1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Budget Workshop 10 Monday, May 19, 2014 11 1:00 p.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: TOM POLLARD, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 TOM MOSER, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BOB REEVES, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X May 19, 2014 2 PAGE Participate in Budget Workshops with county departments, 3 including, but not limited to: 4 Information Technology 7 5 County Court at Law 20 6 County Court at Law/HB66 29 7 Jail Court 31 8 Veteran Services 38 9 198th D.A. 46 10 District Clerk, Jury -- 11 County Attorney 61 12 Human Resources 72 13 Auditor 76 14 County Judge 92 15 Mental Health 96 16 Commissioners Court 98 17 Court Appointed Civil Attorneys - CPS 101 18 Non-Departmental 102 19 County Court 123 20 Law Library 127 21 --- Adjourned 138 22 23 24 25 3 1 On Monday, May 19, 2014, at approximately 1:14 p.m., 2 a budget workshop of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was 3 held in the Commissioners Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay, we'll now go into budget 8 considerations, which is the next item on the agenda, budget 9 workshop. I'm trying to find that agenda page -- I got it 10 right here. This is to hold a workshop to participate in 11 budget workshops with county departments including, but not 12 limited to, Information Technology, County Court at Law, 13 County Court at Law/HB66, Jail Court, Veteran Services, 198th 14 D.A., Jury -- I skipped District Clerk, because I understand 15 the District Clerk is ill today, and we'll reserve that one 16 to another -- a subsequent session. Is that correct? 17 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 18 JUDGE POLLARD: Jury, County Attorney, Human 19 Resources, Auditor, County Judge, Mental Health, 20 Commissioners Court, Court-Appointed Civil Attorneys/C.P.S., 21 Nondepartmental, County Court. 22 MS. HARGIS: Okay. If you don't mind, Judge, I'd 23 like to address the budget books that y'all received. You 24 received an A through Z book, which is a rough draft very 25 similar to what Judge Tinley and I used to work off of. 5-19-14 bwk 4 1 Unfortunately, we didn't tab it for you, and the page numbers 2 were -- had a hole in them, so we apologize for that 3 inconvenience, and we want to thank Jody for helping us with 4 that. We have put tabs in two of the books, and once the 5 hearings are over, we will put your pages that you've already 6 written on back in there, but we will put them under tabs so 7 it will be easier for you to kind of -- with a table of 8 contents in front. So, once we get through, and then we will 9 put the new pages in behind -- in front of your handwritten 10 pages that you have so you can keep up with what changes that 11 you made. 'Cause we will make them here today, and then 12 we'll print new pages for those as we go along. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And you'll print the new 14 page and just get it back to me, and I can put it in my book? 15 MS. HARGIS: If you don't want the tabs. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's correct. 17 MS. HARGIS: Okay. You also received a lot of 18 funds that you have no statutory authority over, and most of 19 those are not even budgeted yet, because they're grant funds 20 in Adult Probation, Juvenile Probation, and we don't even 21 have their budgets yet. So, until we get them, which will 22 probably be in July, they won't even be put in the book. So, 23 you're welcome to have those pages, but I did want you to 24 know that they don't -- most of them you don't have. The 25 airport is budgeted, but that's the only one of the funds 5-19-14 bwk 5 1 that you have. Fund 16, we will do as close to the end of 2 the -- of September as possible, so that we have the right 3 numbers coming forward, the amount of money we have left. 4 And that's pretty much it. I just kind of wanted to explain 5 that before we got started. So, I guess we'll start with the 6 first one, then. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, may I ask a question 8 of the Auditor while -- before we get too far into it? You 9 need to help me understand something here. I only had two 10 days, so I didn't get to go through every line in this thing, 11 but I went through it, and I -- most of it, and the only 12 place that I could find in the budget that actually has 13 salary increases is your budget. I couldn't see any other 14 budget in there that had the salary increases already built 15 in there. 16 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is there a reason for that? 18 MS. HARGIS: All the others do have it. The ones 19 -- and my name is on the list. And we put all -- at the 20 request of Commissioner Letz, the Sheriff's Department is 21 showing those in the deputy section. The Elections is 22 showing that in the Elections section. Tim is showing it in 23 Fund 5 -- I mean Department 513, and then I think I.T. is 24 showing it in Fund 408. They're all in there. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're fixing to do I.T.? 5-19-14 bwk 6 1 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir. You received new pages. 2 The new pages are what were reflected, because you didn't 3 tell me that till Monday; the books were already printed, so 4 we added those pages. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I got the new pages with the 6 additional salary increases, but yours is already built in 7 there. 8 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir, it was, because I was having 9 to make sure that I stayed within -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, can we go back to my 11 question and have you answer that now, please? 12 MS. HARGIS: Why did mine have it originally? 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, ma'am, and no one 14 else's. 15 MS. HARGIS: Because I had to make sure that it was 16 within the 5 percent that could even be able to request 17 those. Because my statutory requirements say that I have to 18 be within 5 percent, so I wanted to show you that, and I 19 didn't want it to be a guess. And it's only a request. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Does yours have a court 21 order from the District Judges along with it? 22 MS. HARGIS: No, sir, I'm asking you first. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. I understand. 24 MS. HARGIS: I'm not doing that. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I simply asked a question. 5-19-14 bwk 7 1 Don't get hot, now. 2 MS. HARGIS: I'm not going through what I did last 3 year. I'm asking first. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. Do you want to go to -- 5 the first one on the list, I understand, is I.T. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. Who wants to tackle 8 that first? 9 MS. HARGIS: John? 10 JUDGE POLLARD: Any questions about it? 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, I have a question. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I just -- what I'm doing is 14 looking at the actual, and this will be a question to John. 15 The actual and total in 2012-2013 was 447,000, and it's 16 increased to 555,000, so -- and I know I'm not looking at 17 this current year, but that's a 24 percent increase in two 18 years. 19 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So help me, just at the top 21 level. I know -- 22 MR. TROLINGER: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And let me say one another 24 thing. I know that I.T. is becoming more and more important 25 in every department, because we're using it more; we're 5-19-14 bwk 8 1 becoming more efficient. But is there something else in 2 there -- give me some feel for a significant 25 -- 24 percent 3 increase. 4 MR. TROLINGER: Well, what you're seeing there 5 is -- salaries obviously compose a lot of it. And we did 6 have in there -- 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No, not -- 8 MR. TROLINGER: I believe I had a little bit of a 9 rise just from the cost-of-living and whatnot over that time 10 period. But significantly -- 11 JUDGE POLLARD: Well, just for the record, 12 that's -- they're small. 65,000 to 67,000. 88,000 to 13 91,000. So, let me take that off the -- that's not a big -- 14 MR. TROLINGER: But as we've digitized and gone to 15 more information technology and less paper; for example, the 16 elections -- well, that's not in this budget. Let me give 17 you a better example. The telephone line item, which 18 includes wireless devices, smart phones, and for the 19 elections in particular, wireless access at the different 20 facilities, we've had to increase the telephone line item. 21 And if you look at the telephone line item, you'll see that 22 over the years, as I've assimilated more of the telephone 23 systems and added and made more of those systems wireless, 24 and taken the old phone system and brought it into the new 25 digital system, that we've had a significant increase in the 5-19-14 bwk 9 1 telephone line item. We've also added fiberoptic connections 2 in every facility, as well as the original microwave network, 3 which was the primary system. So, as we've done that, the 4 telephone line item reflects the increases to all those 5 services. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You have had a big increase in 7 telephone. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: Actually, not too much. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, isn't it 69 to 84? Yes, 10 that's big. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 75 to 84. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No, I'm looking at '13; I'm 13 looking at actual. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: You're looking at actual. Current 15 budget is 75. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, 75. 17 JUDGE POLLARD: 75,7 to -- 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: -- 84. 20 MR. TROLINGER: The other item that brings it up 21 significantly is the software maintenance. For the first 22 five years after I started, we had locked in our software 23 maintenance to no increase, zero percent increase. We spent 24 quite a lot of money with our primary software vendor; a 25 million dollars, in fact. And one of the things I pulled in 5-19-14 bwk 10 1 was an agreement to lock in our maintenance rate to zero 2 percent increase for five years. Well, that expired, and now 3 we're taking the hit every year of about 8 percent, on 4 average, I think it is, increase on the software maintenance. 5 We also added systems that require us to pay additional 6 software maintenance. You know, we did -- in particular, in 7 the Tax Office, we changed systems, and when we did that, we 8 saw a little bit of a decrease in software maintenance. So, 9 overall, the -- the cost of software maintenance, it's people 10 at the other end of the phone in Plano, Texas that help us 11 and support the software. That's what's significantly driven 12 the I.T. budget. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Do they have any discussion of 14 why theirs increased so much? 15 MR. TROLINGER: Well, if -- 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Other than the catch-up we 17 got? 18 MR. TROLINGER: It's exactly that. I've sat down 19 with the management at the -- at our vendors that requested 20 the increases. They said, "Hey, look, you're very far behind 21 what a county your size is paying right now. We're a public 22 company, and we have to -- there are rules." And I said 23 "Well, tell me about the rules, please." And we ended up 24 with, instead of a significant jump, I think a less 25 significant jump to our software maintenance. They really 5-19-14 bwk 11 1 wanted to hit us hard, Commissioner. Ten percent per year is 2 what they were asking, and I think I've got them -- this year 3 there'll be a modest increase. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Last year to this year was 5 40,000 -- $40,000, about 25 percent. 6 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Last year to this year. 8 MR. TROLINGER: And we've added systems. We added 9 an entire system for voter registration that automates the -- 10 the overseas and -- 11 MS. BOLIN: All the mail-in ballots. 12 MR. TROLINGER: -- and the mail-in ballots. And it 13 allows us, instead of having stacks of paper -- well, we 14 still have that, but it allows us to account for -- to have 15 good accountability for those ballots as they come in, and as 16 we send them out. And it's an entire software system that we 17 now pay maintenance on that. That's an example of one of the 18 new systems we installed. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: One thing, I mean, just a point 20 of information. The telephone line item -- correct me if I'm 21 wrong -- used to be scattered with every department, and we 22 put them all in one budget, so there's that -- that's -- you 23 know, if you look back three years, that's part of the reason 24 there's a big jump there. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Same thing with the 5-19-14 bwk 12 1 computers. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm wondering what else. I 4 can't remember what all. 5 MR. TROLINGER: Lots of little things, but 6 basically my goal was -- was to take the I.T. budget and put 7 all those I.T. things in one place where the Commissioners 8 Court could see what we're spending on information 9 technology. Two schools of thought. You scatter it out; you 10 say, "Okay, well, the Tax Office has their line item with 11 their software," and it's hard to account for those things, 12 because there's a greater efficiency in paying through -- 13 through the software vendors that we use. To have myself -- 14 or to negotiate with them on a $200,000 line item and say, 15 "Hey, we want 20 percent off of this." Instead of doing it 16 across 19 different -- or eight or nine different 17 departments, for example. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I think the consolidated way 19 is the way we should go anyway. You actually can see it. 20 MR. TROLINGER: Thank you. 21 JUDGE POLLARD: Who is that vendor? 22 MR. TROLINGER: Tyler Technologies is the largest 23 dollar value. 24 JUDGE POLLARD: Are we tied into them contractually 25 so that we can't -- when they want an increase like that, we 5-19-14 bwk 13 1 can't go to some other vendor and say, "Hey, can we get the 2 same thing done cheaper?" 3 MR. TROLINGER: It's -- 4 JUDGE POLLARD: She's shaking her head no. 5 MR. TROLINGER: It's very expensive. It's about an 6 $800,000 to $900,000 thing to change vendors -- software 7 vendors. The conversion. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: So, once we committed to them, some 9 kind of contract, we're locked in then? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, what happened, Judge, is 11 that we got a good deal originally. We knew that the day of 12 reckoning would come. We were kind of -- we were one of the 13 trial counties when they set up the software, but the -- all 14 our software from 90 percent of our county work is all 15 through one program, which is Tyler Technology. To change 16 the maintenance, you have to change the whole software 17 package county-wide. 18 MR. TROLINGER: Good, thank you. That's very 19 helpful. Very good summary. And, for example, the Tax 20 Office decided that Tyler Technologies was not for them; they 21 weren't being helped enough. It wasn't being maintained the 22 way they wanted it. The features weren't there. We jumped 23 ship and we changed software companies in the Tax Office -- a 24 year and a half ago? 25 MS. BOLIN: No, last March. 5-19-14 bwk 14 1 MR. TROLINGER: Last March, one year ago. Little 2 over a year ago. So, it is doable if it's necessary. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's doable, but it's -- 4 certain offices are much harder, because the Tax Office can 5 be kind of stand-alone. When you get anything from the 6 judicial/law enforcement side, it's all very tied together. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Screwy. 8 MR. TROLINGER: So, what we did on the Tax Office 9 was, Central Appraisal had the vendor that we moved to, the 10 new vendor, so now we're integrated, Tax Office with Central 11 Appraisal. The server is -- the efficiency is much better 12 than it was before, so we're in a better place, in addition 13 to y'all moving away from the -- the primary software vendor 14 that was telling us 10 percent per year, take it or leave it. 15 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 16 COMMISSIONER REEVES: I've got a question; maybe 17 the Auditor can answer it. It's on your software 18 maintenance. You budgeted, current year, 200,987. 19 Year-to-date actual is 109,470, but yet you're projecting at 20 the end of the year $83,049? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good question. 22 COMMISSIONER REEVES: As the rookie, I don't really 23 understand that. How can the projected at the end of the 24 year be less than what you've already spent? 25 MS. HARGIS: Unfortunately, the one false, foul 5-19-14 bwk 15 1 thing in our software is the projections, and unless we 2 manually go in there and do them, they don't come out right. 3 It's based on a percentage, and we have tried everything, and 4 we can't get them to do it right. Believe me, it's the one 5 piece of that software I'd like to throw out, but I have to 6 live with it no matter what. We've tried everything; it 7 projects the whole system, all of our numbers. And -- and we 8 tried to put a percentage in there, and even though the 9 percentage is right, it still gives us the wrong numbers. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Isn't it pretty much -- it's 11 not all projections; it's only certain ones where we have -- 12 it seems like where we are very -- 13 MS. HARGIS: Well, it's the same amount, 'cause you 14 just have one. Unfortunately, if you look at some, they're 15 way over, and some are not. And it's telling it to do it the 16 same way for every single line item, and I apologize for 17 that, but there's really not a whole lot I can do about it. 18 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Do we know what, just for 19 I.T. Department, we're going to be projected at the year end? 20 MS. HARGIS: No, not right now, I do not. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's the reason I look at 22 the previous year actual, 'cause that's the reason. Then 23 I -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. 5-19-14 bwk 16 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: John? 2 MR. TROLINGER: Yes, sir? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Explain the -- your argument 4 for a new employee. 5 MR. TROLINGER: Thank you for asking. (Laughter.) 6 Over the past five years, I have resisted, and actually the 7 past three years, gotten up right to the budget process day, 8 and taken the paperwork that said I need a new I.T. person 9 and put it in my back pocket, because I don't want to spend 10 those dollars. I know that every tax dollar we get is 11 sometimes taken at gunpoint, and I value those dollars very 12 much. I will do everything I can to make it efficient and 13 minimize the cost, and personnel is a huge cost. But the 14 problem is, as you can see, the I.T. budget is growing on 15 these line items. We have more things. We have more 16 equipment. We support more things, but we've done it with 17 the same number of people, and we're really stretched. 18 We're at the point where this morning, I got up and 19 the elections started for early voting. Everything they do 20 is on a tablet or on a piece of electronics, and to support 21 that and also be able to support the -- you know, the 22 everyday things that the users need with the help desk, with 23 the -- you know, the phone calls, we're just stretched to the 24 limit. I could easily ask for one person for every 50 users 25 just for help desk for intense high-level support, for 5-19-14 bwk 17 1 instance, but I won't do that. That means we'd need six 2 people. So, what I do is I've adopted, on the help desk 3 side, kind of like we're outsourced, where we've hired 4 another company, and you have to call that company for help 5 or send them an e-mail and put in a ticket. So that every 6 time someone needs help from I.T., you know, there's a little 7 bit of a hurdle and a little bit of a process to go through, 8 and that's kept things efficient over the years. But I'm at 9 the point where it's just -- it's just not possible to do all 10 these things. 11 And the systems administration portion, I pointed 12 that out in my letter. I need more time on the systems admin 13 thing. We have more people trying to break in and steal 14 things from us. They want to steal our money, the bad guys 15 that break into the computers. You know, they're very smart, 16 and what they want to do is they want to take the money from 17 the Tax Office and transfer it and put it in their bank 18 account somewhere overseas. And that's a significant risk 19 that I face every day. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To get us -- we have a lot to 21 go through today. I'm going to ask you to convince 22 Commissioner Moser, who's your liaison, that you need another 23 person. 24 MR. TROLINGER: I thought I'd done that already. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Pretty much has. 5-19-14 bwk 18 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well -- 2 MR. TROLINGER: Thank you, sir. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We've talked. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Then, you know, when we 5 get to that point of looking at those numbers, I'll rely 6 heavily on that. Because, you know, you're liaison of that 7 office, far more involved than I am. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is it one person or two? 9 MR. TROLINGER: One. 10 MS. HARGIS: That includes all the benefits. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It says two. 12 MS. HARGIS: It includes all the benefits 13 associated with the salary. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. 15 MS. HARGIS: You've got two in your notes? 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, ma'am. 17 MS. HARGIS: You -- 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But I know "two" means 19 "one." I understand. (Laughter.) 20 MR. TROLINGER: And to let you know for budgeting 21 for this year, for projected, to go back to the question on 22 that, we -- we will spend that overtime money that I normally 23 do not touch, and that -- this part-time, I'll use every bit 24 of that this year. So that on the projection for this year, 25 when you look at I.T., you can expect that if we budgeted it, 5-19-14 bwk 19 1 we're going to spend it this year. In years past, I've used 2 it on an emergency basis or sporadically with interns from 3 Schreiner, but this year my plan is I'm going to have to use 4 all that, both the overtime, and there will be a budget 5 amendment probably into the part-time. 6 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Part-time this year is for 7 the intern, correct? 8 MR. TROLINGER: Yes. I was hoping to have a second 9 during the summer and have some overlap, but it looks like we 10 might just stretch through a little bit, stretch out the 11 first intern a little bit. He's got about 40 hours now, and 12 he's doing things. He's putting in phones and fixing 13 problems, installing things now. Thank you very much for 14 your consideration. And just bottom line is, we've taken on 15 a lot more responsibility, consolidated things, brought a lot 16 of efficiency. I think that it looks like we're spending a 17 lot more money, and we are spending more money, but we have 18 brought that from the other line items in the other 19 departments; we've brought that in, consolidated it into I.T. 20 over the years. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 22 MR. TROLINGER: You're welcome. 23 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. We'll go to County 24 Court at Law. 25 JUDGE BROWN: Can we get Kathy up here? 5-19-14 bwk 20 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Good to see you, Judge. 2 JUDGE BROWN: Good to be seen, thank you. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: I'm sure that's true. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Heard that before this 5 morning. 6 JUDGE POLLARD: Judge, it looks like your actual 7 goes from 347,000 to 386,000. 8 JUDGE BROWN: 379, isn't it, .8? I got 379,861, 9 requested budget. 10 JUDGE POLLARD: Administration Recommended. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Sold. 12 JUDGE BROWN: Sold. 13 JUDGE POLLARD: We'll take it. Get out of here. 14 JUDGE BROWN: Well, I don't know. That's what I've 15 got in my hand here. 16 MS. GAULDEN: Me too. 17 JUDGE BROWN: I mean, this is what you just handed 18 me. It says 386. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: There you go. 20 JUDGE BROWN: It went from 386 -- 21 MS. HARGIS: 367. 22 JUDGE BROWN: It went from 346 to 386. Is that 23 what you're looking at? 24 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. 347, yeah. 25 JUDGE BROWN: Where's the difference there? 5-19-14 bwk 21 1 MS. HARGIS: It's actually -- the current budget is 2 367,918. The new budget would be 386,885. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: It's about 30,000. 4 MS. GAULDEN: Part of that is going to go to 5 Court-appointed attorneys, which we're seeing a constant 6 increase in that. I mean, it's -- it's almost like every 7 week in court, we're appointing a lot of attorneys. 8 JUDGE BROWN: Yeah. 9 MS. GAULDEN: And I'd be real surprised if we don't 10 go over that 110. The other -- we did request some small 11 increases, like in the employee training. We're seeing 12 increases in seminar costs and hotel costs and that kind of 13 thing. That particular line item is for mine and Kelly's 14 required -- 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What line item are you on? 16 MS. GAULDEN: This is on the employee training. 17 It's 427-216. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Just read the last three. 19 What is it? 20 MS. GAULDEN: Sorry, 216. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: 216, okay. 22 MS. GAULDEN: And we are going to end up probably 23 about $400 over budget this year because of increases that we 24 were not -- 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's a 33 percent increase; 5-19-14 bwk 22 1 that's pretty high. 2 MS. GAULDEN: Well, we -- I mean, what do we do? 3 We sign up for required training that we have to go to, and 4 we have hotel costs and per diem and all that. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Nothing you can do about it. 6 There was a discussion on the radio about all these 7 continuing educations and what a -- a new industry that is. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What a racket it is. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, what a racket that is. 10 JUDGE BROWN: That is sort of a racket. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. So -- but that's a big 12 increase. 13 JUDGE POLLARD: On line item 105, Court 14 Coordinator, that goes up about $5,000 or $6,000. Is that 15 you? 16 MS. GAULDEN: Yes, sir. 17 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And a similar on 485; that's a 19 100 percent increase in the conferences, so -- 1,000 to 20 2,000. 21 MS. GAULDEN: Yes, sir. We did ask for increases 22 on several line items due to the fact that we're going to 23 have a new judge coming in January 1st, and we don't know at 24 this point how much she's going to have to go to. 25 JUDGE BROWN: He or she. 5-19-14 bwk 23 1 MS. GAULDEN: You know, how many conferences she's 2 going to have to attend. Sorry. (Laughter.) 3 JUDGE BROWN: To be politically correct here. 4 MS. GAULDEN: Okay. Anyway, we're not sure about 5 the extra costs we're going to encounter on that. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, if somebody didn't retire, 7 we'd save a thousand bucks. 8 MS. GAULDEN: Yeah. 9 JUDGE BROWN: Sorry. (Laughter.) 10 JUDGE POLLARD: I'm running into that, too. Even 11 when you have somebody that maybe doesn't even need the 12 training, you're still required by -- by TAC and several 13 people to go take a lot of training. And we're going to run 14 into that on me too, 'cause I got to go take a bunch of them 15 they're requiring me to take. 16 JUDGE BROWN: Yeah, I got to submit so many hours 17 every year. You do too. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Everybody does. That's the 19 racket. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's the racket. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's the racket. 22 JUDGE BROWN: Yeah. 23 MS. HARGIS: And the salaries reflect longevity. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I had -- I had a question, 25 Jeannie. 'Cause I know this isn't -- 5-19-14 bwk 24 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Is that what dictated the court 2 coordinator's raise, is that amount? Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: A big increase in the group 4 insurance. Is that the same percentage for everybody? Or 5 that's gone? 6 MS. HARGIS: No, this is what we're running into 7 with the small departments; that you can have a small 8 department of four or less employees, even, and if one person 9 carries family, they're not going to have enough money in 10 their budget to substantiate the group insurance. So we've 11 gone back in those small departments and we've fixed them so 12 that we don't have to do the budget amendment. A family cost 13 is an additional $8,000 over and above what they contribute, 14 so if you've got three people at seven -- 7,860, which is 15 what we put in there, and one of them's carrying family, 16 they're going to be $8,000 under in their budget. So, we 17 have tried to fix these small departments in the beginning 18 rather than at the end. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tell me again, now, how you 20 were fixing them -- how you fixed them. Do you talk to them 21 and find out who's going to the family plan or anything? 22 MS. HARGIS: Well, right now -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How do you fix it? 24 MS. HARGIS: The current employees, this is what we 25 have. 5-19-14 bwk 25 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. Okay, yeah. 2 MS. HARGIS: Based on what the current employees in 3 that department have today is what we base it on. Next year 4 it could be different. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: But in the past, you didn't list it 6 at what you thought it was going to be, so we had to come 7 back with budget amendments. 8 MS. HARGIS: Well, we had to do -- 9 JUDGE POLLARD: Am I understanding that correctly? 10 MS. HARGIS: We had 25 budget amendments just at 11 the last court meeting, and so rather than have those, I 12 would rather put the right amount of money there in the 13 beginning. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I would -- we would rather 15 you do, too. 16 MS. HARGIS: I mean, we have enough in our group 17 insurance within the system, because we budget enough to pay 18 the premium, but it just makes it more difficult for me to 19 find money in other departments for group insurance and 20 things. This way we don't have to worry about that from the 21 beginning. 22 COMMISSIONER REEVES: What you're saying is that 23 the Sheriff's Department, as many people as are there, one 24 increase doesn't substantially change what you have, but when 25 you only have three or four, one increase blows the budget. 5-19-14 bwk 26 1 MS. HARGIS: One person taking family coverage. 2 And the same thing in my department. We have two of us that 3 don't take -- just by ourselves, but we have two on family, 4 so we're out of budget. 5 MS. LANTZ: It truly happens when employees either 6 leave or come on board with us. One individual may have 7 family coverage and leave us, and the new one that comes on 8 will only take employee coverage. So, it's a constant -- it 9 changes constantly in those figures. So, she's trying to 10 make sure we have more to where we don't overbudget that line 11 item. Plus I think in that, we're possibly going to see a 10 12 to 12 percent increase on our insurance, is what TAC has come 13 out with. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Now, is that built in here? 15 MS. HARGIS: No, sir, it's not. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: When do you do that? 17 MS. HARGIS: When they bring the premium over. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Will that be before October 19 1? Or -- 20 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir. They're supposed to come 21 and present this, I understand, the first week of July. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh. 23 MS. HARGIS: Because, remember, we changed our 24 calendar. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, I do remember that. 5-19-14 bwk 27 1 Thank you for reminding me. Will they present it to the 2 Court? 3 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, cool. 5 MS. HARGIS: I would rather put the right amount in 6 there than guess, because our budget is pretty -- pretty 7 large as it is. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Back to this Court-appointed 9 attorney thing. Just in this one department, it's a $10,000 10 increase. It makes the public defender thing look a little 11 bit better to me. I'm telling you, man, it needs to be 12 considered. 13 JUDGE POLLARD: Might combine it with ad litems and 14 all of that out of juvenile delinquency and stuff, all of 15 that. Because every time I'm having a hearing down there, 16 I'm approving ad litem fees. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure. 18 JUDGE POLLARD: And that's getting to be quite a 19 few hearings. 20 JUDGE BROWN: There's two sides to that coin. You 21 better look into it, okay? I mean, I'm not going to get into 22 it. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Of course there's two sides 24 to it. I'm just saying there's 10,000 bucks in yours, an 25 increase from one year to another. And I'm just saying a 5-19-14 bwk 28 1 public defender needs to be looked at, that's all. There's 2 probably some down side to having a public defender. I heard 3 you say that before. 4 JUDGE BROWN: How much are we spending? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 110. 6 JUDGE BROWN: 110,000? How much is it going to 7 cost you to have a public defender's office with a secretary 8 and -- 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm not getting into that. 10 JUDGE BROWN: I'm just telling you. An assistant. 11 Seriously, you better analyze that. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And then in two years, you 13 get -- going up 20,000. I mean, it just -- 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There's definitely a point -- 15 there's a point when you have to make that change. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. It just keeps going 17 up. 18 JUDGE POLLARD: This is not on the agenda, but I 19 can tell you that I've talked to TAC about that too, and TAC 20 doesn't -- doesn't favor a one-county -- 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: -- situation there. They want you 23 to set up a public defender's office for several counties, so 24 they can all subsidize it and each share a part of it. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That doesn't work here. 5-19-14 bwk 29 1 JUDGE POLLARD: That's just what TAC's position on 2 it is. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I know. I know. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: Thanks, Judge. 6 JUDGE BROWN: Thank you. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, sir. 8 JUDGE BROWN: May we be excused? 9 JUDGE POLLARD: Yes, sir. 10 JUDGE BROWN: See y'all later. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: What's the difference between 12 County Court at Law/HB-66 and the County Court at Law? 13 MS. PIEPER: HB-66 is judicial supplement. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: Is a what? 15 MS. PIEPER: Judicial supplement. 16 JUDGE POLLARD: That's the supplement. 17 JUDGE BROWN: What about it? Let me find out. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There's another page back 19 here. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: No questions? No problems with it? 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No questions from me. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 23 JUDGE BROWN: Okay. I didn't -- 24 JUDGE POLLARD: Thank you. 25 JUDGE BROWN: Thank you. 5-19-14 bwk 30 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Jail Court. 2 MS. HARGIS: Before you get into that, can I ask a 3 question? We're not cutting anything, so I'm not moving 4 anything. Are we planning to make the cuts as we go along, 5 or what are we doing here? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I think if there's 7 something drastic today, that we'll whack on it. But I 8 haven't seen anything -- 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. If I don't see 10 anything, I would say -- 11 MS. HARGIS: I just wanted to know what y'all -- 12 the process. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I would assume that 14 we'll think about this after today for a few days, and as we 15 go along with it, we're going to be able to see. And then 16 once the numbers start coming in from the income side, we're 17 going to be able to see whether we need to go back and whack 18 on it or not. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: I am not waiving my right to come 20 back and whack. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Absolutely not. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm sure there will be 24 whacking going on. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: But for right now, I guess you 5-19-14 bwk 31 1 don't make any changes. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But you could on this one. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: Veterans Services? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, Jail Court. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: Jail Court? All right. 6 MS. HARGIS: The only thing on the Jail Court is 7 the prosecutor, and I don't -- I haven't gotten a report on 8 that in a while. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't believe they're using 10 a special prosecutor that I've seen any more. It's -- the 11 two D.A.'s are handling it in office. Ralph Behrens, that's 12 been discontinued. 13 MS. HARGIS: Lucy's still doing -- 14 MS. STEBBINS: She's not the prosecutor; she does 15 the defense work. 16 MS. HARGIS: Oh, that's right. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But there is no special 18 prosecutor any more like Ralph Behrens. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So we can delete 36,000? 20 MS. HARGIS: No. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Bruce will probably holler, 22 but -- 23 MS. HARGIS: No, that's -- I was wrong. That's the 24 defense side, I'm sorry. I got corrected. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the special judge is 5-19-14 bwk 32 1 zeroed out. And I know 198th Judge has been going out there, 2 but I went out there Friday morning just to be nosy like I 3 do, and Judge Ables was sitting on the bench. Now, how does 4 he get paid? 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I really don't know. They've 6 had some conferences lately where both judges were gone, and 7 Judge Ables and Judge Barton sat on the bench some with both 8 of them. I assume that's working -- 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: These guys get paid from 10 somewhere. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't know. 12 MS. HARGIS: Judge Ables generally, when he just 13 stands in for the District Judges, doesn't charge us. Now, 14 we do pay Judge Barton. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Say that last part real 16 quick? 17 MS. HARGIS: We do pay Judge Barton when he -- they 18 try to take that out of the Region 6 money. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm sure that's where 20 Steve's is coming from, too. 21 MS. HARGIS: And then -- well, he gets so much for 22 being a region judge. But when we needed them in Judge 23 Brown's court, we did pay them, but that came out of Judge 24 Brown's budget. So -- but normally Judge Ables doesn't 25 charge the county -- Kerr County anything -- 5-19-14 bwk 33 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 2 MS. HARGIS: -- when he does that. Unless he -- 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So we need to leave it 4 zeroed out, then? 5 MS. HARGIS: This is just for the defense attorneys 6 to defend, so we just -- you have one attorney that's kind of 7 like a public defender -- is our public defender for jail. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But I'm not sure what the -- I 9 hate to -- 10 JUDGE POLLARD: For indigence? 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But with the Michael Morton 12 Act that got passed, I'm not sure how effective that part is. 13 You may have to ask the D.A.'s, because that changed 14 everything on being able to fast-track people through the 15 court system, which was the whole purpose of the jail court. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That is true. 17 JUDGE POLLARD: This is for appointment for 18 attorneys for indigence in that court -- in the jail? 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, what this is, Your Honor, 20 if I may say, a few years ago, this Court created what was 21 called the jail court, okay? It was just an extra day they 22 could bring in a different prosecutor and judge so that we 23 could try and fast-track inmates that were in jail on 24 V.O.P.'s or just wanted to plead guilty and get it taken care 25 of. They had started out with about three defense attorneys 5-19-14 bwk 34 1 that would work with them and get it done. It kind of went 2 down to Lucy Pearson doing it, and it got done, and it was 3 just a quick way of -- of helping with the jail population 4 when we were getting so overcrowded, okay? Last year, then, 5 with the realignment of the districts and that, it kind of 6 freed up more time in the current two courts, the 198th and 7 the 216th, so what happened, Rex started being the judge on 8 it, just doing it himself mostly. They did away with Ralph's 9 spot -- Ralph Behrens was the prosecutor -- and now I think 10 the prosecutors are just handling it. 11 Bruce has more prosecutors than the 198th; I don't 12 know where he's paying or getting that funding from for those 13 extra prosecutors, but -- and then Lucy Pearson was doing a 14 lot -- most of the defense work, to where it could be just 15 done real quick, you know, make sure the inmates have their 16 rights done and everything. But then when the Michael Morton 17 Act got passed last year at the Legislature, it kind of 18 changed everything. Everything kind of came to a screeching 19 halt because of all the new hoops that the defense attorneys 20 and the prosecutors all have to jump through to make sure 21 that the Legislature is happy with the way they're -- our 22 inmates are being treated, I guess you might say. 23 JUDGE POLLARD: I guess the bottom line question 24 is, Sheriff, can we -- can we delete this 36,000 now, or is 25 it still needed? 5-19-14 bwk 35 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I think the two District 2 Judges would be the best ones to ask; they're the ones doing 3 it. But as far as I know, it probably can be deleted, unless 4 they could use it in the other -- 5 MR. MONROE: We still see it occasionally on pleas, 6 where we'll do a plea, and Lucy Pearson will call it a 7 fast-track plea, which is the old terminology they used to 8 use. Doesn't happen very often. We still see it some. So, 9 I'd say I doubt that Judge Williams or Judge Emerson would 10 recommend totally deleting it, but -- but the Sheriff is 11 right, that's drawing to a close because of the Michael 12 Morton Act. And what that did was require prosecutors to 13 specifically itemize their various discovery that they're 14 giving to defense lawyers, but the defense lawyer and the 15 defendant have to sign on that they've received it and 16 reviewed it, which means these defendants that get arrested 17 on Saturday night and say, you know, "It was methamphetamine; 18 let me just plead out Monday," we can't do that any more. 19 We've got to go through the process. We've got to give them 20 the discovery. The lawyer's got to sign off that they've 21 seen it. The defendant's got to sign off that he's seen it. 22 And so those expedited pleas are becoming a thing of the 23 past. The Legislature may tweak that next time around, once 24 they see that it had that effect, but right now that's what 25 we're doing. 5-19-14 bwk 36 1 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: So, I don't know. 2 JUDGE POLLARD: So right now, should we cut it in 3 half? Would that be a practical approach? 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I think Lucy probably will end 5 up going just to act as another Court-appointed attorney, and 6 not a special deal for individual cases. I don't know what 7 to tell y'all to do on that. 8 MR. MONROE: I think I would defer that to the 9 District Judges. They're going to be a little bit better to 10 tell you whether or not, as a practical matter, that still 11 exists in the same context as it did before. I know Lucy is 12 still doing it. Since we don't have the -- the jail court 13 any more like we used to have, it was a specialized day for 14 that, it just changed the context of it. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: The actuals in 2012-2013 were 16 like 24,000. Why don't we just cut it back to 24,000? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean -- 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And then discuss it if we -- 19 JUDGE POLLARD: I think we better wait and talk to 20 the District Judges. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 22 MR. MONROE: They may well concur with that. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The -- I went out there 24 Friday just to take a peek, and the place was packed with 25 people. I mean, it's like a real courtroom. 5-19-14 bwk 37 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Did you have trouble getting out? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I had trouble getting out, 3 and that was -- 4 MR. MONROE: Kind of like a real courtroom. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: There's lawyers wandering around 6 everywhere, you know, that kind of thing. That's a dangerous 7 situation. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Awful. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But what they did, Buster, on 10 a lot of that is they have changed the regular court dates to 11 try and do more of the inmates that would be on normal court 12 days, but you do them out there. So, it's not necessarily a 13 jail court. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, I see. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's doing pleas; it's just 16 splitting up part of -- they're getting so big up here, they 17 try and divide it up. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Maybe that's what was going 19 on. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's why it got so crazy. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I tell you, this jail court, 22 I still say it's a wonderful thing. If the state government 23 will leave us alone, they'd get them in and out of there. 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It was fabulous until the 25 Michael Morton Act. 5-19-14 bwk 38 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Good objective. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Really good idea. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. We want to defer on that 4 till we get some information from the District Judges? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 6 JUDGE POLLARD: And who's going to be in charge of 7 the responsibility of talking to the District Judges about 8 that and getting back to us? 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Jody. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I've got it on my yellow pad. 11 When they're here, we can ask them. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. All right. Anything else on 13 that one? If not, we'll go on to Veteran Services, Page 33. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Maggie, how are you doing? 15 MS. BAKER: I'm doing fine. 16 JUDGE POLLARD: Maggie, did you get the word about 17 checking with some other suppliers? 18 MS. BAKER: Yes, sir. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: Vendors? And I don't suppose 20 you've had time to get that done yet, or any of it? 21 MS. BAKER: No, sir. I was gone all last week with 22 training, so -- 23 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 24 MS. BAKER: I got a lot of my e-mails this morning. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: I just wanted to make sure you got 5-19-14 bwk 39 1 the word. 2 MS. BAKER: Yes, sir. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How are we doing with the 5 gas, oil and maintenance and all that? I mean, your 6 transportation. I mean, how are you doing so far? 7 MS. BAKER: It's doing really well. I mean, I 8 travel, you know, a lot around town, and I did go to San 9 Antonio last week in the car, and went over and back, and 10 filled up with $50. So -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I had a phone call last week 12 from one of the veterans guys that had requested you to pick 13 up some family members, I think, and take them somewhere, and 14 you refused to do that. 15 MS. BAKER: Well, I know I -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Or something like that. He 17 wanted me to change your ruling, and I thought, "Wait a 18 minute, we're doing a taxi service for people now?" 19 MS. BAKER: Right. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: What was that? 21 MS. BAKER: There's another gentleman who's a 22 V.S.O. in this town. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Correct. 24 MS. BAKER: And he said that even though there's 25 like eight employees that work in that office, that none of 5-19-14 bwk 40 1 them could take this person, and so they wanted me to. When 2 I worked at that other organization, that was part of my job, 3 and it was part of my budget and everything. And when I 4 first started here, I asked about that, and I was told that 5 the insurance probably wouldn't cover it, and that if I used 6 my own vehicle, that I'd be using my own insurance, and I 7 didn't think that was -- that was a good idea. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: Your own insurance company wouldn't 9 like that. 10 MS. BAKER: No. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We talked, and my response was 12 exactly the same as yours, Commissioner, that this is not 13 intended to be a taxi service. There's volunteer groups 14 around town that will assist in that. We'll help coordinate 15 it, but that's not the -- that's not our job. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I appreciate you standing 17 firm with the rules. I do. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I have a question for you, 19 Maggie. 20 MS. BAKER: Okay. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I was talking about 22 conferences a while ago, and you have $1,200 for conferences. 23 And my question is, is that enough? 24 MS. BAKER: Well, the first one I had last week was 25 paid by Texas Veterans Commission. 5-19-14 bwk 41 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 2 MS. BAKER: They do one a year. Now, if there's 3 any other training, like there's going to be the fall 4 conference, and that's in September. That's going to be in 5 Houston, and I believe that's a four-day conference. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Mm-hmm. 7 MS. BAKER: So, as far as I know, I've checked with 8 Tami King in Gillespie County. She seems to think that as of 9 right now, just for that one concert -- or conference, it's 10 going to be, like, between $800 to $1,000. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. So that's what's in 12 here? 13 MS. BAKER: Yes. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. All right. I just 15 wanted to make sure, since you -- you're the new kid on the 16 block. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Go up to the newsletter, and 18 that's -- and it's in here mainly because I thought it was 19 something we should talk about. Maggie thinks it's a good 20 idea, and I concur that a monthly newsletter will be a good 21 thing to go out from the Court, but it shouldn't just be a -- 22 you know, a piece of Xerox paper folded. It ought to be 23 something that looks like a newsletter, and that was the cost 24 that she has in there, $3,400 in there. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: That's for printing cost or what? 5-19-14 bwk 42 1 Postage? 2 MS. BAKER: No, that's for printing. That's to get 3 everything -- 4 JUDGE POLLARD: How do you distribute it? 5 MS. BAKER: That would be -- some would go through 6 e-mail, and then some would go, like, with -- just, like, to 7 county offices, and then with, like, a couple hotels, the 8 Chamber of Commerce and the Visitors Center. And I could 9 just take those, and that would be included in my budget. 10 JUDGE POLLARD: So there's no postage in here? 11 MS. BAKER: No. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Not on that. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Just e-mail them. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And we talked about there's a 15 service called iContact that a lot of businesses use that you 16 can do it through that, through e-mail, but have some hard 17 copies out there. And I put it -- I told Maggie to put it in 18 her budget so we could discuss it here. Is that something 19 that we think is a good idea or not? 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I do. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, it seems to me that it 22 would be a way to get information out. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And I think as part of it, we 24 identified for Maggie's job to help people understand what's 25 available to them that they might not know about, so that's a 5-19-14 bwk 43 1 good reason for -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: $3,400 for printing costs. And 3 if it doesn't work, no one's picking them up, we can always 4 stop it midyear. 5 MS. BAKER: Well, that budget can also be cut in 6 half. Last week at training, the president of the County 7 Veteran Service Officers said that a lot of the C.V.S.O.'s 8 are going into doing, like, a Facebook page, and so that 9 could be partly on that. I don't know how you feel about 10 Facebook, but you could set up a page for Kerr County Veteran 11 Service Officer's information about all the county stuff that 12 goes on with veterans, and then the other half could be out 13 of budget as actually printing. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: Well, have you checked into 15 Facebook fairly recently and the cost of it? That's a pretty 16 sizable cost. 17 MS. BAKER: To set up? No, there's -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's free. It depends on if 19 you have someone doing it for you, or you -- 20 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. Because we got I.T. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Individuals can do it, really, 22 or groups can do it for free. But the question would be, how 23 many veterans use Facebook? You know, that would be the 24 other thing. 25 MS. BAKER: Right. 5-19-14 bwk 44 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Anyway -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Something that we need to go 3 through. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We can figure it out. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The question that I did have, 6 Maggie, was the operating equipment carried over, the 6,000. 7 MS. BAKER: Okay. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not sure you -- I mean, I 9 think your office is pretty much outfitted. I don't know 10 that we need a -- maybe $1,000 there, to me. 11 MS. BAKER: There's just a few more things, but I 12 guess part of that would be used for -- in case there is 13 extra for the -- for conferences, if I would need something 14 like that. You know, so I wouldn't really need the whole 15 6,000, but probably part of that. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You know, maybe 2,000? 17 MS. BAKER: That would -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So reduce that to 2,000. 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. 20 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Reduce it to, or by? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To 2,000. 22 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Reduce it by 4,000. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Back to the Facebook thing, 24 now, we're still trying to target those folks out there that 25 are unable, for whatever reason, to get their benefits. 5-19-14 bwk 45 1 MS. BAKER: Right. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And we think that if we did 3 a Facebook thing, that -- I just don't see that, but I -- I 4 certainly could be wrong. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's probably, 6 Commissioner, more awareness that we have a veteran service 7 officer here to help. I don't know that you -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I see the newsletter. 9 I understand the newsletter. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I don't -- Facebook, I'm 11 not so sure of myself, but -- you know. 12 COMMISSIONER REEVES: I think a lot of the current 13 returning veterans from the current conflicts will be using 14 Facebook a lot more than we would anticipate, and I think 15 it's a good way to get out to the people what's available. 16 They'll be using it a lot more than anything. 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I agree with you. Facebook's 18 easy and cheap. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, is Facebook a better 20 vehicle than -- what's another one of those things? 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Twitter. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Twitter? 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Oh, yeah. 24 MS. BAKER: I've never used Twitter. I don't 25 know -- 5-19-14 bwk 46 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I can't spell Twitter. I 2 don't even know what that is, but I know a lot of people that 3 use Twitter are trying to get me to do the Twitter thing. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's just 28 words. 5 MR. ROBLES: You can only use, like, 120 6 characters, like a paragraph. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: But anyway, Facebook is -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good job. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We don't need to micromanage 12 that. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: Thank you, ma'am. 198th D.A., and 15 it's on Pages 35, 274, and 277. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, boy. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You can cut his, Judge. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Hey, Rusty, watch 19 this. (Laughter.) 20 MR. MONROE: You know, once you lose the respect, 21 you never gain it back. (Laughter.) Never get it back. We 22 just had the veteran services. Anybody have any questions 23 about how we picked on a veteran, the jury trial last week? 24 I'm being facetious. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No questions whatsoever. 5-19-14 bwk 47 1 Thank you for doing that. 2 MR. MONROE: I'm not sure the newspaper saw the 3 same trial that we presented. That's a subject for another 4 day. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What is the account number? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's see, it's 445. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: 445? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. And 445 and -- 9 MS. HARGIS: This gets into the other funds. The 10 only -- Fund 84 and the other funds are their funds. The 84 11 is the consolidated fund that he has his whole budget in that 12 comprises both Bandera County and Kerr County. The Fund 94 13 and 95 are forfeiture funds and seizure funds that this Court 14 doesn't budget. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, we're looking at 10-445 16 now? 17 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, the 10-445 is our portion of the 18 198th budget. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Have a nice year. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And so doing my thing of 21 looking at actual, 2013 was 205, and now we're asking 327. 22 MS. HARGIS: Which -- 23 MR. MONROE: I don't think it's quite that much of 24 an increase, Commissioner. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, I'm looking at 445-570. 5-19-14 bwk 48 1 Oh, that's capital outlay. Sorry about that. That was all 2 the -- no, I was looking at total. Total -- are we looking 3 at 10-445, 198th? 4 JUDGE POLLARD: This changes. 5 MS. HARGIS: 327 is correct. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: 205 to 327, 30 percent 7 increase. 8 MR. DEAN: I believe the discrepancy is going to be 9 on some of the reimbursements. Ms. Hargis can probably speak 10 to that. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I'm talking about 12 expenditures. 13 MR. DEAN: Yes, sir. I believe she's listing them 14 there in Incode, but I believe these are reimbursements that 15 are actually coming from the State that offset the -- 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I'm not talking about 17 reimbursements, I'm talking about expenditures. 18 MR. MONROE: Commissioner, with all due respect, 19 I've got a little sheet here on the budget. I don't have 20 that in front of me. I'm happy to address that if I can have 21 what you've got. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's what we're looking at. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: If you look on Page 274, you'll 24 see his total budget for all the counties. It's 84,445. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: 84,445. 5-19-14 bwk 49 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's his whole budget. You 2 will have to take our percentage part that's on Fund 10, but 3 it shows you where the changes are. 4 COMMISSIONER REEVES: So, take this times the 5 percent that the county -- that Kerr County does? 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Our percentage. 7 MS. HARGIS: That's our percentage of his budget. 8 And he has been using -- he's been using forfeiture money for 9 some of his employees, and so this year he moved the final -- 10 the final employee over from the forfeiture fund. Keep in 11 mind, we're -- there's only two counties sharing this budget 12 now. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, Jeannie, I still have my 14 fundamental question on your stuff, and that's what we're 15 looking at. 16 MS. HARGIS: Okay. You should have four line 17 items; is that correct? 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. 19 MS. HARGIS: Okay. The first one is the county 20 supplement. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Hey, Jeannie, I'm asking about 22 445-330 expenditures. 23 MS. HARGIS: Expenditures, it's one-half of his 24 budget. He just handed it to you, and if you'll look at it, 25 based on our population and Bandera's population, we are 5-19-14 bwk 50 1 greater than 50 percent of that budget, so our share -- 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Let me ask you -- would you 3 just let me ask my question? Why does it go from 205 to 327? 4 MS. HARGIS: From 265. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, I'm not looking at 6 projected. You said don't look at projected. I'm looking at 7 last year actual, 205. 8 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir. He had -- 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: This year requested, 327. 10 MS. HARGIS: He had two employees last year. They 11 were not included in there because he was paying them out of 12 forfeiture money. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, that answers my 14 question. So, that's two employees increase in this budget 15 item. 16 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. 17 MS. HARGIS: Just one. Just one now. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You answered my question. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: And I saw in your request -- budget 20 request too, Scott, where you wanted to switch over people 21 from those other funds to salary. 22 MR. MONROE: Yeah. A little historical background; 23 y'all probably know more about it than I do. I inherited an 24 office and a staff that -- and I want to be real careful 25 about how much we talk about forfeiture, and the reason 5-19-14 bwk 51 1 being, I've got a quorum of my forfeiture committee right 2 here. And that's -- I might want to ask Rusty to step out. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'd be more than happy to step 4 out. 5 MR. MONROE: Need to be careful there. One of the 6 things that I felt it was responsible for me to do, for a 7 number of reasons, was to shift my employees that were being 8 paid out of forfeiture money over into regular operating 9 money, because the forfeiture has got a life expectancy 10 that's ending. So, the one employee now that I still have 11 that's being paid by forfeiture happens to be sitting in 12 here, but that is basically the increase that I am requesting 13 this year, is to shift that last investigator out of 14 forfeiture into mainstream money. It's affected me in a 15 bunch of different ways, one being reluctant to address how I 16 spend forfeiture money, because I don't know what employees I 17 still got to pay out of it. I believe my staff is necessary. 18 I use everybody over there in probably a lot of ways they 19 don't want to be used, but I'm not really asking for a change 20 other than I'm shifting over who's paying for it. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Let me -- Buster probably 22 remembers this, but for the rest of the Court, the previous 23 D.A. had a huge forfeiture fund, very large. He grew his 24 staff and paid them out of that, so it bypassed this Court. 25 So, the Legislature -- 5-19-14 bwk 52 1 JUDGE POLLARD: I don't know if that was his total 2 motivation, but it was -- 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It wasn't his motivation, but 4 it happened that way. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: He wasn't responsible to this -- 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Court. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: -- to report it to the Court. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, he wasn't responsible. 9 They were working; I mean, it's not like they were being paid 10 and not doing it. They were doing the work. He had a huge 11 forfeiture fund which he was able to use, and it helped the 12 county taxpayers because he was able to fund stuff out of 13 that budget as opposed to the general budget. The 14 Legislature, for whatever reason, decided that the 198th 15 forfeiture fund would now be under the oversight of three 16 people that were named by Representative Hilderbran, and that 17 fund is no longer -- the forfeiture fund is being reduced, 18 and the current D.A. is trying to get those people onto the 19 county's general fund tax roll, which is -- I think everyone 20 kind of thinks that's probably the right way to do it, where 21 it should be. 22 MR. MONROE: And -- 23 JUDGE POLLARD: That's the way the Legislature 24 wants it done, for sure. 25 MR. MONROE: That's right. With respect to the 5-19-14 bwk 53 1 198th, it is. Because, notice, the 452nd gets no oversight 2 committee, but the 198th kept theirs. And the primary 3 generation of the forfeiture money was an employee that we no 4 longer have. You know, I -- although I think it had, for the 5 most part, been discontinued by the time I took office, I did 6 not continue the interdiction program out there that was 7 generating forfeiture money. I just personally felt like it 8 was a conflict of the D.A.'s office getting a -- a larger 9 percentage, because we are the -- the agency generating the 10 forfeiture. We would then have to pick a law enforcement 11 agency in the county that would share what usually used to be 12 the D.A.'s percentage; then it's going to the 198th judge to 13 approve or disapprove the forfeiture. I just felt like it 14 was not appropriate. There's still counties that do that, 15 and apparently do fine, but I don't. So, I can't say that 16 the well is totally dry on forfeitures, but I think for the 17 most part, it is. There -- nobody is actually out on the 18 interstate looking for forfeitures any more. Not here, 19 anyway. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: We're all dancing around really 21 sensitive issues here without talking about them, so -- so 22 suffice it to say this is what the Legislature wants, and it 23 probably is the best way to do it. 24 MR. MONROE: I believe so. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay? 5-19-14 bwk 54 1 MR. MONROE: I believe so. We -- we're still 2 learning with a two-county district, from six. Logistically, 3 our lives got much better September the 1st. I mean, if you 4 can just imagine, before, we had six grand juries every 5 month, and in theory, six pretrials every month. We could 6 not do six jury trials a month; there's not six weeks in a 7 month, but we had a jury trial setting every single week of 8 every month for the rest of the year. When we took on 9 Bandera and lost the other five counties, we didn't increase 10 the jury trial settings, because it gave the judge a chance 11 to add a civil trial setting in each of those counties that 12 was separate and apart from the criminal trials. Used to be 13 that they overlapped, and the civil case didn't go unless the 14 criminal case fell apart. Now that we're able to do that, 15 we've always been -- 16 JUDGE POLLARD: Most of the time. 17 MR. MONROE: That's right. We've always been able 18 to add an extra pretrial day, which is what Rusty's talking 19 about, out at the jail. Which before we didn't have enough 20 Fridays in a month to do that, because we had grand juries on 21 the Fridays. But we're able do that now, so we're moving 22 cases faster. Michael Morton Act is going to affect that, 23 and I don't know -- we throw that phrase out off our tongues 24 so easily, and I'm not sure y'all are familiar with what the 25 Morton Act is. And no question, that was a prosecutor that 5-19-14 bwk 55 1 did some things he should haven't done. I don't think most 2 of the prosecutors do that, but the effect of it is that 3 we've got to be very, very deliberate on discovery. And I 4 think you'll see it in some other areas. I think you're 5 going to see it in defense lawyer costs, which -- and I'm not 6 for or against the public defender's office. You know, I'm 7 -- I'm up there whether y'all have -- do it that way or not. 8 But they'll have the same thing. It will affect the public 9 defender's office the same way. They just can't rush these 10 things through any more. 11 It's probably going to be, per se, ineffective 12 assistance of counsel to not comply with that act until the 13 Legislature tweaks it a little bit. So, we're just wading 14 our way through it. Really, what we're trying to document is 15 -- are the ways that it's working and the ways it's not 16 working, so when the next legislative session comes up, we 17 can say, "Look, we understand what your guys were doing, and 18 it's a great idea, but we need to tweak this a little bit 19 because it's not having the desired effect." But I think 20 you're going to see an increased cost in Court-appointed 21 lawyers. They're now going to have to do more than they had 22 to do before, and maybe they should be, but there's no 23 question there is going to be now. 24 But -- and if you have my little budget with red, 25 and Kyle did that, and you see on there the primary cost 5-19-14 bwk 56 1 increases are the result of moving that last spot over into 2 county money. And so that's going to change, the FICA's 3 going to change, the health insurance some. If you see the 4 zeros on the budget, I did this basically because those are 5 line items that the 216th has in theirs. I'm just trying to 6 make it where we're all speaking the same language. As far 7 as other than salaries, the two counties are not spending a 8 whole lot of money on my office. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Are the percentages based on 10 population? 11 MR. MONROE: Yes. We've sent a copy of this to 12 Judge Evans as well. I have not gotten feedback from him. 13 We'll meet with Judge Evans whenever he's ready to meet with 14 us. But, you know, we made no secret with him on the -- when 15 we brought Bandera County in, I told him that my desire was 16 to get my staff out of forfeiture funds and into county funds 17 so they had some life expectancy and some job security that 18 was not dependent on a forfeiture budget. So, I don't know 19 how Bandera County will feel about that, other than they've 20 been made aware that it's coming as well, so it's not going 21 to be a surprise that I'm requesting out of them. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: I'm surprised there isn't a bigger 23 population difference between us and Bandera County than 24 that. 25 MR. MONROE: It's been -- it's been pretty much a 5-19-14 bwk 57 1 wash as far as case load goes. My five counties previously 2 combined, Bandera County's generating about that much, if not 3 a little bit more than those counties. Of course, we're the 4 new guys, so we're getting some cases resubmitted to us that 5 we watch for, and kind of wondered how come it was turned 6 down the first time, and that's why he's sending it to us 7 again. But I think they're very pleased, because they have 8 access to us that they just didn't have before. You know, 9 Bruce was busy and he was spread out, and so I think it's 10 working out fine. I think Bandera County is very pleased. 11 We traditionally believe there's two things that affect 12 criminal behavior. One is freedom, and another one is your 13 pocketbook, and so we've done the latter pretty heavily, I 14 think. And with district court fines, the county keeps that 15 money. It doesn't go to the State. Doesn't go to the State, 16 so I think we're pulling our weight. So, if there's any 17 other questions, I'm happy to answer them. 18 COMMISSIONER REEVES: This may be for the Auditor, 19 or you, Mr. Monroe. You show on your worksheet Kerr County 20 has roughly 70 percent of the total, and on the one we got 21 from Jeannie, it shows 58.67 percent. Which is it? 22 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, I think we got a little bit of 23 difference here, but I think this one is more updated than I 24 had originally. 25 MR. MONROE: And what we -- there's no science 5-19-14 bwk 58 1 involved in that, you know. It's based on population. First 2 thing we did was call Mr. Curry's office and said, "How do 3 you get your percentages?" And we used the same resource 4 material, I think, that they did. 5 MR. DEAN: U.S. Census projected for this year. 6 COMMISSIONER REEVES: And so you're -- basically, 7 Kerr County's share of the expenditures, what you're showing 8 is 321,632. 9 MR. MONROE: Right. 10 COMMISSIONER REEVES: And we -- back to Jeannie. 11 We add a 9,000 county supplement to that number? 12 MS. HARGIS: No, the county supplement is -- is a 13 match for whatever the District Judges get as a supplement, 14 and that includes juvenile board. Anything they get a 15 supplement for, the D.A. gets a match. We don't have any -- 16 and we share that between counties, and the maximum is 17 18,000. And we only have two counties, so, it's 9,000. It's 18 a little bit less for the 216th, but that's what it is. 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Thank you. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: Thanks, Scott. 21 MR. MONROE: Any other questions? 22 JUDGE POLLARD: Kyle, thank you. 23 MR. DEAN: You're welcome. 24 MR. MONROE: Kyle did most of this work. 25 MR. DEAN: There's 24,000 in there that's not 5-19-14 bwk 59 1 salary, so basically that office operates on less than 2 $24,000 a year. Some of it is paid out of asset forfeiture, 3 but very little. If we run over -- I've cut it back where -- 4 like, training, travel, all those things, there's some really 5 real minimal cost. If we have unexpected overruns there, we 6 would go to asset forfeiture, with the permission of the 7 committee, and use those funds for that purpose. 8 MR. MONROE: And there's some things on there you 9 can see; car allowance, for example. Y'all guys know I've 10 got -- I've got a fleet of automobiles that I inherited. 11 Nice to have them, but I have more than I use. But I alerted 12 the staff that those days are gone. We'll drive these cars 13 till the wheels fall off, but I'm not going to buy new cars 14 unless somebody hits a big old lick out there on the 15 interstate. Just not going to do that. So, we pay for our 16 automobiles, because that's something we enjoy that the 216th 17 does not enjoy. We pay for that out of forfeiture. We just 18 feel like that's the way to do it, so we're trying to be 19 reasonable. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: Your office is in the county 21 building? 22 MR. MONROE: Yes. We get a lot of perks as a 23 result of that. We're not paying rent; we're not paying 24 utilities. We appreciate that very, very much. The other 25 side of that is I -- I think it's been a help to the 5-19-14 bwk 60 1 Sheriff's Department to have us there, and certainly 2 Probation, because -- 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah, utilities come out of my 4 budget. It's been a big help. (Laughter.) 5 JUDGE POLLARD: He's understood all the time, 6 right? 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, we need a "thank you" 8 from the other county, and from -- yeah. 9 MR. MONROE: That's right. That's right. Well, 10 they appreciate it too. They may not be verbalizing it like 11 they need to. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Thank-you note. 13 MR. MONROE: Any other questions, I'm happy to 14 answer them. 15 JUDGE POLLARD: Appreciate everything, you guys. 16 Thank you. 17 MR. MONROE: Thank you. 18 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. We're skipping District 19 Clerk. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And jury? 21 JUDGE POLLARD: And jury. And I guess we'll go on 22 to County Attorney. She's on Page 44, I think. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 24 JUDGE POLLARD: Somebody messed with my page 25 numbers here, got things way out of order. 5-19-14 bwk 61 1 MS. STEBBINS: It wasn't me. 2 MS. HARGIS: If you look under County Attorney, 3 Judge -- under County Attorney in your tabs. County 4 Attorney. You'll have all of hers. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You're going the wrong way. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: 10-475. 7 MS. HARGIS: Look at your tabs. 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: He doesn't have tabs. 9 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, he does. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 435, 450 -- 11 JUDGE POLLARD: Go ahead, I'll catch up. 12 (Discussion off the record.) 13 MS. STEBBINS: Need more coffee? 14 JUDGE POLLARD: Want to break for a minute? 15 Ten-minute break? 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, that would be good. 17 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. 18 (Recess taken from 2:24 p.m. to 2:38 p.m.) 19 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, let's go. Back in 20 session again. Now we're on County Attorney. Now, this is 21 where we need to get our really big axes out. 22 MS. STEBBINS: Oh. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Right. 24 MS. STEBBINS: Maybe tiny axes. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Sharp knives. 5-19-14 bwk 62 1 MS. STEBBINS: Do y'all have any questions about 2 them? 3 COMMISSIONER REEVES: You're really wanting to cut 4 your budget? From last year? 5 MS. STEBBINS: Yes. In the budget last year was 6 kind of a bigger item for our office, the $12,000 capital 7 outlay item, and that was for a fingerprint system that -- 8 that I think that the prior County Attorney was instructed 9 not to purchase it. So, I don't need that $12,000. We don't 10 foresee any major repairs or purchases for next year. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: Why do you not need it any more? 12 MS. STEBBINS: It was set aside for a fingerprint 13 software or something -- this is my understanding. And I 14 think that -- that Mr. Henneke was instructed not to purchase 15 that, because we didn't need it in the county. Is that 16 right? 17 MS. HARGIS: You recall there was a consultant that 18 came in that was going to do some faster fingerprint 19 analysis -- Rusty, help me with this. And this was for the 20 machine that he needed, but he wanted other -- other entities 21 to approve him being this consultant. He was -- 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: No, no, that's not 23 fingerprint. What that was for -- because we -- 24 MS. STEBBINS: What do I know? 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: What that was for -- and part 5-19-14 bwk 63 1 of it we may see again. That is the company that Bill 2 Aycock, former investigator with Ingram Marshal's Office, has 3 created on the forensic analysis of cell phones. 4 MS. HARGIS: That's right. 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And you can actually 6 download -- Judge, we've had you sign search warrants. You 7 can download real quickly -- 8 JUDGE POLLARD: I saw his presentation out here 9 that was at the Inn of the Hills, the TAC -- was it the 10 TAC-sponsored one? And I understand what you're talking 11 about. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's what that is about. 13 And that is a very -- you know, that -- I mean, I'll be 14 honest; I was one of the ones that nixed it last year when it 15 first started, but I have had to -- due to different 16 investigations, we've had to use it a few times here, and it 17 does help being able to get that information. One of them 18 was during a trial, we needed it. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: I remember; I signed your search 20 warrant. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And we were able to get that 22 information within an hour or two, compared to six months if 23 we send it to the Attorney General's office. And that's 24 about what it takes. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: You guys may not understand. The 5-19-14 bwk 64 1 biggest place to -- they can find and get more evidence out 2 of cell phones now -- 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Mm-hmm. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: -- against criminal defendants than 5 just about anywhere else, and it's all considered like your 6 household, and it's protected under the laws like it's your 7 home. You can't go in and invade that. You got to have all 8 kinds of search warrants and stuff like that to do it. And 9 once you get it, the D.P.S. normally had the only place where 10 you could send the phones to over there. And back at the 11 time I heard his presentation at the Inn of the Hills, it was 12 taking from six months to a year. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: They were that far behind, sending 15 cell phones over there. And you can imagine if you got a 16 murder case or something going on here, and you -- you've 17 seized the phone and send it over there, and you got to wait 18 maybe a year to get the evidence off the phone? And so 19 people were desperate to try to get around that, and that 20 guy, Aycock, could came up with a private firm that would do 21 it for a fee and help out, and try to get it done a lot 22 faster in the turnaround time, and I think that's what he's 23 talking about. 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's exactly what I'm 25 talking about. Now, I haven't added anything into my budget 5-19-14 bwk 65 1 when it comes up for it. He cut it out of that. I may have 2 to add some. I'll talk to Billy and see how the -- where 3 they're at on that, because it's -- it's really a -- once 4 they were up and running, and to be able to just upgrade the 5 software he had in it, which is a cost, once he's up and 6 running and doing it, his deal was his company would provide 7 it at a no-cost fee to the -- to the counties around this 8 area. 9 JUDGE POLLARD: How could he do that? He have a 10 grant somewhere? 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Sponsors and grants and -- 12 JUDGE POLLARD: Well, anyway, but you're looking at 13 some -- or that's real important to be able to get your 14 evidence back within a reasonable period of time. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, is that the 12,000? 16 MS. HARGIS: We do have one in general that we got 17 with the grant. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes. Well, actually, the 19 former D.A. got it -- 20 MS. HARGIS: For juvenile. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- through forfeiture and 22 through some different funds. That's where they originally 23 both started from the equipment, but then they've taken it 24 over. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: So, this $1,200 -- or $12,000 was 5-19-14 bwk 66 1 previously set aside for some help along those lines? Isn't 2 that right? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't know if it was -- I 4 don't know if it was set aside for that, or if the former 5 County Attorney wanted to create his own, or how it -- how 6 it -- that's an awful high-dollar -- 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Let's take it out. I'm not 8 saying we don't need it, but take it out now, and if we need 9 to add -- it's easier to add it back. 10 MS. HARGIS: Well, put it in, I think, a more 11 general budget, because it affects all the court systems. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we take it out right 13 now. 14 MS. STEBBINS: I thought it was for fingerprinting, 15 so what do I know? 16 JUDGE POLLARD: It is out, isn't it? 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I have a question. 18 MS. STEBBINS: Yes, sir? 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: On your conferences and 20 travel. 21 MS. STEBBINS: Yes. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And I understand, you know, 23 probably more than what Rob would have required, but 6,000, 24 that's like about three conferences. 25 MS. STEBBINS: It could be, with the travel and 5-19-14 bwk 67 1 board and -- 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I'm sure it is, so that's 3 still about three conferences. 4 MS. STEBBINS: Yes. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: A couple thousand dollars per 6 -- per conference. 7 MS. STEBBINS: And with the three attorneys -- 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Huh? 9 MS. STEBBINS: With the three attorneys in the 10 office, we're just trying to make sure that the other two get 11 their hours per year, their C.L.E.'s. And then I just 12 requested a little extra for just some extra training. 13 There's -- 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. I was just looking; the 15 last two items were 3,700 and 4,000, so this jumps it up to 16 6,000. 17 MS. STEBBINS: And I won't request that next year. 18 I just requested a little bit more this year so that I can go 19 to, you know, elected prosecutor's seminar and a couple of 20 things that I'd like to do here. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, that's the other staff 22 plus an additional one for you? 23 MS. STEBBINS: Yes, sir. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Got you, okay. I see. 25 MS. HARGIS: And in her defense, Rob didn't send 5-19-14 bwk 68 1 all of his people. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Under litigation expense, -- 4 MS. STEBBINS: Yes, sir? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- prior years, you've been 6 pretty close -- 15, 15,7, 11,9, 15,4, but this year you're 7 way, way down. Is there a reason? Or -- 8 MS. STEBBINS: I don't know. I don't know what the 9 reason is. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's that normally -- what, 11 in the past, was that line item used for? 12 MS. HARGIS: We used it a lot for -- we purchased 13 the lights, and in the tiger case, we had a lot of calls from 14 that. And then we used it for employment cases, cases that 15 the attorney wants advice from -- that they're not -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's outside counsel? 17 MS. STEBBINS: It is. And so this year, we'll 18 have -- well, in this budget year, we're working with the 19 bankruptcy attorney, and then they're -- 20 JUDGE POLLARD: On the fairgrounds. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 22 MS. STEBBINS: Things like that. Items like that. 23 And then, you know, the employment cases, they may come up 24 and they may not, but to have it budgeted is -- is helpful. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 5-19-14 bwk 69 1 MS. HARGIS: And that's the -- mostly that was the 2 law firm that -- I did look at that, 'cause I had the same 3 question. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. All right, now I know 5 what it is. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And the increase in the 7 assistant salaries is reflective of the letter you sent to 8 us? 9 MS. STEBBINS: No, sir. Actually, her -- that 10 $5,000 increase that I requested is not in this, because I 11 submitted it after -- after Jeannie and her office were gone 12 at their training last week. But that increase reflects the 13 change that y'all approved a few weeks ago for my employee, 14 the assistant employee, to bring her a little bit closer to 15 the other assistant that's in my office. 16 JUDGE POLLARD: So it's a raise for her, but there 17 wasn't an increase in the budget because you transferred it 18 from some other line items. 19 MS. STEBBINS: Yes, sir, we transferred it from -- 20 well, from my salary, and then from the -- the amount for 21 Wayne, our retired employee. Well, it's a savings from those 22 two items. 23 JUDGE POLLARD: Gave up some of your own salary. 24 MS. STEBBINS: Yes, sir. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It's still a 10 percent 5-19-14 bwk 70 1 increase. 2 MS. HARGIS: But it's an increase for this year, 3 because it would be over -- 4 COMMISSIONER REEVES: But do we need to -- are you 5 requesting 5,000 more than what's shown on here? 6 MS. STEBBINS: Yes, sir. 7 COMMISSIONER REEVES: So your total will be 8 643,795, is what you're requesting? 9 MS. STEBBINS: Yes, sir. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: But still, I'm thinking -- I 11 don't think I got an answer -- 12 MS. STEBBINS: I'm sorry. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: -- that I understood. On line 14 item 103, that's a 10 percent increase, from 142 to 156. 15 MS. STEBBINS: Yes. That is from the approved 16 increase that you guys approved for my assistant a few weeks 17 ago. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 19 MS. STEBBINS: But I heard something that came out 20 of someplace -- 21 MS. HARGIS: Well, this year, in order -- because 22 you're only paying a partial year. You were only paying six 23 months. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You're talking about this 25 year, it came out of current stuff, so next year -- I got 5-19-14 bwk 71 1 you, okay. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So the total is correct; the 3 638 is correct. 4 MS. HARGIS: No, it will be 643 with the new 5,000. 5 And there will be some benefits on top of that. 6 MS. STEBBINS: Because I submitted the letter late. 7 And you all have -- I believe y'all received that letter, but 8 that amount is not in here, because I didn't submit it in 9 time before Jeannie and her office left for training last 10 week. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: That's also for this assistant. 12 MS. STEBBINS: Yes, sir. 13 JUDGE POLLARD: And that would bring her up to 14 what, 75? 15 MS. STEBBINS: Yes, sir, just about -- yes, sir, 16 75. And -- 17 JUDGE POLLARD: And the other guy's still making 18 80-something? 19 MS. STEBBINS: Yes, sir. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: The other assistant. 21 MS. STEBBINS: Yes, sir. He's making about 85, 22 plus a state supplement of about three. 23 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: She -- this assistant we're talking 5-19-14 bwk 72 1 about came in here a couple times and substituted for her. I 2 tell you, she's something. She's good. 3 MS. STEBBINS: I agree. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: She's worth it. I spend a lot of 5 time with her in juvenile court and over at the State 6 Hospital and Crisis Stabilization. 7 MS. HARGIS: Once she gets four years with the 8 state of Texas, then she can get the prosecutor's supplement. 9 Which is not a lot of money, but -- 10 MS. STEBBINS: It helps every month. She's been 11 prosecuting in other states; she's licensed in three states. 12 She's been prosecuting in other states for about 16 years. 13 JUDGE POLLARD: She's -- she's worth a lot of money 14 to us. We got to get her up where she -- she can't go 15 somewhere else. Somebody can hire her away; we got to 16 protect her. Okay. 17 MS. HARGIS: We'll give you a new page for that. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: Thank you. 20 MS. STEBBINS: You're welcome. 21 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay, H.R. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I'm okay. 23 JUDGE POLLARD: No questions? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Question I had, where did the 25 -- we had immunizations. Is that here, or -- 5-19-14 bwk 73 1 MS. LANTZ: It's in that safety line item. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: In safety? 3 MS. LANTZ: That's where we're doing it. And so 4 for the year, I'll be using the whole $7,000. I have one 5 more employee that does need to get vaccinated at Animal 6 Control, so -- and they're about $1,500 a shot -- or, excuse 7 me, the total of three shots that they take. So -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There's -- for the Court, 9 several years back there was a decision that a lot of our 10 employees, mostly some at the jail and Animal Control that 11 dealt with dangerous situations that -- like hepatitis, 12 people that had hepatitis, we should get them vaccinated. 13 JUDGE POLLARD: Rabid dogs and prisoners. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We started this in the H.R. 15 department, and the animal control field, and I agree, they 16 need to have rabies vaccinations, all those employees. And 17 it's coming out of this budget, out of that line item. 18 That's the way it was done previously. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: You're holding it -- 20 MS. LANTZ: Yes, sir. In order to make that line 21 item go up, I just transferred -- I lowered some other items 22 in my budget to increase that safety up by $1,500. Because I 23 was also notified by Environmental Health they need some 24 immunizations. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 5-19-14 bwk 74 1 MS. LANTZ: Because they deal with waste things. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, okay. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: Your salaries are all holding about 4 even. You don't have any two and a half percent increases on 5 there? 6 MS. LANTZ: Nothing was put in, no, sir. 7 MS. HARGIS: It's in Fund 10. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: What did you say? 9 MS. HARGIS: There's one total amount for Fund 10. 10 And until you -- until the Court authorizes me to put it in 11 the individual line items, we don't do that. I did it one 12 year, and I thought I was going to scream. 13 MS. LANTZ: I didn't request any salary increases, 14 because we just paid a consultant to come in last year, and 15 with that, the consultant brought back to the Court what they 16 felt like the employees should get. And I -- in my 17 department -- 18 JUDGE POLLARD: You were in line? 19 MS. LANTZ: Yes, sir. And so -- 20 JUDGE POLLARD: I got a salary survey book 21 recently. Are you in line with that one? Do you know the 22 book that I'm talking about? 23 MS. LANTZ: That is the TAC, and that's for elected 24 officials. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: Yes. 5-19-14 bwk 75 1 MS. LANTZ: So -- 2 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 3 MS. LANTZ: That's strictly for elected officials. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Speaking of that survey, did 6 one or both of you keep track? I know we gave some 7 individuals partial adjustments last year, but not complete. 8 MS. HARGIS: Yes, we did. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Would one of y'all present that 10 to us? 11 MS. LANTZ: And basically, I guess I just want the 12 Court to realize, we did spend over $30,000 on that survey. 13 And I know there's going to be requests from all the 14 employees, but I hope we can stay in alignment with the grade 15 besides those that are on salary, because if not, we get out 16 of kilter again and then we're back where we started. So, 17 if -- 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree with her 100 19 percent, or actually more than that; 110, maybe. 20 MS. LANTZ: I mean, there's ways to get increases 21 on our steps. So, you know, -- 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure. 23 MS. LANTZ: -- that needs to happen for those 24 employees. However, gentlemen, I just don't want to see that 25 grade where those employees have been placed, or those 5-19-14 bwk 76 1 positions -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We have a tendency to -- 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: County-wide, department heads, 5 elected officials change job descriptions, and then we change 6 salaries, and in five years we're all out of whack again. We 7 need to resist changing job descriptions. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Listen, thank you for saying 9 that. 10 MS. LANTZ: Well, I just -- in my department, I 11 feel like we were pretty much on key. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You need a raise. 13 MS. LANTZ: Well, I think the other employees do, 14 that -- that have merit. I mean, they're well deserved at 15 that, but I just want to -- you know, I'm a -- I want to make 16 sure we stay within kilter of that survey. 17 JUDGE POLLARD: Thank you. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Good thought. 19 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Compliments to you on your 20 budget. 21 MS. LANTZ: Thank you. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. We go to Auditor. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, boy. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Buster's favorite. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Up against the wall. 5-19-14 bwk 77 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. Actual is from 307 -- 307, 2 and it's gone to, recommended, 348, it looks like. 3 MS. HARGIS: 338 is this year, because last year, 4 there -- 5 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. 6 MS. HARGIS: And 350. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. So, we ought to be looking 8 at current budget instead of actual, is what she's saying. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's correct. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I do actuals 'cause it's 11 really -- 12 MS. HARGIS: But the actual doesn't include the 13 raises and things that we got last year. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's just me, personally. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Jeannie, why are you 16 requesting yourself -- well, no, let me ask it -- aren't you 17 planning on leaving soon? 18 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir, I am. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I don't mean that in an 20 ugly way; I'm just -- isn't that true? 21 MS. HARGIS: It is. But I asked for a raise last 22 year and I was turned down, so I'm asking for it again. I 23 think I -- you know, I've worked really hard the last eight 24 years that I've been here, and I've never gotten any extra 25 raises over and above what everybody else has gotten. A lot 5-19-14 bwk 78 1 of the people did get those last year, as you recall. Some 2 of them got six and a half to seven and a half to eight and a 3 half, and I didn't get anything. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sometimes it's hard to see 5 the difference, because you are -- and your salary is 6 different and your bosses are different, et cetera, et 7 cetera. And seeing you -- an Auditor works for the District 8 Judges. It just seems like that should be their 9 responsibility to make the decision about your salary 10 increase. It's just the way I see it. That may be the old 11 way to look at it; I don't know. 12 MS. HARGIS: They want -- 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But I'm hanging in with the 14 old way. 15 MS. HARGIS: Well, I don't mind asking them for 16 that, but at the same token, last year I was told that I need 17 to start here, so -- 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 19 MS. HARGIS: -- I'm starting here. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: Did they tell you that? The 21 judges? 22 MS. HARGIS: Yes, the Court told me that. And so 23 I'm starting with the Court, because I don't want any 24 surprises. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. 5-19-14 bwk 79 1 MS. HARGIS: And so, therefore, I felt it better 2 that I ask the Court. I have my name on the list just like 3 everybody else. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. I understand. 5 MS. HARGIS: And, the statutory things, as long as 6 I don't go over 5 percent -- I've never done that. The other 7 thing, with the -- with the raise, it will give us -- in my 8 salary, an opportunity to have some lap-over of about a -- 9 you know, maybe 30 days of two people, because the person 10 coming in is going to need some training, depending on how 11 much experience that they have. And so the judges have 12 requested that I have some kind of a -- at least -- Tommy was 13 here for three months. I can't be here for three months, but 14 30 days, I think, would give that -- gives that additional 15 leeway to be able to have those two salaries. I don't think 16 -- I don't know what the judges will pay the new Auditor, 17 because I don't know who it's going to be. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's your planned retirement 19 day? 20 MS. HARGIS: Right now, sometime in April, 21 probably. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: April? 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That passed, so you're still 24 here. Well, let me -- I think Jeannie did some things, too, 25 this past year when we had the new Treasurer come in, and -- 5-19-14 bwk 80 1 and on the payroll and things that you -- you had some 2 background on that, you contributed to and fixed, staying 3 here late at night a lot of times; I know that. And I think 4 we'll see it in -- I don't disagree with Buster, but I think 5 we'll see it when Jeannie leaves; it's going to be -- we're 6 all going to hurt. And so -- 7 JUDGE POLLARD: I think so too. 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: A lot of experience comes to 9 -- in a lot of ways for what Jeannie's contributing. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just -- 11 JUDGE POLLARD: I can say that I've been here quite 12 a bit after hours and on weekends and stuff since I've been 13 in office, and I see her here. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Mm-hmm. 15 JUDGE POLLARD: I see her here on Saturdays, and I 16 see her here past working hours. I think this is a good, 17 dedicated lady. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And experienced. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: Yes. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We often compare to other 21 counties of our size, which is good; I think that's good, 22 Judge, to look at the area. But this county has taken on 23 more grants and things, and all kinds of grants -- state 24 grants, federal grants -- than probably any county our size. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Good point. 5-19-14 bwk 81 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that is a lot of extra 2 work, a lot of extra reporting. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: And that's -- she's primarily the 4 credit for that, isn't she? 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, she's certainly 6 involved. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Certainly keeping track of the 8 money on them. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, I think we've had huge 10 grants; sewage treatment plant, $15 million out at the 11 airport in the last few years, and she's been -- you know, 12 that's when I say the experience is really coming to pass. 13 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Which increase in salary are 14 you asking? You got 94,850 and 96,663. Which one are we 15 working with? 16 MS. HARGIS: The 96. 17 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Where did the 94,850 come 18 from in the requested? 19 MS. HARGIS: That was partly the longevity. That 20 came in for this year, and so -- 21 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Partly, and what was the 22 other part? 23 MS. HARGIS: That was the two and a half percent 24 originally that I asked. 25 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Okay. And then -- so the 5-19-14 bwk 82 1 next bump was -- 2 MS. HARGIS: That's five percent of -- of what I -- 3 my salary will be 92. 4 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Based on longevity? 5 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. 6 COMMISSIONER REEVES: 92. 7 MS. HARGIS: My longevity doesn't kick in until 8 July. 9 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Okay. 10 MS. HARGIS: And I wish it affected my retirement, 11 but it won't. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Help me find that number 13 that you were just referring to. I see the 94,850. Where is 14 that other number? 15 COMMISSIONER REEVES: The next one, Administration 16 Recommended. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mine says the same. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 94,850? So you gave the new 19 guy the real numbers; I see what you're up to. (Laughter.) 20 MS. HARGIS: No, my salary's broken into two, and 21 50/50 this year, so it doesn't show up. But if it -- 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, let's make sure we -- 23 that we all have the right numbers. 24 MS. HARGIS: I'll get you the right number. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Please, at least let's do 5-19-14 bwk 83 1 that. So, what is the Administrative Recommended? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 96,663. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the assistant salary, 4 how -- how is that -- I see in the notes that there's a five 5 -- is that a five percent for all three of them, or what? 6 MS. HARGIS: That's two and a half percent for all 7 three of them. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Two and a half percent for 9 each one of them. 10 MS. HARGIS: If I gave them -- just like she said, 11 because they're all the same now, they all have to have -- I 12 can't just pick out one. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Two and a half percent for 14 each, for three of them? 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Jeannie, on part-time salary, 16 where in the past it's been -- a couple years ago, 2,000; 17 last year, 1,000; and then in the current budget, it's 8,000. 18 So, what's the -- 19 MS. HARGIS: Well, I was able to get the Schreiner 20 interns a little more often this year. I've got one more 21 paycheck coming out for this year. I can reduce that maybe 22 to 2,500. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. So -- 24 MS. HARGIS: Because we're not getting -- we really 25 don't have the space for the intern. We had -- 5-19-14 bwk 84 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So we're changing 8,000 to 2 2,500? 3 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, good. 5 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Which one was that, 6 Commissioner? 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's line item 108. 8 MS. HARGIS: That is strictly for in -- for 9 Schreiner interns. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What does that change to? 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: To 2,500. 12 MS. HARGIS: And we had a very fine young man; his 13 name was Travis. He did graduate this year from Schreiner, 14 and we -- when I walked in Saturday, I found all these little 15 gifts, and I couldn't quite figure it out, but he's a real 16 good friend of Jason's, but anyway, he -- you'll get a kick 17 out of this. He left some flowers for all of us. He left 18 yellow golf balls with Sponge Bob, golf balls for Jason, and 19 he gave Jennifer Kleenex boxes, because he couldn't find -- 20 she likes decorative Kleenex boxes, so he just gave her boxes 21 of Kleenex. And then Joy got a big mug to put her iced tea 22 in instead of using a paper cup. And because he knows I'm 23 moving, he gave me bubbles. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see. 25 MS. HARGIS: So he was a really -- really fine 5-19-14 bwk 85 1 young man, and he -- he had worked his 128 hours. He came in 2 during spring break, was doing some inventory, and he 3 actually wanted to come back the next week to finish his 4 inventory, which I thought was really great. We have had 5 some real fine young men. We haven't had any girls so far 6 that have come over, but I had some over at the city. But 7 Schreiner's turning out some really nice -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: He's a nice young man, 9 little redneck fellow. 10 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let me ask you one more 12 question. And I'm not throwing rocks, -- 13 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- so don't start screaming. 15 The assistant salary, you -- that increase there is a 2.5 16 salary increase? 17 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir, for all three of them. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And if we -- if we come 19 along now and give our -- our annual 10 percent salary 20 increase, that's going to make them 12.5. Make everybody 21 else 10, and they're going to be getting 12.5. 22 MS. HARGIS: No, because I would go over my 5 23 percent limit. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, let's pretend that -- 25 say we're giving a 2.5 percent. 5-19-14 bwk 86 1 MS. HARGIS: If you give the 2.5 percent, then 2 they'll get the 2.5 percent. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So they get a 5 percent 4 raise and everybody else is getting a 2.5? 5 MS. HARGIS: No, they'll get whatever the county 6 gets. If the county gets a 2.5 -- 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, if we give 1 percent, 8 they'll get 1 and a half percent? 9 MS. HARGIS: They'll get 1 percent. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They'll get 1 percent, not 11 this 2.5? 12 MS. HARGIS: I have to present it this way so I can 13 take it to the judges to be approved. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I see. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm not knocking it; I'm 16 just trying to be clear of how this thing worked. 17 MS. HARGIS: I was trying to do it the way other 18 auditors do theirs, and they put it in here and then they 19 take it to their District Judges. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, thank you. Thank you 21 very much. 22 MS. HARGIS: I think that we have some other 23 departments that do that as well. I think Juvenile does the 24 same thing, but they always take the raises that the county 25 gets. 5-19-14 bwk 87 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Jeannie, employee training. 2 Historical, 4,300, 2,700, 8,700, 10,000. Steep slope. 3 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. If you'll look, last year we 4 spent 87, and then 93. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And it was 2,700 the year 6 before. 7 MS. HARGIS: Right, because I didn't send everybody 8 before. I didn't have a full crew, and I couldn't send them. 9 So, this is the first year that I've had trained people where 10 I need to send them, and the statute requires -- of course, 11 the statute requires that I have 40 hours, period. And -- 12 but if you're an auditor and we're auditing, A.I.C.P.A. 13 requires that all auditors have 40 hours. I have two new 14 auditors; they have to have 40 hours. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, is that something -- I'm 16 just looking at the end. It's just -- 17 MS. HARGIS: Well, we try to find the cheapest 18 stuff that I can find. I've been sending them to -- we all 19 went to the TAC. I don't go to but one; I send them to the 20 other. I've been trying to send them to more schools. A lot 21 of the stuff that I do, I get free, except for mileage. I 22 serve on several committees, and for that I don't have to 23 pay. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, how many people total? 25 MS. HARGIS: Four. There's four of us. 5-19-14 bwk 88 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So that's $2,500 each? 2 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm, for 40 hours. Which is a lot. 3 It's a lot more than the rest of them have to have. But when 4 you're doing internal audits, you want these audits to be 5 done right, and they're new. Anything else? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Not from me. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 8 MS. HARGIS: You also have a new auditor coming on 9 board that may need to go to more of the TAC stuff. I don't 10 go to as much of the TAC stuff. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I have -- I'm sorry, I have 12 another question. You have two line items; 216, employee 13 training, and 485, conferences. 14 MS. HARGIS: Training is -- I try to put the 15 employees all in the training. It didn't fit, so I had to 16 put some of it down in mine. We use them inter -- the 17 conferences and the training together for all four of us. 18 When I ran out of their money, I had to put it in my money. 19 More -- most of the time, the conferences are for mine. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So that's $4,000 a person. 21 MS. HARGIS: Last year. This year -- 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No, I'm saying that's what 23 you're requesting, 16,000 total. Ten plus six, 16,000, so 24 that's $4,000 training for each employee. Wow. 25 MS. HARGIS: Unfortunately, they don't have ours. 5-19-14 bwk 89 1 We take what we can get in San Antonio, but we don't have as 2 much in San Antonio. And the year we had the conference, we 3 didn't have to pay, when I sent all of them. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. I'm just looking -- 5 $4,000 per year. 6 MS. HARGIS: 2011 -- 2011-2012. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's a lot. 8 MS. HARGIS: That's a lot of money. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're right. 10 MS. HARGIS: We can look at it, if you'd like for 11 me to look at it again and see exactly how many and what the 12 cost of each conference, and I'll get back to you. How's 13 that? 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. See how you can reduce 15 it. 16 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 18 MS. HARGIS: If you look at my health insurance 19 line item, this will give you kind of an idea of what I was 20 talking about in the trend. If you look at 2010-2011, see, I 21 had an employee that had family. Then you go to 2011-2012 22 and 2012-2013; I didn't have anybody that wanted a family, 23 and it went down. The cost of the family coverage is pretty 24 high. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: We subsidize the employees that go 5-19-14 bwk 90 1 buy insurance by almost $8,000 a year. 2 MS. HARGIS: So, hopefully we won't have that 10 3 percent increase. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: Maybe we could all save money by 5 everybody going and signing up for Obama-care. 6 MS. HARGIS: Well, we sat through that, and I'm 7 sure Dawn can speak to this, but we did have a speaker 8 from -- from -- on health insurance. And unless the employee 9 can prove that -- that our coverage is less than what they 10 can get on the exchange -- and it has to be the same 11 coverage, and they can get a subsidy. They can't get off our 12 plan. And I don't see how they're going to get it for 13 what -- because we're giving it to them free. They have to 14 be paying, and they're not paying, so that takes one. And 15 then the subsidy, I think we pretty much -- when we did those 16 raises, the 10 percent and then the additional, we got them 17 off of the food stamp rolls. So, it is an interesting 18 situation, especially for the future. But I think that Dawn 19 has worked with TAC, and I'm so glad that we are in TAC now, 20 because it does afford us at least the opportunity to see 21 these things in the future and try to put them off. But 22 we've had kind of a heavy claims year, so I look -- I don't 23 know; I'm hoping it won't be 10 percent, but I know it's 24 going to be anywhere between 5 and 10. 25 MS. LANTZ: It's going to be a minimum of 10. 5-19-14 bwk 91 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What are you talking about? 2 Minimum of 10 percent of what? 3 JUDGE POLLARD: Increase. 4 MS. LANTZ: The increase is going to be a minimum 5 of 10 percent. It can be higher than that. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Hmm. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we've talked several 8 times; might as well lay it on the table that we're going to 9 have to look at decreasing the subsidy for family coverage. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think so. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, it's a cost. I mean, 12 it's a -- 13 MS. HARGIS: Well, there's several variables I 14 think that we probably need to look at, too. The other -- 15 other thing is -- is, as you noticed, we went from 12.31 to 16 12.49 on the retirement. It was looking for that curve to 17 kind of go down. Well, T.C.D.R.S. also gave us a two-hour 18 speech on Friday, and they have -- we had that 10-year 19 smoothing. Now they claim we have a five-year smoothing. 20 But I hate to tell them, we've already paid out for five 21 years, so I don't see ours going down. That's something that 22 we had talked about doing, was trying to start, you know, 23 sending extra money to raise our ratio. Our ratio right now 24 is 82. They talked about 84 percent being okay as far as -- 25 as funding, but we've dropped 2 percent below that. And 5-19-14 bwk 92 1 Judge Tinley and I, last year, contacted T.C.D.R.S. and said, 2 "What would it take for us to get funded?" There are several 3 plans that are funded, believe it or not. I think they said 4 60 are fully funded, out of 550. But they wanted -- they 5 wanted $3 million, basically, and we don't have $3 million to 6 totally 100 percent fund. But -- 7 JUDGE POLLARD: We don't have a half million for 8 Mooney. 9 MS. HARGIS: Right, no. But it is something to 10 think about. If it does go down any lower, then I think 11 you're going to have to really seriously consider, 'cause you 12 want to stay -- really want to stay in that 84 percent range. 13 You have people like -- she said you have a pool of young 14 people coming in with the older ones going out, so you've 15 always got a moving pool, which helps to kind of smooth the 16 ratio. But ours just keeps going up. When I first came 17 here, it was only seven and a half. Now it's 12.49. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: Thank you, ma'am. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: County Judge. 21 JUDGE POLLARD: County Judge it is. What questions 22 do you have, guys? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I was planning on -- 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Deleting the position, huh? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- getting you about a 5-19-14 bwk 93 1 $50,000 salary increase, until that Obama comment. 2 (Laughter.) And we're going a different direction now. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Really nothing in -- I mean -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What do you think, Judge? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Good the way it is. 6 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do you need to -- 8 JUDGE POLLARD: Well, I'm the new guy on the Court. 9 It wouldn't look right for me to come in and ask for a salary 10 increase, so -- period. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I didn't have any comments on 12 what's submitted. I'm okay. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, that's fine with me. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: I will say that under conferences, 15 and maybe that is a little conservative figure there, that 16 3,000. I may -- what TAC tells me, all the things that I 17 need to go to, that we may have to come in and increase that 18 by about 800 to 1,000. Because -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Let's do that right now. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: Let's do that right this moment? 21 Well, let's just wait until we see that we definitely need 22 it. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You're going to remember it? 24 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 5-19-14 bwk 94 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Carole will. 2 JUDGE POLLARD: Yes, she will. 3 MS. HARGIS: He will need investment training as 4 well. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: What? 6 MS. HARGIS: Investment training. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: That's right. And I don't know -- 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: To get a half percent. 9 JUDGE POLLARD: I don't know where, with all the 10 stuff that I do, you know, where I'm going to have time to go 11 to these things. That's the -- ask that lady over there. 12 MS. GRINSTEAD: Yes, sir. 13 JUDGE POLLARD: When can I take off to go to these 14 things, to take the training? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There may be a little excess in 16 out-of-county mileage, because you don't -- you aren't doing 17 the AACOG, so there may be some money there that could be 18 shifted later. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: But that -- but I am entitled to 20 reimbursement for going to conferences. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That usually comes out of the 22 conference line item. 23 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, that could be. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: When you -- it's for going to 25 San Antonio for AACOG. 5-19-14 bwk 95 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Well, I need to start doing the 2 AACOG thing. But -- 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're going next week. 4 You're going next week. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: Yes, sir. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Next Wednesday. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: Well, you need to -- need to talk 8 to Juvenile -- 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've already talked to her. 10 JUDGE POLLARD: -- Juvenile and all them, because 11 those people, they got statutory times that we have to comply 12 with. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: He's set for next week's 14 AACOG meeting? 15 MS. GRINSTEAD: Yes, he is. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Don't try to get out of it. 17 We're going. 18 MS. HARGIS: There's a pretty gold truck out here. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: We're going to go in that new 20 pickup? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. You mean the one that 23 everybody in the world wants -- all the departments want? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: Rusty wants it. Tim wants it. 5-19-14 bwk 96 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No gas mileage. He and I 2 can't get into one of those little things. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Oh, I see, okay. All right, 4 got you. Rest my case. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: I'd like to go. It's just that 6 something has come up every time, and we haven't been able to 7 go. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're going. They're 9 expecting you. 10 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay, done. That has an ominous 11 threat to it. All right, thank you. Next item is -- unless 12 anybody has any questions further -- 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioners Court is next. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. 15 MS. HARGIS: Can we do mental health? 16 JUDGE POLLARD: Mental health is next. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's one of those -- 19 that's one of these budgets that we don't have any idea. 20 It's going to be up to you, Judge. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's not in my book. 22 MS. HARGIS: Yeah, it is. It's under -- it's under 23 the Judge's, the next one right behind it. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Oh, I see. Okay. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The next one. 5-19-14 bwk 97 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Oh, I'm sorry. I got it, 2 sorry. 3 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 4 JUDGE POLLARD: Nevermind. Next page. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I got it. 6 JUDGE POLLARD: You're talking about 405-100 7 through whatever. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 9 MS. HARGIS: Only one we went up on was the last 10 one, which is 405-403, out-of-county court costs. Those have 11 gone up because of Bexar County. And thanks to our 12 Treasurer, we -- Bexar County insisted on debiting our 13 account, and we didn't like it; we closed it off, and so 14 they're going to start billing us now. And I think we can 15 control the billing, because they were over-billing and 16 under-billing, and it was causing us all kinds of problems. 17 So -- but it has gone up, because more cases are from Bexar 18 County now than we've had before. It runs in -- in cycles. 19 You know, it's kind of like the popular stuff -- 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It's gone up a lot. 21 JUDGE POLLARD: But we don't control Bexar County 22 doing -- it's their whim down there. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 24 JUDGE POLLARD: So that's out of our control. 25 MS. HARGIS: That is for if we have a case that's 5-19-14 bwk 98 1 in another county, but it's our case and they hear it; we 2 have to pay for it. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 4 MS. HARGIS: We do the same thing here; we bill 5 them. So, we have a pretty healthy amount the J.P.'s and the 6 Judge hears. We probably get much more than that. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: Well, that's good. All right. Any 8 further questions or comments on that one? All right. Then 9 let's go on to Commissioners Court. Maybe we ought to just 10 ask the Auditor to ask the questions of us, and reverse the 11 roles here. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You don't want to do that. 13 (Laughter.) 14 JUDGE POLLARD: Put us on the hot spot. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Go ahead, Rusty, because you 16 haven't come up yet. Go ahead. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's right. That's why I 18 said you don't want us to do that. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: Come on up and burn some bridges. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Huh-uh, no way. (Laughter.) 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Pretty much same as last year. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It is. 23 MS. LANTZ: Y'all did very well. 24 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Thank you. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: $600 increase, little less. 5-19-14 bwk 99 1 MS. HARGIS: In the conference line item for y'all, 2 2,000 per Commissioner. Because one year we almost didn't 3 have enough. Some of you charge; some of you don't. 4 COMMISSIONER REEVES: 1,500 a commissioner? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 1,500 a commissioner. 6 MS. HARGIS: 1,500. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: As opposed to -- 8 MS. HARGIS: That's really just, I think, 9 equivalent to two conferences barely, isn't it? The 1,500? 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And two conference -- yeah, 11 that's about right. And two conferences does it as far as 12 the C.E. 13 MS. HARGIS: Because, unfortunately, they put a lot 14 of y'all's stuff at real expensive hotels, and it makes it 15 difficult for all of them. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Ought to sleep in that big new 17 truck. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And they do -- and they -- 19 nevermind, I'm not going there. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Buster isn't even going to 21 conferences any more. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: They cost way too much. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: How do you get your continuing 24 education? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't get it. 5-19-14 bwk 100 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He doesn't care any more, 2 'cause it's his last term. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What are they going to do, 4 kick me out? 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That would be a good idea. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Would be a nice try. 7 MS. STEBBINS: I see the gears working there. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: See what the voters think 9 about that. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think we might have a little 11 thing here. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I intend on going my last 13 year, because I'm president of two different associations, 14 and the only guy in the state that's ever done that. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You want an award too? 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, I don't want an award; I 17 want a free damn steak dinner. And I'm going to go say 18 good-bye. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: I thought it had something to do 20 with food. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I just want to say good-bye 22 to my friends. 23 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. Well, and the way you do 24 that is have that longevity that you have had here. You make 25 a lot of -- a lot of friends across a lot of rivers and 5-19-14 bwk 101 1 bridges during that time. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They're all friends, right, 3 Buster? 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No. We've had a good time, 5 though, I'll tell you. 6 JUDGE POLLARD: I tell you, it's amazing when you 7 get into TAC or any of these other places, I mean, people 8 know him and really are friends of his. He's -- he really is 9 well thought of -- 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've got some good friends. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: -- outside of here. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I've got some good friends 13 all over the state, good folks. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. So, are we through with 15 this one? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Court-appointed civil 19 attorneys. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: C.P.S. This the one that I 21 had a question about. The current budget -- the current 22 budget's 170, and projected year-end, 136. And then we're 23 going to up to 175. 24 MS. HARGIS: That's the Court-appointed attorneys 25 in the C.P.S., because they keep going up. 5-19-14 bwk 102 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But we've only -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Spent 78 year-to-date. That's 3 about half. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Which is about half. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is that on schedule? 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Mm-hmm. 7 MS. HARGIS: It's going to go that high this year 8 if you've got there in six months. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Pretty close. 10 MS. HARGIS: That's the one court we can't control. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 12 MS. HARGIS: That costs more money. The others are 13 down, way down. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I don't have any questions 15 at all. 16 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. Nondepartmental, is that 17 next? 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. How are we doing 19 on the pauper's issue? 20 MS. HARGIS: It's slowed down a little bit. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Everybody in the courthouse 22 is involved in that. 23 MS. HARGIS: Sorry. 24 JUDGE POLLARD: Even burying people. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 5-19-14 bwk 103 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Grimes used to do that most of the 2 time. 3 MS. HARGIS: It's in miscellaneous, Judge. 4 MR. ROBLES: 409-404. 5 MS. HARGIS: For those of you who have tabs, it's 6 in the miscellaneous. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think they rearranged this. 8 MS. HARGIS: Under miscellaneous, it's the second 9 page. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Oh, okay. Got it, all right. 11 MS. HARGIS: Okay. At the request of the Judge, 12 the two and a half percent for all employees is located on 13 the first line. The benefits for that is on the second line. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Wait, what employees? 15 MS. HARGIS: All employees. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, I see. Okay. 17 MS. HARGIS: For Fund 10. 18 JUDGE POLLARD: Everybody gets the two and a half 19 percent. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is it two and a half? Is 21 that what it is? 22 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir, Fund 10 only. This is Fund 23 10 only. 24 JUDGE POLLARD: That's -- that was the objective 25 some time ago; we was going to see if we can do it. 5-19-14 bwk 104 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. I like having it in 2 here. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's a good starting point. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We have a number in the budget. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I like it. I kind of like 6 being able to see that. But we want to go up if we can. 7 MS. HARGIS: They changed our workmen's comp, and 8 that's gone up a little bit. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So -- 10 JUDGE POLLARD: Turns into a big number, an 11 increase. It's just something we got; we can look at and 12 see, and I guess when we get to the revenue side of things 13 and see what's coming in, we're going to have to take a look 14 back. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's exactly right. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. It's on my yellow pad. 17 MS. HARGIS: I do have summary sheets, but let's 18 get through with this first. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- I noticed that you 20 have -- the audit went up 5,000, which I think you knew that 21 already, the outside audit? 22 MS. HARGIS: I thought I brought it down. 23 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Looks like it costs 30, but 24 we budgeted 35 for it last year. 25 MS. HARGIS: I've always budgeted 35, because in 5-19-14 bwk 105 1 case they decide to charge us more for a single audit, which 2 we will be doing a single audit. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, then. But I was looking 4 at -- under contingency. 5 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir. I went with the high 6 number. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, probably a good idea. 8 MS. HARGIS: To start out with, and then we chip at 9 it. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, I think that the, you know, 11 professional services you kept level. You went up on 12 contingency, which I think, based on this year, is not a bad 13 thing. We can just make a note that contingencies is a 14 pretty large number this year, up to 100,000. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Really? So, what's that 16 rationale? I didn't hear it. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's just -- we seem to be 18 spending a lot this year. 19 MS. HARGIS: The original budget was actually 20 75,000. We've already moved all but 58 into other line 21 items, and we're probably going to move the rest of this. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just one -- I think we need to 23 just make a note that it's a high number. We need to, once 24 the revenue side comes in, maybe come down. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: When the previous actual was 5-19-14 bwk 106 1 36, and now we're -- 2 MS. HARGIS: Well, it actually may have been 36, 3 but we may have moved money from there to other areas. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Oh, I see what you're saying. 5 MS. HARGIS: We use contingency to balance the 6 other departments. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. All right. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Kind of like the Sheriff's. 9 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Property insurance? 10 MS. HARGIS: Property insurance, we probably will 11 go up, because we've got the new building going up, and that 12 will be at a higher value. We're also adding -- we're adding 13 out at the airport, but that shouldn't affect us, because 14 they're paying their own insurance. 15 COMMISSIONER REEVES: I just noticed we've spent 16 almost 60 this year, or projected for 60. 17 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah, what happened there? How 18 come we're only asking for 33 when -- increase when we got an 19 almost 59,849 projected this year? 20 MS. HARGIS: I got off on the wrong line item, so 21 hang on. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What line item is that? 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Property insurance. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Projected year-end is not 25 accurate. The actual -- a lot of those are paid annually. 5-19-14 bwk 107 1 MS. HARGIS: Oh, one of the reasons is that some -- 2 and when we get the bill in, we actually go to the different 3 departments, and one of the allocations was wrong this year, 4 we noticed when we were going through to the general fund. 5 So, the insurance really hasn't gone down; it's that we 6 placed it in the proper departments. One of the departments 7 didn't get charged last year for their share. Rusty gets 8 charged in his budget for his property -- for his vehicles 9 and buildings and so forth, so we have line items in certain 10 departments. The Environmental and Animal Control also have 11 a line item for property insurance. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is that -- is that -- 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Vehicles, yes. Property. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: See, I can see that, but the 15 buildings should all be under one item for us, it seems to 16 me. 17 COMMISSIONER REEVES: So we will pay 60,000 this 18 year in insurance? 19 MS. HARGIS: The insurance -- the total bill was 20 about 140,000. 21 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Which, under this 22 nondepartmental, we're going to pay 60? 23 MS. HARGIS: We should pay 33. You're looking at 24 projected again. 25 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Yes. 5-19-14 bwk 108 1 MS. HARGIS: Okay. We've actually paid 24,986. We 2 have a -- they will come in on July 1 with our bill. We'll 3 have three additional months on the accrual basis to add to 4 this, and it will come out to about 33,000. The cars are a 5 big -- they're 11 pages of vehicles. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. I think the cars need 7 to be charged to the departments, but the buildings should be 8 under this -- under here. This -- all we are looking at are 9 buildings here, correct? 10 MS. HARGIS: Right. Yeah, these are just the 11 buildings here. The cars -- 12 COMMISSIONER REEVES: How much are we paying for 13 buildings this year? 14 MS. HARGIS: I'd have to look. Just -- I mean, I 15 know what the total bill was, but I don't -- we also got a 16 big credit, because they overbilled us on several different 17 things. The property is for the buildings only. The 18 liability insurance, which doesn't make a lot of sense, 19 includes the property and the vehicles. 20 COMMISSIONER REEVES: So, under 480, is this 21 insurance for the buildings? Or buildings and cars? 22 MS. HARGIS: Buildings. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Buildings. 24 MS. HARGIS: Cars are under liability. My mistake 25 on that. That doesn't make -- 5-19-14 bwk 109 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I'm with Jonathan; put the 2 cars under the departments. 3 MS. HARGIS: The cars are under liability; they 4 come in at different times. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We've been going -- I've been 6 going through working with H.R. on this. They had -- they've 7 had -- we're trying to get all the buildings right. We're 8 looking at the airport to make sure everything's covered 9 there properly. At the Hill Country Youth Event Center, 10 trying to sort that out and take what we just demolished off. 11 MS. HARGIS: We have to take what's demolished off, 12 but we also have to pick up another coverage for under 13 construction. It's a double coverage. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But there was -- we had an 15 extra building listed out there under our policy that we -- 16 and we're trying to make sure they're all correct. We're 17 working on -- 18 MS. HARGIS: We worked on it last year extensively 19 with the appraisal and checking our assets. I know she 20 worked on the one with the airport, and it should have been 21 on there already. The Brinkman -- and I thought that I had 22 it on there in January, but the -- those buildings are not 23 under ours; they're under the airport. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Oh, that's right. The -- 25 MS. HARGIS: It comes in on our policy. That's 5-19-14 bwk 110 1 what I'm saying. There's other departments that -- that -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's billed out to them. 3 MS. HARGIS: -- that we have to bill out, like the 4 airport. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. So -- so, the Brown 6 hangar which we're acquiring -- which we're inheriting, okay, 7 the Brinkman hangar, so that's covered under airport 8 insurance; is that right? 9 MS. HARGIS: The property will be covered by Kerr 10 County. The liability insurance is carried by the City. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So that's a building we didn't 12 have last year that we have this year. 13 MS. HARGIS: That's a building we're adding on. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's going to be included in 15 here? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 17 MS. HARGIS: Right. We also had a big credit. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's going to be on here, but 19 it will actually get billed out to the Airport Board. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I know, but we'll see it here. 21 MS. HARGIS: We had a big credit this year as well, 22 because they had buildings on there that we caught when the 23 bill came in in July last year that were wrong. We have to 24 check the bill every year. We got an $8,700 credit this year 25 alone on automobiles that shouldn't have been on there. So, 5-19-14 bwk 111 1 we -- it takes us a while to go through that bill every year. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We'll get a -- we will know in 3 July what this number is for next year that we're going 4 through right now, making sure -- 5 MS. HARGIS: We get the bill in July. We're 6 working on the appraisal rolls now, I mean, sending in the 7 documentation. Now, I understand from Dawn this morning -- 8 normally, they had told me they only do these appraisals once 9 every three years, but they're changing companies, so we get 10 it -- we just had it done last year, as you'll recall, and so 11 now we'll get to have it done again. Which is good, 'cause 12 that means -- 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Just like -- well, just stick 14 on airport for a minute. So we've inherited one building 15 which we didn't have, so it's going to have to have insurance 16 on it. And the -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: T-hangars. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: -- Alamo College building was 19 a big increase in the -- you know, in improvements in it, and 20 then the T-hangars. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Will be added. 22 MS. HARGIS: That will be addressed, yeah. We have 23 had the AACOG building in there, so we're -- 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. So, you're saying 25 they're all going to be accounted for? 5-19-14 bwk 112 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. That's important, okay. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: Before we leave this one, I want to 4 go back to the two and a half percent thing across the board 5 and ask a few questions. Maybe it's a request. I don't want 6 a study or I don't want a survey of -- salary surveys or 7 anything like that. What I'd like is some input from the 8 department heads as to what they feel about -- are employees' 9 salaries and benefits competitive in the private -- for 10 private industry or other governmental entities? I'm asking 11 the question. I'm asking for employee turnover concerns. 12 So, are we losing any employees to private industry or to 13 other governmental entities? And if so, do you think it's 14 because of salary or benefits or what? I'd just like to have 15 an expression from department heads on that. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it'd be interesting to 17 hear. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Do you want that now, or at 19 the time we give our budget? 20 JUDGE POLLARD: Pardon? 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Do you want that now or at the 22 time we give our budget? 23 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah, you got a big department. 24 I'd like to hear that right now. As compared to K.P.D., for 25 example, Rusty. 5-19-14 bwk 113 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And don't forget the $8,000 2 family -- 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Actually, as far as your line 4 officers and our people that are working, this county and 5 this Court, with the Sheriff's Office, jail and deputies, has 6 really done well in the last especially ten years, trying to 7 bring them up equivalent. Now, if you look at Gillespie 8 County and Kendall County, they are paying more than we are, 9 but we had been outpaced. As far as Kerrville P.D., if you 10 look at those, we're pretty equivalent. Now, where it does 11 get out of whack, okay, is county-wide, and especially such 12 as mine or that, is your department heads or your higher-ups, 13 there is not enough gap between the higher-ups and the -- and 14 the line, because we brought all those up. So, your 15 department heads haven't grown, whether it be the elected 16 official, as myself, or some of these other ones. And where 17 you take -- and I'm not complaining, gentlemen, but if you 18 look at Kerrville P.D. and the Sheriff's Office, deputies are 19 paid pretty much equivalent, okay? If you get into what 20 their captains make over there, it's about anywhere from -- 21 close to probably 10,000 more than my chief. If you get to 22 their chief compared to mine, you're talking 40,000 23 difference in the police chief and mine, okay. 24 That's where we have failed, because the County has 25 done great with longevity and educational, and it has kept 5-19-14 bwk 114 1 our people moving up. But when it came to elected officials, 2 it didn't -- they're not entitled to that, okay? And so it 3 knocked that all out of whack. So, the way I look at it now, 4 if you -- if you really want to look, I think, in mine, I 5 think we've -- we've tried to bring them up some in the last 6 salary study stuff, but where you get into clerks and 7 secretaries, I think there's a gap in there that needs some 8 improvement. But at this point, I think -- and thank 9 goodness, due to the longevity, we haven't seen the turnover 10 that we used to see in the Sheriff's Office, because we have 11 brought them up. You know, I'll put it that way, Judge. 12 Less than 12 years ago, 14 years, when I took office, the 13 starting salary for a deputy back then was about -- I think 14 then it was 17,000-something a year, and right now we're at 15 about 40, okay. So that's a lot of ground made up in 14 16 years. But that's where we're at. 17 JUDGE POLLARD: The reason I'm asking this question 18 is if it turns out, from the revenue side, that we have to 19 take a look back and take a look at cutting, I think that one 20 of the things that we need to keep in mind is that we do 21 subsidize our employees on health insurance by this $8,000 22 figure a year. And if you start having to cut something on 23 -- maybe salary-wise, I wouldn't be in favor of cutting the 24 subsidy on the health insurance, because, see, that's 25 something they don't pay taxes on. If you cut them on their 5-19-14 bwk 115 1 salary, you cut them down some income there. I think that 2 health insurance is -- that helps us keep our employees, and 3 I wouldn't be in favor of cutting anything. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I think your health insurance 5 and some of the benefits are no doubt what helps you keep 6 some employees. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: I think so. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's not just salary. 9 JUDGE POLLARD: That will help us a lot on our 10 employee turnover. Give them raises as much as we can, of 11 course, but I need to -- I think we -- I need to have some 12 input from all the department heads, what they all think 13 about that issue. What do you think? 14 MS. BOLIN: Well, I can tell you I've hired three 15 people in the last year, and my top candidates turned down 16 the position because they would be taking a cut in pay, 17 regardless of the benefits. 18 JUDGE POLLARD: Where were they working? 19 MS. BOLIN: That's substantially -- 20 JUDGE POLLARD: I mean, where were they working? 21 Private industry? 22 MS. BOLIN: From private industry to us. And I 23 think that's the biggest problem that I've had, is getting 24 the people that I would really like to work in my office. I 25 mean, we have great benefits. Nobody's complaining about 5-19-14 bwk 116 1 them, but the -- and the salary to me is good. It's way more 2 than what I started at, and I know you guys are the same. 3 But the private industry, even in Kerr County, is paying more 4 than what we are. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's -- and I think 6 that's pretty common. And I don't have a problem with that, 7 you know. I mean, there's a trade-off there. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We also have a -- a security 10 level if do you good work. I mean, it's a pretty secure job. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think employees -- 12 unemployment here is like 4 percent, so that's our most fully 13 employed. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You don't talk about the 15 insurance thing very much around here, or we don't talk about 16 the insurance thing very much. I appreciate you bringing 17 that up, because that is a -- 18 JUDGE POLLARD: That's our real carrot to stay 19 here. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It absolutely is. 21 JUDGE POLLARD: It is. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Only reason I'm here. 23 JUDGE POLLARD: Well, that's probably the only 24 reason you've alive still. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, sure, could be. 5-19-14 bwk 117 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Maybe in my case. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, I think, you know, 3 going back, the reason the Court -- I don't know, however 4 long ago we did that longevity thing, everything -- for those 5 that don't know, every three years, an employee gets an 6 automatic two and a half percent increase. It's built in. 7 It comes as -- rolls in on their anniversary date, and we did 8 that to try to keep this -- to keep our salaries competitive 9 with other areas, since we were just slowly falling behind. 10 And that has really helped, county-wide. Keeping our 11 employees and keeping our salaries, you know, from falling 12 further behind is where I am, and I don't have a real 13 problem -- it's not being behind what people around are paid, 14 but I think we need to be competitive. We've accomplished 15 that through this policy. 16 JUDGE POLLARD: Well, Dawn, what do you think from 17 where your position is looking at county-wide? What's your 18 observation on it? 19 MS. LANTZ: Again, we did that study last year, and 20 we are higher than city of Kerrville on the entry level 21 positions, so a lot of them, we do get a lot of positions, 22 and I've seen on the applications, we start off $13, $14 an 23 hour at an entry level. They're coming from $9-an-hour jobs, 24 so yes, we do pay quite a bit more. Now, those specialty 25 areas where they need more expertise, I'm sure we're paid 5-19-14 bwk 118 1 lower. And in the Auditor's office, she looks for a certain 2 criteria in her office, so naturally, you're not going to get 3 a C.P.A. here for $40,000 a year. But, you know, those are 4 the differences we have. But -- 5 JUDGE POLLARD: I guess that's -- Diane, that's 6 what you're getting at. You're trying to get some people 7 with some expertise; is that right? To work in your office; 8 is that right? 9 MS. BOLIN: More or less. 10 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. 11 MS. BOLIN: I feel like they to have some customer 12 service background, which a lot of places have. But the 13 quality of employee, I don't want it to be a swinging door. 14 I don't want to have to keep interviewing people, so I try to 15 glean the people that I think will stay and do the county 16 right, be here 20 years, 25 years. 17 JUDGE POLLARD: Right. John, what do you have to 18 say about it? 19 MR. TROLINGER: Well, we're fortunate that we're 20 able to pay our I.T. specialists enough to keep them here and 21 have longevity, 'cause it's really sensitive to turnover in 22 I.T. And I had that when I first started with I.T. 23 specialists, so the Court has given me enough to keep them 24 here and keep them happy, so we're pretty good. I could 25 leave and go get 20,000 more a year, but I'd have to move. 5-19-14 bwk 119 1 So, really, looking at the I.T. department overall, I think 2 we're just in the right place, and we're able to attract -- 3 when we want to put out the requests, we're able to attract 4 someone that's going to be the right level. We're just at 5 the right level, I believe, for I.T. Thank you. 6 MS. STEBBINS: I -- my limited experience here at 7 the county, the employees in my office, I think, have been 8 here quite a while. I know that the -- I had one that just 9 retired after being here, you know, over a decade, I believe. 10 Correct me if I'm wrong; I think he's been here 16 years or 11 something. And then the others in the office, one came in 12 with Judge Emerson when he came in as County Attorney, and 13 then another one has been here -- I think she's been here 14 about four or five years. And one of the prosecutors has 15 been here for five years as well. But I think there's some 16 staying power in my office. And one of the young ladies 17 who's in there now who just got a promotion, she plans to 18 stay a good long while. So, I think that people are happy 19 working for the county. At least in my office, they'd like 20 to stay. 21 JUDGE POLLARD: Your assistant county attorneys 22 are, as far as you know, planning to stay here? 23 MS. STEBBINS: I think so. Far as I know, I think 24 they're planning on staying. One, I had to ask him to give 25 me a chance, a little while before he looked elsewhere, just 5-19-14 bwk 120 1 in the -- in the change, but I think he's planning on staying 2 too. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Now, I think John said 4 something very interesting, too. It's -- you know, he could 5 make more money going elsewhere, but he wants to stay here. 6 There's a lot of people that want to be here and are willing 7 to -- to take -- I know when we looked for a 911 executive 8 director, it was like a $40,000-a-year position, but good 9 gracious, the number of resumes -- we have really super, 10 super, super-qualified people that want to get out of the rat 11 race in Dallas and Houston, and were willing to take a cut in 12 salary, and some of them were retired military. And if -- 13 and the people we had on that list was superb. So, people 14 are willing to live in this area for less money. 15 MS. STEBBINS: Special place. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It's special, right. 17 JUDGE POLLARD: Jason? 18 MR. DAVIS: Judge, Commissioners, on the facility 19 side, I don't want to speak out of turn. I can't tell you 20 that I've got a strong enough feeling for that to give you 21 any firm judgment at this point. I will tell you that I've 22 been asked more than once about the salary for our 23 part-timers. I don't see anything at this point on the 24 facility side that is too out of line with where it should 25 be, with possibly the exception of one position. I don't see 5-19-14 bwk 121 1 anything that's too out of line even with other counties, 2 other than the fact there's not a lot of potential for 3 growth, because they are a smaller facility. Not a lot you 4 can do about that. You cannot ignore the benefits side, 5 whether it be the retirement, which has not been mentioned 6 too greatly, and, of course, the insurance. That's a huge -- 7 those are two huge things that employees are aware of and -- 8 and are thankful for, myself and across the board. That's 9 something that is truly -- our retirement program is a pretty 10 good program, and employees are aware of that. It's not 11 taken for granted, I can tell you that. 12 On the probation side, obviously, the board sets 13 the salaries for probation officers and for probation staff. 14 Our type of officer/employee that we have is a different 15 market than most other counties, strictly because of the 16 degree requirements. The problem that Kerr County has with 17 probation is going to be the same problem that almost every 18 other county's going to have with probation staff, and that 19 is retention and competition with the federal system. 20 Qualified individuals in a probation department, whether it 21 be adult or juvenile, are very often crossing over into other 22 federal -- into federal agencies; Border Patrol, I.C.E., 23 I.R.S. Yes, that's an issue somewhat here. We've lost a 24 couple of people to the feds, but you're going to have that 25 with every other probation office in the state. Not any 5-19-14 bwk 122 1 different than anyone else. 2 JUDGE POLLARD: We can't compete with the feds. 3 MR. DAVIS: Thank you. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: Across the board pretty much. 5 Jannett, you got any comments in this regard? 6 MS. PIEPER: No, I don't think you can go really 7 anyplace else, unless you have degrees, starting out at 14 an 8 hour. So, the employees seem to be really happy and pleased. 9 When the study came out, they got an increase in their -- 10 their salaries, and then the longevity kicks in, and so they 11 seem really happy. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. All right. So, what I've 13 heard is quality of life to live in Kerr County, and I think 14 I've heard that across the board for many years, especially 15 with the professional people, doctors and lawyers and CPA's 16 and all that. It costs you money to live in the hill 17 country, 'cause you can't make as much here, but quality of 18 life is important to you. I guess our retirement system I've 19 mentioned -- I've heard mentioned is attractive, and it helps 20 keep our employees here, and our health insurance. So, those 21 are the three things I've heard mentioned here that are 22 important to help us. All right, I'm satisfied with the 23 answers on that. I appreciate your participation. All 24 right. County Court? 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Where -- Jeannie, where do you 5-19-14 bwk 123 1 find 426? 2 MS. HARGIS: Right behind the next one. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Huh? 4 MS. HARGIS: Right behind the 409, I think -- no, 5 you have to go back to County Judge again. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Go back to County Judge? 7 JUDGE POLLARD: Right behind County Judge. Yeah, I 8 think it's County Court. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Why do we not put those things 10 in numerical order? 11 MS. HARGIS: Because, unfortunately, they came that 12 way when I got here. 13 JUDGE POLLARD: Ours is not to ask why, but just to 14 accept it. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Only problem is, I can't find 16 it. 17 JUDGE POLLARD: Well -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's -- 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 10-426. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, I know. 21 MS. HARGIS: Under County Judge, you've got a tab 22 that says "County Judge." 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 24 MS. HARGIS: It's the last one. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Under County Judge, okay. 5-19-14 bwk 124 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: If you had them numbered, it 2 would be Page 20. 3 MS. HARGIS: Actually, I lied; it's under County 4 Commissioners. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It's under County 6 Commissioners? 7 MS. HARGIS: 'Cause I just got this book too. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: See, I don't have a Page 20, so 9 there's no way -- 10 MS. HARGIS: Commissioners Court. Commissioners 11 Court. Everybody's got the -- two of you have a tab for 12 Commissioners Court. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, just a minute. 14 MS. HARGIS: Find your tab for Commissioners Court. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, got it. 16 MS. HARGIS: Second page. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 426. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Bingo. 19 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Thank you. 21 MS. HARGIS: Uh-huh. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I don't know how to find it 23 otherwise. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Page number. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: Supposed to be 7, isn't it? 5-19-14 bwk 125 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 20. 2 JUDGE POLLARD: I don't have a 20. 3 COMMISSIONER REEVES: If you got Jody's version, 4 it's Page 20. 5 MS. HARGIS: Do you have the Commissioners Court 6 tab? It's -- 7 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 8 MS. HARGIS: We got to get you all the same books 9 here. It's a little crazy. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Commissioners Court. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: I think you may have a job working 12 out puzzles. 13 MS. HARGIS: I know. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: There it is right there. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Ours is working fine. 16 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah, yours is working fine. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Got the page number and -- 18 and this little schedule here with the -- 19 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah, I got that. But, I mean, I 20 don't have the page. The page is gone. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, she's pretty tricky 22 breaking you new guys in. 23 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. 24 MS. HARGIS: And I do appreciate what she did very 25 much. Any questions on this one? 5-19-14 bwk 126 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Mm-hmm. Why did retirement 2 jump up so much from last year to this year? And this is -- 3 MS. HARGIS: Current budget is 12,037. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Huh? 5 MS. HARGIS: Current budget is 12,037. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, I know. It jumped from 7 9,000 to 12,000. 8 MS. HARGIS: I'm going to have to check that. 9 Right off the top of my head, I don't know. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. Put you a big question 11 mark. 12 MS. HARGIS: Let me double-check these. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That was my only question. 14 MS. HARGIS: Oh, probably because of the elected 15 official's salary that we didn't include before, the mental 16 health. It includes the top -- the 13,000. The 5,000 was 17 new this year, the 533 and the 78. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What are you talking about? 19 MS. HARGIS: Okay, 101 -- you add 101, 104, 108, 20 and 110 and multiply that times 12.49; it's 12,220. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Oh, I see. 22 MS. HARGIS: We didn't have those. Those were not 23 in these other years. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, got you. Okay, that 25 explains it. 5-19-14 bwk 127 1 MS. HARGIS: That was a change that the Judge had 2 made. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, I see. So they weren't 4 in the previous -- okay, wasn't in the previous year, so that 5 explains it. 6 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. We have one employee with a -- 7 with some longevity for next year. 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, got you. 9 MS. HARGIS: Is that it? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's the only question I had. 11 MS. HARGIS: Oh. Can we squeeze the Law Library in 12 here? 13 MS. STEBBINS: Should have done it with my budget. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sure. 15 MS. STEBBINS: The Law Library, I don't think there 16 are any changes. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's not on the workshop list. 18 I don't know. You're the County Attorney. Can we talk about 19 it or not? 20 MS. STEBBINS: Is it not on the list? 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It's not on the list. 22 MS. GRINSTEAD: It says "including, but not limited 23 to." That's why we worded it that way. 24 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Let's hear it. 25 MS. STEBBINS: I don't think we have any changes at 5-19-14 bwk 128 1 all on the Law Library. 2 MS. HARGIS: Actually, we do. 3 MS. STEBBINS: We reduced it some. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's -- what funds it? 5 MS. HARGIS: It's Fund 18. 6 MR. ROBLES: 18. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Fund 19? 8 MR. ROBLES: 18. 9 MS. HARGIS: 18. Let me pass this out. It might 10 be easier just to look at this, 'cause it's just one item. 11 (Discussion off the record.) 12 JUDGE POLLARD: Just one comment to you. 13 MS. HARGIS: Y'all ready? 14 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah, go ahead. 15 MS. STEBBINS: Last year about midyear, I wasn't 16 here, but the Law Library went from the District Clerk's 17 Office to the County Attorney's office. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 19 MS. STEBBINS: And so without the librarian's 20 salary, which is just over $4,000, it's a state supplement, I 21 believe. 22 MS. HARGIS: No. 23 MS. STEBBINS: No, it's not? It's county, okay. 24 So, without that librarian salary -- and I think that what's 25 happened between that time and this time is that just trying 5-19-14 bwk 129 1 to get a handle on the subscriptions and the automatic 2 renewals on particular books and stocking the library and 3 keeping it up to date, there's been a decrease in the amount 4 that's requested over there. I think -- 5 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. We were at 71, then we went 6 down to 62. This year we've only spent 38, and we're 7 budgeting 62. In these statutory funds, we usually budget a 8 little bit more, because we don't have the emergency 9 situation. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is -- this is a dedicated 11 fund that we can't -- it's here. I'd go ahead and go with -- 12 agree with keeping it that amount. I know that the previous 13 County Attorney deleted or canceled a lot of things that he 14 thought were just a waste of money, so I suspect that after 15 another year of this, we can kind of figure out what a good 16 number is. But I have no problem leaving it 62, because it's 17 a dedicated item. 18 MS. HARGIS: What about moving it back to the 19 District Clerk's Office? 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's a different discussion 21 at a different day. 22 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 23 MS. STEBBINS: Thank you. 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: This year you won't have the 25 expenses in it you have next year, because next year's the 5-19-14 bwk 130 1 legislative year. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: So then all departments -- 4 like all my officers and that, we have to order all new law 5 books, which also come out of that. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 7 MS. HARGIS: One thing I did notice, the revenue I 8 projected would be up a little bit. But, you know, if we 9 spend 62, we take in about 61,950; you know, we're kind of 10 washing. I did hand y'all a summary sheet, per your request. 11 Please note that on Monday evening before I left, we did get 12 the Central Appraisal preliminary numbers. They are in here. 13 The maximum is in here. We did get an additional amount of 14 revenue. Everybody -- have you got enough? I have plenty. 15 Everybody got one? The total levy for next year, without any 16 cuts, which is -- you know, we're taking ourselves out here 17 on the line, because we've always lost. The year before 18 last, we lost 250,000 in revenue. That possibility is always 19 out there with the protest. The total levy for this year, 20 keeping this current tax rate, is 16,682,687. There was 21 about $138 million in increased property values. So, I have 22 -- with the whole budget without any cuts, you can see that 23 will pull us down to 19 percent. If we put the 600,000 in, 24 whether we put it in now or we put it in the -- in the budget 25 for the airport, that brings us down to 15 percent, and that 5-19-14 bwk 131 1 is without any cuts. Road and Bridge has some $650,000 worth 2 of capital. Perhaps he's going to have to cut a little bit 3 of that, because that puts him $396,000 in the hole. And, 4 again, these are based on the estimates that I -- the best 5 estimates that I can come up with, with our cash balance 6 starting on -- on October 1 of next year. So -- and we have 7 an increase in the debt service; we knew that was going to 8 happen. That's kind of taking some of our -- of that 9 additional money that we've got. We have the new obligation 10 of 191,250. We got 17,000 in accrual off of the issue, so 11 that's going to be a bigger bite than you -- the 2012 issue 12 went down, because the financial advisers knew that the 2010 13 issue was going to be high. We still have one more year on 14 the 2010 issue. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You didn't put library in 16 there. 17 MS. HARGIS: I did not. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I sent you a letter. 19 MS. HARGIS: I know. I think I have it in the 20 book, but I know -- 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Oh, it's in the book. Got 22 you, okay. All right. So, we'll discuss that. 23 MS. HARGIS: Which would put us even more in the 24 hole. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 5-19-14 bwk 132 1 MS. HARGIS: But, you know, again, this is a 2 crystal ball I don't have. I'm not -- I was pretty close 3 last year, that we ended the year with five million, two. We 4 ended the year with five million two and a little bit more. 5 But it's pretty early. I don't have a lot of extra revenue 6 here for sales tax. We can look at that again, but there's 7 not much else. I got the revenue projections that you 8 already have, and you can take a look at those. But I was 9 excited to get the roll. Road and Bridge got an additional 10 65,000 based on the roll. So, it was great news, and I was 11 very excited about it. But we're -- we need to make -- we 12 have about a million -- with all of the requests that are in 13 here, all the employees that were requested, everything -- 14 COMMISSIONER REEVES: How much? 15 MS. HARGIS: The deficit? 16 (Commissioner Reeves nodded.) 17 MS. HARGIS: I don't have it in front of me, but I 18 think it's going to be close to about a million, seven. I'd 19 hate to see our fund balance go down that low, but that's not 20 my job. That's -- 21 COMMISSIONER REEVES: And is that including -- 22 MS. HARGIS: The airport. 23 COMMISSIONER REEVES: And the library? 24 MS. HARGIS: No, it doesn't include the library. 25 If you include that, it would put us at a million, nine. 5-19-14 bwk 133 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The library -- not the library, 2 the airport. You have 660 down here. Is that just taking it 3 out of reserves? Is that what that is? 4 MS. HARGIS: That's added to the -- well, it's 5 taking it out of reserves and then putting it into our next 6 year's budget as well, the 660. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So -- and there's an option 8 there of -- of doing a five-year note on that. 9 MS. HARGIS: I would suggest after the meeting this 10 morning, which there may be other additional items that need 11 to be repaired, that that might be a possibility to go out 12 and get -- you know, get a five-year note or a three-year 13 note. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, I think that's an option 15 we need to look at. I think the approach is -- is this Court 16 recommended that they hire an expert, which they're doing, 17 and I think they'll probably come back with some of the 18 repairs that are not -- you know, just putting a blanket over 19 the whole thing, doing coating on some of the newer buildings 20 and things like that, so hopefully that will reduce some of 21 those costs. And then it may be in some of the buildings, 22 just -- they're looking at maybe even moving equipment out to 23 stuff that's not fully utilized in the airport, and just -- 24 maybe the hammer house, they say, "Forget it; it's going to 25 be too costly to fix." Some of that equipment is almost near 5-19-14 bwk 134 1 its -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's what they arrived at at 3 the last meeting. Their long-range plan they presented was 4 to use the -- the hangar building on the far east, which is a 5 new building. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They weren't even going to 8 completely utilize that for a couple of years. Well, move 9 all the stuff into that building, -- 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, that's an option. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- tear out a bunch of garbage. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's the option they're 13 looking at. So, leaving the number in is probably, you know, 14 appropriate. I don't think -- hopefully it's not going to be 15 any more than that, but they're looking at -- I think they're 16 doing a good job looking. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I mean, I think the key 18 is that we need to look at that overall package, not jumping 19 all of a sudden and put plastic over all these roofs. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Exactly. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, they're doing the right 22 thing, you know, by hiring a consultant, figuring out where 23 the real problem is. I know everyone says it's an emergency 24 and needs to be fixed, but it hasn't changed in five years. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, yeah, it has. The 5-19-14 bwk 135 1 roof's gone. 2 JUDGE POLLARD: Well, is there insurance on that? 3 Do they have some insurance on that? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The roof's always been 5 looking -- 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No, no, the roof is gone, in 7 big sections. It's gone. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: Tore some of the roof off? 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It left a big hole. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We have insurance that covers 11 that. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We have to fix it anyway. We 13 got a letter saying it's an emergency, so -- so, anyway -- 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Letter from who? 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: From Mooney to the Airport 16 Board, and the Airport Board sent it to us. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I saw that, but the roof -- 18 that damage is an emergency and can be fixed by our 19 insurance. 20 MS. HARGIS: Their insurance is included in their 21 lease. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: In their lease. I mean -- 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: If they can fix it, that's the 24 way to do it. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But, I mean, it's an emergency, 5-19-14 bwk 136 1 but I have a bit of a problem with their current -- whatever 2 Barry's title is, Chief Operating Officer, whatever it is. 3 You know, when he's been there for five years and knows it 4 looks rough, and to say all of a sudden, you know, it's an 5 emergency -- they need to be fixed, but to qualify as an 6 emergency, the roof's -- other than it's a new hole. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It's people mostly. You know, 8 they can't work in there in electrical with water coming down 9 on electrical stuff. They haven't worked in there hardly in 10 five years. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The roof didn't change in five 12 years. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Agree. Agree. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, it needs to be fixed. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It is what it is. Either fix 16 it or bulldoze it, bottom line. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We need to fix it; I agree with 18 that. But I have a problem jumping up and down saying it's 19 an emergency when it's been like that for five years. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, they can't work in 21 there. It's people's safety. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And they've known that for five 23 years. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It doesn't matter. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: They haven't had that -- 5-19-14 bwk 137 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's almost been shut down for 2 five years. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We could have gone out there 4 and fixed it, but we didn't. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, that's my point. It's 6 not an emergency to us and the City. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It's an emergency. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We decided not -- we chose not 9 to fix it. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It's an emergency for the 11 people working there. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: Well, whatever. If we want to get 13 them back working in there, -- 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It's an emergency. 15 JUDGE POLLARD: -- we're going to have to consider 16 fixing it somehow. We'll do it the best way we can, schedule 17 it or whatever, do the things that you're talking about. But 18 I'm -- I'm confident that when they finally figure out what 19 needs to be done, then you get somebody to bid on it, it's 20 going to cost twice as much as we thought. I mean, that just 21 seems to be the standard. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree with that. 23 JUDGE POLLARD: I mean, expect it. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. We should consider it 25 for sure. Okay, are we through? 5-19-14 bwk 138 1 JUDGE POLLARD: I think we're through. Anybody 2 want to move for adjournment? 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So moved. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: All those in favor, signify by 6 raising your right hand. 7 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 4-0.) 8 JUDGE POLLARD: It is unanimous. 9 (Budget workshop adjourned at 4:10 p.m.) 10 - - - - - - - - - - 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 5-19-14 bwk 139 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 official reporter for the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 26th day of May, 2014. 8 9 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 10 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 11 Certified Shorthand Reporter 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 5-19-14 bwk