1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Regular Session 10 Monday, February 13, 2012 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 GUY R. OVERBY, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X February 13, 2012 2 PAGE 3 -- Visitors' Input 6 -- Commissioners' Comments 13 4 1.1 Public Hearing concerning revision of plat for 5 Lots 3 and 4 of Cypress Springs Estates, Phase I 18 6 1.2 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for final approval concerning revision of plat for 7 Lots 3 and 4 of Cypress Springs Estates, Phase I 19 8 1.3 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to accept preliminary revision of plat for Lots 4, 9 5, and 6 of Cave Springs Addition; set a public hearing 19 10 1.4 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 11 approve temporary extension of lease agreement with Kerrville Little League, Inc. 21 12 1.5 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 13 approve report to Commissioners Court of the status of investments made under Section 887(b) 14 Probate Code 23 15 1.6 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve contract with K’Star; allow County Judge 16 to sign same 25 17 1.7 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to authorize Environmental Health Director, Ray 18 Garcia, to hire a temporary full-time employee utilizing funds from e-Government Technologies, 19 Inc., settlement agreement 25 20 1.8 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to apply for National Association of Counties 21 membership and enroll in NACo prescription discount card program 27 22 1.14 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 23 accept resignation of ESD#1 board member Ken Wood, effective February 20, 2012, and appoint 24 Donna Damon to a 2-year term on ESD #1 Board of Commissioners 31 25 3 1 I N D E X (Continued) February 13, 2012 2 PAGE 1.15 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 3 approving resolution from Kerr County Commissioners Court authorizing City of 4 Kerrville access to public sewer infrastructure located within the County’s easements for 5 Kerrville South Wastewater Project 32 6 1.16 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to revise Kerr County burn ban order as per request 7 by Kerr Wildlife Area & Texas Parks and Wildlife 36, 43 8 1.9 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on resolution supporting Kerrville V.A. Hospital 37 9 1.17 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 10 implementation of the burn ban 44 11 1.18 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to move all indoor arena events to outdoor arena 12 at Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center 45 13 1.19 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to raise rates for use of indoor and outdoor arenas 14 at Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center 46 15 1.10 Presentation by Ray Watson with Kerr Economic Development Corporation regarding Culligan Water 16 Treatments Systems business 50 17 1.11 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve economic incentives package for Culligan 18 Water Treatments Systems business as recommended by Board of Directors of K.E.D.C. 59 19 1.12 Presentation by Ray Watson with Kerr Economic 20 Development Corporation regarding the LeMeilleur’s RV Truck and Equipment Repair Company 60 21 1.13 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 22 approve economic incentives package for LeMeilleur’s RV Truck and Equipment Repair 23 Company as recommended by Board of Directors of K.E.D.C. 63 24 1.20 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 25 accept reports on cash count audits for County Clerk, District Clerk, and Tax Assessor-Collector 64 4 1 I N D E X (Continued) February 13, 2012 2 PAGE 1.21 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action 3 regarding all aspects of demolition, bidding and construction of new show barn at Hill 4 Country Youth Exhibit Center 65, 72 5 1.22 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action regarding contract with Peter Lewis for 6 renovations at Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center 68 7 1.25 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to declare the gas chamber at the Animal Control 8 facility as surplus; authorize disposal at recycle facility 70 9 1.27 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 10 accept the 2011 Partial Racial Profiling report for Kerr County Sheriff’s Office 70 11 1.23 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action 12 regarding capital items list for proposed debt issue 76, 13 128 1.24 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 14 approve order authorizing publication of notice of intention to issue certificates of obligation to 15 finance acquisition of equipment and construction or improvement of facilities in the county --- 16 1.26 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 17 lease agreement with Hill Country District Junior Livestock Association for use of the Hill Country 18 Youth Exhibit Center facilities; authorize County Judge to sign it 125 19 4.1 Pay Bills 173 20 4.2 Budget Amendments 175 4.3 Late Bills 176 21 4.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 178 22 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee Assignments 179 23 5.2 Reports from Elected Officials/Department Heads 181 24 --- Adjourned 183 25 5 1 On Monday, February 13, 2012, at 9:00 a.m., a regular 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. 8 Let me call to order this regularly scheduled meeting of the 9 Kerr County Commissioners Court posted and scheduled for this 10 date and time, Monday, February the 13th, 2012, at 9 a.m. It 11 is that time now. Commissioner Baldwin? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. Would you please 13 rise with me, and let's have a word of prayer, and then we'll 14 do the pledge of allegiance. 15 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Be seated, please. At 18 this time, if there's any member of the public or audience 19 that wishes to be heard with respect to any matter which is 20 not a listed agenda item, this is your opportunity to come 21 forward and tell us what's on your mind. If you wish to be 22 heard on an agenda item, we would ask that you fill out a 23 participation form. There should be some located at the rear 24 of the room. It's not essential, but it helps me to be sure 25 that I'm aware that someone is wanting to be heard on that 2-13-12 6 1 agenda item. If we get to an agenda item that you wish to be 2 heard on, and you have not filed a participation form, get my 3 attention in some manner and I'll give you the opportunity. 4 But right now, if any member of the public or audience wishes 5 to be heard on any matter which is not a listed agenda item, 6 come forward tell us what's on your mind. If you'd give us 7 your name and address, please? 8 MR. FOSTER: Denny Foster, 635 Lane Valley Road, 9 Comfort. I have been appointed the new acting Chamber 10 president as of this morning. I just wanted the Court to 11 know that the Chamber is going to continue to move forward in 12 the fashion that we have in the last several months, with 13 being a more proactive voice in the business community, and 14 supporting the city and the county on future economic growth. 15 So, please use us. We will not be sitting back and resting 16 on our laurels while we search for a permanent replacement, 17 but we do -- we are going to be supporting and moving forward 18 in the manner we have in the past. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. Appreciate you 20 being here this morning. 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Thank you. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: There is something I'd like to 23 mention, and in doing this, I'd like two people to stand up; 24 Deputy Charlie Witt and Geraldine Rodriguez, both Kerr County 25 employees. This is something that occurred on the 10th, and 2-13-12 7 1 I would like to read a little short report and let the Court 2 and them understand how we feel about our employees. It 3 says, "On 2/10, of '12, at approximately 7:50 a.m., I, Deputy 4 Charlie Witt, was notified of an unresponsive individual on 5 the first floor of the Kerr County Courthouse. I responded 6 and observed a white female lying on her back just inside the 7 west entrance door. A male individual was at her head, and 8 Geraldine Rodriguez was kneeling on the floor at the victim's 9 right side. I took the position at the victim's head. I was 10 told the victim was sitting in a chair when she passed out 11 and was placed on the floor. I tilted the victim's head to 12 open her airway, and felt and heard her breathing. I asked 13 Tim Bollier to retrieve the AED located in the Kerr County 14 Clerk's Office, which he did. As I was holding the victim's 15 head, she stopped breathing and I could not find a pulse. I 16 immediately gave two rescue breaths and asked Geraldine to 17 start chest compressions. After a series of compressions, 18 the victim gasped for a breath and started breathing on her 19 own again. I instructed Geraldine to stop compressions. The 20 victim continued to breathe on her own, and I was able to 21 detect a pulse. I then instructed and assisted Geraldine in 22 hooking up the AED to the victim. After getting the AED 23 system up and running, a 'no shock' was advised. EMS arrived 24 at 8:05 a.m., and the victim was transported to Sid Peterson 25 Hospital." 2-13-12 8 1 Victim has since been transported, airlifted to 2 Austin, a hospital in Austin where her cardiologist is. She 3 is doing well as of the last I heard Saturday evening, but 4 she does have some health issues that are being attended to. 5 But there's no doubt that two of your employees saved this 6 victim's life. And this victim's well known by the Court and 7 by this County, and I just think this Court ought to 8 recognize both of those employees for outstanding work above 9 and beyond what they did, and I thank you. 10 (Applause.) 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hear, hear. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Thank you. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Thank y'all. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Sheriff. Mr. Cantrell, 15 good morning. 16 MR. CANTRELL: I'm Bill Cantrell; I live at 428 17 Saddle Club Drive in Kerrville. I'm the post commander of 18 AMVETS Post 1000 here in Kerrville. First of all, I'd like 19 to say on the agenda item that comes up at 9:45, I believe, 20 that I applaud -- we applaud the Commissioners Court on what 21 you plan to do. We are very much in support of the employees 22 of the veteran's hospital here. I also wanted to speak just 23 briefly -- I spoke to Guy yesterday, and I guess I'm going to 24 go back on what I said; I'd like to speak briefly about the 25 EUL, which I know you're going to have the presentation on 2-13-12 9 1 the 27th of this month, followed by a presentation to the 2 City Council on the 28th. I know you all remember that about 3 a year and a half ago, I came out very strongly in support of 4 the then EUL for the veterans homeless project that ended up 5 in defeat. The developer withdrew because there was not a 6 single organization or entity that came out in support, just 7 a few voices. But the V.A. didn't give up. As you know, 8 they turned around and came out with a new one which is more 9 in tune with the community for senior affordable veterans' 10 housing, assisted living. 11 Now, I would like you to know the reason I'm coming 12 out a bit early, even though I know you're going to have a 13 presentation at that time, I'd like y'all to be thinking that 14 this is something that we strongly support. AMVETS Post 1000 15 has since that time received our charter, and all 41 of our 16 members are strongly in support of this EUL. I spoke with 17 the developer, Craig Taylor, on Saturday, had a very lengthy 18 discussion with him. I know he's made a lot of -- they have 19 made a lot of concessions to satisfy the -- the reasons that 20 the City Council stated that they opposed it, such as it will 21 be veterans only. Now I don't want to steal too much of his 22 thunder, because some of these things he will want to 23 present, and it will probably be better that they be 24 presented in kind of a new light. But, you know, I'm a life 25 member of the VFW. I'm a life member of the Vietnam 2-13-12 10 1 Veterans, a life member of AMVETS. I'm a member of American 2 Legion, a member of the Sons of the American Revolution. I'm 3 also a member of the Hill Country Honor Guard. 4 I've had a chance to talk to a lot of veterans. 5 And I know you all keep up with the news, so I know you've 6 read what's shown up in the papers, the letters to the 7 editor, Joseph Benham's editorial. I do not have permission 8 to speak for any of the other organizations other than the 9 AMVETS post, but I do know -- I know you've read in the paper 10 that both Henry Bronts and Art Modgling, the president and 11 vice president of Vietnam Veterans Post 863, wrote a letter 12 to the editor strongly in support. Also, Joseph Benham's 13 editorial in support. He's not only a member of the Hill 14 Country Veterans Council, but chaplain of the S.A.R. The 15 Hill Country Veterans Council, I know you read the vice 16 president Bennie Hyde's letter, on and on. I have talked to 17 the Military Order of Purple Heart; they've indicated their 18 support. Hill Country Veterans Council, General Schellhase, 19 Bennie Hyde, have indicated their support. 20 So, I'd just like everybody to be thinking about 21 this. This is something -- I have seen the plans. I have 22 seen their finished -- pictures of their finished products. 23 They've done a number of these across the country. And I'll 24 tell you, I'm going to be 73 next month, and I would like to 25 end up in a place like this. My dad died of Alzheimer's, and 2-13-12 11 1 I got to see some of the places that were available and what 2 they cost. I will not qualify for this, because this is for 3 some of our veterans that would not be able to afford some of 4 the other nursing homes in this community. You know, for 5 somewhere between 550 and 750, they'll get something that 6 would cost them 2,500 a month and up. So, I'd just like you 7 to be thinking about supporting this. Thanks a lot. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. We appreciate you 9 being here. Any other member of the audience or public that 10 wishes to be heard on a matter which is not a listed agenda 11 item? Yes, sir. If you'll come forward, give us your name 12 and address, and tell us what's on your mind. 13 MR. HILL: My name is Durwin Hill. I live at 139 14 Four Bears Trail, Bear Paw Ranch. I wanted to come today -- 15 I visited with my Commissioner, Commissioner Baldwin. I know 16 about a month ago, y'all were considering plans for an 17 expansion of the show barn, and with my background, I've 18 spent a career in the FFA program in Texas. I was an ag 19 teacher; I was an area supervisor in Waco. I was head of FFA 20 in Texas for eight years, executive secretary, worked all the 21 major shows, worked with all Extension Service, was a 4-H 22 member. And I've seen, on a personal basis, at school 23 districts all over this state, how the FFA and 4-H programs 24 has helped young people, and I want to applaud you folks for 25 considering expansion of the show barn facilities. You've 2-13-12 12 1 got a wonderful district show here and a wonderful county 2 show, and you folks are doing a wonderful job. And I wanted 3 to let you know, from my background, I certainly applaud what 4 you're doing. 5 One quick story. I worked the Houston Livestock 6 Show for 25 years. I heard two parents talking -- this is 7 about 25, 30 years ago. And they was showing beef heifers, 8 and this one dad said to the other -- he said, "Isn't that 9 your son standing in first place?" And he said, "Yes, sir, 10 sure is." He said, "That's my son in third place." Said, 11 "That's an awful good heifer your son has." He said, "How 12 much did that heifer cost you?" He said, "Well, we paid a 13 couple thousand dollars for this heifer." He said, "My 14 goodness." He said, "How in the world do you ever expect to 15 make any money out of that heifer?" And that -- well, that 16 dad turned to that other one and said, "Fella, I don't ever 17 expect to make money out of that heifer." He said, "That 18 heifer is helping me raise a son." And said, "That heifer is 19 cheap"; said, "My other son at home's got three Kawasaki 20 motorcycles." He said, "I can assure you, this heifer is 21 cheap." 22 So, I -- you know, we got to have the right 23 perspective about this. And any time you invest in young 24 people in this state, I can assure you, your money's well 25 spent. And I just wanted to come and tell you folks, as a 2-13-12 13 1 patriot in this county -- we retired here; been here about 2 eight years. I wanted you folks to know that I certainly 3 applaud what you're trying to do out there, and keep up the 4 good work. Thanks. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. We appreciate you 6 being here. 7 MR. HILL: You bet. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Of course, y'all understand 9 he's in Precinct 1. (Laughter.) 10 MR. HILL: Yeah, I got a good commissioner. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. And he's smart, 12 too. (Laughter.) 13 MR. ODOM: Unsolicited. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: What did that cost you? 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll slip it to you later. 16 MR. HILL: There you go. There you go. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other member of the audience or 18 public have anything they wish to say that's not on an agenda 19 item? Okay, let's move on. Now, Commissioner this is your 20 chance to follow right on behind your biggest fan out there. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I've been -- my family 22 and I have been here for four years, and we're proud to be 23 here. And I wanted to tell y'all about something I've got 24 cooking. Probably next meeting, we'll have a small ESD 25 presentation in this room, and I've got goosebumps, and I 2-13-12 14 1 think you will -- as we move closer to that meeting, you'll 2 have goosebumps. And the County Attorney doesn't know it 3 yet, but he's going to participate in it. But that's -- 4 that's about all. I wanted to introduce my friend Jay Dozier 5 back there from the First Christian Church in Kerrville. At 6 some point, he's going to come in and do the opening prayer 7 for us, at a later date. You're late, my friend. 8 (Laughter.) And I'm glad you're here, though. I really am. 9 MR. DOZIER: Thanks, Buster. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's about it, Judge. I 11 think -- you know, I'm looking forward to this day. God, 12 look at this. We got a bunch of stuff to talk about. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Overby? 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Two things, Judge, I want to 15 talk about and just mention. Last Saturday, we had -- the 16 Center Point Lions had their fundraising for the pancakes 17 last week. Had a great crowd out there. The Sheriff was out 18 there and Rob was out there. And, again, those moneys are 19 used to help with scholarships and grants. It was very 20 successful. Thanks for all the hard work out there as well. 21 I also want to mention, you know, we're talking about youth. 22 Of course, I can't comment on anything in the public forum, 23 but later on I will, but I also want to mention Commissioner 24 Baldwin and I attended about a week ago a Fellowship of 25 Christian Athletes breakfast -- morning breakfast. And, you 2-13-12 15 1 know, our Kerrville Tivy Antler football coach, Mark Smith, 2 took a job in Judson. I'd just like to recognize, again, 3 Mark Smith's efforts the last 10 years in our community 4 working with youth. We have seen the lives of many young men 5 and women touched in our community by his efforts, and I just 6 would like to say from the county standpoint, you know he 7 will be well missed here, but we know that he'll do well 8 where he went. We thank him for what he did. We've got new 9 leadership and somebody new coming in our community to work 10 with our youth. And, anyway, it was just a good meeting; had 11 a lots of folks there for that breakfast meeting, and we 12 appreciate Mr. Smith and his coaching here for the last 10 13 years at Tivy. That's it. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Commissioner Letz? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I want to certainly agree with 16 what Commissioner Overby said about Mark Smith. Mark is a 17 fantastic man, good Christian, great coach, great with the 18 kids. He did a really good job, and it's a -- we're very 19 fortunate that, you know, he was brought here by his 20 predecessor, Neal LaHue, who is also doing very well. Both 21 of them now will be head coaches in San Antonio. Aqua Texas, 22 I want to bring it up briefly. I guess it was at our last 23 meeting, we had it on our agenda. I'm not ready to put it 24 back on the agenda. The resolution's still working. I'm 25 getting some information, receiving phone calls about new 2-13-12 16 1 things. And I was not aware about some of the rate 2 structures, and so I'm trying to get all that, and then we 3 will probably send it off, hopefully have that wrapped up 4 this week, and then get it off to Aqua Texas so they have a 5 little bit of advance warning that it's coming. This other 6 thing is just -- it just came to my attention there's a lady 7 in east Kerr County that spends a lot of time -- she works 8 full-time too, but picking up trash along the roads. And I 9 don't know about how it goes on out in the west, but I know 10 in the eastern part of the county, for some reason, there's 11 been a lot of trash on Highway 27. She does usually pick it 12 up. I want to recognize Deyl Reeh. She's worked -- or picks 13 up trash pretty much weekly on Bartelshell, Schladoer, Gattis 14 Bluff, that whole little area, and just takes it upon 15 herself; doesn't really want any recognition or anything, but 16 I really appreciate people that look after our countryside 17 and our community. That's it. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Oehler? 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I had a call from a 20 lady that had occasion to use our animal control services 21 recently, and they don't get a whole lot of pats on the back 22 for anything, and she is going to send me a letter talking 23 about how professional, how caring, and how her pet was 24 handled when she had to surrender it, and wants to commend 25 the whole department out there for taking the time and -- and 2-13-12 17 1 doing it correctly. And they just -- they get a lot of 2 criticism, but very little praise. And so, anyway, that -- 3 that was a real highlight. The lady talked to me for 15 4 minutes the other day, and that was very nice. I'll be 5 getting a letter, and I'll forward that on to the -- to the 6 Animal Control folks. That's it. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: It is a tough job, Commissioner. A 8 lot of what they do draws out the worst, and hopefully, in 9 some cases, like the one you're talking about, the best of 10 emotions. And with respect to their operations out there, 11 since we've changed over to a new method of euthanasia that 12 the animal rights organizations have been advocating for some 13 time, I've heard a lot of positive comments about support for 14 our doing that, and appreciate the efforts of the Court and 15 the Animal Control people in bringing that change about, 16 since it is matter that's near and dear to the hearts of 17 those animal rights people. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And also, on that -- I'll 19 just comment just about that much. The closing on the two 20 mornings a week is really working well. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Till 11 o'clock to the 23 public. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: My other -- I also want to mention 25 that in connection with this incident that the Sheriff talked 2-13-12 18 1 about, the individual who had become unresponsive was also a 2 public employee, a fellow employee to a lot of our Kerr 3 County employees. So, not -- not that that would make any 4 difference; if it were a total, complete stranger, I'm sure 5 the actions would have been the same. But in this particular 6 case, it happened to be one of -- one of our own public 7 employees that works very closely with the county. Let's get 8 on with our agenda; we've got a fairly lengthy one. At this 9 time, I will recess the Commissioners Court meeting, and I'll 10 convene a public hearing concerning the revision of plat for 11 Lots 3 and 4 of Cypress Springs Estates, Phase I, as set 12 forth in Volume 7, Page 12, Plat Records, and located in 13 Precinct 4. 14 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 9:21 a.m., and a public hearing was held in open 15 court, as follows:) 16 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Is there any member of the public or 18 audience that wishes to be heard with respect to the revision 19 of plat for Lots 3 and 4 of Cypress Springs Estates, Phase I, 20 as set forth in Volume 7, Page 12, Plat Records? Seeing no 21 one coming forward, I will close the public hearing 22 concerning the revision of plat for Lots 3 and 4 of Cypress 23 Springs Estates, Phase I. 24 (The public hearing was concluded at 9:22 a.m., and the regular Commissioners Court meeting was 25 reopened.) 2-13-12 19 1 - - - - - - - - - - 2 JUDGE TINLEY: And I will reconvene the 3 Commissioners Court meeting, and go to Item 2; consider, 4 discuss, and take appropriate action for the final approval 5 concerning the revision of plat for Lots 3 and 4 of Cypress 6 Springs Estates, Phase I, as set forth in Volume 7, Page 12, 7 Plat Records. Mr. Odom? 8 MR. ODOM: Good morning, Judge. Mr. and Mrs. Smith 9 own Lots 3 and 4 in Cypress Springs Estates, Phase I. The 10 Smiths would like to combine Lots 3 and 4 together, and 11 making Lot 3R, a total of 4.7 acres. So, at this time, we 12 ask the Court for final approval for the revision of plat for 13 Lots 3 and 4 of Cypress Springs Estates, Phase I, Volume 7, 14 Page 12, Precinct 4. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Move approval. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 18 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion on the 19 motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your 20 right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's go to 25 Item 3, our 9:10 timed item; to consider, discuss, and take 2-13-12 20 1 appropriate action to accept the preliminary revision of plat 2 for Lots 4, 5, and 6 of Cave Springs Addition, Section 5, 3 Phase 1, Block D, and set a public hearing, the same being 4 located in Precinct 4. 5 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. Before I start, I just want 6 to make a correction on this. I missed it. On the date, it 7 should not be February; it should be March the 26th. And I 8 will confirm that as I make the synopsis of everything. 9 Mr. and Mrs. Outland own Lots 4, 5, and 6 of Cave Springs 10 Addition, Section 5, Phase I, Block D. The Outlands would 11 like to combine all three lots into one lot, which will total 12 1.78 acres. At this time, we ask the Court to accept the 13 preliminary revision of plat for Lots 4, 5, and 6 of Cave 14 Springs addition, Section 5, Phase I, Block D, and to set a 15 public hearing for Monday, March the 26th, 2012, at 9 a.m. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So moved. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to set a 19 public hearing on the matter for 9 a.m. on March 26th, 2012. 20 Any question or discussion on the motion? All in favor of 21 that motion, signify by raising your right hand. 22 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 24 (No response.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll go to 2-13-12 21 1 Item 4; to consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 2 approve temporary extension of lease agreement with Kerrville 3 Little League, Inc. Commissioner Letz? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I put this on the agenda. It's 5 basically an extension through this season, if it's needed to 6 be that long, for the -- basically extending the current 7 lease. Rob and I met with the counsel representing Little 8 League and the representative of Select Baseball and 9 president of Little League last week. I guess we met with 10 them about that. Pretty much had a good meeting. I think 11 we're all on the same page as to where we're going. Doug 12 Robertson is going to go back to his board and talk to them 13 about it, and then between the County Attorney and John 14 Carlson, they'll work out a lease, as I understand it. 15 That's where we -- but it seems to be moving forward. I 16 don't think there's any real issues that are turning 17 insurmountable. It's just a matter of making sure everyone 18 is in agreement. I'll make a notion that we approve the 19 extension until -- July 31st? 20 MR. HENNEKE: Yes. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Till July 31st of 2012. 22 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'll second that. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: I have a motion and a second to 24 approve the extension of the Little League lease. It's just 25 an extension of the existing lease through July 31st of this 2-13-12 22 1 year? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And one of the reasons for that 5 is a new entity is going to be set up that we will actually 6 be contracting with, and it's going to take about that long 7 to get that entity to go on to get its 503 status, so it's -- 8 that's really -- I think the deal will be pretty much set up 9 ahead of time, but we're not having anyone to contract with. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That -- that program of 12 setting that entity up, will that come into this courtroom or 13 something? Y'all are just going to put together, and get on 14 down -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We will contract with the 16 entity, but we're not setting it up. We're pretty much 17 telling -- you know, saying how we think it should be set up, 18 and they're -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Will that entity be approved 20 by this Court? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, I don't think so. No. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Why not? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, it's not our entity. 24 It's the -- an entity being set up to run that facility, but 25 it's -- we'll contract with it, and then it's going to -- 2-13-12 23 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We will contract -- this 2 Court will contract with it? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, contract with that 4 entity. And that entity is going to have a -- the way it's 5 envisioned right now is a five-member board, which would be 6 two from Little League, two from Select Baseball, and one 7 kind of at large that those other four agree to, and it's 8 fairly flexible. That board -- that five-member board will 9 pretty much be responsible for running the facility, making 10 sure that everyone stays happy out there. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other comments or questions on 12 the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 13 your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 18 Item 5; to consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 19 approve the report to Commissioners Court of the status of 20 investments made under Section 887B of the Probate Code. 21 Ms. Pieper, this is an annual requirement that the Court be 22 made aware of and approve those Court-directed investments 23 that are made for the benefit of incapacitated persons, 24 minors, things such as that, where those individuals have 25 received awards from the courts or -- or similar type 2-13-12 24 1 monetary -- 2 MS. PIEPER: That is correct. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Once again this year, my 5 name is not on this list. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You feel fortunate or what? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: I think you're of legal age, aren't 8 you, Commissioner? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I am legal age. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: There could only be one other reason 11 it would be on there. I don't think you want to be on there 12 for that reason. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, probably not. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I can still hope. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I make a motion we approve the 18 report as submitted. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 20 approval of the report as submitted. Question or discussion 21 on that motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by 22 raising your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 2-13-12 25 1 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. 2 MS. PIEPER: Thank you. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to Item 6 quickly; to 4 consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to approve 5 contract with K'Star and allow County Judge to sign same. 6 This is our standard service under County-sponsored 7 organizations in the amount as approved in the budget. 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Make a motion to approve 9 that. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 12 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 13 favor, signify by raising your right hand. 14 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 16 (No response.) 17 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We'll go to 18 Item 7, which is a 9:30 timed item, which it happens to be 19 now, to consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 20 authorize Environmental Health Director, Ray Garcia, to hire 21 temporary full-time employee utilizing funds from the 22 eGovernment Technologies, Inc., settlement agreement. 23 Mr. Garcia? 24 MR. GARCIA: This is part of the settlement 25 agreement. I spoke to the H.R. Director. We are calculating 2-13-12 26 1 about five months of employment with the settlement agreement 2 to work on the physical files. So -- 3 MR. HENNEKE: Ray, are you hiring a temp? 4 MR. GARCIA: This will be a temporary. 5 MR. HENNEKE: Going through a temp agency? 6 MR. GARCIA: No, we're going to go ahead and 7 utilize the people that are already in the system. We're 8 going to attempt to use those that are already in the system 9 here with Kerr County. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What does that mean? 11 MR. GARCIA: We'll see if they'll -- if they want 12 to actually do this work. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We have several temps. 15 MR. GARCIA: We have thousands of files, so -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 17 MR. GARCIA: -- it's pretty tedious work. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 21 approval of the agenda item. Question or discussion? All in 22 favor, signify by raising your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 2-13-12 27 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's go to 2 Item 8; to consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 3 apply for National Association of Counties membership, and 4 enroll in the NACo prescription discount card program. 5 Ms. Hargis? 6 MS. HARGIS: About a week ago, I received -- the 7 County Auditors Association has a listserv, and I received an 8 e-mail concerning this discount program, and I think I gave 9 y'all a copy of that. This is a no-cost program, other than 10 we have to join the National Association of Counties, which 11 is $861. And this offers a 24 percent discount to any 12 resident of Kerr County. I think it's a good program. In 13 addition to that, there is a rebate of a dollar to the County 14 for servicing it. NACo pays for the cards. I haven't gotten 15 the total details down, but I think it's mostly web-based, 16 but this would allow those people who don't have insurance to 17 get a discount on their prescriptions. It even works for pet 18 prescriptions. The -- we're not as large as Denton County, 19 but Denton County is receiving about $500 a month from their 20 program, so I think our dues would be more than paid back by 21 those people that use the program. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I missed your first part. Can 23 you say the first little piece again, if you can remember 24 what you said about the cost and who uses it? 25 MS. HARGIS: There is no cost to the County. Any 2-13-12 28 1 resident of Kerr County can have a card and use it, and it's 2 a 24 percent discount at the pharmacist on retail-cost 3 prescriptions. It also works for pet prescriptions. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's important. 5 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Mm-hmm. 6 MS. HARGIS: There's a lot of people who have pets, 7 and that's very expensive now. The -- it's just a card they 8 get with our seal on it. We're able to do it. They print -- 9 NACo does everything. We don't have to pay for anything. 10 So, they set up the program, they provide the cards, they 11 provide the pamphlets. It just offers those people who don't 12 have insurance a way to get a discount on prescriptions. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: How do we get the cards to 14 them? 15 MS. HARGIS: Through the web. They're able to 16 print them down from the website. We'll have to put a link 17 on our website, and they just -- they can print them down. 18 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: If I'm not mistaken, several 19 counties also are participating in this as well across the 20 state too, correct? 21 MS. HARGIS: That's the reason that I brought it to 22 you. There was -- when it appeared on my listserv, I was 23 amazed at the number of counties that have participated in 24 it. 25 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'm -- go ahead. 2-13-12 29 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just was going to say, who 2 cares what other counties do? That's -- 3 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'm glad to see them helping 4 people who don't have funding. And -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But -- but did you know that 6 in this county, all you have to do is go down to H.E.B. or 7 Walmart and join up with what they do, and they get -- I 8 mean, they get -- you can get medicine for $4. I mean, you 9 don't have to join an organization that we have turned down 10 twice in this courtroom. And it says -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Go ahead. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hold on a minute. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He's on a roll. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. It's free, no cost to 15 the County, and that comes right after the invoice for $861. 16 I'm -- I'm very familiar with NACo, and we -- the State of 17 Texas has two elected members of that thing to represent 18 Texas, and I know them both very well, and this is nothing 19 more than a lobbying effort that they use our money to give 20 to elected officials nationwide. I wouldn't join -- I'll 21 vote no; I can tell that you much. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, Commissioner, you said 23 most of what I was going to say. You only left off the one 24 part; the lobbying effort is generally contrary to the 25 political philosophy of me, -- 2-13-12 30 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That is correct. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- and probably the majority of 3 citizens of this county. That's why I won't vote for it. 4 It's basically supporting -- it's -- to me, it's like 5 supporting -- I should not say "supporting." I'm against it 6 because of who they lobby for -- in favor of. 7 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Have they had previous visits 8 here before for a similar application to this program? 9 MS. HARGIS: I have no idea. It's the first time 10 I've ever been involved with it, so all of this is prior me. 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. I -- 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure, it's been in this 13 courtroom. 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: On this program before? 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. We have voted it down 16 twice. 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Like looks it's going to be 19 the third time. 20 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. It looks like it's 21 helping people somewhere. That's good. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: We got a motion? 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not from me. 24 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Not from previous history. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any member of the Court have 2-13-12 31 1 anything to offer -- motion to offer in connection with that 2 matter? Hearing none, we will move on. Let's go to Item 14; 3 to consider, discuss, take appropriate action to accept the 4 resignation of Emergency Services District Number 1 board 5 member, Ken Wood, effective February the 20th of this year, 6 and appoint Donna Damon to a two-year term on ESD Board 7 Number 1 Board of Commissioners. Commissioner Oehler? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes, sir. Ken Wood has been 9 serving on the ESD board in Ingram for 15 years. He tendered 10 a resignation to me, asking that he resign effective February 11 the 20th at their regular board meeting, and that Ms. Donna 12 Damon, who resides within the district, be appointed to fill 13 his unexpired term. Which would be what, about a year? 14 MS. THOMPSON: It was just this January. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, almost two years. So, I'll 16 make a motion we accept his resignation and appoint Donna -- 17 Donna Damon as the new ESD Number 1 Board of Commissioners. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll second that. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Question 20 or discussion? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just wanted to say, Ken 22 Wood has been a servant to this community in a huge, huge 23 way, and I hate to see his kind -- I guess he's moving off? 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: He's moving out of state, 25 going back closer to Kansas or somewhere. 2-13-12 32 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Not near as smart as I 2 thought he was, then. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You know, that does happen 4 periodically. But I do commend him and thank him for his 5 service, and I will try to make the meeting on the 20th and 6 do that in person. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Very good. Very grateful to 8 him. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: I think Mr. Wood has been a good 10 resource in connection with our looking into the formation of 11 another ESD, and he's been very, very cooperative and helpful 12 that regard, too. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: True. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We have another new expert 15 that's within the -- almost touching distance from where we 16 sit. Cheryl is on the ESD board. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, that's right. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or comments on 19 the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 20 your right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 22 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 23 (No response.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's go to 25 Item 15; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action on 2-13-12 33 1 approving a resolution from Kerr County Commissioners Court 2 authorizing the City of Kerrville access to public sewer 3 infrastructure located within the County's easements for the 4 Kerrville South wastewater project. Commissioner Overby? 5 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Judge and Commissioners, 6 again, this is regarding our Kerrville South wastewater 7 project. As you remember, we have completed the four phases 8 of the Kerrville South wastewater project. The request here 9 again comes from the need to make sure that those phases in 10 that projects out there, the folks that the City will have 11 easement to the -- access to the county easement in those 12 particular projects out there. Basically, this request -- 13 resolution we probably should have passed in the earlier 14 phases so that there would be access to them, to the county 15 easements to go ahead and make sure that they could service 16 those needs for wastewater services out in Kerrville South 17 wastewater. Again, before you, I visited with our County 18 Attorney in helping us address and go ahead and -- and get 19 the language in here, and we've had the language go back and 20 forth, I know, between County and City to get this language 21 in here for this resolution. But, again, with the four 22 phases that are completed, and Phase 5 application that will 23 be going in June of this year, we needed to get a resolution 24 in place of the four previous phases that are completed, and 25 with the Phase 5 beginning so that we can proceed going 2-13-12 34 1 forward with that application as well. County Attorney, 2 anything that you would add to the resolution of support 3 here? 4 MR. HENNEKE: I'd just, you know, make sure the 5 record would note that it was the City that requested that 6 the County do some kind of resolution to give them authority 7 to access the wastewater infrastructure, and that the version 8 of this resolution as presented to the Court I've already 9 shared with the City Attorney, and the City Attorney has 10 approved it to me as acceptable for the needs of the City, 11 and what they -- they needed it for. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This -- is it needed? I mean, 13 I wouldn't -- we can go ahead and do it if they want, but, I 14 mean, we don't have a resolution with Aqua Texas -- or they 15 don't do sewer, I guess. But the water -- what difference 16 does it make? They use our right-of-ways. And Wiedenfeld 17 Waterworks. 18 MR. HENNEKE: We do this for the first three phases 19 of the grant project. But the grant project, you know, 20 involves us building it and then handing it over to the City 21 for them to add to their infrastructure and to maintain. And 22 they said they wanted it, so it certainly doesn't hurt 23 anything to confirm that they have authority to -- 24 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Have access. 25 MR. HENNEKE: -- fix the sewage lines, maintain 2-13-12 35 1 them. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just seems weird to me, but 3 anyway, if they want it, I don't see any problem with it. 4 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I will make a motion, then, 5 to go ahead, and for resolution from Kerr County 6 Commissioners Court authorizing the City of Kerrville access 7 to the public sewer infrastructure located within the Kerr 8 County easements for the Kerrville South Wastewater project, 9 and that will be my motion. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Guy, why don't you add in 11 the actual county roads that are involved in that, please. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There's two -- 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: And county roads -- and you 15 are looking where? 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Quail Valley -- 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Quail Valley -- it's all the 18 phases, Quail Valley and Lydick Lane. And all the streets 19 are included in those first four phases. That would be my 20 motion. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Do I hear a second? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second. 24 Further question or discussion on the motion? All in favor 25 of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 2-13-12 36 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 3 (No response.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 5 Item 16; to consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 6 revise the Kerr County burn ban order as per request by Kerr 7 Wildlife Area and Texas Parks and Wildlife. Commissioner 8 Oehler? 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Rob has the document that 10 they -- he prepared, and made a -- do you have that with you, 11 Rob? 12 MR. HENNEKE: I don't have a hard copy. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: But, anyway, the changes made 14 to that basically were to modify the burn ban order to 15 reflect that all state and federal agencies be exempt from 16 filing burn ban -- prescribed burn plans with the county; 17 that they have to file those plans -- they still have to make 18 all the notifications that they would under normal 19 circumstances when they want to do prescribed burns, like 20 notifying volunteers, notifying all their neighbors, and also 21 file the plan with the State, which they do anyway. They 22 wrote the plan. And it's just making it simpler for them, 23 and quicker, rather than having to give us several days 24 notice and then whenever -- maybe the day comes after they've 25 given notice, the conditions aren't right to do a prescribed 2-13-12 37 1 burn, and they have to start all over again. So, they've 2 asked the Texas -- let's see, Texas Department of Agriculture 3 and Parks and Wildlife have made this request, and they had 4 the suggested language which Rob completed. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, that's just two state 6 agencies. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Right. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Or are you going to say all 9 state and federal agencies? 10 MR. HENNEKE: Could we -- Commissioner Oehler, I 11 thought you had the copy. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I did have. 13 MR. HENNEKE: I can send it to Jody right now, and 14 she can print it off so everybody could see exactly what 15 we're talking about. That will take a couple minutes. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, we can come back to that. 17 Okay. Let's go back to Item 9, which is a 9:45 timed item. 18 It appears to be that time now; to consider, discuss, and 19 take appropriate action on resolution supporting the 20 Kerrville V.A. Hospital. Commissioner Overby? 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Judge and Commissioners, if 22 we remember back in December, at the end of last year, the 23 Commissioners Court wanted to bring certain -- bring 24 recognition to our Kerrville V.A. Hospital, and for the 25 outstanding services that we have with this facility, 2-13-12 38 1 long-term history in Kerrville and Kerr County, and recognize 2 the Kerrville V.A. Hospital and their employees, the services 3 that they provide in this community on an annual and 4 day-to-day operation in this community. I know that we have 5 lots of veterans in here today, and again, thank you for your 6 service for our country over the years. We're glad that 7 you're here, and we are very blessed to have our country and 8 the V.A. Hospital here. I would like to read this 9 resolution -- go ahead. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner, if I might interrupt 11 just a minute, all those veterans that are here with us in 12 the audience, would they please stand so they can be 13 recognized? 14 (Applause.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: We appreciate your service. Thank 16 you. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, can I make a 18 comment before you read it? I'm glad you're going to read 19 it. I want to -- two things; you went over it kind of 20 quickly. This resolution, I think, is very timely because of 21 some recent -- the housing facility that's being looked at 22 out at the V.A., and -- but we talked about it originally. I 23 really appreciate Commissioner Overby tackling to write this 24 thing. It was felt that we should just kind of, as a Court, 25 almost on an annual basis, go over how important the V.A. is 2-13-12 39 1 to us, for one, to support the veterans of our community, but 2 also to let our -- you know, our state and national 3 congressional delegation know how important it is that we 4 recognize it's important. We have been -- this Court has 5 been in the front line fighting to keep the hospital here and 6 keep it as active as possible since -- gosh, since -- 10, 15 7 years. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Long time. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We helped -- 10 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Before then. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And, I mean, we're real 12 active -- we were real active during the period when they 13 were -- took away -- I guess put it under Audie Murphy in 14 San Antonio. And, you know, we worked very closely with the 15 Hill Country Veterans Council when it was originally formed a 16 long time ago. I remember going to -- Sherry Cunningham did 17 a lot, she and Bennie Hyde back here. I know he was at that 18 first meeting with General Bacon, who's no longer with us. 19 General Schellhase, a lot of other people were there, and 20 it's just really appropriate that we recognize that facility 21 and our veterans. I just wanted to get that in. 22 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Good. I appreciate, 23 Commissioner, your comments. I would like to read this 24 resolution for recognizing our veterans. "Resolution of Kerr 25 County Commissioners Court recognizing and supporting the 2-13-12 40 1 outstanding health care services provided by the Kerrville 2 V.A. facility of the South Texas Veterans Health Care System. 3 Whereas, the Kerrville V.A. Hospital facility was started in 4 November of 1919 by a group of Kerr County citizens with the 5 aid of the Benevolent War Risk Society, American Legion State 6 Commander Claude Birkhead, and Texas State Official Health 7 Officer, Dr. Collins. Together, they launched a drive to 8 raise one-half million dollars to construct a hospital in 9 Kerrville for the care of World War I veterans. Whereas, on 10 December 19th, 1947, the dedication ceremonies were held for 11 the main hospital building which is still in use today. 12 Whereas, on March 15th, 1995, the Kerrville V.A. Medical 13 Center and the Audie L. Murphy Memorial Hospital merged to 14 form the South Texas Veterans Health Care System; and 15 "Whereas, the Kerrville V.A. Hospital has been a 16 major health care provider for South Texas for many years and 17 continues to enjoy a reputation as one of the finest V.A. 18 facilities in the nation; and whereas, in 2012, an estimated 19 5,700 veterans residing in the Texas Hill Country, which 20 encompasses a 16-county geographical area, will receive acute 21 medical, primary, and long-term care services; and whereas, 22 the facility additionally supports the Community Living 23 Centers, which include the Home of the Brave (Specialty 24 Dementia Unit), the Heroes Haven and Sky Blue Vista, 20 acute 25 care beds, urgent care center/triage services, six primary 2-13-12 41 1 care teams which have been expanded to the Patient Aligned 2 Care Team (PACT) model, physical medicine and rehabilitation 3 services, and respiratory therapy services; and 4 "Whereas, today other specialty care services are 5 provided in outpatient clinics, to include orthopedics, 6 neurology, dermatology, women's health, G.I., G.U., podiatry, 7 minor procedures, audiology, ophthalmology, mental health, 8 and dental clinic; ancillary services including imaging, 9 pathology and laboratory medicine, pharmacy, nutrition and 10 food services, chaplain service, recreation service, 11 voluntary service, canteen service, logistics, and sterile 12 processing service; and whereas, the Kerrville V.A. facility 13 is currently in the process of implementing new specialty 14 care service programs with Tele-health, as well as other 15 programs, including website redevelopment and social media 16 access using Facebook and Twitter services; and whereas, Kerr 17 County receives substantial economic benefits from the 18 Kerrville V.A. facility, including benefits from the 19 facility's operations and sales, supported in businesses and 20 other organizations in the community, jobs/salaries, worker 21 spending, commercial property on tax rolls supported by the 22 spending of workers, residential property owned or occupied 23 by workers on local tax rolls, and out-of-town visitors to 24 the division; and 25 "Whereas, in 2012, the Kerrville V.A. facility 2-13-12 42 1 employed 430 workers, the facility's spending and spending by 2 its employees supported another 170 jobs in the community, 3 for a total of 600 jobs in the community; and whereas, the 4 facility is estimated to have an economic impact -- direct 5 and indirect impact of $52,754,227 in 2012; and whereas, 6 remodeling construction is underway with $300,000 worth of 7 improvements to the canteen, cafeteria, food areas, as well 8 as $750,000 being spent to improve the second floor to 9 enhance the aesthetics for the dental, X-ray, and laboratory 10 departments. Other possible improvements are being 11 considered to improve the energy efficiency of this facility. 12 "Now, therefore, be it resolved that on this day, 13 the 13th day of February, 2012, Kerr County Commissioners 14 Court unanimously supports the outstanding medical services 15 provided by the Kerrville V.A. facility of the S.T.V.H.C.S. 16 for veterans living in Kerr County and the Texas Hill Country 17 communities, as well as the commitment of its employees who 18 provide tremendous care for our veterans on a daily basis." 19 And with that, that will be my motion of support of this 20 resolution being signed by Commissioners Court for the 21 Kerrville V.A. Hospital. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second in 24 support of the resolution. Do I hear any other questions or 25 comments? 2-13-12 43 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just a -- I'll -- nevermind. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion, signify 3 by raising your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 6 (No response.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Thank you. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, it's an honor to vote 10 in favor of this motion. 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Judge, I'd also like to add, 12 Robin Gutierrez is not here today. I want to give her as 13 much time as we have. I know we have a lot of veterans here. 14 She did have a call this morning, had something come up, but 15 I'd also like to recognize the leadership out there of our 16 director with Robin Gutierrez, and all the doctors and all 17 the other support out there. As we read in our resolution, 18 it stands by itself -- itself there in that support. But, 19 again, we thank Robin and her guidance out there with our 20 V.A., and thank you veterans for being here today. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's move on to Item 17 -- 22 actually, 16. Go back to 16, to consider, discuss, take 23 appropriate action to revise Kerr County burn ban order as 24 per request by Kerr Wildlife Area and Texas Parks and 25 Wildlife. We have the proposed order. Let me go ahead and 2-13-12 44 1 call Item 17 for the renewal of the burn ban order to 2 consider, discuss, take appropriate action on implementation 3 of the burn ban. The documentation which has been furnished 4 to the Court is the new proposed burn ban order, and it 5 includes the language as requested by Parks and Wildlife and 6 Department of Agriculture, that it does not apply to 7 prescribed burns conducted by burn personnel of a federal or 8 state agency or institution of higher education for 9 prescribed burns on agency-owned or -managed properties for 10 the purpose of training local fire department personnel or 11 prescribed burn managers, or for the purpose of research and 12 demonstration by burn personnel of a federal or state agency 13 or institution of higher education. That's the added 14 language, in addition to adding other exemptions prescribed 15 burn manager certified by the Texas Department of Agriculture 16 or certified under appropriate provision of the Natural 17 Resources Code. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll move we adopt the order 19 restricting outdoor burning as presented today, as modified. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to -- for 22 the adoption of the order restricting outdoor -- outdoor 23 burning as modified, as requested under Item 16. Further 24 question or discussion? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just a comment. It never -- 2-13-12 45 1 I've been working with the burn ban, prescribed burns for 2 some time, and it never entered my thought that that they 3 thought that they would be subject to it, since they were the 4 ones approving it. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Like Bruce said, they wrote 6 it. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They wrote it. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, certainly, it has always 9 been the intent of the Court that they could conduct burns. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. Well, now we just put 11 it in writing. Kerr Wildlife Area requested -- I met with 12 them one day for about an hour and a half, and this is what 13 their request was. That's what we did. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments? 15 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 16 hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Item 18; to 21 consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to move all 22 indoor arena activity events to the outdoor arena at the Hill 23 Country Youth Exhibit Center. Mr. Bollier? 24 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. I would also like to 25 recommend -- if we do something with this, I would also like 2-13-12 46 1 to recommend that we move all nonprofit organizations outside 2 only, because their fees are already waived already, and that 3 would just make it fair. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I thought about that one. I 5 did have a -- have a conversation with a lady that called 6 that has -- is involved with barrel racing. What do they 7 call, Tim, that organization that comes in here? 8 MR. BOLLIER: Heart of the Hills. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Heart of the Hills? 10 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Anyway, she's saying that to 12 go up on that arena rent is -- is a little bit out of line 13 because of what other places are charging. She wanted to 14 make sure that her rent would not change for the 2012 -- or 15 events that are already booked. And -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me interrupt you, Commissioner. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: The rates -- the rental rates are in 19 another -- 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay, excuse me. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: -- another agenda item. If we want 22 to roll all this together, it seems -- 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Let's roll it together. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me go ahead and call Item 19, 25 then; to consider, discuss, take appropriate action to raise 2-13-12 47 1 the rates for the use of the indoor and outdoor arenas at the 2 Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center. Okay. We got it all on 3 the table now. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: All right, now. Well, 5 anyway, she's saying that -- she quoted me a bunch of prices 6 from other surrounding areas like Gillespie County and 7 Harper, and I think Bandera. Anyway, some of those rates for 8 outdoor arenas are somewhere from $150 to $250, and we -- I 9 don't think we need to exceed that if we ever plan on having 10 anything come back here. And the thing is underutilized as 11 it is, and so I would recommend that we -- the rental now is 12 200 a day, outdoor? 13 MS. GRINSTEAD: The outdoor, I believe, is 350. I 14 never rented it, but I think it's 350. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. Well, I think that's 16 one reason we haven't rented it. We probably need to lower 17 that rate, and we sure don't need to go up on the indoor 18 arena. 19 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And one of the concerns that 21 the barrel racing folks have, of course -- I don't know how 22 to put this, but they sometimes get a little picky about 23 things. They talk about, well, that arena hasn't been proven 24 yet; it hasn't had barrel racing much in it, and they don't 25 want to go outside because of that. And, you know, they're 2-13-12 48 1 not sure about the -- the soil that we put in there, which we 2 pretty well have tested best we could to be very much like 3 the indoor arena. But as far as -- as forcing people 4 outside, I don't know that we can, but I think if we get the 5 arena rent on the outside down to a lower price, it may 6 encourage that a little bit more. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Are you suggesting that maybe we 8 take a little bit more specific look at this, and what the 9 rates are in other venues, and maybe bring this back to -- 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: -- to readjust these things? 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It would not hurt at all. 13 But it was the first I'd heard about what the others are 14 charging in the immediate area, and I was a little surprised 15 that some of them were as low as 150. And what that does is, 16 that encourages people to come to town. They may not pay so 17 much in the rental, but they bring events to town and they 18 spend money and they buy things. And, you know, that may 19 need to be more of our focus than worrying about trying to 20 get too much for our rental. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: I bet Mr. Watson would have some 22 thoughts about that, wouldn't you? 23 MR. WATSON: I agree. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Wanting to bring folks to town. 25 MR. WATSON: Definitely. I think you're right on 2-13-12 49 1 that. Better to get them in here and then let them spend 2 their money. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 4 MR. BOLLIER: So, are we recommending to lower the 5 outdoor arena? 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, we're going to come 7 back with it at another meeting. 8 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I don't know that we want to 10 -- we need to talk about who is going to be forced outside 11 and what -- you know, how they're going to take it. 12 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Tim, do you -- and you don't 14 have to give it to us right now, but if you could give us an 15 idea as to what the prep time is for the outdoor arena? 16 Which I wouldn't think it would be that much. 17 MR. BOLLIER: The prep time for the outdoor arena 18 is not long. It is not long at all. It just depends on if 19 we're moving out -- if we got to move a bunch of bleachers 20 out there, you're talking about a couple hours, maybe. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we want to make sure we 22 cover our costs, but we're not trying to make a profit. 23 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's right. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, I mean, you know, it looks 25 like we're probably in the $150 range, probably. 2-13-12 50 1 MR. BOLLIER: I mean, where I was thinking -- what 2 I was thinking here, you know, you can save a lot of money 3 just on all of the setup and all that that we have to do with 4 the indoor arena. You know, you're talking -- when we set up 5 the indoor arena, you're talking anywhere from an all-day 6 venture to a day and a half, and then two to three days 7 plowing it and getting it the way those people like it. So, 8 you know, if you got the outdoor arena, all you're talking 9 about is moving some bleachers out there and 30 -- 30 minutes 10 worth of plowing out there, is what we're talking about. 11 That was the whole idea behind it, you know. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think let's talk about this 13 between now and next meeting. We'll put it back on. 14 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Make a suggestion. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. 17 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to our 10 o'clock timed 19 item now; Item Number 10, a presentation by Mr. Ray Watson 20 with the Economic Development Corporation regarding Culligan 21 Water Treatment Systems business. Mr. Watson? 22 MR. WATSON: Morning, Judge, Commissioners. Thank 23 you for the opportunity to be in front of you again. Let me 24 give you this. Culligan Water approached us about two weeks 25 ago, and we got it on our board meeting last Thursday to 2-13-12 51 1 actually review their application, and what they were wanting 2 to do was -- 'cause you can see in the paperwork that is 3 being passed around, is to apply for a tax abatement -- 4 five-year tax abatement on their new facility. Their current 5 facility that they have, as you see there, is a $125,000 6 value. Their new facility will be around a million. They 7 are going from a 5,200 square foot facility to 12,000 square 8 foot facility. You have the estimated dollar values there. 9 As you see, the City of Kerrville will be about $7,420 over 10 five years. The County would be about $6,180. They are 11 retaining 13 jobs, and they scored an 11. You have the 12 language from the incentives policy basically saying they are 13 eligible for an abatement under the policy that was put in 14 place. And with that, I'll take any questions. The Judge 15 sat in on our meeting as well, and our board approved it to 16 be passed on up to y'all. And, once again, this is another 17 project that Commissioner Overby had brought to our 18 attention, and so we appreciate that, and the direct work 19 that we're having with the Commissioners Court. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: The recommendation from the board of 21 the Kerr Economic Development Corporation was that, based 22 upon scoring of this project, it's, in essence, an expansion 23 of an existing business, with new -- new tax values to go on 24 the rolls, considerably large amount of new tax values, very 25 much like the next item. In fact, they're -- they're 2-13-12 52 1 somewhat like twins, aren't they? 2 MR. WATSON: They're almost exact dollar value. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: And that -- the recommendation by 4 the board was that both the City of Kerrville and -- and Kerr 5 County approve a five-year tax abatement beginning at 50 6 percent of the ad valorem tax for the first year, and then a 7 reduction of 10 percent each year until the total five years 8 has -- has expired, as indicated. 9 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Judge, I'd like to just go 10 ahead and add something. And, Ray, thanks for the 11 presentation here. Mr. Boerner did give me a call this 12 morning. He apologized; he couldn't be here this morning. 13 He had to take care of some family issues, and we all 14 understand that when that crops up. He is going to be here 15 on the 27th just to introduce himself, if you haven't known 16 the Boerner family for a long time. He's been a long -- long 17 resident of this community. He was, in fact, in Rotary Club 18 here for many years, and lives in San Antonio. The other 19 thing I'd just like to add to what Ray was saying about other 20 things, some other features with this rendition, talking 21 about doing a water catchment system on the roof. Obviously, 22 with the desert area that we're in, I think as you start 23 seeing more business development and renovations and projects 24 in the future, rainwater cachements are things that we need 25 to continually be emphasizing and trying to have incentives 2-13-12 53 1 for folks, just like we're doing right here. Some other 2 things that he's going to be doing also, potentially, is some 3 solar panels. In San Antonio -- the facility that he has in 4 San Antonio, they're saving energy on energy-efficient 5 things, so this is really -- I just wanted to comment on 6 that. And it's a good project, and increasing tax values on 7 our books, and new -- new sales tax potential and new 8 property tax. 9 MR. WATSON: Also, Judge, they are taking a 10 facility that they currently have, and that's where the new 11 facility will be. It will be a refurbishing of a really 12 dilapidated area. Mr. Overby and I both saw their images and 13 drawings. Very impressive, and looked real nice. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, we saw the layout, and it's -- 15 it's really a redevelopment of an area that has become 16 blighted over the years, and it's going to be a real benefit 17 to the community. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is this the one over on -- 19 MR. WATSON: Water Street. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- Water Street? 21 MR. WATSON: Yes, sir. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is there a -- in our policy, a 23 minimum amount to get, you know, this -- the application 24 that's going to -- likely would be approved? 25 MR. WATSON: Yes, sir. They have to -- as you read 2-13-12 54 1 in this language here, they have to have a minimum of 11 2 points to even be considered for -- 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess my question is, how do 4 you get 11 points? 5 MR. WATSON: You have a value of the building. You 6 have to have a minimum refurbishment of $500,000 or more. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 8 MR. WATSON: Then you get so much points for that, 9 and you also -- in this project and with the next project, 10 both of them only scored five points, but there's a 11 discretionary up to 10 points for it being an existing 12 building -- an existing business. And so those -- they were 13 given an additional six points for that being an existing 14 facility, so -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make kind of a general 16 comment. I can't remember if it was Mr. Avery or Mr. 17 Brinkman, but one of the two, 10 years ago or so, sent us a 18 letter -- I don't think either one of them came to court; 19 sent us a letter saying they wish we would look after the 20 businesses that were here, and quit going after all the ones 21 that are not here. They're the ones that are paying taxes. 22 And I -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That would be Mr. Avery. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mr. Avery said that. It might 25 -- I mean, Mr. Brinkman said something. They both may have. 2-13-12 55 1 Anyway, I'm glad we're doing something for someone who's 2 here. It's great to go out and get people, but these 3 businesses have been here for a long time; they've been -- 4 certainly, they've been paying the -- footing the bill for 5 many years, and I'm glad we're offering some of the 6 incentives packages to those as well. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: The strategic plan, Commissioner, 8 anticipates that of the economic development that will occur, 9 approximately 75 to 80 percent of that will be in enhancement 10 or enlargement of existing businesses, and that's 11 traditionally what you get in most communities. And the 12 incentive policy that was adopted by the Court, I believe, in 13 September -- '09? 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: '09. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Or '08? 16 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: We finished the strategic 17 plan in December of '08, and it was adopted in '09. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. The plan was adopted, and 19 right after that -- so it would have been September '09. The 20 thresholds for consideration for enhancement of existing 21 businesses are lower than for a new businesses, and that was 22 one of the -- one of the items that Mr. Watson referred to. 23 There was a discretionary statement in the -- in the policy 24 that for enhancement of existing businesses, that if they 25 meet the threshold amount, consideration could be given up to 2-13-12 56 1 10 points, whereas in a new business, it'd only be eligible 2 for five. So, that's how we got here on both of these 3 projects that we're looking at today. 4 MR. WATSON: Yes, sir. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, while you're talking, 6 would you do me a favor? I haven't heard you talk about this 7 in quite some time, and I think it's extremely important, and 8 it applies to this today, about -- about the balance between 9 business taxing and the ad valorem taxes of residents, and 10 how we've been out of kilter for all those years. You used 11 to talk about that a lot. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: That used to be my standard soapbox. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Would you mind doing 14 that one more time? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Well -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You know, we have to eat 17 lunch at noon, now. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. I think -- I don't think the 19 numbers have changed much, but the economic gurus, at least 20 previously, said that the normal -- the normal balance of 21 residential ad valorem to commercial industrial business ad 22 valorem should be about 60 to 65 percent to 35, 40 percent, 23 with the weighted portion, the heavier portion, being on the 24 business, industrial, and commercial. There's a saying in 25 local government, particularly in cities, that rooftops cost 2-13-12 57 1 money. There were a number of studies done over the years, 2 and the last group of studies I saw indicated that for every 3 dollar of ad valorem tax revenue received by a local 4 government, they paid out somewhere between $1.10 and $1.60 5 in services, which is pretty evident that that's a losing 6 proposition. So, you -- you balance your budget or you get 7 the additional enhancement to make up for that off of the 8 business, industrial and commercial, because they carry more 9 than their fair share of the burden of the tax load. In 10 Kerrville/Kerr County right now, we are, I think, at last -- 11 last look that you took, it was somewhat in excess of 70 12 percent residential, so we're way out of whack. 13 MR. WATSON: Right. 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: About an 80/20, really. In 15 the county, it's even bigger. It's, like, 86/14 where it's 16 on the residential and what's commercial. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: It has slowly been increasing over 18 the years, and we've -- we've got to turn -- turn that the 19 other direction to get this thing back in balance. We hear 20 the homeowners screaming about the residential tax rate. 21 That's why the residential tax rates are as they are, because 22 that's the only place you've got to go make it up. You've -- 23 you've got further exacerbation of that from the over-65 tax 24 freeze, of course, and the high number of seniors that we 25 have in this county. So, it is in everybody's interest to 2-13-12 58 1 have a significant increase in business, commercial, and 2 industrial tax base, and it really does wonders for you. And 3 we've got to move towards it if -- if we're going to -- if 4 we're going to get back -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're taking some of those 6 strides today. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, absolutely. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what this is about. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: This is just two small steps getting 10 there. The Fox Tank is a nice step in that direction, but we 11 need more. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's correct. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: We need more. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I agree. That was my 15 objection years ago, whenever this first was brought up, was 16 the older businesses got no consideration whatsoever; it was 17 all for new. I didn't think it was fair. And I'm full in 18 support of this. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: No, the existing businesses have a 20 leg up under our incentive policy. They've got -- they've 21 got lower thresholds to meet, and -- and they get additional 22 considerations pretty much across the board, because they're 23 existing businesses. You know, you dance with who brung you, 24 and they've been here a long time struggling with us. So, 25 that -- that's why they're given that. 2-13-12 59 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I agree. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: That's appropriate. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 'Cause it was totally unfair 4 the way it was proposed years ago. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me go ahead and call Item 11; to 6 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to approve 7 economic incentive package for Culligan Water Treatment 8 Systems business as recommended by the Board of Directors of 9 Kerr Economic Development Corporation. As I indicated, the 10 recommendation was the five-year ad valorem tax abatement by 11 both the City and the County, and that's what's before us 12 today. 13 MR. WATSON: Judge, I would also note that yourself 14 and Mayor Wampler had asked for us to put an estimate of what 15 the taxes were going to be to your respective entities, and 16 so that is strictly an estimate based on whatever the final 17 value of the building will be appraised at by the Appraisal 18 District. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, yeah, and the tax rates as may 20 be assessed. 21 MR. WATSON: That's correct. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: From year to year. We do that every 23 year. I appreciate you mentioning that, Ray. 24 MR. WATSON: Yes, sir. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Do I hear a motion to approve that 2-13-12 60 1 recommendation in connection with the Culligan Water 2 Treatment Systems business? 3 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Motion made here. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 6 approval of the recommendation by the Board of Directors for 7 the Kerr Economic Development Corporation. Question or 8 discussion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 9 your right hand. 10 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 11 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 12 (No response.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. We will go 14 to Item 12, which is a 10:15 timed item, and I can't believe 15 how accurate we are on schedule today. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, we're good. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: A presentation by Mr. Watson with 18 the Kerr Economic Development Corporation regarding the 19 LeMeilleur R.V. Truck and Equipment Repair Company. 20 MR. WATSON: This is another project that was 21 brought to us. We were able to bring it in front of our 22 board last week. It too scored a five under the general 23 provisions, and then it was given an extra six points because 24 of the existing business. It looks almost like a mirror 25 image of what you just saw. The new facility will be about a 2-13-12 61 1 million dollars. It will have basically 5.5 new jobs over a 2 period of time, three retained jobs, and you have the 3 language there. And I will answer any questions for you. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Here again, we've got an existing 5 business that's expanding appreciably, and the recommendation 6 by the Board of Directors of the Kerr Economic Development 7 Corporation was for a five-year tax abatement graduating 10 8 percent each year, beginning at 50 percent. Again, the 9 estimates are estimates, depending upon what the valuation 10 and tax rates are. 11 MR. WATSON: And, Judge, the other thing I'd like 12 to point out on both these projects is, even at the maximum 13 rate the first year of 50 percent, both of these will return 14 more money on the remaining 50 percent to the County than 15 what they are receiving today as a current facility. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, yeah. 17 MR. WATSON: So -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: We're not losing anything. 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Huh-uh. You're gaining, 20 yeah. I'd like to say a comment here also at this time 21 during the presentation part, if I can. I'd like to say 22 again, on this particular development, this is really good 23 for our community because of the need for auto mechanics in 24 this community, and the need -- folks need to realize in this 25 community the shortage of mechanics that are working on your 2-13-12 62 1 cars today, and not getting younger folks taught and trained 2 to come up to take care of your automobiles. And this 3 particular project here, expanding new opportunities for 4 folks that are going through school and trade to get in auto 5 mechanics and have a place to go is really exciting. So, I 6 think it's a great new way to address an issue that's very 7 serious in our community about having trained mechanics to 8 work on your cars, and I think this is a great project to 9 help train those new people. 10 MR. WATSON: And, Judge, Ms. LeMeilleur is here 11 today if you have any questions of her. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. LeMeilleur, would you stand so 13 everybody can see you here? 14 MS. LEMEILLEUR: We're both here. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, good. 16 MR. LEMEILLEUR: I'd like to say one thing there. 17 We continue to train our technicians. I hire ASE-certified 18 technicians, and my guys go to school. Every month, I pay 19 for them to go to school and pay for their training, because 20 we believe in what we do that much. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, sir. Good to have you 22 with us here today. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How long have you been in 24 business in Kerrville? 25 MR. LEMEILLEUR: I've done it 32 years in this 2-13-12 63 1 town. I've been in business for myself 14 years in June. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me go ahead and call Item 13; to 3 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to approve the 4 economic incentives package for LeMeilleur R.V. Truck and 5 Equipment Repair Company as recommended by the Board of 6 Directors of Kerr Economic Development Corporation. 7 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Judge, I do have one thing. 8 I need to recuse myself on this item on the vote. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move for approval of 11 the agenda item. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 14 approval of the incentives package for LeMeilleur's R.V. 15 Truck and Equipment Repair Company as recommended by the 16 Board of Directors of Kerr Economic Development Corporation. 17 Any question or discussion on that motion? 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I want to make a comment. 19 The words were said that we need -- the need for mechanics. 20 Well, you're not only getting mechanics here, but you're 21 getting quality and mechanics that have integrity. Good 22 people. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Other comments or questions? All in 24 favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 25 (The motion carried 3-0, with one abstention.) 2-13-12 64 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Thank you, Mr. 4 Watson. 5 MR. WATSON: Thank you. Have a good day. 6 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Thank you. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: We look forward to seeing you 8 frequently, if that's at all possible. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: God, don't encourage him. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, if he keeps bringing us people 11 like this, why not? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Maybe he could send somebody 13 else over here. (Laughter.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's go to Item 20; to consider, 15 discuss, take appropriate action to accept the reports on 16 cash count audits for County Clerk, District Clerk, and Tax 17 Assessor/Collector. 18 MS. MABRY: Good morning. You should have the 19 reports in your packet. And I just wanted to say one extra 20 thing. The cash count on the County Clerk's audit, they have 21 extra steps built in for internal control, and I just want to 22 say good job. Any questions, I'd be glad to address. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move we accept the reports. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to accept 2-13-12 65 1 the reports. Question or discussion? All in favor of 2 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 3 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 4 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 5 (No response.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: The motion does carry. Let's go to 7 Item 21; to consider, discuss, and take appropriate action 8 regarding all aspects of demolition, bidding, and 9 construction of the new show barn at Hill Country Youth 10 Exhibit Center. Commissioner Oehler? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I think I talked with 12 Jon a little bit about this prior to the meeting, just to see 13 what we wanted to do. I think there's several things we're 14 probably going to have to put off for a little bit, but I'm 15 not sure that we ought not go ahead and -- and talk about 16 getting the environmental assessment done, and also talking 17 about demolition. Not that we have to do it, but in order to 18 keep this thing on track, even if we get sidetracked 19 somewhere during this process, that I think we could discuss 20 it anyway. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is Peter going to be here? 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, he wasn't planning on 23 coming. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Did he give you a -- a number 25 on the environmental assessment? 2-13-12 66 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, he did not. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He gave us a number earlier of 3 about -- of less than 10,000. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, five -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Seven. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 7,500, and the demolition was 7 estimated at 50,000, 60,000. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Demolition, I think the process 9 should be we go out for bids on the demolition. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Right. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And then on the environmental 12 assessment, probably do a not-to-exceed number, and if it 13 comes in higher than that, then it can come back to the 14 Court. So, I'll make a motion to authorize Peter Lewis to 15 obtain an environmental assessment of the property in an 16 amount not to exceed $10,000. 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'll second that. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second as 19 indicated. Question or discussion? 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can I ask you a question? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sure. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Where did that number come 23 from? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Peter Lewis gave us a number of 25 6,000, I thought. 2-13-12 67 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I just think to give him a 3 little bit of breathing room. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, thank you. Are you 5 going to do something on the demolition? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just going to do a separate -- 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Do a separate motion. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- separate motion on that one. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments on 10 the motion? All in favor of the motion, signify by raising 11 your right hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Then I'll make a motion to 17 authorize Peter Lewis to prepare the documents to go out for 18 bid on the demolition of the barn facility. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Speaking of -- 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Hog barn facility. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Hog barn. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: -- the area behind the exhibit hall? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes, not to include the 2-13-12 68 1 exhibit hall. 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's right. Specify it. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Please. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Do we have a second? 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, we have a motion and a second. 7 Question or comments on the motion? All in favor of that 8 motion, signify by raising your right hand. 9 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 11 (No response.) 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Anything else in 13 connection with Item 21? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably not. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to Item 22; 16 consider, discuss, take appropriate action regarding the 17 contract with Peter Lewis for renovations at the Hill Country 18 Youth Exhibit Center. We ready to go there? 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Probably need to do that if 20 we're going to get him to do this other work for us. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: That's what I'm thinking. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Might should have been first, 23 but anyway... 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We might need -- he was going 25 to give us a number, I thought, for that. 2-13-12 69 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There's been -- there's been 2 some things that have happened since that time, and I know 3 that he can't give us a number until he has a better idea of 4 what his involvement is going to be based on the some of the 5 other things that have happened. Do you want to just hire 6 him to do the environmental assessment and go out for bids on 7 demolition? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why don't we pass on this till 9 after break? 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Good idea. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And? The agenda item is 13 talking about hiring Peter Lewis to do all -- all the work. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To coordinate all the going out 15 for bids and drawings and things of that nature. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And there's an issue of -- 17 well, nevermind. We'll see after lunch. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What will change between now 20 and then? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll give Peter a call, see if 22 he has a number of what he thinks the best way to proceed to 23 get Item 1.21 moving, because there's still some costs, 24 trying to figure exactly what the scope is going to be. That 25 is the holdup in looking at some new numbers. 2-13-12 70 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to Item 25; 2 consider, discuss, take appropriate action to declare the gas 3 chamber at the Animal Control facility as surplus, authorize 4 disposal at the recycle facility. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This pretty well says what 6 the plan is -- needs to be. That way, it's -- people will 7 know that we no longer are in possession of one, so we can't 8 use it. We've told them we're not, and we haven't been. And 9 so I move that we declare the gas chamber surplus in the 10 Animal Control facility, and have it disposed of at recycle, 11 and we -- to get Janie to have the money from that to put 12 back in her budget. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: He made a motion. Are you making a 15 second? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh, yes. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. We have a motion and a second 18 as indicated. Question or discussion? All in favor, signify 19 by raising your right hand. 20 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 22 (No response.) 23 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Let's go to 24 Item 27; consider, discuss, take appropriate action to accept 25 the 2011 Partial Racial Profiling Report for Kerr County 2-13-12 71 1 Sheriff's Office. 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Y'all should each have a copy. 3 It's just that time of year, except now we have to send it to 4 Austin and to y'all. All we did was change it a little. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, who do you send it to in 6 Austin? 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: TCLEOSE, Texas Commission on 8 Law Enforcement officers. And they just -- they don't even 9 know what they're supposed to do with it. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And neither do we. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's been that way for years. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: But, you see, the feds think it's 14 important. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But the one thing about -- 17 yeah, you're right. One thing about it. When you look at 18 it, that is not the total number of vehicles -- vehicle 19 stops. What you have to report is the number of vehicle 20 stops that actually ended in citations, not warnings and all 21 that, so you're getting a very limited number. And then, 22 since we do use video cameras, a lot of other ones are exempt 23 from having to be reported, too. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move we accept the 2011 25 Partial Racial Profiling Report for Kerr County Sheriff's 2-13-12 72 1 Office. 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Second. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded. Further 4 question or discussion? All in favor, signify by raising 5 your right hand. 6 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 8 (No response.) 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. Let's take about a 10 15-, 20-minute recess. 11 (Recess taken from 10:28 a.m. to 10:49 a.m.) 12 - - - - - - - - - - 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to order, if 14 we might. Let's go back to Item 21 and revisit that; to 15 consider, discuss, take appropriate action regarding all 16 aspects of demolition, bidding, and construction of the new 17 show barn at the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I talked to Peter Lewis 19 during the break, and he says that he can get the 20 environmental assessment done, and I think we put in a max of 21 2,500 instead of the 10,000 that we had done earlier. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Wow. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And he does not have a figure 24 yet on doing the bid work for the demolition. He will have 25 that before the next meeting. 2-13-12 73 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On the demo part, I've talked 3 to Maintenance, and also Road and Bridge, and they feel that 4 they can probably handle the demolition for us. And it will 5 be the cost of an excavator, and I -- and it will be some 6 equipment that we don't keep to rent. My guess would be, the 7 cost of the excavator, we're looking at probably in the 8 neighborhood of no more than 35,000 for a month, including 9 the fuel it will take, and then you'll have the personnel, 10 and then there's -- all of the material will be hauled 11 straight to Center Point, and that will probably be for the 12 recycling. And on the metal, it will probably pay for 13 itself. I mean, the metal will almost pay for the excavator, 14 I bet, pretty close to a wash. There's quite a bit of metal 15 in that building. So, we can take the demo off the table and 16 not worry about that. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Won't have to have Peter work 18 on it. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Peter won't need to work on 20 that. And then -- but we do need to wait for the 21 environmental assessment to make sure that there's nothing of 22 concern to Leonard's people. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Right. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: With regard to the outstanding order 25 which was voted by the Court a little bit ago, not to exceed 2-13-12 74 1 10,000, do I hear a motion that that order be amended to be 2 capped at 2,500? 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Do I hear a second to that 5 motion? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second to 8 amend the prior order, where the cost is capped at 2,500 for 9 the environmental assessment. Question or discussion on the 10 amendment to that order? All in favor, signify by raising 11 your right hand. 12 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 13 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 14 (No response.) 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, if I could, let me just 17 make a motion to cancel -- or rescind the order related to 18 demolition, so we don't have an order out there asking Peter 19 to do something that we're not intending for him to do. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and second to 22 rescind that order that we passed just before the break. Any 23 question or discussion on that motion? 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I will contact him to that 25 effect. 2-13-12 75 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, if he's not been contacted 2 about doing the work in the first place, you probably don't 3 need -- 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, I just did, and he was 5 going to get a price for that, but now he doesn't need to 6 mess with it. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Any other questions or 8 comments? 9 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Commissioner Letz, is there a 10 timeline on that environmental assessment? Did he say? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Pretty quick, in the next 12 week or two. 13 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay, that's good. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: All in favor of the motion, signify 16 by raising your right hand. 17 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 18 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 19 (No response.) 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. That rescinds that 21 order. Okay, anything else in connection with Item 21? 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I hope not. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Number 22, contract with Peter 24 Lewis. That was passed, and I assume we have nothing new to 25 offer there? 2-13-12 76 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Next meeting. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to Item 23; to 4 consider, discuss, take appropriate action regarding capital 5 items list for the proposed debt issue. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What do you want to tackle 7 first, Judge? 8 JUDGE TINLEY: It's your pleasure, gentlemen. I 9 know Road and Bridge is here with -- with a slide show, and 10 they're ready to perform any time that you want to pull the 11 trigger on them. Now that Leonard's here, we got the -- we 12 got the man with us, so we're going to have to answer to him. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think to start with, we 15 need to pull the jail out of the equation. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Pretty -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: That's a nice lick. Can do you 19 something else that big? 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Probably not. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: After the presentation y'all 23 saw from Mr. Gondeck, the issue with the jail, I think, 24 especially over a debt issue in years to come, I think the 25 3.3 that he recommended over that is desperately needed for 2-13-12 77 1 our situation out there, so we don't end up with something 2 else right after this debt issue's been done. I think 3 between the jail and then the little less than 400 on the 4 radio system are both highly needed issues for public safety 5 and for the criminal justice system in this county. I know 6 we would all like to get the court systems to do more, but if 7 you don't address the jail issues, there's no way that the 8 court system can do more at the same time. They've got -- 9 both got to be adhered to at the same time. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I don't know that we've -- 11 there's been any final resolution made, Sheriff. We've just 12 heard one recommendation or position over here to pull that 13 out of an issue, and that may not be the way it ends up. 14 We'll see as we go forward. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I agree. I just think -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: There's lots of work left to do, I 17 think. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, for public safety and 19 that, and criminal justice, I think we really need to look at 20 that seriously. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm not opposed to the tower 22 issue. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: You mean the radio issue? 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Radio issue. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 2-13-12 78 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'm not opposed to that one. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. It -- did that come back, 3 like, 380? 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 384. 5 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: 374, 375? 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 384, wasn't it? 7 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: 374,380. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 374,380. 9 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I support that. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: 375,000, which is a far cry from 1.5 11 that was there previously. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. And that's keeping our 13 current system with some upgrades for the GPS and possible 14 relocation of towers and -- and things like that, to get the 15 coverage. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I've got to go back. 18 He made a statement I just want to get clarified. What do 19 you mean, we can't address the court system unless we address 20 the jail system at the same time? Now, don't forget, we all 21 have to be somewhere at Christmas. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'll try and keep it short. 23 We've -- the court system has a serious backlog issue, okay? 24 And we have a serious issue with probationers not adhering to 25 probation requirements. If you don't give the court system 2-13-12 79 1 some leeway and places to put people, okay, and all those 2 that are out on bond and -- and the violation of probations, 3 you've got to -- you've got to address that issue to give 4 them the beds in the jail to make, one, probation mean 5 something, and two, be able to speed up the court system. 6 The court system may very well sentence people to the 7 penitentiary, okay? But that doesn't mean they leave that 8 day to go to the penitentiary. They have to get all the 9 paperwork done, everything filed, everything completed, all 10 the judgments. And once that's done, then we have to send 11 all that stuff along with any disciplinary issues or anything 12 like that to the penitentiary system, and then they notify us 13 on when we can bring that inmate to prison, okay? And 14 normally, that's about 45 days from the time they accept the 15 paperwork. So, it's -- it's a very slow process. You have 16 to have someplace to put those people or you're going to put 17 them out on bond again, and it doesn't work. You're 18 putting -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand that. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- dangerous people on bond. 21 So, you have that -- 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I respect that. But it 23 seems like to me there's also a population in there that 24 haven't been addressed. I mean, they're just sitting there, 25 and we've heard stories of them sitting there months and not 2-13-12 80 1 even seeing their attorney and things like that, you know, 2 that need to be out of there. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I agree. We've got some in 4 there with -- sitting there 400 days waiting to go to trial. 5 A lot of those may be having M.H.M.R. type hearings, 6 competency-type hearings. Or a lot of those -- I think the 7 court system can do a whole lot better on -- on getting those 8 people done. But those people -- and they try and give 9 precedence to the ones that are in custody to get those cases 10 done, but when you've got one that's in custody, and -- for 11 300, 400 days, and you've got some -- some that are out of 12 custody for a year and a half, two years, they've got to get 13 those -- you know, both sides of that taken care of. 14 Now, those that are out of custody, when you start 15 taking care of those, you start filling up the jail even more 16 than what we are. You start taking care of those in custody, 17 even after they pled and all that, you've still got that 18 lapse of time period before they go. And we have so many, as 19 I presented to this Court in the past, that are waiting. You 20 know, there's right at 1,000 in the District Courts and 1,000 21 in County Court waiting to go to trial, that we just -- and 22 we've got probably close to 2,000 outstanding warrants. 23 We've got to have the beds to be able to put these people in 24 them. My population this morning on females was 26. We've 25 got to have the room to put these people. 2-13-12 81 1 The other thing is -- and you can have the head of 2 Probation come in. Probation doesn't mean anything right 3 now, 'cause they can violate it, and what are they going to 4 do? Okay? The State doesn't want them revoking them all the 5 time on administrative issues and not paying their fines and 6 costs to Kerr County. And the county courts are facing the 7 same thing, and that's all they got, is fines and costs to 8 Kerr County to bring that in. And if there's no room to put 9 them to actually put teeth back in probation, then probation 10 doesn't mean anything, and you don't have anything they can 11 do with them. The community service isn't done, which helps 12 all of our citizens. Nothing is -- is addressed, because we 13 just can't do anything with them; there's too many, and no 14 bed space. 15 What you have -- if you got bed space for violation 16 of probationers, then what you have is where a judge, as a 17 condition of his being put on probation, and he violates it 18 in those administrative ways six months down the road, a year 19 down the road, and he's on 10 years probation, every time he 20 violates it, if you've got room to house that person, a judge 21 can put him in your jail for 30 days, 60 days to 180 days, 22 and probation starts meaning something. And in the long 23 term, what happens is, that inmate or that probationer can 24 spend more time locked up in jail on probation than they can 25 if they go on to the penitentiary. So, what we saw when -- 2-13-12 82 1 right after we built this current facility, is probation 2 meant something. The judges had that option. And so what 3 you ended up seeing, instead of people pleading out for 4 probation and having all those violations and upping your 5 jail counts, they were pleading out for penitentiary time, 6 'cause they could spend less time locked up. Well, it put 7 that dollar cost and everything on the penitentiary system on 8 the state, not on the locals. And now we're back to putting 9 it on the locals. You've got to be able to address both 10 issues, but if you don't have the bed space in your facility, 11 you're not addressing it. 12 Now, the only other thing you could do is do like 13 Fredericksburg's been doing for years now, is housing out of 14 county. Fredericksburg's cost over the last three years has 15 been $1.2 million that they have spent housing their inmates 16 in other counties, and that 1.2 million is gone, and now 17 they're looking at seriously having to build their jail, but 18 they've already lost 1.2 million in doing that. And I don't 19 think that's a very wise use of our taxpayers' dollars in 20 spending it that way. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Rusty, I think the only thing 22 that you aren't bringing up in the equation, and this is my 23 biggest problem with -- I mean, the further we can delay it, 24 it's the M & O cost. I mean, we're having to add -- we 25 cannot afford to hire more employees, period. We just can't 2-13-12 83 1 do it; we don't have the money. And I don't -- until we get 2 some growth somewhere, I don't see that we're going to have 3 it. So, I mean, we can build it and finance it over 20 4 years, but we're not going to get more staff, so how's that 5 solve the problem? 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, I'm not saying it's an 7 easy problem for any of you gentlemen, but what I'm saying 8 is, if we want to provide adequate public safety and criminal 9 justice in this county, we have got to have a place to put 10 those people that violate the crime and do not need to be on 11 our streets. And I -- I understand what you're saying. 12 Maybe we can look at some other issues inside the county. 13 Maybe we can look at some other issues, you know, seriously 14 inside my own department, to where we can afford to try and 15 put the appropriate staff. I think, in addition, -- and 16 Wayne Gondeck's here, the one you heard from -- that it's not 17 a very big staff increase. I gave up last year a number of 18 staff positions. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That would be more expensive 21 than getting back the staff positions to put in the jail, 22 because the positions we gave up were higher paying positions 23 than what the jailers get paid. But we've got -- I've seen 24 this happen before, and -- and it's not good for our 25 community. And I think it's something -- just like the 2-13-12 84 1 financial adviser first -- when he came in and talked, 2 there's certain things that the county's mandated to do, and 3 certain things that we have options to do. And I think we've 4 got to take care of the mandated issues, and have. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't doubt that at all. 6 I agree with you 100 percent. I didn't want to get in this 7 conversation till we eat your sandwiches on Wednesday, but -- 8 here we are. Maybe there's -- maybe you'll have some grace 9 for me and let me have one anyway. But, you know, I hear 10 about these people that are sitting in the jail, and they're 11 not -- you know, their attorney hasn't even been over there 12 to see them. We don't know if they're guilty; we don't know 13 who they are. They're just sitting there, and there's lots 14 of them, and they've been sitting there a long time. Or we 15 hear about a District Attorney not wanting to cut a deal, or 16 cutting the wrong deal, you know, not making common sense and 17 those kind of things. See, that, to me, looking at those 18 things, that's looking at the court system as opposed to just 19 automatically going your route and building a building. I 20 mean, we -- I think -- I don't think we're doing our job 21 unless we do look at all those. And I know we've tried. In 22 this room, we've had D.A.'s and district judges and -- and 23 district clerks -- and the prettiest district clerk in Texas, 24 by the way. 25 MS. UECKER: Oh. 2-13-12 85 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How'd I do with that one? 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah. 3 MS. UECKER: What do you want? 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I agree with you, Buster. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But all of those things have 6 to be -- we owe the taxpayers to take a look at every bit of 7 that stuff. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I totally agree. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, let's do it. 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But it's -- but one thing you 11 have to look at, the jail's averaging 150, 160 all the time, 12 okay? And that's county court, district court, all. That's 13 how many are actually locked up right now. But the issue you 14 have, you have over 2,000 waiting for trial, okay? No matter 15 what you do, -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How many warrants? 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- the 150, 160 that you speed 18 up getting out of the jail, okay, or try and speed up their 19 sentences -- and Rob, I'm sure, would be one to -- at least 20 he'd like to be able to sentence some of them to a year in 21 the county jail on these misdemeanors that need it, instead 22 of repeat after repeat after repeat and putting them on 23 probation after probation after probation, that they don't 24 pay attention to, and no other alternatives, 'cause you can't 25 put them in jail; you don't have the space. Now, the 2-13-12 86 1 issue -- 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Are 40 beds going to cure 3 that? 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Forty beds are going to 5 give -- no, 48 beds, which the recommendation was last week, 6 and working with the court system is the only way we can 7 address this issue. I've told y'all this in the past, and I 8 truly mean it. There's not a sheriff around that wants more 9 inmates, because I just got served with another federal 10 lawsuit Friday. I mean, I'm not trying to advocate for a 11 larger jail. I'm trying to say that where we are in looking 12 at our entire system, we can take care of the 160 in jail; 13 you could move every one of them out. You've still got about 14 1,800 that are out there on bond that have to go through the 15 court system. The 160 in jail, you know, isn't going to 16 solve that issue by itself. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Don't forget your warrants. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, really, they're part of 19 that 1,800, or -- or 2,000, because they come from cases that 20 are pending. But you've got to address both issues at the 21 same time. And then the -- the real serious issue is women. 22 I can't really appropriately classify women, the way it is in 23 jail right now, without more bed space. You can't do it. I 24 think Mr. Gondeck is here, and I'd be more than happy -- he 25 can explain things a whole lot better than I normally do, 2-13-12 87 1 anyhow. But you have got to look at the jail issue seriously 2 in the near future -- very near future. It's going to take 3 you over a year to get it built and open and running, anyhow. 4 I agree that the Ag Barn is great, but -- 5 MS. UECKER: I don't know if this information will 6 help, but in defense of the courts, I have to say that 7 recently, they have really been trying to push these cases to 8 trial. I know Judge Williams has really ticked off a bunch 9 of lawyers by trying to force them to trial, so that, number 10 one, we don't waste jury panels; number two, we get these 11 cases taken care of. I've had that conversation with him. 12 And Judge Williams -- and I don't know -- I personally think 13 that the election may make a difference, whichever way it 14 goes. I -- I don't know. I mean, just from conversations 15 I've had with -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You mean the D.A. thing? 17 What's she talking about, Obama or what? 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Maybe the Sheriff; I don't know. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Maybe me. Maybe people are 20 tired of me. (Laughter.) 21 MS. UECKER: No, I'm referring to the D.A.'s race. 22 I think either way that goes, that's -- one way or the other, 23 I may need to get a sledgehammer or something, but I think 24 that's going to improve a little bit. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The radio system, that is a 2-13-12 88 1 serious public safety issue. But if you don't give your law 2 enforcement officers across this county, not just mine, the 3 ability to enforce the law instead of having to constantly 4 deal with people that are on bond, on bond, on bond, and 5 they're getting in fights and they're constantly dealing with 6 either those or the ones that are on probation, then we're 7 doing it just as bad. We're endangering a lot of people by 8 not addressing both issues. But I seriously don't believe 9 you can address one without addressing the other. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, you hinted at -- so 11 you think that we ought to lay down the Ag Barn and build you 12 a jail? 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, I did not say that, okay? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I know you didn't say it, 15 but you hinted at it. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: As your financial adviser 17 said, there's certain things the county's mandated to do and 18 certain things we need to do. I think our Ag Barn 19 facility -- we've got the fifth largest stock show in the 20 state. That old building that you were going to demolish, I 21 didn't hear it this morning, 'cause of the exhibit hall, but 22 it was built in, like, 1956, okay? And there's no doubt -- 23 I've been out there year after year, just as all of you 24 gentlemen, and I was pretty will raised here. You know, it 25 should have been addressed a long time ago. But a long time 2-13-12 89 1 ago, when it -- when people tried to address it and this 2 Court tried to address it, the voters of the county turned it 3 down. Maybe that's why that one's not going back out for a 4 vote. It's needed. I'm not saying it's not needed, but it's 5 needed for the limited part of Kerr County residents that it 6 serves. Our county economic impact is very large, okay. 7 Criminal justice system is needed for every resident, whether 8 they pay taxes, or renters or whatever in this county. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think both are serving the 10 entire county, but -- 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I agree. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yes. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I think Leonard and Kelly want to 14 talk about dump trucks and things. Don't you? 15 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Come tell us what you got to 17 say about dump trucks and all things of yellow iron. 18 MR. ODOM: Well, Wednesday, I think Commissioner 19 Oehler made the comment to me about my wish list, and I tried 20 to explain my needs versus wish, and this -- these are needs. 21 And Kelly is the computer whiz here. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Is it somewhat reduced from 23 the last time, or is it the same list? 24 MR. ODOM: It is the same list, sir. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just thought I would ask. 2-13-12 90 1 MR. ODOM: But I think, as I -- and I will try to 2 make this -- it can get a little bit long, but I think if you 3 start to realize the hours on some of this, the pictures 4 speak a thousand words. We were talking -- one of the first 5 priorities was a crack sealer. What that is, is taking a 6 look at that will give you an idea of what I have. That is 7 totally -- and parts for it are no longer used -- "used" -- 8 even available. So, it's basically dead. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Is it operational now, Leonard? 10 MR. ODOM: No, sir, it is not. The only thing that 11 we use, we do have a -- just storage is what we're using it 12 for right now, for AEP. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Maybe I'm not understanding you; I'm 14 sorry. 15 MR. ODOM: Well, you can see it's about 600 16 gallons, so sometimes we will put AEP in there, if we have -- 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Storage, okay. 18 MR. ODOM: Storage, basically. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. But you don't have an 20 operational unit that you can -- 21 MR. ODOM: We don't have a crack sealer. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: -- put out on the road to seal 23 cracks with? 24 MR. ODOM: No, sir. It's a '72 model that you 25 can't even get parts for any more. Slide 3, this shows the 2-13-12 91 1 cracks that are occurring in the roads today. And 2 particularly in this last year, with the drought and all, the 3 roads are dry; has traverse cracking, which means it's 4 shearing up underneath. The road is coming apart, your 5 subgrade is. And what you have there is just wide cracks 6 where the water can go down in it. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's Precinct 3, isn't it? 8 MR. ODOM: I believe so. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Looks like it over on those 10 roads out there. 11 MR. ODOM: This shows a working crew with a crack 12 sealing machine. That's not ours, but it gives you an idea. 13 You've seen them out there on the highways. TexDOT -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 15 MR. ODOM: -- contracts this out. This shows the 16 close-up of rubberized material placed in the cracks, which 17 goes down; you can see some of those very large cracks are 18 sealed. It keeps the water from going down in it, and then 19 you can do your sealcoat. The idea is -- is to prolong the 20 use. Instead of having -- being forced to do a seal crack -- 21 or a sealcoat on it, I'm extending the life of this, and -- 22 and to be able to facilitate the ones that need the sealcoat 23 and preventive maintenance, this will give me time to do 24 that. The guys are talking about it, and we -- more and more 25 we see of the roads, we can prolong this. Material is not 2-13-12 92 1 going to get cheaper. 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Leonard, how long, when you 3 do something like that, can it extend a road's use? 4 MR. ODOM: At least several years, until it comes 5 in when it -- we feel like the road would be able to come -- 6 you know, it has to do with use and damage. Is Precinct 1 7 having more need than 3 or 4? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What? 9 MR. ODOM: And so I can be able to facilitate -- 10 the use of that road can continue; it doesn't keep from you 11 traversing that road. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You don't need that for me, so 13 we don't need that. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Leonard, let me -- let me ask you, 15 if those cracks are not sealed, the result is that water 16 seeps through the cracks, -- 17 MR. ODOM: Then the road comes -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: -- undermines the base, and then you 19 have base failure? 20 MR. ODOM: You have base failures, and that means a 21 problem. I've got to go out and do a major repair. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Not just a sealcoating job. 23 MR. ODOM: That's right. 24 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: All right. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Next? 2-13-12 93 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Look at something else. 2 MR. ODOM: Okay, Group 2. That shows -- some of 3 that is a 230,000 -- 230-gallon, and that's what I'm thinking 4 about there, is the most productive. But that's what a crack 5 sealing machine looks like. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: That's your $25,000 model? 7 MR. ODOM: Yes. And I'm hoping that's enough, but 8 yes. Small bucket truck. We bought -- this is a '99 Ford 9 F-350. That's our truck now; we bought that one used. It 10 has 64,660 miles on the -- on the truck, and there's 5,000 11 hours on that bucket. Our crews use it extensively. Not 12 only do we use it, we've even had -- Maintenance has had many 13 -- several times needing that too, and we have no problems 14 with that. But the crews are going out, and there's more and 15 more. And, of course, we have Michael Jackson is out there 16 all the time cutting and doing our patching, and the crews 17 themselves to get things ready are needing -- they need 18 another truck. And we have to delay that by -- someone -- 19 either the complaint's there and they will finish that, or 20 the crews have to put it off, and everybody wants it almost 21 at the same time. We feel like our productivity can stay, 22 and stay with what we need to do with if we get another 23 bucket truck, if we find one, probably used. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You're looking for a used 25 one? 2-13-12 94 1 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. All right, let's go to Group 2 3. And, of course, that red boom and all, if we get one, 3 it'll be maroon and white. (Laughter.) It will not be red 4 and white. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Orange? 6 MR. ODOM: No orange. God will not forgive me for 7 that. All right. This is -- 8 MR. HENNEKE: It'll last longer and work harder if 9 it's orange. 10 MR. ODOM: Oh, yeah. 11 MR. HENNEKE: Stick around. 12 MR. ODOM: You forgot, God was an Aggie, Class 13 of 00. (Laughter.) This is a -- a chip spreader. That is a 14 1400 series; it's got about a 14-inch mouth on it. It does a 15 very good job. We keep that up in Precinct 4 normally, but 16 we found a lot of times that 14-inch won't take a lot of 17 these trees, and we went to an 1800 series, which has got 18 about an 8-, 10-inch mouth, which will take most of what we 19 want to get in there. These Vermeers, that one has 1,250 20 hours on it already. That was a 2008 model. And that -- 21 what we want do is to get another 1800 series that we can put 22 out in both, and keep that 1400 as a backup to make sure we 23 can take care of anything we need. But that 1800, as you can 24 see, can chew something up pretty easy. 25 All right. Slide 2 shows RBU-12. It is a 1987 2-13-12 95 1 Brose open-cab broom with 7,000 hours on it. This particular 2 broom has a gas motor, and starts to smoke a lot. I feel 3 sorry for it, but we keep it going. That's -- 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Only one you've got, isn't it? 5 MR. ODOM: Well, I have a couple more here. I have 6 a '94 and a 2004 broom. The '94 has 4,772 miles on it -- I 7 mean hours on it. The 2004 broom has 569 hours on it. I'm 8 sorry, that was 2007. The 2004 has 1,005 hours on it. We 9 went to the enclosed cab to keep the dust -- it's a health 10 problem. It makes productivity a whole lot easier when you 11 can see and you can breathe, and so we've gone to that with 12 the air conditioning. Our productivity is certainly -- with 13 all enclosed cabs, and where it's dust-proof and it's cooler, 14 your productivity goes up tremendously. They don't even like 15 to take a break; they'll stay in it just -- in these summer 16 days, when you got 105 degrees, you can get work done, so 17 this is the way to go as far as the road broom, and we would 18 like to get another one to replace our original one that had 19 7,000 hours on it. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Is that the one that Tommy 21 ran off in Ingram Lake? 22 MR. ODOM: That's right. And because of operator's 23 head space sometimes is a problem. Anybody that's been in 24 the army knows that. Group 5, the pneumatic roller. There 25 you see the 1984 Ingram. It has 11,347 hours on it. If you 2-13-12 96 1 notice anything that's peculiar about that, it's called a 2 rollover protection system; it's missing. The problem with 3 any of these rollers, that they're -- the weight is high. 4 You have a high center of gravity, and they have a tendency 5 to roll over; that's a danger. We only use it now where we 6 have flat areas. That is the demand that we have with the 7 supervisors. If it's a safe area and it's flat, we'll use 8 that. We have more and more needs. We would like to replace 9 that. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Leonard, what if -- the one without 11 the ROPs, what would OSHA say if they saw you using that on 12 the job, or a similar-type safety organization? 13 MR. ODOM: I would -- they would probably not be 14 happy. My argument would be, this is a pre-existing 15 condition that was -- we've had it this time, and when I 16 replace it, I would assume that they would demand that at 17 that point, that I would have a ROPs or insurance probably 18 with -- but I feel that we -- this is what I have, and this 19 is what we utilize, to try -- 20 JUDGE TINLEY: They do manufacturing without ROPs 21 any more? 22 MR. ODOM: No. 23 MS. HOFFER: Against the law. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: How long has it been that way? 25 MR. ODOM: This right here? 2-13-12 97 1 JUDGE TINLEY: No, how long has it been since they 2 no longer manufacture them without the ROPs? 3 MR. ODOM: I don't know, Judge. Ingram went out of 4 business a few years back there in San Antonio, so I guess 5 maybe in the last 10 years or so. 6 MS. HOFFER: At least. 7 MR. ODOM: At least that long. Time passes. 8 MS. HOFFER: Big cat roller, I don't know what year 9 model that is, but that's got ROPs on it. 10 MR. ODOM: Sometime back in the '90's. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 12 MR. ODOM: We have a 2002 PS-150. It has 2,286 13 hours on it. I have a 2009 PS-150 with 335 hours. What we 14 want to do is to replace that old one, and to come up with 15 the PS-150, I'll probably look at something out of the rental 16 unit from Holt. I want to try to keep my units about the -- 17 if it's Cat, then I'm predominantly Cat. I would like to try 18 to stay that way, but I think I can pick up one that's out of 19 their rental unit and make it work for many years. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, that $73,000, that's a used 21 one? 22 MR. ODOM: Sir? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 73,000 listed, that's a used 24 one? 25 MR. ODOM: I'm not -- I don't see exactly where 2-13-12 98 1 that number's at, but I would say that's probably a new one 2 in there, probably. Sounds like that's probably a new one. 3 But, remember, I'm going to be good on some and I'm going to 4 miss some, and that's what I've tried to be in perspective. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Leonard, let me ask you this. I 7 know -- 8 MR. ODOM: You know I'm not frivolous with my 9 money. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, we know that. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: I know on previous occasions, one 12 time that there was a lot of this yellow iron that was being 13 turned back that was on lease or rental or whatnot, and there 14 was really an abundance of it that was falling back that 15 became real attractive to purchase. 16 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that still going on? 18 MR. ODOM: That is occurring now. It looks like 19 South Texas, a lot of the things that they started, it seems 20 like they're coming back in off the rental, and they're 21 sitting there in the yards. And then, of course, they're 22 going through the maintenance on it. When and if this next 23 surge goes, that thing is -- was packed. A while back, when 24 I discussed that yellow iron out there, then it disappeared. 25 But it's like everybody's sort of caught up right now, and 2-13-12 99 1 it's coming back into Holt, and it's coming back into 2 Komatsu; a lot of them are John Deere. So, a lot of things 3 are starting to come back, and I think they're slowing up. 4 I'm sure it'll pick up again, but to answer your question, 5 now's the time to strike. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the reason I asked that, I was 7 thinking that maybe with all the roads and pads that are 8 being built over this Eagle Ford stuff south of San Antonio, 9 and up in the Dallas area you still got that Barnett shale; 10 some of that's going on. And west Texas boys, there's a lot 11 of exploration going on there that maybe that was absorbing 12 it, maybe it's not. I don't know. 13 MR. ODOM: Right now, I think most of that went 14 down to South Texas, from what we've heard, or from the Cat 15 representative with us. And I just watch it. When I have a 16 chance to go down there, I'll drive through and look. And 17 it's beginning to snap back, like, a couple months ago. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 19 MR. ODOM: So, to me, they've already built a lot 20 of the roads to get in and out and started the drilling, and, 21 you know, just -- I don't know if I've said it before; that 22 South Texas will keep going. It's going to have a play for a 23 while. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 25 MR. ODOM: Several more years. Then it's going to 2-13-12 100 1 come up y'all's way up towards Texas -- up towards Austin, 2 and it's going to play that shale back in there. That's when 3 it's really going to get interesting, what they do to the 4 infrastructure at that point. They're tearing -- they're 5 just staying on those large ranches down in South Texas; the 6 only reason that the State's not yelling yet. But when they 7 come up around Austin, they will be yelling. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: It's close when the politicians can 9 see it from the capitol. 10 MR. ODOM: They'll be able to see it. They'll be 11 able to drive it. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And feel it. 13 MR. ODOM: Let's see. Pneumatic -- oh, dump 14 trucks? Okay, 6409. This should look familiar, doesn't it, 15 Bruce? 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, that looks familiar. 17 MR. ODOM: That is a Chevrolet dump truck with 18 320,550 miles on it. This truck is used out of the Ingram 19 yard, and works Precinct 4. Precinct 4 is probably half the 20 county. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Over half. 22 MR. ODOM: Over half, so it's traveling over -- and 23 this county's 1,100 square miles, so you've got a lot of 24 square miles to try to get to, to do shoulder work and all. 25 I've been blessed with that one since I came here 20-some-odd 2-13-12 101 1 years ago, so it's time for it to be replaced. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: You said the motor's about worn out. 3 How many more miles do you think it's got left? 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's been rebuilt; it's not 5 the original motor. 6 MR. ODOM: Yes. It's not -- it's good money going 7 after bad; that's what it is, if I do anything to it. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 9 MR. ODOM: We'll let somebody else find out when we 10 put it out to bid on our gov -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Determine how many more miles it has 12 left? 13 MR. ODOM: Yes. This is a 1989 GMC truck with 14 284,343 miles on it. This also has a gas motor, and our 15 maintenance costs are just increasing by messing with it in 16 this hill country. 17 MS. HOFFER: Hydraulic brakes, too, on the last two 18 dump trucks. No air brakes. If you've ever been on some of 19 the hills here with a full load in it, which I have, it's 20 kind of scary with hydraulic brakes. 21 MR. ODOM: Mm-hmm. 22 MS. HOFFER: They don't want to hold. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: That's what you got a transmission 24 for. 25 MS. HOFFER: Some of these lack that, too. 2-13-12 102 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: You hope that holds together too. 3 MR. ODOM: Hope that holds too, at least slow you 4 down where you can jump out the door and run beside it. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: At least the bed still looks 6 pretty good. 7 MR. ODOM: Yeah. You know, all these, I've got 8 pictures of all of them going through, but we're talking 9 211,000, 122,000, 141,000, 159,000. When I get into the 2002 10 models, I've got 80,000 miles on them, on those dump trucks. 11 We have gone to the push button, to the automatic, because I 12 don't get the type of person that are used to driving 13 two-speeds any more. They tear them up, so we've tried to 14 cut down on our maintenance there and to provide that ability 15 to just put it in drive and go, and -- and not worry about 16 them tearing the transmission or two-speeds up. So, that is 17 one thing. Plus, when we have a side loader on it, it makes 18 it easier to lay that material out on the side of the road, 19 if we're doing edging and all, with automatic and other than 20 our standards. So, we're trying to -- you can see the 21 mileage. We're trying to push everything as far as we can 22 and spend the money as expeditiously as we can. But our 23 maintenance cost keeps going up, and that's one thing that 24 I -- I don't like, because I think that's good money going 25 after bad. That is a -- you can't win in maintenance. You 2-13-12 103 1 never win in maintenance. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How many dump trucks do you 3 have? 4 MR. ODOM: Oh, what, about eight, Kelly? 5 MS. HOFFER: About eight. 6 MR. ODOM: About eight. 7 MS. HOFFER: Each crew is assigned one, and then -- 8 then we've got some backup ones in case one of them goes 9 down. 10 MR. ODOM: Yeah. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You got two new ones. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Some of them also have side loader 13 boxes on it. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just got two new ones. 15 MR. ODOM: Just got two new ones, and those -- that 16 is Unit 176 and 177. Those are two new 2012 International 17 series trucks. Both of these trucks have 330 horsepower. 18 We got those so we could pull these hills, as well as our big 19 trailer we put our heavy equipment on. That can pull those 20 around, 'cause we only had a couple of trucks that could do 21 that. We checked them; only a couple that could do it. So, 22 we want to go that way. We think that's a tried and proved 23 engine and all, and truck. And they are really nice trucks, 24 and we look forward to, over time, to build that up into an 25 International fleet right there. The -- go to the wood chip 2-13-12 104 1 box. There's a new one right there. Heck of a truck. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You got those through Buy 3 Board, or how do you get those? 4 MR. ODOM: Buy Board. That computer is about as 5 fast as I am, so that doesn't say too much. That is our big 6 bucket truck that we bought a few years ago. I think we got 7 it from what, Tempe, Arizona? 8 MS. HOFFER: Yuma. 9 MR. ODOM: The box is what we're looking at on that 10 right there. We want to try to buy a new box for the chips. 11 We're talking about a new chip spreader we put on a truck. 12 We're sort of in quandary of which truck you substitute for. 13 We have one that you can see what that does to these 14 particles getting inside the cab. That's inside of the 15 steering column right there, wood chips. 16 MS. HOFFER: That's if we were just using a regular 17 dump bed, and angling and shooting the chips in. That's why 18 we wanted to show what it starts to do to some of the 19 electronics. 20 MR. ODOM: There's the bed. So, if we can -- we 21 want to do that, we'll find a truck that we can substitute, 22 put it on, and make it safer and easier. You know, the 23 capacity that we could put on one saves several trips that a 24 regular dump truck has to run and dump. This saves on fuel, 25 wear and tear. Can stay on the job long, because then you 2-13-12 105 1 have to stop; you can't chip anything. So, productivity goes 2 up just from the fact that we can utilize something like 3 that. We think that this would fit our needs for all the 4 maintenance crews. There's always brush cutting out there to 5 do, particularly on the roads that they're trying to get 6 preventive maintenance on. 7 All right. Eight? There's one of them that we try 8 to haul around, and that is one. We got a '92 with 3,906 9 hours on it. We want to go toward the -- these right here, 10 like the Vibromax or a Dynapac. This -- that one -- the 11 first one we saw was a '92. I bought those to try to get the 12 repair of the roads. We're almost at that point that we have 13 rebuilt and we're really in a maintenance mode, so I don't 14 need that big machine any more. It can still be used, but 15 we'll probably try to sell that, and then if I can get 16 another one, we're all right. That's just a big one to do a 17 static roll on -- on your chip seal. And because we use that 18 basalt rock, it's very, very hard; it doesn't crush. You 19 couldn't use a steel wheel on the limestone stuff, but we use 20 that basalt, which I think is -- pays off over the long-term 21 of a road. You got skid resistance. There's some newer 22 ones, not all that fancy, but they get the job done, and 23 particularly on the smaller jobs for patching if a road comes 24 apart. All right. Water truck. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: There's -- 2-13-12 106 1 MR. ODOM: 6108, a 1978 water truck with 450,000 2 miles on it. This truck has a gas motor with hydraulic 3 brakes. Again, a real safety issue on high hills. All 4 right, next one. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: What's the -- what's -- 6 MR. ODOM: Sir? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: -- the capacity of that water truck? 8 MR. ODOM: About 1,000 gallons. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. That's a lot of weight. 10 MS. HOFFER: And I'm not sure if it has baffles in 11 the tank, either. 12 MR. ODOM: Yeah. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh. 14 MS. HOFFER: Probably can roll pretty easily if 15 you're not careful. 16 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. Without those baffles, it 17 makes a big difference. This is one of the old Center Point 18 trucks. It had been a fire truck, I think, and we brought 19 that in back in our system. That International truck has 20 357,966 miles, and these miles are current as of Friday. 21 These pictures, you know, that looks good. That picture 22 is -- most of the pictures we have are three to four years 23 old, so you can imagine what it looks like now. Those are 24 not current pictures. This is a 1986 GMC truck with 279,497 25 miles on it. Now, this does have a diesel engine, has air 2-13-12 107 1 brakes on it, but it's like me; it's getting worn-out. It's 2 tired, okay? This is a '95 International water truck with 3 140,527 miles on it. I bought this -- this came from the 4 city of San Antonio; bought it from them. And that truck has 5 a diesel motor and air brakes, and it's still a good running 6 truck. This one is the most current one; it's a 2007 7 Freightliner truck with 15,535 miles on it. We purchased 8 this truck used from Holt Cat a couple years ago. It's a 9 diesel with air brakes. This is the newest one of our fleet. 10 This -- we wanted to show you pictures out there. There's 11 some out there that's probably 3,000 to 4,000 gallons we're 12 looking at. Particularly when I go to your area there, I 13 need that much capacity of different places that I can start 14 to run water and have that reserve up there. That's about 15 four fillings in that little old water truck that we have up 16 there. So -- 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And trips. 18 MR. ODOM: Too many trips. And my bigger storage 19 that I have is in Mountain Home right there. That's where I 20 have that 15,000-gallon reserve tank up there that they keep 21 filled up for us. 22 MS. HOFFER: And not only -- 23 MR. ODOM: Go ahead. 24 MS. HOFFER: Not only that, but the State -- we 25 haven't been able to draw water out of the river with our 2-13-12 108 1 permit for the last two years, so we have to go to the city's 2 wastewater treatment plant. So, that's a long trip from the 3 wastewater treatment plant all the way back to Mountain Home 4 with anywhere from a 1,600- to a 2,000-gallon tank. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Doesn't take long to let it 6 out, does it? 7 MR. ODOM: No. 8 MS. HOFFER: That's right. 9 MR. ODOM: And what we're having to use now is use 10 our haul truck to haul that big 35,000-gallon tank I had that 11 I got from Ergon; just put water in, and then suck off that, 12 and then when it gets empty, I take it back somewhere that we 13 have water there. But if I have something big of that 14 capacity right there, we can take care of most of the jobs 15 that we do. I don't try to go in and do three miles at a 16 time. We'll take a third of a mile, a half a mile. That's 17 enough water to make it work. And then the next day, we can 18 start in on the other process. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, you're proposing one -- 20 MR. ODOM: One, yes, sir. Right now. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What -- what's water cost when 22 you have to buy it at the city? 23 MS. HOFFER: Now, I don't -- they give us a pretty 24 good rate, but I remember last summer signing one of the 25 P.O.'s, -- 2-13-12 109 1 MR. ODOM: $1,000 a month. 2 MS. HOFFER: -- and it was $900 to $1,000 for one 3 month for us to buy the water, where when we can draw on our 4 state permit, it doesn't cost us anything but the $110 a year 5 for the permit. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How long does it take to -- to 7 fill -- I mean, how do they -- does it just pump it from a 8 water stand? 9 MS. HOFFER: They've got a water stand with a meter 10 on it. You go and fill out the paperwork and meter it out. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Top fill? 12 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir, from the top. It's curved 13 pipe. 14 MS. HOFFER: I have filled one a couple of times, 15 and it's about a half an hour, 45 minutes for a 2,000-gallon 16 tank. 17 MR. ODOM: Then wherever you're going, you've got 18 that time -- that distance there to get to the job, and by 19 the time you -- with the summers that we have, you're already 20 dry. I mean, it's -- you've shot yourself in the foot. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And we're not really -- I'm on 22 the Little League page right now in my mind. You know, it 23 would probably be economical for the County to almost take 24 over that well at the Little League field and use it. 25 MR. ODOM: Across the street from us? 2-13-12 110 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. Hook it up, even put in 2 a storage tank up there if we need to, 'cause that well's 3 over 100 gallons a minute. 4 MR. ODOM: That would fill me up. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Keep it on that side. You can 6 change that. I mean, it just seems like it would be a way to 7 help give you water right where you are right now. 8 MR. ODOM: Yeah. I don't think that it's going to 9 get any better. I think -- you know, you had the depression, 10 the seven-year drought. I really think we're in an 11 eight-year drought, is -- is where we're headed with 12 everything. So -- 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We need to get over there and 14 look at that. 15 MR. ODOM: Okay. We'll beat the depression; let's 16 put that it way. All right, Group 10. Oh, this is -- go 17 back there. This is another -- it's about a 1,000-gallon; it 18 sits up there. If we can find the right cabin chassis of a 19 used truck that's a better one, we might put that into play 20 right there, but that's only 1,000 gallons. That looks big, 21 but that's not that big. Bruce knows what we're talking 22 about. It -- it doesn't fit all our trucks. I even thought 23 about 26, 27, but the -- the chassis part is too small for 24 it, so I've got to find something that will make it work. 25 And it's been sitting there forever, but I've never had a 2-13-12 111 1 chance to have any vehicles that I could afford to modify. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: That sure looks bigger than 1,000 3 gallons. Looks like a big trailer-mounted 5,000 -- 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Just the angle of the 5 picture. 6 MR. ODOM: It's the angle of the picture is all. I 7 blame that on Kelly. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You don't want to take a side 9 view of the fish; you want to -- 10 MR. ODOM: That's right. That one makes it look a 11 whole lot bigger than it is, but it's not. All right. My 12 truck, 190,000 miles. It's a 2007 -- it's really a 2006 13 model; bought it right at the beginning of 2007. We can 14 still use it in the system like my old '95 truck that I had, 15 and my 2001; I had 220,000 miles on it. I got 190,000. I 16 got a lifter sounding on the thing now. It just went dead in 17 the middle of 1604 right at I-10 about two weeks ago. 18 Alternator went out on it, and I just had enough space to get 19 over. And my mechanic was ahead of me in the water truck; I 20 was following, and -- I'm sorry, it was a dump truck. And we 21 had a warranty deal with Rush, and we picked up that truck, 22 and it goes dead. It's been a good truck, but, you know, 23 that's what I'm looking at. It's not a 60,000-mile trade-in; 24 it's almost 200,000. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Who has a 60,000-mile trade-in? 2-13-12 112 1 MR. ODOM: I don't know. I'm just assuming 2 somebody might have a 60,000-mile trade-in. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, it'd be nice to have one of 4 those, wouldn't it? 5 MR. ODOM: I could drive it three times as long, 6 probably. Two supervisors trucks. I think that -- just go 7 through and show the pictures to everybody. There's my old 8 one right there, that brown one. There's another one. 9 They're Dodges. When we start out, let me just give the 10 mileage on a lot of these here. A '95 pickup, 210,000 miles. 11 '99 Dodge pickup, 189. Another Dodge, 225,000. '99 Dodge 12 pickup, 119,000 -- that's a young one. 2000, 208. '01 13 Ford -- an old Ford truck, 254,000. 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It will probably still go 15 another two or three years. Those Dodges and Chevrolet are 16 the ones that -- 17 MR. ODOM: Yeah. The only problem is, it costs 18 about $800 just to change the plugs on them if you took it 19 somewhere. That's the bad thing about Fords. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I know that. 21 MR. ODOM: Good truck. Good 5.4, but it will cost 22 you an arm and a leg or a full day of maintenance just for 23 one truck to change the spark plugs. I'm used to that old 24 Chevrolet; take them out and you go on. You know, it's no 25 more. But, anyway, they're worn out, so we're looking at 2-13-12 113 1 replacing two supervisor trucks, is what I'm trying to do at 2 least on that. And we'll keep the others back, or we'll give 3 them to someone that can use it, whether it's Tim or -- or 4 Animal Control, if they want to -- you know, not any of these 5 worn-out ones, but there's a Dodge in there, and we think, 6 you know, we could put that over to Animal Control, maybe, if 7 they -- y'all wanted it. And, you know, these are the new 8 trucks, and they have asked us to go to a utility bed, and 9 that's what we would like to do when we get the supervisors' 10 trucks. These are -- that's the newest one; I just got 174, 11 and that's for Simms out there in your area right there. And 12 this is a picture of a newer -- of a long-bed. You see the 13 capacity of what we're trying to do. You've got more places 14 to put things; saws, things like that. 15 MS. HOFFER: Secure. We had a brand-new, probably 16 $800 saw that got stolen out of the back of one of the 17 pickups. The crew was on down the road a little ways, and 18 the saw got used once. 19 MR. ODOM: We were doing sealcoating back in 20 Precinct 1. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Figures. 22 MR. ODOM: Stole it out of his truck. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Might have known it would be 24 in Precinct 1. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Total jealousy. Total 2-13-12 114 1 jealousy. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Where do you think the culprit that 3 snatched it came from, Buster? 4 MR. ODOM: All right, let's go to 12. We are 5 almost through, if y'all bear with me here. This is a small 6 dump truck. That's what we do the patching with, where they 7 can pick up dead animals; they can throw it in it. And the 8 big thing is -- is where they can do the patching there 9 without really hurting them too high; it's just about right. 10 And so that unit has 140,000 miles on it. We would like 11 another one. The crews are starting to use it, too. We need 12 -- that would increase the productivity in that area, other 13 than waiting on Michael. But everybody's wanting that -- 14 that truck, and if Michael's not using that one, we put him 15 in a -- one of the lift trucks to cut brush. Then he'll go 16 back to patching. 17 MS. HOFFER: And another thing is, too, with just 18 having the one -- keep in mind that this is the truck that we 19 usually pick up the dead animals in, so if Michael's out 20 patching, they have to come all the way back to Spur 100 to 21 dump the asphalt, drive out to wherever that dead deer's at, 22 pick up the dead deer; then they have to rinse the bed out, 23 and then they get to load their C.C. back up and head back 24 out where they just got called from and start all over again. 25 MR. ODOM: Does that sound productive? 2-13-12 115 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. 2 MR. ODOM: No, it doesn't. It's not productive. 3 And that's my fault, maybe, if we can come up with another 4 idea. But I have an idea; I just sort of mentioned it right 5 there, and since you can't put a dead animal with a live 6 animal, that truck might be the thing you want to think 7 about. They could use that and let us stay on what we're 8 doing, cutting brush or patching. These are the shredders 9 that I was talking about the other day. And that price is -- 10 I can't say -- Charlie's not there. Charlie gave me that 11 price within the last year or so, but probably $10,000 to 12 $12,000, in there somewhere. But I had 15, and I think 13 that's what he gave me at that point for replacing these 14 shredders. Remember, I have about 500 miles of roads spread 15 out over 1,100 square miles, and we will go at least twice, 16 three, sometimes four times a year, depending upon the 17 weather. The more rain, the quicker it comes back. And 18 they're worn-out; they're just going out. The newest one 19 that I got -- and I got that John Deere, because it's a good 20 machine. I did get some ones from Seguin, and we got those. 21 The guys don't like those as much as they do the John Deere 22 and all. They have given us more maintenance problems than 23 the John Deere has. And we're looking at double batwing, not 24 a single. That's the reason you're on up there into the mid 25 to tens of thousands. Mowing tractors, it's a 5510. I would 2-13-12 116 1 like to replace those. Let's see, that 5510, one of them, 2 RBU-72 -- what unit is that? 3 MS. HOFFER: 72 and 73. 4 MR. ODOM: So, 73 has 3,700 hours. The other 5510 5 has 3,800 hours. And these are driven like a car, all over 6 the place. You know, they just -- it just puts real wear and 7 tear going all over the place. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Do you plan on trading those 9 in, or selling them and taking the -- 10 MR. ODOM: I would probably try to trade them in 11 and see. We will take a look. Maybe we might use them for 12 level-ups. We have done that in Aaron's area where we put a 13 box blade on back, and he does a fabulous job with that 14 tractor. You remember the old yellow one that was state 15 highway department, bought before I came here, and we 16 couldn't find parts for it any more. So, we put one of the 17 -- I think a 5510 would work, but yes, we plan to trade those 18 in, get something for them. 19 MS. HOFFER: We usually keep maybe one as a backup, 20 because if we've got four mowers going, there's always one 21 that's down -- 22 MR. ODOM: Always one down. 23 MS. HOFFER: -- or something as the mowing season 24 gets going. So -- 25 MR. ODOM: 5520, 1,935 hours. John Deere, 2003, 2-13-12 117 1 RBU-113, that one has 2,200 hours. It looks like one of 2 them -- I don't know if that picture was the new -- which one 3 was it, Kelly, that had the hood that was blown out? 4 MS. HOFFER: This one. It's this one. 5 MR. ODOM: This one. It doesn't reflect what it 6 looks like now. The hood just totally came -- just looked 7 like it blew up from the inside. We went with John Deere to 8 find out why. That should have never happened. Their 9 plastics totally deteriorated. And, of course, their comment 10 was it -- it's past warranty; that, you know, no problem. 11 And it looks like it ran over a land mine, blew out through 12 it. And I think that just replacing the hood is over -- 13 around $3,000 for that plastic hood, because it's painted 14 green. Just like painted yellow. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Kind of like yellow. I'm not 16 sure which paint's more expensive, the green or the yellow. 17 MR. ODOM: I don't know. Both of them are mighty 18 proud of themselves. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They sell it by the ounce. 20 MR. ODOM: It's like gold. All right, the Tahoe. 21 Then this should -- you'll ask me to leave for sure. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Funny looking Tahoe. 23 MR. ODOM: That's what we had reserved for the 24 courts. Y'all can take -- 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I figured that. Or worse. 2-13-12 118 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You don't have a price on 2 here for your Tahoe. 3 MR. BOLLIER: 42. 4 MR. ODOM: 42, I'm sorry. We had it up right there 5 on the screen. 6 MS. HOFFER: It was getting late on Friday when I 7 was typing all of that. I wanted to go home. (Laughter.) 8 MR. ODOM: This has 47,000 miles on it, and it's 9 still in good shape. The Court uses it at times, as well as 10 other departments here in the courthouse. We don't have a 11 problem. What our thought was, was to go ahead and give this 12 to the courthouse here; we'll keep the maintenance on it and 13 all, but we'd like another one just as backup. This is a 14 2003. Next -- this September, the '13's come out. It's 10 15 years old. That doesn't mean it's not safe, but y'all would 16 still have the use of it, but it would be good to go ahead 17 and have that. We wanted something small, so when I have the 18 ladies go either bring something up here or go to pick up 19 some supplies, this is more appropriate, smaller, to take 20 care of it. You know, y'all can -- you still have the use of 21 it. It's still a fine machine, but I just think as far as 22 less use, something new would go another 10 years for us. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Need to go with something 24 smaller than a Tahoe. 25 MR. ODOM: Sir? 2-13-12 119 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Couldn't you go with something 2 smaller than a Tahoe? 3 MR. ODOM: Well, I don't know. Well, there's some 4 other new things out there, aren't there? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I was thinking, it's primarily 6 a runaround truck. I mean -- 7 MR. ODOM: That's -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, that's what it is. 9 MR. ODOM: That's essentially it. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think you could go with 11 something probably a lot smaller. 12 MR. ODOM: Can y'all use it, though? I mean, you 13 know, the way we set that up before was for y'all's use too. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 15 MR. ODOM: The reason I brought it -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We have used it on occasion, 17 but I don't know that our use is justification for a vehicle. 18 MR. ODOM: Okay. You realize that these smaller 19 ones -- I just looked at some yesterday. I -- my wife, I got 20 her out to look, and some of this stuff is 43,000. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's why I want littler. 22 MR. ODOM: No, I'm talking about the little -- I'm 23 talking about some little, bitty things over here. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: S.U.V. type. 25 MR. ODOM: I was totally shocked, the prices they 2-13-12 120 1 want for that. That's -- the government being involved, it's 2 saving something. They save something all right. Yeah. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Leonard, one time we were 4 going to Uvalde in your truck, and we come up on this little 5 grocery store that was built in the mid-1700's or so, and to 6 get a cup of coffee. We pull in -- we were going to Uvalde 7 to school. We pull in there and walk in there, and this 8 little lady comes running behind the counter and says, "It's 9 Pat. It's Pat. It's Judge Pat." You know, it's like he was 10 a big hero or something. And -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Didn't that prove it to you? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, it did. And that's 13 the last time we're going to use that truck, I can tell you 14 for sure. 15 MR. ODOM: They sort of knew what was going on, 16 huh? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: "That's Pat Tinley," she 18 says. 19 MR. ODOM: That's sort of like me. When I lived in 20 Castroville, the County Judge's name was Odom, so I had to be 21 careful when I went through Hondo. I think -- I appreciate 22 you taking the time, letting me do this. We wanted y'all to 23 see what we had out there. And I know that you -- the 24 thought is, Road and Bridge gets something new all the time. 25 There is so much out there that we -- that, you know, just 2-13-12 121 1 because we have some of that, you can see where we're at. To 2 eliminate this, I would ask you to take my original thought 3 and contemplate that very hard. I appreciate what has been 4 said to me, but we have a need for it. Some are safety 5 needs. Some of it's -- and every bit of it's for production. 6 This is what we're here for, to do the best job we can for 7 everybody. And -- and the more production I can get, if I 8 don't have it down in the shop, I'm out there working, and we 9 get things done. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: You're projecting this out as your 11 needs for what period of time, Leonard? 12 MR. ODOM: Probably at least -- maybe two to three 13 years, maybe. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Not beyond that? 15 MR. ODOM: Sir? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Not beyond that? 17 MR. ODOM: Well, it looks like I'm probably going 18 to have to be out four to five. But you asked me what I -- 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Your druthers would be two to 20 three. I think we're thinking a minimum of five here. 21 MR. ODOM: Well, it is what it is. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. That sounds like the quote I 23 heard. 24 MR. ODOM: If I can, if we bumped up, $100,000 does 25 not go far. 2-13-12 122 1 JUDGE TINLEY: No, I understand that. That yellow 2 iron is -- 3 MR. ODOM: We've seen equipment up here, and we 4 just -- it just doesn't. But if I'm in that range right 5 there, I can start to do it. But two trucks -- the two 6 trucks I just got cost me $163,000. Then I'm dead for a 7 while. So, we try to prioritize and try to make it the best 8 we can. I would come -- anything that I sell, I would ask 9 you to allow me to -- to use that money back to try to pick 10 something up in there that will help us elongate the money. 11 And you know I will, because I have in the past. I will 12 continue to do that. We will buy used equipment just as much 13 as we can. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If you were to, I guess, 15 attribute the sales price of everything -- I mean, say if you 16 get a water truck -- that's probably not a good example -- 17 sell the old water truck you have. If all of those funds 18 were put back into it, how much money total would that be? 19 Tractors, all those trucks? I mean, I'm guessing 100,000? 20 MR. ODOM: It would be under 100,000. 21 MS. HOFFER: I don't think it would be -- we sold a 22 bunch of stuff that first go-around with Gov.deals, and I 23 think we ended up -- what was it, 70,000-something? 24 MR. ODOM: 70-something. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Those tractors are -- 2-13-12 123 1 MR. ODOM: The tractors will bring me something in 2 there. I'm not quite sure where, but that's it. That old 3 water truck, those old dump trucks, you know, you won't get a 4 whole lot for them, but I'm hoping that I could come out 5 between $70,000 and $100,000, and I'd be optimistic. And 6 people are -- things are beginning to move a little bit, so 7 they may pay a little bit more. Remember, the market's down. 8 Construction's down. So, I'm realistic in saying, "Who wants 9 to buy something?" We put -- I would put a bottom -- what I 10 want for it, and then we'd have to wait and see if I get it. 11 But -- maybe change it, but I'm being realistic. I'm hoping 12 you're right; it's 100,000. That would be great. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Well -- 14 MR. ODOM: And I might be able to do it with that 15 roller. That roller might bring me a whole lot more to bring 16 the average up, that big -- that big Cat. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Your operation method has been to -- 18 you've told me from day one that you want your people to have 19 the right equipment. Otherwise, you got to have more people. 20 And you can do a lot more with fewer people if you got the 21 right equipment. That's how you reduce the number of 22 personnel. 23 MR. ODOM: That's right. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Having the right equipment. 25 MR. ODOM: That's right, sir. 2-13-12 124 1 JUDGE TINLEY: You buy the equipment once. You buy 2 the personnel every year. 3 MR. ODOM: That's right, every year. Plus the 4 overhead that goes with it that increases with their -- and 5 one -- you know, some of this equipment, you can see -- I've 6 been here since 1991. Some of this equipment's been with me 7 all that time. So, can you -- will it pay for itself? It 8 pays for itself over the long run. And we're in it for the 9 long run, way after I'm gone. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, Leonard. 11 MR. ODOM: Thank y'all. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't know if we've got other 13 folks that want to try and make their case. Let me figure 14 out what we're going to do here first. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Do stock show while they're 16 sitting back there; then they can go back to work. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: I was planning on hanging onto them 18 to be our lunch ticket. 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh, yeah, right. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Wasn't that your intention? 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, it wasn't my intention. 22 Leave him alone; I'm working on getting another ESD member. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: They're nicer to me than they've 24 been to you, then. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, they probably have 2-13-12 125 1 been. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They've been pretty nice to 4 me, too. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Well, let's go to Item 6 26; then we may have to come back to the other one. 7 Consider, discuss, take appropriate action on the lease 8 agreement with the Hill Country District/Junior Livestock 9 Association for use of the Hill Country Youth Exhibit Center 10 facilities; authorize County Judge to sign same. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, is the -- is the rest of 12 the Court even aware what the lease is? Have y'all even 13 looked at it? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: I've looked at it. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I know you have. I know Bruce 16 and I have. I don't know if -- 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: We've seen it, but give us a 18 summary again. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's a 20-year deal. They're 20 paying $250 for that 20-year period; then there's a 10-year 21 option, another 10-year option after that. It's a pretty 22 simple lease. There's not a whole lot in there. They get 23 their -- their use of it, and their designated period -- 24 month of January, basically, and their fundraiser. There's 25 not a lot of detail in it, like the other one had all the 2-13-12 126 1 Court-ordered things about tractors and things like that. We 2 left all of -- no dumpster language, no commitment as to 3 maintenance, you know, that we're going to contribute to it, 4 or Maintenance Department personnel year to year. That can 5 be worked out year to year, rather than tie it down for a 6 20-year period. And it's pretty simple. Anything I'm 7 leaving out, Rob or Bruce? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Took a while to get to it, 9 but finally -- you know, everybody agrees. And that's 10 already been sent to -- already been presented to the 11 executive board, I guess, and it was voted on and approved. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So you think this is ready to 13 go forward with the Court here today, then? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. I think if you sign it, 15 it's a done deal. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, let's -- 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I make a motion that we 18 accept the -- 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: There you go. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- lease agreement. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion. Do I hear a 22 second? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: We have a motion and a second to 25 approve the lease agreement with the Hill Country District 2-13-12 127 1 Junior Livestock Association for use of the Hill Country 2 Youth Exhibit Center facilities, authorize me to sign it, as 3 per the document presented to members of the Court today. 4 Correct? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And the County Attorney, I 6 guess, wrote it, so -- so I guess it gets his formal 7 approval. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Further question or 9 discussion? 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: The only thing -- statement I 11 would make is, this -- this kind of ties down the use of it, 12 which was not tied down prior to this time, for the stock 13 show to be guaranteed use of that facility -- 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: It's good. 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- for that period of time. 16 And that gives them some assurance, and that they will help, 17 hopefully, raise money as they have said they would for the 18 building project. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Excellent. 20 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Good deal. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other question or comment? All 22 in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 24 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 25 (No response.) 2-13-12 128 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we only charge them 250 3 a month? 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You know what? I'd duck if I 5 were you. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. (Laughter.) They're 7 still in the room, I see. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. What's the pleasure of the 9 Court? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Barbecue. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: You want to go to lunch, right? 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Why don't we be in recess 14 till about 1:30. 15 (Recess taken from 12:05 p.m. to 1:32 p.m.) 16 - - - - - - - - - - 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let's come back to order, if 18 we might, from our lunch recess. We were on Item 23, which 19 is consider, discuss, take appropriate action regarding 20 capital items list for proposed debt issue. I think Road and 21 Bridge had finished with their -- 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: God, I hope so. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: -- dog and pony show, and got 24 their -- tried to make their case. Anybody else that may -- 25 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 2-13-12 129 1 JUDGE TINLEY: -- want to eliminate their list, 2 well, they can step right up. (Laughter.) 3 MR. BOLLIER: No, sir. I'm -- it's quite easy. I 4 think the last time, the Court had cut my capital items down 5 to 40,000. I would like for the Court to reconsider and add 6 six -- I'm going to say $6,700 back to that for the angle 7 broom, and I believe I've talked to each -- to some of y'all 8 about it. So, we'll be able to use that inside the new show 9 barn, plus we can also sweep our asphalt on the outside of 10 the building with that angle broom. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: That's a sweeping machine that 12 you're calling it -- 13 MR. BOLLIER: No, sir. This is just an angle 14 broom, Judge. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 16 MR. BOLLIER: The big machine was -- 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Goes on your Bobcat, right? 18 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. Yes, sir. 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Attachment. 20 MR. BOLLIER: Attachment, yes, sir. 21 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. It's called a what? 22 MR. BOLLIER: Angle broom. And that's all I was 23 asking. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: And that was 6,700? 25 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 2-13-12 130 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, do you want -- are you 2 finished? 3 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, I'm done. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: On this -- go ahead. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll just say, while Road and 6 Bridge is fresh on our mind, let's go back. Can we kind of 7 finalize that -- set a number there? 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yes. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I look at that -- it was at 1.1 10 originally. 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Mm-hmm. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It seems to me that Leonard 13 said that he'll get about 70,000 to 100,000 on surplusing 14 that stuff, so that to me comes off pretty easily. The other 15 thing, I would say there's probably a -- on deferring a 16 little bit of that a little bit, another 100,000 can come 17 off, so it'd be more in the range of -- 18 JUDGE TINLEY: 900? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- 900. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 850 or 900. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 850 or 900. I agree that the 22 -- I mean, most of what he showed -- 23 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Is a need. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- needs to be replaced. You 25 know, I'm not -- I'm not totally convinced that we need, I 2-13-12 131 1 mean, you know, the quantity of some of those types of 2 equipment. I think a lot of what he's holding is -- is the 3 trucks -- the supervisors trucks and all those I think 4 definitely need to be replaced. The Tahoe, I think that 5 needs to be relooked at. I think that we -- they can get a 6 little -- a little used car. You know, I mean, it doesn't -- 7 they don't need a $40,000 vehicle to run down to the 8 courthouse. It's almost 10 years old, got 40,000 miles on 9 it, so obviously, it's not a high-use vehicle. I think that 10 I -- on the water trucks, the old one needs to be retired, 11 but I'm not so certain that that one's already really not 12 retired. I think -- I think some of those that are -- 13 they -- it'd be nice to replace them. Need to replace them? 14 I'm not sure that everything needs to be replaced. I don't 15 know that we need five water trucks. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You know, I was thinking the 17 same thing. And what made me think it, though, I was looking 18 at it from a little bit different direction, is the fact we 19 have about 500 miles of county road, and almost all of it is 20 paved, and we should be in a maintenance-only plan going 21 forward. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: That's essentially what he said. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I don't know about all 24 these water trucks. I mean, what do they do? 25 MS. HARGIS: It's just one. 2-13-12 132 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And so -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just one water truck, but he's 3 got a total of five in his inventory. He's got quite a few 4 water trucks. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 6 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: They use some of those old 7 ones sometimes to haul water to fires. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. And that's one of the 9 things good about the water trucks, but even on the dump 10 trucks, I mean, the oldest one, I agree it needs to go. 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm just not so certain some of 13 these need replaced right now. You know, I think he will 14 start rolling them back, you know, and he does a good job of 15 kind of keeping them, but I just think there's probably 16 another -- you know, we can't afford to have too much sitting 17 around that's kind of a -- in case something's broken one 18 day, just to have a backup. We need some backup, but you 19 don't need a whole lot of backup, in my mind. And the newer 20 equipment you get, it needs -- you know, it has to last a 21 long time. Some of his trucks with the high mileage, I 22 agree, those need to go. Some of the things, like on the 23 tractors, $3,000 on a tractor isn't that much. I mean, you 24 know, I think there's some give and take in some of his 25 estimates. I think the vehicles -- the dump truck, the 2-13-12 133 1 hydraulic brakes dump truck, they need to be gotten rid of 2 one way or another. Whether you replace them or not, we 3 shouldn't be using those. So -- but I'm going to give him 4 the flexibility to do that. I think they could, and that's 5 a -- I don't know -- 6 JUDGE TINLEY: What are you plugging him in for, 7 then? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'd go with 850. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's a good one. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'll go for that. 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: And let him use it 12 discretionally where he needs to. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And he gets the -- and when he 14 surpluses the stuff, that money goes back into buying 15 equipment automatically, so he doesn't have to come back and 16 -- you know, in the past, he's come in every time he gets rid 17 of something. He can still do it that way, but my intent is 18 that surplus money goes back into new equipment for him. 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Okay. So, we're giving him 20 850, but with the trade-in of all the equipment, that's 21 another 100,000, so really, he has about 900 -- about 950,000 22 to work with, okay. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: That carried him from -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He was at 500. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: 500, okay. 2-13-12 134 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He was at 532; now he's at 850. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Maintenance. I notice we 3 have the jail boiler in your budget. Is that where it ought 4 to be? 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's all part of the 6 maintenance. But I think if you look, it got cut out last 7 time. I was a little bit confused. That 40 he's got this 8 his budget doesn't include the boiler. 9 MS. HARGIS: I think we took the boiler and put it 10 into the renovations. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: If you look at that figure on 14 the radios, I think all you need is 400 total in that. 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: On the digital conversion? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah -- it's not the digital. 17 We went to the -- 18 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: 375. 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Just upgrade 375 to 400 max by 20 the time it gets installed. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Just round it a little bit there; 25 22 grand, Bruce. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You're going to do what? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Wait, wait, wait. Go back. 25 Where is the -- there's nothing in here for digital 2-13-12 135 1 conversion. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Number 6. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I see it. It says patrol 4 vehicles, 500,000. Digital conversion, there's no numbers 5 across from that one. 6 MS. HARGIS: There's not. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: That's 'cause it got eliminated. 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Right. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They were in the original 10 list, and they just disappeared; I don't know how that 11 happened. I think it's the Auditor. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So we add -- so we're adding 13 375 back. 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Right. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. And originally, it was a 16 million and a half. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So the Sheriff now has eight -- 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: 875. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 875. 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. Okay, we took 22 everything out of Animal Control. We're just going to take 23 it out. We're going to let Animal Control and Environmental 24 Health each have one vehicle over the period rather than two. 25 Do we just cut them out? 2-13-12 136 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, just leave one. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We got two. I'm trying to 3 figure out which one does what. Environmental Health, 4 there's one there. If I'm not mistaken, he said he could 5 trade the one in and it would only be 15,000 difference. 6 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, if that's the one we give 8 him, then he needs 15,000 in there instead of 35. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Is that right? 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Put 15,000 in Item 9? 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Put 16, just -- 13 MS. HARGIS: We've got graphics. 14 MR. GARCIA: Right. We might want to do the -- for 15 the graphics. I think we -- did you have written out, 16 Jeannie, on the price for the graphics? 17 MS. HARGIS: Last one you had done was about 18 $1,200, 'cause you have the grill guard and the graphics and 19 the radio, and -- 20 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: 17,000? 21 MS. HARGIS: 16,5. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 16,5. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: And that's on Environmental Health. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Environmental Health. And on 25 Animal Control, that should be whatever -- what's a new one 2-13-12 137 1 cost nowadays? 26? 2 MS. HARGIS: 28. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 28. 28 needs to go there, 4 since it's one instead of two. 5 MS. HARGIS: Plus you need money for cages. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Does that 28 include graphics? 7 MS. HARGIS: No, but she just uses a little sign on 8 hers. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Say again? 10 MS. HARGIS: She just has a sign that says "Animal 11 Control." It's not -- it's not -- 12 JUDGE TINLEY: And she moves the cages over. 13 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, it's not the major graphics that 14 they put on. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Was it 28 on Animal? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: She had some radio and 17 installation expenses. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: And Environmental was net what? 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 16,5 is what I've got down. 20 MS. HARGIS: Let's put 30,000 in for her, because 21 she will probably need a grill guard on there, too. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: What? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 30. 24 MS. HARGIS: 30. That gives her room for graphics, 25 grill guard, and in case she needs some money for changing 2-13-12 138 1 the cages over, and she'll need some money to change the 2 radios over. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bruce, you could get your 4 picture put on the side of it like politicians. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Get ready for the next 7 election. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah, uh-huh. I'm not sure 9 that's what you want to put your picture on. (Laughter.) 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Just trying to be helpful. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Put yourself on there. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Maintenance, where did we end up on 15 that one, total? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 46,7. 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: 47. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 47. 19 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. Let's round it up, if we can, a 20 little bit. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Say what? 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 46,7. 23 MS. HARGIS: Round them up or down a little bit, 24 because it's kind of hard to have an issue with strange 25 dollar amounts. 2-13-12 139 1 JUDGE TINLEY: We can do like the Sheriff; just 2 round them all up 25,000. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The nearest hundred thousand. 4 MS. HARGIS: Not that much. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: No. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Obama math. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Crumbs. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, wait a minute. Let's 9 land on this number. Maintenance? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 47. 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: 47. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 47? 13 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's exactly what I 15 thought. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: What do you say? 17 MR. BOLLIER: 47 -- 50. 18 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: No. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: You and the Sheriff go outside and 20 have a discussion, okay? 21 MR. BOLLIER: I'll settle for -- 22 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll work while you're gone. 23 MR. BOLLIER: -- 47, Judge. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think that was a good 2-13-12 140 1 answer. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Juvenile Detention. They 3 were requesting one vehicle. 4 MS. HARGIS: You gave him back one vehicle, and 5 then the locks and all that. And he -- the control system. 6 So, he originally had two vehicles in there. You took away 7 the Ford Escape. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, Judge, I guess we ought to 9 round that 97 up to 200,000? (Laughter.) 10 MS. HARGIS: No. But -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Too close to 100 to be comfortable 12 for the Sheriff; he'd want to go to 125. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Depends on how long all this 14 takes to get going. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Just a matter of getting on track, 16 isn't it, Sheriff? 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's it. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Now, Ms. Hargis, tell me about 19 the -- the vehicle issue with Juvenile. 20 MS. HARGIS: He requested a 2012 Ford F-150 and a 21 2012 Ford Escape. You gave him 25,000 for the 2012 Ford 22 F-150 and didn't give him the Escape; you took that away. He 23 needed the Ford Escape to transport -- 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. So that, along with his 25 control system and doors, we're going to insert 100,000. Is 2-13-12 141 1 that what I'm hearing from everybody here? 2 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yes. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, but I have a question. 4 He's keeping the Escape or keeping the F-150? 5 MS. HARGIS: You just gave him -- you gave him 6 25,000, so whatever he can get with that 25,000. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why does he need a pickup, I 8 guess, is my question. 9 MS. HARGIS: That's what he put down here. I don't 10 know. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He gets an Escape. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 13 MS. HARGIS: He gets the Escape and not the pickup, 14 okay. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not sure -- yeah. 16 MR. BOLLIER: That's what he gets for not being 17 here. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Still probably twenty -- 19 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah, keep it in there. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So, how much there? 21 MS. HARGIS: Better leave that at 100. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's what I've got. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Total of 100? 25 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. 'Cause he's got graphics, 2-13-12 142 1 even on the Escape, he's got to put on there. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. John, it's not good to be at 3 the end of the list, I don't think. But -- 4 MR. TROLINGER: Well, I'd like to go with Tim's 5 comment, and if they're not here, then more for us. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Sit down and have a chat with the 7 Sheriff, and we'll take care of you in the meantime. 8 MR. BOLLIER: Thanks, John. 9 MR. TROLINGER: I took an emergency call from the 10 Ingram City Marshal a couple meetings ago, and it went down 11 to half of what I'd requested, so I've been sticking close to 12 the process. But I've looked -- I've looked at everything I 13 can on this, and -- and just like Mr. Odom told you earlier, 14 trying look three years out is probably a good number for 15 I.T. also, you know, when I add up all these things. So, if 16 you -- if you want to say this is a three-year and -- and a 17 couple more, maybe, I.T. budget, it is, and it's the 18 essentials. I've cut off the excess. Now, can we cut it 19 more? Maybe. But what do you want to cut? It might take us 20 you know, hours to discuss that in the open meeting. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't think you're going to get 22 that. 23 MR. TROLINGER: But I have spent quite a lot of 24 time on this, and I've got all the final numbers in for the 25 large projects, and we've actually set up some demos for some 2-13-12 143 1 of these projects. And aside from the desktop computers, 2 we're just doing the things that we need to do. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I remember you telling us 4 early on that it was going to take you a while to get your 5 numbers together, 'cause you had a lot of different vendors 6 to work with and so forth. And -- okay, let's start with the 7 pie in the sky number. What's that? 8 MR. TROLINGER: Well -- 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that the 750? 10 MR. TROLINGER: Initially, I said $1.17 million, 11 and that included a large system that let us consolidate the 12 terabytes of data that we now have, and centralize it and 13 make it redundant, and clean up some of the internal 14 housekeeping. Just reduces overhead on my part. You do not 15 really see any benefit outside of -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Sheriff, have y'all been talking a 17 lot, you and John? 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I haven't said a word, Your 19 Honor. 20 MR. TROLINGER: The meeting before this, I walked 21 in, and I was at 500,000. I don't know -- I don't know where 22 that number's from, but I added up just the things that we 23 need to do as part of regular I.T., replacing computers and 24 servers and some new software projects, and I'm at $740,000. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: And does that include the annual 2-13-12 144 1 software maintenance updates and so forth under our existing 2 system and programs? 3 MR. TROLINGER: It does not include the operation 4 and maintenance. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: So that's an annual budgetary 6 thing, huh? 7 MR. TROLINGER: That's right. The software 8 maintenance is annual, and I don't think we -- 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Can't put that in the capital 10 anyway. 11 MR. TROLINGER: -- can capitalize that. Right now, 12 it's about $160,000 per year, right at 160, and with the new 13 software that we want to add on, it would go up to about 173. 14 We actually save a little bit in one place and add in others. 15 So, the annual cost, that operation/maintenance cost goes up 16 just a little bit with that. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: So, your fixed costs, capital-wise, 18 are 740, did you say? 19 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: So, you're down about 350,000. 21 MS. HARGIS: Where did you cut, John? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, he's not making any allowance 23 for -- for desktops, apparently. 24 MR. TROLINGER: Well, no, the desktops and the 25 laptops are all included. The large projects on the back end 2-13-12 145 1 where we -- where we take the data storage and consolidate 2 it, and do some major things there, which it's not a -- a 3 need; it's just where the industry's going. And some other 4 places on the workstations and desktops, I did cut off 5 what -- typically, I had right at $2,600 or $2,700 per 6 workstation for the software and the hardware and the 7 scanners and the printers, and the phones and everything 8 included in setting up a new computer user. That ends up 9 being about $2,000 when I pare off the things that -- we 10 don't really need to have a scanner at every desk. But it 11 helps a lot; you don't have to have fax machines and $40, 12 $45-a-month phone lines. The -- the other projects, the Tax 13 Office, I discussed them at the previous meeting, if you want 14 me to go back over that again. I certainly reiterate them. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Let me see if I can push from a 16 different direction, John. You say 740 fixed. What is your 17 comfort zone with plugging you in for taking care of your 18 I.T. capital needs of 750,000 for three years? 19 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: That's a -- you have a reasonable 21 comfort zone with that? 22 MR. TROLINGER: I have a good number for three 23 years, yes. Four, I was concerned. Five, I just didn't -- I 24 don't think so. But I can't see what we're going to be doing 25 in five years. I don't know. I keep a rolling five-year -- 2-13-12 146 1 I've kept a rolling plan, master plan. I know in 2014, I've 2 got a few things on it, but beyond that, I just don't know. 3 I know that we need to have a regular desktop replacement. I 4 need to replace servers, and we need to accommodate the new 5 technology as it comes up. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And you mentioned desktop; 7 you mentioned laptop. 8 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But you haven't -- in my 10 opinion, you haven't talked about future, like iPad-type 11 things. 12 MR. TROLINGER: Okay. Well -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I know that's way expensive; 14 I understand that. But still, it's the things that are three 15 and five years out there, though. 16 MR. TROLINGER: Well, I've shied away from the 17 expensive tablets, because they are expensive, and if you 18 have one at home, you know that typically you have to have a 19 computer and a tablet, so it really doubles our expense -- 20 our cost. But in the courtrooms, you see us trying to use 21 the ThinkPad computers; they've got a keyboard and display 22 that's fairly compact, and the way that we're going with 23 that, I think that's the right direction for -- for Kerr 24 County. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What is that? 2-13-12 147 1 MR. TROLINGER: It's a small laptop. It's about 2 $750 when we load all the software and hardware to go with. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But it acts just like a pad? 4 Fold it up and throw it in your packet, and out the door? 5 MR. TROLINGER: It's not a touch screen, but it's a 6 useful -- it's a workstation. It's a tool that you can use. 7 If you had to, you could take it on the road and be able to 8 do all your work not tethered to another computer. Well, in 9 some cases, you are tethered to another computer, but it's 10 not required. The difficult plan on mobile devices for the 11 Sheriff's Office, we've looked at fingerprinting systems 12 that'll allow the deputies out in the field to -- to take a 13 fingerprint and match it against a warrant database, our 14 internal fingerprint database. That's -- the Sheriff's 15 working on a grant for the majority of that system, but I can 16 see two or three years from now that we'll need to have 17 devices in the hands of the deputies or his admin staff, 18 certainly the captains, where they can have mobile devices. 19 So, I budgeted for that as part of this; I put in 32 devices. 20 Fortunately, West Central Wireless, their staff has come out 21 with data -- with 3G data, so we just started a trial run on 22 two devices with that last month. So, that's part of the 23 future I'm looking at. Of course, we're putting wireless in 24 most of the facilities so that we can connect all these 25 devices to something. 2-13-12 148 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The fingerprint deal he's 2 talking about is the AFIS system. We already have received a 3 45,000 -- $47,000 grant for that. And those devices he's 4 talking about, the mobile ID, which are extremely important, 5 are part of that grant. That grant's not going to cost this 6 county. There's going to be probably four of those mobile 7 devices. The expense that the County will have, the only 8 thing I really needed John to plug into that is, each one of 9 those mobile devices has to be tied to a -- like, a 10 Blackberry phone that it brings back onto that device, so 11 that you don't have to have one in every car, and they just 12 move it with them. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: So, only the increase from a regular 14 cell phone to a Blackberry phone for integration with those 15 mobile devices, that would be the only increases? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Maybe four phones. That's the 17 only increase you're looking at. And then the City -- we're 18 trying to do this regional. We've had them involved in it 19 too. A couple of those devices may go to the city, but 20 they're going to have to have their own phones attached to 21 that, or if Ingram takes one, they'll have to. But the 22 county expense may be the reoccurring -- 23 JUDGE TINLEY: This is a joint grant with you and 24 the City? 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No. What this is, is a grant 2-13-12 149 1 that Clay applied for that we wanted from AACOG and that to 2 give us our own automated fingerprint identification system 3 that I've been trying to get for years. We were awarded that 4 grant. Right now, if you submit a fingerprint to D.P.S. to 5 the lab to get ID'd from a burglary scene, you're looking at 6 anywhere from six to eight months turnaround. That's how far 7 behind the lab is in Austin. This will give us our own 8 database that will do that fingerprint search locally. We're 9 trying -- we've got it large enough that Bandera, Kendall, 10 Gillespie, Junction, Real, and Edwards County will also be 11 able to submit all their fingerprints to that same system, 12 and it will ID and all that here within a matter of minutes, 13 instead of months, and it's all on a grant that has been 14 approved. 15 MR. TROLINGER: And it's great system, by the way. 16 We've looked at it a couple of times over the seven years 17 I've been here. The -- the idea behind that is, we need to 18 budget for these things, which can be between -- these 19 devices can be between $300 and $600 each. So, I put in as 20 -- I put that in along with the line item for laptops and -- 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So you'd be, like, really happy 22 with 800,000? 23 MR. TROLINGER: Well, 800,000 would probably get me 24 the beginnings of what's called a -- of what's called -- I'm 25 sorry. We are network-attached storage right now, and if we 2-13-12 150 1 go to a storage area network where we take basically all this 2 massive amount of data that we've scanned in and digitized, 3 and it allows me to safely and reliably back it up and -- and 4 have replication, that lets me start doing that. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: For four years? 6 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: You bought that fourth year cheap. 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Extra 12 months. 9 MR. TROLINGER: Well, I'd already looked at four 10 years, so I'm already -- I'm already at that point. But I'd 11 really like to put in the storage area network. I think with 12 the amount of data that we have -- and the County Attorney's 13 a good example. We put in storage for him for six terabytes, 14 which is just a lot of data. That's -- that's a lot. And to 15 be able to manage that, every night it's got to be backed up. 16 Three times a day, it's got a backup that takes place. And 17 the overhead of sitting there and trying to fix these 18 problems day to day, the management of the systems that I've 19 put in, that's -- it's become burdensome. So, that would 20 help quite a lot if I was at $800,000, yes. Thank you. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's pretty close to what -- 22 you've been spending how much a year, 200, 225 a year? 23 MR. TROLINGER: It's been up and down, but that 24 would be the average, yes, sir. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 2-13-12 151 1 MR. TROLINGER: And I've tried to normalize that, 2 so thanks a lot for -- I appreciate not having to, you know, 3 go through each one of these, and the trust that y'all put in 4 me to do that. Thank you very much. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, I want -- if we could go 6 back to the first page, the show barn, I think there's some 7 additional site expenditures that may not have been put in 8 those original numbers, and I think we're still working on 9 them. That is a -- a maximum number here. I think we ought 10 to put 100,000 back in there, at least in this phase, and 11 then we can back off of that once we actually have a number. 12 I don't want to be under here. 13 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Yeah. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I think the next couple 15 weeks, we'll figure out if that's -- exactly what that is 16 going to leave us, some of that site work out there and other 17 infrastructure costs. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: So, what you're suggesting is to 19 leave the exhibit hall where it is, and -- 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Put the show barn at 2 million. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: At 2 million, to cover 22 contingencies? 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Contingencies and site work, 24 infrastructure, utilities, things of that nature. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 2-13-12 152 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm hoping that won't be 2 needed, but -- 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What's he whining about? 4 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Jeannie, are we pretty certain 6 on the Center Point Wastewater, at 450, that number? 7 MS. HARGIS: That's what is in the application that 8 we put in. It was a million, seven, and I think 450 -- 450 9 is what's they mentioned at the meeting. Now, I haven't seen 10 it come back yet. We'll know a better number on that when we 11 get closer, but I can check with Keller to make sure. 12 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: We -- 13 MS. HARGIS: I'm almost positive -- 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: We potentially can get most 15 of that back; am I correct? Or some of it, potentially? 16 MS. HARGIS: If the EDAP comes in and pays for some 17 of it, we could. But they haven't -- they haven't agreed to 18 do that as of right now, that I know of. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, there's, you know, a 20 letter I got today which talks about part of the EDAP also. 21 I was confused by EDAP; they talked about it being 89/11. 89 22 percent -- 11 percent we'd be responsible for, which is a lot 23 lower number than I thought before, so I want to kind of 24 verify that figure. So -- 25 MS. HARGIS: They do another analysis? 2-13-12 153 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They've -- they finally 2 approved Chapter C of the EDAP, so it's part of the letter. 3 I just read it briefly, but some of that -- you know, 4 hopefully that's coming back. That really would help if we 5 can get part of that 450 back. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Does Constable, Precinct 4, remain 7 the same at 35? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yes, sir. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And Cade Loop, that's a fixed 11 number. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Cade Loop is a fixed number. 13 And I also got information from TexDOT saying that they're 14 going to build a -- we're still capped at 350, but instead of 15 a 24-foot, we're going to get a 28-foot-wide bridge which 16 will have room for pedestrians. 17 MS. HARGIS: Great. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Give the ability to maybe improve 19 some of that area down there that we just got. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: And they're going to build 21 it -- what he's proposing right now is building on the 22 upstream side, all in one piece, and then tear out the old 23 structure after he's through. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Good. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: If they can make the approach 2-13-12 154 1 work on the south side of the river. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That just happened this last 4 week. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I received word last week from 6 TexDOT that the Lazy Valley over Cypress Creek is probably a 7 go if we can get the right-of-way locked up by July. There 8 may be a little expenditure there, but I think we can 9 probably handle it. Then we have one property owner -- I 10 haven't visited with Rob; he may have to get involved with 11 one of the property owners. One of them doesn't see the 12 need. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Imagine that. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: One of your cousins? (Laughter.) 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's not going to be like the 16 one I had. 17 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: What is this? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, it's -- the gentleman 19 lives in North Carolina, and his sister lives in Canada, and 20 they don't see the need for a new bridge here because they 21 don't live here. And it's -- for those that may have known 22 Dr. Glen Lich, who was -- 23 JUDGE TINLEY: I knew Glen, sure. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's his children. I think 25 they own that property out there. So, I'm working with them, 2-13-12 155 1 but they don't seem very anxious to work with us. They're 2 trying to determine from North Carolina that that bridge 3 isn't needed. Anyway, there may be -- I think we can 4 probably work through with them, hopefully. It's only a 5 10-foot strip, is all we need from them. We can probably 6 realign further south and delete that completely. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I finally got my road 8 right-of-way issue at Flaming Arrow approved after two years. 9 They have finally agreed that they would give up the easement 10 to make the -- widen that approach so trucks can make that 11 turn off the bridge and onto the bridge. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Anyway, but that's -- it 13 shouldn't -- it'll be a small amount, if we have to do 14 anything. It can come out of his budget. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Are we pretty well through -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Condemnation. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Are we through here on these various 18 capital items, other than the Sheriff? I mean, because -- I 19 mean, does anybody want -- besides the Sheriff want to get 20 that back in the -- okay. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Get what back in? 22 JUDGE TINLEY: The jail. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I think it's an 24 interesting debate, between constitutional offices and wish 25 list. 2-13-12 156 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The number -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's a good conversation, I 3 think. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The number in here, I see an 5 $8 million and a $1 million. 6 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. I didn't change it, because I 7 didn't have -- I didn't get a proposal; I had to give it to 8 Tom. I think it was three million, 336, or something like 9 that. I didn't put it in, because I didn't want to assume 10 anything. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just want to get through 12 the Wednesday sandwich thing, and then -- 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Then we'll come back and revisit. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Then we'll talk seriously 15 about the amount. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: You may get a better sandwich on 17 Wednesday if we just hold fast where we are now. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I think so. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Bigger incentive to get you on 20 board. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's exactly right. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, I'm with you. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 48 was three -- three, six. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, I saw your yellow tablet 25 over there. Do you have a new total for us? 2-13-12 157 1 JUDGE TINLEY: No, I don't, but I can do one if 2 you'll give me just a few minutes. Well, I say I can. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That calculator's about as 4 bad as Jon's pocketknife; need to get you a little bit bigger 5 one. 6 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 7 JUDGE TINLEY: I got $6,078,500. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 6,078,000? 9 JUDGE TINLEY: 6,078,500. That's what I get. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So -- 11 MS. HARGIS: Where'd you get -- you got six? I 12 didn't get six. Six million, what? What did you get? 13 JUDGE TINLEY: $6,078,500. 14 MS. HARGIS: Oh, I didn't add those. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: On the jail, I mean, just kind 16 of where I am on the jail -- I'll bring it up again; I know 17 Rusty will if I don't. I don't -- I'm not convinced to do it 18 right now. And, you know, from when the financial adviser 19 was here, the only risk, really, in waiting -- it doesn't 20 change anything -- a couple years, and really look at it and 21 try to tackle some of these others problems, is if interest 22 rates go up. I mean, that's the only -- 23 JUDGE TINLEY: And/or construction costs. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. But, I mean, that's 25 the -- the risk. And I just -- you know, I'm just not quite 2-13-12 158 1 there yet, personally. I'd like to look at it a little bit 2 more. 3 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I would agree with you. 4 That's kind of where I'm -- I'm at right now, is we need to 5 look at a little bit more of our options to see -- I hear 6 what's going on. The report that you gave last time was very 7 informative and very -- understanding the difference between 8 minimum and medium, medium and max. There's no doubt about 9 it, that -- that we're going to have to look at a facility 10 down the road. There's no doubt about that with state cuts 11 that are coming, more of the issues that we're having, that 12 we're facing in our communities today. But I also like what 13 Commissioner Letz says; there's a lot of, still, things I 14 want to -- to still, you know, look at what some of our 15 options are and what we're needing to look at as far as the 16 Court's concerned, and that's kind of where I feel right now 17 about the same thing. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: This Court has the final 19 decision. The only thing that I would caution you on, is 20 we're at 26 females now, gentlemen. We're going to be 21 housing out of county if we wait. If we wait a year, two 22 years, three years, we will be spending our tax dollars in 23 another county. If we start on it, with the costs the way 24 they are, okay, at this time, construction or otherwise, it 25 does still give us the leeway -- Judge Tinley and the Auditor 2-13-12 159 1 can say this -- can tell at that point it is now to where 2 we're having to use it totally for our own. The County can 3 currently assist Fredericksburg and make back that money. 4 You're going to be spending a lot of it. We were bringing in 5 over half a million there for a while per year, until I got 6 too crowded then. You know, I can't say how long that could 7 last because of our situation with our females, but when 8 you're talking construction costs and you're talking needs, 9 okay, I first came to this Court in 2005 with the need, and 10 we put it off. We went through this same thing. 11 And I would just -- you know, I'm going to abide by 12 it, go with whatever the Court decides, but I'm just saying 13 it can't be put off, and keep being put off and being put 14 off. The first time was 2002, that facility needs. Y'all 15 looked at 2005; the Jail Commission did one. We did another 16 one in 2011, and went through architects in 2005, and -- 17 because I understand nobody wants to spend money on jails. 18 But the thing I have to look at, you have to spend money on 19 public safety, and we are mandated to provide that jail, and 20 we have to provide, quote, a "safe and suitable jail." And 21 the reason the funding has -- some of the debt service has 22 come available now is because of that jail, because the debt 23 on the jail has been paid off. The purpose at that time, 24 back when this Court went with it, was so that we could get 25 it paid off before we had to add on. You accomplished 2-13-12 160 1 everything, and now we're going backwards on that. And there 2 are some issues, I think we're going to start shipping money 3 to other counties, and we're not going to have that many 4 options. Gillespie County is using Comanche, Texas. If you 5 want to see employee costs go up, let us start shipping 6 inmates to Comanche, Texas, 'cause I don't have that 7 manpower. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Ms. Auditor, can you go over -- 9 what would the -- I guess, the maximum numbers that 10 Mr. Henderson said, you know, the 10 million? 9 million? 11 What was the total number that he said we could afford to do? 12 Do you remember? 13 MS. HARGIS: No, I don't. I think it was more than 14 seven. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 16 MS. HARGIS: Between seven and nine. But he really 17 hadn't put total pencil to it; he was just doing an estimate. 18 You know, I think we might want to look at different ways of 19 doing this issue than just a straight C.O. If we break it 20 down in smaller issues, it's easier to set, rather than -- 21 you know, you can still do the C.O.'s, but you phase them -- 22 that's what the City did. The reason they did that is 23 because they got a better -- they got a better rate of 24 interest on it. You know, we have the 2016 issue, and that's 25 just -- you know, we can't refund that issue. We've got a 2-13-12 161 1 little bit of leeway; we can push some of this out, but what 2 we're going to end up doing is paying real small interest 3 payments on those first four years. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: That cap that the financial adviser 6 talked about, that was on a shorter-term amortization, wasn't 7 it? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It was. The longer -- the 9 longer term where the -- the stuff that -- the cars and 10 computers and all that Road and Bridge stuff, all that was 11 going to mature early and pay off early, and then that would 12 be, like, a 5- to 7-year note, and then -- 5-year, I believe, 13 and then the longer -- if we decide to do the jail and the Ag 14 Barn project, those would be over 20. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. Those would be the latter 16 portion of the longer-term maturity. 17 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Right. 18 MS. HARGIS: Just have a call date on there. We'd 19 refund that issue, and then take the rest of them out. You 20 can call a portion of an issue and leave the remainder, and 21 have actually two issues, and that's probably what we would 22 do. We'd call it, pay off this portion, and leave the other 23 intact. You can make your coupons where they're just a few 24 of them callable, or all of them callable. I mean, there's 25 just so many different ways of doing it, but the main thing 2-13-12 162 1 was that you wanted to have 2017 and 2018 to pay off the 2 short-term items. Road and Bridge, if you think about it, 3 most of these items are really long-term, the big-ticket 4 items. Center Point is a long-term item. The bridge is 5 long-term. The barn -- the exhibit center is long-term. And 6 then if we did the jail, that's long-term. So, most of the 7 items are long-term. 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Right. 9 MS. HARGIS: So we should be able to pay off most 10 of the short-term -- it may take three years. 11 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: So, your first interest 12 payment on that would be 2014? 2013? 13 MS. HARRIS: It depends on when we sell it. We can 14 push it -- generally, you can push it a year. 15 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: So you could go to 2014? 16 MS. HARGIS: This is 2012; we'd be pushing it to go 17 2014. We could do it late 2013, but I think we'd be pushing 18 it to go to 2014. The most I've seen them pushed is 18 19 months. And you would -- you can do a real small payment in 20 2013, and then make the next payment in 2014 a little bit 21 bigger. But our real margin of being able to pay it is in 22 2013. 2013, it drops the lowest; then it goes back up. So, 23 in 2013, it drops down to a million, one -- a million, 135, I 24 think, and then it goes from one million, two, and then one 25 million, 236, so it kind of levels. So, that's kind of where 2-13-12 163 1 we're at. And we still have one more of that 2010 issue next 2 year -- not 2010, 2008. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, is it going to be better -- 4 I mean, my quick math is basically 2,675,000 that's not 5 long-term. 6 MS. HARGIS: Right. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Pretty close to that. 8 MS. HARGIS: We ought to be able to pay that off 9 probably in your -- I would -- in your -- in two years. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. So, does it make sense 11 to do three issues, then do one for the -- I guess to do that 12 by itself, or that and the Ag Barn together, and then come 13 back with the jail later? 14 MS. HARGIS: I don't know. That's what I'd like to 15 sit down and work with him on. We haven't really sat down 16 and looked at it because we didn't have a number, and that's 17 why I didn't have Bob come today. We need a number so we can 18 sit down and -- and play the different types of scenarios and 19 bring them back to you. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Hargis needs to have an 21 opportunity to get with Mr. Henderson and look at all the 22 potential available options, and run through each one of 23 those scenarios and structure them as to whether or not it 24 will fit within what we have outstanding now, and still 25 properly amortize the short-term stuff, roll the long-term 2-13-12 164 1 stuff, figure in the call dates and so forth. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think I kind of look at it as 3 three components; the short-term, the jail, and then the 4 other long-term capital. 5 MS. HARGIS: We just don't -- as Commissioner 6 Oehler said, we don't want to put you in a box. That's why 7 we need to really think this through. So, we need to look 8 at, is it better to do a C.O, and then maybe have a call date 9 out -- maybe not five years; maybe it needs to be six years 10 when we're totally out of it, and then have the call date 11 come that year, and pay off maybe part of them, and then 12 another call date the following year. There's all kinds of 13 ways to structure it, but until we sit down and look at it to 14 see -- and then potential growth is going to make a huge 15 difference. I mean, what we brought on today will help us to 16 do this a little faster than we anticipated. And the more 17 businesses, the more sales tax that we put on. The sales tax 18 we really need on the M & O side, but the more value we get 19 -- even at 50 percent, as he said, that's more value than we 20 were getting before. So -- and then with more employees 21 coming to town, perhaps they'll buy more houses, and, you 22 know, it will be a ripple effect. But it's real hard to see, 23 with the flatness of the economy right now, where we're going 24 as far as growth, so that makes this whole scenario a little 25 bit harder, because we're going to have to look at it with 2-13-12 165 1 flat growth. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think the -- I mean, I think 3 one of the things, we need to look at a jail component in the 4 relatively short-term horizon. I mean, I don't think we can 5 just forget about that. It's got to be -- it's got to be 6 included in the picture. It's just whether we pull the 7 trigger on that part right now or not, in my mind. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: This would be one of several options 9 that she would work through with the financial adviser on the 10 various options we have, and plugging that into some of the 11 various models that they're -- we want to look at it from all 12 angles. 13 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. Bob and I talk about it from 14 time to time. I mean, we used some hypothetical, but at this 15 point, the amount was still pretty high. We're still -- even 16 if we add the jail in the future, we're still looking at 17 close to $10 million here. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's really -- I don't -- we 20 can't not look at the jail, and be boxed in for five years. 21 We have to figure that at some point, it's going to have to 22 happen. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's got to be figured. We 24 got to plan for it now, see how it fits into the payoff. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 2-13-12 166 1 MS. HARGIS: And that's what he's been doing all 2 along. He's been planning for the jail every time we do an 3 issue. But we had thought we could wait till 2015, and 4 that's kind of the way he had it planned. So, 2015, two 5 years to build. And, see, that would have put us right where 6 we would have been. But -- 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I guess we've kind of settled 8 on a number here that we're somewhat comfortable with as far 9 as all the other capital items? 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I think we've -- we've given 11 the various departments an opportunity to really take a close 12 look at their situation, and some of them obviously would 13 like more. Some of them got more, and -- but I think we've 14 pretty well gone through the needs on the short term, at 15 least. I say "short term"; three to five. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Well, should we have them 17 look at this and then look at the jail issue and how all that 18 -- and how this could be mixed and matched with the 19 long-term, which would be the jail and also the Ag Barn? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, yeah. They can -- they can 21 put it all in there, and they can -- they can structure it on 22 a tiered basis, or they can structure it on individual 23 issues. You try and stay away from individual issues because 24 of the cost of issuance, but sometimes, depending upon the 25 rate for short-term and the higher rate for longer-term, 2-13-12 167 1 sometimes it may be better to -- you know, those are some of 2 the things they're going to have to look at. But run through 3 all the various options. Bob has programs that he can 4 squeeze this stuff through, and -- and really massage these 5 figures with the calls and everything plugged into it. 6 MS. HARGIS: But we want to be sure this time we 7 have enough call dates that it doesn't put you in a pickle. 8 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: The options. 9 MS. HARGIS: And we need the options. If that 10 means in -- in '17, '18, and '19, you have a call date, that 11 gives you the option. And to start, put that for 20 years. 12 The 20-year option is a great option on the long-term items, 13 but I don't think you really want to be paying 20 years on -- 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh, no. 15 MS. HARGIS: -- on the others. But -- 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Horrible. 17 MS. HARGIS: But what you might want to do is -- is 18 take the long-term ones out with the smaller payment, and 19 have the availability of not maybe paying all of it off, but 20 enough that it gives you enough to sell another issue in 21 between. You're going to have to be kind of balancing, and 22 keeping that -- your debt rate at a constant. If you had a 23 lot of growth or, you know, even growing, say, 3 percent a 24 year, it would be real easy to take this out. That's our 25 biggest problem. 2-13-12 168 1 JUDGE TINLEY: But you can't assume you're going to 2 have that. 3 MS. HARGIS: Hmm-mm. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: And he's not going to let you do it, 6 either. 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No, I wouldn't expect for him 8 to. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Because he knows if you're going to 10 the marketplace, they're not going to let you do it without 11 being able to see -- 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: No. 13 MS. HARGIS: No. And in all the issues that we've 14 done since I've been here, we've really projected -- I think 15 one, we did 1 percent, but the last two have been flat. 16 'Cause you have to be fairly careful when you go out to the 17 market. If we do grow, that's great, but you don't want to 18 predict something. Can we go over these figures, just so 19 that I make sure? The only one that I'm not sure of is the 20 Road and Bridge. Was Road and Bridge eight, or was it 850? 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 850, is what I have. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: 850. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 850. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Plus, you don't get anything back 25 from the salvage; he gets that to utilize for his capital 2-13-12 169 1 needs. 2 MS. HARGIS: Okay. And then I.T. was eight. The 3 Sheriff's Office, 500 for cars, 375 for radio. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: 875? Sure you don't want to round 5 that off to an even million? 6 MS. HARGIS: No. Juvenile Detention, 100. 47 for 7 Maintenance, 16,5 for Environmental Health, 30,000 for Animal 8 Control, and then 35,000 for Constable. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: And then, of course, you got 10 2 million, show barn; 500, county portion of Exhibit Hall; 11 450, Center Point Wastewater; 25, Kerrville South; 350, Cade 12 Loop Bridge. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Three million, 325. 14 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Page 1. 15 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, there's one other issue, 17 gentlemen, that doesn't pertain to the Sheriff's Office. 18 Judge Tinley will -- will know what this one is, talking 19 about the elections coming up. I know one of the -- in the 20 D.A.'s office, they're talking about having to come get the 21 rest of that annex out there completed to move in a D.A.'s 22 office. So, there will not be an office for the D.A. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: I've not talked to anybody about 24 that. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But I'm just saying, you know, 2-13-12 170 1 the building portion is what they're saying won't be there. 2 And the rest of that unexpanded area where you'd have to put 3 in restrooms, walls thereafter can be done in-house with 4 Tim's crew and my work crews out there, but we're -- there 5 would probably be some expense. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Sure. You're going to have 7 electrical, plumbing, and that sort of thing. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Electric and plumbing. But I 9 don't know what one D.A. -- but the other D.A. has already 10 said that that's where they'd have to go with the D.A.'s 11 office, 'cause they wouldn't have one unless y'all rented 12 something else out. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: First I've heard about that, but -- 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's why I thought it ought 15 to be said in this, because that's a big possibility. 16 MR. TROLINGER: Judge Tinley, I anticipated those 17 costs for I.T. I kind of see it coming, just having to build 18 out that space, so computers and whatnot, and I.T. running 19 the wire. We've got a handle on it. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Is it a big secret which D.A. might 21 be looking at -- 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, I don't mind telling you 23 what I've heard, because the building where you're renting 24 for 198th currently, I think, is owned by the current D.A. 25 who is leaving that office. So, the new D.A. would not 2-13-12 171 1 necessarily have a 198th D.A.'s office. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Takes up one side of it. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't know what the other 6 side -- I have no idea. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll leave that as a fitness area, 8 right? 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes, the other side is a 10 fitness area. Okay. I mean, we have in that unexpanded -- 11 'cause you built for the future and that. There are a couple 12 of, you know, vacant offices in there. I don't have a 13 problem, but it's just that unexpanded area, I don't know 14 what the situation with the District Attorney's office is 15 going to be. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Appreciate that, Sheriff. 17 MS. HARGIS: So, eight -- 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Big enough for females to go 19 in there out of the jail? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: What? 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Is it big enough to make 22 cells for eight females? 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Just make personal trainers out of 24 them. I'm sure they would love to be personal trainers, see 25 how much they could whip up on you. Good training for S.O. 2-13-12 172 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I think it would be good 2 training for Rusty, actually. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You just -- 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Ms. Hargis, I think you've got some 5 homework to do with the financial adviser. 6 MS. HARGIS: I do. And there -- you know, we need 7 to look at cost of issuance. It's not great, but with the 8 size of issue it's going to be... 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 10 MS. HARGIS: So, do we want to wait on putting a 11 number out there till we kind of see what it's going to cost, 12 and then go out there? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, I think -- I don't see 14 any point in putting a number out until we know how we're 15 going to structure it. 16 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And what we're going to 18 structure. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: What it is, and how much it is. We 20 need to know both of those, or how many there are. 21 MS. HARGIS: I agree. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 23 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. 24 (Discussion off the record.) 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, let me see. On 24, then, 2-13-12 173 1 we're going to pass on that one, right? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I believe so. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. We got anything more 4 on 23, gentlemen? Okay. I show that we are down to the tail 5 end. Section 4, payment of bills. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move we pay the bills. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to pay the 9 bills. Question or discussion? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've got a question. It's 11 just -- it's just the print, I think. On Page 2, the last 12 heading down there, what does that say? 13 MS. HARGIS: The last item? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The last -- yes, ma'am, the 15 last department head or heading, or however -- look here. 16 MS. HARGIS: 216th Court. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, that one. 18 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is it the 216th District 20 Court, or is it the Kerr County Treasurer? 21 MS. HARGIS: It's the 216th District Court. What 22 we do is, this is moving money to the Treasurer's office, and 23 then we change it to Fund 83, which is the District Court's 24 fund that we use. We do it quarterly; we move the funds from 25 our budget to the other fund. That's basically -- that's 2-13-12 174 1 really all that's doing. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. The same thing on the 3 next page, the last one. Is that -- 4 MS. HARGIS: 436 should be the same, yes. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 436, all right. You're 6 leaving me behind here. 436 -- 7 MS. HARGIS: 436 is the 198th. Department 436 is 8 198th. Department 435 is the 216th. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. Now, tell me what 10 that is again so I'll know. And, of course, it's the same 11 thing on the next page; 198th District Attorney, Kerr County 12 Treasurer. 13 MS. HARGIS: We pay the district court bills out of 14 Fund 83, and so what we do is, on a quarterly basis, we move 15 one-quarter of the budget that we have into that -- into that 16 fund. Because they have other counties paying them as well, 17 and so we move our portion -- Kerr County's portion into that 18 fund. They have a separate set of books, more or less, for 19 them. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. I've been here 20 21 years; first time I've ever seen that. 22 MS. HARGIS: We did it last year and the year 23 before. Mindy just did it all at one time. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That almost makes sense. 25 Almost. 2-13-12 175 1 MS. HARGIS: Well, but it was making the judges not 2 understand, so we started doing it quarterly. They asked for 3 it to be done quarterly. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What judges? 5 MS. HARGIS: The District Judges, so they can 6 understand their budget. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You know what? I'm the one 8 that has to read this thing and vote on it. It's not them. 9 So, to me, that's confusing. But that's just me. All right. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Any other questions or comments? 11 All in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 12 hand. 13 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 14 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 15 (No response.) 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion does carry. Budget 17 amendments. I've been presented with Budget Amendment 18 Requests Numbers 1 through 10, dated 13 February 2012. Do I 19 hear a motion that the budget amendments as requested in the 20 summary be approved as submitted? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So moved. 22 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: I'll second. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded for 24 approval of the budget amendment requests as submitted in the 25 budget amendment requests. Question or discussion? All in 2-13-12 176 1 favor, signify by raising your right hand. 2 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 4 (No response.) 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. Late bills. We've 6 got three of them, it looks like. Judge Robert Barton, 7 Extreme Outfitters, Regional Public Defender. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge Barton and Extreme 9 Outfitters? 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Wonder what kind of extreme outfit 11 you're getting. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That is pretty funny, 13 though, isn't it? 14 MS. HARGIS: That's actually a grill guard for the 15 truck. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: For who? 17 MS. HARGIS: For Environmental's truck. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: I thought they were running over you 19 from the rear. (Laughter.) 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Driving backwards. 21 MS. HARGIS: He wanted one on either end. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. Might need one. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move we pay the late bills. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: I hear a motion to pay the late 25 bills. 2-13-12 177 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Second. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: And second. Any question or 3 discussion? All in favor, signify by raising your right 4 hand. 5 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 6 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 7 (No response.) 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion carries. 9 MS. HARGIS: Judge, just one thing. I just wanted 10 to point out to y'all that we are now using that Regional 11 Public Defender's Office. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Let's see, where'd I 13 see that the other day? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, what you saw was on the 15 indictment of that young man who was 17 at the time of the 16 offense, for whom capital punishment may not be imposed. 17 They declined to defend that case because the death penalty 18 was not an option. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I guess that's where I 20 saw it. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. So, it's on our nickel. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: We have two that they are 23 covering in jail, and what was the other one? 24 JUDGE TINLEY: This was the Ingram case on the baby 25 death. 2-13-12 178 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Oh, they declined that one. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, because the -- because the 3 defendant was less than 17 years old at the time -- or was 17 4 at the time of the commission of the offense, and therefore, 5 death penalty option was not available. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: At 17? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: So it's no longer -- 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But they do still have one 9 pending. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, yeah. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That they are defending. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. I have been presented with 13 monthly reports from Kerr County Payroll for January 2012; 14 District Clerk, Amended, December 2011; District Clerk for 15 January 2012; Constable, Precinct 1; County Clerk for January 16 2012; Justice of the Peace 2 for January 2012; Justice of the 17 Peace 3 for January 2012; and Environmental Health Department 18 for January 2012; Constable, Precinct 4. Do I hear a motion 19 that the indicated monthly reports be approved as presented? 20 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Motion to approve. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Motion made and seconded to approve 23 the indicated reports. Question or discussion? All in 24 favor, signify by raising your right hand. 25 (The motion carried by unanimous vote.) 2-13-12 179 1 JUDGE TINLEY: All opposed, same sign. 2 (No response.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: That motion does carry. Reports 4 from Commissioners in connection with their committee or 5 liaison assignments? Commissioner Baldwin? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir. Everything I do is 7 confidential. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. Commissioner Overby? 9 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Judge, just one. We'll be 10 having a report from Dean Danos, our AACOG Executive Director 11 will be coming. I'm anticipating him in early March to come 12 give a presentation on the ART, on our transportation here in 13 Kerr County, just to let you know that we have approximately 14 1,300 to 1,600 trips that they provide on a monthly basis for 15 our folks who need that type of service, the transportation, 16 that can't get around. But one of the things that he'll be 17 talking about will be anticipating state budget cuts that are 18 coming with that program, and he'll be giving us an update on 19 that program, on how it will be going next year. And so, 20 just to let you know it will be coming. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Anything else? 22 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's it. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: You got anything for us, 24 Commissioner Letz? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just mainly for Commissioner 2-13-12 180 1 Baldwin. Here's the 2012 State Water Plan, so if anyone 2 wants to get boned up on it, there's a copy in my office. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'd like to take that when 4 you get through. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Running short at the house? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That was a campaign speech. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. Okay. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Incidentally, there -- an issue 9 that will become pretty clear is that the next Legislature's 10 going to be tackling funding this plan as one of their top 11 items, for a lot of different reasons. Obviously, mainly the 12 recent drought. So -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That will be one of those 14 S.B. 1 things. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. We need to keep an eye 16 on it, because the funding mechanisms are going to hit 17 everybody. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And it's things from putting 20 them on electric bills -- or putting a surcharge on 21 everyone's electric bills in the state to charging for all 22 water -- putting a surcharge on all the water. You know, and 23 lots of different things are being talked about, but what is 24 pretty clear, both from the Water Development Board and some 25 other people I've been visiting, is that it's going to be an 2-13-12 181 1 item as to they've got to figure out how to fund it, and they 2 haven't figured that out yet. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: They just need to get a piece of 4 Aqua Texas action, don't they? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what it sounds like 6 to me. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sounds like they're getting 8 ready to. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: They went to school on them, didn't 10 they? 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. That's how this works? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's it. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Commissioner Oehler? 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not necessarily. I gave a 15 report on Animal Control this morning. And, of course, we 16 continue to work with the Ag Barn issue, and that will 17 probably continue. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Elected officials? 19 Department heads? 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Rusty doesn't get a turn. 21 MR. HENNEKE: Briefly, gentlemen, two things. 22 First of all, I congratulate Commissioner Baldwin for his 23 recognition in today's Daily Times as one of the 100 top 24 athletes -- Tivy football athletes to -- 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Buster? 2-13-12 182 1 MR. HENNEKE: Yeah, look at the newspaper. 2 Commissioner Baldwin was named one of the top 100 Tivy Antler 3 football player greats of the history of Tivy football. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Where does this get me? 5 Does that get me anything? 6 MR. HENNEKE: Congratulations. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Mark, you know I care for 8 you deeply. (Laughter.) I was thinking more along the lines 9 of hugging. 10 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Who came in number one? 11 MR. HENNEKE: It's not ranked, but you could make 12 your own ranking, I'm sure. 13 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: Just listed them all? 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Of course, we will at my 15 house. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: You've already done it, right? 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 18 MR. HENNEKE: The other thing I'd mention is, 19 congratulations to you all. Driving out to Center Point on 20 Saturday, the basketball goals that Tim and his maintenance 21 crew put up look great, and about 5:00, 5:30 on Saturday, 22 there were a dozen kids in the county park there on the river 23 playing basketball. The whole court was full, and at the 24 Lion's Club dinner, several folks there thanked the County 25 for having those put up. And they're being -- they're being 2-13-12 183 1 used. Looks great. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Can we charge those kids for 3 using them? 4 MR. BOLLIER: Taking care of you, right? 5 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: That's right. Tim did a good 6 job with those improvements. I'm glad you brought that up, 7 'cause he -- 8 JUDGE TINLEY: And they're using them. 9 COMMISSIONER OVERBY: They're using them; they had 10 14 or 15 kids out there playing. And, you know, the rims we 11 placed out there had been up there for years. There was no 12 more -- you couldn't attach anything any more; they were all 13 gone, so you had no choice. I mean, they replaced them. So, 14 it's good to see that park's being used and they're enjoying 15 it. Appreciate you bringing that up. 16 MR. HENNEKE: Sure. Thank you. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, anybody else? Speak now or 18 forever hold your peace. We're adjourned. 19 (Commissioners Court was adjourned at 2:50 p.m.) 20 - - - - - - - - - - 21 22 23 24 25 2-13-12 184 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 official reporter for the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 21st day of February, 8 2012. 9 10 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 11 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 12 Certified Shorthand Reporter 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 2-13-12