1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Special Session 10 Monday, November 22, 2010 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge 23 H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 24 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 25 ABSENT: WILLIAM "BILL" WILLIAMS, Commissioner Pct. 2 2 1 I N D E X November 22, 2010 2 PAGE 3 --- Visitors' Input 6 --- Commissioners' Comments 13 4 1.1 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action 5 concerning various issues on C.P. River Road between Crossing Street Bridge and Dave and 6 Shelley's Place; set public hearing regarding installing 3-way stop at Harless Way E. and 7 C.P. River Road, and another 3-way stop at Crossing Street E. and C.P. River Rd., Pct. 2 15 8 1.2 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 9 approve proposal from architect Peter Lewis for fees and estimated costs for new Ingram Annex 10 building 21 11 1.5 Public Hearing for revision of plat for Lot 125-R consisting of Lot 1 of Howard's Hill and Lots 124 12 and 125 of Country Manor, Section 2, Precinct 1 27 13 1.6 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for final approval for revision of plat for Lot 125-R 14 consisting of Lot 1 of Howard's Hill and Lots 124 and 125, Country Manor, Section 2, Precinct 1 27 15 1.7 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for 16 final approval for private road name of White Cross Ranch Road NW, Precinct 4 30 17 1.8 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 18 review concept plan for water line easement across county property, Precinct 2 30 19 1.3 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 20 recommend to the Charles Schreiner Road Fund Trustee the manner of expenditure of earnings 21 from the trust 34 22 1.4 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to declare an HP Printer as surplus for 216th 23 District Attorney's Office 36 24 1.9 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to finalize and determine Texas County and District 25 Retirement System rate for Kerr County for 2011 36 3 1 I N D E X (Continued) November 22, 2010 2 PAGE 3 1.10 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on Forfeiture Report for 198th District Attorney 37 4 1.11 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 5 approve contracts with K'Star, CASA, Big Brothers and Sisters, Dietert Center, and Families & 6 Literacy, Inc.; allow County Judge to sign same 41 7 1.15 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on reports from various county offices on telephone 8 service, and report from IT Director 42 9 1.12 Public Hearing to vacate, abandon, and discontinue a portion of Jones Road 76 10 1.14 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 11 request from City of Kerrville's Economic Improvement Corporation to undertake a project 12 outside Kerrville city limits by funding the Hill Country Shooting Sports Center with 4B 13 sales tax receipts 77 14 1.13 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to vacate, abandon, and discontinue a portion of 15 Jones Road 84 16 1.16 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to run new electrical service to new outdoor arena 17 at Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center at an approximate cost of $8,300 85 18 1.17 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 19 additional county personnel policies regarding exempt positions 89 20 1.18 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action 21 regarding health insurance contract to include life insurance policies for employees; allow 22 County Judge to sign same 91 23 1.19 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action regarding establishment of Fund 11 health 24 benefits reserve fund 92 25 4 1 I N D E X (Continued) November 22, 2010 2 PAGE 3 1.20 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to authorize County Judge to appoint committee to 4 study criteria for inclusion of name(s) on War Memorial; make policy recommendation to 5 Commissioners Court 102 6 1.21 Receive report/update on repairs of Ingram Dam and Flat Rock Dam from Freese and Nichols, Inc. 7 and/or Pro South Construction 105 8 4.1 Pay Bills 113 9 4.2 Budget Amendments 117 4.3 Late Bills --- 10 4.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 122 11 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee Assignments --- 12 5.2 Reports from Elected Officials/Department Heads 123 13 1.22 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on pending and possible litigation regarding 14 encroachment on public easement (Exec. Session) 125 15 3.1 Action as may be required on matters discussed in Executive Session 126 16 --- Adjourned 128 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 5 1 On Monday, November 22, 2010, at 9:00 a.m., a special 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. 8 Let me call to order this regularly scheduled meeting of the 9 Kerr County Commissioners Court posted and scheduled for this 10 date and time, Monday, November 22, 2010, at 9 a.m. It is 11 that time now. Commissioner Baldwin? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. Would y'all all 13 rise and have a word of prayer with me, and then we'll do the 14 pledge of allegiance. 15 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Please be seated. At 17 this time, if there's member of the public or the audience 18 that wishes to be heard on any matter that is not listed on 19 the agenda, this is your opportunity to be heard. If you 20 wish to be heard on an agenda item, there's some 21 participation forms at the rear of the room. We'd ask that 22 you fill those out, get them up here to us. It's not 23 essential; it just helps me to be aware that there is someone 24 that wishes to be heard on a particular agenda item, and 25 maybe avoid passing over them, which we don't like to do. 11-22-10 6 1 But if you have something to say that's not pertaining to a 2 listed agenda item, this is your opportunity to come forward. 3 Give us your name and address and tell us what's on your 4 mind. 5 MR. STOFFREGEN: Sure. Let me get my glasses. 6 Judge, my name's Jack Stoffregen. I'm an attorney with the 7 Capital Public Defender's office that's officed out of 8 Lubbock now. I was on the way to work this morning and took 9 a wrong turn, I guess; I ended up in Kerrville. (Laughter.) 10 So, I wanted -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Your lucky day. 12 MR. STOFFREGEN: I wanted to visit with y'all, and 13 I appreciate you letting me have the opportunity to address 14 you. I'm going to be real brief, and I can answer questions 15 if you need me to. And if I may approach, Judge, I've got a 16 handout for everybody. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All right, good. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll pass them around. 19 MR. STOFFREGEN: Okay. Probably all of you have 20 heard of our office. Three years ago, we were formed with 21 money from the Task Force for Indigent Defense to handle 22 capital representation at the trial level in a region of west 23 Texas that covers 85 counties. We've been successful, and 24 the task force, just this last October, authorized us -- in 25 June they authorized us to open up the 4th, 5th, and 6th 11-22-10 7 1 judicial administrative regions, which you can see on the 2 brochure, the area toward the bottom, which includes your 3 county here. If you were to get a capital murder case where 4 the State was seeking the death penalty in your county, we 5 will provide -- and it's free right now. We'll provide the 6 defense team that's required. By constitutional mandate now, 7 you have to have two lawyers, a mitigation specialist, and a 8 fact investigator at a minimum on these. And, obviously, 9 most capital murder defendants are indigent. You're having 10 to foot the bill for that, and those can run up into the -- 11 easily into the 100,000-plus dollars to handle one of those 12 cases. 13 So, the idea behind this is to kind of set up a 14 risk pool with all the counties where you pay a -- pay a fee 15 into the program each year. And, obviously, hoping you never 16 have one of these, but if you do, we'll take care of it. 17 We're taking cases in this region now. We've opened an 18 office in Uvalde. January 1st, we'll open an office in 19 Kingsville, and I'll have those staffed with lawyers, 20 mitigators, an investigator, and legal assistants to handle 21 that. In fact, since October the 1st of this year, we've 22 already been appointed on two cases in this new region. 23 We've been appointed on one in Edna, which is Jackson County, 24 and one in Kingsville, which is Kleberg County. The task 25 force has provided funding for this for us to open the 11-22-10 8 1 offices, to equip them, to hire the folks, which is what 2 we've been doing now. 3 No cost this first year to the counties, because we 4 know you've just gone through your budget process and haven't 5 set aside funds for this. Next year, the task force is going 6 to pay 100 percent of the fee again, but the counties will 7 start paying into the program so that there'll be a surplus 8 built up. The formula for just determining what your funding 9 amount is going to be -- level's going to be was based upon 10 your county's percentage population, percentage of the whole 11 in this area; it's 50 percent, and then your county's average 12 of capital murder cases over the last 10 years. And under 13 the formula that the State has provided and given to me, 14 we're showing your population estimated in 2008 at 47,625, 15 and we're showing .6 cases average a year. So, apparently 16 over the last 10 years, your District Clerk has reported to 17 the State that there have been six capital murder cases that 18 have been filed in your county, and that's what it's based 19 on. 20 So, as I said, this year you're in -- I mean, if 21 you were to get one now, you just have to call. We'll 22 provide that service for you. We'll provide the defense 23 team. Next year, in fiscal year 2012, your fee would be 24 $12,095 paid in. The following year, '13, would be 17,207. 25 In fiscal year '14, 25,811. '15 is $34,415. And then in the 11-22-10 9 1 last fiscal year of the program, the sixth year, it's 2 $43,018. Those numbers are locked in. Those won't change. 3 For instance, if, out of the 52 counties that are eligible to 4 participate, 48 do so, we don't get all the money, that your 5 figures are still the same. So, it gives your Auditor and 6 gives you some budget predictability, and it -- and it 7 certainly will -- if you get a case, will help you sleep a 8 little bit better at night, perhaps. You don't have to -- to 9 worry about the money that's out there. 10 We've been appointed so far on 27 or 28 cases in 11 our region, so -- the west Texas region that we started in. 12 So, you know, there -- there's some around out there. So, 13 maybe that helps. And out of my budget, if you have -- for 14 instance, if you have cases now, I don't know if you have to 15 -- if you have qualified -- you know, there have to be 16 attorneys that are qualified on a list that's maintained to 17 handle these types of cases. I don't know if you have to go 18 to San Antonio to get the attorneys, or if you have attorneys 19 here that are on the list. But, for instance, if you were to 20 get a case here, and I assign a team out of Uvalde, which 21 would make sense to come up here and take care of it, all 22 travel expenses, food, hotel, all that comes out of my 23 budget. County's not on the hook for any of that. If you 24 were to get a case here that had to be moved to San Antonio 25 on a change of venue, you know, you'd be responsible normally 11-22-10 10 1 to pay to put them up, and all that comes out of my budget. 2 The County is -- this is it, with two exceptions. 3 And one exception is, in capital murder cases, many times 4 there are experts. You know, if the prosecutor says, you 5 know, "I've got a DNA expert," then the defense has the right 6 to ask the Court, the trial judge, to petition for money for 7 an expert of our own. That would still come out of your 8 budget. But we have to be able to convince the trial judge 9 that -- that there is really a need for it. We just can't go 10 ask for any expert that we want. We have to -- he's a 11 gatekeeper under the law, and he has to say whether we really 12 need that expert or not. And the second one is if there's a 13 death sentence, the law prohibits us, the trial lawyers, from 14 handling the appeal. So, if there were a death sentence on 15 appeal, we would not be able to do that. Somebody else 16 would. That's a real quick sketch, and I appreciate your 17 time. And if you have any questions, I don't mind answering 18 them, or I'll come back at the -- at y'all's request and do a 19 little bit more formal presentation, if you want. But you've 20 got the -- yes, sir, Judge? 21 JUDGE TINLEY: The step up each year in the cost, 22 is that because of a step down in funding through the state 23 indigent defense system? 24 MR. STOFFREGEN: It is, Judge. Right -- right now, 25 the State has said we're going to pay 100 percent this year, 11-22-10 11 1 and they already granted that. They're going to pay 100 2 percent next year as well, and then the following year, 3 they're going to pay 80 percent, 60, and 40. And so we'll be 4 building up a little bit of a surplus. In our region, in the 5 -- in west Texas now, they did -- it was going to be 100, 80, 6 60, 40, but they were -- the State was so pleased with what 7 we've been able to do so far that they gave us 100 percent 8 the second year. And so we've built -- as of October 1st, 9 when we finished our third fiscal year, we had a surplus 10 there of $660,000. So, that's -- couple reasons for this. 11 It's a program where we've got money where we don't dump it 12 back into your lap; we can finish the cases out. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: So, this year we are automatically 14 in the program? 15 MR. STOFFREGEN: You are, Judge. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 17 MR. STOFFREGEN: You're covered now. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Well -- 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Suppose we subscribe, as it 20 were, the following year. What prohibitions, if any, are 21 there to prevent us from deciding the year following that to 22 pull back? 23 MR. STOFFREGEN: There's -- there isn't. In fact, 24 you should have an interlocal agreement. We'll resend it. 25 We're resending them now, an interlocal agreement between 11-22-10 12 1 your county and Lubbock County. And you sign it, and we know 2 that you can only bind your Court for a year at a time, and 3 the task force can only grant a year at a time. And so each 4 year, what we're doing in our region in the north, each year 5 the Commissioners Court meets and reapproves. If you met and 6 decided not to reapprove, there's not really anything that 7 can be done. We -- I think the language of the interlocal 8 says that -- that we want the counties to -- to act in good 9 faith, and we're acting in good faith as well to try to 10 participate. We think it's a good program. Out of the 85 11 counties that participate, that are eligible in our region 12 now to participate, 71 have signed interlocals. We have 14 13 that didn't, for one reason or another. 14 Generally, I have found, in traveling all those 15 counties, the reason is that -- there are two that prevail. 16 One is we have a prosecutor that doesn't believe in the death 17 sentence, and says -- and has gone to his Commissioners Court 18 and said, "I will never, ever ask for a death sentence, so 19 save your money." And the second is, we have some counties 20 that have -- are rolling the dice and saying we're just going 21 to take a chance we don't get one. And so we had one county, 22 Wilbarger County -- we've been sitting on 70 counties. 23 Wilbarger County is Vernon, that didn't -- chose not to 24 participate. I'd gone and made a couple presentations and 25 talked to the judge, and then got a call this last year from 11-22-10 13 1 him, and he said, "Can we still get in?" And they had a 2 capital murder case, a baby-killing case, and so they were 3 able to get in and pay the back fees and everything. But we 4 can't take a case in that situation after, you know, they've 5 turned us down. When they say no, we're not going to 6 participate, and won't sign the interlocal and didn't pay in 7 for two years, then they get one. Otherwise, there isn't a 8 county out there that would ever join until they got the 9 case. They'd say we're going to sit back and wait; if we get 10 a case, we'll join. So -- but -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? 12 MR. STOFFREGEN: Thank you. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: We appreciate you being here. 14 MR. STOFFREGEN: Thank you very much. I appreciate 15 the time. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Is there any other member of 17 the public or the audience that wishes to be heard on a 18 matter that is not a listed agenda item? Seeing no one 19 coming -- else coming forward or trying to be recognized, 20 we'll move on. Commissioner Baldwin? Do you have something 21 for us this morning? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir. I'm excited about 23 this agenda and getting through it. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Commissioner Letz? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll just remind everybody that 11-22-10 14 1 this week is the annual Christmas in Comfort. The parade is 2 Saturday night, and all day long booths, festivities are 3 going on in downtown Comfort on High Street, 7th, so I 4 encourage everyone to come down. It's usually a pretty good 5 time. I think the parade starts at 7:00, and I believe my 6 two boys have been coerced into being in the parade. I've 7 been coerced into decorating their -- 8 JUDGE TINLEY: They know the way to get you 9 involved, don't they? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mother does. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's it. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Oehler? 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not a whole lot. We drained 16 Ingram Lake last week. We'll talk about some of that later 17 in the morning, whenever Freese-Nichols comes to make the 18 presentation. Anyway, all went well. Got all the 19 permissions necessary to do it. So far, you know, no -- no 20 terrible phone calls. The lake is drained as low as it's 21 going to go, and did it pretty quick. That's it. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. I appreciate your 23 grabbing ahold of that thing, because it was fast-moving, and 24 needed to have someone that was able to make things happen, 25 and we appreciate that. Let's get on with our agenda, if we 11-22-10 15 1 might. Item 1 is to consider, discuss, take appropriate 2 action concerning various issues on Center Point River Road 3 between Crossing Street Bridge and Dave and Shelly's Place, 4 and set a public hearing regarding installation of three-way 5 stop signs at Harless Way East and Center Point River Road, 6 and another three-way stop at Crossing Street East and Center 7 Point River Road, all located in Precinct 2. Mr. Odom? 8 MR. ODOM: Yes, Judge. Good morning. We've given 9 the Court a chronological timeline concerning this particular 10 area of Center Point River Road, and I think for expedience, 11 that I not go through it. So, basically, we had a meeting 12 several times, and we had a meeting back on August the 24th, 13 2010, at our Road and Bridge office, and you see the 14 attendees for that. And at this time, Mr. O'Fiel, who is the 15 attorney for Mr. Johns, had asked about a three-way stop sign 16 being installed. As you can see, this issue has been worked 17 on diligently, and we have reduced the speed through some 18 markings on the road and all, which is good also. But we 19 would like to try the installation of a three-way stop at 20 Harless Way East and at Crossing Street. Being that these 21 are regulatory signs, a public hearing will need to be set, 22 giving the opportunity for anyone to speak their thoughts 23 about this proposal. 24 We also need to discuss the pedestrian crossing 25 signs that -- there were signs that were put up in our 11-22-10 16 1 right-of-way. They were told to take them down. They 2 haven't been done at this time. And -- and I will go out 3 today, but as of last time you and I discussed, they had not. 4 So, if they are, then that takes care of one problem. But -- 5 excuse me just a second -- they need to be removed. If 6 they're back on his property, I don't care, but not on our 7 property, right-of-way. At this time, we ask the Court to 8 set a public hearing regarding the installation of a 9 three-way stop at Harless Way and Center Point River Road, 10 and also at Crossing Street East and Center Point Road for 11 December the 28th, 2010, at 9 a.m. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to approve 15 a public hearing on the matter to be set for December 28th, 16 2010, at 9 a.m. Question or discussion on that motion? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Leonard, are you going to have 18 -- well, at the public hearing, do you anticipate wanting to 19 move forward with this? 20 MR. ODOM: I want to move forward with it. After 21 the public hearing, y'all can make that decision, see if 22 there is anyone objecting to that. I've heard so many 23 different things in prior meetings down at the -- the bridge. 24 I think y'all have heard that too, about how fast traffic 25 goes along in there. This would facilitate slowing that down 11-22-10 17 1 around that curve down to the bridge, as well as up in some 2 areas there by Mr. Steadham and some rental properties in 3 there where children are supposed to be at, and up there at 4 the tavern. It would also facilitate maybe slowing that down 5 and stopping it. Let's put it this way; enforcement will 6 stop it. I will facilitate, I believe, the improvement of 7 it, that speed. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask you a question. 9 As far as the agenda is concerned in December, having those 10 agenda items, -- 11 MR. ODOM: That's right. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- is it one public hearing 13 for two different signs? Or do you have a public hearing for 14 each one? 15 MR. ODOM: To me, I -- I would assume one public 16 hearing for both signs at that location. Same road, Center 17 Point River Road. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't know that I -- I think 20 I might kind of go along with -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I disagree, but, you know, 22 he's the chief. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And the reason, because they're 24 two separate locations. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 11-22-10 18 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I can see going with one 2 and not the other. I guess you could do it either way, but I 3 think it's cleaner if we have two public hearings. 4 MR. HENNEKE: It probably is. I think it doesn't 5 hurt anything to do two separate public hearings for the two 6 different locations. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just set them 10 minutes 8 apart or 5 minutes apart. 9 MR. ODOM: Five minutes apart. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 9:00 and 9:05. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And -- yeah. 12 MR. ODOM: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To me, they're -- one of them 14 is a lot more necessary than the other one, in my mind, but 15 looking at it, certainly hoping -- 16 MR. ODOM: That's fine. I -- for expediency, I was 17 just doing one. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sure. 19 MR. HENNEKE: I'd like to recognize -- Mr. Odom has 20 already done a tremendous amount to address the issues there 21 with the painting of the speed limit on the road and by 22 cleaning up the right-of-way, but the concerns have continued 23 on that stretch of -- of road, and from both the concerns 24 about the bridge, speed of traffic, and also the speed of 25 traffic from people that are crossing the street to get to 11-22-10 19 1 the river. And -- but I think Mr. Odom's already done quite 2 a bit, and he's done a great job to address the concerns out 3 there. 4 MR. ODOM: Yeah. What we've done so far probably 5 is fine right now, but how long would that last without 6 facilitating -- doing this? We have stop signs all through 7 Center Point, and if they had a city limits, that would be in 8 the city limits. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: One -- I mean, my looking at 11 it, down by Dave's Place there's a lot of people cross -- 12 people walking across that road. That's a dangerous spot, 13 and somewhere on River Road, I agree, we need a stop sign to 14 slow that traffic down. Just looks like that one by that 15 corner -- 16 MR. ODOM: At Crossing Street, you mean? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, the Crossing Street one. 18 MR. ODOM: Well, that is -- and the reason I do 19 that, if you've been at some of the meetings -- and the Judge 20 was at one meeting in Center Point -- there was a continual 21 complaint about the speed, and children and pedestrians 22 walking on that bridge, crossing right there. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 24 MR. ODOM: So when we looked at it, I mean, I took 25 everything into consideration. And even -- that speed is 11-22-10 20 1 running 31 to 33 miles an hour right along in there before 2 you hit that curve, so I was trying to slow it down. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My question is, I don't see how 4 the stop sign's going to make you go any slower than that 5 curve makes you go. If you're going around -- I mean, that 6 curve slows you down. 7 MR. ODOM: That curve is extreme. And it could not 8 be modified much. I mean, the state -- we've looked at that 9 too, so the state was a -- was a control point on their 10 elevation and everything else before. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. But anyway, that's 12 fine. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Questions? Comments? So, the 14 motion is to set two public hearings, one at 9 a.m., one at 15 9:05, first one to be the first proposed three-way stop at 16 Harless Way and Center Point River Road, and the second to be 17 a three-way stop at Crossing Street East and Center Point 18 River Road. Is that correct? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, sir. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion? 21 MS. HOFFER: Hey, Judge, do we also on that, then, 22 have to do two finals? Two separate finals, or can we do one 23 final after the two separate -- 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Best do two. 25 MS. HOFFER: Two finals? 11-22-10 21 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 2 MS. HOFFER: Okay. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion? All 4 in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 5 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 7 (No response.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 9 our 9:05 timed item; to consider, discuss, take appropriate 10 action to approve proposal from architect Peter Lewis for 11 fees and estimated costs for new Ingram Annex building. 12 Commissioner Oehler? 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I was asked to do this last 14 meeting, and Peter Lewis is here to present what he thinks 15 it's going to cost. 16 MR. LEWIS: Morning, Judge, Commissioners. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Morning. 18 MR. LEWIS: Thank you for the opportunity to come 19 before you this morning. Commissioner Oehler and I have 20 visited several times, and I have worked with a local general 21 contractor to come up with some budget numbers for 22 construction of an 1,800 square foot, one-story, 23 pre-engineered metal building shell, basically shell only, 24 with rough-in electrical and rough-in plumbing. The plan is 25 to have restrooms and offices in there eventually, and 11-22-10 22 1 Commissioner Oehler has offered that there are some other 2 ways to get some of that interior construction done. So, the 3 number -- the budget number that we have come up with is for 4 the shell only, and not the site work either. The site work 5 would also be handled by county forces. The budget number 6 that we have come up with is -- has a little bit of 7 contingency in it. It has contractor's overhead and profit, 8 and for that 1,800 square foot building and a 300 square foot 9 porch, about a 2,100 square foot slab area, our -- our 10 estimated budget is $80,000. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That includes your fees? 12 MR. LEWIS: No, my fees are actually on top of 13 that, and the fees that we had -- thank you for asking. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I should haven't asked. Just 15 automatically assume that. 16 MR. LEWIS: At the last Commissioners Court 17 meeting, I was unable to be here, but Commissioner Oehler 18 presented faithfully on my behalf a proposal to do an hourly 19 agreement to provide architectural, structural, mechanical, 20 engineering drawings for that building on an hourly basis, to 21 a guaranteed maximum amount of $14,500, and that would 22 include soup to nuts for you. We would work with whatever 23 county forces -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Soup to nuts, huh? 25 MR. LEWIS: Soup to nuts. Whatever county 11-22-10 23 1 forces -- you know, county staff, J.P. staff or tax office 2 staff, we would work with them, Commissioners Court, to make 3 sure that we get the layout of the building inside correct, 4 and then technical documents for construction, assist you in 5 bidding, and monitor the project during construction, the 6 same as we did on the Sheriff's annex in this past year. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, on the -- do you 8 have an estimate on the additional cost? 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The additional cost would 10 only be -- what I intend to do is, last week, you know, we 11 tore down the -- the outdoor arena. I got with the 12 contractor that tore that down, and I retrieved all the 13 posts, and I intend to sawmill those into lumber to use for 14 part of the interior. And I'd like to tear down the old 15 teachers quarters at Reservation School and utilize all that 16 lumber and all the materials there that can be used to finish 17 out the inside of that, and do that with maintenance staff. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- but what about plumbing, 19 electrical? 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, that will be 21 something -- we have the plumbing -- I have no idea on that. 22 I mean, we've got -- this bid is somewhat high, just that 23 "cover yourself" thing. But we would have to have a plumber 24 that we have on an hourly annual bid do the top-out with, you 25 know, fixtures and -- on both plumbing and electrical, and 11-22-10 24 1 then heating and air conditioning. We have all -- I believe 2 all three of those on board, annual bid by the hour. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we kind of need to know 4 that, because if we go forward with this project, to me, we 5 need to get it done so we can stop the old -- and I don't 6 want to have a building sitting out there empty. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Right. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: While we're paying rent on 9 another building. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mm-hmm. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we need to know. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We can nail that down a 13 little closer. Do you have any ideas on the cost on the 14 other stuff? 15 MR. LEWIS: Well, you know, I -- I'm not prepared 16 to respond on all the items. I know on the plumbing, the 17 rough-in number was about 8,000, a finish-out for the 18 bathrooms was a total of 20, so about a $12,000 swing, plus 19 contractor's overhead and profit. And these are -- all those 20 are numbers -- the overhead and profit multiplier, I'm using 21 15 percent. So -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably look at another -- 23 probably -- 24 MR. LEWIS: Electrical, probably another -- I've 25 got a $5,000 rough-in. It's probably another 5,000 to 7,000 11-22-10 25 1 on electrical. 2 MR. ODOM: What about site work? 3 MR. LEWIS: Site work is -- I don't have a number 4 for that. 5 MR. ODOM: Is it going to be like the S.O.? 6 MR. LEWIS: Yes. 7 MR. ODOM: Where we have to dig down 6 feet? 8 MR. LEWIS: Oh, I think not. But I don't know; 9 that soil out there has been -- it is fill that's been placed 10 there over time, so there would have to be an analysis of 11 that, of soils out there before either the building or the 12 site work was done, and the parking. But -- but we had 13 discussed that the County would do any of that paving out 14 there, like you did you out there. 15 MR. ODOM: The material -- I mean, there's the cost 16 of material. And -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And the H.V.A.C. is probably 18 going to be, what, 15? 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think we need -- I don't 20 know. You're talking about real small spaces. I think we 21 need two separate units there, though, or -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You can do 15, I bet. 23 MR. LEWIS: We can -- if -- 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You can get closer at the 25 next meeting, if you want to do that. 11-22-10 26 1 MR. LEWIS: We can come back with a full-tilt -- 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 3 MR. LEWIS: And we'll estimate something on the 4 parking. We'll do it at market rates, as if you were to go 5 out to a general contractor, and then you could let Mr. Odom 6 look at what he might do in terms of the paving, with a 7 caveat that we don't -- we don't expect to excavate 5 or 6 8 feet of fill out there. But -- 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I can't imagine doing that. 10 Most of that's pretty good material that was put down -- 11 MR. LEWIS: One-story building, simple slab, small 12 area. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- over 10 or 12 years. It 14 was kind of compacted when it was put in there. If it's 15 going to settle, it would have settled. But, anyway, you 16 still have to know those things. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Any more questions for Mr. Lewis? 18 We thank you, sir. Appreciate it. 19 MR. LEWIS: Thank you. Appreciate it. Happy 20 Thanksgiving to y'all. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Same to you, sir. Okay. Let's go 22 to our 9:15 item. We'll now recess the Commissioners Court 23 meeting, and I will convene a public hearing for the revision 24 of plat for Lot 125-R, consisting of Lot 1 of Howard's Hill, 25 as set forth in Volume 6, Page 203, Plat Records, and Lots 11-22-10 27 1 124 and 125 of Country Manor, Section 2, as set forth in 2 Volume 4, Page 222, Plat Records, and all located in Precinct 3 1. 4 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 9:31 a.m., and a public hearing was held in open 5 court, as follows:) 6 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Is there any member of the public 8 that wishes to be heard with respect to the revision of the 9 plat for Lot 125-R, consisting of Lot 1 of Howard's Hill, as 10 set forth in Volume 6, Page 203, and Lots 124 and 125 of 11 Country Manor, Section 2, as set forth in Volume 4, Page 222? 12 Seeing no one coming forward, I will close the public hearing 13 for the revision of plat for Lot 125-R, consisting of Lot 1 14 of Howard's Hill, as set forth in Volume 6, Page 203, and 15 Lots 124 and 125 of Country Manor, Section 2, as set forth in 16 Volume 4, Page 222, in Precinct 1. 17 (The public hearing was concluded at 9:32 a.m., and the regular Commissioners Court meeting was 18 reopened.) 19 - - - - - - - - - - 20 JUDGE TINLEY: And let's move to our 9:20 timed 21 item. I will reconvene the Commissioners Court meeting, and 22 we'll go to Item 6; consider, discuss, take appropriate 23 action for the final approval for the revision of plat for 24 Lot 125-R, consisting of Lot 1 of Howard's Hill, as set forth 25 in Volume 6, Page 203, and Lots 124 and 125, Country Manor, 11-22-10 28 1 Section 2, set forth in Volume 4, Page 222. Mr. Odom? 2 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. Thank you. All the 3 requirements have been met. At this time, we ask the Court 4 for their final approval for the revision of plat of Lot 5 125-R of Country Manor, Section 2, Precinct 1. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can you remind me what we did 7 here? I mean -- 8 MR. ODOM: What we did, we had two people in this 9 subdivision that were involved in it, and we combined -- they 10 had two lots -- they had three lots down there, I think -- 11 two lots, and combined them up there, Ridge Grove and Glen 12 Shadows. We just combined those two lots into one. We had 13 smaller lots and made it into one big lot, brought it into 14 another subdivision. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's what I'm -- it used to 16 be -- I'm looking at the as-platted; I'm trying to figure out 17 -- I'm not sure I understand. 18 MR. ODOM: You see Lot 2 up there? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, sir. 20 MR. ODOM: And you have Lot 1. And they brought 21 in, I believe, 20 -- I can't read that number right there. 22 My eyes. They brought in two lots to make this thing come 23 out at Ridge Grove. We're just combining lots, making it 24 bigger. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Move for approval. 11-22-10 29 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 3 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? 4 Mr. Voelkel? 5 MR. VOELKEL: Yes, sir. I just wanted to make one 6 comment. This, as you are aware, is an ETJ plat, and we have 7 been to the City of Kerrville on November the 4th; they had 8 their public hearing. They approved the plat. They have a 9 strange policy at the city on these ETJ plats, that they will 10 not sign the plat until the County has had their public 11 hearing, approved it, and signed it. I have a request that 12 once you have done that today, if that's the will of the 13 Court, that I get the plat back before we -- we record it to 14 take it back to City Hall to let the Planning Commission sign 15 the plat. It's very interesting how that works, but it's 16 just a -- it's just a lot of legwork that's probably 17 unnecessary, but right now that's the City's poly. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Gives you something to do, though, 19 doesn't it? 20 MR. VOELKEL: Gives me a lot to do, yes, sir. 21 Thank you, sir. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? All in favor of the 23 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 11-22-10 30 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll go to 3 Item 1.7, a 9:25 timed item; to consider, discuss, take 4 appropriate action for final approval for the private road 5 name of White Cross Road Northwest, and located in Precinct 6 4. Mr. Odom? 7 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. This is just a name change to 8 a private road, and at this time, we ask for your final 9 approval. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Move approval. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 13 approval. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 14 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Let's go to Item 19 8; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action to review 20 the concept plan for a water line easement across county 21 property located in Precinct 2. Mr. Odom? 22 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. I'm sorry, I thought I was 23 through for a second. This -- Mr. Jenschke came to the 24 office and was talking about bringing a line across our 25 property at the back back there, approximately at the -- 11-22-10 31 1 around the asphalt pit, coming across there as close to our 2 property line as he can get. This was access off the water 3 line on Spur 100. I have no problems with it. I think that 4 he has come and also talked to the Judge about it. I sent 5 him there to discuss it, and personally, it'll be down deep 6 enough, it will be expedient for them, plus we'll have a line 7 in there; if anything should ever happen, we -- we've got a 8 line that we can tap into should we need it. So, I think 9 it's to the benefit of Road and Bridge, as well as -- as the 10 credit union up there. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This is potable water you're 12 talking about? 13 MR. ODOM: Yes. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 17 approval. Question or discussion? The -- the credit union 18 people sometime back came to see me, and they had 19 investigated numerous possible options with the City to try 20 and get water over there to their -- to their business 21 location, and they just couldn't come up with anything. And 22 finally got all the way back down the road to Spur 100, and 23 said, well, if we can just bring it across you guys, whatever 24 the cost, we'll pay. So -- 25 MR. ODOM: Yeah. And the City wasn't objecting. I 11-22-10 32 1 think they had a real problem of a portable water -- just to 2 get it across to the other side of the highway there, with 3 all the hassle and the cost. So, to me, it was just a 4 win-win for us, for the County if this came out. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Where's their water come from 6 now, the credit union? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Comes from the V.A. well. 8 MR. ODOM: V.A. well. And the V.A.'s cutting them 9 off. I think they asked them to find a way to do it. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I see. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the issue with the V.A. well 12 is, I don't think that thing's ever been tested or -- I'm not 13 sure. I don't think so. 14 MR. ODOM: Well -- 15 JUDGE TINLEY: I know for their drinking water, 16 they've told me that they use bottled water. At the -- at 17 the credit union. 18 MR. ODOM: Remind me not to go to the V.A. 19 Hospital. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think it's intended to be 21 their in-house potable water supply, is what I'm telling you, 22 at the V.A. 23 MR. ODOM: Anyway, they were in a bind, and was 24 asked to do it another way, and this was a logical way to do 25 it. And we'd have a line right through our property, so we 11-22-10 33 1 could tap into it if we ever needed it. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 3 MR. HENNEKE: And, Judge, Commissioners, to 4 clarify, the Court, I guess, voted with a favorable opinion 5 of the proposal. Of course, nothing's been brought back for 6 approval, and it wasn't noticed for today's meeting to 7 approve any specific route or easement or anything, I think 8 is what I understood the Court just did. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, we've got a general -- general 10 route that's described in the backup materials as to where 11 they would install this line. 12 MR. ODOM: That's correct. And Mr. Voelkel has 13 also gone out there and platted that line route, so we know 14 where it's at, and it's already been basically platted out. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we can -- if I 16 understand what the County Attorney's saying, we're going to 17 need to have a legal instrument -- 18 MR. ODOM: Drawn. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- drawn up for this. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Or legal easement. 22 MR. ODOM: Yeah. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, yeah. Sure. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 25 MR. ODOM: I can't sign that; it would be y'all. 11-22-10 34 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, are we going to authorize 3 the County Judge to sign that instrument when it comes 4 through? Rather than dealing with this thing again? Who 5 made the motion? Oh. That's what I said. That's what I 6 intended in my motion. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's what I intended in my 9 second. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. So, we have that issue 11 covered. Any other question or discussion on the motion? 12 All in favor of that motion, signify by raising your right 13 hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go 18 back to Item 3; to consider, discuss, and take appropriate 19 action to recommend to the Charles Schreiner Road Fund 20 trustee, that being Security State Bank and Trust, the matter 21 of expenditure of earnings from the trust. Ms. Hargis? 22 MS. HARGIS: As you recall, I brought this as an 23 amendment at the last meeting, and y'all asked me to contact 24 Security State Bank. As you noticed, there is an e-mail from 25 Security State Bank stating that there's really no 11-22-10 35 1 distribution this year, but we do have approximately $65,000 2 in that account, and they have no objections to us using 3 those funds, as long as you approve the work. And there are 4 two roads listed that we gave you. One is Coker Road in 5 Precinct 1, and the other one is Cutbirth Road in Precinct 4. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We got to cut Coker out; we 7 need that in Precinct 4. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Negative. (Laughter.) 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Move approval. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We are -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: We're not cutting Coker out. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Unless you'd like for me to 14 include that in my motion. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're approving what? 16 MS. HARGIS: We're approving the amendment to use 17 the funds for this budget year. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. Second. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 20 indicated. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 21 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. We'll move to 11-22-10 36 1 Item 4; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 2 declare an H.P. printer as a surplus item for the 216th 3 District Attorney's office. 4 MS. HARGIS: I don't see her here, but she 5 requested that. It's a printer that cannot be repaired, 6 so -- 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 11 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 12 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's go to 17 Item 9; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 18 finalize and determine Texas County and District Retirement 19 System rate for Kerr County for 2011. I put this on the 20 agenda. As the Court will recall, annually, by the 15th of 21 December of each year, we're required to officially notify 22 the T.C.D.R.S. of what our elections are to participate in 23 their system for the coming year, and again we must do that. 24 Our budgeting was based upon no changes in our current 25 elections, and -- but I just need the approval in order to 11-22-10 37 1 submit that to T.C.D.R.S. by December 15th. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Leave it the same? 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, leave it the same. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 7 approval. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 8 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 9 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 11 (No response.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 13 Item 10; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action on 14 forfeiture report for the 198th District Attorney. I put 15 this on the agenda at the request of the D.A.'s office to 16 approve. It's a requirement of the law. It's an interesting 17 report, -- 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: -- needless to say. There -- 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: How much do you reckon the 21 Sheriff's going to get out of this? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: I'll let you ask him that question. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't get any out of that. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There he is. He was quiet. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just can't see him back there; 11-22-10 38 1 he's kind of low. 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Tell me how much is in there 3 and I'll try and get some of it. (Laughter.) 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It says ending balance, if 5 I'm reading this correctly, is 1.661 million. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Probably about right. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 661,933. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Do you have any questions about it, 9 Ms. Hargis? 10 MS. HARGIS: No, sir. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Seems to be in order. 12 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Does this also confirm or bolster 14 the requirement that prosecutors or other folks who spend 15 forfeiture funds are required to get Commissioners Court 16 approval for any salaries they pay, or salary supplements to 17 county employees? That permission probably needs to come 18 prior to budget approval, but this would seem to confirm it, 19 would it not? 20 MS. HARGIS: This confirms it, but he also 21 presented that at his budget, that they would be taking 22 certain items out of that to -- when you approved his budget, 23 you actually approved that. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 25 MS. HARGIS: They are required to submit a budget 11-22-10 39 1 on all these forfeiture funds in advance. They don't really 2 have to send them to the Court; they just have to tell you 3 that they are going to use the funds for this purpose. And 4 all of the people required to do these reports have issued a 5 budget. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Question. These are funds that 7 are seized directly by the 198th -- 8 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- police force? I mean, I 10 don't know what else you call it, their little black vans you 11 see running around the interstate. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Charcoal gray. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Charcoal gray. Trying to 14 figure out what they were. I'm just wondering -- just wanted 15 to make sure that it wasn't in addition to what the local law 16 enforcement are seizing in these counties. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It could be part of that. If 18 we made a seizure and we filed the case in the 198th, there's 19 a portion of the seizure we make that goes to the 198th, if 20 that's the court we filed it in. But the same thing is -- if 21 they make the seizure and we assisted on it, then there's a 22 portion of their seizure that goes to the Sheriff's Office. 23 So, it's an interlocal agreement that's signed, and 24 percentages on how that works. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My question is, under -- it 11-22-10 40 1 says, "Amount seized by employees of your agency." So, this 2 is the net that -- that they're getting? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. 4 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So any other amounts get 6 distributed before the report. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: There's different lines in 8 that report. That's in one of the other parts. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, what is the 11 appropriate action? Accept? 12 JUDGE TINLEY: The certification provides that the 13 Commissioners Court has conducted the audit required, and 14 that based upon that audit, we believe it to be correct and 15 meet requirements of Chapter 59 of the Code of Criminal 16 Procedure. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Absolutely. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. Wait a minute, yours was a 21 motion? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm a motion. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. All right. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I kind of wanted to second 25 it too, see if I could get away with that, for later on. 11-22-10 41 1 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. All right. We have a motion 2 and a second to certify that Commissioners Court has audited 3 as required by law and made the finding required. Question 4 or discussion on the motion? All in favor of the motion, 5 signify by raising your right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's move 10 to Item 11; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 11 approve contracts with K'Star, CASA, Big Brothers/Big 12 Sisters, Dietert Center, Families and Literacy, and allow the 13 County Judge to sign same. These are standard contracts for 14 those county-sponsored agencies in the, for the most part, 15 greatly reduced amounts this budget year. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 19 approval of the agreements. Question or discussion? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The contracts are the same 21 except for the amount? Very good. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor, signify by raising 23 your right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 11-22-10 42 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 3 Item 15; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action on 4 reports from various county offices on telephone service, and 5 reports from I.T. Director. Commissioner Baldwin? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, Judge. We've 7 been hearing from the Sheriff about -- Rusty, do you want to 8 come up here? 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Smart aleck. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Not big enough. About his 11 telephone system not working, and the more I thought about 12 it, the crazier this thing got. And he actually called me 13 one day and says, "Call my emergency number." And I did, 14 several times, and could not get through. And, number one, 15 that scares me, on behalf of the citizens of our community. 16 And, number two, it just -- it just says liability to me. 17 But -- and this thing's got to be cleared up. And the more I 18 talk about it and look around, there's other offices that are 19 still having some issues with -- with the new phone service, 20 and I just want to get it cleared up. I'm not interested in 21 beating anybody up or pointing a finger at anybody. I just 22 want to get it cleared up, and particularly with our 23 emergency services. Now, before -- before this issue gets 24 too cloudy here, I want to -- a recommendation that I want to 25 lay on the table, a possible recommendation to -- just to 11-22-10 43 1 consider is that we contact Hill Country Telephone. If you 2 remember, when we -- when we first started doing business 3 with them, one of their sales points was, "If you can think 4 it, we can do it," something similar to that. And I'm 5 just -- I'm thinking that we could ask Hill Country Telephone 6 to come in and take a look at our system and troubleshoot it 7 and see where our problems are. If we're still -- I haven't 8 checked. I'm assuming we're still having problems this 9 morning; I have no idea. But if we are, to get some help 10 from outside. But other than that, I just wanted to bring it 11 to the table, and let's have the discussion. I'm assuming 12 that the Sheriff of Kerr County will have some comments, and 13 I don't know if any other offices have showed up or not; I 14 don't have any idea. But if they have problems, they need to 15 be down here talking to us. So, I'm going to turn it over to 16 the various county offices to talk about the telephone 17 service, or -- and our I.T. Director come forward and tell us 18 -- give us a report and an update on the issues. Y'all don't 19 run over each other out there. 20 MR. TROLINGER: I don't see a line forming. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Me either. You are the 22 line. 23 MR. TROLINGER: I did inquire -- once I saw the 24 agenda item, I did go and make some inquiries to seek out 25 problems from the courthouse. I checked with the County 11-22-10 44 1 Clerk, who's probably got the largest volume of phone calls 2 in the courthouse, and did not get a problem of any type. 3 Thank you, Jannett. And the Sheriff's Office continues to 4 have problems with both the phone service and individual 5 phones. We're working on those. We're resolving them. But 6 as the Sheriff said before, individual problems, different 7 things keep happening, and those different things we keep 8 fixing. Hill Country Telephone is here; they're represented 9 today if we have questions for them about the phone service. 10 And, Commissioner Baldwin, the particular instance that you 11 referred to of the phone outage was the telephone trunk; it 12 was actually turned off for a time period. And -- 13 MR. TINLEY: I can -- 14 MR. TROLINGER: And Hill Country Telephone can 15 speak to that. 16 MR. TINLEY: Yes, sir. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand that the 18 telephone service up to the walls -- the outer walls of the 19 courthouse are Hill Country Telephone; then once it gets 20 inside, it's ours. Is that basically -- 21 MR. TINLEY: Yes, sir. 22 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. 23 MR. TINLEY: Yes, sir. Yes. My name is Patrick 24 Tinley, Jr. I'm the central office supervisor -- 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You actually come out in 11-22-10 45 1 public and talk like that? (Laughter.) 2 MR. TINLEY: Yes, sir. We were working on the 3 issue with the Sprint calls that were getting duplicated at 4 the Sheriff's Office, and in the time we had the vendor, 5 which is GenBand, which used to be Nortel, was working on the 6 switch, trying to determine the problem that was occurring 7 with the failed calls. What would happen is, when somebody 8 would hit "send" on their phone, it would send the call to 9 the Sheriff's office twice. The first call the dispatcher 10 would answer, it would be dead air. Then the next call, it 11 would be the actual person. I talked to Sprint at length, 12 and they found there was trouble in the towers. At least 13 that's what they told me. They said they were going to reset 14 the towers. At that time, they reset the towers. It took 15 about an hour and a half before we saw any improvement. 16 Beyond that, we have been still working with Sprint, 17 particularly on some long distance issues. It affects our 18 co-op area, as well as our area here in Kerrville and in 19 Mason. So, we -- we've been diligently working on those 20 issues. 21 I've been working with John now -- oh, I don't know 22 how long we've been working together, probably the better 23 part of the year on issues. I've known John since I was at 24 TRC Engineering, and now I'm with Hill Country, so we have a 25 good relationship. John can get ahold of me at a moment's 11-22-10 46 1 notice, so it's not a problem. We were working on the 2 problem with the duplicate calls when the vendor 3 misunderstood which T-1 -- the T-1 is the signal that the PRI 4 rides on. He accidentally turned the wrong T-1 -- T-1 down. 5 At that time, we were notified by John; John said there's 6 something going on. We -- you know, the vendor said, "That 7 was my fault; I got the wrong T-1." Cause his T-1 is 3116, 8 and the T-1 he was supposed to turn down was 3216. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I would have known the 10 difference. 11 MR. TINLEY: So he got them mixed up. So, you 12 know, like you said, we would be more than happy -- and I've 13 -- I've offered, you know, if John needs assistance, you 14 know, my staff is at his disposal. So we have been more than 15 happy to help you guys, you know, 'cause obviously, public 16 safety is paramount. We don't want to cause anybody to not 17 be able to get ahold of a dispatcher. And, you know, we want 18 -- you know, we live in this community too. You know, I 19 don't want to pick up the phone and not be able to get ahold 20 of you guys. So, we are very, very sensitive to that -- that 21 problem. So -- 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. Thank you. 23 Thank you very much. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The question I have -- I'm not 25 sure if it goes to you or to John. But John said that there 11-22-10 47 1 were many different problems, and you keep fixing them, 2 mainly at the Sheriff's department. Why do we have -- why 3 are there many different problems? Is there a wiring 4 problem? Is -- where's the -- I mean, that just doesn't make 5 sense to me, why there continues to be problems. 6 MR. TROLINGER: Well, for instance, this morning 7 there was a problem in the jail; one of the phones was 8 forwarded to the wrong place, so the calls going to the jail 9 were getting forwarded back to someone. And it's just 10 punching the wrong button on the phone. The previous 11 problems in dispatch, we actually had hardware problems with 12 the phones. We replaced the phones. In the front, the main 13 number for the Sheriff's Office, there was a compatibility 14 problem between the expansion module that's got all these 15 buttons for speed dials and busy lamp fields, and that 16 compatibility problem was between the phone hardware, and we 17 fixed that. We replaced that, and the problem's not 18 reoccurring, so it's fixed. But there are different problems 19 that come up, and we fix them as they come up, whether 20 they're major or minor. And every one of these problems 21 gives me great angst, and I just stay after it until it's 22 fixed. And the Sheriff's real good about making sure 23 everybody reports the problems, so everything that's 24 happening is getting -- getting reported, which is really 25 good. But there are lots of different problems. So far, no 11-22-10 48 1 wiring problems that I know of. We did run wire to a great 2 many of the phones ourselves in-house. We -- I.T. actually 3 ran the wire. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there a way I can 5 troubleshoot the system to make sure everything's compatible 6 and working properly? I mean, why -- I guess what confused 7 me, all of a sudden there's a hardware compatibility problem. 8 Why has that just started? 9 MR. TROLINGER: Well, the Sheriff specified that 10 the dispatcher and the front phone have -- have these busy 11 lamp fields that they can press the button and speed dial, 12 very quickly transfer calls. Although we had planned on that 13 and it was specified in the original system, we never 14 installed that in the courthouse. When we went to install 15 the Sheriff's Office, we did it about a month in advance 16 before we actually went over to Hill Country's system. It 17 seemed to work okay, but when we went online and the calls 18 started coming in and needed to be transferred, it just 19 wasn't working. Took a little bit of troubleshooting. We 20 finally identified it and got the right hardware matched up, 21 so it works correctly. And since -- 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Are we talking about service 23 problems or equipment problems, or some combination of the 24 two? And compared to when it started and where we are now, 25 what is that mix? 11-22-10 49 1 MR. TROLINGER: We have -- 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Do you understand? 3 MR. TROLINGER: We have both hardware -- our 4 telephone system hardware itself, and the service. And Hill 5 Country Telephone has been just great to work with. As soon 6 as I report a problem on e-mail, I get a response very 7 quickly. The outage was resolved within about three minutes 8 of me making the phone call. The hardware, the majority of 9 it's working. There are one or two problems remaining. 10 They're back in the jail right now, and I think we've got to 11 replace the phone back there. I.T. specialist Matt Comer's 12 over there right now looking at it to determine if we've got 13 to replace that phone. Otherwise, all the other phones in 14 the Sheriff's Office and the county system are operational. 15 There's one out of about 238 that have a problem this 16 morning. And then the telephone service that Patrick alluded 17 to, even though Sprint has reset their system, we are still 18 seeing problems with call delivery from those phones, and as 19 of this morning, the latest example was one of the 20 dispatchers actually called; the phone rang once with no one 21 on it, and the second time it rang in dispatch, it was that 22 call being completed, but only one phone call was placed. 23 So, that's a phone service issue, so we have both. We have 24 both hardware problems and phone service issues, and we're 25 working through each of those. 11-22-10 50 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are those -- is Sprint 2 involved? They're coming in on Sprint cell phones? 3 MR. TINLEY: Yes. I have initiated trouble tickets 4 with Sprint, as I don't have control over their network or 5 their switching equipment. And that's the reason I contacted 6 them, because when I had the vendor online, when the incident 7 occurred, he could see two calls setups coming in, like, 8 within seven seconds of each other. And when I contacted 9 Sprint -- using an employee cell phone, 'cause we don't have 10 a direct trunk to them; they actually send their calls to us 11 via San Antonio. I contacted them and opened a trouble 12 ticket with that subscriber's cell phone. And as soon as I 13 told them what was going on, they knew -- they said that this 14 has occurred before, and it's something with the towers. 15 But, obviously, if they reset the towers and it was fine for 16 probably most of the -- the rest of the week and the weekend, 17 and then it's now started occurring, so I don't know if 18 they've done a new software load on their towers or what it 19 is, 'cause we don't have the same problem with AT&T cell 20 phones, West Central Wireless, Five Star. None of the other 21 major players -- I think Cricket, but I think Cricket uses 22 the Sprint network. 23 MR. TROLINGER: And what made it difficult to 24 identify the problem is that it's only happening on the 25 Sheriff's Office phone numbers. It's not happening on the 11-22-10 51 1 phone numbers that are coming into the courthouse or the 2 airport or the extension -- none of the other numbers are 3 having that problem. So, immediately, I'm thinking it must 4 be a hardware problem, that I've got something wrong. So, it 5 was difficult to troubleshoot, but once we identified that it 6 was the carrier, you know, right away went after it to fix 7 it. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I just have a hard -- I mean, 9 I'm just trying to figure it out, 'cause I use Sprint. And 10 how can a problem -- this trigger to one number? I mean, how 11 -- I don't see how that works. 12 MR. TINLEY: I think it has to do with -- the 13 number was ported. And when they make a call, and to a 14 ported number, the first thing they -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's "ported" mean? 16 MR. TINLEY: Ported, we took the number from 17 Windstream to our system. And by doing that, that number 18 typically resided in Windstream's network. And when you port 19 the number, you actually -- there's a database inquiry that 20 comes into play, so that when you call the number, the -- the 21 PST -- and the public switch telephone network typically is 22 everything's routed by that number, but now that numbers are 23 ported, the number has to be a database dip. So -- and the 24 national database, they go up and look up the -- now this 25 number belongs to Hill Country. And that number is assigned 11-22-10 52 1 what we call a local routing number, and then the local 2 routing number is how they are supposed to route their call. 3 I don't know if that's triggering the issue, because all the 4 numbers here at the courthouse are the same way. They're all 5 ported, and they all have an LRN trigger associated with it. 6 So, it's just -- I don't know. It's a very -- 'cause I don't 7 have any other subscribers reporting similar problems. It's 8 just -- but we did see -- the vendor did see that the call 9 was being duplicated from the network twice within seven 10 seconds, which shouldn't happen. That would be like if you 11 hit your cell phone and hit send, let it wait 7 or 10 12 seconds, then hit end, then hit send again. It just 13 shouldn't be happening. And the lady at Sprint, she said 14 she's seen this happen before, and she said they were going 15 to reset the towers, 'cause that's usually what it is, is 16 that even though the subscriber sends the call to the tower, 17 the tower was duplicating the call twice. So, why -- why it 18 is on the 896 -- is it 896-1216 and -1133? I have no idea. 19 That is a mystery. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, last week I called as a 21 citizen, and let's pretend that, you know, there's somebody 22 breaking in my house, and I realize my shotgun's out in the 23 truck. So, I need -- I need some help, so I call the 24 emergency number and I get some kind of recording. I can't 25 remember what it was, but it was some kind of recording. 11-22-10 53 1 MR. TINLEY: Yeah. That was at the time that the 2 T-1 was turned down. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There wasn't a human being 4 that answered the phone to help me. 5 MR. TINLEY: No, sir. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It was a recording. So, 7 we've got that kind of thing cleared up? 8 MR. TINLEY: Yes, sir. That was a problem -- the 9 vendor accidentally turned the wrong T-1 down. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: For your information, I've 11 got another shotgun in the house. 12 MR. TINLEY: Yes, sir. Just don't use it on me. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sheriff, are we making headway? 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: In the last few days, I think 16 we may be making headway. Now, what John said this morning 17 about the Sprint calls still, the deal with the dispatcher, 18 the dispatcher called the office from her cell phone last 19 night. She called twice, couldn't never ever get through. 20 It dropped both calls. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Did she use Sprint? 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: She was using Sprint. My 23 problem is, we never ever -- and I don't understand this 24 stuff, as you can tell. Okay? Why weren't we having these 25 problems with Windstream? What I sent y'all, this is one 11-22-10 54 1 month's worth of trouble stuff we sent to the help desk, 2 okay? I don't -- and it's gotten better in the last few 3 days, there's no doubt, but it's not solved. All right? And 4 I don't like playing Russian roulette with somebody trying to 5 call our office, and that's what I feel like we're doing. 6 'Cause every time it is something different. It's hardware, 7 it's this phone, it's Hill Country Telephone, it's Sprint, 8 it's porting. It's always something, but it's always 9 continuing. Okay? And my only problem is, we had a year 10 left on this other contract, and I don't know what's happened 11 to that contract. I had till December 2011, and I don't know 12 what's happened, if it got bought out or anything else. But 13 all of a sudden we're with this, and we're playing Russian 14 roulette with the phones, people calling. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I think the -- the 16 porting issue makes sense to me, just from my -- I mean, I 17 had that problem. I had a big problem when I went from 18 whoever I was with, then I went to Sprint. I was with Five 19 Star and I went to Sprint, and it took about three weeks so I 20 could get calls on a regular basis. So, I mean -- and it's a 21 -- you know, if that -- if the porting's the issue, going 22 back to Windstream would just make it worse. Then you have 23 to start all over again with the porting issue. I understand 24 porting. You know, I know what that is. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Then you still have -- you 11-22-10 55 1 know, it's just -- I have one of them was going to be here, 2 one member from another agency that said he won't call our 3 office any more, 'cause it's just -- it's ridiculous to try 4 and understand the echo, the delay, everything else on the 5 phone system, and said they don't have it at Ingram school, 6 which has their system, I guess, or Hill Country, even. They 7 don't have it other places, but they do in ours. Buster was 8 -- was present when the Judge and one of our District Judges 9 and I were talking. He said the court coordinator and him 10 deal with everything on cell phones, 'cause they're not going 11 to go through this phone system; it's that bad. You know, 12 there's just -- it's constant issues. I don't -- I don't 13 know them. I don't understand them. All I know is we don't 14 have the service that I think we ought to be demanding, 15 especially out at the Sheriff's Office. And -- 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think the demand is being 17 met. It's just you can't snap your fingers and make it all 18 just go away in a few minutes. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, I can't. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You ought to, but you can't 21 do that. If you start over on something else, you're going 22 to have the same issues. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't think I'm going to 24 have these kind of issues. You know, a lot of what I've been 25 told is it's voice-over IP. It's not hard line. I don't 11-22-10 56 1 think -- I don't know, Bruce, okay? All I know -- 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't think any of us know. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: If I had -- what I wrote, if I 4 had these kind of issues at my house with the phone service, 5 I would have already trashed it and gone somewhere else, 6 okay? Because -- and that's at my house. Now we're talking 7 emergency phones. Not everybody having an emergency dials 8 911. And we were even having trouble with that; when they 9 call 911 and it rings at Kendall County, which is right next 10 door, and Kendall County was transferring them to us, they 11 were dropping, okay? I don't know. But I -- it's just -- 12 and John's right. He's gone nuts -- I saw him sit up there 13 two days solid in our dispatch after this -- this came out. 14 It's constantly one thing after another. And if it were 15 solved, then I'd be happy, but this is what we made for the 16 last 30 days. This was October 7th till November 12th. 17 That's the reports that we sent in to the help desk, okay? 18 It's up to y'all. I've done -- I don't know what else I can 19 do, okay? But I don't think that we have a -- at this point, 20 maybe a year from now, maybe. But I don't have that kind of 21 time. I don't think we have a reliable emergency phone 22 system for the Sheriff's Office. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: How about today? 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We had the ones last night. I 25 gave John one; he said it was a forwarded call. Elaine was 11-22-10 57 1 saying she had all kinds of problems. She'd transfer a call, 2 and it would go to a different transfer number instead of the 3 one she was doing, besides this Sprint issue still. Sprint, 4 and I think it was Verizon too for a while, wasn't it? 5 MR. TROLINGER: No, sir. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Or just Sprint. 7 MR. TROLINGER: No, sir, Sprint also hosts other 8 phone companies' calls, so that's -- 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Some of the Pocket or 10 Sprint -- 11 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's a lot of different -- but 13 people are playing Russian roulette on whether you're going 14 to get through to the Sheriff's office or not when you call. 15 And we do deal with an enormous amount of phone calls, as 16 John can say. When they first switched us over to the jail, 17 from 1:30 in the afternoon till 5 o'clock that afternoon the 18 first day, the jail phone alone had 350 calls. Okay? That's 19 from 1:30 to 5:00. 20 MR. TROLINGER: And previously they just had one 21 phone line, so it rang busy on visitation calls. So, now 22 they're inundated, because they can get all the calls that 23 they can -- that the phones will ring on, and it's a lot. 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And that is -- 25 MR. TROLINGER: There were a lot of calls. Now, we 11-22-10 58 1 did put the Adult Probation and the C.I.D. online first, and 2 Adult Probation had a similar volume of calls. It was what I 3 thought was very smooth compared to, say, the courthouse 4 switchover, for that. And when we went and put the jail and 5 the Sheriff's office on, we had problems. And we've resolved 6 those. The jail's changed the way they're doing visitation. 7 We're talking about getting, maybe, a separate visitation 8 phone line, or visitation's been expanded so you can call in 9 on more -- more time periods instead of a narrow time period. 10 And some things have to be changed on both sides. There's 11 some give and take, since the phone system does have 12 different capabilities, lots of extra capabilities we didn't 13 have before. And the Sheriff does have a large pile of paper 14 with some things that are repeated, because every time I 15 update an issue on the help desk, it's going to send another 16 e-mail to let the Sheriff know something's been changed. In 17 other words, if we had another phone call that didn't go 18 through, then I updated the help desk issue, and that printed 19 another piece of paper. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Sure. 21 MR. TROLINGER: And also in that packet that the 22 Sheriff has is a page -- full page that I spent some time 23 writing up that explains how the phone system works, and the 24 various failure scenarios and the things that will occur if, 25 for instance, the phone trunk does go down. So, when the T-1 11-22-10 59 1 was turned off, the outgoing calls remained in -- it was 2 difficult to identify that there was a problem, because 3 everyone was calling out, but they were calling out through 4 the courthouse's trunk, because when there's a failure at the 5 Sheriff's Office, all the calls are automatically directed to 6 go out through the courthouse. And there were a couple of 7 dozen calls that went out that way, so it took a while before 8 someone called and finally got ahold of the Sheriff or 9 dispatch and said, "Hey, the phone lines aren't -- the phone 10 calls aren't coming in." 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, the dispatch had to call 12 me on a cell phone, 'cause they said they couldn't get out to 13 call me. I don't know whether they didn't wait long enough, 14 or all the switches -- but they tried to get out and call me 15 on the dispatch phone; could not get out to make a call. 16 MR. TROLINGER: There were a couple dozen calls 17 that went out. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I said, "Call the emergency 19 number and see what you get." The recording he got is, "All 20 circuits are busy now." It's a recording. And we were 21 totally without phone service, what we had way back in the 22 summer when everything had serious problems. But I -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There may be some other 24 departments that want to say something about it too. I'm not 25 sure about that, but -- 11-22-10 60 1 MR. TROLINGER: Well, in any case, each time an 2 issue occurs, the Sheriff's kept in the loop with the help 3 desk. He gets basically a piece of paper at this point, if 4 he's printing it out, to let him know that there's a problem, 5 what's happened, and when it's fixed he gets notification 6 that it's fixed. So, I expect the problem with the phone 7 back in the jail's been fixed already. Matt Comer's been 8 back there for an hour, and that's resolved. And maybe it 9 was the individual phone, or maybe it was the -- the phone 10 was forwarded incorrectly, but whichever the case is, that's 11 fixed. We still have the remaining problem with delivering 12 Sprint cell phone calls, we think. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Linda, did you have 14 something? 15 MS. UECKER: We're still having echoes and, you 16 know, talking -- delay, talking over each other. You know, 17 kind of hard -- you start talking and they start talking, 18 because there's evidently a delay. And I've actually had 19 situations where I've had to call somebody back on my 20 personal cell phone to be able to carry on a conversation. 21 It's usually temporary, but there are times when calls are 22 dropped, and I -- long distance calls, sometimes I have 23 trouble getting -- making a long distance call. I don't know 24 why a certain -- 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Making a call or having the service 11-22-10 61 1 be satisfactory? 2 MS. UECKER: Making the call. It won't go through, 3 and then I have to use my cell phone so I can get through. 4 So, I mean, they're -- they're temporary, but, you know, they 5 are annoying. But, you know, we work with John to try to fix 6 those. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We actually had a complaint 8 trying to report a burglary; they called the deputy directly 9 on the cell phone because dispatch couldn't understand them, 10 and with that same real bad delay and talking over, we 11 couldn't get the information. 12 MS. UECKER: You sit there, and you go, "Okay, you 13 go." You know, "You go. You go." Okay? You're talking on 14 top of each other. And you don't know when to start because 15 of the delay. And it's -- sometimes it gets a little crazy. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Ladies first. 17 MS. LAVENDER: We're seeing the same problems in 18 the basement with our phones, both in Indigent Health and the 19 Victims Services. A lot of times it's the issue of coming -- 20 and it's probably cell phone, Sprint cell phone. But they 21 can't hear us, but we can hear them. And it's like they're 22 in a barrel. And then a lot of times when we get ready to 23 call out, we -- there's not a phone line available to us. 24 And I get a lot of out-of-county calls from the surrounding 25 counties, and so I have to get -- 'cause I don't have cell 11-22-10 62 1 phone service down there sitting at my desk. My cell phone 2 doesn't work. If I take it out of my pocket and lay it on my 3 desk, it does. And so then I've got to get up, take my cell 4 phone and go out in the hall, or go outside where I can call 5 these people back. And it's because the incoming calls are 6 so bad that we can't hear them and can't deal with them. 7 MS. HENDERSON: Well, first I want to thank John, 8 'cause we were having major problems upstairs. John's always 9 there; he comes up and tries to get it fixed. We still are 10 having problems. It's the -- the delay, the talking over 11 each other. It sounds like you're talking and they're 12 talking, and you're interrupting them. Both judges won't 13 even use the phone; they use their cell phone. I use my cell 14 phone to call 325, because if I call Junction, Mason, it's 15 really bad, so I've been using my own personal cell phone 16 also. But I don't know -- does it have to be voice-over IP? 17 I mean, is that the only way it works? 18 MR. TINLEY: Talking about your system? 19 MS. HENDERSON: Yeah. 20 MR. TINLEY: That would be a question for John. 21 MS. HENDERSON: I think -- and that's just my 22 opinion, is it's voice-over IP, but I don't know if it has to 23 be. But it's to the point if we do a conference call in the 24 courtroom, and the people are on the phone and they're 25 talking about -- and the Judge is going, "Wait a minute, wait 11-22-10 63 1 a minute." They can't hear him until everybody stops talking 2 and it's silent. Then he can talk. And he'll sit there and 3 say, "I'm trying to get them to quit talking," but they don't 4 -- they can't hear him. So, that's the -- we're really still 5 having problems. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Ken? 7 MR. RUARK: Okay. My name's Ken Ruark; I'm the 8 sales and customer relations manager for Hill Country 9 Telephone. And just sitting in here and listening, it 10 appears to me that you have two issues. One, the -- from 11 Hill Country's perspective. One is that, yes, we have an 12 issue with Sprint that Patrick and I will both go back and 13 make sure that we can correct as soon as we can. However, 14 that -- not to belabor, get into all the technical issues, 15 but Windstream is involved with this also, and the porting 16 and Sprint and these towers, and it gets to be a long, 17 drawn-out process. You experienced some of that. What I 18 will stand here and guarantee you, from Hill Country's 19 perspective, that we will do whatever we have to to get that 20 resolved as quickly as we can, and we -- and a time from what 21 I understand we believe we had. So whatever has occurred in 22 the last week or so, we don't know at this point. The second 23 issue, it appears, from what you have is that you may have 24 some hardware, telephone switching issues within your 25 telephone phone system. I don't pretend to be an expert at 11-22-10 64 1 that, but I think you have two separate issues. One is the 2 phone service with Sprint that we are involved with, and two 3 is actually the switch that you purchased. And I think that 4 so this is not confusing, I don't want to do that. Take one; 5 address that. Take the other and address that, and see where 6 we're at. And I think you'll be able to resolve it. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You mentioned the switch we 8 purchased. 9 MR. RUARK: I understand you did. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What is that? 11 MR. RUARK: Switch telephone system. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The system? 13 MR. RUARK: Yeah. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So it's back to the hardware. 15 MR. RUARK: Could very well be. But you're going 16 to have to differentiate between -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 18 MR. RUARK: -- one or the other. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And one's inside the building; 20 one's outside the building. 21 MR. RUARK: That's right. Does that help? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Tim, you had an issue? 23 MR. BOLLIER: It's just when I'm dialing out, you 24 know, like, if I just call an extension, like if I call Jody 25 from down there, I don't have any problem. But it seems like 11-22-10 65 1 when I dial out, I've always -- I've got a problem. And it's 2 not every time, you know. It's just a come-and-go thing. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: What's the nature of the problem? 4 MR. BOLLIER: Most of the time you can't hear them, 5 or you'll get cut off. And other than that, I mean, I don't 6 use -- I don't use that phone down there. I use my cell 7 phone for everything, because I've had a problem with it ever 8 since it's been put in down there. And I use my cell phone 9 unless I'm dialing an extension inside the courthouse. If I 10 dial extensions inside the courthouse, it works fine, but if 11 I try to dial, you know, like Jonathan on his cell phone, I 12 can't. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: One of the things that I have some 14 concern about is this delay and this overrunning and whatnot. 15 I'm trying to figure out, are we talking about an equipment 16 issue or are we talking about -- and when I say "equipment 17 issue," I mean in-house to Kerr County, or a service issue 18 dealing with either Hill Country Telephone or the various 19 vendors that interact with them and their system. They got 20 these -- I don't know. I guess they got various independent 21 phone companies out there that come through their system. 22 You're talking about area code 325, which is Junction and 23 those northern counties up there in the 198th. That's where 24 your major problems is? 25 MS. HENDERSON: That's where I notice it the most. 11-22-10 66 1 I still have the -- the delay, the talking over each other, 2 and the echo. I have that everywhere. But I drop a lot of 3 calls -- they drop the calls going to 325 a lot more 4 than around here, 830 numbers or 210 numbers. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: How can we identify whether 6 it's an equipment problem or another problem with -- service 7 problem? 8 MR. TINLEY: Well, I will say this; that we do have 9 other subscribers in the same area that are using the system. 10 Kerrville Daily Times, you know, they're using the PRI, and 11 they have not had this type of issue. 12 MR. RUARK: It's -- 13 MR. TINLEY: That's the only thing I can say, is 14 that I haven't had a similar problem with another subscriber. 15 MR. RUARK: We have a number of locations we'll 16 use. Usually what's he's talking about is a PRI, and all 17 that does is allow multiple phone calls to be sent and 18 received at the same time. It's just a technology. 19 MR. TINLEY: Their -- typically their systems are 20 using a -- a Norstar or a -- I think that's the most common 21 one. I think there's maybe one Avaya system, which purchased 22 Norstar. But, I mean, that's -- we haven't seen the same 23 type of issues reported as we have -- 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You have different hardware? 25 MR. TINLEY: Right. 11-22-10 67 1 MR. RUARK: Yes. 2 MR. TINLEY: With a different -- 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Sounds to me like we have a 4 hardware problem. 5 MR. TINLEY: So I don't know. I think it may be a 6 combination of things, because I'm familiar a little bit with 7 how this system works here, is that you've got one system 8 that handles the calls, and then you have another system that 9 interfaces the PRI to the system. Is that correct, John? 10 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. 11 MR. TINLEY: So, yeah. So there may be something 12 there, but I don't know. I just know that we have not 13 experienced the same type of issues. 14 MR. RUARK: We -- 15 MR. TINLEY: With our equipment connected to 16 another type of -- 17 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- the other systems you were 18 talking about, Norstar or Norstar-related? 19 MR. TINLEY: Excuse me? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, you were talking about these 21 others where you've not experienced problems where they were 22 using Norstar equipment or Norstar-related. 23 MR. TINLEY: Yes, sir. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: That was the setup at Windstream, 25 wasn't it? That -- that -- 11-22-10 68 1 MR. TINLEY: Well, most of these subscribers that 2 we have put onto a PRI did not have a PRI before. We 3 actually installed the card that goes into their system, 4 particularly like Family Practice and Associates, and Daily 5 Times is another one that we had to install the actual card 6 to interface their system with the PRI. And we did that for 7 a number of reasons. They had a number of lines that would 8 have required a lot more fiberoptic terminals in their 9 building than would have been financially feasible to install 10 those. It was economically less expensive to put in a PRI, 11 which gave them some additional functionality. 12 MR. RUARK: To make a long story short, from Hill 13 Country's perspective -- that's who I'm representing -- is 14 that we buy the best technology that's available today to 15 provide the phone services through PRI's, fiberoptics or 16 whatever, and that is a software package. That is software. 17 It is not the old electrical switches like you used to have. 18 This is actual computer software. So, I -- I can't sit here 19 and guarantee that nothing's ever going to go wrong with 20 that, but we buy the best we can. 21 MR. TINLEY: And I won't say voice-over IP -- I 22 mean, it's -- it's not new any more. It's still -- and our 23 local 911 service is over a voice-over IP PSAP; they did that 24 over about three weeks ago. And that does ride across some 25 of our fiberoptic circuits here in town into the Sheriff's 11-22-10 69 1 office. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: My question relating to Norstar-type 3 equipment is that when Windstream was a provider, that was 4 the type of equipment that they were primarily utilizing, 5 were they not? 6 MR. TINLEY: Yes. That and Mitel, I think, who 7 Windstream is -- they're selling right now. I believe those 8 are the two. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: So, when they port over, maybe 10 things went over easier to start that -- 11 MR. TINLEY: Well, I mean, you think about it. The 12 equipment -- that equipment's been around for probably 13 15-plus years. Now, they recently announced the type of 14 system that you guys had, which I had knowledge of, was the 15 modular ICS system, they were not -- recently announced that 16 they're not going to continue to manufacture that any more. 17 They're going to what they call their business communications 18 manager, which is their new system, which can be also 19 hard-wired and voice-over IP. But the -- there's many 20 numerous system out there. There's -- I mean, there's even 21 systems you can download off the internet for free if you're 22 a small business owner. 23 MR. RUARK: I wouldn't recommend that. 24 MR. TINLEY: You would be needing, you know, to 25 have technical savvy on some of those systems. I mean, some 11-22-10 70 1 of the systems are very, very complicated. I haven't 2 actually been able to look at John's system. I've seen it a 3 little bit, and some of the features it has are very 4 impressive compared to the price that it was. But, you know, 5 it is newer technology, and sometimes you -- I refer to newer 6 technology as the bleeding edge instead of the leading edge, 7 'cause you tend to get a nosebleed sometimes because of it. 8 But -- 9 MR. RUARK: Here's what -- I guess, bottom line, 10 here's what Hill Country will do. We'll support the County 11 in every way, shape, or form that we can. If we determine 12 that for some reason it's our issue and we've created some 13 problem, I will come back in this room and tell you that. 14 I'm not -- you know, I'm not afraid of that. But at this 15 point, everything that I've heard and everything I've seen 16 and everything I know, other than the Windstream issue, 17 doesn't point to Hill Country Telephone. That's all I can 18 tell you at this point. But I'm a big boy, and I don't 19 really mind. If it were, I would tell you. 20 MR. TINLEY: Other than our interfacing with the 21 other vendors. That's obviously something we need to fix 22 with the vendor. 23 MR. RUARK: Yeah. 24 MR. TINLEY: And -- but like I said, you know, 25 John -- John is -- John and I work daily together. If he has 11-22-10 71 1 a problem -- and it doesn't matter if -- if it might be an 2 internal problem or not. I devote time to him as much as I 3 can, so that he can make the county more functional. And 4 that's, you know, my ultimate goal. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: John, what degree of communication 6 or cooperation have you received from the vendor, this system 7 that -- that we've acquired? 8 MR. TROLINGER: Not -- not a whole lot recently, 9 but we -- I.T. are supporting the system, and have taken 10 in-house the -- the setup of the new phones and the 11 programming the extensions and stuff. So, really, it's an 12 I.T. system, so when -- when Hill Country Telephone says, 13 "Hey, this delay problem's not coming from any other -- we're 14 not having problems anywhere else," then, you know, it's Kerr 15 County I.T. It's not calling the vendor that sold us the 16 system. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: My point is, are you calling the 18 vendor because of possible failure of the equipment which we 19 purchased from that vendor? 20 MR. TROLINGER: No, sir, I have not, not since the 21 initial install at the courthouse was completed and signed 22 off on. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On the vendor, I mean, my -- 24 obviously, the person who installed it didn't manufacture it. 25 I don't think he did. Isn't it -- I mean, shouldn't we be 11-22-10 72 1 contacting the manufacturer of the phones themselves and 2 saying we have a problem? You send your people down and 3 figure out why we have a problem. I don't know why we have 4 to go through the person that installed it. It should be the 5 manufacturer. 6 MR. TROLINGER: Right. And back when we had a 7 problem at the courthouse, I did get to that point. I did go 8 straight to the manufacturer of the interface for the PRI and 9 said, "Hey, we've got this -- this echo. Everyone's hearing 10 themselves. We need this fixed." And they weren't able to 11 fix it. They've since come out with a fix, about a month 12 ago. We would have lived with it until then, but I went in 13 and figured it out and found a fix for it. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess my problem is, we spent 15 a bunch of money on that system, and if the phones themselves 16 are a problem, the manufacturer of those phones needs to be 17 held accountable. And what I'm hearing from the other 18 elected -- other offices are they've given up on the phones 19 and they're just using cell phones. Well, that's not 20 acceptable. If the phones are a problem, they need to fix 21 them. I mean, I don't think it's your problem. I mean, 22 'it's your problem because you're the go-between, but it 23 seems to me that it's a phone problem. And that, you know, 24 should be solved. 25 MR. TROLINGER: Well, we do have three actual 11-22-10 73 1 physical phones that are bad, no good, at the Sheriff's 2 Office since we started the install process. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not talking about the 4 Sheriff. I'm talking about every -- sounds like the whole -- 5 almost the whole annex. Sounds to me like everything in the 6 annex isn't working right. 7 MR. TROLINGER: And then the interface that 8 connects to Hill Country Telephone that I was talking about, 9 those problems where I contacted the manufacturer, those 10 problems -- if they still exist with the delay, if that's 11 where it's coming from, then I'll work it out with Hill 12 Country Telephone and the manufacturer of that system 13 directly. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I guess -- 15 MR. TROLINGER: That's another box; that's another 16 manufacturer. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. But it is -- it seems 18 to me that every phone that we have over there, everything 19 upstairs, Becky's saying is bad. Linda's over here too, but 20 Diane's over there. And Rosa's over there in the annex. 21 Linda is upstairs. Sounds like almost the whole courthouse 22 is still having the echo problems, at least sporadically, and 23 to talk over each other. And to me, you know, if Hill 24 Country Co-op -- the system is working elsewhere in this 25 city, and their same phone lines, then to me it's got to be 11-22-10 74 1 a -- a hardware problem, which to me is the actual phone 2 handset, and we just replaced all those. Therefore, we 3 should go to that vendor. 4 MR. TROLINGER: And that's the point I'm trying to 5 make. It's not the handset manufacturer. It's the interface 6 to the phone company manufacturer. That's the issue. It's 7 one black box. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Either way -- 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Still hardware. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Maybe you need to visit with 11 the County Attorney. Maybe that's the appropriate action. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Now you've hit it, Commissioner. I 13 think that's where we are. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I was thinking we were going 17 to argue the same thing. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Pieper, you had a comment you 19 wish to make? 20 MS. PIEPER: Well, but mine's related to the agenda 21 item, to take appropriate action on the telephone service. 22 Mine is not with the telephone service that y'all have been 23 talking about. I would like for the Court to take 24 appropriate action to allow me to disconnect the 25 hearing-impaired phone line that has been in my office since 11-22-10 75 1 way before I was there, that we never use. To my knowledge, 2 we've not ever had a call on it. 3 MS. UECKER: I think you have to have it. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Unfortunately, I think 5 probably under federal law -- 6 MS. UECKER: Required to have it. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: That's something for the County 8 Attorney to respond to, but I suspect under federal law, 9 we've got to have it, 'cause we're a public building. 10 MS. PIEPER: Okay, we'll keep it. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Even if you never get a call. 12 MS. PIEPER: Never had a call. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Only thing I would ask this 14 Court is that -- I don't know if it's John or who, but we 15 are, you know, at a serious situation, in my opinion, out 16 there with the emergency calls. Now, the one thing I will 17 say is that when one of the phone company technicians came 18 out and they were taking out some of our Nortel or whatever 19 the phones were, they said the equipment we have gone to was 20 a serious step down from the equipment we had. Okay? And 21 all I'm asking this Court is, I got to have reliable phone 22 service out there with the citizens. I'm begging the Court 23 to take some kind of action and get us some reliable phone 24 system. 25 MR. RUARK: And I'll just clarify, it was not Hill 11-22-10 76 1 Country Telephone that told you that. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: I know. That's what we purchased. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Not their service. It's the 4 in-house equipment. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If it doesn't get better, 7 it'll be on the agenda next time. That's all I can say. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Hope somebody doesn't die 9 first. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I hope so too. Thank 11 y'all for your participation. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: How many folks are here for the 13 public hearing with respect to the Jones Road issue? 14 Anybody? Let me go ahead and call that. It's our 10 o'clock 15 timed item. I will recess the Commissioners Court meeting, 16 and I will convene a public hearing concerning the vacation, 17 abandonment, and discontinuance of a portion of Jones Road. 18 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 10:36 a.m., and a public hearing was held in 19 open court, as follows:) 20 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Is there any member of the audience 22 or public that wishes to be heard with respect to vacating, 23 abandoning, and discontinuing a portion of Jones Road? 24 Seeing no one coming forward, I will close the public hearing 25 concerning the vacating, abandoning, and discontinuing a 11-22-10 77 1 portion of Jones Road. 2 (The public hearing was concluded at 10:36 a.m., and the regular Commissioners Court meeting was 3 reopened.) 4 - - - - - - - - - - 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to our other 10 o'clock 6 timed item, Item 14; consider, discuss, take appropriate 7 action to request from the City of Kerrville's Economic -- on 8 the request from the City of Kerrville's Economic Improvement 9 Corporation to undertake a project outside the Kerrville city 10 limits by funding the Hill Country Shooting Sports Center 11 with 4B sales tax receipts. Ms. Wendele? 12 MS. WENDELE: Good morning. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think this is going to be a 14 highly controversial item. 15 MS. WENDELE: I certainly hope not, Judge. But 16 good morning to the Judge and Commissioners. I'm Mindy 17 Wendele, Director of Business Programs and Public Affairs for 18 the City of Kerrville. And the item that I'd like to discuss 19 with you is discussing and taking positive action on our 20 request from the Economic Improvement Corporation to spend 21 half-cent sales tax funding in the county. To give you a bit 22 of history, on October the 18th, Jack Burch with Hill Country 23 Shooting Sports Center made a presentation to our Economic 24 Improvement Corporation requesting funds -- half-cent sales 25 tax funds for construction costs relating to the Olympic Air 11-22-10 78 1 Hall in the amount of $494,838. The E.I.C. Board nodded 2 favorably for this presentation, and directed staff to hold a 3 public hearing and draft a funding agreement for the 4 consideration at the November 15th meeting, which we did. A 5 public hearing was held on November the 15th at their regular 6 scheduled meeting, and they -- the board approved the funding 7 agreement for this funding request. As it is with all funds 8 that are to be spent outside our taxing jurisdiction, we must 9 come to you as the next step to ask permission for us to 10 spend the money for the Olympic Air Hall at the Hill Country 11 Shooting Sports Center. Once you give us your positive 12 go-ahead today, the next step would be to send the funding 13 agreement to the City Council for their approval, which is 14 all in the state law, for the December 14th meeting, and it 15 is scheduled for that meeting. Mr. Burch is here, if you 16 have any questions of him, or I'll be happy to entertain any 17 questions at this time. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is the number? 498,000 19 and what? 20 MS. WENDELE: $494,838. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: One more time? I'm sorry. 22 MS. WENDELE: $494,838. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That was his request, and 24 that's what we are agreeing to do? 25 MS. WENDELE: Yes, sir. 11-22-10 79 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Is this going to get us where we can 3 go forward totally with the needs of that building, Jack? 4 MR. BURCH: Morning, Judge, Commissioners. The 5 answer to your question is yes, partially. It will get us up 6 to where we can use the building by all codes, plus 20 7 electronic targets, which will allow us to start holding 8 events in there as well. So, that's the answer. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: How many total electronic targets 10 are planned? 11 MR. BURCH: Eighty. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: So, you're only going to do a fourth 13 of the electronic targets? 14 MR. BURCH: That's correct, only because the state 15 fire marshal informed us we had to put fire sprinklers in 16 there, so that took up quite a bit of electronic targets. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. In your initial request, you 18 had the money in to do all the electronic targets, or your 19 initial thinking was to get all the electronic -- finish it 20 out, get the electronic targets for all 80? 21 MR. BURCH: Yes. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: And then we got -- you got the props 23 knocked out from under you when they said there's going to be 24 a requirement for a sprinkler system in that building? 25 MR. BURCH: That's correct. 11-22-10 80 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That's a big old building, so that's 2 got to be a big old sprinkler system. 3 MR. BURCH: $125,000 worth. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: So, that's about what it's going to 5 take to finish out the electronic targeting, is 125? 6 MR. BURCH: Actually, no. It's -- to get the other 7 60 is 265. But we got to have the fire suppression before we 8 can go and find any more money for the rest of the targets, 9 because you can't even open the building without it, 10 according to the fire marshal. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- and this is just a 12 question. I probably shouldn't even ask the question. 13 (Laughter.) 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: All of us are thinking about 15 it. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- the building's in the 17 county. 18 MR. BURCH: It is. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Generally, we don't have 20 sprinkler -- fire code in the county. 21 MR. BURCH: What the county requirement is, is the 22 state requirement. When you're inside the city limits, the 23 city sets its own policy. When it's out in the county, if 24 the county doesn't have a policy, you fall to the state. 25 When the building's over 20,000 square feet, you got to have 11-22-10 81 1 fire suppression. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 3 MR. BURCH: That's something fairly new, by the 4 way, 'cause it wasn't that way several years ago. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Jack, here's where I'm coming from. 6 I want -- I want to see you get that thing done completely, 7 totally, top-notch. 'Cause you have a facility out there 8 which probably has the greatest potential to generate 9 economic development of anything to come down the pike for a 10 long, long time. 11 MR. BURCH: From 2005 to-date, a little over $16 12 million of total impact. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. And as you get that facility 14 where you can hold additional events or additional types of 15 events, more disciplines, that -- that just widens the 16 capability of what you're able to do. So, -- 17 MR. BURCH: Yes, sir. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: -- are we going to get there fairly 19 quickly, the total completion? 20 MR. BURCH: Judge, I can't answer that question. 21 This is totally a funding issue, of finding the funds to be 22 able to do it, 'cause you can't capitalize this facility and 23 expect it to pay back to sustain a debt that would be 24 required for the entire completion. So, finding the funding 25 through E.I.C. and different agencies is the only way to do 11-22-10 82 1 this. So -- 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, its value is what it generates 3 for the community. That's where the real value is. And 4 that's -- that's why I've always been so supportive of it, 5 because it -- and you've brought that thing from, you know, I 6 guess a conception in your mind to all the way up to now a 7 U.S. Olympic training facility, and you're doing Olympic 8 events there. You've got more planned, I'm sure. 9 MR. BURCH: The Olympic trials this coming year. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Just like the Olympic shotgun 11 trials were last go-around? 12 MR. BURCH: Yes, sir. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I just want to see you get done. I 14 want to see you get done -- 15 MR. BURCH: You and me both, Judge. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: -- where you got the whole thing 17 there ready to go. 18 MR. BURCH: You and me both, Judge. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Have you talked to Sudie from 20 the Convention and Visitors Bureau about some funding? 21 MR. BURCH: Yes, Sudie and I work very closely 22 together. She helps us in every way she can, Mr. Oehler, and 23 we're working at every angle that we can work at. Of course, 24 the economic times we're in make it a little more difficult, 25 but yes. 11-22-10 83 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You know, it just seems to me 2 like they have an awful -- they have a large budget there, 3 and that they could -- they could help fund that. 4 MR. BURCH: That would be a Sudie question. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It would be a big money-maker 6 for the Convention and Visitors Bureau with more people 7 coming. You'd get paid back pretty wick. 8 MR. BURCH: It's paid back very quickly for the 9 city of Kerrville. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Right. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, with what's on the table 12 right now, I move that we approve the request from City of 13 Kerrville's Economic Improvement Corporation to undertake a 14 project outside the Kerrville city limits by funding the Hill 15 Country Shooting Sports Center for 4B sales tax in the amount 16 of 494,838. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 19 approval of the agenda item as indicated. Question or 20 discussion on the motion? All in favor of the motion, 21 signify by raising your right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. We'll be in 11-22-10 84 1 recess for about 15 minutes or so. 2 MS. WENDELE: Thank you very much. 3 (Recess taken from 10:45 a.m. to 11:05 a.m.) 4 - - - - - - - - - - 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to order, if 6 we might, from our recess. We'll go to Item 13; to consider, 7 discuss, take appropriate action to vacate, abandon, and 8 discontinue a portion of Jones Road. Commissioner Letz? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, I make a motion -- well, 10 I mean, first let me explain. This is a little road out in 11 Hill Country Ranch Estates. No problems with it; it's just 12 closing a little bit of the end of the road at the request of 13 the landowners. Obviously, no one spoke at the public 14 hearing. We posted it out there in the neighborhood. No one 15 objected to it there. So, I'll go ahead and make a motion 16 that we vacate, abandon, discontinue a portion of Jones Road. 17 The portion to be discontinued, the County Attorney has the 18 appropriate documentation to handle that portion. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 21 approval of the agenda item as indicated. Question or 22 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 23 your right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 11-22-10 85 1 (No response.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. We'll go to 3 Item 16, which is to consider, discuss, and take appropriate 4 action to run new electrical service to new outdoor arena at 5 the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center at an approximate cost 6 of $8,300. Commissioner Oehler? 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, you know, we built the 8 new arena, so if we're going to power it up and be able to 9 have people use it, I think we -- you know, we're going to 10 have to run power at some point. And Tim has come up with a 11 plan, along with -- by using D.W. Electric to make a 12 recommendation as to where we can do that. And you're 13 looking at the price for doing that, and that does not 14 include any lighting; that just gets power underground for 15 future -- you know, for present service needs and future 16 service needs. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, this pole's the size for 18 the future lighting? 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: As needed? 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: For anything that we would 22 build there, including lighting. Like, if we happened to 23 cover it someday, we would have enough power for restrooms 24 and concession and -- with individual panels to serve those 25 areas, so you don't have a mess. And it also -- I ought to 11-22-10 86 1 let you tell all this, but I think -- but, anyway, also it 2 will -- it will take and move everything on the circuit that 3 goes there, and right now there are some things that are tied 4 onto the 4-H livestock area, as well as our shop and the 5 storage areas, that will no longer be serving other places. 6 This will serve everything independently of that facility. 7 MR. BOLLIER: I talked to David Cowart and Eric 8 over at KPUB, and there -- there where the old horse barn is 9 now, where Roy's got his -- I call it the inner city project, 10 the part there that come down, KPUB's going to come in and 11 run a slack span over to the red fence that separates the 12 paved area from the east end, polo field, and come down, and 13 they're going to run just slack span, and then we'll run a 14 service pole 60 feet in there from there we're going to go 15 underground down to where we can come straight across to the 16 concession stand -- or not concession stand. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Press box. 18 MR. BOLLIER: Press box, and run electricity in 19 there. But while we're doing that, we're going to go ahead 20 and run enough service for future use, to where we have it 21 there; we don't have to do this twice. We can come out of 22 there, and when they have arena lights and hook all that up, 23 we're going to make sure they have lights up in the top and 24 in the press -- press box, and some outlets for the P.A. 25 system, their air-conditioner and so forth. And then on the 11-22-10 87 1 bottom, we'll make sure we have some electrical outlets in 2 there; of course, some lights so they can plug in their 3 refrigerator and stuff. We'll have three separate panels by 4 the time we're all through. We'll have a -- there at the -- 5 a panel box there where we start it, and a panel box in the 6 middle or at the end down here, and then a panel box inside 7 the press box. And we'll cut that leg out that's going to 8 come -- that's already there that comes from the panel that's 9 there now, that runs all the R.V. hookups. That little piece 10 right there will be cut out, and we're going to run all that 11 in there to where we won't have any more problems down 12 through there, and it will all be solved. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I might mention one more 14 thing, too; that they contacted KPUB, and they've agreed to 15 put overhead service in free. 16 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, they waived it. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 830-something dollars there, 18 donating to the cause. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Super. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sounds pretty reasonable. This 21 is pulling the wire too? 22 MR. BOLLIER: Well, I left out one thing. David 23 Wahrmund came up with this $8,300 figure, just an approximate 24 cost, and like I -- and I told David we will help them dig 25 the ditch. He said, well, we don't have to run a ditcher; 11-22-10 88 1 they're going to come in and dig it. We'll help them lay the 2 pipe, cover the pipe and everything else, and we can reduce 3 the $8,300. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Taking some of the labor cost off? 5 MR. BOLLIER: Take some of the labor cost off it. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's including all the wire 7 and -- 8 MR. BOLLIER: That's including all the wire and 9 everything. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Cheap. 11 MR. BOLLIER: We're going to go in with a 3-inch 12 conduit, so we have plenty of room for additional -- 13 whatever. I mean, that sounds kind of big, but I'm like 14 Commissioner Oehler -- 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Much easier to pull a 3-inch 16 than -- 17 MR. BOLLIER: It's a lot easier. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Might not be a bad idea to 19 throw another 2-inch in there while you're -- if you do need 20 to pull additional service, you can. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We shouldn't, with the -- the 22 wire that's going in there, because they're planning ahead 23 for quite a bit of electricity to go to that facility. 24 Should be a one-time deal. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. Move approval. 11-22-10 89 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 3 approval as indicated. Question or discussion? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And the motion is to expend up 5 to $8,300. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's to come from the 7 capital funds. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: For that project. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or discussion? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And -- what did you say? 13 What did you just say? 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Come from capital funds for 15 that project. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Capital funds, okay. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: The Auditor didn't grasp her chest 18 as though it was a problem out there, so I assume it's okay. 19 Any other question or discussion? All in favor of the 20 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Item 17, to 25 consider, discuss, take appropriate action on additional 11-22-10 90 1 county personnel policies regarding exempt positions. 2 MS. HYDE: Judge, I brought this back based upon 3 some discussions that you and I have had. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 5 MS. HYDE: The two that are being looked at right 6 now are 5.02, which is vacation, and 5.04, which is sick 7 leave policies, and all that's been added is the word "exempt 8 employees" to both of them. So that exempt employees and 9 regular employees fall under the same terminology under 10 policies, procedures, and guidelines. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Actually, I had Ms. Hyde take 12 a look at this at my request, 'cause it seemed like we had a 13 gap. I think -- I think folks assumed that -- that the 14 exempt employees were governed by the same accrual policies 15 for vacation and sick time as nonexempt, but the policy 16 doesn't say that. So, my request then was to memorialize 17 that so, in fact, what I think everybody was assuming is, in 18 fact, the case and there's no question about it. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 22 approval. Question or discussion? 23 MS. HYDE: I will go back, Judge, based on our 24 conversation, and look at all the other policies that have 25 just "employees" that should be covered with exempt, and then 11-22-10 91 1 we can add those in. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or discussion? 4 All in favor, signify by raising your right hand. 5 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 7 (No response.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. Let's go to 18; 9 consider, discuss, take appropriate action regarding health 10 insurance contract, to include life insurance policies for 11 employees, and allow County Judge to sign same. 12 MS. HYDE: I gave this to the Judge and talked to 13 the Judge about this to make sure. Our current contract is 14 with ING, who had our stop loss. This is your major medical. 15 That is a $20,000 life insurance policy that the County pays 16 for via the medical. Humana has patched that, and also said 17 that they would do it a guarantee for two years. Since we're 18 moving away from ING, we are suggesting that we move away 19 from ING 100 percent, and I just wanted y'all's permission to 20 allow the Judge to sign the new contract, after the County 21 Attorney has blessed it. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Just move it over -- ING over to 23 Humana, in essence? 24 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Because Humana's now going to be 11-22-10 92 1 filling the function that ING was. 2 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Or what was -- UMR. 4 MS. HYDE: It was UMR-slash-ING. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Now it's going to be Humana. 6 MS. HYDE: We're moving to Humana. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is included in our health 8 insurance plan, correct? 9 MS. HYDE: Yes, sir. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Motion. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and second for 13 approval. Question or discussion on the motion? All in 14 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 19 Item 19; consider, discuss, take appropriate action regarding 20 establishment of Fund 11 health benefits reserve fund. 21 Ms. Hyde. 22 MS. HYDE: During budget this year, there was a lot 23 of discussion about, "Where are we going to get money? Where 24 is it going to be? Where are you going to put it?" And when 25 we discussed it during the budget, it was discussed that we 11-22-10 93 1 put this -- this extra on the stop loss back into a fund so 2 that we don't get into the same mess that we got into this 3 year regarding claims and payment of claims. And so I just 4 want a little bit of clarification on the fund. It's health 5 benefits. It is a benefits reserve fund. And that way 6 you've got the Treasurer, the Auditor, and myself that are 7 all on the same page on where -- what are we doing? Where 8 are we doing it? If we all step in front of a bus tomorrow, 9 y'all have something as well to protect the Court on what 10 we're doing. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm in favor of doing this, 12 because I think if we -- it's something we should have done a 13 long time ago, and I think those funds need to be kept 14 separate, and they need to be put into a true reserve. Only 15 we can authorize expenditure of this. You know, it will help 16 cut our costs in future years by having a reserve to cover 17 things like we had in this past year with excess claims and 18 -- and problems if we have a reserve to draw from. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Isn't the net effect of this 20 now also to reduce our general reserves? Or general -- 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not necessarily. We could 22 still authorize expenditure of it. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, but if it's -- if it's 24 designated for health only, and if we're just -- it's kind of 25 like -- it becomes like a Road and Bridge fund, to me. All 11-22-10 94 1 of a sudden, then it's a designated fund, and any excess that 2 we were banking on to put into our general fund this year is 3 going to be less money. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I'm just saying that we 5 can still -- we can do it that way, as long as we put it into 6 a reserve and not authorize it to be spent, only by 7 Commissioners Court. And not just be mixed in -- 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me clarify something up front 9 here. These are reimbursements from our stop loss carrier? 10 MS. HYDE: Some of it is reimbursement. Some of it 11 is duplication of payment, and some of it is aggregate off of 12 the stop loss. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: So these would not be replacing, 14 quote, budgeted funds. 15 MS. HARGIS: Some of it would. 16 MS. HYDE: Some would. That's the first 50,000 -- 17 first 60,000 right now. Everything is going into the general 18 fund, and so we're not seeing what we brought back to the 19 table because it's put into the general fund. If we put it 20 into a benefits, and not call it health insurance, or -- we'd 21 have to call it the correct terminology; then it could be 22 used for other things. The problem is, we've been using it, 23 and then during budget y'all were concerned and confused, 24 because where was all this money? We used it. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, but we used it to fund 11-22-10 95 1 our operations. 2 MS. HARGIS: Well, we used it to offset the 3 insurance premium we're already paying. And I don't mind 4 setting this up. My biggest problem with it right now -- and 5 she and I -- the only place we have a conflict is on this, is 6 that we're going to run -- if I run my numbers right, by the 7 end of December we're going to be $586,000 in the hole on the 8 current insurance policy for the first 90 days. That's not 9 the new insurance policy; that's the old one. We are that 10 much out of budget right now. I need these funds to bring 11 that gap closer together for this year. I think from -- from 12 this point forward, once we get level, when we get into a 13 true 100 percent plan, then that would be different. I also 14 think that when we are budgeting, rather than -- and I 15 haven't brought this to y'all. Rather than budget this -- 16 these funds, as such, we need to budget a reserve for health 17 insurance, whether it be 50,000 or -- every year, to offset 18 this. Because to offset it truly, we need, you know, to 19 budget funds that are really going to go into that reserve. 20 This is a fluctuating item. 21 MS. HYDE: She can't budget -- she can't budget the 22 smoke, and I can't budget smoke. Because we don't know 23 what's coming back. We don't know who's going to be sick. 24 We don't know how much there's going to be. 25 MS. HARGIS: And knowing -- I mean, it helps you to 11-22-10 96 1 reduce. Now, we know that we probably got about $350,000 2 back. We also paid out some of that, because when we pay out 3 our claims, we pay them out first; then we get reimbursed. 4 So, you know, there's a lag as well. So, for instance, if I 5 let her have all that money right now, my lag is probably 6 going to be June, so I'm -- I'm pretty much under budget and 7 really having a hard time figuring if we're even going to 8 make budget because of that. Right now, I don't mind putting 9 it in the fund, but if we need that money towards the end of 10 this year, we've got to make ourselves pretty much whole this 11 year. We cannot go into next year with a great big huge 12 hole. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I totally agree. But, you 14 know, I'm saying that you put it in a fund; you don't just 15 automatically expend that without -- that's a way to let us 16 know where we are -- 17 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, we're going to do that. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- in the process, rather 19 than having it just happen, and all of a sudden at the end of 20 time, you know, up jumps the devil, and, you know, we don't 21 know why we don't have any money. 22 MS. HYDE: Here's the devil this time. 23 MS. HARGIS: Well, I don't know that you -- 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm not going to designate 25 who the devil is. 11-22-10 97 1 MS. HARGIS: Eva would like for you to know how 2 much money comes through. I think we need to give you a 3 report on that on a monthly basis, so that you actually know 4 the refund checks that come back in. I think that's a fairly 5 simple thing to do so that you're aware of that. But we've 6 got to pay ourselves back for what we've already paid out. 7 That just makes sense. If you get a refund on -- on your 8 electric bill, you're not going to put it back in your 9 special electrical; you're going to put it back where you 10 spent it. And right now we need to make ourselves whole 11 before we start saving money we don't have. And the thing 12 is, at the end of the day, because my reserves are low, it's 13 not going to help me over on the reserve side. You're still 14 going to have to bring that up. So, I'd like to -- before we 15 decide to do this, because there's other ramifications of 16 this right now that have to do with the accounting. And I 17 don't want to get into that, but there's new GASB rules out 18 there that when you declare a reserve, you have to show it on 19 the balance sheet and you have to do a whole lot of things. 20 So, before we get into that, I would like to bring all of 21 that to you, as well as my plan for next year as to setting 22 up a reserve and how we would do that. We're putting the 23 money in there right now, and the only place that money has 24 ever gone is back into the health -- 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Are you sure? 11-22-10 98 1 MS. HARGIS: -- line items. That money -- 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Are you telling me that's the 3 only place any of that money has ever been expended? 4 MS. HYDE: No. We used it. We had to use it. We 5 had to use it to pay bills. 6 MS. HARGIS: We used to it pay health bills, Bruce. 7 We did not put it in any other line item. I can show you 8 every refund check went into our Group Insurance line item. 9 It paid out group insurance. That's the only thing it 10 went -- her contention is it went into the general fund. 11 That is correct, but it went to pay group health insurance 12 benefits. It did not go to pay for Eva's department or for 13 my department. It went into group health insurance. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 15 MS. HARGIS: It -- yes, it did go into the general 16 fund, but the refunds themselves were credited against the 17 group insurance claims. That is correct, Eva. They were in 18 207-091, all that money. 19 MS. HYDE: And they -- once October 1 starts, then 20 it goes back into there, so there is nothing. You start at 21 zero again. So, that's where our bone of contention is. 22 MS. HARGIS: That's a reserve that you have to set 23 up. 24 MS. HYDE: And we've never set it up. 25 MS. HARGIS: Just putting money that we get right 11-22-10 99 1 now -- these are refunds from last year, Eva. So, I think we 2 need to, before we jump off into this, let us do some 3 homework and do an analysis of this, and let's do it the 4 right way the first time, rather than have to correct it. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Your point is that we need to 6 address this issue to make sure that we take care of these 7 excess claims that we're having to pay with these refunds to 8 the extent that we can. 9 MS. HARGIS: Right. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Before rushing headlong into 11 creating a, quote, reserve fund, because it has accounting 12 and legal implications. 13 MS. HARGIS: For the future, for this year. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's not get in a big hurry here? 15 MS. HARGIS: Yes. I think we need to set the 16 policy up correctly, because once you set up a reserve, you 17 know, you must -- you know, as Bruce says, not only are you 18 putting a claim on it as far as being anything being paid out 19 of there or moneys being moved, but you're also setting that 20 up in your financial statements and in the legal connotations 21 that you give to the bondholders when you go out for a bond, 22 so this needs to be done in a -- a very correct manner. We 23 need to work with the County Attorney on this. We -- we need 24 resolutions that follow this so that the auditors can find 25 this as well as the bond people. So, it's a larger picture. 11-22-10 100 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So -- I tend to agree with 2 you. And don't you repeat that outside this room. 3 (Laughter.) But you want to comply with GASB, -- 4 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- visit with the County 6 Attorney, and provide us with a plan. 7 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Your plan. See, that kind 9 of makes sense to me. Kind of. 10 MS. HARGIS: And I'm -- 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It also makes sense that we 12 have control over funds, just for the knowledge, whether we 13 spend them for -- you know, exactly what she's saying. At 14 least we have the knowledge of where that money's being 15 spent. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So if we don't establish a 17 reserve fund today, you're going to go in there and gobble up 18 all that money and we're not going to be able to take -- 19 MS. HYDE: We're going to use it for the bills. 20 We're going to use it for the bills. Although she and I 21 disagree with -- with where it needs to go, this was just to 22 get it on the agenda so you guys understand, and that this 23 plan comes to fruition fairly quickly; that we don't wait 24 until next budget year. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see both sides. Somebody 11-22-10 101 1 do something. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I definitely want to 3 look at a plan, because I want to make sure -- if it's a 4 reserve fund, I don't want to be taking money out of our 5 general fund, causing a general fund problem. 6 MS. HYDE: Right. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Because we all of a sudden put 8 a bunch of money in the reserve fund we can't touch now. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We can touch it, under what 10 I'm saying, if we approve the expenditure of it. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What I'm saying is we need to 12 look at how it's set up exactly right. I mean, I think we're 13 saying the same thing, but we need to look at the -- 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, I don't want -- I would 15 never want to go into our reserves -- our general fund 16 reserve to pay a medical bill when we have money in insurance 17 reserves to pay it. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But we don't have an insurance 19 reserve. 20 MS. HYDE: No. 21 MS. HARGIS: No. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We just have a general fund. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's what we're talking 24 about setting up. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. But, I mean, I think 11-22-10 102 1 it's interesting to track it. 2 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I think I like the idea of 4 having -- I don't know that I like it being an official 5 reserve account. I like the idea of having a separate line 6 item that we can see. It may be in the red for a while, and 7 may be in the black for a while, but we can follow how the 8 money goes, and all the money that we expend or receive 9 related to health insurance should go into one line item so 10 we can watch it. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I couldn't agree more. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I like that. Just -- I just 13 don't think I like having a reserve fund. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We're saying the same thing, 15 just a different way to get there. I just want to make sure 16 that we track that, you know, and are aware of where it's 17 going and what's it's being spent for, and how much is there 18 and how much is not there. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Bring back the plan. Okay. Let's 21 go to Item 20; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 22 authorize County Judge to appoint a committee to study 23 criteria for inclusion of names on war memorial; make policy 24 recommendations to Commissioners Court. I put this on the 25 agenda. During this whole process of the expansion of the 11-22-10 103 1 war memorial, I've been hearing more and more comments 2 about -- to give you an example, the young Marine corporal 3 that we laid to rest here where there was such an outpouring 4 of support from the community here not too long ago. Under 5 our current criteria, even though that young man's family 6 resided here in Kerr County, landowners and so forth, under 7 the current criteria, he wasn't eligible to be included on 8 the memorial. And I'm hearing more and more about we need to 9 reexamine that criteria. I -- I brought it to the Court 10 earlier; I probably urged the Court to take action on it 11 without doing this, and that's my fault. But I want to -- I 12 want the authority to appoint a committee of maybe as little 13 as three, as many as five, to look at the criteria that we 14 need to put in place for individuals' names to be included on 15 that memorial out there. And I had -- I had one call from a 16 gentleman that said, "I'll fund that whole memorial if you'll 17 agree to some conditions." And as we talked, I said, "Well, 18 I can't agree to any conditions," obviously. Can accept your 19 money, but -- and as we talked, his concern was the criteria, 20 because he saw it as too restrictive. This was a retired 21 military man that obviously felt very strongly about the 22 subject. So, I -- I think we need to reexamine it, and so 23 that's what I'm asking for, that authority. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 11-22-10 104 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 2 approval. Question or discussion? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My only comment is, I would ask 4 you maybe to at least visit with the Hill Country Veterans 5 Council and -- and get their input, 'cause they seem to 6 represent a lot of the -- maybe have one of them -- designate 7 one of the appointments or selection for you. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Probably VFW. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: VFW, talk to some of those 10 organizations; get input from those other organizations. And 11 the other, I guess, overall guidance is, we need to try to 12 keep it simple, and -- which may be impossible, but it's 13 something that's, you know, I'd say simple, so that we can 14 determine if someone's eligible or not. Because I think this 15 has become more and more evident with the -- the current 16 young men and women that have lost their lives in the Middle 17 East. We have a boy that, technically, his parents lived in 18 Kendall County; he was buried in Center Point, James Kiehl. 19 We have the most recent boy whose parents live in Kerrville, 20 and, you know, family's very involved in Kerrville. And we 21 have another one -- these are just the three that I can 22 recollect right away, of -- of George Houghton's son who 23 lives in Falling Waters, you know, but not as connected to 24 the area as the other two. Yet his parents lived in -- you 25 know, so I'm just -- it's hard for me to envision how to get 11-22-10 105 1 a policy that -- you don't want to just detract from the 2 meaning of the memorial and put everyone on it, but at the 3 same time, we certainly want to recognize those that are -- 4 that should be recognized as Kerr County residents. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: That's why I felt like that when I 6 made the recommendation to the Court several years ago, it 7 was obviously too hasty, and we really need to take a look at 8 it. And it is -- it's going to be tough. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's hard to figure out where 10 you draw the line. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Something that -- that you can nail 12 down and -- and really know for sure, and it's going to be 13 tough. It really is. Further question? All in favor of the 14 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. Let's go to Item 19 21; receive a report or update on affairs of Ingram Dam and 20 Flat Rock Dam from Freese and Nichols, Inc., and/or Pro South 21 Construction. Commissioner Oehler? 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Asked Freese-Nichols to come 23 in today and give us an update on what they had found, and -- 24 at Ingram Dam, and give us an idea about how -- what they 25 found and how they're going to fix it. So, take it. 11-22-10 106 1 MR. GRIFFIN: Tanner Griffin with Freese and 2 Nichols. I put together just a few photos and slides that 3 will kind of go along with where we've been, what we're doing 4 right now, and then where we're headed. Started out at Flat 5 Rock. Didn't find a whole lot of voids over there. Pretty 6 minimal from what we were thinking. Just some numbers, we 7 pumped 922 bags of Portland cement, 428 bags of sand. And I 8 think we anticipated about 8,000 bags of Portland cement. I 9 just -- just to kind of give you a frame of reference, the 10 amount of voids we found, there was one significant void on 11 the far end down there on the dam that we were able to fill 12 successfully, filled across the spillway, and completed that 13 in about five or six days. That right there is the colloidal 14 mixture that we're pumping the grout with. It gets the grout 15 to latex paint-type texture, which allows it to flow in very 16 small voids and get where we need to go and get them filled. 17 Go to the next one. 18 Now we've popped over to Ingram Dam, where we 19 encountered a little bit more voids than what we anticipated. 20 Just this side of the spillway, we found a pretty large void, 21 in the neighborhood of 25 feet from top to bottom, and about 22 10 feet wide. That ranges from a depth up to almost 5 feet, 23 so we've got five and a half, six inches of concrete, and 24 then nothing for 4 to 5 feet. And so -- go to the next one. 25 It shows kind of where -- a quick shot of where -- where it 11-22-10 107 1 is. As far as the number of bags we pumped in at Ingram is 2 1,133 bags of Portland cement and 223 bags of sand, and we 3 haven't even scratched the surface yet. We found this large 4 void, which we had T.C.E.Q. dam safety engineers out last -- 5 Wednesday, was it? And they agreed that we need to go ahead 6 and cut some portholes 12 to 14 inches square, and fill that 7 big hole with concrete instead of pumping grout in it, just 8 due to the volume there. 9 Also, we've lowered the lake. If anybody's been 10 over there, they've noticed that it's being drained, and 11 pretty much gone now. We were having a whole lot of water 12 come from the upstream side through this void and many of the 13 other voids across the face of the dam. And by water coming 14 through, I don't mean just sitting in there, but racing 15 through there. And that's a major -- major problem; causes 16 undermining. So, now that the water level's down, we're just 17 seeing water that's just sitting in those pockets now, which 18 our grout and cement will have an underwater additive so it 19 can set up in the water. You can go on to the next one. 20 This is looking at the upstream side. There's a seam that 21 you can kind of see those piles of dust there. That's where 22 we've drilled holes. We're going to do a method of stitch 23 grouting that seam, which that's where the water's coming 24 through the upstream side, making its way through and then 25 going down the -- into the downstream side. And this is a 11-22-10 108 1 picture of one of the bigger holes in that lap joint where 2 water is getting in. That's on the near side by the road, 3 where we had quite a bit of water coming through by that 4 large void. 5 Again, here's another shot of that -- that joint. 6 And just to give you some idea of how big that is, that's 7 anywhere from nothing up to an inch gap where that concrete 8 has come apart, allowing water to get in there. And, you 9 know, this -- the down -- or the upstream side was not part 10 of the original contract, and so, fortunately, we were able 11 to get the Watermaster to agree to let that water down, and 12 so we're going to have to do quite a bit of pumping on this 13 upstream side. And where we are today, currently we're 14 drilling those holes along that -- along that joint to get an 15 idea of how much void we do have. Hopefully by Wednesday, 16 we'll be -- have drilled across that whole -- whole joint 17 there. And we found by that outlet that's up near the top of 18 the crest of the dam, down on the far end, there -- there was 19 about a 2-foot void on the upstream side that we found that 20 we think we can probably pump the heavy sanded grout in 21 there, but that was causing some problems near that outlet. 22 And, again, another shot; this is by the spillway. 23 That joint, again, you can see some of the damage and the 24 cracking or holes letting water in there. And we've -- we've 25 gone in -- we've already had a couple guys slip and slide in 11-22-10 109 1 the water when we first started lowering the lake, so we've 2 decided to -- we're power washing the face of that upstream 3 to get all that moss and stuff off of there, so -- just so 4 it's a little safer to stand there. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's warm. 6 MR. GRIFFIN: Yeah. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mike didn't think so. 8 MR. GRIFFIN: Yeah, y'all had a couple of people 9 jump in. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Day before we pulled the 11 plug, Mike did a graceful entrance into the upstream side. 12 He said the water was about 50. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Keep you awake. 14 MR. GRIFFIN: And there by that outlet is where we 15 found the 2-foot void, just on the other side of it. And I 16 believe that's all of the -- oh, here's the outlet on the 17 downstream side. We had some roots that were coming up in 18 that joint that was poured when they pulled this -- that 19 outlet, so we've since removed all those roots. That way we 20 can get concrete back in that area covered up so those roots 21 won't continue to crack in that area -- that water. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Water. 23 MR. GRIFFIN: So, that's -- that's where we are 24 right now. Do y'all have any questions? Concerns? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Timetable? 11-22-10 110 1 MR. GRIFFIN: We're hoping -- depending on what we 2 found on the upstream face, we're thinking, worst case, three 3 weeks -- three to four weeks if we can get -- you know, if 4 it's nothing major on that upstream side. Hopefully next 5 week, starting Monday or Tuesday, we'll pump some concrete 6 into that big void, and we anticipate -- we want to do it 7 slow so we don't blow out the face of the dam with the weight 8 of that concrete. But we're thinking about -- about two days 9 for that hole, just pumping about five yards of concrete at a 10 time. We're still estimating about 40 yards of concrete for 11 that void. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Is the estimated -- or the approach 13 and the fix that -- that you're indicating here, is that 14 consistent with what your engineering reports have dictated 15 and have authorized? 16 MR. GRIFFIN: This -- we're getting beyond scope 17 now. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 19 MR. GRIFFIN: As far as the upstream side, and then 20 this large void that we found. In the -- I don't know if 21 y'all saw the sonar that was done several years back that, 22 you know, just basically showed some areas; they didn't give 23 any, you know, depths. And, you know, we were anticipating 24 anywhere from 2- to 6-inch voids, not much bigger than that. 25 Not anticipating a 5-foot void, which is something that you 11-22-10 111 1 really don't grout. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So, you're getting beyond 3 what we originally believed to be the problem. 4 MR. GRIFFIN: Yes, sir. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: But you're recommending going 6 forward in the manner that you've indicated. Are you 7 planning on amending your engineering report to -- to 8 indicate that this is what needs to be done, in fact? 9 MR. GRIFFIN: Yes, sir. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 11 MR. GRIFFIN: And we -- and, as I said, T.C.E.Q. 12 dam safety officials were out, and they -- they concurred 13 with, you know, what we needed to do and the -- you know, the 14 magnitude of it, needing to get it fixed. I think their term 15 was "emergency fix." Due to the Flat Rock not being what we 16 anticipated, there's -- you know, I think we've gone through 17 $122,000 of the $297,000 budget, which includes all the -- 18 you know, the pumping we've done so far in Ingram. So, 19 there's a large number of dollars that's still in there, and 20 talking with the contractor, we still feel we can come in 21 near that -- that contracted amount. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: But T.C.E.Q. dam safety people 23 concurred with -- with your engineering recommendation as to 24 how to resolve this problem, and you plan on amending your 25 report to so indicate and recommend that? 11-22-10 112 1 MR. GRIFFIN: Correct. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3 MR. GRIFFIN: And then they'll be -- you know, 4 we'll be in contact with them as far as how -- you know, what 5 we're doing exactly, and then when we're done with record 6 drawings so they have everything on file for what we did and 7 how it was repaired. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Everybody's being copied with 9 all the -- all the information. And I spent a good part of 10 the day with Les Boyd on Friday, and some of these other 11 voids were identified, and he was making recommendations, and 12 also going to copy all that to T.C.E.Q. dam safety for their 13 review. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: And all that is being well 15 documented, I assume? And -- 16 MR. GRIFFIN: Yes, sir. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. From your engineering 18 standpoint and recommendation? 19 MR. GRIFFIN: Correct. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Thank you. 22 MR. GRIFFIN: Sure. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Seems like y'all are getting 24 a little bit rough, calling dam safety people. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, I know. 11-22-10 113 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They called me, Buster, after 2 I talked to the Watermaster. That's how they got involved. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They also wanted to come see 5 how we drained the lake, get out of Austin for a day. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Dam people. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We've got one more item on 8 the agenda. I assume that is going to require executive 9 session? 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Why don't we go to Section 4 of the 12 agenda, payment of the bills. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, I move we pay the bills 14 today. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I do too. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that we pay 17 the bills. Question or discussion? Ms. Hargis, we're not -- 18 we're -- are we merely acting as the banker for the Adult 19 Probation offices? 20 MS. HARGIS: Yes. And that came through, again, as 21 part of the report this time because of the closing of the 22 books. It's one of those things at the end of the year that 23 we run into, where we can't sever it out like we'd like to. 24 But we pay theirs, and unfortunately, it shows up on this 25 report. 11-22-10 114 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 2 MS. HARGIS: Which you're not approving those. 3 You're -- 4 JUDGE TINLEY: But out of our funds, all we pay is 5 the -- are the garrison-type expenses, the utilities and 6 housing and that sort of stuff? 7 MS. HARGIS: That's right. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Page 6, Sheriff's Department, 9 vehicle repair, vehicle maintenance, almost $1,900. Is that 10 a whole bunch of vehicles, or did we have one that -- 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's one of them four-legged 12 things that ran across the road in front of it. 13 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, we've had a couple of those 14 four-legged friends over there. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Hunters weren't doing a good 16 enough job lately. 17 MS. HARGIS: And we have a $1,000 deductible, so we 18 will be getting some refunds on -- on one of them, but not 19 the first -- not one. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The first one was 21 900-something, so we won't get that. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Is Krause doing body work? 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. I didn't think so. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, Krause is our oil changes 11-22-10 115 1 and regular repairs. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. That's where that 1,900 3 was. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah. That may have been a 5 month or two worth of bills. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Page 8, Department of Public Safety, 7 Time-Warner Cable. 8 MS. HARGIS: They still have cable. They have 9 cable over there. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I guess -- here's my note that 11 I put on it. 12 MS. HARGIS: I think it's the internet. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I'll tell you what the note says. 14 If they code it, quote, telephone, unquote, we get to pay it? 15 Question mark. 16 MS. HARGIS: No. I believe this is their internet 17 service. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think that's for more than 19 a month. 20 MS. HARGIS: But I'll have to check, Judge. I 21 didn't -- you caught me on this one. I don't know. I have 22 to look. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Maybe I'm not real familiar with 24 what all we pay. I thought we -- 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Secretary is what I thought. 11-22-10 116 1 MS. HARGIS: Well, no, we pay their telephone and 2 we pay some other expenses over there. I don't have it in 3 front of me, but we don't just pay for her. They have a 4 whole budget. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: If you got something that itemizes 6 that, I'd appreciate you circulating that to us. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This is the first time in 8 all these years that I've heard internet or television or 9 whatever it is they have with the -- with that particular 10 service. We do the breathalyzer thing with them, and we used 11 to buy the radar units. 12 MS. HARGIS: We used to do the pagers, and we don't 13 do the pagers any more. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Don't do the pagers any 15 more. I'll tell you what, when this stuff pops up -- the 16 great state of Texas, they're on TV this morning bragging on 17 how they're going to balance the budget. I wonder how 18 they're going to do that. 19 MS. HARGIS: Well, get ready for the... 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You can feel the suction 22 starting to build, can't you? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's the love. I guarantee 24 you, man. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: That's all I got, gentlemen. Any 11-22-10 117 1 other questions or comments? All in favor of the motion, 2 signify by raising your right hand. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 5 (No response.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. Budget 7 amendments. You've got one of those -- 8 MS. HARGIS: For the Schreiner -- 9 JUDGE TINLEY: -- for the next step on the 10 Schreiner Road Trust fund? 11 MS. HARGIS: Yes. So that is just the budget -- 12 really, just putting that budget into place. That's all that 13 is. Now, there was a question earlier about Windstream and 14 the contract. We probably should let the County Attorney -- 15 we've both been researching this, but we will be paying for 16 the Windstream bill -- two different sections of that 17 Windstream bill at the Sheriff's Office for -- one for 12 18 months and one for 13 months, I believe. 19 MR. HENNEKE: Well, we haven't stopped. We have 20 two contracts in place between the Sheriff's Office and 21 Windstream, one for lease of equipment and one for service. 22 I think the total is approximately 800 -- 800 and change a 23 month between the two agreements. They're five-year 24 agreements, and expire in December of 2011. There's not been 25 any, to my knowledge, action to negotiate a termination of 11-22-10 118 1 those agreements per the terms of the agreements. The 2 penalty clause on one for early termination is 12 months 3 times the monthly rate which we're at, and the other one does 4 not have an early termination clause. But, again, we're 5 about 12 months out from the end of the -- of the agreement. 6 My understanding from the County Auditor's office is that the 7 funds for the -- for these Windstream contracts are in the 8 Sheriff's I.T. budget -- or telecommunications budget, that 9 are in there, and that's where this is being paid from, even 10 though now the phone budget items are now in the I.T. 11 Department. So, we -- we budgeted money for these contracts, 12 and I guess we're continuing to pay them. And if -- if the 13 Court would like me to get with Windstream and negotiate, try 14 to see if we can negotiate a -- a termination, I'd be glad to 15 do so, but there's just not been any action on them, and 16 we're just continuing to pay them while -- 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Basically, service with them, 18 haven't we terminated that now that we have Hill Country? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: You can still have redundant 20 telephone service, can't you? 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We don't have the equipment 22 any more. I.T. came and took all the equipment. I don't 23 know where it is, okay? And some of the phone lines -- 24 MS. HARGIS: They've been disconnected, one at a 25 time. They're not all disconnected yet. 11-22-10 119 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Some of them we still have to 2 have, such as the Center Point line, the Crimestoppers line, 3 and some of the other numbers. All that equipment was 4 leased. I don't know why he took -- 5 MR. HENNEKE: Still leasing it. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And, you know -- 7 MS. HARGIS: We have been disconnecting, is my 8 understanding from my office, because Tracy's been dealing 9 with them one at a time. It's not -- you know, whenever John 10 says, "Release this line," then we -- so we still have more 11 lines that we haven't gotten. It takes Windstream, as you 12 recall, about 90 days to disconnect a line, so we're still 13 working on that. And we are going to -- we're trying to get 14 a contact; our contact is no longer with Windstream. And 15 Ms. Henderson has been gracious enough to find us a new 16 contact that we're going to try to deal with, and between the 17 County Attorney and my office, we're going to try to 18 renegotiate this so we can reduce this cost. But I did want 19 you to be aware of that. 20 (Commissioner Baldwin left the meeting.) 21 MR. HENNEKE: If -- if we're so directed. I mean, 22 right now there's not been any Court direction to seek to 23 terminate the agreement. We entered into a five-year 24 agreement four years ago, and if the Court wants to terminate 25 that, then I can contact Windstream. Otherwise, we're still 11-22-10 120 1 just paying every month like, you know, we've had set up. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Do you need to put that on 3 the next agenda for us to take formal action to do that? 4 MR. HENNEKE: If that's what -- if y'all want to. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Why don't we get that issue on the 6 next agenda? 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't think we can do it 8 today. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: No. No. 10 MS. HARGIS: And the other -- the other thing is -- 11 that I mentioned to you, the 500,000. I do want the Court to 12 be aware that, you know, Eva's going to have the insurance 13 consultants meet with me tomorrow. I do not have the numbers 14 on the new policy, and I'm -- I'm very concerned that we 15 won't meet our budget for next year, based on the claims that 16 we have right now. So, that's kind of where we're at. I 17 want to keep you informed. We hope to make that -- 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Good. Good. I expect that. 19 MS. HARGIS: I have a spreadsheet which I haven't 20 reviewed with her yet that I've done -- Mindy and I did based 21 on what we can kind of guess at. But, again, these -- 22 unfortunately, the way claims work, we run about six months 23 behind, at least 90 days behind as far as paying some of 24 these, and so it may be a while before we finish this -- this 25 all out. But just based on our current budgeting and how 11-22-10 121 1 much we've paid out already, we're already in the hole. 2 So -- and I ran it through December using some estimated 3 numbers, and the 500,000 came up. And, again, I haven't 4 shared this with her, but I do want the Court to know that 5 I'm not sure we're going to meet that budget number, and -- 6 because it's just November, so we're all aware of it. And 7 we'll work on it on a constant basis, but -- 8 JUDGE TINLEY: That's what the two of y'all do, is 9 consistently share information, so that the right hand knows 10 what the left's doing. You can kind of shepherd it along. 11 MS. HARGIS: Thank you. 12 THE CLERK: Judge? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: We need a motion on the budget 14 amendments. 15 THE CLERK: Yeah, that's what I was going to say. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Move approval. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 19 approval of a budget amendment relating to the Schreiner Road 20 Trust. Question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, 21 signify by raising your right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed? 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. You have no late 11-22-10 122 1 bills, I assume? 2 MS. HARGIS: No, sir, we do not. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Monthly reports? I received 4 monthly reports, Kerr County Treasurer's report for October 5 2010; Justice of the Peace, Precinct 1; Justice of the Peace, 6 Precinct 2; District Clerk; Constable, Precinct 3, for 7 September and October 2010; and Justice of the Peace, 8 Precinct 4. Do I hear a motion that these reports as 9 indicated be approved? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, sir. So moved. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 13 approval of the indicated reports. Question or discussion? 14 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 15 hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed? 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. Any more reports? 20 How about reports from Commissioners in connection with their 21 liaison or committee assignments? Commissioner Letz? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't think I have anything 23 at the moment. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Oehler? 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not really. 11-22-10 123 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. How about elected officials? 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Of course, real quick. Our 3 two long-term inmates have finally pled, on their way to the 4 prison system. The last one's in the Kowalski case, and he's 5 been taken care of. Our population as of this morning, total 6 was 141, which has dropped drastically, and females has gone 7 down to 15. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, how about that. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We got lucky. T.D.C. took a 10 whole bunch the other day last week. We were -- the courts 11 finally moved some. I guess some of them, you know, decided 12 long enough. So, knock on wood, right now we're doing pretty 13 good on that end of things. That's all I've got. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Good. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 16 MR. HENNEKE: Briefly, Judge, Commissioners, I just 17 wanted to make you aware. We had the holiday lighting parade 18 and ceremony on Saturday. We had an elderly woman that fell, 19 got hurt. Not due to our negligence; just happened to be a 20 little depression area over on the exit there, Earl Garrett 21 and Jefferson Street. Nighttime, walking through the grass, 22 lost her footing and fell down, hurt herself. I talked with 23 Tim about it. He's looking at it, but I went out there and 24 checked it out, and it's not anything that I think we should 25 have done differently. It just happened to be uneven ground, 11-22-10 124 1 and she tripped and fell and hurt herself. But I wanted to 2 make sure y'all were aware of that. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: We are going to report it, however, 4 to our premises liability carrier? 5 MR. HENNEKE: Yes, sir. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Ms. Williams? 7 MS. WILLIAMS: Just wanted to let the Court know 8 we're moved into our new office, and I want to tell you, the 9 Maintenance Department did a fantastic job getting that ready 10 for us to move last Thursday. Sheriff's Office, B.J. brought 11 three guys over. They got all our big stuff moved by noon. 12 Maintenance did a fantastic job in helping us get everything 13 settled and set up, and I.T. did a good job getting our 14 computers up and our phones, so we were ready to rock and 15 roll come Friday morning. So, come down, look at the office. 16 It's really, really nice. I didn't realize how many people 17 thought we were down in the mushroom patch until we got moved 18 to the new offices. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Buster's wanting to know if 20 you're going to be serving cookies and punch. 21 MS. WILLIAMS: That will probably be a little bit 22 later, closer to Christmas. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just thought I'd ask that, 24 you know, for him. 25 MS. WILLIAMS: Okay. 11-22-10 125 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: One other bit of sad news I 2 want to mention. Our Jail Administrator, Ms. -- or Assistant 3 Jail Administrator, Ms. Mabel, as we call her, her husband 4 passed away this last weekend. He's been ill for a long 5 time, but I think the service is Friday at Grimes. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other elected officials? 7 Department heads? 8 MS. HYDE: Insurance. We are looking to do open 9 enrollment second week of December. I talked to several of 10 you regarding some of the comments and responses that we've 11 had thus far. I will put it on the agenda after I talk to 12 the County Attorney. I am going to encourage the Court to 13 please come to some open enrollments. My response will be 14 based upon, "This was the Court's decision, and this is what 15 we need to do." So, if you have any other points that you 16 would like me to pass on, please let me know. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Do you need computers for the 18 open enrollment? 19 MS. HYDE: Mm-hmm. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? Okay. At this time, 22 we will go out of public or open session at 11:59 for the 23 purpose of going into closed or executive session. 24 (The open session was closed at 11:59 a.m., and an executive session was held, the transcript of which 25 is contained in a separate document.) - - - - - - - - - - 11-22-10 126 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, we're back in open or public 2 session, and it is 12:16 p.m. Does any member of the Court 3 have anything to offer with respect to matters discussed in 4 executive or closed session? 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I move that we authorize the 6 County Attorney to write a letter and try to get a remedy to 7 the item discussed in executive session. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Got to name what it is, though. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We need a name on it? To 10 Bill Vlasek through his attorney, Tom Pollard. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 14 indicated. Question or discussion? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do we need any more 16 specificity, or is this enough? 17 MR. HENNEKE: This is with regard -- as noticed on 18 the agenda item, this is in regard to the easement 19 encroachment issue on Mr. Vlasek's property on Ingram Lake, 20 and in west Kerr County. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll include that into my 22 motion. Thank you. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Any further question or discussion? 24 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 25 hand. 11-22-10 127 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Gentlemen, 5 do we have anything else to come before the Court at this 6 time? 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What's the deal tomorrow at 8 11 o'clock at the Sheriff's Office? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Agenda for tomorrow. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Some kind of -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Social thing or something. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, this isn't social. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, 11 o'clock? Hazard mitigation 14 public meeting. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What is that? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: That's a very, very important -- ask 17 the Kerrville Fire Marshal. He's the one that wants you to 18 be there. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The fire marshal? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, he's one of them that sent a 21 message over here. He really wants all of us to be there. I 22 don't know; maybe he's having a party. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We should get some better 24 explanation. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We need to schedule better, 11-22-10 128 1 'cause I won't be around tomorrow. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I plan to be there, 3 but -- 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. I -- 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I just didn't understand what 6 this was about. I thought maybe some more birds flying 7 through the air invading Kerr County or something. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anything else, gentlemen? 9 We'll be adjourned. 10 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 12:17 p.m.) 11 - - - - - - - - - - 12 13 STATE OF TEXAS | 14 COUNTY OF KERR | 15 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 16 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 17 official reporter for the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 18 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 19 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 29th day of November, 20 2010. 21 22 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 23 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 24 Certified Shorthand Reporter 25 11-22-10