1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Budget Workshop 10 Tuesday, July 6, 2010 11 1:00 p.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X July 6, 2010 2 PAGE 3 Review and discuss FY 2010-11 Budgets and fiscal, capital expenditure and personnel matters related 4 thereto for various county departments: 5 198th District Court 4 6 Health Benefits Plan Issues 5 7 Modification to Position Schedule 30 8 Proposed County Capital Expenditures 33 9 Cost of Living Adjustment/Considerations 35 10 Animal Control 39 11 Juvenile Detention Facility 40 12 Facilities and Maintenance 42 13 Justice of the Peace 1, 2, 3 & 4 76 14 Constable 1, 2, 3 & 4 88 15 216th Adult Probation 103 16 Revenues update 104 17 --- Adjourned 110 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 3 1 On Tuesday, July 6, 2010, at 1:00 p.m., a budget 2 workshop meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was 3 held in the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 (Judge Tinley and Commissioner Letz were not present at the beginning of the workshop.) 8 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This is a workshop in the 10 Commissioners' Courtroom, 1:00 p.m., Tuesday, July 6th, 2010, 11 in the Commissioners Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse. It 12 is that time and that date, and we are now in a workshop 13 session. There's a list -- the good Judge is out due to 14 family issues, and Letz is wandering around as usual. 15 (Laughter.) The -- we have a list of items that we're going 16 to go over, and they're not necessarily in -- in this -- 17 you're first. 18 JUDGE EMERSON: Thank you. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're welcome. Not 20 necessarily in this order, as a matter of fact. And I -- 21 what we want to do here is, as we call them up, the 22 Commissioners Court -- members of the Commissioners Court may 23 have some comments to make first. And if they do not, just 24 like Rex, as an example, is just going to launch into 25 whatever he has to say, and -- and so we'll start with the 7-6-10 bwk 4 1 198th District Court, the honorable judge. Anybody have 2 anything to say? 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm still looking for my 4 budgets. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see, okay. Go ahead, Rex. 6 JUDGE EMERSON: Mine's actually pretty simple. 7 Special district judge, we reduced it by $2,000. The only 8 real increase we have is on equipment maintenance, and that's 9 because of our copier. We had to take it up to $1,200 for 10 equipment maintenance. Special trials shows a slight -- 11 shows an increase from zero to $1,000, but we don't even have 12 to maintain that amount. We don't need to. I may have 13 further reductions coming later, but it's a little premature 14 for me to make that presentation to the Court. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tell me about -- I'm just 16 curious about the special judge, what you see. Is something 17 going on that you wouldn't -- I mean, do you ever use special 18 judges? 19 JUDGE EMERSON: I think it's based on -- it's based 20 on -- this $1,000 is in there because I'm new to the 21 position, and I keep running into new things, and I'm not 22 quite sure if I'm going to hit something. The odds are it 23 will never be used, but -- 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 25 JUDGE EMERSON: -- I'm acting out of an abundance 7-6-10 bwk 5 1 of caution. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very well. Anything else? 3 JUDGE EMERSON: That's it. I would appreciate 4 approval. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Anything from the Court? I 6 thank you, sir. 7 JUDGE EMERSON: Thank you. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thank you, Rex. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You know, we can argue if 10 you want. 11 MS. HENDERSON: Hey, it was nice having him here. 12 JUDGE EMERSON: I just want to tell you how much I 13 appreciate the fact that you dressed up for this session. 14 (Laughter.) 15 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Wait a minute. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Health benefits plan issues. 17 Who does that? Ms. Hyde? Come forth. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You're not going to give us 19 a test on all that stuff you've been sending out, are you? 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There's a lot of it. 21 MR. LOONEY: Easy test. Nobody knows the right 22 answers. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Huh? 24 MR. LOONEY: Be easy to take the test. Nobody 25 knows the right answers. 7-6-10 bwk 6 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: They won't know them after 2 today either, will they? 3 MS. HYDE: No, sir, probably not. This is a 4 different one. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Somebody made mention about 6 the right-hand stapling, but apparently it's floated over 7 someone's head. This is a different one. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh, that's what I got. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This is the budget process; 10 you might be able to get the attention now. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You can always tell where the 12 info comes from. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Lots of tax hikes coming in 14 2011. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Staples are always in the 16 right-hand corner. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is this another one? I 18 guess -- 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Here's another one. Oh, my 20 gosh. I should have brought my glasses. 21 MS. HYDE: Well, we don't have big enough paper. I 22 mean, I guess I could have gone to Jannett's office and we 23 could have blown it up. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Believe me, I can figure it 25 out. 7-6-10 bwk 7 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Health benefits plan issues. 2 MS. HYDE: Discuss the employee health benefit plan 3 issues. For the discussion, we still don't know -- it's 4 still unknown what the president's final changes are going to 5 be, and modifications. The estimate of the cost started at 6 2.7 million for this year. We're now looking at 2.95. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Against current, which is? 8 MS. HYDE: Our current is 2.2 million. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 10 MS. HYDE: That's a $750,000 increase. That's 11 approximate. These are all approximations. We don't -- we 12 don't know the final outcome yet. What we do know is that we 13 were to give some methodologies or some discussion points for 14 y'all to consider regarding how to make up that $750,000. 15 So, of course, I look at active employee cost remains at 16 zero; employees pay nothing. Or the suggestion was that 17 employees pay $100 per month. That would be -- at 300 18 employees, it's not rocket science; there's $300,000. To me, 19 that's a simple way to look at it. 20 (Commissioner Letz joined the meeting.) 21 MS. HYDE: And our job is to look at employees 22 first, so we went into the next phase, which was active 23 employee spouse and dependent cost increased to $300 per 24 month. Spouses currently are $240; that's a $60 increase on 25 a spouse, and it would be a $171 increase on children, going 7-6-10 bwk 8 1 from $129, which we did not raise last year, to $300. If we 2 do those changes alone, that's between $200,000 and $215,000 3 in savings. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Is that reflected on this 5 worksheet you gave us? 6 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. Increase the retiree cost to 7 $300 per month, and increase the spouse -- retiree spouse to 8 the actual cost, which is going to be approximately $885 a 9 month. Look at retirees no longer being eligible for the 10 H.R.A. benefit, which is the deductible that we pay into, and 11 look at potentially looking at active married employees who 12 currently pay nothing; if there's two people that both work 13 for the county, look at them paying $150. These are just 14 some things that we threw out there for you guys to ponder 15 and think about. If we look at increasing the employee 16 spouse and dependent cost, you're looking at 205,000 to 17 $215,000. Increasing the retiree spouse coverage to full 18 cost is about $28,000. Increasing retirees from 200 to 300 a 19 month is another 31,000. And then the one that will probably 20 get me shot is -- we talked about it last year -- the sick 21 pay benefit. We figured out that on your sick pay -- on our 22 sick pay benefits right now, we give -- we give out 8 dollars 23 -- I mean 8 hours per month, or 96 hours per year. We talked 24 about it last year, and we made so many changes, y'all said 25 let's hold off and look at it another year. If we reduced it 7-6-10 bwk 9 1 from 8 hours a month -- from 8 hours per month to 4 hours per 2 month, which is from 12 days to 6 days annually, it's a cost 3 savings of $300,000. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Say that one again, please? 5 MS. HYDE: Right now we give 8 hours per month, or 6 96 hours a year. If we reduce that to 4 hours per month, or 7 6 days a year, which is 48, it's a cost savings of $300,000. 8 And, again -- 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Wait just a second. 10 MS. HARGIS: It's not really a cost savings unless 11 we hire somebody to fill their spot. If they're sick and you 12 don't put anybody in their spot, you're still going to pay 13 them if they have sick leave, so they -- or they take 14 vacation. So -- 15 MS. HYDE: The problem is, Jeannie, they are taking 16 it and we are paying it. In an average 10-person office, if 17 they all take their 12 days, then that means basically, 18 gentlemen, it's 120 days. And in a 10-person office, you got 19 20 to 21 days per month that are working days; that's an 20 average of six months out of the year that we're down an 21 employee. It doesn't have to be the same employee; it can be 22 any one of the 10. And they are taking them. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, what you're saying is that 24 it appears that employees are taking sick days for other 25 purposes? 7-6-10 bwk 10 1 MS. HYDE: I don't know that I would say they're 2 taking it for other purposes. I just think that -- we just 3 know that they're taking them. Some offices have 4 instituted -- they have to bring a doctor's excuse, which has 5 reduced sick-ins, because if they bring a doctor's excuse, 6 they typically have to pay a $30 copay, and that gets -- 7 that's hitting their pockets. But we're also looking at 8 helping them understand, you know, you can plan the doctor's 9 appointment for end of the day, 4 o'clock. 'Cause, I mean, 10 I challenge most of us to go to a doctor's appointment at 11 10 o'clock and actually see the doctor at 10:00. So, it 12 erodes their sick time if they're going during the middle of 13 the day, and sometimes they don't come back. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Is that something we can do 16 under the new health care law? 17 MS. HYDE: Which one? Reduce their sick? 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The multitude of things that 19 have been floating our way. 20 MS. HYDE: The sick pay has nothing to do with the 21 health care plan. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Nothing to do with health 23 care, so you can -- you can do -- 24 MS. HYDE: That's a policy. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- do whatever you wish with 7-6-10 bwk 11 1 that. 2 MS. HYDE: Right. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: As long as we're not cutting 4 benefits or health plan. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Well, that would be a cut 6 in benefits. 7 MS. HYDE: But it's not health care benefits. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's a personal benefit. 10 MS. HYDE: That's just a straight benefit. We 11 don't even have to give sick days. If you look at the 12 spreadsheet, y'all said keep it simple. The first columns 13 are what we currently get. If you flip to the last page, 14 that will probably make it the easiest. Right now, employees 15 paying into the system -- into the health insurance system, 16 it's approximately $308,304 a year. That's how much 17 employees are currently paying in, whether it's for their 18 spouses or children. If you go to the middle section, if we 19 increase it to the 300 for the spouse and for the children, 20 the family plan goes to $600. That's $511,200. That's a 21 cost difference between what we're doing now and what we can 22 do of $203,000. What we can't measure at this point is what 23 the difference is going to be on dependent status. Dependent 24 status is changed. And even within the law, the law is 25 contradicting itself. In one part, it tells us that we have 7-6-10 bwk 12 1 to guarantee that dependent coverage is through the age of 2 27, which means as soon as they turn 27, then we can cut them 3 off. But then you go down about 60 pages, and it tells you, 4 well, no, it's through the age of 26. So, there's two 5 different things that they have not clarified yet within the 6 law. That's adding either another year or two years to our 7 insurance plan for dependents. In addition, the dependent -- 8 what is a dependent? They have not clarified what a 9 dependent is, other than the fact they no longer have to be a 10 full-time student and they don't have to be living in your 11 household. It doesn't match the I.R.S. regs. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Go back to those two numbers. 13 Right now it's $308,304? 14 MS. HYDE: Right. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's the amount that the 16 family coverage brings in, okay. What does that family 17 coverage cost us? 18 MS. HYDE: What does it cost us? This year, 2.2 19 million. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just the family? Just that 21 portion, not the employees? 22 MS. HYDE: No, it's total. 23 MR. LOONEY: Claims cost? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. Well, I mean, if we're 25 talking -- we're going from 300 -- I want to find out what 7-6-10 bwk 13 1 the subsidy is. How much are the taxpayers -- 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Are we subsidizing the family 3 plan? 4 MR. LOONEY: I'm sorry, sir. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Did you say that right, Bruce? 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes, I think so. 7 MR. LOONEY: Say that one again so I make sure I 8 understand. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How much is the -- are we 10 subsidizing the spouse and/or dependent coverage? 11 MR. LOONEY: If you want to -- if you look at it 12 from the standpoint of how much is the claim payments made to 13 dependents in relationship to the fixed cost, we can -- I 14 don't have that -- 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just fixed cost, where if 16 we're contributing somewhere around 710 or 700-some dollars a 17 month per employee, -- 18 MS. HYDE: About 760. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- if we're only getting back 20 240, then the difference should be what we're subsidizing the 21 dependents -- or the family. 22 MR. LOONEY: Since we're self-funded, you have to 23 look -- if you're looking at pure cost, then you have to look 24 at claims cost -- 25 MS. HYDE: Right. 7-6-10 bwk 14 1 MR. LOONEY: -- plus the fixed costs that we pay to 2 have the additional coverage of the specific and aggregate 3 insurance. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 5 MR. LOONEY: You have to combine those three items 6 together, and that claims cost is going to be a roller 7 coaster. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 9 MR. LOONEY: So, we can go back historically and 10 try to factor what it has been for the last two to three 11 years to come up with a number. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That would be helpful. 'Cause, 13 I mean, the way I look at it, I mean, I don't want to -- I 14 want to make sure we don't start charging them more than 15 they're receiving. 16 MR. LOONEY: You don't want to be in the insurance 17 business. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, if it's -- if we're 20 subsidizing, if they're giving us 304,000 and it's costing 21 the County 800,000, that -- to me, that's a $500,000 subsidy. 22 MR. LOONEY: I'll get that -- I'll get those 23 numbers. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That number. 25 MR. LOONEY: I'll get those numbers. 7-6-10 bwk 15 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Eva, you got three columns 3 here. The existing in one? 4 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. The middle one is the 5 proposed. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What is that? 7 MS. HYDE: It's the proposed at $300. And then the 8 last one was -- was some other suggestions, that you do the 9 spouse at 300, you do children up to two at 300, and then you 10 do a per capita, per child. So, your proposed family is 11 going to -- is going to substantially increase. If you have 12 a spouse and three children, then it can be $1,200 a month, 13 which is a large difference from what they pay right now, 14 which is $359 for a family. If you look at the $600, which 15 is the middle of the road, which is the middle -- middle set 16 of columns, then you're looking at right now they pay $359 17 for a family; it would go up to $600. So, it's a difference 18 of two -- $171. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Per month? 20 MS. HYDE: Per month. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: $359 up to what? 22 MS. HYDE: To $600. And then there is the 23 catch-all that we could always go back and hit employees. 24 But when we talked about hitting employees, we don't know 25 what this is going to -- what this is going to do or what -- 7-6-10 bwk 16 1 what changes might occur between now and elections. But even 2 then, we've still got two more years. Gary's got some more 3 information on stop loss which is surprising. And even they 4 are hedging their bets at this point that, yeah, we'll 5 guarantee you, and your costs won't be much more next year, 6 but the following year we can go up 57 percent in cost. Now, 7 that's what they're putting out in their contracts, which is 8 unbelievable. So I think that everyone is in a real state of 9 flux. They don't -- we really don't know what the heck is 10 going on, but we do know our claims cost is up. 11 MR. LOONEY: When Eva talks about not knowing, you 12 know, what's going on, I need to make sure that we understand 13 that. We had a seminar in San Antonio two weeks -- three 14 weeks ago. We had the president of Blue Cross/Blue Shield 15 was there for the four states of Illinois, New Mexico, 16 Oklahoma, and Texas. The Department of Insurance 17 Commissioner was there, Mike Geeslin, and then we had an 18 attorney/accountant that was there that was a partner in -- 19 one of the partners in San Antonio. These three gentlemen 20 put on the seminar, and they essentially did a caveat at the 21 beginning of their presentations. 22 MS. HYDE: Every one of them. 23 MR. LOONEY: Every one of them said, "This is the 24 way it is today. We're going to give that speech again in 25 two weeks, and we know that there will be parts of it that 7-6-10 bwk 17 1 have to be changed during that time frame." So, the fact 2 that we're -- we don't know, it's this definition of 3 "dependent" -- 4 MS. HYDE: Huge. 5 MR. LOONEY: The definition of "dependent" is going 6 to be a definition that's other than what the I.R.S. 7 currently uses. But they -- we don't know when it's going to 8 come out, and we don't know what it's going to actually say. 9 We do know that the people that are putting it together in 10 the past have used totally different language, totally 11 different evaluations. We do know that these dependent 12 children may be married, and that we may be picking up the 13 dependents of dependents under the plan. 14 MS. HYDE: Which we discussed that once before, in 15 that -- where's Linda? I'll borrow Linda. Linda's got a 16 son, and he's 26 years of age, and Linda is claiming him as a 17 dependent for insurance. And he gets married, and his wife 18 has got four kids. The way it reads right now, not only can 19 we pick up him as the dependent, but we pick up his wife and 20 those children as well. And there's nothing that we can say 21 or do about it. People don't understand that -- that 22 insurance is mandatory. It will be mandatory by law. We 23 don't even know how we would look at dependents, as far as 24 how do you keep up with them? The I.R.S. doesn't keep up 25 with them now. They can't. So how in the world are we going 7-6-10 bwk 18 1 to keep up with them? 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: When does it become 3 mandatory? 4 MS. HYDE: Dependent -- 5 MR. LOONEY: Mandatory dependents? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, insurance. Having 7 insurance. 8 MR. LOONEY: 2014. 9 MS. HYDE: 2014. 10 MR. LOONEY: We already meet all the qualifications 11 under the health care 2014 requirements, because of the fact 12 that all of our employees are covered, the fact that our 13 benefit plan is greater than the actuarial value that they've 14 established to be the minimum plan. 15 MS. HYDE: Right. 16 MR. LOONEY: So we're already meeting those 17 requirements. But the thing that the bill didn't do anything 18 to do -- didn't do anything about was controlling the cost of 19 health care. So, from plan design, benefits, from being able 20 to have people move in and off the plan, those administrative 21 things we're pretty much in tune with today, but the cost of 22 the plan as to what is elevated and what that's escalated -- 23 MS. HYDE: One of the big ones is that the plan we 24 currently have is a $2 million max cap. There is no max cap 25 in the law. It's unlimited. 7-6-10 bwk 19 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: When does that go into 2 effect? 3 MR. LOONEY: September 23rd. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: This year? 5 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The cap is wiped out for 7 any plan? 8 MR. LOONEY: Anniversary date following the 9 September 23rd date. 10 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Gary, I notice everything's 11 in a state of flux, and I start by saying I appreciate the 12 fact that you had these seminars and trying to educate Eva 13 and others and us as to what's taking place. I guess my 14 question has to do with, we've got between now and September 15 30th to get our act together for budget year '10-'11. Are we 16 going to be able to know exactly what the law will allow us 17 to do or not do in this time frame? 18 MR. LOONEY: What they -- what they've done is 19 they've come up with a -- a law or a regulatory statement 20 that says that if you have your plan grandfathered -- if your 21 plan is grandfathered, then this is what your benefit 22 structure will look like moving forward, and here's the limit 23 that you can make and the changes of your plan. An interim 24 regulation that was put out three weeks ago. Interim 25 regulations, similar to the interim regulations we have with 7-6-10 bwk 20 1 COBRA that went on for 27 years. So, it's an interim 2 regulation. All of the elements that are grandfathered in 3 there we can apply a cost to and project that into next year. 4 Right now, we really don't find any benefit from being a 5 grandfathered plan. We can't find any reason to -- to 6 grandfather, because it doesn't allow us to make changes in 7 the benefit plan moving forward in relationship to 8 coinsurance coverages, maximum limits. There are rules and 9 regulations about what we can and can't do, but the things 10 that are going to impact us the most in cost are the no 11 lifetime maximum on any benefits, no annual maximum on any 12 benefits, such as a limit of $10,000 for so many days under 13 such-and-such a carrier, not being able to put those internal 14 limits in the policy. And the one other item that's going to 15 be probably the more expensive, and hopefully long-term will 16 help us, though, is that there won't be any coinsurance or 17 copayments allowed on wellness benefits. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: On what? 19 MR. LOONEY: Wellness benefits. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, wellness. Okay. 21 MR. LOONEY: Which means that it's going to be an 22 open-ticket item that we have to pay at 100 percent. No 23 coinsurance, no copayments. 24 MS. HYDE: No deductible. 25 MR. LOONEY: No deductible. That -- that's going 7-6-10 bwk 21 1 to go into effect on the next anniversary date. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, if somebody enters a 3 wellness program, we have to pay for it? Is that what you're 4 saying? 5 MS. HYDE: No, no, no. He's talking about 6 wellness -- 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Somebody joins the gym, 8 and -- 9 MS. HYDE: No, no, no. Medical. Medical. 10 MR. LOONEY: There's a -- there's a set of codes 11 that physicians use to identify when a person comes into 12 their office with an organic complaint, a problem. That's 13 diagnosed and treated as an ongoing. If they come in for 14 their annual physical, that's considered a wellness -- 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 16 MR. LOONEY: -- check-up benefit. No reason to be 17 at the doctor's office other than to check their health to 18 see what their status is. That's a wellness benefit. And 19 the doctors code it, and there will be no office visit 20 copays, no coinsurance, paid at 100 percent. 21 MS. HYDE: Also things like immunizations. 22 Immunizations will be considered, you know, copay. No 23 deductible. There are some of those that we've been trying 24 to do within the plan so that we could see what some of those 25 cost factors are, but we really thought that there would be 7-6-10 bwk 22 1 some -- some sort of limit. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, there'll actually be no 3 copay on those kind of -- 4 MS. HYDE: Or deductible. 5 MR. LOONEY: Or deductible. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No deductible, so they just 7 go ahead and do it and we're responsible for that, 100 8 percent of it? 9 MR. LOONEY: With all due respect to our physician 10 community, I hate to give them an open ticket. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 12 MR. LOONEY: So -- but back to your question, 13 Commissioner, the -- can we give you a hard dollar number? 14 We're going to have the aggregate contract from the insurance 15 company. The aggregate contract, when we get that number 16 from them on the renewal, will be our maximum cost that we'll 17 be liable for that plan. For that budget year. 18 MS. HYDE: For the budget year. 19 MR. LOONEY: That maximum cost. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's the stop loss 21 portion? 22 MR. LOONEY: That's the stop loss portion of the 23 plan. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 25 MR. LOONEY: So we will have that element still as 7-6-10 bwk 23 1 part of our plan. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Although we're going to be 3 liable outside of that number if it were to occur. 4 MR. LOONEY: No. 5 MS. HYDE: Yes. 6 MR. LOONEY: No liability. The liability for all 7 the benefits paid under that plan will be covered by that 8 aggregate insurance contract. 9 MS. HYDE: Aggregate will also cover. 10 MR. LOONEY: It will be covering these items, too. 11 MS. HYDE: That's true. 12 MR. LOONEY: Obviously, that increases the 13 liability of the insurance company. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 15 MR. LOONEY: Which increases the premium cost, 16 which is reflected back in the projected cost. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So I guess, then, what I was 18 kind of getting to was, well, what happens whenever the cap 19 is lifted? How do we -- how do we -- how can we set a limit 20 when there is no limit -- 21 MR. LOONEY: The insurance -- 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- to what our exposure would 23 be? 24 MR. LOONEY: Well, our -- the insurance -- the 25 actuaries that the insurance companies are giving us those 7-6-10 bwk 24 1 maximum aggregate numbers, they are giving us caps. So -- 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, stop loss is, but 3 federal government's not. 4 MS. HYDE: No. 5 MR. LOONEY: No. 6 MS. HYDE: I mean, the stop loss is still 7 showing -- you can still get a million, 2 million, 5 million, 8 10 million. But, I mean -- 9 MR. LOONEY: We'll be able to give you a hard 10 number. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. I assume from all 12 this that Eva's told us as we're dealing with employee 13 participation, that currently that is not something that the 14 feds are looking to govern at this point? 15 MS. HYDE: At this point. 16 MR. LOONEY: At this point. 17 MS. HYDE: But -- 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: As we speak today. 19 MS. HYDE: But in those letters that I've been 20 giving you guys, keep in mind that one of the things that the 21 president is trying to put onto other bills and other 22 legislation is that employers -- because as soon as it 23 started to come out, employers started scurrying, trying to 24 find ways to minimize their cost, okay? So, one of the 25 things that he wants is 10 percent. That's the max you can 7-6-10 bwk 25 1 increase on any given line item to your employees. Well, 2 right now employees pay zero, so I'm not being -- I mean, it 3 ain't rocket science; 10 percent of nothing is nothing. So, 4 10 percent of $129 is $12.90, which is a drop in the bucket. 5 10 percent -- I mean, on a monthly basis. You know, 10 6 percent of $240 is $24. Again, you know, if something like 7 that -- if he's able to get something like that through as 8 well, you know, I think Jeannie and I agree on this. Where 9 does the buck actually stop? This plan is not free. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I don't know what 11 happens. You know, another one of the things that's being 12 pushed through the legislation is unionization of workers, 13 because there are some exemptions I see for those 14 organizations. 15 MS. HYDE: Yeah. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That -- of course, that 17 doesn't mean that's a better deal. That just means that 18 they're trying to push unions. 19 MR. LOONEY: Well, one of the elements of the whole 20 bill is the fact that in 2018, there's going to be an 21 additional tax placed on any benefit plans that are 22 considered to be Cadillac plans. So, what the unions were 23 very concerned about is that, because of their negotiations, 24 all of their plans are going to be considered Cadillac plans. 25 And one of the biggest organizational groups in Washington 7-6-10 bwk 26 1 recently has been the firefighters and the police officers 2 association, because a lot of them have benefit plans that 3 would be considered Cadillac plans. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: And we have to assume that 5 we do not fall in that category? 6 MR. LOONEY: We don't fall in it -- 7 MS. HYDE: Yet. 8 MR. LOONEY: -- yet. You know, the minimum program 9 right now, actuarial, it says that your benefit plan must pay 10 60 percent of the expenses and charges incurred by the 11 individual. At least 60 percent. Our plan is in the 82, 85 12 percent range, and depending on the HRA methodology, it can 13 be in the 90 percent range. 14 MS. HYDE: But they are also looking at for 2011, 15 changing the H.R.A. status like they have the H.S.A. and the 16 F.S.A., so that the H.R.A. would be taxable. It'll be 17 included, and it'll be taxable. In addition, of course, as 18 everyone is well aware, we've been talking about it for the 19 last couple of months, in 2011 we have to put -- we'll put it 20 on the employees' checks, as well as their W-2's, how much -- 21 how much insurance -- 22 MR. LOONEY: The value. 23 MS. HYDE: How much is the value of the insurance 24 on everyone's W-2's. Typically, the I.R.S. doesn't force 25 that unless they're going to tax it at some point. 7-6-10 bwk 27 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The way I read that, it was 2 going to start being taxed in 2011. 3 MS. HYDE: They haven't made that determination. 4 It will probably be -- 5 MR. LOONEY: Depends on which tax you're talking 6 about. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We're supposed to report that 8 this year on W-2's so that they can take it in '11, from what 9 I read. 10 MS. HARGIS: 2012. 11 MR. LOONEY: They haven't said they're going to tax 12 it. What they've said at this point is for informational 13 purposes only. And the reason that they want that is that, 14 according to what we read and hear -- 15 MS. HYDE: They want to know who has insurance. 16 MR. LOONEY: So that when the time comes for an 17 employer to be required to provide us that, they will be able 18 to look at a W-2 to see, in fact, if there was an expense by 19 the employer to that individual. That's what we're being 20 told. 21 MS. HYDE: But to add to what you were saying, if 22 you look at this one, it tells you what the projected tax 23 hikes are. They're looking at the 10 percent bracket raises 24 to an expanded 15, 25 to 28, 28 to 31, 33 1/3 to 36, and 35 25 to 39.6, so basically 40 cent on every dollar. I mean, 7-6-10 bwk 28 1 that's a large increase for taxes. And as far as I know, 2 they still have not said anything about continuing the 2001 3 and 2003 tax cuts. 4 MR. LOONEY: Those are going to go away. 5 MS. HYDE: I mean, they only have a month or so. 6 MR. LOONEY: A new 3.8 percent excise tax is going 7 to be charged for personal income tax for, for lack of better 8 terminology, excess profit. A lot of the tax involved, the 9 Medicare tax is going to increase for individuals over a 10 certain earning level. Medicare premiums are increasing. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there any good news? 12 MR. LOONEY: I started to wear black. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's what I was fixing to 14 say. 15 MR. LOONEY: I've got a shirt that's got a target 16 on it; I started to wear that. Believe me, the messenger 17 service nowadays is not very good, not very positive. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, we're just going to have 19 to do the best -- you're going to give us the best 20 projections you can, and the best cost estimate, and we got 21 to figure out some way to pay for it. 22 (Mr. Looney nodded.) 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Bottom line. 24 MR. LOONEY: That's pretty much it. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 'Cause we really -- you know, 7-6-10 bwk 29 1 I don't think that anybody wants to cut any benefits that we 2 presently give employees -- provide them. I don't think that 3 that would be right, because they're going to get hit down 4 the road with some costs that they haven't had before, even 5 if it's not in health care. 6 MR. LOONEY: But some of the major corporations 7 have done evaluations of the health care costs in 8 relationship to potential penalties that they would pay by 9 not offering it, and the reduction in their expense is 10 substantial. Because many of them were paying -- one of them 11 that I saw was -- they're paying roughly $3.8 million a year 12 -- no, I'm sorry, $3.8 billion a year. And it will reduce 13 back to -- 14 MS. HYDE: AT&T. 15 MR. LOONEY: -- $6 million if they were just to pay 16 the penalty taxes. 17 MS. HYDE: If you have the web, I mean, it's great. 18 Look up AT&T. It's a small Power Point presentation with 19 music, and they're telling the employees and showing the 20 employees. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Telling them what? 22 MS. HYDE: They're telling and showing the 23 employees -- that's what he's talking about, is AT&T. What's 24 cheaper? Pay the penalties or have insurance? 25 MR. LOONEY: So, some of the -- some of the 7-6-10 bwk 30 1 concepts that Eva's giving you as far as premium charges are 2 concerned, it's financing. You know, it's trying to figure 3 the best way to make those dollars work out overall in the 4 budget. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What else? 6 MS. HYDE: Hopefully, that's it. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That's enough to digest for 8 one setting. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I've got indigestion. 10 MR. LOONEY: I actually have two and a half more 11 hours, but if -- 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Commissioner Letz, you have 13 an agenda item. Would you like for us to take that up at 14 this time? Or -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Certainly. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: You would? Okay. The budget 17 workshop is now in recess, and we'll open the Commissioners 18 Court for one agenda item. 19 (The open session was closed at 10:37 a.m., and a Commissioners Court special meeting was held, the 20 transcript of which is contained in a separate document.) 21 - - - - - - - - - - 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We'll now open up the 23 workshop again at 1:38.3335. And let's go to modification to 24 position schedule. Is that Ms. Hyde as well? Want us to 25 come back to you sometime? Or -- 7-6-10 bwk 31 1 MS. HYDE: Modifications to the position 2 schedule -- 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, ma'am. 4 MS. HYDE: -- are fairly short. Road and Bridge, 5 maintain the certified mechanic position as a permanent. 6 Road and Bridge, one merit increase of 2.5 for the -- the 7 employee receiving the political subdivision license for 8 pesticide. The employee will increase our personnel to order 9 and dispense chemicals. County Attorney, reclassification of 10 a position from a 15.9 to a 17.5, no increase in dollars. 11 County Clerk, reduction of one full-time position. 12 Courthouse, review request regarding three elected officials' 13 chief deputies increasing to Grade 23 after completion of all 14 education certifications, including documentation of their 15 ability to perform the official statutory duties, not to 16 exceed a 2.5 percent increase or no more than a four-grade 17 increase as outlined by the Court regarding promotions 18 practice on the policy. Each of the offices have more than 19 five personnel, and we have not changed any position 20 schedules or given anything on that. 21 Maintenance, review request for an additional 22 position of housekeeping maintenance at a Grade 14. 23 Maintenance, review request for promotion of employee to lead 24 employee from Grade 14.4 to Grade 15.5, which is a 5 percent 25 increase. Maintenance, request -- review request to add 7-6-10 bwk 32 1 part-time temporary position for 500 hours, which will be 2 five grand. J.P. 2, one 2.5 percent increase per elected 3 official request. Employee has not received any other 4 discretional increases from her employer. Employee became 5 the first court clerk certified by the State for J.P.'s. Tax 6 Assessor/Collector, a 2.5 percent increase for two employees 7 who have completed certification for R.T.C., completed over 8 137 hours of classes and passed all final exams. District 9 Clerk, review request for additional dollars and part-time 10 line items from 10,000 to 18,000 to allow for a permanent 11 part-time position, not full-time. 12 Sheriff, request for one more additional deputy, 13 budgeted at 21.5-5 for master peace officer; increases the 14 total deputies from 16 to 17. Request from Sheriff, request 15 for one 5 percent merit increase due to additional job 16 responsibilities and becoming dispatch supervisor over 10 17 dispatchers. Sheriff, educational increases in the S.O. and 18 jail; that's 6 to 10, approximately. We're requesting to 19 have a line item just for educational increases instead of 20 trying to put them on people, because right now, if you say 21 that Eva's going to get one, she may or may not, depending on 22 whether she does the education. But there might be somebody 23 else that goes through something and they go and get their 24 education, so we're moving money around. Human Resources, 25 review and discuss a request for part-time position to change 7-6-10 bwk 33 1 to full-time and increase from Grade 17 to Grade 22. Request 2 based upon the retirement of current employee during the 3 2010-2011 budget year. If retirement date is changed, 4 request is removed. And that's it. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Do you have a copy of that 6 for us? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Copy of that for us, ma'am, 8 please? Any discussion at the table on whatever she said? 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Not yet. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Let's look at that a little 12 closer, see what the impact is. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is the next one yours too? 14 MS. HYDE: No, sir. I don't have anything to do 15 with the loans or the bonds. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Proposed county capital 17 expenditures. Is that yours, Mrs. Auditor? 18 MS. HARGIS: I really don't know why this one was 19 on here. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We can go right by it. 21 MS. HARGIS: Except for -- I think it entails 22 perhaps the -- there aren't any capital expenditures in the 23 budget today; however, there have been, as I think three of 24 you are aware of -- well, I think all four of you are aware 25 that there have been requests from three constables for 7-6-10 bwk 34 1 vehicles. 2 (Judge Tinley joined the meeting.) 3 MS. HARGIS: And we do have enough money in the 4 savings that we had from the radios and -- well, actually, 5 all the radios, and then the air-conditioners, is to afford 6 those three out of the capital -- the 2010 bond issue that we 7 have. So, if y'all want to consider those, we have an 8 approximate cost on those; I think it's 22,9 on the vehicles. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I thought it was 22,340. 10 MS. HARGIS: Was it 22,340? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 22,340 is what I had. Of 12 course, I could be wrong. 13 MS. HARGIS: We added a heavier engine. We had to 14 add a heavier engine and a coolant to them. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 16 MS. HARGIS: Those are Expeditions. They had asked 17 for Tahoes, but we have been able to acquire a bid for 18 Expeditions; it's quite reasonable, so that's up to the Court 19 as to whether or not you want to give those. That's the only 20 capital that -- that has -- that I know of right now, unless 21 somebody's got one that they haven't brought to us. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. All right, thank you. 23 (Discussion off the record.) 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: See where we are, Judge? 25 Welcome home. 7-6-10 bwk 35 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So nice to see you. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I understand we're just talking 4 about capital expenditures? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Cost of -- anything further 7 on the capital? Cost-of-living considerations. Ms. Hyde? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If she doesn't respond, just 9 go right on by her. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 11 MS. HYDE: Oh, I'm sorry. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Do we have hearing aids in the 13 wellness program? (Laughter.) 14 MR. LOONEY: Hundred percent, Judge. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: How about understanding aids? Do we 16 have any of those? I have a need for some of those. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Some of us do. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 19 MS. HYDE: COLA's as of June 17 included numbers as 20 of May. June's index should be available by July 19th. The 21 index doesn't rise each month, so I'll continue updating the 22 Court just like I have been for the last five months. Right 23 now the COLA, if we did it today, it would be 2.56 percent. 24 The way that the trend is going out, if you look at the trend 25 and you look at the graph, it continues to rise. So, August 7-6-10 bwk 36 1 to August is typically when we do our final, so the trend is 2 approximately a 3 percent increase. Based upon the 9 -- .9 3 percent proposed increase in the Medicare tax reform -- and I 4 hope that I did this correctly and it's not looked at 5 derogatorily, but Obama has cost increases to employer health 6 care benefit plans of approximately 3 percent COLA. I'm 7 requesting the Court to consider a total of a 5 percent 8 increase across the board for employees. To help decrease 9 the cost of this across-the-board increase, please consider 10 the following changes: Of the $750,000 that we need, we have 11 found savings of $550,000. However, comma, the information 12 that I've been giving you, the increased taxes, the increased 13 cost, everything that we've done for our employees during the 14 last four years is going to be pretty close to a moot point. 15 So, you asked. That's where I'm at. 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You weren't looking for a 17 yes or no today, were you? 18 MS. HYDE: Oh, no, sir. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: No. We're just getting some things 20 out on the table. 21 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What -- what are the $500,000 23 in savings that you identified? What are those? 24 MS. HYDE: $500,000, you got employees, spouse, and 25 dependent coverage cost, if we do the dependent coverage cost 7-6-10 bwk 37 1 at the medium range. The other two -- one, I think, is going 2 to be trying to price people out of insurance. And we can't 3 do that, by the way; we can't be discriminatory. So, between 4 $202,000 and $210,000. Increasing retiree/spouse coverage 5 from $200 to full cost is another 28,000. It's on the last 6 page of what I gave you, sir. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 8 MS. HYDE: Increasing the retiree coverage from 200 9 to 300 is another 31,000, and decreasing the sick day 10 accruals down to six, that's 288,000 to $300,000. There's 11 the 550: Boy, it got quiet. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Any member of the Court have 13 anything to offer on that? Have we already -- have we 14 already taken up the 198th court? 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: We did that one, okay. The next one 17 is Animal Control. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah? 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is not on here, but at our 21 next meeting, can we have on here an update from the revenue 22 side? I mean, we don't have it on this sheet. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: We can have it on this one if it's 24 available. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It just seems that when we're 7-6-10 bwk 38 1 talking about the big picture before we go into 2 departments -- my brain's kind of on the big picture, if we 3 have an idea where we are revenue-wise so I can start really 4 making notes. 5 MS. HARGIS: I can pull the spreadsheet that I did 6 for Bruce; it was only a couple weeks ago. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I didn't bring it. 8 MS. HARGIS: I've got it. I'll print it. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I left it at home, but the 10 revenue side is -- looks like there is some positive from 11 property tax in the value; valuations have increased some. 12 There will be some additional revenue there. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: 2.6 percent. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I didn't think it was going 15 to happen. And then I think there's another area or two 16 where there may be some money come in that we hadn't 17 expected. But -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, our revenues -- 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Revenues are going to be a 20 little bit better. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Up slightly. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They revalued the river in 23 the Hunt area. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me guess. You heard about it? 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, I haven't, but I'm sure 7-6-10 bwk 39 1 that some of them haven't opened their appraisals, or -- 2 that, or they're frozen; they don't care what the valuation 3 went to. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Compared to where they live -- 5 maybe it's not their primary residence. Maybe it's not that 6 substantial. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Maybe not. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's what I know about it. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, Ms. Whitt. 11 MS. WHITT: Well, there's not a whole lot of 12 changes on mine. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I made some adjustments, and 14 primarily those are based upon trying to amortize on an 15 annual basis what your costs have been running. 16 MS. WHITT: Right. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Or where -- in the case where you 18 may have used very little, or in some cases -- I'm not 19 necessarily talking about your budget, but somewhere they had 20 an amount budgeted and nothing was used, I scaled that back, 21 because it's not needed. We don't want to plug it in. 22 MS. WHITT: I think everything's okay, with the 23 exception of the telephone. After talking to John and 24 figuring up -- being on the new system, and the three current 25 cell phones that we have, you suggested 750. 7-6-10 bwk 40 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 2 MS. WHITT: It would be approximately 850, after 3 talking to John. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. And that's primarily because 5 of the cell phones, I guess, isn't it? 6 MS. WHITT: Correct. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. So, we're going to go 8 with 850. That's still a pretty nice little savings. A lot 9 of folks, I understand, didn't -- they don't know what kind 10 of savings we're going to have with this new system, and 11 we're going to have to figure that out. But -- 12 MS. WHITT: Overall, my budget has actually gone 13 down, so -- due to that. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 15 MS. WHITT: And that's it. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? 17 MS. WHITT: No, sir. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Anybody on the Court have anything 19 that they'd like to offer with respect to the Animal Control? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Moving right along. 23 MS. WHITT: Thank you. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Juvenile Detention Facility. Way 25 towards the end, aren't you? 7-6-10 bwk 41 1 MS. MABRY: 76. 2 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's the number? 3 MS. MABRY: 76. 4 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's the number? 5 MR. STANTON: 76. 6 MS. MABRY: 76-572, should be. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Everybody there yet? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think I found it. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What's the number, Judge? 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Fund 76-572, way towards the end. I 11 made a pretty good reduction in property and liability 12 insurance. That's based upon -- based upon the utilization 13 to this point. Hopefully you don't have two big policies 14 that come due between now and October 1 that are going to 15 chew up all that $21,000. 16 MR. STANTON: Last year we had money left over in 17 that budget line item, so -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 19 MR. STANTON: -- I'm assuming -- 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I'm looking at -- you only 21 spent 9,800. 22 MR. STANTON: Yes, sir. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: And generally that coverage remains 24 pretty consistent. The other reduction I did was in your 25 food budget, here again, for a couple reasons. Number one, 7-6-10 bwk 42 1 your -- your census is down this year from last year. 2 MR. STANTON: It's about -- 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Generally. 4 MR. STANTON: -- 12 percent as far as juveniles 5 goes. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: And then I amortized your -- your 7 year-to-date. 8 MR. STANTON: Right. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: And that's how I came up -- not much 10 of a reduction. $2,000, 25 to 23. 11 MR. STANTON: Yes, sir. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Do you think the 23 is workable? 13 MR. STANTON: Yes, sir. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any other issues you've got, 15 Kevin? 16 MR. STANTON: No, sir. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Any member of the Court have any 18 questions or concerns about where we are on that one? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No, sir. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Appreciate it, Kevin. 21 MR. STANTON: No problem, sir. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Facilities and Maintenance. We got 23 a bunch of those. 24 MS. MABRY: First one is 10-510. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What? 7-6-10 bwk 43 1 MS. MABRY: 10-510. 2 MR. BOLLIER: 510, sir. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 4 MR. BOLLIER: And then 511 and 513 and 666. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let me see what I did here. 6 First one I made an adjustment was uniforms. 7 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: That was based upon the historical 9 use. Plus looking back, prior year was 5,500. So, between 10 that and amortizing your year-to-date actual, I dropped that 11 to 6,000. 12 MR. BOLLIER: Next one was 510 -- 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Pardon? 14 MR. BOLLIER: The next one you dropped down was 15 350, supplies. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Is the 6,000 unrealistic, Tim? 17 MR. BOLLIER: For uniforms? 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 19 MR. BOLLIER: I think uniforms were $7,100 total at 20 the end of the year, is what I think. I'll have to go look 21 at the numbers, sir. I did not look at the numbers, but I do 22 believe that 7,100 for last year for uniforms for all the 23 guys at the ag -- that's everybody. That's everybody but 24 Maria, 'cause Maria doesn't wear a uniform. So, that's eight 25 of us. 7-6-10 bwk 44 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I'm thinking that maybe we've 2 got some -- we consolidated some of those maintenance 3 accounts. 4 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: And, for example, jail maintenance, 6 that zeroed out. What was the other one? 7 MR. BOLLIER: You've got supplies, 510. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: No, no. No, the other -- the other 9 budget that you you've got. 10 MR. BOLLIER: Oh, 666. We had uniforms, but we -- 11 in the jail, which was 511, we had uniforms in 666, and we 12 also had uniforms in 510, and we put them all last year into 13 510, I believe. Or I thought we did. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, we sure did. 15 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So maybe -- maybe what I've 17 done here, because of the consolidation, we need to get back 18 to where you were. 19 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: If, in fact, you're taking them all 21 out of there. 22 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. That's why I had put -- I 23 just kind of went to 8,000 instead of 75. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 25 MR. BOLLIER: And then if -- 7-6-10 bwk 45 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, you've also -- 2 MR. BOLLIER: -- if we add the other maintenance 3 personnel, then it'll go up. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. Okay, so let's restore that 5 to eight. Supplies. 6 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. We had went up -- in the 7 supplies, according -- let me make sure -- well, see, I don't 8 understand something, Judge. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 MR. BOLLIER: If I look at 511, you went from -- 11 unless you -- you know, you're putting it together, you went 12 from $8,000 in 511 to 40,000 in custodian supplies. I don't 13 understand that. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: 4,000, not 40,000. 15 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. Well, I got -- no, I got 16 40,000. 17 MS. HARGIS: It printed out as 40. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Did it? 19 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: I meant to cut it back to 4,000. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Take it, Tim. Take it. 22 MR. BOLLIER: I cannot -- I'll take it and leave, 23 sir. That's good. (Laughter.) 24 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Man's got a lot to learn about 25 budgets. 7-6-10 bwk 46 1 JUDGE TINLEY: He got 40,000 in there. You got a 2 lot of float to run all over the map. 3 MR. BOLLIER: That's got a lot of cleaning, Judge. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: I know. I pulled that by 5 annualizing your 12,6 that you used year-to-date. That's how 6 I got that, -- 7 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: -- obviously. 9 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. I mean, we had -- I see here 10 where we had 25, and we went to -- and I had just put 28 in 11 there. I was thinking about the jail, extra jail stuff over 12 there, you know, paper and stuff like that. But I'd also 13 kind of added a little bit in 511. 'Cause -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, we got the new building we got 15 to add on too, don't we? 16 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. Yes, sir, we have that. 17 Nothing out there, just that new building. And I believe 18 there's five separate bathrooms in there for toilet paper and 19 stuff like that, I believe. So that's why I kind of went -- 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Why don't we pull that up to 25? 21 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, I can do that. 22 MS. HARGIS: Which line item are you on? 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Supplies. 24 MR. BOLLIER: 350. 510-350. 25 MS. HARGIS: 510? 7-6-10 bwk 47 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 510. 2 MR. BOLLIER: 510-350. And then the -- the only 3 other one I see there, Judge, where you cut it was 569, in 4 operating equipment. I would like to see at least 1,500 in 5 there, Judge. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is the 350 up there? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: How many cell phones you got? 8 MR. BOLLIER: Nine. Telephone -- 9 MS. MABRY: Yes, the 350's up there. 10 MR. BOLLIER: Yeah, there's nine total, sir. Then 11 you got 1,500 on there. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: You'll get a crick in your neck, 13 Buster. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Are you going to be able to operate 16 with the 1,500 on your cell phones? 17 MR. BOLLIER: Well, it was at 24, sir. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 19 MR. BOLLIER: I'm going to add one more. If we're 20 not going to give him a cell phone -- he'll be at the jail. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Land lines are not going to be any 22 appreciable expense, are they, Mr. Trolinger? 23 MR. TROLINGER: No, sir, they will not change for 24 that line item. They will not change for that line item. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm talking about the cost going 7-6-10 bwk 48 1 down as well, isn't it? 2 MR. TROLINGER: County-wide? 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm speaking specifically with 4 regard to his. 5 MR. TROLINGER: I haven't looked at this particular 6 line item. I don't know. I have to look at it for you, sir. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, why would you go down to 8 15? 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I'm looking at the 10 year-to-date, 867, and I'm equating that to -- actually, I 11 should equate it to nine months, since you pay in advance. 12 But -- but I'm still computing -- annualizing that on the 13 basis of eight months, and that's how I get there. 14 MS. HARGIS: You put 1,500 in there, operating 15 equipment? 16 MR. BOLLIER: No, we're at telephone, Jeannie. 17 MS. HARGIS: In 510? 18 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, ma'am. 19 MS. HARGIS: Y'all are skipping back between. 20 MR. BOLLIER: We're at 420, Jeannie. 21 MR. TROLINGER: Judge Tinley, the only thing on 22 that line item that will come off is the Ag Barn, once we 23 remove this phone line out there. But that -- that I'm not 24 sure, because we are providing public internet access on one 25 of those phone lines, and to turn that off would remove that 7-6-10 bwk 49 1 service. So, we want to go find a way to switch that over 2 first. That may or may not happen by September 30th. 3 MS. HARGIS: I think 1,500 is enough, because 4 what's happened there is he's being charged for less phones 5 now when we redid the phone service, so he's only being 6 charged for the phones he's got, so he's only paid out 867. 7 He's only got three more months to go; 1,500 is more than 8 enough. 9 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, ma'am. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Leasehold improvements. 11 MR. BOLLIER: Sir? 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Leasehold improvements, line 470. 13 What in the world -- did you just bring the 1,500 over 'cause 14 that's what you had in the current budget? 15 MR. BOLLIER: I guess I did, sir. I don't even 16 know what that is, to tell you the truth. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Actually, probably ought to go to 18 zero instead of 500. 19 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. I don't use it. I do not 20 use that line item, sir, unless it's there for somebody else. 21 MS. HARGIS: Do you have a copy machine? 22 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, I do. But it's not leased. 23 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This is really fun. This 25 whole exercise is a lot of -- I mean, I am having a ball. 7-6-10 bwk 50 1 However, all I see is the number -- the budget amount. Is 2 that number that y'all are talking to -- I don't have idea 3 where we came from, where we've been, how much the Judge has 4 taken out. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I can do that. I can -- 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I mean, it should reflect 7 here, though, where I can -- where we can -- 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We had this same problem last 9 year. 10 MS. HARGIS: Remember, what I had y'all pull up was 11 the report. Let's pull up the report. If all of you will 12 follow, and -- 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I pulled up the report, 14 Jeannie, but I don't have the year-to-date the Judge is 15 talking about. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: And you want the historic? 17 MS. HARGIS: You're in the actual budget. So, let 18 me fix Buster's, and then I'll fix the rest of them. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Did you pull the leasehold down to 21 zero, Tess? 22 MS. MABRY: Yes. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Maybe if you'll go to general 25 ledger and reports -- 7-6-10 bwk 51 1 MS. HARGIS: Go to report -- go to report 2 generator. Go to budget reports. Go to Administrative 3 Recommended. And you just -- we're in 10, so you just want 4 to go to 10. I'm going to change the date; you don't have 5 to. And then you have to pick -- you have to pick A.R. 6 budget here. Invalid report period? Why is it invalid 7 report period? Shoot. 8 (Discussion off the record.) 9 MS. HARGIS: It's giving me an invalid report; I 10 don't understand. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll go with report; this is 12 where I was earlier. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Why don't we go off the record until 14 we get all this sorted out, where we are. 15 (Discussion off the record.) 16 MS. HARGIS: We've resolved the technical 17 difficulties. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Everybody set? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're ready. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Everybody comfortable? The lights 21 come on? 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What does that mean? 23 JUDGE TINLEY: You're looking at Buster, thinking 24 there's got to be something better than this. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The light wasn't even 7-6-10 bwk 52 1 flickering. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, why don't we come back to 3 order. Tim, we were -- 4 MR. BOLLIER: We were on 470, sir. That just needs 5 to be zero, because all of my -- my copy machines and stuff 6 belong to the county. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Come on down to line 569. 8 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Take that down to 1,000. 10 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Unless you got something specific in 12 mind, you haven't spent anything out of what you got there 13 now. 14 MR. BOLLIER: Well, we -- I thought we did. 15 Jeannie, didn't we use that for something? We did not? It's 16 still all there? Okay. That's fine, sir. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. And then the last one, your 18 capital, looks like you just brought that one over. 19 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. That should be zero, sir. 20 That should be zero. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: That's what I got it at. 22 MR. BOLLIER: Because there's nothing -- we have 23 nothing in there. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 25 MR. BOLLIER: Then 511 is next, sir. 7-6-10 bwk 53 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 2 MR. BOLLIER: The jail. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hit the little arrows up 4 here. 5 MR. BOLLIER: You took -- are you there yet? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Waiting on you. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hey, don't get cute. 8 MR. BOLLIER: Oh, I'm not, sir. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: "Are y'all there yet?" 10 MR. BOLLIER: I'm just flipping pages, sir. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is it we're looking at? 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Jail maintenance. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 511. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What page is it on? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: 55. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Hmm? 17 JUDGE TINLEY: 55. See? I'm helping you out. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. Look at all this 19 information. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Overtime. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I feel like a part of the 22 deal now, don't you? 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Oh, yeah. 24 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. I would -- I don't think 25 500 is enough there for the jail. I just turned in a bunch 7-6-10 bwk 54 1 today on 112; 27 and 14, about 31 hours, 32 hours in there 2 that I turned in overtime today off that one line item. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, looking at what you've done so 4 far, it -- are you just now starting to use it? 5 MR. BOLLIER: Well, I -- I've used it out of -- 6 JUDGE TINLEY: You may have another body next year, 7 too. 8 MR. BOLLIER: Yeah. Sir, I thought I had -- I had 9 been using that all year long. I didn't even think -- I 10 don't -- I'm not even for sure there's even any left in 11 there. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, unless you've spent it all 13 since June 30th -- 14 MR. BOLLIER: Well, I don't think so. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You charge to it Rusty's 16 account? 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Probably did. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There you go. Jail 19 maintenance; it ought to go to jail -- Rusty's. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's the way I look at it. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Give me my own maintenance 22 division, then. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Come out of his gas line 24 item. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Tell me where we are on that 7-6-10 bwk 55 1 overtime then, Tim. 2 MR. BOLLIER: We -- we can cut it, sir. But I just 3 think we need more in there than 500. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: 1,000? 5 MR. BOLLIER: Let's go to 1,000, sir. And then if 6 we're through there, 350 was the next one, sir. You said 7 that was supposed to be 4,000 instead of 40? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm showing 4,000. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm showing four. Maybe I 10 just changed it. 11 MR. BOLLIER: Just must have printed wrong. 12 MS. HARGIS: She just changed it. 13 MS. MABRY: It was 40, but I did change it just -- 14 just a little while ago. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. 16 MS. HYDE: Makes a big difference. 17 MS. MABRY: We talked about it this morning. We 18 figured that was an error, so we -- we discussed it. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, normally when I plug in those 20 changes, I try to make a habit of looking to make -- 'cause 21 there was a time or two where it was too long or too short. 22 Okay. On your jail repairs -- 23 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. That's been pretty -- 24 that's been -- that's down quite a bit, sir. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are those repairs in the past 7-6-10 bwk 56 1 largely the air-conditioners? Have the -- 2 MR. BOLLIER: A lot of it, sir. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's been taken care of. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's going to be -- yeah. 5 MR. BOLLIER: We're fixing to replace -- 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This budget year. 7 MR. BOLLIER: We're fixing to replace the -- 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Second half. 9 MR. BOLLIER: -- the other nine up there as soon 10 as -- I think we got it on the next -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 12 MR. BOLLIER: -- budget meeting on the 20th, I 13 believe, to -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, the new bids will come in. 15 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: But that's the balance of the 17 air-conditioners, so they'll be all new units up there. 18 MR. BOLLIER: Every one of them. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You put a new boiler in, right? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: No. 21 MR. BOLLIER: Not yet. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Didn't something blow up out 23 there this year? 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Electrical deal blew up, but 25 that didn't cost the County. The boiler has not been 7-6-10 bwk 57 1 replaced as yet, and that will have to be at some point, 2 there's no doubt. I won't say -- you know looking at it, we 3 very well may make it through next year. I can't say that 4 we'll have to do it next year, but it is, you know -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's the cost on that item? 6 Have any idea? 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I can't tell. I had Tim get 8 them out there to look at it. They weren't sure how they 9 were -- 10 MR. BOLLIER: They weren't sure. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is the one, because of the 12 walls, you can't get to it? 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You have to cut it out from 14 one end, and they would -- I don't think they would ever give 15 him an estimate on replacing it. Because the one that's in 16 there they don't make any more, at all. It would have to 17 redesign some stuff to put one in there. And they didn't -- 18 MR. BOLLIER: They would never give me a total 19 price. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there any other big repairs 21 pending out there that we're aware of? 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No. Only thing that we are 23 having more and more issues with are door motors and some -- 24 the welds on some of the doors, things like that. We're 25 getting, you know, more of that mechanical type -- a lot of 7-6-10 bwk 58 1 the -- the plumbing stuff they've gotten taken care of over 2 the years. This whole -- the biggest major ones for years 3 has been air-conditioners. This will take care of most of 4 that, but we will have, I'm sure, some motors burning out, 5 things like that on those doors there, just starting, and 6 they're all the same. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This can be reduced somewhat. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 9 MR. BOLLIER: We're replacing motors. 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah, some. It's just 11 gradually with those door motors. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: How much notice can you have 13 on the boiler before it goes out, just quits? 14 MR. BOLLIER: None. When it goes, it goes. It's 15 over with. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah. And, see, that whole 17 system is different, because it's a circulating heated water 18 system. It doesn't heat water and then cut off. Any time 19 you push a button, you get hot water in a matter of, you 20 know, 10 seconds because of those showers. They're all 21 push-button deal that does -- it's not like they can wait 22 four months. So, you're -- when it goes, it's going to go 23 and it's going to have to be replaced at that point. 24 MR. BOLLIER: Everybody's going to get cold showers 25 for a while. 7-6-10 bwk 59 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Real cold. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The 55 you can live with, Tim? 3 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, I can live with it, sir. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to major repairs. 5 MR. BOLLIER: I don't think we've done anything 6 there. I think we can reduce that. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go back to your jail repairs. 8 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Can we do some lower than that? I'm 10 hearing some suggestion that maybe we can go for less. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 40? 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You got 29 the other day. 13 MR. BOLLIER: We're up to 29 up to date right now. 14 29,301. I don't -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think, granted, if the boiler 16 goes out, it's an emergency; we have to fix it. But, you 17 know, you -- 18 MR. BOLLIER: That's not going to be a cheap issue. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, but you don't budget -- 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You can't budget -- 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- emergencies. You budget for 22 what you think is going to break. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Over half your 29 this year 24 has probably been them air-conditioners. 25 MR. BOLLIER: Most of it. 7-6-10 bwk 60 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd say 30 or 40. 2 MR. BOLLIER: And Whelan's Plumbing, too, because 3 of that. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd give it 30 or 40. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's take that down to 40. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, I think 40 is a good 7 number. 8 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Then come on down to major 10 repairs. Now, I don't know why you got two different ones 11 there, but you haven't done anything out of the five that you 12 have, so I pulled that down to two. 13 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. That's fine, sir. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why don't we just eliminate 15 that item? 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Major repairs and -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Jail repairs. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Jail repairs. 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Six of one, half a dozen of 20 the other. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Unless -- if you have a line 22 there, you need to have something specific to go in it, I 23 would think. How would you -- unless you know you're going 24 to have a major repair, how do you budget for it? 25 MS. HARGIS: Let's take it to zero. 7-6-10 bwk 61 1 MR. BOLLIER: I've been doing this for six years, 2 and I've never touched that. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Take it out? 4 MR. BOLLIER: I never use that line item. We're 5 taking it to zero? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Sure are. 7 MR. BOLLIER: Man, I'm saving y'all. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You got a problem? 9 MR. BOLLIER: No, sir. I like that, sir. I'm 10 filling my pocket. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, it's coming out of your 12 pocket. You may be filling it with something else, but -- 13 JUDGE TINLEY: If you smell something, maybe you 14 figured out what it is. 15 MR. BOLLIER: Yeah. When we get to the Sheriff's 16 budget, it will go -- he'll suck it back. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Blame it on the Sheriff. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, what's the next one? 19 MR. BOLLIER: 513, sir. 20 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 513. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Page 62. 22 MR. BOLLIER: Overtime. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What page is it? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 62. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's nice to be able to see 7-6-10 bwk 62 1 some numbers, Buster. We can participate now. 2 (Discussion off the record.) 3 MR. BOLLIER: What's in -- I had 2,000, and he cut 4 it to 500. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 62? 6 MR. BOLLIER: 10-513 sir, 112. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: What page number? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 62 on mine. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Page 62. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is -- let's see. So he 11 requested a certain amount for salaries, and you recommended 12 more, Judge? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Hmm? No, I didn't mess with that. 14 I didn't mess with any of the salaries, 'cause that's all 15 position schedule, and you've got some longevity, you got 16 some -- all that education. All that stuff comes into play. 17 MS. HYDE: That has not come into play. 18 MS. MABRY: Any increase that was in there was put 19 in there -- we had that half-year increase last time starting 20 April, and projecting that on a whole year would be any 21 increase that was in there. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. You didn't use any of your 23 overtime in that one. That's the reason I cut it to 500 24 there. 25 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. I'm just -- I just want to 7-6-10 bwk 63 1 make sure we don't cut ourselves short when it comes to Stock 2 Show and fair time. And the main -- the main places that we 3 use overtime is the jail, anyway. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Any excess we need to charge to the 5 jail, don't we? 6 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. That's why -- I'm sitting 7 here thinking. I'm going, you know, that's probably my -- my 8 fault, I haven't been taking it out of there. I've been 9 taking it out of probably 666. That's what I'm thinking. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just want to make sure -- we 11 don't need too many piles. 12 MR. BOLLIER: No, that's what I'm saying. We just 13 need a little pile in the jail and a little pile at the Ag 14 Barn. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, that gives you a little where 16 you haven't used any so far this year out of that one. 17 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Come on down to fuel, oil, and 19 maintenance. 20 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: I reduced that based upon looking at 22 your historical use, and also annualizing your year-to-date. 23 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. We don't use a lot of -- we 24 don't use a lot of fuel, 'cause we're mainly just in town. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Coming down -- 7-6-10 bwk 64 1 MS. HARGIS: Got a lot of trucks, though. We got 2 another truck coming in on his -- on his fleet, though. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I think we can work it in there. 4 MS. HARGIS: Four should be enough. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Trash service. If I annualize -- 6 and that's something that occurs on a monthly basis? 7 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: If I annualize that one, I don't see 9 how you get there. 10 MR. BOLLIER: Well, we had -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: I come out to 2,600. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Only thing -- well, most of 13 mine's in my budget, but then you have to look at it -- 14 you've got that other stuff where either it's hazardous type 15 waste, or if it's leaves and things like that, that's a whole 16 separate deal that comes in about every four or every six 17 months. 18 MR. BOLLIER: It's -- 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's not part of the regular 20 trash service. I don't know if he has anything. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What's it being paid out of? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: What's that? 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What he's saying about the 24 hazardous waste and stuff coming under a different -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He said it still comes out of 7-6-10 bwk 65 1 trash service. Just wouldn't come out monthly. 2 MR. BOLLIER: Trash service is, too, when we haul 3 stuff off, like trash when we clean up, we go out to the 4 dump. I also take that out of there too. And when I do 5 things at the jail, it also comes out of there too. Any -- 6 it comes out of 666. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Nothing out of the jail. 8 You're going to have to cut that jail budget back. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I have my own trash service. 10 But I think what a lot of that is is when Maintenance or B.J. 11 -- they haul limbs and other trash to the dump also, and they 12 have to pay that rate at the dump that they, I guess, charge. 13 (Discussion off the record.) 14 MS. HARGIS: We had 29 last year, Judge. I would 15 think 3,000 would be a better number. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Can you live with three, Tim? 17 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. Yes, sir. If I'm only -- 18 if I'm only at 24, whatever it is. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You ought to make it on 20 three. 21 MR. BOLLIER: Yeah -- yes, sir. And equipment -- 22 the next one should be equipment repair. I believe you gave 23 me 1,000 in there. I had it at 3,000. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Year-to-date's 80. 7-6-10 bwk 66 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If you're buying all new 2 lawnmowers and trimmers -- 3 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, but you got to remember, 4 too, I've also got to buy teeth. I've also got to buy shanks 5 for my tractors, for my implements. I've also got to buy -- 6 let me see, new belts. I've also got to buy plugs, sometimes 7 new blades. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You sure haven't spent much 9 year-to-date. 10 MR. BOLLIER: Sir? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You haven't spent much 12 year-to-date, the way I look at it. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: We can buy you a new file for those 14 blades. (Laughter.) 15 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. Okay, sir. 16 MS. HARGIS: Go to 60? 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's why I buy them by the 18 box. 19 MS. HARGIS: What are you going to go to? 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Leave it. 21 MS. HARGIS: Leave it. Let's go back up to 22 utilities. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Up to what? 24 MS. HARGIS: Utilities, one line item. 25 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 7-6-10 bwk 67 1 MS. HARGIS: He's already spent 651. He's going to 2 bust 770. That needs to be around 1,000, because he's got 3 three more months on that 651. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Are those utilities for your shop 5 back there? 6 MS. HARGIS: No, that's for the Ag Barn. 7 MR. BOLLIER: That's just for the Ag Barn. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why are they so low? 9 JUDGE TINLEY: It sure is. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's not the Ag Barn. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mm-hmm. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't know what utilities you're 14 paying out of there, but she's got a point. If you annualize 15 the 651 -- 16 MS. HARGIS: I think in the past, they had paid all 17 the utilities for his -- his operations out of this line 18 item, and we switched it and divided it up. The building -- 19 this building was in there, and now it's under 510 instead of 20 being here. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Line 340 goes to 1,000 and 22 annualizes at that. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Does that put us to building 24 repairs? 25 MS. HARGIS: Still leave it at 70? 7-6-10 bwk 68 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Utilities is to 1,000. 2 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 70,000 for building repairs? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The notes say it's a sign -- 6 repairing the front sign, water lines and electrical outlets, 7 mainly. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, if you annualize 9 spent-to-date, it comes out to almost 67,000. That's why I 10 didn't change that number. That gives him about a 5 percent 11 cushion. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Are we done with you? 14 MR. BOLLIER: Sir? 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Only other thing, Stanton was 16 mentioning he's got about 28,000 in repairs coming to the 17 J.D.C. for lock replacement, and if that's coming out of that 18 70 -- 19 MS. HARGIS: Not out of -- 20 MR. BOLLIER: Doesn't come out of parks. 21 MS. HARGIS: Doesn't come out of parks. We're in 22 parks. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. 24 MR. STANTON: He's already got it in his budget. 25 (Discussion off the record.) 7-6-10 bwk 69 1 MR. STANTON: $800 each. 2 MR. BOLLIER: Come on, Kevin. You got to help me 3 out here a little bit, buddy. 4 MR. STANTON: That's why I'm sitting here. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Remind him -- 6 MR. STANTON: That's why I'm sitting right here. 7 MR. BOLLIER: No, 513 is what -- I usually take 8 Kevin's stuff out of out there. Animal Control, the little 9 courthouse in Ingram, Center Point stuff, if I have to buy 10 anything, comes out of 513. 11 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 12 MR. BOLLIER: It's always come out of 513. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: 70,000? 14 MR. BOLLIER: Out of 513, yes, sir, because the 15 courthouse has its own budget. The jail has its own budget, 16 and the rest is coming out of 513, every bit of it. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, you have 70,000 for major 18 repairs, so you factored in that 10,000, sounds like. 19 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, I did. If y'all say I did, I'll 20 go along with it. It's only 10,000. 21 MS. PIEPER: I wish everybody was that agreeable. 22 MR. BOLLIER: I didn't know it was 10,000. I 23 forgot what we talked about. 24 MR. STANTON: $800 a lock. We got 12 locks. 25 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, there is, you're right. I'll 7-6-10 bwk 70 1 take the credit. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: You know, sometimes austerity -- 3 there's an incentive for austerity, and if you don't have the 4 money, sometimes it makes you a little bit more cautious. 5 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: And a little bit more prudent about 7 what you spend. So -- 8 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: It's nice to have a little cushion, 10 but we don't want there to be float. 11 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: No hidey-holes. 13 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: No float. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: I was looking at the Sheriff when I 16 said "hidey-holes." 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You took all my hidey-holes 18 away years ago, Judge. I think it was about the first year 19 you took office. 20 MR. BOLLIER: He's done a pretty good job today on 21 mine. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anything else on yours, Tim? 23 MR. BOLLIER: 666, sir. One more, then we're done. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which one? 25 MR. BOLLIER: 666, that's Ag Barn. I don't know -- 7-6-10 bwk 71 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Don't know yet. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's on 94. 3 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 94. 4 MR. BOLLIER: I'm not -- 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Got it. 6 MR. BOLLIER: On the -- I just now noticed it. On 7 the postage, sir, you went to 100. Jody's the one that told 8 me to go to 500, because of all the stuff that she -- that 9 she sends out. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, apparently she's been using 11 the Commissioners Court budget to do all of her postage with. 12 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: 'Cause she hasn't used much there, 14 44 bucks so far this year. 15 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. I thought that's what she told 16 me. I went on her word on that. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 18 MS. HARGIS: Judge, on trash pickup, did you mean 19 that to be 7,500 and you put 750 in? 20 MR. BOLLIER: I didn't do that. I had 6,800. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Trash pickup is 6,800. 22 MR. BOLLIER: You've got 750 there, sir. 23 MS. HARGIS: You've got 750. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: No, I got that on telephone. 25 MS. HARGIS: No, you got that on trash. 7-6-10 bwk 72 1 MR. BOLLIER: You got that on trash. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You may have wanted it on 3 telephone. 4 MS. HARGIS: May have thought you hit the phone, 5 but you didn't. 6 MR. BOLLIER: You got 3,000 down here on telephone, 7 sir. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let him think what he wants 9 to think. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Trash pickup, telephone. 11 MS. HARGIS: But in the system -- look in the 12 system. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me see what I've got here. I 14 may have put it on the wrong one. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Surely you haven't made a 16 mistake? 17 JUDGE TINLEY: No. That's -- that's inconceivable, 18 isn't it? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is. Somebody's gotten 20 into your computer. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Sure wouldn't have been me, 22 would it? Yep, that's exactly what happened. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. I knew it. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: We want 6,800 there. 25 MR. BOLLIER: Are we leaving the $6,800 at trash 7-6-10 bwk 73 1 pickup? 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 3 MR. BOLLIER: Okay, 68. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: On telephone is where I went to 750 5 on it. 6 MR. BOLLIER: So, telephone -- telephone, I think, 7 is three -- I see is 3,000, sir. 420 -- yeah 666-420. I see 8 $3,000. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. But I've got 750 there for 10 some reason. I think -- but I've also checked it off, so 11 that 750 is -- I don't know what I was doing when I did that. 12 That's the second one, Buster. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You made two mistakes in one 14 day? I still think somebody's getting into your computer. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, had to be if there's two of 16 them. I have no idea why I put that there. Supplies -- you 17 see what I did with your supplies? And do you understand 18 why? 19 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: New building. 20 MR. BOLLIER: It's cut from 12,000 to 4,500? 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 22 MR. BOLLIER: Well, I don't -- I don't understand 23 why, no, sir. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, because you've only spent 25 $2,375 so far this year, two-thirds of the year. 7-6-10 bwk 74 1 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. I can live with it. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: He got carried away with the 3 pencil on that one. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, he did. Come on down to 5 building and grounds maintenance. 6 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. You went to 22 there, sir. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: There again, based on the 13,150 8 that you spent so far. You annualize that, and it's 9 something under 22. 10 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: 19,7 and a quarter. That gives you 12 a little float there. 13 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 14 MS. HARGIS: Where? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Major repairs, down to 2,000. 16 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Here again, based on what you spent. 18 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. That should be it for me, 19 sir. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. You just want to get out of 21 here, don't you? 22 MR. BOLLIER: No, I'm fine. 23 (Discussion off the record.) 24 MR. BOLLIER: Wait a minute, sir. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah? 7-6-10 bwk 75 1 MR. BOLLIER: Wait a minute. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 3 MR. BOLLIER: I have 2,000 in there. The only time 4 I use that overtime -- see, every weekend I have overtime. 5 Every Saturday I have overtime. That's guaranteed almost 6 every Saturday, okay? And that's the reason I've always just 7 put $2,000 in there. A lot of times I use comp time in there 8 too, but when it's the stock show, when it comes to town, 9 that's where we eat up a lot of overtime. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Aren't you getting some compensation 11 from the -- 12 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: -- Stock Show Association? 14 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, I get a little bit for 15 that. Anything that's overtime, they pay for. On Friday 16 nights. That's the only time they pay that. 17 MS. HARGIS: But we still have to have a line item 18 for it, and then we have a revenue for it; it offsets it. 19 MR. BOLLIER: Yes. That's only time the stock show 20 pays, is Friday. 21 MS. HARGIS: If it's in the payroll system, it's 22 got to hit a line item. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: In other words, they pay the 24 County and we pay it out. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: It's not netted out as against this. 7-6-10 bwk 76 1 So what do we need, another 1,000 there? 2 MS. HARGIS: What did you have? 3 MR. BOLLIER: I have two. I would like to have -- 4 that would be plenty. Three would be plenty. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't want you to have plenty; I 6 want you to have just enough. (Laughter.) 7 MR. BOLLIER: It's probably a little bit shy, sir. 8 I -- that will be fine. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 2,250? 10 MR. BOLLIER: I could live with 2,500, if you want 11 to know the truth. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We'll turn this into an 14 auction in a little bit. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Okay. See, now that you're 16 in the loop, Buster, isn't this fun? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I tell you what, man, I'm 18 sweating. My palms are just sweating. Crazy. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Is that it for you, Tim? 20 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. Thank you. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I need a drink pretty bad. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We're to J.P.'s, 455. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What page, Judge? 25 JUDGE TINLEY: I'll get there. 7-6-10 bwk 77 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I'm going to get some 2 water. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did you say 455? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: 35. 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Which page? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: 35. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 35. 8 MS. HARGIS: And they should be right after each 9 other; 35, 36, 37, 38. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Where's David? 11 JUDGE WRIGHT: He went back to his office. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: He's working. 13 (Discussion off the record.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: There he is. 15 JUDGE BILLEITER: Thank you. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: You get some revenue in while you 17 were gone? 18 JUDGE BILLEITER: I'm sorry, what? 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Are you generating some 20 revenue? 21 JUDGE BILLEITER: You bet. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Productivity, that's what we're 23 looking for. 24 JUDGE BILLEITER: Productivity, that's right. I 25 didn't make any changes. I don't know whether you did or 7-6-10 bwk 78 1 not. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: I did. I did. Let's look at 3 postage. I brought that down to 1,100, based upon your 4 year-to-date actual, annualized that, and then plugged in a 5 float. 6 JUDGE BILLEITER: Okay. Office -- 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Office supplies, same thing. 8 JUDGE BILLEITER: Okay. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Telephone, a lot of that is because 10 of our new system. And I may be flying blind on some of 11 these. Is 250 on his -- you don't have any cell phones, do 12 you? 13 JUDGE BILLEITER: No. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 15 MR. TROLINGER: Last we heard from the Auditor was, 16 I believe, $4.56 per phone, per month. 17 JUDGE BILLEITER: Okay. So that ought to be 18 sufficient, then. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: And then I brought your conferences 20 down to -- 21 JUDGE BILLEITER: That's something -- I have two 22 conferences yet to attend this year. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Oh, yeah. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Should get it up pretty 25 close to budgeted. 7-6-10 bwk 79 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Looks to me like we bring it 2 back to where it was. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Sure does, doesn't it? 4 Excuse the ring. 5 MS. MABRY: What amount, David? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: 33, where it was. 7 JUDGE BILLEITER: Okay. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's it, I think. 10 JUDGE BILLEITER: What? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think that's it. 12 JUDGE BILLEITER: Is that it? 13 MS. HARGIS: Take it back up, Judge? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 15 MS. HARGIS: To 33? Is that enough? 16 JUDGE BILLEITER: I think so. I don't know 17 whether -- is Elsa's -- the last conference she went to, she 18 just got back from one. Has that been taken out? 19 MS. MABRY: It should already be in there. 20 JUDGE BILLEITER: Has that already been taken out? 21 MS. HARGIS: We're looking. 22 JUDGE BILLEITER: Okay. If that's all, I'm happy. 23 Thank you, Judge. 24 JUDGE WRIGHT: I really regret that this is the 25 last time I'm going to do this. 7-6-10 bwk 80 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, come on. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the least we can do is make it 3 memorable for you, right? 4 JUDGE WRIGHT: Do what? 5 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Anything you want? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: The least we can do is make it 7 memorable. 8 JUDGE WRIGHT: No, you don't need to do that. I do 9 have one question. On the conferences, I won't be using 10 them, but J.R. Hoyne will. His first class is in December. 11 I will still be in office, and he'll still be at the 12 Sheriff's Department, but he has to go to that school. That 13 will come out of my budget, right? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. And what I did was, I 15 increased that to 3,500, because I knew we had a new one 16 coming in office. I don't know whether that's an adequate 17 amount or not. 18 JUDGE WRIGHT: That should -- yes, it should be 19 more than enough. 20 JUDGE MITCHELL: I can remember the first year I 21 was in office. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: That's the reason I did that. 23 JUDGE WRIGHT: Other than that, removing the 24 capital outlay is all I've got. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Telephone, I pulled that one down to 7-6-10 bwk 81 1 750, because we're going to get that in the new system, and 2 you don't have all those -- yours have been running -- just 3 for your line, it costs like 160 a month, haven't they? 4 JUDGE WRIGHT: It's hard-wired; there's nothing I 5 can do about it. I'm part of the Sheriff's Department. It's 6 a fixed amount. 7 MS. HARGIS: We're not changing the system, are we? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Huh? 9 MS. HARGIS: We're not changing the Sheriff's 10 Office, are we? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Not the Sheriff's Office. 12 MS. HARGIS: The Sheriff's Office, the annex. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yours is part -- 14 JUDGE WRIGHT: Mine goes through their trunk. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: That issue remains outstanding. 16 MS. HARGIS: Okay, good. I knew that was going to 17 come up. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I agree, it does remain 19 outstanding. It's going to be after a fight. I don't want 20 that system. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, you may have to keep your -- 22 some of your emergency lines hard-wired that-a-way, but I 23 want to get everything converted over to our total system 24 that I can. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I agree, we need to discuss a 7-6-10 bwk 82 1 lot of that, see how we -- you know, realistically, how we 2 can make everything work, especially with the new building. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: But you have separate numbers out 4 there, and we're planning on tying her into our system, are 5 we not? 6 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 8 MS. HARGIS: Will that take place, though, by 9 September? 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, if it doesn't take place until 11 October or November, we still -- you know, we're going to get 12 the majority of the year. Hopefully we'll get switched over 13 one of these days, if we have to go over there with a gun in 14 hand to get the Windstream people to do that. 15 MS. HARGIS: I forgot -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Pardon? 17 MS. HARGIS: Just as a suggestion, why don't we 18 take it to 1,000, just in case? 'Cause her bill's -- she has 19 a fax line and a phone. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: I know. I know. 21 MR. AYALA: Two phone lines. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, including the -- 23 MS. HARGIS: So, let's take to it 1,000. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Including the -- 25 MS. HARGIS: Because they -- again, if Windstream 7-6-10 bwk 83 1 does like they did here, it will take time to get off of 2 them. We'll be paying two bills again. 3 JUDGE WRIGHT: You took it from 2,250 down to 750? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 5 MS. HARGIS: I put it back up to 1,000, 'cause we 6 have no long distance on the new phone lines. 7 JUDGE WRIGHT: That's just a flat -- flat fee. I 8 don't use long distance. 9 MS. HARGIS: It's not your fault. I mean, it's 10 because you're on a separate line, but you won't be any more, 11 and that's helpful. That means it's $4.56 a line, so that 12 makes a huge difference. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anything else, Judge? 14 JUDGE WRIGHT: That's it. That's all I've got. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Go to Page 38, which is 3, 16 J.P. 3. 17 JUDGE MITCHELL: Okay. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think I beat you up too bad. 19 JUDGE MITCHELL: Well, no. I see that you brought 20 my postage down 400. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 22 JUDGE MITCHELL: And my office supplies to 350. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 24 JUDGE MITCHELL: Telephone, 750. And I'm going to 25 ask you to go ahead and bring down my conferences to 1,500 7-6-10 bwk 84 1 instead of 2,000. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Can you go out and train some of the 3 rest of these people to come in with that attitude? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Why do you have to be so 5 difficult? 6 JUDGE MITCHELL: Oh, I don't know. I just -- it's 7 just a thing we relatives -- you know, it happens to us. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Uh-oh, let's not claim him 9 as a relative. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, I'm going to need an 11 attorney in this deal. I can see that coming. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Yeah, right over there. 13 JUDGE MITCHELL: Other than that, everything looks 14 fine for me. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's get right on by. 17 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Very good. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Judge, you weren't expecting 19 a gift, and you got one. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 21 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: That was easy. Now here 22 comes the problem. 23 JUDGE RAGSDALE: You're right. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mr. Bill. 25 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Hey, how are you? 7-6-10 bwk 85 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm good. How are you? 2 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Thank you. 3 MS. MABRY: Mm-hmm. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's see what I did with you. 5 Didn't beat up on you too bad. Brought your office supplies 6 down to 1,300 from 1,500. 7 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Just 'cause? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Just 'cause. It's based upon 9 annualizing what you're spending. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: To-date, you spent 866, is 11 what it says here on this sheet. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And you have 1,500 budgeted. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: If you write on both sides 15 of the page, you can get it down further. 16 JUDGE RAGSDALE: We do. We run the stuff through 17 the copier twice. I didn't -- I didn't see any major changes 18 or any -- you know. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, your utilities, I pulled those 20 down. 21 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Oh. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: 2,300. 23 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Has the budget gone -- I mean, 24 have the expenditures gone down on that too? 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Well -- 7-6-10 bwk 86 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There's -- 1,392 has been 2 year-to-date, and you have 2,860 budgeted. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: That comes out to a little over 4 $2,000, so I gave you a $300 float. Be careful what you do 5 with the thermostat. 6 JUDGE RAGSDALE: I don't care. They can roast; I 7 got a fan. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 9 JUDGE RAGSDALE: But the only reason it was there 10 is because I -- I too had gone over the year -- the 11 expenditures and came up with that figure. I think that was 12 actually a couple years ago. I didn't know the utilities had 13 gone down. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, 2007 and '8 was 2,763. 15 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Mm-hmm. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And 2006 and '7 was 2,470. 17 But then this year-to-date's only 1,392. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The only thing I would mention 19 in that year-to-date is, I found that several of mine -- not 20 knocking the Auditor's office, but a lot of times that's at 21 least one to two, and sometimes three months behind -- 22 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Yes. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- of what the actual to-date 24 is there. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: On utilities? 7-6-10 bwk 87 1 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Oh, it's not uncommon to -- to be 2 a month behind, just by the nature of the beast. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: That's factored into how I annualize 4 these things, anyway. I've got it through nine months here, 5 and I'm only using eight of it, so that gives an additional 6 float too. 7 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Well, you know, it's fine with me. 8 If we need to get more, we'll get it. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 10 MS. BOLIN: And, Bill, they could -- utilities 11 could have gone down when they put that new thermostat in. 12 JUDGE RAGSDALE: New thermostat got taken out 13 'cause it didn't work. It's back to the same old thermostat 14 we've always had. 15 MR. TROLINGER: We did replace a couple of the 16 computers, and we've got a laptop in there from last year. 17 That's less power, and the flat screens use less power, and 18 that big copier, so those are big -- those are big hits there 19 on your electricity. 20 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Could be. Works for me. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Once they fixed all the water 22 leaks. 23 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Yes. 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Maybe that helped with 25 insulation. 7-6-10 bwk 88 1 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Well, you know, it could be. 2 Actually, they put that roof over the top of the roof, so 3 that might have had something. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It will help. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Could help. 6 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Well, if you don't have any 7 questions, I'm fine. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 9 (Commissioner Baldwin left the courtroom.) 10 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Is that a no? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No questions. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No questions. 13 JUDGE RAGSDALE: Thank you. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Page 64. 16 MS. HARGIS: Constables are 551. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 64. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: 64? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Page 64. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Now we got the constables 21 over there on one, and Buster left. Is he probably being 22 arrested? 23 (Commissioner Baldwin returned to the courtroom.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Hey, Buster, where's your 7-6-10 bwk 89 1 constable? Oh, there he is. 2 MR. LAVENDER: He's ready. I'm just waiting to be 3 called up. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Sitting back there in the 5 corner. 6 MR. LAVENDER: With due respect to my Commissioner, 7 I had to wait till he returned. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Getting as far away from him 9 as you can. 10 MR. LAVENDER: I was waiting for him to return. 11 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You didn't want him to miss 12 anything, did you? 13 MR. LAVENDER: That's right, in the loop. Judge? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Have you seen what I've done to you? 15 MR. LAVENDER: Yes, sir, I have. A couple of 16 places that were a reduction a little bit. I can live with 17 that. I'll try to continue to be as efficient. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't think you can get 19 any better than you are, John, I'm telling you. 20 MR. LAVENDER: Did you get that? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've been around here a long 22 time; I've seen lots of stuff. You're the top of the line. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: There's nothing there that you can't 24 live without? 25 MR. LAVENDER: I can live with those. 7-6-10 bwk 90 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. I pretty well 2 equalized all the constables in the areas that I could. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is this where you're going to 4 talk about the constable cars? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We can. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, we could. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I was looking for my 8 paperwork, and I'm sorry, I can't get my hands on it. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I might have it. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What I wanted to point out 11 was the difference -- the County Auditor has done some 12 research and some negotiations that are pretty astounding, 13 the difference between the -- something and the something. I 14 think we're talking about -- we talked about new Ford pickups 15 like Maintenance and Environmental Health drive. I could see 16 our constables going to that, and the Auditor has done some 17 research and some negotiations with the Ford Motor Company, 18 and come up with a vehicle -- it's an Expedition that is less 19 than the pickup, and it is really the -- well, at least my 20 constable's choice of vehicle, because it's enclosed; you can 21 lock the door and everything's locked up in there, unlike a 22 pickup where you still have some stuff showing, like your dog 23 and things like that. That was a joke, Bill. 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: I got it. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 7-6-10 bwk 91 1 MR. LAVENDER: Bruce didn't understand. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Huh? 3 MR. LAVENDER: Bruce didn't understand about the 4 dog in the back of the truck. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I tried. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm not going to respond to 7 that. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, like, to give you an 9 example, the pickups were 24,000, and the Expeditions are 10 22,000. It just absolutely has blown my mind that those 11 things are less cost, but it's due to the good Auditor and 12 what she has done. Have I said that enough? 13 MS. BOLIN: I heard that. 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: One more time, you can give 15 her a problem. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: One more time and she's going 17 to ask for a raise, Buster. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What's neat about it, 19 though, it goes a step further than -- than this; that she 20 actually has worked out a deal with them where -- tell them 21 about the every three or four, five years, whatever it is. 22 MS. HARGIS: Well, I'm going to ask the 23 representative from the Ford dealership to come over, but he 24 suggested that to revolve our vehicles, that if we could turn 25 them back in anywhere between 50,000 and 75,000 miles, 7-6-10 bwk 92 1 depending on the year that we do it, 8,000 for the year. 2 Then we just swap that vehicle for a new vehicle for $8,000, 3 so that way we could move our vehicles off a probably 4 every-three-year basis without spending full cost for them. 5 So, I wanted to bring him in the last workshop so you could 6 talk to him. He said he would come and talk to you. 7 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Did he not also tell you 8 that they stay in the maintenance program at that mileage 9 too? 10 MS. HARGIS: Yes. That was something else that I 11 actually didn't really think about. I was thinking the price 12 was so good, but that takes us out of maintenance, because 13 every three years, they stay within the -- this new car 14 warranty, so that helps us. Except for, you know, the tires 15 and things of that nature. So, it keeps our fleet up to 16 date. And, you know, now they are. So, we need to think 17 about something like that rather than buying brand new 18 vehicles every time, because as you look now, it's continuing 19 to go up. We were lucky to get the kind of program for this 20 year. But each year Ford gives -- he said this year it's 21 8,550. Now, I noticed some of the ads there have given 22 rebates as much as 8,550, so I think that's probably what it 23 is; it's a rebate. And this is not a fancy Expedition. It 24 doesn't have a third seat and it's just plain, but it meets 25 the needs, and it's a little better for them carrying 7-6-10 bwk 93 1 prisoners. So, the gentleman over there wants our business, 2 so he's trying to help us out. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: These particular units also have the 4 heavy-duty package, the suspension and transmission coolers? 5 MR. LAVENDER: It's what they call a special 6 purpose vehicle, which gives it the additional engine with a 7 cooler, and they include the trailer -- the tow package. I 8 don't expect I'll be towing a trailer, but it gives you the 9 extra engine cooler, the transmission cooler, and the higher 10 capacity -- 11 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. The first bid I had didn't, and 12 then I had Angel look at it, and he said we need -- we needed 13 that. And then we got the second -- second estimate 14 including what they needed with it. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: What are we paying for Tahoes? 16 MS. HARGIS: Tahoes? Anywhere from 34,000 to 17 39,000. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's totally equipped. 19 That's with the -- 20 MS. HARGIS: Jason's came in, though, at -- and his 21 doesn't have what yours has, and it was 35,000. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'm not paying that much. 23 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: The number I saw from my 24 constable, again for the Expedition, also indicated some 25 additional costs of about $8,000. 7-6-10 bwk 94 1 MR. LAVENDER: Now, that additional cost is to 2 upgrade to the digital video recorder -- and I can be the 3 salesman for that, if you'd like -- and the emergency light 4 equipment. We anticipate moving our radio equipment and our 5 radar equipment from our existing units to the new unit. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: So, is the 8,000 a solid 7 number, or is it subject to change? 8 MR. LAVENDER: The 35,000 for an additional video 9 recorder is solid, according to the digital video people. 10 The other two numbers are comparable numbers for what it's 11 costing to do the graphics on the Sheriff's Office cars, and 12 that -- that's a steady number. 13 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay, thank you. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: The big-ticket item is the digital 15 recording device? 16 MR. LAVENDER: Yes, sir. And there's some real 17 advantages to the digital over the VHS that we have now. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: You can actually see what it's 19 recording. 20 MR. LAVENDER: Well, yeah, you can do that now. 21 But the thing I like most, and the Sheriff is talking about 22 that, is the pre-event recorder. And it worked out well when 23 Ray had his little accident up by Ingram Dam, when he turned 24 on his overheads after he had the accident. But the 25 pre-event recorder records two minutes before you turn it on. 7-6-10 bwk 95 1 You're able to see the situation before the incident 2 occurred, and when it occurred. And for us working traffic, 3 you can watch a -- like, get a neighborhood complaint about a 4 stop sign or something. You can sit and watch that stop 5 sign. When you see the guy run the stop sign, you turn on 6 your recorder, and he is recorded running the stop sign. 7 Makes your case pretty airtight. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Two minutes? 9 MR. LAVENDER: It records two minutes before you 10 turn it on. It's always placed on the hard drive, but you 11 don't put it on the disk unless you ask for it, so you just 12 sit at the intersection and watch it happen, turn on your -- 13 your recorder, and you have from two minutes before you 14 turned it on. So -- 15 JUDGE TINLEY: That's kind of sneaky, isn't it? 16 MR. LAVENDER: Yeah, that's the way we are. 17 (Laughter.) Yeah. But that's really -- that's -- all the 18 Sheriff's digital stuff is that way. And I think it's great 19 for enforcement purposes, too. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Another -- another 21 attraction here is not a capital outlay item. It comes -- 22 what do you call the fund? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Capital outlay's already been 24 budgeted here. 25 MS. HARGIS: It's the bonds that we sold, the 2010 7-6-10 bwk 96 1 bonds. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And this is -- the excess here 3 is from -- 4 MS. HARGIS: The radios that we -- we got the 5 grants for, we budgeted for them anyway, and we knew we might 6 have that extra money. And the air-conditioners. So, all 7 totaled, that was about 300-something thousand we bought. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's in my hand. 9 MS. HARGIS: We bought four trucks out of that, so 10 we still have money there. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, we had enough for another 12 90,000 or -- 90,000. 13 MS. HARGIS: We do need to see what Constable 4 14 wants to do. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's what I was going to 16 ask next. 17 MS. HARGIS: Since he's mine, I want to be sure 18 he's taken care of. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Bob, are you interested in 20 buying one of those? 21 MR. TERRILL: No, sir. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Going to keep what you have? 23 MR. TERRILL: Exactly. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: It's your call. 25 MS. HARGIS: Does he want the digital recorder or 7-6-10 bwk 97 1 anything? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do you want the digital -- why 3 don't we wait till we get there. 4 MR. TERRILL: Yes, sir. Yes. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: You want to be properly equipped; 6 you just want to control what vehicle you got? 7 MR. TERRILL: That's correct, sir. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. 9 MR. LAVENDER: Anything else? 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Let's go to Constable 2. You 11 see the only adjustment I made to you? Operating equipment, 12 from 1,500 down to 500? 13 MR. AYALA: Yes, sir. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Same thing I did in Constable 1. 15 MR. AYALA: I'm -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: And Constable 3. 17 MR. AYALA: I'm going to ask to turn my cell phone 18 in. I don't use it, so I can cut my telephone budget by 250. 19 Just save me $50 a year for long distance calls. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: So you want to cut your phone from 21 300 down to -- 22 MR. AYALA: 250. I don't know what they charge us 23 for those -- for our cell phones a month, but I don't need 24 it. 25 MS. HARGIS: It's $10 a month. 7-6-10 bwk 98 1 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Cut it from 300 to what? 2 MR. AYALA: I mean from 300 to 50. Just -- 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 4 MR. AYALA: Only thing I use is long distance 5 occasionally. The cell phone just didn't work for me. 6 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: For the record, I assume 7 you want the -- the Expedition buy-in as well? 8 MR. AYALA: Yes. 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Just want to get you on the 10 record. 11 MR. AYALA: Yes. 12 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 13 MR. AYALA: More so than the pickup. It's more -- 14 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: You got more miles on your 15 vehicle than any of the other constables, have you not? 16 MR. AYALA: Yes, sir. About -- before the end of 17 the year, I'll probably have a little over 100,000. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Okay. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else, Joel? 20 MR. AYALA: No. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Thanks, Joel. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Three? 24 MR. GARZA: Good afternoon, gentlemen. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: You've seen what I've done to you? 7-6-10 bwk 99 1 MR. GARZA: Yes, Judge. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Pulled your postage and office 3 supplies down both to 150. I've taken out your training 4 school, and basically because you haven't spent any. 5 MR. GARZA: I was going to go to a training school 6 in Galveston; it didn't work out. I still have some 7 training, hopefully -- maybe in August or September. Usually 8 do the fire training at Camp Bullis, but that's why I haven't 9 done anything. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. So what I'm hearing, 11 then, is that you plan on using some of your training budget 12 this year? 13 MR. GARZA: Yes, sir. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: And you'd like it for next year too? 15 MR. GARZA: Yes, sir, if possible. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's kick that back to where 17 it was, then. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask you a question. 19 Aren't you guys required a certain amount of CEU's annually 20 to keep your certification up or anything? 21 MR. GARZA: Yes, sir. Every two years, we, you 22 know, have civil process and 40 hours of additional training. 23 Constables have to have -- have 20 hours of process and 40 24 hours in other training to equal, you know, current training 25 levels, I guess. 7-6-10 bwk 100 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Every other year? 2 MR. GARZA: Well, within two years. You have two 3 years to complete your training. 4 MS. HARGIS: They use some of their LEOSE money for 5 that, too. 6 MR. AYALA: We went to Bill Blackburn's deal, and 7 John and I went to Sam Houston. It was free. All it cost us 8 was a week's worth of lodging at a discounted rate, so we 9 used our LEOSE money to pay for that, and we got all our 10 training out in -- in five days for the two-year cycle. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And that's TCLEOSE 12 certification? 13 MR. AYALA: Yes. 14 MR. GARZA: Yes, sir. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's the way to do it. 16 MR. GARZA: Yeah. Hopefully go to Sam Houston 17 State in Huntsville this year, 'cause by next year I have to 18 have it. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. What about the equipment? I 21 pulled everybody else down to 500 on that. 22 MR. GARZA: I guess so. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 24 MR. GARZA: If -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I know you wanted a vehicle. 7-6-10 bwk 101 1 MR. GARZA: Yes, Commissioner, if it's available, I 2 would. And I would prefer the Expedition, if it's possible. 3 Just for me, it would look like to me more of a police-type 4 vehicle that could be more recognized than a truck. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You can't find a damn 7 redneck any more that wants a truck. This is bad. 8 (Laughter.) 9 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Sign of the times. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sign of the times. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, Mr. Bob. Looks like the only 12 thing I messed with you on was your telephone. 13 MR. TERRILL: That's not a problem, sir. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: A-okay? 15 MR. TERRILL: A-okay, sir. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Anything else that you 17 need to bring to our attention? 18 MR. TERRILL: Not a thing. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, we appreciate hearing from you 20 every once in a while. 21 MR. TERRILL: I'll come to town once in a while. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Send us a postcard, you know, tell 23 us you're -- 24 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Tell us how the kids are. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: -- you're alive and well out there 7-6-10 bwk 102 1 in west Kerr. 2 MR. TERRILL: I'll work on it. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Can you tell any difference 4 on -- 5 MR. TERRILL: I might have to get some postage if I 6 want to send you one of them postcards. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Bob, can you tell any 8 difference on Skyview since they've done that? 9 MR. TERRILL: They put a lot of paint on it, and so 10 it'll probably slow some people down. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Some people driving a little 12 slower? 13 MR. TERRILL: Yes, sir. Is that it, sir? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: That's it, Bob. 15 MS. HARGIS: I can say he does his job. I see him 16 all the time. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: How many tickets have you 19 had? 20 MS. HARGIS: None. I watch for him. (Laughter.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: You got the fear in her, Bob. 22 MS. HARGIS: Don't look for my car. You don't know 23 what color it is. 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Not 'cause she's a law-abiding 25 citizen; it's just 'cause she watches. 7-6-10 bwk 103 1 MS. HARGIS: I do have a heavy foot. I watch it 2 when I come through Ingram. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 216th Adult Probation. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What's your number? 5 MS. DAVIS: 571. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: 571, okay. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can't be far. 78. 8 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Page 78? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Hey, John? Somehow or 11 another the little rat came by and removed everything over 12 here where I was. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Yours is pretty simple. 14 MS. DAVIS: Not much in there, is it? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: We don't have any more rent. 16 MS. DAVIS: No. Do we need to have, like, a 17 month's worth just in case? Or are you pretty sure we're -- 18 do we need a month's worth just in case, or are you pretty 19 sure we'll be in there by the 1st of October? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: They're required to deliver the 21 building by September 1, so we got a month cushion. And that 22 was intentional, because your lease goes through to October 23 1, and even if they hold over a few days, which they probably 24 won't; they're actually ahead of the schedule on 25 construction. 7-6-10 bwk 104 1 MS. DAVIS: Okay. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Have you been out there? 3 MS. DAVIS: I've driven by, but I haven't been in. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, stick your nose in there and 5 see what you're going to end up with. It's kind of a mess in 6 there from drywall stuff, but you can get a good idea -- 7 MS. DAVIS: Okay. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: -- what's going down there. 9 MS. DAVIS: I didn't know they were doing the 10 drywall. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, yeah. They're essentially 12 complete on the drywall now. 13 MS. DAVIS: Wonderful. 14 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I can show you blueprints. 16 You can see how it's laid out on y'all's side. 17 MS. DAVIS: Sounds good. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Good enough. 19 MS. DAVIS: All right. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: We got some revenue numbers that 21 were brought in. Ms. Hargis, you want to give us a woodshed 22 on these? 23 MS. HARGIS: I would if somebody would give me an 24 extra one that I brought over. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: That's it. 7-6-10 bwk 105 1 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Here, just take mine. 3 MS. HARGIS: I got it. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, take mine. 5 MS. HARGIS: No. No, I got it. You don't want to 6 hear, right? About a week ago, I guess, or two weeks ago, 7 Commissioner Oehler asked these questions, so I had to do my 8 homework. The sales tax is really the picture that 9 everybody's looking at. I will tell you for the month of 10 June, which is really the month of April, we were only $257 11 short of where we had been last year, which is as close as 12 we've been. We've been running 14 percent behind. This -- 13 this doesn't quite equate to that; it's about 8.96, is what 14 the 315 is. But that's what I'm estimating we'll be short on 15 sales tax. (Coughing.) 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: She really gets choked up 17 when she talks about that. 18 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Mm-hmm. 19 MS. HARGIS: I have allergies this time of the day, 20 every day. I'm sorry about that. The fines and fees, 21 another bleak picture. You can see what we had in 2008-2009, 22 and year-to-date in 2008-2009 was a million, four, as 23 compared to a million, five, so we're a little bit up on the 24 fines and fees. Not a lot. I don't expect either District 25 Court or the County Clerk's office to come near the budget. 7-6-10 bwk 106 1 They're going to be short unless something drastic, you know, 2 happens over the summer. But based on their average right 3 now, they won't meet the budget we had from last year. So, 4 any of your current revenue that you have in your budget for 5 now, I have cut that by $500,000 for next year. I've gone 6 back to the 2006 levels of sales tax, and actually a little 7 bit less than 2006, because it's really what's plotting, is 8 about 2006. 9 The State just sent us a newsletter -- or their 10 magazine from the Controller's office, and it has increased 11 some, as we can tell by the difference in this last month. 12 But, you know, it's kind of hard on the sales tax, because we 13 run two months behind and then we get the payment, so it's a 14 little bit hard to kind of tell. But if you compare the 15 comparable months in the same time frames, we're still, you 16 know, running at the 2006 levels. If you look at starting in 17 2006, actually, all the way through '08-'09, most of the time 18 we got 200-something thousand, 300-something thousand. If 19 you look at this year, we're in the hundred thousands. We 20 haven't -- we've broke 200,000, I think, once. That was a 21 quarterly payment. So, I'm hoping there's a lot of traffic 22 here this weekend, and with the river being up and -- and 23 people not wanting to go to the beach, I'm hoping they're 24 coming here. 25 So, the other thing that we looked at -- or I 7-6-10 bwk 107 1 looked at was the projection of the budget itself. The 2 current year, we budgeted 18 million -- 18,216,000. The 3 current budget amount of -- I mean, that's of revenue. 4 Expenses, 18,119,000, for an overage of 97,303. That's what 5 we budgeted. The next line down, so far we've gotten 6 revenue -- you can see the decrease here, 17,400,000. Our 7 expenses I estimate to be 16,787,000, which will give us 8 excess of 612,534. A huge part of that number is in Juvenile 9 Probation. Juvenile Probation is probably -- is $389,000 10 under budget right now. They have not used the housing. 11 That equates, though, to the fact that Juvenile Detention 12 Center is not getting as much revenue as we projected because 13 they don't have a full house. And they don't have a full 14 house of other people, and we don't have a full house of our 15 kids. It's -- nobody seems to be able to especially put 16 their hand on it, but juvenile crime seems to have gone down. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. It -- 2009 was just a 18 tremendous spike by almost -- my case -- my number of 19 hearings increased almost 50 percent, but it looks like this 20 year it's settling back to where it was in 2008. So -- 21 MS. HARGIS: But they still do not have the IV-E 22 money. The IV-E money is pretty much gone, and that's what 23 we used a big bulk of, and that's the reason his budget went 24 up so much. So, hopefully he's going to have -- and we 25 predict that he'll probably have a $350 shortfall, so that's 7-6-10 bwk 108 1 why you're seeing the excess money. That's a lot coming from 2 one department. And you have some other departments -- 3 everybody's been very frugal this year. I don't see a lot of 4 spending. I don't see a lot of people running to spend. And 5 then the second page that you have is -- is our approved 6 budget, compared to the requested budget. And you can see 7 we're running a pretty close -- pretty close here. The 8 requested budget to the approved budget last year, there's 9 just a nominal amount of difference here, so the folks are -- 10 know that they needed to cut back, and the Judge has cut back 11 even more, which I wasn't aware of until this morning. 12 So, I don't think our expense side, per se, is the 13 side that we need to worry about, except in our health 14 insurance, which we had kind of hoped we wouldn't have to hit 15 that ball, but it's going to hit us. And how it does and how 16 we offset it is up to y'all. But, I would take some of those 17 recommendations that she gave you into consideration, even 18 though they hit my pocketbook just like everybody else's. 19 But, the -- that's our biggest hit. You know, even if we 20 gave the raises this year that she's asked for, that's not 21 the hit. This year it's the -- when we went up last year by 22 half a million, you know, we're going to have to go up 23 another 750,000. So -- but I -- the lists are hot. My 24 listserv, which is the Auditors Association listserv, a 25 question went out; it was really -- and when I got in this 7-6-10 bwk 109 1 morning, there probably were 20 or 30 people asking, "What is 2 your health insurance cost? What are you going to do about 3 it?" So, from the small counties, I'm seeing 500 a month to 4 anywhere from eight to nine. So, we're not the only ones. 5 It's just -- you know, it's kind of the hardest pill to 6 swallow. 7 But other than that, I think, you know, we've done 8 a good job this year with our budgeting. On our revenue 9 side, there's not a whole lot we can do about that. It 10 either comes in or it doesn't. So that's the reason why I 11 decided to be even more conservative, pull it back even more. 12 In fact, I pulled back -- the Judge and I talked. I pulled 13 the sales tax back another 100,000, 'cause I was a little bit 14 concerned about that. Once we get a little further in and I 15 get another month and I can see -- but I still think we need 16 to be real conservative with that sales tax. I think it's 17 really volatile right now. People will spend for a little 18 while, then they stop. You know, I mean, I've been trying to 19 watch all the news shows; I'm sure everybody else has too, 20 you know, all the economists. Some of them are saying, you 21 know, it's going to be 2012. Some say 2013, we're going to 22 go back into recession. So, it's across the board as to 23 what's going to happen, so it's going to be a difficult -- 24 more difficult year for us just to pay for costs that we 25 can't control versus the ones we can. 7-6-10 bwk 110 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Buster, did you have a comment about 3 the Auditor's presentation? 4 MS. HARGIS: You're questioning me, I can tell. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It was magnificent, wasn't 6 it? 7 MS. HARGIS: Buster, what did I give you for lunch? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Nothing yet. 9 MS. HARGIS: Oh, okay. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 11 MS. HARGIS: I owe him a lunch at Buzzie's 12 Barbecue. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Gentlemen, anything else on this 14 workshop? 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hasn't it been wonderful? 16 COMMISSIONER WILLIAMS: Good. It's been cool. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: The short time I was here, it was. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This is so good. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 20 MS. HARGIS: We hope it's easier than last year. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We took care of his items 22 earlier as well. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. Okay. Well, we'll be 24 adjourned. 25 (Budget workshop adjourned at 3:29 p.m.) - - - - - - - - - - 7-6-10 bwk 111 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 official reporter for the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 9th day of July, 2010. 8 9 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 10 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 11 Certified Shorthand Reporter 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 7-6-10 bwk