1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Special Session 10 Monday, April 12, 2010 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X April 12, 2010 2 PAGE --- Commissioners' Comments 5 3 1.1 Consider/discuss, approve a resolution 4 proclaiming the week of April 18- 24 as Crime Victims Rights Week in Kerr County 5 to match the statewide proclamation 13 6 1.2 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on reducing registration fee to $1 for rabies 7 clinic at Doyle Community Center April 24, 2010 14 8 1.3 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve a proclamation to declare May 6, 2010, 9 "National Day of Prayer" 15 10 1.4 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to appoint Ray Garcia as primary representative 11 and Julie Shirley as alternate representative from Kerr County on AACOG Resource Recovery 12 Committee 16 13 1.7 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to set a public hearing for proposed speed limit 14 and speed limit signs on Backacre Road, Precinct 1 17 15 1.8 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to set public hearing for proposed speed limit and speed 16 limit signs on Lower Reservation Road, Precinct 4 18 17 1.9 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to declare RB6421 Storage Tanker surplus 20 18 1.10 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 19 adopt resolution and proclamation in commemoration of 75th anniversary of the USDA Natural Resources 20 Conservation Service (NRCS) 22 21 1.12 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action regarding the use of the indoor arena by 4-H 22 Horse Club or members thereof 23 23 1.5 Public Hearing for adding a stop sign at Roundabout Lane and Sandy Lane, Precinct 2 35 24 1.6 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 25 approve installing stop sign at Roundabout Lane and Sandy Lane, Precinct 2 36 3 1 I N D E X (Continued) April 12, 2010 2 PAGE 3 1.15 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to authorize Kerr County Auditor to conduct an 4 audit of Kerr County Attorney's office through March 31, 2010 37 5 1.16 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 6 allocate funding from 2007 or 2010 capital funds and approve air duct cleaning of courthouse and 7 jail 38 8 1.14 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to sign updated HRA agreements with DataPath, Inc. 9 for 2010 45 10 1.17 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to authorize County Auditor and Sheriff to work on 11 developing policies for disposition of assets, collection of data for grants, grant procedure 12 policy, internal control policy, financial policy 46 13 1.11 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve plans for Hill County Youth Exhibition 14 Center Rodeo Arena and go out for bids 54 15 1.13 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on request from Kerrville Citizen Police Academy 16 Alumni Association, a 501(c)(4) organization, to receive discount on rental fees for Indoor Arena 17 at the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center 64 18 1.18 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve new telephone system service for county 19 courthouse 69 20 4.1 Pay Bills 88 4.2 Budget Amendments 99 21 4.3 Late Bills 101 4.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 102 22 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee 23 Assignments 103 24 5.2 Reports from Elected Officials/Department Heads 106 25 --- Adjourned 112 4 1 On Monday, April 12, 2010, at 9:00 a.m., a special 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let me call to order this 8 regularly scheduled meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners 9 Court posted and scheduled for this date and time, Monday, 10 April 12th, 2010, at 9 a.m. It is that time now. 11 Commissioner Baldwin? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. Would you stand 13 and join me in a word of prayer, and then after that we'll do 14 the pledge of allegiance to the flag. 15 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. At this time, if there's 17 any member of the public or the audience that wishes to be 18 heard on any matter that is not a listed agenda item, this is 19 your opportunity to come forward and tell us what's on your 20 mind. If you wish to be heard on an agenda item, there's a 21 participation form at the back of the room that we would 22 prefer that you fill out. The main purpose of that is so 23 that I don't miss you when we get to that item. If you've 24 not filled out a participation form, when we get to an agenda 25 item, if you want to be heard on it, get my attention in some 4-12-10 5 1 manner and I'll see that you do have that opportunity. But 2 right now, if there's any member of the public or audience 3 that wishes to be heard on any matter that is not a listed 4 agenda item, feel free to come forward at this time. Seeing 5 no one coming forward, we will move on. Commissioner 6 Baldwin, what do you have for us this morning? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just wanted to say to you 8 guys -- of course, y'all were there Saturday at the marker 9 dedication out on Harper Road of the Texas Great Trail -- 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Western Trail. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Western Trail, and what a 12 fantastic -- I've been to 2.7 million of those things, and 13 what a fantastic time that was. It was incredible. Dr. 14 Rector and I were sitting having a cold drink on the steps, 15 and an artist appeared after the deal with this giant 16 painting, and -- and a guy writing a book walked up and sat 17 down and visited with us that has documented that trail all 18 the way from Brownsville, Texas to Canada, and just an 19 incredible -- the whole thing is just so incredible. And 20 imagining that valley from hill to hill full of longhorn 21 steers, it just -- it's just phenomenal. And the -- I think 22 the Historical Commission did a fantastic job, and my hat's 23 off to them, and it was fun. Now, I don't -- I don't know 24 why I'm telling y'all that; y'all were there, but just in 25 case you forgot. And then tonight, Commissioner Letz and I 4-12-10 6 1 are going to a subdivision in my precinct, Northwest Hills, 2 to talk about ETJ. Now, they specifically requested him to 3 be there, and the gentleman that called me and made the 4 invite, I don't know him well enough to tell him the truth 5 over the phone about Commissioner Letz. (Laughter.) But 6 Ms. Lavender and her -- 7 MS. LAVENDER: Actually, tomorrow night. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tomorrow night. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. I was going to be 10 in trouble. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm going to go tonight, get 12 it over with. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: You got another commitment tonight. 14 We got it. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's right, that's what it 16 is. We're playing basketball tonight. Now -- but Rosa 17 Lavender and her husband John -- of course, John's the 18 constable in Precinct 1 -- are going to be there, just for a 19 little security, you know what I'm saying, 'cause I can go 20 there and it turns out pretty good, but I'm hauling Letz with 21 me, and so there's no telling what's going to happen there. 22 So, I'm thankful for the security to go along. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Is any member of the Council going 24 to be there? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't think they're ready 4-12-10 7 1 for that. Maybe we can do that next month. Hey, think about 2 that. 3 MS. LAVENDER: We did. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sell some Cokes and beer and 5 popcorn and stuff. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Tickets. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, tickets. So, anyway, 8 thank you. And we're going to have a great meeting. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Williams? 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just following up a bit on 11 what Commissioner Baldwin was saying about the Great Western 12 Trail marker ceremony, it was indeed really a good event, as 13 you might expect when Dr. Rector joins with the Historical 14 Commission to do these things. It was really neat. The 15 painting that the Commissioner was talking about was about 16 4 foot by 8 feet, and it was -- and was longhorns in the 17 pasture, basically; not on the drive, per se. And I saw that 18 artist and talked to him later, and I asked him what he had 19 done, how he had done that so big, and it's a process. This 20 guy has the gallery over here on Water Street, he and his 21 wife, and it's a process where they take photographs and meld 22 however many they want to use; in this case, it was two. And 23 they meld them together on the computer, and put -- and get 24 the whole visual that they wish to have, and then they print 25 it out; there's a special process. And then it's painted by 4-12-10 8 1 hand, in some cases as much as 90-plus percent. In this 2 case, he said about 70 percent was painted over, and it was 3 just absolutely magnificent in terms of -- of the subject 4 matter and the whole process. I told him at the end, I said, 5 "That's really great. I appreciate the information. That 6 would really look good in the courthouse." He said, 7 "Really?" 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It would look good in this 9 courtroom. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But he didn't offer it. 11 So, anyhow, it was a good event. That's all I got, Judge. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Commissioner Letz? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The past couple weeks, I've 14 been in one meeting after another. Everyone, I'm sure, is 15 interested in the Habitat Conservation Plan for the Southern 16 Edwards Plateau. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're going to tell us 18 about it? Great. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's moving right along. 20 That's as much as we're going to talk about it today. There 21 will be this summer, at some point, a presentation by that 22 group to this Commissioners Court, and all the other 23 commissioners courts that will be part of this area, which I 24 think there are nine counties, eight counties, something like 25 that. They thought that this would be a good test run, 4-12-10 9 1 because I'm -- hopefully, a little bit, on the grounds that 2 I'm the chair of the committee; they can get a little bit of 3 a friendly reception here, instead of going to Bandera, where 4 Judge Evans told them to stay the hell out of their county. 5 (Laughter.) But, anyway, that's working. Last week I was in 6 Austin for the Model Subdivision Rule task force, and that 7 just -- it's -- we're on a fast track to get something 8 written by September on that. And -- and tempers are flaring 9 a little bit -- or not really tempers; I guess points of view 10 were escalating rapidly at our meeting in Austin. And I was 11 obviously on one side, as frequently happens with these 12 things. And they've been tasked to write part of the 13 changes. This Friday is a meeting for Region J in Camp Wood. 14 It will be an interesting meeting. Want to go to Camp Wood? 15 MS. GRINSTEAD: Thursday. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This Thursday, Camp Wood. 17 Thursday in Camp Wood. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Right after basketball 19 practice. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's a public hearing on the 21 current plans being submitted to the State for the next state 22 water plan. And -- but there's also some workshops that are 23 pretty interesting. They kind of explain the regional 24 process, going over the GMA processes and some other things. 25 Primarily a big workshop, so a lot of information about water 4-12-10 10 1 issues will be discussed there. I, unfortunately, will be 2 out of town and not be able to attend. And -- is Thursday 3 the 15th? That same day in Austin, there is a -- I believe 4 it's a Senate hearing, either Senate or a House hearing, 5 where I was asked to testify on the GMA process and DFC's, 6 that whole thing. I'll be out of town for that as well, but 7 I will be submitting written testimony on that based on our 8 experience with the DFC process. That's kind of -- 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How's the family? Have you 10 seen them lately? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They were fine this morning. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Oehler? 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh, not a whole lot, Judge, 14 other than, you know, volunteerism is alive and well in the 15 west end of the county. Had a big fundraiser over the 16 weekend for a lady that's very ill, and lots of folks turned 17 out and we had a lot of people involved on the volunteer side 18 of it doing the meal and -- and the auction, all that. Very 19 well received, and it's always nice to see that that stuff is 20 not -- has not gone away. On that same note, the Ingram 21 friends and faculty are having their annual fundraiser dinner 22 on Saturday at the Museum of Western Art, and there's a group 23 of us that are going to do the cooking this year. They're 24 going to have beef tenderloin and some of sides and stuff 25 that Robbie Crocker's doing, and I think Beth Haney and her 4-12-10 11 1 boyfriend/husband are going to do camp cobbler out of Dutch 2 ovens for the dessert. And so we're trying to make the food 3 cost less, and have more -- more income for what it was 4 intended to be, which was to give scholarships. So, anyway, 5 other than that, grass is green, flowers are up. Need more 6 rain. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. I received notification 8 that Tierra Linda Volunteer Fire Department, which, of 9 course, is just across the county line in Gillespie County, 10 but which services a good part of the northern -- northern 11 part of the precinct of Commissioner Baldwin, Precinct 1, 12 received designation/certification from the Texas Department 13 of State Health Services as a Texas Emergency Medical 14 Services First Responder organization, and so they're getting 15 themselves medically qualified, as well as firefighting 16 qualified, and that puts them in a position to provide better 17 services, again, as Commissioner Oehler said, on a volunteer 18 basis to the citizens in that area. 19 I don't know how many of you have been paying 20 attention to what's going on out at the Law Enforcement 21 complex. Leonard Odom and his crews have done an absolutely 22 wonderful job of doing the site work out there. They -- once 23 we got past that first subgrade where we were fighting the 24 moisture problem, why, things came on up with the -- with the 25 foundation pad, and early part of this month it was turned 4-12-10 12 1 over to the contractor, fully signed off and certified by the 2 soil testing engineering people. So, that's ready to go, and 3 they're now working on that, getting the pad ready with -- 4 for the plumbing rough-in and so forth, to pour that 5 foundation. Mr. Leonard and his guys have moved over; 6 they're working on some drainage issues that have needed 7 attention probably better than 10 years as a result of that 8 detention pond that was acquired out there, and they're 9 getting that squared away where it's going to work this time, 10 by golly, and doing a fabulous job out there. So, kudos to 11 his -- his guys and gals for their good work out there. 12 They're really doing a fabulous job, and they're saving this 13 county one bunch of money by doing this work in-house. And 14 as you see those people, -- they're truly professionals -- 15 thank them for their work, because they're doing a great job. 16 I'm sure most of those on the Court have seen a 17 notification that the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service has 18 decided to weigh in on the -- the L.C.R.A. transmission line 19 game. They're going to be holding some hearings on inclusion 20 of items in the environmental impact statement, and there's a 21 series of meetings, one in San Angelo, Comfort, Junction, and 22 Lampasas. Comfort is Wednesday, the 21st of April, and the 23 one in Junction is Thursday, April the 22nd. Any of you 24 needing any information on that, why, feel free to ask for 25 it. And, lastly, I wanted to pass along that Kerr County has 4-12-10 13 1 been designated as a gold -- earned a gold leadership circle 2 award on the issue of financial transparency. Most of you 3 recall that some several months ago, we put our finances 4 online for the entire world to see, that every dime that we 5 spend is -- is there for them to look at. And, as a result, 6 the -- the Texas Comptroller has designated Kerr County as a 7 gold leadership circle award recipient. That's all I got. 8 Let's get on with the agenda. Item 1, to consider, discuss, 9 approve resolution proclaiming the week of April 18th through 10 the 24th as Crime Victims Rights Week in Kerr County, to 11 match statewide proclamation by Governor Rick Perry. 12 Ms. Lavender? 13 MS. LAVENDER: Good morning, gentlemen. I would 14 just ask that you approve this resolution. It's a standard 15 resolution mirroring what he did. The county this week will 16 talk about it. You know, we've got some great organizations 17 in this community that work with victims and provide services 18 for them and are sure that their rights are protected, and 19 this is a way to honor the organizations and the programs. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move adoption of the 21 resolution signifying that the week of April 18 though 24 is 22 designated as Crime Victims Rights Week in Texas. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 25 approval. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 4-12-10 14 1 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 2 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 4 (No response.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 6 MS. LAVENDER: Thank you. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move to the next item, to 8 consider, discuss, take appropriate action on reducing the 9 registration fee to $1 for the rabies clinic at Doyle 10 Community Center on April the 24th, 2010. I think we had 11 this before us, but the date got -- 12 MS. WHITT: Correct. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: -- mixed up. 14 MS. WHITT: And, if I'm not mistaken, I think y'all 15 already approved it. I just needed to come back and correct 16 the date. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 19 MS. WHITT: The new and correct date is April 24th. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and second for 21 approval. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 22 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 4-12-10 15 1 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. 2 MS. WHITT: Thank you. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move to Item 3; consider, 4 discuss, take appropriate action to approve proclamation to 5 declare May the 6th, 2010, as National Day of Prayer. 6 Reverend Fern Lancaster has requested this action by the 7 Court. She was unable to be here today. This is something 8 that has occurred for the last -- 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Forever. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: -- indeterminable number of years, 11 but many years. 12 MS. PIEPER: Should that be 2011, Judge? Oh, I'm 13 sorry, '10's this year. I'm a year ahead. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Glad to see Ms. Pieper's thinking 15 about her budget already, by golly. (Laughter.) 16 Fortunately, this has no budgetary impact. 17 MS. PIEPER: Right. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 21 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 22 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 4-12-10 16 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's move 2 to Item 4; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 3 appoint Ray Garcia as the primary representative, and Julie 4 Shirley as alternate representative from Kerr County on the 5 AACOG Resource Recovery Committee. I put this on the agenda 6 at the request of Ray Garcia. Apparently, our primary 7 designee is no longer available to serve, and the AACOG 8 organization asked that we make new appointments so that our 9 representation is complete down there. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 13 approval. Question or discussion on the motion? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What does the Resource Recovery 15 Committee do, Judge? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They -- basically, they 17 allocate the funds that come from recycling and so forth. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And, as you might expect, 20 since the biggest part of the area that generates the most 21 trash is Bexar County, they get the biggest piece of that 22 pie, but all 11 counties surrounding it get some of it, and 23 it's done on the basis of grant application, or application 24 for specific projects. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 4-12-10 17 1 THE CLERK: We have a motion and a second. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. We have a motion and a 3 second. All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 4 right hand. 5 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 7 (No response.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. Let's go to 9 Item 7, if we might. Consider, discuss, and take appropriate 10 action to set a public hearing for proposed speed limit and 11 speed limit signs on Backacre Road, located in Precinct 1. 12 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. Backacre is located off Coker 13 Road, and there has never been a posted speed limit there. 14 Ms. Smith had requested that Backacre needed some speed limit 15 signs. We placed three traffic counters out there over a 16 period of March 25th through the 29th. We got an average 17 speed of 40 miles an hour. However, I went out to look at 18 it; it's very curvy, and 40 miles an hour is just not -- it's 19 too fast. The complaint was that people were speeding, and 20 so we needed -- well, we said that we would take a look. We 21 recommend, just driving this, that 35 really be the posted 22 speed for this. And like all things, we -- I believe I had 23 Kelly talk to the -- or call the lady to remind her that -- 24 that this is going to be for everybody, not just the ones 25 that live there. So, if you're setting a speed there, you 4-12-10 18 1 really have this -- this speed problem, that 35 miles an hour 2 is a reasonable speed in those curves, as curvy as it is. 3 So, the Sheriff's Department -- you know, somebody may get a 4 ticket, so they just have to consider that. But at this 5 time, we ask the Court to set a public hearing for Monday, 6 May the 24th, 2010, at 9:30 regarding the setting the speed 7 limit and setting speed limit signs for Backacre Road, 8 Precinct 1. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to set a 12 public hearing on the matter for May the 24th, 2010, at 13 9:30 a.m. Question or discussion on the motion? All in 14 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. We'll move to 19 Item 8; to consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 20 set a public hearing for proposed speed limit and speed limit 21 signs on Lower Reservation Road, located in Precinct 4. 22 Mr. Odom? 23 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. Recently, in March, we had a 24 Mr. Bryant request a traffic count for speed limit. The 25 Reservation Road was done at three different locations, 4-12-10 19 1 through the 1st, April Fool's Day -- through April Fool's 2 Day, April the 1st, to take a look at this speed. The 85 3 percentile shows that the number one box is 47. Number 2 was 4 53, and Number -- Box 6 was 62 miles an hour, way too fast 5 for that road. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's a straight road through 7 there. 8 MR. ODOM: The gentleman is right, there is some 9 speeding out there. According to this, -- 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It would look that way. 11 MR. ODOM: -- the average speed would be 54 miles 12 an hour, which would indicate that -- we feel that 55 miles 13 an hour is too high. We recommend that speed limit be set at 14 45. We felt -- drove that; we felt that was reasonable in 15 there. And that we recommend that eight speed limit signs be 16 set, four in either direction, which is a long ways. That 17 would cover that entire distance from 479 to Weatherby. So, 18 at this time, we ask the Court to set a public hearing for 19 Monday, May the 24th, 2010, at 9:45 a.m. regarding setting 20 the speed limit and setting the speed limit signs for 21 Reservation Road, Precinct 4. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Move approval. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 25 approval of the agenda item to set a public hearing on the 4-12-10 20 1 matter for May 24th, 2010, at 9:45 a.m. Question or 2 discussion on the motion? All in favor of the motion, 3 signify by raising your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll move 8 to Item 9; to consider, discuss, and take appropriate action 9 to declare Road and Bridge 6421 storage tanker surplus. 10 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. This is an old tanker from -- 11 oh, I guess before the Unit Road System started, and it is a 12 5,000-gallon tanker. We have two tankers out there. We're 13 using the other one; we put a pump on it so that we can get 14 it in and out. It's got a gravitational flow, and we do not 15 need that tanker. We would like at this time the Court's 16 permission to declare it surplus and to put it on the Gov.com 17 web site to sell it. And, like I say, it's a '63 Fruehoff, 18 and we have no use for it. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Move approval. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 22 approval of the agenda item to declare it surplus and 23 authorize the sale. Question or discussion on the motion? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Leonard, would this be -- 25 would this be an item that a volunteer fire department could 4-12-10 21 1 use? 2 MR. ODOM: I'm not quite sure. Hadn't thought of 3 that, but, I mean, if they -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I mean, -- 5 MR. ODOM: Feasible. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- does it function? 7 MR. ODOM: It functions. It flows, but I don't 8 know how much oil is left in there. But it could be heated 9 up, I guess, and -- 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's that old tar tanker out 11 there that was in the old Ingram yard? 12 MR. ODOM: Mm-hmm. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Is that the one you're 14 talking about? 15 MR. ODOM: Yeah. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I know what you're talking 17 about. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What they're doing now is 19 using the other tanker they keep up at the Mountain Home 20 yard, the fire department, and that's the one they can fill 21 and respond with. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hey, nevermind. 23 MR. ODOM: Okay. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Does the pump work on this one that 25 you're -- 4-12-10 22 1 MR. ODOM: No, sir, it's gravitational flow. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Only? 3 MR. ODOM: Right. If you look at the pictures, it 4 will show you a ditch back behind it, and -- and we have to 5 back in there and pray that nothing's set up on it. But most 6 of that's AEP, but it's getting more and more difficult; the 7 elevation of the different -- just little distributors are 8 different. And we have one now that has a pump on it. We 9 placed a pump on the other one that's in the yard. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Further question or 11 discussion on the motion? All in favor of the motion, 12 signify by raising your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 17 Item 10; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 18 adopt resolution and proclamation in commemoration of the 19 75th anniversary of the U.S.D.A. Natural Resources 20 Conservation Service. I put this on the agenda at the 21 request of the N.C.R.S. -- N.R.C.S. folks in connection with 22 the overall state and national effort that they're doing. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 4-12-10 23 1 approval. Question or discussion on the motion? All in 2 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 5 (No response.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Okay, we'll 7 go to Item 12; consider, discuss, take appropriate action 8 regarding the use of the indoor arena by the 4-H Horse Club 9 or members thereof. I put this on the agenda as a result of 10 some confusion and problems that have resulted about the use 11 of the indoor arena by members of the 4-H, either 12 collectively or -- or individually, and we -- we have tried 13 to set up a system whereby the 4-H people would make the 14 request to use that arena, number one, with the priority that 15 if -- if those folks want to use an arena to do some riding, 16 the horse folk, that they use the outdoor arena, 'cause 17 that's there for their purpose and solely under their 18 control. With respect to the indoor arena, we tried to set 19 up a procedure whereby those requests needed to be made 20 through the Extension Office or the 4-H Coordinator so that 21 everybody's on the same page, and -- but there's been some 22 difficulty with that. There's been an effort to reserve the 23 arena, quote, in lieu of -- or in case of inclement weather; 24 just been various difficulties we've had with some of the -- 25 primarily the adult leaders of the 4-H horse group outfit. 4-12-10 24 1 So, I -- I told Jody and Mr. Bollier that I would put this on 2 the agenda so that the Court could weigh in on it and come up 3 with some solutions, hopefully, that are definitive and -- 4 and that we can enforce. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask you a question. 6 You said -- you said that the -- you said something was under 7 the direction of the 4-H, and -- 8 JUDGE TINLEY: The outdoor arena. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The outdoor arena. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But not -- but not the 12 indoor arena. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: No, sir. The indoor arena is part 14 of our -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Does the outdoor arena -- 16 does Jody have -- is she involved in that function in any 17 way? 18 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think so. 19 MS. GRINSTEAD: No. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not the outdoor. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So -- so -- but I thought we 22 had some kind of written policy about the indoor arena, about 23 use of it. This just rings a bell to me, that we've been 24 through this before. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: I think we attempted to establish a 4-12-10 25 1 policy, but the -- the take I'm getting is that there are 2 some of the folks involved in the 4-H horse group that don't 3 particularly like that, and they would prefer to use the 4 indoor arena even when the outdoor arena is available to them 5 and it's not inclement weather. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is this for events or for 7 practice, Judge? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Practice, primarily. Practice. 9 Practice totally. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Small groups or individuals. And -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And then how does a small 12 group or an individual get into the building to use the 13 indoor arena? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, they would have to go through 15 the -- the 4-H or Extension people in -- in making that 16 arrangement. That's one of the things that we were trying to 17 insist upon, that -- that if there was going to be any use of 18 the indoor arena by the horse people, that it either be a 19 booked event, such as they do at the beginning of every year 20 for their regularly scheduled events, or if it's going to be 21 an event in the indoor arena or use of the indoor arena, that 22 it come through the Extension Office or -- or 4-H 23 Coordinator. And that, of course, would give them access. 24 One of the problems that -- that Tim's had is that normally 25 they want to use it after normal business hours. Well, Tim 4-12-10 26 1 says that puts him in a position of having to have someone 2 there. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: And that messes up his work schedule 5 with his guys, sometimes creates some overtime, and -- but it 6 continues to be a problem, and I think a reaffirmation by the 7 Court of those policies would -- would be beneficial in -- in 8 Tim's work out there, as well as Jody's in scheduling the use 9 of it. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think one solution is that we 11 remove the Extension Office as having the ability to let 12 people use the indoor arena, and move it -- 13 JUDGE TINLEY: No, no, no. 14 MR. BOLLIER: They shouldn't have anything. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: No, the request to use the indoor 16 arena should not come directly from any of the 4-H adult 17 leaders or horse people. The request to use should come to 18 Jody, as the scheduler for that, -- 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: -- through and only through the 21 Extension Office or 4-H. That's what we've been trying to 22 do. That's been a difficulty. You know, and apparently 23 there's been some difficulty with the 4-H and Extension 24 people authorizing the use without it being cleared through 25 Jody. That's been another problem. 4-12-10 27 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That -- so, that second problem 2 is an Extension problem? I mean, if I hear you right, that 3 it's -- I mean, the Extension problem is easier to solve, in 4 my mind, than the -- the people that's using it. I mean, 5 'cause I think the Extension people are employees. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think that's why we had it 8 going through them. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, and I think it needs to. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And I think that they've just 11 kind of gotten a little too lax, saying, "Well, you know, 12 it's okay; y'all just go on over there and use it." Well, 13 you know, that gives -- you know, it gives access to 14 something that we have no -- no idea that there is anybody 15 out there. It's a liability. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mm-hmm. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Could be a big liability. 18 And somebody needs to be there to lock up and make sure the 19 place is secure whenever the event or the practice or 20 whatever is over. And I just -- you know, I think that what 21 I was told, they booked it formally three times last year for 22 events; is that right? 23 MS. GRINSTEAD: Something like that, yeah. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And so we need to kind of 25 have some limit on how many times they can actually book it. 4-12-10 28 1 It needs to be an event. You know, a practice session can be 2 put off. It doesn't have to be done on a Friday at 3 7 o'clock. You know, it could be done Saturday morning 4 sometimes, or they could do it different and use the outdoor 5 arena. If they have bad weather one night or something. But 6 they also need to let us know whenever they want to use the 7 outdoor, because they complain, well, the outdoor arena 8 hasn't been plowed. Well, Tim's more than glad to plow it, 9 get it ready for them, if he knows in advance that it needs 10 to be done. So, there's going to have to be some better 11 communication, you know, between the 4-H Horse Club and -- in 12 my opinion, and the Extension Office before they ever even 13 get as far as trying to book something through Jody. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But for practice sessions, 15 they don't even try to book it; they just do it. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, they just evidently have 17 at times just gone out there and done it. And we've tried to 18 secure that facility because of liability purposes. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Tim? 20 MR. BOLLIER: Well, I have a small solution. I 21 don't -- I don't know if this will work, but, you know, the 22 4-H rodeo, they have -- they used to have four rodeos a year. 23 And my solution to that is, they always want to -- to have 24 the indoor arena as a backup. Always. Well, my solution to 25 that is to not even let them have -- have the indoor arena as 4-12-10 29 1 a backup. But they schedule four rodeos, and into their 2 rodeo year, let's schedule two rodeo make-up days, instead of 3 us letting them have the indoor arena too. Because, I mean, 4 if they go to the indoor arena, then you have to have 5 somebody there, or -- do you understand what I'm saying? And 6 it would be easier for them to use -- to book it for their 7 four rodeos, and at the end of their rodeo season have -- 8 have two rain-out dates booked in there somewhere, because 9 that's 50 percent of what they have for rodeos. You see what 10 I'm saying? And I think that would be -- that would solve 11 that problem. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, if they have booked 13 rodeos inside, there shouldn't be any rain-out days. 14 MR. BOLLIER: They don't have them -- they don't 15 have them booked inside. They have them booked for the 16 outdoor arena, but they have the indoor arena -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Reserved. 18 MR. BOLLIER: -- tentatively booked. That leaves 19 us to where we can't book the indoor arena for something 20 else. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. Well, we have -- 22 JUDGE TINLEY: That puts them in a position of 23 having to have that indoor arena -- if it looks like it's 24 going to be bad weather, to scramble to set it up. 25 MR. BOLLIER: And if you'll go out there, I don't 4-12-10 30 1 think they used the outdoor arena one time last year. I 2 think they used the indoor arena regardless of what the 3 weather was like, 'cause I don't remember if it was raining 4 or what, but I know they didn't have -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Didn't have much rain last 6 year. 7 MR. BOLLIER: That's true; we did not. But I don't 8 remember them using the outdoor arena at all, Judge. At all. 9 I believe they used our indoor arena all four -- for all four 10 rodeos. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, that may go to the issue of 12 whether or not we even want to do a new outdoor arena. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Exactly. 14 MR. BOLLIER: I mean, we've got to force them to 15 use the outdoor arena. If we don't, I mean, what -- what 16 good are we doing when we build them a new -- new outdoor 17 arena if they're not going to use it? I mean, because you -- 18 I get phone calls -- Jody will tell you we get phone calls, 19 and they have the outdoor arena, and it's a beautiful day, 20 but they want the indoor arena. I mean, I don't get it. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Have there ever been 22 occasions when they did a practice that you didn't know about 23 that came just in advance of a setup for something else? 24 MR. BOLLIER: Not that I know of. I mean, any time 25 they ever showed up out there, I've known they're coming. 4-12-10 31 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I think we need to 2 know -- if there's going to be any practices at all out 3 there, it needs to be during regular business hours. It has 4 to go through Jody in advance so Tim can know about it. If 5 that's what we want to do. I mean, that's one option, is to 6 practice only during business hours. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't know why we need to use 8 it for practice in the indoor arena, ever. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I really don't either, 10 honestly, unless it's in winter. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I can see a -- using -- 12 reserving it as a backup if the weather's truly bad, because, 13 I mean, it is a -- you know, it is an issue to families and 14 parents to have a rodeo scheduled, and then have to cancel 15 it, then reschedule it. 'Cause, I mean, everyone's times are 16 pretty much booked up, and a lot of these parents are 17 involved in lots of activities, and that's good, so I don't 18 mind them having it as a backup. But it needs to be a true 19 backup. It doesn't mean that they -- they need to use the 20 outdoor arena, but I just don't see any situation where they 21 need to use the indoor arena for practice. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Maybe -- maybe we ought to 23 just make it that way. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I agree 100 percent. 25 I think that's kind of been -- that's the way I've always 4-12-10 32 1 kind of understood it, myself. I think the issue is -- is 2 getting the Extension Service and the 4-H people to 3 understand what we're saying. And if they can't understand 4 that, then we need to remove them, and they just come 5 straight to Jody, and that's it. I mean, I don't know why we 6 want to play patty-cake about this thing. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I think -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Either you do it or you 9 don't. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think that's the solution. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 12 MR. BOLLIER: Well, it makes it kind of hard to 13 keep that -- that indoor arena, you know, with enough 14 moisture in it when you let them come in and practice, okay? 15 Because, you know, they always roll up the doors, and it 16 dries it out. And it keeps it -- it makes it pretty hard to 17 keep it moist in there. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there a way that you can -- 19 like, when you close it at the end of the day, that we can 20 shut off all power so it can't be -- people can't go in and 21 do anything? I mean, if we -- if you lock it up, they can't 22 get in there, correct? 23 MR. BOLLIER: We don't want to go there, Jonathan. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, we do. 25 MR. BOLLIER: You really don't want to go there, 4-12-10 33 1 because I'm going to tell you right now, they all have keys. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They don't have keys to the 3 new locks, though. 4 MR. BOLLIER: I mean, I can change the locks. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What about the power? Can we 6 put the power on a lockbox? 7 MR. BOLLIER: I can shut the power off, but it's -- 8 I think that I can lock that by putting -- you know where the 9 main switch is, and I believe I can put a lock there. But -- 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think that's the way -- I 11 just think that I would really rather that power to be locked 12 off when it's not open for county functions, and that solves 13 the problem. And they'll learn to not go in there, 'cause 14 it's going to be dark. (Laughter.) 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's one way. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Whereupon our liability may get 17 worse. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, right. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd also, you know, put some 20 signage up that, you know, this facility is only open for 21 scheduled events. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the other issue -- I 23 mean, we have an agenda item here to deal with the rodeo 24 arena that these two guys have worked hard on, and I'd like 25 to know, if they're not planning on using this thing, we need 4-12-10 34 1 to rethink this. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sure do. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm -- that's kind of where I am. 4 You know, if they got events, why, they can hold those in the 5 indoor arena. They schedule their events at the beginning of 6 the year, just like they do now, and if they're not -- if 7 they're just doing what they can on a whim, whenever, I -- I 8 can't see what compels somebody to have to use an arena just 9 to do some practice riding, working with an animal. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Much rather be outdoors. I 11 mean -- 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If it's wet and slick, don't 13 go. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. We don't have that many 15 rain days. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do we need any formal action? 18 Or -- 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I -- at this point, I think 20 that we let Tim and Jody work up -- even though they may -- 21 we'll research to see exactly what we've got in place, and to 22 the degree it needs to be amended, have them work up some 23 definitive policy out there and bring it back so that we can 24 get the Court to nail it down. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir, I agree. 4-12-10 35 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Does that work? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Sounds good to me. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Boy, that was a tough one. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to our 9:30 timed item; 7 it's a bit past that now. At this time, I will recess the 8 Commissioners Court meeting, and I will convene a public 9 hearing for adding a stop sign at Roundabout Lane and Sandy 10 Lane located in Precinct 2. 11 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 9:43 a.m., and a public hearing was held in open 12 court, as follows:) 13 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Is there any member of the public or 15 the audience that wishes to be heard with respect to the 16 addition of a stop sign at Roundabout Lane and Sandy Lane 17 located in Precinct 2? 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Seeing no one coming forward, I will 20 close the public hearing with respect to the adding of a stop 21 sign at Roundabout Lane and Sandy Lane, located in Precinct 22 2, and I will reconvene the Commissioners Court meeting. 23 (The public hearing was concluded at 9:44 a.m., and the regular Commissioners Court meeting was 24 reopened.) 25 - - - - - - - - - - 4-12-10 36 1 JUDGE TINLEY: And I will go to Item 6 on the 2 agenda; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 3 approve installing a stop sign at Roundabout Lane and Sandy 4 Lane in Precinct 2. Mr. Odom? 5 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. Ms. West lives at 132 Sandy 6 Lane, which is adjacent to Roundabout. It's perpendicular to 7 that piece of property, and they have been having people run 8 into their fence. When this little subdivision was put 9 together, there was no stop sign ever put there, which has 10 been years before I got here. And basically, that request 11 is, what can we do? We believe that if we set a stop sign 12 there, that will help notify people. Apparently, it's coming 13 up on them too quick. So, at this time, we ask the Court for 14 their approval to install one stop sign at Roundabout Lane 15 and Sandy Lane. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This solution comes about 17 as a result of discussions that I've had with Ms. West, and 18 Leonard's had with the people out there. There have been a 19 lot of folks who just crash through this intersection and 20 plow up their fence, and they first wanted a guardrail placed 21 in front of their fence. It's kind of a "T" intersection 22 there. Leonard, it's kind of a "T" intersection? 23 MR. ODOM: It's a "T" intersection. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And so this is a solution 25 that we came up with, because we don't wish to be putting up 4-12-10 37 1 guardrails for the express purpose of protecting somebody's 2 fence. This is a better solution. 3 MR. ODOM: Right. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, I would move adoption, 5 approval of the installation of a stop sign. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 8 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion on that 9 motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 10 right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's go to 15 Item 14, if we might. Consider, discuss, take appropriate 16 action to sign updated HRA agreements with DataPath, Inc. for 17 2010. Ms. Hyde? I don't see her here. Let's defer on that 18 one and come back to it, if we might. Let's go to Item 15; 19 to consider, discuss, take appropriate action to authorize 20 Kerr County Auditor to conduct an audit of the Kerr County 21 Attorney's office through March 31, 2010. Mr. Henneke? 22 MR. HENNEKE: Thank you, Judge, Commissioners. In 23 an attempt to do my due diligence and to be fiscally 24 responsible with the office, I'm asking the Court to 25 authorize the Kerr County Auditor to conduct an audit of my 4-12-10 38 1 office through March 31st of 2010. I don't expect that 2 there's anything going to be found. I think that office has 3 been very well run, but in trying to do my best to serve the 4 taxpayers and the county, I just think it's a good practice 5 to start with a new register when you change out the shifts. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 10 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is a good practice. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Very good. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Very good. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion, signify 15 by raising your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 20 Item 16; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 21 allocate funding from 2007 or 2010 capital funds, approve air 22 duct cleaning of the courthouse and the jail. Mr. Bollier? 23 MR. BOLLIER: Last Commissioners Court, y'all asked 24 me to divide these out between the courthouse and the jail, 25 which I have done. Airtech's part at the courthouse -- and 4-12-10 39 1 Airtech's part would include cleaning the indoor coils, 2 blower wheels, and oil motor if needed on all 3 air-conditioners here and at the -- at the jail. At the 4 courthouse, there was going to -- the amount is 2,500, and at 5 the jail was 1,500. Now, to clean the duct work, which would 6 be Steamatic, the courthouse, they want $17,710 to clean all 7 the duct work here, and at the jail, 7,590, which the total 8 would be 23,5. And then the other bid that I -- that I had 9 received from Cornbread and Sons -- 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Cornbread? 11 MR. BOLLIER: Cornbread. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Cornbread, yes. 13 MR. BOLLIER: Cornbread and Sons. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: He lives in Elm Pass II. 15 MR. BOLLIER: I have two bids here. One's 16 concerning the jail, and one the courthouse. And -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Want to borrow my glasses? 18 MR. BOLLIER: I might have to, sir. This here is 19 the jail. The total was $21,792 just for the jail. Just for 20 the jail. And this one over here was for the courthouse, and 21 I believe they got all three floors as a separate bid. He 22 went the second floor, this floor, and the lower level, which 23 it all came out to -- one floor was 1,990; one floor was 24 5,005. One floor was 3,155. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is this Cornbread's bid? 4-12-10 40 1 MR. BOLLIER: That's Mr. Cornbread's bid. The 2 total bid came out to, like, 32 -- $32,000. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: As opposed to a total of 4 the other? 5 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What was the other one? 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 23. 8 MR. BOLLIER: 23,5 plus -- plus 4. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 27. 10 MR. BOLLIER: 27,5. And this one was -- come out 11 to 32. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The first bid was for cleaning 13 the air handlers and not the duct work? 14 MR. BOLLIER: No, the first bid was everything. 15 The duct work, but they also included cleaning the coils, the 16 inside of the air-conditioners, and checking all those -- 17 those air-conditioners out for us. Even though they are 18 brand-new at the jail. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But the first number you gave 20 us was, like, 2,500 and 1,500. Is that part of the -- is 21 that in addition to the 23,000 on this first bid? 22 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. The first bid is for Steamatic 23 to come in and clean the ducts. This is just the duct work, 24 okay? Is 23,5. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Right. 4-12-10 41 1 MR. BOLLIER: And then Airtech would come in and 2 clean our indoor coils, blower wheels if needed, and oil 3 motors as needed, for 4,000. So, you got to add the 4,000 to 4 the 23,5. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Wouldn't we have -- I mean, 6 aren't we already under a maintenance on the -- with 7 Compton's or whoever on the -- all the equipment? So, they 8 should be oiled and taken care of, all of the -- 9 MR. BOLLIER: Compton's is no longer -- we haven't 10 used -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Or whoever. I mean -- 12 MR. BOLLIER: It's Airtech. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Airtech doesn't -- aren't they 14 already doing that? 15 MR. BOLLIER: No. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think your warranty service 17 includes ordinary maintenance, routine maintenance. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought we had -- don't we 19 have somebody -- maybe that was in the past. Service 20 contract? We don't have a service contract on 21 air-conditioners any more? 22 (Mr. Bollier shook his head negatively.) 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can't you oil them? 24 MR. BOLLIER: We can do that. I mean, we 25 basically -- when we go up and there and change filters every 4-12-10 42 1 30 to 45 days, we basically go through them anyway and check 2 all the belts and check the wheels and bearings and check 3 what we can. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. I mean, I don't -- I 5 don't see -- 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That has much -- 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't see a need for that, 8 for $4,000. And on the duct work, explain to me why this is 9 an important thing for us to do. 10 MR. BOLLIER: To make sure that we get out the mold 11 that may be up in there. It's like over here in Judge 12 Brown's office, we cleaned his ducts -- we had Steamatic come 13 and clean his ducts because he was having a serious problem 14 over there with his -- with going hoarse and stuff. After we 15 cleaned those ducts out, he -- Judge Brown hasn't had a 16 problem. And then over in the Clerk's office -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, it's a -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Health. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- health issue? 20 MR. BOLLIER: It's a health issue. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I just want it on the record as 22 to why we're spending $25,000. 23 MR. BOLLIER: Health issue. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Where's the money going to 25 come from? 4-12-10 43 1 MR. BOLLIER: Ms. Hargis, they're talking to you 2 now, ma'am. 3 MS. HARGIS: I would propose that we take this from 4 some of the savings that the Sheriff's Office sent back on 5 the 2010 bond issue. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How can this be considered a 7 capital improvement? Isn't this a maintenance issue? 8 MS. HARGIS: It is. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't think it comes out of 10 capital. I can't see that. And if we -- you know -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did the Auditor say capital 12 improvement? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, the bond issue, to me, is 14 capital -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, I see. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And, to me, this needs to come 17 out of -- in the maintenance line item. That's a little bit 18 stretching it, in my mind. 19 MS. HARGIS: We can take it out of maintenance line 20 for now. We can take it out of the maintenance line item 21 right now that he has for the general, you know, maintenance 22 of the buildings. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Major repairs, or -- don't we 24 have that -- I mean, I would rather take it out of one of 25 those line items. And if we have something extraordinary 4-12-10 44 1 that comes up, it would likely be a capital item, and use 2 that money for that. I just think this is not a capital 3 item. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I agree. I can't construe 5 this as a capital item. 6 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: It's a major repair item, 8 but it's not a capital item. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. So, I'll move approval 10 to accept the -- what's your recommendation, first? 11 MR. BOLLIER: I recommend that we get the air ducts 12 cleaned, and I recommend we use Steamatic. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I accept your recommendation, 14 and that we authorize you to continue negotiating, or get a 15 contract from Air Tech, authorize the County Attorney -- 16 County Judge to sign same after review by the County 17 Attorney, and for the funds to come from maintenance line 18 items within your department. 19 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 22 indicated. Further question or discussion? All in favor of 23 the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 4-12-10 45 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go 3 back to Item 14, if we might; consider, discuss, take 4 appropriate action to sign updated HRA agreements with 5 DataPath, Inc. for 2010. Ms. Hyde? 6 MS. HYDE: Good morning, gentlemen. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Morning. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Good afternoon. 9 MS. HYDE: This is our HRA agreement with DataPath. 10 They also are under the name IDPAS, IDPas or something like 11 that. And all I need is approval for the Judge to sign this 12 agreement going for 2010. The County Attorney has gone over 13 it. There were two items that he wanted added. One was a 14 signature block for DataPath, and the other one was some 15 language in the second paragraph on the first page, which it 16 is attached, which both parties hereby affirm, and those have 17 been added. This is just -- there's been no change except 18 for the $3,000 max carryover for all the employees, and we 19 just needed to get it in the agreement to make sure that the 20 agreement was up-to-date. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're saying that what you 22 want us to do today is authorize the Judge to sign it? Is 23 that -- 24 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, we've already approved 4-12-10 46 1 all -- 2 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We already have this in 4 effect; this is a renewal agreement. 5 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 9 approval of the agenda item. Further question or discussion 10 on the item -- on the motion? All in favor of the motion, 11 signify by raising your right hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. 16 MS. HYDE: Judge, I need two copies with your 17 signature, please, sir. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to Item 17; 19 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to authorize 20 County Auditor and the Sheriff to work on developing policies 21 for disposition of assets, collection of data for grants, 22 grant procedure policy, internal control policy, and 23 financial policy, to be general policies that the Court will 24 approve, and with the suggestion that elected officials use 25 these policies when applying for grants. The recommendations 4-12-10 47 1 have been made by the governor's office after the on-site 2 visit. Which was last week? 3 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Last week. Ms. Hargis? 5 MS. HARGIS: It has again been suggested by the 6 Governor's office that we don't have necessarily any policies 7 in place. For instance, this morning you approved declaring 8 something surplus, but we don't -- other than the Local 9 Government Code, we don't really have procedures written down 10 as to what we'll do on the disposition of an item. And they 11 want to see general policies in place for this, especially 12 for items -- like, we're getting equipment from this R money, 13 this stimulus money, that shows what our -- in the future, 14 because they will track these vehicles in the future, that we 15 have some sort of written policy as to how we will dispose of 16 these items. So, along with -- they want financial policies 17 in place, internal control policies in place and things of 18 this nature. And they're going to be general policies. 19 We'll start with the disposition. They recommend we make 20 them simple, which is what we're going to try to do. For 21 instance, the disposition policy could be two or three pages 22 long; it just basically follows the Local Government Code and 23 then just says, you know, you'll come to the Court, for 24 instance, as you did today, you'll declare your property 25 surplus funds, and then we'll have a policy as to what they 4-12-10 48 1 can do with -- how they proceed once they sell the item, 2 where that money goes, so forth and so on. 3 We just don't have anything written down. We -- we 4 sort of do what we -- we've done for years, but we just don't 5 have anything written. The Sheriff had some policies in 6 place in his office as to what -- how they dispose of certain 7 items like the seized vehicles and so forth, but they didn't 8 want that. They wanted a general county policy, and they 9 want these for all of these different functions, because this 10 is what the federal government is asking when we get this 11 type of money. So, these are the recommendations that we put 12 in place, and they will be coming down in the letter that -- 13 that they did for on-site visit. They found no problems, and 14 -- and they didn't cite us for anything. They were very 15 nice. They were here for about two and a half days, and we 16 kind of toted them around and showed them different things. 17 Unfortunately, the grant that they decided to audit, we 18 didn't have the vehicles yet, so we didn't have very much for 19 them to see. But these are just general things that they 20 requested that we have. And, again, these are federal 21 government requirements. And the reason for the on-site 22 visits is not necessarily to write us up on anything 23 necessarily wrong, but to help us get to the end so that if 24 we do get audited by the federal government, we're in 25 compliance. 4-12-10 49 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Ms. Hargis? 2 MS. HARGIS: Yes? 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You said they requested 4 these things. Did they request it in writing? Do we have a 5 letter? 6 MS. HARGIS: There will -- yes, there will be a 7 written -- there will be a written document. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. And I've always 9 thought, like, you know, when we -- when we declare something 10 surplus and put on it the block, we're complying with state 11 law. Do we need to go further than the state law? 12 MS. HARGIS: Yes. We don't have anything in 13 writing. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: State law is in writing. 15 MS. HARGIS: Well, the state law says what 16 generally, but it doesn't say they have to come to 17 Commissioners Court even, if you read the state law. 'Cause 18 I actually typed it up the other night, just to get it... It 19 says that -- it's called disposition of salvage and surplus 20 property, and -- and we don't have any direction other than 21 general government law that you can declare it salvage, but 22 it doesn't necessarily say, you know, what procedures you -- 23 you do, how you -- if you have to sell it through Gov.deals. 24 I mean, that's a new thing that we have. Do you have an 25 auction? It's very general, the government. So, what they 4-12-10 50 1 want is to put that down in writing, and -- and it's just a 2 general policy. And it's good to have that kind of -- it's 3 kind of like the bidding process. You know, we kind of ran 4 into some little problems along the way as to how we're 5 writing the bids for the newspaper. Are we writing them 6 correctly? Are we putting the proper things in them? And it 7 got to the point where Rex and I, before we let anybody put 8 anything in the newspaper, we ran it through Rex to make sure 9 that it didn't have the wrong term in there, because we had 10 to call back some of those. So -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I hope do you the same thing 12 with the County Attorney now. 13 MS. HARGIS: We will. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Ms. Hargis, I notice in the 15 language of your agenda item that you're going to work with 16 the Sheriff, "the Auditor and the Sheriff to work on 17 developing policies..." Is that going to be exclusively just 18 the Sheriff? Because there are other major users -- 19 MS. HARGIS: No. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: -- such as Road and Bridge, 21 for example. Are we going to seek input from everybody? 22 MS. HARGIS: We'll seek input from everybody. The 23 reason I put Sheriff down there is he has his special stuff, 24 so I have to have his special stuff integrated into the 25 general. And the reason I mention the seized, there's 4-12-10 51 1 different -- for the different types of property he gets in 2 law enforcement, they have certain regulations they have to 3 follow. We don't necessarily have to follow those, because 4 we don't get those kind of items in the general county 5 facilities. So, yes, once it's written, I would like -- you 6 know, for instance, I worked on the disposition one. I got 7 down to doing the law itself and kind of outlining it. Now I 8 need the rules section, which, you know, I'm just going to 9 put the rules kind of like we've been following. I'll send 10 that out, let everybody review it, and -- and then we'll 11 bring that collaborative effort back. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And in a draft form, or 13 finalized form? 14 MS. HARGIS: In a draft form. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner, I -- I get the 17 impression that this thing is being driven by federal 18 bureaucrats. You know, even though we're following the law 19 very closely in disposing of property and how we inventory it 20 and track it and so forth, they want some written document 21 that actually sets that out. And this is particularly geared 22 towards grant funds that are utilized to purchase this stuff, 23 and then we track that property. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Sounds like more bureaucracy 25 to me. 4-12-10 52 1 JUDGE TINLEY: It is. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If you're following the 3 rules, you're following the rules. I mean, and you do not 4 declare it salvage; you just declare it surplus. That's 5 disposed of in the proper way. 6 MS. HARGIS: We discussed that with them, but they 7 were not happy with that, sorry. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Before you know it, we'll 9 have a personal policeman. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Maybe sooner than you 11 think. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 13 MS. HARGIS: So, do I get a collaborative effort to 14 start on these, and first one being the disposition? 'Cause 15 that's the one they asked for first. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move that the County 17 Auditor and the Sheriff and others be appointed to work on 18 developing policies for the disposition of assets, et cetera, 19 et cetera, et cetera. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: As per the agenda item? 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 25 indicated. Question or discussion on that motion? All in 4-12-10 53 1 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 2 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 4 (No response.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. I have been 6 handed a -- a notification that was made in conjunction with 7 a scheduled public hearing regarding maintenance of Cummings 8 Lane. The notification stated that a public hearing would be 9 held by the Commissioners Court on April the 12th, 2010, at 10 10 a.m. with respect to that matter. Unfortunately, for some 11 reason that is as yet unknown to me -- but I'm responsible 12 for the agenda, so I suppose the responsibility lays here -- 13 this matter was not -- 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If it's you or I, yes, it 15 is. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. (Laughter.) I wasn't looking 17 at you to hand it off to you, Commissioner. For some reason, 18 it did not make it on the agenda. Now, that tells me that -- 19 and I'm looking for confirmation from the County Attorney -- 20 inasmuch as it's not on the agenda, I don't think we can go 21 forward on it today. 22 MR. HENNEKE: That's correct, Judge. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: And he's giving me an affirmation. 24 I apologize to those that are here, and I see Mr. Doyle at 25 the back of the room, and I suspect that's exactly why he's 4-12-10 54 1 here. There may be others, and I suspect that we will have 2 to reschedule the public hearing, and there will be new 3 notices sent out. Again, I apologize for the inconvenience 4 it may have caused you, but we're unable to go forward on it 5 today because it did not make it on the agenda, and I 6 apologize for that. I thank you for being here. You're 7 welcome to stay. Appreciate your interest in county 8 government, and you'll be renotified. Thank you very much. 9 AUDIENCE: Judge, can we get it posted pretty soon? 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Say again? 11 AUDIENCE: Do you think we can get it posted pretty 12 soon? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I suspect the -- the setting of the 14 public hearing will occur at the next meeting of the Court, 15 which will be the fourth Monday of this month, and we will 16 set a public hearing at that time. The public hearing will 17 be probably 30-plus days following that, okay? 18 AUDIENCE: Thank you, Judge Tinley. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, thank you. Okay, let's go to 20 Item 11, if we might. Consider, discuss, and take 21 appropriate action to approve plans for the Hill Country 22 Youth Exhibition Center rodeo arena, and to go out for bids. 23 Commissioners Letz and Oehler. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, we've been working with 25 Peter Lewis on the final -- final draft. And, lo and behold, 4-12-10 55 1 he walked through the door. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He's here. 3 MR. LEWIS: At 9:30, right? 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 9:30 when you got here? 5 MR. LEWIS: Well, no. No, sir. Well, 6 Commissioners, Judge, appreciate the opportunity to visit 7 with you about the rodeo arena. We have met over the last 8 several months regarding relocation of the -- I guess, 9 essentially, demolition of the existing rodeo arena and 10 relocating to the other side of the property, the east side 11 of the property that's consistent with the master plan that 12 Commissioners adopted last year. And I have been working 13 with Commissioners Oehler and Letz to develop a plan for the 14 arena, press box, and a future -- future bleachers, covered 15 bleachers. We have a bid document, the project manual that 16 has instructions to bidders and some minor specifications. I 17 think the -- when I met last with Commissioners, we talked 18 about some specific dates to receive and open bids, and then 19 we also wanted to discuss a pre-bid meeting. And if you 20 would turn to Page 1 of 1 in your -- do you all have copies 21 of the spec book as well? Turn to Page 1 of 1. We had 22 talked about a date of Monday, April 26th, to receive and 23 open bids. And that's -- I think that will be part of what 24 you'll be approving today, would be approving the release of 25 these drawings as -- as we've presented them in front of you, 4-12-10 56 1 as well as approving a bid date. This would be advertised 2 publicly. And I understand that Commissioners have also had 3 inquiries from some interested parties, so -- 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mm-hmm. 5 MR. LEWIS: It's a small project. We do not 6 require a bid bond, a performance bond, and the County will 7 be taking some of the scope of it upon themselves, 8 specifically the electrical and lighting piece for the press 9 box and any site lighting around the arena. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Peter, am I missing 11 something, or is it not in here about removing the old arena? 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Demolition. 13 MR. LEWIS: I don't have demolition. We can add 14 that. We had discussed that that was something you were 15 going to handle. I can -- we can add it as part of the 16 scope, if you'd like. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think what we had talked 18 about at one time, I think at one of our earlier meetings, is 19 to give that end as a -- part of the demolition would be they 20 get salvage of everything, all the materials, with the 21 exception of the bleachers, the aluminum bleachers. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Of the bleachers, some of the 23 seats. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The actual aluminum seating 25 where the current bleachers are. And hoping that the value 4-12-10 57 1 of that surplus would almost offset the cost of the 2 demolition, or at least come close. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think that ought be part of 4 it. There's -- there's quite a bit of salvage. Some 5 people -- you know, whoever builds this might be able to 6 reuse of some of what they take down. And also, it would 7 make this disappear. 8 MR. LEWIS: Well, I mean, our intent was that the 9 materials that would be used in the rodeo arena would be new. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Reused at another facility. 12 MR. LEWIS: So, we'd want to stipulate that in 13 this, that they would -- 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, they cannot reuse it. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Would it not be appropriate to make 17 it a -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Alternate? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: -- a three-prong bid? One is to bid 20 for demolition, or bid for construction of the new, or one 21 bid for demolition and construction on a net basis. 22 MR. LEWIS: Okay. So we've got demolition as, 23 say, -- 24 JUDGE TINLEY: As one. 25 MR. LEWIS: -- Option 1. 4-12-10 58 1 JUDGE TINLEY: One bid proposition. 2 MR. LEWIS: New construction. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: New construction would be number 4 two. 5 MR. LEWIS: Mm-hmm. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: And then a third bid for both of 7 those on a net basis. 8 MR. LEWIS: Yeah. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I like that. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, that's good. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That way we can pick and 12 choose. 13 MR. LEWIS: I should have thought of that. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If the bill for demolition's 15 very high, we can figure out a way to do it with community 16 service -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mm-hmm. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- or somebody. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is it the plan to replace 20 the bleachers immediately, or later? 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Later. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Later. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They're not part of this. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's a different type of 25 construction, trying to -- 4-12-10 59 1 MR. LEWIS: We provided a layout, just to give 2 Commissioners a sense of how many folks you could sit there, 3 in a footprint that the 4-H had. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, and we have those 5 movable bleachers right now that we can put out there until 6 we decide -- 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: As needed. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- what we're going to do, 9 rather than spend a bunch of money on that, too. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think he's -- Peter, correct 11 me if I'm wrong. He agreed to do this at no expense since 12 he's now going to add to his resumé. (Laughter.) 13 MR. LEWIS: Now that I do rodeo arenas, which 14 carries well in the Hill Country, in South Texas. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Volunteerism is alive and 16 well. 17 MR. LEWIS: I would suggest, then, that we -- give 18 me some time to change the documents, and so that date, the 19 26th, will not be the bid date. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: I think that's a good plan. 21 MR. LEWIS: That we jump it two weeks to your next 22 regular scheduled meeting, you would open them. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, it appears that there's still 24 some ongoing discussion about whether or not we even want to 25 build a new arena because of the use -- the use factor. 4-12-10 60 1 MR. LEWIS: Yes. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: So that -- that may still be 3 open-ended. And, of course -- 4 MR. LEWIS: How shall I proceed with the 5 invitation, then? Specific date? Go ahead and assign a 6 specific date? Or -- 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Say the 10th. May the 10th. 8 MR. LEWIS: May 10th. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would go ahead and do that. 10 I think we will certainly bid it. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, yeah, we'll bid it. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think that the wording of the 13 bids, we're going to have -- need to have maybe a -- a 14 meeting with the 4-H folks. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To make sure that -- 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Everybody understands the 18 program. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, understands where we're 20 going. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask you a question. 22 At one time, we talked about having a restroom out there near 23 this arena. When and how did that drop off? You don't think 24 that there's a need for that? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- 4-12-10 61 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, there is -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- there is a need, but it was 3 felt that it would -- we're trying to get this -- a lot of 4 basically arena-type folks to bid on this, I think, rather 5 than a general contractor, and the restrooms would be a 6 separate item. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, okay. So, we're going 8 do to a restroom out there? 9 MR. LEWIS: We also talk about maybe those being a 10 part of the horse barn attached to that. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Attached to the horse barn. 13 Maybe Maintenance can do -- 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There's space that we left 15 out that's not concreted -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Exactly. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- for that. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Exactly. I remember that. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There's also a pretty big 20 electrical component that will come down for lighting at some 21 point. We left all that off. We really were trying to get a 22 lot of the local folks that can build this type of -- 23 welders, basically, trying to keep general contractors from 24 driving the cost up. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You know how rodeo people 4-12-10 62 1 are; they use the restroom. Unbelievable. (Laughter.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: But we are happy to assist you in 3 broadening your resumé. 4 MR. LEWIS: Thank you. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: So you can get that additional 6 exposure to that -- that portion of the trade. 7 MR. LEWIS: I thank you very much. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can go ahead and approve 9 this. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can. I'll make a motion 12 that we approve the plans as presented. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And then put the dates in. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, modify the dates as 15 discussed, and put the demolition topics on the -- 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, as amended. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: On the proposal? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On the proposal. 19 MR. LEWIS: And then there is the small matter of 20 my proposal. I think the Judge has it in front of him. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't know that that -- 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Small matter of your 23 proposal? 24 MR. LEWIS: Yes, sir, if you needed to take action 25 on that day. 4-12-10 63 1 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm not sure we can do it under the 2 agenda item. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We'll do it next time. Trust 4 us. Just trust us. 5 MR. LEWIS: Very good. I do. I do. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: We have -- we have a motion and a 7 second. Is there any further question or discussion on the 8 motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 9 right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 12 (No response.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carried. Thank you, Mr. 14 Lewis. 15 MR. LEWIS: I'll have these back to you within the 16 week. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: We will attempt to find other 18 projects to broaden your resumé and experience. 19 MR. LEWIS: Thank you. I look forward to that. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Peter and his people have been 21 wonderful to work with on our project out at the Sheriff's 22 Annex, and that thing's going along smoothly. Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Speaking of restrooms. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Why don't we go ahead and take about 25 a 15-minute break. 4-12-10 64 1 (Recess taken from 10:17 a.m. to 10:33 a.m.) 2 - - - - - - - - - - - 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's come back to order, if 4 we might, from our mid-morning recess. We'll go to Item 13, 5 a 10:30 timed item, to consider, discuss, take appropriate 6 action on request from Kerrville Citizens Police Academy 7 Alumni Association, that being a 501(c) -- (c)(4) nonprofit, 8 to receive a discount on rental fees for the indoor arena at 9 the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center. Ms. Smith? 10 MS. SMITH: Yes. I was applying to see if we could 11 get that discount. We are a 501(c)(4) with the I.R.S. right 12 now, and we have the paperwork in to get that changed to a 13 501(c)(3). Our president of the association has been working 14 with the state association of Police Academy Alumni 15 Associations to make sure we have that paperwork done 16 correctly, and there are other citizen police -- police 17 alumni who have qualified for that and have it, and so I'm 18 here to see if we can get a discount. I understand that on 19 events like a rodeo, where someone else is sponsoring it, 20 that you prorate whatever discount that we might get 21 depending on how much the nonprofit actually receives from 22 the proceeds. And Lester Meier is the rodeo person who has 23 offered us this opportunity, at the last minute, so we are 24 seeing if it's a viable project for us. And this is a part 25 of our process of trying to get all of our ducks lined up. 4-12-10 65 1 JUDGE TINLEY: When -- when is the event scheduled 2 for, Ms. Smith? 3 MS. SMITH: The event is scheduled for April 30th 4 of this year and May 1st. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Three weeks. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Has -- has Lester Meier made 8 application? 9 MS. GRINSTEAD: It's already been reserved. He 10 reserved the dates a long time ago, but told me that a local 11 nonprofit or local group would be calling with all the 12 details. And I got the call from Brenda on -- Thursday? 13 Friday? 14 MS. SMITH: Yes. What I was doing when I called is 15 just -- you know, we were -- again, we were making sure 16 everything -- trying to get our bearings, in other words. 17 And so I was just making sure that, indeed, the arena was 18 reserved. And it was at that point I found out that -- that 19 he expected us to take care of that, so that's why I'm here. 20 And one thing that we need to -- our association needs to 21 find out is if, to qualify for any sort of waiver or 22 discount, does the nonprofit need to pay directly, or can 23 Lester Meier do that? 24 JUDGE TINLEY: I think it's our customary practice 25 that whoever the -- whoever's putting on the event is the 4-12-10 66 1 one. Now, the rate that that individual pays or that 2 organization may pay is going to depend upon, as you say -- 3 for example, if -- if your organization is going to benefit 4 50 percent of the proceeds, 50 percent of the rate would be 5 at the lower, more moderate, not-for-profit rate. The other 6 50 percent would be at the -- at the regular commercial rate. 7 MS. SMITH: So -- 8 JUDGE TINLEY: But we normally rely upon whoever's 9 actually doing the event; in this case, Lester Meier Rodeo 10 Company, to -- 11 MS. SMITH: Pay. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: -- to comply with the -- with the 13 rental provisions, the insurance provisions and so forth. 14 Have you reached an agreement with Lester Meier as to the -- 15 what portion of the proceeds that you're going -- that your 16 organization is going to benefit? 17 MS. SMITH: 25 percent I think is what we're 18 batting back and forth, but at this point, because we got the 19 opportunity so late in the game, our association is really 20 negotiating with him to change some of the -- some of the 21 terms. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think, Judge, it seems 23 that -- I mean, we can go ahead and add this association to 24 the nonprofit list, and if they can work out a deal, great. 25 If not, so be it. I'll make such a motion. 4-12-10 67 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'll second it. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that the 3 Kerrville Citizens Police Academy Alumni Association be 4 designated as a nonprofit user of the -- of the county Hill 5 Country Youth Exhibit facilities for purposes of 6 determination of rental rates. I assume that was the intent? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's the intent, yes, sir. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion on 9 that motion? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, sir? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Commissioner Letz, what does 13 "so be it" mean? In your comments just now. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If they can't -- they're on our 15 list, and from now for the next year as a nonprofit 16 organization, and they will be treated just like any other 17 nonprofit. If they can work out a deal with Lester Meier or 18 anybody else, they would receive the nonprofit status, and 19 they'll be treated no differently than any other nonprofit. 20 If they don't work out a deal with Lester Meier, then they 21 don't have to work out a deal with him, and he's, you know, 22 either going to lease the spot or not lease it. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So -- so, one pays full 24 price at that time? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. That has nothing to do 4-12-10 68 1 with Lester Meier. This is only to do with this association. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, 501(c)(4) is -- is the 3 same thing as (c)(3)? 4 MS. HARGIS: When they applied for the 501(c)(4), 5 since I happened to help them do this -- you probably don't 6 know that -- when I was at my prior career, the reason they 7 did this is because that's what they fall under. When you're 8 applying for a 501(c) status, as we told y'all, there's 9 several different determinations, and the determination of an 10 alumni fell under (4). It also eliminates a lot of paperwork 11 for the -- when you're doing the tax return itself, so it's 12 advantageous for some of these organizations not to be a 13 501(c)(3), just because of the cost of the paperwork 14 involved. But it's -- it is a nonprofit. It does fall under 15 the 501(c)(3), you know, guidelines that we had. It's just 16 that they had to go under that particular designation at the 17 time. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, thank you. I have no 19 problem with it at all. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or discussion on 21 the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 22 your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 4-12-10 69 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Ms. Smith. 2 MS. SMITH: Thank you. Do we need to do this every 3 year, to get on the list? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think you're on the list. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: No, I think once you're there, you 6 stay there. Unless you -- 7 MS. SMITH: Unless things change? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: -- do something that comes to our 9 attention that maybe we ought to take you off. 10 MS. SMITH: Thank you. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: You bet. Let's go to Item 18; 12 consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to approve new 13 telephone system service for the county courthouse. 14 Mr. Trolinger? 15 MR. TROLINGER: Thank you, Judge. A couple of 16 things to start with besides the material that I've handed 17 out to you. The County Attorney has reviewed all the 18 contracts and has some input; he may want to speak on this 19 issue. And we have representatives from both Windstream and 20 Time-Warner here. If you have any questions, I'm sure they'd 21 be glad to answer anything. And there's one change in the 22 handout. The -- the cost from Time-Warner, they have a 23 promotional that came out on Friday, and the change is from 24 505 to 475 on the -- on the line item for the PRI. Thank 25 you. 4-12-10 70 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, if we postpone this, I can 2 anticipate that Windstream will come back with a lower number 3 too, and maybe drop the cost as well? 4 MR. DYE: I can't comment on that, but I can 5 certainly guarantee you an answer to that. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And the reason I say that 7 somewhat in jest, but at the same time, every time we come, 8 the numbers have changed. And, you know, that concerns me a 9 little bit. But, anyway -- 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's concerning whenever it 11 changes after the -- we want it in writing. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, these were never 14 sealed bids. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I understand they're not sealed 16 bids, but it's interesting. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: John, my question -- one of 18 my questions is, you know, I tried -- I tried to read this, 19 and I didn't do real well with it. But when did you receive 20 these agreements? Because let me -- one of the things I see 21 in here is some of this old stuff of 2007. 22 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Some of those agreements, 24 and I see them all back in here, but I don't really see 25 up-to-dates on the newer stuff. When -- like, did you 4-12-10 71 1 receive them all at one time, or this year? 2 MR. TROLINGER: Over a period of about three weeks 3 in February, I received the proposals. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 2010? 5 MR. TROLINGER: The reason I included the old 2007 6 contract in the court agenda item that was approved is 7 because that has the existing contract that we have with 8 Time-Warner Cable. Time-Warner Cable gave us a proposal for 9 the new service, but we're going to work under the existing 10 contract. And the County Attorney needed to review it, so 11 that's why I included that. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And everybody -- all three 13 of these companies were working off the same set of 14 information? 15 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. We had site visits from each 16 of the three, and I was able to provide the same information. 17 There were some questions and answers on-site, you know, in 18 person, but I tried to the best of my ability to handle it 19 through e-mail, so that, you know, if something came up that 20 was a little bit different, we'd be able to tell the others. 21 But, essentially, the service -- there are two components; 22 there's the service for the PRI, which is kind of like going 23 to a store and -- going to the Sprint store, for instance, 24 just to use a third provider, and saying, "I want, you know, 25 this type service." You're going to get a PRI from each of 4-12-10 72 1 the three. It's exactly the same thing. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Well, the reason I'm 3 asking this question is because one of the companies -- and 4 this is a small thing, I'm sure. One of the companies talked 5 about bringing their fiberoptic lines through the 6 County-owned conduits. 7 MR. TROLINGER: Okay. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The other two companies did 9 not talk about that. And, I mean, is that a part of your 10 bid? I mean, why would one -- or, basically, I'm glad one 11 did. Why did the other two not? How else were they going to 12 get their lines into the courthouse? 13 MR. TROLINGER: Well, all three providers came out 14 and marked the lines in back of the courthouse, and all three 15 providers were on site during this time period, and I was 16 able to speak with all three. And there was a concern about 17 the conduit that was being used by Time-Warner that the 18 existing Time-Warner line's in, and the ownership of that. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And have you established the 20 ownership? 21 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. I made it clear that -- that 22 that was Kerr County's property, that that conduit box that 23 was coming into the courthouse was Kerr County's. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It seemed -- one of the 25 companies seemed to understand that very clearly, Hill 4-12-10 73 1 Country Telephone. There wasn't any question about who owned 2 it. Now, one other question here, I see Time-Warner long 3 distance rate is 30 cents per minute; is that correct? 4 MR. TROLINGER: Three cents. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Three cents a minute. Oh. 6 Oh, I see where the point is, yes. Forgive me. Yes, I do 7 see that on the proposed solution now. That's clear. Good, 8 thank you. So, you're comfortable in thinking that all three 9 companies were on level ground and came in here and gave you 10 their bids, equal, and everybody's happy, and nobody had a 11 leg up and all those things? 12 MR. TROLINGER: Well the initial process, yes. 13 Once we came to Commissioners Court the first time, I felt it 14 -- there was some inequities that -- you know, once we -- 15 once the prices were divulged, they were able to see the 16 competition's price. But, of course, the County Attorney has 17 -- has come in on this, and maybe Mr. Henneke wants to speak 18 to it. He said basically on these confidentiality -- 19 confidentiality clauses that are in each one of the 20 proposals -- I don't want to speak for you. If you want to 21 fill in -- 22 MR. HENNEKE: Well, no, that's a different issue, 23 John. That's -- 24 MR. TROLINGER: Okay. 25 MR. HENNEKE: And part of the difficulty, and it 4-12-10 74 1 wasn't made clear to me, I saw that the Time-Warner -- 2 Time-Warner Cable was a proposal, but I wasn't made aware 3 that the proposal included adoption of the old contract. And 4 so I see that now in the back of the materials. But one of 5 my points to Mr. Trolinger was that Time-Warner Cable 6 proposal, that's not a contract, and I didn't have a contract 7 to review. It was unclear as far the as the terms they're 8 wanting to propose. Now, some of the agreements did speak to 9 post-exclusion confidentiality. I pointed out to 10 Mr. Trolinger that under the Texas Open Records Act, the 11 County cannot merely agree to make something confidential 12 because it wants to. There are specific exceptions within 13 the act to what pertains to confidential material. Part of 14 that, to my recollection, does include, you know, during the 15 bid process, but then after the fact, you know, that material 16 may become a public record. And so my -- my concern was some 17 of the boilerplate language in the contracts that were 18 proposed to me for execution that would seem to, after the 19 fact, impose a confidentiality where such confidentiality 20 doesn't exist under the Open Records Act. So, I'm not -- I 21 haven't been brought -- the bidding -- the original bidding 22 and all the bid process predates me. And I hear the concerns 23 of the Commissioners Court. As far as the actual contract 24 with Time-Warner Cable, I need a chance to look at that. I 25 saw the proposal, you know, but it wasn't the contract that I 4-12-10 75 1 thought that was being asked to be executed today. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let's talk about that for a 3 minute. I note in this packet that Mr. Trolinger presented 4 to the Court, there are a couple copies of the signature page 5 with the Judge's signature on it, representing something from 6 a contract for a sum of 334.37. Now, my question is, are we 7 talking about a new agreement for the services detailed that 8 you want brought in here or changed, or are we talking about 9 an addendum or an amendment to an existing agreement? What 10 are we talking about? 11 MR. TROLINGER: Okay, maybe I can get -- 12 MR. BROWN: This will be considered as a new 13 agreement, since it is a new line of service we're coming in 14 with. 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, there's really no 16 reason for to us see Judge Tinley' signature on the signature 17 page for an old agreement, 'cause it's irrelevant. 18 MR. BROWN: That was provided more as an example as 19 to the previous terms and conditions that we operated on, and 20 that would continue forward. But, again, that was just more 21 for informational purposes, though. 22 MR. TROLINGER: My primary concern to the Court was 23 that this is a -- each of the service providers are coming in 24 with five-year terms of service for the contract. And I 25 wanted to show that in 2007, and previously to that, 2005, we 4-12-10 76 1 had accepted the service for -- for data from Time-Warner as 2 a five-year contract, but with the stipulation from the 3 County Attorney that the County could not be obligated. 4 That's a paraphrase. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'd like to hear you 6 address the Court with respect to what this new service, from 7 whomever we get it, does to correct the existing problems 8 we're having with telecommunications. Somebody want to 9 address that for me? 10 MR. TROLINGER: Okay. Well, as of last week, the 11 echo problem is resolved. I found a work-around to that. 12 Still waiting for a permanent fix from the manufacturer of 13 the actual hardware that we purchased, but I found a 14 work-around to get rid of the echo, and as far as I know, the 15 echo is gone. 16 MS. HARGIS: Not in mine. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: How about the billing 18 issues, the breaking out the bill by extension? What about 19 all that? 20 MR. TROLINGER: Well, the issue of -- of 21 Windstream's billing, we probably won't know until the next 22 billing cycle, but I know that it was addressed. I saw 23 e-mails; I was copied on e-mails back and forth between 24 Windstream and the Auditor's office. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We won't know until the 4-12-10 77 1 next billing cycle? So, in other words, we're getting sort 2 of a pig in a poke here, right? 3 MR. TROLINGER: Well, I was told that the database 4 programmer has actually gone and fixed the problems that -- 5 when -- that the Auditor's office had complained of. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Windstream? 7 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. But until we actually receive 8 the bill, I won't know for a fact that it's repaired, or 9 worse. When you make a change, there's typically something 10 that needs to be worked out again. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: John, the -- Windstream's 13 proposal is using the existing copper cable, and Hill 14 Country's proposal and Time-Warner's are using a new 15 fiberoptic cable. 16 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, that is correct. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's the difference from the 18 standpoint of -- of functionality and user -- 19 MR. TROLINGER: As far as the users, they won't 20 know the difference. I don't think they'd be able to tell 21 the difference in the quality of service. It gives 22 flexibility from the infrastructure side. I think we have a 23 lot of capability there. The existing copper that's here now 24 will remain, and then we'll add on the fiber, and that'll 25 give us a redundant path. So, the technical issues on the 4-12-10 78 1 back end are what this -- what that really addresses, not 2 what the users would hear. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: What about future technology 4 improvements, additions and so forth vis-a-vis the copper 5 versus the fiberoptic? Any issues there? 6 MR. TROLINGER: Well, for the phone, it does -- I 7 think it makes it easier for us to add services. Ryan, do 8 you have anything on that? 9 MR. BROWN: Well, going on the fiber side, it's a 10 lot faster turn-up if you guys do need to expand services as 11 well, but also it kind of future-proofs you as far as if any 12 standards change in the future, like a lot of -- like SIP is 13 a common protocol that they're talking about being a new 14 format for doing voice across the entire nation. And so you 15 already have that infrastructure in place. Let's say another 16 5, 10, 15 years from now, you guys go through another phone 17 change. Really just be a small piece of the equipment swap, 18 instead of a big infrastructure overhaul time. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: So that's the only real advantage, 20 is changing down the road? 21 MR. BROWN: It does future-proof you on changing 22 down the road, but also, as I mentioned, if you do need to 23 deploy additional services, it's a lot shorter interval to, 24 like, fire up an additional PRI service. Let's say you guys 25 are at capacity for your current phone -- with the phone 4-12-10 79 1 trunk we bring in. We would -- by going in on a fiber, we 2 can fire up a second trunk or a third trunk or fourth trunk a 3 lot faster. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Now, having heard from -- 5 you're Time-Warner, right? 6 MR. BROWN: Yes, sir. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: We -- I think out of fairness, we 8 need Windstream to be able to address that issue. 9 MR. DYE: The County hasn't actually requested any 10 additional services that can't necessarily be brought in on 11 copper. Windstream also has never been asked to bring fiber 12 to the property for whatever technology they desired to 13 actually have. Let me make -- for example, if the County so 14 wished to have, let's say, a 50 megabit internet service 15 brought in, Windstream could certainly deliver that to you, 16 and more than likely we would deliver it to you on fiber. 17 MR. TROLINGER: Trey, I'm sorry, that -- maybe 18 you're -- I know you're in here as a substitute, but we did 19 request the -- the higher speed, the 20 mbs, and it's a 20 separate agenda item, but for data, we do have a -- a 20 mbs 21 on tap, and I do have a proposal for that from y'all, by the 22 way. 23 MR. DYE: Okay. 24 MR. TROLINGER: So we do have that proposal. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: What about the issue as to the -- 4-12-10 80 1 the convenience and speed at which the add-ons can be made? 2 MR. DYE: I am unaware of any capacity issues right 3 now that we have currently on copper. At this point, as far 4 as delivering services to the County, I'm certain that 5 Windstream can provide those just as quickly as any other 6 carrier in this town. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: John, let me -- let me make a 8 disclosure here, if I might. I'm sure the members of the 9 Court are aware, and probably a number in county government. 10 My son works for Hill Country Telephone. He's in their 11 office function in some manner. I'm not sure exactly what he 12 does, but I feel compelled to make that disclosure. A couple 13 other items. On the PRI, whether it be by copper or by -- by 14 fiberoptic, is that something that we need to transition to, 15 irrespective of what else we do? 16 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. This is -- regardless, 17 with the new telephone system, we want the new technology of 18 the PRI. The old phone system, we could not have a PRI, so 19 we were paying about twice as much with the old technology 20 per month. And with the new, it just makes sense, no-brainer 21 to go to it. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let me raise one more issue. 23 I'm a little troubled by the -- the eleventh-hour disclosure 24 of a -- I forget what you called it, but it was a special 25 rate that suddenly got run in here. 4-12-10 81 1 MR. TROLINGER: It's a promotional. Yes, sir, it 2 came out on Friday. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Promotional, yeah. Yeah. I'm -- I 4 think I have this same concern that I heard Jon expressing, 5 is it looks like we got a seesaw thing going on here, and 6 whoever happens to be at the closest eleventh hour to the 7 decision time seems to suddenly get their horse in first 8 place in the race, and I'm troubled by that. I think 9 everybody needs to be on the same page, and we need to look 10 at one shot, delivered at one time, and -- and thereafter, 11 once the lid comes off, none of this back and forth stuff. 12 Because I -- yeah, we might be in a position to better play 13 off one against the other, but I don't think the process ends 14 up being fair to all of the -- all of the possible vendors. 15 And I've got a real concern when, here at the eleventh hour, 16 one comes in on -- on the basis of some special promotional 17 rate that just came out. I don't know whether that's a 18 special promotional rate to everybody within their system, or 19 whether it happens to be just governmental or -- I don't care 20 what it is. Doesn't make any difference at this point. My 21 point is, it happened, and -- and I don't think -- I think 22 the perception is there's not fairness in the process. 23 That's my concern. And, you know, if everybody had to come 24 in -- say, "Okay, give me your last shot, and have it to me 25 by 5 o'clock on -- not later than 5 o'clock on such-and-such 4-12-10 82 1 date," and then everything's frozen, I think we're back to 2 fairness. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I couldn't agree with 4 you more, except that I think it's more than perception. I 5 think that's exactly what it is. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's unfair. And I am -- I 8 am disturbed by that as well, coupled with the County 9 Attorney indicated that maybe he hadn't completed his reading 10 of the contracts and all those kinds of things. I -- 11 MR. HENNEKE: Well, I don't have the contract 12 proposed by Time-Warner Cable for -- for this period. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Can't review what they 14 haven't given you, right? 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Do you have Windstreams's -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Kind of hard to do. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Do you have any of the 18 contracts? 19 MR. HENNEKE: I have contracts from Hill Country 20 and from Windstream. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What it shows, what I'm 22 seeing here, if we went by the numbers that were presented 23 before the eleventh-hour thing, it's pretty clear in my mind 24 which one is -- if all these were done at the same time, and 25 they all had a fair shot at it and this is what the result 4-12-10 83 1 was, then there's your answer. 2 MR. TROLINGER: Commissioner Oehler, it's not, 3 because Windstream has lowered their price post the first 4 agenda item. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Then you need to give them 6 another deadline. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, you weren't 8 finished? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I just wanted to 10 finish my thought here. I've been kind of saying this, that 11 what I would like to see -- I think the way to do this thing, 12 let's fire one more shot at it, and if these three companies 13 want to do business with Kerr County, that is fine. If they 14 don't, that's also fine. But what we can do is say to them, 15 "Give us your best shot; have it if here 8 o'clock Friday 16 morning," and then this group can reconvene the next morning 17 and knock this thing out. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'd like to add onto that, 19 too, what Commissioner Baldwin's saying, by making certain 20 that when you bring it back again -- and I know it's 21 frustrating that you're going to have to bring it back again, 22 but you are. 23 MR. TROLINGER: Well, the echo's fixed, so that's 24 the weight of the world off my shoulders. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If we keep asking you to 4-12-10 84 1 bring it back, maybe everything will get fixed by the time 2 you finally get here. 3 MR. TROLINGER: It's working out well. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The echo is not fixed. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: My point is, when you bring 6 it back, whenever that is, and for purposes of expediting 7 things, I hope you can get it back in time for the next 8 meeting of this month, I'd like to see -- or like to be able 9 to know that each of these bidders is providing the same 10 service(s). There's no disparity in terms of what they're 11 bidding on. You only list the PRI and the long distance 12 rate. If that's all it is, fine; then repeat that. If 13 that's not all it is, list the things that are going to be -- 14 we're going to be blessed with with this new contract. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I want to go one step further. 16 When I go back here, I mean, I -- I have your summary sheet, 17 and I look at the numbers on each one, and I have a real hard 18 time coming up with your summary sheet. Because I don't -- 19 you know, I don't understand this stuff to start with. But 20 if I look at Windstreams's, there's -- it says ISDN-PRI 21 service, including one 50 DID block, and total charge is 22 $490. And I got to that because you said 490 on your sheet. 23 I go to Hill Country's, I get -- it says Kerrville -- I find 24 your number on the line that says Kerrville exchange per 25 circuit, per month, and above it is all kinds of bandwidth 4-12-10 85 1 stuff, which evidently was irrelevant, and it was 558. Then 2 I go to Time-Warner's, and I have one; I go to to find your 3 number, I go to voice services, one PRI, 20 times 20, which I 4 presume is bandwidth. So, I would like to see you say what 5 we want, and then put the numbers in so they all are bidding 6 on the exact same form, so I can see it. 'Cause I don't -- I 7 don't see -- I mean, I -- and I trust you, but I -- I would 8 like to have it to know that they're bidding on the same 9 thing. And I don't know that, because Hill Country Co-Op -- 10 you know, I don't understand all their bandwidth numbers up 11 on top, why they even have those in there if we're going off 12 whatever the Kerrville exchange number is anyway. So, 13 it's -- I'm sure you understand it, but I clearly don't. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, Jon. You're a 15 nice young man. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: And he's behaving today. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And you're behaving. Are 18 you getting all this down? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I know I'm slow on this stuff, 20 so -- 21 MR. TROLINGER: There is a lot to it. That's why I 22 made a summary sheet, to -- to break it out. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I think that if you think 24 that fiberoptic -- a new fiberoptic is good, I think everyone 25 should bid new fiberoptic. That eliminates one more 4-12-10 86 1 difference. 2 MR. TROLINGER: That is actually a factor. The two 3 providers are going to bring the fiberoptic, and the other, 4 the existing copper. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. But I heard this 6 gentleman back here say that he could bring in new 7 fiberoptic. Well, if we want new fiberoptic, let's bring in 8 new fiberoptic. 9 MR. TROLINGER: I think it goes more to the pricing 10 fairness than anything. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I thinks it's -- 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But it's equality of the 14 proposals. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. I mean, I can't -- I 16 don't think I'm comparing apples to apples if some are fiber 17 and some are on copper. 18 MR. TROLINGER: That's right. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. That's exactly 20 what you're saying. 21 MR. TROLINGER: That's right. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Exactly what it is. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, they should all be on 24 fiber; that's what we want. You need to say what we want. 25 You need to say what bandwidth we want it at. You know, you 4-12-10 87 1 say how you want the bid to come in, and then they can adjust 2 their stuff to fill in three, four, five numbers. I don't 3 want to see it all. 4 MR. TROLINGER: So, what I understand is we send 5 out a bid sheet; we say, "Fill in your numbers here in the 6 empty spaces." We'll take that -- 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Put them in an envelope, send 8 them back to me. We'll open them on the court date. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, and that way it's -- you 10 know, it's clear, and it's fair. And I -- and I don't know 11 that I'll understand it, but I know they're at least bidding 12 on the same numbers. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If you don't understand, we 14 get him to interpret for us. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll keep trying, won't we, John? 17 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. And, Commissioner 18 Baldwin, I'm sorry if you're still getting echo. I'll give 19 you a call and we'll look at that, see what we can find. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're going to call me, me, 21 me, me, me? (Laughter.) 22 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: What his problem is, he gets a call 25 that he says, "This is my wife, wife, wife, wife," and he 4-12-10 88 1 thinks there's more than one, and he's got a problem with 2 that. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Yeah. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Why don't we now go to 5 Section 4 of the agenda, and payment of the bills. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move we pay the bills. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Second. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to pay the 9 bills. I assume that includes the direct payables that they 10 provided us a number of sheets for; is that correct? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, sir. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Any further question or 13 discussion on the motion? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, yeah. Let's -- hold 15 on just a second, Judge. Let me get arranged here. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Deranged? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want to get deranged. 18 Now, what all -- okay, hold on. All right, here's the bills. 19 Here's the regular bills, okay? Now, I have eight -- let's 20 see, three, four, six -- seven other pages of documents. 21 What are they? 22 MS. HARGIS: Those are the -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We really are -- this thing 24 is really growing like crazy here. Help me. Help me 25 understand what we're doing. 4-12-10 89 1 MS. HARGIS: Unfortunately, we'd like to blend them 2 into one for you, but the computer system will not allow 3 that. That's the reason why we have to give you individual 4 ones. We had three weeks in between meetings, so that's why 5 you have more of these than you normally would have had. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bruce has been here since 7 Noah's Ark, and we've always done this right here, everything 8 on this, and what doesn't make the cut doesn't get paid. You 9 understand what I'm saying? 10 MS. HARGIS: No, it has all -- it has always been 11 paid. You never received this. Those bills were done by 12 direct payables, and those direct payables did not come to 13 the Court. And so I am bringing those direct payables to the 14 Court so that you see every check that goes through. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I understand, and I 16 appreciate you doing all that stuff. But it was never done 17 like this. I mean, this -- this has gotten wild, to me. I 18 mean, I don't even know what the hell this is. 19 MS. HARGIS: It's the direct payables. You -- you 20 don't want to see them? Then if you want to -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want it to be a part of 22 this. 23 MS. HARGIS: It can't be, I'm sorry. The software 24 won't allow us to do it. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Software won't, okay. 4-12-10 90 1 MS. HARGIS: What happens is, the software picks up 2 a date, and that date is what prints out. Once the checks 3 have been processed, it won't pick them up any more, so we 4 can't get them in this packet. In fact, we have to be very 5 careful that we pull this on the exact day we get finished 6 with the payables to get it to process the -- the special 7 reports that you're getting. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Ms. Hargis, can you explain why 9 we have direct payables? 10 MS. HARGIS: It's my understanding -- this was done 11 prior to my getting here, but the direct payables were for 12 people who are traveling, for electric bills that -- any type 13 of a utility bill that we receive in between court dates, to 14 keep that from being late and possibly the service being 15 disconnected, and for, you know, the bills that were going to 16 have a late payment due on them. That has been the procedure 17 that has been done, and Mindy can agree with me on that. 18 That's been done for years. The only difference is, we are 19 now bringing you those so that you have an opportunity to see 20 the checks that went through in between court dates, so that 21 you're aware of them and you know everything that goes 22 through. The only other thing I could do is, we can put 23 these on a spreadsheet. That's the only thing we can do. We 24 can't get the computer system to do it, but if you like, we 25 will try to initiate a spreadsheet. It's just that it's very 4-12-10 91 1 difficult for us to put all this together on a -- you know, 2 in 24 hours, but we will do that if that's what the Court 3 wants us to do. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think the problem in this 5 whole thing is the fact that we don't get to see these except 6 in a meeting, and we didn't actually approve payment of them, 7 and they are not ever -- is that kind of where you're going 8 there, Buster? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's it. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They're being paid without 11 Commissioners Court approval. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: We've been approving them 13 just like we do the main bill list. But what my -- my 14 question about this is, I can understand the direction, for 15 purposes of avoiding a late payment penalty and things of 16 that nature, and that's where this started. I would agree. 17 But I see some items on this particular list which, really, I 18 would be curious to know if there was a late payment penalty 19 associated -- the possibility of a late payment penalty 20 associated with that particular bill. Utility bills for my 21 sub-office in Center Point, for example; that one pops out at 22 me. Is -- whomever -- Aqua Texas going to cut off the water 23 over there if we don't get it done and pay it, you know, 24 through the regular bill process? 25 MS. HARGIS: They have a really large late fee on 4-12-10 92 1 theirs. And yes, they do. They have 10 days, 'cause I 2 happen to be on them, and they will -- they will. They have 3 a 10-day and a 15-day cutoff. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The one that jumped out at 5 me -- 6 MS. HARGIS: Doesn't matter if it's a county or 7 not. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That might have been a poor 9 illustration. Excuse me, Buster. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's okay. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: But there are -- there are 12 payments and reimbursements to Kerr County employees for 13 attending conferences. 14 MS. HARGIS: That's -- 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And hotels. 16 MS. HARGIS: That's been the common practice, 17 that -- that a lot of people wait until -- some people know 18 they're going; some people don't know they're going, and so 19 they will ask for those payables generally the week that 20 they're going so that they don't have the -- you know, 21 necessarily know what they need for expenses and so forth. 22 So, they wait till the last minute, so that they're not, you 23 know, tying up the money with a check sitting there for two 24 weeks in between court dates. That's been common practice 25 here, that they -- 4-12-10 93 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So you're saying that those 2 things don't -- just didn't make the cut. 3 MS. HARGIS: Right, they just didn't make the cut. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, fine. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What about County Progress 6 Magazine that we purchase, and been purchasing for 20, 30 7 years? 8 MS. HARGIS: That one, again, I think was -- and 9 some of these, again, are late. They're going to be late, 10 and the subscription changes. Like, you know, AICPA 11 Magazine, if you order it when you -- when you're supposed 12 to. If you don't, then you pay a higher price. We try to 13 get everything through as much as we can so that we don't 14 have any more late bills, we don't have any more delinquent 15 charges in our credit. If this is confusing y'all, we can do 16 it on a different list, but -- but I'm more comfortable with 17 you knowing everything that you pay. And that's the reason 18 -- and we pull it the best way we can off of the system. If 19 there's a better way that you would like for us to make this 20 presentation, you know, we will do the best we can to come up 21 with that. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Let me ask you one other 23 question. In the perhaps unlikely event that one of us would 24 focus in on a particular payment that's on this list of 25 direct payments, and for some reason not want that to have 4-12-10 94 1 been paid, how do you -- how do you handle that? Pending 2 further information or whatever. 3 MS. HARGIS: That's a problem. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Hmm? 5 MS. HARGIS: That's a problem. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I know. Yeah, I guess once 7 the check's in the mail, it's in the mail. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, probably a lot of these 9 payments are made to individuals or entities that we've got 10 ongoing business with, and there will be future charges, and 11 we'll probably have some leverage there. 12 MS. HARGIS: One of the biggest problems -- vendors 13 that we have is Ikon, and another one is Accu. I've got an 14 e-mail from Don on it. Some of these have real short strings 15 on them, and it doesn't matter that we're a governmental 16 entity. They don't care; they want their bill. And this 17 particular court date, we had almost a three-week -- 21-day 18 difference, because we had that extra week in the month of 19 March. So, you have to understand, if you met on -- we 20 talked about this before. If you met on a weekly basis, you 21 wouldn't see this, because everything would go through on a 22 weekly basis. But -- but meeting every two weeks, it is not 23 necessarily 14 days. Sometimes it's 18 days or 20 days. In 24 this particular case, it was three weeks in between. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- I mean, I have mixed 4-12-10 95 1 thoughts on this. I mean, I appreciate your diligence in 2 getting these paid so we don't have late fees, and many, many 3 companies are shortening that period, in my mind, to 4 intentionally be able to get these very high late fees, so I 5 think that's -- I appreciate that. I have a concern on the 6 other side, though, of things being paid without our 7 approval, which I'm not sure there's authority to do that. 8 And since you like policy so much -- (Laughter.) 9 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's a nice way of putting 11 it. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- I think that we should maybe 13 have a policy that utility -- that authorizes payment of -- 14 any payment to keep us from incurring a late fee, or to 15 reimburse an employee to keep an employee from having a 16 hardship placed on them. 'Cause, you know, I know there was 17 one in there for Jannett for $1,100. If she put that 18 conference expense on her credit card, we should get it paid 19 back within the time period so she doesn't have to pay 20 interest on that, and I support those. But other than those 21 two instances -- I think that's what you're doing here -- we 22 shouldn't do it, and I think we should have a policy that 23 authorizes you to do -- to pay those two types of bills. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And advances to an employee 25 who needs it, or to the hotel or something of that nature. 4-12-10 96 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Something like that, and that's 2 pretty much it. Because I think it's -- you know, we're on 3 kind of thin ice, in my mind, having all this money go out, 4 and it's a substantial amount, without us having -- without 5 you having any authority to do it, in my mind. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's exactly what I was 7 trying to say earlier. You said it better. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: The policy would grant that 9 authority if it's to accomplish these specific purposes. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Right. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. I think that's -- 12 JUDGE TINLEY: That would be your cover, as it 13 were. 14 MS. HARGIS: I appreciate that. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Another thing that you may want to 16 consider, early payment discounts. That might be another 17 item -- 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: -- that would fall under it. I 20 don't -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do people do that? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Huh? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: People do that? 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 25 MS. HARGIS: There's still some who do. So, we 4-12-10 97 1 want to do it for advances. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yes. 3 MS. HARGIS: For travel. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Employee reimbursements. 5 MS. HARGIS: Employee reimbursement. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Utilities. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Utilities. 8 MS. HARGIS: Utilities. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We may want to go through 10 this just in case we're missing something there. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Let her bring back a draft of a 12 policy, I think is where we're going. 13 MS. WILLIAMS: May I say something? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, ma'am, we're going to get to 15 you. 16 MS. WILLIAMS: Well, I just wanted to bring up that 17 there was a standing court order that was probably five, six, 18 seven, eight, maybe ten years ago, to pay late utility bills, 19 to pay conference registrations, travel, lodging. There was 20 a standing court order that those things could be paid 21 between court dates, and the Court approved it, but I don't 22 remember how long ago it's been. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Well, as part of this 24 process, get Cheryl to bring that up, and y'all can work 25 on -- if that needs to be updated and brought back and 4-12-10 98 1 tweaked, so be it. If not, that's the cover you're working 2 under now, obviously. Ms. Hyde? 3 MS. HYDE: You also, in 2006, when I -- when y'all 4 hired me and we went through the I.R.S. and the insurance 5 issues, y'all also said that I could get the insurance paid 6 through direct payables, because there was confrontation and 7 we were getting behind and things weren't straight. So, that 8 was another -- that's a huge one. I'm sorry, but I can bring 9 that order back, too. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good illustration. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I think we should probably, 12 you know, do this annually. I think it ought to be part of 13 our budget. I really don't -- I mean, I'm -- you know, I'm 14 glad we have old court orders, but I think that this is the 15 type of thing that we really ought to put as part of our 16 budget. We have a lot of other similar type things in our 17 budget, and this -- just put it in there so we're aware of it 18 and keep track of it, and if we need to modify it any year, 19 it keeps it in front of us. 20 MS. HARGIS: That would be helpful to us. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 22 MS. HARGIS: In other words, we need your guidance 23 on these things. And that's the reason why we're bringing it 24 to your attention, 'cause some of these things I'm not 25 comfortable with, but I'm kind of, like, forced to either -- 4-12-10 99 1 you know, I stand up as much as I can, but there's some 2 points that, you know, I'm at the end of the gun. I don't 3 want -- you know, at the end of the day. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Work on developing that new policy. 5 Let's look at the old court order and see what we need to 6 include, and bring it back. 7 MS. HARGIS: Okay, super. I appreciate that. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any other question or 9 discussion on the motion? All -- I'm sorry. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Are we doing the motion on 11 the bills, or are we including the direct payables? 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Direct payables are included. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: The least we can do is to approve 15 them after the fact and confirm them. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, I agree. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion? All 18 in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. Budget 23 amendments. Looks like we have one in the County 24 Attorney's -- 25 MS. HARGIS: Yes, the County Attorney's office. We 4-12-10 100 1 had, I think, discussed -- or the Court had discussed, in the 2 interim period, not having, you know, a County Attorney in 3 that position; that we would use some of those funds to pay 4 for outside attorneys that we needed. And so we need to -- 5 to fix that line item so that it doesn't, you know, go over. 6 And so my suggestion was that we only do 10,000 at this time. 7 If we go over some more, then we still have funds to do it. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Over the contract attorney's fees? 9 MR. HENNEKE: Yes, Your Honor, from the portion of 10 the budget for the County Attorney position that was not 11 utilized, or during the vacancy. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Sure. 13 MS. HARGIS: Because at the time of budgeting, we 14 didn't budget for any of that, because we didn't need it. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Move approval. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 18 approval of the budget amendment. Any further discussion? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've got a question. I 20 didn't hear you say Court-appointed attorneys. What 21 attorneys? 22 MR. HENNEKE: Special contract attorneys out of my 23 office, who for the last six months, I think, have been 24 supplementing the office and helping cover the State Hospital 25 or to be a special prosecutor or to provide legal work with 4-12-10 101 1 my office. This is not for Court-appointed defense 2 attorneys. This is for -- 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do we have -- we have a line 4 in the budget to pay those type of folks? 5 MR. HENNEKE: Yes, sir. 6 MS. HARGIS: We had a line in the budget, but we 7 didn't have it substantial enough, because we had a full crew 8 or full staffing; we had a County Attorney and two other 9 attorneys. But when we had the appointment of -- of Rex to 10 the District Judge, we only had two attorneys, and that left 11 us short for some of the courts. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, I understand. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Wasn't a need for it before 14 that. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 17 THE CLERK: We have a motion and a second. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion on 19 the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 20 your right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Is this the 25 only late bill that we have, the one for Fujitsu? 4-12-10 102 1 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: There is a maintenance contract, 3 apparently, for the District Clerk on some Fujitsu equipment 4 up there, I guess. 5 MS. HARGIS: It's her annual maintenance on her 6 copy -- I think it's a copy machine or -- 7 MR. TROLINGER: Scanner. 8 MS. HARGIS: -- scanner, and it did come in late. 9 But it does have a late fee on it as well. But it's an 10 annual -- and we have -- we normally have paid this in 11 January, but somehow or another, it got lost in the mail. It 12 was due in January, so this is really, like, the second 13 notice on this. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Do I hear a motion to approve 15 payment of the late bill? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Move approval. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 19 approval. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 20 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. I've been 25 presented with monthly reports from Constable, Precinct 3; 4-12-10 103 1 Constable, Precinct 1; County Clerk; Environmental Health; 2 Justice of the Peace, Precinct 3; and Kerr County payroll for 3 March 2010. Do I hear a motion that those designated reports 4 be approved as submitted? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that the 8 designated reports be approved as submitted. Question or 9 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 10 your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Okay, let's 15 now go to Section 5, reports from Commissioners in connection 16 with their liaison or committee assignments. Commissioner 17 Baldwin, do you have anything for us in that regard? 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I guess not. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Commissioner Williams? 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, sir. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Letz? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Briefly. The County Attorney 23 and myself are working on the ETJ issues with the City. We 24 have a draft agreement from -- from them, and we'll be 25 further discussing the draft and meeting with City staff as 4-12-10 104 1 appropriate to try to get it back on our agenda. Goal 2 timeline is to have it hopefully back to -- or to the 3 Commissioners Court for some sort of action first meeting in 4 May. Hopefully we can make that. And airport, everyone 5 knows the status out there. There's an airport board 6 meeting; I'll be attending that this afternoon. We'll have 7 an idea where we are with the management contract -- or where 8 they are with the management contract. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, they're going to 10 wait -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's on their agenda. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is it on today? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, it's on their agenda, as 14 is also the water project, awarding bids. It's on their 15 agenda, I believe, also. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, there's some things that 18 we're looking at. That's it. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There you go, Judge; maybe 20 that will work better. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: I got one, okay. When was the City 22 due to come back? Didn't they have 30 days to bring back 23 their proposal? 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thirty days from the last 25 meeting. 4-12-10 105 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, which is pretty close. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. Anything else, 3 Commissioner Letz? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, sir. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: What do you have for us, 6 Commissioner Oehler? 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, two things, one being 8 that it's really good that Janie and her staff and all, as 9 well as another veterinarian in the community, is doing the 10 -- going to put on the deal over at the Doyle Center. That's 11 one good thing. Anything we can do to help alleviate some of 12 the overpopulation problems, I think, the better off we are. 13 Number two thing is, Ray Garcia got involved last week with 14 having a problem with tires being dumped in the river up at 15 Ingram, and he called, and I encouraged him to include the 16 City of Ingram as well as Road and Bridge in the cleanup 17 efforts, which he did. And it was a cooperative effort, and 18 I think A and A Tire took the tires for disposal. So, Ingram 19 brought a backhoe, and the County furnished a dump truck, 20 and -- and Environmental Health -- I think Jesse wandered off 21 down in the river to help tie a chain around them, and it got 22 taken care of. But we're hoping to catch whoever it is 23 that's doing that kind of thing. But it was a cooperative 24 effort between several different agencies and communities to 25 make it all happen. Now that everybody's aware of it, maybe 4-12-10 106 1 we can have more people watching for this sort of thing and 2 reporting these kind of activities that we need to stop. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I notice U.G.R.A. is 4 getting more engaged in that. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's good. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, they are. I think we 8 need to include them on more things. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I agree. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's it, Judge. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Do we have any reports 12 from elected officials or department heads? Ms. Hyde? Is 13 the Sheriff on vacation? 14 MS. HYDE: It's not my turn to watch him this week, 15 sir, I'm sorry. (Laughter.) There's six. I told you -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Who's his chaperone this week? Do 17 you know? 18 MS. HYDE: I would -- 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not me. I haven't seen him. 20 MS. HYDE: It would be Commissioner Oehler. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: She is not the Sheriff's 22 keeper. 23 MS. HYDE: I told you that I would keep you updated 24 with changes. I had requested Gary to give me an updated 25 easy-to-read report on what has passed legislation, and I'd 4-12-10 107 1 like to get permission from y'all to bring this portion of 2 it -- these are the big-ticket items that are going to be 3 hitting us with our new plan year -- at your pleasure, 4 perhaps in May. And that way, you have plenty of time to 5 kind of go over these -- these big tickets and have some 6 questions, and we can try to start answering questions before 7 we get into the budget. The big changes, we are a 8 grandfathered plan. It's not the typical grandfather that -- 9 that we think of, but we are grandfathered based on this new 10 law. The dependents coverage until age 26 is huge. That's a 11 huge change. And although the dependent coverage changes, 12 the I.R.S. Code did not change on dependents, so that I'm 13 sure will be a question, and it's going to be very difficult 14 to get people to understand. Over-the-counter drugs, there 15 are changes, but -- but we're already close to the 16 compliance, so we'll be okay with OTC drugs and our HRA 17 account. Urban retiree reinsurance. This is one of the 18 reasons why I was pretty negative about 55 retirees, because 19 now it's passed. And if you read that, it tells you what we 20 have to do, and basically, it ends up that the County would 21 have to pay for this reinsurance for 55's and out. So, this 22 gives you a little bit of reading material, and at y'all's 23 pleasure, and whichever meeting you'd like in May, I'd like 24 to bring Gary back and start answering some of your questions 25 as we go forward with what we can, because there's a lot of 4-12-10 108 1 changes. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This is probably the tip of 3 the iceberg. 4 MS. HYDE: Oh, yes, sir. But these are the big 5 tips -- tips. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: On the early retiree, -- 7 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: -- what you're talking about is 9 those prior to age 65 where they're not eligible for 10 Medicare, correct? 11 MS. HYDE: What they did is, because there were so 12 many plans out there, Judge, that had an option for 13 55-year-olds to go out, and in the state of Texas, as you're 14 well aware, teachers can do that. Most of your organizations 15 allow 55 retirees at a much higher rate. We had talked about 16 it for the last few years, and that was always. "No, no, no, 17 please, let's don't." This is one of the reasons why, is 18 that at 55, we would be responsible for 80 percent of 19 reimbursement towards that difference. But it's not in our 20 plan. It's never been in our plan. Therefore, it was real 21 important y'all understand, this is one of the grandfather 22 issues. So -- and we're not a VEBA, so it's a short-term fix 23 to shore up early retiree coverage until long-term measures, 24 which they're talking about underwriting new reform. That is 25 this reform that says this is what you're going to have to 4-12-10 109 1 do. So, the less we put in at this point, in my opinion, the 2 less that we try to change it, the better at this point, 3 'cause they're going to continue to change the law. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: I notice that on this special tier 5 of drugs that we adopted, that the drug companies are -- are 6 countering the effort to increase the copays with this coupon 7 or rebates or what whatever it may be. But I've noticed 8 they're now incorporating that in their TV advertising. I 9 think it was Nexium; might may have been another one, but it 10 was one of the seven, in which they're specifically touting 11 that your copay may be as little as -- and I think the number 12 was $35. 13 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: So, they're going after the -- the 15 effort to try and make those drugs more difficult to obtain 16 without paying a higher cost. 17 MS. HYDE: What more and more plans are doing is, 18 mid-plan year, they are changing their plan and they are 19 disallowing those prescriptions, period. They're going back 20 and they're disallowing them, because it's -- it's about 21 profit. It's about profit for those companies. And so -- do 22 you want to tell them what you were telling on the break? I 23 think that's great. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't know what you're 25 talking about. Who are you? No, the -- I thought it was 4-12-10 110 1 kind of an interesting deal, and it's something for all of us 2 to participate in. I was getting a prescription filled the 3 end of this last week, and my pharmacist says, "Hey, Buster, 4 want to try a -- we have a new drug that is an alternative to 5 the one." And we cut it almost in half. Almost in half. 6 It's brand-new, and we just happened to hit there. And I 7 said -- I asked him, I said, "What is the best" -- 'cause I 8 never considered my pharmacist as being one of those guys. I 9 thought it would be my doctor. But he said, "Just, you know, 10 talk to me. Ask me the question and I'll figure it out for 11 you." And we -- like, it cut -- it cut my copay from 35 to 5 12 bucks, and the insurance cost way, way down. You know, so 13 it's something that I think it's worthy of us to ask the 14 question. And we're going to -- we're going to take a look 15 at everything I do with him now and see what we can do. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: It's interesting. You made the 17 statement that your copay went down from 35 to 5, and the 18 insurance cost. When you say insurance cost, read "Kerr 19 County." We are paying that. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Exactly. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: That's the thing that we need to 22 impress upon all of our employees. This directly benefits 23 the county, because we are the insurance company, up -- up to 24 a limit that very few reach, so it's important that we do 25 that. 4-12-10 111 1 MS. HYDE: Would y'all like to see us come back and 2 answer some of your questions regarding this in May, once we 3 know a little bit more? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: As you've got information, I think 5 it would be helpful if we got it. 6 MS. HYDE: Okay. Thank you, sir. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Other -- Ms. Hargis? 8 MS. HARGIS: I just wanted to report that we are 9 working on our financial audit. It isn't complete. Probably 10 the first meeting in May, we'll present that, along with -- 11 we do have copies of the actuarial study, which I have not 12 passed out to all of you yet until I can go over it with the 13 gentleman who prepared it. But you're going to see from that 14 study that our annual liability is around $300,000, which is 15 -- you know, that's for people that are 60 to 65 years old. 16 So, if we add between 55 and 60, that liability will increase 17 substantially. The other thing that helped us on that was 18 the fact that you passed an order that if you're over 65, you 19 have to get Medicaid -- Medicare. 20 MS. HYDE: Medicare. 21 MS. HARGIS: So, that also helped that liability. 22 The other thing I want to bring up is, I'm going to be 23 leaving on Saturday; probably won't be back about till the 24 27th. I'm going on vacation. So, if you need someone in my 25 office, I will be tied -- I will have a computer with me. If 4-12-10 112 1 you need to e-mail me for any reason, or need me to make a 2 decision on something, I'll be keeping contact on a daily 3 basis with my staff, so I just wanted you to know I'd be out. 4 Okey-doke. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Have a good time. Where are 7 you going? 8 MS. HARGIS: I'm going to Kentucky. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just in time for the 10 Kentucky Derby. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Derby, yeah. Any other elected 12 officials? Department heads? Anything else to come before 13 the Court at this time? We'll be adjourned. 14 (Commissioners Court was adjourned at 11:37 a.m.) 15 - - - - - - - - - - 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 4-12-10 113 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 official reporter for the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 14th day of April, 2010. 8 9 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 10 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 11 Certified Shorthand Reporter 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 4-12-10