1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Special Session 10 Monday, January 24, 2011 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 GUY R. OVERBY, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X January 24, 2011 2 PAGE --- Visitors Input 6 3 --- Commissioners' Comments 8 4 1.1 Public Hearing for proposed private road name "Infamous Trail NW", Precinct 4 11 5 1.2 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for 6 final approval for proposed private road name "Infamous Trail NW", Precinct 4 12 7 1.3 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 8 set public hearing for adoption of new Flood Damage Prevention Order 13 9 1.4 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 2010 10 report from Kerr County Historical Commission 15 11 1.5 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on proposal for public access roadway improvements 12 on IH-10 to provide access to Town Creek Development and adjacent property 33 13 1.6 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 14 approve maintenance agreement between Kerr County and Ikon on microfilm reader-printer in County 15 Clerk's Office for $400 per year; authorize County Judge to sign same 64 16 1.7 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 17 approve report to Commissioners Court of status of investments made under Section 887(b), Probate 18 Code 65 19 1.8 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to authorize Auditor and Treasurer to advertise for 20 depository service contract RFA's 65 21 1.9 Acknowledge receipt of quarterly investment report from Patterson and Associates for quarter ending 22 12-31-10 70 23 1.10 Consider/discuss, approve resolution for the submission of General Victim Assistance-Direct 24 Services Programs grant proposal for 2011-2012 to Office of the Governor, Criminal Justice Division, 25 to fund Kerr County Crime Victims Coordinator program for another year 70 3 1 I N D E X (Continued) January 24, 2011 2 PAGE 1.11 Recognition of Kerr County Crime Stoppers 25th 3 Anniversary; present certificate from Governor Rick Perry to Kerr County Crime Stoppers board 4 president Patrick Cass 72 5 1.12 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to set an ESD presentation to Commissioners Court and 6 community for February 7, 2011, at 6:30 p.m., District Courtroom 75 7 1.13 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 8 payment of attorney fees for outside counsel in LCRA PUC matter 78 9 1.14 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 10 set public hearing regarding court action to close, vacate, abandon and/or discontinue all 11 or a portion of Camp Verde Rd. from FM 480 to Hwy 173 pursuant to Texas Transportation Code 94 12 1.15 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 13 reappoint Commissioners Ken Wood, Cheryl Thompson, and Donald Oehler to ESD #1 102 14 1.16 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 15 approve application for 2011 Criminal Justice Programs Solicitation in the amount of $44,500 16 for Automated Fingerprint Identification System 103 17 1.17 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve amendment to CHM Agreement for inmate 18 health services at Kerr County Jail 108 19 1.18 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve 2011-2012 maintenance agreement between 20 Voice Products, Inc. and Kerr County Sheriff for maintenance of recorder equipment in dispatch 111 21 1.19 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 22 approve agreement and proposal for a transport- ability study conducted by FitForce and its 23 associates to validate physical readiness standards for patrol and correction officers 113 24 1.20 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 25 "Tier 1 - Partial Exemption Racial Profiling Report" for Constable, Precinct 1 115 4 1 I N D E X (Continued) January 24, 2011 2 PAGE 1.21 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 3 various profiles to be sent to City of Kerrville concerning joint city/county functions 117 4 1.22 Pending and possible litigation regarding Vlasek 5 issue (Executive Session) --- 6 1.23 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on retainage belonging to Kendnel Kasper Construction 7 pursuant to construction contract on Sheriff's Office Annex 126 8 4.1 Pay Bills 131 9 4.2 Budget Amendments --- 4.3 Late Bills 131 10 4.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 133 11 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee Assignments 134 12 5.2 Reports from Elected Officials/Department Heads 138 13 1.24 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to confer with County Attorney regarding status of 14 LCRA CREZ litigation; consider/discuss, take appropriate action to authorize pursuit of 15 appellate remedies (Executive Session) 142 16 --- Adjourned 142 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 5 1 On Monday, January 24, 2011, at 9:00 a.m., a special 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. 8 Let me call to order this regularly scheduled meeting of the 9 Kerr County Commissioners Court posted and scheduled for this 10 date and time, Monday, January 24th, 2011, at 9 a.m. It's a 11 bit past that time now. Commissioner Baldwin? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. Would you please 13 stand and pray with us, and then we will have the pledge of 14 allegiance. 15 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: At this time, if there's a member of 19 the public or the audience that wishes to be heard on a 20 matter that is not a listed agenda item, this is your 21 opportunity to come forward and tell us what's on your mind. 22 If you wish to be heard on an agenda item, we'd ask that you 23 wait until that agenda item is called, and we'd also ask that 24 you fill out a participation form. There should be some 25 located at the rear of the room. If, for some reason, we get 1-24-11 6 1 to an agenda item and you want to be heard on that item and 2 have not filled out a participation form, that's fine too. 3 Just get my attention in some manner, and we'll give you that 4 opportunity. But right now, if there's any member of the 5 audience that wishes to be heard on a matter that is not a 6 listed agenda item, come forward and tell us what's on your 7 mind. Yes, sir? If you'll come forward, give us your name 8 and address, please. 9 MR. CHRISTIANSEN: Dee Christiansen. We live over 10 on Interstate 10 and Goat Creek Road there. Is the 11 interstate alignment of the power lines on the agenda, or 12 that's just a private session? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: No, it is not on the agenda. 14 MR. CHRISTIANSEN: It's not on? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: No. 16 MR. CHRISTIANSEN: Could you -- 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, with the exception of -- of 18 possible litigation. 19 MR. CHRISTIANSEN: Right. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Which, of course, is a matter that 21 can be handled in executive session. Did you have some 22 comments you'd like to make on that? 23 MR. CHRISTIANSEN: I'd just like to say, first of 24 all, I never did think that anybody would be foolish enough 25 to run the power lines down Interstate 10. I mean, that was 1-24-11 7 1 just beyond my wildest comprehension, when there's so much 2 vacant land that wouldn't interfere. When it actually 3 happened, I mean, it was pretty -- I was surprised. And I'd 4 just like to say that, you know, we -- we contribute -- our 5 customers contribute $9 million a year to Kerr County. 6 That's based on the Travel Council's numbers, not ours. We 7 pay $60,000 to $70,000 a year in taxes. We've been working 8 over there for 11 years to build a nice product, which I 9 think is a nice product for Kerr County, and now to have some 10 agency come through there and put a power line and take half 11 of our place out, destroy the half that remains, it's just 12 beyond my wildest dreams, and so we are definitely going to 13 sue. We hope the County sues. And I'm sure we're not alone 14 in that with the other customers. I talked to Cecil 15 Atkission this morning, and others. And this -- I think it's 16 just ridiculous. Thank you. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. Anyone else wish to 18 be heard on any matter that is not a listed agenda item? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, would I assume 20 correctly that that gentleman -- would I assume that the 21 gentleman's from Buckhorn? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, sir, he certainly is. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Seeing no one else coming forward, 25 we'll move on with the agenda. Commissioner Baldwin, do you 1-24-11 8 1 have anything for us this morning? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, none, other than I am 3 really excited about this meeting. My wife told me to say 4 that. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You know, that's all. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, you'll get in trouble if you 8 don't say it. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir, that's exactly 10 right. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Overby? 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Judge and Commissioners, I 13 would like to just kind give a couple of comments. Of 14 course, getting up to full speed with what's going on, I just 15 in the last couple of weeks have been attending several 16 department meetings, learning what's going on in our county 17 right now, and obviously for the constituents in Precinct 2, 18 learning what's going on. And so in representing them and 19 telling them what's happening, I'd just like to say the last 20 couple weeks I've attended department meetings in the 21 Sheriff's Department area, the Environmental Department, our 22 land and -- Road and Bridge area, and Human Resources, and I 23 just want to say to those departments, just what's going on 24 right now, you're working in some challenging economic times 25 that we're all facing up here, but I'm just very impressed by 1-24-11 9 1 how you're working with your tight budgets that we have. 2 And, of course, looking at our forecast for 2011, those 3 budgets are going to remain tight. But, again, you're doing 4 a fantastic job in just what's going on. I look forward to 5 working with the Commissioners and you as this year proceeds 6 and going forward with these challenging times. 7 A couple other comments. I wanted to just comment 8 on the livestock show. I had an opportunity to call some, I 9 guess, play-by-play -- on Friday nights, I'm used to calling 10 either T.V. or radio football games play-by-play. I never 11 called livestock play-by-play, or rulings. I learned a few 12 things last week. First of all, that hand signals on the 13 sidelines aren't normally just for quarterbacks, but I 14 learned on livestock, on show weekend, there's a lot of hand 15 signals going on with what's going on as well. So, just, 16 again, very impressive livestock performance, and it was just 17 great to see it packed out there, Commissioners, and to see 18 what was going on. And I will say that's a tremendous 19 economic boon to our community. And, again, we need to be 20 revisiting the opportunity to push ag expansion out there in 21 that facility and those properties. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask you a question. 23 Were you out there when the deer and the antelope played? 24 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Well, yeah. Well, there was 25 a lot of deer and antelope playing, so... 1-24-11 10 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: It was very impressive. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? 4 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: No, thank you. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Letz? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Really, just kind of a 7 follow-up on that a little bit. The stock show was -- we had 8 great weather; you can't beat that. The week before, Kendall 9 County wasn't quite so nice, so it was very fortunate for us 10 in Kerr County. Good attendance. The sale appeared to me -- 11 I'm not sure what the total dollars were, but I know there 12 seemed to be more buyers than I've seen, in the last year 13 anyway, or last couple years, and a lot of new buyers, which 14 is good to see. Very active bidding. I wasn't there a real 15 long time. I know Bruce was there a good part of the day, I 16 think. But it was a great show. Great sale, I think. And 17 hats off to everyone involved; kids, the Stock Show 18 Association, everybody else, Tim, wherever he is -- I don't 19 know if he's in here. Our Maintenance Department did a great 20 job, as always, and also volunteers with TexDOT and Sheriff's 21 Department, a lot of people out there, county-wide effort. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that it? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's it. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Oehler? 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll continue on with that a 1-24-11 11 1 little bit. It seemed to me that everything that we did in 2 preparation for that event, as far as closing the park, 3 closing the road, really didn't have to happen, but it was 4 there in case it was needed, and they used the park. And 5 trailer parking was all the way at the other end of the park 6 this year, which is different than where they've had it in 7 the past. Seemed to me like everything flowed smoothly. I 8 didn't hear any -- much, if any, griping, complaining from 9 anybody, and it was a huge show, lots of participants. And 10 it is an economic boon for Kerr County, that kind of group of 11 people coming in. I understand there were 2,700 entries. 12 And, of course, there's multiples for some of the 13 participants. But that is -- that's huge, and hats off to 14 everybody, just like Jon said. It takes a lot of folks to 15 put that event on. That's it. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Let's get on with our 17 agenda. At this time, I will recess the Commissioners Court 18 meeting, and I'll convene a public hearing for the proposed 19 private road name Infamous Trail Northwest located in 20 Precinct 4. 21 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 9:13 a.m., and a public hearing was held in open 22 court, as follows:) 23 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Is there any member of the public or 25 audience that wishes to be heard with respect to the proposed 1-24-11 12 1 private road name Infamous Trail Northwest located in 2 Precinct 4? 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Seeing no one coming forward, I will 5 close the public hearing for the proposed road -- private 6 road name of Infamous Trail Northwest, and I will reconvene 7 the Commissioners Court meeting. 8 (The public hearing was concluded at 9:13 a.m. and the regular Commissioners Court meeting was 9 reopened.) 10 - - - - - - - - - - 11 JUDGE TINLEY: And we'll go to Item 2; consider, 12 discuss, take appropriate action for the final approval of 13 the proposed private road name Infamous Trail Northwest, 14 located in Precinct 4. Mr. Odom? 15 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir, Judge. Thank you. 16 Mr. Lubojasky requested on November 22nd, 2010, the private 17 road name of Infamous Trail Northwest, with four lots serving 18 the subdivision out there. This is off Love Ranch over 19 there. And he has written a letter that states that all four 20 owners agree to the proposed name, and at this time we ask 21 the Court for the final approval for the proposed private 22 road name Infamous Trail Northwest, Precinct 4. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Move approval. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 1-24-11 13 1 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 2 favor of that motion, signify by raising your right hand. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 5 (No response.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll move 7 to Item 3, a 9:15 timed item. It is that time now. 8 Consider, discuss, take appropriate action to set a public 9 hearing for the adoption of new Flood Damage Prevention Order 10 for Precincts 1, 2, 3, and 4. Mr. Odom? 11 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. Before you, you have on the 12 agenda item there is the proposed Flood Damage Prevention 13 Order and the changes thereof. Is John here? 14 MS. HOFFER: I didn't see him. 15 MR. ODOM: Huh? 16 MS. HOFFER: I don't see him. 17 MR. ODOM: Well, I was thinking John was supposed 18 to be here, but this has been reviewed. I've looked at it. 19 I had one change, some wording, and we've sent this to the -- 20 Rob to review, and I believe that he has made some new 21 changes on that prevention order. And any questions I guess 22 I will try to answer for you. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Len, are the -- I presume this 24 is going to be on file at the clerk's office? 25 MR. ODOM: Yes. 1-24-11 14 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are the maps going to be there 2 as well? Copies of the new maps? I mean -- 3 MR. ODOM: The copies of the new map will be given 4 there, yes, and we'll have some at the office there too. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's one of the things -- we 6 just need to make sure those maps are available to the public 7 prior to the public hearing. 8 MR. ODOM: Right. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Rob, I mean, we're okay to go 10 ahead and move forward with the draft version? 11 MR. HENNEKE: Yes, sir. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move we set the public 13 hearing for adoption of the new flood -- new Flood Damage 14 Prevention Order for February -- what's the second week -- 15 February 28th, I believe. 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: February 28th. 17 MR. ODOM: I think February 28th. 18 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's correct. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: February 28th. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: What time? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 10 a.m. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second to set 24 a public hearing for the adoption of the new Flood Damage 25 Prevention Order for February 28th, 2011, at 10 a.m. 1-24-11 15 1 Question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify 2 by raising your right hand. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 5 (No response.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Thank you. 7 We'll go to our next timed item, Item 4, a 9:15 item; 8 consider, discuss, take appropriate action on 2010 report 9 from the Kerr County Historical Commission. Ms. Leonard? 10 MS. LEONARD: Good morning. I think you all have 11 copies of the report, so I'll just kind of briefly go over 12 it. This year saw continued interest by members of the Kerr 13 County Historical Commission in fulfilling our state-mandated 14 purpose of preserving our county's historic cultural 15 resources. We continued to fulfill our responsibility for 16 public education through history-related presentations at our 17 monthly meetings. This year's programs covered early ranch 18 life, cemeteries, early education, archeology, challenges and 19 triumphs of the county's first female sheriff, and a pioneer 20 family's experiences. We also held a giant meeting with the 21 Hill Country Archeological Association. A longstanding way 22 of reaching the public is through evolving displays in the 23 courthouse lobby. This year's exhibits continued with Kerr 24 County Historical Markers and Cemeteries, and a new exhibit 25 on the Ayala and Other Hispanic Citizens of Kerr County. The 1-24-11 16 1 annual exhibit at the Kerr Arts and Cultural Center featured 2 The Changing Face of Kerr County. This display compared 3 historic and modern photographs of scenes throughout the 4 county. 5 We continued our historical marker and oral history 6 programs with recognition of several historic sites and 7 notable county citizens that have contributed to the county's 8 heritage. Refurbishment of several historic markers by the 9 Boy Scouts greatly improved the appearance of these 10 treasures. This year we also worked on increasing attendance 11 and attracting new members via a new resident visitation 12 service. Local newspapers were generous in coverage of our 13 exhibit and historical marker dedication ceremonies, which 14 enabled us to spread the news about our county's heritage. 15 In April, the Texas Historical Commission bestowed the Kerr 16 County Historical Commission with the Distinguished Service 17 Award for our 2009 contributions. This award was formally 18 presented to us by the Kerr County Commissioners Court. 19 Last year, the archives, we added oral history and 20 marker applications, news articles, and a video by Wheeler 21 Mosty recording his memories of the 1932 flood. Schreiner 22 University personnel are digitalizing oral histories to make 23 them available as part of their internet-based "Faces of Kerr 24 County" series. We continue to use the room in the basement 25 of the courthouse to store our photographic collection, and 1-24-11 17 1 the courthouse commission room is now arranged as a work room 2 for multiple commission projects. Our historical markers, we 3 had three; Old Spanish Trail, Great Western Trail, and the 4 Apelt Armadillo Farm, and each ceremony received extensive 5 local newspaper coverage and had large audiences. We 6 received notification from Texas Historical Commission that 7 the Notre Dame Catholic Church and the N.O. Reynolds home in 8 Center Point were approved for markers. We now await 9 approval from T.H.C. for the H.E.B. Grocery Store and the 10 Center Point school. 11 The Boy Scout Troop 60 undertook a marker 12 refurbishment project. Using instruction from the T.H.C., 13 the scouts restored six markers to a like-new condition. A 14 merit patch was designed and funded by the Kerr County 15 Historical Commission, and was presented at a Kerr County 16 Commissioners Court meeting. Marker activities still in work 17 include dedication ceremonies for the Masonic Building and 18 the Starkey Cemetery. The final approval of the state-funded 19 marker recognizing the Penataka Comanche for placement at 20 Camp Verde has been approved. And additionally, TexDOT 21 approved the movement of Camp Verde Confederate States of 22 America marker from the courthouse to the historic park 23 across from Camp Verde Store. 24 Oral history. We finalized the oral histories of 25 Robert Lee Mosty, Mary Ayala Garza, James Avery, "Boss" 1-24-11 18 1 Merritt, and Frances Kaiser. Exhibits this year were the 2 Kerr County historical markers in the courthouse, and then a 3 new exhibit about the Kerr County Hispanic community was 4 based on an interview with David Alcorta, in the display 5 cabinets. The Kerr County Cemetery brochure was updated and 6 republished in July, and this brochure summarizes information 7 on the county cemeteries, plus providing driving directions 8 and GPS coordinates. A Historic Texas Cemetery Application 9 for the Wellborn Cemetery near Center Point was submitted to 10 the T.H.C. Our web site, we have 250 members on Facebook, 11 and this is an excellent medium to complement the 12 Commission's web site in receiving inquires about Kerr County 13 history. Archeology, we receive monthly updates from the 14 Hill Country Archeological Association and their involvement 15 with electric transmission lines, cell tower construction, 16 bridge replacement projects, and discovery of potential 17 historic sites throughout the county. And the Union Church 18 is resulting in a newly erected gate with gateposts and 19 refurbished fencing from the first Kerr County Courthouse. 20 What was left out of here is endangered properties. 21 The Famous Door owners are cooperating to donate memorabilia. 22 Stagecoach stop at Center Point -- a half mile east of Center 23 Point has been identified, and the Center Point train depot 24 building was found and identified in Boerne. And as a 25 special project, we contracted with Kerr County Greeters, a 1-24-11 19 1 newcomer welcoming group, to try to capture new meeting 2 attendees and new members. Unfortunately, this effort did 3 not gain us any new attendees. Our awards was -- I mentioned 4 we were recognized for our 2009 achievements with the 5 Distinguished Service Award. We have submitted this year 6 nominations for the 2010 Texas Historical Commission awards 7 for Bonnie Arnold for the Award of Excellence in Media for 8 the Community Journal series on Kerr County military, and we 9 have submitted longtime Kerrville Historical Commission 10 member Clarabelle Snodgrass for the T.H.C.'s Ruth Lester 11 Lifetime Achievement Award, and winners will be announced at 12 the 2011 conference. And there's a list of chronological 13 that y'all have. And at this time, too, one of our new 14 commission members is with us, and it's Jay Bailey. I'd like 15 to introduce him. 16 MR. BAILEY: Good morning, Commissioners. I'm Jay 17 Bailey. 18 MS. LEONARD: And also, Judge Tinley, I left -- did 19 you give him the membership list? I brought in a membership 20 list about two weeks ago that you were to sign, but I gave 21 her a new one, 'cause I need to mail it. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me say something right 23 quick. 24 MS. LEONARD: Okay. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have that list. 1-24-11 20 1 MS. LEONARD: But there's another list that -- 2 that's separate from your list. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. I have both 4 lists. 5 MS. LEONARD: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And is that -- is the new 7 list, is that the new additions from last week? 8 MS. LEONARD: That's everybody. That's everybody 9 on that list. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And so that's a requirement 11 of the County Judge to sign off on all -- 12 MS. LEONARD: Yes. I have to send it to Austin. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And to add all the addresses 14 and phone numbers, I think, and then we send it on to Austin. 15 MS. LEONARD: Right. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, we're going to do that. 17 We'll take care of that. There's one issue that has come up. 18 These guys started asking me about membership -- about the 19 membership. Is it equal across the county in their 20 precincts? 21 MS. LEONARD: We're trying. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Well, I think that 23 they're willing to help fix that. And the minority issue, is 24 there minorities on that group? So, I think that -- I think 25 that we're going to have a conversation about that, and we 1-24-11 21 1 want to add some minorities on it, for sure. I do. 2 MS. LEONARD: That would be wonderful. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: For absolute sure, I do. 4 And you mentioned a name in your report, the Ayala family, 5 and one of our constables is a member of that family. We 6 need to put him on this thing. 7 MS. LEONARD: I would love to have him, yes. I 8 would love to have him. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We need to put him on that 10 thing, whether he likes it or not. (Laughter.) 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Can you mention it to him? 12 Have you mentioned that to him? 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I didn't think so. 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: He doesn't know yet. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And he doesn't need to know 17 until he gets his notice to come to the meeting. So, that's 18 about it. But I'd like to give you an example of people that 19 are representative in our -- in our individual precincts. In 20 my precinct, there are 12 members in my precinct alone, and 21 in Commissioners Oehler's, there is zero. So I don't -- I'm 22 pretty happy with mine; I like that number. But, you know, 23 it's up to these guys if they want to work those numbers 24 around or not. 25 MS. LEONARD: Well, I've spoken with Lucy Gould -- 1-24-11 22 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Gould. 2 MS. LEONARD: -- and tried to get her on the 3 commission and help me, you know, recruit people from west 4 Kerr County. And -- 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I will help you with that. I 6 just -- I was not aware until it was brought to my attention 7 that we didn't have good -- you know, a good number of 8 representatives on that. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Don't have any. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Don't have any. 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I believe there were six in 12 Precinct 2. I believe 10 were in Precinct 3, so that's 28 13 that we have. And zero in Precinct 4. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, that's kind of sad. 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah, that is kind of sad. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the other -- and, 17 certainly, we might -- my precinct has a lot, but the concern 18 I have is that they're not distributed. I only know of one 19 in Precinct -- in 308 or 303, which is the rural areas. Or 20 320, for that matter. I'm not sure about 320, but I know -- 21 and I think we need to really work on trying to get people 22 from a diverse area. 23 MS. LEONARD: We want that. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How many members are on the 25 Historical Commission, or can that be any number that the 1-24-11 23 1 Court chooses? That's Question A. And Question B is, how do 2 they get there, and who approves them? I mean, how are they 3 found? 4 MS. LEONARD: Usually they start attending 5 meetings, and some of our other -- our commission members 6 recommend people that they work with and know that they have 7 historical interest. And, quite frankly, we have a lot of 8 people on here that don't do anything. And as in every 9 organization, there's probably five or six people that, you 10 know, do all the work. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 12 MS. LEONARD: And that's one of my goals this year, 13 is to try to question each one of these people, what their 14 interests are, and then hopefully assign them to different 15 committees. Like, if they're interested in archeology or 16 cemeteries or preserving old buildings, or -- you know, 17 just -- you know. And as you know, we're limited, because, 18 you know, we -- you know, people call me and say, "Why aren't 19 you saving this -- this house?" Well, number one, we usually 20 don't know about it till it's destroyed, and second of all, 21 we have no funds to do it. And so all -- all we can do is 22 help, you know, make the people aware that we are interested 23 in history. Even if you tear a house down, if you have any 24 memorabilia that the County might be interested in -- and one 25 thing our county is lacking in, we have no county museum. We 1-24-11 24 1 have no -- you know, people that want to donate collections 2 to us, there's no place to -- to do anything with it. And, 3 of course, that's a humongous undertaking to -- as you know, 4 you've got staff. You know, I mean, that -- that would be -- 5 but there are other ways that that could be probably 6 accomplished. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Isn't -- I mean, I know that 8 Schreiner Mansion was recently given to Schreiner University. 9 Is that -- and that, I mean, is a museum, which I always kind 10 of looked at as a county-type museum. 11 MS. LEONARD: We don't own it. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there any communication with 13 the university about it? 14 MS. LEONARD: Yes, but they're noncommittal. And 15 we've heard they want to use it just like an event center, 16 which would -- you know -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They can do what they want. 18 MS. LEONARD: Yeah, they own it, so they obviously 19 can do whatever. We're hoping that maybe in the new 20 Schreiner Department Store, that they might have a little 21 area that they might say this is -- but it would be really 22 nice for -- for Kerr County to have some kind of -- I mean, 23 Comfort has a museum. I mean, these small towns. But, I 24 mean, like I say, it's a huge undertaking. You've got staff, 25 insurance, you know, building upkeep. You know, it's -- so I 1-24-11 25 1 don't -- I'm not particularly suggesting that, but I think we 2 need to think about it. And with your help, I would love to 3 maybe figure out some way we could be able to, you know, take 4 care of some of these -- all these things that people are 5 wanting to donate. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On the membership -- and I've 7 talked to some people, but I really -- I wasn't really sure 8 of the process. And I know there's a list that has to go in. 9 Does the list have to go in right now? And if it does, can 10 we change the membership or -- or add during the year? 11 MS. LEONARD: Yes. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there a maximum -- 13 MS. LEONARD: For instance, last year Dell Sheftall 14 resigned, and Ann Bethel has recently resigned. Now, whether 15 the -- you know, for whatever reason, you know, health or 16 they travel or they just don't have the time. And, you know, 17 it's kind of tricky to approach some of these people and say, 18 you know, "You haven't been to a meeting," you know. "Do you 19 want to continue?" But I think, you know, it almost has to 20 get down to that. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think that can be addressed. 22 On other boards I've been on, you can address it with bylaws, 23 that if you don't attend -- if you miss, you know, more than 24 four out of the 12 meetings or five out of the 12, whatever, 25 even six out of the 12, you're automatically off. And that 1-24-11 26 1 way, it's not -- you don't have the personality issue of 2 saying, you know, "You're fired." 3 MS. LEONARD: Right. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's hard to fire a volunteer, 5 anyway. 6 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'd like to say to 7 Ms. Leonard in behalf of the Historical Commission -- I mean, 8 the board that's serving here on the Historical Commission 9 group, I appreciate your leadership and your group working 10 together to work on trying to keep our Kerr County history, 11 'cause we have so much. You know, there is so much 12 historical part to this area. I think just trying to find 13 where we can preserve some of that so that the story will be 14 told to our next generation is very important. So, I think 15 the challenges that you're stating out there are things that 16 we, as a county, need to look at long-term so that the story 17 can be shared down the road, and seeing how we can address 18 those areas, I think, will be important. 19 MS. LEONARD: Thank you. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think from -- go ahead. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Have you had any conversations with 22 representatives from Cailloux Foundation -- 23 MS. LEONARD: No. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: -- about trying to do something? 25 MS. LEONARD: I think we were hoping -- you know, 1-24-11 27 1 waiting, you know. And, no. To answer your question, no, we 2 have not. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: When was the last time you had any 4 dialogue with the folks at Schreiner relative to the 5 Schreiner Mansion? 6 MS. LEONARD: Well, Kat Walker is on our board, and 7 she represents Schreiner. And, you know, we ask her from 8 time to time, but I don't think they really know what they're 9 going to do with the mansion. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 11 MS. LEONARD: So -- but, anyway, I appreciate 12 y'all, and thank you very much. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have one more 14 comment/question, and it's -- I guess it's appropriate to ask 15 this. I'm a little concerned recently of trying to figure 16 out what is members of the Historical Commission versus the 17 Historical Commission taking stands on issues. Most 18 recently -- you know, I get some e-mails occasionally. 19 There's one most recently, I think, about a letter that James 20 Avery wrote in the paper. And I don't think it is 21 appropriate for any member of the Historical Commission to 22 imply they're speaking for the Historical Commission unless 23 there is a vote of the full commission every time. I know 24 there's an e-mail I saw that said that -- you know, about 25 talking to the executive committee. Executive committee I 1-24-11 28 1 don't think has that kind of authority, or shouldn't have 2 that kind of authority. 3 So, I think that it needs to be real clear that, 4 you know, the Historical Commission is a branch of the county 5 government, and just stay focused on historical issues and 6 work on that. And I don't think -- and if individual members 7 want to, they can do whatever they want, but they need to do 8 it and make it real clear that it's done as an individual, 9 not as the Historical Commission. Because when it's -- when 10 it's tied to the Historical Commission, that's tied to me, 11 and I get pretty upset when I look at something and -- or get 12 e-mails that are disparaging about somebody, just because 13 it's a personality-type issue, to me. And I don't want to go 14 into any more of the details on it, but I got a lot of 15 e-mails recently that are very disturbing to me from members 16 of the Historical Commission, and I think it needs to be very 17 clear to your whole membership that -- 18 MS. LEONARD: Well, I would like to know, you know, 19 because, really, the executive committee and myself should be 20 the only ones speaking for the Historical Commission, not 21 individual members. And -- and, in fact, that e-mail is 22 going to out, and it's going to be made clear that when you 23 speak for the Historical Commission, that's not appropriate. 24 And -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: See, I don't think you can 1-24-11 29 1 speak for the Historical Commission without the full 2 membership. 3 MS. LEONARD: Yes, exactly. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But you have. 5 MS. LEONARD: Yes, and I'm going to make that 6 explicitly clear. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- 'cause that's -- I'm 8 troubled with that. Back to the membership. So, you're 9 going to work with -- you want us to -- 10 MS. LEONARD: Yeah, any suggestions. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You want us to find some 12 people? 13 MS. LEONARD: Absolutely. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Then we can add them. And we 15 get -- can't get too big a list, is what I'm hearing. If we 16 can get -- if we have a membership of 40 people, that's okay? 17 MS. LEONARD: Should we get rid of some of Buster's 18 people? (Laughter.) 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: If Buster's on there, you probably 21 should. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I think you don't want to 23 get people off just because of how many Precinct 312 may 24 have. I'm not sure how many members are from 312, but say 25 312 has a lot of members. I'm not advocating removing them. 1-24-11 30 1 I'm just saying that we need to go into 308, 320, and 303, 2 and really try to get more of a balance. And -- 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. I need to get some, 4 period. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You got a whole bunch to get. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Surely the ones that would be 7 recommended that were willing to serve would be accepted. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That means I have no 10 representation. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We set up road blocks out 12 there. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, evidently. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Is there a deadline for submission 15 of this membership roster? 16 MS. LEONARD: No. They can be added and subtracted 17 throughout the year. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But as far as us sending 19 that list to Austin? 20 MS. LEONARD: Oh, we add to it -- we can add to it. 21 But -- 22 JUDGE TINLEY: What's the calendar date deadline 23 for submission, if there is one? 24 MS. LEONARD: There's no -- they just like to know 25 at the first of the year, you know, who's out, who's in. 1-24-11 31 1 Just for -- I guess for -- you know, the bean counters have 2 to know -- 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mailing purposes. 4 MS. LEONARD: -- who's doing what. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, we'll come up with 6 numbers or people from this group here and notify you, and 7 we'll send the list -- eventually send the list to Austin. 8 MS. LEONARD: And you'll have telephone numbers 9 and -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes. 11 MS. LAVENDER: -- all the information? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, ma'am. 13 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Good. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you for your report. 15 It was excellent. 16 MS. LEONARD: And you might remind whoever you're 17 talking to, you know, that our meeting times are third Monday 18 at noon at Schreiner University, the Logan Library. And the 19 public is invited to attend. They're welcome to attend and 20 see if that's -- 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Where do you meet? 22 MS. LEONARD: Logan Library. 23 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 24 MS. LEONARD: And our meetings usually last only an 25 hour, and we have a program every time, and so it's not going 1-24-11 32 1 to take a huge amount of time out of their -- their day. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's always been very fun 3 every time I've been out there. When you get -- when y'all 4 get that stuff from the Famous Door, I want to have my 5 picture taken with that old Famous Door sign. 6 MS. LEONARD: We're supposed to get it. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's one of my favorite 8 places in history, I can tell you. 9 MS. LEONARD: I can't believe you're admitting 10 that. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Great enchiladas. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You should have some of those 13 from the past. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I do. Thank you so much. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thanks. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Do we need to take any action at 17 this time by the Court? 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I guess we could accept 19 the -- 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Accept the report? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Accept the annual report. 22 And I move that we do so. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Second that. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second to 1-24-11 33 1 accept the annual report from the Kerr County Historical 2 Commission. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 3 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. Let's go to 8 Item 5, a 9:30 timed item. We're running a little bit over. 9 Consider, discuss, take appropriate action on proposal for 10 public access roadway improvements on I.H. 10 to provide 11 access to the Town Creek Development and adjacent property. 12 Commissioner Overby? 13 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yes, Judge Tinley. I've had 14 a request made by Chuck Coleman, the developer on the Town 15 Creek Development, to come talk about a potential economic 16 development on the public access road possibly by Interstate 17 10. And, Mr. Coleman, go ahead. 18 MR. COLEMAN: Sure, thank you. Let me pass out 19 some information. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Could you tell us how many 21 trees it took to print this? 22 MR. COLEMAN: They were mostly cedar trees. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good, thank you. If 24 you have any more, feel free to hand them out. 25 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: There you go. 1-24-11 34 1 MR. COLEMAN: Several of you attended the ARRPO 2 meeting in December, and these are revised from that. Judge, 3 Commissioners, I really appreciate y'all allowing me to 4 visit. My name is Chuck Coleman. I live at 309 Bobwhite 5 Drive. I'm not a silver-tongued devil, so I'd what I'd like 6 to do is get through this presentation, which mirrors the 7 book, pretty quickly, and then just open it for question and 8 answers. What we've done -- let me see if I can get my... 9 What we've done, we've determined that if we could -- if we 10 could create access ramps off I-10 directly onto the Town 11 Creek Development property, we could open not only that 12 property, but property on the east and on the west and on the 13 north side for future economic development. We could convert 14 all of that property from primarily residential to 15 commercial. And, you know, that's one -- and I'll get into 16 that in a minute. That's one of our goals, is to shift the 17 burden from residential owners paying a large share of our 18 property tax burden to commercial businesses that are more 19 equipped to do that. 20 As we -- as we came up with this, we thought, well, 21 we got to show the benefit for doing this. And that's what 22 this study is all about. We determined -- and we went 23 through a lot of specific analysis I'll talk about in a 24 minute. We determined that the annual property and sales tax 25 benefit for the whole community, in the city, the county, 1-24-11 35 1 K.I.S.D., would be $19 million a year after it was fully 2 built out, which would take anywhere from 7 to 10, maybe 15 3 years. It's not a short-term plan; it's more of a long-term 4 plan. And the cost of constructing those ramps is about 5 11,500,000. Now, financing alternatives. We think we can do 6 this -- the preferable way to do it is a Chapter 380 7 development agreement. At the ARRPO meeting in December, 8 TexDOT representatives were here and they talked about the 9 program that they have, Number 2, where they approve it, and 10 the local group -- the local communities, taxing entities 11 come up with the money, and TexDOT reimburses them over time. 12 That's an option. 13 Third option is a T.I.F., which is tax increment 14 financing. It's pretty bureaucratic, and there's a lot of 15 legalese that you have to satisfy. But I'm told that the 380 16 can mirror a T.I.F. And the way these things work, what you 17 do, you -- one, you do a study similar to this, only 18 official, and you determine absorption, and then you 19 determine that tax revenue that's going to be coming in over 20 time. And you take that tax revenue, and all the parties, in 21 a negotiated agreement, determine that some portion of 22 that tax revenue that's going to be new will be used to repay 23 the developer for the construction of the ramps. The 24 developer will go out and he'll borrow the money and he'll 25 build the ramps, and then he'll receive payment from those 1-24-11 36 1 incremental revenues over time; 10, 15, 20 years, whatever is 2 negotiated. 3 There are other ways to go, state level and local 4 -- and local level E.I.C. funds. One of the things we 5 determined when we went through the sales tax portion of 6 this, the State does very well. Their portion on an annual 7 basis, if this were all fully built out, is -- it's, like, 8 $30 million in sales tax. The way we did this, the way we 9 came up with this, we had a land planning architect out of 10 San Antonio develop a use-specific site plan, and working in 11 conjunction with our Grubb-Ellis commercial broker, they 12 determined, based on their experience in San Antonio and 13 Austin, how they felt this would build out. And they -- they 14 took our land and the land next to us, and then they -- they 15 applied specific uses to that land, and they got -- they got 16 specific square footages, and then they applied that to 17 specific building square footages, and they applied that to 18 determine retail sales per square foot, or application. So, 19 it's got a lot of -- it's got a lot of detailed methodology 20 behind it. We determined the ad valorem tax benefit, and 21 once we got the cost of the land and the buildings, we 22 applied the current tax rates, and we'll show that in a 23 minute. Same thing on the sales tax. I lost my mouse. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask you a question 25 while you're fiddling with your mouse. 1-24-11 37 1 MR. COLEMAN: Sure. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: When you -- when you have an 3 exit ramp or an entry ramp on the interstate, an access road 4 or frontage road and all those, is that -- is the developer 5 required to pay for that? 6 MR. COLEMAN: Well, I don't know. I think in a 7 case like this -- I don't know, Buster. I think in a case 8 like this, it needs to be a public/private partnership, 9 'cause that is a high cost. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure it is. 11 MR. COLEMAN: And I think especially with the 12 benefit that the whole community will enjoy, I think it's 13 better -- what would happen under a Chapter 380, those future 14 tax benefits would really pay for it. The developer would 15 front everything and make everything happen, but it 16 wouldn't -- it wouldn't be the City or the County or school 17 district putting up any money for it. It would just be those 18 future tax revenues that they created out of doing that. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just wasn't aware that -- 20 I just assumed that if -- if there was going to be any 21 changes to the interstate, that the -- whoever owns the 22 interstate would be responsible for making those changes. 23 MR. COLEMAN: Well, you know, and you're right; 24 TexDOT has to approve everything. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They'll pay for it, though. 1-24-11 38 1 MR. COLEMAN: Well, and typically -- typically, in 2 the best of all worlds, TexDOT would have the money to pay 3 for it. Now, in our ARRPO meeting, they -- were very adamant 4 that they didn't have any money. And I guess what happens, 5 Buster, it gets -- it gets pushed till they do have money. 6 And that -- they indicated several years, like five to seven, 7 10 years. Several years. So -- so, typically I think you're 8 right, TexDOT would pay for it. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think, Buster, on part of 10 that, I think, you know, Chuck's right. TexDOT was adamant 11 that they weren't paying for it, 'cause it's -- but I think 12 what is happening more and more is that TexDOT is pushing 13 this off -- and I'll go to an example in Comfort where 14 they're building a Love's truck stop at the Highway 87 exit, 15 and my understanding is Love's is redoing that whole exit 16 ramp and redoing the roads and all -- everything, all the 17 infrastructure for both Kendall County and TexDOT, and it's 18 all their dime. I mean, if they want it, they pay for it. 19 And without the -- without them redoing their whole exit ramp 20 and all those roads right there, they can't build it. So, I 21 think the new direction from TexDOT is if you want something, 22 you're paying for it, whether it's good or bad. 23 MR. COLEMAN: Times are tough. Times are very 24 tough. I think I got my mouse going. The benefits of these 25 access ramps, we've got Town Creek Development that's poised 1-24-11 39 1 and ready to go. It's 375 acres total. We've got Keystone 2 Development with about 46 commercial acres on the east of us. 3 We have Higgins acreage of about 49 acres on the west. And 4 we didn't quantify that hill on the north side, but that's 5 available, and then there's -- there's Holdsworth. What we 6 envision here -- you'll see it in a minute -- we're going to 7 bring a four-lane road from I-10 across our property all the 8 way down to Ms. B.T. Wilson's eventually, but it'll go to 9 Holdsworth Drive. And, in essence, what will happen, 10 Holdsworth Drive will become a frontage road for as long as 11 it goes. It'll help distribute traffic off Harper, and even 12 Sidney Baker to some extent. 13 We have generally thought that the absorption will 14 take place over a 7- to 10-year period, and we know that 15 that's very considerable. Who knows for sure? When I was 16 asking our commercial broker about this, he -- he -- I said, 17 "What am I going to say if they ask me about that?" And he 18 said, "Tell them it's five years." He truly believes that, 19 because of the economy that we've been in, and because of the 20 deferred baby boomers, that it's going to absorb very, very 21 quickly as the economy begins to turn around. Now, I don't 22 know. Seven to ten years -- and I've got some absorption 23 schedules in here I'll show you. Seven to ten years. Even 24 if it's 15 years, this thing works and it's a good deal. One 25 of the things we determined as City Council worked with 1-24-11 40 1 Commissioners Court to determine who -- who would control 2 building standards and that kind of thing in the ETJ, one of 3 the things I know Council became critically aware of, there's 4 not a lot of expansion land. There's just very, very little. 5 It's hard to go out toward the airport. You can't really go 6 south, and then you're locked on the west side by Ingram. 7 All you've got, really, is the north, and the topography is 8 such that you don't have a whole lot of north. 9 Again, I mentioned this would shift the burden from 10 residential to commercial, which is one of our big goals for 11 economic development, and it also helps mitigate the impact 12 of the residential tax freeze because of that shift from 13 residential. I've got a detailed schedule of benefits that 14 we'll hit in a minute. City of Kerrville, on an annual 15 basis, would get about seven and a half million. E.I.C. 16 would get about 2.4. Kerr County would get about 4.3. 17 K.I.S.D., about 4.9. Total of 19 million. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Now, that's sales and ad valorem 19 combined? 20 MR. COLEMAN: Both of them combined, Judge. I got 21 a schedule I'll show you in a minute. And, again, what this 22 would do -- I kind of touched on this -- Town Creek Parkway, 23 as it cuts totally across that Town Creek property down to 24 Ms. B.T. Wilson's, could then follow Town Creek onto Highway 25 27 and be linked to Highway 27. We have -- we could have 1-24-11 41 1 eventually a third north-south corridor that, again, helps 2 distribute traffic, and it would help take a lot of that 3 traffic off Harper Road. And I know that TexDOT -- that's 4 one of their goals. They were always very concerned about 5 the residential nature of Harper and the way it just kept 6 getting busier and busier. 7 Economic development. We have job creation as this 8 thing is built out. And this 19 million in tax revenues 9 doesn't include any economic development at all, for 10 construction of the thing or construction of any of those 11 businesses or the staffing of any of those businesses. The 12 community would have an inventory of land available for 13 business growth and relocation, and that would be in 14 accordance with what TXP was promulgating. It could be 15 applied to technology, health care, education applications. 16 A big chunk of this plan is multi-family land, and with 17 retirement facility land. And, again, that goes to the 18 increasing retiree demographic we have here. 19 Number 5 -- and this is not the reason. I mean, 20 this is just a sideline, but were the convention center to be 21 revisited later, we -- we have land that is -- we have land 22 with an exit ramp. That's why it was never considered to 23 begin with; hotels wanted an exit ramp, but we would have 24 land that would be extremely flat topo that could be easily 25 built on that would be donated to the community. The cost of 1-24-11 42 1 the ramps on the eastbound side is 4.6 million, on the 2 westbound is 2.9. On the eastbound side, that's -- that's 3 the side -- it's on the south side, basically, so that that's 4 where your frontage road for the development is. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that -- does that include, 6 the 4.6, a ramp or a bridge over the interstate? 7 MR. COLEMAN: Yes, it does, and I got a slide on 8 that in just a second. We came along -- this is hard to say. 9 We came along and we thought, well, what -- you know, what's 10 the real payback period on this? And if you look at this 11 middle one, the 10-year absorption, if -- and if you look at 12 the cumulative tax benefits on a straight-line basis, say 13 that 19 million -- say it takes 10 years to build it out, and 14 that 19 million, we get about 1.9 million a year over those 15 10 years. What that does, that shows that you end up with -- 16 I can't read it -- you end up with a payback period of 11 17 million over 36 months. Now, that's -- that assumes that, 18 you know, you start from baseline and you -- I mean, once 19 you've started, there would be a couple years buildup for 20 this planning and that kind of thing. If you look at a 21 15-year absorption, which is a long time, you're looking at a 22 45-month payback. 20-year absorption is a 53-month payback. 23 Contributors to the report. I did all the clerical 24 stuff, as you can tell. Kit Corbin is our broker with 25 Grubb-Ellis, and Kit is a heavyweight guy. He's the number 1-24-11 43 1 one producer for Grubb-Ellis in the United States for a 2 couple years. He's number one producer in the state of Texas 3 for, like, 20 years. He is the guy that did the Toyota deal 4 in San Antonio. He was -- and he was more than a broker. He 5 was like a -- and I don't understand the details, but he was 6 a principal in all of that. He's extremely proficient and 7 competent. Barry Middleman, he's the land planning architect 8 that, when you go to San Antonio and you see all these new 9 developments, he's done almost all of them. You go out to 10 his web site, and he's pretty heavy-duty. Jeff Carroll is 11 our own local Matkin-Hoover engineer. Todd Gold, REOC out of 12 San Antonio. He and his associate Alcide Longgoria helped 13 with determining the retail sales per square foot and that 14 kind of thing. They used Austin and San Antonio comps from 15 their clients and discounted it by 25 percent for the 16 Kerrville market, because it was a more rural market. 17 Now, this next slide is -- it's hard to see, but 18 it's actually -- it's actually the land that includes Town 19 Creek, Higgins up here, and then Town -- and then Keystone 20 over here. It's a pretty big chunk of acreage. Doesn't show 21 anything on the north side. It's a little easier to see 22 here, because you got some color coding that shows the 23 various applications. And I know that's hard to see, so I'm 24 going to just tell you what we've got along I-10. Retail pad 25 sites, hotel, banks, that kind of thing, we've got about 33 1-24-11 44 1 acres. We've got three multi-family sites, which are about 2 83 acres, so that's a pretty big application there. We've 3 got a corporate meeting center for about 9 acres. We've got 4 an office tract, 5 acres. We've got three retail strip 5 centers for 16 acres. We've got seven commercial anchors for 6 105 acres. We've got a retirement home for 16 acres. We've 7 got a section for health care and medical offices for about 8 15 acres. And then -- yeah, here that is there. We -- we 9 have some more slides here. I put them in just 'cause we 10 paid for them. (Laughter.) This is Matkin-Hoover's slide, 11 and it's -- it's kind of compressed. It's kind of squatted 12 down, but it shows I-10 over here, and it shows frontage 13 roads on the north side. The thought is we let future 14 development drive that. And then you show the -- the Town 15 Creek Parkway coming down to Holdsworth Drive. 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That road alone, you're 17 estimating about 1.8? 18 MR. COLEMAN: That's correct. Four-lane, divided, 19 kind of like Holdsworth is. 20 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Right. 21 MR. COLEMAN: This is just an overlay on 22 photography. This is a good slide, because what it does, 23 it's a slope analysis that these architects use. As you can 24 see dark blue, purple, that's where we have pretty steep 25 hills. All the rest of that -- this green and the tan -- is 1-24-11 45 1 pretty flat. So, for the Kerrville hill country, it's 2 remarkably flat, low cost to build on. It's going to be very 3 attractive to anybody coming to town or in town. This shows 4 more the breakout of the 19 million. If you look at the ad 5 valorem tax column right here, City of Kerrville's 2.3 6 million, Kerr County's 1.8 million, K.I.S.D. is 4.8 million. 7 Gets down to 9 million. Sales tax, 9.6 million. There would 8 be some hotel/motel tax off a small hotel along the 9 interstate. All of that was determined. There's even -- 10 there's a lot more detail underneath this. All of that was 11 determined using current tax rates. This one is -- well, 12 it's more detailed on the ad valorem tax value. There was an 13 article in the paper this weekend about downtown having 113 14 million worth of tax base that was not taxed. Total tax base 15 on this would be about -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: 305. 17 MR. COLEMAN: Thanks, Judge. It would be 415 18 million when it's fully built out. And, again, this shows -- 19 we actually did it by site, and it shows the City's portion. 20 The thought is there the City would annex all of the 21 development, and that's why they'd be getting the lion's 22 share. Our development's already annexed, but they would 23 probably annex on either side. You see the County's portion. 24 Next one is sales tax benefit. My numbers kind of got out of 25 the boxes, but again, sales tax benefit on those sales tax 1-24-11 46 1 revenue dollars per square foot. This is, again, a schedule 2 for Matkin-Hoover that -- where he actually did his opinion 3 of probable cost, and that's the end of it. I'd entertain 4 any questions. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Chuck, only question I have is 6 -- and I think it's -- I mean, I like the overall plan, and I 7 really like the fact that you're putting -- you or someone's 8 putting up money up front, and you're trying to get money 9 recouped out of the sales -- out of the ad valorem taxes down 10 the road, which is the only way I can see this thing at all 11 moving forward. But my question is, I've been a commissioner 12 14 years, and I haven't seen this kind -- we haven't had a 13 spot like this, but I haven't seen that kind of growth in 14 commercial activity since I've been here, and I just have a 15 real hard time thinking that that area can -- Kerrville can 16 absorb that much commercial space in 10 years. Where's -- 17 where do you project -- or where are your experts projecting 18 that's coming from? 19 MR. COLEMAN: Well, you know, one -- and, 20 Commissioner, we haven't really done an absorption study. 21 This is just calculating on the basis of assuming that it was 22 absorbed. We -- and that would be one of the elements. The 23 way we show this thing working, we want to build community 24 support for the program, and we want everybody in the 25 community to see the medium and long-term value of the 1-24-11 47 1 project. And then -- then what will happen once we've done 2 that and we've gained TexDOT approval -- and somewhere in 3 between there, we would have to go and have TXP or somebody 4 do a feasibility study and determine that. What we're told, 5 and what these -- these professionals think happens is that 6 we are driven by the baby boomers; that it's a huge force 7 that just hadn't materialized because of the downturn that we 8 went into. I know just before the downturn, we have always 9 -- once Holdsworth was announced that it was going to be 10 done, we have been held in abeyance waiting for -- we 11 couldn't get anybody to do anything without Holdsworth Drive. 12 They wanted to see it. Well, when it started construction, 13 it was going to be about a year until completion occurred. 14 We had KB Homes approach us to negotiate hard with us. We 15 turned them down; we didn't like what they did in Boerne. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 17 MR. COLEMAN: We had Centex -- we had Centex 18 negotiating with us very hard, and we had a verbal approval 19 with D.R. Horton, which is the leading, we think, in the 20 country. They were going to buy the entire thing for 21 residential. Now, they agreed -- they agreed week one to go 22 to contract, and week two -- and week two they issued their 23 first corporate loss report that started that downturn, and 24 they issued a corporate moratorium against any land 25 acquisition. At the same time, the stock market just went to 1-24-11 48 1 heck in a hand basket, and all these -- all these retirees 2 lost tremendous value in their retirement packages, so 3 they've all had to defer retirement. Once we begin to recoup 4 and start the recovery, I think we're going to see not only 5 that portion that's been deferred, but it's like a graph like 6 this. We're going to see that corner down here that's been 7 deferred on top of this graph, this increasing load as they 8 get bigger and bigger. So, as you look at San Antonio 9 building out this way, Boerne and the way it builds up, I 10 just -- I personally think it's coming. I don't think it's 11 going to come in five or seven years, but I'd hang my hat on 12 ten for sure. And if it didn't come in 10, if it came in 15, 13 it's still a good planning tool for the whole community. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Chuck, if you go the 380 route, the 15 absorption really becomes your problem, doesn't it? 16 MR. COLEMAN: That's right. That's right. Thanks 17 for pointing that out. (Laughter.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: I mean, that's the bottom line, 19 isn't it? 20 MR. COLEMAN: Yes, it is. And -- and, again, what 21 happens, we get the experts to come in, do the absorption, 22 and then what we have to do -- we don't have 11 million 23 sitting in the bank just chomping at the bit to spend it. 24 We're going to have to go to a lender and convince a lender 25 that this thing works. And they're -- they're not going to 1-24-11 49 1 do it lightly themselves. They're going to look at it and 2 make sure they think it works. And then whenever that all 3 occurs, that gives you -- you've got -- you've got your 4 professional study guys, you got your tight-fisted lender, 5 and you got your -- your tight-fisted developer that are 6 wanting to make sure it all works. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: But the bottom line, it's in your 8 lap if you go 380. 9 MR. COLEMAN: That's correct. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Because you're planning on the 11 absorption being what you think it will be for your 12 recoupment aspect. 13 MR. COLEMAN: That's correct. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: But otherwise, it's your money at 15 risk. 16 MR. COLEMAN: That's right. 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I think, Chuck, the other 18 thing is, again, what we're hearing today from you -- and, of 19 course, what the Commissioners, you know, might -- might 20 support or discuss possibly up here is what you're saying. 21 Basically, you want to look at City Council -- from what we 22 understand, City Council is going to be meeting with E.I.C. 23 to start looking at future capital projects. 24 MR. COLEMAN: Now -- 25 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Is this one that you would 1-24-11 50 1 want to get in front of them for exploring as an opportunity 2 for E.I.C., 4B funding? 3 MR. COLEMAN: Well, you know, Commissioner, as we 4 both sat through that meeting a couple weeks ago, and I've 5 had -- since had a discussion with Todd, I think -- I think 6 their issues are bigger. I think they're all trying to 7 determine, philosophically, what everybody's role in economic 8 development's going to be. 9 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 10 MR. COLEMAN: And how I think E.I.C. is exercising 11 some independence, and they need to figure out along with 12 Council the best way for them to work together for the 13 benefit of the community. And you tack in the new KEDC; all 14 of that has to be incorporated in a good teamwork approach 15 for the whole community. 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 17 MR. COLEMAN: Now, I am scheduled to present to -- 18 to E.I.C., and I couldn't get on the agenda until I told them 19 I wasn't looking for money. (Laughter.) 20 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 21 MR. COLEMAN: So, we're not really looking -- 22 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: You're giving the report. 23 MR. COLEMAN: That's right. We're doing the same 24 thing we've done here. We're not -- and we aren't looking 25 for money. But we do think -- 1-24-11 51 1 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah. 2 MR. COLEMAN: -- this is such a strong thing, I 3 wish I was a good enough speaker that everybody could see 4 this and understand this. 5 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 6 MR. COLEMAN: On a longer-term basis. 7 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Again, you're just at the 8 point right now where you're exploring all of your financial 9 options and everything here so that you could see the project 10 happening, such as the Chapter 380. 11 MR. COLEMAN: That's right. And what -- what 12 happened -- I'm going to go back to another slide. What 13 happened, Todd Parton has actually -- that's -- Todd Parton 14 has actually done a 380 in the past, and he tells us that 15 it's very, very similar to a TIF, but you don't have quite 16 the hoops you have to jump through. You can contractually do 17 it all so that everybody can -- that wants to participate in 18 the community can participate. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Why is it not an option to 20 develop off of -- from Holdsworth in the beginning and kind 21 of get your foot in the door before you propose doing the big 22 access off of I-10? 23 MR. COLEMAN: Well, you know, Bruce, we had 24 Councilman Keeble bring that up. She wanted to see -- she 25 wanted to see payback on Holdsworth first, and it's very 1-24-11 52 1 understandable. When you look at Holdsworth, you've got the 2 Salvation center; you've got -- is it Altek Plastic? 3 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Atek. 4 MR. COLEMAN: Atek there long-term; been there for 5 a long time, and a good economic development venue, a good 6 thing for Kerrville from way back. Now you've got the Kroc 7 Center. That's a huge living benefit -- lifestyle benefit 8 for the whole community; however, it's nonprofit. You come 9 down a little bit further, you got Keystone Development, and 10 what they've got, they got a huge housing -- see that red 11 spot on the bottom? Up on top of the hill, huge topo. And 12 the only way they can get to that right now is winding around 13 from Sidney Baker to the top there through Vicksburg Village. 14 Now, that gray on either side is pretty topographic off 15 Holdsworth. They're not going to have a lot there. 16 You get to us. We're really the only ones left on 17 Holdsworth. And our problem is, we either -- it has to be 18 either/or. And, again, if we can't get support for this, if 19 it doesn't work, if it falls away, we'll turn right around, 20 go back to one of these national residential builders. And 21 what you do then, when you do that, it's almost an either/or. 22 You either commit to those guys -- and we would have a 23 smattering of commercial along Holdsworth, but not a lot. 24 These -- these national builders would take up 80 percent of 25 that land, and we don't get a do-over. I mean, it's 1-24-11 53 1 either -- kind of either/or. We either go that route, or if 2 we can -- we can do the access ramps, we may get all 3 commercial. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I guess my point is, 5 why couldn't you build the road, the four-lane that you're 6 talking about, in the same location and develop commercial 7 off of that? 8 MR. COLEMAN: The -- 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: City won't allow it? 10 MR. COLEMAN: The users won't go for that. They've 11 got to have -- in fact, they've got to have interstate exit 12 access. And I'll share another thing with you that we're -- 13 we have thought about. You brought a point up in December 14 about whether or not we'd donate right-of-way under the land 15 for the -- 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Of course you will, if you 17 get somebody to pay for it. 18 MR. COLEMAN: I appreciate you bringing -- you 19 bringing that up. We would do that. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 21 MR. COLEMAN: In addition, we have -- we have 22 talked about the fact that the river trails are a real 23 exciting thing right now, for the city anyway. We've 24 talked -- we've got about a mile frontage along Town Creek. 25 We would donate that to -- probably to the city to create a 1-24-11 54 1 hike and bike trail all the way down, at least to Ms. B.T. 2 Wilson's, and then I think they've got most of the 3 right-of-way along Town Creek to link into the Guadalupe 4 River, so that would be a good amenity for the community. We 5 would also donate -- that's about 10 acres. We'd donate 15 6 acres for a convention center or hotel, if that's what the 7 community wanted. And, again, that's flat, low-cost 8 buildable land. The -- and, Commissioner, I guess maybe to 9 answer your question, we just can't get anybody to come in 10 unless -- unless we've got the access, any commercial retail. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Would -- Chuck, would an option 12 be -- and maybe this is a part of that going back to -- back 13 to some of the drawings, to build an access road all the way 14 on the south side of the interstate from -- and basically go 15 out past Lowe's and continue that all the way down. You have 16 to, at some point, cross Town Creek, I guess. But, I mean, 17 you wouldn't -- you could get pretty good access along the 18 interstate with a lot of that property by basically extending 19 the road, whatever -- what's that road that goes by Lowe's? 20 Whatever that -- 21 MR. COLEMAN: Goes underneath that underpass. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, just keeps on going past 23 where Jenschke's got his property; just keeps on going 24 straight on. 25 MR. COLEMAN: You know, Commissioner, the way all 1-24-11 55 1 of this actually evolved or started, I'm in Rotary. Todd 2 Parton's in Rotary. And I saw him talking to -- and I don't 3 remember who he was talking to -- somebody after Rotary lunch 4 one day. I went up to say hi, and he was talking about 5 meeting with Lamar Smith, and they were specifically looking 6 at trying to get money from Lamar Smith to build frontage 7 roads. And as they looked into this, and I don't know the 8 detail to which they've done that, they determined it was 9 just cost prohibitive; you just couldn't make it work because 10 of all of the topo. And I know when we started off, we had 11 some discussions with representatives of Higgins group where 12 we were going to try to join forces and do the same thing, 13 bring it from Harper Road. And -- and, again, the problem is 14 that bridge at Town Creek there, it's huge. It's like -- 15 it's even more so than the one at Holdsworth, so it's 16 extremely expensive. And then -- then you've still got the 17 cost of the rest of the frontage, which is expensive as well. 18 You know, you got the choke point cutting through that big 19 cut at I-10 coming east of us towards Sidney Baker. I don't 20 know how you'd get around that. I don't know what you'd do. 21 You have to come up over the hill somehow. And, you know, 22 that's -- Keystone's got all of that platted for lots and 23 such. I know back by Lowe's, the City looked at that and 24 determined they couldn't do anything there, so -- but, again, 25 I don't know the specifics. 1-24-11 56 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, does that -- it doesn't 2 work. That makes sense; it probably costs as much to build a 3 bridge across Town Creek as it does to build a bridge across 4 the interstate. 5 MR. COLEMAN: And you look at Holdsworth already 6 being built, make it into frontage. 7 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Judge, I have one question. 8 How far is this possible site of this exit on this -- the 9 north and south, how far is this from the Harper Road exit? 10 MR. COLEMAN: Well, when you look -- when you look 11 at Harper Road all the way down to Town Creek Parkway, which 12 is the spine road coming down, it's 1 mile. 13 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: One mile? 14 MR. COLEMAN: You know, and when you look at the 15 map, on those little inset maps, it's amazing, but the way 16 the roads curve, it's closer -- it's closer to Harper, but 17 it's more in the middle than you realize. You know, the 18 actual exit ramp would be -- when you're eastbound, would be 19 just less than a mile. 20 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 21 MR. COLEMAN: And we -- you know, we are aware that 22 there -- there can be issues. However, we feel -- and, 23 again, we feel that if the community supports this thing 24 and -- and we can show the value, that TexDOT will cooperate, 25 with a minor variance if it requires one. We don't know that 1-24-11 57 1 it does, but it has been something that somebody has talked 2 about. 3 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, if we could bless it for 5 no money, you'd be in good shape? 6 MR. COLEMAN: Sign up, let's go. I do -- I do 7 think -- Commissioner, I do think that's right. I think the 8 burden's back on the developer, and everybody benefits. 9 Community strong benefit. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, Chuck, right now basically 11 you're just making a presentation, and at some point you're 12 going to come back and ask us for something? 13 MR. COLEMAN: Well, I was hoping it might be on the 14 agenda this time. 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Let me ask you this. I -- go 16 ahead. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What are you asking, then? 18 What do you want us to do? What would you like to see us do? 19 MR. COLEMAN: The City, two weeks ago on their 20 agenda, they approved getting this -- listing this as a 21 priority with the ARRPO group. And I -- one, I would 22 appreciate you all doing that, where -- you know, on their 23 rural transportation priorities. And -- 24 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Just work with revisions 25 with -- with ARRPO? Is that what you want to do? 1-24-11 58 1 MR. COLEMAN: Right, the Alamo Area, and TexDOT's 2 involved in that. They were going to have their 3 meeting January 26th or 28th; it's been pushed to sometime in 4 March. I don't know the exact date. So -- so, Commissioner, 5 that's one priority or one thing I'd like right there. The 6 other thing the City did, they -- they voted to do that, and 7 then they also voted to put this on their capital projects 8 list and start working the process. Now, that doesn't mean 9 that they got money for it and they're paying for it or 10 anything like that. They've just got it identified as 11 something that they want to pursue. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We understand that. 13 MR. COLEMAN: Now, is that a long, long list? 14 Well, and if you all are structured that way, and I don't 15 know, I would appreciate that too. Beyond that, maybe it's a 16 resolution just -- just supporting the project and expressing 17 a willingness to work -- 18 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: And do you want us also to be 19 supportive of your exploring the different type of financial 20 options you're going to be looking at as well? 21 MR. COLEMAN: Well, yes. Yes, that would be good 22 too. 23 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: As you're exploring your 24 options that you're saying. 25 MR. COLEMAN: This is almost -- I don't know how it 1-24-11 59 1 all comes together exactly, but I know one of the things the 2 City -- after they voted approval, I had a meeting with City 3 staff last week, and they appointed Christine to start 4 looking at the comprehensive plan and transportation plan and 5 looking at the modifications for that. They appointed 6 Charlie Hastings, our engineer, to start working with Jeff 7 Carroll -- excuse me -- and having meetings with TexDOT to -- 8 to start that process and see what might be involved there. 9 And then Todd and Mike Erwin were going to start looking at 10 380. And then if you guys -- if you guys are agreeable to 11 all of this, they were going to start meeting with you all 12 too. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the -- to me, what I'd 14 like to see, rather than just do a resolution -- I mean, a 15 motion today that's really not specific and thought out, I'd 16 like to get a resolution that maybe you draft, and pick 17 someone on the Court you want to work with, and have at our 18 next meeting a resolution that says A, B, C, D, -- 19 MR. COLEMAN: Sure. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- this is what you want us to 21 do. Then we have a specific action we can take. 22 MR. COLEMAN: That would be good. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Do you want to work with 24 Commissioner Overby on that to see if y'all can cobble 25 something together that can be brought back to us? 1-24-11 60 1 MR. COLEMAN: With his economic development 2 background, I think that would be a perfect choice. 3 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: All right. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm a little unclear about 5 what we're doing here. I can see us -- I mean, I'm certainly 6 in favor of supporting access to a property, but I don't know 7 about telling him to continue seeking funding. I mean, 8 that -- I don't care what you do. 9 MR. COLEMAN: Well, Commissioner, one thing -- and 10 this -- what the thought is, is within this 380 agreement, 11 there would be an agreement where the developer was a 12 participant and the City was a participant and the County was 13 a participant. It would all be based on expected benefit. 14 So -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. So I guess we need to 16 clarify, to me, what the benefit is for the county. 17 MR. COLEMAN: Well, it's the four point -- hang on. 18 It's the -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I can't vote -- I 20 can't vote to approve something that might -- is going to 21 happen or maybe could happen, or maybe should happen. 22 That's -- you know, that's not the way government runs. 23 MR. COLEMAN: No, I understand that. I do 24 understand that. We would -- if you saw the benefit of this, 25 and saw that this could very well happen -- 1-24-11 61 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see what you're saying. I 2 see the numbers and I see the possibilities, but I -- you 3 know, whatever. Whatever. We'll talk about it. 4 MR. COLEMAN: And, Commissioner, what could we do 5 to -- what would you like to see? What could we -- 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, like I said, I mean, I 7 would vote to approve you to go and -- I mean, I'm in support 8 of you seeking ingress-egress to Interstate 10, as an 9 example. But as far as you going and visiting with TexDOT, 10 you know, go. You're a free enterprise person. 11 MR. COLEMAN: Thank you. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You know, that's -- 13 MR. COLEMAN: I understand. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't think you need 15 government approval or encouragement for you, as a private 16 sector, to go seek funding. I don't get that. 17 MR. COLEMAN: I understand. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So -- 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Unless the funding included 20 some kind of tax abatement that would be given to pay -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, tax abatement's a 22 little different animal, if that's what we're talking about. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Or give it some kind -- you 24 know, if you use future revenues from tax -- from property 25 tax to help pay that back, I'm not interested. 1-24-11 62 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the enhancement of -- of tax 2 revenue by virtue of increased value that the projects would 3 bring, that would be part of the 380 agreement, and certainly 4 that would be something that would be negotiated and -- and 5 very definitively put together with respect to all of the 6 taxing entities. And that would be a subject for a future 7 day, once you get to the point where the developer has -- 8 knows that the developer can put up the funds to complete the 9 necessary infrastructure to make it happen, and then you get 10 the 380 put in place. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: See, what I hear is -- is 12 that -- and I guess for the resolution, I am -- I am open to 13 looking at a 380. That's about as far as I'm going on a 380, 14 'cause I have no knowledge about a 380. But if you want 15 to -- you know, yeah, if that's part of your plan, I support 16 looking at that more. 17 MR. COLEMAN: It's just a way of putting the 18 responsibility on the developer, and paying for it out of 19 future tax -- 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 21 MR. COLEMAN: -- benefit that -- that's not really 22 been realized yet. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. So, anyway, I think 24 that's probably the best -- 25 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: So, you have a motion on a 1-24-11 63 1 resolution? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we have no action 3 today. 4 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'll work with you. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Get a resolution, come back, 6 and then make sure it's not too specific. 7 MR. COLEMAN: Thanks. I really appreciate y'all's 8 time. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a question here. 10 MS. McMAHON: Chuck, you mentioned the benefit to 11 the school district. If it brings jobs, wouldn't there need 12 to be a school built to accommodate the increase in children? 13 So part of the increase to the school district would actually 14 be offset by building a school. 15 MR. COLEMAN: That's true, it would. Now, they are 16 constantly -- and I know they're, like, five, ten years ahead 17 in their planning process. They had already approached us a 18 couple years ago, just before the downturn, and we had an 19 agreement. We were in a residential site plan at that point. 20 We agreed to give them 10 acres for a school. And I think 21 that probably still stands, although with us converting away 22 from residential, they're probably not going to want that. 23 But you're right; increased growth would -- would bring new 24 kids, new schools. I don't think -- I don't think -- I don't 25 know to what percentage it would be a big burden to the 1-24-11 64 1 school district. I don't know. 2 MS. McMAHON: Thank you. 3 MR. COLEMAN: Thanks, gentlemen. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Chuck. We appreciate it. 5 MR. COLEMAN: Can I gather up my stuff here? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Let's go ahead and take up 7 Item 6; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 8 approve maintenance agreement between Kerr County and Ikon on 9 a microfilm reader-printer in the County Clerk's office for 10 an annual fee of $400 per year as budgeted, and authorize 11 County Judge to sign same. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 15 approval. Question or discussion? All in favor of the 16 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, the County Attorney's 22 reviewed that, correct? 23 MS. PIEPER: Yes, he has reviewed it. He made 24 changes, and Ikon Corporation has accepted his changes. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 1-24-11 65 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move to Item 7; consider, 2 discuss, take appropriate action to approve report to 3 Commissioners Court on the status of investments made under 4 Section 887(b) of the Probate Code. These are accounts that 5 you hold under, essentially, court orders? 6 MS. PIEPER: That is correct. And we have to give 7 the report every January to the -- to y'all. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move we accept the report. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 11 approval. Question or discussion? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It says approval -- approve 13 report? Approve or accept, whatever we need to do. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion? All 15 in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 20 Item 8; to consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 21 authorize the Auditor and the Treasurer to advertise for a 22 depository service contract RFA's. What's the "A"? 23 MS. WILLIAMS: Request for Applications, I believe. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You got a new one to deal 25 with. 1-24-11 66 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, not an RFQ. 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: What was it? 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Request for Application. 4 MS. WILLIAMS: Request for Applications. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Hasn't been done in quite a 6 while. 7 MS. WILLIAMS: As you gentlemen know, our 8 depository contract does expire in May of this year, and we 9 are required to go out and get applications, bids, proposals. 10 So -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's a one-year deal? 12 MS. HARGIS: No, it's a two-year program. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Two-year. 14 MS. HARGIS: The State had legislation about, I 15 think, four years ago that limited us to doing a two-year 16 banking service contract. We can renew it, but it's only a 17 two-year contract. And we haven't done an RFP or an RFA 18 since 1994. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: We're currently on an extension, 20 aren't we? 21 MS. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. And the game has changed 23 immensely since we did our last one, hasn't it? 24 MS. HARGIS: It has. And Linda Patterson had -- as 25 part of her contract, has helped us to write this document so 1-24-11 67 1 that we have everything that we need in there. And it has an 2 application where they can give us extra services, or we've 3 given specific things, but it's pretty open, so we're going 4 to get hopefully more bids than we have in the past. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Did you say 1994? 6 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Been a long time. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Seems that when I first came on 9 the Court, -- 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You didn't have it. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- we were with, like, Wells 12 Fargo or someone, and we changed. We've been with Security 13 State the entire time? 14 MS. WILLIAMS: We've been with Security State that 15 entire time. Prior to that, I think we were with -- 16 MS. HARGIS: Bank of America. 17 MS. WILLIAMS: -- First National Bank. 18 MS. HARGIS: Schreiner Bank. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, good. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Times have changed. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Been a while. 22 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Been a long time since I 23 heard that. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Some people don't even 25 remember that. 1-24-11 68 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 4 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, when we're talking 6 about bidding here, will we -- is it -- are we required to 7 take the lowest bid? 8 MS. HARGIS: No. 9 MS. WILLIAMS: No. 10 MS. HARGIS: These are services, so we will -- we 11 will take the service that fits our needs. This is more of a 12 need-type situation. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Could there be -- that's 14 good. Could there be a bank from out of the community bid on 15 this thing? 16 MS. HARGIS: There could be. But, again, that 17 depends on the Court, as to whether they feel that's what's, 18 you know, in our best interest. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. 20 MS. HARGIS: And we're encouraging as many of the 21 local banks that can. Keep in mind, because they have to be 22 the depository, they have a lot of collateral 23 responsibilities, and some of the banks are not equipped for 24 that and cannot do governmental entities. So, it kind of 25 limits us to certain banks, because they have to meet all the 1-24-11 69 1 governmental requirements. Security State Bank apparently 2 was the only one that did make the bid back in 1994. Bank of 3 America can do it. I don't know whether they will. They 4 kind of got out of the marketplace. Wells Fargo, I'm sure, 5 will be a game player in this. The other one that will be, 6 and just got bought out again, is Sterling Bank. Because 7 they -- they were very active in the municipal area in the 8 Houston market, so they know how to deal with it. There are 9 just a lot of agreements that they have to agree to, that our 10 attorney has to agree and so forth, and so a lot of banks 11 don't have the collateral to do that. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we're talking about 13 federal regulations or state regulations? 14 MS. HARGIS: Federal and state, both, yes. It's to 15 protect us. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. Yeah, the 17 federal people are out to protect us. That's their goal. 18 (Laughter.) 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Everything gets cheaper with 20 more regulation, right? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 22 MS. HARGIS: We hope to have this back to you and 23 approved by the month of March, so that we can -- we can have 24 a transition, if there is a transition. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 1-24-11 70 1 MS. HARGIS: It's not saying there would be, but if 2 there is a transition, that gives you about 60 days to do it. 3 It takes about 60 days to transition. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion? All 5 in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. Item 9 is 10 acknowledge receipt of quarterly investment report from 11 Patterson Associates for the quarter ending 12-31-2010. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 15 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 16 favor, signify by raising your right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. 21 MS. WILLIAMS: Thank you. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Item 10 is to consider, discuss, and 23 approve resolution for the submission of a General Victim 24 Assistance Direct Services Program grant proposal for 2011-12 25 to the Office of the Governor, Criminal Justice Division, 1-24-11 71 1 purpose of the grant being to fund Kerr County Crime Victims 2 Coordinator program for yet another year. 3 MS. LAVENDER: Yet another year. This will be the 4 seventh year of the grant, if we're successful. In the 5 beginning, when we started with this, they told us that they 6 didn't do very long-term commitments, so I think we're kind 7 of prepared. If it doesn't happen again, we'll handle it, 8 but we're hoping that we'll be able to get the grant for 9 another year. Some of the grants in this category have been 10 as long as 10 years, so we'll just have to wait and see. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, this thing definitely 12 will run out at some point? 13 MS. LAVENDER: Well, it depends on what the federal 14 dollars are, 'cause this is a federal-funded grant. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And you made the statement, 16 We are ready to -- ready to handle it. 17 MS. LAVENDER: Yeah, we're going to take it out of 18 your salary if we lose this. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That will buy your gas down 20 here one time. 21 MS. LAVENDER: Right, absolutely. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So -- 23 MS. LAVENDER: Pick up cans along the highway or 24 something. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How do -- I remember having 1-24-11 72 1 this conversation in the beginning, seven years ago, but I 2 don't remember what -- we're just going to figure it out as 3 we go along? 4 MS. LAVENDER: We'll work it out if it happens. 5 How's that for a plan? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's scary, but okay. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval of the 8 resolution. 9 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Second. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 11 approval. Let's see if we can set a record. 12 MS. LAVENDER: Yes. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Any question or discussion? All in 14 favor, signify by raising your right hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. Let's move to 19 Item 11; to recognize Kerr County Crime Stoppers 25th 20 anniversary. There's a resolution that's been presented here 21 that I would like to get into the record at this point in 22 time that I think -- this is a resolution which recognizes 23 the Kerr County Crime Stoppers 25th anniversary. "Whereas, 24 the Board of Directors of Kerr County Crime Stoppers recently 25 received recognition from Governor Rick Perry of the 1-24-11 73 1 organization's 25 years of service to the citizens of Kerr 2 County; and whereas, Kerr County Crime Stoppers was chartered 3 in late 1985; and whereas, Kerr County Crime Stoppers has 4 paid out almost $200,000 in rewards" -- should that be 20? 5 MS. LAVENDER: 200,000. 6 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Wow. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, 200. "And whereas, Kerr 8 County Crime Stoppers has been responsible for the arrest of 9 1,264 suspects based on tips; and whereas, almost $270,000 10 worth of narcotics has been seized; and whereas, stolen 11 property valued at $542,951 has been recovered; and whereas, 12 a total of 2,290 offenses in Kerr County have been cleared 13 based on Crime Stoppers tips since 1985; and whereas, Crime 14 Stoppers tips can be called into one of the two hotlines, can 15 be e-mailed, or can be texted through the TipSoft software 16 program; and whereas, Kerr County Crime Stoppers sponsors 17 Campus Crime Stoppers programs on eight local secondary 18 school campuses, being Tivy High School, Hal Peterson Middle 19 School, B.T. Wilson 6th grade campus, Ingram Tom Moore High 20 School, Ingram Middle School, Center Point High School, and 21 Center Point Middle School; and whereas, Crime Stoppers also 22 pays the subscription fee for the Kerr County Sheriff's 23 Office web service called Leads On Line, which provides 24 information from pawn shops around the state. Leads On Line 25 has led to the solving of a number of residential burglaries 1-24-11 74 1 in the county in the past three years. Now, therefore, be it 2 resolved that the Commissioners Court of Kerr County does 3 hereby officially recognize Kerr County Crime Stoppers 25th 4 anniversary and thanks them for their service to the citizens 5 of Kerr County. Adopted this 24th day of January, 2011." Do 6 I hear a motion for approval of the resolution? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second -- third. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 11 approval of the resolution. Question or discussion? All in 12 favor, signify by raising your right hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. It's my 17 pleasure to present this award from the Governor to the 18 representatives of Kerr County Crime Stoppers who are here, 19 in recognition of their 25th anniversary. 20 MR. CASS: Thank you, sir. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: You bet. 22 (Applause.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Lavender, if you'd tell us who 24 we have here from Crime Stoppers organization? 25 MS. LAVENDER: This is Pat Cass, and Pat is the 1-24-11 75 1 president of the board of directors of Crime Stoppers. And 2 this is George McHorse, who is our county Crime Stoppers 3 coordinator. 4 MR. CASS: Assisted by Rosa at all times. Thank 5 you. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. We appreciate your work. 8 (Applause.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Why don't we go ahead and 10 take a recess for about 15 minutes. 11 (Recess taken from 10:35 a.m. to 10:53 a.m.) 12 - - - - - - - - - - 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to order, if 14 we might. Everyone be seated, please. Let's come back to 15 order. Item 12; consider, discuss, take appropriate action 16 to sets an ESD presentation to Commissioners Court and the 17 community for February 7th, 2011, at 6:30 p.m. in the 18 district courtroom here in the courthouse. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. If you remember, 20 you assigned -- this Court assigned me to look into a 21 county-wide emergency service district, much like what is out 22 at Ingram and the one out at Mountain Home, but do it 23 county-wide, which may or may not include the city of 24 Kerrville and the ETJ, et cetera. So, we've been meeting and 25 putting together a presentation of what that might look like, 1-24-11 76 1 and we are ready to do that, and we'd like to do it on 2 Monday, February the 7th, at 6:30 p.m., upstairs. With your 3 approval, if we -- if you do approve that today, that date 4 and time, then I will start my contacting volunteer firemen 5 and fire persons and emergency service people around the 6 community, or all the -- anybody that would be interested in 7 it, to come and hear the presentation to the Commissioners 8 Court, so we can just get this thing rocking and rolling. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, is there an 10 Option 2 day? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm sorry? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there another option for a 13 date? And I don't have to be here, but I cannot make it that 14 day -- that evening. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, see, that's not all 16 bad. (Laughter.) 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You may have done it on 18 purpose. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That -- 20 JUDGE TINLEY: You talked about that; do you 21 remember? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Absolutely. You think I 23 just selected the day? We selected a Monday that's an off 24 Commissioners Court meeting date, and knowing that you 25 wouldn't be here. So -- 1-24-11 77 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Which is -- that's fine. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We can change the date, but 3 I think we need to get down -- we need to kick this can down 4 the road. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree totally, and rather 6 than defer setting the date, go ahead and -- 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right, then, that's what 8 we'll do. My motion is that we have a Commissioners Court 9 meeting for an ESD presentation for February -- Monday, 10 February the 7th, 2011, at 6:30, p.m., in the district 11 courtrooms upstairs. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I second that. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second. 14 Question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify 15 by raising your right hand. 16 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 18 (No response.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We might actually get 21 something done. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that because you're setting 23 a meeting, or because I'm not going to be there? Or both? 24 You don't have to answer that. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's right. 1-24-11 78 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to Item 13; consider, 2 discuss, take appropriate action on payment of the attorney's 3 fees for outside counsel in the L.C.R.A. P.U.C. matter. 4 Mr. Henneke? 5 MR. HENNEKE: Judge, good morning. Commissioners. 6 As the Court is aware, Kerr County, in partnership with the 7 City of Kerrville and Kerrville Public Utility Board, formed 8 a partnership and retained as co-counsel the law firm of 9 Lloyd Gosselink, who has provided us a tremendous 10 representation during the L.C.R.A. CREZ transmission line 11 litigation up through the unfortunate decision of the Public 12 Utility Commission last week. The lead attorney is Georgia 13 Crump, and for those of you who've had the opportunity to 14 meet her, she's recognized as one of the premier municipal 15 and utility attorneys in Austin and Texas, and we had the 16 fortune of her assistance. Back when we last spoke about 17 outside counsel, along with the KPUB and the City of 18 Kerrville, this Court had authorized expenditures up to 19 $20,000 from Kerr County for payment of her attorney's fees. 20 That was based upon an initial estimate that she had given 21 us, at my request, as far as where she projected, back in 22 October -- early October, I think, maybe late September, 23 where this case would go. 24 The case was a massive case. I don't think that -- 25 certainly not with regard to any of these transmission line 1-24-11 79 1 cases has anyone ever seen the size or scope or level of work 2 needed in one of these cases. And, for example, there's been 3 over 3,000 documents -- over 3,000 documents that were filed 4 just in connection with the administrative judge's trial. 5 Due to the complexity and the work involved, her fees are 6 projected to go over the limit that this Court set. I don't 7 have a hard figure on the total, because it's -- we just 8 finished this up last Thursday, but at this point, I would -- 9 I would guess that our share, along with the -- would be 10 probably another 10. I've had conversations with the City 11 Attorney, and also with Mr. McCuan at Kerrville Public 12 Utility Board, and they're committed to -- I don't know about 13 actions of their board, but they've expressed their 14 recommendation, which would be mine, that we take the 15 appropriate action to -- to, you know, pay the bills, the 16 bills being very reasonable. 17 I will note for the Court that it was the testimony 18 during the ALJ trial that, for example, the Clear View 19 Alliance group has spent upwards of $400,000 in attorney's 20 fees in this process, and it looks like our total bill, if 21 the Court does so approve, would be approximately 30. So, 22 the results are unfortunate, but I was with her and worked 23 with her every step of the way, and it was not due to 24 anything that she did or anything less than extraordinary 25 legal representation that she provided. We were well 1-24-11 80 1 represented, and I think it was right that we engaged in this 2 process as we did, despite the unfortunate results. But due 3 to the Court's last action when we last discussed this, I 4 wanted to bring this matter back. Judge Tinley, you 5 participated in the hearings and in the commission meetings. 6 You've met Ms. Crump. I think I've spoken with on you this, 7 and I just wanted to bring this issue back and ask for the 8 Court's direction. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: I never thought 20 -- our share of 10 20 was going to cover it anyway. This thing just ballooned 11 into a massive, massive case, and I don't think there's been 12 another case like it, or even closely approaching it before 13 the commission ever. And when you said 20, I never thought 14 that was going to cover it. That was before I knew how big 15 it was going to get, really. I anticipated it would be -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Rob, you had mentioned the 17 Clear View Alliance spent 400,000. Did they -- were they 18 more successful? How did they come out? I just imagine that 19 spending a bunch more money had an impact. 20 MR. HENNEKE: I'd say they -- well, I don't -- 21 having watched it, actively participated in this process 22 since becoming County Attorney and all the way through, our 23 representation was important to be in the process to 24 participate as we did. I wouldn't say that Clear View 25 Alliance, quote, won or lost because they spent more money. 1-24-11 81 1 Or I wouldn't say that, you know, a group, you know, didn't 2 prevail because they spent less money. I mean, if you look 3 at the goals of the Clear View Alliance, their only route was 4 to come due south on 277 from the McCamey D substation to 5 I-10, and then go 90 degrees east on I-10 from, I think, 6 Sonora, where would it hook up all the way. And they wanted 7 just highway right-of-way the whole way, and nothing but. 8 And what the commission decided last week was, it kind of 9 snakes down from McCamey D on a diagonal course until it 10 hooks up with I-10 just west of Junction, and then travels 11 east. Clear View Alliance was not the only group that was 12 advocating for the route to come through Kerr County. For 13 example, you know, Gillespie County, the City of 14 Fredericksburg were very adamant that that was the route that 15 they preferred, as many other groups were too. So, as far as 16 Clearview's agenda being 277 to I-10, they didn't get that. 17 You know, the majority of the route goes along I-10, which is 18 something that they advocated for, along with most of the 19 other parties that participated in that -- in the action. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That being said, I mean, 21 certainly we need to, you know, I think, in my mind, pay the 22 attorneys. I'm not particularly happy that it's over the 23 limit we set, but, you know, I trust your discretion that it 24 was, you know, appropriate. The question comes to me is as 25 to where does the money come from? Ms. Auditor? 1-24-11 82 1 MS. HARGIS: We've already spent all of our 2 professional fees, so we're going to have to go to 3 contingency. We've already hit that once already, because we 4 have a bill in front of us now from the -- so we're using our 5 contingency pretty fast. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So -- but that's, at this 7 point -- 8 MS. HARGIS: That's the only place we have it. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. And this is really just 10 a -- a notice at this point, because we don't have an actual 11 bill, correct? 12 MR. HENNEKE: Well, it hasn't been authorized, 13 number one. And number two, what I -- my intention was also, 14 following the conversation we're going to have later on in 15 the agenda, is to ask for last and final, if that's the 16 Court's direction, or at least to close this chapter and 17 where we're at, you know, if we look to proceed forward 18 towards anything else. And then with that, I can present 19 then the remainder, either to the Court on an agenda item, or 20 submit it as a bill, and it would just be at the Court's 21 direction on how it would want to receive that information. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Rob, are you talking about 23 -- I mean, are we in the -- are we at the point to where we 24 are appealing something, or are we still telling them, "Get 25 that thing the hell out of here"? Or what -- at what point 1-24-11 83 1 are we? 2 MR. HENNEKE: The Public Utility Commission has 3 issued their decision as of last Thursday, two business days 4 ago, that the route for the 364-KV transmission line will be 5 coming along I-10 through Kerr County and through the city of 6 Kerrville. So, that ends the determination of where the 7 route is going to go. Now, the next step would be an appeal 8 of that determination, and there are remedies available that 9 we may or may not choose to pursue, which I'll discuss with 10 you later. But we have just gotten to the point of 11 determination of where -- where the route goes. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And so we want -- we want to 13 hire a lawyer again to appeal? 14 MR. HENNEKE: Not necessarily. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: No. No, we're not to that point, 16 Commissioner. There's a bill that's up through, I believe, 17 December 31, the end of December. There's some additional 18 services that were rendered that we've not yet been billed 19 for. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 21 MR. HENNEKE: The two -- 22 JUDGE TINLEY: That will carry through the 23 Commission's decision, which just occurred last week. And 24 that's what we're presently -- the initial process that we 25 signed on for, as it were. 1-24-11 84 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: The difficulty is that, because of 3 the magnitude of the case -- and they've written us a lengthy 4 letter explaining the reason and breaking down their earlier 5 estimates, and how -- what actually occurred for running over 6 that estimate. Just plain and simple, it was the massiveness 7 of this particular case that necessitated more work. But 8 we've got a billing in front of us now for about 7,300, I 9 believe. 10 MR. HENNEKE: Yes, sir. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: But there will be another small 12 billing to cover the work through the Commission's decision. 13 Then, with respect to any appeals, that's a whole 'nother 14 subject. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: That'll be discussed later. The -- 17 we do have a participation form that -- that was filed with 18 respect to this particular matter. Michael Allen asked to be 19 heard on it. Yes, sir? Come forward, Mr. Allen, and tell us 20 your thoughts on it. 21 MR. ALLEN: Okay. Thank you, Judge, Commissioners. 22 And I not only want to thank you for letting me speak, but 23 also just in general for your service. I have great 24 appreciation for the work y'all do. My father was a 25 commissioner for a long time in Burnet County, Precinct 1-24-11 85 1 Number 4, so I have a great appreciation for what y'all do. 2 The ugly power lines and how to -- how to perhaps prevent 3 those from coming through the front door of Kerrville. After 4 reading about the cost of wind power and how it's currently 5 paid for, it occurs to me that the problem with those power 6 lines might just go away on their own if we could slow that 7 process down some. And I'll show you these articles I've 8 been reading. It says that the current federal subsidy for 9 wind power is $6.44 per million BTU's, British thermal units, 10 the way you measure that. $6.44 per million. The same 11 million BTU's of electricity can be generated with $4 of 12 natural gas. And the federal subsidy doesn't cover all the 13 cost, of course. So -- and I read that the -- the federal 14 government, as we all do, is currently spending $1.60 for 15 every one dollar it collects in revenue -- taxes. So, it 16 just stands to reason to me that a lot of subsidies and 17 excessive government spending for things that we probably 18 can't afford, they're just going to go away on their own. 19 And so it occurs to me that -- that if we could gum up the 20 works and slow down that process of these power lines being 21 built to bring wind-generated power through Kerr County, 22 those lines may stand abandoned and vacant if -- if they're 23 -- if they get built. 24 So, my encouragement to you and the City of 25 Kerrville is to -- would be to fight those any way we can. 1-24-11 86 1 Gum up the works; lawsuits, appeal. Normally, as a banker, 2 I'm -- I don't go for filing lawsuits. That's not my nature. 3 But -- but we're against an unusual enemy here. We're 4 fighting our own tax dollars. So, I got two articles 5 explaining that, if I'm allowed to give those to you. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Surely. 7 MR. ALLEN: I'll leave that with you. That talks 8 about what the power is. These are both articles out of the 9 Wall Street Journal, which is something a banker reads pretty 10 regularly, but -- but I'm sure there's other articles that 11 might say -- 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, sir. 13 MR. ALLEN: -- in more detail. I'm certainly not 14 an electrical engineer, so I don't know about all those 15 things. 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Thank you, Mike. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can we have one more for the 18 clerk? 19 MR. ALLEN: Yes. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Got an extra one? 21 MR. ALLEN: And anybody else that wants one, I'd be 22 glad to pass them around. 23 MR. HENNEKE: I'll take a couple. 24 MR. ALLEN: But that's my little pleading to you, 25 is to gum up the works, slow it down any way you can. 1-24-11 87 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Your spiel, essentially, is time 2 cures a lot of ills, right? 3 MR. ALLEN: I think those things will stand vacant 4 someday, unless the -- the price of oil and natural gas is 5 going to have to double again before wind power becomes 6 economically feasible. And I think our federal government is 7 just going to have to cut back their spending. And with what 8 we hear on the news, it's a popular thing to talk about 9 cutting -- cutting the excess, so I think it's going to 10 occur. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- I know I've heard -- I 12 know there's a lot of federal subsidies going into the wind 13 generation. Do you -- are you aware of how many federal 14 subsidies are going into the power line construction? 15 MR. ALLEN: No, sir, I'm not. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That would be an interesting 17 thing to find out, because that's -- to me, that is -- the 18 little bit of leverage we may have would be in that area. 19 There are federal dollars spent on the power -- actual 20 construction or rebates on the -- or some kind of tax credit, 21 something on the power line construction. But that would be 22 at least an avenue to get to representatives in Washington. 23 May not go very far, but at least it might be -- I'd be 24 surprised if there's not some sort of a tax credit or subsidy 25 in those construction projects. 1-24-11 88 1 MR. ALLEN: You know, what we did when we worked on 2 KPUB getting that farm 20-something years ago, Kerrville had 3 an L.C.R.A. -- a representative on the L.C.R.A. board who is 4 the current representative -- or is that still the case? 5 That we get them a spot on the -- 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Hoffman? 7 MS. HOFFMAN: This county currently does not have a 8 position on the L.C.R.A. board. By statutory authority, we 9 have a number of reserve spots on the board for our statutory 10 counties. Kerr County's not a statutory county. There are 11 other seats for the Governor to appoint in other counties 12 where we have services. The last person was Lucy Wilke that 13 represented from this area. We currently have a board member 14 from Blanco County; that's as close to this area as you get. 15 But the Governor appoints the board members. 16 MR. ALLEN: 'Cause this is an L.C.R.A. initiative. 17 Should we go -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, it's actually -- the 19 Legislature awarded the construction obligation to L.C.R.A. 20 Transmission Services Corporation, which is a private, 21 for-profit entity, as I understand it, which is separate and 22 apart from L.C.R.A., which is a political subdivision. 23 Ms. Hoffman, maybe you can give us an answer. Is there any 24 sort of federal money or federal subsidy going into the 25 actual construction of those lines that you're aware of? 1-24-11 89 1 MS. HOFFMAN: No. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: That'll be spent by the Transmission 3 Services Corporation, and they'll recoup it through the 4 ratepayers. 5 MS. HOFFMAN: We go back to the P.U.C. The line is 6 built for what's called rate recovery, and then they 7 determine if our costs are allowable to be charged across the 8 board within ERCOT, which is Electrical Reliability Council 9 of Texas, all the ratepayers within the grid in the state of 10 Texas. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, Ms. Hoffman, if Mr. Allen's 12 correct and the lines are underutilized and built, the 13 ratepayers still pay for it, even though they're 14 underutilized? 15 MS. HOFFMAN: The ratepayers would still pay for 16 the cost of installing them. I would suggest if -- if those 17 in the room did not see Chairman Smitherman's opening remarks 18 of the January 20th meeting, you might go back and view that. 19 It's on the Public Utility Commission web site. He does 20 speak about wind power. He speaks about reliability, needs 21 that are met by building these CREZ lines. In addition to 22 bringing wind power, they also provide a much needed 23 reliability situation to move power around within our state. 24 So, you might -- you might just be interested to hear what he 25 said. 1-24-11 90 1 MR. ALLEN: I read where that was -- the primary 2 purpose was to move wind energy into the Austin area. Of 3 course, they want to sustain power; I understand that, but 4 they also said that it might serve a purpose to move the 5 power. But there was some conversation, or what I read, that 6 that power could be moved on existing lines too. So, whether 7 there's a need for them or not -- 8 JUDGE TINLEY: There were actually two legs that 9 were prescribed as part of the CREZ process that were 10 eliminated by virtue of being able to upgrade, at least for 11 now. Whether or not it's a permanent solution, we don't 12 know. But the Gillespie to Newton, which went on up through 13 Llano and Lampasas, that was eliminated by being able to 14 upgrade an existing line, and also the Gillespie to Kendall, 15 which goes down to Comfort, which was originally part of this 16 line, was eliminated because there was another line that 17 could be upgraded which would handle the problem, at least 18 for now. Again, I suspect if the power load gets to a 19 certain point, they'll have to do something there, but at 20 least for now. 21 MR. ALLEN: Additionally, I forgot to introduce 22 John Miller; he's here in support of my effort this morning. 23 He came to help me. Thank y'all. 24 MR. MILLER: Thank you, Mike. My name's John 25 Miller. Mike and I have been discussing this subject for 1-24-11 91 1 some time, and he reads the Wall Street Journal every day, so 2 he gives me all the copies of all that. So, you know, from a 3 -- a political standpoint -- and this -- this issue of -- of 4 wind and turbine energy has been a pretty interesting subject 5 through the years. And, of course, what I most dislike about 6 it is the issue of it being subsidized, that it's not an 7 economic factor by itself. And, of course, with natural gas 8 prices being so cheap right now, and, of course, the article 9 that Mike gave you, T. Boone Pickens making a pretty big 10 business mistake believing that wind turbine power was going 11 to be the real source of energy, and it's going certainly 12 down in the -- the expansion at the present time. I would -- 13 I would also urge you, 'cause I -- as I think almost 14 everybody in Kerr County, they don't want to see a bunch of 15 power lines going down Interstate 10; that whatever we can 16 do, the County Commissioners and the City of Kerrville, we 17 need to do it to fight this. And whether or not it'll go 18 away through the natural economic factors of federal 19 government not having enough money to subsidize it, we need 20 to fight it. So, we're all behind y'all on what you can do 21 for it. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: You think T. Boone may have been 23 better off continuing to invest in water, rather than this 24 wind-generated power situation? 25 MR. MILLER: Well, according to the Wall Street 1-24-11 92 1 Journal, he would be. So, I imagine he'll have to make that 2 decision. Of course, General Electric selling all those 3 turbines, they may have a hard time getting them all 4 delivered. So -- 5 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's right. 6 MR. MILLER: -- we'll find out. Thank you. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Thank you. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, I guess we're back to where we 10 were. Is that redundancy? We're back to where we were. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Actually, it's a nice line 12 for a song. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. So, what you're seeking today 14 is the Court's approval to pay the excess costs over the 15 original estimate, and take that out of contingency? Okay. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have voted previously not 17 to pay these lawyers any money, because I feel like that we 18 have a lawyer here that is very, very, very capable of 19 handling this. But if we owe money, I also believe that we 20 need to pay our bills, so I move we -- 10,000? Was that what 21 you said? 22 MR. HENNEKE: I will get a final number through 23 right now. And it's -- we have the bill through the end of 24 December, which is about 7,300, and then the majority of work 25 in January has been the two Public Utility Commission 1-24-11 93 1 meetings. So, I would -- I don't have a firm number, 2 Commissioner, but I think that's in the ballpark of what I 3 would expect. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't know about that. 5 I'd certainly commit to pay what we owe, but I don't know 6 that we need to put a dollar amount if we don't know a dollar 7 amount. I mean, should we do up to -- 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: A not-to-exceed? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: A not-to-exceed type thing? 10 Or -- 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Or we can just pay the bill 12 that's been submitted today, and then we'll wait for another 13 bill to approve in the future. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is -- this 10,000, is there 15 an actual bill? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, we've got a bill for the 17 $7,372.79. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's what we're trying to 19 pay today, right? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So let's pay that. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And then -- 23 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'll second that. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Seventy what, now? 25 JUDGE TINLEY: 7,372.79. 1-24-11 94 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: And that's your motion? 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir, it is. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We have a second. Question 5 or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by 6 raising your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. Let's go to 14; 11 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to set a public 12 hearing regarding court action to close, vacate, abandon, 13 and/or discontinue all or a portion of Camp Verde Road from 14 F.M. 480 to Highway 173 pursuant to Texas Transportation 15 code. Commissioner Overby? 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Judge Tinley, Commissioners, 17 Item 1.14 is the appropriate action just to start the public 18 hearing request for a presentation and a public hearing and 19 an action item set by the Court. It would be set on February 20 28th. What we're talking about here is the closing -- 21 possible closing of all or a part of the Camp Verde Road from 22 480 to Highway 173. I would like to say that, basically, 23 what is happening right now with the business entity that 24 we're having there right now, what was -- what is scheduled 25 for our February 28th meeting is to have a presentation made 1-24-11 95 1 by the business entity at that time, to look at their 2 business expansion possibilities here with their -- their 3 current operation. Then there will be a public hearing that 4 would be set after that, and then, of course, right after 5 that the request of action by this Court at that time. 6 What I would like to say, and for the record here, 7 what we're talking about is the Camp Verde Road closure. 8 What the business entity has proposed is a possibility of 9 closing about three-fourths of a mile of this Camp Verde 10 Road. For the record, just basically, they're starting at 11 the first portion, or about .22 miles; that would be from 173 12 on Camp Verde Road. Camp Verde Road would still remain open 13 to allow for their business expansion and for parking on that 14 road. The other portion of that quarter of a mile that we 15 would have still open would be at the opposite end of off -- 16 coming off 480 onto Camp Verde Road would be for a -- more of 17 a safety issue that would be there for the folks that would 18 be exiting off 480 at night; if they're not used to that 19 road, that would be able to have an area there that they 20 could come off the road for safety issues, and to be able to 21 have time to turn around and come back. I just wanted to say 22 specifically, right now there are still other specific 23 details and data and information that we're gathering at this 24 time. There's a lot of things that we're still working out, 25 but I did want to go ahead, and at the request from the 1-24-11 96 1 entity here, to go ahead and place this as far as our public 2 hearing set for February 28th. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: At what time? Probably need do it 4 later if there's going to be a presentation. 5 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I would say probably 11:00. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: 10:15? 7 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah, 10:15. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, we have a public hearing 10 at 10:00. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: We set that earlier. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: 10:30? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What did we set that one on? 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You set one on -- 15 MS. HYDE: The flood damage. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Flood damage. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's probably not going to be 18 a real long one, so we can either move that one up, or might 19 want to move this one up to 9:30. Is that appropriate? 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We'd have to go back and -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, this one. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Move this one, say, to 11:00? 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Either that or 9:30. Or 24 9:00. May take a while to discuss that issue. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. Do you think that that 1-24-11 97 1 should -- that public hearing would be the time to let 2 everybody get up and speak and let the presentation be part 3 of that public hearing, rather than having a separate item? 4 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That is correct. There would 5 be -- there's the process here of basically having the 6 presentation first, and then having the public hearing for 7 those that would like to speak at that time, to allow that 8 process. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the reason for the -- I 10 kind of like the presentation, 'cause that way there's -- if 11 we have questions, we can ask them. During the public 12 hearing, we can't ask any questions. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, we can't participate in 14 that. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, this way we could. 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Right. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay, that's fine. 18 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay with that? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, what time? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's do it at 11:00. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 11 o'clock. Commissioner, 22 I've got a question. I'm a little bit uncomfortable with 23 this language of "discontinue all or a portion." The -- you 24 know, if we're asking the public to come in and tell us their 25 opinion on something, are they going to come in and talk 1-24-11 98 1 about all -- the whole road closing, or are they going to 2 come in and give us an opinion on part of the road closing? 3 And if they come in to talk about a part of it, and then we 4 vote on all of it, I mean, I just -- I see a -- I don't know. 5 To me, that's not real clean -- real clear. 6 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I think that's the reason 7 why, in the request here today for the public hearing, I 8 wanted to state specifically what they're wanting to do is 9 have, like I said, .22 acres coming off 173 to still remain 10 open to allow for their expansion project, and then the -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's a portion. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's a portion of that. 13 See, the mile -- the road is approximately 1 mile long, and 14 what they're recommending there would be about three-fourths 15 of that mile. And there would be diagrams; there would be 16 maps that would specifically show that. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Why don't we say a portion 18 of it, then? Why are they trying to say all of it? 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: We -- 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I guess that would be an 21 option. 22 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: We can say a portion of that. 23 And the reason why we put on it here is just for the -- to 24 make sure that we have that for discussion for today on how 25 that -- 1-24-11 99 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: -- wants to be on there. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Wide range of discussion. 4 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's probably better to 6 narrow the discussion on this one. I mean, there's no reason 7 to talk about closing the whole road if we're not going to 8 close the whole road. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Absolutely. 10 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's right. And that's -- 11 and what basically will be in the presentation will have maps 12 that are shown. That's the reason why we want to state it 13 again. We're not -- we're talking a portion of it. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If you have a public hearing 15 on one -- on one of those issues, "portion" or "all," and 16 then you vote on something else, that's -- shouldn't be doing 17 that. 18 MR. HENNEKE: But the purpose -- and, Commissioner, 19 I will take the responsibility for the verbiage. It was my 20 suggestion, just to make sure -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what I thought. It 22 looks like a lawyer -- (Laughter.) It looks like a lawyer 23 had a hold of this. 24 MR. HENNEKE: There was broad notice so that -- for 25 a public hearing, so that anyone who may be affected should 1-24-11 100 1 be then given notice that, you know, there is a change that 2 would affect that road, something that this Court wants to 3 elicit public testimony on here in about 30 days. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: If we get to the end of the road, 5 and for some reason unbeknownst at this time we want to close 6 it all, we wouldn't be able to under this scenario, unless we 7 advertise it "all or a portion," I think is the rationale, 8 that -- to keep all the options open. But once they make the 9 presentation, then the folks that have an interest in this 10 matter will have a clear idea exactly what these folks have 11 in mind. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And then -- and then the 13 agenda item for us to -- when we actually take our vote -- 14 MR. HENNEKE: Will be then we will have a specific 15 plan, and -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 17 MR. HENNEKE: -- and survey and, you know, diagram 18 showing exactly -- 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: From what point to what 20 point. 21 MR. HENNEKE: Point to point. Then I would 22 anticipate that that would be what the Court would -- would 23 vote on. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not trying to be overly 25 picky here, but we can't close all of that road. We don't 1-24-11 101 1 have the legal authority, 'cause we don't own it. There's a 2 portion of it that TexDOT controls access to their park, so, 3 I mean, you know, we can only control -- we can only close a 4 portion of that whole road. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Well, that solves that issue, 6 then. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, it does. It does. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, it will be -- 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Sure glad you pointed that 10 out, finally. Didn't think you ever were going to. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Why were you holding back on us, 12 Jon? (Laughter.) 13 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: We're still working on 14 details. 15 MR. HENNEKE: Exactly. This leaves the notice open 16 to make sure that everyone who should receive notice is 17 notified. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, that's fine. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: That was a motion? 20 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's a motion. This is a 21 motion. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and a second to 24 conduct a public hearing February 28th, 2011, at 11 a.m. 25 Question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify 1-24-11 102 1 by raising your right hand. 2 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 4 (No response.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 6 Item 15; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 7 reappoint Commissioners Ken Wood, Cheryl Thompson, and Donald 8 Oehler to ESD Number 1. Commissioner Oehler in Precinct 4. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I move for reappointment of 10 the three mentioned in the agenda item. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 13 approval. Question or discussion? 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm sure glad they agreed to 15 do it again. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: You'd have had to go round up some 17 more. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll tell you, sometimes 19 they're hard to round up. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion, signify 21 by raising your right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. Let's go to 1-24-11 103 1 Item 16; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 2 approve application for a 2011 Criminal Justice Program 3 solicitation in the amount of $44,500 for an Automated 4 Fingerprint Identification System for Kerr County. Where's 5 the high Sheriff? 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'm hiding. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: There he is. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Chief Deputy Barton does all 9 the grants; he's going to present this. 10 DEPUTY BARTON: Morning, gentlemen. Just want to 11 seek permission to approve a resolution to go before AACOG 12 and apply for a $44,500 grant to be utilized for an Automated 13 Fingerprint Identification System that we've sought other 14 grants for this project. It needs to be a project that's 15 sort of missed by this county. It would really help the 16 Sheriff's Office out. Currently, right now it takes D.P.S. 17 seven -- they're seven months behind just entering latent 18 fingerprints that we send to be run through their system, so 19 this would help alleviate some of that backlog. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: This requires a resolution to be 21 approved by the Court to apply for a grant? 22 DEPUTY BARTON: Yes, sir, it does. There's no 23 matching funds required by the grant. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't know why we wouldn't 25 support that. 1-24-11 104 1 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah, that's right. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that a motion? 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's a motion. 4 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'll second. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and a second for 6 approval. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Clay -- go ahead. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do we have a resolution? 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And this would authorize the 10 Judge to be -- oh, you already have it? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And authorize -- 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Authorize the Judge to sign. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask a question. 14 When -- who do you -- who do you -- you go to D.P.S. in order 15 to -- whenever you do fingerprints? 16 DEPUTY BARTON: Well, currently, right now when we 17 lift prints from a crime scene, we have to submit them to 18 D.P.S. to be run through the state database, the state AFIS 19 system. And, of course, the state AFIS system is made up 20 primarily of all people who've been arrested for Class B 21 offenses and higher throughout the state. Within the last 22 year, they started collecting Class C misdemeanor 23 fingerprints. This system, we could run back through and 24 enter into the computer all the Class C's that we've handled 25 in the past, all of our jail files. 1-24-11 105 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This new system? 2 DEPUTY BARTON: Yes, sir. We can scan all these 3 prints into this computer system. We can add them. As the 4 fingerprints daily are sent to D.P.S., it would upgrade our 5 database daily. D.P.S. will send us the last five years 6 worth of submissions that we've sent onto a disk; we can 7 update the database, and what it will allow us to do is that 8 when we get us a latent that's been picked up from a crime 9 scene, we could at least run it through our local system 10 first to see if we had a match, prior to having to submit it 11 to D.P.S. and wait for them to run it through their system. 12 And hopefully, if we had a local match, especially off a 13 Class C violator, someone who was picked up for public 14 intoxication in the past, we have copies of prints, but 15 D.P.S. would not -- and now he's decided to become a burglar. 16 We could get a match quicker, get this offender picked up 17 before he has a chance to go out and offend more, instead of 18 waiting seven months, hoping that D.P.S. could get a match. 19 In this case scenario, they wouldn't get a match. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, if you -- but -- so this 21 thing doesn't really enhance what D.P.S. does today, then? 22 It's just -- 23 DEPUTY BARTON: It just gives us an opportunity -- 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- local records? 25 DEPUTY BARTON: Local system. 1-24-11 106 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: To catch it early? 2 DEPUTY BARTON: To see. And we can ask for the -- 3 the adjoining counties, if they want to submit data -- 4 fingerprint data. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Rusty's standing up. Let's 6 hurry up and get through this. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It does enhance it, Buster, 8 because D.P.S. has no Class C's. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: All the public intoxication, 11 none of those are in the D.P.S. -- 12 DEPUTY BARTON: Prior to 2010. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah, 2010. So, all ours that 14 we have on file out there would be put into a system. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is this system just to take the 16 current paper copies and get them into a system? Or -- 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Compares them. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But it doesn't -- don't we 19 currently -- don't you -- didn't we, a while back, buy a 20 system that you do them automatically? I mean, we don't do 21 the electronic -- don't we have an electronic fingerprint 22 system out there? 23 DEPUTY BARTON: We do have an electronic 24 fingerprint system, one that we purchased a number of years 25 ago that actually got replaced. D.P.S. came through and put 1-24-11 107 1 a new system in, and those records go directly to D.P.S. 2 every morning. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 4 DEPUTY BARTON: Whenever we fingerprint -- I say 5 every morning, but they dump into the statewide system. We 6 could actually tie onto it where it also dumps into our 7 system also. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 9 DEPUTY BARTON: The same. But this is not for the 10 purpose of taking fingerprints; this is a database of 11 fingerprints stored. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 13 DEPUTY BARTON: That will take a latent 14 fingerprint. You can put it in there; it will do a 15 comparison through the computer and see if we have somebody 16 in our system that matches the fingerprint that was picked up 17 from the crime scene. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is it going to look like on 19 C.S.I., where it comes up in color with the little red dots 20 on them? 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You can do that. 22 DEPUTY BARTON: I think that's the theory behind 23 it. I can't tell if you it's going to be in color. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I want it to have a little neat 25 back screen just like that. 1-24-11 108 1 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: How long would it take, if 2 your grant application is -- to possibly see those funds? 3 DEPUTY BARTON: Let's see. 4 MS. LAVENDER: September 1. 5 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Six months? 6 MS. LAVENDER: Mm-hmm, September 1. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: September. 8 MS. LAVENDER: Same cycle as mine. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there a motion yet? Move 10 approval. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. We got a motion and a second, 12 yeah. We're just trying to get to a vote here. Any other 13 question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify 14 by raising your right hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. Let's go to 19 Item 17; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 20 approve the amendment to the C.H.M. agreement for inmate 21 health services at the Kerr County Jail. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: This is just an extension from 23 last year, extending it up to another year. It has been 24 reviewed by the County Attorney. The County Attorney has 25 noticed a couple date issues on it, but that's the way this 1-24-11 109 1 -- this agreement's been done ever since we started in 2008. 2 It goes from -- it states October 1, and then it does state 3 ending September 30th, and that's just the way it's been 4 worded every year that we've done it. There's no price 5 change or anything. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 9 approval. Question or discussion? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You're happy with the service? 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We did change physicians. 12 They changed physicians, and just to give you an idea, our 13 prescription bill went from about anywhere from 6,000 to 14 10,000 a month, down to 300 a month. 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Doing a good job. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: So I'm very happy with it. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That was -- that's because 18 of the change of the physician? 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's it. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Sheriff, I note in the original 21 contract on the -- on the amount to be paid by the County, 22 the original contract contains an automatic escalator, and 23 this amendment to the contract which renews for one more year 24 provides that that's not operative for this year, and the 25 cost is to remain the same. 1-24-11 110 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's what's their amendments 2 state, if you've read those at one point in time. So they -- 3 JUDGE TINLEY: My question to you is whether -- 4 what's the possibility of getting that automatic escalator 5 out altogether? 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I think it's something during 7 this year that we should look at. We have had a lot better 8 dealings, you might say, with their corporate people, or 9 their -- or their heads. They've now even appointed their 10 own representative to represent us, and we've been able to 11 have a lot more monthly -- you know, every other month 12 discussion on a lot of things with our contract with them, 13 talked to them about it, and I think that's a good 14 possibility and something we ought to look at. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Why don't we just put in 16 there, "to be negotiated on an annual basis," rather than put 17 an automatic escalator? 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I agree, and I think that's 19 something that we can definitely look at this coming year. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: But right now, we're -- our rate is 21 set. Same as we paid last year. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: For the current year. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We're okay now. Next year we 25 might be in trouble. 1-24-11 111 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Next year we need to look at 2 it. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: That's my whole point. And we got 4 some leverage about whether or not we renew in the future, 5 too. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's right. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: There are others in this business, 8 aren't there? 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: There's a few. That is a very 10 -- you know, there's not that many providers that do it like 11 that. We'd go back to doing it ourself. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Further question or 13 discussion? 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: No. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion, signify 16 by raising your right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. Item 18; 21 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to approve the 22 2011-12 maintenance agreement between Voice Products, 23 Incorporated, and Kerr County Sheriff for maintenance of the 24 recorder equipment in dispatch. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: This is the -- mainly the 1-24-11 112 1 radio recorder that records all radio traffic coming and 2 going out of our dispatch office and that, and so it is a 3 renewal on it. The County Attorney did look at it. There 4 were a couple notes he made on it. One was the overtime that 5 would be paid -- or the payment outside of the contract if it 6 was an emergency-type situation. He suggested that that be 7 put -- or that the emergency -- the request be put in 8 writing. Well, the problem I had with that is, you know, 9 this company's in Houston. Normally if we have an emergency 10 situation, it's more of a call on the phone from me or from 11 my dispatch supervisor to get that done, get it fixed right 12 then. So, I'm not so worried about that. He said that part 13 wasn't a controller. The last paragraph he added to this 14 contract was the deal that it would be budget -- pending 15 availability of funds, budgeted funds. He requested that. I 16 thought it was a good idea. I did -- we did get a hold of 17 Voice Products. They had no problem in adding that final 18 paragraph just as our County Attorney suggested it, so it has 19 been added to that copy that I would request that we get the 20 Judge's signature on. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 24 approval as indicated. Further question or discussion? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, the -- the actual 1-24-11 113 1 document that's there that we're voting on has that paragraph 2 change -- 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- in it? 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It has that one paragraph in 6 it that was suggested by the County Attorney. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Das gut. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion? All 9 in favor, signify by raising your right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 12 (No response.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 14 Item 19; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action to 15 approve the agreement and proposal for a transportability 16 study conducted by FitForce and its associates to validate 17 physical readiness standards for patrol officers and 18 corrections officers. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. There was back -- 20 backup attached to this you could see. It is a contract for 21 them to come down and do the validation study, which is -- 22 we've already implemented a way for new hires that have to go 23 through a physical fitness test before they're eligible for 24 new -- for being hired. In continuation with that, my deal 25 is to -- to also bring all current employees up and create a 1-24-11 114 1 standard physical fitness battery of tests that will be done 2 on the -- on current employees, and do that in a legal means 3 that is fit, totally job-related, and that we could survive. 4 And according to the best way you can do it, number one, the 5 most defensible in any lawsuit is a total individual study, 6 which would cost us about $80,000. The number two way in 7 defensibility on any civil litigation is what they call a 8 transportability study, which is what I'm asking for here. 9 And then, of course, the least preferred way is just kind of 10 winging it and doing it on your own. I don't want to do 11 that. I have the funds in my budget -- in my training budget 12 to pay this contract. And -- 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How much is the one you want? 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Total is 25,000. And that's 15 doing both Sheriff's Office and jail personnel. 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: And you have money in the 17 budget, you said? 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Money in my training budget to 19 do it. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I second it. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to approve 23 the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in favor, 24 signify by raising your right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 1-24-11 115 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go 4 to -- 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Thank you, gentlemen. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: -- Item 20; consider, discuss, and 7 take appropriate action on Tier 1 Partial Exemption Racial 8 Profiling Report for the Constable, Precinct 1. Commissioner 9 Baldwin? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. This is a little 11 bit different thing than we've been doing, so I've asked 12 Mr. Lavender to come and -- (Someone sneezed.) Bless you. 13 Was that you, John? 14 MR. LAVENDER: That wasn't me. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. To come and explain 16 what this is. And we -- as I was visiting with him this 17 morning, I actually pulled him over this morning. 18 MR. LAVENDER: I was going to tell them about that, 19 Commissioner. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I retract my question. 21 MR. LAVENDER: The bad guy stopped the cops. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, let me tell the story. 23 (Laughter.) 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Did you get him on camera? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we got to talking about 1-24-11 116 1 it, and it's brand-new law, and I think maybe Precinct 1 2 Constable's the first guy in the state to comply with the 3 law. 4 MR. LAVENDER: Good morning, gentlemen. What we 5 have is, historically -- or prior to this year, we've 6 reported racial profiling to our governing agency, which in 7 my case is Commissioners Court. This year is the first year 8 that we also report to the state at the TCLEOSE level, and 9 that submission is done electronically. I prepared mine the 10 morning of the first day that it was available, and it's been 11 submitted, and the TCLEOSE computer has accepted it. And 12 that's what you have. Mine was easy to do, because I do my 13 spreadsheet on all my violator contacts as the year goes by, 14 and when you get to the end, you punch the little button and 15 you have all of your information out. So, that's why I was 16 able to get it done so -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You're just trying to show off. 18 MR. LAVENDER: Say again? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You're just trying to show off. 20 MR. LAVENDER: We're number one. So, those are the 21 numbers that are reflected in the state report, and it's the 22 same, of course, for what I report to you. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: The appropriate action you're asking 24 for is? 25 MR. LAVENDER: Acceptance. Just acknowledge 1-24-11 117 1 receipt of it. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we can either do it here 3 or we can do it in the -- in the final part, but let's -- I 4 move that we accept the Partial Exemption Racial Profiling 5 Report, Tier 1. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for the 8 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 9 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed -- 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thanks, John. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Item 21; to 16 consider, discuss, take appropriate action on various 17 profiles to be sent to the City of Kerrville concerning joint 18 city/county functions. Commissioner Letz? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I just -- I put this on 20 the agenda to make sure we're all on the same page as to what 21 we're going to -- we agreed to send over there. This Friday, 22 is my recollection. And three out of the four, I guess, 23 contested areas, whatever you want to call it, I'm involved 24 with. So -- and, you know, I don't have any kind of thoughts 25 on what I think those should be on these profiles. I'll just 1-24-11 118 1 leave it up to the Court. On animal control, my thought is 2 we should have the county rules apply everywhere, period. If 3 they don't want to do that, then they can do their own animal 4 control. 'Cause it's pretty simple. If we're going to -- I 5 think that's enough said on that. On the library, I see kind 6 of three options on that. One, basically leave it the way it 7 is; form a county-wide library district, which we have talked 8 about previously; or make us 50/50 partners, and I mean 9 partners, where we have equal say, 'cause they want us to 10 contribute more dollars. Those are the -- I mean, those are 11 the only things that I can support going forward. I'm not 12 even sure I support the last one. Not sure if we want to be 13 partners, but if we're going to do anything other than what 14 we're doing right now, I know I'm not going to get in a 15 situation like we were before where we're paying half the 16 bills and not having any say in how things are done with 17 salaries or who's hired and all that. So, those are the 18 three options that I see on the library. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Would not a further option be that 20 we make some adjustments to what we pay? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, and that -- that, I 22 think, goes with what I'm saying is the same. It's the same 23 type of thing. The funding dollars could vary. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm looking at down, too, not just 25 up. 1-24-11 119 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It could be zero, couldn't 2 it? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, yeah. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It could be zero. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Could be zero. So, those three 6 options. Under A, I would agree, it's -- the funding level 7 would be just, you know, discussed. And then at the airport, 8 you know, I think what I heard at the meeting was that 9 there's -- the governance at the airport is not even on the 10 table. Therefore, what we're talking about at the airport is 11 -- I'm not real sure I understand why they want this, but if 12 they want to start paying part of the operations costs, you 13 know, I'm willing to talk to them. If they want to -- you 14 know, we thought we did that in a manner where we all -- both 15 parties do have equal input, and we were paying 100 percent. 16 If they want to have equal input and pay half, well, I don't 17 really have a problem with that. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, from zero to half. 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Come on in and pay 50 20 percent. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So -- 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That probably won't be an 23 option they will accept, Jon. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But, you know, that's -- you 25 know, I don't -- 1-24-11 120 1 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's where I see we are at 3 the airport. And airport, obviously, you know, I think -- 4 and what I'm looking for here is kind of a -- a basic 5 agreement on the ones that I'm kind of working on. Then I'll 6 get with Commissioner Oehler and Commissioner Overby to get 7 the actual language proper. And then when it comes to the 8 ESD/fire profile, I'll just hand that to Commissioner 9 Baldwin. I'm not sure what -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: ESD? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, the -- 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: EMS. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: EMS, not ESD. I'm sorry. 14 Fire/EMS issue, you know, I'm not directly involved with that 15 one, so I'll let Commissioner Baldwin work that. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The County Attorney and I 17 are going to visit about that -- that one. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But on the -- you know, I do 19 have -- 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I would welcome -- I would 21 welcome your interest in the EMS issue. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think my interest overall is, 23 I see a problem of joining those two services completely from 24 our -- from our standpoint, because it makes it very -- 25 it's -- you know, it's putting things together that puts us 1-24-11 121 1 in a -- a very difficult situation. We may be very happy 2 with the EMS and decide we don't want that much fire, and 3 then all of a sudden, if you want to change, you've got to 4 throw everything out. So, I mean, I'm against joining them 5 completely from our standpoint. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, and also, you could 8 even say the same thing about EMS. If we -- if we decided 9 that we could get a better service for less contribution for 10 the residents outside the city, we would have that option to 11 do that as well. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. And I think -- and on 13 that, I'm -- you know, would it be -- you know, I don't 14 personally think that it is reasonable or worthwhile to -- 15 when I say "worthwhile," I don't think we need to send a fire 16 truck out to the far regions of the county in any direction 17 with an ambulance. So, if that -- you know, as their current 18 policy, I believe, is. And if that is a point that they're 19 going to insist on, I think that we have to look at other 20 options very, very seriously, because that is a cost that I 21 don't think is reasonable. 22 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Right. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: That would be their proposal for 24 level of service, however. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 1-24-11 122 1 JUDGE TINLEY: But we -- we probably need to 2 suggest to them that we want those options. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't mind telling you, I 4 sent questions last week to the assistant to the City 5 Manager. They sent out an e-mail requesting things that, you 6 know, we might be concerned over, and I sent a list about 7 that long of stuff that dealt with -- with basically your -- 8 your costs, your actual audited costs, as opposed to what you 9 budget, and response times. And input on animal control, we 10 had some issues that -- that could have been serious issues, 11 some more serious, between the Police Department and Animal 12 Control this last year over bite cases. We have also had -- 13 had them call -- Environmental Health has been called several 14 times, and we have no mechanism for any charges there. They 15 just call, and Ray has helped them several times, including 16 just recently. I have documentation he gave me that shows 17 that he was involved in a Code Enforcement case on dumping, 18 and was just about to the end of it and getting ready to have 19 it abated when the City took it away from him. But they 20 didn't mind asking him in the beginning. So, you know, 21 there's those kinds of things. And I got -- you know, I 22 wanted to know what response times were. I didn't mean to 23 intrude, Buster, on your territory, but I felt like we -- 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think you did. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think we need to know what 1-24-11 123 1 response times were out in especially my area, which is so 2 far from anything. You know, like, what is -- what is your 3 normal response time to Divide School? And Mountain Home, 4 and Hunt, and River End, and -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Garven Store. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. Those -- those kinds 7 of places. What are your -- you know, your normal response 8 times? Because that will factor into -- you know, a 9 possibility of another way to solve our EMS issue is to have 10 at some point satellite offices for EMS service. If you're 11 going to have -- if you're going to have any reasonable 12 times, you're going to have to change the way it works. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't know what the cost of 15 that will be, and that's a factor in the whole thing, too. 16 Of course, those of us that choose to live where we live know 17 that, you know, -- 18 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's right. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- you can expect that it's 20 going to take a while for -- to get there. 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I was just going to say on 22 the airport, as far as the governance issue, I agree with you 23 100 percent. You know, I've sat back in my previous position 24 and seen how that process -- where we've gone to. And, you 25 know, just sitting in now on the Airport Board and watching 1-24-11 124 1 how they're functioning is absolutely -- it's wonderful to 2 see how they're doing and operating at the airport. So, 3 we've got some good folks on the Airport Board that are -- 4 it's working, and those things are doing very, very good, and 5 I support that effort. I agree with you on that. Again, as 6 far as the funding issue as well, I'm right along with you. 7 If they want to fund half of it and they want to come on, you 8 know, do that. But I stand totally 100 percent right where 9 you are on the Airport Board. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: I think we've got pretty good 11 guidance at this point on the parameters that we want to set. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, we kind of will work on our 13 respective areas and get them to Jody to make one package. 14 Then you can send it over to them with a cover letter. Is 15 that the plan? 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm going to go ahead -- I 17 intend to meet with the City Manager on my -- on the stuff 18 that I, you know, have as liaison. I don't mind going 19 toe-to-toe with him and telling him exactly what -- you know, 20 what I see the issues are, and whether they want to continue 21 with having us be -- doing that service, or whether they need 22 to -- they think they can do it better. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My understanding was just they 24 wanted -- or we agreed to send profiles over at the end of 25 this week, and then start meetings. I agree, and I'd like to 1-24-11 125 1 go with you on those that we're doing jointly. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the other -- I think we 4 didn't really talk much about Environmental Health, but that 5 does need to be on the table with them a little bit. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And -- 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Because from what I found 9 out, they really don't have a certified code enforcement over 10 there to do some of the stuff that Ray has the certifications 11 to do, and does well. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I know that Commissioner 14 Baldwin and I, maybe others, are working on some just overall 15 data as -- as to the services that we provide to the 16 residents county-wide. Where it becomes an issue every time 17 we get in discussion with the City is, you know, the -- the 18 jail, the courts, the District Clerk, County Clerk, Tax 19 Assessor. A majority -- almost all those offices are done 20 for all county residents, and that seems to be forgotten many 21 times. I think it's -- with the help of the Auditor, we're 22 kind of quantifying how much money, what percent of our 23 budget goes to those services. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: A significant portion. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 1-24-11 126 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, we've got our guidance. Let's 2 go to 23; consider, discuss, take appropriate action on 3 retainage belonging to Kendnel Kasper Construction pursuant 4 to construction contract on Sheriff's Office annex. We've 5 got the retainage in the amount of 88,000-plus that we've 6 withheld, actually since September, I guess. And I think the 7 30 days ran day before yesterday, if I'm not mistaken. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Ended? 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, something like that. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Day before yesterday? 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, our 30-day retainage. So, 12 that period is up. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, our 88,000, let's see, 14 that should buy the Sheriff's fingerprint thing. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is Buzzie's open? 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I mean, I understand -- we 18 were out there the other day, and I saw there's still some 19 leaks in the roof. How do we handle that? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Do you want to address this, 21 Mr. Steinruck? 22 MR. STEINRUCK: As of today, we have taken care of 23 all that. Kendnel was there Friday with them, and then we've 24 got the two subs that were responsible for some of those 25 leaks, and they've taken care of those at this moment -- at 1-24-11 127 1 this morning. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How do we know until it rains? 4 MR. STEINRUCK: We can get out there with a water 5 hose and hose it down, or -- but I think we've got them. 6 Again, it's still under warranty. It's our responsibility to 7 fix those. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's the warranty on that 9 roof? 10 MR. STEINRUCK: It's a one-year warranty. But, you 11 know, if it's still the same thing constantly, we'll still 12 come back and keep fixing it. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The other question I have -- 14 and I talked to our Maintenance about it a little bit. I'm 15 not sure if it's your responsibility or they're doing it, but 16 to me, it's -- when you walk out of the doors on the -- 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: South side. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, actually both sides. You 19 walk out in the middle, there's no railing in front of you. 20 There's kind of a little angle there, and you almost fall 21 face first off that -- the landing. And I talked to 22 Maintenance about getting railings up there, and I can't 23 remember if that was something that he's responsible for or 24 y'all were responsible for, but if y'all were responsible for 25 it, I think that needs to be done. 1-24-11 128 1 MR. STEINRUCK: Do you want to talk about that? 2 MR. LEWIS: Yeah. We had discussed having railings 3 in front of those doors. The code requires a railing where a 4 dropoff is 30 inches or greater. We don't have that 5 condition at those locations. We had discussed this with the 6 Judge at the end of construction, and the decision was made 7 not to provide railings. We had some sketches for those, and 8 I guess the decision was deferred to see if there was really 9 a need for those. And we talked about maybe doing some 10 landscaping there, but that hasn't happened yet. So -- and 11 maybe some landscaping at those locations would also be a 12 deterrent, but we -- we identified those as potential issues, 13 discussed them, I think, appropriately, and a decision was 14 made to defer that construction. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. So, that answers my 16 question. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: They're not obligated to do it. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tim will do it, 'cause I think 19 they are definitely needed. I think it's very, very 20 dangerous. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There is a lot of slope. 22 There's more slope than -- it's like it goes out flat, and -- 23 almost flat, and it -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It does. It does do that. And 25 I understand the reason for that. 1-24-11 129 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Quite a bit of angle to it. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You have these guys from 3 Comfort, you know, -- 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Maybe that should be a -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- that come out of there, 6 and I saw him come out the other day; he and I were together 7 and came out, and he almost -- 8 MR. LEWIS: Made it over the edge. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- made it over the edge. 10 Of course, I was pushing him, but... (Laughter.) But I 11 agree with Jon; I think there's something needs to go up 12 there. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Maintenance -- it's just a 14 matter of getting pipes and painting them. 15 MR. LEWIS: And matching the handrails already on 16 those ramps and other steps. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Same diameter. I think it can 18 be done pretty inexpensively by Maintenance. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: There was one other leak I 20 talked with Kendnel about Friday when we were there on the 21 east side of that building above those air-conditioners -- or 22 west side of the building above the air-conditioner units 23 outside. There is a vent in there that kind of vents that 24 attic, and they were telling me some of the water that leaked 25 in through one of the investigator's offices is coming from 1-24-11 130 1 that vent. And not that it's put in different or something, 2 but that it doesn't really have kind of a shield -- cover 3 over that outside, so when you get a blowing wind, it's going 4 to come in there. Well, it's done it once already at least. 5 You know, we haven't had much -- much rain, and I worry about 6 it going through that wall. I don't know if there should be 7 that cover on there, if that's something else Maintenance is 8 going to -- 9 MR. STEINRUCK: I believe there was some type of 10 opening in there. They were supposed to have fixed that this 11 morning also. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. I don't know. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. I make a motion we 14 release the retainage. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 17 approval of the agenda item to release retainage. Question 18 or discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by 19 raising your right hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Okay. Item 24 24 is an executive session item. Let's go to Section 4 of 25 the -- 1-24-11 131 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, is Item 22 an 2 executive as well? 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Pending or possible -- well -- 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We're going to pass that, 5 because that issue is -- there's going to be a meeting 6 between the person that is on the agenda and our counsel that 7 we authorized last meeting on Wednesday. So, -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- I don't know what's going 10 to come out of that yet, but I guess I'll -- I just put it on 11 this agenda as a safeguard. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, we're going to defer on that. 13 Let's go to Item 4, payment of the bills. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, I move we pay the bills. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to pay the 17 bills. Question or discussion? All in favor of the motion, 18 signify by raising your right hand. 19 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 21 (No response.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carried. Do we have any 23 budget amendments? 24 MS. HARGIS: No. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Do we have -- we have two late 1-24-11 132 1 bills. One was the retainage to Kendnel Kasper which was 2 just approved; it's ready for payment. The other late bill 3 is to Anderson Steadham, dealing with the construction 4 services out at the -- out at the Sheriff's Office Annex. 5 That's been approved by the Sheriff, the supervising 6 architect, and he's ready for payment. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How much is it? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: It's $19,549. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That takes care of all of 10 that? 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, one more payment after 12 that. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just thought I'd ask, Rusty. 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And then there's one I just 15 gave her on the FitForce; that's the first of three payments 16 in that contract. 17 MS. HARGIS: They require $6,250 up front to start 18 the study for the training. 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That total was 25, again, 20 wasn't it? 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 25. 22 MS. HARGIS: 25,000. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Three separate payments. 24 MS. HARGIS: But before they begin work, they 25 require a check. 1-24-11 133 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Approval of the contract approves 2 the up-front payment, I would think. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Just making sure, Judge. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 5 MS. HARGIS: We'll do another late bill for that. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: That would be classified as a late 7 bill? Okay. Do I hear a motion for approval of the late 8 bills? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 10 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'll second. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for the 12 payment of the late bills as indicated. Question or 13 discussion? All in favor, signify by raising your right 14 hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 17 (No response.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. We have monthly 19 reports. Kerr County Treasurer for December 2010; Monthly 20 Investment Report for December 2010 from Patterson 21 Associates; Justice of the Peace, Precinct 4; Justice of the 22 Peace, Precinct 1; Justice of the Peace, Precinct 2; 23 Constable, Precinct 4; Constable, Precinct 3; and Road and 24 Bridge paving project. Do I hear a motion that the indicated 25 reports be approved as presented? 1-24-11 134 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that the 4 indicated reports be approved as presented. Question or 5 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 6 your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Reports from 11 Commissioners in connection with their liaison assignments. 12 Commissioner 1? 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir. Thank you. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Two? 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Just briefly, this Wednesday 16 I will be attending my first AACOG meeting all day on 17 Wednesday down in San Antonio. I also wanted to let the 18 Commissioners know that on February 9th through the 11th, 19 we'll be having an economic delegation go to Washington, D.C. 20 That will be the 9th through the 11th, and wanted to let you 21 know that that was coming up, and we'll be going, and been 22 asked to go on that trip with that representation. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? 24 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: No. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Letz? 1-24-11 135 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't think I have anything. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Oehler? 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: New outdoor arena and 4-H 4 Horse Club. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This doesn't sound good. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Do I sound excited or what? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I was hoping that was just a 8 rumor. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I don't think it is a 10 rumor. I think that we -- we have some issues -- or 11 evidently 4-H does with us. They seem like they're going to 12 want to abandon ship and go to Fredericksburg instead of 13 using our new facility, because it doesn't have lights. And, 14 you know, I don't know -- I told the person that asked me 15 about it, that confirmed that she had been told by the 4-H 16 Horse Club group that that's what was happening and we need 17 to get some lights up out there, "Well, I don't know that we 18 want to spend the kind of money it takes to put permanent 19 lights up to light that arena until we know for sure or have 20 some idea that we're not going to find dollars to cover it 21 with in the near future." Which we need to get on if we're 22 going to do it. Either that, or we need to plan on building 23 some bleachers and doing some things to complete that, and 24 where it is usable at night. But not necessarily for the 4-H 25 Horse Club having priority, because they had -- they had the 1-24-11 136 1 ability to use the old outdoor arena all last summer, and it 2 had lights in it. And I had Tim and them to plow it and 3 water it prior to the nights that it was supposed to be used, 4 and to my knowledge, I believe there were two times that 5 there was one horse in that arena, 'cause I went and checked. 6 And when I didn't check, I had them check and see if there 7 had been any horses in there. And so, you know, I'm probably 8 going to be a little bit more hard-headed toward the 4-H 9 Horse Club whenever they come and want us to do things for 10 them whenever they refuse to do things that -- you know, to 11 use -- use the facility whenever they claim that they use it 12 all the time, and that's not the case. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I might add just a comment to 14 that, is that members of that group were present at every 15 design meeting for that facility, and -- or I won't say 16 every -- certainly the majority of design meetings for that 17 facility, and were very -- they liked it. They liked the 18 plan. They liked the whole plan. They were aware that 19 lights would be coming, but not necessarily right away. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, anyway, that will be 21 something I'll be kind of working on to the best of my 22 ability, and also trying to figure out some way to get 23 funding to cover that thing, 'cause Peter told us it's about 24 three-quarters of a million is what we need to complete the 25 concession, bleachers, lights, cover, the whole bit, and I 1-24-11 137 1 hope we can find that from somebody. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: But, anyway, that just being 4 one. And then, of course, I always am in touch with Animal 5 Control and Environmental Health. Ray has quite a few issues 6 going at any given time. I gave another one to him last week 7 to work on. But that's about my report. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Well, I hope the 4-H horse 9 people are happy over at Fredericksburg in the interim. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, I would say that I hope 11 they are too. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Based upon the number of times they 13 used their own arena here, they're probably not going to burn 14 up a lot of fuel going to Fredericksburg, are they? 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'll say, Bruce, the other 16 thing I just wanted to say, just talking about finding those 17 additional funds, I agree with you 100 percent. The 18 opportunity -- this Commissioners Court has looked at the 19 potential expansion of the ag facilities and the complex, and 20 it needs to be looked at seriously again right now and in 21 moving forward and trying to do that and finding those funds 22 to do it. And, again, I think when we came out of what we 23 came out of this last week with the stock show and those 24 things, and what we can attract here with the other types of 25 conventions that can come in here, or other facility 1-24-11 138 1 associational meetings, I'm 100 percent behind you on how we 2 need to find some funds to make this complex move forward. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: You're talking about the whole 5 master plan. 6 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: The whole master plan. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We can do probably three 8 times the good with a third of the money that was proposed to 9 do a convention center. 10 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: That's exactly right. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: At a fraction of the cost of 13 what was looked at. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Reports from elected 15 officials? 16 MS. BOLIN: How about this one? 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Tax Assessor. 18 MS. BOLIN: I just wanted to let y'all know that we 19 are at 68.48 percent of collections, which is up 1.68 percent 20 from last year. 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: How much is it up? 22 MS. BOLIN: 1.68. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's good news. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: With the last big -- the big 25 one yet to come here at the end of the month, and probably by 1-24-11 139 1 Friday. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Sheriff, what's the population at 3 the jail? Just answer the question. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I got two things. One, it's 5 about 140, 142 this morning. We're up a little bit. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Uh-oh, he's up again. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Don't know what to tell you 8 there, other than it is -- but the other possible good news 9 that's not totally confirmed, we did get notice from the FBI. 10 I think y'all know that pretty well our most wanted person 11 that we have dates back to the double homicide that occurred 12 off Goat Creek Road area several years ago where we had two 13 females raped and murdered out there, and we've been hunting 14 that illegal alien ever since then. Word we got last week 15 through the FBI is that man is incarcerated in Mexico, 16 looking at a 30-year prison term in Mexico for a rape and 17 murder he did down there during 2010. I've always said I 18 thought that the man was a serial rapist and murderer. But I 19 -- so what that means is, we never waived the death sentence 20 on him because of the seriousness and the issues with that. 21 So, we did send down the paperwork, and I think you'll 22 recall, the District Attorney at that time, Ron Sutton, his 23 office and them went to Mexico City, filed everything there 24 to where they would prosecute him in Mexico for our crime up 25 here. I don't see any of that happening at this time, 1-24-11 140 1 because they've got their own crime on him, and I don't 2 believe there is any good time in a Mexican prison. 3 So, we're looking at it, looking at what is the 4 possibility, if we do waive the death sentence, of 30 years 5 from now bringing him back and giving him -- you know, trying 6 him on our case here, which is a DNA case, and I think it's 7 an excellent case. That it would not necessarily be a 8 capital murder trial that Kerr County would have to face and 9 that, expense wise, but yet keep that man locked up for the 10 rest of his life in prison, is what we're kind of hoping. 11 So, we'll just have to see how it plays out. And the FBI 12 wanted to wait a little bit, let him get through their 13 sentencing down there. Then, through the D.A.'s office, 14 we'll try and get some DNA samples; Mexico will do it for us. 15 Dealing with another country's going to be interesting in 16 doing this, but hopefully to get that case totally wrapped 17 up. But it is a -- a good feeling that no -- that he is in 18 custody, at least. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Is there a way that you're aware of 20 that we can place a detainer on him? 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's what we're -- 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Subject to release? 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: All these things we're trying 24 to check in Mexico, dealing with a second country. You know, 25 that's -- it's all new. We're going to try and do it, but 1-24-11 141 1 they wanted to try him first on their case, so that's what 2 they did. So, we're going to have to wait and see. I'm just 3 glad to know he's not running the streets. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Buster, jails down there 5 aren't as nice as they are here, are they? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No -- I don't know. 7 (Laughter.) 8 MS. BOLIN: Almost got him. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sounds like you guys got an 10 issue, to me. We probably need to give him some counseling. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah, he probably needs some 12 of that counseling, Buster. We can give him some counseling. 13 But that's kind of where we're at on almost everything. I 14 think everything else is going all right. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Any other elected 16 official? Department head? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You'll have to talk to Pat 18 about that. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, my response is, "I don't 20 remember." 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's right. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: I thought that would be yours, too. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. At this time, we will go out 25 of public or open session for the purpose of going into 1-24-11 142 1 executive session to consider Item 24. 2 (The open session was closed at 12:16 p.m., and an executive session was held, the transcript of which 3 is contained in a separate document.) 4 - - - - - - - - - - 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. It's 12:44. We're back in 6 open or public session. Does any member of the Court have 7 anything to offer with respect to matters discussed in 8 executive session? Anything else to come before the Court 9 this morning -- this afternoon? We're adjourned. 10 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 12:44 p.m.) 11 - - - - - - - - - - 12 13 STATE OF TEXAS | 14 COUNTY OF KERR | 15 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 16 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 17 official reporter for the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 18 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 19 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 28th day of January, 20 2011. 21 22 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 23 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 24 Certified Shorthand Reporter 25 1-24-11