1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Budget Workshop 10 Monday, August 18, 2014 11 11:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: TOM POLLARD, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 TOM MOSER, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BOB REEVES, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X August 18, 2014 2 PAGE 3 --- Participate in Budget Workshop to discuss proposed FY 2014-15 Kerr County Budget 3 4 --- Adjourned 49 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 3 1 On Monday, August 18, 2014, at 11 a.m., a budget 2 workshop of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE POLLARD: Let's proceed to the next item, to 8 participate in a budget workshop to discuss proposed fiscal 9 year 2014 and '15 Kerr County budget. Is the County Auditor 10 ready to make a presentation? 11 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: On what you just handed us? 13 MS. HARGIS: Yes. There were a few changes. Is 14 this on? 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah. 16 MS. HARGIS: You can hear me? There were a few 17 changes that we had to make due to some position schedules 18 this last week. They were existing employees, but they had 19 higher salaries than we needed to -- from promotions or being 20 moved around. So, we also had to do -- fix the grant for the 21 Crime Victims, so we have all three of those in. And those 22 were the major changes between last time that we met and 23 today, and that's really all the changes that we've made based 24 on the position schedule. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: As I understand it, those three 8-18-14 bwk 4 1 changes amount to what, about $10,000? 2 MS. HARGIS: Right. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: In the budget? 4 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. And that leaves us with a 6 shortfall of -- what is it? 7 MS. HARGIS: 371,000, rounded off. Which -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Wait. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What's that? 10 MS. HARGIS: 371. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Say the whole sentence? 12 MS. HARGIS: That puts our shortfall for the year 13 right now, surplus -- the use of surplus funds of $370,382. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Now, this $370,000 shortfall, 15 that's including the increased revenue? 16 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So -- so, simply said, if we're 18 trying to balance the budget, we're $370,000 short. 19 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm, that's correct. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I might just make a general 21 comment, that -- correct me if I'm wrong, Commissioner 22 Baldwin, but I don't believe, as long as I've been a 23 Commissioner, that we've yet -- I -- we never spend the entire 24 budget. It's impossible. There's a number of different 25 accounts we have. 8-18-14 bwk 5 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is one of the lower 3 deficits that we have had going into a budget, probably. You 4 know, and almost -- well, I think every time -- every budget 5 since I've been a commissioner, the amount that we said is 6 going to be a deficit turned out not to be a deficit. So, I 7 mean -- 'cause you can't just -- you know, it's not possible 8 to spend everything 'cause of some of these salary items and 9 all that. So, we -- you know, having a short -- or a minor 10 deficit in the budget is -- is kind of standard, and yields a 11 balanced budget. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So it's betting on the come, 13 but it is not balancing the budget going in, what we're 14 adopting. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: But I understand what you're 17 saying. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. 19 COMMISSIONER REEVES: We have -- how much will we -- 20 do you project that we won't spend in this year's budget left 21 over? 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Take it out of there. 23 MS. HARGIS: I think I'm predicting about a half a 24 million this year, which is less than we have in the past. We 25 had a million, four in 2011, a million, five in 2012, and 981 8-18-14 bwk 6 1 in 2013. But we gave a smaller deductible this year on our 2 health insurance, and the dental was included in that premium, 3 so our premium was -- and we had an increase in premium last 4 year which we absorbed, so that's going to bring our overall 5 outcome down a little bit. But I would say around 500. 6 That's conservative, but I don't think it will be much more 7 than that. 8 COMMISSIONER REEVES: So, 500,000 left over from 9 last -- from this current year's budget, and basically the 10 deficit this year will eat up what -- 11 MS. HARGIS: Pretty much what we take off. 12 COMMISSIONER REEVES: But this is what Commissioner 13 Letz is saying; we don't ever spend all of it, so it's -- 14 MS. HARGIS: Well, and in the past, we've had that 15 group insurance premium that was a little bit high. Now we're 16 actually going to be using every penny of our group insurance, 17 so it's going to look a little different in this -- in the 18 coming year. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's one of the reasons 20 we look at the reserves; it's really a better judge than from 21 year to year, because that takes out the fluctuations in the 22 budget spending and all in our budget. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And I appreciate what 24 Commissioner Letz has said. I think it's an excellent point. 25 Just off the top of your head, say for the last three years -- 8-18-14 bwk 7 1 so you project this year we'll go out a half a million in the 2 positive. In the previous two years, -- 3 MS. HARGIS: That's what -- 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: -- it's been a million-plus, as 5 I recall. 6 MS. HARGIS: It was down to less than a million last 7 year. 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 9 MS. HARGIS: In 2012, -- 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: The year before that. 11 MS. HARGIS: Year before that was a million, five. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. So, a million, five; a 13 million. Ballpark, half a million, so okay. All right. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, I mean, it's a deficit, 15 but -- 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And it goes into reserves, 17 right? 18 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 20 MS. HARGIS: And we purposely did those years a 21 little bit so that we could get -- our reserves had gotten 22 very low. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Mm-hmm. 24 MS. HARGIS: And so we -- those two particular years 25 were done with bringing the reserve back up in mind. 8-18-14 bwk 8 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. And that was -- I think 2 Commissioner Moser was on the Court, and I know Commissioner 3 Baldwin was. Our reserves got down to about 12 percent, and 4 we, you know, really tightened the belt. And part of the way 5 we do the budgeting, you know, trying -- that's how you build 6 it, by not spending it. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: So the reserves are now 25 percent, 8 are they? 9 MS. HARGIS: 25 -- if you'll look at the summary, 10 we're at 25.12. 25 percent on the general fund. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: Mm-hmm. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Do we -- 13 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. And that's kind of the 14 bright line, too. We don't want to drop below 25 percent 15 because that has an adverse effect on our interest rates. Is 16 that correct? 17 MS. HARGIS: That's correct. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And cash flow and everything 19 else. 20 MS. HARGIS: Cash flow is a real problem if we go 21 under 25 percent. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And that's what's also 23 recommended by the State? 24 MS. HARGIS: Yes, it is. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. Any further questions or 8-18-14 bwk 9 1 comments on the budget? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: Any other Commissioners? Yes, sir? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have two comments, and one's a 5 minor -- minor one, and it's the Law Library. I think the 6 stipend for the Law Library -- I think the plan in the budget, 7 I believe, is moving it back up to the District Clerk. Is 8 that money -- 9 MS. HARGIS: That's what's been requested by the two 10 departments. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is Robbin here? 12 MS. HARGIS: Yes, she is right here. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh, there you are. Hi, Robbin. 14 I just wanted to make sure you're here when I said it. To 15 me -- the stipend is 4,200-something? 16 MS. HARGIS: Mm-hmm. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To me, that seems like a lot for 18 that. That equates to about 8 percent of the salary of -- 7 19 or 8 percent of your total salary, and I didn't think it took 20 that much time to do it. I don't have a problem with a 21 stipend, but I think that -- I'm not sure how it got so high. 22 Well, I know how it got that high; every time we did an 23 increase, we increased that along the way. You know, do you 24 think that it -- that that is an accurate amount, that it's 25 about 8 percent of the time to do that? And, I mean, I think 8-18-14 bwk 10 1 it should be lower, personally. That's my feeling. I think 2 it should be closer to 2,000 or 3,000, somewhere in that 3 range, more than 4,200. But that's just for what it's worth. 4 MS. BURLEW: I haven't done the Law Library in the 5 last year, so I don't know what kind of changes they've made 6 as far as the County Attorney, so I couldn't tell you, you 7 know, what time frame we're talking about. I'm just going by 8 the past when Linda had it. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 10 MS. BURLEW: And I know it was time-consuming with 11 the pockets parts and so forth. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I think it's -- I guess my 13 comment is I'm not going to -- like I say, I think it's 14 something I wanted to bring up. That's one of the reasons I 15 think the County Attorney took it down to his office 16 previously, was to eliminate that stipend, but for whatever 17 reason it's going back up, and the stipend's coming back up. 18 So I'm just -- you know, I think it should be lower, but I'm 19 not going to make a big fight over it. But I think that -- 20 you know, I would appreciate it, if the stipend stays that 21 rate, that you really keep track of the hours, because I just 22 don't think it's right for the taxpayers to pay that much if 23 it's not -- if that's not the amount of work that -- or the 24 amount of time required. And based on the, you now, rough 25 calculations, that means about one hour a day should be 8-18-14 bwk 11 1 spent -- every day should be spent having to do that, and I 2 just cannot imagine it takes that much time. 3 The other comment I have is a Road and Bridge 4 question. And I just want to make sure that -- and I don't 5 think it's in there, 'cause we didn't really talk about it 6 when we started the budget. It's the Lane Valley 7 right-of-way project. I was hoping to get most of that done 8 this year. It's -- the survey, I think, is going to be 9 finalized this year, but I don't think the funding is -- I 10 don't think it's going to be far enough along to be able to 11 set aside those funds out of this year's budget. So, the 12 Auditor -- and I think it's -- Leonard, didn't we figure 13 about 45,000 or 50,000? I forgot at what point -- 14 MR. ODOM: We discussed 50,000. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 50,000 for that project. If it 16 cannot be -- you can't carry it forward unless we have an 17 actual agreement, correct? I'm looking at the Auditor for 18 that. 19 MS. HARGIS: We can do it as an encumbrance for up 20 to 90 days, but that's as long as I can... 21 MR. ODOM: Yeah. When are they going to start? I 22 mean, I don't have any -- 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, the -- I mean, we're 24 finalizing the right-of-way part. I mean, 90 days after -- I 25 think it -- so, 90 days is by the first of the year; I think 8-18-14 bwk 12 1 it could probably be done by then. You've got to spend the 2 money within 90 days? 3 MS. HARGIS: You're supposed to, yes. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You don't want to just zero 5 it out. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: My preference would be -- I just 7 don't want to get caught short, because it's -- my preference 8 would be to put 50,000 into Road and Bridge for that project 9 for next year. 10 MS. HARGIS: Okay. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And it's basically -- I mean, 12 it's not -- the increase in the budget is for next year, but 13 at the same time, it's money that's not going to be spent this 14 year in the budget, so it's not that -- it's not really a net 15 change. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How much -- how much did we 17 originally put in there this year? This year that we're in 18 right now is the first year we did the Lane Valley thing? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: First year we spent any money on 20 a little bit of right-of-way. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How much? 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it was 40 -- 30? 23 MS. HOFFER: Wasn't it just for survey? 2,000. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought it was -- part of it 25 went under special projects. 8-18-14 bwk 13 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 2,000 for -- 2 MS. HOFFER: Survey work. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: -- surveying work? 4 MS. HARGIS: That's about all. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And so now he wants to 6 increase it by $48,000. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do you want to throw him out, 9 or do you want me to? 10 MS. HARGIS: I can't do that. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Neither can I. (Laughter.) 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's a project we've 13 been working on for a long time. We've surveyed it. We've 14 been surveying it again. Right now we're finalizing it. 15 It's -- there have been, in the last three months, three 16 wrecks, one fatality, and another wreck that it was just an 17 act of God that it wasn't a fatality. It's a dangerous road. 18 Charlie and I have driven on it enough times. I think anyone 19 who drives on this road -- we have three landowners that are 20 willing to work with the County; they're going to give the 21 County the right-of-way if we build new fences. And that's -- 22 the funds are to fence the right-of-way. They're willing to 23 give us the property -- four landowners; Mr. Cagle, 24 Mr. Foreman, Mr. Crenwelge, and Mr. Henry. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Does that complete -- 8-18-14 bwk 14 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It goes -- I'd say it goes -- 2 it'll cover, mileage-wise, probably 75 percent of the road, 3 70 percent of the road. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And so -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It will take it -- we're 6 taking -- it's the middle piece that's bad. Really, just a 7 lot of -- it's basically -- y'all know where Dawn lives? It's 8 a little bit past Dawn's house, out about 4 miles. There's 9 about a 4-mile stretch that's very narrow. It's about 10 anywhere from, right now, probably 25 foot wide 11 fence-to-fence, and it's a winding road that goes down in two 12 draws and a couple right-angle corners. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the other remaining 14 30 percent, I mean, you're going to have to purchase later on? 15 Or -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't -- 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: When does that happen? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This is the dangerous part. The 19 rest of the part -- the part further back, until there's more 20 traffic, I don't think it's justified to do anything. On the 21 front part, it's a straightaway that has not been that 22 dangerous. It's -- we'd like to get some additional 23 right-of-way, but it's -- those property owners have not been 24 as easy to work with. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Where does that -- I have to 8-18-14 bwk 15 1 ask Len this. It's a dangerous road. I take everything 2 you're saying for granted, but where does this road 3 improvement for safety relate to priority for other things in 4 the county? 5 MR. ODOM: What's a human life worth? 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No, I didn't ask that. I said 7 this road, relative to other roads that have potential 8 dangerous -- danger also. Where does this fit in priority to 9 the other roads that need to be improved, and in a similar or 10 other fashion? 11 MR. ODOM: Well, -- 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think that's important. 13 MR. ODOM: -- this one here is probably as -- as bad 14 as I've seen. When you get out in the west end, you get some 15 very narrow roads at 20, 30 -- 30 foot's all that's got. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 17 MR. ODOM: And it's developing there. You have 18 that -- I don't recall the name of it, but the one back there 19 behind your ranch there. All that -- 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Privilege Creek, but that still 21 hasn't developed. 22 MR. ODOM: Hasn't developed yet, but it has 23 potential. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: But I know Spur 100 and a lot 25 of other roads and bridges that are almost single-lane. 8-18-14 bwk 16 1 MR. ODOM: Yes, sir, and I'm going to address that 2 in the new budget year, or toward the end of this budget year. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. And I'm not arguing with 4 this; I'm just saying I think we look at these kind of things 5 in allocating funds; ought to have some thought into 6 prioritization. 7 MR. ODOM: That's -- I always do. I'll -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I can say that in my precinct, 9 it's the worst -- most dangerous stretch of road that exists. 10 And I know that, you know, county-wide, when there have 11 been -- you know, as we can afford it, we've tried to fix 12 roads. 13 MR. ODOM: With that -- 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sheppard Rees is a good example 15 in Precinct 1. It was -- we knew the traffic in that area was 16 growing. 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Sure. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You know, we did that one. The 19 bridge on Spur 100, the one that needs to be fixed. 20 MR. ODOM: Yeah. If you grade everything by 21 accidents and all like that with that fatality, you come to 22 the forefront of priorities. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. I'm just -- I'm not -- I 24 don't have a -- 25 JUDGE POLLARD: So there hasn't been a fatality yet 8-18-14 bwk 17 1 on Spur 100? 2 MR. ODOM: No, sir, and that will be widened. That 3 facility -- that crossing there, I'm going to do that. I will 4 look at the budget. At this point, I didn't come prepared to 5 come in here to give you $50,000. But -- 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Have to be an increase, I mean, 7 obviously. 8 MR. ODOM: Well, that's true, and I may have some 9 there. The only problem, like the Auditor said, is I can only 10 carry it forward so far. And that fence and clearing and all 11 like that is not going to happen in 30 days. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think it's better to not try 13 to rush it out of the current budget, and put the money in the 14 next-year budget. I mean -- 15 JUDGE POLLARD: A budget change? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Add 50,000 to the -- to his Road 17 and Bridge special -- put it under special projects. 18 MR. ODOM: Right. And let me take a look, 'cause as 19 I go through, I've got about a month and a half here to look 20 at what -- there are some savings. When I say "savings," 21 salary and things like that, that I can come up with enough 22 maybe to offset -- at least offset it as I go into -- and it 23 goes back to my reserves anyways. So -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 25 MR. ODOM: -- it is doable, maybe without impacting. 8-18-14 bwk 18 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 2 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. Mr. Reeves, do you have 3 anything? 4 MR. REEVES: Just -- what Commissioner Letz is 5 saying, just so I understand, you don't see any need to have 6 to purchase the right-of-ways? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 8 MR. REEVES: It's a time where they're willing to 9 give the right-of-way. We're not going to have to look for 10 land acquisition because of the need to straighten this road; 11 is that what I understand? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, that's correct. There -- 13 we've -- you know, and this has been not just on this project; 14 we did the same thing over on Stoneleigh, Lazy Valley, some 15 other roads. If the County's willing to work on fixing the 16 roads long-term and improving it, I haven't bought 17 right-of-way, ever. I think that people should donate the 18 right-of-way, and -- and in every area in my precinct that 19 I've had, people have always done that. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the donation of the 21 right-of-way, and then us building a fence in lieu of, 22 that's -- we've been doing that a long, long time. 23 MR. ODOM: Long time. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's been a -- that's a good 25 swap. 8-18-14 bwk 19 1 MR. ODOM: That's cheap overall. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It is. This fatality, that 3 was a head-on deal, wasn't it? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And I just can't picture that 6 in my mind, why they did that head-on thing. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, it was -- I mean, no one 8 knows because one person, obviously, is deceased. But it 9 was -- where it happened is where you have a -- and Len has 10 since gone out and cleared brush to try to make -- improve the 11 line of sight, but your -- basically, it was a blind corner. 12 One car was coming up a hill, one car was right on a corner. 13 One went like that. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I see, yeah. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And don't know if there -- what 16 the intent was exactly that caused it. Speed did not appear 17 to be -- from what I've heard from the D.P.S. reports, to be 18 the cause. But, you know, maybe someone -- you know, looking 19 at the possibility of, you know, seizure, heart attack, cell 20 phone. I mean, just the idea that one of them was distracted, 21 or something happened with one of them. That was the 22 individual that was deceased. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And the possibility of 24 subdivision-type building going on in the -- on the end of it 25 back there where it could be -- could be an increase of 8-18-14 bwk 20 1 traffic, I don't see that within the next few months, but -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, I don't think that that's -- 3 that's not the -- the desire is more the people that are 4 willing to give the right-of-way right now. We're not going 5 -- there's, you know, another 2 miles that would need to be 6 addressed at some point if that happens, but I think the 7 developer -- I'd look to that developer if that ever happened. 8 Well, it is going to happen, I think, but the developer to 9 help improve the road towards the back part where it gets 10 really, really narrow. 11 MR. ODOM: They would have to get 90 feet of 12 right-of-way at that point to get to an arterial. 13 JUDGE POLLARD: What's your position about the 14 current budget? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I think what's Len's 16 saying is he's going to try -- you know, his budget's not part 17 of our general budget. To add 50,000 to next year's budget, 18 and he may be able to, you know -- 19 MR. ODOM: My reserves. Leave it in reserves 20 somehow. 21 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. 22 MR. ODOM: Just give me a little bit of time, and 23 I'll -- we'll get back with you -- with the Judge and you, if 24 that's all right. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, okay. 8-18-14 bwk 21 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. Anything else, Bob? 2 MR. REEVES: Not at this time. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Judge, I do have one question 4 of the Auditor. Are there any salary increases in the budget 5 other than longevity and education and all those other things? 6 Just all of us Indians? 7 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Is there? 9 MS. HARGIS: Yeah. Yes, there were eight -- eight 10 salary increases that were approved by the Court. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. I meant 12 besides those. 13 MS. HARGIS: No. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Besides -- nothing slipped in 15 there? 16 MS. HARGIS: No. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 18 MS. HARGIS: No, that's -- the position schedule was 19 changed because of people moving into positions in the current 20 year. We didn't have their current salary, so once we got 21 that, it raised it. Because there's been movement this year, 22 so you can't -- it was -- it was just an occurrence that 23 happened. It wasn't meant to be, but it's something that 24 happened in three departments. And then we had to fix the 25 grant -- Rosa's grant. And we are getting a grant, plus two 8-18-14 bwk 22 1 other counties are sharing in that, the difference that we 2 didn't get this year. So, you know, that helped us with our 3 budget, because we got the grant this year. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 5 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Do you recall, just to refresh 6 my memory, which positions those were? 7 MS. HARGIS: County Attorney's office, the -- her 8 assistant attorney. 9 JUDGE POLLARD: That's Stacy? 10 MS. HARGIS: Stacy. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Road and Bridge. 12 MS. HARGIS: Road and Bridge. Mine. 13 MR. REEVES: Yours? 14 MS. HARGIS: Mine. 15 MR. REEVES: How much was your increase? 16 MS. HARGIS: Four. 17 MR. REEVES: 4,000? 18 MS. HARGIS: But the overall budget went down, 19 because I'm not going to be here a whole year. 20 COMMISSIONER REEVES: I don't recall yours. When 21 did we do that? 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judges are doing it upstairs. 24 COMMISSIONER REEVES: The Judges have approved that? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. They decide and just tell 8-18-14 bwk 23 1 us what it's going to be. 2 MR. REEVES: Okay. 3 MS. HARGIS: Then we had crime -- the indigent -- 4 indigent department -- Indigent Health Department went up. I 5 don't necessarily remember what all -- there were several in 6 Road and Bridge. Part of the Road and Bridge ones were due 7 to -- and then we had some in juvenile, Juvenile Detention. 8 So, most of those were -- Road and Bridge and the Juvenile 9 Detention were left over from the study, and so there were two 10 or three in each one of those departments that we didn't take 11 all the way up last year, because we were trying to do just a 12 little bit at a time, 'cause some of the people on that study 13 were, like, three or four steps down. So, we didn't -- we 14 took them to two, and then we decided to go ahead and just get 15 it done, because it's too hard to keep up with year to year 16 what this person or that person had done. And there was only, 17 like I said, six left, I think. 18 MR. REEVES: Thank you. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: Any other further comments? Or -- 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I have a comment. 21 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I want to go back to the 23 subject of the Butt-Holdsworth Library. We looked at -- 24 Commissioners Court -- I think at a previous Commissioners 25 Court, we looked at -- sent the City a couple of options on -- 8-18-14 bwk 24 1 tried to get our foot back in the door in the library, with 2 them recognizing that we are providing services for 3 environmental health and animal control. And another one 4 where we contribute $200,000, and they pay their fair share of 5 some other things. Reading the newspaper, the City Council 6 rejected that. I think that they -- well, for whatever 7 reason, I'm not going to speak for them, they rejected that. 8 So, I would like for us to include in the budget $65,000 next 9 year to take a small step back toward the facility -- the 10 library being available to residents of the county, where they 11 don't have to pay. 'Cause there's a lot of people that want 12 to use the library and they can't, can't afford it. 13 So, $65,000 at the top, but the minimum would be 14 1,000 people in the county, outside the city, that would have 15 full privileges in the library. It would be probably about 16 1,900 people if they only used $35 for fees. So, the 17 County -- the City says anybody outside the city, they that 18 want full privileges pay $65 a year, or $35 a year if they 19 only have library. So, I'm proposing that we take a small 20 step toward opening the door back for the residents of the 21 county to use the library. In the past, I think up to 22 2013 -- I've said this before -- we paid about 50 percent of 23 the operating budget for the library. In 2013, the Court 24 decided we didn't want to do that any more, so that's -- 25 that's the facts, and that's what's existing right now. 8-18-14 bwk 25 1 And then what I would propose is it's -- it's not 2 obvious, okay, what the fair balance or the fair share is. 3 When you look at 25,000 people in the city and approximately 4 25,000 people in the county, people in the city pay both 5 county taxes and city taxes, but they receive part of the 6 services the County provides, and in animal control and 7 environmental health. And I myself did some 8 back-of-the-envelope analysis, and if I do that and look at 9 the percentage of those services enjoyed by the citizens of 10 the city and what they pay, it's -- it appears to me that the 11 City's getting the short end of the stick. But that's a 12 cursory analysis, and I'm not saying I'm qualified to do 13 that. But what I've proposed to do, if we can do $65,000 14 next year, then during next year, determine what that fair 15 balance is between services we provide, services the City 16 provides, and find out what the difference would be, and see 17 if we can't get a City/County full partnership agreement on 18 shared services, because after all, all these services are 19 owned by residents of the county -- of Kerr County, period, 20 so it's not fair to have services -- duplicate services 21 provided. 22 So, that's what I would -- that's what I would hope 23 we could do in this budget, is -- and $65,000, where would it 24 come from? You know, if we -- we've just got through talking 25 about if we're going to run out -- we've got maybe 10,000, 8-18-14 bwk 26 1 something like that, in reserve if we -- to get it down to 2 25 percent, not going below 25 percent. There's about 3,000 3 in the budget already, so that's 13,000. So we're about, you 4 know, 50,000 short. If we're going to run out of the year at 5 500,000, 10 percent of that would cover the -- cover the 6 library. So -- 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: How much is already in the 8 budget? 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: 3,000. I think that's correct. 10 MS. HARGIS: No, there's not anything. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I'm sorry, it's zero. I'm 12 looking at the reserve. I'm sorry, zero. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, thank you. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, zero. 15 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. I don't know if the 16 Sheriff needs a break to go to the bathroom or he wants to 17 speak to this issue; he's been waving his hands. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'd like to speak to this issue 19 for just a minute. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: Thank you. I sort of figured that. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Being here for a number of 22 years, like a couple of Commissioners, one thing I -- I don't 23 know if Commissioner Moser realizes or understands thoroughly. 24 I'm a city citizen; I pay city taxes and I pay county taxes, 25 but I do have a very thorough understanding of the difference 8-18-14 bwk 27 1 between those two taxing entities and what those taxes can go 2 for. And one thing I think the Commissioner needs to 3 understand is anything above a Class C traffic offense that 4 occurs either inside the city or out in the county, the County 5 pays for the prosecution. Any warrant above a Class C offense 6 that the guy absconds and takes off to Hawaii or wherever, the 7 County pays for that. Any offense above a Class C traffic 8 offense that occurs in the city, once there's a warrant 9 issued, it's the County's responsibility. Not counting all 10 the lawsuits filed in this county are the County's 11 responsibility to take care of; City doesn't fund that. Not 12 counting all our deed records, all our death certificates, 13 marriage licenses, anything that occurs in this courthouse, 14 that's what my county taxes pay for, being a resident of this 15 city, running this entire courthouse, okay? 16 The City does not have a county jail. They pay for 17 one day, one night of a Class C offense, a traffic-type 18 offense, okay. They pay for one night of that person being 19 in jail until they see the judge the next morning. They 20 don't pay for anything else. Only thing -- I've learned a 21 lot of people think the City has their own jail. They don't 22 have their own jail. Every bit of that jail expense comes 23 from the County, and I don't think that there's really a 24 thorough understanding of what the difference is. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: To your knowledge, is there a 8-18-14 bwk 28 1 contract between the City and the County to support our 2 providing that service? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: There is a contract on the one 4 day until they see the judge, okay, on Class C's. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: Doesn't affect anything else? 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's the only thing. 7 Everything else with the jail is teetotally up to the county 8 tax dollars, and my portion of the county tax dollars I pay as 9 a city resident. The -- I just don't think that a lot of that 10 gets out and understood, okay? There was an agreement -- 11 JUDGE POLLARD: Keeping in mind that the Sheriff's 12 budget is -- is the lion's share of our budget. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's right. There was also 14 an agreement a long time ago; one of your former police chiefs 15 in this county started out as the city animal control, and he 16 was their dogcatcher, okay? And back under joint agreements 17 that I sat in many of those meetings, and I think some of the 18 media in this room probably sat through some of those 19 meetings, there was worked out agreements, and that's how the 20 County took over animal control and environmental health. It 21 was for an exchange for other services. Those services, on 22 the city part, have ended, but the County's still obligated -- 23 or still being asked to pay the full amount of those $700,000 24 budgets without the City paying any, when they do have the 25 authority to have their own animal control. 8-18-14 bwk 29 1 And the only last comment I'll make on the 2 library -- and this Court, most of them know my mother was a 3 librarian, so I know where it comes from. I went to high 4 school in this county; I know where it comes from. But I 5 asked this Court for four new officers for this year, 'cause 6 if it's a perfect day and nobody out or anything else, and 7 which never happens, I only have four officers -- patrol 8 officers patrolling 1,100 square miles. We do have a larger 9 population than the city does. We have all the courts, we 10 have the jail, we have all that kind of stuff. And I would 11 be teetotally against putting the library before we put the 12 safety of all citizens, 'cause the city of Kerrville is also 13 part of the county on furnishing enough officers on the 14 street to adequately provide it. Those are my comments. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Let me comment on that, and I 16 -- and I appreciate everything you said, and I think you make 17 my point. You helped make the point that we need to look at 18 what services are provided by the County, their operating 19 budget, and what are provided by the City. And -- and then 20 look at the shared -- the services enjoyed by the residents 21 outside the city and inside the city, and see what that 22 balance is. I absolutely agree with you. You're making my 23 point 100 percent. So I think -- and so -- so, therefore, you 24 know, what I'm saying is -- and I don't know if you made the 25 same speech in 2000 -- from between 1965 to 2013 or not, but 8-18-14 bwk 30 1 it was perfectly appropriate there. And I'd be happy to go 2 back and look at the record and see if you made that same 3 speech. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I sure did. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And so for some reason, up 6 until 2013, it was ignored. 7 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I agree. 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So maybe you've made it every 9 single year, and I appreciate you making it again, okay? And 10 I think it's appropriate. And all you are doing is saying, 11 "Yeah, let's look at this," these shared services, and see 12 what a fair, balanced amount is, and figure out -- because -- 13 and I agree with what Commissioner Letz said the other day. 14 We had worked out -- I wasn't here, but County Commissioners 15 worked really hard with City Council to establish interlocal 16 agreements, and I think we were pretty much in sync on that, 17 and then the City chose to disrupt that by saying they didn't 18 want the County being -- you know, paying for the operations 19 of the airport. And that -- 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Through the last two mayors, 21 that's correct. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: 'Cause that kind of screwed up 23 everything. Pardon my French. 24 JUDGE POLLARD: I'd like to interrupt just a second 25 and point something out. The Commissioners Court directed me 8-18-14 bwk 31 1 to make that A or B offer to the City in writing. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Mm-hmm. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: And I did, in fact, send a letter to 4 the City to that effect. I've not received anything from the 5 City as to their position. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's what I said. We can't -- 7 I'm -- on that point, it's -- I haven't heard -- I read what 8 was in the paper, but I haven't heard anything. 9 JUDGE POLLARD: I don't know if they're going to do 10 us the courtesy of responding to our letter or not. We'll 11 see. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But -- 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I read that in the paper, but 14 you're -- you're correct, Commissioner. I have made these 15 same deals in the past, but what solved a lot of it was at one 16 point, I think a lot of those agreements were reached over at 17 the meeting room at KPUB during the joint agreements. They 18 were agreed. 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The County would do this with 21 animal control, and animal control has grown drastically, and 22 environmental health, and the City would do this with airport 23 and -- and library. And it's now gone one-sided, because of, 24 my understanding, a lot of things, but one thing, it's kind of 25 like the fire and EMS contract that's costing this county, you 8-18-14 bwk 32 1 know, $1.2 million, okay? And -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 1.4. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 1.4 million, with their 4 increase this year. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: $1.4 million for a fire 7 contract. Now, EMS, I agree, I'd like to know what the actual 8 cost is. What I've seen in looking at their budget, we pretty 9 well pay for it; the City doesn't pay much, is about what it 10 amounts to, that shortfall. But the one thing I have seen is 11 if we're paying the fire department $600,000 or $700,000, 12 whatever portion of that 1.2 it is, to cover Kerrville South, 13 and -- 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It covers more than that. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- and a little bit north, 16 okay, with what their contract originally read, I know Chief 17 Ojeda was doing us real well on that, on sending more trucks 18 and more personnel out when it was needed than what the 19 original contract required. But we're giving our volunteers 20 who do 90 percent of it out in the county, and we're giving 21 them what per department? 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: 25. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: You know, 25,000 a department, 24 and giving the city of Kerrville that backs up a little bit 25 over $600,000, $700,000? I just -- you have -- 8-18-14 bwk 33 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, Rusty, you're making my 2 point exactly; I couldn't agree more. What you're doing -- 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But the argument you're going 4 to get from the City is, that's what the county taxes are 5 obligated to pay, which I agree. And it is on some of 6 those -- you know, the courthouse runs the prosecutions, so 7 they don't want to consider that. 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What you're doing is making the 9 speech that should be made at what I'm suggesting we do, okay? 10 So save your speech till we have that meeting, 'cause I think 11 it's totally appropriate. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'll -- 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We're not going to do anything 14 about it today. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'll save my speech, okay? 16 But -- when it's appropriate for you, as long as we don't put 17 libraries above public safety today. 18 JUDGE POLLARD: This is a workshop; we're not going 19 to take any action. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Only comment I'll make, 22 Commissioner, you know, one, I'd like to hear from the City. 23 I thought we sent the olive branch over to them saying, "Hey, 24 we'll see if we can work these two out." I think it was quite 25 generous from our standpoint. But -- but the other part of it 8-18-14 bwk 34 1 is everyone always talks about historically, we split the cost 2 of the library. That's true. Historically, we split the cost 3 of animal control. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: True. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The same -- both of those 6 agreements were changed at the same time. So, the City wants 7 us to pick up the library -- or, you know, part of it, but not 8 the other part. I don't see how that's fair. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I agree with you. I agree with 10 you 100 percent. I don't -- I don't think it's fair, but I 11 think we need to look at every one of these things, everything 12 Rusty said; animal control, EMS, everything else. We need to 13 look at all those things and see what the fair share and the 14 balance should be. Absolutely agree 100 percent. But I don't 15 think we're going to do it between now and October 1st. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, and I agree. And I think 17 -- but my concern is, the most important agreement we have 18 with the City is fire and EMS. 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't want to do anything to 21 jeopardize that. We have a 10-year deal. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Peace. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But we had a deal previously; 24 the City canceled it. Several times they've canceled their 25 contracts with us. We have a little bit more teeth in this 8-18-14 bwk 35 1 one to -- to not cancel it, but I just don't want to get in a 2 situation where we're arguing about animal control and the 3 library, and the City says, "The heck with it, we're canceling 4 fire and EMS." 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, I agree. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that's what has happened in 7 the past, so I'd rather just leave it well enough alone. And 8 if they don't want -- they'll fund the library; we'll do 9 animal control, and -- 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Let's put fire and EMS on stone 11 tablets, I agree, if we can find stone tablets. Okay. Well, 12 that's my comment. 13 JUDGE POLLARD: Anybody else have any further 14 comments or input on the budget? Bob's about to say 15 something. Do it. 16 MR. REEVES: I'm just going back to the library and 17 our agreements. When you look at -- in the private sector, 18 when you make an offer, you always may expect a counteroffer 19 on a deal, or I see one. We have not heard anything, other 20 than what has been reported and assume to be true in the 21 media. So, I'd like to hear something back, number one, from 22 the City. Number two is, there's no disputing that all 23 citizens who reside within the city of Kerrville are county 24 taxpayers -- or county residents, and yeah, they're taxpayers. 25 I just -- when I look at this with my businesses, I pay 8-18-14 bwk 36 1 property taxes in the city of Kerrville; personal, business 2 property taxes. Where my shop is, I do not own the building, 3 but I add 1/12th of the annual taxes -- all taxes to my rent 4 payment, so -- and then Janet pays personal property taxes on 5 her accounting firm. We pay city taxes, but I can't go to the 6 library as a city taxpayer and utilize the library. So, while 7 I feel like our county residents -- we should find some 8 equitable way to take care of them to go to the library, I 9 think there's a bigger picture that is going to take a lot of 10 sit-down and talking and negotiating on. If we were to do 11 anything on the library, I feel like it would be better to do 12 something of a reimbursement to the residents that use it than 13 just paying "X" amount to the City. And I don't think we can 14 come up with that plan in the next 30 days. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, that's what I'm 16 proposing, is say $65,000, first-come, first-served, for 17 people outside the city to have library privileges. And 18 then -- and then to see how many people really want that and 19 are using it. Because I think I mentioned before, before we 20 zeroed it -- or before it was zeroed. Not before we zeroed 21 it. Before it was zeroed, okay, 47 percent of the cardholders 22 lived outside the city; 53 percent lived in the city. And now 23 it's 97 -- I mean 93 percent city, 6 percent county. So, 24 there's been a dramatic reduction in the number of people 25 outside the city that are -- that are library cardholders. 8-18-14 bwk 37 1 And a big percentage -- 2 JUDGE POLLARD: That are disenfranchised. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So that -- and I agree with 4 everything you're saying about taxes. I agree with everything 5 Jonathan is saying and everything the -- the Sheriff is 6 saying, and I think it's -- I think there's a lot -- it's 7 complex, okay? Especially when you put in percentage served 8 and percentage paid. 'Cause I tried to do it myself, and it's 9 a pretty complicated algorithm to do that, but it's worth 10 doing. But in the meantime, I'm just saying if we can put it 11 in the budget, we can afford it, let's -- let's move in that 12 direction. I'm not saying what the end will be. Move in the 13 direction to let some of the people in the county use the 14 library like they have in the past. 15 JUDGE POLLARD: If we put it in the budget, wouldn't 16 that drop our 25 percent requirement? 17 MS. HARGIS: Yes, sir. 18 JUDGE POLLARD: Below that? 19 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: But I'm not saying take it all 21 out -- number one, don't drop -- don't let it go below 22 25 percent, okay. 23 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: There's about $10,000 or so in 25 there that you can get it down to 25 percent. If you get it 8-18-14 bwk 38 1 from 25.12 down to 25 percent, I think it's something like 2 10,000. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: So then you're saying offer them 4 10,000 instead of 65? 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No, I'm saying 10,000 there. 6 Then if we -- I'm going to go back to betting on the come that 7 Commissioner Letz talked about. If we -- we go in -- every 8 year we have money left over, and let the other -- let the 9 other 50,000 come out of betting on the come. 10 JUDGE POLLARD: Now, the problem with that is that 11 it might not happen that way. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It might not happen that way. 13 JUDGE POLLARD: Then we'd be short. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, therefore -- but with that 15 argument, Judge -- with that argument, we shouldn't have any 16 budget that's not balanced. We can't bet on the come. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't disagree with your -- 18 the money is -- yes, it's an issue. To me, it's more of a -- 19 to me, it's a principle issue working with the City. We had a 20 deal. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I agree. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And until the City is willing to 23 -- we sent them a letter. They haven't responded. We opened 24 negotiations to try to solve this. We haven't heard anything 25 back. 8-18-14 bwk 39 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Hasn't been any negotiations. We 2 made an offer. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We made an offer. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: And there haven't been any 5 negotiations. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And until -- you know, so I look 7 at that as the City isn't concerned about this. You know, I 8 just think it's too late in the process to do anything this 9 year. We need to look at it, I think, for next year. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, and that's what I'm 11 proposing; not this year, next year. 65,000 next year. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: For 2015-16 budget? 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. Right, yeah. For -- 14 for the budget we're working on right now, this budget we're 15 having a workshop on today. 16 JUDGE POLLARD: Well, that's '14-'15. 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, '14-'15. And then for 18 2015-16, do all of the negotiations with the City on fair 19 share for everything except fire and EMS, okay? 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But they've already told us they 21 don't want to talk to us about that stuff. Their answer was, 22 from what the paper said -- and at least we're relying on the 23 paper, 'cause they haven't responded. Their answer was they 24 pay those taxes already, period. That's all they said. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's -- 8-18-14 bwk 40 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So they don't want to talk to 2 us, evidently. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, that will -- if they 4 don't want to talk next year, then we will -- for '15-'16, 5 we'll figure out what to do. But for '14-'15, I'm suggesting 6 that 65,000 -- per the city's offer right now, anybody can use 7 the library if they pay, so I'm offering -- saying -- 8 COMMISSIONER REEVES: And they made that offer? 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Of course. It's on the table, 10 yeah. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I haven't seen anything from the 12 City, period. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No, that's the 65 -- you can go 14 over there right now, okay, and pay $65 for full privileges, 15 or you can pay $35 -- 'cause I've done it, okay? -- pay $35 16 for privileges not including the computers, which I don't 17 need, but other people do. Computers are full all the time. 18 But anybody can do that. 19 MR. REEVES: But what I'm asking is, have they made 20 the offer that if we give $65,000, that 1,000 residents of 21 Kerr County that live outside the city limits of Kerrville -- 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's their current policy. 23 COMMISSIONER REEVES: No, but if we give them 24 65,000, have they put it in writing that the first 1,000 -- 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No. No. 8-18-14 bwk 41 1 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Okay. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No, but we can go over there -- 3 we, the County, can go over and pay for it, okay? Say here's 4 Joe Blow, okay? We want to buy him a library card. They'd 5 say fine. That's it; we pay them the money. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think I want the County 7 Attorney -- 8 JUDGE POLLARD: 400-something-odd are using it right 9 now. $35 times that is about -- 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: It's about 17,000, isn't it? 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Something like that. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think this is illegal to do 14 that. We're -- we're going to pay county tax dollars to help 15 1,000 individual people? Huh-uh, I don't think that's -- 16 that's -- the County Attorney's not present, but I'm quite 17 certain that's going to be illegal. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, we'll find out. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can ask for an opinion from 20 her. But -- you know, because you go up there, and say you're 21 the 1,000th person, or -- and I go up there, the next one 22 after it. I don't get anything? 23 JUDGE POLLARD: Can't -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Can't discriminate. That's 25 illegal. 8-18-14 bwk 42 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You may have a point. I don't 2 know. I don't know; we'll find out. Anyway, that's my 3 comments on the budget. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. All right. Are there any 5 further comments? 6 MS. BOLIN: I just have a question. The Auditor got 7 a 4 percent raise per the District Court -- District Judges, 8 and I understand that. How much did her staff get? 9 MS. HARGIS: My staff got 2.5; they got one step. 10 MS. BOLIN: Okay. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Is that the 2.5 that all 12 employees got as a COLA, or is this above that? 13 MS. HARGIS: That's above that. 14 MS. LANTZ: I don't -- 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: So your staff got a 5 percent 16 raise. 17 MS. BOLIN: And you get six and a half. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The H.R. Director says we 19 haven't -- she doesn't have a letter to that effect. 20 MS. LANTZ: Not yet. 21 MS. HARGIS: We don't have the order yet. I 22 requested that. I stood in front of the Court and requested 23 that. I did, and it was approved. I didn't hide it. I came 24 to the Court. I didn't go to the Judges first; I came to you 25 first. Buster asked me why I was coming, and I did bring it 8-18-14 bwk 43 1 to the Court. You still are saving over $22,000 on my budget 2 this year over last year. 3 MR. REEVES: So what is your proposed salary? 4 MS. HARGIS: $16,000 savings. 5 MR. REEVES: No, ma'am, your proposed salary for the 6 coming fiscal year. 7 MS. HARGIS: Proposed salary? 96,000. 8 MR. REEVES: What I have -- 9 MS. HARGIS: That's without the two and a half 10 percent. 11 MR. REEVES: On July 29th, 2014, you had 91,663. 12 MS. HARGIS: I had a longevity on the 1st of July. 13 MR. REEVES: Okay. 14 MS. HARGIS: That brought me to 92,079, I believe. 15 MR. REEVES: So what is your proposed salary for 16 this fiscal year? 17 MS. HARGIS: It's 96-something. I didn't bring it. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You're saying this fiscal year 19 or the next? 20 COMMISSIONER REEVES: The coming -- the one we're 21 working on. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: '14-'15. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: All right. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And Commissioner Baldwin and I 25 have been through this in the past. Once they decide on the 8-18-14 bwk 44 1 order, it's too late. The Judges have in the past, and did 2 this year to my recollection, ask for comments from us. And, 3 you know, -- 4 MS. HARGIS: That's why I requested -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- they take that into their 6 consideration and decide what they're going to do. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. Yes, sir? 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And I like Jeannie and I like 9 her department, but the only comment I would say is it's kind 10 of like me requesting a special increase in one of my 11 employees. If I don't have that increase in before budget 12 adoption, then y'all won't give it. 13 MS. HARGIS: I did ask for that. 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: If those Judges don't have -- 15 they're the ones that set her salary; she doesn't set her own. 16 If those Judges don't have that increase request in before the 17 adoption of this budget, I don't think you're required to fund 18 it. And I don't think her employees should be treated any 19 different, 'cause all we've heard is about how tight this 20 budget is. But I don't think her employees should be treated 21 one bit different than all the other 300-something employees 22 you have in this county. I agree they work hard, okay? But 23 I'll put a jailer and some of these clerks around here up 24 against them any day, and in their own respective field, 25 they're all working extremely hard. 8-18-14 bwk 45 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Rusty, the only comment -- I 2 don't -- I agree with what you're saying, but this is just a 3 workshop. We're not adopting this today. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, anything else? Thank 6 you, Jeannie. Anybody else have anything? 7 MS. HARGIS: If we -- we can go back to that. I 8 mean, I brought this up at the beginning of the budget 9 hearings, so when I take my order up there, I need to know -- 10 I don't want to go up there and have -- that was my whole 11 point of bringing it to the Court. I didn't want to go up to 12 the Judges with something that wasn't approved by the 13 Commissioners. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I personally don't think -- I 15 think that -- 16 JUDGE POLLARD: I think the two and a half percent 17 might have been misunderstood. That needs to be the same 18 standard. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. I think that they should 20 not get an additional two and a half percent. I think all the 21 employees should be treated the same in that area. Your 22 salary, you know, I'll -- you know, I personally don't think 23 you should get an increase above. Last year I believe you -- 24 MS. HARGIS: I asked for it last year; I did not get 25 one. 8-18-14 bwk 46 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You didn't get one last year? 2 That -- I kind of leave that to the District Judges more, 3 because they set it. I mean, my preference would be no, other 4 than the two and a half percent, but that's just my feeling, 5 because I think all employees should be treated the same. 6 JUDGE POLLARD: That would be my personal -- I agree 7 with what you say; I agree with that. 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What did he say? What did 9 you say? (Laughter.) 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Everyone should be treated the 11 same. Two and a half percent. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: I think she's entitled to her pay, 13 but as far as the employees -- it's because she didn't get one 14 last year. But it's -- I think all the employees ought to be 15 treated the same, and I think a 5 percent raise for her 16 employees is -- it ought to be two and a half. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do the District Judges -- are 18 they -- are your employees their employees, or are your 19 employees our employees? 20 MS. HARGIS: They're -- they're the Court's 21 employees, and mine. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So -- so, we control that, 23 the two and a half percent. 24 JUDGE POLLARD: Well, it may be a procedural 25 problem. We just have to check that, but we could make -- 8-18-14 bwk 47 1 MS. HARGIS: I want to do what the Court wants me to 2 do. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: Jeannie and I will go to the Judges 4 and we'll get this straight, okay? 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, that's fine. Do that. 6 Actually, I think that we need to oppose the District Judges 7 on her salary increase. You're getting up around $90,000; 8 that's a hell of a lot of money for a county employee in Kerr 9 County in 2014. That's a lot of money, and I, for one, will 10 tell them I disagree. But I personally -- I think we need to 11 do it as a Court. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I spend a lot of time up 14 there. 15 JUDGE POLLARD: I think we all ought to talk to 16 them. That's fine. That's fine. 17 MS. HARGIS: The hearing is on the 21st, so I need 18 to know, so I don't want them confused. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What hearing is on the 21st? 20 MS. HARGIS: Our public hearing. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Ours? 22 MS. HARGIS: The public hearing for my salary is on 23 the 21st. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Up there? 25 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 8-18-14 bwk 48 1 MS. BOLIN: What time? 2 MS. HARGIS: 8 o'clock. 3 MS. BOLIN: 8 o'clock. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: 21st at 8 o'clock? 5 MS. HARGIS: Yes. 6 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. Thank you, Jeannie. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But the -- I'm hearing that your 8 employees are our -- are fixed by the -- by us, and not by the 9 Judges. And they're -- 10 MS. HARGIS: No, they're fixed by the Judges as 11 well. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh. I thought you just told 13 Buster otherwise. 14 MS. HARGIS: No, I told him they were fixed by the 15 Judges. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: She's treated me that way for 17 years and years. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Poor baby. 19 MS. HARGIS: I will point out, there were a lot of 20 people who got very large raises last year, and I got nothing. 21 And I requested that. And I think I carried my load this 22 year, and I told you that in the hearing, and that's why I 23 requested it. That's why I brought it to y'all, and you did 24 approve it. And there were three people that said it was 25 okay. Now you're back. This is exactly what happened to me 8-18-14 bwk 49 1 last year. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not -- your salary I'm not 3 as concerned about as I am your employees'. I recall you 4 coming about your salary, and I don't have a -- that's -- 5 JUDGE POLLARD: I do too. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The employees, I don't recall 7 that that was included in that. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: Thank you. Anybody else have 9 anything? All right. I'll entertain a motion to adjourn the 10 public hearing. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So moved. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 13 JUDGE POLLARD: Motion and second. Those in favor, 14 signify by raising your right hand. 15 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 4-0.) 16 JUDGE POLLARD: It's unanimous. All right, thank 17 you. 18 (Budget workshop adjourned at 11:58 a.m.) 19 - - - - - - - - - - 20 21 22 23 24 25 8-18-14 bwk 50 1 STATE OF TEXAS | 2 COUNTY OF KERR | 3 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 4 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 5 official reporter for the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 6 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 7 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 19th day of August, 8 2014. 9 10 JANNETT PIEPER, Kerr County Clerk 11 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 12 Certified Shorthand Reporter 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 8-18-14 bwk