1 1 2 3 KERR COUNTY COMMISSIONERS' COURT 4 Regular Session 5 Monday, January 10, 2022 6 9:00 a.m. 7 Commissioners' Courtroom 8 Kerr County Courthouse 9 Kerrville, Texas 78028 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 PRESENT: ROB KELLY, Kerr County Judge HARLEY BELEW, Commissioner Precinct 1 24 T. BECK GIPSON, Commissioner Precinct 2 JONATHAN LETZ, Commissioner Precinct 3 25 DON HARRIS, Commissioner Precinct 4 2 1 I-N-D-E-X 2 NO. PAGE 3 *** Public Input. 5 4 *** Commissioner's Comments. 12 5 1.1 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 13 action regarding the 198th Asset Forfeiture 6 Budget. 7 1.3 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 16 action to authorize the Animal Service 8 Director to reduce the annual registration fee to $1.00 during the Annual Rabies 9 Vaccination Clinics being held February 5- February 19, 2022. Also to advertise by 10 placing sign on the courthouse grounds. The current fees are $5.00 (neutered/spayed) 11 and $10.00 (non-neutered/spayed). 12 1.2 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 17 action to accept Annual Racial Profiling 13 Report from 216th District Attorney. 14 1.4 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 18 action to approve Resolution recognizing 15 January 23-29, 2022 as School Choice Week in Kerr County. 16 1.5 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 19 17 action to approve contract with Hill Country Cares, and allow County Judge to 18 sign same. 19 1.6 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 19 action to surplus items for IT Department. 20 1.8 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 20 21 action to consider COVID and sick leave policy. 22 1.9 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 22 23 action to clarify the rate of pay for Jill Shackelford for her consulting services for 24 aggregate production operations, Court Order 38726. 25 3 1 I-N-D-E-X 2 NO. PAGE 3 1.7 Presentation regarding Chronic Wasting 28 Disease (CWD). 4 1.10 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 33 5 action to review liaison responsibilities and determine liaison appointments for 2022. 6 1.11 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 38 7 action on County revision of plat and right-of-way policy. 8 1.12 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 68 9 action on request for variance for Section 6.03.C.16, 6.03.C.18, 7.02, and 7.06 of the 10 Kerr County Subdivision Regulations for Verde Park Estates Section II, Revision of 11 Plat for Tract 5, regarding the ownership of road easements. 12 1.13 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 73 13 action for the Court to approve a final plat for The Hideout Ranch and accept Bond Number 14 L256051-2131 in the amount of $1,828,024.00 for associated construction improvements in 15 Mountain Home, Texas. 16 1.14 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 77 action for the Court to approve a final 17 plat for Cypress Vine, Deed File No. 21-07985. 18 1.15 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 79 action for the Court to approve and authorize 19 the County Judge to execute Change Order No. 1 to the East Kerr/Center Point Wastewater 20 Collection Project Phase II contract in the amount of $57,371.58. 21 1.16 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 86 22 action on how to determine if an access road meets public health and safety standards. 23 1.17 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 94 24 action to appoint an alternate for Mary Krebs on the Alamo Area Council of Governments 25 (AACOG) Criminal Justice Advisory Committee (CJAC). 4 1 I-N-D-E-X 2 NO. PAGE 3 1.18 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 94 action to designate a member of 4 Commissioners' Court as a representative on the Courthouse Security Committee. 5 1.19 Consider, discuss and take appropriate 95 6 action on request to post notices in all courthouse bathrooms regarding Human 7 Trafficking Awareness Month. 8 2.1 Budget Amendments. 97 9 2.2 Pay Bills. 97 10 2.4 Auditor Reports. 98 11 2.5 Accept Monthly Reports. 98 12 2.6 Court Orders. 99 13 3.2 Status reports from Elected Officials. 100 14 3.3 Status reports from Liaison Commissioners. 102 15 *** Adjournment. 103 16 *** Reporter's Certificate. 104 17 * * * * * * 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 5 1 JUDGE KELLY: Court will come to order. 2 Good morning. It is Monday, January the 10th, 2022. 3 Kerr County Commissioners' Court is now in session. If 4 you would, please stand for the prayer and the pledge, 5 which will be given by Commissioner Gipson. 6 (Prayer and pledge.) 7 JUDGE KELLY: Please be seated. I want to 8 remind everyone to turn your phones off or to vibrate so 9 they don't disturb the meeting. And -- and with that, 10 then we will go to the input portion of the program. We 11 seem to have several people lined up to talk to us 12 input. So -- and remember, input is where you have 13 three minutes. Identify yourself, where you live. 14 Three minutes. On something that's not on the agenda. 15 So Rich Paces. 16 MR. PACES: Hi, I'm Rich Paces from Center 17 Point. And look, I recently came across Order No. 18 3888 -- one more 8 to that, 38888. This deals with the 19 ARPA funds. And as I read the Court order that was 20 unanimously approved in this Commissioners' Court and 21 then I see that Judge Kelly, you have signed off on the 22 Department of Treasury's terms and conditions for the 23 award of these funds. So that means that we've accepted 24 full compliance with all Federal statutes, regulations 25 and executive orders. That's the one that really 6 1 bothers me. 2 And so I'm just going to ask you three 3 questions. What have you done -- what has the County 4 done, what has the Commissioners' Court done, to 5 identify all of the areas in which we may not be in 6 compliance? What are the consequences of noncompliance? 7 And lastly, what have you done to protect the people of 8 Kerr County from any noncompliance? Those are my simple 9 questions. Thank you. 10 JUDGE KELLY: Bethany Puceo. 11 MS. PUCEO: Hi. My name is Bethany Puceo. 12 I live right in the City of Kerrville. I wanted to -- 13 you know, this is about the ARPA funds and I wasn't able 14 to attend last meeting due to the holidays, but the 15 meeting before that we had this room and the room 16 upstairs filled and the meeting before that we had maybe 17 50 people here. And the unanimously the people are 18 saying we don't want these funds and we don't want the 19 strings attached. We don't want the executive orders. 20 This is not -- we don't want to be bought by the Federal 21 Government, thank you very much. We'd like the Federal 22 Government to say out of Kerr County and their money. 23 And I want to thank Harley Belew. Thank you 24 for representing us so well at that meeting and being a 25 voice for the people and bringing that forward. 7 1 Unfortunately, you know, nobody else wanted to support 2 you in supporting us really. Because this is what the 3 people want. We want the money sent back. And so I'm 4 just disappointed. This isn't over. We're not dropping 5 this. We don't want this money. We want it sent back. 6 That contract, I'd like to know by the time 7 it all goes south none of you will probably be in office 8 but we're going to get stuck with it and that's not 9 okay. And it needs to be fixed. And to me, I don't 10 know if we can get out of that contract by sending the 11 money back, but I would like that to be looked into and 12 we would like the money to be sent back. 13 JUDGE KELLY: Thank you. Terri Hall. 14 MS. HALL: Good morning. Terri Hall, 118 15 Independence Lane, Ingram. And we do represent a group 16 of people, We The People: Liberty in Action. And you 17 took action to put any expenditure of the ARPA funds to 18 a vote of Commissioners' Court right before 19 Thanksgiving. But that's not what the citizens asked 20 you to do. 21 You want clarity on the strings attached 22 through various court challenges and such, but we 23 already know from you signing off on accepting those 24 funds, the order that Mr. Paces has already brought up 25 and that I know you're all aware of, makes us obligated 8 1 to all those executive orders that the administration 2 has already signed and any future ones that he will sign 3 between now and 2024 when the funds must be expended. 4 But here's how the citizens interpret your 5 actions. It's we know better than you. Sit down. Be 6 quiet. Let us make the decision for you. But in Kerr 7 County that's not how we want this to work. We want 8 government of the people, by the people, and for the 9 people. You have informed voters. You have the 10 blessing of more informed voters here in Kerr County. 11 People who care. People who are engaged. People who 12 investigate and research for themselves. They know 13 enough about these funds to know that this is not good 14 for our County. It's not good for our community. 15 Another thing is that we want you to 16 remember that we hired you at the ballot box to do a job 17 and ultimately the taxpayers are the ones who sign your 18 paycheck. So who's really in charge? It should be us. 19 Our U.S. Constitution and Texas Constitution 20 is about self-governance. And you're the stewards of 21 that. There's no question. But we want you to be 22 stewards and not our masters. We're not so naive to 23 think that this move isn't just a strategy perhaps to 24 put it off until there's votes to spend the money. If 25 we're found not to be in compliance, perhaps after 9 1 you've moved on, not even in office anymore, who's going 2 to have to pick up the pieces for that? It's the 3 taxpayers. We're always the ones left to clean up the 4 mess. 5 This administration is clearly, now I'm 6 talking about the Biden administration. We've never 7 seen this in our lifetimes, I don't think. They're not 8 just disagreeing with us on how to spend money or if we 9 tax or if we issue debt or something like that, these 10 people are hell bent on destroying this country. 11 And if you look at just some of the 12 executive orders this man has already signed, he signed 13 almost a hundred on the first day in office. We're 14 still wading through them and the impact that that's 15 going to have on all of us as citizens. Not just to 16 mention the -- the mandates on -- the health mandates. 17 He's mandating gun control. And this is a two-way 18 county. This is a two-way state. This is unbelievable. 19 The land reps. 20 Y'all already did the 30 by 30 resolution to 21 protect us from that executive order. How about the 22 Green New Deal Initiative? Mandatory emissions 23 reduction. Making it easier for incarcerated people to 24 vote. Increasing the minimum wage. Reversing all the 25 Trump era work requirements for welfare recipients and 10 1 more. That's just what he's already done. We don't 2 want that here in Kerr County and we're asking you to 3 send these monies back. 4 JUDGE KELLY: Thank you, Miss Hall. Alicia 5 Bell. 6 MS. BELL: Alicia Bell. Precinct 2. This 7 is more than just ARPA funds, this is enslaving the 8 people. This is about -- there is no virus. This is 9 about injecting people with something that can kill 10 them. 11 Are you ready to stand before God and say 12 yes, that is something that you should be doing? You 13 need to be sending this money back. There is no virus. 14 If the germ theory was true, there would be nobody alive 15 to discover it. 16 You ever had pets? All the germs that 17 you've been exposed to your whole life, why are you 18 still here? And you're going to allow people to be 19 enslaved and forcibly injected? Is that where you want 20 to stand before God? Thank you. 21 JUDGE KELLY: Is there anyone here for the 22 input portion of the meeting? Okay. 23 MR. SHEFFIELD: I'm sorry, Your Honor. I 24 filled something out out front. I thought that Miss 25 Dowdy has got it. 11 1 MS. DOWDY: Is it on the agenda? I'm sorry. 2 MR. SHEFFIELD: Huh? 3 MS. DOWDY: Is it on the agenda? 4 MR. SHEFFIELD: No, ma'am. 5 MS. DOWDY: Okay. 6 MR. SHEFFIELD: I don't believe so. 7 MS. DOWDY: I believe his -- 8 MR. SHEFFIELD: It's already been brought? 9 JUDGE KELLY: Oh, I see it. It's over here. 10 John Sheffield. 11 MR. SHEFFIELD: Yes, sir. Thank you, sir. 12 Gentlemen of the Court, Your Honor. Thank 13 you for your time. My name is John Sheffield. I own 14 the old Ingram Grocery in Ingram, Texas. I live in 15 Center Point on Verde Creek. 16 I'm here today to speak about what has been 17 spoken about, and I want to thank Mr. Paces because at 18 our meeting on Saturday, that's when he heard about this 19 Order No. 38888, item 1.6, agreement with the U.S. 20 Department of Treasury regarding ARPA. Came to be heard 21 this the 23rd day of August, 2021 with a motion made by 22 Commissioner Letz, seconded by Commissioner Harris. The 23 Court unanimously approved by a vote of 5-0-0 that Kerr 24 County enter into an agreement with the U.S. Department 25 of Treasury to comply with ARPA award terms and 12 1 conditions, and authorize the County Judge to sign same. 2 Gentlemen, why I'm here is to ask that we 3 bring this back on the agenda, and I ask that we rescind 4 this order or at least have it up for discussion once 5 again. And I certainly thank you for your time. 6 JUDGE KELLY: Thank you, Mr. Sheffield. 7 Anyone else for the public input portion of the meeting? 8 Very well. Then we'll move on to Commissioners 9 Comments. Precinct 1. 10 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Well, I sure thought it 11 was going to rain but it didn't quite get there. But it 12 was nice to get a little moisture over the weekend. 13 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: Nothing in Precinct 2. 14 JUDGE KELLY: Three? 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Another very good stock 16 show. The numbers a little over 1.1 million was raised 17 at the sale. And it'll help a lot of kids either move 18 on to college or move on to future projects. So anyway, 19 good event. That's all I have. 20 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Yeah, and I'll just 21 continue with that. Our community supports our youth. 22 And spending time out there you see kids that spent a 23 lot of time learning responsibilities and stuff and -- 24 and they were rewarded in the sale, and that's heart 25 warming. 13 1 On another note, it's dry out there, guys. 2 Precinct 4 is under burn ban, and we were blessed with a 3 lot of rains earlier, and now that we've got dry fuel on 4 the ground so please be cautious. That's it. 5 JUDGE KELLY: And the only thing I would add 6 is that the stock show was a great event. Truly was. 7 And it's a lot of us together without masks. And what 8 the Peterson is telling us now is we're expecting this 9 Omicron thing to spike within the next week or two. So 10 whether you believe in it or not, I'm just asking 11 everybody take care of yourself. Take care of your 12 family. Be careful. 13 So with that. Let's move on to the 14 consideration agenda. 1.1 consider, discuss and take 15 appropriate action regarding the 198th asset forfeiture 16 budget. Stephen Harpold. 17 MR. HARPOLD: I'm here, Judge, for any 18 questions y'all might have with regard to that issue. 19 JUDGE KELLY: Any questions? 20 MR. HARPOLD: Normally this is something 21 that we held in the small little committee thing that's 22 set for that, but we felt like with not taking up 23 y'all's time and just putting this on a regular agenda, 24 would just be much more easier and less obtrusive with 25 regards to filing notices and stuff like that, so -- 14 1 JUDGE KELLY: So you're -- go ahead. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: The question is, is 3 there a provision to go to the -- all the Commissioners 4 Courts? 5 MR. HARPOLD: Yes. Yeah. It's like 6 paragraph one is what we normally did and -- 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 8 MR. HARPOLD: -- paragraph two was the other 9 way. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Normally -- this is for 11 a little information -- there's a committee, of which 12 I'm on it and the Sheriff's on it, and I believe it's 13 the Judge from Bandera County on the committee, to 14 approve these funds. Set up a number of years ago. 15 Anyway. 16 And the other option is to bring it to each 17 of the counties, so I'll make a motion that we approve 18 the budget for the asset forfeiture account as 19 submitted. 20 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: I'll second that. 21 JUDGE KELLY: Got a motion and a second to 22 approve the 198th asset forfeiture budget. Any 23 discussion? 24 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Is this pretty well in 25 line with what's been in the years past, Stephen? 15 1 MR. HARPOLD: My sense is that in the years 2 past, the budget was just basically the amount that was 3 in the account divvied up. And what I just did is I 4 just looked at it and said, well, we're not even 5 spending close to that and so I just knocked it down to 6 what I thought was a more realistic approach of what we 7 might would spend it on. 8 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: That makes sense. 9 MR. HARPOLD: Yes, sir. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And this is money that 11 isn't spent out of our general funds -- 12 MR. HARPOLD: Right. Yes, sir. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- or the general funds 14 fund for the County in the 198th. 15 JUDGE KELLY: Any other discussion? Those 16 in favor raise your hand. Unanimous, five zero. 17 MR. HARPOLD: Thank y'all. Thanks for all 18 y'all do. 19 JUDGE KELLY: Item 1.2 consider, discuss and 20 take appropriate action to accept the annual Racial 21 Profiling Report from the 216th District Attorney's 22 office. Is Miss Flores here? 23 MRS. STEBBINS: Do you want me to check the 24 hall? 25 SHERIFF LEITHA: No, sir. 16 1 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Come back to it? 2 JUDGE KELLY: We'll come back to it. 3 Let's go ahead and move on to Item 1.3 4 consider, discuss and take appropriate action to 5 authorize the Animal Service Director to reduce the 6 annual registration fee to one dollar during the Annual 7 Rabies Vaccination Clinics being held February 5 through 8 February 19, and also to advertise by placing a sign on 9 the courthouse grounds, and the current fees are five 10 dollars (neutered/spayed) and ten dollars 11 (non-neutered/spayed). Reagan Givens. 12 MR. GIVENS: Good morning. This is 13 something I've been coming here yearly to request. And 14 basically we're looking this year for the Annual Rabies 15 Drive to lower the annual registration fee to a dollar, 16 just like in the years past, for a two-week period of 17 February 5th through February 19th, 2022. We're 18 lowering it to one dollar from five dollars if they're 19 neutered/spayed or ten dollars for non-neutered/spayed. 20 Basically that's an incentive for people to get their 21 pets registered. 22 This is also a good opportunity for people 23 to get their unvaccinated animals vaccinated through the 24 vet clinics. So what people will do is call their local 25 vet clinic and set up an appointment and they'll get it 17 1 at a discounted rate for that two-week period. 2 And then also, we advertise for this with 3 the sign that we've historically put on the corner out 4 here on the courthouse lawn. 5 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Okay. I move for 6 approval. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 8 JUDGE KELLY: Got a motion and a second to 9 approve the authorization for the Animal Service 10 Director to reduce the annual registration fee to one 11 dollar during the Annual Rabies Vaccination Clinics 12 February 5 through 19. Any discussion? Those in favor 13 raise your hand. Unanimous, five zero. 14 MRS. STEBBINS: Judge -- 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we could 16 probably handle 1.2. I mean, what was said is that 17 they're exempt from filing the report. 18 MRS. STEBBINS: I just asked the DA for that 19 office if she wanted me to ask y'all to accept it if you 20 already had it and she said yes, that no one would be 21 here today from her office. 22 JUDGE KELLY: Okay. So we'll go back to 23 1.2? 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 25 JUDGE KELLY: Do you want to make a motion? 18 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make a motion that 2 we accept the report which basically just states that 3 they're exempt from filing this because they -- well, 4 that's their exemption. That's my motion. 5 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: Second. 6 JUDGE KELLY: Okay. We got a motion and a 7 second? 8 COMMISSIONER BELEW: It says we're supposed 9 to be accepting the report. That's what the item says. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That we're -- yeah, 11 we're accepting the report that says that they're exempt 12 from filing the report. 13 COMMISSIONER BELEW: That's the government 14 for you, folks. There you go. 15 MRS. STEBBINS: They don't make stops. They 16 don't make traffic stops. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They don't make traffic 18 stops. And that's what it says. 19 JUDGE KELLY: Those in favor raise your 20 hand. Unanimous. 21 1.4 consider, discuss and take appropriate 22 action to approve a Resolution recognizing January 23 23 through 29 as School Choice Week in Kerr County. 24 I think we all got the notice of this asking 25 us to put it on the agenda and I talked to Jody and she 19 1 said Commissioner Harris had already done it. 2 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: So anyway. 3 JUDGE KELLY: I'll make a motion that we 4 approve the Resolution for students. 5 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: And I'll second it. 6 JUDGE KELLY: Any discussion? 7 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Well, I think we're 8 all in favor of school choice. Especially here in Kerr 9 County. 10 JUDGE KELLY: Those in favor raise your 11 hand. Unanimous. 12 1.5 consider, discuss and take appropriate 13 action to approve the contract with Hill Country Cares 14 and allow me to sign the same. 15 This is just a routine renewal contract that 16 we do every year. 17 COMMISSIONER BELEW: I move for approval. 18 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: Second. 19 JUDGE KELLY: Got a motion and a second to 20 approve the contract with Hill Country Cares. Any 21 discussion? Those in favor raise your hand. Unanimous. 22 1.6 consider, discuss and take appropriate 23 action to surplus items for the IT Department. 24 Ms. Shelton. 25 MRS. SHELTON: Yes. We have a list of items 20 1 that the IT Department has asked to be surplused. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll move we approve the 3 list, which is made up primarily of computer and 4 computer parts. 5 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Second. 6 JUDGE KELLY: Got a motion and a second to 7 approve surplusing the items for the IT Department. Any 8 discussion? Those in favor raise your hand. Unanimous. 9 We're at that curious spot that we're 10 actually ahead of our agenda. So I'm going to skip down 11 to 1.8. We'll come back to 1.7 in just a minute. 12 Consider, discuss and take appropriate action to 13 consider COVID and sick leave policy. Miss Doss. 14 MRS. DOSS: Yes. Good morning, gentlemen. 15 We were just bringing this to the Court because of the 16 spike and to encourage people that are symptomatic to 17 stay home without using their own leave. I know that 18 FFCRA, the Families First Coronavirus Act in 2020 19 granted 80 hours and the County matched that, which we 20 transferred into '21. I'm just asking for the Court to 21 consider additional time for 2022. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I guess I'm more of the 23 opinion that to me we need to move on. And if you're 24 sick, stay home. Regardless of what you're sick with. 25 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: We got so many things 21 1 that are so similar, and I don't know. Some of y'all 2 know and don't know that I tested positive the second 3 time right after Christmas and I wouldn't even have 4 known I had it if I hadn't tested. Because we were 5 having cedar fever. 6 We're having -- it's cold and flu season and 7 everything else and the symptoms are all the same. And 8 you know, it was a big inconvenience more than anything. 9 So we do have to move on at some point. The numbers 10 that are important are hospitalizations and deaths. 11 Those -- those are the important numbers. But getting a 12 cold is not. 13 MRS. DOSS: Okay. I've just heard buzz 14 about it and I was just going to -- I told people that I 15 would bring it to the Court for your consideration, 16 so -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean so -- I guess the 18 answer is no additional sick time for COVID. If you're 19 sick, you stay home and use your current sick or PTO. 20 MRS. DOSS: All right. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And I don't -- this 22 doesn't take action, does it? I mean -- 23 MRS. DOSS: No. If y'all don't grant it 24 then it's -- nothing needs to be done. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And technically doesn't 22 1 it expire -- the last policy expire at the end of our 2 last -- 3 MRS. DOSS: 12-31, correct. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So that -- shouldn't 5 this be taken off of the -- out of our payroll? 6 MRS. DOSS: We'll do that. So people are 7 just instructed to use their sick time if they have any 8 remaining balance and then moving forward PTO. All 9 right. Thank you. 10 JUDGE KELLY: It's time for 1.9, which is 11 consider, discuss and take appropriate action to clarify 12 the rate of pay for Jill Shackelford for her consulting 13 services for the aggregate production operations. 14 This came to the light at our last meeting 15 toward the end of the year. The contract that we signed 16 with Jill actually says $275 an hour. And our order 17 says $275 -- not to exceed $275. And so for the 18 November she charged us the 275, just like our order 19 says. 20 But I need to bring it to you as to what do 21 we need to do with regard to this contract that we have 22 with her? Because it does say $275 an hour. I was 23 surprised to see that. But it does. 24 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Are we -- where are we 25 at with it? 23 1 JUDGE KELLY: Oh, it's doing great. She's 2 really providing a very valuable service. But we meet 3 probably once every two months, two or three months. 4 COMMISSIONER BELEW: So it's a retainer? Is 5 that the way it's working, as a retainer? 6 JUDGE KELLY: Well, we paid her initially to 7 set it up. 8 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Or does she get paid 9 when she shows up? 10 JUDGE KELLY: We paid her to set it up. And 11 then with the expectation that she would help us keep it 12 going. Be an ongoing consultation position. 13 COMMISSIONER BELEW: She comes in as a 14 facilitator then. 15 JUDGE KELLY: Yes. And she -- 16 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Okay. 17 JUDGE KELLY: -- she arranges for programs. 18 Had somebody from TxDOT last time that was telling us 19 what to do and all that. And telling us everything that 20 affects the aggregate production. 21 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Right. 22 JUDGE KELLY: And it's been very good. You 23 know, we've got the operators, we've got the citizens, 24 and we've got the business people there. We have a lot 25 of ex-officio people that kind of represented us from 24 1 Representative Murr's office. And Senator Buckingham 2 showed up. So we've had really good participation. 3 It's be very worthwhile. This is not anything we want 4 to abandon. The question is, what do we want to do 5 about compensating her to facilitate this. 6 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Well, this -- 7 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: It says $250.00 8 instead of 275, unless I'm misreading this. 9 JUDGE KELLY: No, that's -- I misspoke. 10 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: I just wanted to make 11 sure. 12 COMMISSIONER BELEW: What are the -- my 13 question is, what are the benefits of this being an 14 ongoing, open-ended session or sessions, seminars, 15 whatever we want to call them, as opposed to kind of 16 vote on it at some point and saying we -- we got it 17 figured out. 18 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Bingo. That's what 19 I'm wondering. Is there a light at the end of the 20 tunnel or -- or what? 21 JUDGE KELLY: Well, that -- the light at the 22 end of the tunnel I think is the ongoing relationships 23 that were created. That's the light as I see it. What 24 she's done is she has been instrumental in preparing 25 programs for those in-person meetings, which has been 25 1 very beneficial. And we paid her to do that. The lump 2 sum amount that we put in the order, which I guess was 3 250. I got the numbers wrong. 4 But the issue is the contract says per hour. 5 And I told her that we couldn't pay that without me 6 bringing it back to the Court unless discussing what the 7 Court was willing to pay and what we want to do. 8 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Well, she's brought it 9 back to the table and made progress there. But do we 10 need her to hold everybody's hand from here on? I 11 mean -- 12 COMMISSIONER BELEW: I think that it -- that 13 just as what happened with Kerrville Pets Alive, citizen 14 group got together, they took it from there. I think 15 that might be a good idea for this as well. Because it 16 affects certain people. They learned something. She's 17 been a great facilitator in that conversation. 18 At some point, instead of this being never 19 ending, I think we'll need to have that -- you know, put 20 together a group like that and say they take it from 21 here. Now when -- when that happens, I don't know. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: How many -- I agree with 23 what both of y'all said. I think that's what she said 24 originally when she came and presented to us, that she 25 was not here forever, she was here for a period of time. 26 1 So when you -- a couple more meetings or -- I mean -- 2 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Or can she help 3 facilitate a group understanding what they're doing and 4 how to go forward? That would be my -- that's how she's 5 most use to us, I think. That she would help a group 6 establish five or six people or whatever and then they 7 have a board and then they meet with the aggregate 8 producers and she helps out and she gets her check and 9 if we ever need her, we'll call her back. We have a 10 good relationship with her and she's been helpful, so -- 11 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: I agree. 12 JUDGE KELLY: I don't think anybody 13 disagrees with what we're saying here. The issue is 14 that if she's going to continue to work with us from 15 today forward, we need to have a clear understanding of 16 what we're willing to compensate her or not. 17 I don't want her to operate under the 18 misconception that we're going to pay $250 an hour 19 because we're not. I didn't anticipate that we would. 20 COMMISSIONER BELEW: I'm not opposed to that 21 if we can, you know, get it capped off. A couple more 22 meetings, that costs us $500.00 to get a committee -- a 23 citizens committee going. 24 JUDGE KELLY: Well, she lives in -- outside 25 Buda. So we have travel time from Buda and back, plus 27 1 the time here with us. Which is probably -- she gets 2 here early and sets up, gets somebody to provide a 3 little snack or a meal for the people. And there's 4 probably -- I'm guessing we'll be looking at a minimum 5 of three, maybe four hours for each meeting. So that 6 would be a thousand dollars. 7 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Okay. Another thousand 8 dollars. So then you have a citizens group that 9 understands what -- what their -- how to achieve their 10 goals and know what the goals are and how to facilitate 11 that and how to get it done, and we've got a whole other 12 group of Kerr County citizens that have special 13 meetings, that have learned how to address it. And then 14 everybody else in the County isn't footing the bill. 15 JUDGE KELLY: Okay. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I would recommend that 17 you -- you or somebody visit with her and say, you know, 18 rather than hourly, do a per meeting amount and say 19 we're looking at, you know, maybe $500.00 a meeting, 20 something like that, with the idea that we want it 21 turned over in maybe three more meetings or something 22 along that line. 23 JUDGE KELLY: Well, then why -- why don't I 24 suggest that I -- I visit with her. Okay. Because I 25 sit on that -- that council with her, that advisory 28 1 council, and see how many more meetings she thinks that 2 we'll need her guidance. I mean, she's still available 3 to us. We can call her on the telephone. But coming 4 down here for meetings and everything. And visit with 5 her and report back to you. 6 COMMISSIONER BELEW: This would be good. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. 8 JUDGE KELLY: So with that, the next item on 9 the agenda, we'll go back to item 1.7, which is a 10 presentation regarding Chronic Wasting Disease. Ms. 11 McBryde. 12 MS. McBRYDE: Good morning. My name is 13 Michelle McBryde. I'm residing in Precinct 4 at the 14 moment. I just wanted to come and visit with y'all 15 about Chronic Wasting Disease. I have submitted a fax 16 sheet I believe that y'all have all received. And as a 17 private consulting service that I have, I found that 18 landowners are getting more and more concerned about the 19 Chronic Wasting Disease and where the responsibility 20 lies. 21 And I'm trying to address this before it 22 becomes a big problem for the County and for the City. 23 I don't know how the County offices work. And I think 24 to implement plans of making a productive and positive 25 solution, I have to understand what would work best for 29 1 y'all. So I'm hoping that we can open channels of 2 communication to be able to eliminate more confusion 3 about Chronic Wasting Disease. 4 I know that most recently there's 5 information out there that now we have COVID in 6 wildlife, which I just -- I don't see how that can be. 7 But I also don't have factual information to prove it 8 one way or another. I think we've gotten so mixed up 9 with opinions and facts that it's created so much 10 confusion. 11 So coming to you, I'm just trying to create 12 awareness of the problems that I foresee. I understand 13 there are positive cases in Kerr County. But they are 14 not documented cases so that's just basically hearsay. 15 But I think that's where we're eventually moving to that 16 point. 17 Do you have any questions for me? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make a general 19 comment because I -- you know, because I've talked to 20 you at length -- 21 MS. McBRYDE: Yes, sir. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- and I know quite a 23 bit about the Chronic Wasting Disease. But it's really 24 nothing that we as a Commissioners' Court have any -- 25 other than making public aware that it exists, any part 30 1 of it. 2 I mean, you know, it's a disease that deer, 3 white-tail deer have and some other exotics, three or 4 four types of exotics. Not most exotics so far. And 5 it's fatal to the deer that get it eventually, but it 6 takes a long time for them to develop tendency. But 7 there's really nothing that we can do, other than what 8 you've done today, and kind of let the public be aware 9 that this is a problem. 10 There's a lot of parks and wildlife, just 11 kind of elite agency monitoring it. They take deer 12 samples across the county on almost a daily basis and 13 they send -- a couple of things, you can send off and 14 get them tested at A&M for -- I think it's the only lab 15 in Texas right now. And so far, they haven't found any 16 confirmed cases that have gone through that testing 17 program. But I think you are right that it's likely 18 that it will, you know, at some point possibly get into 19 the County. It is in Kendall County. It is in Medina 20 County. 21 MS. McBRYDE: Yes, sir. And Uvalde County. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And other counties 23 around us. 24 MS. McBRYDE: Yeah. Another concern is that 25 it's, you know, possibly a zoonotic disease. And I 31 1 don't think we're addressing that issue at all. 2 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Yeah, I didn't hear 3 what you said. What's -- 4 MS. McBRYDE: Possibly a zoonotic disease, 5 meaning it can be transferred from animals to humans 6 through consumption. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. They're doing -- 8 they're -- fortunately, the U.S. Congress did do 9 something right and they did I think $80 million 10 dollars, I believe, they allocated to try and to learn 11 more about the disease. And finally Texas has done -- 12 has much less of a problem than a lot of other states. 13 Michigan, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, they have far -- and 14 Colorado -- have a far greater problem than we do. 15 So it certainly is in Texas as well, but 16 hopefully they'll find a -- there have been recent 17 reports I presume that are accurate that -- I want to 18 say it's Iowa or Illinois or one of those states where 19 they have found it in white-tail -- or I should -- COVID 20 in white-tail deer. 21 MS. McBRYDE: I'm sorry, I didn't hear you. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They found COVID in 23 white-tail deer. 24 MS. McBRYDE: Yeah. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Which is an odd thing. 32 1 And you know, I'm not even sure why they even tested 2 deer for that. But anyway, I think public awareness is 3 really good. I know parks and wildlife -- it doesn't 4 make a lot of sense to me. I don't understand the 5 statistics. But they have statistically the samples 6 together across the state that seem to show that it's 7 certainly not prevalent, if it even exists in the wild 8 population right now. Even though we know that in a few 9 isolated areas there -- it has been found around 10 facilities. So -- 11 MS. McBRYDE: Well, I know the first case 12 was found in free-ranging deer in Texas. So -- 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, they have it in 14 mule deer and elk free range. 15 MS. McBRYDE: Yes. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And to my knowledge, the 17 white-tail deer that have been found to have it have 18 been near breeding facilities or at breeding facilities. 19 MS. McBRYDE: I believe the one in Uvalde 20 County -- I mean in Val Verde County was not near a 21 breeding facility actually. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's correct and that 23 one's an unknown. That's a puzzle. 24 MS. McBRYDE: Which it could have been a 25 false positive too. 33 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. Right. 2 MS. McBRYDE: There's so many factors that 3 have to be considered. But I think that the information 4 being provided is not accurate because it's not being 5 fact checked. And that's concerning. And which I've 6 been trying to do. But every time you, you know, go 7 down a bunny trail and you end up in briar patch and 8 then that cave you went in on collapsed. So I think 9 that's where a lot of leads are taking a lot of people 10 and it's creating a lot of confusion. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. But I think what 12 you did today is the way to get it out in public 13 awareness and that's going to be good. 14 MS. McBRYDE: Okay. I just wanted to have 15 your support with that. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 17 MS. McBRYDE: Thank y'all. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Thank you. 19 JUDGE KELLY: Thank you. 20 The next item on the agenda is 1.10 21 consider, discuss and take appropriate action to review 22 the liaison responsibilities and determine liaison 23 appointments for 2022. 24 Rather than doing anything unilaterally, I 25 reached out to all of you to see if there's anyone who 34 1 wanted to change about the liaison appointments. Two of 2 you have gotten back with me and told me that they want 3 to keep what they're doing, so -- but I wanted to bring 4 this to talk about it as a group because open meetings 5 don't let us do that. 6 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Well, my view on this 7 is -- and when -- two years ago, three years ago, we 8 decided to split up some of them that where there was 9 two Commissioners on as liaisons would go to one, to 10 where we could talk to one other person rather than just 11 the person that was on that same team or what have you. 12 JUDGE KELLY: I think it's been working 13 good. 14 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Yeah, I think it has. 15 But looking at the makeup here and how there's going to 16 be some new faces down the road, you know, I think we 17 may go back to the two on some of them. A couple people 18 have said they're not going to be seeking a second term 19 and, you know, just for example, I know there's a couple 20 items that Harley has that I wouldn't mind sharing with 21 him to be up to snuff when Harley's gone. And probably 22 some others were mine or what have you. 23 We know they'll be a new spot there coming 24 up. And then, what, two years down the road a couple of 25 these. You know, I might want to go back to being on 35 1 the facility at the AG barn out there with Jonathan to 2 where we're not caught flat-footed when somebody leaves. 3 Does that make sense? 4 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Good thinking. 5 JUDGE KELLY: Well, I would encourage y'all 6 to -- this is a tricky thing to do because open meetings 7 only allows us to talk to one other person about a 8 topic. So if you'll notice, I reached out to each one 9 of y'all individually and did not talk to you about 10 anybody else's. If y'all will talk among yourselves to 11 the extent that you can in accordance with the open 12 meetings act, if there's things you want to adjust, 13 we'll adjust it. I just threw it out there because it's 14 time to do the appointments -- 15 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: It needs to be 16 considered. 17 JUDGE KELLY: -- and I thought it ought to 18 be discussed. 19 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: My response was I 20 really didn't want to shift as I'm just barely getting 21 familiar with what I've started on. But other than 22 that, I have no problem with it. I understand that -- 23 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: And we don't know 24 who's going to be sitting there. And different ones 25 bring different skill sets that would be appropriate for 36 1 some of these liaisons. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'm -- I like kind of 3 the setup we have this year, but I think next year when 4 there will be at least one new Commissioner, probably 5 just one, maybe we'll see how it goes. You don't have a 6 problem with that, do you? You don't have a problem 7 with one new Commissioner? 8 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: No. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. That would be 10 good because I'm not going to run for reelection. So 11 I'm here for three more years. And I have probably more 12 than anybody else right now on the court and I need 13 to, you know -- and some of those are really important. 14 And I need somebody that really wants to be engaged and 15 spend a lot of time. Because some of the -- you know, 16 some of these liaison positions are as needed and some 17 are almost every other day or -- 18 JUDGE KELLY: The two that you have that I 19 think -- I think are the most important that we need 20 your -- we need continuity with would be Animal Services 21 because that's going to be part of our bond issue, and 22 that does require almost daily, certainly weekly input, 23 and the other one is HR. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: HR. Yeah. 25 JUDGE KELLY: Personally. 37 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Those two and I -- I'd 2 like to keep that -- both of those this next year, but I 3 think after that either bring in another person or we 4 can bring in another person now. And with the idea that 5 my, you know, two years or so I'd like to be off of both 6 of those because it really -- you know, you get thrown 7 in the briar patch when you -- and along with the HR is 8 also the insurance pool coordinator. 9 COMMISSIONER BELEW: That's a pretty 10 complicated one. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. You get insurance 12 pool form and then there would be -- you get -- every 13 thing related to insurance comes to you. And some of 14 it's -- so you have to really be -- look through it and 15 see what it is and see who else was copied. I've sent 16 the Sheriff a whole bunch last night. 17 SHERIFF LEITHA: Last night, yeah. 18 JUDGE KELLY: Well, just -- just so the 19 public's aware of what we're dealing with, this is the 20 list of liaison appointments that we deal with. This is 21 the whole page, double spaced. And we try to spread 22 those duties out among the five of us. And in three 23 years, there's only going to be two of us sitting here. 24 So I'm trying to get us prepared for when that happens. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And that's just an 38 1 example to the public of what I'm talking about. The 2 insurance pool coordinator. You know, because it has to 3 go to a person. It can't go to everybody. And it's not 4 that there's any action, it's just there's -- what I was 5 talking about with the Sheriff, a lawsuit. You know, we 6 get a lot of lawsuits filed against the County. Mostly 7 the jail or in the Sheriff's Department anyway. That's 8 just the nature of that business. You know, there's no 9 reason for -- to take action, but I get them -- he 10 didn't get copied. So I need to get -- make sure he's 11 aware of what attorney has been assigned to a lawsuit 12 because it will impact his office. That's the type of 13 thing that it's just a matter of e-mailing or forwarding 14 it to the department that it needs to go to. And 15 usually I get that type of thing to the County Attorneys 16 usually, either gets it originally or she puts it out to 17 somebody to forward it. 18 JUDGE KELLY: Okay. Then the next item on 19 the agenda is item 1.11 consider, discuss and take 20 appropriate action on the County revision of plat and 21 right-of-way policy. Commissioner Belew. 22 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Okay. We had recently 23 a Mr. Crab in here, and he had an issue with his 24 right-of-way because we required people to replat when 25 property changes hands. So as part of that -- 39 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That's not accurate. 2 COMMISSIONER BELEW: What? 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They require a replat 4 when they divide their property. 5 COMMISSIONER BELEW: When they divide their 6 property, yeah. But that's property changing hands. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. But if I sell -- if 8 I sell the property that doesn't require the replat, 9 it's the dividing of property. 10 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Dividing the property. 11 So subdividing the property. And so what I'm -- what 12 I'm seeing here and I talked to our attorney Chuck 13 Kimbrough about this, and the idea that -- and I talked 14 to the County Surveyor. 15 The idea that emerged from the three -- from 16 the two conversations between the three of us is that we 17 might have a more efficient way to do this and that 18 would be to exempt the properties that were established 19 as a road easement prior to 2007 when we had the 20 subdivision rules change. So that -- I think it's more 21 efficient. We don't have people coming back to the 22 Court all the time to ask for a variance. 23 I talked also to Charlie so that's three 24 conversations about how to do this. I just think that 25 there's got to be a more efficient way to do this. 40 1 There are people -- I talked to somebody recently who 2 has a -- wants to do a family partition of exactly ten 3 acres. That would change things for them. It would -- 4 it's going to stress some people. 5 It doesn't mean we wouldn't look at 6 variances in the future, you're always going to have to. 7 But if we could at least eliminate this one. It was the 8 opinion of Mr. Kimbrough that easements are just as good 9 as the right-of-ways and would save us a lot of time and 10 trouble. 11 All we have to do is put a sentence or a 12 paragraph in our subdivision rules that say that these 13 properties that exist with an easement right now, if 14 they're replatted they don't lose a portion of that 15 property and put them in a bind. So I just think that 16 it's a more efficient way to do it if we can do that 17 because we have efficiency, we have consistency. Over 18 time -- now it's not a lot but over time, when the 19 County takes property away from somebody, you lose 20 revenue on that. That's part of it, you have more 21 responsibility for it. So that's part of it. I don't 22 think that's a good idea. 23 And I don't -- you know, this -- we're kind 24 of micro managing if everybody that has one comes back 25 to the court. I'd rather see them do their thing, 41 1 have -- be grandfathered in. Everybody that subdivided 2 and did development after 2007 understands what the 3 rules are. 4 Some of these other people are finding out 5 the hard way. Like the gentleman that came in here the 6 other day. And I just feel like that we want to be as 7 streamlined and efficient unless there's any genuine 8 compelling interest for the County and I don't see any, 9 especially in that particular case. In that case it was 10 a private road, privately maintained. It was a public 11 road, privately maintained, and neither the taxpayer nor 12 the County gained a thing from the County getting a 13 right-of-way there. Because there was an easement that 14 already exists. 15 So it seems to me the more reasonable course 16 and the less burden on the taxpayers, the less that it 17 has the appearance of a taking of some sort. I asked 18 all these different questions of our attorney and he -- 19 he felt like that the easement, and I agree, the 20 easement is the best way to go. Because it's already 21 there. And we have access to everything we need via an 22 easement. If we need to change the road, we need to 23 come into their property a little bit, we already have 24 the easement and that already covers it. So taking away 25 that frontage from somebody that has to -- has to do a 42 1 replat, I just -- I don't think it's best practice 2 because I don't think it's efficient. 3 And it certainly is not the best thing for 4 the taxpayer, the property owner. In the long run, I 5 don't think it's the best thing for the County either. 6 So I wanted to ask if you -- if everybody would consider 7 that we put just a sentence or a paragraph into the 8 subdivision rules that will exempt these properties 9 prior to 2007 from having to go through this and give up 10 a right-of-way. 11 JUDGE KELLY: Post 2007. 12 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Post 2007 where 13 everybody already is subject to those rules. 14 JUDGE KELLY: Well, yeah, you're -- you're 15 talking about post -- 16 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Yeah, that they're 17 grandfathered in with an easement. 18 JUDGE KELLY: Let me kind of set the stage 19 so the public knows what we're talking about. We're in 20 the process of working on revisions to our subdivision 21 rules, as we speak. We hope to have that finalized 22 sometime in this first quarter. I want to get it done 23 before budget. But that's something that's already 24 started. What we're talking about here is when you have 25 to go in and replat. And it's the replat that we're 43 1 talking about. 2 COMMISSIONER BELEW: It triggers it. 3 JUDGE KELLY: It requires a dedication 4 instead of a right-of-way. Kerr County policy has been 5 not to accept an easement for those roads but for them 6 to be dedicated to the County. And that's a policy long 7 before me. Long before most of us on this Court. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It actually was in the 9 rules in '84. 10 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Well, so we found out 11 in the process. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, in the process. 13 Yeah. 14 JUDGE KELLY: And I couldn't agree more with 15 Commissioner Belew, we don't want to micro manage. And 16 we don't want to have to deal with these on a case by 17 case basis, but we do have a variance case on the agenda 18 today. 19 COMMISSIONER BELEW: We do. 20 JUDGE KELLY: And we'll come to a 21 variance -- we do have to deal with them case by case. 22 I'd rather see our subdivision rules be enforced more 23 objectively. And what I mean by that is just like balls 24 and -- call it balls and strikes. Black and white 25 stripes. You call it a ball, you call it a strike, and 44 1 you apply it the same way every time. You know what the 2 strike zone is. That's the way I would like to see the 3 rules, the subdivision rules apply. 4 We've got some wrinkles here of what 5 happened. And part of the problem, and I know we've got 6 a couple people here that do want to address the Court 7 on this, but part of the problem is that some of these 8 subdivisions predate 2007. 9 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Right. 10 JUDGE KELLY: And may even predate 1984. 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: A lot of them do. 12 JUDGE KELLY: And so that doesn't solve the 13 problem for most people that are living in a subdivision 14 this was platted that long ago. And some of these 15 subdivisions are older. You would think that with the 16 subdivision rules having to change in 2007 -- 17 (Phone ringing.) 18 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Your time's up. 19 (Laughter.) 20 MR. PACE: It was on silent. 21 COMMISSIONER BELEW: If these folks ever get 22 to the start doing that to us -- it might be an 23 improvement actually. 24 JUDGE KELLY: I know we've got a couple 25 people here that want to address the Court on this. 45 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Judge, let me -- if I 2 may make a comment on this. But I think -- and I agree 3 with what you're both -- both of y'all said. But I 4 think there's a big distinction that we need to make in 5 the rules. If it's a County maintained road or if it's 6 a private road. And the reason is, if it's a County 7 maintained road, we need that right-of-way because we're 8 responsible for maintaining it. 9 COMMISSIONER BELEW: But if you have an 10 easement, you're already -- 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well -- 12 COMMISSIONER BELEW: -- you already have a 13 road. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- but most of our 15 roads -- or many of them, there isn't an easement. But 16 we -- and we need to get some -- you know, most of our 17 roads are prescriptive easements, which are just -- you 18 get the road only. You don't even -- and you may get 19 the shoulder. That's debatable. So in those 20 situations, we need to get additional property. 21 Now, if it's a private road, that's the 22 responsibility of -- that's part of the -- you know, the 23 risk of people that buy on a private road. It's their 24 responsibility. It's not the County's responsibility. 25 So -- 46 1 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Well, what would you 2 suggest then as somebody that wants to do a family 3 partition and has a piece of property that can be 4 partitioned but it's on -- it's on a county road and 5 they have an easement already? They don't -- and here's 6 the thing, they don't gain anything when the replat 7 happens. They don't gain any extra service from the 8 County. The County doesn't give up anything by that 9 happening. So why should that person then have to give 10 up road frontage? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: They don't. They -- all 12 they have to do is give us a deeded right-of-way. They 13 need to give us -- 14 COMMISSIONER BELEW: It's not included in 15 the plat. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But we -- no, I'm 17 talk -- I'm talking about -- you talking about -- 18 COMMISSIONER BELEW: The plat says that it 19 has to be separate from the right-of-way, which makes -- 20 which that person is giving up property. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, you take any -- 22 any county road, you know -- 23 COMMISSIONER BELEW: That's not the same as 24 an easement though. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Prescriptive easement. 47 1 You only -- you only get the road. Many -- most of our 2 county roads we -- all we actually control is the road 3 surface. But people expect us, and we do handle it, we 4 mow along the side of it. 5 COMMISSIONER BELEW: I know. 6 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We need to have the 7 right to modify those roads. You know, you -- I don't 8 want to own it, I just want a right-of-way to it. And 9 we don't have that right now on a lot of these County 10 roads. 11 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Right now the way it's 12 being -- 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I agree with what 14 you're saying. 15 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Yeah. 16 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I don't want to take -- 17 COMMISSIONER BELEW: They are giving up -- 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- they get -- they keep 19 ownership of the ten acres, but they're giving the 20 County a right-of-way on part of that ten acres. 21 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Okay. As long as it 22 doesn't -- there's no taking in it and deny -- 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 24 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Because, you know, I 25 know there's a legal term for taking. But if you get 48 1 something from me that I didn't want you to get, you 2 took something from me. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 4 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: It was already taken. 5 The developer gave it when he put it in the plat, 6 submitted it to the County, and the County accepted it 7 because of that. 8 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Well, let's me see 9 here. Now you're talking about the fee simple. Is that 10 what you're talking about? 11 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 12 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: Well, I'm talking 13 about -- no, I'm talking about this -- you know, the 14 easement -- the right-of-way easement in -- in this case 15 we had this last week. 16 JUDGE KELLY: Well, it's on the agenda 17 today. 18 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: Yeah. The developer 19 in 1984 or 1986, whenever it was, granted that easement 20 to the County. So it's not we're taking it. It was 21 already -- 22 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Right. But that's not 23 a right-of-way. That's not somebody getting replatting 24 and having -- 25 JUDGE KELLY: Well, it -- it technically is 49 1 a right-of-way. I don't want to debate these terms. 2 COMMISSIONER BELEW: But when you look at a 3 plat and somebody's taking from your property and it's 4 not on your plat anymore -- 5 JUDGE KELLY: The issue -- the issue is the 6 dedication. 7 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Yes. Exactly. 8 JUDGE KELLY: That's the issue. 9 COMMISSIONER BELEW: And that's what Chuck 10 says. 11 JUDGE KELLY: Our subdivision rules require 12 developer when they come to us after requesting plat 13 approval, they have to dedicate those roads so that 14 they're publicly opened and publicly maintained. That's 15 what we require in the subdivision rules. And that's 16 for the big developers. 17 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Right. 18 JUDGE KELLY: That's -- that's the 19 requirement. And that was decided long before most of 20 us were on this Court. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: That all of us were on 22 this Court. 23 JUDGE KELLY: Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER BELEW: And according to 25 Mr. Kimbrough, it's all in the wording of that 50 1 dedication. Which apparently they can be worded 2 different ways. I was not aware of that part of it. 3 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: I'm sure we can get a 4 policy that solves this. Boy, I'm sure for it. Because 5 rather than -- 6 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Right. I think we're 7 all in agreement here that we don't want to take 8 anything away from the taxpayers. We don't want to 9 damage anybody. But I think if we -- if we can figure 10 out a way to just put -- to kind of grandfather in and 11 take it into account what you're talking about, 12 Jonathan, and what Beck's talking about hear, and doing 13 the best possible thing for it, the property owner, 14 bingo, we need to do that. 15 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: I think -- and we need 16 to really lean on Chuck to get some advice here. I 17 don't think we have to reinvent the wheel here because 18 other counties have been through the same thing. 19 There's -- there's language out there that other 20 counties have that we can adopt or tweak and insert, I 21 would think, and he should be aware of it. 22 COMMISSIONER BELEW: He said most of 23 everybody's with easements. TxDOT is the one that does 24 the right-of-ways. 25 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Right. 51 1 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Most counties don't. 2 And easement should provide what we need. If we need to 3 expand the road or fix a blind curve or whatever. And 4 Charlie, if you want to say anything about it, you and I 5 have discussed this at length. If you want to add 6 anything, please do. 7 MR. HASTINGS: I think what we need is the 8 policy in our regulation clear, if there's an exemption, 9 what is that exemption. So that we're not wasting time 10 trying to get variances for things that are unnecessary. 11 It's unfortunate -- our rules have been this way since 12 1984. Exactly this. Don't ask me why in 1986 they did 13 it as a road easement. I don't know. Maybe they had a 14 separate discussion and decided it was okay. Maybe 15 nobody was looking. But -- 16 COMMISSIONER BELEW: That's a lot of it. 17 MR. HASTINGS: It probably was. And you've 18 also gotta remember, although we had subdivision 19 regulations in 1984, we didn't have a County Engineer in 20 '84. I think the first one was '87. And so it's just 21 one of those things. But clarification is what the 22 public's looking for, and what I'm looking for to help 23 the public so that we can not waste much time. 24 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Well, I don't just want 25 clarification; I want to make sure that people have the 52 1 right to their property. Ultimately, they're -- while 2 in a small measure, that property brings in revenue for 3 the County. It may be a small little strip of frontage, 4 but it brings in revenue for the County. 5 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Well, the least 6 intrusive for the property owner. 7 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Least intrusive. Thank 8 you. So I don't know that we need to take action on 9 anything. 10 JUDGE KELLY: Well, before we take our 11 morning break, I do want to give the homeowners and 12 people that are here that wanted to address the Court. 13 I know Joe's here and Gene's here. Is there anything 14 you'd like to address to the Court at this time? Please 15 approach the podium. 16 MR. STOUDT: Well, I thank you -- 17 JUDGE KELLY: Identify yourself and where 18 you live. 19 MR. STOUDT: Yes, sir. I am Gene STOUDT. I 20 live at 430 Kerrville Country Drive. And you gentlemen 21 have touched on everything that I've written here, so I 22 really don't know if I should read it because you did an 23 outstanding job. 24 And Harley, you are in my Precinct and we 25 haven't met and we have not talked, and everything you 53 1 said is exactly on board. So I'm going to do this 2 little -- it took me a lot longer to write this than it 3 is probably to say it. And you guys brought your bullet 4 proof vests this morning, I see that. 5 COMMISSIONER BELEW: His is checkered. 6 (Laughter.) 7 MR. STOUDT: But I do appreciate you taking 8 the time to listen to us and I'm going to just run down 9 my list here. 10 Good morning, Commissioners and Judge. My 11 name is Gene Stoudt. I reside at 430 Kerrville Country 12 Drive, in Kerrville Country Estates. I am on the Board 13 of the Kerrville Country property owners association and 14 chair of the architect committee. Thank you for hearing 15 our concerns. 16 And today there are three things that I'd 17 like to discuss. Owner of five acres do not lose their 18 property value. The County won't incur unintended 19 consequences, lawsuits, et cetera. We could go through 20 a bunch. Request that the County table this decision on 21 issues -- on this issue until further research. 22 Kerr Country Estates, part of my job is that 23 I approve the building sites and plans. Each new owner 24 is to submit a house plan, a lot plan, a plot plan, the 25 location of their building, the water well and their 54 1 sewer. And if they are going to subdivide it, they must 2 have at least a minimum of five acres. That's in our 3 rules and regs. 4 I'm not really understanding whether the 5 County is making sure that the roads are wide enough, 6 but I hear your complaints or views. When a 7 right-of-way is approved, a right-of-way is just that. 8 It's access for the city, state, county, and the utility 9 companies to be able to access that area. And yes, when 10 the property owner was granted the easement, the initial 11 plat decades ago -- in our case I believe it was in 12 1972, John? When we were platted. And they had already 13 dedicated the land for public use and the intent to 14 claim the ownership -- our intent was to claim the 15 ownership, you guys had the right-of-way or the County 16 had the right-of-way. 17 Now, do we still claim that ownership if you 18 do deed it or -- and if so, do we still pay taxes on it? 19 I mean, this thing could go anywhere. If so, do we 20 still pay ownership, do we pay taxes on it? If not, do 21 we get that portion deducted from the tax role? Don't 22 even want to go there. My understanding, and this is an 23 example of where you were going, that a homeowner with 24 5.10 acres is allowed to drill a water well. And if 25 they have less, they are not. That is a County -- I 55 1 have not done the research on that. I've been told that 2 that is a County rule. Great, I love it. That's one of 3 the things that I check on when they bring the plans to 4 me. The rules imposed by the County. 5 So a person that has 5.01 acres and the 6 right-of-way is .02 -- I just threw numbers in there. 7 You could pick any number you wanted. Then his 8 investment is now deemed unsuitable for a house or a 9 building. You can't drill a water well. If he bought 10 it for a reason to -- or subdivide it, then they can't 11 put that water well in it. And that's where you were 12 going, Harley. I believe that you're right on it. The 13 investment now -- the investor has now lost value in 14 that. 15 So if someone has bought that property 16 thinking that they were going to put a house on it for 17 the future, then he can't do that. Unintended 18 consequences again. And there's so many areas to this. 19 I talked to some people and I -- they said it's 20 nonending. Unintended consequences. 21 I ask that the Court -- that you table this 22 until there's further research and post a public notice, 23 if so, and review it with the County surveyor and the 24 council. My understanding is in 19 -- in 2007 no 25 properties had been platted to the center of the road. 56 1 So maybe to exempt the right-of-way dedication for plats 2 prior to 2007. We never talked. So you -- you got the 3 same information that I got. Basically grandfather them 4 in for the requirement proposed in front of us today or 5 whatever it was. 6 My little note here, and I just did it for 7 the -- probably no good reason but you're going to get 8 to hear it anyway. Sometimes we make tough decisions 9 and have to do the right thing. Please do not be 10 blinded by the policies or look back on mistakes that 11 we've made in the past because we all make mistakes. 12 The only people that don't make mistakes are those that 13 don't do anything. And by golly, you guys have to do a 14 lot and I appreciate it. I hope that you will take this 15 under consideration and avoid any unintended 16 consequences that the County and all the rest of us may 17 have. And I thank you for your time. 18 JUDGE KELLY: And Gene, just to clarify, 19 we're not attempting to do anything right now. This is 20 the way it was. This is what we inherited. So when you 21 ask us to table, we don't have -- we're not making a 22 proposal yet. 23 MR. STOUDT: Okay. 24 JUDGE KELLY: What we're trying to do is 25 figure out how to enforce our rules. That's what we're 57 1 struggling to do. Because what we want is to have 2 uniform enforcement that applies to everybody equally. 3 That's what we want. 4 MR. STOUDT: And I appreciate that. And 5 that's exactly right. I just want the Court to 6 understand, people that have five acres, and there's 7 some here in this room that have 5.08 acres to be exact, 8 this rule, if it was to get in effect would -- they 9 can't build on it. 10 JUDGE KELLY: And to clarify because we've 11 got Tom Jones here, that's not the County rule, that is 12 the Headwater Groundwater conservation rule. 13 MR. STOUDT: Okay. And it's a good rule. I 14 mean -- 15 JUDGE KELLY: Right. And we like it. 16 MR. STOUDT: Yeah. I like it. But I -- 17 my -- part of my job is to make sure that they have 18 that. So if you take that portion away, then they lose 19 that. They can't drill that well. And then that's -- 20 JUDGE KELLY: So that's -- that's the 21 Headwaters issue; not a County issue. 22 MR. STOUDT: Okay. 23 COMMISSIONER BELEW: But we don't want to 24 harm any property owners in Kerr County. 25 MR. STOUDT: Sure. And I appreciate it. 58 1 Thank you, gentlemen. 2 JUDGE KELLY: Joe, would you like to address 3 us? 4 MR. TAYLOR: Thank you, Judge. My name is 5 Joe Taylor. And I read in the Sunday paper that there 6 is a new subdivision that is trying to get approval from 7 y'all out Interstate 10, 473, and the way it's platted 8 is that the County owns the -- the road and the property 9 owners own up to the road or to the edge of the road. 10 And that's smart. I like that. I think that that has 11 got vision and foresight. 12 The problem is, is that when you look 13 backwards at the way it used to be done where properties 14 went to the center of the road. I bought 10 acres. I 15 bought ten acres knowing that I could sell five acres in 16 our subdivision. And I've been paying taxes on those 10 17 acres. And when I bought the 10 acres, it was valued at 18 10 acres. And so if I sell it to my family, I think 19 there's a family exemption. But if I sell it -- if my 20 daughter says, I'm going to teach school somewhere else, 21 dad, you're going to have to sell -- then that's my 22 retirement. Having my daughter live next to me is my 23 retirement. 24 So if I have to sell it to a stranger, now 25 I've subdivided 10 acres. And if you interpret that as 59 1 creating a new subdivision, it gives the impression like 2 this big ranch out here on Interstate 10 is making these 3 new subdivisions. Well, then if you -- if you take the 4 frontage where that road was, I have less than 10 acres. 5 I'm no longer able to sell five acres. That's the 6 unintended consequences. And then the County would own 7 the portion that's right in front of mine. But until 8 the guy across the street, Mr. Pike, sells his or 9 subdivides his, you'll only own the left half and not 10 the right half, depending on which direction you're 11 traveling. So then everybody's coming up for a 12 different variance and causing a whole lot of struggles 13 for you all and there's a lot of tension and a lot of 14 stress. 15 And when I talked to Lee Voelkel, he said, 16 you know, if you just grandfathered everything before 17 2007 subdivisions and -- and don't -- don't call a 18 division of 10 acres a new subdivision in an existing 19 subdivision. That's -- that's where we get into 20 trouble. So -- 21 JUDGE KELLY: Joe, you and I talked this 22 weekend. Let's clarify. If you're talking about a 23 family partition, like Commissioner Belew talked about 24 it, those do not require platting. 25 MR. TAYLOR: But what if I sell it to a 60 1 stranger? 2 JUDGE KELLY: That requires platting because 3 you're dividing your property. 4 MR. TAYLOR: Right. 5 JUDGE KELLY: That's -- that's what triggers 6 the application of these old subdivision rules that 7 you're complaining about is because it is being 8 subdivided. 9 MR. TAYLOR: That's -- and so the 10 interpretation is if -- if it's an old established 11 subdivision before 2007, then if a property owner 12 divides a portion of it, if that's all grandfathered and 13 not defined as a new subdivision, then everything's 14 clear. No landowner feels like their property is being 15 taken away from them. When I paid for it, I paid taxes 16 on it. Then I lose and it has all these unintended 17 consequences. And everybody's upset. 18 I just think that if the County agent and 19 other people say, let's just grandfather those in before 20 the rule was made in 2007, and any new subdivision, that 21 is a newly developed subdivision, do the new rules. I 22 think it's clear cut. It's simple. And that would be 23 my recommendation. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. Just a comment. 25 And -- and I'm getting into probably more detail than I 61 1 should. 2 JUDGE KELLY: You're going into the weeds 3 here. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll go in the weeds 5 just a little bit. I agree with everything you're 6 saying. And we don't want to -- especially on a private 7 road, there's no question that we don't want to -- 8 MR. TAYLOR: It's not a private road. It's 9 a -- it's a county road. 10 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. A county road. 11 We don't want to reduce the amount of acreage you own. 12 MR. TAYLOR: Thank you. 13 JUDGE KELLY: Let me just clarify. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But -- but when you -- 15 when -- when you're in a subdivision -- when you divide 16 land, by State Law you're a subdivider. We can't change 17 State Law. 18 MR. TAYLOR: But you can grandfather that 19 towards the -- 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 21 MR. TAYLOR: -- subdivision that was created 22 before 2007. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can do -- we can do 24 what you're asking, I believe, on the ownership of the 25 property. 62 1 MR. TAYLOR: Yeah. I think it's just real 2 clear that way. Our church gave Nimitz Elementary 3 School, KISD, an easement from across our property on 4 Ranchero Road and Valley View. We gave it to them 5 for -- I think it was one dollar. And they maintain it. 6 They own the easement. They take care of it. But the 7 land underneath belongs to us. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 9 MR. TAYLOR: And if in fact, the 10 administrator called Mr. Faust and he said, we'd like to 11 buy that from you-all. Well, if he said we passed a 12 rule that says we're taking it. Well, I mean, we're -- 13 I'm trying to be a nice preacher, but that would really 14 greatly anger me. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're in agreement on 16 what you want. 17 MR. TAYLOR: Okay. 18 JUDGE KELLY: You are a nice preacher, Joe. 19 What I'm trying to do is I'm trying to get people to use 20 the proper terminology because it's going to make it a 21 whole lot easier. We are in the process of working on 22 revising subdivision rules. This is clearly on our 23 radar screen. It's clearly going to be addressed. 24 MR. TAYLOR: Yeah. 25 JUDGE KELLY: And there will be public 63 1 meetings for everybody to have input on what we do. 2 Because that's -- that's what we -- 3 MR. TAYLOR: Thank you. Thank you very 4 much. 5 JUDGE KELLY: But what I was trying to 6 clarify, we're talking about Kerrville Country Estates. 7 That is privately owned. The roads in that subdivision 8 are privately owned. 9 MR. TAYLOR: They're not County roads? 10 JUDGE KELLY: They're County maintained. 11 MR. TAYLOR: Okay. 12 JUDGE KELLY: But you own to the middle of 13 the road on your side -- 14 MR. TAYLOR: Right. 15 JUDGE KELLY: -- and your neighbor on across 16 the street owns to the middle of the road. 17 MR. TAYLOR: Right. 18 JUDGE KELLY: But the County's got an 19 easement so that that is a public use. 20 MR. TAYLOR: Yes. 21 JUDGE KELLY: Private ownership. Public 22 use. 23 MR. TAYLOR: Okay. 24 JUDGE KELLY: Okay? 25 MR. TAYLOR: So if you all own it, do you 64 1 only own the left side? 2 JUDGE KELLY: If that were the case, if 3 what -- what -- if that's the way it unfolded, that's 4 what it would be. But in the subdivisions we're talking 5 about now that we're working on, the big one out here, 6 the Hideout, the one on 471? 7 MR. TAYLOR: Uh-huh. 8 JUDGE KELLY: There we've required that that 9 roadway, that right-of-way, which includes the roadway 10 itself, the paved road, and the shoulders -- 11 MR. TAYLOR: Uh-huh. 12 JUDGE KELLY: -- that -- that is dedicated 13 to the County. 14 MR. TAYLOR: That's great. 15 JUDGE KELLY: And -- and it was that way 16 since 1984, but certainly since 2007. Those are the 17 rules that we're working under right now. That's what's 18 required is that it be dedicated. Now, when we're 19 talking about subdivisions and partitions, those are two 20 very important concepts that you need to keep clearly in 21 your mind because they're different. 22 When you partition it, you partition -- 23 it's a family partition is what we're calling it. And 24 they're exempt from subdivision rules. 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Some subdivision rules. 65 1 JUDGE KELLY: Some -- yeah, some subdivision 2 rules. 3 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Now, the one we had the 4 other day is an existing subdivision. So the rules -- 5 and I read them, are different for an existing 6 subdivision. 7 JUDGE KELLY: That's right. And that's 8 because 1986 they went and formed that subdivision. And 9 so now what -- and so -- and so if you divide your 10 property with your family, partition is with your 11 family, these rules -- this rule does not apply to you. 12 But if you're going to divide it and sell it 13 to someone other than your family, then the subdivision 14 rules do apply. And that's subdividing versus 15 partitioning. And I'm just trying to get the 16 terminology right. And we understand the result can be 17 unintended consequences. Nobody really wants to take 18 anything. But we do want to enforce the subdivision 19 rules and we're trying to figure out how we can do 20 that -- 21 MR. TAYLOR: Right. 22 JUDGE KELLY: -- consistently with everybody 23 else's interest. 24 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: And hopefully we're 25 going to draw a conclusion within the next two or three 66 1 months. 2 MR. TAYLOR: Well, thank you all. And -- 3 and if my daughter decides not to purchase it or receive 4 it and I have to sell it to a stranger for my 5 retirement, then I'm in that situation where those 6 unintended consequences really mess me up badly, so -- 7 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: And who's going to 8 buy it? 9 MR. TAYLOR: Nobody's going to buy it. They 10 can't -- 11 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Because they can't 12 put a well on it. 13 MR. TAYLOR: Right. And -- 14 JUDGE KELLY: If you'd like to address the 15 Court, you need to come to the podium. 16 MR. TAYLOR: Thank y'all very much. Bless 17 y'all. 18 MR. HASTINGS: Judge, one question. And 19 Joe, before you go. Does that 10 acres that you have, 20 is it an existing subdivision? 21 MR. TAYLOR: Yes. 22 MR. HASTINGS: Okay. 23 MR. TAYLOR: Kerrville Country Estates. 24 MR. HASTINGS: So -- and if there is one -- 25 one more clarification that -- because I think we've 67 1 been stating -- we've not stated that if you're an 2 existing subdivision and you want to do a family 3 partition, because you're -- you -- there's already a 4 plat on file, your revising that plat so there's a 5 revision of plat process. So you're -- you are back to 6 the platting process and now you're back to dedicating 7 right-of-way because that's what our rules say, and 8 that's why we're here today because that's what happens. 9 MR. TAYLOR: Good clarification. 10 MR. HASTINGS: Yeah. So there -- there is 11 -- so everything you were worried about is something to 12 worry about. That's what we're trying to fix today. 13 MR. TAYLOR: Oh, I thought they said I 14 didn't have to worry about it. 15 MR. HASTINGS: Remember if they fix it, you 16 won't have to worry about it. 17 MR. TAYLOR: Can I get a vote of one, two, 18 three, four -- five, that I don't need to worry about 19 it? 20 COMMISSIONER BELEW: You'll have to go with 21 the latest revision and that's it right there. 22 JUDGE KELLY: And it's complicated as you 23 can see. 24 COMMISSIONER BELEW: So we're trying to 25 uncomplicate it. 68 1 JUDGE KELLY: We're trying to figure it out. 2 MR. TAYLOR: Well, I just think it's real -- 3 it's just real simple if you just grandfather all 4 subdivisions that were created and their further 5 subdivision within that subdivision. It's clearer. And 6 there's no more problem. 7 MR. HASTINGS: That last thing was not true. 8 JUDGE KELLY: Well, it's just complicated. 9 MR. TAYLOR: Okay. 10 JUDGE KELLY: We've got to sit down and -- 11 MR. TAYLOR: Thank y'all for working on it. 12 JUDGE KELLY: Let's take about a ten minute 13 break and we'll come back at 10:20. 14 (Recess.) 15 JUDGE KELLY: Okay. Come back to order. 16 Continuing on our 10 o'clock agenda. We're running a 17 little late. Item 1.12 consider, discuss and take 18 appropriate action on a request for variance for Section 19 6.03.C.16, 6.03.C.18; 7.02 and 7.06 of the Kerr County 20 Subdivision Regulations for Verde Park Estates, Section 21 II, Revision of Plat for Tract 5; regarding the 22 ownership of road easements. Eric Ashley. 23 MR. ASHLEY: Yes, sir. I understand y'all 24 discussed this already. But since it's taking three 25 months of y'all's time and my time and everybody else's 69 1 time, I might as well say what's on my heart here. So 2 being a surveyor, did you know there's directions for 3 surveying in the Bible? 4 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Here we go. 5 MR. ASHLEY: Remove not the ancient 6 landmarks and boundaries which our forefather's have 7 set. Well, my forefather's were the surveyors that came 8 before me and they marked property lines in the middle 9 of the road easement and private property owners bought 10 the property to the middle of the road easement and by 11 God they own it. 12 When you read the Bible verse out of 13 context, sometimes you oughta read the whole paragraph. 14 Sometimes you oughta read the whole book. Sometimes 15 you'll need to be in the perspective of the person that 16 wrote the Bible verse. And when you understand the 17 perspective of the person that wrote the Bible verse, 18 there's a different meaning than the sentence of any 19 interpreted individual. 20 I am requesting a variance for Section -- 21 all right. Y'all asked me to do this now. I didn't -- 22 I'm sorry. Y'all asked me to do it. The new variance 23 rules. Okay. Special variance 6.03.C.16, 6.03.C.18, 24 7.02, and 7.06 of the Kerr County Subdivision Rules and 25 Regulations. As currently being interpreted by our 70 1 County Engineers for the Verde Park Estates Section II, 2 revision of plat for Tract 5. 3 My clients are Herman and Kevin Kreb and Pam 4 Kreb. Undue hardship will result from requiring strict 5 compliance to the rules as currently interpreted. There 6 are special circumstances affecting the land involved 7 such that strict application of the provisions of these 8 rules and regulations will deprive the owner of the 9 reasonable ownership of his property, in fact, as 10 approved by Commissioners of 1986, Volume 5, Page 235 of 11 the plat records of Kerr County, Texas. 12 The variance is necessary for the 13 preservation and enjoyment of substantial property 14 rights of ownership, title, fee and possession, 15 including the monetary value when sold. Granting a 16 variance would not be detrimental to public health, 17 safety or welfare or injurious to any other property in 18 the area. 19 Granting of a variance will not have the 20 effect of preventing the ordering subdivision of other 21 land in the area and is consistent with the general 22 purpose and intent -- intent is a big word. Why were 23 the rules written in the first place? For a new 24 subdivision -- of the Kerr County subdivision rules and 25 regulations that historically interpreted and enforced. 71 1 The 50-foot wide public road easement which 2 has been dedicated forever to the public by the recorded 3 plat is still in full effect. Any effort to rededicate 4 a portion of the road easement again serves no purpose 5 and is, in fact, impractical. 6 Private property owner has been paying taxes 7 on a strip of land for decades. Paid good money for it 8 and has a deed to it. If the strip is separated from 9 parent track, it cannot be sold separately and has 10 diminished the value of the parent tract. Taxes have 11 been paid for decades for nothing. For this reason, the 12 use of the land between the edge of the road and the 13 easement right-of-way line should remain privately owned 14 for use by the landowner as he sees fit, so long as he 15 does not impede the public use of the easement. The 16 County does not maintain the road. 17 Time honored tradition after 2007 of 18 respecting existing subdivisions as approved by the 19 Commissioners Court prior to 2007, where additional 20 right-of-way dedications have been exempted by 21 grandfathering them from requirement when replatted to 22 be maintained in perpetuity. 23 A rule should be in the best interest of the 24 public, be practical, make common sense, and protect 25 private property rights. This can and should be easily 72 1 clarified when the rules are soon rewritten. 2 My prayer is that County surveyor will be 3 included and his opinions respected in the rewrite. 4 He's a wise man and he's been dealing with this his 5 whole life. And I think there's probably not a person 6 in this County that has more knowledge of land law than 7 Lee Voelkel, including the local attorney. 8 A simple sentence such as, Section 9 6.03.C.16; 6.03.C.18, 7.02, and 7.06 do not apply to 10 subdivisions approved by the Court prior to 2007. 11 Problem solved. This is often referred to as a 12 grandfather rule. It seems to be a good common sense 13 solution. 14 A revision of plat, especially in a case of 15 family partition to maintain all private property rights 16 without exception. Let's focus on over-zealous 17 developers, guys. Let's leave the little guys alone. 18 I was looking at the Texas Government Code, 19 which is often quoted here, Foundation of the 20 Subdivision Rules. And it says, Commissioners may adopt 21 rules which allow the division of property in the 22 platted subdivision by metes and bounds. The family 23 should be exempt from the subdivision process 24 regardless. Because of the cost and the time delays and 25 because we should favor -- our laws should favor the 73 1 families and the private property owners. Thank you. 2 JUDGE KELLY: What do you want to do? 3 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: Again, not for all the 4 reasons you just stated, but I -- I do encourage the 5 passage of a motion to accept this variance. And the 6 main reason I think it should is because on the plat we 7 have a road creating a corner or a side of this lot 8 that's not even there. It -- it's there on a piece of 9 paper but there's no road there at all. And there's no 10 intent of using it. It doesn't impede anybody else from 11 using it. To me, that's grounds for a variance at least 12 in this case. 13 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Second. 14 JUDGE KELLY: We've got a motion and a 15 second to grant a variance as presented. 16 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: Yes. 17 JUDGE KELLY: Any discussion? 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Agree. 19 JUDGE KELLY: Okay. Those in favor raise 20 your hand. And I'm just going to abstain. I'm trying 21 to enforce rules. So that passes, four, zero, one. 22 Moving on to item 1.13 consider, discuss and 23 take appropriate action for the Court to approve a final 24 plat for the Hideout Ranch and accept Bond Number 25 L256051-2131 in the amount of $1,828,024.00 for 74 1 associated construction improvements in Mountain Home, 2 Texas. Precinct 4. Mr. Hastings. 3 MR. HASTINGS: Thank you, Judge. This 4 proposed subdivision consists of property located in 5 Kerr County and Gillespie County. It includes portions 6 of an unofficial subdivision known as Harper Valley. 7 Access to the subdivision will be off of FM 8 479 in Kerr County at two locations where they have two 9 entrances. The developer's contractor began 10 construction before subdivision plans had been approved, 11 and a notice of violation was sent out on November 12th, 12 2021. The developer took immediate corrective action 13 and is now in compliance. The developer has also sent 14 information stating that no lots have been sold. That's 15 in your packet. 16 The County Engineer request the Court 17 approve a final plat for the Hideout Ranch and accept a 18 performance bond for the associated construction 19 improvements in Mountain Home, Texas. Precinct 4. 20 And that is Bond Number L256051-2131 in the 21 amount of $1,828,024.00. 22 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: I move for approval. 23 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Second. 24 JUDGE KELLY: Got a motion and a second to 25 approve the final plat for the Hideout Ranch. Any 75 1 discussion? 2 Charlie, what -- we know they did these 3 things before the plat was presented to us. I don't 4 think they -- they laid out the roads, surveyed the 5 lots -- 6 MR. HASTINGS: Yes, sir. 7 JUDGE KELLY: -- and had a big tent sale or 8 something. What -- what was it they did? 9 MR. HASTINGS: My understanding was that the 10 tent sale was a presale. My understanding is that 11 those -- whatever lots were sold have not -- they've not 12 closed on those properties. That's my understanding. 13 And I -- I don't know that for a fact other than -- but 14 that's what I've been told. 15 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: More or less 16 contingent on being approved and everything, I think. 17 That's what I understand. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's pretty common for 19 developers to presell kind of. I guess kind of pre- 20 reserve lots. They don't sell them; they're reserving 21 them. 22 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: They don't sign on the 23 dotted line, but you got first shot of whatever. 24 JUDGE KELLY: But this is one where they 25 actually laid out the roads. They did and put the base 76 1 down and made them take the base back up. 2 MR. HASTINGS: The base has been taken up. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And this is another 4 reason why preliminary plats are good. Because, you 5 know, we all know this but the State obviously doesn't. 6 JUDGE KELLY: The State well knows. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: And you know, developers 8 are able under our rules to work on roads and things 9 after the preliminary -- between the preliminary plat 10 and final plat. And you know, and that's when a lot of 11 it gets done during that process and -- but the State 12 has other ideas, or legislature. 13 MR. HASTINGS: Well, what they -- what they 14 did was they started on -- they went too far with the 15 construction of those roads without approved 16 construction plans. 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 18 MR. HASTINGS: They do now, as of last week, 19 have approved construction plans. That's been 20 finalized. It may have been the week before. I can't 21 remember the exact date. 22 I will also note that in your packets the 23 preliminary plat copy that you have in there is missing 24 a vicinity map on it. But the mylar copies that we'll 25 hand to Jackie here in a little bit have a vicinity map 77 1 on there to show the location of the subdivision. It 2 was on original submittal. It got lost in the shuffle 3 somehow and it -- it's back on the final. But the one 4 that you have in your packet, that is missing. So if 5 you notice the vicinity map was missing, that -- we got 6 it corrected. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. 8 JUDGE KELLY: Any other discussion? We got 9 a motion and a second to approve the final plat for the 10 Hideout Ranch in Precinct 4. Those in favor raise your 11 hand. Opposed? Four one. 12 MRS. DOWDY: Who was opposed to it? 13 JUDGE KELLY: I was. I am. 14 Moving on to item 1.14 consider, discuss and 15 take appropriate action for the Court to approve the 16 final plat for Cypress Vine. Charlie Hastings. 17 MR. HASTINGS: This proposal creates five 18 lots with frontage along Bartel Road in Comfort, Texas. 19 It also dedicates 1.034 acres of right-of-way along 20 Bartel Road. Lots 1, 2, 4, and 5 will be between 5.001 21 acres and 5.011 acres. Lot 3 will be 7.381 acres. 22 We have the -- the plat. There's not 23 anything technically wrong with the plat that's in front 24 of you. It's ready to be filed with the exception, the 25 only thing that we're missing is the drainage report. 78 1 All our subdivision regulations require lots with 2 five -- or subdivisions with five or more lots or lots 3 that are less then 20 acres to have some drainage 4 calculations done. That hasn't been provided yet. I 5 don't know what it's going to show because this 6 particular subdivision is being done along an existing 7 road. 8 So the developer is not building a new road 9 or changing the drainage other than what it was the day 10 that he bought the land. So it probably be a real 11 simple letter from their engineer, we just don't have it 12 yet. Because of that, we're asking the Court to 13 conditionally approve this plat subject to us receiving 14 that final engineering report of drainage report. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So move. 16 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Second. 17 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: Second. 18 JUDGE KELLY: We've got a motion and a 19 second to approve the final plat approval for Cypress 20 Vine and Bartel Road just outside of Comfort. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's conditional 22 approval. 23 JUDGE KELLY: Conditional approval. Yes. 24 Any discussion? Those in favor raise your hand. 25 Unanimous, five zero. 79 1 Item 1.15 consider, discuss and take 2 appropriate action for the Court to approve and 3 authorize the County Judge to execute Change Order 4 No. 1 to the East Kerr/Center Point Wastewater 5 Collection Project Phase II contract in the amount of 6 $57,371.58. Mr. Hastings. 7 MR. HASTINGS: This item will authorize the 8 execution of Change Order No. 1 to the contract for the 9 East Kerr/Center Point Wastewater Collection Project 10 Phase II to provide for the replacement of 28 cleanout 11 covers in the roadways with locking cleanout covers and 12 for the installation of about 95 feet of force main by 13 horizontal directional drilling instead of cut and cover 14 construction. The Change Order and backup information 15 have been attached to the agenda bill. The Change Order 16 was reviewed and vetted by the engineer, Tetra Tech, and 17 recommended for execution. 18 Several of the cleanout covers in the 19 roadways that were installed in Phase I and they have 20 been popping up as a result of traffic driving over 21 them. While the cleanout frames and covers are cast 22 iron and they are traffic rated, the covers do not 23 include a locking system and some of them pop up and off 24 after repeated tire impacts. The hole left by the 25 cleanout when the cast iron lid has popped off is a 80 1 hazard to other motor vehicles and may cause tire 2 damage. 3 A portion of this Change Order will allow 4 for the replacement of all of the cleanout frames and 5 covers in Phase I with a locking cleanout and cover to 6 prevent the inadvertent opening of the cleanouts in the 7 future. 8 A portion of force main C-F is across a 9 natural low area. It appears that the area was once 10 used as a dumping place for trash and debris by the 11 property owners, especially downstream of the crossing. 12 Upon clearing the area for the lift station it was 13 determined that there is a possibility that conventional 14 cut and cover construction might result in the 15 disturbance of some materials. 16 To avoid disturbing the existing condition 17 and thus creating a situation that requires remediation, 18 it was determined that the best way to cross the low 19 area would be to install the force main with horizontal 20 directional drilling. In addition, this method would 21 eliminate the need to remove two mature trees in the 22 same area. 23 So there's -- there's lots of benefits to 24 doing this. It's normal. But -- and we have provisions 25 for it in the contract. But it does take a Change 81 1 Order. This will change the contract amount by 2 $57,371.58. The new contract total for Phase II will be 3 $10,623,326.57. The contract time currently is 450 4 days. This will add 105 days. The new contract total 5 days will be 555 days. 6 The County Engineer recommends that the 7 Court authorize the County Judge to execute Change Order 8 No. 1 to the East Kerr/Center Point Wastewater 9 Collection Project Phase II contract in the amount of 10 $57,371.58. 11 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: I move. I so move. 12 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 13 JUDGE KELLY: We've got a motion and a 14 second to approve the contract on the East Kerr/Center 15 Point Wastewater Collection Project as presented. Any 16 other discussion? 17 COMMISSIONER BELEW: I have a question. 18 These -- these manhole covers that are popping up or 19 where -- 20 MR. HASTINGS: Cleanout covers. Yes, sir. 21 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Cleanout covers. 22 How -- what's the size? What are the dimensions? 23 MR. HASTINGS: Six inch diameter. So when 24 the lid pops up, you've got a six-inch hole in the road. 25 COMMISSIONER BELEW: And was this -- this is 82 1 done elsewhere. Why -- why was this kind of thing put 2 in here? I mean -- 3 MR. HASTINGS: Well, this fixes the Phase 1 4 cleanouts that are popping up. 5 COMMISSIONER BELEW: I understand where you 6 -- what you want out of this. Why do they have to be 7 replaced? Why didn't we get the right thing to begin 8 with? 9 MR. HASTINGS: I don't know the answer to 10 that. 11 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Is this not part of the 12 original bid? 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It was specified -- the 14 covers that were specified were not supposed to do this. 15 But they are. 16 COMMISSIONER BELEW: So it's standard 17 product. Shouldn't we have a way to -- to get our money 18 back on that? We're just going to throw all those away 19 and call it a loss or can we -- 20 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Yeah. Sorry, we made 21 a mistake? 22 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Yeah, that doesn't cut 23 it with me. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean -- but the ones 25 that were installed were -- and specified were supposed 83 1 to not do this. But they are. I mean, I don't know -- 2 COMMISSIONER BELEW: That falls on the 3 contractor. That doesn't fall on us. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. We -- it doesn't 5 fall on the contractor. It calls on the specifications. 6 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: The manufacturer. 7 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Well, some -- somebody 8 besides the County should pay for that. For the 9 replacement of those at least. The other part of it, 10 avoiding the trash and not killing trees, that's another 11 matter. But replacement of faulty parts -- we shouldn't 12 -- we shouldn't take the hit on that. 13 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: I don't disagree with 14 you. But I -- I know this process. We need to 15 follow-up on that if we can get remedy. But we -- 16 MR. HASTINGS: I think they need to be -- if 17 we just follow-up with the original contractor for 18 Phase 1 and -- 19 COMMISSIONER BELEW: What's -- what is it 20 made out of? 21 MR. HASTINGS: Cast iron. 22 COMMISSIONER BELEW: So we just take a trip 23 to scrap solutions and we're done? Is that it? I think 24 we oughta get our money back on that and the County 25 shouldn't be -- 84 1 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Or it should be 2 replaced. 3 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Yeah. They replace 4 them with a better product. They can take that and 5 reuse it someplace else. They can repurpose that if 6 they want to. Come get them. Get us some good ones. 7 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: I'm concerned about a 8 delay. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I think we need 10 to do it. And I also agree, I mean that -- it's a good 11 point. That we should go back either on the -- 12 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Well, we need to hold 13 somebody's feet to the fire on this. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, on the 15 accountability as to why they're not working properly. 16 And I don't know -- you'd have to look at the 17 specifications. If they were specified. In which case 18 you need to get Tetra Tech's help. 19 MR. HASTINGS: We can have Tetra Tech get 20 with the bonding company for the Phase I contractor. 21 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Yeah, it's a bonded 22 issue so -- 23 MR. HASTINGS: Yes. 24 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Yeah. Okay. So what 25 do we -- what do we want to do? Make that part of the 85 1 motion or what? How are we going to follow up on that 2 and make sure we don't get -- 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We can make it part of 4 the motion that we pursue it. I mean, you know, whether 5 we -- 6 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: It's that or pass, I 7 mean -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, we don't need a 9 pass it because we need to do it. We need to get these 10 things fixed and we need -- the boring needs to get 11 done. 12 COMMISSIONER BELEW: That's a lot of extra 13 time. That's four more months, isn't it? 14 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: We need some answers. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So I'm fine with part of 16 the motion is that we pursue a reimbursement through the 17 bonding company, through Tetra Tech and the bonding 18 company. 19 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: Restate that. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I said to approve the 21 Change Order and -- 22 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: And pursue remedies. 23 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- pursue remedies 24 through the bonding company or the previous contractor. 25 JUDGE KELLY: So you're amending your motion 86 1 to -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: He made the motion. I'm 3 amending the second and he's agreeing. 4 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: He's amending it. 5 Yes. 6 JUDGE KELLY: Okay. We've got an amended 7 motion on the table to approve the Change Order and 8 pursue possible remedies. Any discussion? Those in 9 favor raise your hand. Unanimous. Five-0. 10 Moving on to Item 1.16 consider, discuss and 11 take appropriate action on how to determine if an access 12 road meets public health and safety standards. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I put this -- we -- on 14 the agenda because we talked about this quite a bit at 15 the last meeting. And the issue or the one that's 16 pending is in my Precinct. And immediately after the 17 meeting I was called and said so what do I do and I 18 really couldn't give him a clear answer because we 19 talked a lot about it but didn't really say what they 20 need to do. 21 Like on a variance, that's very clear. If 22 somebody wants a variance, what they have to show. But 23 what is unclear to me as to what a individual is to show 24 that their road is not a public safety hazard. So I 25 think -- 87 1 JUDGE KELLY: I'm confused what you're 2 talking about. 3 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We talked about if -- 4 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: The pig trap. 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: We're not supposed to 6 use that terminology. It's that road. And there's 7 others. Another one, which is not going to be platted 8 now but it may in the future. As to what standard we're 9 going to determine makes a road not -- or not public 10 safety. 11 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Can I ask a question 12 about this? And you'll know as much about this as 13 anybody. If I understand it, if it's a country lane it 14 has to have some -- and Charlie -- if it's a country 15 lane, it has to have like -- something like 22 feet of 16 base to qualify, is that right? 17 MR. HASTINGS: Right. 18 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Okay. So this -- in 19 this particular case, as I recall, is about 20 feet 20 of -- 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: To existing 22 right-of-way. 23 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Okay. It's existing 24 right-of-way and -- 25 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So it meets -- it's not 88 1 a subdivision violation. It meets our subdivision 2 rules. It's that what is the criteria that we're going 3 to use to say that that road does not meet the Public 4 Safety standards? 5 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Why can't people that 6 purchase or live back there be responsible for their own 7 problem? I mean, why do we have to -- 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, I tend to agree 9 with that. 10 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: I mean, I don't like a 11 lot of regulations but, I mean, you know, you find out 12 how in the middle -- you got to get an easement from 13 somebody or right-of-way from somebody, you know that's 14 a problem, because it's more than a place to go hunting. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I mean, I agree. I 16 don't -- you know, I was not really in favor of doing -- 17 going down this road but to me, you know -- 18 JUDGE KELLY: But this is a privately-owned 19 public use road. 20 COMMISSIONER BELEW: It would be after this. 21 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It's a -- it's an 22 easement -- I don't know if it's public or not. It's an 23 easement to someone's property. The elements that 24 divides a ranch into three lots. 25 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Then it would be a 89 1 public road. If you have -- 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Well, if you get the 3 permission of three people and they -- 4 COMMISSIONER BELEW: So the buyer beware. 5 So it can still be a private road. This is what I was 6 talking about earlier. That we treat people like 7 grownups. They go file the paperwork with the County 8 Clerk, which is what the Clerk's office is for, and we 9 don't micromanage everything. I said before when this 10 particular one came up, it's his problem or her problem, 11 whoever it is. Let them sort it out with their 12 neighbors. And I don't think we oughta be playing 13 Mother May I with everything. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: But he doesn't need to 15 sort it out. We were threatening -- we were 16 discussing, I won't say threatening. We were discussing 17 not approving a plat -- 18 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Because of that. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: -- because of this. But 20 he doesn't -- he has access. 21 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Now, was it -- once -- 22 did 9-1-1 come into this? Now you've got three, four 23 homes back up in there. They've gotta give them 24 addresses and so on. And now you've got to have -- and 25 this was the whole crux of it. And brush trucks get in 90 1 there too. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Fire trucks have been on 3 the property already. 4 COMMISSIONER BELEW: And there's plenty of 5 places where you have to wait for one to pass before the 6 other one, there's plenty of low water crossings where 7 you can't get but one vehicle across at a time. So we 8 live with this every single day. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. But to me, he's 10 meeting our subdivision rules. The access is up to the 11 individuals that buy the property. 12 COMMISSIONER BELEW: If we don't act on it, 13 we haven't set any kind of precedent. 14 JUDGE KELLY: That's true. 15 COMMISSIONER BELEW: And I think that's 16 where the -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think that there is a 18 point when we may have to step in, but this one isn't 19 one of them. I just don't like having -- trying to set 20 some criteria because we never know what it's going to 21 be. I mean, to me this situation is taking 800 acres, 22 dividing it into three lots. There's a whole lot of 23 property in this County that have similar situations. 24 And now, if he was putting in a hundred lots, that's a 25 little different issue. But three -- 91 1 COMMISSIONER BELEW: He could. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. You know, then I 3 think we have to say, hey, you don't have access to the 4 subdivision. But for, you know, three, you know, lots, 5 one's 50 acres, I think one is 250, and the other one's 6 350. Something like that. Four hundred. I mean, 7 there's a whole lot of properties like that. 8 COMMISSIONER BELEW: So is this kicking the 9 can down the road for another court because someday 10 somebody's going to want 160, division by 160 of 800 11 acres. 12 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Well, you know, if a 13 guy goes in there and buys this place and wants to do 14 that, you've gotta -- he knows how to get there, he 15 knows access is going to be a problem. Now, neighbors 16 don't want to sell him anything or what have you, that's 17 his problem again. But to do what he wants, he's 18 probably going to have to get someone else's property. 19 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 20 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Then we get calls about 21 why the road is bad, you know? When somebody lives in 22 Houston and they have a country place here and they have 23 to drive over the -- holes, it's quaint then. When they 24 live on it, when they retire here, they're all pissed 25 off about it. 92 1 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No kidding. 2 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Why isn't my road 3 fixed? 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Put in a private road 5 and -- 6 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Yeah, I -- I'm with 7 you. I think we should do nothing. 8 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I think we should -- I 9 agree. 10 COMMISSIONER BELEW: I mean, it's private 11 road. Private use. Then I think the sellers and the 12 buyers beware. 13 JUDGE KELLY: Beware. 14 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. 15 JUDGE KELLY: And if they want to come to us 16 and want to make it a public road -- 17 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Oh yeah. I agree with 18 that. 19 COMMISSIONER BELEW: But we can't set a 20 minimum of acreage sold back in there or lots or plots 21 or anything. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: No. 23 COMMISSIONER BELEW: We can't have anything 24 to do with that at all. It's got to be hands off all 25 together. 93 1 JUDGE KELLY: I would. 2 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah. 3 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Heather, was that a 4 nice smile or -- 5 COMMISSIONER LETZ: So I'll tell him that it 6 was presented and it's -- 7 COMMISSIONER BELEW: He's got to get his own 8 right-of-way or whatever. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: His -- his -- what he's 10 talked about doing is in compliance with our subdivision 11 rules and present it and move forward. 12 JUDGE KELLY: But I think we oughta -- we 13 ought to put him on notice that any further subdivision 14 of his properties will be -- 15 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Again, buyer beware. 16 JUDGE KELLY: -- will be subject to the 17 subdivision rules. 18 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Right. 19 COMMISSIONER BELEW: I think we just send 20 him over to Headwaters and -- 21 MR. JONES: Not very nice. 22 (Laughter.) 23 JUDGE KELLY: Well -- 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: All right. I think that 25 answers the question. Charlie, did that answer the 94 1 question in your mind? 2 MR. HASTINGS: It's clear as mud. 3 COMMISSIONER BELEW: It's clear as mud. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. No action. 5 JUDGE KELLY: Item 1.17 consider, discuss 6 and take appropriate action to appoint an alternate for 7 Mary Krebs on the Alamo Area Council of Governments 8 Criminal Justice Advisory Committee. 9 I think last time when we approved Jason 10 Davis that I would ask Paul Gonzales. I've asked him, 11 he's graciously agreed to serve as the alternate. So 12 we've got a couple young people lined up to move into 13 those position when it's time. So I nominate Paul 14 Gonzales. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 16 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: Third. 17 JUDGE KELLY: Any discussion? Those in 18 favor raise your hand. Unanimous, five zero. 19 1.18 consider, discuss and take appropriate 20 action to designate a member of Commissioners' Court as 21 a representative on the Courthouse Security Committee. 22 We were notified by Judge Emerson that 23 they're reconvening the courthouse security committee 24 and we need to have a representative on it. 25 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: I wouldn't mind doing 95 1 it, working with them. 2 JUDGE KELLY: Okay. I have no problem with 3 that. 4 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I'll make a motion that 5 it's Commission Harris. 6 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Second. 7 JUDGE KELLY: We've got a motion and a 8 second for Commissioner Harris to serve on the 9 Courtrhouse Security Committee. Those in favor raise 10 your hand. Unanimous. 11 COMMISSIONER BELEW: I just want to say for 12 the record, I just wish he wasn't here when we'd done 13 that. 14 (Laughter.) 15 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Yeah. It'd have been 16 automatic then. You wouldn't even have to vote. 17 Everybody's nodding their head. 18 JUDGE KELLY: 1.19 consider, discuss and 19 take appropriate action on a request to post notices in 20 all courthouse bathrooms regarding Human Trafficking 21 Awareness Month. 22 I spoke to Rotary last week and they are 23 sponsoring these warning signs to put both in male and 24 female bathrooms. I brought some for -- gave them to 25 Jody. And we need to ask the Court if it's okay to put 96 1 them up in the bathrooms. 2 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Is it to help somebody 3 if they're -- to get away? 4 JUDGE KELLY: Yes. If they go -- if you're 5 going to the bathroom and if they -- they have any kind 6 of problem, this is trying to help them -- I mean we've 7 got copies of it sitting out there. 8 COMMISSIONER BELEW: So will this indicate 9 to them that this is a safe place? They are to go to 10 the nearest officer or what? What is it? 11 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Sheriff, have we seen 12 a lot of this? 13 SHERIFF LEITHA: No. Not a whole lot right 14 now. 15 COMMISSIONER LETZ: It gives them a number 16 to call. Yeah. I think it -- I'll make a motion. 17 JUDGE KELLY: They asked if I could just 18 bring them and put them in the courthouse and I said I 19 don't see why not, but we'll take it up. 20 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Be in there forever 21 or -- 22 JUDGE KELLY: I think just the month of 23 January being Human Trafficking Awareness Month. 24 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Okay. I'll make a 25 motion that the human trafficking awareness signs be put 97 1 in the County bathrooms through the month of January. 2 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: Second. 3 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Second. 4 JUDGE KELLY: We've got a motion and a 5 second to approve putting up Human Trafficking Awareness 6 posters. Any discussion? All those in favor raise your 7 hand. Unanimous. 8 Okay. Move on to the approval docket 2.1 9 budget amendments. 10 MRS. SHELTON: We have one line item 11 request. All we're doing is transferring $1500 into 12 liability insurance line from a postage and office 13 supply line. 14 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Move for approval. 15 JUDGE KELLY: I just need a second. I'll 16 second it. Got a motion and a second to approve the 17 budget amendments as presented. Any discussion? Those 18 in favor raise your hand. Unanimous. 19 2.2 pay the bills. 20 MRS. SHELTON: Yes. Invoices for today's 21 consideration amount to $453,762.27. 22 COMMISSIONER LETZ: I move to pay it. 23 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Second. 24 JUDGE KELLY: We've got a motion and a 25 second to approve the bills as presented. Any 98 1 discussion? Those in favor raise your hand. Unanimous. 2 2.3 late bills. 3 MRS. SHELTON: There are not any. 4 JUDGE KELLY: 2.4 Auditor reports. 5 MRS. SHELTON: Yes. We had -- the auditor's 6 office conducted an audit of the County Jail Commissary 7 and the inmate trust accounts for the year ending 8 September the 30th, 2021 and issued a report to the 9 Sheriff. Based on the testing procedures performed, 10 expenditures and revenues were supported by adequate 11 documentation and purchases were made in accordance with 12 Local Government Code Section 351.0415. Upon the 13 Court's acceptance, the report will be sent to the Texas 14 Commission on Jail Standards. We're asking that you 15 accept the report. 16 COMMISSIONER BELEW: I'll move to accept the 17 report. 18 COMMISSIONER GIPSON: Second. 19 JUDGE KELLY: Got a motion and a second to 20 accept the auditor's report as presented. Any 21 discussion? Those in favor raise your hand. Unanimous. 22 Monthly reports. 23 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Yes, sir. December 24 2021, County Clerk Jackie J.D. Dowdy. Auditor Tanya 25 Shelton. Environmental Health OSSF Director Ashli 99 1 Badders. Constables Precinct 1, Tommy Rodriguez. 2 Precinct 2, Kyle Schneider. Precinct 3, Paul Gonzales. 3 Precinct 4, Brad Rider. And Justice of the Peace, 4 Precinct 2, J. R. Hoyne. Precinct 3, Kathy Mitchell. 5 And Precinct 4, Bill Ragsdale. I move for approval. 6 COMMISSIONER BELEW: Second. 7 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Second. 8 JUDGE KELLY: Got a motion and a second to 9 approve the monthly reports as presented. Any 10 discussion? Those in favor raise your hand. Unanimous, 11 five zero. 12 Court orders. 13 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Yeah, we have our Court 14 orders from our December 28th meeting, 39123 through 15 39139. And I did recommend a change to 39131. This is 16 the one related to our vote to -- well, originally it 17 said approve to vote for the directors for the Texas 18 Association of Counties health and employee benefits 19 pool for the three-year term, effective January 1, 2022. 20 I think we should add the language as recommended by the 21 directors of TAC. And that's why we did it. And with 22 that modification, I'll move for approval. 23 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: Second. 24 JUDGE KELLY: We've got a motion and a 25 second to approve the court orders as presented. Any 100 1 discussion? Those in favor raise your hand. Unanimous. 2 Information agenda. 3.1. Department heads. 3 Any status reports? 4 3.2 elected officials? 5 SHERIFF LEITHA: Yeah, just want to kind of 6 update you on the Sheriff's office and what's going on 7 with COVID. As of this morning, we got about 13 cases 8 back there in five different pods. About two jailers. 9 And what I want to explain part of what Jennifer put on 10 there today, 1.8 -- I asked her to put that on there. 11 And I totally agree with you on the COVID sick leave 12 policy. 13 The only thing I felt as administrator and 14 supervisor of the jail staff, the jail is full. That's 15 a good thing. But a lot of my people have less than a 16 year on in there and so they don't have that time built 17 up. Of course, I have several employees with 20 plus 18 years that still have a thousand plus hours of sick 19 leave on the books. 20 But what I just want y'all to understand 21 with those people, you know, according to jail 22 standards, you know, we have to be in there 24-hours a 23 day, seven days a week. And they don't have an 24 opportunity like other County employees to have social 25 distancing. 101 1 But you know, we only got two right now. 2 You know, we were -- they have to be in that atmosphere 3 all day long and, you know, they don't have that option. 4 But you know, we'll monitor it. The good thing is this 5 is only lasting about five days. You know, I have five 6 employees total, but two in the jail at this time with 7 COVID. So just kind of share that with you. That's why 8 she put it on there is because I asked her to. 9 COMMISSIONER LETZ: Sheriff, isn't this -- 10 wasn't there some legislation that law enforcement -- 11 SHERIFF LEITHA: Yes. And that's a whole 12 other can of worms, Commissioner, with Jennifer going 13 through worker's comp. I mean it's -- you know, I do 14 have two employees currently on there. One because of 15 COVID. We can look at that option. But to me, that's 16 kind of -- it's going to be extended stay. Right now, 17 you know, we're trying to encourage them to take off 18 about five days and come back to work, if I'm correct, 19 Jennifer. Isn't that right? 20 MRS. DOSS: Well, you have to prove that 21 you -- that you were exposed in the workplace. And it's 22 basically law enforcement is covered quarantine. 23 There's -- they should be paid to quarantine. And it's 24 just law enforcement. It's not office staff or 25 dispatchers. 102 1 SHERIFF LEITHA: And that's something I'll 2 get with Jennifer and we'll look into. You know, we're 3 trying to encourage them, you know, to go home and come 4 back as soon as possible. And you know, under workers 5 comp that probably takes a little bit of time to process 6 that. We're trying to get them fixed and back in. 7 The only thing I'm concerned about is my 8 people with a year or less. You know, they just don't 9 have that time built up like several of my other 10 employees. So -- but we'll work it out and I think 11 we're down to two and I'll let you know if something 12 else come up. 13 JUDGE KELLY: Then item 3.3 status reports 14 from liaison commissioners. 15 COMMISSIONER HARRIS: I just want to give a 16 shout out to the extension out there. The County shows 17 last week, and all -- the guys were all hands on deck 18 and really made us move show for -- and really helped 19 the kids and parents. So good shout out to them. 20 JUDGE KELLY: And a shout out that I'll make 21 about the stock show is I listened to about ten minutes 22 recognizing -- and not recognizing the face that Roy 23 Walston made that presentation. But I knew the voice. 24 But with that beard, I didn't know who it was. 25 Okay. With that we're going to adjourn and 103 1 go into Executive Session. We'll take about a five 2 minute break -- about a five minute break and start back 3 in Executive Session. 4 (Break.) 5 (Executive Session.) 6 JUDGE KELLY: It is 11:28 and we finished 7 our executive session and we have nothing else left on 8 the agenda, and we are adjourned. 9 * * * * * * 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 104 1 STATE OF TEXAS * 2 COUNTY OF KERR * 3 I, DEBRA ELLEN GIFFORD, Certified Shorthand 4 Reporter in and for the State of Texas, and Official 5 Court Reporter in and for Kerr County, do hereby certify 6 that the above and foregoing pages contain and comprise 7 a true and correct transcription of the proceedings had 8 in the above-entitled Regular Commissioners' Court. 9 Dated this the 21st day of January, A.D. 10 2022. 11 12 /s/DEBRA ELLEN GIFFORD Certified Shorthand Reporter 13 No. 953 Expiration Date 04/30/2023 14 * * * * * * 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25