1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Budget Workshop 10 Monday, July 8, 2013 11 1:30 p.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: PAT TINLEY, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 TOM MOSER, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BRUCE OEHLER, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X July 8, 203 2 PAGE 3 1. Review and discuss FY 2013-14 individual department budgets, including requests for 4 additional personnel 3 5 2. Review and discuss FY 2013-14 employee insurance programs, including group employee health benefits 6 and voluntary supplemental insurance programs; TCDRS elections 63 7 -- Adjourned 80 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 3 1 On Monday, July 8, 2013, at 1:30 p.m., a budget 2 workshop of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Good afternoon, ladies and 8 gentlemen. Let me call to order this Commissioners Court 9 workshop scheduled for Monday, July 8th, 2013, at 1:30 p.m. 10 It's a bit past that time now. The first item is to review 11 and discuss fiscal year 2013-14 individual department 12 budgets, including requests for additional personnel. Now, 13 initially, each of you that had a department budget submitted 14 what your requests were. Subsequent to that, those of us 15 that mess with it, being the Auditor's office and myself, we 16 may have gone in and made some adjustments. We may not have. 17 If we made adjustments, it was probably because, in looking 18 at your spending history and things of that nature, we 19 thought it was probably too high. I'm not sure there was any 20 of them we thought maybe were too low. Maybe there were a 21 few. But adjustments were made. And I'm operating on the 22 premise that each of you has gone back in and looked at your 23 budget as it has been adjusted. Now, if you've not done 24 that, you need to do that. 25 Now, the individual department budgets that we want 7-8-13 bwk 4 1 to talk about today exclude salaries, exclude capital, but 2 will include requests for additional personnel. If one of 3 the adjustments we've made is something that you don't feel 4 like you can live with, this is what we want to hear about 5 today. But we don't want to go through everybody's 6 individual budget line item by line item; only if there are 7 some particular items in your budget that we've adjusted from 8 your request that you don't feel are appropriate, those are 9 the ones we want to hear about. Okay? Those are the ground 10 rules. So, everybody that's computerized, you're set up to 11 be able to -- 12 MS. HARGIS: Those of you who have the computers, 13 you have an e-mail from Jennifer Doss. If you'll open the 14 e-mail. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: When was the e-mail sent? 16 MS. HARGIS: About 1 o'clock. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't have it. 18 MS. HARGIS: It said you received it. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: She's in here. 20 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Do we have the summary -- can 22 you get the summary up top? 23 MS. HARGIS: No, I don't have that. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Well, fine. Well, this is 25 mainly for the Court. Meanwhile, while we're trying to get 7-8-13 bwk 5 1 that, let's look at the summary as it exists right now. 2 That's the one-page document that was passed out just a 3 moment ago, and it shows our estimated fund balances at the 4 end of the year, estimated tax revenue, estimated non-tax 5 revenue, expenditures. Those expenditures are per what's 6 plugged into the budget right now. So, those would give us 7 in the general fund slightly more than 25 percent reserve at 8 the end of the day, considering all -- again, it's almost 26 9 percent. Road and Bridge is at 15.8. I show an estimated 10 fund balance at the end of the year going into -- at the end 11 of this year going into next year of 530,000 in your 12 operating account. At the end of the year, estimated fund 13 balance of 460,000. Now, I know Leonard has told me in the 14 past that he'd like to have somewhere around 500,000 as a 15 reserve, and I think this is pretty much in keeping with 16 that. Is that something you think you can live with like 17 this, Leonard? 18 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir, I think that -- that's fine. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. Everybody on the same 20 page here? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, but -- 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Not there yet? Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mr. Trolinger, there's a 24 computer problem. 25 MR. TROLINGER: It's Monday. What else? 7-8-13 bwk 6 1 MS. HARGIS: It's an e-mail you received about 2 1:00. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Any way to speed up e-mail? 4 MS. HARGIS: 12:30. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: From Ms. Doss. She's a very 6 nice person. 7 MR. TROLINGER: Wow, 5,000 -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You tell me not to delete 9 anything. I never wipe anything out. Records retention. 10 MR. TROLINGER: Looks like everything you've been 11 sent has been received. I don't see you waiting for 12 anything. 13 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 14 MS. HARGIS: We've got them printing for those two 15 of you do that don't have a printed copy. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think I'm okay. 17 MS. HARGIS: Could I ask where y'all printed yours 18 from? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, ma'am, you may not. 20 (Laughter.) 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You can ask, but you're not 22 going to get an answer. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Confidential information. 24 MS. HARGIS: I just want to make sure you have the 25 same copy. 7-8-13 bwk 7 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It better be. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Is there any -- I don't think we 3 need to go into the annual revenue items right now. 4 MS. HARGIS: No, we're still -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can get started. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: The -- the first budget is the 7 County Judge, and there's about three or four of those in 8 there. One of them is shown under the County Judge as 9 Commissioners Court. Anybody on the Court have any heartburn 10 about what's in there now? 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I imagine if we look at it 12 just a minute, we can find some. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, let's move on, then. 14 (Laughter.) 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did you desire to hear 16 gnashing of teeth? 17 JUDGE TINLEY: No, I don't desire to hear it. I 18 can move through very quickly, if you like. County Clerk, 19 and that's going to include her records budgets and so forth; 20 her records management, records archival. County Clerk's 21 okay, I guess. How about Information Technology? 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think we need one. I like 23 them; they do a good job. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: You good with the nuts and bolts in 25 your budget as we've adjusted it? 7-8-13 bwk 8 1 MR. TROLINGER: I went and looked through, and I 2 didn't see any major deviations from my requested, so it 3 looks pretty good, Judge. Thank you. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. County Court at Law? 5 MS. HARGIS: You might want to point out that 6 change there. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Oh, yeah. We've -- part of the 8 problem is, we've -- our budget this year took a hit because 9 of legislation which increased the District Judges' salaries, 10 which automatically required that the County Court at Law 11 salary be increased by -- 15,000, wasn't it? 12 MS. HARGIS: 17,000. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: 17. And so -- 14 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That explains that. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: This year had to be funded right now 16 out of this year's budget, because that starts in September 17 on the state budget. That's going to affect the ongoing 18 budget. That's a major change there. I assume no one has a 19 problem with that. The Court Compliance? 20 MS. HARGIS: Judge, let's let the other two get 21 caught up. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Say again? 23 MS. HARGIS: Let's let them get to the right page. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: I can't tell you a page number, 25 'cause I don't have one, gentlemen. 7-8-13 bwk 9 1 MS. HARGIS: There's not a page number because we 2 weren't going to print them. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: You're there. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, I'm quick. Few years 5 practice. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Faster than a speeding bullet. 7 Crime Victims? I got word from Rosa; we've made one small 8 adjustment in some -- 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, go back to Court 10 Compliance. I just want to ask you a question to make sure 11 that I'm seeing things properly. Now, what is today's -- 12 let's just take the top one, the assistant salary. What 13 is -- this budget that we're in right now, what is the 14 salary? 15 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 34,051, I think. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Looks like, yeah. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. And so it's decreased 18 from this year to next year? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I suspect it's probably a 20 payroll every two weeks now versus monthly. 21 MS. HARGIS: No, it's taken back to Step 1. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh, really? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Going to have a new 24 employee? 25 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 7-8-13 bwk 10 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Step 1. Grade -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, it's the current budget 3 and proposed budget. I see it, okay. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, then why is the second 5 one different? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, because that's the one still 7 there. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Step increase automatic or 9 something? 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 11 MS. HARGIS: No, the step -- the step increases -- 12 that employee was there for several years, so we have -- the 13 Court usually starts a new employee at the -- at Step 1. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. What about the -- 15 what about the collector, though? 16 MS. HARGIS: The collector's is exactly the same as 17 it had been. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is? 19 MS. HARGIS: She may have a longevity in there. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's what I'm saying. That's 21 a -- that must be it. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Longevity. 23 MS. HARGIS: There's probably a longevity from last 24 year. We didn't change that. We haven't changed any of the 25 salaries, except if we knew they were going to Step 1 because 7-8-13 bwk 11 1 the space was empty, we changed them. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I understand that. 3 MS. HARGIS: Or if there's longevity, we changed 4 it. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, about the -- about $200 6 a year would be a longevity increase? 7 MS. HARGIS: Depends on when it was. Like, mine is 8 July, so I only get three months of one year. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 10 MS. HARGIS: It's on your anniversary date. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see, okay. I hope I don't 12 have to commit suicide over this, or get drunk, either one. 13 Same thing. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: I got a gun here and some whiskey 15 over here. Which one do you want? Okay. You through there? 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. Thank you. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Crime Victims? That's 18 grant-funded. District Judges? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I know a couple of them. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 21 MS. HARGIS: Okay. Those have also changed with 22 the legislation. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, because of the increase in 24 salary. We had to pick up some of the -- not only did the 25 salary change, but the -- 7-8-13 bwk 12 1 MS. HARGIS: Supplements. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: -- the court's composition of the 3 counties included, and that changed our level of contribution 4 in both 198th and 216th. 5 MS. HARGIS: And we do have to begin paying those 6 new supplements as of September 1. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. So, it's going to affect our 8 this-year's budget too, but we just have to make that happen. 9 MS. HARGIS: A.G.'s opinion on that one. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And, of course -- 11 MS. HARGIS: We have to pay them. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This doesn't count the other 13 counties that they operate under? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: No, it doesn't. This is the impact 15 to Kerr County only. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Impact to us is -- I mean, it's 17 pretty minimal. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is. And real minimal 19 with the other guys. 20 MS. HARGIS: And also notice on 435 and 436, which 21 are the District Courts, this is the new division of 22 regions -- districts. You have three -- you no longer have 23 four counties in 435, in the 216th; you only have three. 24 Three counties. And then you jump to two counties in the 25 198th. The population of Bandera is about the same as the 7-8-13 bwk 13 1 other counties were to the north. But some of the other 2 things that we have to do that we split 50/50, and we're 3 taking an increase in there, like the supplements for the 4 Judge, which would have been divided by four counties or six 5 counties, now divided by two counties. So, the supplements 6 are 18,000, so now we take 9 and 9, where we did 3,700 last 7 year. So, -- 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Got you. 9 MS. HARGIS: -- there is some cost differential in 10 the court systems because of the change, not a lot. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: No, it's pretty close to a wash. 12 MS. HARGIS: And the salaries -- the salaries as 13 well. Again, the salaries are not being divided by six on 14 one side and four on the other. Now we have three and two, 15 so you're going to see a difference there. And it's not 16 because he got an increase or a decrease; it's because of the 17 way it's divided. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Jail court? 19 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Significant reduction there. 20 What is that? Because of the -- 21 JUDGE TINLEY: The 198th court, for the most part, 22 is going to be absorbing the jail court, with the exception 23 of the appointed defense counsel. And that's why the only -- 24 only remaining item in there deals with appointed defense 25 counsel that we've had in the past. 7-8-13 bwk 14 1 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Okay. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: And it would otherwise be just -- it 3 would otherwise just be charged to Court-appointed attorney 4 in one of the other budgets anyway. So -- 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Much like a public defender. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: As to the fast-track jail court, 7 yeah, mm-hmm. Very much so. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Which seems to work here. 9 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's why we have an 10 increase in the 216th D.A. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Maybe. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It just got moved from one 13 budget to another. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: 216th D.A.? 15 MS. HARGIS: Lucy's here. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Hi, Lucy. 17 MS. WILKE: Hello. 18 MS. HARGIS: There you go. The 216th D.A., there 19 are two legislative -- well, one legislative cost. Again, 20 the supplements to the D.A.'s also went up, the same as the 21 District Judges. They mirror them. And then, as you know, 22 on the 216th, he has now moved into a rental space, and so 23 that additional cost. So, those -- 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Those are the two major items? 25 MS. HARGIS: Two major items in theirs. 7-8-13 bwk 15 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, $50,000 increase? That's 3 what it amounts to? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. Approximately, yeah. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And so how much of that was 6 rental space, and how much was salary? Salary was 9,000? 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Difference between 4,800 and -- and 8 30. 9 MS. HARGIS: 30,000. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: 30 or 36? Is it 3,000 a month? 11 MS. WILKE: Judge, I'm not sure what it is a month. 12 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, this is -- it's around 30,000. 13 I think it's three -- it's not quite three. The -- there is 14 also some additional costs in here for utilities and a few 15 other things, and for his books and supplies. 'Cause they 16 didn't have enough money last year, because the services -- 17 as Rob reported, some of the services that they use have gone 18 up on their cost, and so they're going to be over budget this 19 year. So, you already knew that, so there are a few other 20 things in here that make this a major increase. That 21 significant increase in rent, and then the additional 22 supplement to the D.A., band-aided by legislation. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Which was 4,800 or so. Okay. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, 198th D.A. 25 MS. HARGIS: The 198th D.A. is considerably 7-8-13 bwk 16 1 different. He's been kind enough to reduce that for us 2 twice. He -- it's still going to be more substantial. 3 Again, we are the largest county; there's only one other 4 county, so we are going to have a larger percentage of the 5 cost of this. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's almost a 30 percent 7 increase. 8 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: The other difference is, prior 10 budgets of the 198th, a lot of those funds had been absorbed 11 by forfeiture funds. There's not nearly as much absorbed by 12 forfeiture funds, which obviously come out of the county 13 budget. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Probably none. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: No, there's some. 16 MS. HARGIS: Some. He has taken about 100,000 over 17 there, but we did share that 100, so we -- we've benefited to 18 about 75,000. But keep in mind, this is more of a true 19 budget than we've ever seen, and the forfeiture money that he 20 has now is probably the last of the big money because of the 21 change of location. So -- and he wants to slowly deplete it, 22 not just, you know, immediate. And he also has, as you will 23 -- a special committee -- legislative committee that he has 24 to get approval from. So -- 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, that's what I was 7-8-13 bwk 17 1 thinking. How do you -- did he get permission to move the 2 100,000? 3 MS. HARGIS: I -- he's going to get permission, 4 supposedly. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 6 MS. HARGIS: I don't -- I don't interfere there. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Better to ask for 8 forgiveness than it is to ask permission. 9 MS. HARGIS: Well, one of the reasons that he 10 hasn't met with the committee yet is because he has to have 11 two new members, because two of them were made up from the -- 12 and those new members have not been chosen by -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Governor. 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right now, there's only one 15 sole member. 16 MR. HENNEKE: The committee's sitting right here. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you on the committee? 18 MR. HENNEKE: He is the committee. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You are the committee. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's scary. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: He is the present committee. Okay. 22 District Clerk, you okay? 23 MS. BURLEW: I'm okay, thank you. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. Jury Fund? 25 MS. BURLEW: It's good. 7-8-13 bwk 18 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. County Law Library? 2 MS. HARGIS: We should get more during 3 reimbursements this next year, because they raised that again 4 to give us more in the last legislative session. Remember, 5 they lowered it to the amount of money we -- they were giving 6 us. Now they've raised it back up again. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Good with that? 8 MR. HENNEKE: The only thing I'll note, gentlemen, 9 is -- is what the budget does is it moves the unbudgeted 10 reserve that's already there just into the current budget. 11 So, it's not an increase of $85,000. That 85,000 is already 12 in a surplus. It just hasn't been part of the budget, so 13 that just puts it on the -- on the ledger sheet. But that 14 was my recommendation, and thank you for your consideration. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, you're saying that's just 16 a bookkeeping thing? 17 MS. HARGIS: Well, he's basically budgeted the 18 entire amount of cash that's in -- in the bank, in the cash 19 account. 20 MR. HENNEKE: I budgeted some of that as reserve. 21 Instead of it just sitting it out there in the ethos, I 22 budgeted some as reserve, and the rest of the money is in 23 that line item. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, do we see that coming out 25 someplace else? 7-8-13 bwk 19 1 MS. HARGIS: No. It will come out of the cash 2 reserve that's built up over several -- over many, many 3 years. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So we'll see it coming out of 5 someplace else. 6 MS. HARGIS: No, it's just one fund. This fund is 7 a dedicated fund, and the money -- 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, where is it now? I mean, 9 if it's there -- 10 MS. HARGIS: It has its own cash account. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It has to go from here to 12 there. 13 MS. HARGIS: It's going from the cash account that 14 it's currently sitting in right now. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. So, we'll see the cash 16 account -- 17 MS. HARGIS: Cash account will go down. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, that's my question. So, 19 you see the cash account go down. 20 MS. HARGIS: Right. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Again, District Clerk, records 22 management/preservation. 23 MS. HARGIS: That is actually the County Clerk. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Is that the one that you and the 25 County Clerk jointly share in? 7-8-13 bwk 20 1 MS. BURLEW: Yes, sir. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. 3 MS. PIEPER: Records management the whole county 4 shares, and then we have separate records archival. 5 MS. HARGIS: Basically, I just budgeted the same as 6 last year because I didn't hear from anybody. Because the 7 whole county can use this one. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Let's go to J.P. 1? 2? 3? 9 JUDGE MITCHELL: Mine's fine, Judge. Thank you. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: 4? I would note Judge Ragsdale gave 11 me a call, said he had cases set for court today at 1:30. He 12 indicated that he may need more conference money because of 13 some procedural changes in what the Legislature has done with 14 J.P. courts. I think it is due to the combining of small 15 claims into J.P., and maybe some new procedural rules and 16 some additional training that might be needed for justices of 17 the peace there. I indicated to Judge Ragsdale that our 18 tendency here was to -- with the exception of a new J.P. who 19 required a full 80 hours, I believe, of training as a new 20 J.P., we generally try to keep their budgets the same. And I 21 don't think any of the other J.P.'s had requested any 22 additional conference funds. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Either he's a 24 forward-thinking dude, or these other people are slow. I 25 mean, which one? 7-8-13 bwk 21 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, in looking into the 2 conferences which incorporate these new procedural rules or 3 changes, the ones that are presently scheduled are scheduled 4 within this current budget year. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: And as far as we could tell, there's 7 not any scheduled in the next budget year; at least yet, 8 there's not. So, pass that along. 9 MS. HARGIS: I did budget J.P. technology. I put 10 $10,000 in there. 11 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, I see 19,000. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: In case there were any expenditures 14 that need to be made from that? 15 MS. HARGIS: Any additional. I didn't hear from 16 John, so, I mean, we can change that. We need to look at the 17 cash balance. Do you have something specific you're going to 18 buy? 19 MR. TROLINGER: Well, my only issue with it is the 20 lower level courtroom's not complete. We have two 21 large-screen TV's that we're holding off to get a better 22 deal, get something bigger, that kind of thing. I was just 23 looking for remaining balance, and with about 7,500, I think, 24 in software support and those large screens, I think we need 25 to go to about 12 -- I think we need to go about $14,000 on 7-8-13 bwk 22 1 budgeting that. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: In place of the 10? 3 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: On both of them? 5 MR. TROLINGER: Technology. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 14? 7 MS. HARGIS: On expenses. I can't go up on the 8 revenue. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: 14,5? Or 14? 10 MR. TROLINGER: 14. Thank you. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: That's a dedicated fund anyway, 12 so -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: It's down in the bottom portion of 15 your summary. So -- 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What do you mean, a dedicated 17 fund? 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, that's all it can be used for. 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Oh, I see. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: It's got a current estimated cash 21 balance, beginning of the year, 58,000. That builds from 22 J.P. cases. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Mm-hmm. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay? 25 MS. HARGIS: Because these are dedicated funds, 7-8-13 bwk 23 1 Commissioner Moser, you don't necessarily use all of the 2 funds. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, got you. 4 MS. HARGIS: They have to be specifically used 5 according to the Legislature. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: County Attorney? Are you good? 7 MR. HENNEKE: Nothing changed. The only 8 difference, I think, is the 12,000 there at the bottom, in 9 the event that Mr. Aycock's able to pull together the 10 coalition of governmental entities for that forensic, you 11 know, data lab. If not, they'll come out. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: It's contingency, essentially. 13 MR. HENNEKE: Yes, sir. A placeholder, but nothing 14 changed. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: H.R.? 16 MS. LANTZ: Good. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Auditor? 18 MS. HARGIS: No. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Treasurer? 20 MS. SOLDAN: It's fine. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Election Services? 22 MS. BOLIN: Here. You changed our office supplies 23 down to 8,000. This is a mass mail-out year, and that's why 24 I had it at 12. And the eight is even less than we did the 25 last mass mail-out, so I need at least -- at least 11. That 7-8-13 bwk 24 1 would be 10-402-310. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What -- it goes to 11? 4 MS. BOLIN: That's what I'm asking. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: I don't recall; did you annotate 6 that on your request? 7 MS. BOLIN: I did, yes, sir. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 9 MS. BOLIN: And then I talked to Nadene a little 10 bit about -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's get that one set up first. 12 MS. BOLIN: Sorry. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: 11? Is that where we are? 14 MS. BOLIN: Yes, sir, that should work. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: These are your voter registrations 16 that have got to be mailed out? 17 MS. BOLIN: Yes, sir. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: How's that going to affect your 19 postage? 20 MS. BOLIN: The postage I increased to match so 21 that I could -- I usually go up and down every other year 22 because of the postage. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. That's why you want the 30, 24 okay. 25 MS. BOLIN: Yes, sir. 7-8-13 bwk 25 1 JUDGE TINLEY: So that's covered. 2 MS. BOLIN: Yes. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 4 MS. BOLIN: And then the next thing was the notices 5 on 430 -- 402-430. Nadene said she thinks we can go down to 6 800; that we don't even need the 1,200. She's only using the 7 West Kerr Current. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll take it. 9 MS. BOLIN: Okay. That's the only thing I had on 10 either one of mine. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Nice to see. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you, ma'am. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: One more time, the postage 15 went from 17 to 30 again why? 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Because they mail out all the new -- 17 the complete mail-out for voter registration. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Which they didn't do last 19 year? 20 MS. BOLIN: Right, we do it every other year. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Every other year, okay. Okay. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, Tax Assessor. 23 MS. BOLIN: I'm fine. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Good. Election services. That has 25 to do with -- 7-8-13 bwk 26 1 MS. HARGIS: This is the other account, Diane. 2 MS. BOLIN: Then I'm fine. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Maintenance, courthouse and 4 related buildings. 5 MR. BOLLIER: Good, yes, sir. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Are you good? No, sir? 7 MR. BOLLIER: I'm good in 510, Judge. Do you want 8 me to go on 511? 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, are you okay on 510? 10 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, I am. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Okay. Let's go to 511, the 12 jail maintenance. 13 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. On 511-350, maintenance 14 and custodial supplies, I did put 4,000 there, but I would 15 like to raise that up at least 1,500, maybe 2,000. The mats 16 are killing me over there. We're running short of money, and 17 it's going to take at least another $1,500 in that account -- 18 in that line item to finish out the year, for just mats 19 itself. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: You're going to have to do a budget 21 amendment? 22 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir, for at least 1,500. 23 MS. HARGIS: So, what do you want in here, six? 24 MR. BOLLIER: I'd like to have at least six in 25 there, if I could get it, sir. 7-8-13 bwk 27 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, change it from four to six. 2 Is that the only one on that one? 3 MR. BOLLIER: That's the only one on that one, sir. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 5 MR. BOLLIER: And then -- 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Parks Maintenance? 7 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: 513? 9 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. I only need -- here on 10 331, fuel oil and maintenance, -- 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes, sir. 12 MR. BOLLIER: -- y'all cut me back to 5,000; I had 13 seven in there. I wish I could -- I could probably make it 14 on five, but if it rains and stuff and I have to do a lot of 15 mowing, I'm averaging 40 gallons of gas -- 40 to 50 gallons 16 of gasoline a week to mow the facility every other week, so I 17 would like a little more in there. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Six? 19 MR. BOLLIER: Six will work, sir. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. 21 MR. BOLLIER: I'm easy. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That'll be twice what you 23 expect to go out of the year. 24 MR. BOLLIER: Well, I'm hoping it rains every day. 25 But if it doesn't rain, I can't -- I'm not a weather man. 7-8-13 bwk 28 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: But it's still twice what 2 you're projected to go out a year, right? 3 MR. BOLLIER: What did he say? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: He's working off a drought year. 5 That's why we cut it back, see. 6 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: When we annualize these things, I 8 realized you were coming off a drought year, so... 9 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 11 MR. BOLLIER: And, I mean, if it doesn't rain, I'm 12 not going to have any grass to cut, but I can't -- you know, 13 that's where I'm at. I can't predict that. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can't predict the weather? 15 MR. BOLLIER: Sir? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You can't predict the weather? 17 MR. BOLLIER: No, sir, but I heard that you could, 18 sir. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure you don't want seven? 20 MR. BOLLIER: No, I'll settle for six. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask a question here. 22 Item 457 -- 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You beat me. Probably want to 24 take that out. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Oh. 7-8-13 bwk 29 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Zero that out? 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think zero that out. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Wait a minute, you've got mine 5 pulled up on there. 6 MS. HARGIS: He's not -- 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Parks Maintenance? 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We're working on him here. 9 You're in jail on the screen. 10 MS. HARGIS: The screen and the book don't match. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Thank you. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tim? Tim, 457? 13 MS. HARGIS: We put every department, every -- 14 everything they do under -- 15 MR. BOLLIER: 457? What are you asking me, sir? 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Turtle Creek. 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Turtle Creek School. 18 MR. BOLLIER: Oh, I'm good there. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're going to zero that 20 out? 21 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, we need to zero that out. Yes. 22 Yes, Turtle Creek, we need to zero that out. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Sounds like we're in full 24 agreement. 25 MR. BOLLIER: We need to zero that out. 7-8-13 bwk 30 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Are you good on parks? 2 MR. BOLLIER: I'm good on parks now, sir. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 4 MR. BOLLIER: Now, then, I'd like to go to 666, if 5 we could. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: That's exactly where we're going. 7 Youth Exhibition. 8 MR. BOLLIER: I'm kind of between a rock and a hard 9 spot here. In 10-666-450, building and grounds maintenance, 10 I do not know, and I'm sure that none of us know where we're 11 going to be out there with the new facility. I do not know 12 if the new facility's coming or not coming. So, where I'm at 13 with that, if we get a -- the new facility, then I believe 14 I'm going to need a little more money. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, you know -- 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You got more. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Going from 24 to 30. Isn't 18 that enough for the show barn? 19 MR. BOLLIER: That's not what I show. I only show 20 20. 21 MS. HARGIS: No, it's 30. 22 MR. BOLLIER: Where do you see it? 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Right-hand side. 24 MR. BOLLIER: That says 20, doesn't it? 25 MS. HARGIS: You probably didn't put the right 7-8-13 bwk 31 1 thing. 2 MR. BOLLIER: You put 30 in there? 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 4 MR. BOLLIER: My mistake. I'm good. I can live 5 with that. That's it for me. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, thank you. 7 MR. BOLLIER: Thank you, sir. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Isn't he nice? Nice young 9 man. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Constable 1? 11 MR. LAVENDER: I believe we can make it work. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Another nice young man. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Constable 2? Team players, we call 14 them. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, team players. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Constable 3? Constable 4? County 17 Jail? 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Knew it was coming. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Break out the cheese, boys. 20 (Laughter.) 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, I have to look, because 22 I'm not sure. Jeannie said there weren't any changes. I 23 see -- 24 MS. HARGIS: Let's look at mine. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- quite a few, so I need to 7-8-13 bwk 32 1 make sure mine is what y'all are looking at even after you 2 did print it out. What are you showing for contracted 3 medical in the jail? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: 430,000. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: All right, 'cause mine's 6 showing 344. So, as long as there weren't any in what I had 7 requested, other than the FICA and that that we adjusted, I'm 8 fine with it. That's fine, I have no problem with it. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: So, you're good with -- 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'm good with the jail. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: All right, thank you. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You said contracted medical? 13 That was the increase of some $80,000, $90,000? 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. The jail -- the 15 contract -- we are contracted with that. We're going to be 16 way over budget this year. It's been a very bad year 17 medically. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Even though you're expected to 19 go out of the year at 305? 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah. There's been, in the 21 last two months -- we're under contract, so what happens is, 22 under another line item there where you see prisoner medical, 23 I had put like 20,000 in it last year to help cover anything 24 that would go over the limits in the contract. And that's 25 probably going to go bye-bye this year, okay? But what they 7-8-13 bwk 33 1 are doing is upping all the limits and redoing our contract. 2 And our contract next year, the renewal cost of the contract 3 needs to add one more personnel, one more nurse to it. It 4 will go to the $430,018.92 a year. That is a new contract 5 price. A new contract will go up 80-something thousand 6 dollars. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Good god. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Now, that contract price -- the old 9 contract, as I recall, had a base price, and then if meds 10 went over a certain level, there was an escalator or an 11 add-on that came into play. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: This new contract -- 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: What they're -- what this new 15 contract covers, Judge -- and this is what they sent us. 16 Increase on-site and LVN for 40 hours per week, so 80 hours a 17 week. That's adding an additional LVN. Add the additional 18 provision for the chest X-rays, which that actually covers 19 staff, employees, and volunteers, 'cause all staff and 20 volunteers have to have TB tests. A lot of them cannot have 21 a TB test; they have to have chest X-rays. This covers that 22 cost. It covers a 3.87 C.P.I. increase, okay, which is a 23 $391.45 annual increase. It covers our current monthly cost 24 in the contract. It's 28,731.55. This contract will go to 25 30,234.91, is the base renewal, okay? So, you're talking 7-8-13 bwk 34 1 6,000 a month. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Is it all exclusive of meds? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: So, there's no escalator clause on 5 meds? 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: This is prescriptions and all 7 that. It includes all that. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But it still has those base 10 limits gradually, after you get over that, that cost. And 11 I'll give you an example of a cost this year that's probably 12 outside. Now, also last year we got back -- y'all got back a 13 check -- 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Now, Rusty, when we ask you what 15 time it is, don't tell us how to build a watch. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: What they do -- I'm trying not 17 to, but last year, something you need to consider is we got 18 back a check for $23,000, 'cause inmate costs were not that 19 much, and they sent a reimbursement in our contract for the 20 $23,000, okay? So, we get that up and down. This is a base, 21 and they're trying to figure the best, but their personnel is 22 killing them in the jail with what we've had. But to give 23 you an example, last week we had an inmate that had a fight 24 in the jail. He had to have -- had to be taken to San 25 Antonio for special surgery. 7-8-13 bwk 35 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, but that's detail. 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And that is a $50,000 cost 3 that was unexpected. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Let me ask you a couple other 5 questions. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, without cuts and 8 bruises. The population in the jail from 2011-2012 to -- 9 projected to be at the end of next year hopefully is going to 10 go down with the new alignment of the courts. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Correct. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay? So, if I just look at 13 that and I look at the actual from 2011-12 of 313,000, and 14 the proposed budget of 430,000, that's a 30 percent increase. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's correct. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Medical costs haven't gone up 17 30 percent. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: They're having -- medical 19 costs in the jail definitely have. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: But you could probably have 21 less prisoners, so it just doesn't compute. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It does compute if you know -- 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, I'm listening. 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- what medical costs are in 25 the jail, okay? What you're talking about in the jail, we 7-8-13 bwk 36 1 have on the street right now an epidemic of methamphetamine. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So -- wait, wait, wait. What 3 -- so what's changed? What has changed? 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The medical cost per inmate 5 has drastically increased. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Why? 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Because of the type of inmates 8 that are coming in the jail with additional medical issues. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, we have more of -- a big 10 increase in that type of prisoner? 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And they bring with it a lot 13 more medical costs? 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. Now, I did get something 15 a while ago from Rob on a bill that was passed, goes into 16 effect September 1, which will help my budget some, okay? It 17 says, you know, that county jails -- inmates in county jails 18 are -- the County is eligible for reimbursement for some of 19 those medical costs in the Health and Safety Code. I'm sure 20 it's going to come right back out of the indigent health 21 part, so it's likely to make our indigent health costs go up. 22 But that is an issue. Medical costs are a drastic issue in 23 county jails. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: I think our indigent health cost for 25 the same service is less than what you're used to paying when 7-8-13 bwk 37 1 you have to incur it on a -- on an as-needed basis, though. 2 That's probably the advantage that we'll gain there, in that 3 we've got limits on what we pay for a specific procedure. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But you also have to remember, 5 Commissioner Moser, they are adding personnel; they need 6 another full-time nurse. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Why? 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Because of the amount of work 9 that's -- we run 24 hours a day. I don't have -- 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, but your number of 11 prisoners is not increased, and it's projected to go down. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But the cost per prisoner, 13 medical issues per prisoner -- 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You said you had to add 15 another LVN? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's right. 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Why? 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Because of the amount of work 19 they're having to do with individual inmates. The cost is -- 20 what's gone up drastically is the amount of work and the 21 amount of medical problems coming -- medical and mental 22 coming into the jail. The doctor is doing double the amount 23 of work that he's contracted to do. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You can see why I'm having a 25 hard time with this, 'cause you went from actual 313 to 7-8-13 bwk 38 1 projected end of this year 305, but you're asking for a 2 budget of 430. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, don't look at the 4 projected -- 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Why? 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- at the end of this year, 7 because the costs in the last several months has been 8 drastic. That's what I've tried to tell y'all. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I'm -- keep going. I'm having 10 a hard time. Go ahead. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Come out, and I'll be more 12 than happy to sit down and go over it with you. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: I think that's what's needed. Y'all 14 just have a day of it and y'all figure it out. But your 15 contract is projected to be 430,000? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The contract's -- new contract 17 is 430,018.92. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: We'll say that's close enough. 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: How many bids you get for 20 that? 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: What do you mean, visits? 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Bids. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Bids? What it is, our current 24 contract is one we've used for the last several years. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Maybe you need to change. Go 7-8-13 bwk 39 1 ahead. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: What else? Jail's okay? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Jail's okay. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: All right. Let's go to Sheriff's 5 Department. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Sheriff's part's okay. I have 7 no issue, other than I -- you know, when you get to the 8 point -- 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Sheriff's Office Annex? 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Sheriff's Office Annex, mainly 11 what we do is utilities. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Wait, wait, wait. We 13 increased Sheriff's Department by $60,000, and that was 14 because of the -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Salaries. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Gas and oil. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's probably going to be 18 due to longevity and educational increases, which I'd already 19 projected. We did increase our vehicle maintenance and gas 20 and oil because of the costs there, and 'cause of where we 21 are in our budget. 22 MS. HARGIS: The longevity in the Sheriff's 23 Department is every other year, and this is the big year for 24 them. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. Well, that's a good 7-8-13 bwk 40 1 question. A general question, Judge. Say we go through this 2 and we listen to all this, and we have a bunch of questions 3 when this is over, after digesting it. What's the procedure? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: What's the procedure? 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, to get -- to answer 6 some -- ask questions. I mean, I'm not comprehending every 7 bit of this. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: You're free to ask each individual 9 department -- 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, that's the way to do it. 11 Okay, yeah. Okay. And then next workshop, if there's some 12 clarification or whatever we need to bring to the workshop, 13 we could. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, if we need to itemize it again 15 on the agenda, we can, but I'm trying to keep the agenda 16 focused on items that need to come before the Court that are 17 specific relating to major budget items. I'm trying to keep 18 the nuts and -- the middle part of the budget out of 19 everybody going through it. I just want to hit the points 20 that are relevant to everybody. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Commissioner Moser, since you 23 are even my liaison on all these things, Jail and Sheriff's 24 Office, I would more than welcome you to come out to my 25 office and sit down and visit with me over the budget. 7-8-13 bwk 41 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: All right, good deal. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I can tell you right now, if 3 I have questions in there, we're going to come back and 4 revisit it. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. Yeah, okay. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, there will be a bunch of 8 questions. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: At the end of the day, before we do 10 the final adoption of the budget, the whole thing will be on 11 the table. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, okay. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: But I'm trying to narrow down what's 14 in issue here. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It's a good start. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Annex? You said you're okay 17 on the annex? 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay on annex. 19 MS. HARGIS: It's just utilities. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Utilities is all we're really 21 paying over there. 22 MS. HARGIS: Utilities and insurance. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Courthouse Security? 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'm okay with courthouse 25 security. 7-8-13 bwk 42 1 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Juvenile Probation? That has 2 to go through -- 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The only thing I want, when 4 y'all come back to additional personnel, there is one in the 5 Sheriff's Office I'd like to visit about. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, you didn't mention that when 7 we were at Sheriff's Office. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I tried. You went immediately 9 to Annex. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, I asked if you're okay; you 11 said you were okay. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: With the budget. That's not 13 in the budget, remember? 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, additional personnel. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Additional personnel. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, make your pitch. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I need one more investigator, 18 okay? What we're having and what we're seeing a lot of is 19 the methamphetamine epidemic -- addiction. The drug issues 20 has been major, okay, and as y'all know, we hired -- I went 21 with one that works kind of interdiction traffic, drugs, and 22 he's making a number of cases per day. I have one person 23 assigned to work narcotics. They're assigned to a unit over 24 at the City of Kerrville, which I'm not knocking them; they 25 do a good job. It's done a good job, but it's concentrating 7-8-13 bwk 43 1 more inside the city, and we have a serious drug problem -- 2 methamphetamine epidemic/problem out in the county right now. 3 Every traffic stop he's making, we'll make cases, and I need 4 to create a unit inside the Sheriff's Office to work 5 interdiction narcotics, okay, doing it in traffic stops and 6 that. I need to be able to pull my officer back from the 7 City. I have one that's a current investigator I'll assign 8 to it, but I need at least a three-man unit to get this going 9 to work our issues, and that's what I'm asking for, is one 10 investigator to keep that unit. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Have you calculated the cost of that 12 salary, the roll-ups and all that? 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The salary? No, not the 14 roll-ups. I have not. She would have to figure that in. 15 The salary for an investigator, middle of the line, depending 16 on certification, whether master and that, would run probably 17 at the most about 54. And so then you'd have to calculate 18 roll-ups and the insurance with that. And I'm needing one 19 more position to try and make this unit. That's my -- 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Thank you. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's what I'm requesting. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Rusty, when you talk 24 about -- I mean, I may be out of line asking you in here, but 25 when you talk about you need an investigator, or do you need 7-8-13 bwk 44 1 somebody that knows how to kick doors down? 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Anybody can kick a door down. 3 You've got an assistant D.A. in here. When you're talking 4 making narcotics cases, drawing search warrants, doing all 5 that, yes, that's an investigator-type position. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see, okay. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. And you use regular 9 police officers? 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Investigator. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Who kicks the door down? 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, at the time you get a 13 search warrant, your investigator -- whoever the case agent 14 is going to be, that's normally going to be an investigator, 15 but you always have to use patrol units and everybody else to 16 help do that. That can be a very dangerous type situation. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Don't get mad. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'm not. I'm saying -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm just trying to figure 20 this out. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I use all type of people. 22 I'll send Clay over there with them to help kick the door 23 down. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh god. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Just wherever we can draw 7-8-13 bwk 45 1 from. But working straight narcotics to where that's what 2 they concentrate on, we've got to have a unit. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Thank you. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 54,000, did he say? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: That's just the salary. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Multiply that by 1.37 to get 9 the other -- 10 JUDGE TINLEY: 1.35 is closer. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Is it? 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, 1.35. 13 MS. HARGIS: At least 30 percent roll-up. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: At least. Okay. Okay, Juvenile 15 Probation. Juvenile Board handles that. 216th Adult -- 16 MS. HARGIS: That's a reimbursable -- we reimburse 17 that. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Environmental Health? 19 MR. GARCIA: Fine. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Animal Control? 21 MS. FEGENBUSH: Everything is good. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: You're good? Ag Extension? 23 MR. WALSTON: Looks good. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Road and Bridge? 25 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir. 7-8-13 bwk 46 1 JUDGE TINLEY: How you doing? 2 MR. ODOM: I'm -- Rusty woke me up. (Laughter.) 3 JUDGE TINLEY: I see. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Let me go back to Ag 5 Extension. 6 MR. ODOM: We have -- we're fine, sir. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, but I've got a question. 8 So, we're increasing $30,000, last year's budget to proposed, 9 and you're estimated to go out of the year at 187, so what's 10 the big difference? 11 MS. HARGIS: He's -- 12 MR. WALSTON: Our budget this year is 232, and 13 we're looking at replacing a vehicle and doing some repairs 14 and maintenance in the meeting room, office. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: 24,000 of that is capital outlay, 16 which is still on the table. 17 MR. WALSTON: Yes. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, so come back to that. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Capital outlay items are a totally 20 separate -- 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. That takes care of 22 that. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: -- discussion. 24 MS. HARGIS: Let me interject. The projection is 25 done by the computer system. 7-8-13 bwk 47 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Don't say the computer did it. 2 That's not acceptable. 3 MS. HARGIS: Well, I can't -- 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Don't say the computer did it. 5 MS. HARGIS: The computer does do it automatically. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Unacceptable. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Which is good if you're figuring 8 utilities and insurance payments, but it doesn't do good with 9 anything else. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I don't know why it's that 11 way. "Computer said it." 12 MS. HARGIS: You know, we've gone through and 13 adjusted. We've had years where we've adjusted them; we were 14 off, and so we just -- on the first run, I don't have enough 15 data to get to the end of the year this early. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Leonard, you said you were good with 18 yours? 19 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir, I'm fine. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. That includes your flood 21 control and whatnot? 22 MR. ODOM: Sir? What was that? 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Flood control. 24 MR. ODOM: We're fine. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Indigent Health, we made a 7-8-13 bwk 48 1 minor adjustment to cover the software cost on that one. 2 MS. HARGIS: It's on page -- on the second page 3 down at the bottom, where it says 18,096. It's 18,132. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Where are you? 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Indigent Services. 7 MS. HARGIS: Indigent Services, Fund 50. At the 8 bottom -- almost at the bottom of the fourth column, it says 9 18,096. 10 MR. HOLEKAMP: Okay. 11 MS. HARGIS: It should be 18,132. 12 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Got you. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Juvenile Detention? Kevin? 14 MR. STANTON: We're good, sir. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Nondepartmental? For the Court, 16 primarily. 17 MS. HARGIS: The only thing in the nondepartmental, 18 we did get our insurance; it did go up some. Working on the 19 property insurance. We haven't gotten the liability. We 20 have in contingency the money for Patterson and Associates. 21 As you remember, you asked the Treasurer if she could do the 22 investing without that service, so -- but it's kind of a 23 catch-22. It came out of contingency. Right now, I'd like 24 to leave it in contingency, because we do seem to tend to use 25 that quite frequently, so if we have to, we can reduce that. 7-8-13 bwk 49 1 I think her cost last year was about 20,000 -- 20,000, 2 22,000. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What's the tentative benefit 4 increase, 25,000? 5 MS. HARGIS: Those are the proposed increases in 6 salaries and the changes, which we're going to take up at 7 another session. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that's the next item. That's 9 the health benefits. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Medical insurance. Okay, we got the 12 not-so-good news on that. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Got you, yeah. 14 MS. HARGIS: Okay. Then we've got the next one, 15 which -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's see if there's any more on 17 nondepartmental. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, the big items here, 19 professional services went down 20,000? 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Contingency went up 25,000. 22 MS. HARGIS: 'Cause we've used quite a bit of it 23 this year already, and we're moving things around. We use 24 contingency when we run out in the court system, and we are 25 running out in the court system this year. 198th is out of 7-8-13 bwk 50 1 money in appointed attorneys, so we are having to pull from 2 the 216th, so we will need to pull from there. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Where did we -- there used to 4 be a line item for water planning. It wasn't in 5 nondepartmental; it was somewhere else. What I'm thinking of 6 here is on the grant that we have. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: County-sponsored services, I think, 8 is where it was. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But it probably -- the east 10 Kerr County wastewater facility grant, there may be some 11 requirement there; it would be no more than 5,000, which 12 ought to be able to come out of one of these items. 13 MS. HARGIS: That one in the County-sponsored, I 14 think we probably have that. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Anything else on nondepartmental? 17 MS. HARGIS: This is just mostly insurance and -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 19 MS. HARGIS: -- employee benefits. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Here's your new Veterans Services 21 budget. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And this is for projected 23 full-time? 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Yes. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 7-8-13 bwk 51 1 JUDGE TINLEY: It's projected full-time, but may 2 not be. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, right. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: And it's probably projected on the 5 high end for the salary, depending upon the certification 6 level that we attract. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, good. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: D.P.S., we participate in that 9 budget. 10 MS. HARGIS: Very little now. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Less? 12 MS. HARGIS: About $37,000 less. 13 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Stop and think about it. We 15 used to participate in every one of those line items. 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: A long time. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: City/County, there's a number of 20 items there. 21 MS. HARGIS: This is most of the airport. The 22 airport budget was approved at the 80,400 -- 401. The 25,000 23 is our share of the capital that we get towards the grant 24 that they get. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Does this -- this doesn't 7-8-13 bwk 52 1 consider any increase in revenue from Brinkman hangar? 2 MS. HARGIS: We don't -- 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Which we'll start getting at 4 the end of this calendar year. 5 MS. HARGIS: That is in the airport budget, not in 6 ours. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: But, I mean, that determines 8 how much we have to contribute to the airport. 9 MS. HARGIS: No. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, it does. 11 MS. HARGIS: We -- 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It does do the -- 13 MS. HARGIS: We contribute to the airport based on 14 their budget. They've requested the City and County give 15 them $80,401. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: We've approved that budget. 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, all right. So, if we 18 make an adjustment after the first of the year because of 19 something, then -- okay, got you. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, the bottom line is that the 21 airport is going to have the benefit of some additional 22 funding available to it. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: Presumably, you know, they'll of 25 course have to go through their system. 7-8-13 bwk 53 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We'll do a budget adjustment. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: There you go. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Negative budget adjustment. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Health and Emergency Services. That 5 is the EMS cost and related costs, First Responder expenses, 6 medical director and so forth. That's per the contract and 7 the accelerator clause -- the escalator clause in that 8 contract. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. That's -- okay. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay? 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: County-sponsored. Water Development 13 is -- 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: May I ask a question? Where 15 is the volunteer fire departments? 16 MS. HARGIS: Under Fire, Fund 14. 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. We'll get to it. Okay, 18 thanks. 19 MS. HARGIS: County-sponsored. Jonathan has a 20 Water Development line. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, and I put 5,000 in that 22 water development line. It may not be needed; we may be able 23 to do most of it through in-kind, but if we do need it, it'd 24 be better to have it budgeted. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: 447? 7-8-13 bwk 54 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, sir. 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Mm-hmm. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How much? 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Five. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 5,000. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good gosh. It's all for 7 Comfort. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Center Point. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: For all of our comfort right 10 now. Well, it doesn't affect Precinct 4. 11 MS. HARGIS: Keep in mind that the KCAD contract, I 12 mean, amount will probably change, 'cause we don't get their 13 budget until probably August. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Fire Protection. That's 15 where the vol -- the City of Kerrville contract is, escalator 16 clause there. Volunteer Fire Departments. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can we go back to 18 County-sponsored? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Here we go. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: In the -- the trapper contract, 21 there's no change that -- that I'm aware of, but there is an 22 interlocal agreement with Kendall County for -- one of their 23 trappers comes in about a third of Kerr County. 24 MS. HARGIS: This is what they're billing us now. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's the U.S.D.A., but the 7-8-13 bwk 55 1 Kendall County part, I can't remember where it was. I 2 thought we had a separate line item for that. 3 MS. HARGIS: I've never had that. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No? Okay. We'll come back to 5 that. 6 MS. HARGIS: I can look at that current amount that 7 we're paying. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Now we're over to Fire Protection. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Mm-hmm. Just the 21,000 per 10 volunteer fire department for the last several years probably 11 needs to be increased. 12 MS. HARGIS: We just increased it last year. It 13 was at 12,000 when I got here, and then we increased it to 14 14, and then we went to 15, and then last year we took it -- 15 went to 21. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I'm looking at the same kind 17 of things that Tim did on fuel and oil and all their other 18 expense. 19 MS. HARGIS: These are volunteer fire departments. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I understand, but who do they 21 protect? Us. 22 MS. HARGIS: Well, true. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think I agree with 24 Commissioner Moser, but I think that until we -- at this 25 point, I wouldn't want to change it. It's something we need 7-8-13 bwk 56 1 to look back at again later in the budget, see how we're 2 doing them. If we can afford to give them some, that's fine, 3 but -- 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I tried to get 12 for them 5 last year, and I got 6. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Say again? 7 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I tried to get 12,000 per 8 additional last year in the budget. I was granted six, after 9 we discussed it. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, okay. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 'Cause that's all we had 12 available to give. 13 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's all we had available 14 to give. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 16 MS. HARGIS: Keep in mind, I don't have any more 17 tax money. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: The biggest increase they got prior 19 to that time was three. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Yeah. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's correct. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: From 12 to 15. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. Yeah. Okay, we'll come 24 back to that later. 25 JUDGE TINLEY: Now, here's one for you to sink your 7-8-13 bwk 57 1 teeth into. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I already sunk my teeth in. 3 JUDGE TINLEY: Public library. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: All right. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's go right on to the 6 next one. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I'll come back to that later. 8 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Road Districts, that's 9 somebody else's. Parks. Where's Tim? 10 MS. HARGIS: This is really the Commissioners' 11 budget here. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 13 MS. HARGIS: I put 25,000 in here from ad valorem 14 taxes, and I gave y'all 25,000 to spend. You usually don't 15 spend it, but it's there. You spend it on the porta-potties, 16 and if you, you know, need some repairs at those parks, it 17 generally covers it. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't know if it comes under 19 this parks or possibly the other -- Maintenance parks, but 20 Little League fields. That -- while there's still not a 21 definite answer on that, where we're going, but the -- that's 22 a -- I suspect we're going to be more involved. Little 23 League doesn't seem really, you know, enthusiastic. They're 24 going to have to pay a fee, obviously, but I suspect it's 25 going to be more of a County-run facility. 7-8-13 bwk 58 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Where is that in the budget? 2 Let's talk about that for a minute. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's really -- I mean, if it 4 goes under the Maintenance parks budget, it goes there. Or 5 it comes under here. I don't know which it really fits 6 under; it could go either way. But it's a -- 7 MS. HARGIS: We've never budgeted for it. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We never had an expenditure out 9 there. And it's not a definite; it's still working with 10 them. But I think that it's going to -- part of it will be 11 more involved -- 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Uh-oh. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- for Maintenance. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. 15 Uh-oh. 16 MR. BOLLIER: In my parks budget, there's only 17 $2,000 budgeted in there, in 450, to take care of the parks 18 and stuff, things that we need. My question to the Judge and 19 to the Court is, Commissioner Moser would like for me to add 20 some trash cans -- I mean to add some trash receptacles into 21 Lions Park, and what we would like to do -- and I just want 22 to make sure of whether this money is supposed to come out of 23 my budget, or is this supposed to come out of the 24 Commissioners' park budget? 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: I'd say it's coming out of 7-8-13 bwk 59 1 this one. 2 MR. BOLLIER: Because it's not a whole lot of 3 money. 4 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It needs to come out of this 5 one. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Parks budget. 7 MR. BOLLIER: That's what I wanted to ask, just to 8 make sure that -- 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. 10 MR. BOLLIER: I mean, he told me to remind you when 11 we got there. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, and I appreciate that. 13 So -- 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, you're saying to him, 15 "Get your own trash cans"? 16 MR. BOLLIER: Yes, sir. (Laughter.) 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: This is not a very big item. 18 What -- on this, this is for year-round porta-potties at -- 19 at Lions Park and at Flat Rock Park and -- 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We don't have them 21 year-round. 22 MS. HARGIS: We don't have them year-round. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Only from Memorial Day to 24 Labor Day. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No. No, we talked about -- 7-8-13 bwk 60 1 MR. BOLLIER: We better -- 2 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Porta-potties. 3 MR. BOLLIER: I thought we said we was going to do 4 it all year. 5 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That was what was discussed 6 in here recently, but that's not necessary. 7 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 8 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not at my end, because 9 there's no usage of that -- 10 MR. BOLLIER: That's -- 11 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: -- to speak of after -- I 12 mean, there's some, but nothing like there is in summer 13 months. 14 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. I mean, 'cause the last -- the 15 only reason I was saying anything was -- was the last count I 16 had when we talked about it was we were going to leave them 17 there. 18 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: But that was more or less on 19 the other end of the county. That didn't have anything to do 20 with me. 21 MR. BOLLIER: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: But I think we made that 23 decision, if I'm not mistaken, to do that. So -- to have 24 them there year-round. 25 MS. HARGIS: I don't recall that. 7-8-13 bwk 61 1 MR. BOLLIER: Well, I'm like Commissioner Oehler. 2 In Ingram, we don't need them year-round. 3 MS. HARGIS: No, we don't. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What does this reflect? What 5 do you have in here? 6 MR. BOLLIER: I've got them in there for all year. 7 But that's not -- 8 MS. HARGIS: He didn't put -- I mean, we're paying 9 the porta-potties out of here, but we didn't budget for all 10 year in here. 11 MR. BOLLIER: No. 12 MS. HARGIS: Because it was during the year that 13 you requested that. So, if you are going to do that, that's 14 going to take up a big portion of your $5,000 for that park. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, I'm like Commissioner 16 Letz; I think it's something we need to look at when we're 17 talking about the ballpark changes there. I think they had 18 some pretty strong justification at Lions Park for a lot more 19 than just that. So, we'll come back to that. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Lions Park is used year-round 21 more. 22 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: That's what I'm saying. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, right. 24 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You do whatever you want to 25 in your end; I don't care, but I'm just speaking up for what 7-8-13 bwk 62 1 happens on mine. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Sure, got you. Okay, that's 3 good. 4 MS. HARGIS: So, we have $8,000 down there for park 5 sanitary facilities, so I think that's probably more than 6 enough. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, Tim's saying, "Yeah, 8 okay." 9 MR. BOLLIER: That's plenty of money. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: All the rest of these are special 11 funds, and -- 12 MS. HARGIS: Yeah 32, 36. Center Point is the 13 grant; we just put these in here for information. You do -- 14 Fund 40, though, is budgeted. Fund 40 is a special fund 15 where we get money. Alternate Dispute, we've been collecting 16 about 15,000 and giving them 14. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 18 MS. HARGIS: The District Clerk and County Clerk 19 tech fund is finally building up. For a while there, we 20 didn't have anything in that. I haven't heard from either 21 one of them on that. I think that has to be used for 22 technology. For a while, the first year or so, it didn't 23 build up, but there is some money in there now. Court 24 Records Preservation Fund, I think this is 43. Again, this 25 was one of the ones that was created -- I think it was in the 7-8-13 bwk 63 1 2009 legislative session. And we have done -- we have 8,300 2 in there to be used for -- 3 JUDGE TINLEY: There's not any budgetary issues in 4 any of those. 5 MS. HARGIS: No. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: Let's move on to the second item on 7 the agenda. Review and discuss fiscal year 2013-14 employee 8 insurance programs, including group employee health benefits 9 and voluntary supplemental insurance programs, T.C.D.R.S. 10 elections. We've got some not so good news from TAC, our 11 pool carrier of our health benefits program, indicating that 12 we were subject to an increase of approximately 9.1 percent. 13 We had some high claims history, and that -- that drove that. 14 In terms of numbers, it has gone up about $175,000 in round 15 figures in terms of gross premium. We're basing that on 275 16 employees, which is probably high, because right now we only 17 have 273. At times there are vacancies in certain positions, 18 and that tends to build up and give us even more of a 19 cushion. 20 In addition to looking at that increase, we made 21 inquiry of -- of the pool people at TAC, the insurance 22 experts, and said what, if anything, can we do to increase 23 our employee benefit to our employees, and if so, what will 24 it cost? The primary one that was indicated to us is a 25 reduction of the overall deductible reducing it from $2,000 7-8-13 bwk 64 1 to $1,500, a $500 buy-down, as it were. And the additional 2 cost for that $500 buy-down in the deductible is 3 approximately $92,000. Now, we are in a position to do that. 4 If we do that, however, I think we need to obviously think 5 about sustainability. I don't want to buy it down this year 6 and then say, oops, we got to go back up next year. I -- I'm 7 hopeful that our claims history for the next year, assuming 8 we sign on again with the TAC pool, will be better so that we 9 won't -- we won't have that kind of an increase, and we'll 10 make sustainability a little bit easier, or more easily 11 attained. But that's a matter for the whole Court to 12 consider, in my estimation. So, tell me what you think, 13 gentlemen. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What has it been in the last 15 five years-plus, as far as deductible? 16 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: It's fluctuated. 17 MS. HARGIS: All over the place. We had -- when I 18 first came here in '07, it was $500, and then we got a card 19 that basically paid for the $500. And then the next year, we 20 kept that, and then they took the card away, and the 21 deductible went up to 1,000. Actually, it went up to 1,000 22 the second year I was here; we had the card. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: We were self-insured at that 24 point. 25 MS. HARGIS: Right, partially self-insured. 7-8-13 bwk 65 1 JUDGE TINLEY: That's the big killer. 2 MS. HARGIS: We had the card, a $1,000 deductible 3 at $500. Then on the third year I was here, the deductible 4 went up to 1,500. We had no card. The premium went up. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: When you say no card -- 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: H.S.A. or -- 7 MS. HARGIS: It was an H.S.A. card. And then when 8 we went with TAC -- well, actually, when we went with Humana, 9 we had to go to the $2,000 deductible, because that's all we 10 could afford. We were coming off a really bad claims year, 11 and also coming off of being self-insured. So, we maintained 12 the $2,000 deductible with TAC because that was the best cost 13 for us that they brought in. We have been with them now -- 14 this will be our third renewal. We've only been with them -- 15 not two years. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Second renewal. This will be going 17 into our third year. 18 MS. HARGIS: Third year. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, okay. 20 MS. HARGIS: And there is also a shorter year. And 21 we probably would have gotten an increase last year, but we 22 had a short year, so they -- they didn't give you an increase 23 last year. So, we're probably talking two years here. But 24 the $2,000 is the highest it's ever been here. I think, you 25 know, that was -- that was pretty traumatic. And then one 7-8-13 bwk 66 1 year, we had a $3,000, remember, deductible straight out, and 2 nobody went to the doctor that year. 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You had to pay the full 4 $3,000 before you got one penny of anything paid. 5 MS. HARGIS: So, you know, the $2,000 looked good 6 after that. But, you know, I think the employees, you know, 7 would appreciate that as a benefit. You know, sometimes you 8 give a benefit versus other things. And, you know, coming up 9 with $2,000 and $6,000 -- isn't it six for a family? So, 10 it's six for a family; that's quite a bit. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What do other counties do? 12 Surrounding -- 13 MS. HARGIS: They waive what the cost of their 14 premiums are. We have probably the highest deductible. I 15 think Bandera's only got $1,000. I'm not sure about Kendall 16 and Gillespie, but, I mean -- do you know? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Most of them are with TAC. 18 MS. LANTZ: Yeah, most counties are with TAC. And 19 I think what has caused us problems is we hopped around so 20 much. We had to stay stable with one carrier in order for 21 that to come down. And when they see that consistency, then 22 we, as the Judge says, buy up in our options. So, we've only 23 been with them two consecutive years, going into the third, 24 and one of them was a short year. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. 7-8-13 bwk 67 1 MS. LANTZ: So -- 2 JUDGE TINLEY: If we keep our plan the same going 3 into next year, the cost is 175, roughly, increase. If you 4 want to do that buy-down, that's 92 more. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To me, I mean, that should be 6 -- needs to be considered, but I think you also have to look 7 at the overall pay structure. It's part of the whole 8 package. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: As to what you do. You can't 11 make a decision on this part until you look at the other 12 parts. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You could get rid of the 15 V.A. officer and still not have enough. Almost, though. 16 JUDGE TINLEY: Could. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That was a joke. Okay, I 18 move that we get rid of the V.A. officer. 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No decisions today. 20 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: You know, Buster, I think the 21 rope and the tree is still on the agenda for you. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But -- 23 JUDGE TINLEY: He keeps pitching for a new rope. 24 Doesn't want some old, nasty used rope; he wants a new one. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Super-duper, heavy duty, 7-8-13 bwk 68 1 nonslip. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Shiny white one. Okay. You got the 3 info, gentlemen, so let me pitch out something on T.C.D.R.S. 4 I have heard from at least one retiree who has requested that 5 whatever -- whatever COLA that the employees may get, that 6 the retirees get the benefit of the same COLA, same 7 percentage. The -- the T.C.D.R.S. number on retirees, Dawn 8 Lantz is hurriedly extracting that information. If I'm not 9 mistaken, the percentage that we've done is based upon 10 percentage of overall C.P.I., which is somewhat deceptive as 11 to the actual C.P.I. itself. But then there's another one 12 where you can plug in a percentage amount, if I'm not 13 mistaken. 14 MS. HARGIS: It's in increments of one. One, two, 15 three, four, five. They don't have halves like we do with 16 the steps, so we'd have to ask. 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, what's been the history in 18 the past for retirees? 19 JUDGE TINLEY: We've granted two, as I recall, over 20 a period of -- 21 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Few years. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: -- several years. 23 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: Not that much. 24 MS. HARGIS: We haven't done it. And the reason we 25 granted them then is that up to, like, 3 percent, it didn't 7-8-13 bwk 69 1 cost you anything. 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. 3 MS. HARGIS: Now it costs you from zero, because 4 the T.C.D.R.S. basically had the same problem in 2008 that 5 everybody did when they invested, and so we're basically 6 having a 10-year payout, or a leveling, so to speak, of that 7 interest that was lost, and so the rates are higher. And so 8 if you want to have your retirees, you have to -- it's more, 9 because you're paying just the regular rate for retirement, 10 plus you're paying the recapture of the interest rate, but -- 11 you know, based on over a 10-year time frame, and then you 12 have to pay COLA for the retirees as well now. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, what would be the logic in 14 not increasing for retirees versus current employees? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: Save money. 16 MS. HARGIS: We don't have the money. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: It costs you an additional certain 18 number of points of your payroll. Have you got it here? 19 MS. LANTZ: 02 percent. Like, our rate this year 20 is going to be 12.04 -- 21 JUDGE TINLEY: Dawn? 22 MS. LANTZ: Sorry. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. Our current rate, 12.04, 24 that's a percentage of total payroll now for retirement. 25 MS. HARGIS: And with the insurance -- 7-8-13 bwk 70 1 JUDGE TINLEY: If we want a 2 percent flat rate 2 increase for retirees, that adds .16, or 16 hundredths on -- 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That would be 12.18 or 4 something like that? 5 JUDGE TINLEY: That would be 12.2. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: 12.2, okay. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, which is a pretty good number. 8 And we've got how many retirees, 13? 9 MS. HARGIS: I don't know how they base it. If 10 it's -- if we have to do it on our total payroll, that will 11 be quite a bit. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. Yeah, it's based upon total 13 amount of payroll. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. So, go from 12 to 12.2. 15 JUDGE TINLEY: 12.04 to 12.2. 16 MS. HARGIS: Well, it's really 12.31, because we 17 have that .27 of insurance that we have in there. The .27 of 18 insurance is added on. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: The 20,000? 20 MS. HARGIS: Yes. So, the rate is really 12.31. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, how many dollars is all 22 that? 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Sixteen-hundredths of one percent of 24 payroll. 25 MS. HARGIS: I don't have that. You got about a 7-8-13 bwk 71 1 $14 million payroll. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: $14 million times point -- 3 MS. HARGIS: It's about -- 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: 16? 5 JUDGE TINLEY: .0016. $22,400. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Oh. $22,000, okay. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: Want to carry that along, gentlemen? 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think we should. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay, that's the information. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, good. 11 MS. HARGIS: Do you want me to put that in? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What was the last time we did 13 an increase? 14 MS. LANTZ: 2001. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: When? 16 MS. LANTZ: In 2001, you gave a COLA to retirees. 17 MS. SOVIL: 2009 was the last increase. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What was it, 2009? 19 MS. HARGIS: Because it didn't cost us anything in 20 2009. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, but that's when the last 22 increase was. 23 MS. HARGIS: Because they started charging us 24 because of the market crash. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, okay. 7-8-13 bwk 72 1 MS. HARGIS: It's not anything to do with us, but 2 the pool can't afford to give the COLA's to the retirees at 3 no cost. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: But 2009 is the answer. 5 MS. HARGIS: And it wasn't very much. I think it 6 was 1 percent, as I recall. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's one of those 8 things that I think we need to try to look at for retirees 9 when we can, if we have the ability. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think we got a lot of things 11 on the table here. Today's a good start. Okay. And I think 12 there's quite a lot of questions to be asked, and a lot of 13 balancing to be done. So -- 14 MS. HARGIS: It's basically balanced, so if you add 15 22 and others, then we have to cut something. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I know, but there's put and 17 takes, 'cause I've got a bunch of questions that -- you know, 18 that I'll bring back. 19 JUDGE TINLEY: You going to trim down the Sheriff's 20 budget, bring it back to us and redistribute it? 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You got it, yeah. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Only thing we, as department 23 heads and elected officials, would like to have is an 24 opportunity to be able to address those questions without 25 getting hit blindsided. 7-8-13 bwk 73 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Sure. Well, you know, this is 2 the first time I've seen this, okay? So -- 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I agree. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: -- I'm not about to say, "Yea, 5 verily," but that's not the Judge's procedure. So, like I 6 said, I think it's a good start. There's a bunch of 7 questions, yeah. I'll go back to the department heads and 8 ask for this and that, so forth. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Thank you. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And make some suggestions. 11 JUDGE TINLEY: Any direction to the Auditor at this 12 point on C.P.I. for retirees? 13 MS. HARGIS: From our -- 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I -- 15 MS. HARGIS: It looks like they did get one in 2001 16 of 10.12, but it didn't cost us anything, so I don't know why 17 that occurred. But I'd like to look into that just to make 18 sure, because I know we didn't -- we didn't ask for it. 19 'Cause we have to fill out the form for that. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Mm-hmm. 21 MS. HARGIS: There is one other item that we would 22 like y'all to consider. With the insurance, we have 16 23 families is all on our family plan. And -- is it 16 or 19? 24 Sixteen. 25 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: This is what kind of family 7-8-13 bwk 74 1 plan? 2 JUDGE TINLEY: Health benefits. 3 MS. HARGIS: On our health benefit plan, the 4 employee pays a certain portion if they have a spouse, if 5 they have a child. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, got you. Sure. Okay, 7 I'm with you. 8 MS. HARGIS: The family portion is $450, which is 9 pretty considerable to our employees that have a family. So, 10 we would like the Court to consider maybe lowering that to 11 350, which is a cost of 19,200. So, I'd like -- 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did all the employees get 13 together and make this decision? 14 MR. HENNEKE: They meet at Buzzie's. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Meet at Buzzie's. 16 MS. HARGIS: No, sir. 17 JUDGE TINLEY: Secret, undisclosed location. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. The Grove. 19 MS. HARGIS: Just something that we'd like to see. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: These are the kind of things 21 we need to put a little star beside and bring back, and let's 22 deal with that. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Fine. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And start seeing the big 25 picture of how much money's going to be there and that kind 7-8-13 bwk 75 1 of thing. Just -- I agree that we need to have the 2 conversation. And I agree if there's money laying on the 3 table, we need to get it to our employees, period. 4 JUDGE TINLEY: Most valuable assets we got. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure is. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: We're a service outfit. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Even though they meet 8 secretly now. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah. Okay. 10 MS. BOLIN: Can I just ask one thing, Judge? I 11 noticed as we were going through different budgets that a 12 couple of department heads and a couple elected officials 13 other than the state were getting increases. Are you looking 14 at increases for everybody, or just certain ones in 15 particular? Or -- 16 JUDGE TINLEY: The individual increases for 17 personnel? 18 MS. BOLIN: No, for elected officials and 19 department heads. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, that's particular individuals. 21 We'll be looking at that separately. 22 MS. BOLIN: Okay. 23 JUDGE TINLEY: Under a separate workshop agenda 24 item. 25 MS. BOLIN: Okay. 7-8-13 bwk 76 1 JUDGE TINLEY: The only thing that, personnel-wise, 2 was being considered today was requests for additional 3 personnel in individual departments. 4 MS. BOLIN: Okay. 5 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And, Judge, back to her 7 question, when we come back and talk about individual 8 salaries, et cetera, is that still going to be under the 9 Judge's budget, the proposed budget? Or is this something 10 that we're fixing to throw out into the Commissioners Court 11 now? 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Well, there's -- number one, there's 13 a number of individual requests that will come before the 14 Court. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, that's fine. I just 16 wanted to know what the game plan is going to be. Fine. 17 Good. 18 JUDGE TINLEY: No, it's not -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: This is a proposed budget. 20 JUDGE TINLEY: It's not all -- pardon? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's a proposed budget. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: It ain't yet. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No. 24 JUDGE TINLEY: It's getting closer. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I mean, the Judge -- the 7-8-13 bwk 77 1 Judge's budget. So, we're still not -- 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It's not proposed. It's not 3 to be voted on. It's to be -- here's the first -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're not voting on a damn 5 thing. I'm trying to ask the man what's he's doing here as 6 the County Judge. I understand the law. 7 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm trying -- I'm trying to get 8 myself to a budget that I can finalize. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see, okay. Okay. 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay? All right. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 12 JUDGE TINLEY: Dawn? 13 MS. LANTZ: I would like to backtrack a little bit 14 about the insurance. Because that renewal rate is coming in, 15 and we have sustained within our budget and we're able to 16 afford possibly to do the deductible where it goes down, at 17 least that will help everybody across the board, and that is 18 my goal. You know, I'd like to see everybody benefit from 19 the insurance, because the deductible is so high. And it's 20 harder to pay that down than it is, I know, lowering the 21 premium for the employees in one section. But overall, I 22 think if we can do it where it works across the board for 23 everyone, everybody's at a win-win for our premium coverage. 24 So, that's just basically -- I'd like to see the deductible 25 go down if we had a choice. 7-8-13 bwk 78 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What if you had the choice 2 between that and a small salary increase? Which one would 3 you choose? 4 MS. LANTZ: I'd pick the insurance. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think I would too. 6 MS. LANTZ: But that's my personal opinion. So, I 7 mean -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's right, you're from 9 down there in Comfort. (Laughter.) 10 JUDGE TINLEY: Which automatically makes your 11 personal opinion different, right? Okay. Have we wrung this 12 out about as much as we can? 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I believe so. 14 JUDGE TINLEY: Okay. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Question. For the next -- 16 you're going to talk about the agenda items for the next 17 three or four workshops? 18 JUDGE TINLEY: Three or four? 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Did we schedule -- you 20 scheduled one for every week for four weeks. 21 JUDGE TINLEY: We're probably not going to have one 22 on the 15th, because the H.R. Director's going to be gone, 23 and so many of the items that are going to be relevant are 24 going to directly affect her. We're probably going to be 25 talking about those individual increases in that one, 7-8-13 bwk 79 1 restructuring of -- of departments. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Let me ask it differently. 3 When are the budget workshops scheduled, and is there an 4 agenda for those in your mind? 5 JUDGE TINLEY: There's an agenda for the next one 6 that I was just starting to tell you about, but I don't have 7 anything beyond that. 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: We're going to be looking at 10 individual personnel issues, a lot of those restructuring of 11 departments. We've got all the 14's that we're -- we change 12 to 15's. I want to throw that in your lap. So, in case 13 somebody's not good with that, we've got to rework -- 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We meet on the 22nd? 15 JUDGE TINLEY: 22nd is what I'm looking to on that 16 one, yeah. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You can't do much until after 18 we get the tax numbers -- tax roll numbers, 'cause that will 19 give us revenue size. So, we -- all we can kind of build is 20 a list of things we would like until after we get that next 21 set of numbers. 22 JUDGE TINLEY: I'm hoping we'll get the MGT thing 23 that -- that we can use to interface with those, and they may 24 relate to some restructuring issues too. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: When is that scheduled to -- 7-8-13 bwk 80 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: A month, 27th. Probably about 2 the first -- 3 COMMISSIONER OEHLER: 25th to 27th, somewhere -- 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 27th. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: 25th, yeah. 6 JUDGE TINLEY: So, our workshop schedule may have 7 to defer to that. 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 9 JUDGE TINLEY: Yeah, okay. Anything else, 10 gentlemen? Folks? We'll be adjourned on this workshop. 11 (Budget workshop adjourned at 3:07 p.m.) 12 - - - - - - - - - - 13 14 STATE OF TEXAS | 15 COUNTY OF KERR | 16 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 17 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 18 official reporter for the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 19 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 20 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 18th day of July, 2013. 21 22 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 23 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 24 Certified Shorthand Reporter 25 7-8-13 bwk