1 1 2 3 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS' COURT 4 Special Session 5 Monday, July 16, 2018 6 8:30 a.m. 7 Commissioners' Courtroom 8 Kerr County Courthouse 9 Kerrville, Texas 78028 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 PRESENT: TOM POLLARD, Kerr County Judge TOM MOSER, Commissioner Pct. 2 25 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Pct. 3 BOB REEVES, Commissioner Pct. 4 2 1 I-N-D-E-X 2 NO. PAGE 3 1.1 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 3 action to approve Order Requesting 4 Financial Assistance from the Texas Water Development Board relating to the 5 Center Point/East Kerr County Wastewater System authorizing the filing of two 6 applications for financial assistance and making certain findings in connection 7 therewith. 8 1.2 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 5 action to approve proposed first amendment 9 to the Interlocal Agreement between Kerr County, Texas and the City of Kerrville, 10 Texas for the provision of Animal Control services within the City of Kerrville, 11 Texas, and services of the Butt-Holdsworth Memorial Library for residents of Kerr 12 County. 13 *** Adjournment. 42 14 *** Reporter's Certificate. 43 15 * * * * * * 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 3 1 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, it's Monday, July 2 the 16th, 2018, it's 8:30 a.m. We have a posted agenda 3 this morning, just a special one. We'll get right to 4 it. No preamble stuff with it this morning. 5 Item 1.1 consider, discuss and take 6 appropriate action to approve Order Requesting Financial 7 Assistance from the Texas Water Development Board 8 relating to the Center Point/East Kerr County Wastewater 9 System authorizing the filing of two applications for 10 financial assistance and making certain findings in 11 connection therewith. Commissioner Letz. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, Judge, at the last 13 meeting, everyone will probably remember, we authorized, 14 I think, yourself, myself and Commissioner Moser to sign 15 a lot of documents. One of the documents that came in 16 late that we looked at is a court order, and after 17 visiting with you, and our outside legal counsel Tom 18 Spurgeon it was pretty much unanimous that that 19 authorization did not cover us passing court orders. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: Right. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So the purpose of being 22 here today is just actually to approve a court order 23 that pretty much is exactly what was read in the agenda 24 item. 25 So I'll make motion that we approve the 4 1 Court Order as presented by our outside counsel Tom 2 Spurgeon, and authorize the County Judge to sign same. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: Is there a second? 4 COMMISSIONER REEVES: I'm assuming it's the 5 one in the packet. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh, there it is. Yeah, 7 it's the one in there. 8 COMMISSIONER REEVES: I second. 9 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, it's been moved 10 by Commissioner Precinct 3, seconded by Commissioner 11 Precinct 4 pursuant to item 1.1 on the agenda and that 12 is to -- I'll read that caption again. Consider, 13 discuss and take appropriate action to approve order 14 requesting financial assistance from the Texas Water 15 Development Board relating to the Center Point/East Kerr 16 County Wastewater System authorizing the filing of two 17 applications for financial assistance, and making 18 certain findings in connection therewith. Is there any 19 further comment or discussion? There being none, those 20 in favor of the motion signify by raising your right 21 hands. It's three zero, unanimous. 22 Let the record reflect that Commissioners 23 from Precincts 1 and 2 are absent today, away on 24 vacation, I believe. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: One of them's working. 5 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Pardon. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think one of them's 3 working supposedly. 4 JUDGE POLLARD: One's working? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner Belew's on 6 the radio. 7 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. Item 1.2 on the 8 agenda consider, discuss and take appropriate action to 9 approve proposed first amendment to the Interlocal 10 Agreement between Kerr County, Texas and the City of 11 Kerrville, Texas for the provision of Animal Control 12 services within the City of Kerrville, Texas, and 13 services of the Butt-Holdsworth Memorial Library for 14 residents of Kerr County. Commissioner Letz. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes. At our last 16 meeting we authorized the County Attorney to prepare an 17 amendment to that, or proposed amendment to that 18 agreement based on some documentation and information we 19 presented at that meeting. She has done so, and I think 20 everybody has a copy of that. I think everyone on the 21 Court also received a copy or received an email from 22 Reagan Givens, and based on his -- and I've talked with 23 him as well. Based on that made a revision to the hours 24 slightly. Went back -- instead of going from 9 to 5, 25 went back to 8 to 5 as the amendment, which was the way 6 1 it originally was, and the other really significant 2 change is we called for being open evenings and 3 Saturdays, and that provision we basically changed to be 4 on a trial basis for two months and to see how it works. 5 The concern that Reagan had on that was 6 primarily a staffing issue. If we're only going to go 7 up one on the staff, he still doesn't have the staff to 8 do that, and how you work -- you know, work that into a 9 schedule will be difficult, and also questionable how 10 helpful it really is both on the pet adoption side and 11 on the -- and whether we get more surrenders in than 12 adoptions taken out. But I haven't talked to Reagan 13 since I sent out an email, and over the weekend about 14 the trial basis. Is that something you think may work? 15 MR. GIVENS: To try out the new scheduling? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, to try out -- did 17 you see the email I sent out over the weekend? 18 MR. GIVENS: I was just looking at them. 19 Sorry I'm late. I thought this was at 9. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I thought it was at 9, 21 too. Go ahead and hand this to Reagan and let him -- 22 JUDGE POLLARD: Take a minute to read it 23 Reagan and then comment. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And just some general 25 things that -- just make a comment. The reason to me is 7 1 it's important to really want to rush this through a 2 little bit -- not rush it, we've been talking about it 3 for two months, but I'd like to get something to the 4 City as a formal agreement that twofold, one and main 5 reason is the current 24 hour -- or 24/7 system is about 6 to kill that department. I mean they are having real 7 real difficulties right now. Just to give everyone a 8 little bit of a guideline, I talked to the Sheriff a 9 little -- oh, a couple weeks ago, about staffing. And I 10 said Rusty, how many people, you know, if you're going 11 to be on 24/7, how many people does that take? For one 12 24/7 slot it takes 5 employees. We have 5 total Animal 13 Control Officers. They are just being run ragged right 14 now. And that is the reason, in my opinion, and I think 15 in Reagan's that we're getting a lot of the complaints 16 because we just don't have the time to do anything, 17 because based on that agreement, we're on -- I mean it 18 doesn't work. You can't have 5 employees, 5 Animal 19 Control Officers, working 24/7 and then try to get them 20 on call extra during the day. So the result has been a 21 decrease in service countywide, including the city 22 limits, which is the exact opposite I think than what 23 the City of Kerrville actually wanted in the agreement. 24 So it is to me very important that we get this to the 25 City to try to at least get that one provision changed 8 1 ASAP. The rest of it is not as critical. 2 MR. GIVENS: I like this. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Does that work? 4 MR. GIVENS: Yes. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We'll change it to go -- 6 that's why this is really important, that's why I put it 7 on this special agenda in addition to the other items we 8 had to do today. And I think that the -- you know, my 9 goal would be that we send this to the Mayor and City 10 Council today or tomorrow and hopefully the Council have 11 it on there agenda for next next Tuesday. So they can 12 have some, you know, guidance to us as to how we can 13 proceed, because we can't continue the way we are. It's 14 just flat impossible. 15 If not, my recommendation will be if we 16 don't get some kind of help from the City at their 17 Council meeting next week, I think we just cancel the 18 agreement and start over, because we can't continue 19 24/7. I mean that's just the way it is. So that's kind 20 of why I've -- pushing it a little bit to get it 21 through. And I had a -- I haven't visited by phone, but 22 I did visit by email with the City Manager and pretty 23 much told him that. I said this isn't, you know, in my 24 mind is that this proposed amendment it's not set in 25 stone, it's not a take it or leave it. This is what we 9 1 want, and if the City wants to counter it in some way, 2 that's fine. It's not -- you know, I just want to get 3 the whole process moving as quick as we can to help that 4 staff out there, which is being run ragged right now. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: Is part of this that 6 $50,000.00 contribution from the City? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, that's included in 8 here, and you know, I'm not going to speak for the City 9 on that, but my indication was they didn't want to spend 10 anything. But I'll leave that to the City to answer 11 that. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: Yeah. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But I'm more concerned 14 about the staffing right now, the safety of our 15 employees and safety of the public, that's my biggest 16 concern. I'm looking through here there's a -- do you 17 have the letter? 18 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Which letter? 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The letter for the Judge 20 to -- 21 JUDGE POLLARD: To sign on it. It's 22 probably in the agenda package here that I have. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 24 (Off the record.) 25 COMMISSIONER REEVES: While we're looking 10 1 for that, I'd like to say that -- and it may have been 2 said last week but I will say it again, that Mr. Givens, 3 its true that the last shift of the day 8 p.m. in the 4 dark hours, there are very few calls going out. 5 MR. GIVENS: Very few. 6 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Very few looking at 7 graphs you had provided. 8 MR. GIVENS: Yes, Sir. 9 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Whereas we would still 10 have services available, just on an on-call basis, is 11 that correct? 12 MR. GIVENS: Yes. Any call that would need 13 to be ran will be from 8 p.m. until 8 a.m. would be run 14 by an on-call, which we had done in the past and that 15 was not -- it was done very well. There was no problems 16 with that. There was -- I'm unaware of any time where 17 we didn't have somebody answer the phone. They have a 18 list of all our numbers. If there's some reason why 19 they can't get ahold of one, they'll call either me or 20 another one, and we'll get somebody there. But it's my 21 understanding also that we haven't really had much of an 22 increase in response time either. 23 But I think the important thing to remember 24 here is that we're not -- in the middle of the night 25 we're not responding to any emergency situations. 11 1 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Any emergency? 2 MR. GIVENS: It's not really any emergency; 3 it's when either a PD offersr or Sheriff's deputy has 4 somebody arrested and they're just going to pick up the 5 animal. So it's not a -- we're talking about a 6 difference of maybe five or ten minutes. 7 COMMISSIONER REEVES: And the other part of 8 it you feel we, with our staff, by moving this to 8 to 8 9 will provide better service in the long run? 10 MR. GIVENS: Yes. Because we have been 11 getting a lot of complaints from citizens in Kerrville 12 and in the County about our response times. And a lot 13 of that it's really bad in the summer because we end up 14 going out on a lot of trap calls, and if these animals 15 stay in traps for too long, they die. Skunks, raccoons, 16 it's very bad for them. We tell people try to put it in 17 the shade. We'll get multiple calls through the day 18 where are y'all. We're on our way, sorry. But if we 19 had somebody right now -- if we have one of the Animal 20 Control officers going on vacation, or if they're sick, 21 then there's just one Monday through Friday running all 22 these calls. And then they've got other calls 23 intertwined in between. Maybe aggressive dog or dog at 24 large, bites, things like that that these animals -- 25 basically what happens is myself and Deputy Lange end up 12 1 going out and running some calls, which is not a huge 2 problem, but it is if we have got other things going on, 3 too. 4 As far as the -- right now there's two 5 Monday through Friday, two officers on during the day. 6 The plan that I want to implement as far as scheduling 7 goes would put three officers on duty Monday through 8 Friday through those major parts of the day whenever 9 we're most busy. And then would also have two Animal 10 Control officers during the day on the weekend from 8 to 11 8 as well, so seven days a week. And then we'll have at 12 least two on, and of course anytime somebody goes on 13 vacation or is sick that's -- that's a thing, but we can 14 still -- we've been doing it with one on the weekends 15 and that has not been a huge issue, but we have run into 16 a few situations where we've gone out on a call, had an 17 aggressive dog, the Police Department has been unable to 18 come assist because they're busy, so that's a public 19 safety issue that we wouldn't have had quite as big a 20 problem with if I would have had another officer that 21 could have responded there, too. Because as it was 22 another officer still had to come out and they got -- 23 they ended up getting comp time because they had to go 24 help, because nobody else could go help. 25 COMMISSIONER REEVES: And this is a 13 1 dangerous dog situation? 2 MR. GIVENS: Yes, Sir. And that was on 3 Saturday, I believe. A Saturday or Sunday. But police 4 department didn't have anybody they could send and so it 5 was dangerous. This will eliminate a lot of that. This 6 will also help these guys during the week. We can get 7 those animals faster, we're going to cut down on 8 complaints, we're going to cut down on response times. 9 To be able to have that third officer during the week is 10 pivotable. It's very very important to have that. 11 COMMISSIONER REEVES: And last year your 12 staff increased? 13 MR. GIVENS: Yes, Sir. 14 COMMISSIONER REEVES: But because of your 15 scheduling the amount of availability during peak 16 hours -- 17 MR. GIVENS: Dropped. 18 COMMISSIONER REEVES -- dropped. 19 MR. GIVENS: Yes, Sir. 20 COMMISSIONER REEVES: So you feel that -- I 21 like the agreement. I'm not quite as far out to say 22 let's chunk it, but I would like -- I think this is a 23 very good starting point, and it's the same as any 24 contract negotiation. This is what we feel is best, I 25 think we need to move forward. I see our friends from 14 1 across the street. Do they want to add anything to 2 this? We are friends, aren't we? 3 COUNCILMAN BAROODY: Yeah. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: At the beginning of the 5 meeting. 6 COUNCILMAN BAROODY: No, I don't have any 7 real questions. When the agreement changed, when we 8 went to the new agreement, I think you were just hitting 9 on it. So you guys actually modified down your number 10 of daytime staff, is that it? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, we had three 12 Animal Control Officers that worked 8 to 5, 5 days a 13 week. So with vacations and all that you end up with 14 two to three on call during the day. We added the two, 15 but when you go to a 24/7 shift that takes 5 employees 16 right there. So all of a sudden the agreement said we 17 had to have 5 to do that, so that's where the problem 18 came. And you know it's basically cutting that back to 19 12 hours a day seven days a week, what proposed is, and 20 then adding one officer, which will help alleviate some 21 other issues on adoptions and things. So right now 22 those 5 that we have are also handling other functions 23 and we're trying to get those separated by adding one 24 more Animal Control officer. 25 COMMISSIONER REEVES: And in the dark hours 15 1 there wasn't that many calls during the graveyard shift, 2 whatever you want to call it. 3 COUNCILMAN BAROODY: Because I recall it 4 being -- what was the reason that we went to that? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To what, the 24/7? 6 COUNCILMAN BAROODY: Yeah. Wasn't it 7 supposed to be helping the police department in some 8 form? 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 10 COUNCILMAN BAROODY: That's not necessary, I 11 guess? 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're still on call, but 13 there are very few calls during the night hours. 14 MR. GIVENS: I've had weeks where my night 15 officer has not even had a call. They've worked 36 to 16 48 hours in a week and not had a single call. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Now, they're still on 18 call. If the Kerrville Police needs them, they're on 19 call. It's just a matter -- and the reality is that 20 most of our -- and even during the week if they could be 21 on patrol, you know, it would be one part of town and 22 they're needed somewhere else it still may take them 15, 23 20 minutes to get there, and if they're on call they can 24 also get there that quick anyway. 25 COUNCILMAN BAROODY: We might be overstating 16 1 the need when we entered into this agreement, at night. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. And the City 3 Manager, I visited with him, Rob(sic) and I did -- 4 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Bob. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He didn't have a problem 6 changing that part of it but, you know -- 7 JUDGE POLLARD: When we made this agreement 8 with the City, I went along with it because I felt like 9 that we oughta pay our fair share of the cost of the 10 library and get the county residents back where they can 11 use the library. Since that time we put some provisions 12 in there where we could study, try it for a while and 13 study it for a while. And since that time and listening 14 to Reagan and seeing what's happening here is pretty 15 apparent that we're probably going to end up having to 16 hire about maybe three more -- 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Did you start early? 18 JUDGE POLLARD: -- to provide the services 19 that everybody wants to furnish. So I go back to the 20 hey, are we paying too much that we -- we may be totally 21 funding the library here by doing this, and I don't 22 think it's fair, you know. And I want to focus on that 23 cost situation. And I would like Reagan to do some 24 calculations, if you would, in your spare time. You 25 know you don't have any. But I want to know what it 17 1 cost us to provide these services for the City. Keep in 2 mind now that I think the statute requires us to provide 3 rabies control throughout the County and that includes 4 in the City, okay? So I think we need to calculate how 5 many calls you get, segregate them, how many are from 6 the City, how many are from the County, and then 7 segregate out those that are from the City that are 8 rabies control, because we gotta furnish that anyway. 9 We're getting paid taxes throughout the county to do all 10 of that. And that's going to come up with a net figure. 11 Then whatever that is we multiply that into our budget, 12 total budget, on animal control and I think we're going 13 to find that we're getting screwed big time on this 14 thing, and the county's(sic) coming way the hell out 15 ahead on it, and I want to look at it hard, and I want 16 to push it, and we're going to have to redo this thing, 17 in my opinion, okay? It's just gotta be fair. If it's 18 not fair, (slamming hand), I want to chop it, stop it. 19 Is that clear? 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I apologize for being 21 late. I thought it was at 9 o'clock, sorry. Just drove 22 in from Taos, New Mexico last night. And I heard 23 there's a discussion going on in here, and I said wow I 24 can't believe they're in there discussing that. 25 May I chime in on this? 18 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Chime in. Help yourself. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Let me go back. I 3 don't know what's been said but I can read about it 4 later. There is, as we all know, we looked at combining 5 our -- or providing services to the City with Animal 6 Control, City provides library services, okay? We said 7 we'd look at it after a period, after three months, and 8 see how it was going, we did that. I think in some of 9 the things and I've read some of Reagan's stuff, I think 10 he is overloaded, okay, independent probably of the 11 City, okay, in taking on additional stuff. I think he's 12 overloaded. I think that with that said, okay. I also 13 know -- and I don't know if this has been discussed, but 14 I know that the use of the people outside the City for 15 the library has increased significantly. Maybe this was 16 discussed awhile ago, but 41 percent as of last week, I 17 believe, in -- Councilman Baroody can probably expand on 18 that, but 41 percent of everything taken out of the 19 library as of last week was outside of the City. A year 20 ago it was 33 -- last year, a year ago, it was 33 21 percent, so it is increasing significantly. 22 Significantly. I don't know if the other Commissioners 23 do, but I get a lot -- a lot of thank you's, okay, from 24 everybody outside the city who use that. 25 I think what we need to do is look at the 19 1 situation today and is I think we need to take a group 2 of people from the County, two Commissioners from the 3 County, and Reagan, two whoever the City wants -- 4 JUDGE POLLARD: Don't exclude the Judge on 5 that. 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, let me just keep 7 it so that we don't have to have -- so we can have a 8 working group, okay. So we can have a working group on 9 that and look at both of these institutions as to what 10 it is. Now, we're talking about prices. The thing, you 11 know, if we pro rata the cost of the library, and I'm 12 not advocating the library, I'm just saying we need to 13 bulk look at what our cost situations are. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: I agree. 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: If you pro rata the 41 16 percent it's like $379,000.00, something like that. So 17 they are also going to show a need to increase. So what 18 environment do we have to look at this cost thing. The 19 budgets, okay? We need to totally look at our budget, 20 City needs to totally look at their budget, and see 21 where we are and how we come together. I don't think 22 it's we versus them, I don't agree with that at all, 23 okay. I don't think the county's getting screwed. I 24 don't think the city's getting screwed, because I don't 25 know. You don't know. 20 1 JUDGE POLLARD: Well, I got suspicions. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The public's getting 3 screwed right now, Commissioner. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I don't know. And I 5 don't know that that's true. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, I deal and 7 talk with Reagan and his staff on a daily basis; I don't 8 think you do. We don't have time to go for a long drawn 9 out let's renegotiate and talk on that. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Oh, no I agree. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We need to make a change 12 within the next two weeks to relieve his staff, period. 13 JUDGE POLLARD: And I agree with that. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And talk it out with 15 the City. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean I'm glad to talk 17 to the City. I don't want to cancel the agreement, I 18 don't want to get out of the library; I want to help our 19 employees -- 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Good. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- to be able to do 22 their job, and they can't do it right now. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, we ought to do 24 that, okay. I agree a hundred percent. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But there's an 21 1 agreement, we have a contract. We can't unilaterally 2 change things unless the City allows us, or agrees to 3 it. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We have an Interlocal 5 Agreement that we can amend. This thing's proposed here 6 is to amend it from the county's perspective. What we 7 need to do -- what we need to do -- and let's do it in a 8 week, okay? Not two weeks, let's do it in a week. Sit 9 down with the City and the County and figure out what we 10 need to do for our Interlocal Agreement. Took a long 11 time to develop. It is a very, very strong positive 12 thing that Interlocal Agreement. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We've met with the City. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I haven't. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, go talk to them, 16 go meet with them. 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Let's talk about -- 18 let's talk about the same way we did it before. Let's 19 talk about the Library and Animal Control at the joint 20 meeting. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Why can't we talk about 22 it between this body and let that body talk about it. 23 Why do we -- 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And then you go -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We have open -- 22 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: -- talk -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- meetings 3 requirements. 4 THE REPORTER: One at a time, please. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Why can't we talk about 6 both of them at the same time? 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't want to change 8 anything at the library. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, I don't -- but 10 they might want to change something. So therefore, why 11 do this, what we can do? Well, we're going to go look 12 at it from Animal Control, and I agree with everything 13 Reagan says and what his needs. City's going to do that 14 and they're going to come back and say well, let's look 15 at this change, let's look at your change. Why don't we 16 look at them together and see if we can't find a ground, 17 okay, where we can move forward just like we have in 18 place right now. You're looking at it through one 19 prism. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No, I'm not. I've 21 talked to the City about it, and they're -- 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You talk to them about 23 the library? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Oh, good. Thank you, 23 1 Jonathan. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Believe me, 3 Commissioner, I can talk to anyone on the City Council, 4 or City Manager about any topic I want to. 5 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And I can too, and I -- 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Good. Why don't you do 7 it then. 8 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I pissed off a lot of 9 people when I talked about Animal Control before without 10 having other members of the Court there. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. I was upset when 12 you put together an agreement without talking to the 13 liaisons about it. 14 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Didn't go anywhere. 15 Well, okay -- 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's -- I mean, I -- 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So let's -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- don't care about 19 that. I want to -- 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Let's -- 21 THE REPORTER: Excuse me. Excuse me. One a 22 a time, please. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I want to solve the 24 problem. I have an agreement right here that I've 25 worked with the County Attorney on. I've talked to the 24 1 the City Manager about it, Commissioner Reeves, talked 2 to Reagan. It's not changing anything at the library; 3 it's basically changing the hours of our workload, when 4 we're working, and it's saying that we'll do a couple of 5 other things, and asking for a 50 thousand dollar 6 contribution from the City. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's a big change. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, if they say no 9 then we negotiate it. I'm not saying we're going to 10 walk off with an agreement. 11 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think it's a futile 12 effort to do that. I don't know why we can't do like we 13 did before. We've got an Interlocal Agreement, let's 14 look at that Interlocal Agreement which has -- which has 15 facets of the Animal Control, it has facets of the 16 library, and it's a joint -- it's a document which 17 defines what each person, each entity is going to do in 18 satisfying the Interlocal Agreement. I don't see 19 anything wrong with looking at it together. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We have done that and we 21 are doing that. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Yeah, but you're -- 23 JUDGE POLLARD: This is an emergency thing 24 that needs to be done right away, but the other part -- 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We've got contingency 25 1 funds. 2 JUDGE POLLARD: Pardon. 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We've got contingency 4 funds if we have got to do something in an emergency. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: This doesn't qualify as 6 an emergency. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You're not going to get 8 $50,000.00 out of the City. I don't think. So then 9 what are you going to do? 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We'll make a decision. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: Councilman Baroody, please 12 speak. 13 COUNCILMAN BAROODY: Obviously I'm not 14 speaking for City or City Council. But I will say that 15 when you asked -- the Judge was talking about it. When 16 you're asking for the 50 thousand, I will tell you that 17 one of the questions I would be asking on Council will 18 be not so much how much is the animal services cost, but 19 how much does the -- what is it? What's the official 20 term, the premium services or whatever, that the extra 21 services that the City is asking in the agreement, what 22 do those cost? So that would be a question I'm going to 23 be asking about, and sort of trying to put in a balance 24 on that, whatever the $50,000.00 ask is. So I would say 25 that would be -- that would be -- before we could make a 26 1 decision as far as I'm concerned we would need that, and 2 I understand you're overworked. You mentioned him 3 getting those numbers would take some time or whatever, 4 but that would be an important thing for me. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sure. And we can answer 6 that very easily really. We increased our budget a 133 7 thousand -- or around $130,000.00 last year to implement 8 this agreement. That's what it cost. It's pretty 9 simple, you look at the year before, year here we added 10 two people, we added -- changed our service around, so 11 it was 130. If we add another one, which the agreement 12 proposes, we'll be about $190,000.00 increase. 13 COUNCILMAN BAROODY: But you're also talking 14 about in this amendment cutting some of those cost 15 items? 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Not changing the service 17 to the City at all; changing the hours. 18 COUNCILMAN BAROODY: Right. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Internally how we handle 20 the City calls; not changing the service to the City at 21 all. 22 COUNCILMAN BAROODY: But it's not going to 23 actually cut any of the like -- 24 JUDGE POLLARD: It will still cost us 25 $190,000.00. They're just changing hours. 27 1 COUNCILMAN BAROODY: You're just going to be 2 able to staff those hours more appropriately. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. And the current 4 agreement doesn't give us any flexibility in that. The 5 new agreement modifies that as to how we do it, you 6 know. And I think one of the things that I think is 7 important for us to realize is this agreement was 8 approved probably a month after the current -- Reagan 9 was appointed. So our current Director had no input 10 into this agreement, or virtually no input, very very 11 little. Because he hadn't been in office -- he hadn't 12 even been in that job so yeah, he may have input, but in 13 theory is one thing, but I think actually operating the 14 facility, now he's had it for six months under the 15 Agreement and it isn't working. 16 MR. GIVENS: Well, a big part of that was 24 17 hours a day 7 days a week patrols, so even at night. I 18 can tell you that from a law enforcement and public 19 safety standpoint, or officer safety that is just 20 extremely dangerous. There is -- I've worked a few of 21 these shifts myself at night. When you're out driving 22 around through town or down Ranchero Road, wherever 23 you're at, you can't see if there's a dog out anywhere. 24 All can you see is right in front of your vehicle. I 25 also told these people, because I want them to be as 28 1 safe as they can while they're out there, if you see a 2 dog and you're in a neighborhood or wherever you're at 3 stop, see if the dog will come to you, if it doesn't and 4 it takes off in somebody's yard, get in the vehicle and 5 go. Because you're not running through people's yards, 6 you're not knocking on doors, you're going to get shot. 7 And that's the number one thing that I'm concerned about 8 at night, we can't -- you just can't see anything, and 9 that's when most people are asleep. 10 We even had input from PD officers out there 11 asking why we're working at night. There's just a lot 12 of things at night it's having somebody working those 13 shifts all through the night when they could be working 14 during the day and actually doing something for the 15 citizens that's actually beneficial. That's where -- 16 plus, we're just too short staffed during the day. 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Reagan makes the point 18 perfectly well and I can't agree with him more, but that 19 also makes the point of trying to understand what the 20 best resolution of this is is for Reagan and the Chief 21 of Police, or whomever from the City, to sit down and do 22 this. Same thing with some of these other things that 23 are in this Interlocal Agreement. The hours they're 24 going to be there, okay, that somebody's going to be at 25 the facility. And what do they need, why do they need 29 1 it. What do we need from the library, okay, to keep our 2 constituents happy, okay. The people that live outside 3 the city, even though everyone in the City is our 4 constituent, too. This guy (tapping ring on bench) 5 right here has a lot of people in the City, so therefore 6 it seems to me like if you can address both of these 7 under the umbrella of an Interlocal Agreement, which we 8 have, and look at Reagan's issues, look at the police 9 issues, look at the library issues, and see what we can 10 do rather than doing it unilaterally. Here's our 11 position, here's their position. We're going to 12 eventually going to do that, so why not do it that way 13 at the beginning? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: There's nothing 15 unilateral here. This agreement came after we met with 16 the City Manager, and have met with Reagan quite a bit. 17 I don't see how you say this is unilateral. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, I think it is 19 because I'd like to have been a part of that. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's been on our agenda 21 three times now to talk about it. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Since it has to do with 23 the library, who's the liaison for the library? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: You are. 25 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, thank you. 30 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay, so you chose not 2 to -- the last two times we have talked about it you 3 chose not to participate when you were in Court. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Where? 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: In Court. One time you 6 were on vacation; one time I know you were here. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We didn't discuss this 8 in detail. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yes, we did. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: We did not. Anyway, 11 why don't we have -- instead of having a unilateral, 12 let's amend the agreement, have a joint meeting with the 13 City and County, that's my simple suggestion. And why 14 don't we have a joint meeting with them so we can sit 15 down and understand what their needs are, what our needs 16 are, what the issues are of both sides and then modify 17 the Interlocal Agreement that we have. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make a motion that 19 we approve the proposed draft amendment to the 20 agreement. There was one provision I modified after 21 talking to Reagan over the weekend, and County Attorney 22 said there's some language that needs to be changed 23 there, and that would be included in my motion to 24 approve these and send them to the City. It doesn't 25 preclude anything that Commissioner Moser's talking 31 1 about. And authorize the County Judge to send it to the 2 Mayor. 3 MR. GIVENS: May I just say something real 4 quick? With all due respect, I just hope it's really 5 fast because my staff is getting run into the ground 6 right now, and that's just flat the way it is. And I 7 don't think that there's a sense of urgency from the 8 library as far as that goes. I need to get -- I need to 9 get something going quickly. 10 COMMISSIONER MOSER: I think that's a 11 totally separate issue. I agree with you 100 percent. 12 I think that we have -- we should take care of that, we 13 should fix that. We don't need to have a modification 14 for an Interlocal Agreement to get it. 15 MRS. STEBBINS: You do. You do have to have 16 modification -- 17 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Let me -- 18 MRS. STEBBINS: -- of the agreement. 19 COMMISSIONER MOSER: -- finish please. 20 MRS. STEBBINS: Just correcting you. 21 COMMISSIONER MOSER: May I finish? 22 I don't think you have to have an Interlocal 23 Agreement to do that. If you need additional funds, 24 okay, to operate your facility in your department that 25 is absolutely -- we should listen to that and we should 32 1 provide the funds that you need to take that -- to do 2 that, okay? We can do that immediately, okay, with 3 contingency funds or whatever, or however in the budget 4 that the County Auditor suggests we do it. Or we can do 5 it as part of the budget process. I think there's a lot 6 of other requests that you have other than what the 7 obligations are to the City where people are saying, you 8 know, no kill facility la de da de da. I think that 9 your department needs more funds, okay, and it oughta be 10 part of the budget process. And if it's an emergency, I 11 don't think we need to do this as part of the budget 12 process; I think we need to do that as part of 13 operations right now, and if you need $50,000.00, I 14 think we oughta figure out how to do it with $50,000.00. 15 How long we going to have to wait for the City to do 16 this? And if they come back and say no, then what are 17 we going to do? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I made a motion. 19 COMMISSIONER REEVES: I'm going to second 20 the motion simply because nothing of this pertains to 21 what the library is doing. It's all do we take the 22 effort -- or the effort off of our guys to provide 23 better service countywide, including the city. And 24 according to the County Attorney to change the hours 25 requires an amendment to an Interlocal Agreement, so I'm 33 1 going to second the motion. 2 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It does have to do with 3 the library, too. Read the title of the thing. 4 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Because that's how the 5 Interlocal Agreement -- 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. We're modifying 7 the Interlocal Agreement. 8 COMMISSIONER REEVES: I made a second. 9 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, it's been moved 10 by Commissioner Precinct 3, seconded by Commissioner 11 Precinct 4 to approve the item on the agenda as dictated 12 by Commissioner Letz into the record. And this is item 13 1.2 of the agenda amending the agreement -- Interlocal 14 Agreement with the City of Kerrville for the provision 15 of Animal Control services within the City of Kerrville, 16 and services of the Butt-Holdsworth Memorial Library for 17 residents of Kerr County. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Clarification. I'm 19 saying it's to send a proposed amendment to the City. 20 JUDGE POLLARD: Proposed amendment. 21 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Good enough for me. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. Now, is there 23 any more comment or questions or whatever? 24 I have one. Is there any reason why -- I 25 think it's something we need to do right away to help 34 1 Reagan and his staff. And is there any reason why if we 2 do this and make this proposal to the City that it would 3 preclude us from also addressing other issues later on. 4 Maybe right away about, you know, about the adjustments 5 of it as far as financial part is concerned? It doesn't 6 prevent us from approaching them in that regard, does 7 it? 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 9 JUDGE POLLARD: Okay. Then let's help out 10 our staff for right now, okay, and then let's initiate 11 negotiations. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, you can't do it 13 under this agenda item. 14 JUDGE POLLARD: And trying to make sure this 15 is a fair arrangement between the parties. All right, 16 that's the way I feel about it. What do you think? Can 17 you go along with that song? 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: The second thing, I 19 agree with a hundred percent, we need to do something to 20 help Reagan, okay. I don't think it needs to be done 21 through this procedure. I think -- and I don't know if 22 we can discuss this even under this agenda item, 23 Counselor, can we? 24 MRS. STEBBINS: I don't know what you're 25 asking. 35 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Can we talk about 2 funding -- giving Reagan additional funds under this 3 agenda item? 4 MRS. STEBBINS: The agenda item is related 5 to the Interlocal Agreement, and -- 6 COMMISSIONER MOSER: And the other was the 7 operation of -- 8 MRS. STEBBINS: That's the -- 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: -- Animal Services. 10 MRS. STEBBINS: -- Interlocal Agreement. If 11 you want to talk about getting Reagan additional funds 12 you should probably put on another item. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's what I think. 14 I'm all for that. And we can have an emergency meeting 15 just as quick as we can to help him, because he's got a 16 critically needed thing, so -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Commissioner, on that 18 point I made -- and I'm not in favor of doing it -- I 19 don't think it qualifies as an emergency to do that, but 20 it'll take Reagan a month to be able to go out post 21 another position, higher another -- I mean he can't 22 do -- that's not a quick fix. Changing the hours, if 23 City Council can come back one time and say we agree to 24 that and that part can be done, and everything else can 25 keep on negotiating. 36 1 MR. GIVENS: I can tell you right now, I 2 need at least two more Animal Control officers in order 3 to keep the -- 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, and I understand. 5 I don't disagree with anything you say. But I've also 6 heard from the City Manager, and he says I don't agree 7 with this $50,000.00. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He told me that. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: So when it goes over, 10 so what are we doing to help Reagan with this? Nothing. 11 JUDGE POLLARD: We're changing the hours, 12 and I don't think there are any funds -- emergency funds 13 needed right now, Tom; it's changing the hours right 14 now, and -- 15 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It's requesting -- 16 JUDGE POLLARD: -- then we gotta address the 17 additional -- maybe additional personnel or whatever. 18 COMMISSIONER MOSER: It's requesting 19 $50,000.00. Let me -- let's do it this way. Why don't 20 we -- well, we've already got that -- 21 JUDGE POLLARD: The $50,000.00 is an 22 adjustment to make the contribution fair, supposedly. 23 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well you don't know 24 what the other side is. But anyway, can I procedurally 25 amend what's being proposed even though it's been -- 37 1 JUDGE POLLARD: There's been a motion made 2 and a second made, and I'm going to call for a vote on 3 that now. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay, well let me make 5 one other comment. Since you had a comment, I have a 6 comment. And that would be to approve everything in 7 here except for item F, which is City to provide 8 $50,000.00. 9 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, he's offering it 10 as an amendment to the motion. Is there a second to the 11 amendment? There is not, so that fails. 12 Now, we're going to call for vote on the 13 motion. Those in favor of the motion signify by raising 14 your right hands. Those opposed like sign. It's three 15 to one, it passes. 16 All right, I still want to initiate 17 negotiations with the City about this, and do a study 18 about the cost. I want to take a serious look at what 19 it's costing us on this thing. 20 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's what the hell I 21 proposed. 22 JUDGE POLLARD: All right. And this doesn't 23 preclude that, Tom. 24 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Let's do it. 25 JUDGE POLLARD: Let's do it. 38 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: As part of this same 2 agenda item, I make a motion -- I make a motion for the 3 same agenda item that the City and the County schedule a 4 meeting as soon as possible. It would be comprised at 5 least of -- 6 JUDGE POLLARD: That the County offers to. 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Offers to, okay. The 8 Liaison, a member of Commissioners' Court, a liaison 9 from the library, from Animal Control, the head of 10 Animal Control, and the City to identify the people that 11 they would like to have in that working group, okay, 12 consistent with just exactly what you're saying. And we 13 do that as soon as possible to address the needs of both 14 institutions. 15 JUDGE POLLARD: Can we do that, Counsel, 16 under this agenda item? 17 MRS. STEBBINS: I don't think you need a 18 motion to do it, but -- 19 JUDGE POLLARD: Pardon? 20 MRS. STEBBINS: I don't think you need a 21 motion to schedule a meeting. But you can -- 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think -- I think if 23 Commissioner Moser is -- are you trying to get a group 24 together to come back if the City does not accept 25 this -- 39 1 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- to negotiate then? 3 COMMISSIONER MOSER: No, not if they do not 4 accept it; Just to come back and do it anyway. We need 5 to look at -- make it an independent of whether or not 6 they accept this. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll second it, but I'm 8 not sure I'm going to vote for it. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: She said we don't need 10 a motion to do that. 11 MRS. STEBBINS: If you want to schedule a 12 meeting with them -- 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But if you're 14 authorizing people to negotiate to work on this, I mean 15 we can still have a meeting. I guess the question I 16 have is that, and this is why this has been on our 17 agenda three times now to talk about as a full Court is 18 I think the Judge has opinions, I have opinions, Mr. 19 Reeves has opinions, you have opinions, and I think 20 Commissioner Belew has opinions, and if two of us 21 negotiate it, I think it's getting into a problem on 22 getting the buy-in from the whole Court, because this is 23 a very -- it's an issue that the whole Court is very 24 concerned about on both sides. And that's why -- 25 JUDGE POLLARD: Maybe we oughta have a joint 40 1 session hosted with both organizations. 2 MRS. STEBBINS: Before that it might be a 3 good idea if you want to discuss contract negotiations 4 with the Court you're welcome to do that in executive 5 session so that the Court can -- as an entirety 6 understand its position, and in talking about it in open 7 session might interfere with your ability to negotiate 8 that contract. 9 COMMISSIONER MOSER: You're calling the 10 Interlocal Agreement a contract -- 11 MRS. STEBBINS: It is a -- 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: -- so therefore you can 13 have both bodies there and do it in executive session? 14 MRS. STEBBINS: I don't know about both 15 bodies, I don't know. 16 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's what I'm 17 suggesting, we do this -- 18 JUDGE POLLARD: To address the Open Meetings 19 Act, and if both -- the whole Commissioners' Court and 20 the whole City Council, then we've addressed that, and 21 post it. 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Right. There you go. 23 And could that be done in executive session for both 24 bodies? 25 MRS. STEBBINS: I have no idea. 41 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Listen. To clear up the 2 record, I'll withdraw my second to his motion. Doesn't 3 sound like I need it. 4 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Okay. 5 JUDGE POLLARD: All right, is there a second 6 for his motion? 7 COMMISSIONER MOSER: Well, and that is to 8 have a joint meeting between the City and the County to 9 discuss the Interlocal Agreement and the services 10 provided by both. 11 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Question. 12 COMMISSIONER MOSER: What's wrong with 13 having a meeting for Christ sake? 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm not objecting, I -- 15 COMMISSIONER REEVES: Do we need this 16 motion, Counselor, because if you read the agenda item 17 it's to approve the first amendment, that's all it 18 reads. 19 MRS. STEBBINS: Yes. 20 COMMISSIONER REEVES: So can we even be 21 discussing this? 22 COMMISSIONER MOSER: She said we don't have 23 to have a motion to have this -- 24 COMMISSIONER REEVES: That's fine. But can 25 we even discuss it, Counselor? 42 1 MRS. STEBBINS: You can't take any action. 2 You can discuss it, but you can't take any action. 3 JUDGE POLLARD: No action on it. Look, the 4 thing is it's passed. The motion was passed, and 5 there's no other motion here. If there's no further 6 business for Commissioners' Court at this time, I'm 7 declaring adjournment. That doesn't mean we can't get 8 together and talk and see if we can't arrange something 9 like this. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I have no problem with 11 that. 12 JUDGE POLLARD: I encourage it. 13 COMMISSIONER MOSER: That's all I want to 14 do. 15 JUDGE POLLARD: Fine. We're adjourned, 16 let's get out of here. 17 * * * * * * 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 43 1 STATE OF TEXAS * 2 COUNTY OF KERR * 3 I, DEBRA ELLEN GIFFORD, Certified Shorthand 4 Reporter in and for the State of Texas, and Official 5 Court Reporter in and for Kerr County, do hereby certify 6 that the above and foregoing pages contain and comprise 7 a true and correct transcription of the proceedings had 8 in the above-entitled Commissioners' Court. 9 Dated this the 20th day of July, A.D. 2018. 10 11 /s/DEBRA ELLEN GIFFORD Certified Shorthand Reporter 12 No. 953 Expiration Date 12/31/2018 13 * * * * * * 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25