1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COURT 9 Regular Session 10 Monday, July 13, 2015 11 9:00 a.m. 12 Commissioners' Courtroom 13 Kerr County Courthouse 14 Kerrville, Texas 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: TOM POLLARD, Kerr County Judge H. A. "BUSTER" BALDWIN, Commissioner Pct. 1 24 TOM MOSER, Commissioner Pct. 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 25 BOB REEVES, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I N D E X July 13, 2015 2 PAGE --- Visitors' Input 5 3 --- Commissioners' Comments 7 4 1.1 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to have Jerry Shiever, Kerr County’s tax attorney, 5 report on the trust property process 13 6 1.2 Public Hearing regarding naming the front half of Old Pasture Road East to proposed name Edison 7 Bauer Road East, Precinct 2 29 8 1.3 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action for final approval to name front half of Old Pasture 9 Road East to proposed name Edison Bauer Road East, Precinct 2 29 10 1.4 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 11 accept preliminary plat for “The Estates at Panther Creek” Development, Precinct 4 31 12 1.5 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 13 accept concept plan regarding the proposed “Platinum Park” Subdivision, Precinct 2 31 14 1.6 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 15 revision of the Kerr County Juvenile Detention Facility Policy and Procedure Manual -- 16 1.7 Joint Airport Board is requesting to proceed 17 with refurbishing of the Mooney parking lot, asphalt repair, and taxiway extension, with 18 participation from Kerr County 35 19 1.8 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to approve Kerr County group health renewal plan 20 for upcoming 2015-2016 plan year; have County Judge sign the same 46 21 1.9 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 22 authorize sale of surplus co-ax cable coming off radio towers 60 23 1.10 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to 24 ratify and confirm the pre-agreement letter and environmental documents for 2015-16 Community 25 Development Fund application 61 3 1 I N D E X (Continued) July 13, 2015 2 PAGE 3 1.11 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to request approval to add a bench and flower vases 4 to Kerr County War Memorial 63 5 1.12 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action to select management firm and begin contract 6 negotiations for management services at Hill Country Youth Event Center. (Executive Session 7 as needed) 68 8 1.13 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action regarding possible sale of real property 9 (Executive Session) -- 10 1.14 Consultation with attorney regarding potential litigation (Executive Session) -- 11 1.15 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 12 personnel in County Attorney’s office (Executive Session) -- 13 1.16 Consider/discuss, take appropriate action on 14 independent auditor’s report from agreed-upon procedures performed in County Clerk’s office 15 (Executive Session as needed) -- 16 4.1 Pay Bills 71 4.2 Budget Amendments 71 17 4.3 Late Bills 72 4.4 Approve and Accept Monthly Reports 72 18 5.1 Reports from Commissioners/Liaison Committee 19 Assignments 74 5.2 Reports from Elected Officials/Department Heads 78 20 Recessed until 1:30 p.m. 21 22 23 24 25 4 1 I N D E X (Continued) July 13, 2015 2 PAGE Reconvened at 1:30 p.m. 3 1.17 Public Hearing regarding Park Rules and 4 Regulations 83 5 3.1 Action as may be required on matters discussed in Executive Session 98 6 1.18 Order Authorizing the issuance, sale, and 7 delivery of up to $15,000,000 in aggregate principal amount of Kerr County, Texas Limited 8 Tax Bonds, Series 2015; securing the payment thereof by authorizing levy of an annual ad 9 valorem tax; approving and authorizing execution of a Paying Agent/Registrar Agreement, a Purchase 10 Contract, an Official Statement, and all other instruments and procedures related thereto 99 11 --- Adjourned 112 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 5 1 On Monday, July 13, 2015, at 9:00 a.m., a regular 2 meeting of the Kerr County Commissioners Court was held in 3 the Commissioners' Courtroom, Kerr County Courthouse, 4 Kerrville, Texas, and the following proceedings were had in 5 open court: 6 P R O C E E D I N G S 7 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, it's Monday, July 13, 8 2015. It's 9 a.m. The Kerr County Commissioners Court is in 9 session. Commissioner Reeves will lead us with the prayer 10 and the pledge this morning. 11 COMMISSIONER REEVES: If we could all stand, 12 please. 13 (Prayer and pledge of allegiance.) 14 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. This is the portion of 15 the agenda for visitors to speak on matters that are not on 16 the agenda -- regular agenda. And I've got one participation 17 form filled out by Joel Gonzales. Would you come forward, 18 sir? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Listen to his voice. 20 MR. GONZALES: Yes, sir. Joel Gonzales. I'm here 21 to thank Commissioner Moser, the rest of the Commissioners, 22 and starting with ex-Commissioner Overby. I used to be the 23 chairman of Friends of Center Point, which we started pushing 24 to improve the Lions Park. I want to thank you guys 25 100 percent, because we left off where -- you know, we just 7-13-15 6 1 broke off. Many things happened to me, but I wanted to get 2 back here to let y'all know the response that I've gotten 3 back has been nothing but positive to the optimum. Been 4 going and visiting, and they believe that I'm still in charge 5 of doing what I'm doing, and I'm not, and I clearly tell them 6 I'm not. "Well, you're the guy that did this and you're the 7 guy that did that, and you're the guy..." Well, yes, but -- 8 so I tell them that I've got to come up here and tell you 9 guys thank you. Commissioner Moser, thank you for 10 continually doing what you're doing for Precinct 2, 11 especially the park. It is a jewel. It is something that I 12 saw years ago that I knew it could happen, and the bathrooms 13 now -- I'm going to talk to Tim, but we do need bigger 14 bathrooms, more bathrooms. Those bathrooms are made for 10 15 people per week. We get 100 people per day now. 16 I've got pictures -- I don't know how to send them 17 to you guys, but there's lots of people now, and people from 18 out of state, as always, people from San Antonio coming down 19 here. I've taken lots of videos of people just enjoying the 20 jewel that we have in Center Point. And the people are 21 keeping it clean, to the best of my ability. It has just -- 22 all the trash cans have made a big difference. But I want to 23 thank y'all sincerely from the bottom of my heart, because 24 it's a dream that I had from childhood, and it has become a 25 reality, and I just want to thank y'all. I don't know what 7-13-15 7 1 else to say. Thank you very much. And the people from 2 Center Point, our visitors, families have come to that park 3 already that I've met for 10 years straight, and they're 4 continually coming back, and they love it now. Just need a 5 playground and some permanent bathrooms, and we'll get them. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We're not supposed to comment, 7 but he was a catalyst for getting this thing back on the 8 radar screen. Thanks. 9 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. Thank you, Mr. 10 Gonzales. 11 MR. GONZALES: Thank y'all. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. There being -- is there 13 anyone else? There being no one, we'll go to Commissioners' 14 comments. We'll start with Precinct 1. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir, I do have a 16 comment to make, and -- and a short presentation as well. 17 Recently, there was a meeting up in Lubbock; the Tax 18 Assessor/Collectors of Texas met, and they had a special 19 presentation to make, and that person that was going to 20 receive the presentation was a no-show. And they heard that 21 he was going to be in our courtroom today, and asked me to 22 make a presentation. So, come here. (Laughter.) He acts 23 like a lawyer. Get over here. 24 Texas Tax Assessors/Collectors Association of 25 Texas, Resolution of Appreciation presented to Jerry Shiever. 7-13-15 8 1 Whereas, Jerry Shiever was admitted to the State Bar in '68, 2 and has spent his career in ad valorem tax law while working 3 solo and with the law firm of Perdue, Brandon, Fielder, 4 Collins and Mott, L.L.P., since 2003. He has been the Kerr 5 County delinquent tax attorney for almost 40 years; and 6 whereas, Jerry graduated from the University of Texas with a 7 Bachelor of Business Administration degree in '67, and in '68 8 with a Bachelor of Law degree, after which he had a private 9 practice limited to ad valorem taxation, and worked as 10 partners with Perdue, Brandon, Fielder, Collins and Mott. 11 Whereas, Mr. Shiever's a member of the Texas Bar Association, 12 University of Texas Exes, the Longhorn Foundation, Texas 13 Association of Appraisal Districts, Tax Assessor/Collectors 14 Association of Texas, and Texas Association of Assessing 15 Officers, where he has served as chairman or member of the 16 Attorneys Committee and as an instructor in the legal section 17 of the T.A.A.O. schools. He also served as advisor to the 18 Texas Legislative Property Tax Committee. That's a lot of 19 stuff here. (Laughter.) Whereas, Jerry Shiever is known as 20 a man who loves his boat and fishing, golfing, running, and 21 Hawaii, a man of integrity available to his clients any time, 22 and a man -- and a mind like a steel trap. And, now, 23 therefore, be it resolved that Jerry Shiever is recognized as 24 a valued friend and an honorary member of the Tax 25 Assessor/Collectors Association of Texas, an award only 7-13-15 9 1 presented to those individuals who have performed a notable 2 service for the association. And this is approved by the 3 membership of T.A.C.A. on this day 17th day of June, 2015, at 4 the annual business meeting in Lubbock, Texas. John Ames, 5 President. 6 (Applause.) 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You have to be a geezer to 8 do all that stuff, huh? 9 MR. SHIEVER: I guess. 10 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. Well, 11 congratulations. 12 MR. SHIEVER: I'm actually older than people think 13 I am. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I know. 15 MR. SHIEVER: But also, I smell a conspiracy here. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 17 MR. SHIEVER: I smell a conspiracy. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, you might. 19 MS. BOLIN: Also, when he was in Hawaii and absent 20 from the meeting, he caught 177 and a half pounds of tuna. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I saw the picture. 22 MR. SHIEVER: Oh, you did? And I'll never do that 23 again. (Laughter.) I don't even want to do that again; that 24 was so tiresome. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Big as you are. 7-13-15 10 1 MR. SHIEVER: Thank you, -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 3 MR. SHIEVER: -- Buster and Diane. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: Do you have anything else, Mr. 5 Baldwin? 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: No, sir, that's all I have. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: Mr. Moser? 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Let's see, a couple things. 9 The Center Point Volunteer Fire Department had a huge 10 barbecue on Saturday. I don't know how many people were 11 there. Maybe Joel knows, but there were -- when I left, 12 there were probably 1,000 people there, so I think that's 13 going to be a big success. Then the Judge and I both were 14 down at the dedication of Mosty Nursery, and the history of 15 the Mosty family goes way back into the early 19th century -- 16 late 19th century, coming here and settling, and so there's a 17 historical plaque, which is quite an accomplishment there. 18 And one other thing -- what did I have here? Oh, I -- like 19 everybody else, I've had a ton of calls about the recycling, 20 and the fact that people don't like where it is. And I wish 21 the press would make it very, very clear that the movement of 22 that recycling from the location in town out to 534, that was 23 a unilateral decision by the City. The County knew nothing 24 about it. I tell constituents we didn't know about it. I 25 hate that it's happening, and we had an agreement; we were 7-13-15 11 1 surprised. And where we go in the future, I don't -- I don't 2 know if we, the County, can do anything. But anyway, sorry 3 that that's happening that way. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's it. 6 JUDGE POLLARD: Anything else? 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's it. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: We are a member of a Public 9 Defenders' Association. We kind of pay a fee for all 10 counties that sign up for this particular thing for capital 11 -- the defense of -- extra costs in capital murder cases, or 12 capital cases of one sort or another. We received notice 13 recently that this most recent Legislature made some funds 14 available to -- to that association, and the result is that 15 our normal fee for belonging to that association was a little 16 over $2,500. It's now reduced to a little over $1,200, so 17 that's good news for us, for our costs. That association has 18 asked for a place kind of centrally located in the Texas Hill 19 Country to put on a seminar, and that's going to occur 20 tomorrow in one of the district courtrooms between the hours 21 of 3:00 and 5:00 p.m. And they're going to -- the purpose of 22 it is to invite counties in the central Texas area over here 23 that are not members of it, to talk about the services that 24 they offer and what the cost would be and all of that. And I 25 would invite anybody that's interested in that to go to the 7-13-15 12 1 -- one of the district courtrooms -- Courtroom Number 2, I 2 believe it is -- tomorrow between the hours of 3:00 and 3 5:00 p.m. Okay, that's mine. Do you have any? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't have any, sir. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: Mr. Reeves? 6 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Just a couple things. To 7 echo Commissioner Moser, I'm still getting e-mails on the 8 recycling, but most of the people in my precinct are glad to 9 know there's something a little more convenient between 10 Kerrville and Ingram there; it's Scrap Solutions. And then I 11 just want to comment that Saturday we took a drive up South 12 Fork and around, and it's been a long time since I've seen 13 the country look the way it does in the middle of July, as 14 far as the grass. And we've been blessed with so much rain, 15 the river is getting used a lot. I saw a lot of people out 16 there, so -- you know, both locals and visitors from out of 17 the area. But it's just been a long time since we've seen 18 the country look this good, and it makes you feel good. 19 That's it. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, he mentioned something; 21 I do want to make a comment. I had a couple of calls this 22 past week. While we do have a lot of grass, green grass does 23 burn. We've had a lot of winds, and there were -- when I was 24 driving, I guess, from Comfort to Lane Valley, which is 25 3 miles, there was four fires that had started along the 7-13-15 13 1 road. I presume probably a trailer or something blew; sparks 2 went flying. But we do have a lot of grass, and we've had a 3 lot of wind, and it's getting very dry quickly, so people 4 really need to be mindful of fires. Now, I don't -- I'm not 5 -- I don't like burn bans, not ready to put mine on, but if 6 these winds keep up and we don't get any rain in the next 7 couple weeks, I would suspect that's going to be needed. I 8 see the Sheriff nodding. I don't know how many fires there 9 have been, but they're becoming more prevalent. 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Getting worse. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: I've got better than half-inch 12 cracks in my yard right now, and I can tell that the grass is 13 growing really well, because I'm mowing it a lot, trying to 14 keep up with it. All right, anything else? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, sir. 16 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. If not, we'll go on -- 17 we'll go to Item 1.1 on the agenda; consider, discuss, and 18 take appropriate action to have Jerry Shiever, Kerr County's 19 tax attorney, report on the trust property process, 20 parentheses, how we get the property, quote, in trust, end 21 quote, to Kerr County through delinquent property taxes, and 22 our responsibility once it's in the County's name. Diane 23 Bolin and Mr. Shiever. 24 MR. SHIEVER: I guess this is part of the 25 conspiracy. 7-13-15 14 1 JUDGE POLLARD: This was the bait. 2 MR. SHIEVER: Right. Well, Diane and I have talked 3 for some time about maybe bringing y'all -- giving y'all an 4 update like this. Property is so valuable in Kerr County 5 that we don't have Sheriff's sales all that often, and 6 therefore, trust property all that often, but it does happen. 7 And I just want y'all to be able to understand, like the 8 title of this outline says, the acquisition, possession, and 9 disposition; how we get it, what we do with it while we've 10 got it, and then what we do to get rid of it. 11 The acquisition is very simple. When no bids are 12 received at the Sheriff's sale, then property is struck off 13 in trust to whoever the plaintiff is -- of course, in our 14 case, it will be the County -- for all the other taxing 15 jurisdictions that have taxes due. That's how we acquire it. 16 And until it is resold or redeemed, for that matter, nothing 17 gets paid. No money changes hands. The Court doesn't get 18 paid, I don't get paid, ad litem doesn't get paid, Sheriff 19 doesn't get paid, and only when money starts coming in does 20 anybody get paid. And, of course, it is subject to the right 21 of redemption for either six months or two years. We'll get 22 into that. The two-year period is for unsold trust property 23 that was a homestead or ag use. That's when they have two 24 years to redeem it. And when they redeem it, they have to 25 pay a redemption penalty of either 25 percent during the 7-13-15 15 1 first year, or 50 percent on top of what's due. 2 JUDGE POLLARD: People might not know what you mean 3 by "redemption." 4 MR. SHIEVER: "Redemption" refers to the right of 5 the former owner to reacquire the property. 6 JUDGE POLLARD: Within a certain period of time. 7 MR. SHIEVER: Yeah, within a certain period of 8 time. And sometimes, property ownership may be -- may be 9 split, and you may have a redemption by one person on behalf 10 of more than one person, and then they have to go iron that 11 out between themselves. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: Mm-hmm. 13 MR. SHIEVER: And sometimes not all that is due on 14 property is recovered, either at the Sheriff's sale or at a 15 subsequent resale. And any time not everything that is due 16 is collected, the former owner remains personally liable. 17 So, we could go on the basis of our judgment, get execution 18 on other property that they may own, either here or somewhere 19 else if we know that they've moved. And I think I put in 20 there about the homestead need not be claimed for tax 21 exemption purposes. One never has to claim a homestead 22 exemption. To protect the property from execution, it has to 23 be a claimed homestead, but it doesn't matter whether or not 24 you claim it as a homestead for tax purposes. That's the 25 distinction I want to make there. Now, if property is not a 7-13-15 16 1 homestead or not ag use, then that period of redemption is -- 2 is six months, so it makes a big difference there. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But if there is an ag 4 exemption, is there a period of time? I mean -- 5 MR. SHIEVER: Yeah, it's six -- 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You can redeem -- 7 MR. SHIEVER: Yes, two years. It's treated like a 8 homestead. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay. 10 MR. SHIEVER: If it's not either one of those two 11 categories, then it's just six months. Following a Sheriff's 12 sale where no bids were received -- and, incidentally, the 13 Sheriff's opening bid -- sale opening bid is the lesser of 14 the value put on the property or what's due against it. So, 15 if -- and this is where the deficiencies occur sometimes. If 16 a property's not worth what's due against it, and say it's 17 half of that, if that's the opening bid, and if that bid is 18 successful, then that creates this deficiency right there. 19 And it could also be created the same way on a resale. If 20 you resell it for less than what's due against it, then that 21 deficiency goes on. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: It stays with the property? 23 MR. SHIEVER: Well, the personal liability stays 24 with the owner. No, it doesn't stay with the property. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. 7-13-15 17 1 MR. SHIEVER: Once the property is sold, either at 2 the Sheriff's sale or at a resale, then there's no further 3 liens against it. You have to go get personal liability. 4 When we get -- 5 JUDGE POLLARD: Against the former owner? 6 MR. SHIEVER: Yeah. When we get a tax judgment, we 7 get two things. We get personal liability against that 8 person, and then we -- I get a lien foreclosure, and it's the 9 lien foreclosure that we have the Sheriff's sale for. So, 10 that personal liability remains until the money's -- all the 11 money's collected, if ever. The taxing jurisdictions are 12 entitled to a writ of possession 20 days after the Sheriff's 13 deed's filed. That is, it comes to trust. Then there will 14 be a Sheriff's deed that I prepare, the Sheriff signs, and 20 15 days after that, then we're entitled to possession. Now, we 16 don't always want that, but we're entitled to it. As I 17 pointed out here, if -- if it's got an improvement on it, for 18 instance, and would be suitable for rental, do we want that, 19 and the headaches of being a landlord? Especially if it's 20 still occupied. Do we want to kick somebody out while 21 there's still a redemption period and a possibility of 22 redemption, or not? Those are the kinds of things that we 23 have to ask ourselves sometimes. Usually I would say that we 24 don't want to take possession and kick somebody out as long 25 as there's a right of redemption, but, you know, if we resell 7-13-15 18 1 it, whoever buys it can do that. They're entitled to 2 immediate possession, even if there's still a redemption 3 period left. So, somebody can get kicked out, then come back 4 and redeem and move back in. That doesn't happen very often, 5 but they can. 6 Now, I said that we get a Sheriff's deed, evidence 7 of our ownership. When we turn around and sell it, we can't 8 give a warranty deed. We give a quitclaim deed, which is 9 what a Sheriff's deed is; it's a quitclaim deed. Whether or 10 not we -- people can get title insurance depends on the title 11 company and the area. They all have different standards. 12 That affects what someone is willing to pay for trust 13 property. What are they going to do with it? You know, 14 they're not going to get a warranty deed, and they're going 15 to have to wait quite a while to get title insurance, and 16 there may be other problems with it. A lot of times the 17 reason it's delinquent in the first place is because it's 18 just lost value for some reason or another, and then 19 sometimes people just -- just lose the ability to pay or 20 something like that. Now, whenever property is resold and we 21 have some proceeds, certain costs come off the top. Any cost 22 that we incurred during our period of ownership -- I know we 23 had one here not too long ago where some county employees 24 went out and cleaned up -- I think mowed it and cleaned up 25 some trash and stuff. 7-13-15 19 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Moved a pile of -- several piles of 2 dirt, that kind of stuff. 3 MR. SHIEVER: Right, so that comes off the top. 4 Any expenses during that time are first paid out of those 5 proceeds. Then come the court costs, which includes the 6 Sheriff's fees and service fees and abstract fees and all 7 things like that. Then the taxes are prorated -- whatever's 8 left are prorated among the jurisdictions in proportion to 9 their interest in the judgment. So, if a county's taxes were 10 about 25 percent of the judgment, then they have 25 percent 11 of the proceeds. One of the things that can be done with 12 trust property, we can ask the Sheriff to hold a second 13 Sheriff's sale. We can do this after we've had the property 14 in trust for six months, and any jurisdiction can do this. 15 And sometimes one of the reasons you might want to do this is 16 because it's another auction, more people show up, and this 17 one is an absolute auction. The -- the Sheriff, with the 18 advice and consent, I guess, of me and the Tax Office, can -- 19 can set whatever the opening bid is that they want in trying 20 to push the property. I know in Brazoria County, for a long 21 time -- and they may still do that; I don't work in Brazoria 22 County any more -- would offer the property at 50 percent of 23 the lower of the value or whatever was due, and try to move 24 it that way. 25 What you do -- there's two schools of thought about 7-13-15 20 1 trust property. One is, hold out for getting all your taxes, 2 even if you have to hold it for years. And the other school 3 of thought is, well, take a little less and get it back on 4 the tax roll so it's paying. So, there's different schools 5 of thought there. When property is sold at a Sheriff's sale 6 and the proceeds are more than what's due against it, then 7 that creates what we call excess for the former owners to 8 come in and redeem, and they have two years in which to do 9 that. That doesn't affect us, other than if there is some 10 excess moneys there, and one particular year of taxes was not 11 part of the judgment because it wasn't delinquent yet, we 12 could go in against that excess and collect that one more 13 year out of that excess. Now, if the property comes to us in 14 trust, and later on we resell it for more than what's due 15 against it, that doesn't create excess. We get to keep 16 whatever we recovered over what's due, and split it amongst 17 the taxing jurisdictions. So, excess can only be created at 18 the Sheriff's sale, but not a subsequent resale. 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Jerry, is "excess" -- is 20 that above the value of it? 21 MR. SHIEVER: No, it's above what's due against it. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What's due against it? 23 MR. SHIEVER: Yeah. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Does it ever go -- the 25 value, does it ever reach that point to where -- 7-13-15 21 1 MR. SHIEVER: Where there is excess? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 3 MR. SHIEVER: Oh, yeah. Yeah. And -- 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm glad you're doing this 5 stuff. 6 MR. SHIEVER: Remember a couple years ago when we 7 had that 100 acres -- 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes. 9 MR. SHIEVER: -- out there on Elm Pass Road? Well, 10 there the property was going to sell for way more than what 11 was due against it. There's no question about it. I think 12 there was about $80,000 due against that, and it sold for, I 13 think, $700,000, but it wasn't at a Sheriff's sale. There 14 are people out there that are investors in tax properties, 15 and some investors got involved in this and came in and 16 bought everybody out, and then paid the taxes so that they 17 could sell it. They wanted to be in charge of a sale rather 18 than us and the Sheriff, so we got out of that. But they 19 came in and gave us a check for $80,000 that day. But that 20 clearly would have had excess there. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 22 MR. SHIEVER: Let's see. There is a provision 23 little used -- we don't use it -- that allows an owner to 24 avoid a tax suit, and therefore trust property situation, by 25 conveying property directly to the taxing jurisdictions. 7-13-15 22 1 They say, "I don't want it any more; here it is," and give 2 you a deed to it. The problem is, that doesn't affect any 3 other liens other than tax liens. They -- that doesn't cut 4 that off, and so you got to be real careful, if you were 5 going to do this, that you're not getting negative equity for 6 doing that. So, because it doesn't affect any kind of 7 encumbrances, we don't usually mess with that. Plus, if a 8 county, for instance, was to take a deed from somebody, if we 9 haven't resold it -- just like if it's a trust property, but 10 if we haven't resold it within six months, the other 11 jurisdictions are entitled for their taxes to be paid by the 12 county. So, here the county has no money coming in, but they 13 have to go pay everybody else those taxes, and then try to 14 still keep on trying to sell, so it just -- it's just not a 15 real good workable situation that we've ever found. 16 I made the comment here about taxing units may want 17 to eliminate risk of holding property by delaying a Sheriff's 18 sale until a definite purchaser appears. I've had the 19 occasion to do that before when there might be environmental 20 problems to holding property. So, you never know necessarily 21 if you're going to get a bid, and therefore get the property 22 in trust. But you can -- I've had agreements with someone 23 that they would come in and bid a certain amount at a 24 Sheriff's sale if I put it up for a sale. That way -- and if 25 the jurisdictions approve beforehand a minimum bid -- say 7-13-15 23 1 it's less than what's due against it, 'cause you'll have to 2 approve that. In fact, I didn't mention that before. On a 3 resale, if you -- if you're not going to get everything 4 that's due against it, or at least the value, the other 5 jurisdictions have to consent in order to do that, okay? In 6 the situation I'm talking about, all the jurisdictions would 7 have to consent before a Sheriff's sale of a certain bid. If 8 it didn't get that bid, then there's no sale. If it does, 9 then we've -- so, in other words, we're never in the chain of 10 title. So, I've done that before. 11 I mentioned about working with interest in 12 minerals, where there could be some liability there, maybe 13 for plugging an abandoned well, if we didn't know about it, 14 and all of a sudden we have it in trust and may have to plug 15 it. There are a couple of exemptions, both federal and 16 state, that would exempt us from liability for environmental 17 problems if we happen to get stuck with something like that. 18 We don't have to -- we're not liable for it like ordinary 19 owners would be. Let's see, back to the excess, I've talked 20 about that the former owner has two years in which to claim 21 that. If they don't claim it within that two-year period, 22 then it comes to the taxing jurisdictions. We split that up. 23 That was one reason I wanted to, on that 100 acres, try to 24 take that through to a Sheriff's sale, because I knew there 25 was going to be a sale of it way more than what it was worth. 7-13-15 24 1 And we had a lot of owners; I think I had 60 owners in that 2 case before it was done, a lot of owners that we couldn't get 3 in touch with, and so there would be excess that would not be 4 claimed by them. Nobody knows where they are, and so it 5 would come to the taxing jurisdictions after two years. But 6 these guys ended up finding them. I mean, they hounded some 7 of those former owners until they found everybody, and then 8 took it out of -- paid the taxes and took it out of that -- 9 out of that situation, and just went forward on a partition 10 case, and they just sold the entire property. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: That was the Smith brothers out of 12 Austin, wasn't it? 13 MR. SHIEVER: That was what? 14 JUDGE POLLARD: The Smith brothers out of Austin 15 that bought all of it? 16 MR. SHIEVER: Yeah. Actually, I think they're out 17 of College Station. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Out of College Station. 19 MR. SHIEVER: Yeah, I believe so. And those guys 20 are pretty sharp, though. They knew more than their lawyer 21 did, I think, in this case. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Jerry, just real quick, you 23 said on redemption, when they come back to redeem it, there's 24 a redemption penalty, or they have to pay sometimes 25 50 percent of -- what's that? 50 percent of what? 7-13-15 25 1 MR. SHIEVER: Of the redemption price, what 2 somebody paid for it. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Paid for it, okay. 4 MR. SHIEVER: Now, if they redeem it while it's in 5 trust to us, there is no redemption penalty. 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. 7 MR. SHIEVER: It's only if they redeem from a 8 private person. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: So they pay that private 10 person? 11 MR. SHIEVER: Yeah, what they paid for it. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Plus 50 percent. 13 MR. SHIEVER: Yeah, 45 percent or 50 percent. 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah. 15 MR. SHIEVER: That probably covers most of what 16 y'all need to know, I guess. Any questions about that? 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm with Buster; I'm glad 18 you're the one doing it. 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I was going to say, that's my 20 sentiment. Glad you're on top of that, you and Diane. 21 MR. SHIEVER: Now, we visited a year or two ago, I 22 guess, when we had some sales, and we weren't sure about 23 Diane's authority to approve the bid or not without having to 24 come to y'all each and every time, and y'all continued what 25 had been done since when Paula was here, so it just goes 7-13-15 26 1 through them. I will mention that there is one trust 2 property that we still have, and that's the one that y'all 3 sent some people out there to clean it up. That's the only 4 one we have. There were about -- let's see, one, two -- six 5 properties that were sold last year as trust properties, and 6 all of those sold for more than was due against it. Not a 7 whole lot more, but more than was due against it. And there 8 were various places around town, and so we only have this one 9 left. And we post information about that on our website, and 10 Diane puts it on the county's website too, I believe. 11 COMMISSIONER REEVES: I know we have had to go back 12 out there because of all the rain, and our maintenance 13 crew -- 14 MR. SHIEVER: Yeah. 15 COMMISSIONER REEVES: -- has put it on a regular 16 schedule. 17 MR. SHIEVER: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Because we got a letter -- I 19 think you got the letter on it, didn't you, Ray? Or a phone 20 call, about the property -- 21 MR. GARCIA: Yes, sir. 22 COMMISSIONER REEVES: -- being overgrown. 23 MS. BOLIN: Just be sure and give me the bill so 24 that I can -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Reimburse. 7-13-15 27 1 MS. BOLIN: That needs to go in with the -- 2 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Get with Tim; he's keeping a 3 record of that. 4 MS. BOLIN: Okay. 5 MR. SHIEVER: Remember, that comes off the top when 6 people call me and say, "What does it take to buy the 7 property?" And we've had some bids on it. See, it's valued 8 at 15,000 right now, and there's almost 5,000 due against it. 9 We had a bid of 1,000. Well, of course, we didn't want to 10 take that. A lot of people -- as I said, for the reasons 11 that the deed they get, and lack of title insurance up front, 12 we don't expect them to pay a full, fair market value, but 13 1,000 when it's been appraised at 15, that's not quite 14 enough. So, okay, if there are no more questions, well, 15 thank you, gentlemen. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, Jerry. 17 MR. SHIEVER: Thanks for the conspiracy, Buster. 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I know that we count on Jerry 19 a lot to help us through that land mine of getting all the 20 Sheriff's sales and that done. We appreciate it. 21 MS. STEBBINS: Jerry, do you have another copy of 22 your outline? 23 MR. SHIEVER: Yes. 24 MS. STEBBINS: May have I one, please? Thank you. 25 MR. SHIEVER: I referred to the different statutory 7-13-15 28 1 authorities for everything, I said in case anybody wants to 2 check on that and see if we're right. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The thing I read said that 4 you had served Kerr County for 40 years. That means that 5 you're over 40 years old, huh? You've lied to me again. 6 MR. SHIEVER: A little. And whoever wrote this may 7 have stretched that a little bit. I don't -- I think my 8 first case here -- Doris was the Tax Assessor, of course, and 9 we got hired to defend the county. Some car dealership -- I 10 think the owner of a car dealership in Midland had some 11 property that they didn't like the value that she put on it, 12 so he filed suit against the county, and we won that. And it 13 was sometimes later on, then, that they hired us to do just 14 the regular delinquent tax work. I think that was in the 15 '70's, somewhere along that -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 1970's? 17 MR. SHIEVER: Yeah, 1970's. (Laughter.) 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Well, I really can't tell, 19 you know. 20 MR. SHIEVER: Friends like you, Buster. (Laughter.) 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you very much. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay, let's go on to Item 1.3 on 23 the agenda; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action 24 for the Court's final approval to name -- 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What about 1.2? 7-13-15 29 1 JUDGE POLLARD: What? 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: 1.2. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, I skipped one. 1.2; 4 public hearing regarding naming the front half of Old Pasture 5 Road East to proposed name Edison Bauer Road East, Precinct 6 2. 7 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 9:27 a.m., and a public hearing was held in open 8 court, as follows:) 9 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 10 JUDGE POLLARD: Public hearing. Is there any -- I 11 declare the public hearing open. Is there anybody wishing to 12 speak regarding this? (No response.) There being none, I'll 13 close the public hearing. 14 (The public hearing was concluded at 9:27 a.m., and the regular Commissioners Court meeting was 15 reopened.) 16 - - - - - - - - - - 17 JUDGE POLLARD: And go on to 1.3; consider, 18 discuss, and take appropriate action for the Court's final 19 approval to name the front half Old Pasture Road East to 20 proposed name Edison Bauer Road East, Precinct 2. 21 Mr. Hastings? 22 MR. HASTINGS: Thank you. This was considered by 23 the Court on May 20th, and you all set a public hearing for 24 today. You had your concerns addressed by Kerr 911 on 25 May 20th. There was a typo on that application; the name 7-13-15 30 1 would be Edison, with one "d" instead of two. What you have 2 before you now should be correct. At this time, we're asking 3 the Court for their final approval regarding naming the front 4 half of Old Pasture Road East to Edison Bauer Road East, and 5 the back half will remain Old Pasture Road East, Precinct 2. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So moved. 7 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: Been moved and seconded that the 9 front half of Old Pasture Road East be -- the name be changed 10 to Edison, with one "d," Bauer Road East. Is there any 11 further discussion? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Just a comment. And the way 13 they were set up, the access to Old Pasture Road comes in 14 off -- 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: 173. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Not 173. Comes in off of -- 17 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Mack Hollimon. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- Mack Hollimon. 19 MR. HASTINGS: And Rit Jons. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And they're not really 21 connected any more. There's a gate. 22 MR. HASTINGS: There's going to be a gate. 23 JUDGE POLLARD: Any further discussion? If not, 24 those in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 25 hands. 7-13-15 31 1 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 4-0.) 2 JUDGE POLLARD: It's 4-0, unanimous. All right. 3 1.4; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action for the 4 Court to accept the preliminary plat for Estates of Panther 5 Creek Development. Mr. Hastings? 6 MR. HASTINGS: Thank you. The concept plan for 7 this subdivision was considered and approved by Commissioners 8 Court in the spring of 2015. The construction plans have 9 been approved by the County Engineer, and the preconstruction 10 meeting was conducted on June 26th of this year. 11 Construction consists of approximately 1 mile of privately 12 maintained paved roadway and the associated drainage 13 facilities. And the subdivision will be gated, and the 14 roadway named will be Gene Walker Trail. At this time, we 15 ask the Court to approve the preliminary plat for the Estates 16 at Panther Creek Development, Precinct 4. 17 COMMISSIONER REEVES: So moved. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: It's been moved and seconded that 20 the preliminary plat for the Estates at Panther Creek 21 Development be accepted. Is there any further discussion? 22 There being none, those in favor, signify by raising your 23 right hand. 24 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 4-0.) 25 JUDGE POLLARD: It's 4-0, unanimous. Okay, 1.5; 7-13-15 32 1 consider, discuss, and take appropriate action for the Court 2 to accept the concept plan regarding the proposed, quote, 3 "Platinum Park," unquote, Subdivision in Precinct 2. 4 Mr. Hastings? 5 MR. HASTINGS: You should have before you the 6 concept plan for Platinum Park Subdivision. Platinum Park is 7 a proposed 8.33-acre commercial subdivision with three lots 8 and a public road. It's in Center Point. It is located in 9 the high-density development area of Center Point, and it's 10 served by Aqua Texas water provider. The lots are proposed 11 to be served by O.S.S.F.; however, public sewer is 12 anticipated to be reasonably available at some point in the 13 future from the East Kerr County wastewater project. The 14 minimum lot size per Kerr County Subdivision regulations is 1 15 acre. This subdivision will consist of Lots 1 through 3 at 16 5.65 acres, 1.04, and 1.02 acres respectively. At this time, 17 we ask the Court to approve the concept plan for "Platinum 18 Park" Subdivision, Precinct 2. 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So moved. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 21 JUDGE POLLARD: Been moved and seconded that the 22 concept plan for Platinum Park Subdivision in Precinct 2 be 23 accepted and approved. Any further discussion? 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I had a question. It's 25 served today by O.S.S.F.? 7-13-15 33 1 MR. HASTINGS: Yes, sir. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And then when the new system 3 is up and running, do people like that -- are they 4 automatically hooked up, or do we go through -- we have to 5 jump through some hoops to cause them to hook up, or what 6 happens? 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Let me answer that. This one, 8 the sewer line doesn't quite get to that property. That's 9 what he said. It's readily -- I think that, you know, 10 somebody developed this property probably -- 11 MR. HASTINGS: It's probably 300 or 400 feet away. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And it hasn't been decided on 13 through this Court whether mandatory hookup -- to what extent 14 mandatory hookup is required. Still to be determined. So, 15 Commissioner Letz and I have been working with Charlie and 16 other people on that, so "to be determined" on the mandatory 17 hookup. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: The mandatory hook up thing, 19 that's always been a huge debate. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yes, it is. So we've got some 21 thoughts on it, but we need to bring it to the full Court. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Be interesting to see. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I think it will be brought 24 to the Court sooner, rather than later. We need to really 25 start looking at that. We have authority to -- to require 7-13-15 34 1 it. The question is, at what acreage size do we require it? 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Do you cause the owner to 3 pay for it? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Mm-hmm. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But the majority -- I won't say 7 majority. Many of these properties will be under -- like 8 Kerrville South, under a grant program. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Which we approved an 10 application several weeks ago to Texas Department of 11 Agriculture for a $500,000 grant for that purpose. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And there's some -- but, I 13 mean, I think it's -- in the preliminary discussions, it's 14 been, you know, larger tracts -- and I won't define 15 "larger" -- will not be required to hook up. It will be at 16 their option. But there will be some sort of incentive to 17 hook up or, you know, this -- you know, hook on. The 18 question on this, Charlie, my recollection was that the road 19 is going to be a county-maintained road. 20 MR. HASTINGS: Yes, sir. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And everyone's happy with the 22 standard, because it will be a -- because this is a 23 commercial development? 24 MR. HASTINGS: Yes. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Probably a little bit greater 7-13-15 35 1 standards. And they're -- 2 MR. HASTINGS: Greater standards than a 3 residential, yes, sir. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: Any further discussion? If not, 6 those in favor of the motion, signify by raising your right 7 hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 4-0.) 9 JUDGE POLLARD: It's 4-0, unanimous. All right, 10 we'll go on to 1.6; consider, discuss, and take appropriate 11 action on revision of Kerr County Juvenile Detention Facility 12 Policy and Procedures Manual. Mr. Jason Davis. 13 MR. DAVIS: Good morning, Your Honor, 14 Commissioners. I would like to withdraw that request. We 15 are not ready to proceed forward. I would like to -- 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Nice seeing you. 17 MR. DAVIS: Thank you. 18 JUDGE POLLARD: Moving right along, it's past 9:30. 19 1.7; the Joint Airport Board is requesting to proceed with 20 refurbishing the Mooney parking lot, asphalt repair, and 21 taxiway extension with participation from Kerr County. Mr. 22 McKenzie, how are you today, sir? 23 MR. McKENZIE: I'm well, sir. Thank you, Judge. 24 Appreciate it. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Let me tee this up, if I 7-13-15 36 1 might. 2 MR. McKENZIE: Certainly. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: There's been a lot of 4 improvements out at the Mooney facility, and I think we all 5 know that. I think Mooney's invested about six and a half 6 million in new equipment, half a million dollars in roof. I 7 was out there the other day, about three or four days after 8 it rained, going through the employee/customer parking lot, 9 and literally almost couldn't get to the guard shack because 10 of all the water standing. So this is what we, as the City 11 and the County, need to do to be good owners of that 12 property. We need to provide at least minimum standards of 13 acceptability for both the employees and the customers. The 14 customers are coming in to buy a $700,000 airplane, and it 15 looks like the Grapes of Wrath out there. I mean, it's 16 terrible. So, there's been some assessment by the City and 17 the County and Bruce to look at phasing this, but one of the 18 things that's needed very, very early, and that's the primary 19 thing, is to grade that parking lot so that at least it 20 drains, and then some longer-term things. I just wanted to 21 say that before Bruce gets into the nuts and bolts about what 22 needs to be done. But just focus on -- there's some 23 near-term and some long-term things that are going to require 24 more effort. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: What car were you driving when you 7-13-15 37 1 almost couldn't get through the water? 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: My big car. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: Oh, the big one. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I knew that's where you were 5 going. 6 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. Okay. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: My tractor, as a matter of 8 fact. 9 MR. McKENZIE: Thank you, Commissioner. And that's 10 all, indeed, the case. Several weeks ago, we were approached 11 by the folks at Mooney -- owners of Mooney to help them 12 facilitate trying to improve that parking lot there for those 13 -- for their employees to park. And I've consistently 14 counted, I mean, 105 to 120 cars every day in that parking 15 lot, so it's a legitimate request to fix that parking lot. 16 And that's the most immediate need right now. There's four 17 other places that we need to address, but that's the most 18 immediate need that we have right now. And what that's going 19 to take -- and I don't presume to tell the owners how to do 20 this, the City or the County. That's not my position. But I 21 do know what does need to be done, and it's going to take a 22 blade, a water truck, and a roller out there for maybe two 23 days at the most to just fix that employee parking lot, like 24 Commissioner Moser described, to get out of the potholes. 25 It's -- it's pathetic. It's pretty bad. 7-13-15 38 1 JUDGE POLLARD: It's going to be some expenditure 2 for asphalt and other materials. 3 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir, and I appreciate that 4 question. The Airport Board will buy all the materials as we 5 work through this process. We're going to buy, for example, 6 the base material. If we need hydrated lime to stabilize the 7 base, if we need cement to stabilize the base, all the trap 8 rock for the two-course surface treatment, if we get that far 9 in this process. We will buy the hot mix. What we're 10 requesting is participation from the owners for labor and 11 equipment. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Just make it very clear that 13 the first phase is -- 14 MR. McKENZIE: The parking lot. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: -- a couple of days -- couple 16 days just to grade it, then to go back later at some point to 17 hard surface it. 18 MR. McKENZIE: That's right. That will be next 19 spring or next summer when we get to that point. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 21 MR. McKENZIE: What we're trying to do now, the 22 first phase of this is to get those folks in a better parking 23 situation. That's where we're at right now. There's four 24 other things that need to be done out there around the 25 service center delivery hangar, and it's old asphalt. We've 7-13-15 39 1 already had the geo-tech done on this; we know what's beneath 2 it now. We -- I say "we." The airport's already paid for 3 the geo-tech for that. We know what needs to be done. I've 4 consulted with Charlie Hastings about that, and we're in 5 concurrence of how to fix that. This afternoon at 2 o'clock, 6 Charlie Hastings, myself, and the Public Works Director from 7 the City are going to meet out there at 2:00 and formulate a 8 game plan from this point forward as to how to address these 9 issues. And, of course, if the -- if the Court concurs with 10 this and agrees as to how and when the timeline will be so we 11 can fix these things. But the first thing is the parking 12 lot. 13 The other three things -- there's three more things 14 that are just existing asphalt that need to be taken out or 15 asphalt zippered, and you folks are familiar with that; 16 rework the base and then the asphalt's done on that. The 17 City's agreed to do the paving if it's hot mix; they don't 18 have a chip spreader or a distributor like the County does. 19 So, the other thing is to extend the small taxiway maybe 20 150 feet to help Mooney out. That will be a new construction 21 job, but it's -- here again, it's pretty minor when you look 22 at the big scope of things. So, my intention today and the 23 reason I'm here is to request the participation from the 24 County to assist us in the labor and the equipment, much like 25 we did with the new T-hangars that we built, and moving 7-13-15 40 1 forward with this. We, the Airport Board, per se, will buy 2 all the materials. Last Tuesday night I made this same 3 presentation across the street. They agreed to -- they 4 agreed. Just for your information, they said they would 5 participate in the involvement of it. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess a question. First one, 7 I think you've talked about a lot of projects, and I want to 8 go back to -- this is only basically a patch of the parking 9 lot, is all we're doing right now, so it's not a big project. 10 MR. McKENZIE: No. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And you mentioned -- this 12 question may need to go to Charlie, not you, but you 13 mentioned that it would be about two days with the blade and 14 a water truck. 15 MR. HASTINGS: That's just on the employee parking 16 lot, Commissioner. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's all we're looking at 18 right here. 19 MR. HASTINGS: Right. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. It doesn't seem 21 efficient to me, Charlie, to have the County and the City out 22 there for two days together. Seems like -- I mean, is 23 that -- I mean, and I'm asking you. Is that a -- 24 MR. HASTINGS: One or the other needs to do it. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: One or the other needs to do 7-13-15 41 1 this. You mean this part of it? 2 MR. HASTINGS: That's correct. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You have a preference? Is this 4 something that we are better suited to do, and let the City 5 do a little bit more on one of the other projects? Or is the 6 City better situated to do this part, and we could do more on 7 another project? 8 MR. HASTINGS: I think that's the purpose of this 9 meeting this afternoon, is to determine who's best suited. 10 If we're just looking at kind of fairness in what has been 11 done lately out at the airport, there was a significant 12 amount of work that was done by the County a year ago; we 13 spent two full months working on the T-hangars doing dirt 14 work. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, your -- 16 MR. HASTINGS: My preference would be that they do 17 a couple days work out there. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The City do it? 19 MR. HASTINGS: Yes, sir. 20 MR. McKENZIE: That's correct. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I'd like to make a motion, 22 then. I'd like to make a motion that the County work through 23 Bruce, work with the City to determine the near-term thing, 24 the bandaid fix for the couple-of-day effort, and who is most 25 appropriate to do that, okay? And that to be determined in 7-13-15 42 1 the meeting that you have today with Charlie Hastings and 2 with the City Public Works Director, and then for you to come 3 back to the Court with the bigger projects, the hard surface 4 and things about who's going to do what, and what it's going 5 to cost and when it should be done. So, the motion is very 6 simply, move forward on the two-day bandaid thing, determine 7 the best fit for that. And whoever does that, they'll get 8 recognized for the work to be done in the future. 9 MR. McKENZIE: Okay. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That'll let you keep moving on 11 this thing. 12 MR. McKENZIE: Thank you. 13 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I have a question for you. 14 Any of these projects, do they -- do we need to get them in 15 here pronto so we can put them in the budget? Or is there 16 expenses to this thing? I understand that the board is going 17 to pay for the materials on the parking lot, but anything 18 else that we're going to be required to pay for that -- when 19 you're talking about an extension of a runway or something, I 20 can't remember your verbiage, but that sounds like a big deal 21 to me. 22 MR. McKENZIE: It's not, Commissioner, because it's 23 a taxiway. It's a very narrow taxiway; it's right next to 24 their campus there. It just needs to be extended. I may be 25 wrong; maybe it's 180. It's not that far. It will assist 7-13-15 43 1 them greatly in tugging airplanes around there. And to 2 address the first part, if you don't mind me answering this 3 question, the reason we need to fix these other three small 4 areas is because right now, they cannot taxi aircraft across 5 that area because there's loose gravel everywhere, so they 6 shut the aircraft down out on the taxiway. Then they tug it 7 across that area. 'Cause if you ding a prop on a $700,000 8 airplane, not only do you have that problem, but if it goes 9 up into the leading edge of the wing or to the horizontal 10 stabilizer, then you've got a new airplane that you've got to 11 go back and fix. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What Buster's asking is, are 13 the funds necessary to do this work for the materials, are 14 they in the airport budget -- 15 MR. McKENZIE: Yes, sir. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: -- which we approved? Okay. 17 MR. McKENZIE: They are. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Or do we need to include 19 something else in our budget process? 20 MR. McKENZIE: No, sir, we can take care of the 21 materials. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's a very good question. 23 And so the -- but the thinking is, Commissioner Baldwin, is 24 it will require work by the City -- I mean by the County Road 25 and Bridge to do part of this work, and that's to be 7-13-15 44 1 determined right now just what that is. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I understand. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. Good question. 4 MR. McKENZIE: Correct. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It always upsets me when my 6 plane gets a ding by that gravel. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll second the motion. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: What was the motion? 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: The motion was to authorize 11 the -- 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Oh, yeah. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: For the immediate bandaid 14 work, and then to look at -- come back to the Court with 15 what's going to be required on the longer-term stuff. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: And who is in this meeting 17 tomorrow? 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: This afternoon. It's Bruce 19 and Charlie and the Public Works Director. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: City? 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right, to look at what's to be 22 done. 23 MR. McKENZIE: When I say two days, I'm talking 24 about a short span of time; two days, maybe four. I mean -- 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, yeah. 7-13-15 45 1 JUDGE POLLARD: I'm going to try to shorten this a 2 little bit. As I understand, the motion is kind of -- to 3 boil it down, is to authorize the first stage, which is the 4 work for two to four days, whatever is necessary, by the 5 County Road and Bridge Department for purposes of fixing the 6 parking lot out there as described. That's it. Is that 7 right? And then everything else comes back later. 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Correct. County or City, 9 whichever is the best solution. 10 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. And it's to be 11 determined through some kind of a meeting this afternoon with 12 Charlie Hastings and the Airport Board as to who's going to 13 do what as to the allocation between the City and the County. 14 Now, is that a pretty accurate boil-down? 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well stated. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Except it's not the Airport 17 Board; it's the Airport Manager. 18 JUDGE POLLARD: Airport Manager, okay. All right, 19 I amend it to say the Airport Manager, then. All right. Got 20 that motion down? Is there any further discussion? There 21 being none, those in favor of that motion, signify by raising 22 your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 4-0.) 24 JUDGE POLLARD: It's 4-0, unanimous. Zoom, you got 25 it. 7-13-15 46 1 MR. McKENZIE: Thank you, sir. Appreciate it. 2 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. 1.8; consider, discuss, 3 and take appropriate action to approve the Kerr County group 4 health renewal plan for upcoming 2015-16 plan year and have 5 County Judge sign the same. Dawn Lantz. 6 MS. LANTZ: Good morning, Judge, Commissioners. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Morning. 8 MS. LANTZ: I believe everybody should have 9 received a copy of our renewal for this upcoming year. We 10 did have a 7.45 percent increase on our medical, so -- 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: 7.45? 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Wow. 13 MS. LANTZ: Yes, sir. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: To what do you attribute that? 15 MS. LANTZ: We had large claims. I believe you 16 should have received some -- a packet as well with our claim 17 history that I provided that kind of explains a little bit. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, most of that 7.45 is 19 because of a claim? 20 MS. LANTZ: They take, I think, all the claims into 21 consideration. The total claims based on that, yes. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: How much did our claims go up 23 last year compared to -- 24 MS. LANTZ: Last year, our increase was 25 9.9 percent, so actually we went down this year to 7.45. We 7-13-15 47 1 still had an increase, but it wasn't as large as last year. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No, but our claims -- you say 3 our claims went up 9 percent? Or -- 4 JUDGE POLLARD: You're talking about the number of 5 claims or the cost? 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: The cost. The cost. 7 MS. LANTZ: The cost of claims went down. However, 8 we still received an increase, a 7 percent increase. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Hmm. 10 JUDGE POLLARD: So that means that the other 11 participants in the plan throughout the state had a pretty 12 substantial increase. 13 MS. LANTZ: Yes, my understanding. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: We went down and they went up. 15 (Ms. Lantz nodded.) 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The previous year, basically, 17 they stayed the same and we went up. It kind of balances 18 out. What did we have in our preliminary budget numbers, 19 what kind of an increase? 20 MS. DOSS: About 2.2 million. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 2.29? And that is for the -- 22 MS. LANTZ: The basic life, the medical and the 23 dental for the employees. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No change in plan design? 25 MS. LANTZ: No, it stays the same. 7-13-15 48 1 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Ms. Doss, did you say 2 2.9 percent? I didn't hear. 3 MS. DOSS: No, 2.2 million. 4 COMMISSIONER REEVES: 2.2 million. 5 MS. DOSS: For all the health insurance, is what we 6 had budgeted. 7 COMMISSIONER REEVES: And what is it going to cost 8 now, estimated? 9 MS. LANTZ: It depends. We have -- on our plan, we 10 have people that go on and go off, so there's no way to 11 exactly get the exact number. We have to kind of estimate 12 the cost. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I guess, basically, a 14 7.45 percent increase? What was the increase? 15 MS. LANTZ: Yes. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, is it -- we had 17 budgeted 2.2. What's the new number? 18 MS. DOSS: It'll probably be about 2.3 -- 2.34, 19 2.35. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. That's the number I was 21 looking for, thank you. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: So, we need to adjust the budget 23 figure? 24 MS. DOSS: Yes, sir. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 7-13-15 49 1 MS. DOSS: Unless we change coverage, dependent 2 coverage or -- 3 MS. LANTZ: What the employees pay for their 4 dependents' coverage. Currently, employee children, employee 5 spouse is 250 a month, and employee family is 450 a month. 6 JUDGE POLLARD: How much do we need to amend the 7 budget amount? 8 MS. DOSS: About 150,000. We'll have to increase 9 the budget -- 10 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. 11 MS. DOSS: -- to keep coverage as it is right now. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And if we were to look at 13 trying to reduce that anywhere, is, I guess, the biggest 14 impact that we can make by making the change? Let me 15 rephrase it. Traditionally, we have subsidized the dependent 16 care. Employees have always been 100 percent, but the other 17 two plans, the family option and the kids option or spouse, 18 however it works, are we still subsidizing part of those? 19 MS. LANTZ: Yes. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's that costing us? 21 MS. LANTZ: For example, for employee-spouse, the 22 County pays 943.04 with the new plan. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Speak up, Dawn. 24 MS. LANTZ: Employee-spouse is going to be billed 25 1,193.04. The County will pay 943.04, and the employee only 7-13-15 50 1 pays 250. Employee children, 1,133.20; the County pays 2 883.20. And family coverage is -- went up to 1,910.60. The 3 County pays 1,460.60, and the employee pays 450 of that. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's -- how many employees 5 are on those -- those three? 6 MS. LANTZ: We have it broken down. 7 MS. DOSS: I have -- yes, sir. The total that it 8 costs the County to subsidize is about 420,000 a year. And 9 there's 74 employees that are benefiting out of the total of 10 258 employees. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, I don't think we need to 12 make that decision now, but I think we may want to look at 13 that during our budget workshops. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I do too. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Because I think that the -- our 16 primary responsibility should be to be our employees. And I 17 think we just need to look at that cost. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you talking about the 19 children? 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Either children or spouse or 21 family. I mean, and I don't know how much of a change would 22 have to be made to make up some of this increase, but I just 23 think that it's going to be hard. Between all the other 24 things that are budget increases and another 150,000 here, I 25 think it's going to be difficult, so I think we need to look 7-13-15 51 1 at if we can cut it back some. 2 MS. LANTZ: We also have employees -- both 3 employees that work here; they don't pay as much as everyone 4 either. So if both employees, husband and wife, work here, 5 they only pay $100 a month coverage, compared to the 250 or 6 the 450. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So the 420,000 a year, that's 8 for -- that's the County's contribution for family or spouse 9 coverage? 10 MS. LANTZ: All dependents. 11 MS. DOSS: Yes, sir. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Not the employee? 13 MS. DOSS: Yes, sir. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: 420. And so that's 15 potentially going to increase from 420 to what? 16 MS. DOSS: That -- that's part of the increase that 17 we spoke of earlier. It also is calculated with a 7.45 -- 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. Well, I'm with 19 Commissioner Letz; that needs to be part of the budget 20 workshop. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Should. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I think we -- I mean, and 23 we're at that point that we have to put a lot of these things 24 on hold, I think the budget workshop, until we get the 25 revenue numbers in. 7-13-15 52 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right, precisely. 2 JUDGE POLLARD: Sheriff? 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Only thing I would -- you 4 know, you get some of our employees that are down in the 14, 5 15 step range, and they're -- not only, you know, the 6 salaries are lower, but then you're also looking at currently 7 if they have family, it's $450 a month, which is a good 8 thing, but it's still a lot coming out of those smaller 9 paychecks as it is. So, I would just caution that -- 10 MS. LANTZ: And they're single parents. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The only other thing that I 12 would say, and this is a little bit different, but one thing 13 that affects my employees, especially if they are having to 14 be required to use EMS, okay, is Kerrville EMS is not part of 15 our plan. They are an out-of -- 16 MS. LANTZ: Network. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- network EMS. And we've 18 talked about this for years, but, you know, we have Blue 19 Cross/Blue Shield. There should, through TAC, but there's 20 bound to be a way through negotiations we can get Kerrville 21 EMS as part of the plan, because that is really hurting 22 employees that their kid or anything else has to go by EMS 23 anywhere, that it's out of network. It's on top of all this 24 other they're trying to pay. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 7-13-15 53 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Is it -- where's the problem? 4 I'm asking; I don't know. 5 MS. LANTZ: The EMS has to contract -- be a 6 contract with Blue Cross and Blue Shield. And last year, I 7 even brought it up to the mayor that we were not in network. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And so I take it the City 9 doesn't use Blue Cross/Blue Shield? 10 MS. LANTZ: I believe that they have that as well 11 for their plan, but I don't know if they take their network. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They use Blue Cross/Blue 13 Shield? 14 MS. LANTZ: Mm-hmm, but I don't know if EMS accepts 15 it; that's what I'm saying. They may not even have it for 16 their plan, where EMS takes it. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They don't. 18 MS. STEBBINS: They didn't when I was there. They 19 didn't; it was the same. 20 MS. LANTZ: I mean, that's what I understand. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It's just put more off on the 22 employee, same way. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What did you say, Heather? 24 MS. STEBBINS: It was the same. The effect on the 25 city employees was the same as the effect on the county 7-13-15 54 1 employees when I was there. That wasn't that long ago. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 3 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Does it affect retirees in 4 any way? 5 (Ms. Lantz nodded.) 6 COMMISSIONER REEVES: I would say we definitely 7 need to look at this, but I think part of this serves as the 8 additional compensation for our employees, that even though 9 we're paying for the spouse or we're paying for the children 10 with the subsidy, it does serve as compensation for a lot of 11 our employees when they're trying to decide on working for 12 Kerr County or working someplace else. We do need to look at 13 that. I'm not -- 14 JUDGE POLLARD: Absolutely. 15 COMMISSIONER REEVES: We may have to increase the 16 out-of-pocket, but I think we need to be -- recognize that 17 this does help retain a lot of our employees. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It does do that, but it is also 19 only benefiting 74 of our employees. 20 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So you either -- you either 21 continue with the insurance, or give them all a raise. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I agree. It's always been 24 a -- it's always been one of the tools in the drawer to get 25 employees. 7-13-15 55 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, just to repeat, so the 2 $420,000 that the County pays is benefiting 74 employees? 3 MS. DOSS: Yes, sir. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: Out of about, what 280? 6 MS. LANTZ: 258. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: About a quarter of them, or a 8 little over a third of them. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 10 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. Is there a motion on 11 this one? We'll table it till after budget or what? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's our timetable? 13 MS. LANTZ: I have to have it back to TAC by 14 August 3rd. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: August 3rd. 16 MS. LANTZ: So it will be on the next Commissioners 17 Court. And that's why I brought it, 'cause I knew that the 18 budget hearings would be going on. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Jody, we probably want to put a 20 -- a possibility of a special meeting on the 1st or the 2nd. 21 I don't know what the calendar is. 22 MS. GRINSTEAD: The 3rd, I think, is the first 23 Monday in August. 24 MS. LANTZ: Maybe on the 3rd, just have a special 25 meeting. I mean, if we're not going to get the tax rolls 7-13-15 56 1 until the 27th, and we're going to have to make a decision -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But she has to have it by then. 3 MS. LANTZ: I have to have it by the 3rd, and we 4 start our open enrollment, because we have to have everything 5 processed by September 1st in order to do payroll deductions 6 to go into effect in October. So, our open enrollment's 7 going to start the 6th and 7th of August, so I -- 'cause I 8 have to give the employees something. 9 MS. DOSS: And during open enrollment, more 10 families may sign up, which means that number may grow. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, this is just to approve 12 the 7.4 percent increase; is that correct? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Approve the whole plan. 14 MS. LANTZ: The whole plan, even with -- 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: The whole plan. 16 MS. LANTZ: Which includes the -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So, the 2nd, 3rd -- so, the 18 30th is a Friday? 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: August 3rd is the first 20 Thursday of August. Now, the 27th is the last -- or first 21 Monday of August. The 27th is the last Monday of July. 22 Currently, you have -- you have a budget hearing set for the 23 14th, which would be Tuesday, but that's tomorrow, so you 24 don't have enough time. The next one after that on your 25 temporary deal on the 28th of July, you have a budget deal to 7-13-15 57 1 set elected officials' salaries. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would say just -- I mean, we 3 have to look at it a little bit, but somewhere around the 4 29th and 30th, we should have a special workshop, or meeting. 5 I'm just guessing. I'm trying to look -- we get the number 6 on the 27th. If we get it earlier, we can always do it, but 7 we don't want to be able to not -- not run out of time. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: Can we -- rather than setting 9 another budget hearing, can we combine it with one that's 10 already scheduled? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We don't have any more 12 scheduled, I think, do we? 13 MR. ROBLES: Tomorrow. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I know about tomorrow, but we 15 have to have a budget workshop after the tax rolls come out. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: When do the tax rolls come 17 out? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 27th. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. 20 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: On mine, the one you 21 originally came out with that may have changed, you have a 22 public hearing on elected officials' salaries set for the 23 28th. 24 MS. BOLIN: According to the budget calendar here, 25 it does. That may have changed. 7-13-15 58 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, we can do it that way, I 2 mean, or -- but that's -- I mean, why not just move the 3 public hearing to the -- have we already posted the public 4 hearing? 5 MS. GRINSTEAD: No. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would -- to buy a little more 7 time, I'd do it the 30th. That way we have time to get some 8 numbers, and we can hopefully make some tough decisions. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That would be a good idea, the 10 30th. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And if we get the numbers from 13 the revenue side early, well, then we can push things up a 14 little bit. Diane, have you heard from Fourth? 15 MS. BOLIN: I heard from Fourth, and he told me 16 that he thought they could certify with A.R.B. on the 17th -- 17 excuse me, the 17th. But to be able to print them, the 18 software because of the new change per legislation, they're 19 not even going to be ready till the 22nd. And when I talked 20 to Sharon, who actually does everything, she said it would be 21 the last week of the month, first week of August. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What -- I mean, they'll be able 23 to give us a number, though. 24 MS. BOLIN: I'm going to talk -- I'll talk to him 25 after the meeting and find out if I can get any numbers. 7-13-15 59 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 2 MS. BOLIN: You're not the only one asking. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Well, we have to be a 4 little bit fluid until we -- 5 MS. BOLIN: Yes. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- get these numbers in, 7 because that's when we have to make our decisions. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. As to Item 1.8 on the 9 agenda, though, we're going to table it; is that correct? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Correct. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. Is that agreeable with 12 everybody? 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. Someone make a motion 15 to that effect, that 1.8 be tabled. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I don't think you need a 17 motion. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. So moved. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Second. 21 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. Those in favor, signify 22 by raising your right hand. 23 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 4-0.) 24 JUDGE POLLARD: It's 4-0, unanimous. All right, 25 let's go on to 1.9; consider, discuss, and take appropriate 7-13-15 60 1 action to authorize sale of surplus co-ax cable coming off 2 radio towers. Sheriff Hierholzer. 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: What that is, is as they're 4 stretching the new cable up, they're pulling down some of 5 that old co-ax cable. It is copper -- what they call dirty 6 copper, 'cause it's still insulated. We are taking that, and 7 we're having them cut it in lengths that we can haul it over 8 to our yard on a trailer. But I would like authority to have 9 that old cable -- 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Second. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And the funds possibly be 14 reused on some of the incidentals, the radios or anything 15 like that, that we have to purchase in conjunction with this 16 system. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Okay, I change my mind; I 18 withdraw my second. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can't do that, I don't 20 think, Sheriff. The funds have to go to the general fund, 21 okay? No, I guess we can. We've done on it cars and stuff. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yeah, I know it's been done. 23 But all -- you know, I can bring it back to the Court at that 24 time and see what we get for it, just on salvage, and see 25 what we can do with those expenses. However -- 7-13-15 61 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't mind you using it on 2 your equipment, as long as -- can we designate the surplus? 3 MS. DOSS: Yes. I mean, you can put it in the 4 general fund, but then you can designate it wherever you want 5 it to go. 6 JUDGE POLLARD: That's not in Item 1.9 anyway, how 7 to use it. It's just authorizing the sale. 8 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's fine. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So moved. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: Is there a second? 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, there's a second. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. It's been moved and 15 seconded that we authorize the sale of the surplus of co-ax 16 cable. Any further discussion? If not, those in favor, 17 signify by raising your right hand. 18 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 4-0.) 19 JUDGE POLLARD: It's 4-0, unanimous. All right. 20 1.10; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 21 ratify and confirm the pre-agreement letter and environmental 22 documents for 2015-16 Community Development Fund application. 23 MS. DOSS: You should have these in your packets. 24 This was the colonia, Texas Community Development Block Grant 25 that y'all were speaking of earlier. That will be in tandem 7-13-15 62 1 with the Center Point wastewater treatment plant, the 2 pre-agreement letter and the environmental documents. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Move approval. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Second. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: Been moved and seconded for 6 approval of Item 1.10 on the agenda; that is to approve the 7 pre-agreement letter and environmental documents for the 8 2015-16 Community Development Fund application. Any further 9 discussion? There being none, those in favor, signify by 10 raising your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 4-0.) 12 JUDGE POLLARD: It's 4-0, unanimous. Anybody want 13 a break? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 15 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, 10 minutes. 16 (Recess taken from 10:14 a.m. to 1:028 a.m.) 17 - - - - - - - - - - 18 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. You about ready, Maggie? 19 MS. BAKER: Yes, sir. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. We're back in session, 21 and let's resume with Item 1.10; consider, discuss, and take 22 appropriate action to ratify and confirm the pre-agreement 23 letter and environmental documents -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We did that one. 25 MR. BOLLIER: Need to go to 11, Judge. 7-13-15 63 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Oh, we did do that, yeah. Okay. 2 1.11; consider, discuss, and take appropriate action to 3 request approval to add a bench and flower vases to the Kerr 4 County War Memorial. Maggie, by the way, I've had a 5 discussion with Commissioner Letz, and he thinks that bench 6 can be built out of concrete a lot cheaper, and it would be 7 fine. It will be kind of gray to match everything else out 8 there. If that's the one you're talking about on the back 9 side, he's got some other ideas that are really -- 10 MS. BAKER: Well, do I need to do that? 11 JUDGE POLLARD: I like them. All right, go ahead. 12 MS. BAKER: All right. With the bench and the 13 flower vases, I got quotes from Mr. Zirkle. And these are 14 just, you know, ideas, but it would be the gray granite -- 15 the polished gray granite, 9 feet, zero inches, by 1 foot, 16 4 inches, by zero feet, 4 inches, with a polished gray 17 granite pedestal base. It would measure 8 feet, zero inches, 18 by zero feet, 10 inches. That would be a price of $3,000. 19 And the price for the five service symbols at the top, the 20 Army, Air Force, Marines, Navy, and Coast Guard, they'd each 21 be 12 inches in diameter, they would be $1,100. And then the 22 freight, $315. That would be a total cost of $4,425. And 23 then the flower vases -- now, these are the expensive ones. 24 The polished granite, 16 inches by 14 inches, that they'd be 25 $1,080. For just the small tapered monument vases, they'd be 7-13-15 64 1 polished in the front and back and rough sides, they're 10 2 inches in height at the top and tapered to 6 inches at the 3 bottom, or the round polished vases, 10 inches in height and 4 6 or 8 inches in diameter, and those are only $250 for two of 5 those. And, of course, we would get donors to help cover the 6 price. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: Total cost of all of it, based on 8 his bids? 9 MS. BAKER: All together, it would be the 4,425 and 10 the 250, and it would be 4,625 if we went with the lesser 11 amount for the vases. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think that may be a good 13 idea, but when I looked at this agenda item, I was thinking 14 about the landscaping plan for the entire courthouse. We 15 keep doing it piecemeal on this, and personally, I'd like to 16 see how this fits into the whole plan before we move forward 17 with it. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I've got to resurrect that 19 responsibility of mine? 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yes. 21 JUDGE POLLARD: Personally, Buster likes to have 22 his musicals out front and stuff, and there are other people 23 that like to have things, little events on the courthouse 24 lawn out here, and it seems to me that the back side of that 25 monument is kind of blank right now. And Commissioner Letz 7-13-15 65 1 suggested that we use paver stones around the front of the 2 war memorial so people could sit on that instead of in the 3 parking lot, and the chairs, even if it's wet, wouldn't sink 4 down into the grass and all. It seems to me like on the back 5 side, if we used paver stones and built that around to make 6 kind of a -- of a little venue for purposes of events that 7 can be held on the courthouse, like musicals and other things 8 like that, so sort of a little stage type thing. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: All the more purpose for 10 Commissioner Letz to reconvene his committee. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The -- the other thing is, the 12 Judge and I were out there -- I think the 4th of July, we 13 were out there talking about the back side is very bland, of 14 the monument. And we thought about -- but I think the -- you 15 have on here the five service symbols. 16 MS. BAKER: That's correct. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That would be a great way to 18 dress it up. Something else that we talked about was to find 19 a quote from somebody, and -- 20 JUDGE POLLARD: Admiral Nimitz. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- we thought Admiral Nimitz 22 would be a fitting person. You can look for a quote from 23 Admiral Nimitz, someone that has some connection to the 24 community, and put a quote on the centerpiece of it. I mean, 25 I'm sure at some point in his career, he said something -- 7-13-15 66 1 (Laughter) -- noteworthy enough. 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: "Pass the biscuits" or 3 something. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Something. But -- and the 5 benches, I think the benches are a great idea, but my thought 6 was just, you know, you could you probably -- I know you can 7 get concrete benches; we have two local companies that make 8 them. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That you can -- they look nice. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: They do. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And the area out there is 13 pretty much concrete and granite, so concrete would match as 14 well as -- 15 JUDGE POLLARD: It sure would. 16 MS. BAKER: Okay. 17 JUDGE POLLARD: It would be a lot more reasonable. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So -- but I think we ought -- 19 you know, I kind of agree with him, even though it means I've 20 got to get moving on an overall plan for the courthouse. And 21 it's partially done; it's just a matter of -- we probably 22 could even bring it to the Court before it's done. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And incorporate that a little 25 bit. 7-13-15 67 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think we were talking about 2 gazebos and cannons and everything else, and everybody had 3 different ideas of what to do, but all of a sudden it was 4 going to look like a dirt dauber nest; you know, a pod here 5 and a pod there, and without any plan. So -- 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. The more -- where we 7 fell apart last time was trying to get someone to draw it, 8 and trying to get people to draw it at no cost. We still 9 don't -- we're still waiting on that one. So, you know -- 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Some of the Schreiner students 11 could do that. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I bet we could ask -- 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That might be a good option, 15 someone that knows -- you know, that can do that. We have an 16 old drawing that we have finally found, and it's a CAD 17 drawing, but I think it's a paper drawing. But it had every 18 tree located on it, and since some trees have died and fallen 19 and things, we need to get a good updated one. So, I bet -- 20 I appreciate that we need to do something at the war 21 memorial, but I'd kind of like to try to move forward on the 22 whole plan, and then we can have a definite amount -- 23 JUDGE POLLARD: Take a bigger view -- 24 MS. BAKER: Okay. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: -- of the whole courthouse lawn. 7-13-15 68 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. All right. 2 JUDGE POLLARD: Thank you. 3 MS. BAKER: Thank you. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We'll bring it back. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: No action on that one for right 6 now, then. 1.11 -- that's it, the bench. 1.12; consider, 7 discuss, and take appropriate action to select management 8 firm and begin contract negotiations for management services 9 the Hill Country Youth Event Center. Do we want to go into 10 executive session? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are we going to pass on this 12 till tomorrow? We -- the question -- just to get up to 13 everyone up to speed on this, the questions became lengthier 14 than we, I think, kind of really envisioned when we met last 15 time, and we gave them, I think, until Friday -- I mean, 16 today at 5 o'clock to get the numbers back in. 17 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tomorrow. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So we'll do this tomorrow. 19 It's posted for the workshop, so we'll pass on it. 20 COMMISSIONER REEVES: And it's a separate posted 21 item, not just the workshop. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I saw it's posted for 23 tomorrow. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So it would be a perfect 7-13-15 69 1 time. 2 JUDGE POLLARD: So we're going to pass this for 3 right now? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. 1.13; consider, 6 discuss, and take appropriate action regarding possible sale 7 of real property. Do we want to discuss that in open 8 session? Or -- 9 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Executive session, if we can, 10 Judge. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. We'll reserve that one 12 for executive session, then. 1.14; consultation with 13 attorney regarding potential litigation. That needs to be 14 in -- 15 MS. STEBBINS: Yes, sir. 16 JUDGE POLLARD: -- executive session. 1.15; 17 consider, discuss, and take appropriate action on personnel 18 in County Attorney's office. 19 MS. STEBBINS: Executive session, please. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: Executive session. 1.16; consider, 21 discuss, take appropriate action on the independent auditor's 22 report from agreed upon procedures performed in the County 23 Clerk's office. Executive session? 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Executive session. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. All right. 1.17; public 7-13-15 70 1 hearing -- 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's at 1:30. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: That's at 1:30, you're right. All 4 right, 1.18; order authorizing the issuance, sale, and 5 delivery of up to $15 million in aggregate principal 6 amount -- 7 MS. DOSS: That's at 1:30. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: -- of Kerr County, Texas -- 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's at 1:30 also. 10 JUDGE POLLARD: Huh? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's at 1:30 also. 12 MS. GRINSTEAD: It's not a timed item, but they 13 won't be here until this afternoon. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's at 1:30. 15 JUDGE POLLARD: It didn't say 1:30. I guess it's 16 after the 1:30 item. Is there anything we need to go into 17 closed session for now? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 19 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Or do we want to -- 20 JUDGE POLLARD: We can take care of all the bills 21 and stuff. 22 MS. DOSS: Okay. 23 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Then go into closed session. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, we're going to pay the 7-13-15 71 1 bills. Anybody -- 2 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I move we pay the bills. 3 COMMISSIONER REEVES: I'll second. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: Been moved and seconded that we pay 5 the bills as presented. Is there any further discussion? 6 There being none, those in favor, signify by raising your 7 right hand. 8 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 4-0.) 9 JUDGE POLLARD: 4-0, unanimous. 4.2, budget 10 amendments. County Auditor. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Budget amendments? Is that 12 what we're looking at? 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Mm-hmm. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sure a lot of them. 15 MS. DOSS: Yes, sir. It's that time of the year. 16 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, no kidding. Let's 17 see, 28 of them total; that's pretty good. I move for 18 approval of paying the budget amendments. 19 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Ill second. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: Been moved and seconded that we 21 approve the payment -- the budget amendments. Not the 22 payment, but the -- 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah. 24 JUDGE POLLARD: -- the budget amendments. 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Transfer. 7-13-15 72 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Is there any further discussion? 2 There being none, those in favor of the motion, signify by 3 raising your right hand. 4 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 4-0.) 5 JUDGE POLLARD: It's 4-0, unanimous. All right, 6 late bills. 7 MS. DOSS: Well, we have one. It's to pay fuel for 8 the Road and Bridge Department. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'm sorry, what? I didn't 10 hear. 11 MS. DOSS: Late bills. 12 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: It's to pay what? 13 MS. DOSS: To pay fuel for the Road and Bridge 14 Department. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move we pay the late bill to 16 Maxey Energy. 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Second. 18 JUDGE POLLARD: Been moved and seconded we pay the 19 late bill. Any further discussion? There being none, those 20 in favor, signify by raising your right hand. 21 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 4-0.) 22 JUDGE POLLARD: It's 4-0, unanimous. Approve and 23 accept monthly reports. 24 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Yes. Kerr County 25 Environmental Health, Texas Nuisance Abatement program case 7-13-15 73 1 reports, April to June 2015; Kerr County Environmental 2 Health/Animal Services for June 2015; Kerr County 3 Environmental Health, June report; J.P., Precinct 1, for 4 June 2015; Constable, Precinct 1, for June 2015; J.P. 5 Precinct 2, for June 2015; Constable, Precinct 2, for 6 June 2015; J.P., Precinct 3, for June 2015; Constable, 7 Precinct 4, for June 2015; Kerr County District Clerk's 8 Office for June 2015; Kerr County Clerk's office for January 9 to May 2015; Kerr County Payroll Reports for June 2015. 10 JUDGE POLLARD: Is there a motion -- 11 COMMISSIONER REEVES: So moved. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: -- to accept those? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, it's been moved and 15 seconded that those reports be accepted. Any further 16 discussion? There being none, those in favor, signify by 17 raising your right hand. 18 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 4-0.) 19 JUDGE POLLARD: You know, he can be asleep and 20 still raise his right hand. 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yeah, I can still vote. 22 (Laughter.) 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It's a reflection -- 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Sometimes it's left-handed, 25 but, you know... 7-13-15 74 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. Reports from Commissioners, 2 liaison/committee assignments per attachment. Anybody have 3 any reports? 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Nothing. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: One and two have nothing. Do you 6 have anything? I don't have anything. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: No? 9 COMMISSIONER REEVES: I have none. 10 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh, yeah, I do have one, Judge. 12 I want to mention -- I talked to Bob a little bit; it's 13 related. I think potentially it's really important, and it's 14 a big deal. There was a deer in Medina County that came down 15 with a disease called chronic wasting disease. First 16 whitetail in the state of Texas to get the disease. It's 17 been in other states, and it's -- there's an emergency 18 meeting going on tomorrow morning at Parks and Wildlife 19 Commission and the Texas Department of Animal Health, or 20 Animal Health Commission, whatever they're called. They're 21 very serious about it. It's very -- it's a potential 22 problem. It's a very -- a disease that can be transmitted 23 very easily. They're trying to track down where this one 24 came from, but it's -- potentially, it has a big impact on 25 hunting. It has in other states. And there will be quite a 7-13-15 75 1 few press releases coming out, and I just think we need to 2 be, as a Court, aware of it. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And it's for sure that it's -- 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. 5 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Yes. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. There was a slight scare 7 that the first case was in Kerr County. That turned out to 8 be not correct; it was in Medina County. 9 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Are you talking whitetail or 10 exotics? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Whitetail. 12 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Whitetail. 13 MR. BOLLIER: What kind of disease did you say? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Chronic wasting disease, CWD. 15 MR. BOLLIER: What is that, Ray? 16 JUDGE POLLARD: Isn't this the one that has a lot 17 of breeding -- where the breeding process doesn't go through? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It kills them. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: It kills them. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They waste away; they quit 21 eating. 22 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's the way I am. 23 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Not transferable, is it, to 24 humans? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. No, it's not transferable 7-13-15 76 1 to humans, but there are medical concerns about it. So -- 2 but there will be -- I mean, the Parks and Wildlife is going 3 to be sending out -- we saw this morning some press releases 4 trying to educate everyone about it. It has been in the wild 5 in Hudspeth County in the mule deer population for a while; 6 been very contained in that area. But the one in Medina 7 County was at a deer breeding facility, which is of more 8 concern, so they're trying to track down all the deer that 9 are in and out of that facility. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So, where else in the state? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Hudspeth County has had mule 12 deer. The only one -- the whitetail is in Medina County. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Wow. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: If this was a breeding facility, 15 that probably means it was an imported deer from another 16 state. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right, but if any deer out 18 of -- are released to the wild, that's how it will get out, 19 and that's -- they're looking at this. You know, one of the 20 problems with the -- one of the key people in doing this is 21 our downstairs vet, Dr. Bob Dittmar. He's the state 22 veterinarian; he's very involved with some of the Austin -- 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: How does it transmit from deer 24 to deer? Do you know? 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not sure. 7-13-15 77 1 MS. BEATY: What about to other animals? 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't believe so. I think 3 it's primarily -- it may transmit to them -- it may not be 4 that bad. Or I'm not sure of the details of it, because -- 5 depending on the states, but it is something that -- I see 6 the papers are here. You know, I wouldn't write an article 7 based on what I just said. I'd wait, but there will be some 8 press releases coming out from Parks and Wildlife in the next 9 couple days. 10 COMMISSIONER REEVES: And I will say when we had a 11 brief scare that it was in Kerr County, Ray was the first one 12 notified, and he promptly notified both of us as his liaisons 13 about it. Then subsequently, we found out it was incorrect 14 that it was in Kerr County, and Ray kept us posted all along, 15 and he was keeping up on it. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And it was Dr. Wozniak, who was 17 here; he was the one who kind of, I think, caught that it was 18 wrong, because he said, hey, the odds of two cases with very 19 similar facts drew a red flag in his mind. He went and 20 started checking it, found out it was in Kerr and Medina 21 originally. Then he went back and checked and found out it 22 was only in Medina County, thank goodness. So, it's 23 potentially -- Medina County is not far, so -- but still, you 24 know, it's a good concern, and the public will be concerned 25 about it with hunting season, and hunting supports our 7-13-15 78 1 livelihood. But it doesn't impact -- even if you eat the 2 meat, they don't believe there's any impact to humans. I 3 mean, they recommend you don't if it's infested deer, but 4 it's -- it's just that it can hurt the deer population. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No kidding. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So that was it. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Is that what caused the mule 8 deer decline? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't know. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. Reports from elected 12 officials or department heads. Any? 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Just real quick. I did meet 14 with the architect last week; they're still working on plans 15 and changing things, just the preliminary stuff we do on the 16 jail expansion. We meet against next weekend in San Antonio 17 during the Sheriff's convention there, and it's just -- all 18 we're looking at at this point is just what's going to go 19 where and the feasibility, so they'll get through that, and 20 then they'll move on from there. A couple other things the 21 Judge and I talked about, just something the Court probably 22 ought to look at for the future. There is that corner piece 23 of property, about 5 acres or something, for sale there, and 24 as this county grows, you know, it's more and more risk -- 25 and as that jail grows, more and more risk and hazard of 7-13-15 79 1 hauling inmates all across town to the court. And I know 2 this courthouse, as tight as it is, for an investment in 3 future growth of courts and that, it may not be a bad idea to 4 just start looking at considering that purchase of that 5 corner property, 'cause once it goes, it's gone. 6 The only other thing that we ran into when we used 7 our communications trailer for the city, and something -- 8 just as somebody that's done RV'ing in an RV trailer the last 9 couple years, you have a lot of hookups at the Ag Barn for 10 these things coming in, but there's no place out there that 11 is even really like a single dump station out there. And I 12 think with more and more RV's, you're going to end up with 13 about 40 of them out there with hookups for water, but no 14 sewer. Most places like that add at least a single dump 15 station to where those trailers, when they get ready to 16 leave, if their black tanks fill up, they can just go over 17 there and dump it, with the water connection there where they 18 can rinse out those hoses. If you don't, just my experience 19 in 20 years, you're going to have a lot of gray water at 20 night dumped out on that parking lot around that Ag Barn, 21 'cause the black water doesn't fill up as quick, but that 22 gray water, people take their showers or anything else. And 23 I would just consider it, 'cause you can, in hooking those 24 up, put one single dump station so that when people are 25 leaving, they can dump. But if they're there and it fills 7-13-15 80 1 up, they can pull over to it and dump and go back to their 2 spot. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Charge a fee? Can you charge a 4 fee, or is that just built into your -- 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: A lot of them -- most RV 6 parks, anyplace you have it, it's built into your cost. 7 There's only one public dump station that I know of around 8 here, and that's the rest area out at the -- kind of the top 9 of the hill between Kerrville and Comfort; that has a dump 10 station in it. And it's not potable water. You use it to 11 rinse, like, gray water. It's at the 514 mile marker. I 12 think, just to save you problems, it's worth some investment 13 of just putting at least one dump station out there. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Ray, can you look into what 15 that cost might be? 16 COMMISSIONER REEVES: We could use -- as he said, 17 we don't have to use the water we're paying for. We've got 18 two large tanks -- 19 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. All this is is to wash 20 out their hose with it, 'cause nobody wants to put that hose 21 back in storage without rinsing it out. But it would just be 22 advisable to put one. 23 JUDGE POLLARD: Anybody else? Yes, sir? 24 MR. BOLLIER: Just to let y'all know what's going 25 on out at the jail, 18 months ago, we put in some new boilers 7-13-15 81 1 out there. We just discovered that one of our new boilers 2 was leaking. It's covered by warranty, so all it's going to 3 cost us is a little bit of labor to replace. So, that's all 4 I have. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: Anyone else? Reports from boards, 6 commissions, committees? City/County joint projects or 7 operations reports? Or other reports of any kind? If not, I 8 guess we'll go into executive session, then. Let me read all 9 this. The Commissioners Court reserves the right to adjourn 10 into executive session at any time to discuss any of the 11 above matters listed as permitted by law, including if they 12 meet the qualifications in Section 551.071, consultation with 13 attorney; 551.072, deliberation regarding real property; 14 551.073, deliberation regarding gifts; 551.074, personnel 15 matters; 551.078 - .085, deliberations involving individuals' 16 medical or psychiatric records; 551.076, deliberation 17 regarding security devices; 551.087, deliberation regarding 18 economic development negotiations; of Chapter 551 of the 19 Texas Government Code, including the following matters: 20 Consultation with County Attorney about pending and possible 21 litigation, personnel matters, deliberations regarding 22 economic development, and deliberations regarding real 23 property. 24 (The open session was closed at 10:53 a.m., and an executive session was held, the transcript of which 25 is contained in a separate document.) - - - - - - - - - - 7-13-15 82 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right, Judge. 2 COMMISSIONER REEVES: We're in recess till 1:30? 3 JUDGE POLLARD: Yes, sir. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We're in recess right now? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're in recess, yeah. 6 (Recess taken from 12:06 p.m. to 1:30 p.m.) 7 - - - - - - - - - - 8 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. It's 1:30 p.m., on -- 9 have to look up the date. I can't -- 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: The 13th. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: The 13th of July, and the Kerr 12 County Commissioners Court is back in open session. And at 13 this time, we're going to take up item -- the item dealing 14 with the -- it's the public hearing on the park rules and 15 regulations, Item 1.17 of the agenda. And we've had one, 16 two -- looks like about five or six people that have signed 17 up to talk in this public hearing. And I wish to advise you 18 that you're going to be each limited to three minutes, 19 because -- yes, sir? 20 MR. VANDERKAM: I didn't realize we had to sign up. 21 JUDGE POLLARD: That's all right. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You don't have to. 23 JUDGE POLLARD: You don't have to; I'll still let 24 you talk. 25 MR. VANDERKAM: Okay, thank you. 7-13-15 83 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: He's a lot nicer than I am. 2 MR. VANDERKAM: I know you. I know all about you. 3 (Laughter.) 4 JUDGE POLLARD: When it's your turn, I want you to 5 walk up to the podium, identify yourself by name first and 6 where you live, and -- and then your three minutes will start 7 then, and you'll be limited to three minutes. So, I guess 8 there'll be seven of you, 21 minutes. We're not doing this 9 just to be nasty to you. We've got all kinds of stuff to do 10 in court later this afternoon. We've got executive sessions 11 to go into. We don't have enough time, so I'm having to 12 limit it as much as possible to three minutes each. I 13 apologize for that. All right, I now declare the public 14 hearing open under Item 1.17 regarding park rules and 15 regulations, those wishing to speak. 16 (The regular Commissioners Court meeting was closed at 1:32 p.m., and a public hearing was held in open 17 court, as follows:) 18 P U B L I C H E A R I N G 19 JUDGE POLLARD: Who wants to come first? Why don't 20 you, Mr. Bob Waggener? I'll call you up first, because I 21 don't want to waste time on y'all arguing about who's coming 22 up. 23 MR. WAGGENER: Y'all just want to hear me talk 24 again, I guess, huh? 25 JUDGE POLLARD: Maybe so. Okay. 7-13-15 84 1 MR. WAGGENER: Yes, sir. My name is Bob Waggener, 2 and I'm a consulting geological engineer to the oil and gas 3 industry out in west Texas. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: Where do you live? 5 MR. WAGGENER: 2703 Bandera Highway. I live on 6 Flat Rock Lake. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, your three minutes is 8 beginning. 9 MR. WAGGENER: Okay. Last meeting, I supplied you 10 gentlemen with photos and evidence of the erosion on the lake 11 side of our property on Flat Rock Lake, and those should have 12 supplied you with some idea of what we're dealing with, with 13 boat wakes. Any questions on those photos? Do y'all still 14 have them? Probably not. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Mm-hmm. 16 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. 17 MR. WAGGENER: But, anyway, I -- just going through 18 this real quickly, then, is that as of this last July 4th is 19 that I would say that the jet -- jet skiers are still a 20 problem. They still are showing a lack of consideration to 21 the swimmers, the boaters and the fishermen, all of them 22 alike. They have no -- they have no idea how fast they're 23 going up and down that lake. And what I would also point out 24 is that this day I was here last talking to you gentlemen, 25 there was a fatality on Lake Nasworthy in San Angelo where a 7-13-15 85 1 jet skier hit a kayaker, killed him. This will happen on 2 Flat Rock Lake. It's not a question of if; it's just a 3 matter of when. So, what I am again proposing is a no-wake 4 lake, trolling motors only. And I would suggest this, and 5 I'm a big believer in accountability. And if these gentlemen 6 want the privilege of having motorcraft up and down this 7 lake, all right, I would give you gentlemen an absurd 8 proposal, but to make my point. Let them register when they 9 put their boats in. I want their names and addresses, all 10 right? Then each property owner on Flat Rock Lake can go to 11 their property and take a 16th of an inch off their front 12 property line each and every time. Absurd, yes, but my point 13 is we're losing land, and it's a safety issue both. So, I 14 appreciate your time. Thank you very much. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Thank you. 17 JUDGE POLLARD: You gave us something back. I 18 appreciate it. All right, how about Shirley O'Barr? 19 MS. O'BARR: I'm Shirley O'Barr, and I live at 2885 20 Bandera Highway. And I totally agree with what he just said. 21 The jet skiers get in front of our house and they just 22 circle, circle like this, and we have a constant wave against 23 our property all the time. And they have no respect for the 24 paddle-boarders out there, and they have no respect for them 25 at all. And skiing, I mean, that's totally ridiculous on 7-13-15 86 1 that size lake. There's no way they're going to be skiing. 2 There's stumps out in front of our house that are that far 3 under the water, that there's no way, at the speed that they 4 go, that they can see them. And I think that's about all I 5 have to say. 6 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That was a lot. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: Five seconds, all right. 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Thank you. 9 JUDGE POLLARD: Thank you, ma'am. Jack O'Barr? 10 MR. O'BARR: Well, I've got about the same thing. 11 Shirley O'Barr and I live at 2885 Bandera Highway on the 12 river there, and about the same thing. The guys with the 13 jet skis, that's the big problems. Those guys run up and 14 down that thing and have no regard for anything else other 15 than they want to ride that thing fast up and down through 16 there. And out across the lake across the channel there, 17 there's a shallow spot there, and I don't know how many times 18 I've saw boats out there that's stuck on that thing. They 19 don't know it's shallow. They have to get out, pull their 20 boats off. It's only about -- not even waist-deep there, but 21 they just -- the safety, I think, is the big thing. There's 22 a lot of rocks in this thing. There's a lot of stumps in 23 there, and it's -- like I say, it's just going to be a matter 24 of time till somebody on one of those jet skis, watercraft, 25 is going to get hurt bad. But the big thing for us is, of 7-13-15 87 1 course, we're losing shoreline. We've lost almost 8 feet 2 since we've lived there. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Wow. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: Thank you, sir. Peggy Branyon? 5 MS. BRANYON: I didn't come to speak this morning. 6 I'm Peggy Branyon. I live at 2987 Bandera Highway, right 7 next to the dam, the last house on Bandera Highway. It's 8 just very concerning. Everything Shirley and Jack have 9 mentioned is concerning to us, too. We think of the stumps 10 underneath, and I'm afraid there's going to be fatalities, 11 and it's a good thing to take care of things before they 12 happen, don't you think? I hope you will consider that. 13 Thank you. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: Thank you, ma'am. Allen Stern? 15 MR. STERN: My name is Allen Stern. I live at 2565 16 Bandera Highway. The dangers that they speak of are all 17 real, but it does also extend to the boats, because they can 18 go faster than the skidoos or whatever, and they choose to do 19 it right along the shoreline, because there's some depth 20 there. But I think the biggest problem you've got, and your 21 rules will be absolutely not worth anything if we have no 22 means of enforcement. There's got to be some way in which to 23 step up and stop someone from doing it with some authority. 24 If not, I'm afraid you're just wasting your time, but the -- 25 inevitably, somebody's going to get hurt. 7-13-15 88 1 JUDGE POLLARD: How many boats do you got, Sheriff? 2 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I don't have any. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: And, actually, you have to -- 5 and I'll speak real quick. We did get a lot of calls this 6 4th of July over jet skis. I don't know if some of these 7 people were the ones that called or not, but there are 8 numerous complaints always about jet skis. But when it comes 9 to enforcement, there is a special certification officers 10 have to have through Parks and Wildlife and Marine Safety and 11 everything that we've never had to have officers have that. 12 That does take extra training and everything else to get that 13 done, just the training and funding issue. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: Parks and Wildlife have some of 15 those people? 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Yes, all of their people are. 17 But, you know, normally you have to send local officers 18 through their courses to have that -- have the authority to 19 actually write those citations on the water, and then you do 20 have the issue that I don't think any kayak or seized canoe 21 we have is going to catch those jet skis, unless we wait for 22 them to come out. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Paddle faster, Rusty. 24 (Laughter.) 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Paddle faster. But that would 7-13-15 89 1 be an issue that we would have to be able to address to 2 adequately enforce them. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: To -- to even establish 4 something like that, does take it Parks and Wildlife -- 5 Rusty, do you know? -- approval? Or -- 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: It takes their approval. We 7 -- well, as far as the jet skis on the lake and whether 8 you -- I really don't know what Parks and Wildlife rules are. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Enforcement of the violations 11 takes a marine-certified officer to do, okay. Which Parks 12 and Wildlife -- this was several years ago when we looked at 13 it for any of that. Parks and Wildlife does offer that 14 training. It is an extensive training course that I would 15 have to send officers through, and only those officers are 16 allowed to actually enforce those rules. 17 JUDGE POLLARD: Thank you, sir. Yes, sir? 18 MR. VANDERKAM: I didn't make out a form, so now 19 that you've gotten through your list of people who made out 20 forms -- 21 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, hold on. There's one 22 other, Karen Hawkins. 23 MS. HAWKINS: Hi, my name is Karen Hawkins. I live 24 at 4995 Highway 27. My husband and I, we bought a set of 25 jet skis, and we are very law-abiding citizens. We got them 7-13-15 90 1 for our grandsons to use on the lake. My concern about 2 banning -- and we have instructed them carefully. And 3 they're good young men. We talked to the Parks and Wildlife 4 guy; he came out to the lake one day when we were out there 5 and asked if we knew the rules, and we were not aware of some 6 of the things that he shared with us. But we did instruct 7 the boys. And I take exception to the statement that all the 8 jet skiers do all these things, because we haven't operated 9 our jet skis irresponsibly. We've been very responsible in 10 the way that we've done it. My concern about banning them 11 from the lakes is, for us, we like to go out in the evening 12 for a couple of hours and take the kids out and then come 13 back. And if you ban it, then we're going to be put in the 14 position of taking all of our money out of the county; money 15 for gas, money for refreshments, and having to spend a night 16 in a hotel someplace else instead of just being able to take 17 a couple hours on the lake and have fun, okay. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: How long have you had your 19 jet skis? 20 MS. HAWKINS: We've only had them a year. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: A year, okay. 22 MS. HAWKINS: And we weren't out on the 4th of 23 July, if that makes any difference. 24 JUDGE POLLARD: Sir, you're up. 25 MR. VANDERKAM: Okay. Well, I'm going to be 7-13-15 91 1 opposed to the -- and despised by some of my neighbors there, 2 but my name is John Vanderkam, and I live 2849 Bandera 3 Highway, and I live on the lake as well. And the articles in 4 the newspaper, there's been some comparison with what we have 5 on Flat Rock Lake versus Nimitz Lake, which doesn't allow 6 power boats. And just to clear that up, the reason they 7 don't allow power boats on Nimitz Lake is because of the oil 8 residue and the City of Kerrville using that as a water 9 resource. So I think it's not a fair comparison to say what 10 Nimitz Lake is doing, we also should have that at Flat Rock 11 Lake. The other point I'd like to make is that any time you 12 come up with new regulations, which we're talking about here, 13 you got to use resources to enforce them. I can count on the 14 fingers of one hand how many boats in a week's time goes on 15 that lake. Granted, on the 4th of July, there were two jet 16 skis out there, and they were close to Jack and Shirley's 17 house making donuts. 18 MS. O'BARR: I wasn't talking about the 4th. 19 MR. VANDERKAM: Well, or the 5th, whenever it was. 20 It was the 4th or 5th. Anyway, there's not that much traffic 21 on there. I mean, as far as I know, there's been nobody 22 that's been killed or hurt on the lake. 23 MS. O'BARR: Not yet. 24 MR. VANDERKAM: That I know about, okay? Now, in 25 front of my house on Bandera Highway, we've had numerous 7-13-15 92 1 fatalities, so if you want to divert resources from 2 controlling Bandera Highway and the other traffic areas in 3 the county and put them on the lake to control maybe half a 4 dozen boats in a week's time, I think that's a waste. My 5 opinion -- excuse me. In my opinion, that lake is there for 6 everybody's enjoyment, and I think we ought to allow people 7 to use it the way they want to use it. Thank you. 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Thank you, John. 9 JUDGE POLLARD: Thank you. 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: One thing I might mention, and 11 I have not looked them up. Maybe it's something that we ask 12 one of the Parks and Wildlife officers to come over here. I 13 think there are some state rules to operating jet skis, or 14 that -- individual motorcraft I think is how they're 15 considered, and the distance from a bank and the distance 16 from a swimming area. I think there's already some state 17 laws in there. Since I don't do Parks and Wildlife, per se, 18 I don't -- I couldn't sit here and quote them to you, but I 19 know the game wardens could, okay. And it may be something 20 this Court wants to hear from some of them on what could be 21 done under the current state laws that may affect some of 22 this. And, of course, then we have the other issue that 23 currently, unfortunately, most of Parks and Wildlife, along 24 with D.P.S., are on rotating terms at the border. It just 25 leaves us fewer and fewer of those people in the county. 7-13-15 93 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Sheriff, would you mind having -- 2 asking or obtaining from Parks and Wildlife, somehow get us 3 some of those -- get those rules to us? 4 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I have no problem doing that, 5 or at least getting them to contact -- 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Ask them to come over. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: They can come over, but at least 8 get us a set of the rules. Do we have another public hearing 9 set for this? 10 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I can go see if there's any 11 available today, to stop by here. I just don't know, but 12 it's up to y'all. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think I would agree with 14 Commissioner Moser; I think we really need to try and get a 15 game warden over here so we have a little bit of dialogue 16 about who has authority over that water. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. I think that needs to 18 be established. 19 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. Is there anybody else that 20 wants to speak that hasn't spoken? All right, there being 21 none, I declare the public hearing closed. And thank y'all 22 very much for coming by. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We weren't going to take any 24 action today. This was just to listen. So, okay, thank 25 everybody. 7-13-15 94 1 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. 2 MR. VANDERKAM: I think I'll wait until the rest of 3 the people go out. (Laughter.) 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You may want to use our back 5 door. 6 MS. O'BARR: Thank you. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Thank you. Thank everybody. 8 (The public hearing was concluded at 1:44 p.m., and the regular Commissioners Court meeting was 9 reopened.) 10 - - - - - - - - - - 11 JUDGE POLLARD: Closed session now? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 13 (Multi-voice discussion off the record.) 14 THE REPORTER: Remember, there's a record. 15 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Tom, we're still online 16 here. She's still taking down -- 17 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I thought you had adjourned 19 us or something. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: No. No. All right, I think we're 21 going to go into executive session again, and close the open 22 session and go into executive session at this time. 23 (The open session was closed at 1:45 p.m., and an executive session was held, the transcript of which 24 is contained in a separate document.) 25 - - - - - - - - - - 7-13-15 95 1 (Open session resumed at 2:35 p.m.) 2 JUDGE POLLARD: Open session. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're back in open session now. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, executive session is 5 closed; we're back in open session. What is it, Sheriff? 6 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I have a few answers for 7 y'all, just for information on the Parks and Wildlife stuff. 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Uh-huh. 9 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Real quick. 10 JUDGE POLLARD: Real, real quick. 11 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. Water -- Parks and 12 Wildlife watercraft statewide rules are each occupant has to 13 wear a life jacket, like in a boat or a watercraft. Children 14 under 13 can't operate it without an 18-year-old. They can't 15 operate it within 50 feet of another watercraft, boat, shore, 16 or anything else. 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: 50 feet? 18 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: 50 feet, at any speed other 19 than head speed, they call it, just enough to keep your 20 steering, but no wake at all. There's a page and a half of 21 rules, okay. And I visited with a few of the people out in 22 the hallway, and most of these are rules they want. But the 23 problem is to enforce them, and this is where maybe it's my 24 fault; maybe it's whatever. It requires certified peace 25 officers from other agencies must be a marine safety 7-13-15 96 1 enforcement officer certified through the Texas Parks and 2 Wildlife in order to enforce recreational boating safety laws 3 on public waters in Texas and provisions of the Water Safety 4 Act. So, they would have to go through -- and I don't 5 remember what all it was. It was talked about, but they were 6 getting -- they'd have to be done in Austin. Some could be 7 done here, and it was, how are we going to do it? We're 8 going to send every officer through it? Every game warden is 9 already one. But that's what it would take -- 10 JUDGE POLLARD: That's an unfunded mandate from the 11 State. 12 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: -- to be able to enforce those 13 rules. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I think it would be 15 worthwhile if you'd look at getting someone trained. I think 16 a little bit of enforcement would likely go a long, long way. 17 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Well, it's just about having 18 somebody on each shift. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Doesn't have to be there all 20 the time. I'm just saying write a few tickets here so 21 somebody can respond. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: Has anybody approached Parks and 23 Wildlife to see if they can have some of their guys come over 24 and enforce it? 25 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: That's what you do. 7-13-15 97 1 That's -- it's their job. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: They've -- 3 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: The only -- what happens right 4 now, to be honest, this time of year, not just the border 5 safety, which we've all heard that's drained state agencies 6 drastically, but normally during this time of the year, they 7 were rotating them all through all the big lakes; Buchanan, 8 Canyon, Travis, you know, all those bigger lakes throughout 9 the state, where Kerrville doesn't really have that many. 10 So you have very few wardens that were ever around here this 11 time of year. They were trying to get them back in time for 12 hunting season, but this time of year it was really kind of 13 hard. And I can understand that with their manpower issues, 14 but it may be that this can work without any other issues 15 y'all want to address. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge? 17 JUDGE POLLARD: Maybe Parks and Wildlife will do 18 it. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I agree. But are we on 1.13? 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: See, I have one other 21 suggestion before we get off this. We ought to put -- 22 down at the boat ramp, we ought to put a summary of some of 23 those rules and regulations. 24 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Doesn't help if you can't 25 enforce them. 7-13-15 98 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I understand. It does help. 2 Just some people just don't know it. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Here's the rules. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right, yeah. Right. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: Hand out handouts. You know, 6 somehow put a box up, "Here are the rules. Take a copy and 7 study them," something like that. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Are we on 1.13, Judge? 9 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah, we are. I'm sorry. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make a motion that we 11 authorize expenditure of up to $3,000 to get -- for real 12 estate property appraisal, and authorize Commissioner Reeves 13 to coordinate same with the County Attorney. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I second. 15 JUDGE POLLARD: Been moved and seconded that 16 Commissioner Reeves be appointed as a representative of the 17 Court to arrange for expenditure not exceeding $3,000 to 18 obtain appraisals of property in question. Does that say it? 19 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Yes, sir. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. Any further discussion? 21 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, Mr. Reeves. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: I'm sorry, go ahead. 23 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you, Mr. Reeves. 24 COMMISSIONER REEVES: You're welcome, Mr. Baldwin. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: There being none, those in favor, 7-13-15 99 1 signify by raising your right hand. 2 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 4-0.) 3 JUDGE POLLARD: It's 4-0, unanimous. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: James? I thought I saw him. 5 That will come out of professional fees. Where'd he go? 6 We'll call him later. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Afternoon, sir. 9 MR. SPURGEON: Good afternoon. Good afternoon. 10 JUDGE POLLARD: How are you doing, sir? 11 MR. SPURGEON: I'm doing fine, Judge. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. And this one is -- 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 1.18. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: 1.18, order authorizing issuance, 15 sale, and delivery of up to $15 million in aggregate 16 principal amount of Kerr County, Texas limited tax bond 17 series 2015. Where's Brenda? Anybody else want to address 18 it? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Mr. Spurgeon is here. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: Mr. Spurgeon? 21 MR. SPURGEON: Judge, I'm happy to start, but I 22 think Dusty Traylor will be here. Have you talked to him? 23 Is he -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He's supposed to be here in one 25 minute. You have to fill in for him for one minute. 7-13-15 100 1 MR. SPURGEON: If he's here in one minute, I'm 2 going to step aside. But I guess I can start real quickly, 3 but he will have all the details with respect to the sale 4 that took place this morning. Part of the challenge with -- 5 and we appreciate your meeting this afternoon, 'cause I know 6 you did your business -- a lot of your business in the 7 meeting this morning, but there's a provision under Texas law 8 where counties can only levy a tax during a regular meeting. 9 And, you know, you can do -- you can recess and do things 10 like that, which is, I think, what you have done. But bonds 11 are actually priced this month, and then we need to have the 12 Court approve it today in order to finalize that from the 13 underwriters and those type of things. So, we appreciate 14 your waiting, because when you approve the order today, 15 you're essentially levying a tax to approve these -- to 16 approve the bonds that were voted by the people in the county 17 for the new jail. So, he'll have all the details. 18 I'm not sure if you have an actual order that was 19 given to you in your packets, but we had a draft of the order 20 out a week or so ago, something like that. The order I have 21 in front of you right now has all those final numbers in it, 22 and Dusty will tell you that the par amount of the bonds is 23 $13,925,000. It was premium generated in the sale. In fact, 24 if that's him coming, I'll let him finish that, but 25 ultimately you will have 15 million in your construction 7-13-15 101 1 fund, based on the issue price that was generated and those 2 type things. He'll give you all those details. I'll come 3 back, but everything he's going to tell you in terms of the 4 numbers will be put into your order for your consideration 5 later this afternoon. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And here he is. 7 MR. SPURGEON: Hello, Dusty. I just warmed them up 8 for you. 9 MR. TRAYLOR: I had no idea you already made it. 10 Man. 11 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Batter up. 12 MR. TRAYLOR: You might need to check his driving 13 speed. 14 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: (Fingers in ears.) La, la, 15 la, la. (Laughter.) 16 MR. SPURGEON: Once I hit Kerr County, I went down 17 to the speed limit. 18 MR. TRAYLOR: I bet you did. (Laughter.) Good 19 afternoon everybody. I don't know exactly how much 20 information you were able to give -- 21 MR. SPURGEON: Not a lot. 22 MR. TRAYLOR: -- the Court this afternoon. For the 23 record, my name is Dusty Traylor. I'm a director with RBC 24 Capital Markets. We're the financial adviser to the county, 25 and I feel like we have good news to report this afternoon. 7-13-15 102 1 We were able to get out into the market to sell the bonds 2 this morning for the county, 15 -- the $15 million voted 3 bonds that you have for your project. And the all-in fixed 4 interest rate on this is 3.717 percent, so basically 5 3.72 percent. That is the -- that's the rate on this when 6 you factor in all the costs to issue it. We are depositing a 7 full $15 million into the County's project fund, so the 8 issuance cost and things like that are generated from the 9 investors with a premium, but the actual par amount of bonds, 10 the printed amount of these bonds will actually be 11 $13.925 million. The investors are paying a premium of 12 approximately just under $1.3 million for the bonds, and 13 that's very common in the marketplace today, that investors 14 are paying premiums for bonds. But this does complete the 15 entire voting authorization of putting the $15 million into 16 your project account. 17 I worked very closely with -- with Brenda and her 18 team to get a preliminary official statement put together and 19 visit with the rating agencies. They affirmed the County's 20 double-A bond rating, and that is -- you know, you guys got a 21 double-A rating last year, and that double-A rating probably 22 helps your interest rate to the tune of not quite one-quarter 23 of one percent, but maybe, you know, somewhere just shy of 24 one-quarter of one percent it reduces your interest rate, so 25 that saves the county thousands and thousands of dollars over 7-13-15 103 1 the life of this issue. I was looking this -- this afternoon 2 right as we finished the pricing. Total debt service on this 3 issue if we, you know, keep it at its current -- current form 4 all the way to the 20-year life is $21.88 million. I was 5 going back and looking at what our projections were when we 6 ran these numbers in January. Those projections were 7 $23.6 million. So, over the life of the issue, you're 8 already -- the overall total cost of this project is down by 9 about $1.75 million. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Already making money. 11 MR. TRAYLOR: There you go. So -- 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, just keep holding off, 13 then; we're making money. 14 MR. TRAYLOR: Sure. 15 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We're making money; let's keep 17 holding off. 18 MR. TRAYLOR: All in all, we're very pleased with 19 the sale. Congratulations to the County. We think it's very 20 good, and are exited for you to be able to get going on this 21 project. The money, once Tom works the bonds through the 22 A.G.'s office, should be available and in the County's 23 account on August the 11th. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Dusty, when was the -- the rate 25 seemed higher than I recall our last issue being. 7-13-15 104 1 MR. TRAYLOR: Yes. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What was the last issue? Do 3 you recall? 4 MR. TRAYLOR: It was in the 2's, I believe. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, it was less than 3. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: 2.6 or 2.8. 7 MR. TRAYLOR: Something like that. I would have to 8 go back and look. I think there are a couple things that 9 factor into that. One, I believe that issue was a little bit 10 -- was a little bit shorter. Two, that deal was in a 11 bank-qualified environment. You get different interest rates 12 if you're going to sell less than $10 million in a calendar 13 year. That provides about 50 basis points right there. And 14 then secondly, rates have crept up here since the beginning 15 of April in anticipation of the fed making its first interest 16 rate move, so we've experienced some of that. So, that's -- 17 those are the things that contribute to that. But, you know, 18 we're talking 20-year bonds here. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. So -- 20 MR. TRAYLOR: Little bit longer. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- term is part of it? 22 MR. TRAYLOR: Absolutely. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Thank you. 25 MR. TRAYLOR: Thank you. Anything else? 7-13-15 105 1 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Did you come up here on a 2 motorcycle? 3 MR. TRAYLOR: I did not. 4 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: But Bob still -- this one 5 here, is he riding one? 6 MR. SPURGEON: No, I am not. 7 MR. TRAYLOR: Oh, really? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Bob's the only one that 9 drinks too much? 10 MR. TRAYLOR: Yeah, absolutely. My wife won't let 11 me own one. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: To get this, there was a 13 questionnaire filled out. The Auditor asked me a question as 14 the County Judge and in charge of the budget: "Do you intend 15 to balance the budget?" A zero budget. And it had a lot to 16 do, I understand, with the background for all these people 17 bidding on it. And I was -- gave my word, we are going to 18 come down to a zero balanced budget. We've got to now. 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Since you obligated us. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: Well, I had to. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I'm kidding. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: I had to for this deal, okay? All 23 right. 24 MR. SPURGEON: Judge, just to get the action today, 25 the numbers that Dusty's gone through, we put in the order. 7-13-15 106 1 Your maturity schedule starts in 2017. February 15 in 2017 2 will be the first principal payment date. You'll be paying 3 interest beginning on February 15, 2016, and the final 4 maturity is 2035. So, just to give a little ballpark, you'll 5 see interest rates range from about 3.125 percent, kind of in 6 the -- sort of the middle maturity schedule, down to 7 5 percent, but because of the premiums generated, it all kind 8 of goes back to that. As Dusty was saying, you have a net 9 effect of about 3.7 percent overall cost to the county. And 10 the order itself awards the sale of the bonds to your 11 underwriter, authorizing the levy of the tax, approves the 12 official statement, approves your paying registrar agreement 13 with B.O.K.F., which is a bank actually out of Austin, and 14 essentially that's it. But as Dusty said also, this just 15 totally exhausts your voting authorization. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Totally exhausts what? 17 MR. TRAYLOR: Your voting authorization. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Who bought the bonds? 19 MR. TRAYLOR: The underwriter -- the two 20 underwriters on the transaction were Frost Bank and Samco 21 Capital Markets, two very active players in the municipal 22 markets. And this is -- as I went down the list -- I've 23 actually got it on me of actually who bought those bonds. 24 One of the most active buyers that I saw today is pretty 25 interesting; it was First National Back of Abilene, Texas. 7-13-15 107 1 Kind of a little bit of a surprise. Normally on a 2 transaction like this, we would see State Farm or U.S.A.A. or 3 things like that. It was a regional bank that carried the 4 day. 5 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: So, do we have -- did y'all 6 have a printed order or something? What -- 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Jody? 8 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: We have it? This one? Is 9 that -- 10 MS. GRINSTEAD: You just wanted a printed one. 11 MR. SPURGEON: That's the one that's complete 12 there. 13 MS. GRINSTEAD: Yeah, that Kathy sent about 14 2 o'clock this afternoon. 15 MR. SPURGEON: There is a printed order with all 16 the final numbers; I think the Judge is looking through it 17 now. 18 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: I'll bet you some lawyers 19 had ahold of that. 20 MR. SPURGEON: The details are on Page 3 in terms 21 of principal amount and interest rate. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah, but I'm looking for the 23 signature. 24 MR. SPURGEON: Oh, the signature. That will be 25 right past Page 29. 7-13-15 108 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Past Page 29. I'm still on 13. 2 MR. SPURGEON: Okay. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: Long way to go. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: He's a lawyer; he looks at 5 every page. 6 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. Is there going to -- do we 7 need a motion or something to do this, or we've already done 8 it? For me to sign it? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We need a motion, don't we? 10 MR. SPURGEON: Yes, you do need a motion to approve 11 the order. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: Is there a motion? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Motion -- what's the -- 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: There should be verbiage. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: What's the front page -- what's 16 it say right there? I make a motion to pass the order 17 authorizing issuance, sale, and delivery of $13,925,000 in -- 18 do I have to read the whole thing? 19 MR. SPURGEON: You don't have to. It's -- 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Et cetera. 21 MR. SPURGEON: -- issuance of those general 22 obligations. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Of general obligation bonds. 24 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: Second. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. There's been a motion 7-13-15 109 1 made and seconded to authorize the issuance, sale, and 2 delivery of 13.925 million aggregate principal amount of Kerr 3 County, Texas limited tax bond series 2015. Is there any 4 further discussion? 5 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Only discussion is, I'd like 6 to ask -- I know what we gave at public hearings, and what we 7 talked about was the 1.74, or one and three-quarter cent tax 8 increase for the debt. Is that what this ad valorem tax 9 increase for debt service will be? I'd hate for it to be 10 more when that's what we told the public. 11 MR. TRAYLOR: In this notice this initial year, the 12 I & S tax rate associated with just the issuance of the debt 13 should be an increase of 1.75 cents. That's -- we ran those 14 numbers. 15 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: I'm saying can this -- 16 MR. TRAYLOR: In this year. Now, that's -- you've 17 got the $800,000 estimated operating expenses that are going 18 to come online when it is open, and that's 2018, but if 19 you're just looking at the increase associated with issuance 20 of the bonds for the project, the I & S tax needed is one and 21 three-quarters. 22 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Okay. That's what we 23 presented to the public, was one and three-quarters, and I 24 just wanted to make sure that's what this is. 25 COMMISSIONER REEVES: One and three-quarter cent to 7-13-15 110 1 amortize the bonds throughout the entire term? 2 MR. TRAYLOR: Correct. 3 COMMISSIONER REEVES: So we don't have to go up on 4 the tax rate. 5 MR. TRAYLOR: Right. You should be able to handle 6 the one and three-quarter cents as it relates to the 7 amortization of the bonds, yes. 8 COMMISSIONER REEVES: If values remain -- no 9 change. 10 MR. TRAYLOR: Right. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And for the record, this is 12 for the expansion of the jail. 13 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: That's correct. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Kerr County jail. That wasn't 15 stated, so okay. 16 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Right. Because in the public 17 forum, as you know, the 2.92-cent or whatever it was that was 18 projected for maintenance and operations to come in later, 19 the public was informed of that. 20 MR. TRAYLOR: Right. 21 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: But the actual increase in 22 taxes for what was voted on and what we presented was the one 23 and three-quarter cent. 24 MR. TRAYLOR: That's correct. 25 SHERIFF HIERHOLZER: Thank you. 7-13-15 111 1 (Low-voice discussion off the record.) 2 JUDGE POLLARD: Becky's got to sign it too. All 3 right. Is there -- there's been a motion made. Any further 4 discussion? 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Is there a second? 6 JUDGE POLLARD: It's been seconded. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 8 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. There being no further 9 discussion, those in favor of the motion, signify by raising 10 your right hand. 11 (The motion carried by unanimous vote, 4-0.) 12 JUDGE POLLARD: It's 4-0, unanimous, and I will 13 sign it. 14 COMMISSIONER BALDWIN: You don't want to vote on 15 that? 16 JUDGE POLLARD: No. County Clerk's supposed to 17 sign it, too. 18 MR. SPURGEON: Judge, I have actually a number of 19 execution copies for you. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: You've got the original? 21 MR. SPURGEON: Pardon? 22 JUDGE POLLARD: You've got the original? 23 MR. SPURGEON: Yes, sir, I do. I have a number of 24 signature pages for that and some other documents, yes, sir. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: Anything else now for -- 7-13-15 112 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No. 2 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're done. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: We're done. We're adjourned here. 5 (Commissioners Court adjourned at 2:51 p.m.) 6 - - - - - - - - - - 7 8 STATE OF TEXAS | 9 COUNTY OF KERR | 10 The above and foregoing is a true and complete 11 transcription of my stenotype notes taken in my capacity as 12 official reporter for the Commissioners Court of Kerr County, 13 Texas, at the time and place heretofore set forth. 14 DATED at Kerrville, Texas, this 16th day of July, 2015. 15 16 REBECCA BOLIN, Kerr County Clerk 17 BY: _________________________________ Kathy Banik, Deputy County Clerk 18 Certified Shorthand Reporter 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 7-13-15