1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Special Session 10 Monday, January 23, 2012 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 GUY R. OVERBY, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X January 23, 2012 2 PAGE 3 --- Commissioners' Comments 6 4 1.1 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for final approval of alternate plat for Lots 246 B-1 5 and 246 B-2 of B & R Ranches, Precinct 2 13 6 1.2 Consider/discuss and take appropriate action to reduce registration fee to $1 during rabies drive 7 February 4-18, 2012 14 8 1.3 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to close animal shelter to the public during the 9 hours of 8am - 11am on Tuesdays & Thursdays 15 10 1.4 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to allow Kerr County Animal Control to go to 11 euthanasia by injection 17 12 1.5 Consider/discuss, approve resolution for the submission of General Victim Assistance-Direct 13 Services Program grant proposal for 2012-2013 19 14 1.6 Consider/discuss, approve resolution for the submission of Youth Averted from Delinquency (YAD) 15 program to be contracted with local B.C.F.S. affiliate for 2012-2013 20 16 1.9 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for 17 American Legion Auxiliary Unit 208 fourth annual "Here’s to the Heroes" Easter Fest & Cookoff event 18 April 6-7, 2012 at Flat Rock Lake Park 24 19 1.7 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to authorize Environmental Health Director, Ray 20 Garcia, to fill OSSF Inspector position at current budget Step 17/Grade 3 39 21 1.8 Annual report from Kerr County Historical 22 Commission 41 23 1.10 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on Kerrville Veterans Administration Hospital update 24 regarding possible development of 100 housing units on local V.A. property for use of assisting 25 seniors/veterans with low-income housing 45 3 1 I N D E X (Continued) January 23, 2012 2 PAGE 1.11 Public Hearing on Order Adopting Rules of Kerr 3 County, Texas, for On-Site Sewage Facilities 54 4 1.12 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve Order Adopting Rules of Kerr County, 5 Texas, for On-Site Sewage Facilities; new order to supersede all previous orders 55 6 1.13 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 7 approve on behalf of Kerr County the estoppel agreement between Joseph L. Kennedy Enterprises 8 and Kerrville-Kerr County Airport Board; authorize County Judge to sign same 57 9 1.14 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 10 purchase items for Upper Turtle Creek school building, flooring & furniture, for total cost 11 of $5,500 59 12 1.17 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on reallocation of funds remaining in 2008 & 2010 13 bond issues 62 14 1.18 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve plan for capital improvements at Hill 15 Country Youth Exhibit Center 68 16 1.15 Presentation by Ray Watson with K.E.D.C. regarding Fox Tank Company 73 17 1.16 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 18 approve economic incentives package for Fox Tank Company as recommended by board of 19 directors of K.E.D.C. 84 20 1.19 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on list of capital items for new tax anticipation note 86, 21 105 1.21 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 22 request from Kerrville Area Chamber of Commerce to use Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center for 23 KerrFest on August 10 & 11, 2012 95 24 1.22 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to waive rental fees for tables & chairs for 25 KerrFest, to be held August 10 & 11, 2012 102 4 1 I N D E X (Continued) January 23, 2012 2 PAGE 3 1.23 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to allow closure of Riverside Drive from 5 p.m. 4 on August 10, 2012, to 1 a.m. on August 12, 2012, for KerrFest 2012 103 5 1.20 Consider/discuss and take appropriate action to 6 accept recommendations and award bids for the Clean Water State Revolving Fund Grant for the 7 planning phase for Center Point Wastewater Collection System for legal services, engineering 8 services, financial advisor services, and bond attorney 210 9 1.24 Consider/discuss, take appropriate account on 10 contract with Dailey, Rabke & Gondeck, PLLC, for architectural services for new jail facility 212 11 1.25 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 12 approve license agreement with Pictometry International Corp.; authorize County Judge 13 to sign same 216 14 1.26 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to adopt resolution regarding Aqua Texas proposed 15 rate increase 218 16 1.27 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on personnel matters involving Environmental Health 17 Department 224 18 4.1 Pay Bills 228 4.2 Budget Amendments 228 19 4.3 Late Bills 229 4.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 231 20 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee 21 Assignments 231 5.2 Reports from Elected Officials/Department Heads 233 22 --- Adjourned 235 23 24 25 5 1 On Monday, January 23, 2012, at 9:00 a.m., a special 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. 8 Let me call to order this regularly scheduled meeting of the 9 Kerr County Commissioners Court posted and scheduled for this 10 date and time, Monday, January the 23rd, 2012, at 9 a.m. 11 It's just a tad past that right now. If you would, please, 12 if you'd stand, join me in a moment of prayer, as well as the 13 pledge of allegiance to the flag of our country. 14 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Please be seated. At 16 this time, if there's any member of the audience or public 17 that wishes to be heard on a matter which is not a listed 18 agenda item, this is your opportunity to come forward and 19 tell us what's on your mind. If you wish to be heard on an 20 agenda item, we'd prefer that you fill out a participation 21 form. Should be some at the rear of the room. This helps me 22 be aware that there is someone that wishes to be heard on a 23 particular agenda item, and helps me in making sure I don't 24 overlook you. However, if you wish to be heard on an agenda 25 item and have not filled out a participation form, that's 1-23-12 6 1 okay, too. When we get to that item, just get my attention 2 in some manner, and I'll give you the opportunity to be 3 heard. But right now, if there's any member of the audience 4 or public that wishes to be heard on any matter which is not 5 a listed agenda item, this is your opportunity to come 6 forward and tell us what's on your mind. Seeing no one 7 coming forward or otherwise seeking to be recognized, we will 8 move on. Commissioner Baldwin? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, Judge. Just 10 wanted to let you guys know that I've notified the state ESD 11 association, which -- there really is one, by the way. And, 12 -- and I'm trying to find someone from their organization 13 that will come here and make a presentation to us. I think 14 that we're at that point. And in my discussion, I need to 15 know from them how long that presentation would be so that we 16 -- do we want to do it in this setting, or do we want to do 17 it in a workshop type setting? So, I would imagine workshop. 18 It would be a 20-, 30-minute long thing. But, anyway, we're 19 at that point, and I'm going to keep pushing it till we -- 20 till we at least get that done, and see what's the next step 21 down the road. Great stock show. That's all. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Overby? 23 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Judge, again, just following 24 up on what Commissioner Baldwin said, great stock show last 25 week. Good to see lots of kiddoes out there, and family 1-23-12 7 1 members out there, and just everything was very positive out 2 there. Heard a lot of good comments. I know we're going to 3 talk later on in the agenda items today about some of those 4 comments later on today as we look at budgeting out there. A 5 couple of other things I'd like to just bring to attention. 6 Commissioner Baldwin and I attended on Martin Luther King an 7 event with the Dream Team organization here in town; had a 8 breakfast out there and celebrated that holiday. Good 9 organization; they are putting that together. Glad to see 10 that happening. I know they'll be wanting to have that grow 11 in coming years, and we went out and celebrated that day and 12 that holiday with the Dream Team organization here locally. 13 I also wanted to let the Commissioners know that last week, I 14 did attend an AARPO meeting, our Alamo Area Regional Planning 15 Organization. We're already initially looking at projects 16 for the 2016 year out in rural communities. So, it's -- 17 again, it's an initial meeting, but we'll have future 18 meetings over the next couple of months. Just wanted to give 19 you those updates. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that it? 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yes, sir. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Letz? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: A couple items I do want to 24 bring up specifically on the stock show. Basically, one is a 25 comment on one of the individuals that came up -- I don't 1-23-12 8 1 know; somebody else was near me when it happened. Ray Watson 2 came up, and all he saw was dollar signs in his eyes, which 3 was a good thing. He just couldn't get over the number of 4 people there. And the -- he was just saying, basically, "My 5 god, I had no idea how -- the economic impact of this. My 6 god, I had no idea the economic impact of this." And he 7 repeated that probably 20 times, which was -- is true; the 8 economic impact to the community is huge at that show. And 9 the other thing is that, you know, I, over the years, have 10 thanked the Stock Show Association for their work, but this 11 year -- and primarily 'cause I've been, like the rest of the 12 Court, announcing for years and involved with it, but I had 13 the opportunity to be more involved this year than usual, 14 'cause my son was showing for the first time. And I really 15 want to, you know, compliment that organization, the amount 16 of work that goes into everything, the details, from 17 organizing what pens are reserved for what county to figuring 18 out how to get all these animals weighed in, and -- and 19 dealing with all that, and the details of flooring, you know, 20 figuring out floor prices and setting up the sale and 21 coordinating with Gillespie Livestock to get the trailers in 22 and out. It's unbelievable the amount that goes on behind 23 the scenes that the average person, unless you're out there 24 showing, really doesn't see. So, I really want to thank this 25 organization for the work they do. And the final thing is, 1-23-12 9 1 that those that drive Highway 27 a lot remember that Hermann 2 Sons Road, there was a TexDOT project to widen the road, and 3 probably some of the worst paving ever came out of that -- 4 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- at that time. And I know 6 there's -- I received a lot of complaints, and I referred 7 them all to TexDOT. I guess they worked, because they have 8 resurfaced that road after three months of being out there, 9 and it's a much smoother -- better job now. That's it. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Oehler? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, same thing with the 12 stock show group. A lot of people do not realize how much 13 work and effort goes into that. It basically starts the day 14 it's over till the next year. And, you know, I think that 15 everything worked smoother this year than it ever has. You 16 know, the parking situation, where we've opened up both those 17 parks and closed them down for them to stage and to load and 18 unload, and -- and just all the little stuff that we -- we 19 can help them with. We had water put on the field the other 20 day; it was a dust bowl out there, the parking lot. Road and 21 Bridge cooperated real quickly to put a couple loads of water 22 down two different days. And the poor guys standing out 23 there directing traffic were about to smoother from the dust, 24 and -- but I will say that when -- when I got there Friday 25 morning, the parking lot was completely full. People were 1-23-12 10 1 having a hard time finding a place to park, and I think 2 that's the largest crowd I've ever seen. I think weather had 3 a lot to do with that. You know, if it's cold and drizzly or 4 whatever, a lot of people tend to stay home. But, wow, what 5 a group. I got pictures of some of that to put with our 6 little promo on the renovation and the expansion, and just 7 showing how many kids and how many parents and people were in 8 those buildings. It was just standing room only. And I look 9 forward to talking more about that later in the meeting. 10 Also attended -- I went to a meeting last 11 Wednesday, I believe, or Thursday at the Kerr Wildlife, and 12 it'll be an item that will be brought back at a later 13 meeting. But they want to talk about doing some -- some 14 overhaul of our burning -- outdoor burning rules, and I will 15 get with Rob and we'll work on that. I've got the language 16 to find what they want changed in it. Lots of other things, 17 but not necessary to mention at this time. But it was a 18 wonderful experience this year with the stock show, and those 19 people are very supportive of what we're trying to do, and I 20 had numerous people come up to me and say, you know, how they 21 felt like it was finally something going to happen. Anyway, 22 that's it. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, he mentioned fire. 24 There's one thing I do want to -- I'm sure the paper will do 25 an article on it, but U.G.R.A. is hosting a fire preparedness 1-23-12 11 1 seminar, and I think the 20 -- 30th or -- 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 30th, I think. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 30th, I think. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 5:30. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 5:30 at U.G.R.A. I know 6 Representative Hilderbran is going to be there, folks from 7 the Forest Service. It sounds like a really good program. 8 I'd encourage everyone to go, and for the press to certainly 9 publicize it, because if we do go into another dry spring 10 like we had, I think they'll have a lot of good information 11 and public awareness on brush control. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Monday, the 30th, at 5:30. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you, sir. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll be there. I've already 15 made arrangements to go. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, that's it. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm glad to hear that the lights 18 finally came on among economic development people. It -- it 19 makes a tremendous impression when you're out there to see 20 the amount of activity that's going on at this show. I 21 arrived before 8 o'clock on Friday morning, and there was -- 22 it was extremely difficult finding a place to park. The 23 entire east parking lot -- the polo field, as some of you 24 know it -- that was full. The parking area immediately west 25 of the building all the way over to River Star was full. Of 1-23-12 12 1 course, the front had been full for some time. It was a real 2 challenge finding a place to park. You get in the building, 3 and there's literally wall-to-wall people. Stock show people 4 indicated to me preliminarily that the number of entries was 5 down slightly, but the number of people sure wasn't down. I 6 think it may well have been the weather, but a lot of those 7 folks that come there, they're going to be there good weather 8 or bad; doesn't make any difference. But it was literally 9 crawling with people the whole time, and it was really a 10 sight to be thankful for. 11 And I'm glad to see that our E.D. people are really 12 getting the message that this is a tremendous economic engine 13 for this county, and hopefully there'll be more recognition 14 of that at the levels that -- where it needs to be in order 15 that we can get the proper support that we need. But it was 16 a great event. Don't know how long the auction went. I 17 haven't gotten any reports on that yet, or what the -- what 18 the results of the auction are, but I know there were a lot 19 of buyers there, and a lot of them were expressing the fact 20 that we need to -- we need to prop up the bottom end of this 21 thing, as so often that they do. So, it was a great event. 22 I want to keep having it here. And the comments I got about 23 our preliminary plan to go forward at this time with the new 24 show barn were enthusiastically received, and everybody wants 25 to see that happen, at least that made any comments to me. I 1-23-12 13 1 haven't had a single comment about -- that we don't need it. 2 Most of the comments I hear is, "Well, it's about time. 3 We've only needed it for 15 years." So, we're glad so see 4 that happen. 5 Let's get on with our agenda, if we might. The 6 first item is a 9 o'clock timed item; to consider, discuss, 7 and take appropriate action for final approval on the 8 alternate plat for Lots 246B-1 and 246B-2 of B & R ranches 9 located in Precinct 2. Mr. Odom? 10 MR. ODOM: Good morning. 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Morning. 12 MR. ODOM: Mr. and Mrs. Davis own Lot 246-B of 13 B & R Ranches. It was an unofficial plat that was never 14 approved by Commissioners Court, but was filed under Volume 15 1, Page 103A, which is an old one. If you have any questions 16 about this particular circumstances, Lee Voelkel is here to 17 answer any questions we have about the unofficial plat for 18 B.R. -- B & R Ranches. Mr. and Mrs. Davis would like to 19 divide Lot 246B into lot 246B-1, 8.01 acres, and Lot 246B-2 20 into 6.93 acres under the alternate plat process. O.S.S.F. 21 has reviewed and approved and signed the approval form. So, 22 at this time, we ask the Court for their final approval 23 regarding the alternate plat for Lots 246B-1 and 246B-2 of 24 B & R Ranches, Precinct 2. 25 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Motion made. 1-23-12 14 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay, motion made for final 3 approval of the alternate plat for Lots 246B-1 and 246B-2 of 4 the B & R Ranches. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second for 7 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion on that 8 motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 9 right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 12 (No response.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Item Number 14 2, a 9:10 timed item; consider, discuss, and take appropriate 15 action to reduce registration fee to $1 during the rabies 16 drive February 4th through 18th of this year. Ms. Whitt. 17 MS. WHITT: Good morning. I have spoken to Dr. 18 Leifeste, and he's talked to all of the other vets to go 19 ahead and do the rabies drive this year. Dr. McBride will be 20 at the Ingram Fire Department. Dr. Leifeste will be at the 21 Center Point Fire Department. Dr. Chabira will be at the 22 community center -- Cypress Creek Community Center, and 23 Dr. Cardwell will be at the Turtle Creek Fire Department this 24 year. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 1-23-12 15 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 4 approval of the agenda item. Further question or discussion? 5 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 6 hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Item 3, a 11 9:15 timed item, is to consider, discuss, and take 12 appropriate action to close the animal shelter to the public 13 during the hours of 8 a.m. to 11 a.m. Tuesdays and Thursdays. 14 Ms. Whitt? 15 MS. WHITT: I am requesting your approval to close 16 the shelter during those times. That would allow for 17 uninterrupted staff meetings, quarantine transports to the 18 vet, picture taking for Pet Finder pictures. There's a lot 19 of things that we are just not able to get done when the 20 public is in and out with the amount of staff that we 21 currently have. And we did do this at one point back when I 22 started in '96, for -- I believe it was five years we -- we 23 did that, and it worked very well. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Janie, is this a time that 25 generally is not very busy? 1-23-12 16 1 MS. WHITT: No, we're not very busy in the mornings 2 at all. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think she picked Tuesdays 4 and Thursdays for that very reason. I think the next agenda 5 item will probably address that other part of it. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Do you customarily try and do your 7 euthanasia activities during those early morning hours? 8 MS. WHITT: Yes. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: On Tuesday and Thursday? 10 MS. WHITT: That would also allow for that. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: And protect the public from that 12 process, as it were? 13 MS. WHITT: Correct. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, another thing is she's 16 not -- they'll still be responding to calls. 17 MS. WHITT: Yeah, we'll still have officers -- 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That won't be affected. This 19 will just be the staff that needs to be there to do what 20 needs doing at the shelter. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Just relates to the shelter 22 operations? 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. 24 MS. WHITT: Correct. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Does not relate to the 1-23-12 17 1 service that's outside the shelter. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move approval to close the 3 animal shelter from 8 a.m. to 11 a.m. on Tuesdays and 4 Thursdays. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 7 approval as indicated. Question or discussion? All in 8 favor, signify by raising your right hand. 9 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 11 (No response.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Item 4, a 13 9:20 timed item; to consider, discuss, take appropriate 14 action to allow Kerr County Animal Control to go to 15 euthanasia by injection. Ms. Whitt? 16 MS. WHITT: Well, there's a lot of controversy over 17 this, and I would ask for your approval to allow us to start 18 euthanizing by injection, rather than using the chamber. The 19 chamber is old, and there really isn't anyone out there any 20 more that will service our chamber. And I believe without 21 someone servicing it, it could be -- it could be dangerous, 22 not just to the staff, but it could cause a problem with the 23 animals being euthanized. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do the injections cost more? 25 MS. WHITT: Actually, there -- there was a study 1-23-12 18 1 done by the Humane Society, and it's actually cheaper. What 2 I looked into is the numbers of animals that we -- that we 3 euthanize, and the cost was approximately 76 cents per animal 4 by injection, and $1.70 by carbon monoxide, so it is lower. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 6 MS. WHITT: And I do -- 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Being the time differential 8 it takes to do that? 9 MS. WHITT: Correct. Correct. And I do -- 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Takes more staff time to do 11 it. 12 MS. WHITT: There's two of us that are trained, 13 that are certified to euthanize by injection. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: I think your animal rights 15 organizations have been at the forefront advocating the 16 injection method of euthanasia also, for some time. 17 MS. WHITT: Absolutely. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 19 MS. WHITT: Absolutely. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move that we -- 21 MR. HENNEKE: Quick question. You already do do 22 some injections? 23 MS. WHITT: We do some. We do some. We currently 24 use both methods, but I'd like to go strictly to euthanasia 25 by injection. 1-23-12 19 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would make a motion that we 2 authorize Animal Control Department to go to euthanasia by 3 injection only. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Effective immediately. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Effective immediately. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and second as indicated. 8 Any question or discussion on this motion? All in favor of 9 the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 12 (No response.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Thank you, Ms. 14 Whitt. Item 5 is to consider, discuss, and approve 15 resolution for the submission of the General Victim 16 Assistance-Direct Services Program grant proposed for 17 2012-2013 to the Office of the Governor, Criminal Justice 18 Division, purpose of the grant being to fund the Kerr County 19 Crime Victims Coordinator program for another year. 20 MS. LAVENDER: Another year, yes. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Lavender. 22 MS. LAVENDER: Seven years of fun we've had. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Sorry? 24 MS. LAVENDER: I said seven years of fun we've had 25 now. That was not necessary. This is our standard grant 1-23-12 20 1 resolution that we do this time of year to apply for a grant 2 to fund the program. This has -- we are in the seventh year, 3 and so the next year will be the eighth year, if we're lucky. 4 One good thing about it is the General Victims Services line 5 of grant funding did increase last year a little bit, and 6 that's the money that's filtered from the governor's office 7 to AACOG to be divided out. And so I think we're maybe safe 8 for another year at least. So, I'd ask for approval to do 9 that. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is our part of it changed up 11 or down? 12 MS. LAVENDER: No, same 80/20 grant. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move for approval. 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'll second that. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to approve 16 the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in favor of 17 that motion, signify by raising your right hand. 18 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 19 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 20 (No response.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. The next 22 item, Number 6, is to consider, discuss, and approve 23 resolution for the submission of the Youth Averted from 24 Delinquency program to be contracted with the local -- local 25 Baptist Child and Family Services affiliate to be operated 1-23-12 21 1 for 2012-2013 year under the Juvenile Justice and Delinquency 2 Prevention grant program to the Office of the Governor, 3 Criminal Justice Division. Ms. Lavender again. 4 MS. LAVENDER: This grant has, for the last, I 5 believe, three years, been applied for directly by B.C.F.S., 6 and this year the governor changed the rules and said that a 7 nonprofit cannot apply for grants through this funding 8 stream. And so what we would propose is that the County 9 apply for it, and then contract with B.C.F.S. It means the 10 Judge will be the signer of the grant. It means that 11 Ms. Hargis will be the financial officer on the grant. And 12 B.C.F.S. will simply have to submit their bills, their 13 invoices and stuff through the County to do that. We'll have 14 to draw up a memorandum of understanding contract type thing, 15 and Mr. Henneke has agreed to assist us in doing that. But 16 we're more concerned about getting the grant first, because 17 there are continuing reductions in juvenile grant money 18 available statewide, and so until we get the grant, these 19 other details -- it's just a shifting of responsibility, is 20 basically what it is. The YAD grant provided programs -- the 21 Judge can speak more about it if you need to know -- for 22 at-risk youth in the community that are working through the 23 Kerr County Juvenile Probation Department. 24 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Do we know how much, 25 potentially, this grant is? 1-23-12 22 1 MS. LAVENDER: About 100,000. 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Thank you. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: This is one of the major resources 4 that I utilize as juvenile judge in -- in serving the 5 children that come through the juvenile justice court. All 6 indications are, statewide, at least, funding appears to be 7 being pared back for juvenile justice, and the only real 8 difference that we're looking at here is instead of Baptist 9 Child and Family Services having this grant directly and 10 doing it themselves, because we need to apply for the grant, 11 we'll just turn around and contract with those folks to, in 12 essence, have a continuation of that program. 13 MS. LAVENDER: And they have a grant writer in 14 Houston that does their grants, and she's going to write the 15 grant and then send me a copy of it before it's submitted, so 16 that we'll -- we're kept in the loop with it. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Wouldn't the -- I mean, will 18 they give us ample time for the County Attorney to review it? 19 Or -- 20 MS. LAVENDER: The grant? Or the -- 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Before it's submitted? 22 MS. LAVENDER: Do you need to review the grant? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, if we're going to 24 obligate the County, I think we need to make sure we're 25 comfortable. 1-23-12 23 1 MR. HENNEKE: I'll look at it. 2 MS. LAVENDER: We'll do that when we get it. She's 3 supposed to e-mail it to me when she finishes it, and she's 4 already in the process of writing it, so they're due the end 5 of February. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: The request of the Court today is a 7 resolution to submit the grant. It's not the grant terms or 8 agreements; that will come later. 9 MS. LAVENDER: We always have the option to pull 10 out -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 12 MS. LAVENDER: -- if it doesn't work for us. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. Wasn't -- didn't 14 you make that motion? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That was a motion, I guess. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I thought I heard you, I'm 17 sorry. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second for 19 approval of the agenda item. Further question or discussion 20 on the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by 21 raising your right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 1-23-12 24 1 MS. LAVENDER: Thank you. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to Item 9, if we might; to 3 consider, discuss, take appropriate action for the American 4 Legion Auxiliary Unit 208 fourth annual "Here's to the 5 Heroes" Easter Fest and Cookoff event scheduled for April 6 6 and 7, 2012, at Flat Rock Lake Park. Items for discussion 7 and consideration will include recommendations for vehicle 8 traffic control and security personnel for the event 9 activities scheduled for Saturday, April 7, 2012, between the 10 hours of 7:30 a.m. and 6 p.m. Commissioner Overby? 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Judge, Commissioners, if you 12 might remember, on January 9th, this agenda item was brought 13 before you on the fourth annual "Here's to the Heroes" Easter 14 Festival and Cookoff that is being organized by the American 15 Legion Auxiliary Unit 208. And on January 9th, we approved, 16 of course, at that time the overnight camping and the sale of 17 alcohol on the -- on the events that was that weekend. What 18 we had asked to come back was to go ahead and look at the -- 19 the vehicle traffic control. Now, we recall we were looking 20 at closing the entire boat ramp area, but what we have done 21 since then is we've -- we have met with security, our 22 Sheriff's Department; I'm going to have Rusty address his 23 recommendation as well. And we also had our County Attorney 24 go out with us as well to look at those avenues. The -- the 25 event -- the American Legion event for the fourth annual 1-23-12 25 1 "Here's to the Heroes" event has grown. It's -- this year 2 they're anticipating about 2,000 people this year. So, what 3 we're looking at is what is our control for vehicle traffic 4 in the park, and what are the number of security off-duty 5 personnel that should be on hand for the event? Again, the 6 event that they're requesting is from 10:00 to 6:00 on that 7 Saturday. What we are asking to be done is that the park 8 entrance would be closed with a barricade there that would 9 say, "No traffic." We are requesting a security off-duty 10 officer to be there at 7:30 that morning, prior to 11 10 o'clock, so that the dog park owners who are using the 12 park would have plenty of notice that at 10 o'clock, we'd ask 13 them to be out of the park. Either that, or they're going to 14 be in the park, because there won't be any vehicle traffic 15 beginning from 10:00 to 6:00. And, Sheriff, I'm going to 16 have you address, again, with 2000 people, again, your 17 recommendation. We did meet with the Sheriff's Department 18 that day. For 2,000 people, what would you recommend as far 19 as security that day? 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, first off, the people 21 that do use the park for their dog walking, they can't just 22 lock them in or lock them out. There's still public access. 23 I would agree with the vehicles. Our biggest concerns 24 security-wise out there is -- is just like any other event 25 where you're going to have available and served alcohol, or 1-23-12 26 1 have alcohol sold or whatever at that event. With that large 2 a crowd, there's very likely going to be some issues. And I 3 don't remember exactly what the County has on their standards 4 for security at the Ag Barn by the number of participants, 5 but I think that should -- should follow right along those 6 same lines. One issue you're going to have is, in speaking 7 with my captain who went out there with Commissioner Overby, 8 is that we are talking Easter weekend, and officers doing 9 those kind of deals are always off-duty officers. And Easter 10 weekend is a good weekend that they like to be able to spend 11 with their families. 12 So, I don't know what it would be, or the cost. 13 You know, it's up to them; I don't get involved in scheduling 14 off-duty security at any event. That's up to the individual 15 officers to do; I can't do that. But I do think that we need 16 -- they should have at least two people inside the park. I 17 think you need that where -- where the -- all the activity is 18 going. And I definitely believe you're going to have to have 19 at least one -- if you're going to try and block entry with 20 vehicles to that park, you're going to have to have one 21 around that area. I'm sure there's going to be some issues. 22 But it's something as far as whatever the County's policy is 23 in regards to security where alcohol is on county property, I 24 think it needs to be adhered to and addressed in this. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. What -- what would 1-23-12 27 1 be the difference in -- let's say someone had a private dance 2 inside a facility. I mean, what would be the difference in 3 that and -- and having a party down on the river? What is -- 4 what is the requirement -- security requirement for an inside 5 program? 6 MS. GRINSTEAD: Ours is a minimum of two officers, 7 regardless of the number, and then typically I just have the 8 sergeant that deals with K.P.D. tell me. But he's -- 9 typically, if it's over 200, it's one per 100 people, so if 10 you have 300 people, he wants three. If you have 400 people, 11 he wants four. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's probably excessive for 13 this kind of event. 14 MS. GRINSTEAD: Yeah. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't think that's what 16 we've done, especially like the stock show and that, where 17 there is alcohol. I think we had plenty -- you know, it was 18 all signed up off-duty, but it is around the clock, 'cause 19 you got to protect everything down there, protect the people, 20 and I'm not sure that that's what the County actually had in 21 their policy. We wrote some of that last year -- were 22 working at rewriting some of that, but there needs to be a 23 generalized policy. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Where are you going to park 25 everybody? 1-23-12 28 1 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's the big challenge that 2 we had going out there when we met with everybody. That's 3 one reason why we didn't close off the boat ramp, 'cause that 4 parking there, you're still going to have 150 people that can 5 park -- will park in those areas. That's a challenge. A lot 6 of them are parking up at the ag facility up there, and 7 they're walking down. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's where you got to -- 9 almost have to designate that area for parking if you -- 10 because there's not much you can do along Riverside Drive 11 there. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: And the organizers of the 13 event see the deal there. They're all supportive of the 14 security recommendations, and the -- you know, they're very 15 appreciative of what we're doing. But it's growing, and with 16 the opportunities that grow, they've got challenges that 17 they're going to have to address. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: One thing that Scott, the 19 patrol captain that went out there with you, has recommended 20 to them is they've never had any type of signage before, and 21 they definitely are going to have to have some signage out 22 there where they're going to park them up by the rodeo arena, 23 you know, or -- or where they're going to park them to direct 24 those people. There's no way even off-duty officers can 25 control it. 1-23-12 29 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, there's that gate 2 that's kind of on the east end of -- of the Exhibition Hall 3 property, between there and River Star, and that probably 4 would be a good point of entry, or point of entry at 27, and 5 have the people come down, 'cause that's the closest way to 6 get there. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, I would think you'd -- 8 east side or west side? 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: West side, I'm sorry. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You know, I think you'd, you 11 know, work with Maintenance -- Tim? Maintenance. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: There he is. 13 MR. BOLLIER: Okay, talk to me. I was asking Jody 14 a question. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Work with Maintenance to keep 16 the west gate up by the Extension Office open, and have 17 people park kind of on that side of the building, as opposed 18 to over in the rodeo arena. 19 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. Well, that's what I was asking 20 Jody, what we were having that weekend out there. And I 21 believe our favorite lady that we really all love to death 22 is -- Caroline Hanson is going to be out there that weekend. 23 So, we just -- I mean, I'm sure that we can -- they can park 24 in there too, as long as they -- where the old rodeo arena 25 used to be, they can use that for parking too. I don't see 1-23-12 30 1 why they can't. But I would be real careful about parking 2 anybody on the other side over there, you know, because 3 she's -- she's indoor arena. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, they fill up that side 5 with the dog show. 6 MR. BOLLIER: With the dog show, she's going to 7 fill that side up over there, and they use the polo field to 8 walk their dogs, and she's going to have that fence line full 9 of R.V.'s, I can tell you. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So if we kind of divide it, 11 close that gate that you have up at the front, that swing 12 gate, that these folks park on the west side -- 13 MR. BOLLIER: Mm-hmm. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- and the dog show folks park 15 on the east side. 16 MR. BOLLIER: Yeah, we can close these yellow gates 17 and force them in right there. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Force them to go straight down 19 and do a temporary barrier in the back. 20 MR. BOLLIER: They can have all of that, and then 21 the rest ought to be fine. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Put some kind of temporary 23 along the back to keep them from getting all into each other. 24 MR. BOLLIER: We can close that. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: One other thing that I would 1-23-12 31 1 suggest on this, because of the type of -- of event it's 2 going to be, and with the type, is normally off-duty officers 3 working security somewhere, they are not allowed to use 4 county equipment, because it is an off-duty private deal, and 5 we don't allow them to use their county equipment. At the Ag 6 Barn, because it's County-owned property, I do allow them to 7 use -- wear their uniform, which is issued, but that's it. 8 But an event like this, those that are working down there, I 9 really would suggest that the County authorize using at least 10 them having their individual patrol car down there at the 11 same time. I think it's going to be necessary to help 12 control that. Normally don't allow that, but I would request 13 permission from the Court to do that. 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Patrol car? 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's fine. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We also have those -- we have 19 a couple of those ATV's. That would be a lot better than a 20 patrol car in a lot of situations. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: In a lot of situations, that's 22 true, but if we have a traffic issue, I need the overheads on 23 the patrol car; I need the radio in the patrol car down that 24 low, and it's just -- that's my recommendation. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: As far as circulation through 1-23-12 32 1 the crowd -- 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Circulating through the crowd, 3 yeah, they're not going to be driving around, okay. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Be a lot easier, cover a lot 5 more territory with one of those than they can walking. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right, I agree. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Next thing you know, Tim's 8 going to want to put lights on top of his Bobcat out there. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, we won't let Tim do that. 10 I can imagine what he'd be doing. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: One at a time. 12 MR. BOLLIER: I could have put one of those little 13 spotlights up there, self-controlled, but B.J. wanted to go 14 coon hunting. I told him he couldn't do that. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Tim doesn't get red and blue 16 lights. 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: One other item to add as 18 well. In the case of inclement weather, the folks for the 19 judging issue for the event would like to have as a backup 20 the use of the exhibit hall for judging only. They just need 21 to have a backup if there's inclement weather. Again, it 22 would be judging only. That would be also part of the motion 23 that I'll make this morning as well. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What -- 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What about Ms. Hanson? 1-23-12 33 1 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: There's nobody using the 2 exhibit hall. 3 MS. GRINSTEAD: The exhibit hall is open. 4 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Thank you. 5 MR. BOLLIER: Now, the concession -- you can't have 6 the concession stand, because she has it. 7 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: No, it's only judging only. 8 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The only other thing I think 10 they should be made aware of, that if they're going to have 11 to park across and that, is I think that event needs to 12 definitely designate some areas for handicapped. 13 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: We -- 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You're going to have those 15 issues. How are you going to get them down to it? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Only thing about the exhibit 17 hall, I hope we're in a demolition phase of the hog barn 18 right about April. 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's true. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Or before. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Or before. So, I think we need 22 to -- 23 MR. BOLLIER: So, do you want somebody in there or 24 not? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not sure I want people in 1-23-12 34 1 the exhibit hall. Might want to limit it as much as we can. 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: It's not going to be touched. 3 It's going to be -- 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Cordon off the part that's 5 going to be -- 6 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: It's only for inclement 7 weather, and judging only. I mean, we're not going to have a 8 lot of folks have access to it. It'll be for the judging 9 part of it only. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Chili should get cold before 11 you park in there. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: It could be. There's no 13 telling what that weather will be like that week. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They have umbrellas. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Some of that chili's not fit 16 to eat anyway. 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. So, I would like to 18 make a motion, again, for the April -- Saturday, April 7th 19 event for the fourth annual "Here's to the Heroes" Easter 20 Festival and Cookoff sponsored by the American Legion 21 Auxiliary Unit 208, a recommendation of at least three 22 security off-duty personnel to be used at Flat Rock Lake 23 Park, with one of those officers being at the front gate that 24 will be barricaded off for the event from 10 a.m. to 6 p.m. 25 on that Saturday, with one of those off-duty policemen to be 1-23-12 35 1 there by 7:30 that morning to inform -- provide information 2 to other park users that day, and that the other two -- other 3 off-duty policemen or off-duty personnel will be in the park 4 from 10:00 to 6:00 also, with the access -- authorization to 5 use patrol cars for that day inside the park. And to also 6 use the exhibit hall as a backup for inclement weather for 7 judging only, in the case of bad weather that day. That 8 would be my motion. 9 MR. HENNEKE: And just to clarify, Commissioner, 10 'cause I was that the meeting, -- 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yes. 12 MR. HENNEKE: -- what we discussed was closing the 13 park to vehicle traffic from -- 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Vehicle traffic. 15 MR. HENNEKE: -- from 7:30 in the morning to, I 16 guess, 6 o'clock in the evening. So, the one officer would 17 be stationed at the gate, which would be closed to vehicle 18 traffic starting at 7:30. 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Correct. 20 MR. HENNEKE: And then the two other officers would 21 be required to be there by 10 o'clock to patrol the actual 22 event. 23 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What about the boat ramp 25 area? 1-23-12 36 1 MR. HENNEKE: It's not going to be -- 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Not impacted. 3 MR. HENNEKE: -- part of the closed area. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: If you're going to use the 5 park and up above, you may need more additional security, 6 'cause now you've separated it out. So, I don't know what 7 you want to do there. 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Well, I think we've looked at 9 it for this year. I think next year we'll have to look at it 10 again, as far as what the recommendations will be. But I 11 had, again, what the County Attorney has suggested as well as 12 far as the entrance closing, so I'd like to make that 13 addition to my motion as well. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, we have a motion. Do I hear a 15 second? 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I would almost second it. 17 Rusty's last recommendation, I think, is kind of important; 18 that if you have three officers down there on the river, that 19 being a part of that program, you still have a lot of 20 vehicles, and possibly this judging thing going on upstairs 21 that need -- in my mind, requires security of some sort, 22 especially the vehicles. 23 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Are you recommending 24 additional security? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I think that's what 1-23-12 37 1 he's saying. You need to have at least one at the -- 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: How many more would you 3 recommend? 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I wouldn't have any way of 5 really -- I really think we need to go back to whatever the 6 County's policy is on the Ag Barn. I thought it was pretty 7 well set before. But it's really hard for me to recommend 8 that. This is a private organization, so it's going to have 9 to pay off-duty officers, whether mine or the City's. I 10 think, you know, one of the requirements was for peace 11 officers, and not just security, before in the policy. I 12 think that's something this Court has to look at and come up 13 with on the individual events on what y'all think the number 14 of -- of that is. You know, I would -- 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Seems to me you could have 16 two in the park and one up there at the Exhibition Center. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's a cool thing. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And that would be adequate. 19 That's not a real big area. 20 MR. HENNEKE: And you need one at the gate. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, yeah, but I'm talking 22 about the one at the gate being one of the ones in the park. 23 Are you talking about four? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Four. 25 MR. HENNEKE: We've already talked about three, one 1-23-12 38 1 at the gate and two inside. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, we need one more. 3 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: At the top. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay, I'd go for that. 5 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: With that, then, with the 6 recommendation of needing to add an additional security 7 officer for the top of the parking area up there, again, my 8 motion will be for four off-duty personnel folks for the 9 event, with all the other motions that were attached to my 10 initial motion. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: This not an almost second; this is a 13 sure second? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This is the real deal right 15 here, pal. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second. I 17 trust everybody herds it. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: One other comment, really, and 19 it's not really -- I think there needs -- just make sure you 20 let the folks know that there may be some adjustment, 21 depending on what we're doing demolition-wise. 22 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Sure. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: As to accessing that area, 24 including access to the exhibit hall. I mean, I -- it 25 depends on what we're doing and what kind of -- like, if we 1-23-12 39 1 have some -- some issues, we just have to be -- 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Sure. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- aware that there may be some 4 changes there. 5 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: We'll be sure -- 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: At least they won't be 7 working on Easter weekend. 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any other questions or 10 comments on the motion? All in favor of that motion, signify 11 by raising your right hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 16 Item 7, our 9:30 item; consider, discuss, and take 17 appropriate action to authorize Environmental Health 18 Director, Ray Garcia, to fill an O.S.S.F. inspector position 19 at current budget, Step 17, Grade 3 -- actually, I think 20 that's Grade 17, Step 3, if I'm not mistaken. But the 21 position will be vacant via resignation effective 1-26-2012. 22 Mr. Garcia? 23 MR. GARCIA: Good morning. I'm going to request a 24 little something different than what was on here, still in 25 regards to the same position. I'm going to ask that I not -- 1-23-12 40 1 I'm not going to fill the position; I'm going to ask to leave 2 it open for three to five months, see how we fare down there. 3 I'm going to do some reorganization in the department and see 4 if we can still continue to provide the level of service 5 where we're at now. With the downturn of construction, we 6 have slowed a little, and I think we can -- I think I can 7 make it work with one D.R. at this time. And, like I said, 8 just do a little reorganization down there and see how far we 9 can go, and then revisit it again at a later time. I think 10 it's good for us, good for the County. And -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: If you find you need to come back 12 with this particular item, why, you're always free to bring 13 it back. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other -- any member of the Court 16 have any comments they wish to make? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir. Thank you for your 18 diligence. 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Thanks for doing that. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Ray. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'd make a comment, that it's 22 nice to see that whenever somebody sees that they don't need 23 an employee, possibly they can make it work otherwise. I 24 think that's to be commended. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: True. 1-23-12 41 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to Item 8, a 9:45 2 timed item. That's an annual report from the Kerr County 3 Historical Commission. Ms. Leonard. 4 MS. LEONARD: Good morning. 5 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Good morning. 6 MS. LEONARD: I think you all got copies of the 7 2011 report. I'll just go over some of the highlights that I 8 think we accomplished in 2011. We had three marker 9 ceremonies. Notre Dame Church, we celebrated along with 10 their 100-year anniversary. The N.O. Reynolds house in 11 Center Point, we had probably over 100 people attending that, 12 and had wonderful coverage in the newspaper. And then I 13 thought the very best one was the Penateka Indian marker in 14 Camp Verde. We had the Comanche Nation leader, Johnny Wauqua 15 from Lawton, Oklahoma. And that was really interesting, 16 because we also had Joe Davis with the Texas Rangers, and 17 they obviously were adversaries, and shook hands, and it was 18 -- it was a nice event. We have 6,200 volunteer hours, and 19 we increased our membership by 12; we're now at 44 members. 20 Also, we added a history appreciation committee, 21 which I think is going to be really good. It's -- there's 22 Kay Hayes, Joann Redden, and Mike Bowlin. They're going to 23 develop a document that can be used by 7th grade teachers to 24 instruct basic information about Kerr County, and they'll 25 organize the history of Kerr County's founders, the Guadalupe 1-23-12 42 1 River, Indian occupation, industry, educational 2 opportunities, agriculture, and other factions. And this 3 information is going to be available on the worldwide web 4 upon completion, and the teachers will be able to access this 5 information. So, I think that's going to be really a 6 wonderful addition. We were again awarded the -- the 7 distinguished service award. I think this was probably our 8 fourth year, and y'all presented it in Commissioners Court, I 9 think, in April. And I think that's about it. We appreciate 10 your funding us again this year, and we're going to have a 11 lot of great new projects to promote Kerr County history. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And this morning I passed 13 around to -- each one of you got a membership list, and I 14 just want to make a quick comment, Julie. Last week, they 15 had their, I guess, monthly meeting out at Schreiner 16 University, and it was one of the most incredible 17 presentations I have ever seen anywhere. And they videotaped 18 it, and if we can -- we need to have a Commissioners Court 19 meeting, sit here and watch this thing, 'cause that lady -- 20 she's 97. 21 MS. LEONARD: 97. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 97 years old. Sat on a 23 stool, which I find difficult, and -- (Laughter.) Hey, none 24 of that. And -- and made the greatest presentation I've ever 25 seen anybody make. 1-23-12 43 1 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: She was just absolutely 3 phenomenal. Thank you for that program. 4 MS. LEONARD: Well, the program was on Sibyl 5 Sutherland. She taught school for 30 -- I think 42 years, 6 but 32 in Kerr County. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 8 MS. LEONARD: And a remarkable memory. I believe 9 she taught Guy. 10 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: She taught me. 11 MS. LEONARD: She taught art. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We need to overlook some of 13 it, but -- (Laughter.) 14 MS. LEONARD: It did take, didn't it, Guy? 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: It was a great program. It 16 was neat to see all the different kids coming back from 17 different areas. 18 MS. LEONARD: And school teachers -- she had school 19 teachers that came from the valley when they got word that 20 she was speaking. And her son Beau said she could have gone 21 on another two hours. 22 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: She was good. 23 MS. LEONARD: That was a wonderful meeting. And -- 24 any other questions? I was going to say, we are at 44, and 25 if you have any people in your precincts, or people that you 1-23-12 44 1 think might be interested, please call me; we can always use 2 more people. So, thank you. 3 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Thank you. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We'll send this list to 5 Austin. 6 MS. LEONARD: Thank you. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, ma'am, very much. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do we need to accept the list, 9 or they just submit it and we send it, or do we have to do 10 anything on that? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think we should accept it 12 so the record shows that this actually took place. So, I 13 move that we do accept the Commission's annual report -- 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'll second that. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- to Commissioners Court. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Question 17 or discussion? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that includes the 19 membership list, correct? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Correct. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion? All 22 in favor, signify by raising your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 1-23-12 45 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. Let's go to Item 2 10; to consider, discuss, and take appropriate action on 3 Kerrville Veterans Administration Hospital update regarding 4 the possible development of 100 housing units on local V.A. 5 property for the use of assisting senior veterans low-income 6 housing updates, and report provided as a result of recent 7 discussions held with the local Hill Country Veterans Council 8 meeting on January the 17th of this year. Commissioner 9 Overby? 10 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Commissioners, I have this on 11 the agenda to talk about, of course, our local Kerrville V.A. 12 Hospital and about a possible project for low-income housing 13 for senior veterans in our community. I wanted to talk a 14 little bit about it, just give you a recap. The project has 15 changed over the last couple of years. We'll be, of course, 16 in the month of February, doing some recognition and honoring 17 our local V.A. Hospital. I know that we'll be doing 18 something -- a resolution that we plan on having on the 19 agenda sometime in February to recognize the services that 20 our hospital provides for veterans, and the employees that 21 work out there as well. But I want to update, just for 22 Commissioners Court, just for the information from that 23 meeting. Commissioner Baldwin also attended that meeting 24 that day. It was with the Hill Country Veterans Council 25 monthly meeting that was held on Tuesday, the 17th, and 1-23-12 46 1 again, it was on focusing in on the project on veterans 2 senior living, development for qualified veterans through low 3 household income earnings, and this would be a project 4 potentially built on our current V.A. property here in 5 Kerrville. 6 The report and updates from the Communities for 7 Veterans program was presented by Mr. Craig Taylor. 8 Communities for Veterans coordinates and is organized through 9 entities through the beneficial communities and affordable 10 housing solutions, and they develop similar programs like 11 this across the country. The Communities for Veterans 12 program that has made an RFP in regard to the Kerr County -- 13 for the Kerrville V.A. Hospital has other -- other sites that 14 they are also considering for looking at tax credits to do, 15 and those other states include Montana, Illinois, Ohio, New 16 York, Georgia, and here also in Kerrville. Recapping of the 17 initial program was initiated by the U.S. government 18 program -- U.S. -- United States government. In 2008, 19 efforts were focused on assisting a growing population of 20 homeless veterans across the country. A deadline of 2015 was 21 targeted to have established homeless or veterans housing 22 programs across the country in effect moving forward. 23 During that time, over 300 sites across the country 24 were identified for potential veterans housing programs, and 25 it was focused down and shortened down to 38. The list of 38 1-23-12 47 1 possible sites for the program for considerations was 2 established on December 31st, 2011. Just for your 3 information, the Communities for Veterans responded to the 4 RFP for the Kerrville/Kerr County project in September 2011. 5 The earlier veterans low-income housing in 2009, the RFP 6 focused in 2009 on homeless veterans, and in 2011, the RFP 7 has been retooled and focused on senior living for veterans 8 qualified through low-income household earnings here in 9 Kerrville. What is the project currently being considered 10 for the RFP? For your information, it is a Communities for 11 Veterans program that will focus on low-income housing for 12 senior veterans qualified through household income, their 13 earnings. 14 This particular project here in Kerrville/Kerr 15 County, the project has a scope of 100 units. The first 16 phase that they were talking about, a phase of having 80 17 units in the first one, primarily focused on individual 18 living, but also will provide enhanced services for other 19 models, assisted living needs. Remember that the Kerrville 20 V.A. already provides nursing center needs beyond the phases 21 or services being considered under this RFP plan. I will 22 note that Mr. Taylor also mentioned -- I asked him -- one of 23 the questions was what other plans or other phases that you 24 would look at. He did mention that potentially, that Phase 2 25 may have some type of -- of connection with maybe the Wounded 1-23-12 48 1 Warrior program that we've had presentations here in the 2 Commissioners Court on, and we're very familiar with across 3 our country today. 4 This project would be built on 5 acres located on 5 the Kerrville V.A. property. Basically, the boundaries of 6 what they're looking at is 5 acres near Highway 27. This 7 program or project is for veteran housing only -- program 8 only, and veteran families would be included as well. The 9 project is depending solely on the Communities for Veterans 10 to receive low-income tax credits from the U.S. government. 11 That's significantly -- if they don't receive that, this 12 project will not move forward. So, they have made 13 application for those tax credits. The decision on the 14 projects receiving those tax credits will be announced in 15 late March of 2012. The Communities for Veterans program is 16 requesting over 14 million tax dollars worth of tax credits 17 on possible eight selections. 18 Just for the project being considered here at our 19 Kerrville V.A. Hospital, the square footage of living units, 20 one bedroom would consist of 736 square feet. Two bedrooms, 21 812 square feet, and three bedrooms of 1,100 square feet. If 22 the tax -- if the tax credits are awarded to the Communities 23 for Veterans program, the estimated timeline for the project 24 will follow. March 2012, the tax credits recipients would be 25 awarded. In July of 2012, the project development would be 1-23-12 49 1 under way with those tax credits being sold, and how they're 2 going to be operated, operations and management would proceed 3 moving forward, and then November of this year, construction 4 would be under way with the project, with completion in late 5 2013. 6 The daily operations if the project moves forward 7 would employ a minimum of 10 employees that are separate from 8 the Kerrville V.A. operations. When we were there with 9 Mr. Taylor, we did have several questions -- again, we are 10 very supportive of our V.A. Hospital. Again, there's -- we 11 want to help our veterans, and obviously, our veterans that 12 are coming back from overseas right now, from Iraq and 13 Afghanistan, and trying to help them, and what is -- with 14 whatever we need to, and our Kerrville V.A. is going to play 15 a major role in that. But we did ask some questions to 16 Mr. Taylor, and I would tell you that some of those questions 17 are still being studied and will be commented on later. A 18 couple of the questions that were asked that have studies 19 been completed on the community veterans programs on other 20 similar facilities in the country to see what impact, 21 negatively or positively, it may have on local services such 22 as security, medical, schools and et cetera. I believe 23 Mr. -- Commissioner Baldwin had asked that question in some 24 form or another, and comments that came back, there hadn't 25 been any studies to inform us, if I recall. Is that what you 1-23-12 50 1 remember, Commissioner Baldwin? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is. I'd like to make a 3 comment about it. 4 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Sure. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I had spoken with Mr. Taylor 6 and let him know that this Commissioners Court is a proactive 7 group, and we're not -- we don't like to get into crisis 8 control, and that if that -- if they knew of any financial 9 impact on the county, this program, then, you know, we'd like 10 to know so that we can prepare for it. I mean, I'm not 11 talking about endorsing or denying or any of that kind of 12 stuff. I just want to know how it impacts the citizens of 13 this county so that we can get prepared for it. It's like 14 building a road. And he -- and if you remember, four or five 15 years ago, when this program was first mentioned, that's 16 exactly the same question we asked then, and still don't know 17 an answer to it. However, he did -- one thing he did, I 18 think someone asked him about in case of law enforcement 19 needed. He said something about, well, they're going to rely 20 on the city of Kerrville. So, there's an impact there, and 21 that's the kind of thing that -- that I was looking for, you 22 know. What -- what kind of impact would it have on our 23 county? And just -- they simply can't answer that question. 24 And so, anyway, go ahead. 25 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: The other questions that were 1-23-12 51 1 asked -- and Commissioner Baldwin did mention about the 2 security. We did ask -- address what security issues would 3 be, and monitoring the facility. And, again, at this time, 4 there's -- there are still kind of questions about that. 5 They have mentioned, you know, possibly working with local 6 police and fire, EMS services and those things. Another 7 question that was asked, and I -- I specifically asked this 8 question. Again, have -- asked them if they have completed a 9 local market analysis of other senior care facilities in our 10 community. We do know that there is current senior care 11 facilities that are in our community right now that are -- 12 are not filled. There is a lot of vacancy in some of those 13 areas. And there are also two other developments that are 14 requesting tax credits as well as that particular project as 15 well. So, we did ask them to do some type of -- some type of 16 study to see the demand for those type of programs in our 17 community as well. So, again, they're going to -- they're in 18 the process right now of doing those questions. So, I know 19 that there's a lot of questions between now and the end of 20 March, when they get their tax credits back. But, again, we 21 want to help our veteran programs and whatever they're doing. 22 Basically, there's some questions that still need to be asked 23 about the project that they're still trying to answer at this 24 time. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, can you tell me a 1-23-12 52 1 little bit about the Communities for Veterans? I mean, is 2 that a -- a nonprofit? Is it a group of people -- you know, 3 a corporation? What is that entity? 4 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Well, they're -- they've been 5 established over the -- over the country. They're a 6 nonprofit group that runs programs like this across the 7 country. I know that they have similar locations right now 8 that they're operating. He commented, Missouri and -- 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Florida, Tennessee, 10 Kentucky, New York, California. 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah, those are other ones 12 they're trying to get into, but they have some other 13 operations that they're doing as well. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't mean to interrupt, but 15 why -- if they're a nonprofit, why do they need tax credits? 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Well, that's -- that's how 17 they're structured. There's -- that's why they have those 18 comments, basically, how they are -- how they're sold, and 19 how those revenues are sustained for them. He explained that 20 in those settings on that day. We do know that he is going 21 to be making a presentation, I believe, to the City on their 22 agenda Tuesday night as far as that program is concerned as 23 well, and it might be a good thing just to answer more 24 questions on that. We might make -- might ask Craig maybe to 25 come make a presentation to specifically answer that. That's 1-23-12 53 1 how their structure is set up. And I'll be glad to ask 2 Mr. Taylor to come maybe give a presentation to Commissioners 3 Court on how it's structured. I mean, I have no problem with 4 that. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It sounds good. I mean, I'm 6 not trying to be a naysayer or negative, but it sounds like 7 potentially a very good program. I appreciate -- 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I believe so. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- the time you've looked into 10 it, and bringing up the other assisted living type facilities 11 we have and things of that nature. But it's just -- it's one 12 of those -- just want to find out who you're getting in bed 13 with a little bit. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Sounds a little more positive 15 than what we've heard several years ago, what we might be 16 facing. 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Right. Well, and the other 18 thing is, the numbers of -- of these type of facilities 19 across our country with our -- our aging veterans. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mm-hmm. 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: You know, this is geared 22 towards a lot of our veterans who are in the -- from the 23 Vietnam war, and those numbers are getting there, and those 24 numbers are quite high. And Korean conflict as well. So, 25 I'll ask Mr. Taylor, Commissioner Letz, to see if he would -- 1-23-12 54 1 would come do a presentation, and see if we can get that 2 maybe in February or March. That would be good. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That'd be good. I appreciate 4 that. 5 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Any particular action you request 7 from the Court today? Or -- 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Just basically a brief -- 9 just a brief update from that meeting. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Very well. Any other comments from 12 the Court? Let's go to Item 11, a 10 o'clock timed item. At 13 this time, I will recess the Commissioners Court meeting, and 14 I will convene a public hearing on the Order Adopting Rules 15 of Kerr County, Texas for On-Site Sewage Facilities. 16 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 10:04 a.m., and a public hearing was held in 17 open court, as follows:) 18 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Is there any member of the public or 20 audience that wishes to be heard with respect to the Order 21 Adopting Rules of Kerr County, Texas, for On-Site Sewage 22 Facilities? Seeing no one coming forward, I will close the 23 public hearing on the Order Adopting Rules of Kerr County, 24 Texas, for On-Site Sewage Facilities. 25 / 1-23-12 55 1 (The public hearing was concluded at 10:04 a.m., and the regular Commissioners Court meeting was 2 reopened.) 3 - - - - - - - - - - 4 JUDGE TINLEY: I will reconvene the Commissioners 5 Court meeting, and we'll go to Item 12, a 10:05 timed item, 6 to consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to approve 7 the Order Adopting Rules of Kerr County, Texas, for On-Site 8 Sewage Facilities, the new order to supersede all previous 9 orders. Mr. Garcia? 10 MR. GARCIA: Yes. We are at the final stages of 11 approval as per T.C.E.Q. requirements. It has been 12 published, and we have received the affidavit of -- from the 13 publisher. We're ready to move on to the next step of 14 accepting or approving the order. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Ray, let me ask you a 16 question. 17 MR. GARCIA: Yes, sir? 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is there anything in there 19 that is outside the state law? 20 MR. GARCIA: No. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I mean, is there any -- any 22 kind of local -- 23 MR. GARCIA: There is no local ordinance or 24 anything other than what -- 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So we're simply adopting 1-23-12 56 1 what the State of Texas tells us to adopt? 2 MR. GARCIA: Yes, minimum state standards. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 8 approval of the agenda item to adopt the order -- Order 9 Adopting Rules of Kerr County, Texas, for On-Site Sewage 10 Facilities, the same to supersede all previous orders in that 11 regard. Further question or discussion? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just one quick comment. 13 Basically, it's the same as we currently have. 14 MR. GARCIA: Yes. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're not changing anything. 16 The State hasn't really changed anything; just basically 17 updating. 18 MR. GARCIA: All this did was pretty much cover 19 anything that we -- we couldn't be in an agreement or have 20 some type of order with -- interlocal agreement with somebody 21 that's not an authorized agent. And in this case, it was the 22 City of Ingram that's not an authorized agent. That's all 23 this does, is just cover that for anybody that's in Kerr 24 County and our jurisdiction. It will cover minimum state 25 standards. 1-23-12 57 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: But the rules for on-site sewage 3 facilities are covered by state standards. 4 MR. GARCIA: Yes, we have minimum state standards. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or comments? All 7 in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 12 Item 13; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 13 approve on behalf of Kerr County the estoppel agreement 14 between Joseph L. Kennedy Enterprises, Limited, H.C.S.B. -- 15 that's Hill Country State Bank -- and Kerrville/Kerr County 16 Airport Board, authorize County Judge to sign same. I put 17 this on the agenda at the request of the airport people. 18 Apparently, the fixed base operator out there is reworking 19 financing with the bank, and an estoppel agreement is a 20 fairly standard operation in connection with that. Actually, 21 what they're asking us to do is ratify the action of the 22 Airport Board, who we've placed in charge of the airport 23 operation, as one of the owners of that property, and it'll 24 also be carried to the City of Kerrville as the other owner 25 for that. 1-23-12 58 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Would this be a requirement 2 of a lending institution? 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. Yes, that the lease is in full 4 force and effect, and we recognize that that lease exists. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, okay. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No change. Move approval. 7 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'll second it. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Question 9 or comment? I would note with some interest that when it 10 refers to the lease agreement, which was attached as a copy, 11 the Exhibit A somehow shows property down in Bexar County. I 12 don't know how that happened. But the body of the lease, of 13 course, talks about at the Kerrville/Kerr County Airport. I 14 think it was just an oversight in attaching that Exhibit A 15 plat. I don't think it affects the legality at all. 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Question or -- other question or 18 comment? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just a general comment, that 20 Mr. Kennedy made the presentation to the Airport Board. I 21 think Mr. Overby and I were both present. It's exactly what 22 the Judge said. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Moser, any comments on behalf of 24 the Airport Board? 25 MR. MOSER: No, I think it's straightforward. 1-23-12 59 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion, signify 2 by raising your right hand. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 5 (No response.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 7 Item 14; to consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 8 purchase items for the Upper Turtle Creek School building, 9 first being flooring, second furniture, total cost of $5,500. 10 Commissioner Baldwin? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. This is an item 12 that we've been kicking around for a good while. I 13 understand that the -- our Maintenance crew went out and took 14 up some of the old flooring in the school, and I'm really not 15 sure what the -- what the condition of it is. I understand 16 there's more been -- had been taken up now. So, I thought it 17 would -- we better -- I better get on the ball and get out 18 there and get something down, because I know the community 19 uses that facility quite a bit. And so we have sent a 20 company out there to do some measuring and gave us a bid, and 21 also there has been some talk of trying to -- you know, 22 there's always room for tables and chairs and that kind of 23 thing. And Tim and I had talked about possibly building some 24 desk-like seating arrangements out there, and so in the 25 meantime, I understand that they have discovered some of the 1-23-12 60 1 original desks, maybe, out of that old school. That needs to 2 be refurbished, and someone out there knows someone that can 3 refurbish them, and I'd like to go down that road to see what 4 the refurbishing thing is like, and the cost. But I want to 5 do it. I want to do it this way here, and -- and then have 6 the -- have the leeway to refurbish those old desks if we 7 can. And if we can't, then Tim will build us something out 8 there. But all of this needs to be done. Now, the County 9 Auditor assured me that she would find this amount of money 10 for that project out there, so I'm assuming that she has. 11 Are you the County Auditor? There's the County Auditor. 12 MS. HARGIS: Yes, we'll find it. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We'll find it. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do we know where? 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah, where from? 16 MS. HARGIS: We can -- we can use contingency right 17 now, but we have other areas that we can -- you know, but 18 there's plenty of money in contingency. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I really kind of wanted to 20 put it in the court order where it's coming from, though. 21 MS. HARGIS: Contingency. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Contingency. And that's 23 10-something, something, something. 24 MS. HARGIS: 409. Department 409. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And -- but I definitely 1-23-12 61 1 wanted to bring it to Commissioners Court and get your 2 approval to do this kind of thing, to get this kind of money. 3 So, I move that we, in the contingency account, move $5,500 4 over to -- or just leave it there and let us -- let us 5 purchase the things we need to purchase for the Upper Turtle 6 Creek School. 7 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Commissioner, I had one 8 question. Just for folks in our community who may not know 9 about the school, a little history about it. It's quite old. 10 It's old, got a lot of history to it. How old is the 11 facility? How far does it go back, that you know of? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's old. 13 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: It's old. (Laughter.) So 14 that's -- we know that history there, and it's benefited lots 15 of folks in that community for a long time. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, it has. 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's a County-owned facility. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: County-owned facility. You 20 know, the County owns that, and as well as the cemetery 21 across the road. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So we need to maintain county 23 property. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's correct. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Buildings. 1-23-12 62 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, would it make 2 sense to move the money from contingency to Maintenance 3 Department, where they're going to be spent? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure. Sure. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, just -- 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If that's a cleaner way to 7 do it, absolutely. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Does that work? Auditor's 9 nodding her head, sort of. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, that would be a maximum 12 amount. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, mm-hmm. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We have a motion. Do I hear 15 a second? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and a second. 18 Question or comment? All in favor of that motion, signify by 19 raising your right hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carried. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you very much. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move to Item 17; to consider, 1-23-12 63 1 discuss, and take appropriate action on reallocation of funds 2 remaining in the 2008 and 2010 capital issues. Ms. Hargis? 3 MS. HARGIS: At the last meeting, you asked me to 4 do a spreadsheet, and to show the Court how we might 5 reallocate these funds. I'll pass out a sheet to all of you. 6 On the -- keep in mind that on the 2010 issue, we did -- we 7 did set a budget with this. When we set our -- our annual 8 operating budget, we also set the capital budget on the 2010, 9 and that'll be the first page that you're looking at. Of 10 that amount of money, the only amount that -- that I've 11 allocated there is the interest, what was left over in that 12 issue, which was 3,582.91, because it was not assigned during 13 the budget process. The rest of the funds have already begun 14 to be spent by those departments that were given those funds. 15 So, there -- there are two items there that I will leave 16 those up to the individual Commissioners to decide what they 17 want to do with those. On the 2008 -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Stay with this one first. On 19 the airport, the airport number -- and I want to just -- I've 20 talked to the Auditor about this a little bit. 114,000 21 designated for the airport. The problem with it is, that 22 note was sold as a tax-free note -- is that right? -- and 23 those funds can only be used for infrastructure; cannot be 24 used for terminal renovations or anything like that. And we 25 don't -- and they're kind of left -- you know, left over from 1-23-12 64 1 the water project, is really where it came from. 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Right. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would probably reallocate 4 those, 'cause I don't know that we have any large 5 infrastructure projects out there, and I think we need to 6 address the airport on some of the -- under the new budget 7 issue on another agenda item today for our 2012 issue. So, I 8 think that 114,000 should be reallocated. And the other one 9 I'll turn over to Commissioner Baldwin, which is the fire 10 station. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, the Kerrville South 12 fire station is the $40,000. That's the -- that's the bid we 13 got for concrete foundation for the new fire station. And 14 that -- it's really in Precinct 2, but I've just been driving 15 the boat until we get to some point. 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Appreciate you doing that. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, yeah. And -- but it's 18 all -- just remember, it's all a part of the program that we 19 have been trying to put together as far as our -- you know, 20 our fire safety and the EMS program, and throughout the 21 county. And, you know, we're trying to provide some fire 22 protection for those citizens over in Kerrville South, so 23 this is a giant step. It is only the foundation of the 24 building, and we will -- hopefully, you know, we'll cross the 25 building road when we get to it. 1-23-12 65 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, do we think -- is 2 this on a timeline that this money would be -- is it the 3 five-year issue? 4 MS. HARGIS: On the arbitrage? It would be that we 5 should try to spend it within five years, so that would put 6 us to 2015. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there a likelihood that this 8 will -- the building will start construction by 2015? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hopefully it will start this 10 year. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, good. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Be completed this year. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Then it should probably stay 14 where it is. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 17 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, I think that needs to 19 be -- the 114,000 plus the 3,000 would get reallocated. 20 MS. HARGIS: All right. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay? 22 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I agree with that. 24 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's good. 25 MS. HARGIS: Okay, let's go to the 2008 issue. 1-23-12 66 1 Most of those funds in the I.T. area have been spent. There 2 is, of course, the 110,950.87 left from that issue that has 3 not been spent on the ag facility. The courthouse repairs 4 have some money, but we're currently working on a repair on 5 the courthouse, and as I've told you before, as we designate 6 an item in an issue, we must complete that issue before those 7 -- those funds become available for reallocation. And so 8 these are not available for reallocation until those projects 9 are complete. You have a little bit left in Road and Bridge. 10 There's a little left in -- from the vehicles originally 11 purchased in the Environmental Health and Animal Control. 12 And then we -- we did earn a substantial amount of interest 13 on this issue, and so that leaves you 142,815.07 to 14 reallocate, and 45,746.76 to stay in the issue until those 15 projects in the courthouse are complete. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 17 MS. HARGIS: Anyone else? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To clean the -- kind of 19 hopefully clean this up, then, I'll move that we reallocate 20 from the 2008 bond issue the 142,815.07, and any other excess 21 funds out of that bond issue, and the 114,041.92 and the 22 2,581.82 out of the 2010 issue to the Ag Barn. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion as indicated. 25 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Good. 1-23-12 67 1 JUDGE TINLEY: And a second. Question or 2 discussion on the motion? All in favor of the motion, 3 signify by raising your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Before we vote, the -- what 9 is -- do we have a total on that? Has anybody -- 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I was trying to do the math, 11 but -- 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: 340? 13 MS. HARGIS: It's 117,624.83 for the one, and then 14 142 for the other one. 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: So, 260. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 260. 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: 262. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: About 262, pretty close to 19 that. 20 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's good. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's a huge step. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any other items to be 24 considered under this particular item, Ms. Hargis? 25 MS. HARGIS: No, sir. 1-23-12 68 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Let's go to Item 18; 2 consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to approve 3 plan for capital improvements at the Hill Country Youth 4 Exhibit Center. Commissioner Letz? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I handed out to the Court two 6 items. One is just kind of a side issue. I wanted to give 7 everybody an update. Commissioner Oehler and myself and the 8 County Attorney and Stock Show Association, Mr. Reeves and 9 Mr. Henderson, have been working on a new agreement. The -- 10 and they have -- really, what that agreement is, I think 11 we've agreed to the terms, but we're waiting on some language 12 that I wanted to write about the historical -- you know, I 13 guess the history of the property and the facility. I have a 14 draft of that which I've given to Commissioner Oehler and the 15 rest of the Court, and County Attorney. And then if no one 16 has any real problems with that, the County Attorney can just 17 go ahead and incorporate that into an agreement, and then we 18 can meet again with Stock Show Association; Commissioner 19 Oehler and I can and finalize that. I wanted to bring that 20 up, because that's kind of very important to the -- the next 21 issue that we talking about, which is the agenda item. 22 And what I thought we'd try to do today is just to 23 kind of put a very -- a plan forward that we can vote on that 24 would outline the commitment from us, make it a little bit of 25 a challenge to the Stock Show Association. Probably the 1-23-12 69 1 easiest thing would be just to read it and see if there's any 2 comments or changes that the Court would like to make. And 3 it's titled the Proposal for Renovation of the Hill Country 4 Youth Exhibit Center. Kerr County Commissioners Court to 5 approve $2.5 million plan to build a new show barn and new 6 exhibit hall to be implemented as follows: One, Kerr County 7 and the Hill Country District Junior Livestock Show 8 Association will enter into a new 20-year agreement. Kerr 9 County will commit to build a 50,000 square foot show barn to 10 be constructed in 2012. The estimated cost of the facility 11 is 1.2 million. Kerr County will commit to the 12 infrastructure requirements to construct the new show barn, 13 including demolition of the existing hog barn, site work, and 14 other related costs. Kerr County will commit to match up to 15 $500,000 to fundraising efforts of the Hill Country District 16 Junior Livestock Show Association to raise the funds to build 17 a new 22,000 square foot exhibit hall, with plans to 18 construct the building in 2013. The estimated cost of this 19 exhibit hall is $1 million. 20 Essentially, what we're -- you know, I think that's 21 pretty -- kind of self-explanatory, but it's kind of a 22 challenge match to the Stock Show Association to get the -- 23 the exhibit hall phase built, us committing 500,000 to that, 24 and then giving them -- hopefully they can raise another 25 500,000 in the next 12 months to move forward. If they can't 1-23-12 70 1 meet this timeline, of course, that can be extended some, but 2 the idea is for us to get the new barn built now, show our 3 commitment to it. And by this court order, we would make a 4 commitment of the additional 500,000, both to the community 5 and to the Stock Show Association, to get the exhibit hall 6 built as soon as possible, hopefully next year. That's it. 7 Any comments? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I just wanted to say I 9 think there's wisdom in jumping out there and showing the 10 leadership. 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's right. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You know, how can -- I don't 13 know that I would participate in something like that unless I 14 saw the owners being the choo-choo train of the program. 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: The only thing I'd add, 16 Commissioner Letz, I think it's -- you know, we're taking 17 figures that we saw from '08, '010, of three and a half 18 million dollars. I think the Commissioners Court, through 19 the process of involving Junior Livestock Association and 20 other community organizations, we've been able to take that 21 figure and really look at what the functionality of this 22 facility needs to be, the cost of it. And then, instead of 23 being a three and a half million dollar deal that was a 24 grandiose type of thing, we're able to have something here 25 that's going to meet the needs for the next 25, 30 years, and 1-23-12 71 1 I think that the -- the dollar amount that we're doing here 2 is going to serve its purpose. So, I think it's a good deal, 3 and appreciate your working on it, and Commissioner Oehler 4 especially as well. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There's no doubt that I 6 support what you said. I do appreciate the fact that the 7 Court seems to be united on this effort, and so is the Stock 8 Show, and also 4-H and the community is -- seems to be very 9 supportive of it. And I think we just need to move forward 10 and get it done. 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- just to kind of sum 13 it up, I think it was Commissioner Oehler that made the 14 comment to me during the stock show that it's about time we 15 spent some money on the good people, the good kids, the good 16 part of the community, rather than always on the bad part. 17 You know, obviously, we have to do the jail; we have to do a 18 lot of things, and courts. But it's an opportunity to do 19 that. We've planned for that. We have, you know, some of 20 the money set aside. We've done some long-range financing 21 options, and to be able to do this right now. And so, 22 appreciate the work, efforts of everybody. Mr. Reeves, do 23 you have any comments? How much money do y'all -- what's the 24 total sale? 25 MR. REEVES: Total sale was 830,000 this year. If 1-23-12 72 1 you look at the total sale versus total sales, we were down, 2 because we had less units. If you look at average price that 3 went for exhibitors, we were within about $30 or $40 per 4 exhibitor. So, in this day and time, I think that's pretty 5 good. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Good job. 7 MR. REEVES: I thank the Commissioners for their 8 help out there. I think Commissioner Overby learned a little 9 about sheep Thursday morning that he wasn't aware of. 10 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: 6:30 in the morning. We 11 learned a lot real quick. 12 MR. REEVES: As far as your comments, there -- you 13 know, the show's going to do all we can. If I understand 14 correctly -- and forgive me, I'm still catching up on sleep. 15 So, the County is committing to build the new show facility, 16 and you're asking the association to find roughly a half 17 million dollars in sponsorship for the new exhibit hall? Is 18 that -- 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. And we'll match the 20 other half a million. 21 MR. REEVES: Just speaking for myself -- naturally, 22 I have to come back to the executive board, but I see where 23 we could be behind that 100 percent. But there's 16 others 24 that I've got to get the -- get the approval. So -- but once 25 again, I thank the Commissioners for what they've done to 1-23-12 73 1 move forward, and I think we've taken a giant step in about 2 six months. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Super. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make a motion to approve 5 the plan as outlined. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to approve 8 the plan as outlined before the Court in session here. 9 Further question or discussion on that item? All in favor, 10 signify by raising your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Why don't 15 we go ahead and take our recess now; take about a 15-minute 16 recess. 17 (Recess taken from 10:27 a.m. to 10:45 a.m.) 18 - - - - - - - - - - 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to order, if 20 we might, from our recess. Let's go to our 10:30 item, which 21 is Item 15, a presentation by Mr. Ray Watson with the Kerr 22 Economic Development Corporation regarding Fox Tank Company. 23 Mr. Watson? 24 MR. WATSON: Judge Tinley, Commissioners, thank you 25 for having me here today. It's good to be in front of you 1-23-12 74 1 once again. This is on the Fox Tank project, which you have 2 been alluded to in the past and we've had many conversations 3 on. Just to give a little bit of history, Nathan Fox was 4 brought to us by Commissioner Overby back a few months back, 5 and he is looking at relocating a plant that they have in a 6 temporary facility in Comfort, Texas to Kerr County. That 7 facility currently has 42 employee with an average salary of 8 $16 an hour. And those -- that expected growth for that 9 facility is up to -- upwards of around 95 to 100 employees. 10 This project is a joint project with the County, the City, 11 E.I.C., A.C.C.D., and the State. We are working with 12 A.C.C.D. We've actually got a meeting with them and the 13 state folks tomorrow with Texas Workforce Commission to 14 actually start training welders for this project, and get 15 that program going. We are also working with the E.I.C. 16 They have already finalized their commitment to this project, 17 and they are doing their public hearing this evening, which 18 then will go to the City. The City is taking this up in a 19 380 agreement, which will be basically a mirror of what 20 you're being approached with today, and that 380 agreement 21 will have them paying sales tax back to Mr. Fox that is 22 generated by Mr. Fox over the next two years. 23 And so what we have today to present to you is, you 24 have already been told about the property tax abatement which 25 is based on the property tax abatement incentive that's in 1-23-12 75 1 the incentives agreement, and that is a 50 -- 50, 40, 30, 20, 2 10 split for the next five years. And then what we're asking 3 for you also is to enter into a 381 agreement, which would 4 totally be based on the money generated by Fox Tank, and 5 those sales taxes would be shared with Mr. Fox for two years, 6 up to 100 percent the first two years, but at a maximum of 7 75,000. The projections right now is that his sales will 8 project over 75,000 a year back to the county, so it would 9 end up being a one-year agreement, because it's a maximum of 10 two years or a maximum of $75,000. And as -- as I told you 11 many times in the past, my -- my preference is to do 12 agreements like a 380, 381 agreement, because that doesn't 13 cost you any taxes that you're currently getting. That is 14 strictly based on taxes that are generated from this project, 15 and so we would only be sharing in taxes that he is actually 16 generating. So, it's actually a performance-based incentive 17 agreement. So -- and that is -- Mr. Henneke and I have been 18 meeting last week on and off, and he will then be bringing 19 back the agreement for y'all to sign based on your approval 20 of it today. So -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You used the term 22 "performance based." 23 MR. WATSON: Yes, sir. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: To me, that means that you 25 would provide him with incentives based on what performance 1-23-12 76 1 he has shown in the past; i.e., the number of employees. If 2 he says he's going to have 100 employees in the county, you 3 would base his incentives on that -- on those numbers. Once 4 he reaches that 100, which would be 100 percent of his goal, 5 then you provide him with 100 percent. 6 MR. WATSON: The performance -- 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How far off base am I? 8 MR. WATSON: In our -- in economic development, we 9 look at performance-based incentives; it's based on -- the 10 incentive is based on the taxes that he generates. If he 11 generates the sales tax, then he would share in that sales 12 tax that he generates. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It doesn't matter about his 14 commitment of -- 15 MR. WATSON: It does matter about his commitment. 16 Yes, sir, it does matter about his commitment. There is a 17 commitment on there to have a minimum of 60 employees, with 18 60 percent of those employees being hired from within Kerr 19 County. So -- 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 21 MR. WATSON: And that would be part of the 22 agreement. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, great. 24 MR. WATSON: So, yeah, that -- that commitment is 25 not only in y'all's agreement, but also in E.I.C.'s and 1-23-12 77 1 City's agreement as well. So, the -- the commitment is based 2 on 60 minimum. But as I stated a while ago, his growth 3 pattern is such that they are expecting between 90 to 105 4 total employees. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Super. 6 MR. WATSON: Yes, sir. And the -- the really 7 interesting -- and this is just a sidebar, is that we are -- 8 as I was saying, we are working with Ms. Fahrenthold to do a 9 program through A.C.C.D. that will actually create a welding 10 program that we are working with Texas Workforce Commission 11 as well to train -- train young people that can be put in 12 this field, and actually have an opportunity that doesn't 13 require them to go to a normal college program. And when you 14 look at $16 an hour, you know, roughly $32,000-a-year job, 15 that's a lot better opportunity than some of the other jobs 16 that are available to them today. So, I think this is a 17 great program and a great opportunity for us as a community. 18 So -- 19 JUDGE TINLEY: It's got a bunch of win-win to it, 20 Commissioner. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with you 100 22 percent. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: A lot of win-win to it. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You're also taking a business 25 that's currently in Kendall County and moving it to Kerr 1-23-12 78 1 County. 2 MR. WATSON: We don't want to make too much 3 emphasis on that. I'm already in trouble for that one. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Find out where his loyalties 5 are. 6 MR. WATSON: So -- and I guess what we would 7 appreciate today is approval of the -- of the, basically, 8 outlay of the incentive package. And then that would allow 9 Mr. Fox to actually start moving forward with his 10 construction. Like I said, we have the final step with 11 E.I.C. tonight, and then the City will be in their meeting 12 tomorrow night. And I have Mr. Fox here, if y'all would like 13 to make any comments or even ask him any questions. His name 14 is Nathan Fox, if you'd like to visit with him. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Heck, let's take a look at 16 him. (Laughter.) There he is. 17 MR. WATSON: And he's a -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, Mr. Fox. Good to have 19 you here. 20 MR. WATSON: He's a horse trader that just lost a 21 stallion, okay, so be kind to him. 22 MR. FOX: That was the final sign that said leave 23 Kentucky. Gone to Texas. But we're excited about what's 24 going on. We -- we've been a little bit overwhelmed by the 25 amount of business that's kind of pouring in to us, and we've 1-23-12 79 1 got to get production up fast. We've got a tremendous amount 2 of -- of expansion left to do in the Eagle Ford Shale. We're 3 still sending actually the majority of our stuff to Oklahoma 4 and to the Permian Basin right now, and so we've just 5 scratched the surface down here, and still we've got more 6 than we can possibly do. So, we're excited about it. We 7 love this community. My wife and I just moved; we're waiting 8 on our furniture to arrive. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Y'all have any football 10 player kids or anything? 11 MR. FOX: Unfortunately, we're -- we're past that 12 age. But maybe -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Like me, grandkids. 14 MR. FOX: Based on my son, we might have to wait 15 20, 25 years before we see that. But I grew up in Texas. My 16 wife -- I grew up in Albany, Texas. My wife grew up in Fort 17 Worth, and we moved to Kentucky about 27 years ago. And my 18 father has done this since I was in high school, so he -- he 19 was one of the bigger tank manufacturing companies in -- in 20 the state -- in the country, and built it up from nothing. 21 He more or less retired. I got him to move to Kentucky for 22 five years, and the city of Albany -- this is how all this 23 came about. This kind of lit the light bulb above my head. 24 But the city of Albany said we really want you back, and we 25 need jobs. And if you will come back and open this factory 1-23-12 80 1 back up, we'll sell it to you at the end of the year for a 2 dollar. And so he came back. He got the old tank company 3 going again in Albany. And I'm extremely proud of him, 4 because then he brought sort of the -- the grandchildren in, 5 my son and his -- and my nephew in, and they're in their 6 20's, and they're very -- very skilled at this. One's a 7 great salesman, and my son's better on the manufacturing, 8 protection end of this thing, and so it's a good team. 9 And then he approached me and said, you know, "I'm 10 getting to an age where I really need to turn this over to 11 you." So, we made a commitment to move back, and so that's 12 where we're going. So we started -- I started calling 13 different people; New Braunfels, Seguin, San Antonio, Austin, 14 and just see what was out there. At the time, I will tell 15 you, one year ago I was doing this, and I was talking about 16 having 15 employees. So, I got -- I won't say I got a cool 17 reception, but it -- we weren't terribly -- we didn't make 18 much of a -- much noise, but we got some good offers from 19 Rusty Brockman over in New Braunfels and some different 20 people. But that's how I called Guy Overby and got to 21 visiting with him. And we were really impressed when we 22 came, and he gave us a tour of the city. And -- and so it 23 just so happened that we happened to find the facility in 24 Comfort was for lease or sale, and we rebuilt that entire 25 facility. And like I said, we're three times what we had 1-23-12 81 1 projected where we would be at this time, and I think the 2 numbers that Ray are talking about are probably attainable. 3 So, I -- I'm excited about it. I appreciate your commitment 4 to this. And we will -- we'll be a major contributor to this 5 community. So -- 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you very much. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Fox, do you see an additional 9 potential for this county and this community as far as other 10 second-tier providers to that Eagle Ford Shale activity down 11 there in South Texas? 12 MR. FOX: I certainly do, Judge Tinley. And, 13 obviously, we'll buy all that we can buy locally. We'll try 14 to do that. A large part of what we buy is flat carbon 15 steel, you know, out of Houston, but from Cargill. But we do 16 spend a lot of money already in this community. We already 17 have over the last eight months, you know. And it's a very 18 unique community. I don't have to tell you all that. But, I 19 mean, it's even sold my wife, which she was saying, "I'm not 20 moving to a small town again." Well, she's changed her tune. 21 She's very enthusiastic about everything. But as far as that 22 goes, there's -- there's -- there's some tremendous 23 opportunities that are in front of us here that are just 24 coming up every day, and I -- I could anticipate. And I need 25 to tell you, first and foremost, though, we have a three-year 1-23-12 82 1 lease on that property, and I honor anything I agree to, and 2 so we will be in Comfort for two more years. 3 The two plants will run co -- they will run 4 concurrently. They'll run together. The 60 employees we're 5 talking about will be at this facility. Those will be new 6 hires. So, we've got 40 something -- it will depend on if 7 the demand stays strong. If I continue to run two shifts 8 there, we'll keep probably 40 employees. We'll move all of 9 our main offices here. We'll set up the bulk of our 10 accounting, clerical, billing, and so on in Kerrville, and 11 yet we'll still continue to run our Albany operation more as 12 a dispatch place. They produce about -- they produce about 13 25 percent of our product now. We're producing 75 percent of 14 it in Comfort. By the time this facility is up and running, 15 we'll be doing probably 85 to 90 percent of the production in 16 Kerr County, and Albany will pretty much serve as, like I 17 said, a sales and sort of dispatch area. So, I would 18 anticipate, though, that there are a lot of different things 19 that are going to open up with this. I just -- specifically, 20 I can't really say, but... 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Fantastic. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Thanks for coming. 23 MR. FOX: Thanks for seeing me. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Glad to have you here. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Has he bought a home here 1-23-12 83 1 yet? Has he bought a home here yet? 2 MR. WATSON: He has done a one-year lease at 3 Comanche Trace. Then they're also looking for property right 4 now. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Move to Precinct 1. 6 (Laughter.) We're not number one for -- just to talk about. 7 MR. FOX: For any reason? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There's reasons behind it. 9 MR. WATSON: Mr. Baldwin, just for your 10 information, we actually -- Ms. Carlson and I were out at the 11 stock show on Friday, and we were leaving the stock show, and 12 Nathan was there. And he said -- he said -- him and his 13 wife; first time I met his wife. And he said, "We just 14 toured the stock show. We really want to know how we get 15 involved in this." So, I told him that he needs to talk with 16 you on that later. So -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Absolutely. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's not a problem. 19 MR. WATSON: Anyway -- 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mr. Reeves can straighten you 21 out really quick. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions for Mr. Watson 23 with regard to the matter involving Fox Tank? Thank you. 24 Appreciate it. 25 MR. WATSON: Thank you. 1-23-12 84 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to the next item, which is 2 an action item; consider, discuss, and take appropriate 3 action to approve economic incentives package for Fox Tank 4 Company, as recommended by the Board of Directors of Kerr 5 Economic Development Corporation. You've heard what the 6 proposal is. 7 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Judge Tinley -- 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Commission Overby? 9 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yes, I do need to recuse 10 myself on any item with 1.16, and at this time I would be 11 excused from any vote on that. Thank you. 12 (Commissioner Overby left the courtroom.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. Watson, would you give the Court 14 a bullet-point update on the incentives package? Now that 15 we're on the action item, exactly what that package is? 16 MR. WATSON: Yes, sir. The incentive package is 17 a -- as I stated a while ago, is between the City, the 18 County, and the -- and the E.I.C. board, and then also with 19 state funding with Texas Workforce Commission. What we're 20 looking at from the County is a 100 percent tax sharing for 21 two years, up to a maximum of $75,000, and then also a tax 22 abatement on ad valorem tax for the five-year period at 50, 23 40, 30, 20, and 10 percent, based on the value of this 24 facility that he is building here in Kerr County. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Any questions about the exact 1-23-12 85 1 aspects of this incentives package from any member of the 2 Court? 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The two years -- run those 4 numbers by me again. 5 MR. WATSON: It would be a two-year 380 agreement 6 in tax sharing at 100 percent, for a maximum of 75,000. His 7 projected tax -- tax to the Commissioners Court today -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Ad valorem? 9 MR. WATSON: -- is projected at 75,000 a year. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: That's sales tax on that aspect. 11 MR. WATSON: Strictly sales tax. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 13 MR. WATSON: Yes, sir. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: The ad valorem tax is an abatement. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 50, 40, 30, 20 -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Maximum of first year, 50 percent; 17 second year 40, 30, following on, 10 percent reduction each 18 year. 19 MR. WATSON: That is correct. And as I stated 20 earlier, Judge Tinley, this would strictly be on new taxes 21 generated from his facility. No -- no current funds from the 22 County would be asked for. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move approval of the tax 24 incentive package as recommended by K.E.D.C. for the Fox Tank 25 Company. 1-23-12 86 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 3 indicated. Further question or discussion? All in favor of 4 the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 5 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 7 (No response.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 9 MR. WATSON: Thank you, Judge. Look forward to 10 bringing you more of these. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Mr. Watson. Mr. Fox, 12 best success to you. 13 MS. FOX: Thank you very much. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Time to go to work, isn't it? 15 MS. FOX: Yeah, we're ready. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to Item 19; to 17 consider, discuss, take appropriate action on list of capital 18 items for new tax anticipation note or other debt instrument. 19 Ms. Hargis? 20 (Commissioner Overby returned to the courtroom.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Didn't have to stay gone long, did 22 you? 23 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: No. Took me out of the bull 24 pen quick. 25 MS. HARGIS: I think all of you have a copy. If 1-23-12 87 1 you don't have a copy, I'll give you one. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Show it to me. Okay. 3 MS. HARGIS: Do you not have one? 4 THE CLERK: Thank you. 5 MS. HARGIS: Tess was kind enough to prepare this 6 spreadsheet for us so that you could see not only by 7 department, but by category. I don't know how you want to -- 8 to tackle it. I had asked each of the departments to be here 9 to go over their request. The first four items, of course, 10 are Commissioners Court items, those being the Cade Loop, 11 which is 350,000, the Center Point wastewater treatment plant 12 project, which we're doing with the -- with the state. This 13 is our share of the 1.9 million. That is the beginning, the 14 planning stages. Then the second one -- the third one is a 15 grant. This will be our 25,000 that we would have to put up 16 for the next Kerrville South project, which should be the 17 final phase, and that's a $500,000 grant, and we would put in 18 25. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And that includes the 20 apartment complex over there, right? 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: It does not. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Does not? 23 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Does not. That finishes up 24 the rest of Quail Run, I believe. And remember, Commissioner 25 Baldwin, when we talked about the -- the colonia grant, 1-23-12 88 1 remember our request was trying to find out additional money 2 of how that could be structured. We just sent a letter off 3 to get that blessing or approval. That can be identified. 4 And, Commissioner, if that money is allowed to be, then that 5 money could be -- we're asking -- our question is could it be 6 relocated to help finish the apartments there, this project. 7 So, currently it is not. 8 MS. HARGIS: Currently it is not, but when I talked 9 with Keller when he was here at our last Commissioners Court 10 meeting, he's trying to see how we might figure that in. 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: And we should. 12 MS. HARGIS: The problem with that particular one 13 is that apartment complex is owned by an individual who is 14 not really -- doesn't come under the affordable -- 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Qualified. 16 MS. HARGIS: -- qualification. But I think that 17 person has agreed to tie on, and there may be some kind of an 18 agreement we can have with them. And in order to get this 19 project this time, we also have to put in some additional 20 requirements for the city of Kerrville, and that's kind of 21 what's taken up some of this money. But that's not -- I 22 mean, we have the grant out there. We have made the request. 23 But that can be moved around once it's bid. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Ms. Hargis? 25 MS. HARGIS: Yes? 1-23-12 89 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Before you continue, let me 2 just ask, I guess, a question. A lot of people in the 3 audience, this would be the first time they've heard of this 4 list, so I was thinking some of these, especially the bigger 5 ticket items, I think it would be helpful for the 6 Commissioner, whoever it is, to kind of make a few -- explain 7 it a little bit, 'cause these are some big numbers. And 8 also, as we're going through it, just kind of to the Court, 9 do we want to go through the whole list and then start 10 cutting, or do we want to cut as we're going? Because the 11 total is not obtainable, in my opinion. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, let's hear the whole 13 list and then go back. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. 17 MS. HARGIS: Okay. Then the first item is the 18 TexDOT item; that's the Cade Loop that will be done in 19 Precinct 4. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. That was an agreement 21 that we made with TexDOT about four or five years ago, that 22 they are funding 100 percent of six off-system bridges, this 23 being the seventh bridge. They asked that we fund up to half 24 of the project, and there would be no funding on the rest. 25 The other bridges, some of them have been put off a little 1-23-12 90 1 while. The ones in my end of the county, one is finished, 2 one is under construction, and the Cade Loop is scheduled to 3 be let and start construction in August. 4 MS. HARGIS: That's correct. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And we have to pay the 6 $350,000, which is the guaranteed maximum no matter what the 7 project comes in at; that's what the County has to put into 8 it to fund it. 9 MS. HARGIS: By June the 1st. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: The cost is significantly -- 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The estimated cost is in 12 excess of 750,000. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And these -- I mean, the total 15 package of those seven bridges is probably in the 16 neighborhood of 4 or 5 million, I'm guessing; 3 million to 4 17 million, probably. You know, so this is a very good deal for 18 the County. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. 20 MS. HARGIS: Commissioner Letz wants to address the 21 second one, which is our Center Point project. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's a project that 23 Commissioner Williams started who knows how long ago. A long 24 time. 25 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: '07. 1-23-12 91 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's a really important 2 project, for two reasons. One, the water quality issue. The 3 eastern areas that are targeted by this program are on small 4 lots. They're all on septic tanks. It's a -- they're 5 causing -- it's a water quality issue into the Guadalupe 6 River. We're aware of it, have been for some time. We're 7 cleaning that up. And the other part of it is kind of a 8 sister project, I'd say, that's really being looked at more 9 by U.G.R.A. than the County; it's a water distribution system 10 that is very much needed from a -- just a water reliability 11 and growth standpoint in the eastern part of the county. The 12 idea is to get -- I won't go into the whole idea, but to get 13 a lot of that area off groundwater, onto surface water. That 14 will really help the water needs for Kerrville and all of 15 eastern Kerr County, because there's some real problems in 16 the -- in underground water in that part of the county. 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Only thing I'd like to add to 18 what Commissioner Letz said, again, 450,000, this is coming 19 from the Clean Water State Revolving Fund, C.W.S.R.F. 20 Basically, it's a 70/30 grant, so our part is that 30 percent 21 here that we're talking about. This particular item here is 22 about $1.7 million. And so our -- this is our part of that 23 process to move next into this next phase. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And this project is the 25 number-one rated -- currently the number-one rated project in 1-23-12 92 1 the state. 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yes, it is. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To get done. It's been ranked 4 by the Water Development Board based on federal criteria, 5 other criteria, and to get that ranking is pretty unheard of. 6 And it's -- it shows the importance of this project, to get 7 it accomplished from a water quality standpoint. 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Very good. 9 MS. HARGIS: We have also said we've already 10 received 300,000, about, from the State of Texas for the 11 preliminary work on this project as well. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's good. 13 MS. HARGIS: Number three I think we've talked 14 about, but if Commissioner Overby or Commissioner Baldwin -- 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Basically, our application on 16 that is June of this year, that goes in. If that gets 17 approved, then you're looking at the design and engineering 18 phase of that, and if that gets approved, then the 19 construction would begin next year; sometime mid next year, 20 late next year. We'll be finished in '14. So, it's on the 21 last phase of the Kerrville South Wastewater project, and 22 again, it's cleaning up Camp Meeting Creek. It's been going 23 on since '99, the different phases, so this will be the last 24 phase of that. 25 MS. HARGIS: And this is a $500,000 grant, and it 1-23-12 93 1 would be only 5 percent that we would be paying. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is also a water quality 3 issue. And through -- through the -- I think we're in Phase 4 5 on the thing, and it would be the final phase. And -- and 5 we have made -- we may be -- I don't know exactly the number, 6 but possibly a couple of hundred homes we've taken off of 7 septic tanks and put on the city system. So you no longer -- 8 that creek that it drained -- everything drained into ran 9 right through the middle of Riverhill, and, of course, into 10 the Guadalupe River, and we have officially put a stop to 11 that. Great program. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. And the reason this 13 grant was also received, going back, a little bit of history 14 on it, the funding and the priority that did from the State 15 was that that was listed as one of the most polluted bodies 16 of water in the state. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's correct. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that creek was -- it was an 19 effort to clean it up, and it has been cleaned up, so the 20 water quality is very high now. 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Over 200 hookups have been 22 put on those -- those wastewater deals now, so it's -- it's 23 cleaned it up. That's a good deal. 24 MS. HARGIS: Item 4? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Ag Barn. I think we've talked 1-23-12 94 1 about that. I think we need to revise this number some 2 downward, but I think we can leave it -- I mean, we've talked 3 about that enough today. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: The first phase, Commissioner, as 5 budget officer, I was concerned there may be some -- some 6 add-ons that come in. We've got demolition to think about. 7 We've got some electrical and plumbing things to think about. 8 I may be a little heavy on it, but I'd rather be a little 9 heavy than too light, so I tried to put a little float in 10 there when I asked Ms. Hargis to include it at 1.5. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, I understand. 12 MS. HARGIS: Our next department is Road and Bridge 13 Department, and I'm going to let him talk about what he's 14 requested. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is a wish list; correct, 16 Leonard? 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Big wish. 18 MR. ODOM: Well, let's put it this way -- 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me -- let me interrupt you, if I 20 might. This is liable to go on for a while, and I've got 21 several 11 o'clock items that I'd like to go ahead and 22 handle. I think they'll be very short items. If you 23 wouldn't mind, let me go ahead and knock those out right 24 quick. 25 MR. ODOM: No, sir. 1-23-12 95 1 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm not sure that -- I didn't start 2 this until after 11 o'clock, so I may be in error in not 3 doing that. 4 MR. ODOM: It will give me time to contemplate that 5 answer. (Laughter.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: There you go. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Maybe you should revise the 8 list a little. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll come back -- we'll come back 10 to Item 19. Let's go to our 11 -- first 11 o'clock timed 11 item, Item 21. Consider, discuss, take appropriate action on 12 request from Kerrville Area Chamber of Commerce to use the 13 Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center for a KerrFest on August 14 10th and 11th, 2012. Kristan? This is your game here. 15 MR. FOSTER: We've set the date for KerrFest, 16 obviously, and we would like to have the whole facility this 17 year. Last year there was another activity going on. Having 18 it all to ourselves will make it a little bit cleaner, little 19 bit easier for access, et cetera. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Jody, is there anything else 21 scheduled? 22 MS. GRINSTEAD: No. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: This is an event that has multiple 24 sponsors, isn't it? 25 MR. FOSTER: Yes, sir. 1-23-12 96 1 MS. CRADDOCK: Yes. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Tell me who-all's involved here. 3 MR. FOSTER: Well, the County was a great sponsor. 4 The City, the C.V.B., the Chamber, and then about 25 5 different businesses from around the county did sponsorships, 6 whether it be an event or day sponsors for the rodeo. And 7 then, of course, we had the chili cookoff sponsors, the beer 8 brewing competition sponsors and et cetera, and we are 9 looking for more events this year to expand that and bring on 10 even more sponsors. 11 MS. CRADDOCK: I will say we -- we've already gone 12 and asked the City to put into their budget purchase this 13 year security, and they've actually already approved that. 14 We're also adding -- would like to add a dance this year in 15 the parking lot after the rodeo somewhere, so we've already 16 arranged for security for that. And we'd also like to see 17 about closing Flat Rock, or reserving Flat Rock Lake Park 18 also, and possibly close the Riverside Drive like we talked 19 about last year, Commissioner Oehler, for access for 20 contestants. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's not going to be long 22 before we're going to close Riverside for good. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's an agenda item all 24 its own there. 25 MR. FOSTER: Yes. 1-23-12 97 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see on the next agenda 2 item, "waive rental fees on tables and chairs." Now, this 3 one that we're talking about right now, you -- you're 4 requesting the use of the place. Are you requesting waiving 5 the rental fees as well? 6 MR. FOSTER: Yes, we are. 7 MS. CRADDOCK: Yes, sir, we are. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can do you that without 9 those words being written in there? 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just give them the use of it. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: I guess if the motion for use 12 includes "at no cost," I suppose you can, but I'm going to 13 defer to our County Attorney that's sitting right here on the 14 front row. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But specifically worded in 16 one, but not in that one, I was just wondering. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Good point. Good point. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Not a big deal to me. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Do you see a problem with that, 20 Mr. Henneke? 21 MR. HENNEKE: That the two agenda items don't say 22 "at no cost"? 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the one says "waive fees," and 24 the -- the first one that we're on right now for the use of 25 the facilities there does not say that. 1-23-12 98 1 MR. HENNEKE: I don't see a problem with that. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. We're one of the sponsors of 3 the event, and that's our -- one of our contributions. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what the sponsorship 5 means. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Yeah. Well, you just heard 7 from Kristan saying that the City's got security issues. 8 They've already got that plugged into their budget; possibly 9 some other things, I don't know what-all. And, of course, 10 folks at the Chamber are beating the bushes to get commercial 11 and business support for it, and we've got the Convention and 12 Visitors Bureau hustling participants, and it's just a great 13 big happy family event here. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I'm excited. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: I know you are. You would be. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This is a rodeo. 17 MR. FOSTER: Yes, sir. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And you're going to have a 19 dance out in the parking lot. 20 MR. FOSTER: Yes, sir. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's pretty exciting stuff 22 right there. Are you going to have a big star come in? 23 MR. FOSTER: Just me. (Laughter.) We haven't 24 narrowed down -- 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm talking about the -- 1-23-12 99 1 MS. CARLSON: Haven't narrowed it down. We want 2 you to approve this. 3 MR. FOSTER: We have not picked an entertainer yet. 4 We probably want to make sure we have a facility to do it 5 before we hire an act, but there are several acts that would 6 be within our budget that we could get. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Like, big stars? 8 MR. FOSTER: Not too big. More of like regional or 9 local type stars, yeah. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner, are you -- 11 MS. CARLSON: Are you volunteering? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm kind of applying for a 13 job here. I need to entertain, okay? Well, I was just 14 wondering, because I've seen that before out there, and 15 somebody went broke trying to bring in those big stars like 16 that too early. Okay. So, what's -- where are we? Sorry 17 for interrupting. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: We're on Item 21, Commissioner. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's do it. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I move approval. 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'll second. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second for 23 approval of Item 21, the use of -- my understanding being as 24 one of the sponsors, that's -- 25 MS. CRADDOCK: Absolutely. 1-23-12 100 1 JUDGE TINLEY: -- part of our contribution. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: At no cost. 3 MS. CRADDOCK: Absolutely. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Further question or discussion? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just a comment, that this thing 6 is growing, which is a good thing, but it's kind of -- 7 it's -- we're kind of a partner, but we're kind of not a 8 partner. Y'all are doing everything, but we're kind of a 9 partner. I just kind of -- we may need to get more of an 10 agreement, I think. 11 MR. FOSTER: Okay. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The following year as to really 13 what we're doing, and what our, you know, role is in it. And 14 just kind of -- first year kind of was, I know, put together 15 very quickly, but it just seems that we're going -- this is 16 going to be an annual thing. 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I guess we probably ought to 18 have it a little more tighter. 19 MR. FOSTER: You want to do that before 2013? 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll leave that up to the 21 County Attorney. 22 MR. HENNEKE: Well, there's a standard rental 23 agreement that I'm sure -- 24 MS. CRADDOCK: We signed one last year. 25 MR. HENNEKE: -- Jody, that they did. They'll have 1-23-12 101 1 to do it again. That sets forth all the conditions of use 2 for the facility. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think they provide the 4 insurance and that stuff. 5 MS. CARLSON: Yeah. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It seems that we're 7 participating more. I mean, you know, we're -- I don't know 8 if we have Maintenance involved. 9 MS. CRADDOCK: Absolutely. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, we're providing 11 maintenance; we're providing free use. It just -- I think we 12 need to think about this as we're going forward, because -- 13 you know, something to think about. 14 MR. FOSTER: Sure. 15 MS. CARLSON: I think you're just looking at 16 conditions of sponsorship. How about that? A sponsorship 17 agreement. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. If we're sponsors of it 19 and we're not all involved, I want to make sure I'm 20 comfortable with what y'all are doing. 21 MS. CRADDOCK: Sure. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm speaking for the County. 23 MS. CRADDOCK: Sure. I think we'll get together 24 and draw something up and bring it back to you. 25 MS. CARLSON: Sure. 1-23-12 102 1 MS. CRADDOCK: For this year -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If y'all are going to hire 3 Elvis Presley, as an example, we want to know about that. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Do you have a second? 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Got some ideas about the 6 entertainment, don't you? 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I do. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any other question or 9 comment? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 10 right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Item 22; 15 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to waive rental 16 fees for tables and chairs for the KerrFest event held at 17 Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center on August 10 and 11, 2012. 18 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Motion made. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 21 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 22 favor, signify by raising your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 1-23-12 103 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry: Item 23; 2 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to allow the 3 closure of Riverside Drive from 5 p.m. on August the 10th 4 2012, to 1 a.m. on August the 12th, 2012, for the KerrFest 5 event 2012. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Move approval. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 9 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 10 favor, signify by raising your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 13 (No response.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Anything else 15 you guys need? 16 MR. FOSTER: I want to touch on a couple things. 17 On top of the security, the City is also putting into their 18 budget having EMS and paramedics on-site for us this year, 19 and we would like to come back at some point, either to 20 Commissioners Court or individually with Commissioner Oehler 21 and Commissioner Overby, who we worked with last year, and 22 talk about a couple of things on the facility. We want to 23 see what the schedules are for those, such as being a couple 24 of electrical issues and seating issues, more than anything. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 1-23-12 104 1 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Good. 2 MR. FOSTER: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not a problem. And also, if 4 y'all -- are y'all going to have another Chamber mixer 5 sometime next month? 6 MR. FOSTER: Every month. 7 MS. CARLSON: Every month. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If you would like, I could 9 bring the plan and talk to the group about the plan for the 10 expansion and the renovation. 11 MR. FOSTER: I think that would be a great idea. 12 And I would also ask you to try to get on the Rotary -- the 13 Rotary meeting schedule and come and present it there. I 14 think both of those things would be great to -- 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I can handle that. 16 MS. CARLSON: And if there is anything that we can 17 do also outside of that, such as having open forums or open 18 meetings at the Chamber to do some education on that, we'd be 19 happy to as well. 20 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Good deal. Thank you. 21 MR. FOSTER: And I did talk to Steve Bauer last 22 week, as a matter of fact, about how we might be able to 23 include the livestock show association in KerrFest in some 24 way, whether it be a fundraiser for them or recognition or 25 something, so we are going to kick that around. And I do 1-23-12 105 1 think that would be important for us to try to get that -- 2 get that done for this next year. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: You'll have the folks out there on 4 the property. It'd probably be a good thing to remind them 5 of what they can -- 6 MR. FOSTER: I think so. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: -- look forward to if the right 8 things fall into place. 9 MR. FOSTER: Good deal. 10 MS. CRADDOCK: Thank you very much. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Appreciate it. 12 MS. CARLSON: Thank you so much. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to Item 19, if 14 we might, dealing with the capital items. Okay. You got 15 things all planned out in your mind there, Mr. Odom? 16 MR. ODOM: I think I can reply to Commissioner 17 Letz. I have a -- hopefully you have my list in front. But 18 I divided my list into two different areas. One was 19 property, and the other was an equipment list. And to reply 20 to Jonathan's question, I would take the property list as my 21 wish list, okay? When I got to the equipment list, I've 22 looked at that hard and long, and then I've had the 23 supervisors -- we've had a meeting on that, and then we 24 listed things that we saw as priority for increasing our 25 productivity. The things that we have here are things that 1-23-12 106 1 we do have, but maybe we have one of, so that was a priority 2 list, is what you're looking at here, that they felt would 3 improve their performance, instead of waiting for something 4 that we could add to it. So, I don't consider the equipment 5 list as a wish list; it is a priority, is the way we listed 6 that. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 8 MR. ODOM: So, the first part, I'll be try to be 9 quick on it and not take a lot of time. It was a Comfort 10 yard. We have discussed that, and we thought we had it at 11 that point, and the individual did an about-face on us and we 12 ended up not. So, that was my first priority, was looking at 13 for the future. This is future, that we would have something 14 in that Comfort area. As you've discussed here recently the 15 sewer. You start to look at that river from Center Point on, 16 I believe that that's where your growth's going to be in 17 development once that line gets -- gets in. So, I was 18 looking at moving -- having a yard up there to enhance our 19 productivity that they could go, instead of coming all the 20 way back into Spur 100. 21 The property back behind Road and Bridge, I was 22 looking at all 15 acres. It wasn't -- may be something less, 23 but I was looking at consolidating the Maintenance, putting a 24 new facility, which is listed here, that I could start to 25 service probably the Sheriff's Department, doing some things 1-23-12 107 1 that I just don't have the room now. We're pushed in that 2 little area that we have, and that if I could expand that, 3 then -- years ago, when we looked at the project for the ag 4 building, and all that would have been parking back in there. 5 You've already been talking about the -- thank you -- the 6 problems you're having as far as parking. I won't 7 necessarily say a problem, but the tightness that you had. 8 We had looked at and thought that that would be something 9 that the Court -- you never have enough land, and to be 10 centrally located is an ideal thing. 11 Because, remember what I'm saying; as you -- this 12 is Dr. Odom here. As you see the city grow, the growth is 13 going to be up that river towards you, Jonathan. The center 14 of town is going to change. It is just an excellent deal to 15 have that 16 acres there to have infrastructure. If you need 16 it, you've got the land. That's what I was looking at. And 17 that we could pull Maintenance for Tim, everybody to use that 18 facility, and maybe our front office that we have there could 19 be utilized in the capacity for the Court, whether it's 20 Commissioners having office space there. I've got an old 21 building back behind we can move into. So, it provides an 22 opportunity to do service up front, maintenance in the back 23 is the way I looked at that. Okay? Then we were talking 24 about resurfacing the Road and Bridge as well as the J.D.C. 25 parking lot there. That has been discussed, so I put that in 1-23-12 108 1 there. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Leonard, can we stop just a 3 minute? On this additional mechanic shop thing, so -- so 4 you're saying that you couldn't expand until you purchased 5 more property? 6 MR. ODOM: Well, I'm saying that I'm running out of 7 room. You start to push -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. I know that. 9 But that's what I'm hearing you say, though, is the mechanic 10 shop is an additional 5,000 square foot building. 11 MR. ODOM: That -- right. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You couldn't put a new five 13 -- a more -- 5,000 more feet building there without 14 purchasing additional property; is that what you're saying? 15 MR. ODOM: To answer your question, I don't believe 16 I can. Another 5,000 will put me right at the back gate, 17 right by the fuel islands. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 19 MR. ODOM: Only I'd have to keep a distance from 20 these fuel islands with any building. So -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And then -- and then the 22 300,000 that you have for the additional mechanics shop, that 23 is just for the 5,000 square foot building on it? It doesn't 24 mean new mechanics, new tools? 25 MR. ODOM: No. 1-23-12 109 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: New -- 2 MR. ODOM: No, it means additional personnel. If I 3 start to -- if we build this, the idea is to do maintenance 4 for the entire county. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Listen, I'm a huge 6 fan. I've been talking about that for -- since day one. 7 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I really like the idea. I'm 9 just trying to figure out how -- I mean, it says here 300,000 10 for additional mechanics shop. 11 MR. ODOM: That shop that I have in the back is 12 about 5,000 square feet. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 14 MR. ODOM: So you add -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Three bays? 16 MR. ODOM: Three -- well, I think it's four bays. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Four bays. 18 MR. ODOM: But it doesn't have the pit. It has a 19 lift and all. But we wanted to move the entire maintenance 20 portion of rebuilding things and doing that to service -- oil 21 changes and things like that we could do out of that 22 building. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Now, let me ask it 24 one more time. Does that include two or three new mechanics? 25 MR. ODOM: Probably at least two mechanics. 1-23-12 110 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This number right here 2 includes that? 3 MR. ODOM: No. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, that's just the building. 5 MR. ODOM: This is infrastructure. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right. So -- so at some 7 point, you need to address that. 8 MR. ODOM: Right. And I have one position that 9 hasn't been filled already, so we're sitting on one, so we're 10 looking probably at least one additional person if I did 11 that. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I really like that program. 13 I mean, I can see -- I don't know -- I don't think we've ever 14 really run the numbers, but if you maintained Rusty's 15 vehicles, the Maintenance vehicles and all of those people, 16 there's got to be a huge savings, a huge savings there. 17 MR. ODOM: And then -- 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Doing it in-house. 19 MR. ODOM: And set this up where they have two fuel 20 islands that the Sheriff's Department -- where he would have 21 something temporary over there, or where he could get into 22 our yard and fuel at night when they have the rotation and 23 all. We could have more room to put his vehicles that he's 24 not using up there for backup. Just a myriad of things I see 25 we could do, but you need the space. I just don't have the 1-23-12 111 1 space there. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I was going to recommend 3 that you move the Comfort yard money over to there, but if 4 you can't build it without that land behind you there, then 5 it's a moot point. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You can build it in Comfort. 7 Then we can move -- (Laughter.) 8 MR. ODOM: You know, maybe we look at 5 acres 9 instead of 16, if it could be bought that way. But I'm 10 looking across the board. If you expand the facility, which 11 you're going to, you're going to need more parking space. 12 There's a lot of area out there to park. We've even looked 13 at a shuttle service years ago, where people parked, and even 14 changed that crossing. And that -- and the wooded area is 15 ours, but I can't touch it because it's got trees on it. But 16 you could -- you could make a walk-through, work with the 17 highway and probably have a walk-through from there, as well 18 as a shuttle service to move people over to that facility. 19 They could walk right under the road right outside my fence 20 there. So, those are -- that's possibilities. That's my 21 wish list. The equipment is a list that I don't know if I 22 need to waste your time going through, but if you like, I 23 will. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- 25 MR. ODOM: Just tell me how much money I get, and 1-23-12 112 1 then I'll -- 2 JUDGE TINLEY: You'll allocate it. 3 MR. ODOM: I'll allocate it. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: On the equipment, Mr. Odom, would 5 any of these items be replacing items which you currently 6 have in the way of equipment? 7 MR. ODOM: Maybe the dump trucks. But -- you know, 8 as I would weed them out. But the others are -- 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tractors. 10 MR. ODOM: -- crack sealers -- not -- shredders. 11 It's upgrading my shredders; they're worn out. The box is a 12 chip box. Instead of putting it in a dump truck, it is more 13 -- I have one; it is very productive. I can get two to three 14 times the chips. I can fluff up in a dump truck, and it 15 saves dumping, more time on the job chipping, less fuel, less 16 trips trying to find a place to dump. A small bucket truck; 17 the guys really love that. Everybody's fighting over that to 18 have it, and I only have one. So, it's in addition to that; 19 it's not replacing. Broom, that one I would say I have one, 20 I think a 1984 or 1987, old. I'm looking to replace it. 21 That one I am looking to replace. A small steel wheel is an 22 addition. We use -- use that for maintenance, as well as a 23 sealcoat program with that basalt. It doesn't crush it; it 24 just sets it real good. And we want to -- the men feel like 25 that would be a good, productive thing. Everybody's always 1-23-12 113 1 looking for a steel wheel to do some patching and compaction. 2 Pneumatic roller is the one that I was upgrading, 3 one of the old rollers; I think it's from the '80's. The 4 1-ton cab with lift, that is what you see Michael going 5 around doing patching with. It's about a 3- to 4-yard dump 6 truck, little dump truck on a cabin chassis. Two 8- to 7 10-yard dump trucks, an additional water truck. I think I 8 have something from 1978 still running around, only we want 9 to upgrade that. I've got a couple of them. They're yellow 10 and you can't miss them. And then some vehicles for 11 supervisors, as well as myself. I have 187,000 on my truck, 12 and probably be pushing 200 certainly by October. I was 13 thinking of the Chevy Tahoe to replace that, to move that up 14 here that y'all want, and then have another one there that's 15 still a backup. I have about 44,000 on it, but it's a 2003. 16 The Court uses it, as well as other members of the court -- 17 or the courthouse up here, so we thought that would be a good 18 use there. You would have that little Tahoe to run around 19 where you want to. And tractors, I've got some that are from 20 the '90's, and we just want to upgrade. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Leonard, on the tractors, 80 22 horsepower seems big for an awful lot of the roads. 23 MR. ODOM: Well, we have 70's, and we're putting a 24 lot of strain. The men are saying they can't -- if they hit 25 hills, they can't hardly get up them with the 70 horsepower. 1-23-12 114 1 I'm like you. We had smaller ones. I went to the 70's; I 2 thought that would be good. And the guys say, you know, 3 pulling those shredders and all, that it's just not working; 4 that we ought to be going to about an 80 horse. So -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But we're not -- you're not 6 really talking about getting bigger shredders, though? 7 MR. ODOM: No. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 'Cause we have -- 9 MR. ODOM: The shredders would still be about 10 15-footers. Double -- double batwing is what we use. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And those are estimated 12 15,000 a piece now? 13 MR. ODOM: Yes. Yes, sir. It's not cheap any 14 more. And that -- I didn't fluff these numbers. We came up 15 with some things that we thought was going to be in there, 16 but that one we got a price on from Gillespie County over 17 there. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, okay. 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Total equipment, we have 20 about 315,000 in equipment requests, and then the vehicles 21 was 694, is what Leonard mentioned. And then the other was 22 land acquisition or other improvements that you had 23 mentioned. 24 MR. ODOM: Well, I -- is that correct? What 25 you've -- that doesn't sound like what I have here. 1-23-12 115 1 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: What did you have in the 2 purple, total? 3 MR. ODOM: The total was 2.3. 4 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Well, that's total. I'm 5 talking about individually, just equipment requests. 6 MS. HARGIS: He's got purple and blue. The purple 7 and blue one, more than -- 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Well, it's going to be a 9 million dollars. 10 MR. ODOM: I'm sorry, all I've got is this, so I 11 don't know. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I would -- I know the 13 list you're looking at. I don't know what Leonard has. I 14 think, certainly, the tractors and the -- 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Right. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- water trucks get moved to 17 the equipment category. 18 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Right. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We've got to kind of look at 20 those together. 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: There is one, yeah. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: You've got a different one 24 than I've got. 25 MS. HARGIS: His land and all, we'd only take off 1-23-12 116 1 about a million, two; a million, four. 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: A million, four for the land? 3 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. And all that -- so the rest of 4 it's all equipment, so you'd just say a million would still 5 be left. 6 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 7 MS. HARGIS: For all the equipment, yeah. 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay, that's what I had in my 9 mind. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Put a million max on there. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, we haven't started 12 cutting. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I know. You did -- if you 14 put a million max, you cut 1.3 out. 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's right. 16 MR. ODOM: There went the wish list. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Any more questions for Mr. Odom on 18 this? Thank you, sir. 19 MR. ODOM: Thank you. 20 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Thank you. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: S.O.? 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You can see there's only two 23 things on here. One's cars, and one's the radio for this 24 part. Cars, this is estimated on four vehicles per year for 25 five years, and that's probably very conservative at 50,000 a 1-23-12 117 1 vehicle. What that does, if you do four over five years, it 2 puts about 150,000 miles on a vehicle. Patrol averages about 3 30,000 a year. If you actually go five vehicles, which is a 4 full shift for four years, you're a little bit closer, but 5 either way, it's going to come out to just about that. One 6 shift, and that allows you, if you have five vehicles, which 7 would be close at today's prices, 50,000. Or then if you 8 would be replacing them once every four years, average of 9 30,000 miles a year, you're talking about 120,000 miles 10 before you move it off of patrol. And it's just -- they're 11 always -- and I have always told this Court that the new 12 vehicles always go to patrol. Now, we rotate those down, you 13 know. Like, one of my sergeant's vehicles, Tommy Hall, he's 14 probably got 120,000 miles on his Tahoe now. It's going to 15 get replaced on patrol this year, but that Tahoe will most 16 likely go down to warrants or something like that, or to the 17 courthouse, 'cause a lot of that's highway miles. It just 18 depends. But the patrol vehicles get the new. The radio -- 19 JUDGE TINLEY: The amounts that you have enumerated 20 there does not include any residual value of -- 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Trade-ins. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: -- those where they're rolled off 23 either, does it? 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, because a lot of them 25 rolling off are going to still stay in the department for 1-23-12 118 1 other uses. We don't replace C.I.D. vehicles or jail 2 vehicles or any of that with new vehicles. We either count 3 on doing that through seizures, or doing it through rolling 4 down current ones. 5 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: You replaced how many last 6 year? Was it three? 7 MS. HARGIS: Five. 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Five? 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We've got four ordered right 10 now. 11 MS. HARGIS: Four ordered right now. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: On our 2010 loan program, 13 where it says here we replaced three, is that where this came 14 out of that money at that time? 15 MS. HARGIS: Well, they squeezed four out of it. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We're putting a little bit of 17 seizure money in there also to be able to come up with the 18 fourth vehicle. 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Off that 150. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: In fact, probably that 22 practice probably needs to continue, doesn't it? 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: As long as the seizure is 24 there, we can. You know we have changed some things, and 25 changed some of the bidding stuff. 1-23-12 119 1 JUDGE TINLEY: On your digital radio switchover, -- 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Digital. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: -- what's the deadline on that? 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The -- right now, of course, 5 City of Kerrville's gone digital; Ingram's gone digital. 6 Sheriff's Office has not; we're still straight analog. What 7 this would be, one of the latest -- feds are recommending 8 everybody going digital. It's getting harder and harder. 9 You get a little bit better coverage; you get a lot clearer 10 and better audio. Our current radio system is now 12 years 11 old, okay. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I thought we did this. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, we went -- 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I thought we went to digital 15 two or three years ago. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Narrow band was the only thing 17 we did, 'cause that was required to be done by this January. 18 That's what we also assisted. That was looked at -- I told 19 y'all two or three years ago, digital, Bruce, it would have 20 been two million. 21 DEPUTY BARTON: Commissioner, what we did was order 22 equipment through grants that was digital-capable equipment. 23 We outfitted the cars with portable radios. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's what I was talking 25 about. I mean, it's not -- 1-23-12 120 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. The radio system, 2 okay, I'm talking about towers and -- and the radio. The 3 cars -- the equipment in the vehicles has been upgraded to be 4 able to go digital or analog. We don't have to replace all 5 the car radios. And we've helped also with the other 6 departments, you know, the fire departments and that, helping 7 them get some of that. But -- 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You're talking about tower 9 conversion or something like that? 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Tower conversion, so that you 11 can go to digital, okay? One -- we're saying 1.5 million. 12 What that is, is Clay just got notice from one county that 13 did do four towers, which is the same exact type system we 14 have, four towers, simulcast digital system, and I think one 15 of the major companies, Motorola's bid for that county came 16 in at $1 million. That's where the -- for a two-channel, 17 which is what we have now. Because of our fire departments 18 and because of a lot of things still needing to stay analog 19 also, all right, you -- we have a two-channel system. I'd 20 like to keep one of those channels digital and one channel 21 analog to help cover some of these other. Then you're 22 talking -- it does bump it up a little bit. I think they 23 estimated about one point -- 1,050,000 to do that. But by 24 the time it was installed and bids came through, and 25 incidentals, we put in 1.5 million to cover the radio system. 1-23-12 121 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And that gives you the 2 ability to communicate with everybody still? D.P.S.? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All the agencies? 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Definitely. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All the agencies? 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The ones around here, yes. 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Sheriff, is there any federal 9 money in the Homeland Security program to help with this? 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Most of the fed's money has 11 been cut. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: We've used that money before? 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We've always tried. You know, 14 I mean, we've tried. We've used -- we've been able to get 15 over a million dollars in grants. Now, that isn't just for 16 radios, but for major things. I'll constantly always try, 17 but I don't know what's going to happen to a lot of the 18 federal grants. It doesn't look good, from what we've been 19 seeing. And so to upgrade that system, because ours is 20 getting older, our maintenance is costing us more. Our 21 upkeep, our downtime is more, and I think four- or five-year 22 plan, we must look at radio system. 23 DEPUTY BARTON: Well, our current equipment, 24 gentlemen, is a simulcast system. If it gets out of 25 alignment, there's nothing in this equipment -- it was top of 1-23-12 122 1 the line when it was purchased. It's not able to re-sync 2 itself. We have to send -- somebody out of San Antonio has 3 to come up, put equipment on it to get the towers all back 4 re-synced. The new equipment now that they install 5 automatically re-syncs itself, so you never have 6 a synchronization issue between your four towers. It's just 7 the technology, in 10 or 12 years, has increased so much that 8 the -- 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The towers have to open 10 instantaneous of each other to keep the communication. 11 You're talking a millionth of a second type deal, is the 12 synchronization. Right now, without GPS and without that 13 type of technology and equipment on the towers, you know, if 14 it gets out of whack, we're out. You get the garbled. You 15 get the -- you know, you don't have communication in that 16 area until they can come up and re-sync them. 17 DEPUTY BARTON: Either that, or we have to go 18 manually turn off one tower and hope that three towers 19 stretch enough to kind of cover our needs. It's just an 20 upgrade of equipment based on technology improvements. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And we're hoping to be able to 22 use some of the equipment that is there, like the filters and 23 filter canisters and some of that, you know, if you'll 24 remember, the last time we also replaced. The consoles have 25 to be done, all that kind of stuff. So -- but this is 1-23-12 123 1 something that we're behind Kerrville. It didn't cost the 2 City that much. They have one tower, okay? We don't have 3 one tower. Terrain won't allow us to do that, the 4 geographical area we're at. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Can we use their tower? 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Use theirs? We use two 7 L.C.R.A. towers now. We use a Five Star tower, and the other 8 one is a -- 9 DEPUTY BARTON: Two Five Star. 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Two Five Star. 11 DEPUTY BARTON: We're trying also -- gentlemen, we 12 may try to do some tower movement, do some new propagation 13 studies. Because in towns with portable radios right now, I 14 watched the officer stand outside of Walmart on a traffic 15 stop, and he couldn't even reach our dispatch, because with 16 the portable radio, the signal has to go all the way out to 17 41, has to go all the way out Upper Turtle Creek, out of -- 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Cypress Creek. 19 DEPUTY BARTON: I think we can move a tower 20 location closer into Kerrville to give us more -- better 21 coverage in town. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Our in-town is our weak spot. 23 Inside this building, you go down -- you can't really talk on 24 the radio from inside. You'll see officers going outside to 25 do it, but you have those issues. But, you know, towers have 1-23-12 124 1 built out more. You know, our east tower was a little 2 bitty -- what was that, about a 50-foot tower that Five Star 3 is on? But there's a lot of that that can be done, but 4 that's where we're looking at. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any more questions? We'll be 6 in recess till 1:15. 7 (Recess taken from 11:46 a.m. to 1:18 p.m.) 8 - - - - - - - - - - 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to order, if 10 we might, from our lunch recess. We're on Item 19, to 11 consider, discuss, take appropriate action on list of capital 12 items for the prospective debt issue. I believe we were 13 through the Sheriff. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Boy, thank goodness. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Just in time for beans, 16 Buster. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: And the next one we've got is 18 Juvenile Detention. Kevin, do you want to run through what 19 you've got here right quick? 20 MR. STANTON: The main items that we have are -- 21 the big-ticket items that we have are the locks and the 22 control system, control boards at the facility. I've been 23 out there six years, and in the six years I've been out 24 there, the locks have not worked out there correctly since 25 I've been there. We've had six different companies come out. 1-23-12 125 1 We've had Brinks come out. They're Brinks locks; we've had 2 Brinks people come out. We've had, you know, Southern Steel 3 come out. We've had local locksmiths. We've had Tim's guys 4 come out. And for some reason, they just can't seem to get 5 the locks to work. And I've talked to Ray Dunn with Guardian 6 Security. He provided us a quote to change out the locks to 7 go to magnetic locks instead of the regular key locks that 8 we've been using. And along with the key locks -- I mean, 9 with the -- along with the magnetic locks, and then with the 10 control board to control it all out there, the facility, 11 that's what we're looking at. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And touch screen? 13 MR. STANTON: Yes, sir. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tell me how that works. 15 Somebody sits in the control room and bumps into -- has drank 16 too much whiskey for lunch, and falls into the control board 17 and opens all the doors? 18 MR. STANTON: That could actually happen now. 19 (Laughter.) It actually would work probably now better than 20 it would with the touch screen. The touch screen's 21 actually -- 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Have you thought about 23 telling them don't drink during lunch? 24 MR. STANTON: We do do that. The touch screens are 25 actually computer monitors that they can touch. Right now, 1-23-12 126 1 we have this board that's probably about as big as this 2 little -- half of this table, that's got push buttons that 3 you -- that you can open and secure, lock and unlock the 4 doors with. There's probably about eight doors that you're 5 supposed to be able to control with the control board that 6 you should be able to lock and unlock, that you can't. The 7 only way to unlock them or lock them is with a key. The 8 override works. We're still within standards. I mean, if we 9 hit -- there's one button you can push that will open 10 everything, every door in the facility, which keeps us within 11 the standards and those types of things. But as far as -- as 12 just being able to lock and unlock doors and use it like it's 13 supposed to be used, we cannot do that any longer. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And Guardian is a company 15 that's top of the line, well respected and all that? 16 MR. STANTON: Yes, sir. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Guardian's done a security system 18 for this courthouse, security system out at the jail, annex 19 building. When we've had issues with Guardian, literally all 20 it takes is a phone call, and they've got somebody here 21 generally at least by the next day, and they fix what they've 22 put in. 23 MR. STANTON: The current locks that we have out at 24 the facility, I didn't realize they were so expensive until 25 we started -- we actually tried to buy some, replace them, 1-23-12 127 1 tried to fix them, but they're right at $900 a piece for one 2 individual lock out there. And so we've -- the way that 3 they're configured, we can't get away from Brinks because of 4 the way the doors are drilled and the way the wires are run 5 through the hinges of the door and the electrical stuff. You 6 would have to replace the whole door system to change out -- 7 to go from, like, Brinks to a different company's type of 8 locks. That's the reason we're trying to get away from the 9 locking mechanisms they have now and go to the -- I think 10 they're 800-pound magnetic locks. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Use the same doors? 12 MR. STANTON: Yes, sir, we can use the same doors. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That was my next question. 14 MR. STANTON: We can use the same doors. We don't 15 have to -- the only thing that we have to do is, we'll have 16 to pull the old locks out, which I can do or Tim can do. And 17 that's something very simple, because we've been messing with 18 them and doing so much trying to get them to work right. And 19 all they'll do is come in and install the magnetic locks. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What kind of life expectancy 21 is there on those kind of locks? 22 MR. STANTON: I don't know the answer to that; I 23 really don't. I don't know the answer to that question. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Hope they'd last longer than 25 the type -- 1-23-12 128 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: About all you'd have to do on 2 those -- some of the access doors here at the courthouse, 3 they use a key fob to get in. Those are converted to those 4 magnetic. All you have to do is to replace that magnet once 5 in a while, but I don't see that it would be a cost. Most of 6 it's going to come from your -- your control panel, or how 7 you -- how you set it up to be accessed. It can be key fob, 8 it could be card, it can be control panel. It can be a lot 9 of different ways, but Guardian's done us pretty well in all 10 that. 11 MR. STANTON: The way they've talked about it doing 12 is we'll be able to control all the doors and locks from 13 inside the control room. It's just what we need to be able 14 to do. Also, we can assign individual access cards to the 15 different people, different workers, and they'll be able to 16 access certain doors, and we can assign -- whatever key they 17 have can only open certain doors, which right now we don't 18 allow. We've got three main doors or three exterior secured 19 doors -- we call them the red doors -- that we don't allow 20 the general juvenile supervision officers to carry the keys 21 to those doors, where if somebody happened -- and somehow a 22 kid got a hold of the key from one of the supervision 23 officers, they'd be able to get through the facility, but 24 they'd never get out of the facility, 'cause they couldn't 25 open the last door. And so that would be the same thing with 1-23-12 129 1 assigning the magnetic lock keys, the fobs or whatever you're 2 calling them. They can assign those -- those keys to be able 3 to open certain doors, and not the last secure doors, or the 4 red doors. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And then they're 6 reprogrammable, the fobs or the access, like we do it here at 7 the courthouse. Charlie upstairs reprograms those for -- if 8 you have an employee quit or leave or something, you can kill 9 that access off that card totally. You know, even if they 10 forget to turn the card back in or the fob back in, you can 11 reprogram it. It makes it multi-use; you do not have to 12 change keys and rekey everything. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: You've got a couple more items on 14 there, a couple of vehicles. 15 MR. STANTON: Yes, sir. We're looking -- we've got 16 two vehicles that we're looking to replace. We've got a 2000 17 Dodge van that we want to replace with something smaller. 18 It's a 15-passenger van. We're looking to replace it with 19 something smaller. And we've also got one of the Sheriff's 20 Department cars that we got about three years ago, I guess, 21 when they changed them over, and we're looking to replace 22 that car also. 23 MR. HENNEKE: Kevin, how would a Ford Escape be big 24 enough to transport juveniles over here for court? 25 MR. STANTON: Well, when I was talking to the 1-23-12 130 1 dealership -- the Ford dealership, he said the Adult 2 Probation were trying to decide which would be the easiest 3 and the cheapest way to do this, and he said that Adult 4 Probation had outfitted one of their Ford Escapes with -- 5 with a cage, and that it had worked well. And he gave me 6 that as a quote just real quick, and he told me to go look at 7 Adult Probation's car to see if it would work for us. 8 MR. HENNEKE: They don't transport people to court. 9 I mean -- 10 MR. STANTON: I just don't know why they would need 11 a cage in it. They said they put a cage -- 12 MR. HENNEKE: I don't either. 13 MR. STANTON: I haven't had a chance to go over to 14 Adult Probation to look at it yet, but he said generally it 15 would be in that same -- 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That wouldn't be enough 17 passengers, would it? 18 MR. STANTON: It would be two. We've got -- we've 19 got one van that we can haul up to six in. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You're still going to use the 21 one van for more -- 22 MR. STANTON: Yes, sir. This will be the -- the 23 other vehicle will be getting -- will be for long-term -- 24 long -- for the long -- you know, when we have to make 25 long-distance trips and things like that to T.Y.C. or other 1-23-12 131 1 different facilities; we have to transport kids, and when 2 we're just doing one or two kids. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That makes sense. 4 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Mm-hmm. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Get a lot better fuel 6 mileage. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: So, your -- your critical items, of 8 course, are the control system and the control doors. 9 MR. STANTON: Yes. And the locks, yes, sir. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. The vehicles -- 11 MR. STANTON: The one car that we've got that 12 belongs to the Sheriff's Department is in pretty bad shape. 13 It's got 126,000 miles on it. The transmission's going out 14 in it and the tires need to be replaced. It's -- I mean, we 15 could get it fixed. I'm not sure how much it would cost to 16 get it fixed. I don't know if it would be -- at this time, I 17 don't know if it would be worth trying to. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that the Ford Contour? The white 19 Ford Contour? 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's going to be a Crown Vic. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 22 MR. STANTON: One of the older Crown Vics. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: One that we replaced when we 24 did the first round of Tahoes, and that we passed down to 25 them. 1-23-12 132 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anything else we need to know 2 about what you've got on here, Kevin? 3 MR. STANTON: No, sir, that's it. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Any questions for Kevin? Okay. 5 Maintenance? 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Uh-oh. 7 MR. BOLLIER: Oh, yeah, I heard that. As you'll 8 see, I've got two -- two pickups, two F-150's there. I have 9 a 1995 white Chevrolet truck that is a four-door. That's got 10 right at 200,000 miles on it. I have a 2000 that I'd like to 11 replace. I got a 2001 pickup that Mr. Holekamp drove when he 12 was here. It's got right at 100,000 miles on it, that I'd 13 like to replace. But out of those two trucks, I would like 14 to keep one of them out at the Ag Barn, the two old trucks 15 out at the Ag Barn, because we use that for a fuel truck, and 16 all it does is go across the street and come back. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: That's the older of the two? 18 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. Yes, sir. And Ray will 19 pick up something after a while on the pickups. And then on 20 there, you'll see a Hustler ride lawnmower and another 3200 21 4-by-2 ATV and a compact tractor. The Hustler ride lawnmower 22 would really be great, because all we have is -- it's a 23 72-inch, and it's a 72-inch commercial grade mower, and the 24 two that we have are John Deere and 32-inch cut radius. And 25 another ATV would be great, because the one that we have, we 1-23-12 133 1 have -- we really need three during the stock show and three 2 during the fair, and three others, and that's about it. Most 3 of the time, two will get us along just fine. So, you know, 4 if y'all decide to cut that, I have no problem with that. 5 But number five, I have a CT-450 compact tractor, which I 6 already have two tractors out there at the barn. And if we 7 go ahead with this Ag Barn project, we're going to need a 8 third -- we're going to need a third tractor, and it would be 9 really great -- even though I know that I have an extra 10 position in the budget, I'm trying to keep from hiring. That 11 position is a compact tractor, and as you'll notice under 12 notes, it has a three-point rotary cutter, 72-inch. We could 13 really cover a lot of ground with that. 'Cause we do have a 14 rotary cutter, you know, a brush hog, but it's about -- I 15 don't know, probably one of the first ones made; it's pretty 16 old. Number seven, you'll see backhoe attachment. I do know 17 Road and Bridge has backhoes over there, and we've never had 18 a problem getting one. The only problem is that sometimes we 19 have to wait a couple of days. And it doesn't even have to 20 be a new one; I would even settle for a secondhand backhoe, 21 because when we need one, we need one. You know, I can't 22 wait some days. There's times that I can't wait two days. 23 And we're still hand-digging stuff up, when we could be using 24 a tractor that we don't have. An angle broom attachment, 25 that's on there in case the new project gets done. And I put 1-23-12 134 1 another skid loader on there just because the other -- the 2 other skid loader that's out there does not belong to the 3 Maintenance Department; it belongs to Adult Probation. And 4 so, you know, if they wanted, they -- it's theirs, so they 5 can use it any time they want it. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tim, on the -- between the skid 7 loader and the tractor -- 8 MR. BOLLIER: Skid loader -- I mean, tractor. I 9 need the tractor worse than I need the skid loader. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can't you do just about -- 11 isn't the skid loader just more versatile than a tractor? 12 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. But if I have a tractor -- 13 I have a brand new skid steer that we just got back after we 14 sold all this other equipment. The reason I have this -- 15 this compact tractor on there -- I believe I was talking to 16 Commissioner Oehler about it. The reason I have this on 17 there is because this compact tractor can hook the front end 18 of it where the bucket goes; every attachment that Bobcat 19 makes that fits a skid steer will fit this tractor. Plus I 20 have a three-point hookup on the back that I can put any kind 21 of three-point hookup back there, plus it also has hydraulics 22 back there that I could fix the back of that tractor and use 23 anything that Bobcat makes, or anything that they sell right 24 down here at Tractor Supply or Fredericksburg Equipment. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 1-23-12 135 1 MR. BOLLIER: Okay? We on the page? 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm going to say no to the 3 skid steer. 4 MR. BOLLIER: That's fine. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And no to the ATV. 6 MR. BOLLIER: That's fine. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Maybe one pickup instead of 8 two. 9 MR. BOLLIER: I can get by with one pickup. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I knew you could. 11 MR. BOLLIER: I'll mark one out, then. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I know you can get by without 13 another ATV. 14 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, I can. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That was his wish list. 16 MR. BOLLIER: That was kind of a wish part there, 17 but I just kind of throwed it all together. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I know. Just threw it in 19 there so we'd have something to say no to. 20 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The backhoe -- 22 MR. BOLLIER: That's really -- if you look at this 23 attachment, that's $13,000 for just the attachment, is what 24 I'm thinking. And I have not done this yet, but I'm thinking 25 that if I go online, go on the computer or go talk to 1-23-12 136 1 Leonard, I could probably find one, a used one for less than 2 that. A lot less. I don't know; I haven't looked. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If you need one immediately, 4 you can go rent one real quick. 5 MR. BOLLIER: Well, that's -- see, I mean, I don't 6 need a bob -- I don't need it every day. I need it once -- 7 maybe once, twice a year. That's it. I mean, so you -- 8 actually, if you buy that -- I'm just being honest -- it's 9 just going to sit there. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, I know it's going to -- 11 hoses is going to rot on it. 12 MR. BOLLIER: Rot on it. Rats are going to eat it. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably just as well to go 14 rent a mini excavator if you need a backhoe. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's a whole lot better. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You can do a lot more work. 17 MR. BOLLIER: I'm for anything. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I agree. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, you'd put rental money 20 in here, or in -- 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, just take it out of here, 22 and then just use regular budget if you need one. It's $250 23 a day or $350 a day to rent a mini excavator. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Those little excavators are 25 ten times better than a backhoe or tractor for a little more. 1-23-12 137 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm just curious where that 2 money would go. And, you know, would you -- I mean, is there 3 a rental line in his budget? Or -- 4 MS. MABRY: He has an equipment line. 5 MR. BOLLIER: It's an equipment line, or -- 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we would know what that 7 money's for, huh? 8 MR. BOLLIER: Mm-hmm. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: To rent that thing -- what 10 is it, an angle -- angle broom attachment? 11 MR. BOLLIER: It's like a street scraper, except 12 it's 6 foot -- it's 6 to 7 foot long. It's about this big 13 around, and it has attachments that goes onto the front of 14 the Bobcat, and all it does is sweep. You just put it down, 15 and -- 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: At an angle. You can sweep 17 stuff off the parking lot. 18 MR. BOLLIER: To the sides. It doesn't sit 19 straight. It sits like this, so when you go -- like a blade, 20 you push it all to the middle. You can just keep coming and 21 just do it all. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Leonard's got a new broom in 23 his, a good one. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner, I think the thinking 25 on that one was with a huge 50,000 square foot concrete 1-23-12 138 1 floor, -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mm-hmm. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: -- that you probably couldn't get 10 4 or 20 community service workers out there with a broom 5 sweeping that thing too effectively. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I think on that, he 7 needs to get one of those machines that -- that does the -- 8 that basically mops and vacuums and does the whole thing. 9 MR. BOLLIER: It's like a street sweeper, and you 10 can get it -- cut a 48-inch path. It's got two brushes on 11 each side, and you can swap the brushes out. And I think you 12 and I have talked about this, too. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 14 MR. BOLLIER: You can swap the brushes out to a 15 smooth surface or a rough surface. You can also -- it will 16 go in there; you can sweep it. It's kind of got a big water 17 tank on it. It will also more or less mop it after you sweep 18 it all out of there, and then you can also put seal -- not 19 sealer; you can also use it, like, for waxing and stuff like 20 that. But for -- 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's what we saw in -- 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We saw that in over San 23 Antonio. 24 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: San Antonio. 25 MR. BOLLIER: I did not put that on here, because 1-23-12 139 1 it was a major item. I mean, and I don't know if we're going 2 to do the project or not. I didn't put it on here. But for 3 a brand-new one is around $25,000. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'd much rather see you do 5 that, and take the 13 off of here and put that onto something 6 that's going to be useful. There is no way that you can get 7 enough people out there with brooms and mops to do that much 8 space economically, you know. 9 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Got to have it. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's got to be something 11 that's powered. And if that all gets done, that's going to 12 be almost 2 acres under roof. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Tim, didn't you tell me that you -- 14 on this machine, that multi-purpose machine, that you've done 15 some checking into those, and they've got reconditioned, 16 refurbished ones? 17 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, I did. And you can get -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: For about 50 cents on the dollar? 19 MR. BOLLIER: Somewhere between 10,000 to 13,000 20 for -- 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There you go right there. 22 MR. BOLLIER: -- for refurbished ones. I was 23 getting there. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That would be a whole lot 25 more useful. 1-23-12 140 1 MR. BOLLIER: It would be more useful than the 2 angle broom, yes. Because you've got a machine that can do a 3 lot of things versus a machine that can only practically do 4 one thing. 5 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: All right. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that what we're going to 7 do here? 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: So, what's that called? What 9 is that called, now? What kind of equipment is that? A 10 brush? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Floor maintenance machine. 12 MR. BOLLIER: Let's just -- 13 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Thank you. 14 MR. BOLLIER: -- just call it -- I'm just going to 15 call it a street sweeper, because when you put them side by 16 side, they're identical. They're identical. The only 17 difference is a street sweeper has different wheels on it -- 18 tires. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: He's talking about the big 20 ones like the city has. 21 MR. BOLLIER: I'm talking about the big ones. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This is a mini version of 23 that. 24 MR. BOLLIER: Yeah, this is a mini version. 25 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: All right. 1-23-12 141 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This is a Bobcat compared to 2 a D-9. 3 MR. BOLLIER: Yeah. And then you'll also see down 4 there, I took care of our Sheriff. There's a boiler on there 5 for the boiler room for $11,823. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: How critical is that? 7 MR. BOLLIER: Well, my view and Rusty's view is 8 going to be two different views, so I'm just going to say 9 it's -- let's just make it -- I'll make it a high priority 10 thing, because it really needs to be done in the next -- 11 probably next two -- couple years. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Is that 10 years old? 13 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. And it is starting to 14 rust. You can see the rust on the outside. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's about 16 years old. It's 16 -- it's going to be kind of along the same lines like the 17 Jail Commission recommended changing the metal showers to the 18 stainless. This may be something y'all just want to take off 19 this and look at the entire jail improvement stuff when we 20 get to it, and where you're going to go, because I think this 21 will all be done about the same time, whether it's the 22 boiler, the shower replacement, any type of expansion 23 whatever. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: That could certainly be included in 25 the existing jail upgrade package. 1-23-12 142 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's correct. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3 MR. BOLLIER: And -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The boiler's coming out? 5 What about the skid loader, Bruce? 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh, I put an "X" by that one. 7 He just got a brand-new one last year. That's another one of 8 those things he put in there for to us "X" out. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, we just "X" out the 10 entire Maintenance Department and go on to the next one, huh? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not quite. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: We got a few things in there. 13 He's got a truck. 14 MS. HARGIS: Can we go over it again? 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: One truck. He gets his 16 Hustler mower, 'cause he needs that so he can -- that will 17 save a lot of time and labor. 18 MS. HARGIS: Okay. ATV? 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The ATV, no. 20 MR. BOLLIER: No. 21 MS. HARGIS: Tractor? 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Compact tractor, -- 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- yes. Maybe so, yeah. 25 MS. HARGIS: Rotary cutter? 1-23-12 143 1 MR. BOLLIER: Yes. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Bush Hog, yes. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And that's it. 5 MR. BOLLIER: And that's it. The rest is being 6 cut. 7 MS. HARGIS: What about the cleaner? We put the 8 cleaner in place of the 13? 9 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Refurbished one. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, put in -- I would put 11 in one of those machines, refurbished, for -- 12 JUDGE TINLEY: In lieu of that broom. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: In lieu of the broom. 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Street sweeper. 16 MS. HARGIS: Do you want me to put 15,000, just in 17 case? 18 MR. BOLLIER: I would. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 'Cause that's going to be a 20 whole lot more useful. 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: You're going to need that. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll guarantee you, that's a 23 lot of concrete to clean. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Are we through with Tim? 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I imagine he's glad we're 1-23-12 144 1 through with him. I know he was expecting it. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: You know, he's told to do a wish 3 list, and -- 4 MR. BOLLIER: I did. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: -- that's what he did. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: About to be Christmas 7 year-round. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Ray? Looks like you're up next. 9 MR. GARCIA: I'd like to reduce my request to just 10 two vehicles there. Also, Tim alluded to earlier, I got a 11 prospectus from one of our local dealers here to give us some 12 numbers on vehicles. You know, I talked to Jeannie -- worked 13 with Jeannie on this, and this is for Animal Control, for 14 Maintenance. We can add Kevin in there for his vehicles. I 15 think, collectively, we got somewhere around 20 vehicles, or 16 right in there, all together. If you remember, when we 17 bought the vehicles for Environmental Health, Maintenance, 18 and Animal Control, we got a pretty good deal of about -- it 19 was $17,500 per vehicle, and that's way better than any 20 government -- Buy Board. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Beat Buy Board by quite a bit. 22 MR. GARCIA: We did. 23 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: You bought a large volume? 24 MR. GARCIA: Well, -- 25 MS. HARGIS: No. 1-23-12 145 1 MR. GARCIA: -- it was -- 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: How many did you buy? 3 MR. GARCIA: It was only our -- 4 MS. HARGIS: It was Ray's -- Ray's fantastic skills 5 with the sales agent. 6 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Good. 7 MR. GARCIA: We -- he had started out with those 8 vehicles for my department, and we ended up coming in at 9 17,500. And, again, these are brand-new vehicles, okay? You 10 know, they moved on. We got somewhere in the average of that 11 for Maintenance, and then for Animal Control also, okay. In 12 with that, I think I had one vehicle that was six or eight -- 13 I don't know how many years old. I think it was -- oh, 14 excuse me, it was a 10-year-old vehicle that we had traded 15 in, and they basically gave us money because they felt sorry 16 for us. (Laughter.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: How'd you get it down there? Drag 18 it down with a chain? 19 MR. GARCIA: And that's the thing, is what we have 20 to think about here and remember is that -- you know, that 21 the money that we traded -- that we got for a trade-in, you 22 know, that was tacked on, onto our price, even though we got 23 a pretty good price. Well, recently the Court authorized me 24 to get a new vehicle because of the vehicle that I had 25 running that -- I had the accident in and so forth. And that 1-23-12 146 1 vehicle, one of the 2008's that we bought, came in, and we 2 got another -- a damn good deal -- excuse me. We got a 3 $36,000 vehicle, or a $28,990-something government pricing 4 for $15,000, because our trade-in was worth 13,000. Now, 5 that's -- that's on a four-year-old vehicle. The mileage was 6 up there also on that gray vehicle, okay? You know, "What 7 can you do for us again?" Went over there and visited with 8 them. And, again, it came in -- okay, at four years old, our 9 vehicles, if we collectively go around into the departments 10 that I talked about -- Maintenance, Animal Control, myself, 11 and Kevin's Juvenile Detention -- you have vehicles that 12 they're trading in. You know, you just said 100,000 miles; 13 you got a 2005 and whatever vehicle that he got from Rusty. 14 You got basically nothing for the trade-in. I think you got 15 1,000-something for trade-in? 16 MR. STANTON: Mm-hmm. 17 MR. GARCIA: You're probably going to get -- 18 MR. BOLLIER: 500. 19 MR. GARCIA: Whatever, yeah. Okay. So, you know, 20 let's look at what -- if we were to do this deal today on 21 vehicles, okay, my two vehicles that I got right now, I got 22 the appraisal for my vehicles, the two that I wanted, okay? 23 One vehicle is worth $13,000. The other one was worth 24 $13,500. Okay, that's trade-in on a four-year-old vehicle. 25 Okay. Now, let's remember also maintenance cost, okay? 1-23-12 147 1 That's the inside of four years, so three years they're under 2 warranty; we don't pay anything, you know, outside of 3 anything that happens in the warranty. Okay. All that's 4 taken care of through the dealer. Warranty's taken care of. 5 Oil, if you can find a good deal -- I think Len was talking 6 about trying to get all our maintenance done for us. We can 7 do a pretty good deal on that; you're taking that cost out of 8 it. It's the maintenance cost for all of our vehicles. If 9 something happens to the vehicle, that's covered under 10 warranty. 11 Now, let's move ahead, okay? We got four-year-old 12 vehicles right now. The two that I want to trade in are four 13 years old. If I go two years out -- this is the prospectus 14 he gave me, okay? If I go two years out, which makes my 15 vehicle six years old, which makes some of Tim's six years 16 old and Janie's six years old, the vehicle's now worth $5,000 17 trade-in, okay? Okay. Now, minus the dealer's maintenance 18 cost and prep cost that they have to do when you trade in a 19 vehicle, that's $2,009.75, minus that 5,000 that they're 20 going to say that our trucks are worth, so it comes out to 21 $2,990.25 that that vehicle, two years from now, is going to 22 be worth. The numbers are there. It makes good sense to me. 23 I think, in talking to the Auditor -- and I'm -- you guys 24 know, I mean, we can't get better deals than that, to me, I 25 think. In looking at government buy boards and whatnot, 1-23-12 148 1 you're just not going to get that, that type of deal. 2 We've got a good rapport with these guys, and 3 we're -- the money's being spent in Kerr County on top of 4 that. The numbers are there. They're good numbers right now 5 at a four-year term. I mean, we're not getting new vehicles. 6 We're not going to put the mileage on that the Sheriff puts 7 on, obviously, but I think we're one of the next highest 8 ones, and Janie also, because we're out there and patrolling; 9 those miles come up quick on our vehicles. Tim's back and 10 forth all over the county for maintenance; same thing. But 11 at the end of the day, if the County waits any longer on some 12 of these vehicles, we end up paying basically full price for 13 the vehicle, because our vehicles are not worth anything if 14 you take them out to 100-something thousand, or six, eight, 15 ten years. Those are the numbers. 16 Again, as I said, for a whole -- that's what will 17 happen to these other departments, but I am -- as I said, I'm 18 just requesting two instead of the three that we have, and 19 those two vehicles would come out to be, respectively, 20 15,846.67 and 15,346.67 for a vehicle -- per vehicle. And 21 that's minus the cost of decals and whatnot and, you know, 22 equipment to put on them. But I think that's -- you know, 23 that's a pretty good deal, if you look at the cost of what, 24 you know, the County can save in terms of maintenance and 25 vehicles under warranty. 1-23-12 149 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, what's the total that you 2 need? 3 MR. GARCIA: I think my total was different. I 4 think -- Jeannie? 'Cause I'm going to just request one. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: I got 58,210, approximately, for two 6 vehicles. 7 MR. GARCIA: We added the graphics in. 8 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, we added the graphics. 9 MR. GARCIA: We added the graphics and toolboxes 10 and grill guards. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: I just took his number, divided by 12 three and multiplied back by two. I mean, I'm using his 13 number. 14 MS. HARGIS: How much? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: 58,200. 16 MS. HARGIS: Well, I think we used -- if he didn't 17 trade them in, which is the other, so that -- on these 18 numbers, 'cause we didn't know which way you were going to 19 go. So, since it was a five-year program, we gave you -- we 20 just took them out. You might want to trade them in, so 21 these are brand-new vehicles, so if we trade them in, you 22 know, it's going to be a whole lot less. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: A lot less than that. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: The net cost for these are -- are 25 about -- 1-23-12 150 1 MS. HARGIS: 28,000 each. That's what we've got 2 over there. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: -- 15,8; 15,9. 4 MR. GARCIA: Right, for each unit. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Looking at 32? 6 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Mm-hmm. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Plus the graphics and all 8 that. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: 32 net, yeah. 10 MR. GARCIA: We have to add the graphics and 11 toolboxes. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Your number there does not include 13 the graphics? 14 MS. HARGIS: No, sir. 15 MS. MABRY: It doesn't include the graphics. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, okay. 17 MR. GARCIA: They have the -- 18 MS. MABRY: It's approximately $390 per vehicle. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 20 MS. MABRY: Just to do the graphics, $390 per 21 vehicle to do the graphics. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. So, 400 times two 23 would be 800, right? 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. That runs it up to -- 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 32,8. 1-23-12 151 1 JUDGE TINLEY: -- 59,000. 2 MS. HARGIS: I think we have to do grill guards and 3 all that. 4 MR. GARCIA: Grill guards and toolboxes. 5 MS. HARGIS: 35,000, at least. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Maybe we better change -- 7 MS. HARGIS: The grill guards -- 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They changed the frame style. 9 MS. HARGIS: Plus we have to pay to have the radios 10 switched. 11 MR. BOLLIER: I forgot to add on these trucks I've 12 got here, there is a trailer package, grill guard, 13 and eight-crack for 22,9. That's eight-crack, trailer 14 package. And if you don't put the trailer package on, you 15 don't get it. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: It's how much per? 22-what? 17 MR. BOLLIER: 22,908. That's that eight-crack, 18 grill guard, and trailer package. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: 23 and 4 is 2,700. Four for the 20 graphics -- 400. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Think we confused the issue 22 even more? 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I think what Ray was trying to 24 say is what the cost -- when you add in deer guards, the 25 graphics and everything else, it would come out to right at, 1-23-12 152 1 total, about 35,000, is what I'm seeing. 2 MR. GARCIA: Yeah, right. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: For two vehicles, the total of 4 35,000. As long as you add the trade-in. 5 MR. GARCIA: That's with the trade-in. 6 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's with the trade-in. 7 MR. GARCIA: And again, for Tim and Janie, again, 8 depending on their vehicles, that's going to -- we're going 9 to come out a little different on -- 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Little less. 11 MR. GARCIA: -- on everybody's vehicle. But, yeah, 12 theirs will be less than mine. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you fixing to do one 14 here -- Number 14, four-wheel drive vehicle for 35,000. What 15 is that? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's going to be a whole 17 different vehicle. That's going to be more of your 18 four-wheel drive police package type use for the constables, 19 not just a regular truck. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Any more questions for Ray? Okay. 21 Thank you, Ray. 22 MR. GARCIA: All right. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Animal Control? Is Janie here? 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, she's working. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 1-23-12 153 1 MS. HARGIS: She still has three, 'cause she needs 2 three on the road. And then the other two are the single 3 cab. She doesn't need these right away. The single ones she 4 just got last year -- is it last year? 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. 6 MS. HARGIS: And then the -- but she has the same 7 ages as his. The four-year-old ones probably do need to be 8 replaced. She has more miles on hers than Ray does. So, she 9 has three F-150's that she needs to replace, and she can get 10 a trade-in on hers, but we haven't taken hers over to be 11 evaluated or appraised yet. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: What about the chest freezer? 13 MS. HARGIS: The freezer, we took off. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Took off? 16 MS. HARGIS: Off. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Turtle Creek School building, wipe 18 that out. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I thought I'd go for a 20 little double-dipping there. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Looks like you were working 22 on it. 23 MS. HARGIS: I.T. is here. I think he needs to 24 increase his. John? 25 DEPUTY BARTON: He's right behind you. 1-23-12 154 1 JUDGE TINLEY: If we just give you a million, 2 you'll go away, huh? 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what it looks like. 4 MS. HARGIS: No. 5 MR. TROLINGER: Should I run? Good afternoon. I 6 apologize, I don't have for you a really prepared, itemized 7 list. I just e-mailed the Auditor my estimate this morning. 8 I just got my numbers -- a couple of numbers late Friday 9 after 6 p.m. So, I've done everything I could to -- to get 10 the best, closest estimate I could for a five-year plan. I'm 11 pretty comfortable about one year out. Five years is harder 12 to do. So, with that, this year we're at 191,000 for capital 13 on I.T. Last year it was about 119; that was a low year. 14 The year before was about -- it was estimated about 300, and 15 I think we came in about 258. So, it varies year to year, 16 depending on what's going on. We need to refresh some 17 servers. We've got new projects, things like that, but 18 typically what I want to do is even out the cost of replacing 19 computer hardware that we know is going to need to be 20 replaced. For example, the servers. I know that I need, 21 over the next five years, to replace certain servers, and 22 I've got a rough idea of how much it's going to cost, but 23 it's not exact. The -- the desktop computers, we've got 268 24 or so, and we've got 24 laptops on the list, and I can 25 estimate the cost of those, and then add the software and 1-23-12 155 1 things like that, the hardware, the printers, all those line 2 items, and come up with those numbers for you. And -- and 3 that's included. On the software, we've got the typical 4 software licenses that we refresh each year for the 5 anti-virus and whatnot. But the -- the big-ticket items that 6 I've got on the five-year, aside from the -- the 7 workstations, the regular 20 percent or so per year 8 replacement, is time entry software. Human Resources has 9 asked for an automated way to take the time reporting from 10 the employees and put it straight into the payroll system. 11 That's on there for about $13,000. There's probably a 12 server -- we need to replace the Incode server as part of 13 that, so I've got that in there. The Tax Office -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: The 13, does that include the 15 server? 16 MR. TROLINGER: No, sir. The server's about 9,000, 17 I'm estimating. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Well, I recall, John, in your 19 defense, I remember when we were talking about getting these 20 numbers together so that we could start crunching them, you 21 had mentioned that, boy, it's going to take me a while to get 22 this information. I'll do my dangdest, if I can get it 23 within that time. But it sounds to me like it's just now, 24 some of it, starting to come in. 25 MR. TROLINGER: And I've just barely gone around to 1-23-12 156 1 the offices. I apologize for the ones I haven't seen in 2 person to ask them what they need. And I think I've hit the 3 J.P.'s by asking J.P. 3, you know, what do you think we need 4 to do, and things like that. But I may not have everything 5 done. So -- 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, you mentioned J.P.'s. What 7 about the J.P. Technology Fund? How much money have we got 8 in that fund that we might utilize for technology needs for 9 those J.P.'s? Because that's all it can be used for. 10 MR. TROLINGER: Occasionally, we do we make a 11 purchase if something unplanned, unbudgeted in the regular 12 capital budget comes up. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Do we have -- do we have a wealth of 14 money in there? 15 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, there's -- there was about -- 16 yeah, we had about 40,000 at one point, but I haven't looked 17 at it in a couple-three months. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, for what we can utilize it 19 for, I think we need to look at that, because that continues 20 to replenish. 21 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. But John's number here -- and 22 then he says he may need another 100; it's 1,173,249. This 23 probably needs to go to a million, three to make all of 24 the -- and his numbers are tighter than in -- you know, the 25 entire -- 1-23-12 157 1 JUDGE TINLEY: What you're telling me is the 2 technology fund's not going to make up the difference? 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: A stretch, huh? 4 MS. MABRY: We've got about, right now, 62,6 in 5 there. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: 62 in the J.P. Technology? 7 MR. TROLINGER: That's great, because if we run 8 into something, somebody says, "Hey, we need this new 9 project," we're going to use it for the J.P.'s for that. So, 10 I haven't tagged that specifically for capital projects every 11 year. 12 MS. HARGIS: We're changing from the Windows 7 -- I 13 mean the Windows we're currently under to the new -- 14 MR. TROLINGER: Yeah. The regular desktop 15 computer, it's all old news. It's the same thing we've been 16 doing for seven years, but I wanted to highlight that we have 17 the electronic time entry, which is going to automate us with 18 Incode -- with Tyler Technology Incode. With the -- let me 19 talk about the courtroom automation. We want to take the 20 courtrooms and make electronic signatures, and we want to 21 automate the judges so that they have a -- a tablet computer 22 instead of a big pile of paper that the clerks are hauling 23 back and forth, something along the lines of what Rob's doing 24 with his office, where he's taken and scanned every single 25 case document in. And you see him in the courtroom today; 1-23-12 158 1 he's got a laptop with him, a small netbook-type laptop. He 2 wanted to take that paper handling -- I can't tell you how 3 many cents per page, but, gosh, it's at least break-even when 4 we get rid of that stuff, when we get rid of that paper 5 handling and automate that. Plus, just the efficiency of 6 everyone being able to join in and see what's going on, 7 instead of the one paper file sitting in the clerk's office 8 with, you know, "Hand me this." So -- 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You name the judges? 10 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: All right. Now, what 12 judges? 13 MR. TROLINGER: Well, specifically, Judge Tinley's 14 court would be able to use that where the clerk would 15 actually prepare the cases for him and then hand him the 16 tablet, and he'd be able to look through. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, there's one. 18 MR. TROLINGER: The County Clerk's got two courts. 19 MS. PIEPER: County Court at Law, County Court, and 20 I believe District Judges as well. 21 MR. TROLINGER: And I haven't spoken with the 22 District Courts about it yet, but I'm sure once the others 23 come on board, that we'll see them join in. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Just like they've done with video 25 teleconferencing. 1-23-12 159 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Be right on board. 3 MR. TROLINGER: There's -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They don't want to rush into 5 this thing, do they? 6 MR. TROLINGER: It's not -- it's not an easy thing. 7 It's a five-year plan. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, now, look, I agree 9 with you. I just want to make sure that you really have a 10 real, live plan, though, when we're doing this thing of who's 11 going to be on board. I mean, I agree with you. I see the 12 technology -- 13 MR. TROLINGER: And that's -- with my time 14 constraints here, I just haven't had a chance to go and -- 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You need to get you a job 16 and do something with your life, John. My lord. 17 MR. TROLINGER: -- and build a consensus on what we 18 want to do, but I do have from County Court at Law, the 19 County Clerk's office, which are the largest, really, volume 20 that they want to do this. And that's where the efficiency's 21 going to be, in the large volume. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I sure hope we can. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: John, all you've talked about 24 pretty much seems like hardware. What about software? 25 MR. TROLINGER: That's what this is. It's -- 1-23-12 160 1 there's a tablet, but the software cost -- the implementation 2 is the significant cost. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, more of the -- what's 4 that thing we use that everyone's always mad about? 5 MR. HENNEKE: Odyssey. 6 MR. TROLINGER: That's part of Odyssey. Electronic 7 signatures and the tablet and the courtroom automation is 8 part of Odyssey. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But it seems like I was -- this 10 gets us through all of the new things we're going to have to 11 buy for the next five years that we're aware of? 12 MR. TROLINGER: That's right. The -- the other 13 major piece is the Tax Office. We've got a desire to change 14 the accounting and tax collection system. I'll tell you what 15 that's going to do, is it's going to integrate us with 16 Central Appraisal and with Kerrville Independent School 17 District, and with the City, so that all these collections 18 are on the same system, maybe on the same hardware. And 19 we'll be able to work together, so that when the City goes, 20 "Well, we want you to collect for us again," it will be much 21 easier to make the transition, much less expensive. I tried 22 to get the number -- that was actually one of the numbers I 23 was on the phone with after 6:00 on Friday. We're trying to 24 get an idea how much does it cost, because it's not just the 25 software license; it's the implementation where you have 1-23-12 161 1 people come in and they're here on-site. That's really the 2 cost of these systems, is what -- 3 MS. HARGIS: Training. 4 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, the on-site training. And the 5 training on-site, so the software license is not so much. 6 There's the recurring cost of the software also, the 7 maintenance fees, and I've put that on my 2013 numbers. It 8 does increase us about -- about $12,000 per year over what 9 we're paying now, which is about 160 county-wide for software 10 maintenance. And I think I'm at the bottom of my list here 11 for the five-year, and it's $1.17 million, is what I have for 12 five years with Information Technology of capital numbers, 13 items including software, hardware, desktop replacement -- 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: 1.17? 15 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The Auditor said 1.3, so 17 we're -- 18 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. Well, he has another -- 19 MR. TROLINGER: And I did get that added in. 20 MS. HARGIS: Oh, did you get that added in? 21 MR. TROLINGER: I just missed something this 22 morning on phones; I wanted to make sure it was on there. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Now, Buster was asking about this 24 coming on board thing, that I think you questioned whether or 25 not that included this video teleconferencing stuff. Right, 1-23-12 162 1 Buster? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's exactly where I was 3 going with it. 4 MR. TROLINGER: And it's hard to judge what the 5 judges will do. You know, will they take and use it? 6 Because if I budget for it, at least we've got the 7 opportunity. We can certainly implement the County Court at 8 Law, which is the high-volume court, and then not add the 9 others later, and the cost is proportionally less. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You could add County Court 11 at Law, which is the high-volume, and not add the others 12 later? 13 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. And I've got pricing 14 that gives me the whole spectrum to that, but I put in the 15 highest dollar value -- that's about $90,000 right now -- to 16 do all the courts. I counted about 10 courts, including the 17 J.P.'s, to give us the -- you know, the big picture, and then 18 we can reduce it if we -- the others don't participate. 19 MS. HARGIS: District Judges have already asked for 20 that, for the iPads, the notebooks. I mean the small -- 21 MR. TROLINGER: It's basically a big -- a big iPad. 22 It's maybe twice the size. It's large enough so you can read 23 the thing. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If they want it, we need to 25 drag our feet. 1-23-12 163 1 MR. TROLINGER: That's the big picture, and I can 2 give y'all the details once I've -- once I've got a couple 3 more numbers. I'm not comfortable with all the numbers. For 4 example, I really want to be able to tell you that, you know, 5 a server is going to cost 3,400, and a license for it's going 6 to be 4,600, but I've had to estimate in a lot of places, so 7 I don't have a firm on that. But this is the best estimate I 8 could bring today. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, could you ask him to 10 put all that down for us? Or you want me to remember all 11 that? 12 JUDGE TINLEY: I thought you had it. He's got it 13 here. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I do, but I'm just concerned 15 about y'all. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: John's going to -- as he gets these 17 numbers in and he gets them more -- more refined and more 18 accurate, he's going to put together an entire schedule for 19 us. 20 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's going to -- that's 22 going to go to 1.3 million? 23 MR. TROLINGER: Oh, no, sir. I've got -- today's 24 number is all I know. I don't know if it'll go up. I hope 25 it'll go down. That's my anticipation. 1-23-12 164 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Me too. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 3 MR. TROLINGER: Generally -- 4 MS. HARGIS: Take it to a million, two. 5 MR. TROLINGER: Generally, each year I hear 6 complaints from the Auditor that I haven't spent all the 7 money, and that Road and Bridge has done a good job, because 8 they know exactly what they need. But I.T., I don't know. 9 So, if I can make do with not replacing the laptops, then 10 we'll keep the ones another year. We'll keep them another 11 year. For example, Commissioners Court laptops; I've got a 12 plan on replacing those over five years. We may not do it. 13 It's just hard to know. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I would think probably so, 15 in five years. 16 MR. TROLINGER: But I can tell you next year what 17 we're going to do. I know how many computers we need to 18 replace, that we need to have replacements for. But five 19 years is just difficult to do. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, Judge Brown -- the 21 District Judges, Judge Brown, and what's-his-name over here. 22 MR. TROLINGER: Well, not Judge Brown specifically, 23 because I understand that we've got a -- it may be the last 24 term of office for his court. So, we may have -- we'll 25 probably have turnover there at some point, and I think 1-23-12 165 1 that's when we're anticipating implementing -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: His court's really what I 3 was talking about. 4 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, you'd have the three; 6 that's four. That's four judges when you -- 7 MR. TROLINGER: That's right. But more 8 importantly, it's the clerks and, for instance, the County 9 Attorney that are willing to do this, that want to do it. 10 They're the driver behind all that. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: And, of course, the District 12 Attorneys. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What about District 14 Attorneys? 15 MR. TROLINGER: Not sure. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you afraid to talk to 17 them? Are you scared of them? 18 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm kidding. Yeah, really. 20 MS. PIEPER: If we don't hand them a file, they'll 21 have to look at the computer. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I would think that 23 they'd be going that direction too. I mean, I would think. 24 MR. BOLLIER: John, I have a question for you. 25 Can't you -- can't you use that tablet -- can't you use that 1-23-12 166 1 tablet like a computer? Can't you get your e-mail and all 2 that stuff on there too? Or can you? I thought you could. 3 MR. TROLINGER: Well, this particular function 4 is -- it's fixed for the courts. 5 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 6 MR. TROLINGER: It's just for the courts, and we 7 don't want to put other things on it that might break it. We 8 want it to work when they come in at 9 o'clock, and they say, 9 "Okay, great, it's working." 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Quit mucking things up. 11 MR. STANTON: How about separating Juvenile and 12 Sheriff's Department? 13 MR. TROLINGER: From what? 14 MR. STANTON: In Odyssey. They're killing us. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: They're killing us; they keep 16 missing with our computer. 17 MR. TROLINGER: And that's where my timeline is. I 18 just didn't have time to sit down and -- and talk with 19 everyone to find out what we need to do. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, John. 21 MR. TROLINGER: You're welcome, sir. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Schedule to follow. 23 MS. HARGIS: On -- on Gene's vehicle, as you 24 recall, we gave him the Expedition that was here at the 25 courthouse. He now has 98,000 miles on it. It needs a new 1-23-12 167 1 transmission; it needs a brake job. It won't go past 82 2 miles an hour. And he had asked if he could get a four-wheel 3 drive, and that will be depending on the price, because of 4 where he goes. But, remember, by the time we put graphics 5 and bars -- you know, he doesn't need the radio system, 6 because he has that; it will just be switching over. But all 7 of the cars that I got for the other constables ended up at 8 $35,000 by the time we put graphics and the guards and 9 everything on them. This one won't have much of a trade-in 10 value, I don't think, the one we have. How old is that one? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If you remember, we never 12 have purchased a car for Precinct 4. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh, I know. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This will be the first time. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, I know. 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Can you give us a trade-in 17 value? 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We got a lot of credit coming 19 in Precinct 4. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's about a 2002. 21 MS. HARGIS: About a 2002 vehicle that he has. 22 So -- and he's traveling a lot more miles and trying to cover 23 a lot more territory than had been done in the past. So, you 24 know, as he said to me -- and living out in Precinct 4, I 25 mean, we don't live on normal roads out there. 1-23-12 168 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Ah. 3 MR. BOLLIER: Oh. 4 MS. HARGIS: We have to -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: One thing Gene -- 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What about Jody? Can we 8 address Jody's road? 9 MS. HARGIS: Jody's road's bad too. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: One at a time, okay. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: If I can say one thing Gene 12 does do, as Bruce can attest to, during fires, all that kind 13 of stuff, he's trying to help run equipment to the 14 firefighters and that. So, for him, a four-wheel drive 15 vehicle would be a good idea, and it does cost a little bit 16 more. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What about floods? 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I guess he can try and turn it 19 into a boat. I'm not going to. 20 MR. HENNEKE: We haven't had any since he's been 21 constable. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I'm saying -- hasn't 23 rained. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: I thought I taught one how to swim 25 one time, but it didn't work. (Laughter.) 1-23-12 169 1 MS. HARGIS: I'm sure we would get a bid on it, and 2 if the Court didn't want to purchase one, we wouldn't 3 purchase one. So, I mean, that's just the request. And I 4 put the money in similar to what we gave the others. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you still talking about 6 the $35,000? 7 (Ms. Hargis nodded.) 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you talking about 9 getting your road fixed? 10 MS. HARGIS: Well, I'd like to get my road fixed, 11 but I can't, because I have a gate that you have to go 12 through -- 13 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: He's got an '02 right now? 14 Is that what he has? 15 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The one that came from the 17 Sheriff's Department, I believe. 18 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Rusty car. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Sitting down here that we let 21 him have, you know, when Bob retired. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Gentlemen -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And the Sheriff's, that's 25 deferred for another topic, right? 1-23-12 170 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, the -- 2 MS. HARGIS: The jail? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. Could we go through here 4 and do them one at a time, and then we'll give you a sum, 5 what you're going to cut off? 6 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That would be good. 7 MS. HARGIS: Page 1? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. 9 MS. HARGIS: I'm assuming the first four items are 10 staying. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. 12 MS. HARGIS: Okay. Road and Bridge? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Leave Comfort -- leave all the 14 property acquisitions, in my mind. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It would be nice to have that 16 property behind there, but I just don't know that -- I think 17 that's an inflated price. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. And he -- in his talk 19 a while ago, he said something about just -- the possibility 20 of just having a part of it? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can you get -- will they cut 23 part of it out? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No one knows. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: From the back fence up to 1-23-12 171 1 that little building? 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't know. 3 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: It's an option you could 4 explore -- he should explore. He brought it up. Might be 5 able to inquire see if there's any option. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, it seems -- I don't 7 know that that's the best location in the county for us to be 8 building a large Road and Bridge yard. That's expensive real 9 estate. If we're going to expand the Road and Bridge yard 10 long-term, it needs to be moved east, of course. (Laughter.) 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: East, of course. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just out of Comfort 13 somewhere. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I just -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Downtown Comfort. 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Kind of knew that was coming. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't see investing in 19 property there to store -- 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You may be right. You may 21 be right. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You can buy cheaper property 23 east somewhere. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If we were going to buy it, 25 it would be to utilize in conjunction with what we already 1-23-12 172 1 own. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. But we also have -- I 3 mean, at that price, they're storing a lot of their material 4 over there on the other side of Spur 100. I mean, you can 5 buy something cheaper out -- you know, out of town somewhere 6 and put a maintenance barn over there. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How far out of town? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Comfort. (Laughter.) 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You know, Ingram's got a 10 really nice yard. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. Ours is getting full, 12 too. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, it is getting full. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I did -- I think, you know, 15 it's probably more around Center Point makes more sense. The 16 property that was -- came available recently for the Comfort 17 yard was -- the property that was available for a little bit, 18 that was very well suited for it. There's already structures 19 on it. That fell apart, but, you know, somewhere around the 20 airport. Heck, I mean, maybe we ought to use part of the 21 airport property. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What about some of that old 23 pit that they've already excavated? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it just makes more 25 sense, to me, to -- if we're buying real estate for hauling 1-23-12 173 1 -- for stuff like this, to buy 5,000-an-acre stuff rather 2 than 50,000-an-acre stuff. 3 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: There are other options, 4 other land going east, I think, down the road long-term. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What about the airport? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Airport might not be a bad 7 option, some of that property up there by the -- we'd have to 8 work with the City on this, but there's property -- 9 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Well -- 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- up there by the -- what do 11 you call it? The beacon thing up there. That's non-airport 12 use property. It's up there on the hillside. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But the airport owns it. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, and it's airport 15 property. And there's also -- you know. 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: There's a possibility of the 17 -- I don't know whether the old KEDF property might have some 18 access, too. Who knows? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Rusty's got some property, I think. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: One thing I'm wondering is, 21 off where our current -- what we call our barn is, and where 22 we store vehicles, all the way back to Schreiner College, you 23 know, that area, as long as it was just like the mechanic 24 shop, a big shop area, it's already behind security fence, 25 you know. And any expansion of the jail would go straight 1-23-12 174 1 back from the jail; it wouldn't take in that side area back 2 there. If you just had a -- a mechanic yard back there with 3 a big barn for all that, 'cause that's what we'd keep back 4 there to store vehicles and that. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. That, to me -- 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'm just saying that's already 7 part of that 17 acres or whatever it is. I'm saying from -- 8 from it back to Schreiner College. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Bottom line, I don't know that 10 it's the best use of money to spend to buy that property on 11 Spur 100. It seems like pretty expensive property to me. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I agree. 13 MS. HARGIS: So, what do we leave in and take out? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I want to leave it. 15 MS. HARGIS: Want to leave in a amount for right 16 now? And -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: For expansion yard. Just -- 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well -- 19 MS. HARGIS: The further east you go, the more, I 20 think -- I don't know -- I don't know what it's going to do 21 to Precinct 4. Although I live in Precinct 4. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The further east you go, the 23 cheaper it gets. 24 MS. HARGIS: Why can't we go west? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You already have a yard. The 1-23-12 175 1 reason to go -- 2 MS. HARGIS: We'll take the rest of it. We'll take 3 the rest of it. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To go east, one of the benefits 5 of doing that would be to haul material in there and store 6 the material there. Then it can be disbursed. Most of it's 7 coming from the east. Rather than bring it all the way to 8 Kerrville; then you have to transport it back out. You can 9 get it somewhere in the Center Point area. 10 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's right. At least keep 11 it in Precinct 2. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't have a problem with 13 that. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, it makes sense. And it 15 would be a yard out in that area, too, where they don't have 16 any -- they used to use some of the Koennecke property when 17 Doug was around for storing things. They don't have a spot 18 to store anything once you get east of the equipment yard to 19 where the current site is. So, there's a need for some 20 property on the eastern part of the county. 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: How many acres are we talking 22 about we need to get? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Minimum, five. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Five to 10. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Five to 10 acres. But 1-23-12 176 1 there's -- you know, there is a lot of flat land over there 2 that's really old fields that's not all that expensive. 3 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Right. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Compared to this price. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you talking about moving 6 the entire Road and Bridge Department out there? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. Just -- basically, just a 8 yard. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just mechanic -- this new 10 mechanic -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, I wouldn't build a mechanic 12 shop. I'd move the materials from across -- by Little League 13 fields, move the materials out of town, and use the property 14 over there for the mechanic yard. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Move them damn kids out of 16 those baseball fields. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Not moving them out of the 18 baseball fields. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's behind the Little League 20 fields. They're already using it for storage right now. 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'd like to go through 22 everything, then come back to this and see what we're talking 23 about. 24 MS. HARGIS: Let's look at his equipment. Let's 25 look at his equipment. 1-23-12 177 1 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Go through it all. 2 MS. HARGIS: Okay. Purple starts with the -- 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Did you say yes to the mechanic 4 shop and parking lot? 5 MS. HARGIS: No, we're going to come back. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't want to go into 7 specific equipment, 'cause, I mean, Leonard knows what he 8 needs more than I do. I think we should look at the total 9 amount of the equipment, and it was -- someone figured it up 10 earlier. 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: 315. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 315,000. 13 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Mm-hmm. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Based on his purchases 15 historically, that seems a very reasonable number for five 16 years. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It does. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So I don't have any problem 19 with that dollar amount. And if he has to switch equipment 20 around a little bit, that doesn't -- that's appropriate. 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'm good with this, his 22 requests. 23 MS. HARGIS: We're going to keep all the -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Let's keep the dollar amount 25 for the purple. 1-23-12 178 1 MS. HARGIS: What about the blue? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let him figure it out. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Let him figure out what he 4 needs. Seems like we spend, you know, a hundred and -- 5 100,000 to 200,000 a year on equipment. His equipment's 6 expensive. You buy one piece of machinery, you're going to 7 spend that much money. So, that's basically what he's asking 8 for, is 315,000 for five years. That's less than we have 9 been spending. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And let him -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Let him decide what he wants. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I really like that. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not going to say if he 14 wants a broom versus crack sealer. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Equipment comes down to 315, but 16 some of these items that are in vehicles are actually part of 17 the equipment. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The dump trucks should be 19 equipment. Dump trucks, equipment. 20 MS. HARGIS: Okay, which ones, now? Y'all are 21 going faster than I can -- 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What are we agreeing on? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Let's look at this number we 24 had was going down the column. The bucket truck is actually 25 equipment. To me, the 35,000 needs to get moved over to the 1-23-12 179 1 purple column. The 164,000 for the dump trucks is equipment. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. That brings it to 514. 3 MS. HARGIS: Okay, that's 350 on that one side. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Now, the water truck for 80,000 5 is equipment. 6 MS. HARGIS: Where? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And the tractors are 150,000. 8 MS. MABRY: The purple column is 315, and the blue 9 column is 420. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What we're saying is a lot of 11 the blue column should be in the purple column. 12 MS. HARGIS: So, you want the 150 put over in the 13 blue column? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: In the purple. 15 MS. HARGIS: In the purple column. So, you know, 16 we've got 350 plus 80 plus 150. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, the dump trucks -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Plus 164. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 164 for dump trucks. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: And 35. 21 MS. HARGIS: You want the dump trucks over there 22 too? 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And the small bucket truck. 25 MS. HARGIS: I got the small bucket truck on there. 1-23-12 180 1 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: What did we do with the 1-ton 2 extended cab with lift? It's 75. What's happened to that? 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Which one are you talking 4 about? 5 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Second from the bottom. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Blue. 7 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah, item on the first page. 8 It's in the vehicle column, second to the bottom. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's a small dump truck they 10 haul asphalt with. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, that's the guy that 12 does all the patching. That still sounds like an awful lot 13 of money. 14 MS. HARGIS: Okay, that's 744,000. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Looks like enough for one and 16 a half to me. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, me too. 18 MS. HARGIS: 744 in the purple column so far. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Uh-huh. 20 MS. HARGIS: All right. Now we're switching over 21 to the blue. Okay, one on the first page. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm saying leave off the 23 1-ton with cab and lift. 24 MS. HARGIS: On the first page? 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Uh-huh. Is that all right 1-23-12 181 1 with y'all? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me find it. 3 MS. HARGIS: It's on the first page. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second from the bottom. That 5 sounds like an awful lot of money. I don't think it's -- 6 that same thing, you could use one of the older dump trucks 7 for. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We have one of those now, 9 don't we? 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: In fact, if Tim doesn't use 13 the one he's got over there any more at the Ag Barn, that 14 could be converted over to Road and Bridge. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Probably ought to do that 16 anyway. 17 MR. BOLLIER: I love you too, Commissioner. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Because if I remember 19 correctly, we purchased that for $19,000. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Talking about that -- 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That gray Dodge with the dump 22 on it. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, the 1-ton. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. Which is basically the 25 same as what they're putting down here for $70,000 -- 75. 1-23-12 182 1 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm agreeing with 3 Commissioner Oehler. 4 MS. HARGIS: Okay, we'll take that one off. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's my vote. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If it were a smaller amount 7 in there -- 8 MS. HARGIS: You want me to put a smaller amount? 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I would -- I would not put 10 anything more than -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Thirty. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- 30, max. 13 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Because that is a needed 15 vehicle; there's no question. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I agree, because that guy 17 does patching of potholes. 18 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 19 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, I'm responsible for that little 20 dump truck -- or big dump truck. 21 MR. BOLLIER: I will give her credit. She found 22 it. She bought it, just like a woman. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oops. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On the other one on the 25 vehicle, the Chevy Tahoe, I don't -- they may need a vehicle 1-23-12 183 1 to run around in. It can be a little F-100 or 150, whatever 2 they call them now. Doesn't need to be a Tahoe. We don't 3 use it that much to spend $42,000 on a vehicle like that. 4 MS. HARGIS: What about one of those little Ford 5 Escapes? That's what -- they're little, and they -- I mean, 6 they hold four people, and that's all they need to go to the 7 courthouse and the bank and running errands in. 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: What are they, about 20? 9 MS. HARGIS: About 20, 25. I went with -- 10 MR. STANTON: 23,000. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They don't go to the bank. I 12 mean, this -- you're talking about -- this is talking about 13 the Tahoe that sits out there. I mean, if -- 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Kelly drives it around to 15 various things. She goes and looks up places. I mean, she 16 does drive it more than just to the courthouse. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: But still, we don't need -- 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: She doesn't have to carry 20 anything. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Doesn't need a Tahoe. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Escape's fine. More economical 23 vehicle is fine for that. 24 MS. HARGIS: Well, the gasoline involved and 25 everything would be better. The bigger cars, I can see if 1-23-12 184 1 you -- you need to go on that terrain, but if we're just 2 driving on streets, I don't -- and you can hold four people. 3 That's what Adult Probation is going to use theirs for, is to 4 go to school if they need it. And -- 'cause sometimes they 5 do -- all four go, like, to -- they went to San Antonio to 6 get their license for spraying the pesticides and all that 7 kind of stuff. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just need something that will 9 haul four people, max. 10 MS. HARGIS: Right. That's rare, to get four 11 people. Most times, it's one. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, what's that column total 13 now, Jeannie? 14 MS. HARGIS: Well, we're at 54, 23, and 30. We're 15 at 107. What do you want to do about these two, 94,000? I 16 think we can get the two trucks for a whole lot less than 17 $94,000. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: The utility beds cost a pretty 19 good -- those are specialized utility beds. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: These are pretty heavy-duty 21 trucks. They need those; those are driven a lot. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, I'll go for that. I'd 23 go for two. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The admin truck, I think, can 25 be downsized a little bit. 1-23-12 185 1 MS. HARGIS: Okay. We're at -- 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The Tahoe come out, or what 4 happened there? 5 MS. HARGIS: The Tahoe came out, got replaced with 6 a Ford Escape for 23,000. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 23? 8 MS. HARGIS: So we're at 201,000 -- 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Go back. 10 MS. HARGIS: -- for vehicles. We've got a $30,000 11 1-ton extended cab with lift, a $54,000 1-ton all-wheel 12 drive. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That one may be reduced. That 14 can probably go to -- I don't know that that needs to be a 15 1-ton truck. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't think so. 17 MS. HARGIS: If he can get by -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: 45. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 45. Go down to 45. 20 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Going to go to 45 right here 21 instead of 54; see if there's something that works for 45. 22 MS. HARGIS: Like you said, you tell him what you 23 give him; he'll find it. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Give him some amount of 25 money; he's going find something good to drive. 1-23-12 186 1 MS. HARGIS: That's right. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, 190,000? 3 MS. HARGIS: 192. 4 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. Okay. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Now, wait, wait, wait. 6 MS. HARGIS: 744 plus 192. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's a lot more than the 315 8 we started at, Buster. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Boy, no kidding. 10 MS. HARGIS: So he's at 936. But we haven't talked 11 about the land. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 936. 13 MS. HARGIS: As opposed to about one, three, so you 14 talked about 400. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's about what he's been 16 spending. That's about right. That's about right, okay. 17 MS. HARGIS: That should get pretty much his fleet 18 up to par, and if we had to go for a while without it. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, good. 936 for -- that he 20 can spend as he needs. 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's good. 22 MS. HARGIS: Okay. We're done with him? 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just make it 900 even. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's fine too. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did we actually take out the 1-23-12 187 1 McCarthy property? 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did we zero that out? 4 MS. HARGIS: No, I think that we were supposed to 5 go back to the property. 6 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Come back and discuss it. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What about the -- 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If you want to put in for 9 something somewhere else. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- to me, take them all 11 out, and if there's anything, you put in 500,000 for 12 expansion. We'll say expansion for that, just see what comes 13 up. 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Long term. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. I'm not sure we can 16 afford that. 17 MS. HARGIS: What about the repair of the parking 18 lots? 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Parking lots? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: In Comfort, Buster, we can afford 21 it. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The one parking lot, Kevin, I 23 understand, was -- I think we all agree on that one. 24 MS. HARGIS: That's actually not for Kevin. That's 25 actually for the old building, the Juvenile Probation, right 1-23-12 188 1 there in front, okay? So that one's okay? What about Road 2 and Bridge's parking lot? He said he could do -- instead of 3 doing the sealcoat, he could maybe do just the surfacing oil 4 treatment -- I don't know. I'm not -- but his is in pretty 5 bad shape, too. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I think -- yes, I think 7 he needs to do the parking lot. That's basically a 8 maintenance item we actually need to take care of; it gets 9 worse and worse. 10 MS. HARGIS: I think these are estimates. They'll 11 probably come in less than that. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: He can probably find it. 13 Good enough. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: About a million bucks. 15 MS. HARGIS: He took the mechanics shop out too, 16 right? Or not? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: For right now. 18 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: 1,008,000. 20 MS. HARGIS: So, we got one -- you got 936, plus 5, 21 plus 7 -- it's a million, five. That's what I've got for 22 everything. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: A million, five? 24 MS. HARGIS: Well, you put 500,000 -- 25 JUDGE TINLEY: 500. 1-23-12 189 1 MS. HARGIS: -- for the property. 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: For expansion. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He says 500,000 for expansion. 4 She has it 1.5 -- 1,500,000. 5 MS. HARGIS: No, for expansion -- that's the total. 6 Total Road and Bridge. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 1,005,000. 8 MS. HARGIS: But that includes the 500,000 for 9 property. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Are we talking 1,500,000 11 or 1,005,000? 12 MS. HARGIS: 1,500,000. 13 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: 1.5. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 15 MS. HARGIS: You got -- you have your vehicles that 16 you have -- you have Road and Bridge at 936. You add the 70 17 on, that's a million. And then you put 500 back in for the 18 possibility of -- 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Future expansion needs for 20 whatever. 21 MS. HARGIS: Right. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: In Comfort. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If you're not going to 24 address the additional mechanics shop, why do you want to 25 expand? That's the reason that you wanted to get more 1-23-12 190 1 property, is to have this new mechanics shop. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That was at the present 3 location. 4 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Right. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, yeah. That's what I'm 6 saying, though. But if you go to downtown Comfort and 7 purchase 10 acres down there, I would hope you would do that 8 so you could have a new mechanics shop. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, you'd have -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Otherwise, don't buy 11 anything. Why are you expanding if you're not -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Only thing I would be buying 13 would be buying land for storing -- 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Materials. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- materials. But I would take 16 -- I don't mind taking the whole 500,000 out. Leaving it at 17 1,005,000 is fine with me. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: That's where I was. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That goes for me, too. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What did we do? 22 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Going to take out the half a 23 million for any type of future expansion. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: 1,005,000. 1,005. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How do you write that? 1-23-12 191 1 MS. HARGIS: Judge, I got a hundred, six -- a 2 million, six. 936 and 70. 3 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: 1,006? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You better quit; we're going 5 the wrong direction. 6 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's what you got? 7 MS. HARGIS: It's a million, six. Okay. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Wait, before we do that, let's 9 go back up to the Ag Barn. 10 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we can lower that 12 500,000, to 2 million. We have 300,000 currently -- or 13 260,000 currently there. We just moved it there this 14 morning. 15 MS. HARGIS: We did. But I -- I mean, if you're 16 going to leave something somewhere, to me, that's where you 17 need to leave it right now. You don't want to start this 18 project and not be able to finish it. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: We can reduce it by 500,000 because 20 of the grant match. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, the grant match is 22 500,000. So, we still have 300,000, you know -- 23 MS. HARGIS: How much is it going to be to take it 24 down? Do you know? 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Should be plenty in that deal 1-23-12 192 1 to do it. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Where you take the 500,000 is from 3 the exhibit hall portion. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 5 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 6 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: So, 2 million. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that the number? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Total of two. 9 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's what I have. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We were -- we had 2.3 -- 2, 11 2.6, whatever it is. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Right. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Two million. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good job. Good work. 15 That's good work. 16 MS. HARGIS: Okay. Sheriff's Department. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's go right on past that 18 to the Juvenile Detention. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This is probably a five-year 20 fix. After that, there will be another five-year fix, the 21 same amount or more. Every time the government changes, 22 radios, frequencies -- 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sheriff, how critical -- I 24 mean, obviously, the vehicles, you have to have vehicles. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. 1-23-12 193 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How critical is the digital 2 conversion? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I think with our radio system 4 right now being 12 years old, and the issues that we're 5 having with it, I don't think there's any doubt we're going 6 to have to do something. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I was afraid you were going to 8 say that. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What's required by law? 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We're meeting requirements 11 when we went to narrow band. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The problem is, what's our 14 system going to do? It's not -- 15 DEPUTY BARTON: The law only requires us to have a 16 channel, Buster. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We're not required to have a 18 radio. 19 MR. TROLINGER: Communication is the most important 20 thing there is at the Sheriff's Office. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Isn't there a requirement 22 that you're able to communicate with X, Y, and Z? 23 DEPUTY BARTON: On certain channels, yes, sir. But 24 we're talking about -- we've got that accomplished. We're 25 able to inter-op on these particular channels. We're just 1-23-12 194 1 tying to upgrade our two main channels that our guys call 2 back to the office with when they -- especially when they 3 need help. We want to make sure that they can reach back, 4 and we don't have -- 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We're having more and more 6 issues with it. Whenever this -- when this system first went 7 in 12 years ago, we were guaranteed, and what they propagated 8 that it could cover is 98 percent of the county with -- with 9 the car radio, and 95 percent of the county with hand-held. 10 If you talk to any of my people now, they're saying no way; 11 we don't get anywhere near that, okay? The system is -- is 12 wearing out. It's 12 years old. It's microwave technology. 13 It's the maintenance issues. They're up there just about 14 every week. We're paying on the maintenance contracts and 15 that, and we're not getting the coverage. There's dead areas 16 in Center Point; there's dead areas on Loop 534, city of 17 Kerrville. We don't have it in this building, and there's 18 more and more issues out west. It's -- it's a 12-year-old 19 system that is not that reliable any more. You're talking a 20 five-year plan. There's just no way I can see not to do 21 this. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, I'm going to agree with 23 you, but that is exactly what you said 12 years ago. 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's exactly right. Twelve 25 years ago, we couldn't. 1-23-12 195 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we fixed it, except for 2 those valleys out there in Hunt by Camp Mystic. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. Twelve years ago, we 4 bought this system. Remember, we had incidents even out by 5 the airport on Highway 27; we couldn't talk, and had an 6 officer in a heck of a fight out there. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. And that system cost us 9 957,000, I think it was, 12 years ago. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Dailey Wells, wasn't it? 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It was Dailey Wells. When we 12 got the estimate for a digital system before, P25 compliant, 13 which is what everybody's going for, 12 years ago it was 14 $2 million. That's the one thing that has helped on this. 15 The bid that Clay just -- I don't know what county that was, 16 but they bid a four-tower system, which is what we currently 17 have. 18 DEPUTY BARTON: Two-channel, four-tower simulcast. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Which is what we have. It's 20 an identical system to us; they just got the bid in at 21 $1 million. Now, the difference that I would like to do, 22 theirs was two-channel, and two-channel digital. I think we 23 need to leave one channel analog, because it's going to be a 24 very long time before our fire departments, all those people, 25 can afford digital equipment. Now, Kerrville P.D., Ingram 1-23-12 196 1 Marshal's office, they already went digital. They did that a 2 couple years ago, and so we've got digital radios where we 3 can hear them, but that's it, in the car. But to really 4 upgrade our system and replace what we have, it's going to 5 be -- one channel needs to be digital; one channel needs to 6 be analog. That adds a little bump to it. I think what they 7 actually told Clay the other day is, right now, you could 8 probably guess at about 1,050,000. 9 DEPUTY BARTON: Well, the quote that he actually 10 just shot out for strictly digital was $950,000. One reason 11 -- on an analog system like what we currently have, we have 12 overlap areas. You have a certain amount of areas that one 13 tower will cover. You have another tower, and it will cover 14 so much. When it overlaps, you get a fuzzy area. Right out 15 here in front of the high school is an overlap area, and 16 it's -- it just doesn't work right, because it -- you got two 17 signals, two different things overlapping. A digital signal 18 does away with your overlap areas. But, like the Sheriff was 19 saying, just like when the cell phones changed to digital 20 technology, you either have a signal or you don't have a 21 signal. That's the down side to digital. The digital is 22 supposed to have a -- a stronger signal. But the reason we 23 would like to structure to keep one analog is for the 24 interoperability for those who don't have digital equipment. 25 But also, if we got into an area where there was absolutely 1-23-12 197 1 no digital coverage, we'd rather have -- go back to analog 2 like we're doing now. I'd rather hear a real weak signal 3 than no signal at all. My guy can change channels and go 4 back, so he could at least have probably better than what 5 we're going to have now, just because the equipment's going 6 to be newer. But also with the digital, most of the time our 7 digital signal will give us a clearer, stronger signal. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What about -- what would be 9 the benefit of moving the tower out of -- 10 DEPUTY BARTON: Just to get some in-town coverage. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Get closer into town? 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's why -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can you do that? I mean, is 14 it possible to move the tower? 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes, but that's why I want to 16 leave 1.5. If you'll remember, last time we hired -- Trott 17 Communications was the ones that came in and did the studies 18 and acted as our consultant. I think you have to have the 19 propagation studies to show where your coverage is going to 20 be. We don't want to spend a million dollars on a system, 21 and then have holes in it, you know, where we don't have the 22 coverage. You've got to -- and what they all ended up doing 23 was actually driving and getting the coverage. We asked for 24 it in the contract. This is what you have to guarantee, and 25 this is what they did. And it was done then. But that's why 1-23-12 198 1 you need the little bit of leeway left in that fund, so that 2 if we can move the towers, if -- and change from one tower to 3 a different to get better coverage -- you know, there are 4 more towers in this county than there were 12 years ago. 5 Then it may be the best thing we can do. If they can go to a 6 three-tower system, it would be fabulous. I don't think it's 7 going to happen, but it would be fabulous, and we'd cut that 8 price down some. But I think we're going to have to bid it 9 just like we did this one, which is a four-tower system, and 10 give us that coverage. And that's going to keep that price 11 to make sure we're guaranteed to get -- 12 JUDGE TINLEY: The bid for pure digital is just 13 under a million dollars. 14 DEPUTY BARTON: That's what the bid -- 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Which is two-thirds of what we're 16 looking at, the figure here. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, it's 900 -- 18 DEPUTY BARTON: It was 950 for two channels on 19 straight digital. Not a bid for us, but a bid on a system 20 similar to what ours was going to be. They didn't bid it for 21 us in particular. He said I've seen a price brand new that 22 went out to a county that was doing a two-channel, four-site 23 simulcast system, which is what we have. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Can you just not add a chip and get 25 your analog coverage in there? Is it more complicated than 1-23-12 199 1 that? 2 DEPUTY BARTON: You just have to have a little bit 3 extra equipment, about -- he just ballparked maybe $100,000 4 extra equipment, $200,000 extra equipment to make sure we 5 have that fallback on analog. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: So, you know, you're talking a 8 million, one, to a million, two. And then I'm looking at the 9 propagation deal. I don't know what Trott Communications or 10 those that do it, or if we could get it worked in, if the bid 11 could come out. But just to cover us totally and make sure 12 we got that type of coverage is where my big concern was. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that going to allow us to do away 14 with -- if you go digital, is that going to allow us to do 15 away with cell phones? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: With cell phones? 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: As far as how? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Your guys got cell phones, don't 20 they? 21 DEPUTY BARTON: No, sir. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, only sergeants have cell 23 phones. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 25 DEPUTY BARTON: Sergeants and investigators. But 1-23-12 200 1 most of the field deputies -- unless they have personal cell 2 phones, but we don't supply them. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But, no, they don't -- and 4 cell phones are things that you can't talk about on the -- on 5 the air type deal. We -- 6 DEPUTY BARTON: One thing digital does give you is 7 the option of encrypting some of your traffic to where just 8 anybody with a scanner can't pick up your traffic. And that 9 is something that digital does offer, an encryption issue. 10 But it's getting to where it's going to be a public safety 11 platform that the State is wanting people to go to. It's 12 just the digital platform, the P25 digital platform. That's 13 all we're trying to do, is just get up, but we really want to 14 improve what we have now. 15 MR. TROLINGER: And that's a good point. On the 16 computer side, more and more you're seeing these hand-held 17 devices, and pretty much every city in the world, any kid can 18 go on there and download an application and start listening 19 to local law enforcement. If the Sheriff says, "Hey, we need 20 to encrypt certain traffic," we can do it with a digital 21 system. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And that's -- that is becoming 23 some of the issues, because just last week we stopped two 24 that we know are known burglars in our area, okay. One of 25 the deputies just stopped them, and they're sitting in the 1-23-12 201 1 consoles with radios set on a certain channel. We couldn't 2 figure out what they were doing at that time, you know. But 3 it's very possible. It's not unusual that you have them 4 where they're scanning to see if the officers are coming. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sounds like smart crooks to 6 me. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We got to outsmart them. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're not knocking them, 9 are you? 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes, I'm knocking them. I 11 don't want them to be able to do that. Makes it too hard for 12 us. 13 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Makes them work harder. 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's what we're looking at. 15 DEPUTY BARTON: But to answer Bruce's question, all 16 the current field gear that we have will work. This is just 17 upgrading our main -- our from dispatch to our tower systems, 18 and that's just basic, all we're upgrading, just our tower 19 sites. All of our field gear is -- will continue to be used. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: For how long? 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Until the federal government, 22 F.C.C. and all the rest of them change everything again. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, shifting around one of 24 the towers is built in here? 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No. This is just a -- a 1-23-12 202 1 ballpark figure on what another county -- what it cost them 2 to bid out and go with a four-tower, simulcast, digital, 3 two-channel system. What we have right now is a four-tower, 4 simulcast, two-channel analog system, okay? So, it's -- the 5 system's the same. Now, during the study and during the 6 installation, if we can cut it down to three, great, if 7 digital will give us that much more coverage. 8 MS. HARGIS: You've got a million, five. That's 9 what they're asking. Do you need the whole million, five? 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. I wouldn't feel good at 11 being able to do it, and we're required to have that in place 12 when's there's a deadline. We were required to have the 13 narrow band by January I. We did that; we met that. 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: We've done that. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: There's still a lot of stuff, 16 because of the federal government and everything else, on the 17 changes of when they're going to -- to force everybody to go 18 to digital. They -- one time it said 2014, 2015. A lot of 19 that got put off. We don't know, okay? Till we change 20 people up north, we don't know what's going to happen. 21 DEPUTY BARTON: Well, in 2015 they're thinking 22 about taking the inter-op channels -- what the state plan 23 currently calls for, by January of 2015, the state inter-op 24 channels will go to a digital platform. We have the 25 equipment available now. That's why we started planning 1-23-12 203 1 ahead back in 2008 to have equipment that would let us meet 2 that goal, so everything's moving that direction. That's the 3 only mandate right there. No mandate that each individual 4 agency has to move their particular channel by a certain time 5 frame. That gets back to what's going to be best for our 6 needs for the safety of our guys. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I got one more question for 8 you. But so much for the notebook; look at that. 9 (Laughter.) The -- with the digital program, will you be 10 able to communicate with Gillespie, Kendall, Kimble, Bandera, 11 and D.P.S.? 12 DEPUTY BARTON: To the extent that we can right 13 now, just because they're -- 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I mean to just digital. 15 Just digital. Don't do that other one-channel thing. 16 DEPUTY BARTON: It's just because Kendall still has 17 a VHF. We're talking about being on VHF. Gillespie County 18 and Kendall both went to the L.C.R.A. system, which is a 19 900 MHz system. The VHF and 900 can't talk directly to one 20 another. They're changing the 900 MHz, the public safety 21 platform. That's now going to be a 700 MHz, and they're 22 going to start trying to build some of that out. Kendall 23 County does have VHF radios in their car. We can talk 24 directly to Kendall County. They've got our channel; we've 25 got their channel. Gillespie County, we can only talk -- 1-23-12 204 1 they can -- our dispatch can hear them; they can patch us 2 through to them on dispatch. We can't talk from our car to 3 their car. They don't have the equipment. We -- it's not 4 apples and oranges -- it's apples and oranges, basically. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But we will be able to because 6 of that patching in the console. You can patch one type of 7 channel over to the other so that we can continue that. It 8 just has to be routed through dispatchers. 9 DEPUTY BARTON: Bandera County, Buster, is still 10 all going to be VHF. We're going to have -- so whoever we 11 can talk to now, we'll be able to talk to with the new. Same 12 on the new equipment, as long as we can put their channel in 13 there. It's VHF equipment. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 2.5? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that's where we are. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank y'all. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. What about Juvenile 19 Detention, gentlemen? 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They need what they need. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that priority figure. Locks 22 and control system and a couple of vehicles there. On 23 Maintenance -- 24 MS. HARGIS: You already cut that one. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 1-23-12 205 1 MS. HARGIS: What do you want to do with 2 Environmental? The two trucks for him? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, he's two. 5 MS. HARGIS: What about Janie? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, they have five on here? 7 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm, she has five. 8 MR. BOLLIER: Trucks? 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Three is -- 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, Janie. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Two entry. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Ray just wants two. He gets 13 his. Janie had five. 14 MS. HARGIS: Janie has three '08's, and then she 15 has the two 2010's. Because this is a five-year plan; this 16 is not a -- so she's not asking for them today, but in three 17 years she will want to trade them in, before we would have 18 another capital. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the amounts on hers are 20 -- I mean, they're listed -- I mean, we talked -- we cut the 21 two trucks for Environmental Health to 32,8, which includes 22 the trade-ins with them, so this should be cut to -- 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Cut that same amount. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well -- 25 MS. HARGIS: Well, we don't -- hers may have a few 1-23-12 206 1 more miles than his. I don't know. And she has to have the 2 cages put on some of hers. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: She's got the cages; they're 4 changeable. 5 MS. HARGIS: So -- 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's no extra expense. You 7 just slide them out and slide them in. 8 MS. HARGIS: I come out -- if we use the same 9 15,946, that comes up to 47,838. If we left 50,000 there, 10 that would give us a little bit of leeway to make sure. 11 'Cause some of hers -- you know, like, one of his was 15,346 12 and one was -- you know, a trade-in value. And she has more 13 miles on hers. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And the two other trucks, so -- 15 MS. HARGIS: The two other trucks, we paid about 16 20. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 90,000 for her trucks? 18 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. We won't use the 40 right 19 now; we'll use that probably two years from now, in the third 20 year. That's -- again, this is a five-year plan, not a two- 21 or three-year plan. And then the only other one left is the 22 constable, and I think we agreed that's a pretty round number 23 for right now. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And 1.2 for I.T.? 1-23-12 207 1 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I thought 1.3. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, he came down. 4 MS. HARGIS: He came down. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 1.2. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: I'll change it again. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, me too. 8 MS. HARGIS: If we use that other court system, we 9 can really -- that will probably cut down on the time frame 10 between getting the stuff recorded and down to us, and the 11 whole system moving a whole lot faster. Because all that 12 paperwork has to be done, taken back to the judges to sign. 13 So, anything we can to... All right. Now, the last two 14 items, Option 1, Option 2. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're not going on this issue. 16 MS. HARGIS: Not today? 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No. 18 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just think that we need to 20 have a serious talk about the minimum -- what is that, 21 mid-level? 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Minimum, medium, maximum. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Minimum-medium. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Module. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The module thing. I just 1-23-12 208 1 want to have that conversation. I can't understand why we 2 can't talk about that in here. And I don't know that that's 3 a complete answer to this thing, but I think it is an answer 4 to some of it. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Should be one of the -- one of the 6 options we'll probably get back from the architect, I would 7 suspect. I don't know, because we're going to talk about 8 engaging him here momentarily. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the -- we asked -- 10 didn't actually ask the Daily Times, but they did it anyway. 11 We talked about it, and they did it, put their little -- I 12 don't know. What do you call that thing? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Poll. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: A poll? That's a strange 15 word for something like that, but a poll. And it -- the last 16 time I looked at that thing, it was just overwhelming, "Deal 17 with the court system." And -- and that's where my vote 18 would go as well. But then I got to thinking. Do what with 19 the court system? You know, some -- I mean, I just think 20 that we've got to sit down. Somebody has to be honest about 21 this thing at some point, about where is the -- where is the 22 issue? What is really the issue on this jail thing? We got 23 to quit beating around the bush and patty-caking and 24 scratching each other's back and all that, and get down to 25 bottom line. It has to be done, or we're going to spend 1-23-12 209 1 $8 million of the taxpayers' money. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It still won't solve the 3 problem. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And still won't solve the 5 problem. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They're going to spend 7 8 million of their own money, our money. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, there's -- there's an 9 issue somewhere with the court system, and I just really 10 think that we need to know what it is. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll get to that item shortly when 12 we -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, we will? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. I'll shut up and go 16 on, then. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Actually, I don't know why it's on 18 this list, because we're talking about short term or shorter 19 term on Item 19. What you're talking about is what's going 20 to come out as a result of maybe Item 24. But we have to 21 hire the man first. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see where you're at. All 25 right. 1-23-12 210 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go ahead and wind this 2 thing up; what do you say? Let's go to Item 20, to consider, 3 discuss, take appropriate action to accept recommendations 4 and award bids for the Clean Water State Revolving Fund grant 5 for the planning phase for Center Point wastewater collection 6 system for legal services, engineering services, financial 7 adviser services, and bond attorney. Ms. Hargis? 8 MS. HARGIS: Let me start with the easiest one 9 first. We only had one bid for engineering services, and 10 that was Tetra Tech. We had -- and we'll kind of come up 11 from the bottom. We had two legal bids. One of them was the 12 firm that we had engaged, Brad Castleberry. And the other 13 one is -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Escamilla firm? 15 MS. HARGIS: No. Davidson -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Freedle? 17 MS. HARGIS: That's Davidson -- Davidson and 18 Troilo. That firm currently represents Kendall County 19 W C. & I.D. Number 1, so that means that there would be a 20 conflict of interest. So, that's their current client. He 21 submitted this bid knowing that, so that we would have 22 already been through the Clean Water Act with him in case 23 that when Kendall County needs their attorneys, we already 24 have this bid. But -- but this one we can't use, because he 25 has a conflict of interest. So, I recommend we stay with -- 1-23-12 211 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Lloyd Gosselink. 2 MS. HARGIS: -- Lloyd Gosselink. We had two bids 3 for the bond attorney, McCall-Parkhurst and Estrada (sic). 4 Estrada did not put a fee schedule in theirs at all, so their 5 bid didn't match. So, I would recommend we stay with 6 McCall-Parkhurst on that one. Then -- 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Say that again? 8 MS. HARGIS: Escamilla and Poneck, when they gave 9 -- they gave us a bid, but there's no -- there's no fee 10 schedule at all in this bid. There's just qualifications and 11 who they've worked for. They didn't put any -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's McCall-Parkhurst? 13 MS. HARGIS: No, this is Escamilla and Poneck. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's what I was confused 15 about. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: She was recommending 17 McCall-Parkhurst. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 19 MS. HARGIS: The only conflict in bids that we had 20 is on the financial adviser services. Coastal Securities bid 21 for performing this one particular bond issue, they gave us a 22 flat fee, a lower fee than would normally be used. However, 23 if you compare their fees on a normal basis, RBC Capital is 24 -- is lower than they are. And since we've already started 25 the project with -- you know, in 2007 with RBC Dain Rauscher, 1-23-12 212 1 and they've been with us, and their fees are lower on the 2 whole -- they don't actually catch up with each other till we 3 get to a $10 million issue, and we got close to one today, 4 but it's rare for us to have an issue of that size. So, I'm 5 recommending that we stay with RBC Dain Rauscher, because 6 with a one-time fee and then you go back up, and not only 7 you're paying a higher fee, but you don't have the experience 8 as well. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. I'll make a motion 10 we accept the recommendations of the Auditor and award the 11 engineering to Tetra Tech, the outside legal counsel to Lloyd 12 Gosselink, bond counsel to McCall-Parkhurst -- and what do 13 you call the other one? Financial adviser to RBC Dain 14 Rauscher. 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'll second it. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: RBC Capital, whatever. 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'll second. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 19 indicated. Any question or discussion on the motion? All in 20 favor, signify by raising your right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. That'll take 25 us to Item 24; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action 1-23-12 213 1 on contract with Dailey, Rabke, and Gondeck, PLLC, for 2 architectural services for new jail facility. Mr. Henneke? 3 MR. HENNEKE: Judge, you should have a two-page 4 contract I forwarded to Jody. That's what is at issue in the 5 agenda. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Right, here it is. 7 MR. HENNEKE: Yes, sir. This -- after meeting 8 with -- 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Want to refer to this? 10 MR. HENNEKE: I know it. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 12 MR. HENNEKE: I wrote it. After meeting with Judge 13 Tinley -- it was a very good suggestion; instead of entering 14 into the 16-, 20-something page agreement that would have 15 bound the architect for the entire scope of building a new 16 jail expansion facility where there's not yet a decision to 17 do so, that we would initially contract with Mr. Gondeck's 18 firm to do the study and report and evaluation, which is what 19 last Tuesday you gentlemen asked that he put together and 20 report back to the Court. Initially, in the draft contract 21 that I was working on with Mr. Gondeck, he proposed that his 22 services for the -- basically, up to project funding, which 23 would -- would not be more than $30,000. And when I visited 24 with him initially, I proposed putting on an hourly schedule 25 for this initial phase, and he said it was part of what he 1-23-12 214 1 was already proposing that he was going to do globally, but 2 he'd be willing to work with us any way that he would. That 3 his preference was to do it on a flat fee, and this was his 4 counterproposal to my proposal of an hourly rate. His 5 counterproposal was, well, somewhere between $10,000 and 6 $15,000. I put 10 in the contract. And, you know, it's his 7 position that, you know, he'll -- he should break even on 8 this, but with the time and effort involved, he's probably 9 not going to make any money on this phase of the agreement. 10 And -- but he is willing to do as much as it takes to get a 11 report and recommendation that y'all have asked for. So, 12 this is a short, two-page agreement that I drafted. It 13 incorporates his counterproposal, it being a flat fee of 14 $10,000 instead of an hourly fee schedule that engages him to 15 use the jail -- jail standards, and the information from Kerr 16 County, and to put together a report and recommendation of 17 options for the jail center, including, you know, budget 18 configurations, schematics, and different types of layouts. 19 Basically, this is the contract for him to do what you asked 20 him to do last Tuesday. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Buster, I want to make note 22 that the County Attorney's set a very bad precedent here. He 23 has a two-page agreement between -- that he wrote with the 24 architect for us to approve. We'll never get one that short 25 again. 1-23-12 215 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's just -- 2 JUDGE TINLEY: No amount of documents. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Little League draft is, like, 4 20 pages already. I think it looks good. I'll make a motion 5 that we approve the document as submitted. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 8 approval of the agreement with Dailey, Rabke, and Gondeck for 9 their needs study and analysis for law enforcement detention 10 facilities, essentially is what it is. And as stated, 11 consideration is, turnkey, $10,000. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think it's very fair. 13 When will that arrive in here? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I don't know exactly when the 15 -- when we're going to get it, but I suspect as quickly as he 16 can get it done, 'cause we wants to move on to the next 17 phase. But we've got to do this before you can pull the 18 trigger and start the work to get it. Did he give you an 19 estimate of what we're looking at in terms of time? 20 MR. HENNEKE: No, sir, he didn't. Although my -- 21 my recollection from Tuesday's meeting, it seemed that he was 22 pretty well down this road. The Sheriff had already done 23 quite a bit of the research that he needed, and he was 24 familiar with our facility. But before giving an answer or 25 working on any product, he wanted to enter into some kind of 1-23-12 216 1 agreement with Kerr County. So, there's not a time frame 2 specified, but my impression is he's -- he's pretty well down 3 the road working on this. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, good. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments? 6 All in favor of that motion, signify by raising your right 7 hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 10 (No response.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Item 25, to 12 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to approve license 13 agreement with Pictometry International Corporation, 14 authorize County Judge to sign same. 15 MR. HENNEKE: We brought this back. This was on 16 the last Commissioners Court agenda. This is for the imaging 17 software that we're going to jointly share with Kerr 911, and 18 also with the Kerr Central Appraisal District. At the last 19 meeting, the contract was not to where we could approve it, 20 but basically the main change being is we've broken this into 21 three separate -- basically three separate licenses, each 22 with Pictometry. We'll have ours, KCAD will have theirs, and 23 Kerr 911 will have theirs. So, Kerr County's obligation 24 under this contract previously was an undivided third of 25 $77,000. Now our obligation is $23,000. It's the same as 1-23-12 217 1 KCAD; it's the same as Kerr 911, so we're contracting with 2 them for that figure, that figure being less than $50,000, 3 but the caveat being is that all three of our agreements are 4 contingent upon each other. So, if KCAD stops paying, then 5 it would cancel all -- all three agreements, basically. And 6 I know that John reached out to Appraisal District, and also 7 to 911 about their concurrence with this contract in the new 8 form. I don't know if you've heard back, John, but I worked 9 this out directly with the Pictometry contract attorney from 10 New York last week. 11 MR. TROLINGER: We're waiting to hear back on the 12 acceptance from the other two entities, but the only question 13 I received in response to my e-mail question from the County 14 Attorney was if we're going to change the address 15 information, which just says Kerr County on the copy we've 16 got right now. So, I expect that it will be approved by 17 other entities. The changes are relatively minor when you 18 look at the big picture. The County Attorney explained it 19 perfectly. If the other two entities pay and Kerr County 20 pays each year, then we'll continue on with the software, is 21 what the fundamental change is. We each have a contract -- 22 separate contract, but they're tied together. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, you have -- the contracts 24 are basically the same contract three times? 25 MR. TROLINGER: It's identical, with the exception 1-23-12 218 1 of the address and the name. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 3 MR. HENNEKE: And I would recommend, you know, if 4 the Court approves it, it does so contingent upon approval by 5 the other two entities. 6 MR. TROLINGER: The first-year cost is $7,941.50, 7 and it is budgeted. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved for approval, 9 contingent upon the other two entities approving same. 10 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'll second. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded as 12 indicated. Further question or discussion? All in favor, 13 signify by raising your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. we'll go to 18 Item 26; to consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 19 adopt a resolution regarding an Aqua Texas proposed rate 20 increase. Commissioner Letz? 21 MR. CATHEY: May I -- 22 JUDGE TINLEY: I've got you here. 23 MR. CATHEY: Okay, sorry. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: I haven't forgotten. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Based on some comments I made 1-23-12 219 1 at the last meeting, I went ahead and wrote a resolution -- I 2 wanted to take a stab at a resolution to T.C.E.Q. relating to 3 the proposed rate increase from Aqua Texas. I don't know if 4 we need to take action on this today. I think a couple of -- 5 some information I think I need to get included in this is 6 the specifics of the -- because we can cite the specific rate 7 increase; the documents were filed with T.C.E.Q. And we 8 actually received a copy from Mr. Cathey now of that, so we 9 can include that. I really just put this on the agenda 10 for -- this item here today is for everyone to look at, make 11 sure everyone -- if they have any problems, get back to me; 12 I'll bring it back at our next meeting. 13 The County Attorney thinks it would be a good idea, 14 and I agree, to forward a draft to Aqua Texas, let them see 15 what's coming down the road, and if they're willing to -- 16 want to comment or not comment, whatever they want to do. 17 Because I think it is -- a lot of citizens are affected by 18 that. I think -- you know, I don't know that we have a whole 19 lot of authority here. We probably don't have much, kind of 20 like working with P.U.C., but I think it's something we need 21 to do. We have 150 -- as I understand it, kind of this whole 22 period right now is kind of a holding period, 150 days from 23 when the rate increase was announced, that they're kind of 24 waiting to receive information at T.C.E.Q. So, we have time. 25 My plan will be to bring this back at the next meeting, to 1-23-12 220 1 vote on it, and during that time, you know, anxiously 2 awaiting comments from my colleagues up here, or anyone else 3 in the public. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have a question. You say 5 you're -- you want to round up some more information, like 6 what would be the increase -- what is really the increase. 7 Isn't it -- and maybe Mr. Cathey can answer it better. Isn't 8 it each -- each individual water system, even though they're 9 owned by -- 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Aqua Texas. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- Aqua Texas, they -- their 12 rates, the rate increase could be different from each -- from 13 one to another? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: It is. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So how -- yeah, I know. So 17 how do you -- how do we -- how is that addressed? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the -- you know, I 19 don't -- do some checking. What I put in the resolution 20 right now is just, from what I've gathered, anywhere from 20 21 to 67 percent increase. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, I see. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think I have to leave the 24 range, but I would probably go back -- you know, 20 percent I 25 got from Aqua Texas; the 67 I got from an e-mail. I'll 1-23-12 221 1 probably want to verify that 67, 'cause I want to make sure 2 the facts are correct. And the document that Mr. Cathey's 3 sending me, I believe, has every utility in the southwest 4 region, whatever the region was, a document, so we can go 5 through that. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Mr. William Cathey from 1555 Horizon 7 Boulevard has filed a participation form. Mr. Cathey, we 8 appreciate your patience. I'm sure you were highly excited 9 watching all this other kind of nonsense going on here today, 10 but that's -- that's how we make decisions. They're 11 collective decisions, as you can see. 12 MR. CATHEY: Thank you, Judge Tinley and 13 Commissioners. I speak as one of several thousand customers 14 in Kerr County, and that's almost 10 percent of the county 15 population who are on Aqua Texas water. We're being held up 16 by a state-sanctioned monopoly, Aqua Texas, for what some 17 term an outrageous rate increase. Aqua Texas gave notice of 18 a rate increase that would go into effect 21 February for 19 about half of those county water systems -- or Aqua Texas 20 systems in Kerr County. They'll receive a 20 percent 21 increase in their rates for a typical 5,000 gallon a month 22 customer. In the case of the former Kerrville South Water 23 Company customers, and that's about 1,370 of us, we're going 24 to receive a 67 percent rate increase, because we've been 25 paying lower rates for the last four or five years than the 1-23-12 222 1 rest of those. And a couple of subdivisions -- part of the 2 former Harper Water Company are having a 100 percent rate 3 increase. Okay. Aqua Texas justifies this rate increase in 4 their -- in their notice to the -- to the customers that they 5 sent out to every customer, and I'll send one of these to 6 each one of you if you'd like. Also, their rate -- the Aqua 7 Texas filing is on file at Kerrville City Hall, because the 8 Kerrville Aqua Texas customers who are inside Kerrville city 9 limits fall into a different category, so the City of 10 Kerrville has that entire filing. It's 2-, 3-inch thick 11 notebooks. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask you a question. 13 MR. CATHEY: Yes? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They fall under a different 15 number of some sort. Are they lower or higher than -- 16 MR. CATHEY: They're -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- than the County? 18 MR. CATHEY: -- former Kerrville South Water 19 customers, residents who have a 60 percent increase. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll be darned. 21 MR. CATHEY: So, this -- this is really complex. 22 There are 73 water companies in the southwest region of Aqua 23 Texas. They're under this. It goes from Williamson County 24 clear to Medina County, you know, all these along the Hill 25 Country here. I haven't counted up the number of 1-23-12 223 1 subdivisions; it's in the hundreds. And, again, here in Kerr 2 County, we're talking about 43 subdivisions. But Aqua Texas 3 justifies this rate increase by saying that they've invested 4 $31.7 million in capital improvements since the last rate 5 increase in 2004, and each ratepayer share is 2,300 bucks. I 6 don't know what the debt load is for the average tax -- 7 average citizen here in Kerrville, but 2,300 bucks is 8 significant. They're planning the same rate increase across 9 the entire southwest region of their 13,700 customers, so 10 everybody in the southwest region will have the same water 11 rates. So, some of us are having to play catch-up. 12 Okay. I've been contacting property owners in the 13 43 subdivisions to see if we can't come up with an organized 14 protest, and there is a very strict process for doing that. 15 I've been taking a look at benchmarks far as what comparable 16 municipal size systems are, what they charge for water, what 17 other water companies charge for water. And we welcome any 18 support the Commissioners can provide to oppose this rate 19 increase to one that is only fair and reasonable, and based 20 on the -- you know, what actual capital investments they've 21 made to justify the rate increase. Thank you. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Mr. Cathey. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Nice to see you. I never did 25 know who you were till today. 1-23-12 224 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We've got one executive 2 session item, so let's defer -- excuse me. 3 MR. HENNEKE: Judge, I don't believe that needs to 4 be executive session. I've talked with Mr. Garcia about it. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: We can handle it in the clear? 6 MR. HENNEKE: Yes, sir. Jonathan, are you going to 7 write that letter, or do you want me to send that to Aqua 8 Texas? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Let me clean it up a little 10 bit. Then I'll probably let you send it to them. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Item 27; to consider, discuss, take 12 appropriate action on personnel matters involving 13 Environmental Health Department. Mr. Garcia? 14 MR. GARCIA: Yes. This is in regards to a position 15 I received Friday, a resignation for -- this is a totally 16 different one than what we just talked about earlier. So, 17 what I am doing -- and I spoke to the H.R. Director; she's 18 here. I am requesting to fill that position, administrative 19 assistant position. That is vital, and it's key -- a key 20 role for our department. What I am requesting is -- is that 21 whoever the new hire, I get a couple weeks of training time 22 with the current administrative assistant, and possibly take 23 the pay for that new hire out of the line item that I've put 24 on hold, just as a part-time pay out of that. I think, 25 Jeannie, we can make a part-time line item in there so I can 1-23-12 225 1 pay for a couple weeks of training for the new administrative 2 assistant. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: You're also going to have a -- a pay 4 differential between the one that's leaving and the one 5 you're bringing on board? 6 MR. GARCIA: I am requesting it, if -- again, 7 qualifications, experience, to bring them in at the current 8 16.5, depending on experience and qualifications. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So you would need the -- the 10 overlap in -- in time coming out of the position that you've 11 decided not to fill at this time? 12 MR. GARCIA: Right, at this time. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I might -- we need to make 14 sure. I mean, I'm not real keen on that part of it. 15 MR. GARCIA: What part? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On the 16.5. I mean, it 17 depends. There may be some adjustment, but 16.5 is going to 18 be a very experienced person to get. 19 MR. GARCIA: Well, again, that's why I said just -- 20 that's based solely on qualifications and experience. I 21 mean, we talked to H.R., and again, at 16, where they come in 22 at as an administrative assistant, we're just putting that 23 out there in case we do -- if we do get an experienced 24 person, and we can bargain or collectively have something to 25 come back with on that person. 1-23-12 226 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: When you advertise -- when 2 you advertise for a new hire like that, don't you say, "If 3 you come to work for me, you're going to get 'X' amount of 4 dollars"? I mean, how do you do that? How do you do this? 5 MR. GARCIA: This is -- we do put in there based on 6 your qualifications and experience, and then in the 7 requirements section, or the qualifications section on the 8 job description, we put specific things in there. And, 9 again, on this position here, because it has a couple of 10 requirements in there of dealing with the state, and also 11 dealing with law, there is a couple of things in there. And 12 then our -- our data -- our system that we have in 13 Environmental Health is a little different than everybody 14 else's. It is an Excel program. And, again, I think 15 Mr. Trolinger can attest to this, that we have very few 16 people in the courthouse that are -- have the experience in 17 Excel. And this is our total -- this is my whole program on 18 Excel. So, this Excel database, it takes a -- a unique 19 person, or a person that has those qualification skills to be 20 able to navigate through there and generate reports and 21 whatnot in there. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: You know, you quote the minimum, 23 which would be a 16.1, but then say that -- 24 MR. GARCIA: I could work that out with H.R., and 25 I'll make sure that we have it in there that if you don't 1-23-12 227 1 have the qualifications or those experiences to put in there, 2 that this is what the start -- 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Or the actual compensation will be 4 based on qualifications and experience. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Qualifications and 6 experience. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: At a minimum of the -- of the grade 8 16.1. Okay. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not to exceed the present 10 level. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably shouldn't exceed the 12 present level. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I understand. That would be 14 the absolute max under extreme circumstances. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it needs to come back. 16 Do a 16.5 -- I don't recall that we've hired a -- 17 MR. GARCIA: It only -- it would be 16.3, but I 18 don't -- again, we're -- you're really nitpicking, because I 19 got to have somebody that understands the -- 20 MR. TROLINGER: I think what Ray's trying to say 21 is, you need to know and be able to manipulate the custom 22 database that Environmental Health has, and it's not 23 something that you can just find in any clerk's office. It's 24 a -- it's an exceptional skill. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Advertise the position. 1-23-12 228 1 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to Section 4, if we 3 have nothing further on that one. Payment of the bills. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move we pay bills. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and second to pay 7 the bills. Question or comment? All in favor, signify by 8 raising your right hand. 9 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 11 (No response.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. Budget amendments. 13 The budget amendment requests -- 14 MS. HARGIS: We had some late bills. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Huh? 16 MS. HARGIS: We had some late bills. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: I'll get to those. 18 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Right after Item 2, which is budget 20 amendments. 21 MS. HARGIS: Okay, sorry. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: There are six different -- actually, 23 five budget amendments, and a sixth one is to pull something 24 in as an income item, it appears. Do I hear a motion that 25 the budget amendments, as shown by the request dated 23 1-23-12 229 1 January 2012, Items 1 through 6, be approved as submitted? 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Motion made. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Question 5 or discussion? All in favor, signify by raising your right 6 hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 9 (No response.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion carries. Late bills. 11 Looks like we have three different late bills. Applied 12 Concepts, $113. T.E.H.A., $30. Time-Warner Cable, 269.06. 13 MS. HARGIS: These are really not late. They got 14 lost on our desk, so that's the reason why they were showing 15 up as late bills. They were misplaced. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Just fell through the cracks? 17 MS. HARGIS: Fell through the cracks. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is T.E.H.A.? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: You have to talk to somebody smarter 21 than me. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is T.E.H.A.? There is 23 no one smarter than you. 24 MS. HARGIS: What is T.E.H.A.? 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Texas Environmental Health 1-23-12 230 1 Association. How does that sound? 2 MR. GARCIA: Texas Environmental Health 3 Association. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And Rene -- this is Rene's 5 membership? 6 MR. GARCIA: Rene? It should be mine. I'm sorry, 7 I didn't bring my glasses. They have "Rene" on there? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, I just made that up. 9 MS. HARGIS: No, it's not. It is on there. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Rene. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Ray has a new name. 12 MR. GARCIA: That is me. That's supposed to be my 13 membership. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Do I hear a motion that 15 these -- 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Motion made. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for payment 19 of the late bills as indicated. Further question or 20 discussion? All in favor, signify by raising your right 21 hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. I've been 1-23-12 231 1 presented with monthly reports as follows: Kerr County 2 Treasurer for December 2011; Justice of the Peace, Precinct 3 3; Constable, Precinct 3, for November and December 2011; 4 District Clerk; Justice of the Peace, Precinct 1; Justice of 5 the Peace, Precinct 2; and Justice of the Peace, Precinct 4. 6 Do I hear a motion that the indicated reports be approved as 7 presented? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded that the 11 indicated reports be approved as presented. Question or 12 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 13 your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Reports from 18 Commissioners in connection with their liaison or committee 19 assignments. Commissioner Baldwin? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sir, I do not at this time. 21 Thank you for the opportunity, though. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Overby? 23 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Two. I'll be at the AACOG 24 meeting on Wednesday. I want to remind each Commissioner 25 that if you have your volunteer fire departments, remember 1-23-12 232 1 the L.C.R.A. application -- grant applications are going to 2 be due in March. I've got two that I'm writing letters of 3 support for grant requests right now, and they want you to 4 get those letters in, those support letters for their 5 request. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else? 7 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's it. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Letz? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Earlier this morning, I forgot 10 to thank one -- I want to thank Maintenance for their work 11 out at the Ag Barn. I think they spent a lot of hours out 12 there. Wanted to get that on the tape. And the other 13 question I have -- not a liaison thing, but it's going back 14 to the bond issue. I think we don't meet again for three 15 weeks. Do we need to have a special meeting to work this 16 out? I mean, we're talking about our next meeting. 17 MS. HARGIS: Seven million, 9 -- 992. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Seven million -- over 7.9. 19 MS. HARGIS: Hang on a second. $7,997,000 -- 20 7,997,943. Nearly 8 million. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, anyway, I just think we may 23 want to look at a time to do that, because I think we 24 probably shouldn't wait three weeks. 25 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's good. 1-23-12 233 1 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll -- we'll get Ms. Grinstead to 2 do a poll. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And other than that -- and by 4 the 13th meeting, we will have something to report on Little 5 League, either an extension -- probably it will be a 6 month-to-month extension while we're finalizing that deal. 7 And on the Ag Barn, with the Stock Show Association, Bruce 8 and I will probably have that final agreement, we expect, 9 before the Court on the 13th. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that it? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No doubt about it. I think 12 there's been enough; I think I'll just be quiet. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. Elected officials? 14 Department heads? 15 MR. GARCIA: We've completed the Kerr County 16 Nuisance Abatement Program in Precinct 1, Buster. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 18 MR. GARCIA: On Calcote; that is complete. And, 19 Rob, we will be turning that over to you to be filed. That's 20 it. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 22 MR. TROLINGER: I just wanted to clarify, on the 23 communications issue with the Sheriff's Office, I'm not in 24 favor of encrypting the communications; I think they should 25 be open for everybody to hear. But there's a legitimate need 1-23-12 234 1 to encrypt it, and the only way they can do it reasonably is 2 with a digital system. They really need to do that. And, 3 Commissioner Baldwin, that pile of paper that you see in 4 front of the court reporter is what that new software for 5 Odyssey will do, eliminate that piece of paper or all that 6 pile of paper, turn it into an electronic tablet. You made a 7 comment about it; I just wanted to clarify it. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I've already spotted 9 it. I want to know why you haven't done that yet. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Sheriff? 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We've said enough for one day. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: County Attorney? 13 MR. HENNEKE: Briefly -- and, no, the only paper 14 files we have left criminally are those that existed before 15 we moved forward doing electronic, so these are -- those are 16 the old ones. I just wanted to let the Court know I had a 17 piece of equipment in the County Attorney's office; it's a 18 digital projector that's sitting back here. That with the -- 19 the courtroom technology that y'all put in various 20 courtrooms, we didn't have a need for this any more, but it's 21 -- it's a great piece of equipment. It's compatible with 22 that TV. It's also compatible with other digital projectors. 23 But, basically, if you put any object on here, it shows up on 24 the projector on the TV. So, if you have a handout, if you 25 have a picture, if anybody's coming to make a presentation in 1-23-12 235 1 Commissioners Court and they're going to have a demonstrative 2 or something, it will plug into there. Or if H.R. is doing 3 training, or any department's using training and they've got, 4 you know, overheads they need to show, they can use that. 5 But I'm transferring it to I.T., so any -- any department in 6 the county can check it out and use it, and we can use it 7 here in Commissioners Court if y'all want to. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Fantastic. 9 MR. HENNEKE: Very simple to use. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Jody can use it right up here. 11 MS. GRINSTEAD: For what? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You can put -- we were talking 13 about something, putting it up there. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anybody else? Anything? Is 15 that a yes, John? 16 MR. BOLLIER: You got anything else? 17 MR. TROLINGER: No, sir. Thank you. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anybody else? Anything else 19 to come before the Court today? We're adjourned. 20 (Commissioners Court was adjourned at 3:32 p.m.) 21 - - - - - - - - - - 22 23 24 25 1-23-12 236 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 official reporter for the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 28th day of January, 8 2012. 9 10 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 11 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 12 Certified Shorthand Reporter 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 1-23-12