at 17 the last Airport Board meeting -- what's his name? 18 AUDIENCE: Mike. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mike, the city -- I guess the 20 auditor, finance director -- the finance director leaned over 21 and said to me, "Hey, I need -- the County hasn't sent over 22 the $350,000 yet." And I kind of listened. Then shortly 23 after that, the Auditor came in, and I said, "Talk to her 24 about it." And the -- the issue, I think, is -- I mean, our 25 money is sitting in a bank or a fund somewhere. We have this 3-22-10 124 1 $350,000. And I talked with Auditor, I talked with 2 Commissioner Williams a little bit, because there are 3 unknowns as to whether they're going to -- the Airport Board 4 is going to want to go with Option A, B, C, D, or E, and 5 there are five options on this contract that's going to be 6 let as to how far this water line goes. We shouldn't put our 7 money -- or, you know, fund our portion until the contract is 8 awarded. And I think the issue came up, from what Mike told 9 me, was that, well, the City won't bid a contract until they 10 have all their funding in place. And -- and I said -- and I 11 said fine to that. But the fact that we have the money in 12 our account should certainly be sufficient for the City to 13 bid it, and as soon as the Airport Board decides what the 14 contract -- what amount they want to let on that contract, I 15 think then we would know the dollar amount; we would send 16 that dollar amount over to the City. Is that accurate, 17 Ms. Hargis? 18 (Ms. Hargis nodded.) 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's the way it's going to 21 be. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that's the -- 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There's no -- that's not up 24 for negotiation. We're not going to pay a bill that hasn't 25 been incurred. We're not going to pay any more than our fair 3-22-10 125 1 share, which is half of what directly affects what we have 2 agreed to fund. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And the obligation is 4 for -- just for the sake of discussion, say there's A, B, C, 5 D, and E. If A, B, and C are required to satisfy the 6 deficiency in fire suppression, that's what we'll correct. 7 We'll participate in that correction. If D & E are on the 8 wish list, we're not going to participate. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Absolutely not. And we will 10 not pay before there is an actual -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's the sense of this 12 agreement, just to clarify. And so the -- I think the 13 Airport Board -- and the City knows the County's position, 14 that we will -- money's in the bank, and it will be funded as 15 soon as the contract is -- 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It was specified for that 17 purpose. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If that's not good enough, 20 then maybe we shouldn't even do the deal. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I see the Assistant City 22 Manager nodding her head, that's fine. 23 MS. ONDRIAS: I don't see that as -- Kristine 24 Ondrias, Assistant City Manager. I don't see that as a huge 25 issue. Something that you may want to consider in that 3-22-10 126 1 process is an amount of contingency that you would want. 2 Obviously, we don't want to have to come back to you once 3 we've awarded a contract. Obviously, you always get into 4 contingency issues with infrastructure, awarding a certain 5 amount of contingency with that. But, certainly, we can bid 6 the project. We can -- when we do the bid, we can hold those 7 bids for 30, 60 days. Sometimes that does affect your bid 8 price if you hold it longer. But once we do that, then we 9 come back to you guys, or you can send your money at that 10 time. We can award and then move forward, so I don't think 11 any of that is a huge issue. I would suggest that you award 12 some amount of contingency with it. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I don't think contingency 14 is a problem at all. 15 MS. ONDRIAS: Sure. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: My understanding, and I 17 think Commissioner Letz's as well, is that the three elements 18 required for fire suppression -- we'll say A, B, and C for 19 the sake of discussion -- they're going to be bid as the 20 primary part of the -- 21 MS. ONDRIAS: That's correct. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- of the project, and the 23 other two are alternate bids? 24 MS. ONDRIAS: That's correct. There's -- in order 25 to get the project into budget, there are about four 3-22-10 127 1 different colors on the map. It's a nice color-coded map. 2 This issue that you were talking about, that -- that does 3 actually -- it affects the water system and the -- and the 4 fire suppression. It's the redundancy that ties that system 5 back. It creates the loop for the system. Today, if your 6 water goes down, you have a water main break somewhere prior 7 to coming into the airport, you have no redundancy; the 8 airport has no water. And that was one of the fixes that the 9 engineering staff looked at when we did this project, the 10 consultant that we hired, which was BWR. And so -- but in -- 11 in looking at the cost estimates, we really can't afford that 12 at this time. Until you're looking at again still needing to 13 flush the line, and in creating that redundancy at this 14 point. Unless you end up with a significantly lower bid. 15 But, no, you're absolutely right. We can -- we can award the 16 base bid, and then any alternatives at that point that the 17 Board, the Council, or the Commissioners Court -- from the 18 Council's standpoint, we have awarded a budget, and up to 19 that amount, they can do that improvement. If they choose to 20 use that money for anything else, then they would need to 21 come back to the City Council or the Commissioners Court to 22 make a request to use that for -- I think at one point, we 23 talked about T-hangars, and using some of the that money for 24 T-hangars. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's down the line. 3-22-10 128 1 That's a separate project. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do you need any action from us, 3 or is this just fine from the standpoint -- 4 MS. ONDRIAS: No, this is -- this works for us. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't think it should take 6 any additional time to award that contract. I mean, I don't 7 know how -- I mean, we can -- 8 MS. ONDRIAS: I think we're bidding next month? 9 MR. McKENZIE: Should be in April. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think from the standpoint of 11 us -- of ours, the funds are in-house. So, as soon as a 12 decision is made by the Airport Board, it can be funded the 13 next day. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Those contracts typically are -- are 15 good for 30 days, by and large, unless you ask them to be bid 16 longer. 17 MS. ONDRIAS: Right. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Standard period, I believe, is 30 19 days. 20 MS. ONDRIAS: Right. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: And they customarily include a 22 contingency provision, because of scope of work, extras and 23 so forth. Those -- 24 MS. ONDRIAS: And we can do that up front in the 25 bidding process if -- if you'd like us to do that. 3-22-10 129 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's usually the way it's 2 handled. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Good. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to Item 18; to consider, 7 discuss, take appropriate action relating to Kerr County 8 providing airport administrative and support services under 9 the airport services contract for FY 2010-11. Which one of 10 you guys -- 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is going to be 12 Commissioner Letz. I did the other one. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: He got a break. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: At the -- and I'll try to 15 summarize this. At some point late last fall, I believe the 16 City Manager asked the Airport Board to make a decision on 17 the 2010-11 -- or is it '11-'12? The 2011-2012 management 18 contract at the airport. And I don't recall if it was on an 19 airport agenda or not. It was brought up again at the last 20 meeting, formal action to go with the -- you know, to, I 21 guess, ask the City for -- the Airport Board to ask the City 22 for that contract -- management contract for 2011-2012 23 period. And they asked me at the board meeting if I had any 24 problems with it, and I was kind of taken aback, and I -- but 25 I said, "No, it's the Airport Board's decision." After that, 3-22-10 130 1 I talked with, again, the Auditor and Commissioner Williams, 2 and what came up is that starting next year, the County funds 3 100 percent of the operations at the airport as part of our 4 deal, the trade-off of the library. It's the final year of 5 that deal. 6 And the concern was, from the Auditor's standpoint, 7 is that we should not pay for certain professional services 8 to be done by the City under that contract when we already 9 have the infrastructure in-house to do it, being H.R., 10 accounting, and legal, essentially. Those areas that we have 11 -- we're already fully staffed in those departments, and for 12 us to pay the City to do that, essentially, we're paying 13 twice. We already have the infrastructure in place to do it. 14 So, this is on the agenda kind of as -- as to -- one more 15 thing. The impression I got at the Airport Board meeting was 16 that if -- it was an all-or-nothing deal with the City of 17 Kerrville on the management contract, which included those 18 services, and that these particular services couldn't be 19 carved out. And Commissioner Williams and I talked about it 20 a little bit; said, "Well, we need to bring it to the Court, 21 because I don't think that it's appropriate for the 22 Commissioners Court to fund for services that we're already 23 paying to do ourselves." And that's why it's on the agenda 24 and it's styled the way it is, because if the City -- well, I 25 want the Airport Board to make its decisions on most of this 3-22-10 131 1 stuff, as long as it isn't costing the taxpayers additional 2 money. This is one that would cost additional money. The 3 rest of the management contract, it's up to the Airport Board 4 to choose how they want to get things done at the airport. 5 We styled the agenda item this way, that if the City holds 6 true and says it's an all-or-nothing contract, then there are 7 services out there that need to be done, and this is styled 8 so that the County could pick up all those services if the 9 Airport Board wants us to look into that. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You said -- you said 11 '11-'12. You really mean '10-'11. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is it '10-'11? 13 MS. HYDE: '10-'11. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It could end up being 15 '11-'12 and '13-'14. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But it's still putting us out 17 there, you know, the -- a year into advance when we're paying 18 100 percent of the management cost at the airport, so that's 19 the reason it's on the agenda. And I think the agenda item 20 is styled so that, you know, A, the County feels that it 21 should take over those professional services, and in my mind, 22 they're already paid for by the taxpayers. There's no 23 additional charge to the airport to do those services; we do 24 them. So, you know, it should be a reduction in the cost to 25 operate out there under the management contract. And the 3-22-10 132 1 rest of the contract, if they would like to talk to the 2 County about those, we would be glad to discuss it with them. 3 If they want a proposal, we can give them a proposal. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: What you're suggesting, then, 5 Commissioner, is that the Airport Board receive the 6 administrative services -- the H.R., legal, so forth, 7 finance -- at no cost? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: And that they, in essence, bid as a 10 separate item to maintain their autonomy the other 11 maintenance services function, and, you know, then award that 12 bid under ordinary procedures? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Whatever they want to do. If 14 they want to keep using the City Streets Department for the 15 majority of it, that's their decision. If they want to use 16 the County, that's their decision. If they want to use a 17 private entrepreneur, that's -- 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Or formulate an RFP to 19 which we will respond. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. But I think that the -- 21 I mean, I've thought about this. It doesn't make sense to 22 me -- we don't bid out or apportion out our legal and H.R. 23 and accounting portion to other functions, so I don't know 24 why we should do it to the airport now that it's 100 percent 25 funded by the County. It just -- it doesn't make sense. We 3-22-10 133 1 don't do it for any other department; why should we do it to 2 them? And when there was a mixing of funds, it made a 3 difference. So, bottom line is, in our mind -- or my mind, 4 this should reduce the cost of the management contract by 5 whatever professional services part were in there, so the new 6 contract should be less. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: As an alternative, Commissioner, in 8 order that the Airport Board maintain its autonomy, which -- 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They have -- 10 JUDGE TINLEY: -- they need to do. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: They need to do. That's a separate 13 body; they're in charge out there. They should request two 14 different proposals, one for administrative, legal, 15 financial, H.R., so forth, and another for the -- for the 16 maintenance services. And it seems like a redundant process 17 if -- if we're going to bid that we'll do that for nothing, 18 but if they feel like that's necessary in order to maintain 19 their autonomy, so be it. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, that's fine. But our -- 21 yeah. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But by us offering the 23 administrative services for free, it sounds like to me, 24 though, that we're viewing them as a -- a county office. You 25 know, it's just -- it has that appearance. I don't know. 3-22-10 134 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, it kind of -- in my mind, 2 from that standpoint, it is a county -- it's not a 3 department. It's not -- you know, there's other departments, 4 I think, that are kind of similar. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If you look at them as a 6 county department, that's not autonomous at all. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, not a county department, 8 but it's a county -- something that we fund. What about 9 216th? 216th is a -- or some of the other dotted-line things 10 that we fund. We don't charge -- we don't figure out how 11 much legal time some of those departments take. The -- 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But they would -- but would 13 you put it out for bids anyway, the administrative side of it 14 as well? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: If that's what the Airport Board 16 wishes to do. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, right. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: At their discretion. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If we happen to come in 20 free, and they choose -- 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Hard to beat. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Be hard to beat. And they 23 choose us -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: See, I don't know that I agree 25 with the Judge on that point, because the issue is that we 3-22-10 135 1 have to handle the money. I mean, we don't -- it's not 2 something -- if you bid it out, it goes to somebody -- to an 3 accounting firm? I mean -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It would still be their 5 choice, wouldn't it? 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's a package of services. 7 You know, administrative, legal, H.R., whatever, whatever, 8 whatever. And if those services are available here under the 9 same conditions that they would have -- have included in an 10 RFP for anybody to bid on, the point that the Commissioner's 11 making is that we've already -- we've already paid for those. 12 They're available to them. They're available to them. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If it would make it any 14 better, charge them again. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, we don't need to charge 16 them. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I mean, if it smooths 18 out this stormy issue, -- 19 JUDGE TINLEY: To resolve the issue, go ahead head 20 and bid something for it. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- let's charge them. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So we pay -- it's kind of like 23 the Juvenile Detention facility. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Exactly. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Exactly. 3-22-10 136 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Put the money in on this side, 2 and we pay it over here. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We've done that before. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's a very good analogy. 5 It's really just like the Juvenile Detention facility. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Same thing. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Take it out of the left 9 pocket, put it back in the right pocket. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: But you do have the ability to know 11 where your costs are allocated that way. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: And from a cost accounting basis, 14 it's beneficial -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: -- if you're allocating some cost to 17 it. And whether or not it's an appropriate cost or not, you 18 can look at after the fact. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I think the -- I guess the 20 issue is bidding it. Unless someone else is going to do it 21 for zero -- and I guess it doesn't make any difference. It's 22 just -- it's just accountability as to how you do it if it's 23 not done internally. But, anyway -- 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, we've got to maintain that 25 airport in an autonomous situation. We've got them there, 3-22-10 137 1 for goodness sakes. Let's keep them there. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right, that's fine. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: So, what we're -- what we're really 4 talking about is them carving this thing up into two separate 5 components, administrative services and a maintenance 6 function, is really what we're talking about, and asking that 7 they do it that way so as to facilitate -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I kind of think he's on the 10 right track here. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's good. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Fine. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Does this require any 14 action? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: No, we can't tell them what to do. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. Don't tell anybody I 17 agreed with a lawyer today. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Does -- is that sufficient, 19 Bruce? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: He's been listening. 21 MR. McKENZIE: The pleasure of the board. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All he can do is take it to them and 23 say, "Here's how the discussion went. Here's what their 24 suggestion was. What do you think?" Okay, gentlemen, it is 25 almost a quarter after. What's the Court's pleasure? We got 3-22-10 138 1 several more items. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Several. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Do we want to break for lunch? Do 4 we want to plow forward? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's finish this page. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: I can do that. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: And then what's your pleasure? 9 Don't give me a dodge; give me a commitment. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want to go eat. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anybody else have any 12 thoughts differently? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We might go through those items 14 related to the airport, 20 and those last -- 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, okay. Let's take Item 19; 16 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to approve request 17 for Kerrville/Kerr County Joint Airport Board to reappoints 18 Mark Cowden, Corey Walters, and Tom Moser for two-year terms 19 of office beginning June 1, 2010. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 23 approval. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 24 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 3-22-10 139 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carried. Item 20, to 4 consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to confirm the 5 authority of the Kerrville/Kerr County Joint Airport Board to 6 also act as the Joint Airport Zoning Board. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Question 10 or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by 11 raising your right hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll be in 16 recess until 1:30. 17 (Recess taken from 12:15 p.m. to 1:37 p.m.) 18 - - - - - - - - - - 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to order, if 20 we might. Next item is Item 21, to consider, discuss, take 21 appropriate action on proposed L.C.R.A. transmission line 22 route or routes, including possible route that runs adjacent 23 to I.H. 10. I put this on the agenda because of a 24 considerable amount of activity recently dealing with some 25 new routes that apparently L.C.R.A. Transmission Services 3-22-10 140 1 Corporation has come up with subsequent to them doing away 2 with the station just north of Kerrville. Part of the 3 impetus for looking at, for example, the I-10 route, 4 according to my understanding, was the folks up at the 5 northern end, Mason, Menard, up in there, seized on some 6 language that Representative Hilderbran may have given to 7 them, utilizing existing right-of-ways, including I.H. 10. 8 And this Court also did a resolution back when that 9 substation just north of town was still on the table; had a 10 resolution very similar to that. It -- it occurs to me that 11 they now have one very potentially viable route marching 12 right down I-10, where it carves out around the major 13 commercial areas. I'm not exactly sure. I'm sure it cuts 14 out some, but for that reason, and because circumstances have 15 changed, I put it back on the agenda in case the Court wants 16 to take any action. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, actually, I mean, I -- I 18 was planning to put this on the next agenda for the reasons 19 you just outlined, but also because a lot of time has passed 20 since our first resolution. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mm-hmm. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And, you know, I don't know 23 that I disagree with much of what we said in our first one; 24 probably very similar to that, but I was going to put it on 25 the next agenda to have another resolution, and mainly 3-22-10 141 1 because the time has drug out longer than originally thought. 2 That was -- that's probably close to a year ago, we did that 3 first resolution, and just to make sure that we are -- our 4 voice is heard, even though my thought would be it's probably 5 going to be general guidance again, as opposed to any kind of 6 specific route, 'cause I don't want to go down that road, 7 picking a route. But certain -- certain criteria. And I 8 think one of the other criteria that -- I don't think we 9 really directly said it, but I think probably should be 10 included is endangered species a little bit, and that any 11 route that -- you know, because that is a concern on -- on 12 some of the new routes that I -- or I guess the maps that 13 I've seen. There are so many lines on it, it's real hard to 14 figure out exactly what lines you're looking at, but some of 15 them are going through very rugged areas, potentially, or 16 crossing them. And, you know, that's an issue as well, and I 17 think we need to look at that. But, you know -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Were you wanting to do more research 19 before you -- 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, we can. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: -- put it on the agenda? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can, unless you have a 23 resolution prepared. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: I do not. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You know, if I could get until 3-22-10 142 1 the next meeting and prepare a resolution, and we'll kick 2 that around a little bit. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Fine with me. I just -- there was 4 some new developments in that whole process, so I wanted to 5 give the Court the opportunity, if they wanted to take it, to 6 have some other expression of intent. Ms. Hofmann with 7 L.C.R.A., their customer service rep, is here. Any -- 8 anything new and exciting from L.C.R.A. that you wish to 9 report, Ms. Hofmann? 10 MS. HOFMANN: Well, if you want to give me an 11 opportunity to talk to you, I appreciate it. The only thing 12 I would really like to highlight for you all, and for the 13 public, is just kind of some lessons learned. I think from 14 last year -- and I call this kind of Part B of the process, 15 since we had to get a delay, a motion for delay, and then 16 expand our study area to look at two other route corridors 17 that we were directed to look at by the P.U.C., that 18 including the I-10 route. But we heard a lot from 19 commissioners courts. We heard a lot from the public. We 20 heard from state representatives, and we heard from the folks 21 who attended the open houses. And what we're hoping to do 22 this time around, while this is a very emotional issue, and 23 it's something that's certainly not going to result in 24 pleasing everyone, what we have a certain amount of control 25 over is how we communicate the message, and given it's a 3-22-10 143 1 regulatory process, we are attempting to be as transparent as 2 we possibly can within the legal parameters of the process. 3 So, with that in mind, we've created a DVD, which 4 I've dropped off to y'all's offices. That was an attempt to 5 provide folks with a foundational understanding of what this 6 is all about. What's this renewable energy goal in the state 7 of Texas? What does CREZ mean? Why is L.C.R.A. involved? 8 It's not -- it was not developed to be a big promotional 9 effort on L.C.R.A.'s part, but more of a -- you know, "Here, 10 everyone, this is what's going on," and highlighting some 11 commonly asked questions and concerns that folks have had. 12 We've also created an e-newsletter that we have over 900 13 e-mail addresses listed already, and we're attempting to 14 provide up-to-the-minute information to folks who have 15 requested to be kept informed of what's going on with the 16 process. So, as something new occurs, we're attempting to 17 get the word out and notify folks. We've issued more press 18 releases. We've tried to go into a little bit more detail 19 about why we do the things we do. 20 For example, we have a lay-down yard where we've 21 already taken delivery of steel lattice pieces to build steel 22 lattice structures, which, of course, caught people off 23 guard, thinking, well, what do you mean? Has the P.U.C. 24 directed you to build lattice towers yet? Well, no, they 25 have not yet. But we did attempt to explain why we did that. 3-22-10 144 1 We haven't ordered all of our lattice structures for the 2 entire route, but we've ordered about 30 percent of it. It's 3 kind of a risk management approach that we took in securing 4 the steel that we'll need, we think, at some point for maybe 5 portions of the line. But we remain open to hearing from the 6 public, the elected officials. We're certainly going to be 7 directed by the P.U.C. with what route to build and what 8 structures to use. So, beyond that, you know, I -- I welcome 9 y'all's input on how you think we can better communicate as 10 well. So -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: What -- what is the current 12 timetable for this whole process? 13 MS. HOFMANN: Right now, the -- the McCamey D to 14 Kendall to Gillespie route, which is the one that affects 15 Kerr County possibly, will be filed with the Public Utility 16 Commission on July 6th, our recommended and alternative 17 routes. The P.U.C. will then entertain intervenors for 30 18 days. So, folks who are along any of the routes that we file 19 as preferred alternative will be notified simultaneously when 20 we notify the P.U.C. They will then have 30 days in which to 21 decide whether to request to intervene in the case officially 22 or not. Following that time will be a time of testimony from 23 all parties, and hearings by the Public Utility Commission, 24 and the administrative law judge will then make a 25 recommendation to the commissioners, and the commissioners 3-22-10 145 1 will consider then and make their final recommendation. That 2 will all happen within a matter of 180 days. So, we're 3 looking at January '11, end of process time frame. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, you're not prepared at 5 this time to tell us what your preferred primary route is? 6 MS. HOFMANN: No. No. In fact, we just completed 7 our open houses, and we asked that folks try to let us know 8 by March 10th already, and so that date's already passed. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Last thing that I received, I 10 believe, was -- looked like there were three routes on it, 11 the maps that you sent me a week or so ago, where you have 12 one of those kind of north going through -- 13 MS. HOFMANN: Three new -- new routes? 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, not necessarily new, 15 but pretty much -- 16 MS. HOFMANN: Because everything that was on the 17 table back in May, except for the Westwind substation that 18 went away, that's all still in place. Now, there are a few 19 links of some of those preliminary routes that fell off, 20 because we were ready to file in October. And that's when we 21 had to issue the motion for delay, because we had to go back 22 and look at I-10 and Menard, Mason. So, we -- we have all 23 kinds of counties involved with this process now. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You mentioned the one line, the 25 McCamey to -- Kendall? 3-22-10 146 1 MS. HOFMANN: Kendall. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To Gillespie. 3 MS. HOFMANN: To Gillespie. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But isn't Kerr County also hit 5 by the other line that comes -- I mean, as I understand it, 6 there's two lines going in or out of Comfort. There's one 7 line coming in -- I mean, you got to get to Comfort, and you 8 got to get back out of Comfort. And that's what -- from what 9 Dennis told me -- Palafox -- at the meeting, and that there's 10 -- and the way those new maps are shown, two of those lines, 11 they could parallel -- they could parallel each other, so 12 there's actually -- I mean, there could be two lines there. 13 MS. HOFMANN: The area between Kendall and 14 Gillespie, that is that parallel option that we were directed 15 to look at as well. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. So that means -- so 17 it's possible the line would come in and go out, even though 18 it'd have to be a wider right-of-way, 'cause, I guess -- 19 MS. HOFMANN: Right, could be two 345 lines 20 paralleling each other. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I had a lot of comments from 22 a lot of the people around about the I-10 route, thinking 23 that's really not a good route, mainly because of aesthetics; 24 if you're driving through Kerr County, you're going to drive 25 next to it for lots of miles, all the way across Kerr County, 3-22-10 147 1 basically, 'cause if it runs down I-10, some of that's pretty 2 rough territory. Of course, you do have a wide right-of-way, 3 but I've had, you know, some concern from people in my end of 4 the county wondering if that's really a good route or not, 5 and they don't think so. None of us want it in Kerr County. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I mean, wherever it's 7 going to go, you're going to have people -- "not in my back 8 yard," and people -- you know, so that's just going to be 9 there. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Right. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is it better to put it along 12 I-10 so everyone sees it, or put it in an area where some 13 people are impacted really big by it? 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, which is better? 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Don't have a good, clear 17 answer to that. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: My understanding of the proposed 19 I-10 route is that it would be located to the north of I-10 20 generally. Is that correct, Ms. Hofmann? 21 MS. HOFMANN: Well, it varies, depending on where 22 you are along the route. But through Kerrville, it is on the 23 north side. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We sure have a lot already. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: So, you want to -- 3-22-10 148 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll put it on the agenda. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: -- do some more work on it, bring it 3 back? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anybody else have anything to 6 offer on that one for now? We'll get another crack at it, 7 then. Okay, Item 22; consider, discuss, take appropriate 8 action to clarify Court Order Number 31654 to enter into a 9 contract with Bickerstaff Heath Delgado Acosta LLP as a 10 consultant for redistricting in 2011 as a result of the 2010 11 census; authorize County Judge to sign contract for same. 12 This is a cleanup item, is it not, Commissioner? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. I think I referred -- 14 in the motion, I believe I said the 2011 census, and it 15 should have said the 2010 census. It was a matter of getting 16 the year straight, because this is a -- and I elected to put 17 it back on the agenda just because there is some pretty 18 important legal ramifications with census things. Need to 19 make sure we're talking about the right one. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: So, what your proposed agenda item 21 would do, if approved, would -- would modify the 31654 order 22 to provide that it's the 2010 census, as opposed to 2011? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. So moved. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Except that the 25 redistricting actually takes place in '11. 3-22-10 149 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, but it's the 2010 2 census. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 6 approval. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 7 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. Item 23, consider, 12 discuss, take appropriate action to designate an individual 13 employed by the County to serve as the records management 14 officer of Kerr County. I put this on the agenda as a result 15 of communication which I received from the state archives 16 library -- state archives folks that their records reflect 17 that we don't have one of those. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What do they do? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Hmm? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What does that -- what does 21 this records management officer do? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: The records management officer 23 generally -- 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Manage the records? 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, you got it. (Laughter.) I'm 3-22-10 150 1 amazed at your intellect on some occasions. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I tell you, buddy, my 3 kidneys just kicked in. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Do we have somebody that 5 wants to volunteer to do that? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Ms. Hyde. 7 MS. HYDE: Excuse me? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Did she volunteer for that? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, but I think she's -- 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: She looks surprised, like she 11 didn't know anything about it. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's the way she acts. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought we had either 14 designated the County or District Clerk. 15 MS. HYDE: I thought it was the County Clerk or 16 District Clerk. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I thought about the District 18 Clerk. 19 MS. HARGIS: It's the District Clerk. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: All of the above. If you 21 look at the court -- 22 MS. PIEPER: By statute, the elected officials are 23 the records management of their office, so that may be 24 talking about department heads under y'all or something. 25 Because as far as a declaration, I have a declaration of 3-22-10 151 1 compliance that I've had since 1999 on my office. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought that it was already 3 -- we had done this at some point in the past. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, she does. That's what 5 she saying, she does. 6 MS. PIEPER: But I only do it for my office. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I understand. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Linda does it for hers. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 10 MS. BOLIN: Recently I went to the records archive 11 courses, and that's how that came about. They gave that to 12 me saying that I hadn't been designated, and I had for my 13 office. What they're looking for is for all the offices that 14 don't have elected officials. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Back to Ms. Hyde. (Laughter.) 16 MS. BOLIN: Like your office, the Animal Control. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Is that the dumping grounds 18 for anything nobody else wants? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Does Animal Control need one 20 or not? 21 MS. BOLIN: They have records that they have to 22 keep, so -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So what about -- 24 MS. BOLIN: They're a department head, as opposed 25 to being an elected official. 3-22-10 152 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Why don't they just make us 2 a list and let's vote on them -- vote them in, get on down 3 the road? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, what we could do, 5 Commissioner, is designate one individual as the records 6 management officer for Kerr County. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with you. How about 8 Rob Henneke? 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do you have somebody in 10 mind, Judge? 11 JUDGE TINLEY: No, as a matter of fact, I don't. 12 But it -- we're not precluded from designating, to my 13 knowledge, an elected official or any other employee of the 14 county. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: County Attorney's office may 16 not be a bad spot for this. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Really? 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm sure she's excited about 19 doing it. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: She's smiling. 21 MS. HYDE: Okay, sure. Sure. Whatever -- at the 22 pleasure of the Court. Take it while I'm not arguing. I'm 23 kidding, Judge. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Catch you at your weakest moment. 25 MS. HYDE: You got me at a weak moment. My belly's 3-22-10 153 1 full. 2 MS. HARGIS: I think it really should be one of the 3 clerks, because they're familiar with all the statutes and 4 things of that nature, and all the records, so they already 5 keep up with it. To me, it should either be the District 6 Clerk or the County Clerk, 'cause they deal with those 7 records and things of that nature that pass down to the rest 8 of us as well. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which clerk did you have in 10 mind? 11 MS. HARGIS: I think get one of them to volunteer. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Are you talking about law 13 enforcement records, as far as offense reports and things 14 like that? 15 MS. HYDE: You're elected. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. 17 MS. HARGIS: They just need one person that they 18 can call in the county, and then you can call that -- the 19 elected official. I mean, that's been on the books for a 20 long time. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Good. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Do you want to volunteer for 23 this? 24 MS. PIEPER: I'll volunteer. 25 MS. HYDE: Thank you, Jannett. 3-22-10 154 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh. I move we -- wait a 3 minute, where is it? 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do it quick. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move we designate the 6 County Clerk as the records management officer of Kerr 7 County. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Question 10 or discussion? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you, Jannett. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Thank you. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion, signify 14 by raising your right hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 20 MS. PIEPER: Let me put my two cents worth in, 21 though. I will send each of the departments information. 22 Now, if they do not abide by that information from the Texas 23 State Library, that's on their back, and not me. But I will 24 provide them the information that they need to know. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Seems reasonable. 3-22-10 155 1 MS. PIEPER: Okay. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Seems reasonable. But you have the 3 background, the experience, and the knowledge about those 4 matters. That's what's important. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And you're also a resource for 6 people. They can go to you and ask a question, "Do you think 7 this needs to be kept or not kept?" 8 MS. PIEPER: Okay, yeah. That's no problem. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Item 24, consider, discuss, 10 take appropriate action to declare April 2010 as County 11 Government Month in Kerr County. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 15 approval. Question or discussion? All in favor, signify by 16 raising your right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Next item, 21 25; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to confirm and 22 implement 1.5 percent increase in compensation as budgeted 23 for all Kerr County employees effective April 1, 2010, as 24 outlined in Court Order Number 31447, September 14th, 2009. 25 Ms. Hyde? 3-22-10 156 1 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. I just gave y'all a copy of 2 the court order. I just wanted to let y'all know I'm getting 3 ready to key it. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: The court order is pretty 5 self-explanatory, isn't it? Bingo. Yeah. No bail-outs on 6 it. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 8 MS. HYDE: Thank you very much. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What do you mean, "no 10 bail-outs"? 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the -- I'm talking about the 12 court order. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We were supposed to review it 14 on April -- before April 1 to decide if we were going to let 15 it go through or not, the way I remember it. It was done 16 back during budget time. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just caught the tail end 18 of that. What did you say? 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The 1.5 was to be reviewed to 20 see if we were going to do that April -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- 1, or whether we would not 23 allow the 1.5 to go in place. 24 MS. HYDE: I just happened to bring the minutes 25 with me. 3-22-10 157 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What did they say? 2 MS. PIEPER: I didn't remember it that way, but -- 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's the way I remember it. 4 MS. HYDE: I have Pages 123 all the way through 5 144. I did not make copies, because I assumed that we 6 wouldn't -- but just in case, I brought it. Notes began on 7 Page 140, really, concerning this. We had three different 8 motions. Commissioner Letz started the motions, and wanted 9 to give a 2 percent across the board at midpoint of the 10 budget, April 1. Ms. Hargis was asked what would that be. 11 It would be about 130,000, give or take. Ms. Hargis said, 12 "Yeah, about." Commissioner Williams: "Just under 200,000?" 13 Ms. Hargis said, "65 onto 130 is 195." Commissioner William 14 says, "Let's try again." Judge Tinley says, "We've got a 15 motion," and Commissioner Oehler said to exclude -- this is 16 where it got difficult. They were going to exclude the 17 Auditor and her staff along with all District Court staffs, 18 because they were not true county employees. Then the second 19 motion -- that one died because no one seconded it. The 20 second motion came when we were talking about "oppose" or 21 "reject." And Commissioner Baldwin doesn't like the word 22 "reject"; he wanted "oppose," 'cause that was two different 23 things in your mind, reject and oppose. And y'all talked 24 about that for a little bit. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is she talking about this 3-22-10 158 1 Court? 2 MS. HYDE: Oh, yeah. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes. 4 MS. HYDE: Continuing about the "oppose" versus 5 "rejected." Commissioner Oehler said he would use "oppose" 6 instead of "reject." Y'all were okay. Then the next one was 7 Ms. Hargis that, "We only pay one-fourth of the district 8 budgets." And everyone said okay. The clerk says, "Is this 9 under Item 24 or 25?" Judge Tinley says 24. Commissioner 10 Oehler says, "Yep, 24." And then the last thing you guys had 11 was, "We're going to try it again." Commissioner Williams 12 says, "I would move that all Kerr County employees be granted 13 a cost-of-living allowance in the amount of 1.5 percent, to 14 be effective April 1, 2010." Commissioner Letz seconded it, 15 and y'all voted. The discussion was back in the earlier 16 pages. Because we asked for an across-the-board raise 17 October 1, and y'all said, "No way, José." 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: But I think I also remember 19 saying that, yes, that could -- that could be -- that motion 20 did pass, which there's no doubt that it did, but just 21 because that was a court order didn't mean that we could not 22 rescind that order. 23 MS. HYDE: That is correct. You said that on Page 24 125. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I knew I did. 3-22-10 159 1 MS. HYDE: You said it on 125. Then they went all 2 the way through -- 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We could rescind that order, 4 absolutely. 5 MS. HYDE: Absolutely, we can rescind any order 6 that you'd like. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It doesn't just become 8 effective automatically, unless we don't rescind it. 9 MS. HYDE: I mean, you can, right. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, we can always cancel. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I thought you said that on 12 Page 124. (Laughter.) 13 MS. HYDE: No, 125. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It was 125? 15 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: You're slipping. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm slipping, man. 18 MS. HYDE: You were close. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So -- 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What are you saying, Bruce, 21 now? 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm saying that we don't -- 23 we have the option to give that or not give it. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Right. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I mean, if we do nothing, it 3-22-10 160 1 automatically goes in place. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Right. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: But if I make a motion and I 4 don't get a second, it still gets automatically put in place. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Right. 6 MS. HYDE: Right, yes, sir. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So I would offer that motion. 8 I would recommend that we rescind the Court Order Number -- 9 MS. HYDE: Would you like the court order? 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- 31447 that -- that grants 11 a 1.5 percent raise, increasing compensation for all Kerr 12 County employees effective April 1. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion. Do I hear a 14 second? 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion dies for lack of a second. 17 Any other -- 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: -- motions in connection with this 20 item? Okay. Let's move to Item 26; consider, discuss, take 21 appropriate action to declare March 27th, 2010, Bark for Life 22 and A Toast to the Animals day in Kerr County. Commissioner 23 Baldwin? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. Thank you. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: In Precinct 1 this time. 3-22-10 161 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Precinct 1, yes, sir. Back 2 -- back on. That -- the 27th, of course, is this coming 3 Saturday. The Bark for Life program is the second, sometimes 4 annual, and out at the River Star Park. Last year it was 5 really one of the neatest things. Last year they had right 6 at 200 dogs participate in this thing. They're going to 7 double that this year. And they've got all kinds of 8 sponsors, and there's all kind of prizes and all that kind of 9 thing, and it's for -- it's honoring -- it's a fundraiser 10 honoring cancer survivors, and it's kind of the front end of 11 the big cancer program that they'll have later on out at the 12 stadium; just a kind of thing to get everybody in tune. And 13 then later on that very same day, in the evening is A Toast 14 to the Animals out at the Museum of Western Art. You know, 15 they -- they have animal lovers out there, and they have a 16 raffle and auction, and they're having wine and music and -- 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Is there an admission fee for that? 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, there is, and it 19 benefits the Humane Society of Kerrville. So, I just thought 20 that, being the nice people that we are, we'd just go ahead 21 and take a swing at both of those. And the Bark for Life 22 deal, my precious Daisy and I are the -- I don't know what we 23 are. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Grand marshals. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Grand marshal, I guess, for 3-22-10 162 1 the little parade. And she -- she's going to give a little 2 talk, and, of course, I'll have to tell everybody what she 3 says, 'cause I'm the only one that understands her. Her and 4 her one eye. But it's a cute little thing, and I just think 5 it would be kind of neat for us to declare Kerr County that 6 day, Bark for Life and A Toast to Animals day in Kerr County 7 this coming Saturday. I so move. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 10 approval of the agenda item. Any question or discussion? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Is that in the park, or where 12 is that? It's all going to be at the Museum of Western Art? 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, the one in the evening 14 is. The Toast to the Animals is at the museum. Ours is at 15 the -- out there by the Ag Barn at the Star. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's time's your -- 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: River Star? 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: River Star, yes, sir. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What time? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Ours starts at 9 o'clock. I 21 think Daisy and I go on at 10:00. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: In between breaks, you can go 23 to Comfort. It's opening day at Little League, too. 24 MS. GRINSTEAD: Right across the street, Kerrville 25 opening day. 3-22-10 163 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, that's right. I forgot 2 Little League opening day. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What if your dog won't bark? 4 (Laughter.) 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You know, I haven't thought 6 of that. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Buster will. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll do it for him. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mine howls. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: You got to interpret anyway, you 12 see. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, that's right. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: You had a comment, Ms. Whitt? 15 MS. WHITT: Yes. I was just going to say, I'm 16 pleased to say that they have asked us to participate again 17 in the Bark for Life, so we're really excited, and we're 18 going to -- we'll have two officers there. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: I've got a question for you. The 20 Commissioner said that the amount of animals participating in 21 this this year is going to be double. What happened to your 22 spay and neuter program? (Laughter.) 23 MS. WHITT: I can say that they -- with us being 24 there last year, they have made some changes, and this year 25 they are requiring all the participants to provide proof of 3-22-10 164 1 rabies vaccinations and registration, so that's a good thing. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: May be back to 200, Judge. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You can take a page out of 4 the Obama textbook and say if we didn't hadn't done this, it 5 would have been more. (Laughter.) 6 MS. WHITT: And that was -- you know, they talked 7 to us about that, and they decided that would be a really 8 good idea. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Proof of rabies? Is that 10 what you said? 11 MS. WHITT: Yes, sir. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do I have to wear those 13 little tags? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 15 MS. WHITT: That's required by law. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: But you don't have to get a new one, 18 'cause you're within your three years. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's right, okay. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The owners aren't subject to 21 the same things. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Or just promise not to bite 23 anybody? 24 JUDGE TINLEY: That'll work. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If you need some barking, you 3-22-10 165 1 can just go by Animal Control; take your recorder anytime, 2 and you can get that on tape. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments on 4 the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 5 your right hand. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Arf. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bow-wow. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. Let's go to Item 12 27; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to allow 13 KARFA -- that's the Kerr Area Rural Fire Association -- to 14 use the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center free of charge for 15 their emergency vehicle operations course training on June 5 16 and 6, 2010. Commissioner Oehler? 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, Jody called about this 18 the other day, and when she got the call to ask for the use 19 of the Ag Barn, mainly the parking lot and another area, but 20 I thought that was good for us to put that on the agenda to 21 give formal approval of that, rather than individually just 22 saying, "Oh, yeah, that would be fine." So, I'll move that 23 we -- we allow KARFA to use the Youth Exhibit Center free of 24 charge for an emergency vehicle operators course training on 25 June the 5th and 6th, 2010. 3-22-10 166 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Waive all fees? 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Waive all fees. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second with a question. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Question 7 or discussion? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is anything else scheduled out 9 there that weekend? 10 JUDGE MITCHELL: Yes, my family reunion. That's 11 why I was here. My family reunion is scheduled on the 5th. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You can enroll them in the 13 training. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: How big is your family? 15 JUDGE MITCHELL: I already talked to Jody about it, 16 so, I mean, I was already -- 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Why'd you speak up? 18 JUDGE MITCHELL: Because you said was anything else 19 scheduled. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I just want to make sure 21 we didn't have any -- better be careful how I proceed on this 22 one. Want to make sure we had -- the parking lot was not 23 being used for other functions. 24 MS. GRINSTEAD: They said the park -- the actual 25 driving will probably be done on the 6th. On the 5th, they 3-22-10 167 1 want the classroom that's located upstairs. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 3 MS. GRINSTEAD: So there should be no conflicts. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That works. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments? 6 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 7 hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. Let's go to Item 12 28; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to approve 13 continuing disclosure dissemination agent agreement to 14 provide dissemination agent services in connection with the 15 continuing disclosure obligations of Kerr County regarding 16 certain bond issues for which County has agreed to make 17 annual filings pursuant to S.E.C. Rule 15c2-12 -- 2 through 18 12. Ms. Hargis? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Which one of these lawyers 20 wrote all that? 21 (Ms. Hargis raised her hand.) 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're guilty? 23 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Get a rope. 25 MS. HARGIS: When we sold our last bond issue, we 3-22-10 168 1 obligated ourselves to continuing disclosure. Prior to July 2 the 1st of 2009, we were considered a small issuer and did 3 not have to do this, but the S.E.C. has decided that all 4 issuers after July 1, 2009, will make continuing disclosure. 5 It requires us to send our financials and some other 6 pertinent information, very similar to the official statement 7 that we filled out to do the bond issue. Our financial 8 advisers have agreed to do this free, but they want this 9 contract in place in order to do that. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Has the County Attorney reviewed it? 11 MS. HARGIS: No. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Jeannie, what is -- what is 13 -- what do you mean by "certain bond issues"? 14 MS. HARGIS: The certain -- we have other issues, 15 and it only applies to this one issue. That's why they say 16 "certain bond issues." Only any issue after July 1 of 2009 17 would apply. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. That's a "certain 19 bond issue"? 20 MS. HARGIS: It's a legal term. What can I say? 21 MS. HYDE: Issuance. 22 MS. HARGIS: It actually says "issue." Issue. 23 MS. HYDE: But I think he's thinking that -- 24 "issue." Issue, not issuance. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, actually, the word 3-22-10 169 1 that's throwing me is "certain." 2 MS. HARGIS: That's the way it's written. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- Judge ought to 4 answer this, but usually "certain," as used here, refers to a 5 specific -- 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Certain type. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- certain specific one. 8 MS. HARGIS: A specific -- 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Isn't that correct, Judge? 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm, designated. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You're the lawyer. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Essentially, what you got is 13 Bob Henderson, RBC -- or RBC Capital have agreed to be that 14 agent at no cost to us. They will be a conduit for our 15 disclosure requirements, and they will help us make sure 16 we're complying with those disclosure requirements that we 17 have under our credit agreements with this past issue. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 21 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 22 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 3-22-10 170 1 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 2 to Item 29; consider, discuss, take appropriate action on 3 employment of Rob Henneke as County Attorney. Commissioner 4 Baldwin, you put this on the agenda, noting "executive 5 session if necessary." Is it necessary that we do that in 6 executive session? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't think so. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Any part of this in executive 9 session? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I can't -- I don't see it, 11 Judge. I can't imagine -- 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Very well. All right, go ahead. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I just wanted to bring 14 Mr. Henneke in and visit with him. You know, I had -- I have 15 some thoughts, and I'm hoping that we'll all take turns going 16 around the table like we always do. There are -- there are 17 certain times that -- and I'll just give you an example. I 18 desire for you to -- and you probably already know, but I 19 want to say this anyway -- that you know or get to know the 20 Open Meetings and Open Records Act. That is -- those are -- 21 those are things that are important to this Court. You know, 22 I know that it is -- the day we had lunch together, I told 23 you that I -- you know, I'm sure that you have an interest in 24 the courtrooms and the prosecutions and all those things that 25 the County Attorney does, and I think that's fun, but my 3-22-10 171 1 issue is this Commissioners Court, and more particular, me, 2 keeping me out of jail. And so, you know, those things like 3 Open Records and Open Meetings, to the County Attorney, at 4 times we -- we get up here and we get into a hot discussion, 5 and we get off base. We get off of the agenda item. We 6 appear sometimes that there -- there's more than two of us 7 meeting behind closed doors, you know, those kinds of things. 8 And, you know, I want you to understand those laws that 9 you -- so you don't let us run off in the ditch. That's -- 10 you know, and that's my -- kind of my thing. 11 We have -- and, like, Open Records, we kind of have 12 a -- just a standing agreement between us up here that, you 13 know, if anybody was to walk in to Jody and ask her for a 14 copy of a record, we don't say, "Well, give us something in 15 writing." We give them what they want. You know, that kind 16 of thing. And I just -- you know, those kind of things are 17 important to me. Commissioner Letz is always talking about 18 subdivision regulations and ETJ and water and, you know, all 19 those things, and Bill has his and Bruce has -- has his own 20 concerns. And I just want to let you know that there's going 21 to be times where we -- we hand you a -- I don't know how to 22 say it; maybe hand you a list of things that -- that we want 23 or need. There's going to be times that we -- it will just 24 pop up in here where we -- where we're going to have to have 25 an opinion in order to take a next step on an issue, where 3-22-10 172 1 you're going to have to have your opinion, or you go off to 2 the state attorney and get an opinion from them, one of the 3 two. But it's, you know, just those kinds of things. I just 4 wanted to say that to you. 5 MR. HENNEKE: Well, thank you, Commissioner. Of 6 course, it's critical that we comply with the law, both with 7 TORA and TOMA, and I'll be on top of that. In fact, I will 8 be doing the training within the next 90 days, because the 9 law requires that I take training on the Texas Open Meetings 10 Act in the statute I was looking at last night, and it's an 11 important part of what this Court does, is complying with the 12 laws, and I'll be on top of that. I look forward to working 13 with you. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. Thank you very 15 much. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I want to go another 17 direction. Appreciate you being here today and sitting 18 through this entire session. It gives you a pretty good -- 19 pretty good illustration of the variety of topics that come 20 before the Court on any given meeting day. But I also think 21 it's important not only that you participate here, as 22 Ms. Bailey is doing and as you witnessed today and will 23 undoubtedly in the future do, but in my experience on this 24 Court, there was a period of time when the County Attorney's 25 office was kind of like a deep hole of Calcutta, and you'd 3-22-10 173 1 send a request down there for something, and it seldom saw 2 the light of day. Or if it did see the light of; day, it was 3 so old and ancient that you forgot why you sent the memo to 4 start with. So, my -- my thought is that the County Attorney 5 needs to be responsive in all aspects of this Court's 6 business, whether it's in the formal setting like today, or 7 whether it's a memorandum that any of us could direct your 8 attention about any given subject. And we do so because 9 there is some constituent out there who's raised an issue 10 with us, or a problem has arisen and they expect a response, 11 and in turn, so do we. And so, you know, that's just my 12 thoughts. I know you're going to do that, but I feel 13 compelled to make that illustration for you. 14 MR. HENNEKE: Yes, sir. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can I take one more -- 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sure. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: -- whack at this thing? Talking 18 about the black hole of Calcutta, I remember the time that we 19 had a County Attorney here that just basically refused to do 20 any work for the Commissioners Court, and then in turn, we go 21 out and hire an attorney in the community to do the -- to do 22 our work for us. Now, that's a sad day. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That was a sad day, and I 25 hope we never ever get to that point again. 3-22-10 174 1 MR. HENNEKE: Commissioner, I'll be responsive, 2 I'll be accurate, and I believe in showing my work, so y'all 3 will know when you want to know it and you'll know where I'm 4 coming from when I deliver the answer. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the only thing -- I 7 mean, I agree with what both Commissioner Baldwin and 8 Williams said. The only other thing that I would really add 9 to that is that the -- that whole -- the black hole of 10 Calcutta days versus where we are now, largely Rex Emerson 11 got -- made that transition and change down there, and put 12 together a staff and a group down there that are -- are 13 really good. And, obviously, it's going to be -- you're 14 autonomous; it's going to be your office. But, really, get 15 to know how that system works down there, what the staff down 16 there are doing, 'cause it is a first-class operation in my 17 opinion. And, you know, obviously, you'll want to make some 18 modifications once you're in office, but I would move -- just 19 a word of caution. Move slow. It works very, very well down 20 there. When Rex got appointed, Ilse, I think, basically 21 pretty much just let that machine continue to work. You get 22 a request -- obviously, you do a lot of work. We're most 23 concerned about work for us, but every other office in the 24 county relies on the County Attorney's office, and it's a 25 critical function for all offices to work smoothly. So, 3-22-10 175 1 just -- you know, welcome, and at the same time, go slow. 2 And that's it. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Pretty much the same thing. 4 I visited with Rob a little bit about these things, and -- 5 and, you know, being responsive to everybody in this 6 courthouse and everybody that works for the county is very 7 important. And working closely with everybody, where they 8 have the confidence to come see you about issues, and -- and 9 action gets taken fairly quickly is very important. And look 10 forward to having you do just that. 11 MR. HENNEKE: Thank you, Commissioner. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And, Rob, one thing I'd add is 13 that, obviously, your time is going to become, you know, 14 really compressed and a lot of demands on you. And, you 15 know, I expect you -- I think the rest of us up here, we have 16 our own priorities. I may have four or five things floating 17 around down there. If it gets to be too much, say, "Hey, I 18 can't get to that for a while." I would rather know that 19 it's going to be a couple of weeks or a month till you can 20 really get into some of this stuff, as opposed to saying -- 21 you know, then I can act accordingly. I mean, obviously, as 22 quick as you can get things, I'd appreciate it, but knowing 23 where things are is as important as getting the answer a lot 24 of times, just knowing the status. I'd appreciate it. And 25 feedback goes both ways, 'cause, obviously, I know that, you 3-22-10 176 1 know, sometimes Commissioner Baldwin's going to ask for 2 something, I'm going to ask for something, and mine's going 3 to be the priority. (Laughter.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Always is, isn't it? 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There you go; 1, 2, 3, 4. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's the way it's been all 7 these years. But I'm number one. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And a question I do have, also, 9 is I know that on acting on the agenda item, the 10 appointment -- can someone fill me in legally as to what we 11 -- where we are and dates and times? I know that we have a 12 letter of resignation that's requested to be effective -- 13 JUDGE TINLEY: March 31st. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- March 31st. Can action be 15 taken today, or a future date, or do we have to wait until 16 after that date, or where are we? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Give us a couple of minutes; 18 I'll show you. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You got it. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Henneke, welcome aboard. The 21 thing that I think is -- that you're going to find is you're 22 going to have to become an expert in time management, because 23 you got a whole bunch of clients, all the various departments 24 of Kerr County; for example, Juvenile Board. That's someone 25 else that you -- that you get to respond to. And if -- if 3-22-10 177 1 the Court has an issue, for example, I think it's important 2 that we are entitled to rely on your opinion. If you issue a 3 written opinion in a given matter, we are entitled to rely 4 upon that, and that gives us, in essence, immunity if our 5 actions are based upon that opinion. So, it's very, very 6 critical that any opinion that we get is something that we 7 feel comfortable relying upon, and I'm sure you don't want it 8 any other way. But you're going to have -- you're going to 9 have relationships running out your ears before you know it 10 because of all the various departments, and -- and you got a 11 lot of J.P.'s that you're going to be serving, and -- and 12 there's going to be all sorts of matters just falling out of 13 the sky on you. And just hitch it up and get ready, because 14 it's coming. And best of luck, and welcome aboard. 15 MR. HENNEKE: Thank you, sir. Thank you, 16 Commissioners, Judge. I look forward to working with y'all. 17 Look forward to getting up to speed and bringing what I bring 18 to the table to it, and to continue to serve, along with you, 19 the great -- great people of Kerr County. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want to say 21 congratulations on your election, but more importantly, 22 congratulations on your new son. 23 MR. HENNEKE: Thank you. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What a thrill that is. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Bingo, yeah. 3-22-10 178 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, I move that we appoint 2 Rob Henneke as Kerr County Attorney effective April 1, 2010. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 5 indicated. Let me ask for clarification on that, 6 Commissioner. That is to fill the current vacancy in that 7 position? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That is correct, sir. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Would you like to have that 11 language in there, in the order? 12 JUDGE TINLEY: I think we just clarified it on the 13 record. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or comment on the 16 motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 17 right hand. 18 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 20 (No response.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Come 22 April 1, you're it. 23 MR. HENNEKE: I'll be ready to go. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Good. Good. Okay, gentlemen. 25 Anything else on the main agenda that we've not taken care 3-22-10 179 1 of? If not, we'll go to Section 4. First item, pay the 2 bills. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move we pay the bills. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to pay the 6 bills. Question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, 7 signify by raising your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. I gather that 12 that does include the direct, as well as the -- 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, sir. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. All right. Okay, budget 15 amendments. 16 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: We've got -- 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Looks like three of them. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: -- three budget amendments as shown 20 on the Budget Amendment Request Summary. Do I hear a motion 21 that the budget amendments as shown on the summary be 22 approved? 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So moved. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 3-22-10 180 1 approval of the budget amendment requests as shown on the 22 2 March 2010 summary. Question or discussion? All in favor of 3 the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Did you vote, Commissioner? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Late bills. 10 I show one late bill to Kendnel Kasper for some setup work 11 that they've done in connection with the project. 12 MS. HARGIS: 27,000. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: After -- after deduction and 14 retainage, it was approved by the architect and submitted for 15 payment. 16 MS. HARGIS: I have one other one. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Pardon? 18 MS. HARGIS: I have one other one. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 20 MS. HARGIS: You don't have that in front of you, 21 'cause it was handed in at break. One of the Tahoes that we 22 ordered for the Juvenile Probation Department did come in, 23 and we have taken receipt of it. And that is grant funds, as 24 you may recall, and it's 35,225.75. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 35 what? 3-22-10 181 1 MS. HARGIS: 35,225.75. I've asked -- 2 JUDGE TINLEY: That is payable to whom? 3 MS. HARGIS: That's payable to Holiday Chevrolet in 4 Whitesboro, Texas. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Sorry, I didn't catch the last. 6 MS. HARGIS: Whitesboro, Texas. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 8 MS. HARGIS: We have the title and all the 9 paperwork, and I have it right here in front of me. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: We got possession of the vehicle and 11 all the legal documents? 12 MS. HARGIS: The vehicle is parked along the side, 13 actually, right next to my car, so those of you that would 14 like to see it, please -- that's -- that is complete. The 15 Juvenile, he got the one sedan and then they got the Tahoe, 16 so I would assume that maybe the rest of our Tahoes will be 17 coming in shortly. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: On ours, they're telling us 19 ours should start arriving about the middle to last week of 20 April. But then there's still a lot of equipment that has to 21 be added. I doubt if we'll see them on the road until the 22 middle of May. 23 MS. HARGIS: We -- we're very fortunate with these 24 grants being reimbursed almost -- I think we talked about 25 this. I actually sent the report in on the 1st, and the 3-22-10 182 1 money was in the bank by the 6th, so we're getting a very 2 rapid return on these funds. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Do I hear a motion that these two 4 late bills, one to Kendnel Kasper and the other to Holiday 5 Chevrolet, as delineated, be approved? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 9 approval of the late bills as designated. Question or 10 discussion? All in favor, signify by raising your right 11 hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. I've been 16 handed monthly reports from the District Clerk; Justice of 17 the Peace, Precinct 2; Justice of the Peace, Precinct 4; 18 Constable, Precinct 4; Kerr County Treasurer for 19 February 2010; and Road and Bridge Department. Do I hear a 20 motion that these reports be approved as presented? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 24 approval of the designated reports as presented. Question or 25 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 3-22-10 183 1 your right hand. 2 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 4 (No response.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Okay, 6 reports from Commissioners in connection with their liaison 7 or committee assignments. Commissioner. Baldwin, do you have 8 anything for us? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sir, I don't, but thank you 10 for asking. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Williams? 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Not particularly, but I do 13 want to take this opportunity to thank Ms. Bailey for her 14 service to Kerr County. We appreciate what you've done. 15 MS. BAILEY: Thank you. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Wish you well in all your 17 future legal endeavors. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Letz? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Nothing to add. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Oehler? 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: How about elected officials, 23 department heads? 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You knew Rusty was going to 25 be first. 3-22-10 184 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You knew I was going to. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Should have taken that out of order. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I could have given you his 4 report. It would have been a lot quicker. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Jail report is not good. For 6 the last couple weeks, we've been running as high as 178, 7 with as many as 28, 29 females, and in a 32-bed female 8 facility. This morning we were lower; we had some that 9 shipped out and got sent to other places. We were at 168, 10 with 23 females. Currently, there are 30 County Court at Law 11 ones that still need to go to court, 38 198th ones, and 52 12 216th. 216th also had grand jury today, with 42 more on the 13 grand jury list. I do not know how many of those will be 14 true-billed or not. We've got 23 inmates with over 100 days 15 in jail. The longest one's 525 days, and that's a 216th case 16 still waiting. 198th has eight of them with over 100 days; 17 the longest is 300 days. I've got 12 in there for parole 18 violations, and I've got 29 that are serving out sentences or 19 waiting to be shipped out. Got 65 that are in there for 20 violation of probations, and then I've got five in there for 21 murder. So, it's -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: For what? 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Murder. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh, murder. I thought he said 25 money. 3-22-10 185 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, they're not getting that 2 part. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Thirteen in there for 4 immigration violations, and five for organized crime. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Immigration violations ought to be 6 gone fairly soon, shouldn't they? 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Some of those also have other 8 charges pending. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Pardon? 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Some of the those also have 11 other charges pending. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh. 13 MS. BAILEY: Most of them do, don't they? 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah, most of them. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Are we experiencing a problem with 16 the -- with the Friday court docket? 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: A lot of things, I noticed, 18 are getting reset more and more. I couldn't tell you the 19 reason why there has not been that much activity on the 20 Friday court docket. Last Friday, I think all the dockets 21 were reset; I'm not sure. We had hardly anybody going. But 22 I can't -- I haven't looked into that individually enough to 23 be able to give you an accurate answer on what's happening. 24 I know that all -- last week, every morning there have been 25 anywhere from 10 to 20 people put in jail overnight. A lot 3-22-10 186 1 of those get out right away, but some of them don't. I don't 2 know whether it's spring break, whatever, but there was just 3 a lot going on, and hoping it slows down. But it -- I don't 4 know what to tell you. It's going up. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Buster, you need to go to 6 work on those judges -- that judge on the Friday docket? You 7 need to work on that a little more, push that along? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Heck, yeah. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You have 65 with violation of 10 probations or parole violations; those people aren't going 11 anywhere until the Court gets done with them. Those are no 12 bonds. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Are the violations of probation, are 14 they mostly misdemeanors? Or -- 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Probably about half and half. 16 It's just an educated guess, without going through it all. 17 And we're ending up now just with more and more of them with 18 problems, with either mental status -- and the jail staff -- 19 and you can see it in newspaper articles, like lately where 20 now P.D. says they were fighting when they got them to the 21 jail. Well, that's when P.D. or S.O. leaves, and the jail 22 staff deals with them. So, it's been -- been very 23 interesting. I don't know what's going on, but they've had 24 to fight a number of them, put them in restraint chairs. 25 It's just been a -- we've got a number of them that have 3-22-10 187 1 attempted suicide, things like that lately. It's just -- 2 it's really been a difficult case for our jailers. And any 3 time it gets that crowded, it gets worse. You can't separate 4 them out correctly. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How are the state prisons? 6 What's their occupancy levels right now? 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I understand they're pretty 8 close to full. So far we haven't had a problem getting ours 9 in. Once they're paper-ready, I mean, they're still running 10 right up to that 45, 50 days before they take them, but 11 that's been the way that's been. The hardest one getting 12 them into are your treatment facilities, ISF, things like 13 that; those are taking a while. But that's kind of where we 14 are. Other than that, we're waiting on the -- the cars to 15 start coming in. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Maybe we need to consider that 17 additional unfinished space in the new building for housing 18 inmates, as opposed to the 216th District Attorney. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, I don't think the 20 construction will fit the requirements that our nice state 21 Jail Commission's going to require as far as how we construct 22 it for housing inmates. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Who's going to tell them? 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Who, the inmates? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, who's going to tell the 3-22-10 188 1 state about housing them? 2 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm not going to tell them. Are 3 you? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Department heads? Okay. 6 MS. HARGIS: I think all of you received a packet 7 from me regarding the financials. Through the 15th -- 8 basically, both of them are through the 18th of this month. 9 This is not a full six months, because we -- we don't get the 10 clerk's fees until after the end of March, so I did kind of a 11 synopsis on the side for you to -- to kind of see your pluses 12 and your minuses. I will point out that we are behind on the 13 sales tax. Same time this year as last year is the best 14 comparison; we're 127,000 behind. Which isn't bad, but it's 15 not great. You can see where I have brackets, it's below. 16 Where there are no brackets, it's above. You see that on the 17 first page, we're ahead of the tax collections, thanks to 18 Diane's office. We appreciate that. Sales tax is behind. 19 Bail bonds is a little behind. Your permit fees are -- are 20 ahead. Your state-shared revenue, which is, you know, some 21 of these things come in once a year. Most of them do come in 22 once a year. You're ahead there actually 1,528.95. 23 Environmental Health, we are behind, but again, the 24 building, you know, during the wintertime is not as much as 25 it will be in the spring and the fall. We -- the 3-22-10 189 1 out-of-county prisoners, we're ahead. Again, we didn't have 2 any of those last year. And our constable fees and our -- 3 and all of their fees of office, we are ahead right now, 4 combined. Not necessarily each department, but combined. 5 Justices are a little bit behind; the J.P.'s are way behind, 6 which was the -- was the case last year. They're still 7 running very far behind in their civil fees. The criminal 8 fees are ahead. Sheriff fees are ahead. Our reimbursements 9 are ahead. Interest earnings, we kind of knew those would be 10 not there. The next one is all of our varied fees. Again, a 11 lot of these are one-time fees that come in once a year, 12 but -- so that's one reason we may be a little bit behind 13 there. But I do want to point out to you on the very last 14 line that we did get some money from the State, unexpected, 15 unbudgeted, of 47,889, which kind of offsets our 127 a little 16 bit. So, the total revenues are actually ahead 1,218,464.52. 17 I -- I don't want you to get a false sense of 18 security here, 'cause I'm not real pleased with these 19 revenues. We are watching them very closely. They're not 20 running what we need them to run, especially in all the 21 clerk's offices. We're behind -- still behind even what we 22 budgeted. So, I want to bring this again probably when we 23 start our budgeting process maybe in May when we've got a 24 clear six months, but I didn't want to wait until the end, 25 and I want y'all to be kind of on board to know what I know. 3-22-10 190 1 Expenses, on the other hand, are fine. Most everybody is 2 under, or right where they need to be. Considering at this 3 time, they should be at about 58 percent, if you'll notice, 4 most of them haven't even used that much yet. So, all of the 5 spending is -- is way -- is intact. It's where it should be. 6 It's the revenue side that we don't have a lot of control 7 over. I'm hoping now that we got a lot of rain -- we 8 didn't -- you know, with the drought last year, maybe we 9 didn't have as many people -- the camps didn't have as many 10 kids. I'm hoping that will all pick up. 11 Sales tax is the -- the State Controller; we were 12 running right with the state, which was 14 -- about 13 14 percent. And in the newsletter that we received from the 14 Controller's office, they have seen that come up statewide 15 down to 8.8 percent behind, so it is coming up. Now, that's 16 -- you know, affects each -- each area. We're not as bad off 17 as -- as the city, budget-wise. If you look at it, it's way 18 behind, but you understand the budget's divided by 12, so 19 that's why I showed you year-to-date, 'cause it's a little 20 better. But, you know, I'm hoping that comes up. We have 21 collected our ad valorem tax pretty much. We'll be done -- 22 it will trickle in a little bit more until July 1, but we 23 have that semiannual payment in July, so that kind of skews 24 ours a little bit. So, then we get a big kick in July, and 25 then it tapers back off again. So the real test will be to 3-22-10 191 1 see how our fees are coming in in the next couple of months. 2 So -- 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And sales tax. 4 MS. HARGIS: And the sales tax. So, I'll keep you 5 up to date on that. I just want you to be constantly aware 6 of that. I would like to send out a letter, even though 7 everybody's doing a great job, and say, you know, if you 8 don't really need it, don't buy it. Just conserve as much as 9 we can, so that we can -- you know, we can't help the 10 revenue; we can certainly cut our expenses. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Try and offset as much as possible 12 with fund balances? 13 MS. HARGIS: Right. So, if y'all don't mind, I 14 will send out that letter. It's just a, you know, "please 15 help me" type of a letter. Nothing, you know, that's 16 demanding that they cut back, because they are doing a good 17 job. Most of your departments, if you'll look at them, 18 they're in the 65, 70 percent range. They haven't even used 19 any of their -- you know, a lot of discretionary money, 20 they're holding onto it. So -- but, please, if you have any 21 questions regarding revenue or you're concerned about it at 22 any time, you know, please just let my office know. We'll 23 work with you, provide you what you need. I want y'all to be 24 on board with me month by month on this deal. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Hargis, has the Comptroller 3-22-10 192 1 issued any guidance or -- or any numbers that deal with the 2 percentage of lost sales tax to internet sales? 3 MS. HARGIS: I have to look back. To be honest 4 with you, there was something not this month, but the prior 5 month, about internet sales, so I'll have to look back on 6 that and see how that's affecting us. The -- you have to 7 also understand, one of the reasons that we've got, I think, 8 a deflated sales tax -- and I've -- you know, when gas went 9 up, we got the sales tax. We all liked to die, but gas went 10 up; we got the sales tax off of it. When the gas fell, so 11 did the sales tax. So, a lot of that was an inflated sales 12 tax that we got due to gasoline. We've also had a lot of 13 businesses in -- you know, if you've lived here long 14 enough -- you know, I feel like I've lived here long enough, 15 I can say that there's a lot of businesses, even in the 16 downtown area. We lost one out at -- you know, we lost Grape 17 Juice to Kerrville, so we -- you know, in Ingram. We needed 18 that. We don't have it any more. So, there's still a lot of 19 businesses that aren't doing that well. I had a visit from 20 one of the executives of Wells Fargo Bank, and he said a lot 21 of our businesses waited; they're just now feeling it really 22 bad, and they waited till the last minute to come to them, 23 and there's nothing they can do. So, I think we're going to 24 see some more of our businesses go down, you know, as a 25 result of this economy. So, we just need to keep up with it 3-22-10 193 1 and be cognizant of it, knowing that next year, we -- we're 2 going to have to maybe pull back even more than we have in 3 the past. But I just -- I feel like I need to bring the 4 message. It's not real bad yet, but I just want you to know 5 we need to watch it. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions for Ms. Hargis? 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Only in -- this is a report 8 that you generate monthly? Or just periodically? 9 MS. HARGIS: Well, the financial statements are -- 10 you can pull them down yourself, and I will show each one of 11 you how to do that. You can do a summary that I gave you; 12 you can pull that down any time. But I converted this to 13 Excel, because I thought it was a little easier for y'all to 14 read, and I wanted to see myself. We've been running it, 15 unbeknownst to y'all, for about -- that intern that I hired, 16 I've had him doing a report for the last three months, and it 17 just kept bothering me. Our percentages were just not there. 18 And, of course, I worry about -- I worry about budget to 19 actual, but not as much as budget to last year, 'cause last 20 year we were running the same -- pretty much the same budget 21 as we did last year. So, if we have the same revenue as last 22 year, but we're -- we're in good shape, but we're not running 23 that either, so that's what concerns me. And, you know, some 24 of the other counties, and now the city has cut back a 25 million dollars. But I'm not going to cry wolf yet, but I 3-22-10 194 1 will be glad to come over and show each one of you how to 2 pull those down so you can keep up with them if you have -- 3 if you're curious about them. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, what's the total amount 5 of the one and a half percent increase in salary from April 6 through end of the year? 7 MS. HARGIS: I figured total; it's about $88,000. 8 Otherwise, I would have been up here. I -- I had to weigh -- 9 and that's why I've been looking at this, believe me. That's 10 why I had to put it on the agenda. It's not that I didn't 11 want this to go through, but I did want everybody to know, 12 you know, that we're down a little bit. But I think we can 13 stand -- it was already in the budget. It's already plugged 14 into the budget, so I think we'll be all right. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Any more questions for her? Thank 16 you, ma'am. Other department heads? 17 MS. HYDE: Two things. One, everyone knows what 18 happened this morning, right? With health care? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Happened last night. 20 MS. HYDE: Well, I went to bed. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: No, we don't know really what 22 happened. 23 MS. HYDE: Don't really know. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We know how many hands went 25 up on one side and the other. 3-22-10 195 1 MS. HYDE: I'll keep y'all up to date, but I'm not 2 going to bombard you with all the stuff that's out there. We 3 won't know anything for a while. You guys have been around 4 this long enough and understand the game. This doesn't go 5 into effect till 2014. There's a lot that can change between 6 now and then, so I'll leave it there. It's not going to 7 impact us this year as far as insurance, and it probably will 8 not impact us next year on insurance cost, which is good 9 news. I will be gone part of the month of April. I have 10 three conferences that I need to go to, so I will be in and 11 out, but I'll give you guys a -- you'll know where I'm at and 12 how to get ahold of me. And you will be getting invitations 13 to get your Hep A and B shots, gentlemen. You got one 14 invitation and I didn't get any responses. This is an RSVP, 15 so -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What shot? 17 MS. HYDE: Your Hep A and B shots. And if you need 18 tetanus -- 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Isn't that -- didn't we 20 decide -- pretty much decide we didn't need that up here? 21 That was only for people at risk. 22 MS. HYDE: Just tell me, "I don't want it," so I 23 don't order it. If y'all don't want it, that's fine. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Buster promised not to bite, so 25 that's -- that's a help. 3-22-10 196 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I went through my distemper 2 thing a while ago. Is there something new now? 3 MS. HYDE: Yeah. You got Hep A and B and tetanus, 4 so just check with your physicians, and they'll be an e-mail 5 that goes out. Elected/appointed officials will need to have 6 a response by the end of the month so I can order. We held 7 off, trying to see if the prices would go down. They have 8 gone down. Saves us a little bit of money. That's all I 9 got. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, that does include 11 tetanus. That's a good thing. 12 MS. HYDE: Oh, yeah. You get your tetanus too, and 13 we'll have lots of fun giving shots. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You need a tetanus? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably do. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other department heads? Anybody 17 else? Going once. Going twice. Going three times. We're 18 adjourned. 19 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 2:46 p.m.) 20 - - - - - - - - - - 21 22 23 24 25 3-22-10 197 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 official reporter for the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 29th day of March, 2010. 8 9 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 10 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 11 Certified Shorthand Reporter 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 3-22-10